# mk4 5-lug components into mk3?



## punkassjim (Sep 22, 2002)

I'm doing a 1.8T swap into a mk3 GTI, and I'm wondering the following:
Can I use the mk4 control arms, ball joints etc in the mk3?
I know of people who have put Passat VR6 suspension components into their mk2's, and the track width of the front end was WAY too wide, so they had to go back in and put mk3 VR6 suspension components in instead.
What I'm wondering is, does anyone know if the mk4 control arms etc will bolt up to the mk3 subframe, or if the mk4 subframe can be bolted up to the mk3.
As for a straight-up mk3 5-lug conversion, here's what I would need, or so they say:
VR6 Control Arms
VR6 Ball Joints
VR6 spindles
VR6 Brakes (caliper, carrier, rotor, pads)
VR6 sway bar and endlinks
VR6 CV shafts
5 lug rear rotors
I wonder if I could get away with the 1.8T mk4 components, since I already have them all.
Input?


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## evolveVW (Nov 11, 2000)

*Re: mk4 5-lug components into mk3? (punkassjim)*

good question.. couldnt tell you with looking at them.... a few things.. whether or not you can use the Mk4 axles... because I am notsure if the spline in the hub is different. Jim, because you will be one of the first to try to do this... the best way is to compare and test fit.


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## The Prof (Jul 18, 2002)

*Re: mk4 5-lug components into mk3? (evolveVW)*

you can use mk4 CVs in VR spindles, but the driveshafts are too long unless you use the mk4/a4 wishbones


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## JNXtheband (Jul 27, 2000)

*Re: mk4 5-lug components into mk3? (The Prof)*

def not happening. the mk4 suspension setup is very different from mk3 vr6 cars. theres actualy not much similar about the cars themselves.


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## punkassjim (Sep 22, 2002)

*Re: mk4 5-lug components into mk3? (JNXtheband)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JNXtheband* »_def not happening. the mk4 suspension setup is very different from mk3 vr6 cars. theres actualy not much similar about the cars themselves.

no? that's odd, I thought the diagrams in the Bentley were rather similar. I haven't gotten in and taken it all apart yet, but I'm gettin' there.
Prof, d'you happen to know if the mk4 CV/spindle/a-arm combination is wider than the VR6 Plus suspension?
I can't wait to get in there, but things have been hectic around here
...in a good way


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## The Prof (Jul 18, 2002)

yes, well my 4k4 driveshafts are longer than my VR ones so it must be


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## punkassjim (Sep 22, 2002)

*Re: (The Prof)*

ok. good to know, thanks


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## punkassjim (Sep 22, 2002)

*Re: (punkassjim)*

anyone know if the mk4 a-arms will install cleanly onto the mk3 subframe?
EDIT: when Jim doesn't actually get time to get under the car, he asks annoying questions instead










_Modified by punkassjim at 2:25 PM 6-30-2003_


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## punkassjim (Sep 22, 2002)

*Re: mk4 5-lug components into mk3? (The Prof)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The Prof* »_you can use mk4 CVs in VR spindles, but the driveshafts are too long unless you use the mk4/a4 wishbones

Just to document my find:
The mk4 ('01 WE) driveshafts are only a few mm longer than the mk3 8v driveshafts. Not sure if that means the mk3 VR6 shafts are within a mm or two, but it would seem so.
Anyway, the mk4 control arms on my '01 WE are exactly the same length as the mk3 8v control arms. The difference on the mk4 is that the subframe is wider, not the a-arms.
The ball joint on the mk4 mounts exactly the same as the mk3, as does the control arm. The only problem I'm running into is that the strut body/shaft is too long to mount in the mk3. The knuckle/ball-joint mounts fine, as do the mk3 tie-rods to mk4 tie-rod ends. I'm pretty sure I can mount the mk3 8v upper strut bearing on the mk4 strut. I'll find out soon.


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## The Prof (Jul 18, 2002)

ahhh, i'm fitting a 6spd in there so the driveshafts are very differend to my vr ones, not that that helps you much


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## TheRealDutchdub (Jan 15, 2002)

*Re: mk4 5-lug components into mk3? (punkassjim)*

Jim - the Mk4 wishbones (A-arms in US terms) are similair to the A3 VR ones, however you will have problems mounting the swaybar. The Mk4 swaybar will NOT fit.
Also keep in mind if you want to use the Mk4 strut, you cannot adjust the camber as you could on the VR setup, my advise will be, using the VR setup and skip the Mk4 suspension. 
As for the Mk4 driveshafts, if they are the Tri-pot design, skip them and use the VR items instead. Simple replace the drive flanges in the gearbox to VR ones.
As for folks using the 6speed box, you can use the driveshaft that came with the box. I'm using TT quattro driveshafts with a TT quattro box in my MkII with VR6 suspension using a Golf Rallye subframe.


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## punkassjim (Sep 22, 2002)

*Re: mk4 5-lug components into mk3? (TheRealDutchdub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheRealDutchdub* »_Jim - the Mk4 wishbones (A-arms in US terms) are similair to the A3 VR ones, however you will have problems mounting the swaybar. The Mk4 swaybar will NOT fit.

yeah, I saw that. not a problem, I'd rather use my old ones if they're all the same anyway. Was gonna swap the mk4 steering rack in with sway bar and a-arms, but the steering rack's mounting points are wider, go figure. In the long run, it's better that the swap is going to be simpler, but I wanted to make sure I exhausted all the options of using mk4 parts, since these are all 100k miles newer than my old stuff.

_Quote, originally posted by *TheRealDutchdub* »_Also keep in mind if you want to use the Mk4 strut, you cannot adjust the camber as you could on the VR setup, my advise will be, using the VR setup and skip the Mk4 suspension.

ah, so the camber IS adjusted with the strut mounting points! I wasn't sure, cause way back, someone said they didn't loosen those to adjust alignment/camber. So...where is the camber adjustment made on the mk4? That'd be interesting to know.

_Quote, originally posted by *TheRealDutchdub* »_As for the Mk4 driveshafts, if they are the Tri-pot design, skip them and use the VR items instead. Simple replace the drive flanges in the gearbox to VR ones.

I think what I'm gonna do is open up my 020, take the drive flanges outta there and put them in the 02J. Then I'll use the inner driveshaft from the 020, mated to the outer CV from the 02J, and put the mk4 hubs on my mk3 steering knuckles. Sound possible? The only thing I'm concerned about then is whether the driveshafts will be long enough/too long


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