# 1.8T or VR6?



## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

A 1.8T or VR6 for Golf III???? Help, need opinions!!! (j/k)







Just need some input, can't decide. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Mike0105 (Dec 31, 1999)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

I've driven a Golf 3 VR, and I myself own a mk4 GTI 1.8t with a chip and intake and must say I prefer driving the turbo. I mean I love the VR's smooth pull to redline and the sound it makes but when that turbo kicks in it is awesome. My car smokes most Vr's with only a chip and there is a little less weight up front so in theory the handling is better. I have a friend with a mk4 jetta VR and we've driven each others cars and although he says mine is faster he likes the powerband of his car better. Best thing you can do is drive both and see what you like. 
Mike 


[Modified by VWMike81, 4:32 PM 10-12-2001]


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (VWMike81)*

Thanks for the input Mike, I appreciate it! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'll test them out! Anyone else have any input for me?


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## jigga-man (Aug 5, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

I'll put those 1.8t's to bed!!!


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (jigga-man)*

A little cocky are we????







I'm just asking for opinions.


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## Dextrose (Apr 11, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (jigga-man)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I'll put those 1.8t's to bed!!![HR][/HR]​LMAO...that's some funnay ass poop!! But...I'm with ya!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## FlyGTI84 (May 1, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

Not this again. . .


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Dextrose)*

lol! You guys just made my day! Thanks!


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## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

both motors can be fun depending how you drive them.if you want boost get a 18t.if you want smooth rpm get a vr. the 18t is cheaper to add mods too.but if you strap a turbo on a vr its a different story.


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (a2vr6t)*

which would be faster then; the VR6 turbo or the 1.8T chipped??? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

quote:[HR][/HR]which would be faster then; the VR6 turbo or the 1.8T chipped??? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​well lets just say a 18t chipped is around 200hp k..
a vr turbo gets around 400hp..its like having 2 18ts in the same car!


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## Mike0105 (Dec 31, 1999)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (a2vr6t)*

Yeah but the turbo upgrade kits on the 1.8t's are becoming more and more available. I mean 280-300hp is relatively easy to attain with a t3 super 60 on a stock bottom end. If you want to turbo a VR and don't want to lower the compression you're only gonna be around 280 or so hp, maybe a little less. but if you built a VR to run a turbo and really handle alot of boost it would be killer. Oh and would you A2 VR guys stop thinkin you're the shiznit, cuase one of these days a 1.8t will show you whats up







Just messin with ya guys


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## T I N T E K S (Mar 1, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (VWMike81)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Yeah but the turbo upgrade kits on the 1.8t's are becoming more and more available. I mean 280-300hp is relatively easy to attain with a t3 super 60 on a stock bottom end. If you want to turbo a VR and don't want to lower the compression you're only gonna be around 280 or so hp, maybe a little less. but if you built a VR to run a turbo and really handle alot of boost it would be killer. Oh and would you A2 VR guys stop thinkin you're the shiznit, cuase one of these days a 1.8t will show you whats up







Just messin with ya guys














[HR][/HR]​yeah i know what you mean mike..
any motor can be fast ..all it takes is $$$$$..we both know this..
yeah the 18t is no joke..i now im building one








she just wanted to know what a chiped 18t is against a vr turbo..i said no comparison..
its all good...
on the lower compression...the vr can handle 1 bar with a thicker headgasket..


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## Mike0105 (Dec 31, 1999)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (a2vr6t)*

Obviously a chipped 1.8t isn't gonna be near a turbo'd VR, no replacement for displacement!! But the cost of turbo'ing a VR could be pretty pricey. all in all depends on what you want. A turbo'd VR would be pretty damn cool imho
Mike


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## pumbaa (Apr 20, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (VWMike81)*

I'll be Mr. Obvious today...
The VR would be easier to install as these were already available in your car..
But, it would be cheaper to sell your's and buy a VR...
Go with the unique factor.. 1.8T
Bob


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## vwmotorsports (Oct 23, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (VWMike81)*

A2 3.1 vr6









That is the way to go!!!


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## Hardcore VW (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (vwmotorsports)*

quote:[HR][/HR]A2 3.1 vr6








That is the way to go!!![HR][/HR]​Why? what has one of those ever done?


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## Hardcore VW (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

As for the original post,you should think about what you want your final product to be,you can make anything fast,these guys talking about this one being better than that one and so forth fail to realize,there's people with 8v's out there that they could never catch.


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*

I'm thinking about just doing a bad a$* turbo job on the 2.0, how does that sound??? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## Hardcore VW (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

if you have some money and someone out there with some skills,the sky is the limit,infact a 2.0 8v went 10.7 in the 1/4 here in NJ today.....what's the quickest a VR6 or a mighty 1.8t has went?Any of the other people that rants about how good a particular motor is even know?Anyway the point is,money and knowledge win everytime and one without the other is all but useless unless you share it.


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## dubb (Sep 14, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

If you want a vr A3,go buy one.....you cant buy a 1.8t A3.


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (dubb)*

I have a 1.8T A2 and let me tell you it's loads of fun. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
I've driven a few A2 VR's and them too are loads of fun. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Now I don't know how an A3 would feel. But I can tell you that each engine has it's own strengths. Like someone said before, try 'em both out and decide. Personally I would love to have both, an A2 VR and an A2 1.8T that would be sweet.








AS far as the this car will smoke that car crap... If you have money you can make any car smoke another car...we all know that. You can make 2.0's smoke VR's and 1.8T's you can make VR's smoke 2.0 Turbos and 1.8T's and you can make 1.8T's smoke this and that. Bah I hate those arguments, any car can be made fast depending on how much $$$ you spend.
Now if money is a factor you need to consider this, it is cheaper to do a VR swap than it is to do a 1.8T swap. With the left over money you would have from the VR swap you could do aditional things.
Yet, if you have the money to do the 1.8T swap it will be easier to crank power out of the 1.8T. One hardly has to mod internals or change compression on those engines when adding bigger turbo's. Some of these kids are already in the 12's in their 1.8T MK IV's








Some like the sound of the VR6 + Exhaust note
Some like the sound of the Turbo whine and the DV/BOV release air
It's so relative you know.
And lets not forget with more power always come "other" upgrades to try to get it al to the ground.
I voted for the 1.8T cause that is what I have and I love it. 
Good luck in making your decision.


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## ALpHaMoNk_VW (Mar 26, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (dubb)*

quote:[HR][/HR]If you want a vr A3,go buy one.....you cant buy a 1.8t A3.[HR][/HR]​Perfect point right there! make your car a signiture car that people will know as your car! your have it and not every dude around the block. The motor swap is not that hard from what i hear from a good source (don't know abou the wiring part though) it would be unique. that would win my vote. 2.0 turbo is killa nice too and a vr6 (unless you have a 4 door) you can just trade your car for one. Be unique go 1.8T A3







just go custom turbo if you plan on upgrading that stock turbo.
MY 2cents


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (ALpHaMoNk_VW)*

There's a dood in Canada *Lostboyscout* is his vortex name, he has a 1.8T A3 Jetta if I recall correctly. Sweet ride!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 4-door crap rabbit (Sep 4, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]....you can make anything fast,these guys talking about this one being better than that one and so forth fail to realize,there's people with 8v's out there that they could never catch.[HR][/HR]​yes, thank you for massaging my damaged 8v ego....








and as far as the subject goes, if you get the 1.8T (which is what i would do) you can always talk to the APR people if it's not fast enough for you.


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## Hardcore VW (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (4-door crap rabbit)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
and as far as the subject goes, if you get the 1.8T (which is what i would do) you can always talk to the APR people if it's not fast enough for you.[HR][/HR]​What has APR ever done?If I were gonna ask someone about a 1.8T it'd be someone that's done something with one like Alamo/Billy T.But with a 1.8 T,you STILL need a bigger turbo,you STILL need lower compression,you STILL need a chip...I dunno this is all MY opinions for projects I do....1.8T's aren't cost effective for the power they make,the initial cost is too high and you get a bunch of parts you don't even need.


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*


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## Hybrid VW (Jan 18, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*






















X2


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hybrid VW)*









You know what I'm talking about.


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## adamrules (Dec 26, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

both are really nice motors. for me it would depend more on what donor car i could find than anything else.
vr6 would be the easiest and cheapest i would think, just find a totaled car about the same year as yours and bolt it all up, but then again if your going to do this why not just buy a car with a vr in it to begin with?
1.8t would be sorta unique but a more complicated and expensive swap.
fi on your 2.0 is fine if it is a low milage motor, swaping in a newer 2.0 and fi-ing it is also an option. 
don't waste you time trying to fi a high milage motor.


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## mr Paul (Mar 10, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (adamrules)*

what about reliability for lightly modded cars like 1.8t:stock turbo chipped intake exhaust Vr6:intake exhuast chip, maybe,maybe some cams
there are many vr6's pushing over 150k, usually pretty stock but still running. we just havnt seen 1.8t's pusshing more than 100k, only cuz they havnt been around that long. so which lightly modded motor will be more reliable for the next lets say 4 years?
those are my only worries, each will make you very happy, very happy
paul


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## Hardcore VW (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

quote:[HR][/HR]








You know what I'm talking about.







[HR][/HR]​quote:[HR][/HR]








You know what I'm talking about.







[HR][/HR]​Well,I'm glad you 2 know what your talking about,instead of making googly eyes at each other,if you guy's have something to say,come out and say it,we can have conversations about disagreements....I THINK that's still allowed...13.6/106 is an acceptable time,but it's WAY at the low end of what that head is capable of,and you could've acheived those numbers turbocharging whatever motor came in your car originally with WAY less time/money,So unless a main part of your goal is to spend a lot of money,or to have a fashion show going on cause you have the hottest new trend of a motor,your not setting the world on fire,make all the googly eyes you want.


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Well,I'm glad you 2 know what your talking about,instead of making googly eyes at each other,if you guy's have something to say,come out and say it,we can have conversations about disagreements....I THINK that's still allowed...13.6/106 is an acceptable time,but it's WAY at the low end of what that head is capable of,and you could've acheived those numbers turbocharging whatever motor came in your car originally with WAY less time/money,So unless a main part of your goal is to spend a lot of money,or to have a fashion show going on cause you have the hottest new trend of a motor,your not setting the world on fire,make all the googly eyes you want.[HR][/HR]​You don't seem to want to have converstions, you sound arrogant and undermining,quote:[HR][/HR]So unless a main part of your goal is to spend a lot of money,or to have a fashion show going on cause you have the hottest new trend of a motor,your not setting the world on fire,make all the googly eyes you want.[HR][/HR]​ (you actually sound bitter) that's why I won't bother with an explanation. Have a







dude. (And I'm sure Kelly feels the same). You seem to be set on your beliefs and I would not want to change them, cause I practically do not care. I like what I have, I know it was worth the money (especially cause it only had 7000 Kilometers on the engine), I did it for me and not to impress anyone else, it's money well spent.
The person who posted to begine with wanted to know what to get I gave her my opinion and now I'm done with the thread. If you want to takl for real and have a discussion about it you may IM me privately.










[Modified by omegabyte, 7:43 AM 10-19-2001]


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## Hybrid VW (Jan 18, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
What has APR ever done?If I were gonna ask someone about a 1.8T it'd be someone that's done something with one like Alamo/Billy T.But with a 1.8 T,you STILL need a bigger turbo,you STILL need lower compression,you STILL need a chip...I dunno this is all MY opinions for projects I do....1.8T's aren't cost effective for the power they make,the initial cost is too high and you get a bunch of parts you don't even need.[HR][/HR]​1)APR has a 280hp kit- although on the pricey side 2)You don't NEED a bigger turbo- just a chip is plenty for lots of people 3)I've never heard of anyone lowering compression on a 1.8T, in fact, I was told by a friend that has his own engine shop, that depending on the size/shape/etc. of a combustion chamber, it is possible to run over 10:1 with high boost (20 psi) 4)You don't NEED a chip- we don't know what people need. That is like saying that everyone NEEDS a 900hp street car, which obviously, is not the case.
As for my car, I don't give a crap about fashion







My exterior mods are limited to euro bumpers and headlights and 15" wheels. I realize that I could go that fast with a turboed 16V, but mine had 200,000 miles on it, so I figured it would cost pretty close to the same to have the 16V rebuilt to take boost, put a turbo on it, tune it, etc. Plus, with the 1.8T, you get much more modern engine management, and a head that will do awesome with a cam change (maybe better than a fully done up 16V?- I don't know). BTW, that 13.6 was done as the car is driven every day- pump gas, fully inflated street tires (not drag radials), full interior, etc. I could get lower numbers, but that isn't what I'm about


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## adamrules (Dec 26, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hybrid VW)*

well said kelly. 
thats my only argument against 16v's, or g60's for that matter. they are are all too old (high milage) and by the time you get them rebuilt properly you have more money into them than you would to swap in a newer engine design. 
oh and. et's are not everything. my drive to work is not a quarter mile, or a dyno.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

Well, I have yet to own a 1.8T powered car, but have driven a number of them both chipped and not chipped. They're quick, fun and nimble. Great little motor, but you can drop $$ into it really quick for real power. If you're looking for the end all of VW performance, it's a good start.
If you're looking for a motor that can readily piss oil into the firewall and kill timing chain guides, the VR6 is for you







Seriously, the VR6 is a stout motor and if you add boost, it's a monster. I'd take the VR6 over the 1.8T just for the sound at WOT. And that is my $.02.


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (adamrules)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I realize that I could go that fast with a turboed 16V, but mine had 200,000 miles on it, so I figured it would cost pretty close to the same to have the 16V rebuilt to take boost, put a turbo on it, tune it, etc. [HR][/HR]​Exactly that's why I wrote:
quote:[HR][/HR](especially cause it only had 7000 Kilometers on the engine), [HR][/HR]​quote:[HR][/HR]oh and. et's are not everything. my drive to work is not a quarter mile, or a dyno. [HR][/HR]​Thank you!
quote:[HR][/HR]As for my car, I don't give a crap about fashion[HR][/HR]​Exactly! My exterior mods are limited to 16Wheels and Big bumpers, and both are there for performance reasons, the wheels to fit the breaks and the bumper for the intercooler. No colored lights, and other funky stuff, not saying that I would not mind some cool exterior mods though, just can't justify spending money on looks mods over performance.








Kelly I could not have said it better! Thank you.


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## plasmavw (Oct 16, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

why 1.8t it's a good engine and bless the person who came up with the idea but the vr6 i think would be the way to go it's a good trusty engine


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## plasmavw (Oct 16, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (a2vr6t)*

ok the 1.8T when chiped only get's about 185hp but that really pushes the turbo and leading to problems but the vr6 when turbod does not pull 400HP yoour crazy if turbod it will pull around 250hp you just made me laugh thanx


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

you guys are giving me great advice, but where did the looks of a car come up? I don't really care about how pretty my car is, I want go, not show! But as far as I know, i probably will not be getting a vr motor swap, I just think i want a really cool turbo on my 2.0. I don't want to do what everyone else has done. i want something to call my own project. I also want to do most of the work myself, maybe with some help of friends. But for the most part, I want something unique! By the time the prices drop on the 1.8T's everyone else will have one swapped in their car, just like the VR6's. That's why i'm just thinking turbo now. But if anyone has any objections or points to make about that, go ahead and post it. I'm up to talking to anyone who wants to talk about it, and give me a bunch of BS. So, just don't get antsy and say that one engine is better than another just cause you have one. Just say what you know!


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## jga (Jul 26, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (plasmavw)*

I prefer the 1.8t 20v. For what you want 400 hp if you have no traction at all? In the time you waste spinning tires with your 400hp VR6 a 1.8t 20v could smoke you. I see a Corrado VR6 Turbo Alcohol on the track, beautiful sound, about 600 hp, but you listen the car spinning tires from the start to the finish of the quarter mile.


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

If I were you and already ahd a 2.0 I would Turbo it. In fact I ahve a 2.0 MK IV and do plan on adding a Turbo in the future. I'll probably contact ATP http://www.vwturbo.com and get my stuff from them.







I'd do the 2.0 Turbo, front mounted intercooler, maybe do the T3 Super 60 deal, that would seem like adequate power. Add some JE pistons, strengthen the internals, basically beef up the entire engine to handle the boost, add a 3" turboback system etc. Get a special chip specifically burned for the setup. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (jga)*

I never said anything about 400 hp, i dunno where that came from.


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## jga (Jul 26, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (jga)*

Another thing I would like to say is about the comment of Turboe'd a high mileage motor. Personally I was thinking on put a 1.8t 20v on my '88 GTI. But see the costs of the swap, no matter VR6 or 1.8t, they go for about $4000 to $5000 grand. With all that money I could turbo my 16v motor and still have money for paint the car. But if you find one for cheap and you could do it yourself go for the 1.8t. If not put a Turbo on your own motor, if it blow you could find another cheaper than a 1.8t or a VR6. Just my $.02


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

quote:[HR][/HR]If I were you and already ahd a 2.0 I would Turbo it. In fact I ahve a 2.0 MK IV and do plan on adding a Turbo in the future. I'll probably contact ATP http://www.vwturbo.com and get my stuff from them.







I'd do the 2.0 Turbo, front mounted intercooler, maybe do the T3 Super 60 deal, that would seem like adequate power. Add some JE pistons, strengthen the internals, basically beef up the entire engine to handle the boost, add a 3" turboback system etc. Get a special chip specifically burned for the setup. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​Thanks, i think that's what i will prob. do. But if you have anything else you want to tell me....you can IM me, my s/n is GolfChick96.


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## jga (Jul 26, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

I said that because the comment of plasma, not for you. Sorry if you think it was for you.


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (jga)*

quote:[HR][/HR] I said that because the comment of plasma, not for you. Sorry if you think it was for you.[HR][/HR]​it's ok! Thanks for your imput though!


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## Hardcore VW (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

quote:[HR][/HR]You don't seem to want to have converstions, you sound arrogant and undermining,So unless a main part of your goal is to spend a lot of money,or to have a fashion show going on cause you have the hottest new trend of a motor,your not setting the world on fire,make all the googly eyes you want. (you actually sound bitter) that's why I won't bother with an explanation. Have a







dude. (And I'm sure Kelly feels the same). You seem to be set on your beliefs and I would not want to change them, cause I practically do not care. I like what I have, I know it was worth the money (especially cause it only had 7000 Kilometers on the engine), I did it for me and not to impress anyone else, it's money well spent.
The person who posted to begine with wanted to know what to get I gave her my opinion and now I'm done with the thread. If you want to takl for real and have a discussion about it you may IM me privately.









[Modified by omegabyte, 7:43 AM 10-19-2001][HR][/HR]​Thank you very much for the honor to IM you,and I'll pass on the beer,I don't need crutches,but if you read my post I clearly said "I dunno this is all MY opinions for projects I do" if me having an opinion differnt than yours comes off arrogant or bitter,I don't know what to tell you other than turn the sensitivity down a notch,it's not all Leave it to Beaver out here and there's bound to be people with different opinions.And I don't know what you mean about me not seeming to want to have coversations,maybe I'm missing something,I don't know.The fact remains for right around 3k,you can have a motor putting out a reliable 300hp,from what I've seen/expirienced myself,I just don't see that happening with a 1.8t if your expieriences have differed,I'd be delighted to hear about them.I hope this post didn't hurt anyones feelings,if it did,I'm sorry.


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## Mike0105 (Dec 31, 1999)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*

In ref to plasma's claim that a chipped 1.8t onyl has a 185hp...WRONG. My GIAC'd 2001 GTI is rated at 205hp and 235lb ft of torque according to GIAC, and all the private dyno's I've seen validate this claim. Whatever you choose, choose it ebcause you want to do it, not because we said so, thats the best advice I can give!! I love my engine to death, but the sound of a VR6 is amazing, although most can't keep up..hehe
Mike


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (VWMike81)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Whatever you choose, choose it ebcause you want to do it, not because we said so, thats the best advice I can give!! Mike[HR][/HR]​Thanks for the advice Mike... I think your right...It is my project...Anyone else have anything else to say?


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

Yeah, go a build it.


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## Henry (Mar 4, 1999)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

Its simple
If you want to keep the engine stock, get the vr
If you want to lightly modify the engine, get the 1.8t
If you want to heavily modify your engine, but spend less than 5000 dollars and have no more than 300 crank horsepower get the 1.8t
If you want to heavily modify your motor spending more than 5000 dollars and looking for 300+ at the crank get the VR6
Anybody disagree?


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## johnnychimpo (Apr 14, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Henry)*

Bro all I've gotta say is VORTEXBAR!!!!!!!!!
Damn that thing is cool, perect for the office!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## mle (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Henry)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Its simple
If you want to keep the engine stock, get the vr
If you want to lightly modify the engine, get the 1.8t
If you want to heavily modify your engine, but spend less than 5000 dollars and have no more than 300 crank horsepower get the 1.8t
If you want to heavily modify your motor spending more than 5000 dollars and looking for 300+ at the crank get the VR6
Anybody disagree?[HR][/HR]​Ok, if I get the 1.8T, i'll be spending more than 5 grand! Cause I'd be doing the swap along with it!


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## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

the 1.8T is the most graceful engine for the buck. In my family, J4 vr6, G60 (now turbo) 1.8, and 1.8TQMS.
By far the most graceful motor is the 1.8T, its quiet, it scoots, and power is very smooth. The Vr6 comes up close, but looses when it comes to modifying it. 
When you turbo your vr6, you are strapping boost on a motor that was never intended (ecu/motor) for it. You will have issues, it won't be as reliable as the 1.8T sorry to say.. Use a mechanical rising rate fuel pressure regulator to manage the fuel (on a 2.0 motronic, or vr6 motronic) is a very poor way of fuel delivery, under boost.. Unless you go SDS or some other PEM to manage the fuel, you will have a rig thats very sensitive to temperature (and change) on its own. 
Talk to rook12v if you want an opinion on how smooth the vr6 boosted motor is...


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## a2a4raddo (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (mrkrad)*

this is for the dummy that made "get a 30V V6 from a corrado an option"....ALL CORRADOs ARE 12V....SOME ARE 2.9L MOST ARE 2.8L.....Canadian and U.S. spec get the 178HP 2.8L and euro spec CORRADOs got the 190HP 2.9L...both of which are 12V. But you can get a 2.8L 24V VR6 from VW...those make 201HP on the GTI..with a Corrado Cat..should make about 208HP.....A3 GTI VR6 was also a 2.8L 12V identical to the Corrados but made 172HP gue to a more restrictive cat.


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## Montanagreenmachine (Sep 26, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (a2a4raddo)*

Be unique.. Go with the 1.8T
I found you can do this swap yourself for a resonable price, but not quite as cheaply as a vr swap. Good luck finding a motor though.. but they are out there.


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## dohc (Sep 28, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (adamrules)*

Omegabyte, how hard was it to do the swap?
I'm thinking about doing it myself, but I'm also thinking I should just turbo my 1.8 16V instead, might be cheaper to do so?!?!


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## RawLatinaVR6 (Sep 20, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (pumbaa)*

quote:[HR][/HR]The VR would be easier to install as these were already available in your car.. But, it would be cheaper to sell your's and buy a VR...
Go with the unique factor.. 1.8T
Bob[HR][/HR]​I don't really agree... I"ve been looking for a 1.8T, and a VR is cheaper!! Unless someone knows where to get them cheap, meaning reasonable, i"m there...


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## RawLatinaVR6 (Sep 20, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Golf_Girl)*

quote:[HR][/HR]....That's why i'm just thinking turbo now. But if anyone has any objections or points to make about that, go ahead and post it. I'm up to talking to anyone who wants to talk about it, and give me a bunch of BS. So, just don't get antsy and say that one engine is better than another just cause you have one. Just say what you know!







[HR][/HR]​Girl I hear ya... Try these guys at EIP, and ask them questions... they are more than patient and offer great advice!! TECH LINE 410.876.1336
But from what I understand is, if you get a turbo system on a 2.0 or vr6, (stage I), you don't really need to mess with the engine. Stock is good. But if your looking at higher horsepower, in the 250's, then you need cams, flywheels, etc... So find out what Horsepower you wanna stay at, and focus on that... Vr6 will give you higher horses overall than a 2.0... I may be wrong, but i've driven both....
RawLatinaVR6


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## RawLatinaVR6 (Sep 20, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (jga)*

quote:[HR][/HR] ... VR6 or 1.8t, they go for about $4000 to $5000 grand. ...[HR][/HR]​ Girl, if thats the case, call me cause i've found motors for about 2grand...







and, install for about 1 grand... its all who you know...
RawLatina


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## RawLatinaVR6 (Sep 20, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Henry)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Its simple
If you want to keep the engine stock, get the vr
If you want to lightly modify the engine, get the 1.8t
If you want to heavily modify your engine, but spend less than 5000 dollars and have no more than 300 crank horsepower get the 1.8t
If you want to heavily modify your motor spending more than 5000 dollars and looking for 300+ at the crank get the VR6
Anybody disagree?[HR][/HR]​
Here is what i found:
used VR6 (35K miles) 2500 and less a 2.0 is maybe 1000
Vr6 turbo is about 5g's... and a 2.0 is about 3g's
Vr6 turbo HP is 350... and the 2.0 turbo hp is 200+
its whatever you want...


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## scarywoody (Dec 3, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (mr Paul)*

quote:[HR][/HR]what about reliability for lightly modded cars like 1.8t:stock turbo chipped intake exhaust Vr6:intake exhuast chip, maybe,maybe some cams
there are many vr6's pushing over 150k, usually pretty stock but still running. we just havnt seen 1.8t's pusshing more than 100k, only cuz they havnt been around that long. so which lightly modded motor will be more reliable for the next lets say 4 years?
those are my only worries, each will make you very happy, very happy
paul[HR][/HR]​that's a good point the 1.8t is a virtually untested engine....i would say the majority of people have under 50k on them...so what happens to them when they hit 100k????


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## Hardcore VW (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (scarywoody)*

>>that's a good point the 1.8t is a virtually untested engine....i would say the majority of people have under 50k on them...so what happens to them when they hit 100k????<<
I dunno,the bottom end has enough similarities with the old 8v motors to pretty much dull that point,and if it doesn't,there's plenty of Audi A4's out there that should.(I think it's at LEAST on the same level as the Vr6 as far as long term reliability goes.)


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## greenveedubb (Aug 21, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

omegabyte, I got some few questions for you (or anyone that did a 1.8T swap):
1. How many miles did you have in your engine before you did the 1.8T swap? 
2. What kind of engine? Audi 5v or VW 20v? How many miles was it when you bought it?
3. So you bought a new ECU, Engine, and tranny - am I right? How much did each of them cost? How did you get them?
4. How much would labor be when a dealer or a pro shop do the swap?


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## vwtechnician (Apr 30, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (adamrules)*

Go VR6!!!
The reliability is unquestionable. I personally think that people are over rating the 1.8t. I have seen many reliability issues with them.


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## Grabbit (Apr 27, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (a2vr6t)*

quote:[HR][/HR]both motors can be fun depending how you drive them.if you want boost get a 18t.if you want smooth rpm get a vr. the 18t is cheaper to add mods too.but if you strap a turbo on a vr its a different story.







[HR][/HR]​perfect example Dan (a2vr6t is a Dan too), http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif










[Modified by grabbit, 2:55 AM 12-2-2001]


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## Grabbit (Apr 27, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (grabbit)*

if you already have a 2.0 I'd turbo that. It would actually cost about the same if not less to turbo your 2.0 than a vr6 swap or a 1.8t, good examples of this are eddie's 2.0 jetta (spooled_2ltr) and this a2. I talked to the guy (jediaz78) with the a2 below and he said it put out about 190hp at the wheels with a t25 turbo. Hope this helps,








Dan










[Modified by grabbit, 3:12 AM 12-2-2001]


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## rick_da_ruler (Oct 28, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (grabbit)*

hell, if you come to jersey, I'll give you a VR6 and put the poop in for nothing!


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## [email protected] freak (Aug 31, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (rick_da_ruler)*

I'm really thinking of changing my name to "Jetta chick" or something.... maybe I could score a VR like that.








OK, I have lots of advice for you. First off, what do you like about your car? if it's the way it handles, DON'T go for the VR. It's real heavy and you'll have to change the whole front end because of the weight... it's just not the same. The 1.8T is the best. I have to admit I almost wet my bed every night thinking about my car with the 1.8T but I'll have to quote the guy that quoted LastManScout (was LostBoyScout) "If you have to ask how much it costs, you can't afford it." LMS said it costs anywhere between 6 and 10 grand. You have to get an Audi engine or take an Audi intake manifold and put it on a VW engine.... change the whole drivetrain. Sure, it would just happen to kick some booty but for that price, you can get a turbo for your 2.0, a clutch and a LSD (no not the drug silly, the Limited Slip Diferential!!)
Hope this helps! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## TheDeer (Sep 21, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? ([email protected] freak)*

I am building an A2vr turbo car, completely rebuilding it from the bottom end up. I chose the vr cause it has power down below, I bought my girl a 1.8t wolfburg jetta. Hell yeah its nice, but there is serious turbo lag. I can't imaging what Billy.T's is like. I heard its like 4000+ till he gets full boost. I am doing the vr turbo with a bb turbo and other little things to get usable boost by 2000 and full by 3000-3500. Sorry kind of off subject but depending on what you want both are great motors:
low cost mods a 1.8t car will be faster, but there is lag. A bolt on VR doesn't have the lag like a chipped 1.8t. also when the 1.8t comes on its anything but smooth power. I put my old Volks on my girls car and the wheels will break loose, without the chip. The power just surges up and there goes the traction control. Me I didn't want that so I am swapping out the vr that came with the car (don't ask, its a sh!t motor) for an OBDI motor. I am also spending a ton of money on the car. so like I said before its what you want and how much you want to spend.
also doesn't a chipped, intake, and exhast on a 1.8t cause tons of wheelspin? If it doesn then the next mod is a quaife and clutch, there is some cash right there. No need for all that with a bolt on VR, (unless you just car about dragging the car). I could go on, but I am sure someone will just start cutting into my opinion.
Basically get whatever you want, after all its your car and everyone has had good and bad expierences. I also heard that the 1.8t trans's are weak. Then after an enormous amount of 1900 miles on my girls car, guess what trans died. Dealer replaced it, but if you swap the car and chip it. That comes out of your pocket.
My .02


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## Mike0105 (Dec 31, 1999)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (TheDeer)*

My chipped 1.8t has full boost by 2000 rom's, that is not what you call noticable turbo lag. A WRX doesn't kick in till 3500. I mean you can dial the turbo in so it kicks in sooner, just get a lower I believe A/R ration. If you do that though there won't be as much top end. All a trade off!!
Mike


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## marsrocco (Dec 3, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hardcore VW)*

i have one






























2.0l ABA with programable injection cant touch this


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## TheDeer (Sep 21, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (VWMike81)*

quote:[HR][/HR]My chipped 1.8t has full boost by 2000 rom's, that is not what you call noticable turbo lag. A WRX doesn't kick in till 3500. I mean you can dial the turbo in so it kicks in sooner, just get a lower I believe A/R ration. If you do that though there won't be as much top end. All a trade off!!
Mike[HR][/HR]​My point being that the car has no power until the turbo kicks in. I drive the jetta all the time, its got nothing down below. Also the power curve is anything but smooth compared to the vr. Like I stated depending on what you want they are both great motors. that is why I own 2 of them (even though she claims its hers).


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## 1.BillyT (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (TheDeer)*

wow, sorry I am late on this...
Okay... 1.8t, stock from oil pan to valve cover, big turbo, FMIC, more fuel and an exhaust, will make more power than most people will need. 300 wheel is easy. 344 is the most I have made, and that was still with completely stock internals, and ignition.
Erik, something you have to understand, about my motor not hitting full boost by 4000 rpm is two fold. First, full boost is 22psi, not 10, or 15 even. 22psi is alot, enough to blow up a stock VR6. When it hits, it hits hard... feels good. 
Second, and more importantly is gearing. Depending on the gearing that you use in a particular car, 4000 rpm may not be that far from cruising rpm. In the MK4 1.8t, the R&P is a 3.94. Just cruising around, I am only under 3K to get off the line from a stop light. After that, just normal driving, the car is always in the low 3000 rpm range. Sounds bad when you are used to a VR6 tranny, but is no big deal when you are used to a 3.94 R&P. Only if I get caught in an awkward situation do I ever have to worry about lag. Trying to shift this thing before 3000 rpm, just cruising around is hard to do, not like with my old VR6.
I'll get someone that has ridden in it to let you guys know how it feels. I promise, it isn't what you think it is. Granted, a turbo VR6 will always make more power in the midrange than a 1.8t with the same size turbo, but depending on how the car, as a whole, is setup, it may not ever make too much of a difference in driving the car around town.
Not starting crap, just letting you guys know first hand, what my car is like. Personally, I would put a 1.8t in the MK3. If you want a VR6, just go by one. You could get a whole 95 GTI VR6 for around $5-6K, which would probably be less than it would cost you to do a swap to either motor, less than putting a 1.8t in there for sure.
FWIW, my buddy is building a 1.8t A2 that will own all but the most built(I mean built motors, like Deer's) VR6 A2 turbos anywhere, in straightline acceleration, and just obliterate them on a roadcourse, given equal drivers. He is on Vortex. His car is gonna be scary fast, 2400 pounds, 400+hp(... mmmm... I can't wait till that car is done... His turbo was on my car when it made 344 to the wheels. He is gonna have head work and cams, so he will make more, no problem. 
Any more questions, lemme know. Hope I didn't come off as a prick, just passing along some info, with a little bit of my opinion worked into it.








BTW, that is Brad B.'s old car huh... nice. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by 1.BillyT, 2:12 PM 12-10-2001]


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## TheDeer (Sep 21, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (1.BillyT)*

I understand what you are saying I do agree. I am just use to the VR6, but I can appreciate the 1.8t. Your buddy's 1.8t will be pretty sick, but as far as all motor vr6turbo's, completely built including TEC, 248 cams, CCH head, ect.. I havn't seen that many on here, that doesn't mean they don't exist. Or should I say I havn't seen many that drive everyday. Your buddy's 1.8t will be sick, but I think you will see a million a21.8t's and A3 1.8t's next year. Just like when an a2vr was rare. thanks for the info.


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## Hipnotized (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (omegabyte)*

Theres a guy here in Toronto, Canada that has a 1.8T in a Mk1 Golf (Rabbit)...
Wouldn't it be possible to fit in an Audi 5cyl 20V turbo engine into the Golf? Stock 227 HP







And lots of room for tuning of that engine! I know the RSi Golf running 900 HP has the 2.1L 5cyl Audi engine...








Now that would be fun!! Imagine the power potential, and the unique factor!! Not to mention the unique and amazing sounds from the 5 cyl!
Lates,
Hipnotized

[Modified by Hipnotized, 7:57 PM 12-11-2001]


[Modified by Hipnotized, 7:57 PM 12-11-2001]


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## 1.BillyT (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (Hipnotized)*

sure it is possible... but if you didn't notice, that guy had to put the radiator in the back of the car so the motor would fit... not quite like dropping a 1.8t or a VR in an A2








Can't wait to see the finished car Erik, sounds like your gonna have a beast.


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## TheDeer (Sep 21, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (1.BillyT)*

quote:[HR][/HR]sure it is possible... but if you didn't notice, that guy had to put the radiator in the back of the car so the motor would fit... not quite like dropping a 1.8t or a VR in an A2








Can't wait to see the finished car Erik, sounds like your gonna have a beast.[HR][/HR]​You know the car, but its only the shell that's left, everything is gone. And I mean everything, including that motor. I am going ODBI, Carrado dash, ect... It will take time, I am not going to dump all the money in at once (not cause I don't love the car, but don't have the cash). So I figure a couple months it should be out. I am also going to end the saga about 248 cams (sucking). When the car is done and TEC is tuned, ect.. (Which will be timely, to get it to run correct). Basically I am looking for a 14 psi car that will reach easily into the 400+ whp levels. No need to push 25+ psi to hit high numbers (on a VR, not tword you Billy), I am going to rely on tuning. After all isn't that what its all about, to have a reliable low boost car that tears ass. I actually enjoy the tuning part. But anyway, the cams, I am going to put the stock cams in, tune the car. Then dyno it. Change the cams right there to the 248's, go around the block a couple times and dyno the car again. If they suck, well then at least everyone can find out without peoples bs who don't have them. They were sweet in my sc car, so I can't imagine this setup. Either way once the surgery starts I will post the pics but for those who don't know what the shell looks like, its in my sig.


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## mk2 6'in (Dec 3, 2001)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (TheDeer)*

eriks pulling all of this stuff outta his ass... lol just kidding bro.. maybe me and u can have a turbo vr out at the same time? who knows
- vee


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## TheDeer (Sep 21, 2000)

*Re: 1.8T or VR6? (mk2 6'in)*

quote:[HR][/HR]eriks pulling all of this stuff outta his ass... lol just kidding bro.. maybe me and u can have a turbo vr out at the same time? who knows
- vee[HR][/HR]​We shall see, I will post the pics of the Pistons and everything when they get here on the 19th. Or that is at least what UPS is telling me. When the car is ready all depends on money, and how quickly I want to waste it.
Man now UPS says 22



[Modified by TheDeer, 5:05 PM 12-13-2001]


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