# System Error - No Convert. Top Operation



## mwwelch (May 24, 2007)

I have been experiencing a problem with closing the CSC roof on my EOS 2.0T and wanted to know if anyone else has heard of this before?

DETAILS
1. Start the roof closing process by pulling up on the lever and I continue holding and don't release until the windows go up (or I get the error message).
2. The MFD display shows "Convert. top operation" message and warning/indicator chime is heard.
3. Trunk opens and roof begins to close.
4. The MFD display shows "Tailgate swings open" message and roof continues to raise / close.
5. The MFD display switches back to "Convert. top operation" message. Warning/indicator chime stops and roof continues to close.
6. Roof closes (rear window in place, sunroof closed and in place) but instead of windows going up, I hear the roof motor sound for a second or two and then there is a loud double-click as though the trunk is going to open again. Motor stops and MFD displays message stating "System error - No convert. top operation".

The roof goes down with no problem and has never caused any error messages.
To clear the error, I lower the roof again and then raise it again. Sometimes it takes several up/down tries before it will close without an error.
The dealer has had it 4 times and still has not resolved the problem or determined what is wrong. They said there are no errors being stored and everything appears correct even though I have brought it in with the error still on the MFD.
They opened a ticket with VW corporate but have had little luck. Now the service tech wants to take home my new car (2000 miles) to monitor it.
I hope this isn't the start of a long love-hate relationship with this car!

Anyone have any suggestions or heard of this before?


----------



## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: System Error - No Convert. Top Operation (mwwelch)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mwwelch* »_
6. Roof closes (rear window in place, sunroof closed and in place) but instead of windows going up, I hear the roof motor sound for a second or two 

Up to this point every thing sounds right. I hear the roof motor for a second or two before the windows start to close.

_Quote, originally posted by *mwwelch* »_
and then there is a loud double-click as though the trunk is going to open again. Motor stops and MFD displays message stating "System error - No convert. top operation".


It sounds like the tech at the dealer quite simply wants to see error code and when one doesn't appear throws his arms in the air. This is going to require some diagnostic skills. This is why VW tranes one person to be a roof specialist at every dealer. It sounds to me like there is probably a bad switch or sensor that tells the controller the roof closing procedure is complete. Maybe the switch in the trunk latch is bad indicating an open trunk all the time. 
I have not read any posts stating a problem similar to this. If your not having any luck at one dealer perhaps it's best to try another. 


_Modified by solarflare at 1:58 PM 5-24-2007_


----------



## oab97 (Feb 18, 2007)

*Re: System Error - No Convert. Top Operation (solarflare)*

I also have not heard of this specific problem previously. I'm sorry you had to be the one to bring this potential situation into our collective interweb consciousness. The only semi-valuable piece of information that I can offer you is that depending on your location many governments protect auto consumers with a lemon law that dictates if a new car is in for repairs for the same exact problem more than a given number of times (typically 3 or 4) and the dealer still cannot fix it then they must, by law, buy back the car from you. I sincerely hope you won’t ever need to look into this more deeply or at worst implement it, but you should be aware that the option is out there for you.


----------



## mwwelch (May 24, 2007)

*Re: System Error - No Convert. Top Operation (solarflare)*

Yes, I just picked up the loaner car from the dealer and they stated that although they have seen the resulting error on the MFD, they are hoping to run into it themselves.
They've actually shown some real interest (who doesn't like to work on something new and challenging) and overall I'm happy with their service... so far. [They aren't even the same dealer that I bought it from but they are the one I prefer for service.]
They gave me a copy of an email they shot off to the regional VW representative and one of the technicians (I believe from the regional training center) will be onsite tomorrow to check it out further. Guess I can't complain that it isn't being escalated properly.
Unfortunately, it appears as though I'm the first person to report this issue and everyone is curious as to why no error was logged.
Hope my experience can help others...



_Modified by mwwelch at 2:14 PM 5-24-2007_


----------



## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: System Error - No Convert. Top Operation (mwwelch)*

In addition. I find it hard to believe that if the controller knows to display an error message on the MFD it should therefore know what it expected to happen but didn't and convey that information. 
I'm not sure what diagnostic charts are available for the roof operation procedure but I would think there should be one that the tech can follow. If the tech follows your list of events he should be able to narrow the cause and just replace those components. Yes this is the "shot-gun" approach, which is necessary sometimes on intermittent problems, but it can save time and frustration and could prevent them from having to honor the lemon law..


_Modified by solarflare at 2:24 PM 5-24-2007_


----------



## just-jean (Sep 14, 2006)

*Re: System Error - No Convert. Top Operation (mwwelch)*

i had a roof system error message when one of my flappy wings didn't open....was cold at the time so this may have been a factor.
the other day i had it half open for a while... wiped the seals to clean the pollen---it was balanced nicely, had the car motor (and radio







running. when i was finished, i got back in and I had a hydraulic overheat message but it closed and the message was not up long enough for me to read the exact wording. 
if you don't mind, please PM me with the dealer info that you are happy with----I bought mine in ramsey










_Modified by just-jean at 11:51 PM 5-24-2007_


----------



## Speedster356 (Aug 7, 2006)

I too had this error message! The opening sequence halted when the sunroof was halfway open!
It happened once, during a cold night and has never appeared since.
Possible causes? Maybe the cold (about 5 C) or maybe the close distance of obstacles (a tall pavement and a car passing by, car equipped with PDC).
I have the car for 4.5 months now.


----------



## mwwelch (May 24, 2007)

*Re: System Error - No Convert. Top Operation (mwwelch)*

It may be premature as I haven't picked up the car yet, but according to the Service Dept, the issue has been resolved.
The local tech (who had my car overnight) said the situation was getting worse and that they could now reproduce the error.
According to them, they had the regional Service Tech onsite today to work on my escalated issue and they were able to determine that one of the trunk latches need adjusting. The person I spoke with wasn't exactly sure which one but I'll ask again when I pick it up. Strange thing was that no error was being recorded in the computer.
They did say they heard of this being reported by another dealer in southern New Jersey so now I don't feel quite so alone








The local rep wanted to keep the car over the weekend to continue their "observations" but I really think they just wanted to take advantage of the good top-down driving weather we are having here in NJ








If I find out which latch was adjusted I'll post a follow-up... have a great Memorial Day weekend!


----------



## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

Hi Mark
I know this thread is a bit cold but I'd like to hear if you ever did learn from your tech which trunk latch was malfunctioning. I've been having the same problem - intermittently - with my Eos for the last month or so. About half the times I raise the roof it operates normally - that is to say the rear window swings down at the end of the process, the hydraulic motor continues turn for a few seconds (at least I think it's the hydraulic motor - there's a kind of whine from the trunk!), then there is a 'ting' signal and the MFD reads 'Roof Closed' or some such and the windows rise. Other times the hydraulic motor goes on longer, there is a clicking sound, the motor continues for what seems like a second go at doing whatever it is that it does and then the 'ting' signal sounds and the windows rise. Twice though this second try fails, the MFD registers 'System Error' and the windows stay down. You can raise them by the switch on the driver's door and to all intents and purposes the car is lockable and leaveable - only you can't raise the trunk lid. Which would seem to indicate that it is one of the several latches that isn't closing properly. I've so far got over the problem by stopping the engine then starting it again and once more pulling up on the roof switch (ie no need to lower the roof for a second go at the whole process). There is the noise of the hydraulic motor turning and then the 'ting' signal and the windows close normally.
Anyone else beside Mark have this piece of adolescent delinquency (my car's only done 10000 miles so far) to cope with?
I'm taking mine into the dealer for the first service and would appreciate any help anyone could give when I present the problem to him.
Regards
Max 


_Modified by maxdot at 11:00 AM 8-15-2007_


----------



## mwwelch (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (maxdot)*

Sounds like the exact same problem I had. Unfortunately, I never did get to speak with them about the exact solution (other than a latch needed to be adjusted).
I suggest you give them my Service Department's contact information (see below) and have your people call my people








East Coast Volkswagen
Englewood Cliffs, NJ
(201) 567-9000 

Tell them that you understand the an EOS 2.0T was having the same problem and that this group was able to resolve it (with the help of corporate VW).
Knock on wood, but it hasn't happened since and the closing is much smoother and seems more in tune with what one would expect.


----------



## maxdot (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: (mwwelch)*

Mark
Thanks for your quick reply. With the miracle of the web we can reach each other pretty much instantly but I fear it will take a lot more before my French technician in deepest France can chat with your lads in NJ! Pity
Max


_Modified by maxdot at 11:45 AM 8-15-2007_


----------

