# Why does this forum exist?



## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

It's useless, lol. 

The only threads of interest may have been about custom chiptuning...and they were black holed.


----------



## Svedka (Jul 4, 2008)

B4S said:


> It's useless, lol.
> 
> The only threads of interest may have been about custom chiptuning...and they were black holed.


 Purely because it is a asset and full of information:facepalm:


----------



## Christiene (Nov 9, 2010)

this forum got plentty of info , but that is not for the people who dont und it .


----------



## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

No, this forum is useless.


----------



## Jefnes3 (Aug 17, 2001)

Dunno...

I think you expected that the vortex is a place for free exchange of ideas and information, you are sadly mistaken my friend.

-Jeffrey Atwood


----------



## YUENGLINGMIKE! (Sep 9, 2006)

Jefnes3 said:


> Dunno...
> 
> I think you expected that the vortex is a place for free exchange of ideas and information, you are sadly mistaken my friend.
> 
> -Jeffrey Atwood


 ding ding ding!!! :thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## Jefnes3 (Aug 17, 2001)

I was a 'believer' once too. 


-Jeffrey Atwood


----------



## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

Vortex Censorship 

Because their sponsors tune cars, we are not allowed to show you how to do so for free. 

Shame.


----------



## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

There's lots of places to find the info for free...so that's not really the issue. The issue is that this forum was campaigned for, and started...and is completely useless. What good is a technical forum where you can't talk about the forum subject?


----------



## Racer16 (Aug 22, 2002)

I will agree with B4S.I am not surprised that there arent any threads in here as Many tuners are on here to make money.Its a Business for them after all so I'm not surprised no one wants to share any information on the subject.I guess mostly because Bosch Motronic systems aren't a easy thing to learn to write code for and understand.So a lot of tuners have time and money invested in their research and why would anyone want to give that away for free???No one Not in America.Only thing free in America is a drop kick to the face thats about it. Anyways let me get to the point.If anyone Is interested in Motornic systems better luck in another forum.Thats your best bet.Personally Im looking into 1.8t and 2.7t bosch me7.1 and me7.5 good forum for that is Nefmoto.com check it out theres alot of good info on there.Regarding 1.8T and 2.7T also some Naturally aspirated engines as well.


----------



## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

I use Nefmoto.com, and ecuconnections.com for good motronic info. Both forums are open and built around sharing information . 

The problem with Motronic tuning isn't that the pros won't share information, it's understandable that they make a living off of it, so don't really want to spread the info around. It's the clamping down of anyone else who tries to get an open discussion going, which is done by the Vortex staff. Another issue is that the VW community doesn't seem to have any interest in learning this stuff, since a generic over-the-counter chip seems to "cure all ills". Someone in a MkIV will gladly rip out their VERY adaptable management to run MS, rather than learn how to tune their ECU, since MS is cheaper than a chip. 

ME7x is VERY complex, but it's clearly not impossible to learn. A committed group of enthusiasts can easily tear it apart and sort out what needs to be done to tune most setups...but the commitment just isn't there.


----------



## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

B4S said:


> I use Nefmoto.com, and ecuconnections.com for good motronic info. Both forums are open and built around sharing information .
> 
> The problem with Motronic tuning isn't that the pros won't share information, it's understandable that they make a living off of it, so don't really want to spread the info around. It's the clamping down of anyone else who tries to get an open discussion going, which is done by the Vortex staff. Another issue is that the VW community doesn't seem to have any interest in learning this stuff, since a generic over-the-counter chip seems to "cure all ills". Someone in a MkIV will gladly rip out their VERY adaptable management to run MS, rather than learn how to tune their ECU, since MS is cheaper than a chip.
> 
> ME7x is VERY complex, but it's clearly not impossible to learn. A committed group of enthusiasts can easily tear it apart and sort out what needs to be done to tune most setups...but the commitment just isn't there.


 
Ha, we can start filling this forum with ME7 tuning information, lets watch it get black holed.


----------



## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

It would definitely be fun for a while :laugh:.


----------



## ssgacc (Jul 29, 2005)

I've noticed this too. I understand the business angle, but honestly, how much "business" do they really feel they're losing? Anyone who's really committed to learning it probably will. I think most don't really care/have time to bother and just buy a tune. It's kind of sad when you need to go and ask foreigners even the most basic questions.

I'm actually more surprised when I get an answer here than not. The Bosch ME 7.X is mostly a closed topic. NOT bitchy, just sorry.

Another thought. If they really have so much time and expertise in their tunes and it's so much time and developement, do they really think their business will be taken by someone fooling around at their house? What kind of sense does that make? I always here about the countless hours needed to devise a good tune map.


----------



## ALLGORIMSHOW (Jul 1, 2002)

ssgacc said:


> I've noticed this too. I understand the business angle, but honestly, how much "business" do they really feel they're losing? Anyone who's really committed to learning it probably will. I think most don't really care/have time to bother and just buy a tune. It's kind of sad when you need to go and ask foreigners even the most basic questions.
> 
> I'm actually more surprised when I get an answer here than not. The Bosch ME 7.X is mostly a closed topic. NOT bitchy, just sorry.
> 
> Another thought. If they really have so much time and expertise in their tunes and it's so much time and developement, do they really think their business will be taken by someone fooling around at their house? What kind of sense does that make? I always here about the countless hours needed to devise a good tune map.


The vortex is just to commercial now, once the greedy ****s spot a money grab opportunity it's over. :sly:


----------



## JTuckerMK3 (Oct 30, 2009)

lame that there isnt much tuning info on here.:banghead:
i'm in the planning stage of a project and want to figure out what i'm gonna do for tuning.

my donor car is a 97 GTI VR6. can anyone at least tell me what ECU i'm working with?
what programs are normally used to tune it?
any information i can get would be awesome.


----------



## Jefnes3 (Aug 17, 2001)

'97 12v V6 runs the Motronic M5.9
128KB file size on plcc44 chip


-Jeffrey Atwood


----------



## JTuckerMK3 (Oct 30, 2009)

Jefnes3 said:


> '97 12v V6 runs the Motronic M5.9
> 128KB file size on plcc44 chip
> 
> 
> -Jeffrey Atwood


awesome! thanks.

what software is used to tune it?

i have no experience with Motronic. i've only tuned with AEM, ecuflash, etc.


----------



## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

There is no software to tune it, not as far as the Vortex crowd is concerned.

WinOLS can be used, and Tunerpro is an option, but it's unfortunately not as easy as the jap car stuff .

Check out www.ecuconnections.com. The info is biased towards european ecus (overseas cars), but there are many of us that work with North American euro cars. OBD1 ABA and VR stuff is currently very DIY tuneable, but OBD2 isn't as easy yet.


----------



## YUENGLINGMIKE! (Sep 9, 2006)

I have a vr 42# chip sans encryption board. when I get a chance to dump it and upload the file, I will. :beer:


----------



## B4S (Apr 16, 2003)

Ooh, nice. OBD1 or 2?


----------



## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

YUENGLINGMIKE! said:


> I have a vr 42# chip sans encryption board. when I get a chance to dump it and upload the file, I will. :beer:


Bring it on over sometime Mike ; )


----------

