# Porsche vs wilwood vs G60......



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

I currently have some 11" corrado G60 brakes on my 91 Jetta coupe. I am trying to figure out which brake setup I should move up to (because I do want more). The corrado setup is good, but for my driving style and track days, some more would always be beneficial. My options are as follows:
option 1 - porsche boxster 12.3" setup. The known advantages are a 4 piston monoblock caliper and significantly increased swept area with the 12.3" rotors. The negatives IMO are the need for at least a 16" wheel (if I can find the right one) and the increased unsprung weight (I like to keep it as low as possible).....








option 2 - Wilwood 11" kit (4 piston caliper). I do not know as much about this setup, other than a few threads I have just read. I have heard great and not so great things about them. Some say they are not much better than option 3, below, aside from unsprung weight. What I do "know" is that they are great for weight savings, the creak they are known to have can be eliminated, I can run them with many 15" wheels (I like 15's best on my A2) so they'd be good for tire replacement (15's are cheaper) wheel options, etc. I am sopmewhat concerned that peoplw have said they have had caliper problems and have had to return them. If they aren't as common as it seams, I may lean this way, since I can keep my 15" BBS RS to run over them








Option 3 - Audi G60 dual piston caliper. The benefit of this setup is the inexpensive sourcing of parts, with little conversion work needed. With this as well i can stil run 15's, but they definately add weight to the whole system, whcih is not really something I want. Bang for the buck they may be good, but I am not sure that I will be content with them. The girling 60 calipers (audi dual) weigh 16lbs each, vs only 10 lbs for the corrado single piston calipers (weights are caliper carrier and pads).
















Other small things to consider - I do already have some porsche boxster 4 piston calipers AND the appropriate brackets to mount hem on my coupe. So for this setup I just need rotors (and to find wheels to clear the whole thing







) If I go with the wilwoods, I'll have to sell the porsche setup and buy them (which I don't really mind) and I can rock my BBS RS, too. With the G60's, I am not too keen on them, so i may just opt away form them anyway. Any insight or experience with any of these systems would be great. I want to decide soon, so I can get ready for some fun on the track this fall
Thanks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## G60RRADO (Nov 30, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

i'm on the low budget side. can't beat cheap big brakes. fyi i got a spare set!


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (G60RRADO)*

well, if I didn't already have the porsche kit (minus discs) it may be a different story, but I want the best (reasonable) brakes I can get. Thanks for the offer http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 90 GT-G60 (Jan 18, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (G60RRADO)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60RRADO* »_can't beat cheap big brakes. *fyi i got a spare set!*

How much?


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## G60RRADO (Nov 30, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (90 GT-G60)*

true blubayou... in that case a nice set of porsche brakes would be sick.
90 gt g60... you got IM. not trying to hijack this thread. i just posted them in the classifieds.


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## JamieK18T (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (G60RRADO)*

too bad there aren't any 2 piece rotors availible.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (JamieK18T)*

I thought ECS was going to make some. Could be misinformation though


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## BlkVentoTurbo (Oct 15, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

first of all i have willwoods they rule(although porsche set ups are cooler albiet more expensive) these are the reasons :
1 weight , almost 2.3 lbs per side 
2 pad changing is way easy i mean like take the wheel off done
3 you drive a vw , (porsches are cool... however be what you are... a vw)
4 they look more to the time line of an mk2


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (BlkVentoTurbo)*

you mean these are all reasons for wilwoods?
I agree on the weight (major concern for me, I like low unsprung) did you save 2.3lbs per side??? - if so, compared to what?)
pad changes on the porsche are just as easy, no swingin caliper like the VW's
agree on the be what you are, it is just a vw, I just want the best parts for it (I know porsche doesn't necessarily mean better for MY car)
yup. I am not a show guy, so I am lookin for the best performing setup for a vw. I am leaning towards wilwoods. Need to find a 4 luggers with wilwoods that would want to trrade for some porsche brakes......


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## Dansk Ventoe (Sep 30, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Don't you have to rebuild the caliper pistons every year or so on the wilwoods though? I would say the porsche set-up, although if you use tt rotors they are frickin heavy.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (Dansk Ventoe)*

yeah, that is my concern (both about the TT weight and the rebuilding wilwoods). I do not mind some maintenance on my car though(I store it in the winter anyway).
hmmmmmmmm


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## BlkVentoTurbo (Oct 15, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (Dansk Ventoe)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Dansk Ventoe* »_Don't you have to rebuild the caliper pistons every year or so on the wilwoods though? I would say the porsche set-up, although if you use tt rotors they are frickin heavy.
 
i belive that rpi told me that the willwoods are 2.5 or so pounds as a caliper weight not weight saved but i am not shure , they were very light and even in ther catalog they tell the weight savings vs stock it worked out to close to half the stock weight !!!! as far a rebuilding them i know people who have never rebuilt the for like 3 years no probs 
the boxter calipers are very heavy but look the balls i prefer will woods even still i am trying to get some glowing rotor shots


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## Dansk Ventoe (Sep 30, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Im sure the wilwoods don't weight too much. All I know is my brakes (996) weigh a ton!


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## uprisinkhmer (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (Dansk Ventoe)*

i was looking into the porsche brakes also and was wondering would they fit Monte Carlo's? and or is there any other mods i would need to do for the porsche brake kit


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (JamieK18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JamieK18T* »_too bad there aren't any 2 piece rotors availible. 

Zubehor "was" carrying 11", 4x100, "2-piece", lightweight rotors (w/ blue aluminum hats). I don't have a current "500 page catalog", but they had them in the 2001 catalog. I think they ran about $280 a pair. I just picked up the "Wilwood Kit" from Momentum (sans rotors), for $479. I had already bought ATEs before I saw the latest ad.


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

I just called Zubehor...they can get 4x100, 2 piece rotors, w/ aluminum hats, in 280mmx22mm, slotted or slotted and drilled. I think he was wrong on the price though. He quoted me $433 for a pair, but I think that would be "2 pairs" IIRC. Have to find my old catalog.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

nice. thanks for the info. I think I am going the wilwood route. So I can use my 11" rotors with their setup, correct? That would be great, becasue they have quite a bit of life in them since they are not very old......


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

I just sold the porsche wetup to syonara_g60style, so the wilwoods are going to be the ones. He also had a set of the mounting brackets for the wilwoods for my app, so that was part of the deal. So now I have the brackets (on the way) and if my 11" rotors work, I have a good deal of the setup. Just need the calipers and the elbows for the brake lines (I have stainless already) and pads


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## vento 95 GL (May 25, 1999)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*


_Quote, originally posted by *colnago* »_
Zubehor "was" carrying 11", 4x100, "2-piece", lightweight rotors (w/ blue aluminum hats). I don't have a current "500 page catalog", but they had them in the 2001 catalog. I think they ran about $280 a pair. I just picked up the "Wilwood Kit" from Momentum (sans rotors), for $479. I had already bought ATEs before I saw the latest ad.


these are the dics you are talking about. they are made by tecno freno. pretty nice indeed http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_...So I can use my 11" rotors with their setup, correct? That would be great, becasue they have quite a bit of life in them since they are not very old......

That's what everybody says. Momentum Motorparts (where I bought them), and my buddy has the Dynalite IIs, on his G60, with 11" ATE Power discs. I'll get mine in soon. Does anyone know if the "Polymatrix" pads, that come with the Wilwoods, are a "track" pad? Do they need to get hot to work?









'Dem is the ones! I wanted to get the "slotted"...could have sworn they were $240'ish a "pair" not "each".


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_I just sold the porsche wetup to syonara_g60style, so the wilwoods are going to be the ones. He also had a set of the mounting brackets for the wilwoods for my app, so that was part of the deal. So now I have the brackets (on the way) and if my 11" rotors work, I have a good deal of the setup. Just need the calipers and the elbows for the brake lines (I have stainless already) and pads

Greg, I dunno what the going rate is on VW kits for fitting wilwoods, but if you have the brackets already, you can get the Dynalite II calipers from Summit for $102.95 each. I think thats pretty damn cheap for a 4 piston caliper. It says in the catalog that each caliper weighs 2.5 lbs, and the fit .380" thick rotors.
Let me know how they work out for you, I was looking into upgrading, but I dunno if it will fit into my budget, plus I have 11.3" stock.
EDIT: I think the calipers that you actually want are the Billet Dynalite. I read that RPI has a mistake on their site, dunno if thats true, but those are $122.95 on summit.


_Modified by VR6 Mk3 at 9:32 PM 8-31-2003_


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## vento 95 GL (May 25, 1999)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (VR6 Mk3)*

I was thinking if there is any problem running the wilwood during the winter. over here in canada we have pretty tough winters.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (VR6 Mk3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VR6 Mk3* »_
Greg, I dunno what the going rate is on VW kits for fitting wilwoods, but if you have the brackets already, you can get the Dynalite II calipers from Summit for $102.95 each. I think thats pretty damn cheap for a 4 piston caliper. It says in the catalog that each caliper weighs 2.5 lbs, and the fit .380" thick rotors.
Let me know how they work out for you, I was looking into upgrading, but I dunno if it will fit into my budget, plus I have 11.3" stock.
EDIT: I think the calipers that you actually want are the Billet Dynalite. I read that RPI has a mistake on their site, dunno if thats true, but those are $122.95 on summit.


I already have the part numbers for the calipers and I think that summit does have the best price on them. The "kit" fot my car would normally run about $649 for all of it from momentum (cheapest place, AFAIK). But since all I would need is the calipers and elbow fittings for the lines (I already have stainless) and pads, I can definately get in at half of that amount. I will let you know how they work out, but it probably won't be for a while, since I have a few bills to pay before I buy them.
Did you see the wheels I picked up for the coupe??????


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_Did you see the wheels I picked up for the coupe??????

No, I didn't. IM me a link.
You missed a good GTG in lake george by the way. There was a pretty nice mk2 coupe that showed up, ill send you a link to pics when i get a chance.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (VR6 Mk3)*

yeah, I would have liked to go to the GTG, but I had to work (sale was still on at the shop). I saw the pics of the coupe that was there. That thing is pretty sweet. I'll IM you a link the the wheels that should be here this week (or next at the latest)


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## bad_vr_vento (Jun 18, 2003)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

where can you get the 11" 2-piece rotors again?
4X100 ?
these look really nice 

_Quote, originally posted by *colnago* »_
That's what everybody says. Momentum Motorparts (where I bought them), and my buddy has the Dynalite IIs, on his G60, with 11" ATE Power discs. I'll get mine in soon. Does anyone know if the "Polymatrix" pads, that come with the Wilwoods, are a "track" pad? Do they need to get hot to work?









'Dem is the ones! I wanted to get the "slotted"...could have sworn they were $240'ish a "pair" not "each".


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_
I already have the part numbers for the calipers and I think that summit does have the best price on them. The "kit" fot my car would normally run about $649 for all of it from momentum (cheapest place, AFAIK). But since all I would need is the calipers and elbow fittings for the lines (I already have stainless) and pads, I can definately get in at half of that amount. 

I got the "kit" from Momentum, without rotors, for $479...just to give you an idea. I'm using them with 11" ATE Power Discs. It looks like they fit.









_where can you get the 11" 2-piece rotors again?
4X100 ?
these look really nice _ 
I called *Tuning Zubehor* (805) 526-9577. But double check the prices. IIRC, they were ~$230 per "pair", not $230 "each".


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

yeah, I think momentum runs specials on them, cause on their site, it was $649 when I checked (must have included rotors, too). I only need the calipers and pads, since I will have the brackets in a few days and have lines already http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vwtoys (Mar 31, 1999)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Get the Cupra R(?) Brembo red monoblocks brakes(12.3" I think) off of a SEAT, they're direct bolt-on with factory parts. About 600 in parts from the euro dealer. There was a post about them in the G/J II forum, did you not see it?


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (vwtoys)*

yeah, I saw it, but if I were going to do that, I might as well have just used the porsche boxster calipers and the appropriate 12.3" rotors for them. It would have been another route to the same end, 4 piston brembos on 12.3" rotors. My biggest issue with that is the necessary wheel size and added weight of the larger rotors and calipers


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

I already had all of the parts, minus the rotors for the porsche setup, so they were already "direct bolt on" in the form I had them anyway. it would have been more enticing, had I now already gotten the porsche setup....
I have already sold the porsche setup anyway, so it looks like the wilwoods will get a shot. If I don't like em for some reason, i'll get the Seat setup, but I doubt that will happen


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (vwtoys)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vwtoys* »_Get the Cupra R(?) Brembo red monoblocks brakes(12.3" I think) off of a SEAT, they're direct bolt-on with factory parts. About 600 in parts from the euro dealer. There was a post about them in the G/J II forum, did you not see it?

I went Wilwood, finally, instead of the Brembo or Boxter setup, because I finally realized, "I'm going to run 15" wheels come winter." That kinda killed any hopes of "squeezing" the more "desireable" calipers under my 16s.







You got to figure, even if people aren't totally happy with Wilwood, 4 pistons are better than 1 for the Corrado.


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

I was kinda investigating the wilwood route if funds allow in the spring, but I would have to downsize my rotors from stock (I have 11.3"). I wonder if the 4 pistons and the immense savings in unsprung weight would outweigh the smaller rotors. Also my steelies for winter are about 1mm away from the stock caliper. I dunno if the wilwoods are any larger.
I definetly like the idea of a brake upgrade like that which allows me to keep my stock wheels. I also want to save weight, and my suspension is stiff enough on these horrible roads with 15s. That and I can't afford any larger wheels that i would actually want on my car and i use it in winter.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

I am probably not going to run this car in winter (usually have a beater). I was all set to run the porsche brakes, and was ready to buy the rotors, but then I found some 15's I liked (BBS RS) and then got to thinking, as much as I want the 12.3" porsche brakes, I want to retain the ability to run 15's more. I have done it all from 14-17's on my car, and really like 15's the best, for both looks and performance. I don't want to be locked into a wheel/tire size because of my brakes


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## bad_vr_vento (Jun 18, 2003)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

I have a set of 18"s on my A3 jetta, and 11" G60's with 4piston calipers. I usually use my G60 wheels on them, and they leave enough space. Plus the 15"s are a lot better if you take your car to the track every now and then. I was gonna go with 13" Rotors, but i don't wanna roll on 18"s every day (during summer). That's why i wanna get a set of these 2 piece 11"s. I get weight savings, good braking, and a show look.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (bad_vr_vento)*

yeah, I do get to the track (infrequently) so I wanted to be able to run my 15's. Plus, I don't want to HAVE TO roll on my 16" RS for daily driving


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## Dansk Ventoe (Sep 30, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Hey if you could post the weights of the set-ups you know in my thread in this forum. I'd like to assemble a list for anyone who wants to know weights of various combonations.


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_yeah, I do get to the track (infrequently) so I wanted to be able to run my 15's. Plus, I don't want to HAVE TO roll on my 16" RS for daily driving









Let me know next time you are doing a track event, I'm itching to do one.
Have you ever done any of the NASA stuff?


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Greg,
I noticed that you also have or used to have a Mk III Golf.
Does what you say in relation to your Jetta brakes also apply to the Mk III Golf?
I've posted elsewhere in the Brakes forum looking for the ultimate Mk III Golf setup. Is the information necessarily transferrable? Or are Mk III Golfs and Mk II Jettas quite different when it comes to finding brakes?
Cheers,
Matthew


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

basically any of the A3's or A2's with a 4 bolt setup can run the same brakes. If you have an A3, 4 bolt, you can put on 11" corrado brakes (stock is 10.1") or you can get the porsche setups, Seat setup, or wilwoods and go up to 11" rotors as well. There are the same options available for the A3, as long as it is 4 lug. The 5 lug are similar in options, but they are a little different fit (some 4 lug and 5 lug parts are not interchangeable)
As for track days, the ones I have done are through NASA. The next one I hope to do is at Lime Rock Park on November 10th. i have not signed up yet, cause I haven't had any extra cash to do so. Hopefully it doesn't get sold out before I get to sign up


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_... or you can get the porsche setups, Seat setup, or wilwoods and go up to 11" rotors as well.

11inch. My maths aren't too good, but that sounds roughly approximate to 280mm which I have on my car at the moment.
What about the Porsche brakes? Which ones are the ones to go for?
I understand that the R32 brakes aren't possible for some reason, although those would be my choice if they worked.


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdt* »_11inch. My maths aren't too good, but that sounds roughly approximate to 280mm which I have on my car at the moment.
What about the Porsche brakes? Which ones are the ones to go for?
I understand that the R32 brakes aren't possible for some reason, although those would be my choice if they worked.









Mk3 VR6s had 11" brakes up until 96 (in america at least) so thats probably what your car has. For Porsche brakes, I dunno who else sells them, but ECS tuning has a few kits with Boxster 993 Turbo brakes to fit VWs. As far as the R32 goes, I have no idea, but I know you can get kits to fit TT brakes (same as 337/25J/20th AE) which are 12.3",


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (VR6 Mk3)*

Thanks for the tip.
Yes, ECS sell these kits:








Seems like I'd better start saving.








Though I notice that these are five lugs. Do they make four lug kits?


_Modified by mdt at 3:25 PM 9-4-2003_


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdt* »_Thanks for the tip.
Yes, ECS sell these kits:








Seems like I'd better start saving.









Though I notice that these are five lugs. Do they make four lug kits?

_Modified by mdt at 3:25 PM 9-4-2003_

You'd have to get the "Boxter" kit, 12.3", 4x100 rotor w/ Boxter calipers...Must use 17" wheel for the most part. $1095.


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*


_Quote, originally posted by *colnago* »_
You'd have to get the "Boxter" kit, 12.3", 4x100 rotor w/ Boxter calipers...Must use 17" wheel for the most part. $1095.


That's a shame. Why can't you use the 996 brakes? If I have to buy 17 inch wheels I might as welll get the phattest brakes possible.


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdt* »_
That's a shame. Why can't you use the 996 brakes? If I have to buy 17 inch wheels I might as welll get the phattest brakes possible.

The boxster S has the same brakes as the 993 turbo and i think 996 turbo.


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## rabstg (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (bad_vr_vento)*

Just got in my FULLY dust sheilded DynaPros and hope to have them on my Golf by the end of this month. I have 12.19" 2 piece front rotors, and 11.5" rear rotors with factory calipers in the back.
I will try to post the pictures(If I can find a place to host the pictures) of the components and the installation as it goes. 








Since Vortex scrubs the pictures of Wilwoods, here is a URL
http://f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/...iew=t 
_Modified by rabstg at 7:53 AM 9-22-2003_


_Modified by rabstg at 8:34 AM 9-23-2003_


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_I already had all of the parts, minus the rotors for the porsche setup, so they were already "direct bolt on" in the form I had them anyway. it would have been more enticing, had I now already gotten the porsche setup....
I have already sold the porsche setup anyway, so it looks like the wilwoods will get a shot. If I don't like em for some reason, i'll get the Seat setup, but I doubt that will happen

I just got the Wilwoods on...definately lighter than my stock Corrado G60 calipers (haven't weighed stock, but the calipers feel like they weigh upwards of 10lbs. combined). A definate improvement in braking over my: 
- Mintex Red Box (all 4 corners)
- Autotech SS lines
- stock calipers (Corrado G60)
- 11" 4x100 ATE Power Slots
I can now "lock" the wheels nder heavy breaking....not that its an ideal result, but there is definately more braking force available. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'm still breaking in the pads/rotors, but I feel "safer" than with the "fade-prone" Red Box. I only did one high speed stop (running late for appointment and wasn't going to make the light) and I "babied" the brakes as I was trying to avoid glazing. It took longer to stop but I didn't have to "mash the pedal to the floor" as with my previous set up. 
Intall was pretty straight forward, pads will be really easy to change. The only problem was that the pads were rubbing the rotor. We had to put in a 1-2mm washer/spacer on the mounting brackets to push the caliper out away from the car. Clearance is not an issue with the ATE rotors.

Best part is that I can throw on the 15" stock wheels come winter. Now I just have to sell my Borbet Type Cs and get some Kosei







. 
Also, I am using the Wilwood "Polymatrix" pads that came with the kit. I'll give updates on performance, if anyone is interested, as the pads/rotors settle.


_Modified by colnago at 2:32 PM 9-8-2003_


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

Great! That is just the info I was looking for. Post up again once you have them worn in a bit more and can stand on them to feel the real performance of them. Regardless, I am getting them anyway, cause I know they will be an improvement over the G60 setup in both grabbing force and weight


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## 90 GT-G60 (Jan 18, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Would anyone recommend Wilwood's for a Passat TDI?
I am definitely interested in increasing the braking on my new ride.


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (90 GT-G60)*

Ok, I just put my Corrado G60 (single piston) calipers on my bathroom scale







, with Mintex Red Box pads, and SS lines, and they have a "combined weight" of 21lbs. (20lbs without pads). Just an FYI...I believe someone posted Wilwood Dynalite (a.k.a Momentum and RPI 11" Wilwood kit) as 2.5lbs. per caliper, or 5lbs combined. I put one of my Wilwood calipers with the mounting bracket, on the same bathroom scale (digital) and it didn't even register a weight. I can see them being the posted 2.5 lbs.


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

wow







that is a considerable savings in weight. Geez, even better reduction in unsprung weight than with a really light wheel. Just think of the improvement with the brakes and some light wheels http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

I forgot to add, that the weight for the Corrado calipers was with the brackets. When taking off the Wilwood brackets, they couldn't have been more than .25-.5 lbs. So at most the Wilwood (11"kit) calipers/brackets/pads would be around 7-8lbs "combined" vs 21lbs for the Corrado G60 calipers/brackets/pads.

Forgot also, I'm using the Wilwood Polymatrix "D" compound. 
http://www.wilwood.com/product...s.asp 
They say that there is "minimal break in time", I have heat cycled them, and have about 150 miles on them so far. I'll start "stepping" on them today.


_Modified by colnago at 11:46 AM 9-9-2003_


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

O.k....I'm happy with them. I've started "getting on them", and there is a nice "scrubbing of speed" feeling when giving a firm pedal pressing. There isn't the feeling of the brakes "locking", but if you give it an extra push at the end, that's where I feel like I may be able to do an endo.








I don't feel like I can "modulate" the braking, but more like there are only 3 levels: slowing, braking, then all out braking, based on pedal feel/position and slowing of the car. It may just be the nature of the pads, I may just get some Porterfield R4S just to compare. Maybe they are a little more "streetable" than the Polymatrix "D" compound.


----------



## 90 GT-G60 (Jan 18, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

Colnago, 
Keep up the good work! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Will you be selling you Corrado Calipers and carriers by chance?
I know these would fit on my TDI without issue. I was going to take my currant setup off of my Corrado since I took it off the road. But if I try to sell her, I will need brakes, won't I







....


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

Thanks for the update. You know, in some cases like this, I have heard of people actually switching to a smaller MC, allowing for a little more travel in the brake pedal, so it is easier to modulate the brake pressure a little more consistently. My coupe that I am doing this on has the 20mm master cylinder in it still, although I have the 22mm from my old car waiting to go in. Maybe I will setup the wilwoods with the 20mm first and see how that fairs against the 22mm......


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

*90 GT-G60* - I will be selling:
- '92 Corrado G60 calipers and carriers
- 8 month old Mintex Red Box
- New In Box Porterfield R4S pads for Corrado brakes
- 8 month old Autotech Front SS lines
...but someone called "dibs" already. If it falls through, I'll let you know.

*blubayou* - I don't think it's pedal "travel" I have plenty left, I think it's more the nature of the pads. There is only 1-2mm clearance between the pads and rotors (22mm ATE), they "connect" early, but under a light pedal, you can feel the rotor just spinning on the pad. It "slows" but there is a very "manual" feeling to the braking. Like there is no power assist...much like braking a bicycle. More effort, more braking, as if you are pushing the pad against the rotor with your feet. It's very "direct", but not linear, in relation to pedal position. The braking power ramps up, much like a dyno plot on a turbo charged car...if you can imagine.


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

Okay, I see what you are saying. So it isn't so much the force applied by the pistons in the caliper on the pad as it may be the pad material itself. Roger, Roger! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I was imagining it to be a case where the increased travel in the pedal would allow for more variation in the amount of pressure aplied to the system. I will just run with my 22mm mc then, and not bother with the 20mm. Are there many pad choices with these brakes?


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_...Are there many pad choices with these brakes?

Wilwood makes about 8-10 different compounds, Hawk makes a few, Perfomance Friction, Porterfield (I may be ordering soon http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif )...check out the Wilwood site. 
http://www.wilwood.com


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

cool. Thanks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## BlkVentoTurbo (Oct 15, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

COLNAGO.... 
_Quote, originally posted by *colnago* »_Ok, I just put my Corrado G60 (single piston) calipers on my bathroom scale







, with Mintex Red Box pads, and SS lines, and they have a "combined weight" of 21lbs. (20lbs without pads). Just an FYI...I believe someone posted Wilwood Dynalite (a.k.a Momentum and RPI 11" Wilwood kit) as 2.5lbs. per caliper, or 5lbs combined. I put one of my Wilwood calipers with the mounting bracket, on the same bathroom scale (digital) and it didn't even register a weight. I can see them being the posted 2.5 lbs.

i posted that and i f you do an hang test thay ar light 11 inch rotors calipers and lines were like halve the weight of the stock units


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (BlkVentoTurbo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BlkVentoTurbo* »_COLNAGO.... 
i posted that and i f you do an hang test thay ar light 11 inch rotors calipers and lines were like halve the weight of the stock units










Yeah, I may go away from the ATE...it's only been "drizzling" for an hour, and they are starting to rust already.

















I'll probably go with the ones from Zubehor, or get some made, with aluminum hats, from Porterfield or Wilwood.


----------



## 90 GT-G60 (Jan 18, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*


_Quote, originally posted by *colnago* »_

Yeah, I may go away from the ATE...it's only been "drizzling" for an hour, and they are starting to rust already.
















I'll probably go with the ones from Zubehor, or get some made, with aluminum hats, from Porterfield or Wilwood. 


Any brake disk made of Iron is going to rust when there is moisture. 
Even cadium plated ones will rust. The plating on the brakepad surface is worn off the disk the first time you use the brakes. The rest of the brake is still protected.


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (90 GT-G60)*

*90 GT-G60* My G60 calipers are sold.
*** I'd just like to say, "I like this kit." I've been, "leaving it late", as they say, on purpose and the brakes/pads have been performing very well. They have been consistent after hard braking as well. Got me out of trouble on 495 yesterday morning where my last setup wouldn't. I don't have any measurements...too busy doing my 'preparedness' for Isabel.


----------



## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_I want to retain the ability to run 15's more. I have done it all from 14-17's on my car, and really like 15's the best, for both looks and performance.

Blubayou, can you please elaborate upon this? I'm thinking about changing to 16 inch wheels but am interested to know whether it makes sense... I'd be very interested in what you have to say. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## BlkVentoTurbo (Oct 15, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

i have a set of 16 and i like them alot they imhop or the best as far as ride /looks /performance i run a 205 40 16 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 1 use to run a 215 50 15 wich was also good


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdt* »_
Blubayou, can you please elaborate upon this? I'm thinking about changing to 16 inch wheels but am interested to know whether it makes sense... I'd be very interested in what you have to say. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Yeah, obviously the looks part is a preference thing. Performance is debateable depending on what you like. I personally like being able to run 15's so I can run at the ride height I want (coilovers) and get the tires I want relatively inexpensively (toyo T1-S) and I can get a lighter weight 15" wheel than 16" wheel, giving less unsprung weight which is part of the reason I want to do the wilwood brakes too. I do still like 16's and how they drive, but dn't want to worry about less sidewall and bending a wheel, paying more for tires, adding more weight 9both rotational and unsprung) etc. The differences aren't tremendous, but from my experience, the 15's have suited my car better. Oh, also with 15's. the car is a little more stock looking, which I prefer for daily driving. I don't think you'd be making a bad choice with 16's, it's just not my bag http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif (even though I have some 16" BBS RS in my garage. Exceptions can be made for them though







)
here are my 15's and 16's
















both have toyo T1-S, cause I like em


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

I know you asked for someone in particular, but here is a good thread on the pros/cons of "plus sizing":
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1008498 
Basically, the larger the wheel, the more "stable" it is, but is not a "quick" on acceleration and stopping. A 16" on a MkII or MkIII is a good balance between comfort, speed, handling, and looks...although I would go with a 205/45/16.


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

very true. For an A3, 16's are a little better suited than on an A2, I think.
Forgot to add a side note,
My buddy let me drive his WRX STI yesterday, wow, wanna talk about brakes?







4 pot brembos http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

You better get those Wilwoods already and be done with it!!!!







But get a different pad than the "Polymatrix D" so we can compare.


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

okay, I'll try some different ones. I am waitin to sell my engine and some wheels, then I will order the rest of the parts I need http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Thanks for that Blubayou. Like you I would prefer a stock look. I'm not really convinced that bigger wheels look better. As you say, that's a preference thing.
But what about this comment:

_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_I personally like being able to run 15's so I can run at the ride height I want (coilovers) but don't want to worry about less sidewall and bending a wheel, paying more for tires, adding more weight both rotational and unsprung) etc. 

What do you mean by running at the ride height you want? Is that because your car is slammed? I have coilovers too, and I'm keen to avoid limiting what I can do with the car.
Does anyone know the weight of the standard VR6 wheel?
What about running a lower profile tyre on the standard VR6 wheel, would that work?
Cheers guys,
Matthew


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

well, I pretty much always have 2 sets of wheels to run (track vs daily). If I run a 16, I may need to raise the car to clear it, depending on the width/ET of the wheel. I know I can run at one height with basically any 15's and not need to worry about raising/lowering the car whenever I change wheels, just cause that gets old. I am not necessarily REAL low, but I have my car set at a height I like, so different/bigger wheels *might* interfere with it. 
As long as you get the right width/offset, you can probably run a 16 with no rubbing issues on an A3. The A2's seem to have a little more of a rubbing problem in the back with a bigger wheel/tire setup (especially since I have coilovers - I cannot run as high an offset in the rear since the coilovers offer less clearance than the tradional spring/shock assembly). I do have a fender tool, so I can get around that, in most cases though.


----------



## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Not to mention you need to get an alignment every time


----------



## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (VR6 Mk3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VR6 Mk3* »_Not to mention you need to get an alignment every time

I'm not sure I understand the context of this. Are you suggesting that you need to get a wheel alignment every time you change rims? I didn't know that.


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdt* »_
I'm not sure I understand the context of this. Are you suggesting that you need to get a wheel alignment every time you change rims? I didn't know that.

Sorry, no I meant every time he adjust the height of his coilovers.


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_...The A2's seem to have a little more of a rubbing problem in the back with a bigger wheel/tire setup (especially since I have coilovers - I cannot run as high an offset in the rear since the coilovers offer less clearance than the tradional spring/shock assembly)... 

That's why you run spacers.







I went from a 205/50/15 for 15x6.5 wheels on my A2.5 (Corrado G60), to a 202/45/16 for 16x7.5 wheels. I wouldn't suggest dropping your aspect ratio for the same wheel (i.e. if you have 205/50/15, don't go 205/45/15), especially if you plan to "track" the car. Just get a tire with a stiffer sidewall.


----------



## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*


_Quote, originally posted by *colnago* »_I wouldn't suggest dropping your aspect ratio for the same wheel (i.e. if you have 205/50/15, don't go 205/45/15), especially if you plan to "track" the car. Just get a tire with a stiffer sidewall. 

Thanks for that. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Do you have any recommendations? 
I had my eye on BFGoodrich g-Force T/A KDW 2, but only because of the tirerack survey: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/...p.jsp
But if you note, the sample size for this tyre is particularly small.
What do you think?


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

Depends on what you want out of your tire. I think the general concensus is:
Toyo T1-S
Bridgestone S-03
Goodyear GS D3-F1
BFGoodrich g-Force T/A KD
...and not necesarily in that order. Aside from an "R" compound, I think these are viewed as the way to go, street/track, for most grip, wet or dry. I have never been on either one, tried to get T1-S when I ordered my wheels but got the run around by some local dealers. Guys I know that track generally like these, so take it for what its worth.


----------



## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*


_Quote, originally posted by *colnago* »_Depends on what you want out of your tire. I think the general concensus is:
Toyo T1-S
Bridgestone S-03
Goodyear GS D3-F1
BFGoodrich g-Force T/A KD
...and not necesarily in that order. Aside from an "R" compound, I think these are viewed as the way to go, street/track, for most grip, wet or dry. I have never been on either one, tried to get T1-S when I ordered my wheels but got the run around by some local dealers. Guys I know that track generally like these, so take it for what its worth.

Judging from the way in which I am going through tyres at the moment, I'll be able to try them all very soon. Thanks again Colnago. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## rabstg (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

I had the Toyo T1-S on my car and they lasted 20K and I could not break traction even trying. They were FANTASTIC in every way except the road noise. They were loud.
Just to try something else when the Toyo's did wear out, I replaced them with the Kumho Ecsta MX's. They are quieter and they grip very well but the side walls are not as stiff, so I don't think they respond quite as well.


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## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (rabstg)*

Falken Azenis http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I got a set of these, and the grip is crazy. They aren't awesome in the rain, but they aren't horrible, and they are a lot cheaper than anything you mentioned, and I have a feeling they have more grip. Go to any autoX and you will see most of the competitive cars that aren't on race rubber are running them.


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (VR6 Mk3)*

I haven't tried the Azenis yet, since I have been running primarily the Toyo T1-S for many years (both street and track). I have never had any complaints about them (great in dry, rain, etc). Another thing worth mentioning about them is the weight, cause they are one of the lightest (forget off the top of my head what it is though). I have a guy that gets them for me at about $72/tire, so I am not too worried about the price


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_I haven't tried the Azenis yet, since I have been running primarily the Toyo T1-S for many years (both street and track). I have never had any complaints about them (great in dry, rain, etc). Another thing worth mentioning about them is the weight, cause they are one of the lightest (forget off the top of my head what it is though). I have a guy that gets them for me at about $72/tire, so I am not too worried about the price









Wow, street and track. Any pics?


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

pics of what, the tires?


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

they aren't a full race tire, but a good cross-over. I think the speedvision touring cars used them as their rain tires for a while (not sure if they still do)


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_pics of what, the tires?

Yezzum. I'd like to see whether they would cut it as a tyre capable of carrying around my family in on a day to day basis. I don't want a racing tyre, so much as a very soft road tyre. I don't mind about wear. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*









here is their photo http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Thanks for that. I might be heading down to my Toyo shop when my Yokohama ES100s run out. Give me a couple more track days...


----------



## VR6 Mk3 (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

I've heard good things about the Toyos too. I think the Azenis is a little closer to a track tire and less practical for the street, although I've driven on them every day since the beginning of summer and not had any complaints. They are fairly heavy. I dunno the weight, but the super stiff sidewalls make them heavier, and supposedly the tread is like a half in wider than a normal 205.


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdt* »_Thanks for that. I might be heading down to my Toyo shop when my Yokohama ES100s run out. Give me a couple more track days...









What size do you need?


----------



## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Not trying to disrupt your whole tire converstion... but I would like to go with more potent brakes for the front... but I also run BBS RS's 15x8 and ET 38.... So I dont think I have that much clearance, I dont want to do G60 brakes or Girlings because of the weight. (dont want to add more)
So is there any willwood 4 piston caliper I could buy, then buy the brackets, lines and etc...
(I dont know that much about brakes this is why I ask for instruction)


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *danny_16v* »_Not trying to disrupt your whole tire converstion... but I would like to go with more potent brakes for the front... but I also run BBS RS's 15x8 and ET 38.... So I dont think I have that much clearance, I dont want to do G60 brakes or Girlings because of the weight. (dont want to add more)
So is there any willwood 4 piston caliper I could buy, then buy the brackets, lines and etc...
(I dont know that much about brakes this is why I ask for instruction)


You didn't read all 3 pages of this thread then.














I think the consensus is that the only option for a caliper upgrade, and still retain the ability to run 15" wheels, is the 11" Wilwood kit. It's a direct bolt on for 4 bolt VWs. 
http://www.momentummotorparts.com 
has the complete kit, everything you need for a conversion, for $649. I got my kit from them for $479 without rotors (I had already ordered 11" ATE). They bolted right up to my Corrado G60, which comes with 11" rotors. What kind of car would they be going on?


----------



## 90 GT-G60 (Jan 18, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

Hey Colnogo, 
Is your Corrado a year round driver? 
I am interested in the Wilwoods for my TDI. 
But not sure how they will hold up to driving conditions that we have in the winter time.
Also my car has ABS. Is this something to worry about.
I most likely would try to peice the kit together myself.
Summit racing for the calipers $125 each
Zimmerman cross drilled I can get for $42 each. ATE slotts would be less.
I would only need to price the carriers and source the front brake lines in braided steel.
And brake pads.
Know the cost of those aprox?
Thanks!


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (90 GT-G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *90 GT-G60* »_Hey Colnogo, 


Ok, first off, you've got to spell "COLNAGO" correctly, or there will be thousands of Italians hunting you down.








As far as the Wilwood kit, it is for my 5 day/week driven G60 Corrado, 20thAE is my long distance beater. I don't think Wilwoods have issues with "changing climates". My buddy, the only other person I "know personally" that has Wilwoods, has had them on for years, no issues. But he has the "Forged Billet Dynalites". 
As for piecing the kit together yourself, the lines have an "elbow", where they attach to the caliper, becase they mount on the "back", not the sides like most calipers. You could order everything from Wilwood yourself and it may be cheaper. If you can get ATE for less than $42/ea., I'll be giving you a call soon.














Pads, I'm going for Porterfield R4S for the "Dynalite II".
Carriers, I don't think you'll be getting them off the shelf, unless Momentum or RPI are willing to sell them directly. Wilwood "may" have a carrier:
http://www.wilwood.com 
I don't know how much having a carrier machined would cost, but SS lines are gonna' run at least $80-$100. Pads will be $70 or more, for a decent set of Hawks or Porterfields. For all the trouble, just go through Momentum $479 for "everything", w/o rotors, vs RPI $749 (don't know if they'll sell w/o rotors).
Is your TDI 4x100 bolt pattern, with 11" rotors? The Dynalite II calipers accomodate up to 13."something" inch rotors, so the carrier is the missing link. Yeah, you could "piece" it yourself, maybe save $40-$50, but to me, it wasn't worth the hassle. $250 (calipers), plus $100 for lines, $70 for pads, you're already at $420. Then add any shipping if the parts come from different places, and you still need carriers.


----------



## 90 GT-G60 (Jan 18, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

I didn't think the stainless steel lines would be that much, nor the pads.
I may have to rethink this, or I could just go out and buy a set of Corrado calipers and carriers and be done with it. I saw a set for $75.
My TDI currently has 10.1 rotors but they are 4x100.
I am double checking the cost on ATE's but it *may* be around $28 each!
I will confirm this when I get a reply via email.


----------



## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*

Danny, I am now running 15" BBS RS as well, but with the lower BMW offset (25mm 15x7). I am assuming the 38mm offset if your original offset, correct? Can you pull a wheel and measure the actual backspacing on it? I can compare that to mine and see if the inner half of our wheels is the same (I think I may have a little more clearance than you though). I should be getting them soon, so I can show you how they fit and the specs on the wheels (backspacing, etc). I actually have a spare set of knuckles (G60) that I can bolt it all on to show the inside so you can see what kind of clearance there is near the bolts. It may come down to the shape of the caliper (may need a small spacer to clear the bolts on the inside)
Maybe I need to order mine this week, so I can get into this (to help you, of course)


----------



## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (90 GT-G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *90 GT-G60* »_I didn't think the stainless steel lines would be that much, nor the pads.
I may have to rethink this, or I could just go out and buy a set of Corrado calipers and carriers and be done with it. I saw a set for $75.
My TDI currently has 10.1 rotors but they are 4x100.
I am double checking the cost on ATE's but it *may* be around $28 each!
I will confirm this when I get a reply via email.


Well the costs of the lines and pads are dependent on your sources. It seems like "your" sources are MUCH better than mine. I paid $63 each for my ATEs at germanautoparts.com. I haven't seen any SS lines for Dubs under $80, but then I haven't sourced them from a "supply store" or "race shop." 
Corrado calipers and rotors would be an upgrade for you then, but I wasn't happy with my stock setup. It could have very well have just been the "Red Box", but I figured I'd "do it right", and just upgrade the calipers as well. I don't like having to pray while I'm waiting to stop.







You definately need to let us know where you can get ATEs for $28 though. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'll have to check my manual about the ABS when I get home.


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## 90 GT-G60 (Jan 18, 2000)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

I already have stainless steel lines on both the Passat and the Corrado.
I wonder if these can be made to fit into the elbow fitting that you need on the Wilwoods?
Yeah, I was shocked when he gave me a qoute on the Zims. I also got mine from Adirondak and paid about $65 each.
THe only down side may be the shipping. 
My source is in California and unless they are dropped shipped from somewhere on the east coast. The shipping would be more than what we paid from Adirondak.
I quess we will see.


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (90 GT-G60)*

I don't think that the elbows "screw" on, I think the lines are made with a standard connector, and an "elbow" on the other end. Like I said, you may be able to source the parts from a "race part supplier", or Wilwood directly. I can dig up part #s for you later.


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_Danny, I am now running 15" BBS RS as well, but with the lower BMW offset (25mm 15x7). I am assuming the 38mm offset if your original offset, correct? Can you pull a wheel and measure the actual backspacing on it? I can compare that to mine and see if the inner half of our wheels is the same (I think I may have a little more clearance than you though). I should be getting them soon, so I can show you how they fit and the specs on the wheels (backspacing, etc). I actually have a spare set of knuckles (G60) that I can bolt it all on to show the inside so you can see what kind of clearance there is near the bolts. It may come down to the shape of the caliper (may need a small spacer to clear the bolts on the inside)
Maybe I need to order mine this week, so I can get into this (to help you, of course)









Well mine are the VW BBS's and they have ET 38... I dont have my car so I cant let you know how my clearance is... I have stock 10.1's on my GLi.... Im thinking about doing what Colnago did and just buying the calipers and stuff without the rotors and just get stock Brembo 11" rotors... I dont want crossdrilled or slotted... I frankly dont need it.... I actually should make my GLi a little bit faster before I get the brake upgrade.... I dont need the brake upgrade yet, but it will be killer later










_Modified by danny_16v at 3:32 PM 9-22-2003_


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_
What size do you need?

15 inch. But before you extend a generous offer to me on tyres, please bear in mind that I'm 13000kms from you.








Not that I don't need one. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

yes, you are far away, now that I look. My deal will probably not be worthwhile then. Oh well http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

hey blubeyou you wana talk to me


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*

huh?


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

You wanna talk to me?


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

so thats what it will look like







.... are they really noisy??? Do they work better when heated up?? Of coarse that has to do with the pads.... do they lock up easy??


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *danny_16v* »_so thats what it will look like







.... are they really noisy??? Do they work better when heated up?? Of coarse that has to do with the pads.... do they lock up easy??

I have the Wilwood "D" compounds, and they are noisy every "once in a while". Only when making gentle, 30mph - 0 stops. They do need a few stops to heat up though. Once heated, no fade...but that's just during a few minutes of spirited driving, and just "leaving it late" going into stop lights/signs. VERY HAPPY over stock G60 setup. Porterfields are in the near future. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

he did have to run a spacer to clear the bolts on the inside, just so you know (5 or 8mm, I believe). His offset was 25mm on his wheels, but I didn't get the width, so I am not sure how they will compare


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

yeah hes got the non-curved RS's I got the curves baby!!!


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*

good deal http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

are you widening your RS's?


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *danny_16v* »_are you widening your RS's?

Are you saying he's becoming a phatRS?


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *danny_16v* »_are you widening your RS's?

haven't decided yet. Since they are 15x7, they have a decent sized lip already. I may keep the 15's as they are and bring the 16's to either 8" all around or maybe even 9"


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

if I widen the 15's, I will probably need to raise the car a little. I would love it if they were 15x7.5, but 15x8 IMO isn't really functional, which is more important to me


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_if I widen the 15's, I will probably need to raise the car a little. I would love it if they were 15x7.5, but 15x8 IMO isn't really functional, which is more important to me

heres mine


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## blubayou (Oct 3, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (danny_16v)*

man, really whorin those pics out today, huh?


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blubayou* »_man, really whorin those pics out today, huh?









hey... I havent gotten any pic action in more than 8 months... come on... No updates no nothing.... It just feels good to show something new again... Im sorry Im in idiot


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## 84cgtturbo (Apr 3, 2003)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

Hard to see in this pic, but I got the Wilwood kit here on my 84 CGT turbo. 
RPI kit came with 11" slotted x-drilled Brembos, Dynalite IIs calipers, adapters, and steel braided lines for $795. Got the matching Brembo 8.9" on the rear (VW 16V GTI setup). 
No noise, massive stopping power, and definitely lighter than what came off the car. Nothing else to compare to other than the stock brakes, but man what a difference all around! 
Regards,
J. Lyons


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## redsox (Dec 30, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

I just installed the wilwood kit on my 97 VR, about a thousand miles ago. So far, so okay. They are noisy as ****e somedays, and quiet as can be on others. The pedal feel and effort is minimum in any case, and they stop REAL quick. I dont use my car on the track however, so no input on that matter. Overall I would say go with the wilwoods (cost and the wheel size were important, you mentioned), but don't get the metalmaster pads. I think that may be the cause of all the squeakies. Good luck with the brakes!!


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## mdt (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

Guys, largely as a result of this thread, I'm on the verge of buying a Wilwood kit, would you mind having a quick look at this thread and letting me know whether I'm on the right track?
I took my car out with the Alfa and Ferrari Clubs on the weekend and completely trashed my existing set up:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1052171


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## colnago (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (mdt)*

Well, I've never been on the track with my car...yet, but the Mintex "Red Box" faded badly after 1 spirited drive of 3 hard stops. Hardly a track pad, but I was unsatisfied with it's street performance. There are a BUNCH of compounds for the Dynalites. Wilwood makes 8-10, Hawk and PBR make them as well. I believe Porterfield will "create" a pad for you, with certain characteristics, if they don't have an application for your caliper. You only need to send them the dimensions of the plate and pad material. 
My Wilwood "D" compounds have a consitent braking coef. from 100 deg. to 900 deg. It takes 1-2 stops in the morning going to work, but during a spirited drive, I wouldn't see it fading nearly as much as a "street pad". As a dedicated "track pad", I'll find out next year.







In the mean time, I'll be ordering Porterfield R4S. All I know is that my stock calipers couldn't make my PSS9 supported front end "dive" like the Wilwoods can.


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## Chooie (Oct 9, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (colnago)*

This is a topic that holds much interest for me (converting to Wilwoods), as after this winter, I will no longer have a need to run 14" steelies with snow tires. I will have 15x8 BBS RM's, and should forever be in a warmer climate. However, I have seen in at least one other thread that the barrel of the RM does NOT clear the Dynalite II calipers used in the MMP kit. Can anyone clarify this for me? Will the Wilwood kit fit under BBS RM's? If I need to invest in another style or size of wheel, I want to know BEFORE I purchase new brakes, and also before I purchase new Kodiak lips and have the centers refinished.
Thanks in advance!


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## Krazee (Jan 26, 2003)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (blubayou)*

I dont know if you decided what you ultimately wanted to do but I have another option and i dont know if it was mentioned.
If you want to keep your stock G60 brakes, with the Corrado single piston caliper, you could investigate the installation of the mk3 brake system. The advantages are a brake booster, slightly larger master cylinder and 4 dedicated outlets for each wheel. This with stock sized rotors and calipers will be very good.
Dont know if this issure on wilwoods was covered, but I have read/heard that they have to be rebuilt with some regularity and that even though they are 2 pistons, the pad area is the same as normal, thus not improving overall breaking performance much. Im not sure on this, it is only stuff I have read and heard, so dont bust my balls on it.


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## BlkVentoTurbo (Oct 15, 2002)

*Re: Porsche vs wilwood vs G60...... (KrazeeKorrado13)*

ohh btw most will woods have four pistons instead of 2 , the mk3 brakes are 10.1 as oppsed to 11 inches ( eg more swept area ) and the will woos do not have to be rebuilt id pad changes and cleaning is done regulary
these are mine before i put the coilovers on as you can see they are painted red and i have had them allmost a year and would not trade them for the world!!!

















_Modified by BlkVentoTurbo at 4:18 AM 11-13-2003_


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