# mk3 8v ABA: HEAD SWAP & mods... SEE YOUTUBE VIDEO BELOW!!!!



## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

What's UP! VDUB, .. all my VW people, show some love!! 

This is my dailey driver, and instead of the popular VR6 swap or the MUST DO 16v swap, I decided to stick with the 8v and plan on making 300hp turbo later!

But first things first: to get some power now, I BEEFed up the TOP END:

Mk2 8v ABA Head swap w/dual valve springs:
- 4 Angle valve job
- Port and Polish job
- Milled and deck: little higher than 10:1
- Resurfaced and High Temp. Coated all around

AUTOTEC 270 cam
SPA TURBO: adjustable cam gear: set at 0 degree, currently
ARP Head studs: non-undercut
VICTOR REINZ: MLS metal head gasket and gasket kit
BLACKFORESTINDUSTRIES: STage 2 PEM chip: for 270 cam
TECHTONICS: 2" INCH RACE downpipe: it deletes the cat
TECHTONICS: 2.25 catback: Dynomax
8V PULLEY SET
Bosch plugs w/ OEM wires/ Castrol Syntec oil: EDGE

BFI Stage .5 Engin mount Kit/ NOT YET INSTALLED
176 Degree Thermostat/ NOT YET INSTALLED
New OEM+ clutch/ NOT YET INSTALLED

After graduating and new job, want to get rims, interior, and STG 3 turbo kit
Shouts to: ECS tuning, NGP Racing, MJMautohaus, Black Forest, & Techtonics!

YOUTUBE VIDEO: HD


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## mizzuh (Oct 13, 2010)

what are the benefits to installing a mk2 head vs a mk3?


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

only benefit was mk2 8v head come with dual valve springs, and this head was already Ported, polished, milled, resurfaced, Heat coated, 4 angle valve job READY, got it with a HUGE discount from a vdub owner.

At first i was going to get another mk3 ABA and ship to get P&P and purchase HD dual valve springs from TT. but the MK2 head, already comes with them,


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

Now let's see a gauge cluster acceleration video.


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

I dont understand....that head is just a regular ABA head. There is no such thing as a "MKII ABA". All MKII 8v heads are counter-flow (intake and exhaust in the back of the head). Only the MKIII's (1993-2001) had the cross-flow head (intake in the front). That head in your video is just an OBDII German head found on all 1993-1995.5 Golf/Jettas. 

Might want to edit all your threads and YouTube video.......


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

You also cross-posted the same thread in THREE other forums on this site....which is against forum rules.


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## FL 2.0L (Aug 1, 2002)

Loved the video! Keep 'em coming! I can't recall seeing a vid as entertaining for the MKIIIs!


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

thanx reason i did it was for that, and same thing i said before i made the video.

@ tdogg74, sorry I cross posted the same thread, if must close all except 1 can you open the one you closed and close all others.


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## duffmanh06 (Apr 22, 2008)

and dont early obd1 aba heads have dual valve springs?


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## vento86 (Oct 13, 2008)

duffmanh06 said:


> and dont early obd1 aba heads have dual valve springs?


Yes


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## vento86 (Oct 13, 2008)

O and that video is dope:thumbup:


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## groundupjetta (Feb 1, 2010)

Like the video, cool build men :thumbup:


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## VDUBIN (Jun 28, 2001)

small point on your "mk2" aba... 

the ABA is a mk3 engine only and as stated all mk2 engines were counter flow, intake and exhaust on same side of head except for the 16V.

the OBD1 ABA is a forged ABA and the head comes with dual valve springs from the factory and an ISV on the side of the intake. these engines ranged from 1993 to just into 1996 using up their stock during OBD1/OBD2 changeover.

the OBD2 ABA is not a forged ABA and the head comes with single valve springs from the factory and an ISV is part of the throttlebody and is the precurser to the DBW TB we see in the MK4s.
these engines start in 1996 and continue to 1998.

you state that you want to turbo your car later... you are going to have to plan on lowering your compression as you video states "milled and decked; higher than 10:1"

but, nice vid man and good luck on your build.


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## Jay-Bee (Sep 22, 2007)

VDUBIN said:


> ....
> 
> the OBD1 ABA is a forged ABA.....
> 
> the OBD2 ABA is not a forged ABA.....


Stop with all the forged talk, it's only the crankshaft that's forged, and a cast crank can still handle lot's of stress.


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

Jay-Bee said:


> Stop with all the forged talk, it's only the crankshaft that's forged, and a cast crank can still handle lot's of stress.


I was gonna say there's definitely casting lines on all my obd1 heads. I'm sure it's just a big mix up with the whole "obd1 motors have forged internals" and so forth.


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## SPJosh1890 (Sep 4, 2010)

i was diggin the music lol. nice build up!:thumbup:

P.S. off topic but what type of camera are you using? the video quality is pretty nice.


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

Thanx to everyone's comment's! I MEAN EVERYONE! 

and yea, mistake head is the mk3 OBD1 head,.. I have QUESTION! the early mk3 head's OBD1, guy told me they came with dual valve springs is this true or false!

camera is Canon vixia HF20.

the next video will be after I get these mounts and clutch installed, for the clutch I'm going to take it to NGP down in Lorton. video will have pulls, I'll even race a with a b20 or h22 to see where my 8v N/A stands!


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## groundupjetta (Feb 1, 2010)

Mr. VWswagg Sir said:


> Thanx to everyone's comment's! I MEAN EVERYONE!
> 
> and yea, mistake head is the mk3 OBD1 head,.. I have QUESTION! the early mk3 head's OBD1, guy told me they came with dual valve springs is this true or false!
> 
> ...


Its true obd1 heads has the dual valve springs from factory

When you race these ricers just make sure you take to the track


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## hyperformancevw (Mar 15, 2007)

forgot obd1 has oil squirters too where obd2 doesn't


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

Mr. VWswagg Sir said:


> Thanx to everyone's comment's! I MEAN EVERYONE!
> 
> and yea, mistake head is the mk3 OBD1 head,.. I have QUESTION! the early mk3 head's OBD1, guy told me they came with dual valve springs is this true or false!
> 
> ...


 Or you can just line up with me for a good comparison. Tell Benji and John that Apple sent ya. They are good guys down there.


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## VeeDoubleYouGuy (Nov 4, 2003)

like the down pipe :thumbup: 
cool vid man


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## DjBij099 (Jul 21, 2003)

The video and music were a good match. I liked it :thumbup:


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

Gotta correct a few things. Heads are cast, period. 

Not all OBD1 heads have dual springs, not all the internals are different from OBD1 to OBD2, in fact the only thing thats different is the crank, sometimes the pistons, but the pistons are always cast. 

Some OBD1's have squirters. 

I'd also like to say, I think it's a cool build, but those intake ports look stock to me, bad choice of spark plugs, always soak hydraulic lifters before installation, and there is virtually no benefit of an adjustable cam gear on an AT270 and stock intake manifold.


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

jsneed said:


> Gotta correct a few things. Heads are cast, period.
> 
> Not all OBD1 heads have dual springs, not all the internals are different from OBD1 to OBD2, in fact the only thing thats different is the crank, sometimes the pistons, but the pistons are always cast.
> 
> ...


 Did I mention I like your style? :wave: 

But seriously I agree with almost all of this.....but I'm not "vortex approved" so...... :laugh:


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

PBWB said:


> Did I mention I like your style? :wave:
> 
> But seriously I agree with almost all of this.....but I'm not "vortex approved" so...... :laugh:


What's the "almost"?


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## Salsa GTI (Aug 29, 2000)

Jay-Bee said:


> Stop with all the forged talk, it's only the crankshaft that's forged, and a cast crank can still handle lot's of stress.


Exactly...........
Lets stop all the bench racing crap....you people and the forged crank crap...
it sounds like the old chevy ford "D" Bag talk of 4 bolt main blocks forged this and that ..........
All GAY
Just install ANY ABA engine thats in good shape....use duel valve springs...pick a cam...
drop the compression if your shooting for more than 220 whp
get head studs...then build somthing and post dyno charts.......and until you post dyno charts...your HP claims and words are Useless......

Ok im off to punch babys and kick puppys


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

jsneed said:


> What's the "almost"?


The only thing I disagree with is the 270 w/cam gear on a stock intake mani......I'd offer up a dyno comparison but I'm broke at the moment.....But I do have the right setup to do it right now.


Salsa GTI said:


> Exactly...........
> Lets stop all the bench racing crap....you people and the forget crank crap...


I think someone forgot to take their meds. :screwy:


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

PBWB said:


> The only thing I disagree with is the 270 w/cam gear on a stock intake mani......I'd offer up a dyno comparison but I'm broke at the moment.....But I do have the right setup to do it right now.


The adjustable gear is nearly worthless. The 270 has a fat wide powerband, you can't move it up because the stock manifolds don't breathe up there, and you don't need to move it down. I ran a 270 for years and all my adjustable cam gear did was look cool and eat up my timing belt.


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

Is this a good time for me to jump in and tell you you're wrong?


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

tdogg74 said:


> Is this a good time for me to jump in and tell you you're wrong?


Depends


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

tdogg74 said:


> Is this a good time for me to jump in and tell you you're wrong?


Agreed.

I just put a TT adj gear on over the weekend that I had laying around (because of jsneed's post) and set it to -4. It's a night and day difference.....I can feel a small choke in torque from where the deramped TB gave my setup a swift kick in the pants (between 1000-2400rpms believe it or not), but there's still plenty of it when paired with the 2Y trans. But now it screams as if the motor DOESN'T have 160k miles on it. And trust me, if I can run a 15.9 on this car with a crappy 2.1 60' because a weak 16v clutch won't hold BEFORE this (with pretty low compression numbers I might add), then I'm almost certain with the right clutch I can hit 15.6 now. That's how big of a difference the gear made.

I guess we'll find out when the track opens.


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## desamk3 (Sep 29, 2010)

do it makes a big drifrent all this part that you intall


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

desamk3 said:


> do it makes a big drifrent all this part that you intall


Cmplet sentnses pleese.

And yes, it makes a difference.


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## A3 jetta* (Nov 18, 2010)

nice video!


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

PBWB said:


> Agreed.
> 
> I just put a TT adj gear on over the weekend that I had laying around (because of jsneed's post) and set it to -4. It's a night and day difference.....I can feel a small choke in torque from where the deramped TB gave my setup a swift kick in the pants (between 1000-2400rpms believe it or not), but there's still plenty of it when paired with the 2Y trans. But now it screams as if the motor DOESN'T have 160k miles on it. And trust me, if I can run a 15.9 on this car with a crappy 2.1 60' because a weak 16v clutch won't hold BEFORE this (with pretty low compression numbers I might add), then I'm almost certain with the right clutch I can hit 15.6 now. That's how big of a difference the gear made.
> 
> I guess we'll find out when the track opens.


I'm shocked... I've had a several NA ABAs, most fairly stock and one built and neither one seemed to have a dramatic difference with the 270 anywhere between +4 and -4. I did notice a huge difference in cam timing when running a larger cam and SRI, but I attributed that to breathing much better.

I might have to buy another VW and play around with it.:laugh:


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

jsneed said:


> I'm shocked... I've had a several NA ABAs, most fairly stock and one built and neither one seemed to have a dramatic difference with the 270 anywhere between +4 and -4. I did notice a huge difference in cam timing when running a larger cam and SRI, but I attributed that to breathing much better.
> 
> I might have to buy another VW and play around with it.:laugh:


Just don't attribute what I've done or the mods on my car as being "the norm".....I got lucky and made the deramped TB work on my obd2 car, big whoop. With that said I would dare to say to bring me another mk3 that runs high 15's or better with as few/similar mods......cause I seriously doubt you'd find one. For most, it takes at least a performance intake mani to get into the 15s. My setup is just "different". 

Hopefully by the end of the year I'll be able to cut mid/high 15's, then get an intake mani and cut low/mid 15's....then swap it all into a mk2 (obd2 and all) and run 14's after rebuilding the bottom end and shaving the head. Now THAT would be a fun car!


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

PBWB said:


> Just don't attribute what I've done or the mods on my car as being "the norm".....I got lucky and made the deramped TB work on my obd2 car, big whoop. With that said I would dare to say to bring me another mk3 that runs high 15's or better with as few/similar mods......cause I seriously doubt you'd find one. For most, it takes at least a performance intake mani to get into the 15s. My setup is just "different".
> 
> Hopefully by the end of the year I'll be able to cut mid/high 15's, then get an intake mani and cut low/mid 15's....then swap it all into a mk2 (obd2 and all) and run 14's after rebuilding the bottom end and shaving the head. Now THAT would be a fun car!


I did 14.93 in a full weight OBDI Jetta GL. That was with an pretty torn up ABA and a really lucky guess on the tranny. I just grabbed a MKII 020, can't remember which, but it wasn't a 2Y. I can't see being able to replicate it with another car and the same setup. I don't know if it was the ported head and stock intake at that time, but I didn't have any real luck with the cam gear.


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

Thanks for all these different discussions, so yea the head in the video was the OBD1 head and guy said they come with dual valve springs. 

And I'll tell the guys at NGP to check out link, next time I go up there, which i will to install my clutch.


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

PBWB said:


> Just don't attribute what I've done or the mods on my car as being "the norm".....I got lucky and made the deramped TB work on my obd2 car, big whoop. With that said I would dare to say to bring me another mk3 that runs high 15's or better with as few/similar mods......cause I seriously doubt you'd find one. For most, it takes at least a performance intake mani to get into the 15s. My setup is just "different".
> 
> Hopefully by the end of the year I'll be able to cut mid/high 15's, then get an intake mani and cut low/mid 15's....then swap it all into a mk2 (obd2 and all) and run 14's after rebuilding the bottom end and shaving the head. Now THAT would be a fun car!




...:sly: I'll challenge that my friend, wait until I get my clutch and mounts, and let me get just a CAI, not even the SRI or LRI, and I be I break the 15! or lower.. non force induction yet..:snowcool:


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

*UPDATE VIDEO of mk3 8v*

http://youtu.be/NQVNxXmJQUE?hd=1

This is an update in APRIL, after an incident in rain. I replace the fenders that were messed up. My coils are a little weaker now  but suspension overall is a TOUGH one! 

Check out the video


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## Mr Black (Jan 20, 2002)

Nice vid man...I love the shots of the head and D/p assembled....brings back some fond memories of the last head swap I did in my old Mk2. It was the same idea as yours, Autotech 270, decked and ported head, switch from single to dual-outlet exhaust mani. 

Are you enjoying the difference in power?


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

*GREAT NEWS: Drivetrain upgrade*

HEY, I just got my new clutch, LW BFI flywheel, new better axles, and BFI Stage .5 motor mount kit installed by my buddy Nate from Vdub luv!

gonna break the clutch in a few miles and then I will record some pulls

Feels good to get rid of a slippery clutch and shaky motor!!!!!!!!!!!

Stay tuned for the next video


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## AJmustDIE (Dec 22, 2010)

While we're on the subject of making your car faster.. lets step into the opposite side of the equation.

You have rear drum brakes, convert to disk, end of story. :beer:


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

AJmustDIE said:


> While we're on the subject of making your car faster.. lets step into the opposite side of the equation.
> 
> You have rear drum brakes, convert to disk, end of story. :beer:



YEA i know man, the conversion kit is around $450, I want to get my front drilled disc first, coils, intake and new wires.

But breaking the new clutch in 400 miles


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## Mr Black (Jan 20, 2002)

AJmustDIE said:


> WhilYou have rear drum brakes, convert to disk, end of story. :beer:


And that will do.....what exactly?

Your rear brakes contribute virtually no braking power. Stick with the drums and save your money, there are soooo many better things to add to your ride.


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## AJmustDIE (Dec 22, 2010)

Mr Black said:


> And that will do.....what exactly?
> 
> Your rear brakes contribute virtually no braking power. Stick with the drums and save your money, there are soooo many better things to add to your ride.


Yeah, because drum brakes don't totally bring down overall quality.. 
Go to a junkyard if your feelin' cheap and just take all the goods off of another car. :thumbup:


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

*Mk3 8v Drivetrain upgrade: YOUTUBE VIDEO attached!*

That's true.. Check it out fellas, an UP TO DATE video of the modifications. Just finished the video, was kinda lazzy with it, but straight forward. did the video 2 days ago, my car is at 166,350 and running pretty good, well ofcourse it has a new head on its shoulders now!


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## AJmustDIE (Dec 22, 2010)

:thumbup:


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## PBWB (Sep 12, 2004)

Why didn't you paint the entire caliper? You only did the part you can see from outside the car. lol


And I hope you did the input seals on that trans, otherwise you're gonna be pulling it apart once it starts making your new clutch slip.


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## Mr. VWswagg Sir (Aug 30, 2010)

*The input shaft seal in tranny was replaced as well*



PBWB said:


> Why didn't you paint the entire caliper? You only did the part you can see from outside the car. lol
> 
> 
> And I hope you did the input seals on that trans, otherwise you're gonna be pulling it apart once it starts making your new clutch slip.



YES! the input shaft seal was replaced also, i will be sure to put that in the description of the video. :thumbup:

The clutch grabs nice and the STAGE .5 mounts have just enough vibration I can deal with! glad i didn't get Stage 1. The motor doesn't move AT ALL. THANKS BFI.:wave:


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