# What happened to my rock hard brake pedal?



## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

So, I got the brake fluid in my 2007 GTI flushed a few months ago. All was fine with the system before I got this done. I was told that it's a good idea to have it flushed every two years, the only reason why I did it. A few days after the service I noticed that the brake pedal seemed to have a bit more travel in it than before. By that I mean the brakes still work fine, it just takes more push of the pedal to have them engage. Concerned, I returned to the dealership and they bled the brakes, I'm assuming to make sure that no air was in the lines. At first, the pedal was firm again. But soon felt the same, spongy and unpredictable. Before the initial brake service, the tech said that I had "plenty" of pad left in both the front and rear. My car has 26,xxx miles on it and I've never changed anything in the entire brake system besides the fluid. This spongy braking is really irritating considering that I PAID to make it feel worse. How do I get that very solid brake pedal that I once had? I remember barely tapping on the pedal and my brakes would respond. Any help would be very much appreciated. Thanks!


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## Elwood (Aug 10, 2001)

Air. Maybe in the ABS pump. The dealer didn't do a good job.


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## 2000Jet1.8T (Mar 25, 2009)

Did the dealer do this work. It sounds like they let the ABS pump run dry or close to it. I believe it can be purged with a VAGCOM. I would bring it back to whoever did the work and have them do it right.


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## Ld7w_VR (Apr 21, 2006)

While bleeding they would of had to cycle the ABS using vagcom or the manufacture scan tool. I would take it back to them for sure.


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## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

Thanks for the replies. I will mention everything to them when I take it in. Are low fluid and air in the system the only possibilities of what's causing this spongy brake feeling?


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## 2000Jet1.8T (Mar 25, 2009)

No, you could have a bad MC but I wouldn't suspect that since the problem happened after you had them bled.


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## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

Just an update:

I took my car to a touch-less wash the other day. I got the one with the undercarriage and side wash. It seems that cleaning the wheels and brake components has made the pedal feel stiffer again. I hadn't had my car washed in 4-5 months before that. Is it possible that the winter elements (dirt, road salt, etc.) made the braking system feel sloppy? The pedal seems to grab sooner than it did before the wash and there isn't AS MUCH of a delay in actually braking. I'm still going to have the dealer take a look at it, but it definitely feels different.


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## greyhare (Dec 24, 2003)

Possible. The caliper sliders may have been gummed up.


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## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

Update #2:

The car is currently at the dealership. After asking the service adviser if cycling the ABS pump was necessary, he shook his head and simply said "no". I tried explaining that I baby the car and the spongy feel was only noticeable after the initial fluid flush and change. How do I convey that this step is necessary? If they refuse to do it, can someone with a VAG-COM in my local area do it? What will I need besides access to a VAG-COM to do this properly?!


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## EuroSportChicago (Jun 9, 2010)

derekjl said:


> Update #2:
> 
> The car is currently at the dealership. After asking the service adviser if cycling the ABS pump was necessary, he shook his head and simply said "no". I tried explaining that I baby the car and the spongy feel was only noticeable after the initial fluid flush and change. How do I convey that this step is necessary? If they refuse to do it, can someone with a VAG-COM in my local area do it? What will I need besides access to a VAG-COM to do this properly?!


I would bring it to an Indy shop to have them diagnose that it needs the Vag-Com bleed. Then bring the paperwork back to the dealer and have them do it for free. Look up who the higher authority for the dealer would be and basically nag/threaten them until they do it for free. They are getting away with messing your car up with no consequences.


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## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/cars/absbleeding.html

So, according to Ross-Tech, cycling the pump isn't necessary unless it's gone totally dry. Would the pump go dry during a routine fluid change, or is it something that would have to be drained separately? The service adviser also stated that it was normal for the brake pedal to have some give after 26,000 miles on the original components. Like I said, it did feel better after I ran through the car wash. I think I will buy the TyrolSport brass bushings and take it to an independent shop in my area.


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## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

Bump, anyone?


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## Elwood (Aug 10, 2001)

Ross-Tech is correct. In my case, I was using a vacuum bleeder and accidently let the master cylinder go dry. That put air in it AND the ABS pump. If you are careful when bleeding the brakes and never let the MC go dry, you don't need to cycle the ABS pump.


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## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

Elwood said:


> Ross-Tech is correct. In my case, I was using a vacuum bleeder and accidently let the master cylinder go dry. That put air in it AND the ABS pump. If you are careful when bleeding the brakes and never let the MC go dry, you don't need to cycle the ABS pump.


Ok, thanks. I kind of figured that was the case, but wanted the dealer to check everything out anyway. They usually do flawless work, so I was surprised that there was initially an issue. I've heard that adding brass bushings makes the pedal feel much stiffer. Is this true? The dealer also said that my pads looked nearly new, which they do despite 26,000 on the car. Do you have any recommendations for replacement pads when I do have to change them out? I've heard a lot of good about Hawk products.


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## Elwood (Aug 10, 2001)

Hawk is the popular upgrade. I have a set sitting on the shelf in the garage waiting for install (I found them on sale). 

The bushings are this kit. People say it helps. I installed stainless brake lines and found it helped. 

There's no end of things you can spend money on.


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## derekjl (Jun 24, 2006)

Elwood said:


> There's no end of things you can spend money on.


That's getting to be my problem lol. I start doing research and find that there are so many options (pads, rotors, bushings, lines, etc...). I don't really want to spend $2500 on a larger Brembo brake kit, I don't drive the car enough and usually drive conservatively as it is. If I can prolong the life of what I currently have, I'll be willing to spend some extra money on some moderate updates (lines, better pads) when it comes time. Is there any real street benefit of upgrading from plain rotors to cross-drilled/slotted or just slotted ones?


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## Elwood (Aug 10, 2001)

derekjl said:


> Is there any real street benefit of upgrading from plain rotors to cross-drilled/slotted or just slotted ones?


Nope. If you tracked the car, maybe, but remember you're reducing the friction area by drilling holes or putting slots in a rotor. From a street perspective, I want as much friction area as possible in a panic stop situation. Most people buy them for bling.


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