# VEMS or MegaSquirt3 PRO?



## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

trying to get questions answered from both these companies (lugtronics for VEMS) about coil on plug variation possibilities. if anyone has them up & running on their car please let me know about ease of tune ability and support. thanks:beer:


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## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

I think they're both about equal as far as what they can do.. I'm running VEMS. I didn't get it through lugnuts. Just bought my ecu directly from vems. Definetly has tons of capability and the vemstune software is awesome to use. Very user friendly. Ive heard the tunerstudio software is pretty good too. I've been driving a big turbo 1.8t almost daily since the beginning of the year on it. Made some long trips also. It's been reliable. I'd recommend it to anyone


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## 98rzvr6 (Nov 12, 2005)

I have VEMS through Lugtronic and it is absolutely amazing. Car runs amazing and the software is very very user friendly. I was absolutely terrified of using standalone because I didnt know how to tune but once I was able to get a base map from Kevin Black, everything else is sooo easy


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

I can field any Ms3-pro related questions. What coils are you trying to run?

The Pro unit is definitely the top tier MS product but its essentially a fully built up/modded ms3/3x and anything that can do the pro does out pf the box.


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

need_a_VR6 said:


> I can field any Ms3-pro related questions. What coils are you trying to run?
> 
> The Pro unit is definitely the top tier MS product but its essentially a fully built up/modded ms3/3x and anything that can do the pro does out pf the box.


And unlike the ms3/3x the MS3pro WILL run VAG coils without any mods.


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## sp_golf (Nov 28, 2007)

VEMS all the way


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## Jckl (Aug 29, 2004)

If I do decide for sure on standalone in my daily, I am going MS3/3x. :thumbup:

I am going to go MS for my other project.


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## ALLGORIMSHOW (Jul 1, 2002)

MS is a good system and tuner pro is a decent program but the support is lacking when it come to certain things. I had MS3X on ITB's and no one would touch it or had any ideas to give when I needed it. When I finally sorted out the problems and got it running the ecu failed so I decided to part with it. VEMS is just as good as MS but when you add in the support of Lugtronics it's a win win. :beer:


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

Looking to run coil-on-plug unit (read gm LS coils are the most potent). Vems from what I can research has wasted spark (vr6 or 4coil pack). I know there are guys running it & making 700hp. I also read up on guys running megasquirt 3 (not pro) making about 600hp. I've read up on tuning from books & am looking into tuner courses coming up soon. Just trying to find out some feedback about customer support. Also trying to get some feedback of tune ability. I've seen on YouTube how the map/graphing is similar to the "histogram" from eurodyne maestro, which I'm familiar with already. Is vems tuning soft ware the same/similar?


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

> 07-26-2013 04:28 PM98rzvr6
> I have VEMS through Lugtronic and it is absolutely amazing. Car runs amazing and the software is very very user friendly. I was absolutely terrified of using standalone because I didnt know how to tune but once I was able to get a base map from Kevin Black, everything else is sooo easy


Is this a daily driver? Is it high horse power( 300+ hp)? Before I get flamed for the 300+hp question, keep in mind people....these cars are just recently coming from the factory with over 200+hp.


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

> 07-25-2013 05:55 AMchrgdVR
> VEMS or MegaSquirt3 PRO?
> 
> I think they're both about equal as far as what they can do.. I'm running VEMS. I didn't get it through lugnuts. Just bought my ecu directly from vems. Definetly has tons of capability and the vemstune software is awesome to use. Very user friendly. Ive heard the tunerstudio software is pretty good too. I've been driving a big turbo 1.8t almost daily since the beginning of the year on it. Made some long trips also. It's been reliable. I'd recommend it to anyone


Are you running c-o-p set up or coil pack (Bosch Motorsport)?


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## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

Yes it's 300+, running vag coil on plug but as wasted spark. I haven't had any problems with the coilpacks a but I've been thinkin about switching to either gm2 tower coilpacks or a Bosch 4tower to be more efficient..Essenciallly im firing 2 coilpacks at once right now. i was originally going to do cam crank sync and be fully sequential but now im not gonna bother. waste spark is too easy and works great. 
And yes I daily this car as long as the weather is good otherwise I have a pickup truck that I drive


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

Thanks for the info. Wouldn't mind checking it out in person with the software. I'm gonna download the vemstune software & see if I can familiarize myself with it. It's setup is way different from the maestro setup I got on my daily.:beer:


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## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

You in ct? I'm up in hartford. More than welcome to come by the shop on a weekend and check it out


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

Yeah I'm in Bridgeport. I'll def pm ya for this weekend. I'll bring my maestro to compare with.:beer:


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## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

Yeah definetly man that would be cool cause I've been wanting to check maestro out for awhile now too


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## lugnuts (Jul 26, 2001)

Bx V-dubber said:


> Looking to run coil-on-plug unit (read gm LS coils are the most potent). Vems from what I can research has wasted spark (vr6 or 4coil pack). I know there are guys running it & making 700hp. I also read up on guys running megasquirt 3 (not pro) making about 600hp. I've read up on tuning from books & am looking into tuner courses coming up soon. Just trying to find out some feedback about customer support. Also trying to get some feedback of tune ability. I've seen on YouTube how the map/graphing is similar to the "histogram" from eurodyne maestro, which I'm familiar with already. Is vems tuning soft ware the same/similar?


The data logging and graphing of VEMS (or any real standalone) is light years ahead of the Maestro.

I don't know what i would do if I had to use Maestro on our race cars, probably quit, lol.

VEMS will run any of the VW COP coilpacks fine. When I say "fine", it means daily drivers and/or over 150 whp/cylinder on 4,5,6 cylinder engines.


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

I can't complain about maestro due to the fact that I didn't have to go stand alone on a daily & retained emmissions system that can be checked during state inspections. My project doesn't require inspection due to obd1 compliance (with exception of nox/afr's from tailpipe probably).

I know alot of guys are racing/drag with vems, spoke to a few that said the cars were daily but "their definition" of daily was an occasional drive on the road & lots of racing or 1/4 mile.

If vems can run VW coils, I'd like to see if with some type of modification (if any) will it take gm coils.


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## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

That's not my definition, I actually daily my car to and from work everyday unless its really crappy weather. Granted its only a 15-20min ride at my new job but I use to drive 45min each way for awhile. Just drove the car down to Waterfest and back without a glitch the other weekend too. 
don't have to take my car to emmisions though cause the cars over 25yrs old


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

VEMS can run GM coils. The real question is why? must be fun making custom spark plug wires and jamming wires into back of coil. The VW and Bosch motorsports coils do an amazing job. In terms of daily driven, plenty of cars are daily driven. I wired a Ghia on Lugtronic with Bosch Motorsports 2x2 coil. The guy drives it as long as its not raining. As long as emissions is not an issue i dont see any reason not to go standalone. For those who need to pass, a PnP Lugtronic or maestro, depending on application.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

I daily drove my Mk3 on Ms1, Ms2 and Ms3. Saw everything but snow. Its a non issue with good tuning.


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

Not accusing you chrgdvr, just a few people I've met at wf, meets & @ h20i.

As far as why gm coils, the power rating/handling capabilities, longetivity vs VW coils (even though I haven't had issues with the newer fsi coils with ie adapters). The wiring issue I'd have to look into though. Bonesaw, the karmin ghia.......customer doesn't drive in rain by choice or is it something particular to the way things were set up in his build?


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

Need_a_vr6, did you have to go through a "sniffer test" over by you? With ms, how was your experience with their customer support?


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

Doesn't drive in rain cause it is a beautifully painted plenty of other daily driven cars I've wired. I'd seriously consider VW coil on plug or a Motorsports coil. I've used AEB coils, 4 wire coils, Motorsports coils, stock coil. I believe the LS coils have connectors but you got to figure out where to mount them. I'm thinking the GM coils that people run on vr6. There is no connector so you basically just jam wires in the back. And custom wires just seems so stupid. Why not use no plug wires or coil that lets you use stock quality wires.


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

MS is a enthusiast based community. If you want support more than that you deal with someone like Paul who will take care of you. If you go with Lugtronic you are supported by Kevin Black and his dealers. It is his full time gig. The Ecu includes a basemap and tuning via log exchanges.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

Bx V-dubber said:


> Need_a_vr6, did you have to go through a "sniffer test" over by you? With ms, how was your experience with their customer support?


Yes, passed MD sniffer test when I was 12v. Still had a cat on it but no egr/smog pump, etc. 

I am a distributor, so I am my own customer support  depending on the dealer you get different levels of support. I specialize in VAG platform installs but do a lot of other things as well but mostly MS based as I have been working with these systems near the beginning. Shoot me an email if you want anymore details. 

That all said, I have nothing but positive things to say about Kevin and Lugtronic.


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

Thanks for the input guys. I'm gonna email ya some questions I have left about ms need_a_vr6. Gonna hopefully check out vems this weekend to see it in action. I'd like to see ms in action besides you tube though. Thanks to everyone for their inputs. :beer:


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## Bx V-dubber (Dec 17, 2010)

Oh yeah, bonesaw the coils are going on a abf 16v head. I'm assuming the majority of VW COP fit in there. I know for sure gm's do, at least that's what I've seen from Europe.


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

Bosch Motorsports 2x2 coil with stock plug wires or 2.5/2.0 4 wire coils depending on intake manifold


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## 1broknrado (Jul 6, 2005)

*FV-QR*

Sounds like everyone in this thread should vote yes to the link in my sig. Lets get a better Standalone Engine Management forums


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

There already is the carb/itb/sem forum


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## vr-vagman (May 15, 2010)

I like both units. They have good support forums either. A fully equipped vems is cheaper than MSPRO here in EU. MSPro grabs me mostly with its 3D individual cyl fuel and spark control, with the injection timing possibility and the avaiable traction control strategies. The MSPro manual is much much better represented for the end user now than Vems's one on their site.


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## b524vturbo (Dec 27, 2013)

what about the fueltech ft400 been whatching a lot of fast cars running with it a lot of nice features


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## cant get a password (Sep 24, 2004)

I pass sniff test no problems on ms1+extra 

Sent from my LG-P769 using Tapatalk


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