# APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! !



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

Just got the car back and only had 50 miles behind the wheel 
My quick first impression is how smooth and linear the power is and how very very deceiving , things just come up real fast LOL 
Its night and day compared how it was when i first received it .
I have a new scanner and trying to figure how to set it up







but when i do I will post the dyno sheet but for now it made 350 hp / 320ish TQ on 93 pump.
Just wanted to share and im going to drive it all day tomorrow and do some logs and ill be updating this post soon . 
I will also be dynoing the car later this month to compare and see because the weather was 100-106 during the time the car was @APR .

Just want to thank everyone @ APR but espec Steven & Brett for all there hard work and keeping there word to make the car right http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif . 
Now i Just need to push Brett to finish the race file for another 50 ponies







. 
Just like APR tuning style with the 1.8T stage 3 and + kits this 93 tune is no where near the edge and should see even more power improvements in the future as time goes on IMO.











_Modified by rracerguy717 at 9:03 PM 9-1-2007_


_Modified by rracerguy717 at 11:14 PM 9-2-2007_


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## csih (Aug 27, 2006)

350whp?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (csih)*


_Quote, originally posted by *csih* »_350whp?
 
Raw numbers are 328WHP with 93oct in the tank dyno in 100-106 degree weather 110 % humidty this is UNCORRECTED #'s .







Bob.G


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## ruso (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

Awesome numbers! So... if you don't mind me asking... what was the problem with it?


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## sactown_a3 (Nov 15, 2006)

Can't wait. I already ordered my kit.


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## kdagher (May 27, 2006)

*Re: (ruso)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ruso* »_Awesome numbers! So... if you don't mind me asking... what was the problem with it?

X2


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (ruso)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ruso* »_Awesome numbers! So... if you don't mind me asking... what was the problem with it?
 
It was a combo of a few different things like the n-75 along with a software glitch that this file would not run correctly on my car .








Bob.G


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## ruso (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

Was something wrong with your N75 itself or was it software related to the N75? Sorry if I'm asking too specific of questions.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (ruso)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ruso* »_Was something wrong with your N75 itself or was it software related to the N75? .









Both


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## brandon0221 (Mar 7, 2007)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

I want dyno graphs please!


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## tdipower4me (Dec 1, 2005)

congrats oh and VIDEOS SOON!!!!!!


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*

Excellent! Glad to see you're in good form! 
320tq seems quite a bit higher than their advertised 288?? Wonder why they advertised so much lower...
Can't wait to see logs and graphs... I'm actually half excited now about this kit. I'd kind of lost interest. Hopefully H2Sport gets back to me early next week!
JJ


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_Excellent! Glad to see you're in good form! 
320tq seems quite a bit higher than their advertised 288?? Wonder why they advertised so much lower...

 
Those TQ numbers are about right 288WTQ versus 320ish crank/hub TQ.







Bob.G


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## SLYMK6 (Apr 22, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*

racer is going to ruin someones day when they try to race him.


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*

So the 350/320 was crank? I would have expected that to be whp.
JJ


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_So the 350/320 was crank? I would have expected that to be whp.
JJ

That is about right for the boost level on 93 octane with that turbo. The total airflow of the 2871r is really only rated for about 400hp.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_So the 350/320 was crank? I would have expected that to be whp.
JJ
 
Honestly those " numbers " don't tell the whole story , just like APR 1.8T stage 3 and + kits , more important is the area under the curve . 
I can tell you from past experience with these APR BT kits ,when put against something else with higher " numbers ' you just drive away from them .Do a search on "You tube " there plenty video showing this LOL








After a nice 2hr drive this morning i can tell you this car is FAST and the drivablity is OEM perfect not a hick cup , big http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif .
Whats nice you can lug the car in 6th gear under 2k and it drives perfect and no down shifting needed.
I didn't have time to do a ton of logs , i just did a few to see where the CF was which gives me a good idea how aggressive the tune is and to my surprise APR has this thing stepped up a bit , compared to what my initial first impression and comparing APR history of being very very conservative also from owning there stage 3 + kits .
Im going to enjoy the day and the rest holiday weekend with the car and will be gathering logs during the week and ill post them up for everyone , ill also post up the dyno sheets at the same time .
Another big thing is people that are thinking about a front mount inter-cooler this one works great ! ! ! ! . 
I was monitoring IAT and never saw over 30C with it just idle the engine for 10 minutes straight then when doing WOT logs i consistently saw between 21c and 25c







.
But to be fair and subjective the weather here is very mild and logs would be better on a more seasonable weather .The car has seen 30 degree temperature swing from APR to me in the course of 2 days







. 
The bottom line is so far everything Ive experienced since the car been back feels and looks great .







Bob.G



_Modified by rracerguy717 at 10:35 AM 9-2-2007_


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

very nice http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## x9t (Sep 19, 2005)

Sweet man.. congrats.
Jt


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## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: (MFZERO)*

Please make this kit for $1000 as well as DSG compatible.


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## [email protected] (Feb 9, 2001)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*

Glad its back to you Bob. Enjoy and watch out for smokey http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by [email protected] at 8:10 AM 9-2-2007_


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## magilson (Apr 18, 2005)

*Re: (Arin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Arin* »_Please make this kit for $1000 as well as DSG compatible.


http://www.goapr.com/VW/products/financing.html
and ditch the auto


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## SLYMK6 (Apr 22, 2005)

*Re: (magilson)*


_Quote, originally posted by *magilson* »_and ditch the auto
















you just had to open that can of worms.


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## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: (SLY MK5)*

Race a VF RSS car at a track, and get it on video! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: (magilson)*


_Quote, originally posted by *magilson* »_
http://www.goapr.com/VW/products/financing.html
and ditch the auto









If I had it my way, I would have 7 clutches.


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## ItalianGLI (Nov 14, 2002)

*Re: (magilson)*


_Quote, originally posted by *magilson* »_
http://www.goapr.com/VW/products/financing.html
and ditch the auto









Yeah, because DSG has a torque converter








Oh, and don't forget they don't use any clutches either


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## SchnellFowVay (May 20, 2001)

*Re: (ItalianGLI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ItalianGLI* »_
Yeah, because DSG has a torque converter









A DSG is still a fully automatic transmission. The fact that it doens't have a torque converter makes it no less lame that the car shifts for you...
Also, the APR on that financing is 23%. You can do better with many credit cards....


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## SLYMK6 (Apr 22, 2005)

Please please don't turn this into manual versus automatic debating in here this is about the APR Stg 3 and I'm sure racer will be putting good stuff in this thread. Lets not junk it up or even get it locked


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## stockmotor. (Aug 17, 2007)

350hp - 15% = 298whp 
320tq - 15% = 272wtq
Didn't APR stg 3+ kit with the smaller 28rs turbo and smaller 1.8t motor make 340-350whp and equal amount of wtq.








Also the smaller 1.8t motor with the same turbo made 396hp
What's the hold up


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

*Re: (stockmotor.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *stockmotor.* »_350hp - 15% = 298whp 
320tq - 15% = 272wtq
Didn't APR stg 3+ kit with the smaller 28rs turbo and smaller 1.8t motor make 340-350whp and equal amount of wtq.








Also the smaller 1.8t motor with the same turbo made 396hp
What's the hold up
























I believe the stage III+ for the 225 TT does use the 71R, but I could be mistaken.


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

*Re: (ItalianGLI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ItalianGLI* »_
Yeah, because DSG has a torque converter










dictionary.com:
automatic transmission
–noun
an automotive transmission requiring either very little or no manual shifting of gears.
Also called automatic, automatic drive.
Again this is not meant to be a continuation of the debate by definition the DSG is an automatic transmission. No where in the definition I have ever seen does it say that it must have a torque converter.
The DSG is great, but its not for everyone, let it rest.


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## brandon0221 (Mar 7, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
I will post the dyno sheet but 

_Modified by rracerguy717 at 9:03 PM 9-1-2007_


Lets see. I would love see this. Oh BTW from what I know of they both use the 71R turbo. The Stage 3+ has internals that is the difference. (Correct me if im wrong)


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## [email protected] (Jul 30, 2007)

*Re: (stockmotor.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *stockmotor.* »_350hp - 15% = 298whp 
320tq - 15% = 272wtq
Didn't APR stg 3+ kit with the smaller 28rs turbo and smaller 1.8t motor make 340-350whp and equal amount of wtq.








Also the smaller 1.8t motor with the same turbo made 396hp
What's the hold up
























The dyno graph and numbers we provided to Bob G. were taken at the wheels (technically the hubs with our current dyno) on his vehicle with the only corrections being to normalize to a standard day with respect to the ambient temperature, humidity and pressure as is typical of all SAE corrected dyno runs. That is where the 350hp / 320lb-ft numbers come from that Bob provided in his earlier posts. There were no corrections added for any losses through the transaxle. 
You have to remember to compare apples to apples and put the dyno data in the proper context or else the values can all be very confusing.




_Modified by [email protected] at 5:25 PM 9-2-2007_


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## [email protected] (Feb 9, 2001)

*Re: (SchnellFowVay)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SchnellFowVay* »_
A DSG is still a fully automatic transmission. The fact that it doens't have a torque converter makes it no less lame that the car shifts for you...
Also, the APR on that financing is 23%. You can do better with many credit cards....


Just to set the record straight... its 23% only if you do not pay it off in 1 year. If you do its 0% http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## brandon0221 (Mar 7, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

I understand I just wanted to see the dyno printout


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## BIGNICKSGTIS420 (Apr 16, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

very nice woo woo!


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## stockmotor. (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
You have to remember to compare apples to apples and put the dyno data in the proper context or else the values can all be very confusing.


Apples to apples would be 350 vs. 396whp and 320 vs. 378wtq correct?


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## stockmotor. (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
The DSG is great, but its not for everyone, let it rest.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=SJL15n5P9BU


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

*Re: (stockmotor.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *stockmotor.* »_
http://youtube.com/watch?v=SJL15n5P9BU


I think they mixed up their own ad campaign.. he sounds more like a CVT


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## brandon0221 (Mar 7, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
I think they mixed up their own ad campaign.. he sounds more like a CVT









LOL yes that is a CVT for sure no shift change. DSG definitely has shift change but it is so quick.


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## [email protected] (Jul 30, 2007)

*Re: (stockmotor.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *stockmotor.* »_
Apples to apples would be 350 vs. 396whp and 320 vs. 378wtq correct?

No, this is still incorrect. The numbers you are quoting for the MkI Audi TT 225 with APR Stage III+ are crankshaft numbers from the dyno graph on the APR website. So, let's say that we had wheel horsepower and torque numbers for the MkV GLI/GTI with APR Stage III (which we do...let's use the numbers from Bob's car) and we were to assume that the drivetrain loss was 10%. Then we would end up with the following equation...
HPCrank - HPCrank*%loss = HPWheels
>>HPCrank - HPCrank*0.10 = HPWheels
>>HPCrank * (1 - 0.10) = HPWheels
>>HPCrank = HPWheels / (1 - 0.10)
>>HPCrank = HPWheels / (0.90)
Therefore, this leaves us with 388 HP and 355 lb-ft at the crankshaft. I believe these are very respectable numbers. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## kpiskin (Apr 6, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Will there need to be anything different for the Eos? I don't think there is an APR exhaust for the Eos yet, but the FMIC just came out.


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## brandon0221 (Mar 7, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

DYNO Graphs!


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## [email protected] (Jul 30, 2007)

*Re: (brandon0221)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brandon0221* »_DYNO Graphs!

I am not in the office today or tomorrow (labor day holiday) but I will get with Keith and we will post up soon...unless Bob beats us to it.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
unless Bob beats us to it.










Just got home from enjoying the car most of the day







. Bob.G
Here the Dyno graph


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## stockmotor. (Aug 17, 2007)

_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
No, this is still incorrect. The numbers you are quoting for the MkI Audi TT 225 with APR Stage III+ are crankshaft numbers from the dyno graph on the APR website. So, let's say that we had *wheel horsepower* and torque numbers for the MkV GLI/GTI with APR Stage III (which we do...let's use the numbers from Bob's car) and we were to assume that the drivetrain loss was 10%. Then we would end up with the following equation...
HPCrank - HPCrank*%loss = HPWheels
>>HPCrank - HPCrank*0.10 = HPWheels
>>HPCrank * (1 - 0.10) = HPWheels
>>HPCrank = HPWheels / (1 - 0.10)
>>HPCrank = HPWheels / (0.90)
Therefore, this leaves us with 388 HP and 355 lb-ft at the crankshaft. I believe these are very respectable numbers. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


MKI TT: 396 crank - 10% = 359whp
MKV GTI: 328 whp + 10% = 361 crankHP
1.8 = 359 whp / 396 crank
2.0 = 328 whp / 359 crank

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Raw numbers are *328WHP* with 93oct in the tank dyno in 100-106 degree weather 110 % humidty this is UNCORRECTED #'s .







Bob.G


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## stockmotor. (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: (stockmotor.)*

According to this
http://www.race-cars.net/calcu....html
The car should do [email protected], assuming it weights 3,500 with the driver. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## [email protected] (Jul 30, 2007)

*Re: (stockmotor.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *stockmotor.* »_
MKI TT: 396 crank - 10% = 359whp
MKV GTI: 328 whp + 10% = 361 crankHP
1.8 = 359 whp / 396 crank
2.0 = 328 whp / 359 crank


I don't exactly agree with your math. Let me explain why...
#1: The numbers on Bob G.'s graph are wheel horsepower numbers that were SAE corrected to a standard ambient condition (temperature, pressure, and humidity). Without this correction, the guy who runs his car at 40 degrees F in Denver has no way to compare his performance against a car with the same setup at 95 degrees F in Florida. Even though this correction cannot account for all variables given today's advanced engine management systems, it's about as good as you can get without resorting to climate controlled dyno cells with identical dyno setups. 

#2. I don't know where you got the 359 crank and 361 crank numbers you are posting for the 2.0T and I also don't know why you listed two different numbers...maybe it was just a typo. Either way, if you take a wheel horsepower number and multiply it by 1.10 to get the crank horsepower, this is the wrong approach. The reason is, you are essentially adding 10% of the wheel number to the wheel horsepower to get the crank number. This is wrong. What you should be doing is assuming that 10% of the crank number was lost to the wheels and therefore you would actually divide by 0.90 like my equation shows. Remember, percentages are relative. In this case, you really want to stay relative to the crank. Do the math for yourself, 350*1.10 is not equal to 350/0.90. 
The dyno graph that Bob posted is the proper context for this discussion. These numbers, as stated earlier, represent the wheel horsepower/torque correct to standard atmospheric conditions per the SAE formulas. I don't mind discussing crank numbers but I just want to be sure that everyone understands the graph that was provided.
The numbers are 350hp and 320lb-ft at the wheels with SAE corrections for ambient conditions. If you want to assume a 10% drivetrain loss for the MkV, the numbers would be 388.9 hp and 355.6 lb-ft of torque
I am not knocking you at all and I hope you don't take it that way. I am just stating the facts as I was there during the actual dyno run and I am trying to provide you with the factual data. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

_Modified by [email protected] at 12:40 AM 9-3-2007_


_Modified by [email protected] at 12:42 AM 9-3-2007_


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

Much better... those numbers made much more sense being whp. Looks (and I bet it feels) great. 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
JJ


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CDN_MKV* »_Much better... those numbers made much more sense being whp. Looks (and I bet it feels) great. 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
JJ
 
Its ALOT of fun to drive puts a







spinning BOTH wheels in 3rd gear at will at any speed with just your right foot LOL . 
What makes this kit shine IMO is how smoooth it is , I tryed everything to see if i could get it to buck even as low as 1500 rpm in 5th gear and 6th not ONE HIC- CUP . 
It has SOO much more TQ then the 1.8T kits it makes it so much easier to drive in any gear no down shifting needed when climbing hills . 
Another thing i noticed after i got done beating it for the first part of the day LOL is that this thing seems like the gas mileage is ALOT better then when I was just stage 2 when driving normal







.
I suspect because of the very low end tq and not needed to down shift along with little throttle input needed to maintain your speed.







Bob.G


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## CDN_MKV (Feb 19, 2005)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Its ALOT of fun to drive puts a







spinning BOTH wheels in 3rd gear at will at any speed with just your right foot LOL . 
What makes this kit shine IMO is how smoooth it is , I tryed everything to see if i could get it to buck even as low as 1500 rpm in 5th gear and 6th not ONE HIC- CUP . 
It has SOO much more TQ then the 1.8T kits it makes it so much easier to drive in any gear no down shifting needed when climbing hills . 
Another thing i noticed after i got done beating it for the first part of the day LOL is that this thing seems like the gas mileage is ALOT better then when I was just stage 2 when driving normal







.
I suspect because of the very low end tq and not needed to down shift along with little throttle input needed to maintain your speed.







Bob.G



One thing I love about the 2.0T is the extra torque compared to the 1.8T... at low speeds around town it makes such a huge differencem, I don't downshift half as much. 
As a 1.8T stage 3 owner, I was impressed at how it drove and loved how the power came on. It was completely daily driveable which was important since it's my only car. With the exta tq of the 2.0T I can see this kit being even more daily driveable... 
Anyway...first hand experience like this is great. Like you, I have a lot of respect for what these guys do, and the level of service they've shown you. 
JJ


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## TheBox (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: (CDN_MKV)*

Are these kits shipping out yet?


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## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
#1: The numbers on Bob G.'s graph are wheel horsepower numbers that were SAE corrected to a standard ambient condition (temperature, pressure, and humidity). 


Why does the dyno sheet say driveline losses not included?


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## [email protected] (Jul 30, 2007)

*Re: (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_
Why does the dyno sheet say driveline losses not included?

The dyno sheet Bob posted does not have any driveline losses added to get back to crankshaft numbers. This was a wheel horsepower and wheel torque dyno plot SAE corrected to standard ambient conditions. We did not add any 10% or 12% or any other percentage for losses through the transaxle.


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## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
The dyno sheet Bob posted does not have any driveline losses added to get back to crankshaft numbers. This was a wheel horsepower and wheel torque dyno plot SAE corrected to standard ambient conditions. We did not add any 10% or 12% or any other percentage for losses through the transaxle. 

then why on the first page did he say it made 288wtq opposed to 320 crank? Also how much boost is the car running.


_Modified by t3t41.8tgti at 1:31 PM 9-3-2007_


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_
Also how much boost is the car running.

_Modified by t3t41.8tgti at 1:31 PM 9-3-2007_

im seeing a spike 21 , goes to 20 then tapers a bit to 19 ish

_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_
then why on the first page did he say it made 288wtq opposed to 320 crank? 

_Modified by t3t41.8tgti at 1:31 PM 9-3-2007_
 
I can't sand bag a little ? LOL







. Bob.G


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## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

just wondering you still on the stock clutch Bob?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_just wondering you still on the stock clutch Bob?
 
Spec stage 3+ with there matching 14 lb steel flywheel with peuguin diff.







Bob.G


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## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Spec stage 3+ with there matching 14 lb steel flywheel with peuguin diff.







Bob.G
 does it chatter much with the ac on at idle, the aluminum flywheel is driving me crazy.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_ does it chatter much with the ac on at idle, the aluminum flywheel is driving me crazy.
 
Very very Little ONLY with the A/C , thou I used a little heavy blend of gear oil . 
Its quiet otherwise ,Spec did a great job with this IMO .








Bob.G


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## SLYMK6 (Apr 22, 2005)

Where do you get the spec stuff for MKV? I'm having trouble finding a site that has it ?
EDIT: NM: Damn Racer you got money.







Don't think I could afford a Stage 3+ for $1k.


_Modified by SLY MK5 at 8:16 PM 9-3-2007_


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## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

I may just have to switch to the steel flywheel from the aluminum one. I just did the VF mounts and now I hear the chatter even more inside the car with the ac on, and I switched to redline MTL which is a little bit thicker


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (SLY MK5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SLY MK5* »_Where do you get the spec stuff for MKV? I'm having trouble finding a site that has it ?
_Modified by SLY MK5 at 8:16 PM 9-3-2007_
 
Just IM jeremy @ Spec here on the tex , he will take good care of you.







Bob.G


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## AndorGLI (Jul 29, 2007)

how did u get the turbo so quick. i emailed apr and they said its not out to the public yet until ealty ocotber. i want to get one but everyoen i talk to says something differet


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## syntrix (Aug 20, 2000)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
The dyno sheet Bob posted does not have any driveline losses added to get back to crankshaft numbers. This was a wheel horsepower and wheel torque dyno plot SAE corrected to standard ambient conditions. We did not add any 10% or 12% or any other percentage for losses through the transaxle. 

*Still running that Dynapack?*


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## [email protected] (Feb 9, 2001)

*Re: (syntrix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syntrix* »_
*Still running that Dynapack?*

Yes and in fact just upgraded it to the Evolution Upgrade. This completely upgrades the entire system. New software and can now handle 30% more torque. The dynapack is a awsome unit for calibration.


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## [email protected] (Apr 25, 2007)

Glad everything worked out http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

great to hear your car works now







dyno and track please


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## five0vw (May 21, 2004)

*Re: (prodigymb)*

Bob, glad it all came together for ya! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Too bad APR has forgotten about me. Sleepers performance FTW!


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## Craige-O (Mar 1, 2002)

*Re: (five0vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *five0vw* »_Bob, glad it all came together for ya! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Too bad APR has forgotten about me. Sleepers performance FTW! 

I am very courious to see what Sleepers will do... They as of late said they will not work on the 2.0T...


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (APR M1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *APR M1* »_Congrats Bob. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
The car is strong and super smooth. 
Trap speed should be 110+mph

 
Thanks Sam








BTW that was a chipped EVO-9







Bob.G


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Thanks Sam









BTW that was a chipped EVO-9







Bob.G

i ran a stock evo9MR from a 30roll and i beat it with only stg2. more vids bob ! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## APR M1 (Feb 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_
i ran a stock evo9MR from a 30roll and i beat it with only stg2. more vids bob ! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

My EVO ran [email protected], and the Jetta clearly pulled away from me.


----------



## SLYMK6 (Apr 22, 2005)

Hard to tell from the video or I'm just deaf, does it sound any different racer? More vids to come? I'm hooked.


----------



## five0vw (May 21, 2004)

*Re: (Craige-O)*



Craige-O said:


> _Modified by five0vw at 10:39 AM 9-5-2007_
> 
> 
> _Modified by five0vw at 8:39 PM 9-6-2007_


----------



## SLYMK6 (Apr 22, 2005)

*Re: (five0vw)*

What is Sleeper? Quick link?


----------



## five0vw (May 21, 2004)

*Re: (SLY MK5)*

sleepers performance. They are a company local to me that has been doing custom VR-ts along with C2 motorsports and producing 450+whp on all their applications. They did a aba 8v 2.0t for my friend and will be pushing over 300hp shortly once the tuning is done. Great people, but I still hope that APR is in my future.


_Modified by five0vw at 8:38 PM 9-6-2007_


----------



## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

*Re: (five0vw)*

man pretty sweet for a jetta. try going from a lower mph


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (YoungMedic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *YoungMedic* »_man pretty sweet for a jetta. try going from a lower mph









We where just comparing pulling power and going slower would have made his AWD shine and i would have been at a great disadvantage to me







LOL. 
1-2-3 gear pulls like a beast on this car and if i where to REALLY want to race the drag radials would have to be thrown on LOL


----------



## [email protected] (Jun 19, 2006)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

Bob,
I am glad that you are enjoying the car. Seems your having lots of fun! I can't wait for my A3 to have it!


----------



## [email protected] (Feb 9, 2001)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (APR M1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *APR M1* »_Congrats Bob. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
The car is strong and super smooth. 
Trap speed should be 110+mph


Awesome video! Not too shabby for a Dub!


----------



## sxedub (Jul 27, 2005)

nice video, wish i could afford this


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Bob,
I am glad that you are enjoying the car. Seems your having lots of fun! 
 
Im enjoying the heck out of the power with very smooth OEM driveablity and reliability .The gas mileage is stellar so far , better than when I was stage 2 chipped , when your driving it normal







.
APR did a great job engineering and tuning this kit http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
can't wait for a race gas program







Bob.G


----------



## AndorGLI (Jul 29, 2007)

didn't u dyno 416whp??? do u have a buil motor such as pistons and piston rods


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Im enjoying the heck out of the power with very smooth OEM driveablity and reliability .The gas mileage is stellar so far , better than when I was stage 2 chipped , when your driving it normal







.
APR did a great job engineering and tuning this kit http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
can't wait for a race gas program







Bob.G

umm more action videos pls !


----------



## AndorGLI (Jul 29, 2007)

*Re: (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_
umm more action videos pls !

X2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (prodigymb)*

* UPDATE ! ! ! !* 
Here is what good calibration and tuning you receive with the APR stage 3
















This is the miles i went on a tank full , remember its really, really, really, hard to not to drive it like you stole it LOL 389 miles not bad
















Here show that there NO stored fault codes








Just a shot showing that its running OEM A/F which is rich 









I just love driving this car LOL







Bob.G



_Modified by rracerguy717 at 7:12 PM 9-12-2007_


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

came from langhorne. we got 2 vws there before.....i live about 15 minutes away from that dealership


----------



## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: (prodigymb)*

Any dynos yet?? How about track times!?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (sasha18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sasha18T* »_Any dynos yet?? How about track times!?

Dyno hopefully saturday and track next week .







Bob.G


----------



## sasha18T (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Dyno hopefully saturday and track next week .







Bob.G

Awesome! Thanks!


----------



## five0vw (May 21, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Dyno hopefully saturday and track next week .







Bob.G

Like I said, give me a call. I want to go hit up the track with you. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## kdagher (May 27, 2006)

Whats the 0.8% and 0.7 % ? where can i read it, in my vag com ?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (kdagher)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kdagher* »_Whats the 0.8% and 0.7 % ? where can i read it, in my vag com ?
 
That the fuel trims , measuring block # 032.







Bob.G


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

umm paging racer bob to the nearest 1/4 mile !


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_umm paging racer bob to the nearest 1/4 mile !

yeah i know it was a very busy day at work today ,actually its been busy all week. I was planning to get there tonight if i got out of work early enough . 
I really need to fix the wheel hop before i tear something out of the bottom of the car thou LOL.







Bob.G


_Modified by rracerguy717 at 5:35 PM 9-19-2007_


----------



## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

Dude, Alt+Print Screen. Go to paint, CTRL v.


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
yeah i know it was a very busy day at work today , I was planning to get there tonight if i got out of work early enough . 
I really need to fix the wheel hop before i tear something out of the bottom of the car thou LOL.







Bob.G

yeah wheel hop is the evil. owned my throwout bearing - after about 15 passes - warranty ftw








on that note.....do you have any of the vf mounts? i got their pendulum and it made a very nice differnce, that is until i put 19s on and now i get hop again....not nearly as bad as stock.


----------



## BumbleBeeJBG (Apr 30, 2006)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_









Stage III and he still has the dealer plate bracket
























(yes I'm jealous bitch, go to hell)


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (BumbleBeeJBG)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BumbleBeeJBG* »_
Stage III and he still has the dealer plate bracket
























(yes I'm jealous bitch, go to hell)

That's the view most will see , but it will be hard to read the dealer name from actual distance LOL







Bob.G


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

* 3K miles update * 
The car has been a pleasure to drive Ive taken a few trips with flawless reliability . I Drove down early morning to H20 for just Saturday BBQ and returned home.
Its just fun to drive espec when something with power rolls up and see nothing but my smoke @ WOT the mid-range power just doesn't stop pulling LOL







Bob.G


_Modified by rracerguy717 at 7:51 AM 10-1-2007_


----------



## SLYMK6 (Apr 22, 2005)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

any new videos? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (APR M1)*

lets see a dyno sheet, already.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_lets see a dyno sheet, already.
 
Im gonna try to get there soon







Bob.G


----------



## 06MK5GTI (Jul 30, 2006)

Glad to hear you are happy with it. I just ordered mine with Keith at H20 on saturday. Cant wait til it is in.


----------



## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: (06MK5GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *06MK5GTI* »_Glad to hear you are happy with it. I just ordered mine with Keith at H20 on saturday. Cant wait til it is in.

Were you the person I talked to in front of the forget twintercooler setup?


----------



## 06MK5GTI (Jul 30, 2006)

Yeah that was me.


----------



## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: (06MK5GTI)*

Good deal man... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Im gonna try to get there soon







Bob.G
 shouldnt take so long in a fast car


----------



## APR M1 (Feb 21, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (prodigymb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *prodigymb* »_ shouldnt take so long in a fast car









It's not the car, it's the driver.


----------



## prodigymb (Mar 9, 2004)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (APR M1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *APR M1* »_
It's not the car, it's the driver. 
 10.95


----------



## stockmotor. (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_lets see a dyno sheet, already.

x2 
this car has been back for over two months now. What's the hold up!!!


----------



## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (stockmotor.)*

Idiots


----------



## stockmotor. (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (Arin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Arin* »_Idiots 









Who is?








9/1/2007

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Just got the car back and only had 50 miles behind the wheel 










9/12/2007

_Quote, originally posted by *sasha18T* »_Any dynos yet?? How about track times!?

9/13/2007

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Dyno hopefully saturday and track next week .







Bob.G

10/1/2007

_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_lets see a dyno sheet, already.

10/1/2207

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Im gonna try to get there soon







Bob.G

11/5/2007

_Quote, originally posted by *Arin* »_Idiots 



I'd like to see an independent dyno


----------



## YoungMedic (Mar 22, 2006)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (stockmotor.)*

i saw him out-mph a 110+ EVO in a heavier car. thats pretty good to me. 
dyno's are ghey


----------



## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (stockmotor.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *stockmotor.* »_
I'd like to see an independent dyno









APR probally told him he can't dyno the car or post numbers, it wouldn't be the first time they did that either.


----------



## Runin2Rich4FSi (Sep 18, 2007)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_
APR probally told him he can't dyno the car or post numbers, it wouldn't be the first time they did that either.

APR has no problems with my car going on the dyno after the instal.


----------



## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_
APR probally told him he can't dyno the car or post numbers, it wouldn't be the first time they did that either.

Why would they do that? Or MAYBE it would be fair if kit is still under development.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 14, 2005)

Officially from APR:
Please dyno away!
I can say this as I already know what its going to make!


----------



## AndorGLI (Jul 29, 2007)

any 1/4 mile times?


----------



## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
[Just got the car back and only had 50 miles behind the wheel 
My quick first impression is how *smooth and linear *the power is and how very very deceiving , things just come up real fast LOL 
Its night and day compared how it was when i first received it .

Just wanted to share and im going to drive it all day tomorrow and do some logs and ill be updating this post soon . 
Just want to thank everyone @ APR but espec Steven & Brett *for all there hard work and keeping there word to make the car right * http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif . 
Now i Just need to push Brett to finish the race file for another 50 ponies







. 
Just like APR tuning style with the 1.8T stage 3 and + kits this 93 tune is no where near the edge and should see even more power improvements in the future as time goes on IMO.



_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
After a nice 2hr drive this morning i can tell you this car is FAST and the drivablity is OEM perfect not a hick cup , big http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif .
Whats nice you can lug the car in 6th gear under 2k and it drives perfect and no down shifting needed.



_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Just got home from enjoying the car most of the day







. Bob.G



_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Its ALOT of fun to drive puts a







spinning BOTH wheels in 3rd gear at will at any speed with just your right foot LOL . 
*What makes this kit shine IMO is how smoooth it is , I tryed everything to see if i could get it to buck even as low as 1500 rpm in 5th gear and 6th not ONE HIC- CUP . *
It has SOO much more TQ then the 1.8T kits it makes it so much easier to drive in any gear no down shifting needed when climbing hills . 
Another thing i noticed after i got done beating it for the first part of the day LOL is that this thing seems like the gas mileage is ALOT better then when I was just stage 2 when driving normal







.
I suspect because of the very low end tq and not needed to down shift along with little throttle input needed to maintain your speed.







Bob.G



_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Im enjoying the heck out of the power with very smooth OEM driveablity and reliability .The gas mileage is stellar so far , better than when I was stage 2 chipped , when your driving it normal







.
*APR did a great job engineering and tuning this kit *http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
can't wait for a race gas program







Bob.G


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ * UPDATE ! ! ! !* 
Here is what good calibration and tuning you receive with the APR stage 3









This is the miles i went on a tank full , remember its really, really, really, hard to not to drive it like you stole it LOL 389 miles not bad








Here show that there NO stored fault codes

* I just love driving this car LOL*







Bob.G



_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_* 3K miles update * 
The car has been a pleasure to drive Ive taken a few trips with flawless reliability . I Drove down early morning to H20 for just Saturday BBQ and returned home.
*Its just fun to drive *espec when something with power rolls up and see nothing but my smoke @ *WOT the mid-range power just doesn't stop pulling * LOL







Bob.G


I'm glad they finally fixed your car and you are enjoying it.
I want a stage 3 kit soooo bad, but it's a lot of money for me.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (The_Critic)*

QUOTE=The_Critic]
I'm glad they finally fixed your car and you are enjoying it.
I want a stage 3 kit soooo bad, but it's a lot of money for me.







[/QUOTE]
I was soo happy they fixed the drivablity , mis-fires ,multiple CEL , limp mode, but its still very low on power soon after i got it back with 1/4 mile time , then I finally had time to get it dynoed in the spring with poor results which supported my poor trap speed in the 1/4 mile .







Bob.G
Here the link with dyno sheets
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3761751




_Modified by rracerguy717 at 6:07 PM 5-24-2008_


----------



## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_I was soo happy they fixed the drivablity , mis-fires ,multiple CEL , limp mode, but its still very low on power soon after i got it back with 1/4 mile time , then I finally had time to get it dynoed in the spring with poor results which supported my poor trap speed in the 1/4 mile .







Bob.G



_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
After a nice 2hr drive this morning i can tell you *this car is FAST and the drivablity is OEM perfect not a hick cup * , big http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif .
Whats nice you can lug the car in 6th gear under 2k and *it drives perfect* and no down shifting needed.


So let me get this straight. You are very happy with the drivblity and the power, but you are not happy with the dyno sheet?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (The_Critic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The_Critic* »_
So let me get this straight. You are very happy with the drivblity and the power, but you are not happy with the dyno sheet?








 The biggest thing is the TQ is very low 260-280 , torque makes HP.







Bob.G


----------



## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ The biggest thing is the TQ is very low 260-280 , torque makes HP.







Bob.G


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
After a nice 2hr drive this morning i can tell you *this car is FAST and the drivablity is OEM perfect not a hick cup * , big http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif .
Whats nice you can lug the car in 6th gear under 2k and *it drives perfect* and no down shifting needed.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't TQ what makes a car feel fast? If Im understanding this correctly, the car was fast when you got it back







how did it lose TQ between the time you got it back and the Dyno?


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (The_Critic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The_Critic* »_
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't TQ what makes a car feel fast? If Im understanding this correctly, the car was fast when you got it back







how did it lose TQ between the time you got it back and the Dyno?
 
Anything would have felt fast LOL it was simple horrible when I received it from APR and secondly they had it for about month and the summer was ending here . 
It FELT better but the results ( 1/4 mile times and dyno ) proved it was not making the power . 
There plenty of other 05-06 cars with the same poor results take a look around .







Bob.G


----------



## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*

Is there more than 1 racerguy717 here? the one I searched is very happy with his stage 3








I was going to apply for a loan to buy a stage 3, now I'm having second thoughts!
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...01704

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Two weeks ago there was a newer *06/07 STI *that this guy tryed to pull on me he had his foot to the floor board







after *I modulated the throttle to stop the crazy wheel spin I pull ATLEAST 10-15 cars * , I looked in my rear view mirror and his face was priceless and he ended up distance image in the end LOL <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/zeroforum_graphics/biggrinsanta.gif" BORDER="0"> Bob.G


http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...95187

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
I wish you luck putting together parts for your future power goals








But if anyone is looking for a TURN KEY solution like my self with the highest quality of engineered parts you wont find a more complete kit. The kit performs well and drives flawless and you don't have to worry about long term reliability . 
The APR Stage 3 kit is something your wife could drive with no issues on a daily basis and not even know its been modded unless she puts the pedal down LOL . Then you could jump in it and go to Track day event and beat the [email protected] out of it and its just begging for more LOL all this without worrying about engine failure caused by your kit . <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/zeroforum_graphics/grinsanta.gif" BORDER="0"> Bob.G
p.s.
Go into the 1.8T section and ask MANY of the guys that went the DIY 
BT kit and ask them if they had to do it all over again what route they WISH they went ??. 
You will see in the end the APR kit is a bargain and the cream rises to the top










[/QUOTE]

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Just like the APR stage 3 kit its all in the smooth delivery LOL







Bob.G 
p.s. there wont be disappointments with this kit it rocks ! ! ! ! 


http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...24202

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_


rracerguy717 said:


> Clean bill of health with 8K miles on my APR stage 3 kit here .






rracerguy717 said:


> _Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
> Here is the proof below and 2500 mile on this APR stage 3 kit , 1100 miles of it straight shot ( 16hrs ) and the car ran flawless
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (The_Critic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The_Critic* »_Is there more than 1 racerguy717 here? the one I searched is very happy with his stage 3










HAHA
Ok APR Troll LOL . 
Too bad you disguise your self instead of using your REAL S/N or have all have them been banned??







I know who you are pretty sad 
The dyno and the track results speak for them self .
Ill be going back to that same dyno and same track when the car is re-tuned and we will compare the results then.







Bob.G


----------



## mamock116 (Nov 8, 2004)

so which one is faster a mk4 GTI with stage III+ or a mk5 with stage III


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (mamock116)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mamock116* »_so which one is faster a mk4 GTI with stage III+ or a mk5 with stage III

Comparing both kits on MY CARS??
IMO the stage 3+ hands down , even better the stage 3 for the TT kit is the strongest of all the kits .







Bob.G
If I had to do it all over I would go with PAG parts Hardware kit with either Tapp or Uni tune/ fueling kits this is both for the 1.8T and the 2L TFSI engine .







Bob.G


----------



## mamock116 (Nov 8, 2004)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

i guess the extra weight of the mk5 makes a difference then


----------



## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
HAHA
Ok APR Troll LOL . 
Too bad you disguise your self instead of using your REAL S/N or have all have them been banned??







I know who you are pretty sad 
The dyno and the track results speak for them self .
Ill be going back to that same dyno and same track when the car is re-tuned and we will compare the results then.







Bob.G


A person with a legitimate question is a "Troll"? I expected a better answer to what made a car change from fast and powerful to slow and underpowered.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (The_Critic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The_Critic* »_
A person with a legitimate question is a "Troll"? I expected a better answer to what made a car change from fast and powerful to slow and underpowered.
 
Trolll








You can come back and discuss the power gains when the car is re-tuned correctly this time LOL


----------



## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Trolll








You can come back and discuss the power gains when the car is re-tuned correctly this time LOL









I will be waiting


----------



## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

lol i just read this whole thread and i laughed so much my stomach hurts... this rracerguy717 really needs a punch in the face, he either got paid to trash APR or is plain old stupid. Man first you are raving half of this thread how much torque car has and that you can spin both wheels in 3rd gear at ANY speed...and now you say that it lacks torque? What the hell...


----------



## TheBox (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: (mescaline)*

Sorry bob but your being pretty damn ridiculous. After APR was willing to look at your car and even come pick it up you still were complaining. 
your making yourself look like a fool, Quit while your ahead.


----------



## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (TheBox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheBox* »_Sorry bob but your being pretty damn ridiculous. After APR was willing to look at your car and even come pick it up you still were complaining. 
your making yourself look like a fool, Quit while your ahead.

Sorry JR when you walk in my shoes with these guys and pay 5K give them 3 trys at fixing things already and then they continue to say to me " nothing is wrong with my car" ??and I prove the poor results with dyno and 1/4 trap speeds .
Sorry the only one that going to look foolish is APR in the end.
Remember im not the only one having these problem with 05-6 cars and deff not the only one that's got screwed by APR in the past with project cars some that spent 15-20K , one that the customer hasn't driven because it wont even run . 
APR should spend more timing tuning and satisfying customers and less money on there marketing budget LOL







Bob.G


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## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: APR Stage 3 is Back ! ! ! ! (The_Critic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The_Critic* »_
I expected a better answer to what made a car change from fast and powerful to slow and underpowered.

My question is about your car and not someone else. Whenever you are ready, please feel free to answer my question. 
On a side note, please refrain from using this







. You should not be using any of the following,





















http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif





















http://****************.com/smile/emgift.gif 
This is what you should use,














http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

Seriously, how does a car change from fast and powerful to slow and underpowered?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_Seriously, how does a car change from fast and powerful to slow and underpowered?

Now a WESTCOAST APR troll


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## TheBox (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Now a WESTCOAST APR troll









Awesome bob Make sure you include pictures of your exploded engine after they sink a gob of timing into it


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (TheBox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheBox* »_
Awesome bob Make sure you include pictures of your exploded engine after they sink a gob of timing into it

JR they dont need to that APR already did with poor success pulling 5-7 degrees .
Its not how much you request , but how much you actually retain in the end







Bob.G


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## Arin (Jun 27, 2002)

*FV-QR*

I thought you said you wanted timing advanced because you had 0 pull?


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (Arin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Arin* »_I thought you said you wanted timing advanced because you had 0 pull?
 
Yes I want more OVERALL timing .
The zero pull is the other 06 stage 3 car from DE .
His car has a completely different tune than my car when i compare our logs .
But APR keeps telling me there " nothing wrong with my car "LOL







Bob.G


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## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Yes I want more OVERALL timing .
The zero pull is the other 06 stage 3 car from DE .
His car has a completely different tune than my car when i compare our logs .
But APR keeps telling me there " nothing wrong with my car "LOL







Bob.G

But you said yourself that nothing was wrong with your car at the begining of this thread man, did you even read your OWN messages here? Was it even you posting that messages? I just can't believe that some sane person can contradict their self this much. Do you realise that you are making a complete fool of yourself in here? And you paid 5k for it? Didn't you get refunded like half of that money or something and didn't they fix your car 3 times already? and once even came with the truck and picked up your car? 
The thing is that your big mouth got you nowhere now, you are SCARED to contact APR now because of your big mouth (no surprise, if i was working for APR..dude, i would sacrifice over-nighting in jail just to punch you in the face ONCE)... so you have nowhere to turn to.
You shouldn't even be allowed to have a car dude.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (mescaline)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mescaline* »_
The thing is that your big mouth got you nowhere now, you are SCARED to contact APR now because of your big mouth (no surprise, if i was working for APR..dude, i would sacrifice over-nighting in jail just to punch you in the face ONCE)... so you have nowhere to turn to.
You shouldn't even be allowed to have a car dude.

Scared?? hahaha 
I wouldn't let APR look under the hood LOL 

No need to talk to APR , they have no solutions only excuses









Know back on topic otherwise stay out of my thread !!!!!!!!!







Bob.G


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## zemun2 (Sep 2, 2004)

Seriously Bob,
How come your car went from Powerful to not?


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## TheBox (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: (zemun2)*

what if it is just your fuel filter that is clogged


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (zemun2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zemun2* »_Seriously Bob,
How come your car went from Powerful to not?
 
It FELT powerful at first from seat of pants and its very easy to get tricked because of the very low gear ratio ( 1-3 gear ) in the 6 speed. When I went to E-town soon after (about 2 weeks ) after I got it back from the APR the 1/4 mile trap speed was still 103-104mph that's the exact thing it was at first delver at Waterfest.This was then confirmed with the poor dyno results in the spring. 
Basically APR made it FEEL faster by mostly changing waste-gate duty cycle that's about it .







Bob.G


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: (TheBox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheBox* »_what if it is just your fuel filter that is clogged

I p/u one yesterday and going to change it this week when i get a chance BUT im not seeing any low fuel codes .APR also never put a intank pump in my car .


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## TheBox (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: (rracerguy717)*

The intank pump does not flow more from what i remember. it just will not burn out from the high demand. the stock intank will work fine. I have the stock one in one mine now.
you will not necessarily throw a code. the filter fixed JC's car and he was not getting any codes


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## The_Critic (Mar 8, 2008)

*Re: (TheBox)*

Lol @ the clown avoiding the question


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## Kid Hobo (Sep 4, 2005)

*Re: (TheBox) (The_Critic)*








http://****************.com/default/zero2/lock5.gif


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## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Scared?? hahaha 
I wouldn't let APR look under the hood LOL 

No need to talk to APR , they have no solutions only excuses









Know back on topic otherwise stay out of my thread !!!!!!!!!







Bob.G


This is very much on topic my friend. People read your thread and laugh...a lot. This thread will be a reference to every future problems you gonna have with any VAG car and ask questions on this forum. You made such a fool of yourself it's not even funny....


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (mescaline)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mescaline* »_
This thread will be a reference to every future problems you gonna have with any VAG car and ask questions on this forum. You made such a fool of yourself it's not even funny....
 
Then the people reading this should know APR,s software is pulling up words 5-7 degrees on boost onset is normal?? 
That's called poor tuning and actually pretty irresponsible for a BT software meant for a kit that's suppose to be plug and play . 
Then when I compare my logs to another 06 APR stage 3 car which should have identical tune its not even close and im talking what the software is requesting ( timing and boost ) plus his car is pulling ZERO timing and preforming just as poorly as mine ( they tell him there nothing wrong with his car also ) , that's not what i called constant tuning from car to car and APR keeps saying " nothing is wrong with my car " thats pretty funny LOL







Bob.G


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## mamock116 (Nov 8, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (rracerguy717)*

this is getting interesting


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## TheBox (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (mamock116)*

I agree with the critic whats with the








you should have something like this




























http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_ 
Then the people reading this should know APR,s software is pulling up words 5-7 degrees on boost onset is normal?? 
That's called poor tuning and actually pretty irresponsible for a BT software meant for a kit that's suppose to be plug and play . 



Everytime I read your posts you sound dumber and dumber Bob. The software doesn't pull timing, rather the ecu pulls timing based upon 20+ variables from various sensors. This can include excessive knock, to rich a/f, to lean a/f, to much boost, low fuel pressure, coolant temp, egt, air temp, etc. Excessive knock is usually not the cause of most timing pull but rather other variables that I listed above.


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## TheBox (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (t3t41.8tgti)*

x2


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_
Everytime I read your posts you sound dumber and dumber Bob. The software doesn't pull timing, rather the ecu pulls timing based upon 20+ variables from various sensors. This can include excessive knock, to rich a/f, to lean a/f, to much boost, low fuel pressure, coolant temp, egt, air temp, etc. Excessive knock is usually not the cause of most timing pull but rather other variables that I listed above. 

Greg you can word thing how you would like the bottom line is my car is requesting alot more( boost and timing ) than another stage 3 car I mentioned

The car with Stock software = ZERO timing
The car with APR stage 1&2 SW = 1-3 degrees
The car with APR BT software = ton of timing pull 
Greg im sorry your APR fan boy and dont like what I have to say but keep out your personal attacks .
Bottom line is APR made a mess of my project car and im going to voice my opinion its public forum .

Ive been part of this community FAR FAR longer then your self .
My first VW was a 81 Scirroco and I own nothing but VW in my house hold for many years prob had 20 of them along the way .


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## t3t41.8tgti (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (rracerguy717)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Greg you can word thing how you would like the bottom line is my car is requesting alot more( boost and timing ) than another stage 3 car I mentioned

The car with Stock software = ZERO timing
The car with APR stage 1&2 SW = 1-3 degrees
The car with APR BT software = ton of timing pull 


It could be any number of things, after all a BT kit is a huge change from a factory k03. You could have a bad maf, n75, fuel pump, fuel filter or any number of things. If you truley believe your APR tune is wrong go to an APR dealer and get the lastest tune flashed.

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_
Bottom line is APR made a mess of my project car and im going to voice my opinion its public forum .


And they have offered many solutions and have even offered to buy the kit back at exactly what you paid for it including labor. I dont see why you dont just do that and go buy a pag kit.

_Quote, originally posted by *rracerguy717* »_

Ive been part of this community FAR FAR longer then your self .
My first VW was a 81 Scirroco and I own nothing but VW in my house hold for many years prob had 20 of them along the way .


And this means what? I will put you to shame when it comes to anything on a mk3, mk4, mk5 VW or a b5, b6, b7 Audi.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_
And they have offered many solutions


APR has offered NO solution only excuses , with there " Bob nothing is wrong with your car " attitude they will just waste another year of my time dealing with them. 
Another tuner is going to be re-tuning the car soon and ill be posting up the results ,then soon after take a trip to the same dyno APR said was being unfair with there correction factor that gave me low numbers LOL and then backing those dyno numbers up with a 1/4 trap speed at E-town.














Bob.G
My kit is not for sale , APR wishes it would be that easy LOL


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## ruso (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (t3t41.8tgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *t3t41.8tgti* »_And this means what? I will put you to shame when it comes to anything on a mk3, mk4, mk5 VW or a b5, b6, b7 Audi.


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## mamock116 (Nov 8, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (ruso)*

good luck. i look forward to the numbers


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## coolstrybrah (Feb 25, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (mamock116)*

Bob has been a long time APR supporter with his mkiv and his mkv until things went wrong with his mkv.
There is a reason why he was one of the first with a stage 3 apr kit because he trusted them with his car from his past pleasant experiences with APR but that did not continue too long.
You consumers(apr fanbois) keep going against other consumers(bob and others with stage 3 problems) and you will receive worse customer service because the company knows what they can get away with.
If anyone that has a apr stage 3 or anything stage 3 and doubts bob's accusations, why dont you go for a spin in his car and see if there is a difference(if you are near Bob's residence)?
Honestly I have no history with bob or any other company but wrong is wrong and APR needs to step up and treat one of there long time loyal customers right. If anyone cant see it or is acting upon APR to be one of there soldiers...just imagine you spent thousands for performance on your car and the product/promise just doesn't deliver, sucks right?
Lets do the right thing as a community and help get this car running right.
All this mess can do is give APR a bad rap, period; because if I and others don't see any resolution, why should we purchase from APR? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## wale (Jun 24, 2007)

i really like the numbers apr advertises, but the are too expensive, too many fanbois, and they r always getting involved with forum drama...
and as 4 bob, i feel ur pain man.. its times like this that the vf rss kit sounds a lot better than all the kits out there..


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## Calboytex (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (my07blkgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *my07blkgti* »_Bob has been a long time APR supporter with his mkiv and his mkv until things went wrong with his mkv.
There is a reason why he was one of the first with a stage 3 apr kit because he trusted them with his car from his past pleasant experiences with APR but that did not continue too long.
You consumers(apr fanbois) keep going against other consumers(bob and others with stage 3 problems) and you will receive worse customer service because the company knows what they can get away with.
If anyone that has a apr stage 3 or anything stage 3 and doubts bob's accusations, why dont you go for a spin in his car and see if there is a difference(if you are near Bob's residence)?
Honestly I have no history with bob or any other company but wrong is wrong and APR needs to step up and treat one of there long time loyal customers right. If anyone cant see it or is acting upon APR to be one of there soldiers...just imagine you spent thousands for performance on your car and the product/promise just doesn't deliver, sucks right?
Lets do the right thing as a community and help get this car running right.
All this mess can do is give APR a bad rap, period; because if I and others don't see any resolution, why should we purchase from APR? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

best post in this whole thread!


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## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (my07blkgti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *my07blkgti* »_Bob has been a long time APR supporter with his mkiv and his mkv until things went wrong with his mkv.
There is a reason why he was one of the first with a stage 3 apr kit because he trusted them with his car from his past pleasant experiences with APR but that did not continue too long.
You consumers(apr fanbois) keep going against other consumers(bob and others with stage 3 problems) and you will receive worse customer service because the company knows what they can get away with.
If anyone that has a apr stage 3 or anything stage 3 and doubts bob's accusations, why dont you go for a spin in his car and see if there is a difference(if you are near Bob's residence)?
Honestly I have no history with bob or any other company but wrong is wrong and APR needs to step up and treat one of there long time loyal customers right. If anyone cant see it or is acting upon APR to be one of there soldiers...just imagine you spent thousands for performance on your car and the product/promise just doesn't deliver, sucks right?
Lets do the right thing as a community and help get this car running right.
All this mess can do is give APR a bad rap, period; because if I and others don't see any resolution, why should we purchase from APR? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Completely agreed and i had exact same opinion when i first read his whinings...but after i read the whole thread and others posts he had on this forum i can just come to conclusion that this guy should be ran by a big yellow school bus and just forgotten about for...ever.
Your car can't run fine and spin wheels in 3rd gear at ANY speed and all of the sudden lose power. That's not software fault...something is wrong with HIS CAR. I made 420nm of torque on MKIV and i can't spin wheels in 3rd gear all the time!


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## iThread (Sep 27, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (mescaline)*

This is done.


----------

