# 2.7T woes



## shweb (Jan 27, 2006)

I've been searching for evidence or testimonials about supposedly well-known problems with the 2.7T engine. Here's the deal:
I'm still driving my 3rd Audi, a '91 200 TQ 20v. I've had it for a long time and love it, but it's getting old (>230K miles). I've had my eyes on the A6 2.7T for some years now. However, my favorite mechanic, an excellent local Audi expert and racer and Audi loyalist to the bone, insists that the 2.7T engine is REALLY bad news. In fact, he has stated that Audi should recall them for updates. According to him, it seems that Audi dropped the ball on the 5-valve v-block design causing seals to break down after 60K miles. He's already rebuilt 12 of these engines over the past year, all with <100K miles.
So, I'm writing to this forum to find out:
1. Anybody had similar experience with the 2.7T engine?
2. Has there been any acknowledgement from the factory on the existence and/or cause of this?
3. Any after-market cures to look out for so that, once re-built, one could be confident that it was fixed?
4. Any indication that it's inherent in the design of the engine and can't be corrected?
Honestly, I've been a die-hard Audi fan for nearly 20 years, mainly with the tried and true 5cyl, 20v. But this is shaking my confidence in the company, especially in light of the fact that they might be totally sweeping this under the rug.


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## vdubnut_mike (Aug 13, 2002)

*Re: 2.7T woes (shweb)*

So if they recall the 2.7t they should recall all 30v V6's then too? They all used a similar head. The only major problem I've heard of with the motor is the turbos going out (personal experience) I have yet to hear anything about the motor itself, but I have heard of a lot of people pushing serious HP numbers thru a stock motor without any reported problems. So I dunno what to tell you.








and what does the valves have much to do with the V block design? If I recall that would be a head problem, not a Block issue. and they seem to have it down just fine with the beloved 1.8t. I think your mechanic has been breathing fumes of old Audis for too long.


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## shweb (Jan 27, 2006)

*Re: 2.7T woes (vdubnut_mike)*

Well, honestly, I thought I was referring to one engine. Isn't the 2.7T a 30-valve V6? Just goes to show how out of touch I am, I guess. And, I didn't mean to imply that it's a block issue. Just the valve/head design associated with that block. 
I really shouldn't pretend to know fully what I'm talking about here. Just re-iterating from one I happen to trust. I've had my eye on the 2.7T to replace my aged 20v, but he's done a pretty good job discouraging it.
I guess there could also be some other kind of fumes floating around the back of his shop







but that doesn't really make sense. He's a pretty solid guy with an excellent outfit.
I'll see if I can get more detail from him on the specific probem and repost.
In any case, thanks for the reply. You're not the only one that has denied such a known issue. It gives me hope that the 2.7T will be the next project after all


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## whostolesilence (Sep 4, 2005)

in the grand scheme of things it isn't a reliable motor whatsoever.
how long do you really think one is going to last even with just the chip?
also, what is "serious horsepower"? i don't know what this guy is looking to do with his car, but to me serious horsepower is way out of the range the 2.7t is capable of handling.


_Modified by whostolesilence at 6:20 AM 1-28-2006_


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## shweb (Jan 27, 2006)

*Re: (whostolesilence)*

So, Silence, what makes you say that? Specifics would be most helpful here.
I'm not necessarily even really referring to chipped out units with HP pushed to the limit. The problems I"ve been told about were mostly run-0-the-mill family cars.


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## VRSIX- (Feb 1, 2002)

*Re: (shweb)*

I'm glad that Audi have redeveloped the RS4 engine for like 80% from the original S4 one.
(not that these engines have no problems but they are a LOT stronger than the S4 2.7 TT 's)








It all comes down to how you treat the engine.










_Modified by VRSIX- at 7:47 PM 1-28-2006_


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## whostolesilence (Sep 4, 2005)

individual examples aren't as important as sweeping generalizations when it comes to predicting the future of the as yet "random" car you will purchase.
i'm basing my statements from what the magazines and consumer reporting companies have said. I wanted one and walked away with the boring old 2.8 (it's just something to commute with for me) due to my research into this.


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## shweb (Jan 27, 2006)

*But, it *is* a specific issue...*

Silence,
I understand your point. But it *is* something very specific that I'm trying to identify here, at least according to my local shop. From his description, it seems there should be voluminous data out there supporting the existence of such a nasty issue, if indeed it exists.
I'm well aware of random issues that might occur. That's just, unfortunately, part of the game when your considering used vehicles. Or even NEW, for that matter







It's the *known* issues I want to avoid, or at least understand them going in.
Make sense?
As I've stated in this thread, I've sent a message to the shop asking for specifics about this supposedly "known" issue. I'll repost when/if I get more info.
Thanks,
ShWeb


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## shweb (Jan 27, 2006)

*Re: But, it *is* a specific issue... (THAT DAMN GOOD!)*

Yeah, whatever. I didn't post it twice. Not sure how that happened. But, thanks for the tip, albeit with a bit of attitude


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## THAT DAMN GOOD! (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: But, it *is* a specific issue... (shweb)*

yeah, i tend to be rather _blunt_. But i am very interested to see how this post progresses.


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## shweb (Jan 27, 2006)

*Specific info from the shop...*

...received this afternoon.
"the typical problem with the 2.7t is that the cam adjusters leak (aka cam ajuster units & cam chain tensioners). some claim that only the seals leak, but we consistently see them leak from the adjuster body. another problem with some of the 2.7t was premature failure of the waterpump causing the timing belt to slip and bend valves. we also see the camshaft seals leak."
Granted this is all top-end stuff, but it still sounds pretty scary (read: *expensive*).
Also, assuming it's given that this problem exists, once re-worked, is it truly corrected, or just set for a period of time before it all starts again?
I dunno. It scares me a little


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## zerovdub (Aug 15, 2003)

*Re: Specific info from the shop... (shweb)*

I would like to hear more on this. I am looking to step up from my a4 this summer


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## shweb (Jan 27, 2006)

*A "little extra" preventative maintenance...*

zerovdub,
I've discussed this at length on this and other forums. There does indeed seem to be some "issues" with the water pump, the cam adjusters and, to a lesser extent, the cam seals on this engine. However, it seems that most of those that acknowledge the issue simply take it in stride and consider it part of the cost of ownership. 
And, it might not be so bad, really. The WP can be replaced with an improved version from a different mfr that has a metal-blade impeller. I've heard from multiple owners that simply replace the WP and/or cam adjusters at the same time they go in to replace the timing belt (before 80K miles).
So, it comes down to a "little extra" preventative maintenance in order to avoid the really scary stuff that might occur if you don't.
Make sense?
ShWeb


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