# Nobody wants 2012 Beetles - Dealers are shunning them.



## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

My cousin wanted to trade her 2012 Loaded Turbo/S/S/N in for a convertible and I cannot believe what they want to give her for it. She even went to several dealers. Some dealers don't even want to be bothered with it. A few of the dealers said in general VW's dont keep their value. The 2013 are not much more as well too. I am shocked, as I think it is one of the most stylish cars out there. SHAME.

She said this is her last VW. She had a Honda before and got great resale value for it.

WAB...


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Babie said:


> My cousin wanted to trade her 2012 Loaded Turbo/S/S/N in for a convertible and I cannot believe what they want to give her for it. She even went to several dealers. Some dealers don't even want to be bothered with it. A few of the dealers said in general VW's dont keep their value. The 2013 are not much more as well too. I am shocked, as I think it is one of the most stylish cars out there. SHAME.
> 
> She said this is her last VW. She had a Honda before and got great resale value for it.
> 
> WAB...


We must admit that the window motor problem, that went unaddressed for so long, turned people
off on the 2012 Beetle. I'm also thinking that with winter ending, 2013 Beetle convertibles will be
the 'Bugs' they hope to sell in quantity, not the hard-tops.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Yeah well I don't buy cars for their resale value.


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## Jedidub (Oct 6, 2010)

I'm not sure about the dealers not taking them in as a trade, but I know they want to get rid of any 12's they have left over. I bought mine a 2012 turbo manual base model yesterday for $18,000 out the door after taxes, tag and fees and when it's all said and done I'll only be into it for a smidge over $20k after financing and all. I feel they gave me a hell of a deal I'm sure they made their money somewhere as the dealer always does, but I'm happy. It only had 12 miles when I drove it off of the lot it's a late build with sport suspension and gauge pod, and windows were already fixed at the dealer. I really wanted a top of the line model, but this is a 3rd car/weekend car I just couldn't pass up the deal.


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## silverspeedbuggy (Aug 8, 2001)

Why the surprise? The car is less than one year old and there are brand new 2012's sitting on lots with mega clearance prices. My dad always said "Don't buy a car unless you are 100% sure you can live with it for the period of the loan."


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## Skimmy290 (Aug 19, 2012)

silverspeedbuggy said:


> Why the surprise? The car is less than one year old and there are brand new 2012's sitting on lots with mega clearance prices. My dad always said "Don't buy a car unless you are 100% sure you can live with it for the period of the loan."


exactly, unless something goes terribly wrong i wouldn't trade a car till the loan was paid off. Companies like Honda definitely have a better resell value than VW though, it will most likely be like that for a while due to hondas reputation of reliable cars imo


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## vdub10golf (Jan 23, 2010)

Back when the window issue was constant, I tried trading my car in at VW for a GTI and at Chrysler, and Chrysler offered me about $2000 more for the bug than VW did, but I decided against that and just kept it


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

She justs want a fair trade price, not a "lets rip her off price". It was so little, my cousin cryied.


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## Cadenza_7o (Jan 23, 2001)

Sorry but one should never, never compare the resale value of a Honda to a VW, unless it's a TDI. This is coming from someone who has never owned a Honda and will buy a Beetle. But it might help your cousin feel better to know that a Mercedes S-Class can lose 70-80% of its value in 4-5 years... and a Range Rover even more so. 

The Beetle has more competition this time from Mini and Fiat, which is now selling better than Mini the last couple of months. 

If VW wants the Beetle to do better, it may help to drop the price by $2-3k and adding more colors and customization flexibility.


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

Cadenza_7o said:


> Sorry but one should never, never compare the resale value of a Honda to a VW, unless it's a TDI. This is coming from someone who has never owned a Honda and will buy a Beetle. But it might help your cousin feel better to know that a Mercedes S-Class can lose 70-80% of its value in 4-5 years... and a Range Rover even more so.
> 
> The Beetle has more competition this time from Mini and Fiat, which is now selling better than Mini the last couple of months.
> 
> If VW wants the Beetle to do better, it may help to drop the price by $2-3k and adding more colors and customization flexibility.


right on...


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## John Y (Apr 27, 1999)

Jedidub said:


> I'm not sure about the dealers not taking them in as a trade, but I know they want to get rid of any 12's they have left over. I bought mine a 2012 turbo manual base model yesterday for $18,000 out the door after taxes, tag and fees and when it's all said and done I'll only be into it for a smidge over $20k after financing and all. I feel they gave me a hell of a deal I'm sure they made their money somewhere as the dealer always does, but I'm happy. It only had 12 miles when I drove it off of the lot it's a late build with sport suspension and gauge pod, and windows were already fixed at the dealer. I really wanted a top of the line model, but this is a 3rd car/weekend car I just couldn't pass up the deal.


Sounds like a smoking deal:thumbup:; how much off of MSRP was that?


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## SoCalDubber (Jul 21, 2004)

Babie said:


> She justs want a fair trade price, not a "lets rip her off price". It was so little, my cousin cryied.


It's pretty simple... There are still 2012s on the lot that people can get great deals on (not to mention the 0% financing available). If you could buy a NEW car for 0% and at a discount, how much money would YOU need to save before you'd buy a pre-owned 2012 with 3-5% financing?


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

SoCalDubber said:


> It's pretty simple... There are still 2012s on the lot that people can get great deals on (not to mention the 0% financing available). If you could buy a NEW car for 0% and at a discount, how much money would YOU need to save before you'd buy a pre-owned 2012 with 3-5% financing?


My cousin tried another dealer today about 50 miles out. He told her that demand for the new Beetle was non existent and was told my his wholesaler, dont buy any. There are no new 2012 left around my cousin too. Sad, really, I talked her into this past summer. For a car that MSRP just above 30, to be offered 12-15 is ridiculous.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Babie said:


> My cousin tried another dealer today about 50 miles out. He told her that demand for the new Beetle was non existent and was told my his wholesaler, dont buy any. There are no new 2012 left around my cousin too. Sad, really, I talked her into this past summer. For a car that MSRP just above 30, to be offered 12-15 is ridiculous.


Brooklyn is a huge boro and larger than most cities in the U.S., but if I've seen 5 Beetles in the
last year, that would be a guess on the high side. As far as Turbo Beetles go, I may have seen 
a total of 2. Keep in mind that I also travel frequently to the other boroughs, as well as Southern
Connecticut, and all forms of Beetles are scarcer than hens teeth.


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## Front Runner (Nov 29, 2012)

1st year depreciation is terrible for every vehicle. Doesnt matter what make or model. Seems like the dealers were trying to rip your cousin off. What is her location? Sometime that plays into the equation.


30K MSRP? I hope she didnt pay that amount for the car.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

ridgemanron said:


> Brooklyn is a huge boro and larger than most cities in the U.S., but if I've seen 5 Beetles in the
> last year, that would be a guess on the high side. As far as Turbo Beetles go, I may have seen
> a total of 2. Keep in mind that I also travel frequently to the other boroughs, as well as Southern
> Connecticut, and all forms of Beetles are scarcer than hens teeth.


P.S. - Will try to cheer up Babie and her 'cuz' with something I saw on T.V.. They were honoring
the comedienne Jerry lewis when he mentioned that the immortal Charley Chaplin asked him 
for a copy of his favorite 'Lewis' movie called 'The Bellboy'. They showed a scene where arriving
guests pull up to the hotel in an old Beetle and the doorman tells the belboy (Lewis) to remove
everything from the trunk and bring it up to a specific room. When he opens the lid on the back
of the Beetle he is staring at the engine. In the next scene he is shown ringing the bell at the
room where he was to go, and when the woman opens the door he drops the whole engine at
her feet and leaves. It was hilarious !


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## Cadenza_7o (Jan 23, 2001)

ridgemanron said:


> P.S. - Will try to cheer up Babie and her 'cuz' with something I saw on T.V.. They were honoring
> the *comedienne* Jerry lewis when he mentioned that the immortal Charley Chaplin asked him
> for a copy of his favorite 'Lewis' movie called 'The Bellboy'. They showed a scene where arriving
> guests pull up to the hotel in an old Beetle and the doorman tells the belboy (Lewis) to remove
> ...


Babie, 

Just in case you missed it... what is even more funny is ridgemanron giving Jerry Lewis a sex change. (Don't try to imagine that!!!) Comedian (dude); comedienne (dudette). Many students of Romance and German languages do that with random precision in their 1st year. 

I'm surprise no one has put a sticker that says _*Trunk*_ on the trunk lids of New Beetles / Beetles.


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

ridgemanron said:


> P.S. - Will try to cheer up Babie and her 'cuz' with something I saw on T.V.. They were honoring
> the comedienne Jerry lewis when he mentioned that the immortal Charley Chaplin asked him
> for a copy of his favorite 'Lewis' movie called 'The Bellboy'. They showed a scene where arriving
> guests pull up to the hotel in an old Beetle and the doorman tells the belboy (Lewis) to remove
> ...


lol...there was a B in a scene at the Oscars i did see.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

Babie said:


> My cousin tried another dealer today about 50 miles out. He told her that demand for the new Beetle was non existent and was told my his wholesaler, dont buy any. There are no new 2012 left around my cousin too. Sad, really, I talked her into this past summer. For a car that MSRP just above 30, to be offered 12-15 is ridiculous.


LOL - I am expecting not much more for my 2013 Mustang V6 Convertible when I go to trade it, it cost me 32k when I bought it last May. If I get 18 to 20 from the VW dealer I will let them have it, otherwise will see what CarMax will offer. Used ones are only 24 to 26 so I don't expect much.

As far as VW trade in, I traded a TDI 2010 Golf in, was worth less than my 2008 Miata. Not even the VW wanted it.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Chrisho said:


> LOL - I am expecting not much more for my 2013 Mustang V6 Convertible when I go to trade it, it cost me 32k when I bought it last May. If I get 18 to 20 from the VW dealer I will let them have it, otherwise will see what CarMax will offer. Used ones are only 24 to 26 so I don't expect much.
> 
> As far as VW trade in, I traded a TDI 2010 Golf in, was worth less than my 2008 Miata. Not even the VW wanted it.


Man that is too much for a V6 Mustang. You could have a nice 5.0 for that much.


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## the beet (May 5, 2012)

Babie said:


> A few of the dealers said in general VW's dont keep their value.


Wrong! 

Anyone trying to trade in a one-year-old car isn't too bright. :screwy: 

If she wants a new car every year, she should lease. 

'Nuf said.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

stainlineho said:


> Man that is too much for a V6 Mustang. You could have a nice 5.0 for that much.


When you get into convertible territory and add in leather and such its a 32k car. I could have purchased a base convertible for around 27k, a non convertible v8 for a little more. I wasn't planning on going to the Beetle convertible but the TDI option came to the US. When I bought the Mustang VW NA through more than one rep told me no TDI Convertible was coming here. Reading the stories of its availability and I can see it wasn't decided until late that it would be here.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Cadenza_7o said:


> Babie,
> 
> Just in case you missed it... what is even more funny is ridgemanron giving Jerry Lewis a sex change. (Don't try to imagine that!!!) Comedian (dude); comedienne (dudette). Many students of Romance and German languages do that with random precision in their 1st year.
> 
> I'm surprise no one has put a sticker that says _*Trunk*_ on the trunk lids of New Beetles / Beetles.


Nothing gets by 'The Cadenza Man' ! What I want to know is this. When I was a lad we called
a man an 'actor' and a woman an 'actress'. When did everyone become simply an 'actor' by
designation? Is there something about the label 'actress' that women don't like?


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

Wow, this thread is certainly interesting as I had no idea that new Bugs lost so much in value and that nobody wanted them.


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

Skimmy290 said:


> exactly, unless something goes terribly wrong i wouldn't trade a car till the loan was paid off. Companies like Honda definitely have a better resell value than VW though, it will most likely be like that for a while due to hondas reputation of reliable cars imo


Yep, a Honda is very easy to sell or trade without such a huge hit compared to VW. Plus, there are so many more dealerships available to get a Honda serviced. I am 200 miles from any Volkswagen dealer so it's a journey anytime I want to get anything done. Still, I've never been stranded in this two-bit town I live in with any of my Dubs'. 

I suppose it's just the novelty of having a Volkswagen versus anything else. I actually looked at the new Accord and I wasn't impressed with its light as rice paper doors, flakey interior and flimsy truck lid. Oh well, 'at least I'm saving 15% or more my car insurance'.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

SaberOne said:


> Yep, a Honda is very easy to sell or trade without such a huge hit compared to VW. Plus, there are so many more dealerships available to get a Honda serviced. I am 200 miles from any Volkswagen dealer so it's a journey anytime I want to get anything done. Still, I've never been stranded in this two-bit town I live in with any of my Dubs'.
> 
> I suppose it's just the novelty of having a Volkswagen versus anything else. I actually looked at the new Accord and I wasn't impressed with its light as rice paper doors, flakey interior and flimsy truck lid. Oh well, 'at least I'm saving 15% or more my car insurance'.


Will backup that Honda claim, trade a 07 Civic for an 08 Miata and got within a thousand I had spent on it.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Had Honda continued with their S2000, which would have been an S3000 by now, there's a chance
I probably would have bought one. They had one of the best manual shifters I have ever driven
and needed only to tweak the look of the car a bit since it hadn't changed much for the past
10 or more years. Nice clean lines, excellent transmission and motor. Couldn't understand how
the 'girlie' looking Miata would sell like crazy and the S2000 didn't. Heck, to me the Miata still
hasn't changed their look to this day and the little 'bugger' still outsells everything in its class.
Something else that is quite interesting. When Lotus was bringing the Elise S2 to the U.S. in 2005, 
they really wanted to have Honda's engine in the car and not the 1.8 Toyota they settled on. Honda
wouldn't give them the 2,500 engines they wanted, and since Lotus had assisted Toyota engineers
with regard to solving problems in the past, they were able to get the engines. I remember reading
that Lotus engineering can be found in 10% of many cars presently on the road. Corvette was one.
If my back didn't disintegrate on me, making my sitting in the Elise too difficult and painful, I'd 
still be 'tooling' around in that little 'go cart on steroids'. Best handling car you could ever hope to
drive.


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

I decided to call a few dealers for my cuz, anyway, not good news for anyone that owns a 12 and maybe a 13 too.

I was told by 2 dealers today, that when the 14's hit late summer this year, any 12 still on lots will be sent to auctions, or can be bough for an ungodly little amount, like 50% of msrp. 

Excuse me, I still feel sick...one guy said, that the window was the titanic ending for the B. and the cost most people say is a bit on high side. Oh well. I got 0 interest so I dont care, but my cuz didn't and she want out of the car bad.

PS She said when she puts the heater on, the car smells like a burnt tamale.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Babie said:


> I decided to call a few dealers for my cuz, anyway, not good news for anyone that owns a 12 and maybe a 13 too.
> 
> I was told by 2 dealers today, that when the 14's hit late summer this year, any 12 still on lots will be sent to auctions, or can be bough for an ungodly little amount, like 50% of msrp.
> 
> ...


Heater smell is common on Beetles. It will go away.


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## czykvw (May 11, 2006)

Maybe its too soon to trade for a vert? 
1st gen beetles are super cheap but only the hardtops. The 1st gen beetle verts are still stupid high.


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

Man this is all quite depressing. So does anyone know what the 2014 is supposed to offer that the 13 doesn't? I'm actually quite happy with my TDI Bug but maybe I jumped the gun.:what:


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

SaberOne said:


> Man this is all quite depressing. So does anyone know what the 2014 is supposed to offer that the 13 doesn't? I'm actually quite happy with my TDI Bug but maybe I jumped the gun.:what:


the only thng i know is a new media center and interface. and he turbo some cosmetic changes and smoked tails. my brother said the rns-315 is gone too. the new navi with have traffic.


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

Rats! The new Navi sounds very appealing compared to mine, which I think is rather pithy. Even so, to change out to the newer Nav would probably be cost prohibitive. 

The smoked tails also sounds nice and I will most likely order those for my current bug, assuming they're the same fit-up.


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## smpeck (Jul 3, 2012)

Yeah... I'm so upside down in mine and I would love to get rid of it. I plan on suffering through at least until the warranty is up. It's a shame there are so many problems. Funny people keep harping on the window motor issue. LOL. That was the least of my concerns. Only way to go on this car is a base 2.5L for under $20K. Mine is a fully loaded 2013 turbo ... the more bells and whistles... the more problems. The DSG transmission in my car sucks even after all the problems were "fixed" (i.e. masked) with it.


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

Dang, that's horrible news. Now I feel like I'm sitting on a ticking time bomb. The only weird thing I've noticed with the DSG is that when I downshift with the paddle-shifters the process is very peculiar. It actually seems to stress or accelerate upward before going into the lower gear. Not sure if that makes any sense but it's just unusual from my previous non-dsg crappy 2007 Passat.

By the way, I most certainly agree with you with the 'horns n' whistles' being problematic. In fact, one of the reasons I like my Bug (so far) is that it doesn't have as many BS features as my fully-laden previous dubs. e.g. Electric/Air Seats, Individual Climate Control, and the Electronic Parking Break. 

Ok, I did like the Auto Dimming Mirror and Auto Wiper Sensing, and especially the Auto Hold.


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## smpeck (Jul 3, 2012)

SaberOne said:


> Dang, that's horrible news. Now I feel like I'm sitting on a ticking time bomb. The only weird thing I've noticed with the DSG is that when I downshift with the paddle-shifters the process is very peculiar. It actually seems to stress or accelerate upward before going into the lower gear. Not sure if that makes any sense but it's just unusual from my previous non-dsg crappy Passat.


When I first got my 2013 it had a serious shudder problem with the DSG. At low speeds, when accelerating from a rolling stop, the entire car would shake. They resolved the shake, but it still seems to lug and hesitate a bit more than I would like. Sometimes I have to just about floor it to get it to move. When stopped on a hill it tends to make a jerky hesitation when I give it some gas. All in all I can't say it's broken, I just don't like how it works/feels. I know it's not right because I'm basing it on the comparison to my 2012 Beetle Turbo which also had a DSG. I am in a unique position having owned a 2012, trading that one in on the 2013, and then being completely dissatisfied with the 2013's DSG. I guess I got a bad DSG in the 2013 Beetle. It really has turned me off to VWs.... Sadly... I've started looking at Hondas on the road... LOL Tired of putting this thing in the shop.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

I don't understand what you guys mean when you say "suffer" through unless your payment is way too much for you. I don't feel bad...I got my 2012 Turbo with 29 miles for $19k and put 4 grand down through trade-in. I love my car and the issues I hear about the DSG make me like my 6-speed even more. With a short shifter and the clutch bleeder I'm sure it will turn out to be a fine transmission.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

smpeck said:


> When I first got my 2013 it had a serious shudder problem with the DSG. At low speeds, when accelerating from a rolling stop, the entire car would shake. They resolved the shake, but it still seems to lug and hesitate a bit more than I would like. Sometimes I have to just about floor it to get it to move. When stopped on a hill it tends to make a jerky hesitation when I give it some gas. All in all I can't say it's broken, I just don't like how it works/feels. I know it's not right because I'm basing it on the comparison to my 2012 Beetle Turbo which also had a DSG. I am in a unique position having owned a 2012, trading that one in on the 2013, and then being completely dissatisfied with the 2013's DSG. I guess I got a bad DSG in the 2013 Beetle. It really has turned me off to VWs.... Sadly... I've started looking at Hondas on the road... LOL Tired of putting this thing in the shop.


That's horrible man, I really feel for you. I was turned on to VWs because I've driven one for work for the past 6 years and never had a major problem. I bought a Tiguan and never had an issue with it, so I have my faith in VW right now. Yes they have there little quirks but what car doesn't. Its just major stuff having problems that is aggravating.

Honestly the only thing attractive about the DSG in my opinion if not having to replace a clutch to hold more torque. But that's still cheaper than a major DSG repair would be. I'm so glad I bought a manual.


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

I'm not sure the TDI Bug is even available with a manual trans. Even if it were I couldn't use it because of my medical issues. 

Overall I still like my TDI quite well and it's by far more enjoyable to drive than my previous four Dubs. e.g. 1996 Jetta, 2005 1/5 Jetta, 2007 POS Passat, and my son's 2007 Rabbit w/2.5. Only time will tell if I will eat my words, and I'll admit it was a bit of a risk for me to buy another Volkswagen. I say this simply because I believe that Volkswagen quality has gone downhill in since 2007. They seem to use thinner metal, more plastic and quality assurance (QC) just isn't a priority anymore. 

I think my next Volkswagen may well be an Audi.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

SaberOne said:


> I'm not sure the TDI Bug is even available with a manual trans. Even if it were I couldn't use it because of my medical issues.
> 
> 
> I think my next Volkswagen may well be an Audi.


You can still get TDI Beetles with manuals, hell I have one on permanent order; meaning my December order is slated for delivery in JUNE!!!!!! (the hell with the idea with no dealer wants 2012, VW doesn't want to sell 2013s either - if they did they would at least try to deliver orders in a reasonable time).

As for DSG vs manual. Having been given two loaners with DSG transmissions I would NEVER EVER EVER get one. No way, no how, can't even give it to me free.

and for Audi, go ask my friend how fun its to have an expensive VW that breaks and doesn't have trade value either.


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## scarabY2k (Feb 27, 2007)

SoCalDubber said:


> It's pretty simple... There are still 2012s on the lot that people can get great deals on (not to mention the 0% financing available). If you could buy a NEW car for 0% and at a discount, how much money would YOU need to save before you'd buy a pre-owned 2012 with 3-5% financing?


Well said.

Also, the dealer makes a lot of their profits on pre-owned cars. Their intent is to get as little trade in on a model, only to mark it up substantially. Add this and the quoted statement together and a trade-in, regardless of auto brand, equals low trade in value.


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## smpeck (Jul 3, 2012)

stainlineho said:


> I don't understand what you guys mean when you say "suffer" through unless your payment is way too much for you. I don't feel bad...I got my 2012 Turbo with 29 miles for $19k and put 4 grand down through trade-in. I love my car and the issues I hear about the DSG make me like my 6-speed even more. With a short shifter and the clutch bleeder I'm sure it will turn out to be a fine transmission.


By "suffer through".... for me it's not the monthly payment... I mean knowing I'm financially upside down in a brand new car that seems like inferior quality due to tons of rattles, squeaks, problems, recalls, etc.... and not in a position to trade out of it and lose my shirt in the process. This thread confirmed that... hearing that trade in values are even worse than expected.

Glad to hear you got a good one and are happy!


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## silverspeedbuggy (Aug 8, 2001)

'14 Turbo Beetles will also get the new version of the 2.0T with 211 HP. It may also be the first year for the all-new 1.8T for the 'base' models.

WAIT; if the '14's do get the 1.8T, then ALL Beetles will be Turbos! :laugh:


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## Sixtysomething (Aug 7, 2003)

I will have to disagree with those who say that nobody "wants" 2012 Beetles. About 35,000 were sold in the US before the 13s came out, and any leftover new car on a lot, regardless of make or model, will be clearanced out to make room for the current models. As a result, the biggest hit in depreciation will take place once a car is a year old, whether it's a VW, Honda, or for that matter, a $200,000 Rolls Royce.


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## Jedidub (Oct 6, 2010)

John Y said:


> Sounds like a smoking deal:thumbup:; how much off of MSRP was that?


$24,795
+ $750 destination


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

smpeck said:


> Yeah... I'm so upside down in mine and I would love to get rid of it. I plan on suffering through at least until the warranty is up. It's a shame there are so many problems. Funny people keep harping on the window motor issue. LOL. That was the least of my concerns. Only way to go on this car is a base 2.5L for under $20K. Mine is a fully loaded 2013 turbo ... the more bells and whistles... the more problems. The DSG transmission in my car sucks even after all the problems were "fixed" (i.e. masked) with it.


What was wrong with your tranny. Today I needed to pass a junk truck spewing crap onto the road.

I punched it, and the shifting was weird and my car fishtailed. MMmm anyone


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Automatic transmissions like the DSG are extremely complicated in construction and my
thoughts concerning them always centered around them possibly needing to be 'tweaked'
by a professional transmission rebuilder because of all the parts that need to coordinate
with each other. I remember an expensive Infiniti at my friend's shop that was experiencing
'slippage' after the warranty ran out. Since the owner was a close friend of the shop owner,
he asked me to drive the car to a personal friend of his that has been rebuilding transmissions
for numerous years. He got in the car, drove it a bit, then made some kind of adjustments with 
a simple screwdriver. He then gave me the car and said to take it back, as he added, 'it's O.K.
now'. I scratched my head but as I drove the car back to my friend's shop, there wasn't the
slightest hint of slippage. Wonder if this kind of 'tweaking' is something all auto trany cars can
have done to them? Knowing dealerships, I doubt if anything having to do with auto tranys are
within their realm of expertise. My 'shop friend has been repairing all kinds of cars for over 30
years and he still had to send a trany problem car to someone else.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Babie said:


> What was wrong with your tranny. Today I needed to pass a junk truck spewing crap onto the road.
> 
> I punched it, and the shifting was weird and my car fishtailed. MMmm anyone


lol tell me how you fish tailed a fwd car


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

stainlineho said:


> lol tell me how you fish tailed a fwd car


Don't ask me, it just felt like it. I think it was under or overseer. I know my brother said some FWD act weird with racing.


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

I want to add, when the PT Cruiser first came out in 01, people were paying thousands over sticker. FACT for the first 2 years of the car. Why cant the B be like that...wish it did. My brother made money when he sold his after 6 months of owning one. It was a pretty purple color.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

Babie said:


> I want to add, when the PT Cruiser first came out in 01, people were paying thousands over sticker. FACT for the first 2 years of the car. Why cant the B be like that...wish it did. My brother made money when he sold his after 6 months of owning one. It was a pretty purple color.


Because VW took too long to fix the windows?

I rented one from Enterprise while my Mustang was in the shop; deer strike. Guess what, window problem. Their OTHER Beetle was in the shop, guess what for. The Enterprise guys made jokes about it.


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## Front Runner (Nov 29, 2012)

Front Runner said:


> 1st year depreciation is terrible for every vehicle. Doesnt matter what make or model. Seems like the dealers were trying to rip your cousin off. What is her location? Sometime that plays into the equation.
> 
> 
> 30K MSRP? I hope she didnt pay that amount for the car.





fiftysomething said:


> I will have to disagree with those who say that nobody "wants" 2012 Beetles. About 35,000 were sold in the US before the 13s came out, and any leftover new car on a lot, regardless of make or model, will be clearanced out to make room for the current models. As a result, the biggest hit in depreciation will take place once a car is a year old, whether it's a VW, Honda, or for that matter, a $200,000 Rolls Royce.



I completely agree (as listed by my initial post on this thread).



On another note, I'm really enjoying my 12 Turbo Beetle. I've got 4000 miles on it now & have owned it for 4 months and all is well. No issues at all. I paid a little over 20K out the door which includes tax, tags, title and other fees. Take away those and the cost was a little above 19K for my 6 speed, turbo, 2012 model with HID's and 19 wheels. I'm very happy with mine. 

OP, I hate that your cousin isnt.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

This is why Alfa has changed their arrival dates over and over for the new 4C. According to
the 'head honcho', constant testing under all conditions... for all parts of the car and then
continuous re-examining is a necessity. If you don't do it, like Lexus does, your car will be
labeled a 'lemon' and that is something that stays like 'stink on a monkey'!

When Audi had that braking fiasco, which was probably due to a woman who kept pressing the
accelerator when she thought it was the brake pedal, they quickly took immediate steps to save
their good name. Continuous testing was never able to show that the accelerator could be
activated by anything other than foot pedal pressure......but still they went on to install brakes
that Ferrari would have been proud of. They showed that if you held the brake, no matter how 
much force you applied to the accelerator would not cause the car to go forward. People quickly
returned to the showrooms and they haven't looked back since. 

VW should amass a list of constantly reported problems and then show the public how their 
insanely vigorous testing of these parts result in nothing but repeated, proper operation of the
part(s) now ! Windows, engine noises, creaks and rattles, faulty transmissions and anything 
else that has been reported as a problem from numerous owners will require a blitz of 
commercials to the public, showing 'specifically' what was found to be the cause of the problems
and how they have been corrected. Expensive yes, but how much is your good name worth?
If you intend on being a continually growing 'world player' in the world of automtives, solidifying
a trusted name associated with all your products is mandatory ! Otherwise you will be relegated
to second class or lower status faster than you could ever imagine.


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## silverspeedbuggy (Aug 8, 2001)

Babie said:


> I want to add, when the PT Cruiser first came out in 01, people were paying thousands over sticker. FACT for the first 2 years of the car. Why cant the B be like that...wish it did. My brother made money when he sold his after 6 months of owning one. It was a pretty purple color.


There's a few reasons for this:
1. There was literally NOTHING like the PT when it came out
2. There was a ton of demand
3. Chrysler probably couldn't build them fast enough, thus increasing the demand

The New Beetle went thru the same thing in '98 when it came out. At one point there was a 6 month wait for automatic models. People were flipping them for thousands in profit. Once both the PT and the New Beetle reached proper production levels resale came down to a proper level and they were just like any other cars on trade in. 

Unfortunately, we'll never see this type of demand for the Beetle. VW sells a decent enough of them to keep producing them, but there's no pent up demand like there was for the New Beetle. For those too young to remember, car choices were pretty bleak in '98. There had not been a Beetle sold new in over TWENTY years. That's why people went crazy for them when they came out. Right now people can get a clearance '12 for cheap or even a used New Beetle. All these factors contribute to not much demand for the car on the used market.


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

Chrisho said:


> You can still get TDI Beetles with manuals, hell I have one on permanent order; meaning my December order is slated for delivery in JUNE!!!!!! (the hell with the idea with no dealer wants 2012, VW doesn't want to sell 2013s either - if they did they would at least try to deliver orders in a reasonable time).
> 
> As for DSG vs manual. Having been given two loaners with DSG transmissions I would NEVER EVER EVER get one. No way, no how, can't even give it to me free.
> 
> and for Audi, go ask my friend how fun its to have an expensive VW that breaks and doesn't have trade value either.


That's good to know! Honestly, if I didn't have MS with flaky motor and sensory issues I would definitely have preferred a manual transmission. As it is, I'm stuck with this DSG b*llsh*t. I've become accustomed to the crappy transmissions of Volkswagen with the Tiptronic being the most ridiculous feature I've ever seen! I simply use the S' and D' modes as a quasi-manual transmission to get around and I manage okay. About the only way I can regain any performance out of this TDI will be to go to a light alloy race wheel and lightweight summer tire. I'll just keep my fingers crossed that I'm not going to start hating this thing' in six months time.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Manual transmission with a short-shifter really reduces the length of the 'throws' between
gears. Not as 'quick and notchy' as a Honda S2000, but excellent none the less.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

I was at a VW dealer in my area this last week and the GM showed me a program dealers use to decide how they value their pre-owned cars. This program shows them the exact model car they're trying to price at every dealership across the country, and the price that car is valued at. With the 2012 Beetles, the program showed that some dealers had new versions of many of our 2012 Beetles, at greatly reduced prices (for clearance), so as long as some dealers still have brand new 2012s, our 2012 models will have shockingly low value for trade ins and what not.


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## VWNDAHS (Jun 20, 2002)

NickSarazen said:


> I was at a VW dealer in my area this last week and the GM showed me a program dealers use to decide how they value their pre-owned cars. This program shows them the exact model car they're trying to price at every dealership across the country, and the price that car is valued at. With the 2012 Beetles, the program showed that some dealers had new versions of many of our 2012 Beetles, at greatly reduced prices (for clearance), so as long as some dealers still have brand new 2012s, our 2012 models will have shockingly low value for trade ins and what not.


This! I picked up a brand new loaded 2012 for a hair over 30, then picked up a CPO with 3,000 miles on it, same options for low 20s just three months later. Incredible. :beer:


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## SaberOne (Apr 1, 2012)

VWNDAHS said:


> This! I picked up a brand new loaded 2012 for a hair over 30, then picked up a CPO with 3,000 miles on it, same options for low 20s just three months later. Incredible. :beer:


Dang, you guys are already making me have buyers' remorse and I don't even have 3000 miles on my Bug. Despite my physical issues I would have gone with the manual TDI Bug if only I had known. It really wouldn't bother me if I had to wait 5-6 months. Oh well I didn't even think to ask.


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

My cousin called me and said, dealers in her area are pushing the 12's and if they are loaded, get about over 10k off sticker..unheard of.

I can see a 5k lost the first year, but from what I have heard, resale of VW are nil. the GTI's are not to far from that as well.


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## Beets (Sep 22, 2012)

That's what happens when car makers offer 0% and huge incentives, or in this case have to gash prices on leftover new cars. You want to see stupid depreciation? Look at 80% of the Mazda line up...


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Beets said:


> That's what happens when car makers offer 0% and huge incentives, or in this case have to gash prices on leftover new cars. You want to see stupid depreciation? Look at 80% of the Mazda line up...


When you realize how long it took for VW to have Beetles with sun-roofs come through the pipeline,
as well as how long it took for the window motor problem to be resolved, and add to the fact that
people begging for 'loaded' ones couldn't get them and were left in perpetual wait mode, ( I won't
even mention that I ordered which could very well have been the first six-speed TB and waited 
six months for delivery), and you can have some idea as to why customers went elsewhere and
are staying away.


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## Front Runner (Nov 29, 2012)

Babie said:


> My cousin called me and said, dealers in her area are pushing the 12's and if they are loaded, get about over 10k off sticker..unheard of.
> 
> I can see a 5k lost the first year, but from what I have heard, resale of VW are nil. the GTI's are not to far from that as well.


I'm curious to know; what area is she in??

Beetles in my area arent being sold with those types of deals.


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## Stever32 (Jul 27, 2007)

To the person waiting for a TDI. My TDI was ordered on August 10, 2012 and it was delivered February 17, 2013, that's more than 6 months time. Dealer said that TDI 6-speed is a "rare combination" and that's the reason for the wait.


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## Dscot8r!2 (Dec 18, 2012)

Man, there's a lot of conjecture and jumping to conclusions in this thread. More times than not a person's overall experience with a vehicle is directly related to the attitude they have about it. 

Babie - I'm sorry your cousin is feeling screwed by what a particular dealer is saying, but there has to be other factors involved to lowball like that. Miles? CarFax? smoker? Small town dealer? 

That being said the Beetle is and always will be a niche car. It appeals to a much smaller audience than say a GTI. This means they are more subject to hot and cold markets. They will never have trade in / resale value as strong as GTIs, but she must be in a cold market. We can't keep Certified / Pre-Owned 2012 Beetles in stock. We pay very strong money for anyone and everyone we can get our hands on. That dealer your cousin spoke to is a bunch of idiots.


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## czykvw (May 11, 2006)

I hope the beetle never recovers from this.
After the beetle run is over (hopefully not another decade run) 
vw can give us americans something we really need.


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## supamotard (Mar 11, 2013)

*Horse-drawn bug drivers*

I thought only the Amish do the shunning? 
Ha! After getting caught in Amish Mafia and Breaking Amish marathons recently, I'm obsessed with the horse drawn buggy folks.


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## Sixtysomething (Aug 7, 2003)

czykvw said:


> I hope the beetle never recovers from this.
> After the beetle run is over (hopefully not another decade run)
> vw can give us americans something we really need.


The Beetle isn't going to die this time. Volkswagen has learned from their mistake of killing the original Bug in the US back in 1979. The New Beetles of 98-10 and 21st Century Beetles of 2012 onward are a logical and evolutionary continuation of an icon, and the car that literally defines Volkswagen, particularly in the US. While water-cooled Beetles will certainly never have sales numbers like the original air-cooleds, it is here to stay. Sorry, Beetle haters.


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## Sixtysomething (Aug 7, 2003)

Dscot8r!2 said:


> That being said the Beetle is and always will be a niche car. It appeals to a much smaller audience than say a GTI.


Nope. 

So far, for 2013, in the US: Beetle sales: 5928 

GTI sales: 2516

For all of 2012: Beetle sales: 29174 

GTI sales: 16314


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Love my Beetle! Just put in a Pioneer AVH-X5500 head unit!


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## VWNDAHS (Jun 20, 2002)

fiftysomething said:


> The Beetle isn't going to die this time. Volkswagen has learned from their mistake of killing the original Bug in the US back in 1979. The New Beetles of 98-10 and 21st Century Beetles of 2012 onward are a logical and evolutionary continuation of an icon, and the car that literally defines Volkswagen, particularly in the US. While water-cooled Beetles will certainly never have sales numbers like the original air-cooleds, it is here to stay. Sorry, Beetle haters.


Seriously, what always blew my mind was the breakdown of VW's monthly sales, in 2010 the beetle was still one of their best selling models, on an architecture a decade old. Blew my mind.


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## Anthony_A (Feb 1, 2013)

fiftysomething said:


> Nope.
> 
> So far, for 2013, in the US: Beetle sales: 5928
> 
> ...


Aren't the 2012+ Beetles built on the GTI frame? I think that was the best thing VW could have done for the beetle (besides updating the design). I think this alone has drawn a lot of people to the 2012+ Beetle. Speaking personally. I would have never even considered the beetle prior to the 2012 body. As soon as I saw the updated body I knew I wanted to get one. So, as a 30 something male I think VW really hit their mark for expanding the demographic of people who will be attracted to the beetle. It took a full model year before I even saw the new body style here on Long Island. I thought 2013 was the first year of the updated body. Where I'm going with this is that I think as the new body gets more exposure and more vehicles hit the road I think we will see sales rise. 

As for the resale value.. I was talking to a coworker the other day. I mentioned to him that I bought my previous car with the logical side of my brain, with resale value in mind and blah blah blah. With my Beetle I didn't even think about it the resale value. This purchase was done with all heart. I really don't care what the resale value is. I love the car too much to think about selling it any time soon...


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## Dscot8r!2 (Dec 18, 2012)

fiftysomething said:


> Nope.
> 
> So far, for 2013, in the US: Beetle sales: 5928
> 
> ...


These numbers are semantics, Beetles Coupes are not segregated by engine type or model. Golfs and GTIs are even though they are the same body, and a 2.5 Beetle is nowhere near the same car as a TB. In 2012 the SE region of the US sold 3795 Golfs and 4121 GTIs for a total of 7916, there were 6207 Beetles Coupes sold and 174 Convertibles. Maybe the numbers for the rest of the country tell a different story, I only have immediate access to my region. Since the GTI / Golf stopped production in December / January the Beetle will continue to separate in 2013 sell numbers. 

Naturally there is going to be a spike in sales when a new model is released, but I hope it keeps going. VW did a great job on the new Beetle, I love mine, and I love my GTI.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

Anthony_A said:


> Speaking personally. I would have never even considered the beetle prior to the 2012 body. As soon as I saw the updated body I knew I wanted to get one. So, as a 30 something male I think VW really hit their mark for expanding the demographic of people who will be attracted to the beetle.


Same here, I thought the previous model was completely wrong from day 1. It was not a Beetle, it was a caricature of one. Now I am more than willing to ditch my 2013 Mustang for one


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## Sixtysomething (Aug 7, 2003)

True, if you clump the Golf, GTI, and Golf R together, than that total outsold Beetles by about 25% in 2012. Also, and even though the GTI itself only sells about half of the Beetle's numbers, you'll see more of them at VW shows. Still, a Beetle is a Beetle whether it's a 2.5, a Turbo, a convertible, a diesel, or any combination of the above. 

Don't get me wrong here, I think GTIs are cool, too, but what really puzzles me is how the original air-cooled Bugs, even in bone-stock form, have been a staple at VW shows for decades, but when it comes to water-cooled Beetles from 1998 on, it's like the majority of owners view them as nothing more significant than a Plymouth Horizon, so they don't think they're show-worthy. Hence, and getting back to one of the main themes of this thread, this is why when I wave at other NB/21st Century Beetle drivers on the road, most look at me like I'm from the planet Vulcan. 

I'm on a mission to change this mindset. For example, the Mini-Cooper crowd is divided, too, between purists that like the 67s and earlier and the people that have 2004 and up, but the modern Minis are still accepted a lot more at their events than water-cooled Beetles are at VW events. Along with another NB lover, I've started a water-cooled Beetle-only club in the Upper Midwest and would like to think that a couple of other brand new such clubs in Connecticut and North Carolina were inspired by my action.


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## Sixtysomething (Aug 7, 2003)

fiftysomething said:


> Hence, and getting back to one of the main themes of this thread, this is why when I wave at other NB/21st Century Beetle drivers on the road, most look at me like I'm from the planet Vulcan.


I made an error here. This comment is in reference to a different thread titled, Times Have Changed. Sorry. Mind fart.


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## Front Runner (Nov 29, 2012)

Babie said:


> My cousin wanted to trade her 2012 Loaded Turbo/S/S/N in for a convertible and I cannot believe what they want to give her for it. She even went to several dealers. Some dealers don't even want to be bothered with it. A few of the dealers said in general VW's dont keep their value. The 2013 are not much more as well too. I am shocked, as I think it is one of the most stylish cars out there. SHAME.
> 
> She said this is her last VW. She had a Honda before and got great resale value for it.
> 
> WAB...



I unexpectedly traded my 12 Turbo Beetle today and the amount I was given for it was very close to what I paid for it (which doesnt included the $$$ that was knocked off the new car).


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## PLATA (Mar 15, 2013)

Front Runner said:


> I unexpectedly traded my 12 Turbo Beetle today and the amount I was given for it was very close to what I paid for it (which doesnt included the $$$ that was knocked off the new car).


May I ask, traded for what car, was that new car sold at below MSRP , just curios ic:


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## Front Runner (Nov 29, 2012)

PLATA said:


> May I ask, traded for what car, was that new car sold at below MSRP , just curios ic:


Traded for a GTI and yes it was sold for below MSRP.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Front Runner said:


> Traded for a GTI and yes it was sold for below MSRP.


Why did you decide to trade your Beetle in? Why weren't you satisfied with it? What about the GTI appealed to you?


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## jwcardy (Feb 22, 2012)

When we traded our 2.5 2012 beetle in for a 2.0turbo the dealership paid it off and then some. I thinks its really based on the dealership and how much they want to make a sale.


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## Front Runner (Nov 29, 2012)

stainlineho said:


> Why did you decide to trade your Beetle in? Why weren't you satisfied with it? What about the GTI appealed to you?


Great questions. To keep it very simple, 4 doors and functionality for the entire family, not just myself. The beetle had become a primary family vehicle and it was frustrating getting 3 to four people in and out on a frequent basis. Again, it wasnt purchased for that reason, but instead a toy for me. The GTI offers the functionality I need for the family and the fun factor for me. :thumbup:



jwcardy said:


> When we traded our 2.5 2012 beetle in for a 2.0turbo the dealership paid it off and then some. I thinks its really based on the dealership and how much they want to make a sale.


You hit the nail on the head!


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

Front Runner said:


> I unexpectedly traded my 12 Turbo Beetle today and the amount I was given for it was very close to what I paid for it (which doesnt included the $$$ that was knocked off the new car).


weied, cause my cousin and i went to 7 dealers, and all said it was a dead hourse. one has a 12 turbo from a previous trade and no lookers for 4 months.


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## Front Runner (Nov 29, 2012)

Babie said:


> weied, cause my cousin and i went to 7 dealers, and all said it was a dead hourse. one has a 12 turbo from a previous trade and no lookers for 4 months.


I personally believe (from experience buying, selling, & trading cars) that location has alot to do with it. Beetle are selling pretty good in my area, so the dealer knew that they would have no problem selling my old car. 

Now, the type of car must be considered. My Beetle was a base turbo model that only had the LED upgraded headlights, 19" wheels, and the turbo door stickers. If was much cheaper than the 30K you said your cousin paid for hers.


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## Wildcat2012 (Apr 4, 2013)

I have had 2 VW's, I bought my first, a 2005.5 Jetta and really liked the car. I had a few minor problems that the dealer fixed quickly (replaced radio) and something else I forgot, but for some reason I just had to had a SUV so after 2 years I traded for a Toyota, got a decent trade. Then later on I traded that on an Accord (bor-ring!) and then got a 2008 GTI which I kept for 4 years. The reasons for trading the GTI wasn't problems with the car, VW replaced the part in the DSG and gave me 10 years/100k warranty on it and the only other problem was the PCV and they later came back and extended the warranty on it. The reasons were the pricey parts and up coming maintenance, my GTI was one of the last with the rubber band instead of the timing chain - $1,200.00 and there was the 80K maintenance on it and DSG - another $800.00 and I needed tires really bad! Looking back, I shoulda just paid, cause I traded for a 2011 Ford Taurus thinking I needed a big car and getting a deal (talk about a hit - $31k+ MSRP, 1 year old, 17K miles) and I got it for $19,900.00 out the door. I kept that POS 5 months and got tired of dropping it off at the dealer to not get fixed after a few days, transmission issues and we ALL know the DSG is supposed the be the problem child - ha!
In my opinion, VW is better in many ways now. I expect if the economy turns around you're going to see more specialty cars like the Beetle selling better. Hang in there, from one that jumped ship too many times, it sometimes pays to just stay the course.


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## BretAZ (Apr 1, 2013)

Once the leftover 12s are gone things will get better. However, as long as they are offering new ones with $6,000 off its going to be ugly. Pretty soon they will be trying to get rid of the 13s and there will still be 12s on the lot.


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## silverspeedbuggy (Aug 8, 2001)

BretAZ said:


> Once the leftover 12s are gone things will get better. However, as long as they are offering new ones with $6,000 off its going to be ugly. Pretty soon they will be trying to get rid of the 13s and there will still be 12s on the lot.


I was wondering about something like that too; when the updated '13 Turbo's with the R bumper and EA888 engine hit lots, will the remaining pre-update '13s just sit there too?


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## PeterC4 (Apr 2, 2013)

*A lesson learned*

Very interesting thread. My wife has a new fully optioned 2013 Beetle Convertible. She had owned the first new Beetle immediately after it was introduced then we bought the Beetle convertible as soon as it was introduced. She was a typical buyer of the original new Beetle thinking it was a neat design. They did however have their share of problems. In trading those cars in after three years, I felt the residual values offered were low. Our coming into the 2013 Beetle has quite a story to it. My wife's daily driver for the last number of years was a Porsche Carrera 4S Convertible. Unfortunately a serious engine problem would lead to engine replacement which I was unwilling to do. Fortunately a good dealer relationship that owned Porsche, Audi and VW dealers offered me a very fair trade on the 2013 Beetle and I leased it. Essentially I have no lease payments for three years and received cash back on the trade. But the lease deal was quite good as the residual value after 3 years is in excess of 55%. This is where leasing makes sense. In the meantime we will take our time and look for a CPO 2013 Porsche and by the time the lease is up, we will hopefully have our hands on one. 

Leasing has its virtues.


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

For the heck of it, i call several VW dealers to see what I could do trading my 13 LOADED Turbo in for a convertible. 

basically, the average was about 1/3 loss so a average 30K would now be about 20k in trade. I call several. Also, THEY ALL SAID THEY HAVE TO MANY 12 STILL NEW FOR SALE. 

Neat car, but the trade value SUCKS.. really bad.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Babie said:


> For the heck of it, i call several VW dealers to see what I could do trading my 13 LOADED Turbo in for a convertible.
> 
> basically, the average was about 1/3 loss so a average 30K would now be about 20k in trade. I call several. Also, THEY ALL SAID THEY HAVE TO MANY 12 STILL NEW FOR SALE.
> 
> Neat car, but the trade value SUCKS.. really bad.


You're the one that paid 30k for a Beetle.:screwy:


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## Babie (Jul 22, 2012)

stainlineho said:


> You're the one that paid 30k for a Beetle.:screwy:


i did not pay msrp


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## Cadenza_7o (Jan 23, 2001)

Probably not relevant to the residual value of the Beetle...

A relative who's in the car sales business told me last week that despite car sales going up, dealer profits are going down. That's why you see so many dealers offering 0-1% financing with low-to-no down payment. Every manufacturer is doing everything possible to keep their sales number stable to sustain a perception of a healthy industry as well as protecting its stock value.

And sub-prime auto lending is booming right now, which says a lot about the fragile state of our economy.

Side note: March sales for Beetle coupe and 'vert shows improvement. :thumbup:


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Cadenza_7o said:


> Probably not relevant to the residual value of the Beetle...
> 
> A relative who's in the car sales business told me last week that despite car sales going up, dealer profits are going down. That's why you see so many dealers offering 0-1% financing with low-to-no down payment. Every manufacturer is doing everything possible to keep their sales number stable to sustain a perception of a healthy industry as well as protecting its stock value.
> 
> ...


That sucks. Sounds like retail. Seems like all industries are losing profit except for oil and big banks.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

Babie said:


> For the heck of it, i call several VW dealers to see what I could do trading my 13 LOADED Turbo in for a convertible.
> 
> basically, the average was about 1/3 loss so a average 30K would now be about 20k in trade. I call several. Also, THEY ALL SAID THEY HAVE TO MANY 12 STILL NEW FOR SALE.
> 
> Neat car, but the trade value SUCKS.. really bad.


Basically that is the story for my 2013 Mustang I traded for my Beetle.... I did not pay MSRP (S plan I think plus some off that) but a third off is about right for it. Worse when they cannot move last years cars.


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## BretAZ (Apr 1, 2013)

When dealers are offering 6k off a new one, they would have to give you atleast 10k back of what you paid for yours to allow them to make any money on it. As a buyer, you would not pay more for a used one than you would for a new one, right?

That being said, my friend works at a dealership and they took a turbo beetle in on trade with 3k miles. It was gone in less than a week. They did have it priced very aggressive and it was equiped fairly well. Still a decent amount of saving over a new one, but not enought for me to pass up a brand new one.


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## PeterC4 (Apr 2, 2013)

Anthony_A said:


> Aren't the 2012+ Beetles built on the GTI frame? I think that was the best thing VW could have done for the beetle (besides updating the design). I think this alone has drawn a lot of people to the 2012+ Beetle. Speaking personally. I would have never even considered the beetle prior to the 2012 body. As soon as I saw the updated body I knew I wanted to get one. So, as a 30 something male I think VW really hit their mark for expanding the demographic of people who will be attracted to the beetle. It took a full model year before I even saw the new body style here on Long Island. I thought 2013 was the first year of the updated body. Where I'm going with this is that I think as the new body gets more exposure and more vehicles hit the road I think we will see sales rise.
> 
> As for the resale value.. I was talking to a coworker the other day. I mentioned to him that I bought my previous car with the logical side of my brain, with resale value in mind and blah blah blah. With my Beetle I didn't even think about it the resale value. This purchase was done with all heart. I really don't care what the resale value is. I love the car too much to think about selling it any time soon...



Same thing with Porsche...it takes a while.


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## MelindaJBZ (Dec 21, 2012)

Im jealous of all of you that got good deals. I only got $500 off my 2013 Beetle TDI because there were very few in the area and they were being sold as soon as they got off the truck. I had it up to $600 off but then the color and trim I wanted was almost 200 miles away so it got knocked down to pay the the guy who drove through a bad snow storm to get my Ferdinand. A 5 hour round trip took him 12 hours! I waited a year for this car so I didn't mind paying almost full price. This is my 3rd new car and first that I didn't get thousands off MSRP. 

Never buy a car if you think you are not going to keep it for many years. Most cars loose 15- 30% of their value as soon as you buy. Beetles are no different. I had purchased a Camaro and a year and a half later they announced that they would not be making anymore so I went to see about trading in mine and getting the final year. well it was stupid how little I would have got for mine so I kept it. Few years later I totaled it and got much more than it was worth form my insurance company so it all worked out.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

MelindaJBZ said:


> Im jealous of all of you that got good deals. I only got $500 off my 2013 Beetle TDI because there were very few in the area and they were being sold as soon as they got off the truck. I had it up to $600 off but then the color and trim I wanted was almost 200 miles away so it got knocked down to pay the the guy who drove through a bad snow storm to get my Ferdinand. A 5 hour round trip took him 12 hours! I waited a year for this car so I didn't mind paying almost full price. This is my 3rd new car and first that I didn't get thousands off MSRP.
> 
> Never buy a car if you think you are not going to keep it for many years. Most cars loose 15- 30% of their value as soon as you buy. Beetles are no different. I had purchased a Camaro and a year and a half later they announced that they would not be making anymore so I went to see about trading in mine and getting the final year. well it was stupid how little I would have got for mine so I kept it. Few years later I totaled it and got much more than it was worth form my insurance company so it all worked out.


I wouldn't feel so bad considering you got a more rare Beetle. Plus you got exactly what you wanted. Id say the majority of us settled for price/features.


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## Dscot8r!2 (Dec 18, 2012)

MelindaJBZ said:


> Im jealous of all of you that got good deals. I only got $500 off my 2013 Beetle TDI because there were very few in the area and they were being sold as soon as they got off the truck. I had it up to $600 off but then the color and trim I wanted was almost 200 miles away so it got knocked down to pay the the guy who drove through a bad snow storm to get my Ferdinand. A 5 hour round trip took him 12 hours! I waited a year for this car so I didn't mind paying almost full price. This is my 3rd new car and first that I didn't get thousands off MSRP.
> 
> Never buy a car if you think you are not going to keep it for many years. Most cars loose 15- 30% of their value as soon as you buy. Beetles are no different. I had purchased a Camaro and a year and a half later they announced that they would not be making anymore so I went to see about trading in mine and getting the final year. well it was stupid how little I would have got for mine so I kept it. Few years later I totaled it and got much more than it was worth form my insurance company so it all worked out.


Your Beetle TDI Conv. will hold it's value very well. Take good care of it, and you'll be surprised what it would bring in 3 years. 2 & 3 year old TDI SportWagens that were $26k MSRP new are bringing $20k at auctions with 45000 miles on them.


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## Chrisho (Dec 1, 2012)

Dscot8r!2 said:


> Your Beetle TDI Conv. will hold it's value very well. Take good care of it, and you'll be surprised what it would bring in 3 years. 2 & 3 year old TDI SportWagens that were $26k MSRP new are bringing $20k at auctions with 45000 miles on them.


just make sure to have a good color. Reds, whites, and blacks, tend to not change much in favor over time. Oddballs like me who buy those other colors ... well.


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## gulmargha (Mar 12, 2013)

My local dealer had the brilliant idea to order a bunch of yellow beetles :screwy: They're still sitting there, I don't think they've sold a single one. I had to get them to hunt down my black tdi from another dealer.


Chrisho said:


> just make sure to have a good color. Reds, whites, and blacks, tend to not change much in favor over time. Oddballs like me who buy those other colors ... well.


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## PLATA (Mar 15, 2013)

I live in the Baltimore MD / WASHINGTON DC corridor with 5 VW dealers all have no 2012 Turbos on their lots


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## PLATA (Mar 15, 2013)

I live in the Baltimore MD / WASHINGTON DC corridor with 5 VW dealers, all have no 2012 Turbos on their lots


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## BretAZ (Apr 1, 2013)

When I was buying at the end of last month I had considered waiting until the new incentives came out since there were so many 12 Beetles left. Glad I didn't. The incentive went from $3,500 to $3,000 I believe.


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## BretAZ (Apr 1, 2013)

there are still quite a few 12s, including Beetles, languising on the lot around here. 

http://www.bergevw.com/VehicleSearchResults?search=new


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## LUV2LOL (Apr 27, 2013)

I got my 2012 manual Turbo last week just $500 over a 2010 price that has 40,000 miles on it. There was about 9,000 miles on it as it was a demo car. It's a base model (I do miss my sunroof) but it's great fun to drive.


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## ilmattius (Jun 25, 2012)

fiftysomething said:


> The Beetle isn't going to die this time. Volkswagen has learned from their mistake of killing the original Bug in the US back in 1979. The New Beetles of 98-10 and 21st Century Beetles of 2012 onward are a logical and evolutionary continuation of an icon, and the car that literally defines Volkswagen, particularly in the US. While water-cooled Beetles will certainly never have sales numbers like the original air-cooleds, it is here to stay. Sorry, Beetle haters.


 BEETLE HATERS GO TROLL SOMEWHERE ELSE. 

If you don't get how awesome this car is, I can tell you that all of your taste is in your mouth.

BUH-BYE :wave:


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## FlyDiesel (Dec 26, 2004)

What goes Cloppity Clop, Cloppity Clop, *Bang* Bang* Cloppity Clop, Cloppity Clop? 

-An Amish Drive-by Shooting.


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## Cadenza_7o (Jan 23, 2001)

FlyDiesel said:


> What goes Cloppity Clop, Cloppity Clop, *Bang* Bang* Cloppity Clop, Cloppity Clop?
> 
> -An Amish Drive-by Shooting.


 I've not witnessed an Amish drive-by but my '73 air-cooled Super Beetle sounds exactly as you described when the carburetor fouled up. 

:laugh:


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## Sixtysomething (Aug 7, 2003)

I've been trying to search Youtube for Amish death metal bands, but nothing comes up.........


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

fiftysomething said:


> I've been trying to search Youtube for Amish death metal bands, but nothing comes up.........


 Since they're not big fans of electricity, getting the proper sound during rehearsals can be a 'tad' 
on the difficult side.


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## Derby Herbie (Mar 11, 2012)

I traded mine in for a new Ram truck last month. 14K was the best I could get, but got a great deal on the truck. Needed a tow vehicle for snowmobile. Depreciation much, much worse than my previous car-2010 Challenger (which would still have higher trade-in value now as an older, higher mileage car according to kbb-Challenger was the V6 model, about same original purchase price). Even despite the tow issue, the car just wasn't for me (too small, got burned out on the constant city shifting, and lack of torque) and I knew I would want to get rid of it before warranty expired. Its still for sale up in Two Harbors, MN-Here's link-

http://www.sonju.com/Used-2012-Volkswagen-Beetle/vd/16900094

Love the new truck!!!










The old Challenger at Churchill Downs in 2011-(deep water blue identical to reef blue metallic)


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