# Cayenne Caliper Question.



## Richard Harris (Mar 13, 2001)

Does the caliper bolt directly to the hub assembly on Both 2004 and 2008 R32s?


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## spitpilot (Feb 14, 2000)

*Re: Cayenne Caliper Question. (Richard Harris)*

I"d doubt it....Audi/VW have used caliper carriers (brackets) between the caliper and hub carrier in recent models to allow for variations in rotor size (larger for HP cars/smaller for bottom line cars), so I"d bet that both cars you mention have carriers involved in the "equation". http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Richard Harris (Mar 13, 2001)

*Re: Cayenne Caliper Question. (spitpilot)*

I'm 99% certain that one of the model years does not require a carrier. I'd bet it's the 2008 R32.


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: Cayenne Caliper Question. (Richard Harris)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Richard Harris* »_I'm 99% certain that one of the model years does not require a carrier. I'd bet it's the 2008 R32.

04 and 08 brakes are different? Either way...I'm pretty sure NO bremebo caliper bolts straight up to any VW....maybe a Touarg would be the closest...
VW/Audi normally do not have the same disk offset as porsche.


_Modified by GTijoejoe at 9:23 AM 6-17-2009_


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## vwconejo (Apr 18, 2009)

*Re: Cayenne Caliper Question. (GTijoejoe)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GTijoejoe* »_
04 and 08 brakes are different? Either way...I'm pretty sure NO bremebo caliper bolts straight up to any VW....maybe a Touarg would be the closest...
VW/Audi normally do not have the same disk offset as porsche.

_Modified by GTijoejoe at 9:23 AM 6-17-2009_

Correct you are, touaregs come stock with brembo calipers, 6 piston fronts, 4 piston rears


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## vwconejo (Apr 18, 2009)

*Re: Cayenne Caliper Question. (Richard Harris)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Richard Harris* »_Does the caliper bolt directly to the hub assembly on Both 2004 and 2008 R32s?


Neither of these vehicles' calipers bolt on directly to the hub, they both have caliper carriers.


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: Cayenne Caliper Question. (vwconejo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vwconejo* »_
Correct you are, touaregs come stock with brembo calipers, 6 piston fronts, 4 piston rears









YAY!!







what did I win


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## Richard Harris (Mar 13, 2001)

Yes, Touaregs, Cayennes, and Q7 come with stock brembo calipers.
Maybe I didn't state my question correctly. The Six piston brembo caliper featured on the touaregs should bolt directly(no carriers) to the hub assembly on the 04 OR 08 VW R32.


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## a4tq (Jan 18, 2004)

*Re: (Richard Harris)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Richard Harris* »_Yes, Touaregs, Cayennes, and Q7 come with stock brembo calipers.
Maybe I didn't state my question correctly. The Six piston brembo caliper featured on the touaregs should bolt directly(no carriers) to the hub assembly on the 04 OR 08 VW R32.

An adapter is required for the 04 R32 for correct rotor radius and offset.


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## vwconejo (Apr 18, 2009)

*Re: (a4tq)*


_Quote, originally posted by *a4tq* »_
An adapter is required for the 04 R32 for correct rotor radius and offset.


Have you seen any sort of adaptors for the OP's requested setup?
Im wondering if an adapter would work, as Touareg front calipers have the "carrier" part of them built in.


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## vwconejo (Apr 18, 2009)

*Re: (vwconejo)*

As seen in this pic i took a while back, you can see that it has the "carrier" part of it molded into the back of the caliper, as the OP has asked, is it possible to just remove the caliper from a Touareg and bolt on to R32? Im pretty sure and adapter bracket would be difficult to configure, I'm going to check spindle part numbers for both the R32 and Touareg, I know they wont be the same, but if they are the same last 3 #s we may have a nice setup.


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## vwconejo (Apr 18, 2009)

*Re: (vwconejo)*

Close, but not quite, I would still like to actually try and bolt a Touareg/Cayenne caliper onto an R32, aside from having to step up to the Touareg rotors, it seems like it MAY work. Here are both spindles for comparison
T-reg








R32


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## xola3que (Jul 9, 2008)

I'm in the middle of doing mine right now. Few things:
1. Cayenne calipers WILL bolt onto MKV R32 mounting eyelets. Not sure about MKiv R32 but from ESC kit, you do need a fabricated bracket to fit them on correctly.
2. Cayenne rotors WILL NOT work w/ R32. stock Cayenne have very high offset, wrong bolt pattern and spindle center hole is way big. fitting will be very sloppy. You can redrill the bolt pattern but you still have to deal w/ the offset. Other alternative of rotors is a C32 AMG rotors but I have yet to verify that on the R32. I'm ordering a new set of R32 345mm rotors. will let you guys know how it will work w/ the Cayenne calipers
3. You will need new brake lines. I have order number from ECS if anyone interested.
4. You will need at least a 15mm spacer to avoid the wheels hitting the calipers. New mounting bolts and bushing for the 16mm Cayenne eyelet to fit safely w/ the MKV
5. We're luck out because Cayenne calipers are also mounted on the leading edge of the rotors...so no need to swap bridge to the bleeding nipples, no need to swap left caliper to right or vice versa. S4/RS4 club have to do this because their caliper is mounted on the trailing edge.



_Modified by xola3que at 4:08 PM 6-18-2009_


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## Richard Harris (Mar 13, 2001)

Thank you Xola3que. 
They bolt to the MK 5 eyelets as I suspected. BTW, that ETKA looks good. I need to upgrade mine.


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## 13LG60 (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: (xola3que)*

Theres a bit of info out there if you search for it








http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...38694
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3774062
http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/s...73699
http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/s...73722


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## xola3que (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: (1,3LG60)*

Also:
http://www.audizine.com/forum/...74285


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## slayerrule (Feb 20, 2006)

http://mbt-engineering.de/EN/p....html


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## 13LG60 (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: (slayerrule)*

Got this reply to my inquiry to MBT last week when researching this. The ECS kit wont be legal (No TÜV- documents) in Norway, but possibly the MBT kit, as they know what to write in their documents.
If you can find someone to make custom bells at a reasonable price, you can use Porsche 911 GT2 rotors that are 350x34 like the Cayenne ones, but two-piece http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
_Hi Frode,

Thanks for the interest in our products. 

We are offering the entire kit including all the parts like Porsche calipers, pads, etc. for
€ 2.458.-

or the Adapter-kit excluding the calipers. The reason is that you can use the Porsche 955T, VW Touareg and Audi Q7 18'' callipers for this application. And some of our customers have good sources for these parts….()!

€ 1.189.- including the rotors, bells and mounting hardware for the calipers. The calipes , see above are not part of the package.

Any questions are welcome. Let us know if you are interested.

Regards
Uwe
http://www.mbt-engineering.de _



_Modified by 1,3LG60 at 9:59 AM 6-29-2009_


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

*FV-QR*

I have been running with the Q7 (same as the cayenne) calipers on my A3 for about 2 years now. I used stoptech lines but others make the right ones.
I have modified cayenne turbo pads to work with my diameter rotors. 
Currently I am using MK2 TT 3.2 rotors which are 345mm.
The biggest issues is the rotors do not center in the caliper and you need to slightly modify the outboard pad stops so they do not hit the rotor face. 
The pads need to be modified so that they sit centered on the rotor face and don't overhang the inside or outside lip (even though some stock applications do do that).
Some of the A4/S4 guys have tried the ml55 rotors which comparing pics of those to the pics of those that tried C32 rotors appear that they should sit more centered in the caliper then the TT rotors or the C32 rotors. I'll be picking up an ML55 rotor in the next day or two to test since I need to replace my pads.


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## 13LG60 (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

A pic of the ML55 disc on a A3 with these calipers


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

*FV-QR*

I have no doubt that the ml55 rotor will fit diameter wise they are 345mm just like the TT discs I am using. The question comes in of offset and if they will be centered in the rotor correctly. Not having them centered unfortunately means you can only get about 50% pad use before you must replace them or risk the pads popping off the pad stops.


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## 13LG60 (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

Here's some info I've found about the height ("offset") of the different discs
ML 55
Eigenschaft Wert 
Durchmesser [mm] 345 
Höhe [mm] 51 
Bremsscheibenart belüftet 
Bremsscheibendicke [mm] 32,0 
Mindestdicke [mm] 30 
Zentrierungsdurchmesser [mm] 67 
Felge Lochzahl 5 
http://www.q-11.de/webdocs/all...0.gif
R32
Eigenschaft Wert 
Durchmesser [mm] 345 
Höhe [mm] 50 
Bremsscheibenart belüftet 
Bremsscheibendicke [mm] 30,0 
Mindestdicke [mm] 27 
Zentrierungsdurchmesser [mm] 64 
Felge Lochzahl 5 

Cayenne
Durchmesser / Outer Ø [mm] 350,0 
Bremsscheibendicke / Thickness [mm] 34,0
Mindestdicke / Minimum Thickness [mm] 32,0
Lochanzahl / No. of holes 5
Durchmesser : 350,0 mm
Dicke: 34,0mm
Höhe: 68,75 mm
Gewicht pro Stück: 12,04 kg
Looks like the offset of the ML and the R32 discs are quite close, considering the ML discs are 2 mm thicker and only 1 mm higher


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

*FV-QR*

It really just needs to be a few mm more to the inside. not sure exactly what each of those specs are referring to but i have one on the way for tomorrow morning to test it. Would prefer to just see for myself at this point. I will post up what I find. 
I also have someone who is working on rotors for the B6 and B7 S4s with these calipers that I have contacted about test fitting one of those rotors but they don't want to just send one to me to test they want a car there. Basically any mk5 platform based car would do and they have a caliper to test fit with and take measurements. 
In Lathrop CA, anyone who is interested just contact me and I"ll put you in touch with them. They do not advertise here so trying not to violate any rules by posting all their info. 
Based on prices of their other rotors would probably be in around 750 bucks USD for plain or slotted. 
These would end up being a direct fit 2PC rotor for using cayenne, t-reg or Q7 calipers.


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## surffly (Feb 18, 2009)

any updates?
i found this thread while seaching for other stuff....
i remember talking about doing a cheap bbk on the MKV R32 site and got hammered about backyard bbk that will kill me.
nice to see others are thinking and seeing parts for what they are.
so this IS the ecs kit for a 1/3 of the price then?....
im so in
how can you tell when buying calipers if they are for the 330 or 350 disks?


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## xola3que (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: (surffly)*


_Quote, originally posted by *surffly* »_
how can you tell when buying calipers if they are for the 330 or 350 disks?


the stamping on the caliper is either 17ZR or 17ZL for 330mm, 18ZR & 18ZL for 350mm




_Modified by xola3que at 1:48 PM 7-23-2009_


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## surffly (Feb 18, 2009)

so is there a parts list for the DIY?


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## xola3que (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: (surffly)*


_Quote, originally posted by *surffly* »_so is there a parts list for the DIY?

Yeah
--CALIPERS--
Porsche P/N 955.351.422.21/955.351.422.22 (red)
18ZL cast into them
There are 36mm between the guide pins, designed for 34mm thick rotor
Touareg came in two sizes, Touareg and Q7 maybe not have revesible balance pipes
Our calipers mounts towards the back, Porsche mounts towards the front, so switch sides if possible
Swap balance pipe/bleed nipples when changing sides
http://www.genuineaudiparts.com/ Q7 caliper $346.25/ea
Notes on increasing piston size purpose.
1. Large pads get hotter/wear more in their leading edge, leading to taper and performance issues as the leading edge overheats under very hard use (read: track)
2. The way the progressive piston sizes work, is by putting less pressure on the leading edge of the pads. Think about it, if pressure is expressed in psi, less square inches equals less pressure.
--ROTORS--
The target measurement from back of hat surface (where the hub mates) to centerline of braking ring is 27.5mm
Idealy the centerline would be offset .05" (1.27mm) more towards the inboard side (don't know why)
MB P/N 203-421-09-12 (345x30mm) 26lbs. - 2002-2004 C32 AMG/2005-2006 C55 AMG
http://www.koperformance.com $120
When lying flat on a table, are 1.845" high, with a .230 thick flange, for an "underhat measurement" of 1.615" (41.021mm)
41.021mm UH and rotor is 30mm thick. Rotor centerline is half so 41.021-15=26.021mm (1.479mm outboard of 27.5mm target)
Saw field mounted rotor center that sat ~2mm further outboard which supports the above
Lug holes need to be opened up from 12 to 14mm and center bore must be increased about 1mm to 2.680" (saw 68.62mm measured on hub)
Aftermarket C32 2-piece rotors weigh 19lbs (7lbs lighter)
http://www.racingbrake.com/Sea...rch=Y
Audi P/N ?????? (345x29.5mm) rotors - B8 (2010?) S5
http://www.genuineaudiparts.com/ 2008 A5/S5 rotor $90.20
They are left side directional curved vanes for both sides (like the R8) so you get two left side rotors.
Bolt on, but use ~2mm spacers to center rotor (still need to calculate)
--HARDWARE--
http://www.mcmaster.com
P/N 91290A749 (pack of 5) - Socket head bolt, M14, metric grade 12.9, 70mm long (Should have been around 50mm) $10.95
40 mm Fully Threaded 91290A725 $6.11
45 mm Fully Threaded 91290A727 $7.06
50 mm Fully Threaded 91290A735 $8.68
55 mm Fully Threaded 91290A737 $8.47
60 mm Partially Threaded 91290A745 $9.50
65 mm Partially Threaded 91290A747 $9.05
P/N 93795A257 (pack of 10) - Conical locknuts, M14 $8.75
Bushings to go from the 16mm caliper mounting hole to the 14mm bolt that the Audi uses
http://www.asbbearings.com
(4) P/N ZMB 1416-20, 14mm ID x 16mm OD x 20mm long
--LINES--
You can rebend and reuse stock lines
Audi P/N ?????? - B7 RS4 stainless lines work
http://www.genuineaudiparts.com/ Q7 flex hose $51.16
--PADS--
Pad thickness is 16mm
http://www.genuineaudiparts.com/ Q7 front pads $143.52
Caliper is designed for a 34mm thick rotor, you could make shims from Ti6Al4V
Shims could help center rotor and help insulate heat
Ti6Al4V transfers less than half of the energy of stainless steel or 99% Ti

--NOTES--
ECS WILL sell you the entire rotor, ring and hat for $674.80 for the pair and the stainless lines you need for $90.36
JCS is working on a 2 piece rotor for this application that should be a perfect fit
(Copied from gollygwagon @ audizine.com)


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## xola3que (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

Chris
I have the same set up as you. Have you brakes been squeak alot running those set up. I ground down the pins pretty good and I'm sure they're not drawing circles on the rotors. Pads are still new. I have lots of squeaks when I coast to a stop and I can't pin point the source of the noise. Are there some kind of anti-squeal spray?
Ct

_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_I have been running with the Q7 (same as the cayenne) calipers on my A3 for about 2 years now. I used stoptech lines but others make the right ones.
I have modified cayenne turbo pads to work with my diameter rotors. 
Currently I am using MK2 TT 3.2 rotors which are 345mm.
The biggest issues is the rotors do not center in the caliper and you need to slightly modify the outboard pad stops so they do not hit the rotor face. 
The pads need to be modified so that they sit centered on the rotor face and don't overhang the inside or outside lip (even though some stock applications do do that).
Some of the A4/S4 guys have tried the ml55 rotors which comparing pics of those to the pics of those that tried C32 rotors appear that they should sit more centered in the caliper then the TT rotors or the C32 rotors. I'll be picking up an ML55 rotor in the next day or two to test since I need to replace my pads. 



_Modified by xola3que at 11:10 AM 7-20-2009_


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## [email protected] (Jan 6, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (xola3que)*

Just going to bump this up with some known new info. 
C32 rotors = don't work
ml55 rotors = don't work
ml63 rotors = yet to be determined.
I have the caliper and am working with a shop to figure out a solution. I might also try tt-s rotors soon too.


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## xola3que (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

C32 rotors need enlarging those holes to fit. Is that what you mean by not working?


_Modified by xola3que at 11:30 AM 7-24-2009_


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## carbonfold (Jul 18, 2009)

2008 MB ML63 AMG Front rotors (350mmx32mm) will work 100%. Only need a 67mm to 65mm hub centric spacer.
Go to the other posts for more info: 
http://forums.fourtitude.com/z...age=4
I've personally put them on and in the middle of a write up.


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## [email protected] (Jan 6, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (xola3que)*

No I mean the offset is wrong for the mk5/8p chassis. 
However, if you own a b5 a4/s4 they MIGHT work for you. The offset is close to that of the passat 3.6 4motion (same as r32)
Regarding the spacers for the ml63 rotors, do you think you'll need to mod them to fit perfect?


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## carbonfold (Jul 18, 2009)

Not sure yet. I ordered some aluminum ones and still waiting for them to be delivered.
As for offset, I know running this rotor (from a ML63 AMG or ML450 2008 ((part number 164 421 14 12)) works great to a MKV setup (A3/R32/Golf V) and the caliper gives you no offset issues. Well, it does stick out further, but with the correct wheel spacers (12.5mm +), shouldn't give you any problems hitting the inside spokes. 
Offset is perfect for my 2008 A3 and only issue was that hubcentric ring, which I don't see mod'n that ring a big deal, but I'm keeping everyone informed.


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## GinsterDub (Apr 9, 2005)

*Re: (carbonfold)*

What size Cayenne Calipers do you have? 17" or 18". For the 04 R32 you can use the stock R32 rotors but you need an adaptor to make them fit. I have one that I am selling currently, $200 for the brackets and bolts. I'm going a different route.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4509000


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## carbonfold (Jul 18, 2009)

MKV So direct mount.


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## GinsterDub (Apr 9, 2005)

*Re: (carbonfold)*

From everything that we have read they should.


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