# My Build:1.8t into mk3



## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

i am going to be putting a 1.8t into my vr6 jetta GLX. i love my VR but it has 150k+ miles on it, ive had a couple of them and want to try something different and boosted! also i really want an engine with better gas mileage because at the end of the year i will be getting a newer car so i want to save as much money as possible. im looking for the swap to cost me less than 1500 bucks without factoring in the possible sale of my VR6 swap. the AWM i got for this swap was free, and i will be using the bellhousing from an 02J and putting it onto my 02A(because my tranny has about 5k on it). i will be using my axles also. with that said here is my parts list:

2.0l rear engine mount bracket *CHECK*
2.0l front engine mount bracket *CHECK*
*WIRING!!!* this is a huge question mark
Tune
FWD k03 *CHECK*
alternator *CHECK*
FWDintake manifold *CHECK*
mk4 3inch DP *CHECK*
front mount intercooler and piping *CHECK*
inlet
flywheel *CHECK*
fuel rail *CHECK*
injectors *CHECK*
SAI delete *CHECK*
FWD rad hoses
coolant flange*CHECK*
thermostat *CHECK*
timing belt *CHECK*
FWD oilfilter housing and oilcooler*CHECK*

to address hat i said earlier about wiring, that is one thing i want to clearly document in this build thread due to the fact that i cant really find a build thread that lists the option and they route they chose. if anyone can chime in with the different ways a 1.8t can be wired up to run in a mk3 it would be much appreciated as i am still researching these options myself to see which would be the most cost effective and take the least amount of time. i was really looking into using 2.0l wiring and splicing it into and FWD 1.8t harness/ECU setup but then what do i do about the interior stuff? this is all unknown to me. i am a technician but havent done a hybrid swap like this before. if someone can shed light on this it would be nice. im looking to keep my mk3 interior and not have an immobilizer.

pics of it cleaned up









PIC WHEN I JUST PULLED IT OUT AND TOOK ACCESSORIES OFF









Pic of the engine bay its going into


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## madonion (May 1, 2007)

I don't get why your doing it ... your vr is still running fine ? 150k miles isn't that much unless it was poorly maintained Your gonna save a bunch of time and money not doing the swap at all since your getting a new car anyway. Sell The 1.8T + the car end of the story. You won't save any money doing a swap.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

this is the one and only time i will answer these kind of questions... im doing the swap because i am bored with VR's. i have had 4 of the. had a 1.8t before and didnt really have the money to maintain it so i "had a bad experience" with that so i wanna try again. i maintaint the crap out of my VR. runs great. intake, tune, exhaust, clutch and flywheel and i beat 2.0ts with intake and exhaust. runs great and i love it i just want to try something else in my mk3. and i do plan on keeping this car after i get my new one..so the saving is more long term on gas mileage...


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

and ofcourse..more power out of this motor, and less weight


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Since this is all going in a MK3 why not go with a FMIC. Lots of room even with a/c. And what are you planning on doing for engine management? Cheaper in the long run to go standalone especially when you decide the K03 has to go away. And you wont need the stupid MAF.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

so i could use saaaay.. MegaSquirt, then keep my mk3 ecu and use the ms to run the engine? will eventually go front mount but for now i dont wanna deal with running piping. kinda just wanna getthe motor in and running. and i will eventually be putting a big turbo on this


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## way2manydubs (Mar 10, 2006)

So... youre a "technician", but you dont know ecu= Engine Control Unit?
megasquirt would be replacing the ecu.
Good luck.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

yes im a tech and yes i kno an ecu controls the engine but if your so smart why dont you kno that an ecu controls more than just the engine lol:screwy: you can keep your comments to yourself. you can be the best tech in the world but there is no teacher of hybrid swaps..you dont learn that in tech school. which is why im asking questions...i wanna be a know it all ike you :laugh:


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Love2Spool said:


> so i could use saaaay.. MegaSquirt, then keep my mk3 ecu and use the ms to run the engine? will eventually go front mount but for now i dont wanna deal with running piping. kinda just wanna getthe motor in and running. and i will eventually be putting a big turbo on this


Absolutely, MS works VERY well with a 1.8T. MS2 with extra firmware at a minimum on a V3.0 or V3.57 mainboard. MS3 with the 3X expander and a set of LS truck coils and you can run everything on the engine that the factory 1.8T ECU did....and more. I say LS coils because they are plug and play with MS3X ( VAG coils are not) and they are the hottest , most reliable coil out there. Obviously this is an ODB2 w/can bus MK3. On an OBD1 I'd chuck the factory ECU without fear. MS can run the MK3 tach no problem and an MS3/3X can even run the speedo if need be.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

Prof315 said:


> Absolutely, MS works VERY well with a 1.8T. MS2 with extra firmware at a minimum on a V3.0 or V3.57 mainboard. MS3 with the 3X expander and a set of LS truck coils and you can run everything on the engine that the factory 1.8T ECU did....and more. I say LS coils because they are plug and play with MS3X ( VAG coils are not) and they are the hottest , most reliable coil out there. Obviously this is an ODB2 w/can bus MK3. On an OBD1 I'd chuck the factory ECU without fear. MS can run the MK3 tach no problem and an MS3/3X can even run the speedo if need be.


THIS IS GREAT INFO RIGHT HERE! now i feel like this post is going somewhere lol. ok so wit hthat said i will most likely be using MS3. but what about after i get rid of the k03? i have no tune that i can just buy so at that point i will be going to usp to have it tuned..or is there some retailer out there can provides these tunes. also now that the engine part is taken care of, what do i do about running everything in the car??


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## way2manydubs (Mar 10, 2006)

What else does a mk3 ecu control?


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Love2Spool said:


> THIS IS GREAT INFO RIGHT HERE! now i feel like this post is going somewhere lol. ok so wit hthat said i will most likely be using MS3. but what about after i get rid of the k03? i have no tune that i can just buy so at that point i will be going to usp to have it tuned..or is there some retailer out there can provides these tunes. also now that the engine part is taken care of, what do i do about running everything in the car??


You don't buy tunes with megasquirt. It's a fully tunable/configureable DIY standalone engine management system. The only thing I would recommend buying besides the MS itself it a registered copy of Tuner Studio MS. You can get the light version for free but it doesn't have all of the VERY desirable bells and whistles like Autotune that actually works. Go check this link : www.msextra.com for basic info on what Megasquirt is and the different flavors it comes in. Then go to www.megamanual.com for details.

As far as running everything in the car..... what everything? And what year car are we talking about?


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## mafosta (Dec 24, 2007)

what timeframe are you looking at for this project


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

i have since done research and have deleted just about everything other than the engine thatthe ecu controls lol. so thats not an issue anymore. i know megasquirt is fully adjustable but i thought there were pre written tunes that can be oaded via a tuning program. guess not. im not really a tuning guru. i gotta change that. but im surely not looking to be tuning my own car..unless delray beach isnt too far of a drive for you to tune mine 

oh and my time frame....BEFORE H20!!!


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Love2Spool said:


> i have since done research and have deleted just about everything other than the engine thatthe ecu controls lol. so thats not an issue anymore. i know megasquirt is fully adjustable but i thought there were pre written tunes that can be oaded via a tuning program. guess not. im not really a tuning guru. i gotta change that. but im surely not looking to be tuning my own car..unless delray beach isnt too far of a drive for you to tune mine
> 
> oh and my time frame....BEFORE H20!!!


Well if you do an MS2 or MS3/3X I have basemaps I could share and if you had install or tuning issues I could be persuaded to come help for gas money and beer.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

that coule be worked out...providing you drive the 20/20 rado so i can see your tuning in action!lol. i dont know for sure if i want to go standalone yet...what are my other wiring options for getting a q.i8t into my car and running?


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

lets get some more options posted about wiring a 1.8t into an mk3


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## dik-van-dub (Jul 25, 2010)

good bit of info here for running standard management

http://clubgti.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=205887


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Love2Spool said:


> that coule be worked out...providing you drive the 20/20 rado so i can see your tuning in action!lol. i dont know for sure if i want to go standalone yet...what are my other wiring options for getting a q.i8t into my car and running?


It's my daily of course I'd drive it. You can always use stock 1.8t wiring and management. I just prefer standalone for cross generational or cross platform motor swaps. I also like it as an upgrade from older archaic (DIGI) factory systems. I did a fuel only install on a 79 280ZX with a rather tired motor and when I was done (it took just over a day at work to install and tune) the customer said it ran smoother and stonger than when it was brand new. My former boss who worked on them when they were new agreed.


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## WoLfBuRgJeTTa (Mar 4, 2006)

Everything you need is right here (click), I have done all the things you want to do and some. Wiring is on the last page, my car came with a VR also so it should be exactly the same for you. Add map sensor to your list of parts also.



Prof315 said:


> Since this is all going in a MK3 why not go with a FMIC. Lots of room even with a/c. And what are you planning on doing for engine management? Cheaper in the long run to go standalone especially when you decide the K03 has to go away. And you wont need the stupid MAF.


There is not that much room for a front mount, not a decent sized one at least, without some major cutting of the rebar and/or moving the radiator to make it sit parallel with the firewall.

I do agree with getting rid of the MAF but you don't need to go stand alone to do that. OP, I suggest you wire up your car and just get a tune flashed (BT tunes come off the shelf too). This is cheaper in the long run and more reliable unless you like tinkering with your tune to get it absolutely perfect which can take forever if you are not into tuning (which I am not). Also if you do want to go stand alone, Maestro is the way to go hands down.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

dik-van-dub said:


> good bit of info here for running standard management
> 
> http://clubgti.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=205887


thread doesnt work



WoLfBuRgJeTTa said:


> Everything you need is right here (click), I have done all the things you want to do and some. Wiring is on the last page, my car came with a VR also so it should be exactly the same for you. Add map sensor to your list of parts also.


i think i will most likely go with stock 1.8t management. i have the whole engine harness and awp ecu....would i need anything else to getthis engine wired up in my car and running? what would i do about my tach signale and speedo? and i still dont get why you had to take your dash out to wire up the eninge. also im pm'ing you about your other stock turbo


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

will definitely be getting a map sensor..where could i source this? and waht tune are you using that doesnt require a MAF signal? im thinking of getting a united motorsports tune


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## WoLfBuRgJeTTa (Mar 4, 2006)

I'm going to run the maf on the stock turbo while i break my motor in then I will be running Unitronics off the shelf or getting Maestro. Both of those are available with mafless files. I'm getting my map sensor for a local guy parting out his MK4. I got a bunch of misc stuff that I was missing from him, new ones can be bought from most parts stores or online, but they are pricey.


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## WoLfBuRgJeTTa (Mar 4, 2006)

i think you can use your AC compressor and alternator also, you just need a mounting bracket for the 1.8. I have one from a transverse. I also have an intake mani. PM me for info


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

bump for the start of the flow of pics! this build will be well documented


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## WoLfBuRgJeTTa (Mar 4, 2006)

Love2Spool said:


> thread doesnt work
> 
> 
> 
> i think i will most likely go with stock 1.8t management. i have the whole engine harness and awp ecu....would i need anything else to getthis engine wired up in my car and running? what would i do about my tach signale and speedo? and i still dont get why you had to take your dash out to wire up the eninge. also im pm'ing you about your other stock turbo


Tach signal isn't a big deal since your car is CE2, speedo wiringis covered somewhere in my wiring, pretty sure the speed sensor takes car of it. You don't have to take your dash out for wiring butit makes it a whole lot easier to reach things and route wires.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

bump for some progress  just ordered some parts ...will get pics up when i get em in and on


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## Blk95VR6 (Nov 9, 2000)

You can use the MK III alternator and A/C compressor as is, provided you use the MK III accessory bracket (I used one from a 2.0 but the VR6 may work), but to use the MK III power steering pump you'll need the MK IV pulley, mounted to the MK III unit. You'll also need to notch the front crossmember just a bit to ensure the banjo fitting line fits, or else it'll bump the crossmember. You'll need to consider moving your A/C dryer a little (and I mean little) bit, especially when you decide to go with a FMIC. And go ahead and just bite the bullet and do FMIC piping _now_, don't wait, you'll be happy you did all the work now instead of doing it in steps. Because once you get it running, (insert excuse here) will elways keep you from working on the "next" step to making the car (faster, stronger, more reliable, etcetera). Just my .02, take it for what it's worth (or not)...


Mike


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

i value everyones opinion and will take evrything into consideration. i may go the ebay route and just get some piping then fab it up myself. my only thing is that once i go BT (which wont be that long trust me..there isnt going to be much stopping me) i will have to change the piping again...cuz im gunna do rods and a 30r so im gunna want 3inch IC piping at least on the TB side.. and with a tiny lil k03 i wouldnt go with anything more than 2.25 inch piping on the from mount so i dont sacrifice my throttle response. i also have to get it running before H20. so we'll see.

*UPDATE:*

was driving my car yesterday(driving it like i stole it) and i went to slm second and my motor mount bracket completely broke and my engine went flying into my hood.bent my hood and also busted my oil cooler in the process so it wont hold coolant. i dont wanna spend another penny on this VR6 so im gunna go to the yard and see if i can find a bracket. im gunna reinforce the 2.0 engine mount bracket that i bought so this doesnt happen with the 1.8t...but damn these VR6's put down some torque!


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

You think you have torque now? Pfft do a maestro/eurodyne stage 2 flash on the k03s! You'll be like 

Maestro is worth the premium even if you have no interest in tuning. You never have to pay for a new tune ever. Just E-mail Tapp and request a new file, then flash it in yourself.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

ever dyno'd the setup you speak of?


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

the 2.0 mount you bought will make a good paper weight, you need a diesel front mount. go FMIC the SMIC will be a biotch to install, you need to modify the downpipe to work on the mk3 it will hit the fire wall you need to dimple it. the wiring is really easy if you wire it up as a DBC setup like an 058 1.8t the setup its under 14 wires to intergrate depending on what you want working on the cluster, you can run an 06A on an 058 ECU and harness. if you use b4 2.0 coolant lines its plug and play with the 1.8t and vr rad. 

you dont need to strengthen the motor mount brackets, im guess either yours was rusted to shyt or you ripped the bushing all up and caused the motor to jump. 

also, take what i said with a grain of salt, its your build im just giving my imput since i have a 1.8t mk3 cabrio.


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

In for tips and tricks... 

Ill be using an AEB, swapping my mk3 2.0 accessory brackets and accessories over and wiring the engine harness to my factory fuse panel. 

All that is in the future though as I have some engine bay cleaning/rust repair to do, floor pan rust to fix and then get the whole car ready for a respray. Ill get the motor in and situated before anything though so I can make the necessary modifications now before I get it all nice and painted then have to ruin it by smashing or cutting something to get it to fit.


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## WoLfBuRgJeTTa (Mar 4, 2006)

vwb5t said:


> also, take what i said with a grain of salt, its your build im just giving my imput since i have a 1.8t mk3 cabrio.


 This guy's being modest, I saw his build, it was AWESOME!!! :thumbup::thumbup:


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Definately sounds like he knows his sheot that's for sure.


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

WoLfBuRgJeTTa said:


> This guy's being modest, I saw his build, it was AWESOME!!! :thumbup::thumbup:


 thanks dude, on one hand i like to help people out on the other hand i think people get more out figuring things out on there own. the wiring is actually really easy when you get down to it but it scares many many people from even attempting the swap. i did a VR swap and a 1.8t swap back to back basically and i felt the 1.8t swap was easier than the vr. 

but many people also dont have the time or the resources to experiment or see what could work, i have spent countless hours at the local junkyard just staring at different motors trying to figure out how to make my swap neater and easier to pull thats how i found the passat 2.0 coolant lines are a direct match for the 1.8t to VR rad i just popped the hood on one looking for some 02a parts and it was like damn those coolant lines look like they will work on my setup so i got those as well and they did. 

my 1.8t swap has just been a week here and there doing it little by little, this winter the plan is to go back to a bare shell and start from fresh, custom interior harness, new engine harness, weld up the bay. this is my first serious build and im kinda curious as to what i can accomplish when i can strip it and spend 3 months building it rather than a few days or a week on it :laugh:


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

Any suggestion on what coolant lines would be best to use when swapping with a 2.0?


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

i see alot of ppl who do the swap change their copolant bottle to be on the other side of the engine bay..is that really necessary or doe sit just make it more plug and play as far as coolant goes?


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## WoLfBuRgJeTTa (Mar 4, 2006)

The plumbing works better if you move it. However, I'm not running a coolant bubble, I'm running an inline filler.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

pics of this inline filler and where you got it?


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## Blk95VR6 (Nov 9, 2000)

If you're interested in doing coolant lines another way, use the stock MK IV hoses (upper and lower) with a VR6 radiator and you're golden. 


...and I, too, have a 1.8T Cabrio, with a 6 speed, and have had it on the road for over 4 years. Love it...  


Mike


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

Imma have to start writing all this stuff down in case something ever happens to the thread. So much info to remember haha


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

hopefully this thread wont go anywhere, i wanna pack it full of info and turn it into the 1 stop thread for everything for doing a 1.8t swap into an mk3. im about to do a huge update real soon as its coming down to swap time!


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

After seeing some stuff from Afazz, he has me wanting to build my own harness haha....I can see that turning into a DISASTER


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

see what turning into a disaster?


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Love2Spool said:


> see what turning into a disaster?


I think he was referencing himself attempting to build his own harness


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

oh coool..i actually read that afazz thread..pretty cool ****


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

Question........my friend said he has a 1.8T from a 00 or 01 audi a4. How much more work is it using that engine? I thought they used the DBW which is what I'm trying to avoid. He only wants $600 for the complete motor but then I have to deal with the DBW crap right? Also I thought those were the motors that had to get the chip tune done to defeat the immobilizer, correct?


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

harlequin80 said:


> Question........my friend said he has a 1.8T from a 00 or 01 audi a4. How much more work is it using that engine? I thought they used the DBW which is what I'm trying to avoid. He only wants $600 for the complete motor but then I have to deal with the DBW crap right? Also I thought those were the motors that had to get the chip tune done to defeat the immobilizer, correct?


2 issues: 1. it's a longitudinal mount engine: intake, exhaust and turbo won't work.

2. DBW and immobilizer

Of course running standalone management solves any ECU issues


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

yeah forget all that LOL

back to looking at a reman'd block and head. Atleast I start out with the engine I really want and its brand new(ish) and spotless....no cleaning is a + for me


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

Prof315 said:


> 2 issues: 1. it's a longitudinal mount engine: intake, exhaust and turbo won't work.
> 
> 2. DBW and immobilizer
> 
> Of course running standalone management solves any ECU issues



exhaust manifold and turbo can be used if you buy the TT 1.8t mk3 downpipe. 

and whats the engine code? also its easy to convert to DBC just use an AEB harness and mk3 2.0 throttle body


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

vwb5t said:


> also its easy to convert to DBC just use an AEB harness and mk3 2.0 throttle body


and what throttle cable do you use?


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

either VR or early mk4 2.0, i have a VR cable


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

would i have to get an AEB harness or can i jus use my DBW harness and cut out the connectors


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

also can you post pics of how you have that cable routed..love a clean engine bay


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## VW_FAST1.8T (Mar 19, 2008)

I got a 97 golf gl with a aww 1.8t swap done to it that i did almost 2 years ago. so if you have any problems or ?s about the swap fill free to ask. i also have a lot of pics to look at if needed.


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

If I remember right form what I read they say you need the corresponding engine harness to motor.


here are 4 options for wiring: see wiring tips at bottom of page

100% Donor Wiring (ECU/Cluster/Keys)
Swapping over the complete engine harness and associated wiring might not be the easiest part of a swap, but it is possible to make it as painless as can be. First and foremost you MUST get everything from the same car.
This is especially key on the 2001+ engines as they run a more advanced immobilizer than the earlier cars and you must match the ECU, Cluster and keys in order to avoid any issues.
* If your running want to run the engine harness from a engine code other than for which you have (i.e. AEB harness on a AWP engine) you must swap over all the sensors to the style for which harness your using (i.e. no AWP sensors with an AEB harness). If your engine was VVT and you don't want to use it either swap to a non-VVT tensioner or do not connect the controller solenoid, disconnecting it is the same as not having it (for use with non-VVT harnesses).
*
Partial Donor Wiring
Basically the same as using the complete wiring from the donor, except you don't wiring in any part but the donor's engine harness. To get around the need of using the donor's matched cluster you'll need to have the ECU chipped by REVO or Dahlback Racing. Pretty much all chip tuners offer programming which disables the ECU's immobilizer allowing the use of your OE cluster, just ask as its not typically advertised.
NOTE: Check your wiring diagrams! In order to get DTCs from the ECU without the OE donor's cluster you must confirm that the K-Diagnostic line is routed from the ECU to the OBDII port. On some vehicles this was run through the cluster and would need to be corrected.
On AWD Engines pin 43 on the ECU needs to connect to pin 7 on the OBDII port, wire should be gray/white.

Standalone
Wiring standalone will be the easiest but also likely the most expensive. Your selected standalone will come with directions on where everything needs to be attached. The use of standalone will allow infinite flexibility with tuning in the future and keep the rest of the car (i.e. cluster, etc) original.
Standalone will also mean that you'll be swapping a DBW engine to DBC. The Best means to do this is using the Corrado VR6 throttle cable, at roughly $50 new its the right length and ends to make the swap easy.


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

Love2Spool said:


> would i have to get an AEB harness or can i jus use my DBW harness and cut out the connectors


I would get an AEB harness, the 02 sensor connectors are different on the ATW but you can use the mk3 O2's with the AEB harness with no mods. there are a couple other that are different as well, also the coil packs on the AEB are different and use an ICM but you can use the ATW harness to eliminate the ICM. also the ATW has the N249 and MAP sensor plugs that the AEB doesnt use as well as a different oil pressure switch, and SAIP plugs. 

I dont have any good shots of my bay since the last clean up of crap in it but i will try and get some as soon as i get the car back a buddy has it to notch the frame for me right now.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

VW_FAST1.8T said:


> I got a 97 golf gl with a aww 1.8t swap done to it that i did almost 2 years ago. so if you have any problems or ?s about the swap fill free to ask. i also have a lot of pics to look at if needed.


thanks bro..swap is starting next weekend after i have everything else i need, will definitely be getting your number for quick contact lol..if ya dont mind



vwb5t said:


> I would get an AEB harness, the 02 sensor connectors are different on the ATW but you can use the mk3 O2's with the AEB harness with no mods. there are a couple other that are different as well, also the coil packs on the AEB are different and use an ICM but you can use the ATW harness to eliminate the ICM. also the ATW has the N249 and MAP sensor plugs that the AEB doesnt use as well as a different oil pressure switch, and SAIP plugs.
> 
> I dont have any good shots of my bay since the last clean up of crap in it but i will try and get some as soon as i get the car back a buddy has it to notch the frame for me right now.


so your saying that i can use the coil pack section of the harness from the ATW, attatch it to the AEB harness, use the 02's from my mk3, how can i put the MAP sensor into the harness(could i just add the wires into the main ecu connector and run them to the MAP sensor mysself) cuaz i really want to be ablt to use the car without a MAF. also anything and i mean ANYTHING emissions related will be deleted..i feel they just clog up the engine bay. so i will be abler to do away with all of those connectors.


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

the AEB does not use a MAP sensor, the only way to run mafless and DBC is standalone.


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

question.......


how exactly do you wire the AEB harness into the 2.0?

I was thinking about removing all the engine connectors from the 2.0 harness so I have 2 separate harnesses, 1 for lights 1 for engine, but it looked like some of the lighting stuff came out of the ECU portion of the 2.0 harness.

So is it possible to seperate the light portion of the harness from the engine part and then wire the AEB harness into the car using the factory connectors from the 2.0 engine harness and have a separate light harness?


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

what i did was remove the 2.0 harness fuse block connectors, figure out what wires i needed for the swap and removed the rest from the plugs. them matched up the outputs from the harness to the inputs on the fuse block plugs and sliced them together so its plug and play when i remove things. 

the headlight harness is completely separate from the engine harness its just in the same bundle so it can be removed easily. 

i have 4 harnesses in my engine bay. 

1 from the fuse block to the engine/ECU that runs through the factory hole for now and that just runs the motor only, 

1 for the headlight harness that runs through the frame rail 

1 for the starter/alternator/and main power since my battery is in the trunk

and 1 for the oil pressure/temp/coolant temp/and a 1/8th inch boost line for the gauge, i ran a separate VDO coolant temp gauge cause i wanted an accurate coolant temp not the generic VW one.


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

I think I understood that haha.

Sounds basically like what I wanted to do. 

I was dumb and didnt mark what connectors went to what on the motor before I yanked it all so I have no idea what goes to my light harness and what is my engine. 

I gave the light harness piece with the giant plug on it to a friend when he bought my ecodes so that doesn't help either haha.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

dont look now but this thread is becoming very informative


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

on the harness you have this, 

the 2 big yellow are headlights/turns/horn and alt exciter 

the small yellow are some warning lights on the cluster, coolant level, brake fluid, couple other small things.

the 3 white are the engine plugs


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

I started to unwrap the harness.....why in the hell they intertwined so many of the wires i have no idea..

Im trying to separate the harnesses but it seems like Im going to have to depin some of the connectors in order to get the wires out of the mess of the others. There are also a bunch of wires that run and then split off in 4 directions, some to other plugs and no idea where the others go. Ill post a picture later and see if you have any tips on separating them out.


pics:

So the red wires/white stripes go to 1 large connector...they have a brown wire running in the middle along with red/yellow wire and then 2 small brown wires, one going under and one going over one of the red/white wire.....Im guessing the only way to get them all separated is to cut and splice them back together??











There there is this mess....under 3 wires then over top of the 3rd with a small brown wire wrapped around it..


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## WoLfBuRgJeTTa (Mar 4, 2006)

Get used to it, the majority of the wires are a rat's nest :banghead:. That's why I got rid of as many wires as I could.


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

the wiring does suck, heres a some helpful things that i did, go get a notebook and write down every wire its color and what it does as you disassemble the harness. it is timwe consuming but it makes life much easier if you have to trouble shoot, you start to understand the wire harness and if you do it enough you start to see a pattern that vw does with color of the wires and there function. 

you should see the notebook i have for the engine harness its a few pages long and it traces the wires from the block to the color change on the VR cannon plug then back to the AEB harness and then what was intergrated into the mk3 engine plugs as well as the function of all the wires.


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

also just to show you what your getting into not sure if you saw these, here was some of my wiring. 

cut the harness in half 


















all cleaned up









engine side 









engine harness out of the car, this is from the fuse block to the cannon plug on the engine. 









then you can dig into the interior and remove a ton and clean that up as well 




















headlight harness 










still have some work to do but not till the winter, the plans are a new engine harness for a DBW setup and then make my own interior harness so i can do it nicely and neatly unlike the factory one.


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

I think Im going to buy the tool to remove the pins from the plugs. Question, if I do that is it possible to remove the pins from the plugs for the mk3 fuse panel and then remove the pins from the plug on the aeb engine harness and just plug them into the mk3 connectors so I dont have to splice any wires? Then I can just remove all the other wires I wouldnt be using from the large connector


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

the pins are different sizes and shapes they dont plug into the other harness.


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

Go figure


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

so i have officially started the swap now. i will be adding pics to this update tonight when i get home. i have already removed the engine, tranny and engine harness..now to remove the main harness to the ecu. here poses my first challenge. i started to remove the ecu wiring and am starting to realize that the ecu taps into alot of ****..it proveds ground to many things.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

SCRATCH THAT..JUST DECIDE TO REMOVE THE WHOLE BAY HARNESS!! PICS COMING l)


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

are you talking about the 1.8t harness or the 2.0 harness?

My question is..

There is an ECM and ECU correct? This is where Im starting to get lost. You need the ECM and ECU correct? Ive been doing a swap in my mk4 car and I pulled the engine harness which is seperate from the main harness but you need the main harness from the ECU to run to the fuse panel in the mk3 right?


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

no there is only an ecm.... ecm = engine control module , ecu = engine control unit..same thing..called 2 different things. i do not have a 2.0 i have a vr6 car but i was talkin about the harness in my car.. i ended up removing the entire harness from the engine bay. you will notice that it is one big wiring lump and then it split into the enine wiring and the fan wiriing along with ac and all that crap. i will be deleting the stock fans and running 2 electric fans hardwiried to something that only turns on when the key is on. im also deciding that im going to finish shaving my bay and smoth it out. so my bay will only have a harness and wiring for my electric fans which is very simple. the main harness(engine harness) i will attempt to run through the fender well but ill have to get on the fab forums and look into that more and see what i can do myself


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

same thing i planned on doing.

i know in the 1.8t the harness for the motor is separate from the rest of the wiring but doesnt the box it plugs into run to the ECU as well? Maybe I need to post a pic to explain what im talking about


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

run your fans off a thermostat switch it will make them way more efficent and allow the car to get to running temp and stay there for best performance. 

the 1.8t engine harness runs to the ECU box, in that box you have the ECU and all the plugs to intergrate the engine to the rest of the car, IE the ecu interacts with the ICM, cluster, ABS, and if you have it climatronic.

on the vr6 engine harness well all mk3's you have a bunch of grounds, but the are for the headlights, fans, engine, fuse block, ECU, ABS if installed. these are under the battery and can all be moved to the interior if wanted. 

why are you removing the entire body harness?


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

i didnt remove the body harness..just whats in the engine bay..attempting to post pics now of updates


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

good stuff, im posting to subscribe, doing the same swap with an AEB. just getting my random parts to swap stuff over now.


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## Randall Alexander (Dec 2, 2010)

Looking good. Lots of helpful stuff. Thanks and goodluck


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## harlequin80 (Aug 28, 2011)

So a friends friend is picking up a mk3 with a 20v swap for $1500 this weekend and it only needs a fuel pump.......sounds to good to be true. If the dude wasnt such a douche bag I would love to look over the car but he is a total ******* so oh well


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

What a ***!lol..i kno i keep saying updates and pics are coming but they really are..i have just about everything now..just need a tune for my ecu and a trans which i found with cl;utch and pp and flywheel..as soon as i get everything updates will be frequent!!!!!


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

any updates? time to get going on this a mk3 1.8t is such a fun car :laugh:


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## RubaDubDubb (Sep 1, 2011)

I slowly but surely have been eliminating wire by wire as well, I bought this car swapped and the swappee did a horrible job. Im still trying to find which systems are improperly grounded yet and what plugs go where. I have a few plugs under the dash that should be plugged into the fuseblock and I have been hacking at those as well. One at a time, slowly but its happening. Good luck with your build wiring is a whore.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

yea i am not looking forward to the wiring...if i knew exactly what to cut and splice to what..it would be alot easier..but i guess we'll find out soon!


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## mk3FTW. (May 4, 2011)

awesome thread. subscribed :thumbup:


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

Love2Spool said:


> yea i am not looking forward to the wiring...if i knew exactly what to cut and splice to what..it would be alot easier..but i guess we'll find out soon!



did mine last night and this morning, wasnt too bad. ive got a couple jumpers to do still, so hopefully it will work when i put it in.:thumbup:


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

wiring is the fun part, a couple open bentelys, wires all over, trying to figure out what is needed and what isnt. ah the good old times, maybe a few beers as well. 


anyway onto real questions, are either of you running the oil pressure sensors?


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

im going to wire them, weather they work or not i have no idea :laugh:


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

only one will work, the 2.0 has 2 sensors one on the head one on the filter housing, the filter housing is the only one you will get on the 1.8t


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

)ok, what about the high and low pressure wires?(from g2)idk where those go


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

well you could do what i did and not run either lines and just run an oil pressure gauge, if you do that then you need to do this the low pressure switch must be grounded the high pressure must be open curcuit.

or you can run them both since there are 2 spots on the filter housing.


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## RubaDubDubb (Sep 1, 2011)

I ran my sensor and even replaced it as well but for some reason it just constantly flashes on my dash, so I pulled the bulb and thats the end of that. Im running boost, oil psi, and air/fuel so I know my oil psi is within spec and seems fine.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

i dont know what i will do on the oil pressure sensor side of things. will probably just running a straight guage and taking the bulb out!lol


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

i cant get a pic right now, my phone sucks. but i used this http://www.a2resource.com/electrical/CE2.html , http://myweb.whitman.syr.edu/srotblat/swap/ , and this http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...lors-functions-etc.&highlight=aeb+harness+pin , as well as the mk3 bently. i have my AEB harness wire cuts according to those 3 links. i have yet to make any jumpers to the gauge panel/ cluster wiring....


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

you can wire it all up through the fuse block plugs G1 and G2 and F, including the cluster stuff as well.

also dont forget you need to hook the VSS to the car and to the ECU otherwise it will never run right, it will run but not boost right.


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

With the tdi bracket, will you need starter bolts from a mk3 vr6 or will those from the 1.8t or 2.0 motor work or any vr6 starter work?


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

vwb5t said:


> you can wire it all up through the fuse block plugs G1 and G2 and F, including the cluster stuff as well.
> 
> also dont forget you need to hook the VSS to the car and to the ECU otherwise it will never run right, it will run but not boost right.



oo good to know. i would be the one to forget that part and be like WTF WHY ARNT YOU BOOSTING RIGHT!?!?!


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

96VDubbin said:


> With the tdi bracket, will you need starter bolts from a mk3 vr6 or will those from the 1.8t or 2.0 motor work or any vr6 starter work?


i think wolfsburgjetta clarified in his thread thaat you need the vr6 starter bolts


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

Yea I got some 2day & tried it but the bottom bolt was too short, so im looking for the replacement for that one.


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## RubaDubDubb (Sep 1, 2011)

one issue I havent figured out right but am not sure about either is it feels like it surges and also i believe my wastegate controller is maybe messed up as well. It has revo stage 1 chip as well as the 1.8t ecu, so im not sure if the stock gti fuel pump is displacing the wanted fuel or if the chip is incorrectly pulsing my injectors???


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

96VDubbin said:


> Yea I got some 2day & tried it but the bottom bolt was too short, so im looking for the replacement for that one.


BOTTOM BOLT IS TOO SHORT? what mount are you using? got pics that can accompany this?


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

Im using the tdi bracket, ill try 2 get a pic 2day also the 2.0 bracket for the trans wont work, you'll need 1 from an 02a


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

hopefully going to get the motor in and running this week :thumbup: im going to post up in the mk3 forum once i get farther along


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

96VDubbin said:


> Im using the tdi bracket, ill try 2 get a pic 2day also the 2.0 bracket for the trans wont work, you'll need 1 from an 02a


you kno there are ppl who confirm that the 2.0 bracket does work..alos thats the on im using...


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

You're talking about the front bracket correct? Only reason I used the tdi is b/c I've had it for awhile & was told the motor would sit more level. What did you use for the transmission mount bracket?


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

you need a TDI bracket, the 020 and vr bracket dont work unless you modify them.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

vwb5t said:


> you need a TDI bracket, the 020 and vr bracket dont work unless you modify them.


can you elborate on this "modify" you speak of?

im usuing my VR6 trans mount bracket


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## Blk95VR6 (Nov 9, 2000)

96VDubbin said:


> What did you use for the transmission mount bracket?


You could go with the DutchDub (now Dutch"something") mount, or contact user "SDezego", he manufactures the proper front and transmission mounts for the O2M/1.8T swap, but you _will_ have to have your transmission mount cup moved over; not difficult but time consuming, and you're without your car. If you're building it up *now* is the time to do that, get the driveline sitting correctly before you ever do anything else.


Mike


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

Blk95VR6 said:


> .... O2M/1.8T swap....



i dont think anyone on this threa is using a 02m..


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

na Im using 02j as well, Im in need of the vr6 trans bracket right now. The 020 trans bracket won't work unless its drilled out from what I could tell this wkend.


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

Love2Spool said:


> can you elborate on this "modify" you speak of?
> 
> im usuing my VR6 trans mount bracket


we are talking front mount correct? if so the vr mount didnt work on mine i would have had to cut and weld it to make it work. just get either a passat front mount or mk3 tdi cause those are right. i just happened to have a tdi mount hanging out from when i did an 02a in my mk3 jetta.


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

^ yea tdi mount is what I used Im just not sure which bolt I need for the bottom of the starter


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

So im going to be using a 2l oil filter housing, does any body know what thread arrangement is the oil hole on the top?


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## vwb5t (Jun 23, 2008)

as in the thread type? it should be a m10 thread.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

yea i do mean thread type..about to order my stainless steel braided line as we speak!!


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

after a long wait and a ton of sourcing parts..the swap is finally ready to be put into the car! still more things to get for it to be road worthy but at least its going in!lol im sry about my lack of updates..will get a big one together


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Cool Story Bro...

Pics or it didn't happen ic:


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

ok sp heres the update ive been promising..a bunch of picture proof of the prgress!!

got my everything back from the machine shop..shooo shiny





































put on the head and intake mani and turbo




































DP, FMIC, and piping in













































VC on Timing on and covers also 034motorsports PCV hose kit













































pics of short ratio G60 trans and 2.0l mount(looks like it works to me..just had to drill a hold and slide a bolt through it and put a nut on the other side)


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

are u still switching to the mk3 oil filter housing?


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

That is an mk3 oil filter housing


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## andrewduffield23 (Jul 21, 2009)

Bump for you.. I would love to have a 1.8t in my car but I really would hate to have to get into the wiring end of this lol


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

dont look now but i might be continueing the build starting at the end of the month...except with a 2.0l aba bottom end opcorn:


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## builtvw (Sep 20, 2009)

bump for me


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Love2Spool said:


> dont look now but i might be continueing the build starting at the end of the month...except with a 2.0l aba bottom end opcorn:


20/20's are a blast! And have even more torque than a 1.8T The long rod motor works really well with a K03 to about 200-225 whp. Or put a disco potato or some other T25 with a ball bearing center section and make 350-450whp all day long. And it'll still spool nice and quick.


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## Love2Spool (Sep 10, 2010)

hell yea..i cant wait!


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## K.M.A.S.W. (Feb 3, 2012)

just an update for people..this swap is continuing..i will be the one finishing it so look for more status updates. as it stands the motor is in and complete (coolant system, oil system and all components installed). pedal assembly from manual mk4 on the way as it will be swapped in in place of the mk3 pedal assembly. just figureing out wiring and installing the axles then this baby is ready to run.



vwb5t said:


> on the harness you have this,
> 
> the 2 big yellow are headlights/turns/horn and alt exciter
> 
> ...


please elaborate on this more as the same mistake was made on this car....complete engine bay harness was taken out..need to figure this out.



vwb5t said:


> run your fans off a thermostat switch it will make them way more efficent and allow the car to get to running temp and stay there for best performance.


 how do you achieve this? what wires need to be connected to where?



vwb5t said:


> you can wire it all up through the fuse block plugs G1 and G2 and F, including the cluster stuff as well.
> 
> also dont forget you need to hook the VSS to the car and to the ECU otherwise it will never run right, it will run but not boost right.


 please elaborate on which connections that have to be made to make the guage cluster warning indicators functional..also what connections need to be made from the VSS to make the car car "boosts right"



vwb5t said:


> you need a TDI bracket, the 020 and vr bracket dont work unless you modify them.


sorry to be so blunt but this is just wrong..the 1.8t is mounted into the car using vr6 trans mount and all 2.0l mount brackets for the motor...sits nice and level with no modifications necessary


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## K.M.A.S.W. (Feb 3, 2012)

bumpit up.will attempt to fire it up this weekend hopefully


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## missing the prix (Mar 25, 2006)

Love2spool is the walking scum on the vortex, his "rebuilt" motor he sent me (a few months after payment with half the parts missing which i STILL DIDNT GET) was absolute garbage. 

After starting my turbo build only to find out it needs an oil pump assembly. 

He is shady as ****, never answers calls, and now claims if i would have said something he would have refunded me, only answer he has after months of months of bul l****.

The valve cover was cracked, the oil pan was smashed.

And now all the parts he claimed he was going to send me "later on" including a turbo and intake manifold I see popping up in the other threads for sale.

When i asked why i never recieved the things i paid for he simply stated "oh well you didn't really need that stuff."

******


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## missing the prix (Mar 25, 2006)

that motor you all see in the pics is the one i paid for..that manifold n turbo n valve cover all supose to be mine..scumbag slaps together a poorly put together motor sends it to me n plays his games afterwards..would love to meet him in person


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

but on anther note, sorry you got hosed bro and i lol'd at ******


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## VWDREW (Oct 22, 2001)

I just went though this tread as I am kinda thinking about this swap for my golf but it looks like all the talk is for a OBD2 golf and I was wondering how this swap would differ if going into a 1994 OBD1 2.0L Golf, more or less would it be harder to do.


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## K.M.A.S.W. (Feb 3, 2012)

dunnp about the differences..im trying to find some wiring help for the obd2


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

obd1 and obd2 doesnt make a difference. It all depends on what you plan on using for management.


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## K.M.A.S.W. (Feb 3, 2012)

mk4 full harness and ecu..immo defeat so i can use my dash and cluster


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

Either way you will need to splice harness


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