# Some SEL R-Lines coming without Ventilated seats



## Zabes64 (Aug 29, 2018)

Dealer sent me a sticker for a VIN at the 140xxx range and it has Ventilated seats removed with a $200 credit.

Already told my dealer if the one he has coming is missing the ventilated seats I'm not accepting it.


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

The credits they issue are insulting. You cannot tell me that the ventilated seats option are cheaper than the Homelink mirror or rubber floor mats.


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## Zabes64 (Aug 29, 2018)

noodlesatf said:


> The credits they issue are insulting. You cannot tell me that the ventilated seats option are cheaper than the Homelink mirror or rubber floor mats.


Absolutely agree, @Reihenmotor5 and I were discussing that, to me it's a $1500 loss roughly, they are sending it to the DC market, one thing if it was going to Maine or Vermont, but a $200 discount for a car a lot less people are going to want from you later is just ridiculous and poorly done by VW.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Wonder if that's the difference from a dealer unsold stock order vs. a sold factory order? They know not to mess with a "sold" order vs. dealer stock fulfillment?

In Canada, I ordered my 2022 Highline R-Line back in Feb, was worried about what they would delete. Happily, the only real effective deletes between my 2020 and this 2022 was no footwell lights and a single hatch power motor instead of two (but that may have been a regular cost reduction). All other things that I had heard/ rumored deletes were there (rear blind side monitor and powered rear hatch). My 2022 came with ventilated seats.

VAG put out a news story several months ago they they would be deleting blind side monitoring on non-SEL models) on Tiguan's.


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## Zabes64 (Aug 29, 2018)

It's from unsold stock, not an order.


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## OEMplusCC (Jan 27, 2013)

noodlesatf said:


> The credits they issue are insulting. You cannot tell me that the ventilated seats option are cheaper than the Homelink mirror or rubber floor mats.


Although I agree with your statement the reality is that they are giving you credit of what it would have cost them to put those seats in. From accounting prospective it checks out


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Except I'm not paying for the price of the car that it COST them. I'm paying retail overall price, so the discount should have been what an retail realized value of the omitted part would have been. They are mixing cost of the part to them with retail value of the car to me.

They all do this...


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

OEMplusCC said:


> Although I agree with your statement the reality is that they are giving you credit of what it would have cost them to put those seats in. From accounting prospective it checks out


So, if those seats later become available, will they swap them in for $200? No, of course not; it will be several thousand for the parts, plus labor.


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## OEMplusCC (Jan 27, 2013)

noodlesatf said:


> So, if those seats later become available, will they swap them in for $200? No, of course not; it will be several thousand for the parts, plus labor.


Again I am not trying to be on the VW side. I am just saying how they probably got to that number in order for their "expense books to balance out". 
FYI Cost of putting a seat into a car on assembly floor is completely different than replacing a seat into an existing vehicle at a dealer. Two completely different things.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

Just asking here....
Are the seats different or is the "airflow" to the seats the change?
Maybe an additional module for ventilation?

Bob.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

The leather finish is different, they have many vent holes for the air to pass.


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## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

That sucks....I'd want the ventilated seats too.
You can't add them later on either (without spending a fortune--i.e. new seats)


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

OEMplusCC said:


> Again I am not trying to be on the VW side. I am just saying how they probably got to that number in order for their "expense books to balance out".
> FYI Cost of putting a seat into a car on assembly floor is completely different than replacing a seat into an existing vehicle at a dealer. Two completely different things.


Oh, I understand the VW thought process on this. I'm just calling it out for the BS that it is. I don't care that it saves them $200 in parts at assembly time, since it's far more than $200 worth of economic value being left off the car on the lot.


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## schagaphonic (Aug 24, 2008)

I was recently at my dealer for service when I noticed a similar omission on a '22 SE. A $300 credit was noted on the sticker price for not installing the power lift-gate feature!


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## dragonpalm (May 9, 2016)

Reading about how manufacturers, not just VW, are omitting key features on new cars makes me wonder why anyone who absolutely doesn’t need a new car would buy one right now. Sure, the first owner will get some laughable credit but all other owners are stuck with these “covid cars” missing features which makes it undesirable. Add record high prices and low inventory and it really shows how people are obsessed with getting that shiny new car at any cost.


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## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

dragonpalm said:


> Reading about how manufacturers, not just VW, are omitting key features on new cars makes me wonder why anyone who absolutely doesn’t need a new car would buy one right now. Sure, the first owner will get some laughable credit but all other owners are stuck with these “covid cars” missing features which makes it undesirable. Add record high prices and low inventory and it really shows how people are obsessed with getting that shiny new car at any cost.


I totally agree, but it's also that the manufacturers are trying to keep turning out cars missing just a few features instead of just completely stopping production


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

dragonpalm said:


> Reading about how manufacturers, not just VW, are omitting key features on new cars makes me wonder why anyone who absolutely doesn’t need a new car would buy one right now. Sure, the first owner will get some laughable credit but all other owners are stuck with these “covid cars” missing features which makes it undesirable. Add record high prices and low inventory and it really shows how people are obsessed with getting that shiny new car at any cost.


You highlighted why the credits are so low: because they can be. Demand is way ahead of supply, so buyers are accepting the insultingly credits, rather than waiting on cars with the features they want.


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## AdamChandler (Apr 16, 2015)

Spoke to a few dealers today, 2 out of 4 who had the Tiguan SEL, blue with grey interior did not have ventilated seats and they were $200 cheaper.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

I'm sorry, but I do not understand the "grey" interior thing.
To me they look white, or VERY light "grey" at best.
My 3 sons are grown and I rarely have anyone in the vehicle with me (wife still works), but the light color leather seemed like a bad idea from the get go.
Black worked for me.
(Had they offered some of the new colored interiors with the Blue exterior, it might have been a different story....)
Hrmmm....Noisette?

Bob.


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## AdamChandler (Apr 16, 2015)

OhioSpyderman said:


> I'm sorry, but I do not understand the "grey" interior thing.
> To me they look white, or VERY light "grey" at best.
> My 3 sons are grown and I rarely have anyone in the vehicle with me (wife still works), but the light color leather seemed like a bad idea from the get go.
> Black worked for me.
> ...


My wife and I are oddly similar when it comes to 'rareness' must be a millennial thing but she always wants what there are the least of so when she bought her latest motorcycle, she said "only 5 in the country are yellow and loaded so I want yellow" Same with my RAM. I have one of 5 RAMs in the country that are Blue, Limited, Diesel, long bed without a sunroof and with the 33 gallon fuel tank.

We just always opt for the special ones. There's only 4 Blue Tiguan SELs with white interior on the east coast. She just bought one of them. I think if black was rare, she would have done that. I warned her that white is going to show every smudge.


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

OhioSpyderman said:


> I'm sorry, but I do not understand the "grey" interior thing.
> To me they look white, or VERY light "grey" at best.
> My 3 sons are grown and I rarely have anyone in the vehicle with me (wife still works), but the light color leather seemed like a bad idea from the get go.
> Black worked for me.
> ...


My wife's Tiguan SEL R-Line Black is white with the gray interior. It actually looks really sharp on the inside. It's almost more of a silver than a gray.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

I don't disagree with the fact that it is nice, just seemed to be an area of concern (to me).
I am one of those "crazy" people who likes to drive a spotless vehicle.
I've always felt that if you take care of your vehicle, it will take care of you.

Bob.


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## AdamChandler (Apr 16, 2015)

To Bob's point, if you google image search for "white interior dirt Tesla" you'll see why I told her to avoid getting white / grey but it's her car. She can clean the upholstery all she wants


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## kirk_augustin (Jul 21, 2012)

No rational person wants or need "ventilated seats".
Leather is not a conductor, so quickly becomes whatever temp you are.
So you do not want seats to be ventilated, and be the either hot or cold temperature of the car. 
That is like saying you want your coat to be "ventilated" and have lots of little holes in it.
If it is ventilated, then it is useless to protect you from the extremes.


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## kirk_augustin (Jul 21, 2012)

schagaphonic said:


> I was recently at my dealer for service when I noticed a similar omission on a '22 SE. A $300 credit was noted on the sticker price for not installing the power lift-gate feature!


No rational person should want a "power lift-gate" as humans do it easily, better, cheaper, and much more reliably.
When the power lift-gate breaks in a few years, then you will understand.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

kirk_augustin said:


> No rational person should want a "power lift-gate" as humans do it easily, better, cheaper, and much more reliably.
> When the power lift-gate breaks in a few years, then you will understand.


Keep in mind, there are people in our world that can not raise their hands easily to pull down the hatch when open. By your logic, those people are irrational ?

Also, also, ours cars come bundled. It's not easy to add/remove features a-la-cart in the VW world. There are 3-5 bundles of features basically. It's not a Porsche where everything is customizable at order time.


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

kirk_augustin said:


> No rational person should want a "power lift-gate" as humans do it easily, better, cheaper, and much more reliably.
> When the power lift-gate breaks in a few years, then you will understand.


No rational person should want "powered windows" as humans do it easily, better, cheaper, and much more reliably.
When the power windows break in a few years, then you will understand.


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## AdamChandler (Apr 16, 2015)

I can understand Kirk's logic. There are features and convinces we simply don't need and humans measure risk reward on every single thing we do whether we know it or not. Bundling things we don't want or need sucks but that's how we get so many features on an SEL versus SE despite just a couple of grand increase on the sticker...it's cheaper for VW to give you a heated seat than make it an option.

And yes, these things break. They do and I guess you can repair them or not. up to you.


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## dragonpalm (May 9, 2016)

This discussion is about missing features on new Tiguans. Not about the difference between people’s definition of “needs” and “wants”. Going down that rabbit hole on feature-rich modern vehicles is a pointless debate because more features will always be the reality of new cars.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

I'm sorry, but I can't understand Kirk's logic.
For some reason (that maybe HE will explain) he has issues with all new technology.
Power seats, power tailgates, anything that is "helpful".
Yes, they cost more, EVERYTHING does these days.
But then again, while costs are going up, so are wages (although I wouldn't know how much as I am a measly pension getter).
If you can't afford the features, then opt out. No reason to harp on others that pay for them and enjoy them.
Personally, for me, this was my first "new" vehicle in 30 years (honestly).
VW's are pretty far down the chain of "luxury" cars, but I did what I could.

Just my .02

Bob.


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## Hawkeye9723 (Dec 4, 2019)

When I get ready to trade in my Tiguan for a newer model, I'm going to pay close attention to the sticker. If I see that a feature has been omitted, I'll bring it up to the dealer. If I'm paying that much for a car, it better have all the features that they advertise. The laughable "discount" they give for not installing it, is NOT worth it. Especially only $200 for the ventilated seats.


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## DunesMike (Dec 16, 2016)

snobrdrdan said:


> I totally agree, but it's also that the manufacturers are trying to keep turning out cars missing just a few features instead of just completely stopping production


I don’t quite understand the concept that installing the seat ventilation components would somehow delay production. Is there some exotic part or group of parts in the seat ventilation system that is now rare or unavailable? Is VAG’s supply chain so fragile and unadaptable that parts usually sourced from location A would not be available from secondary location B or tertiary location C? I’m certainly no expert on VAG’s mothods for sourcing of parts for car production, but from a business common sense standpoint, this issue seems ridiculously aviodable.


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## kirk_augustin (Jul 21, 2012)

You do not want ventilated seats.
Imagine if someone spills something, like that is never going to happen?
Ventilated seats are impossible to keep clean.
Nor is there any reason for them.
Sheepskins are nicer in the winter, and AC is better in the summer. 
Nothing gained by ventilated seats.


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## AdamChandler (Apr 16, 2015)

kirk_augustin said:


> You do not want ventilated seats.
> Imagine if someone spills something, like that is never going to happen?
> Ventilated seats are impossible to keep clean.
> Nor is there any reason for them.
> ...


"nothing gained' is too absolute. Only a Sith deals in absolutes 

I think a more appropriate statement is perforated seats are very hard to keep clean. Someone with a 'ventilation delete' Tiguan will need to speak up here but my assumption is the Tiguan without ventilated seats that's an SEL will still come with perforated seats. So now the customer has the pain in the ass perforations without the benefit of ventilation. That's like the worst of both worlds.

I personally like ventilation. I have it in 2 vehicles. It's great and I just have a little tiny pick I use when detailing to get crumbs out of the seats. I would not want them for rear seats if I had kids but for front seats, it's really nice. My opinion.

You should probably stop eating in your car though. That would eliminate most of your issues with these seats.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Ventilated seats give that last extra push to cooling your body. Not dramatic, but noticeable. Fair point about cleaning them though.


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

DunesMike said:


> I don’t quite understand the concept that installing the seat ventilation components would somehow delay production. Is there some exotic part or group of parts in the seat ventilation system that is now rare or unavailable? Is VAG’s supply chain so fragile and unadaptable that parts usually sourced from location A would not be available from secondary location B or tertiary location C? I’m certainly no expert on VAG’s mothods for sourcing of parts for car production, but from a business common sense standpoint, this issue seems ridiculously aviodable.


Short answer: yes

Long answer: it has everything to do with how modern cars are built, and therefore scarcity is defined on a daily (maybe even hourly) basis. Modern factories no longer have huge warehouses full of parts waiting to be used, having abandoned that methodology for a "just in time" approach to assembly. That means that any given part--short of things like fasteners and clips, bands, etc--shows up just in time to be installed. So, if a disruption to the supply chain for ventilated seats of a couple of days occurs, but they can get extra non-ventalated seats, then there are a couple of days worth of SEL cars that go out the door with regular seats.

So, while the approach makes sense from a cost (no longer renting huge warehouses, no longer utilizing massive factory floors to queue up hundreds of each part at every station for hours on end) and time (it's faster when the parts you need are dropped off by the shipping company an hour before being bolted in, cars no longer need to be built in batches of similar specs and then the line is retooled for the next run) standpoint, we are seeing how large supply chain disruptions cause massive issues for such a logistically complicated methodology.

If you want some insight into what I'm talking about, watch this:

https://www.amazon.com/James-Mays-Build-Car-Hours/dp/B01G2T56W4


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## Liansonline (Mar 24, 2019)

OhioSpyderman said:


> I'm sorry, but I do not understand the "grey" interior thing.
> To me they look white, or VERY light "grey" at best.
> My 3 sons are grown and I rarely have anyone in the vehicle with me (wife still works), but the light color leather seemed like a bad idea from the get go.
> Black worked for me.
> ...


Love our grey interior on our 2022 and it is staying cleaner than our 2020 with grey interior. Not sure if they change material but the 2020 picks up color off jeans but thankfully it cleans off. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Zabes64 (Aug 29, 2018)

I was told by a contact at VW that starting around VIN 13400ish, for sure by 134109 that ventilated seats were removed and as of now that will continue through MY23.

If the chip shortages get better it could be added back in, but plan is through MY23 no ventilated seats.

So look for VINs under 134000 to be safe if you still want one.


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## PZ (May 9, 2002)

I only wish ventilated seats were an option when we bought out 2019 Tiguan. I wanted cloth seats, but my wife needed power ones as she is vertically challenged and had trouble adjusting the seat close enough to the pedals and high enough to see well. The light gray vinyl is nice and has stayed clean.


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## O-Deer (Sep 15, 2021)

Anyone that can confirm this with a window sticker. My local dealer still lists the feature but of course they don’t show the window stickers online.


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## coolmike41 (Jul 3, 2010)

i like the ventilated seats. IMO, id trade them for the pano roof. in the summer, i mainly keep it closed to let less heat in.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Ditto. I can do without the pano roof.


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## Stevo52 (3 mo ago)

Is there a difference in the seats themselves or is it just a chip shortage?.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

From other threads I've read, the seats are the same, just lacking fans and control modules.
Not sure if it's chip shortage for the modules, but that "might" be a good guess....

Bob.


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## O-Deer (Sep 15, 2021)

Can confirm bought a new one off the trucks yesterday and it’s missing ventilated seating. Oh well.


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## Tiguanian (2 mo ago)

I'm getting highline end of this month and dealer told me ventilated seats are unavailable until 2024.it's a joke. One of the reason I chose tiguan was ventilated seats. Hope VW retrofit those seats when it's available like GM.


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## Zabes64 (Aug 29, 2018)

Tiguanian said:


> I'm getting highline end of this month and dealer told me ventilated seats are unavailable until 2024.it's a joke. One of the reason I chose tiguan was ventilated seats. Hope VW retrofit those seats when it's available like GM.


VW will not be retrofitting the seats, some cars made shortly after 134000 VIN might be lucky enough to have everything but the ventilation units (no idea if that's even true) but they might have all the wiring etc. If that was the case they'd still need the units and new LCD climate control units.

I had to search high and low to find one on the east coast in Platinum grey in early Aug, there were only 3 or 4 available with VINs under 134000.


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## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

Tiguanian said:


> Hope VW retrofit those seats when it's available like GM.


Not gonna happen


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

Other than the seats, what's the difference between an SEL and SEL Premium. Stereo and the 360 cameras? Seems pointless to me to buy a Premium without the seats, since stereos are easy upgrades and the camera is kinda a gimmick.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

Unless I'm mistaken, there is no "Premium" anymore.
I believe the last year for Premium was 2021.
Top models now are SEL R-line (and SE R-line Black) ???

Bob.


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## noodlesatf (Jun 10, 2008)

OhioSpyderman said:


> Unless I'm mistaken, there is no "Premium" anymore.
> I believe the last year for Premium was 2021.
> Top models now are SEL R-line (and SE R-line Black) ???
> 
> Bob.


That makes sense, since the R-Line always added a few features that weren't part of the appearance package. My wife has a 2019 SEL R-Line Black, and it added the digital dash.

I'm guessing all the Tiguans have the LED lights now? Hers does not, since that only came on the Premium.


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## Zabes64 (Aug 29, 2018)

noodlesatf said:


> Other than the seats, what's the difference between an SEL and SEL Premium. Stereo and the 360 cameras? Seems pointless to me to buy a Premium without the seats, since stereos are easy upgrades and the camera is kinda a gimmick.


Now you'd be looking at the difference between an SE and SEL and there are some pretty significant differences, full parking sensors, but end of the day the loss of ventilates seats was going to be enough for me to drop buying a Tiguan if I couldn't find one with them, so it's understandable to say "pass".


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## Hawkeye9723 (Dec 4, 2019)

So, I got this email from VW with a link to their site talking about the MY23 cars. On the page, they are still saying that the SEL R-Line comes with vented seats.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

My local dealer has 2 SEL R-Lines in stock (Black/Black and Pearl White/Black) and their descriptions both say they have the heated/ventilated seats.
I haven't actually gone down there to see if that's true....

Bob.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

2022 Volkswagen Tiguan SEL R-Line with 4MOTION® - Volkswagen dealer serving Dayton OH – New and Used Volkswagen dealership serving Kettering Fairfield Fairborn OH 3VV4B7AX7NM168093


Research the 2022 Volkswagen Tiguan at Evans Volkswagen of Dayton. Here are pictures, specs, and pricing for the 2022 Volkswagen Tiguan 4D Sport Utility SEL R-Line with 4MOTION® located in Dayton. 3VV4B7AX7NM168093




www.evansvolkswagen.com







https://www.evansvolkswagen.com/new-Dayton-2022-Volkswagen-Tiguan-SEL+R+Line+with+4MOTION-3VV4B7AX1NM167005


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## Tiguanian (2 mo ago)

Hawkeye9723 said:


> So, I got this email from VW with a link to their site talking about the MY23 cars. On the page, they are still saying that the SEL R-Line comes with vented seats.


Yeah but when you click build you can see this message on the top. I guess it's upto your locate dealer's inventory.


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

Didn't I read that top trim retained the features? That was several months ago...


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## Tiguanian (2 mo ago)

OhioSpyderman said:


> My local dealer has 2 SEL R-Lines in stock (Black/Black and Pearl White/Black) and their descriptions both say they have the heated/ventilated seats.
> I haven't actually gone down there to see if that's true....
> 
> Bob.


If it's true I wish I could go to US and get the car 😔


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

Tiguanian said:


> If it's true I wish I could go to US and get the car 😔


Call them and ask for Zach.
I'm not big on car dealerships, but this VW dealer has been awesome to work with....

Bob.


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## 1.8TPSSTVARIANT (Nov 29, 2005)

I own a 22' SEL R-Line with ventilated seats, in my opinion, you're not missing much. They are very weak compared to other car brands, and you can barely notice they're on even on full power.


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## OhioSpyderman (Jul 21, 2021)

Swell


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## jonese (Jun 21, 2020)

My '22 has ventilated seats. It's. okay. I mean, it cuts the edge off a bit on a hot day, but it's not a must have feature.


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## puma1552 (Jul 6, 2012)

Arteons are now shipping with ventilated seats again finally, so I'm guessing Tiguans and everything else will be soon too. Finally getting back to building fully baked cars.


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## Uncle Bertie (1 mo ago)

puma1552 said:


> Arteons are now shipping with ventilated seats again finally, so I'm guessing Tiguans and everything else will be soon too. Finally getting back to building fully baked cars.
> [/QUOTE


I have just purchased a 2023 Tiguan SEL R-Line with Ventilated Seats, now they are putting a SE Steering Wheel in the SEL R-Line with a Credit on the sticker price. I got one with Ventilated seats and the SEL R-Line Steering Wheel. Had to move quickly when I found out what was happening.


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## BenoYo1 (11 mo ago)

Uncle Bertie said:


> I have just purchased a 2023 Tiguan SEL R-Line with Ventilated Seats, now they are putting a SE Steering Wheel in the SEL R-Line with a Credit on the sticker price. I got one with Ventilated seats and the SEL R-Line Steering Wheel. Had to move quickly when I found out what was happening.


Whats the difference between the SE and SEL steering wheel? If its that the SE has really buttons I'd see that as a plus no?


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## Zabes64 (Aug 29, 2018)

Just looked and Fairfax Virginia VW had the mixed lower trim steering wheel with the ventilated seats.


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## Uncle Bertie (1 mo ago)

Zabes64 said:


> Just looked and Fairfax Virginia VW had the mixed lower trim steering wheel with the ventilated seats.
> View attachment 246999











This is the SEL R-Line standard fit steering wheel, this is leather as opposed to leatherette on the
SE wheel, ok it has the haptec controls but they work ok for me, I think it looks better and it matches 
the other controls.


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## tiggyi (9 d ago)

Uncle Bertie said:


> I have just purchased a 2023 Tiguan SEL R-Line with Ventilated Seats, now they are putting a SE Steering Wheel in the SEL R-Line with a Credit on the sticker price. I got one with Ventilated seats and the SEL R-Line Steering Wheel. Had to move quickly when I found out what was happening.


 Dang your lucky my dealer told me it will not be available until 2024 lol. I'll just give him 1 star for dealer survey haha.


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