# Move selector lever to position P/N



## BassamLogic (Apr 27, 2014)

Hello *VW Vortex *

I am Having a problem on my 2005 Phaeton which has a 3.2 engine 
Last time I drove it was yesterday and had no problems. This morning, I'd turn the key and it give me various error message."Move selector lever to position P/N"

I tried to move it but with no luck , the message is still there and I also noticed that the light on the shift that indicates that I need to press on the break to start is not glowing 

please note that this is not the 1st time I had this error but before I had to leave it for a while and it will start 

I really love my Phaeton and it has only 75,774 kilometres on , so it is quite new 

you can see the error message and the light indication below in the pictures

Bassam


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Have a look at these two discussions, which are listed in the Phaeton Forum 'Table of Contents' (FAQ by Category), I think they will provide you with appropriate background information to enable you to determine the exact cause of your problem.

....Transmission (any version) - cannot shift out of Park
....Transmission (any version) - PRNDS lights up in display

Michael


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## BassamLogic (Apr 27, 2014)

PanEuropean said:


> Have a look at these two discussions, which are listed in the Phaeton Forum 'Table of Contents' (FAQ by Category), I think they will provide you with appropriate background information to enable you to determine the exact cause of your problem.
> 
> ....Transmission (any version) - cannot shift out of Park
> ....Transmission (any version) - PRNDS lights up in display
> ...


Hi Michael, 

many thanks for the fast response 

I was reading through the form even before I got the Phaeton , and I did read the 2 threads you mentioned above , they don’t have the same as my problem as I can move the leaver up and down , its only that the car won’t start 

is it possible that I need to change the right side battery ? 

one other thing : I have noticed for the past few days that my engine fan blowing high , even before I start the car , also the battery level is now below 12V ,
so how can I tell if it is a battery issue 
thanks once more for this great form and they should make you a big Statue at the Transparent Factory in Dresden , for all the Help you provide to the Phaeton owners


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

The position sensor is broken in the shifting mechanism. Try this thread, it has pictures: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...Unwanted-quot-Move-Selector-to-P-quot-message


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hello Bassam:

For the purpose of determining that the transmission is in Park or Neutral (the only two positions that it is 'safe' to start the engine at), the transmission controller looks at the little sliding plastic plate on top of the shift lever assembly, it doesn't actually look at the physical position of the lever.

If all is in order, the position of the little sliding plastic plate should match the position of the lever. But if the plate is broken, troubles arise.

The second of the two discussions I cited in my reply (post #2) to you provides more details about problems that can arise with that sliding plate. I kind of suspect yours is broken, or perhaps someone spilled a sticky drink (Coke, coffee with sugar, etc.) into the transmission lever assembly and that is what is causing the problem.

If you are keen to investigate it further yourself, you can take things apart to get access to that plate. It is kind of a complex job, and it requires patience to do it. The instructions for getting at that plate are provided in the post Retrofitting Keyless Start to Phaetons that are equipped with Keyless Entry. Obviously, you only want to take apart the middle section of the car, not the other areas that need disassembly to fit a start button.

So far as your battery is concerned (meaning, the battery as a possible source of the problem), I kind of doubt that is the case. A weak battery can cause a lot of problems, but I have not ever heard of it causing a problem with detection of shift lever position. You can rule out the battery as a possible cause (without going out and buying a new battery) by purchasing a battery maintainer and hooking it up to the left battery overnight. Instructions for that can be found here: Purchasing and using a Battery Maintainer for your Phaeton .

Nevertheless, look at your battery and you will find some numbers stamped on the top of one of the battery posts. The numbers show the week and year of manufacture. A battery lasts between 5 and 7 years. If your battery is older than 7 years, you should proactively replace it.

Michael

*PS:* _Please have a look at this post, then fill in the missing information on your profile_ - Please Read - Regarding your Forum Profile


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## Juhani (Sep 15, 2012)

*Move selector to P*

Phaeton 2004 V10, Keyless, a new puzzling problem. When you turn off engine, move selector to P message, but only if lights are on on automatic "tunnel position" you cant lock car and it chime and display message unless you switch lights to 0, when you do that you can hear solenoid release and lock gearlever. This happened few times first then it vent away now its persistant. I checked from tranmission controller and in adaptation it sees gear position like it should P,R,N,D,S same in instument display. Fault in engine conroller, and Kessy is klemme 15 inconsistent and communication. But everything works? dont understand, some relay, someway connected to automatic lights, makes no sense?


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## Juhani (Sep 15, 2012)

*Faults*

So if lights are on and you turn off engine these faults and text move selector to park. If lights are turned off first and then engine nothing.
Also suspension hard, controller is not supplying 1800mA to shocks, regardless what you do, looks that conroller is dead, but level is normal.

3 Faults Found:
18258 - Powertrain Data Bus 
P1850 - 000 - Missing Message from ECU - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00110000
Fault Priority: 0
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 40
Mileage: 0 km
Time Indication: 0

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 0 /min
RPM: 0 /min
RPM: 0 /min
(no units): 30.0
(no units): 25.0
Temperature: 71.0°C
T.B. Angle: 60.0°

28783 - No Communication with Battery Energy Control Module 
U0111 - 004 - - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00110100
Fault Priority: 0
Fault Frequency: 2
Reset counter: 40
Mileage: 0 km
Time Indication: 0

18270 - Powertrain Data Bus 
P1862 - 000 - Missing Message from Instrument Cluster - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00110000
Fault Priority: 0
Fault Frequency: 2
Reset counter: 40
Mileage: 0 km
Time Indication: 0


Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 3D0-937-049-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 937 049 G
Component: STG.Bordnetz 5001 
Coding: 0000003
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2E53B6A1BAD5D03A79-515E

2 Faults Found:
00576 - Terminal 15 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
01299 - Diagnostic Interface for Data Bus (J533) 
013 - Check DTC Memory - Intermittent

Address 34: Level Control Labels: 3D0-907-553-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 907 553 B
Component: LUFTFDR.-CDC- 3C1V0 1101 
Coding: 0015500
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 26434E819225987A81-5140

4 Faults Found:
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01317 - Control Module in Instrument Cluster (J285) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00456 - Control Module for Access and Start Control (J518) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01299 - Diagnostic Interface for Data Bus (J533) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

Address 71: Battery Charger Labels: 3D0-915-181.lbl
Part No: 3D0 915 181 B
Component: Batteriemanagement 2600 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 224B5291FE0D645AED-515E

2 Faults Found:
00576 - Terminal 15 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
00093 - Terminal 15 for Starting Relevant Consumers 
009 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent

Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 3D0-614-517.lbl
Part No: 3D0 614 517 R
Component: ESP 5.7 allrad H33 0043 
Coding: 0008646
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 3169ADDDABEBCFC264-5140

3 Faults Found:
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01317 - Control Module in Instrument Cluster (J285) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

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Address 05: Acc/Start Auth. Labels: 3D0-909-13x-05.lbl
Part No SW: 3D0 909 135 L HW: 5WK 470 22
Component: Kessy 6400 
Coding: 0213228
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2E53B6A1BAD5D03A79-5140

Subsystem 1 - Part No: XXXXXXXXXXX 
Component: ELV XXXX

1 Fault Found:
00576 - Terminal 15 
006 - Short to Plus - Intermittent


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

Status of left battery? Not the typical faults but close enough to check it up. Age? Charge status? Voltage?

Lennart


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## Juhani (Sep 15, 2012)

Yeah, left battery is many times reason for all oddities, but i checked that, it was maybe bit low and I connected extra battery beside of it, no change, but just in case installed new Exide EK950 AGM 95AH to replace same model been there 3years. No change, and also former battery checks to be in nearly new condition still with measured 90AH capacity from fully charged to 10,5v 9hours with 10Amp load.
I have replaced normal alternator regulator charging 13,3v typically in V10, with AC-Delco regulator from US 130Amp altenator, both are Delco, new one is temp. compensated and makes 14,3v +30 to 15v -15, this keeps battery full, not half empty like it used to be.
I think that fault is in controller 9 Boardnetz, as it does all swithcing and for some reason if lights are on it drops main beams off but not parking lights when you stop motor. Or then fault is in wiring.


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

Sounds plausible but before changing parts I would try something that my workshop finally did with my friends P. After changing the left battery it did not even try to start and after some troubleshooting the faulty behaviour was found to be quite deep in the communication between controllers. After towing to workshop they wanted to change the steering column for about €3000 but we disagreed with the conclusion. After thorough troubleshooting by the workshop the tech found that the CAN-signal did not look as it should, instead of a nice square signal it showed slopes and other weak behaviour. He disconnected all the important controllers to let them rest for some time and then connected them again. After that everything worked as it should again.
I am not shure what differs between disconnecting both batteries and disconnectin the controllers but I suspect some capacitors could help holding voltage for some time. It could be that he waited longer than we did before reconnecting things as well.
It was not totally clear wich controllers he disconnected but I would try disconnecting both batteries over night before reconnecting to see what that may give. Strange and unpredictable things can obviously happen if the controllers don’t start up as they should and on top of that seems to lock up in that state.

Lennart


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## Juhani (Sep 15, 2012)

*selektor in P*

Yes, I had both batteries disconnected about 3 hours, allthou I think start bat is not connected to anything else but starter, but car has possibility to start with that only if you first turn key to left relay will connect bats in paralel, V10 does that under 0 deg always when starting. No problems after connecting bats only normal "level control" and "steering angle" which go away by themselves. I think that 3 hours is sufficient atleast all faults disapear, but maybe not, have to try that. It shoud be same as disconnecting controllers. New controller boardnetz was only 19E in ebay i will try that but its pain to get to it under mat pass side. It seems that 15years and 290tkm is too much for electrical system, while ago I had to take locking swithes out from doorhandles as two of them shoved applied in vcds and kessy does not go to sleep when this happens.


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

Well, just some elbow grease then! We were there digging for measurements so I know what you mean. How stiff can a floor mat be??
Good point with faulty handle problem. Just too easy to leave it to another day but if it is intermittently shorted it will make the controller think it is operated and stay awake. If detected as a fault I think it excludes handling signals from that handle, at least that is what I have experienced. The cause of the problem is a bad contsruction of the sealing, moisture reaches the switch parts and it corrodes quite badly. I posted some images somewhere on this forum.
Well, good luck with the floor mat fight!

Lennart


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## Juhani (Sep 15, 2012)

Yeah, thanks, I once took fuses out from rear PTCs, you need to bolt drivers front seat loose and tilt it back, otherwise not possible lift mat, on drivers side you can also check Kessy that its dry if there is water or even moisture it will kill it. Front seat is 100kg or so, so you dont lift it out. Surprisingly handle switches were not that bad but still it sayed applied in vcds and then red leds dont flash on doors, now they do again. Now cant lock from handle but opening works fine


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## Juhani (Sep 15, 2012)

Changed controller 9 boardnetz and checked relays in right footwell. Did not do any change, still if light are on and you shut engine same faults and move selektor to P. If you put lights off first no problem. Also if its daylight and automatic lights dot turn on no problem. Also without power on if you turn lights on also gearselektor solenoid energises and you can move selektor and all meterlights are on, should not be like that. Kessy? Lightsensor? relay somewhere stuck on position? Diode somewhere?


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## Juhani (Sep 15, 2012)

I checked all relays in car if there wuold have been one in stuck "on" position none. Still when lights are on you turn off engine, move selektor to P message, and only when you turn lights off solenoid locks selektor, if you turn lights first it is like should be and no faults in controllers either. Also locked car no key near when you switch lights, parking lights come on but also centerdisplay and all dashboard lights come on and selektor solenoid energises and you can move selektor, but it wont start and ignition is not on. Same with key in car if lights are on parking position, ignition wont switch on and it wont start. switch lights off and it willl start normally. So as long as you switch lights after starting and switch of before shutting motor its normal. Go figure? 
How can you empty DTC memory from Kessy thats one fault this always does, and its full of DTC messages, could that be reason for this? Like aux heater too many fails and then it locks up and reset is from adaptation. But Kessy wont let you in adaptation without code anyone know that?


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