# Calling all Vortech SC owners



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

Ok guys, as we all know by this time, our setup has a major fueling problem. Some of you may have solved it with an inline pump and an FMU, and some may be playing around with larger injectors and ways to trick the ECU into using them correctly, and other may still be running very lean and slowly melting their pistons. Anyway, the only current solution that really delivers enough fuel up top is the FMU route, but those inline pumps are noisy as hell. I have personally been messing around with some 310cc injectors and a MAF calibrator. This improved my lean condition a lot but the car still runs lean up top because of the way the calibrator tricks the ECU and uses a different part of the maps.
So anyway, that's all old news. Today I went to ATP and talked to George, the brains behind the operation and the one who does their chips. I told him about the situation and he is certain that he can work out the maps for use with 310cc injectors on our setup. They have been making chips for larger injectors for a while now, and have made chips for injectors as large as 510cc for their turbo setups. I would like to know how many people would be interested in such a chip. 310cc injectors can be bought for about $250 from summit racing and I would think that the chip would cost about the same, maybe cheaper if enough people are interested. This would deffinately be the best solution to our problems. Of course this will only happen if George can in fact create a chip that runs VERY well. 
So let me know who's interested.
Thanks,
-- Ed


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I'm interested if it runs well. For me, this means:
1) Doesn't go lean, and doesn't go super rich.
2) Has the appropriate timing under boost.
3) Has a smooth idle (~760 to 780 rpm).
4) Doesn't have a speed governor.
5) Has a redline of at least 7000 rpm.
6) Drives like stock the rest of the time.


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (duff_man)*

yea I'd be interested but would need to see results first, but good score!!!!!! hopefully these guys can solve the problem, they should package it and sell it as a stage2 kit!!!!!!


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## rycou34 (Apr 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

I'd be very interested also,but for an OBD 1 version.
I have just the opposite problem that you guys are having *too rich!* 
I had an EIP stage IIchip,24# injectors,Walbro,Cartech, and a 4 bar FPR. 
I have switched to the stock injectors and a 3 bar fpr and I will hopefully be on the dyno next week.
If this chip by ATP could help,and run like Marty asked, Im down for one.
Rycou


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## Dr. Blingonian (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rycou34)*

Why not just run a FMU and inline pump.. It will cost the same and leave you with fully adjustable line pressure in case you want to run a 12psi pulley in the future.


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## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

I would be interested. Let me know what you find. Oh yeah, I would need an OBDI.


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Why not just run a FMU and inline pump.. It will cost the same and leave you with fully adjustable line pressure in case you want to run a 12psi pulley in the future.[HR][/HR]​Like I said, this is one of the options people have. It is no where near perfect, however. Doing this, you take the fueling issue completely into your own hands and the ECU no longer has any control over how much fuel is getting in. This means that when external variables such as temperature and altitude change, your fuel mixture will not adjust and you will run lean or rich, or you have to adjust it with a screw driver every time. Another problem, although not a huge one, is that the inline pumps tend to be quite loud and annoying. 
As for the 12psi pulley. This requires a bit more than just fuel. The charge needs to be cooled down with either a custom IC setup or a Water Injection setup, and possible the compression needs to be lowered with a copper head gasket. I am planning to do this in the near future as well, and I'm sure George would be happy to adjust the chip for this application. Call it stage 3 if you will.


[Modified by vausVR6, 11:31 AM 5-8-2002]


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (duff_man)*

quote:[HR][/HR]on a more serious note...is this a big problem w/ supercharge kits? or is this a result of mixing and matching? i'm gettin a vr6 soon, and want to supercharge it. I'm hearing/finding out this vortech SC you speak of (dont knwo what brand) is the way to go...but NOW i'm finding that you guys are having problems with fuel? The motor i'm gettin is an OBD I vr....so if that's a difference...can sombody maybe explain for me...wether it be in IM or by websites....how this can be avoided 100%....the car will be next to a daily driver.....not a far drive, but driven none the less....and i want as much power out of it as possible. (btw, it's goin in a '85 gti)[HR][/HR]​This is a serious problem for both of the SC kits available that use the Vortech blower (AMS and Eurotech). These kits rely on a 4bar FPR and a custom chip to deliver fuel. The problem with this is that it is physically impossible to deliver enough fuel with this setup at high RPM's. Thus everyone runs crazy lean up top, with ridiculously high EGT's (Marty, 1700 I believe?), melting away their nice pistons. The fueling is something that is left up to the user to solve in this case.


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rycou34)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I'd be very interested also,but for an OBD 1 version.
I have just the opposite problem that you guys are having too rich! 
I had an EIP stage IIchip,24# injectors,Walbro,Cartech, and a 4 bar FPR. 
I have switched to the stock injectors and a 3 bar fpr and I will hopefully be on the dyno next week.
If this chip by ATP could help,and run like Marty asked, Im down for one.[HR][/HR]​If you're running a 3bar FPR and stock injectors with a Walbro and Cartech, you're running lean up top (and rich in the midrange, but that's a given).
If you're running a 4bar FPR and stock injectors with a Walbro and Cartech, you're still running a little lean up top (at 6000rpm +).
With 24# injectors it's hard to say. If you run a 4bar and 24# injectors, you throw rich codes up the yin yang and you run too rich even during closed loop. You might be ok up top, but your car would run like a$$ so who cares.








Note that the Walbro is limited in the fuel pressures it can supply... it maxes out around 85psi with stock injectors.
La la la la la la...


[Modified by Marty, 11:45 AM 5-8-2002]


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## Starbug (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

I plan to do a VR6 MK2 swap this year, and supercharging is one of my options.
If you can do it, I'm interested. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Any more interest? I want to get back to George and let him know what kind of interest there is asap.


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

No soup for you!


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## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Have you Vortech guy's tried to use a 5bar with the Z stage 2 chip? The last time I dynoed I was actually 11.7 through the board. This is alittle rich but nice and safe, I figure if I put a header on it will lean it out a point. This would bring me at 12.5-12.7 I gather. If you have a chance try the chip and see how it works for you guy's. Good Luck


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## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I'm currently running the Walbro/Cartech/4bar FPR setup and will dyno soon to see where I'm at, but I would be very interested in the 310cc/custom chip route if it were properly tuned.


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

Just a 5 bar FPR with stock injectors definitely isn't enough...
I ran a 4 bar FPR with a Cartech and a Walbro and started leaning out from 6000 rpm on up. The problem is the Walbro maxes out at 85psi with stock injectors (~5.9 bar).
I'm confident that a Cartech and Walbro will work just fine on a standard Vortech setup... but once you throw a set of 256 cams on there you need a bit more...
Now this setup may "work," as in it may fix the lean problem for stock cam'd Vortech SC'd VR6s... but is it ideal? No. You'll run a perfect mixture at WOT when not under boost... then as you go into boost in the midrange you'll run way rich... then you'll slowly lean out as you hit redline, hoping that you don't go TOO lean before you shift.
The ideal solution is a properly tuned chip for larger injectors. C'mon George, lets see what you can do!


[Modified by Marty, 1:32 AM 5-9-2002]


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

please keep us updated, there is interest.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## scooterman (Dec 30, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

I know this is off the topic of the ATP chip deal, but I feel I need to give my two cents.
There is no way to shortcut the fuel issue. If you want big, reliable HP, you can't skirt the issue. The stock set-up has limitations that create too many problems. If you are running any kind of FMU, you are still limited by the OE-type (be it 3, 4 or 5-bar) FPR. I chose to go all out on my fuel set-up to avoid these problems. In my 88 GTI VR6 with Vortech SC, I'm running a late-style Corrado G60 fuel tank (uses VR6-style in-tank pump) feeding an Accel/Bosch fuel pump (the BIG one). -06AN hose goes to an Aeromotive rising rate regulator and to 24# injectors. I chopped off the end of the fuel rail and welded it shut. The return comes out of the Aeromotive regulator and back to the tank. It wasn't the cheap way, but I feel safe in saying that my fuel system is not my weak link. It's the foundation for every engine mod I have planned, so it had to be done before I could think about doing anything else.
Scott


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (scooterman)*

The VR6 fuel tank and lines are just fine. The best way to do it is to leave the stock pump and run larger injectors at stock fuel pressure with the proper programming. Done!
Running a larger pump, larger lines, and 24# injectors at a static fuel pressure that won't cause a CEL won't stop a Vortech SC'd VR6 from running lean.


[Modified by Marty, 9:25 PM 5-9-2002]


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## scooterman (Dec 30, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Running a larger pump, larger lines, and 24# injectors at a static fuel pressure that won't cause a CEL won't stop a Vortech SC'd VR6 from running lean.[HR][/HR]​Unless you have bigger plans down the road... 'Nuff said.
Scott


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (scooterman)*

with your setup you're still relying on the RRFPR to control the extra fuel delivery. Same thing as using a cartech with an inline pump. It WILL fix the lean condition but not at all perfectly. You will most likely run rich in the middle and the ECU no longer has control over fuel delivery. That's what we're trying to get around.


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I think we all appreciate the various input and whatnot...but let's not turn this into an argument of this or that. Let's just try to keep it on the original topic of interest for ATP's chip.
So, to answer the question...yes, I'm interested as well...as long as it meets the list of requirements that Marty already listed. The sooner the better...too.
If you can, please try to keep us updated on the possible time frame for this. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Dr. Blingonian (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Of course I would be interested.. even though i just spent all that money on a FMU and inline pump..


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Of course I would be interested.. even though i just spent all that money on a FMU and inline pump..







[HR][/HR]​The FMU's and inline pumps have a VERY good resale value either here on the tex or on E-bay. A lot of people use them on import applications for honda's and such. You shouldn't have any problems getting most of your money back.


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
So, to answer the question...yes, I'm interested as well...as long as it meets the list of requirements that Marty already listed. The sooner the better...too.
[HR][/HR]​Yes, if the chip will be available, then it WILL meet all of the requirements listed above. I made sure George knows this and I have agreed to pay him only in that case.
quote:[HR][/HR]
If you can, please try to keep us updated on the possible time frame for this. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​ATP just moved to a new facility and they are in the process of setting up their dynojet in the new shop. George told me that they plan for it to be finished up by this weekend, so with any luck my car will be on the dyno by next week or possibly the week after. Once the car is on the dyno it should take at most 2 or 3 days to map the chip correctly. In either case I will keep all of you updated about the progress. 
Thanks for all the interest!
-- Ed


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

In response to the OBDI inquiries, I currently don't know of any OBDI Vortech'd car in the area. ATP would of course need access to one in order to map the chip for the OBDI since the maps are very different in OBDII. If anyone knows of such a car around the Bay area or somewhere close, or willing to drive down here, please let me know so that we can get the OBDI guys taken care of as well!


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]In response to the OBDI inquiries, I currently don't know of any OBDI Vortech'd car in the area. ATP would of course need access to one in order to map the chip for the OBDI since the maps are very different in OBDII. If anyone knows of such a car around the Bay area or somewhere close, or willing to drive down here, please let me know so that we can get the OBDI guys taken care of as well![HR][/HR]​Hey Ed..."days" is the kind of time I was hoping to hear regarding this deal.








I'm OBD-1 but won't have the charger installed for another few weeks. Although, I'd be willing drive up (I'm in LA) on a Friday night and spend the day Saturday at the shop just so we can get this taken care of.
On the other hand, if somebody else is OBD-1 and lives closer to where ATP is and already has a charger installed...then by all means, feel free to do the honors. I'm just trying to help out as best as I can. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Ed...a huge thanks to you for organizing this as well!!


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Sounds good. If no one else comes forward, then we can arrange something once you have your charger installed.
Thanks for the help
-- Ed


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

good info!!!!!! sooo with the right chip and injectors......??? problem relatively solved.....??? would this run with the 4bar????
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Sounds good. If no one else comes forward, then we can arrange something once you have your charger installed.
Thanks for the help
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​No problem. I just found out at work that we can stop putting in 70 hour, 6 day weeks now!! Woo-hoo!! Means I get my weekends all to myself and my car!!
In all seriousness...it just means I'll be able to get the charger on sooner. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by Dextrose, 8:30 AM 5-11-2002]


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## unitool (Apr 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

can someone please clarify?? Is this just a concern with modded Vortech superchargers? Or do all aftermarket s/c have a lean condition at the top end?


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## Marc A. Brown (Mar 11, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (unitool)*

quote:[HR][/HR]can someone please clarify?? Is this just a concern with modded Vortech superchargers? Or do all aftermarket s/c have a lean condition at the top end?[HR][/HR]​Most aftermarket SCs have a lean condition on the top end when running the stock fuel system. Most do run in a "safe" range at WOT and have programming to optimize what fuel is being delivered, but you will notice a ramp up in your A/F ratio.


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marc A. Brown)*

quote:[HR][/HR]good info!!!!!! sooo with the right chip and injectors......??? problem relatively solved.....??? would this run with the 4bar????[HR][/HR]​Yes, hopefully if all goes well, the right chip and 310cc injectors running on the 4bar FPR will solve our problems. We will use the 4bar because with it, the 310cc injectors should be running at just under 90% duty cycle (very rough estimate).
quote:[HR][/HR]can someone please clarify?? Is this just a concern with modded Vortech superchargers? Or do all aftermarket s/c have a lean condition at the top end?
[HR][/HR]​Well there are really only two SC setups for the VR6. Z-engineering and the vortech whether it be an AMS or Eurotech Kit. The Z kit only pushes about 6psi which can be handled with the stock fuel system with a 4bar or 5bar FPR and their chip. The ~10psi that the Vortech kits push requires the fuel system to be upgraded or you will run dangerously lean, as a lot of people have been!


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Hey Ed,
Any news recently on this? 
This past weekend I installed a VR6 gas tank and fuel pump in preparation for the charger. Still trying to get to the bottom of my other problem first (missing 25 hp) although I think we've got it narrowed down to either a vacuum leak, causing the FPR not to function properly or a bad rear knock sensor.
In anycase, as soon as I get it resolved I'll be ready to install the kit...and we can take it from there in terms of what needs to be done in order to get an OBD-1 chip burned for 310cc injectors. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## scooterman (Dec 30, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I am down for the chip if George makes it happen! I have an OBD-1 distributor motor in my car.
Scott


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (scooterman)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have an OBD-1 distributor motor in my car.[HR][/HR]​Sweet!! We're talkin' oldskool now!!


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Ok. I finally got in contact with George and set up an appointment for the 28th of this month. This is a little later than I had expected but its still not too bad. Hopefully by the 29th we'll have a nice chip for us


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Ok. I finally got in contact with George and set up an appointment for the 28th of this month. This is a little later than I had expected but its still not too bad. Hopefully by the 29th we'll have a nice chip for us







[HR][/HR]​Excellent!! Thanks again for taking the initiative on this one!!







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Any idea of when a OBDI car will get a turn? And when we are talking about OBDI, are we talking Coilpack or Dist?


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Any idea of when a OBDI car will get a turn? And when we are talking about OBDI, are we talking Coilpack or Dist?[HR][/HR]​I'm working on it as fast as I can. When you've only got weekends to get sh!t done...you can only move so fast. I suspect my car will be ready in June sometime...which isn't really that much longer than the OBD-2 appointment Ed just informed us of today.
My engine is coilpack. 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Sound great Dextrose! I am not in THAT big of a hurry but I would love to have everything finished by waterfest. Would the 310cc inj. work on a Eurotech chip for the time being?


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Sound great Dextrose! I am not in THAT big of a hurry but I would love to have everything finished by waterfest. Would the 310cc inj. work on a Eurotech chip for the time being?[HR][/HR]​I hear ya. Believe me...I also want to get this problem solved as fast as possible too. As for the 310cc injectors with the Eurotech chip...and nothing else? I just don't know, because I have yet to install the kit.


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## rycou34 (Apr 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Couple of questions for you guys. 
Would an OBDI coilpack chip work on a dist. car?
And if not, doesn't anyone in Cali have an SC OBDI dist car they want chipped?
Thanks
Rycou


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rycou34)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Couple of questions for you guys. 
Would an OBDI coilpack chip work on a dist. car?
And if not, doesn't anyone in Cali have an SC OBDI dist car they want chipped?
Thanks
Rycou[HR][/HR]​I'm gonna hope and keep my fingers crossed for you guys that it WILL work. If I had to guess...I'd guess that it would work since OBD-1 is OBD-1 whether it's with a coilpack or distributor.


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## rycou34 (Apr 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Thanks Brian
I am hoping that it works too.
Good luck on your install, whenever you get the chance http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by rycou34, 12:33 PM 5-16-2002]


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rycou34)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks Brian
I am hoping that it works too.[HR][/HR]​No problem. But, we will definitely need to find out for sure...and we will. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## JimGTIVR6 (Jul 18, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

u guys scare me. im not driving my car anymore. O wait, i cant the tranny is broken. Okay well.. when i get it fixed, it goes on the dyno. I find out how lean its running, i cry. end of story. hehe


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## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (JimGTIVR6)*

What happened to your tranny, was it cause of the charger?


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## alpine (May 26, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR] What happened to your tranny, was it cause of the charger?[HR][/HR]​
Have you ever seen the way he drives







bwhahahaha


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## JimGTIVR6 (Jul 18, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

hehe... a diff is the WEAK link on a VW tranny. I broke that link. It just means more $$ and more upgrades


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Sound great Dextrose! I am not in THAT big of a hurry but I would love to have everything finished by waterfest. Would the 310cc inj. work on a Eurotech chip for the time being?[HR][/HR]​You can install the 310cc injectors and the MAF "calibrator" that was discussed above and use the Eurotech chip. This will help the lean problem, but will not completely solve it. Marty dyno'd at 271whp with this setup... he IS still running a bit lean up top but this is only because of the chip maps which are not adjusted correctly. 
As far as OBDI, as soon as anyone makes it to the Bay Area with an OBDI car, we can have an OBDI chip. I'm not sure about the coilpack/distributor issue. It may work but I would expect it to not since it seems like it would be a completely different system... but who knows. I will ask George about this when I get my chip done on the 28th.


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## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Does anyone have the post that discusses the MAF "calibrator"? I have searched for it but have not been able to find it. I thought it would be a nice project for today or tomorrow. Would it make a difference on my system now with just the Eurotech chip and stock inj?


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## brendo (Sep 21, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

I have been using the same chip with an adjustable fpr (not rising rate).
I plan to get it dynoed in a week or so; but according to the data logs, I have not been going lean at the top. The fpr is set to about 4.5 bar currently.


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## brendo (Sep 21, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (scooterman)*

Running a fmu is not limited by the stock regulator. Say you have a 3 bar stock regulator and are running an fmu set to ~4 bar, everything before that fmu will be at the pressure of the fmu.


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (brendo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have been using the same chip with an adjustable fpr (not rising rate).
I plan to get it dynoed in a week or so; but according to the data logs, I have not been going lean at the top. The fpr is set to about 4.5 bar currently.[HR][/HR]​What have you logged and why do you think you are not running lean? Do you have an EGT gauge to monitor?


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

good stuff.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

Bump


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

tomorow is the day. wish us luck


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]tomorow is the day. wish us luck







[HR][/HR]​Cool. Of course we wish you luck. I just picked up my tranny with the new quaife installed. Unfortunately, SLOW ASS Turn2 couldn't manage to get me my front motor mount by this weekend...so putting the engine back in is gonna have to wait until next weekend.


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## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Definetley let us know how it goes. Do you have any ideas as to how much the chip would cost? Under 300 I would hope







.
LEE


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

I feel a group buy about to happen..... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

It's your big day! Make us proud.










[Modified by Marty, 6:22 AM 5-28-2002]


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]It's your big day! Make us proud.







[HR][/HR]​LOL Yeah!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Guess not everyone was wishing us good luck. I just got a call from George saying that they broke their dyno! I'm very dissapointed. We have re-schedueled for next Monday (June 3). I am very sorry for the dellay.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

That sucks man! Oh well, Ive got time. I wont even have my charger for at least another week or two. Good luck on the 3rd, and grab some dyno sheets to post if you can!!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
LEE


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Uh huh. You slept in, bastard!


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (scooterman)*

on my eurotech charged car i ran a 4.0 bar FPR and that was it. ran fine and went 13.5 with full interior, street tires. only the charger and exhaust... with the system in the back http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i went to a 3.0 bar with a vortech fmu and it saved gas and ran a lot better off boost. on boost was the same as normal.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]on my eurotech charged car i ran a 4.0 bar FPR and that was it. ran fine and went 13.5 with full interior, street tires. only the charger and exhaust... with the system in the back http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i went to a 3.0 bar with a vortech fmu and it saved gas and ran a lot better off boost. on boost was the same as normal. [HR][/HR]​"running fine" doesn't mean anything. You were getting very high EGT's and slowly melting your pistons! 
quote:[HR][/HR]Uh huh. You slept in, bastard![HR][/HR]​Haha yea.. slept in till 6PM?


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Well good luck on Monday and hopefully no more mishaps... I think they'll have a lot of customers if the chip programming goes as planned.


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]on my eurotech charged car i ran a 4.0 bar FPR and that was it. ran fine and went 13.5 with full interior, street tires. only the charger and exhaust... with the system in the back http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i went to a 3.0 bar with a vortech fmu and it saved gas and ran a lot better off boost. on boost was the same as normal. 
"running fine" doesn't mean anything. You were getting very high EGT's and slowly melting your pistons! 
Uh huh. You slept in, bastard!
Haha yea.. slept in till 6PM?[HR][/HR]​well lets see. my car has over 100k miles with no problems.







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif pistons look fine, along with the stock rings, bearings and head gasket on 10 psi of boost... more than most people run. also on stock headbolts. the only thing that didnt hold is the diff i blew apart


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

Too bad it's physically impossible to NOT run lean with that setup, otherwise I'd almost believe you!


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

true dat.... 
what are roughly the numbers that our stock pump is good till nad our injectors? also what exactly is a Bar, like what does a 4bar translate to....numbers wise....
other than that ....To The Tiggity...


----------



## blown_sixdub (Dec 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

a bar is a metric unit of pressure
1 bar = 14.5038 psi 4 bar then = 58.015 psi


----------



## S0ULB0Y (Jan 30, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blown_sixdub)*

I've been following this thread for a while and Im definitely interested in the OBDI chip's if they can be had. What I'm really interested in is what I can do for the meantime, I've got a Eurotech chip and that's all I'll have for about a week. Will this be fine to drive around until I get my cartech fmu? and should I even bother to go for an inline pump while this chip is in the works?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (S0ULB0Y)*

You can drive your car with the Eurotech chip, but be sure to never take it above 5000RPM so that you don't run lean. If you are going the cartech route then you will need an inline pump. Another choice is to get 30# injectors and build yourself a little MAF calibrator. That way when an OBDI chip is ready, you can just pop the chip in and be set.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Does anyone have the post that discusses the MAF "calibrator"? I have searched for it but have not been able to find it. I thought it would be a nice project for today or tomorrow. Would it make a difference on my system now with just the Eurotech chip and stock inj?[HR][/HR]​Here are the instructions for the calibrator as posted previously:
Calibrator:
Connector Housing(s): 1 of each part number needed
357-972-754
357-972-764
Wires with terminals:
2 of each will give you all 4 pin/sockets.
000-979-219
000-979-225-A
Gromets: (not required, but completes project)
8 (4 for each connector housing)
357-972-741-B
This is for the 4-pin OBD2 connector.... I'm not sure when this style 
of connector began use...maybe with the first Golf/Jetta VR6.
Then you'll need a 10k 20-turn 'pot' form Radio Shack, less than $1.
Use the Bently book ot verify which pins are which.
Basically connect the 'end' legs of the pot to the + and - MAF signal (MAF side).
connect the + MAF signal from the ECU side to the middle leg.
connect the - MAF signal from the ECU side to the same end leg as the
- MAF signal from the MAF side. 
Connect the - and + power to pass power through, no mod to power.
Adjust the 'pot' so that the voltage comming thru to the ECU side
is roughly 86% (this is for 30# injectors on a VR6) of the signal from
the MAF side. 
Adjust the resistance between the + and - on tthe ECU
side to roughly 8.6K ohms and 10K on the MAF side.
Adjust as needed using the VAg-Com tool so that the LTFT is -5%. (for safety...)


----------



## Blitzkrieg (Mar 19, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Somewhat related to this topic... Where are you guys getting your Vortech SC kits from or are you building them yourselves? I tried going the EuroTech route with no success







and as far as I know, AMS is the only one still selling them (?) A friend of mine has the AMS kit and I remember his first comment about it was that the chip that came with the kit had the rev limiter set at a really low RPM (perhaps set so that a fueling problem didn't occur.) 
Anyway, if I can figure out where to buy the kit, or build it myself, I'll probably be interested in this chip/fuel problem solution as well







I'd almost like to build my own kit because I'd prefer to have the Vortec V2SQ charger which AMS doesn't offer, but I don't know if I'd be able to get all the parts to do it.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Blitzkrieg)*

I was fortunate enough to actually get a kit from Eurotech with the V2SQ. I believe Les is still selling them although I'm not sure if its wise to try to buy from him. Otherwise if you want to build it yourself, the main issue would be the bracket which you'd need to custom make. The other stuff is simple enough.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I to was fortunate enough to get a Eurotech kit (used) with the V2 blower. I actually got it from XXX008XXX (Chris).







Although, I STILL haven't been able to install it yet. I'm putting my engine back in this weekend. So, I'm hoping to have the kit on within the next few weeks and be the OBD-1 car that ATP uses to make the OBD-1 chips. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Well get to it Dextrose!








We are waiting....







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Well get to it Dextrose!








We are waiting....







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​LOL I know I know!! It's bad enough when I've got work hasseling me to work 6 days a week.







Believe me though, I want this as badly as the rest of you!!


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Too bad it's physically impossible to NOT run lean with that setup, otherwise I'd almost believe you!







[HR][/HR]​my car never ran lean. more rich than lean. i dont know but maybe my car was a freak


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]my car never ran lean. more rich than lean. i dont know but maybe my car was a freak[HR][/HR]​So I guess you had an EGT gauge hooked up and verified that with a wide-band O2?


----------



## GTIVR6RACER4EVER (Oct 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

Was it with stock gearing? Also what RPM were you at?
Also I remember someone did a drag coefficent analysis on top speeds, and the body of the gti (vr6) was limited to about 150mph. I know of Vr6's doing 160 for a couple minutes... but thats in europe







I know you were doing over 140 though for sure, but I dont think it was actually 160, maybe like 145-150. Still insane though, congrats on getting that fast, now its time to go that fast on a turn...left and right, haha. Chris ya think my car looked low? It doesn't look too bad. Also congrats on getting your lcns back, hehe, its been a while. Have fun, and be careful. peace


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (GTIVR6RACER4EVER)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Was it with stock gearing? Also what RPM were you at?
Also I remember someone did a drag coefficent analysis on top speeds, and the body of the gti (vr6) was limited to about 150mph. I know of Vr6's doing 160 for a couple minutes... but thats in europe







I know you were doing over 140 though for sure, but I dont think it was actually 160, maybe like 145-150. Still insane though, congrats on getting that fast, now its time to go that fast on a turn...left and right, haha. Chris ya think my car looked low? It doesn't look too bad. Also congrats on getting your lcns back, hehe, its been a while. Have fun, and be careful. peace[HR][/HR]​think you got the wrong thread


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (GTIVR6RACER4EVER)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Also I remember someone did a drag coefficent analysis on top speeds, and the body of the gti (vr6) was limited to about 150mph.[HR][/HR]​That of course depends on your gearing and torque curve!


----------



## JimGTIVR6 (Jul 18, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

my a/f curve showed i started to go to the lean side but never saw an A/F number above 13.5 and that was at 6500 rpm's.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (JimGTIVR6)*

You were running lean from 6k up. And how much boost were you running again?


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

my air fuel guage red rich all the way up to 7200 rpm. no i didnt have a y band o2 although i wish i did....


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]my air fuel guage red rich all the way up to 7200 rpm. [HR][/HR]​So did mine, but I ran too lean from 5500rpm on up, and hit EGTs as high as 1800 F.


----------



## JimGTIVR6 (Jul 18, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

heres a good question.. how many of you guys running on dynos with wideband o2's are still running cats?! 
cat's will mess up your a/f readings..


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]my air fuel guage red rich all the way up to 7200 rpm. 
So did mine, but I ran too lean from 5500rpm on up, and hit EGTs as high as 1800 F.







[HR][/HR]​ok but. it also depends on what your exhaust was also. if you have a restrictive exhaust its going to hold more heat in, and being mine was, well, wide open, i never had too much of a problem with the car or exhaust getting too hot. i had a brospeed header, test pipe, and a borla muffler you could see rite thru. all 2.5 mandrel bent. the ONLY time my car EVER shot flames was going 160 mph for a good 30 - 45 min. dont ask where


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]ok but. it also depends on what your exhaust was also. [HR][/HR]​Why are you in such denial? The relative exhaust sizes has a negligible effect in terms of "retaining heat" in the region of the exhaust port output. In fact, your free-flowing exhaust system is allowing you to draw MORE air into the combustion chamber (you're claiming that it makes more power than a restrictive exhaust, correct?), resulting in a leaner mixture and HIGHER EGTs. You're running lean, you're running lean, neener neener neeeeener...


[Modified by Marty, 1:42 PM 6-1-2002]


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

i didnt say it made more power, but i know my EGTs were not high and i was not running lean. maybe i had a different chip than you or something. who knows but my car ran good.


----------



## scooterman (Dec 30, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

There's no arguing with the all-knowing Marty... He never fails to amaze me - he knows everything!! I bet if you ask him, he could tell you what you had for lunch today.
Scott


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i didnt say it made more power, but i know my EGTs were not high and i was not running lean. maybe i had a different chip than you or something. who knows but my car ran good. [HR][/HR]​Did you have an EGT gauge? Where was the probe installed? What temperatures did you see at redline?


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

marty. what kit do you have? eurotech or ams?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

what's the matter? can't answere a simple question? Did you have an EGT gauge?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]marty. what kit do you have? eurotech or ams?[HR][/HR]​My kit came from Eurocrap. The chip doesn't matter. I assume you ran the stolen AMS errr... I mean Eurocrap chip in your car? Six 205cc injectors at 4 bar at 100% DC can't support enough fuel for the setup past 5500rpm.
I think we should setup a support group for people running lean with Vortech SC'd VR6s.









quote:[HR][/HR]There's no arguing with the all-knowing Marty... He never fails to amaze me - he knows everything!! I bet if you ask him, he could tell you what you had for lunch today.[HR][/HR]​Hah hah very funny, mofo! And yes, you did have dillz with a side of ballz for lunch today.


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

my kit was a eurotech. it wasnt all that bad. i ran faster than most people with less work. 13.5 with street tires. brospeed header, no cat and tt exhaust with no resonators, and neuspeed wires. ground controll fake coilovers on stock struts. i had no diff, a stock clutch, full interior, 2 10" subs and a amp. this was on bald street tires i must add but i did manage to get a 2.1 60 foot time (dont ask how cause i couldnt tell you). i have seen people with cams, manifold, quaffe and a bunch of other stuff not even come close to that. my car also had 90k on the clock. not so shabby for a used supercharger and a piss poor pay check.


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

o yea marty. do you ever see boost creep with your charger. i had a 10 psi pully and on some cold nights i would see up to 13 psi on the boost guage. i havent heard of this happening to anyone else being that most people with chargers either show there cars or dont abuse them all the time. o well just wondering


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]o yea marty. do you ever see boost creep with your charger. i had a 10 psi pully and on some cold nights i would see up to 13 psi on the boost guage. i havent heard of this happening to anyone else being that most people with chargers either show there cars or dont abuse them all the time. o well just wondering







[HR][/HR]​The boost that a charger pushed depends on the density of the air that its pulling in. So on a cold night you do see slightly higher boost numbers than on a hot day. Interesting how u say that most people with chargers just show their cars... I suppose this is true of people with Z-kits but it seems like the vortech crowd is a lot more performance minded. Also could you please answere the question I asked you twice alread... Did you have an EGT gauge?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I have an EGT gauge. I haven't actually installed the gauge yet, but the probe is mounted right in the second exhaust manifold at the cylinder 5 exhaust port about 2 inches from the head. Should make for some pretty accurate readings. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by Dextrose, 3:29 PM 6-3-2002]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

yep.. that's a good place for it. I was however, referring to XXX008XXX's post when he said that his EGT's are not high. I just want to know if he actually has an EGT gauge that is telling him that they're not high or if he just assumes that they're not high


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Go to ATP and wait patiently!


----------



## Starbug (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]yep.. that's a good place for it. I was however, referring to XXX008XXX's post when he said that his EGT's are not high. I just want to know if he actually has an EGT gauge that is telling him that they're not high or if he just assumes that they're not high







[HR][/HR]​And where should the probe go, Vaus?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Starbug)*

quote:[HR][/HR]And where should the probe go, Vaus?














[HR][/HR]​He just said that where I placed mine was a GOOD location. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Ok... here goes. Went to ATP today at 6:30pm. Ran a baseline dyno using the 310cc injectors with the MAF calibrator, got 245.5HP and 211.8TQ. Air fuel wasn't horrible but still quite a bit all over the place and creaping up toward redline. After some tunning and letting the car cool down we got a nice flat a/f curve and 269.6HP and 236.1TQ!!! This is all on crappy california 91 octane pump gas. EGT's stay nice and low and the curve is pretty smooth. After getting full throttle right, George dialed in the part throttle maps and the idle (which is smooth as butter). He still wants me to come back for another short session to work out any bugs I may encounter while actually driving the car. I will post the before and after dynos as soon as I get them online.
Now for the post-tunning impressions. When I first pulled out of the parking lot I redlined 1st and second. Imediately I noticed how much smoother the power delivery is and how much harder it now pulls up top! Very noticable gains here. It idles like a champ also. So far the only bug I want to work out is that there is a bit of a jolt when going from deceleration to part throttle. This will be my main agenda for the next session which I will set up next week after I finish all my finals. All in all I'm very satisfied and VERY impressed that my motor with 87k on it put down 269hp to the ground using the standard vortech pulley and basically no other engine mods. 
Once we have the chip free of the little bugs, everyone can order it and enjoy their chargers!
-- Ed


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

GOOD NEWS!!!!!
now you said you have the MAf thing and 310s....you are running a 4bar?stock pump? stock exhaust? cat convert? 
you da man....way to run with this......please keep us updated..... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by IMWALKIN, 12:30 PM 6-4-2002]


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Outstanding!! Those are great numbers Ed. Thanks a lot for the prompt feedback on this as well. Damn, now I'm really itching to get mine all back together and get up there! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Edit: Before I forget, are those numbers at the crank or at the wheels?


[Modified by Dextrose, 7:19 AM 6-4-2002]


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Sounds sweet! Do you have a copy of the curve with A/F ratio?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Also, any CELs? Is the redline at 7000rpm?


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

I am very excited now. I can't wait to see what Dextrose can put down.


----------



## Myron (Apr 18, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR] snipped a bit; Interesting how u say that most people with chargers just show their cars... I suppose this is true of people with Z-kits but it seems like the vortech crowd is a lot more performance minded. [HR][/HR]​Not







. I have a Z kit and I can assure you that it's not for looks







. BTW, good job on the chip tuning. Looks like you just about got it dialed in.


----------



## xblast (Feb 11, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Myron)*

where do i sign up? i tried runnign the EIP turbo chip with 310cc injectors and now im running so rich that the car chokes. 
please let me know when i can order one


----------



## Starbug (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Before I forget, are those numbers at the crank or at the wheels?
[Modified by Dextrose, 7:19 AM 6-4-2002][HR][/HR]​Why the wheels, of course, my good man.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Starbug)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Why the wheels, of course, my good man.







[HR][/HR]​Most excellent!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]GOOD NEWS!!!!!
now you said you have the MAf thing and 310s....you are running a 4bar?stock pump? stock exhaust? cat convert? 
you da man....way to run with this......please keep us updated..... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

[Modified by IMWALKIN, 12:30 PM 6-4-2002][HR][/HR]​Well I had the MAF calibrator on before we did the chip tunning. That is no longer required. Now I just have the 310cc injectors on a 4bar FPR, stock pump, with the cat.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Also, any CELs? Is the redline at 7000rpm?[HR][/HR]​No CEL's. Redline is set to 7100 if you dare to rev that high










[Modified by vausVR6, 10:25 AM 6-4-2002]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Here's the dyno. Sorry bout the quality.








The red curves are the baseline done with the 310cc injectors and the MAF calibrator.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Looks good! A little bumpy but nothin' too bad. I wonder how well it will run on Vortech setups with cams...


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

BTW let's all thank [email protected] for making it happen!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]BTW let's all thank [email protected] for making it happen![HR][/HR]​I hear that!! Thanks George AND Ed!!!























BTW...and mention on pricing for this yet??


----------



## VWpowa (Mar 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

now someone get him to do a chip for obd I distributor motors....and uhmm...lets just say i will pull my 268 cams and look into buying a turbo kit ... = )


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

No word on pricing just yet. I'll also talk to him about the possibility of a group buy if a lot of people are interested. We'll work those details out once the chip is completely finished.
During the next session I also want to try running some octane boost to see if it will smooth out some of those bumps and possibly be good for a couple extra HP.


----------



## Blitzkrieg (Mar 19, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

So, does AMS do "group buys" on their SC's so I'd have something to plug this new chip into?







Of course, they don't advertise on the Vortex so I guess the buy would have to take place *elsewhere*.


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Blitzkrieg)*

I am also very interested. I have been running AMS software and it sucks ass. My plan was to get a hold of a stage 2 Z chip, walbro pump, and a cartech FMU to help even things out. I like how things are turnig out with this bigger injector setup, though, and would purchase if it becomes avaliable.
Let me just get one thing straight; you got 269 whp with stock pulley, stock fuel pump, no FMU? Simply bigger injectors and this new chip? And we wouldnt need the MAF calibrator?
If this is true, you can def sign me up. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
Let me just get one thing straight; you got 269 whp with stock pulley, stock fuel pump, no FMU? Simply bigger injectors and this new chip? And we wouldnt need the MAF calibrator?
If this is true, you can def sign me up. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​Yes.. that's exactly correct. Just 310cc injectors and the chip with no MAF calibrator or anything like that. The Baseline dyno was done using the GIAC stage 2 chip with big injectors and the MAF calibrator.


----------



## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Myron)*

I race my Z-kit, no fun in standing around and showing it off!








Great #'s by the way!!


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

hey VAUS...what do you mean the base line was done with the use of a Z2 Garett chip?....can you explain, or did I read that wrong? thanks


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Some good news. My next session has been moved up to next Wed. the 12th. So hopefully if all goes well we will have a chip available for purchase by thurs. I will talk to George about pricing and will let you guys know the details.


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Ed, exactly which injectors(manufacturer) are you using for the dyno tuning and were they flow tested prior to the chip tuning or are they new? I'm also wondering how this will effect our great California emissions results? If the chip is properly tuned the HC levels shouldn't change that much, right? Also, thanks for all the leg work on this...


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

I think Ed is using the Ford Racing 30# injectors from Summit Racing. My set just arrived 2 days ago!!







Their color is a dark orangish/red. About $220 for the set of 8. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif In CA they arrive like a day or two after you order them.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Yep that's what I'm running. Hurry up and finish the damn chip, you ho!


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

Regarding emissions, someone just has to go test to see... :\ Theoretically it should be a bit dirtier, but hopefully we'll still be passing!


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Yea.. I'm using the Ford racing injectors... and they were new. As far as emmisions, who knows.. theoretically we should still be ok and part of the purpose of the next session is going to be to tweak cold start a bit so that we are hopefully still emissions friendly


----------



## Vento FI (Apr 19, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Any other good new about the chip?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Vento FI)*

For all the OBD-1 guys out there...it looks like I'll begin making preparations this weekend for the supercharger install. If all goes well I expect it should be on and running within the next 2 weeks. At which point, I'll be in touch with George to make arrangements for getting in there and getting an OBD-1 chip burned for us. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## CyberGTi (Jan 22, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Are these 30lbs injectors plug and play or do I need to splice the wirings. I'm maybe needing to upgrade to this as I'm already at 80% or higher duty cycle on stock injectors for my 2000 VR6.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (CyberGTi)*

Well... I went to ATP today for the second session and sadly George wasn't able to work out the buck. He said that he will contact people he knows who know Motronic inside and out and will see what they have to say about it. Currently I have an appointment set for Tues. the 25th and George said that he should know how to fix it by then. Other than the buck, however, everything seems great. No CEL's no problems... the long term fuel trim is at a nice -0.8% and the car feels great. BTW, assuming that he fixes the bucking problem, he said that he will charge everyone $300 for the chip... Much better than Z's stage 2 for $450 and this chip really works well. 
Sorry for all the waiting but we spent about 4 hours today trying to figure out what is causing the buck and could not work it out. All good things take time


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

No problem...we really appreciate your effort along with George's. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## briang (Mar 10, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Now that AMS is the only place to get the Vortech Charger kit, what are the chances that George would want to offer a complete vortech supercharger kit in addition to his turbo kit line up?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (briang)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Now that AMS is the only place to get the Vortech Charger kit, what are the chances that George would want to offer a complete vortech supercharger kit in addition to his turbo kit line up? [HR][/HR]​I hear that. I think there could be some serious money made if a properly setup kit was offered from the get go. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (scooterman)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I am down for the chip if George makes it happen! I have an OBD-1 distributor motor in my car.
Scott[HR][/HR]​I'm down too! I'm piecing together a Vortech kit for the SLC and will definitely be interested in the chip. 
Keep us posted. Thanks for taking the initiative on this guys! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

Is this chip gonna be available for a while or is it gonna be a buy it now or yer outta luck deal. I may be interested in a couple months but dont have any cash. I just bought my charger.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Is this chip gonna be available for a while or is it gonna be a buy it now or yer outta luck deal. I may be interested in a couple months but dont have any cash. I just bought my charger.[HR][/HR]​I don't see why it woulnd't be available from now on. It's not like George is just gonna trash all the work he's been doing with Ed. Not to mention, there seems to be quite a market out there for this...so I think you'll be fine. If you want to know for sure, then just ask George himself. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I'm sure George will keep the program on file and will make it available from now on. As far as providing a complete SC kit, I don't think that George is interested in doing this but I will bring it up. I'm also currently planning on having a setup running a 12lb. pulley with an aquamist WI kit by the end of the summer. I also have plans drawn up for a "dual mode boost" to use with this setup. So if for instance you run out of water, or just don't want to use the WI all the time, the system will switch over to the original 10psi or whatever boost you like and when the WI is on, the full 12psi will be utilized. I also want to wire it so that if for instance the water pump fails or something goes wrong, it imidiately switches to the low boost setting so you don't blow your motor. Right now I figure this shouldn't cost very much. Basically I need a relatively cheap wastegate and about $100 on top of that to make this work. Now that classes are finaly over, I'll have some time to put this together and see if it actually works


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I am down for the chip if George makes it happen! I have an OBD-1 distributor motor in my car.
Scott
I'm down too! I'm piecing together a Vortech kit for the SLC and will definitely be interested in the chip. 
Keep us posted. Thanks for taking the initiative on this guys! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​I third the need for an OBD1 dist chip


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I third the need for an OBD1 dist chip







[HR][/HR]​As far as I know...there is no need for a different chip on OBD-1 dist. vs. OBD-1 coilpack. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I third the need for an OBD1 dist chip








As far as I know...there is no need for a different chip on OBD-1 dist. vs. OBD-1 coilpack. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​i was just gonna ask that...i hope ur right


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

so would we beable to run this chip without injectors? if not will ATP be selling them as well? looks good!!!!! know if we could just solve the belt tensioning problem......any thoughts?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]so would we beable to run this chip without injectors? if not will ATP be selling them as well? looks good!!!!! know if we could just solve the belt tensioning problem......any thoughts?[HR][/HR]​Absolutely not. The whole point is to use the larger injectors correctly to deliver enough fuel! ATP does sell 310cc injectors but I believe they're more expensive than the ones you can get at summitracing.com. What belt tensioning problem are you speaking of? The system isn't perfect but whenever the belt starts to slip once in a while, just tighten the tensioning bolt half a turn or so and all is fine. This happens because the belt gets worn in when its new. Also try some belt dressing to reduce the slipping.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I will be organizing a loose "group buy" of sorts on billet anodized aluminum water pump pulleys of my own design soon (within the next 2 weeks or so). Slap one of 'em on and SHAZAM, no more belt tensioning worries... that is until you eat a water pump or alternator bearing...








My water pump pulley hasn't gone yet, but I'll be keeping one of these bad boys around for the second it does! Screw replacing that damn pulley over and over and over...










[Modified by Marty, 7:13 PM 6-16-2002]


----------



## alteregovw (Apr 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

If you (marty or Vaus) want to put together buyers for anything to do with making the Vortech based kits better then just let me know and I'll donate a page on my site to it and give you the link to use in your sig or give to others. Anyone who emails me their info and wants in I will post their names on the page to keep count and forward their contact info to the appropriate person.
Sound good? 
I'm in for the chip definitely when it's ready to go!!


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (alteregovw)*

Any more progress on this chip?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

I know Ed is scheduled to be back in with ATP again soon...I think maybe this week.

I've been talking to George about getting in there for us OBD-1 guys. You guys have to realize that ATP is mad booked right now because Waterfest on the east coast is coming up...not to mention, it's summer time.
My time line is EXTREMELY tight. I'm departing for Florida in 6 weeks...regardless, George was way cool enough to try and work with me on this so we can get together a solution for the OBD-1 guys as well. I'll know more next Friday. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Dex, thanks for getting in contact with George http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I do have an appointment schedueled for this tues. the 25th but I've been speaking to george over the past week and he's having a hard time determining what is causing this buck. I will go in on tues. and we'll try to play with some stuff to try to fix it. This has been a real PITA but George considers the request to fix the buck to be more than reasonable so hopefully we'll get it done.
Also a little news... Marty did some testing with this chip on his setup which includes DSR 256 cams and found that the 310cc injectors are not enough. Basically with the standard AMS/Eurotech setup, we're maxxing out the 310cc injectors and the stock fuel pump. It looks like anything that will push more air such as cams or a smaller pulley will require a walbro with either bigger injectors or a 5 bar FPR. I am still planning on doing this later this summer when I make some more money. Just thought I'd let you guys know.


----------



## MKII16v (Oct 23, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Can they not trim down some 440's?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MKII16v)*

oops


[Modified by Marty, 3:07 PM 6-23-2002]


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MKII16v)*

I'm sure they could, but those puppies are like $400 per set of 8!


----------



## MKII16v (Oct 23, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

But that should eliminate the lean problem for those of us with cams and different intake mannies on top of the charger.


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MKII16v)*

my car is not running lean, but i am intrested in a higher rev limiter.. the 6800 limiter i have now sux http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

quote:[HR][/HR]...the 6800 limiter i have now sux http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif [HR][/HR]​
Better safe than sorry. Better to live to fight another day.


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

heh.. my VR has been waaaaaay past that little number before







so its 6800 for all the little school girl VR6's and 7500 for all the $5 wh0res


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

this chip has a rev limiter at 7125RMP.
Yes we could deffinately code a chip for larger injectors but there was no way of knowing that we needed even bigger ones before. I am in the same boat as everyone else. Before I even started I had planned to go to a 12psi pulley and possibly cams later this summer and just have the chip re-mapped. Now it looks like in order to do that I'll need larger injectors and either a walbro or an inline fuel pump since the stock is being stretched to its limits as it is.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Wouldn't ya know it? The day before my appointment at ATP, George's wife went into labor and had a baby. They're reschedueling all appointments for next week. Even more delays.


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Yeah, when I talked with him last Friday...he mentioned that might happen.







It's good to hear though that things have been rescheduled as early as next week. He's trying to get me in there the weekend of July 6th. Let's keep our fingers crossed. Otherwise...the OBD-1 chip might not happen for a WHILE!


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## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Yeah, when I talked with him last Friday...he mentioned that might happen.







It's good to hear though that things have been rescheduled as early as next week. He's trying to get me in there the weekend of July 6th. Let's keep our fingers crossed. Otherwise...the OBD-1 chip might not happen for a WHILE![HR][/HR]​that charger in yet????


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (XXX008XXX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]that charger in yet????[HR][/HR]​LOL 4 more days...4 more days!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
Here are the instructions for the calibrator as posted previously:
Calibrator:
Connector Housing(s): 1 of each part number needed
357-972-754
357-972-764
Wires with terminals:
2 of each will give you all 4 pin/sockets.
000-979-219
000-979-225-A
Gromets: (not required, but completes project)
8 (4 for each connector housing)
357-972-741-B
This is for the 4-pin OBD2 connector.... I'm not sure when this style 
of connector began use...maybe with the first Golf/Jetta VR6.
Then you'll need a 10k 20-turn 'pot' form Radio Shack, less than $1.
Use the Bently book ot verify which pins are which.
Basically connect the 'end' legs of the pot to the + and - MAF signal (MAF side).
connect the + MAF signal from the ECU side to the middle leg.
connect the - MAF signal from the ECU side to the same end leg as the
- MAF signal from the MAF side. 
Connect the - and + power to pass power through, no mod to power.
*Adjust the 'pot' so that the voltage comming thru to the ECU side
is roughly 86% (this is for 30# injectors on a VR6) of the signal from
the MAF side. *
Adjust the resistance between the + and - on tthe ECU
side to roughly 8.6K ohms and 10K on the MAF side.
*Adjust as needed using the VAg-Com tool so that the LTFT is -5%. (for safety...)*
[HR][/HR]​What would you guys suggest as a tuning method on OBD-1 cars where we don't have access to data like the LTFT?? Just go with the 86% rule? Only reason I ask, is because I'm installing this weekend. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by Dextrose, 4:00 PM 6-28-2002]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I'd say go with 86% or whatever. It should be fine as long as its within 25% although I'm not sure if OBDI works the same way. Also, don't be surprised when if you get a buck from decel to part throttle. You might not since you're OBDI but who knows.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I'd say go with 86% or whatever. It should be fine as long as its within 25% although I'm not sure if OBDI works the same way. Also, don't be surprised when if you get a buck from decel to part throttle. You might not since you're OBDI but who knows.[HR][/HR]​Cool...thanks for the reply. If I get it running this weekend, then I'll let you know about any issues that come up. Hopefully it will all be minimal. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Yeah buddy we OBD1 guys got or cheerleader outfits and pom-poms ready ready for you to come threw for us http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Yeah buddy we OBD1 guys got or cheerleader outfits and pom-poms ready ready for you to come threw for us http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​Well, the kit is half way on. May possibly be able to finish the install today...we'll see.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

More dellays with George. He's out all this week so I'm now schedueled for monday. Meanwhile I've been trying to figure out how to fix the buck and with the help of Marty, found something strange that would atleast explain why the buck is occuring. When I log MAF readings with this chip, I see a values almost identical to those I saw with the MAF calibrator. This suggests that the MAF value is not just a straight reading from the sensor but rather is calculated based on fuel injector pulse widths. Since the ECU uses these MAF values for various calculations, most likely this is causing the buck just like the MAF calibrator did before. This is still just a theory but we will test it out on monday. If this is the case, I'm not sure what the correct solution would be. We will try increasing the fuel at very low throttle to see if that atleast lessens the buck. Anyway... just wanted to keep you guys posted on the progress. I'll post more on monday.


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## Vento FI (Apr 19, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Dude:
I'm very anxious for that OBD I chip to come out and you know what i mean, so keep up the good work, don't take things to fast and take your time to install that SC cause I have been waiting for a working chip for a one year and a half.
So Good luck and happy 4th of July, VERY HOOOT!!


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Thanks for keeping us posted http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Ill be waiting to hear from you on Monday!


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have an OBD-1 distributor motor in my car.
Sweet!! We're talkin' oldskool now!!







[HR][/HR]​let me know dextrose when the chip is made..im in need of one also..
thanx http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## kajvr6 (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

ttt


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

quote:[HR][/HR]let me know dextrose when the chip is made..im in need of one also..
thanx http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​Charger is now on and running. It's up to George at ATP now. I have 30 days before I depart for Florida for the Navy. I've made that clear to George and I've also made it clear that any weekend between now and then I can be up there for getting this done. Ball is no longer in my court.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Congrats on the charger. Let us know if the OBD I bucks when using the calibrator as well. Hopefully I'll see ya up here when you come to pay George a visit.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Okay...I have good news to report for the guys in the OBD-1 camp. I just got off the phone with George. He's gone out of his way to try to work me in before I leave for Florida. I leave on about August 9th for the trek to Florida and he has me scheduled on Monday August 5th to do the work for the custom OBD-1 chip.
The one downside to this...is since it's so close to when I leave...I won't be able to make it back in for a follow up session like Ed has done. And therefore won't be able to "technically" complete the tuning of the chip. Although, there's certainly a possibility we'll get lucky and hit it dead on with the first session. 
The other thing to point out, is that even a first pass chip will more than likely be better in terms of driveability than the current setup with the "calibrator" (i.e. 10k pot). Granted the 10k pot is a viable worst case solution, even a 90% properly tuned chip with proper fuel maps to match the boost curve is definitely going to be better. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Good job Dex. I can't wait to see the car! I think that after doing all this work on my car, George will be able to get the chip working right quickly.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Thanks BIG D http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

Here's a little update on the OBDII chip. 
I went in to ATP last night but George had to leave at 8:00 so we didn't get too much finished up. We did, however, manage to significantly decrease the buck by adding fuel at low load. Sadly george ended up burning the wrong chip and didn't have time to re-burn the new one so I haven't tried it out on the street yet. I'm going over there to pick up the newer chip tonight. My main concern is that this inscrease in the maps at low throttle may cause the long term fuel trim to reset at around -10% or something and that would make us run lean at WOT. If this is the case, we'll have to re-center the part throttle maps around something like -15% to smooth out the buck and then re-map the WOT fueling to compensate for the 15% correction. This will pretty much require starting from scratch on the WOT fueling but George said he thinks that if it really works much better he has no problem in spending the time to do it. 
Getting the dyno time for this stuff is the main problem as the rest of the week has been rented out to someone. I'm going to talk to George and see if he'll let me come in late at night some day and do the stuff my self. Not sure how willing he'll be to just hand over his equipment though








We're moving slowly, but atleast we're still moving toward a good chip. it WILL get done... eventually


----------



## Vento FI (Apr 19, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Hey Dextrose:
Good job; we'll be waiting for your info on that chip, we all are anxious for the OBD I chip http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif








Good Luck
Vento FI


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Vento FI)*

Finally put the latest chip in and got to drive around with it. Good news is that the buck is COMPLETELY gone. Feels just like stock. Bad news is that we overshot the fuel correction. This is to be expected since we really didn't have time to tweak it at all. Basically we just raised the fuel by some arbitrary number to see if it will in fact effect the buck. It did, so now we need to find a happy medium. I have a 3 hour session scheduled for wed of next week. Hopefully we can finish up the chip then.
-- Ed


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Outstanding!! And hopefully this will also help in making the OBD-1 session easier...since we've only got one shot at it really. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## alteregovw (Apr 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Hey Ed,
Let him know that the time taken to get the chip just right will be worth it..... I'm a buyer and so is every Vortech kit owner if the result is as good as it already seems to be. He's almost there!!! Thanks for the effort and I can't wait to hear how the car drives after you get the fuel trim correct.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (alteregovw)*

George seems to be very dedicated to working through all this with me and tweaking just right no matter how much time it takes. All of ATP's big injector turbo chips have this bucking issue as well, so George is very happy to finally be able to smooth it out


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Good to hear things are moving along. Very cool of you and Goerge to put in all this effort. Just to let you know I will be purchasing as soon as its avalible. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

One more thing. I'm not gonna say at this time that we will finish the chip during the next session. I want to try adjusting just the low load fueling to get rid of the buck and center the rest of the map normally around 0%. After that I'll test it for a while and see if the low load part of the fueling influences the long term trim. If it doesn't and it stays close to 0%, then the chip will be officially done (assuming nothing else goes wrong







). If those map values do in fact affect the long term trim and make it unstable, then we'll have to scheduel another long session or possibly two to re-center all the part throttle fuel maps around something like -15% and after that completely retune the WOT fuel maps. Hopefully this won't need to be done.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

looks good...take your time and finish it the right way! we will all still be here waiting with our lazy hungry blowers!! just kidding!! great job!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

Visited ATP again last night. The first half an hour was spent on replacing my fouled, $11/piece DENSO spark plugs! We managed to foul these during the last session when I was running crazy rich for a bit while testing for the buck. Anyway... It looks like to significantly reduce the buck we're going to have to re-center all of the maps so that they are about 20% rich. Once we do that, the long term trim will be reset to around -20% and then we will have to remap the WOT maps. I am going to call George today to scheduel the next session of about 3 hours so we can finally get this thing done! Sorry for the dellays but I really want this chip to work well for everyone. 
Thanks for the patience
-- Ed


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Take your time, im broke anyways. Get it done once, and done right. Not that any of these things will be in my near future but will there ever be chips for the 12 psi belt, or custom belts. Also, would water injection be compatible with these chips, I dont see why not but Im an amateur when it comes to chargers. I also remember reading that the 310cc injectors were almost maxed out when using the blower and the chip. If you have other stuff on top of the blower (which I dont) would that push the injectors over the edge and cause a lean condition again? Also, what would be an approximate cost of the chip and injectors and how hard are fuel injectors to install? Thanks


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Anything in addition to the charger (i.e. cams, etc...) will force you to have to go to larger injectors once again...and then you'll also have to upgrade the fuel pump at that point. This chip is strictly for a bolt on charger with 310cc injectors period. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

hey dextrose...any word on the chip yet?
just wondering..keep my updated man..
thanx dan


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

That's right. This setup will flow enough fuel for just the charger. Cams or a smaller pulley will require larger injectors and an upgraded fuel pump (either walbro, or inline). Water injection, however can deffinately be used with the current setup and will provide about 15 additional whp (guess). I was planning on running a smaller pulley with some bigger injectors and having that tuned by the end of the summer, but right now I'm not sure if my motor is up to the challenge. During the last session it seems like we lost about 20whp and can't explain why. The a/f is still right on and the timing isn't being retarted much at all, and yet there's a 20whp loss in power! I'm going to do a compression test this week to see what's up. Might be time for a rebuild


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

Dan: I'm scheduled for Monday afternoon August 5th. That's also cutting it very close for me personally...as I am then leaving that Friday for the drive to Florida (from CA) with the car.
Ed: Damn...I hope everything is okay with your engine. Let us know. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by Dextrose, 4:00 PM 7-18-2002]


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I know this chip is for the 310's. Would it work with the next size up injectors, which by the way, does anyone know what the next size up is? I'm asking cuz it sounds like this chip maxes out the 310's, so with any more work in the future, you'd have to scrap the 310's for larger ones, which is a waste of $$$.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

yes.. we realize this now. There was no way to tell that we'd be maxxing out the injectors, and personally I'm not completely convinced that we are. I'd like to see someone with cams come down and try to tune with these injectors. Anyway, if we go with any bigger injectors, then the buck will get worse and the amount we can decrease it will not be nearly as much. Anyway.. if you ever have to go to larger injectors you can always sell your 310's for almost what you bought them for on E-Bay.


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

damn dude, that would be sh!tty to have to do a rebuild...dose your engine have alot of miles?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Its got 92k miles on it. Somewhat a lot but not enough to warrant a rebuild. We'll see. Hopefully I'll have time to check my compression today and see. I'm also thinking that outside factors MAY explain the loss in horsepower. I didn't check the humidity but it has been quite humid here lately so that may account for it but 25whp seems a lot to me. I'll try to dyno it on a low humidity day and see what's up. It just sucks to not have been able to brake 250whp with the a/f being right on and timing not being pulled back!!


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

keep the (good) news coming cuz we're all licking our lips waiting for this chip. I also just want to clarify that all thats needed for this "stage 2" which i've come to think of it as is the injectors and the chip. is this correct, nothing else, even insignificant little stuff?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I also just want to clarify that all thats needed for this "stage 2" which i've come to think of it as is the injectors and the chip. is this correct, nothing else, even insignificant little stuff?[HR][/HR]​That's it...nothing more...nothing less. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

yep.. injectors and chip. BTW next session is set up for Aug. 1st. This is going to be a 3 hours sessiond and our plan is to re-center the PT maps around -20% and then re-map the WOT fueling around this correction. This will result in a greatly decreased (although still slightly present) buck and correct fueling up to 7k RPM







Then everyone will be able to get their chips!


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

well I did the compression test today and it doesn't look too good. I'm not quite sure what to make of it so here goes:
this is in this cylinder order:
1(152) --- 3(152) --- 5(142)
-----------------------------------
2(187) --- 4(161) --- 6(155)
Anyone have any ideas? and what the hell is that 187 doing there







?!?!? I tested all cylinders several times to make sure that the numbers are consistent and they were. I guess I'm running on one healthy cylinder and the rest are taking a crap







Well atleast the 25whp I lost are now explained! Anyway.. I'm going to post this in the VR forum to see if anyone has any suggestions, so post any of those in that post as to not crap up this post.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Ever find out what was wrong?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Hey.. I actually posted some better news in the other post. Anyway.. I took it to a mechanic who did his own compression test and got 160 in 2 cylinders, 170 in three, and 175 in one cylinder. Not the BEST results but deffinately well within spec (good enough for a new motor as rated by VW). I guess I let the car cool down too much when I did my test which threw the results off. I also had him do a leak-down test and he got 15% in 4 cylinders and 20% in two. This is also within spec and the only place we could hear the air comming out was from the oil cap which I'm told is normal. 
Anyway, I'm attributing the ~20whp loss that I'm seeing mostly to my friend's Jetex exhaust that is currently on the car. Its nice and quiet but the power loss is unacceptable. I sold my booming neuspeed already so I'm in a desperate search for an exhaust that will work for me. 
Hey... atleast my motor isn't fried!!
In other news my next 3 hour session with ATP is tomorow night and we're hoping to get the chip finished although after all this time I'm not going to even expect it







But if it does happen it'll be a nice surprise and then all of you guys can get in on it. I'll update tomorow night after the session.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Well once again George has moved my session. Its set for monday (the 5th). Don't worry Dex, my car's going on the dyno after yours







George has agreed to stay late monday night to get Dex's OBDI chip and to hopefully finish up our OBDII chip. Monday could be the big day for all of us. See ya monday Dex!
-- Ed


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

On another topic, there was someone who was going to get a smaller pulley made for me. I don't remember who and I lost all my e-mails. You out there?
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Well once again George has moved my session. Its set for monday (the 5th). Don't worry Dex, my car's going on the dyno after yours







George has agreed to stay late monday night to get Dex's OBDI chip and to hopefully finish up our OBDII chip. Monday could be the big day for all of us. See ya monday Dex!
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​Yeah!! You better not be taking any of my dyno time!!







I'm leaving EARLY on Monday morning and will be up there for the session that afternoon. Here's hoping that everything on my car is okay and that it all goes smooth. It's a one shot deal for me since the car is being picked up sometime next week to be shipped to FL. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Anyway...I'll see you at the shop Ed!


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

im crossing my fingers dex..im in need of that chip really bad..
please let me know the second the chip is perfected..
i have a corrado ecu# 021 906 258 BJ
[email protected],com
thanx dex..i hope everything goes good..
dan http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

I doubt the chip will be able to get "perfected" in one shot. It'll get damn close and probably close enough for everyone to use untill we have access to another OBDI.


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I doubt the chip will be able to get "perfected" in one shot. It'll get damn close and probably close enough for everyone to use untill we have access to another OBDI.[HR][/HR]​yeah i understand that..any obd1 chip that close to being perfected is better then nothing for the time being..
i was thinking about trying to get a eip chip till dex comes through with the atp one.but,i think im just going to wait for his..
im runing the vortec with just the cartech fmu right now..its not too bad but i want the chip before i go to a smaller pulley.
is there anyone on here that can get a 10/12 lb pulley?
thanx for the heads up vaus! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
dan


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I doubt the chip will be able to get "perfected" in one shot. It'll get damn close and probably close enough for everyone to use untill we have access to another OBDI.[HR][/HR]​I'm sure it won't be perfect, but like Dan said...it's gonna be a hell of a lot better than nothing. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

i am definatly in for an OBD1 chip, i need one ASAP, so thats using the bigger injectors right?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i am definatly in for an OBD1 chip, i need one ASAP, so thats using the bigger injectors right?[HR][/HR]​Yes, using the Ford Racing 310cc injectors. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

so the OBD1 chip will be tuned soon too?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

quote:[HR][/HR]so the OBD1 chip will be tuned soon too?[HR][/HR]​It will be in existance. It won't be *final* but it will be a start. In all actuallity, it could end up being pretty close though. It's happening on Monday afternoon. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## alteregovw (Apr 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

If you want to buy a 12lb pulley then I can get you one, we are a Vortech dealer. Just email me and let me know the diameter... I forget what it is. I'll ship it to you or the shop to have a chip made if one of you guys wants to buy it for testing.


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]so the OBD1 chip will be tuned soon too?
It will be in existance. It won't be *final* but it will be a start. In all actuallity, it could end up being pretty close though. It's happening on Monday afternoon. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​sounds good, keep me updated as to when people will be allowed to buy the obd1 chip


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

Alright guys. It's a little after 10pm here and I'm getting ready for bed. Getting up at 5:30 in the morning and hitting the road for ATP. It's about a 360 mile trek. Let's hope the car holds up without any problems. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Ed, I'll see you at the shop tomorrow afternoon!!
I'll post here when I get back on Tuesday afternoon.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Good luck with the drive Dex. See you tomorow at the shop. If the session goes well tomorow and we consider the chip to be generally good, then you guys will be able to buy them. We're pretty picky, so if they're sold they WILL be pretty good. I'll update tomorow night.
BTW, Dex, if you have a cell phone, give me a call tomorow when you get into town: 415-246-6680. Not sure what time you're gonna be getting into town but if its much earlier than your schedueled session then give me a call and I might be able to blow off work.

-- Ed


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

dex the man!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
if he cant do it nobody can!








keep us tuned on the outcome dex and vaus.. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
just so you know im ready to buy the chip asap.
the chip can still be hot off the press!








dan


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

whats the word on the obd1 chip for today...any?


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

quote:[HR][/HR]whats the word on the obd1 chip for today...any?[HR][/HR]​im also wondering the same thing!








im sure dex had a long day and is getting some rest..
hope to hear good news for the chip...im crossing my fingers! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
dan


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

Ok guys... last night was all over the place. Here's the somewhat long update:
First we worked on Dex's OBDI chip untill about 10PM. It took us a while to get his belt to stop slipping. Anyway, once we got all the mechanical issues worked out, it didn't take long to map the chip correctly and get a nice flat a/f curve. Some more tweaking with the part throttle and the chip was ready. We took it for a ride and Brian couldn't stop smiling. The car felt strong and smooth and NO BUCKING! I was so jealous of you OBDI guys. I forgot to mention that when brian brought his car in it was barely running. a/f was all over the place all the time. Anyway... pending a little long term testing by Brian, the OBDI chip should be available soon.
Then at about 10:30PM my car went on the dyno. We tried a new approach at the bucking issue and it seemed to work very well. Got everything working great and decide to call it a night and let the car cool down for one last run. We let it sit for about 30 minutes and come back. Start the car and for some reason the WOT maps are totally f'd up. It was just running totally lean. Anyway.. I figured I'd let the car warm up and see what it did. So I warmed it up and then tried for one last full throttle run. And suddenly I hear what I thought to REALLY loud detonation (the sound of rods bending and pistons melting). Almost had a heart attack. Anyway.. I shut it down right away and we look under the hood and find that the ground from the RPM pickup for the dyno got sucked into the belt and somehow made it between the idler and SC pulleys! It shredded up the belt nicely but didn't hurt anything else (I'm now running on a 4-rib belt). So we put the old chip back in and called it a night. We're going to have to do some more testing with this new item we found because it really looked promising while it lasted. 
So funny how the OBDI guys will most likely get a good chip before the OBDII guys... but I guess you guys deserve it since you haven't had any chips available at all for the most part







Anyway.. george is doing some more research on this topic to try to explain what happened while I need to order a new belt... anyone have an extra laying around?
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## rycou34 (Apr 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*



> Ok guys... last night was all over the place. Here's the somewhat long update:
> First we worked on Dex's OBDI chip untill about 10PM. It took us a while to get his belt to stop slipping. Anyway, once we got all the mechanical issues worked out, it didn't take long to map the chip correctly and get a nice flat a/f curve. Some more tweaking with the part throttle and the chip was ready. We took it for a ride and Brian couldn't stop smiling. The car felt strong and smooth and NO BUCKING! I was so jealous of you OBDI guys. I forgot to mention that when brian brought his car in it was barely running. a/f was all over the place all the time. Anyway... pending a little long term testing by Brian, the OBDI chip should be available soon.
> T/QUOTE]
> So when can I buy the OBD I chip?
> ...


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rycou34)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
So when can I buy the OBD I chip?








Rycou[HR][/HR]​as soon as we get word back from Brian that the chip is doing well and there are no problems.
-- Ed


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Well I'm going out of town wed. night and comming back mon night. In the mean time I need to get a new belt before my next session on monday the 19th.
-- Ed


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Nice work guys just let me know when is the purchase date for the chip







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rycou34)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
So when can I buy the OBD I chip?








Rycou[HR][/HR]​Me too! -Abe


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

wow! great news dex and vaus..
sorry about your belt vaus..just a little speed bump..good thing nothing else got messed up!








can you please email me when its time for the chip to be made..
i will call george as soon as i get an ok...
thanx dex and vaus..
dan


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

hey Ed...you are running no AC correct? will the chip act differently with cars that have AC??? I would not think so but was curious...what are the rough gains hp wise with this chip and injectors apposed to say a garrett chip and a blower...roughly speaking. The 4belt thing RULES!!!! my belt looks brand new!!!! no cutting, no shreading!!!! it was a 60.5 4rib I think, for cars with AC at autozone... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

wow EXCELLENT news about the obd1 chip, im soo pumped!!! LET ME BUY ONE NOW!!!!


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]hey Ed...you are running no AC correct? will the chip act differently with cars that have AC??? I would not think so but was curious...what are the rough gains hp wise with this chip and injectors apposed to say a garrett chip and a blower...roughly speaking. The 4belt thing RULES!!!! my belt looks brand new!!!! no cutting, no shreading!!!! it was a 60.5 4rib I think, for cars with AC at autozone... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​I do have AC... no way I would ever get rid of it







You're running a 4-rib belt? Why not run a widely available 6-rib if you don't want to cut down an 8-rib?
As far as gains... look at my dyno. My main concern was motor safety. The blower with a garret chip on the stock injectors won't flow enough fuel for our 10psi... you will run lean. With the chip and larger injectors you are keeping your motor safe while making better power.
-- Ed


[Modified by vausVR6, 4:47 PM 8-6-2002]


----------



## Starbug (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR] We took it for a ride and Brian couldn't stop smiling. [HR][/HR]​Yeah, he looked like a friggin Colgate commercial







Also, Brian's car sounded awesome when it was roaring away on the dyno.
quote:[HR][/HR]So I warmed it up and then tried for one last full throttle run. And suddenly I hear what I thought to REALLY loud detonation (the sound of rods bending and pistons melting). Almost had a heart attack. [HR][/HR]​You should have seen your face, Ed. It looked something like this:








quote:[HR][/HR]Anyway.. I shut it down right away and we look under the hood and find that the ground from the RPM pickup for the dyno got sucked into the belt and somehow made it between the idler and SC pulleys! It shredded up the belt nicely but didn't hurt anything else (I'm now running on a 4-rib belt). 
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​It was very fortunate that the clip didn't jam inside anything and completely destroy the belt.
Ed and George did it once, they can do it again. Keep up the good work, guys. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Starbug)*

Okay guys I just got home! It was about 6.5 hours of driving and about 410 miles. Made it up there...did the tuning...and made it back in about 36 hours.
Anyway, the drive home was soooo much better!! Like I told Ed and George last night after the test drive...the car feels like a totally new car. I'll be scanning in the dyno plot a little later tonight. We were seeing just shy of 240 at the wheels...and on top of that, I think it's fair to say that the engine/intake manifold/blower were heat soaked. Even though we had let the car cool down for about 30 minutes...those things still retain heat like crazy. I think I made somewhere close to 20 redline pulls in the few hours that we did all of this...if that gives you any idea of how hard were were hitting it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Regardless of all of this, I am completely and 110% happy to report that on the way home today the driveability was excellent. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'll be calling George to go over all of this with him as well. Like Ed said, this is a well thought out and SAFE way to be running a Vortech based setup. 
For now, I've gotta run out and wash the car because it's being picked up tomorrow to be shipped to Florida!!







I'll write more later along with the dyno plot(s).


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]We were seeing just shy of 240 at the wheels...[HR][/HR]​ Vaus, what hp figures were you making. Did you ever find that 20 whp? Also, any idea (besides heat) why your car peaked at 270 awhile ago and his was 240? Good numbers anyhow, I bet if you tossed that car back on a dyno and it wasnt heatsoaked it would put down some damn good numbers! Nice work fellas


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I bet if you tossed that car back on a dyno and it wasnt heatsoaked it would put down some damn good numbers! Nice work fellas[HR][/HR]​No doubt about that...at all!! This was my first REAL experience with dyno tuning. And towards the end, it became very apparent, just how much heat soak can affect turbo and supercharged applications like ours. With a warmed up yet "cool" engine, I'd say I would have seen 250 whp without too much trouble at all. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Here's the dyno plot as promised:








I think these are pretty damn good curves. Please note, that these were runs 17, 18, and 19!!










[Modified by Dextrose, 7:45 PM 8-6-2002]


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

nice work Dex, very proud of you for all the obd1 guys! When will the chip be ready to be purchased. Also, is the chip for a coilpack or dist...or doesnt it matter?


----------



## CVR6 (Jan 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

I second the Distributor or coil pack question!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

Thanks Nick. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif It was definitely a long haul up there and back...but definitely worth it!! As far as dist. vs. coilpack...I'm currently under the impression that it SHOULD NOT matter. I'm not 100% on this though. Ed (VausVR6) may know more about it since he just finished reading a book on the Motronic fueling system.
Regarding when the chip will be available and for how much. I'm not sure yet...and really, that's up to Gearge at ATP. Which by the way...I'd like to give a huge THANKS to George at ATP for working his magic on this!!


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I believe I heard that dist vs. coil shouldn't matter. I'm not positive about this but we'll ask george. I was also hitting in the high 230's last night. I'm still running the Jetex exhaust so I think that's the major reason. Also I think that when I made my 270 pull weather conditions were much better (less humid and cooler) and also the car had about an hour to cool down (with a huge fan sitting on the intake manifold so heatsoak wasn't an issue. Power is going to vary with each motor obviously but the important thing is that nice flat a/f curve








Like I said the chip will be available once Dex approves of it and george is satisfied with the testing. It should be around $300. As it looks right now, the chip should be available any day once Dex talks to george about his trip home. You lucky OBDI guys!!!
As far as us OBDII guys, I'm gonna fix up my belt and do a little maintanance and will be back on the dyno on monday the 19th. At that time we should hopefully have enough info to finish it up once and for all. Its amazing how much more complex OBDII is compared to OBDI!
I'll keep you all updated on the OBDI release.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

everything sounds good guys..
but 300.00? ouch!








is there any way we can do a group buy on the chip? just a thought..








i heard that corrado ecus have to have a socket soldered in?
is that true?
dan


----------



## rhussjr (Aug 7, 2000)

$300 isn't a bad price, considering the time that is involved in tuning it. Considering dyno time alone, if Vaus and Dex are not having to pay the blunt $$ in the time... Either way, which would you prefer, a chip that gives you a great increase in power and correct management for a fair price; or a chip that is cheaper and doesn't solve the issues that we are all wanting to overcome. As for the Corrado ECU's, no soldering in of anything (94-95 GTI/GLX's will require desolder and a socket put it). The chip will have an encryption board, that is all. I have one of the first chips from George, and awaiting the update to tryout.


[Modified by rhussjr, 1:12 PM 8-7-2002]


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rhussjr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]The chip will have an encription board, that is all. [HR][/HR]​Would this chip be able to be plugged in or is it gonna be a send your ecu to ATP thing? It sounds like you guys just plugged your in and went right?


----------



## rhussjr (Aug 7, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

It will plug right in to your existing socket and will have it's own board that it rest in. Without the excryption board, the chip will not function.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

quote:[HR][/HR]everything sounds good guys..
but 300.00? ouch!








is there any way we can do a group buy on the chip? just a thought..








i heard that corrado ecus have to have a socket soldered in?
is that true?
dan[HR][/HR]​$300 is really a pretty fair price. A regular MKIV GIAC chip costs $300. A stage II z/GIAC chip goes for $500!!! $300 is what George charges for all of his 310cc chips and it seems fair to me.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]everything sounds good guys..
but 300.00? ouch!








is there any way we can do a group buy on the chip? just a thought..








i heard that corrado ecus have to have a socket soldered in?
is that true?
dan
$300 is really a pretty fair price. A regular MKIV GIAC chip costs $300. A stage II z/GIAC chip goes for $500!!! $300 is what George charges for all of his 310cc chips and it seems fair to me.
Thanks
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​yeah i guess that is a fair price for a custom chip..i just didnt think it was going to be that high on such a new chip.
if for instance we have a problem down the road.. can we send the chip in for retuning?
thanx ED


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

If there are updates to the chip I'm sure George will send you a new chip. The chips themselves don't cost much to burn. I'll talk to George about the update stuff as well.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

quote:[HR][/HR]yeah i guess that is a fair price for a custom chip..i just didnt think it was going to be that high on such a new chip.
if for instance we have a problem down the road.. can we send the chip in for retuning?
thanx ED
[HR][/HR]​Hey...we're playing with the big boys now.







Mods like these ain't gonna be cheap, especially for the ones that are done *right!*


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Would having a Velocity Big-Bore T/B and a EIP manifold cause a problem with the current ATP OBD1 chip? I know the with a N/A setup the ecu has to be mapped for the Velocity T/B or else it would cause bucking and driveablity issues, but will the new F/I have to be mapped for this setup?


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

well 300 at first sounded high, but once i thought about it, it became more apparent of the time and reliability of this chip...now sell me one! oh and where is the cheapest place to get the 310cc injectors?


----------



## Starbug (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (a2vr6t)*

quote:[HR][/HR]yeah i guess that is a fair price for a custom chip..i just didnt think it was going to be that high on such a new chip.
if for instance we have a problem down the road.. can we send the chip in for retuning?[HR][/HR]​What'd you think? That after this much time dyno tuning and all the work that has gone into this chip, he'd sell it for a hundred bucks? Stop being such a cheap-ass and appreciate what these guys are doing!


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Would having a Velocity Big-Bore T/B and a EIP manifold cause a problem with the current ATP OBD1 chip? I know the with a N/A setup the ecu has to be mapped for the Velocity T/B or else it would cause bucking and driveablity issues, but will the new F/I have to be mapped for this setup? [HR][/HR]​Its very difficult to say how the chip will react to the manifold and TB. I personally wouldn't expect it to run perfectly because the flow characteristics of your setup will be different enough to make a bit of a difference. The chip would deffinately be a good starting point.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Thanks for the reply http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif so would it be safe to just install the chip with the setup and monitor my EGT and Air/fuel gauges?


----------



## Dr. Blingonian (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

so this is done? You are selling the chips and injectors? how bout OBD1?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

quote:[HR][/HR]so this is done? You are selling the chips and injectors? how bout OBD1?[HR][/HR]​Well, it's not quite done yet. But, I imagine the OBD-1 chip will be available soon. And no, you buy your own injectors. The only thing you buy from ATP is the chip. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I've got the only OBD-1 chip in the country right now...and it sure feeeeeels nice!!








Edit: One other thing that I forgot to mention yesterday, was that my gas mileage on the way up was horrible. As Ed mentioned, my car was running just terribly. I was averaging around 19 mpg on the way up.







With the new chip...on the way home I was averaging anywhere from 22 mpg to 25 mpg and that was cruising at about an average of 75 mph. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by Dextrose, 7:59 PM 8-7-2002]


----------



## fush23 (May 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Do you have any other modifications to your fueling system other than the 310cc injectors on the OBD I car? 
-jeff


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (fush23)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Do you have any other modifications to your fueling system other than the 310cc injectors on the OBD I car? 
-jeff[HR][/HR]​No, it's totally stock with the stock 4 bar FPR.


----------



## Dr. Blingonian (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Good to know its out there. I just got my car running great with my cartech and bosch inline.. And no, I don't care that it makes a lil noise, my catless 2.5" exhaust usually covers that noise up


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Good to know its out there. I just got my car running great with my cartech and bosch inline.. And no, I don't care that it makes a lil noise, my catless 2.5" exhaust usually covers that noise up







[HR][/HR]​Well, the whole point of pursuing this chip was to eliminate the need to tweak with things like RRFPRs etc...which can be very sensitive to climate changes etc. With the chip and the injectors, it's plug 'n play...and safe to boot. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I myself have scrapped plans for a turbo, tuning nightmares, I do not need. Just jumped back into this thread, and man am I getting excited, too. OBDII, coming soon, right?? And, to all you cheapo's, 3 sawbucks for a properly functioning chip. IMO there is not a deal like this ANYWHERE for us VW people. 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif to Dex, Ed and George @ ATP


[Modified by gin8122, 2:19 PM 8-8-2002]


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

alright im getting anxious for a properly running SC OBD1 car....!! Has the final prep gone underway to producing the chip for all to enjoy? sorry for being so antsy


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

TTT, with the mods in my sig, do you guys think this setup wont work for me cause im a lil more then a stock engine with the SC?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

quote:[HR][/HR]TTT, with the mods in my sig, do you guys think this setup wont work for me cause im a lil more then a stock engine with the SC?[HR][/HR]​I doubt that the chip will work right with your motor. You are likely pushing a lot more air up top than a stock SC'd motor and thus will likely run lean up top. Its hard to say how it will react but you can surely try it. Where are you located? Maybe you can come by for a custom chip? Those kinds of mods really require custom tunning to get it just right. Maybe in the future George will have a database of chips for combinations of mod's but that will require people like you and me to come down there and get it tuned out. Untill then we can only try to get the more "popular" setups tuned. 
-- Ed


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

quote:[HR][/HR]so this is done? You are selling the chips and injectors? how bout OBD1?[HR][/HR]​OBDI is very near completion. In fact I imagine the current maps will actually be the final chip. We'll need Dex to drive the car a little more and give us some feedback in order to verify that this chip is ready to be sold. 
OBDII is still in the works. The OBDII system is much more complex than the OBDI and is posing some little problems such as the decel/PT buck that we're trying to work out. Lucky OBDI guys don't have this at all! Actually this is the only problem that has kept the chip from being sold. We ARE working on it slowly but surely. It is very difficult to get dyno time at ATP as they are very busy and that has caused most of the dellays. Also we're trying a new method of running the larger injectors which will hopefully illiminate the buck and make overall drivability much better. Hopefully on the 19th we can dial this in and have a chip for you guys. 
After that its on to bigger and better things (12psi of boost... either using a 12psi pulley or an even smaller pulley with a wastegate to limit boost and get more boost throughout the RPM range). Hopefully tunning this chip won't take nearly as long now that we have all the gained experience from the current chip.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I emailed George today with my feedback. Essentially, everything seems fine. Car is now out of my hands and I'll be departing for Florida on Saturday the 17th. From that point forward, I will unfortunately be offline for 13 weeks for Officer Candidate School. Afterwhich, I'll be back online. But I'm assuming George will go ahead and let the OBD-1 chip out before then. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Kewl http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

Yea... if he doesn't I'll yell at him







Sounds like you OBDI guys will have a nice chip real soon.


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

good, how about letting me be another testes since dex will be outta service







i can get the injectors installed myself and test the chip, what do yah say?


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

I would also like to loan my services for testing.








I would be more than happy to help!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

Well, I'm gonna head this off before it goes any further. Although, I can't speak directly for George, I'm assuming you guys know that you'll be paying for the chip. I don't think he's going to be handing out chips here and there for "test". We did what we could and that was that. I got 400+ miles of all kinds of driving conditions in on the way home and the chip seems pretty good to go. I'm sure George will warn you that the chip is good, but may not be "perfect" and that he'll be selling it under those conditions plus maybe some others that he sees fit. Again, I can't speak for him.
To reitterate, I've emailed him with my follow up. I will try to speak with him on the phone tomorrow. Afterwhich he'll take it from there. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Starbug)*

What'd you think? That after this much time dyno tuning and all the work that has gone into this chip, he'd sell it for a hundred bucks? Stop being such a cheap-ass and appreciate what these guys are doing![/QUOTE]
in no way did i not appreciate the work that was done..








i was wanting to go standalone in the near future to get me by for the time being,
so now i have decided to go that route, that way i can tune it perfectly and dont have to deal with chips again. for a couple 100.00 more i can just go get standalone.
good luck on the move bryan.. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
dan



[Modified by a2vr6t, 12:00 AM 8-12-2002]


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]After that its on to bigger and better things (12psi of boost... either using a 12psi pulley or an even smaller pulley with a wastegate to limit boost and get more boost throughout the RPM range). Hopefully tunning this chip won't take nearly as long now that we have all the gained experience from the current chip.
Thanks
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​Now that is more like what I am looking for. I am going to use a T trim in the V1 charger. That should very easily make 12 psi of boost, on a large pulley. Should not slip as easy that way, and more boost is easily possible. Are you going to start work on that right after this initial chip is done?? Really looking forward to a 12 psi chip. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

Yes... I plan to start on the 12psi project as soon as this chip is done. Man I hope I don't fall behind in school because of my toys







Anyway... I have a couple issues for the 12psi project. I will either need to make a custom FMIC (EIP's is completely outrageously priced) or go the cheap way and use WI. Haven't decided yet. Also I will need to figure out if the 310cc injectors will actually flow enough fuel for the added boost (this is a main issue right now). If they don't then I'll need to go to larger injectors. The only other issue I can forsee is the need for a shorter belt to use with the pulley although a longer tensioning bolt might work as well. Anyway... enough about that for now. 
Like Dex said there will probably not going to be any other "testers" of the OBDI chip. We can't just give it away for free







I'm sure, however that if problems are discovered, George will be happy to fix them and send new copies of the chip.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## S0ULB0Y (Jan 30, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I called ATP and they had basically told me that in approx 2-3 months they would begin to sell their OBD1 chip for the vortech chargers. I was looking for approx timeframe, and I think some others were too. Hope this helps for those of you looking for this info. In the meantime... I'd like to know where I can find a good price on an inline pump such as a bosch?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (S0ULB0Y)*

I just got off the phone with George at ATP and wanted to update everybody as well. Essentially I will not be able to drive my car for about the next 4 weeks because I'll be in Navy boot camp. Around the 4th weekend we should start to get weekend liberty...which means I'll be able to drive the car again, only on the weekend. Nevertheless, George wants to wait for me to log a few more hours/days in the car over the long term just to make sure there are no major problems. I don't forsee anything major. I understand the burning desire that most of you have to get your hands on one of these chips. But, you guys should also try to see this from his point of view regarding quality assurance and selling something that's not only going to work, but work well. I'm sure he doesn't want to rush something to market just to have it bite him in the ass with a 100 people calling up saying this and that about why the chip isn't quite working right with their car. Again, I don't really forsee any of that happening, but...he needs and wants to make sure, and I respect that. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I just wanted keep you guys posted.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Anybody ask about the obd2 chip?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Anybody ask about the obd2 chip?[HR][/HR]​Like I said the OBDII chip is still in the works. The next session is set for the 19th when we can hopefully actually decide on the correct fix for the bucking issue and then I can proceed to test out the final chip. This shouldn't take long as I do a lot of driving and am close to ATP. I don't know about the 2-3 months... it seems a bit long to me but I understand that George wants to be sure that the chip works well. It would be much easier if we had access to another OBDI car. 
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Throw some 256 cams in please.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I don't know about the 2-3 months...[HR][/HR]​He didn't really say 2-3 months to me. He just wanted a bit more time. If I had to guess, more like 1-2 months since for the next 4 weeks I'm out. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Throw some 256 cams in please.[HR][/HR]​No money for the 256's... if someone wants to give me theirs I'm up for the challenge


----------



## silverjettin (Jan 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

ok guys..im in for a chip and bigger injectors!!!OBD2
>>>my car is running like crap once i hit 6000 rpms...
I've got the vortech v1 with ams SC chip and 4 bar fpr...
it pulls pretty hard up to 6k then i experience a serious lack of power..
at first i thought maybe i had a bad coil pack, wires etc??
but after reading this post..im thinking maybe its the chip (thie ams computer i got came off one of the first SC setups they put together)
is this the same problem u guys are having??
thanks


[Modified by silverjettin, 10:22 PM 8-15-2002]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverjettin)*

Ok guys.. sorry to do this again but I had to move my next session to the 29th of this month. I f'd up and schedueled the session for the 19th completely forgetting prior plans. My fault this time








On a brighter note, I talked to George about the OBDI chip. He said he got the checksums fixed now so no CEL. He's going to test it out in the next week and told me that the release of the chip is up to me. I'm going to transfer the decision to Dextrose since he's the only one who has actually tested the chip. Dex, are there ANY problems you've experienced with the chip? If not then its a go and the chip will be released in about a week. Let us know.
-- Ed


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverjettin)*

quote:[HR][/HR]it pulls pretty hard up to 6k then i experience a serious lack of power..
at first i thought maybe i had a bad coil pack, wires etc??[HR][/HR]​It's called melting pistons.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Dex, are there ANY problems you've experienced with the chip? If not then its a go and the chip will be released in about a week. Let us know.
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​I'm gonna go ahead and say that everything is fine as far as I'm concerned. I logged 400+ miles of straight driving with the chip on the way home...in just about every traffic condition imagineable...from dead stand still to 80+ mph cruising. 
I'm glad you posted this, because as of tomorrow afternoon I will be OFFLINE for the next 13-15 weeks. I'm interested to hear how the other OBD-1 guys fair with this chip. I guess there will be a TON of responses to this thread by the time I log back on at Thanksgiving!! 
Good luck guys!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Hey Dex... did you have atleast one cold start? 
-- Ed


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Hey Dex... did you have atleast one cold start? 
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​Yes, the morning after. It was fine. Engine idled smooth. Then I drove the car to the parking lot about 2 miles up the road to be loaded on the car carrier....again, all was fine. I think we're good to go. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Well...I am anxiously waiting for this chip, but in the mean time i may install my FPR and inline fuel pump..unless we get this chip within a month???


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KidCorrado)*

At this point, I would suspect you should be seeing it within a month or less. I don't see why not. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

yep... with dex's approval the chip will be out within a month (consevative time line).
-- Ed


----------



## S0ULB0Y (Jan 30, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

when I called ATP though they said 2-3 months, they said they had it developed, but wanted to keep on testing it. You guys are saying a month conservatively. Its obvious though that Dex cannot continue to test the chip if he's leaving soon. confused...


----------



## KidCorrado (Aug 10, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (S0ULB0Y)*

TTT for this thread...i wanna keep it alive so we can get this OBD1 chip ASAP...I want it real sooooon!


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (S0ULB0Y)*

quote:[HR][/HR]when I called ATP though they said 2-3 months, they said they had it developed, but wanted to keep on testing it. You guys are saying a month conservatively. Its obvious though that Dex cannot continue to test the chip if he's leaving soon. confused...







[HR][/HR]​You called before I talked to George over the phone. Basically he said that on my word the chip will be released. So I left it up to Dex to approve it. Now that he has I will talk to George on the 28th during my next session and you guys should have your chips (OBDI). Hopefully at the same time we can finally finish the OBDII and this will all be over and done with








-- Ed


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Bump for the OBDII session in two days http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

Hope everything goes smoothly! I can hardly wait any longer...I swear I can hear my pistons melting!


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I swear I can hear my pistons melting! [HR][/HR]​Bahahahah! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

A question for vausVR6..Or any one else who knows.
So if I have a Z-charger kit with the current GIAC chip. Is there ever any thing to be gained to pay for a couple hours worth of Dyno tunning..? 
Thanks for the Dyno insite oh master of the Vortech..


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

dont know for sure, but id bet the GIAC chip is pretty well tuned from the factory. couldnt hurt though http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## alteregovw (Apr 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Scooter, I don't think you will be able to improve much on the GIAC software for your zcharger but the dyno could be helpful for some info on the power your car is making and a baseline to go by for your next mod.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (alteregovw)*

like the guys said, the GIAC chip for your Z setup is tuned pretty damn well. The only reason you'd want to go to a custom chip or any other chip for that matter is if you decide to push more boost or do something else as drastic.
-- Ed


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Thanks for the info. Was just curius if there was any thing to be gained as every car is diffrent. So it sounds like just doing a couple base runs is about al that is good. That would make sure every thing is working the way it should. 
Just been trying to learn more about all this sense with luck I will be getting the Z kit in a week or two.


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

SORRY TO HEAR ABOUT THAT!!!!!!!


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

So I changed and I am nowing getting a Vortech kit and a set of really good 310CC injectors. I have a 2.5" TT exhaust and a TTtuning chip. I also have my stock chip and the car has a 4bar FPR. 
1: Were can I get a machined AC pulley.
2: Untill the ATP chip is out what do I need to do or not do to have this up and running on my car. 
I have started doing searches in here and reading a lot about this topic. But would like more advice from fellow OBD1 folks.
Can I just bolt it on and go as long as I do not push much more the 5000 RPM as I hardly do that now.?
Thanks folks.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

yep.. just put the kit on and don't drive over 5000RPM. Then once the injectors and ATP chip are in, you're set to go.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

BTW... here's the update. I went to ATP on wed. I showed up a bit early and talked to George for a couple minutes and then his wife called and he had to rush off to take his baby to the ER. Man... lots of crap happens I guess. Anyway.. the session is on for tues. and I'm pretty confident we can get the chip ready.
-- Ed


----------



## briang (Mar 10, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I still think it would be great if George could offer a complete kit.
Why?
1.) AMS only offers the noisy V-1
2.) Les at EuroTech has a spotty record that scares me a bit (not that I wouldn't try, but I'd be scared of the deal going bad)
3.) A complete kit that is correct out of the box would be a refreshing change.
Please George, please


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (briang)*

OK....just Dyno'd at 241.9 with 223.4torque..... CAN NOT WAIT for this chip.....


----------



## MKII16v (Oct 23, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

I'm still testing things but I should have brackets, oil lines, Alloy waterpump pullies, and possibly plumbing done by the end of sept.


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MKII16v)*

would a vortech bov still be compatible w/ this new injector/chip setup? i know it's not really necessary w/ stock boost, but it's still a cool upgrade, doesnt hurt anything, and sounds cool as HE*L.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

yea.. a BOV will be fine.


----------



## briang (Mar 10, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MKII16v)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I'm still testing things but I should have brackets, oil lines, Alloy waterpump pullies, and possibly plumbing done by the end of sept.[HR][/HR]​Cool!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (briang)*

Yo guys!!! It's been a few weeks...I'm here in the middle of Navy Officer boot camp in Pensacola, FL. Somehow I managed to secure a few minutes of computer time. I have a number of cold startes with the car...all went fine. I also drove the car from my friend's place over to the base after it was shipped across the country...and again all was fine. Hope all is well back in Cali!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I miss being able to drive my car.







Only a few more weeks though, and I'll be allowed. I'll catch you all later. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## VW THUNDER (Oct 15, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Any update on the chip's progress? I'm getting antsy







once everything is developed, all I need to do is find my Vortech kit, yaay. By the way, when the chip is mapped out for the 310cc injectors what else would be needed to solve the fuelling issue? Thanks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## VW THUNDER (Oct 15, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (VW THUNDER)*

Anyone...? BUMMMP http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (VW THUNDER)*

George make progress? HAH! Now _that's_ funny...


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

well here's what happened yesterday. I show up at ATP and george is trying to get his software on his laptop to work because someone at ATP who shall remain nameless (his name is ART!!!) decided to upgrade George's laptop to win2k. So george's laptop wasn't working and he had to re-register the editing software. Of course the company is in Germany and was asleep at the time. I missed my important day of classes for this so I was quite pissed so george said he'd try contacting the company again at midnight. Anyway, he couldn't get the thing working till 4AM and I wasn't able to get in contact with him today. I'm gonna make him come in late tomorow night to do this! Sorry for the mood but this is really getting old especially since ATP is about 1.5 hours away.
-- Ed


----------



## VW THUNDER (Oct 15, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Wow....this seems like it's just a repeating cycle...hopefully this chip will be made soon, I'm dying for it...cuz then I can go run out and buy a Vortech and not worry about fuelling issues http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Man, I feel you...this has got to be your 7th trip! Hopefully nothing else goes wrong next time so you dont waste anymore of your time.


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Lets give Vaus a big hand for keeping us uptdate even if it was not the best news. At least it was not something bad like the chip has new issues and needs more work. 
I am sorry ART wasted a days worth of your time though. Oh well just gives me a little more time to make sure every thing on the car is in tip top shape before I blow her.

Will have a new Bosch O2 senser Friday and may also take her in for a complete tune up as well.
Good luck on the chip let us know if any thing new comes up.
Scott in Seattle.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (VW THUNDER)*

quote:[HR][/HR]cuz then I can go run out and buy a Vortech and not worry about fuelling issues http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​Go and find the vortech now. The chip will be done soon enough, just get it on the car and take it somewhat easy. Obviously, dont redline every gear and youll be fine, plus, for you to ruin your motor by the time the chip is done, you would be in jail for like 985+ speeding tickets. Sorry about ATP again vaus, you should make him sell the chip cheaper for all the delays







Haha


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Man I sure do feel lucky! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## VW THUNDER (Oct 15, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]cuz then I can go run out and buy a Vortech and not worry about fuelling issues http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Go and find the vortech now. The chip will be done soon enough, just get it on the car and take it somewhat easy. Obviously, *dont redline every gear and youll be fine*, plus, for you to ruin your motor by the time the chip is done, you would be in jail for like 985+ speeding tickets. Sorry about ATP again vaus, you should make him sell the chip cheaper for all the delays







Haha







[HR][/HR]​Me....NOT redline in every gear???????? That is purely unpossible, HAHAHA UNpossible! Anyway, I dunno if my mom would let me loan the money to get a Vortech...I've been trying to explain to her how easily I could pay it back.


----------



## MKII16v (Oct 23, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR] I show up at ATP and george is trying to get his software on his laptop to work because someone at ATP who shall remain nameless (his name is ART!!!) decided to upgrade George's laptop to win2k. [HR][/HR]​HAHAHAH I dealed with Art while trying to put together an ATP setup for my car. That guy is impossible to deal with.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MKII16v)*

Art's not the guy to deal with when dealing with ATP. That's all from me


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

So my main question is when can I call and order a OBD1 chip..?
Any known issues that you are still trying to work out...?
When might we see a new Dyno plot with the OBD1 and the new chip..?
My V1 kit and injectors should be here before next weekend. 
Have a good weekend


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

when is the next appointment vaus?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

appointment is set for wed. night. There don't seem to be any issues with the OBDI chip and I will talk to George about releasing it on Wed. I don't think there will be another dyno untill someone else who gets the chip actually dyno's.
-- Ed


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Rumor has it George will be washing his hair on Wednesday night. Looks like another cancellation. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I cant seem to find 310cc injectors from summit







I found some 310cc for honda/acura and they were like $70 a peice








Anyone know were to get them the cheapest...ATP sells them for $400 http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

I got 6 real good one never used for 185 from the person who sold me his Vortech kit. Tehehe
Good luck in your search.
Do some Yahoo and Google searches on fuel injectors.. Also try Jegs as well.
Man I am excited. May have to put my old rims and tires on the front to play around with SMOKING rubber..LOL


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=7202
$219.95. 310cc = 30#.


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

sure those are the right ones?...ford motorsport injectors sold in sets of 8?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

They're all Bosch units. Yes they are correct. I run those exact injectors.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]They're all Bosch units. Yes they are correct. I run those exact injectors.[HR][/HR]​Same here. Just to ease your worries...here's a pic of the box while I was installing:










[Modified by Dextrose, 6:16 AM 9-8-2002]


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Thanks guys...I am ordering them on Monday so I dont have to wait when the chip is available


----------



## vw4sport (Sep 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks guys...I am ordering them on Monday so I dont have to wait when the chip is available[HR][/HR]​i also have these.24lb balance blueprinted Inj....219 for 8 of them!


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vw4sport)*

Bump for tommorrow's dyno session. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## VW THUNDER (Oct 15, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

BUMMMMP...i can't wait to see these dyno #'s


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (VW THUNDER)*

PLEASE, PLEASE!!! say you have some good news!!


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

George was in fact busy washing his hair tonight. There will be no dyno session.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Well the good news is that my car car actually made it on the dyno. The bad news is that the plan to reduce the buck caused some crazy stuff. We narrowed the problem down to what George has labelled as the idle fuel map. Funny thing is that that map seems to effect the fueling under PT and WOT as well so its obviously not the idle map. It took us quite some time to figure out why the hell everything was going crazy when we hadn't changed anything. In reality we thought we were fixing the idle but were messing with this crazy map.
George is going to call his contact to try to find the real idle map. After that we can try messing with this strange map and it may in fact allow us to correct the bucking issue correctly.
Anyway... no chip yet. Sorry guys we were there untill 12:00AM last night and George was anxious to go home so we couldn't mess around with any more stuff.
I did talk to George about OBD-I and we have agreed to release it. So all you OBDI guys go call ATP and order! Also, could the guys ordering e-mail me for my personal records. [email protected].
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Glad to hear from you and glad your session went ok. For some reson I thought you were OBD1. But I guess if you drive a 98 it would not be an OBD1.

So there are no known issues left with OBD1.. HEhehe Very exciting. I guess I suffer from being a tad parrinode when it come to my one and only car that I need to get back forth to my job. 
I have even thought about lowering the boost to around 7.5..I am assuming that the chip will not mind seeing less boost..?
Keep up the good work.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

hard to tell what the chip will do with less boost. Its not tuned for it. Don't worry about it.. 10psi runs great when fueled correctly.
-- Ed


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Just hard to hide the excitment as I have never driven a car with any more power than what I have now. It is hard to get people to spend the time discribing what it is like.
Like in mine I will be in 3rd at 3000 rpm and that is pretty fun as if I floor it it will get up and go. But how are things diffrent with the charger..
Or I am in 4th at 3000 doing 60. if I floor it it sloly takes off but in a few seconds it will just roar and before I know it I am doing 90 in 4th. 
It sounds like I will need compltley change how I drive.?


----------



## alteregovw (Apr 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

With the charger just multiply the effect you have now by about 2 and that is what the charger feels like. First gear goes by so fast that you don't have time to pay attention, 2nd pulls very very hard and third is the sweetest gear..... 3rd will pull hard all the way into the 90s. Once the obdII chip is finished I don't think that I could have much at all bad to say about having a Vortech kit on a VR6. It's simply an excellent addon with very minimal trade-offs.


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (alteregovw)*

Didn't know if I should start another post but wanted to see if there were two more people interested in purchasing a set of the Ford Motorsport 310cc injectors. Silverraddo and I are going to buy them soon but if we have two more people we can average the price down for all of us. It would be $219 x 3 split four ways since they come in sets of 8. It would bring the cost down to $164.25 each plus shipping divided up. Any interest in this???


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

Vaus, any info on the next session??


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

well its pretty hard to believe but I crashed my car on thurs. I rear-ended a Lincoln Navigator at a stop light (damn cell phone!). Well the navigator's trailer hitch went right through my radiator and a/c condensor and messed up the front pretty bad. Gonna need new bumper, rad support, grill, hood, and lights besides the internals. Realistically I won't be expecting my car back for a couple of weeks so I'll set up a session for then. I know we didn't need any more dellays but this one's deffinately out of my hands.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Dr. Blingonian (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]well its pretty hard to believe but I crashed my car on thurs. I rear-ended a Lincoln Navigator at a stop light (damn cell phone!). Well the navigator's trailer hitch went right through my radiator and a/c condensor and messed up the front pretty bad. Gonna need new bumper, rad support, grill, hood, and lights besides the internals. Realistically I won't be expecting my car back for a couple of weeks so I'll set up a session for then. I know we didn't need any more dellays but this one's deffinately out of my hands.[HR][/HR]​







Dude, your just as bad as the bujilian blonde teeny boppers that have almost totalled my car!








I'm very sorry to hear that, but you gotta put the celly down and drive bro.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

heh.. I wasn't actually on the cell. Got a call, and looked down at the wrong second. Dumb thing to do for sure. Atleast no one's hurt and the navigator had barely a scratch on it


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Maybe by the time you guys are done goofing off, Ill have enough cash to cover the chip/injectors







. Just kidding fellas, sorry to hear about your accident. My friend got rear ended two days ago by some 16 year old girl on a cell phone. Oh well glad your okay


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Man that sucks! sorry to hear about your car...at least its repairable. I think you should just give up on the whole chip deal..obviously it just isnt ment to be.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

hah... nah I'm not giving up. Just a minor set-back. Now... where are all those OBDI guys who were so anxious for their chips??


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Well my Kit is in Seattle and should be here Tuesday. Will get it on and give it a little test drive make sure it even works. Then order a chip in about a week I guess. Till then will just keep it under 5000 RPM.
Until I get the chip should I run the 310cc with a 4bar ..? Or stock injectors stock chip and a 3bar. or even a 4 bar..? Will make sure to take out the TT chip as well.
not sure what is best at this point.
OBD1


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

the stock chip with stock injectors with the 4bar would probably be best to run for now but drive it nicely till you get the right chip.
-- Ed


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Bump... Don't want this to get too far lost!!! I've got the injectors. Now waiting for the chip!!! Any OBD1 guys bought the chip? Have any feedback or is everyone waiting for the "first" guy to buy it?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

seriously guys... buy the OBDI. The first guy has already bought it.... that was Dex








-- Ed


----------



## Dr. Blingonian (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

you guys gonna do anything for more boost or the 256s? I am going to be running 15 psi in the spring with 256s..


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]seriously guys... buy the OBDI. The first guy has already bought it.... that was Dex








-- Ed[HR][/HR]​Yes, I was/am the first. And I JUST got back in from my first official weekend of "liberty". Hoo-rah!! Anyway, the car ran like a champ...just as it always has since I got the chip. No complaints WHATSOEVER!!! The weather is a LOT hotter down here in Pensacola, FL as well...and everything was A-okay! 
Please you OBD-1 guys...buy away!! You won't be disappointed! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

quote:[HR][/HR]you guys gonna do anything for more boost or the 256s? I am going to be running 15 psi in the spring with 256s.. [HR][/HR]​You'll need 30# injectors at approximately 7 bar (unreasonable), or 36# injectors at 5 bar (doable), or 42# injectors at 4 bar to keep from going lean with that setup.
Then again you could run stock injectors at ~16 bar instead (~232 psi) with a rising rate FMU. This is the "knowledgeable" way to tune the car.








I'm running 30# injectors at 5 bar and just barely keep from maxing the fueling out up top (6k-7k). At 15psi you could flow up to 20% more air.


[Modified by Marty, 5:29 PM 9-22-2002]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dr. Blingonian)*

quote:[HR][/HR]you guys gonna do anything for more boost or the 256s? I am going to be running 15 psi in the spring with 256s.. [HR][/HR]​I'm planning on mapping a chip for a bit more boost (12 - 13psi). I won't be doing cams because I don't have the funds for it.


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

a shop down the street from me, Cyntex, builds disgusting porsche, bmw, and vw race cars. i talked to one of the guys who works there and said that they can burn a 310cc chip for me, but the dyno time and work will cost me ~$800. not too economical for me, but seeing all of the delays for the atp chip (keep up the good work though vaus) i was curious to check another option. if there were someway to offset the cost for me, it would be worth getting the chip made. vaus, how are you paying for all the dyno time (many hours by now i'm gussing)


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

George and I made a deal and he only charged me the price of a custom chip and we agreed that we had to do whatever it took to make it work right. So I'm deff. not paying for the dyno time... I'm not rich.
-- Ed


----------



## vw4sport (Sep 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Then again you could run stock injectors at ~16 bar instead (~232 psi) with a rising rate FMU. This is the "knowledgeable" way to tune the car.








Or you can run 24lb injectors with a a rrfpr and a stock chip and get 260 whp...Tough choice http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vw4sport)*

Any feedback on the OBDI chip, yet?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

who's buying the OBDI??


----------



## Goobery69 (Nov 22, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I really hope ATP hasn't gotten discouraged in finalizing production of the OBD-II chip since there appears to be a lack of immediate sales of the OBD-I chip.


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Goobery69)*

I know somebody who will but he doesn't have his charger kit fully together and obviously doesn't have it on his car so it doesn't make sense to buy it yet. As for the others that were hanging by for this chip, I expected some solid feedback especially as they lucked out and got theirs first!!!!! I WILL buy the OBDII chip once it comes out if the dyno graphs look remotely close to what we've seen.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

There's one guy in Japan who ordered an OBDI chip. Where are the rest of you??


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]There's one guy in Japan who ordered an OBDI chip. Where are the rest of you??[HR][/HR]​Japan?? WTF? I thought OBD1'ers were anxious to get the chip. The day it is available for OBD2 I will be ordering! Ive been driving around like a bitch for the last 6 months...I need more fuel dammit! 
Hey vaus, any progress on your car?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

still in the shop... hopefully will be done by the 2nd.


----------



## vws4life (Apr 6, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]hard to tell what the chip will do with less boost. Its not tuned for it. Don't worry about it.. 10psi runs great when fueled correctly.
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​
If I can get a hold of a Z-kit it'll run about 6 psi wityh a stock pulley, right? 
Is there an advantage to going with a vortech (easse of install, $$, reliability, etc), or does it matter??
Does it make sense to run this chip with that low of boost, or is it better to upgrade pulleys to get 10+ psi and run a BOV??? oh, BTW its for a 93SLC.
ps. I'm just starting to research and shop for a SC. Also spent the last 2 hours reading this thread. I must be a dumba$$; Until about 30 minutes ago i thought my SL was OBD2








I have lots of other ?'s but will address them later, once my head stops spinning.








OH, and thanks to all for all the valuable info!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vws4life)*

The only advantage with the Z charger is that you dont have to tap your oil pan. The stage 2 Z can yield good power but not as much as the vortech...also the Z kits come with GIAC chips that run very well and do not lean out so there would be no need for a new chip. I say get the vortech...once the chip is made or you sort the fueling, you should see around 240-260 whp.


----------



## Goobery69 (Nov 22, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Any updates?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Goobery69)*

car's still in the shop. The hood is on backorder!!!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

First OBD-1 chip ever here...and the car is STILL running like a champ. No problems and everything is A-Okay. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I'll be ordering mine this Monday. Brian, I know yours is OBD1 but is it distributored or coilpack? Also, do you have a number & contact name for ordering?
This is going to be for my '92 SLC OBD1 distributored. Are we sure that this one chip is good for both distributor & coilpack? Thanks in advance!
Abe- [email protected]


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

Mine should be here some time this week also. So then I will need to pop that in and see how hard the injectors are to put in. Any comments on doing an injector install. Any tip or info would be great.
CAN I PUT them in before I get the chip..? I have a 4 bar stock chip and stock injectors now. What would happen if I put them in now.? I also have a spair 3bar as well.
Could some one IM me with info on the best place to tee in a boost guage.?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Do not put them in until you have the chip. You will run continuously rich.


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Thanks for the answer..







Will wait. 
I got the boost guage hooked up. Out on the freeway at 4500 rpm I was seeing about 5 or 6 PSI of boost 
Keep in mind this is a 30 dollar guage.. I am looking forward to the chip as I have heard that should toss in 30 or 40 HP..?
I tead in right at the FP regulator. I noticed a line comming off the IDLE Air control valve righe before the throttle body.
What would happen if I tee of at this point. Just wonder the most accrute place to run the Boost guage line from..


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

quote:[HR][/HR] http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I'll be ordering mine this Monday. Brian, I know yours is OBD1 but is it distributored or coilpack? Also, do you have a number & contact name for ordering?
This is going to be for my '92 SLC OBD1 distributored. Are we sure that this one chip is good for both distributor & coilpack? Thanks in advance!
Abe- [email protected][HR][/HR]​My engine is a '95 with a coilpack. We've had some informal discussions on this board (and in this thread I believe) as to whether or not distributor vs. coilpack should make a diference...and the overall conclusions was...no. It should make no difference. I'm not "the expert" though, so I would definitely ask George @ ATP about this.
Contact info is on ATP's website at http://www.vwturbo.com/misc/contactinfo.asp 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I would like to know that million dollar question myself because my car is a old-school distributor with no coilpack ?


----------



## MidNiteVR6 (Apr 29, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

well in the beginging of this thread im was so juiced to get a vortech. But alas i have cams(DSR 256) so i guess when i have the money to actually get the vortech (late nov) I'm gonna call George at ATP and talk to him about it. I only live 15 from them (heheh). Anyways this has been one of the most educational threads i have read in awile Thanks Guys and i hope everything turns out great for you.










[Modified by MidNiteVR6, 11:33 PM 10-8-2002]


----------



## bretter (Sep 6, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Questions.








1. Do all vortech kits run lean up top? I have a 3 week old Eurotech. 
2. When is an Intercooler a good idea? What about H20 injection? BOV or no BOV?
3. Basicially, what combo of parts do I need to get the most from my vortech? 
12lb pulley, IC, copper gasket, cams, fuel solution, etc???? 
please enlighten me, thanks.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bretter)*

Im gonna dig this one up again for 2 questions. First of all, are there any updates vaus, how is the car repair coming along







.
Second of all, I noticed that when 1.8t people get chips for their car, they often get 91 octance or 93 octane or race gas (104 I think) versions of the chip based on what octane gas their area can get. I think you guys have 91 in california right. Anyways, in NY we have 93. Would there be anyway to order a 93 octane version of the chip if there would be any benefits? If this isnt possible (considering the progress on the standard chip














) would there be any benefit to even using the 93 (though i would anyway) with the standard chip. I dunno, Ive been wondering about this a little recentley and I figured it would be a good way to bump this baby back up!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Here's the answer to your question. Essentially, the only thing they do for a higher octane gas chip...is slightly advance the timing from where it was on the 91 octance version of the chip. This is not a feasible option, since that will require 
1. more time tuning the chip, and 
2. 93 octane gas, which is rather tough to find in certain (most) parts of CA.
I'm running the only OBD-1 version of the chip that I know of right now, and have been for several months now. The first few months I was in CA and running on 91 octane and now I'm in Florida running on 93 octane. Everything is fine so far. If anything...the 93 will help prevent any pre-detonation that you may have been experiencing with 91 octane gas (although I doubt anyone should have pre-detonation with 91).
Hope this helps. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I'm supposed to get the car back today and we can start back up again. We will most likely make a high octane version of the chip to use with a mixture of race gas.... not sure what octane we'll shoot for








-- Ed


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Well as soon as I get my chip from JRCmotorsports I will get it in and let people know what I think. So far I am hearing it will add about 30 or 40 HP over a stock chip and stock injectors..?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Thanks Dex and Vaus! Thats about what I expected but good to know none the less. Vaus, good luck getting the car back and definitley let us know the next step in dyno tuning. Scooter, let us know how you like the obd1 chip when it arrives. Thanks guys


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Well after getting the car back and discovering that the new coil pack was bad, I finally got my car back today! The next session is scheduled for the 30th so we can get back on track. Sorry for the delay guys.
-- Ed


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Horay for Sunoco 94 octane pump gas (here in philly). it's all i put in now. ok for he chip, i hope?


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

yipeee!


----------



## highbpm (Dec 3, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Wow.
I've just read this whole thread from beginning to end. What a saga.
Great work though guys and it's so good to find a thread where people know their stuff and are really enthsiastic about reaching a solution.
I look forward to reading more as the story unfolds.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (highbpm)*

bumpin-n-grindin







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

F6DTC from NGK.. Yea it had a feeling like it was to rich or a feeling of the ecu pulling the timeing back. Like a hesitation but very suttle..Will go get diffrent plugs in the morning and report back. Now I need to learn a little more about plugs. But it never threw any codes. So that is good. Feels very smoth now. 
Well got the new chip in and the injectors. So far it is only running ok. Like sluggish or like it is knocking and the timinhg is getting pulled back..? It sounds sweet. I took out the Bosch +4's and could only get Auto Light AP 3923 Platinum's I set the gap at .035 for now and will see how it does. Or do I want less gap..?? I hope this is why it runs weird.?


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Well good luck scooter98144 Im try the ole skool s4 plugs and see how they work out If any body want to try those out and be a guinea pig before I put them in they are Bosch F5DPOR


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

man I hope you get it figured out...sound like the plugs might be the prob. 

And only two more days till the next session http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Is the, hopefully, final chip tweaking session happening tomorrow, vaus?


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

Hey vaus, I saw that you are selling your car in the classifieds...why?!? I hope you keep it long enogh to finish the chip.


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Ok I got the meter working and it seems just fine.
After a few minutes it goes in to a hunting mode and swings back and forth very fast. Took it on the freeway and floored it. The thing went to full lean.. I have a feeling this is why it is trunning like crap.
It runs fuel lean any time I give it almost any gas under a load. I could just bairley get it to not do that. 
So what do I start checking or replacing..? Maybe a new Turn2 fuel pump kit..?
I guess I need to see what the pressure is at the fuel line..? I am seeing 20hg of vacum at idle..and about 5psi of boost at about 5,000 rpm..
Well driving to work I could really tell this this is just not getting the gas it needs and I have not a clue why..


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Thats weird that you lean out still with the new chip...I would definately chek the fuel pressure.
Vaus, are you out there?


[Modified by blownmk2vr6, 12:33 AM 11-1-2002]


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Fuel pressure at the test port at idle reads 50 PSI and bentley says it should read 51 very close..
I did not try disconecting the vacum line yet but I have a feeling it will read what it should.
When I rev it way up while it is sitting there pressure climb up twards 60 psi.. If I recall.
Yet under any kind of load it goes full lean. 
OK so fuel pressure at idle is good the O2 sensor is good the injectors are good It has a new fuel filter.. 
I am not sure what else it could be but maybe a worn fuel pump.
Guess I better drop it off and have it looked at.?


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Have you used a VAG-com?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Who cares about the fuel pressure at idle. What's the pressure at when you have it floored at 6000 rpm?


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

I have not used a Vag-Com. When I floor it pressure climbs to around 60 PSI if I recal but there is no load. Maybe I need to run the fuel presure guage into the cabin and go for a drive..
But I feel like it is not the fuel pump because at full cold it runs fine. So under a very certian condition it runs well. So when it is cold the pump has no problem giving enough fuel and the fuel injectors are sparing it but the second the O2 sensor comes on line it runs like crap. Just the slightest load and BAM it hits full lean. You can feal it like a wall. If I give it gas VERY slowly it will run stoich or rich the way it should..
Perhaps the chip is bad.. I have heard other people in here say that about the ATP chips..? Here is a link to the injectors and I am using the 30lb units.. They seem to have all the specs that they should have but I know the chip was done on ford injectors..?
http://www.mrgasket.com/accelpdf/Injector.pdf


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Maybe I need to run the fuel presure guage into the cabin and go for a drive..[HR][/HR]​YES! Stop wasting your time otherwise.


----------



## bollo (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

did the chip ever get finished???


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bollo)*

I think vaus bailed out on us


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bollo)*

The OBD1 is done. I am simply having issues that may or may not be related to the chip. Just can not let the vacum get above 10hg. Any thing from 10HG all the way to boost and up results in the car going full lean.
So I am in the procces of finding out why. It is not the fuel pump or FPR or injectors as those would not run right before it warmed up. Car runs pretty good at a cold start but the second that the O2 sensor warms up it runs as I have talked about..
I am curius about the idle air control and the EGR and air pump as all of those play a role.
Maybe a vacum line is not routed corectly.. but something is telling the ECU to go full lean when you put a load on the car. 
Will keep folks posted as I learn more. Who knows maybe it is a faulty chip..?
May try seeing what happens if I stick the stock chip and go for a short drive.. It should run WAY to rich..As there are bigger injectors in it.
Wish me luck..LOL


----------



## vr6go (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

Yah, I sent vaus an I'M and he's logged on since but I haven't gotten a response yet. Oh well, the chip was close to being done just wish I hadn't hung on and told people it was coming. At least the OBD-I guys got their chip even though this started as an OBD-II project!!!!!


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

If ATP knew how to program an OBD-2 chip then this would have happened a LONG time ago!


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

I guess I'll wait for a garrett chip.....I'm already running Z2 chip?? might as well wait for a VF chip.....


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6go)*

quote:[HR][/HR]At least the OBD-I guys got their chip even though this started as an OBD-II project!!!!!







[HR][/HR]​Just out of curiosity...how many OBD-1 guys are now running the OBD-1 chip? I know I've been running the first chip since July with no problems at all. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Mine was ordered on Tuesday so hopefully I could get you guys some feedback ASAP thanks


----------



## bollo (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

too bad this thing flopped (obd2) it would have been nice to have a proper chip...


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I've been running the OBD1 chip on my SLC since Wednesday. So far so good! Other than an annoying check engine light (DTC 1-1-1-1), the car is running very smooth. I'm going to make a call to George on Monday about the DTC. 
btw Dextrose, do you know what the rev limiter is set to? Also, has the speed governor been removed/increased/changed?
Benzi- Suuuuuup! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif










[Modified by silverraddo, 7:00 AM 11-2-2002]


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

True dat pimp! When you start getting use to the boost just hello at me and imma ask my boy about the 12lbs pulley upgrade but he just wants a big demand if he's gonna do the pulley upgraded so for all you cats out there that want more boost start getting your coins readys and sign up


----------



## bretter (Sep 6, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

I'm in the market for a little more boost..........


----------



## MidNiteVR6 (Apr 29, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bretter)*

cant you just order pigger pulleies from vortech?


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MidNiteVR6)*

Nope not 7 rib pullies. He will make the pullies but it gotta be worth his while of at least 30-50 just to make it worth while but that not gonna be no time soon only if he see's some type of heavy demand for them so guys if you really want these pullies you gotta speak up


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]btw Dextrose, do you know what the rev limiter is set to? Also, has the speed governor been removed/increased/changed?[HR][/HR]​I'm pretty sure we set the rev limiter to 7000 rpms. I was a bit hesitant, but they figured most people would like it that way. I never rev that high. But, it's there just in case you feel the need...the need for speed! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

hey guys. Sorry I haven't been around. As usual George cancelled the previous session. This time he was stuck in an airport on the east coast. I have not re-scheduled because I have a lot of poop going on right now. I decided to sell the car so I'm sorry to say that the OBDII chip will probably not be finished. Just out of curiousity would you guys still be interested in the OBDII chip with the buck? Other than the buck, the chip works very well and I'm sure George will be happy to sell it as is since all their other turbo chips have the same issue. Sorry again, but I've spent a lot of my time on this and just can't do it anymore. Atleast VF will have a setup you guys can run soon.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Atleast VF will have a setup you guys can run soon.
Thanks
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​ Apparently not, heres VF's response from the 12v forum. Is it true? Who knows. Beginning to get a lil frustrated here.
* VF-Engineering kits do not use the same Vortech unit that current kits on the market use. The pipework and belt system are also different. Our software would definitely not work with the Vortech kits already out there, as we have the MAF in a different location and we operate the supercharger at different speeds.
Our MK4 Stage3 at $6000 will be producing a lot more power than non air-water cooled kits that are referred to in the above post. Our figures are estimates and conservatively advertised. Despite which, our air-water cooled kits will be running lower intake temps which is safer for long term reliability etc.
VF-Engineering has a proprietary and exclusive agreement with GIAC for supercharger software. VF-E does not plan to improve products built by other companies because of liability issues. * 
If George were to sell the obd2 chip, I would be interested for a lesser price considering you agreed to pay him, if and only if the chip were completed. Obviously it is not. How bad is the buck to live with, is this only at decel? Also, what could you compare it to in terms of severity, ie. worn motor mounts, etc? If George were willing, I would be willing to pay maybe half price or so for a partially functional chip. $300 was a decent price for a so called perfect chip but Im not sure quite what we've ended up with.
Lastly, Vaus, I wanna thank you for your effort. Its clear that you put alot of time into this and the slack was not on your end of the bargain. Its too bad that things worked out the way they did with ATPs cancellations and your accident and all. Good luck selling your car http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Traitor


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Well I may be returning my OBD1 chip unless ATP sends me one that works. I left the 30lb injectors in and put my stock chip back in. Then went to the 3bar FPR. Now it runs way better. So either the chip he burned was faulty or it just does not work in my car for some reason.
Guess I am stuck waiting for ATP to get back from Sema.. To bad they did not mention that to me last week. 
Sunday I put my old TT chip in the car and it seems to run even better on that. But may go back to the stock chip just to be safe as I had not thought about detonation at VERY high rpm's say in 3rd gear.. 
So what affect on the system does changing to a Turn2 Walbro fuel pump have..? I still would like the ATP chip as others seems to like it. We need to see some clean dynos with it..
So the way it is now after it warms up and I floor it it goes full to almost full rich.. At cruising speeds and part throttle it runs Stoich and hunts back and forth. at idle it hunts full sweep. 
If I am halling ass and let off the throttle it goes lean the way it should..There is a tiny lag when at stoich and I floor it it will go lean for a hair then BAM hits the rich side.
But I do have a feeling that I may be missing out on some more power if I could get a working chip..
Sorry for the long ramblings. Keep in mind I am still learning all the inter relations between all these diffrent parts..


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

finish the chip!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





















please


----------



## MidNiteVR6 (Apr 29, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

Not all hope is lost. My friend kevin is returning to the MKIII arena, after a short lived MKIV jaunt. He plans on supercharging and he is in very good terms with ATP. So it may take another month or two but since vf is a sketchy company like i thought they were going to be that option is out. But just keep your fingers crossed, and be patient, the OBD2 chip should get finished.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MidNiteVR6)*

It seems like the VF stage II chip should work pretty well with our setup but they're deffinately not going to guarantee or advertise it. Also I just found out that the owner of the shop that installed my SC and built my tranny is probably going to buy my car and make it into their project. If this happens I'll try to work something out with him so we can possibly continue the work with ATP. No promisses but atleast its something.
As far as the buck... its not horrible. Its a bit annoying but I got used to it and have been driving with it this whole time (I drive my car a lot). I doubt George will sell the chip for half price since he doesn't really consider the buck to be a major issue because all of their turbo chips have the same problem







. Anyway.. I'm not going to give up completely on this but am also not going to make it as high priority as it has been for me. Hopefully something will eventually get done. I wish I was good buddies with Garret


----------



## BlownGinster (Jun 23, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I'm not giving up on my Vortech. 12psi pulley, ghetto extra injector, and voltage clamp. Its never been on the dyno, but it runs real, real strong. No bucks or anything. She doesn't run as good on the really hot days, but I'm working on that. My intercooler is in the works, along with more "usable" boost







It will be done by spring (I'm never home) The car is super reliable and fun EVERY time I take her out


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BlownGinster)*

I'm selling my ATP chip for $200. 
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## vr6zach (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I don't know what the hell you are doing, but you have a buck when driving?







c'mon what are you doing, I've been rolling around for 5000 miles with no prob! All i can say is work smarter, not harder.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I don't know what the hell you are doing, but you have a buck when driving?







c'mon what are you doing, I've been rolling around for 5000 miles with no prob! All i can say is work smarter, not harder.[HR][/HR]​Uh, what?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I don't know what the hell you are doing, but you have a buck when driving?







c'mon what are you doing, I've been rolling around for 5000 miles with no prob! All i can say is work smarter, not harder.
Uh, what?[HR][/HR]​The buck is nothing more than anyone with an ATP chip or possibly with any other bigger injectors chip experiences. Its not a huge deal... just a little annoying.
-- Ed


----------



## kevinmw (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Hey Scooter,
You posted on the "Home-Built" string that ATP sent you another chip and that everything has been peachy ever since...right? I'm about to get my V2 system for my OBD I and I don't want to put it on without the injectors and proper chip...which brings me to another question or two...the only info I've found is that my system is supposed to produce 8.5 psig of boost...its a second hand new Eurotech system...was your system a Eurotech assembled one?...or at least a V2 based one?...if not...how much psig was it producing?...and where did you get the pulley for it?...I want to make sure that if I get the ATP chip everything will match up so I get the same results...oh...and did you have a bypass in the system?...Vortech told me they recommend a BOV or bypass with anything over 5 psig...but that a BOV can only be used in cars with a speed/density type MAF...does anyone know if that is what is in the OBD I system?...or should i just use a bypass either way?...thanks.



[Modified by kevinmw, 10:35 AM 12-4-2002]


----------



## rhussjr (Aug 7, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (kevinmw)*

Scooter bought his system from me, it is a V1-S trim AMS Kit (8.5 psi). Fueiling issues will remain the same be it a V1 or V2 unit, but with a V5/V9 there is most likely some changes since they do flow less air, but this has yet to be noted. I have not finalized my V5 kit to the point where I am ready to install it. Once I am ready (Christmas install...), we will see what kind of power and reliabe fueling I can achieve.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rhussjr)*

I thought the 8.5psi belt was more like 10.5. Thats what I see on my gauge at redline. Sometimes even 11 if its really cold. I thought the 8.5 was more like 10 and the 12 was more like 14psi. Oh well, even though im obd2 I want scooters update too


----------



## kevinmw (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rhussjr)*

Hey rhussjr,
Thanks...when I get my kit I want to verify the boost it will produce...I think I can do that by confirming the size of the pulley...do you know what the diameter was on the V1 8.5psig set-up?....And are you going to, or will you be running a bypass valve on your system?
Oh and one other unrelated question...can anyone tell me for a fact what aftermarket headlights I will or will not have a problem installing with the Vortech system in the car...Xmas is coming...maybe Santa will bring lights...










[Modified by kevinmw, 4:09 PM 12-4-2002]


----------



## KrUsTyX (Sep 2, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

small question, what about the Eurotech kit? is the ODB1 chip provided with the kit works great with 310cc?
another one: is the V5 inlet/outlet are the same size than the V2 SQ? cause im switching the V2 for a V5 in the kit and i want to know if it will work great... thanks for helping me


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KrUsTyX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]small question, what about the Eurotech kit? is the ODB1 chip provided with the kit works great with 310cc?[HR][/HR]​I am running a Eurotech kit with the V2 and 310cc injectors. The car ran pretty well with the 310cc, eurotech chip, and 4bar. I changed to a 3bar because I had a 25hp drop at around 5200rpm when it ran a SUPER rich. Now with the 3bar it runs perfect. I can't wait to get a new clutch in her this winter and back to the dyno in the spring. 
Good Luck!


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

EGTs?


----------



## briang (Mar 10, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Zach Wrote
quote:[HR][/HR]I don't know what the hell you are doing, but you have a buck when driving?







c'mon what are you doing, I've been rolling around for 5000 miles with no prob! All i can say is work smarter, not harder.[HR][/HR]​Marty wrote
quote:[HR][/HR]Uh, what?[HR][/HR]​Don't mind Zach's rhetoric, he's cool but a bit mouthy. Zach drives a nicely excecuted MK II GTi with a VR6 installed. I'm not sure if his car is OBDI or OBD II, which could make a difference with respect to bucking.


----------



## vr6zach (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (briang)*

I am a bit mouthy, but that makes it fun. I have a obd 1 with a v1 blower,and i just dont under stand why and how your cars dont run right?(that bucking thing)I am using the chip Les sent me and i could not be any more happy. I all so have a rrfpr....maybe this is not 100% right, but my car dont buck. So say what you want but i have no probs. I guess for a post this long, and the big name guys( Marty and vaus) i just cant belive that you are still having these issuses?
Eurotech chip+ rrfpr + 2nd inline fuel pump+ stock injectors= NO PROBLEMS
hope i can help Zach


----------



## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I am a bit mouthy, but that makes it fun. I have a obd 1 with a v1 blower,and i just dont under stand why and how your cars dont run right?(that bucking thing)I am using the chip Les sent me and i could not be any more happy. I all so have a rrfpr....maybe this is not 100% right, but my car dont buck. So say what you want but i have no probs. I guess for a post this long, and the big name guys( Marty and vaus) i just cant belive that you are still having these issuses?
Eurotech chip+ rrfpr + 2nd inline fuel pump+ stock injectors= NO PROBLEMS
hope i can help Zach[HR][/HR]​Show us a dyno with A/F


----------



## vr6zach (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
Show us a dyno with A/F[HR][/HR]​You know i dont really give a rats ass how you cars run. All i am saying is that you guys are going about it the wrong way( but thats just me)
i hit 110 psi of fuel pressure at red line, if you dont well..........

PS i have no idea how to scan or what ever you have to do to post a pic of my chart (sorry)


[Modified by vr6zach, 10:13 PM 12-5-2002]


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

So just tell us the A/F values at upper rpms. If you have a digital camera take a picture of the dyno, host it somewhere and post on here. Also, obd1 responds better to tuning, so the fact that your car isnt bucking isnt because you are a master tuner. Also, their cars were bucking because they have larger injectors and you dont. Oh well, post the dyno up if you can. If you cant tell us your numbers and some a/f values http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*



> Show us a dyno with A/F
> You know i dont really give a rats ass how you cars run. All i am saying is that you guys are going about it the wrong way( but thats just me)
> i hit 110 psi of fuel pressure at red line, if you dont well..........
> 
> Actually I wouldn't understand why you would give a so called rats ass about how our cars run. I actually never had fueling issues with my car, just wanted to know what your A/F is at Redline with how much boost? It's that simple!


----------



## bollo (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

i wish someone would make a proper chip for the obd2 cars...


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bollo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i wish someone would make a proper chip for the obd2 cars...







[HR][/HR]​Funny how this thread started for the obd2 cars, and the obd1 guys are the ones who have a chip. I want somebody to buy the ATP obd2 chip and tell us how it works. Besides Ed of course because its obviously going to work better for him having been designed around his car. If it werent too bad, I would still be up for it. I would rather have my car running safely with a slight buck than running crazy lean. With upgraded motor mounts and soon to be clutch its not a smooth, quiet calm daily driver anyway. I doubt a little bucking would really bother me.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Eurotech chip+ rrfpr + 2nd inline fuel pump+ stock injectors= NO PROBLEMS[HR][/HR]​It has been documented throughout this thread that an in-line pump with a RRFPR will take care of any leaning out. Your A/F curve will be crap, but at least you won't have a buck.


----------



## vr6zach (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

i guess i did not take the time to read this entire post, but its nice to see that someone else has the same set up as me (right or wrong) from what i was told my A/f was right at normal? i really know nothing about larger injectors, water injection, or using a bigger pully. and quote me where i said i was a master tuner?I try to give my 2 cents and i get my head bit off by a bunch of guys who are pissed at me cause thier bust ass cars dont work right and mine dose?
GET OVER YOUR SELF
Your buddy Zach


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i guess i did not take the time to read this entire post, but its nice to see that someone else has the same set up as me (right or wrong) from what i was told my A/f was right at normal? i really know nothing about larger injectors, water injection, or using a bigger pully. and quote me where i said i was a master tuner?I try to give my 2 cents and i get my head bit off by a bunch of guys who are pissed at me cause thier bust ass cars dont work right and mine dose?
GET OVER YOUR SELF
Your buddy Zach[HR][/HR]​? Woah there, cowboy. Your car may drive well while the A/F curve is crap (but safely rich). There may just be a little more power and smoothness to be had.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

quote:[HR][/HR] quote me where i said i was a master tuner?[HR][/HR]​Whoa, you can come on here and say whatever you like, but when somebody else just jokes around you get all defensive.
quote:[HR][/HR]
GET OVER YOUR SELF[HR][/HR]​Good plan! Give it a shot


----------



## kevinmw (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

why do the useful, interesting strings that I obtain the most information from always fall victim to personality clashes?....who cares...can we try and solve some problems and give people some useful answers without the BS?...I'm trying to get some information about how to plumb in a bypass valve...and what connections the ductwork that rhussjr picked up provides for...but instead i have to resort to Im'ing him because of this noise...maybe someone else would like the answers to these questions too since it really hasn't been discussed here...the string wasn't started on this subject but it has been just about everywhere else...and the Home built string seems to have died off too...at least keep it useful in some way shape or form 




[Modified by kevinmw, 4:03 PM 12-6-2002]


----------



## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (kevinmw)*

Exactly! You try and ask someone for a dyno chart to see how the A/F is running and they get all bent out of shape. An A/F guage on your car doesn't mean anything because they are never right!


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

Yeah







, I agree with you guys. I think we are all just a little bit frustrated that nothing ever really came of the obd2 chip


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

so is the consensus on the obd2 chip basically a no-go? this sucks.


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]so is the consensus on the obd2 chip basically a no-go? this sucks.[HR][/HR]​yeah i know, i was really hoping something would happen








i just got my kit yesterday. i just hope i don't have the same problems


----------



## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

yeah! pretty much...they coulnt tap it! only obd1.................


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i just got my kit yesterday. i just hope i don't have the same problems[HR][/HR]​LOL


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

i know i know, *let the fun begin*










[Modified by twodubs, 12:06 PM 12-8-2002]


----------



## kevinmw (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

I'm lucky enough to have OBD I...well that is if everything on the car doesn't start falling apart because its 7 years old now...still I am finding out alot of stuff will not be resolved the way i would want it to be with the kit I'm getting....they skimped...I'll end up coughing up another $600 to $800 just to get the ATP chip, injectors and set the system up with a bypass that it won't come with...and i'll probably end up fabricating some ductwork to incorporate it cleanly....that's more money for supplies and more time...plus I really feel like I should have a rebuilt tranny with a LSD and new motors mounts....talk about a vicious cycle!!!


[Modified by kevinmw, 11:37 AM 12-9-2002]


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (kevinmw)*

Well, i started out with just the charger and I was fine. A little while ago I did the motor mounts, not because i NEEDED them but because it was more of a safety precaution. I have a peloquin now (not yet installed) and Im shopping around for a clutch. The car runs fine without all the extras but the more you push it the more you will want/need them.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Wow havn't seen this thread inna a while


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Wow havn't seen this thread inna a while







[HR][/HR]​Kinda sad huh? I remember back in like June when I would always check this thread to see what progress Vaus was making. I was checking this even before my charger. I have the latest version of the obd2 chip but im waiting on injectors. We shall see how it goes


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

please keep us informed http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i have my kit in my living room just waiting for the right chip., or else it will sit untill spring. so i can work on the fueling my self. its' just too dang cold to work out side in wisconsin


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

I just got my OBD1 ATP chip on Thursday so when I finish working on my daily beater ( hopefully this week ) I could start putting this S/C in the rado







. Don't feel so bad leebro61 I was hopeing for the same thing even before my charger came in the mail since july as well


----------



## kevinmw (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

Yeah its been nasty in NY too 2dubs...plus these pesky holidays always come along at the most inconvieniant time....no time to get any work done on the car or money left to get my chip and injectors right now...ugh...maybe I'll get some $$$ for Xmas!...Benzi, please let me know how you like the OBD I chip...I got nothing but praise back from Dex and Scooter...I want to buy it before I even put the system on the car...


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (kevinmw)*

Being that your in BK as well I will take you for a spin and you could tell me how it feels for yourself


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

you lucky OBD1 guys







i won't give up though, because there is a girl up here with the same set-up, and i think hers is runing fine. i just have to find out what shes running















plus she's OBD2 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by twodubs, 7:16 PM 12-22-2002]


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Just an FYI: it "feels" just fine with stock injectors and a standard SC chip, while you're detonating and melting away the pistons. Don't trust your ass, trust a wide-band and your EGTs.


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Just an FYI: it "feels" just fine with stock injectors and a standard SC chip, while you're detonating and melting away the pistons. Don't trust your ass, trust a wide-band and your EGTs.[HR][/HR]​so what can you do???? i mean there is a chip for the OBD2, right? but will it solve the problem completely? i just want to be nice and safe. this is my daily driver that the charger is going on. so i dont need the smaller pulley i just want a little more "reliable" power







if thats possible


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

1) In-line fuel pump and an FMU.
or
2) Bigger injectors and a chip to control them (i.e., 310cc and ATP chip)


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

what did you run in your car?? if you don't mind me asking.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

I ran 256 cams, so I am a special case.
With stock injectors at 4 bar with an AMS chip, I saw EGTs in the 1800+ degrees F range. I then swapped in a Walbro 255 lph high pressure in-tank pump and threw on a Cartech FMU. The max pressure that the Walbro could push through the six stock injectors at 100% duty cycle was about 90 psi. At this pressure I was still going too lean from 6000 rpm and up. A beefy in-line pump would have allowed more fuel pressure. So I installed a Bosch CIS in-line pump, and immediately removed it. The noise was too much. I could hear it on the freeway at 65 mph over the radio. This has a lot to do with the mounting location (which was under the rear seats beside the fuel filter) and the fact that the pump was forced to cavitate under light load. I then decided to go with bigger injectors instead (310cc). That was fine and dandy, but the stock ECU can't handle all of the extra fuel on it's own. I began by playing with MAF signal calibrators (simple voltage divider circuits on the MAF signal lines) to trick the ECU into injecting less fuel. This worked and the car drove fine, but the timing was a little off and there was a nasty buck related to the fooled MAF signal and the decel to accel part throttle changeover. I actually dyno'd the car with the signal calibrator and it produced just over 271 whp. At 4 bar, the 310cc injectors were still not cutting it from 6000 rpm on up. Things were getting too lean (13:1+), so I had to up the fuel pressure to 5 bar. With six 310cc injectors at 5 bar at 90+% duty cycle, the system finally stayed nice and rich through 7000 rpm, with cool EGTs around 1450 F. It was pretty decent, but the fueling and timing was all over the place. Right around this time ATP started working on their 310cc chip, so I sat tight. I picked one up as soon as the first revisions were available. The fueling and timing were pretty much fine, but there was still a nasty buck (related to the fact that ATP hasn't the slightest clue when it comes to tuning the OBD-2 ECUs). I've been running that combo ever since.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Hey Marty you had a pretty nice setup and I was wondering with your last solution ( were the only problem you had was your timing and fueling )? . Would a MSD boost/timing retard help that situation were it will pull back the timing for the amount of boost you run? Please no flaming just a suggestion.


----------



## kevinmw (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

I'm such a dope!...I didn't even realize that Benzi...that would be Great!...maybe sometime after the holidays...I'm pulling my hair out trying to get set up in the new apartment and do Xmas at the same time...


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*injector ?*

The injectors needed are low impendance correct?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Hey Marty you had a pretty nice setup and I was wondering with your last solution ( were the only problem you had was your timing and fueling )? . Would a MSD boost/timing retard help that situation were it will pull back the timing for the amount of boost you run? Please no flaming just a suggestion.[HR][/HR]​Perhaps that would give you some adjustment control under boost, but the problem was really at all RPM. The ECU never really knew how much air was coming in, so the car just wasn't that smooth. It was liveable, but the ATP chip was a better solution. The ATP is a no brainer for the OBD-1 guys 'cause there is no buck.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

I mean it was a suggestion for the OBD2 guys wow didn't have that much luck with there chip and would a voltage clamp help control the MAF signal to the ECU? I know it's alot of crap to go through but if you OBD2 guys dont have a solution to the problem maybe that will help


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

The voltage clamp did nothing good for me. In fact, it made my MAF signal slightly erratic at high rpm.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Dam well it was worth a try


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

Wow... its crazy to see that this thread is still alive. I haven't been on these boards in a while and just saw this pop up. I feel really bad for all you OBDII guys but I really didn't see the tunning with ATP going anywhere. George really had no clue what was causing the buck and we tried a bunch of random maps to see if they would fix it.... nothing. The buck IS however livable and Marty and I drove around with it for quite some time and I'm sure George would be willing to sell anyone that chip which does in fact solve the fueling issues and keeps the car running nice and safe and makes good power as well. Anyway, I wish all of you good luck with your cars and hope that the VF software will help you guys out. 
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I still haven't seen any responses from OBD-1 guys running the chip?? What gives? What's the story with the OBD-1 guys? Are they out there silently enjoying their chips or am I STILL the only one running one?
Merry Christmas and happy New Year!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I got my chip last week but I havent put it in yet becasue I have to fix my daily driver car ( something has to be reliable







) that should be finished about next week. I know that silverrado and scooter are enjoying there OBD-1 chips. and have chimed in from time to time. I will give you guys a update on progress for my setup and get back to you BTW If anyone has not told you 2 guys ( Vausvr6 & Dextrose I would like to say thanks for the effort you guys put into this great project and before I forget thanks [email protected] for the Software.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

I have an obd2 chip that isnt installed yet. My connection for injectors hasnt replied to my emails in a few days


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Yes I have been happy with my OBD1 chip.. It took a second try though and George was most helpfull on the phone and sent the second chip to me no charge..
I am still not sure just how much power I am making as I am to poor to get a dyno run done. Will do that some day and will post what I find.
So far it seems to make good power and my stock clutch is holding up just fine. I do need to get a better boost guage as the cheap 30 dollor unit I got never goes past 5PSI..


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
the cheap 30 dollor unit I got never goes past 5PSI..[HR][/HR]​Geeeezzzzzz, youre running a vortech sc and you are too cheap to buy real gauges.














. Nah, im just playing with ya, but if it cost $30 for $20 more you could have had a halfway decent autometer gauge or something. Hey, maybe the belts slipping, then you'd be in for a real







eye opener when you start hitting 10 psi


----------



## bollo (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Has anyone tried contacting autothority yet about a proper chip for us OBD2 guys??


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bollo)*

Does anybody live near them? They are in Virginia or something arent they?


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Well Leebro61 being that your kinda like our rep for S/C OBD2 guys for the east coast guess your gonna have to be the guinea pig for this task







. Look on the brite side it's better than driving to California?


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

I didn't want to let the cat out of the bag too soon but I figured you OBD2 guys could use some good news about your SC chip...
*THE OBD2 VR6 SC CHIP WILL "HOPEFULLY" BE FINALIZED BY THE END OF JANUARY!*
A buddy of mine (vortexer vr6go) and I have a tuning session coming up at ATP to finish up the OBD2 chip and iron out a small idling issue I have with my OBD1 SC chip. I've been in contact with [email protected] and offered our time to come up from SoCal to finish the chip. We were initially scheduled to go out there Dec. 18th but due to an unfortunate bearing failure on my charger, we had to postpone the session. As soon as I get back my charger from Vortech after being rebuilt, we will be contacting [email protected] to pencil in an exact date. My guess it'll be sometime after mid-January.
For those curious... my car ('92 SLC) ran great with the chip + 310's. I noticed that the idle was a little rough after warm-up and mentioned it to [email protected] At this point, I'm not sure if it's the chip or something else on the car that is causing the rough idle. (btw, the idle isn't that bad. Just not as smooth as I'm used to.) Anyways, should have that ironed out soon.
As for what happened to my charger, the bearings appeared to have failed. Charger started making a loud clanking noise. I put my hand on the charger and I could feel something not spinning right in there. I got the charger (V2SQ) used so the bearings may have been on the way out. Also, I don't think I helped the situation by using a 6-rib belt. I'll explain... IMO, I believe by using the 6-rib I had to tension the belt more than I had to to keep it from slipping (more stress on the pulley shaft). If I was using the 7-rib, I probably wouldn't have had to tension it as much. FYI, the charger rebuild costs $365! Ouch!








If you have any questions, I'll try to answer them as best I can. Unfortunately, I'm not on here (vortex) as much as I'd like so I'll try to get back & reply as quick as possible. Thanks! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

So you waited until I already bought a bucking version of the damn chip







, oh well. I really hope that it gets done correctly this time but im a little skeptical as Vaus and George couldnt get the bucking correct and they tried several times. I really hope that they can get the buck out and get this chip perfected. Eventually I will have to put my tail between my legs and pay for yet another version of the same exact chip http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]So you waited until I already bought a bucking version of the damn chip







, oh well. ...[HR][/HR]​No need to be mad. At least something's being done to try and finish it up, right? Maybe I shouldn't have let the cat out.







LOL. Did you buy the chip from ATP? If you did, I don't see why they wouldn't send you the revised chip. You'd have to verify that with them or I could ask [email protected] next time I talk to him.
Abe


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

Nah Im not mad. I was just playing around with ya. I bought the chip off of Marty, do you think they would let me exchange it later? Would they really go through their records to find out that I personally didnt buy the chip from them








With my old giac chip, as long as you had this little certificate thingy you could send your chip in for free upgrades, no matter who owned it.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

ahhhh!!!! good news!!!!!! ......please keep us informed!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

Don't get too excited guys. The new chip will still buck. George didn't magically figure out how to tune an OBD-2 chip for larger injectors. If there are any significant changes, it will only be to optimize the chip for the car on which it's being tuned. The fueling on VausVR6's car was perfect. The ONLY problem was the buck, which ATP can't solve.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Like Marty said... George had no clue what caused the buck before I started working with him and he still has no clue how to fix it. We were playing around with a couple maps but none of them seemed to make any difference to the buck. I wouldn't count on him figuring it out by himself in one tunning session, but good luck to you guys anyway.
BTW, if you let me know what day the session is on for, I'll try to stop by.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]...The ONLY problem was the buck, which ATP can't solve.[HR][/HR]​When talking to George he mentioned that the session would be to get the "Driveability" portion squared away. So I assume that includes the buck. He said as far as getting max power that's pretty much done. Now whether or not he's capable of getting the buck issue resolved... who know's?? I don't. Maybe he knows something now which he didn't know before.







Either way we'll try to finish it up. If he fixes the buck, I'm sure there'll be a lot of happy campers. It's worth a shot though, right?
Can't win if you don't play!







We'll see...
btw Marty, I'd like your opinion about something . With my current *OBD1*setup (4bar FPR, 310cc's, stock fuel pump, ATP chip, stock charger pulley), would it be possible to change to a 12lb pulley and re-do the chip *without* changing/adding any other hardware? Or would I have to add a 5bar fpr and/or better fuel pump? Reason I ask is because BenziVR6 is willing to lend me a 12lb pulley so maybe a chip could be set up for it while I'm there. Is it possible? Thanks in advance!


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]It's worth a shot though, right?[HR][/HR]​Of course. Or in Ed's case, shot after shot after shot after shot.








quote:[HR][/HR]btw Marty, I'd like your opinion about something . With my current OBD1setup (4bar FPR, 310cc's, stock fuel pump, ATP chip, stock charger pulley), would it be possible to change to a 12lb pulley and re-do the chip without changing/adding any other hardware? Or would I have to add a 5bar fpr and/or better fuel pump? Reason I ask is because BenziVR6 is willing to lend me a 12lb pulley so maybe a chip could be set up for it while I'm there. Is it possible? Thanks in advance![HR][/HR]​If you have stock cams, you should be fine. Throw it on and give it a run on the dyno with the sniffer to be sure.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Definitely give the 12psi pulley a shot. I would love to be able to upgrade to a 12psi pulley and 5bar fpr if there is a decent chip tuned for it


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

The ATP chip adapts just fine to a 5 bar FPR, as in it doesn't run any richer during closed loop.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

quote:[HR][/HR]The ATP chip adapts just fine to a 5 bar FPR, as in it doesn't run any richer during closed loop.[HR][/HR]​Any speculation as to how that would work with a 12psi pulley. As we found out earlier, 310cc at 4bar is barely enough for 10psi, would 310cc at 5bar be enough for 12?


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Well I will give you guys a update in couple of weeks after I enjoy my 8.5lbs for now then I will switch over to 12lbs and se how it runs prolly even take it to a dyno if I got some extra pocket change


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

310cc at 4 bar is plenty for 10 psi with stock cams. It should be plenty for 12 psi as well.


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

On the topic of a 12psi pulley. Would not the best thing be is to have ATP tune a chip whith a 12psi pulley.. and just charge folks a small upgrade fee if they return the old chip.
Or are you saying the current OB1 chip will or should work just fine with a 12psi pulley.?
Would love to own or buy one of these hard to find pulleys..


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

That's a lot of non-intercooled boost. Careful careful.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

do you have to run 310ccs or can you run larger?








and why cant the buck be worked out?


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

You can run larger. I'm not sure what the upper adaptation limit is on the ATP big injector program. I went to 5 bar with no problems. The buck is related to the ECU determining the decel-accel crossover through the MAF signal, and altering the fueling in the chip seems to alter the interpretted MAF signal.







Other maps in the chip need to be tweeked. I have no idea which, and neither does George.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

sounds like you have alot of faith in george??








not really loving the idea of buying a chip with bucking problems....maybe some sort of way off altering the interpreted Maf signal? like that contraption you guys had before?????


----------



## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

I don't know about faith







I think it's the only alternative out there thus far


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

The 12psi pulley sounds like a good thing to try. I talked to George yesterday and as of now, he still doesn't know how to fix the buck. He said 
we'll have to keep trying things." I wouldn't count on the buck getting fixed but there's always a chance we'll stumble on the correct map to tweak. 
Modifying the actual MAF signal won't help the buck at all because its the calculated value that's causing the problem. It really comes down to figuring out the code which George hasn't yet. Of course that's no reason to not try. That's how you eventually figure things out. During the last session we actually stumbled on something odd and we didn't get a chance to mess around with it so this will give us a chance. Who knows... but I wouldn't expect much. Deffinately bring the 12psi pulley though.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

seriously........someone MUST beable to figure out this buck????? or at the least point George in the right direction......it would be most profitable for him to figure this out.....there are at least six of us waiting for a correct OBD2 chip.....

Vaus looking back on this would you have used diff injectors? or do you feel the 310s were fine...even with a possible 12LB pulley?
and has anyone running, is it six instead of seven rib belts,Autozone..like me...used Vortechs six rib 12LB pulley they sell on their site!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## bollo (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]seriously........someone MUST beable to figure out this buck????? or at the least point George in the right direction......[HR][/HR]​hmmm.... can you say Garrett Lim








VF chip is all I can say fellas!!


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bollo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]VF chip is all I can say fellas!![HR][/HR]​i asked my buddy at AWE about getting the VF chip and he said prolly not.
they want to keep the vf chips w/ the vf kits exclusively http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
and something else about the circuitry or something, i forget, but it wasnt a plausible option from what he said


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

Grrrr! Couldnt ATP call up some other tuner (GIAC) for example and ask for some friendly industry tips about the buck?


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

if the Garrett VF chip is anything like the Garrett Z stage2 chip it will become available.....when I was in the market for a Z chip I had plenty of people willing to part with theirs........










[Modified by IMWALKIN, 12:48 PM 1-2-2003]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]seriously........someone MUST beable to figure out this buck????? or at the least point George in the right direction......it would be most profitable for him to figure this out.....there are at least six of us waiting for a correct OBD2 chip.....

Vaus looking back on this would you have used diff injectors? or do you feel the 310s were fine...even with a possible 12LB pulley?
and has anyone running, is it six instead of seven rib belts,Autozone..like me...used Vortechs six rib 12LB pulley they sell on their site!!!!!!!!!![HR][/HR]​
I'm pretty sure that Garret figured it out. George really hasn't hacked the code at all. All he does is edit maps that have been labelled for him. Garret seems to actually understand the internal workings of the code which allows him to do a lot more. I've been trying to gain more understanding of the different maps with George but it seems that even some of his maps are mislabelled. This makes it very difficult to fix anything.
The 310cc injectors should be fine for 12psi as long as you stick with the stock cams... no need for bigger injectors especially since if the buck isn't fixed bigger injectors will only make it worse.


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Grrrr! Couldnt ATP call up some other tuner (GIAC) for example and ask for some friendly industry tips about the buck?







[HR][/HR]​Hah... there's no way Garret would say a word to ATP or any other tuner for that matter. He's very secretive about his software.
-- Ed


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

how about that 12LB pulley from vortech???? anybody use that???


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]if the Garrett VF chip is anything like the Garrett Z stage2 chip it will become available.....when I was in the market for a Z chip I had plenty of people willing to part with theirs........








[HR][/HR]​Plagarism is not very satisfying. Firstly you inheret all the problems of the original desing and then you are back to square one. 
Our Z-Eng (non GIAC) software we supplied with our kits between Jan 00 and Jun 01 was not encrypted and subsequently we and found it had been copied blatantly. In fact many of people currently having bucking problems may have our software. We also had bucking issues







back then.
Understanding ascii is not easy and then understanding how to re-write it (and being aware of the liability of such work) requires skill and savy. I dont expect anyone will part with such knowledge. Since Jun 01 we have been working very hard with GIAC and all software is encrypted and copyrighted. So needless to say if we see it come up anywhere, we will protect our intellectual property rights.
VF-Engineeirng formerly Z-Engineering USA


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vf-engineering)*

quote:[HR][/HR]if the Garrett VF chip is anything like the Garrett Z stage2 chip it will become available.....when I was in the market for a Z chip I had plenty of people willing to part with theirs........









Plagarism is not very satisfying. Firstly you inheret all the problems of the original desing and then you are back to square one. 
Our Z-Eng (non GIAC) software we supplied with our kits between Jan 00 and Jun 01 was not encrypted and subsequently we and found it had been copied blatantly. In fact many of people currently having bucking problems may have our software. We also had bucking issues







back then.
Understanding ascii is not easy and then understanding how to re-write it (and being aware of the liability of such work) requires skill and savy. I dont expect anyone will part with such knowledge. Since Jun 01 we have been working very hard with GIAC and all software is encrypted and copyrighted. So needless to say if we see it come up anywhere, we will protect our intellectual property rights.
VF-Engineeirng formerly Z-Engineering USA[HR][/HR]​Wow VF.... where did the plagarism talk come from? Believe me no one who's having bucking issues is using your original Z software. The buck we're talking about is due to adjusting the maps to run larger injectors. Your buck was just due to bad software. A tip for future: if you don't want people to pirate your software, make it available to the general public. I'm sure if it works well, people will be willing to pay you for it. If you do, however keep it just for your kits, I'm willing to bet someone will atleast attempt to pirate it. Be nice to your potential customers.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vf-engineering)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Understanding ascii is not easy and then understanding how to re-write it (and being aware of the liability of such work) requires skill and savy. [HR][/HR]​BTW, I'd also suggest to talk about topics you actually do understand. Ascii is simply the code that describes English letters and symbols and has little or nothing to do with chip software. Maybe you meant assembly? 
-- Ed


[Modified by vausVR6, 12:41 PM 1-2-2003]


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Geez! If anybody at all has a working chip in there car it must be from VF or Z engineering. In fact, I heard vwoa stole their ecu chips for stock model cars right out of the vf factory


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Wow VF.... where did the plagarism talk come from? Believe me no one who's having bucking issues is using your original Z software. The buck we're talking about is due to adjusting the maps to run larger injectors. Your buck was just due to bad software. A tip for future: if you don't want people to pirate your software, make it available to the general public. I'm sure if it works well, people will be willing to pay you for it. If you do, however keep it just for your kits, I'm willing to bet someone will atleast attempt to pirate it. Be nice to your potential customers.
Thanks
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​Not trying to come down like a ton of bricks on anyone specifically, but just making our position clear due to what has happened in the past. 
Out of curiosity what is the quantity estimate and type of chip you need? No promises.
[email protected]


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vf-engineering)*








Well by the looks of this thead I think you guys ( v-f ) need to take into consideration that there is a big demand for a proper working OBD-2 and OBD-1 S/C chip! I mean hey the thread is only 16 pages long?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vf-engineering)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
Not trying to come down like a ton of bricks on anyone specifically, but just making our position clear due to what has happened in the past. 
Out of curiosity what is the quantity estimate and type of chip you need? No promises.
[email protected][HR][/HR]​VF, nobody wants to pirate your chip for our setup or anything like that. If anybody ripped off your old Z software and copyed it than that sucks. We just want a working chip compatible for a supercharged vr6 that doesnt run lean and doesnt buck. Apparently we would want a copy of the VF stage 2 chip with whatever sized injectors stage 2 would use. I think we would all be willing to pay for a working chip, its not like we would be ripping off the VF chip and reproducing it and reselling that


----------



## eurotechracing (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vf-engineering)*

quote:[HR][/HR]if the Garrett VF chip is anything like the Garrett Z stage2 chip it will become available.....when I was in the market for a Z chip I had plenty of people willing to part with theirs........









Plagarism is not very satisfying. Firstly you inheret all the problems of the original desing and then you are back to square one. 
Our Z-Eng (non GIAC) software we supplied with our kits between Jan 00 and Jun 01 was not encrypted and subsequently we and found it had been copied blatantly. In fact many of people currently having bucking problems may have our software. We also had bucking issues







back then.
Understanding ascii is not easy and then understanding how to re-write it (and being aware of the liability of such work) requires skill and savy. I dont expect anyone will part with such knowledge. Since Jun 01 we have been working very hard with GIAC and all software is encrypted and copyrighted. So needless to say if we see it come up anywhere, we will protect our intellectual property rights.
VF-Engineeirng formerly Z-Engineering USA[HR][/HR]​
*?*


----------



## KrUsTyX (Sep 2, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bollo)*

small question for you guys... wich chip comes with the EUROTECH kit? does it works great? with 310cc... i also swapped the V2-SQ for the V5... thanks










[Modified by KrUsTyX, 12:11 AM 1-3-2003]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KrUsTyX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]small question for you guys... wich chip comes with the EUROTECH kit? does it works great? with 310cc... i also swapped the V2-SQ for the V5... thanks









[Modified by KrUsTyX, 12:11 AM 1-3-2003][HR][/HR]​The Eurotech kit that I bought came with a chip that ran on the stock injectors and 4bar FPR. Drivability was decent but there was not enough fuel up top and caused EGTs in the range of 1700 degrees. 
-- Ed


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vf-engineering)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
Not trying to come down like a ton of bricks on anyone specifically, but just making our position clear due to what has happened in the past. 
Out of curiosity what is the quantity estimate and type of chip you need? No promises.
[email protected][HR][/HR]​I understand that your old chip was likely copied but I don't see any connection to this thread and don't see the point in stating a random accusation directed at no one. The chip these guys need would run larger than stock injectors and provide enough fuel at redline for 10psi. It should be VERY close to your stage II software. 
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Question, has anyone tried to talk to Nik and see if he would do a chip? His stage 3 software would be what you would need to run your cars with 310's and 10psi. Instead of whining about how George doesn't know how to get rid of the buck ask someone if they will do something. I don't see how Nik was accussing anyone, since someone stated that they might copy his software. He's just protecting his company and his product from being copied. And he did ask what you were looking for in terms to a chip that would help your car run better, He didn't make any promises but at least he asked.


----------



## KrUsTyX (Sep 2, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]small question for you guys... wich chip comes with the EUROTECH kit? does it works great? with 310cc... i also swapped the V2-SQ for the V5... thanks









[Modified by KrUsTyX, 12:11 AM 1-3-2003]
The Eurotech kit that I bought came with a chip that ran on the stock injectors and 4bar FPR. Drivability was decent but there was not enough fuel up top and caused EGTs in the range of 1700 degrees. 
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​so what's my best buy with 310cc... im odb1... ATP? how much

















[Modified by KrUsTyX, 7:48 AM 1-3-2003]


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KrUsTyX)*

thanks for the response VF, I know it was a crappy way of getting you over here...but it worked! We all have been waiting very patiently for a proper chip for our cars..... anything you can do to possibly make this available would be great...... you'd be helping alot of people out and hopefully making a couple of bucks out of it??? please keep us updated...... glad you joined us, I think most of us Vortech owners,right now, would probably hold your family hostage for the right chip...thats how desperate we are! Happy New Year....


[Modified by IMWALKIN, 2:13 PM 1-3-2003]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KrUsTyX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]so what's my best buy with 310cc... im odb1... ATP? how much
















[Modified by KrUsTyX, 7:48 AM 1-3-2003][HR][/HR]​If you're OBDI, go for the ATP chip. People are having good luck with it.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## alteregovw (Apr 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I talked to Nik quite awhile back because I'm a bit interested in becoming a dealer/installer for my area. Anyway it was before he was putting together these new kits and I asked about the chips for the Vortech kits. I said that I was interested in maybe being an outlet for him to sell the chips to Vortech kit owners so that he wouldn't have to deal with it. Anyway, he said that he wasn't really wanting to do that, and I can understand that he was seeing the Vortech kits as competition to his. 
Things have changed now. His new kits can be competitively priced and most will go for them instead of getting a charger kit from AMS or Eurotech... if for just the software that you get and customer service. I also don't see anyone that already has a Vortech kit selling their entire kit to get a VF kit *just* to get that software. We will all just keep plugging away at getting it all dialed in and getting a setup for a 12lb pulley in the future figured out as well if need be. Not many people are going to piece a kit together just to save some money, it's a pretty good hassle also. So what I'm trying to say is that noone with a Vortech already (well most I would guess) is going to take off their kit to buy yours so you aren't really in any competition with current owners of Vortech kits. You could hook them up with a chip and make a profit without cutting into your new kit sales.
Also like it was written above, if they are sold publicly then they won't be a big target for pirating as long as they aren't like $500 or something. At least ATP is trying to get these chips done for us. That is much more than anyone else is doing. AMS hasn't even tried to improve anything or seemed to care about the SC in a long time.
There are alot of things to consider for Nik here. I don't think that you would lose any new kit sales though if a chip were available for the people on this thread. Also, if I didn't already have this kit then I would buy a new one through you. You are actually here on the Vortex addressing things and that is more than most other companies. It shows that you still have a passion for what you do and that counts for a lot. I know I get burned out sometimes of dealing with cars all day long. Not like I'd want to do anything else for a living though. Everyone should give Nik and ATP a big round of applause. If Nik can get a chip for us that is better than ATP's or is before it then,,, well,,, the best man wins. If he (you Nik) decides it's not in his best interest or he already has too much on his plate right now then that is fine too. Of course I know what everyone is hoping happens. Either way, a chip from ATP or VF that works ..... well it works.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (alteregovw)*

Well said, I think Nik deserves a TON of credit for building a reputable sc setup but most importantly backing up his customers http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif ATP also deserves credit for at least trying to make the chip work. Its better than what we have so far.
Also, I dont think software would take away from his sales, a 3 year warranty is unheard of and I gladly would have paid a little extra for the piece of mind. Plus, it appears to be designed flawlessy. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (alteregovw)*

Thanks for the heads up. I will consider our options, but your insight that we have too much on our plate is quite accurate. If you check out our new site, you will see how it is growing.
Our situation on this topic rests on how soon we finish our MK3 stages 1 to 3. When the 3rd stage is in development is when we will decide what to do. The time taken to develop a chip and our aftersales back up and our opportunity cost definitely means there will be a price many will not like.
-nik


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vf-engineering)*

Nik. I see it as supplemental sales? people who already have a vortech based kits have them... the other companies that offer them are bunk? Do you think offering this chip would hurt your sales? you would be selling to a customer that otherwise, honestly, would not be yours. Most people are not going to sell their kits to buy a new one?? it just would cost us too much.. from one kit to another. I say corner the market on this and everyone wins. just my .02. thanks for the replies.... anyone have georges phone number?










[Modified by IMWALKIN, 6:28 PM 1-5-2003]


----------



## JTestman (Oct 21, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

I agree, even though I moved from the S/C realm..
What’s an un-burnt chip cost..
Why in the world would someone buy your kit just to get a chip when stand-alone is cheaper and programmable? 
Sell the chips, encrypt them if you must you have nothing to gain but business and customers. Package deals?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (JTestman)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

doa?


----------



## bully12v (Jan 16, 2003)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

i read as much of this as possible... and i am about to order the ATP OBDII chip, but i have a question about the buck. when exactly does it happen... is it just a slight hesitation at low rpms? does it ever happen at WOT?
thanks.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (bully12v)*

It happens when going from deceleration to part throttle. The way it was explained to me is that if you press the gas in 10% of the way the car will still keep on decelerating as if you werent touching the gas, then press it in another 5% and all of a sudden you will feel 15% of the power and a "buck"
Silverado or vr6go, how bout some progress reports


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]...
Silverado or vr6go, how bout some progress reports







[HR][/HR]​I was hoping for Feb. 3rd & 4th but I haven't been able to get through to [email protected] I've left a message for him to get back to me last week but no response. I also emailed him and haven't received a reply. Will try calling him again this Monday.


[Modified by silverraddo, 7:52 AM 1-19-2003]


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

maybe if we get a li$t of people that would BUY the OBD2 chip that might help george fini$h it.....know what I mean...$$$$$$ that$ what it $eem$ to be about...$$$$ right? count me in....IMWALKIN


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

PUT ME ON THAT LIST















steve


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Well obviously i would buy a perfected version of the chip but everything at ATP seems hit or miss. Scooter is on his what 3rd or 4th obd1 chip that was supposed to be flawless? I would love to see it happen but my hope dwindles everyday


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

so what is the best thing a person with OBD2 can do to make the car not run lean??
my charger is going on on thurs of next week, and i don't want to be melting pistons















steve


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Finally put the latest chip in and got to drive around with it. Good news is that the buck is COMPLETELY gone. Feels just like stock. Bad news is that we overshot the fuel correction. This is to be expected since we really didn't have time to tweak it at all. Basically we just raised the fuel by some arbitrary number to see if it will in fact effect the buck. It did, so now we need to find a happy medium. I have a 3 hour session scheduled for wed of next week. Hopefully we can finish up the chip then.
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​I knew i remembered reading something like this so i dug in and pulled it out. It sounds as if they had the buck solved, they just never went back and cleaned up the loose ends...why did Vaus say that they could NOT solve the buck if they already did have it solved, just not perfected.








I would like to hear what exactly happened from this setup, why cant ATP just keep guessing and checking to find a happy medium


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

That "fix" turned out to be some fluke that they were never able to reproduce. The exact program ran like complete crap the next day.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Its crazy to think vaus put down 269.6!!!!!!!! mine is currently dynoed at 241.9.........thats what a 27hp diff!!!!!!! all because of a chip!!! the torque was not as impressive but came on quicker....... please finish this chip!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Scooter is on his what 3rd or 4th obd1 chip that was supposed to be flawless?[HR][/HR]​I'm not sure I understand what's going on with this. At this point...I believe there are several of us out here that are enjoying our OBD-1 chips with little to no problems at all. And the little problems aren't really what I would classify as probelms anyway...more like personal preference tweaks. Like the one guy that thought the car idled a bit rough. It might be true...but it's not a show stopper by any means. See what I'm saying? So as far as Scooter goes...I can't understand what the problem is there?


----------



## silverraddo (Dec 20, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

quote:[HR][/HR]...I'm not sure I understand what's going on with this. At this point...I believe there are several of us out here that are enjoying our OBD-1 chips with little to no problems at all. And the little problems aren't really what I would classify as probelms anyway...more like personal preference tweaks. Like the one guy that thought the car idled a bit rough...[HR][/HR]​Yes... I am enjoying my chip/sc. The car is fun to drive and pulls hard to redline. I have not encountered any major driveability issues. The only MINOR thing is the car idles a little rough & low (~550rpm) after the car has warmed up. I hope to get that situated as soon as I can get a hold of [email protected] (Anyone else notice how hard it is to get him on the phone?







)
Benzivr6- Want my address so U could send me the 12lb pulley? IM me.


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (silverraddo)*

Here is what I feel has gone wrong with my chip.. I feel like the first chip George sent was simply a bad chip. bad chips are pretty common and it just did not work right. So in round two George dialed in more fuel thinking that the chip was just running lean when in fact it was just a bad chip. 
So now the second one runs right but is over fueling the engine in the mid rpm range. My goel will be to get him on the phone and have that corrected as he now has a dyno with a wide band to look at.
As for boost levals I have a feeling I just had a couple leaks that under 5 or more PSI were leaking. I have sense fixed some of those and hove now seen as high as 7.5psi


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have sense fixed some of those and hove now seen as high as 7.5psi
[HR][/HR]​You should be seeing 10+ psi at redline...and that's for sure. Both VausVR6 and myself were. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## KrUsTyX (Sep 2, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

ok guys, ive just received my vortech charger i just want to show you my little toy!


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I think I was seeing 7.5 at around 5500 rpm or so.. Not sure as it has the cut out set at a low 5700 rpm. This car is a daily driver and I really do not want to over rev it.. 
I think I will ask for the redline to be set at about 6400 rpm and I will shift at or around 6000 or 6200 rpm..
May also get a better boost guage as I am not sure how good the $30 one I have is...LOL..

I also want to replace the belt with a version that is .5 shorter as the pulley is way to close to the fuel rain and rubes if I tighten it any more. 
That is one thing about the new VF kit that people have not talked much about. As it retains the stock belt tensiner if I am correct..







VERY cool..


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Well your belt isnt slipping then. 7.5 psi at 5500 is right on par. I cant believe that you want the redline to be in the low 6ks!!! You are losing like 30whp by not revving it up high






















As a side note, since you helped me on this before. If you remember my car was leaking oil from the filter housing area and you suggested change the o ring on the oil cooler and also change the gasket. Well, had these changed out during an oil change and the b---- is leaking now more than ever







. What should I try next, new oil pressure switches or new oil pressure sender. Gettin' a lil' frustrated over herre


----------



## SCVR6 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

low 6000 RPM redline is worthless even if it's a everday driver.







Just don't rev it that high when your driving. This isn't a turbo so your going to suffer in the performance dept. These blowers make all the power way up top.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (SCVR6)*

Lets keep this at the top of the page. Everybody tell Scooter what a little girl he is being






















Just kidding with you man, get it all figured out and let us know


----------



## ERTW (Jan 17, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Scooter98144,
I hate to say it, but you really should rev it up every once in a while. Normally I drive below 6k, but with an open road and a properly tuned chip I would rev it like it is meant to be. Very fun indeed. I agree with the others.


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (ERTW)*

Ok Ok..







So at what RPM should I have the limit set at. Here in Seattle with the nations crappiest traffic and no were to really stomp on it.. I hardly get to show her off like that any way.
Also frankly I am dirt poor and if it crapped out on me from bouncing the revs to 7 grand are you guys going to pitch in and fix it for me..LOL
As for your oil leaks. Not a clue why it is leaking. Maybe time to have a shop look at it as it should not leak.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Hey yeah, that was just a desperate call for help cause I was at the end of my rope. I bought the hi/low oil pressure switches and Im gonna swap them out tomorrow. 
I dont see how your car will crap out revving to 7k, and just because the rev limiter is there doesnt mean you have to rev to it...even though its tempting. I dont see what could go wrong revving that high a few times a day, unless your engine has a million miles and should be in a museum LOL


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Well, found the oil leak and thats all squared away








I also installed my #30 injectors and the ATP obd2 vortech chip....


----------



## Gavster (Jan 8, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

How does your sc setup run with the chip and the injectors? ALso, can you tell me what all you have sc wise? Like what kit, pulley size, FMU, etc. Thanks man!


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Gavster)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Like what kit, pulley size, FMU, etc. Thanks man![HR][/HR]​Eurotech kit w/V2sq, "8.5" psi pulley (makes more like 10.5ish at redline), no FMU, #30=about 310cc injectors, and atp obd2 vortech 310cc injector chip. Im tired, going to sleep...







*yawn*


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Dam leebro61 U really want to keep the OBD2 guys in suspense huh


----------



## Gavster (Jan 8, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

lol, tired?!?!? you cant be tired!!!!!! j/k. well that sounds very cool, do you have any problems with belt slippage? Have you had an fmu/fpr at all or just a chip? let us know how it runs! Oh yeah, I dont wanna sound like a goon, but what is bucking???


[Modified by Gavster, 3:16 PM 1-29-2003]


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Dam leebro61 U really want to keep the OBD2 guys in suspense huh







[HR][/HR]​Yeah, Ill let you guys know on Thursday








Mayyyyybeeee


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Gavster)*

quote:[HR][/HR]lol, tired?!?!? you cant be tired!!!!!! j/k. well that sounds very cool, do you have any problems with belt slippage? [HR][/HR]​Belt slippage isnt a huge problem. The belt will slip a bit for the first thousand miles or so but once it breaks in you are all set to go. They are also very easy to tension. With a boost gauge, just gradually tighten it bit by bit until you see 10psi at redline. Also, ya dont wanna overtighten it or you might put extra stress on the pulleys. Even if you dont have a gauge, you will hear the thing loudly squeel in the upper rpms if its slipping!
quote:[HR][/HR] Have you had an fmu/fpr at all or just a chip? let us know how it runs! [HR][/HR]​Never had an fmu. The eurotech and AMS kits include a 4bar fpr to replace the stock 3bar fpr. Before yesterday, I was running a completely stock engine (besides motor mounts and that stuff) and just the eurotech bolt on kit. 
quote:[HR][/HR] Oh yeah, I dont wanna sound like a goon, but what is bucking???
[HR][/HR]​Bucking is kind of like a hesitation in the car. I would think it prolly feels alot like poor shifting. Like imagine you dont time your hands and feet right and when you finally release the clutch, the car jerks a bit before it resumes driving normally.
The way Marty explained it to me is this:
Say you are driving your car in 4th gear at 5000 rpms...then all of a sudden you let off the gas and the revs slowly drop to 4000 rpms...then you push the gas in say %10 of the way...and nothing happens, the car continues to decelerate as if nothing is happening (i.e. you didnt touch the gas)
Then you push the gas in another %5 and suddenly the car "bucks" when %15 of the cars power is felt. It only happens during the transition from deceleration to part throttle.







Heres hoping the east coast 93 octane magically helps the bucking


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

cool i'm glad someone else decided to try the OBD2 chip. i will be getting mine in a day or two







i think that with the charger being new to me i might not be as upset about the buck. i think that i will be soooo happy with all the extra power, that i could delt with it















i just hope i get my car back befor the weekend its supposed to hit 40















i wonder if 100 octane might help out even more??
steve


[Modified by twodubs, 3:51 PM 1-29-2003]


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i wonder if 100 octane might help out even more??[HR][/HR]​I don't think it's an octane thing. I think it's more like a fuel delivery at the right time kind of thing.


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Im running 24# Ford Motorsport Injectors with a 3bar regulator.. can i still benefit from this new OBDII ATP SC chip without upgrading my injectors to 30#


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Im running 24# Ford Motorsport Injectors with a 3bar regulator.. can i still benefit from this new OBDII ATP SC chip without upgrading my injectors to 30#[HR][/HR]​I dunno man. Stock injectors are what #20'ers?
So #20 @ 4 bar (eurotech or AMs setups)
or
#24 @ 3 bar 
I may be wrong by this but arent you pushing less fuel than a stock SC kit? Less fuel = even leaner than before. Have you been dynoed


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

I am starting to feel more and more that folks get on here and ask .. Can I run this with that.. What they need to do first is do a dyno with a wide band. Untill you do that you are some what stabbing at the dark when it comes to fueling. 
But for good start my first guess is to run 30# at 3bar.. Or maybe 24 at 4bar..Then just take it easy onthe HIGH rpm runs.. On my car the stock fpr was a 4bar so when I added the bigger injectors you could tell it was to rich so dropping to a 3bar really helped..
But again it was that wide band that told me were I needed to go. 
Well speaking of this I need to log off and call ATP again..


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I am starting to feel more and more that folks get on here and ask .. Can I run this with that.. What they need to do first is do a dyno with a wide band. Untill you do that you are some what stabbing at the dark when it comes to fueling. 
But for good start my first guess is to run 30# at 3bar.. Or maybe 24 at 4bar..Then just take it easy onthe HIGH rpm runs.. On my car the stock fpr was a 4bar so when I added the bigger injectors you could tell it was to rich so dropping to a 3bar really helped..
But again it was that wide band that told me were I needed to go. 
Well speaking of this I need to log off and call ATP again..[HR][/HR]​I am looking to get my car on a dyno asap, its just that there arent too many within regular driving distance of me. The closest one I can think of is at least 2hrs away. When I can figure out who is closest, my car will be on a dyno with wideband.
Quick question for everybody...If the cars were tuned on a dyno for #30 injectors at 4bar, why are the cars that actually use this setup running so rich? Maybe obd2 will be different (hopefully), but Scooter for you to see a/f's of below 10







, thats not right. Grrr...need dyno now


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Also, did 97 vr6's come stock with a 4bar fpr? Cause i was looking through my box of stock parts and I didnt see another fpr







Maybe I should just try to pick up an adjustable fpr so I can change it from 3-4-5 bar as needed


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

OBDII came with a 3bar stock.


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

I am also running 30# with a 3bar and the Eurotech OBDI chip. I was running a 4bar but it ran way to rich around 4500rpm and power cut back over 25whp on the dyno. I do not have a air/fuel graph as they did not have it that day.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I am also running 30# with a 3bar and the Eurotech OBDI chip. I was running a 4bar but it ran way to rich around 4500rpm and power cut back over 25whp on the dyno. I do not have a air/fuel graph as they did not have it that day.[HR][/HR]​Thanks for the info BigDaddy! Also, why have you not purchased an ATP obd1 chip? If I were obd1 I would be all over that. Especially since you already have the #30 injectors in


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

Like I had said before.. I think I was just unlucky and got a bad chip the first time.. The flaw showed up as going full lean. So ATP dialed in more fuel and sent a second chip.. Well sense that one worked right it had the affect of running to rich. I also kind of recall talking about the rev limit and we were worried about the lean ness so we set it lower.. So now I have a chip that works ok other than the richness and cutting out at 5700..
So as Soon as I get a 3rd withthe rev limit around 7 grand I will drive it a while then do one more dyno and wide band.
At least withthese OBD1 chips it seems like it is now possible to add stuff or make changes then just have the chip tweaked and a new one sent out..


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks for the info BigDaddy! Also, why have you not purchased an ATP obd1 chip? If I were obd1 I would be all over that. Especially since you already have the #30 injectors in







[HR][/HR]​Cash flow my man...cash flow.







Plus I am running numbers in the same area that people are with the ATP chip.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR] 
Cash flow my man...cash flow.







Plus I am running numbers in the same area that people are with the ATP chip. [HR][/HR]​Yeah I hear ya








Also, if you dont mind, what were you puttin down as far as power goes?


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

at least you guys have your cars. i'm still waiting.....................








but this weekend i will be like



































.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Is dubwerks gonna dyno your car for you... or do they not have a dyno. I would really like to see another #30/ATP chip dyno...preferably obd2 (you) but obd1 would work too.


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

nope, no dyno. but i am goin to have it done within a week or two. i really want to know whats, what. just sucks that im getting this done in the middle of winter.























steve


[Modified by twodubs, 6:30 PM 1-30-2003]


----------



## BigDaddyCW (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Also, if you dont mind, what were you puttin down as far as power goes?[HR][/HR]​When I was running the 4bar and the 25whp drop at 4500 or so, I was seeing 240whp. I am now running the 3bar but have yet to have it dynoed. I do know it does not run as rich with this setup as you could feel the loss before and now it pulls hard the entire way to my 6250rpm







redline.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (BigDaddyCW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Also, if you dont mind, what were you puttin down as far as power goes?
When I was running the 4bar and the 25whp drop at 4500 or so, I was seeing 240whp. I am now running the 3bar but have yet to have it dynoed. I do know it does not run as rich with this setup as you could feel the loss before and now it pulls hard the entire way to my 6250rpm







redline.[HR][/HR]​Dammnnn...240whp with a 25whp loss and a 6200rpm redline isnt bad at all. I would say getting the ATP chip is worth it just to be able to rev past 6.2k. Thats where all the fun is








[Peer Pressure]C'mon man...everybodys doing it[/Peer Pressure]


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

how much is the OBDII chip from ATP?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

$300 I think....


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

I figured you guys might get a kick out of this. I posted up some videos of my car over in the Mk2 forum. For those that don't know...I've got the ATP OBD-1 chip installed. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=690111


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*








...sounds Hot, but thats all I get...no picture


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Ok A new chip is on the way. I sent George the dyno sheet and we made a couple changes as far as my car goes. I would like to say that ATP has done VERY well by me at working on making it run as well as it can.
Here is what we changed 
REV LIMITER TO 7150
LESS FUEL AT 3000-4500 PER DYNO
3 DEGREES LESS TIMING AT 4500 + TO PREVENT KNOCK 
Any thoughts. Better to be a little safe on the knocking even if you lose a little power.. ??? Or does will the ECu just adcance the timming till knock is present..? Still stuff I do not understand


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

quote:[HR][/HR]3 DEGREES LESS TIMING AT 4500 + TO PREVENT KNOCK [HR][/HR]​We were getting an occasional knock in tha range as well. But, what I've determined since then...is that it appears to depend on any one of about three things...or possibly even a combination of the three. And they are as follows:
1. engine temp (whether or not the engine is hot and has been running for a while)
2. the quality of the gas
3. climate conditions
Even till this day I'll still get a single knock in that rpm range when I floor it...but some days it's there and some days it's not.







Of course, after the ECU detects the ping/knock...it retards the timing a bit. 
Somewhere in several of the 19+ dyno runs we made at ATP (George has them on file)...you can see where the knock was occuring and see exactly how the ECU pulled back the timing...because there's a dip in the hp and torque curves.
Edit: On my last 3 and best 3 dyno runs...the knock was NOT present.


[Modified by Dextrose, 7:07 PM 2-5-2003]


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

maybe I should change my car to OBD1...








at least you guys are on the ball...good luck!


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]maybe I should change my car to OBD1...








at least you guys are on the ball...good luck![HR][/HR]​Hey my car is running nicely on the obd2 chip and #30 injectors. The idle seems a tad low, and the driveability isn't awesome, but its not horrible. WOT is very nice too!


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

So it sounds like having a couple degrees of timming taken out up high is not such a bad thing..I may lose a couple hp but on the other hand the power band should be a little smother if the ECU does not have to retard the timing for me...
Realy looking forward to what should be the last chip. Well at least untill I add a 12psi pulley, Intercooler set up..







But that will be after some tranny work and a few other over do repairs.


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

well.. i finally got my ATP chip in and here is what i noticed..
the car would barely start and ran like absolute poop when i ran it with 24# injectors and a 3.0bar regulator. I then proceeded to swap my 3.0bar for a 4.0bar regulator and the car ran better, but was horribly notchy and didnt make consistant power. I guess i really do need a set of 310cc (30#) injectors to make this chip work really good like everyone here is raving about. 
also my AMS chip has a nice idle (~900 rpm) this ATP chip has an awfully low idle ~700 rpm does anyone else have a low idle?








anyways.. i will be ordering a set of 310cc injectors in a couple weeks and i will give the chip another shot.. otherwise off to ebay it goes


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

The ATP chip was designed to control 30# injectors at 4 bar. Running the chip with 24# injectors would be like running your stock chip and swapping out your stock 19# injectors for 15# injectors. I'm surprised it ran at all.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

quote:[HR][/HR] this ATP chip has an awfully low idle ~700 rpm does anyone else have a low idle?







[HR][/HR]​Yes! My car idles like 620-640 rpms when it settle. The blower seems much happier idleing at about 800rpms (Eurotech chip), and sounds alot better. Im still liking the chip alot, but the things I have noticed are:
-The buck occurs most in the first few gears
-The buck seems to occur most when its cold (<20) and the car is cold
-The idle is low
-CEL is still on, Will have it cleared and codes read again soon.
-Power is great








Also, when they say use #30 injectors at 4 bar, do it. If not for powers sake, for your engines sake!


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

quote:[HR][/HR]also my AMS chip has a nice idle (~900 rpm) this ATP chip has an awfully low idle ~700 rpm does anyone else have a low idle?







[HR][/HR]​Mine idles right around 900-1000 I believe. Still no problems here...and it's been what? 6 to 7 months. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

try keeping on the throttle a bit when you shift.. that helps fix the bucking


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

quote:[HR][/HR]try keeping on the throttle a bit when you shift.. that helps fix the bucking[HR][/HR]​Actually mine doesnt seem to buck much if at all when shifting. Unless is shift really S L O W L Y from 1-2. Other than that, the bucking isnt bad at all! It doesnt even do it all the time. Hey, my mom and gf drove the car and didnt complain. I dont even think they noticed


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

well i got the car back today and i love it







i just have to wait a little bit for the belt to do its thing and then i will be even more happy. next on the list is the trans i got waiting to go in







0 miles w/ brand new peloquin and a brand new clutch and i should be golden. 
steve





















<-- that was me at about 2 this afternoon http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Sounds fun! Let the belt break in. Youll have to tension it a few times, but it takes 2 minutes to do and its better than overtightening it. Give it a few hundred miles and youre good to go


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

yep, cuz she's a screamer. i took it to chicago tonight and when i would pass people it would scare them. kinda funny though







its just soooo hard to stay out of it cuz it sounds soo good untill you get in the upper rpm's and then i screams so i have been takin it easy untill i can tighten it up tomorrow http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
now i can wait to get it on a dyno. did you even get yours done??









steve


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Kinda, i am in the process of doing a vag com dyno. I logged o2 sensor voltage and got .87 past 5k rpms. This equates to about 12.5ish:1 a/f. Definitely in the safety zone.
As for the dyno, you have to redline 3rd gear while logging, speed, rpm and time. Then you pop in the clutch and coast back down to ~30mph. Then you put the data into a spreadsheet and it gives you a dyno. This of course takes into account vehicle weight and some other things. Anyways, since I had to jam the brakes, my numbers were a bit skewed. The car read crazy resistance so it gave me like 1200hp readout after 5k rpms, when i hit the brakes coming back down. Anyways, my graph up to 4.9k is perfect.
Compared to Vaus' 270whp dyno, I make 221whp at 4.9k and he made 219ish at the same point. I made 237 ft/lbs at 4.9k and he made a little over 230. So my numbers are pretty much spot on with his. Also take into account this is on a highway with great air flow, 93 octane and freezing cold







. Im weighing the car on scale with me in it sometime next week (family owns a sand and gravel hauling businees







) so the next time I do it , everything will be perfectly accurate.
I just have to do some late night testing with no traffic.
BTW-Is your CEL on?


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

nope, no CEL. the car is running great. i can't hardley tell its even in there untill you get on it then i'm like whoa







i am gunna get some kdc or kcd motor mount and the trans done before i put it on a dyno. but all this is gunna happen next weeks smoetime i'm just not sure what days and i was getting antsy for my car


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Dammit, why do i still have the friggin CEL. Some B.S. EVAP Emissions code


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

gotta love vw's and i bet its runnning fine. my 96 gl always had the CEL on i hated it but it never ran any different.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Yeah it doesnt effect anything, but it annoys me a tiny bit. Everybody I talked to said it mean nothing. Its like one of those "Your gas cap is unscrewed" codes. More of a reminder to me, "Hey buddy, your car has some engine mods" ...yeah tell me about it


----------



## GTI-VR6-NOTW (Aug 27, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Just curious here as I have no clue............ has anyone tried the following combination:
12psi pulley
36# injectors (380cc)
3 bar or RRFPR


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (GTI-VR6-NOTW)*

nope, i just got my car back. i'm gunna chill on the VR6 for awhile. i've got to get to work on my 16vT project. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









steve


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

just thought i would show everyone the new addition























can't wait for summer









steve


----------



## Gavster (Jan 8, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

What kit is that?? i looks nice, i hope you enjoy it!


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Gavster)*

its the EUROTECH kit. plus i have the ATP stg 2 chip & 310cc injectors. i've put about 400 miles on it and i still get all smiley when i get to some open road
















steve


----------



## Cutter (Feb 18, 2003)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Sounds like delivering enough fuel under boost is a real problem. My mechanic has come up with a very interesting answer. A second set of injectors was installed into the intake manifold. These are fed by an auxillary fuel tank filled with methanol (careful very flammable). The methanol kicks in when the car starts to lean out. Therefore, the system isn't working when driving mildly. Went for a test drive today and went right up to redline without any detonation. Also took it to emissions. It confused them but I passed.
Here's my question. What size is a 12lb pully? Is the best source directly from Vortec? What about belts? I know I should know the answer to these questions but I haven't really messed with this car for about a year.
Thanks in advance


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Cutter)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Sounds like delivering enough fuel under boost is a real problem. My mechanic has come up with a very interesting answer. A second set of injectors was installed into the intake manifold. These are fed by an auxillary fuel tank filled with methanol (careful very flammable). The methanol kicks in when the car starts to lean out. Therefore, the system isn't working when driving mildly. Went for a test drive today and went right up to redline without any detonation. [HR][/HR]​This problem has been solved...and fortunately, the solution was WAY more simple than what you just described. I don't blame you if you didn't take the time to read through 18 pages worth of posts.
But, the bottom line is that there ISN'T a problem delivering fuel up to redline with a larger set of injectors and a matching chip. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Even buy adding more fuel you still need a way to reduce timingbuy at least 2 degrees for every pound of boost you run. That is why chip is also required not only to add fuel but to also back out timing. But it is a great suggestion http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Cutter (Feb 18, 2003)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

Thanks for the tips. I'll let you know how it all works with a small pully. The main goal of the system is to provide good hp without burning up the motor. The alcohol also greatly cools the intake air (more power).


----------



## vw4sport (Sep 25, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Cutter)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks for the tips. I'll let you know how it all works with a small pully. The main goal of the system is to provide good hp without burning up the motor. The alcohol also greatly cools the intake air (more power).[HR][/HR]​
cutter i IM'd and emailed you we should meet up and talk.there is about 5 vr vortechs in az.did Motz do your setup.I remeber they had a 11sec meth inj 16v rabbit.


[Modified by vw4sport, 2:13 AM 2-19-2003]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vw4sport)*

Hey guys.... just decided to check in with the thread. hehe.... 18 pages now







what the hell did I start? 
I'm glad to see more people are finally running the ATP chip. See, I told you the buck wasn't as bad as you prolly imagined. Good luck with your setups. Maybe it'll provide an alternative to the VF kits for people on a tighter budget. I wanna see that 12psi chip








Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I wanna see that 12psi chip








Thanks
-- Ed[HR][/HR]​ditto


----------



## ERTW (Jan 17, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Hey Vaus,
How do like your WRX? How does the ATP chip drive around in closed loop when not on the throttle?


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (ERTW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Hey Vaus,
How do like your WRX? How does the ATP chip drive around in closed loop when not on the throttle?[HR][/HR]​The WRX is fun. Does a lot better in the snow than the GTI







The power isn't anywhere near as smooth as the VR but that will be fixed soon. 
The ATP chip felt fine all the time except for that little buck when going from decel to part throttle.
-- Ed


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Ok.. i got my Ford Motorsport 310cc injectors today, and im ready to give this ATP chip another shot.







Should i run a 3.0bar or a 4.0bar fpr?


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

i think my kit came with the 4bar. have fun cuz i know i do http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
steve


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

run the 4 bar


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Definitely the 4 bar. Though it has been stated countless times in the thread, the setup is for 
-310cc injectors
[email protected] bar fuel pressure








I finally fixed my leaky injector today (dont ask) and Im extremely happy again. I will finish my Vag Com dyno sometime early next week. I had to brake quickly so my readings above 4.8k rpms were messed up, but at 4.8k I was making 221whp and 237ft/lbs. I also logged o2 sensor voltage and got .87 volts above 5k rpms. Basically this translates into a mid 12's to 1 a/f ratio. Rock on!


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

cool http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i will be going to a dyno day on the 16th so i will know alot more then. i will definitly post the results. but as for the car, its still running great. i am getting the tranny put it tomorrow so i should be able to get the power down alot better now







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

I installed the injectors and the chip last night.. here is what i noticed
1. car idles too low (esp for having a 6lb flywheel)
2. .5~1 sec delay between decel and part-tp engine modes (all gears)
3. power dies at 5500 and car wont rev past 6100 (just sputters)
I did break a stupid check valve by the throttle body while i was doing the install.. as a result i had to plug both lines that ran into it so that could be one cause. I also bought the chip from someone on vortex and it could be an old version.. so im going to see if ATP will send me a new chip with a higher idle speed and i will ship them back this one.
Also do any of your ATP chips not have decryption boards for them?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

My chip idles at 680 as you saw in the other post. Mine just popped right in without an encryption board. As for the buck, mine rarely even bucks. Today it didnt at ALL through just daily driving. It seems that is only bucks when I nail it in a gear and then slowly shift. It also does it sometimes on the highway. Like I got it in fifth, I let off and coast. The a/f gauge goes to the first bar of lean, then i hit the gas a bit and nothing happens. I touch it some more and the car drives normally. All in all the buck aint bad at all!
Are you obd1 or 2? Cause oddly enough, it seems like the obd2 guys are having more luck with their chips than obd1, when it seemed the opposite was going to happen. Sweet revenge it is















P.S. Dunno about George replacing your chip considering you didnt buy it through him


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

The lines you are talking about going into the right side of the TB are coolant lines. I dunno how they would affect your performance though







Those are the lines you broke something on no?


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Well I have had my 3rd OBD1 chip in for a while and as far as my but dyno goes it seems just fine. I still need a dyno run on it to check but all six plugs are a nice light brown and the car is a blast to drive. Have seen boost at just a tad over 9psi at about 7000rpm. 
Now I just need a LOW PSI drop intercooler and a 12 PSI pulley and it should be able to keep up with most muscle cars out on the street.
Raced a 5.0 Mustang and kept up with him all the way.
Went over a train track a little hard though and the force broke a seal on the radiator so I need a new one of those. 
But at least they only cost 190 and are easy to replace.
Good luck


----------



## rycou34 (Apr 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

I tried the OBD1 ATP setup and was NOT happy at all.
I fouled 3 sets of plugs within 100 miles! I tried a used and a new set of injectors, to no avail. Car ran as if it were on 3 cylinders, could not drive over 2000 rpm. I had smoke POURING out the exhaust, ev en at idle.
I will be getting in touch with George on getting a new chip, as I believe that this is the problem.
Anyone else have similar problems with the OBD1 chip?


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

i guess this "buck" is the delay im talking about. as for the hose, its a vaccum hose that comes off the left side of the throttle body.. the coolant hoses are on the right side, thoes i have re-routed so hot coolant dosnt go through my TB... 
I know not having the check valve is giving me some sort of emissions check code, and that normally will affect how the car runs. 
I talked to ATP and they said it didnt matter if the chip was used or not, they would upgrade it for $30


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

Outstanding on the upgrade charge! Oh, you are speaking of that tiny little hose on the lower left side. Gotcha, I was thinking right hand side. Hmmm, are you obd1 though?


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Hmmm, are you obd1 though?







[HR][/HR]​Nope 98' OBDII .. there is all sorts of extra emissions stuff on 98's and i think this checkvalve has something to do with it.. 
BTW.. how many of you are running a CAI or some sort of intercooling (front mount, water injection) on your kits?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

oh, did you have a CEL with the chip? I had some BS EVAP code, but it didnt mean anything. It also didnt affect the way the car ran at all. I would clear it and it would come back quickly, but that was it. Everybody I talked to said just to disregard it








Wow Im glad my car runs as good as it does. I was a little skeptical of running this setup since at the time, I was the only one using the chip to my knowledge (since Marty and Vaus had sold their chargers/chips). Since then, twodubs has ran this in his 99 with success, and blownmk2vr6 had the chip, but not yet installed


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

wow! havent checked up on this thread in a while...getting quite long. i still have my obd2 chip but my car is not running and hasnt been for at least a month







. should be running soon and will swap the chip and injectors then. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif cant wait.
How many people are running the obd2 chip now?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

By my count, me and twodubs. You would be the 3rd. Is ATP even selling it to the public yet?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (rycou34)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I tried the OBD1 ATP setup and was NOT happy at all.
I fouled 3 sets of plugs within 100 miles! I tried a used and a new set of injectors, to no avail. Car ran as if it were on 3 cylinders, could not drive over 2000 rpm. I had smoke POURING out the exhaust, ev en at idle.
I will be getting in touch with George on getting a new chip, as I believe that this is the problem.
Anyone else have similar problems with the OBD1 chip?[HR][/HR]​Sounds to me like your car has "other" problems. Clearly, this cannot all be because of an OBD-1 chip that at this point, several other people have running in their car with little to no problems at all. Obviously, the chip could simply be bad...but if it's a good chip, then you have something else wrong.
I was the OBD-1 guinea pig and I couldn't be happier. I've been running this chip since July!!








As for the OBD-2 guy that said he couldn't rev above 5500 rpm ??? what's up with that? I can rev to like 7200 all day if I want.


----------



## MidNiteVR6 (Apr 29, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

I've been following this thread for so long. I'm so excited to get my kit on. It sucks to hear about people's problems though. But alas i have my own setbacks, like timming chains and such. But soon enough I will be in the OBD1 chip croud and probably the first with a DSR 256 chip as well. Luckily i live 15 mins from ATP.


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (MidNiteVR6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I've been following this thread for so long. I'm so excited to get my kit on. [HR][/HR]​My car wont sell, so I am gonna charge it.




























This thread still being alive has fueled my desire to actually go and buy one. Mad props to the creators. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
quote:[HR][/HR]Luckily i live 15 mins from ATP.







[HR][/HR]​O sure, friggin rub it in.


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

To Vaus, Dextrose, and Marty http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Espically our countrys protector that made the drive from Fla and got off of his warship to perfect a chip. And then not be able to run the sonnAmahbitch till he went shore side. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif (thats you Dex







)
And of course George. I *will* be getting one of these in a few weeks to a pair of months. I really cant wait. You da man, keep up the good work. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
*edit* forgot people and more. I appreciate all the work that *ALL* of you put in. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by gin8122, 1:36 AM 2-28-2003]


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

Hey thanks gin8122. LOL I was living in Cali at the time we had the OBD-1 chip made...so it wasn't too much of a hike up there. Regardless...I appreciate the props. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Im just glad to see it is still alive(this thread) At page 13 or 14, the progress slowed on the OBD2 chip. I got a bit discouraged and changed my mind on the charger. But now I am back to thinking that a Vortec is just what I need.


----------



## Ry_GuyGTI (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

i'll be another obd2 runner soon enough


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

whats plugs is everyone running... im running bosch 16v plugs F6-DTC i think


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

good man. yesterday was the only time i really had an issue with the buck. i was in chicago traffic and the stop an go was killing me, it might have had something to do with my lack of motor mounts







but all that will be different when i get the car tonight.








oh i can't wait. finally able to get the power down http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif








steve


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Ry_GuyGTI)*

just out of curiosity, were are you guys getting the obd2 chips from?


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

you can get them right from atp i think.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

atp http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

4 mins left in the auction for the blower. About to bid high. Tell me I am not making a big mistake.............. Please


----------



## KrUsTyX (Sep 2, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]its the EUROTECH kit. plus i have the ATP stg 2 chip & 310cc injectors. i've put about 400 miles on it and i still get all smiley when i get to some open road
















steve[HR][/HR]​have you tried to run this setup with the original chip from EUROTECH? thanks


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (KrUsTyX)*

nope, never did run it with the chip that came in the kit. with all the lean issues i didn't even think about using that pos. plus the buck isn't that bad. i mean i was willing to try the chip instead of running lean









steve


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Didnt make the reserve.








No kit for me......... yet


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

you should just make your own, now that you can buy the chip from ATP.. there are plans on the web to make all the brackets.


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

thats my plan.
Got any links to those sites with bracket plans? I could make that before the milling machine heads to Maine.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

You could do that, or you could get em from JRC motorsports or something like that (rhussjr on vortex). I believe the whole setup is listed on venom's site, back when Blitzkrieg was trying to piece a kit together?



[Modified by leebro61, 5:58 PM 3-3-2003]


----------



## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Ok.. after 2 trips to the dealer i found out they phased out the check valve so i just bought a replacement hose without one. Car runs alot smoother, the "bucking" greatly reduced and barely noticeable and most important i can now wind the biatch out to 7 grand







and it pulls strong. Im gonna do some dataloging with my friends VWTool and make some O2 sensor graphs.. has anyone done this already for me to compare mine to? 
My next step is the water injection which is almost done!


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

I did my own data logging and got .87 volts above 5k rpms. The conversion chart is here:


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (PhOO)*

nice huh!







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Heres a bump, and I almost forgot. My CEL went off a couple weeks back for no apparent reason. I guess the BS evap emissions code cleared itself. CEL's been off since, and prior to this, it had been on straight since july!
Hows everybody else holding up?


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

well the velocity clutch i had installed is slipping when i hit aroung 9 lbs







and the bad thing is, i'm leaving for vegas in a couple of weeks








but other than that she's running great







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

steve
oh did you ever get yours on a dyno??


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

The dyno i was going to today got postponed. So doing a vag com dyno, I got nailed doing 95mph







http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

we will be custom tuning a 310cc vortech system tomorrow with wideband and our l33t tuning software. I plan to modify the idle to 1000 using code (no vag b/s) and dial in a nice timing curve and fuel curve with our wideband.
310cc injectors, 5bar fpr, vortech mk3 98. It should rock hard. Time to end the b/s tuning and get it done right. Then onto bigger pullies









I'll keep ya guys updated.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Then onto *bigger* pullies







[HR][/HR]​
Are you sure youre up to the job of making our cars faster?


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Are you sure youre up to the job of making our cars faster?








[HR][/HR]​cuz i am always ready to make my car faster


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

yeh cause our 4 cylinders are kicking ass on those vr6 s/c's, thats embarassing








(yes i can tune all me 5.9)


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

You do realize that my point was, bigger pullies would slow our cars downw? Im sure it was just a typo, but I thought it was kinda funny


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]You do realize that my point was, bigger pullies would slow our cars downw? Im sure it was just a typo, but I thought it was kinda funny








[HR][/HR]​My thought exactly. I was just about to quote that, and saw your post. Time for _small_ pullies.


----------



## Goobery69 (Nov 22, 1999)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Goobery69)*

i was referring to bigger boost pullies







nyah
2.70 then 1/2 inch smaller to keep the belts easy to buy..

2.70 should be still a little weak unless you have cams.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)would people*

I love my Vortech and all but if im putting more than 12lbs of boost in my car, which means after that internal work HAS to be done, you might as well kick the charger to the curb and get a Turbo because after 12lbs of boost your basically looking for big power IMHO







, Anything less than that keep you charger and reliablity and enjoy







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)would people (benzivr6)*

the v1 sq is capable of 600whp, seen it done on a 5.0, so im not sure why you think its not capable of flow..


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

Yep the bad boy V1-S can churn out 20PSI and is more than enough for most V^ cars
Here is a link to a site with good compressor maps and all the other info for each version
http://www.capa.com.au/vortech_v1s.htm


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

My idea is simple. Super small pulley with adjustable pop off valve.
You set max boost to XX, and it vents.
That way you can get 3,4,5,6,whatever psi at 3000rpm and push 12,13,15,20 at XX psi with the pulley choice and pop off valve
should be easy to find pop off valves. Hell those old dsm bov's didnt hold much boost stock.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

quote:[HR][/HR]My idea is simple. Super small pulley with adjustable pop off valve.[HR][/HR]​This is a common idea, but I've never seen it implemented with any success on centrifugal blowers. People just talk about it and never do it. I'll be interested to see how well it works.


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

your right talk is cheap. You realize what i'm describing is also known in the turbo world as a "WASTEGATE" aka Deltagate. adjustable..
So to say its uncommon would be wrong, but i think its a unique application. Set a deltagate to 12-15psi and roll baby! 









or pop off valve maybe cheaper , but i doubt it!

*HKS 1404-RA005, Adjustable pop-off valve
12-18 pounds. HKS 08108-09159, Flange. HKS 17678-001100, Gasket* 
_HKS Adjustable Pop-Off Valves provide secondary overboost protection in the event of wastegate malfunction or failure. These valves simply pop open at a preset amount of boost pressure allowing excess boost to blow off to the atmosphere_ 









_Protect your motor from too much boost with the GReddy Pop Off Valve. A great safeguard against wastegate failure or boost creep, the pop off valve releases any boost above your desired limit and helps protects your motor from a costly rebuild. Simply mount this valve on the intake tract between the turbo and engine and adjust the spring to the desired release pressure, no vacuum lines required. Note that this is different than a Blow Off Valve in that the Pop Off Valve releases excess pressure under open throttle conditions while a blow off valve only activates under vacuum to protect the turbocharger. These are two separate pieces that do two separate jobs_


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

wastegates would work better since they can be set for boost via spring tension only. Might make a PSSH sound at high rpm's.
I'm more for the "tune the ecu to handle the business) but you know some people are just haters. With enough retard you could run 15psi on a stock motor.. Let's watch and see what unfolds. I'll back some of the development costs to get the chargers pumping boost faster and limiting peak boost.
It would complement the maf relocation kit, big injector/4bar/5bar kit and of course a kick ass chip.

p.s. All a pop off valve is a top diaphrahm(sp) with adjustable spring, you could simply use a bolt to adjust the tension (aka adjustable FPR), so when it reaches XX PSI, the top pops up some and whoosh.

probably home grow it for $10 in parts and some welding.
my saying however is still "Every boost is sacred..." (monty python)



[Modified by mrkrad, 8:13 AM 4-5-2003]


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Here is a link to a site with good compressor maps and all the other info for each version
http://www.capa.com.au/vortech_v1s.htm[HR][/HR]​That is a great site, thanks much. I just wish they had Pro charger maps up there too.


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I'm more for the "tune the ecu to handle the business) [HR][/HR]​ http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif totally agree


----------



## Vento FI (Apr 19, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

The idea of a significally smaller pulley that can get you around 15-18 psi is very good with the wastegate, but you might have another problem and is keeping the belt from sliping at that rpms


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Vento FI)*

Well as for the belt slipping I have seen one company that makes a pulley that has groves cut into it to prevent slipping. They claim it works well. The other much more spendy option is to get a larger main pulley then down size all other but the charger pulley..







You could under drive all the other as well. But that would cost a pretty penny.
Or I kind of like water injection. Seems to work well and does not require to much to get it up and running. 
I just got down with another dyno run on my Vortech kit and all 3 pulls we hit 230hp and 225 torq. I think I was getting a little belt slip the last 1000 rpm and was still a tad to rich in a narrow band down low. I will post the results as soon as I can scan them.


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

310cc and 3bar = perfect for 12psi of boost. I think 24# @ 3bar would be more appropriate for 6psi, and cheaper from the ford dudes. 

The less you change the fuel pressure, the easier it is for me 5.9 to adapt. trust me.



[Modified by mrkrad, 11:32 AM 4-6-2003]


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

I thought ATP was almost maxing out the 310s at 4bar and 10psi?


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

maybe on a t3/t4 but we're talking supercharger. 
310cc + 4 bar = 9:1 air fuel ratio at 7200 and the charger makes a bit of boost then. There is no cam in the car, i demand the hottest s/c cam possible for my 2.70 chip. No ***** ass stock cams.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

I was talking about their SC chip, but i dunno. Im glad, i wasnt looking to buy new injectors again!


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Silverado, WTF is going on with your chip appointments and benzi's 12psi pulley. Updates please!!!!!


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

I sure hope if some guy goes to the trouble of making more chips that they do not insit on some certain cam as well. A stock cam works just fine. Just need a little more boost a little earlier in the rpm band to give it some more low end grunt. Or to flatten out the curve. After all the runs I have done it in no way seems to be maxing out the 310 injectores as I have had a problem be to rich as it is. 
Still not sure why I am so rich. As for any one else comming out with a good chip I will belive it when I see it.


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

quote:[HR][/HR]As for any one else comming out with a good chip I will belive it when I see it. [HR][/HR]​Right here.


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Man, from 4600 on that AF is so nice and flat. 12.1, cant go wrong boosted with that number. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

Yeah besides the 3.5-4k dip, you are rock solid. Have you dynoed since then? I was also curious why you arent making more power? The obd2 guys (vaus and twodubs) both dynoed 269 and 263whp respectively. I have a dyno day the 19th so I will let you know how I fare.
I mean, you cant knock a solid lightweight 240whp car with a nice flat a/f ratio, but I was wondering if you had any insight? What car did your vr6 come out of?


----------



## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Yeah besides the 3.5-4k dip, you are rock solid. Have you dynoed since then? I was also curious why you arent making more power? The obd2 guys (vaus and twodubs) both dynoed 269 and 263whp respectively. [HR][/HR]​Please remember that Vaus dynoed ONE time and one time only at 269 whp if I recal correctly. He had at least 20-30 (maybe more) other runs that were consistent with mine...maybe slightly more power. As for twodubs...I hadn't even heard that he dynoed that much. How many runs showing that much power??
I haven't dynoed since. In fact, the car has less than 4000 miles on it since last July when the charger went on.
Edit: Keep in mind that there are a TON of variables that can affect power output. Climate conditions probably being the most notable. I'd say power output could vary as much as +/- 10 whp depending on climate conditions if not more. Also, heat soak seemed to play a big part in Vaus and mine's power output when we were at ATP together. The dyno above was like pull 19 or so of the night and the engine was pretty damn hot.


[Modified by Dextrose, 7:13 PM 4-6-2003]


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Dextrose)*

Yeah I know.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*









Here is his dyno








I hope he wont mind


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

I hear ya about the heat, god knows how much harder my car pulls in the winter. Heatsoak, especially without an IC or WI will always be a problem with the SC. Just curious is all.....


----------



## gin8122 (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Here is his dyno








I hope he wont mind[HR][/HR]​I doubt it, it's illegible.
quote:[HR][/HR] I'd say power output could vary as much as +/- 10 whp depending on climate conditions if not more[HR][/HR]​
That is a mild guess. It can vary way more than that. Your numbers are good, if they are cinsistent. Peak means shiiiiite, repeatability is all that matters.

I love all the work you guys are doing on this, it pushes me closer to throwing a head on my car. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif to all the work.


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

sorry about the pic of the printout







no scanner and i was rushed to get it up so i just took a pic







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

and it says
run 1--- 263.9 hp 225.4 tq
run 2--- 256-6 hp 222.2 tq
hope that helps. i was pretty much at 11:1 a/f the whole run, on both.








oh and he was not going any higher than the redline on the tach. i know i could have gotten a couple of more horses.
steve


[Modified by twodubs, 12:50 AM 4-7-2003]


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

Nice numbers!


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (gin8122)*

quote:[HR][/HR] 
I doubt it, it's illegible.[HR][/HR]​I can read it just fine...glasses maybe


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

nice job.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif now throw a 12LB pulley on there and see where that takes ya!!!!










[Modified by IMWALKIN, 1:18 PM 4-7-2003]


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

belive me fellas, i want to. but i have a little thing called a 16vT to finnish before the power gets rasied in the VR





















http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
steve


[Modified by twodubs, 12:05 PM 4-7-2003]


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

quote:[HR][/HR]My idea is simple. Super small pulley with adjustable pop off valve.
You set max boost to XX, and it vents.
That way you can get 3,4,5,6,whatever psi at 3000rpm and push 12,13,15,20 at XX psi with the pulley choice and pop off valve
should be easy to find pop off valves. Hell those old dsm bov's didnt hold much boost stock.[HR][/HR]​I actually had plans to implement this very idea when I was still working with the vortech setup. I was going to run a dual mode boost controller using a solenoid to switch between two preset boost levels. This way you can run race gas at the track and pump the boost up a bit. You'd have to do this with a wastegate of course.
Thanks
-- Ed


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vausVR6)*

Here are two of the 5 sheets I scanned from Saturdays dyno session.. As you can see it looks a tad rich still down low and my last run it seems like I had some heat soak. Or maybe a little belt slipp as we had a hard time getting an even 8.5-10 PSI of boost at the very end of the rpm band. Take a look and comment please.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

Still rich man, but a consistent 230whp is alot better than 205whp. If you could get as nice an a/f as dextrose or vaus', you would see that number come up a bunch too. Hell, even twodubs was running rich but his was alot more steady compared to yours. You have been collaborating with George on getting new chips eh? Hes seen your dyno sheets I mean.


----------



## vr6zach (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Well I got my 1st #'s tonight....... I see no reason for any more power than what I have. In a mk2, and where I am from, this is just fine. Oh yeah this is the set up EUROTECH sent me








(stock injectors, and eurotech chip)
















































My A/F is perfect, the car has no probs, no drivability issues....it sweet!


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

man zach i was lookin at that dyno sheet in the other forum. looks good bro. what charger are you running?? i have the V2 and i put down 264/225. with the atp chip and 310cc's. but i can see what your sayin about the power in such a small car. i just can't wait untill the 16vT gets done





















http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









steve
she is lookin good as always


----------



## vr6zach (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

It's a older V-1, and i have no need for more power now. the A/F is too good to mess with. and you better be nice to my old car, remember if you f it up I will kill you in your sleep


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

This was the 3rd chip so far. We thought we had leaned it out enough. Yes I had done a dyno session before this one and sent him the sheet. We backed off timing 3degrees up high incase we were getiing a little nock. he fixed the rpm limit and added more fuel down low but from this it looks like we need to do some more.
Take some more fuel out down low No reason it should be so off not a clue why mine is like this other than I have ACELL injectors and others have Ford injectors.?
So can some one say what would happen if I used a 3bar with this current chip.?


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (vr6zach)*

awww man. belive me, she is wellll taken care of.







you shall see in a few more months.















gettin ready to take the mk3 to vegas on tues for two weeks.






















steve


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

installed the obd2 chip and 30# injectors today. got the chip from vaus a while ago but my car was down for a couple months due to a faulty ecu







. i only took it for a quick spin, and i had 2 other people with me, but it feels real strong and the a/f guage stayed full rich all the way to 7 grand...even with 248 cams. throwing a few codes, but they have nothing to do with the chip...as soon as i take care of that i will take it to the dyno. the buck is noticeable but nothing i cant get used to. it seems to ping or something when i punch in the lower rpms..dont know what thats all about...possibly the cams







. hopefully i will get it to the dyno next week... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

My "buck" was noticeable at first, but it seemed to get lesser and lesser as the chip fully adapted. Maybe thats just me getting used to it though.








Id like to see what your a/f looks like with the cams.


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Id like to see what your a/f looks like with the cams.







[HR][/HR]​ditto to that one.







i


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

yep 248's would be cool lets see that fuel curve and torq curve.


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

maybe your motor mounts are just shot? You sure its buck?


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

quote:[HR][/HR]maybe your motor mounts are just shot? You sure its buck?
[HR][/HR]​If that was towards me, I have a full set of KCD's in the car.


----------



## blownmk2vr6 (Dec 24, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

turn 2's in mine. if you did not know, the reason that the obd2 chip was not officially finished was because of this buck i speak of. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (blownmk2vr6)*

yeah i dont think we have any more buck with 310cc and 3bar fpr now. time to put the maf relocation on, and 2.70 pulley and get the money shot.

air fuel looking pretty good, should have it dialed in perfectly in a week or so.


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

quote:[HR][/HR]yeah i dont think we have any more buck with 310cc and 3bar fpr now. time to put the maf relocation on, and 2.70 pulley and get the money shot.

air fuel looking pretty good, should have it dialed in perfectly in a week or so.[HR][/HR]​3 bar FPR? http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif Have fun with 3 bar across the injectors under vacuum and 2 bar at 1 bar of boost.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

some complained that the ATP chip was rich??? what you throw on an 11-12LB pulley on there to gobble up that fuel!!!!!


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

thats what i'm takling about. [chanting] MORE BOOST MORE BOOST [chanting]







. if i didn't just spend all my cash on the vacation i am goin on i would be all over the pulley








steve
but alas, VEGAS HERE I COME


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

Hey how many guys will be SERIOUS about upgrading to a 12lbs pulley? I got a contact with Riechard racing ( famous for there anti-slip pulleys) and they said they would make them I would just have to send my custom 12 pulley for specs. and they would make 10 for $175 or 15 for $150. they normally cost $270 and they would still need my 12 lbs pulley to copy it. so forever hold now or speak your piece guys. BTW this is also priced for the antislip specs as well http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

well count me in!!! but i won't be home for 2 weeks. but when i get back i am for sure down with this!!!!!!!!!!







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

steve
[email protected]


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Hey how many guys will be SERIOUS about upgrading to a 12lbs pulley? I got a contact with Riechard racing ( famous for there anti-slip pulleys) and they said they would make them I would just have to send my custom 12 pulley for specs. and they would make 10 for $175 or 15 for $150. they normally cost $270 and they would still need my 12 lbs pulley to copy it. so forever hold now or speak your piece guys. BTW this is also priced for the antislip specs as well http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​Damn. Get them made out of stainless for that cost!


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

Work on the price, and put it off for a few months. Even if I dont use it for a while, its something I wanna have around


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

I am sorry that the price is kinda high but it not often that you see these pulleys with this type of quality that are custom built AND are anti-slip we all know how everyone loves there belt slipage on there vortech setups. IF you guys don't feel the price is fair I will tell him forget it and there will be no money out of anybody's pockets. All I could say is I got mine playa's http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

"Anti-slip"? Are they raw aluminum? Anodized? Stainless steel?


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

I would be into one of these pulleys even if I can not run it right away. 150-175 is not so bad. I wish there web site had a little more info on it. Like the finish..? I assume it is anodized clear.? I would love it in brite red.. I would stick it on a charge card..LOL.. as I want to go 12 psi intercooled.. 
Any comments from folks on how hard it is to change pulleys.?


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

http://www.reichardracing.com/Pulleys.htm


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

I think but don't hold me to this they are suppose to be billet aluminum.


----------



## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

http://www.reichardracing.com/ultra_grip_pulley.htm
Here is a better link guys of there ultra-grip pulley http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (benzivr6)*

If they wan "ultra grip" then they should be making the thing out of stainless. Next is anodized aluminum, and then plain aluminum.
I'm not a fan of that "ultra grip" pulley on their website. Either 1) it doesn't really work, and they are just tensioning the belt properly, or 2) it is cutting into the rubber belt (the only way I can see getting more "friction" out of reducing the contact area and having those sharp edges), which I wouldn't consider a good thing.
Are they at least anodizing it? Forget the added adhesion, anodization is needed just for durability alone.


[Modified by Marty, 5:08 PM 4-14-2003]


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Marty)*

ASPracing.com .....got mine for 80bucks


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]ASPracing.com .....got mine for 80bucks







[HR][/HR]​Can you post a littel more info on the pulley you bought. what size how many ribs who and how did you order it from. Is there any thing special about it. At 80 bucks you could get a couple like a 10psi and a 12 to see what works well.
Thanks


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

We already have a 10psi pulley buddy








Yeah more info on that. Like I said, ill pick one up now while I can find it, and just wait to slap it on.


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

quote:[HR][/HR]We already have a 10psi pulley buddy







[HR][/HR]​
speaking of which... if our pulley is rated at 8.5 and (i think) most other people are getting 10 and redline. so what i am wondering is what is the most boost that will come out of this 12lb pulley






















steve


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (twodubs)*

My goal with a smaller pulley is two fold. One is I want more boost and the other part is to counter act the pressure drop from what ever type of intercooler is added. So if say the intercooler has a 2 PSI drop then a 12 psi pulley would add a net of about 2 PSI and also bring the intake temps back down near ambiant air temp. This if I am correct would net good power and still be with in the limits of the engine with out having to retard boost way to much.
If I am off base let me know. I want more power but not so much power things start breaking and snapping..LOL Seems to me 300 whp would truly make the car into a beast. It is a very fast machine now but I want to make it even more wicked over time.
This is one reason I want the trany and clutch and a few other things squared away first before gaing to much more power.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

....go to ASPracing .com and look under custom pulleys.....I just told them what I have and what size I want...they calculate the offsett and you are there....I did 2.85 which is what 11.7?? I think... how would this pulley work with the ATP chip??????? lean?







I need a chip!!!!


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (IMWALKIN)*

quote:[HR][/HR]....go to ASPracing .com and look under custom pulleys.....I just told them what I have and what size I want...they calculate the offsett and you are there....I did 2.85 which is what 11.7?? I think... how would this pulley work with the ATP chip??????? lean?







I need a chip!!!![HR][/HR]​
The only way you will know how that pulley will work for you is to get her up on the dyno with a wide band. Toss it on drive around a little to let the chip have time to addapt then see what kind of numbers you get. Also keep in mind if you are running more boost you will have more heat so after a few runs you may have some unwanted retard of timming do to nock. Things get darn hot even with a fan blowing at the car.
I am assumming you have bigger injectors and a chip now. Unless you have the fueling right now I would not go smaller with the pulley untill you do..


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Scooter98144)*

2.70 fits the belt sizes (autozone) easier. Tuning aint a problem. I've got the s/c vr6 to run 13.0 gotta fatten it up a bit now, the ****** atp chip was nailing 9:1 across the board lol.
nice 12.5:1 till high rpm's then drop dead rich to prevent detonation after peak power. (depending on cams)
2.70 fits the next size belt quite nicely.


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

just a bump to see how everybodies doing


----------



## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (mrkrad)*

double posts are always fun!










_Modified by leebro61 at 8:58 PM 6-6-2003_


----------



## Curb Check (Jun 6, 2003)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

New to the boards.. looks like I get to read 22 pages of info


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (leebro61)*

i was like WHOA!! hehehe oh no what happened


----------



## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: Calling all Vortech SC owners (Curb Check)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Curb Check* »_New to the boards.. looks like I get to read 22 pages of info

its a good 22 pgs of reading







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vausVR6 (Jan 31, 2002)

hey guys.. decided to check back here. Not too much activity in this thread lately... let's keep her alive








I've been working on a fully mapable water injection system with my own controller. In the end it should be cheaper than aquamist's basic system. I'll be installing it on a friend's SC'd VR shortly and hopefully we'll get it on a dyno to tune it out. Should add some potential for higher boost and safer operation. Just some food for thought








-- Ed


----------



## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: (vausVR6)*

The more I run with this intake the more I like it. It does not so much add power but what it does realy well is to keep the intake temps at ambiant all the time. I can drive hard and fast all I want and I still suck in nice cold air. 









My goal now is to lower intake temps. May not add a ton of power but it also does not cost a ton. If you back up in that link you will see a shot of the manifold the will be heat coated and have a EVO style heat sheild as well.


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## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: (vausVR6)*

my water injection setup is gonna be coming to life soon.
My peloquin, CM stage 3 and autotech fly just showed up yesterday though, so I gots to install that soon. Then the fun begins...
Oh, i also ended up with IMWALKINs 2.85" pulley!


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## 98GTi-VR6 (May 16, 2000)

*Re: (leebro61)*

guys, check with collier. He can get you a new recalibrated MAF and a new custom chip to take care of the buck in OBD2 cars.
-Costas


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## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: (98GTi-VR6)*

what belts is everybody using? For some reason, I just cannot get my 6 rib to grip








I had a 6rib for awhile and tensioned it once, and always saw 10+ psi. It wasnt even all that tight either. Now, i put on a new 6rib (same belt) and cannot get it to see over 5-6psi








Belt dressing, longer tensioner bolt (cranked way down too), checked for leaks and have none, etc.
I think my pulley is slightly out of alignment, but I dunno why i used to run a 6 rib belt alot looser than the one i have now, and i had no problems making full boost. Now I cant see past 5psi for crap















Really makes me consider going turbo http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: (leebro61)*

oh, i should add that when i run a 7 rib pulley, it frays on the charger side. Thats what makes me think they are out of alignment. I think that the SC pulley needs to be shimmed closer to the passenger side.
I may also ditch my AC just because i think that pulley may be contributing to the fraying, and its useless anyways with the ribs machined off. The car runs like crap and almost stall out when the AC is on. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## The Hustler (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (leebro61)*


_Quote, originally posted by *leebro61* »_ The car runs like crap and almost stall out when the AC is on. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif

















hehehehe told ya so.






















man that sux withthe belt though. mine is almost tightend all the way. i am still running the belt that came with the kit.







good luck though


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## PhOO (May 23, 2000)

*Re: (leebro61)*

im running a dodge ram 8 rib belt with one rib sliced off.. grips good even when the AC is on


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## leebro61 (Nov 7, 2001)

*Re: (PhOO)*

my gf's dad is a mech, and he said that with the amount of belt wrap i have, there should be NO problem gripping. He suggested getting a new belt and putting brake cleaner on it, and wiping it off with a linty rag. He said that would get the slippery shiny surface off of it.
I will give this a shot tomorrow and hope for the best. He said without the shine the belts have from the factory, i shouldnt even need it to be all that tight.
I may also need to tweak my alignment.


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