# 2.5 swap



## Spatzle (Sep 24, 2011)

I was at a used engine place yesterday, and they had a 2.5 with the manual for a $1000. So I got thinking is this a decent motor for swapping like the 1.8 that falls into place except the wiring like usual. The only guy I found swapping a 5 clyinder in a MKIII is doing awd, and a big turbo. Where I would do bolt-ons and a tune.

I figure this swap would run cheaper then a good 020 rebuild, and the mods I planned for the 8v for 160ish hp. Plus with a better 5 speed, and still a bit more power but mostly torque.

The golf/rabbit does fine with the 2.5. So I think it could be pretty killer in a MKIII becouse its roughly 700 pounds less.

I am bench racing right now becouse my job covers the house, but I want to hop my car up over time. So I want to decide on a path before I just go all over the map, and if the cost is decent enough just do it if my trans let's loose.

Besides it doesn't have a turbo, and I would have to get the immobilizer tuned out. Is there any other reason why it would more annoying then its worth? Say then a hopped up 2.0 8V like I mentioned above.

The plus's I see are 
Cheaper then a VR6 unless I find a great deal
Much cheeper then a 1.8.
Can keep the car I got so I can do things to my taste, and over time.
Power fairly close to both the VR and 1.8T, and with similar potential if the wallet can stay togather.
And lastly I am just an all motor type.


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## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

Completely mental wiring, 200amp relays, custom coding required...

Basically, unless you can do the swap yourself, you won't find very many people able to do the job correctly. It's incredibly difficult.


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## Spatzle (Sep 24, 2011)

I can mechanically do the physical swap in my sleep so I was't to worried unless the motor was bigger in someway than what I have read elsewhere. I have a welder and can fab pretty good, but I am more comfortable with muscle cars. Or anything that can be turned into one.

For the wiring would it be ideal to run 2 fuse boxes to keep in more bolt in. Or use the 2.5's fuse box, and splice my heart away?

When I would take on a project like this I will have my slammed F100 on the road, and idealy a work truck. So if it takes a bit more time it wouldn't be the end of the world.


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## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

It's more than the fusebox IIRC. All the new cars have interconnected systems, even the radio is connected to the ecu in some way . You'd need every single wire from the donor car, and then you'd need to find a company to disable the immobilizer, or you'd need the cluster, key, and everything connected to the ignition.

Nothing Leaves Stock in PA did a 2.5 swap into a Mk1, and they have said it was a nightmare to do. They're one of the best too .

It's not impossible, but if you take it on, it'll be a HUGE job.


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## Spatzle (Sep 24, 2011)

I have seen there work on VW forums, and I hear good things about there shop.

So it looks like a souped up 8V is probily going to be my path.

Atleast that way I have vast support behind me.


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## sauron18 (Apr 11, 2009)

Would be hard to swap the 2.5 in a mk4? I have a jetta 2.0 5 speed it needs a engine swap.


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## Spatzle (Sep 24, 2011)

You would be in the same spot I am at. MKIII and MKIV the engine computer was not wrapped into everyting else elecrically that is why the 1.8T is a good swap for us. Where as the MKV and later the whole car is interconected.

There is mega squirt if you don't live in a smog inspection state.

But I were you sell your car and buy a turbo or VR version if you want more power. Other wise rebuild the aeg.


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## nothing-leaves-stock (Mar 1, 2005)

thanks for the kind comments. we try our best. 

as for the swap... 
its not too terrible to FIT the 2.5L in a mk3.... but wiring? haha :banghead: 

a few tips... 

-you can bolt ANY 4 cylinder trans to the 2.5 with just shaving the top of the trans a bit to fit under the timing cover.. 
-front mount will bolt on the bottom starter thru bolt but NOT the top. but there is a thread bung in the 2.5L block, we cut off the top mouning hole and wleded and tab at a 90* to fit into that bung. 
-the trans will be stock mounting. 
-oem axles if trans mounting is still stock 
-rear pass/side mount will be custom. but if you can weld and make things...its possible. 
-if you want power steering and ac...find all the beetle 2.5L assy stuff(ps, alt, ac, tensioners etc) as the mk5 motors(most common...)do NOT have ps. and the belt setup is totally wierd 
-wiring... GOOD LUCK its terrible. we deleted and changed a ton. you can't "piggy back" the system either and if you want the cluster to work and pass emissions...you have a long road ahead of you and a TON of coding to delete or change in the ecu/can-bus system. IMO, this is why you don't see the swaps happening with oem harness and ecu. MOST are standalone. only ours and unix mk4 is oem ecu. in our mk1, we could delete a lot more then in a mk3/4. if i were doing it again i'd try and find a beetle 2.5L harness and ecu. it will be a BIT easier. but this was 100% the hardest swap we have done to date...because of the wiring. 

best of luck....let us know if we can help or do it for you  

ps, we have a complete swap here for sale too... ecu, harness, complete motor, cluster, pedal etc. $1500


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## sauron18 (Apr 11, 2009)

nothing-leaves-stock said:


> thanks for the kind comments. we try our best.
> 
> as for the swap...
> its not too terrible to FIT the 2.5L in a mk3.... but wiring? haha :banghead:
> ...


 Does the beetle 2.5 has everything integrated to the ecu? what is the difference? Those tips apply to the mk3 and mk4 right?


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## nothing-leaves-stock (Mar 1, 2005)

the beetle setup is closer to a mk4 wiring and ecu BUT it is NOT plug and play like a 1.8t to a 24v to a vr6 etc...theres still a ton of can-bus issues and ecu programing. the 2.5L is nothing like the rest of the mk4 setups


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## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

nothing-leaves-stock said:


> thanks for the kind comments. we try our best.
> 
> as for the swap...
> its not too terrible to FIT the 2.5L in a mk3.... but wiring? haha :banghead:
> ...


 Wow, good to know didn't know that piggy-backing off the OE stuff isn't really a viable option with these motors


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## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

Spatzle said:


> I can mechanically do the physical swap in my sleep so I was't to worried unless the motor was bigger in someway than what I have read elsewhere. I have a welder and can fab pretty good, but I am more comfortable with muscle cars. Or anything that can be turned into one.
> 
> For the wiring would it be ideal to run 2 fuse boxes to keep in more bolt in. Or use the 2.5's fuse box, and splice my heart away?
> 
> When I would take on a project like this I will have my slammed F100 on the road, and idealy a work truck. So if it takes a bit more time it wouldn't be the end of the world.


 What about going standalone with something simple like an SDS EM4?


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## Spatzle (Sep 24, 2011)

Bi anual smog inspections is why I can't do SEM. 

I have had enough run in with the smog people that I need to stay oem'ish


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