# twin engine mk1 questions



## South_East_Vintage (Mar 21, 2004)

hey guys... let me just enter this disclaimer... i know the dubsport car has been beaten to death... and i'm not just some dreamer here... i have real fabrication skills... so here goes...
The only mk1 I know of that has twin engines is the dubsport mk1 golf... and dubsport's website is down... so, can anyone help me? 
What would you use to mount up the rear engine? Could I weld in a hacked up mk2 subframe? 
I'm only looking to use two 2.0 8v's so i'm not worried about mind numbing torque ripping the car apart







As for the throttles, that seems fairly easy, and if I use a hydraulic clutch, that would seem pretty easy... I would need to run a whole separate FI setup... 
could I start both engines simultaneously or one at a time?
Since the final drive in the transaxles wouldn't be locking, I wouldn't really have to worry about turns, but I would have to make sure all the tire treads are even. I guess I would need two fuel pumps... And the stock gastank would be non-existant, so I would need a fuel cell somewhere. 
Do you think a stock radiator would be sufficient for two engines? Or would I need a rear radiator too?
What could be done for shift linkage? Maybe I could enslave a monkey to shift the rear trans for me








Anyway.. any and all info would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Brian


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## RUonWEED (Oct 29, 2004)

*Re: twin engine mk1 questions (Mk1Jetta82)*

im not claming to know anything, but on 5th gear (a tv show) i saw this little yellow brittish car with two toyota engines (i think they were toyota). the shifter was split into two down the middle, and you could shift both at the same time, or separately. im not sure if it was a ratcheting shifter or manual, but with two bars, you could shift them together or separate if you chose. the car was an open cockpit roadster real low to the ground, and was blazin fast.


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## South_East_Vintage (Mar 21, 2004)

*Re: twin engine mk1 questions (Mk1Jetta82)*

Was doing a search online and found a few pictures on http://www.scirocco.org of a volkswagen motorsport scirocco twin engine car... it appears to have two 8v motors, coolant pipes heading to the rear, ITB's, somesort of completely independent 4-link type rear suspension with disc brakes, a roll cage, and seems to have gone for about 60,000 Deutschmark in the early 80s






















anyone know more info about this car? i could REALLY use some underbody pics of the rear suspension...
























Any more info?


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## 1slowdub (Jul 16, 2003)

*Re: twin engine mk1 questions (RUonWEED)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RUonWEED* »_im not claming to know anything, but on 5th gear (a tv show) i saw this little yellow brittish car with two toyota engines (i think they were toyota). the shifter was split into two down the middle, and you could shift both at the same time, or separately. im not sure if it was a ratcheting shifter or manual, but with two bars, you could shift them together or separate if you chose. the car was an open cockpit roadster real low to the ground, and was blazin fast. 

I saw that too. They were Hayabusa engines so it was prolly a modified motorcycle trans.


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## chopWet (May 10, 2003)

the yellow british car was a Tiger Z100, using two bike engines and running two bike gearboxes (therefore sequential shift). There is a guy here in Cape Town who has done a twin 16VT and NOS mk1 check out http://www.ferroli.co.za/ maybe you can email them? I know that he can run one engine at a time or both together, he usually does nice burnouts with just the rear engine engaged!!


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## chopWet (May 10, 2003)

oh and I'd suggest going for carbs instead of FI, much simpler...


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## gamblinfool (Sep 28, 2001)

*Re: (chopWet)*

this was also done on an A1 chassis by my buddy, Anson:
http://www.durocco.com


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## Muffler Bearing (Apr 4, 2004)

i was just thinking about the same thing. however i am a dreamer because i dont have any fab skills and at the moment only a one car garage. and i was thinking of using a mk2 golf.
for mounting the rear engine, i was thinking that hacking off the front clip from another golf/jetta would be the best way to start. pretty much have the rear be as identical to the front as possible.
i was also thinking of using 2 8v engines, but ditching the whole efi system in favor of carbs. pretty much having them being two completely independently running engines. only thing i think they would need to share is a fuel cell (seperate pumps) and a battery. could probably only use one alternator too.
two radiators for sure! i was either thinking of some sort of roof scoop or mounting two smaller heavy duty radiators in the front and running the coolant lines forward for the rear engine.
and sinft linkage. while your at it might as well use cable shift transmissions. i think that would make it ALOT easier to have them sift together.
and again, i am just a dreamer.
-j


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## Anson86-8v (Feb 17, 2003)

*Re: (Muffler Bearing)*

I just updated the Durocco site with the build story, I would appreciate any feedback on the content, layout, whatever.
Click on "story" at the top of the durocco page.
Just let me know if there are any gaps or confusing bits.


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## CDJetta (May 11, 2004)

*Re: (Anson86-8v)*

Nice build. I'm looking at doing a rear engine in a rocco but..... i'm trying to figure out what to do for a suspension setup. From what I read you took the front sub frame from an A2 and welded/bolted it up. How well is that working for ya??


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## CDJetta (May 11, 2004)

*Re: twin engine mk1 questions (Mk1Jetta82)*

What options are there that you guys thought up to mounting the engine in the rear. Right now i'm just throwing around ideas on how to mount everything... haven't done any cutting or buying yet. 
There's your way........ A2 sub frame with custom made suspension mounting
There's the way you mentioned.... tube frame the whole half of the car. 
Do you guys know how the other company above did their mid engine. Does anybody know how momentum tuning did their mid engine 2.0l 20vt??? I have been calling them but I haven't gotten in contact with this guy named Mike. I emailed them and they told me to contact him so that's what i've been doing. Called twice so far and he hasn't been there both times.


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## Anson86-8v (Feb 17, 2003)

*Re: (CDJetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDJetta* »_From what I read you took the front sub frame from an A2 and welded/bolted it up. How well is that working for ya?? 

The A2 subframe is probably the simplest way to go about mid mounting, it takes care of motor mounts and suspension in one fell swoop (whatever the hell that means)
One nasty little problem I have had with my setup is play, the A-arms still have the mushy stock rubber bushings in them and it's rather scary.
When making fast lane changes the rear end can get very squirely, an effect largely brought on by the huge toe/camber changes alowed by the over-ripe stock bushings.
I'm in the middle of refreshing the car right now and poly bushing are deffinately on the menu, I'm hoping this will cure the squirms.
So yea, a tentative very good thank you... I'll get back to you when the poly goes in


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## CDJetta (May 11, 2004)

*Re: (Anson86-8v)*

Please do tell because I might go that route.... it seems like it would help out on a lot of problems. What did you do about the rear hubs though. Aren't they made to turn? Did you weld them up or what? Is there anything you could think of doing right now that if you could do over or spend a hundred or more on that you would do better or over again?


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## Anson86-8v (Feb 17, 2003)

*Re: (CDJetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDJetta* »_ What did you do about the rear hubs though. Aren't they made to turn? Did you weld them up or what? Is there anything you could think of doing right now that if you could do over or spend a hundred or more on that you would do better or over again?

Ah good catch on the hubs, I just added a picture and description to page three of the story about those, let me know if it makes sence.
I realy don't think I would do anything different, the car was intended to be an excercise in cheap power and at a current budget of $1800 I think it's a smashing succes.
If I were to build a second car I would probably go full body-off tube frame.


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## CDJetta (May 11, 2004)

*Re: (Anson86-8v)*

Awesome, I'll take a look at the site in a minute. I'm trying to do more of a complicated swap..... but using close to the same principle but i'll probably do some tube chassis stuff. i'll have to look up information on that but..... when you say, full body-off tube frame are you saying getting a tube frame built and then fitting body panels to it?? If so... there was a guy selling something like that on here not to long ago. A full tube frame rocco.
Now.... if that's not what you mean do you mean getting a rocco chassis and then building a tube frame on top of the chassis from major structeral points sort of like a roll cage. like.... welding a frame on from the front bumper supports and where the rear beem connects for the stock rear suspension and various other points?? 
I don't want to go as extreme as a full on out tube frame with body panels put on.... i would do the second thing I mentioned which is what I am contemplating right now. In my mind, and i'm sure in a lot of other people, I wouldn't consider it a scirocco if it were a tube frame with body panels on it, but... it's not about other people, it's about you. Well... thanks for all the information. It really helps and thanks for the pictures too.


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## chopWet (May 10, 2003)

*Re: (Anson86-8v)*

That DuRocco site is the business!! Very smooth and proffesional looking, funny too not to mention inspirational!! Ghetto power...


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## Muffler Bearing (Apr 4, 2004)

what about that polo v8? i wonder what he used to mount that huge v8 in the hatch of a polo. i figure if it can hold that big chunk of iron, then a similar method would have no problem with a 4cyl.
-j


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## tbanks (Mar 11, 2005)

*Re: twin engine mk1 questions (RUonWEED)*

On the mounting thing, tube frame.
And a monkey is always a good idea, always.


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## bobqzzi (Sep 24, 2003)

*Re: (Anson86-8v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Anson86-8v* »_
Ah good catch on the hubs, I just added a picture and description to page three of the story about those, let me know if it makes sence.
I realy don't think I would do anything different, the car was intended to be an excercise in cheap power and at a current budget of $1800 I think it's a smashing succes.
If I were to build a second car I would probably go full body-off tube frame.

I jut wanted to say that is an awesome project and I admore your can-do attitude.


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## CDJetta (May 11, 2004)

*Re: (bobqzzi)*

Hummm.... I'm thinking about doing a partial tube frame on top of the original chassis for support then using the A3 plus suspension components like the cross memeber and sub frame to try and make it look a little more stock if ya know what I mean. I'm still wondering how I can make the top of the suspension look good but I don't know if that's gunna be possible. 
If I used a VR6 sub frame and cross member, what parts would it take to change the brakes up??
I still want to run a 4 lug setup. I'd prolly also put a seperate A3 vr6 sub frame up front so that it had the plus suspension too. My only concern is that I want to run 13" rims on this car.














I'd need some smaller brakes to do that than the 5 lug 11 inch brakes that come with the vr6. Do the A2 brake components just swap over?? I know when people do a vr6 swap some keep a 4 lug setup. 
Another concern is braking. Aren't you supposed to have smaller brakes in the rear so that they don't lock up before the front do?? What's the smallest front brakes that VW made???


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## Muffler Bearing (Apr 4, 2004)

hold the fone!
that article mentioned a twin engine jetta??
-j


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## CDJetta (May 11, 2004)

*Re: (Muffler Bearing)*

You saw that too. I was wondering about that too but I guess VWM had some pretty nice VWs back in the day. I mean the twin engine rocco had two 180hp engines in it. That's kind of insane for back then and still kind of insane for now.








I wonder how their twin engine jetta did. From what i got from that it said it used two 1.6l engines. 
As for their rear platform for the engine. It looks like they deicded to reinvent the whole rear end and made their own..... I guess they can do that though since they have the man power and gobs of money. lol. Maybe some one should make a twin engine vr6t rocco. lol. It'd prolly be way to heavy though.... not that a twin engine car in general isn't heaby


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## MrDave (Jul 26, 2002)

*Re: (Muffler Bearing)*

The twin-engine Jetta was featured in Motor Trend magazine, issue 2, 1982, and Road and Track magazine, issue 12, 1981.
I used to have photos somewhere, but I can't seem to find 'em.
I think the car was yellow.

As for the Scirocco:
















http://www.roccofreak.de/bimotor/bimotorsc.html
I love that instrument cluster.
-Dave


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## Kaktus (Mar 23, 2004)

There is a twin engined mk1 in South Africa aswell. I think it is for sale aswell. Check it out. 
http://www.ferroli.co.za/
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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