# Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!!



## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

mY vr swap is about 90% done, but has been held up by the wiring.
ALL electrical test at the ecu connector are good but when I turn the 
ignition the fuel pumps don't prime (or do anything for that matter).The starter motor turns but that's all that I get.If I jumper the two appropriate pins at the ecu connector (as per the bentley) the fuel pumps run fine.Any input from you guys would be greatly appreciated.
Marc


_Modified by str8gone at 12:06 AM 9-14-2005_


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (str8gone)*

follow up ? :
If the ignition switch is bad would the starter motor still turn or not?


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## G60Driver (Mar 6, 2002)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (str8gone)*

I had these EXACT problems on my MKIII Cabrio VR6 swap and my troubles were because my MAIN power wire was not correctly connected. Check into it. My ECU wasn't getting direct/constant 12v power. Once I fixed that problem it started right up!
Hope this helped!
-T.J.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (G60Driver)*

Thanks but that's not it....ALL electrical tests done at the 68 pin ecu
connector are good,constant power is there.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (str8gone)*

update:
the ignition switch is fine.....I have no idea what the problem is.
Any info would be appreciated.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (str8gone)*

ttt


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## vVWwDUB (Sep 2, 2002)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (str8gone)*

this is kind of a shot in the dark...but maybe the fuel pump relay?


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (vVWwDUB)*

nope thats working correctly,but thanks.I've gone over the fuses,relays and wiring again and again,it all seems to result in some serious head scratching


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## UndergroundVWparts (Jan 28, 2003)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (str8gone)*

Try thing's like alarm harness by pass or clutch lock out by pass.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (UndergroundVWparts)*

will try ...thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: Wiring woes with my a2 vr6 swap.....HELP!!! (str8gone)*

bump


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## 87 VW GTI (Aug 15, 2003)

Check grounds maybe? Hmm good question. Be sure ECU has a good ground.


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## wagenbob (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: (87 VW GTI)*









Do you see the white plug right above the front motor mount? We had it reversed with the other plug, and we had neither spark nor fuel. Switched it, and we had both. Give that a try. I think they were the crank speed sensor and a knock sensor, but I don't remember precisely. Good luck.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (wagenbob)*

I thought about the possiblility of those two connectors being reversed but if I remember correctly they were color specific(one white, one black).I will definitely give switching the two a try.Thanks for the input!


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

ttt


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## slow2dr (Mar 2, 2002)

the ecu is suppose to give a ground signal to the fuel pump relay... need to see if its doing so... 
def. need to have all powers right..... key ons and the constants! it needs to see the switch..
if its a straight central electric swap then recheck the red/blue wire... yellow end...


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (slow2dr)*

elaborate on the red/blue wire ,yellow end thing....red/blue from the ecu? etc
thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

b-u-m-p


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

ttt


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

bump


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## Hellmet (May 22, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

What was the donor car? OBD1 or 2?


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (Hellmet)*

obd1 passat w/ coilpack
thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

bump


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## phatvr6 (Nov 13, 2001)

the ecu controls the fuel pump by earthing the contorl leg. the wir it uses it yellow, with a green tracer (i think). on some harnesses, that wire has a break in it, and the wire is yellow/blue on the other side of the connector. it's for plugging in an immobiliser. you can either put a fue in to bridge it, ot cut off the yellow connector and solder the yellow.green and yellow.blue wires together.
look for that yellow connector, I bet it's there with nothing plugged into it.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (phatvr6)*

sounds good.I have a yellow 2 pin connector that is unused,but I'm not sure about the specific colors....I check it out
Thanks Again


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Well, I tried the yellow connector trick but still no dice.The colors were
green and the other was blue/red.If i run a jumper wire on the ecu 68 pin connector,(with ecu disconnected) ,from pin 6 to pin 55 as per the bentley,the fuel pumps run as they should when the key is turned.But with the ECU connected nothing happens. This really sux alot
Thanks for the ideas....keep em coming


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

bump


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

ttt


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

someone.........anyone,ideas,shots in the dark,total guesses,anyting


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

bump


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## allDUBS (Jul 28, 2001)

*Re: (str8gone)*

possibly an ECM problem..... if you jump from one pin to another bypassing the ecm, and the pumps run fine, then that would tell me something in the ECM... or whatever is supposed to tell the ecm to make that connection is not sending the signal to do so.. but at this point it kinda sounds like you have exhausted those possible signal sending scenarios.. Have you seen this motor run before with this ECM? in the swap could have possibly been damaged? Maybe try swapping an ECM from a different car.. if this an early VR U shouldn't need to code anything differently for a different ECM.. 
Maybe you already tried this, but I thought I would give it my best.. Good Luck http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (allDUBS)*

allDUBS,Thanks for the input.I agree it seems like an ecu prob but I'm no expert(obviously).I have power to the ecu,power at the cam sensor and coilpack wires but it just doesn't want to go.It seems to me that something is keeping the spark/fuel at bay.I've been over these wires at least 20 times and everything seems to be as in the bentley diagrams.Possibly a clutch pedal safety switch????I don't know if the 93/94 passat had one but it's something I have to look into,although
there aren't any unused wires that would go to said switch.
Thanks Again!


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

bump cause I'm still lost


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## vwcentralVR6 (Dec 23, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

does the car actually start and run? On my swap had similar problem. Finally just tried it and it ran without the fuel pump noise. I guess i wired it through the relay but the lead from the ecu was what was operating the relay. Now there is no pump running when the key is in the on position. The pump only runs when the engine is cranking and/or running which is fine by me.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (vwcentralVR6)*

I actually never tried to start it.I figured since the pumps weren't priming that something was wrong.I guess I should try it and see if she goes, huh?
Thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

I used a voltmeter to test for power to the fuel pumps during cranking
and there is none.There is also no spark from the spark plugs.Does the o2 sensor need to be plugged in for these things to work?That is the only thing that I can come up with that may be holding me back.
Thanks


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## heathens (Apr 30, 2001)

*Re: (str8gone)*

It should still start without the O2 sensor plugged in.


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## heathens (Apr 30, 2001)

*Re: (heathens)*

Crank position sensor? maybe


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (heathens)*

how much is that sensor from the st****r? anyone have a part # (93 passat)
Thanks


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## heathens (Apr 30, 2001)

*Re: (str8gone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *str8gone* »_how much is that sensor from the st****r? anyone have a part # (93 passat)
Thanks

Not sure about thru the dealership, but i think it is like $70 thru vwparts.com or parts4vws.com


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (heathens)*

the only connectors on the ecu harness that I have not used are as follows:
Black single connector with a black/white wire (destination unknown)
Brown single connector with a yellow/black wire (malfunction ind. light)
Black single connector with a lilac/white wire (instrument cluster)
Yellow DOUBLE connector with 1)blue/red and 2) green (a/c stuff)
brown DOUBLE connector with 1) grey/white and 2) yellow ( data link )
The first connector listed above DOESN'T come directly from the ecu,but I can't seem to find it in the wiring diagram.Does anybody know where this wire is supposed to go or at least where is is coming from???


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

bump


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

ttt


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## vwflygti (Sep 11, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Are you using the a2 16v fuel pumps?, just curious...
I switched over to the vr tank and single fuel pump and never had a single problem.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (vwflygti)*

Yeah I am using the 16v pumps,but the problem is not compatibility but rather setting them to go.I posted earlier that they work when electrical tests are performed at the ecu 68 pin connector(with ecu disconnected).But something is keeping the fuel and spark from happening when I try to star the car.I am looking into the crank and cam position sensors to see if they could be the cause.
Thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

The above post should read,GETTING THE PUMPS TO GO, not setting....oops


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Changed the following sensors(new from vw):
Crank position sensor
cam position sensor
and vehicle speed sensor (in tranny)
STILL NO GO.How can I check my ecu to make sure it isn't fried?
Thanks


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## turbo12v (Jul 11, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

did you test the grounds to the ecu I think it is pin 1/54 pin 54/55 and pin 33/54 . 33 is basicly the intire engine harness. I mean I know you said that the coilpack and cam sensor has pwr but does it have ground. if no Then try disconnecting the lage twist connector by the motor and spraying in contact cleaner and then reattaching it. while this seams stupit is just solved the np spark / fuel issue in my corrado vr swap


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (turbo12v)*

Nothing sounds stupid at this point...Thanks for the input,I'll give it a try!!


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

OOPS....MY ECU is fried AND the vehicle spped sensor(in the tranny) has definitely seen better days. And I couldn't figure out why it wouldn't start...DOH! I am in the proces of trying to locate a replacement ECU...Speed sensor and crank,cam sensor were already replaced.
Anyone have an 021 906 258 AT ECU (or equivalent)?
Email [email protected]
Thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Okay....I'm getting somewhere now BUT....I have spark and the fuel pumps prime but I have no voltage to the pumps when cranking her over....Anyone know what tis could be?
Thanks in advance!


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## turbo12v (Jul 11, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

it sounds like the main power to the fuse pannel. it when the car cranks everything is meant to turb off except what is needed to start the cat. ie fuel pump,ecu, and other vitral engine parts. maybe you have it powered off something that shuts gdown....btw what did you HAVE TO DO TO GET THIS FAR,


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (turbo12v)*

MY ECU was fried AND the vehicle speed sensor(in the tranny) was shot.Speed sensor and crank,cam sensor were replaced.
Thanks


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## toplessvdub (Jul 27, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

whats up I have been reading about your progress If nothing, you are dedicated I respect that.Iam starting my project in 4 weeks iam not sure if I should use the 89 jetta or the cab for my vr6 swap.I wish you good luck with yours I wish i had an in put. I would have been stuck like you.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (toplessvdub)*

FOR SALE.....BYOT (bring your own towtruck).
I am through with this sh**


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## wagenbob (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *str8gone* »_FOR SALE.....BYOT (bring your own towtruck).
I am through with this sh**

Aaack! I hope you don't give up, you're so damn close.


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## jok3sta (Oct 19, 2000)

*Re: (str8gone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *str8gone* »_FOR SALE.....BYOT (bring your own towtruck).
I am through with this sh**

man i knwo exactly how u feel man.. i was in the same stage wanting to dump my ish.. ull find out what the problem is accidentally watch.. then u will be the happiest u ever been in a long time.. trust me.. stick wit it u wont regret it..


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (jok3sta)*

Thanks for the words of wisdom all....
bump!


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

and inspiration...appreciated


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## toplessvdub (Jul 27, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

come on you are almost done.I got a few cats working @ a vw dealer ship I will talk to them also i know a guy who has been race rabbits since the late 80s he might know some one.dont give up.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (toplessvdub)*

I would appreciate you speaking to the people you know.
Thanks Again!


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## VW1990CORRADO (Sep 30, 2000)

*Re: (str8gone)*

check for corrosion on the engine harness connector.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (VW1990CORRADO)*

I doubt that would keep the fuel pumps from running but I will give it a try.
Thanks VW1990CORRADO!


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

This is the .....anyone care to venture a quess as to why I have no power to the fuel pumps while cranking bump


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## wagenbob (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

So it's cranking, you have no fuel. Previously, you said you also have no spark. Is that still the case?


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (wagenbob)*

I now HAVE SPARK and the fuel pumps prime w/key as they should, but I have no power to pumps while cranking.
Thanks


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## vwcentralVR6 (Dec 23, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Don"t remember what wire color it is exactly but the gist is take the wire that primes the pumps and reinstall it to power while cranking/running. Sounds like the wire is just in the wrong location.You may end up with no pumps running like i said before but when it is cranked or started it will run http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Vr61552vw (Nov 6, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

theres also a red and brown wire that is supposed to be hooked to constant im pretty sure. i went throughh all this and hooked it up and it started,,,


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (Vr61552vw)*

"theres also a red and brown wire that is supposed to be hooked to constant im pretty sure. i went throughh all this and hooked it up and it started,,,"
Can you elaborate on the above statement???
Thanks


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## max98069 (Jul 10, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

aright this sounds stupid but i had the same problem with my a2 vr6

i used complete obd 2 wiring from passat 
and i bought a auto tech q chip and put it in b4 i started the motor in my a2 and wouldnt do anything
so i too it out put the stuck chip in and started right up

so if ur runnin after market chip make sure its in right or try back to stock
alpine white a2 vr6 golf


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (max98069)*

no aftermarket chip.....thanks though


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

bump


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## The Transplanter (Jan 19, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Recap:
You have a spark whilst the engine is cranking but the fuel pump doesnt run, Right?
Insight:
The low tension side of the ignition sends a signal to the fuel pump relay whilst cranking & running, this is a safety feature incase of an accident, i.e. No spark no fuel.
The signal on the VR ECU/M comes from the yellow/blue wire (T68) from memory, make sure this wire is connected to the original "low tension" wire that feeds you fuel pump relay (cant be more acurate as i do not have a US diagram but this would have come from the original coil)
Al


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (The Transplanter)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The Transplanter* »_Recap:
You have a spark whilst the engine is cranking but the fuel pump doesnt run, Right?
Al

Correct....Thnaks, I will give that a look


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (The Transplanter)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The Transplanter* »_
The signal on the VR ECU/M comes from the yellow/blue wire (T68) from memory, make sure this wire is connected to the original "low tension" wire that feeds you fuel pump relay (cant be more acurate as i do not have a US diagram but this would have come from the original coil)
Al

I think you are referring to T68/6 Yel/Blue which goes to fusebox position G1/3 which is pin 85 of the fuel pump relay correct?


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## The Transplanter (Jan 19, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

That sounds about right








What fuse panel and fuel pump relay are you using?
If using the VR fuse panel then the live to the FP is located @ G2/8, make sure you have a live here whilst cranking the motor, if not work the diagnosis back from there.
If you have spliced the VR wiring into a pre 90 fuse (pre CE) panel then I would recomend making a mini loom for the fuel pump using the VR relay as follows:
1. T68/6 - G1/3 = 3/85 on relay
2. 2/86 on relay - Track 15 (Ignition live)
3. 6/30 on relay - Track 30 (Permanent live)
4. 4/87 on Relay - G2/8 - fuel pump 
Sorry if this is a bit sketchy as this is from memory just now, no diagrams to hand







Just check in the Bentley manual if you have one


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (The Transplanter)*

Thanks for the input....much appreciated


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (The Transplanter)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The Transplanter* »_That sounds about right








What fuse panel and fuel pump relay are you using?
If using the VR fuse panel then the live to the FP is located @ G2/8, make sure you have a live here whilst cranking the motor, if not work the diagnosis back from there.
If you have spliced the VR wiring into a pre 90 fuse (pre CE) panel then I would recomend making a mini loom for the fuel pump using the VR relay as follows:
1. T68/6 - G1/3 = 3/85 on relay
2. 2/86 on relay - Track 15 (Ignition live)
3. 6/30 on relay - Track 30 (Permanent live)
4. 4/87 on Relay - G2/8 - fuel pump 
Sorry if this is a bit sketchy as this is from memory just now, no diagrams to hand







Just check in the Bentley manual if you have one

I checked out the above connections and it is all hooked as it should be,I am stumped
Thanks for the post TRANSPLANTER


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## R (Oct 28, 2000)

*Re: (str8gone)*

What is the status of your O2 sensor? Do you have one or two?
When I swapped a 2.0L into my golf I had issues with the fuel pump relay. I found the problem to be the ground that the ecu supplies to the fuel pump relay needed the O2 wiring to be intact.
Rick


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (R)*


_Quote, originally posted by *R* »_What is the status of your O2 sensor? Do you have one or two?
When I swapped a 2.0L into my golf I had issues with the fuel pump relay. I found the problem to be the ground that the ecu supplies to the fuel pump relay needed the O2 wiring to be intact.
Rick

One o2 sensor,condition unknown, but hooked up.I will look into that.
Thanks


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## Digivalver (Aug 24, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

is it obd1 or 2?


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (Digivalver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Digivalver* »_is it obd1 or 2?


obd1 (94 passat)


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## 87 VW GTI (Aug 15, 2003)

You do not need an o2 sensor. I recently got my a2 vr6 running and still haven't hooked up the o2 sensor after a month. Did you change the ecu yet? What happens if you use a jumper for the fuel pump and try starting it? Does it go? If so, temporarily make a manual fuel pump control switch. Like a racecar








Any ways if thats your only problem I wouldn't worry too much. It has to be something stupid. Just study a bentley fuel pump and relay diagrams like crazy and you'll find your problem. Good luck http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (87 VW GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *87 VW GTI* »_
Just study a bentley fuel pump and relay diagrams like crazy and you'll find your problem. Good luck http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif

I've been studying one like crazy.So crazy I've been institutionalized twice.
Thanks for the input


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

UPDATE:
The only thing sketchy that I have found that I only have 2.5 volts
at the ecu connector between pins 33 and 54 when it should be approx. battery voltage(This is one of the ground tests as per the bentley).
If I spray starting fluid in the throttle body the car fires right up,so that tells me that everything else is ok.I just can't figure out why the fuel pump doesnt run while cranking
It is possible that the injectors aren't spraying either but I assume that if I fix the fuel pump prob. that will also fix the inj prob.
Any input appreciated!


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## The Transplanter (Jan 19, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Wow your still battling with this one http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
If it starts with "starting fluid" at least you know its fuel prob








I would do both of these two things at this stage:
1. Bypass the wiring to the fuel pump as mentioned above. If it runs you know its a relay/wiring problem
2. Check the feed to the injectors whilst the engine is cranking over. If you have no feed then work back to the ECU, if the wires are ok then you could be looking at an ECU problem.
Everytime I see this thread my Bently manual is elsewhere DOH


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (The Transplanter)*


_Quote, originally posted by *The Transplanter* »_
2. Check the feed to the injectors whilst the engine is cranking over. If you have no feed then work back to the ECU, if the wires are ok then you could be looking at an ECU problem. 

I'm not sure how to do this.
What is really bothering me though is the fact that I only have 2.5 volts across pins 54 and 33 at the ecu connector(ecu disconnected).








Any possibilities as to why this is?
Thanks


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## mk2dub4ever (Oct 22, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

try push starting http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
EDIT: 2nd gear works best


_Modified by mk2dub4ever at 3:47 PM 10-5-2004_


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## R (Oct 28, 2000)

*Re: (str8gone)*

If it were me with this problem instead of you... there would be no gas problem. I'd of gone to the corner station bought 5 gal of the cheap stuff, returned to the car, pored all 5 gals into drivers seat stepped back a few yards and tossed in a lit propane torch.
No more problem.
A simple way to bypass fuel pump relay control wiring... remove relay from fuse panel, take a small screwdriver and work the edges of the plastic cover on the relay and the cover will come off without breaking. 
After you get the cover off plug it back into the fuse panel. Use a pencil or something similar to push the contacts closed. You should get fuel when you crank by doing this
Rick


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## DJMoney6916v (Aug 28, 2001)

*Re: (R)*

Try pulling the fuel pump relay out. Do you have power at terminal 30? If so, try jumping between 30 and I think 15 (dont qoute me on this). I have done it a bunch of times on other cars that have a bad relay but I can't remember the numbers off the top of my head. Doing this should constantly run your fuel pump and your car should fire up as long as your injectors are working.
Also, I am not saying that your relay is bad. But if you have power to 30 and you jump the correct pin on the relay, the pumps will run constant.
Where are you located in Nazareth? I am in the Allentown area and may be able to come look at it. I am going to be starting my own swap shortly and have done one VR swap myself, helped with another, and have also done a 2.0 crossflow swap.


_Modified by DJMoney6916v at 12:26 AM 10-9-2004_


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (DJMoney6916v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DJMoney6916v* »_Try pulling the fuel pump relay out. Do you have power at terminal 30? If so, try jumping between 30 and I think 15 (dont qoute me on this). I have done it a bunch of times on other cars that have a bad relay but I can't remember the numbers off the top of my head. Doing this should constantly run your fuel pump and your car should fire up as long as your injectors are working.
Where are you located in Nazareth? I am in the Allentown area and may be able to come look at it. I am going to be starting my own swap shortly and have done one VR swap myself, helped with another, and have also done a 2.0 crossflow swap.

_Modified by DJMoney6916v at 12:26 AM 10-9-2004_

I am near naz speedway. I would appreciate any help you could give me with this. I'll look into the relay jumper
Thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

bump


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## [email protected] (Mar 18, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Did you get this yet?
I have a 91 Jetta that recieved a 93 Passat VR in the shop right now.
I had the no spark,no fuel issue until I found one wire (red/yellow) that needed to have power. Let me know if you need me to look at or compare something for you.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Did you get this yet?
I have a 91 Jetta that recieved a 93 Passat VR in the shop right now.
I had the no spark,no fuel issue until I found one wire (red/yellow) that needed to have power. Let me know if you need me to look at or compare something for you.

No but I haven't really had time to work on it much.
Thanks for the reply....I replied to your pm


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## blkg60 (Apr 14, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

I am in a similar boat with my 90 corrado g60 to vr6 swap. Fuel pump isn't priming and had no spark either. We hooked up the single red/yellow wire to Y1 and we now have spark. It is also making the the fuel pump relay click super fast. 
So still do not have the fuel pump turning on. Any ideas as to why the relay is clicking super fast and not working properly?
By the way, we manually jumped the relay and the car fired right up.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (blkg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blkg60* »_
So still do not have the fuel pump turning on. Any ideas as to why the relay is clicking super fast and not working properly?
By the way, we manually jumped the relay and the car fired right up. 


I wish I could help you out but I have no idea whats going on with that one....are you sure you have the correct relay in there (67,or 167)


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## blkg60 (Apr 14, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

yeah relay is right. It's almost like there is too much power or not enough going to the relay. I don't know. Do you know how much voltage is is suppost to see?


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## 87 VW GTI (Aug 15, 2003)

Bypass the relay. If the pump runs and you still can't start it, then that would tell me the injectors aren't firing. I ran into this issue as well. Buy yourself a "Noid Light". It plugs into one of the injector plugs and will light while cranking if the injectors are firing. I picked mine up at autozone. It turned out that the motor harness had a bunch of corrosion on the terminals and wasn't making good contact. I bought battery terminal cleaner, sprayed it on there, dried it up, and bingo fired RIGHT up. 
Best of luck,
Chris


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## R (Oct 28, 2000)

*Re: (str8gone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *str8gone* »_
I'm not sure how to do this.
What is really bothering me though is the fact that I only have 2.5 volts across pins 54 and 33 at the ecu connector(ecu disconnected).








Any possibilities as to why this is?
Thanks

From looking at a wiring diagram I have here, your wire on term #33 is Brn/Blu and it ends up grounded to the engine block. But to get there it would have to go through the round twist plug that's on the engine.
The wire on #54 is red and goes to G1/9 on the fuse panel and that looks like your always hot lead(12v +) that is shared by #30 on fuel pump relay.
I would take a volt meter from the #54 term to a good ground. You should have battery voltage. If you do your Brn/Blu #33 wire has a problem. First place I'd look is at the plug on the engine.
If your voltage is low on #54 check it going towards the battery could be fusable link etc.
I sure hope that helps, you have been fighting this for a damn long time.
good luck,
Rick


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (R)*


_Quote, originally posted by *R* »_
I sure hope that helps, you have been fighting this for a damn long time.
good luck,
Rick

You're not lying,I have been at this forever.Thanks for the advice


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## blkg60 (Apr 14, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

since we are in a similar i thought i would add my thoughts and what i've been trying.
I thought i had a clicking sound coming from the fuel pump relay, but its actually coming fromthe fuel pump after run control module, aka heated O2 sensor control module. It's a relay not on the fuse block. I've read that this runs the fuel pump when the radiator fans are running to prevent vapor lock. not sure on that one. anyway, i have not hooked up the harness from the fan control module yet so i am wondering if it is causing my fuel pump after run module to click and freak out. Anybody know?
I have jumped the red/yellow wire from ecu to Y1 and now have spark. when i jump the fuel pump relay it primes and the car fires up and runs great. Take off jumper, turn key, and fuel pump makes a brief noise like its gonna turn on, then nothing. after run module starts clicking. I also have the 30 and 30b wires jumped too.
I am getting frustrated. Anyone know whats up with the fuel pump after run?


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## blkg60 (Apr 14, 2002)

*Re: (blkg60)*

alos could the N80 evap check valve up by the carbon canister have anything to do with the fuel pump after run module clicking? I have the canister out and when i plug the evap in it clicks like the after run module, with it unplugged it doesn't click. weird.
These are all things you might want to check if you haven't, Str8gone.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (blkg60)*

thanks for the info....My car will probably go untouched til the winter is over though,(too cold outside and I'm funding a motor build up for my bimmer,so....)


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## blkg60 (Apr 14, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

i hear ya. i dont have the option to let her sit til spring. Moving to Charlotte in a month. Gotta have it running.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (blkg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blkg60* »_i hear ya. i dont have the option to let her sit til spring. Moving to Charlotte in a month. Gotta have it running.

Good luck....keep me posted on any progress


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## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (str8gone)*

i am having the same symtoms in my swap to a 90 corrado
1) fires on starting fluid (have spark)
2) fuel pump relay doesnt come on (relay is good)
3) dont know what to do
any updates?


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brilliantyellowg60* »_i am having the same symtoms in my swap to a 90 corrado
1) fires on starting fluid (have spark)
2) fuel pump relay doesnt come on (relay is good)
3) dont know what to do
any updates?

Nope....sorry. I haven't looked at the vw for quite awhile now but I am gonna have another go at it soon. With the ECU disconnected,check for voltage across pins 33 and 54 on the ecu connector,should be approx. battery voltage.Mine only has about 2.5volts and I think that the reason is a bad ground somewhere but I have yet to find where.


_Modified by str8gone at 2:32 PM 9-16-2005_


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## old school a1s (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

When you have a chance get a Bentley manual for your gti and a passat manual and compare your relay designations the vr6 uses a completely different layout then the gti what you need to see is that the passat relays are different then the gti for running the ecm and the fuel system also you need to check for the t1 connector which is red with a yellow and red wire this needs to be put to constant 30 battery power what I`m figuring from your issues that the the relays are not in place correctly give me a rough diagram of where the relays are and I`ll try to get you a picture of the passat relay set up.Jay


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (old school a1s)*


_Quote, originally posted by *old school a1s* »_ what I`m figuring from your issues that the the relays are not in place correctly give me a rough diagram of where the relays are and I`ll try to get you a picture of the passat relay set up.Jay

Will do...Thanks


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Hey old school a1s.....I can't figure out how to attach pics here. Can you IM me your e mail addy and I'll send em to ya to look at.
Thanks!









_Modified by str8gone at 10:52 PM 9-13-2005_


_Modified by str8gone at 9:56 AM 9-14-2005_


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## old school a1s (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

It`s [email protected] send the pics.Jay


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (old school a1s)*

ttt


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

this is a "BUMPy" road


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

t t







t 


_Modified by str8gone at 6:43 PM 9-26-2005_


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

SOMEONE OFFER CASH FOR THIS P.O.S.







E mail me for pics of the car if you are interested in coming to get it. Keep in mind it will have to be towed, obviously.It has brand new tokico 5 way adjustable struts/shocks with neuspeed race springs,brand new neuspeed front sway bar,corrado cloth seats front and rear,brand new oe radiator,crank sensor,cam sensor,vehicle speed sensor.4 lug retained with 17x7.5 fittipaldi tubolare wheels,brand new (0 miles) yokohama parada spec 2 tires.90k on engine, Car was repainted in 98(Audi aluminum silver metallic),quad headlight grille,big bumpers with factory fogs, and manual m3 mirrors (body matched paint)
BUMP BUMP BUMP

_Modified by str8gone at 10:52 AM 10-4-2005_


_Modified by str8gone at 10:53 AM 10-4-2005_


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (str8gone)*

You should just pay someone to fix it. I'm pretty free in November.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_You should just pay someone to fix it. I'm pretty free in November.

HIRED!!! Pm me to work out the details when you are ready


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## 20vA2jetta (May 22, 2002)

*Re: (str8gone)*

skip that 33 to 54 test.what do you have from body ground to pin 54?
should have B+ all the time.check the yellow/ blue wire from the ecm in the crank position.should be grounded while cranking.do you have key on power @ the relay terminal 86?if oyu jump terminals 30 & 87 at the relay does the car start?


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (20vA2jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *20vA2jetta* »_skip that 33 to 54 test.what do you have from body ground to pin 54?
should have B+ all the time.check the yellow/ blue wire from the ecm in the crank position.should be grounded while cranking.do you have key on power @ the relay terminal 86?if oyu jump terminals 30 & 87 at the relay does the car start?

Thanks for the reply....I'll look into the above mentioned
These are for you


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## turbo12v (Jul 11, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*

sent im...... but first. get out your meter put the black lead to the battery ground and the other onto the piv 54 opn the compter harness. it is a red w/ yellow lead. make sure you ground out through the battery directly. this should have 12v with the ket on. Also what hapens if you jump out the ecm relay and the fuel pump relay. do you here the pump


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (turbo12v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbo12v* »_ what hapens if you jump out the ecm relay and the fuel pump relay. do you here the pump

If you mean run a jumper wire on the ecu connector from pins 54 and 6 (i think) yeah...the pumps run when I do this. I have power to pin 54 but I'm not sure if it stays hot with the key on or not....I'll check it.
Thanks for the reply and the im
I'll get back to ya,sounds good though


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## 85vdub (Apr 9, 2003)

are you sure your fuel lines aren't hooked up backwards? I didn't read the whole thread to see if this had been done. I did this on mine got it all ready to fire up and it wouldn't... checked had spark thought i had fuel for about 15 min until i finally pulled the return hose off and it was dry as a bone. swapped them around real quick hit the key and it fired off.


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## xpalendocious (Nov 28, 2003)

tomorrow i will take a picture of the back of a ce-2 fusepanel and show you whats wrong.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (xpalendocious)*


_Quote, originally posted by *xpalendocious* »_tomorrow i will take a picture of the back of a ce-2 fusepanel and show you whats wrong.

Awesome... thanks
pm sent!


_Modified by str8gone at 6:39 AM 10-14-2005_


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## xpalendocious (Nov 28, 2003)

*Re: (str8gone)*









You need to connect Y, 30, and 30B


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (xpalendocious)*


_Quote, originally posted by *xpalendocious* »_
You need to connect Y, 30, and 30B

Thanks...I'll try that this weekend


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## vesvw (Sep 5, 2001)

*Re: (str8gone)*

......I feel so bad for you....
Thats all, I have no idea as to your problem. I have only swapped once and it went fairly smooth. One of these guys close to you needs to come look at it.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (xpalendocious)*


_Quote, originally posted by *xpalendocious* »_








You need to connect Y, 30, and 30B

Tried this today......no dice


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (vesvw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vesvw* »_......I feel so bad for you....


Thanks.....I need all the support I can get at this point
Here's one on me


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## 85vdub (Apr 9, 2003)

*Re: (85vdub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *85vdub* »_are you sure your fuel lines aren't hooked up backwards? I didn't read the whole thread to see if this had been done. I did this on mine got it all ready to fire up and it wouldn't... checked had spark thought i had fuel for about 15 min until i finally pulled the return hose off and it was dry as a bone. swapped them around real quick hit the key and it fired off.

have you checked into this?


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## xpalendocious (Nov 28, 2003)

Any luck?


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (xpalendocious)*


_Quote, originally posted by *xpalendocious* »_Any luck?

Nope....but I found out that I have bat voltage to the fuel pumps while cranking, however I still don't have juice to the injectors.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (85vdub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *85vdub* »_
have you checked into this?

I suppose I could but I am not getting power to the injectors,actually, the power is there but the ground from the ecu is a.w.o.l.


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## dadzdub (Nov 25, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

Have tried talking to Lenny at L&T Enterprize he always sheds light on the subject. I'm also going to do a swap in my 91 Gti


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (dadzdub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dadzdub* »_Have tried talking to Lenny at L&T Enterprize 

I've been buying parts from him since forever, but I will NEVER take any vehicle of mine to him again for anything....I wouldn't let his people put air in my tires.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

ttt


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## bstdvr (Jun 11, 2004)

*Re: (str8gone)*

i know a bunch of people have been saying to check your relays and everything....i had very similar problems when doing my last vr swap....the relay that is in position 3 according to the mk3 red bentley is the ECM(engine control module) its a power supply....even with this relay removed or bad you can still crank over the motor but it will never start.....i went through all the tests and everthing just like you all the symptoms seem to be the same with the fuel and spark so give it a try....if not i can possibly come out there to help or even buy the car from you....send me some pics of the car and the fuse box [email protected] or hit me up on AIM(a1320perfomance)


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## bloody dismemberment (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: (bstdvr)*

thats the 109 relay its like 13 bucks at the dealer. i cant believe this car dont run yet.


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## str8gone (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (bloody dismemberment)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bloody dismemberment* »_ i cant believe this car dont run yet.

You better believe it, cause it doesn't

That relay was already replaced with a new one


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