# 21 Tiguan Snow mode question



## Acsom (Dec 29, 2019)

When I take the Tiguan out of “Normal” and put it into “Snow”, it’s like throwing an anchor out the back. I know that it will have a lot more drive train loss, but this is _a lot_. My Atlas wasn’t like that; no other 2wd/4wd vehicle I’ve ever had was like this. 

Is this normal for the Tiguan?


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## herkguy (Jan 11, 2006)

It is def noticeable. I haven’t floored it in snow mode, but it does not want to spin tires and crawls off the line unless you press hard.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Not really a loss, it's using 2nd gear from a standstill.


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## Acsom (Dec 29, 2019)

Thanks. I’ve only used it a couple times, and only when necessary.


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## upthewazzu (Nov 4, 2020)

As jonese mentioned, it starts in 2nd gear and uses the economy transmission programming. I never use it.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

I would use it when you know it's super slippery when starting at a stop. Driving with it is painful.


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

If you've ever driven in snow, you probably don't need the dedicated Snow mode. (What, I can't floor it off the line?)


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## BSM (Jul 4, 2020)

phlegm said:


> If you've ever driven in snow, you probably don't need the dedicated Snow mode. (What, I can't floor it off the line?)


The important part of snow mode is that it alters the 4motion system’s tolerance for wheel slip.


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## Jester2893 (May 2, 2008)

BSM said:


> The important part of snow mode is that it alters the 4motion system’s tolerance for wheel slip.


This. It’s helps on snowy highways when accelerating and changing lanes especially I noticed.


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## herkguy (Jan 11, 2006)

I kind of wish we could select rear wheel only, I miss being able to hang the tail out in the snow around corners. Only the truck lets me do that if I turn off the nanny sensors, winter bliss..hehe


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## twowagens (Oct 23, 2010)

Jester2893 said:


> This. It’s helps on snowy highways when accelerating and changing lanes especially I noticed.


That’s interesting. Been trying to find out more about what it does, but there isn’t too much information in the owners manual. Have had a chance to try it out a bit here in Dallas the last couple days. It does seem to start out from a stop in second gear and upshift a bit earlier in snow mode.


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## Volkswagens-for-life (Jun 24, 2013)

herkguy said:


> I kind of wish we could select rear wheel only, I miss being able to hang the tail out in the snow around corners. Only the truck lets me do that if I turn off the nanny sensors, winter bliss..hehe


Buy a haldex controller. Problem solved. My pq35 Tiguan had no issues kicking the rear out with stock controller


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## bluejacket (Aug 4, 2015)

Hey you really want the snow mode to perform as it should. The safe control of your vehicle under snow and ice...is slow and easy.
Not full torque and fast. If not happy in snow mode then select Normal mode or Sport mode. But be advised you will be setting yourself up for some defensive driving. 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

BSM said:


> The important part of snow mode is that it alters the 4motion system’s tolerance for wheel slip.


I assume you mean that wheel slip tolerance is lowered, in that it will divert power more readily? (Normal mode will give you a bit more leeway.)

Just wanted to confirm before I reply.


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## bluejacket (Aug 4, 2015)

Torque is power and when applying to ice..then the non contact or slipping happens. Hence lost of control. Snow mode prevents this from happening during acceleration. And the traction computers does the rest to keep proper safe torque to all 4 wheels.

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## bluejacket (Aug 4, 2015)

Traction depends on what kind or condition your tires you have installed. The newer the tire the better or if you install snow tires that would be the best improvement in Traction. No AWD in snow mode with worn tires or bald tires will work safely or efficiently. 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## PZ (May 9, 2002)

I was pretty happy with normal mode in drive on the patches of ice and snow I hit on purpose today. Great traction, very little wheel slip. My b5 4Mo wagon used to kick the tail out in snow.


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## Acsom (Dec 29, 2019)

phlegm said:


> If you've ever driven in snow, you probably don't need the dedicated Snow mode. (What, I can't floor it off the line?)


I’ve used it to get out of my inclined driveway after some heavy snowfalls. It was pretty impressive, the TIg drove right out while the FWD Kia took about an hour of shoveling, after the plow had run. After I got out of the drive, I turned it off. Probably should have RTFM to find my answer, but it’s also fun to ask here, and thanks for the info.


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## Urano17 (Jul 7, 2018)

Two weeks ago I drove from Chicago to St Paul Minnesota and back. My drive back was in a snow storm. A 6 hour drive ended in 9 hours. The entire drive was in snow mode. I thank God, VW, 4 motion and Bridgestone tires for keeping me safe. At one point I lost sight the interstate with a blanket of snow across the road. I can feel the 4 motion sending power to the rears trying to keep me straight. The semi drivers for the most part were ok, but some were driving like nothing. The reset of us were trying to follow in their tracks. As these semi 's pass us around 55-65 mph it would push the snow causing some cars to spin out. I maintained a steady speed of 45 mph and trying to keep myself out of a ditch. When I finally got home I noticed I averaged 35mpg. From my experience snow mode really tries to keep you from over powering the wheels and sends power where its needed.


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

Just as a follow up, I asked a similar question here in 2019:








4Motion - Snow Mode?


Was curious if anyone had further details on the Snow mode in 4Motion. I can definitely feel that it dulls the throttle, and this is confirmed here: https://www.vwmodels.ca/performance/4motion/ However, that's not adding a lot of value, and if you're already familiar with winter driving, light...




www.vwvortex.com





It is difficult to find out exactly what differs in Snow Mode (or any other 4Motion mode) given a lack of documentation. It seems that it amounts to throttle/transmission mapping (such as starting in 2nd gear), with no specific changes to the AWD system. I found that idea disappointing, and if someone can offer up VW documentation I'd appreciate it.

In the meantime, I just keep it in Normal mode, and do the "throttle mapping" myself. Don't get me wrong - if you find Snow Mode helpful that's excellent. I just find the dulled throttle painful, and of limited value.


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## Urano17 (Jul 7, 2018)

phlegm said:


> Just as a follow up, I asked a similar question here in 2019:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


In my case driving down the interstate with 2-5 inches of snow it works. (9hours) The throttle input and the shifting of the trans makes the driver aware of weather conditions. My throttle input was slow and steady and if it were to step out , you were quickly able to gain control. I too was looking for documentation on how its "Suppose to Work" I did try driving in normal mode for a short period just to find that the rear will step out. It would understeers even with a slow input on the throttle. Hope my experience helps others on what to expect in snow mode.


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## Volkswagens-for-life (Jun 24, 2013)

phlegm said:


> Just as a follow up, I asked a similar question here in 2019:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No documentation? Volkswagen has technical documentation for nearly every system and subsystem they make









4MOTION all-wheel-drive system


The Volkswagen Newsroom is a service of Volkswagen AG for journalists, bloggers, and multipliers. It offers the latest news for press and media.




www.volkswagen-newsroom.com


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Nope. That's a marketing oriented site. No documentation on how the owner is supposed to use 4MOTION or expectations of the system in various modes.

The necessary documentation should have been in the glove box when the vehicle is sold to the end-customer.

_edit: corrected sentence to past tense, remove too much bashing of VW._


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## Volkswagens-for-life (Jun 24, 2013)

Almost an unlimited amount of official Volkswagen literature out there. What exactly are you looking for?









VAG SSP 414 – 4MOTION With Four-wheel Drive Coupling Generation IV – PDF Download


VAG SSP 414 – 4MOTION with Four-wheel Drive Coupling Generation IV control unit J492 Rear-axle Four-wheel. In Brief, 4MOTION Drive Train, Four-wheel Drive Coupling in Detail, Control, System overview, Functional Diagram, Service




procarmanuals.com













VAG SSP 861803 - Tiguan Haldex All-Wheel Drive – PDF Download


VAG SSP 861803 - Tiguan Haldex All-Wheel Drive. Drivetrain, All-Wheel Drive, Clutch Details, Controls, Service, Knowledge, Assessment, The new all-wheel drive clutch in 4MOTION responds rapidly to any driving situation and maintains the best possible traction at all times




procarmanuals.com


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

There's nothing in the documents you pointed to on how the DRIVER is supposed to use the system. Those documents are oriented for the technical inclined individual on how the mechanics of the system function (overall).

The header of both those documents say "Service Training".

Questions still unanswered:

When do you use Snow mode?
What changes when you switch to Snow mode?
When should you not use Snow mode?

I can make my own educated guess to most of those after using it, but they should be documented.


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

Volkswagens-for-life said:


> Almost an unlimited amount of official Volkswagen literature out there. What exactly are you looking for?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Both of those docs are similar (and targeting service personnel), but neither of them indicate differences between the various 4Motion modes, i.e. what is unique to the Haldex in Snow Mode?

If you can find docs around that specifically, we'd appreciate it.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Here's the ONLY documentation I can find on Snow mode from the manual (and other modes included for reference).

It basically describes what Snow mode does with one sentence. The owner's manual describes how to adjust your seat in more detail than this.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
*Driving mode characteristics*

*Snow* ②: The *Snow* driving mode increases accelerator sensitivity on icy or snow-covered roads. It is not possible to shift into *S* position in Snow driving mode.


*On-road* ③: The driving mode *On-road* allows you to choose between the *Eco*, *Normal*, *Sport*, and *Custom* mode options.


*Off-road* ④: In *Off-road* mode, vehicle acceleration is more sensitive in off-road terrain. Shift points may change. In the *Off-road* mode, the Hill Start Assist and Hill Descent Control are active. Park Distance Control (PDC) is switched off in *Off-road* mode.


*Custom Off-road* ⑤: In *Custom Off-road* mode, there are more settings so you can further customize *Off-road* mode. You can select individual characteristics for various systems while still in *Off-road* mode ⇒ Adjusting the Custom driving modes . The settings in *Custom Off-road* mode are stored in the active user profile in the driver personalization feature. Park Distance Control (PDC) is switched off in *Custom Off-road* mode.


*Eco:* Sets the vehicle in a low consumption mode and supports the driver with more eco-friendly driving. The *Eco* mode affects the climate control and ACC system.


*Normal*: Balanced setting for everyday use.


*Sport*: Gives the vehicle a sporty driving feel and is suited for a sporty driving style. Power steering is reduced and the effort required to turn the steering wheel increases. The vehicle's driving response becomes more direct. The ACC system is also affected in *Sport* mode.


*Custom*: Individual systems can be adjusted to suit your personal requirements ⇒ Adjusting the Custom driving modes .


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## Volkswagens-for-life (Jun 24, 2013)

jonese said:


> There's nothing in the documents you pointed to on how the DRIVER is supposed to use the system. Those documents are oriented for the technical inclined individual on how the mechanics of the system function (overall).
> 
> The header of both those documents say "Service Training".
> 
> ...





phlegm said:


> Both of those docs are similar (and targeting service personnel), but neither of them indicate differences between the various 4Motion modes, i.e. what is unique to the Haldex in Snow Mode?
> 
> If you can find docs around that specifically, we'd appreciate it.






Ohh gotcha my bad. Let me see what I can find.


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## IbsFt (Dec 15, 2018)

Volkswagens-for-life said:


> Almost an unlimited amount of official Volkswagen literature out there. What exactly are you looking for?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good info on the 4Motion part, thanks for posting it. As has been pointed out it doesn’t fully explain Snow Mode. Then there are the gems from VW:



newsroom.vw.com/vehicles/why-volkswagen-suvs-are-a-great-companion-for-winter-driving/ said:


> *Snow Mode 1: *Both the Atlas and Tiguan feature Active Control as a part of the 4Motion system, which allows the driver to select specific vehicle profiles based on driving conditions. When Snow Mode is engaged, the transmission upshifts earlier in the power cycle to help optimize traction. The Traction Control System (TCS) helps reduce engine power when it detects slippage from the individual wheel sensors and adapts its sensitivity to straight-line driving and cornering, where traction is of paramount importance. See above for 4Motion availability.


Sooooo ...the TCS adapts its sensitivity to straight-line driving and cornering during snow mode? So how is that different from normal mode, more aggressive power reduction? What other types of driving are there besides going straight or turning? More marketing gibberish?



jonese said:


> ......
> *Driving mode characteristics*
> 
> *Snow* ②: The *Snow* driving mode increases accelerator sensitivity on icy or snow-covered roads. It is not possible to shift into *S* position in Snow driving mode.
> ........


 What do they mean by "increases accelerator sensitivity"? It feels like it does the opposite, as would be expected. A language translation error? Might they have meant "acceleration sensitivity" meaning it increases the traction control sensitivity?


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

Yep @IbsFt - This pretty much came up in my other thread from a couple of years ago. Someone suggested that the Haldex AWD just does the same thing in all modes (torque adjustment, slippage control), while throttle and transmission are the only changes as you move through 4Motion options.


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

BSM said:


> The important part of snow mode is that it alters the 4motion system’s tolerance for wheel slip.





bluejacket said:


> Torque is power and when applying to ice..then the non contact or slipping happens. Hence lost of control. Snow mode prevents this from happening during acceleration. And the traction computers does the rest to keep proper safe torque to all 4 wheels.
> ...


I just wanted to follow up on these 2 quotes because they suggest changes to the AWD (Haldex) portion of the system based on 4Motion mode.

Believe me, I'd like this to be the case, but so far anything we've found suggests 4Motion only alters throttle & gearing, while the AWD just continues to do it's thing regardless of mode.

Did either of you find docs behind this (serious question, not Internet baiting), as I suspect we may all be a bit disappointed. (?)


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## Volkswagens-for-life (Jun 24, 2013)

I haven't had much time to look for further documentation but if you're overly concerned about controlling the 4motion differential then just buy a manual haldex controller and be done with it


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

Volkswagens-for-life said:


> I haven't had much time to look for further documentation but if you're overly concerned about controlling the 4motion differential then just buy a manual haldex controller and be done with it


I'm trying to find out if Snow Mode (most relevant for me) is worth using. If just the throttle damping and starting in 2nd, it isn't worth it IMO. If it is also manipulating the Haldex in a unique way for snow, then it would make more sense.


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## phildo (Jul 23, 1999)

phlegm said:


> I'm trying to find out if Snow Mode (most relevant for me) is worth using. If just the throttle damping and starting in 2nd, it isn't worth it IMO. If it is also manipulating the Haldex in a unique way for snow, then it would make more sense.


"Worth using" is as simple as turning it on and having a go to find out, yes?


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## Volkswagens-for-life (Jun 24, 2013)

phlegm said:


> I'm trying to find out if Snow Mode (most relevant for me) is worth using. If just the throttle damping and starting in 2nd, it isn't worth it IMO. If it is also manipulating the Haldex in a unique way for snow, then it would make more sense.


Fair point. I'm completely theorizing that there are no changes to 4mo itself with the dial. Our TLX says right in the owner's manual what happens to the differentials when the different sport modes are enabled. Likely the Volkswagen has altered throttle maps and braking maps in snow mode


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## DoC0427 (Sep 16, 2019)

phildo said:


> "Worth using" is as simple as turning it on and having a go to find out, yes?


I agree. In this case, what difference does the “technical” difference make? Simply try it in a safe situation (snowy parking lot for example) and if you find it helps you or you feel safer or more in control with SNOW mode then use it. If not, then don’t.

...sorry, just my opinion I suppose.

BTW, I agree that there’s little information out there that describes what all happens in snow, normal, eco, sport modes and as an engineer myself, this irks me. Likely considered “proprietary” by VW, but I don’t know. Nevertheless at the end of the day it doesn’t matter. If a particular mode makes me feel safer or more in control or provides a more satisfying experience for a particular situation, then to me, that’s really the point.

DoC


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## phildo (Jul 23, 1999)

DoC0427 said:


> I agree. In this case, what difference does the “technical” difference make? Simply try it in a safe situation (snowy parking lot for example) and if you find it helps you or you feel safer or more in control with SNOW mode then use it. If not, then don’t.
> 
> ...sorry, just my opinion I suppose.
> 
> BTW, I agree that there’s little information out there that describes what all happens in snow, normal, eco, sport modes and as an engineer myself, this irks me. Likely considered “proprietary” by VW, but I don’t know. Nevertheless at the end of the day it doesn’t matter. If a particular mode makes me feel safer or more in control or provides a more satisfying experience for a particular situation, then to me, that’s really the point.


I totally get wanting to understand the technical aspects. Those details are cool to know. As an owner, I WANT the car to be using the AWD system to assist me. It's what I paid for. Further, it seems that VW would benefit from marketing that fancy system instead of just saying it is throttle/transmission changes.

Where I live (Bend, OR) I appreciate the snow mode. Lots of icy roads and the muted throttle response is appreciated.


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## phlegm (Apr 24, 2019)

phildo said:


> "Worth using" is as simple as turning it on and having a go to find out, yes?





DoC0427 said:


> I agree. In this case, what difference does the “technical” difference make? Simply try it in a safe situation (snowy parking lot for example) and if you find it helps you or you feel safer or more in control with SNOW mode then use it. If not, then don’t.
> 
> ...sorry, just my opinion I suppose.
> 
> ...


I take both your points, and believe me I've tested Snow Mode several times over the past couple of winters here. As far as I can tell, it is merely the Throttle and Takeoff changes that others have described. I can't, for example, really discern much difference between snow/ice behavior and wet pavement.

The concern, or question I'd have, would be if I'm missing out on additional AWD tweaks that might only come into play in some more severe conditions. Maybe a quicker reaction to slip at higher speeds. Maybe some things that aren't safely testable. If I know there were additional changes to the Haldex, I might be more inclined to use Snow Mode, despite the dulled throttle which I dislike.

I understand where you're coming from @DoC0427 re the overall feeling, but to me that's a bit of a placebo that I don't want. I'd prefer to know exactly what I can expect in a given mode, and I find the lack of documentation somewhat frustrating.


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## DoC0427 (Sep 16, 2019)

Yea, I get it and do agree with your point to some degree. But I look at it from VW’s point of view as well... their commitment is not that the snow mode (or sport or eco or whatever) will turn a particular device on or off or change the way certain specific devices behave. Their statement is simply that snow mode improves handling and safety in those modes as it pertains to the respective road conditions. How they do it, is likely considered their IP (or secret sauce).

Think of it this way, if whatever it is that they do resulted in a far superior result than their competitors, they would want to preserve that leadership position and not tell the world too much about how they do it. Unless of course there’s a business reason to do so.

If they had somehow leveraged some new technology like AI or some other thing that is patentable I’m sure they would market the crap out of it since it’s protected and might provide sales gains.

Alternatively, from a more cynical view if they say the mode does X and a person suffers injury because X either did or did not occur, then there may be a liability claim if that person was expecting that X to occur (or not). Likely baseless claim but nevertheless would be expensive to VW to come to that conclusion.

Again, just my opinion and thoughts. I too would like to know every detail I can about the vehicle and settings etc... but in the competitive, litigious world we live in some things are just not going to be openly disclosed.

Cheers...
DoC


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ottothecow (Apr 12, 2019)

phlegm said:


> Just as a follow up, I asked a similar question here in 2019:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm with you on this one. Snow mode's super casual throttle response may be great if you have absolutely no idea how to drive in snow and ice...but I actually feel like it will just teach you bad habits. When I go into snow mode, I end up pushing the throttle a lot harder to compensate, which is not a habit you want to give a driver in the snow (what happens next time they drive a car that doesn't have "snow mode"?)

I feel much better simply using normal mode and the throttle response that I am used to and being gentle with it. Heck, I'd also be OK with something like snow mode having 2nd gear starts but normal throttle response...

That said, if VW really does have the haldex system tuned differently for snow mode in a beneficial way, I suppose I'd be willing to live with it in particularly bad conditions. In an ideal world, snow mode would be customizable like other modes--you could set sport steering, normal throttle response, but put the AWD system into snow mode. 

If that were an option, I'd probably just leave it in that mode all winter. I haven't seen the bare surface of my road in a month. The highways and big roads get worn down to pavement, but the side streets just get plowed down to hardpack snow (when they eventually get plowed) so having the AWD system in snow mode (if it differs from normal) would be something I'd want for several months straight.


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