# Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in.......



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

Well i guess the time has come...
And since there are no SERIOUS camshaft threads (anywhere), i am
guessing this will be the reference point for people looking around...
I already stated in the past i will be posting info once its done, and
now is that time.
I would first like to point out that i was originally planning to
install the Schrick cams (already had them), but due to 
a VERY BAD CHOICE in tech selection, my exhaust cam got damaged
(yes you heard right), and instead of beating the crap out of the
idiot that f***ed me up, i decided to install the full set of S3 cams
and sell my intake cam cheap (keep looking at classifieds)
to get some sort of refund for all the time and money lost in this....
"pioneering endeavor..."
And before going through the details i the upcoming posts, lets start in reverse,
and cut to the chase as they say.....

*STOCK GTI CAMS vs S3 CAMS= ZERO DIFFERENCE.....*









Oh YEAH...you read it right....
In this mystical world of tuning, with ancient folklore and
untold stories of ultimate horsepower, it all comes down to this...
You PAY, you PLAY, you're GAY.....








So without wanting to write too much at the moment, logs are
done, ZERO difference either in MAF readings, BOOST, or TIMING.
Not a single change in CF's...NADA....
Gonna be doing some searching for any boost leaks to justify the results,
and the "after mod" dyno soon, letting the car adapt a while, 
but not really seeing anything there....








Food for thought ???
You bet....



_Modified by GolfRS at 12:42 PM 7-16-2009_


----------



## ebliss (Jun 17, 2008)

So, would it be different if you had installed the Schrick cams?


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (ebliss)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ebliss* »_So, would it be different if you had installed the Schrick cams?

Well visually the Schrick where completely different
as far as the intake cam goes, both in duration and lift.
Can't say much about the exhaust cam since i didn't have
the chance to visually inspect the S3 exhaust cam.
But it's safe to say there is no comparison between the
Schricks and the S3 cams.What the gains would be with the first ?
No clue...
But i already know the results of the second....


----------



## NoTsipa (Feb 26, 2008)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_Well , you're GAY.....









I beleive you 've done extended testing to admit this ... 
I'll say again that S3 cams are not the same as the stock ones , and are good for an extra 6-8 hp gains uptop with correct s/w


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (NoTsipa)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NoTsipa* »_
I beleive you 've done extended testing to admit this ... 
I'll say again that S3 cams are not the same as the stock ones , and are good for an extra 6-8 hp gains uptop with correct s/w 

Well considering you claim you've had them installed for sometime now,
i don't see you giving ANY proof all this time.I on the other hand
did the logs, and will be doing the dyno too.
6-8 horsepower can be had with ONLY the software change as you say.
You don't need any cams for that.Have Revo ?Put some better gas,
turn timing up a notch....BINGO...5+++ HP.
I've had enough of bull**** and misinformation.I can't really tolerate any more.
If you have any serious data to offer besides comments about your GAY behavior,
please produce them.If not, let people that know
what they are doing spread the TRUTH, for once....



_Modified by GolfRS at 12:29 AM 7-17-2009_


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (NoTsipa)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NoTsipa* »_
I beleive you 've done extended testing to admit this ... 
I'll say again that S3 cams are not the same as the stock ones , and are good for an extra 6-8 hp gains uptop with correct s/w 

The only real way to come up with data is send a set of STOCK, S3,SCHRICK to someone that has a CAM DOCTOR so they can spin them and messure them side by side ,other wise your testing is going to be trail and error and hit and miss with results.







Bob.G


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (GolfRS)*

Oh yeah...And another thing...
When my Schrick cam got f***ed i had the option
to put back my stock cams, call it quits, and save me 
some money.But guess what...Based on all the
BULL**** that roams around forums, i decided to dish out
EVEN MORE money to get the S3 cams, and see
whatever little gains i could get, to justify the
installation costs.
Why ?
Cause someone without a clue like yourself suggested i would see
some....
Well....guess what happened.....



_Modified by GolfRS at 12:27 AM 7-17-2009_


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
The only real way to come up with data is send a set of STOCK, S3,SCHRICK to someone that has a CAM DOCTOR so they can spin them and messure them side by side ,other wise your testing is going to be trail and error and hit and miss with results.







Bob.G

That's true, and its what i've also said on the "other" forum when someone
was asking which is better.
On the other hand, you have STOCK FACTORY S3 cams build for a 9.8:1
engine, vs AFTERMARKET BPY cams build for a 10.5:1 engine.
Take a lucky guess which one has the most potential for horsepower....


----------



## NoTsipa (Feb 26, 2008)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (GolfRS)*

Golfy , have you ever posted any proof of all the fairytails you are telling us ? Just food for thinking sh*t . 

_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_ let people that know
what they are doing spread the TRUTH, for once....

Make us all a favor , and get lost then . 
edit @ I see why you're upset . You full of truth and knowledge , but you have an empty pocket . hahah SUCKER ! 


_Modified by NoTsipa at 3:24 AM 7-16-2009_


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_
That's true, and its what i've also said on the "other" forum when someone
was asking which is better.
On the other hand, you have STOCK FACTORY S3 cams build for a 9.8:1
engine, vs AFTERMARKET BPY cams build for a 10.5:1 engine.
Take a lucky guess which one has the most potential for horsepower....
 
It all depends if the aftermarket company does a good job in R & D dept making them . Why do you think CAT has not come out with a cam??? because they want to make sure they are tested for long life and proven power . 
If you look at past history SCHRICKS are not know to do well in FI engines , most good results are N.A.







Bob.G


----------



## ZWStewart (Mar 27, 2002)

*FV-QR*

Trolls 1 , GolfRS 0


----------



## seattheodore (May 5, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (ZWStewart)*

very strange result...






















I cannot understand how it can be possible that we have the same cams with S3







maybe for some reason we cannot see the difference in the power output of our engines. 
PS. I am sorry to hear that you had this accident with your Schrick cams


----------



## bificus99 (Aug 2, 2008)

*Re: Camshafts for the TFSI.The results are in....... (NoTsipa)*

"I'll say again that S3 cams are not the same as the stock ones , and are good for an extra 6-8 hp gains uptop with correct s/w"
I'd say this is about right, maybe more HP with a custom tune but not much more.


----------



## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

*FV-QR*

this is a bummer


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (seattheodore)*


_Quote, originally posted by *seattheodore* »_very strange result...






















I cannot understand how it can be possible that we have the same cams with S3







maybe for some reason we cannot see the difference in the power output of our engines. 
PS. I am sorry to hear that you had this accident with your Schrick cams

There is an explanation for this, but we can talk about that another
time.You have my MSN....


----------



## staulkor (May 21, 2007)

*FV-QR*


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (MFZERO)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MFZERO* »_this is a bummer

Well at least one "candidate" is off the table.
It was about time someone put a stop to all these
rumors.It just happened to be me, cause of my bad
luck...
Wish someone with a K04 would install the Schricks
just to see if the engine is actually "cam limited".
EDIT: Unless of course there is a way to produce power 
with the same boost/MAF/timing numbers....
But i highly doubt it.


_Modified by GolfRS at 1:14 AM 7-17-2009_


----------



## aussievfrss (Sep 8, 2008)

I've had the S3 cams installed for well over 8 months now, and I can confirm there is no difference - timing/lift. I had to replace my stock cams due to my follower killing the intake cam. This occurred as I was tracking my car and tuning my suspensions (whilst still stock).
S3 cams and BPY/BWA cams have the same part number. The only difference and it won't apply to all cars, is the newer/revised cams have a revised camlobe (different material) to help extend the life of the cam follower. Some cars are running verison A and the newer ones are verison B. From my knowledge CCTA engines are running a 4 lobe cam, whilst BWA's are running 3 lobe cams. 
There is a lot of BS on the forums, and it comes from both members and tuners. No one will ever tell you they have a problem, but will gladly and willingly say they are the best. The ones not to buy from or listen to are the ones that go around saying other peoples products are crap or other tuners are lesser.


----------



## Shazsta (Mar 9, 2006)

Thank you Aussievfrss and GolfRS.
I will probably eventually get somebody to put some schricks in mine when i do valves, pistons and rods. but thats gonna be a while. i am at 67k mi right now so it will probably be around 85k mi. that'll also give me some time o save up money from the install. i will probably buy everything part by part just like i did with the k04 upgrade.
again thanks for kicking the cash out to find this out


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Here's another update pending the dyno.
Car seems to have lost quite a bit of torque, and
turbo lag is now obvious.....That, on a 10.5 CR engine...
I'm thinking i probably lost a fair amount of torque down there.
Wanted to up my timing after cams, but i'm getting
the same amount of pull with the S3's, so that's a no go.
Feels strange...
Top seems "a bit" better, but this could be what i want
to feel, and not the truth.
EDIT:Logs show an increase in WG duty cycle, especially after 6000 rpm...
This i'm guessing could be either a normal boost leak, or an exacerbation of the
already existing actuator issue (supposedly).
Gonna be doing a bit more boost leak hunting and see how it goes.
P.S.Can a boost leak be caused by improper camshaft installation ?
(And i don't mean "forgetting to tighten a clamp" type , but rather 
"sealing head cover glue not properly placed" type leak.Does even boost
effect that part ??


_Modified by GolfRS at 11:03 AM 7-18-2009_


----------



## GodSquadMandrake (Feb 17, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (GolfRS)*

Did you follow the instructions in your sig about the KY? 
No boost doesn't get into the valve cover unless it blows around your rings but you have bigger problems then, trust me been there done that it ended with oil spray and fire truck boom boom engine me no likey bad night stuff. 
Are you trying to say that there is a difference now? I am a bit confused by your thread, it's like your thinking outloud


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (GodSquadMandrake)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GodSquadMandrake* »_Did you follow the instructions in your sig about the KY? 
No boost doesn't get into the valve cover unless it blows around your rings but you have bigger problems then, trust me been there done that it ended with oil spray and fire truck boom boom engine me no likey bad night stuff. 
Are you trying to say that there is a difference now? I am a bit confused by your thread, it's like your thinking outloud









Actually yes, its kinda like thinking out loud, that's my way of trying
to transfer as much info as i can, and maybe someone else can
benefit from it.
The worst thing for me is i will never know what could have been
with the Schricks....








P.S.Where did you see me say it runs better now ??


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_Here's another update pending the dyno.
Car seems to have lost quite a bit of torque, and
turbo lag is now obvious.....That, on a 10.5 CR engine...
I'm thinking i probably lost a fair amount of torque down there.
Wanted to up my timing after cams, but i'm getting
the same amount of pull with the S3's, so that's a no go.
Feels strange...
Top seems "a bit" better, but this could be what i want
to feel, and not the truth.
EDIT:Logs show an increase in WG duty cycle, especially after 6000 rpm...
This i'm guessing could be either a normal boost leak, or an exacerbation of the
already existing actuator issue (supposedly).


You need to get a custom tune IMO your prob need more fuel to help suppress knock and then stuff more timing and your WG duty cycle is up because the overlap in the cam and your blowing boost out the tail pipe . Whats your fuel trims?
Do the Schricks have adjustable cam gears? so you can spread out LCA to reduce the overlap.







Bob.G


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_
The worst thing for me is i will never know what could have been
with the Schricks....









 
You took them out already??? if so contact (jeff ) JC he maybe interested in them .







Bob.G


----------



## loudgli (Aug 3, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
You took them out already??? if so contact (jeff ) JC he maybe interested in them .







Bob.G

bob, read his OP.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (loudgli)*


_Quote, originally posted by *loudgli* »_
bob, read his OP.

I didn't see that B4 , that's why I do all my own work LOL
maybe he can send them back to Schrick cam for a re work and get it repaired . 
He didn't use the same mechanic that applies a 5lb lump hammer to but a round peg into a square hole ?


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (rracerguy717)*

Actually the weird part was for me the fact that 
my LTFT DROPPED down to 2.0% as
opposed to 2.7% before.
I wouldn't think there is a case of increased overlap,
for the S3 cams.The Schricks maybe, but 
for FACTORY cams...








I also didn't notice much difference in CF's
so.....According to theory, an engine
with lower CR should have milder cams if anything....
As far as the Schricks are concerned, i am gonna have the
exhaust cam sent to the factory (already got the OK from Schrick)
but since i'm not a fan of opening up a car twice, i'll probably
leave it as is, and sell the Schricks to get some sort of money back...
The only thing i can tell you is that with the corner of my eye i watched
the mech bolting the cam cover with an airgun....
How does that sound......










_Modified by GolfRS at 4:39 PM 7-19-2009_


----------



## jpimp61 (Mar 22, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_The only thing i can tell you is that with the corner of my eye i watched
the mech bolting the cam cover with an airgun....
How does that sound......









sounds like bad news bears


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Just did some more logs...
Unless suddenly there is a new way of producing
horsepower, this little "experiment" has gone
SERIOUSLY sour....
Intake air shows a decrease of 20 g/s almost across the board...
Can now spikes at only 1.6 bar when before it went up to 1.8,
and injection timing at peak boost went from 8.5 ms
to 6.6 ms....Nice huh ??
Just waiting for the dyno, although i can with
fair certainty say its gonna be like 20 HP LESS than before...
Yeah baby...Lets all get the f****n S3 cams !!!!
They are da shizzle......


----------



## marc1171 (Nov 19, 2008)

I don't think it's because of your S3 cams for sure.
You must have some problems elsewhere


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: (marc1171)*


_Quote, originally posted by *marc1171* »_I don't think it's because of your S3 cams for sure.
You must have some problems elsewhere









Right....
And why do you think that ??
You must have a theory since you make such an announcement.
Please enlighten me so i can correct what you think is the problem...


----------



## Sandman333 (Oct 28, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR (GolfRS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GolfRS* »_Just did some more logs...
Unless suddenly there is a new way of producing
horsepower, this little "experiment" has gone
SERIOUSLY sour....
Intake air shows a decrease of 20 g/s almost across the board...
Can now spikes at only 1.6 bar when before it went up to 1.8,
and injection timing at peak boost went from 8.5 ms
to 6.6 ms....Nice huh ??
Just waiting for the dyno, although i can with
fair certainty say its gonna be like 20 HP LESS than before...
Yeah baby...Lets all get the f****n S3 cams !!!!
They are da shizzle......

It sounds like you might be opening it up again anyway, if nothing more than to ditch the S3 cams and put the stockers back in there. Why not try the Schricks in that case? Also, didn't the shop/mechanic that fubar'd your cam pay for the damage? I'd be going to court over it if they refused.


----------



## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (Sandman333)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Sandman333* »_
It sounds like you might be opening it up again anyway, if nothing more than to ditch the S3 cams and put the stockers back in there. Why not try the Schricks in that case? Also, didn't the shop/mechanic that fubar'd your cam pay for the damage? I'd be going to court over it if they refused.

Pay for the damage ??? LOL....funny....You haven't been to Greece have you ?
He almost told me to f*** off cause because of me he was stuck with the car in the shop for two weeks, until the S3 cams got here, so he lost money from the "lack of space"....








I am not opening the car again....That was it, what happened happened.....
BTW, even more logs, MAF measurements show a difference of even -15 g/s at certain areas of the powerband......Now unless the MAF is effected by the heat we've been experiencing (although this new style MAF on the TFSI isn't temp sensitive AFAIK), then i'm gonna be seeing some very interesting results at the dyno soon.....


----------



## aussievfrss (Sep 8, 2008)

Did you get your Turbo kit from them and everything?


----------



## NoTsipa (Feb 26, 2008)

*Re: (aussievfrss)*

Pardon my ingnorance , but what the hell , upgraded cams have to do with MAF readings ? 
Also golfy, what shop did the install and also f*cked up your expensive cam as you claim ? 
You really should draw that sucker to court


----------



## importrepairguy (Feb 27, 2008)

*Re: (NoTsipa)*

Subscribed. (reaches for popcorn)
Good luck on Dyno day.


----------

