# sway bar question



## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

looking to purchase new sway bars- am on stock now








should i get both front and back?
if so which mil?
nuespeed? (most likely i would get)
how much difference does it make? From experience, i am getting alot of roll for example acc on an onramp, will this be eliminated? { i had a few cars modded just have not done sway bars ever.. as to why so many questions ha







}
your input would be awesome http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
thanks in advance


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## MR GIGGLES (Aug 8, 2005)

*Re: sway bar question (DuBSPEED22)*

i had a RSB on my mk4 gti.... i loved it.... keep accelerating around them corners while everyone else is slowing down








i am just unsure as to what size to run on the TT??


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## Ergokinetics (Mar 23, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (MR GIGGLES)*

I'm running a rear Neuspeed 19mm on my TT. Night and day difference over stock. IMHO its one of the best bang for the buck TT mods.


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## my own style tt (Sep 2, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (DuBSPEED22)*

I was told by ELF from Streamline Industrys that he had the 21mm and it was to much so he went down to a 19mm


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## iminthegaragedear (Jul 18, 2007)

I also have the Neuspeed 19mm, and like it a lot. I track my car occasionally and it is much more neutral with this bar.


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## scoTT la rock (Jun 17, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (DuBSPEED22)*

i have the neuspeed 19 RSB and love it! 
im about to get a neuspeed FSB too, as my stock bushings are shot and might as well just get the bar to complete the package.
best prices ive found are MJM- great deals on all things TT:
http://www.mjmautohaus.com/cat..._9079


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## iminthegaragedear (Jul 18, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (scoTT la rock)*

Wouldn't that just bring back more understeer, that you've greatly reduced by adding the rear bar????


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## M this 1! (May 17, 2000)

*Re: sway bar question (iminthegaragedear)*

if you want to make a difference in the car right away, get the 19mm rear and call it done. 
if you want to really make it aggressive w/o too much of a handful, get the 22 ft and rear together.
if you have a 19 now and add the front, you gain some front end feed back and the car is flatter, BUT at the expense of traction. the car will understeer more. 
i did this:
rear 19 only = very good feeling car (a gain of 4mm over stock)
then added front 22 = more understeer at limit, but felt great below that. (a gain of 2mm over stock)
then i replaced the 19 with a 22 rear = lots of oversteer when i want, but no real understeer and a very flat feeling car.
this last step makes sense since the front gained 2mm and the rear gained 3mm over the 19 previously on it.


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## scoTT la rock (Jun 17, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (M this 1!)*

does anyone have any experience with these:
http://www.ttstuff.com/Merchan...50320
here's my situation- i have the neuspeed 19 in the rear, and my bushings are shot on my stock front bar. i could do one of three things:
1. just replace the front bushing with OEM audi (about 12 bucks). im wary of this because they seem crappy from the getgo and they will only need to be replaced again anyway.
2. get the ttstuff powerflex bushings (about 45 bucks). dont know much about these but they sound like they may be good
3. just get a neuspeed FSB and call it a day.
the cost is not really a factor either way, i just wanna eliminate my front-end creaking and do something that will last.
what do you guys think??? any input is appreciated.... THX


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## M this 1! (May 17, 2000)

*Re: sway bar question (scoTT la rock)*

if you have the original set up in the front, you do not have bushing problems. the creaking comes from the sleeve that is on the swaybar itself. it is bonded to the bar. this bond breaks and creaks. buy the 20mm front Power Flex bushings, then cut off the sleeve on the swaybar. grease, and put back together. problem solved AND you get crisper turn in with the power flex. You HAVE to cut off the sleeve to get the new Power Flex to fit and of course to get rid of the noise.


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## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: sway bar question (M this 1!)*


_Quote, originally posted by *M this 1!* »_if you want to make a difference in the car right away, get the 19mm rear and call it done. 
if you want to really make it aggressive w/o too much of a handful, get the 22 ft and rear together.
if you have a 19 now and add the front, you gain some front end feed back and the car is flatter, BUT at the expense of traction. the car will understeer more. 
i did this:
rear 19 only = very good feeling car (a gain of 4mm over stock)
then added front 22 = more understeer at limit, but felt great below that. (a gain of 2mm over stock)
then i replaced the 19 with a 22 rear = lots of oversteer when i want, but no real understeer and a very flat feeling car.
this last step makes sense since the front gained 2mm and the rear gained 3mm over the 19 previously on it. 


Or you can get an H&R 21mm rear with two settings. You will have a 20mm front and 21mm rear. Unless you are really hardcore - this should be sufficient and you won't have to drop you front subframe to install a front bar.


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

so dont get front and backs? just rear?
thanks


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## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: (DuBSPEED22)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DuBSPEED22* »_so dont get front and backs? just rear?
thanks

I run just a rear 21mm H&R bar - with the stock 20mm front - it's fine on the street and track for me - but i've also got KW V3 coilovers.


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## TTracing (Mar 20, 2008)

*Re: ([email protected])*

I had a 25 mm front and a 19 mm back Neuspeed.
Just replaced them with a set of hollow adjustable, Hotchkis, same mm. Save 10 lbs but I'm not faster. I still got to find the right set-up...


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re:*

ordered 19mm nuespeed RSB this afternoon








now how are is it to install? would i be able to do it myself with just a jack and regular tools?
thanks guys


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## cant get a password (Sep 24, 2004)

*Re: Re: (DuBSPEED22)*

I hope you mean a jack and jack stands never get under a car without it being on jackstands or ramps.


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re: Re: (cant get a password)*

ha yea but is it do-able to replace.. might get my buddy to come by for some assistance http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: Re: (DuBSPEED22)*

45 minutes tops - including jacking up your car and putting it on stands.


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: Re: ([email protected])*

You have to remove the rear exhaust section and the heatshield, but all you'll need is a ratchet set tool-wise. Its easy http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## markcorrado1 (Sep 15, 2001)

I saw on Wak-TT's website that you can use the Golf R32 sway bars on the TT (23mm Front, 19mm Rear) I know his in the UK so the R32 might have different size bars over there, does anyone know if they are the same size like in Europe, I checked out the prices on 1stvwparts.com and it was a lot cheaper than buying the Neuspeed bars


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

very interesting, curious about that

what size is our FSB? (stock)


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## cdougyfresh (Sep 16, 2004)

*Re: (markcorrado1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *markcorrado1* »_I saw on Wak-TT's website that you can use the Golf R32 sway bars on the TT (23mm Front, 19mm Rear) I know his in the UK so the R32 might have different size bars over there, does anyone know if they are the same size like in Europe, I checked out the prices on 1stvwparts.com and it was a lot cheaper than buying the Neuspeed bars









i bet you could score one on R32 classifieds even cheaper!


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## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: (DuBSPEED22)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DuBSPEED22* »_very interesting, curious about that

what size is our FSB? (stock)

Early 2000's were 19mm front and 16mm rear. Later when they went to the MKII suspension the fronts were increased to 20mm and rear reduced to 14mm.
There is really no reason to increase front sway bar size.


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## markcorrado1 (Sep 15, 2001)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Early 2000's were 19mm front and 16mm rear. Later when they went to the MKII suspension the fronts were increased to 20mm and rear reduced to 14mm.
There is really no reason to increase front sway bar size. 

So just a 19mm in the rear would neutral things out







I think I'll be saving some cash and I'll be getting a 19mm RSB from the R32







It's only $79 on 1stvwparts.com https://www.trademotion.com/pa...gid=1
Edit, well I did a few searchs in the R32 forum and it looks like as usual in the good ole U S of A the R32 got funked on the sway bars in this country. The EU R32's got bigger sway bars








Here is a pic and part number for the EU R32 RSB
http://www.wak-tt.com/mods/arb/arb.htm








Wonder if VW can order it for cheap state side, I'll do my digging to see what I can find










_Modified by markcorrado1 at 10:30 AM 5-9-2008_


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## M this 1! (May 17, 2000)

*Re: (markcorrado1)*

stop your search and just get the Neuspeed. I can't imagine you saving enough to make it worth your troubles and time.


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re: (M this 1!)*

agreed. got one on the way http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
19 mm, ill let you know my thoughts








still debating whether to get it installed at a shop or doing it myself..


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## DnA-TT (Oct 21, 2003)

*Re: (DuBSPEED22)*

As long as you have basic tools and can elevate the rear of the car, it looks like a straight forward job. Haven't bought my bar yet, but just looking at the car it seems pretty easy.


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## iminthegaragedear (Jul 18, 2007)

Not difficult at all, and not true that you have to remove part of the exhaust. Plenty of room if you just loosen aft hangars and let it droop a bit. A great upgrade.


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: (iminthegaragedear)*

Whatever way you do it, its a 2hr job at most, and very worthwhile


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## Beltway (Apr 5, 2008)

*Re: (l88m22vette)*

I'm running the 28 mm Neuspeed adjustable on the rear and the standard OEM up front, I much prefer the feel of the car now.


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## Krissrock (Sep 10, 2005)

well since ppl are saying it's so easy...does anyone have a write up on installing it?


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## iminthegaragedear (Jul 18, 2007)

Yeah TT in WV has a nice DIY with photos on a rear swaybar change. You can find his link on the "TT Goodies" site.


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re: (iminthegaragedear)*

nice will look into that http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
should be here tom


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## DnA-TT (Oct 21, 2003)

iminthegarage - whoa...never seen that site before. Thanks!


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## iminthegaragedear (Jul 18, 2007)

*Re: (DnA-TT)*


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## Krissrock (Sep 10, 2005)

*Re: (iminthegaragedear)*

well i installed mine today...honestly...i don't feel a difference. THere's no way to install incorrectly right? 
Now i'm kinda motivated to get a front ASB to a bigger difference. 
maybe i'll feel the effect when I get to do some really curvy roads...I just took a spin around the neighborhood for now.


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## DnA-TT (Oct 21, 2003)

I wouldn't expect to notice a lick of difference going around the block. Find some on-ramps or some twisties!


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## bauch1425 (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: (DnA-TT)*

Nice thread - convinced me to do an impulse buy of a 19mm Neuspeed RSB when I was just looking to replacing the squeaking OEM bushings in my FSB.
Hopefully it'll help kill the gross amount of understeer. I took a right corner around my house after it had rained at decent speed and ended up in the left lane... wasn't fun having the wheel cranked and not going where I was supposed to.


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re: (bauch1425)*

hahah nice. yea i cant wait for mine in the mail and get that sucker on.. ill def post my opinon up. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## iminthegaragedear (Jul 18, 2007)

*Re: (Krissrock)*

Well, most folks (myself included) notice a significant difference in body lean/roll as well as a much more neutral feel to the car without the characteristic understeer. I went to an SCCA (roadcourse) event just after putting mine on last year. I found that if I went into a corner too hot, I could get all four corners to slide but never pushed the front end like I used to(understeer). I could easily accellerate out of the slide with my right foot. Iwouldn't expect you to notice it until you drive it a little aggressively, though it may seem a tiny bit stiffer over bumps/ruts. You might expect this to be more noticeable with a bigger or both bigger bars. You gotta drive it to feel it! Cheers


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## Krissrock (Sep 10, 2005)

*Re: (iminthegaragedear)*

as for the instal. TT in VW's page was helpful. Especially since he had a write up and not just pics as some people do....Pics are not helpful alone...but what surprised me is that it could be installed w/o being jacked up. there's bascally no pressure on the bar while the car is flat..anyway, good product


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## dmcalmo (May 12, 2008)

*Re: sway bar question (M this 1!)*

Was wondering if the change from 19mm rear and stock front to the 22mm frt and 22mm rear was about the same feel or worth the price to upgrade both ends.


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## roadyTT (Mar 28, 2006)

*Re: (Krissrock)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Krissrock* »_well i installed mine today...honestly...i don't feel a difference. THere's no way to install incorrectly right? 
Now i'm kinda motivated to get a front ASB to a bigger difference. 
maybe i'll feel the effect when I get to do some really curvy roads...I just took a spin around the neighborhood for now. 

Go find a nice exit or entrance ramp...you'll feel it


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: sway bar question (dmcalmo)*

A front will increase grip, but also ultimately increase understeer. Also, you have to drop the front subframe.
On that note, how do people not know about basic suspension mods? I mean damn, _Gran Turismo_ is 10 years old. Play it already!!


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## M this 1! (May 17, 2000)

*Re: sway bar question (l88m22vette)*

dmcalmo,
the 22 ft/rr is a more aggressive set up over the stock ft/19 rr. in terms of oversteer. the bigger front decreases grip but creates a flatter cornering car that has a quicker turn in. then the bigger rear over the 19 gives back the front grip and then some


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## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: sway bar question (M this 1!)*

I think the moral of the story is to try and balance the front and rear size of the bar so that the rear is close to or only slightly larger in diameter to the front.


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: sway bar question ([email protected])*

^^ Actually, I think closer bars would be good for a TT with a Haldex controller, whereas a stock TT should use a larger rear bar with or without a (smaller) front bar, because of the delayed power distribution. You're really trying to balance the power delivery with the car's behavior. Here is the stock vs. Blue engagement graph:


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## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: sway bar question (l88m22vette)*


_Quote, originally posted by *l88m22vette* »_^^ Actually, I think closer bars would be good for a TT with a Haldex controller, whereas a stock TT should use a larger rear bar with or without a (smaller) front bar, because of the delayed power distribution. You're really trying to balance the power delivery with the car's behavior. 

While the blue haldex may have some effect - a larger rear bar really changes the character of the car - especially at speeds you see on a track. The size of the bars should also relate to the type of suspension you have - ie. spring rates etc. Higher spring rates effectively do the same thing - remove body roll.


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

Soo I got the 19mm RSB installed yesterday....WoWness. Night and Day difference! Its kinda hard to discribe but the response when turning is great, on and off ramps.. you can hug the inside so much better and still be able to acc. out of it without oversteer.
Worth every penny. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Really thinking about getting the Haldex Blue now..


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: sway bar question (DuBSPEED22)*

I think I started something


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (l88m22vette)*

YES you did! ha I think after ever mod i say.. 'why didnt this come stock' ha guess thats why its called 'aftermarket performance'








now is the haldex blue related to the sway bar as far as night and day difference? give me some input http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
sucks b.c i really wanna upgrade my brakes too


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## bauch1425 (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: sway bar question (DuBSPEED22)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DuBSPEED22* »_Soo I got the 19mm RSB installed yesterday....WoWness. Night and Day difference! Its kinda hard to discribe but the response when turning is great, on and off ramps.. you can hug the inside so much better and still be able to acc. out of it without oversteer.
Worth every penny. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Really thinking about getting the Haldex Blue now..
















Did you get it installed yourself? If so, how difficult was it? From the how-to's I've looked at, it looks simple to do. I just got mine yesterday from MJM and looking to install it this weekend. I'm looking forward to it now after I've heard your impressions of it! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (bauch1425)*

Honestly, i was gonna install it and what not.. but to tell you the truth, with my busy life right now and even having a chance at F'in it up i figure ill just bring it to KMD and have it installed and done right.. 100 bucks







done and ready to go.








if your handy enough more power to ya.. i just have this thing, when it comes down to stuff i dont 'think' i can tackle i get it done professionally








best of luck bauch, youll love it! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## M this 1! (May 17, 2000)

*Re: sway bar question (DuBSPEED22)*

on the gas hard out of a 2nd gear corner you will definitely feel the Haldex being night and day. other areas it blends in pretty seamlessly. 
i agree with your question to audi on why not doing it stock this way. the ONLY mod i've done that i didn't was the rear LSD. i could see people getting into trouble and getting too sideways with it. it's great, i love it, but i can see some with low skill levels crashing


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## bauch1425 (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: sway bar question (M this 1!)*

I installed my new RSB yesterday and the difference is amazing. I notice a difference even just cruising around tow - the backend seems WAY stiffer.
I had a chance to get on it today on some (rough) backroads and the difference was great. It didn't feel like the front end wanted to "wash out" like before and it felt more like the backend was pushing, instead of the front pulling.
This should have come stock!
As far as the installation went, it was very straight forward. I managed to remove/install the new one without completely dropping the heat shield and exhaust. I dropped the left and right exhaust hangers, undid the heatshield and just let everything hang there while I worked. 
It would have been a lot easier to install the new bar without the exhaust there, but never working on the TT exhaust before - I wasn't sure how hard it would be to put in once it was out - so I left it.
I'm not the most mechanically inclined person but installing the RSB was extremely straight forward.


_Modified by bauch1425 at 3:23 PM 5-26-2008_


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## DuBSPEED22 (Mar 12, 2007)

*Re: sway bar question (bauch1425)*

Awesome! good to hear! I want the haldex now but i dont want to dish out







$900!!


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