# will we ever get a manual TT in the US ever again???



## AceOfSpades (Feb 26, 2003)

As stated I would buy a new TT but they don't come in manual why!

and now I hear the RS will not be manual WTF!


do I really have to buy a 2013 TTRS!?


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## Huey52 (Nov 10, 2010)

Perhaps the upcoming/revised TTRS, but doubtful otherwise.


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## VR6Now (Dec 31, 2000)

Audi has stated that they are done with manuals. Sadly, they don't want to cater to those who want them. If you want a manual, you're not the customer they are looking for.


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## Vegas-RoadsTTer (Mar 17, 2013)

*Why?*

They are faster than a manual in straight-line acceleration and get better gas mileage in the non-sport mode. US government regulations for fleet fuel efficiency are a driving force for all manufactures to go to automatics. As much as we all like to think we are the best drivers in the world, fact is, using an auto in the sport or track mode has the correct gear selected 99% of the time in spirited driving on open road twisty-turnies. The only time a manual might be getter is if you are a pro driver on a track. Because of fuel efficiency regulations, in 10 years the only cars sold in the US with manuals will be low price cheap cars.


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## R5T (Apr 7, 2010)

VR6Now said:


> Audi has stated that they are done with manuals. Sadly, they don't want to cater to those who want them. If you want a manual, you're not the customer they are looking for.


Audi go's even further with limiting our choices.

Rumor has it that the next Generation Audi Q5 will be quattro and autobox only, there will not be a FWD version and no more manual gearbox version anymore.


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## Huey52 (Nov 10, 2010)

That's fine by me. An Audi without Quattro really isn't an Audi, imho.




R5T said:


> Audi go's even further with limiting our choices.
> 
> Rumor has it that the next Generation Audi Q5 will be quattro and autobox only, there will not be a FWD version and no more manual gearbox version anymore.


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

Vegas-RoadsTTer said:


> They are faster than a manual in straight-line acceleration and get better gas mileage in the non-sport mode. US government regulations for fleet fuel efficiency are a driving force for all manufactures to go to automatics. As much as we all like to think we are the best drivers in the world, fact is, using an auto in the sport or track mode has the correct gear selected 99% of the time in spirited driving on open road twisty-turnies.


DSG must be great for all of the timed events you participate in.


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## ourlee (Jul 19, 2010)

DSG is def faster.


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## R5T (Apr 7, 2010)

Yes, when you are a racing driver it would matter. 
But it's bullocks for road use, what do i care if it is faster, deadly boring to drive.


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## AceOfSpades (Feb 26, 2003)

R5T said:


> Yes, when you are a racing driver it would matter.
> But it's bullocks for road use, what do i care if it is faster, deadly boring to drive.


this guy gets me!

fcuk DSG I never had one work the way I wanted it to work and I would never want a flippy paddle thing maybe an air shifter when its in sport mode but need to shifter way faster

Stick makes a car, a sports car.


sure DSG is faster but who gives 2 ****s!


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## cyberpmg (Nov 27, 2001)

I believe this is more a decision from Audi o America and not by Audi AG.

While DSG may be faster and more efficient, there's more driver engagement when driving a manual. It's that engagement that helps to promote the overall experience. The interaction adds to the excitement. At least with DSG, the flappy paddles help somewhat, but my left foot will fall asleep.


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## mremg (May 10, 2015)

cyberpmg said:


> I believe this is more a decision from Audi o America and not by Audi AG.


Audi of America took everyone by surprise when they announced Mk2 TT RS will be manual only in the US. "But it's 0.6s slower than the DSG! How can they?" quite a few screamed. I'll be very surprised if they ever bring back manual TT again.

Yeah, DSG is good or whatever. But after fiddling with the paddles for a few days, you just put it in D or S and start driving a sporty autobox listening to NPR. If you're a track bro, you'll get online and post how close you're to the Porsche time-wise, thanks to the magic of DSG.

The A4/S4 manual is gone, the A5/S5 is next on the chopping block. By 2017, Audi will join Mercedes as auto-only car brand in the USA. (I'm assuming MB will phase-out SLK 250 manual this year).


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## Woj (Oct 23, 2000)

The MB 250 SLK no longer exists. It has been replaced with the SLK 300 that has the ubiquitous 4 cyl motor seen in the C series and elsewhere.
9 spd auto the only available transmission.

Shame the TT/TTS is stuck with the old 6 spd DSG.


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## mremg (May 10, 2015)

Woj said:


> The MB 250 SLK no longer exists. It has been replaced with the SLK 300 that has the ubiquitous 4 cyl motor seen in the C series and elsewhere.
> 9 spd auto the only available transmission.


Didn't know that about the SLK. So MB is the first German car brand to wipeout manuals entirely from the lineup, soon followed by Audi. I bet BMW will follow suit in a couple of years along with VW. Porsche - I'm not so sure.



Woj said:


> Shame the TT/TTS is stuck with the old 6 spd DSG.


Do you mean you'd rather have an 8-speed ZF8? I used to have an A6 with the ZF8. Really smooth at low speeds and quick gear changes, but not good for flappy paddles. Too many tall gears with close ratios and not really designed for manual shifting or spirited driving. I think 6-spd DSG is good for a sporty car even if Audi manages to tune the ZF8 for aggressive shifting.

At this point, I don't care if it's DSG-only but I wish there was an option for VR6 or similar. The 2.0T is decent, but VAG uses it in every model and doesn't sound as good & doesn't like to rev high.


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## mremg (May 10, 2015)

Well, I might be wrong. There is definitely a possibility

http://www.quattroworld.com/future-models/2017-audi-tt-rs-spied-with-a-6-speed-transmission/


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## VR6Now (Dec 31, 2000)

mremg said:


> Well, I might be wrong. There is definitely a possibility
> 
> http://www.quattroworld.com/future-models/2017-audi-tt-rs-spied-with-a-6-speed-transmission/



European market penetration of manuals far exceeds US demand so they get (and pay for) more powertrain options. We get fewer combinations and what shows up in Sweden means nothing here.


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## VR6Now (Dec 31, 2000)

Vegas-RoadsTTer said:


> ...US government regulations for fleet fuel efficiency are a driving force for all manufactures to go to automatics...


It has absolutely nothing to do with US Government regulations. The fuel economy difference between a 6 dsg Golf R and 6sp manual Golf R is small and not going to matter in the slightest in meeting US Cafe requirements. 

Automakers tend to drop options on cars once demand falls below a certain threshold. In the US, demand for manuals continues to decline. Less people are learning to drive them. It is cheaper to certify one configuration on a car that will sell very few units than two. If they are only going to certify one, the dsg is accessible to both those who can and can not drive manuals. In Europe, it can cost them more money not offering manuals on some cars because buyers still have demand for them.


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## Huey52 (Nov 10, 2010)

Exactly. And Americans have always preferred automatics going way back to their inception. With the efficiency of the DSG we could indeed be nearing the end of manuals.... and internal combustion engines for that matter. Glad I had my time with them but there's no stopping progress.




VR6Now said:


> It has absolutely nothing to do with US Government regulations. The fuel economy difference between a 6 dsg Golf R and 6sp manual Golf R is small and not going to matter in the slightest in meeting US Cafe requirements.
> 
> Automakers tend to drop options on cars once demand falls below a certain threshold. In the US, demand for manuals continues to decline. Less people are learning to drive them. It is cheaper to certify one configuration on a car that will sell very few units than two. If they are only going to certify one, the dsg is accessible to both those who can and can not drive manuals. In Europe, it can cost them more money not offering manuals on some cars because buyers still have demand for them.


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

Huey52 said:


> Exactly. And Americans have always preferred automatics going way back to their inception. With the efficiency of the DSG we could indeed be nearing the end of manuals.... and internal combustion engines for that matter. Glad I had my time with them but there's no stopping progress.


Yet BMW and Audi have produced manuals for the US market only. The B8.5 S4/S5 and recent M5s all had manuals specifically for the US market. When Audi added DSG to the TTRS in Europe they effectively stopped selling manuals. Porsche has also said that manuals are especially important for the US.


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## mremg (May 10, 2015)

JohnLZ7W said:


> Yet BMW and Audi have produced manuals for the US market only. The B8.5 S4/S5 and recent M5s all had manuals specifically for the US market. When Audi added DSG to the TTRS in Europe they effectively stopped selling manuals. Porsche has also said that manuals are especially important for the US.


Yeah the TT RS was manual only in the US and the S4/S5 is available in manual long after they're dead in the European market. Also, the previous gen R8 had higher manual take rate in the US than Europe. I agree that manuals are dead in the Econobox and commuter car market in the US but there is still a decent market for manuals in sports cars.


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## Huey52 (Nov 10, 2010)

Good points. Of course we're all speculating. "Difficult to see. Always in motion is the future." -Star Wars 



mremg said:


> Yeah the TT RS was manual only in the US and the S4/S5 is available in manual long after they're dead in the European market. Also, the previous gen R8 had higher manual take rate in the US than Europe. I agree that manuals are dead in the Econobox and commuter car market in the US but there is still a decent market for manuals in sports cars.


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## spinnetti (Feb 18, 2000)

mremg said:


> Audi of America took everyone by surprise when they announced Mk2 TT RS will be manual only in the US. "But it's 0.6s slower than the DSG! How can they?" quite a few screamed. I'll be very surprised if they ever bring back manual TT again.
> 
> Yeah, DSG is good or whatever. But after fiddling with the paddles for a few days, you just put it in D or S and start driving a sporty autobox listening to NPR. If you're a track bro, you'll get online and post how close you're to the Porsche time-wise, thanks to the magic of DSG.
> 
> The A4/S4 manual is gone, the A5/S5 is next on the chopping block. By 2017, Audi will join Mercedes as auto-only car brand in the USA. (I'm assuming MB will phase-out SLK 250 manual this year).


<sad face> I've had 4 Audi's... didn't think my last one was my last one! It is what it is I guess. I wanted and S5, S4 or RS3 next year, but will all being autos, its off to BMW for an M2 and european delivery


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## AceOfSpades (Feb 26, 2003)

I was told at media day even at Chicago auto show the new Audi A4 in 2018 will come in manual ! My guess is only FWD

Now that 911 R is making shock waves with manuals we man have a little turn around ! 
Till then TTRS or and B8.5 manual for me


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## mremg (May 10, 2015)

AceOfSpades said:


> I was told at media day even at Chicago auto show the new Audi A4 in 2018 will come in manual !


I find it strange that Audi is willing to keep manual in A4, but not in the A3.


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

mremg said:


> I find it strange that Audi is willing to keep manual in A4, but not in the A3.


Probably due to sales volume. I'm guessing they're still selling a lot more A4s than A3s so cost to federalize the manual on the A4 gets spread across more cars.


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## mremg (May 10, 2015)

JohnLZ7W said:


> Probably due to sales volume. I'm guessing they're still selling a lot more A4s than A3s so cost to federalize the manual on the A4 gets spread across more cars.


The A3 outsold the A4 by quite a margin in 2015.

https://www.audiusa.com/newsroom/news/press-releases/2016/01/audi-passes-200000-u-s-sales-for-first-time-with-sixth-record-year

Looks like it'll be similar in 2016

https://www.audiusa.com/newsroom/news/press-releases/2016/03/audi-sets-62nd-consecutive-monthly-u-s-sales-record-in-february


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

mremg said:


> The A3 outsold the A4 by quite a margin in 2015.
> 
> https://www.audiusa.com/newsroom/news/press-releases/2016/01/audi-passes-200000-u-s-sales-for-first-time-with-sixth-record-year
> 
> ...


Well WTF Audi?! We should be getting RS3s with a manual!


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## tt-ho (May 26, 2011)

mremg said:


> The A3 outsold the A4 by quite a margin in 2015.
> 
> https://www.audiusa.com/newsroom/news/press-releases/2016/01/audi-passes-200000-u-s-sales-for-first-time-with-sixth-record-year
> 
> ...


Just the street I live on in my neighborhood, there's 3 A3 lol


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## AceOfSpades (Feb 26, 2003)

tt-ho said:


> Just the street I live on in my neighborhood, there's 3 A3 lol



I will say they did a good job putting and auto union badge on a VW the A3 is much more fun to drive then the A4 but maybe thats due to it not being the new A4?


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