# Anyone running a Dry sump on a vr6?



## German VR6 (Dec 21, 2002)

as topic states


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## BubonicCorrado (Jul 24, 2003)

*Re: Anyone running a Dry sump on a vr6? (German VR6)*

also interested


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## German VR6 (Dec 21, 2002)

*Re: Anyone running a Dry sump on a vr6? (BubonicCorrado)*

anyone???


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## 2.8 MK3 (Feb 24, 2004)

*Re: Anyone running a Dry sump on a vr6? (German VR6)*

have heard it is a mission to setup, i have read before somewhere that there are a few guys here who have it. dont know much about the setup though.


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## German VR6 (Dec 21, 2002)

*Re: Anyone running a Dry sump on a vr6? (2.8 MK3)*

i wanna attempt this setup
i wonder how many stages would be good for a vr6


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## vr6engine (Jan 23, 2006)

*Re: Anyone running a Dry sump on a vr6? (German VR6)*

Hello,
I’m working on my own system for 4 years now







. 








Most of parts used are custom made on drawings.
Here are my main mods :
-	Custom made pattern and aluminium cast sump and machining (ABcast in New Zealand). 
-	Custom made pulleys by HPC and Pace products in England
-	BG 3 stages oil pump from Pace Products Anglia in UK + oil tank + HTD belt + scavenges mesh filters
-	Custom made oil inlet part and oil sandwich plate spacer to remove stock oil cooler.
-	Additional oil jet in timing chains cover
-	Custom made oil pugs to remove stock oil pump and shaft
-	Accusup for pre-oiling and Canton Meca oil filter 
-	AN fittings everywhere
I still have oil tubes to be made but fist quote was around 2000$ for 4 small tubes







! 
Here is a link to my engine on yahoo :
http://fr.pg.photos.yahoo.com/...mAsUm

_Modified by vr6engine at 4:04 PM 1-23-2006_


_Modified by vr6engine at 3:47 PM 1-25-2006_


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## 1SlowSLC (May 4, 2003)

wow very cool setup...never seen that before


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## vr6engine (Jan 23, 2006)

*Re: (1SlowSLC)*

thanks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I hope it will work fine


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## EternalXresT (Jan 5, 2005)

does that pan hold enough oil?


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## German VR6 (Dec 21, 2002)

*Re: (EternalXresT)*

very nice setup http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## PITGUY (Nov 16, 2003)

*Re: (EternalXresT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *EternalXresT* »_does that pan hold enough oil?

it's a DRY sump


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## EternalXresT (Jan 5, 2005)

well i know but idk if you would want a certain amount the it could hold. which is why its a question.


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## Scooter98144 (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: (EternalXresT)*

The dry sump would hold little if any oil. But the drain pick up area is there. As for how much oil. that is up to you and how big of a tank you want. Amagine 8 quarts of oil and all the weight moved from the front of the car to the rear?


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## Zupek (May 10, 2000)

*Re: (Scooter98144)*

would the flow rate of the coolant pump be enough to oil the engine? I would assume you would have to worry about the pump not feeding the engine enough oil (not on your setup, which is REALLY nice)


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## oddy (Nov 26, 2003)

*Re: (fatfreevw)*

quick question: have you test fitted the engine in the car yet? If so do you clear the frame rail on the crank pulley and is the crank pulley 1 or 2 pieces?


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## vr6engine (Jan 23, 2006)

*Re: (German VR6)*

My source of inspiration is definitively Pace Products dry sump setups. They have bolt-on kits for many engines used in competition in England like Vauxhall and even Dodge Viper... According to many dry sump companies, admitted rule is: scavenges stages must be, at minimum, twice the pressure stage oil flow to avoid starvation in pan. Oil and gases are "recycled" in the tank. I will fit this tank in the trunk because it’s not a race car. I must use ¾” hoses minimum (JIC 12 fittings). The tank must be sized to alloy air and gases to be separated from oil before to be pumped by oil pump. It should never be empty at max revving of the engine! 
In theory, oil pan could be practically flat (just space for crank) and the engine sealed (more vacuum). The more you have scavenges stages, the more the engine will be “dry” of oil. But there is not enough free space to scavenge the complex head to make it really possible on a daily driven VR6 street car. But this 2.8l engine is compact like a big 4 cylinders (6 litres of oil if I remember)! 
Oil pressure should not exceed stock 7 bars because of hydro tappets. When I purchased the oil pump (I didn’t though is was so big !), Pace products asked me about : engine HP expected, oil jets, max rev, hydro or mechanical tappets, engine rotation, etc., to advise me the best oil tank capacity and pump flow. I sent them my oil pan drawings and they gave me some good advises. I have made a welded aluminium oil pan first (in my Golf2). 
















The only place where I could fit the 3 stages oil pump was under the block. I also wanted to “protect” the pump behind the sump shape (so that’s why it has practically the same height than stock oil pan in my final project). I wasn’t satisfied with the welded pan (heat distortions). 
So I sent my drawings to several casting companies. The best offer was for a medium sized company in New Zealand (around 1200$ USD for the pattern + 400$ USD for the casting and machine works). It has take many months because my drawings were not clear or dimensions were missing, etc…I recommend to make 3D drawings to help the pattern maker








I’ll use a good 19 row oil radiator with a thermostatic sandwich plate to keep temperature as low as possible (we have a tropical climate







). An Accusump will help to minimize oil pressure fluctuations and will provide a pre-oiling of the engine during stating. I hope it will also add few seconds to stop engine if oil pump or belt fail…
















I also choose to oversize this belt (1” wide but ¾” was probably enough)
It is the price to pay to have the “heart” of the engine at the outside. HP gain is probably low but it was a mechanical challenge, especially in a small country like mine !
Sorry for my English.


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## vr6engine (Jan 23, 2006)

*Re: (vr6engine)*

quick question: have you test fitted the engine in the car yet? If so do you clear the frame rail on the crank pulley and is the crank pulley 1 or 2 pieces?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
unfortunatly, not yet








My initial project was for my VR6 SC Mk2 Golf. But now I have found an Mk3 model, so I have to modify a lot of details to fit the machanic setup. The body is not painted yet because I'm alone to make all jobs. I am working for about 5 years now (and a lot of $$$ spent). I don't know when I'll hear the supercharged VR6 magic sound again







! 
The crank pulley is in 2 parts. So, if I need it, I will be able to change the gear ratio later ( but 1/2 is good according to Pace Products. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif ) 
The pump pulley is very close to the right CV axle and A arm, but I think it is Ok. I have to route the oil feed and return rigid 19mm OD tubes and hoses under the car. I hope to keep rear seats stock but it will not be easy.
I still have engine wiring to make for my Autronic ECU, Aeromotive fuel pump and circuit, intercooler pipes, PWR radiator, etc.. and I need some big $$$ to buy the wonderfull Schimmel VR6 short intake







!










_Modified by vr6engine at 6:13 PM 1-24-2006_


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