# Chipping the 2.5?



## The Critic (Oct 12, 2006)

Do chips exist for the 2.5? Any word on potential manufacturers of chips?


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## Yevi (Dec 7, 2005)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (SodaGuy)*

not likely, there are chip manufacturers but increases are under 10 hp, becuase it's an inline engine
Yev


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## the.ronin (Feb 22, 2006)

Try +8hp for $300 ... although someone brought up a good point that you would get just as much if not less for a CAI costing just as much.
Although I'm curious as to what a CAI, exhaust and the Neuspeed chip from Greedspeed would generate together.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (SodaGuy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SodaGuy* »_Do chips exist for the 2.5? Any word on potential manufacturers of chips?

the only ones i know of are ABD and Upsolute.
Personally i'm waiting for GIAC to come out with one. Hopefully they come through


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*

a chip for our engines wont do much because it is NA. there isnt much to work with IMO. it might raise the redline though, and that could help with max hp.


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## the s is silent (Jul 17, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (Yevi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Yevi* »_not likely, there are chip manufacturers but increases are under 10 hp, *becuase it's an inline engine*
Yev








Please explain.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (mujjuman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mujjuman* »_a chip for our engines wont do much because it is NA. there isnt much to work with IMO. it might raise the redline though, and that could help with max hp. 

Raising the redline would help with 0-60 a lot. It would also help with all the throttle lag. GIAC claims 15whp with its mk.4 12v VR chip which i think is pretty good. Also, remember the talk that the Rabbit was originally supposed to have 170hp but VW knocked it down because they thought it would interfere with GTI sales. I think there is definetly more than just 8hp to gain with a chip, One of these companies just has to learn how to get it all out.


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_
*Raising the redline would help with 0-60 a lot.* It would also help with all the throttle lag. GIAC claims 15whp with its mk.4 12v VR chip which i think is pretty good. Also, remember the talk that the Rabbit was originally supposed to have 170hp but VW knocked it down because they thought it would interfere with GTI sales. I think there is definetly more than just 8hp to gain with a chip, One of these companies just has to learn how to get it all out.

yeah it would. and im betting that theres some more hp to be unleashed around 6200rpm (im being conservative... i'd say 6800rpm but im not 100% sure about that)


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## Yevi (Dec 7, 2005)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (the s is silent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the s is silent* »_







Please explain. 

what i meant was usually you can expect great upgrades with turbocharged engines, also as you know they way manifold designed isn't great either (funnel)
i came up which conclusion that unless there are major upgrades, chips would no do much
Yev


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## the s is silent (Jul 17, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (Yevi)*

I thought you were saying there was some advantage to having a V-configuration engine over an inline when it came to chipping.
And a funnel isn't all bad...if the secondaries are big enough.
http://www.burnsstainless.com/....html I'd love to do a header with one of these (at the bottom the list 5 to 1 as a specialty. Now that would be a funnel that kicks major ass.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (mujjuman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mujjuman* »_
yeah it would. and im betting that theres some more hp to be unleashed around 6200rpm (im being conservative... i'd say 6800rpm but im not 100% sure about that)

If the internals can even be revved that high. The redline might be as low as it is for a reason


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## the s is silent (Jul 17, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_
If the internals can even be revved that high. The redline might be as low as it is for a reason

Thank you! Somebody with a little bit of sense!
The only other reason to restrict the redline is if the torque curve is dropping off, and it makes no sense mathmatically to let the car rev. With the restrictions in the exhaust and the inake heater (engine cover intake), this may be the case. But I'm like you...be darn sure..


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## Bflaker (Oct 27, 2006)

Its obvious what the bottle neck is on the 2.5. The entire exhaust system. If you put a 5-?-1 Header w/ High Flow Cat, and 2.5" exhaust on this car, and then tune it........TOP END. This car already makes good tq. Its the top end that needs some extra breathing room. To do that, you have to open up the exhaust. I guarantee you if a vendor were to make a complete package with header, exhaust and chip you would see close to 160whp and about 180-190bhp. Its all in the tuning though. Cars today are built from the factory to try and counteract modifications. If the PCM sees increased air flow, it will pull timing and dump fuel to protect the motor. Manufacturers are getting smart about the common mods tuners like to do. 


_Modified by Bflaker at 2:55 PM 11-3-2006_


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## Bflaker (Oct 27, 2006)

*Re: (Bflaker)*

Here are some pics to show you what I'm talking about. Its not the size of the runners that I'm concerned with. Its the internal design of the Exhaust Manifold after it enters the Manifold. Look at these pics and you be the judge.


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_
The redline might be as low as it is for a reason

Yup.
From what I can tell, you've got quite a few things working against gaining easy high-rpm N/A power in the 2.5.
This engine is designed for low-rpm torque and is equipped with an intake mani with long, narrow runners, an intake cam of very mild duration and lift (with pressed-on lobes, to boot







), low compression, and a restrictive exhaust system. Bottlenecks galore.
I think taking the N/A route with the 2.5 will prove to be an expensive exercise in futility - much worse than as seen with the 12v VR6.
A low-boost turbo kit will not be so affected by the above-mentioned restrictions and will yield some pretty good results, so long as you're not expecting 230+ hp...


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_
*Raising the redline would help with 0-60 a lot*. It would also help with all the throttle lag. GIAC claims 15whp with its mk.4 12v VR chip which i think is pretty good. Also, remember the talk that the Rabbit was originally supposed to have 170hp but VW knocked it down because they thought it would interfere with GTI sales. I think there is definetly more than just 8hp to gain with a chip, One of these companies just has to learn how to get it all out.


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_
If the internals can even be revved that high. The redline might be as low as it is for a reason

dude you got me so confused... are you FOR raising redline or not? 
we can always upgrade the internals so we can rev that high. 
whatever... the 2.5 Forum is really confusing when it comes to what they want for their cars.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (mujjuman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mujjuman* »_dude you got me so confused... are you FOR raising redline or not? 
we can always upgrade the internals so we can rev that high. 
whatever... the 2.5 Forum is really confusing when it comes to what they want for their cars.









I am FOR raising the redline if it is even possible. And balancing cranks and light weight internals is not exactly a cheap thing that anybody can do. 
Forget a chip, I would like to see a cam that would just make the higher rpm more usable. I know that around 5k rpm my power disappears. A top end oriented cam would do wonders


_Modified by ElLibroGrande at 7:28 PM 11-4-2006_


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## p c (Oct 26, 2006)

all this talk about raising redline, but, does anybody know the r/s ratio. From my understanding, the r/s ratio is the important factor in how high a motor can spin.


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_ A top end oriented cam would do wonders

I highly doubt it, unless you also add different intake and exhaust manis.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: (p c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *p c* »_all this talk about raising redline, but, does anybody know the r/s ratio. From my understanding, the r/s ratio is the important factor in how high a motor can spin. 

No, that's why I said IF it can even be raised


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (My Name Is Luka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *My Name Is Luka* »_I highly doubt it, unless you also add different intake and exhaust manis.

Im sure there would be a very noticable increase. Especially when done with a chip. 
New intake and exhaust manifolds would definetrly help but you can't say cams alone wouldn't make a significant differance.
I can attest to the exhaust being very restrictive. When I upgraded mine it was night and day


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## Al Fresco (Feb 5, 2002)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*

Neuspeed chip= 19 hp. My friend loves it.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (Al Fresco)*

19hp?!
Did your friend dyno his car before and after? if so does he have the graphs?


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## travis3265 (Nov 15, 2003)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (ElLibroGrande)*

yeah and where did he get this chip. i didnt even know it existed. anyway what chips do currently exist for this engine?


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: Chipping the 2.5? (Al Fresco)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Al Fresco* »_Neuspeed chip= 19 hp. My friend loves it.

you sure its for the 2.5 5cyl found in the MKV Jetta/Rabbit? i havent even heard of it...


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## SceviourDub (Jul 9, 2006)

dude who said this car got low compression your wrong. it dont. 10:1 compression. i know that this rabbit can make decent power n/a. i may have had to give up on my turbo project but im still researching this engine inside out.


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (SceviourDub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SceviourDub* »_dude who said this car got low compression your wrong. it dont. 10:1 compression. i know that this rabbit can make decent power n/a. i may have had to give up on my turbo project but im still researching this engine inside out.

 







our engine has a 9.5:1 compression, stock... this is according to VW
unless you tested it and it turned out to be 10:1


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## travis3265 (Nov 15, 2003)

so have we established who makes a chip for the car right now....and where it is availble for purchase?


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## exteg (Oct 17, 2006)

*Re: (travis3265)*

Yikes, that picture of the exhaust manifold above is the ugliest things I have ever seen. Someone out it tuner world, get on that!


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (travis3265)*


_Quote, originally posted by *travis3265* »_so have we established who makes a chip for the car right now....and where it is availble for purchase?

not yet... i checked the Neuspeed site 2 days ago and it wasnt there.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: (mujjuman)*

ABD and I heard Upsolute also has a chip out for the 2.5
And all this talk of Neuspeed's chip and it isn't on their website


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## travis3265 (Nov 15, 2003)

*Re: (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_ABD and I heard Upsolute also has a chip out for the 2.5

got a link for where these can be purchased. everyones talking about these chips being available...but, where are they?


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (travis3265)*


_Quote, originally posted by *travis3265* »_
got a link for where these can be purchased. everyones talking about these chips being available...*but, where are they*?

x2 wtf
until someone posts a link from a manufacturer that has a chip for the *North American 2.5 liter 5cyl engine found in the MKV and New*(er) *Beetle*, i wont believe any more chip claims. 
i had to be specific 


_Modified by mujjuman at 2:32 PM 11-8-2006_


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: (travis3265)*


_Quote, originally posted by *travis3265* »_
got a link for where these can be purchased. everyones talking about these chips being available...but, where are they?

Well it looks like no one is fessing up to having a chip for the 2.5.
ABD *HAD* it on their website, but I can't find it anymore. Upsolute doesn't have anything on their site and neither does Neuspeed. I guess the only thing to do is call each company and see what's going on


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## travis3265 (Nov 15, 2003)

*Re: (ElLibroGrande)*

I have some concrete info from GIAC at least. I emailed them yesterday with this.

When will you be coming out with a chip for the 2.5L 2007 Rabbit engine?

Hi Travis,
Thank you for your email. It is something we will be working on, but it is not yet in development and I don't have an ETA. I can however hang on toyour email and let you know was soon as it becomes avialble.
Best Regards,
Andrea
GIAC 
Automotive Programming


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## SceviourDub (Jul 9, 2006)

*Re: (mujjuman)*

its in the bentaley manual for the 2.5 jetta. 10:1


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## The Critic (Oct 12, 2006)

*Re: (ElLibroGrande)*

http://namotorsports.net/detai...n.299


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: (SodaGuy)*

only 5-7 hp http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## the s is silent (Jul 17, 2004)

*Re: (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_only 5-7 hp http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 

I thought VW detuned the 2.5 with just the chip? These aren't the awesome gains that everybody has been talking about by 'chipping'. Oh wait...I know what it is, nobody has invested the time to do it right. Keep telling yourselves that. (ElLibroGrande...I'm not busting your balls on this one.)
Or you could do it the right way. Look for restrictions in airflow and remove them one at a time. Upgrade the software last.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: (the s is silent)*

I know your not busting my balls, but I never said they detuned it with just the chip, I said I think there is more then just 8hp to gain with one. 
*Paging Schrick*. They did good with their VR6 intake mani, so I would like to see what they can do with this 5 cylinder. 
And I havnt seen a header released either, although it's something that a good exhaust shop can do custom. If the money is ever burning a hole in my pocket maybe I will look further into that.


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (SceviourDub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SceviourDub* »_its in the bentaley manual for the 2.5 jetta. 10:1

thats weird....
this is from the VW website: (pdf file for 2007 2.5, but it was the same for 2006 2.5)
http://www.vw.com/vwcom/conten...s.pdf


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## the s is silent (Jul 17, 2004)

*Re: (ElLibroGrande)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ElLibroGrande* »_I know your not busting my balls, but I never said they detuned it with just the chip, I said I think there is more then just 8hp to gain with one. 
*Paging Schrick*. They did good with their VR6 intake mani, so I would like to see what they can do with this 5 cylinder. 
And I havnt seen a header released either, although it's something that a good exhaust shop can do custom. If the money is ever burning a hole in my pocket maybe I will look further into that.

I think a well built 5 into 1 long-tube header with a merge collector would be a work of art. And something like that is going to have to be built custom at a shop...I doubt any vendor will do it.


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## ElLibroGrande (Mar 19, 2004)

This is probably the sad truth.


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## Mr Black (Jan 20, 2002)

*Re: (ElLibroGrande)*

I can't believe that the tuners aren't all over this motor. It's going to be the ABA of this generation, but with MUCH more potential- 4-valve head and another 500 cc of displacement, what's not to love? 
As for rod-stroke ratio, it changes power characteristics but it's not the be all and end all. An Integra Type-R has a "poor" r/s ratio of 1.72 or something like that and it revs up into the stratosphere. I think an ABA with TDi 95.5mm crank is in the same ballpark, yet everyone always craps on that combo saying "it won't rev" or it's a stump-puller/truck motor etc.
I'm sure once the tuners realize that there are 5x as many 2.5's as there are 2.0t's out there, they will start offering intake/chip/cam/exhaust packages that should bump the power significantly.


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## Yevi (Dec 7, 2005)

*Re: (Mr Black)*

too many bottlenecks, create complicated modifications => high prices aren't attractive
Yev


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (Yevi)*

this is a good car


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## a226sig (Jul 6, 2006)

To think that the newest Golf/bunny and Jetta of the US, doesn't have an ECU upgrade or forced induction kits is obserd!


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## travis3265 (Nov 15, 2003)

*Re: (a226sig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *a226sig* »_To think that the newest Golf/bunny and Jetta of the US, doesn't have an ECU upgrade or forced induction kits is obserd!

well, unitronic is almost done developing their chip, neuspeed has the thunderbunny, and vf engineering has partnered with another company and are developing their turbo kit now. the cars been out now for about 5 minutes, have some patience. it takes time to develop a quality product.


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