# power steering fluid, what type?



## ECPunk (May 16, 2008)

As stated in the title, i need to know what kind of fluid to use. I'm heading on a few hour drive in a few minutes and hoping to get an answer quick. thanks for the help guys.


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## harmankardon35 (Sep 16, 2009)

think that filter would clog up and cause steering issues? or do you just replace it every year or so?


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## turbocharged798 (Apr 13, 2010)

ATF is no way no how compatible with VW PS systems in any shape or form. 

Pentosin CHF11S is the correct fluid. Many people blew the racks and pumps because they used the WRONG fluid and it was not compatible.


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## AudiJunkie (Jun 19, 2009)

Bzzt. You're supposed to supply a reason ATF isn't appropriate, this is after all a technical forum. 

In case you've been in a cave or in outer space the last few years, Pentosin is what blows racks. 

Could the "wrong" fluid have been regular PSF, hmm? Was their system maybe run low...:facepalm: 

Show me one case where a well-functioning system "blew" with a fresh fill of ATF+4. 

Really, that's how it works here. 

I still get emails from guys who switched over a leaking system to ATF and it cured their leaks.


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## harmankardon35 (Sep 16, 2009)

I've been 1.5 years and 60,000 km using ATF, no issues. the original stuff was burnt all to hell and I've heard it tends to do that as it gets hot. Pump was making all sorts of noise until i switched over.


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## turbocharged798 (Apr 13, 2010)

I have CHF11S in my 250,000 mile 99.5 TDI. Original rack and pump. Does not leak. No way as hell I am putting ATF in there. I am still calling BS to CHF11s causing rack failures. 

I do know several people who put regular PS fluid in and promptly blew the rack out. 

Maybe it depends on what year VW we are talking about here?:screwy:


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## AudiJunkie (Jun 19, 2009)

Did you not ever service your fluid? If not good luck to you sir, but it doesn't prove it's better than ATF+4. 

When VW switched over FROM ATF to CHF in 1991-3, the PS parts numbers stayed the same, only the fluid changed from Dex III. 

ftr- MB uses +4 and uses the same PS parts suppliers as VW. 

Also, rack after rack on Audis loose fluid, cavitates, and sheds metal into the system after a session of runaway heating which warps the seals. I can count a dozen guys I know who replaced it at some point. I know the same number or more who now use Mobil 1 ATF or +4. 

It's a matter of selecting a fluid going forward. You can't say racks do not die on CHF, nor can you say every dead rack had plain PSF from top-off. They die with pure CHF. I can't say I know of any racks that failed after going to ATF, but I know people on their 3rd rack with CHF. 

ATF is the most common PSF in the automotive industry. I mention this because I can tell some people are lost. 

I just serviced Mom's 1996 Passat yesterday. It was serviced once halfway through it's life on CHF, and was now slightly low. I topped it with +4 and will flush it fully when I have the time. Mom is hard on the PS, living in the city, with a garage and and parallel parking.


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## rustlerdude (Aug 13, 2007)

Great information posted! 

I will now inform my friends and other service techs about this information. Thank you.


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## marine24 (Jan 19, 2008)

Simple question (not picking a fight), why would they switch from ATF to CHF if the ATF is a better fluid?


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## AudiJunkie (Jun 19, 2009)

CHF came on the market and all the mfgs rushed to it. They came from Dex III, which isn't anything special. I suppose they could claim reduced friction and better mpg, but that doesn't translate into component longevity.

otoh, Mercedes went back to ATF(+4) from CHF. 

If anyone thinks CHF is the ticket to flawless PS function, needs to look into all the failures.

I'll cut it short for now, but will restate that I get lots of emails from guys who ATF saved their PS systems.

Dex VI is now certified for PSF service too.


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## harmankardon35 (Sep 16, 2009)

what about dex3? ive been running it in my truck, thinking about some dexVI


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## AudiJunkie (Jun 19, 2009)

Fresh Dex3 is fine, but Dex VI is "synthetic", on a par with +4. Just don't use Hi-Mi ATF.


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## turbocharged798 (Apr 13, 2010)

AudiJunkie said:


> Did you not ever service your fluid? If not good luck to you sir, but it doesn't prove it's better than ATF+4.
> 
> When VW switched over FROM ATF to CHF in 1991-3, the PS parts numbers stayed the same, only the fluid changed from Dex III.


Once, replaced it with CHF11s. Cost $20 a liter at napa. 

It does look a lot like green ATF.......


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## AudiJunkie (Jun 19, 2009)

It's an aircraft grade hydrolic oil for use at altitude in mega-cold temps. I don't know what the purpose of it in auto applications except in arctic service.


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## gmikel (Nov 10, 2010)

*it's all 10 wt*

it's all 10 weight earl with anti foam and other addatives. use whats recommended for your car. it's not rocket science.


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## AudiJunkie (Jun 19, 2009)

So, "read the manual" is the extent of your insight? :facepalm:


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## ADeHelian (Oct 1, 2009)

so audijunkie, i need to completly flush and refill the entire PS system on my 98 2.0

what fluid should i use/where do i get it. can it be bought at a autozone? or is napa more appropriate? 

thanks in advance.


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## marine24 (Jan 19, 2008)

*issues*

So I just flushed my PS system when I replaced the inner and outer tie rods and went to Dex III and now I have some serious play in my steering wheel. I'm not saying it's because of the fluid change, most likely because because my tie rods were shot and I just couldn't feel how bad it was before, but I'm just trying to make sure it wasn't the fluid. You guys hear of something like this happening with just the fluid? There's no air in the system that I can tell, no whines from the pump, reservoir is full; I'm going to be pissed if I have to get back in there to rebuild the rack after replacing everything and putting it all back together :banghead: This car hates me I swear...:facepalm:


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## harmankardon35 (Sep 16, 2009)

if you replaced the tie rods there shouldn't be any free play. Fluid wont case free-play, you can still steer manually if you disconnect the PS pump. Did you get an alignment done?


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## gmikel (Nov 10, 2010)

*free play*

check your toe in. it can feel like free play, especially if your toe out a little.


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## marine24 (Jan 19, 2008)

harmankardon35 said:


> if you replaced the tie rods there shouldn't be any free play. Fluid wont case free-play, you can still steer manually if you disconnect the PS pump. Did you get an alignment done?


I did get an alignment done, twice. I got one done right away, and then had it rechecked after a couple 100 miles, just to give everything time to settle (new heavy duty strut bushings/ bearings, ball joints and tie rods) just to make sure. I think the first place I took it just sucked at what they were doing because the first thing they told me when I went to pick it up was that I needed to get camber adjustment bolts, which I already had, so I took it to another place a week later and it was way off. Now it's good but I have a ton of play, especially when I'm making turns at 45+ mph. My guess is that I just needed to rebuild the whole rack but I Just wanted to see if there were any other thoughts on the matter.
I'm going to be pissed if I have to replace the entire rack because that's $150 in tie rods I will have wasted :banghead:


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## MarkusWolf (Dec 10, 2001)

CHF11


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## gtibunny8v (Jan 4, 2002)

AudiJunkie said:


> otoh, Mercedes went back to ATF(+4) from CHF.


Don't post info if you don't know what you're talking about. 

Mercedes has used CHF in all the sedans since the M112/M113 engine was introduced. The only 
MB vehicles to use an ATF are the US built SUVs. The exception to that will be ML450 hybrids with
electrohydraulic steering.


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## ADeHelian (Oct 1, 2009)

gtibunny8v said:


> Don't post info if you don't know what you're talking about.
> 
> Mercedes has used CHF in all the sedans since the M112/M113 engine was introduced. The only
> MB vehicles to use an ATF are the US built SUVs. The exception to that will be ML450 hybrids with
> electrohydraulic steering.


nice thread bump  :laugh:


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## Super Hans (May 27, 2011)

:facepalm:

http://www.dieselgiant.com/mercedespowersteeringfluidservice.htm










"Refill with clean ATF Dextron fluid. You can use Mercedes Power steering fluid, but ATF fluid is also a recommended fluid."

http://www.pennzoil.com/documents/PowerSteeringFluid.pdf

"Mercedes 79-99 All"


http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/236.3_en.html

















236.3 Steering gear oils (ATF, Specification 236.3)


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## gtibunny8v (Jan 4, 2002)

This is for the older engines. From the looks of the pic that is most likely a M117 engine. All 124, 129, 170, 202, 208 and all other vehicles with recirculating-ball steering will use ATF Steering Gear Oil (A 000 989 88 03 10) subs to BQ 146 0001. 
DTB S-B-46.25/70 indicated proper P/S fluid.


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