# Apr stage one



## Shortfuse206 (Feb 13, 2012)

Just got the apr stage one tune on my beetle all I can say is holy ****, what a power increase, best upgrade for the money hands down. hopefully by summers end I will be full stage 2. Next on the list is cold air, trans mount, motor mount, and subframe mount.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Shortfuse206 said:


> Just got the apr stage one tune on my beetle all I can say is holy ****, what a power increase, best upgrade for the money hands down. hopefully by summers end I will be full stage 2. Next on the list is cold air, trans mount, motor mount, and subframe mount.


 Keep in mind that your torque has now surged from 207 to 297 and has been found to 
compromise the OEM clutch. Had mine changed at less than 5,000 miles because of the 
slight slippage I detected after going to full Stage II.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

Excuse the stupid question, but what are the mounts you're talking about? What do they do? I know you suggested them to me, Ridgemanron, but I'm not sure what they are.


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## drtechy (Jun 3, 2009)

ridgemanron said:


> Keep in mind that your torque has now surged from 207 to 297 and has been found to
> compromise the OEM clutch. Had mine changed at less than 5,000 miles because of the
> slight slippage I detected after going to full Stage II.


 If its a manual 



Shortfuse206 said:


> Just got the apr stage one tune on my beetle all I can say is holy ****, what a power increase, best upgrade for the money hands down. hopefully by summers end I will be full stage 2. Next on the list is cold air, trans mount, motor mount, and subframe mount.


 Nice welcome, lmk when you're looking to buy those mounts I may have a steal for you, depending if I sell them by the time you're ready. I purchased two sets and now have one brand new set just sitting here.


posted by Tapatalk


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Didn't realize you had a DSG.....thought you were in the six-speed world. With regard to the 
mounts, one is the upper motor mount on the left side of your engine bay. Then there's the 
transmission mount on the other side below the battery, as well as the 'dog bone' - pendulum 
or 'dog bone' torque mount between your motor and transmission. Some have replaced the 
complete 'dog bone' hardware with one that has the polyurethane insert already in it. I preferred 
using my original hardware and replacing the rubber insert material with the 75 durometer 
insert offered by HPA. It's design is such that I don't have the vibrations some report at low 
speeds with their complete units. The HPA insert alone sells for about $189 and you may have to 
work a bit to get the original insert out, but once installed it is great. Most 'dog bones' look like 
smooth hockey pucks with regard to their insert, but the HPA one has angle cuts and ridges built 
in that really do an exceptional job of preventing vibrations. HPA is a true racing tuner in Canada 
and you can investigate their inserts on their site. www.hpamotorsport.com


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

NickSarazen said:


> Excuse the stupid question, but what are the mounts you're talking about? What do they do? I know you suggested them to me, Ridgemanron, but I'm not sure what they are.


 When you substantially increase power, more stress is directed to parts of your car. The three 
mounts (upper motor, transmission, pendulum-dog bone torque) all contain cushioning material 
that in rubber OEM form for the Turbo Beetle has a strength level of about 58-60 durometers 
which is too weak for a Stage II. You want to replace the mounts with those that have the level 
of 75 durometers and thereby reduce as much potential causing vibration as possible. Weak 
mounts, over time, can cause damage to integral parts of your car's structure and you would be 
wise to avoid this from happening. Your car will stay planted to the road better which helps 
with regard to performance, especially during spirited 'take offs' and 'braking'. Personally, I 
replaced my upper motor mount with the one that is in the Golf R. Shape/design is the same but 
coming out of the Audi Division it has 75 durometers of strength instead of the 58-60 that were 
in my original ones. With regard to the transmission mount, I installed the APR VW Racing one. 
With the HPA 'dog bone' insert also installed, I have experienced absolutely no added vibrations 
at complete Stage II so I am quite satisfied. You have many different companies offering these 
products but I'm glad I went the way I did. I also installed 75 durometer bushing inserts in the 
front lower control arms and the rear trailer arms, using the OEM hardware in the car. I'm sure 
that these upgrades also have helped to keep the wheels planted to the road surface during 
spirited driving. Their cost was minimal.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

ridgemanron said:


> When you substantially increase power, more stress is directed to parts of your car. The three
> mounts (upper motor, transmission, pendulum-dog bone torque) all contain cushioning material
> that in rubber OEM form for the Turbo Beetle has a strength level of about 58-60 durometers
> which is too weak for a Stage II. You want to replace the mounts with those that have the level
> ...


 Thank you so much for the information. Very very helpful! I will definitely be installing new mounts before I make any stage 2 upgrades.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Glad to have been of help.


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## Shortfuse206 (Feb 13, 2012)

those mounts are a must have. i might do them before the cold air intake, It's cold here in Michigan so the intake can wait for a bit. I do drive spiritedly quite often and I like to feel the road when I drive so a bit stiffer feel will be welcome.



drtechy said:


> Nice welcome, lmk when you're looking to buy those mounts I may have a steal for you, depending if I sell them by the time you're ready. I purchased two sets and now have one brand new set just sitting here.
> 
> 
> posted by Tapatalk


 I will keep that I mind thanks man.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

Shortfuse206 said:


> those mounts are a must have. i might do them before the cold air intake, It's cold here in Michigan so the intake can wait for a bit. I do drive spiritedly quite often and I like to feel the road when I drive so a bit stiffer feel will be welcome.


 Would you prioritize the mounts ahead of the intake and suspension, even with a stage I flash? I'm asking because I'm in the same position you are, I'm about to flash stage I and I don't know if I should do my mounts before or after my intake.


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

NickSarazen said:


> Would you prioritize the mounts ahead of the intake and suspension, even with a stage I flash? I'm asking because I'm in the same position you are, I'm about to flash stage I and I don't know if I should do my mounts before or after my intake.


 I remember Darryl, , the top tech man at HPA, telling me that the first mount should be the 
'dog bone', to go along withe the ECU 'Flash'.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

ridgemanron said:


> I remember Darryl, , the top tech man at HPA, telling me that the first mount should be the
> 'dog bone', to go along withe the ECU 'Flash'.


 Well that's definitely saying something. Those springs will have to wait then!


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## drtechy (Jun 3, 2009)

IMO stage 1 flash is one of the first things to do. I felt no difference in vibrations or anything with a stage 1 flash and stock mounts. Most of the issues arose for me after I replaced my clutch because it was slipping on stage 2. With the better clutch the stock mounts were feeling too soft. 

Of course don't forget this advice is from someone with a manual and the experience may be different with the dsg. 

posted by Tapatalk


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

I found that another benefit of HPA's 'dog bone' mount insert had to do with 'wheel-hop'. 
Not sure about DSG's but once I installed the insert, prior to changing any of the other 
mounts, my front 'wheel hop' intense sensitivity was, for the most part, gone.


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## jokerny77 (Jul 1, 2008)

You can usually get a better price on the complete set instead of buying them separate, bsh sells a nice set. One of the easiest installs, each mount took me about a half hour. I would always go with the hardware first so you avoid breaking anything. Then upgrade the ecu so you have everything needed to get the most out of the upgraded tune.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

jokerny77 said:


> You can usually get a better price on the complete set instead of buying them separate, bsh sells a nice set. One of the easiest installs, each mount took me about a half hour. I would always go with the hardware first so you avoid breaking anything. Then upgrade the ecu so you have everything needed to get the most out of the upgraded tune.


 So each respective mount is a pretty easy DIY install?


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## jokerny77 (Jul 1, 2008)

yeah if you have any mechanic skills. its harder than changing your oil but easier than changing your timing belt


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

The HPA 'dog bone' insert mount isn't as easy an install as units that include new hardware. 
Getting the old insert out can be a bit of a task, requiring you to literally rip it out in sections. 
Once you do have it out, then inserting the HPA insert is a snap.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

HPA made their own instructional video on the installation, right? Or some other company published a DIY?


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

NickSarazen said:


> HPA made their own instructional video on the installation, right? Or some other company published a DIY?


 I'm sure the video will make the removal look easy but the OEM insert in my Turbo Beetle was 
a b*tch to get out.


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## NickSarazen (Dec 16, 2012)

ridgemanron said:


> I'm sure the video will make the removal look easy but the OEM insert in my Turbo Beetle was
> a b*tch to get out.


 I don't doubt that for a second hahaha. What did you use to remove it?


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## jokerny77 (Jul 1, 2008)

I would use a small propane torch and a small pry bar or screw driver


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

jokerny77 said:


> I would use a small propane torch and a small pry bar or screw driver


 This :thumbup:


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## drtechy (Jun 3, 2009)

jokerny77 said:


> I would use a small propane torch and a small pry bar or screw driver





ridgemanron said:


> This :thumbup:


 Please tell me there is sarcasm in there somewhere. 

posted by Tapatalk


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## ridgemanron (Sep 27, 2011)

Sorry, but you're going to have to relax, get some popcorn, and see the HPA removal video.


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## Tvp125 (Mar 4, 2008)

In regardes to the clutch. I was stage 2 in my MKV GLI and I never felt the clutch slip and I put a little over 60K miles on it before selling it. I would think the clutch in the beetle is the same as that was my GLI at the time.


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## drtechy (Jun 3, 2009)

Tvp125 said:


> In regardes to the clutch. I was stage 2 in my MKV GLI and I never felt the clutch slip and I put a little over 60K miles on it before selling it. I would think the clutch in the beetle is the same as that was my GLI at the time.


 What year GLI? 

edit: just noticed you said MKV, you most likely had an FSI engine then. If so you had a much better clutch than the TSI engines. I had MKV GTI FSI Stage 2 also and never had clutch issues. On my Beetle, the day I went stage II it started slipping lol


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## Tvp125 (Mar 4, 2008)

drtechy said:


> What year GLI?
> 
> edit: just noticed you said MKV, you most likely had an FSI engine then. If so you had a much better clutch than the TSI engines. I had MKV GTI FSI Stage 2 also and never had clutch issues. On my Beetle, the day I went stage II it started slipping lol


 correct It was an FSI. One thing I didn't want to mess with until I had to was the clutch. I guess I am going to have to look into a better replacement for when I jump to stage 2


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## drtechy (Jun 3, 2009)

Tvp125 said:


> correct It was an FSI. One thing I didn't want to mess with until I had to was the clutch. I guess I am going to have to look into a better replacement for when I jump to stage 2


 I know exactly how you feel. I was so mad when I went stage 2 and it started slipping immediately. It was the one expense I didn't want. I ended up going with a clutch masters fx400 kit. Its been great, a bit noisier than I wanted but what can ya do. 

posted by Tapatalk


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## Chris659 (Nov 16, 2012)

I'm sure this has been covered numerous times, but is the clutch upgrade necessary on stage II if you have a DSG tranny or is it only on manuals?


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## drtechy (Jun 3, 2009)

Chris659 said:


> I'm sure this has been covered numerous times, but is the clutch upgrade necessary on stage II if you have a DSG tranny or is it only on manuals?


 Manual only

posted by Tapatalk


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## grahamwright1 (Jun 26, 2012)

drtechy said:


> Manual only
> 
> posted by Tapatalk


 I've seen a lot of speculation about the power capability of the DSG but does anyone know of a definitive source of information on the DSG capabilities with Stage II and beyond?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## Shortfuse206 (Feb 13, 2012)

grahamwright1 said:


> I've seen a lot of speculation about the power capability of the DSG but does anyone know of a definitive source of information on the DSG capabilities with Stage II and beyond?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


 This would be nice to know been thinking about the numbers as well.


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## grahamwright1 (Jun 26, 2012)

grahamwright1 said:


> I've seen a lot of speculation about the power capability of the DSG but does anyone know of a definitive source of information on the DSG capabilities with Stage II and beyond?


Bump

Anyone have more details on the specific power handling of the DSG is our TB's?


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## PooLeArMor (Aug 13, 2008)

grahamwright1 said:


> Bump
> 
> Anyone have more details on the specific power handling of the DSG is our TB's?



the APR Stage 3 car don't have an upgrade DSG software and it runs great.......


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## grahamwright1 (Jun 26, 2012)

PooLeArMor said:


> the APR Stage 3 car don't have an upgrade DSG software and it runs great.......


How many miles / KM's since the upgrade? 

Do you drive is S or D mode most of the time?

If you switch gears manually, what revs do you normally shift at?

Thanks!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## PooLeArMor (Aug 13, 2008)

grahamwright1 said:


> How many miles / KM's since the upgrade?
> 
> Do you drive is S or D mode most of the time?
> 
> ...




I wish I have a APR stage 3 kit lol..... I am just saying I read somewhere that the APR stage 3 is still running on stock DSG software and its run with no problem...


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## Tvp125 (Mar 4, 2008)

I have been stage 2 for about a week and my clutch is already done. I can not go full throttle in any gear without it slipping pretty bad. If I drive it easy there is no problem and it drives fine. but its only a matter of time before i loose all drivability. The clutch has 12K miles on it.


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## stainlineho (Aug 20, 2011)

Tvp125 said:


> I have been stage 2 for about a week and my clutch is already done. I can not go full throttle in any gear without it slipping pretty bad. If I drive it easy there is no problem and it drives fine. but its only a matter of time before i loose all drivability. The clutch has 12K miles on it.


How long were you Stage 1? Did you have any slippage during your time at Stage 1?

Thanks...


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## Tvp125 (Mar 4, 2008)

stainlineho said:


> How long were you Stage 1? Did you have any slippage during your time at Stage 1?
> 
> Thanks...


I went right to stage 2 from stock.


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