# simple question for serious S3 buyers...



## pjunk1 (May 13, 2010)

*IF*, i said, if, a S3 dsg + mmi nav + whatever option you like is $45k. would you buy it?

I had sport differential in place of "whatever option" but informed it will not be offered on MQB; only MLB platform.


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## Exousia (Feb 22, 2010)

If it was the sportback-*Yes, without question*.

If sedan, *maybe* after a few test drives and usability checks, and it included the LED headlights and tails.

if sedan, no LED, or fails usability check, then *no*.


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## Rudy_H (Jul 6, 2012)

Yes if it included NAV

Pretty sure if it has HID's (which the S3 better come base), it will have LED's as this is a trend on all Audi's in the lineup, right down to the current A3. I had someone tell me an A3 had HID's stock that they were selling, and didn't see the LED's...but had them. Lifted the hood and knew Audi wouldn't wire up HID's like that (ended up being made in China crap that lasts a year under severe weather).

Sport diff...a bit confused on what is meant by this, as I understand the new Haldex isn't too mechanical and will be more electronic. So this might be a mute point, copying off options from the S4?

Swayed to the S-Tronic(DSG) myself. 

Sportback becomes a no brainer


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## Cyncris (Aug 12, 2012)

pjunk1 said:


> *IF*, i said, if, a S3 dsg + mmi nav & sport dif goes for $45k. would you buy it?


I fully expect to have the MSRP on mine come to close to 50K.

The DSG is standard and currently the only choice, nav is a have-to for me as well as B&O, optional 19s, and adaptive suspension. Wants are LED headlights, carbon inlays, and smart key. 
The S3 will not have a sport diff option at all.

I have told my salesman to contact me as soon as I can legitimately order one.


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## Travis Grundke (May 26, 1999)

pjunk1 said:


> *IF*, i said, if, a S3 dsg + mmi nav & sport dif goes for $45k. would you buy it?


There will be no sport differential on the S3, that's going to be specific to the MLB product, not MQB.

That said, $45k is out of my budget for a car. I'm likely looking at the 2.0TFSI Quattro A3 instead.


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## VeeDubDriver (Oct 1, 2001)

For me, it all depends on how it leases. But what I want is navi with backup cam, B&O and smart key. I would prefer a manual, but I might be open to S-Tronic.


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## Chimera (Jul 6, 2002)

VeeDubDriver said:


> For me, it all depends on how it leases. But what I want is navi with backup cam, B&O and smart key. I would prefer a manual, but I might be open to S-Tronic.


This. I don't want an $800 payment for the next 5yrs, I'd rather do a $450 lease for 2.5 then decide for a small premium (even with minor mods). A $45k, 300hp BMW 335 xdrive lease starts at 419/mo.


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## pjunk1 (May 13, 2010)

Rudy_H said:


> Yes if it included NAV
> 
> Pretty sure if it has HID's (which the S3 better come base), it will have LED's as this is a trend on all Audi's in the lineup, right down to the current A3. I had someone tell me an A3 had HID's stock that they were selling, and didn't see the LED's...but had them. Lifted the hood and knew Audi wouldn't wire up HID's like that (ended up being made in China crap that lasts a year under severe weather).
> 
> ...


yes, copying off of S4. probably the wrong way but i was just adding options mostly found on the typical S4 trying to make $45k for the S3. we can throw out and replace with something that may add-on another $1k. 

i'm just trying to gauge how many of us would purchase the S3 at $45k +/- given whatever options will be the prepackage on the S3. for example, i looked at the S4's in the orange county and los angeles area. most available S4 had NAV and the sport differential. although, the base msrp on the S4 is $47k, the real world pricing on available units is about $55k to $57k. i found one unit that was $51k. 

my point is that we may focus on the msrp of $39-$40k but reality is that most available S3's will be mid-$40k. unless, you custom order. 

$45k + tax/lic is not cheap by no means. i want it but, dang, after some money down still looking at $700-$800/mth. that's preowned 997 money.


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## mookieblaylock (Sep 25, 2005)

if i get one it's pretty much going to be base model. $3k factory nav is absurd. Adaptive suspension would be nice but that might not even come here. Hatch would be an easy decision


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## KnockKnock (Jun 30, 2005)

Nope. Would love an S3, but it's too rich for my blood, scratch that... my bank account.

OT: in 2015/16 I'll happily pay $30K for nicely loaded (w/nav) 1.8T, or maybe $33K for a Sportback Hybrid.


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## fjork_duf (Jul 13, 2001)

pjunk1 said:


> *IF*, i said, if, a S3 dsg + mmi nav & sport dif goes for $45k. would you buy it?


I would buy it if there was no RS3. But in all honesty I'd cross-shop the new 2 series, and the new STI then make a decision.


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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

nope. this car was at the top of my list when i thought for sure they would offer a manual. now it's off. I will just go buy a 3 series and get a manual.


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## atomic1125 (May 31, 2001)

I would consider it, 45k is absolutely at the tippy top of the price range. I know I want the DSG, and nav for sure. Led and all the sports trimming is a must have.

I think the sweet spot for the s3 will be in the 42-43k range, loaded with nav, led and sporty interior. With sports diff and active suspension and fancy audio maybe top out around 46k. Any more the size of the car would really make it hard to justify the cost.


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## JOES1.8T (Sep 8, 2003)

Being in the service and stationed in Germany, I can order through Audi Military Sales (Factory sales) which sell customed ordered vehicles at invoice. Now I am debating on whether to still go with an A5 or now possibly the S3 given I can probably get a semi or possibly fully loaded S3 at the price of what an A5 premium plus at invoice ($35,201 + $3301 + $895) would be.


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## LWNY (Jul 30, 2008)

Travis Grundke said:


> There will be no sport differential on the S3, that's going to be specific to the MLB product, not MQB.


Not even the XDS psuedo torque vectoring that VW has?
Or the front locking differential that VW is going to put on the GTI?


Not worried about LED light. Even if it doesn't have the eyebrow LEDs, I could go down to radio shack and retrofit their christmas light LED strip.


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## The DarkSide (Aug 4, 2000)

pjunk1 said:


> *IF*, i said, if, a S3 dsg + mmi nav + whatever option you like is $45k. would you buy it?
> 
> I had sport differential in place of "whatever option" but informed it will not be offered on MQB; only MLB platform.


The only 2 options I'd really like is the mmi nav + adaptive suspension. (Curse you DC streets!) I'm sure that would put it close to 45k.. Not sure I'm in at that much. My wife drives a very nicely equipped titanium edition A4 avant. Not sure I want 2 40k+ Audi's. I'd rather have the S3 than the avant but the wife has to lug the kid around. 

If I get a new job and a significant raise in the next year I may consider.. otherwise I may consider a lightly equipped A3 w/quattro.


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## Travis Grundke (May 26, 1999)

mookieblaylock said:


> if i get one it's pretty much going to be base model. $3k factory nav is absurd. Adaptive suspension would be nice but that might not even come here. Hatch would be an easy decision


Audi has said that drive select will be an option on NA spec A3s this go around. Considering how they're packaging it in Europe, it's not a big price bump.


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## Travis Grundke (May 26, 1999)

LWNY said:


> Not even the XDS psuedo torque vectoring that VW has?
> Or the front locking differential that VW is going to put on the GTI?
> 
> 
> Not worried about LED light. Even if it doesn't have the eyebrow LEDs, I could go down to radio shack and retrofit their christmas light LED strip.


IIRC, the XDS and torque vectoring are two different things. I think you're thinking of the electronic limited slip differential in the MQB Golf and the Audi crown differential and/or sports differential for the rear. 

The A3, I believe has the XDS since its MQB product. No torque vectoring sport diff or crown gear diff in the quattro A3 however.


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## Cyncris (Aug 12, 2012)

Keep in mind that if you are a member of Audi Club North America you get a flat 6% off MSRP (no haggling), then if you already own an Audi, you get loyalty of $1000 off. In addition if you have some equity in your car with down payment or trade in of $5000+ and financing for 6 years at about 1.89% you are looking at a payment of $580-$620 on a $50k msrp car.


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## Rudy_H (Jul 6, 2012)

Travis Grundke said:


> That said, $45k is out of my budget for a car. I'm likely looking at the 2.0TFSI Quattro A3 instead.


Actually, I think this is where I am going too now. Just bought a motorbike, and I am sure when a nice day is out where I can enjoy performance, the motorbike will win 9/10 times over riding in a cage. 

$45k for the same engine, except a larger K04 and some suspension tweaks that you will only notice on the track is going to be a tough sell.

2.0TFSI Quattro A3 /w S-Line, hopefully Sportback 
(might be a required package for specific items I have determined as needs, example heated seats and mirrors, auto climate control, and HID's)
+ APR / GIAC tune (maybe downpipe for that 'Stage II')
+ lowering springs

Only one more year of wait left


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## ChrisFu (Jun 9, 2012)

No manual, I am not buying.

Also, it seems increasingly common for people on these forums to confuse LED headlights with LED DRLs. These are not the same thing at all.


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## QwaktastiK (Jul 9, 2006)

With a $39k starting price, I'm fully expecting an optioned S3 to cost $44k without adapted suspension and closer to $46k with it. My question is, can you put lowering springs on the adaptive suspension?

I see on the B8 S4 forums people swapping out their springs, but I don't know if this is possible with the adaptive suspension. If not, I'll stick with the standard suspension option for sure.

Navigation, cold weather package, B&O, Sunroof and alacantara seats would be nice. Push button start is not a must for me. I know how to turn a key. And I'd rather pick up a set of aftermarket wheels than what Audi offers as an option. 

If the RS3 comes, I think it would start at $48k and loaded would be about $56k. I'm down with that. That car is a dream.


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## 02GOLFGTI1.8T (Feb 13, 2002)

how about the pseudo torque vectoring that was premiered in the saab 93 xwd is that included?


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## pjunk1 (May 13, 2010)

Rudy_H said:


> ...$45k for the same engine, except a larger K04 and some suspension tweaks that you will only notice on the track is going to be a tough sell...(


it may not really matter too much to you but the motor is not the same as the 2.0 TFSI in our A3's + the K04 turbo. it's a new 2.0 TFSI motor; new technology with dual injection and valvelift.


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## cyberpmg (Nov 27, 2001)

I hope there are people who will get a fully loaded S3.....













...so I can then get one as a CPO for less and have an extended warranty.


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## Travis Grundke (May 26, 1999)

Cyncris said:


> Keep in mind that if you are a member of Audi Club North America you get a flat 6% off MSRP (no haggling), then if you already own an Audi, you get loyalty of $1000 off. In addition if you have some equity in your car with down payment or trade in of $5000+ and financing for 6 years at about 1.89% you are looking at a payment of $580-$620 on a $50k msrp car.


The loyalty rebate depends on what model you currently have. IIRC, current A3 owners get $750 off, not $1,000. I haven't looked at the guidelines for a month or two, so I may be off, but that's my recollection. 

If I were able to afford a $50k car I'd be shopping an S4 or an A6 - not an A3. That's not to rain on anybody here, it's just to say that I have a really hard time parting with hard earned cash. ;-)


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## Cyncris (Aug 12, 2012)

Travis Grundke said:


> The loyalty rebate depends on what model you currently have. IIRC, current A3 owners get $750 off, not $1,000. I haven't looked at the guidelines for a month or two, so I may be off, but that's my recollection.


The loyalty is based on what car you are buying. It looks like they may have changed it since last time that I looked. I think it was based more on what you spent. Meaning that the S models were more than the A models. It looks like they have made most all of those the same. If that pattern holds, the S3 will have a $750 loyalty just like the A3 Link here: http://www.audiusa.com/us/brand/en/offers/loyalty_incentives.html




Travis Grundke said:


> If I were able to afford a $50k car I'd be shopping an S4 or an A6 - not an A3. That's not to rain on anybody here, it's just to say that I have a really hard time parting with hard earned cash. ;-)


The problem is that unless you are shopping CPO, S4 is going to run closer to 60k.... I have a 2009 A4 now. I do love the car but it is a bit wide and is not really possible to track without buying a BBK. I live in an older section of town and some of the streets are very narrow here. Some to the point of my tires touching the lines on both sides of the car at once.
I have driven an A6 for a day. It was awesome. If I did nothing but interstate driving and rarely if ever went to any cities downtown, that would be a car to have.
I am still wrestling with a new S3 or a 2 year old CPO S5 in 2014. Driving my wife's A3 right after driving my A4 makes me lean toward smaller, lighter, faster. Seeing an S5 leans me the other way. I only have a year to torment myself.......


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## mookieblaylock (Sep 25, 2005)

pjunk1 said:


> it may not really matter too much to you but the motor is not the same as the 2.0 TFSI in our A3's + the K04 turbo. it's a new 2.0 TFSI motor; new technology with dual injection and valvelift.


 but is the s3 motor the same as the new 2t just without ko4


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## pjunk1 (May 13, 2010)

Cyncris said:


> ...The problem is that unless you are shopping CPO, S4 is going to run closer to 60k....


most S4 found at so cal dealerships are about $55k. but, of course, once you add tax/lic you are at around $60k. 

one of the dealerships had 15 S4's in their inventory. that's a lot.


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## Travis Grundke (May 26, 1999)

pjunk1 said:


> one of the dealerships had 15 S4's in their inventory. that's a lot.


IIRC from the March 2013 sales report the S4 made up only 17% of total A4 sales of 3,951. The means that around 671 S4s were sold. One of my local shops has seven on the lot, which surprised me.


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## Travis Grundke (May 26, 1999)

Cyncris said:


> I am still wrestling with a new S3 or a 2 year old CPO S5 in 2014. Driving my wife's A3 right after driving my A4 makes me lean toward smaller, lighter, faster. Seeing an S5 leans me the other way. I only have a year to torment myself.......


In many aspects I agree. Anytime I drive an A4 I cannot wait to get back into my A3. The A6, however, is a completely different league: whereas the A4 seems pretty plain jane and boring, the A6 is a great place to spend some time.


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## pjunk1 (May 13, 2010)

Travis Grundke said:


> IIRC from the March 2013 sales report the S4 made up only 17% of total A4 sales of 3,951. The means that around 671 S4s were sold. One of my local shops has seven on the lot, which surprised me.


some of the local dealerships had zero on the lot and many just had a couple. 

17% seems like a pretty decent figure given how popular the A4 is.


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## LWNY (Jul 30, 2008)

Travis Grundke said:


> IIRC, the XDS and torque vectoring are two different things. I think you're thinking of the electronic limited slip differential in the MQB Golf and the Audi crown differential and/or sports differential for the rear.
> 
> The A3, I believe has the XDS since its MQB product. No torque vectoring sport diff or crown gear diff in the quattro A3 however.


The XDS (which is pseudo torque vectoring) started appearing in VW MK VI vehicles, so it doesnt seem to be specific to MQB. But it is not mentioned in any A3/S3 blurbs.

As for the electronic locking diff, it is the VAQ system described here (don't know why it is not introduced in the Audi models):

http://drivelinenews.com/news/electronic-locking-differential-for-vw-golf-gti-mk7/

BTW, to utilize VAQ into a Haldex AWD system, it would end up more complicated than the Getrag twinster, which turns a transverse layout engine to a rear biased AWD.





02GOLFGTI1.8T said:


> how about the pseudo torque vectoring that was premiered in the saab 93 xwd is that included?


that wasn't a pseudo torque vectoring, but a clutch based locking rear diff, which would have been partially integrated with the haldex clutch. Seems like no other mfg utilized it in their car.


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## Rudy_H (Jul 6, 2012)

mookieblaylock said:


> but is the s3 motor the same as the new 2t just without ko4


Yup

Don't care much about 8P, only MQB
There is a rumor, as I don't see it on ABT's site, but they are getting 280 hp out of the new 2.0T using the stock turbo. 

No word on the S3 tuning yet though.

I am only mentioning this, for if / when they only bring the detuned 2.0TFSI Sportback, so leave the S3 sedan for the non-enthusiasts and just build out your A3 Sportback


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## Dennis M (Jan 26, 2012)

IMO, $45k+ should be the MSRP on the equivalent to the Prestige model with the P+ equivalent at around $42k+. Either way, an S3 could be my next car after my TTS lease is up. DSG is fine with me as the TTS is my first automatic car in 16 years and I'm _very_ impressed. 

+1 on the Audi Supplier program discount through the Audi Club of N. America + loyalty discount. :wave:

-Dennis


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## Chimera (Jul 6, 2002)

Cyncris said:


> Keep in mind that if you are a member of Audi Club North America you get a flat 6% off MSRP (no haggling), then if you already own an Audi, you get loyalty of $1000 off. In addition if you have some equity in your car with down payment or trade in of $5000+ and financing for 6 years at about 1.89% you are looking at a payment of $580-$620 on a $50k msrp car.


Where do you see 6% off MSRP for ACNA members? When I look, it says a flat $500.


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## Travis Grundke (May 26, 1999)

There are two programs: the Audi of America loyalty program for owners of 2001+ Audis, and the Audi Club North America purchasing program. The ACNA program is brand new as of February, I believe.

The loyalty program gives you a discount based on your current model (ie: I think an A3 is good for $750 toward a new car), while the ACNA program gives you the flat 6% off of MSRP for all except RS5, TTRS, A8W12, Q5 hybrid and R8 models. It CAN be combined with the loyalty program and with the new owner appreciation program.

So, let's assume you spec a future A3 sedan at $35,000 and have a current 8P A3. Your total discount with these two programs would be $2,100 with the ACNA program plus $750 for the loyalty program for a total of $2,850 off of sticker.


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## lotuselan (Apr 9, 2008)

I would prefer a S-line with manual 2.0 for under US$40,000 Which means in about 2 years when my car has over 100,000 miles I'll be lookng for another low milage used car, that is still under warranty.


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

pjunk1 said:


> yes, copying off of S4. probably the wrong way but i was just adding options mostly found on the typical S4 trying to make $45k for the S3. we can throw out and replace with something that may add-on another $1k.
> 
> i'm just trying to gauge how many of us would purchase the S3 at $45k +/- given whatever options will be the prepackage on the S3. for example, i looked at the S4's in the orange county and los angeles area. most available S4 had NAV and the sport differential. although, the base msrp on the S4 is $47k, the real world pricing on available units is about $55k to $57k. i found one unit that was $51k.
> 
> ...


"Real World"? Dude, just order the car at $47k. I did this with my car, no hassles, no extra fluff options that I neither needed or wanted. At the end of the day, I think you'd have to be nuts to pay $45k for an S3 when you can get an S4 for what? another $25/month? Screw the S3 at that price. and I can get the S4 with a proper 3rd pedal. 

For the S3 to be competitive, it's gotta be more than a loaded GTI R20, and less than an A4 P+. $37k to me is about the right price for a car that only comes in an automatic. you know, like a loaded out Camry.


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## mookieblaylock (Sep 25, 2005)

FractureCritical said:


> . $37k to me is about the right price for a car that only comes in an automatic. you know, like a loaded out Camry.


no. Dsg is a better transmission and the awd puts it immediately above a camry, further i would never buy an s4 as it's way too heavy for my taste. Low 40s seems about right and next gen a/s4 probably moves up in price also. If you have been paying attention this car is lighter and more powerful than the golf R, and no it's not called an r20


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

mookieblaylock said:


> no. Dsg is a better transmission and the awd puts it immediately above a camry, further i would never buy an s4 as it's way too heavy for my taste. Low 40s seems about right and next gen a/s4 probably moves up in price also. If you have been paying attention this car is lighter and more powerful than the golf R, and no it's not called an r20


so your argument is that you want to pay S4 money for an S3 becuase the S4 will probably move up in price? Wow. you're just the perfect little Audi customer, aren't you? Good luck with that.


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## Pathfinder2041 (Sep 20, 2003)

I'm leaning towards buying the car. Want to see the CLA 45 AMG with a test drive and see the time line for a five cylinder RS3 on this body style before pulling the trigger. I really like the size and proportions of this new S3, and really want to see one in person to determine if this will be the replacement for my B7 S4. If the RS3 is a year or so away from the US launch of the S3 and will be sold in NA, I'm in a great position to wait for it. 

Options such as nav, HID, adaptive suspension, and drive select are great technology advances over my current car, and if the S3 can go out the door at 50K + TTL and really deliver the goods... then I'm all in!


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## Waterfan (Aug 9, 2012)

Travis Grundke said:


> That said, $45k is out of my budget for a car. I'm likely looking at the 2.0TFSI Quattro A3 instead.


Similar for me. Make mine a "no-options" 2.0TFSI Quattro A3. ~220hp/~260tq in a ~3000 lb AWD car will be plenty fun for me. (and if/when I get bored there is APR/GIAC/UM/HPA/etc)


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## phospher5 (Jun 21, 2012)

FractureCritical said:


> "Real World"? Dude, just order the car at $47k. I did this with my car, no hassles, no extra fluff options that I neither needed or wanted. At the end of the day, I think you'd have to be nuts to pay $45k for an S3 when you can get an S4 for what? another $25/month? Screw the S3 at that price. and I can get the S4 with a proper 3rd pedal.
> 
> For the S3 to be competitive, it's gotta be more than a loaded GTI R20, and less than an A4 P+. $37k to me is about the right price for a car that only comes in an automatic. you know, like a loaded out Camry.




Bingo- have an R, it's laggy.... had an S4, want another one..... pricepoint better be noticeably lower than the S4 to be worth it, performance better be noticeably better than my R...... only thing I disagree with is your auto/manual preference..... I am a die hard manual fan, my S4 was manual, my R is manual.....wifes GLI is DSG...... I will never buy a manual again the DSG is superior.


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## Waterfan (Aug 9, 2012)

B8 S4:
3.0 TFSI (supercharged)
333 bhp / 325 ft-lbs
3858 lbs
17 city / 26 hwy
5.1 sec 0-60 (6spd manual)
$47,600 MSRP

MQB S3 (rumors):
2.0T (turbo)
296 bhp / 280 ft-lb
3100 lbs (took FWD 1.4T equipped EU model @ 2755 lbs and added weight arbitrarily for quattro)
20 city / 30 hwy (SWAG)
4.9 sec 0-60 (6spd S-tronic)
$37,000 MSRP (SWAG)


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## xbr80bx (Feb 2, 2007)

Ninja Turtle swag. I'm in as long as the fully loaded version is < 45K.


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## LWNY (Jul 30, 2008)

Waterfan said:


> B8 S4:
> 3.0 TFSI (supercharged)
> 333 bhp / 325 ft-lbs
> 3858 lbs
> ...


The new S3 3 door weigh 3075 LB and the sportback is to weigh 3186 LB, so the S3 sedan, being bigger, must be at least 3200 LB.


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## QwaktastiK (Jul 9, 2006)

FractureCritical said:


> "Real World"? Dude, just order the car at $47k. I did this with my car, no hassles, no extra fluff options that I neither needed or wanted. At the end of the day, I think you'd have to be nuts to pay $45k for an S3 when you can get an S4 for what? another $25/month? Screw the S3 at that price. and I can get the S4 with a proper 3rd pedal.
> 
> For the S3 to be competitive, it's gotta be more than a loaded GTI R20, and less than an A4 P+. $37k to me is about the right price for a car that only comes in an automatic. you know, like a loaded out Camry.





FractureCritical said:


> so your argument is that you want to pay S4 money for an S3 becuase the S4 will probably move up in price? Wow. you're just the perfect little Audi customer, aren't you? Good luck with that.


Your attitude sucks. And honestly it's just not needed.

With the perspective that you're giving, the new S4 is the old S6 pricing...etc. Everything has moved up. But so has their sizes. 

The attractive thing about the new A3/S3 is it's size. The S4 has only gotten bigger in size over the years, not to mention price. Those who miss the days of the B5 are being drawn to the new A3/S3 and it's price compared to the A4/S4. Bigger doesn't always mean better. The smaller vehicle offers better fuel economy, better power to weight ratio and a turbo instead of a supercharger, leaving the possibility of even more power to be discovered in the aftermarket. 

Even if the S4 wasn't as expensive as it is, some people just prefer the size of the B5 over the B8. 

So to bring it back, people are willing to pay (old) S4 money for an S3 because the S4 has moved up in *size*.


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## Waterfan (Aug 9, 2012)

LWNY said:


> The new S3 3 door weigh 3075 LB and the sportback is to weigh 3186 LB, so the S3 sedan, being bigger, must be at least 3200 LB.


quite possible, we won't know anything for sure until US specs are announced.


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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

QwaktastiK said:


> Your attitude sucks. And honestly it's just not needed.
> 
> With the perspective that you're giving, the new S4 is the old S6 pricing...etc. Everything has moved up. But so has their sizes.
> 
> ...


try not to keep your feelings all bottled up hmm? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMIDpJ8H7H0


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## eger (Oct 29, 2007)

No. Not with DSG. I'd rather stay in my 08 A3 and go stage 3 with new clutch / LSD.


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## Cyncris (Aug 12, 2012)

QwaktastiK said:


> Your attitude sucks. And honestly it's just not needed.
> 
> With the perspective that you're giving, the new S4 is the old S6 pricing...etc. Everything has moved up. But so has their sizes.
> 
> ...


I agree his attitude sucks. Anyone that would ever buy a poverty spec S4 has truly lost the meaning of the brand. These are sport luxury cars. Getting an S4 without heated seats, or no nav, or no sport diff, etc....is just retarded. If your budget doesn't allow you to play in that price range than pick something that is in your price range. Don't buy a $46k badge that is stripped. My guess is that Audi offers these just for the lower starting price but doesn't really expect to sell any like that. The ONLY reason that I could understand buying a base S4 would be to turn it into a track only car...and still then I think that I would want the sport diff and really, for that price there are faster cheaper track cars.....


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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

Cyncris said:


> I agree his attitude sucks. Anyone that would ever buy a poverty spec S4 has truly lost the meaning of the brand. These are sport luxury cars. Getting an S4 without heated seats, or no nav, or no sport diff, etc....is just retarded. If your budget doesn't allow you to play in that price range than pick something that is in your price range. Don't buy a $46k badge that is stripped. My guess is that Audi offers these just for the lower starting price but doesn't really expect to sell any like that. The ONLY reason that I could understand buying a base S4 would be to turn it into a track only car...and still then I think that I would want the sport diff and really, for that price there are faster cheaper track cars.....


you are a spokesperson for audi? oh we better call up porsche and tell them they aren't a luxury brand for selling stripped down versions of their cars for a premium.


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## Cyncris (Aug 12, 2012)

kevlartoronto said:


> you are a spokesperson for audi? oh we better call up porsche and tell them they aren't a luxury brand for selling stripped down versions of their cars for a premium.


I never said that I was a spokesperson for Audi, and I have no problem with any brands selling a stripped down version at a premium, being road legal but meant for track use. If they offered a striped S4 with a roll cage for $55k, I think it would be awesome...not for me, but I have no problem with that.
whatshisname was talking about chincing out and buying a poverty spec S4 for $46k because he didn't "need" all those other options, but he did "need" a loaded out GTI. 
He was just spouting off garbage that was not thought out, didn't make good sense and was obviously out of his price range.


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## dmorrow (Jun 9, 2000)

Cyncris said:


> I agree his attitude sucks. *Anyone that would ever buy a poverty spec S4 has truly lost the meaning of the brand. These are sport luxury cars. Getting an S4 without heated seats, or no nav, or no sport diff, etc....is just retarded.* If your budget doesn't allow you to play in that price range than pick something that is in your price range. Don't buy a $46k badge that is stripped. My guess is that Audi offers these just for the lower starting price but doesn't really expect to sell any like that. The ONLY reason that I could understand buying a base S4 would be to turn it into a track only car...and still then I think that I would want the sport diff and really, for that price there are faster cheaper track cars.....


Should I buy my next Audi as I want it or should I run the spec by you to make sure I am getting what you require? I didn't know I needed nav and heated seats to keep from being "retarded". 

What about the upgraded sound system, this optional?


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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

i agree with dmorrow. stop buying into the marketing bs. this is just audi company execs pushing "high profit margin" extras on us. the marketing formula is rather transparent. include one useful option with 5 others you don't care about. want a sunroof? that's going to be 4500 dollars. :screwy: i would love to buy the s3 but don't care about most options honestly....except for one, that once upon a time wasn't an option, it was standard....the manual. hello audi??? anybody over there still care?


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

QwaktastiK said:


> Your attitude sucks. And honestly it's just not needed.
> 
> With the perspective that you're giving, the new S4 is the old S6 pricing...etc. Everything has moved up. But so has their sizes.
> 
> ...


your opinion is that my attitude sucks. you might be right, but my analysis of the situation is not wrong. Bigger doesn't always mean better, but those not 'in the know' will go for the A4 becuase it's bigger and premium brands sell prestige, prestige comes from appearance, and appearance comes with a bigger car in this country and you know it. Those 'in the know' will also go with the A4 (or S4) because it's the MLB platform made in Germany, not a mix-n-match VW sourced low-bid parts bin creation that's hecho in Mexico. 

Anyone who wants a smaller,faster, lighter sedan and doesn't care about the image will go with one of the boy-racer cars like an STi or a Mazdaspeed3 or a GolfR or a Focus ST. the Venn diagram of small bodied high priced luxury themed sport sedans I think is smaller than Audi realizes. 

Of course the brandwhores on this site will still fawn all over it, but few will actually buy it. I cite the manual transmission Audis as example. Many extol the sins of Audi by elimianting them, including myself, but few actually pony up the cash to buy them, so they're gone. I have three in the driveway right now. I'm one of the few in the chewy overlap of the Venn diagram that put his money where his mouth was. 

Does my attitude suck? maybe. but you still know I'm right on this.


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

Cyncris said:


> I agree his attitude sucks. Anyone that would ever buy a poverty spec S4 has truly lost the meaning of the brand. These are sport luxury cars. Getting an S4 without heated seats, or no nav, or no sport diff, etc....is just retarded. If your budget doesn't allow you to play in that price range than pick something that is in your price range. Don't buy a $46k badge that is stripped. My guess is that Audi offers these just for the lower starting price but doesn't really expect to sell any like that. The ONLY reason that I could understand buying a base S4 would be to turn it into a track only car...and still then I think that I would want the sport diff and really, for that price there are faster cheaper track cars.....


"oh, no! an S4 with *only* the Premium Plus package (with heated seats)! How would one ever survive in such a low-end leather lined vehicle furnished with xenon headlights and multi zone climate control! No navigation? how would one possibly survive without turn-by-turn directions as provided by even the cheapest of modern cell phones which everyone carries! The horror of the mere mention of surviving in such squalor would cause one to faint most suddenly! Such a lacking vehcile could ONLY possibly be used for crudities such as track service!"

dude, do you even listen to yourself talk? 
Google the term 'first world problem' and come back here. Preferrably after you complain to someone else who ostensibly cares about the poor folk moving into your neighborhood.


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## dmorrow (Jun 9, 2000)

FractureCritical said:


> your opinion is that my attitude sucks. you might be right, but my analysis of the situation is not wrong. *Bigger doesn't always mean better, but those not 'in the know' will go for the A4 becuase it's bigger and premium brands sell prestige, prestige comes from appearance, and appearance comes with a bigger car in this country* and you know it. Those 'in the know' will also go with the *A4 (or S4) because it's the MLB platform made in Germany, not a mix-n-match VW sourced low-bid parts bin creation that's hecho in Mexico*.
> 
> Anyone who wants a smaller,faster, lighter sedan and doesn't care about the image will go with one of the boy-racer cars like an STi or a Mazdaspeed3 or a GolfR or a Focus ST. the Venn diagram of small bodied high priced luxury themed sport sedans I think is smaller than Audi realizes.
> 
> ...


Not completing following what you are saying but if you tried real hard you could probably come across less like an @ss. As the model number series gets higher the prices generally do also with some overlap based on options and the S versions. My guess is you may be able to get a base S4 cheaper than a completely loaded S3, so what? Spec'd equally you will have to pay more for the S4. No different than getting a base A6 cheaper than a loaded A4, base CTS cheaper than a loaded ATS, base 5 series cheaper than a loaded 3 series.....

Odd that you say "those not in the know" will buy the A4 because of the MLB platform not MQB and it not being made in Mexico. Those "not in the know" have no idea about platform designations or care where the car is built and since when will the A3 be built in Mexico?

I want a slightly bigger car than my current A3 and want to go with a sedan, if the A3 is cheaper spec for spec I may not see the reason to spend the extra money on a bigger, slower, lower mpg, A4 because of the "Prestige". The VW comparable (the Jetta) doesn't come with AWD, has a lower level interior and to me doesn't look as good.

I don't see the S3 buyer also looking at the Focus ST and the R may not be that much cheaper, a hatchback (many don't want), manual, and possibly still old platform and really old engine (very few models used it after 2008) I can see advantages to the S3. The R also may not be available when the S3 hits the market.


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## Waterfan (Aug 9, 2012)

It's too bad this got heated and personal somehow :screwy:, because I find myself agreeing with many of the points that all of you are making.

How did this become an argument? Someone too sensitive, someone not sensitive enough? (actually, who cares?) Can we go back to discussing this in a less heated fashion?


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## ProjectA3 (Aug 12, 2005)

I am pretty sure i will want mine fully loaded, but may end up going without a few things in order to use that $ for a possible custom color.

I have an advantage in that i work for Audi in sales and my employee price will be pretty damn good, but i don't plan to lease this car and will start saving $ next January to be able to use for a down payment of a few grand.


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