# Cracked windshield, Windshield replacement considerations



## ren7295 (May 31, 2005)

*cracked windshield.*


----------



## ren7295 (May 31, 2005)

*Cracked windshield,*

First things first hope everybody is safe after the recent storms,
I have just had my 5000 service at Bob Smith VW NC,The service
tec noticed a crack in the windshield saying this isn't the first time
he has seen this, They ordered the new part and arranged for the
work to be done by Gunter VW Plantation Fla, I work in Film
production so I am on location all over the globe,On arriving at
Gunter they told me they had no contact with Bob smith NC in truth
I was expecting the Phaeton red carpet stupid me, There next
queston howe was I going to paye for the work if you bring the 
car next thursday some one from VW will look at it.
After calling customer service the tell me that Gunter will not pick
the car up or give a loaner. The crack follows the shape of the rear
view mirrow not a stone chip but expect me to take three days to
deal with this.
Such a truly wonderfull car ruined by VW America This is why My next
car will be a Lexus I have been driving VW in Europe for 37 years
such a let down.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: cracked windshield. (ren7295)*

Sorry to hear that. Replacing a Phaeton windshield is fairly straightforward, but like anything else, if you want to get good results, you have to follow the instructions carefully.
In North America, most dealers sublet out the replacement of glass to specialty shops. This is quite different than the practice in Europe, where glass is always replaced at the dealership by VW trained techs. I have attached below the instructions for replacing a Phaeton windshield. You might want to have a little talk with your dealership, and find out if they plan to sublet the work. If so, tell them that you expect them to provide the glass shop with both the complete instructions AND the required special tools and sealants.
Note also that the plenum cover needs to be removed and replaced, and the headliner needs to be removed and replaced. I have not printed the instructions for how to do these two jobs. Your dealer should print them and supply them to the glass shop. The instructions for removing and replacing the plenum cover need to be followed EXACTLY, otherwise, either the plenum cover or the new windshield will get broken during the re-installation process.
If you have a sun beige interior, you might want to suggest that the glass tech wash his or her hands before removing the headliner.
The rain-sensor also needs to be removed and re-installed on the new windshield. One has to be very careful when removing rainsensors - if you just pull on the back of the rainsensor case, it comes apart (breaks). Also, there is a special lubricant used to re-seat the rainsensor, to ensure that there are no air bubbles between the aft side of the glass and the forward face of the rainsensor. Your VW dealer will need to supply the glass shop with this lubricant.
When you get the car back, inspect the plenum area for cracking, the forward edge of the headliner for dirt or damage, function-check the operation of the rainsensor (just spritz a little water on it), function check the motorized interior rear view mirror for correct memory operation, function check the lights in the headliner (front and back), the sunroof, and the garage door opener. I suggest that you ask your dealer to do a diagnostic scan on your car when it comes back from the glass shop, so that they (and not you) catch any little problems such as connectors in the roof that were not put back together.
In other words - if the work is done carefully, by someone who has read all the instructions, and follows them - there will be no problems at all. If the work is done by some oaf at a sublet shop who doesn't read the instructions - there will be problems. Make sure that your service manager comprehends this before he sends the car out to the sublet shop.
Michael


----------



## W12VW (Jun 24, 2005)

*Re: cracked windshield. (ren7295)*

Back in June my W12 had a crack in the winshield similar to that which you have described.
I took the car to Gunther VW in Coconut Crek, Fl. where I go for service, [car bought in NC from Leith].
They gave it back completed, waxed, polished, full tank of gas and of course a loanerhad been provided to me.
Perhaps you got the wrong service advisor?


----------



## joako (Jun 30, 2002)

There are two"Gunther Volkswagen" in South Florida that I know of!
Gunter Volkswagen of Coconut Creek
Gunther Volkswagen of Plantation


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (joako)*

We have a forum member who works at Gunther in Fort Lauderdale - his name is Regan Leighton. He is very knowledgable about the Phaeton, and has helped out several forum members in the past. He might be a good person to contact for some help and introductions to the right people in the service department.
I have never heard anything but nice things said about Regan's dealership - so, perhaps the bad experience noted above was a one-time exception, and things can be corrected.
Michael


----------



## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Anyone have experience with cracked winshields?*

I'm sure I've seen this before, but 2 days ago heard a very loud knock on the windshield- never saw a thing ! What appeared to be similar to a bullet hole appeared about 2 inches from the base, and now a crack appeared moving out fast







...is this something the VW dealer is fully competant to replace properly or would it be better to insist on the body shop taking over?








Thanks
Ed.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (viscount)*

Personally, I would *always *take the car to a VW dealer for stuff like this - cracked windshields, body damage repair, etc. The VW dealer has access to all the technical documentation and head office support - the aftermarket shops do not. Even if your VW dealer chooses to sublet the work out to a specialty shop, you only have to worry about talking to the VW dealer - and, if there are any problems, you have all the resources of VW customer support behind you.
As far as I can tell from reading the instructions, the windshield replacement process is pretty straightforward - *BUT:* The people doing the work need to read and follow the instructions that are specific to the Phaeton. They can't just charge in there and toss in a new windshield using the same procedures they would follow for a '64 Ford Falcon.
It is interesting to note that in the Autoweek long term test of the Phaeton, the authors had a windshield replaced due to stone damage, and then had to go back and have it replaced a second time because the shop that did the work did not follow the instructions correctly - a wind noise appeared after the first replacement.
There is also useful related information for the folks doing the windshield replacement at this post: How to remove the Plenum Chamber Cover (pictures). This task has to be performed as part of the dis-assembly to replace the windshield, and it is a frustrating task that is not well explained in the Phaeton Service Manual.
Michael


_Modified by PanEuropean at 7:52 PM 12-29-2005_


----------



## Kcmover (Jul 20, 2005)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (viscount)*

Another thing to pay attention to might be little rock chips that start as fixable stars that can be filled with epoxy like the Novis system windshield repairs. I see from Michael's photos its a big deal to replace a windshield.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (Kcmover)*

I've got mixed feelings about those 'fixable' small cracks in the windshield. I had one fixed about 5 years ago - the result was, well, better than the crack looked before, but it sure wasn't invisible. Besides, if the car is leased, and you have a crack or rock chip 'fixed', you'll have to put a new windshield in it when you bring it back. So, my take on it now is that if I get another rock chip, I'll replace the whole windshield and enjoy the new glass myself...








If the person who installs the windshield in the Phaeton is careful, reads the instructions first, and follows the directions, there should be no problems associated with replacing the windshield.
Michael


----------



## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (PanEuropean)*

thanks very much for the information! The initial impact site appeared very much as you just described, though over the last 3 days a crack has appeared now about 6" long so it wil have to be replaced. I have set up an appointment with the service manager for next week, and while they have been super on that end, he did say it was a simple process and they do sublet the work out to a third party. When I asked him if they knew what was involved he said they have done 3 previous Phaetons before and not had any issues, though I am a little concerned after looking at this that it is not as simple of a process as he described...I asked about removing the headliner etc and he said they don't do that







they just remove it from the outside....I hate to tell them their job, but I will print both files and make sure he has them....especially given all the connexions in the headliner area, and the additional wiring for the k40 which i have up there as well...I am a bit concerned as this is more involved than just replacing the windscreen in and out. I also expressed my concern about getting the right glass, but he said that they order it via my vin so I can't imagine that part going too far astray. Hopefully they are aware of all the elements involved, and do it properly!!!!!








They have done a top notch job from the service angle so far so hopefully they don't take it amiss when I give these details to them- certainly if I were in the position and was not aware of it I would appreciate them but this should be something they are well aware of I hope!!!
Thanks
Ed


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (viscount)*

From all I have read here on the forum, it seems that the Chicago area has pretty good VW service departments, and more 'Phaetons per unit of population' than any other city in the USA. I don't think you have a lot to worry about.
Michael


----------



## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (PanEuropean)*

Hi, the Autobarn in Evanston has been great. And while the new windshield's been installed now, it is quite clear that it was not replaced with the infra-red glass. VW via PCC says that the old part number has been "superceded" by the new, and there is not the designation of "IR" on the glass itself either (and transponders etc will now work). This has really bothered me, as its the special details like this which make the car so endearing to me, and unless Saint Gobain/Securit have changed their labelling system, VW has made the decision not to replace W12 windshield glass with the same as it arrived at from the factory. Diane at PCC has been most helpful, but she's not able to get more information, and the dealership while also helpful has not made any progress so it appears I will have to live with what's there now, but it is a disappointment to me.








Ed.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (viscount)*

*Archival Note -* A related post, which discusses the differences in glass (infrared vs. non-infrared) in some detail, can be found here: Window Glass - confusion about differences between Phaetons.
Michael


----------



## Kcmover (Jul 20, 2005)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (PanEuropean)*

Has anybody had any experience with little rock chips or stars on windshields being filled before they spread. Noticed a little rock chip and was thinking about having the epoxy thing done to it. 
Does it really work to prevent the spread of the chip.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (Kcmover)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Kcmover* »_Has anybody had any experience with little rock chips or stars on windshields being filled before they spread. Noticed a little rock chip and was thinking about having the epoxy thing done to it. Does it really work to prevent the spread of the chip.

Filling the chip with a chemical that is then cured using UV light does work very well to stop the spread of the chip. There are two downsides to having the chip 'repaired', rather than having the windshield replaced:
*1)* The strength of the windshield is compromised somewhat.
*2)* The repaired area is sometimes visible after the repair has been completed.
On the other hand, you save all the grief (and money) associated with replacing the windshield. Personally - if I lived in an area where rock chips were common (i.e. lots of gravel roads), I would probably choose to have the chips repaired, because it would be too much of a PITA to keep on replacing windshields. If I lived in an area where rock chips were very uncommon (i.e. middle of a big city, or anywhere in Europe), I would probably choose to have the glass replaced.
Be aware that if your car is leased, many lease companies will not accept the vehicle back with a 'repaired' rock chip in the glass - they will replace the windshield when the car is turned in, and charge the cost back to you. Also, there are certain 'critical vision areas' of the windshield where you cannot repair a rock chip - the vehicle will fail a subsequent independent safety inspection if there is a flaw in the glass within the 'critical vision area'. Typically, this area is the middle 1/3 of the glass (top to bottom) on the driver side of the vehicle.
Michael


----------



## Kcmover (Jul 20, 2005)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (PanEuropean)*

Since I own the car outright it would be best to just do the fix as over two or three years it could happen again.
I see your point on if the vehicle was leased.


----------



## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Windshield woes--*

Whilst returning from NM in early July, a kindly lady passed me and threw a rock which bruised my windshield.
It was replaced this week. Yesterday the service person called to report that the wrong windshield had been installed. The correct part # was ordered and the box that arrived had this#. Upon completion and inspection, my service guy noted that the windshield was not correct, it didn't have the IR rating (or whatever resists heat and uv).
So, they have to start over. The moral of this is that VW shipped the wrong part and the box was incorrecly labeled.
So, beware if you ever need a windshield on a W12.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Windshield woes-- (Jack Orr)*

Hello Jack:
Thanks for mentioning this. It will be interesting to see what the outcome is. One of the forum members in Chicago had a similar problem about 8 months ago - needed to get an IR windshield replaced on a W12, and was supplied with a non-IR windshield instead.
Let us know how it goes.
Michael


----------



## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Windshield woes-- (Jack Orr)*

Good luck, my bet is you encounter the same obfuscation and lack of knowledge that I did.....In fact I hope I'm wrong but I'll bet you hear the following story: " that is the right part number, the old one has been superceded with the new part number and that's all the system shows when I put your vin in".......apparently the IR windshield's are considerably more expensive and VW made the decision to erase the part number, replace with the standard non-IR windshield and no longer stock the part in NA








I hope I am wrong, but my new 8 month old windshield does not carry a IR designation (and the colors the not the same) but according to VW is the right part for the car








Good luck!
Ed.


----------



## GripperDon (May 9, 2005)

It might be a blessing in disguise. Now your cell phone (not the phaeton's will work better and maybe Radar detectors also. Lots of sunshine down here and the AC does just fine on the V8 without it.


----------



## Franklin2 (Apr 28, 2005)

*Re: (jlindy)*

Had to replace the windshield on my V8 in June. A rock thrown up by a car (MB 500) on the interstate. Crushed the passenger side and had glass everywhere inside the car. No one hurt, however. Total cost with a VW windshield was $820. Took two glass men several hours and it was done at the dealership under the direction of the Phaeton Tech. Did just a super job - cannot tell it was ever replaced. I took along Michael's guide on replacing the windshield that is in the index. The tech already had it, however. 
Larry


----------



## jlindy (Mar 21, 2006)

$820? The quote I just got for the windshield was $525 with the side moldings. They said that was OEM part straight from VW. So many different prices, I'm wondering if they have the right part in my quote.


----------



## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Re: (jlindy)*

The windshield was $845 incl tax. I'm sweating out the ability of getting the correct windshield.


----------



## car_guy (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: (jlindy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jlindy* »_$820? The quote I just got for the windshield was $525 with the side moldings. They said that was OEM part straight from VW. So many different prices, I'm wondering if they have the right part in my quote.

Does $525 include labor? If it does, it sounds like a great price.


----------



## jlindy (Mar 21, 2006)

*Re: (car_guy)*

Yes it does. I don't think it is the price that they would charge if you went through insurance according to my agent. He told me that he would tell them that I am paying it out of my own pocket becuase sometimes they would give better discounts than just billing insurance full retail. Seemed funny that an insurance agent would tell me that but oh well.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Windshield woes-- (Jack Orr)*

Just a follow-up here for future reference: You have to be very careful to make sure that you order the correct windshield for your Phaeton if it has to be replaced. There are quite a few different windshields (as you can see from the parts listing below), and the differences are subtle.
Setting aside the issue of left hand vs. right hand drive cars, there are three different windshields that can be fitted on a Phaeton. They break down as follows:
Non-infrared reflecting
Infrared reflecting
Heated
The heated windshield was never offered in North America. Phaetons shipped to NAR that were equipped with a V8 engine were fitted with non-infrared reflecting windshields. Phaetons shipped to NAR equipped with a W12 engine were fitted with infrared reflecting windshields.
The key to getting the correct windshield - the most important action to take - is to match the production code for your car (found in the sticker at the front of the owner manual, or the sticker in the right rear corner of the spare tire well) with the appropriate windshield as listed in the parts catalog. If you look at the parts catalog illustration below, you will see various production codes listed on the far right side. Here is what they mean:

*4GP* - a tinted windshield with a sun-band across the top of it and a small window to view the VIN number of the car. This is the windshield fitted to NAR V8 Phaetons.
*4GN* - a windshield with an infrared reflecting metal film embedded in it and a small window to view the VIN number of the car. This is the windshield fitted to NAR W12 Phaetons.
All NAR vehicles must, by law, have a VIN that is visible through the front windshield, so you can take for granted that any windshield shipped in North America will have the viewing window. That is not a concern.
The concern is whether you are supplied with the 'tinted' windshield (which is not infrared reflecting) or whether you are supplied with the 'laminated' windshield, which is infrared reflecting. The terminology can be a bit confusing, because all windshields made since the 1980s are laminated. In the context of Phaetons, 'laminated' means that there is an infrared foil layer laminated in the middle of the two layers of glass. 
There are some production codes that were never offered to North America. These include the following:
*4GH* - a tinted windshield with a sun-band across the top of it, but no viewing window for the VIN.
*4GK* - a windshield with an infrared reflecting metal film embedded in it, but no viewing window for the VIN.
*4GG* - an electrically heated windshield with an infrared reflecting metal film embedded in it. 
*4GM* - an electrically heated windshield with an infrared reflecting metal film embedded in it and a small window to view the VIN number of the car.
Windshields don't have VW part numbers marked on them (due to other standards that apply to identification of car glass), and this can make it difficult to visually identify a windshield and associate it with a specific part number, as Jack's dealer discovered. But, there is one rule that you can count on, and it is this: If the windshield is infrared reflecting, it will have the letters *IR* on it. If it does not have the letters IR on it, it is not infrared reflecting, plain and simple.
More information about production codes can be found at this post: Understanding Phaeton Production Codes & Build Stickers. If you have a look at the build sticker for my Phaeton (a NAR W12), you will see that the production code for the windshield - 4GN - is clearly visible at the bottom of the sticker, second line from the bottom, in the middle.
Michael
*Windshield Parts Listing (worldwide, all variations)*








*Windshield Identification on Build Sticker*








*Infrared Windshield (standard on NAR W12)*








*Non-infrared Windshield (standard on NAR V8)*


----------



## bobschneider (Oct 12, 2004)

*Arrrgh!*

This morning I brought my Phaeton to a glass shop to have the windshield replaced. I would have normally gone to the dealer, but my insurance said that I would have to pay in full and get a partial reimbursement which could result in my being much more out of pocket if I didn't go to one of their shops. So I did some checking on a couple of the shops they referred me two, talked to the owner of one near my home, and decided to go with them. They said that they'd be using an OEM VW windshield, since there aren't any aftermarket one for the Phaeton. He also said he did glass work for my VW dealer.
When I brought the car in, the owner of the shop noticed what appeared to be a break at the very bottom of the windshield, right in front of the driver, in addition to the crack and chip that required that I get it replaced. He asked me what that was, and I said I had no idea that it was there or when it happened - it was in a spot that was hidden by the wiper, and he noticed it when I showed him how to put the wipers into service mode.
When I picked the car up, he told me that the area he noticed was actually where there were wires coming out of the windshield







because it was a heated windshield. I said that I didn't know that the windshield was heated, although I did know that there was some heat resistant foil inside the windshield. He had one of his staff bring the car around, I paid my deductible and left. I noticed the check engine light was on, but it's come on a couple of times before, and I wrote that off to coincidence.
I went and ran a couple of errands on my way home. Each time I stopped and locked the car, after a few seconds the alarm started going off. I tried resetting it, but this kept happening. So I left the car unlocked when I went in the store. At least once, the alarm was going when I came back. But it was fine when the motor was running and I was driving








I put the car in my detached garage, unlocked, and went in the house. About an hour later, my daughter came home and told me that my car alarm was going. I went back out, and tried to turn it off, but found that I couldn't - even if I left the car unlocked, it would lock itself after a couple of minutes, and the alarm started up again.
I phoned the dealer (The Autobarn in Evanston IL), and they said to bring it right in, so I did. I showed the service rep what it was doing, and told him it started just after I got the windshield replaced. I also said that I suspected that the glass shop had disconnected the battery when they did my windshield, since the power trunk was acting like someone had closed it manually, which had to have been the glass shop. The service rep said that he suspected that disconnecting the battery screwed up some of the computers, and they had to be resynced. He said it could take them a couple of hours to get it straightened out, so I had my wife come pick me up.
The service rep called me about two hours later, and said that the alarm and check engine light problems were caused by the glass shop having cut the wiring harness right below where the glass shop owner had told me that he'd found wires coming out of the windshield.







This also caused one of the engine computers to stop working This is going to cost me at least $600 to get fixed, and it obviously isn't covered by the warranty on the car.







I'll talk to the glass shop guy Monday to try to get him to reimburse me - he seemed like a decent guy, but why he or his staff thought they could mess with wiring on any car, much less a Phaeton, is beyond me







If that doesn't work, I'll go back to my insurance company. But at a minimum I'm looking at a lot of hassles, even if I can get my money back.
So if you ever need to get your windshield replaced, tell your insurance company to stuff it if they tell you to go anywhere except a VW dealer who knows Phaetons! 

_Modified by bobschneider at 9:31 PM 3-22-2008_


_Modified by bobschneider at 9:32 PM 3-22-2008_


----------



## ron kramer (Apr 16, 2007)

Dealers won't do windshields here but if taken to a shop on the approved insurance list you would have been covered in MA.


----------



## Jim_CT (Jan 25, 2006)

*Re: Arrrgh! (bobschneider)*

Bob - unfortunate and strange story. 
The US cars don't have the heated windshields, not even a W12.


----------



## kgclark75 (Apr 14, 2006)

*Re: Arrrgh! (Jim_CT)*

I've had a cracked windshield since December, but have been reluctant to have it replaced for fear that they'll screw something up. Do we have any idea the wiring harness below the windshield is for?


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Arrrgh! (bobschneider)*

Hi Bob:
I don't think you have a heated windshield. I am pretty sure that VW did not ship any vehicles with heated windshields to North America.
What you likely have, which all of us have, is a heated area at the bottom of the windshield to prevent the wiper blades from freezing in the park position. My guess is that is what accounts for the wires that the glass installer found.
We have a post in the FAQ about windshield replacement, I think, because there are other considerations that are unique to Phaeton windshield replacements.
FWIW, I _always, always, always_ take my car to a VW dealer to get work done, even if I know that they will subcontract the work out. By having the work order written up by the VW dealer, I have all the protection I need from VW of A if anything goes wrong. Not that I would need to contact VW of A, because if a subcontractor screws up a repair (windshield, body work, whatever), the local VW dealer has a heck of a lot more leverage with them than I would as a single one-off customer.
Michael


----------



## Jim_CT (Jan 25, 2006)

*Re: Arrrgh! (PanEuropean)*

Micheal,
I thought this subject had been discussed before, so thanks for consolidating the thread. 
The windshield on my V8 cracked last year and I discussed replacement with the Danbury VW dealer and my insurance company. The installer is a local glass firm, but they do the replacement at the Danbury VW dealer, in their service bay, under VW technician supervision, and VW supplies the part for the installer. I don't have a garage, and it was a sort-of-cold day when the work was complete, so the service writer recommended leaving it one more day so that all the seals were completely cured in the service bay before I drove it. That sounded good to me.
The new windshield is indistinguishable from the original one.
The forum message has been pretty consistent - we owners need to expect the Phaeton takes some extra time to fix, and we need to work with the best service group we can find. 
The insurance company policies don't recognize any differences in suppliers. As a result, Bob's car will cost more to fix.
Jim 



_Modified by Jim_CT at 7:46 AM 3-23-2008_


----------



## remrem (Jan 20, 2008)

*Re: Windshield woes-- (Jack Orr)*

Hello Jack,
Recently, while speaking with one of the very nice young ladies in the PCC department, the subject of W-12 windshield replacement came up. I don't remember how we got on the topic, but I mentioned that I had read on the forum that getting the correct replacement part seemed to be quite a challenge. She seemed very familiar with the issue, and told me that if I ever had to replace my W-12 windshield that it would be replaced with the (non IR) V-8 version. I don't remember the reason for this, but she seemed very sure that the IR version would not be obtainable. So, I hope for your sake, and all W-12 NAR owners that she was mistaken, or that I misunderstood her. Perhaps Michael can clarify if this is the case. If it is, then I guess as one of the other members commented, at least cell phones and radar detectors will work much better


----------



## bobschneider (Oct 12, 2004)

*Re: Windshield woes-- (remrem)*

With regard to the W-12 replacement windshields, I'll check the ID on the glass once I get my car back from the dealer, and report back. I did check to see if there was a tint difference between the new windshield and the other glass in the car when I picked it up from the glass shop yesterday, and didn't see any.
Michael, your explanation regarding the wires coming out of the glass makes sense to me. As does your recommendation to have all work Phaeton done through a VW dealer. The reason for my earlier post (besides to vent







) was to let folks on the board know what can happen if you don't


----------



## bobschneider (Oct 12, 2004)

I got my car back today - it appears to be fine.
I checked the new windshield. While the ID on it is a bit different than in the picture Michael posted above, it does include "IR" in the ID info. It also appears to be the same blueish shade as the other windows. So it appears that I got a replacement IR windshield.


----------



## ptv (Mar 28, 2008)

Have a cracked windshield. Did not before taking it in for service. VW dealer had car for another issue (H2O leak under dash passenger side), called and told me the glass was chipped and beginning to crack at the base. Husband had checked under the hood because of leak before I took it in but saw no problems. When I picked up the car it had a very visible crack at least 12" long. Dealer says it's not covered by warranty and needs to be taken to a glass dealer to get a replacement - for just under$1,000.00! 
Seems strange that it appeared so suddenly while it was with the dealer. Also seems odd that there are so many of us who have had a cracked window. Mine starts at the bottom and curves across parallel to the bottom 6" up and is inching toward the driver's side. Have others cracks followed the same path? How does one get a chip below the windshield wipers?


----------



## mhoepfin (Dec 20, 2007)

This happened on my last car (Q45). I think it can just happen...
Good advice I got was to check with my insurance company, as this is covered under comprehensive coverage. 
In my case, I had a $100 deductible for the windshield replacement.


----------



## Aristoteles (Sep 21, 2007)

If a number of windscreens are cracking below the windscreenwiper in a typical pattern it would suggest a stress fracture rather than an impact fracture. 
The windscreen is itself designed as a stress-bearing component providing additional rigidity to the cabin. If incorrectly installed it will propagate cracks.
Or so the glassman told me as he installed a new shield in my other car.


----------



## ttvick (Aug 15, 2007)

Hi mom!
After inspecting the outside of the windshield glass around the crack yesterday I found it pretty obvious that there had been no impact from the things like rocks from truck wheels or whatever that usually crack or chip windshields.
Dad is convinced that the crack is from a service tech who may have used a screwdriver or some other such item to pry up a gasket to see where the leak was originating. If that's the case he must not have known the structure of the sunroof drain system as outlined in this thread
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2993188
As mom said (ptv) the crack originates at the bottom of the glass, and hearing Aristotles' comment about the windshield being a stress-bearing component makes me think that dad's argument is very possibly correct... Where the screwdriver or whatever cracked the glass and then the crack spread up from the origin because of the pressure on the glass.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (Aristoteles)*

This post may shed some light on the question: How to remove the Plenum Chamber Cover. Note the warning text in the first illustration.
Michael


----------



## mckinnonw (Mar 27, 2007)

*Help Me to Reduce the Cost to Replace Front Windshield in W12 Phaeton*

Bummer!
I have a 20 inch crack in my front Windshield. Still growing. I think I need to have it replaced.
Has anyone doe this and if so, what was your cost?
Did anyone use a non-VW facility to do the repair?
Just to share what I have learned so far, the local VW dealership quoted me $1050 for the windshield itself and I am awaiting a cost on installation and any other necessary parts. Apparantly they use a third party to do the installation, but they supply the part.
Can anyone help me save $$? Could I buy a windshield out of a junked Phaeton (assuming it was not cracked?)


----------



## mhoepfin (Dec 20, 2007)

A cracked windshield should be covered under the "comprehensive" portion of your auto insurance. You should call your agent.


----------



## remrem (Jan 20, 2008)

*Re: Help Me to Reduce the Cost to Replace Front Windshield in W12 Phaeton (mckinnonw)*

Hello William,
Sorry to hear about your windshield. Take a look at these threads:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2208520
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...age=1
Although they sometimes go off on tangents, what is most important to know is that the W12 windshield is different than the one for the V8. The W12 windshield has a metalized film layer which is supposed to reflect the infrared rays to help keep the interior from getting hot. Thus, you will see an "IR" symbol in the identification area of the windshield.
I have read in numerous places on this forum that W12 owners were finding that their cracked windshields were being replaced with the V8 (non IR) glass. Before I bought my W12, I had been reading about this and happened to ask someone in the Phaeton Customer Care department about it, and was told that ALL Phaeton windshield replacements in North America would be with the V8 (non -IR) glass, even if the car was a W12. I don't remember the reason given, but they said that for some reason they couldn't order the W12 IR glass for North America.
However, just a few months ago, another forum member had to replace his W12 windshield, and he says it does in fact have the IR symbol, so it seems that he got the correct part.
The point here is that if it is important to you that you get the exact replacement part, you should be prepared to be very specific with your VW dealer about it. Also, as you will read in the referenced threads above, there are some unique aspects to installing these windshields and that it would probably be wise to only have it replaced by your dealer, preferably one who understands the idiosynchrocies of the job. Even if they sub-contract it out to a glass installer, at least the responsibility will still be theirs if something isn't done properly. 
By the way, if I ever have to replace my windshield, there is a part of me that might prefer the one that goes on the V8 model. The reason for this is because of the metal film layer on the IR windshield - radar detectors, cell phones, and toll road transponders are all negatively affected.
Good luck.



_Modified by remrem at 9:50 AM 7-21-2008_


----------



## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Re: Help Me to Reduce the Cost to Replace Front Windshield in W12 Phaeton (remrem)*

Quite some time ago my IR windshield was replaced with the non-IR type and I was told that the IR is no longer available.
I have noticed zero difference in heat. My toll tag deal was attached to the front license so that is no issue. My radar now has vastly increased range.
I think this whole issue resembles jousting at windmills.


----------



## ndia6439 (Jun 6, 2005)

*Re: Help Me to Reduce the Cost to Replace Front Windshield in W12 Phaeton (mckinnonw)*

It is about just right. My rear window had a minor crack. ( V8 Phaeton ) 
I looked everywhere but there isn't any other way to cut corner.
Anyone would confirm that it is indeed a dealer item.
The rear should be less costly than the front.
I don't think you could find anything at the junkyard. 
Good luck.

Bob


----------



## kgclark75 (Apr 14, 2006)

*Re: Help Me to Reduce the Cost to Replace Front Windshield in W12 Phaeton (ndia6439)*

I had my windshield replaced a few months ago. There was no problem getting the IR version. It was fully covered by my auto insurance.


----------



## pirateat50 (Dec 10, 2005)

*Re: Help Me to Reduce the Cost to Replace Front Windshield in W12 Phaeton (mckinnonw)*

If you have "comprehensive coverage" on your auto insurance then it should cover the breakage. Unless, of course, you tell them you got drunk and smacked it with a ball bat!


----------



## ttvick (Aug 15, 2007)

We had a crack about the same length in our V8. The price to replace was about the same. However, with research, I was able to prove that the crack occurred at the dealership's fault. Make sure that isn't the case... i.e. it actually happened when the car was in your possession not in shop. The Plenum Intake and the Sunroof Drain have both seen dealers who weren't careful cracking the windshield in these cars. It would, in either of those cases, be a crack though, and not an impact fracture/spider crack/whatever you want to call it when a rock hits the windshield.


----------



## Pink Panther (Jul 17, 2006)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (PanEuropean)*

AutoBarn Countryside Did a great job replacing our windshield. They've replaced many rear and front windows. The work is outsourced and done on premises. They had the W8 window in stock, at $845, i believe the W12 window was approx $1250.
W8 window has a Greenish Hue without the IR, W12 has a Bluish Hue with IR. Size's are exactly the same, I personally think if you have the W12, go with the W8 window for your Tollway Pass and radar will work.
I think my new window is better than original! Oh that Aquapel is the Greatest! FREE When you buy Wipers. So not like cheap rainex.
Im going to talk them into doing my back window too, Hate how rain doesn't run off that window, I can't seee


----------



## remrem (Jan 20, 2008)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (Pink Panther)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Pink Panther* »_ Oh that Aquapel is the Greatest! FREE When you buy Wipers. So not like cheap rainex.

From what I've read, Aquapel like Rain-X doesn't work well unless you are at speeds above 40 mph, has that been your experience? If so, do you use the wipers at low speeds, and are the wipers affected in any way?


----------



## Stoneybroke (Aug 11, 2008)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (remrem)*

I notice that there is some concern about using insurance company approved shops for windshield replacement. Normally, in the insurance industry, these so called "Service First" shops must guarantee their work in order to keep that coveted, very lucrative designation. I had a State Farm approved provider screw up a partial repaint on a Subaru SVX. When my agent called them, they repainted the whole car without a quibble. My point is that if the windshield replacement is not satisfactory, and the shop balks-speak to your agent. The agents have tremendous leverage here.


----------



## Pink Panther (Jul 17, 2006)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (remrem)*

I have Rainx experience and Aquapel experience.
With Aquapel it lasts long time without 'worn areas' needing reapplication, it seems smoother and the wipers seem to wipe it away Clear. It definitely did not dry out my wipers. I think it improved them. I actually enjoyed turning them on.
Rainx: seems smooth at first, after weeks of differentiating temperature's and weather it dissipates, becomes spotty and when rain hits it doesn't always run off like when first applied. After reapplications it seems to have build up. Aquapel acted like it was always freshly put on. It has been on my window for 9 months now. Speed or no speed ( "no speed" for Phaeton?! ), i have a clear clean view. More speed just meant for less wiper use.
The biggest most important difference: Rainx would blur my vision when streetlights hit it as it wiped. Sometimes just wiping the window, there would be a few seconds of 'unable to see'. That really bothered me, that is the main reason i opted to try Aquapel. And my decision was an excellent one, for there was NO moment of blindness with Aquapel. I would definitely reapply and even Pay for it if need be. (that's saying Alot from me! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif )
Rainx has saved me many times in the past, I even drove 150 miles once with no wipers through sleet, slushed muddy trucker slung ice, passing people. But there's an improved product now, I'll be slippen (pun) with Aquapel for awhile now.


----------



## remrem (Jan 20, 2008)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (Pink Panther)*

Well, I received the Aquapel in the mail today. (By the way, I bought it on Ebay and the price was great and the shipping very fast). Anyway, the instructions say not to apply it in temperatures above 90 degrees F and/or in high humidity environments. So, I guess I'll be waiting a few more months before I can give it a try


----------



## Pink Panther (Jul 17, 2006)

*Re: Anyone have experience with cracked winshields? (remrem)*

When inquiring about the Aquepel treatment at the dealership, I was told the charge was mostly due to the Cleaning of the window with a Clay Bar. For that was labor intensive and Most Important that the window be very clean before application.
That is also why i just buy new wipers and have them install them cause they included the complete Aquapel treatment; Clay Bar Cleaning and Applying.
I probably should have mentioned that above.








Im sure you'll do a fine job. Enjoy!


----------



## toktok (Dec 18, 2009)

*Re: cracked windshield. (ren7295)*

If your windshield has a large crack, the best option is to replace the entire windshield instead of attempting a repair kit. Repairs are meant for smaller stars and chunks, but larger cracks are uncontrollable. The most important thing to do is prevent the crack from getting larger. Avoid temperature change. Do not wash your car; the cold water from the hose on a hot or warm windshield causes the crack to spread. Try to leave the car in a protected garage as much as possible to avoid cold or hot weather from expanding the crack. windshieldcalifornia


----------



## Trinbagoo (Oct 11, 2009)

*Re: cracked windshield. (toktok)*

I agree. Ask your local VW dealer in the US for the auto glass dealer they use.
I recently had a chip in my windshield and came upon a auto glass dealer that serviced local VW dealers. Cost of repair $60USD bucks...which is a lot less than dealer cost or a total replacement.
...McK


----------



## sjglaser (Nov 18, 2009)

Coincidentally, yesterday while driving on I-26 a car passed me and hurled a rock at my driver's side window, leaving a small (1-2 mm) yet very noticeable nick on the glass. 
I am not sure most member's auto policies cover this, but mine (USAA) has a no-deductible glass coverage. I called USAA immediately and they put me in touch with their sub for glass. I made an appointment, and surprisingly the tech told me that they had no experience in repairing a side window because they are always replaced. 
The tech was afraid that if a crack developed the window would require replacement.. At that point I said that if the window would need replacement the dealer must do it. I'm sure most would agree that it is best for a trained Phaeton tech removing panels on a door vs a glass tech...USAA had no problem with that request.
Long story short, the repair was performed and it left an almost imperceptible dot on the glass. If it eventually fails, USAA said they would have no problem pay for the dealer to replace. My logic is that I rather avoid having someone removing panels to replace a window, unless absolutely necessary, and live with an very slight mark on the window.
Anyone ever had a side glass replaced?


----------



## GS340 (Oct 26, 2007)

*Re: (sjglaser)*

I've had the window up/down mechanism replace, not sure what it's called. One day heard this grinding sound and the next thing I hear air rushing in the car because the window fell down inside the door. Wouldn't go up.
Dealer repair, no issues...


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (GS340)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GS340* »_ ...not sure what it's called...

The mechanism that raises and lowers the side windows is called a window regulator. It is a pantograph-type assembly. If the glass is damaged, it is not necessary to replace the regulator, and conversely, if the regulator is damaged, it is not necessary to replace the glass.
Sometimes the glass comes loose from the regulator assembly. This can be a result of the fastener that attaches the regulator to the metal bracket at the bottom of the window coming loose (uncommon), or a result of the window pane slipping out of the rubber 'grip' that holds the window pane within the metal bracket (more common). 
If you are a really serious DIY type, you can repair either of the two above problems yourself, however, it is pretty tricky work and requires a LOT of dis-assembly. Generally, it's best to take the car to the VW dealer to have this type of problem solved.
All vehicles (VW or not) use the same general design for side window operation, so, if your VW technician has repaired a side window on any other vehicle during their career (a pretty sure bet), they will know how to repair the side windows on the Phaeton.
Michael


----------



## JulianBenjamin (Jun 22, 2007)

*re: re-post instructions*

Hi Michael,

Would you mind reposting the instructions for replacing the windshield? I'm going to be taking my car in to VW to get it replaced, and I'd like to have a copy just in case they don't have one.

Thanks.


----------



## Fratrick (Jan 23, 2009)

jlindy said:


> $820? The quote I just got for the windshield was $525 with the side moldings. They said that was OEM part straight from VW. So many different prices, I'm wondering if they have the right part in my quote.


Where did you get this done for $525?


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Photos re-hosted.

Michael


----------



## Victor R (Jan 7, 2010)

*Windshield Damage*

Aargh!! 

While driving behind a truck in a construction zone on an interstate highway, a rock (not pebble) was thrown against my windshield. It sounded like a shot!

At first, I didn't see anything as the damage is high on the passenger side, but when I got out of the car, I was confronted by this:










The damage is quite extensive:










The W12's have specialized glass:










I was in touch with my insurance; they subcontract all glass damage work to *Safelight Auto Glass*.
My policy allows me to get OEM replacement parts, and, with a little squawking, I could have this done at the bodyshop at the dealership that does my Phaeton service. Safelite, though, assures me that they can order the correct windshield through a VW dealership based on my VIN, and claim that they can do the install without any problems.

What do you all think? Would you trust Safelite to work on the car or would you insist on taking it to the dealership, which also has the additional disadvantage of being a 30 minute drive farther away?

Victor


----------



## conmoto (Jul 8, 2009)

I just had this conversation with a VW service manager. Installing the windshield is not a complicated job for a professional. How do they know this? Because they ruined two windshields trying to replace wiper motors. Oops.


----------



## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

Difficult decision! My experience with the bodyshop one dealer used was bad, but at another good. The first one was apparently unable to refit the bumper correctly, and eventually sprayed it the wrong colour. The second one did a good job in correcting the botch the first one made. You might be better off with someone who replaces windshields for a living so long as there's nothing too complicated about the Phaeton (hahaha).


----------



## conmoto (Jul 8, 2009)

I


----------



## AndrewO (Aug 19, 2012)

*In the Same Boat*

On Tuesday, a pickup truck was kind enough to toss a rock chip that caused a small chip in the windshield where it meets the driver's side pillar. I figured I could live with this as it wasn't obstructing my view. On Wednesday, after the car had sat out in the sun, the chip turned into a 7 inch crack.

I have no deductible glass coverage and when I called my agent I was given the option of using the insurance company's glass contractor, which would be paid directly or having the work done by the dealer and then be reimbursed upon submission of the paid receipt.

After calling the dealer I was told that their estimate to replace the windshield is $1472.00! $750 for the OEM glass, $261.12 for a rain sensor (if the existing sensor cannot be removed without damage) and $ 266 for two A Pillar trim pieces, plus $195 labor. The work is subcontracted out, but the dealer tells me they have experience with replacing Phaeton windshields.

I recall reading a thread where Michael indicated that the repair also requires removal of the plenum cover and the headliner and use of a special lubricant when reinstalling the rain sensor.

Andrew


----------



## Victor R (Jan 7, 2010)

Andrew,

I had forgotten about the rain sensor. That is very helpful.

In searching the forum, I found *this* thread.

Michael, any chance of re-uploading the document you mention in that thread?

Victor


----------



## Victor R (Jan 7, 2010)

I found another thread on cracked windshields here.

It sure sounds like I should take it to the dealer...

As an aside, I do understand why Michael often merges threads. It can be quite frustrating to find information scattered across several threads about the same problem.

Victor


----------



## Jxander (Aug 5, 2008)

invisiblewave said:


> Difficult decision! My experience with the bodyshop one dealer used was bad, but at another good. The first one was apparently unable to refit the bumper correctly, and eventually sprayed it the wrong colour. The second one did a good job in correcting the botch the first one made. You might be better off with someone who replaces windshields for a living so long as there's nothing too complicated about the Phaeton (hahaha).


My windshield was broken by my VW tech during reinstall of plastic surround after transmission replacement. I wasn't happy with their solution which was to call my insurance company and have them authorize and pay for a new windshield. I thought the dealership should have payed for it. Nevertheless my first goal was to have it replaced correctly with no leaks and for it not to be on my dime. 

They found a VW windshield and it was installed properly by a glass company but at the dealership. The VW dealer was a little reluctant to do the job, so Invisiblewave may have a point to use someone that does automotive glass work every day.

Jim X


----------



## Victor R (Jan 7, 2010)

Got my estimate from the dealer:

Windshield (3D1845011AR): $995
Adhesive Kit (D004660M2): $68.50
RT Windshield spacer (443845631A): $2.30
LT Windshield spacer (443845631A): $2.30
*Subtotal Parts: 1,068.10*

Labor (3 hours): $144.00
Subtotal: 1,212.10

Tax: $72.73
*Grand Total: $1,284.83*

The part for the windshield seems correct, best as I can tell from posts #39 and 40 *here*, as the "R" suffix is used, though the quote says "AR" and I don't see that listed anywhere. confused

Labor seems much less than others have posted.

Thoughts? (Outside of "holy smokes - almost $1300 for a windshield"!!!)

Victor


----------



## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

That's actually less than I would have guessed it would be.


----------



## JulianBenjamin (Jun 22, 2007)

Victor, that's about how much I was charged through the dealer for a windshield replacement. Insurance paid about $1000 of that amount, and I was responsible for the rest. 

I didn't trust Safelite to do it.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi Victor:

I'm not exactly sure what the attachment was that I appended to the thread you referenced - unfortunately, when attachments go missing, they don't leave a reference behind that tells me what I originally put there. I'll see what I can find (starting from scratch) about windshield replacement procedures.

In the meantime, here are some links to other discussions here in the forum about glass replacement:

Window Glass - confusion about differences between Phaetons
Difference in my Phaeton Glass Windows Colour
How to remove the Plenum Chamber Cover (pictures) (part of the disassembly process required to replace the windshield)

Michael


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Victor R said:


> In searching the forum, I found *this* thread.
> 
> Michael, any chance of re-uploading the document you mention in that thread?


Hi Victor:

Attached are the complete installation instructions for a new Phaeton windshield. I suspect that this was what I uploaded to the post you referenced.

Michael


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Michael, thanks for that doc. I have a chip on the windscreen and was considering replacing it, but after reading that I think I'll see if they can injection-repair it first!

Chris


----------



## Victor R (Jan 7, 2010)

Thank you very much, Michael.

Victor


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

*Don't try this at home*

Well, my windscreen chip was apparently too large to successfully carry out a resin injection repair so I was somewhat steam-rollered into booking an on-site replacement.

In UK, most insurance policies include windscreen replacement cover with no loss of no-claims bonus, so it was politic to just allow the claim to take its course as an upgrade from repair, rather than delaying to have it done at my regular dealership which is 140 miles away. There was a policy excess of £75 to pay, but this is better than £440 for the glass plus £200 fitting then 20% VAT.

I printed off Michael's useful VWA document and some comments from this thread and asked for the Tech's views in as polite a way as possible. He was very knowledgeable, was aware of all the points (risk of scuttle/plenum cover cracking, marks on headlining, special treatment of rain sensor lube) and was quite cheerful about the questions. I must admit I would not necessarily feel at ease if a client was asking me in-depth questions about my professional competence! He went round the car before starting and noted any paint stonechips etc, and we signed them off.

The rain sensor operation was also tested and signed off, before and after. I discovered that although the wiper works regardless, the auto sensor only operates when the doors are all closed...

The correct windscreen was supplied, with metal IR layer, VIN window, blue tint etc. This did not seem to present any problems as it was VW-sourced and checked against the VIN.

VW instruct to drop the headliner at the front and remove the A pillar trims. However this was not thought necessary, and in fact did not seem to make any difference, these not attracting any dirt or marks during the process.

All appears to have been done well, despite the on-site environment being a far cry from a vast clean heated dealer workshop. The repair truck has a canopy that can be put over the car if it's raining.

For general interest, here are some photos.

Chris


*Some Roof Electronics disconnected*










*Roof Electronics brackets - inside*










*Side Trim is a push-fit*










*Breaking the seal*










*Cheese wire used to split the old silicone rubber. Note that this process cracked the old glass in several places*










*Roof Electronics brackets - outside*










*New Screen is the correct VW part number, Made in Czechoslovakia *










*Plug for wiper defrost heater comes pre-attached to screen*










*Old Screen Off*










*New Screen On*


----------



## EnglishPhaeton (Dec 6, 2010)

Fantastic post as usual Chris!!

My screen will be replaced after the more in depth requirements!! It is good to see that the mobile repairers did such a competent job.

Stu


----------



## Auditurnedphaeton (Oct 14, 2012)

*Informative*

This has been a very enlightening thread. I just purchased a Phaeton and brought it to my local dealership for service. As a part of the service, I asked them to fix the leak into the cabin (passenger side). They cleaned out all the debris in the drains. However, the next morning after the service (Sunday) I have a 4" crack in the windshield, at the driver side corner. The crack has no apparent rock chip, so I am guessing the VW technician caused it during removal of the plenum cover to clean out the drains. Sigh. Looks like I will have to call the dealership this morning and see what they have to say about it.

In the meantime, I have a glass repair tech coming out to look at the crack to see if it is repairable. More to come on this one.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi Chris:

Thanks very much for taking the time to take all the photos and write the process up - that is a great post!

Michael


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Wow - just noticed that the post above was my 19,999th post - guess that makes this one my 20,000th post here in the forum 

Michael


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

And the clock keeps running. So here it is for posterity, because after your next post it won't be there any more!


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi Chris:

I just noticed your post above today (still catching up on the forum after being away for so long) - thanks for that 'archival snip'. 

Apropos of cracked windshields, just for archival purposes, here is a link to another discussion about windshield replacement:

Windshield replacement required.

Michael


----------

