# 02J swap into Mk3 2.0



## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Hey all,

I'm just gathering info on swapping an 02J (4cyl) into my Cabrio. I want to do it as OEM as possible (little to no fabrication).

So far, I have gotten this info:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...J-Swap-pics-and-answers-for-people-interested
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5820143-DIY-02A-gt-02J-Shifter-conversion-for-VR6-SLC-Cars

Main areas of concern:
*transmission bolt-in*: the 4 cyl bellhousing should just bolt right up to the ABA, pattern is the same. rear trans mount bracket needs to come from an 02A car, should bolt to mk3 mount. The extra cabrio trans mount should bolt up as well.

*Shifter*: with the Polo shift box, the whole shifter assembly should bolt in. 

*Clutch actuator parts*: the 02A/Mk3 clutch master and slave should bolt in, no new pedal assy. needed.

*Clutch/flywheel*: I'm a bit iffy on this. Mk4 2.0, 1.8T Mk3 VR? Passat 02A/ABA? which fit, and which is the best choice?

*Starter*: Mk4 starter should bolt on and work.

*Axles*: according to the VR 02J swap thread, Mk4 2.0l had the same 100mm flanges as Mk3, so the stock axles should fit? I'm going to swap 5 lug on also (maybe not at the same time), what axles would I need then? Stock VR, or hybrid?

Anything I'm missing? Thanks!


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## Mr.loops (May 27, 2010)

Uber seemed to have nailed it with this conversion. According to him, the stock Mk3 axles will work with the new 02J box. 

The only input I can offer is that there are 02J's out there with either 100mm or 108mm flanges. The 100mm are for the Rzeppa style CV's, and the 108mm are for the triple roller style. Double check those flanges before purchasing that box


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Yeah, but his conversion mostly deals with the VR... my main concern were differences between axles and clutch. Good info on the cv. Didn't automatic mk3 VRs come with the later style inner CVs? Is there any sort of upgrade to be had there?

Sent from my face


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Bump for specifics with the clutch. How similar is a VR and ABA clutch for 02a?

Sent from my face


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## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

You'll want an 02A or 02J clutch. The typical recommendation is to go with a VR clutch setup using a single mass, lightweight, flywheel as they're stronger and fit no problem. 

As stated, make sure you get a trans with the 100mm axle flanges. There is NO benefit to the 108mm... I haven't seen any solid proof, but the 108mm are generally believed to be more fragile, mainly due to there only being 3 rollers, as opposed to having 6 ball bearigns. 

To do a 5-lug, you may need hybrid drive shafts, but this is easily done with a vice, a hammer, and a block of wood to swap the wheel end of the shafts. I think you'd want Jetta hubs/axle ends.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Thank you, and thank you again for the extra bit of info about the 108s! 

Good to know. May I ask why stock VR/5 lug axles wouldn't work, if it's the same trans and same brakes? The 2.0 02J should have the matching 100mm cups? Or do the VRs have the 108? I haven't looked into them too much.


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## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

I think I missed some of your original info: 

2.0l and TDI models equipped with 02J trans had 100mm axle flange/cup. 

VR and 1.8T models had 108mm flange/cup. 

I do not know which hub 2.0l or TDI equipped cars came with.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

I'm sorry, i should have specified, I meant Mk3 VR. They also had 108 with the 02A? The rest of the info is useful, thanks  

I already have a 5 lug setup with hybrid axles (11", and 100mm cups), I had thought that was the OE size for Mk3 VR but I suppose not. So the 100mm axles are actually better. I would have perferred to keep it OE with 108mm (in case I need to get a new axle for some reason), but if the 100mm are better, I'll keep those.


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## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

02A trans came with 90mm or 100mm.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Hmm, are you sure? All Mk2 by the end were 100mm except for diesel. I doubt they went back to 90mm for the higher output Mk3s that came with the 02A?


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## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

positive. 

02A: 90mm or 100mm 

02J: 100mm or 108mm 

I am not specifying which vehicles were paired with which flange size, just that each one had 2 distinct sizes.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

I know but the mk3 020s all used 100, so it send odd to use 90 on the special models that used 02a. 

Well, thanks, thatsuseful info too 

Sent from my face


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## 68redbug2000jetta (Sep 14, 2007)

well i know my vr6 02j on my old mk4 had 108mm axles and 1.8t i think also had 108mm.im actually putting mk4 108mm vr6 axles on my 2.0 golf that im doing a 02j conversion on using mk4 hubs re drilled.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Did some etka searching today. 

First off, I learned the 020 soldiered on in the mk4 as the "02K" on small engines in Europe. Far out, man. Some of those used 90mm flanges too. But all 02As I found in mk3s used 100mm axles. Autos used 108mm. Mk3 2.0 02J used 100, vr and tdi used 108. 02j actually shared 02a part numbers too. 

Sent from my face


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Bump this up.

Does this sound good?

http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volkswagen/Jetta/Clutch/55/21

The first one is the upgraded kit offered for the Mk4 2.0. it seems like a good idea since it includes the flywheel and all. But I don't need such a fancy heavy-duty clutch for my 2.0.

if I were to get the second one, the OEM, what else do i need? Flywheel, installation parts?

Basically, what is the cheapest way? There are just too many choices, my head hurts.


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## therealvrt (Jul 21, 2004)

Clutch- flywheel from a corrado g60 or Passat 16v
-disc and pressure plate from above mentioned or corrado vr or passat vr or mk3 vr
You cannot use a vr flywheel because it has 10 bolt holes vs 6 bolt hole to mount it to the crank
Unless you are making big power just get an oem type clutch. 
Use a mk3 shift box, polo not needed. 
02j from a 1.8t has 108 mm cups. You do not want those. Mk4 tdi or 2l came with 100mm cups. Your mk3 axles bolt right up to those 100mm cups as long as your car is not an automatic. 
I believe the mk4 starter has a different connector and i believe any 4cyl 02a starter will work
I believe you will also need an 02a speed sensor or have to change to connector on your harness to match the 02j speed sensor

Edit. The clutch kit you linked is a good choice
If you swap to 5 bolt all you need is mk3 vr axles, no hybrid bs


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

I want the Polo box because I want the 02J shifter. I know I can modify a Mk4 shift box, but, then I wouldn't be OEMPLS, would I? 

Thanks for the info on the VR flywheel. I was wondering why the kits looked identical except fro 2 bolts. As for the clutch, I just want the cheapest, complete kit I can find. I'm not throwing big power (though, the dual mass flywheel might make it feel smoother, it's really expensive!). Speaking of which, any more info on what exactly a dual mass flywheel is 

If i got a 1.8T trans, the cups should be easily swappable, right? From any 02A-style trans. 

The starters for all 020/02A/02J/automatics look the same on German Auto Parts.. except that the Mk4 ones have a built in support bushing (instead of using the trans case to crank), and some are missing the third mounting hole (02A-style trans). So I might need to get one of those, but they do seem relatively universal otherwise. 

The 02J speed sensor bolts in differently? This is the first I've heard about needing one.


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## therealvrt (Jul 21, 2004)

The 02a flanges use a circlip to hold it in place while the 02j uses a bolt to hold it in place and they use different axles seals. Can 02a work in the 02j? That i cannot answer. I would just find 100mm 02j cups
The electrical connector on the speed sensor is different (iirc) not how it installs into the tranny.


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## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

dual mass flywheel is an overweight, over-engineered, over-complicated piece of work built only to justify someone's job at VAG...

I'm not a fan of them...

That said, their main purpose is to smooth transitions and dampen vibrations. It is essentially 2 flywheels built into a single unit, with a spring loaded dampener between them. So when you shift or hit the gas, one plate will start to spin, compress the damper, then catch the second plate, and your off to the races.

Just one more part to break.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

.therealvrt said:


> The 02a flanges use a circlip to hold it in place while the 02j uses a bolt to hold it in place and they use different axles seals. Can 02a work in the 02j? That i cannot answer. I would just find 100mm 02j cups
> The electrical connector on the speed sensor is different (iirc) not how it installs into the tranny.


Good to know, if I do happen across a 1.8T trans (I like the gearing better, it's more like a Mk3 than the bigger-tire Mk4s), I can swap the flanges with another 02J. 

About the speed sensor, why couldn't I jsut use the Mk3 speed sensor then? It might read a bit different, but I could use wheels and tires sized like a Mk4, right? or maybe put the Mk4 gear on the Mk3 sensor? 



rstolz said:


> dual mass flywheel is an overweight, over-engineered, over-complicated piece of work built only to justify someone's job at VAG...
> 
> I'm not a fan of them...
> 
> ...


Haha, that's exactly what I figured. I am kinda going for "overengineered" in this car, however, if it has a history of problems I'll skip it.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

K, so I finally got to starting to remove the old trans.

Question: the clutch pedal is NOT different from cable to hydro? The master cylinder mount looks a lot lower than the cable outlet, and I don't know how it attaches to the pedal?

Also, the front bracket HAS to be from a Mk3 TDI, or can it come from a Passat 16v/ABA/TDI? Thanks!

I also found this, it should include everything I need clutch-wise, for fairly cheap!
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...leo-Clutch-and-Flywheel-Kits-for-16V-2.0L-TDI!


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## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

the pedal is not different but the mounting points are different.

The cable clutch clips in to the top of the pedal, the hydro clutch clips into the middle of the pedal

hydro:
http://volkswagen.workshop-manuals.com/golf-mk3/index.php?id=1745

Cable:
http://volkswagen.workshop-manuals.com/polo-mk3/index.php?id=1780

I can't add anything about the mount for mkIII


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

Thanks, that's helpful! I'll have to bookmark that.


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## adicted to dubs (Apr 19, 2007)

VDub2625 said:


> K, so I finally got to starting to remove the old trans.
> 
> Question: the clutch pedal is NOT different from cable to hydro? The master cylinder mount looks a lot lower than the cable outlet, and I don't know how it attaches to the pedal?
> 
> ...


Yes the front mount bracket has to be Mk3 Tdi


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

adicted to dubs said:


> Yes the front mount bracket has to be Mk3 Tdi


Thanks, and most of the evidence I've seen points to that, however, there is some conflicting info. Why exactly can't a Passat one be used? I'm curious because they both share the same part if it's an automatic VR6, which makes me think the 2.0 bracket should be swappable... not sure why it wouldn't be?


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## adicted to dubs (Apr 19, 2007)

VDub2625 said:


> Thanks, and most of the evidence I've seen points to that, however, there is some conflicting info. Why exactly can't a Passat one be used? I'm curious because they both share the same part if it's an automatic VR6, which makes me think the 2.0 bracket should be swappable... not sure why it wouldn't be?



When I was doing my swap,02J Tdi into Mk3 ABA auto,I tried using both ABA manual and auto front bracket and none would fit properly.
It took me a while to find somebody to put me in a right direction,that being Mk3 Tdi mount.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

adicted to dubs said:


> When I was doing my swap,02J Tdi into Mk3 ABA auto,I tried using both ABA manual and auto front bracket and none would fit properly.
> It took me a while to find somebody to put me in a right direction,that being Mk3 Tdi mount.


ABA bracket from what exactly?


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## adicted to dubs (Apr 19, 2007)

Mk3 jetta/Golf 2.0


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

adicted to dubs said:


> Mk3 jetta/Golf 2.0


 Yeah, that's what I have, I have heard you can hack it but I was talking about the Passat ABA one. Passat uses an 02a, not 020 like mk3.

Sent from my LG-LS970 using Tapatalk 2


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

I have a friend who bought the full clutch and timing chain kit for his VR that didn't pan out. 

I could buy the pp, disc, and tb and use them with a 228mm 6 bolt flywheel, right? 

I'm sorry that I seem to be asking the same questions- it's fitting together in my head, via pictures and whatnot, but it's hard to think about since I haven't actually worked on a VR, or a mk4 2l, or anything with an 02A. i can picture all the 020 stuff easily, lol. 

Still hoping the passat 16v/2.0/TDi bracket would bolt in place of the Mk3 one... I don't see why not if some models DID use the same bracket.


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## VDub2625 (Jan 4, 2003)

I forgot that I made this thread, here's the finished result!

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6050009-02A-J-S-swap-into-Mk3-thread-(4-cylinder)


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