# TT 266/Autotech 270 vs TT 268: Your thoughts.



## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

Like the title says, I am interested in your thoughts. I'm looking primarily at TT's 266 (AKA 270) and their 268. I threw in the Autotech 270 for those that can compare them. 

By 268, I do not mean the 268/260. 

Why these? Because I am able to get a good deal on them.  

I run MSnS, so chip recommendations aren't really needed. However if you needed them to run your cam, feel free to say so. 

Thanks! :beer:


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

You're gonna need to be a little more specific on "thoughts". What do you want to know?


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

tdogg74 said:


> You're gonna need to be a little more specific on "thoughts". What do you want to know?


 Basically if you had both, how would you compare them? If you chose one over the other, why? Stuff along those lines.


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

I preferred the 270 over the 268. It just felt stronger down low and had a much more civilized idle. But to be honest, power numbers will be around the same. Its more of a case of deciding if you want a smoother idle and if you are planning on going FI later.


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

That is essentially what I was looking for. The motor is getting a mk4 intake and exhaust manifold, new AEG lifters, and one of those cams. Nothing more until I am out of grad school in 2 years. So basically yea, no FI. :laugh: 

Any experience with the TT 266? Seems like all I can find different between them is a slight difference in lift (0.448" compared to 0.449") and the obvious 266* duration versus 270*.


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

The difference in power between the two will only be noticed on a dyno. You wont feel a difference between the two on the street.


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

tdogg74 said:


> The difference in power between the two will only be noticed on a dyno. You wont feel a difference between the two on the street.


 Excellent. Exactly what I wanted to know. I'm not for numbers really, just a big smile when I drive.


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

basically you're looking at somewhere around 115whp with what you want to do on an untouched head.


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

tdogg74 said:


> basically you're looking at somewhere around 115whp with what you want to do on an untouched head.


 Yea, the head will be untouched. I have another project brewing to take care of that, but this is just to tide me over while in grad school and slowly building the other project. :sly: 

Plus, 115whp in a 1800lb car isn't too bad. I'm having fun right now at what I would suspect to be barely over 100whp (Tuned pretty aggressively on 91 octane, and with a TT tall block mk1 downpipe and their race/test/cat-delete pipe on a 2.25" magnaflow.) :laugh:


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## (ke) (Aug 27, 2006)

the 266 is a great cam for a bump in any performance/daily ABA. to me, it idles as if the cam isnt even there. but you will enjoy the difference. i really cant say much for the 268, but i doubt the hp numbers will be different, just where you feel the power throughout the rpm range. I have been running the 266 for a little over 2 years, no cylinder head problems...not even a tick, though I went through an entire rebuild before the cam, but as long as high lift springs are used i'm sure it will be okay. but even so, good luck with it :beer:


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

My ABA is OBD1, so I'm not too concerned about the valve springs.

I was planning to do all this this weekend, but that isn't going to happen, so it looks like it will have to wait until spring.


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## (ke) (Aug 27, 2006)

gotcha


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## rommeldawg (May 25, 2009)

i was running a tt268/260 then switched to the autotech 270... the 270 imo is much better across the entire rpm range... no real surges or peaks just keeps pulling


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

rommeldawg said:


> i was running a tt268/260 then switched to the autotech 270... the 270 imo is much better across the entire rpm range... no real surges or peaks just keeps pulling


The 268/260 is an FI cam as I understand. The straight 268 is what I am looking at.


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## Svedka (Jul 4, 2008)

There is many versions of the 268 and most of the newer production ones are very similar to the 270 and if you are running ms on a obd 1 head why are you limiting yourself to the smaller cam? why not Jump up to the 272 or 276?


I have many 8v cams and have used a variety of different styles and manufactures, the older TT 268 had a higher lift then the new ones and the 260/268 was disighned for boosted applications although it gives the same power band as the 270 autotech in a NA car.


good info at bottom of that forumopcorn:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5032570-Pros-and-cons-of-TT-276-cam-and-TT-288-cam

IMO the autotech 270 is a great cam for daily driving on a stock ECU but if I was running MS in a obd1 head I would step up to a 272 or 276 for the most gains.


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## rommeldawg (May 25, 2009)

> 260/268 was disighned for boosted applications although it gives the same power band as the 270 autotech in a NA car.


well thats what collin said from tt when i bought it... but the autotech 270 out performs it. everyone at the shop immediately noticed the difference


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## Svedka (Jul 4, 2008)

possibly your motor and mods as ever car acts different 

or a better quality camshaft not all cams are cut the same, a TT 268 vs a kent 268 will be completely different just like getting a regrind 272 vs a real shrick there is a diffrence


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

Great threads, I've seen those before. My reasoning's for these are essentially money. Is it worth the extra $70-80 for just a couple more horses in an engine that will probably only stay in here for a couple summers only? However, this is exactly the discussion I wanted.

I admit I haven't looked too into the 276, so more searching it is! :laugh:

It looks like the lift of the 276 at .449" is barely under the .450" max for OBD1 dual valve springs... That should be fun...


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## (ke) (Aug 27, 2006)

from what i hear, its worth it. dont get me wrong the 270 is great, but if you are planning on keeping an n/a setup, even if for only a few summers as you said, why settle? i plan on going to the 276 very soon, if you are still deciding by that time i'll let you know how it all worked out.


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

My main concern is that I still want to have a more noticeable power range down low, but up high doesn't matter much to me as I usually don't drive higher up where these larger cams seem to really make a difference.


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## Kiyokix (Dec 16, 2005)

thatcrazylaxdude said:


> My main concern is that I still want to have a more noticeable power range down low, but up high doesn't matter much to me as I usually don't drive higher up where these larger cams seem to really make a difference.


This is exactly where I am with my cam decision. tdogg and I have talked a bit about what a good idea would be, but I never looked at the 268/260 cam before now.

I know the AT270 is a piece of heaven, but everywhere I've read, everyone I've heard talking about it...it always says that the power increase starts at roughly 2500rpms with a small loss lower down. I LOVE what it would do on the top end, but I am much more than willing to sacrifice a bit of power on the top to gain that power on the bottom.

Majority of the driving in my car is between 1700-3000rpms so I don't want to lose anything if I can help it. I'm fine with losing a pinch below 2000rpm, but if I could have the power start building strongly from there on up that would be awesome. I'm not looking to rev this motor above 6k really, so I'm looking for the best powerband I can get between 2000-5500rpm mostly.

All while trying to remain as stealthy as possible lol. :sly:

I know the 268/260 is an FI cam, but with the good idle I imagine it has (from lack of excessive overlap)...how well would it do on an NA motor?

In the end I'm only looking for 115-120whp on my car, anything over that is just a nice surprise but not a requirement by any means. Daily car is very daily...but a bit more fun too would be great! (lighter flywheel, pullies, etc. aka enhanced driveablity mods).

Kei


P.S.
tdogg, you were 10000000000% right about the newer chips for the 2.0! I picked up a chip from United (where Jeff is now) this weekend, and even with my fuel delivery issues (weak or clogged pump not delivering proper pressure...hopefully I can clean it today or get another tomorrow) this chip was WAY more than worth it. It's a totally different animal, I had no idea VW was THAT conservative on their stock tune...and I've never even been able to floor it yet!!! 

*BUY ATP/BFI/C2 chips NOW 2.0 GUYS/GIRLS!!!*


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## nptnbluegti (Nov 7, 2007)

wow!? for real, those BFI chips made a difference? I have the TT stock tune chip and thought it was great... i might as well look into it if I go with a cam upg...


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## Svedka (Jul 4, 2008)

thatcrazylaxdude said:


> My main concern is that I still want to have a more noticeable power range down low, but up high doesn't matter much to me as I usually don't drive higher up where these larger cams seem to really make a difference.


An adjustable cam gear advanced 4 degrees will give you more than what you lose down low and there fairly cheap 40-100$ or so used to new 



Kiyokix said:


> This is exactly where I am with my cam decision. tdogg and I have talked a bit about what a good idea would be, but I never looked at the 268/260 cam before now.
> 
> I know the AT270 is a piece of heaven, but everywhere I've read, everyone I've heard talking about it...it always says that the power increase starts at roughly 2500rpms with a small loss lower down. I LOVE what it would do on the top end, but I am much more than willing to sacrifice a bit of power on the top to gain that power on the bottom.
> 
> ...


The 268/260 is a great cam for idle on a NA I have one and I can barley tell it has a cam but has the same power band as my AT 270 as far as I can tell by the seat of pants dyno

I bought both the 270 and 268/260 and could barely tell the difference in power band's but I could instantly tell the difference in idle quality:thumbup: the 270 had a lobe to it at idle vs the smoother 268/260 but the AT is about $100 the 268/260 asymmetrical cam is about $200 

This was my experience I had no dyno time just me driving it.


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

I'm curious if anyone has had experience using a 276 on stock OBD1 dual valve springs... The cam seems to be pretty close to the max advisable lift for these springs.

Svedka, I see you are selling a 276. If it will probably be alright with my current springs, I am very interested. 

I'm realistically drawing the line here in terms of seeing where this will go. I'm buying new lifters (lightweight AEG ones, whatever USRT has), and a cam, whether it be a 268, the 266, or a 276. I don't want to buy springs if I don't have to. I can probably squeeze an adjustable timing gear in there too. I recall there being some cheap ones on ebay for ~$70ish.


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## Svedka (Jul 4, 2008)

It works great I was not gona pollute this thread with my for sale but I ran it in my GLI xflow obd 1 and only removed it because the wheels spun to much when I let my GF start driving it IMO it was a awsome cam for me and the idle was great but just a little to much for her :laugh:


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## [email protected] (Aug 25, 2010)

compliments of travis and some MS Paint work by moi....













tt266 vs tt276


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

I'm curious as to what else was in/on that motor... I recall seeing that dyno chart somewhere, was that the one with the built head, as in valves and everything?

Looks like a solid increase across the board, maybe 7-8 whp and 7-8 ftlbs difference?

I doubt I will see anything near 135whp on a stock head. :laugh:


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## Kiyokix (Dec 16, 2005)

nptnbluegti said:


> wow!? for real, those BFI chips made a difference? I have the TT stock tune chip and thought it was great... i might as well look into it if I go with a cam upg...


I can't tell you in enough words how fantastic my chip is! I picked up the chip from APT in the United Motorsports group this weekend. Jeff (worked on the BFI/C2 chips) is now over there, and they had a sale this weekend at H2Oi for $150 for ANY MK3 tune you needed. I picked up the 2.0l stock cam tune until I get my cam ideas sorted out.

Seriously, no disrespect to the TT guys (great guys & great products)...but this chip wipes the floor with any other car I've been in. To be fair, the tune is MUCH newer which is why it's so different. The idle comes set at ~1050rpm, but it's left open so you can connect a vagcom to adjust to to anything you want (sweet!).

Buy one now, they still have some left at that price...even when it goes back to regular price it's more than worth it. The ATP chip is a slightly different tune (per Jeff), but any version you get whether ATP, BFI, or C2 will be amazing!



Svedka said:


> An adjustable cam gear advanced 4 degrees will give you more than what you lose down low and there fairly cheap 40-100$ or so used to new


Do you think a cam gear would help out with the 268/260 as well, or do you think it's already good enough as is?




Svedka said:


> The 268/260 is a great cam for idle on a NA I have one and I can barley tell it has a cam but has the same power band as my AT 270 as far as I can tell by the seat of pants dyno
> 
> I bought both the 270 and 268/260 and could barely tell the difference in power band's but I could instantly tell the difference in idle quality:thumbup: the 270 had a lobe to it at idle vs the smoother 268/260 but the AT is about $100 the 268/260 asymmetrical cam is about $200
> 
> This was my experience I had no dyno time just me driving it.


Thanks A LOT Svedka, the 268/260 is sounding better and better by the second. I suppose that's going to be my next thing to save for now. :thumbup:

Kei


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

Leave the 268/260 to the FI guys. The ONLY reason I ran it was because I bought it off some guy for $60 who didn't know what he had. It's definitely better than an NA cam for sure, but at the end of the day, you really want to upgrade your springs and run a bigger NA cam. Just for the top end alone. 

And to the guy wanting to run a big cam on stock springs......

*NO*

Don't be a cheap-ass. On a 276*, at a .450" lift, you have surpassed coil bind and are literally compressing your lifters just to let the lobe pass over the lifter face. Do you _really_ want to rev past 5000rpms like that? Can you say "crushed lifter"? 

READ: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4696004-TECH-OBDII-Valve-Springs.-Installed-height-vs-lift.


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

I meant to imply before that one of the other reasons that I am not too keen on a bigger cam is that I do not want to upgrade my springs. This is a cheap project, I want to be cheap, and a big cam isn't worth my money in my mind for what I want to do, even more so if I have to invest more into HD springs. I've read that thread before and know the implications of this. This is part of the reason why I made the thread title and beginning subject as it is. Anything more than that here has simply been for the enjoyment of researching and seeing what is out there for "options". Am I still somewhat interested in a 276? Yea. But it is as appealing to me as the more milder stage 2 or whatever cams? No.

:beer:


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## (ke) (Aug 27, 2006)

i'd still go with the dual springs anyway. why sacrafice it if your gonna be in the head anyway to replace the cam? i know you said its gonna be a cheap project, and thats what i said to myself at first. then i thought better safe then sorry. before i knew it i had a fully rebuilt head with all usrt internals just for a 266 cam. not saying you would need a full rebuild, but better off getting the dual springs. once you feel the power with a cam like the 266 or 270, after awhile your gonna look for more, just the way of the world :laugh: at least this way if you have the upgraded springs you can be sure that you could go as big as a 276 in the future and not have any probs IMO. ...and i fully agree on the BFI chips that was mentioned before and advancing to 4 degrees. makes a great and fun difference!!


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

*just bought Autotec 270 cam and some more goodies!!*

COOL BEANS DUDE!, I JUST GOT MY PORTED N POLISHED HEAD WITH 4 angle vavle job, Machined milled and resurfaced, JET coated, with dual springs, steel retainers, new lifters.. I just BOUGHT my AUTOTEC 270 cam!!! YAAY, gasket kit and ARP head studs, with TT 2" race downpipe with cat delete, and Tectonics 2.25 catback..

only thing on car right now is the catback, waiting to put ALL this power on the car in 4 weeks,

NEXT, i am going to buy the BFI stage 2 PEM for my 270 cam, heard from 2 high hp 8v mk3 and mk4's it blew away the TT chip and GIAC chip!!!


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## (ke) (Aug 27, 2006)

the BFI REM is deff a good buy, I love it in the car. You'r gonna like the power increase. :beer:


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## ((a.v.))mk-1 (Dec 10, 2010)

any body know if the AT270 cam will fit in my 84 gti jh solid head? autotech site says hydrolic, but ive read different on here... any help is greatly appreciated.


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## Svedka (Jul 4, 2008)

((a.v.))mk-1 said:


> any body know if the AT270 cam will fit in my 84 gti jh solid head? autotech site says hydrolic, but ive read different on here... any help is greatly appreciated.


Will not fit I repeat a hydo cam will not work in a solid lifter head.........


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## ((a.v.))mk-1 (Dec 10, 2010)

perfect thank you for the clairty, so what is the equivalent option for my solid lifter head?


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## Svedka (Jul 4, 2008)

Just wondering why you would use a small cam on a solid lifter head as most people use the solid heads for huge cams and high revs.

You can get a 268,270,272 solid lifter camshaft but not from autotech try TT kent schrick or webb cams best for you to call them and let them know the goals and what you are using.

Also remember with solid lifter cams you need a lifter adjustment when installing. For reference when looking at camshafts use scirocco or rabbit as your model and look for mechanical camshafts.


There are many other suppliers and some places have the ability to custom grind a camshaft for your needs.
http://www.deltacam.com/
http://www.kentcams.com/
http://www.techtonicstuning.com/mai...399_86&zenid=f178a924c43283a5db12079e2cae7528
http://www.bildon.com/catalog/SubCa...=Engine&SubCategory=Camshafts&Nav=6&SubNav=6C
http://www.eurosportacc.com/kentcams_performance_camshaft_cams.htm
http://webcamshafts.com/mobile/automobile/volkswagen/volkswagen_gti_sohc_8v.html


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## ((a.v.))mk-1 (Dec 10, 2010)

Svedka said:


> Just wondering why you would use a small cam on a solid lifter head as most people use the solid heads for huge cams and high revs.
> 
> You can get a 268,270,272 solid lifter camshaft but not from autotech try TT kent schrick or webb cams best for you to call them and let them know the goals and what you are using.
> 
> ...




i was planning on keeping the cam mild becuase it will be my daily driver, im also not ready to fully build the head, so i was looking for a 270(ish) cam to have a good daily driver with some good power, its going on an aba swap, new pistons, kniffed and balanced crank, lightened everything. just wanted somthing nice up top to open it up a bit, probably going to get the head competey rebuild with springs and retainers any ways... just checking into my options... i would really hope to see 130ish out of my build.


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## ((a.v.))mk-1 (Dec 10, 2010)

greaet info in those links, thanks!


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

((a.v.))mk-1 said:


> perfect thank you for the clairty, so what is the equivalent option for my solid lifter head?


Autotech has a 286* SL cam. Don't me mislead by the large duration size...it's a good solid lifter cam.


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## ((a.v.))mk-1 (Dec 10, 2010)

i saw that, but i chickened out seeing that huge number, i ended up going with the 272 tt cam... bought new springs to go along with it... anything else you might recomend a machine shop will need for my head rebuild?


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## JeremiahSOW (Apr 9, 2007)

Quick question. I've got a cam out of a motor I had lying around. It's got two orange stripes on it and the end says kcyb stamped on it. My friend thinks it might be a TT cam. Anyone know what size it might be?


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