# My Phaeton W12



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Hi 
Just bought this on a whim really, dirt cheap, seller said there was problems with the transmission and the alternator..



I like the black trim.



Apart from the tranny and alternator I need a couple of new batteries and some small bits and pieces to make this car perfect.

First off is dismantling engine and transmission, pretty straight forward, it just takes a load of time.



A bit of help on the way is always welcome..



Finally down



Mine is a 2003 model, imported from Italy , it has had some previous work, engine was replaced in 2006 by a brand new one ...





Alternator needs some work, the orings was powder on the hose connections.



The tranny is finally separated from the engine..



The culprit is found, the inputshaft on the A-Drum was shared clean off..



The new and old A-Drum



Going to do a complete rebuild , got all the parts of E-Bay for a really good price..



The clutch housing in the A-Drum also had a crack, never seen this kind of failure before, probably due to faulty mounting in the first place, it was not leaking however.



German reinforced A-Drum



What else should I replace when the package is serviceable ? Any thoughts ?



To be continued...


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## PowerDubs (Jul 22, 2001)

keirn said:


> What else should I replace when the package is serviceable ? Any thoughts ?
> 
> 
> 
> To be continued...





I read the first part- bought W12 on a whim w/ bad alt and trans and I cringed.

Then I scrolled down and saw you had everything under control.

My kind of thread! Love it. Keep posting pics and details.


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Hi (sorry, I don't know your name),

Welcome to the forum! Although the forum is probably the last place you need to look at, judging by the serious work you are doing!  

Thank you for making the thread and posting. I think it will create a lot of interest. That should be a great car when you are finished.

Chris


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Hi 
Thanks, the name is Ole 

Naah, I got it pretty much under control, but the alternator is starting to give me bad vibrations, silly expensive even used, and no one that I know of can repair it, or rather are willing to look at it..
So a new one, but at what price ?


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## PowerDubs (Jul 22, 2001)

Everything is silly expensive on there cars. Comes with the territory.

In the end, you need to rationalize the quality, comfort and power vs the price. If you are ok with a lesser car at a lesser running cost no problem. Many of us are ok with the cost premium for the increase in quality much like fine dining.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Hehe, I am way beyond that kind of rationalization, I just need a new alternator 
So buying a new one, repair the old or buy a used one... that is the question at hand..

/Ole


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi Ole:

Welcome to the forum community!

Great photos, glad to see you have it all under control. I think there is another discussion somewhere in our forum about alternator disassembly - I'm not sure where it is, you will need to use the search feature to find it.

Where are you located? May I trouble you to fill in your forum profile so we know a bit more about you and your car? Instructions for that are here: Please Read - Regarding your Forum Profile

Best regards,

Michael


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

*Alternator threads*

The forum threads are hard to find since sometimes you have to search for _Alternator_ and sometimes _Generator_. Willem (WillemBal) has contributed a lot of information. 

This thread describes some heavy-duty data logging to discover what was going on:
Help Needed for Alternator Problems & Measurements Using VCDS

This one explains how it is possible to replace the W12's alternator without dropping the engine. It also explains how there are different versions of the alternator and that it's quite likely that you will get hold of the wrong replacement:
Generator replacement - the "easy way"


Chris


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

So, after a little digging around in ETKA, the correct option for the alternator is : 07C 903 018 X
This seems to be the one that all models using this kind of alternator is pointing to.

What I also conducted is that the OEM O-Rings will not last long, the main fault factor seems to be waterdamages.
So I suggest using VITON O-Rings as they seem to be up to the spec.

A new 07C 903 018 X is priced at €626 in my version of ETKA (7,4 Plus Update 1027) , tax not included.


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Just in case someone finds this thread while they are looking for part numbers, these are the W12 alternators that are 'out there', both Delphi and Hitachi (both of these have car build option code 8GH, meaning 190A alternator rating):


Car Build Code T08 (W12 engine 07C.2) - uses Delphi unit, all with electrical plug 4D0 971 992 (2-pin black/violet)
<pre>
07C 903 021E from start >> 3D-3-005 500
07C 903 021F replaces the above also order pulley p/n 07D 903 119
07C 903 018 3D-3-005 501 >> 3D-5-005 500 also order pulley p/n 07D 903 119
07C 903 018X replaces the above
</pre>
Car Build Code T1H (W12 engine 07C.4) - uses Hitachi unit:
<pre>
07C 903 021N 3D-5-005 501 >> 3D-6-101 000 connector 4D0 971 992A (2-pin black/blue)
07C 903 021NX replaces the above connector 4D0 971 992A (2-pin black/blue)
07C 903 021P 3D-7-000 001 >> present connector 4D0 971 992B (2-pin black/orange)
07C 903 021PX 3D-7-000 001 >> present connector 4D0 971 992B (2-pin black/orange)
</pre>

Chris


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Ole:

Where are you located (meaning, what country, or better still, what city)?

Michael


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

PanEuropean said:


> Ole:
> 
> Where are you located (meaning, what country, or better still, what city)?
> 
> Michael


Sweden, Hjärup

Close to Malmö and Lund


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Ah, OK, thanks.

I am in Zurich Switzerland at the moment, but I will be riding south (on holiday) to former Yugoslavia, not north, so unfortunately I will miss you.

Michael


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

So..
A brand new alternator is on its way, should be ready for delivery at the end of this week.

The tranny is for most parts finished, all the good stuff is back inside. I had to replace a couple of shims on the A-Drum due to get the play within spec, other than that it now has a new F-Clutch, new bearings , o-rings and clutch lammellas. Cant wait to put it back in the car.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Some progress, the new alternator has arrived at the workshop and I finally have some time over.



The plug connecting the waterhose to the alternator has clear evidence of beeing leaking for a long time..



Here you can see the old O-Ring compared to the new one, no wonder it had a leak.



Cleaned up the connecting "stub"




Alternator test fitted 




Main lead attached




A new toy


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

> A new toy


Are you planning to split the W12 into two VR6's for maintenance purposes? 

Just out of interest, was the alternator the Delphi one?

Chris


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

It was indeed the Delphi one.

//Ole


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## ajz9415 (Feb 7, 2005)

Watching the progress


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Allright , puttings things back together is way more time consuming than merely tearing it apart.



Lining up the exhaust correct is really important, getting it right the first time saves you a lot of trouble later on, I measured the clearance when I dismantled it to make sure it comes back on in the same place as before.



After a couple of hours of making sure everthing was in place I got the engine mounted in the bay.
A really important point is that you do not want to use the threads on the bolts to force the engine into place, I got it perfectly the first time and was very pleased that all bolts lined up perfectly.



I still have a lot of work to do, but I am really pleased that it all went so well ...


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Engine in place, all hooked up minus one intake manifold.



The evidence from the gas cenversion is pretty obvious, but if i am really lucky i will get my hands on a new one in a couple of days.



Got it started , but the idle was rough, VAG-COM told me the culprit was a oxygen sensor, luck for me , it was the only one you actually can get at pretty easy..
Would you take a look at that :|



Lucky for me , I had a spare from an other project..

After a short test drive I am really happy , the tranny shifts silky smooth and behaves wonderfully !!

Here it is back in the workshop after the test drive.. 
Man , I love this piece of machinery.. My A8 is for sale, for sure.



So whats left, well, bits and pieces of plastic, the front fender and for some reason the Xenon Range is not working, cannot even contact the controller via VAG-COM.. that needs sorting out, other than that Perfect ! 



to be continued...


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

The A8 if anyone is curious 




I really like the Newer A8 rims, they just sit perfect on my car.



I wonder if they would fit on the Phaeton .. probably not

But these guys probably would, what do you think ?


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## Daytonabridge (Jan 19, 2014)

Hi Ole ,
Is there anything you can't do !!! . I am staggered at what your'e doing on a W12 , are you a Phaeton Tech ? . I read with interest the repairs and the photos just add to the whole experience of understanding our cars , thank you . Along with the Moderators I look forward to you helping us out with your knowledge .
On the subject of wheels , I have fitted a set of A8 wheels and they look great .


Graham .


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Hehe , thank you Graham!

Well, it is a car, similar to other cars, just more stuff tight packed, and of course, a lot of expensive tight packed stuff at that.
I am not a Phaeton Tech, my actual job is designing and implementing Datacenter networks 
However I do have some background as a car tech, my passion and "feel-well" often comes from cars and the tinkering I do wirh them.
I also have some experince with automatic transissions , all self learned and often by a try and error basis, well and lot of searching online of course..
Basically all high torque automatics looks the same inside once you pop them open.
As Nike tells us.. just do it..

Cheers 
Ole


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## Bindaham (Apr 4, 2014)

keirn said:


> it is a car, similar to other cars


 Oh yeah :laugh:


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

So--- I ran into some trouble, someone has been creative when they plugged in the lambdaprobes, I think they have exchanged them at some point and actually changed the connectors.

See the VAG-COM Scan below, there is tons of errors , mostly I think due to low battery voltage at some point, most stuff work...







VCDS Version: Beta 14.8.1 (x64)
Data version: 20140905
beloc
Monday,15,September,2014,16:54:08:30493

Chassis Type: 3D (3D - VW Phaeton (2002 > 2006))
Scan: 01 02 03 05 06 07 08 09 11 13 15 16 17 18 19 23 27 28 29 2E
34 36 37 38 39 46 47 55 56 57 65 66 68 69 71 75 76 77

VIN: WVWZZZ3DZ38003667 Mileage: 171120km-106329miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine Labels: 07C-906-018-BAP1.lbl
Part No SW: 07C 906 018 B HW: 
Component: D1-6.0L-AT G ª4691 
Coding: 0000173
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 247FD140E4ACE21A9D-FFFF

No Faults Found
or DTCs not supported by controller
or a communication error occurred

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 3D0-927-156.lbl
Part No: 3D0 927 156 C
Component: AG5 01L 6.0 W12 RdW 0910 
Coding: 0000101
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2867C5709884067AB1-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
17125 - Torque Converter Clutch 
P0741 - 003 - Stuck OFF / No Power being transferred
Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2560 /min
RPM: 2272 /min
RPM: 2240 /min
(no units): 1.0
Torque: 488.0 Nm
Temperature: 96.0°C
T.B. Angle: 46.4°
(no units): 4.0


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 3D0-614-517.lbl
Part No: 3D0 614 517 J
Component: ESP 5.7 allrad H24 0042 
Coding: 0008697
Shop #: WSC 00120 000 00000
VCID: 2961C074838E3F72AE-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
01119 - Gear Recognition Signal 
000 - - - Intermittent
01826 - Sensor for Steering Angle (G85); Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
000 - - - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 05: Acc/Start Auth. Labels: 3D0-909-13x-05.lbl
Part No SW: 3D0 909 131 T HW: 5WK 470 21
Component: Kessy 6120 
Coding: 0000232
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 32532718AE587CAA1F-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: XXXXXXXXXXX 
Component: ELV XXXX

5 Faults Found:
00171 - Key 1 not learned 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System 
014 - Defective - Intermittent
01299 - Diagnostic Interface for Data Bus (J533) 
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation - Intermittent
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
009 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent
00087 - Terminal 30 for Starting Relevant Consumers 
009 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 06: Seat Mem. Pass Labels: 3D0-959-759.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 759 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 BF 1401 
Coding: 0000003
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 35591C045F366B923A-FFFF

4 Faults Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 07: Control Head Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl
Part No: 3D0 035 007 
Component: ZAB COCKPIT 0143 
Coding: 0500215
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 55572
VCID: 569BBB88E270408AD3-FFFF

3 Faults Found:
00384 - Optical Databus 
004 - No Signal/Communication
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
01341 - Control Module in Instrument Panel On Comfort CAN (J285) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 3D0-907-040.lbl
Part No: 3D0 907 040 D
Component: Climatronic D1 1123 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 1F75DEACCDCAC1C2C0-FFFF

6 Faults Found:
01274 - Air Flow Flap Positioning Motor (V71) 
014 - Defective
00779 - Outside Air Temp Sensor (G17) 
010 - Open or Short to Plus
00926 - Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00229 - Refrigerant Pressure 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
01308 - Control Module for Roof Electronics (J528) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 3D0-937-049-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 937 049 E
Component: STG.Bordnetz 4501 
Coding: 0000003
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 2C6F39608C7C2A5A55-FFFF

3 Faults Found:
01494 - Bulb for Parking Lamps; Left (M1) 
007 - Short to Ground - Intermittent
01308 - Control Module for Roof Electronics (J528) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00907 - Intervention load Management 
000 - -

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 11: Engine II Labels: 07C-906-018-BAP2.lbl
Part No SW: 07C 906 018 B HW: 
Component: D1-6.0L-AT G ª4691 
Coding: 0000173
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 247FD140E4ACE21A9D-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
19674 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B3 S2; Heating Circuit 
P3218 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
19704 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B4 S2; Heating Circuit 
P3248 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags Labels: 3D0-909-601.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 601 A
Component: Airbag 8.4E 0506 
Coding: 0341705
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2171D854FBBEF732F6-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00532 - Supply Voltage B+ 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel Labels: 3D0-953-549.lbl
Part No: 3D0 953 549 C
Component: Lenksäulenmodul 3301 
Coding: 0000112
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2D693464B766235242-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
00532 - Supply Voltage B+ 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 3D0-920-xxx-17.lbl
Part No: 3D0 920 880 S
Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT RB4 2411 
Coding: 0031111
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 35591C045F366B923A-FFFF

No Faults Found
or DTCs not supported by controller
or a communication error occurred

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl
Part No: 6N0 909 901 
Component: Gateway K<>CAN 0101 
Coding: 0000006
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 55572
VCID: 70D7ED1060D40EBA29-FFFF

12 Faults Found:
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00461 - Control Module for Seat Memory; Passenger (J521) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00462 - Control Module for Seat Memory; Rear (J522) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00478 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Rear (J524) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00908 - Control Module for Wiper Motor 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01308 - Control Module for Roof Electronics (J528) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01327 - Control Module for Parking Aid (J446) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01335 - Drivers Seat/Mirror Position Control Module (J543) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01300 - Control Module for Navigation with CD-Rom (J401) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01305 - Databus for Infotainment 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
02174 - Analog/Digital clock 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 28: HVAC, Rear Labels: 3D0-919-158.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 158 D
Component: Klima-Bedienteil D1 0116 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2C6F39608C7C2A5A55-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 29: Left Light Labels: 3D0-909-157.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 157 
Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(l) X012 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 40790 222 10630
VCID: 66FB8B485210D00A43-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
01539 - Headlights Not Adjusted 
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation - MIL ON

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 34: Level Control Labels: 3D0-907-553-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 907 553 A
Component: LUFTFDR.-CDC- 3C1V0 1090 
Coding: 0015500
Shop #: WSC 02136 264 11712
VCID: 2579CC44EF961B128A-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
00778 - Steering Angle Sensor (G85) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01598 - Drive Battery Voltage 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr Labels: 3D0-959-760.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 760 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 F 1401 
Coding: 0000004
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2D693464B766235242-FFFF

10 Faults Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00997 - Motor for Driver's Seat Position; Fore/Aft (V48) 
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit - Intermittent
01174 - Driver Seat Height Adjustment Motor (V138) 
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit - Intermittent
01902 - Lumbar Support Fore / Aft Adjustment Motor (V230) 
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit - Intermittent
00998 - Motor for Driver's Seat Recline (V45) 
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit - Intermittent
01903 - Seat Tilt Adjustment Motor (V231) 
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit - Intermittent
01901 - Lumbar Support Height Adjustment Motor (V229) 
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 37: Navigation Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 887 
Component: NAVIGATION 0108 
Coding: 0400000
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 71D1E8146BDE07B226-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 38: Roof Electronics Labels: 3D0-907-135.lbl
Part No: 3D0 907 135 B
Component: Dachmodul 0605 
Coding: 0000014
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2273D758FEB8EC2AEF-FFFF

4 Faults Found:
00196 - Inside Mirror Horizontal Position Sensor (G353) 
006 - Short to Plus
00926 - Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00308 - Supply Voltage for Motors for Sunroof/sunroof Shade 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 39: Right Light Labels: 3D0-909-158.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 158 
Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(r) X012 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 67E5864C551AC90278-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
01539 - Headlights Not Adjusted 
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation - MIL ON

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 3D0-959-933.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 933 F
Component: HSG 0101 
Coding: 0000040
Shop #: WSC 12345 123 999999
VCID: 335D221C514275A214-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3D0 959 933 F
Component: HSG 0101

Subsystem 2 - Part No: 3D1 959 701 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet FS 0101

Subsystem 3 - Part No: 3D1 959 702 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet BF 0101

Subsystem 4 - Part No: 3D0 959 703 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet HL 0101

Subsystem 5 - Part No: 3D0 959 704 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet HR 0101

Subsystem 6 - Part No: 3D0 909 610 A
Component: 3G HDSG 2320

Subsystem 7 - Part No: 7L0 907 719 
Component: Neigungssensor 0018

20 Faults Found:
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01308 - Control Module for Roof Electronics (J528) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00927 - Terminal 30 (Right) 
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
01516 - Terminal 30; Left 
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
00926 - Terminal 30 
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00576 - Terminal 15 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
01141 - Luggage Compartment Unlocking Switch (E165) 
007 - Short to Ground - Intermittent
00325 - Rear Window Opening Button (E361) 
007 - Short to Ground - Intermittent
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -
00000 - End of output 
000 - -

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 47: Sound System Labels: 7Lx-035-4xx-47.lbl
Part No: 3D0 035 456 
Component: 08K-AUDIOVERST 0109 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 5E8BA3A88A4088CA8B-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3D0 035 456 
Component: 08K-AUDIOVERST 0109

No Faults Found
or DTCs not supported by controller
or a communication error occurred

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 57: TV Tuner Labels: 3D0-919-146.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 146 
Component: TV Tuner H07 1205 
Coding: 0000010
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 65F98C44AF16DB124A-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00459 - Control Module for Display and Input; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 65: Tire Pressure Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 907 273 
Component: Reifendruckueberw. 0018 
Coding: 0011244
Shop #: WSC 40334 222 183703
VCID: 63FD925CA122A522A4-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective - MIL ON
01312 - Powertrain Data Bus 
013 - Check DTC Memory - MIL ON

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 66: Seat, Rear Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 959 860 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 H 1416 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 00999 444 64523
VCID: 2E6B3368BA60584A7B-FFFF

4 Faults Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 68: Wiper Electr. Labels: 3Dx-955-1xx-V1.clb
Part No: 3D1 955 119 
Component: Front Wiper 2005 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 66FB8B485210D00A43-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
01321 - Control Module for Airbags (J234) 
013 - Check DTC Memory

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 71: Battery Charger Labels: 3D0-915-181.lbl
Part No: 3D0 915 181 C
Component: Batteriemanagement 2700 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 237DD25CE1A2E522E4-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 76: Park Assist Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 919 283 B
Component: ?? Einparkhilfe_ 0606 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2961C074838E3F72AE-FFFF

9 Faults Found:
01629 - Sensor for Parking-Aid; Front Left (G255) 
009 - Open or Short to Ground
01628 - Sensor for Parking-Aid; Front Mid-Left (G254) 
009 - Open or Short to Ground
00434 - Left Front Inner Parking Aid Sensor (G332) 
009 - Open or Short to Ground
00435 - Front Right Inner Parking Aid Sensor (G333) 
009 - Open or Short to Ground
01627 - Sensor for Parking-Aid; Front Mid-Right (G253) 
009 - Open or Short to Ground
01626 - Sensor for Parking-Aid; Front Right (G252) 
009 - Open or Short to Ground
00435 - Front Right Inner Parking Aid Sensor (G333) 
014 - Defective - Intermittent
01547 - Sensor for Parking Aid; Rear Mid-Right (G205) 
014 - Defective - Intermittent
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent

End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 12:10)--------------------------


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

So, what did I do ?

Well, I need to sort out the pin-out and color codes for the oxygen sensors, so I went to Bentley Publishers and purchased the manual...

good grief, why oh why did I not do that before .. awwh man , that would have saved me tons of time troubleshooting several issues... 


For instance ..., color-codes 


aah



Find stuff 



Get tips and tricks... 






Simply awesome stuff !!

A must have for this kind of car.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Now, thanks to Bentley, I know how to remove and install the transmission without removing the engine ..


----------



## PowerDubs (Jul 22, 2001)

keirn said:


> Well, it is a car, similar to other cars, just more stuff tight packed, As Nike tells us.. just do it..




I like your style,.. I am of the same cloth.

:thumbup::beer:


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Thanks.. Truth be told everyone, I messed up, I think the final drive is shot and needs to be replaced, funny driving noise from transmission when under load... Shifts smoothly..


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

A little youtube video of the Phaeton running on Idle


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Felt sooo good to wash it


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Hi Ole,

You have achieved an awesome amount of work. Congratulations! :thumbup:

Did you find out yet what DTCs remained on a scan after you cleared all the old spurious reports created during the work, due to battery and controller disconnections and the like?

Chris


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Thanks, not quite there yet.
But tonight.. We will see.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Oh boy...

So, clared all DTC's and did a second scan...


Engine I and II is concerning me, I get supply voltage to the heater circuit, the resistance over the sensors are fine, cannot really find anything wrong...
I guess I have to check the cabling from end to end and see what is going on in the harness... 

The Coolant fan 2 : It is working fine, I cleaned up the connectors, measured supply voltage and ground, all seems fine.

ABS controller: No Idea what is going on there ..

The airflap thinggy and the control module for the seat memory is not essential , but annoying, I will sort it out eventually..

Bentley eBahn, prepare to enlighten me .. please .. 

Cheers




VCDS Version: Release 12.12.3 (x64)
Data version: 20140822

Tuesday,16,September,2014,21:14:20:30493

Chassis Type: 3D (3D - VW Phaeton (2002 > 2006))
Scan: 01 02 03 05 06 07 08 09 11 13 15 16 17 18 19 23 27 28 29 2E
34 36 37 38 39 46 47 55 56 57 65 66 68 69 71 75 76 77

VIN: WVWZZZ3DZ38003667 Mileage: 171130km/106335miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine Labels: 07C-906-018-BAP1.lbl
Part No SW: 07C 906 018 B HW: 
Component: D1-6.0L-AT G ª4691 
Coding: 0000173
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 247FD140E4ACE23EDF5-FFFF

5 Faults Found:
18070 - Coolant Fan Control 2 
P1662 - 002 - Short to Ground - Intermittent
17606 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B1 S2 
P1198 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
17607 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B2 S2 
P1199 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
18331 - Please Check DTC Memory of ECU Number 2 
P1923 - 008 - 
16540 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B2 S2 
P0156 - 008 - Malfunction in Circuit - Intermittent
Readiness: 0110 1001

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 3D0-927-156.lbl
Part No: 3D0 927 156 C
Component: AG5 01L 6.0 W12 RdW 0910 
Coding: 0000101
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2867C5709884065EF3D-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 3D0-614-517.lbl
Part No: 3D0 614 517 J
Component: ESP 5.7 allrad H24 0042 
Coding: 0008697
Shop #: WSC 00120 000 00000
VCID: 2961C074838E3F56EC3-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
01119 - Gear Recognition Signal 
000 - - - Intermittent
01826 - Sensor for Steering Angle (G85); Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
000 - - - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 05: Acc/Start Auth. Labels: 3D0-909-13x-05.lbl
Part No SW: 3D0 909 131 T HW: 5WK 470 21
Component: Kessy 6120 
Coding: 0000232
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 32532718AE587C8E5D9-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: XXXXXXXXXXX 
Component: ELV XXXX

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 06: Seat Mem. Pass Labels: 3D0-959-759.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 759 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 BF 1401 
Coding: 0000003
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 35591C045F366BB678B-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 07: Control Head Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl
Part No: 3D0 035 007 
Component: ZAB COCKPIT 0143 
Coding: 0500215
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 55572
VCID: D69B3B886270C0AE111-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 3D0-907-040.lbl
Part No: 3D0 907 040 D
Component: Climatronic D1 1123 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 1F75DEACCDCAC1E6827-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
01274 - Air Flow Flap Positioning Motor (V71) 
014 - Defective

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 3D0-937-049-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 937 049 E
Component: STG.Bordnetz 4501 
Coding: 0000003
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 2C6F39608C7C2A7E175-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 11: Engine II Labels: 07C-906-018-BAP2.lbl
Part No SW: 07C 906 018 B HW: 
Component: D1-6.0L-AT G ª4691 
Coding: 0000173
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 247FD140E4ACE23EDF5-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
19674 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B3 S2; Heating Circuit 
P3218 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
19704 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B4 S2; Heating Circuit 
P3248 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags Labels: 3D0-909-601.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 601 A
Component: Airbag 8.4E 0506 
Coding: 0341705
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2171D854FBBEF716B43-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel Labels: 3D0-953-549.lbl
Part No: 3D0 953 549 C
Component: Lenksäulenmodul 3301 
Coding: 0000112
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2D693464B766237600B-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 3D0-920-xxx-17.lbl
Part No: 3D0 920 880 S
Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT RB4 2411 
Coding: 0031111
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 35591C045F366BB678B-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl
Part No: 6N0 909 901 
Component: Gateway K<>CAN 0101 
Coding: 0000006
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 55572
VCID: F0D76D10E0D48E9EEBD-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 28: HVAC, Rear Labels: 3D0-919-158.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 158 D
Component: Klima-Bedienteil D1 0116 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2C6F39608C7C2A7E175-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 29: Left Light Labels: 3D0-909-157.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 157 
Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(l) X012 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 40790 222 10630
VCID: E6FB0B48D210502E811-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 34: Level Control Labels: 3D0-907-553-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 907 553 A
Component: LUFTFDR.-CDC- 3C1V0 1090 
Coding: 0015500
Shop #: WSC 02136 264 11712
VCID: 2579CC44EF961B36C8B-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr Labels: 3D0-959-760.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 760 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 F 1401 
Coding: 0000004
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2D693464B766237600B-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 37: Navigation Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 887 
Component: NAVIGATION 0108 
Coding: 0400000
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: F1D16814EBDE8796E43-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 38: Roof Electronics Labels: 3D0-907-135.lbl
Part No: 3D0 907 135 B
Component: Dachmodul 0605 
Coding: 0000014
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2273D758FEB8EC0EAD9-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00196 - Inside Mirror Horizontal Position Sensor (G353) 
006 - Short to Plus

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 39: Right Light Labels: 3D0-909-158.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 158 
Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(r) X012 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: E7E5064CD51A4926BA7-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 3D0-959-933.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 933 F
Component: HSG 0101 
Coding: 0000040
Shop #: WSC 12345 123 999999
VCID: 335D221C5142758656F-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3D1 959 701 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet FS 0101

Subsystem 2 - Part No: 3D1 959 702 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet BF 0101

Subsystem 3 - Part No: 3D0 959 703 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet HL 0101

Subsystem 4 - Part No: 3D0 959 704 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet HR 0101

Subsystem 5 - Part No: 3D0 909 610 A
Component: 3G HDSG 2320

Subsystem 6 - Part No: 7L0 907 719 
Component: Neigungssensor 0018

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 47: Sound System Labels: 7Lx-035-4xx-47.lbl
Part No: 3D0 035 456 
Component: 08K-AUDIOVERST 0109 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: DE8B23A80A4008EE491-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3D0 035 456 
Component: 08K-AUDIOVERST 0109

No Faults Found
or DTCs not supported by controller
or a communication error occurred

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 57: TV Tuner Labels: 3D0-919-146.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 146 
Component: TV Tuner H07 1205 
Coding: 0000010
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: E5F90C442F165B3688B-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00459 - Control Module for Display and Input; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 65: Tire Pressure Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 907 273 
Component: Reifendruckueberw. 0018 
Coding: 0011244
Shop #: WSC 40334 222 183703
VCID: E3FD125C2122250666F-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 66: Seat, Rear Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 959 860 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 H 1416 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 00999 444 64523
VCID: 2E6B3368BA60586E391-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 68: Wiper Electr. Labels: 3Dx-955-1xx-V1.clb
Part No: 3D1 955 119 
Component: Front Wiper 2005 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: E6FB0B48D210502E811-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 71: Battery Charger Labels: 3D0-915-181.lbl
Part No: 3D0 915 181 C
Component: Batteriemanagement 2700 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 237DD25CE1A2E506A6F-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 76: Park Assist Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 919 283 B
Component: ?? Einparkhilfe_ 0606 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2961C074838E3F56EC3-FFFF

No fault code found.

End ---------------------------------------------------------------------


----------



## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

I can't help with the engine/o2 sensor issues, but I can tell you that flap motor failure isn't unusual. I believe the V71 is relatively easily accessible from the rear of the engine bay, there's some info (although not much, you'll need to look at the diagram) here: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...V113)-not-working-Already-replaced-motor!-too

The mirror controller is all housed in the overhead that the mirror attaches to, although if it's the position sensor that might be in the mirror itself. I don't remember for sure, but I _think_ that module might have some relevance to the seat memory too. Hopefully it's just a wiring problem, the mirror & controller are fairly expensive assuming you even want to bother fixing it.


----------



## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

*Alternative alternator leak fix*

What a gold mine this forum is!

After a year and 30000 km with my Phaeton I have had many questions that found answers on this forum, and a few issues, but most of all a big smile on my face every km of driving!

I did experience the above lousy o-ring flaw and VW insisted on removal of engine.
Estimated cost: at least 2000 €! For replacement of an o-ring for 1€... 
I did not agree to this, so I removed bumper, washer fluid reservoir and oil cooler to get access to the screw that holds the bracket over the connecting "stubs".
The rubber mountings that holds the oil cooler in place WILL break and have to be renewed as the workshop manual states, so be sure to have those before you remove the oil cooler (or to be more correct slide it down out of the way, you don't need to disconnect any tubes from it). It is a little bit tricky to clean the inner "stub" and the water entry on the alternator side, but it is possible. As I didn't experience any malfunctions with the alternator I did not want to remove the alternator with all the extra work. The cost for the repair done this way ends at 50€ instead of the 2000€.
Some pictures of the work:



























If it should be necessary to remove the alternator in the future I know how to do this thanks to the link in this thread. Thanks!

One question: My leak was so small that I didn't have to top up the coolant more then 3-4 times over 30000 km. The plastic cover had the pink residue on the outside, but i suspect it can be found under the cover as well. Should I leave it as it is or could it be a good idea to flush it with destilled water? Or could this make things worse?

I must say it is amazing how much work you guys put in to this to get life so much easier for all of us! The approach in this thread is really in my taste. Nice work, Ole! 

/Lennart


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

The rubber mountings do indeed break, I managed to save one, but replaced them all anyway, quite expensive too.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Oh, and by the way, I figured out why I had such a "funny" grinding noise in the transmission.

Turns out I forgot to fill the rear end final drive with transmission fluid, such a stupid mistake.:screwy:
It just so happened that I had a spare one so I managed to exchange the unit while the transmission was still in the car, filled it up and tested , no more noise. Pheew..

Fluid chart:


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

ravenflies said:


> What a gold mine this forum is!
> 
> 
> One question: My leak was so small that I didn't have to top up the coolant more then 3-4 times over 30000 km. The plastic cover had the pink residue on the outside, but i suspect it can be found under the cover as well. Should I leave it as it is or could it be a good idea to flush it with destilled water? Or could this make things worse?
> ...


Thanks Lennart.

You could try to flush it out, but the residue on my alternator did not really solve in water, did not press the issue much since I had to leave it in exchange for the "new" unit I bought.
Absolutely crucial is the spec of the O-Rings , it should be VITON's best spec.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

The solution for the Lambda problem is eluding me..


----------



## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

I fear you may be in largely uncharted territory, there are only a handful of people here I can think of that even approach your level of competence (Willem, Josh, Jason??). Jason may be your best bet for help, since he is also very knowledgeable when it comes to diagnosis with VCDS.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Ok merry Pheaton W12 owners, I need a favor.

If someone of you could take a look at your car (W12 with BAN Engine), pry open the cover where the connectors for the oxygen sensors are located and either photograph or write down the color codes and pinout on the circled connetors in the area on the graphic below , I would really appreciate it..

Something like this 
Green connector :
pin1 brown/yellow to white on sensor side 
pin2 Red/green to white 
Etc

The reason for me asking is that someone changed the oem connectors to some 3rd party ones sometime in the past.
I have a wiring diagram, but it is for the newer type of harness and it does not match the one I have.

Thanks


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Oh, and if anyone wants it, I can print out / make PDFs of the content in the eBahn and Elsawin should you need it. (the parts you need, it is a lot of info)


----------



## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

If there s anyone who has the "unlock code" for the two lower plastic lugs, position marked below, holding the cover down I can take a photo. I just can't release them without risking tearing them :banghead:.










Right, take off cover -B-...  I know I will feel stupid when I get the answer. As Always...


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Aah , awesome 
Tried to make an understandable graphic.




Does that make sense ?


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

@ ravenflies , where do you live ?


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

I have decided to take the transmission back out, the front final drive is shot and i want to do a overhaul of the rear one as well.
Since I don't really want to go through the whole process of removing the complete unit again I have decided to make a rig that will allow me to remove it without taking the whole thing apart.





The idea is to be able to remove the lower engine mount, that way the starter can be removed and the torque converter loosened from the flywheel.

The engine will be bolted on to the frame I am making, got the idea from the Bentley manual..


----------



## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

I do get the locking lashes on the sides open without any problems, but it stops at the two "lock pins" I try to show in the picture below. Approx. description, hard to see. I will take a picture tomorrow.










And I live in Linköping, will add that in my profile.


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

With reference to the eight Lambda sensors on a BAN production engine, the parts list refer to a changeover of some of them (but not others) from 4-pin to 6-pin parts after car serial number 00735 and again after serial number 04000. Your car is, from the scan, 03667.

That might be the source of some updating of the connectors on your car. Why only some should be revised and not others, I can't make out.

Engine #1 (right side) front and rear bank front and rear sensors were not updated, but those on Engine #2 (left) were. Plug shell kits were released to perform the update on failure, but at this moment I can't find a technical document referring to this.

Chris


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

ravenflies said:


> I do get the locking lashes on the sides open without any problems, but it stops at the two "lock pins" I try to show in the picture below. Approx. description, hard to see. I will take a picture tomorrow.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Aha, you just pry gently with a flat screwdriver until it pops open, at least that is what I did.


----------



## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

This is how it looks on my car, WVWZZZ3DZ48011357.










You can't see the colours on the engine controller side, hard to get a good picture of that, but I hope it is possible to figure it out with the pin numbers and wiríng diagram.

The reason for my strange questions before was that someone had put a great effort in pressing the cover _over_ the stop nothches on the guiding pins. Did take some special treatment to release.


----------



## SyncroS8 (Jul 9, 2012)

Great work.

I know exactly how much work is involved in what you're doing having stripped down a W12 Phaeton.

I still have the transmission if you're interested.

Keep us updated with your progress.

[email protected]

MG


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

ravenflies said:


> This is how it looks on my car, WVWZZZ3DZ48011357.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


First of all, thank you for making the effort to do this for me, simply awesome. 
But..  I really need to see the color coding on the other end as well, the connectors slide right out of the plastic frame and there should be enough play to take a photo or note the location.
It would be much appreciated !

Thanks 
Ole


----------



## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

keirn said:


> But..  I really need to see the color coding on the other end as well, the connectors slide right out of the plastic frame and there should be enough play to take a photo or note the location.


OK, had to use the car last time and my fingertips totally numb after the attempt to open the cover two days before. Now the cover opens as it should and I had the time to fiddle around a bit more. Hope it shows enough!










From the Wiring Diagram:










Good luck with your project!


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Awesome !
Thanks a lot buddy !


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Allrighty!

So this is basically where I left the Phaeton over a week ago...



Today I finally got some shoptime, and this is what I ended up with..



I am normally not a great fan of IKEA stuff, but today the old remains came to good use.



Note the bracket where the bolt sits on top, jup, those are the rear door locking lashes from a Nissan Patrol, who said that Jap cars are useless ? Huh ? 



It is not very pretty , but I am well pleased... 

Cheers mates !


----------



## Normaspappa (Jul 7, 2010)

Looking good mate! Bosse (2serve) hinted about this thread. :thumbup: Keep up the good work.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Aah, when mr Scirocco hints, you better obey


----------



## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

So with your awesome home-manufactured frame in place, the engine is supported from above with no skyhook necessary??


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

invisiblewave said:


> So with your awesome home-manufactured frame in place, the engine is supported from above with no skyhook necessary??


Yup, pretty darn neat !


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

So, I have been up to a little bit of this...



And this ...



and of course that ...




That put together, it does not make for much workshoptime..

You also know that I had some worn out final drives...


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Best built box.. EVER!

If I for some reason want to ship, lets say, a nuclear reactor.. I KNOW who to call !!

Awesome..


----------



## SyncroS8 (Jul 9, 2012)

keirn said:


> Best built box.. EVER!
> 
> If I for some reason want to ship, lets say, a nuclear reactor.. I KNOW who to call !!
> 
> Awesome..


Lol you're welcome :-D 

I just wanted to know that it was going to get there without being damaged. 

At 160kg, they're heavy enough to destroy themselves. 

Oh, if you end up with a dead main casing, I forgot to take a measurement for the crank position sensor. 

MG


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

*Scan from today*

Thrownig all sorts of codes, didnt start at first, seems that I have a faulty relay to nr 1 ecu, after clearing codes it started with a load of codes..

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saturday,30,May,2015,12:13:56:30493
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator
VCDS Version: 14.10.2.0 (x64)
Data version: 20150311
www.Ross-Tech.com


VIN: WVWZZZ3DZ38003667 License Plate: CWT
Mileage: 171410km-106509mi Repair Order: 


Chassis Type: 3D (3D - VW Phaeton (2002 > 2006))
Scan: 01 02 03 05 06 07 08 09 11 13 15 16 17 18 19 23 27 28 29 2E
34 36 37 38 39 46 47 55 56 57 65 66 68 69 71 75 76 77

VIN: WVWZZZ3DZ38003667 Mileage: 171410km-106509miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine Labels: 07C-906-018-BAP1.lbl
Part No SW: 07C 906 018 B HW: 
Component: D1-6.0L-AT G ª4691 
Coding: 0000173
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 247FD140E4ACE2012A7-FFFF

5 Faults Found:
18070 - Coolant Fan Control 2 
P1662 - 002 - Short to Ground - Intermittent
18331 - Please Check DTC Memory of ECU Number 2 
P1923 - 008 - 
17606 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B1 S2 
P1198 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
17607 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B2 S2 
P1199 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
16540 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B2 S2 
P0156 - 008 - Malfunction in Circuit
Readiness: 0110 1101

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 3D0-927-156.lbl
Part No: 3D0 927 156 C
Component: AG5 01L 6.0 W12 RdW 0910 
Coding: 0000101
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2867C5709884066106F-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 3D0-614-517.lbl
Part No: 3D0 614 517 J
Component: ESP 5.7 allrad H24 0042 
Coding: 0008697
Shop #: WSC 00120 000 00000
VCID: 2961C074838E3F69191-FFFF

5 Faults Found:
01314 - Engine Control Module 
013 - Check DTC Memory - Intermittent
01119 - Gear Recognition Signal 
000 - - 
01826 - Sensor for Steering Angle (G85); Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
000 - - - Intermittent
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 05: Acc/Start Auth. Labels: 3D0-909-13x-05.lbl
Part No SW: 3D0 909 131 T HW: 5WK 470 21
Component: Kessy 6120 
Coding: 0000232
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 32532718AE587CB1A8B-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: XXXXXXXXXXX 
Component: ELV XXXX

4 Faults Found:
00087 - Terminal 30 for Starting Relevant Consumers 
009 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
009 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01299 - Diagnostic Interface for Data Bus (J533) 
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 06: Seat Mem. Pass Labels: 3D0-959-759.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 759 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 BF 1401 
Coding: 0000003
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 35591C045F366B898D9-FFFF

3 Faults Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 07: Control Head Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl
Part No: 3D0 035 007 
Component: ZAB COCKPIT 0143 
Coding: 0500215
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 55572
VCID: 569BBB88E2704091643-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00480 - Control Module in Instruments for Infotainment CAN (J285) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 3D0-907-040.lbl
Part No: 3D0 907 040 D
Component: Climatronic D1 1123 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 1F75DEACCDCAC1D9775-FFFF

4 Faults Found:
01274 - Air Flow Flap Positioning Motor (V71) 
014 - Defective - Intermittent
00052 - Rear Right Footwell Temperature Sensor (G310) 
010 - Open or Short to Plus
00926 - Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 3D0-937-049-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 937 049 E
Component: STG.Bordnetz 4501 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 2C6F39608C7C2A41E27-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00907 - Intervention load Management 
000 - - 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 11: Engine II Labels: 07C-906-018-BAP2.lbl
Part No SW: 07C 906 018 B HW: 
Component: D1-6.0L-AT G ª4691 
Coding: 0000173
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 247FD140E4ACE2012A7-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
19679 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B3 S2 
P3223 - 004 - No Activity
19709 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B4 S2 
P3253 - 004 - No Activity

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags Labels: 3D0-909-601.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 601 A
Component: Airbag 8.4E 0506 
Coding: 0341705
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2171D854FBBEF729411-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00532 - Supply Voltage B+ 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel Labels: 3D0-953-549.lbl
Part No: 3D0 953 549 C
Component: Lenksäulenmodul 3301 
Coding: 0000112
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2D693464B7662349F59-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00532 - Supply Voltage B+ 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 3D0-920-xxx-17.lbl
Part No: 3D0 920 880 S
Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT RB4 2411 
Coding: 0031111
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 63069
VCID: 35591C045F366B898D9-FFFF

6 Faults Found:
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00466 - Control Module for Steering Column Electronics (J527) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01325 - Control Module for Tire Pressure Monitoring (J502) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01336 - Company Data Bus for Comfort System 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01305 - Databus for Infotainment 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl
Part No: 6N0 909 901 
Component: Gateway K<>CAN 0101 
Coding: 0000006
Shop #: WSC 00120 264 55572
VCID: 70D7ED1060D40EA19EF-FFFF

6 Faults Found:
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00466 - Control Module for Steering Column Electronics (J527) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01325 - Control Module for Tire Pressure Monitoring (J502) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01336 - Company Data Bus for Comfort System 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01305 - Databus for Infotainment 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 28: HVAC, Rear Labels: 3D0-919-158.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 158 D
Component: Klima-Bedienteil D1 0116 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2C6F39608C7C2A41E27-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 29: Left Light Labels: 3D0-909-157.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 157 
Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(l) X012 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 40790 222 10630
VCID: 66FB8B485210D011F43-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 34: Level Control Labels: 3D0-907-553-V1.clb
Part No: 3D0 907 553 A
Component: LUFTFDR.-CDC- 3C1V0 1090 
Coding: 0015500
Shop #: WSC 02136 264 11712
VCID: 2579CC44EF961B093D9-FFFF

3 Faults Found:
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00778 - Steering Angle Sensor (G85) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
01049 - Supply Voltage Term 50 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr Labels: 3D0-959-760.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 760 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 F 1401 
Coding: 0000004
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2D693464B7662349F59-FFFF

4 Faults Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective
00466 - Control Module for Steering Column Electronics (J527) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 37: Navigation Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 887 
Component: NAVIGATION 0108 
Coding: 0000000
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 71D1E8146BDE07A9911-FFFF

3 Faults Found:
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00384 - Optical Databus 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 38: Roof Electronics Labels: 3D0-907-135.lbl
Part No: 3D0 907 135 B
Component: Dachmodul 0605 
Coding: 0000014
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 2273D758FEB8EC3158B-FFFF

4 Faults Found:
00196 - Inside Mirror Horizontal Position Sensor (G353) 
006 - Short to Plus - Intermittent
00220 - Connection to Sunroof 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00308 - Supply Voltage for Motors for Sunroof/sunroof Shade 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00926 - Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 39: Right Light Labels: 3D0-909-158.lbl
Part No: 3D0 909 158 
Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(r) X012 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 67E5864C551AC919CF5-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 3D0-959-933.lbl
Part No: 3D0 959 933 F
Component: HSG 0101 
Coding: 0000040
Shop #: WSC 12345 123 999999
VCID: 335D221C514275B9A3D-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3D1 959 701 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet FS 0101

Subsystem 2 - Part No: 3D1 959 702 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet BF 0101

Subsystem 3 - Part No: 3D0 959 703 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet HL 0101

Subsystem 4 - Part No: 3D0 959 704 D
Component: Tuersteuergeraet HR 0101

Subsystem 5 - Part No: 3D0 909 610 A
Component: 3G HDSG 2320

Subsystem 6 - Part No: 7L0 907 719 
Component: Neigungssensor 0018

13 Faults Found:
00927 - Terminal 30 (Right) 
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
01516 - Terminal 30; Left 
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
00926 - Terminal 30 
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00576 - Terminal 15 
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
01331 - Door Control Module; Driver Side (J386) 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00932 - Electric Window Motor; Drivers Side (V147) 
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation - Intermittent
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387) 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388) 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00934 - Electric Window Motor; Rear Left (V26) 
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation - Intermittent
00930 - Locking Module for Central Locking; Rear Left (F222) 
008 - Implausible Signal
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J389) 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00935 - Electric Window Motor; Rear Right (V27) 
005 - No or Incorrect Basic Setting / Adaptation

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 47: Sound System Labels: 7Lx-035-4xx-47.lbl
Part No: 3D0 035 456 
Component: 08K-AUDIOVERST 0109 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 5E8BA3A88A4088D13C3-FFFF

Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3D0 035 456 
Component: 08K-AUDIOVERST 0109

No Faults Found
or DTCs not supported by controller
or a communication error occurred

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 57: TV Tuner Labels: 3D0-919-146.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 146 
Component: TV Tuner H07 1205 
Coding: 0000010
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
VCID: 65F98C44AF16DB09FD9-FFFF

1 Fault Found:
00459 - Control Module for Display and Input; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 65: Tire Pressure Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 907 273 
Component: Reifendruckueberw. 0018 
Coding: 0011244
Shop #: WSC 40334 222 183703
VCID: 63FD925CA122A53913D-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective - MIL ON
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 66: Seat, Rear Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 959 860 B
Component: Sitzmemory D1 H 1416 
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 00999 444 64523
VCID: 2E6B3368BA605851CC3-FFFF

3 Faults Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
00003 - Control Module 
014 - Defective
00477 - Control Module; Display & Input; Comfort CAN; Front (J523) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 68: Wiper Electr. Labels: 3Dx-955-1xx-V1.clb
Part No: 3D1 955 119 
Component: Front Wiper 2005 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 66FB8B485210D011F43-FFFF

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 71: Battery Charger Labels: 3D0-915-181.lbl
Part No: 3D0 915 181 C
Component: Batteriemanagement 2700 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 237DD25CE1A2E53953D-FFFF

2 Faults Found:
00085 - Starter Battery Switch-Over Relay (J580) 
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
01314 - Engine Control Module 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 76: Park Assist Labels: None
Part No: 3D0 919 283 B
Component: ?? Einparkhilfe_ 0606 
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2961C074838E3F69191-FFFF

No fault code found.

End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 10:40)--------------------------


----------



## keveola (May 5, 2015)

*Intake manifold*

Hi,

Did you replace the manifold gaskets each time you removed it? 

Somewhere, I read that the manifold bolts/fasteners aren't torqued-down very much and can be reuseable. A new, four-gasket set from the dealer is nearly $800 US. Is there a suitable aftermarket set available?

How many foot-pounds of torque is specified? I woukd like to replace my sparkplugs and a leaky injector, but the cost of gaskets is holding me back.

Great photos! Have you considered filming some YouTube tutorials?


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Video tutorials, haha that would be treat for all the english speakers in the world for sure. 
If you ever watched the show "hell on wheels" you would have noticed the peculiar accent the "swede" has.... Imagine a tutorial in that accent and you are spot on.

Anyway, lately I have done some more transmissions for both Phaetons and Audis, and you all know how heavy that pig is, so... Behold !!









What a difference this makes !!


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Paint is nice


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

So, friends, if anyone of you consider buying a "bullitproof" transmission from the New Jersey based company 517trans.com, let me share some insights.

First of all, the ZF5HP24A was built to withstand approx 420 nm of torque, with some valvebody tinkering and an upgraded A-Drum it can manage the torque produced by our W12 and the RS6. However, driving like you stole it WILL burn your clutches, mainly on 5.th gear , the size of the clutchpack is just to small to withstand the forces. Especially if you dont change the oil and filter on an regular basis.

Now, what about the 517trans ? 
They suggest that they can build a "bullitproof" 1000 nm "no problem" transmission from the 5HP.
This is just not true. 
There is no magic to this, the stuff you can put into this transmission is just not up to spec.
517trans will do a rather poor rebuild, reusing what they can salvage from any old core they have laying around , on top of that , they dont even clean it out properly. 
Just smack that pig back together with standard parts and hope for the best. 
Even better if you are on the other side of the pond, you are not likely to send it back to have them fix it are you ?

But, rather than ranting, let me share some pictures.

This is from a transmission built by 517trans, it has just clocked 600 miles since the rebuild, rough shifting and really hard downshifts was the initial problems.

"gunk" on the magnets, starting to smell fishy..



Not the good Norwegian kind of fish ..



Rather , something is rotten in New Jersey..



Lots of debree in the filter really gave me pause



This looks like some metal shaving , there are no reason for this beeing in the transmission if you clean it out properly....



The red stuff is Silicone gasket material... you NEVER put silicone gasket in a these transmissions, NEVER.



600 miles people 







Some of the valves in the valvebody had signs of beeing stuck , this does not happen over night .
1000 nm bullitproof mind you 





517trans for the win guys. Never Ever Trust these people.


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Hi Ole,

Many thanks for this review of a rebuilt transmission. Here's hoping the transmission shop concerned will chip in with their own comments and explanation.

I once sent off a small van to an unknown shop for an engine replacement. Unfortunately they broke off the entire steering wheel trying to bypass the latch after they lost the keys. then accidentally caved in its roof with a bale loader, then kept saying 'it's nearly ready' when I rang them. After a year I gave up and walked away.

There are some really good and reputable transmission shops. I hope we collectively have some good experiences as well as bad.

Chris


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Paximus said:


> Hi Ole,
> 
> Many thanks for this review of a rebuilt transmission. Here's hoping the transmission shop concerned will chip in with their own comments and explanation.
> 
> ...


+1 on that !
I would LOVE to hear, in great detail no less, how they will perform a 1000 nm bulletproof setup of this.
And let me be the first one to take off my hat and eat it with mustard and gunpowder if they can prove it.


----------



## PowerDubs (Jul 22, 2001)

Being from NJ, but not familiar with that shops name, I googled it.

The website is down. From what I can gather, the owners name was Sam and I may be wrong but it appears he used to work for Level Ten trans shop which is about 20 minutes in the other direction from 517trans...then started his own place.

Both shops have issues posted online.. but honestly, I think that will probably stand true for any auto trans place. There is just soo much that can and will go wrong.

Sorry to hear that you were one of the unlucky ones.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

PowerDubs said:


> Being from NJ, but not familiar with that shops name, I googled it.
> 
> The website is down. From what I can gather, the owners name was Sam and I may be wrong but it appears he used to work for Level Ten trans shop which is about 20 minutes in the other direction from 517trans...then started his own place.
> 
> ...


Hi PowerDubs

I hear what you are saying.
Actually, there are not that many things that can go wrong. 
True, there are a lot of parts that needs to be within spec, but I think that the main issue with this particular transmission is that it is not cleaned out and reassembled properly.
There have been work done on it , no question about that. 
I am no general specialist on transmissions, but I DO know my way around this particular pig since I have rebuilt several now and have seen all the common, and not so common faults. 
From this perspective, I know how much abuse it can take before it collapses. 
This transmission does not appear to have failed in that manner, I can tell.
Over torquing and massive boost have a particular signature, this does not have any of them. 
I also happen to know who owns this vehicle and he is really careful with his stuff.

I can reach the website from where I am sitting .. http://517trans.com/

I would like to have a talk to Sam at 517, not to rant or judge, but rather to know what he did in order to do a good rebuild.

TL;DR A pig with makeup is still a pig.
//Ole


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

*And this little piggy....*

Got the shipment from cascadetransmissionparts, (try to say that quickly 5 times)...
The kit looks really good.. complete with steels and everything


As an unexpected bonus I also got the Transgo Pressure regulator valve, this will eliminate the fluctuating pressure and spikes these transmissions are suffering from.
http://transgo.com/products.php?prd=5HP-24-PR&homeinclude=catalog&category_id=193&parent_id=28&product_id=275&countdisplay=1&start=0&addcountview=Yes

I just had to rip the old one out of the valve body, and behold, the original one has been "tuned" ...


I am at a loss , this is the most... retarded thing I have seen in a long while..
Tuning consists of 2 washers, regular iron washers... inside diameter is so big that it will brush up against the valve body and create scratches, thus making the regulator valve jam..





The updated valve is seen below the original one..

I also discovered that the needle bearing on the A-Hub is so worn that the hub pucks has been in contact with the a-assembly cover..



Smile and wave boys . Just smile and wave...


----------



## mugen85r (May 11, 2003)

Keirn, any new updates?


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

*Yes.. its out*

Hi guys

Just pulled my W12 out of storage, on to troubleshooting electrical problems. 
I had to hotwire the ECU relays to get the car started, even then it only runs on 1 bank...

So, I bought a engine wireing harness of ebay before Christmas , and I am planning to replace it at the same time I drop the engine .. again. 
Good news is that I am getting pretty good at it 

If you recall, i did a rebuild of the transmission, and the tranny works just fine, but.. forgot to fill the final drives.. blerrgh. 

Oh, and by the way, the RS6 transmission is still working like a charm, frequent oilchanges does the trick in making it last. 

Been shopping on ebay for a couple of new parts , since the right side had a leak, there are a couple of parts that needs to be replaced, including airbagsensors, the airduct with preheating and a couple of motors for the seat.


----------



## Bindaham (Apr 4, 2014)

Kerin :thumbup:


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Allrighty, the signal for the ECU relays.. is eluding me ..
So , started off by making sure I have power and 2 fresh batteries, problem persists. To be double sure, I went and bought 2 new ones , no go.
VCDS persists that there are no signal to the ECU relays, wich I agree with. If i jump the wire (negative signal) the car fires, but only on one bank, the other one is dead.
Now, I am pretty sure this is Not a ECU fault since I swapped them , same result. I am starting to think loss of signal on canbus, but to where ?
Well, going to have a look at the diagrams in ELSA and see I can figure out what is supposed to trigger them relays.

Got confirmation on all the stuff I bought by ebay, a cople of days now and it will start dropping in i hope.
I actually ended up buying a COMPLETE used harness, if nothing else , i can trace the elusive black and yellow wires while its sitting on the floor.

This is giving me a challenge, to be sure.. but eventually im gonna get lucky.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Bentley .. !


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)




----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

I have verifyed the symptom , but not found the fault , yet.
By measuring the signal coming from the ECU I found that it is ok when entering the main harness, I then hotwired the two leads to the relays , and whaddaya know, it fired right up on both banks.
I figure that the main harness has some serious issue somwhere between the relays and the ECU.

After that I started to measure resistance between the terminals on the connectores to the Oxygen sensors and found that it is almost 1K ohm, a huge loss somewhere on the way.
That will for sure explain all the error messages thrown from the ECU's. 
The actual fix I suspect is going to be a bit harder. 

But, the car is actually running on all 12 with the hotwires, and that tells me that I have it narrowed down to wire or contact problems.

I'll keep you posted !


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

If you didn't know it, there are a LOT of stuff packed into a Phaeton, some parts are overengineered, others not so much..
And, we need to kill the bastard who chose the type of plastic in the bumpers, it is just so brittle it falls apart from the smalles nudge.

So, I lost it, aand , need a new bumper, plastic parts for the headlight cleaner and some other bits and pieces... all in a days work ..


----------



## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

The dealer I'm occasionally forced to go to uses three people to lift the bumper off and on.


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

*A picture ...*










Found it ! 

A poor junction in the harness under the relays behind the plenum. 

I REALLY had to work my way through all the coupling points in order to even see it, but, there you go.. it runs without hotwires !! 

So , on to some troubleshooting on oxygen sensors 










When troubleshooting W12 - BAN , use address 31, you can see both ECU readouts at once .. the difference in lambda values are due to a air leak.

But , once that was fixed, I went onto greater things, you will remember my final-drive problem, well, time to get it sorted.










It took men a whole day last time, now, done in approx 5 hours... 











Greetings !











!!


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Hi Ole,

Now that Dresden is no longer assembling Phaetons, I hereby award you the title of "*Honorary Factory*"! 

That was a tenacious piece of work!

Chris


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Paximus said:


> Hi Ole,
> 
> Now that Dresden is no longer assembling Phaetons, I hereby award you the title of "*Honorary Factory*"!
> 
> ...


Haha, much appreciated, I find this piece of engineering more interesting each passing day !

Thanks !!


----------



## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Todays shopping list 

Gasket intake manifold 07C 133 238
Tempsensor x2 06A 919 501
Seal x2 19,6 X 3,6 + n 903 168 02


----------



## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

Ole, 

You should at least sell transmission stands and rebuild transmissions. 

If I had a shop, I would buy rebuilt transmissions from you. 

-Eric


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

Wow! Very interresting to follow the progress!
Thanks a lot for the VCDS address 31 tip, very useful in the hunt for the elusive intake air leak on my friends W12. After the last effort, changing a cracked oil separator, it leaked worse than ever before. Breather hoses strongly suspected, brittle as thin ice and expensive as gold. Well, to put things in perspective I just have to read this post  Keep up the good work!

Lennart


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## dinsdale piranha (Mar 24, 2016)

Keirn, I like your style. 
No fear and a go get'em attitude. 
I think your a Texan at heart!
By the way, what size are the alternator coolant tube O rings that you used?
I'm gonna refresh those along with all fluid's before I hand the W12 over to the wife.
Thank's in advance. Jeff:wave::thumbup:


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Thanks guys !

The O-Rings for the alternator:
OEM nr: N 907 834 01 
Size 13,1 x 1,6


Edit: Texan for Sure !!


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

Ole,

Since the engine has been out a few times, I was wondering if you have ever checked the sub frame bushings or motor mounts?

I was thinking that nobody replaces them and worn sub frame bushings or motor mounts could result in high noise and / or harshness (NVH).

I am interested in your findings if you have ever checked them.

-Eric


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN said:


> Ole,
> 
> Since the engine has been out a few times, I was wondering if you have ever checked the sub frame bushings or motor mounts?
> 
> ...


Hi Eric

I have indeed checked them out, and this time I am going to exchange the left motor mount.

//Ole


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

keirn said:


> Hi Eric
> 
> I have indeed checked them out, and this time I am going to exchange the left motor mount.
> 
> //Ole


Thanks Ole.

I was wondering if anybody ever checked those.

So, the other bushings and motor mounts were still good?

-Eric


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

keirn said:


>


Hi Ole,

That's some impressive work that you are putting into your W12!

I'm getting ready to fix the leaking rear seal on the transmission of my W12 and it's really hard to see with the driveshaft and exhaust still installed. Could you take a few detailed photos of the tail end of your transmission, would really appreciate to see how the seal is mounted (I did look it up in the Bentley manual but it doesn't show that black colored end piece in there) before I drop the exhaust and remove the driveshaft. 

Thanks much,


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Phaetonlvr said:


> Hi Ole,
> 
> That's some impressive work that you are putting into your W12!
> 
> ...


Of course , will do .


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN said:


> Thanks Ole.
> 
> I was wondering if anybody ever checked those.
> 
> ...


Pretty good as far as I can tell, I will try to do a writup on how and what I am looking for, and how to check the enginemounts.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

So, this is the enginemount, looks more or less like any other mount, apart from the little vacuum connection on the bottom.












Now, how to test the thing.
You need som way to exit the air from the inside, i have this really handy vacuum pump with a guage on it.










Hook it up to the mount, and start pumping.
There is not a whole lot of air inside to start with, so you will know if it is ok or not in a couple of pumps.
The idea is that it should not leak air back in while on vacuum. Did that make any sence at all ?










I pumped the air out and left it for a couple of minutes , no air leaked back in during that time, so the mount is good.

If you pump pressure in to it, it will make a funny squeek when it releases built up air.

So, if it holds vacuum for a minute, it is ok. 
Also make a visual inspection to look for cracks in rubber (big ones) or missing material.


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

Wow. Where does the air or vacuum hose come from? Is it part of the air suspension?


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Last time I did this I had to do some pretty scary manouvering to get the subframe for the enginemounts removed.
you need the space in order to remove the starter motor, and right side supportbracket, all that just to separate the converter from the flywheel. Gah.

So, this time I actually gave it some thought instead of just gunning it.. 
Came up with this, not pretty, but it works..










Then you just do the whole deal in reverse and get your engine back in place..










There is not a whole lot of space , so pay close attention , all the small parts ... expensive










Easy does it, aaand ....










We have liftoff


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN said:


> Wow. Where does the air or vacuum hose come from? Is it part of the air suspension?


Hi

No, it is connected to the intake manifold.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Oh, I forgot to take pictures of the rear end on the transmission, will get them tomorrow.


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

keirn said:


> Oh, I forgot to take pictures of the rear end on the transmission, will get them tomorrow.


Thanks for remembering to take those, looking forward to seeing the photos. The rear seal leak is staining my driveway quite a bit so I should get on it.

Btw, impressive work and thanks for sharing all those photos!


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Phaetonlvr said:


> Thanks for remembering to take those, looking forward to seeing the photos. The rear seal leak is staining my driveway quite a bit so I should get on it.
> 
> Btw, impressive work and thanks for sharing all those photos!


Thanks 

Ok, you are in for some work..

First , remove middle mufflers..
Then you see something like this










Closer up



















Then you need to remove the heatshield, unscrew the transaxle/propshaft, or whatever it is called...
After the shaft is loose, remove the 2 M8 skrews holding the shaft in place in the middle. 
Then you should be able to wiggle it a bit to make it come above the tranny , or below, what ever you prefer , just get it out of the way.

Then you will see this










Remove the M8 on the flange thinggy , Torx 40 , dont be cheap, buy expensive Torx tools (unlike me the first time) .. 










Remove the (propshaft ? flange thing) and the 4 M8 torx 40 , then you just pull the whole thing off










Knock out the old seal from behind










Here you go !










clean the thing off , and lubricate the new seal with some pertroleum based grease (vaseline is good) 

Place new seal










And find something in similar size for knocking it back in.. gently, if possible, please press it. (unlike me)










Take care to not push it too far, use the old dirty/clean line for reference.

Tadaa











Ok, this is important.. always replace the seal/gasket .. Don't ever intruduce silicon sealant , like this douche did.. 










This is the new seal










Put it back in place in the reverse order.

M8 screws, with Torx 40 heads is to be tightend to 27nm. 



Word of advise, when removing the middle mufflers, use a LOT of WD 40 and brakeclean, especially in the rear joints, once you wiggle it i bit it should come off pretty easy if you just lube it up.. When putting back together, use brakeclean as lube, it takes the WD40 stink out of it 

Hope this was helpful, even in norwegian english.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

And oh, I made some progress

Everything lined up, subframe in the right place, staring to come together..


















Start on Wednesday ?


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

keirn said:


> Hi
> 
> No, it is connected to the intake manifold.


Thanks. Were your vacuum lines all good?


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

Looking forward to seeing your car running on Wednesday.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN said:


> Thanks. Were your vacuum lines all good?


They all look good..


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

keirn said:


> Ok, you are in for some work..
> 
> Hope this was helpful, even in norwegian english.


Sure is and your English is perfectly fine. Very much appreciated that you did a step-by-step with photos!

The procedure looks pretty straight forward with no special tools required, which is good. I looked in the Bentley Repair Manual (the official one for us in the states) but couldn't find the procedure, did find the one for the prop shaft seal at the rear diff and that uses a lot of special tools.

Anyway, I have a few questions if you don't mind. Would it be easier to take the whole exhaust system from the center mufflers on back of instead just the center muffler. This would avoid dealing with the muffler clamps and since I have access to a four-post lift with two dolly jacks it might be easier that way.

Once the driveshaft is disconnected and out of the way is there enough space to get to take the rear transmission flange off when the trans is still in the car? I know you had the trans on a stand in the upright position but if it's in the car I assume the oil might all be leaking out!?

On this parts diagram it shows a gasket/seal (#2) at each end of the driveshaft. Did you have to replace that?


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Phaetonlvr said:


> Sure is and your English is perfectly fine. Very much appreciated that you did a step-by-step with photos!
> 
> The procedure looks pretty straight forward with no special tools required, which is good. I looked in the Bentley Repair Manual (the official one for us in the states) but couldn't find the procedure, did find the one for the prop shaft seal at the rear diff and that uses a lot of special tools.
> 
> ...


I suppose you could remove the whole muffler assembly, but that is one heavy thing to deal with. It usually comes off pretty easy in the clamped joint.

You can remove the flange from the transmission without any problem while still in the Car.

The number 2 seal can be reused, just dont handle it to much.


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

Phaetonlvr said:


> Sure is and your English is perfectly fine.


I was going to post that in my experience Norwegian English is nearly indistinguishable from native English. I once spent a rainy afternoon in Lysebotn with a bunch of Norwegian base jumpers watching Fawlty Towers. Not only did they not require the Norwegian subtitles, they knew pretty much every episode word-for-word.


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

keirn said:


> I suppose you could remove the whole muffler assembly, but that is one heavy thing to deal with. It usually comes off pretty easy in the clamped joint.
> 
> You can remove the flange from the transmission without any problem while still in the Car.
> 
> The number 2 seal can be reused, just dont handle it to much.


Thanks for the answers, I'll get the parts ordered and plan on replacing it in a month or so. I'll report back on how it went.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Sooo, the plan was to start it up yesterday , and I know you are kind of waiting for that. 
But... I have developed a little backproblem lately and I just needed some rest, this is a hobby after all.


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

keirn said:


> Sooo, the plan was to start it up yesterday , and I know you are kind of waiting for that.
> But... I have developed a little backproblem lately and I just needed some rest, this is a hobby after all.


Well, you shouldn't lift the tranny without lifting aid. Did that myself yesterday, arrived on a small lorry from Poland. I have developed a little backproblem lately...
Sorry to hear, hope you recover soon!:beer:

Lennart


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

keirn said:


> Sooo, the plan was to start it up yesterday , and I know you are kind of waiting for that.
> But... I have developed a little backproblem lately and I just needed some rest, this is a hobby after all.


Sorry to hear about your back pain, unfortunately that's a common ailment for car guys, myself included.

Got another question regarding the rear seal replacement. When you take the flange off the transmission is that trans fluid behind it or gear oil from the Center differential? Just want to make sure I have the right fluid ready when I take it apart. Thanks!


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## bobster1969 (Apr 18, 2015)

Did it start ?


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Phaetonlvr said:


> Sorry to hear about your back pain, unfortunately that's a common ailment for car guys, myself included.
> 
> Got another question regarding the rear seal replacement. When you take the flange off the transmission is that trans fluid behind it or gear oil from the Center differential? Just want to make sure I have the right fluid ready when I take it apart. Thanks!


Regular gear oil behind this one, no transfluid.


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

keirn said:


> Regular gear oil behind this one, no transfluid.


Good to know because I would have guessed trans fluid. Thanks!


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

keirn said:


> This is the new seal


Would you have a part # for this seal? The VW dealer I'm working with can't seem to find this in ETKA based on my VIN. The part is shown in the ETKA screenshot but doesn't show as applicable for my car. My W12 got a factory replacement transmission in 2010 which has the same transmission code FGE as the original so that shouldn't really make a difference.


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## Bindaham (Apr 4, 2014)

Phaetonlvr said:


> Would you have a part # for this seal? The VW dealer I'm working with can't seem to find this in ETKA based on my VIN. The part is shown in the ETKA screenshot but doesn't show as applicable for my car. My W12 got a factory replacement transmission in 2010 which has the same transmission code FGE as the original so that shouldn't really make a difference.



it's *01V409133B* called *Round seal*

Regards,


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

Bindaham said:


> it's *01V409133B* called *Round seal*


Thanks much! Looked it up online and it is correct for Phaetons with FGE transmission code. Will order it right up.


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## Bindaham (Apr 4, 2014)

Good luck Stephan


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Its alive!


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

keirn said:


> Its alive!


Great! Tell us more!


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

17606 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B1 S2 
P1198 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
17607 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B2 S2 
P1199 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction

19674 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B3 S2; Heating Circuit 
P3218 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
19704 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B4 S2; Heating Circuit 
P3248 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction


Readiness: 0110 1001

#gonnagonutsforsure


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

keirn said:


> 17606 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B1 S2
> P1198 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
> 17607 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heater Circuit: B2 S2
> P1199 - 008 - Electrical Malfunction
> ...



Oh No!  Another wiring issue? I haven't followed it up in the diagram, but I think a Lambda Sensor pair share a common ground. Unlikely that the sensors would break in pairs like this.

Lennart


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

ravenflies said:


> Oh No!  Another wiring issue? I haven't followed it up in the diagram, but I think a Lambda Sensor pair share a common ground. Unlikely that the sensors would break in pairs like this.
> 
> Lennart


Yeah, this is what I was thinking too, so, I built a cheapo oscilloscope , tested it and went to work.. 

The heating for the Lambdas are Pulsewidth modulated, so any attempt to actually heat it would show as squares in the scope, and sure enough, it does.
The internal resistance in the lambdas are showing approx 8,6 ohms for all four, this is spot on .
Equally I have tested voltage output from the lambdas, and they look good. 


Going to follow up on the common ground theory, that must be investigated for sure!

Well, to be continued ...


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

And oh, the ECUS are going to be renovated by AC-Tronics here in sweden, it seems the outputstage is fried.. Hence low voltage and no return signal ...


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## MIKOBrk (Jan 31, 2015)

keirn said:


> And oh, the ECUS are going to be renovated by AC-Tronics here in sweden, it seems the outputstage is fried.. Hence low voltage and no return signal ...



Hey man!
I read this topic and Im pretty impressed what you are doing with this car!
I have some problems with my w12 as well.
I wanted to ask you how to clean DTC memory. 
I saw you had faults like coolant fan short to ground and "check dtc memory" in a few adresses.
Can someone tell me how to clear this DTC memory?
And what to do with Coolant fan which is constantly showing short to ground?
Coolant fan sometimes works, however It doesnt start during output test.
Does it have connection with poor condition of ECU?


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

MIKOBrk said:


> Hey man!
> I read this topic and Im pretty impressed what you are doing with this car!
> I have some problems with my w12 as well.
> I wanted to ask you how to clean DTC memory.
> ...


Hi Buddy

Well, there could be a number of reasons, but I think this is due to poor implementation of canbus signalling from the various controllers, could also be wiring issues. 
What I found that when testing for instance the return signal to canbus, the signal does not look the same from each time you start the car, but I suspect that this issue could also be related to battery issues.
Not really sure.

Do a scan of your car, and you will se a list of all DTC's that are stored in the various modules. Then you can delete them one at a time, or coose to clear all.


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

I would just like to add that you need to scan with VCDS. After the scan is finished, you are taken back to the scan menu. 

See the second picture:

http://www.ross-tech.com/vcds/tour/autoscan.php

I Print all scans to .xps files, then Clear all DTCs if necessary.

After Clearing all DTCs, VCDS will start a new auto scan.

About 3/4 of the way down on the web page is a paragraph about clearing all DTCs.

-Eric


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## MIKOBrk (Jan 31, 2015)

Thank you for your answers!
The fact is that my batteries are 12,3 and 12,4V when standing so maybe their condition isnt good enough to handle the system.
SO maybe I need to get pair of new batteries.
I've been using vagcom which as I see has less options and disability to clear dtc faults, am I right?

I will start will fixing batteries


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

MIKOBrk said:


> Thank you for your answers!
> The fact is that my batteries are 12,3 and 12,4V when standing so maybe their condition isnt good enough to handle the system.
> SO maybe I need to get pair of new batteries.
> I've been using vagcom which as I see has less options and disability to clear dtc faults, am I right?
> ...


VAGCOM is from Ross-Tech. Fakes are not. 

Are you using VCDS from Ross-Tech, or VCDS-lite with a cheaper tool?

-Eric


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Still not sorted, but I am thinking of having the DTC check of the ECU's removed for this particular issue. Maybe even a Lambda delete.


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## keirn (Aug 20, 2014)

Well Hey !

In the spirit of looking for inspiration I have recently started the Car again, topped up the wheels and is ready to back in the garage !


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

You are very tenacious! How is your back problem, are you ready for this? 

Chris


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

*Corroded nuts and broken studs*



keirn said:


> Thanks
> 
> Ok, you are in for some work..
> 
> ...


Very helpful, did mine now. No lift though.









And another word of advice: as the nuts in the front end of the cats are steel from factory they are heavily corroded, take you time and file them down. Replacement nuts are copper for a very good reason. I used a nut splitter but the shape of the nut made it impossible to split it completely. Thought it came loose but of course the stud broke. Those are stainless steel and a real pain to remove, pressed in place probably before the cat is welded. Didn’t dare to hit it too hard as it is ceramic inside. Centrering the drill even with a good punch mark is very difficult. Took me more time to fix this then the complete work. So: give it an hour or two to file the nuts down enough to break to save a lot of pain.


















/Lennart


Skickat från min iPhone med Tapatalk Pro


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## Phaetonlvr (Feb 26, 2013)

ravenflies said:


> And another word of advice: as the nuts in the front end of the cats are steel from factory they are heavily corroded, take you time and file them down. Replacement nuts are copper for a very good reason. I used a nut splitter but the shape of the nut made it impossible to split it completely. Thought it came loose but of course the stud broke. Those are stainless steel and a real pain to remove, pressed in place probably before the cat is welded. Didn’t dare to hit it too hard as it is ceramic inside. Centrering the drill even with a good punch mark is very difficult. Took me more time to fix this then the complete work. So: give it an hour or two to file the nuts down enough to break to save a lot of pain.
> 
> /Lennart


Lennart,

welcome to the club  I had to replace the trans rear seal on both my W12s, seems like a very common problem. The first one I broke off one of those studs but right at the flange so it came out easy because it was very short that way. I did have to remove the two small rusty bolts on the little heat shield to get a replacement bolt, nut and spring washer in place. 

On my second W12 I also broke off one nut, this time while tightening the nut even though I wire brushed and lubricated it first. A real bummer because the leftover stud is pretty long and I might have to cut it again to get it out.


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

Phaetonlvr said:


> Lennart,
> 
> welcome to the club  I had to replace the trans rear seal on both my W12s, seems like a very common problem. The first one I broke off one of those studs but right at the flange so it came out easy because it was very short that way. I did have to remove the two small rusty bolts on the little heat shield to get a replacement bolt, nut and spring washer in place.
> 
> On my second W12 I also broke off one nut, this time while tightening the nut even though I wire brushed and lubricated it first. A real bummer because the leftover stud is pretty long and I might have to cut it again to get it out.


Guess I was lucky then... On parts in this area i am prepared to go even one step further than the workshop manual, thread overhaul before the right lube for the threads. Not very much left of the nuts even before the attack...









/Lennart


Skickat från min iPhone med Tapatalk Pro


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