# 1.8T into Mk3: just need the basic rundown



## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Since searching for "1.8t" seems not possible, I was wondering if anyone could link me to the (no doubt countless) 1.8T swap info threads. THis is for my Mk3.5 Cabrio (though, mechanically, it's the exact same as a Mk3, it doens't have the immobilizer etc that a later Cabrio does). I would like to know the differences between the multitude of 1.8T engines, as well as the best sources for components. Block, head, turbo, exhaust manifold, intake setup, accessory bolt-ons. I have the transmissions and beefier 5 ;lug suspension and 11" brakes all lined up already, and the elctrical swap won't be difficult for me (though I'd like to know what's the best management to run, and if immo defeat is the only way to get it to work, or if I can make it work with a later Mk3.5 immo installed). 

I'll continue my search as best I can, and link to whatever I find too. Thanks!


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## kpi103 (Mar 6, 2005)

*conversion*

http://blackforestindustries.com/blog/2013/01/21/mk3-1-8t-drop-in-conversion/
Just an idea.


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## SpacedOutStar (Aug 23, 2013)

You really come down to DBW or DBC and wideband or narrowband O2. I would look for a wideband car and use this as a swap because there is a lot of tuning for it. Wideband cars use DBW and you can buy conversion harnesses for about $300 - $400 that will mate them to CE2 so the swap is not that hard. If you get a 2001 Audi A4 1.8T ECM it does not use a immo or you can simply disable it on any ECM and if you are handy with a hex editor you can go to nefmoto.com and learn how to do it. If you get a DBW swap it would be either ME7.1 (narrowband) or ME7.5 (wideband) and I am only taking about MK4, B5, or B6, not familiar with the other models. My Audi was a DBW car but it was narrowband so I bought a ME7.5 ECM, MAF, wideband O2 sensor, and a $150 Raceland conversion harness and now it is ME7.5 with wideband. My year did not come with VVT so this has been resitered off but everything else is functional and the ECM connector is the same. 

Ideally you want to look at MK4 or TT because all of the accessories and manifolds will work without swapping out for the transverse ones. If you are running ME7.1/7.5 you can also find a lot of information about tuning and even free tunes. My buddy is running a Stage 2 tune he got from one of the tuning forums and he found a script to add Antilag and no lift shift so we added this on as well. If it were me I would find a ME7.5 car and grab that or if it came down to it I would settle for a ME7.1 and then covert it to wideband. I am BT so I have to run Stage 3 so I did the wideband swap and went with Maestro which allows me to tune it using a simple interface. For the love of god, whatever you do make sure to drop the oil pan and inspect the pickup screen for the oil pump and make sure it is not blocked. 

I don't know if that helps or confuses things, ask if you don't understand or have more questions.


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## izcorrado18 (Aug 21, 2005)

Check out mine and 20VT. Several 1.8T swap guys posted in our thread.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

kpi103 said:


> http://blackforestindustries.com/blog/2013/01/21/mk3-1-8t-drop-in-conversion/
> Just an idea.


Nah, been following that from the start but that's not how i want to go about my conversion. Thanks though. 



SpacedOutStar said:


> You really come down to DBW or DBC and wideband or narrowband O2. I would look for a wideband car and use this as a swap because there is a lot of tuning for it. Wideband cars use DBW and you can buy conversion harnesses for about $300 - $400 that will mate them to CE2 so the swap is not that hard. If you get a 2001 Audi A4 1.8T ECM it does not use a immo or you can simply disable it on any ECM and if you are handy with a hex editor you can go to nefmoto.com and learn how to do it. If you get a DBW swap it would be either ME7.1 (narrowband) or ME7.5 (wideband) and I am only taking about MK4, B5, or B6, not familiar with the other models. My Audi was a DBW car but it was narrowband so I bought a ME7.5 ECM, MAF, wideband O2 sensor, and a $150 Raceland conversion harness and now it is ME7.5 with wideband. My year did not come with VVT so this has been resitered off but everything else is functional and the ECM connector is the same.
> 
> Ideally you want to look at MK4 or TT because all of the accessories and manifolds will work without swapping out for the transverse ones. If you are running ME7.1/7.5 you can also find a lot of information about tuning and even free tunes. My buddy is running a Stage 2 tune he got from one of the tuning forums and he found a script to add Antilag and no lift shift so we added this on as well. If it were me I would find a ME7.5 car and grab that or if it came down to it I would settle for a ME7.1 and then covert it to wideband. I am BT so I have to run Stage 3 so I did the wideband swap and went with Maestro which allows me to tune it using a simple interface. For the love of god, whatever you do make sure to drop the oil pan and inspect the pickup screen for the oil pump and make sure it is not blocked.
> 
> I don't know if that helps or confuses things, ask if you don't understand or have more questions.


This is extremely helpful, thanks! I hear DBW is more tunable, so that sounds like a good idea. 

So the best car for the full swap would be a ME7.5 Mk4. But I'll likely have to piece together the setup, it seems. I can handle that. What years were 7.5? The whole shebang, block, head, manifolds etc will basically bolt in? Since they're later engines, I assume they're all internal waterpump? That is the only mechanical difference I know for 1.8Ts, is there anything else to watch out for? For eexample what engines do I find VVT on? I know that only the NB had a 150hp hardware engine, would those be the old 7.1s? meaning, are all 7.5s 180hp plus tuneability? I'm actually more interested in economy than power (though anything is obviously an upgrade over my ABA), so VVT etc that I can help tune to get the best economy would be awesome. 

Do you have a link handy for that conversion harness? I think I have seen it before, but can't remember where. Are these the 121 pin ECUs? I have done a pinout of those just to get an idea of how they work. Do you have any specific engine codes for me to look for?

It sounds almost like when I mod my phone... you can pick this or that, at your pleasure, and install yourself, haha. WHat do you use to do that? Can VAG-COM components be used? It would be an even greater incentive for me to get one.



dri0514 said:


> Check out mine and 20VT. Several 1.8T swap guys posted in our thread.


I'll poke around and see what I can find, thanks :thumbup:


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## SpacedOutStar (Aug 23, 2013)

VDub2625 said:


> This is extremely helpful, thanks! I hear DBW is more tunable, so that sounds like a good idea.
> 
> So the best car for the full swap would be a ME7.5 Mk4. But I'll likely have to piece together the setup, it seems. I can handle that. What years were 7.5? The whole shebang, block, head, manifolds etc will basically bolt in? Since they're later engines, I assume they're all internal waterpump? That is the only mechanical difference I know for 1.8Ts, is there anything else to watch out for? For eexample what engines do I find VVT on? I know that only the NB had a 150hp hardware engine, would those be the old 7.1s? meaning, are all 7.5s 180hp plus tuneability? I'm actually more interested in economy than power (though anything is obviously an upgrade over my ABA), so VVT etc that I can help tune to get the best economy would be awesome.


The 2001 and newer TT with the 180hp motor has a K03s, VVT, and wideband and the 2002 and newer Jetta/Golf got the same. I'm more of an Audi guy with these motors (as in longitudinally mounted) but I know the wideband cars used the 06A block with the internal coolant pump and smaller wrist pins. The earlier narrowband TT/Golf/Jetta may have had the 06A block, this I am not sure of but all wideband cars had VVT so this is one thing to look for. Stay away from the NB 1.8T, these motors are not as strong and although they are 1.8T motors they should be avoided like hookers with a rash. There is a lot of tuning for ME7.1 as well, check out the S4 Wiki if you want to see what these guys have been doing but wideband is more common now and has obvious advantages. All 2.7T motors were narrowband as far as I know so those guys have to work with what they got.



VDub2625 said:


> Do you have a link handy for that conversion harness? I think I have seen it before, but can't remember where. Are these the 121 pin ECUs? I have done a pinout of those just to get an idea of how they work. Do you have any specific engine codes for me to look for?


There are many harnesses, this is one for $375 and it makes it plug and play for your car with CE2... http://stancedubs.bigcartel.com/product/plug-play-mk4-engine-swap-harness The 180hp motor is the AWP which you can also use tunes from a AWM and maybe some others, need to research. My ECM is the AWM from a 2001 B5 A4 and I run the AWP Maestro tunes in it. 




VDub2625 said:


> It sounds almost like when I mod my phone... you can pick this or that, at your pleasure, and install yourself, haha. WHat do you use to do that? Can VAG-COM components be used? It would be an even greater incentive for me to get one.


VAG-COM or VCDS as it is now known can't do anything more than you can already do now, it can check codes and change the coding of the control modules but it can't be used to flash the ECM. I used Maestro which comes with its own tuning suite and I use this to upload flashes to the car or to make changes to the existing flash. If you want to look for free tunes and the like then you will need to use something else. NefMoto has a nice flasher and it is free and can read most ME7.1/7.5 ECM's so if you don't want to pay $800 for a single licence on Maestro then the NefMoto flasher would be for you. A lot of these guys are hardcore and actually capture the current tune and then modify them with hex editors and then flash them back. I didn't really want to learn that much so I went with the easier option which still has a huge learning curve. The great thing about either is you can screw with what you want and if you break it you just flash the last working tune and carry on. No matter what, you need to flash, log, examine log, and then change or you can easily damage the motor in a very expensive way. Best option is to do the swap with the the stock tune, kill the immo, and drive it for a bit and then start modding it. If you want launch control or no lift shift you can flash this on a stock tune or a modded one but you can kiss the cat goodbye if you use this too much.



I'll poke around and see what I can find, thanks :thumbup:[/QUOTE]


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

I did find this out:

codes with VVT:
Mk4: AWW, AWP
NB: AWV, BKF, BNU
Passat: AWM
Audi: AMB

If that helps anybody. 

So, for a one-stop purchase, i want a 2002 or newer. I have been going through the wiring diagrams for the AWW/AWP for the last few hours and it is similar to all the other cars with the 121 pin ECU. Good to know. 

I like that harness, but I might just cut/splice the connectors for ECU to fuse box, since it seems pretty easy to do. I'll post pinouts when I'm finished researching in case it helps anyone else too. 

I am sorry, I didn't mean to imply that VAG-COM software could help with a flash, but the hardware should work with any computer software flash, right? The learning curve doesn't scare me, computers are my thing and this will open a whole new set of options for me 

I honestly didn't think 1.8Ts were so easy to swap. I thought you had to do a ton of custom wiring and custom hardware. 

One thing I may have a problem with is I plan to try to run the stock, under-battery Mk3 TDI intercooler. My plate doesn't say OEMPLS for nothing  but are there any problems you think I might run into? Such as pipe direction etc? The intake being on the left side seems to make that very difficult. How about keeping the stock Mk3 airbox? I suppose there isn't an easy way to feed the turbo from the opposite side either.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

In case this helps anyone, this is what I've found:

codes with VVT:
Mk4: AWW, AWP
NB: AWV, BKF, BNU
Passat: AWM
Audi: AMB



T10h	Blue	Kick down switch. closed throttle position (CTP) switch, throttle position (TP) sensor, leak detection pump (LDP), angle sensors for throttle drive (power acceleration actuation)
T10h/1	br/ws & br/bl	throttle position sensor 2 signal?
T10h/2	gn/ws & gr/ws	throttle position sensor 2 pwr/gnd?
T10h/3	ge/gn	throttle position sensor 1 pwr/gnd?
T10h/4	gr/ro	throttle position sensor 1 pwr/gnd?
T10h/5	ws/bl	throttle position sensor 1 signal?
T10h/6	gr/bl	throttle position sensor 2 pwr/gnd?
T10h/7	ge/br	LDP motor
T10h/8	bl/ge	diesel ECU pin 33 to power supply relay (engine electronics)
T10h/9	gn/li	LDP switch
T10h/10	bl/li & gn	speed sensor for 5 speed automatic

T6	Brown	Starter, power supply for engine control module (ECM), fuel pump (FP) relay
T6/1	Sw & sw/li	15 power to ECU (20a fused)
T6/2	li/ws	fuel pump relay or glow plug relay
T6/3	ro/sw	starter
T6/4	ro/gn	30 power to Ecu etc (15/20a fused)
T6/5	bl/ge	fuel pump relay power to MAF, AIR solenoid & relay, EVAp purge valve and Ho2s heaters
T6/6	ge/sw or bl/ge	fuel pump relay power to PCV heating element, or power to coolant preheating relays

T10	orange	Instrument cluster, back−up lights, anti−theft immobilizer/data link connection, air conditioning
T10/1	gr/ws	instrument cluster (electronic power control warning?)
T10/2	gn/ro or gr/ws or gn/ws	Ecu to instrument cluster (MFA only, MPG signal?)
T10/3	bl/gn or li/ws	ECU to booster control (auto) or glow plug relay
T10/4	ws	Ecu to coolant fan control module and AC high pressure sensor
T10/5	ro/sw	ignition switch/PNP relay D50/b (starter) to ?
T10/6	bl/ws	VSS
T10/7	gn/gr or gn	ECU to AC clutch “on”
T10/8	bl/ro	ECU to AC switch “on”
T10/9	gn/br	Tachometer signal to Climatronic unit (climatronic only) and instrument cluster
T10/10	sw/bl	backup light switch

T10e	black	cruise control
T10e/1	bl/gr to bl	cruise control 1
T10e/2	ro/ge	cruise control set switch
T10e/3	sw/ws to sw/ge	cruise control on switch?
T10e/4	sw/ro to ro/sw	brake light switch
T10e/5	ws/ge	brake pedal switch
T10e/6	gn or li/br	Ecu to ?, or TCM to tiptronic switch
T10e/7	li/ro	TCM to tiptronic switch
T10e/8	gn	diesel ECU to glow plug relay
T10e/9	ws	cruise control 0/1
T10e/10	li	TCM to tiptronic switch

T10w	white	Generator (GEN), Data Link Connection (DLC) (low and high bus), Cruise control
T10w/1	li/ge & ws/ro	ECU to DLC connector pin 13
T10w/2	or/sw to sw	CAN high
T10w/3	or/br to ws	CAN low
T10w/4	ws/ro	clutch pedal switch
T10w/5	bl/li to br/ro	alternator pin DFM
T10w/6	br/ws	ECU to coolant fan control module pin 11 (fan switch pin 2)
T10w/7	bl	Ecu to diesel fuel pump relay
T10w/8	ge/ro	Ecu to Coolant fan control module pin 7 (fan switch pin 3)
T10w/9	ro/sw	Ecu to starter (2.0 code BBW only) (post-interlock)
T10w/10	ro/br	Ecu to ignition switch pin 50 (start) (2.0 code BBW only) (pre-interlock)


While it's not 100% complete (I didn't specify what wires go to what engine, etc), it does tell me, "if I have this wire, this is it's function". With this information, I feel confident enough to wire this myself rather than needing an adapter harness. Thought I'd post it in case anyone else wanted it


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