# Using Mobil1 at 130k...and not liking it.



## ocharlas (Jul 2, 2007)

I've put about 60k on this car over the last couple years, predominantly (but not exclusively) on Mobil1 0-40, and i've been pretty happy with it. However, last time I went to autozone they were out of it so I picked up a jug of the high mileage extended performance 10-30 I believe. I figured even if it says it's good for 15k I'd change it out after around 7k, no harm done. 

Well after running it for about a week I went for a pretty hard drive, and when I stopped I noticed my car a) smelled, b) sounded rough, and c) had some smoke coming off the engine. When I cracked the oil cap I noticed some light smoking coming out. Checked the oil level, fine. Since then I've noticed the crispy smell hanging around and it still sounds kind of rough. Now I'm wondering if this oil can't really handle aggressive driving. I started researching a little bit and finding out about different oils and zinc levels and whatnot. Is there another oil I should be using that will offer better protection, between the 130k on my engine and my tendency to disregard speed limits?

I also have a gutted cat so I'm not concerned about ruining it with high levels of zinc, and I see a lot of people recommending premium brands like motul, liquimolli, pentosin, etc...also any weight recommendations, 0-40, 10-40...20-50? Car is pretty stocks except apr 93 tune and turbo back exhaust (and gutted cat like I said). Any feedback is much appreciated, thanks.


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## Apexxx (Nov 10, 2011)

It's hard to ascribe the issues you describe to the oil. M1 *EP* is a fine product. I frequently use the M1 HIGH MILES, which is a dream oil for Euro cars. idk which exact oil you used. Thinner oil will allow more engine noise to come thru, but w/o any excess wear or other problems.











It sounds more like you had some spillage when filling the engine, and it's burning off the manifolds. 

As far as visc, the M1 EP is a normal thin 30 weight, the M1 HM is a thicker 30 weight, with Euro specs, maybe the best product on the shelves.

Bottom line, just drive it and keep an eye on oil level. If you want to top it off w/a thicker oil, just add some 15w-40 HD.


M1 EP will work fine.


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## ocharlas (Jul 2, 2007)

Thanks for the help. that makes sense what you say about the smell. I'm still concerned about the fact that when I opened up the oil cap I saw smoke coming out of the engine, which I don't remember ever seeing. again I can't necessarily tie the two together, but when I see smoke and smell crispy I tend to associate them with each other. 

at it's age (which I know isn't even that old but..), is it unreasonable for me to treat it like a racecar and expect it to be cool with it? I'm not going to sugarcoat it and call my driving "spirited," I live in a rural area and treat my roads like my personal track. But I'm good on maintenance, and the car still pulls strong as ever. 

The main reason I was questioning Mobil1 is that my mechanic (whom I trust implicitly) was recently telling me that Mobil1 isn't what it used to be, because in order to improve emissions they started using less zinc, which is the main protective agent in oil. after doing some googling I noticed that regular Mobil1 has around 900-1000ppm, whereas many imported premium oils have 1200-1300ppm, and race oils have 1800-2000ppm. so I just associate ore zinc with better protection. I know it's oversimplified logic but is ohthere any sense in that?


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## Apexxx (Nov 10, 2011)

Mobil had some serious quality issues right after Katrina, which seemed to continue until somewhat recently. This is in regards to the regular Mobil 1 line. They even dropped the API seal. 

Smoke from under the vc is no big deal. Be sure to check the pcv function for the best engine maintenance. A bad pcv can really mess up the engine. 

Worth a look... 

http://www.pqiamerica.com/


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## Dennis M (Jan 26, 2012)

ocharlas said:


> The main reason I was questioning Mobil1 is that my mechanic (whom I trust implicitly) was recently telling me that Mobil1 isn't what it used to be, because in order to improve emissions they started using less zinc, which is the main protective agent in oil. after doing some googling I noticed that regular Mobil1 has around 900-1000ppm, whereas many imported premium oils have 1200-1300ppm, and race oils have 1800-2000ppm. so I just associate ore zinc with better protection. I know it's oversimplified logic but is ohthere any sense in that?


All oils have lower zinc and phosphorus than they used to. Mobil1 0W-40 has 1,100 ppm's of zinc, which is similar to other imported premium oils.
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Files/Mobil_1_Product_Guide.pdf

Also as manufacturers reduce zinc, they increase other anti-wear additives and multi-functional additives like calcium, moly, and boron as well as non-metallic addtives and improved base oils.

-Dennis


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## edyvw (May 1, 2009)

I would suggest you to go back to M1 0W40 ASAP and see what happens! If that solves the issue, then you know what is it! If car countinous to behave same, then you might have bigger problem.
I had simmilar problem on Opel 2.0 in Europe using Valvoline products. Once I moved back to Castrol I solved that. Engines do tend to like and not like different oils.


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## ocharlas (Jul 2, 2007)

Thanks for the input guys. I'm finally getting around to changing the oil again, I'm just going back to 0-40 for now. Anyone have any good recommendations for an additive to throw in while I'm at it?

Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2


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## Apexxx (Nov 10, 2011)

No way, do not use additives. 

It's absurd to think there are ingredients that oil formulators "forgot" or somehow cheapened out on. 

In fact, the existing additives are proportioned in very specific amounts. Changing that balance and negatively affect the oil's performance.


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## gmikel (Nov 10, 2010)

*just as adding 2cycle oil to gas does*



Apexxx said:


> No way, do not use additives.
> 
> It's absurd to think there are ingredients that oil formulators "forgot" or somehow cheapened out on.
> 
> In fact, the existing additives are proportioned in very specific amounts. Changing that balance and negatively affect the oil's performance.


 the only thing addatives improve is the sellers spread sheet.


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## drobdog06 (May 24, 2012)

Castrol edge 5-40 . Or 10-40 u should go with 10-40thicker full syn.


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## BrutalDictator (Jun 28, 2012)

5w-40 is the choice. Castrol makes a line of odd visc synth oils. A 10w-40 will really have no advantage over a 5w-40. 

Personally, I'd try to get my hands on SynPower 5w-40. Some parts stores can order it for you.


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## reflex vr6 (Jan 27, 2011)

Whatever you end up using do not keep switching especially from high mileage to regular. Many of the additives and seal "conditioners" in high mileage oil will swell the seals to prevent high mileage burning or leaking. This is fine until you go back to a regular oil that doesn't have the additives which will cause you seals to shrink back down causing a bunch of issues. I'm sure one time won't cause any issues but I wouldn't make a habit of switching around.


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## Dennis M (Jan 26, 2012)

BrutalDictator said:


> 5w-40 is the choice. Castrol makes a line of odd visc synth oils. A 10w-40 will really have no advantage over a 5w-40.


Depending on the particular application a 10W-40 could have an advantage over 5W-40.
The 10W-40 will have less viscosity improvers (which are the first thing to be depleted in oil) and therefore have a more stable base stock that a 5W-40. A more stable oil is beneficial for someone that drives hard and/or has oil consumption.

-Dennis


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## BrutalDictator (Jun 28, 2012)

Modern VIIs do not shear out any longer. Considering that HD 5w-40s are state of the art products, I'll place my bet that volatility isn't a problem. Valvoline Extreme Blue comes to mind, same with Chevron Supreme.


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## gmikel (Nov 10, 2010)

*have you used various user name in the past?*



BrutalDictator said:


> Modern VIIs do not shear out any longer. Considering that HD 5w-40s are state of the art products, I'll place my bet that volatility isn't a problem. Valvoline Extreme Blue comes to mind, same with Chevron Supreme.


or is it just by chance that appexx's last post came the same day as your first?


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## meboice (Mar 24, 2012)

Volatility is relative, yes?


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## BrutalDictator (Jun 28, 2012)

Some great oils are relatively volatile, like Havoline, or Formula Shell.

It's not good in a DI engine. 

fwiw, SynPower 10w-30 is under 10% NOWACK.


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## gmikel (Nov 10, 2010)

*nowak*



BrutalDictator said:


> Some great oils are relatively volatile, like Havoline, or Formula Shell.
> 
> It's not good in a DI engine.
> 
> fwiw, SynPower 10w-30 is under 10% NOWACK.


but i think you do all the time


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## CEO (Jul 8, 2012)

The "smoke" comming from the filler cap is likely water vaper and is normal.


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## Dennis M (Jan 26, 2012)

BrutalDictator said:


> Modern VIIs do not shear out any longer. Considering that HD 5w-40s are state of the art products, I'll place my bet that volatility isn't a problem. Valvoline Extreme Blue comes to mind, same with Chevron Supreme.


Actually they do shear. There are plenty of Subaru turbo uoa's (nasioc, subaruforester.org, legacygt.com, iwsti.com, bitog, etc.) where M1 TDT 5W-40 and RT6 5W-40 sheared to a 30 grade. Not unusual at all to still find this happening. 

-Dennis


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## BrutalDictator (Jun 28, 2012)

No fuel?


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## Rico1 (Feb 8, 2001)

I think the OP is making the right choice by going back to the original M1 0W-40. Then see what happens.

What I think about some of the things posted about motor oil in this thread will remain unstated.

Speaking _strictly_ for myself, I learned a lot, and shed some misconceptions I had about what motor oils do (and don't), by visiting BITOG (Bob Is The Oil Guy) and doing some reading. I started with Motor Oil University.


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## meboice (Mar 24, 2012)

Exactly my experience with Mobil 1 5W40 TDT. I find that it is a s very nice oil for my TDi, but it certainly won't last forever in its 'new' state. 



Dennis M said:


> Actually they do shear. There are plenty of Subaru turbo uoa's (nasioc, subaruforester.org, legacygt.com, iwsti.com, bitog, etc.) where M1 TDT 5W-40 and RT6 5W-40 sheared to a 30 grade. Not unusual at all to still find this happening.
> 
> -Dennis


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## liquimolyusa (Jul 8, 2012)

*Liqui Moly Recommendation*

Hi!
We would like to recommend the use of a 5w40 high SAPS (Sulphated Ash, Phosphurus and Sulphur) oil. LIQUI MOLY has an oil called Leichtlauf High Tech that is precisely that. Cover all your manufacturer approvals. And - if you really love your engine - please add one can of CERATEC to the new oil. Shake the can really well, put it in the new oil, put the oil cap on and drive the car right away, taking it thru its paces, taking that engine to the redline as you upshift, AFTER it reaches normal operating temps. When it does, redline it four or five times on upshifts and then drive it normally for a good 100 miles of "spirited" driving.

Email me at [email protected] afterwards.
All our VW's and Audi's have similar treatment.

All the best.


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## gmikel (Nov 10, 2010)

*and*



liquimolyusa said:


> Hi!
> We would like to recommend the use of a 5w40 high SAPS (Sulphated Ash, Phosphurus and Sulphur) oil. LIQUI MOLY has an oil called Leichtlauf High Tech that is precisely that. Cover all your manufacturer approvals. And - if you really love your engine - please add one can of CERATEC to the new oil. Shake the can really well, put it in the new oil, put the oil cap on and drive the car right away, taking it thru its paces, taking that engine to the redline as you upshift, AFTER it reaches normal operating temps. When it does, redline it four or five times on upshifts and then drive it normally for a good 100 miles of "spirited" driving.
> 
> Email me at [email protected] afterwards.
> ...


he has some land in a florida swamp to sell. using 502 earls is a good thing, addatives not so


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## gmikel (Nov 10, 2010)

*new state*



meboice said:


> Exactly my experience with Mobil 1 5W40 TDT. I find that it is a s very nice oil for my TDi, but it certainly won't last forever in its 'new' state.


modern engines with low tension rings and a regular maintainance schedule show very little wear. rings and bearing last a very long time today. it's the little things that break. they run great till they die!


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## Dennis M (Jan 26, 2012)

liquimolyusa said:


> And - if you really love your engine - please add one can of CERATEC to the new oil. Shake the can really well, put it in the new oil, put the oil cap on and drive the car right away, taking it thru its paces, taking that engine to the redline as you upshift, AFTER it reaches normal operating temps. When it does, redline it four or five times on upshifts and then drive it normally for a good 100 miles of "spirited" driving.


How is this Boron Nitride ceramic additive different from Molybdenum Disulfide? If they are both Friction Modifiers that plate the engine internals, why would I use Ceratec over MoS2? Smaller particle sizes? Less ash than Moly? Which one is a better Friction Modifier?


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