# 1.8T vrs 2.0aba in a auto vanagon?



## danster (Jun 1, 2007)

I have recently picked up a parts van that has a 1.8na gas attached to an auto with an old fastforward kit it is mounted at 15* but has the holes for 50*. I was hoping for more power than the 1.8na gas so the choices are 2.0aba bottom with 1.8 head @ 50 no decklid bump, 2.0aba @ 50 decklid bump. 2.0aba @ 15 larger bump, 1.8T @ 15 not to sure how big a bump, I am concerned about the high RPM and the 1.8T will it handle it 4000rpm for extended traveling and reliability? any helpful info will be appreciated 
When I did some searching there was one person discussing the 1.8T with an auto but end results unknown.

Dan


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## the brit (Jun 23, 2003)

No idea with the auto trans, but a OBD1 ABA is SO much simpler to install and wire. Seriously about 1/10 of the install time, and very simple wiring with no boost, turbo oil and water lines etc. I guess for me it would boil down to what you want it for - cheap reliability or show / power.

It's still to early on a Sunday morning for me to remember the relationship between gearing and engine speed, but if 4000rpm is top gear is cruising, what's the point of the higher HP? Getting to that speed really fast? I don't know how much the auto would like that done too many times :laugh:


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## danster (Jun 1, 2007)

The reason for more power is to maintain speeds with traffic and to possibly tow a very small trailer. I am also interested in the 2.0aba swap which is most likely what I will end up doing possibly the 1.8 head on it at 50* but the 1.8T with the extra power it would be hard to get the grin off your face.

The common way seams to be 2.0aba with 1.8 head running the digifant FI. 
What does the stock 2.0 ABA lose by going to the older head and fuel injection system?

Dan


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## the brit (Jun 23, 2003)

When you say ABA bottom with 1.8 head, you mean the stock head, not a 20v head, right?

The ABA bottom is the same swap that a lot of Fox owners do - look in the FAQs and search in that forum - it's well documented and will likely help you a lot. People do that swap as it gets you a decent performance increase without having to switch out your stock sensors etc. It's (almost) a bolt in swap for little money. I drove one of these cars and was very impressed with the power increase for a 'simple' upgrade. A nice side effect is that if you pick up a lower mileage block, hopefully it's a lot less worn. Your budget will go to new head bolts, gaskets etc. If you're sneaky about it, you might not even need to disconnect your exhaust from the head (!), if you're able to drop the bottom end out of the bottom of the van (no idea on a vanagon, sorry). This would (should) be a easy weekend swap. The car I drove was built and owned by Fox-N-It in the fox forums; I think he had a how-to out there on the interest years ago. If I wanted a simple upgrade and didn't feel like swapping the whole engine and wiring, this is a choice I'd be happy to do. You do need to open up your engine of course, but it's a good chance to do a new timing belt, tensioner etc.

Swapping the complete 2.0 ABA motor and injection in gives you a further power boost, maybe another 10hp IIRC (it's been a long time, sorry, so refer to the correct threads about the swap), but means you need to swap in the new engine wiring, ECU, MAF, etc that comes with the ABA. If you look in the Hybrid/Swap forum I posted a list of the minimum wires needed to make a OBD1 ABA run. It's possible to do it with 5 or 6 wires going to the van, and because the engine has all sensor wiring etc located on board, with a nice big single connector going to the ECU it's very easy to wire. You'll likely need the correct pre-heated O2 sensor too if yours is different. The MAF can be run with a cone filter, but it's things like this that you'll need to think about buying and finding a home for in the engine bay, that you wouldn't need to do when keeping your stock head. The advantage is more power, and not having to open a engine up unless you want to do a quick 'rebuild' or refresh on it - new headgasket etc.


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## danster (Jun 1, 2007)

Well you are making the full 2.0aba look good. The parts van engine swap will be swapped into my van that we are driving now so the plan is to build this up on a stand and be all ready to swap into our van in a short down time. So what years did the 2.0 aba come as a OBD1 and did it have a serp belt.

Any links to websites about these swaps? I have been looking on thesamba and starting to search around here.

Thanks for the info.
Dan


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

OBD1 ABA should be 1995 and earlier (1996+ in the US was OBD2 for all vehicles).


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## the brit (Jun 23, 2003)

Both are simple swaps, I just happen to have more knowledge with the OBD1 wiring. Using my method is also just one way; there's a new way going around the mk1 forums where people are adding the whole fuse panel from a OBD2 car and simply supplying it power. That way seems a little more complicated in the end to me, but people seem very happy with it from what i've heard.

OBD1 cars can sometimes be harder to find with lower mileage - some people prefer them due to some minor tweaks that were lost to the later engines probably for cost cutting, such as the oil squirters etc.


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## uncommonvw (Mar 13, 2004)

Why only the 1.8T and 2.0L ABA. Have you considered a 2.0l 16V from a Passat? Here is my reasoning.

2.0L ABA = 115HP

2.0L 16V = 134HP

1.8T = 150HP


With the 16V the HP figures are in the middle of the two you mentioned and the engine likes to be revved anyway. Automatic Passats are a dime a dozen too. I would imagine that the Motronic engine management/wiring would be easier to deal with too.


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## dredward (Nov 11, 2001)

"uncommonvw 
Why only the 1.8T and 2.0L ABA. Have you considered a 2.0l 16V from a Passat? Here is my reasoning.

2.0L ABA = 115HP

2.0L 16V = 134HP

1.8T = 150HP
"
The 1.8t is 150 hp if you decide to go with a non awp. The awp has over 180hp and with just a chip, exhaust, and intake is 240hp/250lbs torque.
To the original poster i have the 1.8t in my camper. However my van is a manual. Someone mentioned on this thread how much easier obd1 is vs obd2. I am not gona argue that but i'll add if you can do one you can do the other. If intimidated just pay someone to do your harness who has done it before. I did this and it cost me aprox $900, well worth it in my opinion. However if you decide to tackle it your self you'll find it's only the first harness you do thats hard. After that you know exactly where to go. You'll have to have a chip tuner remove the imobilizer as well. I was gona go aba with an autotech super charger but given the super charger alone was more then my entire 1.8t swap, the 1.8t was a no brainer.. One reason no ones chimeing in on the 1.8t in an auto is due to extra sensors in the auto to make the motor run right. I imagin eit's possible but it adds a whole new set of issues to over come. If you go 1.8t i'd say swap yer trans to a manual....


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## az84gti (Jan 2, 2008)

*50 Deg. 1.8t*

I would have to agree with _thebrit_2.0 is much easier than 1.8t. lots of hoses and oil lines to fab. How about a 1.8T @ 50 deg.!! Its not been easy but its looking good. Standard Trans w/ .77 O.D..


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## DubPhreek (Apr 17, 2003)

WOW. fabrication!!!!


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## gnarly 928 (May 23, 2009)

*I just finished an ABA/1.8l head vanagon install..*

I combined the top end of my previous 1.8 l 8valve with a 'new' 93 Jetta ABA bottom and I couldn't be more pleased with the results. A very nice motor!

My 1.8liter came with my van (an 84 with a 5sp manual tranny and the 50degree style diesel mounting) It has/had digifant EMS. I put about 50k miles on this motor, which came with the van. I had no history on the 1.8l motor, so while it was still going strong and trouble-free, I decided on a pre-emptive swap. I wanted to know what everything looked like inside and to replace the bits that are known to eventually wear out, so I did my homework. The ABA botttom end combined with a 1.8 liter head and EMS gets a good rap for power and dependability, so I decided to go that route.

I found a complete Jetta ABA motor, all the stuff, for $300. 97k miles is what the seller said. The inside of the motor looked almost new. I got most of my parts from these guys

http://www.techtonicstuning.com/mai...pter=5&zenid=b042357884e3da5e933a4461f0453986

as well as lots of tech. advice during my swap.

I already had a mild camshaft (Autotech 260?) in my 1.8 liter head. The valves, guides and everything were in fine shape, so the swap involved simply unbolting the parts from the smaller block and re-bolting them onto the ABA block (once I stripped all the parts from that one for future resale) The dual downpipe manifold from the cross flow 2.0 liter head bolted right on the 1.8 liter head and is said to provide an additional 10-15hp...so I went ahead and installed that. I had to have another set of primary exhaust tubes bent and welded to complete the dual downpipe exhaust. I could have just bolted on the head, unchanged and saved time and money...but I had the better exhaust in hand from my $300 donor motor.

I used the distributor from my 1.8 liter block...for some reason. I think now that was not a necessary part to swap over, but Techtonics tuning has a bushing to adapt the dist...so it was not much trouble. It turns out my previous block also had a knock sensor system...I think that was one reason I swapped the dist...

The only other even slightly complex task was making the hoses fit onto the ABA oil cooler/filter housing. My 1.8liter didn't have that type filter/cooler heat exchanger. A bit of head scratching and some jig-saw puzzel stuff with all the available hoses and fittings and I got the right plumbing going. That cooler/heat exchanger lowers the highway oil temperature by almost 20f...a fact I was skeptical until I installed the proper hoses and an oil temp gauge and actually saw it for myself.

What else?...Oh, use the diesel vanagon exhaust mounts, available from our Vanagon vendors. Also, I have been using mid grade fuel on the recommendation of the Techtonics Tuning guys. I understand that the compression ratio of a 1.8 liter head on an ABA bottom is slightly higher than the old 1.8 liter. I have yet to hear any detonation. I put about $600 total into the swap-over.....not counting the exhaust system which I think I got ripped-off on...the 'Artiste' who welded it up for me...he was really pretty inept..a good welder, but it was painful to watch him cutting tubes and missing the length by inches..to go back and try again and again...all at $85per hour for shop time...
I will probably make a lot of that back when I sell off the ABA intake, AC comperssor, PS pump, Alternator, WP, etc etc.

This motor, running with the 5sp and normal vanagon tires gives me 23-24miles per gallon at about 65mph...where the engine is turning at 3700rpm. It will happily and with good power, go up to around 6200rpm (my chosen redline). I think the mild cam and my properly done free-flowing exhaust system (thanks to techtonics tuning for advice on configuring that properly for proven best power delivery) really gives me wide and strong power band. With this "new" motor, I have to be careful...I looked down at the speedo and find myself going really fast sometimes now. This motor is so....sweet sounding...

Hope this post helps someone.. Don Hanson


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

The 1.8 Digifant head and 2.0 ABA bottom end is a common swap for Mk2 Golfs and Jettas for a torquey engine with relative overall simplicity and overall it's also a fairly inexpensive swap. So I can see where applying it to other vehciles such as a Vanagon makes sense as well.


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## dubworkz (Apr 24, 2006)

*turbo vanagon*

heyo, i as well have had great luck with my early 2.0 with 1.8 8valve turbo motor swaps. 
i would change out that auto trans for best action. 
its nice to use 2.0 head for the cross flow,but the 8v fits under the stock deck lid.vanagon diesel bell housing,mountig bars setup, 93' 2.0 aba block,1.8 8v digifant head,stock diesel quantam turbo man,& turbo. carrado g-60 injectors,carrado g-60 or mega squirt fuel system. 
bad ass power for your vanagon on the cheap.::laugh:


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## r39o (May 6, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> The 1.8 Digifant head and 2.0 ABA bottom end is a common swap for Mk2 Golfs and Jettas for a torquey engine with relative overall simplicity and overall it's also a fairly inexpensive swap. So I can see where applying it to other vehciles such as a Vanagon makes sense as well.


 YUP. That is the simple ticket. Add in the Digifant fuel system and electronics from the early 90s and you are all set. This is THE no fuss I4 engine setup for the Vanagon. Mix stock diesel parts and the above engine configuration and is is all a simple bolt in for the most part. LOTS of bang for the buck and it is almost all VW USA parts too. It is the conversion just about any body can do and not have to be a master fabricator to make happen. PLUS for us normal people any VW shop will know what to do to service it. No special TICO parts. No fancy OBD II to hiccup. Etc. Simple and about as cheap as it gets. 

All the rest of the I4 conversions start to get complicated real fast. If you like that fine. If you want simple and not hard to deal with, the above will do it. (Why did I do a Subaru?????)


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## Werner in Modesto (Mar 31, 2004)

*80K on 1.8t Vanagon*

Hi! 

I've got about 80,000 miles on my 1.8t Vanagon -- 2001 GTI donor -- AWW engine -- stock 150hp chipped to 209 plus opened up the intake and exhaust so somewhere around 220+hp. Stephan's Auto Haus in Sacramento has done about 20 of them -- http://www.stephansautohaus.com/ 

A lot of fun to drive


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## BenT Syncro (Oct 23, 2006)

I am an infrequent poster on Vortex. However, I see a lot of familiar names in this thread from other forums. I've seen Stephan's, Werner's & Dredward's 1.8T. Have read about Don's ABA. I might have more in common with you on my 88 2wd Doka. It was a 4-speed which I converted to auto for city driving. (Not to worry. I have 2 Syncros which are both manuals.) Bought an old FastForward kit from Seth at Mastercraft. It's an ABA with the 1.8 8-valve head. Techtonics distributor adapter. I still haven't sorted the AFM position. The installer stuck it in a spot I did not like. Besides that, I am quite happy with it's performance as a daily driver. Mine is in a Doka so I do not have any clearance issues to deal with even with the taller 15 degree mounting. Have problems with the old WBX starter. I replaced with a Bosch rebuild but still not turning the engine fast enough sometimes. Bought an offset adapter from Karl at Westy Ventures. Now I just need to get a TDI starter to fit the adapter. Overland Eurospec made their own version of Karl's adapter with the exception that they use a VR6 starter.

BTW, you can use a Vanagon diesel oilpan and oil pick-up if you chose to tilt the motor at 50 degrees. You can't use the diesel bellhousing because that is not removable in the auto trans. I believe David Marshall at FastForward used a KEP adapter plate.


Cheers,

BenT


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## dredward (Nov 11, 2001)

*.*

I didn't have to fab any oil lines to run the 1.8t. The harness i got was plug and play(red to red, blue to blu, blk to blk etc). The parts that plugged into the vans harness used vanagon stly connectors that were color cordinated as well. All the original oiling for the turbo are intact...It's not nearly as complicated as it's being mad out by some on this thread.


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