# ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever



## gymflint (Aug 27, 2004)

A question for those of us fortunate enough to have supercharged their 24v VR6:
How does your supercharged 24v VR6 golf or jetta compare to other "fast" cars (stock or modded)?
If this is a played out question just let me know and I will bludgen my self ritually for the next 3 weeks.


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## 2002gtibluvr6 (Oct 5, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*

since its 1 in the morning im going to bed but i will answer this question for you in the morning, i can talk all day about the charger


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## Jcr1982 (Jul 18, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gymflint* »_ I will bludgen my self ritually for the next 3 weeks.

I vote for this option lol


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## kamakazi (Oct 19, 2004)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*

Lets just say it puts a







on your face! I don't drag or race, I just like the feeling of going faster


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## Peel Box (Oct 19, 2004)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (Jcr1982)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jcr1982* »_
I vote for this option lol


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## gizmopop (Feb 6, 2000)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gymflint* »_A question for those of us fortunate enough to have supercharged their 24v VR6:
How does your supercharged 24v VR6 golf or jetta compare to other "fast" cars (stock or modded)?
If this is a played out question just let me know and I will bludgen my self ritually for the next 3 weeks.

are you thinking about it? Do it...a friend with a Supercharged GLI had no problems pulling my car(stock R32) with just me it in it...he had 4 total...
don't piss off the angry crickets...


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## gymflint (Aug 27, 2004)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gizmopop)*

Yes, i am considering supercharging, but I only want to do it if it is a serious difference and worth the money. I also need to consider that I drive about 500 city miles a month for work. It would have to be able to bear with me while I drivearound working.


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## waterpumper (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*

It makes a serious difference. Money well spent in my book. I am preparing to go to Stage II soon as well. Not because Stage I is lacking but because I am used to the power now and I am hungry for more. With stage I you will have around 250whp. That is nothing to balk at. My car has surprised quite a few people including myself.


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## rajvosa71000 (Jun 9, 2004)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (waterpumper)*

How's S/C'd 24V off the line?


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## 2002gtibluvr6 (Oct 5, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (rajvosa71000)*

depends. if you know how to drive its pretty quick off the line, if you dont its slow off the line. you know how your AC lags your motor? SC lags it a lot worse. but like i said if you know how to drive you can launch it at 3000rpms and be fine. or you can always just start normal then punch it. i do that a lot i dont launch the car ill just start then 1/2 way through 1st get on it, it still almost loses traction doing that, and im down like 70hp from what it woudl be at sealevel. 
sucks being up at 5-6000feet cars are definatly slower up here, when i went to vancouver BC my car scared the living hell out of me it was so fast. guess 250whp will get most things done in a hurry. getting stage 2 offically put on in sept, probably labor day ill be in cali so if anybody wants a quick ride before i leave the LA area let me know ill give ya a few giggles before i head home.
the performance of the car is a lot better with a SC, especailly in canyons and well all over the place, its if you ask me easier to drive and maintain a speed or gain speed, you can go stupid fast, ive gone 155 once ive hit 140+ a few times...those speeds arent a joke you definatly wont do that in a stock 24v, and if you are its gonna take way more ground to get there. i went from 75-155 in probably 3/4 of a mile, it would take way more then that in a NA car. auto/xin becomes easy and really fun, power is so smooth you can floor it mid corner and not worry about traction problems or power surge making you lose traction...thats the main benefit to the SC smoothness of power you dont notice *wow this thing has a lot of power* cause its so smooth it feels like a stock car but when your bouncing off rev limiters left and right and doing triple digits speeds in around 14 seconds its not slow


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## BadassVW (Oct 16, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*

If this car is your primary transportation I would not touch ANYTHING having to do with the engine. you'll end up throwing away thousands of dollars to obtain mediocre performance
Spend money on tires, wheels, suspension and brakes....and enjoy a noseheavy, fwd car that does a fair impersonation of an Audi.
If you have "king of the streets" delusions....any of the current 600cc racerep bikes will provide a much cheaper and more reliable solution to fix your jones 

but hey, it's your money!


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## gymflint (Aug 27, 2004)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (BadassVW)*

Yeah I drive around a lot taking pictures for my job. it is the driving that allows me to have the car in the first place. it gets pretty hot here in Wilmington, NC - wondering about that as well. I read somewhere that stage II has an intercooler or can be paired with an intercooler.
I love being able to get a dtraight answer. Sometimes the tex turns into a mess, but other times it can be very useful. 
I am not looking to be the king of the streets, but going fast is fun. I do a lot of travel as well. Ocean to the mountain trips, and find some quiet places to open it up. Thought the SC would really makes things exciting.
plus, I really like the idea of baffling people who thing of VW's as small, slow cars.
Thanks for all the input.


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## BadassVW (Oct 16, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*

The excitement fades once you've replaced your 4th or 5th MAF







...and that's a best case scenario!


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## 2002gtibluvr6 (Oct 5, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gymflint)*

well a SC'er is probably a good bet for you then. it definatly wont make you king of the streets. there is always a better and faster car around unless of course you have the car that holds the land speed record which NONE of us have. 
it will beat most cars on the road, it puts you in a class of cars/competition that you frankly shouldnt be in but if you come across the right car you'll get smoked. hell i raced a turbo/NOS civic SI the other night *the older style one not the newest one* he was inching on me but my car was pulling timing like crazy, i wasnt running good at all. i would beat him right now but i was definatly impressed even though he was literally inching on me. he gained maybe 4 inches in the course of 15 seconds.
so no you wont be kind of the roads, makes the car really fun to drive and you have the potential to be fast. stage 1 in hot weather im not gonna lie it sucks. when its hot here it makes me not wanna run my car hard at all cause it loses so much power. but when its cold hold on to your butts. stage 2 does come with an intercooler and thats the major reason im getting it. i deal with temps above 100deg on occasion and in the summer/early fall it will easily be in the high 90's on a regular basis. 
badass do you have the catch can from VF? if so get it cause ive only toasted 1 MAF, and that was 3 months ago, it was the original MAF that came with the car it went through 2 different intakes and 20k miles SC"d i cleaned if probably 3 times and never had a problem i finally just bought a new one instead of cleaning it *sensor is still intact* anyways you shouldnt go through MAF's like that. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## Got 24v (Feb 12, 2001)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (gizmopop)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gizmopop* »_
are you thinking about it? Do it...a friend with a Supercharged GLI had no problems pulling my car(stock R32) with just me it in it...he had 4 total...
don't piss off the angry crickets...









that would be me







thanks for the plug Laz long time no see







Yea we had 4 people in my car and pulled on two R's that night. HP and 1/4 in sig. 14.0 at 103 is not bad. Thats a 13sec trap. I say do it and go stg 2. Dont be afraid to put a little race fuel in also


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## 2002gtibluvr6 (Oct 5, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (2002gtibluvr6)*

i just talked to VF a few minutes ago reguarding the stage 2 and got some interesting info from them...
all stage 2 kits are being converted to flashed chips...all socket/hard chips will be removed and converted over for ease of future programing and ability to switch programs if you buy race gas program.
race gas program is available for the stage 2 24v kit. its programmed for 100 oct fuels and can be switched either with a GIAC flashloader or if you have a vagcom/rosstech tool you can do it with your laptop.
they ARE R&Din a stage 3 which includes lowered compression, they said its not running yet and the motor isnt even in a car its a motor sitting on a test stand they are playing around wth different head gasket configurations. *more power in the future for those who want it*
stage 2 costs VF 1550$ to aquire...this includes all outside parts and contractors and programming form GIAC. so they are only making 300$ on the stage 2. if you were to actually purchase the parts yourself to produce a similar setup you'd be spending well over 2k$, they buy things in bulk which lowers their prices.
fuel pump with stage 2 is actually a stock 24v fuel pump, its not from a different vehicle...what they do is they went to the OEM manufacture and placed an order to their specs but in the housing of a 24v fuel pump. they retuned the stock unit basically. the pumps cost 400$ a piece they had to buy the pumps in a bulk order of 500 to get the price down to 400$ a piece...do the math they spent 200,000$ just to get fuel pumps made for this kit.
injectors are rediculously expensive they didnt mention a price but they arent cheap by any means. id say 1200$ of the kits price is involved in fueling the thing thats not including a pullie tensioner or FMIC and all new piping or the chip.
so anybody who is whining about the 1850$ pricetag, good luck the kit the way its set up is a bargain, they keep insisting that its incredibly smooth and really a great improvement over the stage 1 kit. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
for those who got the kit for 1250$ you guys made VF lose money but then again you all waited for like 2 years


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## Flite (Jul 16, 2004)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (2002gtibluvr6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2002gtibluvr6* »_
injectors are rediculously expensive they didnt mention a price but they arent cheap by any means. id say 1200$ of the kits price is involved in fueling the thing thats not including a pullie tensioner or FMIC and all new piping or the chip.


What the hell kind of injector is the kit running then? I'm looking at very large injectors for my car that will run just under 400 bucks. That's rediculous;y expensive?
Here's the deal. If you want your car to maintain absolute stock like driveability and outside appearance, go with VF. If you want to seriously go fast and have a little bit of technical knowledge, go turbo. You're in NC? If so take your car to EIP. All of the 24V kits that EIP has installed themselves run absolutely perfectly. A stage 1 turbo from EIP will run with or beat a stage 2 VF car, and it will drive like a stock car off boost.
There's nothing at all wrong with VF kits. They're a great kit. If all you want is enough extra to suprise some people...VF. If you want enough power to suprise yourself and scare the schitt out of some people, turbo your car.


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## 2002gtibluvr6 (Oct 5, 2002)

*Re: ??? about Supercharged 24v VR6 vs whatever (Flite)*

i dont know what kind of injectors they run but knowing VF and their products im sure its a derivation of the OEM injectors. like i said they never gave me a price on the actual parts. i remember darren when he got injectors his were in the range of 800$ or there abouts im not possitive though. anyways VF uses OEM/custom parts that are ordered in a limited quantity. my guess is the injectors are around 600$ for their setup. so even if that is the case 1000$ of VF's cost of that kit is placed in 2 fueling components. this is a major reason i like VF's products they will get higher flow pumps and injectors and keep stock like fuel pressures to achieve power. i personally feel this is a safer way to fuel a car and produces more consistant and reliable results. its also easier to tune a car with a constant fuel presure. 
i agree with some of your points on VF vs EIP and i disagree on some. but hey thats what im here for right?








about maintaining stock like driveability and reliability yes i would 100% without a doubt recommedn VF over EIP, they have hundreds upon hundreds of kits on the road just for the 24v, that doesnt include R32 12v VR6's and so on, their kits are tried and true and very very rarely will you encounter somebody wiht a problem, and 99% of the time that problem is install related because the kit wasnt installed by a properly quilified individual. i do agree that an EIP car will be faster and more powerful for the buck, but that isnt the goal of everybody...that is the beauty of having choises we can do our own research and chose whats best for us. EIP makes a beautiful product, i was in hot persuit of selling my SC'er and getting a turbo but i kept going through my needs and wants and expectations and decided to stay.
i also know many guys who have been building custom SC"d and turbo VR6's since the day the motor was released, they kept telling me there is nothing like a turbo VR and it will put a hurting on almost anything *basically they are stupid fast* but they kept telling me if you want your car to run properly and maintain reliablity SC the car. hell if anything boost in this motor is boost in this motor its impressive either way, many people would dream of having a SC'd 24v and i get to drive one everyday i find myself lucky...i think your lucky, id love to drive a stage 2 turbo VR.
also about your comment about a stage 2 hanging with a stage 1. think about it stage 2 VF is running 7psi mani pressure stage 1 EIP is running 10psi mani pressure. race gas file for VF stage 2 im guessing is around 310whp which will definatly get some **** done, it will be faster then most cars on the road and definatly has potential to scare people...my car scared me at sealevel, and that was only stage 1, i can only imagine another 60whp under the hood that would be crazy *nobody needs that kind of power and you know that just as well as i do* anyways last comment i have about what you said is the thing about technical knowledge? why would you say that if you want knowledge buy turbo? you can learn just as much about your car/boosting cars...learning more about its mechanics and how things work by SC'ing your car *if your proactive and want to learn* you can learn a lot from both, you can learn nothing from both its all about what you chose to learn and persue. i know more about the VF kit then a lot of people, i dont know everything but i would consider myself knowledgable about it and its different options and different setups you can go with. you are the same way with EIP incredibly knowledable, and everytime somebody asks about a turbo i always say go to flite, and thats cause i respect your knowledge and experiences http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Flite (Jul 16, 2004)

I say that you should have a little more technical knowledge if you want to buy a turbo because there is a little more fine tuning that can be done on turbo cars. It's not as "plug and play" as a S/Cer. Once a s/cer is installed, that's it. You're done, happy motoring. There is a far greater level of adjustability with a turbo. You have to adjust your wastegte springs and set screw, or install and set some sort or electronic boost controller, set your blowoff valve, and in EIPs case, adjust your base fuel pressure and rate of rise.
It's not about "wanting to learn", it's about basic fundamentals that you should already know BEFORE you start driving your turbo car.
(side note, I won't have to worry about setting fuel pressure much longer







)


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## waterpumper (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: (Flite)*

There are companies working on upgrades for the supercharged 24v's. Hopefully we will see some products from them soon. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 1986 jetta gli (May 1, 2004)

*Re: (Flite)*

(side note, I won't have to worry about setting fuel pressure much longer )
why is that?


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## 2002gtibluvr6 (Oct 5, 2002)

*Re: (1986 jetta gli)*

hes doing a standalone setup as well as different injectors. with higher flow injectors and afuel pump you dont have to tweak with a rising rate FPR...which in my opinin is a downside to EIP's setup...i belive its much safer as well as easier to use larger injectors and pumps to achieve your fueling.
anyways your right about needing to know a bit more about your car to turbo it...but its been proven that you dontneed to know anything....PL doesnt even touch his own car really he just has EIP do everything he has the luxury of living right near them though. so yeah its possible to have a turbo VR and not know squat as long as you have a qualified and knowledgable shop/mechanic take care of things for you.
with a SC you still have to know some basic principles of boosting cars, i do all my own work and i have encountered several glitches, boost leaks, diagnosing things just by going off how the car is running and boost readings or CEL/codes it throws. like i said i would consider myself one of the more knowledable guys about SC'ers on this motor but i definatly dont know EVERYTHING about boosting VR's and especailly the turbo route  http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif anyways good luck with your new setup keep us all posted im interested in learning


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## Flite (Jul 16, 2004)

*Re: (2002gtibluvr6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2002gtibluvr6* »_hes doing a standalone setup as well as different injectors. with higher flow injectors and afuel pump you dont have to tweak with a rising rate FPR...which in my opinin is a downside to EIP's setup...i belive its much safer as well as easier to use larger injectors and pumps to achieve your fueling.


No, no I'm not. I'll keep you guys posted, but it doesn't look like I'm going stand alone any more.


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## I Crush Vag's (Feb 20, 2003)

when people talk about unreliable turbo vr6's its always high HP (which I think is completely worthless) If some company came out with a kit that would make 250-290 for under 3200 (no IC) for starters I'd buy me a vr6 and that kit in a second. 
If you have a kit like that and don't track or race often but just like the extra power I'm quite sure you wouldn't have near as many problems bigger turbo vr's


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## Flite (Jul 16, 2004)

*Re: (Not_Quite_Jdm)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Not_Quite_Jdm* »_
when people talk about unreliable turbo vr6's its always high HP (which I think is completely worthless) If some company came out with a kit that would make 250-290 for under 3200 (no IC) for starters I'd buy me a vr6 and that kit in a second. 
If you have a kit like that and don't track or race often but just like the extra power I'm quite sure you wouldn't have near as many problems bigger turbo vr's

Sounds like you're describing HPAs base grass roots kit. It costs a little more than that, but hey, supply and demand...these aren't Hondas.


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## I Crush Vag's (Feb 20, 2003)

And they're not Porsche's either..It's not that it's super hard to put these kits together or do R&D on a kit like I described (others, yes) but it's because people are paying the prices that they offer..and make bank. It sucks that so many people want all this HP out of a FWD just to be tractionless on the streets, it's just useless unless you're into that sort of thing.
Not trying to "offend" anyone but I would figure that with all the kits for the 1.8t and the vr6 being more of the choice for more "refined" tastes that SOMEONE would come out with a mild turbo kit...I mean C2 did it for the MK3. I'd like to piece together a kit myself (slowly) with good parts and see if I can get some custom chip tuning from a shop around here (EIP or AWE) I think there should be alot more options for the 6 as it's a great motor!
You've got to pay to play but who says you can't be a smart shopper?


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## 2002gtibluvr6 (Oct 5, 2002)

*Re: (Not_Quite_Jdm)*

not quite JDM are you talking about turbos or SC"ers? 
cause the main topic in here was SC'in a 24v....and you go on to say its sad that people pay the prices they do for a tractionless FWD car...whens the last time you drove a boosted 24v?
from what i gather the EIP kit isnt too bad on traction, and if driven properly will have ZERO problems.
i drive a SC'd 24v everyday, i dont have traction problems. i can go around a corner at full throttle at 35-40mph and not lose traction, i can gun it in 1st and not lose traction, only time i generally lose traction is if im flooring it in the rain or snow, which well doesnt generally happen too often. so dont run around saying why do people buy these kits. 
we buy them cause we like to have fun with our cars beyond what a normal person would. its fun being in 4th gear and wraping out a 300hp VW...you definatly wont have traction problems past 2nd gear even if your driving like a fool...yeah they arent the best platform but ive definatly seen people build crazier cars on way worse platforms then this. 24v's arent a bad car to turbo or SC the results are very nice and quite worth it


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## I Crush Vag's (Feb 20, 2003)

Yes my last post was about turbo's because I was responding to the other guys post and ending...RELAX
You should have read both my posts and if you did you should have remember what I wrote because I was talking about BIG turbo applications with ALL makes and models (yes I have driven many different FWD cars with boost) but your supercharger comments aren't relevant to what I said because I wasnt talking about them, of course you're not going to get that much loss of traction with linear power.
anywho let the S/C'r talk resume


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