# **USRT Fueling Solutions Presents: The Genesis II Injector**



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

With 500hp and 11sec track times becoming a new "norm" nowadays and gasoline prices inflating to consume whole paychecks, it's about time that hardcore builders had something their wallets might actually thank them for. 

With that we introduce an affordable, fuel efficient, and otherwise SUPERIOR fuel injector line for big turbo builders. The _Genesis II_ injector is available now in 500cc, 630cc, 1000cc, 1600cc, and 2000cc flavors. It is specifically matched to the VW/Audi engine platforms and can be fitted to other makes and models as well. 

The _Genesis II_ injectors feature *Advanced Atomization Technology* yet also big flow. Simply put, they’re a tuning weapon. Features also include wide-angle single cone or dual stream spray patterns with *vapor/mist-like qualities.* Cycle response time is super-fast with minimal dead time. No other product line combines this level of refinement with brute strength. 

Radically tiny droplets are aimed directly at the intake valves avoid wall-wetting. Superior atomization of the air/fuel mixture is guaranteed even with huge bore sizes and cold air. Thus, these injectors are exceptionally easy to dial in and tune. The result is improved fuel economy, faster turbo spool, more low-rpm torque, gains in peak horsepower, and buttery smooth DRIVABILITY. Demand support for _Genesis II_ injectors from your software tuner today!

*1000cc *Flow at 3bar base pressure is perfect to support power in the mid-500s with 1.8T engine or 800s with R32.**
Genesis II 1000cc injector spray demo from [email protected] on Vimeo.




*1600cc *Flow at 3bar base pressure is perfect to support about 600hp with 1.8T engine on e85 or over 1000 with R32.##**
Genesis II 1600cc injector spray demo from [email protected] on Vimeo.




*2000cc* Flow at 3bar base pressure is perfect to support about 800hp with 1.8T engine on e85 or over 1200 with R32.##**
Genesis II 2000cc injector spray demo from [email protected] on Vimeo.




**Up to 8bar rail pressure has been proven safe to take output even higher on each injector size. 

##Do NOT run with Q16 fuel or in extremely high-heat conditions.**

*CLICK PHOTOS FOR MORE INFO AND ORDERING:*


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## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

After several months of delightful results running your 500s with petrol, I want to continue forward with this design when the FrankenTT switches to E85. Will these injectors work on that fuel? If so, then you know where to send me an invoice.


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## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

From Above said:


> 1600cc Flow at 3bar base pressure is perfect to support about 600hp with 1.8T engine on e85


.


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## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

so much for my reading comprehension skilz. Presumably the 1000s are good with E85 then.


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

Why not something in the 800cc range? No need with 1000cc behavior I assume...


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

l88m22vette said:


> Why not something in the 800cc range? No need with 1000cc behavior I assume...


that is correct and also with the range of base pressure these injectors work with...run the 630s at around 5.5bar base pressure...


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

I will be ordering a set of 630's soon.

Sounds like the perfect replacement for the Siemens Deka's.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> I will be ordering a set of 630's soon.
> 
> Sounds like the perfect replacement for the Siemens Deka's.


 PM me when ready:beer::thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

So earlier this [email protected] swapped out the standard EV14 550cc injectors for a set of _Genesis II_ [email protected]

Here are the results:











Numbers speak for themselves and if not the numbers then the drastic change in the area under the curve should definitely speak volumes.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

keep the orders comin!


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> that is correct and also with the range of base pressure these injectors work with...run the 630s at around 5.5bar base pressure...


What kinda fuel pump do you run to use 5.5 bar base pressure plus plenty of boost?


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

groggory said:


> What kinda fuel pump do you run to use 5.5 bar base pressure plus plenty of boost?


I personally would run the Bosch 044 pump due to it's ability to maintain higher flow as pressure increases.


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## 04 GLI Luva (May 30, 2007)

Why would you ever recommend running that much base pressure that's retarded to me. That's why you sell larger injectors. The strain put on ur fuel pump is crazy.


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

04 GLI Luva said:


> Why would you ever recommend running that much base pressure that's retarded to me. That's why you sell larger injectors. The strain put on ur fuel pump is crazy.


You should understand that the Bosch 044 pump was originally used in Porsche and Ferrari cars running CIS. The flow rating is done at 8bar and the pumps are happy at well over that amount. There is no undue "strain" to speak of, actually. The minimal demands of a 5 - 8bar EFI system are truly NOTHING that the pump would ever worry about. You're applying conventional "wisdom" that's completely out of context.

See the flow chart below. The 044's flow vs. pressure curve is even flatter than the huge Aeromotive A1000. It makes a Walbro 255lph look like a ski slope. So, Quintin is absolutely correct with his recommendation:



Of course, every pump still has its limits. That's why folks are wise to run TWO of them, if necessary. That's most easily done with STOCK fuel lines (feed and return) with a surge tank that's well-designed like this one from IE:





Old school injectors, however, are a very different matter. At even 5bar, the EV1 generation (e.g. Bosch "green top") are completely out of their element. They slow down to a point that control becomes challenging. A range of 3 - 4bar is sensible for a forced induction car and no more than 5bar for a naturally aspirated machine. Meanwhile, the new crop of injectors are happy at up to around 9bar at the rail. *You don't have to "go there", but you'll be whooped by somebody who does.*

Look at the direct injection setups. They run *100 - 150 bar* for a reason. That's because atomization improves radically with pressure. Those who want to lead the pack must always do something different than the followers. We're presenting a rational, time-tested, and race-proven path forward for those who want more than the cookie cutter solutions provide. All of our flow ratings are done at the industry standard 3bar, though, and they perform great at conventional pressures, too.

This advice comes from the company who put modern fuel injection on the MAP in the VW/Audi sphere. We've got your best interests in mind. In 5 years, all this will look totally conventional. :beer:


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

These look really amazing.

It would be interesting to see some 5 bar boxed tunes.

I mean, if you've invested in modern injectors and a world class fueling solution... Why not run high base pressure and improve atomization?

While you're at it, run your meth nozzles at 1000 PSI and run direct port 

Rewards are given to those that push


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## Malant (Aug 30, 2004)

Poking my head in here as I have been impressed by these injectors in a LARGE way.

Scott provided me with these injectors a few months back and I ran them at 3 bar with no issues what so ever, everything seemed solid and spot on. After a few tweaks to my fueling setup I was able to up the base pressure to 5 bar and let me tell you. AWESOME. Just by putting in the BVC’s USRT provided and the IC I calculated (I am running Maestro) block 32 was 1.54% and -.78% after 40+ minutes of mixed driving. That’s pretty impressive; to get any other injector into that area of minimal correction normally takes me 4-5 different flashes of adjusting the BVC and IC. EVERYTHING is so much smoother; torque is improved dramatically down low and midrange. No back fires, rock solid idle. Could not be happier.

Just a brief history what I can compare:

*Factory TT 225 Injectors:* @ 3 & 4 bar (solid, just not a lot of fuel)
*Bosch 550CC EV-14 Injectors* @ 3 & 4 bar (very good injector, no complaints, thought this was HUGE improvement over the 630’s) 
*Siemens 630cc Injectors* @ 3 bar (meh, good amount of fuel but inconsistent)
*Genesis 2 Injector* @ 5bar (HOLY **** I did not know injectors could make this much of a difference. Everything is perfect, right out of the box.)

I was so happy and thought I found the perfect injector when I ran my EV14 550’s, until I ran these. Car runs like a DREAM with no tweaking. 

Props to you Scott and USRT, you bring what the VAG community needs. Everyone is so content on just picking your average every day injector and calling it a day. You bring a whole new level to the table and I feel as if the other 99.9% of people tuning VW’s are missing out a level they can’t even comprehend yet. The atomization is superior to any other injector that I have seen offered to our market, and fuel atomization is a very important part of having your car running to its best potential. These paired with direct port WMI and I never see knock, allowing me to push the bar that much further. 

There is a reason why newer cars are using DI and high fuel pressure. Atomization. These injectors help bring our platform a bit closer and share benefits with the newer DI platform cars.

:thumbup::thumbup: for USRT and Scott!


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

I wonder how these compare to injector dynamics' offerings


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

groggory said:


> These look really amazing.
> 
> It would be interesting to see some 5 bar boxed tunes.


Thanks for the positive feed back and... there is a negotiation going on right *now* between the powers that be in the Genesis group and a very major VW/Audi software provider. Whether the tunes are released for 5bar or another pressure is unknown to me, but USRT is feeling confident that a full embrace is only a short while off. -like just after the New Year.



> I mean, if you've invested in modern injectors and a world class fueling solution... Why not run high base pressure and improve atomization?


DING! 



> While you're at it, run your meth nozzles at 1000 PSI and run direct port.


Well, that'd require a serious pump and nozzles that don't t currently exist, but... that's exactly the way we think about it. Speaking of direct port, there's actually a conceptual tie-in with the Genesis II line. That's ATOMIZATION. Check out the way the vapor moves around in STILL air in the videos on this page (the camera man's breath is all that's moving it around).

The first Genesis generation (launched 2005) was all about spray pattern and direct fitment. The second group is now about pattern and fitment but also atomization, response time, and uncommon pressure resistance.



> Rewards are given to those that push


You know it. (salute)


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

:beer::beer::beer:


Loving the warm reception!


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Malant said:


> Poking my head in here as I have been impressed by these injectors in a LARGE way.


Well, thanks for the objective review, sir.  When Genesis injectors first hit the scene, USRT (major distributor) was accused of selling "snake oil". That's because our advice went against the stream of prevailing knowledge. Now, those innovations are taken completely for granted. This is exactly what is going to happen during this round. Folks are going to say "that's stupid" and then they're going to lose races to those who get with the modern program. Next, they're going to buy it, and... then it's going to go mainstream to the point that nobody will ever believe that there were challenges in the first place.

The same EXACT thing happened with water/meth which USRT brought to the VW/Audi mainstream over partially informed objections. Look at the market now. Anybody who says that stuff doesn't work is called out as a silly n00b. :laugh:



groggory said:


> I wonder how these compare to injector dynamics' offerings


Injector Dynamics also wants to know. We got an order from them two days ago. :sly: eace:


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> Injector Dynamics also wants to know. We got an order from them two days ago. :sly: eace:


lol. Guess we'll find out soon enough


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## talx (Apr 4, 2003)

why no Q16?


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

*Q16, etc.*



talx said:


> why no Q16?


It makes the 1600cc and 2000cc's internal seals swell. High heat is also a problem with these two injectors. So, they shouldn't be buried deep inside a cylinder head. In a 1.8T, for example, there are no problems because air surrounds the injectors vs. metal. A 24v VR6 or 4G63, however, might have issues when road raced or rallied in a hot desert area like Arizona. We're being 100% transparent with the many strengths vs. few weakness of our products. R&D bears these things out and we keep it real always. The other injectors run faultlessly with all gasoline brews in all heat ranges, etc. :thumbup:


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## One-Eight GTI (Jan 5, 2010)

Just curious if these Injectors will come with any flow info?? Kinda like what ID does here... Makes setting up BVC a little easier


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

One-Eight GTI said:


> Just curious if these Injectors will come with any flow info?? Kinda like what ID does here... Makes setting up BVC a little easier


Yes, battery offset, flow curve (hi and low) information, we do have available.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

Quintin/Scott

just for clarification ( i see the pictures) all these are for a fact rated @ 3 bar however acceptable up to 8 or 9 bar?

holy hell that turns the standard 1000 @ 3bar into what 1960 @ 9bar give or take? Havent converted in a while its what 16% from 3 to 4 bar.


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

if i can really just swap these in on a unitronic 630cc tune for siemens injectors...

why does unitronic specify that the injector is siemens?? Why dont they just say "630cc injectors"?

Ill have to email unitronic...


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

theswoleguy said:


> just for clarification ( i see the pictures) all these are for a fact rated @ 3 bar however acceptable up to 8 or 9 bar?


All our flow ratings are done at the industry standard 3bar. The 500cc are responsive at up to 8bar rail pressure. The rest can do 9bar at the rail.



> holy hell that turns the standard 1000 @ 3bar into what 1960 @ 9bar give or take? Havent converted in a while its what 16% from 3 to 4 bar.


Actually, it'd turn it into a (rounded) 1730cc, but who's counting?  Keep in mind, though, that you have to subtract the boost pressure from that 9bar ceiling in order to determine the maximum base pressure setting. So, if you were running 2bar boost, for example, you could run a 7bar base pressure for a total of 1525cc. My recommendation is to run the smallest injector that flows the required amount at the *highest* pressure that you can *safely* reach. Yes, this goes against what conventional thinkers believe is correct, but again... they're the ones that will be beat and left wondering. As usual, USRT is here to change the game vs. maintain the status quo.


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

speed51133! said:


> if i can really just swap these in on a unitronic 630cc tune for siemens injectors... why does unitronic specify that the injector is siemens?? Why dont they just say "630cc injectors"?


-because you can't simply swap in any old injectors in place of others. How'd you come to the conclusion that they can be interchanged? For now, Unitronic's programming is for the *Siemens*. Period. :beer:


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

for those that can read it...

I asked specifically if i can swap out my siemens 630 cc injectors for these on a unitronic 630cc tune.

I was told YES!


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Ah, sorry. Quintin simply got that one wrong. It happens. With the twin streams, the Genesis spray pattern puts more of the fuel in the right place in a given amount of time. These injectors are also FAR faster in response and are more resistant to raised fuel pressures than the Siemens. So, the tune will probably need ever so slight adjustment to make them work perfectly.

With that said, the Siemens 630cc tend to vary a LOT in flow and spray pattern. So... "Siemens 630cc" isn't necessarily a hard standard to begin with. Thus, it actually is possible that the Genesis II 630cc could be swapped in. I'd *not* claim that as an official reality, though. Thanks much for paying close attention and bringing this slip to light. :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

speed51133! said:


> for those that can read it...
> 
> I asked specifically if i can swap out my siemens 630 cc injectors for these on a unitronic 630cc tune.
> 
> I was told YES!


i'll admit fault in that. The Uni tune is written for the Seimens, they have a different battery offset, flow curve, and response time. So while YES you can swap them and they may work ok, there's no guarantee that you wont have issues. 

Did Uni ever release that UniSuite or whatever it was called to their dealers?


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> All our flow ratings are done at the industry standard 3bar. The 500cc are responsive at up to 8bar rail pressure. The rest can do 9bar at the rail.
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, it'd turn it into a (rounded) 1730cc, but who's counting?  Keep in mind, though, that you have to subtract the boost pressure from that 9bar ceiling in order to determine the maximum base pressure setting. So, if you were running 2bar boost, for example, you could run a 7bar base pressure for a total of 1525cc. My recommendation is to run the smallest injector that flows the required amount at the *highest* pressure that you can *safely* reach. Yes, this goes against what conventional thinkers believe is correct, but again... they're the ones that will be beat and left wondering. As usual, USRT is here to change the game vs. maintain the status quo.


ahhh ok couldnt remember if it was 13% or 16% off the top of my head but i see from the math it is ~13% thats, hwo i got to my number was 16%. Eitherway wow, and yes i know about the subtraction for boost. My idea was just as you are thinking, run smaller injector at more pressure.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

Scott/Quintin

In about a week or two I may be willing to try out the 630s at 6 bar and see hwo they work out. My uni file is wrote for 870s. My ultimate goal i think would be to have a file wrote for 93 on 1000s @ 3 or 4 bar then have E85 head room.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

theswoleguy said:


> ahhh ok couldnt remember if it was 13% or 16% off the top of my head but i see from the math it is ~13% thats, hwo i got to my number was 16%. Eitherway wow, and yes i know about the subtraction for boost. My idea was just as you are thinking, run smaller injector at more pressure.


Fyi, check my injector faq for fueling formulas


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

i understand. 

I would gladly buy the injectors to try them out, but if they do not work well at all with my unit tune, I do not want to be SOL with useless injectors for my aplication.

you do not have a "test" batch I could rent with a full payment retail price deposit, do you?

btw...everyone says unisettings was never released...but i downloaded it from unitronic's website???


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

speed51133! said:


> i understand.
> 
> I would gladly buy the injectors to try them out, but if they do not work well at all with my unit tune, I do not want to be SOL with useless injectors for my aplication.
> 
> ...


unisuite not settings unisuite was supposed to be similar to "maestro"


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

theswoleguy said:


> Scott/Quintin
> 
> In about a week or two I may be willing to try out the 630s at 6 bar and see hwo they work out. My uni file is wrote for 870s. My ultimate goal i think would be to have a file wrote for 93 on 1000s @ 3 or 4 bar then have E85 head room.


THAT SOUNDS LIKE FUN:beer:


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## Satummoo (Oct 20, 2004)

Thanks Scott for your great help over the phone!

Just ordered 500cc small port 1.8t Injectors


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## BlueSleeper (Nov 9, 2002)

Sorry if I did see it mentioned, but what is the minimum open time at 14V for the 2000cc versions. Does it reach into the sub 1ms, 2ms, how stable is the flow down there? I have the ID2000's but would love to get the better spray pattern of these guys.


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## JohnnyDrama (Feb 15, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> Did Uni ever release that UniSuite or whatever it was called to their dealers?


No. It seems you and Scott need to chat a bit more


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

BlueSleeper said:


> Sorry if I did see it mentioned, but what is the minimum open time at 14V for the 2000cc versions. Does it reach into the sub 1ms, 2ms, how stable is the flow down there? I have the ID2000's but would love to get the better spray pattern of these guys.


 the 2000cc perform identical to the ID just at a much better price.


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## tedgram (Jul 2, 2005)

Interesting!!


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

speed51133! said:


> i understand.
> 
> I would gladly buy the injectors to try them out, but if they do not work well at all with my unit tune, I do not want to be SOL with useless injectors for my aplication.
> 
> ...


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> the 2000cc perform identical to the ID just at a much better price.


Are they dead time matched like the Injector Dynamics units?


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

of course!


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## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

got any info on the TVUB settings to suit these injectors?


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

badger5 said:


> got any info on the TVUB settings to suit these injectors?


 USRT should be able to provide you with a spec sheet but you might be better off working your way from EV14 values. I've tuned for the 500cc's before


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## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

what values did you end up with for the 550's?


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## talx (Apr 4, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> the 2000cc perform identical to the ID just at a much better price.


yes but ID specifically mention that all there range of injectors do support Q16
hey I'm all in for you guys but if you're injectors don't support q16 which is the fuel I use then it's a no go unfortunately

I do give you credit for being up front about it :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

talx said:


> yes but ID specifically mention that all there range of injectors do support Q16
> hey I'm all in for you guys but if you're injectors don't support q16 which is the fuel I use then it's a no go unfortunately
> 
> I do give you credit for being up front about it :thumbup:


 it says it right on their website
1600cc- discontinued
200cc- "incompatible with MTBE fuels" http://www.injectordynamics.com/ID2000.html

the 1000cc on lower however are and so are ours.:thumbup::beer:


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## talx (Apr 4, 2003)

ok sorry about that I didn't notice it when I was looking over


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

more thirsty 1.8t's satisfied:thumbup:


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> of course!


Really? You guys dead time match every set?


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

gdoggmoney said:


> Really? You guys dead time match every set?


yes.


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

gdoggmoney said:


> Really? You guys dead time match every set?


Here's the deal. "Out of the box", injectors like these come in with latency variances that are fractions of what they used to be. There are rarely significant differences to catch. So, we batch test and look for outliers. Mind you, NO group of injectors no matter how well tested is a perfect match with 0.0000000% (to infinity) variance. So long as the data is within a certain statistical "z-score", they're moved on to the customer with full confidence. This is true for us as well as quality competitors.

Meanwhile, an intake manifold will flow differently from one runner to the next to an extent that makes almost ANY injector et look relatively *perfect*. There is no point whatsoever to matching an injector to a radically higher tolerance than the air going to each cylinder. Thus, this is an over-hyped distinction when dealing with properly engineered injectors to begin with. A certain other company pushes the latency matching a lot because they modify small injectors to flow more. That works fine to an extent. However, those small injectors have relatively weak solenoids that become more "off" as the flow and pressure demands increase. The _Genesis II_ line is not modified like that. They're built to do what the do from the factory.

A truly trick service would be to flow each intake manifold runner and head port and then mate higher/lower-flowing injectors to them. This is sometimes done in the WRX EJ20 world where some runners are known to flow more or less. :thumbup:


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## Gulfstream (Jul 28, 2010)

Hi,

At what ms / duty cycle do you flowmatch your injectors?

I recently got some flowmatched Bosch 1600cc injectors which I found rather tricky to tune. SO I took them to a flow bench and turned out pretty bad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krxX4RdN_gc

My car idle at 1.65ms on 910cc's so even lower ms with 1600cc's meaning the difference at idle would be even greater than what you see in the video.


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

Gulfstream said:


> Hi,
> 
> At what ms / duty cycle do you flowmatch your injectors?
> 
> ...


Yeah, most flowbenches do 25/50/75/100% duty cycle. This is why you have issues.


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

Well once a few people have tried these with the current release tunes, I want a set. Just don't wanna blow off money for gen 2's when the gen 1's work now.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

thanksgiving is coming...i'm sure your engine will be thankful for these


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## 87vr6 (Jan 17, 2002)

[email protected] said:


> there is a negotiation going on right *now* between the powers that be in the Genesis group and a very major VW/Audi software provider. Whether the tunes are released for 5bar or another pressure is unknown to me, but USRT is feeling confident that a full embrace is only a short while off. -like just after the New Year.


I'm waiting to see this....


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## mainstayinc (Oct 4, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> So earlier this [email protected] swapped out the standard EV14 550cc injectors for a set of _Genesis II_ [email protected]
> 
> Here are the results:
> 
> ...


Those are very impressive numbers. However, there is no way of telling whether the improved performance is due to the Gen. II injector’s "Advanced Atomization Technology" or the fact that they were run at a full 5 bar fuel pressure in this dyno comparison as compared to the EV14’s 3 bar fuel pressure.



[email protected] said:


> Look at the direct injection setups. They run 100 - 150 bar for a reason. *That's because atomization improves radically with pressure.*


Since atomization improves with fuel pressure, the only way of making an objective comparison of these two injectors is to test them both at the same fuel pressure. That would be very easy to do. You could dyno the same car on the same day at the same fuel pressure but adjust your primary fuel enrichment by some number (~10%) to account the difference in fuel injector flow rating (550cc/500cc = 1.1).

I would be very interested in seeing how the Gen. II injectors compare under those test conditions.


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## c0r3y.af (Oct 8, 2009)

I'm very intrigued by these. I'd love to test them out but I already picked up my Siemens 630cc. Who's running them and how do you like em?


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

c0r3y.af said:


> I'm very intrigued by these. I'd love to test them out but I already picked up my Siemens 630cc. Who's running them and how do you like em?


If you return them I know a guy who would gladly sell his 630's for cheap. He wants some genesis 1000's


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## 377 (May 8, 2003)

*Funny you should ask that*



badger5 said:


> got any info on the TVUB settings to suit these injectors?


I have had excellent experiences with USRT in the past, but I am a little disappointed with my latest exchange. 
On 10/24 I requested latency values info from USRT for a set of 380cc injectors that I purchased a while back (without knowledge of this thread), received a same-day reply stating that they could, but that the injector specs have changed over the years and that photos would help id the correct injector in question. Later that night I sent the photos along with a question I had in regards to the particular injectors, and was looking forward to my answer. I wasn't expecting USRT to have info for the exact injectors they sent me, but ballpark numbers would help to set a base from which to adjust from, thus cutting back time spent fine-tuning. I never received a reply, so I followed up with another request on 11/2, and still have yet to hear back. 

I am thinking that my unused G1 380cc injectors may be insufficient for my needs, and am thinking of going to a larger size for more headroom. The G2 500's look to be a good fit, but it would be tremendously helpful for those who adjust their own maps to have a voltage chart from which to take latency values from, as well as a response from the companies which we support.


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## c0r3y.af (Oct 8, 2009)

groggory said:


> If you return them I know a guy who would gladly sell his 630's for cheap. He wants some genesis 1000's


I'll keep you in mind! I'm running a UM Stage 4 tune meant for the Siemens so I'm a little iffy about using another brand but at the same time I really wanna try them haha.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

"377"

I will look into that matter asap. I apologize for the inconvenience.


Bill, did Scott back to you with the values you were looking for?




:beer:opcorn::beer:


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

I know for a fact Scott can supply you with the info you need. Just give Scott a little more time to dig up more info. Every time I needed any technical info about any injectors I purchased from him he always came thru for me  

Worst case scenario I can provide you with ball park numbers for latency for those injectors.


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## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

hey i went to order 4 315cc green injectors and got a quantity warning? what do i have to do to buy 4 injectors for my 1.8t


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## 377 (May 8, 2003)

Thanks to both Quintin, and Gonzzz. I have total confidence that this is now a non-issue. :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

taverncustoms said:


> hey i went to order 4 315cc green injectors and got a quantity warning? what do i have to do to buy 4 injectors for my 1.8t


ah then there's an error on the site and you mean *415cc*. 

i'll pm you later today with a price.


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## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> ah then there's an error on the site and you mean *415cc*.
> 
> i'll pm you later today with a price.


lol ya 415 for my frankenturbo setup 
i look forward for the price.


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## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> With 500hp and 11sec track times becoming a new "norm" nowadays and gasoline prices inflating to consume whole paychecks, it's about time that hardcore builders had something their wallets might actually thank them for.
> 
> With that we introduce an affordable, fuel efficient, and otherwise SUPERIOR fuel injector line for big turbo builders. The _Genesis II_ injector is available now in 500cc, 630cc, 1000cc, 1600cc, and 2000cc flavors. It is specifically matched to the VW/Audi engine platforms and can be fitted to other makes and models as well.
> 
> ...



do you have video's of these next to "normal" injectors of same flow rating as a comparison of flow pattern, atomisation etc....


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

badger5 said:


> do you have video's of these next to "normal" injectors of same flow rating as a comparison of flow pattern, atomisation etc....


at this time...negative.

Also..

UPDATE: Scott is aware of the questions and is working to compile the info and get it up on the site...more later as that develops :beer:


----------



## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

groggory said:


> If you return them I know a guy who would gladly sell his 630's for cheap. He wants some genesis 1000's


I have a set of real deal ID1000's FS if you want something that has been proven


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> I have a set of real deal ID1000's FS if you want something that has been proven


 Shameless plug










Even ID had their beginnings.

The Genesis II will be "proven" soon enough :beer:


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Shameless plug
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I apologize that wasn't meant as a knock against the Genesis II injectors. Even I ran genesis 550s before I had ID1000s and the Genesis 550s performed flawlessly :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> I apologize that wasn't meant as a knock against the Genesis II injectors. Even I ran genesis 550s before I had ID1000s and the Genesis 550s performed flawlessly :thumbup:


No harm no foul :beer:



Now back to regards to Bill spray pattern question I'll do you all one better...

Here's a YouTube link of a competitor's '1000cc' injector: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-SVedHdBAs. Now, here's what the GenII 1000cc injector looks like: http://vimeo.com/51402967

See the huge improvement in atomization? See how much wider the spray cone is? Now, look at the price difference. Ours are built to specification at the factory. There's is modified with a drill. Which do YOU think is the better deal?


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

in all fairness, that is not an apples to apples video comparison...

the ID video was way higher resolution and a super fast frame per second camera, showing like a single pulse of fuel....


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

soooo...

has anyone tried these in a unitronic 630cc tune??


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

speed51133! said:


> in all fairness, that is not an apples to apples video comparison...
> 
> the ID video was way higher resolution and a super fast frame per second camera, showing like a single pulse of fuel....


That's fair commentary, but it doesn't change the reality. The competitor's injectors start life as the Bosch 550cc EV14 and then larger holes are drilled. The result is a ~910cc flow (@3bar) with compromised spray pattern. It's very straight and doesn't look a lot different in real life compared to what we just showed you. We respect the competition, but know that our solution is far superior. 

It's got the high flow straight out the box at 3bar with no mods. It's engineered to do what it does vs. being hacked and massaged to get the job done. The droplet size is much smaller and far more consistent. The spray pattern is radically improved. On top of that, the price is lower. (It'll surely jump in January after a major tuner rolls out tunes for them, though.)

We're very early in the roll out process for these products. So, give us time to get things fully ironed out regarding information provision and such. The parts are 100% finished and ready to rock, but our overall presentation is not. :thumbup:


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

speed51133! said:


> soooo...
> 
> has anyone tried these in a unitronic 630cc tune??


NOBODY has done this yet. That will undoubtedly change within the next month or two, though. Unitronic either has a set right now or is about to get one (from what we hear through the grapevine). Get your popcorn ready. This is going to be fun. 

Okay, Quintin is your man with the plan. I must disappear back to the laboratory/dungeon where I dwell most of the time.


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> The competitor's injectors start life as the Bosch 550cc EV14 and then larger holes are drilled. The result is a ~910cc flow (@3bar) with compromised spray pattern.


I for one don't take away one thing or another from that video. But your estimation of flow for "hacked" EV14s sounds a lot like the ones I plan to install in place of your 500s when E85 time comes. What do you have which I could compare apples-to-apples with them? I don't believe your 630s would match that flow at 5bar. So where does that leave things?


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

...back from the dungeon for a moment



[email protected] said:


> What do you have which I could compare apples-to-apples with them? I don't believe your 630s would match that flow at 5bar. So where does that leave things?


You're saying that you need about 910cc flow? If so... then, you could run our GenII 1000cc at 3bar or the GenII 630cc at 6bar. Either one would do the trick. My preference would be the smaller injector at higher pressure so long as you've got the pump capacity for it (e.g. 2x 044) and won't go beyond say... 2.5bar boost. :thumbup:


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

I'm here with your ole pal Ed at FFE, discussing just that question. I'm running your adjustable fpr and it goes up to 6bar, but that's a lotta pressure for the stock pump. The inline duty cycles only at boost.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> I'm here with your ole pal Ed at FFE, discussing just that question. I'm running your adjustable fpr and it goes up to 6bar, but that's a lotta pressure for the stock pump. The inline duty cycles only at boost.


I can't imagine the stock pump could run 6 bar + boost. I imagine those high fuel pressures are only attainable with high pressure aftermarket pumps such as the Bosch '044


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

groggory said:


> I can't imagine the stock pump could run 6 bar + boost. I imagine those high fuel pressures are only attainable with high pressure aftermarket pumps such as the Bosch '044


^^^ What he said.



[email protected] said:


> I'm here with your ole pal Ed at FFE,


Sup, ED! 



> I'm running your adjustable fpr and it goes up to 6bar, but that's a lotta pressure for the stock pump.


Yeah, the stock intank pump by itself is not going to come anywhere close to cuttin' the mustard. However, it can certainly feed a stronger inline pump without problems. The inline will "out suck" the intank and thus drop the line pressure between. Since pressure and flow are inversely related, the reduced pressure increases the intank unit's *flow* capacity. So, you'll see very low or even zero psi pressure between them, but that's totally fine because all you need is flow. The pressure is only required between the inline and the fuel rail.



> The inline duty cycles only at boost.


Mmmm... you're pushing through a dead inline pump when out of the boost? :sly: That's not a very good idea. Have it running continuously so as to not unnecessarily overburden the stocker. :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> I'm here with your ole pal Ed at FFE


 Whats this? Ed is still alive! HI ED!


----------



## seth_3515 (Dec 26, 2008)

I have a Uni 830cc tune, fuel lab afpr, and your genesis intank. Could your pump handle the increased fuel pressure on the genesis II 630s, or would an inline be necessary? -6an fuel lines, PTE 5857 turbo looking to make around 450


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

seth_3515 said:


> I have a Uni 830cc tune, fuel lab afpr, and your genesis intank. Could your pump handle the increased fuel pressure on the genesis II 630s, or would an inline be necessary? -6an fuel lines, PTE 5857 turbo looking to make around 450


 Nah, it'll never make big pressure with the 630cc. Nor is it capable of supporting 450hp. -more like 375bhp on pump gas. Think of the current Genesis Intank Pump as a direct competitor to the APR product. It's significantly less expensive and just a bit more powerful. The R&D is ever going, though.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

seth_3515 said:


> I have a Uni 830cc tune, fuel lab afpr, and your genesis intank. Could your pump handle the increased fuel pressure on the genesis II 630s, or would an inline be necessary? -6an fuel lines, PTE 5857 turbo looking to make around 450


 I'd say that depends on the flow you want. Can the genesis pump make pressure???? Sure it can. What volume do you want at that pressure though.

The math will tell you your answer


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

I'd say the injectors rated for 630cc at 3bar would be an interesting option for an 830cc file. Knock them up to 5 bar or so? 

Also, the FrankenTT's fueling system has one of our 044-ish pumps in-line after the main pump. Off boost, it receives a trickle of power to allow smooth passage of the stock pump's flow.


----------



## tedgram (Jul 2, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> I'd say the injectors rated for 630cc at 3bar would be an interesting option for an 830cc file. Knock them up to 5 bar or so?
> 
> Also, the FrankenTT's fueling system has one of our 044-ish pumps in-line after the main pump. Off boost, it receives a trickle of power to allow smooth passage of the stock pump's flow.


 How do you regulate the power to the inline pump?


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> I'd say the injectors rated for 630cc at 3bar would be an interesting option for an 830cc file. Knock them up to 5 bar or so?
> 
> Also, the FrankenTT's fueling system has one of our 044-ish pumps in-line after the main pump. Off boost, it receives a trickle of power to allow smooth passage of the stock pump's flow.


 approx 5.2bar for 830cc flow out of 630cc injectors.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

i may try a few of these shortly, some 1000s pulled back for 870 file and then ran hot for E85... 

Question though what pumps are you recommending for 9 bar?


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Also, the FrankenTT's fueling system has one of our 044-ish pumps in-line after the main pump. Off boost, it receives a trickle of power to allow smooth passage of the stock pump's flow.


 SMART :thumbup:




theswoleguy said:


> Question though what pumps are you recommending for 9 bar?


 Well... these injectors (500cc excepted) are rated for up to 9bar at the rail. So, if you mean a 7bar fpr setting + 2bar boost (or some similar combination), then we're on the same page. -just want to be sure. Anyway, a Bosch 044 (or possibly two in parallel) could/would get the job done nicely. However, the 044 is not rated for eternal life with e85. -more like 500 hours. Thus, until another pump solution presents itself, this may not be practical. (USRT, however, IS working on such solutions *as we speak*.)


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

:beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer:ROUND OF BEER FOR THOSE IN THE GARAGE THIS WEEKEND:beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer:


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> :beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer:ROUND OF BEER FOR THOSE IN THE GARAGE THIS WEEKEND:beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer:


 thanks i plan to be but if i have that many i wont be doing much working


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

theswoleguy said:


> thanks i plan to be but if i have that many i wont be doing much working


 no one said work alone! lol


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## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

So question fueling is still new to me but I am working on it  

I am trying to get all my "eggs" together for my step up to the F23! I am running TT injectors at 4bar currently and of course with a new pump going in I am looking a bigger injectors. 

I am looking at the 500s or the 630s mainly because I don't want to run spacers or plug adapters with the 550s. 

Quesiton is which way should I go up or down? I will be running a custom tune as well.


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

woodywoods86 said:


> I am trying to get all my "eggs" together for my step up to the F23! I am running TT injectors at 4bar currently and of course with a new pump going in I am looking a bigger injectors.


 Is that because you've found a _need_ for bigger injectors or because you just figure you might attract more women that way? There's no big reason to upgrade unless you are in _need_ (as demonstrated by super-high duty cycle from data logs or overly lean AFR, etc).



> I am looking at the 500s or the 630s mainly because I don't want to run spacers or plug adapters with the 550s.


The 500s ship (and are priced) with rail spacers but fit the plugs natively. The 630cc are provided (and priced) with height adapters and also fit the plugs directly. The 550cc require plug adapters. None of this should affect your decision in any way whatsoever. Functionally speaking, they're all completely transparent and irrelevant to operation.



> Question is which way should I go up or down? I will be running a custom tune as well.


For sure, you'll make more power with the 500cc than the 550cc. The 630cc are way oversized and won't deliver any extra value. So, don't go there. Finally, the dyno verified gains that we've shared from FrankenTurbo were done with GenII 500cc at 5bar. However, that was for improved atomization (which does contribute to the gains). A 3bar pressure would have been perfectly sufficient for achieving a proper AFR, however.

So, 500cc at a pressure that your pump can support is our recommendation. :thumbup:


----------



## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Is that because you've found a _need_ for bigger injectors or because you just figure you might attract more women that way? There's no big reason to upgrade unless you are in _need_ (as demonstrated by super-high duty cycle from data logs or overly lean AFR, etc).


 Both _I think_  .  I actually should check my injector duty cycle. My tuner said my tune was at it's max due to limitations of the stock pump. So I am either going with epiceuro intank or the gensis intank (depends on how much of the fuel system I want to replace, different topic all together though). So of course there is the F23 going in to replace the old tired K04 :laugh:. And I don't think there is anyone running less than green giants with a F23. 



> The 500s ship (and are priced) with rail spacers but fit the plugs natively. The 630cc are provided (and priced) with height adapters and also fit the plugs directly. The 550cc require plug adapters. None of this should affect your decision in any way whatsoever. Functionally speaking, they're all completely transparent and irrelevant to operation.


  You are 200% correct, adapters/spacers should not but for some reason it does. I don't like having things that make other things fit. I would rather just have the part fit. Mo parts mo problems and such. :what: 



> For sure, you'll make more power with the 500cc than the 550cc. The 630cc are way oversized and won't deliver any extra value. So, don't go there. Finally, the dyno verified gains that we've shared from FrankenTurbo were done with GenII 500cc at 5bar. However, that was for improved atomization (which does contribute to the gains). A 3bar pressure would have been perfectly sufficient for achieving a proper AFR, however.


 ^ yeah I those :thumbup: 
really excited to see where I can go with the F23, will be a good learning experience and super fun/frustrating :laugh: 




> So, 500cc at a pressure that your pump can support is our recommendation. :thumbup:


 on the list she goes!


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

woodywoods86 said:


> I actually should check my injector duty cycle. My tuner said my tune was at it's max due to limitations of the stock pump.


 Then, don't mess with the injectors until you fix your pump situation. Your injector duty cycle is probably sky high but because the feed pressure drops as the boost increases.



> So I am either going with epiceuro intank or the gensis intank (depends on how much of the fuel system I want to replace, different topic all together though).


The current Genesis Intank Pump solution is fine for a 500cc at 3bar set up. The Epic Euro pump is waaaaay stronger and will allow you to do 5bar with ease. However, that open top makes me nervous... A more stout _Genesis II_ version is in the works now and is scheduled for January-ish release. It'll drop straight in exactly like OEM, will be *more* powerful, but will be offered at a comparable price.



> I don't like having things that make other things fit. I would rather just have the part fit. Mo parts mo problems and such. :what:


Yet you already know this is about SCIENCE and not sentiment. A slap dash arrangement of untested bits IS a risk.

[announcer voice]_Whereas these are Genesis bits that have been proven around the world for years. It's the brand we all TRUST._[/announcer voice]   eace:


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

any drop in setup for the R/TTq guys?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

theswoleguy said:


> any drop in setup for the R/TTq guys?


 Well if you or one of your haldex buddies have a dead pump assembly laying around they are willing to donate in the name of science...we can def get that ball rolling!:beer::wave:


----------



## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Then, don't mess with the injectors until you fix your pump situation. Your injector duty cycle is probably sky high but because the feed pressure drops as the boost increases.


 I guess you can't fix what you don't understand. I will be doing some logs today :laugh: 




> The current Genesis Intank Pump solution is fine for a 500cc at 3bar set up. The Epic Euro pump is waaaaay stronger and will allow you to do 5bar with ease. However, that open top makes me nervous... A more stout _Genesis II_ version is in the works now and is scheduled for January-ish release. It'll drop straight in exactly like OEM, will be *more* powerful, but will be offered at a comparable price.


 oooooo really. The only qualm I had with the gensis was that is uses the stock lines and I broke one of the quick connector going to the filter and I can't find those stupid OEM fittings (I have already had it blow off in the middle of the bay bridge, not fun), so I was going to just -AN the whole system and be done it with and the epiceuro would allow me to do that. 



> Yet you already know this is about SCIENCE and not sentiment. A slap dash arrangement of untested bits IS a risk.


 Reason I stopped playing 21. Even though Statistics dictate the game can't ever get over that gut feeling. 



> [announcer voice]_Whereas these are Genesis bits that have been proven around the world for years. It's the brand we all TRUST._[/announcer voice]   eace:


  I know


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Well if you or one of your haldex buddies have a dead pump assembly laying around they are willing to donate in the name of science...we can def get that ball rolling!:beer::wave:


 i could probably swing that being i do have an R chassis laying around somewhere around here, you cant have the TT one as i just got it running, had i known this weeks ago i wouldve gave you that one


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

theswoleguy said:


> i could probably swing that being i do have an R chassis laying around somewhere around here, you cant have the TT one as i just got it running, had i known this weeks ago i wouldve gave you that one


 well let me know and i will PM the shipping address.


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

woodywoods86 said:


> oooooo really. The only qualm I had with the Genesis was that it uses the stock lines


 Hey, that's a *feature*.   Good news is that the new version pump will be made available with -AN adaptation resembling what you see from Epic. There's really only one way to do it, so form must follow function. It'll work with the stock feed line, too. However, that will ultimately restrict the peak performance. Those that don't need the full flow capacity can stick with the OEM feed line and call it a day. :beer:


----------



## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Hey, that's a *feature*.   Good news is that the new version pump will be made available with -AN adaptation resembling what you see from Epic. There's really only one way to do it, so form must follow function. It'll work with the stock feed line, too. However, that will ultimately restrict the peak performance. Those that don't need the full flow capacity can stick with the OEM feed line and call it a day. :beer:


 Dammit you guys are GOOD! Waitin til January opcorn:


----------



## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

for a 400-500bhp motor what injector/pump combo would you advise?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

*FV-QR*

[email protected] with the 044 pump.


----------



## 87vr6 (Jan 17, 2002)

*FV-QR*

when is the "un-named" software company coming out with the files?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

87vr6 said:


> when is the "un-named" software company coming out with the files?


 Depends on them. I'd venture to say January-ish but again with the holidays approaching its up in the air.


----------



## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

When do you expect a large price increase on these injectors?


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> When do you expect a large price increase on these injectors?


 *
January-ish* :thumbup:


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> When do you expect a large price increase on these injectors?





[email protected] said:


> *
> January-ish* :thumbup:


 i may just order a set to have then so i avoid that lol


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

theswoleguy said:


> i may just order a set to have then so i avoid that lol


 We pledge not to stop you even if it hurts us deep down inside.







:laugh: :thumbup:


----------



## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> [email protected] with the 044 pump.


 did you get the injector data to dial in tvub etc?


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> We pledge not to stop you even if it hurts us deep down inside.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 lol good man, i need to get an adj regulator too for my BBM rail


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

badger5 said:


> did you get the injector data to dial in tvub etc?


 We have *ALL *such information, Bill. -just haven't gotten it prettied up and made ready for public release yet. Anybody that purchases before we officially release will get the information via email.


----------



## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

Wait why are we price increasing, the injectors?  

Can I do a rain check price  

Hell I will guarantee I will purchase some 500cc injectors *in writing* if you keep the same price I am just not quite ready to start collecting parts yet.


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

woodywoods86 said:


> Wait why are we price increasing, the injectors?


 -because they're priced only slightly above cost right now as a courtesy and incentive to early adopters.



> Can I do a rain check price


Nope. However, the 500cc are schedule to jump only $10, anyway. You'll live. :beer:


----------



## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Well if you or one of your haldex buddies have a dead pump assembly laying around they are willing to donate in the name of science...we can def get that ball rolling!:beer::wave:


 I literally just took out my old twin-pump setup (2003 TT quattro). Want me to send them out? I'm interested in that, and maybe some injectors...PM me if you'd like me to send them out :thumbup:


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

l88m22vette said:


> I literally just took out my old twin-pump setup (2003 TT quattro). Want me to send them out? I'm interested in that, and maybe some injectors...PM me if you'd like me to send them out :thumbup:


 Send it here to USRT World HQ and we'll make you a respectful deal on injectors or most anything else:
*
US Rally Team
29B 10th AVE
Haddon Heights, NJ 08035-1204*

We'll know very quickly whether this is a can/can't do. Depending on what we learn, we'll have the pump back in your hands immediately (if it's a "no go") or somewhat later (if we need to figure it out a bit over time). :beer:

P.S. Email box weight/dimensions and we'll email you a Priority Mail shipping label. Take it down to the Post Office and you'll/we'll be all set.


----------



## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> -because they're priced only slightly above cost right now as a courtesy and incentive to early adopters.
> 
> Nope. However, the 500cc are schedule to jump only $10, anyway. You'll live. :beer:


 I don't know... that is two beers! :sly: 

You are right though  they are still on the "to buy" list. :beer:


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

Do you want the whole setup, or just the main pump (on left, pass. side location)? I'll send all of it if you like though too, just let me know. That all sounds great Scott! :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

*FV-QR*

Go ahead and send the whole shebang :thumbup:


----------



## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

Packed and awaiting shipment label. For reference, the setup you see is how you'd look back at it from the (front) seats - main pump on pass. side left, secondary pump setup on driver side right.


----------



## styling5030 (Feb 13, 2009)

on seat leon supercopa witch quattro fuel tank 
 

Uploaded with ImageShack.us 

full pdf: 

http://www.lms-engineering.de/?page_id=13 

Teilekatalog


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

l88m22vette said:


> Packed and awaiting shipment label. For reference, the setup you see is how you'd look back at it from the (front) seats - main pump on pass. side left, secondary pump setup on driver side right.


 PM'd you


----------



## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

My info sent and parts packed (15x14x9), still waiting on label


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## abacorrado (Apr 5, 2005)

So what happens if you use 2 of the 044 pumps in series instead of parallel? Double the pressure, or too much resistance?


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

abacorrado said:


> So what happens if you use 2 of the 044 pumps in series instead of parallel? Double the pressure, or too much resistance?


 That would be a silly configuration. It may increase the pressure a LITTLE, but not double. It would also only increase flow A LITTLE. 

Pumps in parallel are far more useful. 

On a side note, what application are you thinking where you need more fuel pressure than the 044's can supply?


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

groggory said:


> That would be a silly configuration. It may increase the pressure a LITTLE, but not double. It would also only increase flow A LITTLE.


 This response is worth MONEY.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

*FV-QR*

Love the response we have gotten in this forum thus far. Thank you all for the support.


----------



## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

l88m22vette said:


> My info sent and parts packed (*15x14x9, 8lbs*), still waiting on label


:wave:


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

l88m22vette said:


> :wave:


Lemme put a bug in Scott's ear or i'll try and get it to you myself sometime in the next 24hrs (im on deployment so time is limited)


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

l88m22vette said:


> My info sent and parts packed (15x14x9), still waiting on label


pushed that info to Scott just now...sorry for the delay:beer:


----------



## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

I heard that a certain individual is giving the new Genesis II line full support :thumbup:


----------



## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

Just placed my order for 4 of these 630cc badboys. Are different length unspacer adapters necessary for aeb manifolds?


----------



## carsluTT (Dec 31, 2004)

any chance there will be "Genesis II 630cc" for AEB manifolds? maybe its been covered in one of these posts but i didn't see any info on them or see them on the site.

thanks


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

i need to stop dicking off and get some 1000cc's lol


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

carsluTT said:


> any chance there will be "Genesis II 630cc" for AEB manifolds? maybe its been covered in one of these posts but i didn't see any info on them or see them on the site.
> 
> thanks


just needs a set of unspacers:beer:


----------



## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

When is the price jump on 1000cc? I need to get a set of these for my buildup if nothing more than to get it to idle better than the garbage Siemens Deka 630's.


----------



## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> pushed that info to Scott just now...sorry for the delay:beer:


Sent the 225TT setup yesterday, let me know what you guys think


----------



## 87vr6 (Jan 17, 2002)

Is that matching software happening soon?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

*FV-QR*



87vr6 said:


> Is that matching software happening soon?


soon...not up to us at this point..




And in other news...here's a vid of a customers custom ITB 16v running 500cc Genesis II 



https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Kr2omrHs-J8


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Three3Se7en said:


> When is the price jump on 1000cc? I need to get a set of these for my buildup if nothing more than to get it to idle better than the garbage Siemens Deka 630's.


soon...no date yet.




Vegeta Gti said:


> i need to stop dicking off and get some 1000cc's lol


MAN THE HELL UP!


----------



## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

Still waiting on that shirt you guys owe me.:wave:


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Twopnt016v said:


> Still waiting on that shirt you guys owe me.:wave:


message passed:beer:


----------



## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> message passed:beer:


:thumbup::beer:


----------



## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

USRT t-shirt?? Where is mines?

I'm def calling Scott and asking him what's going and where my tee is 

I'm a hardcore USRT fan!


----------



## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> And in other news...here's a vid of a customers custom ITB 16v running 500cc Genesis II
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Kr2omrHs-J8



Wow!! What were the numbers on that?


----------



## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

Alright I'll go order a set then. 

EDIT: Ordered me a set for smallport! :wave::heart:


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Three3Se7en said:


> Alright I'll go order a set then.


do it to it!:thumbup: PM me.


----------



## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

Your Inbox is full.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

vdubguy97 said:


> Wow!! What were the numbers on that?


im trying to find out!


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Three3Se7en said:


> Your Inbox is full.


wow...that took a long time to fill i had two years of messages in there!

Anyway its clear now.


----------



## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

MK1 ITB:heart:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

vdubguy97 said:


> Wow!! What were the numbers on that?


175bhp

145lb-ft


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## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> 175bhp
> 
> 145lb-ft


I was gonna guess low 200's hp. 

But with that amount of horsepower in a car that weights as much as a coffee mug I'm sure its a blast. Let alone the sound of those ITB's.

P.S. Cant wait for the software company's to release these Genesis tune files.opcorn:


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

vdubguy97 said:


> I was gonna guess low 200's hp.
> 
> But with that amount of horsepower in a car that weights as much as a coffee mug I'm sure its a blast. Let alone the sound of those ITB's.
> 
> P.S. Cant wait for the software company's to release these Genesis tune files.opcorn:


you'd be hard pressed to make that much with the race sanction rules they have on sub 2000cc


----------



## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

Just got off the phone with Scott. Real nice guy and helped me with order. :thumbup: To these guys!:heart:


----------



## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

Did you guys get the pump setup?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

l88m22vette said:


> Did you guys get the pump setup?


Yes, thank you. :beer:


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

Cool, excited to see intank results...I'll say hey as far as other stuff ASAP :thumbup:


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

The videos are nice, but it would to see some actual flowsheets and pressure sensitivity charts for these injectors at different base pressures. :beer:

Similar to this link:

http://www.t1racedevelopment.com/en/blog/Are-all-2000cc-injectors-created-equal-.html


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> MAN THE HELL UP!


working on it, new house means new appliances, paying those off, the new bed, the elliptical, blah blah...

gonna hammer out some extra some extra timing belts and so on the next couple of weeks..then get to you..save me a set fool:beer:


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## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

Why the hell would you leave tape like that right in front of the ITBs?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

screwball said:


> Why the hell would you leave tape like that right in front of the ITBs?


i was thinking the same thing:screwy:


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## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

So they can flap in the WIIIIIIIIIND :laugh:


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Thanks to those who ordered this week!:beer:


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## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

Got mine in last night! :thumbup: For fast shipping and a quality product! :heart:


----------



## rhussjr (Aug 7, 2000)

Guys, Still waiting on software info for the 2.0 ABA Turbo...


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

PM'd


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

big ups...


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

Here's a log of my 630's dialed in. I've been keeping boost to a minimum because of the need to upgrade my fuel pump (USRT INTANK PUMP PLEASE!)lol. Genesis Intank isn't keeping up with the flow demands at 350+whp. You can see the dangerously high Injector pulsewidth in the higher rpms. I've since dropped to 12psi until I get the fuel pump situation worked out.

With that said After going from the Deka 630's to the G2 630's idle is rock solid. No stumbling or anything like that. Driveability is far better than the Deka's. 

I will note that the superior atomization helps reduce the knock correction. On average I'm seeing 1.5*-3* less corrections. Great product guys. This can/will translate into alittle more power. 

For the record that is my ignition timing on 93oct with water meth.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

spartiati said:


> Here's a log of my 630's dialed in. I've been keeping boost to a minimum because of the need to upgrade my fuel pump (USRT INTANK PUMP PLEASE!)lol. Genesis Intank isn't keeping up with the flow demands at 350+whp. You can see the dangerously high Injector pulsewidth in the higher rpms. I've since dropped to 12psi until I get the fuel pump situation worked out.
> 
> With that said After going from the Deka 630's to the G2 630's idle is rock solid. No stumbling or anything like that. Driveability is far better than the Deka's.
> 
> ...


 Thanks for the feedback!

We're working on the MUCH higher flowing GenesisII pumps as we speak.....shouldn't be long now...:beer:


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

finally geting mine 1000 set. i think i'm also gonna get a bigger pump, want to ensure the 225 that is stock isn't going to fail. so stoked. :beer:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Vegeta Gti said:


> finally geting mine 1000 set. i think i'm also gonna get a bigger pump, want to ensure the 225 that is stock isn't going to fail. so stoked. :beer:


whatchu need for a pump sir?


----------



## Gulfstream (Jul 28, 2010)

What is the minimum ON time for your 1600cc Genesis II injectors? 

Minimum pulsewith so to speak..


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

well, something that goes right into my CIS system, which most do already, but i'm looking for 300+lph


----------



## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

Vegeta Gti said:


> well, something that goes right into my CIS system, which most do already, but i'm looking for 300+lph


300+ lph at what pressure?


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

groggory said:


> 300+ lph at what pressure?


Time to switch to a diesel pump or set of pumps. Low pressure high volume into a high pressure pump like the diesel guys.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

the pump i'm looking at from arnold is voltage dependent, probably gonna with that cos arnold can make a nice little harness for it so i can get what i want out of it.

gotta remember. i'm CIS originally, so my fpr takes care of pressure, it's all about flow for me now. as my pump in the car is a 225 stock :]


----------



## Gulfstream (Jul 28, 2010)

My Walbro 450LPH pump delivers 390LPH @ 5bars. Also warranted for E85.


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

that's the one sir


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Gulfstream said:


> What is the minimum ON time for your 1600cc Genesis II injectors?
> 
> Minimum pulsewith so to speak..


 That's going to vary from one application to the next. I've seen as low as .125ms


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## Dave926 (Mar 30, 2005)

I know you said soon, but whats a realistic timeframe for the gen2 pump? My stock one is not doing so well, amd i need a replacement soon.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Dave926 said:


> I know you said soon, but whats a realistic timeframe for the gen2 pump? My stock one is not doing so well, amd i need a replacement soon.


for FWD Mk4 applications...about a month


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> for FWD Mk4 applications...about a month


How's it looking for the r/TT guys? Just curious no rush

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## TooLFan46n2 (Oct 18, 1999)

theswoleguy said:


> How's it looking for the r/TT guys? Just curious no rush
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


x2 I'm shopping for a R/TT drop in pump as well


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

theswoleguy said:


> How's it looking for the r/TT guys? Just curious no rush
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2





TooLFan46n2 said:


> x2 I'm shopping for a R/TT drop in pump as well


figure up to a month and a half on them. Waiting to have solid data on the new pump design before pushing production. :beer:


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

Is that being developed from the shot TTq setup I sent you guys? If so I'm glad it went to better use than the recycling bin


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## Dave926 (Mar 30, 2005)

Rough idea on price? Sorry I forgot to ask. I dont mind paying a reasonable premium over an OEM pump or the Gen1 unit so long as the performance is there.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

l88m22vette said:


> Is that being developed from the shot TTq setup I sent you guys? If so I'm glad it went to better use than the recycling bin


:beer::beer::thumbup: thank you



Dave926 said:


> Rough idea on price? Sorry I forgot to ask. I dont mind paying a reasonable premium over an OEM pump or the Gen1 unit so long as the performance is there.


not yet... but it will be very competitive:beer:


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

I'm desperately awaiting my injectors, so stoked

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

looking to replace my siemens 630s try to fix some idleing issues, gt3071 turbo safe to just switch them with the gen 2 630's?


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Vegeta Gti said:


> I'm desperately awaiting my injectors, so stoked
> 
> Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


they should ship out today. thanks :beer:



weenerdog3443 said:


> looking to replace my siemens 630s try to fix some idleing issues, gt3071 turbo safe to just switch them with the gen 2 630's?


Your tune should be adjusted for them. It will run but wont be *optimal*:thumbup:


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

Yo Q, your PM box is full.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Nevaeh_Speed said:


> Yo Q, your PM box is full.


fixed


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

thank you much to my ol friend Q










1000cc goodness, now awaiting my other ecu so Gonzo and myself can make some pwwrrzz

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

Ordered my 1000cc's today. Q is the man.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Vegeta Gti said:


> thank you much to my ol friend Q
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Thanks! I'm excited for you!



Nevaeh_Speed said:


> Ordered my 1000cc's today. Q is the man.


Thank you sir. Order is in:beer:


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

Genesis II 2000cc sitting pretty under an 034 Motorsport Rail.

Just started tuning for them today running E85. Idle was pretty damn good on initial start up even with just a 30% tweak to main fuel table.


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## One-Eight GTI (Jan 5, 2010)

Looking good guys... Vegeta looking forward to hearing about the results with the new Inj and Gonzo:thumbup::thumbup:


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

the Gonzo 630 w were song was solid, now with a better injector, should be insane. especially with my awic system being pumped up, get a larger fuel pump for safety, should be tits!!

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> Genesis II 2000cc sitting pretty under an 034 Motorsport Rail.
> 
> Just started tuning for them today running E85. Idle was pretty damn good on initial start up even with just a 30% tweak to main fuel table.


lookin foward to your results!:beer:


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> Genesis II 2000cc sitting pretty under an 034 Motorsport Rail.
> 
> Just started tuning for them today running E85. Idle was pretty damn good on initial start up even with just a 30% tweak to main fuel table.


I wouldn't just add 30% to your main fuel corrections. I would restore the previous map. 

You should use the injector wizard in Maestro to calculate a new injector constant. If you are using the 1000's then in the injector wizard just plug in 30%smaller for the injector flow rating and that should take care of it. Doing it via the main fuel corrections isn't going to be as refined and will have hiccups everywhere.


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

I reset main fuel correction and calculated the injector constant with the injector wizard for 2225cc of flow which is what these injectors flow at 3bar. That gave me a constant of .014. Then I added 30% to that number and it gave me a new constant of .019

How does that sound?


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

like guessing


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Vegeta Gti said:


> like guessing


hey hey hey, lets not get people riled up!

keep the thread clean.

Thank you.:beer:


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

sorry Q.

only for you i will stop.


still guessing


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

Vegeta Gti said:


> sorry Q.
> 
> only for you i will stop.
> 
> ...


Taken to pm's. Just trying to help him out with what he is trying to do with his tune. We'll keep the thread clean.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

a lot of double standard in here recently.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

:facepalm:



Vegeta Gti said:


> a lot of double standard in here recently.
> 
> Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


:facepalm:


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

Short video of Genesis 2000cc injectors idling on my car running E85 base tune.After I dial in the BVC table it will idle at 14.7 no problem. 

I had a 30 minute phone conversation with Scott prior to purchasing these injectors and he seemed pretty confident that the car WOULD NOT idle well with such a large injector. Needless to say I hope this removes some of the doubt in his mind that we can get these to work even on a street driven car.

For the record, the injector pulsewidth was hovering somewhere between 1.1 and 1.3 milliseconds


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

spartiati said:


> :facepalm:
> 
> 
> 
> :facepalm:


why..it's the truth.


----------



## SuicideGirls (Feb 20, 2013)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> Short video of Genesis 2000cc injectors idling on my car running E85 base tune.After I dial in the BVC table it will idle at 14.7 no problem.
> 
> I had a 30 minute phone conversation with Scott prior to purchasing these injectors and he seemed pretty confident that the car WOULD NOT idle well with such a large injector. Needless to say I hope this removes some of the doubt in his mind that we can get these to work even on a street driven car.
> 
> ...


Embed fail


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

SuicideGirls said:


> Embed fail


fixed


----------



## SuicideGirls (Feb 20, 2013)

At that AFR I hope you had positive pressure on your manifold, too.

Don't know how you even accomplished having the car idle so rich.

I will be grabbing a set of the 2000's and running E85 soon, though. Should be easy enough.


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

SuicideGirls said:


> At that AFR I hope you had positive pressure on your manifold, too.
> 
> Don't know how you even accomplished having the car idle so rich.
> 
> I will be grabbing a set of the 2000's and running E85 soon, though. Should be easy enough.


Once I subtract from the BVC table it will idle at 14.7:1. I had to add a bunch to the table at first because it was idling closer to 20:1 on the base BVC values.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

opcorn:


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> I had a 30 minute phone conversation with Scott prior to purchasing these injectors and he seemed pretty confident that the car WOULD NOT idle well with such a large injector. Needless to say I hope this removes some of the doubt in his mind that we can get these to work even on a street driven car.


I am delighted to be proven overly conservative with the advice, sir. *Bravo!* :beer: Frankly, what we've been sharing about these parts has been understatement. The Genesis II injectors are on a new level of quality. The fueling game has changed. Early adopters are realizing themselves. There's much to look forward to as the parts go mainstream. :thumbup:

Cheers,


----------



## Budsdubbin (Jul 14, 2008)

I had that backround on my laptop!!!! ha I will be going with the gen2's soon enough well done.:thumbup:


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

Got mine today... They look Freakin' great. Can't wait to put my new ecu in and fire this bad boy up... Now I just need some damn wheels. 3 months of sitting on jack stands is getting old. :screwy:


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

the 20 minutes my 1000cc ran today it was beautiful...then my fuel rails bolt hole threads decided to give [email protected] in 3rd gear....lucky my car didn't burst into flames...

so off to the machine shop to have to re-tapped a touch larger, and remove hte tap i broke off in it the intake manifold, but, these things are great. idle is crisp and smooooth and they just react. love them!!


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

Idle looking much better :thumbup:


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

these injectors are pretty fukn solid:thumbup::beer:

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

Too bad Unitronic hasn't released any tunes for these puppies, while other more competent tuners have...


----------



## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> Idle looking much better :thumbup:


There we go!! :thumbup:


----------



## VW indahouse (Feb 25, 2012)

Hi what injectors, pump and FPR for 3-400whp in a lightweight track car?

Already have a APR in tank pump do you recommend a small surge tank or add an inline pump or will the APR suffice? 

Plus already have a 4 bar reg. 

Cheers


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

VW indahouse said:


> Hi what injectors, pump and FPR for 3-400whp in a lightweight track car?
> 
> Already have a APR in tank pump do you recommend a small surge tank or add an inline pump or will the APR suffice?
> 
> ...


i would suggest the 500cc GenII and walbro 255 or bosch 044 pump inline. :thumbup:


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## VW indahouse (Feb 25, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> i would suggest the 500cc GenII and walbro 255 or bosch 044 pump inline. :thumbup:


Thank you  so no surge tank required?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

VW indahouse said:


> Thank you  so no surge tank required?


not unless you're doing heavy track use!


----------



## VW indahouse (Feb 25, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> not unless you're doing heavy track use!


Only sprint type events?


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

VW indahouse said:


> Only sprint type events?


drag race, nah.


----------



## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

Vegeta Gti said:


> the 20 minutes my 1000cc ran today it was beautiful...then my fuel rails bolt hole threads decided to give [email protected] in 3rd gear....lucky my car didn't burst into flames...
> 
> so off to the machine shop to have to re-tapped a touch larger, and remove hte tap i broke off in it the intake manifold, but, these things are great. idle is crisp and smooooth and they just react. love them!!



Holly ****, man your lucky... Gad to hear the car and yourself are ok.


----------



## VW indahouse (Feb 25, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> drag race, nah.


No sorry, Circuit sprints like Time Attack.


----------



## StaceyS3 (Sep 22, 2012)

Like to say a big thanks to Quintin @ usrt for sorting me and a friend out with two sets of gen 2 injectors (1000cc and 630cc) can't wait to get them in and running :beer:


----------



## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

StaceyS3 said:


> Like to say a big thanks to Quintin @ usrt for sorting me and a friend out with two sets of gen 2 injectors (1000cc and 630cc) can't wait to get them in and running :beer:


:thumbup:

Those injectors are REALLY the *shit* :thumbup:


----------



## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

Nevaeh_Speed said:


> Holly ****, man your lucky... Gad to hear the car and yourself are ok.


telling me!! good thing i have two FIA approved extinguishers in the car lol

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

VW indahouse said:


> No sorry, Circuit sprints like Time Attack.


Quintin's advice is spot on. :thumbup: The Bosch 044 or Walbro inline is a smart investment for supporting the 550cc running close to max safe duty cycle. A surge tank isn't *necessary*. However, it also can't hurt. Here's how USRT is putting two 044s to work at the same time along with Genesis II 500cc injectors running at *6bar* base pressure (for extra fine atomization).










We're feeding both ends of the fuel rail to make it work (although only one side is visible here):


----------



## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

That's one sick 8v you've got there Scott.


----------



## Dave926 (Mar 30, 2005)

groggory said:


> That's one sick 8v you've got there Scott.


I recognize that holset from anywhere. Pretty sure its q's car.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Dave926 said:


> I recognize that holset from anywhere. Pretty sure its q's car.


yep and it's now scott's


----------



## 02vwgolf (Oct 6, 2009)

Can't wait to see how that air/water setup turns out:thumbup:

Sent from my VS840 4G using Tapatalk 2


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

sent you a PM scott...

Man i may think about a dual feed setup for high volume Corn...


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Dave926 said:


> I recognize that holset from anywhere. Pretty sure its q's car.


Mighty Q. built it first. :beer: Now, we're smoothing over the rough edges and elevating the game in general. The original heart and soul remains because it was *darned good*. The idea now isn't to make more power so much as improve response, chassis refinement, handling, and braking. It's now nearly ready for the road race track whereas before it was a muscle car.


----------



## vr6 nitrous (sweden) (Dec 18, 2002)

Looking good Scott!!


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

got Fuel?


----------



## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

1000cc @ 3bar or 630cc @ 5bar for 425-475whp?


----------



## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

vdubguy97 said:


> 1000cc @ 3bar or 630cc @ 5bar for 425-475whp?


630cc at 5 bar = 813cc at 3 bar
At 80% IDC and .55 BSFC that will support 450 flywheel horsepower or 369 whp


.......

475 whp at 18% driveline losses = 560 Hp

At .55 BSFC and 80% IDC that's 1010 cc/ min

You need 1000cc/min of fuel flow to make 560 flywheel horsepower with these parameters

...

Your tune and engine determine your exact BSFC. People often exceed 80% IDC; it is not recommended as the injectors go out of their linear region.


----------



## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

Thanks!! 1000cc @3bar it is then.


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## 87vr6 (Jan 17, 2002)

*FV-QR*

So it's march.. Any word on the software..?


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

87vr6 said:


> So it's march.. Any word on the software..?


Here's the story on that. Back in December, a 1.8T engine was on the dyno. Production for these new parts did not ramp up fast enough to get the parts to the company during December. They did arrive just after the New Year and have sat idle since then. The 1.8T was removed from the dyno and newer 3.0l and 4.2l software development began. We're told that the 1.8T will go back into the cycle at some time in the future. We've got nothing more to go on than that which the tuner has shared with us. Our patience is running a bit thin, but all we can do is wait... for now...

If you'd like software created for the proven _Genesis II_ line, then reach out to the company you prefer and push them *hard*. Be assertive. Convey the value that you've seen testing prove and demonstrate. USRT continues to do what we can in the background, but ultimately consumers drive corporate investment.

We're just the folks with the *best VW/Audi injectors* *anywhere in the world*. :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

I love lamp.


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

I remember this picture for the early audizine days.













Still haven't fired up my car but the 1000cc's are installed. Need a new battery car has been sitting forever.


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## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

Money sent for 1000cc injectors!!!! Can't wait for these and the new tune!!!!!


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

Started my car yesterday, started right up w/ no issues. Gonzo tune seems to work just fine with these bad boys.


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Nevaeh_Speed said:


> Started my car yesterday, started right up w/ no issues. Gonzo tune seems to work just fine with these bad boys.


What size are you working with and what's the throttle response like like? -any comments about cold start, steady cruise stability, idle quality, and all other measures of refinement?


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## suffocatemymind (Dec 10, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> What size are you working with and what's the throttle response like like? -any comments about cold start, steady cruise stability, idle quality, and all other measures of refinement?


opcorn:


----------



## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> What size are you working with and what's the throttle response like like? -any comments about cold start, steady cruise stability, idle quality, and all other measures of refinement?


I'm on jack stands at the moment. Cold idle was choppie, but worked it's way back to normal in a few minutes. The throttle response is much nicer than my old 550cc revo file. 

I will make a video this week and post up, but I'm on a base file at the moment as Vegeta is the only 1000cc person I know willing to give Gonzo a chance.:wave:


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

I'm confident the G2 1000cc's will become the new 830's 

They are freaking awesome. I want to see how the 2k's fare out on gas, though ic:


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## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

Nevaeh_Speed said:


> but I'm on a base file at the moment as Vegeta is the only 1000cc person I know willing to give Gonzo a chance.:wave:



I will be working with gonzo on a 1000cc file genesis 2 injector. Just waiting for the injectors to come in!!!


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

vdubguy97 said:


> I will be working with gonzo on a 1000cc file genesis 2 injector. Just waiting for the injectors to come in!!!


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

any word on unitronic updating the 630cc tune for these?


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

speed51133! said:


> any word on unitronic updating the 630cc tune for these?


No, sir.


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

Gonzo seems to be able to upgrade the unitronic tunes just fine.


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

gdoggmoney said:


> Gonzo seems to be able to upgrade the unitronic tunes just fine.


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

opcorn: Inb4gonzotuninggangbang


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

vdubguy97 said:


> I will be working with gonzo on a 1000cc file genesis 2 injector. Just waiting for the injectors to come in!!!


Gonzo and i have been working on it for a couple weeks man

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

gdoggmoney said:


> Gonzo seems to be able to upgrade the unitronic tunes just fine.


Truth or fallacy?

Thought about getting a set for my 870 replacement and tweaking with custom settings

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

theswoleguy said:


> Truth or fallacy?
> 
> Thought about getting a set for my 870 replacement and tweaking with custom settings
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


Give it a shot. Im sure it will "run" just like it "runs" now.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

JohnnyLlama said:


> Give it a shot. Im sure it will "run" just like it "runs" now.


Troll hard much?

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

theswoleguy said:


> Troll hard much?
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


You asked soemthing and I replied.

Justy drop them in, let fuel trims settle, grab UniSettings and apply whatever your fuel trims say. Clear codes, go to town.

I'm sure it would work. Not optimal, but whatever.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

I was inquiring to Gonzo modifying uni code. I'm not worried about getting these to work with my current setup I'm well aware on how to dial them in in regards to fuel trims, I got 630s to run on a vr maf and straight e85 for stock turbo madness go look it up and wrote about it for other users to follow during the initial e85 craze. So take your cute replies and keep them to your self unless contributing.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## Budsdubbin (Jul 14, 2008)

Vegeta Gti said:


> Gonzo and i have been working on it for a couple weeks man
> 
> Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


Weeks? you'd think a injector swap specially with these g2's would be relatively easy to calibrate.


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## Gonzzz (Apr 27, 2010)

theswoleguy said:


> I was inquiring to Gonzo modifying uni code. I'm not worried about getting these to work with my current setup I'm well aware on how to dial them in in regards to fuel trims, I got 630s to run on a vr maf and straight e85 for stock turbo madness go look it up and wrote about it for other users to follow during the initial e85 craze. So take your cute replies and keep them to your self unless contributing.
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


Do you really think Gonzo wants to edit other people's tunes? Stop to think for a second. He is in the tune MAKING business. Not tune editing business. We have other people on here for editing tunes (you know who I'm talking about).


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

Budsdubbin said:


> Weeks? you'd think a injector swap specially with these g2's would be relatively easy to calibrate.


weeks as i got my injectors, we did a bailee barred on my old 630 he made, then i toe my car down for awic upgrades.

we decided to go from scratch and my coolant flange blew after 5 years. got back to work and then my fan and fan switch died.

its hard when both people work and there is a 6 hour time difference, so quit nit picking like fukn vultures.

i also require some special things for my swap. i don't own a crayon smelling lead sled remember.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

JohnnyLlama said:


> Do you really think Gonzo wants to edit other people's tunes? Stop to think for a second. He is in the tune MAKING business. Not tune editing business. We have other people on here for editing tunes (you know who I'm talking about).


 i think where the confusion here is that he can overwrite the code not modify it...but hey i could be wrong, lets just leave it be please :beer:


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> i think where the confusion here is that he can overwrite the code not modify it...but hey i could be wrong, lets just leave it be please :beer:


:thumbup: :beer:


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> i think where the confusion here is that he can overwrite the code not modify it...but hey i could be wrong, lets just leave it be please :beer:


Yes, correct. That is what I meant. He can overwrite that specific portion leaving the rest in tact. :beer:


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## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

Scott or Quintin, Any word on that Gensis II in-tank for the MK4?


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

woodywoods86 said:


> Scott or Quintin, Any word on that Genesis II in-tank for the MK4?


We'll begin releasing test data in about 10 days, I reckon. At the moment, we can only provide the rig 12v from a car battery. However, for best demonstration of capabilities, we really need to give it 13.8V. So, we just ordered in a new power supply for it. We're getting there. Thanks for asking. eace:


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

cables and hook it up to a running alternator powered by any motor (electric or gas)!


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## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> We'll begin releasing test data in about 10 days, I reckon. At the moment, we can only provide the rig 12v from a car battery. However, for best demonstration of capabilities, we really need to give it 13.8V. So, we just ordered in a new power supply for it. We're getting there. Thanks for asking. eace:


opcorn:
In for the Data


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

speed51133! said:


> cables and hook it up to a running alternator powered by any motor (electric or gas)!


That's impractical for doing laboratory-grade testing. No matter, though; we've got the proper solution only a few days away.

I do have *GREAT NEWS*, however. We have successfully adapted the existing design for AWD use. So, all y'all with R32s, TTqs, and A3qs should be taken care of with very little delay. Who's ready to party? :beer:


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> That's impractical for doing laboratory-grade testing. No matter, though; we've got the proper solution only a few days away.
> 
> I do have *GREAT NEWS*, however. We have successfully adapted the existing design for AWD use. So, all y'all with R32s, TTqs, and A3qs should be taken care of with very little delay. Who's ready to party? :beer:


Thus guy as I could use a new pump

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

woodywoods86 said:


> Scott or Quintin, Any word on that Gensis II in-tank for the MK4?


 



 
Our custom test bench is now set up and fully functional. Stand by for updates. It's going to get interesting very soon, folks.


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## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

Cool rig Scott! :thumbup:


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## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Our custom test bench is now set up and fully functional. Stand by for updates. It's going to get interesting very soon, folks.


 Dammit I can't see it on my work computer :banghead: 

Wait it is on youtube checking the phone!


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## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

I got a video of the Gen 2's 1000cc at idle... 

Base file from Gonzo tuning. Cars on jack stands so there is not way to dial it in, but great for a base. I will be replacing this one with a cold start video tomorrow hopefully.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

my car runs awesome, purrss


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## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

Got the 1000cc injectors installed and the Gonzo tuning up and running today. Previous parts were Delphi 830cc injectors and Unitronic tuning. The car idles great, drives like a factory mk4 1.8t again but with a lot more power when needed:laugh:. No more backfires or cold start misfires. The combo of Genesis II 1000cc injectors and the Gonzo tune is perfect!! 

I tried to get a full throttle video but holding the phone and driving was near impossible, will have to rig something up!! 


Idle video with *Genesis II 1000cc* and *Gonzo Tuning*. 




 

4th gear low rpm on and off throttle. No backfires unlike the old setup which had crazy backfires.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

Do you guys know if this will fit in the TT/R32 tanks? 

walbro 465LPH 

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/526211-walbro-450-E85-pump


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

theswoleguy said:


> Do you guys know if this will fit in the TT/R32 tanks?
> 
> walbro 465LPH


 It will not fit the stock Mk4 basket. Nor does it allow the factory surge tank function to work even if it did fit. (We tried.) The flow/pressure curve is great. This pump is really stout. However, it just doesn't play nice with the car itself. No worries, our testing is moving along with the _Genesis II_ solution.


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

:thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> It will not fit the stock Mk4 basket. Nor does it allow the factory surge tank function to work even if it did fit. (We tried.) The flow/pressure curve is great. This pump is really stout. However, it just doesn't play nice with the car itself. No worries, our testing is moving along with the _Genesis II_ solution.


 Hey! Who said you could leave the lab!?:laugh:


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> It will not fit the stock Mk4 basket. Nor does it allow the factory surge tank function to work even if it did fit. (We tried.) The flow/pressure curve is great. This pump is really stout. However, it just doesn't play nice with the car itself. No worries, our testing is moving along with the _Genesis II_ solution.


 Thanks Scott, was looking towards long term e85 involvement.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

theswoleguy said:


> Do you guys know if this will fit in the TT/R32 tanks?
> 
> walbro 465LPH
> 
> http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/526211-walbro-450-E85-pump


 
i have been looking at that pump for my mkI

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> It will not fit the stock Mk4 basket. Nor does it allow the factory surge tank function to work even if it did fit. (We tried.) The flow/pressure curve is great. This pump is really stout. However, it just doesn't play nice with the car itself. No worries, our testing is moving along with the _Genesis II_ solution.


 Arnold can make that 450 pump work with his aftermarket basket. He can actually fit 2 of them in there for crazy power setups


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> ... aftermarket basket...


 key word there.:beer:


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## LEBGTIMK4 (Sep 13, 2010)

Well, I read the first 3~4 pages, but i have a question since i am getting the GenesisII 500cc to work with the F21T. Would these work fine with 3Bar FPR? or I need to switch to 4 bar or 5 bar, since i think it is too much fueling for 260WHP, right? and i have an intake Walbro 255, it is fine too right? 
Cheers for the answer.:beer:


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

LEBGTIMK4 said:


> Well, I read the first 3~4 pages, but i have a question since i am getting the GenesisII 500cc to work with the F21T. Would these work fine with 3Bar FPR? or I need to switch to 4 bar or 5 bar, since i think it is too much fueling for 260WHP, right? and i have an intake Walbro 255, it is fine too right?
> Cheers for the answer.:beer:


 All of that is dependent on your tune. Sure you can throw them in and they may or may not work OK. 

For 260WHP a 3 bar is likely enough. Intank walbro's have starvation issues when low on fuel and cornering in the MKIV chassis. Inline Walbro with the stock intank is a better option. USRT is taking care of that with their GEN 2 pump which has not yet been released (I'm patiently waiting).


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## LEBGTIMK4 (Sep 13, 2010)

spartiati said:


> All of that is dependent on your tune. Sure you can throw them in and they may or may not work OK.
> 
> For 260WHP a 3 bar is likely enough. Intank walbro's have starvation issues when low on fuel and cornering in the MKIV chassis. Inline Walbro with the stock intank is a better option. USRT is taking care of that with their GEN 2 pump which has not yet been released (I'm patiently waiting).


 I am getting a Custom tune hence i will check with my tuner, anyway i got a spare 4bar Bosch FPR in my garage in case i need it. 
if i am not mistaken the Walbro intake can be installed inline with the correct accessories, but i didn't want to go with relay and wires, i guess i souldn't let the fuel level go under the half of the Tank, right? 
Cheers,


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> Arnold can make that 450 pump work with his aftermarket basket. He can actually fit 2 of them in there for crazy power setups


 Normally I see you and others bickering in a rage of insults and smartassness...

Thanks for the info...

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

theswoleguy said:


> Normally I see you and others bickering in a rage of insults and smartassness...
> 
> Thanks for the info...
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


 That was almost a compliment I think 

For what it's worth you can fit 2 aeromotive stealth pumps in the stock basket or use the epic euro tuning double pumper. 2 of those aeromotive pumps are enough to support 800 hp on the right size fuel line


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> For what it's worth you can fit 2 aeromotive stealth pumps in the stock basket or use the epic euro tuning double pumper. 2 of those aeromotive pumps are enough to support 800 hp on the right size fuel line


 However, when doing this, the factory surge tank function is eliminated.


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> However, when doing this, the factory surge tank function is eliminated.


 And a good turn = lean boom.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

i need to find more info on this Gonzo Fella... havent really cared as my uni file hasnt been a problem but i like the adjustability a few of you guys have mentioned, plus I am adding a SEM manifold and I would like to be able to tune for big injectors on 93 and have them double for Corn.


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## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

theswoleguy said:


> i need to find more info on this Gonzo Fella... havent really cared as my uni file hasnt been a problem but i like the adjustability a few of you guys have mentioned, plus I am adding a SEM manifold and I would like to be able to tune for big injectors on 93 and have them double for Corn.


 I need to send my ECU to UNI for adjustments, but after shipping and all associated cost, it might be enough to just pay for another tune from Gonzo.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

T-Boy said:


> I need to send my ECU to UNI for adjustments, but after shipping and all associated cost, it might be enough to just pay for another tune from Gonzo.


 x2 plus i hear other things he can do without constant tweaks nad annoyance from uni... get on gchat


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

i'm 6 hours behind the eastcoast, and i have had zero issues with gonzo getting me flashed or with getting him info or just talking to him about bull****. 

car runs awesome, now i just need to have a fukn day off to get it inspected so i can get out there and really wail this bad chicken for a finer tune. i've had the base file for weeks but been so swamped. 

gonzo ftmfw


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

X2.....Nothing but good experiences with Gonzo! Get with it swoleguy!...You won't be sorry!


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

Twopnt016v said:


> X2.....Nothing but good experiences with Gonzo! Get with it swoleguy!...You won't be sorry!


 Do you rock his tune?

I got 35r built motor and sem with 80mm mafless that needs love. Pm me both of you veg and 2.016v, don't want to derail Scotty thread

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

:beer::beer:


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## Budsdubbin (Jul 14, 2008)

Thought I'd give scott a bump for helping me pick out a ideal fuel setup for my build. He's just a great guy to talk to and very knowlegable about the products he sells. Orders placed and I'll post up my review in the next week or two regarding my experience dialing the 1000's in compared to my ev14 750cc/siemen deka 630cc injectors. Proper atomization should help with my spool, mid range get up and drivability so I'm pretty stoked to get them in.


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## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

Budsdubbin said:


> Thought I'd give scott a bump for helping me pick out a ideal fuel setup for my build. He's just a great guy to talk to and very knowlegable about the products he sells. Orders placed and I'll post up my review in the next week or two regarding my experience dialing the 1000's in compared to my ev14 750cc/siemen deka 630cc injectors. Proper atomization should help with my spool, mid range get up and drivability so I'm pretty stoked to get them in.


Where's the "Like" button.


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## crazyass713 (Dec 28, 2006)

Can you make me anything 1000cc+ in 34mm Scott? I didn't see anything on the website that looked to be 34mm and there is no lengths listed (assuming the shorter ones pictured are 48's)


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

crazyass713 said:


> Can you make me anything 1000cc+ in 34mm Scott?


The Easter Bunny hid my calipers from me, but I'm pretty sure we have the 1000cc and 2000cc in this stubby format. :thumbup:

P.S. Thanks for the positivity, fellas. :heart:


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## crazyass713 (Dec 28, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> The Easter Bunny hid my calipers from me, but I'm pretty sure we have the 1000cc and 2000cc in this stubby format. :thumbup:
> 
> P.S. Thanks for the positivity, fellas. :heart:


Let me know when that bastard returns them haha 

Enjoy your Easter :beer:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

WHOO! 10pages! :laugh:

We really appreciate all the support and positive feedback!:thumbup::beer:


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

*Genesis II PUMP data release*

Things are looking GOOD, fellas. The pump engineering project has taken on epic proportions. There is so much to learn about these devices.The OEM pump's function is typically taken for granted. However, in reality, it's completely GENIUS and hard to duplicate. As far as I know, not one company in the aftermarket has ever designed a properly working intank pump/surge tank solution. Rather, it's just a "pump on a stick" deal that starves around corners when the level is low. This is NOT acceptable to USRT.

Good news is that "hard" isn't enough to deter the Genesis development crew. The upcoming _Genesis II_ system will deliver incredible flow performance while retaining completely factory surge protection. Fitment will be straight forward with a high-flow fuel line option to drop in as well. Both FWD and AWD versions will be offered for Mk4 vehicles. Whats more, the proprietary technology can be ported to other cars, too. So, everybody's going to get the goodies sooner or later. 

Without further ado, here's the performance chart for gasoline. The numbers will be somewhat different with e85 (which the system *is* rated for). Also, AWD numbers will be slightly lower given the greater driveline loss plus burden to carry fuel from one side of the tank to the other:


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## Budsdubbin (Jul 14, 2008)

Great news this pump will be a perfect fit for 95% of the community!


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

summer is fast approaching! Lets finish those builds!:beer:


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

Oh man want awd pump  TT passed emissions yesterday. Needs engine mounts and some 1000.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

theswoleguy said:


> Oh man want awd pump  TT passed emissions yesterday. Needs engine mounts and some 1000.
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


 lets put an order in!


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

is the AWD pump avail?


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

theswoleguy said:


> is the AWD pump avail?


 Both FWD and AWD pumps will be made available. :thumbup: All bench testing is finished. CAD work is almost done. The next step is rapid prototyping.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Both FWD and AWD pumps will be made available. :thumbup: All bench testing is finished. CAD work is almost done. The next step is rapid prototyping.


 oh sweet... you provided all the fueling for this car back a couple years when my friend Josh owned it. Now this Josh owns it lol.


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

:laugh:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Our new 380cc now added to the lineup!


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## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Both FWD and AWD pumps will be made available.





[email protected] said:


> Our new 380cc now added to the lineup!


 If we factor in your AWD in-tank, with a strong "FrankenPump" inline, what bar of fuel rail pressure could we push the new 380s to? Are they high-pressure friendly? E85 compatible?


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> If we factor in your AWD in-tank, with a strong "FrankenPump" inline, what bar of fuel rail pressure could we push the new 380s to? Are they high-pressure friendly? E85 compatible?


 They will handle up to 8bar rail pressure as well. I want to say yes to E85 but i will confirm it tomorrow.:beer:


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Ok so i made a boo-boo the new injectors are ***330cc****. They are E85 compatible and Doug the Genesis II Pump will over power your franken pump making the setup not ideal.:beer:


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## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

but is that Genesis2 pump capable of 8bar base pressure? that and another 2bar of boost?


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

why would you want to run over 150psi through your fuel rail, are you making your own 1.8TFSI motor?


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## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

18T_BT said:


> why would you want to run over 150psi through your fuel rail, are you making your own 1.8TFSI motor?


 Kinda, yeah. I don't know if you're aware, but we've expanded our F23 turbos into the FSI and TSI engines. And it's just really disheartening to see the power those direct-injection engines make. Granted, they're running ~120*bar*, but maybe there's some advantage in only 8-10bar on our lowly 20valves.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

One more satisfied customer! 

Running 500cc.. 

Out the box with the BVC values dialed in: 

Genesis II 500cc injector AFR demo from [email protected] on Vimeo.



Note the incredibly ROCK SOLID idle and AFR! 

Compare that to the typical idle bounce/hunting seen with inferior injectors such as the Siemens Deka 630cc which this customer *removed *in favor of the Genesis II. 

The superior atomization, spray pattern, and response time of these injectors shines through and through and will be further demonstrated by just driving the car. The better injector results in much smoother torque curve and delivery. Thus, cruising and acceleration are much smoother and linear. 

We're making it happen folks, one car at a time!:beer:


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> but is that Genesis2 pump capable of 8bar base pressure? that and another 2bar of boost?


 The pump does not like high pressures. It has great flow but not at that level. 


The injectors wont even handle that... 

the GenII 330 and 500cc are responsive up to 8bar (base+boost) 

the larger GenII are responsive up to 9bar (base+boost)


----------



## Turkbo (Aug 20, 2008)

Hey Scott,

Are the 2000cc injectors compatible with 3.2 24V?


----------



## One-Eight GTI (Jan 5, 2010)

Turkbo said:


> Hey Scott,
> 
> Are the 2000cc injectors compatible with 3.2 24V?


Damn thats alot of injector for a 6 cylinder, are you making 1200 HP


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

One-Eight GTI said:


> Damn thats alot of injector for a 6 cylinder, are you making 1200 HP


He may be using corn...

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


----------



## One-Eight GTI (Jan 5, 2010)

theswoleguy said:


> He may be using corn...
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


Yeah but with Even 1600cc injectors with corn you can run up pretty high on a six cylinder, 1000+ horsepower

*1000cc *Flow at 3bar base pressure is perfect to support power in the mid-500s with 1.8T engine or 800s with R32.**

Genesis II 1000cc injector spray demo from [email protected] on Vimeo.




*1600cc *Flow at 3bar base pressure is perfect to support about 600hp with 1.8T engine on e85 or over 1000 with R32.##**

Genesis II 1600cc injector spray demo from [email protected] on Vimeo.




*2000cc* Flow at 3bar base pressure is perfect to support about 800hp with 1.8T engine on e85 or over 1200 with R32.##**

Genesis II 2000cc injector spray demo from [email protected] on Vimeo.


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

Well aware lol. You never know he may be going for allot of boost lol... 

I want to go back to corn just don't feel like redoing my fuel system.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## One-Eight GTI (Jan 5, 2010)

theswoleguy said:


> Well aware lol. You never know he may be going for allot of boost lol...
> 
> I want to go back to corn just don't feel like redoing my fuel system.
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


Very true:thumbup:

I'm tempted to get some 1600cc Injectors next summer and go corn and forget about W/M... I have 910cc now but no info on the injectors as far as where to set BVC ect... USRT supplies all the info needed on there injectors which would be nice..

I've talked to a few guys around town as I was in the same boat as you didn't want to redo all my fuel lines Ect as E85 you should run special fuel lines ect... I was told by a few guys that what I have would be fine (everything AN) they have been running E85 for years with no issues with somewhat same setup just different cars


----------



## GloryFreak (Feb 20, 2009)

Any updates on the GenII in tank pump? I looked on the website and all I saw was the FWD GenI ???


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

GloryFreak said:


> Any updates on the GenII in tank pump? I looked on the website and all I saw was the FWD GenI ???


The best source for GenII pump updates is the thread that discusses it specifically. In general, though, the final round (we suspect) of bench testing is going on right now. The last discovery was that the pump was strong enough to overwhelm the previous setup's check valve. It's been increased in flow area. More news should be released very shortly. Again, though, see the pump thread for details and let's discuss injectors here. :thumbup:


----------



## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

One-Eight GTI said:


> I've talked to a few guys around town as I was in the same boat as you didn't want to redo all my fuel lines Ect as E85 you should run special fuel lines ect... I was told by a few guys that what I have would be fine (everything AN) they have been running E85 for years with no issues with somewhat same setup just different cars


The OEM lines are pretty much golden for E85.

AN lines with butyl rubber are not E85 safe. E85 will harden the rubber over time and will cause it to slowly disentegrate. As it does this little rubber bits will either start filling up your fuel filter or will make it to your injectors...which doesn't sound like a good thing.

I have had long talks about this with Mitch @ Deering Industries in Long Beach, CA and I trust his opinion. He's been doing lines, fittings, and accessories for over 30 years. He works with race boats, trucks, cars, airplanes, aerospace, submarines, etc etc. He know what hose works where. He's shown me pictures of customer's AN hoses with crumbled insides. His solution is simple. If you want to use AN lines with modern fuels, use PTFE lined hose. Period. It's a bit pricier, but it works and is 100% ethanol (and most other chemicals) compatible.

If you need to use a rubber line, use something that is modern fuels safe such as the Gates Barricade line of hose.

If you need to put a rubber line in your fuel tank...just don't. Go figure something out like a corrugated PTFE hose or something.


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## superkarl (Dec 18, 2012)

*Question for USRT*

i had my 630s in my stock S3 inlet mani. 

without unspacers:



with spacers:



im guessing i dont want the injector seated so far in the manifold as in the unspaced injector picture?
As it seems the spray pattern will be all over the floor and walls of the port?

so the spaced fitment is ideal injector nozzle position (like oem) in that fuel shouldnt line the walls. And that all i need to do is space my fuel rail up the distance pictured? 
Its no problem to do, and will manufacture my own from a rod of alloy. 
Was just curious is the first setup was common with these long nosed injectors.


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## Budsdubbin (Jul 14, 2008)

I've used washers before to space the manifold on my old siemens 630cc. Worst case senario that will do just fine.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

superkarl said:


> Its no problem to do, and will manufacture my own from a rod of alloy.


Dude, support the vw vendors if they have a product at a reasonable price. You don't have to, but $$$ fuels innovation. Just sayin


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Still going strong! 

I bought EIGHT 630cc for myself to ring in 2014...


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

Would it be a problem to post flow data and battery voltage compensation values for all of your injectors?


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## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

waiting for your pumpto power my corn feed inj. 

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk


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## LEBGTIMK4 (Sep 13, 2010)

Well Here is the BVC I got from Scott for the 500cc GenesisII



> Fuel Pressure
> PSID ----8 Volts-------10 Volts----12 Volts------14 Volts--------16 Volts--------Flow
> 43.5-----1.91-----------1.185------0.82----------0.59------------0.42------------500
> 45-------2.12-----------1.25--------0.86----------0.61------------0.44------------509
> ...


Hopes it helps,
:beer:


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## CupraR Carl (Jul 28, 2013)

I currently run the standard 550 genesis injectors @ 3 bar and they are great. I don't have any facility to adjust the tune but would I see a benefit if I was to run a 4 bar reg and use the 500cc genesis II injector as flow will only increase to 577cc. I use wmi and have a SEM manifold if that makes a difference on a small port AMK head. My 550's run at approximately 85% duty cycle. I like the look of the excellent atomisation but am a little confused as to why the 630's and the 500's have different spray patterns.


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## LEBGTIMK4 (Sep 13, 2010)

CupraR Carl said:


> I currently run the standard 550 genesis injectors @ 3 bar and they are great. I don't have any facility to adjust the tune but would I see a benefit if I was to run a 4 bar reg and use the 500cc genesis II injector as flow will only increase to 577cc. I use wmi and have a SEM manifold if that makes a difference on a small port AMK head. My 550's run at approximately 85% duty cycle. I like the look of the excellent atomisation but am a little confused as to why the 630's and the 500's have different spray patterns.


Well Carl, I have 500cc GII with 4bar FPR, and everyone asked me why the hell I didn't get a 550cc with 3 bar.

I got the 500cc because I heard they are better and I know mine are running excellent!!!

Cheers,


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## CupraR Carl (Jul 28, 2013)

LEBGTIMK4 said:


> Well Carl, I have 500cc GII with 4bar FPR, and everyone asked me why the hell I didn't get a 550cc with 3 bar.
> 
> I got the 500cc because I heard they are better and I know mine are running excellent!!!
> 
> Cheers,


That's great to hear, if the 500's were available at the time I'd have done the same as you. It looks like you've got a superior injector with head room to grow as the cars power develops .....as soon as the usrt pump is available.


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> Would it be a problem to post flow data and battery voltage compensation values for all of your injectors?


I've been meaning to do this for a while and just haven't had the time to get to it. Data will be made public "soonish or later".


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

CupraR Carl said:


> I like the look of the excellent atomization but am a little confused as to why the 630's and the 500's have different spray patterns.


Each injector is designed to provide a different mix of benefits for different applications. For example, the Genesis II 500cc are optimized for atomization. This makes cold start easier and boosts mid-range torque along with sharpening throttle response. Peak power doesn't change a whole lot. Since they're slightly on the smaller side, a bump in fuel pressure is convenient for getting the desired fuel flow while improving atomization even more.

On the other hand, the Genesis II 630cc feature twin spray streams. The atomization isn't quite as amazing, but the fuel hits the valves directly. So, emissions cleanliness is improved. Those living in smog Nazi states (e.g. California), may prioritize this feature over the 500cc's torque/response bump. Regardless, those who need the extra fuel flow for making more power (with a bigger turbo, etc.) are well-served with the 630cc's 25% increased flow at 3bar.

Btw... we've got a new 630cc twin stream injector to reveal. It blends the 500cc's atomization with existing 630cc's twin streams. This is accomplished via *TWENTY FOUR HOLES* instead of the of the current 630cc's six and the 500cc's twelve. This technology costs a lot more to produce, but discriminating builders, tuners, and racers will be delighted. Yep, stuff's gettin' REAL over here.

Here are the business ends of our various injectors. (The blue one is a TT225 380cc for comparison.)










Genesis II 500cc










Genesis II 630cc









Genesis II 630cc "DOUBLE FOGGER"


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## CupraR Carl (Jul 28, 2013)

Thanks for explaining that Scott much appreciated. Those new 630's sound awesome, looking forward to the unveiling of that. Its too easy to overlook the technology that is present in an injector. Your the atomisation specialists.:thumbup:


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## One-Eight GTI (Jan 5, 2010)

I just got my set of 2000cc last week can't wait to go. E85.


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

Wow. Will those new 630s fit properly in the AEB manifold? Will there be a 1000cc version? I must know this. This just earned my money, game upped indeed.


----------



## CupraR Carl (Jul 28, 2013)

Will you be adding a video of the new injectors on your website soon for us to see the spray pattern.


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

gdoggmoney said:


> Wow. Will those new 630s fit properly in the AEB manifold? Will there be a 1000cc version? I must know this. This just earned my money, game upped indeed.














Yep, we have it available to fit the big port heads, too (as displayed in the photo above). That option is now listed on the product page. As for a 1000cc, we've got that fully cooked. We just haven't mentioned it... until right now with this post.  It'll be up on the site shortly along with... a variant that does around 1100cc. -breaking news to keep y'all on your toes. There's no rest over here. 










Look inside the two-hole diffuser, by the way, and you'll see that it's still has multiple orifices for fine atomization:














CupraR Carl said:


> Will you be adding a video of the new injectors on your website soon for us to see the spray pattern.


Yezzir, we'll surely get to that, Carl. :thumbup:


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## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> Yep, we have it available to fit the big port heads, too (as displayed in the photo above). That option is now listed on the product page. As for a 1000cc, we've got that fully cooked. We just haven't mentioned it... until right now with this post.  It'll be up on the site shortly along with... a variant that does around 1100cc. -breaking news to keep y'all on your toes. There's no rest over here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Son of a ... I knew it. Glad to see you are doing well 

What is with the two hole diffuser? is that for certain applications or supposed to be there? Those are the 1000cc units I take it? I have to order injectors but the 630 is a little small for the 5857. That said I could 4 bar or 5 bar it, but I'd like e85 low boost headway or e85 mix headway 1000's would do. 

Any videos of the spray pattern on these new ones yet?! :x Must see. Can this rival the atomization of CIS? if that is one thing CIS is good it, it is an ultra fine mist.


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

gdoggmoney said:


> What is with the two hole diffuser? is that for certain applications or supposed to be there?


It's there to more cleanly divide the spray pattern into two streams. This is actually done at the spray tip, but with this much flow, it's not quite as discrete as it could be. That's to say that two streams come directly from the multi-hole plate, but there is some mist in between (about 15% of the total volume). The orange tip fixes that without any meaningful compromise.



> Those are the 1000cc units I take it?


Yes, what you see there is 1000cc. We'll have an 1125cc (or very close), too. It'll look exactly the same.



> Any videos of the spray pattern on these new ones yet?! :x Must see.


Again, we're working on that. :thumbup:



> Can this rival the atomization of CIS? if that is one thing CIS is good it, it is an ultra fine mist.


At low flow rates (i.e. when the pressure is low in a CIS system), these atomize better. At full pressure, CIS still has _somewhat_ of an edge. I say "somewhat" because much of the fuel from a CIS injector emerges finely atomized but then smacks the port walls and then drips. In the end, there's no comparison between the performance that's achieved between these new school parts and the old guns. That's on the combined basis of atomization, spray pattern, and control, of course.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

ssooooo..why did i buy 1000cc g2's last year if these are still g2's but better?

where are my replacements and where do i send in my current ones...


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Vegeta Gti said:


> ssooooo..why did i buy 1000cc g2's last year if these are still g2's but better?
> 
> where are my replacements and where do i send in my current ones...


You do realize that designs evolve over time, right? A 2014 model car is generally superior or otherwise evolved from a 2013, etc. There's nothing wrong with your previous edition 1000cc. There are even benefits to them. They haven't been replaced. They're being complemented with newer stuff as our R&D continues. That's our job. :thumbup:


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

i'm just giving you **** to be a bastard lol:wave::heart::beer:


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Vegeta Gti said:


> i'm just giving you **** to be a bastard lol:wave::heart::beer:


Oh, Jeez. I was just saying to myself: "*OMG, what is this BOZO* *thinking????* Lol, I'm glad that I didn't express what else was going through my mind. :sly::thumbup::heart:eace:


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

did anyone every swap these into a uni 630cc tune?

i asked many months ago, haven't checked here in a while....


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

I know what I'll be ordering soon...


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

Just snagged a set of the fogger 630's.

As always the tech talk with Scott is great! Great company and thankful that there is still development for the older platform! 

Thanks dude!


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

gdoggmoney said:


> Any videos of the spray pattern on these new ones yet?!


Okay, the arse kicking Genesis II 630cc blow mediocre Siemens 630cc out of the water: 







*But*, then there's new *Genesis II 630cc "Double Fogger"* version:





As you can see, both feature two discrete spray streams. The new kid on the block, however, breaks the fuel up into a finer mist. This boosts mid-range torque, sharpens throttle response, cleans up the emissions, and improves cold start performance. The minimum on time, battery offset, and other "handling" characteristics are identical.


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## RodgertheRabit II (Sep 13, 2012)

Yeah, where are my 630 replacements!!!!  :laugh:


haha Any time I call I end up taking way to much of Scotts time talking about all the goodness:wave::beer:

Now, just give everyone an update on the G2 pump and keep usopcorn::thumbup:


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## 3WheelnGTi (Jan 19, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Okay, the arse kicking Genesis II 630cc blow mediocre Siemens 630cc out of the water: ]


Put in a order today for these to get rid of those Siemens :thumbup:


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

speed51133! said:


> did anyone every swap these into a uni 630cc tune?
> 
> i asked many months ago, haven't checked here in a while....


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm hearing these 630cc fogger injectors can idle at stupid lean mixtures... Upwards of 20:1!

:beer:


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> I'm hearing these 630cc fogger injectors can idle at stupid lean mixtures... Upwards of 20:1!
> 
> :beer:


Is that even safe?


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> Is that even safe?


Sure, it's safe. It's not _practical_, but it poses no risk to the engine at all. There's very little heat or cylinder pressures created at a nearly non-existent load. So, it's all good.

The significance here is that technology improvements help a port-injected setup behave similarly to a direct injection engine. The T/FSIs sustain lean combustion via a trifecta of *atomization*, *spray pattern*, and *faster response*. The Genesis II 630cc "Double Fogger" injectors bring that to the 1.8T. Normally, a rich mixture has to be run to ensure that enough fuel is distributed to sustain combustion. Some is wasted, but it's required to get the job done.

In this case, because it all goes where it's supposed to on time in tinier droplets than ever before, an insanely lean mixture still burns. Turbo spool is also faster. Throttle response is more crisp. Idle is steadier. This is what you get for the price of entry. Nothing else comes close and now we're proving it.


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## [email protected] Motorsports (Sep 24, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> Sure, it's safe. It's not _practical_, but it poses no risk to the engine at all. There's very little heat or cylinder pressures created at a nearly non-existent load. So, it's all good.
> 
> The significance here is that technology improvements help a port-injected setup behave similarly to a direct injection engine. The T/FSIs sustain lean combustion via a trifecta of *atomization*, *spray pattern*, and *faster response*. The Genesis II 630cc "Double Fogger" injectors bring that to the 1.8T. Normally, a rich mixture has to be run to ensure that enough fuel is distributed to sustain combustion. Some is wasted, but it's required to get the job done.
> 
> In this case, because it all goes where it's supposed to on time in tinier droplets than ever before, an insanely lean mixture still burns. Turbo spool is also faster. Throttle response is more crisp. Idle is steadier. This is what you get for the price of entry. Nothing else comes close and now we're proving it.


I like it :thumbup:


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## [email protected] Performance (Jul 20, 2011)

Actually I'd be surprised if idling at a lean mixture isn't *cooler* than running richer given the right timing advance.


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

[email protected] Motorsports said:


> I like it :thumbup:


Thank you, Don. I appreciate your simple comment more than you'd ever expect. My joy has always been to push the technology envelope in my areas of special focus.  My frustration has been getting people to understand what the hell I'm even talking about. :laugh:



[email protected] Performance said:


> Actually I'd be surprised if idling at a lean mixture isn't *cooler* than running richer given the right timing advance.


-great point, sir.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Tonight, I installed Eight Genesis II 630cc in my personal car. Flashed it with a base file first and fired her up. After idling about five minutes the stumbling and havoc stopped and it smoothed out to stoich and a duty cycle of about 1.64ms. Took her out for a hard spin to get the fuel trims. Handled WOT ok enough while sounding like a Subaru and popping here and there lol. After about 20mins of moderate flogging, she was much more civil and idle was now SMOOOTH and a pretty fast 1.23ms!

Going to flash it again tomorrow to clean it up some more. But these things feel just like stock.:beer::beer:


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## Gulfstream (Jul 28, 2010)

My Bosch 1700cc injectors has altered their spray pattern after only 1 season. Are you injector based on those? 

E85


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Gulfstream said:


> My Bosch 1700cc injectors has altered their spray pattern after only 1 season. Are you injector based on those?
> 
> E85


My first thought was fouled injectors...possibly from the deterioration of your fuel lines or tank.

Which bosch injectors are you referring to though??


----------



## Gulfstream (Jul 28, 2010)

[email protected] said:


> My first thought was fouled injectors...possibly from the deterioration of your fuel lines or tank.
> 
> Which bosch injectors are you referring to though??


Well, I just came off the phone with a few tuners over here. We have a lot of guys running E85 and each tuner has a locker full of Bosch injectors gone bad after running E85. 


Bosch 1700cc high ohm which are designed for natural gas but claimed to be compatible with E85.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Gulfstream said:


> Well, I just came off the phone with a few tuners over here. We have a lot of guys running E85 and each tuner has a locker full of Bosch injectors gone bad after running E85.
> 
> 
> Bosch 1700cc high ohm which are designed for natural gas but claimed to be compatible with E85.


There you have it. We suspected as such...


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## Gulfstream (Jul 28, 2010)

Yeah, there it is. Are your Genesis injectors based on Bosch or a completely different design?


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

So after a few weeks with my 630 foggers I can say that the new addition in power and efficiency is welcome! I can manage 22.5* of advance @ 23psi with no water meth running. and about 24-25* at my daily 15psi ...

Gf and I took a roadtrip today and managed to get 240 miles so far and the needle is just before the halfway mark on the cluster. This was cruising 65-75mph the whole way with the trunk loaded. I'll try and run it empty to get a solid figure but I am very happy with these injectors so far!


----------



## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

spartiati said:


> So after a few weeks with my 630 foggers I can say that the new addition in power and efficiency is welcome! I can manage 22.5* of advance @ 23psi with no water meth running. and about 24-25* at my daily 15psi ...
> 
> Gf and I took a roadtrip today and managed to get 240 miles so far and the needle is just before the halfway mark on the cluster. This was cruising 65-75mph the whole way with the trunk loaded. I'll try and run it empty to get a solid figure but I am very happy with these injectors so far!


What were your previous injectors and what were you getting with them, for comparison sake.

That being said...those are some incredible numbers.


----------



## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

Gulfstream said:


> Well, I just came off the phone with a few tuners over here. We have a lot of guys running E85 and each tuner has a locker full of Bosch injectors gone bad after running E85.
> 
> 
> Bosch 1700cc high ohm which are designed for natural gas but claimed to be compatible with E85.


I think my bosch 2000cc injectors have altered their spray pattern as well. Is there a way to have them cleaned???


----------



## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

groggory said:


> What were your previous injectors and what were you getting with them, for comparison sake.
> 
> That being said...those are some incredible numbers.


I have ran anything from Bosch 550's to Deka 630's, modified 550's to flow 850cc and the original genesis 630's. These 630cc foggers @4bar are sitting at 80% duty cycle @ 22psi on my setup and drive around town nicely. For making power and highway cruising they really are just that damn good...


----------



## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

I have a general question for Scott. Why are none of these injectors shipped out with filter baskets installed in them? I have been doing some research and it seems that most companies are selling these high flow injectors with no filter baskets in them.


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> I have a general question for Scott. Why are none of these injectors shipped out with filter baskets installed in them? I have been doing some research and it seems that most companies are selling these high flow injectors with no filter baskets in them.


Well, you didn't specify which "_these_" parts you're asking about. However, the majority of the Genesis II injectors are custom assemblies of Bosch EV-14 components (often adding parts from other major manufacturers, too). The EV-14 standard utilizes a non-serviceable screen element located deep inside the unit. It's not a removable or serviceable piece as is pressed into the top of older generation injectors. :thumbup:


----------



## suffocatemymind (Dec 10, 2007)

groggory said:


> That being said...those are some incredible numbers.


X2!!!


----------



## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Well, you didn't specify which "_these_" parts you're asking about. However, the majority of the Genesis II injectors are custom assemblies of Bosch EV-14 components (often adding parts from other major manufacturers, too). The EV-14 standard utilizes a non-serviceable screen element located deep inside the unit. It's not a removable or serviceable piece as is pressed into the top of older generation injectors. :thumbup:


So my ev14 injectors, if they are clogged, should be thrown away?


----------



## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

formerly silveratljetta said:


> So my ev14 injectors, if they are clogged, should be thrown away?


No. You don't know where the clog is or if it can be cleaned out.

If they were clogged I'd send them to an injector service company like RC Engineering in Torrance, CA where they would be flow and spray tested, ultrasonicly cleaned, rebuilt, and re flow and spray tested.


----------



## RabbitGTDguy (Jul 9, 2002)

Have my 630cc GII units in. Glad I made the move!

Joe


----------



## ArTT Vandelay (Mar 31, 2003)

*Adding my two vpcents to what seems to be a good thread...*

I'm more active on he qw TT forums, but rabbitgtdguy and spartiati and of course Scott have all played a part in getting me in these new 630 gII double forgers. I'm still working on tuning, and have found my iat's are just too high so I'll be installing an fmic this weekend (finally!!). Also gonna get a tank full of e85 and see if we can't make it work. 

I'll keep you all informed if it's of interest. 

My setup:
2000 audi TT
Scat rods
630 double forgers
4bar fpr
Bosch 044 pump
Frankenturbo f21
225 TT maf
Maestro tuning on a wideband awp conversion
Etc etc


----------



## Alec's TT (Jan 28, 2013)

would it be possible to get specs for the gen 2 1000's such as battery compensations?


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

Alec's TT said:


> would it be possible to get specs for the gen 2 1000's such as battery compensations?


Use the injector dynamics BVC values for the ID1000's. They will get you in the neighborhood of where you need to be.


----------



## Alec's TT (Jan 28, 2013)

Using those will help out my part throttle driving?


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## formerly silveratljetta (Feb 6, 2007)

Alec's TT said:


> Using those will help out my part throttle driving?


If your BVC values are not correct it will affect a lot of things


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## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

I can't get 630 double foggers until Gonzo finishes his tuning suite. 

I hear the hype is well founded.


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Alec's TT said:


> would it be possible to get specs for the gen 2 1000's such as battery compensations?



Fuel Pressure (psid)  Offset (µsec)   8 Volts10 Volts12 Volts14 Volts16 Volts43.51455950680495375451475965690500380
5015401020720525405551605106575055043060168011057805804556517501140810605475701825117584063549575189511208806655058019651270925690515852050132096571552090 2160136099575054095 229013951015780565100 241014301035810590
105 251514851060830605110 262015551095840615115 275016201135855630120 293516751175875665125 317517201220900715130 343517551265925755

<colgroup><col><col span="5"></colgroup><tbody>

</tbody>


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## Budsdubbin (Jul 14, 2008)

Those values are different from what I've got from Q?

@43.5psi
8v 10 12 14 16

2.5ms 1.6 1.25 .97 .97


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

Budsdubbin said:


> Those values are different from what I've got from Q?


R&D is an ongoing thing, so perhaps the data is different that what we released in the past. Regardless, that's the info (specific to 2000cc) that I recommend that you work with at this time. :thumbup:


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## jackedrabbit (Jan 11, 2011)

Scott, your inbox is full! Trying to get in touch with you.


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## Budsdubbin (Jul 14, 2008)

I thought there was something a bit funky with the bvc he gave me. Thanks for posting them!


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## [email protected] (Jan 13, 2005)

jackedrabbit said:


> Scott, your inbox is full! Trying to get in touch with you.


Please email me directly. Or, visit the USRT Facebook page and message me there. Every time I clear my Vortex in box, it gets clogged with more incoming questions within a day or so. I literally cannot keep up with it. eace:


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## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Please email me directly. Or, visit the USRT Facebook page and message me there. Every time I clear my Vortex in box, it gets clogged with more incoming questions within a day or so. I literally cannot keep up with it. eace:












I feel like that is a great problem to have.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

Most of the time, USRT doesn't sleep, and with good reason! We're always looking to improve on an already excellent product!

The 500cc Genesis II FOGGER Series injectors are improved with full metal bodies, etched logo in the lower half, and no longer a need for rail spacers! Run these up to 8bar fuel pressure and quench your motor's thirst today!


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

from the dead!

How's everyone doing with their GenII injectors? What projects are going on? Lets see some results!


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## woodywoods86 (Jul 29, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> from the dead!
> 
> How's everyone doing with their GenII injectors? What projects are going on? Lets see some results!


630s are about to do a 3000 miles trip. I will let you know the results.

Any suggestions on a good minimum pulsewidth to start with. Idle and Part throttle are a little rough.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2009)

woodywoods86 said:


> 630s are about to do a 3000 miles trip. I will let you know the results.
> 
> Any suggestions on a good minimum pulsewidth to start with. Idle and Part throttle are a little rough.


My v8 has the 630cc set at like 1.60~1.65ms for idle and thats pretty damn smooth.


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## Elcroato (May 21, 2002)

I'm considering getting a set. Not sure if I should go with 1000's or 630's. I'll be shooting for 500hp, but until I get there I'll probably be hanging around in the 300 range. I have an EFR7163.


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## spartiati (May 19, 2008)

Elcroato said:


> I'm considering getting a set. Not sure if I should go with 1000's or 630's. I'll be shooting for 500hp, but until I get there I'll probably be hanging around in the 300 range. I have an EFR7163.


Go for the 1000's. No reason to go small only to upgrade later. You'll have no issues running the 1000's for 300-500hp range.


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## Elcroato (May 21, 2002)

spartiati said:


> Go for the 1000's. No reason to go small only to upgrade later. You'll have no issues running the 1000's for 300-500hp range.


:thumbup:


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