# 3.6L VR6 Swap info needed



## give_it_to_dem (Jan 28, 2005)

Hi All,

I'm collecting parts to swap a 3.6L from a 06 Passat into my Mk4 AWD Jetta but having a hard time finding info about the swap.

So far, i know UM has a "Swap File" for this motor which takes care of the immobilizer, *i plan on running FSI* so i also have the fuel pump control module (part# 3C0906093C) but not sure if this would work with my R32 intank or do i need the one from the Passat 4Motion. UM pulled and used all wiring from a passat for the swap they did so they are not sure.

What i need to know is if this will work with my MK4 fuse box and cluster...

Parts i have so far:

Complete Long block
Engine Harness
ECU
Fuel Pump Control Module

Here's a few pictures...


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## SilverTrek12v (Dec 28, 2005)

Yes it will work with the mk4 fuse box and cluster. 
Yes it will work with your current fuel pump. 
You need a mk5 fsi electric gas pedal or the passat one. 
You need the gas filter from mk5 gti (6.4bar) ,like that u convert to only a feed gas line to the engine. 
You need the swap file by UM or UNi. 
You need a 24v acc braket for alternator/ power steering pump. 
You need the fuel pump module for best fuel economy 

Most important u need the second harness that goes to the ecu, unfortunatly that harness is one piece with the chassis harness, on that harness u can cut it at the firewall or cut it after the gas pedal. so you'd have it from ecu to firewall or gas pedal. Send me that harness and i can make u a plug&play harness. IM me for more details. 

Here's 2 of our swaps


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## give_it_to_dem (Jan 28, 2005)

Sounds like i'm almost there.... 

I'll start the hunt for: 

Mk5 fsi electric gas pedal or the passat 
MK5 GTI Fuel Filter 
Chassis Harness. 

Thank you VERY much for the info!!!


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## Corrado4Life (Jul 3, 2001)

I'm doing this swap into my Corrado right now. Does anyone know if I need A custom header or downpipe?


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## give_it_to_dem (Jan 28, 2005)

If you already have the manifolds then you need to get a DP made, if you don't, you can get them off eBay or have headers made which would cost about $1300-$1700.


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## Corrado4Life (Jul 3, 2001)

Thanks for the info.


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## vwmaniac16vr6 (Nov 17, 2004)

when you get to the wiring let me know, i have the wiring diagrams and get help you with that.


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## CorrieG60 (Jan 18, 2004)

Care to post that online? Might be helpful for other people with the intention of installing a 3.6 into their car..:thumbup:


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## give_it_to_dem (Jan 28, 2005)

^^Agreed^^

Thanks for reaching out dude! I'm still having a hard time finding the chassis harness. Most places don't keep them.


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## PinoyVR6 (May 24, 2003)

SilverTrek12v said:


> Yes it will work with the mk4 fuse box and cluster.
> Yes it will work with your current fuel pump.
> You need a mk5 fsi electric gas pedal or the passat one.
> You need the gas filter from mk5 gti (6.4bar) ,like that u convert to only a feed gas line to the engine.
> ...


the porsche intake manifold is bad a$$


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## vwmaniac16vr6 (Nov 17, 2004)

i will see if i can make a screen shot catalog as my wire harness diagrams are from all-data which uses the bently as there VW/Audi information resource. So since its part of a much larger program its more involved then just posting the diagrams. Its supposed to snow here tomorrow so if it does and im not busy i'll take the time to screen shot all of them and post them in here or email to Khudee and he can post them.


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## give_it_to_dem (Jan 28, 2005)

vwmaniac16vr6 said:


> i will see if i can make a screen shot catalog as my wire harness diagrams are from all-data which uses the bently as there VW/Audi information resource. So since its part of a much larger program its more involved then just posting the diagrams. Its supposed to snow here tomorrow so if it does and im not busy i'll take the time to screen shot all of them and post them in here or email to Khudee and he can post them.


:thumbup::thumbup:


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## Corrado4Life (Jul 3, 2001)

*Data Bus On Board Diagnostic*

Do we need the Data Bus On Board Diagnostic interface J533 as well?


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## give_it_to_dem (Jan 28, 2005)

Corrado4Life said:


> Do we need the Data Bus On Board Diagnostic interface J533 as well?


What's that for?


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## Corrado4Life (Jul 3, 2001)

It's function is to communicate between all of the different modules in the car. I'm just not sure if you need it... I have all of the diagrams, I just need to know if I need any other control modules besides the ECM.


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## Corrado4Life (Jul 3, 2001)

Someone has to know the answer. Are there other Control Modules needed for this swap?


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## Jo|\| (Jul 3, 2011)

vwmaniac16vr6 said:


> i will see if i can make a screen shot catalog as my wire harness diagrams are from all-data which uses the bently as there VW/Audi information resource. So since its part of a much larger program its more involved then just posting the diagrams. Its supposed to snow here tomorrow so if it does and im not busy i'll take the time to screen shot all of them and post them in here or email to Khudee and he can post them.


Any progress on the screenshots? I would really like to see the whats needed before buying anything.


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## zamergli (Apr 18, 2010)

guys will be helpfull please if some one here can hel pm e to this is what i have so far, 

full touareg engine 3.6 fsi code BHK 
engine harness 
ecu 

but my big problems are the next 

my car its a 86 gti original 1.8 8v but my friend swap a vr6 24v 2.8 from a gli 
so the car is not finish but i get a good deal on the touareg engine and i can not believe how many miles this engine have when i get it ( 5 MILES):laugh: 


so the other problem its 

ECU immo 
ecu interior harness 


SO PLEASE IF SOME ONE HAVE OR ITS SELLING THE HARNESS AND SOME ONE CAN HELP ME PREFERED LOCAL OR IN CANADA WILL BE HELPFUL BC THE ONLY GUYS I FUND TO HELP ME BUT CHARGE ALLOT ARE IN POLAND AND THEY WANT ALMOST 700 DOLLARS FOR THE SERVICE


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## Slapbladder (Feb 1, 2006)

No it will NOT work with the current pump....the R32 pump will burn out as the fuel pump controller pulses the pump which burns out the brushes. You need an FSI fuel pump in tank to work correctly.


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## Manaury (Jan 28, 2015)

*will the 3.6 vr would fit on the 3.2 vr transmission on my golf r32 2004?*

the reason i am asking because i would like to upgraded the engine but i dnt want to use dsg transmission just regular manual stick shift from my 2004 r32.......is it possible ?.....there both vr6.....or how can it be done?


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## d-bot (Sep 6, 2004)

As long as it is a 6 cyl transmission nothing else has to change.


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## Rapid Decompression (Dec 5, 2004)

I would love to see one of these boosted


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## un1ko (Apr 6, 2004)

Subscribed! I might consider doing this swap on my B5 S4. Gathering info :beer:


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## graeme86 (Jun 27, 2003)

Slapbladder said:


> No it will NOT work with the current pump....the R32 pump will burn out as the fuel pump controller pulses the pump which burns out the brushes. You need an FSI fuel pump in tank to work correctly.


Hi Slap. I recall you used an uprated RS4 pump or something similar due to your forced induction.

If one was just replacing the pump for a "stock" conversion, does a particular FSI stock pump fit into the R32 tank without modification?

Also the fuel pump control module (part# 3C0906093C) mentioned by OP is the one you used as well?

Graeme


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## magics5rip (Mar 17, 2004)

un1ko said:


> Subscribed! I might consider doing this swap on my B5 S4. Gathering info :beer:


I was thinking of a similar swap into a facelift A4. However, an S4 is the better candidate since it has a 6 spd tranny. Swapping the 6spd into the A4 isn't cheap since you need the rear end and all 4 axles as well...(you can get away with 2 axles if you swap the rear axle cups)

My initial question is: will the 6spd from the S4 bolt up to the 3.6 directly or is an adapter plate needed? If a lot of the similar issues exist here as they do for the 2.8 VR swap then it is probably not worth the effort. However, since this motor was available in the B6 Passat 4Motion there is hope that it is a little less dependent on the specialty parts from 034...

EDIT: From what I read, VR6 trans bolt patterns are all the same so the adapter plate is necessary for the 3.6 swap which would mean all the other specialty parts are necessary.


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## un1ko (Apr 6, 2004)

magics5rip said:


> I was thinking of a similar swap into a facelift A4. However, an S4 is the better candidate since it has a 6 spd tranny. Swapping the 6spd into the A4 isn't cheap since you need the rear end and all 4 axles as well...(you can get away with 2 axles if you swap the rear axle cups)
> 
> My initial question is: will the 6spd from the S4 bolt up to the 3.6 directly or is an adapter plate needed? If a lot of the similar issues exist here as they do for the 2.8 VR swap then it is probably not worth the effort. However, since this motor was available in the B6 Passat 4Motion there is hope that it is a little less dependent on the specialty parts from 034...
> 
> EDIT: From what I read, VR6 trans bolt patterns are all the same so the adapter plate is necessary for the 3.6 swap which would mean all the other specialty parts are necessary.



It depends what A4 you have, if it's the 2.8 then the transmission should be ok. If it's the 1.8t, then the cheapest way is to get the 2.8 trans. If you're plan is to leave it stock. You do need an adapter plate, but you can get it from a Touareg. 

I'm trying to see if I can use a OEM starter, instead of buying 034s.


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## magics5rip (Mar 17, 2004)

un1ko said:


> It depends what A4 you have, if it's the 2.8 then the transmission should be ok. If it's the 1.8t, then the cheapest way is to get the 2.8 trans. If you're plan is to leave it stock. You do need an adapter plate, but you can get it from a Touareg.
> 
> I'm trying to see if I can use a OEM starter, instead of buying 034s.


I was considering swapping over to a B6 30V 01e transmission but comparing the Speed/RPM of the gearing there isn't much a benefit to be had. the 2.8 5spd would be the lowest cost solution for sure.


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

Bump for any more info on the wiring.

I'm slowly mapping out the MED9.1 wiring to the stock MK4 wiring. Is there any difference in the CANBus, or can I just tie into the existing CANBus lines on the MK4? Is anyone willing to share wiring diagrams on this swap? Or am I on my own for this? I currently have a 2006 Passat 3.6 ECU / engine harness / chassis harness coming my way. I was going to attempt to make a plug and pray harness with a old ME7.x harness I have laying around.


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## un1ko (Apr 6, 2004)

magics5rip said:


> I was considering swapping over to a B6 30V 01e transmission but comparing the Speed/RPM of the gearing there isn't much a benefit to be had. the 2.8 5spd would be the lowest cost solution for sure.


The B6 30V 01e transmission is actually a good option, I was thinking in swapping mine for that one. If you are looking to run a stock VR the 2.8 01A trans would be fine. You can always change it down the road.





dorkage said:


> Bump for any more info on the wiring.
> 
> I'm slowly mapping out the MED9.1 wiring to the stock MK4 wiring. Is there any difference in the CANBus, or can I just tie into the existing CANBus lines on the MK4? Is anyone willing to share wiring diagrams on this swap? Or am I on my own for this? I currently have a 2006 Passat 3.6 ECU / engine harness / chassis harness coming my way. I was going to attempt to make a plug and pray harness with a old ME7.x harness I have laying around.


Using the MED9.1 is a whole different ball game. Just an idea... why don't you use the wiring from an R32 from a MK4? Ditch the FSI. I think you just have to plug the extra holes and you're set. There's a post of someone doing this. It'd be easier to tune, since more ppl have experience tuning ME7. This is just an idea and that's the route I'm thinking in taking when I start my project or maybe just use standalone, not sure yet.


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

un1ko said:


> Using the MED9.1 is a whole different ball game. Just an idea... why don't you use the wiring from an R32 from a MK4? Ditch the FSI. I think you just have to plug the extra holes and you're set. There's a post of someone doing this. It'd be easier to tune, since more ppl have experience tuning ME7. This is just an idea and that's the route I'm thinking in taking when I start my project or maybe just use standalone, not sure yet.


The consensus in this thread I made seems to be the opposite. You can get MED9.1 working like stock in a MK4, but you can't get ME7 running well the 3.6 with it's original cam adjusters.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?7141473-CDBV-vs-BLV-differences


The I think I have about 80% of the wiring sorted out. We'll see when my chassis harness arrives and I actually dig into it. The biggest issue is the tuning, and I think cruise control. It looks like ME7 and MK4s use discrete wires, whereas MED9.1 seems to only have one single wire. The other issue might be clutch vacuum vent wire. B6 with a 3.6FSI never had a manual, but the Touareg did, and it used the same ECU, but with a different revision letter, so that might allow a clutch pedal to be correctly connected. 

I have about 50 of the wires from the T94 connector sorted out, as far as I can tell, once I sort it a bit better I will post it on here and let other people look over it and see if I goofed up.


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## magics5rip (Mar 17, 2004)

un1ko said:


> The B6 30V 01e transmission is actually a good option, I was thinking in swapping mine for that one. If you are looking to run a stock VR the 2.8 01A trans would be fine. You can always change it down the road.


The only thing I like a little more about the S4 01e is the taller 6th gear for highway driving. Its mostly me just being nit picky and wanting to think through every part of the build since I'd want it to be a daily driver as well. 

Just for kicks, here are some speed/rpm tables for each trans:

B5 S4 01E Gear Ratios

B6 A4 30V 01E Gear Ratios

At the end of the day, the taller S4 6th gear only nets a 200rpm difference at 70mph. 30V 01E swap does make a good bit of sense if you don't want to pay the S4 tax :thumbup:


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

double post


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## un1ko (Apr 6, 2004)

dorkage said:


> The consensus in this thread I made seems to be the opposite. You can get MED9.1 working like stock in a MK4, but you can't get ME7 running well the 3.6 with it's original cam adjusters.
> 
> http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?7141473-CDBV-vs-BLV-differences
> 
> ...


It seems like you're doing your home work. Yeah tuning is going to be tough and that what I meant... I've heard that tuning a MED9.1 is more complex, and not sure how many ppl are out there that can do that. That's why I mentioned going with than older wiring, but it seems that yours stuff figured out. I never knew that the Touareg came in manual, that's great info! Working on the wiring is crazy work. My swap was a pain! I have an 2001 Audi S4 and I put a 2.0T stroker with an A4 2001 wiring harness and ECU. Ppl think oh it's the same body it's an easy swap, plug and play. That was not the case. So I know your pain and I know how hard it is to find info. 




magics5rip said:


> The only thing I like a little more about the S4 01e is the taller 6th gear for highway driving. Its mostly me just being nit picky and wanting to think through every part of the build since I'd want it to be a daily driver as well.
> 
> Just for kicks, here are some speed/rpm tables for each trans:
> 
> ...


Great info! You know what you want. As for me I'm on the fence. If I should do the 3.6 swap on my S4 or get an Audi B6 or B7 and do the swap. My son wants my car, so I was thinking in just putting a stock 1.8T and give it to him (since all the wiring is already there). He's only 15, so I don't want his car to be fast. I want him to learn how to drive first and then help him mod his own car.


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## graeme86 (Jun 27, 2003)

On another thread someone mentioned that the water hose from radiator joins the crackpipe at a different spot,s o a stock MkIV hose does not fit properly.

Is there an OEM replacement off another model that joins everything up nicely again? (presumably the 3.6 upper hose may be the best substitute?)


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

graeme86 said:


> On another thread someone mentioned that the water hose from radiator joins the crackpipe at a different spot,s o a stock MkIV hose does not fit properly.
> 
> Is there an OEM replacement off another model that joins everything up nicely again? (presumably the 3.6 upper hose may be the best substitute?)


I mentioned it in the .:R thread, I will find out in the next week or so since we are in the middle of the swap right now.


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## magics5rip (Mar 17, 2004)

Anyone have external measurements for the 3.6 block? I'm curious to the size of the block vs the 2.8 VR. Some literature says the external dimensions did not change thanks to the piston offset and angle change; I'd like to know how much truth there is to that statement with actual numbers.

Thanks!


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

magics5rip said:


> Anyone have external measurements for the 3.6 block? I'm curious to the size of the block vs the 2.8 VR. Some literature says the external dimensions did not change thanks to the piston offset and angle change; I'd like to know how much truth there is to that statement with actual numbers.
> 
> Thanks!


Bolts in identical to any other VR6. It even has the bosses for the MK2/3 mounts.


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## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

So what if someone were to drop one of these into an a1 chassis? Would the fuel pumps be able to keep up?


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## homerunmanjb (Apr 27, 2013)

*Part numbers*

Would you happen to know the part numbers for all the parts that you listed that are needed for the swap? I currently have a r32 swapped with the 3.6L engine but it isn't running the FSI and I'd like to get around to doing that. Thanks!




SilverTrek12v said:


> Yes it will work with the mk4 fuse box and cluster.
> Yes it will work with your current fuel pump.
> You need a mk5 fsi electric gas pedal or the passat one.
> You need the gas filter from mk5 gti (6.4bar) ,like that u convert to only a feed gas line to the engine.
> ...


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

Let's start with which FSI parts you have. How are you running it without FSI? 3.2 cylinder head on a 3.6 block? Or do you have a custom intake manifold?


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## homerunmanjb (Apr 27, 2013)

Sorry, I didn't realize someone had gotten back to me so quickly haha. It has a custom intake manifold. It looks like a usual short runner intake. It's $helby's old car as I found out after doing some searching about the car in general. I just asked him what parts it does have and what else it needs to complete the FSI so I'm waiting to hear back on that. But i know it's running on a c2 tune for the old 3.2 motor and i'm guessing it has the engine harness but other than that, i'm not totally certain until he gets back to me on it. 




dorkage said:


> Let's start with which FSI parts you have. How are you running it without FSI? 3.2 cylinder head on a 3.6 block? Or do you have a custom intake manifold?


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

homerunmanjb said:


> Sorry, I didn't realize someone had gotten back to me so quickly haha. It has a custom intake manifold. It looks like a usual short runner intake. It's $helby's old car as I found out after doing some searching about the car in general. I just asked him what parts it does have and what else it needs to complete the FSI so I'm waiting to hear back on that. But i know it's running on a c2 tune for the old 3.2 motor and i'm guessing it has the engine harness but other than that, i'm not totally certain until he gets back to me on it.


I just finished the FSI swap in my MK4. The ECU still needs to get tuned(16 codes right now all for non existent things.), but the wiring was quite simple. You need a spare MK4 engine wiring harness, the part the plugs into the cowling plus, and the whole B6 3.6 Passat car harness. 

You'll need:
B6/3C 3.6 harness
3.6 FSI ECU MED9.1
FPCM to control the fuel pressure in the returnless fuel system.
FSI Accelerator (I haven't gotten my MK4 one to work, but I'm not giving up yet!)
O2 sensors from the 3.6.
Intake and exhaust manifolds, but I guess you have the exhaust sorted out.

I can't remember what else off the top of my head.

I'll have a wiring write up by the end of the year, hopefully sooner.


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## homerunmanjb (Apr 27, 2013)

Oh ok. Well $helby got back to me and said "it's on all of the 3.2 wiring/ecu, pedal, throttle body, and injectors. other than what you're getting you'll need the throttle body, intake manifold, high pressure fuel pump, and fuel lines. last i looked you could find most of it on eBay pretty easily."

Luckily the car runs without this stuff so I'll buy the parts as I have the means to do so. The only part that'll suck is putting it all in, hoping it works haha. From my searching, I haven't really been able to find a DIY/true build thread for this swap. Just people asking the same thing haha. 



dorkage said:


> I just finished the FSI swap in my MK4. The ECU still needs to get tuned(16 codes right now all for non existent things.), but the wiring was quite simple. You need a spare MK4 engine wiring harness, the part the plugs into the cowling plus, and the whole B6 3.6 Passat car harness.
> 
> You'll need:
> B6/3C 3.6 harness
> ...


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## Axeln (Jun 20, 2014)

d-bot said:


> As long as it is a 6 cyl transmission nothing else has to change.


So can you bolt on any 3.6 block to any mk3/mk4 vr tranny? Let's line up some ground zero chassis: *MK3 VR6 12v FWD*, *MK3 2.9 Syncro*, *MK4 2.3 VR5 FWD, 4Motion* and *MK4 2.8 VR6 FWD and 4Motion*. 

The Cayenne, Touareg and Q7 have the 3.6 longitudinally mounted.
The Passat, CC and Skoda Superb have it transverse mounted.

Can someone pair these up depending of which solutions bolt right up, which ones need an adaptor plate and the no-go ones?

e.g. The Passat CC 4Motion 3.6 block bolts right up to a MK4 2.8 4Motion tranny.


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## dorkage (Jul 7, 2009)

Axeln said:


> So can you bolt on any 3.6 block to any mk3/mk4 vr tranny? Let's line up some ground zero chassis: *MK3 VR6 12v FWD*, *MK3 2.9 Syncro*, *MK4 2.3 VR5 FWD, 4Motion* and *MK4 2.8 VR6 FWD and 4Motion*.
> 
> The Cayenne, Touareg and Q7 have the 3.6 longitudinally mounted.
> The Passat, CC and Skoda Superb have it transverse mounted.
> ...


If it came with a VR, it will fit. You might have some issues with the accessory bracket and coolant lines, as I am having right now, but it has all the bosses for all the old motor mounts. Getting it into place is the easiest part of the swap.


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## itschrisb (Jun 7, 2007)

Is there a full breakdown of parts needed to do this swap? Is it easier sourcing a full parts car or to piece everything together? Im planning on doing it in a mk2 so i know some stuff will be different but all the mechanical stuff will be the same.

Thanks


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## corrado3000 (Sep 3, 2008)

Sooo I have a passast that i can use to remove all that is needed, any info on harness wiring and type of fuel pump suggested would be great


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## Quzminskas (Feb 1, 2017)

*3.6 swap hellp*

Hello I see you did few projects with 3.6 engine I'm stuck with ecu wiring . Anny chance you can help me with that? I plan to fit 2013 passat 3.6 fsi engine in my corrado g60. I have everything engine, engine loom, gas pedal, fuel module, air box. Corrado VR6 K subframe, cross member, special gearbox bracket for 02m gearbox. So I'm stuck with wiring thanks for Anny help.


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