# tons of white smoke after catless downpipe install???



## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

I got my 2006 FSI setup flashed with APR stage 2 yesterday and drove it home on stock mode because I didn't yet have a downpipe. My catless downpipe was waiting at home so I then installed it and also changed the oil. I took it for a 4 mile test drive while it was dark out and the car felt great. Then today once it was light out I went around town for probably 10-15 more miles and the car has been blowing white smoke the whole time. *UPDATE: diagnosed that the smoke appears after I let off the gas and the throttlebody closes, at times like coming to a stop.*

I check the plugs and they are fine.
I checked for oil and coolant consumption and they are fine. *UPDATE: it is burning oil*
I pulled the pipe that connects the PCV valve to the intake manifold and that was fine (wasn't clogged or dirty) *UPDATE: replaced with new PCV which didn't help*
The car drives absolutely perfect.

Do I just need to wait a while longer for the new downpipe to burn off coating? or anything else to check?


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

does the smoke evaporate rapidly? does it have a smell to it?


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## LEWXCORE (Jul 7, 2007)

theblue said:


> I got my 2006 FSI setup flashed with APR stage 2 yesterday and drove it home on stock mode because I didn't yet have a downpipe. My catless downpipe was waiting at home so I then installed it and also changed the oil. I took it for a 4 mile test drive while it was dark out and the car felt great. Then today once it was light out I went around town for probably 10-15 more miles and the car has been blowing white smoke the whole time.
> 
> I check the plugs and they are fine.
> I checked for oil and coolant consumption and they are fine.
> ...


does it smell like burnt oil? did you replace the downpipe gasket?


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

I'm not sure how to define "evaporates rapidly". If I stop at a light a couple seconds later it catches the car and passes by. I don't really see much behind me when driving at speed so I guess that might mean yes

I looked at the gasket when I removed the stock pipe and it looked better than the one that came with my ebay downpipe so I reused it. The only place that smoke escapes from is the exhaust (it's not leaking under the hood).

While the smoke looks very white, when I wipe off the back of my car with a rag, the rag turns black. (unburnt fuel?). The smell is lot like a 2 stroke motor, oily if anything. There is no sweetness to the smell at all so I don't think it's coolant.

I also should note that while my car has 85k on it, the entire long block was replaced by audi for the previous owner about 1500 miles ago. They reused the turbo and other bolt ons. This oil change was the first on the new motor.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

Update: half way on a 300 mile trip. The car appears to only really blow smoke on deceleration. 

Hmmmm


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## mrbikle (Jul 2, 2005)

smell the smoke at idle.... if it smells sweet then its coolant.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

As I said above, it's oily and not at all sweet


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## mrbikle (Jul 2, 2005)

possibly coating of the downpipe burning off? unno. if you arent getting coolant or oil consumption....wellll


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

Update: I am burning oil. After maybe 350 miles I lost about 1/5 of a quart of oil.

Now the question is what is broken.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

update... I decided to grab a newer revision "p" PCV valve to replace the "e" one that was on the car after inspecting the pipe and finding a bit of oil in the pipe. 

This made no difference (goodbye $80). 

I still haven't inspected the rear PCV vavle to see what version it is. 

I keep coming back to thinking this must be emissions/PCV related since the oil smoke is only when off throttle and coming to a stop. 

I also want to do a compression test then maybe seafoam?


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## [email protected] (Jan 6, 2006)

Under decel only? Turbo seals are done. Check where your down pipe connects to the turbo. I bet it's wet with oil. Sorry to hear.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

Explain you thinking on this. My thought would be that I would get smoke under boost if the seals went. Also some perfromance loss or bad noise.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

I removed the rear check valve that runs between the valve cover and the intake path (right before the turbo). 

It had some clean unburnt oil on the intake side and a little of the milkshake stuff on the valvecover side. The valve worked perfectly when I tested it so I reinstalled. 

P.S. it's a real pain to get this pipe removed and reinstalled. 

So with that I think I've officially ruled out the PVC system. 

Maybe I'll compression test next?


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

I just read this thread about Mobil 5w30 and just my luck that's what I'm using. 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5143198-2.0t-engine-oil 

maybe I should seafoam and switch to a better and thicker oil? I'm not sure that I think oil alone could cause this.... but maybe?


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

update... took the car into a shop that's done a lot of work with audis and they dug into the motor and think the valve cover is to blame since all the other PCV stuff is good. If I remember correctly the tech said there are passages and maybe more check stuff in the molded cover. 

There is definitely oil going down the back check valve and into the turbo. 

part is ordered so now we'll see if that does it.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

update... got the car back with the new valve cover and it still shows all of the same problems. They mechanic claims that it will take a bit for any oil to burn out of the system... I'm not sold but I'll give it a week and watch oil consumption to see if it's burning still. The mechanic says if the problem persists then the turbo is next to replace...

this sucks.... and a big thanks to APR for telling me they're too busy to talk when I called for support (how about you send us an email). Then I waste my time writing an email to which they didn't read and then just ignored me. A+ support guys :banghead:


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

I've been researching this all evening and I have some new thoughts.

The theory is that that back port which should open under boost is getting stuck. I tested this pipe by blowing through it both ways and finding it only allowed air in one direction but this test alone might not show full functionality. If blocked under boost, the blow-by gases (containing oil, etc.) circulating through the PCV got backed up (because of the lack of circulation on the outlet port) causing the blow-by to be pushed out through your exhaust system. Then when I let off the gas and come to a stop the remaining gases in the pressurized valve cover can now exit through the intake side freely resulting in a giant puff of oily smoke.

this explains the oil consumption, smoke, yet still perfect performance. I just hope I'm right. Compression test upcoming.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

compression is coming back good... 190ish across the board.

wtf is making my car burn oil and smoke. two remaining theories are the oil type: mobil 5w30 (maybe I should switch to TDT 5w40), and the rear PCV.


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## vwisthebest (Sep 17, 2003)

use a proper european 5w40 replace that rear port pipe


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## VW1990CORRADO (Sep 30, 2000)

any resolution? turbo?


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

no resolution yet.. still trying to figure out what is broken before I throw away more money on parts that are working fine.


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## VW1990CORRADO (Sep 30, 2000)

is the smoking consistant?


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## [email protected] (Jan 6, 2006)

Did you check the turbine side of your turbo? Remove the downpipe and inspect. When the exhaust side oil seal fails you'll see blue smoke at idle/light decel. You may feel excessive shaft play too. Also you'll have oil right at the beginning of the downpipe and turbo.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

[email protected] said:


> Did you check the turbine side of your turbo? Remove the downpipe and inspect. When the exhaust side oil seal fails you'll see blue smoke at idle/light decel. You may feel excessive shaft play too. Also you'll have oil right at the beginning of the downpipe and turbo.


 that does sound exactly like the problem that I'm having... I might remove the downpipe and test later. 

thanks!


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## [email protected] (Jan 6, 2006)

Sent IM. Good luck! :beer:


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

there is unburnt oil on both sides of the turbo... 

so I ordered another turbo thanks to a seller on here with a good deal. 

anybody know what I should expect to pay for a turbo swap? (guessing 2-3 hours labor?)


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## VW1990CORRADO (Sep 30, 2000)

if i had to guess, 5-8


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## gli_boi (Jun 2, 2009)

if i recall correctly it calls for about 5.8 hours to replace the turbo


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

I read the instructions from another thread. Does not look like that many hours unless I'm missing something?


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## Krieger (May 5, 2009)

they charge you to make as much money as possible... if it takes them 3-4 hours to actually do it, dont you think they will want to charge you for that extra long coffee break they need to ponder what to do next? lol


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## pezillion (Aug 16, 2006)

*white smoke*

I had this happen a few times last winter, only when really cold , around zero, I looked like a crop duster, it went away after 5 miles. I installed a catch can and removed the crappy pcv valve with the bsh plate, havent had it since, I believe it was a PCV problem. 

Revo Stage II, catless 3" downpipe, evoms intake.


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## pezillion (Aug 16, 2006)

*white smoke*

doesn't the ECU give more gas to heat up the cat when its cold?


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## gli_boi (Jun 2, 2009)

Krieger said:


> they charge you to make as much money as possible... if it takes them 3-4 hours to actually do it, dont you think they will want to charge you for that extra long coffee break they need to ponder what to do next? lol


i was just quoting what it calls for as time.. i dont work at a dealer, but work at a performance shop.. when i took my k04 of to put my k03 back on it took me roughly about 4 hours by myself.. but that was doing it for the second time in my life..


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## VW1990CORRADO (Sep 30, 2000)

theblue said:


> I read the instructions from another thread. Does not look like that many hours unless I'm missing something?


i suggest doing it yourself then.


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

it looks like the problem is resolved!!!

turbo replacement appear to fix it.

my diagnosis is oil seal in the turbo leaking oil to the exhaust side.


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## NYCameron (Nov 17, 2010)

I have the same exact problem (but without the apr stage 2 flash)

I really hope that the PCV valve can fix my problem, because I don't want to have to drop the money on a used K03 right now when I kinda/sorta want to go K04 in the future

all the time spent replacing it doesn't seem worth it to replace with the same part


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## theblue (Aug 16, 2001)

You can pull the downpipe off and look for oil / oil stains. Or you can throw money at at pcv and hope for good luck


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## NYCameron (Nov 17, 2010)

theblue said:


> You can pull the downpipe off and look for oil / oil stains. Or you can throw money at at pcv and hope for good luck


well when the guy installed my DP, he asked if I had oil consumption issues because he said he saw a lot of oil there

and my brother has an 06 gli (i drive an 06 2.0t a3), and he replaced his pcv with the bsh blockoff plate (I think that is what the name was). So I will use his to see if there is any issues

also, do you happen to have a link to the thread of how to swap the turbo?


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## arismkv (Jun 17, 2008)

Bringing this back from dead. I'm having the same exact issue, and lately my turbo has been over boosting by more than it should. 

So far I believe it can be a crack on the valve cover that is causing the smoking, or an exhaust leak. 
If it's the turbo, idk if I would want to put a ko4 on my daily or not 

I'm revo stage 2.


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