# Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter



## J.R. Rogers (Dec 29, 2000)

Okay, after a few months of toying with the audio in the Beetle off and on, I've reached the conclusion that the rear-speaker audio sucks, VW knows it, and there's nothing you can do about it.
*How is started...*
A few months back, I decided to "clean up" the rear audio because frankly, it sounds like mud when you pan all the way to the back. So I tore into the back side panels to find an interesting setup. The rear speaker is mounted on a one-inch spaced speaker basket, is attached to a thin metal bracket, and suspended in mid air. To top it off, there's a big rubber ring attached to the front of the speaker which seals the front of the speaker from the open rear area. I ordered a set of Blaupunkt OverDrive 3-way 6 3/4" speakers based on their good specs. When they arrived, I attempted an installation. They simply didn't fit right in the odd 6 3/4" bracket and wouldn't fit flush against it. So I cut out a foam "washer" from an XTC speaker baffle and installed it. 
The result - The highs were there, the mids were okay, but the bottom was distorted, and the higher you cranked it, the worse it sounded. I figured that this was caused by the poor enclosure. I cut out two foam "funnels" which I attached to the back of the side wall, to channel the sound into the cabin of the car. This helped somewhat but the audio was still lacking about 10 decibles - the volume was very faint coming from the rear. I left it that way for awhile, but then decided to do some more work. Figuring that the Blaupunkts were trash, I ordered some POlk 6.5" speakers to replace them. Before I went to work installing them, I decided to do some testing to try to figure out what exactly was the problem with the rear audio.
*The test...* 
I built a small cardboard box enclosure, which I sealed completely with packing tape. Cut out a speaker opening, mounted the Blaupunkts, turned the system on... Wow!!! These things do sound pretty good... and have good bass, albeit low volume compared to stock - due to the cheap lightweight quality components of the stock speakers. I took one of the stock speakers, mounted it in the box... Louder, but very little bass and still somewhat muddy. Tried the Polk EX602a. POW! Very clean high quality sound about as loud as stock. Bingo! Hooked the Polks up to the factory location.... Mud. Nothing but some mids and highs, distorted lows. Put the side panel back on - same thing. (Plus, the Polks require a 6.5-6.75" speaker adapter to fit which I had to improvise since I didn't have one.)
So now what? Of course, order new speakers. After research, I found out that Kenwood makes a replacement speaker specifically for the Beetle, Audi, and others. The KFC-1738C. I decided to give these a shot, based on their 3-way design and good specs. These arrived and I put them through the paces... They performed almost Identical to the OverDrive ODx663's. So now what?!?!? What is the problem with the Beetle?
*Conclusion* 
The rear side panels of the Beetle suck for audio and VW knows it. That's why they tried to "enhance" the sound by installing that rubber ring around the speakers. It's got to be the worst designed rear audio system I've ever seen/heard. They've also tried to enhance the sound by putting a dynomat-like material directly behind the speaker. I think this also does very little.
My theory is that much of the audio produced, comes from the bass which moves through the body panels of the inside of the car. That's what seems to happen in the front - the speakers mount close to the front speaker grill in a small enclosed area, and the tight bass from the stock front speakers pounds the front door panels, causing some decent sub-bass. The rear of the Beetle lacks this physical property. The speakers are suspended on a thin metal bracket which seems to absorb much of the thump. The sound from the rear of the speaker is transmitted through the huge open side panel in the rear, while the sound from the front of the speaker is poorly transmitted through the rubber seal fastened to the front of the speaker. Without this rubber seal, the audio is garbage at best, because the sound waves from the front of the speaker cancel out the sound waves from the rear of the speaker. Thus, if you buy an aftermarket speaker and toss the rubber ring away, you get mud and distortion. You can build a spacer to position the front of the speaker closer to the interior of the car, but it does very little to increase the bass response or the volume of the sound. You can build a custom funnel, but that also does very little.
Out of frustration, I've gone back to my factory speakers. After spending many hours of trial and error on this project, I've determined that you just can't get better audio from the rear without going to extremes...
*Theory...*
A couple of things to think about trying when attempting to get better audio from the rear..
1) Rip out the metal brackets and build your own custom enclosure.
2) Surface mount the speakers.
I gave much thought to #2, but then decided the speakers would look funny because they'll stick out about 1" from the side wall once the speaker grilles are attached. Also, you need a BIG 6.75" - 7" speaker grille to cover the speaker most 6.5 and 6.75" grilles wont cut it.








Comments? How have you gotten decent audio from the rear of the Beetle, without adding stuff to the trunk?
J.R.


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## VPRBEETLE (Sep 20, 2001)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (J.R. Rogers)*

My 2000 beetle sounded great when I added a set of MOMO/Polk components to the rear, however it only got better when I added as set of 12"subs to the trunk.







The best thing I could tell you is this: 
1) you MUST build up the space between the mounting brackets and the panel with a set of custom made MDF spacer rings, this will bring the rear speaker almost flush with the rear panel.
2) install the rear speakers. In my honist opinion if you want a set of good preforming, non-component speakers, without the over $400.00 price tag. Go with the infinity kapas. I have had them in the beetle before the MOMO's as well as other cars and they perform great for the price. 
3)Last you have to do some cutting but try and re install the rubber ring. i was able to do it with the infinity's however the MOMO's are a mid woofer and really didn't require it because i was able to bring the speaker all the way out to the panel. 
This was just my experiance, it's possable that someone was able to get better results from their findings, but the "WOW, I feel like i'm in a movie theater" after the DVD is over is good enough results for me







Good Luck, hope I was of some help.


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## ang4100 (Dec 29, 2000)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (J.R. Rogers)*

yeah your right the New Beetle sound system does suck. Vw didnt think it through that well, I had the problem corrected by adding an AudioBahn 6channel amp and 2 12s in the trunk. I no longer have a trunk but the stereo sounds gr8


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## J.R. Rogers (Dec 29, 2000)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (VPRBEETLE)*

Thanks for the comments! Do you happen to have pictures of your installation? So basically, you built a spacer for the speakers to move them closer to the car, and cut the rubber rings off and attached them to the speaker somehow? Please explain...
Last question... I'm assuming you surface-mounted the Momo's?
Thanks for your help!
J.R.


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## sOnICtheBeEtLe (Oct 5, 2001)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (VPRBEETLE)*

HOW THE HELL DID U FIT 2 12'S IN YOUR TRUNK NO TRUNK SPACE .. MAN ..??? I HAVE 10'S ... THAT BARLEY FITS ..


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## sOnICtheBeEtLe (Oct 5, 2001)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (J.R. Rogers)*

I FEEL U.. STOCK SYSTEM DOES SUCK ... BUT ..MONSOON IS NOT THAT BAD ...BUT .. IF I WERE .. U ... CHANGE THE WHOLE THING ...!! AS FOR I HAVE .. SONY XPLODE ....DECK ...FILP DOWN .. SONY XPLODE ...SPEAKERS ... FOR ALL FOUR PANALS .. FRONT AND BACK .. SONY EXPLODE ..1000 WATTS .. AMP . AND 2 ALPINE TYPE R'S SIZE 10 SUBS ... KNOCKS.. PREEETY HARD ...IM STILL WORKING ON MY CROSS OVER ...AND MY EQUALIZER ... AND MAY BE SOME TV SCREENS .....TRYING TO STAY WITH THE SAME BRAND BUT PEEPS .. SAY .. MIXING BRANDS IS BETTER .....BUT GOOD LUCK ON YOUR PROJECT .... THATS SIDE PANAL IS A B*tch TO TAKE OFF..














IM ALSO TRING TO CUSTOMIZE .. THE BACK OF MY CAR ... BUT DONT WANT TO TAKE SPARE ... OFF ..???SO .. I DONT KNOW .


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## VPRBEETLE (Sep 20, 2001)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (J.R. Rogers)*

Actually J.R., I didn't take any pictures of the install. Basicaly you take 2 roughly 8X8 inch squares of 1/2 inch MDF and glue them together then you need to take the outside diameter of the stock speakers and draw them on the sandwiched MDF then you take the mounting diameter of the new speakers ( the new speakers almost always come with a template of the mounting diameter) and trace that diameter on to the MDF what you should get is 2 circles with the inner one (the new speaker mounting hole) about a 1/2 inch -3/4 inch smaller. You then use a dremmel tool to cut out the unwanted wood leaving you with one ring.







You get to do it all over again for the other side.







You then drill your holes for mounting the new spacers to the car and the speaker to the new rings and install. Be warned it took me close to 2 hours to just make the rings and I have done it before on a 99 passat. It's alot of cutting but is essential so the sound doesn't get lost in the panel. Actually i also used the spacers on my front doors too. My speakers aren't flush mounted their just brought right up to the pannels with a ring of dynamat around where the speaker would touch the door or rear pannel so the vibration is dampened. And like everyone else 2 12's in the rear leave me no trunk room, but that's about to change with a custom box real soon.


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## silversport (Aug 8, 2001)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (J.R. Rogers)*

JR-
Thanks for posting your (frustrating) attempts to cure the rear speaker syndrome. While reading your post, I came to the same conclusion you did-why not just build an enclosure to mount inside the rear interior panel? Cut away all or part of that flimsy metal bracket, build a small wood enclosure and secure w/brackets and screws or silcone. How does this sound?


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## silversport (Aug 8, 2001)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (VPRBEETLE)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Actually J.R., I didn't take any pictures of the install. Basicaly you take 2 roughly 8X8 inch squares of 1/2 inch MDF and glue them together then you need to take the outside diameter of the stock speakers and draw them on the sandwiched MDF then you take the mounting diameter of the new speakers ( the new speakers almost always come with a template of the mounting diameter) and trace that diameter on to the MDF what you should get is 2 circles with the inner one (the new speaker mounting hole) about a 1/2 inch -3/4 inch smaller. You then use a dremmel tool to cut out the unwanted wood leaving you with one ring.







You get to do it all over again for the other side.







You then drill your holes for mounting the new spacers to the car and the speaker to the new rings and install. Be warned it took me close to 2 hours to just make the rings and I have done it before on a 99 passat. It's alot of cutting but is essential so the sound doesn't get lost in the panel. Actually i also used the spacers on my front doors too. My speakers aren't flush mounted their just brought right up to the pannels with a ring of dynamat around where the speaker would touch the door or rear pannel so the vibration is dampened. And like everyone else 2 12's in the rear leave me no trunk room, but that's about to change with a custom box real soon.[HR][/HR]​I used a 1" thick spacer made of a sandwich hardwood, and it still left the speaker about 1"-1 1/2" too far from the inside of the panel! That's why I think it makes sense to cut out that metal bracket, take measurements and install a pre-fabbed box.








With my spacers and the bass turned up, I get a ringing sound coming from the back speakers, which sounds like the metal bracket vibrating. That's why I'm favoring making a speaker box.


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## GGKauten (Aug 6, 2005)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (silversport)*

Why go through all the trouble for some rear speakers which essentially just fill your sound in.
If you are going to make some custom enclosure, why not just put an 8 inch sub in the space of each of the rear speakers and add a three way component set to the front doors!







Damn that actually sounds like a really good idea now that I think about it.....hmm I will post my findinds tomorrow when I take out my rear speakers. Maybe I will figure out a system to make some brackets for the rear to fix this problem.
Thanks for posting this, now I know what I am going to run into when I change my rear speakers this week.


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## BigBlockBug (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (GGKauten)*

you need a crossover for the speakers to rule out the frequencies they are not hitting very well, IE bass. get a sub for the bass, a highpass for the rears, and cross overs for the front


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## no-BUG-me (Jun 27, 2004)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (J.R. Rogers)*

From what I've read, VW only intended the rear speakers to be "midrange fill" with the front speakers creating the stereo soundstage in front. 
Even with the Monsoon system, the rear speakers remain midrange fill.
I put in 2 way JBLs in the rear panels retaining the rubber rings, and have a 8" Bazooka sub in the trunk run from the rear speakers. 
The sound quality and volume level is excellent and I am very happy with this as a simple solution. 
The adjustments for treble,mid,bass on the head unit make it easy to tune the system to my liking. 
The sub in the trunk was the key to getting the bass I wanted/needed, and having it completely removable is also to my liking. I didn't want a huge permanent fixture taking up my trunk.
2 plugs, and 2 straps and the sub comes out.


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## YllwTRB (Feb 15, 2004)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (no-BUG-me)*

I upgraded all my speaker and the wiring on my Beetle. All monster calble with 12 gauge wire and Rockford Forsgate speakers. Also put in a 1200 watt amp that powere 150w to each front speaker and 800 to a 12 inch woofer in the trunk. My rear speakers are being powered by the head unit which a a top of the line Pioneer head unit. Of course everyting wrapped in Dyno matt and it sounds GREAAAAAT. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Pelican18TQA4 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (YllwTRB)*

I have a full JL Audio setup going in next Friday, I'll let you all know what I think after it's all done! I've got a 450/4 amp powering a set of XR653-CS 3-way components up front and a pair of XR650-CXi coaxials in the rear. For bass I've got a 500/1 powering a 10w7 in a sealed box.


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## GGKauten (Aug 6, 2005)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (Pelican18TQA4)*

That 10w7 should sound BEAUTIFUL! Great choice!


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## Pelican18TQA4 (Dec 13, 2000)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (GGKauten)*

I previously had just the sub hooked up and you are correct, it sounded beautiful and really POUNDED when turned up!


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## Scarab_Beetle (Dec 11, 2004)

wow... i wish we could have more people willing to conduct such thorough testing on engine and suspension components as you have with the sound system! Thumbs up for your hard work, i just couldn't justifying putting so much work into something that doesn't make me any faster


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## NBTurboFreak (Jan 16, 2004)

*Re: Beetle rear speakers... The final chapter (sOnICtheBeEtLe)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sOnICtheBeEtLe* »_HOW THE HELL DID U FIT 2 12'S IN YOUR TRUNK NO TRUNK SPACE .. MAN ..??? I HAVE 10'S ... THAT BARLEY FITS ..

I have 2 RF T1 12s in a ported box and the amps all in the trunk and still have a little space left for some jumper cable, fuses, and a few other small items. I also upgraded all the factory speakers with RF FanQ 6.5 front and rear and added 3.5 in the dash to fill up the monsoon spots. It now sounds very clean and hits hard at loud volumes. I will post some pics later.


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## capt_caper (Dec 18, 2011)

*Glad I found this thread*

Wanted to upgrade my stock sound system (non monsoon) for some time.

Came across a steal of a deal on a set of JBL GTO627 coaxial 6.5 inch. to mount in the rear to start off.

I was so terribly disappointed (dis-heartened) to test them with the rear car panels off. Not only less bass than the stock speakers but lots of noise from the speaker mounting panels etc.

Reading hear and elsewhere, I am going to try two things to improve the situation. 1) I will seal the new speaker to the door panel with a high density foam ring (with or without building up a mounting ring) ... and 2) I am going to install a layer of sound damping material where ever I see fit.

The sound damping material I got (based on my internet searches) is Resisto Multi Purpose (Aluminium) Waterproof Membrane because I can't get Peel & Seal Aluminium (http://www.lowes.com/pd_154017-81326-PS625___) here in Canada. Resisto is available at Rona (like a Lowes) http://www.rona.ca/en/multipurpose-waterproofing-membrane-74165156 

I plan a follow up here with the results.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1tiP0erg4w1YVd3WXZPeVdGcVk/view?usp=sharing


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