# tt cams, 264/260 install



## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

so i just picked up a set of tt 264/260 cams.(at a great price) 
Of course i will need a new tune, c2 cam file... but the million dollar question is,

What eles will I need.....

-new valve cover gasket
-upper tube seals???
-throttle body gaskets
list:
1. 022 103 484F x6, Spark Plug Gaskets
2. 022133237C x1, Intake Manifold Gasket
3. 022 103 483E x1, Valve Cover Gasket
4. 021 121 119A x1, Thermostat Gasket
5. N 104 883 02 x2, Cam Adjuster Bolts
6. 066-109-345-A x6, Seal washer
7. RTV gasket maker
8. G12 coolant 

so i now i need more.... and i may not even need some of those. 
So any help will be great,
also anyone that has done this first hand, what did you use as a refrence guide. Bentley, chilton,.... i dont know....

thanks


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## spitfire481 (Mar 21, 2007)

i did mine a few weeks ago. bentley helps for torque specs and the bolt sequence for the cam caps but most of it is just marking where things were when it came apart, and re-assembling the same way. make sure the cam sprockets are both locked closckwise and there are 16 chain links between the arrows on the sprockets. you should replace valve cover gasket, the 6 o-rings for the spark plug tubes under the valve cover, t-stat housing gasket, intake manifold gasket. and you need a tube of high temp rtv for the side timing cover


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

cool, 

iam gonna start getting all the gaskets/seals together.

where can i get a bentley or a install refrence guide? or the best source for a "step by step" procedure?


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## spitfire481 (Mar 21, 2007)

http://www.amazon.com/Volkswagen-Je...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277391997&sr=8-1

there really isnt much of a step by step anywhere.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

even though it dosent say anything about the 3.2l it does refrence the 2.8l

same set up but would some specs be different???


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## spitfire481 (Mar 21, 2007)

its the same. but there is an r32 addition in the back of the book that shows the chain/cam removal/install. but its pretty much a direct copy from the 2.8 24v section


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)




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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

list:
1. 022 103 484F x6, Spark Plug Gaskets
2. 022133237C x1, Intake Manifold Gasket
3. 022 103 483E x1, Valve Cover Gasket
4. 021 121 119A x1, Thermostat Gasket
5. N 104 883 02 x2, Cam Adjuster Bolts
6. 066-109-345-A x6, Seal washer
7. RTV gasket maker
8. G12 coolant


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## dainese (Jul 23, 2009)

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4105591http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4105591


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

thanks alot bro!

not sure what hat you pulled these out of, but i like it!


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## VdubbPeach (Mar 25, 2008)

i didnt know you had cams!?!


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

VdubbPeach said:


> i didnt know you had cams!?!



i dont yet peachy!

they are at the house waiting for the $$$$ to grow on the tree out back so i can have them installed and then get software.

--but there is alot of speculation and talk right now that c2 has changed some of their software since the lead enginneer(jeff atwood) left.... sooooooo,

iam trying to find out if the software HAS changed or it is rumor.... if it has I may take a roadtrip to CT to have it tuned by Jeff himself if its not to expensive!


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## cpinde (Jul 5, 2010)

Where did you get the cams from? I just got an R motor and am doing cams and a bunch of other stuff but am trying to find a good place to get cams.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

cpinde said:


> Where did you get the cams from? I just got an R motor and am doing cams and a bunch of other stuff but am trying to find a good place to get cams.




i bought them off a guy who was hard up for cash....

most places are around $800 or so....


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## VdubbPeach (Mar 25, 2008)

Like I said I'm gonna be the nice meth dealer on the corner that won't stab you  haha..want the corner across the street? I heard something about the c2 switch but from what I read they are just adding more and the profiles are still the same? Idk food for thought


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

just did my tt cams this past weekend, will be getting the united motorsport(jeff atwood) tune this week


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

Rmeitz167 said:


> just did my tt cams this past weekend, will be getting the united motorsport(jeff atwood) tune this week


are you gonna dyno it afterwards?? please do!


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

yep im probably going to be heading to the dyno tuesday


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

Rmeitz167 said:


> yep im probably going to be heading to the dyno tuesday



cool keep up posted on the final #'s


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## cpinde (Jul 5, 2010)

hammered have you put your cams in yet? Where did you get the VW specific parts from? I'm going to be doing cams in about 3 weeks. I'm going to do all the timing and waterpump while I have everything apart. I might do the MKV oil pan too or I might just wait and do it when I do the pistons, rods, and turbo in the late spring.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

cpinde said:


> hammered have you put your cams in yet? Where did you get the VW specific parts from? I'm going to be doing cams in about 3 weeks. I'm going to do all the timing and waterpump while I have everything apart. I might do the MKV oil pan too or I might just wait and do it when I do the pistons, rods, and turbo in the late spring.



have not done my cams.... yet. just dont have the $$$ for the install or software.

i've decided against doing them myself after hearing a few peoples stories/trials and tribulations.

as far as teh oem parts iam getting them from the dealer. I work at a dealer(not a vw dealer) so i get most of them very cheap. (less then most people/shops)


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## cpinde (Jul 5, 2010)

What kind of problems have you been hearing about from people who did the cams themselves?

I used to be the sales manager of a VW dealership and wish I could still get the discount I did. It sure would make a difference in parts prices.


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

hammeredGLI said:


> have not done my cams.... yet. just dont have the $$$ for the install or software.
> 
> *you can get the same cam flash i did from aptuning for 299. Its the united motorsport flash(jeff atwood)*
> 
> ...



i say do it yourself, it wasnt bad at all. I would just suggest having a torque wrench that measures in newton meters or inch pounds, youll need it when torqueing the cam caps etc.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

cpinde said:


> What kind of problems have you been hearing about from people who did the cams themselves?
> 
> I used to be the sales manager of a VW dealership and wish I could still get the discount I did. It sure would make a difference in parts prices.


search some of the minor instALL issues people have had... cel's and ****. I would perfer someones warranty or guarentee on the install. especially from a shop that has done the install before. w/e... i dont have the time and nor do i have the "true" expierence...... w/e



Rmeitz167 said:


> i say do it yourself, it wasnt bad at all. I would just suggest having a torque wrench that measures in newton meters or inch pounds, youll need it when torqueing the cam caps etc.


see above response. **** it


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

you can get the same cam flash i did from aptuning for 299. Its the united motorsport flash(jeff atwood)



you said this in a previous post....

the c2 is that cheap and 1 hr from the house at ngp


jeff is in ct and is 8 or so hrs away... and is more money. if he wants to throw me a custom tune for the same install price as the "upgrade" to the c2 cam ****, I'd be all over it.... but i doubt he will.

jeff lmk if you want me to rep your softwARE.... and drive up and have you set me up!


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## cpinde (Jul 5, 2010)

There aren't a lot of shops that have done any cams on 24v VR6's, especially in the MD area. Induktion and NGP are probably the only two bigger shops that have done any and both are great shops. APTuning is a great shop too, it's where I get 90% of my parts, but I don't know if they've done any cams. I'm going to run C2's cam file. I asked Chris about a custom tune and he said that the cam file I'll get from him has been tweaked so much that a custom tune would probably not net much more hp.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

cpinde said:


> There aren't a lot of shops that have done any cams on 24v VR6's, especially in the MD area. Induktion and NGP are probably the only two bigger shops that have done any and both are great shops..


yea, both are more then qualified/adequate. plus ngp has the C2 software. I am also good friends with the owner of R.A.I motorsports... i know they CAN do it... 



cpinde said:


> APTuning is a great shop too, it's where I get 90% of my parts, but I don't know if they've done any cams..


never heard of them....


and Iam prob gonna run the c2 cam file.... seems like a lead pipe lock. unless jeff from united can hook me with a custom tune


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

the variable is whether c2 has changed any of jeff's tunes yet. i love my flash, i havent made it to the dyno yet, but its been holding its own and is notiably different than just the giac 93 flash i drove on for a week after i did the cams. In all honesty, the cams werent bad at all. the hardest part was getting the intake manifold off and that isnt bad at all.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

Rmeitz167 said:


> the variable is whether c2 has changed any of jeff's tunes yet.


from speaking with chris at c2... nothing has changed. and some recent peeps that have used the file have produced the same whp as previous runs. i guess i take it with a grain of salt though....

your running the cam file?



Rmeitz167 said:


> i love my flash, i havent made it to the dyno yet, but its been holding its own and is notiably different than just the giac 93 flash i drove on for a week after i did the cams..


so you just ran the cams on the giac 93 oct flash....(non cam flash)? did you feel the gain? 
what software are you running now, which cam file i mean????



Rmeitz167 said:


> In all honesty, the cams werent bad at all. the hardest part was getting the intake manifold off and that isnt bad at all.


so have you dont work like that before? are you a tech??? full shop of supplies and tools???


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

hammeredGLI said:


> from speaking with chris at c2... nothing has changed. and some recent peeps that have used the file have produced the same whp as previous runs. i guess i take it with a grain of salt though....
> 
> your running the cam file?
> 
> ...



I have a box full of tools ive accumulated while owning my mk3 vrt. I am not a tech, i merely know basic things and have a head of knowledge on 12v vr's that sort of carries over to the 24v world. The different on just the 93 file was limited, no where near as good as my United Motorsport cam flash. itll also help to have a bentley manual handy


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

Rmeitz167 said:


> where near as good as my United Motorsport cam flash.




you have the new tune from jeff?


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## cpinde (Jul 5, 2010)

Don't worry hammered I'll be doing mine in about 2 weeks so I'll have a DIY with exactly what tools you need and everything. I have a Bently that you can use too.


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

hammeredGLI said:


> you have the new tune from jeff?


yes


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

Rmeitz167 said:


> yes


do you have any dyno sheets?

what type of power did it put down... i'd like to compare power #'s with the c2 software


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## BOUDAH (Aug 15, 2008)

Hammerhead, I live like 20 minutes from Jeff, haha had the R tuned with his NA Flash while iw as on R & R in july. Not sure if hell kick my ass for releasing this but he claims his software (dubed united motorsport) is more aggresive than his tunes from C2. 

I have never ahd C2 Software when he was with them. My buddy Jeremy, JERD on the forum here got Schrick 268s instaled and Jeff tuned his car NA first, then tuned the Cams. So id PM JERD when u get a chance and ask him.

I got Schrick 272's and will be getting flashed by him when i return, then ill be dynoing the car at that point, so well see. The Tex wont see results till Mid December though


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

BOUDAH said:


> Hammerhead, I live like 20 minutes from Jeff, haha had the R tuned with his NA Flash while iw as on R & R in july. Not sure if hell kick my ass for releasing this but he claims his software (dubed united motorsport) is more aggresive than his tunes from C2.
> 
> I have never ahd C2 Software when he was with them. My buddy Jeremy, JERD on the forum here got Schrick 268s instaled and Jeff tuned his car NA first, then tuned the Cams. So id PM JERD when u get a chance and ask him.
> 
> I got Schrick 272's and will be getting flashed by him when i return, then ill be dynoing the car at that point, so well see. The Tex wont see results till Mid December though


its hammered.... 


but all good. I would love to make a roadtrip of it. But the cost iam sure for jeff to tune is redic... probably way outside of my budget.


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

so pickup his off the shelf tune, either way... your getting his tune. I had many option for what tune i wanted, and after speaking with jeff about his tune and how i could get one without coming to him, he let me know aptuning in lebanon, pa would soon become one of his dealers, so i spoke to tom at aptuning and set up a date for when theyd be getting his tunes so i could get my car flashed. Im looking forward to dynoing my car, it will be most likely the week after h2o depending on how my clutch holds out.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

Rmeitz167 said:


> so pickup his off the shelf tune, either way... your getting his tune. I had many option for what tune i wanted, and after speaking with jeff about his tune and how i could get one without coming to him, he let me know aptuning in lebanon, pa would soon become one of his dealers, so i spoke to tom at aptuning and set up a date for when theyd be getting his tunes so i could get my car flashed. Im looking forward to dynoing my car, it will be most likely the week after h2o depending on how my clutch holds out.



werd.

i didnt know he had a dealer network set up yet...


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## Rmeitz167 (Dec 16, 2007)

its begining to pick up. im sure aptuning will be at h2o, there at almost any other show.


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## 1.8T_CR (Oct 24, 2003)

hammeredGLI said:


> so i just picked up a set of tt 264/260 cams.(at a great price)
> Of course i will need a new tune, c2 cam file... but the million dollar question is,
> 
> What eles will I need.....
> ...


I installed mines like 1 year ago, it runs perfect, the installations is :banghead: you need to disassemble a lot of things, but it woth it. Be carefully with the number of holes in the chain of the cams.

I got mine r32 with that cams, with CAI and GIAC in both ECU (engine and DSG) and dyno shows around 200 whp and 201 lbs of torque.


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## VdubbPeach (Mar 25, 2008)

jesse sell me these


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

VdubbPeach said:


> jesse sell me these


for the right price... everything is for sale!


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## smittyr32 (Mar 11, 2008)

I herd these cams give u little to no power gains and that doin a cam upgrade isn't Even worth it if u a turbo set up...


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

smittyr32 said:


> I herd these cams give u little to no power gains and that doin a cam upgrade isn't Even worth it if u a turbo set up...


http://www.techtonicstuning.com/mai...ct_info&cPath=2_24_105_407_107&products_id=72

i have seen this direct from the company that makes them...


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## jr_ss (Jan 3, 2010)

Hammered, I did a bit of searching around on the forums based off our discussion in the FS section. I found this comparo between Schrick 268/264's and TT's 264/260's. It seems that the Schricks have a slight advantage on the trq curve, but it's hardly noticeable. I'd like to see the dyno's overlaid on each other to see where the actually differences between the two are if any. Keep inmind, you may see more power with a Jeff Atwood tune than you would with the Giac, as it was already proven that his tunes showed significant gains over Giac. If you want to sell those cams, lmk. I'd try them out now based on the information in the thread below.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3189922


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## Benbuilt4u (Mar 10, 2003)

what are people shops charging to install cams?


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## jr_ss (Jan 3, 2010)

Benbuilt4u said:


> what are people shops charging to install cams?


 Whatever 6-8hrs labor is plus parts.... It all depends on what shop you decide to take your car to, as each shop charges a different rate.


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## PowerDubs (Jul 22, 2001)

Make sure they have installed VW 24v cams before. I've seen more shops/people screw it up the first time than not.


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## hammeredGLI (Dec 15, 2005)

PowerDubs said:


> Make sure they have installed VW 24v cams before. I've seen more shops/people screw it up the first time than not.


 very true... 

i've heard of a few peeps warning this. If the shop hasn't done them, i wouldnt go there.


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