# Roof Leak Discussion (Consolidated older discussions)



## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

*New Eos - leak on day one*

_*Moderator Note:* This discussion began on January 15, 2007. On February 20, 2007, we figured out how to fix roof leaks, and the solution is fully documented here: How to solve (or prevent) Eos Roof leaks. Normally I would not make an editorial comment like this at the start of someone else's post, however, just in case some person in the future trips over this discussion while searching for leak information - well, it's no longer necessary for them to read through 3 pages to find out where to go to get the fix. Michael_
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I took delivery on my Eos 2.0TFSI DSG on saturday 13 January. Drives very well and looks fantastic.
However, before the end of the day (it was raining all day I should say) I noticed a single drop of water about midway along the internal trim on driver's side (about midway along the length of the rear window) - sorry I don't know the precise term for that part of the car!
I wiped it dry and left it overnight and by Sunday morning there was another drip in the same spot. It seeems to be coming from the "tubular" (sorry that's the best description I can give) rubber seal or trim which follows the line of the slope of the rear window.
I've reported this to the dealer and will take the vehicle to them tonight so that they can see the location.
I have a few immediate questions:-
1. Have any other owners experienced a drip/leak in this location and if so has it been sorted?
2. If yes, is it a problem known to VW (either in North America or Europe/UK) ?
3. Given that my dealer does not have an Eos specialist technician, should I insist that the investigation is done by an Eos specialist (dealer says there is one elsewhere in the west of Scotland - I'm in Glasgow).
Thanks
Peter 


_Modified by PanEuropean at 6:25 PM 3-5-2007_


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (pjgraham86)*

Hi Peter, is there such thing as an Eos specialists ?
If there is, then perhaps he should be sent back to the factory to sort out the problems at the production stage.
Sorry, couldn't resist having a crude attempt at a joke.
On very serious note, then I have not experienced a leak in this area or even read about one on any other forum.
So you have unique problem with this.
Best of luck in getting it resolved, and please let us know what the outcome is 
Cheers.








Paul..


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## swordfish1 (Jul 22, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*

You had a previous one leak didn't you Pete? 
Sorry to hear of your troubles. I have no garage at the moment so it is left with no protection from the elements. As you'll no doubt know, it has been torrential for the last couple of days. Mine is as dry as a bone inside. So it's not a problem with them all.
Have it seen by a specialist. The chap at my dealership SEEMS to have ironed out all the teething problems. I'm really happy with the way he dealt with it. It's a complicated piece of kit, and I personally think it needs a person who has been trained specifically on it to try to fix it.
Good luck....I love mine even more now the niggles have gone!!


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## GurnyGub (Nov 21, 2006)

Peter
Sorry to hear that, any chance of a photo of the leak? Tomorrow I feel like waiting for the car transporter in Belfast with a hose. I didn't expect to feel so worried about my new car, it's not how you're meant to feel. Ask in the garage how they washed the car for PDI, re my post in 'new car check list'.


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

*Re: (GurnyGub)*

Thanks for your comments and sympathy Dave/John.
John - I will certainly ask if a pressure washer was used in the PDI as that could have as you say compromised a seal.
I will ask the dealer at least to liaise with the specialist so that they have his input on the problem - even if the car doesn't actually need to go to him for the fix. I think they know me well enough (and they know I'm a lawyer by day which can't do me any harm for a change!) that they'll not try any quick "suck it and see" fix but let's see.
Meantime I'll try to enjoy the car till it goes back to them and see how we go. 
Peter


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (pjgraham86)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pjgraham86* »_However, before the end of the day (it was raining all day I should say) I noticed a single drop of water about midway along the internal trim... 

Hi Peter:
I understand that the 'quality specification' (my term, for want of a better word) that VW has defined for water leaks goes more or less like this:
*A) *If you get one or two droplets of water (maximum) entering the car during a heavy rainstorm at the seal where the glass meets the roof, or where the roof meets the front windshield, that is acceptable as long as the water droplets are not big enough to roll down and reach the dashboard or the trim on the middle of the door.
*B)* If you get more water than one or two drops, or you get 'big enough' drops that they roll down the inside of the glass and reach the instrument panel or the inside of the doors, then that is considered a problem that needs to be fixed.
*C)* The car must not be washed in automatic car washes, either with brushes or without brushes (touchless). If you wash it at a coin-op wash using a spray wand, the wand must not be used above the top of the door panels.
In other words, in a heavy rainstorm, one or two droplets that are not big enough to roll down the inside glass would be considered acceptable.
This is how things were explained to me, don't take this as an official VW statement, because I am not a VW official.
Michael


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## eosman (Nov 1, 2006)

Peter I am pleased that your car arrived but sorry to hear about the rain droplet issue. Having cancelled my TDI I was looking at two TFSIs and a V6 at a dealer waiting for PDIs - I noticed that in one case the driver's side sunroof seal was pinched - I appreciate that this is not your issue but these points do concern me. If I had taken delivery of a car I would be over the moon and, like you, simply concerned to get what looks to be a small issue at present put right. Having opted out for the time being I am going to watch what happens and I much appreciate all the input that this forum gets.


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
Hi Peter:
I understand that the 'quality specification' (my term, for want of a better word) that VW has defined for water leaks goes more or less like this:
*A) *If you get one or two droplets of water (maximum) entering the car during a heavy rainstorm at the seal where the glass meets the roof, or where the roof meets the front windshield, that is acceptable as long as the water droplets are not big enough to roll down and reach the dashboard or the trim on the middle of the door.
*B)* If you get more water than one or two drops, or you get 'big enough' drops that they roll down the inside of the glass and reach the instrument panel or the inside of the doors, then that is considered a problem that needs to be fixed.
*C)* The car must not be washed in automatic car washes, either with brushes or without brushes (touchless). If you wash it at a coin-op wash using a spray wand, the wand must not be used above the top of the door panels.
In other words, in a heavy rainstorm, one or two droplets that are not big enough to roll down the inside glass would be considered acceptable.
This is how things were explained to me, don't take this as an official VW statement, because I am not a VW official.
Michael

Hi chaps, surely in the 21st centuary, using 21st centuary manufacturing techniques, it is possible to manufacture a piece of machinery, using metal, glass and some sort of rubber/neoprene/silicon seals that do not actually leak. 
We wouldn't be happy is a pair of wellington boots, that only cost a few £s ( and even less $s) let in a few drops of water !!, So why should people be expected to put up with an expensive car that leaks ?
Paul..


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## mark_d_drake (Aug 17, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*

90% of people on this side of the pond will have no idea what "Wellington Boots" are...


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (mark_d_drake)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mark_d_drake* »_90% of people on this side of the pond will have no idea what "Wellington Boots" are...

Hi Mark, if you own a pair, then you can paddle in a pon(if its not too deep) or puddle and you will not get your feet wet.
They were invented years ago and named after a famous English Duke who kicked the **** out of the enemy during a long a bitter campaign.
A quick search on google will provide lots of info etc on the Duke of Wellington.








Paul..


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## flheat (Sep 29, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_
Hi chaps, surely in the 21st centuary, using 21st centuary manufacturing techniques, it is possible to manufacture a piece of machinery, using metal, glass and some sort of rubber/neoprene/silicon seals that do not actually leak. 
We wouldn't be happy is a pair of wellington boots, that only cost a few £s ( and even less $s) let in a few drops of water !!, So why should people be expected to put up with an expensive car that leaks ?
Paul..

Because in the 21st CENTURY we are not perfect--we call can make mistakes. As I said before, we continue to elevate the standards we have towards other beyond the standards that we would expect others to hold us accountable. Granted, there are some here that experience extremes of water leakage and my understanding goes out to them but to complain about one or two drops and allow it to ruin an otherwise enjoyable driving experience does not make sense to me.
Yes, we may have the technology to make the car leak-proof, but I think it comes to a point where a decision is made for acceptable tolerances. Perhaps the car could be engineered that guarantees 0 dribbles of water but costs $1000 more in development costs, is that an acceptable cost/benefit? These types of decisions are made all the time in the corporate world.
Likewise, in the 21st century why does mileage on cars vary? Every car is built from the same blueprint. Here most of us think nothing of allowing for a 10-20% tolerance. As far as I am concerned I am enjoying my Eos and am pleased with my cost and benefits and I don't sweat the petty things.
My "expensive" A4 cabriolet leaked a few dribbles during a carwash or heavy rainstorm and you know what? I would reach for my rag in the map pocket and wipe it dry and at the next ray of sun, I was the envy of every person in their dry, confining hardtop. Life is short, life is good.


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## Steve_UK (Aug 30, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (pjgraham86)*

I thought I would live with my EOS for a week before making any posts. I picked it up on Saturday morning also and I, too, love it.
Interestingly I too had a water droplet in exactly the same place on Sunday morning. I've had a Golf Cabriolet for the last six years which was very dependable but sometimes (very rarely, but sometimes) let in the odd drop of water. I also note our moderator's comments. So I will continue to live with the car for the rest of the week before making my first 'post-ownership' comments. The dealer will make contact with me this Wednesday (he says) to see how I am getting on with the car. I'll let him know about the drop of water and hear his thoughts on the subject.
I am enjoying my EOS having had it for less than three days and can't wait to get in it again for the journey home this evening.
Steve


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## mark_d_drake (Aug 17, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*

Hey I'm an expat Brit, even if I have gone native, mainly for the reason that even in a bad year I only have to drive to work with the roof up 10 or 12 times....


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## GurnyGub (Nov 21, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (Steve_UK)*

Bruce
Yeah, you're right, a drip's no problem, if it doesn't get worse. Google 'volvo c70 leaks' and hear the scream "Don't buy this car!"
Steve
Health to enjoy.
I'm making no apologies for playing Sherlock re PDI, I wish it was that simple. But if the manual advises us to Krytox after every wash, how many dealers do you think know to reapply it when prepping our cars, after maybe a high pressure wash?
John


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## lonerthx (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (mark_d_drake)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mark_d_drake* »_Hey I'm an expat Brit, even if I have gone native, mainly for the reason that even in a bad year I only have to drive to work with the roof up 10 or 12 times....









Another ex-pat here, and a recent one too (2 years today). In LA as well.
There would of been some bad weather near the dealer, just before I picked up my car on Friday. No signs of leaks inside, and I did purposely look.
I'm waiting for the rain to come, it's been unusually cold recently, but dry. When the rain does turn up it's heavier than most downpours I experienced in the UK. I'm expecting any leaks to appear then, although I've got a car cover on order for other reasons too.


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## SeaTreg (Dec 27, 2004)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_

*C)* The car must not be washed in automatic car washes, either with brushes or without brushes (touchless). If you wash it at a coin-op wash using a spray wand, the wand must not be used above the top of the door panels.
This is how things were explained to me, don't take this as an official VW statement, because I am not a VW official.
Michael

Well.....if you read the actual owners manual (page 21 on USA spec vehicles), it says "wash the CSC roof only in an automatic car wash, or by hand washing". It also says to never wash the roof with a power washer. 
So, going through a car wash is not going to cause a problem, and VW actually recommends it!
I have a friend that has an EOS, and has had no problems using an automatic car wash.

_Modified by SeaTreg at 2:29 PM 1-15-2007_


_Modified by SeaTreg at 2:30 PM 1-15-2007_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_Hi chaps, surely in the 21st centuary, using 21st centuary manufacturing techniques, it is possible to manufacture a piece of machinery, using metal, glass and some sort of rubber/neoprene/silicon seals that do not actually leak. 

You are correct. Such a vehicle is called a 'hardtop', a 'saloon', or a 'coupe'. If you go to your neighborhood Bentley dealer, you will find that they have the same policy about water droplets (one or two is OK, as long as they don't run down the glass to the door) for the Bentley Continental Convertible.
Michael


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

Thanks to all for their input. Firstly I should say that the water drops (and there was more than one - I just wiped them one at a time - have not by any means ruined the Eos experience for me and I am sure it will not do so. I note Michael's (and others') comments about acceptable tolerances and can't really argue with that particularly if a £115K Bentley is built to the same tolerances and the Volvo is far worse (by some accounts) than the Eos.
I went to the dealer last night just to let him see the location of the drip if not the actual drip (my wife had wiped the latest drip before showing the car off to her workmates!!). He has been very proactive - his service manager gave him the name and number of the Eos specialist at a dealer in Ayr (around 30 miles away) who has got the car booked in for next Tuesday "for a couple of days". He appears to know the precise nature of the problem (he's had 2 Eos' in his workshop previously for the same thing and has treated them in accordance with some kind of "advisory note" (saleman's words) from VW along the lines of "if this happens, carry out the following...."
I can't pretend that the salesman knoew the finer detail of the fix but the problem appears to be that some water occasionally does not drain as it should and is forced (in this case) backwards along the internal rubber seal and drips off the end. It appears to be accepted that water gets in but should drain somewhere (sorry this is vague) but isn't. 
All I care about is that there is a fix and the dealer is doing his best to sort it (although I did suggest in an e-mail to him that I would prefer them to involve the nearest Eos specialist rather than have the techs at the dealership try to sort it without any Eos experience. The gist of my rambling post is that I am delighted with the car and with the dealer's repsonse to the problem. 
Incidentally, they are replacing both nearside tyres and front nearside alloy - they tyres (on delivery) had what looked like little chunks "cut out " of them and the front alloy was slightly scraped in the same area - probably happened on the transporter I suspect. Anyway there was no quibble and the tyres and wheel have been ordered to be fitted when car gets back from roof man. Aplogies for the rambling post but I hope this gives some encouragement to others. I'll report more fully on the fix when I get the car back.
Cheers
Peter


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

One more thing - do you think it's reasonable for me to ask the dealer to take the car on the 30 mile (each way) trip to Eos man by trailer ? I don't really want 60 miles put on the car - am I being unreasonable ?
Peter


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: (pjgraham86)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pjgraham86* »_One more thing - do you think it's reasonable for me to ask the dealer to take the car on the 30 mile (each way) trip to Eos man by trailer ? I don't really want 60 miles put on the car - am I being unreasonable ?
Peter

Hi Peter, 
I really hope you get your leak (whoops, sorry folks, memtioned that horrible word again) fixed asap.
I also did not want Someone else driving my car on a 30 mile round trip, when my car disappeared for 8 days to be "fixed" in the bodyshop in the next town, but when I mentioned this to my dealer, they said that they did not have a trailer, and if I wanted my car transported from one garage to the other by trailer, then they would charge me for the hire of a trailer !
Don't you just love customer service.
Paul..


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
You are correct. Such a vehicle is called a 'hardtop', a 'saloon', or a 'coupe'. If you go to your neighborhood Bentley dealer, you will find that they have the same policy about water droplets (one or two is OK, as long as they don't run down the glass to the door) for the Bentley Continental Convertible.
Michael

Hmm,
I do not recall the salesman telling me to expect a few drops of water everytime that it rains.
The Triumph Spitfire MKIV, complete with vinyl roof, that I owned in the 1970's was more water tight than all these purposely designed coupe convertables.
Perhaps "cc" should mean "coupe colander"








Paul..


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (flheat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flheat* »_
Yes, we may have the technology to make the car leak-proof, but I think it comes to a point where a decision is made for acceptable tolerances. Perhaps the car could be engineered that guarantees 0 dribbles of water but costs $1000 more in development costs, is that an acceptable cost/benefit? These types of decisions are made all the time in the corporate world.


Being one of the people that does have a major leak and after owning the car for 5 days took it back to the dealer on the 5th December and it's been there ever since, I am sure that if VW had honest advertising and said "this car may leak a few drops of water", I would certainly not have bought one. I guess I am naively one of those people that expect to buy a car in the 21st century that is watertight
I have a 1959 Austin Healey Frogeye (bugeye) sprite that even with the top up I would expect to leak a few drops on my head (not that it ever goes out when it's wet!) but that car is nearly 50 years old...........I think zero leaks is the only acceptable standard when you pay $50,000 for a car like I did. Fortunately my dealer thinks the same and that's why I don't have it back yet!


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *grubbygirl* »_
Being one of the people that does have a major leak and after owning the car for 5 days took it back to the dealer on the 5th December and it's been there ever since, I am sure that if VW had honest advertising and said "this car may leak a few drops of water", I would certainly not have bought one. I guess I am naively one of those people that expect to buy a car in the 21st century that is watertight
I have a 1959 Austin Healey Frogeye (bugeye) sprite that even with the top up I would expect to leak a few drops on my head (not that it ever goes out when it's wet!) but that car is nearly 50 years old...........I think zero leaks is the only acceptable standard when you pay $50,000 for a car like I did. Fortunately my dealer thinks the same and that's why I don't have it back yet!

Hi Grubby Girl, 
going off the topic slightly, have you any pictures of the Frogeye ?
I would love to see them.
Paul..


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## vweosdriver (Oct 30, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

In 12 1/2 years of ownership I never had a Miata that leaked.


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## flheat (Sep 29, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (vweosdriver)*

In 18 months of ownership my 2001 Miata leaked down the driver's side window; however, I had no other issues with the car. Nothing's perfect.
In 42 months of ownership my 2003 Audi A4 Cabriolet leaked down the driver's side window.
In 7 years of ownership my 1993 Honda del Sol leaked down the drive's side window by the A pillar.
All were much worse than the 1 or 2 drops I have experienced with my Eos on the A pillar.
I guess I am used to carrying a rag with me in the map pocket.


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_
Hi Grubby Girl, 
going off the topic slightly, have you any pictures of the Frogeye ?
I would love to see them.
Paul..


Sure - here he is!!


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## GurnyGub (Nov 21, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

(This'll fool a few)
Fandabbydozy! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## just4fun (Oct 29, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

Hey, great little car, looks like it's in pretty nice condition as well.
Kevin


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

Hi, 
Wow, absolutely brill. 
Looks like he's had plenty of TLC
It's now the wall paper on my PC.
Thanks.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif















Paul


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_Hi, 
Wow, absolutely brill. 
Looks like he's had plenty of TLC
It's now the wall paper on my PC.
Thanks.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif















Paul

He will be happy to be your wallpaper. He is in great shape, a tiny bit of bubbling on the rear wing seams but that is easily rectified. The body is sound. It's very original, I am lucky to have it looked after by real enthusiast classic car mechanics who wont ever replace anything of it can be fixed. It's good fun to own and an invetsment and virtually costs me nothing to maintain and run. No road tax, insurance is £95 a year ($180), but of course he only ever comes out on sunny days and I do about 200-300 miles a year in him.
Angela


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

Hi Angela (much nicer than grubbygirl)
Thanks again for the great picture.
No need for the conversion to $'s as I am "up north" here in the UK.
Is there any news as to when you will get your Eos returned yet ?

Paul...


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## archiea (Nov 29, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (GurnyGub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GurnyGub* »_Bruce
Yeah, you're right, a drip's no problem, if it doesn't get worse. Google 'volvo c70 leaks' and hear the scream "Don't buy this car!"


Wow... so much for safe cars..... 
NHTSA Recall History
1998: Front-passenger airbag may be overly sensitive to certain electrostatic discharges; could possibly cause inadvertent deployment.
1998: Operation of headlight switch over extended period of time can result in inconsistent operation.
1998-00 C70: Over extended time period, headlight switch may cease to operate.
2001 V70: Bolted joint attaching the bracket for the child restraint, may have been incorrectly tightened. The seat occupant may not be properly restrained, increasing the risk of injury.
2001 V70: Rear-outboard seatbelt-anchorage bolts may have been incorrectly tightened. In the event of a crash, the seat occupant may not be properly restrained.


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## WolfsburgerMitFries (Jul 4, 2005)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (GurnyGub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GurnyGub* »_Bruce
Yeah, you're right, a drip's no problem, if it doesn't get worse. Google 'volvo c70 leaks' and hear the scream "Don't buy this car!"
John

Actually the Volvo C70 is a good comparable car to watch for water leaks, because both the C70 and Eos have their retractable hard tops sourced from Webasto. 
The thing that you have to differentiate during your research, is reports of leakage problems that are specific to the last generation soft top C70s. I really can't find any reports of leakage problems with the current C70 RHT on google.




_Modified by WolfsburgerMitFries at 3:22 PM 1-20-2007_


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## Turbocrazy (Nov 14, 2002)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (WolfsburgerMitFries)*

Hey Wolfsburger,
Here are some consumer C70 hardtop reviews.
http://www.edmunds.com/new/200...07141
Also, my friends have had their C70 since last August. They have had it at the dealership 6 times, many of these were week long stays while they tried to figure out what was wrong. 3 of the times were for failed roof operation, and the roof was stuck in the open position! The other 3 times were for water leaks. Living in southern CA, we really haven't gotten a lot of heavy rain since these cars debuted. But my friends say their car leaks even with a drizzle or hand car wash.


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_Hi Angela (much nicer than grubbygirl)
Thanks again for the great picture.
No need for the conversion to $'s as I am "up north" here in the UK.
Is there any news as to when you will get your Eos returned yet ?

Paul...









Hi Paul
I'm down South! I have been told that my car is due back from the roof specialists middle to end of next week. They then have to put the interior back and they are fitting an Ipod adaptor and mudflaps. I am thinking of asking them to water test it with me present before they put the interior back (as it wasn't one of those drip on the head leaks!), not sure how they would take that request!
Angela


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## hulahoops (Aug 27, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

Angela,
I have been reading about your troubles and really feel for you. I hope when you get your eos back you will be as happy as you can be and everything is fine with the car. I'm just glad it didn't happen to me! (selfish I know).
Simon
(your county neighbour)


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *grubbygirl* »_
Hi Paul
I'm down South! I have been told that my car is due back from the roof specialists middle to end of next week. They then have to put the interior back and they are fitting an Ipod adaptor and mudflaps. I am thinking of asking them to water test it with me present before they put the interior back (as it wasn't one of those drip on the head leaks!), not sure how they would take that request!
Angela

Hi Angela,
considering the length of time that your car has been back at the dealers, then I think that it would be perfectly reasonable of you to reject the car under the "sale of goods act"
I know that you must love the design/shape of the Eos, because after all that is what has got us all hooked upon it, but your situation is beyond a joke, and your patience must be wearing very thin by now.
Best of luck.
Paul..


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_
Hi Angela,
considering the length of time that your car has been back at the dealers, then I think that it would be perfectly reasonable of you to reject the car under the "sale of goods act"
I know that you must love the design/shape of the Eos, because after all that is what has got us all hooked upon it, but your situation is beyond a joke, and your patience must be wearing very thin by now.
Best of luck.
Paul..









They have offered me a refund or replacement, but for a couple of reasons I am giving them a go at trying to fix it. Firtly I love the car and hate the thought of another long wait for a replacement and secondly from what I have read about leaks and the fact that the Eos I am driving is also wet inside, there is no guarantee that a replacement would be leak free either!!
I have consulted with trading standards and they have told me to be very clear when I collect the car that because I have allowed them to repair it I have not in fact accepted the car, and to stress to them that I need to be convinced that it is completely repaired. I have discovered if you accept a car you in effect waive your rights to a refund or replacement, however if it continues to be a recurring fault I can demand a refund at a later date!


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *grubbygirl* »_
They have offered me a refund or replacement, but for a couple of reasons I am giving them a go at trying to fix it. Firtly I love the car and hate the thought of another long wait for a replacement and secondly from what I have read about leaks and the fact that the Eos I am driving is also wet inside, there is no guarantee that a replacement would be leak free either!!
I have consulted with trading standards and they have told me to be very clear when I collect the car that because I have allowed them to repair it I have not in fact accepted the car, and to stress to them that I need to be convinced that it is completely repaired. I have discovered if you accept a car you in effect waive your rights to a refund or replacement, however if it continues to be a recurring fault I can demand a refund at a later date!


Your dealer must think that your name is Angel, not Angela !
Crossing my fingers (and toes) that all will be ok for you.
Paul..


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_
Your dealer must think that your name is Angel, not Angela !
Crossing my fingers (and toes) that all will be ok for you.
Paul..










LOL
Having Christmas in the middle didn't help and they didn't want to start essing with the roof themselves so I had to wait for it to get a slot with the specialists..........which is interesting in itself as there are 4 of them in the country I had to wait over a week to get a slot (doesn't bode well methinks!) They had already replaced the seal twice, the second with a modified seal from Germany (which did improve things).
The longest delays have actually been with VW themsleves authorising the work. Like I have said before if it wasn't for the fact I have been driving their demonstrator Eos for the last 5 weeks has at least made life bearable!! In fact the car I am driving is up for sale if anyone is interested 
http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/te...o=322
I must be a little crackers!










_Modified by grubbygirl at 10:50 PM 1-21-2007_


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## lonerthx (Oct 5, 2006)

We've had our first heavy rain last night. It looks like we have a leak in the same spot as Peter.
I only had time to look from outside as I was leaving the house. But a single large drop on the interior trim. 
It appears it came from a corner seal where the rear window section meets the roof.
I should be receiving my order of Krytox any day now. I've washed the car once, and did notice all the rubber seals are dry, as in no lubricant or such present. I do hope that fixes it.
Peter, has your leak been resolved?


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

Matt,
I have just phoned the dealer where my Eos was taken on 23 Jan and it is being collected by my own dealer right now. Unfortunately they'll need to put another 50 or so km on the clock driving it back to Glasgow !!)(the selling dealer does not have a roof specialist - for any west coast of Scotland owners out there incidentally its Ingrams in Ayr who do the work). I expect to pick it up tomorrow - they need to replace two (slightly) damaged tyres before handing it back to me.
I have been told that the problem has been sorted. I was told by the salesman - forgive me if I am repeating this but hope it's generally useful info - that the fix was a foam seal of some sort being inserted to ensure that rainwater flowed the right way. If I get more details I'll post those after I pick the car up. Here's hoping !
Peter


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## lonerthx (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (pjgraham86)*

Thanks for the reply. Good luck with the car.
Looking at my car last night, it appeared I had the leak on both sides in the same place. The water isn't necessarily coming through at that point in the seals, but could be running down the interior lining. 
If it is the same I yours, and the foam seal works I'll take it to the dealer rather that risk just the krytox.


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

*Re: (lonerthx)*

Matt,
I'm picking the car up in a coule of hours but will need to head straight back to my office. I'll have a good look tomorrow, altho' as luck would have it the forecast is for a bright dry weekend!!
If it's any help, it definitely looked as tho' the water came in and ran down inside the rubber trim/lining and dropped from there onto the interior "ledge". It seemed to drip from the end of the rubber trim which follows the curve of the roof (going towards the rear of the car and sloping with the rear window line) behind (and above) the driver's shoulder, if that makes any sense (!!).
Now all I need worry about is whether the dealer will manage to replace the damaged alloy wheel and tyre without damaging the new one (in traditional tyre fitter style).......
I'll report back soon - I might even post a picture or two once my computer arrives back from the repair shop and I can get to grips with photobucket instructions !!
Peter


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

Got the car back - had to park it and get back to work on a glorious (yes - in Glasgow!!) winter's day........
The dealer handed me the worksheet received from the workshop which dealt with the repair -it says as follows:-
- checked for water ingress, no leaks could be found;
- carried out recall number 61A8as per instructed;
- lubed seals and cleaned off all polish;
- roadtested all OK
I don't know what that recall is but I assume it's the insertion of the foam seal/stopper which I mentioned in earlier post.
Hope this is helpful - I'll report again when rain returns (as it assuredly will before too long).
Meantime I have plans for a roof down/music up trip on Saturday to make up for lost time !!
Peter


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## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

Dear All
Oh dear, this forum is a very mixed blessing. Here's me with my Eos arriving 6 weeks early on Monday and instead a surge of joyous adrenalin I've got a sinking feeling after reading this and all too many other threads. Still, I'm arming myself with the recommended list of things to look out for and my optimistic, rosy-tinted spectacles. Which, as every Homer scholar will recognise, is entirely the right colour to view rosy-fingered dawn (rhododactulos eos) with. 
What's more I haven't had time to finish her garage off yet AND the moment I pick her up I'm scheduled to leave on a three-week vacation (without wheels). Still I guess that'll give me time to RTFM.
Max


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## GurnyGub (Nov 21, 2006)

Maxdot
I know exactly what you mean, it took an edge off slightly, but replaced it with some realism. A bit like having to turn Santa's toy over to scour it for any blemishes. I have had my Eos for two weeks now, and it is everything I hoped for, a truly great car. The VWvortex forum can make depressing reading at times, for those of a nervous disposition, but in my case, and I hope yours, it is a positive blessing in our knowledge of a complex, groundbreaking car. My thanks to Michael, and most of the posters for their unselfish sharing of info. And my thoughts are with those owners who have had problems, and who have been let down sometimes by poor service and lack of care. I like to think of the countless Eos owners who are driving about smiling, and who've never heard of a forum, much less a 'fix'. Too cold for concrete your way too!
John


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## WolfsburgerMitFries (Jul 4, 2005)

*Re: (maxdot)*


_Quote, originally posted by *maxdot* »_Here's me with my Eos arriving 6 weeks early on Monday and instead a surge of joyous adrenalin

Congratulations on your new car Max. Do keep this in mind, while we may be able to track new features and talk about problems here, one thing we do not know about is production line updates or improvements that enhance the reliability of the car. Just as we have roof leakage discussions here, you can bet Volkswagen has that issue under the microscope because the last thing any auto manufacturer can afford today is a reputation for low quality.
Please contribute to the body of knowledge we have here, and share your experiences. Your car is showing up just in time for the spring rains.


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Now what?*

I'm looking for a little advice. Despite promises that my car would be ready "next week" it appears for me next week never arrives as I have now been told this 3 times!! Below is the email I have now sent to the service manager because I have been very very tolerent up to now and now I am at the end of my patience. 
For those that don't know my story - I picked up my new Eos on the 30th November, it was wet when I picked it up (the drivers side cubby was half full of water), it went back to the dealer on the 5th December and it's been there ever since. It has had 2 replacement roof seals (one a modified one), it's been taken to one of 4 roof specialists to have goodness knows what done to the roof (nobody will tell me), and it returned from there over 2 weeks ago now and it's still not ready for me to pick up although I have been living with the promises that it will be!
I really believe now that it isn't fixed and they are just stalling. Although I love the car I am now not sure I now want to own one as even the demonstrator I am driving is wet (and now getting very smelly)
You will see form my email I have asked for a meeting with the manager. Anyone any other advice? Particularly UK people who know UK law.......also is there anyone in Sussex that wants to come with me ?? LOL 









_Quote »_
Dear xxxx

Following our telephone conversation today I have been thinking of what you said and there are a few things that are just not sitting very comfortably in my view. 

Just to go through events of the last couple of weeks.

1. I contacted you on Wednesday 17th January when you said that arrangements were being made to get my car back from Portsmouth and you said it was due back at the end of the week and it should be ready for me to collect the following week.
2. You left a message on my voicemail on the 19th confirming that the car was back with you and you would be putting the interior back and doing the other work and again confirmed it should be ready by the mid to end of the following week.
3. I called you on the 24th January and you said you were water testing it and it would be ready by the end of the week, or maybe the beginning of this week.
4. I called you again on Wednesday and you said that you were putting it back together and you would call me on Thursday just to go through everything with me and make sure everything was done that I was expecting to be done so it would be ready for me to pick up today. You didn't call which led to my calling you today.
5. In our telephone conversation today you said that VW technical had been in touch and they are now asking you to check some measurements on the roof/widow seal, so in fact you were again nowhere near giving me back the car as promised.
As I said to you this is now getting beyond a joke. I had the car for 5 days and you have now had the car for 2 months. I just does not take this long to put an interior back and while I accept that you want it to be just right before you hand it back there are a number of things that just do not sit right with me and I believe that in fact the leak is not fixed and in fact these undelivered on promises to have the car back to me is probably a smoke screen because the problem has not been resolved.

You state that VW have asked you to take some measurements on the roof, yet the car has been in Portsmouth having the roof fixed, so why are you having to take measurements now? From previous experience it's been a problem to get VW to respond hence the delay at the beginning of this escapade. I really find it hard to believe that VW have voluntarily contacted you to get you to take these measurements, I think it is more likely you have contacted them because there is still a problem.

My car has undergone a considerable amount of work to try and fix this leak, and I now have no confidence that it is fixed, or will ever be fixed or if it is indeed fixed that fix will last. I believe that I have been more than patient in allowing you the opportunity to put this right, and I am sure it is unlikely anyone else would have waited this long and still end up being a position of only having yet another promise that it will be ready by the beginning or end of "next week". Tomorrow really never does come.

I am now pretty much at the end of my patience and on top of the fact that your demonstrator Eos also clearly has a leak, I have lost confidence in this model and I have certainly lost confidence in my particular car. I am now minded to reject the car.

I now wish to have a meeting with **** at the earliest opportunity to discuss a way forward.




Angela


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## chris2.0tdsg (Nov 29, 2006)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

Angela, really sorry to hear this story. It makes me anxious to thoroughly check my car on expected arrival the week of feb 12 (expe cted). 
I cannot be much of a help not knowing UK law, but in Holland we would need to officialy put the dealer in default (if i say this right) by handing over a letter (or by delivery guaranteed mail) and giving him the opportunity to fix it by date xyz or else.
What i would do is have him cosign your printed email for confirmation of your correct explanation for the facts and time they have happened. Or maybe write a seperate bullit wise piece of paper in a very unemotional and fact oriented way stating the facts and timings and have him sign for understanding.
From your story it sounds to me that your dealer and VW importer may have a conflict on things that either have done or not done on your car?

Good luck with all of this. In the end, it should work out. VW might wish all customers were like you.
chris


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## just4fun (Oct 29, 2006)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *grubbygirl* »_I'm looking for a little advice.Angela

Hi Angela,
Wow, how do you give advice on a situation such as yours?
You indicated in an earlier post that VW had offered you the opportunity of a refund or a replacement car. If I had suffered through your particular experience, I would take the money and run at this point.
With delivery of my EOS only a few weeks away, your post has dampened my enthusiasm (no pun intended), and raised the question again; is the EOS the best choice right now, or should a person hold off a few years until the car has a chance to prove itself?
In Canada it is very important for us to make informed purchasing decisions because we have no Lemon Law, it is very much _*caveat emptor*_ (buyer beware). As long as the dealership/manufacture are making an effort to adhere to the terms and conditions of the warranty we have very little recourse.
If the warranty is breached, or the a vehicle proves to truly be a lemon, we have an arbitration system that can be used to assist in a resolution, but awards of replacement vehicles or full refunds are rare under arbitration.
I'm still pretty certain that the owners that are experiencing serious leak issues represent a small minority of overall EOS owners, so I'm 99.5% certain I will carry through with purchasing our EOS. I will however have all the information you have provided about your particular experience running through my mind while making the final decision about writing the cheque.
I truly wish your ownership experience had been far less disappointing, but, it is what it is, and as I said earlier, if I was in your shoes I would take the money and walk out the front door. (assuming that option is still on the table)
Kevin








PS I know this info doesn't help you with your situation, but I wanted to let you know your willingness to share your experience with us has provided valuable insight that can be taken into consideration during the decision making process. Thanks for all your posts.
_Modified by just4fun at 7:48 AM 2-3-2007_


_Modified by just4fun at 8:02 AM 2-3-2007_


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## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

Angela
The thought of what you've been going through is just too awful and, for what it's worth, I guess everyone on this forum is feeling for you. In the first place having to cope with the let-down and deception of the excitement of owning such a car is bad enough, but when you add to that the anger and frustration you must feel in the face of the inability of VW to put it right and their seeming shillyshallying and lack of frankness over the issue - well, I don't know a better definition of the word 'nightmare'!
I wish there was more that we could offer than solidarity and fellow feeling - you sure have that
Max


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## GurnyGub (Nov 21, 2006)

Angela,
This is only my opinion. I think time has run out. Ding. The ref has waved his arms. In UK law it's obvious you have given them far more than reasonable time to supply you a car fit for purpose. They have failed. I think, despite my happy experience so far, you would be very brave to proceed. Personallly, all this would be at the back of my mind, the owner satisfaction would be diminished, backup confidence zero, and I would walk too, as Kevin said. Whatever you do, let us know. I hope VW is listening.
John


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## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (PanEuropean)*



PanEuropean said:


> If you go to your neighborhood Bentley dealer, you will find that they have the same policy about water droplets (one or two is OK, as long as they don't run down the glass to the door) for the Bentley Continental Convertible.
> Michael
> The fact that VW now own Bentley makes the comparison rather less then compelling.
> My father used to own one (sometime in the 50s) and it certainly didn't leak, even in a Canadian winter or whenever it is wettest in Ottawa - and I certainly wouldn't have liked to have been the service manager who had to tell him the 'guidelines' if it had leaked!
> ...


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## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

Sorry. I didn't mean to post twice - just add my name - but I can't make out how to edit a post even though I have read the Help entry, nor can I make out how to enclose a quote from someone else's post in one of those neat boxes. Bother.
Max
Well now I've figured out how to edit (and delete a post once posted) but still the box surround eludes me


_Modified by maxdot at 10:40 AM 2-3-2007_


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

Hi Angela,
As a Scottish lawyer and owner of an Eos that leaked (top post), I think I am in a position to advise!
I think you've already given the dealer more than "reasonable opportunity" to fix the leak. I don't know if you had your meeting yet or how that went so dpending on the answer to that you may not need further input. 
Assuming all is still not well, however, I suggest that you send a letter or e-mail to the dealership briefly outlining what has been done and on what dates etc than advise that you require the car to be fixed and available for collection within say 7 days (I'd say longer if they hadn't already had it for almost 2 months!). Then spell out that if that doesn't happen you'll be rejecting the vehicle as not being of satisfactory quality and will be expecting a full and immediate refund.
Hope you get the outcome you want and sorry your experience has been so sour.
Peter


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## PaulZooms (Dec 16, 2006)

*Re: (maxdot)*


_Quote, originally posted by *maxdot* »_...I can't ...make out how to enclose a quote from someone else's post in one of those neat boxes... 

Max - Reply, then hit the quote button above the edit window. The post you are replying to will appear surrounded by HTML tags (before and after, that is) to cause it to be displayed in the "neat box".


_Modified by PaulZooms at 4:54 AM 2-5-2007_


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

Hi Angela, it's time to let your head rule and not your heart.
Demand a full refund and walk away from it. Your car is not fit for purpose.
Considering the length of time that your car has *not* been with you, then VW have had the time to send it back to the factory where it was built, and to have all the faults fixed once and for all.
You do not deserve to be treated like this.
paul..


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## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: Quote box*


_Quote, originally posted by *PaulZooms* »_
Max - Reply, then hit the quote button above the edit window. The post you are replying to will appear surrounded by HTML tags (before and after, that is) to cause it to be displayed in the "neat box".

_Modified by PaulZooms at 4:54 AM 2-5-2007_

Paul 
Thanks for the tip. 
Aiyeeee, the adventure starts tomorrow, and I did manage to finish the driveway to her new garage - only the gravel's kinda loose and the slope's kinda steep, so I won't dare use it for a while unless someone can photoshop me some tractor wheels onto her in case of trouble
Max


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: Now what? (trampdog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *trampdog* »_Hi Angela, it's time to let your head rule and not your heart.
Demand a full refund and walk away from it. Your car is not fit for purpose.
Considering the length of time that your car has *not* been with you, then VW have had the time to send it back to the factory where it was built, and to have all the faults fixed once and for all.
You do not deserve to be treated like this.
paul..

I am meeting with them on Thursday. I have rejcetd the car in my email. I don't want it back even if they do claim it is fixed. they have just had to do too much work on it to get it right I have no confidence in it any more. Even if they have fixed it I have no guarantee that it will stay fixed. I have decided I want my money back and I am not being deterred from that end. 
I hate to say this, as much as it is a lovely car I do not intend to replace it with another Eos. Maybe in a couple of years time when they have sorted this out in the production process, but as it stands now I have decided to spend a littel more and get a Mercedes


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## trampdog (Jan 7, 2007)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

HI Angela, 
for what it is worth, I think that you are making the right decision.
Please let us all know when yor refund comes through.
The Merc sounds like a wise choice.
Paul...


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: Now what? (trampdog)*

Hello all
just to give you an update on my car. The dealer has not quibbled about giving me a refund, what they do want to do is sort me out with another car. The only problem is that this company although has outlets for 16 manufacturers they don't have a Mercedes Franchise!!
To give them their due though they are still trying to source a merc SLK for me and arrange to have it delivered from wherever it is in the country. They have suggested I look at the new Audi TT Roadster which is due for launch in March (and they have an Audi franchise just across the road!) and even though I wouldn't get delivery until the end of April, I can keep their demostrator Eos until then. I'm just not sure about going for a brand new model again! It's also about $2k above my budget but they said they would make the numbers fit if necessary.
I can't fault the treatment I have had so far.
So....Eos fans - what do I do.............go for a 1 year old Merecedes SLK or the new Audi TT Roadster?








Ange;a


_Modified by grubbygirl at 12:04 AM 2-9-2007_


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## WolfsburgerMitFries (Jul 4, 2005)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

Mercedes-Benz has been in the gutter for a while, I'd steer clear of that brand until they decide to start making Mercedes-Benzes again. They've been riding on brand image and past reputation for too long. They've got too much product out now and have lost focus.



_Modified by WolfsburgerMitFries at 7:28 PM 2-8-2007_


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## pepino1977 (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (pjgraham86)*

there are some threads about this topic at vweosclub.com if you are interested... sorry about your problem!


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## chocoholic_too (Jan 2, 2007)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

I read about the new TT in a car magazine and it's supposed to be really sweet, uhm make that Schweeeet, but the Slk has the retractable hard top, although trunk space will be nill. 
So it depends what you prefer in a top. Performance wise the TT probably has more power and agility although I can't say for sure since I've not driven either.
I tell you this though, the SLK was always on my dream wish list but too unpractical for an only car for me. And I seriously considered the TT when I was getting my little 2 seater toy. ( crossfire won out on this one)
So either car will be cool! Just make a pro and con list and see what works best for you.


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## GurnyGub (Nov 21, 2006)

Angela,
Yep, that's right, the pro and con list worked for me. Then leave it for a day, or three, you know all about patience anyway, go back to it, and a glass of wine may help! My hard choice was between the A4 Q cabrio and the Eos V6, I'm sure I was right in my case. May I suggest the new BMW cc as a runner? And keep us all informed please. 
John


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## just4fun (Oct 29, 2006)

*Re: Now what? (grubbygirl)*

Angela,
Great to hear your dealer is making such an effort to establish credibility with you.
I've always had a soft spot in my heart for the SLK, but a two seater isn't practical for me at this time. Also, like Wolfsburger pointed out. I too have heard Mercedes has been slipping a bit on the quality side, but that's only hear say, I can't confirm through experience.
I know nothing about the TT so can't provide any insight on this car.
Do the pros and cons thing, drive their EOS while you mull it over, and then go with your gut instinct, your gut will never steer you wrong.
Kevin


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## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

Angela
After making a list of pros and cons and finishing a bottle of wine, you could try tossing a coin and see whether you're disappointed by the result - that is if you manage to catch the coin and can remember which car was heads and which tails.
Max


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## swordfish1 (Jul 22, 2006)

*Re: (maxdot)*

I love my EOS, but if I'd have suffered like you, I'd not get another. I'd go for the Audi...TT roadster if it's practical, A4 if you need the room.
I think they're both gorgeous cars and the new TT is getting decent reviews (actually I'm considering getting rid of the MG and buying one).
Hope you have better luck next time.
(As a post script....to all you waiting for your EOSes, not all roof mechanisms are sh*te. Mine has been trouble free in this first seven months. Lets hope the problems on these forums are an extreme minority







)


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## pjgraham86 (Aug 10, 2006)

Angela,
Looks like (not before time) you are getting the right kind of reaction from your dealer. I doubt if there are many around who would offer what they have offered to you, altho' I suppose your case was exceptionally bad and therefore worthy of an exceptional offer.
From the reviews I've read I think I'd go for the TT Roadster, particularly if they can work the figures for you. I'd assume they'd have less room to manoevre with the Merc if they are sourcing it elsewhere. 
Still, it's a nice dilemma to have - I'd agree that a nice glass or two of wine mulling over brochures might help!!
Best of luck.
Peter


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: (pjgraham86)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pjgraham86* »_Angela,
Looks like (not before time) you are getting the right kind of reaction from your dealer. I doubt if there are many around who would offer what they have offered to you, altho' I suppose your case was exceptionally bad and therefore worthy of an exceptional offer.
From the reviews I've read I think I'd go for the TT Roadster, particularly if they can work the figures for you. I'd assume they'd have less room to manoevre with the Merc if they are sourcing it elsewhere. 
Still, it's a nice dilemma to have - I'd agree that a nice glass or two of wine mulling over brochures might help!!
Best of luck.
Peter

Looks like I spoke to soon about the dealer. Yesterday I was dealing with the Service manager, today the service manager was told by sales to keep out of it and I met with the brand manager. Audi TT deal was not on the table. I am picking up a cheque (check) on Tuesday at which time I hand back my loan car. They are perfectly happy to see me without a car immediately. I think that has pretty much ended my relationship with VW for good.
Went straight to the mercedes dealer who has sourced 5 SLKs for me to choose from. He will be seeing whats the best deal he can get tomorrow. If I decide on one they will send someone to collect inspect it and drive it back. I am having the cheque from VW made out to the merc dealership just to make life easier. They are hoping to have me in my new SLK by the weekend.
I took the SLK for a good test drive and it's a fantastic car without doubt. All the add-ons in the Eos are standard in the SLK. And best of all not only do the telephone buttons on the steering wheel actually work, the ipod adaptor shows the track details and they key fob remotely opens the roof - yay!
Oh and one thing I noticed - the SLK has a double seal on the roof, so it looks like if the first one leaks you're protected by a second. VW could learn from that


_Modified by grubbygirl at 11:05 PM 2-9-2007_


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## EurovanTastic (Feb 19, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (trampdog)*

I think what people need to realize here is that this is a first type series for VW and a fully automated roof. While yes, they do say some leakage is acceptable, most of it is not and at the very least VW has implemented techniques to fix the problems. As mentioned in this and other threads, in the owners manual they are clear to state the part# and prupose of the seal lubricant you must purchase in order to keep the seals soft and "leak proof" for the life of the car , the $94 price tag every couple years is well worth it. Just keep in good relations with your dealer and they should be able to correct any and all issues for you.


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (EurovanTastic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *EurovanTastic* »_I think what people need to realize here is that this is a first type series for VW and a fully automated roof. While yes, they do say some leakage is acceptable, most of it is not and at the very least VW has implemented techniques to fix the problems. As mentioned in this and other threads, in the owners manual they are clear to state the part# and prupose of the seal lubricant you must purchase in order to keep the seals soft and "leak proof" for the life of the car , the $94 price tag every couple years is well worth it. Just keep in good relations with your dealer and they should be able to correct any and all issues for you.

They should be able to correct it without doubt unless the fault is uncorrectable. My dealer admitted to me that this was far from an isolated problem and VW were working hard to find a solution. 
I collected the check from my dealer last week. He tried to talk me into having the car back as (and this is a direct quote) "my Eos was now the most desirable Eos in the country". I don't take that as being any kind of positive reference for the car......it's desirable because it's the only one that doesn't leak! Except after making that grand statement I saw that my car was already up for sale on the forecourt, and all the windows were covered in condensation ......when I pointed that out to him he said "oh, that doesn't look good!" That is a car that had the seals replaced twice, the roof removed by the specialists and realigned, other remedial work that they wouldn't even tell me what........and the car was STILL damp inside. My car was 5 days old when it went back to have the leak fixed. when I first picked it up I opened the drivers side cubby (in front of the salesman before I even drove it away) and it was full of water. No time to do the maintenance that you say is necessary (oh and by the way, no such section on maintenance of the seals is in the UK handbook).
I appreciate that any car manufacturer can make a duff car and all things being equal I could have accepted that, except for one thing. the Eos they loaned me also leaked, it leaked so badly that I was able to show them the mould growing on it on the inside - and the musty smell inside was so strong they valeted the car for me part way through the 2 1/2 months I had it! So my experience of the Eos is 2 out of 2 leaked! Enough for me to call it a day I'm afraid. Sure it's VW's first mechanical roof, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be tested rigerously before it's released onto the market. Mine unfortunately is not an isolated problem, and I feel sorry for the person who buys my car as they clearly haven't fixed it and it's still up for sale and going to passed onto some other unsuspecting buyer who's going to go through all this again!
This is a beautiful car with a flaw. One day I might buy another because I actually loved the car, but not until they sort this problem out.
Oh, and I pick up my new Mercedes tomorrow. If you ever get a chance check out the roof seals on the Mercedes, they are double seals and a very different design - VW could learn from it!!


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## EurovanTastic (Feb 19, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

i am sorry to hear about all the problems, and i hate to say The EOS i 
knew and saw was fixed within 2 days, with no parts replacement or 
seal replacement. car has not leaked at all since. Mabye Just a 
matter of bad timing for the solutions available..


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## kghia (Nov 16, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (EurovanTastic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *EurovanTastic* »_I think what people need to realize here is that this is a first type series for VW and a fully automated roof. While yes, they do say some leakage is acceptable, most of it is not and at the very least VW has implemented techniques to fix the problems. As mentioned in this and other threads, in the owners manual they are clear to state the part# and prupose of the seal lubricant you must purchase in order to keep the seals soft and "leak proof" for the life of the car , the $94 price tag every couple years is well worth it. Just keep in good relations with your dealer and they should be able to correct any and all issues for you.

If it didn't happen until after a couple of years, *it would be a different story*
I am also getting told that the seal maintenance is my responsibility, both by my dealer (who didn't even know about the lubricant until I showed them the manual & part#), and by people here in the forums!
Down the line-- I can see it being on me.
Right after sale-- car should be perfect for a while.
While I haven't seen leaks, my windows often have condensation on the inside in the evenings, as bad or worse than in my 40 year old aircooled VWs.
I also have dry seals with white spots, as do the Eos's *still on the dealership lot*
"First year" might explain a little in the way of problems, but it does *not excuse problems* -- VW should be taking care of problems quickly, and educating dealers to do so also.
In the US, this might be even *more important*, since many people do not show the dealer loyalty in purchasing and servicing that they do in Europe (at least acc. to Michael and others). VW needs to earn the fickle market, and give them *reason* to have loyalty.
William


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## just4fun (Oct 29, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *grubbygirl* »_
Oh, and I pick up my new Mercedes tomorrow. If you ever get a chance check out the roof seals on the Mercedes, they are double seals and a very different design - VW could learn from it!!

Considering all you have gone through, and your amazing patience through it all, your position, and decision, to move on is both justifiable, and understandable.
Hope you end up truly impressed and ecstatic with the SLK ownership.
I picked up my wifes EOS on Saturday, and it is too soon to tell, but so far no sign of any of the problems reported. Here's keeping the fingers crossed.
Kevin


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## EurovanTastic (Feb 19, 2007)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (kghia)*

I am sorry to hear about the problems with your dealer, the solution i 
have experienced may just be that my dealer has researched the 
problem a bit more?... anyhow, i have also seen sometimes a small 
separation at the top of the A PILLAR TRIM , right at the top corner. 
the seal connecting to the to the painted portion and the door seal 
where a drainage point is. Sometime a small separation occurs there 
which can be easily fixed with the right adhesive from the dealer. As 
for the leaks being your responsibility, yes and no. The cars warranty 
will fix leaks, creaks and adjustments for 1year or 10,000kms 
(canadain) including the seal leaks and seal lubricant application. 
Unforutnately after that it will be upon you, but as i said, doing it 
every couple of years will prevent any future problems. hope the info 
is useful


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## grubbygirl (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (EurovanTastic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *EurovanTastic* »_I think what people need to realize here is that this is a first type series for VW and a fully automated roof. While yes, they do say some leakage is acceptable, most of it is not and at the very least VW has implemented techniques to fix the problems. As mentioned in this and other threads, in the owners manual they are clear to state the part# and prupose of the seal lubricant you must purchase in order to keep the seals soft and "leak proof" for the life of the car , the $94 price tag every couple years is well worth it. Just keep in good relations with your dealer and they should be able to correct any and all issues for you.

They should be able to correct it without doubt unless the fault is uncorrectable. My dealer admitted to me that this was far from an isolated problem and VW were working hard to find a solution. 
I collected the check from my dealer last week. He tried to talk me into having the car back as (and this is a direct quote) "my Eos was now the most desirable Eos in the country". I don't take that as being any kind of positive reference for the car......it's desirable because it's the only one that doesn't leak! Except after making that grand statement I saw that my car was already up for sale on the forecourt, and all the windows were covered in condensation ......when I pointed that out to him he said "oh, that doesn't look good!" That is a car that had the seals replaced twice, the roof removed by the specialists and realigned, other remedial work that they wouldn't even tell me what........and the car was STILL damp inside. My car was 5 days old when it went back to have the leak fixed. when I first picked it up I opened the drivers side cubby (in front of the salesman before I even drove it away) and it was full of water. No time to do the maintenance that you say is necessary (oh and by the way, no such section on maintenance of the seals is in the UK handbook).
I appreciate that any car manufacturer can make a duff car and all things being equal I could have accepted that, except for one thing. the Eos they loaned me also leaked, it leaked so badly that I was able to show them the mould growing on it on the inside - and the musty smell inside was so strong they valeted the car for me part way through the 2 1/2 months I had it! So my experience of the Eos is 2 out of 2 leaked! Enough for me to call it a day I'm afraid. Sure it's VW's first mechanical roof, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be tested rigerously before it's released onto the market. Mine unfortunately is not an isolated problem, and I feel sorry for the person who buys my car as they clearly haven't fixed it and it's still up for sale and going to passed onto some other unsuspecting buyer who's going to go through all this again!
This is a beautiful car with a flaw. One day I might buy another because I actually loved the car, but not until they sort this problem out.
Oh, and I pick up my new Mercedes tomorrow. If you ever get a chance check out the roof seals on the Mercedes, they are double seals and a very different design - VW could learn from it!!


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: New Eos - leak on day one (grubbygirl)*

Hi Angela:
I hope you have a lot of fun with the new Mercedes - come back and tell us all about it!
Also, don't be a stranger here just because you no longer have an Eos - you have made a whole bunch of really useful contributions to the forum during your time here, and we would be worse off without you. So, by all means, drop back and visit us!
Michael


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## lonerthx (Oct 5, 2006)

I just posted in the sticky thread, put thought I'd follow up here too. 
Applying krytox solved my minor leaks.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (lonerthx)*

Just for reference, the URL of the post that Matt referred to above is How to solve (or prevent) Eos Roof leaks. Go there, and you will find the solution for roof leaks.
Michael


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