# Gonzo Tuning?



## odonnejl (Sep 3, 2008)

Hello fellow dubbers, 

I know there has been countless threads about this but I'm looking for some honest opinions from people running the tune and what everything thinks about me wanting his stage 2 with my GTI having 160,000 on it. The engine is completely stock besides a 3 inch straight pipe from the turbo back no cat, intake, and 007 diverter valve. Gonzo is claiming his stage 2 programing ups the boost to 21 lbs. I'm pretty leary of doing this and want to know what everyone thinks. 


Thanks.


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

:facepalm: Don't buy anything gonzo. But to answer your question 21 psi spike is normal for stage 1/2 tunes. Buy quality software, not a hack job


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## TooLFan46n2 (Oct 18, 1999)

Seeing his own videos of his shop car and how it runs should be enough to scare you away. :facepalm:


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## Boostedwolf (Sep 23, 2008)

*Gonzo tuning*

I'm running a big turbo 870 file from him its a base file that hasn't been tweaked at all and my fuel trims are great and it runs good, i've pulled on 2 big turbo uni cars with cva1 cams and have not had any issues with it


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

AzDubN said:


> Truth.
> 
> I was skeptical at first but I have 3 good friends all on a Gonzo tune and their cars run great. Boostedwolfs car ran better on its first start without the maf plugged in, bad 02 no adaptation than my Uni 830 file. Runs even better now.
> 
> ...


 

:laugh: :thumbup:


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

TooLFan46n2 said:


> Seeing his own videos of his shop car and how it runs should be enough to scare you away. :facepalm:


 this :thumbup:


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

ANYONE can get all the "Gonzo Tuning" they want for FREE here www.nefariousmotorsports.com 

Follow his posts there, and you too can be a CarTooner:thumbup::thumbup:


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...o-kit-installation-thread&highlight=gonzo+gtt 

read this ridiculous thread :facepalm: JOKES :laugh:


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## ejg3855 (Sep 23, 2004)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> ANYONE can get all the "Gonzo Tuning" they want for FREE here www.nefariousmotorsports.com
> 
> Follow his posts there, and you too can be a CarTooner:thumbup::thumbup:


 yea there is tons of good info over there. But its not to hard to tune, once you understand how the maps work. If you were to spend a few months learning you could get 80% of the way there.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Stage 2+ preview: 




 
opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> ANYONE can get all the "Gonzo Tuning" they want for FREE here www.nefariousmotorsports.com
> 
> Follow his posts there, and you too can be a CarTooner:thumbup::thumbup:


 Yeah, you are right. A lot of times I lend people a hand when they need help figuring something out. The knowledge is there. You just have to make it work for you :thumbup:


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

^^^ WOW I MISSED THE AWESOME!!!!!! 


You guys, seriously we need to swap phone numbers so wehn this stuff goes down we can text each other. 


Gonzo tuning intercooler: 













The boost leaks are free of charge.


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## Boostedwolf (Sep 23, 2008)

Thats a vibrant core they come that way for mounting its casted that way smart guy 


gdoggmoney said:


> ^^^ WOW I MISSED THE AWESOME!!!!!!
> 
> 
> You guys, seriously we need to swap phone numbers so wehn this stuff goes down we can text each other.
> ...


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## seth_3515 (Dec 26, 2008)

I just don't get this nonsense.. So he learned how to program from nefarious, big whoop. He obviously has a following with working cars and a few BT tunes as well. It's not a secret you can learn to do it yourself but not many want to put in the time and effort to do it. Gonzo did and is making generic stage tunes like any other company.. I personally don't blame him one bit. He saw a market and is trying to get a product out there at a fair price as well. I was a little leery at first but after talking with him and the support has been awesome. Also, no one around me tunes for other two tunes. Providing data logs to adjust the tune makes me feel much better so I can see and keep an eye on things and make sure they are acceptable (timing pull, afr, etc) to me.


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

Boostedwolf said:


> Thats a vibrant core they come that way for mounting its casted that way smart guy


 Oh. Sorry. 


That still does not change the chinese turbos, poor tuning and otherwise silly stuff coming from the muppet.


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## Boostedwolf (Sep 23, 2008)

gdoggmoney said:


> Oh. Sorry.
> 
> 
> That still does not change the chinese turbos, poor tuning and otherwise silly stuff coming from the muppet.


 Build a k03/ko4 framed turbo here in america full casting machining and everything and compete with companies that are successfully selling Chinese turbos on here already for 8 times the price there worth, not going to happen. 
Also as far as "poor tuning" he's been great modifying my file every time I've made a change due to turbos and injector sizing for free no shipping the ecm to Canada and waiting a month at a time, my big turbo car idles terrific and pulls hard. we all know dbw and me7.. based ecm's suck so we either deal with it or standalone


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

me7 isn't the problem with tuning, running large injectors that aren't ev14 style makes these cars idle poorly


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

18T_BT said:


> me7 isn't the problem with tuning, running large injectors that aren't ev14 style makes these cars idle poorly


 No, its not properly tuning ME7 what gives you a bad idle.


Some injectors are really tough to get right, though.


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## Boostedwolf (Sep 23, 2008)

87vr6 said:


> Without any kind of details that statement is useless.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not hating on anybody here, but really? If you're going to make claims, at least provide facts to back up your statements.


 working on it  just had it all apart again to reroute the w.g. and put another muffler on total of 3, blew two axles up had to install raxle and as soon as that's done its going to the dyno


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Boostedwolf said:


> working on it  just had it all apart again to reroute the w.g. and put another muffler on total of 3, blew two axles up had to install raxle and as soon as that's done its going to the dyno


 You still owe me logs 


:laugh:


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## rains (May 30, 2008)

Gonzo, are you still working on your Annihilator turbo? 

Was watching the other thread, then it got locked


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## 87vr6 (Jan 17, 2002)

Boostedwolf said:


> working on it  just had it all apart again to reroute the w.g. and put another muffler on total of 3, blew two axles up had to install raxle and as soon as that's done its going to the dyno


 So that means you can't tell me the specs of the two uni-tuned cars, your car, whether or not driver experience was a factor, their numbers and charts, whether or not you had a jump on them, etc... 

Racing is baseless. Unless you remove all variables, it's not a true test. Back to back dyno's of all vehicles is the only way


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

rains said:


> Gonzo, are you still working on your Annihilator turbo?
> 
> Was watching the other thread, then it got locked


 Yes. I put a hold on it because I wanted to work on Stage 2+ and release both together.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

apparently the dyno isn't the way to settle, as i am repeatedly told.and i agree. i am a great driver,i have been racing in many forms since a kid.no crazy pro kind of guy, but great.

i have power to weight and a solid setup. but you would need to take one driver, width mile, quarter mile half mile full mile and some slalom to decipher how much better a car is than another.

anyway. i will butt fuk your souls!!!!!!!111!!11!!elevntybillion!!!!

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

but in this vase, the street is the most really available, not safe, way to do it, but video is the key.

i need to get more to put certain individuals in their respective place. anyway, back to naruto overdosing

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> No, its not properly tuning ME7 what gives you a bad idle.
> 
> 
> Some injectors are really tough to get right, though.


 

Wait, so do you agree with me or disagree with me because the two sentences contradict somewhat?


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

18T_BT said:


> Wait, so do you agree with me or disagree with me because the two sentences contradict somewhat?


 I agree that some injectors are horrible to tune for, BUT for the most part, you should be able to get a smooth idle if you put enough work into. If you put the time into, its possible. 

I got a smooth idle out of Siemens 630cc's, without even touching misfire detection or idle torque reserve, even though they aren't the greatest :thumbup:

Having a flow matched set helps a LOT sometimes.


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

Can you tune 1000cc injectors to idle as stock? 
Do the 630's you mention idle as stock?


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

Still looks like there isn't a dyno yet for the GTT kit. How surprising.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

18T_BT said:


> Do the 630's you mention idle as stock?


 Yes. Pretty darn close to stock, if not same. You can't tell, really.



18T_BT said:


> Can you tune 1000cc injectors to idle as stock?


 Oy, which ones? You have a PM :thumbup:


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> Still looks like there isn't a dyno yet for the GTT kit. How surprising.


 My test car ran into some issues. I have a new test car now along with a fully rebuilt motor and rods. Just finished putting it together yesterday. Turbo is in. I just need to go pass inspection and then its *ON* :thumbup:

PS: That Stage 2+ preview video was made with that car.


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> My test car ran into some issues. I have a new test car now along with a fully rebuilt motor and rods. Just finished putting it together yesterday. Turbo is in. I just need to go pass inspection and then its *ON* :thumbup:
> 
> PS: That Stage 2+ preview video was made with that car.


 opcorn:


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

The rods are a good idea. That beast is going to be mighty powerful on pump gas with its quarter sized turbine inlet, and making 25psi no load. 

Gonz, my good man, you are the highest rev tuner that ever did tune.


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

gdoggmoney said:


> The rods are a good idea. That beast is going to be mighty powerful on pump gas with its quarter sized turbine inlet, and making 25psi no load.
> 
> Gonz, my good man, you are the highest rev tuner that ever did tune.


 :laugh::thumbup:


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## mkiv_farfegnugen (Sep 14, 2010)

*Got my Stage 3*

Just got my sage 3 tune from gonzo and i have to say WOW... 
Went to a ko4-022 turbo and 380cc injectors and the car pulls all day. 

I ran my buddy stage 2+ Unitronic and took him on 3rd gear.. Was the same results after 6 runs. 

I will have some dyno charts later in the month for you guys and for the price he cant be beat as well the level of service he provides is amazing. 

My 2 cents:thumbup:


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

Vegeta Gti said:


> apparently the dyno isn't the way to settle, as i am repeatedly told.and i agree. i am a great driver,i have been racing in many forms since a kid.no crazy pro kind of guy, but great.
> 
> i have power to weight and a solid setup. but you would need to take one driver, width mile, quarter mile half mile full mile and some slalom to decipher how much better a car is than another.
> 
> ...


 :laugh::beer: 



[email protected] said:


> Still looks like there isn't a dyno yet for the GTT kit. How surprising.


 this LOL. :facepalm: 



dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> opcorn:


 gimme some of dat opcorn: 



gdoggmoney said:


> The rods are a good idea. That beast is going to be mighty powerful on pump gas with its quarter sized turbine inlet, and making 25psi no load.
> 
> Gonz, my good man, you are the highest rev tuner that ever did tune.


 :thumbup: 



mkiv_farfegnugen said:


> Just got my sage 3 tune from gonzo and i have to say WOW...
> Went to a ko4-022 turbo and 380cc injectors and the car pulls all day.
> 
> I ran my buddy stage 2+ Unitronic and took him on 3rd gear.. Was the same results after 6 runs.
> ...


 booo, run a frankenturbo car and see what happends. you put on an upgraded turbo and then brag about taking a stock turbo car :screwy: i **** on all stock turbo vw's, and that means nothing because i have a BT


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

uni stg2+ is for a k04XX turbo... 

i'm waiting for someone to get a tune here so i can obliterate them repeatedly and go... y u mad bro?


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

Vegeta Gti said:


> uni stg2+ is for a k04XX turbo...
> 
> i'm waiting for someone to get a tune here so i can obliterate them repeatedly and go... y u mad bro?


 damn, i missed the "+" when i read that. It's still a little early here, i just woked up and gotta jet 2 work. I'll be back later :beer::laugh:


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## rains (May 30, 2008)

have a good day at work, honey :heart:


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## ForVWLife (Nov 12, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> My test car ran into some issues.


 shockingggg


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

ForVWLife said:


> shockingggg


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

Gonz, since XS power makes their compressor housings easily removable, are you going to design the same sort of functionality into the GTT Annihilator? 











I think something like this could really take R&R time down a bunch.


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

See, here's what's really sad to me: kids these days are really bright. Not everyone is going to be studying quantum mechanics but kids are still really bright. 

Here you have a kid like Gonzo, doing his little tuning thing. His original tune material and custom code material is highly questionable... but hey, ignoring that for a second, he can at least be intelligible when you speak to him. So, Gonzo is doing his thing, whatever, and decides to adopt the public motto of "I love being told I can't do something, it makes me want to do it more." Here's where **** breaks down.... kids can be so bright but also be so ****ing *stubborn*. You have him talking about his "turbo" kit and his brand new tune features, this and that. He's missing the point, though. He's busy wasting his time, and energy, on trying to prove to people he's so smart and can add custom code to do all this special ****... but in terms of "Gonzo Tuning" he's still putting out work that is sloppy. 

Take a look at Arnold at Pagparts. Anyone who knows a little bit about him knows he does TONS of custom work. Always busy. But Arnold is smart, and he has a very small set of core things he's worked on perfecting... like his bottom mount v-band turbo kit. Think of all the threads you've seen where people look for advice on a BT kit... and think of how many times people have shouted out "v-band bottom mount from Pagparts". The kit itself can be customized a bunch of different ways, but at the core, it's a solid, well-engineered product with a clear focus and it can be built from there. This is how most people look at it... not a v-band manifold with a lot of options, but a *package* with a lot of options. 

Now, you have Gonzo showing us videos of a shift light and MFA stalk controlled launch control. Yo, that's great... but where are your CORE products? Unitronic has their stock 1.8T tunes, their Stage 2+ tunes, 630cc BT tune, etc. Eurodyne has a bunch of base maps and ****. APR has their maps, etc etc. Where are the *standard* Gonzo tunes? Tunes that have been consistently proven and show to work well? You've been so busy trying to prove that you can hang with the big boys, add custom code to ME7, etc etc, that you've entirely lost focus (IMO) on showing that you can concentrate on putting out a consistent product with documented and proven performance. Maybe it's just me, but I think it's real stupid to try and do every possible thing you can. Focus on one thing, perfect it, and move on. Add tweaks where necessary. 

In the case of this forum, you're never going to have much respect until you show us the finished, clean and consistent 1.8T work you've done. You wouldn't even have to troll or play along with the trolling if you spent some time to clean up your business image and release evidence of a really quality product. 

Seriously... if you want to prove us all wrong, if you love a challenge... do this.


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> /* Snip */


 Golf clap? Golf clap!


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> Now, you have Gonzo showing us videos of a shift light and MFA stalk controlled launch control. Yo, that's great... but where are your CORE products? Unitronic has their stock 1.8T tunes, their Stage 2+ tunes, 630cc BT tune, etc. Eurodyne has a bunch of base maps and ****. APR has their maps, etc etc. Where are the *standard* Gonzo tunes? Tunes that have been consistently proven and show to work well? You've been so busy trying to prove that you can hang with the big boys, add custom code to ME7, etc etc, that you've entirely lost focus (IMO) on showing that you can concentrate on putting out a consistent product with documented and proven performance. Maybe it's just me, but I think it's real stupid to try and do every possible thing you can. Focus on one thing, perfect it, and move on. Add tweaks where necessary.


 The "+" lineup of products (yes I said *lineup *and *products*, there is more coming soon) are going to the core products. *This is what will set Gonzo Tuning and other competitors apart*. I'm not going to give any more information until everything is ready to go, but now you know that I will be releasing a LINEUP of products, that fit in as an upgrade/and, or replace some products in my current lineup.

The video was meant to be a teaser to build up hype around Stage 2+. It wasn't made to wow the 1.8T Engine Forum on VWVortex.com. It was just a teaser for the masses of what is coming.

Hope that clears it up.

Edit: Happy 1000th post for me. Hurray! :thumbup:


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

^^^ weak sauce as usual. :laugh: 




rains said:


> have a good day at work, honey :heart:


 :screwy:


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Big_Tom said:


> ^^^ weak sauce as usual. :laugh:


 Upping your post count as usual.


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> See, here's what's really sad to me: kids these days are really bright. Not everyone is going to be studying quantum mechanics but kids are still really bright.
> 
> Here you have a kid like Gonzo, doing his little tuning thing. His original tune material and custom code material is highly questionable... but hey, ignoring that for a second, he can at least be intelligible when you speak to him. So, Gonzo is doing his thing, whatever, and decides to adopt the public motto of "I love being told I can't do something, it makes me want to do it more." Here's where **** breaks down.... kids can be so bright but also be so ****ing *stubborn*. You have him talking about his "turbo" kit and his brand new tune features, this and that. He's missing the point, though. He's busy wasting his time, and energy, on trying to prove to people he's so smart and can add custom code to do all this special ****... but in terms of "Gonzo Tuning" he's still putting out work that is sloppy.
> 
> ...


 
It's funny this is how you see things. I don't know Gonzo, nor do I know anything about his tunes. It sounds like he does a lot of custom tuning for people, not just generic files, although he probably has those as well. *BUT,* were you around when the first Revo file came out? Where you around when the first UNI files were out? How about Mike @ UNI learned how to tune on my car and many others. He was bashed for it and now he's a 'proven' tuner. 

This forum is such a joke. All you guys do is pile on people like a snowball effect because it's cool to make fun? Nobody asked you to run his SW. If you don't want it, then don't run it. It's plain and simple. This isn't hunger games...We are all here because we like to go fast and modify cars, period!


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Upping your post count as usual.


 yep ic:


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Also there is about 8 months worth of development that have gone onto the "+" lineup. I've been planning for and working on this for a long long time. Anybody who knows me knows this. I'm not trying to prove anything. I want just want to release some really good products.



18T_BT said:


> This forum is such a joke.


 Seriously. 

Anyways, I should have several dyno sheets soon. Stage 2+, GTT, GT3071R, GT28RS, PTE 50trim, and some MKV stuff too


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Upping your post count as usual.


 ZING!!:beer::thumbup:







18T_BT said:


> It's funny this is how you see things. I don't know Gonzo, nor do I know anything about his tunes. It sounds like he does a lot of custom tuning for people, not just generic files, although he probably has those as well. *BUT,* were you around when the first Revo file came out? Where you around when the first UNI files were out? How about Mike @ UNI learned how to tune on my car and many others. He was bashed for it and now he's a 'proven' tuner.
> 
> This forum is such a joke. All you guys do is pile on people like a snowball effect because it's cool to make fun? Nobody asked you to run his SW. If you don't want it, then don't run it. It's plain and simple. This isn't hunger games...We are all here because we like to go fast and modify cars, period!


 Can't really argue with any of these points :thumbup:








Big_Tom said:


> yep ic:


 Like a Boss:thumbup:







[email protected] said:


> Also there is about 8 months worth of development that have gone onto the "+" lineup. I've been planning for and working on this for a long long time. Anybody who knows me knows this. I'm not trying to prove anything. I want just want to release some really good products.
> 
> 
> Seriously.
> ...


 Cool Story Bro


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## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

18T_BT said:


> It's funny this is how you see things. I don't know Gonzo, nor do I know anything about his tunes. It sounds like he does a lot of custom tuning for people, not just generic files, although he probably has those as well. *BUT,* were you around when the first Revo file came out? Where you around when the first UNI files were out? How about Mike @ UNI learned how to tune on my car and many others. He was bashed for it and now he's a 'proven' tuner.
> 
> This forum is such a joke. All you guys do is pile on people like a snowball effect because it's cool to make fun? Nobody asked you to run his SW. If you don't want it, then don't run it. It's plain and simple. This isn't hunger games...We are all here because we like to go fast and modify cars, period!


 Exactly, we have all been here since day 1 in the 1.8t's "scene" i dont recognize a lot of these people now a days. 

Truth be told Revo/APR/Uni/Giac ALL HAD PROBLEMS , trust me i know and so does 18T_BT FIRST HAND. Gonzo does not appear to be having thread after thread with motor blew, runs like total crap on perfect hardware, etc. Most issues are hardware related, especially on higher mileage cars since the 1.8t is old news now, and i doubt you see many guys with a 1 year old car with 20k miles on them anymore...... 

People need to be realistic here, he's a new guy on the block, great, he's not blowing up cars, and his customers appear to be happy. 


I see a lot of bitching going on, and hating, but you have no idea how lucky you are to have OPTIONS of tuners now, people doing custom tuning! I dont see any major companies custom tuning on request for a reasonable amount of money? correct me if im wrong......This is the primary reason i started tuning 6 years ago, to learn to do it myself on my car's, to my liking, and not being stuck with a OTS tune. 

:screwy::screwy::screwy:


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

RaraK69 said:


> Exactly, we have all been here since day 1 in the 1.8t's "scene" i dont recognize a lot of these people now a days.
> 
> Truth be told Revo/APR/Uni/Giac ALL HAD PROBLEMS , trust me i know and so does 18T_BT FIRST HAND. Gonzo does not appear to be having thread after thread with motor blew, runs like total crap on perfect hardware, etc. Most issues are hardware related, especially on higher mileage cars since the 1.8t is old news now, and i doubt you see many guys with a 1 year old car with 20k miles on them anymore......
> 
> ...


 I've been on vortex since there was a legit off topic forum. over 10 years. I've owned 1.8T cars since they were new, always had one. 

In the end it is still crappy motronic, which when it works great it is AMAZING how great and smooth it can be. 

But when it does not? Yeah sensors that are bad when they are below thresholds for the ECU to trigger codes, complex logic involved in basic troubleshooting? Really? 

No wonder these cars are filling junkyards. 

You need an EE minor and a good scope to get anywhere with these things. 

People who really want a good tune? Yank off the DBW garbage, and go standalone. 

Either way, soon I think the Gonz will have a stranglehold on the market, baby.


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## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

gdoggmoney said:


> I've been on vortex since there was a legit off topic forum. over 10 years. I've owned 1.8T cars since they were new, always had one.
> 
> In the end it is still crappy motronic, which when it works great it is AMAZING how great and smooth it can be.
> 
> ...


 I 100% understand your point of view on the power and flexibility of standalone EMS, however i think you may be a bit close minded(no offense) in regards to Motronic. They each have their places in tuning, and in performance cars. 

They each have a TON of pros and cons each. The MAJOR ISSUE is that motronic systems are very hush hush. You need to spend countless hours, spend countless dollars, and log your ass off for a good tune, or spend $1500 on standalone, wire it, get a book on tuning(mr bell?) and hit the dyno. 

It just turns out to be simple ROI in the grand scheme of things. Its more efficient for someone to custom tune a vehicle to go standalone, period, and i 100% agree. However, there will be the other 99.7% of the public who will buy from a tuner a motronic tune. simply because its easiest, cheapest, gets you an OK tune, but no best necessarily, and everyones happy enough with it. If you get beyond the point where you question your tune*? and think it needs tweaks left and right, then you have crossed the line of a typical customer/consumer/car enthusiast and must move on to what you suggest or put the time in to custom tune motronic. 

*This is an assumption based on the proven tunes available on the market right now 


I would NEVER expect someone to take the time to learn motornic systems, and learn to tune them with various levels of hardware changes, and not expect to make a business out of it in some form . Its simply not worth it by a LOOOOOONG shot.


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

The best part that is missing from all this: 

Standalone = you aren't passing emissions/inspection unless you have obd1 and you are exempt from most of it and even then you have to find a way to pass like under 5k/year or something 

Motronic = go pass inspection even in Cali (there are some exceptions but mostly because people remove emissions control parts) and even then you'll usually pass inspection barring unusual circumstances and is one of the biggest reasons OEM tuning was/is such a hit across all cars not just VW's 

that's huge especially in a mk4 (unless you live in Ohio or Florida where there is no real emissions testing) since none of them are obd1


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

several more states dont have emissions, michigan,hawaii,parts of VA and MD, parts of colorado,montana, texas. 

just saying. 


i do find it funny, watching this place over hte last 13/14 years....hilarious... 

anyone remember the original lay out? i had a fukn dream about it the other day. was creepy.


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Vegeta Gti said:


> several more states dont have emissions, michigan,hawaii,parts of VA and MD, parts of colorado,montana, texas.
> 
> just saying.


 Most of them wont stay that way for long Chris.


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

i agree, hawaii, funny enough, doesnt give a damn. it thinks it will cost too much to start enforcing it because so many of the people are poor,etc. 

regardless, this threadopcorn:opcorn:


----------



## rains (May 30, 2008)

Big_Tom said:


> ^^^ weak sauce as usual. :laugh:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 ****ing roomates. Sorry Tom, I really need to lock my computer. They troll on my facebook, and apparantly this forum too, if it's left open.


----------



## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

man if you guys only knew the REAL story. lol.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

reflected said:


> man if you guys only knew the REAL story. lol.


 Come here and give me a hug, bro :heart:

You still got your 1.8T?


----------



## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

yep. still got the 1.8t and picked up a mk6 golf tdi 6spd a few weeks ago.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

reflected said:


> yep. still got the 1.8t and picked up a mk6 golf tdi 6spd a few weeks ago.


 You want a special test file for your 1.8T? It has some cool custom features I hear 

Talk to someone about tuning the MK6? I might be able to hook you up.


----------



## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

sure, send it over. give me a reason to drive it again. and i got a guy that can do me a mk6 tune.


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

RaraK69 said:


> I 100% understand your point of view on the power and flexibility of standalone EMS, however i think you may be a bit close minded(no offense) in regards to Motronic. They each have their places in tuning, and in performance cars.
> 
> They each have a TON of pros and cons each. The MAJOR ISSUE is that motronic systems are very hush hush. You need to spend countless hours, spend countless dollars, and log your ass off for a good tune, or spend $1500 on standalone, wire it, get a book on tuning(mr bell?) and hit the dyno.
> 
> ...


 I love you. No seriously, I have a skillbrocrush on you. 

You just make sense, don't talk yourself up or bull**** but it's quite obvious you really know what you are doing. 

That is just it, Motronic is radically different than anything else and as we know the documentation is meh, or german meh. 

So want to retune my ECU for 3651's and the associated airflow bumps?


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

reflected said:


> sure, send it over. give me a reason to drive it again. and i got a guy that can do me a mk6 tune.


 Send me your ori first.

And if that falls thru, I know someone that can tune it for ya


----------



## Cryser (Sep 9, 2009)

ME7 isn't THAT hard to understand and tune, but it's one of those things you have to just dive in head first and drown a bit before you can swim. There will never be an internet article or a book on it to teach you the system, trust me I tried. Not that I'm an amazing writer but there is just way to much to understand and explain in order to explain a single target map and people just won't read half the stuff anyway then get mad when something goes wrong even though it was explained in something they decided to pass over. 

A major problem with BT tunes that has cause so many issues is the America public absolute refusal to use the damn MAF sensor. That is causing SO many problems in SO many peoples tunes it's not even funny. You simply CAN NOT plot out an airflow table to match every location let alone all the various temps, air density, etc etc that people are going to encountering DDing a car across the county. That's only one of the tables that needs to tweaked by going MAFLESS, your gonna be constantly tweaking tables and have to basically reload a need tune every time you start the car. 

IF/When more BT people finally realize that a MAF can help greatly for a DD car a sincerely feel a lot of the issue people have with part throttle will begin to disappear. MAFLESS tunes are great for drag cars and car that are gonna be at WOT all the time, other then that there is great amount of power being left on the table by not using a MAF sensor.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Cryser said:


> ME7 isn't THAT hard to understand and tune


 I agree. The people who usually whine is the people who don't put in the time or effort, or are looking for a free lunch.



Cryser said:


> A major problem with BT tunes that has cause so many issues is the America public absolute refusal to use the damn MAF sensor


 I agree again. If your MAF sensor is breaking too often, either A. your filter sucks or B. you are maxing it out and need a bigger housing.

I offer MAFless tunes because everyone wants one. That's the only reason I do it.


----------



## ridemyfast (Jul 18, 2010)

whats with all the hate towards gonzo? ive heard nothing but good things about his tune. i was going to try it out to see if it was any better than uni. the only reason i didnt is because i sent an email about 6 or so months ago asking the benefits of his tune over uni besides the 3 psi of boost and didnt get a response back


----------



## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Send me your ori first.
> 
> And if that falls thru, I know someone that can tune it for ya


 replied to your text message. and i have a feeling me and you know the same people.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

reflected said:


> replied to your text message. and i have a feeling me and you know the same people.


 I sent you a BIN


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

Vortex wasn't always like this. I just think it's bored....there isn't much going on anymore since all the companies have moved on to the FSI motors. I've stayed away for a while, but I figured I'm going to breath new life to my old setup....so I'm on the tex a lot more now. 
I think it's great that Gonzo can provide his services. Since the 1.8t is old news, I'd like to see prices come down more....so if Gonzo can offer his services for cheaper but keep the quality on par, more power to him.


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

T-Boy said:


> Vortex wasn't always like this. I just think it's bored....there isn't much going on anymore since all the companies have moved on to the FSI motors. I've stayed away for a while, but I figured I'm going to breath new life to my old setup....so I'm on the tex a lot more now.
> I think it's great that Gonzo can provide his services. Since the 1.8t is old news, I'd like to see prices come down more....so if Gonzo can offer his services for cheaper but keep the quality on par, more power to him.


 I agree. I've been on this forum for 10 years and have seen a lot of attitude shifts, and a lot of vendors come and go. I have talked to Gonzo, and his head is definitely in the right place. New products for a stale platform should be encouraged in any form, and honestly I don't know why anyone would try to discourage innovation. If you're going to pick on someone, why not choose a target like APR who is marketing a $300 carbon fiber intake for the CR TDI that makes a +0 HP gain? Perhaps it's because the little guy is always the easier target...


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

apr, good, solid software, horribly over priced hardware.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

4ceFed4 said:


> I agree. I've been on this forum for 10 years and have seen a lot of attitude shifts, and a lot of vendors come and go. I have talked to Gonzo, and his head is definitely in the right place. New products for a stale platform should be encouraged in any form, and honestly I don't know why anyone would try to discourage innovation. If you're going to pick on someone, why not choose a target like APR who is marketing a $300 carbon fiber intake for the CR TDI that makes a +0 HP gain? Perhaps it's because the little guy is always the easier target...


 :laugh: shows how often you visit the 1.8T technical forum..

We pretty much ran APR out of that forum on a rail for their lack of support to their existing customers, as well as abandoning the platform

The Gonzo dissing comes from posts that he made less than a year ago which were noob to the Max, where he aquired many of his tunes, and the fact that he was banned from the forum a few times for being an asshat and selling pirated software without paying to advertise.

Don't get me started on "supporting the little guy"; as I've supported Chris Tapp (eurodyne), who is an innovator, and offered the the only user tunable me7 system, as well as 2 step, and no lift shift a couple years before Gonzo.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> :laugh: shows how often you visit the 1.8T technical forum..
> 
> We pretty much ran APR out of that forum on a rail for their lack of support to their existing customers, as well as abandoning the platform
> 
> ...


 :beer: that gtt turbo thread is all the proof one needs. 25+ psi in neutral lol


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Big_Tom said:


> :beer: that gtt turbo thread is all the proof one needs. 25+ psi in neutral lol


 Brake boosting in the driveway FTMFW:thumbup::beer:


----------



## misternoob (Oct 25, 2009)

odonnejl said:


> Hello fellow dubbers,
> 
> I know there has been countless threads about this but I'm looking for some honest opinions from people running the tune and what everything thinks about me wanting his stage 2 with my GTI having 160,000 on it. The engine is completely stock besides a 3 inch straight pipe from the turbo back no cat, intake, and 007 diverter valve. Gonzo is claiming his stage 2 programing ups the boost to 21 lbs. I'm pretty leary of doing this and want to know what everyone thinks.
> 
> ...


 To help answer your question: 

Gonzo's tune is great. Launch control is fun especially with LSD. I never had a single issue with the tune. It has been running great since it was flashed. I recently traded the car and he loves it. To give you an idea I had APR and REVO Stage 2. Neither of those tunes were bad it just so happened that I enjoyed Gonzo's tune much more and felt that I got more out of it. If given the choice I would go with Gonzo again and I do plan to. 

I always recommend Gonzo. The price is extremely reasonable and you get great options. The customer support is just as good and that in itself is something to consider. I have not seen other tuners openly offer that you send them logs to see if there is an opportunity to get more out of it. 
:beer:


----------



## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

misternoob said:


> To help answer your question:
> 
> Gonzo's tune is great. Launch control is fun especially with LSD. I never had a single issue with the tune. It has been running great since it was flashed. I recently traded the car and the PO loves it. To give you an idea I had APR and REVO Stage 2. Neither of those tunes were bad it just so happened that I enjoyed Gonzo's tune much more and felt that I got more out of it. If given the choice I would go with Gonzo again and I do plan to.
> 
> ...


 Malone Tuning has been doing this since he offered up 1.8T tunes, and presumably the same thing for his TDI customers. He has gotten his fair share of **** for being backed up beyond belief, but again... a lot of people here getting all "wow" over imaginary "firsts".


----------



## misternoob (Oct 25, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Malone Tuning has been doing this since he offered up 1.8T tunes, and presumably the same thing for his TDI customers. He has gotten his fair share of **** for being backed up beyond belief, but again... *a lot of people here getting all "wow" over imaginary "firsts"* .


 I guess it's a rite of passage. Either way it doesnt take away from his tunes. 

Launch control isnt new- N2MB provides this option ($150+ but no tune) and Eurodyne has it as well but thats with the purchase of a $800+ tune (which is custom). But it is a "first" for a "basic tune" under $400 to provide so many different options. (Dont take this the wrong way) But it is not too different than your emissions delete resistors. Resistors arent new BUT the way in which you implement them is. I am all for supporting the underdog/little guy/etc. especially if the product is and does what it says it can do.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

*misternoob*, swing by and lets tune your TT. I will hook you up with some custom code


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## misternoob (Oct 25, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> *misternoob*, swing by and lets tune your TT. I will hook you up with some custom code


 :thumbup: once the lady goes on vacation I'll take a ride down there and get the tune. I havent been on a quad/atv since last year so all the more reason. 

:thumbup:


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

misternoob said:


> :thumbup: once the lady goes on vacation I'll take a ride down there and get the tune. I havent been on a quad/atv since last year so all the more reason.
> 
> :thumbup:


 I broke my elbow in December so I haven't been on a quad since then :laugh:

Sounds good :thumbup:


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## bbjetta87 (Jun 21, 2009)

ive had gonzos tunes since march of last year, ( have the emails to prove it) and have never had a single issue with his tune. Ive been testing his 2+ since november and am 100% impressed with his work. im always out to help the little guy in life and think what hes doing is phenomenal. the 1.8t is becoming a very aged platform and i think that his custom coding hes been doing is amazing. I would be the first to tell you that something is garbage and i promise you that theres no disappointment. :thumbup:gonzo:thumbup:


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## Killathrilla (Sep 21, 2011)

Have stage 2, :thumbup: does exactly what i want it to do. I'm going to buy 2+ when it comes out. 

Rather give my dollars to this guy doing things today then the guys that did it years ago and mark it up because their names on it. :beer:


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## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

reflected said:


> man if you guys only knew the real story. Lol.


 01010111 01100101 01101100 01100011 01101111 01101101 01100101 00100000 01000010 01100001 01100011 01101011 00100001  



RaraK69 said:


> I would NEVER expect someone to take the time to learn motornic systems, and learn to tune them with various levels of hardware changes, and not expect to make a business out of it in some form .


 This. 


18T_BT said:


> It's funny this is how you see things. I don't know Gonzo, nor do I know anything about his tunes. It sounds like he does a lot of custom tuning for people, not just generic files, although he probably has those as well. *BUT,* were you around when the first Revo file came out? Where you around when the first UNI files were out? How about Mike @ UNI learned how to tune on my car and many others. He was bashed for it and now he's a 'proven' tuner.


 and this :thumbup: 
I lobbied to create the Motronic Tuning forum (CLICK HERE) and after 200 Votes we got the forum created....and after 6 months had to move over to another forum . Activity became dead because those who knew didnt share and those who shared got told not to share. 
I do not condone nor care how Gonzo first started out in the industry but that is a mute point at this stage of the game. Last I checked no Bosch Motronic Engineer's were active members of this forum and it is clear (to me) that Gonzo has invested the time , energy and effort into understanding Motronic so until a personal from Bosch comes in and gives his opinion then we can either : 


Ignore him 

Support him 

do what he did , learn motronic and become his competitor 

 

Choose which you wish to do. 
Just my 2 cents.


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## Mindfault (Feb 2, 2010)

My car now Idles smooth. and dont be quick to say u walked on me kevin, i had a tune for stock head, cams and rev limiter, and my turbo is too big :-( i am down to give er a pull on the highway though :laugh: but yeh, shes a hardened criminal now, shes finally outta jail. i missed my car sneezing this whole time. make me a manifold for the vr so i can twin charge it


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

INA said:


> 01010111 01100101 01101100 01100011 01101111 01101101 01100101 00100000 01000010 01100001 01100011 01101011 00100001


 haha. thanks. :beer:


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

reflected said:


> haha. thanks. :beer:


You were gone a while.


----------



## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

i was never gone, just never posted.


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

reflected said:


> i was never gone, just never posted.


5768792c2062656361757365207468697320706c61636520697320646561643f2053696e63652077652061726520686176696e6720616c6c2074686973206d6174682066756e2077697468206c6574746572732e


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

eh, idk. just never really felt like posting anything. and i didnt have new to post either. saw this thread, saw everyone going back and forth, and figured id stir the pot a little bit. but no one really noticed my comment either though.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

reflected said:


> eh, idk. just never really felt like posting anything. and i didnt have new to post either. saw this thread, saw everyone going back and forth, and figured id *stir the pot a little bit*. but no one really noticed my comment either though.


 I see it how it is


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> I see it how it is


hey, just like guy up there said, its been a little boring in here.


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## ejg3855 (Sep 23, 2004)

Cryser said:


> IF/When more BT people finally realize that a MAF can help greatly for a DD car a sincerely feel a lot of the issue people have with part throttle will begin to disappear. MAFLESS tunes are great for drag cars and car that are gonna be at WOT all the time, other then that there is great amount of power being left on the table by not using a MAF sensor.


I agree with this too except that its the fixation on using a pre-turbo maf. 

I am running blow-thru and we are progressing with the fine-tuning of it. Much better data with the MAF being 6" from the throttle body, not susceptible to boost leaks, etc.


----------



## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

ejg3855 said:


> I agree with this too except that its the fixation on using a pre-turbo maf.
> 
> I am running blow-thru and we are progressing with the fine-tuning of it. Much better data with the MAF being 6" from the throttle body, not susceptible to boost leaks, etc.


What are the major tuning differences? Curious to learn about blow-thru setups on ME7.


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

ejg3855 said:


> I agree with this too except that its the fixation on using a pre-turbo maf.
> 
> I am running blow-thru and we are progressing with the fine-tuning of it. Much better data with the MAF being 6" from the throttle body, not susceptible to boost leaks, etc.


I like the way you think.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

ejg3855 said:


> I agree with this too except that its the fixation on using a pre-turbo maf.
> 
> I am running blow-thru and we are progressing with the fine-tuning of it. Much better data with the MAF being 6" from the throttle body, not susceptible to boost leaks, etc.


THIS has my attention:beer:







[email protected] said:


> What are the major tuning differences? Curious to learn about blow-thru setups on ME7.


^^^ What he said


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Blow-thru is nothing new. I have discussed this with a few people on this thread before.
Its possible, but there is a lot of calibration work involved.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Blow-thru is nothing new. I have discussed this with a few people on this thread before.
> Its possible, but there is a lot of calibration work involved.


I know its not new, but it is unheard of on me7 dude.

Wanna silence your troll squad once and for all? Here's your chance buddy! Do something new:thumbup: 

Blow through maf FTW:thumbup::thumbup:


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> I know its not new, but it is unheard of on me7 dude.


 Its been done on ME7 before...
If I ever get a turbo 24v, that will be what I'll be using.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Its been done on ME7 before...
> If I ever get a turbo 24v, that will be what I'll be using.


By who? And we need a 18t blow through tune... do it..


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> By who? And we need a 18t blow through tune... do it..


he won't do it. usually creating something "NEW" involves real work :laugh:


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Tuning for a blow-thru setup is not something you would want to tune for remotely. If someone wants to step up and come get tuned at my shop, its on.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Tuning for a blow-thru setup is not something you would want to tune for remotely. If someone wants to step up and come get tuned at my shop, its on.


why cant u use one of ur test cars?


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Big_Tom said:


> why cant u use one of ur test cars?


I have no need for a blow-thru setup.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

ha, ok. :laugh:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> I have no idea how to tune for a blow-thru setup.


 :sly:


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

What advantage would a blow through set up have on our cars?


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

T-Boy said:


> What advantage would a blow through set up have on our cars?


More accurate readings.


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> More accurate readings.


Is the 1.8t plagued with inaccurate MAF readings? I feel that they just have crappy sensors...come up with a better MAF. No?


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

T-Boy said:


> Is the 1.8t plagued with inaccurate MAF readings? I feel that they just have crappy sensors...come up with a better MAF. No?


Think outside the box buddy, and forget about the fact that its a "1.8T", because that doesn't matter. Its a Turbo engine; bottom line. 

The maf on these cars is placed right after the air inlet. After the maf, it passes through a glowing hot turbocharger which superheats the air which makes the molecules less dense, then it travels through a few feet of tubing and couplers (which can leak) to an intercooler (which can leak) that lowers the temperature (but not back to ambient), again raising the density of the air(although not usually as dense as it went in), and then through several more feet of charge piping, and couplers(that can leak), into the throttle body, and then into the intake manifold, where it finally passes into the combustion chambers.

^^^notice all the variables AFTER the air is metered by the maf? The system ATTEMPTS to correct for these variables using the IAT sensor, primary o2, map, etc., but at the end of the day there are too many variables to guarantee a 100% accurate maf correction. If the maf is placed instead near the throttle body, you're now eliminating all of those variables, and getting a 100% accurate reading of "mass air flow"...

Consequently this reading will be unaffected by pressure differentials, tiny vacuum/boost leaks, temperature changes, etc. Now the maf can be used as a much more accurate link in the chain of sensors, which comprise the engine management 'system'; allowing a much higher 'collective' degree of accuracy, within the sum of the control readings produced via the sensors in the system.

Many other marques, and tuning circles have used blow through systems to great success for a long time. Our market hasn't seen it yet; due to the collective laziness of most tuners, and their only wanting to make simple 'tweaks' to the factory settings within the me7 ecu to "just make things work". 

Heck; the early GIAC, REVO, APR BT tunes relied mostly on just a larger maf housing, to "trick" the factory ecu into thinking it was seeing much lower air volume than reality, in order to "trick" the ecu into firing larger than stock injectors.

Later we progressed, or regressed(depending on how you look at it) into mafless tunes, which leave something to be desired as they cut a part of the data chain out of the equation.

IMO a blow through system would be the best of all worlds so to speak.


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Think outside the box buddy, and forget about the fact that its a "1.8T", because that doesn't matter. Its a Turbo engine; bottom line.
> 
> The maf on these cars is placed right after the air inlet. After the maf, it passes through a glowing hot turbocharger which superheats the air which makes the molecules less dense, then it travels through a few feet of tubing and couplers (which can leak) to an intercooler (which can leak) that lowers the temperature (but not back to ambient), again raising the density of the air(although not usually as dense as it went in), and then through several more feet of charge piping, and couplers(that can leak), into the throttle body, and then into the intake manifold, where it finally passes into the combustion chambers.
> 
> ...


Does the MAF measure Volume or Density of air? 
The same amount of air that passes through the MAF is the same amount of air that gets to the engine....that doesn't change regardless of how many turbos and intercooler it passes.
Not arguing with you, just truely want to know why blow through is such a big deal. :thumbup:

I'd also rather the car run crappy when I have leaks to let me know it needs fixing. If you run a blow through and is not complaining of leaks, you just roll around not knowing of the leaks when it happens.


----------



## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Think outside the box buddy, and forget about the fact that its a "1.8T", because that doesn't matter. Its a Turbo engine; bottom line.
> 
> The maf on these cars is placed right after the air inlet. After the maf, it passes through a glowing hot turbocharger which superheats the air which makes the molecules less dense, then it travels through a few feet of tubing and couplers (which can leak) to an intercooler (which can leak) that lowers the temperature (but not back to ambient), again raising the density of the air(although not usually as dense as it went in), and then through several more feet of charge piping, and couplers(that can leak), into the throttle body, and then into the intake manifold, where it finally passes into the combustion chambers.
> 
> ...


The ME7 model is very comprehensive.... and its modelled engine characteristics are very impressive... Once others dip in and adjust "stuff" without neccessarily knowing or caring about the model, then issues can occur... 

Its a complex beastie..

starting with the torque request from the pedal... and then the rest is "Magic"


----------



## Marcus_Aurelius (Mar 1, 2012)

Blow through set up is nice if calibrated properly. You have much better accuracy and most importantly *consistency* (being placed in a spot that is immune to filter turbulence and a host of other things). I have ran my DSMs and EVOs in blow through set up so I have some experience with them, the nicest thing after the conversion was that values would stay consistent almost to the decimals run after run (try replicating the exact same values back to back on a conventional MAF configuration). 

With that said, there is always the risk of not calibrating properly. So at the end, your setup is as good as the tuner. I have seen people doing the conversion in the EVO world and be all excited but coming back scratching their head and bashing "blow through" because they made less power. Personally, I would not go through the trouble if it's not needed (90% of cars don't need it). The whole point behind the idea is to get pinpoint accuracy to push the tune to the ragged edge safely. How many in this discussion are chasing MBT and flirting with the limit of pumping loss and stretched head bolts? If you don't fit that profile, don't bother. As far as I know even the tuners or tooners for that matter don't even know how to get that close to the limits in this community (that is why I don't even use a tuning company even without Maestro, although I probably have the nastiest K04 1.8t ever built).

What would be nice is a speed density set up but that an entirely new discussion in itself!


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

T-Boy said:


> Does the MAF measure Volume or Density of air?
> The same amount of air that passes through the MAF is the same amount of air that gets to the engine....that doesn't change regardless of how many turbos and intercooler it passes.
> Not arguing with you, just truely want to know why blow through is such a big deal. :thumbup:
> 
> I'd also rather the car run crappy when I have leaks to let me know it needs fixing. If you run a blow through and is not complaining of leaks, you just roll around not knowing of the leaks when it happens.


A maf relays information to the ecu by current being run through a wire, that wire is then cooled at varying degrees depending on the both the volume, and density of the air passing over it; which in turn varies the ohms or resistance of the current passing through the wire. These (ohms) are then read by the ecu to determine the readings. Both air volume, and density over the heated wire will will affect the cooling of it. 

So to answer your first question it calculates both density, and volume; as a heated wire doesn't (know) which is affecting its cooling, and said resistance.

Accuracy is the key here. Its the same logic that's used in placement of an egt probe, or a wideband o2 sensor as close as possible to the exhaust manifold; to get as accurate of a reading as possible.

Blow through systems are better, more accurate, and used by many other tuning circles that are FAR more evolved than our own.

We are the ones that are behind on this one. Your statement about leaving accuracy on the table in lieu of using the maf as an impromptu leak detector is moot IMO. Thats what regular pressure testing is for...


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> A maf relays information to the ecu by current being run through a wire, that wire is then cooled at varying degrees depending on the both the volume, and density of the air passing over it; which in turn varies the ohms or resistance of the current passing through the wire. These (ohms) are then read by the ecu to determine the readings. Both air volume, and density over the heated wire will will affect the cooling of it.
> 
> So to answer your first question it calculates both density, and volume; as a heated wire doesn't (know) which is affecting its cooling, and said resistance.
> 
> ...


Seems you're after all out performance then. If that's the case then I can see exploring all avanues like blow through. I just can't see this setup being implemented on a daily driver....maybe it's because I don't see the whole picture. :beer:


----------



## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

T-Boy said:


> Seems you're after all out performance then. If that's the case then I can see exploring all avanues like blow through. I just can't see this setup being implemented on a daily driver....maybe it's because I don't see the whole picture. :beer:


Well, it helps with performance as well as daily driving. Since, it's a bit more accurate on a blow through your tip in values will be more accurate, so your part throttle will be better callibrated etc..


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

18T_BT said:


> Well, it helps with performance as well as daily driving. Since, it's a bit more accurate on a blow through your tip in values will be more accurate, so your part throttle will be better callibrated etc..


Gotcha....makes sense. :thumbup:


Thanks guys for the blow through lesson. :thumbup:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

T-Boy said:


> Seems you're after all out performance then. If that's the case then I can see exploring all avanues like blow through. I just can't see this setup being implemented on a daily driver....maybe it's because I don't see the whole picture. :beer:









18T_BT said:


> Well, it helps with performance as well as daily driving. Since, it's a bit more accurate on a blow through your tip in values will be more accurate, so your part throttle will be better callibrated etc..


^^^^ what he said:beer:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> :sly:


:laugh::thumbup:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Big_Tom said:


> :laugh::thumbup:


:wave:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> :wave:


:wave: :beer::beer:


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

What about water meth with a blow through design? Seems it would lead to either direct port or post tb only. Leaving out the room needed to really give the first jet room to cool the charge. Obviously you wouldn't want to spray wm into a maf? 

Don't really care about blow through, but as much as we use wm on 1.8t's it seems like a total overhaul of the pipes to welded instead of couplers where possible, rewiring the maf / extending, obvious tuning and loss of wm or a complete remodeling of the previous setup. Seems like a lot of trouble where it's not necessary for most of the public. If it were, wouldn't uni, tapp, apr, etc. be making them for their bt programs?:wave:


----------



## Marcus_Aurelius (Mar 1, 2012)

DMVDUB said:


> What about water meth with a blow through design? Seems it would lead to either direct port or post tb only. Leaving out the room needed to really give the first jet room to cool the charge. Obviously you wouldn't want to spray wm into a maf?
> 
> Don't really care about blow through, but as much as we use wm on 1.8t's it seems like a total overhaul of the pipes to welded instead of couplers where possible, rewiring the maf / extending, obvious tuning and loss of wm or a complete remodeling of the previous setup. Seems like a lot of trouble where it's not necessary for most of the public. If it were, wouldn't uni, tapp, apr, etc. be making them for their bt programs?:wave:


If you really want to run a blow through setup, Water/Meth injection should not be a problem. Just run post TB or direct port for in-cylinder cooling, and appropriately sized nozzles far enough downstream of the sensor that the spray is fully atomized when reaching the nozzle. If this is a problem for anyone to make work, they should not be modifying cars at all.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Tuning for a blow-thru setup is nothing short of a PITA. That's the main reason almost nobody does it. That, and that mass producing tunes for ProM-MAF is not feasible.

Lots of people here are talking about blow-thru this and blow-thru that, but who's gonna step up and actually go thru it? Someone step up already


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> Tuning for a blow-thru setup is nothing short of a PITA. That's the main reason almost nobody does it. That, and that mass producing tunes for ProM-MAF is not feasible.
> 
> Lots of people here are talking about blow-thru this and blow-thru that, but who's gonna step up and actually go thru it? Someone step up already


You're the supa tuna....tune a blow thru and show us how it's done.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

T-Boy said:


> You're the supa tuna....tune a blow thru and show us how it's done.


 Come hea with your supa build and let's go :thumbup:


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

I guess my real concern isn't the how but the if. Wouldn't the maf be subjected to the vapor in the tract and the possibility of being soaked if there is compressor surge, or when the bov or dv releases. I guess direct port is the answer to that problem though


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> Come hea with your supa build and let's go :thumbup:


I don't have a supa build to bring to you.:beer:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

DMVDUB said:


> I guess my real concern isn't the how but the if. Wouldn't the maf be subjected to the vapor in the tract and the possibility of being soaked if there is compressor surge, or when the bov or dv releases. I guess direct port is the answer to that problem though


Id say your adding an extra variable with the w/m that doesn't even need to be considered at this stage. First order of business would be addressing the obvious corrections that are coded in due to the factory maf placement (iat, etc). Before anyone says it, im aware that this will be more complex in me7 than im explaining it, since me7 cross references EVERYTHING, but it shouldn't be the most difficult thing to accomplish either. 

It would be nice if Chris Tapp, or Guy Frieling would chime in on this; as it would be nice to have at least a cursery understanding of some possible ecu intervention that we might not otherwise think of.

Gonzo this is your que buddy


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Its not hard, its just the work involved that makes it tedious. There is nothing in ME7 stopping you from doing this. Absolutely nothing.

There is really no incentive for any tuner to do a blow-thru tune when they already have regular 630cc, 830cc, 1000cc tunes that work perfectly. That's why its not common. Its been done before because I have seen it.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Gonzo this is your que buddy


this. i doubt he'll step up to the plate ic:


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Big_Tom said:


> this. i doubt he'll step up to the plate ic:


 Come up here and let's go buddy. Then you can take all the pictures you want.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Come up here and let's go buddy. Then you can take all the pictures you want.


I'll pass :wave:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Its not hard, its just the work involved that makes it tedious. There is nothing in ME7 stopping you from doing this. Absolutely nothing.
> 
> There is really no incentive for any tuner to do a blow-thru tune when they already have regular 630cc, 830cc, 1000cc tunes that work perfectly. That's why its not common. Its been done before because I have seen it.


Who did this? And where did you see it? It would be nice to hear from someone who's done it.

Im well aware that its not "necessary" for any particular application, but there's part of me that thinks me7 might be a bit more.. I dunno.. "cooperative" if we eliminated or minimized some of the "cross checking" in the code, by gaining much more precise maf readings. 

The reasoning behind my train of thought is; since we are better off using the maf in general with regards to throttle tip in, and part throttle drivability. Wouldn't we be that much better off, if we climbed to yet another plateau of accuracy??

Your thoughts?


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Who did this? And where did you see it? It would be nice to hear from someone who's done it.
> 
> Im well aware that its not "necessary" for any particular application, but there's part of me that thinks me7 might be a bit more.. I dunno.. "cooperative" if we eliminated or minimized some of the "cross checking" in the code, by gaining much more precise maf readings.
> 
> ...


He doesn't think that deep bro  he want to add tons of "new" mad tight features. i'm guessing next will be push to start from drivers window switch


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Big_Tom said:


> He doesn't think that deep bro  he want to add tons of "new" mad tight features


Meh.. Im giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one If he REALLY understands me7 the way he says he does; he should be able to somewhat accurately explain which maps need to be altered, or disabled in order to accomplish this.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

somebody get him a car to do this so we can have this blow thru already


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

Good lord this thread actually went somewhere intelligent and all we get from Tom is some more sh1t talking. Why waste everyone's time when everyone else is actually addressing a subject that some people are obviously interested in. 

You make cracks about mad tight features... I think everyone agreed that adjustable launch control was a good job. Are going to claim he stole that code from you cat or some other obscene crap. Obviously he has to know something about the workings of me7 sine NOBODY has that feature. The closest thing is apr and still it's completely different. :wave:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

DMVDUB said:


> Good lord this thread actually went somewhere intelligent and all we get from Tom is some more sh1t talking. Why waste everyone's time when everyone else is actually addressing a subject that some people are obviously interested in.
> 
> You make cracks about mad tight features... I think everyone agreed that adjustable launch control was a good job. Are going to claim he stole that code from you cat or some other obscene crap. Obviously he has to know something about the workings of me7 sine NOBODY has that feature. The closest thing is apr and still it's completely different. :wave:


yeah he stole all of his tunes and features from me :laugh: :screwy:


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Higher accuracy is not gonna majorly improve throttle response. When you have tuners out there that do not know how to properly tune the optimal torque map and try to disable torque monitoring because they keep on running into torque exceeded codes, the first thing to do in that case is to learn how to properly rescale said map to get smooth throttle response. Then blow-thru might make a difference in throttle response. There is other pros to blow-thru, but you talked about throttle response.

A MAF is a MAF. If you rescale it and calibrate it properly, ME7 will not care. Everyone acts like ME7 is some big nasty monster that throws fits left and right, when its really not that way at all.


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

It does seem like a lot of platforms are using this design on supercharged and turbo apps though. Tradstone even makes blow through pipes.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Higher accuracy is not gonna majorly improve throttle response. When you have tuners out there that do not know how to properly tune the optimal torque map and try to disable torque monitoring because they keep on running into torque exceeded codes, the first thing to do in that case is to learn how to properly rescale said map to get smooth throttle response. Then blow-thru might make a difference in throttle response. There is other pros to blow-thru, but you talked about throttle response.
> 
> A MAF is a MAF. If you rescale it and calibrate it properly, ME7 will not care. Everyone acts like ME7 is some big nasty monster that throws fits left and right, when its really not that way at all.


I personally like me7, and understand the fickle nature of it to a reasonable degree. Enough so anyway, that I NEVER personally ran into issues with it.

The maps run in a 4 dimensional spectrum (for lack of a better term), in such a way that several maps, and their corresponding 'axi' "run into" eachother on six different planes, in such a way that if the seperate planes where the maps bisect dont "line up", the ecu will become 'confused'.

Simply put; you must move the entire box, not just an individual panel. If you attempt to move one panel, while keeping the others stationary the box will tear, and be rendered essentially useless.

This "box" can be squeezed and manipulated like a 'spongy' parallelagram. 

The question is....

Which of the (6) panels would YOU start with?


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back. You take the blue pill - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill - you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

LOL 4th dimension :laugh:

What's next? Holes in timing maps?


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> LOL 4th dimension :laugh:
> 
> What's next? Holes in timing maps?


Of course there's 4 dimensions; because it can all be folded in on itself depending on which axi you move, and where. YOU should know this. The maps do NOT exist on a flat, 2 dimensional plane, or even in a traditional 3 dimensional perspective; as the maps are moved, or manipulated; other maps that bisect are altered causing another set of consequences on a different plane (referencing correction, in another set of maps)

Which map would you adjust FIRST, and then which map will HAVE to be moved next; in order to keep things in 'sync'?


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

If that's all you could come up with to save face, I'm out. Later.

Edit: You can't call shared axises between maps '4th dimensional'. If you change a shared axis, its easy to know which other maps are affected by said axis and fix the maps accordingly. Please go away.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> If that's all you could come up with to save face, I'm out. Later.


Then how would YOU describe the way all of these maps bisect Mr cartooner??

I attempted to explain, or paint a picture of how all the mapping bisects inside the me7 code. You have NEVER even touched on anything even remotely technical; because YOU obviously look at the code in 2 dimensions. (Assuming you even understand it that deeply)


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Okay.


----------



## BoostedGLS0218 (Dec 10, 2011)

Gonzo you want to tune my car for a blow-by
Just give me a loaner


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

BoostedGLS0218 said:


> Gonzo you want to tune my car for a blow-by
> Just give me a loaner


:beer:


----------



## Cryser (Sep 9, 2009)

okay, so I would be actually interested in trying to tune for a blow through MAF, that is once I get my cable back from Arnold and I have my new engine in and running to a good degree with the standard MAF configuration.

I will have to thing about it some more but really once you got the MAF scaled correctly in terms of size and correct sensor the only other maps I could see that would need tweaking would be Optimal Torque and MAF correction, maybe injection correction.

Anyway I guess I'll start researching how the evo guys are doing it and what they are changing and see if I can come up with some way to transfer that over to the ME7 platform, once I get some time after finals and get myself settled down from the engine build 

If anyone has good informational sites or book concerning they subject they would like to share I would appreciate the PMs to at least have a place to start.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Injection correction shouldn't need to be touched.

In other news, I have new launch control code:





No more nasty (ricer) backfires. N75 is plugged in, no tricks.


----------



## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Then how would YOU describe the way all of these maps bisect Mr cartooner??
> 
> I attempted to explain, or paint a picture of how all the mapping bisects inside the me7 code. You have NEVER even touched on anything even remotely technical; because YOU obviously look at the code in 2 dimensions. (Assuming you even understand it that deeply)


MEception? 

I see your point of view with interaction between maps, its a good theory, but in code and reality, this does NOT work this way. Ecu grabs inputs for calculations from the maps and runs it through high/low pass filters depending on the function, takes that value, multiplies by a correction(one or more depending on exact switches(ie. iat , rpm, etc)) all kinda of functions like this. 

Its just computer code man, you grab these inputs, then there is a switch to where that data flows, and math is done on the data and you eventually reach your output value for what the car will do.


Honestly, mind will be blown if you read through some of the functions and actually disassembled the c16x code to assembly, or even psuedo code/C. Then you will see what im saying.

I would be more than happy to post up a sample function, but im sure you can go find your own on nefmoto site since it was made freely available a while back.


----------



## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Then how would YOU describe the way all of these maps bisect Mr cartooner??
> 
> I attempted to explain, or paint a picture of how all the mapping bisects inside the me7 code. You have NEVER even touched on anything even remotely technical; because YOU obviously look at the code in 2 dimensions. (Assuming you even understand it that deeply)


the code is in hex.. is that 2d enough for you

have a nice look at winols demo and see what it "actually" does
:thumbup:


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

Originally Posted by dubinsincuwereindiapers 
Then how would YOU describe the way all of these maps bisect Mr cartooner??

I attempted to explain, or paint a picture of how all the mapping bisects inside the me7 code. You have NEVER even touched on anything even remotely technical; because YOU obviously look at the code in 2 dimensions. (Assuming you even understand it that deeply) 


Posted by badger5
the code is in hex.. is that 2d enough for you

have a nice look at winols demo and see what it "actually" does

opcorn::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

Yep, those .bin files and hex codes are sure fourth dimensional... You play them on your radio and you'll go back in time too. Obvious comment from someone who has never actually looked at the code in OLS. It's not all Maestro's pretty graph layouts. Not even tuner pro looks "4d".


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

RaraK69 said:


> MEception?
> 
> I see your point of view with interaction between maps, its a good theory, but in code and reality, this does NOT work this way. Ecu grabs inputs for calculations from the maps and runs it through high/low pass filters depending on the function, takes that value, multiplies by a correction(one or more depending on exact switches(ie. iat , rpm, etc)) all kinda of functions like this.
> 
> ...


assembly language :thumbup: thats one of the languages i speak


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

DMVDUB said:


> Originally Posted by dubinsincuwereindiapers
> Then how would YOU describe the way all of these maps bisect Mr cartooner??
> 
> I attempted to explain, or paint a picture of how all the mapping bisects inside the me7 code. You have NEVER even touched on anything even remotely technical; because YOU obviously look at the code in 2 dimensions. (Assuming you even understand it that deeply)
> ...


STFU you annoying twit. I was merely explaining how the maps interrelate to one another in an imaginary visual context, so MAYBE guys can sorta wrap their brains around it

Now I've got your corny ass, who showed up on the scene a year ago, posting dumb ass threads about shít that was done ten years ago, to guys who've ALREADY done it, as if you've discovered something

Search function/FAQ > YOU

And fúcking LOL @ your fûcking 'cartooner', asshat buddy pm'ing me; telling me that I have transfer a fûcking bin file to 'prove' that im a fûcking me7 TOONER, which I never claimed to be. Although I do have a better than average understanding of how the systems work, because of the research I've done.

IM NOT THE FÛCKING ASSHAT WHO CLAIMS TO BE A FÛCKING TOONER, WHEN HES REALLY JUST TWEAKING EXISTING FILES, AND RESELLING THEM AS HIS OWN..:thumbdown::thumbdown:

FTFY


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

:laugh::laugh:opcorn:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> STFU you annoying twit. I was merely explaining how the maps interrelate to one another in an imaginary visual context, so MAYBE guys can sorta wrap their brains around it
> 
> Now I've got your corny ass, who showed up on the scene a year ago, posting dumb ass threads about shít that was done ten years ago, to guys who've ALREADY done it, as if you've discovered something
> 
> ...


:laugh::beer: mr. cartooner is quick to send a PM about some rift raft. Yeah I'm sure he came up with all that code on his own or with his "team of computer scientist he hired" :laugh: I laugh because he prob doens't make enough money to pay 1 real computer scientist for some contract work, let alone a team


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Immadbro


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Immadbro


ahahahaha :wave:


----------



## iTech (Dec 29, 2008)

Man this is the most entertaining thread I have followed in quite some time . Thank you vortex for never letting me down. I think I am going to back to the 5th dimension an stick with my Maestro. Keep an eye out the next new feature will be a combination of dash switches to make you travel back in time LOL


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

iTech said:


> Man this is the most entertaining thread I have followed in quite some time . Thank you vortex for never letting me down. I think I am going to back to the 5th dimension an stick with my Maestro. Keep an eye out the next new feature will be a combination of dash switches to make you travel back in time LOL


 :laugh:

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Here is the old code being compiled:








I don't use this code, but something much better and 100% custom as you can see in the videos.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Stock code modified to call added routine on the left, stock on the right.

Big_Tom, you speak assembly? Hahahahahaha


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Stock code modified to call added routine on the left, stock on the right.
> 
> Big_Tom, you speak assembly? Hahahahahaha


and ur laughing why? I currently speak Assembly, C, Java, Python, SQL, HTML, & CSS ic:


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

Real programmers can write assembly code in any language


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> Real programmers can write assembly code in any language


:facepalm:


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

It's a joke. :facepalm:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

:facepalm:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> It's a joke. :facepalm:


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

Just when you thought vortex's future was looking bright....this guy comes along.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> Just when you thought vortex's future was looking bright....this guy comes along.


what are you talking about :screwy: you made a horrible joke :facepalm:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Big_Tom said:


> what are you talking about :screwy: you made a horrible joke :facepalm:


I dunno. A horrible joke is better than no joke at all IMO. 

That said; here's the last two pm's that our favorite "cartooner" sent me. I thought these were rather funny:laugh: especially since I've never once claimed to be an me7 tuner:screwy:


[email protected] said:


> I like the way you keyboard tune. Please tell me more about these '4th dimensional' maps and how they fold. You are obviously the more talented ME7 tuner here
> 
> You think you know what you are talking about, yet you probably can't even compile successfully some simple C167 code.
> 
> Heck, I'll send you a BIN with custom code. If you can port the code to a different BIN successfully, you win.





[email protected] said:


> [email protected] said:
> 
> 
> > I like the way you keyboard tune. Please tell me more about these '4th dimensional' maps and how they fold. You are obviously the more talented ME7 tuner here
> ...


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> I dunno. A horrible joke is better than no joke at all IMO.
> 
> That said; here's the last two pm's that our favorite "cartooner" sent me. I thought these were rather funny:laugh: especially since I've never once claimed to be an me7 tuner:screwy:


LOL @ Porting It To Another Bin File. The fast and the furious meets computer science :laugh:


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> I've never once claimed to be an me7 tuner:screwy:


 If I recall correctly, you tried to 'school' me on how ME7 maps work on a 4th dimensional level (I still laugh my pants off every time I think about this).
But let me refresh your memory and show you how childish you act:


dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> I personally like me7, and understand the fickle nature of it to a reasonable degree. Enough so anyway, that I NEVER personally ran into issues with it.
> 
> The maps run in a 4 dimensional spectrum (for lack of a better term), in such a way that several maps, and their corresponding 'axi' "run into" eachother on six different planes, in such a way that if the seperate planes where the maps bisect dont "line up", the ecu will become 'confused'.





dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Of course there's 4 dimensions; because it can all be folded in on itself depending on which axi you move, and where. *YOU should know this*. The maps do NOT exist on a flat, 2 dimensional plane, or even in a traditional 3 dimensional perspective; as the maps are moved, or manipulated; other maps that bisect are altered causing another set of consequences on a different plane (referencing correction, in another set of maps)


 Here you clearly imply that you know what you are talking about.

Then you got schooled by two other respectable members of this forum:


RaraK69 said:


> MEception?
> 
> I see your point of view with interaction between maps, its a good theory, but in code and reality, this does NOT work this way. Ecu grabs inputs for calculations from the maps and runs it through high/low pass filters depending on the function, takes that value, multiplies by a correction(one or more depending on exact switches(ie. iat , rpm, etc)) all kinda of functions like this.
> 
> ...





badger5 said:


> the code is in hex.. is that 2d enough for you
> 
> have a nice look at winols demo and see what it "actually" does
> :thumbup:


Even DMVDUB knows this isn't true, and he isn't even a tuner. Then you decide to attack him because you know attacking RaRak or badger5 wouldn't end well. Then you proceed to say that you "have a better than average understanding of how the systems work, because of the research [you've] done," as shown below.


dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Although I do have a better than average understanding of how the systems work, because of the research I've done.


Really? Your research has showed you that ME7 works on a 4th dimensional level? :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

This is pretty much the last post I'm ever directing towards you since your posts lack any intelligence whatsoever, and you fail miserably at being somewhat logical. Basically, you are at a point where you know you are wrong, but you aren't willing to give up, but I think one of your posts sums it up pretty well:


dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Immadbro


Now you have two choices: 1. Stop trying to bug me or 2. Keep making a fool out of yourself.
It's all up to you man opcorn:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> If I recall correctly, you tried to 'school' me on how ME7 maps work on a 4th dimensional level (I still laugh my pants off every time I think about this).
> But let me refresh your memory and show you how childish you act:
> 
> 
> ...


First off; your 'buddy' dmvdub is the biggest asshat to ever grace this forum. The fellow literally rehashed every basic tuning principal with regards to these engines, as if we are in a 2001 timewarp.  

That said; he didn't prove a single thing with his comments towards myself, except for the fact that he obviously likes the way your balls taste.:thumbup:

I was making an analogy. Pure and simple. None of this detracts from your lack of prowess as a tuner. You are great at creating diversions to the fact that you are an amateur masquerading as a veteran tuner. Misdirection is your tool of choice in every circumstance where your credibility, or experience is questioned.

How many times have you been banned from this forum again? Was it two or three? I can't remember. And what about YOUR new hybrid turbocharger system that you've stolen from Doug of Frankenturbo, and claim as your own revolutionary design? You hijack the toils of others, and resell them as your own, and when called out on it, you redirect the argument in order to divert the focus away from your own checkered past, and fraudulent present. 

Im not the only member of this forum that sees through you. Not everyone has the memory of a goldfish.


----------



## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

LOL okay, 'analogy' :laugh:


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> LOL okay, 'analogy' :laugh:


Thats it? "LOL" son I am dissapoint...

So how's your "new hybrid Turbo system; that YOU designed"? :sly:


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

The hybrid turbo is working very well on the cars we have it installed in. Second doug stole it from scroll products and the name frankenturbo was used years ago on a DSM based T4 hybrid. Third you can call me all the names you want, I came from a different platform, actually several, and wanted to learn as much as possible about this engine before I started modding it. 

You may claim to have all this knowledge about the 1.8t... That's nice. I build and maintain marine engines pushing 2000 to 8000 hp. Come to my world buddy and see who gets schooled.:wave:

Also the GTT is not the same as Doug's design at all, it is bolt on and performs the same or better as the f23 and don't worry your pissy little diaper there will be dyno's soon.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

opcorn:opcorn:


----------



## 20VCanuck (Mar 11, 2011)

I dont understand everyone's need in this thread to bash everyone
At the end of the day its the internet..There will be no fist to cuffs, you've proven nothing.
It is starting to get irritating for me to sift through threads of people bashing eachother just to maybe find a few "Helpful" posts where I can learn something, or see something interesting/intriguing.

At the end of the day, will I buy gonzo's product? No, but who am I to tell an enterprenuer they cannot do what they seek to accomplish?

If you dont like the product, or even the man behind it dont support him. Dont buy it, inform people why this is the case if they want to buy it, sure thats how poor companies exit business.


However, I do not see every thread posted in by gonzo, or thread pertaining turn into this. Which it does.


Am I the only one who thinks this way?!


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

20VCanuck said:


> At the end of the day, will I buy gonzo's product? No...


Nuff Said :beer:


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

20VCanuck said:


> Am I the only one who thinks this way?!


No, I agree. Problem is, you have all these trolls that appear to know everything and have never actually experienced Gonzo in real life yet bash him for his work. Which others seem to praise his work. How come no one bashes Integrated engineering for their design fault in their manual tensioner spacer setup? It tore my timing belt apart. I called them up, explained the issue and they handled it. I didn't go into their 20v Products Lineup thread exclaiming "Don't buy IE, they suck :facepalm: :facepalm:, they shouldn't put out products before it's fully tested!" That is called trolling and is completely ignorant and disrespectful.


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> No, I agree. Problem is, you have all these trolls that appear to know everything and have never actually experienced Gonzo in real life yet bash him for his work. Which others seem to praise his work. How come no one bashes Integrated engineering for their design fault in their manual tensioner spacer setup? It tore my timing belt apart. I called them up, explained the issue and they handled it. I didn't go into their 20v Products Lineup thread exclaiming "Don't buy IE, they suck :facepalm: :facepalm:, they shouldn't put out products before it's fully tested!" That is called trolling and is completely ignorant and disrespectful.


:facepalm:These "trolls" were here LONG before gonzo and his magic tunes came along  also, you don't have to buy and install it on your car to know it's crap. have you never visually inspected something and it was obvious, it was for you? i guess not  so i guess you'd be fine with running a ss autochrome turbo if you never saw one in real life even tho a quick google search will yeild a ton of horror stories? :screwy:


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

this thread needs less talk and more boobs.


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

Gonzo is just so cute. Remember when he said his Turbo does 20psi in neutral? Now he has a video of his "new" antilag code showing his car doing 20psi with his GTT Turbo installed.

Kind of funny how you said it boosts without AL, but now you're showing it in an AL video lololol... also funny how setzi has been talking about no backfire AL on nefmoto and now you magically have that too... lololol all day long.


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

Big_Tom said:


> :facepalm:These "trolls" were here LONG before gonzo and his magic tunes came along


Yeah, apparently around Aug 18th, 2007. So these "veteran" trolls bash a new guy? Are you Cole Hamels or something?

How do you know his tunes are crap? His turbos? 

Come on man, lay off. You are like a leech sucking the blood out of this thread. .


----------



## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

who in this thread has bsl100 or x17 that i can borrow??? need asap. :wave:


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## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

How is it funny to show in anti lag. Tobz you don't know sh!t about cars or racing. You are a electrical nerd trying to be someone else on the Internet. You dont have a bt car, or even a tuned car for that matter. I'm willing to bet you've never even been to a track, to race or watch. You've never cracked open an engine of any kind. You've never written code. You make little diode trinkets. Gonz wrote the code to switch the al rpms with th cc stalk... Can you do that? No. Dude you may have people fooled with your big talk about this and that, but you dont know a damn thing about building a street car, race car or any other car. 

Trolls being around for a long time tells you one thing, they were then and are now just that trolls.

People who don't use his product should have no right to bash it. They haven't used it, they don't know. Period. There are far more people running his tune and are happy than the opposite. Happy people don't post. People with problems do.

Do people forget APR and their random check sum errors that brick the ecu from nowhere, or how pricey the tune is for such low power output?

What about the Unitronic tunes for k03&04 turbos that surge, go into limp, and if they do run smooth put out the same power as gonzos tune that costs less and comes with customer support and upgrades, al, nls, deletes, immo, etc.? 

Or revo that just plain sucks.

Or GIAC that causes cars to limp out, or needs to be reflashed over and over, and won't support the customer for sh!t. They also don't seem to give a damn what people sell their tune for since in the DC area there are several places selling GIAC-X for $800-$1000

Malone, who's apparently great at tuning tdi but nobody hears anything else... There was an attempt to make a tune for frankenturbo but that seemed to fall off. 

So, who has a tune from gonzo and feels ripped off, or feels that one of the other companies would have given them more for the money? :wave:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Gonzo is just so cute. Remember when he said his Turbo does 20psi in neutral? Now he has a video of his "new" antilag code showing his car doing 20psi with his GTT Turbo installed.
> 
> Kind of funny how you said it boosts without AL, but now you're showing it in an AL video lololol... also funny how setzi has been talking about no backfire AL on nefmoto and now you magically have that too... lololol all day long.


:laugh:



K20017 said:


> Yeah, apparently around Aug 18th, 2007. So these "veteran" trolls bash a new guy? Are you Cole Hamels or something?
> 
> How do you know his tunes are crap? His turbos?
> 
> Come on man, lay off. You are like a leech sucking the blood out of this thread. .


hey, you used "veteran" not myself. 5 years give or take is not that long, but long enough to learn a thing or 2. and it's at least twice as long as that muppet tuner has been around.
i think it's funny you wanna quote dates. quote your's too, then compare and see that it appears i came along before you. what you can do is go fix a big bowl of chocolate d*ck ice cream :wave: stop worryin about me and worry about yourself :facepalm:


----------



## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

reflected said:


> this thread needs less talk and more boobs.


^^this x2 :beer:opcorn::beer:opcorn:


----------



## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

This thread is pure hilarity.

Yeah, anyone here with a negative opinion has never done anything of value. Only DMVDUB and Gonzo know anything about cars.

The GTT Turbo is the single greatest thing to happen to the 1.8T. You can make 20psi on it with ALS if you want... but you can make it in neutral without it. That's just how revolutionary this turbo and the tune is. 

One click of the CC stalk and your car instantly has 500hp.


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

Big_Tom said:


> hey, you used "veteran" not myself. 5 years give or take is not that long, but long enough to learn a thing or 2. and it's at least twice as long as that muppet tuner has been around.
> i think it's funny you wanna quote dates. quote your's too, then compare and see that it appears i came along before you. what you can do is go fix a big bowl of chocolate d*ck ice cream :wave: stop worryin about me and worry about yourself :facepalm:



I'm almost at a loss of words. Following your date logic, you apparently have WAY MORE knowledge than pete from IE.










Hahahahaha.

No matter if you have been working on cars for 30 years before the start of vwvortex, your reputation and knowledge starts from your join date. :laugh:

Get back under your bridge, troll.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> Are you Cole Hamels or something?


nah, more like Cole Trickle  ic:


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

You have a negative opinion when you've never used any of his products... So that just proves you're an idiot. 

Anti lag is supposed to make boost tobz... 

Dude, go play with your tinker toys. Because you don't know anything about cars. I know I don't know everything about the 1.8t, that's why I bought one. But tobz you don't know anything about any of them. Whatever you know is some crap you regurgitate out of some book. Get some real world experience. You're just like the little bitches I work with that came out of academy, they think they know everything because the saw it in a book... They get proved wrong on a daily basis by people like me who've gained my experience from working on ships from 30M to 300M. I was building DSMs faster than anything you'll ever known while you were still pissing your pants in kindergarten. This is your first car and now you think you're an expert....:bs::facepalm:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> I'm almost at a loss of words. Following your date logic, you apparently have WAY MORE knowledge than pete from IE.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


ok, so where in my posts did i say join joining sooner makes you smarter than the next guy? and why are you even mentioning Pete's name in this silly ass thread? you are living proof that date logic is not true. :facepalm::screwy: dude give it up already. you must still be mad i called you on your horrible joke. :laugh: :facepalm:

AND YOU SHOULD BE LOST FOR WORDS, KEEP IT THAT WAY


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

Big_Tom said:


> 5 years give or take is not that long, but long enough to learn a thing or 2. and it's at least twice as long as that muppet tuner has been around.
> i think it's funny you wanna quote dates. quote your's too, then compare and see that it appears i came along before you.


So explain to me what you mean here. It looks like you are trying to say since you have been around longer on the vortex, you know more about cars than me, and more than Gonzo as well. Is this correct?


----------



## ManualOrNothing101 (Mar 2, 2009)

You guys hate on Gonzo too much, he obviously knows what he's doing from what I've read up on his posts on vortex and NefMoto.

Keep goin strong and let the haters hate Gonzo :thumbup: :beer::beer:


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## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

:banghead:


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

do you people even know what youre arguing about anymore? :laugh:


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> So explain to me what you mean here. It looks like you are trying to say since you have been around longer on the vortex, you know more about cars than me, and more than Gonzo as well. Is this correct?


LOL if you cannot read what i wrote and understand it, sorry brah. I'm not here for all that. explain to me where you saw me say that joining vwvortex before the next guy makes you smarter/better? if i wanted to type that, i would have :facepalm: i said exactly what i wanted to say, you can take it and run with it all you want. you're worse than a tabloid :facepalm:


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## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

reflected said:


> do you people even know what youre arguing about anymore? :laugh:


:laugh: lmfaoeace:


----------



## K20017 (Nov 14, 2007)

Yeah, I can't understand what you meant. You can't take the 2 minutes to type your explanation? Well..apparently you aren't here for all that. Great asset to the Volkswagen community you are.


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

T-Boy said:


> :laugh: lmfaoeace:


seriously. did you read it all? i mean it makes no sense. like what is the end result that theyre trying to get to? that gonzo sucks or not? or that one of them pwnz the other n00b?


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

K20017 said:


> Yeah, I can't understand what you meant. You can't take the 2 minutes to type your explanation? Well..apparently you aren't here for all that. Great asset to the Volkswagen community you are.


I don't care to elaborate on the subject. Also don't care to get into the whole "asset" subject either. You can PM anyone on my friends list and ask about me, they'll elaborate  you on the other hand don't seen to have any friends, just sayin. who likes you around here? who are you helping out? ic: Let my nuts go please :wave:


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## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

gratuitous engine pics


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

reflected said:


> seriously. did you read it all? i mean it makes no sense. like what is the end result that theyre trying to get to? that gonzo sucks or not? or that one of them pwnz the other n00b?


You're correct, in that 90% of this bickering is irrelevant. What is relevant however; is the simple fact that Gonzo has been banned from this forum a few times for advertising infractions, has been disingenuous about the length of his tuning experience, as well as his posts in this forum in the recent past. 

When called on any of these relevant points, he likes to skirt the issue with irrelevant remarks; instead of fielding a cogent argument to rebuke the aforementioned statements, as he obviously lacks a cogent argument to the contrary.

This is my problem with Gonzo..


----------



## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)




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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

Whats with all the Bass boat motors???


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## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

reflected said:


> seriously. did you read it all? i mean it makes no sense. like what is the end result that theyre trying to get to? that gonzo sucks or not? or that one of them pwnz the other n00b?


I think it's more along the lines of "My peepee is bigger....yours is smaller! So i win!" :laugh:


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## DMVDUB (Jan 11, 2010)

Thread has no point so I figured I'd post some random engines from my ships... These are the babys, 2000hp...

Maybe next will be the motor from my big ship, you could fit a GTi in the turbo...


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

This sh_t right here...:laugh:


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Twopnt016v said:


> This sh_t right here...:laugh:


No doubt. The tugboat engines are the best part IMO :sly:


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## 87vr6 (Jan 17, 2002)

Are marine diesel motor pictures the new cat pictures?


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Let's not forget who started the bickering here. It wasn't me.


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> You're correct, in that 90% of this bickering is irrelevant. What is relevant however; is the simple fact that Gonzo has been banned from this forum a few times for advertising infractions, has been disingenuous about the length of his tuning experience, as well as his posts in this forum in the recent past.
> 
> When called on any of these relevant points, he likes to skirt the issue with irrelevant remarks; instead of fielding a cogent argument to rebuke the aforementioned statements, as he obviously lacks a cogent argument to the contrary.
> 
> This is my problem with Gonzo..


lol, ive been banned from this forum several times over again for selling green top cts's back in the day. :laugh: 
the only thing that should matter is whether gonzo's final product is a quality product or is it junk. 100% of everything else is irrelevant.
like i said before, if you guys only knew the real story. gonzo's product is quality.


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## bbjetta87 (Jun 21, 2009)

Big_Tom said:


> stop worryin about me and worry about yourself :facepalm:


stop worrying about gonzo and worry about yourself.



reflected said:


> like i said before, if you guys only knew the real story. gonzo's product is quality.


:thumbup::thumbup:


in all honesty, you guys are ridiculous with this bullsh!t. unless you have personally used gonzos products, how can you trash them?


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## BoostedGLS0218 (Dec 10, 2011)

**** are all you guys crying about here? Who cares? :screwy:


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

bbjetta87 said:


> stop worrying about gonzo and worry about yourself.
> 
> 
> :thumbup::thumbup:
> ...


:thumbdown: you're a gonzo fan boy of course umadbro :facepalm:


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

Meh:thumbdown::thumbdown:


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## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

this is epic ****ting on.......im enjoying it.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

RaraK69 said:


> this is epic ****ting on.......im enjoying it.


 Screw you 

Buying x17 I heard?


----------



## rains (May 30, 2008)

come on guys ... let's not get this thread locked like his turbo thread.

I, for one, would like to see his turbo kit get released. If it reviews good, and is legit, then :thumbup: If not, then I guess the Gonzo haters were right.

But, until either happens, I'm not going to hate or him, or be a nutswinger, and will continue to read these threads.


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## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

yessir i have a few friends with the tool and nothing but excellent things to say about it.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Actually the tune for the GTT's is almost done. Just got to finish fine tweaking the fueling and boost response and its good to go. The clutch on my test car is now shot, though. Waiting to replace that, finish up tune, and hit the dyno.



RaraK69 said:


> yessir i have a few friends with the tool and nothing but excellent things to say about it.


 Sweet. Let me know how it works out for ya :thumbup:


----------



## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

DMVDUB said:


> You have a negative opinion when you've never used any of his products... So that just proves you're an idiot.
> 
> Anti lag is supposed to make boost tobz...
> 
> Dude, go play with your tinker toys. Because you don't know anything about cars. I know I don't know everything about the 1.8t, that's why I bought one. But tobz you don't know anything about any of them. Whatever you know is some crap you regurgitate out of some book. Get some real world experience. You're just like the little bitches I work with that came out of academy, they think they know everything because the saw it in a book... They get proved wrong on a daily basis by people like me who've gained my experience from working on ships from 30M to 300M. I was building DSMs faster than anything you'll ever known while you were still pissing your pants in kindergarten. This is your first car and now you think you're an expert....:bs::facepalm:


It's funny how you're Gonzo's biggest fanboy and you're talking about people with no experience, etc etc... yet that is exactly who Gonzo is... a dude that got all his info from a forum and has been "tuning" for what.. less than a year? and now he suddenly knows everything about ME7.5.

How long has your boy been building engines? Oh, er... right... his own car is in shambles. Well, I mean, he's been tuning a long time so that makes up for it.. oh, woops, wait a minute... he's only been around for like a year.

What was your point about experience again? :laugh:

(side note: apparently it went over your head... but if the turbo can supposedly make boost in neutral with no tricks AKA no antilag... then why would you demo your anti-lag feature on that turbo? either the turbo doesn't make boost in neutral by itself... in which case he was lying... or his anti-lag doesn't do **** and the turbo is making boost without it... in which caser the ALS doesn't do anything... so either way he's a tool and is lying/trying to bull**** everyone.... proving my point :laugh: )


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Actually I got a different car now and I went with a different route with the fueling this time around.

I was doing 500cc's @ 4bar but it seems like the Genesis intank fuel pump wasn't able to keep up. (I think it technically it should be capable of it, but that's not what my logs say).

This time around I'm doing 550's @ 3bar and I started from scratch since I wanted to include the Stage 2+ features on the GTT software.

Its close to being done. Cold starts and idle are perfect. Feels like a stock car. I just need to put in a new MAF and O2 and then drive the car and log the fueling to make it as close to perfect as possible. That, and a new clutch. Hopefully I can finish it this week. I also need to test the tune switching code this week. It should prove to be a pretty busy week.


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## bbjetta87 (Jun 21, 2009)

Big_Tom said:


> :thumbdown: you're a gonzo fan boy of course umadbro :facepalm:


if you mean that i am a fan of his work thats correct, im not mad at all to be honest, just dont understand how you or anyone that hasnt used his work can be trashing it, we obviously all know you dont like what he does but honestly you post in every single one of gonzos threads and all you ever do is say some stupid remark. it just gets extremely repetitive. do you just look for the word "gonzo" when you scroll down the page? to bash someone once is one thing, but to bash every single thread is just f*cking stupid. You have stated your opinion (which is an opinion without any kind of personal experience) at least 10 plus times. I honestly think its enough.


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

bbjetta87 said:


> if you mean that i am a fan of his work thats correct, im not mad at all to be honest, just dont understand how you or anyone that hasnt used his work can be trashing it, we obviously all know you dont like what he does but honestly you post in every single one of gonzos threads and all you ever do is say some stupid remark. it just gets extremely repetitive. do you just look for the word "gonzo" when you scroll down the page? to bash someone once is one thing, but to bash every single thread is just f*cking stupid. You have stated your opinion (which is an opinion without any kind of personal experience) at least 10 plus times. I honestly think its enough.


COOL STORY BRO :facepalm:


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## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

I can't bash Gonzo in good conscience after reading this. Gonzo has his shít together guys; I owe him a :beer:and an apology.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?t=5616176


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## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

bbjetta87 said:


> if you mean that i am a fan of his work thats correct, im not mad at all to be honest, just dont understand how you or anyone that hasnt used his work can be trashing it, we obviously all know you dont like what he does but honestly you post in every single one of gonzos threads and all you ever do is say some stupid remark. it just gets extremely repetitive. do you just look for the word "gonzo" when you scroll down the page? to bash someone once is one thing, but to bash every single thread is just f*cking stupid. You have stated your opinion (which is an opinion without any kind of personal experience) at least 10 plus times. I honestly think its enough.


Amen to this :beer:


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## Dub Ken (Dec 24, 2004)

I do a lot of my own custom tuning on the 1.8T ME7. It is primarily a hobby, but the main reason I do it is because I think the cost of the typical cookie cutter software tuning is ridiculous. And in terms of quality, it's rare that I open a "professional" tune in my editor and do not have "WTF?!" moment when looking at some sloppy remaps. I owe a lot of what I know to guys like Gonzo in the ME7 tuning community and Gonzo specifically has been a large contributor of knowledge. I can vouch that he really knows his stuff. :beer:


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> I can't bash Gonzo in good conscience after reading this. Gonzo has his shít together guys; I owe him a :beer:and an apology.
> http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?t=5616176




UGH :facepalm: UGH

Taylor at http://www.dotuning.com/ tuned Johns car and how I know is that I was there with Taylor at the FFE dynoday.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

18T_BT said:


> Taylor at http://www.dotuning.com/ tuned Johns car and how I know is that I was there with Taylor at the FFE dynoday.


Correct. Which is a really close buddy of mines and we are always doing (tuning) shenanigans together 

Wish I could've made it to the dyno day.


----------



## Pisko (Jan 14, 2006)

You do realize the Vortex Community laugh and think you are [email protected]&$ right? opcorn:opcorn:








If you dont like the product, or person, dont buy it.....nough said...


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> I can't bash Gonzo in good conscience after reading this. Gonzo has his shít together guys; I owe him a :beer:and an apology.
> http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?t=5616176





:thumbup:


Agreed. Looks like action is starting to happen or was happening instead of words.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

gdoggmoney said:


> :thumbup:
> 
> 
> Agreed. Looks like action is starting to happen or was happening instead of words.


Yuuuup! Can't ever argue with action, and results:thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## bbjetta87 (Jun 21, 2009)

Big_Tom said:


> COOL STORY BRO :facepalm:


another stupid remark i see. youve gotta get sick of this eventually...:facepalm:



dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> I can't bash Gonzo in good conscience after reading this. Gonzo has his shít together guys; I owe him a :beer:and an apology.
> http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?t=5616176


very impressive stuff :thumbup:


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## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

bbjetta87 said:


> another stupid remark i see. youve gotta get sick of this eventually...:facepalm:


ANOTHER COOL STORY BRO :facepalm::wave:


----------



## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)




----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

RaraK69 said:


>


:laugh::beer:


----------



## thefrese (Mar 8, 2012)

odonnejl said:


> Hello fellow dubbers,
> 
> I know there has been countless threads about this but I'm looking for some honest opinions from people running the tune and what everything thinks about me wanting his stage 2 with my GTI having 160,000 on it. The engine is completely stock besides a 3 inch straight pipe from the turbo back no cat, intake, and 007 diverter valve. Gonzo is claiming his stage 2 programing ups the boost to 21 lbs. I'm pretty leary of doing this and want to know what everyone thinks.
> 
> ...


On topic.... I know two people with Gonzo's tune. Both of them love it and DD their cars with no problems but broken old hoses from the boost increase.


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

thefrese said:


> On topic.... I know two people with Gonzo's tune. Both of them love it and DD their cars with no problems but broken old hoses from the boost increase.


 :thumbup:


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## ridemyfast (Jul 18, 2010)

thefrese said:


> On topic.... I know two people with Gonzo's tune. Both of them love it and DD their cars with no problems but broken old hoses from the boost increase.


how does gonzos stage 2 compare to unitronic's stage 2?


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Yuuuup! Can't ever argue with action, and results:thumbup::thumbup:


Gonzo apparently has mastered the 2012 version of CIS-Motronic. THAT takes skill.


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## bb-tt (Jul 2, 2013)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> A maf relays information to the ecu by current being run through a wire, that wire is then cooled at varying degrees depending on the both the volume, and density of the air passing over it; which in turn varies the ohms or resistance of the current passing through the wire. These (ohms) are then read by the ecu to determine the readings. Both air volume, and density over the heated wire will will affect the cooling of it.
> 
> So to answer your first question it calculates both density, and volume; as a heated wire doesn't (know) which is affecting its cooling, and said resistance.
> 
> ...



So the MAF sensor is essentially a piece of thermocouple wire?


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## Slimjimmn (Apr 8, 2006)

The maf sensor is a resistor that gets heated and the change in current draw is determined in a preset list of values to what the injectors should operate to


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## WishingBig (Jan 23, 2012)

Hey, 2002 VW Passat 1.8T Automatic with Tip Tronic.. Got anything for it? Tried using your site to contact and got nothing twice now.


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## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

Slimjimmn said:


> The maf sensor is a resistor that gets heated and the change in current draw is determined in a preset list of values to what the injectors should operate to


nope.

you got the heated bit right, but thats all fella

http://badger-5.com/bin/published-bosch-sensor-data.pdf

pages 56/57 explain what it does...

0-5v (well 1-5v output) to ecu which in turn has its voltage to kg/h mass flow scaler corresponding to the input voltage mlhfm table


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

JWishnok said:


> Hey, 2002 VW Passat 1.8T Automatic with Tip Tronic.. Got anything for it? Tried using your site to contact and got nothing twice now.


You should pm [email protected]

http://forums.vwvortex.com/member.php?777568-Jeff-GonzoTuning


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