# CAI Throwing a P0102



## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

I had an AEM cold air intake installed a few weeks ago and it's since thrown off a CEL with error code P0102  (Mass or Volume Air Flow Circuit Low Input). Is this something to be concerned about?
By way of background, this is AEM's work-in-process CAI for the 2.5L. In the first fitting, they had problems fitting in the MAF. After a couple weeks, they were able to get the CAI installed with the MAF quite snug against the battery. However, they are in the process of putting together a MAF extension kit. Photo of the CAI here.
AEM is aware of the CEL and had sent a guy to read off the code and turn the CEL off. They are aware that the CEL is back on. I'm hoping to hear back from them again soon.
After some research, I'm concerned that the MAF is misreading the air flow and perhaps running my engine too lean (i.e., not detecting the extra air flow and compensating with fuel) possibly leading to long-term damage. The link to OBD above suggests it could be something as simple as a dirty MAF or oil from the filter getting to the sensor.
Or maybe this is no big deal at all? No expert here on engines so any feedback greatly appreciated.


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: CAI Throwing a P0102 (the.ronin)*

hmm, Dont get me wrong, AEM is a top company in intakes but that intake I can notice something, the maf sensor is WAY to low leaving the sensor wire to be stretched and tight and leaving it no slack like it should be, the engine moves and when it moves that intake moves and just pulls the MAF sensor wire along with it.










_Modified by omni1 at 11:04 AM 9-20-2006_


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: CAI Throwing a P0102 (omni1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *omni1* »_hmm, Dont get me wrong, AEM is a top company in intakes but that intake I can notice something, the maf sensor is WAY to low leaving the sensor wire to be stretched and tight and leaving it no slack like it should be, the engine moves and when it moves that intake moves and just pulls the MAF sensor wire along with it.










Thanks for the response Omni ... perhaps that's contributing to the P0102? When they initially installed the CAI, the CEL did not go off until the driver hit the freeway. When they came by to check on the code and turned off the CEL, it did not turn back on until I had done a good amount of driving.


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: CAI Throwing a P0102 (the.ronin)*

Not really sure, I know when I had the WR intake in my car, my car was fine for a couple of months then I started having about 5 codes thrown at me, ranging from running to lean or too rich, to MAF sensors, Something with my injectors, it was bad, then I took the intake out and everything went back to normal, I guess it may depend on the actual design. I know the WR their design had like a intake inside an intake which I guess stopped alot of the flow and in their design is supposed to make air flow better but obviously not. 
# The MAF may be disconnected, or a wiring connection may be bad
In your situation Im not really sure but if you look at your intake in the picture it seems like there is no slack at all for the MAF sensor, Another thing could be that the sensor may be too high in the pipe to read the air, the sensor should be close to or directly in the middle of the piping to read all the air flow, which is sort of common sense hehe, but im not sure if thats it, 

# The MAF may be dirty or otherwise contaminated (if you use an oiled air filter such as a K&N air filter, some of the oil may have made it's way onto the MAF sensor).
another thing could be is, there a debris panel on the orginal MAF sensor to stop dust or debris from hitting the sensor directly, if the pipe is just an open pipe it can possible be picking up dust or particles in the sensor comming from the filter. You might want to check and make sure the filter is secured and wire tight on the intake. My filter fell off one day and didnt notice it for awhile until I took the intake out and I noticed the filter was inside rolling around the whole time. So thankfully my sensor did not get damaged but you might want to check that. Also make sure those two tubings that lead to your engine right before the throttle, make sure they are tight and not leaking any air. Make sure those two tubings are in the right place because if you look at the tips of both of them one of them is slightly smaller then the other when you plug them into the intake so you might want to check that as well.



_Modified by omni1 at 11:59 AM 9-20-2006_


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

Thanks omni http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*

no probz


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: (omni1)*

hey ronin, I was speaking to a rep from ABD today regarding some of the CEL issues they were experiencing with some of their customers and he told me it was due to the hoses that lead to your engine. MAKE SURE THEY ARE SNUG TIGHT, AND PUSHED IN ALLL THE WAY UNTIL THEY SNAP COMPLETELY. That goes for the both of them. Because that little leak right after the sensor can be what is throwing the codes as well so check that








Oh and since you have the prototype see if you can get them to move the MAF Block up alittle more so there wont be tension on the MAF Wiring if possible, and make sure that those measurements are PERFECT for the tubes, if the tubes feel loose or you can move the tubes from side to side tell AEM. But first get them if you can to move that MAF Block Up more.


_Modified by omni1 at 12:26 AM 9-22-2006_


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: (omni1)*

DUDE, I JUST LOOKED AT THE PICTURE AGAIN BECAUSE ITS BUGGING ME, I JUST NOTICED YOUR MAF SENSOR IS THE WRONG WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!









This was my intake:

















_Modified by omni1 at 1:03 PM 9-22-2006_


_Modified by omni1 at 1:04 PM 9-22-2006_


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

Godamn omni, I didn't notice the responses to this thread cos I thought it was still the "no probz" response ... I am contacting AEM right away.
On a side note they did mention that they were working on a fix already (whatever that means) and have specifically indicated a MAF extension kit on the way.
Thanks again omni.
[edit] I just find it difficult to fathom that AEM could actually put a MAF on backwards ...


_Modified by the.ronin at 1:01 PM 9-26-2006_


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*

I Had no clue bro until I noticed it at the last minute hehe








that MAF block needs!!!!!!!! to be welded on more closer to the throttle haha, that MAF wire would just not reach haha


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## rishsn (Aug 26, 2006)

*Re: (omni1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *omni1* »_I Had no clue bro until I noticed it at the last minute hehe








that MAF block needs!!!!!!!! to be welded on more closer to the throttle haha, that MAF wire would just not reach haha

An 8 inch minimum clearance between the throttle and the MAF sensor is required otherwise you are gonna get cel and decreased performance. Also maf is too tight definate extension required.


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: (rishsn)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rishsn* »_An 8 inch minimum clearance between the throttle and the MAF sensor is required otherwise you are gonna get cel and decreased performance. Also maf is too tight definate extension required.

Thanks Rishsn. I'm hoping to hear back from AEM soon on the MAF extension kit ...


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

Looks like AEM will be bringing my car in tomorrow ... no details as to what they've got planned but hopefully they got the MAF extension kit squared away and can clean up the CEL.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*

nice ronin, I hope the info i gave ya really woke them up







, as well along with yours


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: (omni1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *omni1* »_nice ronin, I hope the info i gave ya really woke them up







, as well along with yours









I forwarded your comments to them and even sent your drawings ... I didn't get a reply. Hopefully I didn't piss them off.


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## Silver__DUB (Oct 3, 2006)

I find it weird that AEM cant figure out the solution, I mean, I' ve made my CAI my self and it's not throwing any CEL!


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

Turns out I misunderstood and they want the car _for an entire week_ ... even though they'll be reimbursing me for rental expenses it's still a pain so I've rescheduled for the second week of November.
Yes, I find it wierd too ... AEM wasn't born yesterday. We'll just have to see.


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*

Hey guys, I just got a vag com and ran the autoscan ... looks like I'm throwing a P0102 and a P0101.
Can someone shed some light on this in particular what "Fault Status" and "Fault Priority" mean? 

_Quote »_
Address 01: Engine
Part No SW: 07K 906 032 AN HW: Hardware No
Component: 2.5l R5/4V G 6738
Coding: 0000003
Shop #: WSC 00066
2 Faults Found:
000258 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Signal too Low
P0102 - 002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent - MIL ON
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 10100010
Fault Priority: 0
Fault Frequency: 254
Mileage: 18874 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 08:07:52
Freeze Frame:
RPM: 1791 /min
Load: 57.6 %
Speed: 23.0 km/h
Temperature: 53.0°C
Temperature: 21.0°C
Absolute Pres.: 1000.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.351 V
000257 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Implausible Signal
P0101 - 004 - No Signal/Communication - MIL ON
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 11100100
Fault Priority: 0
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 18874 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 08:08:42
Freeze Frame:
RPM: 1407 /min
Load: 43.1 %
Speed: 8.0 km/h
Temperature: 33.0°C
Temperature: 23.0°C
Absolute Pres.: 1000.0 mbar
Voltage: 14.351 V
Readiness: 0000 1000


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## omni1 (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the.ronin* »_Hey guys, I just got a vag com and ran the autoscan ... looks like I'm throwing a P0102 and a P0101.
Can someone shed some light on this in particular what "Fault Status" and "Fault Priority" mean? 



hmmm lol, i think my theories were somewhat along the lines of the codes


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: (omni1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *omni1* »_
hmmm lol, i think my theories were somewhat along the lines of the codes









Yup those descriptions really point to the harness being too tight. Also confirmed it with a VW guy. I had to postpone bringing the car in for a few weeks because I there's some mods I'd like to do in the meantime. Stupid I know but they are really cool mods.


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

I'm putting the project on hold and letting AEM have the car for the week ... they do not believe that a MAF extension will solve the CEL and need to do extensive testing.
Should have it back by Friday and will let you guys know.


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## Silver__DUB (Oct 3, 2006)

wire harness stretched and isnt workiong properly.. and your maf is sitting to high in the tubing simply because they make their own mounting unit. thats my guess.


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

Well, after being without the car since Tuesday, which, even though they were willing to pay for rental, really sucked, I got it back today ... stock.








They are pretty mum about details or maybe the folks I talk to are far removed from the actual R&D that goes on.
Oh well ...


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*

I heard back from AEM over the weekend ... they are going to redesign the kit and go with a different solution. Expect about 4-6 weeks until it's completed. Good news is these guys clearly want to put in the effort to make a flawless product.
Will let you know when I hear more.


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## jaysunptell (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: CAI Throwing a P0102 (the.ronin)*

I have been reading this post as its updated. Is this the same item as you are talking about?? 
ABD Racing LAN Pipe Intake System for Golf/Jetta 2.5L MKV (05-up) 

Quantity in Basket: none
Code: 70.LAN.5K
Price: $299.95
Shipping Weight: 15.00 pounds




Quantity: 

We are the first to develop a full intake system for the 2.5L powered Golf & Jetta. All intake parts are manufactured from 3” stainless steel that is ceramic coated for heat resistance and added beauty. Dyno proven gains performed at an independent facility prove gains from 5-7 HP at the wheels on our test vehicle 2005 Jetta MK5 2.5L. This 2- piece kit includes the fresh air intake tube and an ABD Racing big bore intake tube to relocate the MAF sensor. 
Not legal for use on pollution controlled vehicles operated on public streets/Race use only !


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: CAI Throwing a P0102 (jaysunptell)*

That's Autobahn Designs or "ABD" ... I'm referring to Advanced Engine Management or "AEM". http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by the.ronin at 5:22 PM 11-13-2006_


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: CAI Throwing a P0102 (the.ronin)*

has the issue been resolved?


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

Should hear back from them mid-January.


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## huevosrancheros (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the.ronin* »_Should hear back from them mid-January.

Damn, Can't wait!!!


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

I did get an email from them a couple weeks ago just letting me know they are continuing to work on it ... I wouldn't expect to hear anything until mid-January or even the end of January.
As soon as I do though, I will be sure to pass along the info. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## huevosrancheros (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: (the.ronin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the.ronin* »_I did get an email from them a couple weeks ago just letting me know they are continuing to work on it ... I wouldn't expect to hear anything until mid-January or even the end of January.
As soon as I do though, I will be sure to pass along the info. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif

cool beans








Thanks for all your info, you rock
happy holidays


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