# Bosch 044 inline fuel pump



## ngorske (Aug 27, 2010)

I got a Bosch 044 inline fuel pump and I'm not exactly sure on how it hooks into an FSI engine. If anyone has done this or knows anything any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi (Apr 4, 2007)

Sell it; buy a walbro and hobb switch. 

I ran one of my FSIs with a 044 as an intank. Required tons of modding and SW tweaking that I never got sooooooooo I had a bunch of codes.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi said:


> Sell it; buy a walbro and hobb switch.
> 
> I ran one of my FSIs with a 044 as an intank. Required tons of modding and SW tweaking that I never got sooooooooo I had a bunch of codes.


There will be a REAL BT intank pump solution shortly, drop in plug and play works with the PWM OEM manegement , its being worked on as we speak hope to have a test unit in my car by Dyno day. 
There is also REAL( not modded) BT FSI injectors being produced from teir one supplier will follow along with a complete high flow fuel rail and system to support 600+ WHP that will be made to fit around the OEM intake manifold and can be used for aftermarket units.They also will be venturing into upgraded HPFP .

I will keep everyone updated this is exciting news for BT FSI for 2011:biggrinsanta: Bob.G


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## EL_3grab (Mar 25, 2006)

rracerguy717 said:


> There will be a REAL BT intank pump solution shortly, drop in plug and play works with the PWM OEM manegement , its being worked on as we speak hope to have a test unit in my car by Dyno day.
> There is also REAL( not modded) BT FSI injectors being produced from teir one supplier will follow along with a complete high flow fuel rail and system to support 600+ WHP that will be made to fit around the OEM intake manifold and can be used for aftermarket units.They also will be venturing into upgraded HPFP .
> 
> I will keep everyone updated this is exciting news for BT FSI for 2011:biggrinsanta: Bob.G


Great news Bob :thumbup:

I'm actually plannig to take my ride 600+ hp on pump gas after I get my phaeton


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## $GTI07$ (Feb 29, 2008)

rracerguy717 said:


> There will be a REAL BT intank pump solution shortly, drop in plug and play works with the PWM OEM manegement , its being worked on as we speak hope to have a test unit in my car by Dyno day.
> There is also REAL( not modded) BT FSI injectors being produced from teir one supplier will follow along with a complete high flow fuel rail and system to support 600+ WHP that will be made to fit around the OEM intake manifold and can be used for aftermarket units.They also will be venturing into upgraded HPFP .
> 
> I will keep everyone updated this is exciting news for BT FSI for 2011:biggrinsanta: Bob.G


that is good info.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

ngorske said:


> I got a Bosch 044 inline fuel pump and I'm not exactly sure on how it hooks into an FSI engine. If anyone has done this or knows anything any help would be greatly appreciated.


You can do it inline or intank. I have tried both and both worked fine. I had to disconnect the factory harness and used somthing else for the intank though. Inline off a hobbs is the best way to go for an easy fix. i found that my 255 couldnt cut it even though they support over 550hp on a regular efi. The issue is that the high pressure pump wants 5/6 bar so the pump duty would be at like 95% and the pressure would still fall off.


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## LEWXCORE (Jul 7, 2007)

Someone say 600hp fsi injectors? Ha! Who's making them? Kmdtuning.com?? Lololol


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## crew219 (Oct 18, 2000)

rracerguy717 said:


> There will be a REAL BT intank pump solution shortly, drop in plug and play works with the PWM OEM manegement , its being worked on as we speak hope to have a test unit in my car by Dyno day.
> There is also REAL( not modded) BT FSI injectors being produced from teir one supplier will follow along with a complete high flow fuel rail and system to support 600+ WHP that will be made to fit around the OEM intake manifold and can be used for aftermarket units.They also will be venturing into upgraded HPFP .
> 
> I will keep everyone updated this is exciting news for BT FSI for 2011:biggrinsanta: Bob.G


:bs:

So when you say Tier 1 supplier, you're referencing a company like Hitachi, Siemens or Bosch? And said supplier is willing to make all these products because you gave them your old LPFP and told them that we needed parts? 

I'll believe it when I see it...


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## CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi (Apr 4, 2007)

LEWXCORE said:


> Someone say 600hp fsi injectors? Who's making them?


x2


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

crew219 said:


> I'll believe it when I see it...


No info will be given untill each conponent is tested ,proven on my car , will see who's laughing last Dave. You should not be concerned about this anyway because your APR Stage 3 SW is not worthy LOL Bob G


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## CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi (Apr 4, 2007)

rracerguy717 said:


> No info will be given untill each conponent is tested ,proven on my car , will see who's laughing last Dave. You should not be concerned about this anyway because your APR Stage 3 SW is not worthy LOL Bob G



ha. spoken like a true gentleman


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## [email protected] (Jul 29, 2008)

rracerguy717 said:


> You should not be concerned about this anyway because your APR Stage 3 SW is not worthy LOL Bob G


Bob,

We are not exactly interested in creating drag racing only setups as they are typically very laggy and not the type of racing or customer we are interested in capturing. Lets admit it, we all know the idea of a 600 HP FWD GTI is neat and when someone sets a good time and trap, I love to hear about it and tell everyone, but that's not what we're all about. You know this more than anyone! If that's the route you want to take your car, then do it! You don't have to pull us into every argument or discussion about it. Just keep in mind, it's almost 2011... our stage 3 hardware was created in 2006, our tuning set the fastes and quickest drag racing time in 2008 (not by us, by a customer), and again, our tuning topped 600 whp in 2008 as well. If people are finally catching up to that, that's fine buy us. If they are doing it for only a couple hundred bucks, then more power to them. We don't really care. Those customers obviously have goals which we are not exactly looking to support.

:thumbup:


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> Bob,
> 
> We are not exactly interested in creating drag racing only setups as they are typically very laggy and not the type of racing or customer we are interested in capturing. Lets admit it, we all know the idea of a 600 HP FWD GTI is neat and when someone sets a good time and trap, I love to hear about it and tell everyone, but that's not what we're all about. You know this more than anyone! If that's the route you want to take your car, then do it! You don't have to pull us into every argument or discussion about it. Just keep in mind, it's almost 2011... our stage 3 hardware was created in 2006, our tuning set the fastes and quickest drag racing time in 2008 (not by us, by a customer), and again, our tuning topped 600 whp in 2008 as well. If people are finally catching up to that, that's fine buy us. If they are doing it for only a couple hundred bucks, then more power to them. We don't really care. Those customers obviously have goals which we are not exactly looking to support.
> 
> :thumbup:


Arin Bottom Line APR failed with me , and my car has been total disapontment and has never come even close to your numbers .The 2L FSI Engine has TON of potenial just fueling limited . 
That said 2011 will be a BIG year for BT FSI people because finally those limited fueling and mulitple Software options will bring it to another level .
Im not a Drag racer looking for 600hp I knew that from the start but running and tunning 2871 @ under 20psi with tq under or around 300 whp is joke. Im happy now working with companys and people that are and want to put a smooth, safe product out but work with there customer toward there realistic goal without leaving Tons of power on the table .IMO Making ONE cookie cutter tune that works all over the WORLD under the worst/poorest conditions is NEVER gonna perform at great level with all the feed back from under performing APR Stage 3 FSI kit customers im right on point.  Bob.G


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## [email protected] (Jul 29, 2008)

rracerguy717 said:


> IMO Making ONE cookie cutter tune that works all over the WORLD under the worst/poorest conditions is NEVER gonna perform at great level with all the feed back from under performing APR Stage 3 FSI kit customers im right on point.  Bob.G


We don't use one tune across the entire world. There are many different variations between ECU's and we have calibrated APR Stage 3 in many different countries. On your particular box code, we simply installed a timer that would go from powerful to weak back to powerful every 6 months so you would look like a happy customer and a total prick w/o any logical explanation to everyone reading your posts. We did this all almost half a decade ago when you were one of the only people in the world with it and charged you way less than everyone else in order to do this. :thumbup:


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## magilson (Apr 18, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> We don't use one tune across the entire world. There are many different variations between ECU's and we have calibrated APR Stage 3 in many different countries. On your particular box code, we simply installed a timer that would go from powerful to weak back to powerful every 6 months so you would look like a happy customer and a total prick w/o any logical explanation to everyone reading your posts. We did this all almost half a decade ago when you were one of the only people in the world with it and charged you way less than everyone else in order to do this. :thumbup:


QFT. I also read on the super secret underground APR forums that you guys included an auto destruct on December 21, 2012.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

magilson said:


> QFT. I also read on the super secret underground APR forums that you guys included an auto destruct on December 21, 2012.


There will be a new one but it will be there for all to see , where APR Stage 3 customer can speak out in 2011 where they can share there results ( good or bad ) without being attacked by APR or there nut swingers with a PR event .

APR is used to customers just getting frustrated and they just go away, sell there car or simple move on to another car. Well there will be none of the above with me . :wave: haha Bob.G


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## crew219 (Oct 18, 2000)

rracerguy717 said:


> There will be a new one but it will be there for all to see , where APR Stage 3 customer can speak out in 2011 where they can share there results ( good or bad ) without being attacked by APR or there nut swingers with a PR event .
> 
> APR is used to customers just getting frustrated and they just go away, sell there car or simple move on to another car. Well there will be none of the above with me . :wave: haha Bob.G


I think Arin should post that email you sent him awhile ago before he started working at APR. Makes your intent quite clear. Perhaps if you didn't choose to edit all of your incriminating posts, people may actually believe that your motives are genuine. 

That being said, I can't imagine a Tier 1 supplier choosing to work with someone who can't even spell "tier" correctly


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## sciblades (Oct 21, 2008)

hoping for the best, expecting the worse. I will believe when i see it


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## LEWXCORE (Jul 7, 2007)

sciblades said:


> hoping for the best, expecting the worse. I will believe when i see it


ya i don't really believe anything i hear on here anymore. i have a throttle pipe with an efi injector bung on it sitting in my trunk.. i'm about to just go after the 5th injector setup that i never wanted to do.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

crew219 said:


> I think Arin should post that email you sent him awhile ago before he started working at APR. Makes your intent quite clear. Perhaps if you didn't choose to edit all of your incriminating posts, people may actually believe that your motives are genuine.
> 
> That being said, I can't imagine a Tier 1 supplier choosing to work with someone who can't even spell "tier" correctly


Dont worry about spelling or grammer Dave , I take care of ALL ( every single one ) of my customers and make sure they got what they paid for and double check every job personally.

APR didnt live up to there end with incomplete kit and under delivered in the power dept and they had many times to get it right .That being said IF they put out a such a great product with power figures that live up too there advertised numbers they have nothing to worry about NO ?  Bob.G


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

I love this forum! :beer: opcorn:


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

MFZERO said:


> I love this forum! :beer: opcorn:


Makes you laugh eh?:laugh:


[email protected] said:


> Those customers obviously have goals which we are not exactly looking to support.


Cant argue with that business model. If APR thought there was a market for it , they would have developed it by now.:thumbup:


rracerguy717 said:


> There will be a REAL BT intank pump solution shortly, drop in plug and play works with the PWM OEM manegement ,


There is allready a BT intank fuel pump solution and it does not work well.
Unless you have someone who works with plastic and has the ability of making molds (by the 1000's) for you then I highly doubt your solution would be beneficial over 1/4 tank of gas. 
Will it work? Of course it will.
Will you sell Alot? Maybe 5-10 kits
Why wont you sell more than this? Because VW/Audi/Seat/Skoda owners in general are not Honda or Toyota owners. They like to know that whatever parts they buy (performance or not) does not compromise OEM drive ability and that is a disgustingly harsh reality.

In order to get an intank fuel pump set up , you need to do away with the OEM basket, something alot of people are not willing to sacrifice. Dont believe me? Try installing it in your car , leave about $5 worth of fuel in the tank and go for a nice lap around a race track. You will swap back to an OEM pump + inline fuel set up so fast.

Now is there a real BT fuel system for the FSI coming out? You bet your lucky stars there is one.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

Everyone makes this fuel system out to be harder then it is. The only real issue is the hpfp float and injectors. Everything else could be done like a normal efi car. Spend some time on honda-tech, most of those guys know what they are doing. Just because you have a vw doesn't mean that you can't solve problems like a honda guy.


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## blackvento36 (Mar 17, 2003)

Hmm, there's alot of ulterior motives in this thread............but this **** was funny....



[email protected] said:


> .......On your particular box code, we simply installed a timer that would go from powerful to weak back to powerful every 6 months so you would look like a happy customer and a total prick w/o any logical explanation....


........and somewhat true from what I recall


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## eastwick897 (Sep 2, 2007)

Whats the ETA for a full fuel system like this to be released to the public?


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

eastwick897 said:


> Whats the ETA for a full fuel system like this to be released to the public?


Probably the same eta as when ill f*** Eva Mendes.


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## kamahao112 (Nov 17, 2007)

IMAN973 said:


> Probably the same eta as when ill f*** Eva Mendes.



bwahaha ahahaha haha a

i got your vid ..lol http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/03/the-eva-mendes-sex-tape-v_n_668960.html


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## CLestat (Nov 15, 2007)

Sub's


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

IMAN973 said:


> Everyone makes this fuel system out to be harder then it is. The only real issue is the hpfp float and injectors. Everything else could be done like a normal efi car. Spend some time on honda-tech, most of those guys know what they are doing. Just because you have a vw doesn't mean that you can't solve problems like a honda guy.


 
Sure it is the same as every other EFI car if you ignore the PWM fuel pump controller and the dual stage intank pump..then it is exactly like every other car. 

Or in other words nothing like 99% of the FI cars on the road

but yea the same.


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## eastwick897 (Sep 2, 2007)

IMAN973 said:


> Probably the same eta as when ill f*** Eva Mendes.


 Well get on that man! If you need help handling her shoot me a PM


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## velocity196 (Feb 19, 2006)

IMAN973 said:


> Probably the same eta as when ill f*** Eva Mendes.


 Uhhhhhh...can I watch....please


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Sure it is the same as every other EFI car if you ignore the PWM fuel pump controller and the dual stage intank pump..then it is exactly like every other car.
> 
> Or in other words nothing like 99% of the FI cars on the road
> 
> but yea the same.


 Its the same in the respect that the hpfp requires a more standard amount of fuel to operate. How you provide that fuel is where vw made it more complicated then it needs to be.


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

IMAN973 said:


> Its the same in the respect that the hpfp requires a more standard amount of fuel to operate. How you provide that fuel is where vw made it more complicated then it needs to be.


 
Yes it is the same in respect it requiring fuel just like any engine.

However we are talking about upgrading here, and because of how it was made it isn't anything remotely like other vehicles and that means you can't simply upgrade it like other vehicles which is what you said. 

Actually many cars do have dual stage in tank pumps and actually experience the same problems that people have when upgrading to a single stage pump in a VW, they complain about the issues just as much also. I reality many modern cars have issues upgrading the fuel systems and there is no just do it like this or that car unless you want the same issues they have also, plus our specific issues.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Yes it is the same in respect it requiring fuel just like any engine.
> 
> However we are talking about upgrading here, and because of how it was made it isn't anything remotely like other vehicles and that means you can't simply upgrade it like other vehicles which is what you said.
> 
> Actually many cars do have dual stage in tank pumps and actually experience the same problems that people have when upgrading to a single stage pump in a VW, they complain about the issues just as much also. I reality many modern cars have issues upgrading the fuel systems and there is no just do it like this or that car unless you want the same issues they have also, plus our specific issues.


 The facts of the matter are that you can upgrade the pump but its not plug and play. Just because from the factory it came with a pw signal doesn't mean you can't change that. Again what is the purpose of the pump? Its to supply the high pressure pump with enough fuel to enable it to sutain the requested bar. If you now what the high pressure pump requires to do that, then you can work backwords and redesign a low fuel system that meets that requirement. We all know this isn't rocket sicence but most people never try anything out and do r&d on it.


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

IMAN973 said:


> The facts of the matter are that you can upgrade the pump but its not plug and play. Just because from the factory it came with a pw signal doesn't mean you can't change that. Again what is the purpose of the pump? Its to supply the high pressure pump with enough fuel to enable it to sutain the requested bar. If you now what the high pressure pump requires to do that, then you can work backwords and redesign a low fuel system that meets that requirement. We all know this isn't rocket sicence but most people never try anything out and do r&d on it.


 
That is not what you said, you said it was the same as any other car, it isn't and that is all i corrected you on since it is misleading people.

If you slap in an inline 044 after the regulator the car won't run right and throw codes without special tuning. 

If you slap in an inline 044 before the regular the car won't run right and throw codes without special tuning.

If you slap an 044 in the tank even hooked up the the factor fuel pump controller the car will generally run fine but you will get codes without special tuning.

If you eliminate the stock dual stage pump and put a pump in its place say an intank 044 or a walbro 255 that is single stage only you lose the factory sump function of that housing which keeps roughly .6 liters of fuel on hand for the pump at all times. Without the dual stage pump you have issues with fuel supply at low fuel levels and even long turns at moderate fuel levels.

So there are actual real issues beyond that of just no plug and play options, even if there was a great plug and play solution on the market today there are still things that need to be handled on the software side. You are correct it isn't rocket science but there are factors beyond what your average guy at home can contend with no matter how skilled or knowlegable they are.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> That is not what you said, you said it was the same as any other car, it isn't and that is all i corrected you on since it is misleading people.
> 
> If you slap in an inline 044 after the regulator the car won't run right and throw codes without special tuning.
> 
> ...


 I did not intend to mislead people. Yes I agree with what your saying. But if you run a sumped tank, x fuel pump, inline fpr, then the low side is solid. Will you get a cel? Yep but I personally could care less as long as the high pressure pump gets the fuel it needs. Is it cheap? Nope I spent over 1500 on it with pumps,, filters, regulator, .125 aluminum sheet, and hose assemblies but it works and it holds the requested low pressure.


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## sabba (Oct 25, 2008)

so where does the USP solution fit into this equation?


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

sabba said:


> so where does the USP solution fit into this equation?


 What "solution" lol 

USP has a band aid for the problem. The kit is intended to help it but not fix the problem. Dont forget we are talking about 5/6 bar of fuel. At those higher then average pressures most pumps fall off because they are not designed to flow massive volumes at those pressures. Why do most platforms use dual 044s to supply fuel at 4 bar? because the rate of consumption is greater then what one 044 can sustain, and thats at only 4 bar. 

Also duty cycle comes into play. Do you want your daily to have a 255 pump at 95% duty or would you rather upgrade to a 300lph 044 and run a 65% duty?


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## sabba (Oct 25, 2008)

IMAN973 said:


> What "solution" lol
> 
> USP has a band aid for the problem. The kit is intended to help it but not fix the problem. Dont forget we are talking about 5/6 bar of fuel. At those higher then average pressures most pumps fall off because they are not designed to flow massive volumes at those pressures. Why do most platforms use dual 044s to supply fuel at 4 bar? because the rate of consumption is greater then what one 044 can sustain, and thats at only 4 bar.
> 
> Also duty cycle comes into play. Do you want your daily to have a 255 pump at 95% duty or would you rather upgrade to a 300lph 044 and run a 65% duty?


 OK, so i quess I used the word "_solution_" pretty loosely. 

So your saying there are better means then this AUX pump to deal with and possibly the resolve issue of maintaining proper pressure in fuel rail to keep the HPFP happy? 

I am currently in the market to upgrade my low end fueling. 

thanks 
Nick


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

sabba said:


> OK, so i quess I used the word "_solution_" pretty loosely.
> 
> So your saying there are better means then this AUX pump to deal with and possibly the resolve issue of maintaining proper pressure in fuel rail to keep the HPFP happy?
> 
> ...


 Yes but its not cost effective nor oem. I mentioned the optimal hardware above but there are drawbacks like keeping no less then 1/8 of a tank of gas. Im not bashing their kit im just saying when you lower compression you just exasperate fuel issues exponentually thus causing you to have a better solution.


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## sabba (Oct 25, 2008)

IMAN973 said:


> Yes but its not cost effective nor oem. I mentioned the optimal hardware above but there are drawbacks like keeping no less then 1/8 of a tank of gas. Im not bashing their kit im just saying when you lower compression you just exasperate fuel issues exponentually thus causing you to have a better solution.


 i hear you, it just a bit confusing for someone like myself who is really not in "the know" when it all the potential fixes or patches available. 

im just trying to make sense of all of this and make the most informed choice possible. I would like to avoid too many unforeseen hiccups the first time around. 
Right now my tune is safe but to have the overhead of safety in terms of fuel supply I do now plus the ability to make more power is tempting.  

With my current tune, it only request stock pressures in fuel rail and I am making nice power to the wheel...


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

IMAN973 said:


> I did not intend to mislead people. Yes I agree with what your saying. But if you run a sumped tank, x fuel pump, inline fpr, then the low side is solid. Will you get a cel? *Yep but I personally could care less as long as the high pressure pump gets the fuel it needs*. Is it cheap? Nope I spent over 1500 on it with pumps,, filters, regulator, .125 aluminum sheet, and hose assemblies but it works and it holds the requested low pressure.


 How long did you run the car like this with the check engine light on? Sounds very similar to what i did over 2 years ago but my cel would turn into a limp mode after about 35 miles....Clear the code and i was fine to make power for another 35 miles or so before limp again. Have you done any serious long term testing?


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> How long did you run the car like this with the check engine light on? Sounds very similar to what i did over 2 years ago but my cel would turn into a limp mode after about 35 miles....Clear the code and i was fine to make power for another 35 miles or so before limp again. Have you done any serious long term testing?


 Sotfware has come a long way from two/ three years ago.


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

ok so that is pretty much the answer chris was looking for, it will be a hardware/software package not just hardware.


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## 18bora. (Aug 18, 2007)

The FSI motor seems nothing but a lot of headache…. and I was actually eyeing the new Golf R, what the hell was I thinking. :facepalm:


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> ok so that is pretty much the answer chris was looking for, it will be a hardware/software package not just hardware.


 I never said that. I did not modify my tune for my low pressure fuel system. What kit are you refering to? This is seperate from what my associates are working on. I did this for my car on my car just like you did. I have no ambitions to sell this setup to anyone but if a customer came to me, id be more then happy to weld up a fuel cell and make some hose for the car.


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## velocity196 (Feb 19, 2006)

18bora. said:


> The FSI motor seems nothing but a lot of headache…. and I was actually eyeing the new Golf R, what the hell was I thinking. :facepalm:


 Save this car fir the big boyz ! 

I kid I kid , it's a year away homie, we got time :thumbup:


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

If you didn't modify your tune then you will have the same issue as everyone else..your not really making any sense.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> If you didn't modify your tune then you will have the same issue as everyone else..your not really making any sense.


 I don't have this so called "issue", what don't you understand. :facepalm:


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

If you run your pump non pwm even with an adjustable fpr their will be times when fuel pressure is out of spec...not sure why you have no problem, you must be the only one. You got some attitude too. 

Personally i think you have done no real testing and you are only going off theory. We will wait for you to lay down big dyno charts *and time slips* to back them up.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

*wasn't finished typing


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> If you run your pump non pwm even with an adjustable fpr their will be times when fuel pressure is out of spec...not sure why you have no problem, you must be the only one. You got some attitude too.
> 
> Personally i think you have done no real testing and you are only going off theory. We will wait for you to lay down big dyno charts *and time slips* to back them up.


 I have an attitude towards you because you think your better then everyone else. You have this know-it-all mentality that only you can try new designs. We all know how you swore up an down that the car will not run good without runner flaps and everyone believed you until other people 2 years later tried it and don't have any issues. 

I don't care what you think. You also thought that I was the one starting **** and you were proven wrong again. Don't forget you were the one who was launching at 8 grand with your 35 and couldnt beat times people running a standard apr stg 3. 

I will put the power down without an issue. You don't know me or my goals or my skill level. I don't need a shop to weld little intake extensions like you did. I weld my own stuff including a traction bar setup im designing as I wait for my new crank. 

You attack everything I say and its getting annoying. Don't you have a part to get or something? Like seriously you don't even have a fsi anymore so why troll. What you did years ago was good at the time but a new batch of cars are making new records. Don't hate just keep it moving onto the next car.


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

IMAN973 said:


> I have an attitude towards you because you think your better then everyone else. You have this know-it-all mentality that only you can try new designs. We all know how you swore up an down that the car will not run good without runner flaps and everyone believed you until other people 2 years later tried it and don't have any issues.
> 
> *I don't think i am better than everyone else i am telling you what I have tried and it doesn't work, IDK what the hell you are talking about with the runner flaps now your just making **** up*
> 
> ...


 *I don't attack everything you say but you are the only one posting on the internet you have this all figured out and you know the magical ways, I simply asked how you were making it work with no software chage where more than 1 other person had issue*


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## [email protected] (Jul 29, 2008)

IMAN973 said:


> We all know how you swore up an down that the car will not run good without runner flaps and everyone believed you until other people 2 years later tried it and don't have any issues.


  

Not a single issue with flaps removed? That's contrary to every test we preformed on multiple vehicles. If I remember correctly, it took a bit of work in the software to get the car running correctly on cold start. Not looking to get into a vicious argument, but I find that interesting.


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

Arin don't bother, didn't you hear him? He works on his own car he knows more than us..


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## [email protected] (Jul 29, 2008)

For the record, I'm not looking to pwn anyone on this one. I've just heard several people (Even those's who's opinions I respect and don't believe blow smoke up my ass) say "I have absolutely no issues" while I know I've personally seen, felt, and driven the exact opposite. 

One of the most obvious issue was driving just after cold start. With no software adjustments if you would try to give it any decent load rolling down the street, the car would buck and stumble. After cold start went away, it ran fine for the most part.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> *I don't attack everything you say but you are the only one posting on the internet you have this all figured out and you know the magical ways, I simply asked how you were making it work with no software chage where more than 1 other person had issue*


 Im well aware of all the issues jeff no need to make excuses about why you didn't make more power. I just said it was good at the time. Why didn't you modify your tune for the 35? Because you couldn't adjust anything, we now have software that does. 

I just started going for big power this offseason. So how am I a joke if I decided to take on all the challenges that I know you faced and still continue? You gave up and I don't blame you but don't knock people who no the issues and still build a new motor. Yes jeff im building a new fsi with a complete new setup. Could I have dropped a vrt in there yep, what about a 1.8 , of could but I didn't. I like the challange. I LOVE when people like you say i can't do something. 

Having a welder and being able to weld are two different things.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> For the record, I'm not looking to pwn anyone on this one. I've just heard several people (Even those's who's opinions I respect and don't believe blow smoke up my ass) say "I have absolutely no issues" while I know I've personally seen, felt, and driven the exact opposite.
> 
> One of the most obvious issue was driving just after cold start. With no software adjustments if you would try to give it any decent load rolling down the street, the car would buck and stumble. After cold start went away, it ran fine for the most part.


 The only thing I can think of is that the cars that I have scene without flaps where bts tuned by uni. Lewxcore is one of them. He lives in florida so cold starts are not an issue for him. I also didn't have any issues with my mani wo flaps either and im running ctapp.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

I also want to say im not an expert with 10 years at welding but im proficient at it.


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

Issac you can drop this you couldn't figure it out so you gave up crap, I love my mk5, i like to race it... I am attempting to compete in a class that has cars going [email protected] and they will only be going faster next season. Despite the FSI being challanging why would i want to use an engine that will not get me anywhere near my goals..When you build an FSI that can do 0-185mph in 1320 feet than i will respect your opinion that I "gave up".


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Issac you can drop this you couldn't figure it out so you gave up crap, I love my mk5, i like to race it... I am attempting to compete in a class that has cars going [email protected] and they will only be going faster next season. Despite the FSI being challanging why would i want to use an engine that will not get me anywhere near my goals..When you build an FSI that can do 0-185mph in 1320 feet than i will respect your opinion that I "gave up".


 Now were on a completly different topic. Obviously tony and miller run **** in street outlaw no question. Tony w his mph and miller w the new car will be going crazy fast. I wont doubt that eds motor w gears wouldn't compete either but we're not talking about outlaw racing. Theres only one or two vws even competing. But if that was the case why would you choose such a heavy chassis? I dont care but its a valid point. No question outlaw is crazy fast.


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## [email protected] (Jun 24, 2009)

IMAN973 said:


> Now were on a completly different topic. Obviously tony and miller run **** in street outlaw no question. Tony w his mph and miller w the new car will be going crazy fast. I wont doubt that eds motor w gears wouldn't compete either but we're not talking about outlaw racing. Theres only one or two vws even competing. But if that was the case why would you choose such a heavy chassis? I dont care but its a valid point. No question outlaw is crazy fast.


 I like my car and i feel with me in it i can come pretty close to 2500 which in't much off from the class rules. 
Ed's car and my car have 100% same exact setup, only difference is i will have motec he will still have his SM4. 
We are trying to compete because it is fun, do we expect to go compete with tony and miller? No not this year but you have to start somewhere. 
Miller does have a hand in my car though and will continue to support and tune the car that Ed is building for me. 

Now does it make sense why i ditched the FSI? I don't always ask you questions about your car to be a dick, some times i really want to know how it works..I think you take some of the things i say a little to hard to heart because of what happened between me and Issam. 



And just to poke a little fun, I do have an FSI.. It just has 2 turbos on it and is 3L's


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> I like my car and i feel with me in it i can come pretty close to 2500 which in't much off from the class rules.
> Ed's car and my car have 100% same exact setup, only difference is i will have motec he will still have his SM4.
> We are trying to compete because it is fun, do we expect to go compete with tony and miller? No not this year but you have to start somewhere.
> Miller does have a hand in my car though and will continue to support and tune the car that Ed is building for me.
> ...


 I always understood why you left but you know if you kept trying you could make this motor just as good. Would it have been easy or right now? Nope but at least you did something no one else could do. Its all about how you look at it. A 1000 hp 1.8 is an accomplishment as well. 

You may be right but we both know that most things are not blatantly said. Theres a lot of hard feelings in the vw world because these cars are not fast and to make them fast takes a lot of connections. We all have to work extra hard to make them fast and people get defensive and start to hate when other people start to tackle those same issues because they may have the means and the will power to overcome them.


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

Its just like the milf at the strip club that's been there for forever, she's always hating on the new "talent" because she might have fewer bullet wounds then her.


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## CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi (Apr 4, 2007)

opcorn: 

bullet wounds are HOT, but i prefer scarred wrists from failed suicide attempts. 



IMAN973 said:


> Its just like the milf at the strip club that's been there for forever, she's always hating on the new "talent" because she might have fewer bullet wounds then her.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

18bora. said:


> The FSI motor seems nothing but a lot of headache…. and I was actually eyeing the new Golf R, what the hell was I thinking. :facepalm:


 Dont waste your time Sam the EVO does EVERYTHING much better @ less than 1/2 the price and you wont have to jump through hoops to get decent power . 

You would be going backwards if you got the new R.  Bob.G


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## CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi (Apr 4, 2007)

rracerguy717 said:


> Dont waste your time Sam the EVO does EVERYTHING much better @ less than 1/2 the price and you wont have to jump through hoops to get decent power .
> 
> You would be going backwards if you got the new R.  Bob.G


 im getting back into a subie after i sell these cars and never looking back!


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## LEWXCORE (Jul 7, 2007)

i like making my car fast because it's the last thing anyone expects out of an A3. **** an evo or subie. the scarcity of a car with this motor running hard on the streets and the awe that strikes people when they see it run is all worth the hassle for me.


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## EL_3grab (Mar 25, 2006)

LEWXCORE said:


> i like making my car fast because it's the last thing anyone expects out of an A3. **** an evo or subie. the scarcity of a car with this motor running hard on the streets and the awe that strikes people when they see it run is all worth the hassle for me.


 x2


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## CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi (Apr 4, 2007)

LEWXCORE said:


> i like making my car fast because it's the last thing anyone expects out of an A3. **** an evo or subie. the scarcity of a car with this motor running hard on the streets and the awe that strikes people when they see it run is all worth the hassle for me.


 With what I have spent on these FSIs (two GTIs and my old A3) I could've built three eight second rotaries, a bad ass evo and STI combo, or rebuilt a few schools in the gaza strip.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

LEWXCORE said:


> i like making my car fast because it's the last thing anyone expects out of an A3. **** an evo or subie. the scarcity of a car with this motor running hard on the streets and the awe that strikes people when they see it run is all worth the hassle for me.


 Thats why we all have VW/audi's until and EVO with only bolt on and a tune drives HARD away from you and you have 10K into the car. Then you go back to your tuner and he says "but your car is butter smooth " LOL. What a joke. I cant wait untill there more interest in VAG cars from tuners on the other side So that these VAG tuners lose market share and MAKES them push harder. The day of mail box/clone tunes will be a thing of the past. !!!!


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## CoNGLoMeRaTeGTi (Apr 4, 2007)

rracerguy717 said:


> Thats why we all have VW/audi's until and EVO with only bolt on and a tune drives HARD away from you and you have 10K into the car. Then you go back to your tuner and he says "but your car is butter smooth " LOL. What a joke. I cant wait untill there more interest in VAG cars from tuners on the other side So that these VAG tuners lose market share and MAKES them push harder. The day of mail box/clone tunes will be a thing of the past. !!!!


 x2


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

rracerguy717 said:


> Thats why we all have VW/audi's until and EVO with only bolt on and a tune drives HARD away from you and you have 10K into the car. Then you go back to your tuner and he says "but your car is butter smooth " LOL. What a joke. I cant wait untill there more interest in VAG cars from tuners on the other side So that these VAG tuners lose market share and MAKES them push harder. The day of mail box/clone tunes will be a thing of the past. !!!!


 x1000


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## $GTI07$ (Feb 29, 2008)

we need more info on the bigger injectors?


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## CLestat (Nov 15, 2007)

$gti07$ said:


> we need more info on the bigger injectors?


 x 1,000,000


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## LEWXCORE (Jul 7, 2007)

rracerguy717 said:


> Thats why we all have VW/audi's until and EVO with only bolt on and a tune drives HARD away from you and you have 10K into the car. Then you go back to your tuner and he says "but your car is butter smooth " LOL. What a joke. I cant wait untill there more interest in VAG cars from tuners on the other side So that these VAG tuners lose market share and MAKES them push harder. The day of mail box/clone tunes will be a thing of the past. !!!!


 yeh you have a good point on the VAG tuners. There's so much money to be made here from companies that are willing to work harder that this **** we are handed after we pay good money. 

As far as the evo's go... idk man by the time I had 10k under my hood i was blowing away evo's left and right that thought they were fast with their e85 and fp turbos


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

rracerguy717 said:


> The day of mail box/clone tunes will be a thing of the past. !!!!


Not quite..

Most "custom" tunes are 99.9% the same as the last guys and next guys cars. It is a joke in those markets get away with calling custom. Heck even custom in this market is an absolute joke. Just because I special order a couch from Ikea doesn't mean it is custom and that is along the lines of what most custom tuners are doing..


On top of that despite the handful of standouts a majority of this market and even the other markets being compared just want off the shelf reliable products, not custom not balls the wall wall max power. In every market there are the die hards and those who want to go bigger and bigger but that isn't truely what most want. It isn't even what most of the people reading these threads want which only represents a single digit percent of the whole tuning market, and that is of the people who modify not owners.. So if 200 people own the car and 100 modify it 2 of those want more then just bolt on stuff so 1% of the overall owners.


There is a market for what you guys want that is for certain no one is going to argue that. But you also have to realize that there is a log of talk. Why are there stage 3 kits? certainly not for people to buy they are so you buy stage 1 and maybe stage 2. Do people buy them, sure or no one would waste the money but bigger turbos are for marketing not for trully selling. You make a ton more money off the dream then you do the product itself.

Bottom line is also, if you want to keep bringing up the evo market, is people put their money where their mouth is there which people don't here. Yes a few do but not in the numbers that makes anything worth while. I get calls all the time for people wanting to make big power on A4 2.0ts, we tell them until someone comes up with a good reliable fuel solution we can't tune it, guess what no one has come up with one. No one is putting their money where their mouth is they want everything handed to them. Even companies producing hardware kits are limiting themselves to what the stock fuel system can do on those which isn't much and a joke compared to the transverse cars. That wouldn't happen in other markets because people actually buy stuff once it is produced, this market everyone begs begs begs for it and then bitches about the price when it comes out, it isn't worth the time or money for many companies. 

If you crazies want progress you don't need to keep screaming at and yelling at the people who can do it for you, because that always works... You need to get the not crazies on board so that there is an actual demand. 

If someone came out with cheap injectors that flowed for 800hp today, it wouldn't matter the same people who would go big yesterday will go big tomorrow, no market share was gained.


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## yvrnycracer (Apr 17, 2007)

oh how I will miss the drama of the 2.0TFSI forums... 

the 3.0TFSI world is just not the same... 

still very interested in LP side development...


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## sciblades (Oct 21, 2008)

i'm going to be joining you in the 3.0 side soon, love that platform..


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## sabba (Oct 25, 2008)

sciblades said:


> i'm going to be joining you in the 3.0 side soon, love that platform..


noooooooooooooooooooooo!


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## [email protected] (Jul 29, 2008)

yvrnycracer said:


> oh how I will miss the drama of the 2.0TFSI forums...
> 
> the 3.0TFSI world is just not the same...
> 
> still very interested in LP side development...


3.0 TFSI is the ****. I have customers putting down 80+ AWHP with just our software over what they did with stock software. The engine is putting down nearly what they claim at the crank as we are seeing at all 4 wheels. A chipped car with race fuel is like 400 AWHP, it's nutty and such a hot platform. Chip, Intake, Exhaust, Done. :thumbup:


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