# #ULTRA Compared: 2011 Audi TT RS vs. 1985 Audi Sport quattro



## [email protected] (Apr 9, 2004)

If we want to start a conversation about lightweight automotive production at Audi then there is no better beginning point than the venerable Sport quattro. Perhaps better known for its more visibly noticeable short wheelbase, the Sport quattro went so much further by utilizing nearly every exotic material and inventive design available to Reagan-era Audi engineers. To take a closer look, Audi of America granted us rare access to one of these very rare cars kept in its historic collection. And, to measure both how ahead of their time those engineers were while also pinpointing how far mass-produced Audis have come, we’ve brought along a German-spec Audi TT RS, also borrowed from Audi of America, as a comparison.

* Full Story *


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## djdub (Dec 30, 2001)

Great read. One quick question though, was the RS3 not considered for this review because there's no chance of that car coming to North America?

Having owned a Mk1 TT (225), I bet this car is leaps and bounds better. Wish I could get all the fun "little" cars but it's hard to pull off the TT with kids and luggage. 

(Audi, I guess if your reading this, it would be great to bring the RS3 to NA in a few years. That would be a great transition from the Golf R.)


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## [email protected] (Dec 12, 2001)

We actually did the "leg work" for this article a while back, before there even was an RS3. George has (for obvious reasons) been saving this one for the right time.

The commentary among many of us who drove the car that weekend was that the TT RS was like a "baby R8." They're incredible cars. They have extremely high limits, and are just faster than the sum of their parts would seem to suggest.

The Sport quattro was pretty incredible too, but in a different way. It was definitely something from a different era, and the little quirks of an extremely limited production, largely handbuilt car were evident all over the place. (You could see the seam in the roof where the kevlar composite panel was joined to the steel one, etc...)

-Tim


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## [email protected] (Apr 9, 2004)

RS 3 is still being considered for America.

RS 3 has carbon front fenders but I believe the TT RS is the better subject because it has been more extensively lightened. Also, we worked with what we had.


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## djdub (Dec 30, 2001)

Yeah, the differences you guys described in the article verse the two cars is just amazing. Technology has progressed so much during this timeframe. Obviously the Sport Quattro is more raw. Whereas the TT RS is sharper. I bet it would have been that much better with 19inch wheels as well. 

This is where you must have different cars in the stable, old and new. :thumbup:

One day, my garage will be able to afford both. 

Great stuff guys...Thanks again.


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## DrDomm (Feb 16, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> ...RS 3 has carbon front fenders but I believe the TT RS is the better subject because it has been more extensively lightened.


George, can you talk a little about how the TT RS has been extensively lightened? Apparently the 5cyl engine is significantly heavier than the 2.0T in the TTS, and even the 3.2L V6. Some people claim the RS is quite nose heavy. Do you have any numbers regarding weight distribution compared to the TTS?


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## [email protected] (Apr 9, 2004)

DrDomm said:


> George, can you talk a little about how the TT RS has been extensively lightened? Apparently the 5cyl engine is significantly heavier than the 2.0T in the TTS, and even the 3.2L V6. Some people claim the RS is quite nose heavy. Do you have any numbers regarding weight distribution compared to the TTS?


In regards to the lightening, the RS 3 is a steel chassis with carbon fiber fenders. The TT is an aluminum Audi Space Frame with just a steel subframe in the rear of the chassis. The 2.5T is undoubtedly heavier than the 2.0T but the TT's aluminum chassis and panels make it the more aggressive (and more costly) of the two.

I'll see what I can get in regards to the weight distribution of the two.


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## DrDomm (Feb 16, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> In regards to the lightening, the RS 3 is a steel chassis with carbon fiber fenders. The TT is an aluminum Audi Space Frame with just a steel subframe in the rear of the chassis. The 2.5T is undoubtedly heavier than the 2.0T but the TT's aluminum chassis and panels make it the more aggressive (and more costly) of the two.
> 
> I'll see what I can get in regards to the weight distribution of the two.


I think you misunderstood my question. I'm aware that all TT's have the aluminum ASF. I was wondering what separated the TT RS from other TT's in terms of "extensive lightening" despite the heavier engine.

So my question is comparing the weight distribution of the TT RS with the TTS.


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

There is no additional lightening to the TTRS. I guess maybe you could consider the Euro-spec racing seats an effort to lighten the car but that's it. The TTRS body is identical to all of the other TTs except for the front and rear bumper details, no additional composite or aluminum construction.

I think I've seen the RS tips the scales around 3250lbs, pretty close to a 3.2 and similar weight distribution.

John


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## fjork_duf (Jul 13, 2001)

[email protected] said:


> RS 3 is still being considered for America.
> 
> RS 3 has carbon front fenders but I believe the TT RS is the better subject because it has been more extensively lightened. Also, we worked with what we had.


Awesome news. I'd like to hear some official announcement soon. I need to know when I have to start selling cars to get one of these.

I do definitely like the looks and size of the TTRS more, but it's harder to justify for family and day to day use. Argh... In any case I need this 5-cyl turbo bad. I'm sold.


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## joshsmith (Apr 17, 2011)

Awesome read guys!! You're too lucky to have gotten to spend that amount of time with the 2 cars!

Made me more excited for when my TTRS arrives! (same colour combo too except I have the matte aluminium mirros).  

I think I went through and saved just about every single photo of the 2 cars. :laugh:

I know first hand (because I've driven the TTRS many times), how good that car is, however the Sport Quattro I would KILL to drive and own as well!! 

Any idea how much I could pick one up for? I expect it would be something over-the-top as it is a classic and it pretty much shaped the way for all Audi's and probably all sports cars. I have looked everywhere and there are none for sale in Australia, I did however find one for sale in the UK (although it's not exactly stock) for like 200,000 Euros??? :banghead: http://www.classiccarsforsale.co.uk/classic-car-page.php/carno/134222 

The acceleration times you guys achieved in the Sport Quattro astonished me as the car is STILL that fast!! 

HOW FAST WAS IT WHEN IT WAS BUILT?!?!? :O !!


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## [email protected] (Dec 12, 2001)

It will likely be extremely hard to ever find a Sport quattro for sale, though not impossible. They only ever made 214 of them, for homologation purposes, and not all of those were ever for sale to customers. (Onky 164 of them were customer cars.) They sold for the 1980s equivalent of $150,000 us dollars or so when new, and they're not getting any cheaper. it is common for them to sell for well in to the territory you mentioned in your example. Basically, youre looking for one of less than 200 cars that are still around. 

The acceleration times and such as mentioned in the article are from when the car ws new, as we didn't attach any timing gear to it. 

Glad you liked the article!

Tim


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## [email protected] (Apr 9, 2004)

Hi Josh, your TT RS sounds sweet. I'm in love with that car. 

As for the Sport quattros, I've never seen one for sale for less than six figures and they're usually listed on specialty sites.

Quickly eyeballing this one it appears that it was repainted (doubt it was Rohrl's or Piech's) black. The interior also appears to have been done in black leather too and I'm pretty sure that wasn't done at the factory. It does look factory quality though which is most impressive. I hate the aftermarket wheels but for those who did brake upgrades there weren't many choices. If interested in that one I'd ask the owner if the original Ronal wheels and AP brakes come with the car.

BTW, our acceleration numbers were from AutoCar and done at the time. We didn't think it'd be proper to do full-on testing with the sole Sport quattro Audi of America owns.


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## joshsmith (Apr 17, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> Hi Josh, your TT RS sounds sweet. I'm in love with that car.
> 
> As for the Sport quattros, I've never seen one for sale for less than six figures and they're usually listed on specialty sites.
> 
> ...


Thanks George - too excited to wait anymore for the TTRS! Over here in Aus we get the Recaro's as standard too  

Yeah it wouldn't suprise me that the car has been repainted (what kind of paint could last 25+ years!!) It's definitely tempting to get my hands on one but I suspect I'm going to have to add it to my wishlist for the next few years given the hole the TTRS put in my wallet  - worth every penny I may add!  

And yeah that makes sense - you'd not want to break it! Still - an impressive car from then which undoubtably would give a lot of cars a run for their money by todays standards! 

How does the Sport Quattro feel? Obviously it wouldn't be anything like the TTRS - perhaps more "rough and ready". Handles well?? I'm not one who is a big fan of classic cars - but that is the only classic I really want!


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## rconn14 (Sep 7, 2006)

Beautiful pair of cars... one gripe... with all the talk about the shortened wheelbase how is there not a single photo of the side profile of the Sport quattro?


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## [email protected] (Dec 12, 2001)

How about this one?










From the Photo Gallery linked at the end of the article.



-Tim


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## rconn14 (Sep 7, 2006)

ohhhhhhhh okay, thanks sugar.


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## JettaTSW16 (Dec 15, 1999)

Hi,

I sent George a PM regarding that Sport Quattro. Per my PM, if it is the car I believe it is, it actually had a bit of work done to it by a German Tuning firm at the request of it's 1st owner, and produces quite a bit more than it's stock rated HP. 

Can someone at Fourtitude please get in touch with him to read / review my PM?  

Here are some recent Sport photos I have taken myself for those that want a few more shots. 










http://www.neuwerks.com/newsite/index.php?option=com_gallery2&Itemid=43&g2_itemId=16308


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## [email protected] (Apr 9, 2004)

Hey, I responded to your PM the day I got it. You can also respond via my email at george (at) fourtitude.com. Thanks!


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