# MKV GTI FSI Fueling Issues - Cam follower intact but p2293/p0087/p0171 codes



## bizzarODog (Jul 5, 2016)

Hi all, new here but have been lurking for a while. The resources here have been invaluable, but now I've run into something I can't quite track down. I know theres likely some info somewhere on the forums, but its difficult to sift through all the bad cam follower cases, which this doesn't seem to be.

First things first, 2008 GTI with 86k on the clock, pretty regular oil changes but kinda procrastinating on the timing belt, which I plan to do soon. I've been having some issues lately with CEL's and power loss. I've noticed that my car is often well down on power with some "lumpy" delivery, particularly in the 2-3k range before boost builds. 3 or 4 times I've had my car feel like its gone into some kind of limp mode, with almost no power to speak of, but its gone away each time I start the car next. Its thrown a couple CEL's (p2293 and p0087 mostly) but they've also gone away quickly. The first time this occurred was about a month ago. I took the car into the dealership, fearing the worst (follower/hpfp/cam replacement) but walked out with TSB work being done on a sensor and assurances that the follower was ok. Not entirely trusting the dealer, and not having checked the follower for about 25k miles, I pulled it and saw that it was totally fine. Plugs were overdue, so I replaced them and the coils, which did fix a misfire that I think was unrelated. Things felt ok for a while, but then ran into the severe power cut (limp mode?) twice last week. I changed the air and fuel filter (which was nasty) and took for a short test drive. It felt like my power was back, until I took it for a long drive yesterday and then back and forth to work. On my way home I got another CEL with p2293, p0087, and p0171 codes. If its not the *big* issue (cam follower) what else could it be? I'm not super handy around an engine and I've kind of run out of ideas. I think I read something about the hpfp solenoid (N276?) potentially causing issues, but I'm not entirely sure how to diagnose or if it could cause this. Idle is pretty smooth and I haven't had issues with cold starts... don't know if thats relevant either, but maybe it rules stuff out.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## bizzarODog (Jul 5, 2016)

Small update, but no real progress. I had slightly rounded the flats on the pressure relief valve for the HPFP, so I went to replace that today. I noticed that the pin was slightly bent when taking it out so I thought it was possible that had something to do with the codes. Unfortunately no such luck, CEL came back after clearing. So far only p0171 has made an appearance, so I'll keep an eye out for the rest on the off chance I managed to fix one problem and then somehow cause another vacuum leak in the process (had p0171 in the past with a vac leak that was fixed)

FYI follower and cam after last replacement (30k between replacements, 85k on the clock) follower was fine, pump tip ok, cam looks fine to me just superficial scratches (lmk if you disagree). click through for higher res.


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## kbad (May 26, 2007)

hey man .. welcome to the vortex, hope you get this sorted out soon .. since you've already addressed many items and with power loss as you are describing, have you checked the in-tank fuel pump/sending unit - the sending unit can become faulty causing random mischief, specially if original .. good luck!


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## bizzarODog (Jul 5, 2016)

kbad said:


> hey man .. welcome to the vortex, hope you get this sorted out soon .. since you've already addressed many items and with power loss as you are describing, have you checked the in-tank fuel pump/sending unit - the sending unit can become faulty causing random mischief, specially if original .. good luck!


Thanks for the reply! I haven't checked the in-tank fuel pump. Are you referring to issues with the pump itself or with the control module (or both)? I'm not sure how I can go about diagnosing those problems, or if just replacing the pump is the best option. Should I consider replacing the low pressure fuel sensor or is that unlikely to be the cause?


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## mddlfngz (May 26, 2016)

Hey!

If you have access to VCDS you should check these:

Checking Fuel Pressure
Prerequisites:
Ignition ON
Engine ON (Idle)
System voltage at least 11.0 V.
Coolant Temperature at least 80 °C

[Select]
[01 - Engine]
[Meas. Blocks - 08]
Group 103
[Go!]
Field 1: Fuel Pressure (Low), Specification: 2800...7200 mbar
Field 2: Fuel Pump Adaptation, Specification: -1000...+1000 %
Note:

Timing chain driven engines such as the CCTA, CBFA and CCTA were phased in during model year 2008. Those engines do not use a G410 (Low) Fuel Pressure Sensor so Measuring Blocks group 103 is not applicable.

Group 106
[Go!]
Field 2: Fuel Rail,Pressure (actual): 55% or below is normal at idle
55% to 60% is a gray area, it may be okay, but may indicate a problem
Above 60% implies there is a failure or restriction
Causes of low pressure can include kinks or restrictions in fuel lines
Fuel filter issues including restricted/clogged or incorrect part number
Failing lift pump in fuel tank. We have seen numerous cases of sub-standard quality "factory" replacements in "factory boxes" that were obtained from aftermarket sources and are not sourced from official dealers. This led to troubleshooting problems that were solved by installing correct factory parts. We encourage customers to only install lift pump and fuel filter sourced directly from a VW/Audi dealer.

Group 140
[Go!]
Field 3: Fuel Rail Pressure (High), Specification: 25.0...110.0 bar
Increase the Engine Speed while checking this value, the Pressure has to rise with the Engine Speed.
Group 230
[Go!]
Field 1: Specified Fuel Rail Pressure (High)
Field 2: Actual Fuel Rail Pressure (High), Specification: 25.0...110.0 bar
Field 3: Deviation between specified and actual fuel pressure, Specification: max. 5.0 bar
This video may be helpful:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jThQVzYFbVo


[Done, Go Back]
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]


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## bizzarODog (Jul 5, 2016)

mddlfngz said:


> Hey!
> 
> If you have access to VCDS you should check these:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice. I don't know anybody with VCDS personally, but I've been meaning to ask around for friends of friends and the like. I've also got the low pressure fuel sensor incoming from ECS, though I'm not exactly bullish it will fix the issue. 

Since last week I haven't seen any p2293/p0087 codes re-emerge, but I'm definitely still way down on power. p0171 keeps coming back if I clear it. The last time I had p0171 codes it was a vacuum leak, but I don't recall losing so much power and idle was high, so I kinda doubt its necessarily that. Without the ability to diagnose the fuel system via VCDS its probably going to be tough to separate this from any other potential issue, but is it possible that the PCV is bad and this is causing the lean code? I pulled the dipstick out while running and the engine didn't seem to run particularly rough, and I got what sounded like a sucking sound. Something similar when I pulled the oil cap off.


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## bizzarODog (Jul 5, 2016)

Still no luck finding anyone with VCDS, so I'm afraid I won't be able to really figure this one out without just throwing stuff at the wall and seeing what sticks. I guess the good news is that all my codes are gone. I cleared the p0171 twice and after the second time it hasn't come back (about a week now), but my car still feels down on power. Sometimes it seems significantly worse than others, but in general it seems like really bad turbo lag, with no power down low. Contemplating inspecting/replacing the diverter valve.


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