# 2010 Audi A3 TDI vs Golf, plus checklist and FAQ



## chittychittybangbang (May 28, 2007)

Hi, I wrote up a TDI specific Audi A3 FAQ. Includes videos, reviews, and more. I'll update the article as more info comes out. That's my site - it's a TDI specific site so until now it's mostly VW. Now that the Audi A3 is coming out I'll have lots of Audi specific info. And the DSG /S-tronic transmission/CBEA TDI engine are shared so much of the information is the same. Also includes a VW/Audi wheel gallery with part numbers etc. View here:
http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1...t.htm
And although I like Audi design, it looks like the 2010 Golf has better features if you can live with leatherette instead of leather. The VW multifunction steering wheel got a major refresh so it looks much nicer too. Oh, and it should cost less too! Something is not right with this situation


----------



## DavidSG (Aug 11, 2006)

*Re: 2010 Audi A3 TDI vs Golf, plus checklist and FAQ (chittychittybangbang)*

Good stuff.
A3 is starting to look dated, but still offers a more premium package. But alas, no 6MT. 
Looks like my dream of owning an A3 are fading - I don't think they'll ever bring a version to the US that I'd buy, even though I love the styling. Been waiting for the 2.0T (gas) quattro with 6MT - who knows if that'll ever happen. Would settle for a FWD TDI, but only with a stick.
That Golf TDI is a tempting package. Might give the A3 another year - see what the 2011 updates bring.


----------



## chittychittybangbang (May 28, 2007)

What's annoying is that the reason I'm sure there's no quattro A3 TDI (in North America) is because of emissions. Yet a 6 speed instead of S-tronic/DSG would get better emissions because of lighter weight.
I think they are going to be S-tronic only because of the limited sales numbers so they wanted to limit choice and expense. If you want a stick, get a used manual transmission out of a Jetta/Golf and swap it in. I see no reason why it woudln't be the same trans since it's the same engine. The ECU might need some magic and the springs would need to be swapped too but it's doable.


----------



## 2YY4U (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: 2010 Audi A3 TDI vs Golf, plus checklist and FAQ (chittychittybangbang)*

Nice article! You just helped me decide between the A3 and Jetta.
I am waiting for the 2010 Jetta TDI sedan and my only wish was that I could have xenon lights. Any hopes in there? Suggestions?
Again, great write up.


----------



## Corradorennenprofi (Nov 6, 2003)

*Re: (chittychittybangbang)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chittychittybangbang* »_What's annoying is that the reason I'm sure there's no quattro A3 TDI (in North America) is because of emissions. Yet a 6 speed instead of S-tronic/DSG would get better emissions because of lighter weight.
I think they are going to be S-tronic only because of the limited sales numbers so they wanted to limit choice and expense. If you want a stick, get a used manual transmission out of a Jetta/Golf and swap it in. I see no reason why it woudln't be the same trans since it's the same engine. The ECU might need some magic and the springs would need to be swapped too but it's doable.

Anyone have any idea how much it would cost do to a transmission swap from a DSG to a manual?
You'd have to include the additional price of the DSG transmission when purchasing the car new of course. The Audi A3 TDI manual transmission most likely is tougher than the normal A3 manual transmission given gobs of low end torque








I'm not sure if the transmission on the A3 TDI would be comparable to the VW Golf/Jetta TDI. It looks like the redline for the 2.0 TDI Golf is 5,000 rpm and from a photo of a 2.0 TDI A3 I saw in the German magazine "Gute Fahrt" the red line was at 4,500 rpm. Perhaps they are tuned differently?
By the way, would doing a transmission swap void the warranty from Audi?


----------



## VWAddict (Jun 12, 1999)

*Re: (Corradorennenprofi)*

Wouldn't you need to find a quattro Manual transmission? -Or are they the same?
Think about it. -If they differ, you'd be importing a transmission from Europe, or putting in a VW one, I think. -Can anyone confirm or correct me on that part?
Keith


----------



## Audi'sRevenge (Mar 24, 2008)

*Re: (VWAddict)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWAddict* »_Wouldn't you need to find a quattro Manual transmission? -Or are they the same?
Think about it. -If they differ, you'd be importing a transmission from Europe, or putting in a VW one, I think. -Can anyone confirm or correct me on that part?
Keith

TDI _isn't_ Quattro though. The Haldex is not even an option on the TDI according to the information. Why then it's only available as DSG is a mystery, given the 2.0T FWD has a traditional manual.
What's odd though is that the DSG gets better FE ratings, not worse; yes it's heavier but the DSG is more "efficient" in shifting (than an automatic and a clutch-pedal manual) so it posts higher EPA numbers, not lower. Wouldn't the same be true for the TDI?
Anyway a good lot of information there on the site







I think the conclusion though is the one you always come to with the VW v. the Audi (just like the GTI v. A3 2.0T and R32 v. 3.2L Quattro)--the VW is better overall value, the Audi is relatively overpriced and you "get less" and pay more for the benefit of "other things" (interior, paint, etc.).


----------



## Audi'sRevenge (Mar 24, 2008)

*Re: (Corradorennenprofi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corradorennenprofi* »_
The Audi A3 TDI manual transmission most likely is tougher than the normal A3 manual transmission given gobs of low end torque









Meh, I doubt it. Turbo is a turbo, gas or diesel not a huge difference. Yeah the TDI develops 236lb*ft but the 2.0T is rated 207lb*ft at 1800rpm--it ain't no slouch either. Chipped the 2.0T is nearly 300lb*ft, and stock manual trannies (and DSGs) hold up fine.
The only real net difference about the TDI is that you'll go a lot farther on a tank, and stink up the place from the diesel, lol.


----------



## tdotA3mike (Feb 5, 2009)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi'sRevenge* »_
Meh, I doubt it. Turbo is a turbo, gas or diesel not a huge difference. Yeah the TDI develops 236lb*ft but the 2.0T is rated 207lb*ft at 1800rpm--it ain't no slouch either. Chipped the 2.0T is nearly 300lb*ft, and stock manual trannies (and DSGs) hold up fine.
The only real net difference about the TDI is that you'll go a lot farther on a tank, and stink up the place from the diesel, lol.


yeah no worries on either DSG or 6speed till you get passed 400 FPT
oh and not true with the clean TDI's i test drove the jetta clean TDI, andi was amazed car didn't smell! and was pretty quiet for a diesel! 


_Modified by tdotA3mike at 11:19 AM 7/6/2009_


----------



## TPE_A3 (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (tdotA3mike)*

Used to drive a 2007 2.0 TDI A3. (170, and chipped)
I have to say it's way better with DSG in my view. 1st gear takes you to about....10km/h. Lots of rowing if you are crawling through traffic.


----------



## tdotA3mike (Feb 5, 2009)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *TPE_A3* »_Used to drive a 2007 2.0 TDI A3. (170, and chipped)
I have to say it's way better with DSG in my view. 1st gear takes you to about....10km/h. Lots of rowing if you are crawling through traffic.


haha yeah my buddy used to have an old golf TDI stick he hated 1st,,, lol


----------



## Audi'sRevenge (Mar 24, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (tdotA3mike)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tdotA3mike* »_oh and not true with the clean TDI's i test drove the jetta clean TDI, andi was amazed car didn't smell! and was pretty quiet for a diesel! 

Nah they all smell, diesels. I've been [standing] at the back end of VW "clean TDI"s, MB Bluetecs, and BMW 335d w/urea injection. They all smell IMO. Stinkin' diesel.










_Modified by Audi'sRevenge at 11:05 AM 7/6/2009_


----------



## TPE_A3 (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Audi'sRevenge)*

Yeah...they do smell...but I miss it sometimes!


----------



## Corradorennenprofi (Nov 6, 2003)

*Re: (chittychittybangbang)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chittychittybangbang* »_What's annoying is that the reason I'm sure there's no quattro A3 TDI (in North America) is because of emissions. Yet a 6 speed instead of S-tronic/DSG would get better emissions because of lighter weight.
I think they are going to be S-tronic only because of the limited sales numbers so they wanted to limit choice and expense. If you want a stick, get a used manual transmission out of a Jetta/Golf and swap it in. I see no reason why it woudln't be the same trans since it's the same engine. The ECU might need some magic and the springs would need to be swapped too but it's doable.

I asked my mecahnic and doing a swap from a DSG transmission to a manual transmission would be astronomically expenisve. There are a lot of parts that are different besides the transmission. Best bet would be to sell it and get a stick. Only thing is that as the past has shown in the US the A3 was never offered with quattro or the 3.2 VR6 without the DSG/S-tronic transmission.


----------



## Corradorennenprofi (Nov 6, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (Audi'sRevenge)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi’sRevenge* »_
Nah they all smell, diesels. I've been [standing] at the back end of VW "clean TDI"s, MB Bluetecs, and BMW 335d w/urea injection. They all smell IMO. Stinkin' diesel.









_Modified by Audi'sRevenge at 11:05 AM 7/6/2009_








I was referring to the 2.0 clean diesel TDI. This engine was developed for the US market to pass the strict restrictions and first appeared in the 2009 Jetta TDI. A 2007 Audi A3 TDI did not have the same engine set up as will be on the 2010 TDI.
The 2.0 TDI Clean Diesels do not smell and the bosch common rail is a lot quierter than the Puemenduese, almost too quiet. I hate the smell of diesel exhaust spewing from dirty trucks. It I thought the new TDIs smelled I wouldn't buy them.
The new TDIs have particle filters. Hold up a coffe filter or tissue paper to the back of the exuahst and it will be cleaner than the exhaust from your 2.0 TSI


----------



## Audi'sRevenge (Mar 24, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Corradorennenprofi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corradorennenprofi* »_Hold up a coffe filter or tissue paper to the back of the exuahst and it will be cleaner than the exhaust from your 2.0 TSI









I'm sure you are correct there, but the gasoline engine still smells way better.
I've said this before... If I wanted to kill myself with car exhaust it would be real easy with a gasoline car. I'd just park it in the garage port the exhaust in the cabin, inhale the exhaust, fall asleep and die. That suicide attempt would end real quick with a diesel because I'd be coughing, gagging and throwing up, and subsequently running far away due to how offensive I find diesel (and again this goes for new diesels as well despite the fact that the keep using that buzzword "clean" to describe them). "Clean" or not, it still stinks IMO.


----------



## chittychittybangbang (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (Corradorennenprofi)*

Not as expensive as your mechanic thinks...the TDI engine is the exact same as the Jetta/Golf TDI engine and they come with 6 speed manuals standard. The front chassis is the same. Therefore, I believe you would just need front springs (DSG/S-tronic is heavier), maybe front shocks to bolt the transmission right up - no custom mounts or anything.
The wiring is another story...I have no clue if the engine will run without signal from the DSG. Past TDI had ECUs in which you just changed the soft coding through VCDS from auto to manual. 
The new engine management is totally different and I wouldn't know where to begin making the electronics work. The biggest problem is that USA TDI have emissions control systems that weren't found elsewhere in Europe in the past. 

_Quote, originally posted by *Corradorennenprofi* »_
I asked my mecahnic and doing a swap from a DSG transmission to a manual transmission would be astronomically expenisve. There are a lot of parts that are different besides the transmission. Best bet would be to sell it and get a stick. Only thing is that as the past has shown in the US the A3 was never offered with quattro or the 3.2 VR6 without the DSG/S-tronic transmission.


----------



## Corradorennenprofi (Nov 6, 2003)

*Re: (chittychittybangbang)*

It still just doesn't make any sense.
The base price for a 2.0 TSI gasoline A3 is 26K whenever a diesel is offered the increase on price is about 3k, the DSG/Stronic transmission cost 1.5k and to get it with paddle shifters (which I think is the only way they offer it at Audi) means that you would have to go with luxury plus which should be 2k extra.
I would pay about $4,000 more to get a car with a transmission I despise and Options in the luxury plus package that I do not need.
If my mechanic said it would be astronomically high to do a transmission swap from DSG to stick it means it would be astronomically high. He listed all the different parts that were different like differentials, I just didn't write them down because it doesn't matter.
I'll just get a two door 6 spd manual VW Golf TDI, it's sad that Audi lets down enthusiasts in the US by caving in to the massses of dopes that don't know how to drive manual transmission










_Modified by Corradorennenprofi at 9:05 AM 7-20-2009_


----------



## ACD (Feb 20, 1999)

*Re: (Corradorennenprofi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corradorennenprofi* »_It still just doesn't make any sense.
The base price for a 2.0 TSI gasoline A3 is 26K whenever a diesel is offered the increase on price is about 3k, the DSG/Stronic transmission cost 1.5k and to get it with paddle shifters (which I think is the only way they offer it at Audi) means that you would have to go with luxury plus which should be 2k extra.
I would pay about $4,000 more to get a car with a transmission I despise and Options in the luxury plus package that I do not need.
If my mechanic said it would be astronomically high to do a transmission swap from DSG to stick it means it would be astronomically high. He listed all the different parts that were different like differentials, I just didn't write them down because it doesn't matter.
I'll just get a two door 6 spd manual VW Golf TDI, it's sad that Audi lets down enthusiasts in the US by caving in to the massses of dopes that don't know how to drive manual transmission









_Modified by Corradorennenprofi at 9:05 AM 7-20-2009_

I'm considering the Jetta Sportwagon or Golf 5-door with 6spd manual. More useful than the A3, just as good looking and cheaper.


----------



## RogueTDI (Dec 12, 2002)

*Re: 2010 Audi A3 TDI vs Golf, plus checklist and FAQ (chittychittybangbang)*

Thanks for the write up chitty - I found it very useful.
I'm coming from 98 Jetta TDI which has been a real love/hate relationship... 
I'm really drawn to a 2010 Golf TDI, and will be considering it my default if Audi A4 3.0TDI and BMW 335D dont meet my requirements. I'd consider Audi A3 also, if the features and price "add up." With potential of around 160-170whp w/ tuning, and ~3000lb curb weight, a 2.0 CRD Golf is starting to look very appealing. Really liking the way it looks too. Also love that it's basically just a highly refined and improved Mk5, which was already pretty great. Saving $10-15k sounds pretty nice too.







It would be my 3rd VW diesel, and a return to my first choice - a hatch (1981 Rabbit Diesel was my first car, no Mk3 Golf TDI was available).
And for the record, I know diesel exhaust smell, and I've stuck my nose right into the exhaust stream of a running 2.0TDI CRD w/ the 50-state emission system. There is zero smell. I think most of it is caught in the DPF, embedded in the particles. 



_Modified by RogueTDI at 4:06 AM 9-14-2009_


----------



## cosmicgreenGTI (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: 2010 Audi A3 TDI vs Golf, plus checklist and FAQ (RogueTDI)*

Thanks for all the info on your webpage!


----------

