# Track Day mkV or mkVI



## 3Whlr (Feb 11, 2013)

Been away from VW for a few years but looking to get a track day/ summer car and so looking at mkV or mkVI GTI's as I like the idea of carting the kids around or throwing a bike in the back during the week and going to the track on the weekend. Reading the forums though it doesn't give me confidence that these cars would be a good choice. Those who track mkV or mkVI GTI's please give guidance. Thanks

1. Tech-ED and others strongly indicate these cars have tendency for "snap" oversteer without ESP and that it should not be disabled... this makes no sense to me. Why would VW build a car which relies on ESP to keep people safe when pushing the limits? 
2. Racers, are the cars really that difficult to control at the limit when the rear steps out
...... even on a setup car with proper suspension? Is a neutral setup for running comfortably at 10/10ths be really that impossible to obtain with these cars without ESP?
3. Recently it has been reported that ESP disable is an option for mkVI Golf R. Does the VAG-COM approach also apply to mkV and mkVI GTI's?

I really want a GTI to learn to drive fast on the track but these issues are not making me feel good about pursing a GTI for a track day weapon. If it helps with your answer I have been autoX'ng for many years (>15), done track days in a mkIII GTI VR6, karting school, and was competent at a miata racing school.


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## PoweredByG60 (Nov 12, 2001)

I can only speak from a novice angle. This last weekend was my 4th track day with NASA racing here in nor cal.
All in my 12 GTI wDSG stock. It is a lot of fun, I am not trying to race just running in HPDE. I have passed cars I don't feel I should be able to. I have got the rear loose in some fast sweeping turns but nothing unmanageable on stock street tires.
There are a few folks I know also that enjoy them on track.


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## new2FWD (Mar 24, 2012)

The question that I can answer: you can disable the ESP on Golf Rs with VAG COM. 

As far as snap oversteer goes the GTIs are easy to manage. I auto X our 1986 911 that's set up for the track and with that car you have to be very careful. Front engine/ FWD has been very easy to manage oversteer in my GTI. A little oppo and you're fine. They are very stable and the tendancy is to understeer.


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## 3Whlr (Feb 11, 2013)

Thanks for the feedback. Never driven a GTI without a rear twist axle and was freaked out by some of the things on the "ESP disable" boards regarding the stability of the newer cars without the nanny on. Didn't know if something wierd happened when VW went away from the twist axle. Seeing some video of "drifting" mkV and new2fwd comments about a 2008 suggests to me that the mkV may be easier to setup for the track.

Yeah definately no confusing a gti with a 911. BUT I would expect a 911 to behave that way. Was not expecting what I was hearing from TechED regarding the danger of removing the ESP and snap oversteer on a GTI. Was just over the top and I thouth the motorsports page would provide better insight to the nature of these cars.


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## jjr329 (Jul 9, 2009)

When you first start out with a car you aren't familiar with leave ESP on. Once you are comfortable with how it behaves then turn it off and slowly build up to 9-10/10ths. I made the mistake of pushing for too much "progress" during my 3rd track event and had the rear come around on me and did a little "farming." I turned it back on and spent the rest of the 3 day event feeling out the car. 

I now only leave ESP on in the rain on track.


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## Rocko'sEuroGTi (Feb 2, 2005)

Snap oversteer can be remedied by lower rear tire pressures. My race car had this problem until a local former autox champ pointed out my rears didn't need to be at 33psi. Fronts I now run 34, rears 25 psi. The rears will let go much more gradually now, and with warning in the way of a bit of sidewall lean.

I track my MKVI Jetta TDI with ESC on (no option to shut off) and it is very well composed. The ESC only intervenes when I am willfully pushing it past its limits. The brakes are the only noted downside so far, but I imagine the GTi probably has a better set of brakes then the grocery getter TDi.
TDI at Eagles Canyon Raceway


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## 3Whlr (Feb 11, 2013)

Thanks for the great feedback and excellent video. Need to get out there


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## mk21.8Tjetta (Jun 3, 2002)

Bringing this back from the dead...

To the OP, what did you eventually buy? I'm wondering the same thing as you. I'd also be interested to know feedback of what the mk4/5 compared to the mk3 VR on the track ? Thanks!


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