# pic requested* how low without a notch



## thatAstock18T (Nov 16, 2005)

very interested in bagging my 20th and wanted to see how low u can get before u have to notch ur frame, 17's preferred thx. btw i really did search


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## limet (Jan 8, 2009)

The passenger side sits on the axle

Those are 18s, but I think the r32 has a little more room then the other mk4s


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## rjones1214 (Apr 24, 2009)

That pic looks as low as I've seen without a frame notch. 

Getting your frame notch isn't that big of a deal, just find someone local who knows what they're doing. All you/they need is a hole saw, some pipe and a welder.


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## arethirdytwo (Apr 4, 2007)

Depends on wheels... The R does go lower but in order to lay subframe with 19's it takes a lot. I have a p side notch (which the axle goes into a ways) trimmed subframe and trimmed control arms. With no trimming they bind before you lay out. 18's or smaller are a breeze, small notch (if you even need it) and your on the ground. 19's are haaaaard.


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## arethirdytwo (Apr 4, 2007)

Just saw 17's... With a FWD chassis you would probably need a notch, with the R I could probably lift the tires off the ground without a notch. 17's and Mk4 :screwy:


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## [email protected] (Jul 5, 2011)

thatAstock18T said:


> very interested in bagging my 20th and wanted to see how low u can get before u have to notch ur frame, 17's preferred thx. btw i really did search


The biggest "problem" with not notching is that you only are notching the passenger side... So you have a choice of either having the car sit uneven (lower on the drivers side) OR you're going to have to leave some pressure in the driver side bag to have it appear to be an even drop.

Mindy, one of my clients up in the PNW, just finished her install and is on 17s.. she hasn't notched yet so I'll try to get her to snap some pics :thumbup:

Feel free to PM or email me with questions :thumbup:


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## President Lincoln (Jun 27, 2005)

Hows this:










Thats on 18.8.5 et +25 all the way down. Of coarse the drivers side looks better.


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## [email protected] (Jul 5, 2011)




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## thatAstock18T (Nov 16, 2005)

thanks everyone thats awesome i know the notch isn't a big deal but i just wanted to know also i have a gli lip which i believe is a little lower then an r32 bumper. what psi do u run for reg driving for a smooth and comfortable ride


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## [email protected] (Jul 5, 2011)

thatAstock18T said:


> thanks everyone thats awesome i know the notch isn't a big deal but i just wanted to know. what psi do u run for reg driving for a smooth and comfortable ride


I typically run ~ 37 psi on my Air Lift XLs... PM me and I'd be happy to answer all your questions and help get you set up with the right air kit for you :thumbup:


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## Burth (Oct 15, 2010)

Another socalstanceshop air kit on 17" for now, not frame notch yet!


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## wagner17 (Oct 20, 2009)

notch is really needed to go as low as you can its like 150 bucks top....


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## thatAstock18T (Nov 16, 2005)

someone in maryland come take me for a ride to sell me on air!


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## kilimats (Mar 5, 2006)

Driver side will go lower, passenger side is a finger gap higher


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## kilimats (Mar 5, 2006)

regarding the PSI, i don't really notice a huge difference between low and high stance on the Airlift XL, only when I blast the bags it becomes harsh/stiff but i never have to


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## ryanmiller (Apr 13, 2006)

no notch is about about a decent coilover height. if your not going to make the car low, why bag it?


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## Seppdelaney (Apr 11, 2011)

ryanmiller said:


> no notch is about about a decent coilover height. if your not going to make the car low, why bag it?


Because the beauty of air is that you can set the ride height more easily... it's easier to change, so if you need 4x4 status for the winter, you just add more air... as opposed to messing with the coils and having to go get an alignment whenever you raise or lower the car.
It's all about flexibility for me, at least.


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## Niagara_V_Dub (Sep 25, 2007)

The thing I wonder about with the notch is structural rigidity. I am now professional or mechanical engineering person with extensive knowledge in material stress testing... but... would a notch weaken that part and potentially cause it to buckle? Or is the pipe welded in enough to counter that? And I know that 1000's of people have done it, but in theory isn't it weaker?


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## Tofik (May 7, 2007)

Niagara_V_Dub said:


> The thing I wonder about with the notch is structural rigidity. I am now professional or mechanical engineering person with extensive knowledge in material stress testing... but... would a notch weaken that part and potentially cause it to buckle? Or is the pipe welded in enough to counter that? And I know that 1000's of people have done it, but in theory isn't it weaker?


yes, any modification , cutting and welding will always weaken the frame.. im sure the notch weakens the frame a bit..

I have a notch and didnt really care about it weakening the frame,..i know it did but its not like the frame will twist or buckle from the weight of the motor.. i looked at it this way.. if i get into a head on or rear end someone at 50+mph.. the cars totalled.. notch or no notch will not save the car from being totalled.


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## ryanmiller (Apr 13, 2006)

do you realize that the frame is designed with crumple zones? they are so weak they would buckle before the frame notched area would


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## wagner17 (Oct 20, 2009)

so notch it and get the lowest you can get


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## kilimats (Mar 5, 2006)

Seppdelaney said:


> Because the beauty of air is that you can set the ride height more easily... it's easier to change, so if you need 4x4 status for the winter, you just add more air... as opposed to messing with the coils and having to go get an alignment whenever you raise or lower the car.
> It's all about flexibility for me, at least.


agreed 100%, some people think air is about going the lowest, for some it's about the functionality more than the look


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## Seppdelaney (Apr 11, 2011)

Don't get me wrong. Parking on your subframe is fricken sweet. But you don't drive around at that height if you value your cars oil pan. With air, you get "the look", but with the added functionality of setting the height wherever you want. 
A notch won't kill your car, so if you want to lay frame, don't be afraid. 


Written with spaghettio's on my iPhone.


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## ryanmiller (Apr 13, 2006)

well even if your not all about getting super low, I would still recommend to notch it. even if you air it out so it stops on the axle, that is putting undue stress on the joints, basically your resting 1/4 your cars weight on the axle joints, when they are not designed to have any type of side load on them

plus, at any moderately low driving height it will hit your axle to the frame


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## Niagara_V_Dub (Sep 25, 2007)

True Ryan, plus when you air it out it won't sit level without the notch. It will look all janky and uneven. I think when one glorious day I do go on air, I will notch it and then weld side plates on it to reinforce the area that got cut. Even though the frame is designed to crumple in places, I just want around that notch to be strong. The potholes in Buffalo are frame swallowers, you can rip a oil pan off at stock height.


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## [email protected] (Dec 15, 2010)

If you have the XL's you really want a notch to keep the axle from contacting the frame on big road inputs. When those two items touch, the force is really high and can certainly damage your axle and maybe even the transmission.

Also, the kit really shouldn't be driven at max height for long. The ride isn;t good there with no rebound travel and you will hear the topping noise of the struts on almost every dip.

One more thing..whether you have air or coils, if you significantly change (like over .5") the height that you spend all your time driving at, you WILL need an alignment. Kinematics of the suspension don't change with the type of springs you have..:thumbup:


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