# APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!!



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)




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## .:R:. (Mar 3, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

any fuel cuts?


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## im_a_local (Jun 4, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Is the manifold made out of.... inconel maybe?


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## crew219 (Oct 18, 2000)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (.:R:.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *.:R:.* »_any fuel cuts?

Includes an APR rail-pump








Dave


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (crew217)*


_Quote, originally posted by *crew217* »_Includes an APR rail-pump








Dave

Doesn't answer the question that you quoted


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

Quick parts rundown:
1 APR Rail Pump
2 APR Injectors
3 APR Inconel Exhaust Manifold (pic is a painted sla prototype)
4 cast aluminum maf housing
5 cast aluminum charge pipe to i.c.
6 APR/Garrett Turbocharger
7 APR Cast Downturn (connected to turbo exhaust housing)
8 APR Silicone inlet hose and exit hose
and of course all oil and coolant lines, hardware and gaskets and everything else needed for the install!


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_
Doesn't answer the question that you quoted










There are no fuel cuts. Many magazine and online editors have experienced the kit as well as several other industry insiders and there has not been one bad experience or hiccup. Randy Pobst drove the car to amazing times at the Streets of Willow as seen in the new Sport Compact Car without a single issue.


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## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

how much power are we expecting from this badass setup?


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (dubbkidd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dubbkidd* »_how much power are we expecting from this badass setup?









380-450 depending on fuel qaulity and internal strength.


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Quick parts rundown:
1 APR Rail Pump
2 APR Injectors
3 APR Inconel Exhaust Manifold (pic is a painted sla prototype)
4 cast aluminum maf housing
5 cast aluminum charge pipe to i.c.
6 APR/Garrett Turbocharger
7 APR Cast Downturn (connected to turbo exhaust housing)
8 APR Silicone inlet hose and exit hose
and of course all oil and coolant lines, hardware and gaskets and everything else needed for the install!

Thanks for the FACTS keith!


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## .:R:. (Mar 3, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

new apr rail pump, injectors http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif sorry about the fuel cut comment then


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## whizbang18T (Nov 17, 2000)

glad to see they're using braided oil/coolant lines ... much better than the original 1.8t stage 3 lines (you old school transverse stage 3'ers know what i'm talkin about haha)


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## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
380-450 depending on fuel qaulity and internal strength.

are you refering to whp or bhp
how much could we expect to be able to put out with stock internals? or is this kit gone include strenghten rods, etc?


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (dubbkidd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dubbkidd* »_
are you refering to whp or bhp
how much could we expect to be able to put out with stock internals? or is this kit gone include strenghten rods, etc?

Just asked him this in another thead. They are in the process of testing the limits of stock internals and will share once concrete results are known http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Kit looks great, thanks for the info! I can't wait until spring..








JJ


_Modified by CDN_MKV at 5:30 PM 12-22-2006_


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## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*

do they have expected pricing??? rough estimate maybe...
after seeing those pictures i am regretting buying a new rabbit today as a secondary car....maybe i should get rid of it take that money and buy this kit










_Modified by [email protected] at 5:40 PM 12-22-2006_


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_do they have expected pricing??? rough estimate maybe...
after seeing those pictures i am regretting buying a new rabbit today as a secondary car....maybe i should get rid of it take that money and buy this kit









_Modified by [email protected] at 5:40 PM 12-22-2006_


Yes, they do. I'll wait for Keith to chime in with the FACTS once again.


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## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

very interesting.
will the rail pump and injectors be able to work a step down for supplying a k04 setup?


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## Sincity (May 17, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (YoungMedic)*

Forged pistons and connecting rods to hit 450? Bad A$$


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## im_a_local (Jun 4, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Keith, I see the injectors and pump are APR units. Are they made in house? Thats pretty sick, you guys producing injectors and rail pump just for this setup







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Branman (Oct 6, 2004)

awesome job as usaul, looks great guys!


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## Faerus (May 7, 2006)

I would also like to know if the 380-450 quoted is at the wheels. I know in the article about the APR GTI it said it got 380 to the wheels, what was that with?


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (Faerus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Faerus* »_I would also like to know if the 380-450 quoted is at the wheels. I know in the article about the APR GTI it said it got 380 to the wheels, what was that with?

I thought it said it was 380 crank with 365 whp. 400 crank on the race program.
Here's an exerpt from the article:
"APR also did the engine tuning on the R GTI utilizing the same Stage 3 big-turbo kit found on their SEMA car but tuned for regular pump gas and good for 355hp to the wheels - or about 400hp at the crank."

JJ


_Modified by CDN_MKV at 10:04 PM 12-22-2006_


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## scotchy (Oct 2, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Very cool!
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif APR


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## BumbleBeeJBG (Apr 30, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (scotchy)*

WE NEED AWD! OMG!!
400hp in a FWD car is a sin.


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## StreetSpeed2000 (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (scotchy)*

I read the SCC GTI shootout last night at Borders. The APR GTI put something like 365hp to the wheels and the R GTI put 356hp to the wheels; or something like that. Those numbers are right within 10whp if my memory serves. I DO know the APR was in the 360whp and the R GTI was in the 350whp range. I believe both the R GTI and APR GTI had forged rods. The R GTI went 0-60 in 4.82 (I believe) and the APR in 5.1ish. The R GTI did the Streets of Willow track in 1.27ish. For those of you how browse SCC, you may know they do an Ultimate Street Car challenge every year. They said in the article that last years winner of that was a 650whp NSX which also ran the course at 1.27. Of course, comparing a pro driver in an R GTI to Joe Shmo in a NSX isn't really apples to apples, but still, pretty cool IMO.
Most of the numbers I mentioned are just about right, so there ya go! I'm gonna go out on a limb and speculate that the kit is gonna cost upwards of $7-8K. Not including a necessary stage 3 clutch and LSD (add another 2.5k installed). So, for $10000, I think I'll spend a little more time having a blast on the track rather than on the ability to go 0-60 in 4.8 (which points to high 12 second passes, though I'm sure it'll be quicker as I'm sure they were way low on traction even with a Quaife LSD). BUT, for those of you who got the cash, I wanna ride when someone puts on in their car!








Sorry for the rambling. 

_Modified by StreetSpeed2000 at 10:15 AM 12-23-2006_


_Modified by StreetSpeed2000 at 10:15 AM 12-23-2006_


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## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

So, has this kit or the K04 kit been tested on a DSG car yet ?? want to know if it can handle the power..??


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## gtboost (Oct 11, 2005)

*Re: (Frankie92481)*

i recently talked to keith about the k04 kit with dsg. he said so far the cars have had zero issues, but it is still too early to say yes or no on if it is ok for dsg.
im sure once these people log some miles on the car we will find out as soon as apr ok's it


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## Faerus (May 7, 2006)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_
I thought it said it was 380 crank with 365 whp. 400 crank on the race program.
Here's an exerpt from the article:
"APR also did the engine tuning on the R GTI utilizing the same Stage 3 big-turbo kit found on their SEMA car but tuned for regular pump gas and good for 355hp to the wheels - or about 400hp at the crank."

JJ

_Modified by CDN_MKV at 10:04 PM 12-22-2006_

"In the end Volkswagen chose APR's car below as the winner of the competition. APR's car put close to 385hp to the wheels (more than 400 crank horsepower) with a new forthcoming "big turbo" kit utilizing an APR-specific Garrett GT series turbo."


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_








 
Looks good Keith http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif seems like ive seen something similar before LOL














Bob.G


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## sharons03jetta (Jul 6, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*

so is the built bottom end required or recomended.....?


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## 18bora (Oct 12, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

No one noticed it









_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ( 18bora)*


_Quote, originally posted by * [email protected]* »_Here is the Stg 3 2.0T transverse update-
All cast pieces are now in production. There are 2 steps here.
The first is the tooling being created (this is where castings come from). Second is the foundry pouring the first production batches. As I write this, the tooling is being created for all the cast pieces (exhaust manifold, downturn, etc...). Then the foundry will pour the first run of the production units. 
The software is finished as are the hoses. The fueling components are in production as well. In sumary all items are finished or are in full production. 
We expect kits to begin to ship early March. This may change by a few weeks or so but not by much. 
Thanks
Stephen/APR


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (StreetSpeed2000)*


_Quote, originally posted by *StreetSpeed2000* »_
Most of the numbers I mentioned are just about right, so there ya go! I'm gonna go out on a limb and speculate that the kit is gonna cost upwards of $7-8K. Not including a necessary stage 3 clutch and LSD (add another 2.5k installed). So, for $10000, I think I'll spend a little more time having a blast on the track rather than on the ability to go 0-60 in 4.8 (which points to high 12 second passes, though I'm sure it'll be quicker as I'm sure they were way low on traction even with a Quaife LSD). BUT, for those of you who got the cash, I wanna ride when someone puts on in their car!








Sorry for the rambling. 

_Modified by StreetSpeed2000 at 10:15 AM 12-23-2006_

_Modified by StreetSpeed2000 at 10:15 AM 12-23-2006_


385whp with race gas and rods. Both VoA's R-GTi and our GTi were equipped with rods as the only internal strengthening. This was done to ensure no issues as strength testing was not conclusive at that time.
The selection of the turbo allows for very fast spool and a range of hp options through calibration. We have still not pushed the kit to its maximum potential. We can offer the calibration from 340chp to an estimated 450chp. In typical APR fashion, our advanced ecu recalibration methods and ability to create additional functionality within the ecu allows for us to design a range of situation specific recalibrations completely recalibrated as its own accomplishment. Using the cruise control to select a specific recalibration and selecting different grades of octane, our clients can go from daily driving fun to track day 650whp NSX killing power!








APR has mastered VAG engine turbocharging in a complete fashion that noone has duplicated to date. We have been developing upgraded turbo systems for VAG turbo engines since 1998.
Our 1.8T Stage 3/3+ systems have been the epitome of daily driving power for 1000's of clients and our enigineering team has continued to improve upon this industry standard with the development of the 2.0T FSI Stage 3 Turbo System.
Our recalibration philosophies allow for a linear, smooth power band that sometimes even seems deceptive due to the continual pull the pilot feels with no neck snapping, jarring and traction loosing boost spikes or uncontrollable torque steer. Our kits don't only give you the impression of power, they allow you to win the race with the best times as well without having to fight the car through the track.
I found the track data in Sport Compact Car's article the most interesting. Both APR equipped GTi's were continually faster through all corners than the competition. Sometimes by double digit numbers. This is a true testament to the abilities of our Stage 3. The editors even commented that our braking system was not up to par with the other cars, yet the Stage 3 GTi's continued to post faster and faster times while widening the gap over the competition.
As far as pricing, I think everyone will be pleasantly surprised. I can't give exact numbers quite yet but some of the numbers being thrown around are alot higher than our targets. http://****************.com/smile/emgift.gif 
With nearly 10 years of experience developing, supporting, installing, driving, racing and owning APR Stage 3 Turbo systems a phone call away at nearly any time, your relationship with our sales and support team will be unsurpassed as well.
The APR Stage 3 ownership experience is one of comradery, fun and passion. At our Annual Customer Appreciation Bbq's, tours of our facility, the exclusive Stage 3 Owner's Forum, trackdays and driving events, VAG enthusiast shows and on nearly any forum Stage 3 owners are part of an unique experience in which our Sales, Tech Support, Engineering Team, Executive Management and Distribution Network are available as guides to receiving the most enjoyment possible out of your APR Stage 3 Turbo System. At any event you will find a group of enthusiasts talking amongst themselves with our staff or individually wearing a knowing smile.












_Modified by [email protected] at 9:45 AM 12-24-2006_


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_

* 385whp with race gas *and rods. Both VoA's R-GTi and our GTi were equipped with rods as the only internal strengthening. our clients can go from daily driving fun to track day* 650whp NSX * killing power!









 
I would like to comment on this, as APR customer (my third car with there products including stage 3+ ) and first hand experience .
APR tuned BT kits are ALL use able power along the entire RPM band ( there no dyno queens here







) from the crack of the throttle straight to red line you will pull hard and wont give up anything from the start with turbo lag/ spool ( if you can control the throttle from wheel spin ).
Then you can hand this same car to your wife and she can go get the groceries and it drives like a STOCK car . 
I expect the 2L TFSI stage 3 kit to be even better because of the massive TQ that Can be had from a finely tuned TFSI engine can provide and this engine LOVES boost and loves to REV effortlessly because of the beautiful new head design finally coming up to date







.







Bob.G


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## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*

i am excited







the kit looks awesome


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## Faerus (May 7, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
385whp with race gas and rods._Modified by [email protected] at 9:45 AM 12-24-2006_

What torque did it make at the wheels?


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## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (Faerus)*

when does apr plan on relasing this terrific kit?


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (Faerus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Faerus* »_
What torque did it make at the wheels?

I can't remember exactly but it was approx. 330wtrq.


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (dubbkidd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dubbkidd* »_when does apr plan on relasing this terrific kit?









March'ish.


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
March'ish.

Perfect timing.. That's bonus time for me







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_
Perfect timing.. That's bonus time for me







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


excellent. bonus' are very nice.


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## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
March'ish.

awesome, i think i need to start saving up


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## graygoose2k7 (Jul 25, 2006)

So the BT kit throws off the cars hp/tq bias?


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## Binary Star (Mar 27, 2001)

*Re: (graygoose2k7)*

as always, a great BT product. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## [email protected] (Aug 26, 2001)

One thing that may not be obvious to the layman but is appreciated if you have had one of our 1.8T kits- thoroughness. Our kits are much, much more than a new manifold and a turbo- as they should be in order to provide a complete experience (performance, reliability, drivability, etc.) There are multiple castings with this kit other than the investment cast inconel manifold. Notice the cast MAF housing intake pipe and new cast 'pancake' pipe in the original pic. (There is also the new intercooler design but we will hold off releasing those details for a bit.







) All intake hoses are CAD designed and are built off custom mandrels (there are four separate hoses.) Small details are not ignored: the turbocharger has a custom support brace, even the metallurgy of the exhaust fasteners is considered (we have custom fasteners built from our drawings). We have also mastered FSI from a fueling perspective and supply a high pressure fuel pump (custom engineered, very tricky part to do correct and consistently), a new low pressure fuel pump and higher flow capacity injectors. Oh, and we have been known to be pretty good at engine software as well.








All of these custom parts are very expensive to design and tool and no one puts the amount of resources into this type of product as we do. There is a good reason a number of companies tried to produce a 1.8T turbo kit but backed out. The 2.0T turbo kit builds on our experience with the 1.8T and takes it a number of steps further!


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## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_One thing that may not be obvious to the layman but is appreciated if you have had one of our 1.8T kits- thoroughness. Our kits are much, much more than a new manifold and a turbo- as they should be in order to provide a complete experience (performance, reliability, drivability, etc.) There are multiple castings with this kit other than the investment cast inconel manifold. Notice the cast MAF housing intake pipe and new cast 'pancake' pipe in the original pic. (There is also the new intercooler design but we will hold off releasing those details for a bit.







) All intake hoses are CAD designed and are built off custom mandrels (there are four separate hoses.) Small details are not ignored: the turbocharger has a custom support brace, even the metallurgy of the exhaust fasteners is considered (we have custom fasteners built from our drawings). We have also mastered FSI from a fueling perspective and supply a high pressure fuel pump (custom engineered, very tricky part to do correct and consistently), a new low pressure fuel pump and higher flow capacity injectors. Oh, and we have been known to be pretty good at engine software as well.








All of these custom parts are very expensive to design and tool and no one puts the amount of resources into this type of product as we do. There is a good reason a number of companies tried to produce a 1.8T turbo kit but backed out. The 2.0T turbo kit builds on our experience with the 1.8T and takes it a number of steps further!

Thats really nice !!!
Now just give us a quick price estimate, so we can go cry by ourselves....








EDIT: Oh and another thing....Did you know *your K04 kit* is sold for ~*6000 USD in Austria* and ~*7300 USD in Greece* ?? Are these prices right ??And how much to you really expect the BT kit to sell for over the pond ???















APR should do smth about that if they are hoping to have a Europen market .... 


_Modified by GolfRS at 10:05 PM 12-27-2006_


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## [email protected] (Feb 9, 2001)

*Re: (GolfRS)*

Have no fear ....the pricing on this kit will be in the ballpark of our current Stg 3+ 1.8T systems.


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## Captain Jack (Mar 2, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Have no fear ....the pricing on this kit will be in the ballpark of our current Stg 3+ 1.8T systems.

Are we talking nosebleed section or behind the home team dugout?


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## Sincity (May 17, 2005)

*Re: (Captain Jack)*

LOL


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: (Sincity)*

TWO WEEKS!!!!!!


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## [email protected] (Jun 19, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ( 18bora)*


_Quote, originally posted by * 18bora* »_No one noticed it










I know what you mean.. lol


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## whizbang18T (Nov 17, 2000)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ( 18bora)*


_Quote, originally posted by * 18bora* »_No one noticed it










noticed??? grrr ... sneaky ... spill it!















i honestly don't see what could be interesting .... the factory electrical DV mounted on the compressor housing







or something _else?_


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## whizbang18T (Nov 17, 2000)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_One thing that may not be obvious to the layman but is appreciated if you have had one of our 1.8T kits- thoroughness. Our kits are much, much more than a new manifold and a turbo- as they should be in order to provide a complete experience (performance, reliability, drivability, etc.) There are multiple castings with this kit other than the investment cast inconel manifold. Notice the cast MAF housing intake pipe and new cast 'pancake' pipe in the original pic. (There is also the new intercooler design but we will hold off releasing those details for a bit.







) All intake hoses are CAD designed and are built off custom mandrels (there are four separate hoses.) Small details are not ignored: the turbocharger has a *custom support brace*, even the *metallurgy of the exhaust fasteners* is considered (we have custom fasteners built from our drawings). We have also mastered FSI from a fueling perspective and supply a *high pressure fuel pump* (custom engineered, very tricky part to do correct and consistently), a new *low pressure fuel pump* and higher flow capacity injectors. Oh, and we have been known to be pretty good at engine software as well.








All of these custom parts are very expensive to design and tool and no one puts the amount of resources into this type of product as we do. There is a good reason a number of companies tried to produce a 1.8T turbo kit but backed out. The 2.0T turbo kit builds on our experience with the 1.8T and takes it a number of steps further!

neato ... nice to see improved coolant lines as well


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (whizbang18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *whizbang18T* »_
neato ... nice to see improved coolant lines as well









Do I owe you a set of coolant lines? Give me a call and I'll get them out to you. http://****************.com/smile/emgift.gif


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## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Please do some testing on a DSG car


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## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (Frankie92481)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Frankie92481* »_Please do some testing on a DSG car









BOOM......
There are you happy now ????


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## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (GolfRS)*

Wow, I'm really impressed with this so far http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I'm already saving up for it, and with my tax return coming in, it's only a matter of time


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## XM_Rocks (Jan 29, 2005)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_
BOOM......
There are you happy now ????























hahaha Yeah I dont see anyone actually steping up to be the DSG dev car.
If the A3 came in the 2.0T Quattro 6MT configuration I would sell my GTI tommorow.








I still think 365HP to the front wheels is insane. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: (XM_Rocks)*


_Quote, originally posted by *XM_Rocks* »_
I still think 365HP to the front wheels is insane. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif










nooooooo, fassstttttt


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (whizbang18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *whizbang18T* »_
the factory electrical DV mounted on the compressor housing








Uh, where was that at?


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (Captain Jack)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Captain Jack* »_
Are we talking nosebleed section or behind the home team dugout?









I think it'll be more like a homerun!


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## whizbang18T (Nov 17, 2000)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_







Uh, where was that at?

d'oh .. my bad ... looks like the wastegate solenoid


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (whizbang18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *whizbang18T* »_
d'oh .. my bad ... looks like the wastegate solenoid
















so where is the d.v.?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
so where is the d.v.?

I see it, that will need a thread of its own LOL







Bob.G


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## whizbang18T (Nov 17, 2000)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
so where is the d.v.?

i don't see it







is there a stub/line off the charge pipe behind the intake or will it be relocated elsewhere? or have you gone mechanical?
spill it bob!










_Modified by whizbang18T at 1:25 PM 12/28/2006_


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (whizbang18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *whizbang18T* »_

spill it bob!









_Modified by whizbang18T at 1:25 PM 12/28/2006_
 
Hell No ,I want my stage 3 kit in the spring LOL







Bob.G 
P.S. I will say its being tested and holds 30 psi nicely


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Looks like an APR BOV to me, but what do I know.
JJ


----------



## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

looks like an inlet for a recirc valve. probably mechanical


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

Now is it me, or is the connection to the downpipe positioned wrong ??
Is this a longitudinal engine ??
Hmmm...weird....


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_Now is it me, or is the connection to the downpipe positioned wrong ??
Is this a longitudinal engine ??
Hmmm...weird....


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (gtiiiiiiii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gtiiiiiiii* »_









YEP.....
THOUGHT SO.....


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

lol, its transverse, instead of risking burning up the turbo, we provide a new downturn to connect to the turbo with all of our transverse applications. the oem style aftermarket exhaust downpipe is not a good idea for a turbo that large.


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_lol, its transverse, instead of risking burning up the turbo, we provide a new downturn to connect to the turbo with all of our transverse applications. the oem style aftermarket exhaust downpipe is not a good idea for a turbo that large.

Can you elaborate? Is that due to the amount and type of material the downturn is made of and it's ability to draw more heat away from the hot side? 
Thx..
JJ


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_lol, its transverse, instead of risking burning up the turbo, we provide a new downturn to connect to the turbo with all of our transverse applications. the oem style aftermarket exhaust downpipe is not a good idea for a turbo that large.

What does that mean ??
We would have to throw away our DP's and install a new one if we buy this kit??
Even your current DP would not work ??


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_
Can you elaborate? Is that due to the amount and type of material the downturn is made of and it's ability to draw more heat away from the hot side? 
Thx..
JJ



exactly, it was recently explained to me by Brett so I will ask to him explain further.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_
What does that mean ??
We would have to throw away our DP's and install a new one if we buy this kit??
Even your current DP would not work ??









correct, you will not be able to use your oem or oem turbo aftermarket downpipe. the kit will include a cast downturn and a new downpipe to ensure longevity of the turbo charger.


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_
What does that mean ??
We would have to throw away our DP's and install a new one if we buy this kit??
Even your current DP would not work ??









I believe (correct me if I am wrong Keith) that there is a 3" dp supplied with the kit similar to the 1.8T applications. A cat would be required however.
JJ


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_
I believe (correct me if I am wrong Keith) that there is a 3" dp supplied with the kit similar to the 1.8T applications. A cat would be required however.
JJ

For our 1.8T apps we offer 2.5" or 3" testpipe or highflow cat sections to connect to the downturn. We will more than likely offer the 2.0T Stage 3 with either cat or testpipe in 3" only.


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
For our 1.8T apps we offer 2.5" or 3" testpipe or highflow cat sections to connect to the downturn. We will more than likely offer the 2.0T Stage 3 with either cat or testpipe in 3" only.

Ah..thx for the clarification. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## whizbang18T (Nov 17, 2000)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Hell No ,I want my stage 3 kit in the spring LOL







Bob.G 
P.S. I will say its being tested and holds 30 psi nicely










30psi on the 28RS? at what rpm???? and ... new map sensor??


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
correct, you will not be able to use your oem or oem turbo aftermarket downpipe. the kit will include a cast downturn and a new downpipe to ensure longevity of the turbo charger.

Well i'm sorry to say that just sux..... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
People that bought a DP hoping this will be a bolt on kit can't just thow it in the garbage....
Nice...


----------



## FUZE (Apr 13, 2004)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_People that bought a DP hoping this will be a bolt on kit can't just thow it in the garbage....

Come on now, you wouldn't throw it in the garbage. You still have plenty of options here. No need to get all depressed yet.


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

how does the oem plastic intake hold up to 30psi? 
fwiw guys, a 28rs won't do 450bhp. thats what a 2871r is for. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [email protected] (Aug 26, 2001)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_Well i'm sorry to say that just sux..... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
People that bought a DP hoping this will be a bolt on kit can't just thow it in the garbage....
Nice...

Well we sure weren't going to go with the other option- an adaptor plate. It's cheap and you can keep your downpipe but it's just wrong. There is no reason good enough to justify introducing a weak point in the system with a sandwiched adaptor plate- this would create a compromised seal, mediocre transition geometry, and would raise the possibility of a mechanical failure at the joint. Furthermore we wouldn't have the flexibility to locate the turbo exactly where we want it (compromised turbo geometry and overall packaging.) A cast downturn, though expensive to develop and tool, is the way to go here. Better seal, better reliability, and the transition geometry can be perfectly optimized...


----------



## StreetSpeed2000 (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_
Well i'm sorry to say that just sux..... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
People that bought a DP hoping this will be a bolt on kit can't just thow it in the garbage....
Nice...


If you're planning on shelling out nearly $10000 (my speculation), for BT kit, clutch, LSD, and install, I can't imagine a $400 downpipe is gonna make or break ya!


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (StreetSpeed2000)*


_Quote, originally posted by *StreetSpeed2000* »_
If you're planning on shelling out nearly $10000 (my speculation), for BT kit, clutch, LSD, and install, I can't imagine a $400 downpipe is gonna make or break ya!

not to mention, there is always the classifieds. iirc, the dp never was permanant...so you can resell it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (mirror)*

Yeah! How dare you give me 450 bhp but make me get rid of my dp!!!
I'm making like 230 whp right now you bastards! Screw you for trying to give me like 75% power gains or some stupid crap!
That's gaytarded.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (gtiiiiiiii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gtiiiiiiii* »_Yeah! How dare you give me 450 bhp but make me get rid of my dp!!!
I'm making like 230 whp right now you bastards! Screw you for trying to give me like 75% power gains or some stupid crap!
That's gaytarded.

LMAO!


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_how does the oem plastic intake hold up to 30psi? 
fwiw guys, a 28rs won't do 450bhp. thats what a 2871r is for. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
LMAO!









You're laughing now, but I'm pretty sure GolfRS could find an oem downpipe for way cheaper then what you're offering in your kit. Then he'll match it to his awesome k04 and just sell them like hot cakes.
Goodbye APR, hello "We be ghetto racerz"









_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_how does the oem plastic intake hold up to 30psi? 
fwiw guys, a 28rs won't do 450bhp. thats what a 2871r is for. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Uh they are not using a 28rs so I'm not sure what this post is about... 
Surely you know not all 28rs are created equally right? That's like saying a t4 is only good for 300 hp or something...
APR already mentioned it's a garret turbo with APR specs, could be a 2871, or a gt30 perhaps http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif *cough*







*cough*


_Modified by gtiiiiiiii at 7:33 AM 12-29-2006_


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (gtiiiiiiii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gtiiiiiiii* »_
You're laughing now, but I'm pretty sure GolfRS could find an oem downpipe for way cheaper then what you're offering in your kit. Then he'll match it to his awesome k04 and just sell them like hot cakes.
Goodbye APR, hello "We be ghetto racerz"









Uh they are not using a 28rs so I'm not sure what this post is about... 
Surely you know not all 28rs are created equally right? That's like saying a t4 is only good for 300 hp or something...
APR already mentioned it's a garret turbo with APR specs, could be a 2871, or a gt30 perhaps http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif *cough*







*cough*

_Modified by gtiiiiiiii at 7:33 AM 12-29-2006_

i'm pretty fluant in what turbos are capable of. you do understand that a 28rs still has a 60mm wheel, regardless of what you want to do to it right? the difference is the exducer, and the trim. a 60mm inducer won't flow 450hp. knowing APR from the 1.8t side, they are all about maximizing he turbo, and creating the power under the curve. which would point to a 2871r. if they ran a 3r, it would make more...i'm pretty confident of that. 
my main concern would be the plastic intake. how much expansion lyes when seeing 30psi?


----------



## whizbang18T (Nov 17, 2000)

no joke ... probably a custom intake mani in the works (a la motorsport pkg)


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
i'm pretty fluant in what turbos are capable of. you do understand that a 28rs still has a 60mm wheel, regardless of what you want to do to it right? the difference is the exducer, and the trim. a 60mm inducer won't flow 450hp. knowing APR from the 1.8t side, they are all about maximizing he turbo, and creating the power under the curve. which would point to a 2871r. if they ran a 3r, it would make more...i'm pretty confident of that. 
my main concern would be the plastic intake. how much expansion lyes when seeing 30psi? 

I do understand and I don't beleive they're using a 28rs either, my point was that I stay away from saying what the maximum power of a turbo is because you just never really know without the specs on it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Anyways, yeah I would be curious as well about the intake tract under that amount of pressure.


----------



## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
There is no reason good enough to justify introducing a weak point in the system with a sandwiched adaptor plate- 
A cast downturn, though expensive to develop and tool, is the way to go here. Better seal, better reliability, and the transition geometry can be perfectly optimized...

QUALITY!







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
my main concern would be the plastic intake. how much expansion lyes when seeing 30psi? 

how does he intake hold to 30psi guys? APR...keith...hello?


----------



## PD Performance (Jul 1, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Well we sure weren't going to go with the other option- an adaptor plate. It's cheap and you can keep your downpipe but it's just wrong. There is no reason good enough to justify introducing a weak point in the system with a sandwiched adaptor plate- this would create a compromised seal, mediocre transition geometry, and would raise the possibility of a mechanical failure at the joint. Furthermore we wouldn't have the flexibility to locate the turbo exactly where we want it (compromised turbo geometry and overall packaging.) A cast downturn, though expensive to develop and tool, is the way to go here. Better seal, better reliability, and the transition geometry can be perfectly optimized...

why would a downturn not be any of the negative things you say about the adapter plate? In a sense the downturn itself is also just an adapter only done slightly differently. There will be the same number of joints and surfaces. A cast piece can crack just as easily as the adapter can warp. The downturn is just simply another form of adapter.

The kit looks great just like the 1.8t version did, but its pretty lame to come up with bogus excuses as to why something is better when it has all the same possible problems.
The only real valid reason is the last part about fitment and more importantly the flow since the downturn would have a much better transition between the outlet of the turbo and inlet to the downpipe since they are different shapes.


----------



## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

The kit looks great APR http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## T62 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: (Don R)*

PD I see your point but I do not think its valid here. We all know a Spacer style adapter != a cast formed downpipe elbow.


----------



## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
how does he intake hold to 30psi guys? APR...keith...hello? 

The intake mani will not see 30 psi. I believe the highest it will see from this kit is 22-24 psi. I suspect with APR's new Motorsport packages they will or are in the midst of developing one.


----------



## [email protected] (Aug 26, 2001)

*Re: (PD Performance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PD Performance* »_why would a downturn not be any of the negative things you say about the adapter plate? In a sense the downturn itself is also just an adapter only done slightly differently. There will be the same number of joints and surfaces. A cast piece can crack just as easily as the adapter can warp. The downturn is just simply another form of adapter.

The cast downturn eliminates using a sandwiched adaptor plate. A sandwiched adaptor plate has twice the sealing surfaces and will also inherently be more demanding of the fasteners. An adaptor plate simply is a less reliable solution - this isn't conjecture, it's fact.


----------



## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
The cast downturn eliminates using a sandwiched adaptor plate. A sandwiched adaptor plate has twice the sealing surfaces 
 a downturn has the same amount of sealing surface as an adaptor plate.


----------



## apotek (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: (t3t41.8tgti)*

Yes, overall it does. But he is talking about the sealing surfaces at the turbo outlet, which is the stressed area they are concerned about. The cast downturn eliminates having to use longer bolts that a flat adapter plate would require and eliminates the extra sealing surfaces a flat adapter plate adds at the stressed turbo outlet.
Makes sense to me.










_Modified by apotek at 9:50 PM 12-30-2006_


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (gtiiiiiiii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gtiiiiiiii* »_
You're laughing now, but I'm pretty sure GolfRS could find an oem downpipe for way cheaper then what you're offering in your kit. Then he'll match it to his awesome k04 and just sell them like hot cakes.
Goodbye APR, hello "We be ghetto racerz"










MAN THAT WAS FUNNY !!!
JUST DON'T QUIT YOUR DAY JOB....YET....
SERIOUSLY THOUGH.....
THERE IS ANOTHER SOLUTION YOU MIGHT WANNA CHECK OUT...
ITS CALLED *VF ENGINEERING * 
HOW "GHETTO" IS THAT ???


----------



## TypeR #126 (May 10, 2006)

*Re: cast downtturn*

Hi Brett,
I'm curious why APR chose to cast a new downpipe elbow instead of a new turbine housing that would mate to the stock DP (seems like a similar amount of effort in my mind)? Would that have still compromised the wastgate flow?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: cast downtturn (TypeR #126)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TypeR #126* »_
I'm curious why APR chose to cast a new downpipe elbow instead of a new turbine housing that would mate to the stock DP (seems like a similar amount of effort in my mind)? Would that have still compromised the wastgate flow?
 
I think they went with the down turn elbow for a few reasons listed below 
1) if they casted hybrid turbine housing then your increasing kit cost which already needs and expensive custom HP rail pump with matching FSI injectors
2) Future stage turbo upgrades will be and easy hardware swap 
3) The casted elbow was brought over from the stage 3/3+ 1.8T kit and worked flawless and * when its not broken don't fix it * IMO LOL







Bob.G
edit to add 
It would be nice thou if Brett design a TWIN scroll hotside housing to match there beutiful incone exhaust manifold for future turbo upgrades AKA stage 3+ (3071 /3076 ) for better spool hint hint LOL











_Modified by rracerguy717 at 4:25 PM 12-30-2006_


----------



## TypeR #126 (May 10, 2006)

I'm not familiar with the 1.8T kits, but is it's the same elbow, then that would make a lot of financial sense.
A twinscroll hot side with an equal length inconel header would indeed be the cat's meow. I've been sold on them since I put one on my STi.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (TypeR #126)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TypeR #126* »_I'm not familiar with the 1.8T kits, but is it's the same elbow, then that would make a lot of financial sense.

 
Here some info and pic's on the APR stage 3/3+ kit.







Bob.G

http://www.goapr.com/VW/produc...g.jpg
http://www.goapr.com/VW/produc...n.jpg
http://www.goapr.com/VW/produc....html


----------



## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Here some info and pic's on the APR stage 3/3+ kit.







Bob.G

http://www.goapr.com/VW/produc...g.jpg
http://www.goapr.com/VW/produc...n.jpg
http://www.goapr.com/VW/produc....html

Wow, that FSI manifold looks really bad compared to VF-ENGINEERING'S manifold. 
Was arp's even flow tested?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_
Wow, that FSI manifold looks really bad compared to VF-ENGINEERING'S manifold. 
Was arp's even flow tested?
 
Yeah flow tested on a smaller 1.8T engine @ 416whp








http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2685793
I applaud VF for building there * FIRST TURBO KIT * but they are going to be the kit that has to prove them self's not APR 
APR history espec with there BT kits speak for them self's .







Bob.G


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_Wow, that FSI manifold looks really bad compared to VF-ENGINEERING'S manifold. 
Was arp's even flow tested?

You're kidding right?
That manifold has been flow tested at arround same time VF got into business of aftermarket performance parts.


----------



## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Yeah flow tested on a smaller 1.8T engine

Why post 1.8T stuff in a 2.0T FSI Tech forum for arp's vaporware stg3 kit?
That was certainly confusing, glad it's clarified. Oh wait, is arp using 1.8T manifolds in their 2.0 kit? Is that what you are saying?


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_
Why post 1.8T stuff in a 2.0T FSI Tech forum for arp's vaporware stg3 kit?
That was certainly confusing, glad it's clarified. Oh wait, is arp using 1.8T manifolds in their 2.0 kit? Is that what you are saying?

Sometimes I wonder if God wore an APR shirt if you'd doubt him too because it says APR on it...


----------



## iThread (Sep 27, 2005)

Knock it off. This didn't continue in the GIAC/VF topic and it's not going to continue here.


----------



## JETTSET (Oct 16, 2001)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
You're kidding right?
That manifold has been flow tested at arround same time VF got into business of aftermarket performance parts.


You sir are the one who must be kidding. VF has been in the business of forced induction since 1996. That is quite some time before the 1.8T even existed.


----------



## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

Well, I compared the pictures, looks like someone was trying to pass the 1.8T manifold as the one in the FSI kit. That's where it went off topic.
For the other people that were confused, too, go look at the first post on the first page. The manifolds are very much different.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (JETTSET)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JETTSET* »_
You sir are the one who must be kidding. VF has been in the business of forced induction since 1996. That is quite some time before the 1.8T even existed. 

i seriously hope you are kidding right??? 1996 before the 1.8t even existed??? 1996 audi a4 used a 1.8t which was available to buy in 1995....nice try though 



_Modified by [email protected] at 9:34 AM 12-31-2006_


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_Well, I compared the pictures, looks like someone was trying to pass the 1.8T manifold as the one in the FSI kit. That's where it went off topic.
For the other people that were confused, too, go look at the first post on the first page. The manifolds are very much different.

When the 1.8T manifold was posted it was stated to be a *1.8T* manifold and was posted as a reference. It was not posted and claimed to be the 2.0T manifold. 
It was clear if yo read the whole post. IMO
JJ


----------



## TypeR #126 (May 10, 2006)

Yes, it was never implied, or stated, that APR was using the same manifold for both the 1.8T and the 2.0T.
I had simply asked about using the cast elbow in the kit, instead of a new cast exhaust housing to mate to the stock DP. At that point Bob G. pointed out that the elbow was probably the same casting as used in the 1.8T kits. Since the turbo is the same, that would make a lot of sense. No need to re-engineer something that is already proven to work well and needlessly increase production and therefore retail costs. Bob also posted some images of the complete 1.8T kit for my benefit because I was not familiar with it, coming most recently from the Subaru world.


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

kit looks good


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_kit looks good









thank you!


----------



## shady12v (Oct 14, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
i seriously hope you are kidding right??? 1996 before the 1.8t even existed??? 1996 audi a4 used a 1.8t which was available to buy in 1995....nice try though 

_Modified by [email protected] at 9:34 AM 12-31-2006_

the 96 a4 was NOT offered in the USA with a 1.8t. Only offered with a 2.8L 12v V6. 1997 was the first year that the a4 was available in the USA with a 1.8T. I do, however believe that 1.8t was offered outside of the usa in 1996 on the a4.
I dont get involved in these petty fact arguments, but i dealt with a slow ass 96 a4 for 5 years...


----------



## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: (shady12v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *shady12v* »_
the 96 a4 was NOT offered in the USA with a 1.8t. Only offered with a 2.8L 12v V6. 1997 was the first year that the a4 was available in the USA with a 1.8T. I do, however believe that 1.8t was offered outside of the usa in 1996 on the a4.
I dont get involved in these petty fact arguments, but i dealt with a slow ass 96 a4 for 5 years...









Correct. USA 1996 A4's had sluggy 2.8's only


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (syntrix)*

you are right it was 1997 but available to buy in 1996


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_you are right it was 1997 but available to buy in 1996

and if we think more globally, it was available in 95 as 96 models to the majority of the world's population. sometimes us Americans get a little hung up on ourselves and forget that we spin around the sun just like everyone else and are not in fact the center of the galaxy








however, I think the point trying to be made is that the company in discussion that is producing the hardware has never developed a turbo kit before and the company responsible for the software has never developed a production turbo kit for a VAG motor until the last year and very, very few of those kits have been installed as to date by regular customers with no independant feedback as of yet. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

Is it just me or [email protected] deleted his post in this thread too?


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_Is it just me or [email protected] deleted his post in this thread too?


Yeah, I saw that as well. Wonder why? I would love to entertain a technical discussion with someone from that camp but it seems it never happens.


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
and if we think more globally, it was available in 95 as 96 models to the majority of the world's population. sometimes us Americans get a little hung up on ourselves and forget that we spin around the sun just like everyone else and are not in fact the center of the galaxy








however, I think the point trying to be made is that the company in discussion that is producing the hardware has never developed a turbo kit before and the company responsible for the software has never developed a production turbo kit for a VAG motor until the last year and very, very few of those kits have been installed as to date by regular customers with no independant feedback as of yet. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Thats exacly where i was going but since i've been warned few time to keep my mouth shut i need to keep *FACT's* that hurt feelings to bare minimum..


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
however, I think the point trying to be made is that the company in discussion that is producing the hardware has never developed a turbo kit before and the company responsible for the software has never developed a production turbo kit for a VAG motor until the last year and very, very few of those kits have been installed as to date by regular customers with no independant feedback as of yet. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Yeah, I get why you're saying that, but it seems to me that companies that for many years have built f/i kits and written effective f/i software for engines that never came from the factory with f/i, should certainly be up to the task of building turbo upgrade kits and writing software for engines already f/i from the factory.
To me, that's pretty damn impressive and something not a lot of VAG tuners have been able to do.


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_Yeah, I get why you're saying that, but it seems to me that companies that for many years have built f/i kits and written effective f/i software for engines that never came from the factory with f/i, should certainly be up to the task of building turbo upgrade kits and writing software for engines already f/i from the factory.
To me, that's pretty damn impressive and something not a lot of VAG tuners have been able to do.

Not sure what you mean but "not a lot of VAG tuners have been able to do"








APR, REVO, MTM, Sportec, Dahlback and few others had 1.8t BT software some 2.5-3 years before GIAC came up with one.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_
Yeah, I get why you're saying that, but it seems to me that companies that for many years have built f/i kits and written effective f/i software for engines that never came from the factory with f/i, should certainly be up to the task of building turbo upgrade kits and writing software for engines already f/i from the factory.
To me, that's pretty damn impressive and something not a lot of VAG tuners have been able to do.

I see your point completely however, some of those accomplishments were made by ZF Engineering.


_Modified by [email protected] at 10:27 AM 1-4-2007_


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Not sure what you mean but "not a lot of VAG tuners have been able to do"








APR, REVO, MTM, Sportec, Dahlback and few others had 1.8t BT software some 2.5-3 years before GIAC came up with one.


offering it and being successful with it are 2 diff things.


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Not sure what you mean but "not a lot of VAG tuners have been able to do"








APR, REVO, MTM, Sportec, Dahlback and few others had 1.8t BT software some 2.5-3 years before GIAC came up with one.


I think you need to reread what I wrote.
My point is that though VF and GIAC may be new to the BT scene, their credentials in putting together *f/i kits for non f/i cars* impresses me enough to believe no one needs to doubt their abilities (as per the statement made by [email protected]). 
To my knowledge, none of the tuners you listed have made kits or written f/i software for non f/i VAG cars. Only VF/GIAC and HGP/HPA have as far as I know.
But sorry to take this so off topic and I mean no disrespect to anyone at APR. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_offering it and being successful with it are 2 diff things. 

And who of the named tuners didnt have sucessfull BT software?


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_I see your point completely however, some of those accomplishments were made by ZF Engineering.

_Modified by [email protected] at 10:27 AM 1-4-2007_

hold on, hold on, hold on.. Are you saying what i think you're saying.
Are we talking about the same ZF engineering that had major issues with their superchargers and instead of warrantying them they decided to close the company.


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
hold on, hold on, hold on.. Are you saying what i think you're saying.
Are we talking about the same ZF engineering that had major issues with their superchargers and instead of warrantying them they decided to close the company. 

Dude, WTF is wrong with you? I know you're hot for APR, but the stuff you write ain't doing them any favors.
Back in the late '90s I had a Z Engineering kit on my GTI VR6. It blew up in less than 3k miles. They gave me another one (under warranty) and that blew up 5k miles later. They gave me another one (warranty again) and I sold that with the car a couple thousand miles later. Z Engineering swtiched to VF Engineering soon after, and because they treated me so well I bought a Vortech based kit for my new Mk4 GTI VR6 and didn't have a single issue for the 2 years I owned it. As far as I know, ZE took care of their customers and made the switch to VF smoothly. But that's not the point, is it?
The point here is that you're trying to raise up one company (APR) by taking pot shots at others (VF and GIAC) and that's usually a pretty flawed strategy. APR, GIAC and VF are respectable tuners in their own rights, and each has a great deal to be proud of. It's a big market and I personally hope each succeeds so that we consumers get some good products at some good pricing


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_Dude, WTF is wrong with you? I know you're hot for APR, but the stuff you write ain't doing them any favors.
Back in the late '90s I had a Z Engineering kit on my GTI VR6. It blew up in less than 3k miles. They gave me another one (under warranty) and that blew up 5k miles later. They gave me another one (warranty again) and I sold that with the car a couple thousand miles later. Z Engineering swtiched to VF Engineering soon after, and because they treated me so well I bought a Vortech based kit for my new Mk4 GTI VR6 and didn't have a single issue for the 2 years I owned it. As far as I know, ZE took care of their customers and made the switch to VF smoothly. But that's not the point, is it?
The point here is that you're trying to raise up one company (APR) by taking pot shots at others (VF and GIAC) and that's usually a pretty flawed strategy. APR, GIAC and VF are respectable tuners in their own rights, and each has a great deal to be proud of. It's a big market and I personally hope each succeeds so that we consumers get some good products at some good pricing









I'm hot for APR stuff...lol
Dude you might wanna do some research before you say something like that again.
If you do some searches on Audizine under my name you'll see that i gave APR way more **** then i'm giving GIAC now.
I have never had APR tuning or any other APR parts on my car. I'm currently running REVO and had also Neuspeed and GIAC on my car. 
Reason I'm doing this is because i've seen GIAC cars granade left and right, pull massive ammount of timing (my self included) and get crapy support from the GIAC (hell, they wont even talk to you directly). I've also had numerous conversations with GIAC's best known dealer and he was also trying to convince me that pulling 12 degrees of timing is ok as long as knock voltages were below 20 vdc, were talking audible knocking here.
So please leave me out of your APR fan boy comments.
I can care less if APR goes out of business today, but between the two I'll pick APR without thinking twice about it.


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Dude you might wanna do some research before you say something like that again.

Ah, I see. You're just generally pissed off at everyone








Sorry about that. I still think you might be a bit overzealous in your attacks, but you go ahead and do what you gotta do


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_
I think you need to reread what I wrote.
My point is that though VF and GIAC may be new to the BT scene, their credentials in putting together *f/i kits for non f/i cars* impresses me enough to believe no one needs to doubt their abilities (as per the statement made by [email protected]). 
To my knowledge, none of the tuners you listed have made kits or written f/i software for non f/i VAG cars. Only VF/GIAC and HGP/HPA have as far as I know.
But sorry to take this so off topic and I mean no disrespect to anyone at APR. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

I think this is a good conversation. I hope we can discuss without emotions.
From what I have seen with tuning n/a cars for boost, we provide r32 turbo software as a private label for a turbo kit manufacturer, its not as difficult as the turbo cars are. The turbo tuning is so much more indepth due to the additional mapping.
N/A cars have 2 main parameters, fuel and timing. Boost adds three but noone is adding boost regulation into the n/a ecu's. So you are still only calibrating those 2 parameters while boost is maintained as pretty much a constant variable with no opportunity for complete integration into the ems. Its kinda like a piggy back addition with the use of an ebc to control it or pulley size on a s./c.
Turbo cars have many more safety features and mapping to control the boost. The me 7 was a huge technological accomplishment because its an ems that will finally regulate boost to an acceptable degree. The 1.8T was really the first practical, reliable, widely produced gas turbo car and it was due to the advanced controls of the ems. me 7 for n/a cars is nothing in comparison to that of me 7 for f/i cars.
Some tuners made their name with n/a cars and were able to tune s./c. kits and what not and provide good results. However, the 1.8T was never developed to the same extent as the vr was by this company for a good reason I am sure. There were many reports of their attempts but never any fruition.


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
I think this is a good conversation. I hope we can discuss without emotions.

Sure thing. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I appreciate what you wrote and don't disagree entirely, though I do think you make out f/i tuning for n/a applications a bit easier than it probably is.
But your speculation that GIAC hasn't written 1.8T BT software due to their inability to handle the complexity of the ECU seems to be reaching a bit. I mean, this is a company that offers several upgrades for the 996TT and 997TT, so are you saying that tuning the 1.8T is much more difficult than than tuning a Porsche 997TT?
I guess all I'm getting at is that you keep suggesting GIAC may not be up to the task of tuning a 2.0T BT kit, but I look at their credentials and don't come up with the same doubts as you. Absolutely, they still need to establish a track record in the BT market, but to suggest they're in over their heads doesn't seem right to me.


----------



## Binary Star (Mar 27, 2001)

*Re: (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_But your speculation that GIAC hasn't written 1.8T BT software due to their inability to handle the complexity of the ECU seems to be reaching a bit. 

its not that the BT software wasn't written, its just that it wasn't available publicly without specific hardware requirements.


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## TypeGTI (Dec 31, 2004)

*Re: (JettaDude101)*

Just be happy that you have choices... whether it be APR, VF, Revo or GIAC, just be happy. Can't you guys just figure it out, whether you have a custom kit on a MK 2, a STI, a blown Mustang, or a APR VW. We all do this for the same reason...


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## VRsexxy (Apr 1, 2004)

*Re: (JettaDude101)*

I'm surprised to read some of these remarks. I have had nothing but excellent experiences with VF and GIAC in the past. I've had a GIAC-tuned VF blower on my 24v GTI which ran flawlessly for 25k miles before getting my new car. Customer service VF has been second to none (and I have heard the same from many others). My current car has a GIAC flash and again...perfection.
I have been following VF's development of the new RS/S and RS/R kits and I have no reason to believe that they would settle for anything less than perfection. VF's engineering dept. is extremely capable and I feel the same way about GIAC. There is no reason to think that their new turbo kits would not live up to their excellent reputation that they have established with their supercharger kits.
Just my two cents. I hope this thread can stay on topic.
That said, cheers to the boys at APR for what looks like a very nice kit







.


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## Faerus (May 7, 2006)

Not to open a whole new can of worms, but can you explain why you (APR) have chosen to simply add rods for your Stage 3+ while VF/GIAC have chosen rods and pistons for their Stage 3+ equivalent. Not that this is a bad choice on APR's part as I trust their reliability considering there are many happy Stage 3+ 1.8T users, just wanting to know







.


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## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
And who of the named tuners didnt have sucessfull BT software?

the ones who no longer offer SW (k04 isn't "BT" SW)

_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
If you do some searches on Audizine under my name you'll see that i gave APR way more **** then i'm giving GIAC now.
I have never had APR tuning or any other APR parts on my car. I'm currently running REVO and had also Neuspeed and GIAC on my car. 
Reason I'm doing this is because *i've seen GIAC cars granade left and right,* 

no you haven't. you've seen stories on boards, and decide to spread the word of what you heard, and visualized. we've all seen APR stg3/3+ cars grenade too...doesn't mean APR makes a bad kit. it means these tuners get http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for continuing to push the limit, and GIAC is no exception.


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## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
no you haven't. you've seen stories on boards, and decide to spread the word of what you heard, and visualized. we've all seen APR stg3/3+ cars grenade too...doesn't mean APR makes a bad kit. it means these tuners get http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for continuing to push the limit, and GIAC is no exception. 

Haha, yeah seriously... He made it sound like he was going down the road and saw 6 giac cars explode on the trip home.


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## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: (Faerus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Faerus* »_Not to open a whole new can of worms, but can you explain why you (APR) have chosen to simply add rods for your Stage 3+ while VF/GIAC have chosen rods and pistons for their Stage 3+ equivalent. Not that this is a bad choice on APR's part as I trust their reliability considering there are many happy Stage 3+ 1.8T users, just wanting to know







.

The stock pistons manufactured by Mahle are already high-quality die cast forged pistons made from an Alum Alloy consisting of magnesium and silicone that are capable to withstand high temps and cyl pressures.

_Quote, originally posted by *Mahle* »_








The ECOFORM® piston concept developed by MAHLE for cast pistons opens up new opportunities for weight reduction. With this concept, a new casting technology in the pin axis enables large recesses for the ring belt and hence a considerable reduction in the piston weight. In comparison with pistons from 1996, a reduction between 20 and 25 percent of the oscillating masses can be achieved with the combination of MAHLE ECOFORM® pistons and keystone connecting rods. The inclination of the box walls enables relatively large skirt widths in the lower region and improves the stress distribution in the support area. Compared with only inclined drawn side cores, the weight reduction turns out to be greater and the flow of force in the pin boss is not disrupted.



















_Modified by Don R at 9:41 AM 1-5-2007_


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (Faerus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Faerus* »_Not to open a whole new can of worms, but can you explain why you (APR) have chosen to simply add rods for your Stage 3+ while VF/GIAC have chosen rods and pistons for their Stage 3+ equivalent. Not that this is a bad choice on APR's part as I trust their reliability considering there are many happy Stage 3+ 1.8T users, just wanting to know







.

Because APR doesn't need to drop the compression in order to properly tune the 2.0t with GT28RS.


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
the ones who no longer offer SW (k04 isn't "BT" SW)
no you haven't. you've seen stories on boards, and decide to spread the word of what you heard, and visualized. we've all seen APR stg3/3+ cars grenade too...doesn't mean APR makes a bad kit. it means these tuners get http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for continuing to push the limit, and GIAC is no exception. 

Actually my good friends B5 granaded with just GIAC chip and everything else stock on it.
Not sure who no longer offers BT software, can you please elaborate.
Thanks


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## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
APR, REVO, MTM, Sportec, Dahlback and few others had 1.8t BT software some 2.5-3 years before GIAC came up with one.


show me a successful "BT" dbr, mtm, and even sportec car. not just a website which lists what they were able to accomplish with some tuning. an ACTUAL car that is successfully running it.

_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Actually my good friends B5 granaded with just GIAC chip and everything else stock on it.
Not sure who no longer offers BT software, can you please elaborate.
Thanks

and that can be said for ANY sw company out there. i mean, i know your friends car was deff properly maintained, and never beaten on....


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## TRTLspd (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Because APR doesn't need to drop the compression in order to properly tune the 2.0t with GT28RS. 

oooooh APR doesn't need to drop the compression... thats a big slap in VF's face huh? OMG OMG OMG... you are so awsome... can i be your friend?


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## TRTLspd (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_Reason I'm doing this is because i've seen GIAC cars granade left and right, 


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Actually my good friends B5 granaded with just GIAC chip and everything else stock on it.
Not sure who no longer offers BT software, can you please elaborate.
Thanks

hummm... so i guess that your friends car, you must've seen on the left. which car did you see on the right?


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

I just wanted to point out that it's been *TWO WEEKS* since this thread started.


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## magilson (Apr 18, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_I just wanted to point out that it's been *TWO WEEKS* since this thread started.









Wait so how many times has the planet rotated since then? 1..2..3..4... 14! 14 times! Ah Ah Ah Ah!


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: (TRTLspd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TRTLspd* »_
oooooh APR doesn't need to drop the compression... thats a big slap in VF's face huh? OMG OMG OMG... you are so awsome... can i be your friend?










And the VF thread with the options, you can do it without lowering the compression. Did a little zbird forget that, or is he just turbo trolling without the facts?
*RS/S: GT28RS turbo + VF cast manifold + injectors + rail pump + GIAC 91 octane software (+ exhaust and I/C extra-cost options). 300-whp, $5250 retail.*
Of course, they will offer a strengthened *option*, too. 
*RS/R: RS/S + rods and pistons (for increased strength and lower compression) + I/C. Currently, we're consistently achieving 350-whp and 310 lb-ft of torque at the wheels.*
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2886906


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (TRTLspd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TRTLspd* »_oooooh APR doesn't need to drop the compression... thats a big slap in VF's face huh? OMG OMG OMG... you are so awsome... can i be your friend?









Its not a slap in the face at all, its a matter of fact.
Fact is:
1. VF/GIAC are dropping engine compression ration in order to get the kit to work
2. APR is keeping stock compression ratio an getting kit to work.
Looking forward to REVO's BT tuning to see if they also have to drop the CR... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Fact is:
1. VF/GIAC are dropping engine compression ration in order to get the kit to work


Not a fact.
Check a few posts up and the reference to the VF FACTS. 
edit: I like recycling:
And the VF thread with the options, you can do it without lowering the compression. Did a little zbird forget that, or is he just turbo trolling without the facts?
*RS/S: GT28RS turbo + VF cast manifold + injectors + rail pump + GIAC 91 octane software (+ exhaust and I/C extra-cost options). 300-whp, $5250 retail.*
Of course, they will offer a strengthened *option*, too. 
*RS/R: RS/S + rods and pistons (for increased strength and lower compression) + I/C. Currently, we're consistently achieving 350-whp and 310 lb-ft of torque at the wheels.*
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2886906


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## TRTLspd (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Its not a slap in the face at all, its a matter of fact.
Fact is:
1. VF/GIAC are dropping engine compression ration in order to get the kit to work
2. APR is keeping stock compression ratio an getting kit to work.


you must be the most intelligent person on vortex! please read the post above yours and then rewrite the FACTS!!! 
the fact is, no one has to drop the engine compression to get the kit to work







... they are offering it as an extra option... 
do you know the meaning of extra options? here is an example for you: in a VW GTI, wheels and tires are standard but a navigation is an option. get it?


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## Faerus (May 7, 2006)

*Re: (Don R)*

Thanks for the info Don R, very informative! That's the kind of information I like reading, not stuff like blah blah blah they don't have to. I understand they don't have to use new pistons or they would, I was just wondering why they didn't a benefit enough from it to offer it as an option as VF/GIAC have.


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## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Do I owe you a set of coolant lines? Give me a call and I'll get them out to you. http://****************.com/smile/emgift.gif 

really? I had to purchase mine for like 200 bucks.....


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (T-Boy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *T-Boy* »_
really? I had to purchase mine for like 200 bucks.....









that was in reference to his vague mentioning of the coolant lines was all.


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_
Sure thing. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I appreciate what you wrote and don't disagree entirely, though I do think you make out f/i tuning for n/a applications a bit easier than it probably is.
But your speculation that GIAC hasn't written 1.8T BT software due to their inability to handle the complexity of the ECU seems to be reaching a bit. I mean, this is a company that offers several upgrades for the 996TT and 997TT, so are you saying that tuning the 1.8T is much more difficult than than tuning a Porsche 997TT?
I guess all I'm getting at is that you keep suggesting GIAC may not be up to the task of tuning a 2.0T BT kit, but I look at their credentials and don't come up with the same doubts as you. Absolutely, they still need to establish a track record in the BT market, but to suggest they're in over their heads doesn't seem right to me.

the cost of a vehicle does not determine the complexity of the recalibration. the 997t went very smoothly for our engineers, another day at the office. if you notice our porsche link has "changes coming" attached to it







the vehicles that are mapped for certain hardware and you then change that hardware are very difficult. you have to know how to work with all of those maps. on a n/a going to f/i those maps aren't there. so you don't have to change them just the ones that were there for the n/a stuff, peice of cake.
ecu recalibration with no hardware changes is easier on almost any car than one that has had hardware changes. if the hardware changes aren't something controlled by the ecu, then its still easy. However, if you change hardware that is controlled by the ecu, you have to know how all of those maps work with each other.


_Modified by [email protected] at 2:54 PM 1-5-2007_


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (Faerus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Faerus* »_Not to open a whole new can of worms, but can you explain why you (APR) have chosen to simply add rods for your Stage 3+ while VF/GIAC have chosen rods and pistons for their Stage 3+ equivalent. Not that this is a bad choice on APR's part as I trust their reliability considering there are many happy Stage 3+ 1.8T users, just wanting to know







.

From my experience, the reason for changing pistons is to lower compression, increase ability to resist damage from detonation or last longer in higher heat situations. none of these possible issues arise from our recalibration. basically, no need to fix something unless its broken or the possibility of breaking is a concern.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
From my experience, the reason for changing pistons is to lower compression, * increase ability to resist damage from detonation or last longer in higher heat situations. * 
 
To keep it simple "AKA" it just give more saftey margin for poor tuning







. Dont know why you would need upgrade in pistons and rods for under 400 WHP/WTQ. Ill put that extra $3K
toward suspension ,LSD , clutch , etc . If its not broken dont fix it LOL IMO







Bob.G


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## therealvrt (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
From my experience, the reason for changing pistons is to lower compression, increase ability to resist damage from detonation or last longer in higher heat situations. none of these possible issues arise from our recalibration. basically, no need to fix something unless its broken or the possibility of breaking is a concern.

wow 
you guys are the best!!!!
i can't believe i have being modifing VW's for 13+ years and never used any of your products, what was i thinking!!!
can you please help


_Modified by .therealvrt at 11:53 PM 1-5-2007_


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## Faerus (May 7, 2006)

Since you will be providing a downpipe with your BT, will it include your 100 cell cat and then cost less to get a cat-delete or do you pay extra for the cat? What options cat wise are you going to offer on the downpipe since the stock/aftermarket ones will not fit.


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## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: (Faerus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Faerus* »_Thanks for the info Don R, very informative! That's the kind of information I like reading, not stuff like blah blah blah they don't have to. I understand they don't have to use new pistons or they would, I was just wondering why they didn't a benefit enough from it to offer it as an option as VF/GIAC have.

No prob, http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## [email protected] (Aug 26, 2001)

*Re: (Don R)*

For those that don't know, I am an original founder of APR and have overseen the engineering/development efforts at APR since it's inception. I will attempt to address some of the questions posed here:
Lowering compression for the turbo kit is preferable in an ideal world but not as practical in a real world scenario. Besides the labor and component cost to R&R pistons/connecting rods all cars with more than ~10k miles would likely require a rehone/boring. To do this correctly the entire engine would have to be dismantled. Very low mileage engines would likely have enough cross-hatch left to eliminate this step (and would 'only' incur the cost of the pistons/rods and R&R) but those who don't would be looking at thousands of dollars in extra costs. This being the case, it should be quite obvious why we looked at this situation quite seriously and diligently.
I think this is an appropriate time to address the issue of resources: simply put, no one in this market can match the access to resources or the level of technology that we put into our products- period. Not only did we pioneer many of these technologies to the market we actually have these technologies in house, such as stereolithography. Those of you who have been around the market long enough know that in 2000 there was only one company offering multiple engine program switching to this market- APR. Over time other companies developed their systems but we were the pioneers. This is just one example. We thrive on being the technology leader in this industry and the end result is positive for all enthusiasts whether you use our products or not. In doing so we have accumulated a great deal of engineering and technological resources in house. But we also have direct lines to outside resources. The 2.0T turbo kit was developed with Volkswagen N.A.- we had full access to the factory CAD geometry. This geometry was used to create a Pro/E assembly upon which we were able to design the turbo kit and other components. End result: parts that fit perfectly. We also have links to virtually every component supplier of interest and have dealt with some for many years. Don't forget we also acquired Oettinger, the oldest VW tuner in existence, awhile back. Anyways, the point of all this is that we have the resources, both internally and externally, to produce unrivalled products.
Back to the piston discussion: The overall objective with the kit is to produce a product that is reliable, drivable, and has optimum performance for the best bang-for-the-buck ratio. Yes, some of you may say that our stuff is already too expensive, I realize that (but disagree.) We are taking an engine (car) that was designed for a certain set of criteria and power level and we are altering that drastically. In doing so we must be as efficient as possible- replace the weak components, keep the strong components and as many of the adequate components as possible. In order to do this we must apply sound engineering principles and research every questionable component. Naturally, we have spoken to the original manufacturers on the piston issues. The S3 pistons are a more ideal piston for this application. They are lower compression (most importantly) and have a 1mm larger wristpin (nominal strength increase.) But the stock pistons work and they work well (look at the track and power numbers in the latest issue of Sport Compact Car.) Very careful calibration is the key to making the stock pistons work, especially on pump fuel. We have no reservations in making the power numbers that we have on stock pistons. This is provided that the calibration is excellent. I cannot stress enough how important calibration is to overall engine longevity on this motor. We have put a great deal of effort into understanding this engine, both from a mechanical and engine management point of view.
Note that when I say engine management I mean the actual structure of the engine calculations, theory behind that structure, and methodology of calibration. I am NOT refering to the electronic aspect of engine control- electronic layout, checksum calculations, communication protocols, EEPROM flashing, etc. These are two entirely separate fields and they should be treated separately. If your lead calibrator is also your lead programmer than you have serious problems! Either your calibration or your programming will suffer. The background of a top notch calibrator will be entirely different than the background of a top programmer.
Back to the topic, it is so critical that the mechanical and engine management (as described above) understandings of the powerplant are linked together because they are inseparable if the engine is turning. Many of the stresses placed on the engine components, both mechanical and thermal, are directly related to how well this overall picture is understood and how well the engine calibration represents this understanding. We feel we really excel in this area.
The connecting rods are likely to be the first true limiter on this engine. Although information is available on the connecting rods, we are performing our own tests to determine the actual limits. More on this when we can speak definitively.
Lastly, I would like to mention that kit options will be available from APR. We have not officially released any prices or option information at this point. Just like the 1.8T, connecting rod and piston options will be made available, as will a killer intercooling setup. Some extreme tunes (special fuels, etc.) may require additional components. Down the road even more extreme setups will likely be available as well. Thanks!


----------



## VRsexxy (Apr 1, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Lowering compression for the turbo kit is preferable in an ideal world...

nice to hear from a REAL source.

_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Lastly, I would like to mention that kit options will be available from APR. We have not officially released any prices or option information at this point. Just like the 1.8T, connecting rod and piston options will be made available, as will a killer intercooling setup. Some extreme tunes (special fuels, etc.) may require additional components. Down the road even more extreme setups will likely be available as well. Thanks!

Options, you say? Sounds nice. Its good to have choices.

_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Its not a slap in the face at all, its a matter of fact.
Fact is:
1. VF/GIAC are dropping engine compression ration in order to get the kit to work
2. APR is keeping stock compression ratio an getting kit to work.
Looking forward to REVO's BT tuning to see if they also have to drop the CR... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 















Its not about getting it to work, its about making it optimal. Maybe you'll calm dowm a little.


_Modified by VRsexxy at 12:59 PM 1-6-2007_


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (VRsexxy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VRsexxy* »_














Its not about getting it to work, its about making it optimal. Maybe you'll calm dowm a little.

_Modified by VRsexxy at 12:59 PM 1-6-2007_

Is taking the engine out and replacing, rods, pistons and honing optimal, when you can just replace rods with engine still in car.
Were talking about cost of 10+ more hours in labor and set of pistons here.


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Is taking the engine out and replacing, rods, pistons and honing optimal, when you can just replace rods with engine still in car.
Were talking about cost of 10+ more hours in labor and set of pistons here.

you can thank VF later on when you're ready to pioneer a 35r. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
you can thank VF later on when you're ready to pioneer a 35r. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif o wait...you prolly will never pioneer anything in your life. 

o wait...I prolly will never pioneer anything in my life
So they're selling upgraded pistons to prep you for GT35r...








I don't think so bud.
BTW not all of us wanna hit 20 psi at 4.5k rpm's


_Modified by zemun2 at 2:17 PM 1-6-2007_


----------



## Bastard (Jul 3, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
380-450 depending on fuel qaulity and internal strength.


Now THAT is funny.
So this kit will work perfectly fine with no issues right up to when the motor blows up.


----------



## Bastard (Jul 3, 2003)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Its not a slap in the face at all, its a matter of fact.
Fact is:
1. VF/GIAC are dropping engine compression ration in order to get the kit to work
2. APR is keeping stock compression ratio an getting kit to work.
Looking forward to REVO's BT tuning to see if they also have to drop the CR... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


This is utter nonsense. VF is doing things the safe way. They would prefer not to have a long line of of internet babies crying about their blown up engines. VF is proceeding along the lines of what they know. And APR is proceeding along the lines of what they THINK they know.


----------



## Bastard (Jul 3, 2003)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
you can thank VF later on when you're ready to pioneer a 35r. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

And when the APR nutswingers start breaking things and people start pointing fingers at everything and everyone but the parts they should have replaced.


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
o wait...I prolly will never pioneer anything in my life
So they're selling upgraded pistons to prep you for GT35r...








I don't think so bud.
BTW not all of us wanna hit 20 psi at 4.5k rpm's

_Modified by zemun2 at 2:17 PM 1-6-2007_

go find out for us. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Bastard (Jul 3, 2003)

*Re: (Faerus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Faerus* »_Thanks for the info Don R, very informative! That's the kind of information I like reading, not stuff like blah blah blah they don't have to. I understand they don't have to use new pistons or they would, I was just wondering why they didn't a benefit enough from it to offer it as an option as VF/GIAC have.


Something to ponder: If these stock pistons are sooooo great. Why on EARTH would a major tuning company choose to toss em onto midden heap and replace them?


----------



## Bastard (Jul 3, 2003)

*Re: (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_ a downturn has the same amount of sealing surface as an adaptor plate.









wned:

LOL i love this thread


----------



## iThread (Sep 27, 2005)

This is getting old.
How about the VF camp stays in the VF topic and the APR camp stays in the APR topic.
It's getting tiresome trying to maintain order in each and I don't want to lock either one of them.


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: (Bastard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Bastard* »_

This is utter nonsense. VF is doing things the safe way. They would prefer not to have a long line of of internet babies crying about their blown up engines. VF is proceeding along the lines of what they know. And APR is proceeding along the lines of what they THINK they know.

What they think they know? You're forgetting that this is APR's 3rd BT kit on already FI engine, where VF has not had a single kit for already FI engines.


----------



## VRsexxy (Apr 1, 2004)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
Is taking the engine out and replacing, rods, pistons and honing optimal, when you can just replace rods with engine still in car.
Were talking about cost of 10+ more hours in labor and set of pistons here.

And thats why its a definitive staged upgrade. You have a choice.


----------



## [email protected] (Aug 26, 2001)

*Re: (iThread)*

Moderator, we won't care if you lock this topic so please do so if you wish. I prefer to let our products speak for themselves. Some of our guys get ancy and can't help but spill the beans. I much prefer to hold on to things until they are ready for consumption.







Our 2.0T kit represented itself well at the GTI Challenge and will do the same when it's released. Until then, this is all talk...


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (Bastard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Bastard* »_

Something to ponder: If these stock pistons are sooooo great. Why on EARTH would a major tuning company choose to toss em onto midden heap and replace them?
 
I think that's the reason for his question . 
FYI for comparison Bob Q engine dyno tested 716HP with STOCK 1.8T piston , so i would say the 2L piston can handle the task for 400WHP espec when you take in account from the document Don posted showing the 2L TFSI piston cylinder pressure rated 30% higher than the 1.8T piston .







Bob.G


----------



## iThread (Sep 27, 2005)

Thanks Brett, I'll let this one rool and see what happens. Unles you're telling me to lock it








Even though Keith is the OP, it's your companies topic.


----------



## Bastard (Jul 3, 2003)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_
What they think they know? You're forgetting that this is APR's 3rd BT kit on already FI engine, where VF has not had a single kit for already FI engines.

Learn to read between the lines. Thats all I can say on the subject.


----------



## aussie audi guy (Jan 28, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_









Keith, I go away for 2 WEEKS holiday & finally you get some clear pictures - good work & email some more nice pics


----------



## FlyingTurtle (Mar 26, 2006)

*Re: (Bastard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Bastard* »_
Learn to read between the lines. Thats all I can say on the subject.


----------



## DubDriver17 (Feb 29, 2004)

*Re: (AbtSportsline)*

Will you guys be offering parts like the injectors and the fuel rail as "a la carte" parts, and will they make much of a difference in a stage 2 tuned car?


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (DubDriver17)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DubDriver17* »_Will you guys be offering parts like the injectors and the fuel rail as "a la carte" parts, and will they make much of a difference in a stage 2 tuned car?

x2


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (DubDriver17)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DubDriver17* »_Will you guys be offering parts like the injectors and the fuel rail as "a la carte" parts, and will they make much of a difference in a stage 2 tuned car?
 
Only to confirmed APR software customers LOL







Bob.G


----------



## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

I think that 2871R needs to be upgraded to a GT3071R or even a 3076R-10/11







30R turbine wheels have a nice seemless power curve.


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (Don R)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Don R* »_I think that 2871R needs to be upgraded to a GT3071R or even a 3076R-10/11







30R turbine wheels have a nice seemless power curve.

i would assume APR would leave the 30r wheels to their motorsports packages. and the 76r with a t25...ugh.


----------



## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: (mirror)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirror* »_
i would assume APR would leave the 30r wheels to their motorsports packages. and the 76r with a t25...ugh. 

Th GT3076R-10/11 use a 56.5mm turbine wheel in either a .84 trim or 90 trim same as what the GT3071R uses.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (Don R)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Don R* »_ * a 3076R-10/11







divided housing* 30R turbine wheels have a nice seemless power curve.
 
I fixed that one for you Don LOL







Bob.G


----------



## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
I fixed that one for you Don LOL







Bob.G

Oh well, there you go







Thanks!


----------



## DubDriver17 (Feb 29, 2004)

*Re: (DubDriver17)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DubDriver17* »_Will you guys be offering parts like the injectors and the fuel rail as "a la carte" parts, and will they make much of a difference in a stage 2 tuned car?

I have the Stage 2 beta program, but this question kinda got ignored. Any info on this APR?


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (Don R)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Don R* »_
Th GT3076R-10/11 use a 56.5mm turbine wheel in either a .84 trim or 90 trim same as what the GT3071R uses.

84 trim. nothing like choking that turbo up.


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Very nice how much


----------



## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Very nice how much 

One million dollars....


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Very nice how much 

x2


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (DubDriver17)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DubDriver17* »_Will you guys be offering parts like the injectors and the fuel rail as "a la carte" parts, and will they make much of a difference in a stage 2 tuned car?

We are completing some testing and are exploring the opportunity to do just that.
The fuel pump would be important to Stage 2 and ko4 cars. The fuel pump on the ko4 is making some very nice power, gt28rs like power even.
On Stage 2 cars I think we might see a small increase in both torque and power peak to peak but the area under the curve increases are very nice. 25lb ft and 15 or so hp in the low end to midrange.


----------



## WetWagen (Apr 23, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
We are completing some testing and are exploring the opportunity to do just that.
The fuel pump would be important to Stage 2 and ko4 cars. The fuel pump on the ko4 is making some very nice power, gt28rs like power even.
On Stage 2 cars I think we might see a small increase in both torque and power peak to peak but the area under the curve increases are very nice. 25lb ft and 15 or so hp in the low end to midrange.

So uhh... ummm... when will the APR all wheel drive kits be available?










_Modified by (mkV)Jetta2.0t at 1:26 PM 1-11-2007_


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
On Stage 2 cars I think we might see a small increase in both torque and power peak to peak but the area under the curve increases are very nice. 25lb ft and 15 or so hp in the low end to midrange.
 
I would have to agree , i just need bigger pump Keith too find this out







Bob.G


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
The fuel pump would be important to Stage 2 and ko4 cars. The fuel pump on the ko4 is making some very nice power, gt28rs like power even.
On Stage 2 cars I think we might see a small increase in both torque and power peak to peak but the area under the curve increases are very nice. 25lb ft and 15 or so hp in the low end to midrange.

i can't wait to slap one on my stg.2







put me on the waiting list http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
and if the k04 was almost making 300 crank hp and 320 ft/lbs before whats it up to now i am excited to kno


_Modified by [email protected] at 11:23 AM 1-11-2007_


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

any pricing updates?


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
We are completing some testing and are exploring the opportunity to do just that.
The fuel pump would be important to Stage 2 and ko4 cars. The fuel pump on the ko4 is making some very nice power, gt28rs like power even.
On Stage 2 cars I think we might see a small increase in both torque and power peak to peak but the area under the curve increases are very nice. 25lb ft and 15 or so hp in the low end to midrange.

Any updates on this testing or anything new to report on the pricing/availability of your Stage III kit?
JJ


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_
Any updates on this testing or anything new to report on the pricing/availability of your Stage III kit?
JJ
 
Here is a little update for those people in the southeast region









_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_APR will be in attendance as well with our 400hp Project SEMA MK5 GTI.
Come out and see the world's most powerful 2.0T FSI in action at the track!
We will also be avialable with our mobile operations center for ecu upgrades and customer support during the event!

 

Here is the full link to the thread
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3028085


----------



## five0vw (May 21, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

Im surprised this thread is still going. I am very excited for the kits release. Cant wait to sport the APR logo on my mkV. Be prepared for some very attractive 1/4 mile times from me.








I am a Revo guy and so is my g/f. We are very happy w/Revo because it has not let us down and has performed pretty strong! I am anticipating APRs setup to be as reliable if not better! More of a Linear power curve making it better for track situations and better for the overall wear on the chasis. Until we get this kit on ppls cars lets keep the speculation down. I know that alot of you have or think you have extensive tuning knowledge, but lets leave this thread up to APRs people. If you know whats best start your own thread or start your own company and become Pioneers yourself. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for APRs long standing history!


----------



## five0vw (May 21, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Very nice how much 

I meant to post this in my first reply for ya.








Very nice how much??


----------



## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

would this fuel pump be compatable with revo?


----------



## wunderman4 (Apr 27, 2006)

I want 400hp......


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (dubbkidd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dubbkidd* »_would this fuel pump be compatable with revo?

i think it is only going to be available to comfirmed apr owners, apr is the company that did all the research and had these new parts manufactured for them so i think revo and giac customers are on their own..but you never kno they might play nice and help out the people that decide to go revo or giac=)


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_giac customers are on their own..

GIAC/VF have their own pump...


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_
GIAC/VF have their own pump...

i stand corrected i have not bin following their post so i was unaware


----------



## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

ohhh....wait........so for ppl with stg2, they can increase their power by adding this larger fuel pump?


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Not sure if it's been asked or covered yet, I glanced through the posts but didn't see it. Can we expect the install to be comparable to the 1.8T stage III kit install? (complexity and time required?)
Thanks,
JJ


----------



## dubbkidd (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: (dubbkidd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dubbkidd* »_ohhh....wait........so for ppl with stg2, they can increase their power by adding this larger fuel pump?


bump


----------



## shady12v (Oct 14, 2004)

*Re: (dubbkidd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dubbkidd* »_ohhh....wait........so for ppl with stg2, they can increase their power by adding this larger fuel pump?

yes....but how much power is to be determined.
Think about it. The most powerful file (stage2 Beta) is limited by its fuel cuts. Once the fuel situation is addressed then they will be able to squeeze some more power out of the stock turbo.
I am looking forward to the release of the pump and truely hope that it will not be super expensive.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (shady12v)*

updates


----------



## c1rcausa (Sep 2, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_updates









x2


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (c1rcausa)*

Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war!


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Time for an update I think... pricing, timing? 
Any news on testing the limits of internals?? 
Come on, throw us a bone... 
JJ


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_Time for an update I think... pricing, timing? 
Any news on testing the limits of internals?? 
Come on, throw us a bone... 
JJ
 
Dealer conference / BBQ is any day now there should be some info leaked out then







Bob.G


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

well the apr dealer conference was today, hopefully we'll get some news on the kit soon.


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (prodigymb)*

I wish. I also really want an upgraded fuel pump


----------



## wamatt (Mar 9, 2006)

is it worth waiting for this over the K04 kit?
Is this BT setup going to introduce more lag than the stock or k04? 
Will it be available in the next month?


----------



## [email protected] (Feb 7, 2006)

*Re: (wamatt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wamatt* »_is it worth waiting for this over the K04 kit?
Is this BT setup going to introduce more lag than the stock or k04? 
Will it be available in the next month?

Definitely worth waiting for!
Turbo lag is minimal with this kit. Onset is early.
No project date just yet, but they are indeed VERY close.


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

APR, what's the word? What's your estimated dates? And the million dollar question (to some of us) will you be developing a longitudinal version for us A4 owners that can easily put this power to the ground


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Anything? .. Anything? .. Beuller? .. Beuller?


----------



## wamatt (Mar 9, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_Anything? .. Anything? .. Beuller? .. Beuller? 

ROFL - my fav line in FBDO


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_APR, what's the word? What's your estimated dates? And the million dollar question (to some of us) will you be developing a longitudinal version for us A4 owners that can easily put this power to the ground









As for the transverse application we are looking at a close to confirmed release pricing estimate of $5500. Tentatively, we will release the kit at approx. 370hp on oem internals with a 400hp calibration available to those who install rods.
The A4 will be released after the transverse applications, I don't have a good eta quite yet!


----------



## Branman (Oct 6, 2004)

wow not bad at all


----------



## NS01GTI (Jan 31, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
As for the transverse application we are looking at a close to confirmed release pricing estimate of $5500. Tentatively, we will release the kit at approx. 370hp on oem internals with a 400hp calibration available to those who install rods.
The A4 will be released after the transverse applications, I don't have a good eta quite yet!









Can we expect any kind of price change on the 2.0T K04 kits with the release of the Stage 3?


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
As for the transverse application we are looking at a close to confirmed release pricing estimate of $5500. Tentatively, we will release the kit at approx. 370hp on oem internals with a 400hp calibration available to those who install rods.
The A4 will be released after the transverse applications, I don't have a good eta quite yet!









jesus! that's outstanding news. Now hurry with the longitudinal! You just made me want this more w/ that kind of price


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
As for the transverse application we are looking at a close to confirmed release pricing estimate of $5500. Tentatively, we will release the kit at approx. 370hp on oem internals with a 400hp calibration available to those who install rods.
The A4 will be released after the transverse applications, I don't have a good eta quite yet!









Yeah not bad... the next question is when can we start ordering?


----------



## wamatt (Mar 9, 2006)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*

I would like to order today please.


----------



## wamatt (Mar 9, 2006)

can we preorder?


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (NS01GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NS01GTI* »_
Can we expect any kind of price change on the 2.0T K04 kits with the release of the Stage 3? 

no but you can expect more power from them with a fuel pump to take you closer to 320hp.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_
Yeah not bad... the next question is when can we start ordering?









Some of our distributors have begun taking deposits. If you would like to contact your closest APR distributor to find out follow this link http://www.goapr.com/VW/dealer/locator.php
Off the top of my head, I know NGP and German Motoring are!


----------



## Branman (Oct 6, 2004)

what about the beta file runners any plans for the pump upgrade


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (Branman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Branman* »_what about the beta file runners any plans for the pump upgrade 

yes, my GTi is going to have the beta recalibrated to become production and then we will add the fuel pump. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

prices on the fuel pump?


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_prices on the fuel pump?

$1k'ish.


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
$1k'ish.

*cough* *cough*






















What was that again ???
Is that in YEN ??


----------



## bigbumpmike (Aug 26, 2003)

i would be intrested in if it would give me over the 250whp mark i would be happy right now makeing 236whp off stage 2 revo and intake and catless open exhuast


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
$1k'ish.

satan! satan! That's pretty hefty. Will k04 people get it free or discounted? Otherwise they're paying 200 less than stage 3


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
satan! satan! That's pretty hefty. Will k04 people get it free or discounted? Otherwise they're paying 200 less than stage 3

So true....
And still the price of a k04 is way up there


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
satan! satan! That's pretty hefty. Will k04 people get it free or discounted? Otherwise they're paying 200 less than stage 3

We haven't worked out all of the pricing quite yet. we will know more as the release approaches.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
$1k'ish.
 
one word WOW


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
one word WOW









Does that sound much ???
NOOOOOO....
Just imagine buying a K04 kit for ~4000 bucks only to find out THE PUMP you need costs 1/4 of the kit itself....


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_
Just imagine buying a K04 kit for ~4000 bucks only to find out THE PUMP you need costs 1/4 of the kit itself....



















































More importantly a fuel pump upgrade will be needed even in a CHIPPED cars because this is a mechanical pump, that was built with little too no head room so after lets say as little as 25K miles worth of wear and tear on the OEM pump, fuel pressure/ pump leakage, you will experience fuel cut, no if or ands about it !!!!!!.
The software tuner that doesn't address this issue will suffer long term IMO remember there alot life span left in this motor , its fairly in its infancy of life .
IMO what ever tuner steps up and comes up with a reasonably priced pump / fueling solution is going to dominate the long term in the 2L FSI performance chip market even thou that tuner may not have the BEST performance software out there.







Bob.G


----------



## Branman (Oct 6, 2004)

so what kind of power might we expect from production beta file with the fuel pump. I would imagine no fuel cut at least.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (Branman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Branman* »_so what kind of power might we expect from production beta file with the fuel pump. I would imagine no fuel cut at least.

Certainly no fuel cut. I will have more info in the next couple of weeks or so.


----------



## Branman (Oct 6, 2004)

great thanks Keith


----------



## nemo1ner (May 5, 2004)

*Re: (bluelagoon1)*

As soon as this thing is available for the A4, I will bring evil to the garden state parkway....muuuaahahahaha!!!


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (nemo1ner)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nemo1ner* »_As soon as this thing is available for the A4, I will bring evil to the garden state parkway....muuuaahahahaha!!!



















Thanks for the laugh, been a rough day!


----------



## bigbumpmike (Aug 26, 2003)

man keith i can't wait tell you start selling these i will have my car back early may from washington state and will be real excited about a new fuel pump.


----------



## Sincity (May 17, 2005)

*Re: (bigbumpmike)*

Ditto on that fuel pump, Keith.


----------



## BucBrew (Feb 28, 2007)

What parts would this kti consist of?


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (BucBrew)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BucBrew* »_What parts would this kti consist of?

Read the first page of this thread. Keith listed what will be in the kit.
JJ


----------



## GTIR6 (Apr 2, 2007)

*Re: (Branman)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## 07_BM_GTI (May 18, 2006)

edit: saw the other thread
parts are starting to arrive










_Modified by 07_BM_GTI at 8:20 PM 4-19-2007_


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: (07_BM_GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *07_BM_GTI* »_so it said the kits were expected to ship around March, so I imagine the date got pushed back. When is the expected release??

end of may for gti/gli/a3


----------



## mithong (Feb 24, 2007)

let me put on my flame suit
but someone please explain to me why you would want this much power through a fwd drivetrain... even with an LSD


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (mithong)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mithong* »_let me put on my flame suit
but someone please explain to me why you would want this much power through a fwd drivetrain... even with an LSD

Fun. 
Look for any deeper meaning and you're doing yourself (and the rest of us) a disservice.


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (mithong)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mithong* »_let me put on my flame suit
but someone please explain to me why you would want this much power through a fwd drivetrain... even with an LSD

Apparently you've never driven a properly set up fwd car or learned to modulate the throttle =]
True, that kind of power is pretty absurd, but I would definitely go to 245 tires in the front and install an lsd. I think that would handle the power alot better. It's obviously not going to be an autocross turbo kit, stock turbo is fine for that, but for road course or just plain vehicular lunacy I think this kit will work out well.


----------



## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: (mithong)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mithong* »_let me put on my flame suit
but someone please explain to me why you would want this much power through a fwd drivetrain... even with an LSD

As stated above me, I feel the same. Mad HP, even without LSD, isn't just an on/off switch. Real drivers can modulate throttle and know how to take lines through corners.
The same could be said about a RWD car. Spin tires all day long in RWD and it's worthless! Especially when throttle.lift.oversteer/fishtailing > you.


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_
As stated above me, I feel the same. Mad HP, even without LSD, isn't just an on/off switch. Real drivers can modulate throttle and know how to take lines through corners.
The same could be said about a RWD car. Spin tires all day long in RWD and it's worthless! Especially when throttle.lift.oversteer/fishtailing > you.

Yes it's all about controlling throttle... with my 1.8T stage III (296whp) once I learnt how the power was delivered I simply used my right foot to keep the tires on the edge of traction while accelerating. It just becomes second nature.
The acceleration in every gear is simply incredible... when 3rd, 4th, 5th etc pull equally as hard all the way to redline and past, you realize how amazing and FUN it really is... 
The thing about the 1.8T kit was it was so driveable! It was as driveable as the day I bought it. In typical APR fashion I'm sure this kit will be very much the same... 
All I can say is if you ever have a chance to get a ride in a stage III car do it... you'll gain a true appreciation for it!
JJ


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Keith,
Looks like you require ECU's to be shipped to APR for the 2.0T stage III kits? Local APR dealers will not be able to program stage III software?
Thanks!
JJ


----------



## edisonr (Oct 24, 2003)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*

Update?


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: (edisonr)*

Can I comfortably drive this daily? I put alot of miles on my car.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_Keith,
Looks like you require ECU's to be shipped to APR for the 2.0T stage III kits? Local APR dealers will not be able to program stage III software?
Thanks!
JJ

I am not sure how that will play out as of yet. I will know more towards the release!


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
I am not sure how that will play out as of yet. I will know more towards the release!

Any idea when that is? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (Jim Dangle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim Dangle* »_Can I comfortably drive this daily? I put alot of miles on my car. 

Certainly, or else we won't release it! We don't try to make your car any less drivable with any of our products and we are pretty well known for being one of the few if only companies for vw and audi that make turbo upgrades that are fun and powerful but at the same time your mother can drive them!


----------



## BucBrew (Feb 28, 2007)

How far away is this? I saw a full page ad for the stage3 kit in European Sports Car magazine.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (BucBrew)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BucBrew* »_How far away is this? I saw a full page ad for the stage3 kit in European Sports Car magazine.
 
Yeah Keith stop teasing us LOL







Bob.G


----------



## BucBrew (Feb 28, 2007)

Seriously, check the magazine, full page ad for the stage3 kit.


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: (BucBrew)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BucBrew* »_Seriously, check the magazine, full page ad for the stage3 kit.

that's the 2nd such issue. i think a feb or march issue had the same ad in there


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (bluelagoon1)*

Keith " ARE WE THERE YET "







Bob.G


----------



## FlyingTurtle (Mar 26, 2006)

not yet


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Keith " ARE WE THERE YET "







Bob.G








are we?


----------



## Rub-ISH (Aug 8, 2006)

*Re: (prodigymb)*

1k fuel pump, jesus talk about price gouging I need a fuel pump but I mean a grand is like 2/3rds of my monthly expendable income...
Ouch. I hope someone can do better than that


----------



## csih (Aug 27, 2006)

APR Provides finance...lol


----------



## TypeR #126 (May 10, 2006)

*Re: (Rub-ISH)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rub-ISH* »_1but I mean a grand is like 2/3rds of my monthly expendable income...


Oh to be young and mortgage free again!


----------



## Rub-ISH (Aug 8, 2006)

*Re: (csih)*


_Quote, originally posted by *csih* »_APR Provides finance...lol

Yeah and im sure the rate is a very reasonable 29% http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (Rub-ISH)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rub-ISH* »_
Yeah and im sure the rate is a very reasonable 29% http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
 
Well approx $450.00 month for 12 months @ 0 % intro rate = stage 3 kit =







Bob.G


----------



## ZWStewart (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_i think it is only going to be available to comfirmed apr owners, apr is the company that did all the research and had these new parts manufactured for them so i think revo and giac customers are on their own..but you never kno they might play nice and help out the people that decide to go revo or giac=) 

So, APR wont sell me a fuel pump b/c I don't run there software?


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (ZWStewart)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ZWStewart* »_
So, APR wont sell me a fuel pump b/c I don't run there software? 

no, not at all. We would sell you the pump but your car won't operate correctly until you get some calibration to support the pump. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

So are we still looking at the beginning of June to start shipping kits and is $5500 still looking like the release pricing?
JJ


----------



## ruso (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_no, not at all. We would sell you the pump but your car won't operate correctly until you get some calibration to support the pump. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

So the new pump would be incompatible with say, stock software? This applies to my question I had about the dealer accidentally flashing over a calibrated ECU that was running hardware incompatible with stock software. Looks like APR's going to have to supply some sort of encryption with anything over Stage 1 software.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (ruso)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ruso* »_
So the new pump would be incompatible with say, stock software? This applies to my question I had about the dealer accidentally flashing over a calibrated ECU that was running hardware incompatible with stock software. Looks like APR's going to have to supply some sort of encryption with anything over Stage 1 software.









well, it will be like any mod that includes fueling changes, not that much of an issue for the B6 A4 Stage 1+ guys. I will put some regular ko4 code on my car and see what's up.


----------



## mwwVW (Mar 31, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*

so...any update as to when these kits will be ready and shipping?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (mwwhonda)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mwwhonda* »_so...any update as to when these kits will be ready and shipping?
 
Yeah Keith when my stage 3 kit arriving?? LOL







Bob.G


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (mwwhonda)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mwwhonda* »_so...any update as to when these kits will be ready and shipping?

I hope soon with the Canadian $ as high as it is right now! It's actually half affordable. Watch our $ tank right when they release it.... lol 
JJ


----------



## NS01GTI (Jan 31, 2005)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_
I hope soon with the Canadian $ as high as it is right now! It's actually half affordable. Watch our $ tank right when they release it.... lol 
JJ

That's part of the reason I grabbed my K04 now.








Maybe APR will pre-charge you for it, and put you won a waiting list until it's released?


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (NS01GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NS01GTI* »_
That's part of the reason I grabbed my K04 now.








Maybe APR will pre-charge you for it, and put you won a waiting list until it's released? 

I won't actually be buying directly from APR, I'll be purchasing through H2Sport in Ontario so I can't pay for it until they've paid for it. I need to pay them the CAD equivalent at the time. Buying through them saves me an extra 7% on taxes that I'd otherwise pay if I brought it up myself. (~$500)... so it's a waiting game.
JJ


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*

lets bump this to the top . dont want Keith to forget about it LOL


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 25, 2007)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_lets bump this to the top . dont want Keith to forget about it LOL









Yeah Keith!...


----------



## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

*Price?? *


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: (sasha18T)*

i thought the thread title stated...
*"no vaporware here!!"*


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

we are waiting for the arrival of more castings and such and finishing up some additional features we've added for the final production version.
more info should come soon. I'll keep you posted, I promise, as soon as I get it, you'll get it!


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Additional features? Do tell.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (Jim Dangle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim Dangle* »_Additional features? Do tell.

just some minor tweaks really, I'll get some pics up in a couple of weeks!


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

couple. of. weeks. 

:sigh:


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (Jim Dangle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim Dangle* »_couple. of. weeks. 

:sigh: 

I know, its killing me too. I have to wait just as long as you guys except I get to look at it when I want to but I'm not allowed to touch yet.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
I know, its killing me too. I have to wait just as long as you guys except I get to look at it when I want to but I'm not allowed to touch yet.









Where my big box !!!!


----------



## EurodealerTX (Oct 16, 2006)

Oh to have a product that has THIS MANY gearhead consumers salivating...
I trust you Keith. I'll stay tuned. Here's a bump just in case!
^
-mcs


----------



## dmd2005 (Oct 26, 2005)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*

CDN_MKV I'd wait a little longer, cuz the Canadian economy isn't slowing down anytime soon and the buck will keep on rising throughout the year. Analyst are expecting the Canadian $ to be on par with the US$ BEFORE the end of the year.....and if the Canadian dollar goes above the US$, isn't the Free Trade Agreement working in our favour where there's no duty per NAFTA? 
Just a rumour, but if you're gonna slap on the BT kit, I'd love to see your ride since I'll be moving back to Vancity in the next few months.


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (dmd2005)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dmd2005* »_CDN_MKV I'd wait a little longer, cuz the Canadian economy isn't slowing down anytime soon and the buck will keep on rising throughout the year. Analyst are expecting the Canadian $ to be on par with the US$ BEFORE the end of the year.....and if the Canadian dollar goes above the US$, isn't the Free Trade Agreement working in our favour where there's no duty per NAFTA? 
Just a rumour, but if you're gonna slap on the BT kit, I'd love to see your ride since I'll be moving back to Vancity in the next few months.


There is no duty anyway.... I just pay taxes on the CAD amount. We'll see where it's at when it's released







(Already it's $400 cheaper than it was at the end of last year.)


----------



## jMkV (Jun 9, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

when you guys installed this was the engine out of the car.... if not... did you need to remove an axle to get it out from the bottom?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (jMkV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jMkV* »_when you guys installed this was the engine out of the car.... if not... did you need to remove an axle to get it out from the bottom?

From looking at the space behind the MKV car you prob can do this install all from top.
APR said to do the MK iv Stage 3 + from the bottom and i figure and easy way and did it from the top without removing and axle.
There ALOT more space on the MKV compared to the MKiv car .







Bob.G

p.s. Ill Let you know how hard it is soon enough


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (jMkV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jMkV* »_when you guys installed this was the engine out of the car.... ?
 
The only car ive seen this needed is the 2.7TT S-4







Bob.G


----------



## XM_Rocks (Jan 29, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*

APR - Will you have a test car running the Stage 3 at your new facility?


----------



## NS01GTI (Jan 31, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
From looking at the space behind the MKV car you prob can do this install all from top.
APR said to do the MK iv Stage 3 + from the bottom and i figure and easy way and did it from the top without removing and axle.
There ALOT more space on the MKV compared to the MKiv car .







Bob.G

p.s. Ill Let you know how hard it is soon enough









When when when??


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (NS01GTI)*

I hope to be able to buy the fuel pump first, then when I have enough for the kit be able to do it like that. In steps sorta...


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (XM_Rocks)*


_Quote, originally posted by *XM_Rocks* »_APR - Will you have a test car running the Stage 3 at your new facility?

we will have 3 at least.


----------



## [email protected] (Sep 6, 2006)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Where my big box !!!!








 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
we will have 3 at least.

Fine, I'll do it.


----------



## FlyingTurtle (Mar 26, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (Jim Dangle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim Dangle* »_
Fine, I'll do it.


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (AbtSportsline)*


_Quote, originally posted by *AbtSportsline* »_









And so will he ^


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
we will have 3 at least.

ahem we need one at our facility Keith !


----------



## [email protected] (Feb 7, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
From looking at the space behind the MKV car you prob can do this install all from top.
APR said to do the MK iv Stage 3 + from the bottom and i figure and easy way and did it from the top without removing and axle.
There ALOT more space on the MKV compared to the MKiv car .







Bob.G

p.s. Ill Let you know how hard it is soon enough









You can remove the stock turbo 2 ways. Through the bottom, you have to lower the subframe. Then squeeze it through the tunnel. 
Through the top you have to loosen up the motor mounts and tilt the motor forward a good 5-6". There's more room the MkV, but remember the turbo+manifold is enormous. It's also really heavy so lifting it up and out is a bit more difficult.


----------



## runningoutofspace (Apr 16, 2007)

*Re: (Frankie92481)*

OK, SO I CALLED APR TODAY AND THE SALESMAN SAID: 
::::::::::::::::::::: ITS A "NO" FOR A DSG STAGE III 2.0T:::::::::::::::::
"YOU'D WEAR OUT THE TRANSMISSION AFTER 100 MILES."
NOW, I'M LOOKING FOR AN ALTERNATIVE BECAUSE I READ THAT THE 3.2 DSG's are running fine on HPA's FTS400, SO IT MUST BE POSSIBLE?


----------



## runningoutofspace (Apr 16, 2007)

*Re: (XM_Rocks)*

AND AMERICA'S INVENTIONS MISSED THIS EPISODE.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (runningoutofspace)*


_Quote, originally posted by *runningoutofspace* »_
NOW, I'M LOOKING FOR AN ALTERNATIVE BECAUSE I READ THAT THE 3.2 DSG's are running fine on HPA's FTS400, SO IT MUST BE POSSIBLE?
 
ANYTHING is possible depends want your will to spend for it LOL








I would call HPA FIRST and see how much it will cost for the up-grade to your DSG to hold that kind of power , because the DSG they have in that car has been modifyed. Then if you dont get shocked by the price i would then contact Keith @ APR and MAYBE they would be willing to work with you if you could show them that your DSG has that up-grade and the abilty to hold the power .







Bob.G


----------



## runningoutofspace (Apr 16, 2007)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

I don't even know, but I hope APR or somebody is working on it because I wanted the Stage III - WITHOUT KNOWING THE LIMITS AND ISSUES.
Personally, I think it will be cheaper to install an Dual Quad-core Xeon MacPro onto my ECU just to get it to adjust fast enough.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (runningoutofspace)*


_Quote, originally posted by *runningoutofspace* »_ I wanted the Stage III - WITHOUT KNOWING THE LIMITS AND ISSUES.


Then IMO look for a different kit .
APR is not going to build a product or a "KIT" that's has a question about if its going to hold up or not, just because they can make a profit there reputation is more important .







Bob.G


----------



## WetWagen (Apr 23, 2006)

*Re: (runningoutofspace)*


_Quote, originally posted by *runningoutofspace* »_OK, SO I CALLED APR TODAY AND THE SALESMAN SAID: 
::::::::::::::::::::: ITS A "NO" FOR A DSG STAGE III 2.0T:::::::::::::::::
"YOU'D WEAR OUT THE TRANSMISSION AFTER 100 MILES."
NOW, I'M LOOKING FOR AN ALTERNATIVE BECAUSE I READ THAT THE 3.2 DSG's are running fine on HPA's FTS400, SO IT MUST BE POSSIBLE?

That's crazy. If the software would limit torque to an acceptable number in the midrange, it most certainly should make the horsepower on the top end. 
If the K04 kit can manage just 260 lb/ft through the rev range up at 6000 rpm (the supposed acceptable limit for the DSG), you'll still be making ~297 HP which is well above the K03. 
What gives? It's torque limited, not horsepower (to a point... not sure how the DSG would handle 9000 RPMs)


_Modified by (mkV)Jetta2.0t at 6:06 AM 6-8-2007_


----------



## five0vw (May 21, 2004)

*Re: ((mkV)Jetta2.0t)*

Keith...... PM me for an update.


----------



## runningoutofspace (Apr 16, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Update, just in case you didn't see my other post:
I wanted the Stage III Big Turbo kit from APR for my DSG MKV 2.0T and the guy at APR my shattered my hopes because he said it would wear out the transmission after 100 miles.
No, I'm not questioning their reputation here but I absolutely couldn't give up after that because I've seen the DSG HPA TT that was running their FTS 400 system and I believe someone in Taipei just installed a FTS 450 as well. 
Ok, both cars were 3.2 engines, one had a HPA modified transmission, but the point is that I believe both were DSG engines (atleast one was). 
And I'n not that knowledgeble to know if the amount of torque is enough torque to handle the stage III, but that's not the answer. 
Yet, anything is possible.
So, my next step was to search for a LSD upgrade from HPA, Peliquin and Quaife because I figured a soloution to the problem would start their by going to those who develop aftermarket trans for DSG and in my search - I hit Peloquin and actually got one of the main guys on the phone!
An unnamed informant at Peloquin informed me that Peloquin already has a DSG LSD in the production phase, but are waiting a few months for top secret G14 classified reasons (No!, there's no issues - no speculations please - I DON'T work for them, OK).
Yet he said that in Europe some 2.0T DSGs are handling up to 500hp without issue.
He didn't say anything about the result, but he said its possible.
So, now I'm sounding off for someone out there to prove it to us that the 2.0 and 3.2 DSGs are working with big turbo mods, superchargers and working obviously above 2_ _+ lbs of torque.
Prove it please, but don't use HPA's projects to justify unless you got the full scoop on how the transmission was modified or if you know for sure, it wasn't!
"It only takes one exception to prove a theory wrong"


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (runningoutofspace)*


_Quote, originally posted by *runningoutofspace* »_Update, just in case you didn't see my other post:
I wanted the Stage III Big Turbo kit from APR for my DSG MKV 2.0T and the guy at APR my shattered my hopes because he said it would wear out the transmission after 100 miles.
No, I'm not questioning their reputation here but I absolutely couldn't give up after that because I've seen the DSG HPA TT that was running their FTS 400 system and I believe someone in Taipei just installed a FTS 450 as well. 
Ok, both cars were 3.2 engines, one had a HPA modified transmission, but the point is that I believe both were DSG engines (atleast one was). 
And I'n not that knowledgeble to know if the amount of torque is enough torque to handle the stage III, but that's not the answer. 
Yet, anything is possible.
So, my next step was to search for a LSD upgrade from HPA, Peliquin and Quaife because I figured a soloution to the problem would start their by going to those who develop aftermarket trans for DSG and in my search - I hit Peloquin and actually got one of the main guys on the phone!
An unnamed informant at Peloquin informed me that Peloquin already has a DSG LSD in the production phase, but are waiting a few months for top secret G14 classified reasons (No!, there's no issues - no speculations please - I DON'T work for them, OK).
Yet he said that in Europe some 2.0T DSGs are handling up to 500hp without issue.
He didn't say anything about the result, but he said its possible.
So, now I'm sounding off for someone out there to prove it to us that the 2.0 and 3.2 DSGs are working with big turbo mods, superchargers and working obviously above 2_ _+ lbs of torque.
Prove it please, but don't use HPA's projects to justify unless you got the full scoop on how the transmission was modified or if you know for sure, it wasn't!
"It only takes one exception to prove a theory wrong"

wow. you're really......different. yeah--that's it......different


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*









Race gas, race gas file. Car was spinning on the dyno as you can see from the curve.








Race gas, 93 oct road course file. Notice the flat trq curve.


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

i would take that tq curve anyday.


----------



## FreshieMedia (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (mirror)*

356whp/289wtq on 93 = Very impressive numbers. Can we see the A/F graph?


----------



## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (FreshieMedia)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FreshieMedia* »_356whp/289wtq on 93 = Very impressive numbers. Can we see the A/F graph?
Thats pretty impressive? what turbo? Id like to go with a gt30r, for 400whp on 93 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_








Race gas, race gas file. Car was spinning on the dyno as you can see from the curve.








Race gas, 93 oct road course file. Notice the flat trq curve.
 
Stop teasing!!!!!!!!!!! and start shipping these kits LOL


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (FreshieMedia)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FreshieMedia* »_356whp/289wtq on 93 = Very impressive numbers. Can we see the A/F graph?

no tango, these are the dyno's from the sport compact car article and VoA's GTI Tuner Challenge.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (sasha18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sasha18T* »_Thats pretty impressive? what turbo? Id like to go with a gt30r, for 400whp on 93 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

2871r


----------



## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
2871r

Nice, slightly larger and it will do 400whp on 93 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## FreshieMedia (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (sasha18T)*

Any idea what this would be good for on the 1/4 mile with an average launch on street tires and 93 oct? This looks like it would be a sick road car with torque available at just about any RPM and an engine that does not quit on the top end http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif , but what about at the dragstrip? Just curious as this is the next logical question. Are you guys going to offer a 100 or 104 octane program as well? (sorry if this has already been covered). Oh and, GT2871R


----------



## FreshieMedia (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (sasha18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sasha18T* »_
Nice, slightly larger and it will do 400whp on 93 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

I think the 2871R is rated 400hp at the crank.....


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (FreshieMedia)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FreshieMedia* »_Any idea what this would be good for on the 1/4 mile with an average launch on street tires and 93 oct? This looks like it would be a sick road car with torque available at just about any RPM and an engine that does not quit on the top end http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif , but what about at the dragstrip? Just curious as this is the next logical question. Are you guys going to offer a 100 or 104 octane program as well? (sorry if this has already been covered). Oh and, GT2871R

















the 1/4 time, I can't really speculate, I'll let you know whence I have run mine.
yes, there will be 100 and 104 in typical APR fashion! Might need rods for that though.


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (sasha18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sasha18T* »_Thats pretty impressive? what turbo? Id like to go with a gt30r, for 400whp on 93 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

isn't that on the 93 file but using race gas still? or did i read that wrong? what difference would that make on 93 w/ actual 93 gas in there?


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
isn't that on the 93 file but using race gas still? or did i read that wrong? what difference would that make on 93 w/ actual 93 gas in there?

not a whole lot. octane specific files provide alot of additional power. its been said that adding race gas to a 91 type cal will yeild good results but we always get alot more by developing an octane specific cal. typically with a stock turbo car you would see 5-8 by adding the gas and 9-13 by recalibrating it, roughly. I would speculate on the stage 3 it might be 15-20 by adding the gas only.


----------



## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (FreshieMedia)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FreshieMedia* »_Any idea what this would be good for on the 1/4 mile with an average launch on street tires and 93 oct? This looks like it would be a sick road car with torque available at just about any RPM and an engine that does not quit on the top end http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif , but what about at the dragstrip? Just curious as this is the next logical question. Are you guys going to offer a 100 or 104 octane program as well? (sorry if this has already been covered). Oh and, GT2871R
















Well, there are mk4's in the high 11's with 350whp or so. According to the hp/whp calculators, a portly mk5 needs 450whp to run a 10.90....Most of these calculators are meant for rwd though. I hope to run mid 13's before I change turbos


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

What about on vegetable oil. Do you guys make a veggy program.


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
not a whole lot. octane specific files provide alot of additional power. its been said that adding race gas to a 91 type cal will yeild good results but we always get alot more by developing an octane specific cal. typically with a stock turbo car you would see 5-8 by adding the gas and 9-13 by recalibrating it, roughly. I would speculate on the stage 3 it might be 15-20 by adding the gas only.

so from the 93 file dyno, we're looking closer to 335-340whp?


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (Jim Dangle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim Dangle* »_What about on vegetable oil. Do you guys make a veggy program. 

we made one for Randy Pobst! He has a TDI Jetta.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
so from the 93 file dyno, we're looking closer to 335-340whp?

maybe, we'll see! we like the numbers that dyno made and there is some room as those cal's are conservative.


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

hahha


----------



## FlyingTurtle (Mar 26, 2006)

i still want a K04 Keith
Dangle, you are funny


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
so from the 93 file dyno, we're looking closer to 335-340whp?
 
thats about right for 93 
The 1.8T stage 3+ does around 300WHP on 93 pump and 345-360 on race gas program using the smaller 28RS turbo .







Bob.G


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
thats about right for 93 
The 1.8T stage 3+ does around 300WHP on 93 pump and 345-360 on race gas program using the smaller 28RS turbo .







Bob.G

remember the advantages of FSI. Our concern for power is not making enough, its what the rods can handle so we are finalizing that testing and that's where our power will be, with a safe margin of course.


----------



## FlyingTurtle (Mar 26, 2006)

makes sense


----------



## XM_Rocks (Jan 29, 2005)

*Re: (AbtSportsline)*


_Quote, originally posted by *AbtSportsline* »_makes sense

I hate that you have a MK5 GTI and I dont!








The 2.0T is going to turn some heads when these Stage 3 Kits roll out.


----------



## SilverA3 (May 2, 2007)

This kit is going to be awesome!!! Question, at the moment I am running water/meth injection so I will be able to run some more aggressive boost while still using 91oct right? So hopefully be able to make the power the 100oct map and boost would give you on just 91 or am I like way off here? Thanks.
-Spence


----------



## FlyingTurtle (Mar 26, 2006)

*Re: (XM_Rocks)*


_Quote, originally posted by *XM_Rocks* »_
I hate that you have a MK5 GTI and I dont!








The 2.0T is going to turn some heads when these Stage 3 Kits roll out.


You miss it dont you?


----------



## VolksWurks (Oct 20, 2006)

*Re: (AbtSportsline)*

ready for one myself! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

350whp niiice


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## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_350whp niiice









Nice! I want 400whp on pump gas though, for 5k anyways http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## FreshieMedia (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
remember the advantages of FSI. Our concern for power is not making enough, its what the rods can handle so we are finalizing that testing and that's where our power will be, with a safe margin of course.

Forget stock rods.....how far can this kit be pushed?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (FreshieMedia)*

lets bump this up its been a while LOL
whats the news on this kit Keith???







Bob.G


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_lets bump this up its been a while LOL
whats the news on this kit Keith???







Bob.G


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (SilverA3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SilverA3* »_This kit is going to be awesome!!! Question, at the moment I am running water/meth injection so I will be able to run some more aggressive boost while still using 91oct right? So hopefully be able to make the power the 100oct map and boost would give you on just 91 or am I like way off here? Thanks.
-Spence


Spence,
Our octane specific calibrations typically have timing changes with no changes in requested boost pressure. You will be able to run more aggressive timing with similar boost pressures as you cycle to the higher octane programming.
In regards to the water/meth, its possible to do so, APR doesn't recommend it but if you log the appropriate channels to ensure no threat of possible damage, you could theoretically run a higher octane file.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (FreshieMedia)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FreshieMedia* »_
Forget stock rods.....how far can this kit be pushed?

There is certainly opportunity for additional end user modification to the APR Stage 3. APR will always provide a turn key solution that ensures all safety and longevity specs are met but if the client chooses to modify beyond what we provide, there is definitely room. I see clients with 1.8T's using manual or electronic boost controllers to increase boost pressure over our calibrations and installing water/meth, dump tubes, etc. that show good gains. On the 2.0T stage 3 there is definitely room left in the turbo and some fueling as well to push it further with additional mods. The calibration provided will be around 20-24 psi and the turbo certainly has some efficiency left.
In the future, APR will release a new calibration that will require upgraded rods and will take further advantage of the headway left in the Stage 3.


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_In the future, APR will release a new calibration that will require upgraded rods and will take further advantage of the headway left in the Stage 3.

But WHEN????


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
But WHEN????









There will be one kit shipping before WF and full inventory should be able to ship first half of August!
Looks like we may be accepting more preorders soon.........


----------



## XM_Rocks (Jan 29, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Keith: Kinda OT but if someone were to drive/fly out to your new facility with the intention of buying one of your Stage 3 kits are any of the Stage 3 cars avaialbe to drive around your new track (when it is built?).
Again props on the 12 months no interest financing partnership! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
There will be one kit shipping before WF and full inventory should be able to ship first half of August!
Looks like we may be accepting more preorders soon.........

will there be discount pricing available for pre-orders at waterfest? (this determines if im coming or not). and who's the lucky bastard that gets the 1 kit before wf?


----------



## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
will there be discount pricing available for pre-orders at waterfest? (this determines if im coming or not). and who's the lucky bastard that gets the 1 kit before wf?

Probably the dude that won the Christmas raffle?? 
JJ


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (XM_Rocks)*


_Quote, originally posted by *XM_Rocks* »_Keith: Kinda OT but if someone were to drive/fly out to your new facility with the intention of buying one of your Stage 3 kits are any of the Stage 3 cars avaialbe to drive around your new track (when it is built?).
Again props on the 12 months no interest financing partnership! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


If you were to visit us in November or December and I still have my GTi and the track is done...............


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
will there be discount pricing available for pre-orders at waterfest? (this determines if im coming or not). and who's the lucky bastard that gets the 1 kit before wf?

There will be some incentives for the 2.0T FSI APR Stage 3 at Waterfest for sure! We will take preorders at special pricing and then be able to ship them by the second week of August.
There will also be some official announcements regarding all of this soon. I just can't contain myself that long!


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
There will be some incentives for the 2.0T FSI APR Stage 3 at Waterfest for sure! We will take preorders at special pricing and then be able to ship them by the second week of August.
There will also be some official announcements regarding all of this soon. I just can't contain myself that long!








 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (prodigymb)*

So august eh?


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (Jim Dangle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim Dangle* »_So august eh?


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
There will be some incentives for the 2.0T FSI APR Stage 3 at Waterfest for sure! We will take preorders at special pricing and then be able to ship them by the second week of August.
There will also be some official announcements regarding all of this soon. I just can't contain myself that long!









can you give me a time on the longitudinal kits? it's only a couple diff pipes and a diff file. it couldnt be that far behind...could it? and, will i still be able to get the incentive on the longitudinal kit at WF?


----------



## euro 20v (Apr 2, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (Jim Dangle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim Dangle* »_So august eh? 


please ship Jim his kit as soon as possible, i cant wait to install my first 2.0t stage 3


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
can you give me a time on the longitudinal kits? it's only a couple diff pipes and a diff file. it couldnt be that far behind...could it? and, will i still be able to get the incentive on the longitudinal kit at WF?

We will offer a similar promotion whence the longitudinal is near realease. Right now we have no plans for the release in the near future.


----------



## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Right now we have no plans for the release in the near future.









where is the audi loyalty?? What does APR stand for again??








looks like the most of the audi crowd, especially on audizine, will be going w/ a giac-based kit then. that's a shame, people will buy your products if they are available


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (bluelagoon1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bluelagoon1* »_
where is the audi loyalty?? What does APR stand for again??








looks like the most of the audi crowd, especially on audizine, will be going w/ a giac-based kit then. that's a shame, people will buy your products if they are available

Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't mean like years away or anything. I just don't want everyone to think its right around the corner. Christmas time or the first of next year are our current plans.
And the transverse stage 3 will apply to the Audi A3 and mk2 TT!


----------



## mrponline (Jan 11, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! ([email protected])*

Will this kit be developed for US spec cars ONLY ? Or will the rest of us located outside the US be able to get the kit with software / programs that are compatible with our engines / ECUs.


_Modified by mrponline at 3:14 PM 7-4-2007_


----------



## JumpalTurbo5 (Feb 21, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (mrponline)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mrponline* »_Will this kit be developed for US spec cars ONLY ? Or will the rest of us located outside the US be able to get the kit with software / programs that are compatible with our engines / ECUs.

I am sure Keith will reply with more concrete answer, but from looking
at http://www.goapr.de, we can expect this kit will be also available for other
countries.


----------



## aussie audi guy (Jan 28, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (mrponline)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mrponline* »_Will this kit be developed for US spec cars ONLY ? Or will the rest of us located outside the US be able to get the kit with software / programs that are compatible with our engines / ECUs.

_Modified by mrponline at 3:14 PM 7-4-2007_

Of Course it will http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif - We expect to get two of the first kits available and have them straight on the APR AUS demo cars - and as always, we work with APR on the software & AUS specific ECU codes


----------



## mrponline (Jan 11, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (aussie audi guy)*

Saying that APR couldnt develop K04 programs for the my Engine / ECU even after having my ECU for 6 months








So you can imagine why i might have concerns to go down the same path again and not get a result.


----------



## aussie audi guy (Jan 28, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (mrponline)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mrponline* »_Saying that APR couldnt develop K04 programs for the my Engine / ECU even after having my ECU for 6 months








So you can imagine why i might have concerns to go down the same path again and not get a result.

Same as any new OS conversion - we need to get a hold of a car & work with APR on the software. We do a lot of work with them on this basis.
Same happened with the other 2.0T K04 conversions & stage 3+ A4 & TT Conversions done here & in the UK.
You can't expect to ship your car directly to them? & you can't expect them to throw something together & "hope" it works - we don't work like that.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 2.0T teaser pic! No vaporware here!! (JumpalTurbo5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JumpalTurbo5* »_
I am sure Keith will reply with more concrete answer, but from looking
at http://www.goapr.de, we can expect this kit will be also available for other
countries.

Here is a pic of a right hand development car at APR im sure this kit is not to far behind .


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## 4wealn (Nov 21, 2005)

Hey Keith, when will the rail pump be released? If I cannot make it to waterfest can I get the same pricing as the show if I call the shop and order one. Do you have a final price for it yet and will my APR dealer have the software for the pump if I get one at waterfest or will I have to wait for the software. Thanks in advance. Cyrrently running stage 2 93 octane and love it.


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (4wealn)*


_Quote, originally posted by *4wealn* »_Hey Keith, when will the rail pump be released? If I cannot make it to waterfest can I get the same pricing as the show if I call the shop and order one. Do you have a final price for it yet and will my APR dealer have the software for the pump if I get one at waterfest or will I have to wait for the software. Thanks in advance. Cyrrently running stage 2 93 octane and love it.

Fuel pump will be released this week! I'll be able to answer the rest of your questions in the release info!


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## adam cutright (Feb 14, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

has anyone bought this kit yet? I'm probably going to order it in a few weeks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Can't wait


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (polskavw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *polskavw* »_has anyone bought this kit yet? I'm probably going to order it in a few weeks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Can't wait

It's not available yet. Should be very shortly though.. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (polskavw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *polskavw* »_has anyone bought this kit yet? I'm probably going to order it in a few weeks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Can't wait

Yes, we have sold the first kit just last week! Our client takes delivery on Thursday next week! We've performed the install for the client as well.


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## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Any pics? Dynos?







Price?? Is it 5k?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Yes, we have sold the first kit just last week! Our client takes delivery on Thursday next week! We've performed the install for the client as well.









DAMM I have to wait until thursday , your killing me LOL







Bob.G


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## gti_in_nj (Jul 13, 2007)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

will this work with dsg as well or only m/t?


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## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: (gti_in_nj)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_in_nj* »_will this work with dsg as well or only m/t?

Some testing is being done with dsg in other markets and we are following it very closely. We've seen some issues and seen some ideas to correct them. I think things will play out with the DSG soon enough, 3 mos to a year, and everyone will be happy.


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## casj75 (Jul 13, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Keith.
I live in Denmark, Europe, will APR Germany also offer the high pressure fuelpump? and will it be ready for delevery at the same time in Europe as in US? 
Is the price around $1000 ?








If APR Germany dont get it, can I order it from you the?


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## MFT-Motorsport (May 14, 2007)

*Re: (casj75)*

Hi casj75,
you can get all APR products directly from us too, we will have them as soon as APR send the big container to us ;-) I think shipping form D > DK will much cheaper for such a small thing...


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## Zer0infrn015 (Mar 18, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*

I was trying to look through the pages for a price for the stage 3 kit but 12 pages involved a lot of reading so I thought I would just ask. My car isn't even fully broken in yet so I am in no hurry to start with the upgrades but I can feel a bt setup in my future so I am starting to look now. How much is the kit and what all is included?


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## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

*Re: (Zer0infrn015)*

price release at waterfest


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## smartyin (Jul 24, 2005)

info release this weekend??
today is...............?


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (YoungMedic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *YoungMedic* »_price release at waterfest
 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
DAMM I have to wait until thursday , your killing me LOL







Bob.G
 
I wonder if ill ever see my car again LOL


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

i'll be looking for that thing at WF13


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## tdipower4me (Dec 1, 2005)

bob, where are you getting the kit installed?


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (tdipower4me)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tdipower4me* »_bob, where are you getting the kit installed?

@apr


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## tdipower4me (Dec 1, 2005)

*Re: (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_
@apr

yea i know that, but which one? salisbury motorcar? or one down in the city?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (tdipower4me)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tdipower4me* »_
yea i know that, but which one? salisbury motorcar? or one down in the city?
 
@ APR home office in A.L. 
that's my car in the pic above.
It will be in APR booth with the stage 3 installed you can stop by and take a look, Right Keith ??LOL .







Bob.G

_Modified by rracerguy717 at 1:55 PM 7-19-2007_


_Modified by rracerguy717 at 2:25 PM 7-19-2007_


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
@ APR home office in A.L. 
that's my car in the pic above.
It will be in APR booth with the stage 3 installed you can stop by and take a look, Right Keith LOL .







Bob.G

_Modified by rracerguy717 at 1:55 PM 7-19-2007_

i wanna see it run the 1320 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Jim Dangle (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: (prodigymb)*

Can I get a ride in a stg3 car this weekend?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_
i wanna see it run the 1320 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
 
I do too LOL 
lets see how things go this weekend







Bob.G


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
I do too LOL 
lets see how things go this weekend







Bob.G

you gonna be there both days? i am coming up on sunday


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_
you gonna be there both days? i am coming up on sunday
 
you bet im taking that thing home sunday, hell or high water ~!!!!!







Bob.G


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## tdipower4me (Dec 1, 2005)

i look forward to seeing this car sunday cuz thats when i'll be there


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
you bet im taking that thing home sunday, hell or high water ~!!!!!







Bob.G

niice i'll see you sunday, im gonna be there flashing cars


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## AutotechRD (Aug 19, 2004)

*Re: (prodigymb)*

About flashing cars...Come on man, it's a family event...


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## bluelagoon1 (Apr 21, 2005)

*Re: (AutotechRD)*

alright, who's got the low down on the kit, options packages, and pricing from waterfest. let's have it


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## tdipower4me (Dec 1, 2005)

i know.


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## Sincity (May 17, 2005)

*Re: (AutotechRD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *AutotechRD* »_About flashing cars...Come on man, it's a family event...


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## [email protected] (Jun 19, 2006)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
I wonder if ill ever see my car again LOL

















I see my car!!! I guess I should put my suspension on it soon..


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
I see my car!!! I guess I should put my suspension on it soon..









 
It needs REAL HP first







, then it will get a suspension worthy and brakes will follow soon after .







Bob.G


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## LeBlanc. (Jul 15, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
I see my car!!! I guess I should put my suspension on it soon..










dunno why you'd waste the money on an Altima...


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## [email protected] (Jun 19, 2006)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
It needs REAL HP first







, then it will get a suspension worthy and brakes will follow soon after .







Bob.G

Ill get that REAL HP soon, but currently its pretty damn fast as is. I mean, you know its not stock..


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Ill get that REAL HP soon, but currently its pretty damn fast as is. I mean, you know its not stock..









can you pass me some "REAL HP"


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## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Ill get that REAL HP soon, but currently its pretty damn fast as is. I mean, you know its not stock..










hurry up and slam that thing mayn....


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## [email protected] (Jun 19, 2006)

*Re: (YoungMedic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *YoungMedic* »_

hurry up and slam that thing mayn....









I know, right... I keep frickin spending my money on guitar ****.. Actually just bought a new amp.. lol http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 









I take it APR gets all their parts from Autozone?


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## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

sweet which one?
werent you playing out of a Mesa? Id love to rock a dual rectifier through like a 1960A cabinet with greenbacks.... droool


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## dubbinhydro (Sep 1, 2004)

*Re: (YoungMedic)*

How do I preorder?????


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## dubbinhydro (Sep 1, 2004)

*Re: (YoungMedic)*

How do I preorder?????


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## [email protected] (Jun 19, 2006)

*Re: (dubbinhydro)*

You can call up and speak to a sales rep or I, and we would put the kit on a pre-order for you. Please let me know if you have any further questions. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## djbranboogy (Nov 13, 2015)

Can you please help find installation parts only? I have the gtx2867r already.
I need:
cast aluminum charge pipe to i.c.
Silicone inlet hose and exit hose
Downpipe flange adapter for fsi/tsi
Please help me out. No one sells pieces separate. I got a deal on the turbo and I want to piece together the rest.


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