# Alternative to "chip"/tuning yourself, Nefmoto



## warpedhalo (Sep 23, 2010)

Hey guys.

I have recently been looking around for an alternative to spending $600+ on tuning software to run my GT30 on my 2001 TT 225. I've come accross info on running a MAP clamp, tuning with lemmingwinks, and a few other things. What has my attention the most though is a program from NefMoto.

Aparently, as long as you have the Bosh ME7 ECU, you can use this program to flash it, and then you can use a different program, I believe it's called tunerpro, to tune everything. Has anyone played around with this? I know it's pretty technical stuff, but I'm comfortable with that. 

Basiclly looking for opinions and experience here. Let me know what you think. I did a search for NefMoto and didn't return any results, so I'm assuming this isn't a very popular route.


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## 1.8 skeet skeet (Aug 11, 2004)

Why go through all the trouble:screwy: These companies have years of R&D in their software...I would spend the 600 and save time and money :thumbup:


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## warpedhalo (Sep 23, 2010)

Oh, i definately do not mind the trouble. In fact, I wouldn't buy a "chip" unless it had end user tuneability. Not sure if that's a word or not... The way I see it, these "chips" pretty much have to be universal. I mean, they may be close... if you tell them the list of mods you have, but unless you sit in the car and log, and/or dyno it you can't be sure the settings are correct. How many people on here complain because of rich idle and the like? How would a "chip" company know how much a custom intake would flow? I'd much rather spend hours logging and tuning. I'll log/tune whether I buy the $600 chip or not. So as far as saving time and money by buying a chip, if this nefmoto software works, I'd save at least $600 and have a similar amount of time invested. Plus with NefMoto's software you can set up launch control! How cool is that? Does anybody else offer that?


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## ejg3855 (Sep 23, 2004)

It can be done. IF you like reading HEX code.

http://www.ecuconnections.com/


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## poopie (Feb 22, 2005)

Most BT tunes need some tweaking to get it right. I find that off the shelf BT tunes get you in the ballpark, but you always need a little dyno tune to get the most out of your set up. basic stock turbo reflashes are another story. No need to co custom there.


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## warpedhalo (Sep 23, 2010)

See, I don't want to have to read hex code, but I will. I should have just waited until I got the battery back in the car before posting. I plan on trying this out, and my understanding is that these programs read the code for you. I'm not a programmer, and the only time I've had to play with HEX stuff was when I modded my xbox game. I'm more or less asking if anyone has tried these programs out. I'll post my results once I try it, I'm just looking for someone else's experience before I do it. To learn from other people's mistakes before I make them myself and find out the hard way ha ha.


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## SoloGLI (Jan 20, 2005)

Off the shelf BT tunes have come a LONG way in the last few years. PLENTY of people are running Unitronic and Eurodyne with 0 problems and they didn't have to tweak anything and they put down some serious numbers.

Eurodyne has already come out with the option to tune anything and everything you want with their Maestro software. I believe Unitronic is in the process of developing their own software to do the same thing. Search in the 1.8t forums, theres TONS more info in there.


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## Doooglasss (Aug 28, 2009)

I'm an IT guy, I live breathe and eat tech all day. I understand programing languages as well and have wired many cars... I took one look at Hondata's Kpro end user software and had a headache. I got my friends car to run but it needed dyno time and somebody who understood what all the fueling options did to make it run right.

Yea if it was my car I could have spent six months learning it and tried it myself but I would have probably fried something in the process during a test run under lean conditions accidentally...

If you want to have end user adjustment look to Eurodyne's Maestro. It's priced fairly and the software package looks nice. People are pretty happy with it so far and there is a HUGE tuning thread in the 1.8T section. They also give you a basemap to work off of- what could be better than that? The big difference between Eurodyne and standalone is that Eurodyne still pulls timing and has knock detection. It's safer and proven.

I'd personally keep away from no name tuning companies and DIY stuff here unless you REALLY know what you're doing or have the money to dump on a new setup if you accidentally send this one to the junkyard.

Also a lot of the complaints you hear people talking about with BT setups is because they are cheapening out or doing it all wrong. Faulty wiring, mismatched used parts, old sensors & bad injectors. Unitronic is coming out with flow-bench tested & matched fuel injector sets in the next few months. This is going to do away with a lot of the lean/rich/cold start/bad idle issues that people complain about.


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## warpedhalo (Sep 23, 2010)

Coming back to post on an old thread here for the potential future viewers... this whole self tuning thing is going to be a reality. Very soon. Already is a reality for the s7 guys, and we're talking about 99% for a 1.8t kbox (2001 TT 225Q). Could potentially tune now with a program that is difficult to use, but tunerpro is the way to go cause it's way more user friendly and normal people can understand it... and it's free. Not there quite yet, but REAL close. I'm holding my breath.


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## PLAYED TT (Oct 17, 2010)

This sounds like way too much trouble, but it's your car, do what you like


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## omerkm1 (Feb 23, 2010)

It seems to me like Eurodyne/Maestro would be the way to go. You need a base map to get the car started and on the dyno. I know from years ago watching my friends with AEM's standalone on their b series honda engines struggle, it sucks when you can even get the car to start because the stand alone engine management system forced you to re-wire the car. 

Have the 1.8t guys pushed the limits of a stock turbo with Maestro? That would be interesting to me. Going BT seems like I would sacrificing reliability.


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## warpedhalo (Sep 23, 2010)

ha ha ha, yeah it's going to be a lot of trouble... a lot. Like, you're going to have to keep adding things very very slowly and log everything to make sure everything's in check and know exactly what to change. But I'm saying changing them is going to be easy... not that tuning is going to be easy. There's definately still a lot of potential to completely screw everything up. And like you're saying, it will be a lot easier to start with a base tune, but once this stuff gets to be public and stuff I'd imagine that once people got things tweaked up to a certain point they would (wishful thinking) post their say tuned k04 file. Maybe a gt28 file and so on. Then you could tweak say for your different sized injectors you know? Like the subaru guys and the evo guys do, a nice open community of tuners.

But I don't think it would be any more dangerous than maestro really. Basically a less user-friendly version of the same thing. But I'm sure that one could totally screw up their car just the same with maestro. It's going to be essential to have a good understanding of how everything works and what to change using either method. But the me7 tuning wiki pretty much tells you what you need to know about fueling/timing/boost, what maps to change, and how to change them and in what order to do everything. Everything you'd really need to run a bigger MAF, BT, and bigger injectors or anything else that would affect a/f and timing and whatnot. Plus how to set up launch control and a few other goodies. It has a lot of potential to the people that are patient enough. But to save $1000 on maestro I'll be as patient as it takes to get a base tune, and like I said, hopefully one day I could just download a base tune from the forum. From there it shouldn't be too much work for someone new at it. Just an understanding of things and a lot of reading what/how to change stuff.


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## dave6134 (Jun 29, 2010)

*Instructions for Reading ECU using Nefmoto*

I'm just staring to investigate reading/writing ATW 1.8T and see what options I might have with Nefmoto. 

For starters, I'd like to just read the ECU and store in a file. Plan to use a hex editor and some analysis and see what might be possible


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## warpedhalo (Sep 23, 2010)

Well, there's been a lot of progress since the last time I posted about this nefmoto stuff. I have an 01 TT 225, and all the work for everything is basically done. I just download my ecu flash to my laptop, load the definitions file made up for my "K-box" and my flash to TunerPro, and tune away. But it's not really like that for every car. From what I've gathred there are a LOT of different definition files, basically for every revision or version of the ME7 ECU... so a lot. But there are a lot of definition files over there too, so check it out. If yours isn't listed, request it! 

Used to be all this checksum problems and hex editing and all that but not so much anymore. There's a free logging/flashing/cel scanner program to download, TunerPro (free) to alter the flashes, and a checksum checker plugin for tunerpro ($10) to verify your altered flash files. That's all ya need. Well, that and enough know-how (research) to not tune your motor to be a grenade. But yeah... $10 and you can tune away apparently.

However, I have not done it. I'll definately post more when I actually get to doing it. JUST got my new turbo on and a/f tuned w/lemmiwinks. I know there's a lot more potential in the car, and lemmiwinks just isn't going to bring it out seeing how it tunes accross the whole RPM range w/its adjustments. But yeah, definately go over there and check that forum out.


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## turbogregtn (Oct 13, 2009)

warpedhalo said:


> Well, there's been a lot of progress since the last time I posted about this nefmoto stuff. I have an 01 TT 225, and all the work for everything is basically done. I just download my ecu flash to my laptop, load the definitions file made up for my "K-box" and my flash to TunerPro, and tune away. But it's not really like that for every car. From what I've gathred there are a LOT of different definition files, basically for every revision or version of the ME7 ECU... so a lot. But there are a lot of definition files over there too, so check it out. If yours isn't listed, request it!
> 
> Used to be all this checksum problems and hex editing and all that but not so much anymore. There's a free logging/flashing/cel scanner program to download, TunerPro (free) to alter the flashes, and a checksum checker plugin for tunerpro ($10) to verify your altered flash files. That's all ya need. Well, that and enough know-how (research) to not tune your motor to be a grenade. But yeah... $10 and you can tune away apparently.
> 
> However, I have not done it. I'll definately post more when I actually get to doing it. JUST got my new turbo on and a/f tuned w/lemmiwinks. I know there's a lot more potential in the car, and lemmiwinks just isn't going to bring it out seeing how it tunes accross the whole RPM range w/its adjustments. But yeah, definately go over there and check that forum out.


:wave: good to see people doing stuff like this. i have played with tunerpro cool stuff. work on the load tuning first tap you a wide band o2 A/F gauge. remember 14.7 to 1 only for part throttle. do a richer A/F for WOT do all the part throttle stuff first then go to the WOT. if you can do live data with your setup watch the fuel tables


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## lbandt (Sep 13, 2012)

im not finding much out there. hows this coming?


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## toy4two2 (Feb 6, 2012)

lbandt said:


> im not finding much out there. hows this coming?


any updates? Anyone do a hybrid K04 tune w/550cc injectors?


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## ejg3855 (Sep 23, 2004)

lbandt said:


> im not finding much out there. hows this coming?


There is everything you need to know and more there, if you're looking for a step by step how to there isn't one. 

The calibrations and map definitions are there. 

Its very time consuming to learn, I gave up on it and moved to diesel.


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## JakeMk2 (Dec 1, 2016)

Anyone have a copy of nefmoto? Seems he's gone awol.


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