# Interior Door Panel Removal -- Bass Speaker Broken Wire Repair



## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

Members of the forum,
I have been a long time, happy Phaeton owner. I have constantly visited this site to find all sorts of answers to my questions, so I am hoping you can help me out here.
I have recently discovered that my 2 rear and my 1 front (driver's side) bass speakers (large speakers) are not producing any sound. I have confirmed with my Vagcom that the speakers are having issues.
I took the car to my dealer to have him look at the issue, but they say the speakers are blown. I have had a good bit of experience with blown speakers, and I have never known them to just be totally silent -- they always make SOME kind of noise, just not the right ones







.
Since the blown speakers were "my fault," it will not be covered under my warranty







. As such, I have decided to do the repairs myself, and either replace the speakers with aftermarkert, or try to order some matching speakers straight from VW. Either way, I need to get behind the doors to see what needs to be done.
I have looked at Michael's post about removing the door panels, and it has been very helpful! I have not, however, been able to find the trim removal tool (the one used for the fasteners) anywhere. I am trying to gather some tips about how to successfully remove the fasteners from my door trim without breaking them. 
My question is this: How can I remove the door trim without the special removal tool, or where can I find the tool to order?
Also, does anyone have a P/N for the Phaeton front & rear bass speakers?
Thanks,
Damon Smith

*Archival Note:* Here's the post that Damon refers to, which provides an illustrated guide to removing interior door panels. The problem being addressed in this post is keyless access function, but the process of removing the interior door panel also applies when you need to get access to a speaker mounted in a door. See here - Keyless Entry Issues (consolidated discussions)


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Almost forgot to mention: I have found a tool that looks similar to Michael's photo, and may be able to do the job. Any opinions on the following tool?
EG 12105 listed on http://www.samstagsales.com/vwaudi.htm


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Apple_Eater* »_How can I remove the door trim without the special removal tool, or where can I find the tool to order?

Hi Damon:
The tool is quite generic in nature - it is not a special "Phaeton" tool, although it is a Volkswagen-specific tool.
I have seen virtually identical tools offered for sale from well stocked Snap-On and Mac Tools trucks. My suggestion is that you print a couple of pictures of the tool, and take them to a Snap-On or Mac Tools distributor. Chances are that the distributor will be able to get you a tool that is functionally equivilent.
Another possibility is to look for a very large automotive store (bigger than average) and see if they have a similar tool in stock in the body shop supplies section.
Finally, it is also possible to order the tool via any Volkswagen dealer. It is not a 'secret item' or protected part. Just note the tool identification number, and go to the parts department of a local VW dealer. FYI, Snap-On is the company that makes most of VW's specialty tools, and Snap-On is not cheap. So, be sure you are holding onto the counter when the parts guy tells you the price of the VW tool.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (PanEuropean)*

*Archival Note:* Here's the link to the discussion that Damon referenced, which contains instructions for removing the door panels and a picture of the special tool - Keyless Entry Issues (consolidated discussions)


Also, below are extracts from the Phaeton repair manual that explain how to remove the driver door panel and the front passenger door panel.

Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Apple_Eater* »_Almost forgot to mention: I have found a tool that looks similar to Michael's photo, and may be able to do the job. Any opinions on the following tool?
EG 12105 listed on http://www.samstagsales.com/vwaudi.htm

That one looks like it might be a bit 'light duty' for the fasteners on the Phaeton door. I think you might be better off with the HAZET 799-5, which is illustrated just a bit further down the page.
Michael


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## oldham4 (Apr 27, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Damon,
I have the same problem regarding the lower speakers on the driver side of the car. The dealership has told me that the amplifier needs to be replaced because they verified the speakers are in fine by measuring resistance through the amplifier wiring harness in the trunk. You might want to see if your dealer has done the same. Apparently, my Phaeton tech has replaced amps on other Tauregs & Phaetons for similar problems & it has solved the situation.
If you have a 12 channel DSP system like me, the amplifier is not cheap. Additionally, it is located behind the starter battery & I have not yet been able to figure out how to remove it.
I can get the part numbers for the speakers if you let me know whether you hvae an 8 or 12 speaker system.
Thanks,
George


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (oldham4)*

If the issue is, in fact the amplifier, would your warranty then cover it? 
The reason I ask is that when I did a VAGCOM scan on my car it reported a Mid-Range Bass speaker in the right front door has an open circuit. Frankly, I can't tell, and the stereo still sounds as good as any stock car stereo I've ever heard.
Nonetheless, if the warranty covers the whole car... and the stereo equipment is not on the exceptions list...
Bill


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## eurolok003 (Mar 16, 2009)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (357Sig)*

If you're considering after-market speakers, maybe you can look into Dynaudio. They are one of the most natural car- and home-speakers. By the way, they are the OEM supplier for VW's upgraded speaker range. I have a pair at home, and they're phenomenal!


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (eurolok003)*

I have not thought about trying to measure resistance from the amp, I will certainly do that! My vagcom reports open circuit, so I have a feeling that is the speaker itself, but I suppose incorrect reporting is possible.
I have the 12-speaker DSP system. I have loved it and it actually took me a few months to notice these speakers were out! -- the system is that good. I would certainly like to have it back up to full-steam, however. I am certain my dealership has not checked the resistance, as they are somewhat incompetent







and actually lied on the receipt they gave me (said a part was replaced and TESTED, and it doesn't even work!) so I'll be either taking my car elsewhere or doing it myself. Unfortunately, it is a 3+ hour drive to get anywhere that can work on my Phaeton http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

I seem to remember someone testing a similar issue by swapping the outputs on the amplifier to verify that it was the amp and not the speakers. I cannot locate that thread at the moment, but I know I have read about that problem. 
It sticks in my mind that Michael replaced his amp, or had his replaced, as well.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (357Sig)*

Correct, I replaced mine, the bass output failed for the front two speakers. There was nothing wrong with the speakers.
It is a PITA to get the amp in and out of its bracket. I think I wrote an illustrated 'how-to' post, not sure if I put it in the FAQ or not.
My experience has been that if there are sound problems, the cause is usually the amplifier, not the speakers.
Michael


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (PanEuropean)*

Michael,
Where might I find the amp? I have removed the relay box and originally thought it to be the metallic box located directly behind the relay box, but this appears to be incorrect.
Do I need to remove the battery to get to the amp? If so, how do I go about doing this?


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Many hours later, I have successfully removed the battery. That was the single most difficult thing I have done in my entire life. I snapped some photos of the compartment sans battery, can someone point me in the direction of the amp?
I was thinking this was the amp








Here is a picture of the entire battery compartment, so you guys can have an idea of what I am working with








Michael, can you point me in the direction to the amp? I have already ordered a repair manual, and I am sure it will have the right directions, but I am a bit impatient when it comes to my Phaeton


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Hello again:
The item you have photographed above is the battery controller, not the amplifier. The *12 channel* amplifier is on the *RIGHT *side of the car, just forward of the starter battery, more or less in the same general area as the gas cap. It is possible that the 8 channel amplifier is located on the right side of the car, because the repair manual also provides instructions for removing an amplifier from the right side.

If you are not sure if you have a 12 channel or 8 channel sound system, remove the bin from the left side of the car and have a look outboard and just forward of the battery to see if there is an amplifier installed on the left side... it's easy to see the 12 channel amplifier (on the left side) without any further disassembly.

Removal instructions for both potential locations are attached below.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (PanEuropean)*

Here is a photo of the 12 channel amplifier, which is located on the right side of the car (behind the starter battery).

*12 Channel Amplifier*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (PanEuropean)*

Damon:

Here's wiring diagrams (for both the 8 channel and 12 channel sound systems) that might help you determine if the amplifier is actually sending a healthy signal out to the various speakers.

My guess is that you are going to find that the problem is with the amplifier, not with the speakers. So, you might want to hold off on taking any door panels apart.

Michael


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (PanEuropean)*

Michael,
Thanks very much for your helpful reply! It's too bad that all my work removing the wrong battery was wasted








Anyways, I am a bit unsure about how to access the starter battery. Please refer to the following image:








I am a bit unsure about how to remove this storage area in order to access the battery compartment. I'll try popping it out with a trim removal tool later, but does your Phaeton have something similar to this? I am wondering if the previous owner retrofitted some sort of storage thing instead of the traditional cover.


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

That's how they all are (unless there is a DVD player fitted there). To remove the panel you pull with steady pressure at the top of the bin. The clips will release one by one, they are very strong. The motion to remove the panel will be much like opening a door that has hinges at the bottom.
It is held in place with push-in clips at the top and sides and tabs that fit into the surround at the bottom. DO NOT pry from the bottom edge because you will break the tabs. Once the clips release from the top and sides, the entire plastic storage bin will lift out of the lower surround. This will be possible when the top of the bin has been moved about 45 - 60 degrees inboard from its original position. Replacement is obvious once you have the part in your hand.
Bill


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (357Sig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *357Sig* »_The clips will release one by one, they are very strong. 

Bill is right - the clips are really strong. So, don't be afraid to give it a good yank at the top.
Michael


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (PanEuropean)*

I have removed the amp, and tested with a multimeter the speakers in question. Each of them is an open circuit, as indicated by the vagcom. This (I believe) eliminates the possibility of the amplifier being the source of my problems.
I believe that the only remaining possibilities are
1. Wiring fault of some kind, speakers not plugged in, disconnected at "pillar" connector, etc.
2. Speakers blown
Does this seem correct to you guys? Would by next step be to remove door panels and inspect the speakers/wiring?
EDIT: By the way, I have the 12 speaker system, can anyone send me the P/N for the speakers so I can begin shopping? I am starting to suspect the speakers are indeed the problem...











*Postscript added years later: * Here's a picture of the most probable cause of a non-functional speaker -


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Michael,
I am trying to figure out exactly which speakers are needing to be replaced, and am a bit confused by the layout of the Phaeton 12 speaker system.
Based on this post: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...97588
It appears there are 2 speakers in the lower grille on each front door -- I'm assuming a mid-bass and bass (in accordance with the wiring diagram)
Is this also the case with the rear doors?
The reason I ask is that, if there ARE two speakers in each lower grille, then BOTH speakers in my rear doors have malfunctioned. I removed parts of the trim on my rear driver door to try to get at the speaker, and as part of removing the trim, the smaller (midrange? tweeter?) speaker near the locks was disconnected. Now, if I fade music to rear left, there is *no* sound at all. This means that the ONLY speaker correctly functioning in the rear left of my car was the one near the door locks.
As such, it appears as though that door will need two speakers at least. Is this the case?
Thanks,
Damon
EDIT: I think I just answered my own question. Based on my count, there are 2 speakers in each lower grille in the front -- 4 speakers total. There is one near each door handle -- 8 so far. One in each rear door grille -- 10 so far. Then there are the two additional on the pillars near the windshield in front -- 12 speakers.
Is this the correct layout for the speakers? If so, I'll do some more testing to see if only my bass or also my mid-bass speakers are blown in the front. Does this mean there are no mid-bass speakers in the rear?


_Modified by Apple_Eater at 11:30 PM 9-16-2009_


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Here's the answer to the precise location of all the speakers. 

Where are the 12 speakers?

_(Broken link corrected by Michael)_


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (357Sig)*

Thanks so much for that link, not sure why I couldn't find it myself








I'll do some more testing with my multimeter to figure out exactly which speakers need work.
My previous question still stands: Where should I look next, the wiring or the speakers?
If I can get into the speaker compartments, I think I should be able to test the wiring by simple bridging the positive and negative terminals of the speakers with a strand of wire (after disconnecting all batteries, of course) and then checking for a closed circuit at the amplifier. Does this sound reasonable? If the test is successful, that eliminates all possibilities except the speakers in question being blown, the least desirable outcome


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

I have re-verified all of my findings with my multimeter given my new knowledge of the Phaeton's sound system, and here is what I have discovered:
Both treble speakers are reading 3.5 Ohms, as expected
All four DSP Midrange speakers are reading 13 Ohms, I'm assuming they are higher impedance by design.
Both DSP Mid-bass speakers are reading 3.5 Ohms.
One Bass speaker (the one working correctly) is reading 2 Ohms.
Three Bass speakers (the three noted by the vagcom) are open circuits.
As such, I can conclude that there is either a wiring issue (given the quality of service from my dealership thus far, I wouldn't put it past them to have disconnected the speakers and not reconnected them -- all the doors with speaker issues are the same doors that had the window motors replaced by the dealership) or the speakers are blown.
I will be removing the door trim when I obtain a tool to do so, and briding the + and - terminals on the speakers, then testing for impedence again (should be 0 Ohms). If this is true, the speakers are certainly the issue. If the circuit is still open, there is some sort of wiring problem.
What do you guys think? Does my logic hold water?
EDIT: I am totally at a loss looking for replacement speakers. As far as I understand, I need a subwoofer with 2 Ohm impedance that is 6 1/2". Is this correct? Anyone else replaced their bass speakers that can give me some help?


_Modified by Apple_Eater at 8:54 AM 9-17-2009_


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

I have removed the door panel and am making progress.
My next question: Does anyone know how to remove the speakers? I have checked the rear driver speaker and it is indeed problematic. The repair manual says to drill out the rivets, but I am not quite sure what this entails -- I am not excited about the idea of taking a drill to my Phaeton!
Also, it says to take note of the replacement part numbers for new rivets, but such a number I cannot find.
If you guys can help me out with the next step, I will be very happy


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Fine folks of the Phaeton forum:
I have an update on the speakers, and also a PSA for the good of all members.
Upon removing the door panel (what a job!) I tested the contacts directly on the speaker for an open circuit. To my dismay, the circuit was, in fact, open, meaning the speaker was toast. Not being one to quit easily, I decided to toy with the speaker. I pressed on the speaker (driver?) while touching the contact points and I got a beep, indicating a closed circuit. I pressed hard for a few seconds (be careful if you attempt this, it takes some finesse and you must press the right place, mine was near the upper-left of the speaker) and got a solid tone. I have since reconnected the amplifier and reassembled the car (excepting the door panel) and tested the speaker and voila! I now have a working speaker!
As far as I can tell, something was shaken loose inside the speaker. I choose to attribute this to the remarkable door slamming that has tortured my Phaeton.
To all Phaeton owners: Feel justified when you cringe as someone slams your door -- they might ruin your speakers!
I am hoping this is the same problem with the other two bass speakers, I will post my findings tomorrow when I have the energy to remove the other two door panels.
Thanks so much for your help guys, I couldn't have done it without you!


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Another update: This evening, I went to go listen to my radio. As soon as I turned the volume up past 50%, the speaker went out again. I'll see if I can do anything to fix it, but it seems like it really IS blown. Time to go shopping.


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

It sounds like you're capable and your troubleshooting skills follow logical paths.
I imagine you are relieved that the amplifier is not the component requiring replacement. If memory serves, I seem to remember that it is in the range of $700.
Bill


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (357Sig)*

I just finished removing the front driver door panel and was both pleasantly and unpleasantly surprised with what I found.
I removed the speaker from the door frame by removing the bolts. Upon closer inspection, I noticed the wires in the speaker appeared to be cut or broken somehow, shown in the following picture:








The wire appears (to me at least) to have been cut. The wire is not ripped from it's post, but rather cleanly cut about 1/8" from the terminal.
I have soldered the wire back to it's terminal (not pictured), reinstalled the speaker in the door, and voila! Now I have a speaker that is actually fixed, and I don't think it'll be temporary (I turned it all the way up -- no issues!)
The wire appears to have simply broken due to the bass hitting very hard. I've had to solder it twice so far, apparently there is a lot of strain on these wires.
If anyone else has issues with speakers not making any sound at all, DON'T assume it's blown, even if the dealer tells you so, if there is *no sound at all* you may want to check the speaker's internal wiring.


_Modified by Apple_Eater at 1:10 PM 9-18-2009_


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## excitablekid (Dec 30, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Please let us know how your speakers work in the next days.
I have been amazed/dismayed at the number of people with speaker problems in their Phaeton, and if there is some brittleness to the wiring causing the "blown" speakers it will certainly save a lot in future repairs if the problem you found proves to be common. 
Bravo, for your persistence. But please report the functional outcome.
Thanks,
Erick


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (excitablekid)*

I have removed the rear driver speaker from it's rivets and run some tests. I realized it did not have the same problem as the other speaker, and there was no way I could fix it, so I took it apart to see what had gone wrong.
I don't have any pictures, but somehow the voice coil (loops of wire going around the speaker) had been damaged.
One of the wires in the voice coil had been snapped in half, much like the other wiring in the front speaker. Since this was inside the voice coil, repair would be near impossible (I had to dremmel the casing to bits just to see the voice coil)
I will update you guys when I find what is amiss with the rear passenger side, and I will likely try to find new drivers to replace the rear two.
The front driver speaker is still working flawlessly after I soldered it for the second time -- I ran through some bass-intensive songs at max volume with no issues.


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## oldham4 (Apr 27, 2008)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*

Damon,
Which tool did you finally get for door trim removal, and where did you get it? You have motivated me to tackle this problem in my car now that instructions have been posted on removing the amplifier. 
Thanks,
George


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (Apple_Eater)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Apple_Eater* »_The wire appears (to me at least) to have been cut...

No, I doubt very much if it was cut. I have seen the identical problem myself on another Phaeton bass speaker. I've been really busy this week, and not had time to search for the photo (I think I have a photo of it).
My guess is that the speaker cone moves back and forth through quite a large distance, and it is possible that the wire fails due to vibration.
Michael


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## Apple_Eater (Aug 22, 2007)

*Re: Door trim removal -- Speaker replacement (PanEuropean)*

George,
I just picked up a garden-variety door trim removal tool from my local O'Reilly autoparts store. Here is a link to the product listing on their website:
http://www.oreillyauto.com/sit...49050
Other than being awkwardly shaped (very difficult to get it into the fasteners just right) it did the job perfectly -- I didn't break a single fastener.
Also, if you're looking at tackling the speakers, you will need a powered drill to drill through the rivet, and a rivet kit to replace them when finished.
I would also advise you to look into purchasing a repair manual from Bentley Publishers -- it has saved me much time and effort (although it is occasionally inaccurate).


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Well - a couple of years have passed since the last post on this subject (directly above), and today, I dropped in to see Willem whilst riding my motorcycle through the mountain twisties of central Netherlands. We took the driver door interior trim panel off his Phaeton to investigate a bass speaker that was not functioning. 

Sure enough, we found the same problem that was previously reported above - one of the wires that leads from the bass speaker cone had fractured (probably from metal fatigue) at the point where it is soldered onto the terminal of the speaker. 

It appears that this is sort of an design error on the part of Blaupunkt, who make these speakers. The speaker wires are soldered onto the terminal, then a small amount of epoxy (the black material) is painted over top of the soldered area. Unfortunately, the epoxy doesn't permit the wire to flex, and after a while, the wire just breaks off due to the back-and-forth movement of the speaker cone. The wire won't move away from the terminal when it breaks, so, if you are in there investigating, very gently poke the wire to see if it is still connected or if it has come loose. 

The repair is quite simple, you just remove the epoxy and re-solder the wire in place. It is easy to remove the speaker from the door to fix it - it is held in place with four screws, and has one quick-disconnect electrical connector on it. 

Be very judicious with solder when you re-attach the wire - you *DON'T* want to add more solder, and you especially don't want to allow either the existing solder or any new solder to "wick" further up the wire towards the speaker cone. The problem of the broken wire is caused (in the first instance) by too much solder wicking up the wire, which renders the wire inflexible. 

Michael 

*Broken Wire (typical) - Front Door Bass Speaker* 









*Michael & Willem - June 2011, Netherlands*


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## steveskinr (Oct 31, 2007)

Please post a picture of the mountain twisties of central Netherlands.


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)




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## WillemBal (Nov 20, 2010)

PanEuropean said:


> Well - a couple of years have passed since the last post on this subject (directly above), and today, I dropped in to see Willem whilst riding my motorcycle through the mountain twisties of central Netherlands. We took the driver door interior trim panel off his Phaeton to investigate a bass speaker that was not functioning.


 While Michael and I were having fun taking the door apart, fixing the speaker and talking and explaining all kinds of details to my Phaeton minded son, a tiny detail slipped through our attention… introducing another problem, which we first noticed while test driving. Just about every control on the door panel didn't function, including the window controls, trunk and gas cover. So that was good for 20 minutes more fun. It is amazing to see how simple it is to disassemble the door panel. The only condition is that you must have done it before. 
Here is the solution. 
I first checked and reseated just about every connector. When I came to check the little door handle lighting connector, I remembered that both Michael and I were both a bit puzzled about how it should be seated. Below photograph shows the connector just prior to sliding it into the jack. 

*Removed door trim panel with door handle lighting connector and jack - wrong way.* 










As you can see, there are two metal strips visible. This turned out to be wrong. These two metal strips should be positioned upside down. That way, only the other side, which is plain black plastic, can be seen. So what went wrong during our first attempt? 
This connector has two small notches on one side and so has the jack in which it fits. They are so small that it is still possible to reversely insert the connector; only moderate force is needed to do that. 
Note that after seating it correctly, the door handle did NOT light up straight away. This is caused by the interior lighting system which goes out after some idle time. Just closing and opening the door, paying attention not to damage the loose door trim panel, it did function again. 
So the fix was simple. Just reseat the door handle lighting connector properly, and there was no need to remove the entire door panel. But it was fun to do it myself this time and a good practice for the doing the job on the other bass speaker, of the front passenger door. 
Since the sound quality already has much improved, I'm looking forward to fix the other side. I will probably do that next week, when the procedure is still fresh in my mind. And with the help of Michael's excellently detailed instructions above and hands-on practice. 
Willem


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## wouterjansen60 (Aug 27, 2011)

*Subwoofer in trunk of Phaeton 3.0 TDI 2007*

Hello Michael, all Phaeton users,

I want to install a (Pioneer TS WX77A) subwoofer incl. amplifier in the trunk. 

Could u advise me where is the best place to hook up to the rear door bass speakers (in the trunk near the right battery? ). I just need to hook up to existing rear bass speakers, but preferably already in the trunk. Power connections are fairely easy as all connections are available.

Thx in advange,

Wouter Jansen, NL, Amsterdam
[email protected]

PS, i managed to exchange to xenonbulbs without trouble, thx to your clear workout in an other link.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi Wouter:

I am going to guess that the most probable "best place" to connect to the wires that lead to the two rear door speakers would be at or near the large connector that plugs into the existing amplifier for the sound system.

There are two types of sound systems in Phaetons: a 8 channel, 10 speaker system that is standard equipment, and an optional 12 channel, 12 speaker system.

If you have a look in the Phaeton Forum 'Table of Contents' (FAQ by Category), you will find discussions there that explain how to identify which system is which, and you will also find PDFs of wiring diagrams for both of these systems (the wiring is very different between the two). The PDFs should enable you to identify the correct wires by correlating the pin numbers on the connector to the wires that feed to the two rear door bass speakers.

Michael


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

Wouter, if you're going to amplify the signal to the subwoofer, isn't it the pre-amp output you need, not the speaker level wires? Or are you talking about driving the rear door speakers with filtered output from the amp?


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## wouterjansen60 (Aug 27, 2011)

*Installing a Active subwoofer (pioneer tx ws77a) in trunk Phaeton*



invisiblewave said:


> Wouter, if you're going to amplify the signal to the subwoofer, isn't it the pre-amp output you need, not the speaker level wires? Or are you talking about driving the rear door speakers with filtered output from the amp?


Hi ,

Well, i just need to connect straight to the speakerwires, preferably the rear door bass speakers left and right as my active subwoofer is prepared for this input i guess this is indeed the filtered speaker output). I know the audio amplifier is located on the left side in the trunk behind the (starter) battery, just now trying to find out the pin-colorscheme. I do have the 12 channel amp. System...

So, if anyone can tell me which pins i need to use for both left and right low bass rear speaker, i am a happy man ... Thx a lot


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## wouterjansen60 (Aug 27, 2011)

wouterjansen60 said:


> Hi ,
> 
> Well, i just need to connect straight to the speakerwires, preferably the rear door bass speakers left and right as my active subwoofer is prepared for this input i guess this is indeed the filtered speaker output). I know the audio amplifier is located on the left side in the trunk behind the (starter) battery, just now trying to find out the pin-colorscheme. I do have the 12 channel amp. System...
> 
> So, if anyone can tell me which pins i need to use for both left and right low bass rear speaker, i am a happy man ... Thx a lot


Correction, the amp is located on the right site. The wiring schedule mention indeed about a J 525 controller..... This is not the amp?


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## WillemBal (Nov 20, 2010)

wouterjansen60 said:


> Correction, the amp is located on the right site. The wiring schedule mention indeed about a J 525 controller..... This is not the amp?


Yep, J525 is the amp. 
But won't the outside world will be hearing more of your subwoofer than yourself? What is the added value?
Willem


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## wouterjansen60 (Aug 27, 2011)

WillemBal said:


> Yep, J525 is the amp.
> But won't the outside world will be hearing more of your subwoofer than yourself? What is the added value?
> Willem


Ur welcome to hear the result yourself in Amsterdam (and yes, i do still manage to park that Phaeton there) , and i am sure that many Phaeton users would love to add some more finest deep basses. I am sure u will love one too. Btw, apart of Michaels great information sources i did found somewere the specific connector wiringcolors and numbers..., upload will follow, and some pics.. Many more other related questions, but later


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## WillemBal (Nov 20, 2010)

Ahhh, Amsterdam...Perhaps this proves how burglar proof the Phaeton is. Anyway, I wasn't sure whether you found the wiring or not. So I organized the information I already gathered about the wiring and interconnections with the purpose to upgrade the infotainment system. Fruitless so far, but the information can be useful at times. Here you go:










You probably need just the RF and LF BWFR (Bass speaker) terminals. The legend of acronyms and speaker definitions is given below:

Legenda
*Abbrev.	Description VW description*
TWTR	Tweeter Treble speaker
SQKR	Squawker Mid range speaker
MWFR	Mid bass woofer Mid bass speaker
BWFR	Woofer Bass speaker
LF Left front
RF Right front
LR Left rear
RR Right rear

Would be great to hear the result when you have installed the sub woofer! 

Willem


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## wouterjansen60 (Aug 27, 2011)

*Phaeton Audio J525 controller / amp. pin layout*



wouterjansen60 said:


> Ur welcome to hear the result yourself in Amsterdam (and yes, i do still manage to park that Phaeton there) , and i am sure that many Phaeton users would love to add some more finest deep basses. I am sure u will love one too. Btw, apart of Michaels great information sources i did found somewere the specific connector wiringcolors and numbers..., upload will follow, and some pics.. Many more other related questions, but later


Thx Willem, now just collect the Guts for this operation and some reasonabe temperatures to do the work . Keep you updated. Amazing what a inlormation is availbale over here. 
Have a good weekend, Wouter


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## wouterjansen60 (Aug 27, 2011)

*Phaeton subwoofer*

Dear all,

After carefully investigation the wiring scheme, i finally decided to ask a professional installer to do the job, a good move as they needed approx. 3h just to install the Pioneer WX77A active subwoofer in the trunk...

A major job, right (starter) battery has to be removed, lost of wiring has to be loosen, not even to mention how to bring the subwoofer userpanel up to the front. Indeed, the rear seat had to be removed aswell. In total it resulted in 3h Laborcost, however it works fine now and the coffee during installation was nice 

I am not able to upload some pics yet (not easy on this forum as new user), but the main message is, don't you ever think to do it yourself, even when it "just seems" a simple connection to speaker wiring....

Additional i decided to install a Solista unit, that was fairely easy to install and now i can enjoy my Iphone music or USBstick with music. The CD player however is useless now. There are specific treats on this on this forum.

Regards,
Wouter


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## wouterjansen60 (Aug 27, 2011)

*Installing a subwoofer in trunk of Phaeton 3.0 TDI 2007*










I toke a while, but here the first picture in order to get an idea how complex it is to get access to the speaker control unit. It is located behind the right side battery. Later i post the subwoofer itself lokated in the trunk. And o boy, what a sound now


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## oca123 (Jan 14, 2012)

Well, he never posted pics of the subwoofer. I did something similar in mine. Here are some pics. Let's see if you can spot what's strange about them.


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Ummm - that's a lot of wires to cut confidently with the starter battery still connected... even if the other one is presumably off.

Or is it the nice paint colour? 

CB


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## jkuisma (Nov 23, 2009)

Dude, your battery isolation relay is on the wrong side, belongs to the left, together with accessory battery... ...on a second though, must say you're trolling on a wrong forum, it ain't a Phaeton you've gutted 

Looks like a pretty intensive wiring project. Got it back together again?

Jouko


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## EnglishPhaeton (Dec 6, 2010)

jkuisma said:


> Dude, your battery isolation relay is on the wrong side, belongs to the left, together with accessory battery... ...on a second though, must say you're trolling on a wrong forum, it ain't a Phaeton you've gutted
> 
> Looks like a pretty intensive wiring project. Got it back together again?
> 
> Jouko


Jouko,

I think from his post its a Continental GT

Stu


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

CGT, P - same thing as far as the platform technicals are concerned, apart from a few parts prefix changes to guarantee a doubled maintenance cost.

There is no equivalent to this forum for the Bentley, so it's great to hear what's going on upstairs!

CB


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## EnglishPhaeton (Dec 6, 2010)

Paximus said:


> CGT, P - same thing as far as the platform technicals are concerned, apart from a few parts prefix changes to guarantee a doubled maintenance cost.
> 
> There is no equivalent to this forum for the Bentley, so it's great to hear what's going on upstairs!
> 
> CB


Chris,

and others....... would it not be prudent to invite CGT and CFS owners to slum it with us? I'm sure there would be some mileage in it for all concerned.

Stu


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

I'm sure that's a good idea. Last year I posted a couple of links hooking tech discussion back here in the VWVortex Bentley area (where the tumbleweed is only occasionally disturbed by the drifting sands!).

CB


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

What??? It's bad enough with the Phaeton tweed jackets, god only knows what it'll be like here with the WAGs & their bling!


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

They do fit the best after-market digital sound systems though!


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## EnglishPhaeton (Dec 6, 2010)

invisiblewave said:


> What??? It's bad enough with the Phaeton tweed jackets, god only knows what it'll be like here with the WAGs & their bling!


Waggy and Blingy?????????


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Paul:

Please ignore the playground banter from our Bash Street chums, a P rebadged and shoved into a CGT carrosserie would double in value...

And I still don't know what's unusual in your photos!

CB


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## oca123 (Jan 14, 2012)

Yup, it's a CGT, not a P.

Whenever someone comments on my car, I tell them that it's actually a VW. Most of them don't believe me.
Yes, I got it back together perfectly fine... I wish I had pictures, but this has been a lot of fun... I cut up the front doors to install some massive mid-bass drivers... I modified the a-pillars to install Focal mids+tweets... I had a carputer with a screen showing real-time FFT graphs in the trunk for a while....

Now I just gutted everything out again, as I am getting ready to build a massive 4th order bandpass subwoofer box that will fire through that ski hole. I actually ended up hiring an acoustical engineer to draw up blueprints for that one... should have them next week.

This car has only been seeing maybe 2000 miles/year. With this last batch of sound system goodness, I hope to make it a daily driver... at least until it starts falling apart.

I wish there was an easy way to upgrade the alternator without having to drop the engine. I could use 300 amps... since it's a 4 wheel drive, would it be possible/easy/how costly to install a 2nd alternator back there?

P

PS: playground banter is fun! And yes, a used P in a CGT body would double in value... which is sad... but sparks some ideas...
Let's get some used P's, some body kits from this company http://www.autoevolution.com/news/b...based-on-chrysler-sebring-for-sale-29603.html and lets make some money!!!


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

OK, I added some aftermarket bling brass buttons to the tweed jacket!


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## casezoo1 (May 8, 2010)

*Does anyone have the procedure for removing the rear door interior panel?*

Does anyone have the procedure for removing the rear door interior panel?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

casezoo1 said:


> Does anyone have the procedure for removing the rear door interior panel?


Yes, see here: Keyless Entry Issues (consolidated discussions)


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## gamocles (Feb 4, 2016)

*Bentley speaker wiring diagram*

Anybody have the 12 speaker wiring diagram?


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