# Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again



## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

With frigid weather and shorter trips the past couple of weeks, excessive oil buildup in the air intake tube has reappeared in our 2002 EV. 
When we bought the van last summer, I discovered the vacuum line on the Crankcase Ventilation hose running from the valve cover to the back of the air intake tube was blocked, causing pressure to build in the crankcase to a point where oil was being forced up into the air intake and fouling the MAF sensor/filling the air filter with oil.
Replacing the vent hose fixed that problem....until now.
Since the symptoms are the same, I suspected a blockage in the vacuum hose/fitting on the crankcase vent hose and checked that. All is fine with it.
Next thought is the actual crankcase vent valve that the hose plugs into at the backside of the air intake tube is icing up/freezing closed, causing the same problem with excessive pressure and oil discharge into the air intake. (looking at the air intake tube, the only place oil can get into there is from the crankcase vent hose or the vacuum fitting on the front side that goes down to the air shroud around the fuel injectors at the front corner of the valve cover/cylinder head)
I tested the heaing element on the PCV valve per the bently instructions. It is getting the proper voltage from the van's electrical system (11.6 volts with ignition on but engine not running) BUT the heating element's resistance is 24ohms when Bently says it should be 7 to 12 ohms at room temp.
So, can anyone add insight on whether too high of an impedence in a heating element would cause it to not get hot (or hot enough) to keep the rubber valve from icing shut???
If so, I'll need to replace the entire air intake tube as the heating element/pcv valve are not removable from the tube








Cheers


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Too high of resistance creates heat in most cases, no?


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (CdnVWJunk-e)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CdnVWJunk-e* »_Too high of resistance creates heat in most cases, no?

I'm not sure. I think the amount of electrical current being supplied is important too. 
For those who are wondering what part I'm talking about, here's a pic with the Cranckase Vent valve and heater assembly that resides on the backside of the intake hose.








I don't suppose anyone else could pull the connector off of theirs and put an ohm meter on the two connector pins of the heating element to compare? 
Merry Christmas everyone!


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

I just ohm'd mine. It is ~45F ambient, and the item reads 15.4ohms.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: (rensho)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_I just ohm'd mine. It is ~45F ambient, and the item reads 15.4ohms.

Much appreciated,sir.








Looks like a new intake hose/pcv and heater assembly my be in order. 
I did a search of my normal sources for van parts and this seems to only be available through the dealer. I'll check salvage sources before ordering it from the dealer, though.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (Passat514)*

Is this it?
http://store.europarts-sd.com/....aspx


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## chendermi (May 20, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (CdnVWJunk-e)*

Ohm's Law says that I = V/R, where I is current, V is voltage and R is resistance.
So given a constant voltage, a lower resistance will give higher current (and more heat).


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

*Re: (Passat514)*

My intake hose is not free of oil either. Last time I cleaned it, there was maybe 1 teaspoon of oil in it.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (chendermi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chendermi* »_Ohm's Law says that I = V/R, where I is current, V is voltage and R is resistance.
So given a constant voltage, a lower resistance will give higher current (and more heat).


Thanks!
So, now that the temps are staying below freezing during the day, oil is running down the air inlet hose, past the MAF and into the airfilter to the point of dripping out the bottom of the airbox. Where is it coming from?
Here's a pic of the Crankcase Vent Valve and heater assembly-the ONLY entry point of oil into the air inlet hose and where I see oil entering the intake tract:








and a closeup of the valve itself. (The valve is the round rubber piece at the center of the opening. The black spokes keep it from allowing flow back into the crankcase vent hose and engine) 








I cannot tell if the heating element heats the actual rubber membrane or the outer edge where there are small oval pathways through the valve assembly that surrounds the rubber membrane.
My theory is that the small pathways around the rubber valve are freezing/getting clogged up. The pressure builds in the crankcase until it's enough to "pop" the rubber valve open and release the pressure--along with burping out a good amount of oil.
At least it's not letting pressure build to the point of blowing out main seals and valve cover gaskets like I see is happening to BMW owners in cold climates like Canada when their Crankcase Vent Valve freezes/gets gummed shut on their X5's with the V8 engine. My Audi tech friend also tells me the new 3.0 liter Audi engine pukes oil when it's below freezing and the driver takes short trips so the engine never burns off the water vapor that builds up inside the block.
A replacement Crankcase Vent Valve can only be obtained along with the entire inlet hose assembly from VW. List is $280.00!







1stVWParts.com shows it for $210.
Good luck finding one in a salvage yard! There just aren't many EV's with the 24v VR6 in boneyards. Everyone I called said they throw the intake hoses out.....except for VW/Audi specialist salvage yards!!!
Luckily, the 24v VR6 found in the 2002-2004 Jetta/Golf GTI used what appears to be the identical CCV valve.
So, I found one at a salvage yard specializing in VW for $40 and will cut it off of the Jetta's inlet hose and epoxy it onto the EV's Inlet hose.
Stay tuned.....


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

If that doesn't work ouit for you, try this:
http://sandiego.craigslist.org....html
I see in his pic that there's still an intake hose there so maybe he's still got that part.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (gti_matt)*

Thanks Matt! 
Always good to have a plan B (or is it plan C now?)


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

I have the exact same issue. My CEL is on indicating the valve is bad. Post back if this fixes the issue. Thx.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wilsonm73* »_I have the exact same issue. My CEL is on indicating the valve is bad. Post back if this fixes the issue. Thx. 

Will do. Just waiting for the donor inlet hose/ccv valve to arrive.

Are you getting an excessive amount of oil in your air intake hose too?


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Passat514* »_
Will do. Just waiting for the donor inlet hose/ccv valve to arrive.

Are you getting an excessive amount of oil in your air intake hose too?


Yes. I was checking the air and pollen filter when I noticed oil dripping out of the MAF so I took the whole intake apart to see what was going on. There was a lot of oil but your post and the others on here was really helpful. When ever it would drop below about 50 degrees I'd get a CEL for some valve that would go away when the temperature rose back up again. But with winter here its on consistently. I hadn't noticed the oil till now.


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: (rensho)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_My intake hose is not free of oil either. Last time I cleaned it, there was maybe 1 teaspoon of oil in it.

Mine had like 3-5 tblspn's.


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Any update? Mine is worse. I think it may be pumping oil into the cylinders through the in take and wrecking the cat. My engine is starting to get noisy like there's too much back pressure. I am going to the mechanic tomorrow for a look.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

I successfully grafted on the heated crankcase vent valve from the 01 Jetta 24v VR6 donor inlet hose. Alas, it did not solve the problem. Oil continues to contaminate the air cleaner element and dribble from the air box.
After much head scratching and discussion w/ VW mechanic friend, I removed the oil filler tube from the valve cover and found......
major SLUDGE buildup








I scooped enough sticky black tar out of the area below where the oil filler tube bolts on to make a ball the size of a golf ball!
We pulled the oil pan and cleaned the oil pump screen of its sludge/crap buildup and the rest of the goo out of the pan. 
Oil pressure seems fine-never had a low pressure warning light.
Severe oil buildup in the inlet hose only happens after sustained highway driving (30 min's or more at 65+mph).
Driving around town yields very minimal buildup.
Soooo, my theory is the oil drains in the cylinder head are clogged, causing oil to pool up around the camshafts and be "whipped" into enough aerosolized oil "spray" at the sustained 3k rpms that highway use brings. This all gets sucked into the intake via the Crankcase vent and falls out of suspension when it comes into contact with the cold air coming in from the airbox (it's been below 32 degrees for a month here). 
This all runs downhill to the air cleaner and fills the air filter and box to the point where it runs out the bottom drains and fouls the Mass Airflow Sensor








Auto RX is on order and I'm hoping that will free up the oil passageways from the head back down into the block.
That's my theory at least....


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

Short answer is, replacing the Crankcase Vent Valve did not solve the oil buildup in the airbox problem.
I did successfully graft the donor CCV onto the intake hose (broke the old one off and plastic welded the new one on. Got the new one off of a intake hose from a wrecked Jetta w/ a 24v VR6. It's the identical heated CCV assembly to our vans")
The oil discharge seems to only occur with extended highway driving (30+ minutes at 65 to 70mph). After 30 min's on the highway, the EPS and Traction Control warning lights illuminate and oil drains from the airbox when I stop the van. 
No excessive oil in the intake tube with city driving.
So, I pulled the oil filler tube and found major sludge buildup in the cylinder head! (sticky, tar like stuff)








It's never had a low oil pressure warning, but that was probably a matter of time. 
We pulled the oil pan and cleaned out the oil pump's pickup screen along with all of the sludge buildup on the bottom end.
I ordered some Auto RX and hope that will remove/reduce the sludge buildup.
I'm thinking that the oil drains in the head are pretty clogged, so the oil "pools" in the head around the cams at high engine speeds and isn't draining fast enough (like a slow drain in a sink). This is getting aerosolized by the cams whipping through it and the aerosolized oil gets sucked out of the head via the CCV tube, into the intake tube and falls out of suspension when it hits the COLD air stream coming in from the airbox.
Previous owner didn't chainge oil often enough or clogged up CCV hose we fixed after buying the van caused the sever sludging.
We'll see.....


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Strange, I am the original owner and have changed my oil on the money at 5000 miles like the OEM specifications with high quality oil for the entire life of the van. Mine goes to my mechanic tomorrow to have a looksy. I don't have time to do all the work you have just done right now. Thanks for the update. Let us know if clearing out the sludge makes any difference. 
Mine had a lot of oil after I drove it at 100-110mph for an hour to the airport and then 80mph on the way home. We were a little late to pick up my mother in-law at Frankfurt. It could be highway driving like you said. I would be a little disappointed if this engine had sludge since I have put only the best oil in it and changed oil and filter regularly. After I get it fixed we are going to sell ours. Its starting to have 3-5 issues a year and its not worth it to ship it back to the US this spring.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

I didn't take a photo of the bottom end when we had the pan off, but I'll grab a "before" pic of the timing chain area that's under the filler tube when I get the Auto RX. 
I want to see if that does anything and it's the easist way to see what's in there.
This engine isn't known for sludge in the Golf/Jetta iterations, but it's not mounted the same in those cars either.


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## mekramer001 (Jun 30, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

I had a sludge problem in my 2.8L Audi A4, discovered at 80K miles. Same as you, changed oil religiously using only approved full synthetic oils. Car was used mostly for short trips, under 5 miles. Had that creamy white waxy buildup people see on the colder areas of the valve covers, inside the PCV tubes and such.
Filled the engine completely with a kerosene type product and let it soak for a week. Removed spark plugs and turned it over by hand to avoid compression lock. Then cleaned the whole top end and everything I could reach from below after removing the oil pan. Everything seems to be staying much cleaner after switching to a semi-synthetic.
I read somewhere that semi-synthetics are actually better in situations where normal operating temps are not maintained long enough to heat everything up to the point that it doesn't condense in colder areas of the engine. Something about the additives used in full synthetics versus those used in dino oils.
If anyone can validate this or knows otherwise, I'm listening. For now, I'll stick to the semi-synthetics. Using Liqui-Moly semi-synthetic. Wilsonm73, ask your German mechanics what they think about all this.
_Modified by mekramer001 at 6:33 PM 1-18-2010_


_Modified by mekramer001 at 6:34 PM 1-18-2010_


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

out of curiosity, how many miles do you have on yours?
This is our second 2002 EV and the original one had 125k mi on it and never exhibited this problem. We bought that one at 56k miles and it only saw the proper synthetic.
This "new" one had 86k on it when we bought it in May and is now at 95k. It's had this issue since purchase but the problem went away over the summer after we replaced the crankcase breather hose (the little vacuum line was totally plugged and the hose broke in 2 pieces when I went to remove it)


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Passat514* »_out of curiosity, how many miles do you have on yours?
This is our second 2002 EV and the original one had 125k mi on it and never exhibited this problem. We bought that one at 56k miles and it only saw the proper synthetic.
This "new" one had 86k on it when we bought it in May and is now at 95k. It's had this issue since purchase but the problem went away over the summer after we replaced the crankcase breather hose (the little vacuum line was totally plugged and the hose broke in 2 pieces when I went to remove it)

111K miles with Mobil, Castrol, and occasionally a Penzoil Synthetic. I have been using Mann filters. I will have them check the breather hose, my guess is the breather hose was plugged on yours because of the sludge. My guy is pretty quick and should let me know in a day or two. Thanks for sharing what you've learned. 
One of my best friends bought a 2000 Caravelle VR6 12v and as he was driving it back from the dealer the oil light kept flashing. They checked the oil twice and it measure normally. Finally they stopped and called ADAC (like AAA only way better) the the mechanic said that there was probably sludge in the motor. Sure enough sludge had plugged any number of oil passage ways and ruined the head. The dealer wanted to due the repairs himself. Long story short it became the van from







It was a nightmare, after the engine rebuild they had to replace the trans and then the a/c compressor and never owned a VW again until I sold him my Jetta VR6. 
I guess I am seeing why VW spec's high quality oil for these. What's insane is my diesel passat is suppose to go 10k miles on an oil change, it always freaks me out a little. The oil for that costs 22 Euro a liter.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

Yeah, I think the extended oil change intervals that most manufacturers are going to is going to result in a lot of problems down the road for them. 
People just aren't going to use the right oil and most folks don't realize that their normal driving habits put them into the "severe" duty category. 
They'll just get the jiffy lube special every 5000 to 10000 miles and trade/turn their car in after 3 or 4 years.








Unfortunately, it'll be the next owner who'll pay the price








I've owned our '99 Passat 1.8t since new. Synthetic Castrol 5W40, Mobil 1 0W40, and the occasional Shell Rotella T 5W40 since 20k miles when I had the ECU "chipped". 
It now has 245k miles on it and compression is still within spec for a "new" engine. The difference is religious oil changes at 5k miles with the right oil and mostly highway driving of 10 miles or more distance before shutting it down. 
Sadly, all of the things that get us excited about the vehicle when it's new like powerful but fuel efficient engines end up as time bombs due to the realities of normal use for most drivers. Sadly, even concientous owners like you also get nailed.


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Its interesting here in Germany we rent MB Sprinters and Vito's all the time for my company. They have 30,000 km service interval. They also run like 6 liters of oil for a 2.3 liter. Many of the Porsche's also run huge amounts of oil. I helped one of my friends buy a VW Touran 2.0TDI which has a 30,000 km oil change and service from the factory but it only has 3.8 liters in the pan??








My Passat has about 240k miles on it. Its also been chipped and its driven on the autobahn at high rev's for its whole life. It uses about a liter and half over 10k miles of that 22 euro a liter VW spec 505 01 Castrol. The German's crank out some mileage on their diesels over here. I would bet that stop an go traffic is harder on the engine than constant highway driving.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

Please share what findings your mechanic arrives at. 
I'm wondering if adding some sort of deflector/shroud over the top of the cams/rocker arms would help reduce the amount of oil spray inside the head and the resulting mess it makes in the intake.
My 1.8t uses a baffle/cover over the cams underneath the actual valve cover to do just this. Maybe the newer VR6 motors have gone to the same thing?


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (wilsonm73)*

Well, the AutoRX arrived and I took a couple of pics before adding the AutoRX.
Here's what it looks like under the oil filler tube (this is after removing a good amount of "tar" by hand and fresh oil)
















I'll take a couple of pics after I drain the initial treatment of AutoRX in about 2k miles and again after the "rinse" phase (AutoRx says the rinse oil change is when the greatest difference in sludge/deposits will be noticed)


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## wilsonm73 (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Passat514* »_Please share what findings your mechanic arrives at. 
I'm wondering if adding some sort of deflector/shroud over the top of the cams/rocker arms would help reduce the amount of oil spray inside the head and the resulting mess it makes in the intake.
My 1.8t uses a baffle/cover over the cams underneath the actual valve cover to do just this. Maybe the newer VR6 motors have gone to the same thing?


I had my mechanic look over the car and he says there's no sludge in the engine and the PCV system is free and clear. He said it was normal for VW's to pump a little oil up into the intake in cold weather. He did replace two ball joints and do the 100k service. The CEL was from the charcoal evap system for the fuel tank. There must be some moisture in there and when it gets cold it freezes setting off the CEL. Maybe I am using too heavy an oil for the winter weather? Normally I run a 5 or 10W synthetic.


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## tornado (Apr 16, 1999)

Just had my 1st CEL appear today om my '02 EV...owner the van for 3.5 years. Just did a 1000 mile drive up the West coast to Vancouver. Been rainy for weeks but above freezing. Van is parked in underground spot.
I'm thinking maybe gas cap not holding pressure or maybe the charcoal canister. Any way to interrogate the ECU without a VAG-Com? My old Corrado VR^ used to be able to blink out the CEL codes...a bit fussy to do but it got you something to work on.
Cheers!
Mike.


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## pwschuh (Mar 4, 2009)

*Re: (tornado)*

Yes, to interrogate the ECU without VAG-Com you need a Scan Gauge or other OBD-II breakout box. Plenty of them on the market.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: (tornado)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tornado* »_Any way to interrogate the ECU without a VAG-Com? My old Corrado VR^ used to be able to blink out the CEL codes...a bit fussy to do but it got you something to work on.
Cheers!
Mike.


You can also go to your local Autozone, Advance AutoParts, Pep Boyz, etc... and they'll plug in their scan tool to read the code for you. No charge


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## triptronic (Apr 12, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

crazy sludge!


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (triptronic)*

AutoRX is in and I'm going to add an oil catch-can into the crankcase ventilation circuit in the hopes of removing the heavier oil vapors/condensation prior to them getting into the engine's air intake.
If you search the tech forum for the VR6 here on the Vortex, oil buildup in the air intake hose, MAF and throttle valve is a common issue. Looks like the catch can is the solution.
My hope is that de-sludging the engine/freeing up the oil drain pathways from the valve train area back down to the sump and adding the catch can will keep the oil fouling issue from occurring again.
I'll update this with how the catch can install goes...


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Update...
Catch can installed and accumulating oil/soup only when van is driven for 30+ minutes at highway speeds (3k rpms). Here's a pic (notice the "custom" bracket made from the battery holder off of our old Snapper lawn mower
















And...the "Soup" that accumulates
















The amount in the pan was after about 100 miles of mixed city/highway driving, including one 30+ minute drive on the highway.
The amount of accumulation in the catch can does seem to be decreasing as time progresses. It could be from the Auto-RX starting to do its thing OR because temps are getting warmer.
Stay tuned....


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## triptronic (Apr 12, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

wow that is weird! great update.


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## mekramer001 (Jun 30, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Interesting. The cold air intake to the filter air-box takes it air through a short snorkle that goes to the intake grill on the right fender.
The snorkel is "gasketed" to the intake grill area with a thick foam rubber pad that has a hole for the snorkel. If the foam pad is askew (like mine was from the factory) then the intake is partly blocked and the air intake pulls from the wet area behind the fender, and/or tries to pull air from the warm air intake. The (emissions related) warm air intake pulls air in from near the exhaust manifold down-pipe area.
Shine a flashlight into the fender intake grill and check that the snorkel isn't blocked by the foam gasket block.
Maybe totally off-base for your problem, but it's easy to check, anyway.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (triptronic)*

Update...
Just drained the AutoRX "clean" phase oil and replaced with 10w40 Castrol GTX for the "rinse" phase. Contact at AutoRX feels this will take 2 treatments to clear most sludge out.
The rate or oil accumulation in the catch can has slowed, but it still accumulates oil/froth when driving at highway speeds at a rate of a full can after 100 miles of continuous highway use (3k+ rpms).
Interestingly, we can go weeks of driving in the city and not accumulate a drop.
While changing the oil, I connected a mechanical oil pressure gauge to see if the oil discharge was due to a failed pressure releif valve in the oil pump. The valve is supposed to prevent oil pressure from rising above 7 bar. 
Oil pressure checked out OK. 2.2 bar at idle. 5 bar at 2k rpms and max of 6.4 bar at high rev's.
So, all indications are that the oil drains in the head are clogged with sludge, causing oil to pool around the cams at higher engine speeds.


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## gencode (Apr 14, 2010)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Passat514,
Im a littel confused, did you ever figure out how oil was getting into your air intake tube? Im having the same issue and ordred the entire replacement tube as that little propeller looking thing only comes part of the entire thing. But it appears that did not solve your issue.
I started my own thread here but really other than rings Im not getting an answer.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?&id=4848049
Can you help?


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (gencode)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gencode* »_
Im a littel confused, did you ever figure out how oil was getting into your air intake tube? Im having the same issue and ordred the entire replacement tube as that little propeller looking thing only comes part of the entire thing. But it appears that did not solve your issue.
I started my own thread here but really other than rings Im not getting an answer.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?&id=4848049
Can you help?

I wish I definitively knew the cause but I can only say what I've ruled out:
Too much oil pressure? No-mechanical oil pressure test checked out OK
Crankcase Vent Hose blocked/freezing at the heating element? No-oil accumulating in intake tube when ambient temps well above freezing. Plus, I replaced the heating element that is glued to the intake tube with no effect on the oil buildup.
Severe "Blow-by" at the piston rings? Not likely-tested compression and it's within VW spec for a "new" engine approximately 10k mi ago when problem first appeared.
At this point, I'm leaning towards the oil drains in the head being blocked by sludge causing oil to not drain from head fast enough during operation above 3k rpms. 
Sludge buildup in engine was very evident when I pulled the oil filler tube off of the valve cover and when I pulled the oil pan to check out the pump screen for blockage. I removed a lot of gooey sludge from the pan. 
The van's a daily driver for my wife, so pulling the motor and rebuilding is not a good option. 
I'm trying a couple of AutoRX treatments to see if that will remove enough sludge to avoid the severe buildup.


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## gencode (Apr 14, 2010)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Im not sure if you saw my thread but I am having the same issue. Yesterday I went to VW and they said its highly unlikely that its rings or you would see smoke at start up etc. Also there is oil inside the intake air tube, the oil would not go the reverse direction back up through the intake manifold from heads to the air intake tube (that makes sense). So that oil must be coming from the above the heads like under the valve cover, not below the heads like a gasket/rings. My car actually had TWO versions, like yours had that temp thing on the air intake, I ordered the entire air intake to get it but the guy at VW canceled it, he said no, it’s not that as you found out. He said the PCV in some of my cars is between the oil cap and the valve cover, you can just take it off, but my 2.0L has it Built “inside” the cover, I have to have the valve cover removed and have it cleaned or replaced if to bad, making sure I remove any sludge. He said that would most likely fix it. I was thinking is yours the same?
One more thing, my dip stick was all broken up, allowing air to get in, a big hole. He replaced that and actually it seems to have helped a lot, so far I have had no smoke over 80mph and no oil loss, sounds to good to be true, simple fix. But I’m not convinced yet, I’m gonna try it again this morning on the interstate ay 80mph. If it smokes I’m getting the valve cover/PCV cleaning and I think that will solve it.
Do you have a PCV between valve cover and oil cap or is it just a tall fat area under the oil cap like mine?


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (gencode)*

I did read your post and yes, you seem to be having the same issue, but with a 2.0.
According to the Bently manual, the 24v VR6 engine in our van does not use a "PCV valve" in the normal sense. It relies on a "Crankcase Ventilation System" which is a vent tube that runs from the upper left corner of the valve cover up to the air intake tube. On engines destined for cooler climates, there's a heating element in-line with the crankcase vent hose where it attaches to the air intake tube.
Bentley doesn't say a word about a PCV valve integrated in the valve cover and there's no picture for me to reference what the underside of the valve cover looks like. Frankly, it's entirely possible there's some sort of a valve under there but no one seems to know.








If the AutoRX doesn't help things, I'll be pulling off the valve cover and taking a look.
Good luck


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## gencode (Apr 14, 2010)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Yes, I know, I also have that heating element, I had the entire tube on order (200 bucks) when I went to check on it the VW guy stopped me and gave me all this info. Colder climite ones wont have the PCV on top of the vlave cover, you have to clean it from the inside he said. take it off and use carb cleaner he said, btw did yours ever puff smoke like mine?
Well day 2, and no oil loss. I had it up to 90mph and no smoke. drove about 150 miles. Basically yeah, these things seem sensitive, anything wrong, like extra air or not enough flow this will happen. If you cant find leaks or anything broke or holes like my dip stick shaft I’d take off the valve cover like he said and clean as much gunk as you can and the hoses. Make sure nothing is left open like my dipstick was or other vacuum leaks and nothing clogged. Clean the valve cover good under the oil cap where the hoses connect to with carburetor fluid (per the VW guy at Reeves).
Put it back and it just may work…should not take too long, one day at most, or have someone else do it. Cleaning is always good anyhow.
You know whats ironic, this car was purchased at Reeves in Tampa, its a Florida Car, but it has the "made for cold climit" design :-D


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## gencode (Apr 14, 2010)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (gencode)*

Oh one more thing, under the valve cover there will be (at least on mine) a large piece of plastic, this is an oil splash shield to prevent the oil from getting up into the tube, if that’s broken it can also make oil get up into the air tube. He said that big shield cover over all the rockers acts as an oil separator, Unless you have a outside oil separator, my bet is you don’t, you will probably have this plastic piece under the valve cover, make sure it’s not broken apart or anything or he said it can also make oil come up into the air tube.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (gencode)*

Thanks for the tip. I don't see any plastic baffle under the valve cover like you have on the 2.0 or on my 1.8t. The drawings don't indicate one is used on the vr6. Perhaps that is why all vr6 models have the reputation of depositing oil in the intake air tube-even when "new". 
I'll be taking the vc off and checking it out anyway after I'm finished with the "rinse" phase of the AutoRX treatment. 
Stay tuned...


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## gencode (Apr 14, 2010)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

The VW guy told me it was not in the diagram on mine, his screen showed 2 valve covers, one with and one without the pcv on top and mine, without it, you may go by the local vw parts dept and talk to them as I did.
You know your comment "closed crank case" words made me try something; I went outside and started my car. I took the dip stick out (engine sound changed noticeably) and then put my thumb over the dipstick hole, and it sure had a pretty good suction. I really am thinking my issue may be resolved, looks like it was the vacuum leak from the broken oil dip stick tube causing the valve air tube blow by. 
If you start, then take out your dip stick and put your thumb over it do you get a good vacuum? If not maybe you have a vacuum leak too causing the blow by on that heater thing. BTW, that heater thing seems to be rubber’ish.
If the vacume leake caused this on mine, as it seems to have, you may want to double check for one before you get into the valve cover. Do a smoke test maybe?
I dont want to jinx it saying its resolved on mine but so far several days and I’ve done a lot of 80 mph driving and my smoke and oil loss has not shown its ugly head. Today I cleaned the air tube real good with carb cleaner and I will check it in a few days to see if it’s still dry, I’m praying it is still dry in a week.


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

My 02 had a plastic channel with steel wool inside, inside the valve cover.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: (rensho)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_My 02 had a plastic channel with steel wool inside, inside the valve cover.

Did that channel separate the ccv connection on the valve cover from the open space under the vc? (ie, the ccv opening does not open directly to the valvetrain area)
I wonder if that steel wool could disappear over time due to rust/oxidation? If that's what is supposed to separate the liquid from the vapors in the ventilation system, its absence could cause high accumulation of oil in the intake air tube via the ccv hose.
I think it's time to pull the valve cover and inspect...


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: (rensho)*

Did the channel look like this?


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

Yes, it looked exactly like that.


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## mekramer001 (Jun 30, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

I carefully checked the entire air intake on my 2003 yesterday for any signs of oil or condensate mix. Nothing at all. It wasn't even misted with oil vapor, it was bone dry.
I thought again about the "black foam blocking the air snorkel in the fenderwell" issue. (see my previous response) If there is restricted air intake, (the same as a really dirty air filter would cause) that could cause a high vacuum condition in the intake under the cruise conditions you mentioned. If so, it could be pulling way too much vapor out of the engine.
Just a thought, and it's easy to check. The snorkel should be seen sticking through the foam block in the upper left of the area behind the fender intake slots. Use a flashlight since it's black on black in there! If you don't see the round snorkel tube and just see black foam, remove the airbox and reposition things.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (mekramer001)*

Thanks for the suggestion. I checked the airbox positioning and yes, the snorkel is extending through the foam surround in the fender as seen from the outside. Air filter was replaced 2 weeks ago and has no oil contamination since I installed the catch can. 
The amount of oil accumulating in the catch can seems to be dropping as the "rinse" phase of the AutoRX treatment continues.
I'll still remove the VC and take a look at the black plastic baffle/vent area when I get some time to take the thing apart.


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## mekramer001 (Jun 30, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

OK, snorkel not blocked by foam- that's good. When you have the valve cover off you can pour some oil in and see how well it drains. Usually the holes are pretty big, though, like 8 mm or so.
Do you still operate with the bottom pan and plastic engine cover in place? They help keep things uniformly hot in cold climes.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (mekramer001)*

Yep, upper engine cover has been in place up until I installed the oil catch can this spring. Belly pan is in place as well.


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## mekramer001 (Jun 30, 2004)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (Passat514)*

Another thought on this: 
The vacuum hose diagram is a little sketchy, and I could see how there could be an incorrect connection made during service or replacement of a hose. As you are not the original owner, this might be the case and you would not be aware.
Is there a photo or some way you could sketch your connections so I can compare them to mine?
There are a few different vacuum connection points that could affect this situation without otherwise causing noticeable performance issues.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Excessive oil in Air Intake Tube....Again (mekramer001)*

Hadn't thought of that. I'll consult my Bentley CD's diagram and verify how things are connected. Thanks.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

Well, I finally got around to pulling the valve cover off to see what is causing oil to get sucked up the crankcase vent hose and into the intake tube. Here's what I was greeted by...
































:banghead:

Keep in mind that we've had the van for the past 15k miles and during that time, it's seen oil changes every 3k miles with synthetic 5W40 except for during the 2 rounds of Auto-RX. Did the original owner EVER change the oil during the first 86k miles???

SO, I went to work with my shop-vac and various small screwdrivers to get into the small spaces between the rocker arms and drains. 

The pathway from the far left of the valve area to the drain was completely blocked by sludge (directly under where the crankcase vent is on the valve cover. Lord only knows how the variable valve timing is still operable, given the sludge covering everything on the timing chain end!

I've managed to remove all of the heavy/chunky deposits but want some advice before I close her up. 

Is there a solution that is safe to pour over the valve area to "flush" any bits of sludge down into the oil pan and out the drain??? I'm worried about clogging up the oil pump's intake screen with bits-o-sludge.

Thanks in advance.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

Sorry, we'll try to correctly insert the pic's this time.











and 












and the passenger side of the head....


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)




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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Lunch break update*

Update: 

Got the valve cover cleaned, including removing the plastic baffle (see previous post pic valve cover underside) and cleaning it out. 

Looks like the purpose of this plastic baffle is to provide a space and medium (stainless steel mesh that is packed inside the space) to allow liquids (oil) to fall out of suspension in the air being sucked out of the engine by the Crankcase Vent hose mechanism. 

If you look at the previous pic of a clean valve cover and baffle, you can see the small holes in the underside of the black plastic baffle. Presumably, those would allow oil / liquids to drain back into the cylinder head after they condense in the stainless steel mesh. Well, when it's completely plugged up with sludge and the drains are plugged, the liquid oil has nowhere to go but up the crankcase vent and into the engine's air intake.

Combine that with blocked oil pathways in the head where oil could not flow easily down to the drain that is located at the lower left corner of the head (facing it from the vehicle's front) and I'm pretty sure I've found the cause of our troubles.

Finished vacuuming out the sludge chunks and anything that looks like it could flow down into the oil pan/get sucked up into the oil pump and clog the pickup screen.

Now, for reassembly and.....:beer::beer::beer::beer:


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

*Update -cleaned and running*

Here are some "after" pic's of the valve area following vacuuming of as much sludge as I could get with a small hose rigged up to my shop-vac.










and the drain area...










Interesting note, the van seems to accelerate and shift noticably smoother now. Have not experienced the jolting upshift to second under light throttle. Makes me think there's some tie-in with the variable valve timing / ECU and the TCU??

Anyway, I'll update as it gets colder to advise if oil deposits in the intake air tube continue or not.

:beer:


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## dubbinit (Jun 17, 2005)

Any update on this? I just found some oil in my intake, was replacing my air filter & cleaning MAF. Quite a bit of oil in tube. 2nd owner since 45k. Religiously changed the oil every 5k w/synthetic. 1st owner had some records. Hopefully engine does not have sludge build up.


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## Passat514 (Apr 1, 2005)

After 1500 miles, the air intake hose/mass airflow sensor/air filter have remained oil-free. Driving during this time included a couple of 2+ hour long highway drives. 

Prior to removing the valve cover and cleaning out the sludge blocking the path to the oil drain in the head, it would be puking oil into the air intake after 30 minutes on the highway, so this is a major improvement. 

Given the design, I think its normal to have a small amount of oil accumulate in the "accordian" section of the air intake hose due to condensation. 

If you have enough oil building up that it is draining down the intake, past the mass airflow sensor and into the air filter, you likely have the same problem I did. If oil isn't getting into the air filter or building up on the throttle valve, I wouldn't worry about it. Just clean the oil out of the intake tube every oil change


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## ShelSilver (Jul 20, 2013)

I've had a slow oil drip on the garage floor and the engine light came on with code P0171. I popped the hood and found oil all around the area of the mass air flow sensor. I found this thread and decided to check the PCV valve at the top of the intake manifold.

This is what mine looks like:









I cleaned it as best I could, but this post paints a pretty clear picture that I should replace the entire manifold $300 at Europarts

What else should I replace or be worried about?


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## KBATTPO (Jan 15, 2001)

Pull the little L-shaped plastic elbow (see the attached picture) and check its orifice. Mine was blocked solid with gunk. Cleaned up this elbow and replaced the thin rubber hose for a good measure - no more oil in the MAF pipe.


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