# Reverse lights wire or fuse location



## HunterST (Dec 11, 2008)

I'm wiring up a backup camera, which comes with a voltage sense lead so it automatically turns on/off with the backup lights. 
Does anyone know either the fuse location for the backup/reverse lights, or the physical location (and color) of the hot wire for the backup lights, so I can tap into that?
Thanks!


----------



## CLMims (Jul 13, 2007)

*Re: Reverse lights wire or fuse location (HunterST)*

From the wiring diagrams, it appears the fuses involved are 18, 24, and 26 (they link to the J393 Convenience System Control Unit).
The reversing light bulbs (one of the few that are not LEDs) are part of the J692/J693 Tail Light control units in the trunk lid, so I'm not sure how to Tap in to the actual wire that carries the signal to the bulb (I'll see if I can find a pinout for the J393)


----------



## ruddyone (Feb 9, 2009)

*Re: Reverse lights wire or fuse location (HunterST)*

Hey Dan -
Any chance you can do a write-up after you complete this? I've been planning on doing a back-up camera. But, just need to find the time. Which one did you purchase?
Best Regards,
Nate


----------



## HunterST (Dec 11, 2008)

*Re: Reverse lights wire or fuse location (ruddyone)*

I sure will - I bought my kit from these guys: http://www.navvideo.com/navvid...n.asp. For cameras, I chose NV_CAMERA2, which I mounted to the underside of the bumper, at the top of my license plate frame. As an aside, the Engrish written on the VERY nice box for the (made in China) camera is noteworthy:
All Back A Car Backsight System
Transcendency In Focus
Art In The Highest Flight 
Driver A Good Underservant








Here's the original thread I started on this topic: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4181957 To the admins, sorry for starting a second - I actually forgot about the first, it was so long ago - feel free to merge.
Mounting the camera was easy, I drilled a 1/2" hole behind my license plate to fish the camera wires through, which I pulled through one of the louvered vents in the spare tire well. Also, installing the circuitry into the infotainment head unit wasn't hard at all - instructions provided by the NavVideo folks were pretty straightforward. The little black box will fit into my cd changer space (along with my Dice unit), so the hard part is going to be connecting the two ends.
That said, at this point I'm stumped. I pulled my trunk lid liner partly away so I could put a voltage meter on the connector going to one of the backup lights, but I was still unable to figure it out - saw no change in voltage coming through the connector whether the reverse light was on or not. But I was testing with it unplugged - is the car smart enough to not send voltage if the bulb isn't present? Not sure. So I'll try to completely disassemble that this weekend. But even if I do find the wire that carries voltage in the lid, I need to either trace that back into the trunk compartment, or somehow run a wire along the trunk wiring harness... 
My neighbor thinks I'm crazy... "you buy a $75k car but you're too cheap to pay to have someone install your camera?" He just doesn't get it - this is half the fun!


----------



## ruddyone (Feb 9, 2009)

*FV-QR*

Dan -
Sounds like a good project. That's the exact company I was going to use. I was looking at the Nav_Camera3 though as I like the idea of having it flush mounted. 
Did you get a chance to run the wires and make sure everything actually worked? Just wondering how the picture came through.
I don't think I would run the wires through the trunk. Seems like there would be a chance of something braking or a wire getting too tight or something. There has to be another place to connect into that line. I have found that you can get wiring diagrams from VW US here: ERWIN Online - VW America A 1 day session is $35. Maybe that will help.
Keep it up and let us know.
Best Regards,
Nate


----------



## HunterST (Dec 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (ruddyone)*

Thanks Nate - 
After a few hours of research, here's what I now know - the wires coming off the camera are just power (+/-) and RCA video. So that solves one problem but creates another - I still need to run the video wire through the car, but now I need to pick up my reverse signal from somewhere inside the cabin. 
I still think I need to bring the camera wires in through the trunk - easy source of power for the camera (left rear fuse box), and I don't need to drill through any steel.  this picture (from a discussion on LATCH hooks) gives me some ideas for getting into the cabin through the trunk; once inside the car I'm sure I can route it up to the glove box without too much difficulty...
The problem is still the reverse sense wire coming off the control module, which will be in the glove box. The wire that comes with the kit is very long, so I'm sure they expect you to run it back to the actual reverse bulb, which I obviously don't want to do. I can think of two other possibilities:
1) According to a phaeton technician self-study manual I found on the web, "Control Module J519 is located on the front passenger's side in the right front footwell electronics box". In the table of J519 Input Signals, I see Backup Light Switch F4 among a slew of other connectors. Will that wire carry 12 volts? No clue, but worth investigating considering the proximity. Has anyone ever cracked that puppy open?
2) This may be the simplest solution - I wonder if the "R" indicator bulb next to the shifter draws 12 volts?


----------



## Phaeton2 (May 18, 2013)

Hi, bringing this thread back from the dead. I'm in the process of installing a backup camera and I need to find the reverse backup light power. I can't figure this out either. There is a non-led reverse light which should be drawing 12 V in reverse but I can't find it with my voltmeter on the taillight. The wires for the tailights are easy to tap into. Just lower the rear shelf in the trunk and they are on the driver side above. The highest voltage I found was 3V. I'm wondering if the tailight steps up the power somehow. 

I'm using a wireless video transmitter to avoid running the wire to the front. It has been nothing but trouble. If I did this again, I would hardwire. The transmitters overheat but this is not an issue if they are only on for a few minutes. I've installed a fuse on each transistor. There is 12V off of the shifter led's but you have to be careful. There is not enough current to turn the transmitter on (you will dim the leds if you tap into it). You'll have to use a set of transistors to pull power from somewhere else but tap into the reverse led transistor on the shifter led board. My uncle is an electronics repair man and he helped me with the design. I can share how to do this once I figure it out. For one moment, I wasn't very careful and I believe I shorted the shifter board and maybe the tiptronic board as well. If anyone has a spare let me know.


----------



## Phaeton2 (May 18, 2013)

Ok so I figured this out. There are two black with blue stripe wires leading to each reverse light in the trunk. You can find those wires above the rear shelf in the trunk adjacent to the black retractable cabling for the trunk lid. Just lower the rear shelf by taking out the 8-10 carpeted screws (carpet on head so they are hidden) using a torx. Pull on the shelf to pop the latches. Unwrap the black cloth cable wrap to find the wires. You can tap into ground near the left tail light. I'll give you a warning that the backup camear install is not easy. You have been warned! 

I burned up my tiptronic gear selector and shifter led lights below the shifter trying to tap into the shifter light circuit. If anyone has a donor please let me know!!


----------



## Phaeton2 (May 18, 2013)

I noticed my left rear trunk lid is working sporadically after taping into the reverse light. I believe I need to isolate the wireless transmitter with a relay. I'll let you know the results. If you decide to go the wireless transmitter route do a little research to be sure they work well. The set I received overheats if left on for any significant time. I'm going to change the setup to a hardwire. I thought it would be ok if left on for a short time, but it is proving to be more trouble than it is worth.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Steve:

What kind of backup camera did you use? Can you supply us with a URL (a link) to the vendor of the camera? How did you wire it in?

I have not seen a successful backup camera installation on a NAR Phaeton before, yours appears to be the first "pretty good quality" installation. Can you tell us more about how you wired it, where the connections are, what level of difficulty the whole job was, etc.?

I am particularly interested in finding out where, exactly, you managed to 'inject' the video signal from the camera into the big front information display. In other words, what and where did you connect the camera's video signal to?

Michael


----------



## Phaeton2 (May 18, 2013)

I can post more later, but basically from my research most of the backup cameras systems are similar. They bypass the screen video input in the back of the screen. I replicated mine after the Nav-TV, BNT-KIT which is made for the Phaeton and Bentley. http://navtv.com/product/43/bnt-kit.html 

The kit is normally $700. Being that I'm thrifty, I bought a NAV-TV adapter on ebay which was made for a different vehicle. Then I constructed my own adapter, which required me to solder over 100 connections. Then you need to buy a camera to go with the NAV-TV adapter and if you wish wireless transmitters (which I don't recommend). I found the source to buy the NAV-TV blue box new for a very reasonable price. If anyone is interested in a more economical approach, I could put together a package with the prewired harness and various bits to make it easy...if I decide it worth my trouble. It is a lot of work to construct the adapter. It's also a fair amount of work to install, especially when you have no instructions to follow. With instructions, I think most people could do it but it does take some patience. Anyhow, I need to do some more testing to make sure it is 100% operational. My install will also have video in the car (in motion) when I'm finished. The video quality is actually pretty good, the photos don't do it justice. I'm going to hook up a single din DVD player, Apple TV, or wire my Iphone to the unit. With Apple TV or the Iphone hookup I should be able to replicate my Iphone screen to the screen in the car. So you could use your iphone navigation, netflix, etc and play it on the screen.

Lastly, I added a MP3 adapter which will allow audio for the video and get this...I was able to keep the 6 disk changer. If I can get the bluetooth figured out as well, I should have a fairly updated technology package. It's taken a lot of research to figure it out.... Unfortunately, I broke a few parts (tiptronic at shifter and led shifter board below shifter cover) in the process which I must fix  I guess this is standard when charting new territory. If anyone has the parts I'll gladly make them an adapter in exchange. I think I just need the electronics not any plastic pieces.

Here are some photos
Video support 









Rear camera, ignore the tool in the rear license plate lamp. That was used to pull the wire.










MP3 / CD changer switch in glove box (to select changer or MP3). With exception of ipod cable coming from old telephone antennae location in center console, only visible component of MP3/6 disk changer integration.


----------



## Jorgsphaeton (Sep 8, 2009)

tell me how dit you get the glovebox out?

thanks Jorg


----------



## Phaeton2 (May 18, 2013)

The center console glovebox is removed following the below steps:

1) remove shifter following recommended Bentley manual procedure (see remove shifter thread) 
2) remove wood shifter cover (see push start button thread)
3) remove one cup holder (see how to remove cupholder thread)
3) unplug power outlet connector. Connector will be covered in foam likely between black plastic air ducts under center console. You'll need to shift some if the wires to get to the connector. It is buried. 
4) remove 4 carpeted screw covers in the bottom of the glovebox (one at each corner). Use dental pick or similar to remove. 
5) remove 4 torx screws below covers. 
6) remove trim piece around phone cord in glovebox by pulling vertically on trim. 
7) lift glove box vertically out of center console
8) disconnect phone cord connector below glovebox if required to remove glovebox (don't remember if this step is necessary)

Note you maybe able to skip steps 1 & 2 by removing one or two cupholders. I'm note sure but I would try that first since you risk damage to tiptronic sensor by removing shifter.


----------



## robbie-rocket-pants (Mar 25, 2012)

I'm thinking of adding a reversing camera to my GP3 (with RNS-810). 

I have seen this on ebay:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181138765566?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Has anyone tried this yet ? If so where is the best place to route the cable ?


----------



## robbie-rocket-pants (Mar 25, 2012)

OK, I bought the reversing camera. I'm in the process of testing it before fully fitting

The VCDS coding is different to those in the instructions, as the long coding on module 37 (Navigation) looks different.

The instructions say to adjust control module 37 (Navigation) byte 3 to value "41" (it is 12 bytes long in the instructions: 04 05 00 41 01 00 05 00 00 00 10 0A).

But my original long coding is only 9 bytes long : 02 01 00 02 00 00 00 20 00

I can only change byte 3 to "42", like this: 02 01 00 42 00 00 00 20 00


Edit: After initially thinking it was not going to work, I packed up and left the car for an hour or so, during which time the RNS810 must have had time to fully power down and re-set itself. So now it appears to work OK. I also found that you need to keep the "Reverse Camera" box_ unchecked_ in the CAN Gateway installation list.

I still need to finalise the wiring connections - in particular getting the reverse signal - I think I may need a CAN bus relay rather than just tapping straight into the LED reverse light wire (when I find it).


----------



## Widescreen111 (Sep 19, 2015)

*Same problem and only 9 bytes long coding without long coding helper*



robbie-rocket-pants said:


> OK, I bought the reversing camera. I'm in the process of testing it before fully fitting
> 
> The VCDS coding is different to those in the instructions, as the long coding on module 37 (Navigation) looks different.
> 
> ...


Hi Robbie,

I just purchased on 2009 MY Phaeton 3,0 TDI with original equipment rear view camera.
What I didnt know and the dealer coudn´t tell me is that when did this camera stopped working.
So i did a VCDS scan and found following fault:

Address 19: CAN Gateway Labels: 6N0-909-901-7L.clb
Part No SW: 6N0 909 901 HW: 3D0 920 885 T
Component: J533 GW-K-CAN TP20 0616 
Coding: FFF7FFAFBB011002
Shop #: WSC 31068 001 1048576
VCID: F0E52164E3B88CE

1 Fault Found:
02873 - Control Module for Back-Up Camera (J772) 
004 - No Signal/Communication
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100100
Fault Priority: 6
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 131
Mileage: 94303 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2015.09.11
Time: 16:52:46

I don´t have any black screen on RNS 810 when inreverse, sensors and led varning rear display works fine..

I also noted that the insctructions found on the internet are not matching the RNS 810 or Phaeton coding for that module.
There is no long coding helper and I´m (I was) too scared to change anything out of the blue.
But can you confirm that the change of byte 3 to "active" (tick mark in box) will do the trick and unchecking reverse camera on CAN list ?
I´m not sure why the original camera could loose coding like that, so it might be CAN bus failure on that control module which I´m going to check anyhow.
Or if You have some ideas for troubleshooting, I´m more that happy to take part of it !
BR
wide


----------



## robbie-rocket-pants (Mar 25, 2012)

Hi Wide,

the reversing camera I fitted was an aftermarket Chinese camera (which I'm very pleased with). That is the reason that I needed to keep the box _unticked_ in the CAN Gateway Installation list - otherwise the car started looking for the Back-Up Camera Control Module, which is not fitted. I believe the trick of setting byte 3 to value 42 is to tell the RNS810 to switch on the video input when it detects reverse gear. 

By the looks of your scan it may well be that you have a wiring or control module fault. My only suggestion at the moment would be to unplug and re-plug the controller (underneath the rear parcel-shelf perhaps ?)

I do not know if either of these changes would be effective with your OEM camera. To be honest, I would give it a go - I swapped the settings round a few times while I was trying to get it to work. Remember to make a note of the original long coding, just in case. Also be sure you have got byte 3 selected (I seem to remember it shows the active byte number at the top of the screen).

Good luck,
Robbie


----------

