# What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (dbc)



## 91driver (Feb 25, 2004)

I'm looking for info to get me started on possible donor cars for my 1991 MK2 golf to be more specific. Anybody have some links to educate me in basic Audi models of the late 80's and early 90's. Links are great. Thanks for the help.


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## sirhc (Sep 23, 1999)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (91driver)*

1986-88 Audi 5000TQ
1989-91 Audi 100/200
1992-96 Audi S4/S6
86' to 90' had the 10vt, while 91' to 96' had the 20vt. The 20vts are definitely the preferred motor, however they command at least $2500 for a complete motor, if not more. For a relatively low budget project, the 10vt is the way to go... as they can be found for pennies. I'd also recommend these folks as an answer to your fueling and ignition needs. 
http://www.034efi.com
EFI is definately the way to get power out of these early cars, its possible to see close to 300ph with the stock motor and turbo. Good luck!
*Edit* Oh, and I'm sure you've seen this guy, right? http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1170697


_Modified by sirhc at 11:12 AM 3-18-2004_


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## SLAB (Aug 1, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (91driver)*

by reading your subject....and seeing what car you have...im going to assume you mean the drive-by-cable 1.8 turbo.
this can be found in all pre-1999 A4's, and Passats...engine code AEB
1998-1999 passats
1997-1999 A4's


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## sirhc (Sep 23, 1999)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (SLAB)*

I guess that would make more sense...







I sometimes forget that not everyone is infatuated with the 5 cyl motor.


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## PerL (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (sirhc)*

Well, he _did_ say late 80's, early 90's. Those were the days of the 2.2T's (







), while the 1.8T is late 90's.


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## NW4KQ driver (Nov 30, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (PerL)*

he did say *5V* too. which to me would mean 1.8t. Why cant people just way 1.8t it would make it way easier


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## PerL (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (NW4KQ driver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NW4KQ driver* »_he did say *5V* too. 

Indeed he did, maybe he meant the 25V engine?


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## blkaudicq (Oct 22, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (PerL)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PerL* »_
Indeed he did, maybe he meant the 25V engine?









Maybe he did...The origonal Audi 5v head!!


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## 91driver (Feb 25, 2004)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (blkaudicq)*

Interesting.....5 cylinder engines. That wasn't what I was considering, but it's got my attention now. Why was production stopped? honestly I was looking for something with a bit more parts and info availability. The 1.8t was my target, but I'm open to suggestions especially if parts are in wide availability and low cost. To tell you the truth I always wanted a Golf or if possible Audi wagon, but more for daily driving. This will become a reality in the months to come, but for know I am looking for a street machine, high in potential and withought a warranty. The Golf I have jsut aquired is my current daily driver, though I can't go wrong with the gas mileage, potential, hundreds of other enthusiasts who in turns support my obsesion, and the fun factor. I actually had been working on a 240sx project for the past 2 years when I finally came to the reality that practicality was an issue. So....I figured, I guess I'll work up a dub instead. It definitely would benefit my future aspirations for a brand new VAG, keeping it close in framaliarity with parts and knowledge resources. I always wanted a Golf, but the 240 was for sale, close to salvage, and cheap for parts. I'm glad I came across my Golf though, probably the best $800 i've ever spent....well, except for food maybe....nah. 
To conclude the post, (long at that), my golf does infact have Digifant II electronic fuel injection. If I were to swap, II would want to swap out prety much the entire front clip, harnesses and all. I know that there is probably no fabrication needed for mounting points, which makes me happy. Does anyone know of my options for 91' non obd audis with 1.8t's? I've been told that transmissions will interchange as well so that there are no big drivetrain headaches. What would I want to look for as far as a complete used audi? Links to audi model specs and info is great. Which brings me to this, why don'tthey get to work on the "model guide: section. this would make me, and i'm sure others _very happy _







. Thanks everyone. Tell me more about basic 5cylinder specs. Thanks!


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## 91driver (Feb 25, 2004)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (blkaudicq)*

I didn't.....but I do now!!! What's with the blue coating atop the chamber/head?


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## PerL (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (91driver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *91driver* »_Interesting.....5 cylinder engines.<snip> Why was production stopped?

Production wasnt actually stopped, the 5-cyl lived on in gas and diesel versions in the T4 (Eurovan), but the reason Audi stoped using the 5-cyl engine was that it was too large. The engine was too long to fit the front end of both the B5 (A4) and C5 (A6).


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## PerL (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (91driver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *91driver* »_What's with the blue coating atop the chamber/head?

I guess it's just painted to set off the 5 valves.


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (91driver)*

check out the hybrid forum of vortex http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
that would be your best bet to find info on 1.8t swaps


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## billzcat1 (Sep 10, 2001)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (91driver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *91driver* »_ Does anyone know of my options for 91' non obd audis with 1.8t's? I've been told that transmissions will interchange as well so that there are no big drivetrain headaches. 

Doesn't exist. The first year we saw the 1.8t in America was 1997 in the A4. You cannot get a 1.8t that is not OBD-2. The early A4s and Passats are the motors to use for your golf swap. The wiring is much less complex since these motors are the more traditional "drive-by-cable" throttled motors. The drive-by-wire swaps are possible as well, but much more involved.

_Quote, originally posted by *91driver* »_ The 1.8t was my target, but I'm open to suggestions especially if parts are in wide availability and low cost.

Parts for the various 5-cylinder motors are becoming more and more difficult to find and also more expensive with each passing day. Those of us interested in them rely on salvage yards for any major part since most major components are far out of reach if you try to order new. Case in point - the 91 20vt intake manifold is over $700 wholesale. The upgraded 225hp TT intake mani for the 1.8t is $180. New maintenance parts are still available for most 5-cylinders (seals, gaskets, lifters, etc) but they are getting more expensive too.

_Quote, originally posted by *91driver* »_ Tell me more about basic 5cylinder specs. Thanks!

Lets talk 5-cylinder! This is limited to the US-market cars, btw. Some of these rules get thrown out the window in European-market and race cars.
Lets start by saying that all Audi 5-cylinder motors are related in the same way that all VW 4-cylinders are related. Also, the 5-cylinder motors share architecture with their VW brethren.
Audi 5-cylinder motors come in 2 varieties - 10v and 20v. The 10v is basically an 8v VW motor with an extra cylinder, and the 20v is basically a 16v with an extra cylinder. Bore spacing, port shape, combustion chamber design is all the same. 
Since we are talking turbo motors, I'll skip the boring NA motors and the kooky diesels of the early 80s. The 10v turbo motor was produced from 1980 to 1991 in displacements of 2144cc and 2226cc. HP ranged from 136hp (up to 83) to 140 (84-85) and 162 (85-91). There was a 2144 cc version from 81-87 that made 160hp as well, but it is quite rare. All 10v turbos until 89.5 had a K26 turbocharger. Some water, some oil cooled. In 89.5 they went to a smaller K24 to reduce lag and improve throttle response. All 10vts are fueled by CIS or a CIS-derivitive (CIS-Lambda, CIS-E, etc) 
The 10v turbo motor's strength is literally its strength. The bottom ends feature stubby forged rods and burly forged pistons on a forged steel crank. The exhaust valves are sodium filled for durability. Another good point in the 10vt is the relative ease of locating one in the junkyard. Used parts should be relatively abundant and inexpensive. 
The weakness of the 10vt is the head design and fueling system. Even when equipped with EFI, a modern turbo, and header, they are still only pushing around 300 wheel hp on pump gas. They are simply too knock-prone to do any better. Another weakness is that there are virtually no aftermarket bolt-ons. Modifications are custom and one-off pieces. This is cheaper than bolt-ons, but more difficult.
The 20v turbo motor was produced in 2226cc displacement from 1991-1997. For the 91 model year, they made 218hp, then for 92-97 they made 227hp. The major difference between the two was intercooler placement, intake manifold design, and a direct ingition system introduced in 92.
All 20v turbo motors use Bosch Motronic engine management with sequential EFI and spark control. Even today, its a fairly modern system. All 20vts come equipped with a K24 turbocharger. Through the use of a chip, exhaust, and WG spring the 20vt should be close to 280 bhp.
The strength of the 20vt is in the aftermarket and OEM support. Thanks to the RS2 (A 315hp euro-only version) there are a ton of factory bolt-ons that can really wake this motor up and keep OEM driveability and reliability. There are also a few companies that actually offer upgraded components for the 20vt. Also, the more modern head design has much better resistance to knock. 
The weakness of the 20vt is in the cost. A motor usually sets you back at least $2500 and all these bolt-ons aren't cheap! If you have fabricating experience, you can turn out functional pieces for pennies on the dollar when tuning a 20vt. Another "weakness" is the bottom end. The pistons are still forged, but the compression ratio is a touch high at 9.3:1. The rods are longer and skinnier than in the 10v turbo and become the weak point of the motor somewhere in the 450hp range. This can be acheived using pump gas as well.
So I hope this covers the "5-cyl turbo" FAQ - I could add more details but it would get tediously long...as if it wasn't already!















If you have specific questions feel free to shoot them out!


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (billzcat1)*

Richard.... you're the man http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 91driver (Feb 25, 2004)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (MFZERO)*

I am amazed of the abundance of information you have just relieved yourself of. Outstanding billzcat! Be proud. I guess I will look about the ways of a 1.8t. However, still waiting for those links







I guess I should move this on over to swaps now, just wanted to see what was most desirable from the audi crowd as I'm sure many of the straight dubbers don't even know of a 25v 5 cyl. engine. Thanks for the time and efforts everyone. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## MartijnGizmo (Apr 21, 2002)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (91driver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *91driver* »_I am amazed of the abundance of information you have just relieved yourself of. Outstanding billzcat! Be proud. I guess I will look about the ways of a 1.8t. However, still waiting for those links







I guess I should move this on over to swaps now, just wanted to see what was most desirable from the audi crowd as I'm sure many of the straight dubbers don't even know of a 25v 5 cyl. engine. Thanks for the time and efforts everyone. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

I'd like to add: the 25v engine was used in the famous Taladega-project.....


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## danny_16v (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (MartijnGizmo)*

I yern for 20v URS4... soooo hot.


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (danny_16v)*

We all do


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## glibobbo21 (Nov 11, 2002)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (MFZERO)*

i second that motion


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## StormChaser (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (glibobbo21)*

Since you are doing all that custom work on the golf quattro...why not go with a turnbo I5, maybe a 20V turbo I5?


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## glibobbo21 (Nov 11, 2002)

*Re: What early year audi's came with the 5v turbo (duandcc)*

its going to be a turbo, whther its a 20v or not remains to be seen


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