# Noob ?? Why the rough ride?



## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

I have the airlift digital kit and the ride is freaking horrible. This can't be the way they're suppose to work. What did I do wrong?


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## bsail25 (Dec 1, 2009)

it might be how much pressure you have in the bags. i have manual switches, but the higher up i go the rougher the ride gets


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## SuperBacon (May 8, 2006)

yeah what pressures are you running? And which airlift kit do you have? We need more info


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

SuperBacon said:


> yeah what pressures are you running? And which airlift kit do you have? We need more info


 The kit is the digital lifestyles kit by airlit. basically what ecs is selling but i have different compressors. and hardware.. 

Right now as of pressure I am running80psi in front and 56 in the rear..


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## thepirate (Jun 6, 2008)

80psi seems like a lot. When I run 80 its a bit bouncy, I usually go 70/65. I'm on MasonTechs.


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## NDubber (Sep 11, 2006)

i run upper 30's in my BOC's on mk3 and like mid 40s in mk6 on Bagyards


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## Residentevol (Sep 19, 2000)

yeah dude re-read your manual I think they give you recommended pressures. 80/60 is WAY high and it seems reversed. I think the recommended pressure for a Mkv is around 45 psi up front and 55 in the rear.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Residentevol said:


> yeah dude re-read your manual I think they give you recommended pressures. 80/60 is WAY high and it seems reversed. I think the recommended pressure for a Mkv is around 45 psi up front and 55 in the rear.


 If I run that pressure in the front the tires are in the fenders. I am running 195/65/15


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## jettahead99 (Jul 21, 2008)

bagdwag said:


> I am running 195/65/15


 Call me crazy but that seems pretty small for a mkv...:sly:


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## SuperBacon (May 8, 2006)

the mkiv my boss just did had to run close to 80 in the front to lift. Are your front bags single bellow or the new double bellow? That plays a big role in how much pressure you need to run. But the mkiv he did rode just fine with 80 front (idk what the rear was)


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## arethirdytwo (Apr 4, 2007)

Agreed, mine reach full lift at 120.




SuperBacon said:


> the mkiv my boss just did had to run close to 80 in the front to lift. Are your front bags single bellow or the new double bellow? That plays a big role in how much pressure you need to run. But the mkiv he did rode just fine with 80 front (idk what the rear was)


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## dustinwark (Dec 3, 2008)

bagdwag said:


> If I run that pressure in the front the tires are in the fenders. I am running 195/65/15


 :what: what wheels are you running? You must have a rabbit to run wheels that small if you have a MKV. 

I say get some normal size wheels, small tires on those (can't get too good a stretch on narrow wheels) and roll lower.


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## zacharys666 (Jan 28, 2008)

The airlift manual stated that max psi in the front is 120psi (single bellow bag) and 80psi in the rear. I usually ride about 65-70psi in the front and 35-40psi in the rear in my mkIV. Are you running spacers in the front?


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

The car is a mkiv wagon.. The front is the old style air lift kit that now basically ecs sells for mkiv


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## [email protected] (Feb 19, 2010)

For the Air Lift MK4 'Performance' sleeve style bags we found the best ride was 60-65 psi up front


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## reynolds9000 (Oct 16, 2003)

In my mk3 with airlift lifestyle bags, 80psi is almost full lift and bouncy as ****! I usually ride around 25-30psi in the front, 45 in the rear.


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## SuperBacon (May 8, 2006)

reynolds9000 said:


> In my mk3 with airlift lifestyle bags, 80psi is almost full lift and bouncy as ****! I usually ride around 25-30psi in the front, 45 in the rear.


 The mk3 kits use double bellow, and the kit he has uses a single bellow. The single bellow takes much more psi to inflate than our double bellows


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## thepirate (Jun 6, 2008)

Well that explains why I run high psi compared to you guys. I've got a single bellow bag, If I go under 70 psi I start bouncing off my upper controls. :thumbdown:


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

like I said I am a noob.. I got the kit directly from airlift and it was about 3 mons ago so it is not the xl bag. They did tell me to grind the ring off so i did .. I changed the front to 65ish and itss a little better but im worried about the fenders..


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## [email protected] (Dec 15, 2010)

bagdwag said:


> I have the airlift digital kit and the ride is freaking horrible. This can't be the way they're suppose to work. What did I do wrong?


Friend-

One of the things you need to do is check what position the damping adjuster is at. If you have it turned down to 0 (softest at full counter clockwise) the ride will suck balls as there is not enough damping and the ride will be floaty and you will bottom out often! I would have you try setting them at 7 from full soft. If you have them at 9 (full stiff) that would also account for a rough ride because you have too much damping.

It may take a few tries to find a place you like. Also, make sure your tie pressures are not too high. That also makes a big difference on such small tires.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

[email protected] said:


> Friend-
> 
> One of the things you need to do is check what position the damping adjuster is at. If you have it turned down to 0 (softest at full counter clockwise) the ride will suck balls as there is not enough damping and the ride will be floaty and you will bottom out often! I would have you try setting them at 7 from full soft. If you have them at 9 (full stiff) that would also account for a rough ride because you have too much damping.
> 
> It may take a few tries to find a place you like. Also, make sure your tie pressures are not too high. That also makes a big difference on such small tires.


Brain.
Thank you for your support one thing I will say that when I was missing parts or parts broke the people at airlift were quick to send out the pieces I needed without question. Good People.. 

I will mess around with the dampers a little bit today to see if i can get the quality of the ride better...:thumbup:.. 

The problem with running less than 70psi with the setup is that the tires are in the fenders even with no spacers and just stock wheels..


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## Retromini (Nov 7, 2004)

Adjusting the damping will do wonders. I was riding around with mine set too low for a while and it wasn't the most comfortable. I went a played around with stiffer settings until I found a good balance. The ride comfort difference was night and day. Much better now. That's one of the benefits of damper adjustability. Lets you match your damping to your personal pressure needs which vary between bags and cars. :thumbup:


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

I just adjusted to the numbers that Brain had said to start off with I havent had a chance to go for a drive but I do have to go some where about 30 miles away here in about 2 hours(both city and highway driving) so that should give me some feel as what I should expect and the adjustments I will have to make..

I do keep a full 350pc craftsman tool box and a floor jack in the trunk of this car if that makes much difference...

I am also using the stock oem shocks in the rear of the car! They have at least 35k on them but I couldnt really get a straight answer when looking into gettting new ones.. I thought at one point that they were holding my car up when I tried to go "all down"

Ultimate goal: Great ride quality ( if thats posibile) and for the car to sit level for the most part..


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## [email protected] (Dec 15, 2010)

bagdwag said:


> Brain.
> Thank you for your support one thing I will say that when I was missing parts or parts broke the people at airlift were quick to send out the pieces I needed without question. Good People..
> 
> I will mess around with the dampers a little bit today to see if i can get the quality of the ride better...:thumbup:..
> ...


Let me know how it goes. If you find that you need to run 90psi to keep enough clearance, you will definitely want to run higher damping to manage the extra spring rate.:beer:


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## unitzero (Jan 15, 2008)

On my mk4 my dampning is adjusted to 7 and I run between 70 and 80 PSI in the front for regular driving ( avoiding fender damage on full lock from my winter baloon tyres) and around 30-40 PSI in the rear 

seems to be a comfortable ride - a little stiffer than stock but not as harsh as coils.

I have no sway bar - and rings ground off front struts.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Just rode 30 miles 70 psi up front around 55-60 rear with the damp at 7 the ride wasn't bad I have a tdi so more weight in the front and rear with the tools


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

I still have the pressures adjusted to reccomendations as well as the damping I feel a major difference but I still feel like I have some tuning to do ..The tire sits very close to the fender at those pressures but higher gets bouncy... idk..

What about shocks in the rear? does any company make speacialized shocks that will go lower?


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

What shocks are you running in the rear


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

I have been running 70 psi front and 60 psi rear witht the damper set at 7 for a couple days it still feels a little stiff and harsh but I think if I go much lower in the front I'll be eating my fenders


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## Retromini (Nov 7, 2004)

Factory suggestions are just that....suggestions. They make for good starting points, but it's always a good idea for you to do your own tinkering once you try it out. Every car is different from the weight to the distribution. What works well for a few cars may not be the same setting for your car.

If you're really worried about the height, why not raise the pressure up to 80 and turn up the damping 1 or 2? It seems counter intuitive, but sometimes a "rough" ride is actually an under dampened suspension setup. 

When you have a free day, just play with the settings. Drive around, see how it feels. If it needs a change go under and raise the damping 2 settings. Drive it again and if it feels like an improvement, move it up 1 more and see how that feels. If it feels like too much, spin it down one. It's just about finding the right balance between spring rate (pressure) and damping for your specific car.


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## tspooner (Feb 28, 2010)

bagdwag said:


> If I run that pressure in the front the tires are in the fenders. I am running 195/65/15


sounds like stealies.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Stock OEM 15in Alloy's


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Iam open to suggestions for my 15in in regards to tire sizes.. I think I have the fronts pretty much dialed in but the rear is acting wierd with 100k on it maybe new shocks???? if so what shocks work best with this kind of application


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

I still am unnotched an am running a sway bar I think from what I am hearing that I want to keep the sway bar but would notching allow me to run better psi? I am running 65-70psi and 60psi rear


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## Santi (Mar 26, 2004)

first of all, the controller style doesnt have anything to do with the ride qualtiy, digital vs. analog it dont matter... 

For the rears you need some Bilstein shocks... The sleeve bags that are used by airlift do run a higher PSI and are normally soft... 

I'm not sure what you expected from air ride, but its not like a Lincoln/Cadiallc on air...

Also running 15" wheels w/ balloon tires will make it bouncy... You should plan on getting some 17s or 18s...


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Santi said:


> first of all, the controller style doesnt have anything to do with the ride qualtiy, digital vs. analog it dont matter...
> 
> For the rears you need some Bilstein shocks... The sleeve bags that are used by airlift do run a higher PSI and are normally soft...
> 
> ...


Thanks for the information I will get on some shocks today,.. I wasnt expecting a caddy ride but I have beeen getting really harsh bumps and rides..


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## Santi (Mar 26, 2004)

Wait.. you are using the airlift rear kit for a mk5? or something else?? and it didnt come with the rear shocks already???


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

This is for a mkiv


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## Santi (Mar 26, 2004)

bagdwag said:


> This is for a mkiv


my fault... i thought i read mk5 somewhere.. ok... your rear shocks are proly blown.. just upgrade those, and plan on getting some bigger wheels.. it'll help...


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Yup. I ordered some good rear shocks so Hopefully that helps a good bit.. so on airlift what is a good ride pressure to be at?


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## [email protected] (Dec 15, 2010)

bagdwag said:


> Yup. I ordered some good rear shocks so Hopefully that helps a good bit.. so on airlift what is a good ride pressure to be at?


Pressure depends on the weight of your car, the load, like people inside, and what height you want to roll at. There is no perfect formula as there are too many variables. Play around until you are happy

Getting good rear shocks will make a huge difference for your ride. Air springs need more rebound control than coil springs so going with a stiffer aftermarket shock is definitely the correct direction!


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## bassmanjosh (Nov 6, 2004)

bagdwag said:


> The kit is the digital lifestyles kit by airlit. basically what ecs is selling but i have different compressors. and hardware..
> 
> Right now as of pressure I am running80psi in front and 56 in the rear..



I have the XL kit on my mkv and I ride at 50 in front and 70 in rear and the ride is great. the less PSI in the bags, the softer the ride.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

I got some KONI's for the rear and new strut bushings but now there is like a poping sound in the rear and the ride is still rough as hell.

Those guys with the airlift kit what psi's are you running?

I do not have the frame notched out


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## [email protected] (Dec 15, 2010)

bagdwag said:


> I got some KONI's for the rear and new strut bushings but now there is like a poping sound in the rear and the ride is still rough as hell.
> 
> Those guys with the airlift kit what psi's are you running?
> 
> I do not have the frame notched out


Where do you have the Koni's adjusted? Are they the yellow sports or the reds?  Was the noise there before you changed shocks or after? Pics of your install would also help us help you.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

[email protected] said:


> Where do you have the Koni's adjusted? Are they the yellow sports or the reds? Was the noise there before you changed shocks or after? Pics of your install would also help us help you.


I went with the SRT. They are orange.. there was a different noise before..now its like a poping sound..


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## eurotrsh (Dec 25, 2004)

My lady's GTI has the STR-T out back with no noises or issues at all.


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## 95jetta17 (Jan 21, 2008)

i ride 35 front 40 rear and it rides amazing.


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## Santi (Mar 26, 2004)

bagdwag said:


> I went with the SRT. They are orange.. there was a different noise before..now its like a poping sound..


Something isnt aligning correctly, or wasnt tightened right... 

Does the sound happen when you go up and down, or just when driving?? 

HAve you driven it @ different pressures to see if it changes the sound? 40psi vs. 80psi.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Santi said:


> Something isnt aligning correctly, or wasnt tightened right...
> 
> Does the sound happen when you go up and down, or just when driving??
> 
> HAve you driven it @ different pressures to see if it changes the sound? 40psi vs. 80psi.


I do not have any
Noises when going up and down only when driving


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## thepirate (Jun 6, 2008)

I have all sorts of noises when riding, my control arms have had it, did you check those? Maybe the popping is from a loose bolt in the back did you check and torque everything down again?


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

thepirate said:


> I have all sorts of noises when riding, my control arms have had it, did you check those? Maybe the popping is from a loose bolt in the back did you check and torque everything down again?


torqued eveverything when the recommendation was made by the dealer.. I will try again .. I have a hard time believing thats what it is again


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

95jetta17 said:


> i ride 35 front 40 rear and it rides amazing.


How are you not into your fenders at that pressure. at 65psi in the front Im rubbing the fender.. Something cant be setup right


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## Clean PG (May 9, 2005)

bagdwag said:


> How are you not into your fenders at that pressure. at 65psi in the front Im rubbing the fender.. Something cant be setup right


1) when you say 'rubbing the fender', are you referring to the actual fender or your fender liners?

reason i ask is i have a mk4 on bags running the same winter tire setup (195/65/15), and even when i take all the air out of my bags my tires dont touch the fenders because theyre tucked in so much. so you must be running large spacers up front (are you?) or you are referring to your fender liners. if youre hitting your fender liners just take them out, it wont hurt anything and youll be amazed at how much more space you get up there.

2) another note: i notice you keep asking if notching your frame will help. the answer is no. the ONLY thing notching your frame will do is let you go lower when you fully deflate the bags when parked.

3) what's your fender-to-ground measurement at 65psi up front? also for 80psi up front?


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Clean PG said:


> 1) when you say 'rubbing the fender', are you referring to the actual fender or your fender liners?
> 
> reason i ask is i have a mk4 on bags running the same winter tire setup (195/65/15), and even when i take all the air out of my bags my tires dont touch the fenders because theyre tucked in so much. so you must be running large spacers up front (are you?) or you are referring to your fender liners. if youre hitting your fender liners just take them out, it wont hurt anything and youll be amazed at how much more space you get up there.
> 
> ...


My setup will be a 15 on a 195.65.15 tire

I am talking about the fender liners I guess because they are still in... The car is a Jetta Wagon TDi.
When I go psi lower in the front it seems as if things are scrapping that could just be the fender liner but it feels more under the car..
I will get that measurement today and I will let you know..


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Clean PG said:


> 1) when you say 'rubbing the fender', are you referring to the actual fender or your fender liners?
> 
> reason i ask is i have a mk4 on bags running the same winter tire setup (195/65/15), and even when i take all the air out of my bags my tires dont touch the fenders because theyre tucked in so much. so you must be running large spacers up front (are you?) or you are referring to your fender liners. if youre hitting your fender liners just take them out, it wont hurt anything and youll be amazed at how much more space you get up there.
> 
> ...


24in from the fender to the ground and removing the liners did help I am at 58 all around now any lower in the front and im in the fender when turning


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## Clean PG (May 9, 2005)

bagdwag said:


> My setup will be a 15 on a 195.65.15 tire
> 
> I am talking about the fender liners I guess because they are still in... The car is a Jetta Wagon TDi.
> When I go psi lower in the front it seems as if things are scrapping that could just be the fender liner but it feels more under the car..
> I will get that measurement today and I will let you know..


if it's fender liners then you can remove them. there's really no way to avoid rubbing them when you're low, it's a given.

so now you have 2 options: you can remove them entirely which is what most people do, including myself, OR you can take them out and cut out the upper arch part of them so you still have the front and back portion for splash guards but when you go low there's no liner above the tire that will get hit.

if youre driving around fairly low, you could also be rubbing your front swaybar with your axles. did you say earlier in the thread if you removed your front swaybar or no?


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Clean PG said:


> if it's fender liners then you can remove them. there's really no way to avoid rubbing them when you're low, it's a given.
> 
> so now you have 2 options: you can remove them entirely which is what most people do, including myself, OR you can take them out and cut out the upper arch part of them so you still have the front and back portion for splash guards but when you go low there's no liner above the tire that will get hit.
> 
> if youre driving around fairly low, you could also be rubbing your front swaybar with your axles. did you say earlier in the thread if you removed your front swaybar or no?


I removed them entirely from the car.. I do have the sway bar connected and I believe that is what it is hitting


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## Clean PG (May 9, 2005)

if your ride height is about average to OEM and you're still hearing/feeling this noise, then it's probably not your axles rubbing on your front swaybar. but if you're dailying it at a somewhat low height and hear the rubbing, id recommend cutting it out because you're bound to hit it. if you want you could jack the car up and inspect where the swaybar arches over the axles to check for rub marks, that'd be a clear giveaway.

i'd still be curious to know what your ftg measurements are at the psi you're driving at.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

It is making contact with sway bar. How bad will it be without a sway bar


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## Clean PG (May 9, 2005)

bagdwag said:


> It is making contact with sway bar. How bad will it be without a sway bar


if you just daily the car you wont even notice a difference. id venture to guess that a vast majority of those who go air just completely cut out their front swaybar and don't install an aftermarket one, myself included.

if you auto-cross with it, then you should consider getting a replacement that doesnt arch over the axles (h&r sells one i believe). but in all other cases it's not really necessary.


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## OffLineR (Oct 19, 2010)

Clean PG said:


> if you just daily the car you wont even notice a difference. id venture to guess that a vast majority of those who go air just completely cut out their front swaybar and don't install an aftermarket one, myself included.
> 
> if you auto-cross with it, then you should consider getting a replacement that doesnt arch over the axles (h&r sells one i believe). but in all other cases it's not really necessary.


I love cornering and taking out my sway bar was a great concern to me.

When I first removed it I felt like it was too bad to drive this way.
Than I get used to drive like this or the feeling off bad handling was psychological.
In both cases you'll forget that you have taken it out in couple of weeks if you daily your car


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

It is def the sway bar hitting on the axle on the pass side only.. There is a guage mark. 

So I guess my main question how unsafe will it be to drive without the sway bar what differences will it make .. I want a good ride but I do not want an unsafe driver..

It is a jetta wagon so no auto x for me in this car


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## Clean PG (May 9, 2005)

bagdwag said:


> It is def the sway bar hitting on the axle on the pass side only.. There is a guage mark.
> 
> So I guess my main question how unsafe will it be to drive without the sway bar what differences will it make .. I want a good ride but I do not want an unsafe driver..
> 
> It is a jetta wagon so no auto x for me in this car


that question has been asked many times in the mk4 forums and it's pretty much always resulted with the OP cutting it out. it isnt all that detrimental to the car to drive without a front swaybar, it's more of a mentality thing. i was kind of sketched out by the idea too, but after my air ride install and cutting out my fsb i had a 150mile drive home and after that i had no more concerns 

another way to look at it is you paid a good chunk of money for air ride to get low, so why would you want to settle on only going as low as your front swaybar will let you when it's an easy job to remove and commonly done.


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## PatrickVas (Aug 23, 2007)

I got airlift XL fronts and Slam Specialties RE-5s in the rear and I run 45psi front, 38psi rear on my mkv as a daily NYC height and the ride is awesome.... 80/60 seems pretty high, then again thats just me


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## Mexx_TDI (Aug 8, 2008)

airlift xl's on mk5 ,daily driven,50-50psi ride is AWESOME.


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## bagdwag (Aug 11, 2010)

Thats awesome... Im talking an MKiv with the air lift digital kit


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