# Supercharger for 2.5



## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

I have been thinking about taking a VF engineering supercharger from a VR6 kit and modifying it to fit the 2.5 rabbit engine. I love superchargers and I don't want excessive power. Maybe 8-10psi tops. If I got this to work, would anyone else want one made?
Please leave feedback. I have heard there is not enough room to fit one, but I would like to see if you move a few things if there would be enough room. Maybe a company like VF can create one if there is enough interest.


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## WikidMkV (Oct 26, 2006)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*

Do It! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Nez (Apr 22, 2008)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (WikidMkV)*

sounds interesting http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Nez)*

I emailed VF about this, maybe they will create a kit. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## yvrnycracer (Apr 17, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Xyphyr* »_I emailed VF about this, maybe they will create a kit. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Considering the availability of turbo kits... doubt it... but I would love to see this done... definitely be something different http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (yvrnycracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yvrnycracer* »_
Considering the availability of turbo kits... doubt it... but I would love to see this done... definitely be something different http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









Something about a 2.5S sounds sexy as hell, then I can ad a kompressor mercades badge.


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## undercoverdubber (Aug 24, 2008)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*

I want so much more so than a turbo, modest power boost at low end to get things rolling, no sharing oil w/a hot turbo.


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## racerbunny24 (Dec 2, 2006)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*

would love this!
im not a power whore just wouldnt mind a lil boostage...

doooo eeeet!


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (racerbunny24)*

I feel the same way as you guys, I will have my buddy at PSI look into it for me. He does custom tuning of engines and custom built manifolds.







I dont want a 400whp car, I want a daily driver with low end power as I am in the city. I am hoping to get like about 280-300whp outa it when its completed. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I will start saving to get this done, maybe I can get a sponsorship to help cover the costs.


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## racerbunny24 (Dec 2, 2006)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*

or donations!


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## PerkeyTurkey (Dec 4, 2007)

i was thinking of doing the same thing but not anytime soon


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (PerkeyTurkey)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PerkeyTurkey* »_i was thinking of doing the same thing but not anytime soon

Same here. I plan on other things b4 I get too crazy into performance.


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## skyrolla89 (Nov 16, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Xyphyr* »_I feel the same way as you guys, I will have my buddy at PSI look into it for me. He does custom tuning of engines and custom built manifolds.







I dont want a 400whp car, I want a daily driver with low end power as I am in the city. I am hoping to get like about *280-300whp* outa it when its completed. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I will start saving to get this done, maybe I can get a sponsorship to help cover the costs.









The perfect amount for daily driving, plus then dont have to worry moddin everything else..


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## CandyWhabbit (Sep 14, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (skyrolla89)*

i would love to see this done....i was hoping that VF would make a supercharger for the 2.5's but it does not look like to promising.


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

Neuspeed made a supercharger for the 2.0L... why cant someone replace our plastic manifold with a Jackson Racing unit or something to that matter? I had a VR6 Supercharged and i LOVED it. if someone came out with a SC for the 2.5, i'd be on it like a bum on a hot ham sammich'


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## yvrnycracer (Apr 17, 2007)

how about twin charging


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

Yeah, why not toss another grenade under the hood.


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## yvrnycracer (Apr 17, 2007)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbomonkeyexpress* »_Yeah, why not toss another grenade under the hood. 

I will be doing that on thursday thanks to eurojet...

















and a twincharged rabbit... that would be a build thread http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## darkk (Jun 22, 2006)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*

who is going to do the programming for this???


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## Black_Bunny_08 (Aug 12, 2008)

I'm interested too...let me know when you figure approximate cost involved!!


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## dotdub (Apr 4, 2008)

*Re: (yvrnycracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yvrnycracer* »_how about twin charging









x2 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: (dotdub)*

Supercharger http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (darkk)*


_Quote, originally posted by *darkk* »_who is going to do the programming for this???

My buddy from Torque Freaks. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I might just wait for the kit to come out. When it finally does...


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## Black_Bunny_08 (Aug 12, 2008)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Xyphyr* »_
My buddy from Torque Freaks. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I might just wait for the kit to come out. When it finally does...









Any approximate date?


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## Outie5000 (Aug 8, 2007)

I'd be all over a SC for the rabbit. Less expensive, less maintenance, more power throughout, no surprises at 3500rpm.. It would be very interesting to see how it works.


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## JTIgirl422 (Jan 31, 2005)

damn you took my idea for the winter.... hmm what project can i do this winter now??
If you do it GL


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## Blitzkrieg'nBunny (Feb 11, 2007)

ummm yes please, id like a supercharger..


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (yvrnycracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yvrnycracer* »_
I will be doing that on thursday thanks to eurojet...










Starbucks?


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (Xyphyr)*

VF is not making a Supercharger for the 2.5







What other places can we contact?


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

neuspeed made a supercharger for the More than worthless 2.0L Why the hell not for us.


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## VAGMeister (Sep 7, 2005)

Supercharger!


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*

TO NEUSPEED! WOOSH!!


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## b00stin_02917 (Aug 11, 2006)

*Re: (Xyphyr)*

forget the vf blower.. get a kit from kraftwerks.. rotrex supercharger w/ self contained oiling system and use a fmic. You would just need to make some mounts etc..









"Included Items:
• Rotrex C30-94 Supercharger
• Rotrex Self-Contained Oiling System
o Rotrex Magnetic Oil Filter
o Oil Lines
o Rotrex Oil Reservoir
• Rotrex SX100 Oil (1 Liter)"
will make up to 400+hp








thats a base kit for a s2000.. the blowers alone are around $2100
http://www.kraftwerksusa.com is the site.


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## skyrolla89 (Nov 16, 2007)

*Re: (b00stin_02917)*


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## 08 VduB WaBBiT (Apr 3, 2008)

i'm waitin for a supercharger...i dont wanna turbo my car...i love the whinninggg


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## kiserhd (Feb 2, 2008)

*Re: (Xyphyr)*

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/ - next best bet.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Blitzkrieg'nBunny)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Blitzkrieg’nBunny* »_ummm yes please, id like a supercharger..

Really?Whats your paypal...I will send a request for payment.
What I find funny is that everyone in this forum is like "yes please,bring it...I want" yet when the time comes to fork over the cash everyone all of a sudden goes quiet.With the way everyone was posting a year ago pertaining to the much anticipated C2 kit,you would have thought half the forum by now would be forced induced yet I only know of 7-8 members running a turbocharger








Back to the OP : There is no room in the engine bay for a decent sized supercharger.The Rabbit was meant to be turbocharged...ask Audi ,they bolted one to the TTRS.


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

that's cool and all, but look at the size of the massive intake manifold. Many Traditional superchargers replace the intake manifold, remember, superchargers arent just turbo-look a likes with a pulley.


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## kiserhd (Feb 2, 2008)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*

If you go with a roots style w/ an integrated intake manifold I'm sure it will fit fine. With some tweaking you might be able to modify one of the Eatons that GM uses. 
If you decide to run a Centrifugal S/C I think you may run into some clearance/fitment problems. Besides the powerband a centrifugal produces you might as well go turbo.


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## Lloyd Plumtree (Aug 13, 2008)

*FV-QR*

you could just send me your money and ill burn it for you. Chargers are worthless.


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Lloyd Plumtree)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lloyd Plumtree* »_you could just send me your money and ill burn it for you. Chargers are worthless. 

Most intelligent post i've ever read. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## skyrolla89 (Nov 16, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (turbomonkeyexpress)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbomonkeyexpress* »_
Most intelligent post i've ever read. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif









lol, i was gonna say my friend has one with a 07 mustang and the car is rele fast.. it's stupid fast.


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

I had a 97 GTI, chipped, cammed, and supercharged. Let's just say it wasnt slow either. 
but what the hell.. Forced induction.. It's worthless right? NAWZ is where it's at y0.


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbomonkeyexpress* »_I had a 97 GTI, chipped, cammed, and supercharged. Let's just say it wasnt slow either. 
but what the hell.. Forced induction.. It's worthless right? NAWZ is where it's at y0. 

YEAH DUDE NAWZ IS THE BEST!! Lets just douse the engine in gasoline and set it on fire to save time. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## undercoverdubber (Aug 24, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (skyrolla89)*


_Quote, originally posted by *skyrolla89* »_
lol, i was gonna say my friend has one with a 07 mustang and the car is rele fast.. it's stupid fast.

yeah but thats a big dumb american muscle car, not a finely tuned german auto...
oh wait, mbz clk, one of the fastest supercars made that can be driven daily has a "worthless" blower on it.


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## david8814 (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (undercoverdubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *undercoverdubber* »_
oh wait, mbz clk, one of the fastest supercars made that can be driven daily has a "worthless" blower on it.









You need to be specific... A CLK is nothing special. A CLK63 AMG on the other hand... However it is naturally aspirated.
I hope you're not confusing a CLK with the Mercedes SLR McLaren (5.4L supercharged)... Which is the only "supercar" Mercedes has ever made.


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (david8814)*


_Quote, originally posted by *david8814* »_
You need to be specific... A CLK is nothing special. A CLK63 AMG on the other hand... However it is naturally aspirated.
I hope you're not confusing a CLK with the Mercedes SLR McLaren (5.4L supercharged)... Which is the only "supercar" Mercedes has ever made.









Possibly the CLK-DTM? It's another supercharged monster. Anyway he was right that Benz makes use of supers on some of their meanest cars.


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## 2ohgti (Nov 8, 2004)

*Re: (kiserhd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kiserhd* »_If you go with a roots style w/ an integrated intake manifold I'm sure it will fit fine. With some tweaking you might be able to modify one of the Eatons that GM uses. 
If you decide to run a Centrifugal S/C I think you may run into some clearance/fitment problems. Besides the powerband a centrifugal produces you might as well go turbo.

I have to agree with this. A roots style may be better with intergrated into the intake manifold. The intake manifold may have to be flopped around, because the pulleys are on the other side of the engine. Also, the MAF wires will have to be relocated as well.


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

Flip flopping the intake manifold in theory shouldnt be too difficult, Maf / Throttlebody wires could be disconnected, and have extension Plug-n-plays. Anyone want to argue that it would skew the sensor data via resistance from lengthened wire?


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## undercoverdubber (Aug 24, 2008)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbomonkeyexpress* »_ Anyone want to argue that it would skew the sensor data via resistance from lengthened wire? 

its possible I guess, but the lengths youd be talking about would make impedance reflections negligible. Typically this become a problem when adding nodes or adding significant length and in the latter this can be calculated for.
Thats just a guess though, Ive never worked on can bus.


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## piston (Oct 17, 2008)

*Re: (kiserhd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kiserhd* »_If you go with a roots style w/ an integrated intake manifold I'm sure it will fit fine. With some tweaking you might be able to modify one of the Eatons that GM uses. 


An Eaton M62 probably would be just fine but an intake manifold with an after cooler maybe needed since roots blowers tend to generate a lot of heat. It would easily push 10-12 lbs of boost and more with a smaller pulley.
IIRC, the one used on the Cobalt SS/Saturn Redline is for their 2.0, which is a 4cyl(4 port intake). So, it wouldn't line up to our 5 port engine.
If would be cool to see someone like Jackson Racing make a roots style SC kit for the 2.5l though.
I also agree that people do tend to go quiet when one gets released due to price but $3000-5000 for a good SC kit is common.
If they included a chip with tuning, that would even be better but those usually run on the rich side to be safe.



_Modified by piston at 2:46 PM 10-17-2008_


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

*Re: (piston)*

Yeah but you expect to pay 3-5 grand on a turbo kit that "works well" anyhow... so those of us with the money and will to do so, already know the average costs. The rest of the kiddo's out there wet dreaming about a car wanting a turbo or super, and giving up once they see the price, can go ask mommy and daddy.


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## daemontrym (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*

The m62/M90/M112 are all the same design but for different sized motors. 
M62 is OEM on the supercharged mercedes 4cyl and 3800 Series 1 engines, supercharged cobalts. 
M90 comes on 3800 Series 2 and 3 v6 GM engines..
The M62 you can pick up very cheap and rebuild them for cheap as well. You can get the rebuild kits from zzpperformance.com. They specialize in anything GM and supercharged. You also can purchase intercoolers that sandwich inbetween the supercharger and the intake as well. They come in stages and different sized stacks, they also sell ported superchargers as well for not too much. They have tons of parts for these things. 
I know ALOT about these superchargers and where to get parts because I was about to put one of these engines into one of my fieros. Engine managemeant with them was easy because you could just splice bits and pieces of the stock harness's together and run it off of the 3800 Series 2 PCM. But, with Vw I don't know how that all works im still a newb in this game. 
As for using the supercharger the setup I think is cost effective if it were to be produced is a custom intake manifold. If you look at the stock one it has the 5 runners and angles down. I understand that the long runners and the pattern that it uses is used for much better torque and mid end versus high end whether you have an 07 and down or 08 plus. If we made a long runner aluminum intake that slopes down, has the supercharger that mounts straight to it, and runs off of the serpentine belt. This setup here would be ideal because the snout would be in a much better position. The only problem besides engineering a manifold is software to make use of it. 
To me if a tuner picked up on that package it would be much more cost effective then a turbo and would come at a much lower price then the turbo kits available. I have seen 11 and high 10 second fieros running off these superchargers on a 3800 V6. I have also seen these engines turbo and supercharged taking a grand prix to the 10s and zzp has an example on their website. It would be great if a tuner would put in their 2 cents. Hourly rates of getting something engineered, then machined, then bench tested, and all of that stuff cost a lot of money.


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## Corruptkid (Feb 19, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Really?Whats your paypal...I will send a request for payment.
What I find funny is that everyone in this forum is like "yes please,bring it...I want" yet when the time comes to fork over the cash everyone all of a sudden goes quiet.With the way everyone was posting a year ago pertaining to the much anticipated C2 kit,you would have thought half the forum by now would be forced induced yet I only know of 7-8 members running a turbocharger








Back to the OP : There is no room in the engine bay for a decent sized supercharger.The Rabbit was meant to be turbocharged...ask Audi ,they bolted one to the TTRS. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.verruckt.com/smile/halloween_pumpkin3.gif" BORDER="0"> 

I was turbocharged for all of two days before the thing went boom...then i stayed turbocharged and it went boom again


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## sharons03jetta (Jul 6, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (Lloyd Plumtree)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lloyd Plumtree* »_you could just send me your money and ill burn it for you. Chargers are worthless.


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## skyrolla89 (Nov 16, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (sharons03jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sharons03jetta* »_
































I love the size of that wing especially when its on a Honda...


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (skyrolla89)*


_Quote, originally posted by *skyrolla89* »_
I love the size of that wing especially when its on a Honda...









X2 but seriously, nobody is planning on making one.


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## daemontrym (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Xyphyr)*

Forced induction is a matter of preference rather then one being directly better than each other. To me its like going up to one of you and saying, " My Dad can beat up your Dad!" It also really depends on what you want out of the car and if you want to run retarded levels of boost or not. With a motor that already produces 170 Hp(I have an 08), I don't think it would take too much boost to make something really fun. I know ALOT about the Eaton stuff thats what I want to stick with. The only 2 things that keep me from doing it is finishing my Army enlistment 3 months ago and going to school full time. I believe if engine managemeant, knowing how much boost I am going to run, getting a custom intake manifold, how big of injectors, and how to route the belt I will be home free. Turbo innercoolers can be easily used for the setups and those can be had for not too much anyways. For fieros on 3800 supercharged swaps we would use stock SAAB side mount innercoolers and mount then underneath the Grate in the back. 
After an intake manifold is made and engine managemeant is hashed out that would be a potent package that would be able to run atleast 12-15 lbs of boost.


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (daemontrym)*

Found this in the BBM FAQ. Enjoy.








Are there any plans to develop a supercharge system for the MkV 2.5L (5) cyl. Rabbit / Jetta?
BBM is considering the development of a twin screw "Lysholm type" supercharger system for the 2.5l (5) cyl. engine platform. This decision will be made in the first quarter of 2009. It can take up to one full year or longer to engineer, develop and test a new forced induction system for production.


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## rangerbrown (Jul 12, 2007)

it woudl be cheaper to turbo but the time it comes out


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Xyphyr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Xyphyr* »_
BBM is considering the development of a twin screw "Lysholm type" supercharger system for the 2.5l (5) cyl. engine platform. This decision will be made in the first quarter of 2009. It can take up to one full year or longer to engineer, develop and test a new forced induction system for production.

BBM can consider from now until the cows come home....
All the companies that are producing FI kits for the 2.5 motor are "novices" to the platform/engine (and I mean that in the nicest way possible).
AGAIN for those who did not read , *THERE IS NO ROOM IN THE ENGINE BAY TO PLACE A DECENT SIZED SUPERCHARGER*.I was looking into this back @ the end of 2005/beginning 2006 and we are now approaching the end of 2008....
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2400994
In the MKV platform to get a decent sized supercharger in there would require a custom intake manifold.That would make the kit 800US+ more than what it is supposed to be.
The cost to develop the kit vs the number of pontential buyers will make it an unfeasable project.The sad reality is this, the 2.5 motor is in the BASE Jetta/Golf.People who buy these cars buy them for the price,not for the performance.It will take another 5 years for them to be handed down to users who would want to modify them.If you look at the # of forced induced 2.5 Motors in this forum,the number is less than 10.Hardly anything to build a company on!


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*

Unless you are BBM's accountant, I don't think you need to pop a blood vessel over this. They acknowledged the proposition on their website, so if the answer is NO to a supercharger then let them say it in due time. 
Bahn Brenner got started when you were about 12 years old so folks should take their word over yours.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (dumbassmozart)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_
Bahn Brenner got started when you were about 12 years old so folks should take their word over yours.


folks should take their word over mine?
I started modifying dubs when you were about 10 years old, joined vortex when you were 14 years old and sponsoured my own forum when you were 18 year olds....I guess if I showed my 700whp Rabbit motor then that would make me more credible?Not to toot my own horn but next time you want to bring up age research who you are talking to.
The reason I pop a blood vessel is due to the simple fact that no matter how many times I reply to threads like these someone always seem to over look the obvious.
I am not there accountant but I am an Engineer.I know what components cost and I know what product development takes.If BBM comes out with a solution it will be overly expensive.There 8V "bolt in" kit sold for more than 3000US.Unfortunately the stock intake manifold hugs the upper portion of the engine so well that there is practically no room to fit any charger for 200+hp.What about infront of the head light?Nope...been there done that.Again NO room.
The inline-5 engine will require a LARGER supercharger than what they sold in there 8V kits and a custom intake manifold as the only space in the engine bay for a possible supercharger is over the alternator.Even if they managed to integrate the supercharger into the intake manifold design and used laminova coolers (most possible solution) ,they would be looking @ $5000US+. If you have that kind of money to put down then go right ahead.If they have a solution that is less affordable than a turbo conversion then my hats goes off to them.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*

Very expensive to develop but deadly powerful 
we like to say lots o' fun tickets but well worth the ride!
With the adoption of this project I would budget for a casted custom intake manifold that will hold the compressor and the liquid / air intercooler. One of our guys has this engine in his wife's jetta and it does look very feasible and an extremely lethal combination


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_With the adoption of this project I would budget for a casted custom intake manifold that will hold the compressor and the liquid / air intercooler.


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Even if they managed to integrate the supercharger into the intake manifold design and used laminova coolers (most possible solution)

Good luck John.
I wish you all the best but we all know how casting parts can be especially for small quantities <= 100


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Good luck John.
I wish you all the best but we all know how casting parts can be especially for small quantities <= 100

i know a few good tool makers...lol
been building parts for the vw audi crowd for many years now and know what people love and demand. people want high quality, excellent service with mega performance... oh and delivery. so anyway i've always tried to not talk and or pretend to offer what we call vapor ware. you know when you sit around on your a$$ playing on the vortex talking about $h1t you never build. when and if i say green light it will happen... might not. right now things are shaky all over and bbm like many are holding it all down. all i can say is that this engine will be more than well worth the investment. peace












_Modified by JBETZ at 1:12 AM 10-23-2008_


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
folks should take their word over mine?
I started modifying dubs when you were about 10 years old, joined vortex when you were 14 years old and sponsoured my own forum when you were 18 year olds....I guess if I showed my 700whp Rabbit motor then that would make me more credible?Not to toot my own horn but next time you want to bring up age research who you are talking to.
The reason I pop a blood vessel is due to the simple fact that no matter how many times I reply to threads like these someone always seem to over look the obvious.


Nobody cares how old I was, I'm not telling anyone their ideas are right or wrong in this thread.
You are claiming to know more than anybody else, including tuning companies, which is fine. Go ahead and claim all you want. I dont care if you crap out a 700whp motor every time you go to the bathroom. 
You should not come in here and repeatedly put down ideas and shoot down inquiring minds. Nobody is bothering you to go make them a supercharger so why do you care if they ask? It's not your problem.
*YOU ARE NOT THE ONLY PERSON ON THIS FORUM SO WE SHOULD NOT ALL SHUT UP AND GO AWAY JUST BECAUSE YOU SAID SO.*


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: FV-QR (dumbassmozart)*

i demand a lock









this really comes into play










_Modified by JBETZ at 2:11 AM 10-23-2008_


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
this really comes into play

Stop posting hp figures from underpowered turbo 8V's John.
I know of some 8V Turbo's that will give you a run for your money.









_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_
You are claiming to know more than anybody else, including tuning companies, which is fine. 

I looked into this in depth 3 years ago (Please see the link I posted above)....it is simply not economically feasible. Again incase you missed the main point , no one in there right mind is going to buy a $16,000 Jetta/Golf (rabbit) and install a performance part that is worth 1/3 of the car.Look at the activity of this forum and compare it to the activity of the 2.0 FSI forum which was created at roughly the same time.The comparison is like night and day.In general 2.5 owners do not modify there engines and it is the same scenario with 2.0 ABA & AEG owners.You get the odd guy here and there modifying there engines but nothing compared to the 2.0 FSIT and 1.8T users.
You can have all the ideas in the world and we can have 7 pages of brain storming coupled with back to back idea clashing but unfortunately *none of them will ever see fruitation* , and _IF_ they do see frutation they will be so expensive that everyone will just shy away from it.
Thanks for understanding.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Wizard-of-OD)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
You can have all the ideas in the world and we can have 7 pages of brain storming coupled with back to back idea clashing but unfortunately *none of them will ever see fruitation* , and _IF_ they do see frutation they will be so expensive that everyone will just shy away from it.

Then let them shy away from it. I don't care if the kit doesn't ever happen, I really don't. I am not arguing engineering with you. Thank you for telling us that you don't think it's a cost effective project. Let Bahn Brenner tell the people what they find out with their own time and resources.


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

Wizard-of-Odd, is it really your duty to piss in everyone's cheerios or do you just get off "being there, and having done that".


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## undercoverdubber (Aug 24, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_Very expensive to develop but deadly powerful 
we like to say lots o' fun tickets but well worth the ride!
With the adoption of this project I would budget for a casted custom intake manifold that will hold the compressor and the liquid / air intercooler. One of our guys has this engine in his wife's jetta and it does look very feasible and an extremely lethal combination










Even if you dont get it to production, please just prototype to prove it can be done, saving face on the vortex will be its own reward








Seriously, Id really like a sc if cost/perf/reliability was there.


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## undercoverdubber (Aug 24, 2008)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
You can have all the ideas in the world and we can have 7 pages of brain storming coupled with back to back idea clashing but unfortunately none of them will ever see *fruitation* , and _IF_ they do see *frutation *they will be so expensive that everyone will just shy away from it.
Thanks for understanding.

Not to be a spell checking douche, but do you mean fruition?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (undercoverdubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *undercoverdubber* »_
Not to be a spell checking douche, but do you mean fruition?

Yes in the heat of the moment last night I forgot to turn on my spell check.

_Quote, originally posted by *undercoverdubber* »_please just prototype to prove it can be done.

But we allready know it can be done....
My objective is to not piss anyone off as that would be the last thing I want to do.If you are looking to force induce your 2.5 motor then turbocharge it.
You have enough displacement that the motor will not be *laggy* by any means and there are VERY affordable kits on the market.


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## undercoverdubber (Aug 24, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
But we allready know it can be done....
My objective is to not piss anyone off as that would be the last thing I want to do.If you are looking to force induce your 2.5 motor then turbocharge it.
You have enough displacement that the motor will not be *laggy* by any means and there are VERY affordable kits on the market.

I havnt heard of this motor being sc'd yet, any info/resources on it?
I hear ya about turbos interms of merits over sc, but a few things I dont like about turbos; increased heat (I know any forced induction creates heat), sharing engine oil w/the turbo.


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## reepercustom (Oct 23, 2008)

this is so back and forth i would also be intrested in the super charger never been a fan of the turbo i also under stand all the points that everyone has posted but a supercharger is more me sry to say so i like turbo's but i dont want to run one unless its twin charged which i dont have the money to do


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## Xyphyr (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (reepercustom)*


_Quote, originally posted by *reepercustom* »_this is so back and forth i would also be intrested in the super charger never been a fan of the turbo i also under stand all the points that everyone has posted but a supercharger is more me sry to say so i like turbo's but i dont want to run one unless its twin charged which i dont have the money to do

Okay... talked to [email protected] and he said that a turbo is the best bang for your buck. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## daemontrym (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: (Xyphyr)*

I'm telling you guys a look at the Eaton M62-M90 roots chargers are worth it. A lot of power can be had out of them, power is instant, parts for them are cheap, and the units themselves are cheap.
The only hurdle is getting an intake engineered to fit it everything and software made everything else is easy. I can tackle engineering an intake with alot of research and Autocad drawings. My father is a machinest with 30 years experience I can go as far as having him make a setup program to machine them. I just dont have the resources to build one. I just got out of the Army and am finishing an electrical engineering degree full time.


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## daemontrym (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: (daemontrym)*

As for the ideas with the intercooler casted into the manifold check this out.
http://www.zzperformance.com/g...d=139
Gets mounted between the supercharger and intake manifold. 
Turbo intercoolers can be used just might have to get some custom bends in. They sell intercoolers that can be used that aren't retardedly expensive like most of the VW stuff is.


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## turbomonkeyexpress (Nov 26, 2004)

*Re: (Xyphyr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Xyphyr* »_
Okay... talked to [email protected] and he said that a turbo is the best bang for your buck. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif

Look at the VR6... a vr6 turbo will probably be quicker, top end, than a supercharged VR6... But having driven a turbo, and having owned a Supercharged VR, the Supercharger was MUCH more fun and the power curve was amazing. I had turbo'd VR's beat until the higher mph when they'd finally catch up. 
I want a supercharger for this car.


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## dlob32 (Aug 17, 2006)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbomonkeyexpress* »_
I want a supercharger for this car. 

i 2nd that. i could care less about huge numbers i just want a fun car mainly. powers only fun when you can control it. i like the driveability/reliability of a charger too. plus the sound is way cooler


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## daemontrym (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: (dlob32)*

If I wasn't currently half way through college I would tackle this using an eaton supercarger. You can buy these things from the junk yard and rebuild them with parts from zzpperformance for $250 dollars or less. They have their own oil supply and are very reliable they just aren't as efficient as centrifugal or screw types. If we can build an intake manifold to emulate the LSJ engine, find a belt to fit the added pulley, and have software to run it the combo would be lethal.
A plate can be machined out of phenolic to mount the thottle body on the supercharger.


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## Dynamic Rollover (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: (turbomonkeyexpress)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbomonkeyexpress* »_Wizard-of-Odd, is it really your duty to piss in everyone's cheerios or do you just get off *talking and posting about*"being there, and having done that" *but refuses to post pics, data, or builds*.


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## Lloyd Plumtree (Aug 13, 2008)

*FV-QR*

lol. awesome. d.r.made my night


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## BlackRabbit2point5 (Sep 6, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
BBM can consider from now until the cows come home....
All the companies that are producing FI kits for the 2.5 motor are "novices" to the platform/engine (and I mean that in the nicest way possible).
AGAIN for those who did not read , *THERE IS NO ROOM IN THE ENGINE BAY TO PLACE A DECENT SIZED SUPERCHARGER*.I was looking into this back @ the end of 2005/beginning 2006 and we are now approaching the end of 2008....
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2400994
In the MKV platform to get a decent sized supercharger in there would require a custom intake manifold.That would make the kit 800US+ more than what it is supposed to be.
The cost to develop the kit vs the number of pontential buyers will make it an unfeasable project.The sad reality is this, the 2.5 motor is in the BASE Jetta/Golf.People who buy these cars buy them for the price,not for the performance.It will take another 5 years for them to be handed down to users who would want to modify them.If you look at the # of forced induced 2.5 Motors in this forum,the number is less than 10.Hardly anything to build a company on!

after VF said they couldn't get one to fit and didn't feel like wasting the R&D money and BBM told me they had no plans for supercharging the 2.5 (which I guess has changed now) I opted for the c2 turbo kit and I will explain why I now think that a turbo is a much better match for our engine. Not looking for fights just trying to plunk down some of my thoughts.
1. Car is FWD. In my opinion the low end on the 2.5 is just about perfect for FWD and more will just smoke your rubber and leave you with the same disappointed feeling up top. I even think GIAC 92 oct software has a tad too much oomph on the clutch drop
2. good luck squeezing it in there as mentioned before its not like this hasn't been tried before
3. The torque curve on a 2.5T is more flat and smooth than a pedophiles date (isn't that one of the reason people like superchargers more?
4. Later on if you want stupid amounts of boost you already have some of what you need
5. Sleeper mode, the turbo really shuts up your exhaust
In the MKV platform to get a decent sized supercharger in there would require a custom intake manifold.That would make the kit 800US+ more than what it is supposed to be.
The cost to develop the kit vs the number of pontential buyers will make it an unfeasable project.The sad reality is this, the 2.5 motor is in the BASE Jetta/Golf.People who buy these cars buy them for the price,not for the performance.It will take another 5 years for them to be handed down to users who would want to modify them.If you look at the # of forced induced 2.5 Motors in this forum,the number is less than 10.Hardly anything to build a company on!

_Modified by BlackRabbit2point5 at 6:53 AM 12-23-2008_

_Modified by BlackRabbit2point5 at 6:55 AM 12-23-2008_
tons of edits due to completely messing up the quote tagging


_Modified by BlackRabbit2point5 at 7:01 AM 12-23-2008_


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (BlackRabbit2point5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lloyd Plumtree* »_lol. awesome. d.r.made my night

I am sure he did...

_Quote, originally posted by *BlackRabbit2point5* »_If you look at the # of forced induced 2.5 Motors in this forum,the number is less than 10.Hardly anything to build a company on!

I still see some regulars posting in here that have been "talking" about Forced induction on a 2.5 motor SINCE 2005!
Finally someone that understands the business model of a company.Thank you.
Here is a kit we just did for the 1.8T 20V motor:


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## Dynamic Rollover (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_

Here is a kit we just did for the 1.8T 20V motor:


Who is "we" and where was it done? Can you post up a pic of your warehouse? I want to see the 700whp Rabbit motor "you" built. Can you post pics of your "running" 9 second 1.8T? 
I honestly would really like to see them. I think that it would make a lot of haters respect you.


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Issam, Who made the cart? I need one of those.


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## sharons03jetta (Jul 6, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (Audi4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi4u* »_Issam, Who made the cart? I need one of those.


X2 that pretty sweet.....


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Dynamic Rollover)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Dynamic Rollover* »_I think that it would make a lot of haters respect you. 

I am not seeking respect from anyone.I let results speak for themselves....forum elders such as Audi4U and [email protected] know who "we" are
















_Quote, originally posted by *Audi4u* »_Issam, Who made the cart? I need one of those.

We make them here in house Andre.Send me a PM.


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
I let results speak for themselves....

Then let other people's results speak for themselves, jackass.


_Modified by dumbassmozart at 11:56 PM 12-23-2008_


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (dumbassmozart)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_Then let other people's results speak for themselves,jackass

Love the comments http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Let me know when you start developing parts for this community so I can return the favour








Incase you have been reading the thread,the only forced induction kits available for the 2.5 is either custom or C2 motorsports.This thread has once again proven to me what a complete waste of time it is to argue with "forum engineers". Posts and threads like this only drive companies away.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## AlBeezy36 (Jun 25, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*

Why don't you guys start working with eachother instead of against.
Everyone is getting their panties in a bunch and really the bottom line is we all want our 2.5s to be faster. Stop having a knowledge peeing contest and start brainstorming. IDK, I just get sick of all this bickering crap!
...it's the friggin holidays for crying out loud!


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Incase you have been reading the thread,the only forced induction kits available for the 2.5 is either custom or C2 motorsports.This thread has once again proven to me what a complete waste of time it is to argue with "forum engineers". Posts and threads like this only drive companies away.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

No you read the thread. You spent the entire time telling people how other companies will fail the same way you did, but then you have the nerve say you let results do the talking. 
If every engineer in history was like you we'd still be riding horses everywhere. You are an uncreative sore loser.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_
No you read the thread. You spent the entire time telling people how other companies will fail the same way you did, but then you have the nerve say you let results do the talking.









jesus please take a course in reading comprehension...
Please do not put words in my mouth.This is what I said.

_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_There is no room in the engine bay for a *DECENT* sized supercharger.


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
In the MKV platform to get a decent sized supercharger in there would require a custom intake manifold.That would make the kit 800US+ more than what it is supposed to be.*The cost to develop the kit vs the number of pontential buyers will make it an unfeasable project*.

Read the bold parts.*When you are done then RE-READ them again*.
Who said I failed and where did I say that other companies will fail? I will never wish failure on any company out there.I simply stated *REALITY*...the non sugar coated version.
I can fit a pea size supercharger in the engine bay that will make about 200hp.That is about 50 hp over stock and it will cost you approx $3500 US.Then there is the possibility of building the supercharger/intake manifold system all in one but you would be looking @ 6500US for a 130hp increase over stock.
Would you spend $3500US for 50hp or $6500US for 130hp when you can buy the C2 kit? The answer is NO...
The best reply in this entire thread that sums up tuners thoughts on the 2.5 forum is this:

_Quote, originally posted by *BlackRabbit2point5* »_If you look at the # of forced induced 2.5 Motors in this forum,the number is less than 10.*Hardly anything to build a company on*!

This forum is about Volkswagen's and more specific the 2.5 motor.If you want to continue this debate then feel free to add some technical content AS I HAVE rather than fueling your ego. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## daemontrym (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Wizard-of-OD)*

Yooo 
Some of yall need to rub one and chill alittle...
When I decide to build this right here is my inspiration. 
http://media.gm.com/us/powertr...R.jpg


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *daemontrym* »_
When I decide to build this right here is my inspiration. 


What we all need is more posts like that ^^^
I apologize to all the other readers for help making this thread a battleground. Almost every first-time attempt at an engineering solution is completely impractical and unaffordable, but if you keep attacking it somebody might figure it out. 
What speaks the loudest to me is that the guy on here who has made more horses than anyone else (you all know him) is NEVER seen shooting down ideas.


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Please do not put words in my mouth.This is what I said.


You said you could not make one that is economically feasible, which is fine. That means you get to step aside now while someone else tries, unless you wanna get back to the drawing board smart guy. 


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
If you want to continue this debate then feel free to add some technical content AS I HAVE rather than fueling your ego. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

You haven't put anything up except a picture of an engine with a watermark on it, which takes slightly more effort than inserting your thumb into your rectum.


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## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (dumbassmozart)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_Almost every first-time attempt at an engineering solution is completely impractical and unaffordable, but if you keep attacking it somebody might figure it out.

If you have any input on attacking the problem then I am sure I speak for the masses when I say I am all ears.

_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_
You haven't put anything up except a picture of an engine with a watermark on it, which takes slightly more effort than inserting your thumb into your rectum.

Is that what you see?
That engine is a Rotrex supercharger kit installed on a VW 1.8T motor.I would say that the "slight" effort you referred to is 200+ hours of design ,engineering ,research and development.


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## nater (Apr 10, 2000)

*Re: Supercharger for 2.5 (Xyphyr)*

I think it's time to pull the plug on this thread. http://****************.com/default/zero2/lock5.gif


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