# CBR 900 Carb Questions



## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*CBR 900 ITB Questions...*

Hey, I have a 84 GLI. Ive decided to go the N/A route. Unfortunitly i only know a bit here and there about it all. Anyways, i have ITB's from a CBR 900. I was going to go with R1 ITB's, but heard 40mm's is on the bigger side, although they would work. Now, ive read that the R1's need bigger jets because of their size? (correct me if im wrong). The CBR ITBs are 38mm, Compared to the 40mm R1. My question is, would anyone know if the CBR 900 would need bigger jets also? Or would they be fine? As far as fuel pump, what should i go with, or is stock fine? along with what fuel regulator would you guys suggest? With the inlet manifold, how long should the "runners" be between the head and ITBs.
Again, im new to ITB's and carbs and want to get a more detailed idea of what ive got to do.
Ive read threw some of the posts about it all, but it would help out me, and others, if we could get down what exactly is needed.
Thanks, I appreciate anyhelp you guys might have. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 








What i am dealing with.
For those in the same boat as me, this has lots of information on bike ITB's. http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...age=1


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## freeze plug (Oct 26, 2006)

*Re: CBR 900 ITB Questions... (mk2fu)*

carbs use jets, itbs use standard injectors.


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: CBR 900 ITB Questions... (freeze plug)*


_Quote, originally posted by *freeze plug* »_carbs use jets, itbs use standard injectors.

i suppose thease are carbs then. thanks for the reply, would the jets need to be drilled out/get a jet kit?


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## frechem (Oct 19, 2002)

*Re: CBR 900 ITB Questions... (mk2fu)*

Yes those are carbs and they are on the small side for you. They are meant for a 900cc motor where yours has twice the displacement. You will have to raise the main, needle, and pilot jets quite a bit to even try and get those things to work for you.


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: CBR 900 ITB Questions... (frechem)*

"Quote, originally posted by beau_layman » 
I think it might be tough finding a set of carbs big enough. 
38 and 40's seem to be quite common actually. That should more than enough for 8v 1.8. Dual 40 dells or webs actually tends to be a bit much for a DD."

from another thread.








Ill try them and see what happens.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4XND5veuZo
heres a derby running on the carbs, but not a 1.8 i dont think.

Anyone know if you have to redrill the jets? or just more fuel pressure?


_Modified by mk2fu at 2:10 AM 11-15-2008_


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

I'm looking to do this as well. I have a 16v my buddy will give me but it would need a computer or carbs to operate in my mk1. My 8v is beat.


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_I'm looking to do this as well. I have a 16v my buddy will give me but it would need a computer or carbs to operate in my mk1. My 8v is beat.









I have some more information i got from a guy on youtube about his CBR carbs, ill post em up later, jusst heading out


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (mk2fu)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mk2fu* »_
I have some more information i got from a guy on youtube about his CBR carbs, ill post em up later, jusst heading out

Well??








I just purchased a set of CBR 900RR carbs and looked a little more at the 16v that's going in http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
What dizzy are you guys running with carbs? Vacuum advance off a SAAB 900 from the mid-early 80's sounds like a nice one. Can anyone confirm what is a good one to get?
Keep in mind I'm installing this 16v in my mk1 that is currently on CIS (not going to run CIS anymore obviously)


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## El Jarretto (Jan 18, 2006)

*Re: CBR 900 ITB Questions... (frechem)*


_Quote, originally posted by *frechem* »_Yes those are carbs and they are on the small side for you. They are meant for a 900cc motor where yours has twice the displacement. You will have to raise the main, needle, and pilot jets quite a bit to even try and get those things to work for you.
Yes but engine speed also determines carburetor sizing, and a CBR 900 will far out rev the 1.8


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: CBR 900 ITB Questions... (El Jarretto)*

heres some info i got from a guy off youtube.
"Re:hey carb question 
Parts to replace/adjust:
intake manifold
carbs + main jet 
fuel pump from a motorbike
throttle + choke cable
Here's a topic from a guy who built it in in his Derby with pictures along the way:
http://volksforum.com/forum/sh...y+cbr"
"Re: Re:hey carb question 
It's Dutch








I used a pump from some Yamaha motorcycle...but any pump wil do.
The jets need to be drilled up to around 1,5mm.
My carbs are from a Honda 900 Fireblade."
and his car on CBR 900 carbs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmcjhcUaY7c
helpful guy. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote »_Parts to replace/adjust:
intake manifold
carbs + main jet
fuel pump from a motorbike
throttle + choke cable

good list!
what is the optimum jetting? I can have a machine shop drill it out (free @ work) or just buy a stage 3 jet kit...
ANY bike fuel pump?? I'd hate to lose top end power because i'm running lean. that also sounds like it could lead to a potentially detonated motor as well








last thing: is there anywhere to buy custom length throttle and choke cables? custom bike shops have to know resources for that...



_Modified by OrangeDUB at 7:50 PM 11-29-2008_


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

That guy says 1.8mm drilled, another guy just sent me a msg on youtube and has his 205 running with 1.7 drilled.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (mk2fu)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mk2fu* »_That guy says 1.8mm drilled, another guy just sent me a msg on youtube and has his 205 running with 1.7 drilled.

I'm finding these jet kits for $50-150... is it worth it to buy that or is properly drilling out the needle just as good?? (I'd use the machine shop at work and do it right)


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

*FV-QR*

buy a low pressure fuel pressure reg from summit or jegs. 5-7 psi.
and a low pressure carter fuel pump, used in marine apps.
its all on ebay.. so you can check it out easier.
i have 40mm carbs too, but im no where near ready to mess with jets. put them on the car, run it and then see where your at, imo.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Yep I found the fuel pump I want it's a Carter rotary.
Are fuel pressure regulators universal and is that one adjustable? I though you only needed 3-4 psi?
My buddy who's a mechanic has also done carbs on a 16v in his caddy (dual weber 45's I think) so I'm going to be getting some help from him along the way too. Unless you know carbs really well they can seem a bit tricky, but a challenge is always fun, right?


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## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yeah it might be 3-5 psi... its been awhile and my fpr is in my tool box.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

I got myself a 1.74 mm drill bit http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Carbs should be here late in the week!


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_I got myself a 1.74 mm drill bit http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Carbs should be here late in the week!

Awesome stuff, I wish i could do mine at the same time. Post some pictures up when you drill them out! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

UPS showed up today








disassembly/jetting/cleaning soon to come


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

So a friend has a dizzy off his 84 saab 900 turbo- will it work with a 16v?


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## SARGES1.8S (Sep 29, 2006)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

oh yeah thats the goods! bring em by soz I can check em out!


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## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*Re: CBR 900 ITB Questions... (mk2fu)*

any progress?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Unfortunately I'm most likely not running carbs. As much as I want to I think it would be very unreliable with how hot and cold it gets here in IA.. I have the bit ready to ship to MK2FU, just need to get postage paid for and then sent.
I might sell my carb setup but then again I really like the 900RR bikes and may actually buy one install these lol


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

Alright well I've not really given up, but what happened to my rabbit puts me in a situation where I need to rebuild or replace the motor.
I think I spun a crank bearing due to a possible headgasket leak.







So.. I know way too many people that have all generations of cheap vw parts and that makes my decision way too hard








Not sure if I want to carb it still, but I have to build a intake mani, buy a carter rotary fuel pump and my buddy has that vac advance ign dist. for me I just have to get it. So another $100 in parts and I'm set (theoretically, probs not though







)
Should I let the cold weather scare me this much? My carbed 92 ninja starts poorly in the cold...


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## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

im still building mine 
im not to worried about the weather becuase its not my daily driver thats getting the carbs


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (fastrabbitvw)*

im working on a 1.8 16v for in my mk1 as well and using the same carbs, im putting a block heater in to help it out in the winter, for $25 at germanautoparts.com it seemed worthwhile. Stick with the project and keep posting haha


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## slayer00 (Oct 31, 2006)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

Instead of useing a ****ty saab dizzy why not get one of these? 
http://www.autosportlabs.com/m....html
They are great, ive got one setup in my 8v


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## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*Re: (slayer00)*


_Quote, originally posted by *slayer00* »_Instead of useing a ****ty saab dizzy why not get one of these? 
http://www.autosportlabs.com/m....html
They are great, ive got one setup in my 8v

my cbr carbs came with tps already on them so this might be good idea for spark


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Megajolt looks pretty nice. How straight-forward was the install in a 8v though? Did you just tap onto the crank sensor?


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## slayer00 (Oct 31, 2006)

Mine is an 84 gti so has no trigger wheels, I just used a 36-1 wheel and welded on a power steering pump pulley I had machined down, Its really easy to assemble and install


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: (slayer00)*

Hey, Little update/off topic, I got the drilbit from Orange Dub, Im going to drill them tomorrow, The screws basicly stripped out on my carbs and couldnt get to my main jet, But i got them out so its good to go, tomorrow ill drill.
Who was the one im sending too?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: (mk2fu)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mk2fu* »_Hey, Little update/off topic, I got the drilbit from Orange Dub, Im going to drill them tomorrow, The screws basicly stripped out on my carbs and couldnt get to my main jet, But i got them out so its good to go, tomorrow ill drill.
Who was the one im sending too?









Those screws are pretty cheap huh! I thought mine were. Fastrabbitvw needs them next. Just hold onto them until whenever he gets his address to you or I. No rush


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

are you just drilling out the main jets? what size are you going with?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_are you just drilling out the main jets? what size are you going with?

Yes; 1.75mm.


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

do you just use a drill bit or does it need to be a reamer?


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## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*Re: (mk2fu)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mk2fu* »_Hey, Little update/off topic, I got the drilbit from Orange Dub, Im going to drill them tomorrow, The screws basicly stripped out on my carbs and couldnt get to my main jet, But i got them out so its good to go, tomorrow ill drill.
Who was the one im sending too?









if i could get it after your done that would be great








what are you guys using for you inqtake manifold
i was gonna cut my lower intake mani and use silicone housing to connet the carbs to it


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (fastrabbitvw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *fastrabbitvw* »_
what are you guys using for you inqtake manifold
i was gonna cut my lower intake mani and use silicone housing to connet the carbs to it

im building one in a machining class im taking this semester, ill post up picks as i get em.


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (mudanddust)*

im thinking about writing a cnc program for a 16v flange, would anyone be interested in one?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_im thinking about writing a cnc program for a 16v flange, would anyone be interested in one?

I would be interested!


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

would you want aluminum or steel? Im still not sure what i want to make my manifold out of


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

make me a custome 2l manifold?








ive heard of someone using aluminum baseball batts cut up as the runners. kinda cool.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Steel please. I'd possibly take 2


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

i am going to get a smaller radiator, possibly a civic rad, and offset it so i wont have anything infront of the carbs aside from the grill. Moving the rad will allow room for a longish runner manifold, what do you guys think? im still not sure if i want to use aluminum or steel for the mani, but i was thinking 3/8" for steel and 1/2" for AL


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

I just scored a set of cbr carbs off ebay (whoever outbid me at the last second at 69.00$, f you)
i also have a honda radiator, so i will be runnung that instead of the VW radiator. 
Ill make a thread when i start working on the project http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

thats what i want to put in my rabbit, what radiator do you have, civic? is it after market or oe?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

oe honda civic i think. its got nice fittings at the bottom too for oil cooling i believe or ps cooling, guess its up to the user.
i typed in honda civic radiator in google and this came up, its the small one in the front










_Modified by yeayeayea at 7:00 PM 1-25-2009_


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

looks like an oem type of deal to me, what are you going to do about the fan switch?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

i think they have adapters that allow you to run em in the hose, but i may be wrong


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

ok so in this picture, what is the box connected to the tube at the bottom of the picture connected to? the air box?
what does the short cable with the twist knob at the end do? it appears to adjust the butterflies ever so slightly, is this the choke cable? 
how are the slides activated? do people running these carbs keep the flatslides and the butterflies?










_Modified by yeayeayea at 6:50 PM 1-29-2009_


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_ok so in this picture, what is the box connected to the tube at the bottom of the picture connected to? the air box?
what does the short cable with the twist knob at the end do? it appears to adjust the butterflies ever so slightly, is this the choke cable? 
how are the slides activated? do people running these carbs keep the flatslides and the butterflies?









_Modified by yeayeayea at 6:50 PM 1-29-2009_

im not sure what the box is all about, maybe some type of fuel over flow reservoir?
but the cable with the knob on the end is used to adjust idle. 
and the slides are activated by vacuum, which is one of the great things about CV (constant velocity) carbs. so yeah keep the flats and the butterflies. check this out http://www.drpiston.com/Cvcarbs.html


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

well i know if i blow on that tube with the box on it, the flatslides open up. if you pop off the black caps there is a rubber diaphram that when vacuum is applied to it it opens the flatsides. the tube with the box is hooked to the opposite side of the diaphram i suppose. also, i suppose that in the picture above, the carbs are actually upside down, and that the black caps should be facing upwards correct?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Alriiight.... yeah I think you guys are fairly correct with your assumptions about carbs from the pic I posted of mine. Yeah they are upside down, and QUITE dirty which is how I got them right out of the shipping box. They will be cleaned and horns painted to match the valve cover http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Here is a basic diagram (should be the same as the one posted)


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

hot damn thank you very much


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

OK I think I am ready to buy my fuel pump.... someone is making me an intake manifold place








Getting there....


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

when people say they drill out the main jet, theyre talking about the one labeled "main jet" and not the one labeled "main air jet" right? or do they drill out both?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_when people say they drill out the main jet, theyre talking about the one labeled "main jet" and not the one labeled "main air jet" right? or do they drill out both? 

Main jet. Fuel jet. Opening the orifice allows more fuel to enter the emulsion tube. Removing them is easy. Careful as they are usually brass and can strip out easily!
EDIT: see it in the middle, the short fat one.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

sweet picture, good to know what i need to drill. where did you guys get your drill bits?

also, why does everyone seem to run a msd 6a ignition system? does the stock ignition setup not work if you are not using the CIS airbox and injection? do they do it just to clean up the wiring?


_Modified by yeayeayea at 10:34 PM 2-2-2009_


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

I am just going with a 84 saab vac advance ign. distruibuter, should work fine no 6a needed. maybe that setup is a little better...
You remove the jet from the carb and drill it. I read that 1.7-1.8 mm was best so I found a 1.75mm one at work it's being passed around to other people in here.
You could try to find the drillbit online to buy, or wait to get it from the others using it here (mk2fu & fastrabbitvw) or you can buy a stage 3 jet kit and just swap the new jets in no drilling needed.


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

the jets should really be reamed, a regular spiral 2 flute drill bit does not cut a perfectly round hole, and the finish on the inside of the bore is not very nice. A reamer is really what you want to use. What you want to do is use a drill bit to bore it 1/64" undersized and then ream to 1.7mm or 1.8mm. I would just get a sae sized because it will be harder to find a metric size in the US and i really dont think that your 93 octane will notice the difference. This is the size im gona use. http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/...60085


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_the jets should really be reamed, a regular spiral 2 flute drill bit does not cut a perfectly round hole, and the finish on the inside of the bore is not very nice. A reamer is really what you want to use. What you want to do is use a drill bit to bore it 1/64" undersized and then ream to 1.7mm or 1.8mm. I would just get a sae sized because it will be harder to find a metric size in the US and i really dont think that your 93 octane will notice the difference. This is the size im gona use. http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/...60085

Under the microscope at work it looked pretty good inside but I am sure the reamer would have been better.


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_looks like an oem type of deal to me, what are you going to do about the fan switch? 

i was just going to run it straight to the ignition, the call will only be driven in the summer, so the cooler the better?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (mk2fu)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mk2fu* »_
i was just going to run it straight to the ignition, the call will only be driven in the summer, so the cooler the better?

then it will take a long time to warm the engine up (increased wear) and will burn up a cooling fan is short time


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

yeah i dont know about running the fan full time. even in the summer, it normally only runs when idling or on really hot days. I think you can get inline adapters that have a bung for the switch that just go in your lower rad hose. thats what im gona run


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

should it go in the lower or the upper rad hose though? in the stock rad, is the sensor in the coolant before it passes through the rad or after?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

I believe the switch is IN the radiator in my rabbit...midway up on the driver's side.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yea but its in the end opposite the inlet and outlet. so basicially it has made it half the distance between the inlet and the outlet, so its not as hot as the upper pipe, but not as cool as the lower. unless im misunderstanding the flow properties. only reason i worry is that i dont want it to come on all the time if its in the upper, or never come on if its in the lower, since its designed to be between the two.

does this look right?










_Modified by yeayeayea at 11:38 AM 2-3-2009_


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

I want to run almost no wiring. How does this switch work? Anyone care to explain?







Heats up then turns on a fan? I wont be having an ECU to controll anything. Any help would be appreciated. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

what you would need is a temperature sensor that does not change resistance as it changes temperature, but rather opens or closes a set of contacts as it changes temperature. that way it doesnt need any kind of ecu to interpret it, it can simply be wired as the signal wire for the fan relay.
Can anyone take some measurements for me? center to center of the #1 to #2 carb bodies, and the center to center of the #2 to #3 carb bodies.


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (yeayeayea)*

2.8" and 3.44"


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

Cool thanks, updated the pic with the measurements. figured it would be useful for people wanting to plan out manifolds for these without splitting the carbs apart. I think stock runner spacing is 88mm, which would mean the middle two are just about perfect for a 16v, and the #1 and #4 runners would have to be angled in to match the carbs. Ive been thinking, to compensate for the longer, angled runner, would running longer velocity stacks on the inner carbs to make the head to stack length the same across all 4 cylinders. anyone done this? 










_Modified by yeayeayea at 9:29 PM 2-3-2009_


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

has anyone split their carbs up and shimmed them out so they are evenly spaced? I have seen others do it with different carbs, but havent with cbr's


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

i did it with my gsxr itbs, but they were fully splittable and had syncronizing screws in between each butterfly. the cbr carbs look like theyre solid between the #1 and #2 carbs, as well as the #3 and the #4 carb, so the only ones you could shim are the middle 2, which according to your measurements are less than 1mm off from the standard 16v runner spacing.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Well fellas I just ordered my fuel pump. Brand new Carter rotary model #P4070 from Summit Racing... $82 shipped








Not sure if that pump is PERFECT for these carbs but I think it should work nicely. 72 GPH @ 6 psi max.
Nice little kit


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

let us know how it turns out, strongly considering that pump myself. will you be running the stock intank pump as well?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

The pump will go under the car because I want to keep the bay a little tidy. The pump can supposedly be used for push or pull and has been proven to work in the aforementioned location. This is the same pump my friend is running on his 16v caddy on dual weber 45's so it should do the trick.
Also I just got access to a heated garage so serious progress will commence in a couple weeks! I might have to start my own build thread on this so I don't clutter this thread with all the BS I'm doing














http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

what psi does the stock intank pump work at?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

some pics of mine all cleaned up. popped all the caps and the bowls, everything was nice and clean.


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_i did it with my gsxr itbs, but they were fully splittable and had syncronizing screws in between each butterfly. the cbr carbs look like theyre solid between the #1 and #2 carbs, as well as the #3 and the #4 carb, so the only ones you could shim are the middle 2, which according to your measurements are less than 1mm off from the standard 16v runner spacing.

i was bored this weekend so i decided to try to split them, and it is possible, they do have adjustment screws between each of the butterflies. does anyone make spacer for these? or is it totally a custom job?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yeah youre right, i took a look at mine and realized they had the screws, but it doesnt look as easy to spread em as it was on the gsxr tb's. im still just going to make a manifold to match the spacing, instead of making the spacing match the manifold.


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## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

got the bit in the mail today gonan try to have my jets drilled by this weekend
whoever needs it next send me a pm


_Modified by fastrabbitvw at 5:42 PM 2-23-2009_


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (fastrabbitvw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *fastrabbitvw* »_got the bit in the mail today gonan try to have my jets drilled by this weekend
whoever needs it next send me a pm

Whoever wants it next speak up!
I started tearing my 16v apart. Got 90% of the parts. Sounds like there is a shop in town that is more than capable of making custom manifolds out of aluminum.


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_
Whoever wants it next speak up!
I started tearing my 16v apart. Got 90% of the parts. Sounds like there is a shop in town that is more than capable of making custom manifolds out of aluminum.

sounds like your most of the way there http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

I would like the bit next please!


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

what size is the bit you guys are passing around?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

1.75mm basically stage 3 jetting


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

It's my drill bit I don't care who gets it next I just ask that it stays packaged up nice so it won't get broken or lost in shipping to the next dubber


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

is there a way to separate the mixing tube from the jet?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

Probably the only way would be to remove the jet and then it should just come out or you may be able to unscrew it. Run enough carb cleaner through it and it should be clean though either way installed or removed!


----------



## 75injectedSB (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

I am using the same carbs, I will post up pics of my intake and set up once I get home. I went with the stage 3 set up for jetting. I will let you guys know how it runs once I get the head finished. Glad to see that I am not the only one running these http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Keep up the good work fellas!!


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *75injectedSB* »_I am using the same carbs, I will post up pics of my intake and set up once I get home. I went with the stage 3 set up for jetting. I will let you guys know how it runs once I get the head finished. Glad to see that I am not the only one running these http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Keep up the good work fellas!!


Welcome to the group







I'm buying your scirocco exhaust manifold


----------



## 75injectedSB (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_
Welcome to the group







I'm buying your scirocco exhaust manifold









That you are, mine is set up on a crossflow though, not 16v. Decided to get it running this way and then rebuild the 16v I have and go from there. I am running the carter 4070 as well. Pre and post pump filters, Adj FPR. Motor is a RD block, OBD1 ABA head, supertech valves, Ti retainers, Autotech springs, Neuspeed 276* and home built header. Should be fun...


----------



## 89dx (Mar 17, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (75injectedSB)*

any updates guys, im thinking doing this on my bunny.


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

I am in the process of dis-assembling my 16v motor for a "freshining up" rebuild. Nothing carb-related yet!


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

who ever i was sending the drill bit to please pm me i lost your info


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

pm sent


----------



## diddle. (Aug 7, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

Are you 16v guys running 1.8L's with the 1.75mm jets? Im in the process of trying to set up a 2.1L 16v on R1 carbs and need help figuring out my jet sizes. Thanks


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (diddle.)*

which jets are the main ones


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

^^^ The big one that you use a flatblade screwdriver to remove


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

is it the one that also has the hex on it for a wrench, and the mixing tube?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Yes but it is 2 parts and you don't need to remove the whole thing. Using a screwdriver just remove the main jets from the base of the mixing tube (~1/4" in length)
Mine when I removed the jets (sorry for the bad pic)


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

How are you all coming along? I start putting my 16v back together tomorrow night after work (starting on it @ 1 am lol)
Workign on either making an intake manifold plate by hand or having one milled by a fellow dubber up north of me. That's the last piece I need is the manifold http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

im going to have weiRtech cut me one, he is a member here on vortex and cuts flanges if you ship him a gasket.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

guys i wrote a cnc program to cut em if anyone needs them


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

16v intake manifold flanges? im sent


----------



## 89dx (Mar 17, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

need a 16v flanges too


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

any update on these


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

i am still waiting for one of the mills to be open, but i should get some time on one this week. Who all wants one and what do you want al or steel?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

I need a steel one. have been trying to get a few friends to get it done locally (well a few hours away locally) but it isn't happening too easily... 1/4-3/8" thick steel gasket match would make me a happy person


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

i used a gasket to write the program so they will be gasket matched. The stock i have is 3/8" steel


----------



## Killa_ganja (Apr 6, 2007)

Does anyone have pics of this installed on a MK2 8 V 
thinking of setting this up 
also 
the fuel pump that is in the Car right now wont work with a CBR 900 I suppose.
what fuel pump is recomended ? 
are there any key specs that need to be met ??


----------



## 75injectedSB (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: (Killa_ganja)*

Being that these carbs had a fuel pump on the bike, I would assume that the carter 4070 will work just fine. I am running a regulator with mine just to be safe. I will have mine on my rabbit here soon, just need to finish the manifold.


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

have a question here im going to use the auxiliary fuel pump the one thats in the tank that delivers the fuel to the fuel pump etc.. i can use a fuel reg for carbs like the holley one? any one knows how muh psi that pump delivers? thanks


----------



## Dave926 (Mar 30, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

you can use the pump in the tank and bypass the one under the car. I used a holley reg as well 1-4 psi and a summitt fuel pressure gauge as well.
The intank pump will do just fine for running carbs. If you plan on nitrous or something crazy, then consider a carter.
I ran 3/8 steel brake to the front of the car, and it was just fine for my setup.


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Dave926)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Dave926* »_you can use the pump in the tank and bypass the one under the car. I used a holley reg as well 1-4 psi and a summitt fuel pressure gauge as well.
The intank pump will do just fine for running carbs. If you plan on nitrous or something crazy, then consider a carter.
I ran 3/8 steel brake to the front of the car, and it was just fine for my setup.
thanks bro
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

ive just got a bunch of loose ends to tie up and mine will be done 
i still need to find a vacuum source for my knock box 
does it need a constant vacuum or does it need vacuum that changes with the motor rpms


----------



## Killa_ganja (Apr 6, 2007)

Great thread ..
thanks for the help 75injectedSB


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

where is the vacuum line for the knock box normally located? is it after the check valve in the brake booster, or to the vacuum resevoir? if so, that would probably suggest it needs constant vacuum. if its just hooked inline with a standard vacuum line that changes with throttle position, id say it is probably important to rehook it as such.


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_where is the vacuum line for the knock box normally located? is it after the check valve in the brake booster, or to the vacuum resevoir? if so, that would probably suggest it needs constant vacuum. if its just hooked inline with a standard vacuum line that changes with throttle position, id say it is probably important to rehook it as such.

i didnt think of that but i figure that would work to figure the vacuum out i think it came from the throttle body to a t connector then to the knock box


----------



## VANDENPLAS (Dec 31, 2007)

i just got a set of these carbs off a fellow texer.
do you need to run knock box ignition with these carbs?
also will they work on a 2.0 aba?? 
i love carbs a 4 in sync threw some nice exhaust 
weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Yeah what is everyone doing with the knock boxes? My friend has this box we're going to wire up to my distributor, I'm sure that's it...


----------



## 75injectedSB (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

I looked at my parts rocco last night and the knock box was hooked to manifold vacuum. Not sure if it was correct but that is where the car was running before I tore it apart.


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: (75injectedSB)*

ok so here are mine cleaned up and waiting for a motor lets keep this alive


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

you seem to be missing a piece.









you can see it on the topside of my carbs here,








its held on by the two screws i circled in green and pulls on the lil plungers i circled in orange.

i dont know what it does, or how its activated, but just letting you know


----------



## 75injectedSB (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

That is the choke, say hello to hard cold starts...


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (75injectedSB)*

haha goodbye choke hello ether


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

well his info says puerto rico. do they have cold starts there?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_well his info says puerto rico. do they have cold starts there?


Well it depends on how literal you want to get








Cold start = engine is at dormant temp vs operating temp. Warm weather will help with cold starts I would have to think.


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

i have the choke piece i just didnt put it but either way im going to set this carbs so nice that i will not need a choke


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

getting my pay check on wednesday should beable to get mine done soon


----------



## 75injectedSB (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (fastrabbitvw)*

Sweet deal, keep us posted.


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

How are the manifold plates coming? I'm getting DAMN close to needing mine


----------



## 75injectedSB (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

So what are all you guys doing for the throttle cable deal?


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

manifold flanges should be done tuesday or wednesday


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_manifold flanges should be done tuesday or wednesday

Kick ass! You'll have to PM me how much you want for your troubles.


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_
Kick ass! You'll have to PM me how much you want for your troubles.


me too!


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

me three


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

me four


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

im thinking 60 shipped for steel, ill try to have pics up by tomorrow or wednesday


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

So what are you guys running for alternator setups?
I started this thread to figure out what I need to keep them out of the way of the carbs and also wanted to knwo what's good to get since my 16v motor didn't come with the charging accessories: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4379162


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

im gonna be using the aba serpintine setup


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

well i read your other thread, and since your engine has nothing on it, i would just upgrade to the aba stuff. 
quieter, never needs tensioning, sits lower, and its serpentine so its alot less likely to slip and squeal.

since youre not running AC or PS either, you would only need one belt, a VR6 waterpump pulley for the waterpump, and the aba alternator and bracket/tensioner setup. probably 40 bucks at a junkyard for newer, lower mileage, nicer serpentine stuff than old vbelt crap.

for the water outlet neck on the front of the head, you can either run the readily available ABF neck, which points the hose towards the drivers side (great for if you are running a smaller radiator to leave open space infront of the carbs) or you can find one of the black aba tensioner springs and the stock neck.

as for the crank pulley, the part you need is off of a mk4 tdi. it is already the right offset for serpentine (no milling like with 8v pulleys, no spacers like with 1.8t pulleys) and can be had pretty cheap on ebay.
the part number you need is 038 105 243









and this is what you will end up with


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

where do i mount my power steering pump? do i use the 16v bracket or aba>?


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

aba. 

youll have run a vbelt for the power steering pulley unless you want to get tricky with the belts


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

i wannna somone finished it


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

my project isnt gonna take off until after finals
just not enough time in the weekends im down there to really crack into it.

if you were talking about the serpentine stuff, i had a prototype setup that turned everything off of one belt. just never had the time to make it tough enough for daily use.
























i even went as far as to buy the belt to make it work , but it was a wee bit too short and took a ton of force to get it on and i ended up bending the bracket holding the lower idler on, after that the project went on backburner.

















i straightened the bracket, got a belt a half inch longer, and it worked. someday ill finish it. it would be better if the additional idler had the lips on the sides to prevent the belt riding off, since the belt rides on it for a good bit of its cirfumference. a vr6 tensioner pulley would work but its grooves would have to be ground down so it doesnt cut into the backside of the belt. the one i used was a ford focus zetec timing belt tensioner.



_Modified by yeayeayea at 9:58 AM 5-10-2009_


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *junn* »_i wannna somone finished it










I'm off to a good roll. HOPE HOPE HOPE to have it running within a month. Although at the beginning of April I thought I would have it put together by May


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Hey take me off the list for manifold plates-- I have a guy at work making me one now. He';s hooking me up with a trade for a wireless router.... No hard feelings.
----------------------
Okay now what are you guys doing for filters/screens on the velocity stacks??
I'm going to try to do a screen like this








...or this guy's custom ones
http://bills-b-racing.com/Colors.html

FYI the end of the stack has exactly a 2" diameter, I measured today with a caliper.


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

what kinda throttle cable would be long enough to reach?


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

after i cut them i had to move the upper holes, im just learning the programming, but other than that they turned out nice. ive got three steel ones left, let me know if you want one. $60 shipped


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

what serpentine belt are you running? with the aba setup, just crank, wp, and alt? also how do you tension it with out the aba tensioner?


_Modified by mudanddust at 10:09 AM 5-14-2009_


----------



## e-townvdub (Aug 1, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

i may be picking up one of them manifold flanges http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif when i get paid














this thread is great, i had a set of these carbs when i was doing my motor last year but got cold feet but i feel like carbing my new 16valve/aba im building


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_what serpentine belt are you running? with the aba setup, just crank, wp, and alt? also how do you tension it with out the aba tensioner?

_Modified by mudanddust at 10:09 AM 5-14-2009_

that pic without the tensioner is an ABF setup.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

how did you track that down?


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

why the manifold plates are steel shoudnt they be aluminum for heat transfer or they work well with steel?


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

either one is going to get hot, the aluminum will actually get hotter quicker, but both will get hot. In a itb setup the intake charge is inside the "hott" intake runner for such a minute fraction of a second that there is not enough time to transfer much heat if any from the manifold. Infact you are more likely to warm up the intake charge while in the cylinder head rather than the manifold. 
the reason i made a bunch out of steel is because thats what people wanted. A lot more people can weld steel than can weld aluminum. If you would like an aluminum one, i can make it, however it will cost a little more.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_how did you track that down?



INA sells them on here
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3494634


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

one of these bad boys are mine







yall suckas better hurry up and get one of the remaining few


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

shipping out tomorrow yeayeayea


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

picked up some goodies at the yard on sunday including an alt. heres the bracket im working on
















I also found a couple 740 turbo's and pulled the oil coolers. I told the guy they were trans coolers, he charged me 8$ for each one haha



























_Modified by mudanddust at 8:59 PM 5-27-2009_


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

what are you all doing for tranies?


_Modified by mudanddust at 8:05 PM 5-30-2009_


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

I am running my stock 8v tranny setup. If it breaks (maybe/probs) then I'm doing a 16v pressure plate along with 210mm clutch and flywheel.
Oh and if you guys want screens for your CBR carbs, call Bill and tell him Casey sent you: 586-883-0942
Yellow camo per request!


















_Modified by OrangeDUB at 7:25 PM 5-30-2009_


----------



## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

thats pretty nice http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

how well do those things filter? is there anything other that the two layers of mesh?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_how well do those things filter? is there anything other that the two layers of mesh?

They fit like a glove and Bill told me it's a 3 layer mesh system that filters down to 2 widths of a human hair and he also said they flow air like the screens aren't even there. He makes 1000's of these


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

i might have to get me some of those


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_i might have to get me some of those









Do it- you'll be happy. I couldn't find 2" screens ANYWHERE on the interwebz. I resorted to calling a place that had smaller ones (2.5-2.25") and they didn't have 2" but ended up referring me to Bill who makes the screens for them. Done deal.
I don't know if I said price but *the screens are $35 / pair + $6.95 shipping*


_Modified by OrangeDUB at 12:52 PM 6-2-2009_


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

does anyone sell longer velocity stacks for these carbs?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

How's everyone doing?

_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_does anyone sell longer velocity stacks for these carbs?

I haven't found any. They seem to be proprietary but you could have a shop cut them and weld in extensions in. For looks I am assuming?


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

making progress slowly. I got my serp setup together with a little custom bracketeering. I think it looks good, seems to work well but well see how much i squeels when i finally get it running. ( how much tolerance does a serp belt have as far as alignment?) My motor is ready to go in the car minus clutch and trans (anyone got a close ratio 020 that is good and they are trying to unload?) so hopefully she will be breathing in a month or so!


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

my motor is in i just have to tie up all the loose ends then i should beable to start this piece


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

when you mention tolerance in the serpentine belt setup, do you mean belt tension or left and right pulley placement? 
as for the longer stacks, it would be mostly for looks. thing is these bikes rev alot higher than our engines, so they have short stacks. i can make the short stacks work with longer runners on the manifold, but that will put the carbs pretty close to the rad support. if i got longer stacks i could have shorter runners and still have the proper length for a car engine and get the carbs away from the rad support.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

recently powdercoated my velocity stacks, which i plan on doing the manifold in the same coating.








here is the same coating on a compressor housing to show the sparkle of the candy paint










im doing the centers of my wheels in this same paint, and probably the valve cover.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_when you mention tolerance in the serpentine belt setup, do you mean belt tension or left and right pulley placement?
 i meant left and right pulley placement


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

i know if the left to right is a ltitle off the belt will start to ride up and make noise. 
thats something i experienced while working on my wacky belt setup


_Modified by yeayeayea at 10:17 PM 6-17-2009_


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

how far is a little? im off by a mill or two


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

im not sure, but just turning the crank by hand was enough to make it happen.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

i cranked it over a little with socket and it seems to work, we will see if it squeels or not, but i think it will be good. 
I made that waterpump pulley, it weighs 1/2 as much as the steel vr one i copied. as of right now i have a neuspeed power pulley on the crank, what do you guys think about not running a harmonic dampner?


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

that waterpump pulley is slick. 
and id say you are fine, you are running no AC and no PS correct? then the only load is alternator and waterpump on a system designed for the addition of those two. Plus, the 16v engines are built pretty tight and arent clunky like a diesel or anything, so you will probably be fine without one. infact i tried to remove the one out of my tdi crank pulley but was unsuccessful. Plus I have a buddy who has a 300+whp aba16vt mk2 gti and he has an aluminum crank pulley with no dampner and he has no problems


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Any other mk1 guys doing this?
I don't know where to put the carter fuel pump.. Under the car by the stock fuel pump, there isn't a good spot I could find... Might be putting it under the hood but I don't really want to since I want it as bare bones as possible in the bay you know...


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

im not using a carter, but i think i am just gona put it back by the tank.


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

So what radiator/fan setup are you guys doing? I remember some talk about using a honda radiator...
I have some clearance issues with both the stock radiator upper neck and radiator fan shroud, so it's going to have to be a custom setup..








upper neck almost protruding into carb


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

most guys run honda crx radiators because theyre about half as wide as a vw radiator. you just gotta run custom lines.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

heres how the honda radiator sits in relation to the carbs


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

I ended up using my old 8v radiator and modifying the radiator support. I now have a 12" slim line 1350 CFM fan installed as well.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

that definitely gives you the room, but the honda rad gives you a direct airflow towards the carbs.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_that definitely gives you the room, but the honda rad gives you a direct airflow towards the carbs.

yeah thats what im gona run as wellhttp://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3447417


----------



## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

quick question...im installing CBR900 carb on my 8V with the bike fuel pump and i dont know if i should place it near the gaz tank or nearer the carb ??


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

i would say near the gas tank, that way if you run out of fuel it will be alot easier for it to reprime itself.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

yeah thats what i think im gona do too


----------



## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

ok perfect...and anybody how big the jets i should start on a Solid lifters 8V with a cam and mild porting ?


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

i think most people either run the stge 3 jets or drill em out to like 1.75mm. its somewhere in this thread.

fastrabbitvw had a drill bit that they were mailing around. it was 1.75. he was supposed to mail it to me but i never received it, so i dont know if it got lost in the mail or was never sent out.


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Aww man I wanted everyone to get that thing! fasrabbitvw, send it on to save yeayeayea from spending $100+ on a jet kit


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

Haha i really want it too! I pm'ed him and he responded so hopefully the ball will get rolling again


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

i hope that size works otherwise we are all gona be sunk! haha


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

Sorry guys I just started a new job and forgot got them on there way to yeayeayea now


----------



## boostedbunny041 (Nov 10, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

I'm doing a r1/aba setup and I've heard you don't want to much direct flow to the carbs especially if your not running true filters because the air flow at speed can cause turbulence in the velocity stacks and make tuning it a b**ch


----------



## boostedbunny041 (Nov 10, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

oh yeah my car is an mk1 golf, also i'm going to be using the stock r1 fuel pump because you don't need to use a regulator, the pump does it and it has the correct pressure 3-4 psi http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (boostedbunny041)*

well, my mk1 is gone, along with the bike carbs.







money was tight but im glad you guys are keeping this going. Nice work http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

that sucks, mine is still slow going but hopefully it will be done within the next month or so.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

That's too bad mk2fu







I'm still picking away at mine. It seems liek after I get 2 things installed, I find 2 more things I need to modify or buy


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_That's too bad mk2fu







I'm still picking away at mine. It seems liek after I get 2 things installed, I find 2 more things I need to modify or buy









that makes two of us


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## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

im in a little hold up i lost the title and bill of sale for the car the motor was going in so now i gotta switch everything becuase its going in my rabbit and i sent that drill bit to yeayeayea it should show up soon


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

thats quite a pisser losing all that.

bad news to you two above who are abandoning your projects









good news though, I just ordered the piping im going to be using for my intake runners







so as soon as that shows up i can weld up and powdercoat the manifold


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Howdy. What do these need to get hooked up to? Coordinate the color with the NIPPLES


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

i think that is just connected to the airbox to only allow filtered air into the chamber above. i may be mistaken though, its been a while since ive looked at em


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (yeayeayea)*

 
started working on a die to expand my runners from round to oval. When i get mine done if you want i can send it around like the drill as long as i get it back


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

wouldnt putting them into a vice achieve the same effect?


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

ehh sorta, thats the way a lot of people do it, this is the way they do it on headers and the like, i guess its the right way to do it. It lets you use a slightly smaller diameter runner that is really close to the id of the carbs yet still have it match the port perfectly= awsome flow!


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

and i still havent received the drill bit from fastrabbitvw, im not sure if he sent it out or not or if it got lost in the mail


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (yeayeayea)*

what size bit are you using? ill grab one at work if its MIA


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

1.85mm I •think•. It's back in the early pages of this thread.
For my intake mani we just did the runners the dirty way, vice. And it was galvanized exhaust tubing. Expanded the ends(barely needed to) to tightly fit the carbs.
Currently the intake mani is at the machine shop getting the head surface perfectly flat after welding and smoothing out all the welds.
I have about 5 more wires to connect, then finish up the coolant hoses and I should be damn near close to turning the key. I'm sooooooo excited!!!!!!


----------



## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

*FV-QR*

i put it in a drop box infront of a usps office ill replace it if it doesnt show up soon


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Everyone-
I found a souce from an amature airplane website that has a solder-on throttle cable end that would adapt our oem throttle cable to a mikuni-type.
Fact of the matter is, I am required to buy the pieces in sets of 5. Well I only need one... so do you guys- there's roughly 5 of us so I figured I'd send them out to whoever's interested for cost of shipping ($5)
Who's in?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

in http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

do you have a pic of what youre talking about?

and i think it was a 1.75mm bit


_Modified by yeayeayea at 10:24 AM 8-14-2009_


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_in http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

do you have a pic of what youre talking about?


Sure do Right Here It's about halfway down the page.
Notice they have different sizes avail, and I have yet to determine which is appropriate if any. I was too late the other night to call the company and talk to someone, then I found the page displayed in this post with the specs, so tonight I (or a volunteer- one of you guys) can look at the carb throttle attachment and measure what the size needs to be.


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Ok guys the place I listed does not have the correct size fittings- however I found a place that does. It's $8 shipping + $1 in parts... so I will still say $5 shipped per part. It's still cheap- just enough to cover shipping and the trouble on my part.
I would like to buy these ASAP so let's get everyone that's interested in so I can know how many to buy.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

what exactly does the part your talking about do?


----------



## idmini (Jan 7, 2004)

I'm in for a cable end, my project little deuce coupe, na just kidding, sorta, 82 rocco, 1.7 stock block factory head mild port, chamber, with big cam. oh looking for 1.6 or 1.7 big top pistons


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_what exactly does the part your talking about do?

It's a barrel-shaped end for your oem (vw) throttle cable to properly fit to the throttle linkage on your carbs. It will most likely solder on (via torch). I have to talk to the company first and get some details as their website just has part numbers.

_Quote, originally posted by *idmini* »_I'm in for a cable end, my project little deuce coupe, na just kidding, sorta, 82 rocco, 1.7 stock block factory head mild port, chamber, with big cam. oh looking for 1.6 or 1.7 big top pistons

Cool, you're on the list for the cable fitting.
Sounds like a cool build. I wish I had the funds now for a head like that on my 16v


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

in for the barrel fitting


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_in for the barrel fitting









http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## idmini (Jan 7, 2004)

What happened to the cable ends and the 8v manifolds... keep this alive i got my carbs and cam in the pistons are in the works. Is the distributor of the saab the only way to go for adv or is there another way? Can a msd or other box be used to set timming? alltho I like the vacuum advance, kinda wanna do a limited electric everything


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *idmini* »_What happened to the cable ends and the 8v manifolds... keep this alive i got my carbs and cam in the pistons are in the works. Is the distributor of the saab the only way to go for adv or is there another way? Can a msd or other box be used to set timming? alltho I like the vacuum advance, kinda wanna do a limited electric everything

Yo! I just got back from a Vegas bachelor party and that emptied my wallet for sure. I'll order the cable ends this weekend when I get that much needed paycheck. 
The saab distributor I have also has centrifugal advance, so I am not planning on using the vac advance, although I can if it is necessary. I will post up info on what I am doing for the ignition system. It will be using a stock 8v ignition module (with the heatsink riveted to the panel in the rain tray) and a little re-wiring. Very simple and bare-bones. I will post up a schematic of how it's wired. I would now beut I don't have it yet.
I just got my intake manifold from the machine shop today- nice and flat, and now gloss black.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

orange are you doing all this for an 8v or a 16v?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_orange are you doing all this for an 8v or a 16v?

I replaced my stock 8v with a 9a 16v. Were you asking because of the ignition module? A cis 16v should have one too but I don't know for sure


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yeah just because you said you were using the 8v stuff. I have a CIS-E 1989 GTI 16v, which from the little reading i have done should have an ignition system compatable with carbs, but bettered by the saab distributor.


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

^^^Exactly. This way you don't need to buy MSD standalone or the like. Modding what you have to work with what you got is no stranger to this swap


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

This is the ignition control module I will be re-wiring to use. Found under that black metal flap in the rain tray of mk1/2's


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

ooh i have a spare Jetronic ECU with one of those on top, i guess ill save it as a spare
So heres what ive gotten done so far
should have gotten some 30* bends , the 45's are making it angle downward. perhaps down the road I will get some 30's and reweld the manifold but for now these will have to do.


























































_Modified by yeayeayea at 12:45 AM 9-8-2009_


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## fastrabbitvw (Jun 30, 2006)

Corrected if I'm wrong but don't the float bowls need to be ats level as possible to the ground?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

they are more level than in those pictures, since those arent welded up. 


















_Modified by yeayeayea at 7:07 AM 9-9-2009_


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (fastrabbitvw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *fastrabbitvw* »_Corrected if I'm wrong but don't the float bowls need to be ats level as possible to the ground?

not so much on cv carbs, on a lot of bikes they arent mounted level, and ive seen them mounted in v8s and such at really steep angles. i think the floats are designed to work in a wide range.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Wow those runners are long! I have minbe mounted up and I'll take a picture of where I'm at with everything tonight if I get time http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
LOL silly me forgot to remove the debris-blocking paper towel wads from out of the head openings since it had been sitting so I had to take the carbs back off yesterday and fish the wadding out and then re-mount them








All good now


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

haha i did that once, dead tired one morning i tried to move my gti, only to find it not start and sound very odd.
popped the hood, i had forgot that I had not reinstalled the upper intake manifold the night before, and had just sucked paper towels down the lower intake all the way to the valve. much fishing ensued.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_haha i did that once, dead tired one morning i tried to move my gti, only to find it not start and sound very odd.
popped the hood, i had forgot that I had not reinstalled the upper intake manifold the night before, and had just sucked paper towels down the lower intake all the way to the valve. much fishing ensued.

Haha yeah I didn't start mine, I just had that lightbulb turn on as I realized that they were still in there.


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

i did the same thing but with a rag and a turbo. i was amazed at how well it shreded it


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

quick question, do the main jets have a needle that go in them? if so, when you drill them out wouldnt you need a bigger needle?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

http://rs180.rapidshare.com/fi...l.zip
theres a pretty detailed repair manual and a parts catalog

got the fuel lines all mocked up, just need to get some clamps








not 100% sure i want to run them over by the fender or go for a straight shot alongside the motor.\








looks stock to me!








wait what are those trumpet things?








WTF???








aha, ram air styles








gonna try and start it this morning


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*



it runs but leaks fuel out of the front of the carbs. gonna take em apart and clean em this weekend.


----------



## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

awesome work man! Congrats


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

what are you doing for ignition?


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

stock. didnt change a thing. mine is a 1989 so it had cis E i believe and i guess the knock box ignition. eventually id like to run a volvo vacuum advance distributor


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Congrats on being the first one to start it! Why the eff is it spewin fuel though? It's coming out all the carbs and the overflow really bad..
The saab turbo dizzy also works- it's vac AND centrifugal advance.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

its spewing fuel because the regulator cant regulate down low enough to prevent it. 
either that or my floats are stuck open from sitting too long.

I have been chatting with HyperformanceVW and he drew me this diagram








he said he had the same problem, and by adding a return line to one of the outlets of the regulator he was able to get the pressure low enough to run these carbs. 
Ive read on some cbr sites that when the fuel pumps on these bikes break, the owners just take them off and run them as gravity fed without any problems, so im beginning to think even 3 psi might be more than enough to run them.


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

What is your fuel pressure at?


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

no clue, my gauge is broken







it never moves off 0psi which doesnt seem right given the amount of fuel its dumping. 

friday i hope to have the issue resolved. i will post up what my fix is


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_no clue, my gauge is broken







it never moves off 0psi which doesnt seem right given the amount of fuel its dumping. 

friday i hope to have the issue resolved. i will post up what my fix is

That sucks about the gauge! It does seem like you have too much fuel going to the carbs beca7use they are overflowing, and I would wait to clean them out until you hook the return up from the reg to the tank. no point in taking them off when something else seems to be the blame, although it is a possibility something is stuck in them after sitting dry.
And please do let us know what you find out.
PS can't you just turn down the pressure @ the reg?

__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view











_Modified by OrangeDUB at 11:31 PM 9-15-2009_


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_
That sucks about the gauge! It does seem like you have too much fuel going to the carbs beca7use they are overflowing, and I would wait to clean them out until you hook the return up from the reg to the tank. no point in taking them off when something else seems to be the blame, although it is a possibility something is stuck in them after sitting dry.
And please do let us know what you find out.
PS can't you just turn down the pressure @ the reg?

__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view












definitely. first thing first is to get a return line on the regulator and to replace all my ziptie hose clamps with metal ones (sounds safe right?)
all cylinders appeared to be firing properly, and responded to throttle changes well, so it leads me to believe each carb is doing what it is supposed to aside from receiving too much fuel. so im not going to disassemble them until all other options are exhausted.
Finally I could turn down the pressure at the regulator, but i dont know which way to turn it, nor do i know what its min and max values are. from what HyperformanceVW was telling me, it sounds like my regulator is not capable of regulating down that low without returning some of the fuel to the tank.
I should be getting a new gauge this weekend, as well as a cooling fan of some sort and a serpentine belt to finish the conversion. I have to have it tagged and running by next weekend for H2O so this friday and possibly sunday is going to be crazy


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

so i added the return line but i still cant get it to stop leaking out the fronts. Although the return line helped a ton, its just barely coming out now. i got the throttle cable worked out, its a mix between a bicycle brake cable, a scirocco throttle cable guide, and the stock cable. no pics yet, but the rear stock intake manifold bracket (the one with 4 bolt holes, not 3) can be flipped around and bolted onto the intake manifold bolting holes and be used to hold a throttle cable. lines right up, all you have to do is widen the lower mounting holes a little bit.

shot some fireballs out the exhaust last night, it sounds wicked


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Hmm so did you turn down the pressure then? Too much fuel pressure sounds like it's your problem. It sounds like you really should get a gauge. I think the a few PSI could make the difference between being normal and overflowing on these gravity fed carbs. Plus you should worry about blowing seals if there is too much pressure. (They ARE originally gravity fed right?)
So.... here is my progress:
Intake manifold bolts ready for mothers (this stuff is GREAT)








Before cleaning up/polishing one bolt, and the finished ones
















Bay shot- note the tidy alternator setup- don't see those too often in mk1's
















The only vac line in the car- to the brake booster
































I still have to wire up all the sensors and a couple other things, install my catch can, and figure out what I'm going to do with the coolant hoses.


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

i have a quick question...i will be running the CBR fuel pump and there is a small nipple that look like a vacuum on the bottom of the pump ??? do i block it ?? anyone plan on using these ?


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_so i added the return line but i still cant get it to stop leaking out the fronts. Although the return line helped a ton, its just barely coming out now. i got the throttle cable worked out, its a mix between a bicycle brake cable, a scirocco throttle cable guide, and the stock cable. no pics yet, but the rear stock intake manifold bracket (the one with 4 bolt holes, not 3) can be flipped around and bolted onto the intake manifold bolting holes and be used to hold a throttle cable. lines right up, all you have to do is widen the lower mounting holes a little bit.

shot some fireballs out the exhaust last night, it sounds wicked










Sounds badass!!!!! More video please!!


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

well i wish i had not fallen asleep this afternoon, i meant to work on it this evening. i drilled out the jets with a 1.73mm (it was either that or a 1.78mm, all i had) and switched the feed line from a 3/8" line to a 1/4 line and now its just barely coming out. i think after h2O (or before if i can get new couplers) i will cut the manifold and mount the carbs at a more upward angle. still, its running pretty decently, havent driven it yet because im missing 3 coupler clamps due to a ****ty ebay seller.


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

on a rabbit 1.8 8V, did anybody tried rapping the intake tube over the engine to put the carbs in front of the car ?? a little bit like a stock 16V but reverse ??? longer tube = more lowerend power right ??


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

ive never seen it, but thast doesnt mean it wouldnt work. and yes longer runners means more low end power.

i have seen people cut upper intake manifolds for 16v engines and run the carbs on the back of the engine.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_note the tidy alternator setup- don't see those too often in mk1's








 whats that bracket off of? / whats the lower bracket look like?


----------



## veector (Mar 1, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mudanddust* »_ whats that bracket off of? / whats the lower bracket look like?

x2 very interested also what belt are you using? Any special pulleys on the water pump or alternator?


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

The alternator bracket AND alternator are off a mk1 diesel without A/C.
The crank and waterpump pulleys are lined up and I did not modify them. The alternator pulley had to be shimmed out with an 1/8" washer at the shaft/pulley assembly, and then since that wasn't enough to line it up with the other 2 pulleys I had to dremel the casing a little to get it over some more. All in all it was spaced towards the pasenger side fender about 1/4".
When I get time I will take detailed pics to help explain exactly what I did.
Here is a pic of the mk1 diesel non-A/C bracket


----------



## badazzgti88 (May 2, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_so i added the return line but i still cant get it to stop leaking out the fronts. Although the return line helped a ton, its just barely coming out now. i got the throttle cable worked out, its a mix between a bicycle brake cable, a scirocco throttle cable guide, and the stock cable. no pics yet, but the rear stock intake manifold bracket (the one with 4 bolt holes, not 3) can be flipped around and bolted onto the intake manifold bolting holes and be used to hold a throttle cable. lines right up, all you have to do is widen the lower mounting holes a little bit.

shot some fireballs out the exhaust last night, it sounds wicked









damn wes, that was a awesome idea on the throttle cable.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

mike that throttle cable was alright but v2.0 is gonna be alot better.

orange dub, what throttle cable is that? have you gotten yours running yet?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BD1d1bIspuk


_Modified by yeayeayea at 8:32 PM 10-24-2009_


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Stock throttle cable that was on my 8v. Nope I haven't had much going on with mine lately, I've been slackin'.


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

im thinking a vr6 cable should be more than long enough, but for now im just gonna shorten what i have. still cant get the gauge to read higher than 0, no matter how high i turn the fuel pressure regulator. however, now no matter how high i turn the fuel pressure regulator, there is absolutely no fuel leaking out the fronts. so problem solved i suppose.


----------



## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

Amazing work, I think we should get a list of everything needed to get the carbs to run on a 16v. 
you guys are making me want to go out and buy another set...


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

step 1: remove fuel pump assembly under car
step 2: install carb fuel filter, connect two halves of return line
step 3: make intake manifold
step 4: remove cis
step 5: clamp carbs to manifold
step 6: install low pressure fuel regulator
step 7: start


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_step 1: remove fuel pump assembly under car
step 2: install carb fuel filter, connect two halves of return line
step 3: make intake manifold
step 4: remove cis
step 5: clamp carbs to manifold
step 6: install low pressure fuel regulator
step 7: start

In a small small nutshell. Like pistachio shell. I think I have spent over a grand, granted I did a 16v swap as well ($100 for motor).


----------



## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

i would like to run these on an aba 8v. i figure ill get the lower half of the manifold machined down and use it as a platform for the manifold.


----------



## badazzgti88 (May 2, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_
In a small small nutshell. Like pistachio shell. I think I have spent over a grand, granted I did a 16v swap as well ($100 for motor).

Well we ate like 2 bags of pistachio's one night working on it lol







, and i don't think he spent more than acouple hundred bucks if that.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yeah i havent spent much at all. just time i suppose


----------



## franque (Jul 12, 2008)

So, how much power are these Carbs good to?


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

no clue, but id like to dyno my setup once i get it dialed in nice


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_no clue, but id like to dyno my setup once i get it dialed in nice

I would also like to. That and go to the drag strip with the top down


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kreO9ml1RZg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRevuvRbW8I


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Nice you got yours running and driving!!


----------



## badazzgti88 (May 2, 2006)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*

it's still wack!







When can i come take a ride wes?


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

gonna be working on it friday gotta get ready for that track day. i dunno if itll be ready to actually make runs at the track though. I hope so though!


----------



## super64 (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

step 1: remove fuel pump assembly under car
step 2: install carb fuel filter, connect two halves of return line
step 3: make intake manifold
step 4: remove cis
step 5: clamp carbs to manifold
step 6: install low pressure fuel regulator
step 7: start

So I just read all the thread and am still not sure if you need a return fuel line. Do you need one? I have a MK1 with a stock 1600 in it and have an 1800 ready to go in but stock it has no return fuel line. Do I need to put one in?








And what is wrong with using the stock fuel pump? It currently just supplies a crap little carby.


----------



## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (super64)*


_Quote, originally posted by *super64* »_And what is wrong with using the stock fuel pump? It currently just supplies a crap little carby.

we are all converting from fuel injection to carbs. FI requires a lot more fuel pressure than carbs, so if you are coming from a stock carbed mk1 all you need to do is run a pressure regulator


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

if your car already has a carb from the factory then you dont need to mess with the fuel supply.

i currently run a return line off my regulator, but im switching to a setup without. the bike carbs do not have return lines, just an overflow line that i guess could be connected to the stock return line if you wanted.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

I'm currently not running a return line to my tank, but that idea is pretty good for the carb overflow to return to the tank. I might do that it would be easy..


----------



## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yeah it would be pretty easy, and considering the carbs are above the gas tanks on our cars, it should work out pretty well


----------



## super64 (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

Yeah I am just not too keen on running a return line. My other floG is a GLD so has a return line from the factory, so when I went EFI it was all too easy, but I dont want to have to put my own return in. I'm lazy lol


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

I ran my own feed line from the tank to the carbs- it was harder to pull the old lines out vs. install my new one. Granted my new one is nice ~3/8" braided rubber fuel line (or whatever size dia. the pump needs)
I figured the stock fuel line size is way too small for the volume on our pumps... at least what carter reccomends to run.


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## badazzgti88 (May 2, 2006)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_I ran my own feed line from the tank to the carbs- it was harder to pull the old lines out vs. install my new one. Granted my new one is nice ~3/8" braided rubber fuel line (or whatever size dia. the pump needs)
I figured the stock fuel line size is way too small for the volume on our pumps... at least what carter reccomends to run.

I don't know but stock cis pumps flow alot of fuel. The stock line should have been fine


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: (badazzgti88)*


_Quote, originally posted by *badazzgti88* »_
I don't know but stock cis pumps flow alot of fuel. The stock line should have been fine

HVLP is different than HVLP.. the rotary carter pumps a couple of us are using are HVLP to simulate gravity feed like the carbs are built to handle. With my fuel lines I'm just "following the directions"








Some people use the in tank pumps only for carbs and I have heard that works, but I figured I'd use the same pump that my buddy is using for his 2.0L 16v on dual 45's.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

hvlp is different than hvhp is what you mean i believe. the stock high pressur epump would be a nightmare to regulate down to 2 psi


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_hvlp is different than hvhp is what you mean i believe. the stock high pressur epump would be a nightmare to regulate down to 2 psi


Haha yeah, duh. Thanks yeayea.
The main thing is you want to make sure that the carbs are getting the volume they need. If they don't get the fuel, it will lean out and we all know what that can mean- detonation!!!!!


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yeah im gonna take em apart and make sure everything inside is tip top, as well as setting the ldle mixture screws and go from there


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## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

what main jet size are you guys goung to use? for a 2.0 16v thanks


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

im running 1.73mm jets in mine
ive read 1.70 for a 1.8 8v, up to 1.8 for a 2.0 16v. 
)
i have a 1.8 16v with headwork and cams, and full exhaust (header, cat delete, tt w/ borla)

not sure if i want to step up to a slightly bigger main or play with the needle height settings


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## oopseyesharted (Mar 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

I have an 85 jetta coupe. I have already removed the cis crap and was going to install a single or dual weber setup.
But, after seeing and hearing the videos in here, I am beginning to wonder if I shouldnt do motorcycle carbs.
My car already has a vacuum advance distributor.....seems simple enough.
I just need to do something about an intake manifold.
Anybody have an 8v counterflow on bike carbs in here?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

does the vacuum advance distributor help with WOT performance, since there isnt any vacuum at WOT? or is it only for part throttle and idle?


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (oopseyesharted)*


_Quote, originally posted by *oopseyesharted* »_Anybody have an 8v counterflow on bike carbs in here?

not yet haha, but im sure people have done it/are doing it


----------



## oopseyesharted (Mar 2, 2005)

*FV-QR*

I might have to give it a try
The intake is gonna be a difficult part for me.
I have no welder or metal working skills.


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## super64 (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (oopseyesharted)*

So just wondering what your fuel consumption is like with these carbs? Better or worse than the EFI it replaced?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

mine replaced CIS, which i got great gas mikleage on.

its not as good, but then again its way out of tune, so still too early to tell


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## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_im running 1.73mm jets in mine
ive read 1.70 for a 1.8 8v, up to 1.8 for a 2.0 16v. 
)
i have a 1.8 16v with headwork and cams, and full exhaust (header, cat delete, tt w/ borla)

not sure if i want to step up to a slightly bigger main or play with the needle height settings

thenks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

hi...maybe its gonna sound stupid but on this picture...is the gaz fed from the top where the line split and on bottom is the overflow ? but why is there a filter ?? and do you guys run 1/4 line ?
thanks


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

the line on the bottom with the filter is the gas feed line.
the smaller line that runs along the top and down the right hand side is the gas overflow lines
the short line with the box on it is a vent tube for the vacuum actuated slides


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Speaking of the vacuum slides.. What did you hook those up to? Intake manifold or something?
As for fuel lines I ran all 3/8" (I thinks) 
And you can tuck those fuel overflow lines down in between the carbs for a cleaner look. Not sure if that would hurt the functionality though.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

the slides dont need any external vacuum source, they get their vacuum from a port built into the carb itself.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_the slides dont need any external vacuum source, they get their vacuum from a port built into the carb itself.

So just filter the air on that tube and you're good? What are yuou doing with yours (permanently speaking)


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

eventually id like to get a breather filter on there, but who knows..... i dont want to tie it into the crankcase ventilation system because i dont want the air pulses from the crankcase to mess with the slides


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

so last night i got some practice with the lathe here on campus








turned down an ABA crank pulley 6mm, also took a thin layer off the steel portion to remove the rust and shave a tad off the mass









































i would have taken more off the steel part to save weight, but i couldnt find any oil to lubricate the cutting bit and didnt want to wear it out.


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

ok and last question...im putting this on my rabbit wich have the vacuum dissy...to what can i hook it up to ?? and to help it start the first time...should i play with the dizzy timing...retard or advance (conterclock or ?? )
thanks


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

is your rabbit carbureted from the factory? if so, then i wouldnt mess with the ignition timing at all to start off with. I am still runnign the same ignition setup i was on CIS. it started fine, and i dont have a vacuum advance dizzy.
you need to put a vacuum line port in one or all of your runners, im running only one in my #4 runner to operate the power brakes and the vacuum actuated HVAc controls. you could just tap your vacuum line for the dizzy off that line


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

no my car was cis before but i dont know why i have a vacuum dizzy... but i heard its not good to plug it to the manifold...it would advance instead of retard or inverse...i guess i could leave it unplugged.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

theyr ecalled vacuum advance distributors for a reason


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## badazzgti88 (May 2, 2006)

*Re: (kojiru)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kojiru* »_hi...maybe its gonna sound stupid but on this picture...is the gaz fed from the top where the line split and on bottom is the overflow ? but why is there a filter ?? and do you guys run 1/4 line ?
thanks








wes, I'm not saying your wrong because you know better than me but are you sure the tubes on the bottom of the carbs is the feed line? Why would the over flow come off the top of the carb when the tank is above the carbs? Just seems strange to me. Every motorcycle, dirtbike, or 4wheeler I've had has always had the fuel feed line on top of the carb and the over flow coming off the bowls.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

i dunno why it is, but i have a honda factory repair and parts manual for these carbs (in pdf form if someone knows where i can host it, ~50MB) and it lists the bottom tube as the fuel line and the top one as the air vent tubes


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

nevermind found a site already hosting it. its the first two
http://moto.gazovisistemi.com/


----------



## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Thanks for posting the manual that will help with tuning








BTW what did you have to tune so far if anything?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

either earlier in this thread or in anothe rbike carb thread there is a pdf of an article about runnign bike carbs, it was scanned out of a UK magazine i believe

it mentions whats needed to get them to work properly










_Modified by yeayeayea at 7:45 PM 11-12-2009_


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

got mine runnig today !!! so nice !
now i need to find a way to attatch the little hook that goes on the gaz pedal to the throtle cable...any idea ?? 
(now they hold together with a vise grip lol )


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

Congratulations on getting yours running! I spent all day flyin around in mine, to and from an end of year vw gtg. 
im not sure what part youre talking about? are you saying you cant get your throttle cable clipped onto the gas pedal? i think the scirocco cable is different than the mk2 cable


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

Pic from the gtg the other day







its a blast to drive
























i shaved down my aba pulley some more, its pretty light now


































_Modified by yeayeayea at 9:44 AM 11-16-2009_


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

on my rabbit there is a little hook at the end of the cable that attach to the padal...so now the cable i used for throtle have a little ball at eash end...now i need to find a way to fit the hook to the cable...


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

why dont you just use the stock cable? else you are goign to have to mate the two cables together like i did.


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

i dont know on mk2 but on the mk1 the cable doesnt end with a ball...any...i think i got what i need...thanks anyhow !


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Yeayea did you realize you removed the timing mark on that crank pulley? I hope you made a new one


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## badazzgti88 (May 2, 2006)

*Re: (OrangeDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OrangeDUB* »_Yeayea did you realize you removed the timing mark on that crank pulley? I hope you made a new one








you don't need acrank pully timing mark on a 16v it's on the flywheel


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

http://i902.photobucket.com/al...a.jpg

its still there though, 4 oclock position. i had to make it go all the way through with a bandsaw but its there


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_http://i902.photobucket.com/al...a.jpg

its still there though, 4 oclock position. i had to make it go all the way through with a bandsaw but its there

I see what the f you did there


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

heres the video of mine running !! overlook the coolant line block with Visegrip lol...the engine need an overhaul but at least i got it running very decent ! : ) 
Not bad for 5 degree day in Montreal...


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

awesome man!
are they set up the same as they were on the bike or have you started messing with the jets?


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

for now i have just drill the main to see if i will invest in this project during the winter !


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: (kojiru)*

you havent drilled the main jet yet?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

i think he said that is all he has done.


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## kojiru (Dec 5, 2005)

yes all i have done is drill the main jet and do the manifold... and find a throttle cable.


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (kojiru)*

finally got the motor in haha its taken too long, but i should have pics up this weekend


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

shiiiiiit ive been dailying mine for like 3 weeks now...


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

yeah i wish i could say the same, but too many other projects goin on, 
what kind of stuff did you guys do to clean up your engine bays if anything? i am trying to eliminate as much wiring as possible, hopefully i can get it down to lighting, a few sensors, and ignition wiring, and minimal hosiery. any ideas?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

havent done anything yet. that comes this winter


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## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

im so stoked just fired up my b3!! man it sounds sweet!! and the revs are so smooth thera are a lot of things still to work on but it fired up nice and idles nice too and it was digi2 and the only thing i did was to disconnect the flow meter take of the stock intake put the carbs in


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

im guessing you took off your stock high pressure fuel pump too?


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## junn (May 6, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

jajaja no i fired it up with the stock pump







but i had it clamped so that the pressure drop a little bit im going to change it of course
_Quote, originally posted by *yeayeayea* »_im guessing you took off your stock high pressure fuel pump too?


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (junn)*

vice grip fuel pressure regulator


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

trying to regulate 44psi down to 2 psi with vice grips must be scary


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

anyone running a different pump? what are you doing for wiring?


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## leandre1 (Feb 26, 2004)

Hook up a motorcycle fuel pump and that will solve all your fuel pressure problems. Preferebly a fuel pump from the same kind of bike you got the carb from.
Thats what I did when I did my Bike carb conversion.


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## impulse byer (Mar 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

What year of bike would be best to source the carbs from?


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (leandre1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *leandre1* »_Hook up a motorcycle fuel pump and that will solve all your fuel pressure problems. Preferebly a fuel pump from the same kind of bike you got the carb from.
Thats what I did when I did my Bike carb conversion.

ive got a low pressure pump, i was just wondering if you use the stock wiring or not.


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

the year your carbs came from.....


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## RTCustomz (Dec 20, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

bump watch, have a couple of 2004 zx11 carbs im going to mess with http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## SimonWagen (Oct 18, 2008)

*FV-QR*

do you think 1.8mm is to big for a 1.8 16v????? the larger the jets, the more gas it pass???? mine is passing to much gas even with the stock 1.27main jets....im planning redrill it till 1.8mm. 
what should i do???? how can i manage that excess of gas???


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

you got something else going on if you are running rich with 1.27 jets, and its proably fuel pressure related.


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

yeayeayea, are you driving your car in the winter? How are the carbs holding up? any problems?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

nah, dont want it to get salty, but before they salted everything it was doing alright even in 20 degree weathers


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## i4turbo (Oct 26, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

What year saab or w.e car does the vac advance / centrifugal advance dist come from?
also are they direct bolt onto a 16v engine or does it need to be modded to fit? im just sourcing all my parts before the big swap...
thanks everyonw for all the info
SO far I got
r1 carbs
16v engine
mk1 rabbit ready to swap into
close ratio gti trans
100mm shafts
16v PP
Light flywheel
8v clutch (tranny is small spline)
going to use stock ICM and run vac/cent advance dist


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

its off the late 80s saab 900s or 9000s i forget but i think it needs to be modified.


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## i4turbo (Oct 26, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (yeayeayea)*

I just found one from a member here on vortex, im just going to get some pics to make sure its the right one.
Im going with a 2000 R1 fuel pump, instead of gettin the carter 4070 and fpr, rather keep it as cheap as possible...
Ill post up once its all in one place, thanks for all the info


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (i4turbo)*

im working on re spacing my carbs, anyone else done that with success? if so what did you use for the large vacume rubber tube conector things?


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

ill take that as a no


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

yeah i didnt mess with respacing the carbs.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Spacing them looked like a pain! A kit would be nice but I doubt that's around.
I jsut got my bunny in my garage so I should have mine running and hopefully tuned by springtime!


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (OrangeDUB)*

i put together my own that vacume hookup is the last thing i need


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (mudanddust)*

im grabbing another set and going to try and put them on a 2l 8v. lets give it a try..


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## iwanta16v (Mar 8, 2008)

Where did you guys get the carbs from?


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## yeayeayea (May 29, 2005)

*FV-QR*

ebay http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## iwanta16v (Mar 8, 2008)

Is it a bit quicker with the crabs rather than stock?
Ohh..and have you got it on a dyno yet?


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## mudanddust (Oct 24, 2007)

*Re: (iwanta16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iwanta16v* »_crabs

hehehe yeha the crabs make all the difference


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## mk2fu (May 14, 2007)

*Re: (mudanddust)*

im building a 2l aba. getting the manifold welded up this weekend, and then im going to find some carbs. ill take some pictures when i get to the shop


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

OH MY GOD I FINALLY FOUND THIS THREAD AGAIN 

Mine's done except I blew out several [probably] junk starters. Tweaked a few things. Using the saab dizzy and probs a late mk1 cabby brake master/res to clear the dizzy. 

*What starter should I be using for mk1 tranny/9a motor??*


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## thegimpster (Feb 26, 2007)

bump cause i just read the whole thread and have most of the stuff... well a mk1 jetta coupe, a 16v engine, the carbs, and a pile of parts. no intake manifold yet.


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

Here's some motivation guys. This is my rabbit and this video was filmed late this past summer. I'm filming the video, and my buddy is in the driver's seat.


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## idarabbitho (Apr 1, 2008)

are using a saab distributor? if so, how are you hooking up the vacuum for the advance? are you just running it straight off the carbs to the distributor? the reason i ask is that i have that same setup pretty much and i am just needing a few things finished up and thats one of the things i cant seem to find the answer too. 

thanks in advace


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

idarabbitho said:


> are using a saab distributor? if so, how are you hooking up the vacuum for the advance? are you just running it straight off the carbs to the distributor? the reason i ask is that i have that same setup pretty much and i am just needing a few things finished up and thats one of the things i cant seem to find the answer too.
> 
> thanks in advace


Saab Dizzy ahs centrifugal and vac advance. i'll be using both just because I have a feeling that it was built with both for a reason. My vac system is a tube connecting the brake booster to cylinder #4's intake runner. There is a universal T in the line that will give me a few outlets. Your other option is to have all your nipples on a vac canister. I'm not sure how much vacuum I will have but some systems use a bubble to retain constant presure (like the stupid square of bubbles that mk1's come with strapped to teh underside of the hood). Either way i'm not too worried but haven't driven it around on this setup either. Just testing it while parked in the garage.


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## idarabbitho (Apr 1, 2008)

thanks for the help. i have removed the brake booster to go to manual brakes. would i just hook up the vacuum to the #4 runner with the carbs and distributor? and or still use a vacuum bubble thing?
thanks again


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## OrangeDUB (Sep 18, 2006)

I don't know enough either way. I would have to think that the dizzy would be just fine with your vac line directly attached to the runner.


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## idarabbitho (Apr 1, 2008)

ill give it a try. thanks for the help


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## oopseyesharted (Mar 2, 2005)

I wanted to bump this from way back.
Lots of good info and pics in here.


----------

