# 2.5L Rally/Rallycross car.



## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

I've had my. 2000 Zx3 Focus I've been running in the TX region SCCA rally series for several years, but it's become a PITA to get performance parts for the damn thing and the parts for the AWD strap came from a Mandeo --so it's an even bigger PITA to service these days. 

So, I cut a deal with the wife, and I purchased a 2013 2.5L Golf to DD and build over the next 4 years into my next rally car --this time for the much tougher New Mexico series...I'll be in an NA group. No snails or force feeding allowed. 

So, for now the car is my DD, but it will be a dedicated rally car when we buy the next round of cars in 5 years. We don't have emissions here --and I already deleted the cat. SAI is going next, and then I'm going to do a VTA catch can. I'm building over time, but I hate just throwing parts at cars --so I need a plan. 

I already have: 
P-Flo 
Power Pulley 
GTI catback 
Tsuedo Midpipe 
17*8 wheels 245/35r17 Eagle GT rubber 
Diesel geek SS. 

I'm wanting some info on some things: 

--I saw a thread here that said the 2012&2013 have individual tube headers. Can anyone confirm this? 

--What is the issue on the TB sensors prohibiting ITB's? What's the way around it? 

--Is there a stand alone EMS that will work with the stock cluster and ignition system? 

--What's the best tuning software for these ECUs? WinOLS? Something else? 

--What's the best overbore for these motors? 

--What's the highest compression pistons these things can take? Are there any quality stroker kits? 

--Does the TTRS crankshaft fit? Is there any benefit? 

--What's the recommended port and polish method? Does anyone sell P&Ped heads? 

--Where can I get blank cams? Or any cams for that matter(are integrated engineering going to actually get produced?) 

--What's the news on shortened valves to allow higher compression and thicker cams? 

--What car can I raid a 5MT Haldex setup out of that will mate with this motor? 

I'm sure I'll have more questions, and I'm not dead set on anything yet besides racing NA in NM SCCA rally. If I seem uncertain, I'm new to imports. I switched b/c y'all dubbers get much longer term performance parts support than I have with my Focus. 

Thanks!


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## DerekH (Sep 4, 2010)

Looks like you have some solid plans. hope you keep us updated. 

First off id recommend a 245 45 17. i think the 245 35 would be enough smaller it would skrew with things. 

Talk to NLS about all things ITB, they did a one time ITB set up and it seems like they had a lot of success with it. Talk to IE about overbore and strokers but i have not heard anything about it although im sure it is very doable. I don't believe there is any point in going with a ttrs crank. the bluewater car uses a stock 2.5 crank to my knowledge and its making over 800 awhp. Ive also heard that there is limited success with port and polish because of how well the head already flows but i don't there there has been a whole lot of experimentation with it so there might be a way of doing it well. 

Im no expert so i could be very wrong on any of these things. However they are things that i do believe i have read here and there.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

DerekH said:


> Looks like you have some solid plans. hope you keep us updated.
> 
> First off id recommend a 245 45 17. i think the 245 35 would be enough smaller it would skrew with things.
> 
> ...


 Thanks! 

I chose the rubber because my gears are too big. I'll be changing tire size when I build a transmission. 

I'll follow your advice on asking NLS. He has obviously found whatever workaround it takes to get ITBs working. 

I'm trying to get in touch with integrated engineering, but they're pretty tight lipped about future products. I can understand that. I'll try asking about stroker kits --I want increased compression, increased flow, increased fuel, cams and ITBs --and I'd like them to be reliable. That combo has always worked for me in the past --but who knows there may be better ways to build a VW than what I'm used to doing. 

As for keeping y'all updated. That's kinda the plan . When I finally start rallying this car, I'd like to have somewhere to whore some pics and whatnot.


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## itskohler (Jan 7, 2011)

Sub'd for eminent long term greatness


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> I've had my. 2000 Zx3 Focus I've been running in the TX region SCCA rally series for several years, but it's become a PITA to get performance parts for the damn thing and the parts for the AWD strap came from a Mandeo --so it's an even bigger PITA to service these days.
> 
> So, I cut a deal with the wife, and I purchased a 2013 2.5L Golf to DD and build over the next 4 years into my next rally car --this time for the much tougher New Mexico series...I'll be in an NA group. No snails or force feeding allowed.
> 
> ...


 
Some answers in bold above, hope they help. 

In for 5 years when this is racing. Its possible I might be moving to tx soon glad to hear they have rallycross there, I would love to give it a try. Not much in NC.


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## rabbitlvr (Oct 8, 2011)

In five years I will be graduating college but this will be bigger then that! sub'd


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> Some answers in bold above, hope they help.
> 
> In for 5 years when this is racing. Its possible I might be moving to tx soon glad to hear they have rallycross there, I would love to give it a try. Not much in NC.


 

Thanks for the info. I'll have more time next week to spend of the phone, so I appreciate getting me a list of people with brains to pick. 

Insofar as SCCA rallycross in Texas, it ranges from all out speed stage races to intricate navigation challenges with speed limits to time attack. 

This season there's a new type of rally added that's pretty neat --the objective is to run the corse forwards on day one and then run the course backwards on day two. You gain or lose points for getting the same average speeds and similar times both days. If I wasn't having so many problems with the Focus I'd be running that for kicks, but money is tight with a young family so its going to be a while before I get to do much actual stage racing again. 

I'll be doing mostly rallycross and timing challenges with speed limits for a while. They're fun and don't require a purpose built car. 

BTW, you've got a killer car for rally. You might want to put a spoiler or wing on it for stage racing, and if you haven't got one yet, get a diesel geek panzer plate and shifter. 

I'm looking at body work myself too, but I'll likely be going a *tad* lower for road rally instead of offload like yours is setup for. I'm trying to find a single grill setup like is on a Focus or Fiesta ST. I'll probably find it on an Audi and use that hood and bumper --then just pull fenders for 17*9s with 265s. 

The sheer ammount of parts for these cars is astounding. I'm frisking spoiled for choice over the Focus. 

BTW I think your car is modified enough that you'll need to be running in the modified fwd class. Aftermarket forced induction and a lift will put you into whole new ball game. I run the prepared class --it's all OEM+ on the suspension (OEM+ AWD swaps are okay) and no aftermarket force feeding or big turbo kits like the the Golf .:R guys try to get away with. I can do a manifold or ITBs so I'll be doing ITBs if I can get it worked out. If the rules on turbos change I might do a snail, but that's not likely. 

There is a stock class I'd still be in right now. It's 100% stock suspensions and requires 100% street legal parts.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

If anyone else is interested: 





 
It's a great hobby and it can be done on a stock car. Most clubs charge like $50 for a weekend in RallyX. Stage racing is a LOT pricier, so for now this is what I am doing until my new car gets built out.


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## regal7point5 (Oct 2, 2009)

Does the class make you have only 5 forward gears? You can use the 5 speed and Haldex, differential, etc from a 180hp Quattro TT. OR, as stated the 6 speed from an R32 and the haldex, rear diff, etc will work or the same equipment from a 225hp Quattro TT.

Obviously, there will be fabrication required for the rear diff and associated parts, but the trans *should* bolt right up. Not sure if the output shaft for the rear will be in the right place on a MKV chassis.


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

The trans from a TT or an R32 needs a little grinding, but then it will bolt right on. If you use the R32 haldex, just get the entire rear subframe assembly, it will bolt directly in, but you will have to add 2 braces for the rear subframe mounts and then all you will need is a haldex controller and the R32 gas tank to clear the drive shaft.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

regal7point5 said:


> Does the class make you have only 5 forward gears? You can use the 5 speed and Haldex, differential, etc from a 180hp Quattro TT. OR, as stated the 6 speed from an R32 and the haldex, rear diff, etc will work or the same equipment from a 225hp Quattro TT.
> 
> Obviously, there will be fabrication required for the rear diff and associated parts, but the trans *should* bolt right up. Not sure if the output shaft for the rear will be in the right place on a MKV chassis.


From what i understand the O2Q/O2M weigh in the vicinity of 75Lbs more weight, and while I'm in the NA group I still compete against turbo cars. My car gets to be around 500Lbs lighter. Also IIRC there are issues with the shift forks in the VAG 6-speeds whereas their 5speeds have diff issues which are 100% solved with an LSD.

Could I run a custom driveshaft so I could use the MKV/VI rear diff w/ the TT MKI trans? Or could I mount the power transfer unit from an MKV/MKVI with the TT trans?


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Just shoved the Autotech subframe mount in here at lunch. It's not stiff enough.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> The trans from a TT or an R32 needs a little grinding, but then it will bolt right on. If you use the R32 haldex, just get the entire rear subframe assembly, it will bolt directly in, but you will have to add 2 braces for the rear subframe mounts and then all you will need is a haldex controller and the R32 gas tank to clear the drive shaft.


Awesome!

Does the R32 flange fit? I though they were VR6 a d had a larger bell housing?

Is there any difference between the MKII TT strap, MKV R32 strap and the MKVI Golf R strap?

Also, can I just cut the spare tire well out of one of those cars, or do I need the whole trunk floor pan?


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> From what i understand the O2Q/O2M weigh in the vicinity of 75Lbs more weight, and while I'm in the NA group I still compete against turbo cars. My car gets to be around 500Lbs lighter. Also IIRC there are issues with the shift forks in the VAG 6-speeds whereas their 5speeds have diff issues which are 100% solved with an LSD.
> 
> Could I run a custom driveshaft so I could use the MKV/VI rear diff w/ the TT MKI trans? Or could I mount the power transfer unit from an MKV/MKVI with the TT trans?


BTW AWD is pretty much a necessity. I'd be in the heavy 2WD class because of the adjusted displacement rules. The heavy 2WD class allows boosted motors up to 6L. I'd never win a single race against boosted VR6s or V8 swaps when we'd have the same minimum weight.


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

Vr6 uses a different bell housing. Any TT 02m will bolt right up. 

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


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## vwluger22 (Jan 25, 2005)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> Also, can I just cut the spare tire well out of one of those cars, or do I need the whole trunk floor pan?


Could swap the whole pan if you want or I think you could just get away with a flat rear pan no spare tire well. I don't believe anything mounts to the spare tire are also don't forget about the fuel tank if you planned on using a oem solution.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Pat @ Pitt Soundworks said:


> Vr6 uses a different bell housing. Any TT 02m will bolt right up.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


Would the bell housing from a 1.8T 5MT mate to case from a VR6 5MT?

Or could I modify a non-AWD 5MT to accept the power transfer unit? I have seen a few references on here that suggest some O2Qs have been converted to an O2M AWD by tapping bolt holes and swapping the diff.

I really would prefer to save every but of weight possible, and avoid the risk blown shift forks. However, if there's no other way --what's the ideal 6MT ratios for this engine?

BTW your project is sick, Pat. 1000AWHP is pretty crazy for such a motor with 2.48L stock displacement.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

vwluger22 said:


> Could swap the whole pan if you want or I think you could just get away with a flat rear pan no spare tire well. I don't believe anything mounts to the spare tire are also don't forget about the fuel tank if you planned on using a oem solution.


Did the Vortex Super Beetle swap the entire pan? And thanks for the tip on the fuel tank. That has to be OEM. 

The rules on modifying a floor pan are *very* nit pickey, and it has to basically be OEM or OEM like.
http://www.vwvortex.com/features/project-cars/superbeetle/super-beetle-cutting-and-splicing/

This shows a single crossmember and the spare tire well were all that it took on the super beetle. Is there a reason this won't work on this car?


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## vwluger22 (Jan 25, 2005)

Yes it looks like they "swapped" the pan or just went to the VW oem parts bin and got a new one for a golf R. 

Few years ago I sold a totaled mkv.:R as a AWD swap stripped the car down to the shell and left the rear end, trunk pan, gas tank and rear haldex ect intact. Don't know if the guy ever made the swap happen or not. But to keep it oem as possible I would find a parts car to remove everything from that way you can make the cuts where you want and have every nut and bolt you will needed. A few people have done the swap with a wrecked R and I think someone used a TT.


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> Would the bell housing from a 1.8T 5MT mate to case from a VR6 5MT?
> 
> Or could I modify a non-AWD 5MT to accept the power transfer unit? I have seen a few references on here that suggest some O2Qs have been converted to an O2M AWD by tapping bolt holes and swapping the diff.
> 
> ...


I believe the bellhousings are interchangeable. I have not heard of going from fwd to awd, but have seen the awd go to fwd. It might be possible, I just haven't heard of it.

Shift forks are an easy fix, open the tranny, drill out the rivet, put in a stainless bolt and nut, and tack weld the nut. When you make enough power to actually start braking forks, then it gets expensive. If you're worried about weight and still want awd, then the mk1tts came in a 5speed quattro, code dxw. IIRC, it's not as strong as the 6speed. But it'll work.

ratios, I know not.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

vwluger22 said:


> Yes it looks like they "swapped" the pan or just went to the VW oem parts bin and got a new one for a golf R.
> 
> Few years ago I sold a totaled mkv.:R as a AWD swap stripped the car down to the shell and left the rear end, trunk pan, gas tank and rear haldex ect intact. Don't know if the guy ever made the swap happen or not. But to keep it oem as possible I would find a parts car to remove everything from that way you can make the cuts where you want and have every nut and bolt you will needed. A few people have done the swap with a wrecked R and I think someone used a TT.


Awesome! 

I agree on the parts car. There will be Golf Rs totaled out by the time I need one.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Pat @ Pitt Soundworks said:


> I believe the bellhousings are interchangeable. I have not heard of going from fwd to awd, but have seen the awd go to fwd. It might be possible, I just haven't heard of it.
> 
> Shift forks are an easy fix, open the tranny, drill out the rivet, put in a stainless bolt and nut, and tack weld the nut. When you make enough power to actually start braking forks, then it gets expensive. If you're worried about weight and still want awd, then the mk1tts came in a 5speed quattro, code dxw. IIRC, it's not as strong as the 6speed. But it'll work.
> 
> ratios, I know not.


Thanks! That's exactly what I needed to know!


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

I couldnt find where this was actually answered, but you can just cut the spare tire well out. The only thing that is attached to it is the evap canister and that can be relocated.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> I couldnt find where this was actually answered, but you can just cut the spare tire well out. The only thing that is attached to it is the evap canister and that can be relocated.


Awesome! Thanks! That was what it looked like from the Super Beetle build thread! Good to have confirmation.

I'm assuming I need that reinforcing beam they cut out of there too, but those two parts have to be a hell of a lot cheaper than a whole floor pan. I feel like a loser admitting this, but one of the skills I'm lacking is welding. I can solder with the best of them, but I cannot weld to save my life.

BTW where in Tx will you be moving? The Panhandle is a beautiful place one you get used to the dust storms. I've lived in San Antone, Austin, Houston Bd Dallas/Ft Worth. I'm going to try like Hell to stay here or maybe move back to San Antonio. DFW and Houston don't feel much like Texas anymore, and Austin is where the guvment is so people have that "I'm important" attitude--and since I finished I undergrad in the UT system I have never wanted to go back.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Couple suspension questions:

What would be involved in a complete TTRS suspension swap? Not just the front LCAs, balljoints and knuckles --but the whole damn front and rear suspension.

How much width would I gain and how much lower would I go?

And I have an atmospheric oxygen density question for any of you who understand the physics of combustion better than my rudimentary grasp of the subject:

I was camping in the NM mountains for a few nights where the rallyX circuit I want to compete in will be --my 180Lb butt dyno is telling me that the car is significantly slower here.

Is this real, or am I seeing white rabbits from wonderland? 
--I think it's real, and due to the lower O^2 density, or maybe due to the 91oct instead of the 93oct I'm used to in lower elevation.

If this is real:
--What the Hell can I do about this? 

Is a lighter N/A car going to make enough power to be viably competitive with bigturbo cars that are a few hundred pounds heavier? Or should I just build a heaver snail-mobile myself?


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Austin is where I would be moving.



> I was camping in the NM mountains for a few nights where the rallyX circuit I want to compete in will be --my 180Lb butt dyno is telling me that the car is significantly slower here.


Altitude can effect the cars performance on a noticeable level. From what I remember the NA loss is something like 3% per 1000ft. And is smaller on turbo and sc'd cars.



> Is a lighter N/A car going to make enough power to be viably competitive with bigturbo cars that are a few hundred pounds heavier? Or should I just build a heaver snail-mobile myself?


Depends on the numbers I guess. The only number we ever got out of NLS about the ITB rabbit is 250whp, but who knows what the curve looked like. So its hard to say what would be the outcome of something like that.


Im not sure on the other questions.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> Austin is where I would be moving.


Austin is cool if you like booze, and stay out of the politics. I liked it back in undergrad, and my sister and her husband still love it there. Avoid driving by campus in rush hour --the highways were built when the town was sub-200K population so rush hour is a bitch.

The big amateur rallyX league is outside of Austin. You'll LOVE that. It's called Texas RallySport. Look them up. It wasn't a big thing while I was studying EE and stats out there, but I'd sure race it now. 



mldouthi said:


> Altitude can effect the cars performance on a noticeable level. From what I remember the NA loss is something like 3% per 1000ft. And is smaller on turbo and sc'd cars.


Dammit. I had not been accounting for that whatsoever. But, se la vive --hence the thread.



mldouthi said:


> Depends on the numbers I guess. The only number we ever got out of NLS about the ITB rabbit is 250whp, but who knows what the curve looked like. So its hard to say what would be the outcome of something like that.


RallyX is more about handling in the dirt and how fast the curve builds than the top end power IMHO. The SCCA rules explicitly state a track is to be designed for 45MPH average top speeds.

BUT, this car is really struggling at 4K feet right now. It's not looking good for an NA build if the FI guys will have a lot more power at elevation. If that's the case, I can do escargot --it's not ideal, but if I can outspool a larger displacement turbo car, I could still beat them.


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> Austin is cool if you like booze, and stay out of the politics. I liked it back in undergrad, and my sister and her husband still love it there. Avoid driving by campus in rush hour --the highways were built when the town was sub-200K population so rush hour is a bitch.
> 
> The big amateur rallyX league is outside of Austin. You'll LOVE that. It's called Texas RallySport. Look them up. It wasn't a big thing while I was studying EE and stats out there, but I'd sure race it now.
> 
> ...


Not much of a drinker and I dont like politics, haha, but I do think I would enjoy that there is rally racing so close. Seems like a fun hobby to get into. That is if I could ever stop working on stuff long enough to do a race ha. 

Well from what I was talking about with the power curve is that you might have to low end power advantage to get out of the corners, while they are waiting for there turbo to spool. As boost comes in later at higher elevations. 

But a turbo 2.5 is no joke either. :thumbup:


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> Not much of a drinker and I dont like politics, haha, but I do think I would enjoy that there is rally racing so close. Seems like a fun hobby to get into. That is if I could ever stop working on stuff long enough to do a race ha.


It's a great way to meet car nuts, and some of my best friendships formed in RallyX. Austin is FULL of Dubbers, Subie guys, Focus Fanatics and Volvo owning chicks. 

So many Volvos...and I think 90% of them have AWD Volvos because their rich daddies of sorority girls don't trust their driving skills. It's kinda disconcerting, and you learn to give Volvos a wide birth --except for C30s. The C30 is driven by hipsters who think Dubbers are too mainstream. LOL. 



mldouthi said:


> Well from what I was talking about with the power curve is that you might have to low end power advantage to get out of the corners, while they are waiting for there turbo to spool. As boost comes in later at higher elevations.


Ahh. I see says the blind man!



mldouthi said:


> But a turbo 2.5 is no joke either. :thumbup:


Agreed. They're pretty damn fast from what I've seen. It'd probably be cheaper too. 

If I did go the snail route, just how fast do they spool w/ an under drive pulley? Any way I slice it, I need to build power faster than everyone else. They'll have more of it, but if I get to 45mph the fastest and stay there the longest --then it's a huge advantage.


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Good to know, haha.



> Agreed. They're pretty damn fast from what I've seen. It'd probably be cheaper too.
> 
> If I did go the snail route, just how fast do they spool w/ an under drive pulley? Any way I slice it, I need to build power faster than everyone else. They'll have more of it, but if I get to 45mph the fastest and stay there the longest --then it's a huge advantage.


That is all in the size turbo you use. There are others on the forum that could answer the turbo size question better than me. I have put all my FI knowledge into the SC project so I am lacking in the turbo department. Next project will have a 2.5T though


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> That is all in the size turbo you use. There are others on the forum that could answer the turbo size question better than me. I have put all my FI knowledge into the SC project so I am lacking in the turbo department. Next project will have a 2.5T though


I guess I just need to reassess some things then. I need to figure out the best way to get a fat torque band and best acceleration offroad or on asphalt at high elevation.

I'm thinking that the TTRS suspension on 17*9s w/ a 255 patch is the way to go. It'll get me better steering ratios, about 2" wider and w/ good damps I will stay about an inch from stock height. 

The funny bit there is that now I'm debating a 2.5T build too. *chuckle* At least this is cheaper than starting with an Audi...


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Does anyone know about a viable piggyback ECU for these cars?


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Does anyone know if the USP high flow lower fuel pump will work in our cars? I'd like to use that as an upgrade for my fuel pump...


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Ok. I'm about to rule out ITBs as a realistic possibility since I cannot figure out how Josh out at NLS used the OE throttlebody to to control the ITBs.

That brings me to a change in my basic design. I'm debating using a C2 SRI since it is cheaper and offers a fatter torque curve than a UM SRI. This should bring my car to near or even beyond 200 WHP with an appropriate tune. With the addition of headers, an NA cam set, overbore and 11:1 or maybe 12:1 compression on a flex fuel tune running E85 --would I be looking at somewhere near 250WHP and/or 250WTQ?

If I cannot get to where I want NA, I've been writing Doug out FrankenTurbo. I think that'll be the setup I go with. His hybrid turbos on TSIs and FSIs spool faster than K04 kits and make good power.

I see that Marcus is also working on a full blower kit. If that pans out well, I would definitely consider such a solution. 

Thoughts?


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

250/250 not going to happen. Well maybe if you dump a ton of money in to the head or re-index the cams for more top end (losing bottom end power), or use nitrous.

FT is too small for a 2.5L. They're designed for instant spool on 1.4-1.8L.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Pat @ Pitt Soundworks said:


> 250/250 not going to happen.
> 
> FT is too small for a 2.5L. They're designed for instant spool on 1.4-1.8L.


Then I wonder if he's designing a new turbo for the 2.5L?

What size turbo would you recommend for instant spool?


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

That I do not know and have not been up on.

I wouldn't start with anything smaller than a gt28rs and would probably go straight for the gtx2867r. Even the RS, I feel, would leave a lot to be desired on the top end.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Pat @ Pitt Soundworks said:


> That I do not know and have not been up on.
> 
> I wouldn't start with anything smaller than a gt28rs and would probably go straight for the gtx2867r. Even the RS, I feel, would leave a lot to be desired on the top end.


Is there any resource I could use to compare spool times from one to another? 

I'm not aiming for all out power, and my car cannot exceed 6850RPM. Quick cars with excellent handling trump fast cars which usually lack traction in rallyX.


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> Is there any resource I could use to compare spool times from one to another?
> 
> I'm not aiming for all out power, and my car cannot exceed 6850RPM. Quick cars with excellent handling trump fast cars which usually lack traction in rallyX.


http://www.squirrelpf.com/turbocalc/


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

This is a map from that calculator, but I'm not sure I'm using it right. When should I expect min and max boost on a 2.5L?


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

The red dots are the rpms shown in the "calculator output" area above, so you can see when the engine will start to build boost/see full boost.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> The red dots are the rpms shown in the "calculator output" area above, so you can see when the engine will start to build boost/see full boost.


The min and max boost sections are in the user input area with a default min boost of 3000rpm. From what I've read the C2 kit hits boost at 2000rpm, but that should be able to be reduced lower.


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Just fill in the chart to the numbers you want and search for a turbo comp map that fits. Remember to refresh the map if you change any numbers.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

I'm looking into chassis reinforcement now.


What are the weak points in the MKV/MK6 chassis that racing brings out? What can be done about them?


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## HollisJoy (Dec 26, 2011)

I went with a Unibrace XB just to cut down the unibody flex.
I have yet to purchase the UB or RB brace to complete the pkg.

http://unibrace.com/product/

Have you read any of Hyde16's posts? Lots of good stuff in there. :thumbup:
I bought a Tyrol Deadset Collar Kit, but havent installed it.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...endations-for-a-Daily-Driver-Enthusiast-Setup

I hope to have my car handling like a slot car for AutoX 2014.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Don't know how long it'll be before I have the cash to get it installed, but I ordered a strap


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

It bolts in. Just jack it up and slap it in. No biggy

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 4


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Pat @ Pitt Soundworks said:


> It bolts in. Just jack it up and slap it in. No biggy
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 4


 Thanks Pat! 

I thought there was some sort of issue with the OEM spare tire well needing to be replaced? I was planning on having a body shop transplanting the spare well and crossmembers from an Audi.


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## A1an (Mar 22, 2007)

This thread has great promise. opcorn: 

Kind of jealous. My 07 is reaching the point of needing to be replaced and with its high mileage I won't get much when it comes to trade/sell in a year. Would make a great start for a project race vehicle but this area really sucks for autocross, rallycross, etc.


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> Thanks Pat!
> 
> I thought there was some sort of issue with the OEM spare tire well needing to be replaced? I was planning on having a body shop transplanting the spare well and crossmembers from an Audi.


 Well yes, the tire well will need cut out. Unless you're dead set on replacing the stock tub, you could throw some sheet metal over it and call it done. No need for a body shop.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Pat @ Pitt Soundworks said:


> Well yes, the tire well will need cut out. Unless you're dead set on replacing the stock tub, you could throw some sheet metal over it and call it done. No need for a body shop.


 I think I have to have a spare tire well to pass safety inspection. I should check into that more.


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

bolt the spare it to the hood or hatch hah


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

Lol, or put the wheel on the trunk. And with foam you can make a mold for tbe tire... That's how rabbits/gti come from factory

Also, where did you buy this part/section?? How much was it?

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

thygreyt said:


> Also, where did you buy this part/section?? How much was it?


 I got mine from Eurospec for $1450 open box, and I have a friend delivering it, so I paid no freight. They have them new for $1650 plus freight. 

Came with everything you see plus the controller. Rear diff, axles, braking sysytem, lines, all of it. The only things I'll be buying are the trans, driveshaft, LSDs, and sway bar. I saw it on Ebay, and couldn't pass it up --it's a factory part for a 2012 .:R. 

Damn skippy if you ask me  



thygreyt said:


> Lol, or put the wheel on the trunk. And with foam you can make a mold for tbe tire... That's how rabbits/gti come from factory


 Really? I have a Golf, and it looks like the spare well is molded into the floor pan. I saw the Vortex super beetle, and was planning on doing what they did. My car is already at the body shop since it was broken into about a week ago, and I was just thinking about having them weld in an Audi/R32/R spare tire well and support brace if I can find one before they're done. 

It's a spare tire well, I don't think anyone will even notice if it doesn't exactly match the paint color. 



Pat @ Pitt Soundworks said:


> bolt the spare it to the hood or hatch hah


 Midlothi should totally make a rear hatch spare for his lifted Rabbit. That'd be sick! 

I don't think I can do that --there are SCCA rules about spare relocation.


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> I got mine from Eurospec for $1450 open box, and I have a friend delivering it, so I paid no freight. They have them new for $1650 plus freight.
> 
> Came with everything you see plus the controller. Rear diff, axles, braking sysytem, lines, all of it. The only things I'll be buying are the trans, driveshaft, LSDs, and sway bar. I saw it on Ebay, and couldn't pass it up --it's a factory part for a 2012 .:R.
> 
> ...


 
You will also need a R gas tank to clear the drive shaft that runs to the back. You might already know that but it wasnt on your list. 

The molded foam that Fred is talking about doesnt hold the tire, it just makes some pockets for the jack and factor tools. So the tire does sit in a metal well. 

Oh and I already made a swing out hatch spare tire carrier.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> You will also need a R gas tank to clear the drive shaft that runs to the back. You might already know that but it wasnt on your list.


 DO I need the fuel pumps too? I saw somewhere that if you don't transplant the pumps, you never read more than half full on your gas tank. 



mldouthi said:


> The molded foam that Fred is talking about doesnt hold the tire, it just makes some pockets for the jack and factor tools. So the tire does sit in a metal well.


 I get ya. Is there a way to slightly raise the trunk floor and put the spare in a custom foam insert? 



mldouthi said:


> Oh and I already made a swing out hatch spare tire carrier.


 You are classic V-Dub, mate. :beer: 

I would love to see someone do something similar to homebrew revive the Baja Beetle LOL! My mom had a lifted Baja back in the day --we have a long history of Dub modding in this family :thumbup:


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> DO I need the fuel pumps too? I saw somewhere that if you don't transplant the pumps, you never read more than half full on your gas tank.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Im not sure on the fuel pump. 

It looks like you would have to cut about half way up the spare tire well and put a new floor in it to be level with where the subframe mounts. You wouldnt need any different foam, the tire would just stick up higher. The center bulge is what holds the wheel in place, so that could just be raised as well. 

There are a couple lifted beetles also. There were 2 or 3 at this past sowo


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

I think I've finally found the coils I'm going to use. Does anyone have an opinion on ISC coil overs?

http://roc-euro.com/shop-by-vehicle/volkswagen/isc-coilover-kit-mkvi-golf-r.html

There are guys doing mild lifts to Golf Rs with these --and racing rallyX with them. That's exactly what I intend to do with them


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## killerbunny (Jul 10, 2008)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> I think I've finally found the coils I'm going to use. Does anyone have an opinion on ISC coil overs?
> 
> http://roc-euro.com/shop-by-vehicle/volkswagen/isc-coilover-kit-mkvi-golf-r.html
> 
> There are guys doing mild lifts to Golf Rs with these --and racing rallyX with them. That's exactly what I intend to do with them


I don't have experience with those coils. I just wanted to say I know the guys over at roc-euro they are good guys, and have a nice shop. I go to school close to them.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

killerbunny said:


> I don't have experience with those coils. I just wanted to say I know the guys over at roc-euro they are good guys, and have a nice shop. I go to school close to them.


One of the guys at Roc-Euro has a lifted .:R he races a RallyX running these coils. I'd actually like to talk to him about these  --it'll probably have to wait until after Xmas.


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## gugu1981 (Jul 25, 2011)

That looks very interesting!

I would love to see what information you can dig up. I want to firm up the handling of my golf too, but i have a Tow hitch, so lowering the vehicle is not practical. a mild lift on the base golf (which is already an inch or so higher than golf R) would be ideal. If not, minimal drop may be acceptable.


Peter


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## killerbunny (Jul 10, 2008)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> One of the guys at Roc-Euro has a lifted .:R he races a RallyX running these coils. I'd actually like to talk to him about these  --it'll probably have to wait until after Xmas.


One of my friends rally crosses his old Volvo. He saw the R a few weeks ago at an event. Says it looked good. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Anyone know what the A5 chassis ride heights are supposed to be? I've been talking to some of my old UTA Racing teammates, and they've convinced me I should stay inside factory chassis height specs for the platform.


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## I5MKV516 (Dec 26, 2013)

good luck with this build :thumbup:


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Okay, I went with an OEM Golf R suspension and Spulen front lower arms for now. Debating camber plates too. None of that will bump my class for this season while I'm not making a lot of power. As of right now, I'm going to beat this transmission to death while I'm at it and snag an AWD 02Q once I've got a FrankenTurbo on is sucker and I can afford the body work I need for he strap.

I'm fitting rear mudflaps and shopping around lubbock for somewhere to get my fenders rolled tomorrow. I'm already poking with 245s and I'm dead set on getting 255 snow tires under hear come May.

Also doing the basic 40K stuff in the morning. TTRS coilpacks, fuel filter, cabin air, oil change --probably the gearbox fluid too. Flushed and bled the brakes/clutch 5-6K ago, so I'm not going to worry about that right now.


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

02q awd? You meant 02m?
Also, with the right wheels you shouldn't be poking with 245s... 

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

thygreyt said:


> 02q awd? You meant 02m?


Forgive me, I should have said AWD capable 02Q.

I'll probably buy an 02Q with the PTU bolt holes and build it out using Mk TT 5sp internals (no forks to break) and an AWD LSD. No point in wasting money on a more expensive 02M case. :beer:



thygreyt said:


> Also, with the right wheels you shouldn't be poking with 245s.


They're poking on purpose. In rallyX, any extra with is allowed so long as you can stuff them under modified fenders.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

I need a set of these :beer:

$600 ain't a bad price either.


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Or $200 for these universal ones.  They would just need a little triming, or just bolt them up, they flex.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> Or $200 for these universal ones.  They would just need a little triming, or just bolt them up, they flex.


When you tear yours, can you replace them?


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## mldouthi (Jun 26, 2010)

Most companies that sell these on ebay make more than one set. I mean if you were going to spend $600, just buy 3 sets and you will be good for a long time. I havent torn mine yet, and I rub them alot. Its just slowly wearing into them. But if your tires arent the size of mine (which they wont be) you shouldnt have that problem.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

mldouthi said:


> ...if your tires arent the size of mine (which they wont be) you shouldnt have that problem.


No, mine will be OEM diameter but significantly wider and pushed out to flush with the flared fenders at stock US Golf R height. They'll probably never rub if I build them right.


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## vwluger22 (Jan 25, 2005)

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6081517-Motorsport-style&p=85143786#post85143786


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

vwluger22 said:


> http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6081517-Motorsport-style&p=85143786#post85143786


The listing in that thread goes nowhere. Do you have a link to those particular JDM flares now?


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## vwluger22 (Jan 25, 2005)

Looked up the sellers other items these look like them http://m.ebay.com/itm/111257515186 they also got some with out bolt holes.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

Well, it's been way too long since I updated things.

What I've done recently is:

Ordered 11.5:1 internals (thanks f5racing)
Ordered a knifed crank (thanks [email protected])
Started aquiring parts for custom geared trans project
Ordered 034 RSB and all their adjustable end links

Lifted the Golf 0.5" on Golf R springs w/ 034 mounts

Went IE SRI --amazing product. Waiting on an SRI tuned ECU to get back right now :beer: cheers to Pete!

I need to take proper pics of the lift :beer:


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## granth (Dec 5, 2001)

Good choice with the IE SRI. The new software rocks - Pete's tune feels real good. I'll be taking mine in this week for a port-flash of the final dyno-tuned release. I've been running a beta version for a few weeks and I'm very happy with it. :thumbup:

Are you doing an 0a4 > 02q swap? I'm planning the same, but still searching for a low-mileage transmission to beef up. Keep us updated with your progress.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

granth said:


> Good choice with the IE SRI. The new software rocks - Pete's tune feels real good. I'll be taking mine in this week for a port-flash of the final dyno-tuned release. I've been running a beta version for a few weeks and I'm very happy with it. :thumbup:
> 
> Are you doing an 0a4 > 02q swap? I'm planning the same, but still searching for a low-mileage transmission to beef up. Keep us updated with your progress.



Thanks! 

I'm holding off on the O2Q swap until I can do it right and go AWD. I'm redoing the gears in my 0A4 for now.


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## granth (Dec 5, 2001)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> I'm holding off on the O2Q swap until I can do it right and go AWD. I'm redoing the gears in my 0A4 for now.


Just gears? No torsen diff? 

I've considered upgrading my 5spd too. I'm ok with the gear ratios, but a new diff, clutch, and mount seems easy and practical compared to the 02q swap. 

Here's my list for the swap. Not sure if it's complete, but it's already weighing in at >$4k. Makes me ask the question: Is the 02q really THAT much better/stronger? 

* Transmission
* Axles
* Starter
* Shift knob
* Clutch line
* Bolt kits
* Clutch Kit
* Mount
* Short shifter
* Torsen diff
* Shifter forks

:beer:


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

granth said:


> Just gears? No torsen diff?
> 
> I've considered upgrading my 5spd too. I'm ok with the gear ratios, but a new diff, clutch, and mount seems easy and practical compared to the 02q swap.
> 
> ...


I just bought the diff up for sale in the classifieds.


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## HollisJoy (Dec 26, 2011)

Your inbox is full. :wave:


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

HollisJoy said:


> Your inbox is full. :wave:


Fixed.


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

A word about the new 034 RSB --it's a great product. Very good match for the factory FSB on a 2.5L.

Also --my steering feels loose at high RPMs. I think the culprit is blown motor mounts, but I'm holding off on replacements until 034 releases some rubber ones.

...and I wrecked my car this week. It's the excuse I needed to do a Golf R front end and buy some vanity plates. All that was damaged was the front bumper and license plate. Luckily it wasn't too bad.


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## gugu1981 (Jul 25, 2011)

Rabbid Rally Rabbit said:


> ...and I wrecked my car this week. It's the excuse I needed to do a Golf R front end and buy some vanity plates. All that was damaged was the front bumper and license plate. Luckily it wasn't too bad.


Not you too....... 


Peter


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## Rabbid Rally Rabbit (May 5, 2013)

gugu1981 said:


> Not you too.......
> 
> 
> Peter


Yeah. I was behind this idiot chick on the phone at a light when I was driving to my teaching gig at Tech. Her lights went off and I waited 2-3 seconds before I slipped into first gear --she was just coasting in gear and wasn't on the gas. Probably be ruled my fault but if I were representing myself, I'd fight it because there wasn't an adequate signal of no forward progress as required by the Tex. Transp. Code.


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