# Car won't start after refueling



## WolfsburgTurbo (Mar 29, 2002)

Ok, so it's not that it doesn't start, but it hesitates and takes about 5 seconds of effort to get it going and then it runs really rough for about 5 minutes after I refuel. 
After that it's fine. I have zero problems getting it started any other time, unless I fill up. 
What the heck is causing this?









^^ That's true if you can help me solve this...


----------



## Andaloons (Apr 16, 2004)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (WolfsburgTurbo)*

A build of some sediment in your gas tank? Gets flushed around when you refill? 
Maybe.
...also, are you topping off your tank when you fill up?


_Modified by Andaloons at 8:30 PM 8-15-2008_


----------



## VWAUDITEK (Dec 26, 2006)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (Andaloons)*

When you fill up the car do you "top it off",and keep filling it even after the gas pump has 'clicked"?.....IF you do this you will put excess fuel into the tank and sone will get into the EVAP vapor hose and flood the car out.
Just quit over filling it and stop once the gas pump clicks once,and you should be OK,unless you damaged a one way-purge valve.


----------



## WolfsburgTurbo (Mar 29, 2002)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (VWAUDITEK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWAUDITEK* »_When you fill up the car do you "top it off",and keep filling it even after the gas pump has 'clicked"?.....IF you do this you will put excess fuel into the tank and sone will get into the EVAP vapor hose and flood the car out.
Just quit over filling it and stop once the gas pump clicks once,and you should be OK,unless you damaged a one way-purge valve.

I wonder if I damaged this "one way purge valve"? What would be involved in replacing it?


----------



## Golfmk3_18 (Sep 22, 2004)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (WolfsburgTurbo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *WolfsburgTurbo* »_
I wonder if I damaged this "one way purge valve"? What would be involved in replacing it?

was the car worked on recently? 2 inverted evap hoses cause this exact problem , and only when you fill up....the hose that should be going into the closed evap purge solenoid, is going to the open side and when you put fuel into your car you force your intake to fill up with gas vapors....I've seen this a few times on cars after intake gaskets were done or jobs of the sort and the tech inverted the 2 hoses without realizing it, since you only realize it once you go fill err up
EDIT: and no your purge valve wont be damaged by this


_Modified by Golfmk3_18 at 5:41 PM 8-15-2008_


----------



## sounrealx (Apr 4, 2007)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (Golfmk3_18)*

-do you use injector cleaner? 
-When was last oil change?
-what octane gas?
-last fuel filter change?


----------



## mirror (Dec 18, 2006)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (sounrealx)*

i would say you have some dirt in your tank. i would change the fuel filter, and see if it helps. sounds like when you fill up, you're stirring the crap around.


----------



## WolfsburgTurbo (Mar 29, 2002)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (sounrealx)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sounrealx* »_-do you use injector cleaner? 
-When was last oil change?
-what octane gas?
-last fuel filter change?

- I've never used injector cleaner.
- Last oil change was probably 3 or 4 months ago
- 93 octane (APR 93)
- I've never changed my fuel filter, but I will tomorrow. Hopefully that's all it is.


----------



## sounrealx (Apr 4, 2007)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (WolfsburgTurbo)*

good luck on it being the filter, and i suggest picking up some lucas injector cleaner, for 10$ you can treat 100 gallons, which works out to be the same as some of the *less expensive* cleaners.. give it a try. I give it a few oz's every oil change http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Chickenman35 (Jul 28, 2006)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (WolfsburgTurbo)*

N80 valve ( Evaporative Vacuum Purge Valve ) is likely leaking. Same thing happenned to my Audi. Wouldn't start after fueling. Car acts like it is fllooding.
What happens is that valve sticks open and when you refuel, all of the fuel vapors go into the Evap Canister ( Charcoal Canister ) . The N80 valve is located between the Evap Canister and the Intake manifold and is suppossed to be closed when the engine is off. When you start the engine, the N80 valve " cycles" ( that's the "clacking" or " clicking" sound you often here under the hood for a few minutes ) and the fumes are slowly sucked into the Intake Manifold at a controlled rate.
When the N80 valve fails, it usually sticks open. So all those gasoline fumes flow directly into your intake manifold when you fill up. Then car doesn't want to start and will run rough. After starting, a faulty N80 valve can alos cause a " mystery" vacuum leak and trip a long term lean fuel trim code.
Overfilling the gas tank is a no no on our cars. This can flood the Evaporative Canister and flush carbon particles into the N80 valve which causes it to stick open.










_Modified by Chickenman35 at 10:26 PM 8-16-2008_


----------



## Chickenman35 (Jul 28, 2006)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (Golfmk3_18)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Golfmk3_18* »_
Snip
EDIT: and no your purge valve wont be damaged by this

_Modified by Golfmk3_18 at 5:41 PM 8-15-2008_

Incorrect. Overfilling the fuel tank can definitely damage the N80 valve ( Evaporative Canistor Purge valve ). Well documented by VW/AUDI and all mfg's who use this type of valve ( BMW, Porshe, Volvo and Saab to name a few ). Thye all warn about fuel tank overfilling in their Technical Service Bulletins.
I pooched mine when I was yakking to a guy at the filling station and tank over filled. Instant death for the N80 valve. All sorts of carbon crap ran through it. Tried cleaning it but it didn't last. $58.59 for a new OEM Bosch unit from http://www.autohausaz.com
Part number: 0280142300


----------



## WolfsburgTurbo (Mar 29, 2002)

*Re: Car won't start after refueling (Chickenman35)*

Ok, this might sound like a really stupid question, but is that the same part that I would need for my 2001 1.8T AWW?
The last thing I need is to order the wrong part...


----------



## Canguro (Nov 10, 2017)

*Thanks!!*

After 9 years, your answer is still valid and correct, N80 was the cause of my cold start problems, changed the valve and my jetta is again a match!! Thanks a lot Chickenman35 I own you big time.


----------



## blurm (Jun 1, 2011)

Chickenman35 said:


> N80 valve ( Evaporative Vacuum Purge Valve ) is likely leaking. Same thing happenned to my Audi. Wouldn't start after fueling. Car acts like it is fllooding.
> What happens is that valve sticks open and when you refuel, all of the fuel vapors go into the Evap Canister ( Charcoal Canister ) . The N80 valve is located between the Evap Canister and the Intake manifold and is suppossed to be closed when the engine is off. When you start the engine, the N80 valve " cycles" ( that's the "clacking" or " clicking" sound you often here under the hood for a few minutes ) and the fumes are slowly sucked into the Intake Manifold at a controlled rate.
> When the N80 valve fails, it usually sticks open. So all those gasoline fumes flow directly into your intake manifold when you fill up. Then car doesn't want to start and will run rough. After starting, a faulty N80 valve can alos cause a " mystery" vacuum leak and trip a long term lean fuel trim code.
> Overfilling the gas tank is a no no on our cars. This can flood the Evaporative Canister and flush carbon particles into the N80 valve which causes it to stick open.
> ...


Chicken 

I am having trouble with the car the not starting after refueling. I pulled the N80 and hooked it to 12V and it was "clicking" and it was holding a vacuum. Should I replace anyways ? I am getting PO171 code and I am pretty certain I don't have a vacuum leak so this would suggest a mystery EVAP leak leak as you mentioned.

The other odd thing I noticed was the the " GAS CAP " error light came on the way down to the junk yard yesterday. I am trying to get this thing smogged with no luck because of the error codes. So frustrating. I will replace the gas cap but what I am really wondering is it possible for the N80 to work correctly some of the time and incorrectly after refueling ???

Any suggestions would be helpful.

Best Regards

Blurm


----------



## blurm (Jun 1, 2011)

WolfsburgTurbo said:


> Ok, this might sound like a really stupid question, but is that the same part that I would need for my 2001 1.8T AWW?
> The last thing I need is to order the wrong part...


Hi Wolfsburg,


I am having trouble with the car the not starting after refueling. I pulled the N80 and hooked it to 12V and it was "clicking" and it was holding a vacuum. Should I replace anyways ? I am getting PO171 code and I am pretty certain I don't have a vacuum leak so this would suggest a mystery EVAP leak leak as you mentioned.

The other odd thing I noticed was the the " GAS CAP " error light came on the way down to the junk yard yesterday. I am trying to get this thing smogged with no luck because of the error codes. So frustrating. I will replace the gas cap but what I am really wondering is it possible for the N80 to work correctly some of the time and incorrectly after refueling ???


What was your solution to the problem ? 

Any suggestions would be helpful.

Best Regards

Blurm


----------



## Chickenman35 (Jul 28, 2006)

Juts replace the N80 valve. Go for a new one. They are about $57 for genuine Bosch part from ECS and other online vendors. Charcoal particles get washed through it when they fail and they can damage the valve. Although it " Clicks ", sealing can be intermittent and they will sometimes stick open and sometimes stick closed.

You gas cap error is very likely the N80 valve sticking as it affects the whole Canister Evap system, which included the Gas cap . Your long term fuel trims will also go out of whack.

Edit: A damaged or sticking N80 valve will cause a problem after refueling because it will push raw fuel fumes directly into the Intake manifold. Even raw fuel. If you over fill the Fuel Tank even once, you can fill the Evap canister with fuel. Charcoal particles also go through the Evap vent, through the N80 valve and into the Intake manifold. When you fill up, the N80 valve does may be stuck open ( Roll of the dice ) and the Fuel Vapors pour into the Intake manifold flooding the engine.

In extreme cases you may have to replace the Evap Canister as well. Autocrossing or Track Days on a full tank can cause this issue as well. Fuel slosh from full tank, goes into Evap Canister. Found this out the hard way.. Now I Autocross with no more than 1/4 Tank... and I when I refuel I don't Top Off. haven't had a problem with the N80 valve since. Replaced them twice before I got smarter...


----------



## Chickenman35 (Jul 28, 2006)

If you need to get the car through emissions testing in a hurry, you can try and flush the old Valve with some Brake Cleaner. But you have to be able to open and close the valve electrically while you do that. 

Electricity, sparks and a flammable spray liquid are NOT a good combination. If you decide to do this, do it outside and have a* full Fire extinguisher ready *and wear appropriate safety gear.


----------



## DonkeOtee (Feb 13, 2021)

mirror said:


> *Re: Car won't start after refueling (sounrealx)*
> 
> i would say you have some dirt in your tank. i would change the fuel filter, and see if it helps. sounds like when you fill up, you're stirring the crap around.


💆‍♂️


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

What's with these first post mofo's and their useless replies to old and very old threads?

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## ronifresh (Jul 27, 2014)

Golfmk3_18 said:


> *Re: Car won't start after refueling (WolfsburgTurbo)*
> 
> 
> _Quote, originally posted by *WolfsburgTurbo* »_
> ...


Hi, can you show or explain the inverted hoses. I think i re installed them backwards and having this issue. Its an Mk5 gti. Thanks.


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

Wrong forum/platform

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------

