# MKV gas, rough and low idle, clicking and white smoke



## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

Wife started 2009 MKV gas and it sounded like a diesel. White smoke, rough and low idle. She took another car to work. CAN showed no problems. Oil level fine and always used proper type. Radiator fluid pink and at full level.

I increased RPM to 1500, fluctuates 100 to 200 down, then back up. Fuel gauge at 3/4.

Issue started just the morning.

Car has 93K, no problems whatsoever, until now.

Really like my Jetta.
John


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## mdr (Dec 30, 2005)

Which engine?


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

*Update: rough idle*

Model SE. Engine 2.5 

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Called VW service manager and they thought the head gasket blown, with the white smoke. 

Restarted, and runs almost as before, perhaps a bit low RPM, but loud engine clicking stopped. No white smoke.

1500 RPM does fluctuate as before.

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Restarted and clicking returned, but not as loud as before. Something is not right , for engine not as before.

A bit confused. 
John


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## mdr (Dec 30, 2005)

White is usually water. Hard to tell from a phone call, so dealer made a worst case guess. What's it smell like? Carefully put your hand in the exhaust stream leaving the tail pipe. (No extra credit for burns. Don't be stupid  ). What's your hand smell/feel like?


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## mdr (Dec 30, 2005)

Don't know if the 2.5 has a water jacket on the intake. I've had cars which lost coolant there instead of the head gasket. Head gaskets can also get exhaust gases and oil mixing with the coolant. Is the cooling system 'burping'? Any water in the oil? Excessive smoke out the dip stick tube?


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

*jetta: clicking*

restarted engine, and no visiable smoke, but outside temperature warmer.

Didn't really smell anything from the exhaust, but using my glasses the lenses had water vapor appear. Of course engine not up to true temperature, thus water vapor could be from initial start.

Fluid levels are ok, no noticeable burping.

Primary issue, besides clicking was excessive white exhaust smoke this morning. Never seen such smoking before.

Service manager has yet to call.
___________________________

Just restated and got to full temperature. Water vapor appears same as before, with my glasses as the test instrument. Clicking still evident, but much less. Again, no radiator burping nor smoke from dipstick

John


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

i've had this happen before.

engine was barely able to idle. it sounded horrible.

turned the engine off, waited a few seconds and restarted it and the symptoms were completely gone.

the only thing i think could have happened was that the engine didn't like the way i started it up and shut it down within 20 seconds the night before. i needed to move the vehicle out of the way and i didn't feel like letting it warm up at all.

white smoke can be from a intermittent a/f mixture problem.

also, a failing n80 valve will give you a vacuum leak without triggering a CEL.


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## WASCALLY_09WABBIT (Jul 22, 2014)

le0n said:


> also, a failing n80 valve will give you a vacuum leak without triggering a CEL.


:thumbup:

If it is the N80 valve, your local dealer should carry it in stock. Most dealers will carry this part because it's not an uncommon part to have fail.


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

Started engine again, and seems to be getting better. Took for a short drive around the block and performance as before.

Dealer yet to call, so given that I will leave the Jetta in the garage overnight and see what happens in the morning. Will forward results. 

Couple of questions:
1. Could bad gas cause this issue?

2. Reviewing forum an issue to replace the timing chain tensioner. Specifically, if needed, when to do it, and how best to do it. Advice? 

Of the N80 valve, link to show how to replace?

I really like my jetta, and do want to keep it.

Very grateful, with best regards, 

John


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

so it's running fine now? just with a slight stumble in the idle?

from what you've described, i wouldn't suspect bad fuel.

in regards to the timing chain tensioner, i wouldn't suspect that either. the 2009 are not prone to those problems you've probably been reading about. so don't venture down that avenue just yet.

the n80 valve is just two clamps and a harness clip right on top of the engine. you'll need a small hose clamp to replace the crimp clamp (see photo below). the clamp on the other side is re-usable.


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

Very thankful. Wife to get one on way home. Cost $23.

Will install this evening and then see what happens in the morning.

Will advise.

Regards,
John


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

within the past few months, has it ever been hard to start the car after fueling? multiple cranks, etc...


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

Never a problem with starting. The opposite, starts very fast.

If hard to start or too many cranks what does this imply?

Note: I've installed N80 valve and will forward what happens in the morning.

The valve is called: Tankenlueftungsventil. Part number is: 06E 906 517 A. My cost was $23.32, and in stock.

I don't know German, but the name seems to mean "Tank air breathing valve", just a guess. 
John


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

Hard start condition is a symptom of a bad n80.

It's not the only symptom though.


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## WASCALLY_09WABBIT (Jul 22, 2014)

Could it be the secondary air system?


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

WASCALLY_09WABBIT said:


> Could it be the secondary air system?


Yep. All vacuum lines need to be inspected.


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## WASCALLY_09WABBIT (Jul 22, 2014)

Then I'd say his best bet is either replacing the n80 valve, or getting the secondary air repair kit. Whether my 2.5 needs it or not, I'm getting it before I hit 120k. Just so it's still covered under warranty.


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

Started Jetta this morning and everything back to normal  . Hopefully will continue.

leOn, very easy to replace the N80 valve. This may have been the problem.

Cannot overstate my thanks.

In return a service tip for engine oil changes: mark oil canister adjacent to engine mark to ease canister installation. I used white nail polish.

Also to protect the front from debris I've installed a clear bra. This really helps.

Again, thankful and with best regards,
John


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## mdr (Dec 30, 2005)

Nice. Way easier than a head gasket.


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

^^ that's great; i'm glad you got it working again.

thanks for the update and tips.

if you don't mind, give us another update in a few days after some miles have been put on the vehicle. this way, anyone else searching these symptoms can see a possible (simple) solution to their issue.


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

Will update in a few days.

With everyone's comments I was saved hundreds if not thousands of dollars !!!!!

This is a very good forum.

With regards,
John


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## juanpablo442 (Jan 27, 2014)

Jetta has started normally everyday this week with normal sounds.

I would say that it is A-OK. 

Of course if things change will add a thread.

A tip: I use large vice grips to remove and then install the large metal clamp between the air hose and air filter. Specifically, I close the vice-grip to open the clamp, then to clear the air hose lip I screw in the adjusting screw to expand the clamp to allow clamp to pass over air hose lip, then slowly release the clamp. To re-attach clamp I screw out the adjusting screw to grab the clamp, grab the clamp, then turn adjust screw in to allow clamp to be placed over air hose. This is easy to do.

Again, thankful to everyone, and with best regards,
John


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

Excellent update. 

Thanks.


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