# weird sound question 09 gti



## goudok (Apr 28, 2008)

i got a quick question.. i just went from a 337gti to an 09 gti (tsi).. and right at around 2400-3000 rpm i get this weird sound..its like ticking or something...it runs fine.. well as far as i know it runs fine but i could be wrong...what do u guys think?..ps you can only hear it when the music is completely off so its not super loud., but you can still hear it


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## myeyez (Oct 31, 2008)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

I have an 09 (TSI w/ APR stg1) and around 1500 miles. I just started to notice the same noise. It sounds like its comming from the passenger side front. I can only hear it when im on the gas and between 2200 and 2900 rpm's. To me it sounds like a loose washer vibrating on a bolt. I was thinking it was the fuel line vibrating but its my understanding that this only happens at idle. Any ideas what this might be? I dont notice any loss in performance.


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

If it's happening during part-throttle, I'd say it's the wategate cycling. Just a hunch though. Maybe I'm way the heck off..


_Modified by ryan mills at 2:02 PM 11-1-2008_


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## goudok (Apr 28, 2008)

yes.. thats exacly when mine happens..part throtle from the passenger side front...
i guess im not the only one.. dealership told me its nothing...but then again you never know with them


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## VaHillBilly (Sep 21, 2008)

Could it be related to the noise pipe? I hear an odd sound as well, to me it sound kind of like a metallic rattle.


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## ODY (Jun 26, 2008)

OHHHH BOY......ever since i got my car about 4months ago that noise has been driving me crazyyy...you guys took the words right out of my mouth.........i took it in like four times to the dealer ship its driving me crazyyyy...
between 2000-3000rpm specially in higher gear u hear like a gargel/vibration comign from the passenger side....sounds like something is loose...sometimes the noise is lounder then other times....
if somone could figure this out.....
I have a 2008.5 A3..


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

I'm hearing the same thing. Only have 350 miles on mine. Thinking of taking it to the dealer as well.
I'd really like to get an answer to this, starting to get worried...


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## myeyez (Oct 31, 2008)

I notice that the noise is louder and more pronounced when the car is colder. After I drive for a while it’s not quite as bad. Also, I’ve noticed that if I keep my foot on the gas and keep the rpm's in that range (2500’ish) the noise is constantly there. Meaning I can make the noise whenever I want and for as long as I want if I keep my car in that rpm range and I’m giving it a little gas.


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

I just took it for another spin and I'm noticing the same. I can make it happen in gears 2-5 whenever I want at that RPM. It's pretty annoying and definitely doesn't sound like it should be there.
It also seems to only be when under a load. Revving the engine without a load on the engine does not seem to have the same effect.
Here is some cross pollination on the issue...
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/...68371


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## ODY (Jun 26, 2008)

i am guessing this is normal....but is there a way of fixing the noise....i feel like am driving a broken down civic when i hear it....


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## goudok (Apr 28, 2008)

*Re: (ODY)*

im just glad im not the only one hearing it... i think the noise is normal...but i still would love to know what is making that noise..


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

This has no correlation to the noise pipe at all, or does it?


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## Stratus2003 (Sep 27, 2003)

my 09 does not have this noise (almost 6K on it) and yes I have removed the noise pipe - I went the tiggy pipe route.


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

interesting. Thanks!
How much does the noise pipe mod reduce noise on the TSI? What noise are we talking about too? The more guttural sound?


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## Stratus2003 (Sep 27, 2003)

all you guys with the noise - are you running pzev or non-pzev - or is the noise on both?


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

sorry pretty new to the scene. What's pzev?


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## ODY (Jun 26, 2008)

Sorry am a noob whats up with this Noise pipe delete? I have an A3, but i hear guys on the GTI use the A3 noise pipe...should i do this mode on my A3 or is it a GTI thing?


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

From what I gather, the GTI has a pipe who's purpose is to pump engine noise into the cabin. The other vehicles (tiguan, A3, etc) that use the 2.0T engine have a toned down version of this.
I think they have it on the GTI to feed the FAST...


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (GGERG15)*

The noise pipe is only on the GTI, not the A3. GTI owners actually purchase the A3 pipe to replace the "noisemaker" on their GTIs.
As far as this weird sound, I don't have this problem at all (My car is a DSG)....
TO the people with the problem: do you drive a manual or DSG?


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

Manual


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## myeyez (Oct 31, 2008)

DSG


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## ODY (Jun 26, 2008)

I am Manual as well............I would love for someone to figure something out.....This noise has been killing me since the first day i got my car.


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (ODY)*

Maybe I will turn down my music on the way home to see if I can hear any weird noises.... lol


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## 16VSerenity (Jul 26, 2006)

I have an 08 (CCTA) that has about 2,500 miles on it and I get this exact thing as well. I brought it to the dealership once for something else and had them look into this as well. The tech drove it and stated it was normal. I would like a better answer than that however.....


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## jsiggy1 (Nov 9, 2008)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

Did anyone ver get a resolution to this problem? I just bought a 2009 GTI and have 350 miles and I am hearing the same thing. Thanks!


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## ODY (Jun 26, 2008)

This problem drives me nuts...specailly now that the weather is cooling down...i hear it more offten............................


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## acunje (Oct 2, 2008)

i know they switched to a timing chain in the tsi...
i have the rattle also... and it sounds kinda like marbles in a cup of something to be honest...
which is similar to what all motorcycle motors experience when the cam chain tensioner is loose....
could this be related... i am subsribing to this one
note that on motorccles... it is only experienced when the rpms are at certain intervals such as this is


_Modified by acunje at 1:12 PM 11-11-2008_


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

The only ticking I've heard was at idle, when the car is doing a test on the evap system. I hear once a week or so about two minutes after starting my car. It only happens once, and it last for about 10 seconds. Sound like the same thing? Other than that, I really can't think of anything else... If it's loud enough to record, please do so. Also if someone can describe the sound a bit better, that might help too.


_Modified by ryan mills at 2:23 AM 11-13-2008_


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (ryan mills)*

Check the link I posted above. Some more action / info on the issue.


_Modified by GGERG15 at 9:22 PM 11-12-2008_


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

If it sounds like a small room full of rattlesnakes, it's the flex connection on the downpipe. My Wifes Tiguan makes that noise all of the time, mine, not as much. Grab ahold of the downpipe and give it a little strech, you'll hear it. I'm hoping that an aftermarket downpipe will solve this problem.


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## 16VSerenity (Jul 26, 2006)

^Interesting....


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## KampfGTI (Mar 28, 2007)

yea i hear this on my manual wolf


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## ODY (Jun 26, 2008)

any word on solving this problem?


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: (ODY)*

soon as I get a downpipe, I'll let you know.


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## DBGLI (Sep 22, 2008)

sounds to me that its just a noisy metallic catalytic converter that they are using on the tsi. i used to hear the same noise on my mazda 6 with high flow magnaflow cats. i work at a dealership and i hear this sound on all the tsi's. it happens on my GLI too its not so loud though and i have a catback so you really dont notice it with the increased noise.


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## GRB (Aug 24, 2003)

*Re: (DBGLI)*

I've got the same noise on mine. It's annoying. It's like a rattle /fluttery turbo spool sound. That's the best way I can describe it.


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## lookin4trouble (Jun 14, 2008)

Same noise here (CBFA). The noise subsided around 3K miles or so, but it came back after I got my oil changed @ 5K. Pissed me off. I've also heard (like some of the other people on this post) that the "noise" can be eliminated by doing the Tiggy Pipe mod, but I don't know why it would be more pronounced after an oil change ...


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## DBGLI (Sep 22, 2008)

the noise will not be eliminated by doing the tiguan pipe because the tiguans have the noise also....


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## To Sink Or Swim (Dec 3, 2008)

I have an 09 GTI and it makes the same noise. It sounds to me like it comes right between the center dash and the gauge panel. It occurs between gears 2-5 and under heavier acceleration. It gets quite annoying








BTW this is my first post on here, usually on golfmkv.com


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: (To Sink Or Swim)*

Everyone, it's the down pipe. Rub your fingers over the flex connection, you'll hear the sound that everyone is describing.


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

Count me in as a rattler too, 09 TSI w/ DSG... Could this be a build date dependent issue?


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## GRB (Aug 24, 2003)

Whatever it is it sounds awful and it's embarrassing. Especially since it's a brand new car.


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## WhiteLightningMKV (Dec 2, 2008)

I have an 09 and had that same ****ty raspy sound under acceleration especially under load. I had the noise pipe removed completely and installed a tiguan pipe. The noise is now finally gone.


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## TustinMKVTDi (Oct 27, 2008)

*Re: (WhiteLightningMKV)*

Only 250 miles on my 09, I hear the same noise as well, I wonder it if is apparent from the outside as it is in the inside.


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## GRB (Aug 24, 2003)

*Re: (TustinMKVTDi)*

You can hear if from outside. It's making me miss the spool of my 1.8T.


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## Stratus2003 (Sep 27, 2003)

*Re: (UncannySkill)*

I still have my MKIV - you are right - the spool on that thang is SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET!


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## DBGLI (Sep 22, 2008)

the tiguan pipe might make it not as pronounced on the interior but the sound is still their on the outside. i have tiguans here since i work at a vw store and you can still hear it on the inside of the tiguan so i dunno


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (ryan mills)*

So I checked out the flex connection on the DP like the other poster mentioned and the more I look at it the more that the connection making the noise makes sense.
The flex connection has a fine mesh cover that goes over the accordion that actually flexes. When I first ran my fingers on it there wasn't much noise, but the more I thought about the forces on the connection the more it making noise is a possibility.
The flex connection is there to allow the engine to move on it's mounts with cracking the exhaust pipe. In a transverse mounted engine with FWD the engine moves forward and backward in response to acceleration and deceleration. During acceleration the engine rocks towards the rear of the car, this causes the flex connection to compress. This compression creates slack in the mesh cover around the flex connection. This slack coupled with the engine harmonic vibration between 2000-3000 rpm causes the mesh to rattle against the flex pipe and make the noise. 
At this point I don't understand the purpose of the mesh other than a skin to protect the flex pipe from road debris, but it seems unlikely that debris would get kicked up that far into the exhaust tunnel so close to the engine.
I'm wondering if a little exhaust repair tape wrapped around the center of the screen might dampen the vibration or quiet the noise?
Any thoughts on my theory?


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## 16VSerenity (Jul 26, 2006)

^Very interesting......going to have to take a look at this myself.....


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

I was thinking about header wrap, but it would probably trap moisture and rot the flex connection out. I still got my money on a new downpipe for a fix, if only one was availabl for the CBFA GTI.


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## mercavius (May 16, 2002)

*Re: (ryan mills)*

just get a new downpipe


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## Lblizzie (May 8, 2008)

I had the exact same this but when I removed my noise pipe It went away...Or atleast I think it did, maybe its all in my head but I deffinately think that it helped. I didn't go the tiggy route, I just got an expansion plug from the auto part store. Total cost: $3.50. Someone else should try it to confirm.


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## LastVR6 (Mar 4, 2006)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

I have the exact same noise in my 08 FSI manual. Drives me f***ing crazy. Only under hard acceleration I get this vibrating/tingy noise that almost sounds as if it is loose plastic on the center console, but I think it's more than that.
...AND just yesterday I had an even louder more annoying sound coming from the passenger side. Dealership told me it was a loose mounting bracket for the fuel line. Apparently it's something VW has created a bulletin about as the service rep told me this is happening to others. It was louder than an idling diesel motor, just terrible. Seems to be gone since I took it to the dealership, but I'm doubtful it's gone for good.
On another note, the noise some of you MAY be experiencing at idle might just be the nature of the direct injection engine. Almost a constant tapping noise, this is normal. But I'm sure everyone in this forum knows the difference between that and a loose part.


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (ChronicTeutonic)*

So I got myself some of that repair tape but I didn't like how it functioned. It's basically some fiberglass, aluminum tape and wire that is used to hold it in place while the 'glass sets. I'm thinking it will probably melt through the mesh into the flex accordion underneath making the joint less flexible (not good.)
Those of you with the metallic rattle at 2000-3000 rpm what does your flex connection look like? Is it braided like so:








Or is it more like a screen? 








How much damage would it cause to just remove the screen with some side cutters?
I'm starting to think this is a design flaw that should be fixed by the dealer, or they should allow me to remove the screen without voiding my warranty.

_Modified by ChronicTeutonic at 1:18 PM 12/17/2008_


_Modified by ChronicTeutonic at 8:48 PM 12-17-2008_


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

it's like the bottom screen. Here's a pic of mine. 








I wonder about removing that crap as well...


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (ryan mills)*

Thanks Ryan! Hope some others are checking theirs too.
I decided that I'm going to do aluminum muffler tape, it's just a sticky foil nothing with fiberglass.
If you want to see how much your TSI engine moves under load check out 0:48 in this vid, try to imagine what is happening at the flex connection: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOWc0gB6CJU


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

I really don't feel that the flex pipe is the issue.


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## danielraymond (Oct 18, 2008)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

I'have got the exact same sound on my 2009 Tiguan


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## GRB (Aug 24, 2003)

Anybody with an aftermarket downpipe care to chime in on this? Seriously this noise bugs me and I know the dealership won't do anything to fix it.


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (UncannySkill)*

I don't think a DP is available for the CBFA yet. It has a different turbo output flange than the CCTA?


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (GGERG15)*

"I really don't feel that the flex pipe is the issue."
Care to enlighten us?


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## DBGLI (Sep 22, 2008)

pretty sure the downpipe for the cbfa and ccta are exactly the same. according to awe.


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

I feel as though the noise is coming from the engine bay right in front of the passenger side airbag.
This flex pipe is underneath the vehicle, I think we would hear it near the floor where as I hear it up top.


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## goliath337 (May 1, 2002)

downpipes are slightly different and the noise will go away if they made a dogbone insert for us, but no luck yet (if its the one single pop you are talking about when the engine shifts in its mounts)


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## 09wolf (Dec 22, 2008)

Heya, I've got a 2009 VW Jetta Wolfsburg Manual, just hit over 750 miles -- started to hear something that sounds like chattering, only occurs during 2500-3000RPM, only while vehicle is in gear.


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## Kthor703 (Jan 5, 2009)

Yes i am having the same problem on mine...thought it was uncommon since it was new but now i have a sense of relief.. Do you think i should take mine in to see if i can get an answer or should i stick with what one of you said about the dealer saying it was normal?


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## Boostismydrug (Dec 17, 2008)

*Re: (Kthor703)*

ive just gotten used to it lol.. it doesnt seem to affect the performance of the vehicle so i just try to ignore it.. yes it does have the annoying obnoxious feeling when it happens but eh.. whatever id rather just enjoy the car =D


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## GLIzzie (Sep 6, 2007)

guys the noise isn't the flexpipe on the stock downpipe because i just got an atp 3" installed and i'm hearing the same noise as before.. i'm leaning more and more towards scrapage against that metal wall


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (GLIzzie)*

Yeah my tape didn't do anything either. I also tried to tighten up the tunnel heat shielding but that didn't fix it. Spent a good 10 minutes thumping on various parts of the shield to see if I could hear the noise, but no luck isolating it.


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## GRB (Aug 24, 2003)

I'm thinking it's related to the wastegate.


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## Pannikattk (Nov 9, 2001)

*Re: (GGERG15)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GGERG15* »_I feel as though the noise is coming from the engine bay right in front of the passenger side airbag.
This flex pipe is underneath the vehicle, I think we would hear it near the floor where as I hear it up top.

You might be hearing it up top because the noise pipe is amplifying the sound and pumping it right into the cabin. The theory seems to make sense to me.
I myself haven't experienced the issue but I've only got like 2k miles on my TSI. I've been slammed on coils for a good 1k miles, so the DP is definitely flexing more than it would in stock form.
I guess I won't have to worry too much once I get my custom 3" DP installed next month


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## danielraymond (Oct 18, 2008)

*Re: (UncannySkill)*


_Quote, originally posted by *UncannySkill* »_I'm thinking it's related to the wastegate.

Do you mean Diverter Valve. I have seen that VW has a new part number for it.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4205180



_Modified by danielraymond at 5:13 PM 1-16-2009_


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## wahoojohn (Nov 15, 2008)

I've got about 1800 miles on my '09 Wolf DSG. I hear the noise, have no idea what it is - but since it seems to be so common, I'm not as worried about it. Hopefully there will be a fix sometime soon - I don't like that sound.


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## wahoojohn (Nov 15, 2008)

To me, it sounds like pop rocks in a soda can.


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: (wahoojohn)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wahoojohn* »_To me, it sounds like pop rocks in a soda can.

and that's the best description that I've heard so far. Mine sounds just like that. Again, not as bad in my GTI as the Tiguan. I've actually gotten used to it. It'll bother me much more when the window-down weather hits again.


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## [email protected] (Oct 5, 2005)

*Re: (ChronicTeutonic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ChronicTeutonic* »_
If you want to see how much your TSI engine moves under load check out 0:48 in this vid, try to imagine what is happening at the flex connection: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOWc0gB6CJU

Has anyone thought about putting their car on a dyno and trying to locate the issue while the car is stationary? Safety is optimal obviously, but a good tech should be able to narrow it down for you even over the sound of the dyno...just a thought.


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Has anyone thought about putting their car on a dyno and trying to locate the issue while the car is stationary? Safety is optimal obviously, but a good tech should be able to narrow it down for you even over the sound of the dyno...just a thought.


Even better. I had my wife drive down the road while I held on underneath, lying on a creeper. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Actually, I did go under the car and had the brake and gas both applied to make the engine rock back and there it was.... right there at the downpipe


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

so you are sure it is the downpipe? Its the flex on the DP? Where is this flex pipe in respect to the turbo. Is it on the turbo side or exhaust side?


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (GGERG15)*

The flex is after the turbo. 
So if we've confirmed that this is the problem how do we get VW to fix it? It's not like the car doesn't run properly?


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

*Re: (ryan mills)*

Where exactly were you listening if I wanted to try this? I had the service guys at my dealer put it on a lift and put it under a load and they said they couldn't hear it... but they did acknowledge it when driving.


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## To Sink Or Swim (Dec 3, 2008)

This happens to me too, its supposadly a problem and nobody knows what it is... I've taken it to the dealer and they said it was my exhaust.. But they are idiots and I know it isn't i took it to the dealer again today and I will let you know after Im done


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## Andrew 16v (Jul 29, 2003)

*Re: (To Sink Or Swim)*

Man, haven't noticed this yet, but now I'm gonna be listening for it!


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: (GGERG15)*

It has to be a pretty big load. but I'm pretty sure VW will do nothing about it. The sound is annoying, but does not hurt anything. I betcha the new golf will have a different downpipe design though. Mark my words people, it'll be different. Any hoot, I'm still waiting on an aftermarket cbfa downpipe to go with my software...


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## ODY (Jun 26, 2008)

i still hear it on my Audi A3 2008.5 TSFI...and i am pretty sure it is the downpipe/flex pipe....can we not replace that?


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: (ODY)*

it can be replaced, but I'm waiting on apr to make one for the cbfa engine.


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

bump for any news?


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## EngTech1 (Nov 30, 2008)

*Re: (UncannySkill) - Everyone Needs to Here - What Your Talking about.*

No Sound Clip , - Equals No Sound !


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## Thehappygti (Feb 6, 2009)

I've got the same problem. WTF? I bought this car with 8 miles on it and noticed it right away. Hopefully when I put the next exhaust in it'll go away. If not????


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## dubskeet (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (Thehappygti)*

alright guys im here to clear all your problems lol it is the downpipe i have bpy engine which is the tfsi and the downpipe is the same your tsi with flex section so it can move my noise wasnt that bad but i did just put on my eurojet dp and it cured all my noise its really quite now in terms of movement hope this helps clear things up


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## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*Same here*

I think I have the same problem. I noticed it the first time I drove the car, with about 9 miles on it. '09 JSW 2.0T/ 6 speed. It currently has about 200 miles on it.
It sounds mainly like water splashing up under the car, or a plastic bag being wrinkled. I can get it to occur in most gears, but most easily in 3-5. It is definitely an engine load based noise, as I can get the car to make the noise in different gears and at different RPMs. If I hear the noise and keep the throttle in that same position (so I am usually speeding up), I can make the noise for as long as I want. It doesn't seem to change at all with outside temp or engine temp.
I'll have to start playing with the down pipe, but it's strange that people are reporting different results with the different down pipes and noise pipes.


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## trillsx88 (Nov 27, 2007)

*Re: Same here (NicholasJay)*

I never heard this sound before and I have 5k on my 09 gti cbfa. Mayb im not listening to it very well.


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## VdubVSHonda (May 4, 2008)

*Re: Same here (trillsx88)*

glad to see I'm not the only one with this annoying sound... I was gonna take it to the dealer to see if they can fix it tomorrow but seeing that no dealer has been able to do anything about it I'm not gonna waste my time


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## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*Re: (GGERG15)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GGERG15* »_bump for any news?

I am assuming you are the same "GGERG15" that is on the golfmkv forum. In that forum you said you were taking the car to the dealer, yet you never let us know what the dealer said. That was quite a while ago now, so I assume the problem was never resolved, but I'd like to hear what happened.
Thanks


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## Tonyz (Mar 28, 2009)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

Same with 09 A3 2.0T


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## koukis14 (Mar 31, 2009)

My 09 wolfsburg manual does it as well


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

OK... So here is my update.
Last saturday I took the car for a quick drive to meet a fellow GTI driver for lunch. When I shut down the car he noticed an odd rattle sound. We figured it must have been something else and went to eat. Coming back out and turning the car back on we both listened and sure enough there was a nasty rattle.
We isolated it to being about 1500-1700RPM and thought it was coming from the rear of the engine. I was only about 2 miles from the dealer at the time and figured it was time for a trip. They ended up having the car till yesterday which made it about 6 days. Apparently the diaphragm on the waste gate of my turbo had come loose and was rattling. Furthermore, upon removing the turbo it seems as if the waste gate actuator was completely seized. Needless to say I got a completely new turbo and assembly as that turbo is mostly one cast piece.
Here is the interesting part... I no longer hear the rattle that started this thread. I have only driven it with the new turbo for about 60 miles so it is too early to tell if this fixed anything. I looked at the list of part numbers and found that it was the same equipment put back in except for the HPFP which was also replaced due to a recent TSB.
Hope this helps.


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (GGERG15)*

Oh sweet, so there is a TSB now for our HPFP?


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## VW2009SportWagen (Apr 22, 2009)

*Metallic rattling noise*

I hear the same noise in my 2009 Jetta SportWagen 2.0t. It's a metallic rattling sound that is only heard under load (turbo on) between 2000-3000 RPM. It's happened the entire 4 months that I have owned my car. I've taken it to two separate dealers to get different opinions. They both acknowledge that they hear the noise and they say they will take it into the shop to take a look at it. Then they return later and say that the noise is normal. They say it is just the sound of the air going through the exhaust when the turbo is spooling up. The one dealer even blocked off the turbo resonator pipe to see if that had any effect, but it didn't. They admit that it doesn't happen on all the cars, but they say it is still normal. Please let me know if anyone finds a solution. This noise makes me not want to accelerate in the 2000-3000 RPM range, which is frustrating because I bought the car for it's low end power.


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

up here in canada i have a 2009 tsi same problem its driving me nuts!


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## 09vdubgti (Mar 28, 2009)

its the noise pipe according to my service guy. sounds like a steel sponge being spinned around doesnt it like someone said before rattle snake like he said its from the noise pipe.


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

but i really dont think it is... its an audable ratte ive even herd it coming from outside the car with the window down while driving beside a median


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## Carter N (Apr 26, 2009)

I have this noise too in my '09 GTI DSG. 
I can't really hear it while the windows are up, but when they are down under moderate acceleration it is very noticeable. the sound is best described as metal vibration, which is why the mesh housing on the flex pipe makes the most sense. 
going to a dealer soon to see what they say.


----------



## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

keep us updated, i linked my dealership to this thred


----------



## galvo (Jun 14, 2006)

Someone just pointed me to this thread after asking about this noise that people are noticing. It sounds almost exactly like a heat shield. I have no idea what it is, I just know that it happens on everyone's car. 
I didn't read the whole thread, only the first page or so. Looking for insight.


----------



## Carter N (Apr 26, 2009)

Well i went to the dealership and it was raining outside in the city so they couldn't hear anything... but i have done a bit of driving to really get familiar with the sound. this is what i have noticed so far...
I believe it is in fact the flex connection on the down pipe. When i described it to a dealer he said that this was a problem with 06-08 models that was addressed with the new engine, however the downpipe didn't change so i think he is full of it. 
the sound occurs between 2000-3500 depending on how fast you are accelerating... The noise is best described as a raspy metal vibration (best heard with the windows down)... the noise pauses when the transmissions shifts. 
I think there was some confusion in this thread... it started out as a clicking sound from behind the dash which is a completely separate issue...


----------



## 09vdubgti (Mar 28, 2009)

its the noise pipe. the noise pipe is also connected to a speaker like thing thats behind the glove box so you could hear more engine noise inside the cabin. Did you realize that well at least to my knowledge that 09 gti's come standard with a noise pipe my friend has an 08 and doesnt have it and it doesnt make the noises you guys are describing.


----------



## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

all the GTIs in the USA have the noise pipe. if he doesnt, then someone took it out.


----------



## 09vdubgti (Mar 28, 2009)

*Re: (placenta)*

i guess so then.


----------



## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*Re: (09vdubgti)*

Other people with the Tiguan have complained they have the noise too. But the Tiguan doesn't have the noise pipe.


----------



## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (NicholasJay)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NicholasJay* »_Other people with the Tiguan have complained they have the noise too. But the Tiguan doesn't have the noise pipe.

because its the flex area on the downpipe which 80% of everyone has already confirmed...








do you guys even read the entire thread?


----------



## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (placenta)*

Thank you Placenta!
RTFT!
Anyway, has anyone got VW or a dealer to do anything other that recognize the noise is there?


----------



## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (ChronicTeutonic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ChronicTeutonic* »_Thank you Placenta!
RTFT!
Anyway, has anyone got VW or a dealer to do anything other that recognize the noise is there?

hah np. my TSI does NOT have any of these noises by the way..


----------



## SilverRubicon (Jan 9, 2009)

*Re: Metallic rattling noise (VW2009SportWagen)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VW2009SportWagen* »_I hear the same noise in my 2009 Jetta SportWagen 2.0t. It's a metallic rattling sound that is only heard under load (turbo on) between 2000-3000 RPM. It's happened the entire 4 months that I have owned my car. I've taken it to two separate dealers to get different opinions. They both acknowledge that they hear the noise and they say they will take it into the shop to take a look at it. Then they return later and say that the noise is normal. They say it is just the sound of the air going through the exhaust when the turbo is spooling up. The one dealer even blocked off the turbo resonator pipe to see if that had any effect, but it didn't. They admit that it doesn't happen on all the cars, but they say it is still normal. Please let me know if anyone finds a solution. This noise makes me not want to accelerate in the 2000-3000 RPM range, which is frustrating because I bought the car for it's low end power.

I just wanted to chime in here for fellow JSW SEL owners... I also have the noise. Didn't really know what to use as a search term for this noise, but I seemed to have stumbled across the right thread! As this noise seems fairly well documented, I'm not going to worry about it (for now). It could be a heat shield, exhaust, just about anything metallic. My car only has 500 miles on it. Maybe it will improve as carbon builds up in the exhaust, or maybe not. As long as it blows up before the warranty expires...
Anyhow, I just wanted to confirm that another JSW owner has the noise.


_Modified by SilverRubicon at 8:10 PM 5-12-2009_


----------



## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*Re: (placenta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *placenta* »_
because its the flex area on the downpipe which 80% of everyone has already confirmed...








do you guys even read the entire thread?

I hope you weren't directing your comment at me. I was just pointing out the same fact you were. It's hard to tell over the internet where comments are directed.


----------



## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*Re: (ChronicTeutonic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ChronicTeutonic* »_
Anyway, has anyone got VW or a dealer to do anything other that recognize the noise is there?

My car has had this issue since the day I bought it, with 9 miles on it. Before I bought it, I heard the sound. I had my salesman, a mechanic, and even the sales manager ride with me to hear the noise. They all heard it, yet couldn't figure out what it was. I had them take it to the shop and put it in the air to see if they could see anything wrong. I was told that a few mechanics looked at it and couldn't find anything obvious. It was noted on my purchase order, that the noise was present when the car was delivered. The noise is still there, with 2300 miles on the car, and I haven't had it back to the dealer since I bought it.


----------



## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (NicholasJay)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NicholasJay* »_
I hope you weren't directing your comment at me. I was just pointing out the same fact you were. It's hard to tell over the internet where comments are directed. 

i was, but my mistake. after re-reading your thread carefully i understood your point. you were saying if the tiguan is reporting it, then it can't be the noisepipe making the noise. nice. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

Quick Update:
8200 Miles on my car, still there if not worse.


----------



## SilverRubicon (Jan 9, 2009)

*Re: (placenta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *placenta* »_because its the flex area on the downpipe which 80% of everyone has already confirmed...









So to summarize... (a) the prevailing opinion is it's the down pipe creating the noise and (b) replacing the down pipe (or installing a turbo-back exhaust) may solve the problem. Point (b) may be a stretch, but I believe that has been suggested.


----------



## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*Re: (SilverRubicon)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SilverRubicon* »_
So to summarize... (a) the prevailing opinion is it's the down pipe creating the noise and (b) replacing the down pipe (or installing a turbo-back exhaust) may solve the problem. Point (b) may be a stretch, but I believe that has been suggested.

It does sound like it is coming from the mesh on the flex pipe. When I had my car on the lift (installing my RSB),I was playing around with the flex pipe. If I twist the mesh around the outside of the flex pipe, there is a sound very similar to what I hear from inside the car.
If anyone is brave enough to cut off the mesh and see if that solves the problem, that would be great.


----------



## eric brower (Oct 7, 2008)

*Re: (NicholasJay)*

i put a downpipe on my car and i dont hear the noise anymore... about 99% sure its the chicken wire they put around the stock flexpipe causing the noise.


----------



## SilverRubicon (Jan 9, 2009)

*Re: (eric brower)*


_Quote, originally posted by *eric brower* »_i put a downpipe on my car and i dont hear the noise anymore... about 99% sure its the chicken wire they put around the stock flexpipe causing the noise.

Thank you. You've just given me all the justification I need to buy an aftermarket exhaust.


----------



## xnoplanbx (Feb 9, 2008)

I've had the new gti for a couple of weeks, definitely sounds like the exhaust rattling to me.


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## myeyez (Oct 31, 2008)

I installed the carbino intake and the rattling noise went away. In that rpm range where I used to hear the raspy rattling I now just hear the turbo spooling up. Its a smooth high speed fan like noise. Does anyone else have an intake on their car?


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (xnoplanbx)*

Finally! I found the source of my noise.
Bend this heat shield away from the tunnel and the cables underneath. It is only secured at two points on the top.


----------



## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (ChronicTeutonic)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ChronicTeutonic* »_Finally! I found the source of my noise.
Bend this heat shield away from the tunnel and the cables underneath. It is only secured at two points on the top.









nice find. i dont have the noise but good to know. so you bend it UP, right?


----------



## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (placenta)*

Yes up along the bottom edge and away from the firewall/tunnel.


----------



## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

I'm going to try this today. I'll let you know if we have another success story.


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

good to hear that someone finally figured it out!


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## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*Re: (GGERG15)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GGERG15* »_I'm going to try this today. I'll let you know if we have another success story.










Any news?


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

i tried it, didnt solve it


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## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (MaxVW)*

Sorry to hear that. Mine is still quiet... did you bend it up and away from the sub-frame? There is some kind of electronics unit under there that it might be vibrating against.


----------



## Projektwo.0 (Aug 6, 2004)

*Re: (ChronicTeutonic)*

i just put my exhaust on and looked and bent that heatshield up.. i didnt notice any rubbing marks there either.. made no difference


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## GGERG15 (Nov 4, 2008)

I'm pretty sure this fixed my issue.
Either that or I'm so used to it that my head blocks it out


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

*Re: (acunje)*

ACUNJE has hit it right on the "head"! This is the source of the mysterious noise... I have it too.. mostly at the shift points (DSG) under medium load and it is completely normal...


----------



## ChronicTeutonic (Dec 8, 2008)

*Re: (GGERG15)*

Still noise free....wonder if folks take this shield out and put some dynamat on it, heck maybe even check the two bolts for tightness...


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

*Re: (ChronicTeutonic)*

Maybe there are two different "noises" going on and we are all mixing the two?








Okay I'll look at the shield, and tighten it up if needed, but others are not reporting the same success as you have after bending it up some...
My noise sound like a chain buzz at around 2400rpm shift points


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

*Re: (VWRedux)*

I swear... it sounds just like a lose chain noise ( a fast "zzzzzttt" sound at shift point ) just like my chainsaw when the chain tensioner doesn't do its job. With so many chains on this new TSI engine with three oil pressure tensioners, it's possible that at the shift points these tensioners back off a bit buzzing the chain until the next gear is engaged... 
This sound can also be found while driving chain driven OHC bikes like my buddies BMW.
Either way we should keep looking since so many of us are having the same issue.
What happened to the member who had the waste gate and turbo replaced and the sound went away? I think he had a true "rattle" issue and not a fast "zzzzttt" sound.


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

i think the sound most of us are talking about is basically wha sounds like a heat shield rattling under heavy load and low rpm ie "lugging" up a hill in a high gear


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## idk alex (May 30, 2009)

Okay I havent posted in here for awhile.
I had the noise when I first got the car. I took it to the dealer and they thought i was crazy.
So at 4400 miles I installed an ATP downpipe. And APR st2+.
The tuning shop noticed this sound and we checked all of the heatshields, we gave up.
Next time I jack my car up I will check that heatshield though.


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## nemesis fox (Feb 11, 2007)

*Re: (idk alex)*

I definitely hear the same buzz/rattle sound on my new 09 GTI. it's not even broken in yet and it's already making this noise. It sounds like a muffled exhaust rattle, almost a buzzing, between 2000-3000 rpm under load. It's next to impossible to hear without the windows down, but it's easy to identify if they are. It's driving me nuts. I'll be inspecting the heatshield/downpipe as soon as I get a chance. This may just push up my downpipe plans...


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

*Re: (nemesis fox)*

Have the new TSI?http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Then it's got to be the OHC CHAIN making the noise! We all have it.... therefore it's common to us all, something we never heard before because none of us ever had this engine before, right?








So forget the heat shields, down pipes, mounting brackets, etc., etc. When these items would buzz, they were never this hard to find before... right? They were easy fixes.
Over the weekend I had it on my lift 5 times looking for it with no luck. I tried everything recommended in this thread, we all tried all kinds of stuff to no avail. (Some claim success but it cannot be reproduced when others try it.) It's got to be the numerous chains and hydraulic tensioners in this new engine.
Unless we learn otherwise from VW techline or directly from the guy who designed the TSI engine (Dr. Rudolf Krebs) I would recommend we all have a







and enjoy our great VW cars.


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## idk alex (May 30, 2009)

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.


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## scenturion (Apr 11, 2009)

09 TSI with this buzz too


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## VdubVSHonda (May 4, 2008)

*Re: (nemesis fox)*

this noise is driving me insane! VW needs to put out A TSB for this STAT!!


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (idk alex)*


_Quote, originally posted by *idk alex* »_I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.

I always drink beer, and when I do, I prefer cold and wet http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Simmsled (May 3, 2007)

I drove three 09 GTIs (two 6mt and one DSG) before buying mine. ALL THREE had this sound. It made the sound on my test drive and my salesman (im fairly certain was hard of hearing) could not hear it. My fiance heard it. Since the cars ALL had less than 100 miles, I did not know what to make of it. I'm at 3,400 miles now. Nothing has changed. 
This HAS to be a design oversight. It is only a matter of time before the TSB is out on it. 
How could ANYONE miss this? QC anyone?


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

Could this be the cause (on DSG cars)?








http://forums.audiworld.com/sh...97270


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

i doubt it cus the standard cars mak the same noise as the dsg ones


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## scenturion (Apr 11, 2009)

*Re: (Simmsled)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Simmsled* »_I drove three 09 GTIs (two 6mt and one DSG) before buying mine. ALL THREE had this sound. It made the sound on my test drive and my salesman (im fairly certain was hard of hearing) could not hear it. My fiance heard it. Since the cars ALL had less than 100 miles, I did not know what to make of it. I'm at 3,400 miles now. Nothing has changed. 
This HAS to be a design oversight. It is only a matter of time before the TSB is out on it. 
How could ANYONE miss this? QC anyone?

Yup, took mine to the dealership to get it looked at under warranty. Service tech couldnt hear it, but we drove a new (29 miles) GTI and it had the same noise.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (scenturion)*

Read all 5 pages and believe now what I believed after reading the first few post. There really is no problem. Just like the MKIV R32 had a raspy exhaust, it seems like cars with TSI engines also have some sort of rasp. Just like many here, back in 04 people were going back to the dealership complaining about the rasp just to have the exhaust replaced under warranty and still have the same rasp or they were told that it was normal and were sent on their way. You learn to live with the raps. I heard the noise shortly after my purchase and to be honest, the raps is nothing compared to the R32. It actually reminded me of my R and brought a smile to my face. I haven't payed attention to it that much this time around but with the R the raps would be toned down significantly after the exhaust had some time to heat up. 
As many people have said, it happened when the car was new and continues to happen now. It's normal and that's the end of the story. If you think that it's the down pipe and want to replace it then go right ahead but I doubt that VW will do anything about it. You're practically asking VW to change the exhaust design because you don't like the exhaust note.


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (aladro)*

My 09 GTI makes this annoying exhaust rattle too. I wish I noticed it on the test drive. It's really bothering me. 




_Modified by velocidub at 3:46 PM 7-25-2009_


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

*Re: (velocidub)*

Relax, it's the electronic waste gate on the turbo and it is perfectly normal, (my tech. demonstrated it for me). In fact when you stop hearing that sound is when you really have trouble.
LISTEN... you should be thanking your lucky stars that that is the only issue you're having... (small nothings) compared to all the 08-09 DSG cars with faulty trannies and Mechatronic Modules being reported... check out the DSG thread under technical and then I would knock on wood.

















_Modified by VWRedux at 10:12 AM 7-29-2009_


----------



## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (VWRedux)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWRedux* »_Relax, it's the electronic waste gate on the turbo and it is perfectly normal, (my tech. demonstrated it for me). In fact when you stop hearing that sound is when you really have trouble.
_Modified by VWRedux at 10:12 AM 7-29-2009_

Can you provide steps to demonstrate? No doubting you but I'll like to get my head in there and see what is going on.


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## babydubz (Dec 13, 2007)

huh and I thought it was only MY car. I was going to go bring it into the dealer to get it checked out, but I guess it won't do anything. 
Like some people said, it sounds like a loose washer/bolt metallic-y vibrating. 
Cross your fingers for a TSB!


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## mguccion (Aug 6, 2009)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (myeyez)*

The weird noise seems to be coming from the passenger side of my 09 GTI, from the middle or the back of the car. It is a low pitched buzzing or rattling sound. If you hit the ceiling with your hand, you can hear the noise. 
Ive taken it to the dealership twice. The second time, they told me they took off the lining on the ceiling put insulation or plastic clips along the wires on the inside of the roof to keep them from rattling. We test drove it, and of course the noise was gone.
Then, later that day it came back. The car makes the noise btwn 20-40 mph, over some but not all bumpy surfaces.
Does any of this sound familiar, or am I on a thread for a different annoying noise?


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## Smigelski (Dec 9, 2008)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *mguccion* »_The weird noise seems to be coming from the passenger side of my 09 GTI, from the middle or the back of the car. It is a low pitched buzzing or rattling sound. If you hit the ceiling with your hand, you can hear the noise. 
Ive taken it to the dealership twice. The second time, they told me they took off the lining on the ceiling put insulation or plastic clips along the wires on the inside of the roof to keep them from rattling. We test drove it, and of course the noise was gone.
Then, later that day it came back. The car makes the noise btwn 20-40 mph, over some but not all bumpy surfaces.
Does any of this sound familiar, or am I on a thread for a different annoying noise?



Sorry, that's a totally different noise than the one we are talking about here.


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## SilverRubicon (Jan 9, 2009)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_2009 GLI here
The dealer told me that this was part of the "design" and "sound enhancing" to make it more sporty - I almost crapped my pants laughing when they told me this...

I believe he is referring to the pipe that redirects engine noise into the passenger compartment to make it sound "sporty". The problem is, he heard what he wanted to hear, not what you said. There's a difference between "sporty" and the buzzing that we're hearing.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_2009 GLI here
5,300 Miles
The buzzing is exactly from 2400 to 2600 for me - in 3rd gear and up. 
This is such a joke to say "that's how they are"
VW needs to repairs issues and this IS an issue.
The dealer told me that this was part of the "design" and "sound enhancing" to make it more sporty - I almost crapped my pants laughing when they told me this...
This IS a problem - FIX IT VW

There is a something called a noise pipe. If you're unhappy about search for the noise pipe delete mod.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_
Mod? I did not ask the manufacturer to do a Mod - if it doesn't work they should have not put it on and need to take care of it.

Plain stupidy. There is no mod here, YOU BOUGHT THE CAR THE WAY IT IS. The noise pipe has absolutely nothing to do with the noise complaint on this thread. If you had read what was posted you would have seen that it's the wastegate making this noise. If you would have read some more then you would have seen that some people got rid of it by changing their downpipe. Just because you heard a noise coming from your car suddenly is makes you an expert and demand VW to take things off their car. When you stop hearing your wastegate, then you'll have a real problem.


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_
WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM MORAN?


funniest thing i ever read. check your spelling bro.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (placenta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *placenta* »_
funniest thing i ever read. check your spelling bro.

People like YOU are the ones who ruin the idea of a forum.
Go make yourself useful boy genius and get a JOB


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (zerostudio)*

Well I had a reply but I got and "invalid" post because by the mod or the creator. I will not continue because I got it all, even though I didn't get to post it and because this thread should not get locked over something stupid. 
The problem here is the wastegate, it vibrates just like many other things.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

Add me to the list.
2009 A3 2.0T FSI, DSG, FWD. Same noise. 
I have 450 miles on mine. I just recently noticed it because I've been babying the engine during break-in. But it does do it, and it's easy to replicate by putting the DSG in 3rd at 25-30 mph and then tapping the throttle up to about 40mph.
The dealer wants to take a look at it next week. Not too optimistic that they'll be able to solve it. However, if it's "normal", then it's not a big deal to me.


_Modified by BigStig at 10:09 AM 8-26-2009_


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## Var (Aug 13, 2009)

I've got just under 1k miles on my '09 Gti. I have the same noise going on. My first 2 instincts were
1-wastegate
2-mild pinging 
I was pretty sure it was the wastegate before I found this thread and now I'm more convinced of it. I just didn't realize out turbos were so eager to spool that there needs to be wastegate operation at such low load levels.


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## scenturion (Apr 11, 2009)

*Re: (Var)*

My car makes the rattle, another 09 made the rattle. My suggestion: chip your car, then the whine of the turbo will be louder than the rattle


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

Just took my brand new 4 week old GTI in for this same exact noise. Tech said it's completly normal. I luv everyhing about my car except for this stupid broken sounding noise. 
Maybe after I install more mods I won't be able to hear it anymore?


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (kirkbar)*

So it seems that it's either the heat-resistant flex tubing on the DP, or it's from the wastegate. A few folks claim that an aftermarket DP fixes it, but then others have an aftermarket DP and still have the noise. 
Is there such a thing as an aftermarket wastegate? Anyone know of anyone with one that can confirm/deny that it is the culprit?
Regarding the chain, if it is a chain, then why is the sound only reproducable when the car is in gear and moving? I'd think that if it were a noisy tensioner, it'd do it when the car wasn't moving.








There has to be an answer as to what part exactly is making this noise. Maybe not a fix, but at least a solid explanation. Maybe if enough of us complain and take it in to be inspected, it'll get enough attention that some sort of TSB could be issued. Maybe.







here's to dreaming.










_Modified by BigStig at 10:07 AM 8-28-2009_


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (BigStig)*

FYI. I had my dealer look at my brand new A3 to diagnose this noise.
The service manager heard it and agreed that it was not really a 'normal' kind of engine noise. He promised that they'd investigate and let me know what it is.
4 hours later...
He says it is the wastegate, just as a few members here have suggested. And apparently it is normal for the 2.0 TFSI engine. Two other A3's and a GTI on the lot make the same noise, and he says he confirmed with Audi that it is 'normal'. Something about how the wastegate functions under partial load. 
While it would have been nice if there was a simple fix, I'm ok with it so long as it's supposed to be there.
Is there such a thing as an aftermarket wastegate?

















_Modified by BigStig at 2:09 PM 9-2-2009_


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_FYI. I had my dealer look at my brand new A3 to diagnose this noise.
The service manager heard it and agreed that it was not really a 'normal' kind of engine noise. He promised that they'd investigate and let me know what it is.
4 hours later...
He says it is the wastegate, just as a few members here have suggested. And apparently it is normal for the 2.0 TFSI engine. Two other A3's and a GTI on the lot make the same noise, and he says he confirmed with Audi that it is 'normal'. Something about how the wastegate functions under partial load. 
While it would have been nice if there was a simple fix, I'm ok with it so long as it's supposed to be there.
Is there such a thing as an aftermarket wastegate?
















_Modified by BigStig at 2:09 PM 9-2-2009_

i believe it.. it may not be "ideal" but its normal for THESE cars..


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (placenta)*

They should put in their brochure - still unacceptable to me. Mine is REALLY loud when cold - very very annoying rattle on a brand new car.
I would have bought a Ford is I wanted built-in noise - as part of "their design"
I have been through the dealer and they say the same thing - "its operating as designed" - I was also told the same thing about my flywheel and drivers side door noise - which was all replaced after a 3rd and 4th visit to the dealer.


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## JCMaler (Jan 8, 2003)

*Re: (zerostudio)*

arrrrgggghh...
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4557411
I wouldn't have bought this car with this rattle. around 550 miles on the clock and it's getting progressively worse from what I can tell... My wife and I heard it faintly very early on. it doesn't sound like it's coming from the engine. It does sound like an exhaust rattle. Anyway, I guess i'll start reading all five pages of stressed mk5 owners.... depressing.














update: -read all 5 pages and will call the dealer for the inevitable "non-answer".
I don't believe it's the chains in the engine... I can see it being the downpipe, the exhaust mesh or heat shield, or wastegate...
"normal" or not, I wouldn't have bought the car with this sound. windows down or up it's still obnovious and a loud rattle. not a pleasant or sporty (raspy) rattle, if there ever was such a thing.










_Modified by JCMaler at 1:39 PM 9-10-2009_


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## ThatGuyRyan (Oct 21, 2006)

*Re: (JCMaler)*

Every time this thread gets bumped I try and replicate it in my own car and never can, or at least don't hear anything annoying enough to be noticeable. Either I was lucky, I'm not picky, or I have a busted wastegate


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (ThatGuyRyan)*

That's why I question whether or not it's really "normal". If it was truly normal to the engine design, then everyone ought to be hearing it. Everyone with a 2009+ 2.0 TFSI. Right?
In my case, it's very easy to replicate....
1. Roll down the windows (important - I can't hear it with the windows up)
2. On a quiet (no other traffic), 35-40mph road, slow to about 20mph. Ideally, next to something that will reflect the sound - like a store front or a concrete median.
3. Manually downshift to 3rd. That bumps the RPM's to about 2100 (on my DSG A3).
4. Accelerate briskly to 35-40mph, using about half throttle.
5. I hear a metallic raspy rattle that starts by 2,200 RPM and ends by 3,000. It's not subtle.
It'll do it at any part-throttle acceleration in any gear. Hard to hear in 1st because the RPM sweep is so fast. Hard to hear past 5th because of road noise. Easy in 2,3, & 4.
I can _tolerate_ it, but I'm not really happy about it. It sounds pretty crappy, IMHO. Nothing about the noise feels 'sporty' or 'cool' to me. It's not a 'neat' sort of turbo noise. Nor is it a 'tuned' kind of exhaust noise. It just sounds like an old, crummy, run-down car trying to accelerate.








My A3 is my first VAG product, so I don't know what 'normal' really is. But I do know that none of my other turbocharged cars ever made a noise like that. Not my Subaru Impreza WRX. Neither Saab 9-3 Aero 2.0T or 2.8T. Not my Pontiac Solstice GXP, with its 2L Turbo-DI engine. 
I really hope that VAG figures out what it is and eventually issues some sort of TSB about it. Even though my dealer says it's "normal", I intend to bother them about it at every opportunity.


_Modified by BigStig at 8:56 AM 9-10-2009_


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

I get the same exact noise on my brand new 09 GTI (TSI) w/DSG.
Just got my first online survey from VAG and at the end commented on this stupid noise and let them know that 1) I'm not happy about it. and 2) The dealership said it was normal when I took it in after 1200 miles.
I also marked the check where is asked if I want them to contact me and I hope to hear from them soon.
The ironic thing is I never heard it while test driving the 3 GTI's i looked at. I think it was because it was 95 degrees out the the air/windows rolled up.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (kirkbar)*

My noise is exactly between 2400 and 2800rpm on my 6 speed manual. I can hear it with the windows down or up - doesn;t matter - cold start its REALLY noisy - sounds like a heat-shield that is about to come off...
I plan on bringing my car back often and not give up on this. I didn't dish out 26,000 of my hard earned money for something that rattles as standard equipment - what a joke - German boast over engineering - NOT under-engineering.
Also 0- this is my 4th Turbo (VW) in 10 years - none of the other made any noise whatsoever


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## JJM25 (Jan 12, 2006)

I never noticed it when my scirocco was stock. Only when I fitted a decat downpipe did I hear it. But that was only after I purposely tried to listen for noises to see how the car sounded hehe
Another scirocco owner here has had it when stock, and after his downpipe install. 
If you have to go through all of that to replicate it, is it REALLY an irritating sound?


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (JJM25)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JJM25* »_If you have to go through all of that to replicate it, is it REALLY an irritating sound?

There's nothing complicated about replicating the noise. I only laid out the steps like that so one might know *exactly* how to reproduce the noise.
If I have my windows rolled down, to *prevent* the noise I have to either drive like a little old lady and keep the RPM's below 2k, or I have to drive aggressively and keep the RPM's above 3k. 
The problem for me is that the car makes the noise right in the very sweet spot for normal, everyday, leaving-a-stop-sign acceleration. 


_Modified by BigStig at 10:11 AM 9-10-2009_


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

You don't have to go through much of anything to hear it. I hear it every time I step on the gas under moderate to heavy acceleration.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (kirkbar)*

VAG experts.....
I don't know a lot about the technical aspects of what's going on, but what about something like this : 
http://www.forgemotorsport.com...FSITV
Is this an aftermarket product that would replace the VAG part that's making this noise? I *totally agree* that it shouldn't make the noise to begin with. But if VW/Audi says it's normal, could this be a solution?
Just curious...



_Modified by BigStig at 10:19 AM 9-10-2009_


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## ThatGuyRyan (Oct 21, 2006)

*Re: (BigStig)*

No, that's the diverter valve, the noise is from the wastegate. We use the same DVs as the FSI motor.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (ThatGuyRyan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ThatGuyRyan* »_No, that's the diverter valve, the noise is from the wastegate. We use the same DVs as the FSI motor.

Ah ha. Thank you. See? I said I didn't know what I was talking about.








I found that Forge valve while browsing around and thought that maybe that could be an answer. Guess not!








So, does an aftermarket wastegate for the 2009+ 2.0TFSI motor exist? 


_Modified by BigStig at 10:26 AM 9-10-2009_


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

There is a Forge wastegate actuator but it's for the FSI motor. Not sure if this would do anything in this case.
http://www.namotorsports.net/d...VAG05


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
The problem for me is that the car makes the noise right in the very sweet spot for normal, everyday, leaving-a-stop-sign acceleration. 

_Modified by BigStig at 10:11 AM 9-10-2009_

Bingo! 
I can't believe VW did not prevent such an IRRITATING sound from getting into production. It sounds AWFUL. 
I do my best to ignore it. But, I'll be looking for a fix. Maybe a different car.


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## ThatGuyRyan (Oct 21, 2006)

*Re: (velocidub)*

So I did my best to hear this on the way home from work... nothin'. I don't know if it's just my car or what, but I can't remember ever really hearing it or at least to the point of it being noticeable. To keep some information going I'm just under 20k and have a CBFA. Is the noise mixed between CBFA and CCTA cars? I have a dogbone insert and am pretty low on coils, but no real engine mods.

__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

I heard it on day 3 of ownership - completly stock and have a CBFA engine. Now that I have the mods I hear it less because the intake and chipped turbo spool sound.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (ThatGuyRyan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ThatGuyRyan* »_So I did my best to hear this on the way home from work... nothin'. I don't know if it's just my car or what, but I can't remember ever really hearing it or at least to the point of it being noticeable. To keep some information going I'm just under 20k and have a CBFA. Is the noise mixed between CBFA and CCTA cars? I have a dogbone insert and am pretty low on coils, but no real engine mods.

__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view










Some people here are blowing this way out of proportion. This man here is trying to duplicated it but can't hear it. It's because it's not as bad as people are making it out to be. If it were that bad, it would be heard with the windows up. 
Yeah yeah yea, you spent somewhere in the vicinity of $25K for the car and it makes a rattle sound from time to time; take it as part of the personality of the car. The most absurd one I read was someone saying that they would get rid of the car for this minor issue, if an issue at all, as if a mute gateway makes up an entire car.


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## wildeman940 (Sep 2, 2009)

Does anyone think the wastegate can be modified to stop the noise? Are there any aftermarket TSI wastegates yet?


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (aladro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *aladro* »_
Some people here are blowing this way out of proportion.


Says the person who doesn't even drive a car with this engine (according to your bio, anyway).









_Quote »_
This man here is trying to duplicated it but can't hear it. It's because it's not as bad as people are making it out to be. If it were that bad, it would be heard with the windows up. 


Perhaps trying to confirm whether or not it's supposed to be there for the collective good? VW/Audi says it's normal. So if he can't hear it, perhaps somethings wrong with his car! We've had a few folks say that if you CAN'T hear it, something might be wrong with your wastegate!









_Quote »_
Yeah yeah yea, you spent somewhere in the vicinity of $25K for the car and it makes a rattle sound from time to time; take it as part of the personality of the car. The most absurd one I read was someone saying that they would get rid of the car for this minor issue, if an issue at all, as if a mute gateway makes up an entire car. 
 
It's their money. Why would you care? If it pisses off that guy enough, and he wants to trade it for something else, so be it.
I'm truly happy for those that don't hear it or don't have the noise. I'm equally happy for those who are cool enough to just dismiss it as a 'quirk' of the car. But for those of us blessed with this "feature", and those of us who's personalities won't allow us to just accept it, this truly is a blemish on an otherwise great car.


_Modified by BigStig at 8:29 PM 9-10-2009_


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
this truly is a blemish on an otherwise great car.



This is how I feel. The vibrating/rattle noise may be normal, but for me it is an irritating UNREFINED sound. I've never heard this on any other turbo-charged engine. BTW, this 09 GTI is my 4th car with a turbo.
This noise is loud enough to hear with the windows up. The other day ,as a matter of fact, I was stopped at a light and heard another GTI taking off going through the light the other way. I could hear the rattle from that car 50-100 ft away!!!! It sounded like it had a hole in the exhaust. 
My 09 GTI is my 9th VW. I am very loyal to VW and a diehard fan of their cars. All my VW's have been solid reliable, fun cars. Never a major issue. I've tolerated "quirks" in all of them. None of those quirks took away from the enjoyment of the car. This "wastegate rattle" if that's what it is, does.
I can only hope VW will find a way to silence this rattle. With all the improvements on the TSI vs the FSI, I am really surprised they didn't change the design before the engine went into production.
Let me add to what BigStig said. This buzz-rattle noise aside, my 09 GTI is incredibly comfortable and fun to drive. I love it. It's just too bad instead of hearing the turbo spool and other engine sounds I have to listen to the wastegate rattle. Most days I don't care. I ignore it. But, sometimes it really bothers me.


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## JJM25 (Jan 12, 2006)

*Re: (BigStig)*

I hope inovillo doesnt mind but I borrowed a pic from his thread. The red circled area is the wastegate. I dont see how you can modify it...


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
Says the person who doesn't even drive a car with this engine (according to your bio, anyway).










Don't believe everything that you read on the internet. Some things may be lies, other things might be omitted or just simply outdated. There must be a reason why I'm in such a specific forum.

_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
Perhaps trying to confirm whether or not it's supposed to be there for the collective good? VW/Audi says it's normal. So if he can't hear it, perhaps somethings wrong with his car! We've had a few folks say that if you CAN'T hear it, something might be wrong with your wastegate!










Great that he's trying to confirm for the collective good. My point was that some people trying to confirm it can't hear, this may because it's not as bad as some are making it to be. If I were new to this and didn't know better I might be lead to believe that the engine was falling apart. If something were wrong with the wastegate of those who can hear it, there would be telling signs, big signs.

_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
It's their money. Why would you care? If it pisses off that guy enough, and he wants to trade it for something else, so be it.


I don't. It's simply an absurd comment. 
I hear it, and it's nothing worst than the raspy R32 exhaust. If VW had a TSB for this, would I bring my car in? Sure. Would I cry about it on an online forum and say I was going to sell it? NO.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (aladro)*

I would like to add info to this thread. I tried to hear this noise on the way to work today and couldn't really unless I was going 20 mph on 6th gear and then and everything would start shaking and of then things got very audible. I remember hearing the waste gate rattle quite distinctively in the past but seems to have quit down. Most of the new complaints are of people new to the car with very low miles. I'm at close to 4K miles on the car and the waste gate is pretty much mute. Can people hearing their waste gate rattle speak to what mileage they have on their car. The way I'm seeing it, things may quite down after some break in period.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (aladro)*

5,400 Miles and getting louder.
This is not "sometimes" but every gear - every-time.
Windows up or down - very annoying
IF some of you don;t have a problem with this or don't care about the noise if you do - then why are you on here reading this? This is for people having issues with this - lets leave the needless comments about other people off here.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (aladro)*

Great idea. I hope you're right about the break-in theory! Though there is one post where someone claims it got worse over time...
I bought my '09 A3 about a month ago, with 15 miles on the odometer. I first started hearing the noise at around 150 miles, a few days after purchase. That was the first time I started accelerating into the 2-3k RPM range with any amount of throttle, so AFAIK, it was doing it from mile 0.
As of today, one-month later, I've got 1,700 miles on the car. I actually *want* to say that the noise is slightly less abrasive now than it was when new. It's still there, and it still bothers me, but it _might_ actually be a bit quieter than it used to be. So you may be on to something. However, I don't know if I'm just learning to ignore it (likely) or if it's actually decreasing in volume/intensity. 
Honestly, I think I'm sort of learning/training myself to accelerate in a manner that minimizes the noise. I've sort of figured out that if I give it a bit *more* throttle than I'd normally use for 'everyday' driving through 2-3k RPM, then back off as the RPM's swing past 3K, the noise is minimized or almost completely eliminated.
Normal or not, I'd like to have a deeper understanding of why and what this noise is. Simply because I'm curious about it and I like to know how and why things work the way they do. I realize that no one here probably has the answer. Is it the wastegate valve chattering as the pressure is released? 
Would an aftermarket tune affect the wastegate operation? Any possibility that would help it? I was thinking of heading to my nearest APR dealer and getting the free 6-hour demo tune to see if that had any affect (and, of course, to see what an APR tune is like







). Again, just curiosity.


_Modified by BigStig at 7:16 AM 9-11-2009_


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_5,400 Miles and getting louder.
This is not "sometimes" but every gear - every-time.
Windows up or down - very annoying
IF some of you don;t have a problem with this or don't care about the noise if you do - then why are you on here reading this? This is for people having issues with this - lets leave the needless comments about other people off here.

Why, because unlike what you said, this is not a place for people having the issue, but a place to share information. I'm on here because at some point I did have the issue and wanted to know more about it. I can share things such as the fact that after 4000 miles of which some were aggressively, the problem seems to have gone away. This may give people an idea that maybe if they wait a little, things may be better. It may not be the miles on my car but simply the damp weather today and could of had an effect on it. Because if people with solution to a problem never stuck around, other people may never get an answer to their problems. Because otherwise things may get out of control and get blown out of proportion.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (aladro)*

aladro
What car do you drive?
R32 forums are elsewhere - how could you comment on a car you know nothing about.
Please - show some respect.
To everyone else:
There are many example of "sounds" drivers have issues with that VW and their dealers say its "normal" and then later give in and make the correct adjustment/fix. I have had 3 already in 5,400 miles. 
Yes these are great cars - that's why we bought one - but its doesn't mean that ever single one of these cars are made without possible issues or common issues. This TSI is brand new and its pretty common for manufacturers to have issues with the first production cycle. This is obviously happening to a lot of people and not a one off thing to complain about. VW should know (from us) when something needs tweaking - and its their responsibility to correct it.
Simple as that.


_Modified by zerostudio at 9:47 AM 9-11-2009_


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

I am just going to keep complaining to the dealer every time I take the car in and at every chance I get when VOA calls or surveys me. I think if enouf of us do this (to those who hate it) - we may be able to get someting done about it.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_aladro
What car do you drive?
R32 forums are elsewhere - how could you comment on a car you know nothing about.


Are threads read or just skimmed through? I've obviously posted enough to show I have a car with a TSI engine. How about the one which you responded to where I asked the mileage on people's cars because as *I had the issue initially but after some time it seems to have gone away* ? How accurate is my profile really when it says that am 108 years old.

_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_Great idea. I hope you're right about the break-in theory! Though there is one post where someone claims it got worse over time...
I bought my '09 A3 about a month ago, with 15 miles on the odometer. I first started hearing the noise at around 150 miles, a few days after purchase. That was the first time I started accelerating into the 2-3k RPM range with any amount of throttle, so AFAIK, it was doing it from mile 0.
As of today, one-month later, I've got 1,700 miles on the car. I actually *want* to say that the noise is slightly less abrasive now than it was when new. It's still there, and it still bothers me, but it _might_ actually be a bit quieter than it used to be. So you may be on to something. However, I don't know if I'm just learning to ignore it (likely) or if it's actually decreasing in volume/intensity. 
Honestly, I think I'm sort of learning/training myself to accelerate in a manner that minimizes the noise. I've sort of figured out that if I give it a bit *more* throttle than I'd normally use for 'everyday' driving through 2-3k RPM, then back off as the RPM's swing past 3K, the noise is minimized or almost completely eliminated.
Normal or not, I'd like to have a deeper understanding of why and what this noise is. Simply because I'm curious about it and I like to know how and why things work the way they do. I realize that no one here probably has the answer. Is it the wastegate valve chattering as the pressure is released? 
Would an aftermarket tune affect the wastegate operation? Any possibility that would help it? I was thinking of heading to my nearest APR dealer and getting the free 6-hour demo tune to see if that had any affect (and, of course, to see what an APR tune is like







). Again, just curiosity.


For that one post which zerostudio claims it has gotten worst. Has it really or is he paying more attention to it? Does a leaking faucet get louder over time or does it "seem" to get louder because it's driving you nuts and can't sleep? 
Will a tune help the issue, no initially but possibly if you believe in the break in theory. 4K on my car, 3K of which are on APR tune. Did I hear it before? Yes. Do I hear it now with tune? No. Do it hear it now with stock tune? No. I'm sure that the tune helped things break in a little faster. Also some have said that a DP have solve the rattle while others say no.


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

UPDATE - I just got a call from the dealership in regards to my VOA survey comments about this noise. 
I told the service manager that I was not happy about the diagnosis for this sound the last time I was in. I am going in on Tuesday next week to go for a test drive with the shop foreman. 
I did mention that many people were complaining about this on-line and he mentiond that this was the first he heard of it. This leads me to beleive that this may only exist in a small number of our cars?
I'll keep everyone posted.


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (kirkbar)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kirkbar* »_
I did mention that many people were complaining about this on-line and he mentiond that this was the first he heard of it. This leads me to beleive that this may only exist in a small number of our cars?


Think of it from their side.. maybe 50 people on a forum compared to the amount of GTIs ever sold would not be a "large number of people".. probably under 1%.


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## dave-g (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: (placenta)*

I'll chime in, I've had the same problem and i've got about 13K on my car. heard it on the test drive (i think it had 3 miles on it at that point). pointed it out to the sales guy, he said "oh that's the turbo." I've owned a lot of VW's and several other euro performance cars (Porsche & Volvo), but never a turbo, so i took his word and figured it wasn't that bad or it would go away. wrong.
So, like the poster who supplied the exact steps to reproduce the problem, I wrote the EXACT same ones (i wish i would have searched the vortex first and saved some time) for the VW service where i bought it. they came back and said that it was normal and that all the GTI's on the lot they tested did the same thing. well for me, there's no comfort in safety in numbers. it just pissed me off more. 
to me, it sounds like an old honda civic with a cheap coffee can exhaust that isn't bolted on tight enough. there I said it. it's not only annoying but it's down right embarrassing to someone who takes pride in caring for their car, as it sounds like it is falling apart. here's where i almost lost it, I was helping out at the Pittsburgh Vintage Grand Prix a few weeks ago, and since my station was on the backstretch, I drove the GTI around the track and parked it up on the grass. around lunch time, they called us in to meet back at the starting line. but there were still cars out on the track giving charity rides, so I got waved on and took off, I was enjoying a nice pace around the track, working the paddle-shifters and dropped down into 2nd around the hairpin turn and stomped on it coming out, that damn buzzing sounded like a swarm of pissed off hornets in a coffee can! I think the corner workers probably got a good laugh at my expense.
I'm actually considering selling it now. not just because of this noise, but other ones like the clicking above the seat belt retractor on the driver's side, and the passenger seat rattle, dash rattle... it just doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the current state of their quality control.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (dave-g)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dave-g* »_I'll chime in, I've had the same problem and i've got about 13K on my car. heard it on the test drive (i think it had 3 miles on it at that point). pointed it out to the sales guy, he said "oh that's the turbo." I've owned a lot of VW's and several other euro performance cars (Porsche & Volvo), but never a turbo, so i took his word and figured it wasn't that bad or it would go away. wrong.
So, like the poster who supplied the exact steps to reproduce the problem, I wrote the EXACT same ones (i wish i would have searched the vortex first and saved some time) for the VW service where i bought it. they came back and said that it was normal and that all the GTI's on the lot they tested did the same thing. well for me, there's no comfort in safety in numbers. it just pissed me off more. 
to me, it sounds like an old honda civic with a cheap coffee can exhaust that isn't bolted on tight enough. there I said it. it's not only annoying but it's down right embarrassing to someone who takes pride in caring for their car, as it sounds like it is falling apart. here's where i almost lost it, I was helping out at the Pittsburgh Vintage Grand Prix a few weeks ago, and since my station was on the backstretch, I drove the GTI around the track and parked it up on the grass. around lunch time, they called us in to meet back at the starting line. but there were still cars out on the track giving charity rides, so I got waved on and took off, I was enjoying a nice pace around the track, working the paddle-shifters and dropped down into 2nd around the hairpin turn and stomped on it coming out, that damn buzzing sounded like a swarm of pissed off hornets in a coffee can! I think the corner workers probably got a good laugh at my expense.
I'm actually considering selling it now. not just because of this noise, but other ones like the clicking above the seat belt retractor on the driver's side, and the passenger seat rattle, dash rattle... it just doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the current state of their quality control. 

I could not agree more - its ludicrous for VW not to take responsibility for such an obvious issue.
...and yes - "belt retractor on the driver's side"...
is REALLY annoying - right in your ear - they replaced a piece for me at the dealer and it still does it. My car has 5,400 miles on it and its been through so much work at the dealer - 6+ times now. After 7 VW's this one might get me to never buy again - so sad as I really love them - to a point.
My clutch flywheel and bearings where replaced after my 4th visit of begging/bitching for them to fix the VERY loud rattle from the transmission when idle and not in gear - they claimed was "working as designed by VW" and perfectly normal - treated me like an idiot. Then all of the sudden VW Tech line tells the dealer that its a "terrible" and "assembly issue" issue and to replace the parts above. This was finally completed after being in the shop for a week - for something that was "normal" supposedly - in the previous 4 visits - what a joke.
IT IS like pulling teeth with VW and their dealers - don;t give up - hopefully these threads can help show that we are not accepting this and any other issues.

_Modified by zerostudio at 2:33 PM 9-12-2009_


_Modified by zerostudio at 2:36 PM 9-12-2009_


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## JCMaler (Jan 8, 2003)

*Re:*

I've been cranking my stereo lately to drown out all engine noise to keep me sane (sad). I think I'll eventually take out that stupid sound pipe to see if it lessens the amplification of the noise. Mine is loud inside the cabin with the windows up.


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## ThatGuyRyan (Oct 21, 2006)

*Re: Re: (JCMaler)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JCMaler* »_I think I'll eventually take out that stupid sound pipe to see if it lessens the amplification of the noise.

I forgot about that. I have my "noise pipe" blocked. Maybe that's why I don't hear it as much?


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## JCMaler (Jan 8, 2003)

*Re: Re: (ThatGuyRyan)*

Well, I did my part today and took the head shop technician/foreman for a ride. I wasn't too optimistic about the outcome going in based on all I have read in the last week, but I thought I should get my complaint on record. The tech heard the sound; he first said "I think that's normal?!?" (a question.)... I politely explained that there's quite a reaction to this noise online and as it may be a "normal characteristic" of this car (engine), it's not _normal_, it's not _sporty_, and it's not turbo spool. He didn't disagree. He knew of no TSB, or hasn't heard it before but he said we would research it. For this reason I implore you to take your car's in and/or call about the noise if it bothers you. I will be calling to follow up on my visit.
Now I don't want to pick fights here, but I pose a rhetorical question: If you hear this described raspy rattle sound in your GTI or Tiguan, and you don't find it's bad enough to voice your disapproval to VW, and eventually either "the masses" move VW to find a solution or they determine there's a problem/solution on their own...will you bring your car in for service then? Let's not fight about it, let's push VW to find a cause and corrective action!


_Modified by JCMaler at 2:31 PM 9-15-2009_


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

*Re: Re: (JCMaler)*

You and I had the same sort of day as I did the same thing. Me and the VW shop foreman went for a ride and I could barely reproduce the noise but he knew what I was talking about. 
He didn't think it was the wastegate but leaned more towards the downpipe mesh and he told me this is different on the TSI engines. 
He said he could use some metal bands around the mesh to stop the vibrations but for now I just told him to let VW know about this and when I come in for my 10K service - we'll revisit the problem. He was a very nice guy and wanted to help out.
I also sent an e-mail to the shop manager and he too said he is sending my comments to VW.


----------



## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: Re: (kirkbar)*

I'm in 100% agreement with you guys. Those of us with the noise who are irritated, we need to complain. We're either A) such a small group of crazy people that it won't matter, or B) enough of us that VAG will get enough complaints to cross a threshold where they'll research it. Either way, the best we can do is to bring it up to our respective service people, and to make it known on surveys that this noise is an irritation.

_Quote, originally posted by *kirkbar* »_
He didn't think it was the wastegate but leaned more towards the downpipe mesh and he told me this is different on the TSI engines. 
He said he could use some metal bands around the mesh to stop the vibrations but for now I just told him to let VW know about this and when I come in for my 10K service - we'll revisit the problem. He was a very nice guy and wanted to help out.


A vote for the DP mesh. Very Interesting. On one hand, kudos to your shop guy for suggesting a way to quiet it down. But on the other hand, seriously, it'd be nice to get a straight answer on what exactly this noise is. Do let the group know the outcome of your 10k service!


_Modified by BigStig at 12:02 PM 9-15-2009_


----------



## JCMaler (Jan 8, 2003)

*Re: Re: (BigStig)*

My mother just had her Cadillac in for service with a rattle. They used 'chassis ears' to diagnose the problem.







I would think the downpipe, downpipe screen, and that heat shield around it could be tested this way...?


----------



## wildeman940 (Sep 2, 2009)

Has anyone determined beyond doubt that this noise is from the waste gate?


----------



## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (wildeman940)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wildeman940* »_Has anyone determined beyond doubt that this noise is from the waste gate?

Does your '09 Passat CC make the same noise?


----------



## a3stronic (Aug 24, 2009)

*Re: (BigStig)*

I do not think the noise isssue is related with the Turbo Engine. It has got to be the transmission. I own a 09 Audi A3 1.6 Stronic and i have the same complains as mentioned on this topic. Several trips to the dealer but they did nothing to fix this problem. The dealer claimed that the noise coming from the car is a characteristic noise of the new Stronic transmission. That's it. 
By the way they also suggested that I should extend my warranty just in case, because a new transmission will cost around 9000Euro
Here is the link... Enjoy...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyoCZLqDtpo


----------



## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (a3stronic)*

If the noise you're hearing is the same one that we're hearing, then I think your dealer is wrong. The noise at the end of your video sounds a lot like what I'm hearing.
There are people here with manual transmissions that are hearing the noise. If it were the DSG, only those of us with DSG's would hear it.
Though on the other hand, it is interesting that your noise sounds very familiar to mine, yet you have a different engine, the 1.6T. Would it be possible that the 2.0T and 1.6T share the same wastegate design? If yes, then that would be more evidence for the wastegate. If not, then it would be evidence against the wastegate. And if that's the case, I'd be back to thinking it's the aluminum heat-wrap stuff vibrating/rubbing.
I just continue to find it highly annoying. I'm up to 2,400 miles and the noise is just as loud as ever. I had thought that maybe it was going away, but I'm convinced now that it isn't. 


_Modified by BigStig at 6:33 AM 10-1-2009_


----------



## wildeman940 (Sep 2, 2009)

*Re: (BigStig)*

Yes, my Passat cc 09 manual makes the same noise. Has since it was new.


----------



## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (wildeman940)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wildeman940* »_Yes, my Passat cc 09 manual makes the same noise. Has since it was new. 

Not really surprising since it's the same 2.0T engine. But definitely interesting in that it's a different model car completely (further removed from the GTI/Scirroco/A3 cousins) & that you've got a manual. Anyone know if the CC 2.0T has the same sort of insulation on the undercarraige & exhaust that could be causing the noise? Or does this just reinforce the wastegate theory?
Good, in that the more models affected means the more chance for complaints and ultimately a TSB, Maybe.
Bad, in that you're part of the club now too.


----------



## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (BigStig)*

Bringing my GLI in today for the 4th time - new dealer - lets see what they say. I already have a dialog from VW of America as well - not much help from them as they are still calling this noise "as designed" which is really funny - not really.
Everyone needs to bring their car in and complain - thats the only way they will start researching and responding. I find it very very hard to believe they do not know about this. I am sure they are trying to sweep it under the rug until it becomes a larger scale complain pool of owners.
Will keep you posted.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_
Will keep you posted.

Excellent. Please do, zerostudio! 
Good luck!!!


----------



## JCMaler (Jan 8, 2003)

*Re: (zerostudio)*

I called to check in with the VW shop foreman who previously took a ride with me in my car ("I think that's normal?!?"). He asked me to give him a few days to research the issue. He found no known problems out there, which is what I expected. They were courteous and supportive about my dissatisfaction with the noise however.
They said to call VW customer service to voice my concerns, which I will do, and I suggest all to do it also (Strength in numbers to get some engineers looking at this)! *1-800-822-8987*.
I also went to a second dealership where I did not buy my car and spoke with the service manager who also heard of no issues/complaints out there or from customers about this noise, but they told me to bring it in to check it out...


_Modified by JCMaler at 3:54 PM 10-1-2009_


----------



## a3stronic (Aug 24, 2009)

*Re: (BigStig)*

My engine is a non-turbo. For the technical part of your question I do not know if we have the same wategate design. According to my mechanic the noise is coming from the transmission. I thought that the noise only came from the automatic transmissions. If the manuels are making noises like ours that makes things more comlplicated. Here in Turkey they are claiming that only the new stronic transmissions' dry dual clutch system is causing the noise but as we see manual cars have also got the same problem. 
It does not seem possible for Audi or Wv to sell these car without proper tests. So it boils down to this; they do not want to fix this problem. Once more this noises are annoying and unacceptable for any normal car.


----------



## bokiNY (Nov 26, 2008)

Well, a3stronic, if your car is non-turbo there's no wastegate on it either...so you might be experiencing a different type of noise.
My experience, 09 GLI with 21k miles, APR Stage 1 at 4k miles, Carbonio CAI at 5k miles, noise pipe delete at 8k miles, BFI dog bone insert at 10k miles and could barely hear the noise. Now, at 21k miles I just put the 42dd ssr downpipe and APR Stage 2 and the noise came up loud and clear - it's annoying the h3ll out of me, could it really be wastegate? If so VW is never going to replace it because they'll have to either replace the whole turbo or change the design of the turbo itself...could I be right?


----------



## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

i have 2010 wolfsburg and experience the same issue. My car only has 400 miles, but i have definitely noticed the noise with music off. It is like a chchchchchchchch said really fast. Best way i can describe it.


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

*Re: (dingchavez)*

One person did mention theyre noise went away with the installation of their carbino intake...My car is bone stock atm and i have the noise, but my carbino is on the way so once i install it ill let you all know if i still have the noise.


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## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

*Re:*

I know this is not very helpful but I have a 2010 GTi and do not have this issue. Don't know what would be different ...


----------



## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: Re: (Frankie92481)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Frankie92481* »_I know this is not very helpful but I have a 2010 GTi and do not have this issue. Don't know what would be different ...

pics or it didn't happen.


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## Simmsled (May 3, 2007)

*Re: Re: (ryan mills)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ryan mills* »_
pics or it didn't happen.









I can second this. I drove a MKVI GTI and no noise.


----------



## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: Re: (Simmsled)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Simmsled* »_
I can second this. I drove a MKVI GTI and no noise.

still want pics. Not really for proof, but I like to look at the car.


----------



## nachtmusik (Aug 1, 2006)

*Re: (a3stronic)*

FWIW, both my parents and I have 2008.5 GTI's...mine with about 10,400 miles and theirs with about 20,000 miles. Neither car has developed this noise (knock on wood).


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (nachtmusik)*

Just got the DSG temp sensor recall in the mail so I have to make an appt with the dealer.
I will mention this noise and they WILL hear it. It's easily audible.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (velocidub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *velocidub* »_Just got the DSG temp sensor recall in the mail so I have to make an appt with the dealer.
I will mention this noise and they WILL hear it. It's easily audible.

Good luck. Several of us have had techs hear & acknowledge the noise. On my demo-ride, the service manager agreed that it didn't sound like a 'normal' sort of engine noise. He promised they'd "look into it". Then later said that there isn't anything wrong and that it's normal for the 2008.5+ 2.0TFSI engine.








This can't be true - we've proven it here. Some people have the noise and others don't. If it were part of the design of the engine|turbo|wastegate|downpipe-insulation, then they'd all do it. But they don't. So it's not "normal". 
The problem is that no one seems to have a solution for it. 4,400 miles on my '09 A3 now. Still making the noise. Not any louder or more frequently than it used to. But still annoying. I'll ask the dealer again to check into it at the 5k service. Not that I expect they'll be able to figure it out the second time around.
I'm not usually one to aftermarket mod-up my vehicles, but if it's proven that an aftermarket <something> that solves the problem, I'd gladly do it.


_Modified by BigStig at 11:00 AM 10-23-2009_


----------



## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (BigStig)*

Same here - still have it at 5,600 miles. 
For me it didn't start until about 3,500-4,000 Miles.
At this point - the sound is slightly quieter so the dealer claims they do not know where to look etc...
Its very disappointing as VW is ignoring it for some reason or another.
I am going to wait it out to the 10,000 check up and see if it gets worse or better. This forum is a good place to document this IF it does become a serious issue going forward.
So please - anyone that is getting this noise - make it known on here - your dealer and by calling VWofAmerica


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

I bet its the wg flapper valve. It happend under part throttle and i would bet its just as the wg starts opening so the valve is rattling against the exaust turbine housing. I've noticed that some waste gate flapper valves seem like they are barely attached so they could vibrate around really easily i dunno just my $0.02 can anyone chime in with and aftermarket turbo on the tsi?


----------



## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

*Re: (MaxVW)*

A few people ive asked also said it is probably the waste gate, and that is most likely normal. I experience the noise on occasion, always within 2-3k rpm. People also mentioned that it could possibly be the flex connector, as it vibrates and flexes under engine pressure. I don't think it is the flex connector, as this theory was tested, but It is either the waste gate or the diverter valve. I'm not positive, but I know there is an option to upgrade your DV from ECS tuning because the OEM ones have a different diaphragm or something. Someone also mentioned to me that a torn diaphrapgm can be the cause of this noise so I really don't know if it is the waste gate or the DV...
Hopefully someone that experiences this noise gets the newer DV and tests it. If its still there, then my guess would be the wastegate. 
By the way, here is the thread on the DV. I don't know if it would apply to my car, but then again I do have a TSI 2.0t. Just an idea...
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4578412

_Modified by dingchavez at 7:14 AM 10-30-2009_


_Modified by dingchavez at 7:15 AM 10-30-2009_


----------



## MikeGLI (Apr 5, 2003)

*Re: (dingchavez)*

I took 2 service techs for a drive and reproduced it for them. The first didnt seem to know his ass from his elbow, the other just assumed it was normal. 
I was already late for work so i didn't bother arguing with the manager.


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## wildeman940 (Sep 2, 2009)

*Re: (MaxVW)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MaxVW* »_I bet its the wg flapper valve. It happend under part throttle and i would bet its just as the wg starts opening so the valve is rattling against the exaust turbine housing. I've noticed that some waste gate flapper valves seem like they are barely attached so they could vibrate around really easily i dunno just my $0.02 can anyone chime in with and aftermarket turbo on the tsi?

that sounds about right. Not a pleasant noise for such a advanced engine.


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

*Re: (wildeman940)*

Facts:
1)the noise occurs at 2700rpm no matter what gear
2) it does not occur while revving in neutral
3) it happens on occasion, for me
4) it's annoying and must be fixed
5) vw doesn't care
what happens at 2700 rpm?
Does the flex connector flex?


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## acunje (Oct 2, 2008)

long story short... two theories are
flex pipe on DP.
new cam chain noted in the updated TSI motor...much like that heard on a motorcycle with a not properly tightened cam chain tensioner
some claim the noise goes away with aftermarket DP


----------



## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (acunje)*


_Quote, originally posted by *acunje* »_long story short... two theories are
flex pipe on DP.
new cam chain noted in the updated TSI motor...much like that heard on a motorcycle with a not properly tightened cam chain tensioner
some claim the noise goes away with aftermarket DP

By my count, there are three theories. The first two as you have stated.
But there is a third theory that it's the wastegate on the turbo, per MaxVW's post (and others) above.
And just 'on occasion'? You're lucky. Mine does it every time. Hot or cold. Chattering starts at around 2,200 RPM, peaks by 2,700, and is gone by 3,000.


_Modified by BigStig at 12:37 PM 11-5-2009_


----------



## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

*Re: (BigStig)*

Yea, sometimes it occurs and other times it does not. I am positive too, because I typically drive with my windows open and no music. And yes, it does occur within those rpm ranges.
Also, I'm pretty sure I could not hear the noise in neutral. If someone can test this out by simply revving their car and listening for the noise, it would help. For me it is random, some rides I will not hear it at all, some times its very apparent and annoying. 
It almost sounds like something fizzling, like an air leak (maybe from an intercooler pipe?) but I'm not sure. However, if the noise isnt heard in neutral, than how can it be the downpipe or wastegate? If it only occurs when the cars in moving and in gear, then perhaps its air being misplaced. I dontknow though, im used to big straightforward LS1's


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

After doing just about everything you can do to the TSI engine as of right now, the wastegate theory seems about right. THe wategate has a small metal plunger on a little pivoting mount that looks like it can be making the noise described. My downpipe theory might be a little off because I could hear the sound at the flex connection. That's probably where the sound can radiate and make the most noise. I claimed that with my downpipe the sound disappeared.... I did get a stage II tune at the same time, which would probably change the duty cycle of the wastegate, making the noise go away. At this point if you have the noise, I don't know what I would do. My wifes Tiguan still makes the noise, but I got used to it. Maybe you can too. I'm thinking the srtongest argument is the wastegate at this time. If the noise is just too much, I did get a AWE k04 turbo kit, and no longer have the issue. $3000 might be a little steep for a rattle though. One a side note, 2003-2004 Ford Mustand Cobra's don't stand a chance from a roll!


----------



## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (ryan mills)*

Went in today to have the DSG reflash recall and 90 day checkup. 
I had the tech ride with me and he said the noise was coming from the turbo. I could barely reproduce the noise!!








Go figure. The noise seems to be lessening as the car breaks in more and when the engine is really hot you can barely hear it. I guess that's a good thing http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
It's always something with these cars.
Thanks everyone for keeping this thread alive.


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## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

*Re: (dingchavez)*

I'm starting to notice this noise on my MKVI .....
It doesnt bother me, just turn up the music


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (velocidub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *velocidub* »_Went in today to have the DSG reflash recall and 90 day checkup. 

Slightly off topic, but...
Out of curiosity, did your DSG gear indicator disappear after the 37E5 DSG recall/reflash? 
Several of us over in the A3 forum have noticed (and Audi has confirmed) that a "feature" of the reflash is that the driver's center display no longer indicates the selected gear in Drive or Sport modes. So at the bottom of the display, rather than [PRN*D*S X], where X is the chosen gear; 1-6, we now just get [PRN*D*S ] - no gear display. Quite lovely.








Just curious if the same "feature" affects the GTI.
And to offer some relevance to the topic.... I'm at 5,400 miles. Noise is as loud as ever. Really unchanged for the past 3-4k miles. It still ticks me off, but I'm slowly - S L O W L Y - learning to just get over it. Still, I hate driving by any sort of wall. Sounds really nasty. I've even had a couple of people ask me about the car & noise, and I've had to just tell them that's what VW's and Audi's do. Not exactly a glowing advertisement for VAG engineering...










_Modified by BigStig at 9:43 AM 11-11-2009_


----------



## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
Out of curiosity, did your DSG gear indicator disappear after the 37E5 DSG recall/reflash? 

_Modified by BigStig at 9:43 AM 11-11-2009_

No it's still there. Only in manual mode though. It never showed the gear indicator in D or S mode.
The mistake I made during the drive with the tech was we had the windows down and the background noise from traffic etc drowned out the buuuzzzzzz-rattle. Next time I'll leave the windows up.
Also, I could barely get up to 2500 rpm. The car is too fast







I kept almost running into the cars in front of me.
Yeah, I agree we need to learn to live with this noise. The car is too fun to drive IMO to let this buzz get to us.


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## skyfire74 (Nov 12, 2009)

*Re: (velocidub)*

Hi,
Just found this thread after a message from BigStig over in another forum. Reading though looks like I have the same problem, and it really bugs me - not something I can get used to (my opinion anyway).
I have a '09 A3 2.0TFSI manual. I have had the rattling acceleration between about 2200 and 2800rpm since I got the car, and its still doing it after 9k miles. It always happens at anything but very light acceleration, worse with the windows down, but still with windows up - sounds more clicky.
Something not always mentioned in this thread, but certainly clear with my car is the even louder rattling at cold start in much lower rev range - about 1500+. Probably the same thing, but louder and lasts for about 30s after start. Also, pulling away slowly on flat ground whilst making this rattle, the car seems to jump very slightly as if going over slight lumps in the road, then as the rattle stops, the power seems to increase and the car runs smooth. Very subtle, and not always apparent - but maybe some help in diagnosis???
Have been to the dealer many times, had new turbo / flex joint initially, but no change, still waiting for them to get back to me as they are going to their 'Audi technical recourse'.
I certainly want to get to the bottom of this.
Cheers,
C


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## O_o (Nov 12, 2009)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

I heard a noise when I first drove "my" new car, that sounds similar to what many of you describe. It happened under light load at low RPM (2000-2500 RPM). Somebody already described it as "pop-rocks in a soda can", and I don't think I can top that. There was definitely a bubbling liquid quality to it, combined with a gritty noise akin to a diesel knock. I thought it sounded like it was coming from the vicinity of the gearbox, suggesting an exhaust problem. My solution? Simple: I refused delivery, and am currently waiting for the dealer to bring in different car.
I know it's too late for many of you, but for others who may be reading this: ALWAYS drive, and thoroughly inspect, a new car before accepting delivery. If there is ANYTHING wrong with it, make it clear that you are not accepting it until any and all problems have been corrected to your full satisfaction. Do not listen to any promises. The way it works is this: if you accept delivery, it's YOUR problem; if you refuse, it's THEIRS. They will be much more inclined to make it right -- FAST -- if they know they're not getting a penny until you're satisfied. Also, if you take delivery, and they can't fix it, you're stuck with a lemon. If you refuse, it can still be exchanged, because it has no miles on it.


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## rpt613 (Nov 24, 2009)

I'm hearing the same noise. Just got my car 3 days ago. It's got the DSG tranny. Taking it to the dealer this week to have it looked at. Would be surprised if they admit to a design/manufacturing flaw. Will post result.


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## gtalexad2001 (Aug 15, 2006)

*Re:*

Count me in...i have the buzzing rattle on my new 2010 GTI. I will plug the noise pipe this weekend just to see how much of a difference that makes. 
But as far as I can tell from driving with the window down, the noise is coming from somewhere under the car. So I doubt it is just a buzzy noise box.


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## Fignewton (Jun 12, 2007)

*Re: Re: (gtalexad2001)*

I'll join the que. 2010 Wolfsburg manual with 1500K, noise since delivery. Going in to the dealership Friday for my "courtesy inspection" will ask them then. Not expecting much.


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## rpt613 (Nov 24, 2009)

Took my Jetta Wolfsburg to the dealer today. They acknowledge that there's a problem -- and not just with my car. They were able to reproduce it on another with the same engine & transmission. They didn't find the cause. I have to take it back on the 7th and leave it with them until they figure it out. I'm gonna get a loaner for the duration. Was told there are no service bulletins or anything else on the matter. So the dealer opened a "ticket" which will bring the problem to the attention of head office (as if they don't already know!). I guess I can't ask for more than that for now. Will keep everybody posted.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (rpt613)*

rpt613 - thanks and keep us posted after the 7th - I am very curious what they find.
I am still getting the "can't find it" but its "normal" and "don't worry about it"
This is ridiculous that its on the 2009 and now the 2010's as well.


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

*Re: (zerostudio)*

I'm glad people are making the effort to get there cars checked and hopefully diagnosed. My 2010 wolfsburg with 1.5k miles also makes this noise constantly. Apparently its normal, but in all honesty, it just doesn't sound good. I'll contribute to this thread as I too am still trying to get to the bottom of this annoyance.


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (dingchavez)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dingchavez* »_I'm glad people are making the effort to get there cars checked and hopefully diagnosed. 

I have my invoice documenting the buzz rattle sound from my 90 day courtesy check. 
Every time I have the car serviced, I'll bring it up again.
It doesn't bother me nearly as much as it did when the car was new. But, I do hope they can find a way to silence it. It can be annoying, and embarrassing.


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## joey26lil (Nov 11, 2007)

i have that same rattle/marble noise with the ebay catless downpipe.. its really annoying.. i have an 08.5 cbfa dsg


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

i have posted a couple times probably in this thread saying i do not have the noise..
well i heard it today finally. i think i have always had it, but i timed everything just right at 1500rpm, laid into the accelerator gently, and heard the bucket of marbles starting right about 2500rpms.
that being said, its not a huge deal at all to me. This is one of the noisiest engines i've ever had to begin with. Whats a tiny bit more noise? If this was my 135i with a super smooth, refined engine, then the rattle might bother me. since the engine sounds like a tractor anyway, I dont care about this rattle. Sounds normal to me..


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## Fignewton (Jun 12, 2007)

*Re: (placenta)*

Had my "courtesy check" on Friday. They diagnosed the rattle as the turbo spooling up. Classic.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (Fignewton)*

I am embarrassed for the dealer...
I got that too - its sad they think we are that stupid...
Keep up the fight.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (Fignewton)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Fignewton* »_Had my "courtesy check" on Friday. They diagnosed the rattle as the turbo spooling up. Classic. 

One of the leading theories of this noise is that it's the wastegate chattering under partial load. If that's true, then it is produced when the turbo is spooling up. Without the turbo, there'd be no wastegate, and with no wastegate, there'd be no noise.
So in a round-a-bout way, it *is* being caused by the turbo spooling up. 
I don't really care what it is, nor who's fault it is. I just want a solution so that my A3 ceases sounding like a old Honda Civic with a duct-taped-coffee-can muffler.



_Modified by BigStig at 12:38 PM 11-30-2009_


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## rpt613 (Nov 24, 2009)

Didn't expect to be reporting back so soon. Recall from my earlier post that I was taking my car back to the dealer today. I left it there at 7:30 not expecting to get it back for a couple of days. Well, three hours later I got a call to come get the car. They hadn't found anything to explain the noise, although they reconfirmed that it was indeed there. Small comfort. Anyway, I was told that I could bring the car back when the rep from head office was in town. Hmm. Not what I was hoping to hear but hardly unexpected based on the experiences that other people have recounted here. I suppose I'll take the car back yet again. What choice do I have other than enduring the noise or drowning it out with the stereo?
As it happens, the loaner I was given was a 2010 Passat CC, the 2.0 version w/ DSG. Wouldn't you know it? it makes the same sort of noise albeit not nearly as loudly as my car does. Don't know what to make of that. Maybe it is the waste gate and maybe there is a noise and it's just more noticeable on the Jetta and GTI for some reason?


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

*Re: (rpt613)*

QUESTION: Does anyone experience the noise with APR stage 1 ecu upgrade? Someone here mentioned that it would alter the wastegate cycle, which crossed my mind, and now I'm thinking once I get stage 1 the noise will be reduced.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (dingchavez)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dingchavez* »_QUESTION: Does anyone experience the noise with APR stage 1 ecu upgrade? Someone here mentioned that it would alter the wastegate cycle, which crossed my mind, and now I'm thinking once I get stage 1 the noise will be reduced. 

I'd love to know too. If it helped, I'd get flashed tomorrow.








My nearest APR dealer is about 100-miles away. If they were any closer (or open on weekends), I would have already visited them for the free 6 hour demo-tune. That would answer the question without forking over any $$$. And if it quenched this noise, I'd absolutely get the flash. No question. I'm looking for an excuse anyway....

















_Modified by BigStig at 9:08 AM 12-8-2009_


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Many models affected...*

Good info, rpt613.
I think it's pretty clear that can affect any vehicle with the 200hp 2.0TFSI. It definitely affects the GTI, the A3, and the Jetta Wolfsburg 2.0T. And I've seen posts both here and elsewhere regarding the 2.0T CC, the EOS, and the Tiguan. I haven't heard if it affects the 2.0T in the base TT, but I suspect it might since it's the same engine. 
Not sure about the TTS or the A4, but I doubt it. I am pretty sure that the 2.0T in those vehicles is different enough. Specifically, I think the turbo is different. But I may be wrong. The tuning, at the very least, is definitely different (more hp + torque).


_Modified by BigStig at 8:59 AM 12-8-2009_


----------



## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: Many models affected... 2010 as well - confirmed*

Hello all you buzzing noise victims..
I just picked up my new 2010 GTI a week ago and the buzzing was there immediately leaving the dealer.
At this point, after many trip tot eh dealer with 2009 GLI, I am assuming its nothing problematic. However - very annoying to buy a NEW car with a buzzing built into the car - kinda silly and frustrating.
Gotta press VW to take responsibility of this - so far - ignored issue - whether its a bog deal or not at all - its still a noise that is NOT "normal".


----------



## dpmcgrath (Dec 5, 2009)

*Re: Many models affected... (BigStig)*

Just got mine back from the dealer today, where the VW of A field rep took it for a test ride. The results? Yes, he was able to duplicate the sound, yes, it is the wastegate valve, and yes, it is normal. Great. Now all we have is the acknowledgment that we have noisy, normal engine. 
I wouldn't hold my breath that VW is actually going to DO something about it.


----------



## Fignewton (Jun 12, 2007)

*Re: Many models affected... (dpmcgrath)*

Anyone else notice that it seems to have increased in frequency with the cold weather? Maybe just me.


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## ScottyMKVI (Oct 18, 2009)

*Re: Many models affected... (Fignewton)*

I just installed a 3" downpipe and can hear a metallic buzzing noise now. At first, I was thinking that it was an exhaust leak, but now I think it may be this issue. The noise I have is load dependant (it won't do it just revving the engine) but not really rpm dependant.


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## VdubVSHonda (May 4, 2008)

*Re: Many models affected... (ScottyMKVI)*

i'm APR stage 1 and I've had the noise since day 1 of delivery... APR ECU upgrade changed nothing


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: Many models affected... (ScottyMKVI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ScottyMKVI* »_I just installed a 3" downpipe and can hear a metallic buzzing noise now. At first, I was thinking that it was an exhaust leak, but now I think it may be this issue. The noise I have is load dependant (it won't do it just revving the engine) but not really rpm dependant.

what about it? its normal.


----------



## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

*Re: Many models affected... (dpmcgrath)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpmcgrath* »_Just got mine back from the dealer today, where the VW of A field rep took it for a test ride. The results? Yes, he was able to duplicate the sound, yes, it is the wastegate valve, and yes, it is normal. Great. Now all we have is the acknowledgment that we have noisy, normal engine. 
I wouldn't hold my breath that VW is actually going to DO something about it. 


I hear what your saying. However remember when the FSI engines first came out and everyone complained about the fuel pump ticking away under the hood. Guess what, same deal. Is it normal? Yes, Is there anything we can do about it? Nope .....


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

*Re: Many models affected... (Frankie92481)*

Yea its definitely normal on the 2010 turbos. My gf just got a 2010 passat and I hear it, especially since I was trying to hear it. What I did happen to notice when I popped her hood was that the 2010 passats don't have a noise pipe...Most likely because they're more luxurious and people want a quite cabin, but still. I got gimped with a noise pipe =(


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## JTwGTI (Sep 25, 2003)

*Re: Many models affected... (dingchavez)*

2010 MkVI GTI - check
Annoying ass engine buzz between 2000-3000K - check
Above 3000 revs it sounds like a totally different engine, and a solid one at that!


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*"Buzzzvergnügen"*

Ditto
2-3,000 like clock work
Still embarrassing for a new car... really disappointing coming from the Germans
They should put in the brochures - apparently a new German Engineering marvel
They call it "Buzzzvergnügen" and bring back the late 80's/early 90's








Even with this annoyance - I am so in love with my GTI


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## shembree (Nov 27, 2009)

I've got the same issue on my MkVI GTI 6m. Under partial throttle and particularly on deceleration. Did a search for "wastegate flutter" on google; everything I found describes my noise perfectly.


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## wilgomez (Jul 18, 2006)

i noticed this noise in every tsi engine i drive. the tsi engine as a louder cam adjuster that can be heard even on idle. on accel @ low rpms the ecm advances cam angle for low rpm torque.


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## pburt (Jul 27, 2009)

It's nice to know that this problem is universal (every TSI has it) and benign (doesn't damage engine or degrade performance). However, the noise is annoying. If it was just a "hiss" or sucking sound, it wouldn't be so bad. It's the "gritty" noise that accompanies the hiss that drives me nuts. It sounds almost like there is sand spinning around in the air intake or something. Is there any way to deaden the sound of the cam adjuster (if that is what is actually making the noise)?
Phil


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## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

*Re: (pburt)*

After installing my Intake and Downpipe I can't hear the noise anymore.
It may just be due to me hearing the exhaust more... but not sure...


----------



## MBH (Jun 19, 2009)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
Not really surprising since it's the same 2.0T engine. But definitely interesting in that it's a different model car completely (further removed from the GTI/Scirroco/A3 cousins) & that you've got a manual. Anyone know if the CC 2.0T has the same sort of insulation on the undercarraige & exhaust that could be causing the noise? Or does this just reinforce the wastegate theory?
Good, in that the more models affected means the more chance for complaints and ultimately a TSB, Maybe.
Bad, in that you're part of the club now too.









My '10 CC 2.0T with DSG makes the noise as well. It has since I took delivery of it with 27 miles on it. Seems more pronounced in the cold, but maybe that's more of a factor of it being colder out and me having more seat time in the car.
It sounds like its coming from right behind the steering column on mine, and its annoying as hell. So far the only thing I have done to correct the problem involves the rotating the little knob on the bottom left on the radio clockwise. Thinking of putting a system in the car soon, so that might add further relief


----------



## Simmsled (May 3, 2007)

Okay, so wastegate. What can we do to change out the wastegate?


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## bokiNY (Nov 26, 2008)

Replacing a turbo?


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (Simmsled)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Simmsled* »_Okay, so wastegate. What can we do to change out the wastegate? 


Guys, I am still oblivious to the noise you are all referring to, i guess Im just not paying attention or the description doesnt describe what my brain says i am hearing.
As for replacing the WG, unlike the FSI motor where the WG is bolted on, the TSI WG is riveted to the engine, and cannot be removed.


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## bokiNY (Nov 26, 2008)

Wouldn't this be the ideal time for someone with the knowledge and means to slap a k03 instead of the IHI one and see if that's going to work or not (like Noside07 already suggested on golfmkv.com)? I'd put Forge's WG on it too and test it all out - might be a nice stock like set up with maybe a small gain on top of it too? Just guessing (no expert here).


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (bokiNY)*

I spoke with Forge about testing out their WG several months ago and that is when they told me about the WG being rivieted on.
What would be the point in swapping out turbos with another stock unit?
If you have the stock TSI turbo removed you might as well upgrade to a K04 or a BT.....


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## MaxVW (Nov 4, 2004)

does anyone have an aftermarket turbo on a tsi?


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## lookin4trouble (Jun 14, 2008)

Yes. There are a couple out there. Probably don't have this issue anymore ...
On a side note. I've been living with this noise for 30K+ miles and I don't even notice it anymore. It bothered the crap outta me initially, but I think I've tuned it out at this point.


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## boatvolt (Jan 17, 2010)

In the market for a MK6 GTI [loved my MK1, in spite of problems], and in doing research, found this thread. Seems this noise issue [which would drive me crazy] has been going on since the introduction of the TSI, as evidenced by nearly 300 posts in thread.
Hard to believe that VW engineering has not found a solution; more likely that VW bean counters do not want the expense of a retrofit that a TSB would bring on. 
"Normal" being a relative term, VW could mount octagonal wheels and call them "normal". Normal yes, right no.
I had hoped that VW's spotty reliability was in the past, but their short-sighted corporate culture has cost them my business.


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: (MaxVW)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MaxVW* »_does anyone have an aftermarket turbo on a tsi?

I do! And if you're wondering, I don't have the noise. My wifes Tiguan is all stock and still makes the noise, but it doesn't seem as noticable now at 20,000 miles. Either I'm used to it, or it's gotten a little quieter. Since it's cold, we havent had the windows down lately either.


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (boatvolt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *boatvolt* »_
Hard to believe that VW engineering has not found a solution; more likely that VW bean counters do not want the expense of a retrofit that a TSB would bring on. 
"Normal" being a relative term, VW could mount octagonal wheels and call them "normal". Normal yes, right no.
I had hoped that VW's spotty reliability was in the past, but their short-sighted corporate culture has cost them my business.

Maybe its NOT a problem?
Ever think of that?
Guess what, my car makes a noise when I step on the gas pedal maybe I should take it in to the dealer to have them look at it?


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## bokiNY (Nov 26, 2008)

*Re: (ViRtUaLheretic)*

Well, I think that k03 is a bit bigger than the TSI's IHI unit (from what people observed) so it might provide a nice little gain especially if used in pair with Forge's WG. You could probably find a used k03 from people that did upgrade theirs for substantially less than new k04 plus manifold plus dv relocate plus tune and etc. And how come that nobody is intrigued by this set up, at least to prove the point and be the first one out there to test it. I'm just not sure about the TSI's ECU - would it be ok with the k03? Someone try this please! Fixing that freaking rattling noise with this might be worth a couple of hunderd bucks for used k03 even if it doesn't mean increase in hp. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## boatvolt (Jan 17, 2010)

Alright, maybe it's not a problem. 
Nearly 300 posts in this thread, but not a problem...
In any case, it's not MY problem.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (boatvolt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *boatvolt* »_Alright, maybe it's not a problem. 
Nearly 300 posts in this thread, but not a problem...
In any case, it's not MY problem.

I'm with the guy above, this is not a problem and post counts don't mean a thing. When the engine starts failing then call it a problem, until then it's an annoyance. People stating that they can't believe VW isn't doing anything about it need to think twice. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it a problem. Hey, I don't quite like my exhaust note, maybe I'll gather a couple of people that think the same and call it a problem in the hopes that VW calls for a recalls the damn things and puts a louder one in. 
If post counts meant a thing then MKIV R32 cars would have had a recall to deal with their raspy exhaust a long time ago.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (aladro)*

We can debate whether or not it's a fixable "problem" forever. 
"Problem" or not, the question remains... Why do some cars exhibit the noise and others don't? If it's "normal", then ALL of the EA888 2.0 TFSI engines should make the noise. If that's the case, on those engines that don't have the noise, then THEY have a problem. There is *something* different about some of our 2.0TFSI's, and that's cause for concern. A manufacturing tolerance error? Bad batch of wastegates? Heinz sleeping again in the assembly bay in Ingolstadt? Bad Karma?
I obviously can't speak for anyone else, but in my case, the '09 A3 that I test drove *DID NOT* make the noise. This car & test drives are what sold me on the A3. My A3, found at a different dealer and shipped to me, DOES make the noise. And yes, shame on me for not taking another thorough test drive when I took delivery of my car. That is my fault and I blame no one else. But I wasn't expecting this sort of "sample variation". 
At 10k miles, I've now had sufficient time to (mostly) just "get over it" and worry about the myriad of bigger problems in life. But as my first VAG product, it's an interesting lesson in what "normal" is. VAG can and likely will choose to ignore the complaint. And that's fine. Their prerogative. They got their money from me. But it's entirely likely it'll be the last time they ever do, if this is the 'way of VAG'. Lesson learned, when it comes to VAG, caveat emptor. 
The part that disappoints me is when I give a ride to others in my car, and *they* notice the noise. As they inevitably ask what the noise is, and I tell 'em, "It's the engine, and the dealer says it's normal.". Their response, "oh, doesn't sound right." Yep. My point exactly. I've already had one co-worker that was seriously thinking about buying a GTI VI that now isn't because of this noise, which is really sad considering how great of a car the GTI is.


_Modified by BigStig at 6:51 AM 1/18/2010_


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_We can debate whether or not it's a fixable "problem" forever. 
"Problem" or not, the question remains... Why do some cars exhibit the noise and others don't? If it's "normal", then ALL of the EA888 2.0 TFSI engines should make the noise. If that's the case, on those engines that don't have the noise, then THEY have a problem. There is *something* different about some of our 2.0TFSI's, and that's cause for concern. A manufacturing tolerance error? Bad batch of wastegates? Heinz sleeping again in the assembly bay in Ingolstadt? Bad Karma?
I obviously can't speak for anyone else, but in my case, the '09 A3 that I test drove *DID NOT* make the noise. This car & test drives are what sold me on the A3. My A3, found at a different dealer and shipped to me, DOES make the noise. And yes, shame on me for not taking another thorough test drive when I took delivery of my car. That is my fault and I blame no one else. But I wasn't expecting this sort of "sample variation". 
At 10k miles, I've now had sufficient time to (mostly) just "get over it" and worry about the myriad of bigger problems in life. But as my first VAG product, it's an interesting lesson in what "normal" is. VAG can and likely will choose to ignore the complaint. And that's fine. Their prerogative. They got their money from me. But it's entirely likely it'll be the last time they ever do, if this is the 'way of VAG'. Lesson learned, when it comes to VAG, caveat emptor. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 


Did the A3 not make the noise or did you not hear it. Most people bought their cars and did not hear during the test drive. Did you test drive the A3 under the right conditions. There are times when I hear it more than others, don't know if it's due to temperature or humidity but sometimes it's more audible than others. As far as I'm concerned ALL TSI engines have a rattling waster gate.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (aladro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *aladro* »_
Did the A3 not make the noise or did you not hear it. Most people bought their cars and did not hear during the test drive. Did you test drive the A3 under the right conditions. There are times when I hear it more than others, don't know if it's due to temperature or humidity but sometimes it's more audible than others. As far as I'm concerned ALL TSI engines have a rattling waster gate.


I did not hear anything like it on the test drives. Since the noise happens under perfectly normal, every-day acceleration on my car, I'm 100% certain that I drove the tester in such a manner that it would have produced the noise. Perhaps the tester was a quieter example while mine is a louder example. I don't know. But it backs the theory that some have the noise and some don't, just as we've got some people posting that they don't have the noise.
But I do agree that it is widespread. I've since witnessed the noise in another 2009 A3 and a 2009 GTI. No idea about that tester. Weird, I agree. 


_Modified by BigStig at 7:10 AM 1-18-2010_


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## boatvolt (Jan 17, 2010)

It might be a good idea to have a signed statement from the dealer that this is normal. It would make it easier to explain when it comes time to sell to someone who has not had the benefit of the information in this forum.


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## boatvolt (Jan 17, 2010)

Not sure if this has been posted before:
http://www.sciroccocentral.co....rt=20

Technical product information Transaction No.: 2021062/1 
Rattling noises from engine/exhaust system Release date: 10-Jul-2009 
Customer statement / workshop findings
Rattling or jarring noise from the engine compartment / exhaust system when accelerating between 2400 and 3000 rpm . 
Technical background
Waste gate adjustment rod of the turbo charger rattles when accelerating.
Production change
---
Measure
Do not repair, the noises are construction-related and normal. There is no parts damage.
Warranty accounting instructions
This is no fault in the sense of warranty.


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## VAJetta2.0 (Jan 20, 2010)

2010 Jetta 2.0 5200 miles
Captured the rattle...sorry for the background noise. Obviously everybody knows what it sounds like but for what its worth...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONcIZnefqxs


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (VAJetta2.0)*

Good work. Yep. That's precisely what I'm hearing.


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## super steve (Nov 23, 2009)

*Re: (VAJetta2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VAJetta2.0* »_2010 Jetta 2.0 5200 miles
Captured the rattle...sorry for the background noise. Obviously everybody knows what it sounds like but for what its worth...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONcIZnefqxs

I have this noise really bad on my 2010 mk6 GTI (bad meaning you can hear it clearly even with the windows rolled up)
Although I can make out the sound, I am sure a person who previously hasnt heard it wont be able to differentiate on that video...
I will see if I can record mine sometime.


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## VAJetta2.0 (Jan 20, 2010)

Yeah...sorry for the impromtu video...I'll see if I can get a better one when it's not raining


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## evoljetta (Dec 26, 1999)

*Re: (VAJetta2.0)*

Interesting..thought I was going insane...2010 gti..i also have that exact noise..odd thing is(may be all in my mind) when I do have this noise(somewhat intermittent) the car seems to lack a bit of the punch...when i dont hear it..goes like a raped ape...when it does happen its between 2200-3000k..


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (evoljetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *evoljetta* »_Interesting..thought I was going insane...2010 gti..i also have that exact noise..odd thing is(may be all in my mind) when I do have this noise(somewhat intermittent) the car seems to lack a bit of the punch...when i dont hear it..goes like a raped ape...when it does happen its between 2200-3000k..









DEF not intermittent - its 100% there ALL the time. And DEF not a loss in power - simply something rattling
VERY annoying coming from a German product - very diappointing


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

*Re: (super steve)*

Mine too - same sound - good job capturing it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I posted on this thread months ago when I got my 09 GTI TSI. Since then I removed the noise box and it's a little less noticeable. Next week I will install the AWE downpipe (was a possible cause at one point on this thread). Not sure if that solve the problem but it will help "hide" the noise.


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

*Re: (kirkbar)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kirkbar* »_ Next week I will install the AWE downpipe (was a possible cause at one point on this thread). Not sure if that solve the problem but it will help "hide" the noise.

umm no. it will be even louder, as it will have less muffling it.


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## jase-dk (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: (placenta)*

I also get this rough "rrrrrrrh" sound during accelaration between 2.300 and 3.000 RPM. My car is a 2008 VW Passat CC 1.8 TSi.
I mostly get this during medium and heavy acceleration in 2nd and 3rd gear (I have manual). The engine performance is fine, and the engine uses no or very little oil (i have 48.000 km on it).
Comming from BMW this sound is a real pain. It's not a sporty sound and if I did not know any better I would think that something was wrong with the engine.
I subscribe to the wastegate theory.
JASE
Denmark, Scandinavia


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## jase-dk (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: (jase-dk)*

I just listened to VWJetta2.0 video on you tube. After this I am not sure about the sound.
Is the the faint "tin foile being shaked" sound, or is the engine sound getting a bit more loud and "Raaaaaaah" like.
What I am hearing between 2.300 and 3.000 RPM is the "Raaaaaah" sound.
Are we all talking about the same sound here? - some are describing the sound as "marbels in a can".
JASE-DK


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

The sound was different on my 2009 GLI and my new GTI - same RPM range similar noise - its a loose peace of something that need to secure or replace - probably simple but costly to "get to" is my guess why they are avoiding it.


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## hruinoll (Jan 2, 2010)

Haha, I was just about to post a thread about this noise, good thing I found this one.
I thought that maybe since I'm new to VWs, 2.0T, and turbos in general that I may simply be retarded and misunderstanding some very basic thing... but so many people are concerned about it as well. 
Just to confirm: I hear the noise from about 2000-2500 to 3000-3200 rpm, it sounds sort of like a mix between a snake hiss and a ball of tinfoil rattling around in a can - "shshshhshhhkskksksh" (this is such a hard thing to describe accurately). Is that pretty much what we're talking about? I don't think there's any power loss, I've only got about 800 miles on my car and it's been making the noise since day one I think. My car is a 2010 GTI.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

YUP - that would be it - welcome to the club.


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## hruinoll (Jan 2, 2010)

God damn it
Has anyone tried contacting some sites or shows about this, like NPS's Car Talk or Edmunds?


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## super steve (Nov 23, 2009)

*Re: (hruinoll)*

It was raining where I live... pretty wet up here in Toronto.
I couldnt recreate the sound in the wet. I heard it vaguely the first time when I tried to make the noise, but it was really hard to distinguish from the noise that water + tires make on mine and others' cars on the road.
After it stopped raining, I could not recreate the sound... 2k to 3k in gears 1 to 4, I could not get it... (didnt try the other gears because I was going fast enough)
I will have to wait and see what happens once its dry out. Have you guys noticed this?


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## super steve (Nov 23, 2009)

*Re: (super steve)*

never mind... its dry today and the noise still exists


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## jase-dk (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: (super steve)*

I am still not totally clear about the sound. My engine gets louder when I push it in 2nd and 3rd gear between 2.300 and 3.000 RPM.
I am not surprise that the engine (or exhaust) makes more noise in this situation but the noise in not exactly "sporty". It's kind of a "rough" noise as the engine/exhaust goes from a soft wisper to "rrraaaaaa" between 2.300 and 3.000 RPM.
After 3.000 RPM the engine is again still. Also there is not much engine noise at high speeds (not even if I floor the pedal).
Would be great if someone could record the sound.
BR:
JASE


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (super steve)*

Mine does it in the wet, dry, hot, cold, whatever. Cold engine, hot engine, whatever.
About the only time I don't hear it is when accelerating on a slippery road. But then, the only reason I don't is because I'd be accelerating lightly and keeping the RPM's below 2,000.








The noise has been described over and over. But if you don't hear it or want to know what it sounds like, it's pretty simple. Take an empty metal coffee can. An empty Campbell's or Chunky soup can would also work. Dump a handful of 1/2 inch metal nails in it. Maybe a couple dozen. Now swirl those nails around the inside of the can like you were mixing a drink. That's darn-near exactly the noise that I'm hearing. A "swishing", rattling, metallic noise. 
Engine sounds fine below 2k. And wonderful from 3k to redline. But like an old, beat-up rice burner with a POS exhaust from about 2,200-3,000. It is annoying.


_Modified by BigStig at 4:12 PM 1-25-2010_


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_
Engine sounds fine below 2k. And wonderful from 3k to redline. But like an old, beat-up rice burner with a POS exhaust from about 2,200-3,000. It is annoying.



Perfect description! All the more reason to floor it!


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## Rumit (Apr 5, 2008)

I don't mean this in a smart alecky way, but did you guys not hear this on the test drives before you bought your car?


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: (Rumit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rumit* »_I don't mean this in a smart alecky way, but did you guys not hear this on the test drives before you bought your car?

In my case, the 2009.5 A3 that I test drove didn't make the noise. The 2009.5 A3 that I purchased does make the noise. Identical cars, other than the color. 
Yes, in hindsight, I should have test driven *my* A3 before taking delivery. My fault, 100%. But I just sort of assumed it'd be like every other brand-new car I've ever purchased in that there wouldn't be any "sample variation" in engine noise between identical models.








Lesson learned.


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## boatvolt (Jan 17, 2010)

Reply from VWoA:
Reference # 100037188 

Dear Bob: 

Thank you for your interest in our products and your e-mail in regard to the GTI MK6. I understand you are considering purchasing this vehicle and you are concerned about an engine rattle, and you would like to know what has been done to correct this concern on our upcoming models. As a potential new member of the Volkswagen family your questions are important to me, and I appreciate the opportunity to respond. 

We strive to design a vehicle that is safe, reliable, and fun to drive. Here at the Customer CARE Center we provide our customers with warranty information and repair updates. We rely on our dealerships to be our technical resources, and to provide our customers the answers they are seeking regarding drivability and vehicle concerns. Our records do not indicate an engine rattle as being a common concern with this vehicle. It is because of this I would be unable to provide you an answer in regard to a correction for this concern. I encourage you to take some time exploring the vehicle you are planning to purchase. Please drive it and discuss it with the dealership, both sales and service. We understand that purchasing a new vehicle is a big investment. Our dealerships are in place to help you make the right decision, and to help you feel comfortable with your purchase. My hope is we will get the opportunity to welcome you to the Volkswagen family very soon! 

As a potential new member of the Volkswagen family, your questions are important to us. Again, thank you for your e-mail. If I may be of further assistance regarding this, or any other matter, please don’t hesitate to contact me again by e-mail at http://www.vw.com, or through our Customer CARE Center at (800) 822-8987. If I am not available, one of my colleagues will be able to assist you.
Sincerely,

Tracy Goralczyk 
Ext. 43594
Customer CARE Advocate

I fowarded this thread, asked for reply.


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## kirkbar (Jun 5, 2000)

*Re: (placenta)*

The AWE downpipe makes the exhaust sound LOUDER - that said - I notice the rattle much less now. Now add an catback and I bet the noise is undetectable.


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

*Re: (kirkbar)*

Im still not sure what sounds you guys are talking about.
This thread is 10 pages long, and been around for OVER a year now.....
For the love of god, somebody record a decent video of the sound.
Untill then I think all yall are crazy


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (boatvolt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *boatvolt* »_Reply from VWoA:
Reference # 100037188 

Dear Bob: 

Thank you for your interest in our products and your e-mail in regard to the GTI MK6. I understand you are considering purchasing this vehicle and you are concerned about an engine rattle, and you would like to know what has been done to correct this concern on our upcoming models. As a potential new member of the Volkswagen family your questions are important to me, and I appreciate the opportunity to respond. 

We strive to design a vehicle that is safe, reliable, and fun to drive. Here at the Customer CARE Center we provide our customers with warranty information and repair updates. We rely on our dealerships to be our technical resources, and to provide our customers the answers they are seeking regarding drivability and vehicle concerns. Our records do not indicate an engine rattle as being a common concern with this vehicle. It is because of this I would be unable to provide you an answer in regard to a correction for this concern. I encourage you to take some time exploring the vehicle you are planning to purchase. Please drive it and discuss it with the dealership, both sales and service. We understand that purchasing a new vehicle is a big investment. Our dealerships are in place to help you make the right decision, and to help you feel comfortable with your purchase. My hope is we will get the opportunity to welcome you to the Volkswagen family very soon! 

As a potential new member of the Volkswagen family, your questions are important to us. Again, thank you for your e-mail. If I may be of further assistance regarding this, or any other matter, please don’t hesitate to contact me again by e-mail at http://www.vw.com, or through our Customer CARE Center at (800) 822-8987. If I am not available, one of my colleagues will be able to assist you.
Sincerely,

Tracy Goralczyk 
Ext. 43594
Customer CARE Advocate

I fowarded this thread, asked for reply.

Interestingly enough, when dealership service departments make inquiries to VW about the noise, the response is that it's the waste gate but when a potential customer makes an inquiry about it, they don't have it on record. Sounds like the common premature radiator fan failure on the MKIV that my dealership said "oh yea, we get a lot of those" but VWoA customer service had nothing on record.


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## jase-dk (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: (ViRtUaLheretic)*

Actually, I think the engine sounds a bit like a diesel between 2.300 and 3.000 RPM. However, it only happens under pressure. Apart from the, the engine is smooth and noise free.


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## BoostedEG6 (May 12, 2006)

*Re: (jase-dk)*

I will work on trying to get a video of the noise. But there is so much ambient noise going on while the car is under load (only time I hear the noise) its even hard for a human ear to catch let alone a mic. I test drove two of these 10' GTI's from the dealer with 10mi or less on each and the noise was present on BOTH manual GTI's. On colder starts you can actually feel a vibration from the noise. SOMEONE NEEDS TO FIGURE THIS OUT lol.


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## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

*Re: (BoostedEG6)*

Not to sound like a douche but this might be one of those "normal" noises that never get fixed. If its operating to design and doing what its supposed to do, I don't think they will fix something thats not broken. Look at the noise that comes from the high pressure pump, tick tick tick tick. Thats just the way its going to be and there is no fix for it.


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## boatvolt (Jan 17, 2010)

Update from VWoA:

Reference # 100037188 

Dear Bob:

Thank you for responding to my e-mail in regard to the GTI. I understand you are seeking for me to view the website link you have provided and then respond to you. I appreciate the opportunity to respond. 

It is not possible for me to promise you that any vehicle you purchase will never experience a concern. All vehicles are driven and cared for differently by each owner. I can tell you that at this time we do not have any indication that the concern you are reading about is an ongoing concern with all the new GTI’s. I have received the website you sent to me to review; however, I am not able to comment on this website as it not authorized by Volkswagen. 

If I may be of further assistance regarding this, or any other matter, please don’t hesitate to contact me again by e-mail at http://www.vw.com, or through our Customer CARE Center at (800) 822-8987. If I am not available, one of my colleagues will be able to assist you.
Sincerely,

Tracy Goralczyk 
Ext. 43594
Customer CARE Advocate


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## hodag (Feb 8, 2010)

I have the same exact rattle - I described it to my dealer as a tinny rattle that sounds like a loose heat shield. This does only happen at a certain engine rpm in the 2500 range. My dealer took a day and a half to pull my dash because they blamed it on something loose behind the dash. I got it back - 13 days later - and still have the same rattle. 
I suggest that everyone that has this problem email VW customer care. Maybe if they get several hundred/thousand emails or letters, they may change their tune. Frankly, this rattle bugs the living **** out of me. I hear it every time I accelerate....EVERY time. 
Come on people - only WE can get VW to listen!!


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (hodag)*


_Quote, originally posted by *hodag* »_My dealer took a day and a half to pull my dash because they blamed it on something loose behind the dash. I got it back - 13 days later - and still have the same rattle. 


Wow! Talk about incompetence! 
My car is going in for its first oil change Saturday. I will mention this buzz-rattle _again_.

__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view









I'm learning to live with the awful racket, but it still bothers me. I can't wait till I get to drive with the windows down http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA*

I have called, written and spoken to numerous people at VWofAmeerica and they could care less.
Granted this is probably not a huge deal and juts something loose... but I strongly believe that VW needs to correct it - whether its dangerous or not - new cars do not make these sounds. This is my 2nd vehicle with the same annoying noise.
Toyota ignored their customers as well and look what happen to them after the NHTSA department received tons of calls issues etc...
I suggest everyone that is sick of this issue - to CALL and EMAIL NHTSA and COMPLAIN. VW will take note very very quickly I presume especially with whats going on with Toyota.
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/porta...08a0c/
NHTSA Headquarters
1200 New Jersey Avenue, SE
West Building
Washington, DC 20590
Toll-Free: 1-888-327-4236


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_I have called, written and spoken to numerous people at VWofAmeerica and they could care less.
Granted this is probably not a huge deal and juts something loose... but I strongly believe that VW needs to correct it - whether its dangerous or not - new cars do not make these sounds. This is my 2nd vehicle with the same annoying noise.
Toyota ignored their customers as well and look what happen to them after the NHTSA department received tons of calls issues etc...
I suggest everyone that is sick of this issue - to CALL and EMAIL NHTSA and COMPLAIN. VW will take note very very quickly I presume especially with whats going on with Toyota.
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/porta...08a0c/
NHTSA Headquarters
1200 New Jersey Avenue, SE
West Building
Washington, DC 20590
Toll-Free: 1-888-327-4236 

This is a prime example of what ignorance on the internet can lead to. Lets all get together and tell NHTSA how unsafe our cars are due to a noise. Do not make an attempt to try to compare this to Toyota's issue. Never has my gas pedal gotten stuck or has my car put me in danger.
If the first car you bought made a noise that annoyed you then you should have never bought the second one. 
The NHTSA is going to tell VW to investigate the problem which they already have. IT'S YOUR WASTE GATE and that's the end of the story. NOTHING UNSAFE ABOUT THAT.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (aladro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *aladro* »_
This is a prime example of what ignorance on the internet can lead to. Lets all get together and tell NHTSA how unsafe our cars are due to a noise. Do not make an attempt to try to compare this to Toyota's issue. Never has my gas pedal gotten stuck or has my car put me in danger.
If the first car you bought made a noise that annoyed you then you should have never bought the second one. 
The NHTSA is going to tell VW to investigate the problem which they already have. IT'S YOUR WASTE GATE and that's the end of the story. NOTHING UNSAFE ABOUT THAT.

aladro - if you don't have a problem with your car - then why are you on here - please avoid this topic if your fine with the issue.
I did NOT say its LIKE the Toyota issue at all - if you can read...
I received a letter from VW stating that the sound is "as designed" (They did NOT say it was the wastegate) to operate - which is complete BS.
Internet brings guys like you in that are bored and feel the need to respond to every forum topic.
This information is for people that are NOT happy with their cars due to this issue - so please start your own topic about how you have figured it out and tell other how to fix - but please stay our of this topic - thank you.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_
aladro - if you don't have a problem with your car - then why are you on here - please avoid this topic if your fine with the issue.
I did NOT say its LIKE the Toyota issue at all - if you can read...
I received a letter from VW stating that the sound is "as designed" (They did NOT say it was the wastegate) to operate - which is complete BS.
Internet brings guys like you in that are bored and feel the need to respond to every forum topic.
This information is for people that are NOT happy with their cars due to this issue - so please start your own topic about how you have figured it out and tell other how to fix - but please stay our of this topic - thank you.

Since you are so quick to point out the fact that I didn't read, I suppose it's only fair that I do the same. Go back and read the last 10 pages, and then you'll see my contributions to this. Go back and read how this issue has already been identified as the waste gate. Go on the TSI forum and read other post regarding this same issue (don't forget to read my contributions) and read all about the waste gate. 
I will also ask you to not be an cyber thug and not send me IMs calling names and pointing out that that my profile says R32. My response to that falls into "read the last 10 pages", I've cleared that up before.
Toyota ignored a safety issue, so any backlash they receive is well deserved. Please tell me where VW has ignored a safety issue.
Yes, I own a car with a 2.0 TSI that happens to make a noise but I am missing where this noise falls under "safety". No, I am not bored. I track this topic, in case maybe something arises and because I get a kick out of ignorant posts. For those reasons I will continue to post here as I please. 
Please go on and answer why it is that you bought a second car with a TSI motor in it if the noise bothered you so much. I can only image that you test drove it and heard the issue. Buy 2 cars and then complain about it, that sounds rational to me. 
If you really feel the need to respond to me, send me a private message. Let's keep this post about the noise and not about you and me.
I understand that you are not happy about the noise, but think about what you are asking people to do. You are asking people to place a complaint with National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. Key part, "safety". If you want to rip them apart on consumer reports, I would say go for it, but this is not a safety issue.
Instead of creating my own post about how to fix it, I'll just summarize what has already been said on this one. It's the waste gate. How to remedy? Change your turbo to something else. Some people have had success with replacing their down pipe. Others have not. I've pointed out that the noise seems to have died down a bit after putting miles on the car. Others have seconded that while others have said that the noise level has not changed.


_Modified by aladro at 10:32 PM 3-2-2010_


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (aladro)*

ALADRO - GET LOST and leave me alone - get a life - please


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## SilverRubicon (Jan 9, 2009)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_ALADRO - GET LOST and leave me alone - get a life - please

I'm with aladro. Not a safety issue and his previous post was well stated.


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## Frankie92481 (Dec 22, 2005)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (SilverRubicon)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SilverRubicon* »_
I'm with aladro. Not a safety issue and his previous post was well stated.

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## super steve (Nov 23, 2009)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (Frankie92481)*

no need to say tell each other to get lost...
Anyways, hopefully with mileage , my car's rattle will reduce


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## wildeman940 (Sep 2, 2009)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (SilverRubicon)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SilverRubicon* »_
I'm with aladro. Not a safety issue and his previous post was well stated.

Agree. Plus I find the strange throttle lag after shifting on some of these TSI models more annoying because performance is actually effected.

 [URL]http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4637088 [/URL] 


_Modified by wildeman940 at 10:09 PM 3-4-2010_


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (super steve)*


_Quote, originally posted by *super steve* »_no need to say tell each other to get lost...
Anyways, hopefully with mileage , my car's rattle will reduce


Seems to be the case with my wife's Tiguan. I hardly ever hear it.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (ryan mills)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ryan mills* »_

Seems to be the case with my wife's Tiguan. I hardly ever hear it. 

A while back I posted that it seemed like the noise had died down a bit. This weekend brought nice whether and I was able to ride with the windows down. I am happy to report that the noise is pretty much non existent.


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (aladro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *aladro* »_
A while back I posted that it seemed like the noise had died down a bit. This weekend brought nice whether and I was able to ride with the windows down. I am happy to report that the noise is pretty much non existent. 

Good for you! Mine still buzzes like something's going to fall off. Sounds terrible http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (velocidub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *velocidub* »_
Good for you! Mine still buzzes like something's going to fall off. Sounds terrible http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 

Hmm.... My wifes Tiguan has 20,000 miles. How many have you racked up? Maybe it takes a long time for the wastegate to get enough gunk on it for it to quiet down.


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## BigStig (Aug 18, 2009)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (ryan mills)*

12,000 miles on my '09 A3 TFSI. There's been no change to the sound since mile 150 when I first heard it. No louder, no quieter, and exhibits the same characteristics as it always has.
For those that had the noise but now don't, please tell the rest of us about when you noticed the noise quieting down.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (BigStig)*

Same noise level here since mile 1
@4,000 now


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: Going to the next level - VW could care-less - Everyone Needs to Call the NHTSA (BigStig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BigStig* »_12,000 miles on my '09 A3 TFSI. There's been no change to the sound since mile 150 when I first heard it. No louder, no quieter, and exhibits the same characteristics as it always has.
For those that had the noise but now don't, please tell the rest of us about when you noticed the noise quieting down.

I noticed the noise during the my original test drive. APR tune at 1K miles. Noise seemed to die down a bit at around 6K miles. At 10.5K miles now and the noise is hardly audible. I believe I hear something at times but only because I know what I'm listening for. If I didn't know the noise existed before, I would never hear it now. Maybe the tune put more stress on the waste gate? Maybe my driving style put more stress on the waste gate? My short commute to work is all city miles. The weekend is mostly the only time that the car sees the highway. Maybe the waste gate gets more use because of the stop and go traffic. Turbo starts to spool at 1700 rpms right?
I've been trying to see if I can hear the noise for the past 3 days. I installed the BFI torque arm insert this weekend so 2 out of the last 3 days of me trying to listen for the noise were under different conditions than the last 10.5K miles. However, those last 2 days, seemed to be the same noise level wise as the first day without the insert.


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## bokiNY (Nov 26, 2008)

09 GLI here w/ APR S2 and 30k miles - the noise seems to be almost non existent now (annoyed the hell out of me at the beginning though). I'd say that it gradually got quieter from 20k to 30k.


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## galvo (Jun 14, 2006)

I love how the customer CARE (?) specialist said there are no signs of this being a widespread issue.
Bitch, just talk to 10 TSI owners and I bet you at least 9 of the 10 owners would state that their car is affected.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Re: (galvo)*

I was also told by Customer Careless that this engine was DESIGNED to make these noises by the Engineers in Germany - I have a former letter from VW of A stating exactly that.
Its just insulting dealing with them.


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## galvo (Jun 14, 2006)

*Re: (zerostudio)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerostudio* »_I was also told by Customer Careless that this engine was DESIGNED to make these noises by the Engineers in Germany - I have a former letter from VW of A stating exactly that.
Its just insulting dealing with them.

You should have wiped your ass with the letter prior to sending it back to them.


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## sutts (Mar 10, 2010)

Hello from the not-so-sunny UK. 
Been following this thread with interest as I have a new (in November 2009) Skoda Octavia vRS estate with the blown 2.0 TSI engine, and it has exactly the same engine noise between 2.3-2.9k rpm as described above i.e. nails in a tin can/rattlesnake etc. Very annoying!
My dealer is sympathetic and has contacted Skoda UK who say (funnily enough) they are unaware of any problems, but I know of at least one Skoda vRS owner over here who rejected his new car purely because of this noise. The dealer agrees that it is likely to be the wastegate valve. I have a remap waiting to go on which, as a by-product, I hope may help. 
I just thought I would post this out of VAG owner sympathy and hope that at some point someone will come up with a workable solution?!


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## jase-dk (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: (sutts)*

I think i managed to record the sound in my 1.8TSi Passat CC.
ftp://ftp.selco.com/public/Passat18Tsi.mp3
I have manual transmission. What you hear is first moderate acceleration in 1st. gear, then change to 2nd. (the click), then moderate acceleration from 2.000 to 3.000 RPM.
Notice how the engine get more load and rough in 2nd between 2.000 and 3.000 RPM. After 3.000 RPM it the sound become less pronounced and more smooth again.
Is this the sound you are all talking about?
I have no noticable oil consumption and no engine fault codes.
JASE-DK


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## jase-dk (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: (jase-dk)*

And my car is all stock... no engine tuning and no fancy exhaust








2008 model / 50.000 km.
JASE-DK


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## jase-dk (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: (jase-dk)*

I have just been to the dealer for a test drive together with a mechanic. They say that the sound i normal and that it is caused by some inlet valves opening around 2.000 RPM to give the engine additional boost.
They showed me some nice looking drawings of the engines internal parts and what they said seems plausible.
Provided that the sound is normal it does'nt bother me.
JASE-DK


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## O_o (Nov 12, 2009)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti (goudok)*

Just came across this. Apologies if this has already been posted. Don't have the time to read through 400 posts:

_Quote »_Technical product information Transaction No.: 2021062/1
Rattling noises from engine/exhaust system Release date: 10-Jul-2009
Customer statement / workshop findings
Rattling or jarring noise from the engine compartment / exhaust system when accelerating between 2400 and 3000 rpm .
Technical background
Waste gate adjustment rod of the turbo charger rattles when accelerating.
Production change
---
Measure
Do not repair, the noises are construction-related and normal. There is no parts damage.
Warranty accounting instructions
This is no fault in the sense of warranty.

Edit: Taken from the MkVI forum, not official VW communication.
Side note: This bugs me when I drive my wife's '10 Wolf, because I try to make the noise. She just drives the car and doesn't care. She also has a lead foot, which helps.


_Modified by  at 10:43 PM 3/19/2010_


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: weird sound question 09 gti ()*


_Quote, originally posted by ** »_ She just drives the car and doesn't care. She also has a lead foot, which helps.

_Modified by  at 10:43 PM 3/19/2010_

Yeah, if you drive with a heavy foot you don't hear the sound over the engine. But, one of the amazing things about the 2.0T is the torque and speed it builds at low rpm. It buzzes and rattles at a sweet spot in the rpm range. Between 2-2500 I believe. When I had an 06 GTI manual I would shift at that rpm all the time because it was a very smooth spot to shift.


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## tebby (Nov 24, 2009)

*Re: (BigStig)*

I'm with you, I've dealt with this issue for 6900 miles, I didn't buy a car that likes to sound like a can of marbles rattling every time i accelerate between 1500-3000 RPM. I'll buy a different turbo manufactured vehicle next time. Lesson learned, like people previously mentioned, this was my first turbo and first vw purchased, when I asked the salesman what that noise was and he said oh thats nothing to worry about that's the turbo, and since riding around in some other turbo charged cars that actually make a turbo spool whine vs. this garbage sound i'll take my business elsewhere next time.. eff you vw simple as that.


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## Milo1975 (Feb 16, 2010)

*Re: (tebby)*

Maybe someone with an aftermarket or upgraded diverter valve could chime in and let us know if the noise was resolved by doing the swap.
Anyone here the noise until they changed / upgraded the diverter valve??


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## SilverRubicon (Jan 9, 2009)

*Re: (tebby)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tebby* »_I asked the salesman what that noise was and he said oh thats nothing to worry about that's the turbo

Yet you still purchased the vehicle.


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

*2010 audi a3 - same problem!!*

i have a 2010 A3 with 800 miles on it and man this stupid noise is bugging the hell out of me. I just noticed it over the weekend.. it isint noticeable if i open the sunroof or turn on the radio.. just a nice low rattle right in the sweet spot at 2300 - 3000 rpm, in any gear. WTH! What im really suprised about is that i never noticed it earlier in the few weeks ive had the car - i do remember noticing this after getting gas at a texaco vs a shell (where i normally go.) There MUST be a way to get rid of this noise.. 

1) im going to try shell gas again and see if that makes any difference
2) install a noisy roof rack on the car to diffuse the sound hopefully ?? my thule rack is in the mail!


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

AWE K04 kit. More power, no rattle. Not the cheapest solution, but it works. Apr stage III is another solution to the issue. I bet the Forge Wastegate actuator would also solve the problem, but it's a bit of work to get to.


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

i spent a good two hours at mile one tisher in silver spring, md today trying to figure out a cure for this noise.. Like others noticed, all the 2.0t a3s have it.. Test drove mine and then another new one on the lot --- same thing. However, what of note is that even though the it sounds like the rattle is coming from the engine bay, im pretty convinced now that its from the exhaust.. 

1) All windows are up, sitting in the drivers seat, it sounds like its coming from the front passenger side
2) Sitting in the passenger seat it sounds like its coming from the rear of the car
3) If you put the drivers side window down, it is most definately audible from the rear of the car, and a bit raspy instead of metallic (which is what we hear with the windows up). 

So, defiantely the exhaust.. has anyone been able to get rid of it with an aftermarket exhaust ? 

The service guy wants me to bring the car in again next week to see if they can do something about it -- make sure heatshields are not too tight etc.. but beyond that they wont be able to do anything. 

I was also thinking that if it is indeed the exhaust, swapping it out or even wrapping some heat wrap on the pipes might get rid of it ??


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

Frankie92481 said:


> After installing my Intake and Downpipe I can't hear the noise anymore.
> It may just be due to me hearing the exhaust more... but not sure...


has anyone tried an intake and/or exhaust replacement on the A3 ? did it take care of it ?


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## FullP (Apr 28, 2007)

I also have that noise. Late 2009 A3 2.0T (CCZA) DSG. Looks like VW/AUDI has not done anything to fix this. It's annoying and there should be a recall, but I doubt we will see a fix for this. I am surprised it's not the downpipe. I guess we will all have to live with the noise. :screwy:


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

here is another capture of the noise right around 2k rpm and on - 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7l_ylFfdEs


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4867840-Rattle-on-acceleration&p=65942758&posted=1

Is the the first docmented solution .. see the last post from today! K&N filter drowns the noise on the CC.

here is the equivalent filter for the a3
http://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?Prod=57-0618-1


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Getting Louder*

Mine is getting louder and more annoying - this is ridiculous already. 
I am at 6,500 miles and its twice as loud since new.


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

so im convinced that the noise is coming from the exhaust system. drove a brand new vw jeta for 50-60 miles with the 2.5 (non turbo) engine over the weekend. the rattle is even louder in that car and stays on till 4000 rpm (even worse than the a3). with the windows down the exhaust note is identical to the A3, and the rattle cannot be heard (just a raspy exhaust note at that rpm, just like my car). 

I think its really as simple as that, there is something about the way the exhaust is designed in these cars (turbo or not) - i bet the heatsheilds are similarly placed and the downpipe is similar as well. 

After the jetta experience, at least from my pov its not the diverter valve, or the wastegate, or the turbo spoolup. Still need to take the car to the dealer so they can put chassis ears and try and detect the source. im hoping its one of the heatshields.


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## VeeDub Racer (Jan 24, 2002)

*It's the Exhaust... At least on my car.*

Hey guys. So I just switched my down pipe to the new EuroJet modular 3" system. I now no longer have the chchchchchchch sound at 2500rpm. When we pulled the factory down pip out of the car, all I could hear was chchchchch as we were trying to maneuver it out of the tight space. Once it was out, it was noticable that the flex section of the exhaust is VERY flexy and the chain mail looking covering over it acts like a Shekere as the pipe flexes: 









Anyway, now you can hear the turbo spool and the waste gate actuate, which is more of a shhhhhh shhhh sound, but there is DEFINITELY no chchchchchch sound anymore. 

Comparing the two exhaust sections side by side:


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## VeeDub Racer (Jan 24, 2002)

And btw, with the resonator on the dp and the factory cat-back installed, there is nearly 0 increase in exhaust volume, so I know that the exhaust note is not just covering up the chchchchch sound.


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## Fignewton (Jun 12, 2007)

Silly question. Do you think a DV Spacer would affect the sound? Either lessen it by allowing air to escape, or even drown it out sound wise?


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## CandyWhiteTSi (Jul 22, 2004)

Hmmm.... I should have my Eurojet dp installed hopefully within a week or so, whenever I get it... I will be sure to see if the rattle chhchchch noise is gone for me as well.. The only difference with mine, is I have no resonator.


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## Aguilar (Jan 28, 2006)

Nothing new here, just another new 09 GLI with the rattling noise. Glad to know it's normal. It also has the common dash vent rattle and wind noise coming from the driver's rear view mirror housing that wasn't present in any of my previous 3 MkVs.


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## pjunk1 (May 13, 2010)

man, this was one of the first things i noticed on my new '10 A3 2.0t. i heard it durring the test drive as well. now, i have about 1800 miles on it and still has THE noise. i created a thread in another forum but most didn't know what i was referring to but it appears everyone here does. i wanted to see if other 2.0 tsi cars had it. so, i took out my neighbor's '09 TT and sure enough it has it as well. the funny thing is my neighbor never noticed it til i pointed it out. i think this is the case for many tsi owners.

has anyone contacted audi corp. recently? if so, what was their response? i plan to address this issue with the stealership and see where it goes. i know a tech there that used to be a shop foreman at another audi dealership i used to go to for my '97 A4. hopefully, he'll be able to push for something to be done for me. if they do nothing about it i plan on contacting audi. i'm sure if all of us with the 2.0 tsi engine speak-up, they will have to address it. 

from what i have read it's 'normal' annoying issue for all of us. it doesn't seem to be an issue that affects the performance of the car nor does it seem like it will cause engine/exhaust problems in the future but who wants to hear that noise. 

i love my A3 but it does have a lot of 'normal' weird noises. another one being the diesel-like ticking at start-up. 

anyways, i hope this heard continues and a solution can be provided by audi...soon!


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

CandyWhiteTSi said:


> Hmmm.... I should have my Eurojet dp installed hopefully within a week or so, whenever I get it... I will be sure to see if the rattle chhchchch noise is gone for me as well.. The only difference with mine, is I have no resonator.


any update ?


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## blackgl98 (Jan 23, 2006)

Here is a follow up from a fellow on golfmk6.com


> I've been dealing with Volkswagen and the dealership regarding this issue for the past few weeks. I first started hearing rattling coming from the engine bay at around 700Km. First, none of technicians I've talked to at the dealership agree that the rattling is caused by wastegate flutter. Here's one techs response:
> 
> "From my experience working for a rally team and thus working with many turbocharged vehicles, I can safely say that the "wastegate flutter" sound is not actually caused by the wastegate, but rather is an effect produced by throttle lift-off causing compressed air to pass back through the compressor. It is very prominent when a blow-off valve is installed, and sounds more like a chirp and less like the noise you are describing. The function of the wastegate ensures that correct boost pressure is maintained in the turbo, and the sound you are hearing may be a byproduct of that function, particularly as you describe it as being at relatively low rpms."
> 
> ...


http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8045


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## Rangod (Feb 11, 2010)

It seems to me all CCT and CBE engine configurations make this noise. Some more and some less. The wastegate cycling theory is not plausible as it is the solenoid that cycles on and off not the actual valve in the exhuast stream opening and closing. The valve in the exhaust stream has a "floating open" effect with the amount of the opening depending on the duty cycle of the wastgate solenoid valve N75 ,which controls pressure acting on a diaphragm that open the wastegate. The wastegate also would cycle more at higher RPM as more exhaust gas must bypass the turbine in order to maintain the requested boost level which would cause more noise at higher RPM and this is not the case. The down pipe flex cage area is what i suspect as i have tapped on the cat and generated a similar noise to what you hear under load between 2300 and 2700 RPM. If i hold onto the flex pipe cage the noise goes away. In cars where the noise is louder the flex pipe test i just decribed produces a louder rattle in the cage. I am on lunch break and about to change one out for this rattle. I will let you all know the result. By the way My 2010 GTi CBE used to make this noise. APR ECM tuning 91 octane and some spirited driving seems to have solved the noise for me (that is the noise just stopped one day).


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## Rangod (Feb 11, 2010)

OK. new factory down pipe reduced noise to almost imperceptable but not gone so dont go to your dealer expecting them to get rid of your noise. However i can say the noise is less so the flex pipe is the cause and the guy who said "there is a breakin period" is correct as my 2010 GTi no longer has the noise.


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## velocidub (Oct 27, 2002)

The noise is till there for my 09 GTI after 1 yr and 8500 miles. Hasn't lessened any.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Getting Louder*



velocidub said:


> The noise is till there for my 09 GTI after 1 yr and 8500 miles. Hasn't lessened any.


 
Mine is about 8700 miles and getting louder. 

blackgl98 - Thank you for your post - its dead on - the majority of the people on here are excepting _fanboys_ - I never owned a car with such ridiculous noise as a standard feature according to VW customer service. 

VW needs to address this - period.


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## VeeDub Racer (Jan 24, 2002)

almost 10K miles since I replaced my down pipe. STILL NO NOISE. Stop trying to figure out what this is... it is the type of FLEX PIPE that VW uses on the down pipe. There is NOTHING WRONG WITH THE CAR! THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THE MOTOR! STOP BLAMING VW! IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, GET A NEW DOWN PIPE OR TRADE IN YOUR CAR AND SHUT UP! 

sorry... I have been having a rough week. hopefully I don't offend anyone.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*NHTSA Contact Information*

They where very interested in the issue and are perusing it. 

http://www.nhtsa.gov/Contact 
NHTSA Headquarters 
1200 New Jersey Avenue, SE 
West Building 
Washington, DC 20590 
Toll-Free: 1-888-327-4236 

Those of you who are not happy with the noise and are not interested in designing the motor yourself - I suggest you file a complaint. 
Those of you who love to spend additional $$$ on making your car sound like a new car - please SHUT UP and keep it to yourself - as you have NO issue - lucky you.


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## Th1 (Sep 22, 2010)

*Audi 2.0 TSI Turbo Rattle*

My first post with this forum. Thank you to all that had time to share their experience and information. 

My A3 has had this noise from the very first day I drove it off the lot, I figured it sounded like an exhaust heat-shroud rattle or at worst an internal baffle within the exhaust had broken a spot weld and resonated at 2500-3000 rpm. 
Having track vehicles and spent copious amounts of time wrenching on all manner of automotive projects, I wanted to keep this car stock and just have a drive-around-town-car. Either way my thinking was its a warranty issue to be remedied in the near future and I need not start to reinvent this vehicle. 

Not the case! 

At the time of the first service I mentioned the noise; the dealership claimed it could not be reproduced. 

Then the car went in for the recall on the breather valve in the gas tank, mentioned the noise again and again they claimed it was not reproducible. 

All the while the noise had been getting more frequent and sustained. 

So at 10k miles, I put it on the rack and went over every heat shield, loose bolt, plastic piece and anything that looked like it could create a rattle. NO good! The rattle remained. 

My suspicions at this time leaned towards the exhaust system, but were unconfirmed. 

I resisted the impulse to tear into the A3 and sort things on my own and took it to the dealer, had a technician ride along and kept him in the car until it made the noise for a sufficient amount of time for him to exhaust all of his basic reasons for the noise. Left the car with the Dealer to effect repairs. 

I get a call the next day that they had found the problem and were now replacing the turbo. As I understand, the turbo and waste gate (WG) are married from the parts manufacturer, so I'm assuming, at this point, the WG has been replaced as well. They requested I leave the car another night so they could do a cold test run and confirm there were no further issues. I agreed. 

The next morning I receive another call from the dealer, they stated the noise remained and that they were going to bring in an "Audi Specialist". This concerned me as this was an Audi dealership, none-the-less I agreed to leave the car another night and have the "Specialist" take a look. 

The next evening I receive a call from the Dealer, he tells me the "Specialist" claimed the sound was normal and that it was originating from the WG. 

I take this to mean, that Audi North America does not warranty the noise that is being produced by the WG and the fact this Dealer went through the trouble of trying to solve the problem they did not get or read the inter-Dealer memo that this noise is an SOP for these Audi/VW engines. 

Having read this entire thread I see that I'm not alone in this issue. It is infuriating beyond description to have a new vehicle with such a high market reputation have such a crap build standard. My track S4 never had such build issues, I blew up the S4's KO3s, but that is because they were not designed for that type of use. This car goes to the park and the grocery store and it is sounding like it is falling apart. I have yet to get all the bugs in the transmission and the windows that seem to have a mind of their own addressed by the Dealer. 

...and now to rant a bit... if I wanted to buy a throw-away car that ran like crap, was built like crap, had crap resale value, and did everything crappy there are many cars to choose from built by the Big 3. To those that say "Dude, turn up your stereo" or "I put a race exhaust on mine and can't hear the noise anymore"... good for you, and please help yourself to more of the cool-aid in the metal bucket, I hear it’s real tasty. 

This non-stop lowering of quality on products in the US is BOVINE FECAL MATTER in the highest regard! What is worse is that we are slowly being taught to accept this as the "norm" and it is taking hold, we are accepting this CRAP! 

To those that say "your car makes noise when you step on the gas; you got use to that noise as normal", please stop talking, you're embarrassing yourself. There are noises that let you know when a machine is operating correctly and there are noises that let you know the machine is about to fly apart. When discussing the operation of an internal combustion engine with compressed induction, a rattle is a noise that indicates imminent malfunction. When discussing a can of spray paint from the hardware store, a rattle indicates proper function. ...ok? 

...ranting has concluded... 

Contacted Audi and will try to get an official response; I have seen the VW responses and figure I will not fair any better with Audi. Perhaps it will go a little towards easing buyer concern when selling my A3. I'm also campaigning to get an audience with the "Audi Specialist", I have low expectations this will come to fruition. From what research I have completed, the only solution to the noise that is the WG, is replacing the OEM turbo and WG. I'm going to contact other resources like Stasis and see if they have found any other solutions. 

I will post again if I find anything relevant. 


Thank you again,


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## mikeg6045 (Apr 14, 2010)

Th1 said:


> My first post with this forum. Thank you to all that had time to share their experience and information.
> 
> My A3 has had this noise from the very first day I drove it off the lot, I figured it sounded like an exhaust heat-shroud rattle or at worst an internal baffle within the exhaust had broken a spot weld and resonated at 2500-3000 rpm.
> Having track vehicles and spent copious amounts of time wrenching on all manner of automotive projects, I wanted to keep this car stock and just have a drive-around-town-car. Either way my thinking was its a warranty issue to be remedied in the near future and I need not start to reinvent this vehicle.
> ...


 When I installed an aftermarket downpipe the noise went away. which leads me to think its the flex joint of the oem downpipe.


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## Th1 (Sep 22, 2010)

*Exhaust Fix???*

I was unable to make the exhaust rattle on the ramp. When you replaced yours did you see the issue within the downpipe? Having worked with Stainless Steel braided piping for varius applications they are not prone to rattling and thus I'm a little suspicious. Did you do your own work? What brand of aftermarket pipe did you use? 

Thx,


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## mikeg6045 (Apr 14, 2010)

Th1 said:


> I was unable to make the exhaust rattle on the ramp. When you replaced yours did you see the issue within the downpipe? Having worked with Stainless Steel braided piping for varius applications they are not prone to rattling and thus I'm a little suspicious. Did you do your own work? What brand of aftermarket pipe did you use?
> 
> Thx,


I used an APR pipe.

I was replacing the pipe for an upgrade , not as a fix for the rattle noise. 

Yes, the work was done on my car with me involved and present.

in my case the noise COMPLETELY went away with the downpipe. Never to be heard again. And it had nothing to do with a loud exhaust system of the stereo being turned up loud. I am not the type of person to ignore a noise that troubles me by adding a set of flowmasters from pep boys to my car.

not sure what else to say as far you being suspicious, but this has been the case for many other TSI owners. no noise after downpipe replacement.

btw, nice rant.  i agree with many of the points made. Unfortunately there is no solution to the problem of cost cutting and the majority will happily accept the products if it means they save 5 dollars a month on there payment. We are in the minority as far as understanding atleast 1% of the components that make up the build quality of the vehicle.

also to add, no i did not visually see a problem with the downpipe i removed off the stock car. I'm not sure your going to be able to make a downpipe resonate with your hands while being on a ramp anyway.


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## Th1 (Sep 22, 2010)

Mike,

Thx for the reply. 

My attempt to reproduce the resonation while the car was on the rack was to eliminate the possibility of a blatant lack of workmanship being the cause of the noise. Beyond the obvious causes exact reproduction of the environment/circumstances that creates the resonance is very difficult, agreed. The visual inspection of the OEM downpipe would be to eliminate similar quality shortfalls.

Could you describe all the alterations you completed on your car; as your build seems to have incorporated other engine components some of these may have played a role in the elimination of "the noise".


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## mikeg6045 (Apr 14, 2010)

Th1 said:


> Mike,
> 
> Thx for the reply.
> 
> ...


first mod i did was install a downpipe by itself along with software. and drove like that for a while. no other mods. And i mean none. no intake, nothing. drove like that for a couple thousand miles.


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## Th1 (Sep 22, 2010)

mikeg6045 said:


> first mod i did was install a downpipe by itself along with software. and drove like that for a while. no other mods. And i mean none. no intake, nothing. drove like that for a couple thousand miles.


Do you have the APR model number and software release number? 

...and to be clear, you ran only the downpipe and software, no other engine or exhaust mod.


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

Th1, you seem just a little upset with the cheap sounding noises an otherwise nice car is making. My only question is did you try the TSB where the dealer adds a weight to the wastegate actuator? I understand that your car is still stock, correct? If that is the case, it would benefit everyone with this same issue. On a side note, after 29,000 miles, my wifes Tiguan doesn't have the issue anymore.


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## duanyuefeng (Sep 26, 2010)

ryan mills said:


> Th1, you seem just a little upset with the cheap sounding noises an otherwise nice car is making. My only question is did you try the TSB where the dealer adds a weight to the wastegate actuator? I understand that your car is still stock, correct? If that is the case, it would benefit everyone with this same issue. On a side note, after 29,000 miles, my wifes Tiguan doesn't have the issue anymore.


what type of gas do you use? I reproduced my noise to the dealer here today and the service guy talked to VW right away, VW suggested-

1. Put another 500miles and see what will happen, I have 500miles on it now.
2. Switching from different types of gas, 87,89,93... 

Don't know why they want me to try in this way.


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## Th1 (Sep 22, 2010)

Update...

It turns out that the dealership that performed the turbo replacement work on my A3 had Audi Factory approval before doing the work. When I received a call-back from the service manager that I have been exclusively communicating with at this dealership, he tried to back-peddle and assure me that all was fine and the noise is a normal feature with these 2.0 TSI motors. I posed him the simple question, "If all is fine, then why did the Factory approve a turbo swap?" He himm'd and haww'd and finally admitted he did not have an answer. He said he would make another attempt at sorting this out. That was Friday, 9/24. Tuesday, 9/28, I received a call-back from Audi. The Audi rep also began the conversation with "how everything is fine and it all within normal operating parameters". I posed the same simple question I posed to the dealership along with an additional question, "When did Audi start engineering rattles into their cars?" She droned on that everything was fine. As that part of the conversation was going nowhere, I then stated that regardless of the "normal" status of the rattle in the eyes of Audi, as it was my intent to keep the car, such noises would eventually impact the reliability and resale value of the car and because it was never disclosed at the sale and there were never any attempts to communicate this was normal until now, they, Audi, need to buy back the car. The Audi rep stated the question would need to go above her and she would call again this Friday.

To date, the only sure fix I have found is a replacement of the OEM turbo and wastegate with aftermarket units. The talk of downpipes, different gas, letting it go away on its own, chip-reflash and others have not produced any constant evidence they cure the issue nor do they address the core issue. Let’s also remember, Audi is aware of the noise and its origins, the wastegate. Their position is to continue to sell the consumer that it’s all normal. 

I will post again once I hear back from Audi.


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## duanyuefeng (Sep 26, 2010)

Th1 said:


> Update...
> 
> It turns out that the dealership that performed the turbo replacement work on my A3 had Audi Factory approval before doing the work. When I received a call-back from the service manager that I have been exclusively communicating with at this dealership, he tried to back-peddle and assure me that all was fine and the noise is a normal feature with these 2.0 TSI motors. I posed him the simple question, "If all is fine, then why did the Factory approve a turbo swap?" He himm'd and haww'd and finally admitted he did not have an answer. He said he would make another attempt at sorting this out. That was Friday, 9/24. Tuesday, 9/28, I received a call-back from Audi. The Audi rep also began the conversation with "how everything is fine and it all within normal operating parameters". I posed the same simple question I posed to the dealership along with an additional question, "When did Audi start engineering rattles into their cars?" She droned on that everything was fine. As that part of the conversation was going nowhere, I then stated that regardless of the "normal" status of the rattle in the eyes of Audi, as it was my intent to keep the car, such noises would eventually impact the reliability and resale value of the car and because it was never disclosed at the sale and there were never any attempts to communicate this was normal until now, they, Audi, need to buy back the car. The Audi rep stated the question would need to go above her and she would call again this Friday.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the update. As I spoke to VW customer care today, they didn't even say they were aware of the problem. 

Isn't replacing an aftermarket wastegate alone enough to solve the problem? Do we have to replace an OEM turbo at the same time?


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## Th1 (Sep 22, 2010)

*Update...*

Audi stated they would not buy back the vehicle and for me to try to have a discussion with the dealership. The Dealership stated there was little they could do without a factory approval for the buy-back. At this point I have turned the matter over to a Lemon-Law Attorney. My conversations with the firm to date have been positive. More to the point they were conveying how dumbfounded they were that Audi did NOT buy back the vehicle as it clearly was their responsibility to do so under CA Lemon Laws. Interestingly, in the letter back from Audi they included Better Business Bureau information and encouraged me to contact them. Not sure if this was in response to action taken by the Attorney. I'm awaiting the outcome from the Attorney's efforts, they claim that it is essentially a slam-dunk and they have been servicing several claims for similar against Audi. They also mentioned it will take at least a couple of months. All this sounds good, but these are attorneys, so I'll wait and see what type of results come from this before celebrating. FYI... as this is the Lemon Law being pursued there are no fees that come directly from the consumer, all compensation and other costs for attorneys come from the manufacturer of the vehicle in question. Not sure if there are any variations of the Lemon Law from state to state.

Regarding the replacement question, as I understand it, the turbo and waste gate on this series of motors has been integrated. Meaning you cannot replace one without the other. Problem being, even if one was so inclined, once you have replaced the OEM unit with an aftermarket unit, although better than the OEM unit, it would effectively cancel the factory warranty on the motor and perhaps more. Some intense research would need to be completed on this and even then I'm not sure Audi or a Dealership would stand behind the swap. 

I'll post again once I have the out-come from the Lemon Law Attorney.


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

I strongly believe getting an aftermarket wastgate will solve the issues with noise. If you were to get a wasegate with a slightly stronger spring, it would stop all of the noise. it would change the engines performacne characteristics slightly, but the noise will be gone.


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

im seriously getting sick of this noise.. it almost feels weird now when i drive my 335i after a few days and DONT hear any stupid rattles. 

So, what are we gonna do about, ive ehausted all options with the dealer. i think the ONLY way we are going to get AUDI/VW's attention is if we make noise about this collectively. There must be a way.


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## rpt613 (Nov 24, 2009)

Update on my situation...

The VW rep that was supposed to follow up with me never did. Big surprise. It's been almost a year now. I had major heart surgery shortly after I started pursuing the issue so I let it drop (didn't need the aggravation). Well, I'm all healed up now but my car isn't. It's still making that infernal racket -- not that I expected it to go away. Anyway, the car is scheduled for a service appt soon. I'll bring it up with the dealer again then. If nothing comes of that, I'd be on board with the last fellow's suggestion re doing something collectively. I don't know what exactly (a petition of some sort perhaps?) but I'm willing to give it a shot.


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

Just to update you who are all currently uninformed - the noise probably stems from the wastegate's actuator rod. There is a lingering thread about this that I don't have time to find atm but will link later. Apparently attaching a 2oz weight to the rod may fix it.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

dingchavez said:


> Just to update you who are all currently uninformed - the noise probably stems from the wastegate's actuator rod. There is a lingering thread about this that I don't have time to find atm but will link later. Apparently attaching a 2oz weight to the rod may fix it.


Here is my UPDATE:
My car was in for 5 days as the dealer worked closely with VW techline on this issue - again. The reason I brought it in the 2nd time is because the dealer had a "tech bulletin" about this "using a weight solution" - so I let them give it a try...

When i picked my car up - I was so excited as it seemed to be gone - so I thought. I will say that gears 1st through 4th - no nose whatsoever. In 5th and 6six (Manual Trans) with normal acceleration - the buzzing noise is still there... granted its 80% less than it was - but obviously still a band-aid and not a fix from VW.

Now... prior to this visit and this "tech bulletin about the "weight" - VW claimed there was NO issue and that their engine was designed to sound that way!!! Well apparently they don;t think its normal as they are trying to come up with a fix for this ISSUE.

Conclusion is that whatever they "did" took away 80% of it but still appears between 2,000-3,000rpm's like before - but now only in 5th and 6th gear. I am still waiting to find out what the3y actually did to my car - as my receipt says nothing about it.

I will not leave this issue alone. A band-aid will not satisfy me. I am more than interested on doing anything you guys want collectively - that is the only way VW will actually FIX this issue and not try to sweep it under the rug.


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

Well thats good news I guess. I wouldn't really mind the noise in high gears because I'm not in them as much. However every gear, and as loud as it is, is extremely annoying. Hopefully when you find out exactly what they did to fix to some degree youll let us know


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## rpt613 (Nov 24, 2009)

I'm going back to the dealer on the 15th with the Tech Bulletin mentioned above in hand. Will let you know the outcome.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Tech Bulletin*

Talked to VW corporate today to escalate the issue to upper customer service?
When I mentioned the amount of people on VWvortex (and Audi 2.0T owners as well) that had this issue - they said "oh, we could careless about VWVortex - sorry" They obviously prefer owners not communicate with others - well the negative conversation at-least - I am sure they LOVE the flip-side - but issues they don't want to hear about from VWvortex.

Anyway...they said to me that they where not aware of this issue "AT ALL" - of course

They also said they had no idea there was a bulletin out on this issue and was clear to quickly point out that a bulletin is just that and nothing remotely close to a recall of any kind etc... I never said it was a recall.

Its funny that for the past 2 years of this issue, VW only response was "its operating as designed" bla bla bla - and now they acknowledge the issue but still want it to go away with this "weight on the actuator rod" thats DOESN'T work - only decreases the noise level - a band-aid.

What everyone needs to demand is them replacing the affected parts (turbo/waste-gate/actuator - whatever was changed - with ones from the 2011) - as it has now been "corrected" for 2011. Again - now why would they "correct" something that was designed so flawlessly from 2008 to 2010 - because IT WAS AN ISSUE.

Found this online...

and...


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## Ricky Bobby (Sep 29, 2005)

zerostudio said:


> Talked to VW corporate today to escalate the issue to upper customer service?
> When I mentioned the amount of people on VWvortex (and Audi 2.0T owners as well) that had this issue - they said "oh, we could careless about VWVortex - sorry" They obviously prefer owners not communicate with others - well the negative conversation at-least - I am sure they LOVE the flip-side - but issues they don't want to hear about from VWvortex.
> 
> Anyway...they said to me that they where not aware of this issue "AT ALL" - of course
> ...



Great job posting the TSB for this.


I have a question about this noise, does it seem to rattle or vibrate through the cabin when accelerating moderate throttle from 1800-3k? If so, I always thought it was my exhaust, but I may have this same problem and may need the dealer to put the weight on my wastegate rod.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

Its not a vibration you feel at all. Its a sound - like a loose metal piece - its hard to describe. 
Sounds like your experiencing it - most if not everyone with a 2.0T from 2008 to 2010 VW and Audi is affected.


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

Out of curiosity, if the actuator / rod is the issue, would replacing this unit with say a Forge actuator fix this?


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## rpt613 (Nov 24, 2009)

Took my car to the dealer yesterday. They couldn't hear the noise!! They suggested over the phone that I take the service manager out for a spin and point it out to him. I said okay but when I got to the dealership I was told he was "in a meeting." How convenient. I paid for my oil change and left. So I've gone to the two VW dealerships in the city and basically gotten the bum's rush at both. (The first one said the noise was there and to bring the car back when a rep from the mothership was in town. They said they'd call me when he got in. They never did. That was a year ago.) This is my first VW. I've had Hondas and Nissans before and while I've had problems with them, I've always been happy with the service I received. Perhaps I should have stuck with them. On a side note, my '10 Wolfsburg has developed a couple of rather loud squeaks and rattles emanating from inside the cabin. I can't be sure but it sounds like they're coming from the sunroof and the dash on the passenger side. I'm loathe to complain to the dealer again for fear I'll be told the same thing..."Sorry sir, we can't hear anything." Anyone else out there experiencing similar squeaks/rattles?


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## EngTech1 (Nov 30, 2008)

*no sound file ?*


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## ibedoughboy (Mar 29, 2008)

rpt613 said:


> Took my car to the dealer yesterday. They couldn't hear the noise!! They suggested over the phone that I take the service manager out for a spin and point it out to him. I said okay but when I got to the dealership I was told he was "in a meeting." How convenient. I paid for my oil change and left. So I've gone to the two VW dealerships in the city and basically gotten the bum's rush at both. (The first one said the noise was there and to bring the car back when a rep from the mothership was in town. They said they'd call me when he got in. They never did. That was a year ago.) This is my first VW. I've had Hondas and Nissans before and while I've had problems with them, I've always been happy with the service I received. Perhaps I should have stuck with them. On a side note, my '10 Wolfsburg has developed a couple of rather loud squeaks and rattles emanating from inside the cabin. I can't be sure but it sounds like they're coming from the sunroof and the dash on the passenger side. I'm loathe to complain to the dealer again for fear I'll be told the same thing..."Sorry sir, we can't hear anything." Anyone else out there experiencing similar squeaks/rattles?


Oh yea several rattles. I have a '10 Wolfsburg Jetta, 4200miles on it now. The sunroof shade rattles when open, the grill on the top of the dash buzzes, the passenger door speaker grill buzzes, and the driver door handle (inside) surround buzzes. Of course these are never repeatable when it's in to the dealer. They always just say "tech couldn't hear it", smile, and send me on my way. Next time I'm in I'll ask how the door comes apart and I'll fix the damn thing myself. I want to do a sound tube delete to quiet down the engine drone in the cabin, but what'll drown out the rattles then? lol

The rattling discussed here is not real apparent with my car. I can hear it when it kicks down momentarily (DSG) but as soon as it shifts it goes away, and I'm running 2500-3200 constant rpm on the highway (b/n 70 and 80mph). With it going away after shifting I just thought it was just the turbo boosting. To me it sounds like popcorn kernels in a tin can.

The car is generally pretty nice. The '11 Jetta's are crap. Plastic everywhere! I bought this b/c I liked my MKIV so well (the excellent driving dynamics and interior). This one doesn't drive as well (IMO) but the interior is still nice (too look at). I assume the '11 will drive no better than the MKV and they murdered the high quality interior. Good luck VW, you lost another customer. Sorry for leaving you Chrysler, I'll be back shortly.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

Th1 said:


> Audi stated they would not buy back the vehicle and for me to try to have a discussion with the dealership. The Dealership stated there was little they could do without a factory approval for the buy-back. At this point I have turned the matter over to a Lemon-Law Attorney. My conversations with the firm to date have been positive. More to the point they were conveying how dumbfounded they were that Audi did NOT buy back the vehicle as it clearly was their responsibility to do so under CA Lemon Laws. Interestingly, in the letter back from Audi they included Better Business Bureau information and encouraged me to contact them. Not sure if this was in response to action taken by the Attorney. I'm awaiting the outcome from the Attorney's efforts, they claim that it is essentially a slam-dunk and they have been servicing several claims for similar against Audi. They also mentioned it will take at least a couple of months. All this sounds good, but these are attorneys, so I'll wait and see what type of results come from this before celebrating. FYI... as this is the Lemon Law being pursued there are no fees that come directly from the consumer, all compensation and other costs for attorneys come from the manufacturer of the vehicle in question. Not sure if there are any variations of the Lemon Law from state to state.
> 
> Regarding the replacement question, as I understand it, the turbo and waste gate on this series of motors has been integrated. Meaning you cannot replace one without the other. Problem being, even if one was so inclined, once you have replaced the OEM unit with an aftermarket unit, although better than the OEM unit, it would effectively cancel the factory warranty on the motor and perhaps more. Some intense research would need to be completed on this and even then I'm not sure Audi or a Dealership would stand behind the swap.
> 
> I'll post again once I have the out-come from the Lemon Law Attorney.


Th1 - Any updates - progress?


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## O_o (Nov 12, 2009)

rpt613 said:


> Took my car to the dealer yesterday. They couldn't hear the noise!! They suggested over the phone that I take the service manager out for a spin and point it out to him. I said okay but when I got to the dealership I was told he was "in a meeting." How convenient.


Standard operating procedure taken straight from their service training manuals.



rpt613 said:


> Anyone else out there experiencing similar squeaks/rattles?


Only every VW owner. Freude durch fahren!

[OFF TOPIC]

Dealers pretend they can't hear anything because they would go bankrupt fixing everybody's pops, squeaks, and rattles (they don't get warranty money unless the fix is officially sanctioned by VW, and a virgin goat is ritually sacrificed), so you either get used to it or fix it yourself.

On the wife's car ('10 Wbg), the sunroof shade made noise because the plastic part with the handle didn't fit properly. After trying a few things that didn't work, I ended up simply removing the shade altogether (well, busting it to pieces would be more accurate). Unless you routinely receive fellatio while driving next to 18-wheelers, I don't understand its purpose.

She also had buzzing from the front doors, which turned out to be the handles, not the speakers. Split 'em apart, gooped silicone on any contacting surfaces, and trimmed the excess when dry. Smelled awful for a few days, but it's quiet as a mouse now.

For the dash noise: it's probably the HVAC diverter/damper, which pops as it expands/contracts when the heat or A/C is turned on. I think there's a DIY on the FAQ page.

[/OFF TOPIC]


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## Th1 (Sep 22, 2010)

Still awaiting the outcome from the efforts of the Lemon-Law-Attorney. When I first spoke with the attorney's, they had stated it would take at least 2 months; Dec 5 will be the soonest I expect to hear anything. The reality is I am not expecting favorable results at this point. The number of these units in the market and the expense that would be incurred by Audi/VW is huge, so they will fight hard! From my research and it appears some of you are also finding the same information, the dealerships and factory are FULLY aware of the issue that is creating the noise. To this there is no refuting. The stonewalling and playing-dumb, is at best, the default response from those that must deal with the direct interface with the consumers of this product. 

I can only say that PERSISTENCE will be what carries the day. I would advise anyone with this motor configuration experiencing the turbo wastegate noise to take it to the dealer and make sure the service adviser checking in the vehicle writes the exact complaint on the work order. Keep bringing the vehicle back, take it to another dealer, but be sure to have the service adviser write down the same thing each time!!! This type of documentation will do much towards the resolution of the problem, albeit you will likely need the assistance of a Lemon-Law-Attorney. For the record, I am certainly NO advocate for attorneys; however, sometimes they are needed. 

The more people that document this issue, speak to consumer agencies and resist becoming complacent, the more likely VW will be made to make amends. 

I still am amazed that Audi allowed my dealer to make the swap with a new turbo/wastegate, I believe this is a pivotal piece in prevailing against the Audi/VW company line. I am not sure if owners of similarly equipped vehicles that persist sufficiently might receive similar attempts to rectify their noise issue. To those that are still advocating replacing the wastegate, understand the turbo and wastegate are integrated on this motor configuration, that means you get to replace both pieces and once the replacement is completed you have effectively canceled the factory warranty on your vehicle.:banghead::banghead: 

Good work to those making the effort! Let's keep pushing back!!!

I will update when I hear something... 

Best,


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## dingchavez (Oct 8, 2009)

Is anyone stage 1 and still experiences this noise? is it as bad?


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

Th1 said:


> I still am amazed that Audi allowed my dealer to make the swap with a new turbo/wastegate, I believe this is a pivotal piece in prevailing against the Audi/VW company line. I am not sure if owners of similarly equipped vehicles that persist sufficiently might receive similar attempts to rectify their noise issue. To those that are still advocating replacing the wastegate, understand the turbo and wastegate are integrated on this motor configuration, that means you get to replace both pieces and once the replacement is completed you have effectively canceled the factory warranty on your vehicle.:banghead::banghead:
> 
> Best,


Sorry - confirming - so Audi "did" replace the turbo assembly on your car?
And are you still having the noise or just trying to help us out?


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Lets act on this and get serious...*

Here is my list of MUST complaints that everyone should completing. It will be easier to get this done while we are still in warranty rather than post warranty when your turbo etc... possibly goes out? Lets get these institutions to do their jobs and pressure VW/Audi to be held liable for their responsibilities and stop lying to us all.

I have already completed all of the following:

1. Your *Dealer* - they will most likely say they don’t hear it... or possible do the Technical Bulletin #2158 “Because of exhaust gas pulsations the wastegate flap and actuator rod vibrate at the introduction of boost pressure” Even after they make the first attempt of hanging the weight to the actuator, they will most likely just turn around and say the car is actually worked as specified and normal. Even though the Technical Bulletin itself says that if the noise does not go away with the suggested solution, to keep investigating the “issue”

2. Call *VW or America* : http://www.vw.com/en/contact_us/nav/contact_us.html and file a formal complaint on the issue re the Technical Bulletin etc... You will get nowhere guaranteed.

3. File with you states *Attorney General* : http://www.naag.org/current-attorneys-general.php You will file against the dealership who in turn will have to get the VW or Audi involved. This one gets their attention immediately.

4. File with *NHTSA* : http://www.nhtsa.gov/ As much as VW or Audi can tell us over and over again that a buzzing engine noise is “normal”, we have the right to say it is not until proven “normal” or repaired like they did for the 2011 model year - its really simple. They released the Technical Bulletin because its an “issue” not because its operating “normal”.

5. File a complaint to protect your consumer rights with *The Federal Trade Commission* : http://www.ftc.gov/ 

6. File a complaint with the *Better Business Bureau* : http://www.bbb.org/ as being ignored by your dealer or a manufacturer on an issue that they themselves acknowledge as an issue with their Technical Bulletin.

OK... I know it looks overwhelming, but please take the time to do these steps and they will see we are well aware and informed of VW/Audi’s negligence on this obvious and documented issue.


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

I've been down this road. The only way to twist VW's arm is to get MEDIA attention. Trust me. All else is meaningless. Figure out how to do it and you've got them, especially if it hits by Spring 2011 when they're trying to sell cars, especially the new Jetta. :thumbup:


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

zerostudio said:


> Talked to VW corporate today to escalate the issue to upper customer service?
> When I mentioned the amount of people on VWvortex (and Audi 2.0T owners as well) that had this issue - they said "oh, we could careless about VWVortex - sorry" They obviously prefer owners not communicate with others - well the negative conversation at-least - I am sure they LOVE the flip-side - but issues they don't want to hear about from VWvortex.
> 
> Anyway...they said to me that they where not aware of this issue "AT ALL" - of course
> ...


has anyone taken this to the dealer yet ?


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## Jahmas001 (Aug 21, 2009)

*ticking noise at idle*

I have the noise too and it really reminds me of the sound that my fuel pump used to make on my Porsche (VW) 914 when it was pressuring up. Even the location i.e., the passenger side towards the back wheel area. But I know that the fuel pump on the TSI is quite different and the engine is certainly in a different location but.... the noise is the same


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

*Update from VW Corporate...*

I received a call from a 3rd tear supervisor - after complaining for the abuse I was talking from their customer service.

He was very apologetic to the "experience I've had with the first two customer service reps (that are "Regional Case Managers").

He then *assured* me that VW is well aware (really? - even after the Technical Bulletin acknowledgment? - again your aware?) of this being a "*real issue*", and that they *WILL* have a program in place by the end of the year - but more likely in the new year to resolve the noise issue for good.

So... it appears that their relentless stand on " the car was operating as designed and is _normal_" is/might be over.

*NOW is the time to bring your car in and ask for it to be fixed!!!!!!*


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## ManTech (Oct 13, 2010)

zerostudio said:


> I received a call from a 3rd tear supervisor - after complaining for the abuse I was talking from their customer service.
> 
> He was very apologetic to the "experience I've had with the first two customer service reps (that are "Regional Case Managers").
> 
> ...



Look you have a good issue here but don't over spam it. The mods here will shut you down. Try to keep it alive but let one thread in each forum dominate the issue.

The key to this issue is to find out the truth about what's being said behind the scenes. What really transpires between the service-technician when he calls VW's Tech-Line for further instructions after he goes through the described procedure and determines the problem is indeed a faulty turbo actuator? What do they discuss? Someone who has been involved (like you) needs to do a little poking around. The next time you see your repair tech, ask, "Hey, so what did Tech-Line say to you?" 

If you look again at the TSB, take note that the Service & Solution lines are left blank. That's no mistake. They want nothing written at this point. It's all verbally transmitted behind the scenes. Find out what VW's Tech-Line is telling these service teams and you may get the answer, or the smoking gun you seek.

Good luck. :thumbup:


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

I just got my audi back from the dealer. they could not find the tsb, so it must be a VW only thing 

Im serious when i say im ready for the next course of action. How about we register a website with this issue, have everyone post there that wants this fixed, and submit to audi, vw, nhtsa etc etc. i dont know what else to do.. maybe create a facebook page while we are at it. 

Here are some other threads on the same topic. 

http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8045&page=11

http://forums.subdriven.com/showthr...ur-TSI-still-rattling-between-2-3k&p=67483287


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

aquaanox said:


> I just got my audi back from the dealer. they could not find the tsb, so it must be a VW only thing
> 
> Im serious when i say im ready for the next course of action. How about we register a website with this issue, have everyone post there that wants this fixed, and submit to audi, vw, nhtsa etc etc. i dont know what else to do.. maybe create a facebook page while we are at it.
> 
> ...


Anything you want to do - I will help you with all details.

BBB wrote me today with a HUGE packets of info - they now attack auto manufacturers like a lemon law attorney - very interesting. I will post the general info sheet that attached with it with the options manufacturers have in responding to the compliant.

I have 2 lemon law attorneys begging for the case right now - going to pull the trigger Friday if I don't hear back from VW on an official fix and date for the fix.

Facebook - Blog of Webpage - GREAT idea - let me know what I can do to help. Feel free to email me through here and we can get started in email exchange.


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

*CALL AUDI and VW Customer Care*

So i just spend about 30 minutes with " Jamie " at Audi customer care.. Just ask for her, report this issue. She assured me that if enough people call in to report the problem, AUDI will pay attention. That they have in the past launched campaigns from customer care when a large number of people reported a problem. 

She also promised to call my dealer back and get back to me by thursday. It seems to me that not enough people are actually calling VW and Audi and reporting this problem. the number is 1-800-822-2834 (AUDI), Monday through Friday, 8 am to 9 pm.


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## dubious judas (Sep 23, 2010)

zerostudio said:


> Anything you want to do - I will help you with all details.
> 
> BBB wrote me today with a HUGE packets of info - they now attack auto manufacturers like a lemon law attorney - very interesting. I will post the general info sheet that attached with it with the options manufacturers have in responding to the compliant.
> 
> ...


You can declare it a lemon from just a noise? I thought it had to be a safety issue?

If someone makes a facebook page let me know, sounds like a good way to get attention.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

zerostudio said:


> Anything you want to do - I will help you with all details.
> 
> BBB wrote me today with a HUGE packets of info - they now attack auto manufacturers like a lemon law attorney - very interesting. I will post the general info sheet that attached with it with the options manufacturers have in responding to the compliant.
> 
> ...



Good luck on the lemon law. Let me ask you this, is the car in working the same way it did when your drove it off the lot? Yes. Have there been any attempts at fixing the car? No, because it drives and rides the same as the day you picked it up. So how does the lemon law apply here?


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## astrokat (Nov 16, 2010)

Took my 2010 Jetta Wolfsburg Ed. into local dealer last week. They said they couldn't hear noise. I insisted I could get the car to make the noise, so two techs went with me to test. Sadly, rain and wind during ride kept them from really hearing the noise. I was told me to monitor it and return if problem continues. A service ticket hadn’t been started, so was told they would mail it to me. It never came. 

I've heard the noise since day one of owning the car. Before I bought the Jetta, I tested a 2010 GTI and heard the same rattle. I figured it was something I could live with. Over time and 12k miles the noise has become worse. I’ve owned both Audi and VW in the past so I’m accustomed to strange noises, but this is ridiculous. 

I have noticed with the recent cold snap here in KY that the noise is more noticeable. I’m going to try another dealer to see if I have better luck. All I want is to love this car. It’s not gonna happen as long as this obnoxious noise continues. This will be my last VW.


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## aladro (Apr 21, 2007)

astrokat said:


> I've heard the noise since day one of owning the car. Before I bought the Jetta, I tested a 2010 GTI and heard the same rattle... This will be my last VW.


 Sorry but the you're the one to blame for this. Bought the car even though you heard the noise and now demanding that it be fixed.


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## Bullitt_TDI (Dec 12, 2006)

My 2011 started doing this recently. I have 3000 miles on it . 4dr 6spd manual. 

Interestingly enough, I had a 2010 CC TSI with 10K. It didn't have this issue.


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## astrokat (Nov 16, 2010)

aladro said:


> Sorry but the you're the one to blame for this. Bought the car even though you heard the noise and now demanding that it be fixed.


 Thanks for clearing that up for me.


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## passatdubai (Dec 28, 2010)

I got my new 2010 Passat 2.0 TSI 10 days ago, I immediatly noticed the sound, its horrible. I never noticed it on the demo car.

I went to the VW service centre here in Dubai and they simply said its normal and its the noise created by the turbo. 

Sounds like rubbish to me.


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## heimbachae (Apr 8, 2009)

09 GTI TSI with 47k miles. I'm decently sure this problem as you gentlemen described just started happening to me. Weather was down in the single digits over the weekend and I had my car in to see about a check engine light. Apparently my intake manifold needs to be replaced. I'll ask about this problem when they get the part in, cause it JUST started happening and it is NOT nice sounding.


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## mrchaps (Jun 17, 2010)

All right, so add me to the list. I've done a lot of research on this since I've had the issue since I got the vehicle. It's driving me crazy! I've thought about selling my car, but with the money I'm going to loose from doing that I might as well buy a K04 and get rid of the issue while making it crazy fast.

The noise is very, very loud on my car. I don't think it was like this before I switched downpipes back and forth. I was one of the ones who at first could swear it was the stock downpipe the cause of the problem, now I am sure it's not. I even took a video of it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__aLctQuLdk

I must say, that sound is pretty close to how it sounds when the car accelerates. But no, the stock downpipe is not the problem. 

First I had a USP catless downpipe, the noise was loud and I thought it was my heat shield, i moved it and moved it without luck, then I switched to the stock downpipe and it went away, or maybe I thought it went away because the difference in sound volume was very big, but it was still there, a little bit but there. Now I have a 42dd catted and resonated downpipe and it's as loud as it has ever been. It has been described perfectly already by all posters on this thread, give it gas and expect a bzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!!! aaahh!! the only difference between me and all the other guys is that everyone says they stop hearing it at 3k rpms. It did that with my stock dp, not with this one, now I can hear it starting from around 2.3k and all the way up. 

I could switch to my stock downpipe again, but the gains from the new apr stg2 file, the carbonio and the 42dd downpipe are just too much to let go. 

what to do? i really feel frustrated, maybe my flex section is bad and the sound is getting out more? but if that was the case, i would be able to smell the fumes like if I had not cat converter right?

I will try the weight band aid this week and report back..


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## shucky (Jun 2, 2003)

I'll chime in. My wifes Tiguan did this from day one. It didn't really bother us at all. My CC did NOT do this whatsoever. My new 2011 GTI did this from the moment I drove it off the dealer lot. Again, doesn't bother me really. Guess I'm used to it from the Tig. Plus, you can only hear it with the windows down and the radio off. Regardless, I'm only posting to inform you guys that 2011's still do this so dont think just because the TSB states up to 2010 that for 2011 they fixed/changed something. They didn't.


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## mrchaps (Jun 17, 2010)

Reporting back, the weight did nothing on my wastegate. Same noise. 

I have two options now, go back to my stock dp and see if it gets better OR, get a K04 and get rid of this noisy wastegate. I don't have money for the 2nd so I'll try the first one.


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## Kid Hobo (Sep 4, 2005)

:facepalm:

The stock K03s turbos actually have a built in muffler feature on them. That's why they don't whine like after market turbos when they spin up. At the rpm range described, the muffler oscillates pressures back and forth the the WG which is why you hear that sound. It's normal. Going to a 3" DP is changing the back pressure which may eliminate the sound, but not always depending on the config/pressures at the turbo. If you really want to get rid of the noise, go K04. 

I've owned 3 mark Vs, both FSI and TSI and they all did it. And back to one of the oldest memes about VWs and rattles and noises; just turn your radio up. :thumbup:


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## rags2riches (Jan 2, 2010)

I don't have a TSI or TFSI, however if one of you guys with low mileage TSI GTI's that can't ignore a wee buzzing noise would like to sell your car to me used I would like to talk to you. Not like it's that big of a deal. They all seem to do it and no problems(non-harmonics related lol) have been reported as far as something failing. Like dude said.


Kid Hobo said:


> :facepalm:
> I've owned 3 mark Vs, both FSI and TSI and they all did it. And back to one of the oldest memes about VWs and rattles and noises; just turn your radio up. :thumbup:


PS If one of you guys decides to sell your car to me, I noticed a rattle noise between 2000 and 3000 rpm and that makes your car worth 1500 less than book value. LOL. You wouldn't go for that would you? If not, I don't see why you can't just drive the car as is. My $.02.


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## aquaanox (May 3, 2010)

WOW. its been over a year and still no resolve from either Audi or VW. :banghead:

im thinking about setting up a site called www.VWandAudiEnginesRattle.com

Maybe that will catch their attention.


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## zerostudio (Oct 8, 2002)

aquaanox said:


> WOW. its been over a year and still no resolve from either Audi or VW. :banghead:
> 
> im thinking about setting up a site called www.VWandAudiEnginesRattle.com
> 
> Maybe that will catch their attention.


Someone has to do something. 
They would have not bought my GTI back if they had a fix is how it appears to me. 

I miss my GTI but not the issues that came along with it. 

The more exposure this gets the better.


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## VWRedux (Jun 3, 2009)

It's the poor little cricket that VAG attached to the turbo to totally screw us touchy Americans over! :laugh:


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## astrokat (Nov 16, 2010)

*Finally! A solution*

I called a dealer today and asked about the potential fix I’ve read about for the acceleration noise. As usual, their first response is to shut down and say they’ve never heard of the problem. Fortunately for me, I’ve kept up with this forum and others on the web for well over a year, so I had lots of info to back them into a corner. I gave them the old TSB#21-10-01 that addressed the issue but didn’t provide a fix. The service manager reluctantly looked up it up and found that a new TSB came out this month (June ’11) outlining a fix. The new TSB# is 21-11-03. The service manager said according to this TSB the issue only affects 300 vehicles. The fix involves attaching a retention clip. The noise is caused by the turbo wastegate rod and actuator. I truly hope this fixes the problem. I would be happy with just a 50% reduction of the noise.

After more research, they found the part and ordered it. I take my 2010 Jetta Wolfsburg in for the modification next week. I’ll post an update along with the retention clip part number.


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## iRoborg (Nov 5, 2011)

*rattling noise from engine or exhaust area while accelerating from 1800-3000 RPM*

Betten Imports in Grand Rapids, Michigan applied this fix to my car (after I complained about it six times). The noise completely went away for three months. Then one day it came back. Turns out that the parts they used for the fix were made out of lead and the heat of the turbo melted them. VW has a new fix which will resist the heat.


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