# DIY: SAI Delete on CBFA Engine



## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

Since October of 2010 I had been curious about deleting the Secondary Air Intake (SAI) from my GTI. The SAI is factory installed on 2008.5+ GTI's located in states with more strict emissions standards. So the specific engine we're referencing is the 2.0T TSI *CBFA*.
In summary, the SAI system serves to pump additional fresh air into the exhaust to warm up the cats. Apparently this aids in reducing emissions. Oh well...

*Why do this mod:*
Some people have been asking WHY bother removing this system from your car. Honestly, there's really no legitimate reason aside from wanting to clean up the engine bay a bit more.
_There are no performance gains to be expected from the SAI delete!_

*Side effects:*
The SAI Delete has been done on two cars thus far and has NOT resulted in any negative side effects. The SAI Delete _currently_ causes a Check Engine Light (CEL) to illuminate on your dash. Please keep in mind that because the SAI Delete is a relatively new modification for the TSI, so information is still forthcoming. :thumbup:









*Tools needed:*
T30 Torx wrench/bit
basic sized metric ratchet kit

*Parts needed:*
-_Integrated Engineering_ 2.0T TSI SAI Block Off Plate: http://www.intengineering.com/billet-accessories/2-0t-tsi-sai-block-off-plate.html









*Parts being removed:*
-Solenoid Secondary Air Valve - Part No: 06J131097D
-All associated tubing, brackets, and bolts
-Secondary Air Pump - Part No: 07K131333A

*Onto some pics...*
Here's an exploded view of the oem airbox and SAI system.









Here you can see the 'Solenoid Secondary Air Valve' in the very middle of the screen, and the small intake for the SAI located slightly down and to the left.









And here's a close up of the 'Solenoid Secondary Air Valve'. This entire assembly will be removed eventually.









*DIY Steps:*
_I'm going to skip the details of some steps because assuming that you're doing this mod, you already have a decent understanding of the steps leading up to the SAI Delete._

*Step 1:* Remove the intake at least up to the MAF. It's not necessary to remove the stage II of your intake.
*Step 2:* Remove the battery and battery tray
*Step 3:* Disconnect the three sensors pertinent to the SAI system. Two are located on the Solenoid Secondary Air Valve, and the other is located down by where the SAI tubing routes behind the driver's side fog light.
*Step 4:* Behind the Solenoid Secondary Air Valve, use the T30 torx wrench to remove two screws which are on brackets integrated into two separate lines, at least one of which is a coolant line. This will allow the lines to flex, enabling you to access the two rear screws which bolt the Solenoid Secondary Air Valve onto the engine block.
*Step 5:* Using the T30 torx wrench, carefully remove the three screws that bolt the Solenoid Secondary Air Valve onto the engine block (two at the rear above and below the lines mentioned in *Step 4*, and one at at the front and oriented slightly higher). Remove the Solenoid Secondary Air Valve and the associated gasket.



























*Step 6:* Use the _Integrated Engineering_ Blockoff Plate and oem gasket to cap off the hole in the engine. Do *NOT* use the o-ring that comes installed on the 1.8T Blockoff Plate application.









I reused the oem gasket to create a better seal because the 1.8T Blockoff Plate doesn't match up perfectly, *nor is it intended to*. It's only off by about 2mm though. Going to communicate with _Integrated Engineering_ on developing a piece that mates up perfectly on the 2.0T. *I drew the black circle that you see on the Blockoff Plate just to illustrate where the hole on the engine is in relation to the Blockoff Plate.*








*But then I installed the Blockoff Plate upside down...* ha ha
Essentially the hole is slightly off to the *RIGHT* of the two screws used to bolt down the Blockoff plate. (So opposite of how I have it bolted on.)









*Step 7:* Replace one of the screws that originally removed in *Step 4.* It's pretty obvious which one, because only one can be replaced at this point. 
*Step 8:* Removing the SAI tubing by reaching inside the bumper on the driver's side, as if you were accessing the fog lights. The fittings for this tubing is the same as used on the PCV lines, so have fun with that.









*Step 9:* _At this point the engine bay is looking much cleaner, and yes -- you can stop here if you want, but there's still the Secondary Air Pump located behind the driver's side fog light (that you just disconnected the tubing from in *Step 8* and the sensor from in *Step 3*. I'd recommend that you continue, because this is by far the easiest and most painless step of them all... _
The best way to access the two inboard bolts on the Secondary Air Pump is to jack the car up on the driver's side and remove the rock tray.








Remove the two 13mm inboard bolts.








Access the third 13mm bolt through the removable covers you'd use to access the fog lights. (Sorry the area was too tight to take a picture of, but you can see where it's removed in the pic above.)

The picture below shows the orientation of the Secondary Air Pump, bracket, and bolts.









*Step 10:* Put everything back together and admire your work. 



Post or PM me with questions. And _stay tuned_


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

Awesome. Thank You. :thumbup:


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

Thanks for the writeup! :thumbup::thumbup:

Any idea how much all of this stuff weighs combined?
Probably 10lbs or so?


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## mikeh6 (Aug 8, 2007)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> Thanks for the writeup! :thumbup::thumbup:
> 
> Any idea how much all of this stuff weighs combined?
> Probably 10lbs or so?


that's what i was wondering


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> Thanks for the writeup! :thumbup::thumbup:
> 
> Any idea how much all of this stuff weighs combined?
> Probably 10lbs or so?





mikeh6 said:


> that's what i was wondering


Probably about that much. I will weigh later today and let you know.
More curious than that is how expensive the removed parts are... Makes me wanna start a FS thread


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

I wonder if there is an option in vag com to disable the SAI?
I wont follow through unless I can make sure I dont get a CEL


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> I wonder if there is an option in vag com to disable the SAI?
> I wont follow through unless I can make sure I dont get a CEL


Me either but at least it's nice to know b/c either through VCDS or one of the tuning vendors I'm sure there's a way to disable it.


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

i like this...i HATE that thing...

BUT..

in NY..if you have CEL they wont inspect your car OR you automatically fail...so until theres a tune that bypasses this...im out


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

sum41kid861 said:


> i like this...i HATE that thing...
> 
> BUT..
> 
> in NY..if you have CEL they wont inspect your car OR you automatically fail...so until theres a tune that bypasses this...im out


Luckily in FL we don't have inspection or emissions check but I can't stand CEL's :banghead:


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

sum41kid861 said:


> in NY..if you have CEL they wont inspect your car OR you automatically fail...so until theres a tune that bypasses this...im out


 Even with this written out in a tune/flash you may fail an emissions inspection if your state clears your readiness results to check if they reset to not being ready.


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## [email protected] (Jan 2, 2009)

Just saw this thread... I'm modifying the 1.8T plate design to suit today and ordering material, we should be able to fit it into our production schedule in the next 2-3 weeks. I'd expect them finished up in a month or so. 

OP: Shoot me an email when you see them come out if you want, I'll swing you one for the effort. :thumbup:


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## v-dubIV (Jul 6, 2003)

sorry for the noob question but other than weight saving's ( which seems to be very little ) and a barely noticeable cleaner bay, what are the benifits of doing this?


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Just saw this thread... I'm modifying the 1.8T plate design to suit today and ordering material, we should be able to fit it into our production schedule in the next 2-3 weeks. I'd expect them finished up in a month or so.
> 
> OP: Shoot me an email when you see them come out if you want, I'll swing you one for the effort. :thumbup:


 Thanks! I really appreciate it! 
And of course I'll update the thread with new pics and some closeups of the product, etc. 
Have y'all been able to research how to get around the CEL at all???


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

dsm1983 said:


> *Parts needed:*
> -Solenoid Secondary Air Valve gasket - Part No: 06J131120B - You can reuse the one you already have if you prefer.
> -_Integrated Engineering_ 1.8t SAI Blockoff Plate: http://www.intengineering.com/18t-SAI-Blockoff-Plate-p8914932.html


 I sell that same plate for $12! :laugh:


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## [email protected] (Jan 2, 2009)

No, you sell a quickly made knock off which is not anodized and has a very poor machined finish, even in their own product photo. Plus, if somebody wanted to buy that, they might as well go place your order directly with 034, and skip the wheeling, dealing, drop ship king of the world, who likes to pretend everybody else's product is his own. :laugh: eace:


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

alright gentlemen, let's keep this thread clean


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

:laugh:


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## v-dubIV (Jul 6, 2003)

thanks for someone answering my question as to what the benifit or purpose of doing this would be other than getting a CEL light and being able to put a "cool" CEL sticker on your car for +5 scene points


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## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> No, you sell a quickly made knock off which is not anodized and has a very poor machined finish, even in their own product photo.











Peter,
It is no secret to anyone that we work closely with 034 but Id hate to be the barer of bad news and tell you our SAI plates are produced in house and are *CLEAR ANODIZED*. Once the part is completed the machining process , it is placed in a tumbler and deburred after which it is sent for anodizing.Like you I take great pride in everything I do , even my photographs which are all done with a Nikon D90 camera ,however, I have not once publically called any of your products poor but thank you for opening the can of worms and showing your true low class colours.

As for "knock off" .I (Issam Abed) made SAI block off plates in 2005 for QED. Bob showed an image of one and you quickly jumped on the market and started offering a competing product. So you basically knocked off a Knock off.That was 2005....your website went live in 2007. Same goes for your meth plates , your rods , and every other product you "designed".

To date You/INTegrated Engineering have COPIED 16 of our products (and I am sure more will come). Products I designed , prototyped and brought to the market regardless of who they were sold by.
Your latest one:
http://www.intengineering.com/Integrated-Engineering-p9720026-1-2.html

Ours which I developed for my own personal 16V and marketed through 034 Motorsport.
http://www.034motorsport.com/engine-components-vw-16v-16v-coil-bracket-and-dist-blockoff-p-417.html
"this product was added to our catalog on Friday 17 February, 2006."

and the one before that:
Yours:
http://www.intengineering.com/Integrated-Engineering-p9551637-1-2.html

Ours:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...-Oil-Cooler-Kits-Billet-Valve-covers-amp-More

You charge $39 (up from your $25 price 3 years ago) because you can. We charge $12 because we made 200 pieces and because our customers wont run IE products just like yours wont run INA products. You have won over some of our customers and we have won over some of yours.There is enough to go around but please in the future do not EVER insult one of our products.
Thank You.
"eace:"


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## Slayer (Aug 8, 2000)

^ LOL, someone got told. :laugh:


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## PatientlyWaiting (Apr 28, 2005)

v-dubIV said:


> thanks for someone answering my question as to what the benifit or purpose of doing this would be other than getting a CEL light and being able to put a "cool" CEL sticker on your car for +5 scene points


Cleaner engine bay, no high pitch whine at start up, no need for a breather filter when installing an intake...


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## [email protected] (Jan 2, 2009)

INA said:


> Peter,
> It is no secret to anyone that we work closely with 034 but Id hate to be the barer of bad news and tell you our SAI plates are produced in house and are *CLEAR ANODIZED*. Once the part is completed the machining process , it is placed in a tumbler and deburred after which it is sent for anodizing.Like you I take great pride in everything I do , even my photographs which are all done with a Nikon D90 camera ,however, I have not once publically called any of your products poor but thank you for opening the can of worms and showing your true low class colours.
> 
> As for "knock off" .I (Issam Abed) made SAI block off plates in 2005 for QED. Bob showed an image of one and you quickly jumped on the market and started offering a competing product. So you basically knocked off a Knock off.That was 2005....your website went live in 2007. Same goes for your meth plates , your rods , and every other product you "designed".
> ...


LOL, you are high.


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## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> LOL, you are high.


Coming from you id take that as a compliment. 
:thumbup:

OP , should have something interesting to show you today.:beer:


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## insideoutoreo699 (Dec 8, 2008)

LOL epic!


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

again...this is great and all...but theres still a CEL :banghead:


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

sum41kid861 said:


> again...this is great and all...but theres still a CEL :banghead:


We literally JUST started doing this, dood. 
Seriously, there are only 2 cars in the entire United States, possibly the world, that have done this so far. In time, we'll figure out what needs to be done via VagCom and resistors to foul the CEL.


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

dsm1983 said:


> We literally JUST started doing this, dood.
> Seriously, there are only 2 cars in the entire United States, possibly the world, that have done this so far. In time, we'll figure out what needs to be done via VagCom and resistors to foul the CEL.


:thumbup:


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## MR2ToVW (Jan 1, 2009)

dsm1983 said:


> We literally JUST started doing this, dood.
> Seriously, there are only 2 cars in the entire United States, possibly the world, that have done this so far. In time, we'll figure out what needs to be done via VagCom and resistors to foul the CEL.


I could certainly be wrong, but I don't think there's anywhere in vcds that lets you alter what type of emissions equipment is installed on the car. Otherwise, we'd all just switch off cat monitoring, etc. The car will continue to fail readiness and throw a CEL.


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

MR2ToVW said:


> I could certainly be wrong, but I don't think there's anywhere in vcds that lets you alter what type of emissions equipment is installed on the car. Otherwise, we'd all just switch off cat monitoring, etc. The car will continue to fail readiness and throw a CEL.


we'll see...


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## insideoutoreo699 (Dec 8, 2008)

All you need is a dremel


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

OP, have you contacted Ross Tech about this?
There may be an option (hopefully) that allows us to disable the SAI check in vag com.
If you haven't I will contact them and ask them.


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> OP, have you contacted Ross Tech about this?
> There may be an option (hopefully) that allows us to disable the SAI check in vag com.
> If you haven't I will contact them and ask them.


Apologies, but I have not contacted them. I welcome any assistance or research on this project because I have been SWAMPED lately with work, preparing for a couple of shows coming up, and other various projects (as I know you know). 
Let us know what you find out! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

dsm1983 said:


> Apologies, but I have not contacted them. I welcome any assistance or research on this project because I have been SWAMPED lately with work, preparing for a couple of shows coming up, and other various projects (as I know you know).
> Let us know what you find out! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


NP man, I know all too well how busy life gets.
Before I contact Ross Tech about this, what is the specific error you are getting as a result of the SAI delete?
Id like to send them the exact error with the initial e-mail I send them.
If you could post that up when you get a chance I will get ahold of them. :thumbup:


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> NP man, I know all too well how busy life gets.
> Before I contact Ross Tech about this, what is the specific error you are getting as a result of the SAI delete?
> Id like to send them the exact error with the initial e-mail I send them.
> If you could post that up when you get a chance I will get ahold of them. :thumbup:


I will Vag and post up the error codes.


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## W3motorwerke (Jul 19, 2011)

*Has anyone thought of keeping this but elimate the tubing and put a breather filter right at the pump side? seeing how the pump only runs when the engine is cold there is no need to keep the filter up front. *

It look like you could put a filter right to the pump or shorten the tubing


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

W3motorwerke said:


> *Has anyone thought of keeping this but elimate the tubing and put a breather filter right at the pump side? seeing how the pump only runs when the engine is cold there is no need to keep the filter up front. *
> 
> It look like you could put a filter right to the pump or shorten the tubing


Yes - you could mount a filter right up next to the pump, which would put it behind the drivers-side fog light. On the oe setup the tubing is just mounted to the filtered side of the airbox.

Anyways, still haven't been able to Vagcom the car yet. Been very busy from DubFest last Sunday and then there's always my office job sucking the life outa me... :banghead:


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

I'd vagcom it for you but it's a little ways away :laugh:


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## Ricky Bobby (Sep 29, 2005)

dsm1983 said:


> Yes - you could mount a filter right up next to the pump, which would put it behind the drivers-side fog light. On the oe setup the tubing is just mounted to the filtered side of the airbox.



I think thats what i'm gonna do is shorten that tubing coming off the pump and tuck the piece under the headlight so its stealthier and unseen


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## W3motorwerke (Jul 19, 2011)

it look like you could literally put the filter right to the pump


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## ryan mills (May 3, 2002)

W3motorwerke said:


> *Has anyone thought of keeping this but elimate the tubing and put a breather filter right at the pump side? seeing how the pump only runs when the engine is cold there is no need to keep the filter up front. *
> 
> It look like you could put a filter right to the pump or shorten the tubing


Oh, like this? 









It makes it even louder, not the best idea that I had.


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

This might help?
http://www.intengineering.com/PostReleased-SAIEVAP-p9622690.html


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> This might help?
> http://www.intengineering.com/PostReleased-SAIEVAP-p9622690.html


 :thumbup:


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

someone try it!


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> LOL, you are high.


 strong comeback!


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> This might help?
> http://www.intengineering.com/PostReleased-SAIEVAP-p9622690.html


 yeah, I thought about purchasing that. but I'm going to wait until the companies themselves try them out and then put out the information. CEL for life anyways. 
and I kinda like how INA and IE are competing on this somewhat.


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> This might help?
> http://www.intengineering.com/PostReleased-SAIEVAP-p9622690.html


 i might get that next week. right after i confirm the shape of the connector


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## MFZERO (Mar 13, 2002)

thygreyt said:


> i might get that next week. right after i confirm the shape of the connector


 they do offer different options on this site. It's the company that makes them, IE just re-sells them.

http://www.postreleased.com/


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

MFZERO said:


> they do offer different options on this site. It's the company that makes them, IE just re-sells them.
> 
> http://www.postreleased.com/


 ROFL! dang that is cheap! nice find!


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

any advances on this?


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## Ricky Bobby (Sep 29, 2005)

i just tore out the breather filter hose line and put the breather filter off the elbow of the pump like ryan mills did, it makes it a tad louder but only for the 1 min it runs on cold starts, and plus i got rid of that breather filter in the engine bay.


i'm satisfied just to not look at it anymore.


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

I havent tried/looked at following the SAI line, is it easy to get at from the underside?
Easy to remove too?
I wouldnt mind just putting a filter on the end of it as you did to get rid of that stupid hose, without having to delete the whole thing and cause (another) CEL


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## Ricky Bobby (Sep 29, 2005)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> I havent tried/looked at following the SAI line, is it easy to get at from the underside?
> Easy to remove too?
> I wouldnt mind just putting a filter on the end of it as you did to get rid of that stupid hose, without having to delete the whole thing and cause (another) CEL



yeah its pretty easy!

just take off your fog light grill and unclip the hose facing the rear of the car, it clips off just like the SAI on the airbox.

there is a clip holding the both hoses together i just unclipped the hose to remove off of that, and took the clip out since it wasnt needed anymore, then you can just take the elbow portion and slice the hose off of that, and just clamp your breather filter on it like ryan mills, or you could just leave a 4" section or so after the "L" bend off of the pump so that the filter faces up.


(I did the second one, but I'm considering taking the piece of hose that I left and just doing it off the L off the pump like mills)



Either way you cannot see the breather filter or hose from the top of my engine bay, just the one accordian hose that goes from the SAI to the manifold?




hope that helps virtual pm me if you need anything i can try to snap a few pics!


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

On 2nd thought, since the breather is so low in the bay I might just leave it as is, for fear of some sort of hydro lock problem.
Just this past summer I had one occasion where the highway I was driving on flooded and I had to drive through a good 2.5feet of water. That would have been a disaster with a breather filter that low on my car.


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## Ricky Bobby (Sep 29, 2005)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> On 2nd thought, since the breather is so low in the bay I might just leave it as is, for fear of some sort of hydro lock problem.
> Just this past summer I had one occasion where the highway I was driving on flooded and I had to drive through a good 2.5feet of water. That would have been a disaster with a breather filter that low on my car.



you can at least shorten the tubing to get it out of the upper part of the engine bay, i'll try to snap a pic of mine for you man


and no fear of hydrolock unless you start your car from cold in a 2.5 foot puddle haha, but damn thats crazy how did your car do? you're lowered on race springs too right?


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## placenta (Jun 3, 2003)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> On 2nd thought, since the breather is so low in the bay I might just leave it as is, for fear of some sort of hydro lock problem.
> Just this past summer I had one occasion where the highway I was driving on flooded and I had to drive through a good 2.5feet of water. That would have been a disaster with a breather filter that low on my car.


good call. not like it effects anything just leaving it connected..


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

Ricky Bobby said:


> you can at least shorten the tubing to get it out of the upper part of the engine bay, i'll try to snap a pic of mine for you man
> 
> 
> and no fear of hydrolock unless you start your car from cold in a 2.5 foot puddle haha, but damn thats crazy how did your car do? you're lowered on race springs too right?


 Car took it like a champ. Im riding on BC Racing BR Coilovers, with a fairly aggressive drop.
Function > Form

The only problem was that I had to ride on the FAR shoulder in the fast lane as the slow lane was under 4feet of water and when I was on the shoulder I hit a giant chunk of metal or something (I never saw it) and it ripped up part of the plastic covers under the car and popped my front left tire (slow leak, as I made it home that night just fine and didn't see it wsa flat til lthe next day). There were a few cars that were flooded out and under water in the slow lane.
$hit was crazy


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## GTI010H20 (Jan 23, 2010)

:thumbup:
bump

for anything new with this....?

I know it'll prob be a while but its something that maybe APR could look at or maybe shed some light on was to weather they can do it or if it is possible......as far as coding out or fixing any or all cels. Maybe just the resistors and ghost plugs will be enough?


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## mike000 (Jun 21, 2008)

any pics of a cleaned up bay with the SAI delete? lets see the difference it makes from a full engine bay prosective (if any)


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

mike000 said:


> any pics of a cleaned up bay with the SAI delete? lets see the difference it makes from a full engine bay prosective (if any)


u cant tell from the top...so itll look the same


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

sum41kid861 said:


> u cant tell from the top...so itll look the same


not exactly :facepalm:


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

dsm1983 said:


> not exactly :facepalm:


the SAI is located under the drivers headlight and under the frame rail. beside the piping coming from that area, which u cant see at first glance if you have an aftermarket intake and by doing this mod you most likely do, your not gonna tell a difference as af as appearance/cleanlyness


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## GTI010H20 (Jan 23, 2010)

sum41kid861 said:


> the SAI is located under the drivers headlight and under the frame rail. beside the piping coming from that area, which u cant see at first glance if you have an aftermarket intake and by doing this mod you most likely do, your not gonna tell a difference as af as appearance/cleanlyness


I get what you are both saying but anyone interested in doing his mod is going to notice a difference one way or another.

You won't see the two tubes and yes if you look hard enough you will see/not see the block of plate and lack of the part that was bolted to the block. Not a bad little mod once someone has actually figured out how to trick the computer though.


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## TheZooKeeper (Jan 28, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> No, you sell a quickly made knock off which is not anodized and has a very poor machined finish, even in their own product photo. Plus, if somebody wanted to buy that, they might as well go place your order directly with 034, and skip the wheeling, dealing, drop ship king of the world, who likes to pretend everybody else's product is his own. :laugh: eace:


QFT


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## GTI010H20 (Jan 23, 2010)

Anything new with this Mod? No answer to the Cel yet? Looks like a couple of those connector resistors and maybe jumping the connectors even may do the trick. DSM have you made any progress with this?


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

GTI010H20 said:


> Anything new with this Mod? No answer to the Cel yet? Looks like a couple of those connector resistors and maybe jumping the connectors even may do the trick. DSM have you made any progress with this?


Aside from driving around for many thousands of miles with no issues (aside from a CEL), nothing new to report.
And it appears that IE and INA have lost interest somewhat also. Although as stated somewhere in here, some of their existing products _MAY_ already work to defeat the CEL.


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## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

dsm1983 said:


> Aside from driving around for many thousands of miles with no issues (aside from a CEL), nothing new to report.
> And it appears that IE and INA have lost interest somewhat also. Although as stated somewhere in here, some of their existing products _MAY_ already work to defeat the CEL.


Sorry was working on your A/C delete kit which is now done and been in testing for 2 weeks to make sure that high load bearing that does not fail 

let me know what you need anytime of the day and ill help out


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

INA said:


> Sorry was working on your A/C delete kit which is now done and been in testing for 2 weeks to make sure that high load bearing that does not fail
> 
> let me know what you need anytime of the day and ill help out


Oh realllly... Can you PM me with details??? Going to assume it frees up a few ponies


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## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

dsm1983 said:


> Oh realllly... Can you PM me with details??? Going to assume it frees up a few ponies


 Dont know until you hit the dyno!


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## ThatGuyRyan (Oct 21, 2006)

dsm, thanks for the great DIY. I have a CEL from P1424 (Secondary Air Injection System; Bank 1: Leak Detected) and was lead here which should help me fix it so I can pass inspection. Of course now that I see this I want to rip all that **** outta there, but we'll wait until I've got a sticker first :laugh: 

Very interested to see if this ends up being CEL/inspection proof. Best of luck!


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## GTI010H20 (Jan 23, 2010)

really just gotta figure out what resistors work with what connector. This is what I'm guessing at least. I would do it now but I have to pass emissions in a few months for the first time. After that I'll have two years to figure out a CEL fix. There's gotta be a way though.


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

_2 fault codes from the SAI Delete 
_ 

009266 - Secondary. Air Inj. Sys. Flow/Pressure Sens Bank 1 
P2432 - 000 - Short to Ground - MIL ON 
Freeze Frame: 
Fault Status: 11100000 
Fault Priority: 0 
Fault Frequency: 1 
Mileage: 30966 km 
Time Indication: 0 
Date: 2014.14.02 
Time: 14:42:46 

Freeze Frame: 
RPM: 0 /min 
Load: 0.0 % 
Speed: 0.0 km/h 
Temperature: 60.0∞C 
Temperature: 45.0∞C 
Absolute Pres.: 980.0 mbar 
Voltage: 12.192 V 

005170 - Secondary Air Injection Solenoid Valve (N112) 
P1432 - 000 - Open Circuit - MIL ON 
Freeze Frame: 
Fault Status: 11100000 
Fault Priority: 0 
Fault Frequency: 1 
Mileage: 30966 km 
Time Indication: 0 
Date: 2014.14.02 
Time: 14:44:58 

Freeze Frame: 
RPM: 1188 /min 
Load: 15.3 % 
Speed: 0.0 km/h 
Temperature: 60.0∞C 
Temperature: 44.0∞C 
Absolute Pres.: 980.0 mbar 
Voltage: 11.938 V


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## GTI010H20 (Jan 23, 2010)

dsm1983 said:


> _2 fault codes from the SAI Delete
> _
> 
> 009266 - Secondary. Air Inj. Sys. Flow/Pressure Sens Bank 1
> ...


Hmmmm judging by the description of those faults it would seem they could somehow be electronically tricked. Seems like a different fault than the incurable one described in the block off plate's product description. 

Maybe two resistors and one is re grounded to the body off of both connectors from the resistor to the body?


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## Alexvr (Feb 6, 2008)

so i have a cct tsi and i was wondering ig there has yet to be a cel light delete? also i will be needing a block off plate and a sensor from http://www.postreleased.com? looking to do this the next few days


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

CCTA engines do not have the Secondary Air System, so this does not apply to you. You don't need a block of plate or anything. :thumbup:


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## NEW2B (Dec 1, 2006)

maybe someone here can help me, 
a day after my k04 install i started the car up and got mil light on, 

"secondary air injection system bank 1 insufficient flow p0491." 
I don't hear the pump running when I start it in the morning 

problem is the shop is 2.5 hours away. 
can anyone advise what could i check on my own , 
for 50k miles and never had this issue, im assuming they did not put something back properly. maybe i can save myself the trip back there? 
thanks..


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

Might pull the trigger on some of those resistors just to try and figure this out on my own.


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

dsm1983 said:


> Might pull the trigger on some of those resistors just to try and figure this out on my own.


I'm not too familiar as to what resistors to get otherwise I'll be right there with you. I would think it would work as long as the voltage doesn't fluctuate like the CANBUS system. Still not sure were in VCDS you'd be able to tweak it. Do you have an insight DSM?


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

dsm1983 said:


> Might pull the trigger on some of those resistors just to try and figure this out on my own.


do eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet
Figuring out how to cure the CEL for the DP was enough of hte pain in the ass for the time being. I dont even want to start messing with evap stuff LoL

Keep us posted with your findings :thumbup:


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> do eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet
> Figuring out how to cure the CEL for the DP was enough of hte pain in the ass for the time being. I dont even want to start messing with evap stuff LoL
> 
> Keep us posted with your findings :thumbup:


how did u end up getting rid of the CEL for the dp?


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

sum41kid861 said:


> how did u end up getting rid of the CEL for the dp?


2nd o2 spacer: 42D spacer, Autozone Spark Plug non fouler (drilled out)

3rd o2 spacer: Wayne Angle Block, Autozone Spark Plug non Fouler (NOT drilled out), Autozone Spark Plug non Fouler (drilled out)


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

when referring to 2nd and 3rd are you including the one ON the turbo as #1, top of dp #2, and after cat #3?


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## koko5869 (Feb 15, 2006)

Getting rid of the "missing pump" code is easy. 

It's the "incorrect flow" code that has been killer for years. 

Has anyone brought anything up to arin at apr?


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## Ricky Bobby (Sep 29, 2005)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> 2nd o2 spacer: 42D spacer, Autozone Spark Plug non fouler (drilled out)
> 
> 3rd o2 spacer: Wayne Angle Block, Autozone Spark Plug non Fouler (NOT drilled out), Autozone Spark Plug non Fouler (drilled out)



SHUT THE EFF UP? You cured the CEL, and you're CBFA right???
Have you scanned for any insufficient flow codes or anything of the sort? How long has the CEL been gone? And is the 42DD spacer the same as Wayne's angle block, I would just get 2 of whichever then.

If so I'm very happy for you, because I have emissions testing next year and have no intention of putting stock DP back on, and I'd love to switch to APR non-testpipe file just so I can pass!


The first o2 on the turbo has no spacer on right, and you have Eurojet DP which is a 100 cell metal cat?


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

sum41kid861 said:


> when referring to 2nd and 3rd are you including the one ON the turbo as #1, top of dp #2, and after cat #3?


correct
From front to back of car
1,2,3



Ricky Bobby said:


> SHUT THE EFF UP? You cured the CEL, and you're CBFA right???
> Have you scanned for any insufficient flow codes or anything of the sort? How long has the CEL been gone? And is the 42DD spacer the same as Wayne's angle block, I would just get 2 of whichever then.
> 
> If so I'm very happy for you, because I have emissions testing next year and have no intention of putting stock DP back on, and I'd love to switch to APR non-testpipe file just so I can pass!
> ...


 Correct, TSI CBFA, NO CEL.

Occasionally the CEL will come and go (signal rich and/or/both signal lean, on both sensors) but I am 95% CEL free (for over a month now). 
The first time the CEL came back I used vag com to get rid of it and it didn't return for 3 days, then went away OMW home from work that evening.
I origionally bought the Wayne Angle block 2 years ago and I tried to just use that with steel wool to defeat the CEL, and rather than messing with contacting him I just went straight to 42D Design for my 2nd spacer.
Now that everything is working, I ain't touching it 

Keep in mind that I do drive ~50 miles a day round trip to work and I love to drive everywhere so I am putting more than enough mileage on these spacers. I would estimate I have over 1k miles since I had everything sorted out.


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

from the golfmk6 forums:



GunMetalGTI said:


> Not saying anything else but Eurodyne can turn this fault code off among man others. Just learned about it today.


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

dsm1983 said:


> from the golfmk6 forums:


YES!!!:heart::thumbup:


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## koko5869 (Feb 15, 2006)

MasterNele03 said:


> I'm not too familiar as to what resistors to get otherwise I'll be right there with you. I would think it would work as long as the voltage doesn't fluctuate like the CANBUS system. Still not sure were in VCDS you'd be able to tweak it. Do you have an insight DSM?


If you take a voltmeter and select the ohms (resistance)(also a funny upside down horseshoe looking thing), put a probe on each side of the plug and it'll.give you a reading. 
That's the size of the resistor you need to get rid of the "missing pump" code. 
For mk4 1.8t's, it is a 440 ohm resistor. Don't know if that'll help you at all. 

I have a 24v mk2 coming to my garage soon to wire up and get running, after that ill see if I can dig into the Mk6 a little more. 

Also 440ohm resistor to remove the Evap purge valve on the mk4s


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## MasterNele03 (May 27, 2008)

koko5869 said:


> If you take a voltmeter and select the ohms (resistance)(also a funny upside down horseshoe looking thing), put a probe on each side of the plug and it'll.give you a reading.
> That's the size of the resistor you need to get rid of the "missing pump" code.
> For mk4 1.8t's, it is a 440 ohm resistor. Don't know if that'll help you at all.
> 
> ...


Oh great thanks, that def does help getting rid of the "missing pump" error code, but how would you go about doing the "incorrect flow" code? hmm


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## koko5869 (Feb 15, 2006)

A question for the ages my friend.


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## Deütsche Möb (Dec 5, 2011)

Going to Wuste2012 in Las Vegas. Hopefully IE will have some resistors that we can try out. :thumbup:


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

koko5869 said:


> If you take a voltmeter and select the ohms (resistance)(also a funny upside down horseshoe looking thing), put a probe on each side of the plug and it'll.give you a reading.
> That's the size of the resistor you need to get rid of the "missing pump" code.
> For mk4 1.8t's, it is a 440 ohm resistor. Don't know if that'll help you at all.
> 
> ...


 wrong. 



Deütsche Möb said:


> Going to Wuste2012 in Las Vegas. Hopefully IE will have some resistors that we can try out. :thumbup:


 all this evap stuff has been done already. run a proper search. 

i have no N80, no SAI, no SAI pressure sensor, etc. 

some pics can be found on the build thread... the resistor info? look it up.


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## PatientlyWaiting (Apr 28, 2005)

thygreyt said:


> some pics can be found on the build thread... the resistor info? look it up.


 I searched your thread for 15 solid minutes, I did not see anything about a resistor size. Here's to helping the community!


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## Deütsche Möb (Dec 5, 2011)

thygreyt said:


> wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Thanks for all the invaluable info. :what: 
Seriously though, if you're such a wealth of knowledge on the topic, then please enlighten us. (Obviously needs to be specific to the cbfa tsi.)


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

ViRtUaLheretic said:


> OP, have you contacted Ross Tech about this?
> There may be an option (hopefully) that allows us to disable the SAI check in vag com.
> If you haven't I will contact them and ask them.


 no, that will not be possible. sai is coded in flash. it must be disabled by a tuner or someone equally competent.


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

any updates on this topic?


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## dsm1983 (Aug 8, 2009)

sum41kid861 said:


> any updates on this topic?


unfortunately not.
engine runs great though!


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## Custom158 (Sep 4, 2006)

Ricky Bobby said:


> SHUT THE EFF UP? You cured the CEL, and you're CBFA right???
> Have you scanned for any insufficient flow codes or anything of the sort? How long has the CEL been gone? And is the 42DD spacer the same as Wayne's angle block, I would just get 2 of whichever then.
> 
> If so I'm very happy for you, because I have emissions testing next year and have no intention of putting stock DP back on, and I'd love to switch to APR non-testpipe file just so I can pass!
> ...


FYI APR stage 2 file turns off the 2nd o2 sensor (yes i know theres one up on the turbo but i dont consider it to be a part of the exhaust system so much as part of the turbo) from reading/throwing a code. i have a 3"tb with no spacers or anything on my CBFA, and with APR S2 tune i got no lights.

bump cause i've been tracking this thread once and a while to get updates once the CEL issue gets solved


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## reflected (Apr 6, 2007)

this is an me17.5 2.5l ecu but the edits are the same on the med17.5.(2) 2.0t engine.

all emissions passed.


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## ViRtUaLheretic (Aug 17, 2008)

Custom158 said:


> FYI APR stage 2 file turns off the 2nd o2 sensor (yes i know theres one up on the turbo but i dont consider it to be a part of the exhaust system so much as part of the turbo) from reading/throwing a code. i have a 3"tb with no spacers or anything on my CBFA, and with APR S2 tune i got no lights.
> 
> bump cause i've been tracking this thread once and a while to get updates once the CEL issue gets solved


APR Strage 2 *TESTPIPE *file turns off the o2 sensor (no CEL)
The APR Stage 2 *NON TESTPIPE* file leaves the signal alone (will get a CEL)

As stated before I run a catless 3" Eurojet downpipe with the APR *NON TESTPIPE* file and with the addition of spacers and non foulers I am CEL free and can pass an obd2 scan.


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## ThatGuyRyan (Oct 21, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Bump for visibility. Has anyone anywhere made any progress here?


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## PowerslavePA (Dec 9, 2014)

Yes, reviving another thread, I read the post with the pictures, cool, however; 
I removed the two 13mm bolts that hold the SAI on to the front horn/frame rail, but
it still won't drop down. I only need to get it down to install the skid plate bracket under
the SAI bracket. I got the riv-nut in, past the SAI bracket, but it won't drop down
any more than 1/4" 

Oh, I see there is a 3rd one behind the cover to get the fogs, is that the fender-well
cover in the liner, or the front cover? I have fogs installed, and to replace the
bulbs on mine, I have covers in the fender liner... I will see if I can get at it
tomorrow... Thanks for the post...

I only need to drop it down so I can install the Osiris skid plate bracket on this
side. I do not want to delete it, YET...


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## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

Great write-up!


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## sum41kid861 (Oct 30, 2006)

sooooooooo resistor size?


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