# Megasquirt running COP ignition?



## TURBOPHIL (Jan 31, 2002)

Has anyone here used the MS unit to control a coil on plug setup similar to the 1.8t but on a 16v engine?
Please post some pics and diagram if you got any.
thanks guys


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## rjc69 (Oct 10, 2006)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (TURBOPHIL)*

Checkout msefi.com Its the megasquirts forums. i remember reading something about that in the ign setup/tuning section.


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## TURBOPHIL (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (rjc69)*

I checked it out awhle back but the info was somewhat sketchy back then, maybe its upgraded now. I was hooping to find someone here that has done this setup and could get some suggestions.


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (TURBOPHIL)*

I had planned on doing it for my new engine, but and not at that point yet, When I was researching, I recall there was a guy here here running then Bens_cab or something like that. I think he was running the 20v cops in Wasted spark though. A later picture of his car showed though that he switched to a coil pack.
As far as I know the only success that I have seen has been using the *4* Wire 20v COPs in Wasted spark. This requires some changes to the board and such.
Shawn


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## toplessvw (Jul 31, 2003)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (TURBOPHIL)*

good luck on that, I would not waste time trying to get it to work on a 16 valve cop need two reference points cam and crank and a 16 valve you would have to rig up both, just run your board with two vb921's running a wasted spark coil and plug wires, and get a aftermarket trigger wheel and sensor


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (toplessvw)*

Easiest way on a 16v is to go missing tooth cam trigger. One wheel/sensor to deal with. There's details in the msextra.com forums/manual.


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## tha-dood (Aug 13, 2003)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (need_a_VR6)*

i got my 1.8t to run on the 4 wire non-bolt down AWP COP's running in waisted spark. but after like 5 hours of running the car something stopped working on the board and it isnt the processor, and i duno what it is. now only cylinders 1+4 have spark for the first 10 seconds of starting the car, so you can never really start it. having dealt with it first hand, id have to say its not worth the trouble, not on megasquirt http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
btw... the AWP coils have a built in ignition drivers, so i didnt use VB921's. from what i understand the three wire COPs do not have ignition drivers, so if you wanted to do something, you would end up using 2-4 VB921s....

to run true individual COP spark, you need both a cam and a crank sensor. the cam wheel on the AEB 1.8ts would work, but not the later wheels. i could be wrong but i dont believe it would be bolt on either.


_Modified by tha-dood at 5:38 PM 6-7-2007_


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## TURBOPHIL (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (tha-dood)*

Thansk for the reply guys, I did some research on the coil on plug setup from reading the msextra manual
http://www.msextra.com/manuals...p.GIF
According to the website when using the vb921 you have to run the 660 ohms resistors instead of the 330 which comes with the system. Don't know if this will solve the problem of your car cutting off after 5 hrs of running but if you don't have these resistors you might want to get them. Anyway we need to continue pushing the evelope with these systems in order to perfect them, I know it can be fustrating but when we collectively attack this problem , it will get solved. I know I am sounding like a motivational speaker, but I know we have some smart Dubbers on this forum. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif








BTW I have an ABA block with the 60-2 crank sensor, Xkromx has a trigger that he made which is cam mounted, I can also use the ABF dissy as cam sensor or I can use the 1.8t cam sensor and modify it to fit the 16v cam.


_Modified by TURBOPHIL at 2:58 AM 6-8-2007_


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (TURBOPHIL)*

From the research that I have done, it is not really the MS technology that is a problem, it is the COPs available. I am building a 20v, so physical fitment is not a problem (obviously). I have a set of the 3 wires Cops, so technically, using 4 VBs with the correct resistors should be possible. The Key word here is should. Others tried many times and have failed form some reason. I am not one to easily take defeat (mine or someone else's), but I also don't like sticking a pointy stick in my eye for the sake of doing so







I look at it this way, VW COPs and ignitors are like a tuned circuit. And even so, they have probs and COPS go out. Change something from the expected parameters and you are asking for trouble.
One problem is not knowing the detailed specs on the coils (Dwell, charge time etc). This can lead to toasted Vbs and such. I cooked a Vb when I first set my system up on my 8v single coil and never came to a consensus as to why, other than the dwell settings which were not that far off from where they are now.
The 4 wire COPs (From what I recall) take an inverted trigger signal from the norm. Sort of like how VW's Hall sensors that go low while a lot of Hall's go high. This requires changing the board transistors to the correct ones and then adding the additional VB circuits. Also, when you run more than 2 VBs, there are issues documented where you need to run extra grounds from the board as the grnd pin(s) for the ign VBs is not sufficient and can burn up the tracer.
I am just babbling, but you see where I am going with this. I don't know which direction I will end up taking, but I will likely go wasted Spark could pack. It is tried and true and NO ONE like breaking down








S


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## TURBOPHIL (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt running COP ignition? (sdezego)*

After reading all your probs, I might just go with the wasted spark cooil pack, don't like breaking down also.







I know the MK4 had some problem with the 3 wire cop setup, from what I have read the 4 wire hitachi plugs are the best. 
Its good to get some good inputs from reliable source, thanks again for the inputs http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## bens_cab (Oct 30, 2005)

Hi guys i used the cops but i was getting some weird advance issues which was down to the ecu 
the 3 wire cops are a no no i switched to wasted spark using a peugeot coilpack this sorted the problem out the car runs sweet and has covered over 10k miles now
Ben


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## TURBOPHIL (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: (bens_cab)*

Thanks Ben, I appreciate the input. I will be using coil packs after reading all these posts.


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