# new ml compared to touareg,



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

Hi everyone:
I recently went down to my local mercedes dealer, and took an ml 320 cdi for a test drive. Sorry all of you treg fans, but you have no Idea what you are missing. the ml320 cdi is worth every penny. its more quiet then a gas touareg. 
I agree that the touareg is an excellent vehicle with a high quality interior and great offroad capabilities, but for a simillar price, how can I put it, A mercedes is a mercedes and a VW is a VW, and VW, and the Touareg is not a mercedes. The new Ml is light years ahead of the old ml. They really listened to everyones complaints and corrected everything with the new one.
I am not trying to bash the touareg, and the touareg has its strong points also, but just wanted to say, that for this much money, I will go with the ML and the 320 cdi is unreal. You have to guess that its a diesel. the v6tdi is a good motor, but waiting 2 years?????? why when you can have the THEN::: NOW!!!


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## mech888 (Oct 1, 2006)

I drove one. Handling sucked....


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## smithjss (Jan 8, 2007)

*Re: (mech888)*

Do you mean the 350??


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## cjamie (May 21, 2005)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (tregv6tdi)*

not only I have no idea of what I am missing. I have no idea of what I am reading either...
Can you please describe the so called Mercedes feel? Somehow I missed that feeling when I test drove the ML.


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *smithjss* »_Do you mean the 350??

The 350 is the gas engine. The 320 is the diesel engine.

_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_Hi everyone:
I recently went down to my local mercedes dealer, and took an ml 320 cdi for a test drive. Sorry all of you treg fans, but you have no Idea what you are missing. the ml320 cdi is worth every penny. its more quiet then a gas touareg. 
I agree that the touareg is an excellent vehicle with a high quality interior and great offroad capabilities, but for a simillar price, how can I put it, A mercedes is a mercedes and a VW is a VW, and VW, and the Touareg is not a mercedes. The new Ml is light years ahead of the old ml. They really listened to everyones complaints and corrected everything with the new one.
I am not trying to bash the touareg, and the touareg has its strong points also, but just wanted to say, that for this much money, I will go with the ML and the 320 cdi is unreal. You have to guess that its a diesel. the v6tdi is a good motor, but waiting 2 years?????? why when you can have the THEN::: NOW!!!

Are they doing a better job of assembly in Alabama these days?


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

its a much more trouble free car than the touareg. I did not test drive the 350, i drove the 320 cdi v6 24 valve common rail direct injection diesel similar engine to the v6tdi of the touareg.


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

oh lets not forget about customer service. compared to mercedes, vw does not have any. I am sure someone will say that you have to find a good dealer, but thats exactly my point. All the Merc dealers have to be good dealers. you don't have to go find a better dealer.
anyways, the torque and the 7 speed tranny works really well. its ease on fuel, even the spring suspension has a good comfortable ride. the air suspension is similar to that of the touareg. no expliation needed.
the leather seats are not pink.


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

The touareg is made at Bratislava in Slovakia which is where kia and hayundis are being built.
the ML is built in the good USA. which is where HONDA and TOYOTAs are being built. (quality labor)


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## PAULLLLLIN (Mar 29, 2007)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

The ML's interior is crap and just because its a Mercedes doesn't mean its going to be a...well...a Mercedes. I still rather a Touareg...now a Range Rover...thats a completely diff. subject lol


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## MinerSK (May 19, 2006)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_The touareg is made at Bratislava in Slovakia which is where kia and hayundis are being built.

Well, just a couple of facts about the "European Detroit":
TOUAREG, Q7 and CAYENNE are all built in Bratislava. All the models produce the same people on the same product lines.
You have no idea what workforce quality they employ in VW Bratislava! 
Do you know that on the lines work actually a lot of technical university degree people?






















KIA are being built in Zilina in northwestern Slovakia. The factory is the most modern car making plant in Europe and KIA C'eed is coming with 7 years of guarantee as a standard!
Then there is another big Peugeot plant in Trnava, which is just some 40 km from Bratislava.


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## Gunship (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (tregv6tdi)*

tregV6tdi is obviously there just to stirr.
I thought of upgrading to a 2007 face lift Treg and decided to once again try the ML 320 / New X5 .. Prado / L/C 100 / Hummer 3 ... everything Q7 included.
The V6Tdi is untouchable in 95% of all categories.
If I needed 7 seats I would have taken a very close look at the GL big boy that I will admit !


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## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: (mech888)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mech888* »_I drove one. Handling sucked....

Ditto; and it's power is not compelling -- it has wife power.
ML's have never "done it for me"; and Mercedes makes too many models IMO, everyone and their dog is driving one -- they have diminished the brand. Being Porsche/TReg/Audi focused, seeing a Mercedes makes me happy that another sucker is born every day


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## jrtouareg (Jun 15, 2005)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

After owning Hondas for 12years, I got rid of both my Pilot and Odyssey because of recalls and quality issues. They were good vehicles until they started building them in Alabama. My uncle has had 3 MLs. He said that the only one that really felt like a Merc was his ML55. He said the others felt more like driving a Tahoe. The ML55 actually gets sent to Germany to be completely disassembled and transformed by AMG. He said it still saw a lot of time in the shop. He test drove the new ML diesel and was not impressed. Traded the ML55 for a V8 Treg. He is waiting for the V6 TDI. I have a client who let me drive his new ML350. I can tell that its built in Alabama. Does not handle like the Treg or even feel like its a German vehicle. Just my 2cw.


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## wrh3 (Mar 18, 2004)

When we started looking for alternatives to our '04 Treg, we drove just about all of the SUVs out there: several different models of Land Rovers, MBs, Toyotas, domestic brands, and finally came back to the Touareg and got our '05 (which has been trouble free). It is hard to beat the quality of the materials, assembly, performance and value the VW offers http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## khaug (Jun 5, 2007)

*Re: (wrh3)*

We rented a ML350 for a vacation a year ago. Handling was nice enough, but the powertrain was awful - the engine is a torqueless wonder, and the 7-speed tranny is very reluctant to downshift, leaving you powerless at awkward moments.
Test drove a Jeep GC with the 320 CDI powertrain a couple of months ago. It, too, seemed very short of torque (not at all like our E320 CDI, which has a different engine).
Each car has it's particular merits, but the Touareg V10 TDI still gets my vote.


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## chickdr (Nov 28, 2003)

*Re: (khaug)*


_Quote, originally posted by *khaug* »_We rented a ML350 for a vacation a year ago. Handling was nice enough, but the powertrain was awful - *the engine is a torqueless wonder*, and the 7-speed tranny is very reluctant to downshift, leaving you powerless at awkward moments.

Interesting comment from someone with a 550ft/lb V10 tdi. ANYTHING will seem like a torqueless wonder compared to that motor except maybe the ML63...


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

When trying to decide what I wanted, before getting my Touareg, I first looked at the H3, since I had a Colorado, my feelings were...boring. Then I looked at an ML350. Nice enough, liked the interior layout, and the cup holders in the dash are cool, but again, I was left rather uninspired. Then I drove an X5 3.0, and 4.4. Neither left me thinking they are the ultimate driving machine. Then one night, it hit me. The following Saturday, we tested a used 04 Touareg, and I knew I'd found my vehicle. We ended up taking it home to keep. 
I sit at a computer at work all day long, so I get ample time to research anything that comes to mind. The ML series spends ample time in the shop. That's a hit against it in my book. Their is no software like VAG-com for the MB. And most people are very unhappy with how their dealers treat them. The X5 is a little better, but not much. And their is still no software available to the general public. Also, you can honestly tell that they aren't made in Germany or any other factory in Europe. And the 07 and up ML AND GL series gear shifter is in the worst possible place it could be in, and is electronic. It almost seems to me that it's engineered to break.


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_The ML series spends ample time in the shop. That's a hit against it in my book. Their is no software like VAG-com for the MB. And most people are very unhappy with how their dealers treat them.

I had a 99 ML430. I was not satisfied with the treatment by the dealer either. It was like I owned one of their "bottom of the line" vehicles, which basically it was. I guess if I had purchased an S-class or even an E-class from them I would have been given better treatment.


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

Personally, I've tried Toyota, and was not impressed with the vehicle, or the service I didn't recieve from dealers in several states.
I've given GM a shot, and they were ok. Service was hit and miss. My biggest gripe with GM service is when they fixed one problem, they created a new one. Once I started fixing the issues myself, the problems stopped. 
Now, we have 2 VWs, and I have no complaints about VW themself. The dealer we bought my wife's car from is a joke, but we now take both to the place mine came from, and have no gripes. Also, VW actually contacts us after we visit the dealership, and have no problems working through our problems. How many ML owners can say that?
Lastly, call a few independent BMW or MB service shops, and ask their honest opinion of the ML and X series vehicles. I'd be willing to guess that they will steer you away from them.


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## chickdr (Nov 28, 2003)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_Lastly, call a few independent BMW or MB service shops, and ask their honest opinion of the ML and X series vehicles. I'd be willing to guess that they will steer you away from them. 

Honestly, you must be very lucky with your 04 Treg to say something like this. 2004's are pretty much universally scorned. Nobody in their right mind would recommend anybody buy a 2004 or even 2005. This board confirms this comment frequently. Many VW dealers suck too. I was lucky with mine but there are threads all over the Vortex talking about shoddy service at many dealers...


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## mml7 (Dec 3, 1999)

*Re: (chickdr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chickdr* »_ 2004's are pretty much universally scorned. Nobody in their right mind would recommend anybody buy a 2004 or even 2005. 

Not ours. Our first run, 007xx VIN'd 2004 (build date March 2003) was probably the most trouble free car we've ever owned. The _only_ reason why we traded it in was because we needed a 7 seater. Of course, despite our good luck, I don't think that I'd recommend an '04....
When it came time to shop for another car, we couldn't bring ourselves to seriously look at the GL...As the OP states, a "mercedes is a mercedes". (read: a bit too snobby for us)


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## irbrenda (Oct 9, 2000)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_When trying to decide what I wanted, before getting my Touareg, I first looked at the H3, since I had a Colorado, my feelings were...boring. ...Then I drove an X5 3.0, and 4.4. Neither left me thinking they are the ultimate driving machine. 

Well, I own an '06 H3, an '05 X5 and an '06 Touareg. The H3 is not boring...it's just slow and horrid on gas, maybe worse than the Egg but since it's slowwww, I feel it's perfect for my speed demon son to use The X5 IS definitely boring but very reliable, zero problems so far. The Touareg is my baby which no one touches but me. I have a soft spot in my heart for my deceased '04, which had a multitude of minor problems but never left me stranded, was very hard to part with but I had to and the '06 is absolutely troublefree and the best vehicle I've ever owned and I've owned many.


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

I've only had mine for 3 weeks. We bought it used. But I'm aware of the quirks of an 04, and money being an issue, we couldn't afford new. Looking at many things such as towing ability, comfort, and ergonomics to name a few, the big egg was what fit my needs best. I originally bought my Colorado because of the 5 cylinder, and my fondness for them from my youth, and dreaming of owning a 5 cylinder quattro. I'm not saying I don't expect issues with my Touareg, but, having one of the techs at the dealership we bought from, in the same vw club we are in, I'm a bit more comfortable with that. And it certainly beats all the little nit picky things that my in-laws have had to deal with on their overpriced, uncomfortable, ugly 04 SRX station wagon.


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

Oops, I forgot. For 3 years, I drooled over the H3, and drove about a dozen. I just couldn't ever get comfortable in it. It's got more blind spots than any H1 I ever drove in the AF.


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## wrh3 (Mar 18, 2004)

To be fair, the only lingering issues I had with my '04 were related to the voltage / generator wires and some small things which were addressed by TSBs and recalls a month after I traded it in......but the '05 was the color combination we wanted anyway so it worked out.....


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## worladdie (Dec 1, 2006)

*Re: (chickdr)*

On this board many people with right minds have recommended 05s, Ive even heard here people lauding their 04s


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## mech888 (Oct 1, 2006)

My 04 was great.....


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## Shabbis (Jul 13, 1999)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_Oops, I forgot. For 3 years, I drooled over the H3, and drove about a dozen. I just couldn't ever get comfortable in it. It's got more blind spots than any H1 I ever drove in the AF. 

I felt the same about the FJ. Test drove one and it has blind spots the size of Montana in the back. Plus the Touareg is in a complete different class than the FJ, and can go everywhere an FJ can.


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## miraclewhips (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (tregv6tdi)*

I am not trying to bash the touareg, and the touareg has its strong points also, but just wanted to say, that for this much money, I will go with the ML and the 320 cdi is unreal.......

Not trying to bash the touareg...... of course your not buddy.
Your post is like walking into a restaraunt and telling the chef that his food is good, but the place across the street is much better for the money!


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## COTDI (May 28, 2007)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (miraclewhips)*

I drove the ml320cdi and then bought the V10 TDI. There's no comparison in torque and the benz seemed very top-heavy compared to the touareg. Try taking the 320 offroad, like I can with the touareg as well. Is it worth the 15K extra you pay? That's for you to decide, but it was for me...


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (COTDI)*

How much is a well equipped ML320 CDI? Looks like close to $50k to me. Do Mercedes dealers give discounts on them?


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (COTDI)*

comparing a v10 tdi to a v6 cdi is unfaair. you should compare a v8 cdi, ml 420 cdi to the v10. even with 2 less cylanders, it gives the v10 a run. 
I did not mean to steer up so much emotion with this thread. But, for what its worth, its great to hear all of these opinions. Also, I don't know of another car forum that you find so many committed users.
the ml has its pros as does the touareg. I guess it has to do with personal needs. I have to agree that the previous model ML sucked compared to the new one and the first generation one did have all sorts of problems just like the touareg is going through.
I owned a ML320 gas 1998 that got bought back by mercedes and replaced with a e320. The difference between the two were huge. The new Ml reminds me of the E call that i had after the buy back.
I guess, in the end, its down to personal preference, resale value, and cost of ownership. So what are the figures do you think? How many ml are sold per every Touareg?


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

Basically, it's all going to boil down to personal preference. One bad Toyota in my case has left me with a crappy outlook on anything Toyota touches. My parents have the best luck with Ford vehicles, but GM vehicles don't seem to like them. I never had a gripe about either, though the 2 GMs my wife and I recently traded were fine vehicles, and I even had an 04 Colorado, which is supposedly loaded with mechanical failures, but mine never left me hanging. The MLs with an actual frame under it were nice, though top heavy, but the newer version, with the electronic gear shift on the column just doesn't do it for me. I wouldn't have minded an H3, but the more I looked at them, they just wouldn't do what I need it to do. Cargo space and towing ability are both top priorities for me, considering I'll need the ability to transport my dogs to and from training in a couple years, the Touareg was a shoe in.


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

http://germancarscene.com/2007...class/  http://germancarscene.com/2007...class/


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## SUVW (Jan 29, 2004)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

Gotta love that Google translator. Some classic sentences there.
So, since the majority of us are USA drivers, this comparo is really irrelevant. We have no V6 TDI... yet.
But I enjoyed reading that translated thread.


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (SUVW)*

well for me it counts, as those are the two that i have to choose from. My roads are badly paved so suspension plays a huge role, i do lots of hill climbing and descending and rarely go above 60 mph. roads are so bad, you need the bet available suspension for comfort.
as you can tell, my needs are totally different from an average us driver. Oh and diesel is 50% cheaper than gas for me.
a adequately equipped touareg (package 1) springs v6tdi us$64,000, ml with the same options us$69,000. if you add air suspension and low range, you add $6000 t the price of the Ml.
on the tuoareg, air suspension is not available.


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## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (spockcat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *spockcat* »_How much is a well equipped ML320 CDI? Looks like close to $50k to me. Do Mercedes dealers give discounts on them? 

Closer to $58k MSRP


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (ehd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ehd* »_
Closer to $58k MSRP

Oh. Then the decision is very clear. Touareg V10 as a leftover 2006 is going to be less money and even a 2007 should be no more than that.
I would also pick the Touareg V8 for $10k+ less or a Touareg V6 FSI for $15k+ less.


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## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (spockcat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *spockcat* »_
Oh. Then the decision is very clear. Touareg V10 as a leftover 2006 is going to be less money and even a 2007 should be no more than that.
I would also pick the Touareg V8 for $10k+ less or a Touareg V6 FSI for $15k+ less. 

$58k was the build on-line price (loaded w/air-suspension). Granted, a similar build on-line 08 FSI v8 TReg would be $60k and a 08 v10 is $76k-$78k.


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## Gunship (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_well for me it counts, as those are the two that i have to choose from. My roads are badly paved so suspension plays a huge role, i do lots of hill climbing and descending and rarely go above 60 mph. roads are so bad, you need the bet available suspension for comfort.
as you can tell, my needs are totally different from an average us driver. Oh and diesel is 50% cheaper than gas for me.
a adequately equipped touareg (package 1) springs v6tdi us$64,000, ml with the same options us$69,000. if you add air suspension and low range, you add $6000 t the price of the Ml.
on the tuoareg, air suspension is not available.

In SA you hardly find a Touareg (notice the spelling







) without air suspension. They import them 100 to 1 I hear.
Anyway the ML320 oil pump sucks to the Egg V6Tdi - please read this after you traded your Merc in for one ..


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_if you add air suspension and low range, you add $6000 t the price of the Ml.
on the tuoareg, air suspension is not available.

MB offers low range on the ML? That is news to me. I don't see it on MB's website.

All VW Touareg V10TDIs come with air suspension standard. As for the V6TDI, VW isn't offering it in the USA at this time due to emissions standards. Since VW does offer air suspension as an option on the V6 and V8 models in the USA, I assume that it will be available on the V6TDI when they come to the USA next year.


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (spockcat)*

yes the ML has low range center lock and rear lock. It has everything that the touareg has plus reliability. 
http://e-services.mercedes-ben...1.jpg
As I said before, different markets different needs. The market that I am in, needs low range and it is offered.


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

Here is some information on the ml's 4wd package.
Standard: variable hill descent control, hill start assist. 4matic 4wd 4-ets system, Electronic Stability Porgram ESP (helps with understeer and oversteer. also has a offroad button that clibrates the 4-matic abs, and transmision to offroad use.
OFF ROAD PRO-ENGEERING package across the range. The package includes: dual-range transfer case with low-range ratio, centre and rear difflocks, high-ride AIRMATIC, manual-mode autobox and other powertrain changes.
Hope that clears the 4wd capabilities of the ML.


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

Plus reliability? Do they include a tech in a box package with it now?
Honestly, it sounds like you've made up your mind that you want the ML. So, I guess the question is, are you trying to convince some of us to jump ship; are you asking us to change your mind; or are you just shring what you've learned with us for future reference?


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*

you are right i did make up my mind. when I started the post My mind was not made up, but now it is. I am not trying to convince anyone here. I am sure everyone here is as happy with their touareg as they could be. the touareg is an excellent suv as it the x5, ML hey even the Highlander, as bland as it may look, does its job and fits its nitch very well.
Each of the german suvs target a certain type of person or type of personality and lifestyle. I have realized that the touareg is not for me. I also realized that many people make more of it than it really is just like many people make more of a mercedes than it really is. Looking at my choices and comparing all the suvs out there, The ML fits me and my lifestyle better than the touareg.
I did truly consider the touareg, and had already paid 50% of the suv. but after waiting 5 months since my first payment (febuary) for a car that i was promised May delivery, and last week hearing that the production was backed up because of faulty transmissions, i decided to start looking at other options.I was last told November delivery. 








There has to be something wrong here.
In the past few months, reading about all these nightmares that people have been going through with a touareg Really helped my decide too. I have realized that many people purchased the touareg looking for something better and have been disappointed, and then there are the hardcore touareg fan that don't want to accept that they made a mistake or say that its the most trouble free car that they have ever owned.  
I went to see two other dealers for the touarg and asked about how reliable it was, and they could not give me a strait answer.


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## Gunship (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

You forget one thing : This is a Touareg site and as such people that has *mostly problems* with their Egg's will post about it. The other 99,9% of us are silent readers and having a great time with our Egg's. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I wish you luck with your ML. Drove a V10 last night and it was one of the best drives I ever had. Speedo reading 255 km/h between Somerset West and Cape Town http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Good luck with the Em EL (you gonna need it)


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## vrsexxy_GTI (Sep 14, 2004)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_its a much more trouble free car than the touareg. I did not test drive the 350, i drove the 320 cdi v6 24 valve common rail direct injection diesel similar engine to the v6tdi of the touareg. 


Are you sure about that? The 2006 ML was rated the least reliable car in the north american market


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## Gunship (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: (vrsexxy_GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vrsexxy_GTI* »_
Are you sure about that? The 2006 ML was rated the least reliable car in the north american market 

The same in South Africa and I am sure I saw it just about stone last in the UK as well.


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## rflor (Apr 11, 2000)

*Re: (worladdie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *worladdie* »_On this board many people with right minds have recommended 05s, Ive even heard here people lauding their 04s

Agreed...in 25,000 miles, my 2005 has had exactly one problem (a leaky coolant seal in the alternator).


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## Gunship (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: (rflor)*

Maybe before you buy mate read this :
http://www.mercedes-benz-usa.com/ml_class.php


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## Islandiver (Nov 13, 2004)

All I can say is this. I looked at an ML 320. It was very nice, even considderd trading my 04 v10 on it. In the end the dealer would not take the Touareg on trade or if I did trade it they put a very low wholesale price on it. Funny I never had a problem getting rid of my 01 ML-55. No car truck or SUV is perfect. In the end its what floats your boat.


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

I was heart set on an ML350. I wanted nothing else. Dispite all the bad reports about it. I kept saying that it was just that being an MB, it's held to a higher standard, and MB owners are just a lot more picky. I was still unsure about it though, despite how much I wanted one. Plenty of room in the back for my dogs, would tow a 4 dog trailer no problem. But I just couldn't commit to it without my wife agreeing. So, to make my wife happy, I tested the very same Touareg that I now drive. More space inside, rides better, better consumer ratings, tows more, and gets better mileage.


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

thanks everyone for looking out for me. All i can say is that the ML is a 2008. Its the third year of production. As many of you have said, the bad touaregs are the 2004 and 2005. with all of the bad rap about mercedes in the past few years, I am sure that the third time around, (just like the touareg) they got all of the bugs fixed. I will for sure go test drive a touareg again and see what the dealer has to say now about when they expect to have the new ones in.
resale value: this is a car that I will most likely be keeping to 6 to 8 years, so as far as resale value i am sure that there is none for either case.
as far and these upper line lux suvs go, (german cars mainly) they are over engineered cars thats their problem. the more stuff they have the more stuff can malfunction. what I am trying to say is, the more technology advanced they are the more chances for glitches.
regarding the ML's past problems. 2006, 2007, bad solenoid in transmision. (tsb)
air suspension problems. (tsb)
fuel guage (tsb)
steering column rough (tsb)
diesel freezese when super cold and don't use a winter formula diesel??????


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## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

How on Earth would you not use winter formula diesel in the winter? Seems rhetorical. 
Also, pay close attention to the gear selector on the new MLs. Any spirited driving could result in accidentally bumping it, and who knows what that could cause. It's also now electronically selected, rather than mechanically selected. 
Choose what suits you best.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*

turns out that it happened to this guy in Australia. he left the (hot diesel formula) to go up a mountain. Being a diesel, he did not need to refuel. the next morning, frozen diesel.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

are the 2008s just like the 2004s? thats what i am afraid of.
here is a thread that i found on another forum.
2008 Touareg review
I finally got my new 2008 Touareg 3 weeks ago, traded 2004 BMW 325I. The car handles great, comfortable and luxurious interior. I got the technology package and love the nav system, backup camera, and upgraded sound system. The car looks great too! Big improvement over the previous models. There is no other SUV that looks as good as Touareg does, OK maybe Audi Q7 or Porsche, but we're talking about much higher $$$$ too. However, on the third day the fuel cap light came on. OK, we thought perhaps the cap wasn't put on properly. We fixed that, the light went off. The next day the engine light came on.Contacted the dealer to learn that the light was related to the cap and should reset itself after three days. Well, it never did. Took it back to the dealer to get it reset. The engine light came back on right the next day. Called the dealer, schedule an appointment to get it fixed. That was Thursday 7/26, today 7/29 the car is still in shop! Apparently there is a small air leak somewhere and it's hard to detect where. Service people say that it's nothing serious, but it drives me crazy that it takes them so long to get it fixed. Little disappointing!!!


----------



## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_its a much more trouble free car than the touareg. I did not test drive the 350, i drove the 320 cdi v6 24 valve common rail direct injection diesel similar engine to the v6tdi of the touareg. 


How can you say this if you just test-drove the car, and where the car is built has absolutely nothing to do with quality. VW choose Slovakia and other eastern Europe countries because its cheaper for them to build them there and they still have to pass zillion of quality controls so it really doesn't matter.
Mercedes just can't compete with VW when it comes to SUVs and interior, sorry.
And whats that Mercedes is Mercedes and VW is VW? I prefer VW, maybe i would prefer Mercedes if you asked me this 10 years ago but right now Mercedes is crap, all they have are some really over-priced vehicles. There are 3-4 Mercedes models i like for the money but VW on the other hand...every model is good on its way


----------



## kpg111 (May 5, 2002)

*Re: new ml compared to touareg, (tregv6tdi)*

To each his own, it all boils down to individual tastes. As for me, I'd still choose a VW Touareg!


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

agreed:
my taste, ML!!!!


----------



## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

Mercedes ML is about as exciting and as cool as an '84 Cadillac Cimmaron.


----------



## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: (NickM)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NickM* »_Mercedes ML is about as exciting and as cool as an '84 Cadillac Cimmaron.








Ditto;







I get no emotion from ML's as well...


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (ehd)*

i guess it all depends on what you are looking for in a SUV.
For me the ML is just at another level. VW just can;t go there.


----------



## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_i guess it all depends on what you are looking for in a SUV.
For me the ML is just at another level. VW just can;t go there. 

Yea, level down....


----------



## jrtouareg (Jun 15, 2005)

Funny I was suppose to have a meeting with a client today and I called him on his cell since he was running 30 minutes late. He told me he was at the MB dealer trying to return his 2 month old ML350 because it keeps breaking. His exact words: "There's always a [email protected]#$ing part that breaks and then it stays in the shop for days. I think its been in there more than I've had it at home."


----------



## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_i guess it all depends on what you are looking for in a SUV.
For me the ML is just at another level. VW just can;t go there. 

Are you trying to convince yourself to purchase this inferior suv; or trying self-justify a bad decision


----------



## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_i guess it all depends on what you are looking for in a SUV.
For me the ML is just at another level. VW just can;t go there. 

Sounds like you're looking for a label and other people's acceptance. In which case the three pointed star sounds perfect for you. Buy it up and enjoy...


----------



## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

i think he bought it already...


----------



## SUVW (Jan 29, 2004)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_i guess it all depends on what you are looking for in a SUV.
For me the ML is just at another level. VW just can;t go there. 

This sounds like a partisan political discussion to me. A waste of time. He's dead set on what he wants, and no one's going to convince him otherwise.
What's the point?


----------



## The Mad Hatter (May 18, 2005)

I normally don't like feeding trolls, but...
All this debate about Treg vs MLs maybe all well and good, there is no comparison in my opinion. They may have similar off-road characteristics, but until I see a ML tackling the same mountain trails we do at a Colorado Rally in our Tregs, I will stick with my "VW".
'nuff Said!


_Modified by The Mad Hatter at 5:15 AM 8-3-2007_


----------



## Glenn in Den (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: (The Mad Hatter)*

I was on the ML vs TREG fence for quite a while. In fact, the discount is what pushed me off the fence. I got a massive discount on my V10 and MB was being very stingy with their discounts. 
However, I do think this thread was started by a troll who just wants to resurrect a long, silly debate that I've seen crop up here several times in my relatively short membership here.
What I find laughable is that he brings up resale value and reliablilty as a feature for MERCEDES !!! Good one!!


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

I beleive that each car has its pros and cons. The touareg as had its handfull of clients wanting their money back for the same reasons if not more. I think they are both better than most out there. This is a touareg forum and its only normal that you reactions are as they are in order to cover your purchase. Had I already purchased, I would not at this forum. 
someone comment stated that people mainly come to forums to complain and to seek answers regarding the problems that they have with their Touaregs, and that 99% of them are fine and do not give any problems. 
If this is true, then the touaregs is a real POS, becuase the ML outsells the touareg about 4-5 to 1 and there are alot more people complaining about touaregs and problems here and at club touareg that the mercedes forums.
anyways, I understand you have to justify your purchase as I may have to if I purchase a touareg or an ML.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

Did anyone notice the forum topic titles.

anyone else's driver's seat making terrible noises when it automatically moves forward and back....

Peeling Black Trim

Reputable brake job in Georgia (brakes are so expensive that you have to have them done at another shop.)

POLL: brake pad life....????
First day with my '04 Touareg...and a problem/question already

Keyless Entry not working

rev matching... I noticed when going uphill then braking, that my V8 blips the throttle on each

Cayenne TT sway bars installed on an 04 V8 w/air (good handling requires Cayanne parts) 
Squeaking suspension after brake job?
Unusual engine noise '04 V8

Oil Pressure Message
Water Leak thru Roof Console
Bye Bye 2004 V8 Touareg - I WON"T miss you!


----------



## jrtouareg (Jun 15, 2005)

Since you're obviously here just to annoy and justify your decision, just go away and hang out with your fellow ML bloggers what ever that web site may be. After all, this is the Touareg site for helpful Treggers, not ML's. I do not think you'll get any help for your ML in this forum. We can have constructive discussions and have fun all by ourselves without people like you.


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

I'm starting to think that MB owners are like Rover or Jag owners. They know the problems exist, but pride gets in the way of their honesty. Any time that I hear constant complaints of people saying that they get blown off by the dealership come service time, unless they have an E or C class, that's not a good thing. VW owners do complain about the problems, but we also admit our vehicles do have problems. In this era, what vehicle doesn't? I will say one thing though, I've yet to see a Touareg, Cayenne, or Q7 sitting on the side of the road waiting for a tow, or riding on the back of a flatbed or tow truck, but can not say the same for the ML class. Oh, and let us not forget, the MB 5-Star diagnostics system is $250,000, and a VAG-com is AT MOST, $900. Good luck diagnosing which O2 sensor to replace on that ML.


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

*Re: (jrtouareg)*

I don't want him to leave just yet. This is starting to become fun.


----------



## maczrool (Apr 28, 2004)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_I will say one thing though, I've yet to see a Touareg, Cayenne, or Q7 sitting on the side of the road waiting for a tow, or riding on the back of a flatbed or tow truck, but can not say the same for the ML class. 

My Touareg's been on a flatbed, but then it was the dealer's fault for not reconnecting the radiator fan back after the condensation TSB.
Stu


----------



## Jimbuffalo (Sep 1, 2005)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*

this is a fun thread.
so I'll weigh in because someone else thought this poster had already purchased an ML. As confirmed above, he hasn't spent dime one on anything!
what you have here is some dude who actually thinks that the people who participate in this forum for all the right reasons actually care what he thinks.
impresses me as a teenager with plenty of summer vacation time who has likes cars and can do some internet research to sound knowledgeable. big whoop.
The gleeful, repetitive "nyah nyah nyah I know you are but what am I" retorts are silly, yet funny.
I agree. We should keep this thread going. Be glad the loser's not living next door.
"Uh yeh, nice grill you bought....mine's better. that one only does 7400 btus, mine is the 9000 supermax"
"Just got back from a trip to Tahiti? I was there once...food was no good."
"Oh? You were at the game? I had front row seats, center court..."
You have here a dime a dozen poseur who, because he can't afford a Touareg (or an ML, for that matter) figures he'll just come on to this site to poke people in the eye. 
nice hobby! 
the sin is called jealousy

So


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

*Re: (maczrool)*

Eh, that's still not routine use causing the failure. That was just human error of someone being in a hurry.


----------



## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

You want to see topics on the front page of the ML forums? These are all the titles on the first page of various Mercedes ML-W164 (the current version) forums. 
The ML forums are just full of happy people:
http://www.mercedesforum.com/forumid_14/tt.htm
Accelerator is sticking
steering question
ENGINE COOLING SYS. FLUSH
Coolant light flashes 
Headlamp left/right drive adjustment 
CHECK ENGINE 
ML430 MAF Help!
what time is it 
2006 ML350 Transmission, steering and numerous other issues
ML320 with strange buzz/hum
Weird..Can't figure it out. it won't start! 
Another forum: http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w164-m-class/

Considering ML, still quality concerns out there? 
'07 ML350 our worst MB 
Switched my ML 
2006 ML350 Transmission, steering and numerous other issues 
Still another: http://www.mbworld.org/forums/...&f=72
ML320 CDI transmission problems
2006 ML Steering & Transmission Problem
ipod not visible on comand?
Noises . .
Installing other DVD-Navigation-Hifi System
"brake wear"
2006 ML350 Transmission, Steering and numerous other issues
SRS Malfunction-again..
2006 ML350 transmission problems.
Altitude display says zero.....
any info please
Why we still drive a Mercedes. 
Another: http://www.m-benzforum.com/mer....html
ML 320 Start problem
ML 430 stalls
Stupid Newbie ML320 Navigation Questions, Please Help!!!!!!! 
*How* to replace a driveshaft center-support bearing?
Suspension Problem With ML320
replace brakes!
make seats comfortable
MERCEDES ML 270CDi AUTO GEARBOX HELP NEEDED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HELP NEEDED REGARDING GEAR BOX!
PS: I didn't see any threads with photos like this either:










_Modified by spockcat at 2:19 PM 8-3-2007_


----------



## maczrool (Apr 28, 2004)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_Eh, that's still not routine use causing the failure. That was just human error of someone being in a hurry. 

Right. I'm sure any ML would be equally unhappy in bumper to bumper traffic with no fan.
Stu


----------



## Glenn in Den (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*

The ML is a nice vehicle. . . and I'm sure the Alabama folks do a good job building it . . . . but I've always wondered what a German or other European citizen, living next to an MB plant, thinks about his/her ML or R or GL coming from Alabama!! It's the only place they're made worldwide. That's gotta sting . . . even if only a little!


----------



## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_I'm starting to think that MB owners are like Rover or Jag owners. They know the problems exist, but pride gets in the way of their honesty. Any time that I hear constant complaints of people saying that they get blown off by the dealership come service time, unless they have an E or C class, that's not a good thing. 

At least I understand RR and Jag owners..the vehicles (expect for the recent Ford/Jags) look to be designed by people who care and had passion when they designed them...the ML is like D&G sunglasses..people spend more because they want everyone else to see the label.
you're right on the blow-offs @ the MB dealer, unless you're driving a late model CLS/S/SL, you might as well show up in a rusty '79 220D..MLs are a dime a dozen.


----------



## SUVW (Jan 29, 2004)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_Did anyone notice the forum topic titles.

anyone else's driver's seat making terrible noises when it automatically moves forward and back....

Peeling Black Trim

Reputable brake job in Georgia (brakes are so expensive that you have to have them done at another shop.)

POLL: brake pad life....????
First day with my '04 Touareg...and a problem/question already

Keyless Entry not working

rev matching... I noticed when going uphill then braking, that my V8 blips the throttle on each

Cayenne TT sway bars installed on an 04 V8 w/air (good handling requires Cayanne parts) 
Squeaking suspension after brake job?
Unusual engine noise '04 V8

Oil Pressure Message
Water Leak thru Roof Console
Bye Bye 2004 V8 Touareg - I WON"T miss you!

Here, pal.
Spend a little time with this.
http://www.mercedes-benz-usa.com/ml_class.php


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

*Re: (spockcat)*

Those forums were what made my stomach knot up when I was being unsuccessfully talked into buying an ML at the dealership. They also spoke of how they had wonderful service after the sale, but I couldn't find a single owner in the STL area that felt any of the 3 dealers met their claims. I already knew, by word of mouth, that the dealer my T-reg came from takes care of their people, so it made it even easier. Heck, one of the MB salesman, also an Audi salesman had nothing good to say about VWs in general, and kept saying they all come from Mexico.














I've never owned a vehicle that I can't wait until the next time I get in it, nor want to get out of until this one. Driving the ML was like driving a slightly higher priced Cadillac.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*

hey all. 
I have to say thanks for all of you support. For me, its a close call. it has to do with availability also. the point that I have been trying to get to all along, is that they are both great SUVs and one maybe better for one person and the other would be better for the next. 
Basically what Steve is saying is that there is no fun factor with the ML.
I am actually leaning more towards the Touareg than the ML. I think the Touareg 2 are excellent. I am still waiting for them to arrive in my part of the world. But if the ML gets here first, and it will take many more months for the dealer to receive the touareg, then I may have to go with the ML.
I don't understand why an AUDI salesman would not have good things to say about VW, because the touareg and Q7 are almost the same vehicle.


----------



## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_hey all. 
I don't understand why an AUDI salesman would not have good things to say about VW, because the touareg and Q7 are almost the same vehicle.


Just a wild ass guess here, but I'm thinking he wants to sell you a Q7 instead of you buying a Touareg.


----------



## SUVW (Jan 29, 2004)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_hey all. 
I have to say thanks for all of you support. For me, its a close call. it has to do with availability also. the point that I have been trying to get to all along, is that they are both great SUVs and one maybe better for one person and the other would be better for the next. 
Basically what Steve is saying is that there is no fun factor with the ML.
I am actually leaning more towards the Touareg than the ML. I think the Touareg 2 are excellent. I am still waiting for them to arrive in my part of the world. But if the ML gets here first, and it will take many more months for the dealer to receive the touareg, then I may have to go with the ML.
I don't understand why an AUDI salesman would not have good things to say about VW, because the touareg and Q7 are almost the same vehicle.


I think it's time to just make your decision, and forget involving all of us.
Good luck.


----------



## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: (NickM)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NickM* »_
Just a wild ass guess here, but I'm thinking he wants to sell you a Q7 instead of you buying a Touareg.


----------



## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

Man, you can't figure that out...you should really have your wife with you or even your kid when purchasing a vehicle or else you gonna get ripped off big time lol
As i said earlier i dont own T or any other SUV but i am thinking about purchasing SUV after i am done with my heavily modded GTI. It's time for some bigger car. I drove ML and drove Touareg and i can't tell you...there is no comparasion, have you seen ML's interior? uh


----------



## Tregger (Mar 9, 2004)

My 2004 had a lot of issues, but I still always heard that voice in my head saying......"I love driving this vehicle !".
My 2006 has had zero issues and I am loving it even more.
Get the Touareq.....you won't regret it ! Nut to each his own.....you will know what decision is right for you.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (Tregger)*

how are air suspensions these days. any issues? Is it worth the extra money?


----------



## The Mad Hatter (May 18, 2005)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_how are air suspensions these days. any issues? Is it worth the extra money?

Well if you like having the ability to go from comfort to sports handling... being able to go offroading or driving crazy mad on surface streets... Then I'd say it's worth it!


----------



## Lunker (Feb 2, 2005)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_Hi everyone:
I recently went down to my local mercedes dealer, and took an ml 320 cdi for a test drive. Sorry all of you treg fans, but you have no Idea what you are missing. the ml320 cdi is worth every penny. its more quiet then a gas touareg. 
I agree that the touareg is an excellent vehicle with a high quality interior and great offroad capabilities, but for a simillar price, how can I put it, A mercedes is a mercedes and a VW is a VW, and VW, and the Touareg is not a mercedes. The new Ml is light years ahead of the old ml. They really listened to everyones complaints and corrected everything with the new one.
I am not trying to bash the touareg, and the touareg has its strong points also, but just wanted to say, that for this much money, I will go with the ML and the 320 cdi is unreal. You have to guess that its a diesel. the v6tdi is a good motor, but waiting 2 years?????? why when you can have the THEN::: NOW!!!


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_hey all. 
I have to say thanks for all of you support. For me, its a close call. it has to do with availability also. the point that I have been trying to get to all along, is that they are both great SUVs and one maybe better for one person and the other would be better for the next. 
Basically what Steve is saying is that there is no fun factor with the ML.
I am actually leaning more towards the Touareg than the ML. I think the Touareg 2 are excellent. I am still waiting for them to arrive in my part of the world. But if the ML gets here first, and it will take many more months for the dealer to receive the touareg, then I may have to go with the ML.
I don't understand why an AUDI salesman would not have good things to say about VW, because the touareg and Q7 are almost the same vehicle.









make up your freakin mind....3 pages of bs'n the touareg and now you're leaning towards one??.. you're more fikled than a 15yo girl










_Modified by Lunker at 5:43 PM 8-5-2007_


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

*Re: (Lunker)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lunker* »_








make up your freakin mind....3 pages of bs'n the touareg and now you're leaning towards one??.. you're more fikled than a 15yo girl









_Modified by Lunker at 5:43 PM 8-5-2007_

Probably worse than that.


----------



## Tregger (Mar 9, 2004)

I love the air suspension. I drove one with the steel suspension before I bought my 2004 with air.
Go with the air !
My 2004 had 45K miles when it was replaced by my 2006 that now has 23K miles. Both never had any issues with the air suspension.


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

I'm diggin the air ride in mine. I do wish I had the 3.6 rather than the 3.2, but I'm not complaining.


----------



## garibaldo (Jul 10, 2004)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

If you can stick it, I think the air suspension is one of the most realiable features of the suv. Do a search for air suspension on touareg and you'll see what I mean.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

ok finally ordered my touareg.
white gold,
crome package with oval tailpipes
v6 tdi
airsuspension
xenon
tinted glass
leather pure biege
memory package for both front seats and seatbelts, side view mirrors, and stearing wheel
premium radio and sub.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

Production date is end of august.
I also want to thank everyone for all of their help and for all of your opinions.


----------



## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

Should have bought a GL320 CDI.


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

You'll like it. Oh, and we fully expect pics. Be patient on delivery, it takes time.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

are there any options that are a must to have that i did not take, or are there options that are not worth it?


----------



## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*

seems like you missed the V10








....seriously looks like all the good stuff is there. congrats on the touareg.


----------



## khaug (Jun 5, 2007)

*Re: (chickdr)*

_Interesting comment from someone with a 550ft/lb V10 tdi. ANYTHING will seem like a torqueless wonder compared to that motor except maybe the ML63..._
Actually, we've has our Egg for only 2 months now, and the "torqueless wonder" comment was based on the ML 350 vs. our 3 year old MB E320 CDI (369 lb/ft). The ML 350 was not a power train I'd ever have been happy with.
Just today rode in our dealership's ML 350 (shuttle) while they had our E320 for service. The quality of the interior materials, fit & finish was hugely below our Touareg, and about comparable with a Chevrolet Impala! 
More and more, I'm seeing the V10 CDI as a "cult car", unappreciated by the "great unwashed". It pains me that it's going away soon!


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

the v6 tdi is very similar in performance to a mercedes 320 cdi.
I do not have any experience with the v10, and they are not available in my area, but I was in a q7 with the v6tdi and all i can say is wow. It does not sound as smooth as a V8 gas, but you cannot tell that its a diesel when you are in the vehicle.


----------



## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_...but I was in a q7 with the v6tdi and all i can say is wow. It does not sound as smooth as a V8 gas, but you cannot tell that its a diesel when you are in the vehicle. 

The Q7 v6TDI's "mini-van like" 9.1sec 0-60 time is far from compelling IMO -- vs. 8.2 for the FSI v6 or 7.1 for the FSI v8.


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

*Re: (ehd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ehd* »_
The Q7 v6TDI's "mini-van like" 9.1sec 0-60 time is far from compelling IMO -- vs. 8.2 for the FSI v6 or 7.1 for the FSI v8.

It's a 6500 pound vehicle, with a 3 liter V6 diesel. Most people that buy this combo aren't worried about going fast.


----------



## ehd (Sep 9, 2006)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Steve Talley* »_
It's a 6500 pound vehicle, with a 3 liter V6 diesel. Most people that buy this combo aren't worried about going fast. 

...Nor do "mini-van'ers", I assume -- thus my point








However, IMO anyone buying a $$ Q7/Cayenne/Touareg has to care somewhat about performance or they wouldn't be buying in that market segment.








BTW - you are 1,000lbs - 1,400lbs high on your weight for the Q7, depending on the motor option.


_Modified by ehd at 10:51 AM 8-10-2007_


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## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

where we live, its a diesel market. torque is more important than hp. there are not many roads that you can go over 40 mph because of traffic and bad roads. we use our 4wd every day in steep sill climbing muddy roads. basiclly we use suvs for what they were originally made for. so 0 to 60 does not mean much as long as its less than 11 secs.


----------



## Steve Talley (Sep 25, 2006)

I find myself having to speed up, instead of slow down. Never owned a vehicle, that was mine, that is this comfortable to just cruise in. Though, I do have the same problem in my wife's Passat.


----------



## tregv6tdi (May 28, 2007)

*Re: (Steve Talley)*

my dealer informed me that there are 2 versions of the air suspension. one with standard chasis, and the other with a sport chasis? Whats the difference, and which is better for me?
thanks


----------



## Yeti35 (May 17, 2006)

*Re: (spockcat)*

Hey Spock, did I give you permission to use that pic in your post?














Oh, and in case you were wondering, that pic is of an 04 V6 non airsuspension and it was still fun to drive offroad in the rally in CO!!










_Modified by Yeti35 at 12:23 PM 8-12-2007_


----------



## MinerSK (May 19, 2006)

*Re: (tregv6tdi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tregv6tdi* »_my dealer informed me that there are 2 versions of the air suspension. one with standard chasis, and the other with a sport chasis? Whats the difference, and which is better for me?
thanks

In Europe they sell:
1/ CDC air suspension (the original one), ordering code PSL, costs 3,450 Euros
2/ Adaptive sporting CDC (a new one), shoulg go 20mm lower and has an automatic anti-leaning feature, ordering code PSM, costs 3,870 Euros
If I am ordering now, then I go for the new adaptive CDC.


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