# 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t



## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

Ok, ive searched this forum (to what i think is to my best ability), but i cant find anything specifically what im looking for. other than aspiration, what is the difference between the 2.5 inline5 and the 2.0t?
is the 2.5 just a 2.0 with an extra cylinder? or are they completely different blocks and setups?(other than the extra cylinder).
perhaps this may seem like a silly question, and perhaps it belongs in the mkV forum, but i wasnt sure.
basically, i want to know if you can get as much power (or more) out of a 2.5 than the 2.0.


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

at this point in time it is much cheaper to make more power with the 2.0 then the 2.5. 
a stage 1 rabbit costs 3,999 and a stage 1 kit for gti is 600 bucks and the gti will still be faster than the rabbit
a stage 2 kit is $4,499, stage 2 for a gti is still just $600. you will need to upgrade the exhaust on both though apparently the 2.0 gti is still faster
the 2.5 is more feasible when you are trying to make big power IMO. when you are past the point of what the 2.0 fsi fuel system and ko3 turbo can deliver. at this point you are basically starting from scratch with the 2.0 none of the factory turbo components are useful so you may aswell add an extra cylinder


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## mk1vw (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (GrocerySnake)*

good questions here.
i would guess the bore and stroke is the same based on the displacement difference.
i would be interested to know if the 2.0T cams are driven like the 2.5 and vr6- chain drive on the tranny side or something else...
for power potential the 2.5 would be superior assuming the head flows halfway decent. the displacement increase and conventional fuel injectors make for easy power.
this is assuming the 2.5 crank is forged and can stand up to the boost.


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (mk1vw)*

well judging by this thread:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4530817
..it seems that rabbits are much more expensive to get a lot of power out of.
a shame, because i really like the idea of an n/a powerhouse.
i ask because im debating on building a mk5 gti or rabbit. i think though, the 2.5 could make a substatial amount of power all-motor, given the time and money. we'll see








oh and thanks for the responses. what do you guys think?


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## mk1vw (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (GrocerySnake)*

i kinda assumed boost for the 2.5 in the comparison.
making NA power will always be more expensive and the results not so great.


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (mk1vw)*

ive been doing some more research and searching a lot on the forum, and it does seem that boosting is the way to go. but i might as well have a gti. until they make a LOT of parts for these cars a long way down the road, it just doesnt seem feasible. but C2s cams are a big stride towards that!


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## mkv1003 (Feb 20, 2010)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (GrocerySnake)*

Here's a big question that needs to be answered. What is your power goal? (HP and TQ).
If your goals are around 250 HP, I say go with a rabbit and put c2's stage 2 kit on it. I'm not quite sure the average price differences between the mkv rabbits and gtis, but when comparing the mkvi golfs and gtis it costs about the same to buy a rabbit and boost it as it does to just buy a gti. a new golf is $17,6~~ and a gti is 23,6~~ so about $6,000 difference. for 6,000 you can get the stage 2 kit installed and still have some leftover. You will outperform a stock gti, your insurance will be cheaper, your car will sound absolutely amazing, and you will have something that not very many people have, a 2.5T.
Just my $0.02


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (mkv1003)*

you $0.02 is very much appreciated.
that would be sick. *ponders* 2.5t......2.5t........2.5t
maybe, maybe. but yes 250hp 270/280tq would be nice.(im assuming that the torque would stay somewhat higher than hp). that almost seems like it would be worth the time. but would you need to change any of the internals? or could you just bolt on turbo setup, piping, etc, and then retune?
im sure somewhere on here someone has done this.
edit: i found a guy turboing an 09. going with a custom setup hes lookin at 325+hp
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4694107
this is definitely looking more attractive.

_Modified by GrocerySnake at 7:52 PM 3-28-2010_


_Modified by GrocerySnake at 7:53 PM 3-28-2010_


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## DrewTheBrave (Apr 25, 2008)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (GrocerySnake)*

Keep in mind that a simple ECU flash that costs around $500 to $600 will bring the 2.0T to around 250hp. It may be cheaper buy a Rabbit and install C2's turbo kit, but if I had the money I'd go with a GTI.
I really like the 2.5 for what it is, but the 2.0T is a much cheaper/easier engine to get more power out of. For now.


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (DrewTheBrave)*

thats exactly what i have been thinking about. the way i look at it i can go two ways
1. buy a GTi, spend less down the road and have the power now.
2. buy a rabbit, do little things here and there until they come out with more stuff for the 2.5.
but a few years from now, ill either have a fairly modded gti(just like everyone else) or have a heavily modified(and very unique) rabbit....and after seein what Brabbit32 is doing, im leaning toward the 2.5








i just have to play the waiting game


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## mk1vw (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (GrocerySnake)*

2.5T http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 2ohgti (Nov 8, 2004)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (GrocerySnake)*

2.0T has more potential and is cheaper for more HP. Asking this question in a 2.5 tech form will give you bias opinions.


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (2ohgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2ohgti* »_2.0T has more potential and is cheaper for more HP. Asking this question in a 2.5 tech form will give you bias opinions. 

Well I would think that the 2.5 would be capable of making more power, eventually, with the right mods. However I do concede that FOR NOW the 2.0t is superior.
But where do you suggest I should have posted this?










_Modified by GrocerySnake at 9:46 AM 3-29-2010_


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## 2ohgti (Nov 8, 2004)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (GrocerySnake)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GrocerySnake* »_
Well I would think that the 2.5 would be capable of making more power, eventually, with the right mods. However I do concede that FOR NOW the 2.0t is superior.
But where do you suggest I should have posted this?









_Modified by GrocerySnake at 9:46 AM 3-29-2010_

I agree. You would think a 2.5T should have more potential being larger, extra cyl,, and more valves. The real problem is that the aftermarket for the 2.5 is weak and over priced.


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## LampyB (Apr 2, 2007)

yes a 2.5T would be awesome, but the price is astronimical. ok so say you have the $4-6K necessary to do this project, but you've also got to take into consideration the performance quality of the rabbit's suspension, transmission, shifter, motor mounts, exhaust, etc. Putting that much power into a Rabbit is going to require upgrading just about everything on the car in addition to the engine. You're looking at like $10K to legitimately turbo a rabbit, soo not worth it IMO for the lack of interior accessories and whatnot. You'll still have a very low-end car with a ton of power. Might as well add a BAT to a GTI and upgrade everything on top of the engine and it will still be a few grand less....
just not worth it in this car, enjoy it for what it is and buy a GTI if you really crave power.


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: (LampyB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LampyB* »_yes a 2.5T would be awesome, but the price is astronimical. ok so say you have the $4-6K necessary to do this project, but you've also got to take into consideration the performance quality of the rabbit's suspension, transmission, shifter, motor mounts, exhaust, etc. Putting that much power into a Rabbit is going to require upgrading just about everything on the car in addition to the engine. 

Idk about 10k but I hadn't thought about this a lot. I wasn't planning on 350+hp. Just stage 1.. My goal being 250-275. I understand its easier to get this power out of a gti, but who wants to be just another 2.0t???
2.5t ........yea it just sounds cooler










_Modified by GrocerySnake at 12:38 PM 3-30-2010_


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## mk1vw (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (2ohgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2ohgti* »_2.0T has more potential and is cheaper for more HP. Asking this question in a 2.5 tech form will give you bias opinions. 

you think we are bias when yout user name refers to 2.0? lol.
I'll buy the cheaper part, but more power potential? not sure about that.
why does the 2.0 have more potential? does the head flow better than the 2.5? does the total CFM of the 2.0 head surpass the 2.5? 
the only thing that could possibly hold back the 2.5 is the crank or the block, and i doubt either of those would fail under 500hp.
time will tell as the big hp 2.5's come around.


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (mk1vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mk1vw* »_
time will tell as the big hp 2.5's come around.

exactly. its like this for every car/motor. we just have to wait for bigger and better stuff to come out. even if the 2.5 does have a limitation the 2.0 doesnt, im sure someone will find, and produce a
solution


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## conejoZING! (Nov 25, 2007)

*Re: (GrocerySnake)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GrocerySnake* »_
2.5t ........yea it just sounds cooler








_Modified by GrocerySnake at 12:38 PM 3-30-2010_

It most certainly does. 
2.5... It is much cheaper initially to get from the VW dealer. It is much more reliable than the GTI (just read consumer reports). It sounds far better than the GTI. The engine response kicks in without any turbo lag at all. It is a naturally aspirated fun little prankster (Got a Touhou Tewi on my rearview mirror!). It is even more insulting to other drivers when they realize that little Tewi Inaba just kicked their @**
2.0t GTI - get ready to hand over moolah at the dealer for a car with almost too many options and fancy gizmos. After putting a hole in your wallet then you'll have to put more of a hole in your wallet for APR type stuff. Then once your car is a screeching, less reliable "race car" you will burn through tires and get a lot more police attention. This will put more of a hole in your wallet. The GTI is also less reliable than the Rabbit (just read consumer reports).


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## Rabbitoid (Feb 18, 2009)

I would just like to say I love the name "Rabbit." When I turbo it, I will have a "Turbo Bunny" which is... just say "I have a Turbo Bunny." It's great. GTI? What does that mean? Not only that, but you have a little Rabbit icon on the back. I will never shave that off. Bunny. I need to wash my Bunny. Driving a Rabbit around also means you have an enormous penus, not compensating for anything.


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: (Rabbitoid)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rabbitoid* »_Driving a Rabbit around also means you have an enormous penus, not compensating for anything.

This, is a given.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 2ohgti (Nov 8, 2004)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (mk1vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mk1vw* »_
you think we are bias when yout user name refers to 2.0? lol.
I'll buy the cheaper part, but more power potential? not sure about that.
why does the 2.0 have more potential? does the head flow better than the 2.5? does the total CFM of the 2.0 head surpass the 2.5? 
the only thing that could possibly hold back the 2.5 is the crank or the block, and i doubt either of those would fail under 500hp.
time will tell as the big hp 2.5's come around.

The 2ohgti name comes from a 98' 2.0 8v GTI I had so....not very bias w/ 115 hp of furry lol..
I really do like VW NA engines those and my favorite I've has so far is the 12v VR6. 
I think the 2.5 could have more potential, but companies don't want to give it a chance. They just want to focus on 2.0Ts http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
I would love to see more ugrades for the turbos, cams, lighten flywheels, and superchargers. I like the idea of a 20vT or a supercharged 20v http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## darkk (Jun 22, 2006)

*Re: (MaxVW)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MaxVW* »_
a stage 2 kit is $4,499, stage 2 for a gti is still just $600. you will need to upgrade the exhaust on both though apparently the 2.0 gti is still faster

NOT TRUE. 
The C2 stg2 rabbit will be as fast without question. We have a C2 stg2 Jetta and an 08 GTI w/TSI stg 2+ Both cars are virtually identical from point A to point B. Each has a little different power in certain areas. But all said and done, they are very very comparable...


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## magics5rip (Mar 17, 2004)

*Re: 2.5-I5 vs 2.0t (2ohgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2ohgti* »_
I agree. You would think a 2.5T should have more potential being larger, extra cyl,, and more valves. The real problem is that the aftermarket for the 2.5 is weak and over priced. 

This is probably a result of the 2.5 aftermarket being fairly new compared to the 2.0 market. The 2.0 has more potential right now because it has been designed from the factory to BE a turbo car, so any upgrade will mean a lot more easy power at your fingertips. 
This point has been made in the 2.5 forum as well: when the vr6 hit the scene, it was just as expensive to modify as the 2.5 is right now. Over time, the vr6 has become far superior to its period rival 2.0 in power potential vs $ spent.


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## sleees345 (Dec 31, 2009)

Keep in mind that the 2.5 is becoming the standard for VW's new lineup of non-turbo cars. 
The new Golf, Jetta, Jetta Wagon (i think), their upcoming mid-size sedan, and the future Beetle replacement are all slated to have the 2.5 in them. With the majority of the VW lineup powered by this thing, I think it'll get a lot more attention. There will be 2.5 drivers ALL over the place, and a lot of them will want mods. 
we need patience, and the goods will come.


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## metive (Apr 6, 2010)

Is it true that the 06-07 have more useable low-end power than the higher hp o8 models? Meaning the torque curve is felt lower in the rpm band. I read this could be the case.


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## japoipnoi (Oct 31, 2005)

*"Hole in Wallet"*

2.0T GTI 17.3mpg City I think. Highway is high cuz 6 spd.
2.5 23 mpg
-Road & Track


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## GrocerySnake (Feb 25, 2010)

*Re: (metive)*



metive said:


> Is it true that the 06-07 have more useable low-end power than the higher hp o8 models? Meaning the torque curve is felt lower in the rpm band. I read this could be the cas
> I don't think so. Check this thread out.
> http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3834246
> I'm pretty sure the two engines are identical performance wise, except the 08s power band extends slighty farther into the higher rpms(hence the 20 extra crank hp). Someone else mentioned that the only real difference is that the 08s pull a bit smoother. I think that's right for the most part, correct me if I am wrong.


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## mkv1003 (Feb 20, 2010)

*Re: (GrocerySnake)*

If you do actually decide you want to go the 2.5T path, get an 08 or older. The 09+ models don't have software available and it is very pricey for custom software (around 10k for turbo kit and software) and A LOT of downtime while software is being made.


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## charlenberlin (Nov 26, 2008)

Some body check out the new Audi TT RS 5cyl turbo ???? Just a question when you talk about engine devellopment out of the factory.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (conejoZING!)*


_Quote, originally posted by *conejoZING!* »_
It most certainly does. 
2.5... It is much cheaper initially to get from the VW dealer. It is much more reliable than the GTI (just read consumer reports). It sounds far better than the GTI. The engine response kicks in without any turbo lag at all. It is a naturally aspirated fun little prankster (Got a Touhou Tewi on my rearview mirror!). It is even more insulting to other drivers when they realize that little Tewi Inaba just kicked their @**
2.0t GTI - get ready to hand over moolah at the dealer for a car with almost too many options and fancy gizmos. After putting a hole in your wallet then you'll have to put more of a hole in your wallet for APR type stuff. Then once your car is a screeching, less reliable "race car" you will burn through tires and get a lot more police attention. This will put more of a hole in your wallet. The GTI is also less reliable than the Rabbit (just read consumer reports).

Everything you posted goes out the window the moment you put T next to the 2.5. Your comment also goes to show you know nothing about the 2.0T.


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