# bike carbs on my mk3



## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

ok so i desided i was wanting to put bike carbs on my mk3 golf, i was just wanting to see if anyone had done this on here its an obd1 2.0 i was hoping that u guys could help me out with what all i need and what all i have to do. thanks


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## 95jetta17 (Jan 21, 2008)

:laugh:


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## zrace07 (Jul 26, 2007)

*FV-QR*

:facepalm:


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

dont worry its gonna happen and its gonna work haha


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## polofreaks (Aug 14, 2005)

I think they usually use yamaha R1 carbs when doing this. ... . I dont know much more about it.


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

thanks ur the first one to actually give an answer not think im stupid for doing this haha


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## 95jetta17 (Jan 21, 2008)

94_golf said:


> dont worry its gonna happen and its gonna work haha


says every noob :facepalm:


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

and yet it works so jokes on u haha


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## Big Cojones (Mar 2, 2010)

This should help you out.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?1288305-FAQ-Carbs

In the technical section there is a carbs, ITB's abd SEM forum in there. You should be able to get alot more info in there than here. GL


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## 97trekker (Dec 9, 2010)

all anyone does is make fun of everyone else dont worry man goodluck its your project **** everyone else


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

thanks man i aint worrying about it if it works it works and i got a cool little mk3 and if not i put it back to the way it was doesnt really change a whole lot


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## Hurt (May 3, 2011)

Not many people bike carb or ITB a crossflow head. If you want power out of your 8v, just get the c2 turbo kit.


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

i would but i dont have the time or the money to do the turbo thing right but prolly sometime in the future for sure


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## 95jetta17 (Jan 21, 2008)

Hurt said:


> Not many people bike carb or ITB a crossflow head. If you want power out of your 8v, just get the c2 turbo kit.


i would do ITB over bike carbs...i dont see you getting a huge gain of power for the effort you would put in


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## youlostme21 (Aug 12, 2008)

I think its more for the cool factor in this application. If you were putting it in a mk1 or something then it wold cut out alot excess stuff. 
Posts pics/video when you get her running, sounds like a cool lil project.


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## jbigs268 (Dec 1, 2009)

95jetta17 said:


> i would do ITB over bike carbs...i dont see you getting a huge gain of power for the effort you would put in


x2
and ITBs are badass.


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## RatBustard (Jun 15, 2007)

one of my favorite mk3s:



















http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4076881-The-Final-Chapter


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## crackershack99 (Jan 20, 2006)

95jetta17 said:


> i would do ITB over bike carbs...i dont see you getting a huge gain of power for the effort you would put in


Do the ITBs and the turbo. You will not be sorry


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

ok so i havent brushed up on my stuff lately itbs r basicly like velocity stacks rnt they and all u r truely acomplishing by this is basicly moving ur fuel rail out a bit haha


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## 12vsex (May 2, 2011)

crackershack99 said:


> Do the ITBs and the turbo. You will not be sorry


you cant have itb's and a turbo.. its one or the other:facepalm:
You could in theory put a plenum over the itb setup but you would have so many issues with the crossflow.Reason being that all n/a intake manifolds are tuned based on intake pulse waves. ITBs allow more precise and less restriced intake based on vaccuum. Pressurizing it nulls pretty much all of the benefits and in some cases can hinder airflow seeing as the butterflys dirrectly in the runners can create turbulance whereas one single TB in a plenum give the intake time to converge and enter the head as smoothly as the manifold will allow.


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

12vsex said:


> you cant have itb's and a turbo.. its one or the other


Oh....


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## 95jetta17 (Jan 21, 2008)

tdogg74 said:


> Oh....


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## Sallad (Aug 29, 2004)

12vsex said:


> you cant have itb's and a turbo.. its one or the other:facepalm:


Really, eh? Do more research before posting.



As for the ITB question, in the 16v world, a lot of guys use GSX-R carbs. Nice power gains doing this.


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## 95jetta17 (Jan 21, 2008)

Tdogg i want more info on that setup


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## jbigs268 (Dec 1, 2009)

95jetta17 said:


> Tdogg i want more info on that setup


x2

that looks nuts


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## BHCfarkas (Jul 18, 2008)

This thread is a cluster **** of stupid.

R1 carbs work on most engines just fine, and it's apparent that the OP is simply doing it for the cool factor. 

OP really needs to do more research on the difference between ITBs and Carbs, however.

And to the guy who said you can't turbo an ITB or even a Carbed car for that matter, needs excused from this thread.


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## crackershack99 (Jan 20, 2006)

12vsex said:


> you cant have itb's and a turbo.. its one or the other:facepalm:
> You could in theory put a plenum over the itb setup but you would have so many issues with the crossflow.Reason being that all n/a intake manifolds are tuned based on intake pulse waves. ITBs allow more precise and less restriced intake based on vaccuum. Pressurizing it nulls pretty much all of the benefits and in some cases can hinder airflow seeing as the butterflys dirrectly in the runners can create turbulance whereas one single TB in a plenum give the intake time to converge and enter the head as smoothly as the manifold will allow.



Wow I guess Ill have to quit driving my jetta now that it will not work.


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## 12vsex (May 2, 2011)

never said it was inpossible, and never said anything about carbs. I just said that you would have problems with the crossflow head design. ITBs are mostly about throttle response. They pretty much give you the best possible throttle response because they minimize the "throttled volume" (volume between the TB and the heads.)They are the main reason sport bikes can rev so quick, then back down to idle in a heartbeat. Granted rotational inertia plays a big role too (exe flywheel, and light weight internals), but the throttled volume is the no#1 key here. By decreasing the time it takes the engine to see the air (or lack of) from the TB, the faster the engine will respond to inputs.
The problem with just making the throttled volume very small with a single TB is that you need to have a plenum (air capacitor) between the TB and the heads. A small plenum will hurt top end power. So this is a tough decision on how big to make the plenum as there is no "best" size. Where you gain in one area, you loose from the other. With ITBs on a turbo engine, you can have both a small throttled volume and large plenum. They should help with air/fuel mixing as they create quite a bit of turbulence right above the injectors (think TGV that works through out the RPM) at half throttles. The large plenum should also allow better cylinder filling at high RPMs as well. ITBs by themselves, usually gain a little HP too from increased flow. There are some critical design keys that MUST be implemented however when doing your own ITB / Turbo kit. Its all about the size of the trumpets and plenum. Ease of tuning is ultimately what it comes down to on a street car. Neither is it a "good value " mod. The amount of money involved is basicly retarded. What you are attempting is pretty ambitious and I admire you for attempting something so difficult......However what you are suggesting on a Econo Motor from vw sounds like a recipe for disaster; if you do not have near perfect knowledge of the amount of air that is in each cylinder at any one time then you risk very severe engine damage. My worry would be that the noise in the 'MAP' signal would be sufficent to make your base spark table nonsense and impossible to calibrate. Also what will the difference be between transient and steady state running with the set up you have???Why dont you try and find an alternative challenge which is actually do-able and wont risk a hugely expensive engine bill at the end of it. Honestly not wanting to pi$$ on your chips - but just dont want you to wreck your motor! this is diff with carbs ( In all this is for itb's ) no ecu or things relative to that are needed for side drafts. all im trying to say is itb's are redundant with a turbo. Look at what nissan did with their skylines... removed their itbs when they went to Turbo. they had better gains from a manifold and 1 tb. Its all about function not looks unfortunately. However if your going for looks then by all means do what you want. For the amount of $$$$$ spent on getting the car to run well you could have 2x the boost on a well built motor using 1tb and a nice manifold or plenum.


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## xcrashx (Mar 20, 2009)

Did you really not notice that the guy above you posted a picture of his car, which actually has itbs AND a turbo? Judging by his work and the look of the engine bay, im pretty sure he know what hes talking about. Also you and didnt have to write a huge ass essay thats confusing as **** and so technical that pretty much no one will read it :screwy:

your thinking way to hard for your own good bub :facepalm:


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

yea kinda gave up like 3 sentences in haha


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## Dmoneythegreat (Jan 13, 2010)

So much fail in this thread


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## 12vsex (May 2, 2011)

never said anything about his car.. I wrote what I did to state that im not stupid. His car works yeah... Never said it didnt, I would like to know what went into it and how easy it was to tune it. Im about functionality and easy tuning. Plain and simple... Its harder than it sounds to put both FI and ITB's on a car. Its not at all a bolt on and go thing. somone who doesnt know what they are doing will destroy a motor


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## crackershack99 (Jan 20, 2006)

12vsex said:


> never said anything about his car.. I wrote what I did to state that im not stupid. His car works yeah... Never said it didnt, I would like to know what went into it and how easy it was to tune it. Im about functionality and easy tuning. Plain and simple... Its harder than it sounds to put both FI and ITB's on a car. Its not at all a bolt on and go thing. somone who doesnt know what they are doing will destroy a motor


The planning was the worst part. The tunning wasnt that bad due to O34 stand alone and a wide band 02. I was lucky enough that the shop that put it together had done a couple of ITB FI cars before mine. Mine was the first two liter and there have been a ton of growing pains. I am beyond happy with the preformance. All in all it took three year to get it right.


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

so yamaha r1 carbs off like a 1000 or does it really matter? and how much time do u think this would take haha


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

Im moving this to the ITB forum where it will get more traffic.


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## BHCfarkas (Jul 18, 2008)

94_golf said:


> so yamaha r1 carbs off like a 1000 or does it really matter? and how much time do u think this would take haha


Do you have any idea what its going to take to run carbs? This isn't an ******* question, but I'm not sure you're ready to take on a project like this judging from the questions you're asking. Carbs are relatively easy to work with and I've gone from a fuel injected setup to carb a couple times on my previous project cars.


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

dude ive had bigger projects than this im just seeing what all im gonna need for this i was more of old american cars, carbs is something i enjoy working on, its just the first time ive done an import to carbs, rather ask an assload of questions then not enough


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## psychobandito (Sep 10, 2009)

what's your plan for ignition?


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## 94_golf (Feb 3, 2011)

keep the distrib. i guess it shouldnt have any affect on that haha


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## psychobandito (Sep 10, 2009)

Read the entire carb faq.


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## 86Franklin (Apr 5, 2008)

94_golf said:


> so yamaha r1 carbs off like a 1000 or does it really matter? and how much time do u think this would take haha


R1 (the 1 stands for 1000).... and it depends if you are going to build the manifold to adapt the carbs to the head or not. If a shop does it, it will probably take 2+weeks and they will also need the car (or whatever head you are planning on using) and the carbs. Bike carbs are probably the cheapest alternative to a FI setup except for just keeping it stock. You can expect on spending 600 and more if you dont make your own manifold. If you don't know how to tune bike carbs or any carburetor for that matter you should either search and read everything you can before asking anymore questions. This is your project not ours. If you truly get stumped and haven't had luck with any searches then ask a question. There are plenty of threads in the Carbs, ITBs tech forum that go into pretty good detail on this subject. That goes for both 16v and crossflow 8v. 

Tthe jist.. Research to see if bike carbs are what you want vs. other setups. Then research some more on how its done, pros and cons. All this information is out there. ON this forum and plenty others. 

Heres my 2 cents to you personally. seeing as you asked this question with out searching and if you did it obviously wasnt a good effort. I suggest you read every bike carb related post in the carbs, ITB forum. If you dont feel like doing that then i don't think you should even consider doing this swap...

Edit: bike carbs greater than 36mm will be best. Preferably 38 or 40mm. Frozen337 has done an crossflow bike carb setup, search his posts. Also if your state has any emission laws you might as well forget about it.


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## psychobandito (Sep 10, 2009)

If you don't think carbs are going to change your ignition, you're going to have a lot of trouble.


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## FAh-kit8vt (Oct 19, 2009)

12vsex said:


> you cant have itb's and a turbo.. .











i usually don't post on here. but i felt compelled.


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