# Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

Not a fancy title but one you can search to.
Got one of the first running almost two weeks ago and I'm finally getting the time to get all the information up. I'll put it up in stages in this first post so be patient. Having problems with my ftp so I won't have screenshots and the .msq until tonight.
I will assume that all those reading will have base MS knowledge. Those who don't feel free to ask some questions.
1992 SLC engine/drivetrain into a 1992 GTI (my old one). Car has been running a stock chipped ECU for a little over a year. All factory sensors have been used, only addition to the engine bay is a single vacuum line for the map signal.
Wiring is straight forward from a cut up Motronic ECU connector to the MS DB37 connector. I will post the pinout below. 
[MS to Motronic Pinout Placeholder]
Board built and tuned by me. 
MS1 V3 
MSnS-E 029t 
Board mods/hardware: 
VRIN - TachSelect
TSEL - VROUT INV 
D14 with pullup to IGN (no VB) 
Both VR pots fully CCW 
Launch Circuit 








Tach Circuit (not working yet) w/ 2k pullup








TIP120 for PWM idle valve with 1N4001 flyback diode between output and 12v
Remove Q4, Q20 and R39. replace R39 with a wired link or solder the (E) emittor to the right side of position R39 rather than at the Q4 position. 








Innovate LC1 wideband to stock narrowband O2 pigtail.
MSQ: http://www.msruns.com/download.php?id=5661 you will have to register/login until I host it
[Placeholder for configuration screenshots]






























The maps are street tuned about as good as they can get and I will NOT post dyno tuned maps as they are customer owned. So, don't ask








The car with this ECU ran 14.0's all day at Waterfest on Sunday despite non-ideal conditions. 
Enjoy!!








_Modified by need_a_VR6 at 1:47 PM 7-26-2007_


_Modified by need_a_VR6 at 9:06 AM 1-2-2010_


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Nice work http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (sdezego)*

Thanks man! great info


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (VWralley)*

Thanks I'll get the real msq up later tonight for those that want to download and go


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## fourthchirpin (Nov 19, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

interesting....pm sent.


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## darren p. (Jan 27, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Good stuff Paul...hurry up on a coil pack one.








I know you haven't done it yet but what, if any difference do you for see between the OBDI coilpack motors and OBDII? Does the distro VR use the same style IAC valve as the coilpack motors?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (darren p.)*

The only difference as far as the setup is concerned is that the OBD2's have the idle valve in the throttle body. I'm pretty sure though it will even work without the uprated transistor I posted above, as the OBD2 idle motor is a much lower current unit.
The OBD1 cars all have the same IAC, either distro or coil. 
Working on it though.. hopefully I'll make some nice progress in August without all the races taking up my time.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Wiring Schedule:
Motronic T68 Pin # ---- MS Pin # --- Function
1,7,10,33,55,56 ---- 8-19 --- Ground
36 ---------------------20-------- IAT+
14----------------------21--------CLT+
41----------------------26--------TPS+
40----------------------22--------TPS 
20----------------------23--------O2
67----------------------24--------VR+
68----------------------7----------VR-/VR Shield
22----------------------25--------Tach
27----------------------27--------PWM 12v
23----------------------28--------12v supply
53----------------------30--------PWM Idle (Fidle)
3,24,26-------------32/33-------INJA
2,4,25--------------34/35--------INJB
8-----------------------36---------Ignition Out
6-----------------------37----------Fuel Pump (Relay)
28---------------------37----------Heated O2 (Relay)
X-----------------------29----------Launch
T68/9 needs to be pulled to ground to turn the ECM relay on. There's a 12v ignition hot supply to the ECU that I didn't write down. It needs to control a relay that pulls it on. The stock ECU must have an internal transistor to do this. I'll post up that fix when I do it http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Sorry for the sloppy order but it's how I think.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Tach circuit works with a 4.7k pullup.
The 'funny' issues with the fuel pump relay were solved with an additional relay. T68/9 is grounded through a relay that's switched on with ignition hot on T68/38, the other two pins of the relay (contact and coil ground) are grounded at the MS at pins 14/15.


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## 92rado2.8 (Jul 12, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

I was just going to do a whole big post but Paul got to it before me. 
The vehicle is mine and Paul did a great job with the wiring and getting all the bugs worked out.
I will put up some pics as soon as I can. If anyone has a question about the car feel free to PM me,


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## deviantsoldier (Dec 14, 2006)

need_a_vr6, can i use your spark advance table on my mk4 coilpack vr6 to start off with? will it be accurate since you have a distributer?


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## MySunRoofWorks (Aug 2, 2000)

This is great, I have been thinking about doing this for awhile on my coilpack 93 Corrado. Keep it coming! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Tire_Marx (Mar 4, 2004)

anything else done to the vr, or 14's on stock motor with MS?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (Tire_Marx)*

Spark map should work on a coilpack car, even the wheel decoder settings should work. Just have to use three spark outputs instead of just the one. 
The motor is a stock 92 SLC motor with a Mk4 headgasket, intake and 2.5" TT exhaust.


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## deviantsoldier (Dec 14, 2006)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*

Outstanding. i got my vr6 running yesterday on your spark and fuel maps. thanks need_a_VR6


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## 92rado2.8 (Jul 12, 2004)

*Re: (Tire_Marx)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Tire_Marx* »_anything else done to the vr, or 14's on stock motor with MS?

Yeah it is pretty much stock, Along with what Paul mentioned I have a 42 draft design test pipe, no ac or ps, no front sway bar, started to mess around with my intake mani. Thats it. I have a set of schricks waiting to go in but I need HD springs and a couple of other things first.
Just wanted to also say that Paul is a great guy and has helped me out alot over the years, throwing parts my way and some tech support. I would not trust anyone else with wiring up a MS. The inside of my MS looked better than my mother board in my computer


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## all-starr-me (Jul 14, 2003)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

what's gonna be the advantage of a distributor or coil pack over each other as far as cost, ease of use and spark control? I have parts and harnesses for both and am deciding what way to go in the spring for my coupe.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (all-starr-me)*

Distributor is only one spark output, and the coil is three. Distro would be a bit easier, but in the grand scheme of things they're not that different.


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## surfer1992 (Nov 20, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

ahh I did somthing wrong... I burned the VB921.....








any advise ?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (surfer1992)*

Whats the setup? On this install I didn't use the VB921.


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## nuts4boosting (Jun 30, 2006)

im sent


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## deepgrooves74 (Aug 3, 2006)

*MegaSquirt... Paul*

Hey Paul... I was told to give you a shout from Scott over at USRT concerning help putting together a Megasquirt kit for my car.
Thanks!
cj


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: MegaSquirt... Paul (deepgrooves74)*

Shoot me a PM http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## edge-motorsports (Oct 1, 2006)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

i also run have been running a similar ms setup for a little over a year in my autocross car. it was a grat upgrade from the stock ecu. we went from 192whp to 214whp with just megasquirt. 
i don't normally drag race but we took it to the strip at the end of the season and ran 12.2 consistently..it was fun! (its in a mk1 jetta coupe by the way)

i would recomend MS to anyone as a good upgrade for a vr6


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

i have my coilpack vr6 running on your msq just altered a few settings as mines direct coil pack wired with 3x vb921 cheers


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (ade007)*

Good stuff, glad it worked for you!


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

i run 36lb injectors no cat just fitted my techedge linear wideband and been out tuning allday my car has never run as quick im very pleased


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (ade007)*

When you're done make sure you put the msq on msruns! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## MySunRoofWorks (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*

Paul, what MS unit do you recommend to use with a coil pack VR6? Also do you think it's better to buy a pre-built unit or if someone has decent electronics experience, to build one? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (MySunRoofWorks)*

Either a 3.0 or 3.57 depending if you want to solder a lot or not. The 3.0 isn't bad to assemble just a lot of parts! If you find that sort of thing FUN, do it, you'll learn more just by seeing the hardware and reading the assembly manual then anyone with a prebuilt. I like building them myself but my time is limited and I'm getting prebuilts from DIYAutotune now.


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## MySunRoofWorks (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_Either a 3.0 or 3.57 depending if you want to solder a lot or not. The 3.0 isn't bad to assemble just a lot of parts! If you find that sort of thing FUN, do it, you'll learn more just by seeing the hardware and reading the assembly manual then anyone with a prebuilt. I like building them myself but my time is limited and I'm getting prebuilts from DIYAutotune now.

I have plenty of time and solder these days. Thinking about picking one up after the new year. I'm trying to squeeze every last pony out of my NA car before I give up and go FI.


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

i bought mine from phil ringwood extraefi.co.uk pre modifyied to suit my coilpack vr6 and i asked for pauls msq to be pre installed but altered for coilpack all i had to do was turn my required fuel down to from 13.6 to 7.2 to suit 36lb injectors @ 4 bar .. it came with a short lume to wire to stock ecu plug all coulor coded and wires labeled with a pin 4 pin diagram it made it a very easy install for me plug and play if you have an old ecu to break up for the socket 


_Modified by ade007 at 3:11 AM 12-30-2007_


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*

ok matey i will put my msq on msruns... i have been very busy i fitted a turbo now







i will put that msq on too when ive done some tuning


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## Dead-Rabbits (Jan 11, 2008)

*VR6 Distributor*

Can anyone help me at my options for my MS2 V3.57 Firmware 2.687 to start my VR6 Turbo Distributor Engine ???
I have ignition and fuel, but the Engine doesn't start.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (Dead-Rabbits)*

I got your email, just send me your msq and I'll take a look.


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## Black86GTI (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (need_a_VR6)*

how would you rate the MS on the vr compared to say an OBDII swap.I currently have a Distributor motor. Right now im just building my motor to run NA with some minor mods. but down the line a turbo is possible. i have not used MS but ive heard its pretty basic as far as tuning.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (Black86GTI)*

It all depends on what you want, how much you like to 'fiddle' and your patience for your own inadequacies! For under 400whp C2 OBD2 software is great and you don't have to think twice about it. For someone that needs/wants tunability, then you'd be looking at standalone anyway and it's a very inexpensive route to take. I've setup and tuned quite a few of these and there's always something new I learn along the way.
Labor wise the MS wiring/harness install will take longer then OBD1-->OBD2 unless it's in a Corrado/B3 and then it might be about similar times.


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## Black86GTI (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_It all depends on what you want, how much you like to 'fiddle' and your patience for your own inadequacies! For under 400whp C2 OBD2 software is great and you don't have to think twice about it. For someone that needs/wants tunability, then you'd be looking at standalone anyway and it's a very inexpensive route to take. I've setup and tuned quite a few of these and there's always something new I learn along the way.
Labor wise the MS wiring/harness install will take longer then OBD1-->OBD2 unless it's in a Corrado/B3 and then it might be about similar times.

its in a 86 MKII with ce1 so i have to do the full ceII swap withe fuse box etc.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (Black86GTI)*

MS is probably easier then!


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## Black86GTI (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (need_a_VR6)*

what version of MS would you recomend? and would i need a relay board?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (Black86GTI)*

I've been using MS1's so far on V3's but on a distro car a 3.57 would work easily as well if you're buying prebuilt. I generally never use relay boards, unless the install is on a car that normally wasn't fuel injected.


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## Black86GTI (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (need_a_VR6)*

so i would be FIN with either w MS-1 v3.0 or 3.57 and this would give me full timing control as well. sounds good to me. and yea ill be buying a prebuilt just to save any hassle as ive already been playing the waiting game to Get my motor together


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (Black86GTI)*

Yes either would work fine on a distributor car, though the V3 does make additions to the setup easier with the proto area that's there. If you are using a stock cluster, be sure your builder installs the MS tach circuit with a 4.7k resistor like I mentioned earlier in the thread.


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## Noobercorn (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

subscribed.


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (Noobercorn)*

how long did it take u to assemble the jim stim and msI if u remember need_a_vr6??


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (96VDubbin)*

The JimStim was about an hour maybe two and a fully built V3 takes me about 4hrs without mods, so add another hour or so for mods and testing of those. Be warned though that I've been doing this awhile and can almost build a V3 in my sleep








I should have another msq for a re-tune I did on this car for Schrick 268s and a ported head shortly. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Black86GTI (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Once my motor is done ill be going with a v3 its only a matter of time ill have a post how to tie a MS into a CE1 fuse box using hopefully a factory plug and then i will be wiring the MS into the VR6 engine harness conector. should work out pretty nice.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (Black86GTI)*

CE1 isn't that hard I've done MS 16v's with it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Black86GTI (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_CE1 isn't that hard I've done MS 16v's with it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

yea its going to be easier than swaping my car over to CE2 the plan is to just take the old CIS engine harness and grab my constant 12volts etc from that and hopefully tie into the fuel pump at the fuse box as well. then just run a new MS harness out to the round vr6 engine conector to try and keep it semi stock looking.
the big thing is i had to wait a month for pistons and my block is on its third week at the machine shop. theres only one shop i trust doing a VR and they are busy doing race motors


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## kyle_b (Jul 12, 2007)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (Black86GTI)*

what value bias resistors are you using to use stock air and coolant temp sensors?


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## 96VDubbin (Mar 22, 2003)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

thanx


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (kyle_b)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kyle_b* »_what value bias resistors are you using to use stock air and coolant temp sensors?

The GM resistors (stock) but I tweaked the S19 with Easytherm.


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

black86gti, if i remember correctly, ce1 triggers fuel pump relay on 12v while ce2 and MS trigger on ground. so you might still need to wire an external relay for the fuel pump.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (bonesaw)*

Not sure if that's true, I did an 89 Golf that had CE1 Digi2 on it and it was a ground trigger as well.


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## Black86GTI (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (bonesaw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bonesaw* »_black86gti, if i remember correctly, ce1 triggers fuel pump relay on 12v while ce2 and MS trigger on ground. so you might still need to wire an external relay for the fuel pump.

when i get to the point of wiring ill figure that out. if it is a a positive trigger and i need 12v. not a huge deal would take maybe 2 mins to wire up the relay. Ive done car audio/ electronics for 5 years so relays and wiring/relays isnt a big deal for me.


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## bonesaw (Aug 8, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (Black86GTI)*

when i looked it was for an 80 pickup. ce1 is so ****ed as nothing is the same.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (bonesaw)*

All those Mk1's are silly, and definitely not CE1. The Mk1's German vs Westmoreland are all different and then depending on the year the PA cars are different from each other. Drives me nuts constantly!
Anyway the 80 pickup fuel pump relay is strange, as with all CIS ones, it's 12v ignition to turn it on, and the ground is constant. However internal to the relay is a timer to keep it on for 2sec, as well as it needs an ignition pulse on terminal1 to keep the pump running.


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## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

pop


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## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

ttt


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## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (Black86GTI)*

ttt


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## Noobercorn (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (hasnfefr)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

i need some advise please my 36lb hi injectors are at 100% duty my mate gave me 6 560cc low injectors from an evo lancer car im going to fit them and alter settings to suit and see how it runs but i think i may need the hires code what value resistors will i need for low impedance please. also do i need 6 resistors or just put 2 on the injector banks ?? were can i find the hires code ms1 v3 any advise welcome cheers

_Modified by ade007 at 9:37 AM 6-11-2008_


_Modified by ade007 at 9:39 AM 6-11-2008_


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (ade007)*

560's aren't *that* big, you can still get away with the low-res version, I've been using regular MS1 MSnS-E 029y4 on everything lately. You might need to run a slightly rich idle but I got a DSM running just last night on 029Y4 and 750cc's at 12:1 afr at 600rpm with low imp and PWM control and it works great. If I raise the idle to ~900rpm I can probably lean it out quite a bit more.
The resistor will depend on the resistance of the low-imp injectors. On the 4cyls the DSM resistor box works well, but you'd need two of them. If you're using actual resistors you will need 6 of them.
Also be sure the Evo injectors physically fit, I'm not sure if they match the stock Bosch ones in dimensions.
If you want hi-res, click HERE


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## epic.banned (Feb 25, 2008)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*

off the top of your head, for the tach circuit. what is the voltage for the ignition control module and the pull-up value?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (epic.banned)*

Tach circuit uses a 4.7k pullup to 12v, the ignition mod uses a 1k pullup to 5v.


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## Noobercorn (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*

paul, can you confirm what pin 59 is on the ECU of a dizzy rado? i know it is a black wire to the MAF, but what is it's function?
oh, and pin 16 and 17 too please.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (Noobercorn)*

No clue I've never used those wires for anything, must be unimportant


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

i have the evo injectors fitted with the pwm control fired right up and idle was same as with the 36lb ones with a bit of tweaking..i had to swop the o rings off my old injectors to make the evo ones fit as the evo o rings were too slim also i could not put the clip on but they are wedged nice and tight into the rail and can not move anywere and plus they were free







i have saved the hi res incase i need at a later date thanks


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (ade007)*

Glad that worked out well for you http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

i have a tuning problem im going lean after 5k over 16psi in higher gears no matter how high i raise the vebins in that area the injector duty is around 57% peak i need to check my fuel pressure i have a walbro inline fitted any other ideas ? my req-fuel is 4.8 for 648cc injectors ([email protected]) is there any parameters that could be set wrong that throw the fueling out at higher boost any ideas ??


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (ade007)*

Check the fuel pressure would be the first thing.


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

my fuel pressure was 50psi on idle when i pulled the vac off the fuel reg it went to 60psi so my mate says take the fuel pump out off the tank and run just off the inline pump see if it any better when i did this my inline fuel pump was not working no pressure at the rail after 10 mins off playing we found i had the walbro wired wrong what a tit i feel its been like this for a few months now and i wonder how it ever ran also the pump is much quieter


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (ade007)*

So your fuel pressure was probably dropping with load then?


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## ade007 (Jun 12, 2007)

yes thats what was happening my rpms are so much better too it will pull strong all way to 7000rpm now with stock cams in i am really loving megasquirt


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## epic.banned (Feb 25, 2008)

*Re: (ade007)*

anyone else with dyno number/ track times?
Curious to see the improvements


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## 92rado2.8 (Jul 12, 2004)

*Re: (epic.banned)*

My best on DR's 225-50-15 is a 13.54 @101.98. Very little tuning has been done. All by Need_a_VR6. 
I will have times on slicks come next Wed. and a dyno sheet to follow on the 1st of July. Hope this info is helpful











_Modified by 92rado2.8 at 3:44 PM 6-19-2008_


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## epic.banned (Feb 25, 2008)

*Re: (92rado2.8)*


_Quote, originally posted by *92rado2.8* »_My best on DR's 225-50-15 is a 13.54 @101.98. Very little tuning has been done. All by Need_a_VR6. 
I will have times on slicks come next Wed. and a dyno sheet to follow on the 1st of July. Hope this info is helpful









_Modified by 92rado2.8 at 3:44 PM 6-19-2008_

Is that just a stock engine?
Those are some killer times!


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## 92rado2.8 (Jul 12, 2004)

*Re: (epic.banned)*


_Quote, originally posted by *epic.banned* »_
Is that just a stock engine?
Those are some killer times!

Thanks and no. The best time I ever pulled stock was 13.64 at 102.xx. I have yet to really put in the time in the current set-up like I did when I first got the car. It has more in it. The current set-up is MS on a 92 dizzy with 170,000 miles on it. Schrick 268's, mildly ported head(can't do less to a head mild), ported intake and exhaust mani's, mk4 headgasket, 42dd test pipe to a TT 2.5 with a Borla. Trans is a o2a with a corrado R/P(367 I believe) and a peloquin and a clutch net red PP with a 6 puck disc. Motor mounts are old KCD and Turn2 Stg5's. That sums it up. With slicks and more seat time I am hoping for low 13's which is possible.


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## epos.verbot (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_
D14 with pullup to IGN (no VB) 


Is this the same pullup that the Bosch ignition uses from the MS extra Manuals?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (epos.verbot)*

Yes but I use 1k to 5v, not sure why other then it works!


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## epos.verbot (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_Yes but I use 1k to 5v, not sure why other then it works!

Thanks, Just what I needed. Figured I could let the iron cool down for a bit last night and make sure I had my ducks in a row before just goin buck wild with it.


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## epos.verbot (Jul 9, 2008)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (epos.verbot)*

Curious as to how to setup a wasted spark setup for stock coils on a coilpack car. Just had someone ask me about building them a board tonight and it would be good information. I don't think the VB coil drivers would be necessary


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (epos.verbot)*

It's been done, but not by me personally, at least not yet. The ones I build for others I use the 3x VB's just to delete the stock coilpack and run GM/MSD coils.


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Hey Paul,
My roomate and I decided to give it a go at soldering up a MS1 V3, one for a dizzy VR (his) and one for a coilpack VR (mine). 
The question I have is about the VB921's, well, now BIP373's. I'm having trouble finding documentation about where they go/how to set it up to work with wasted spark. Can ya help me out?


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (JRaptor)*

http://www.msextra.com/manuals...tcoil
You have to paypal me money when you get it working though


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_http://www.msextra.com/manuals...tcoil
You have to paypal me money when you get it working though

















So I replace R26, R27 and R29 with a 330ohm resistor? Then I install another DB15 connector and just link stuff to it on the back side? Nothing actually plugs into it?


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (JRaptor)*

No it's three additional resistors from the tops of those (trigger end), each one going to pin 1 of a different BIP. 
Then you tie all the grounds, BIP pin 3 together and run that to the DB25 and make sure that has a BADASS ground to the head near the coils. 
Then you run wires from each BIP Pin2 to double pins on the DB25 and those are now your coil trigger wires.
Wires from the DB25 will be the big ground, and then three coil trigger wires.


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_No it's three additional resistors from the tops of those (trigger end), each one going to pin 1 of a different BIP. 
Then you tie all the grounds, BIP pin 3 together and run that to the DB25 and make sure that has a BADASS ground to the head near the coils. 
Then you run wires from each BIP Pin2 to double pins on the DB25 and those are now your coil trigger wires.
Wires from the DB25 will be the big ground, and then three coil trigger wires. 

Do I simply wire/solder the BIP's up such as that and install the entire high current ignition driver circuit?
Do I need a pull-up resistor?


----------



## Lord_Verminaard (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (JRaptor)*

Is there any way to retain the knock-sensor ignition with MS?
Brendan


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (Lord_Verminaard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lord_Verminaard* »_Is there any way to retain the knock-sensor ignition with MS?
Brendan

Use Knocksense, found here.
http://www.viatrack.ca/


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (JRaptor)*

3 BIPs
Pin 1 of each BIP through a 330ohm resistor to each LED (top of R26, 29, 27)
Pin 2 of each BIP through the 'new' connector and to the coil - 
Pin 3 of each BIP tied together through the 'new' connector to engine ground
No additional parts are needed (pullup, etc).

You can get knock sensing to work but I haven't found much use for it yet. I've used the MSExtra circuit as well as a Knocksense but once it's tuned, it's tuned. Generally best torque isn't usually right against knock on these motors unless they're highly boosted on not enough octane.


----------



## Lord_Verminaard (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Cool, thanks JRaptor and Paul!
Brendan


----------



## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (Lord_Verminaard)*

ttt


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

hey paul we need some help with that tach circuit diagram / pullup thingy. 
where does the 4.7K resistor connect to?


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (JRaptor)*

The 4.7k goes between the signal wire and 12v.


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_The 4.7k goes between the signal wire and 12v.

I don't know why this confuses me so much. The signal wire coming out of the MS box, aka pin 25? Or is the signal wire inside the MS box? 
I've got everything down except for this tach circuit...
Thanks Paul.


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (JRaptor)*

Haha, it's all good. Inside the ms box the same spot on the transistor that the signal output wire goes to needs a 4.7k resistor that's then wired to 12v.


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

Alright we got the car running! Hooray! 
Couple problems...Fuel pump constantly runs and D14 LED is constantly lit even when the key is off.
The car isn't using an ISV whatsover so I left our the PWN 12v and PWN Idle wires that run from the MS to the stock ECU plug adapter.
We did jumper T68/9 to T68/1, which is one of the ground wires for the MS. C
Could either of these be a reason why the FP constantly runs or the LED is lit?
edit...it ran beautifully! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by JRaptor at 1:02 AM 9-1-2008_


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

*Re: (JRaptor)*

figured out the FP problem, T68/9 has to be relayed to ground. d'oh


----------



## ClownTrigger (Aug 30, 2006)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

I just got my 8v running last night on 029y, briefly, until smoke rolled out of my v3 PCB.... I've learned quite a bit a bit since starting this switchover from digi2, and a just wanted to add a correction to your original post, and see if I can get some clarification.

_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_Launch Circuit 









This is the right circuit to build for a switched low input, but the launch input is JS11 on a v3 PCB, not JS9 like that picture says. 
http://www.msextra.com/manuals...unchC

_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_Tach Circuit (not working yet) w/ 2k pullup









Just to clarify, the "selected pin on the MS PCB" is the pin selected in Megatune under More Settings > Tacho Output Pin. 
Does this work on Mk2 clusters that get their tach signal from the switched side of the coil, or do you need to build a high voltage tach circuit like one of these?

















_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_TIP120 for PWM idle valve with 1N4001 flyback diode between output and 12v
Remove Q4, Q20 and R39. replace R39 with a wired link or solder the (E) emittor to the right side of position R39 rather than at the Q4 position. 









A word of caution with mounting the 1N4001 flyback diode on the PCB... *Don't* tie the +12V side of the diode to the +12V pin on the 5V regulator like this picture says is a good place to get +12V from.








That's how I made smoke roll out of my PCB. After doing some research on flyback diodes on relay/solenoid coils, I found out that a substantial amount of voltage can flow back through that 1N4001 (1000's of volts can be generated by some coils), and the 12V going into the 5V regulator goes passed a 24V zener, which I evidently killed. Regrettably when it failed, it failed into a short, not an open, so the zener was effectively shorting +12V right off of pin 28 to GND through a tiny little trace on the board. Needless to say, the trace didn't make it.
Bottom line, if you're going to put the 1N4001 on the PCB, tie the +12V side to somewhere that's directly connected to pin 28 on the DB37. I'm going to try the +12V pin on one of the darlingtons in the flyback PWM damping circuits. I don't have high impedance injectors, so I'm not using them anyway, and there's a big fat trace on the bottom side of the board going right to pin 28.
Thanks for posting all that info though Paul. Even with a bit of confusion on my part, your post was an enormous help.


_Modified by ClownTrigger at 9:15 AM 9-6-2008_


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (ClownTrigger)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ClownTrigger* »_

This is the right circuit to build for a switched low input, but the launch input is JS11 on a v3 PCB, not JS9 like that picture says.

I thought I put that in my notes but 100% right. 

_Quote »_
Does this work on Mk2 clusters that get their tach signal from the switched side of the coil, or do you need to build a high voltage tach circuit like one of these?

Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, depends on the tach. I've used the high voltage mod with the relay coil and it works all the time. Make sure you're using higher then 029s I think as there's a change in the duty cycle for the tach output. Otherwise you can burn up processors.

_Quote »_
Bottom line, if you're going to put the 1N4001 on the PCB, tie the +12V side to somewhere that's directly connected to pin 28 on the DB37.
Thanks for posting all that info though Paul. Even with a bit of confusion on my part, your post was an enormous help.


I usually use the S12c pad on the V3's and lately I've been mounting the TIP in the Q16 spot, works out for the on coil driver cars nicely.
You're welcome, glad I could help!


----------



## Kenner8v88 (Jun 15, 2005)

Just installed my tach circuit on my Corrado VRT using a adapter harness to a stock motronic plug....
So far, from what I get from the diagram, I believe the 2N transistor goes in the prototype area, with one lead to ground, the input lead from the 1K resistor (which also connects to pin JS3), and the output lead to the 4.7K resistor. 
The 4.7K resistor can then connect to S12 for 12v power on one lead, and then the other lead connects to the both the 2N2222A transistor and IAC1A going to pin 25 for the tach output. Pin 25 then connects to pin 22 on the motronic plug.
Is this correct? If so...it still doesn't work for me.
I used a 1/2 watt 4.7K resistor and a 1/4 watt 1K resistor, could this be my problem? Should I have just matched the watts or is 1/2 too high, or 1/4 too small?


----------



## ClownTrigger (Aug 30, 2006)

*Re: (Kenner8v88)*

Hey Ken, sup man. Remember me? You ported an 8v head for me earlier this year.
That sounds right to me. You might need to try different resistors in place of the 4.7k. Make sure the transistor is connected properly.








Other than that, have you enabled the tacho pin output in Megatune?


----------



## Kenner8v88 (Jun 15, 2005)

Hey Greg,
Thanks for posting the above info, we had the transistor hooked up incorrectly, the tach now works! Hooray!
The only problems we are having now are that our AEM UEGO wideband is reading differently on MS than the gauge, and the CLT is reading about 30 degrees higher than our cluster....makes us wonder if the IAT is accurate.


----------



## ClownTrigger (Aug 30, 2006)

*Re: (Kenner8v88)*

Glad I could help on the tach.
First, did you choose the right wideband in the settings.ini under car1? Use the configurator from megatune. Then make sure that in Megatune under basic settings>exhaust gas settings, you choose wideband for EGO sensor type.
Full instructions for the above: http://www.msextra.com/manuals...ambda 
I have an LC-1, so I don't know anything about the UEGO, but if there's a way to make the controller output a constant voltage (like a 2.5V flat line or something), tell it to, and see if there's an offset between the voltage you're asking for and what you're reading on megatune (realtime display). If it's different, check your grounding.
As for the CLT sensor, since you're worried about the IAT sensor too, I'm assuming that you're using the GM sensors. Are you sure you installed the correct bias resistors on the board? Are you sure the CLT sensor is the one that's wrong and not your dash? Check it after the car sit's overnight. Before you start the car, it should read about what the outside temperature is.
Do you have any other means of temperature measurement? Infared, thermocouple...? I'm going to have to use easytherm to dial in my digi2 sensor still once I remember to bring a thermocouple home from work to get the three resistance points myself, but my IAT sensor is the GM one, and it's reading right.


----------



## Kenner8v88 (Jun 15, 2005)

we are using the stock bosch vr6 sensors with modified code using easytherm.
we have one of those lasers that measures temperature, the CLT definitely does not read the outside temp, but if i recall, the IAT does read correctly. 
We've been tuning it for 5.5psi, and so far everything has been great. Still needs some tweaking but we can get into boost.








Once we get this UEGO working with the MS, some datalogging will make tuning for 20psi WAY easier.


----------



## [email protected] (Sep 8, 2008)

*Re: (Kenner8v88)*

When using EasyTherm, be sure to copy the INC files it generates over to your project folder since MegaTune needs these to interpret the readings. Even if the MS has the EasyTherm data loaded correctly, if the INC files are not copied you'll confuse MegaTune.


----------



## tooslojetta (Sep 9, 2007)

Looking for some MS help. Having problems with acceleration enrichment (at least I think thats the problem). I've tried both MAPdot and TPSdot with about the same success. MAPdot seems to work a little better but at about 3-5% TPS it stumbles badly. And only if I slowly go to 3-5%. Smoothly going through 3-5% works nicely but a faster KPA/sec or TPSsec stumbles. Any ideas or sample AE data? This is an OBD1 VR6 no mods. Thanks!


----------



## [email protected] (Sep 8, 2008)

*Re: (tooslojetta)*

There's a tutorial on AE tuning here:
http://www.msextra.com/manuals...accel
And a somewhat hidden section of the manual here:
http://www.msextra.com/manuals...e.txt
I hope this can be of some help.


----------



## 92rado2.8 (Jul 12, 2004)

*Re: (tooslojetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tooslojetta* »_Looking for some MS help. Having problems with acceleration enrichment (at least I think thats the problem). I've tried both MAPdot and TPSdot with about the same success. MAPdot seems to work a little better but at about 3-5% TPS it stumbles badly. And only if I slowly go to 3-5%. Smoothly going through 3-5% works nicely but a faster KPA/sec or TPSsec stumbles. Any ideas or sample AE data? This is an OBD1 VR6 no mods. Thanks! 

I can send you a MSQ that Paul did for me on my setup. The set-up this thread talks about is the one on my car right now. PM me your E-mail and I can get it out to you. 
On a side note, Tuning for some reason is the hardest thing for me to get, but Paul has done his best to try and help me. We all should have a get together, kind of like a MS meet. Sound good to anyone else? I am sure Paul would not mind, could make him a couple of bucks


----------



## tooslojetta (Sep 9, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_There's a tutorial on AE tuning here:
http://www.msextra.com/manuals...accel
And a somewhat hidden section of the manual here:
http://www.msextra.com/manuals...e.txt
I hope this can be of some help.

Thanks Matt! I already reviewed both of those (the manual and the "hidden txt file" ) Both were informative but unless I missed something there is no real way to log/track TPSdot(ADC) per sec or MAPdot per sec. I tried logging map and time and correlating a "change in MAP per second" and programming AE bins accordingly but there may be another issue that I'm missing. Fortunately I wired a T68 plug for the MS so I can quickly switch back to the factory ECU (where tip in/AE works perfectly). I'm confident the problem is in how I have the MS programmed just not sure where. Other than the very specific point of tip in and holding 3-5 % TPS AE works great, all of the cold start enrichments work well, the VE and spark tables have been tuned for desired performance on the dyno. Unfortunately I am planning on blowing the engine up on massive quantities of N2O this coming Sunday at the Pgh Classic and really wanted to do it on MS


----------



## tooslojetta (Sep 9, 2007)

*Re: (92rado2.8)*


_Quote, originally posted by *92rado2.8* »_
I can send you a MSQ that Paul did for me on my setup. The set-up this thread talks about is the one on my car right now. PM me your E-mail and I can get it out to you. 


I love tuning but hate time consuming issues like this one. My email is [email protected]
Thanks


----------



## JRaptor (Dec 13, 2006)

I would love to learn more about tuning. We are doing our best at tuning my co-workers boosted VR. So far it's going good, just trying to steady out that AFR line is a bit tough.


----------



## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: (Kenner8v88)*

head of the line!


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (hasnfefr)*

Got another one of these almost done on an SLC with some big turbo and Siemens 60lb/hr injectors.


----------



## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

ttt


----------



## mk3aba20vt (Dec 28, 2006)

could you give more details on the tach circuit and the launch circuit?


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (mk3aba20vt)*

Launch Circuit 








That, but without the 2k resistor.
Tach Circuit where it says 1-10k use 4.7k


----------



## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: (Kenner8v88)*

ttt


----------



## PapioGXL (Jun 3, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Just got my rado running on MS, thanks for the groundwork.

It helps to make sure the tacho output is on in megatune doesn't it. :wallbash: lol


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*

Haha, yeah even with all the info it's still easy to miss something! Glad it helped though.


----------



## VW_Robb (Aug 18, 2008)

*ABA Crank Offset 4 MS2*

Does anyone know what the crank offset is on a ABA engine? I have to back track a bit to figure it out







so I thought I might try asking before I tore back into my engine. Here is what I'm dealing with: it's an ABA 16v engine running a waste spark coil pack, using MS2 v3.57 as the management. In order to get it to fire I need to know how many teeth pass by the VSS until BTDC. Does anyone know this?


----------



## ClownTrigger (Aug 30, 2006)

*Re: ABA Crank Offset 4 MS2 (VW_Robb)*

For an ABA shortblock:
















I'm also running wastespark coilpacks. I have MS1 extra, so idk if your numbers will be the same, but at least it's a start.


_Modified by ClownTrigger at 10:23 AM 3-14-2009_


----------



## PapioGXL (Jun 3, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Alright, I'm having issues with my VR. I have the 55lb injectors in for prepping to turbo it, but I'm hitting some snags. I'm using the hi-res code also, but other than the fuel and code, everything was setup the same as need_a_vr6.
Now on to my problems. I switched the req_fuel to ~5.2 but have been playing with it. My Wideband seems to be reading rather erratically and I noticed my PW1 was exactly half of PW2.
When its running, the engine vibrates a lot, and has a loud clanking noise from the rear bank. I'm thinking that the engine is running very lean on bank 1 and very rich on bank 2, and the difference in power balance is the cause. Does this sound about right? If so, what would cause the difference in pw?
On to timing. I started off running the same spark settings as shown, but it would backfire through the intake occasionally on failed startups. I started playing with the trim angle, and it seems to start the quickest/run the smoothest at approx 32* advance trim.
Also, my wideband is reading differently from the display to the MS, I'm using JAW and have the MS set for LC1 while using the OUTPUT 1 on the JAW. I think Beav might be able to help me with this.
Any help would be greatly appreciated, as I need to work everything out in about 3 weeks to drive it 800 miles back to NE.
Thanks guys.


----------



## Lord_Verminaard (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PapioGXL* »_
Also, my wideband is reading differently from the display to the MS, I'm using JAW and have the MS set for LC1 while using the OUTPUT 1 on the JAW. I think Beav might be able to help me with this.


I don't have any MS experience so I can't be of much help with that, but I have used JAW. What do you have your Output1 on the JAW set to? It is my understanding that some of the other wideband controllers say that their output is 1v but usually it is more like 1.7 volts- if your JAW is set to output 1v, then it will only output 1v. I remember reading that in order to use a JAW with MS or whatever, you have to set the output to read whatever the voltage of an LC1 would put out. You could also just set the JAW to output standard narrowband and set that accordingly in MS, and just monitor your AFR through JAW instead.
Hope that helped some.
Brendan


----------



## [email protected] (Sep 8, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PapioGXL* »_Alright, I'm having issues with my VR. I have the 55lb injectors in for prepping to turbo it, but I'm hitting some snags. I'm using the hi-res code also, but other than the fuel and code, everything was setup the same as need_a_vr6.
Now on to my problems. I switched the req_fuel to ~5.2 but have been playing with it. My Wideband seems to be reading rather erratically and I noticed my PW1 was exactly half of PW2.

PW2 tends to give a bogus reading unless you are running dual table code. Unless you have specifically enabled dual table, ignore PW2.


_Quote »_On to timing. I started off running the same spark settings as shown, but it would backfire through the intake occasionally on failed startups. I started playing with the trim angle, and it seems to start the quickest/run the smoothest at approx 32* advance trim.

Check with a timing light, make sure the timing displayed in MegaTune is what you're really getting on the engine.


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

I had to look at some logs to confirm but PW2 is complete garbage on some and fine on others. 
Agreed, I've set up a few cars with this wheel decoder and I don't think I've done two the same. Your offset and the first tooth trigger will determine your static timing, just change the offset so MS and reality match. 
For the JAW, you might want to check for grounding problems.


----------



## PapioGXL (Jun 3, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Brenden, I'm just using whatever the JAW came programmed with, as I heard it was the same as an LC-1, but I'm not sure on the accuracy of that.

Matt, thanks for the help, I bought my RX-7's MS unit from you like 3 years ago, awesome customer service, its definitely nice to get parts from involved vendors.








Paul, I checked the timing last night, and it was only 2* off from TDC when timing was fixed at 0 with your decoder settings. It just seems VERY odd that its running buttery smooth at 30* advance spark. It jumps from about 1000 RPM to about 200 when I switch it, and smooths out audibly. I found out at least two of the plugs are misfiring pretty badly, they're missing about 50% of the time now.


_Modified by PapioGXL at 7:06 PM 3-18-2009_


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*

I just got another distro car on HR10g running recently, I'll try and get the msq posted for you tomorrow to try. 
Which plugs are fouling? All on the same injector bank?


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR (need_a_VR6)*

HR10g msq, for all stock stuff, but you can tweak it for your use: http://www.msruns.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=22799


----------



## Lord_Verminaard (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PapioGXL* »_Brenden, I'm just using whatever the JAW came programmed with, as I heard it was the same as an LC-1, but I'm not sure on the accuracy of that.


Ok, found the thread on 14point7 forum about that same issue: http://14point7.com/forum/index.php?topic=107.0
Hope that helps.
Brendan


----------



## PapioGXL (Jun 3, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Paul, I just threw in the stock injectors again, and ran your .msq, but I had the same problems as before. I really appreciate the help, I owe you a case of beer if I ever see you in person. I also didn''t notice really any difference with my IAC unplugged or plugged in, not that big of a deal, I can live with a bumped up idle and no IAC for now.
Another thing, I took it around the block really quick, and if you florr it, it has no power, and intermittently has a split second of full power, then right back to nothing. It really kinda feels like a large timing retard on a 2step.


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*

I would just triple check your wiring and make sure your board mods are done right as well. That latest HR10g msq runs/drives without issues.


----------



## PapioGXL (Jun 3, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Will do. I'm going to go yank the board out tonight.
Do you happen to know of any readily available usd adapters that will work with MS and vista? My old junk laptop is falling apart and causing half of my frustrations. lol


----------



## PapioGXL (Jun 3, 2008)

*FV-QR*

And survey says I need to start smoking, never done it before, but it might help. lol
I guess I completely overlooked the tsel jumper, when I got the board it was jumped to VROUT, not VROUTINV. I had to have looked at it 100 times.


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*

Switch that, turn both pots fully ccw and start from there.


----------



## PapioGXL (Jun 3, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Unfortunately, I won't be working on this project anymore. The engine died and when i restarted it with a factory computer, was knocking something fierce. I pulled the plugs and 1 and 3 were oil fouled while the other 4 were normal. :crying: I pulled the dipstick, and there were lots of shavings in there. :yuck: 
So I'm going to have to find a buyer for it before Saturday or else its as good as scrap to me.








So if anyone in the Cleveland area wants a project, let me know.


----------



## mk2t (Jan 14, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (PapioGXL)*

might be a stupid Q but whats is the "relay coil" in the tach diagram?









_Modified by mk2t at 8:02 AM 5-10-2009_

_Modified by mk2t at 8:03 AM 5-10-2009_


_Modified by mk2t at 8:03 AM 5-10-2009_


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR (mk2t)*

It's the coil section of a normal automotive relay, it 'simulates' the sort of signal an ignition coil outputs. The best way to build that circuit is take an old/used relay open it up and cut the coil out of it. If you use the entire coil it clicks like an sob


----------



## mk2t (Jan 14, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (need_a_VR6)*

thanks! i had a feeling it was as simple as that, just wanted to be sure


----------



## mk2t (Jan 14, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (mk2t)*

well... i did try that high voltage tach output circuit. i does work, good tach signal, but it makes all my other input/output going wild. clt/mat fliks up and down etc... motor starts but runs effy because of that.
any clue why anyone?


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (mk2t)*

I'm trying to get my megasquirted MKIV vr6 started...
First off, I pulled the injectors and I don't see them squirting during crank. I see them fire when MS first comes on, which I suspect is the priming pulse. But after that, nothing. I'm worried that they aren't getting power during crank, or that the immobilizer is cutting power to them. Do I need to put them on relayed power, or just fused power directly to the battery?
Next, my cranking power situation is all screwy... I'm running off of switched +12 from the vw wiring harness... but I'm pretty sure it loses power during crank. 
I need help setting up a relay that will come on and STAY on while cranking so I can ensure consistent power to the megasquirt, injectors, etc. 
Any ideas?


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: FV-QR (majic)*

If you're losing power during cranking you're tapping off the wrong wire, the one that loses power is load reduction. Not sure what's right on a MK4 but usually it's main current track "15" on the older stuff. 
As far as the injectors, generally I take power from the fuel pump output if wiring from scratch. Though right to battery + is fine, you just have the potential to flood the motor if you somehow blow the injector drivers and you'll have no way to shut them off short of unplugging the MS ecu.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

Hmmm... alright, I'll try current track 15 under the dash, right? Is that a black/yellow wire, or what color is it?


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (majic)*

The 'main' current tracks in the Bentley are the ones that go across the top of the wiring diagram (30, 30b, 31, 15 and X). Just find the diagram with the ignition switch on it and see which wire/color connects to 15.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

Okay... I'm pretty sure the motronic was cutting power to the injectors, thus no fuel was getting to the motor while cranking. It appeared as though it was working because motronic powered the injectors for a priming pulse (I guess), but then when it doesn't see the RPM signal (or G28 sensor) I suppose it cuts power. As a result, I'm rewiring to use pin 15 off of the ignition switch (black/blue wire).
I'll report back tomorrow.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

sooooo... I rewired the injectors to run off of the black/blue lead (should be current track 15... the MKIV wiring diagrams are a little different, and don't show all the main current tracks).
Now I know I"m getting fuel during crank, and the megasquirt stays on while cranking without any finagling. NOW... I got it turning over, but it was lugging real hard for about 5 or 6 seconds at 500 RPM and then dies. I pulled the plugs and they're wet.. too much fuel? I've got a 3.0L bored out vr6, 36lb injectors with a 4bar FPR... when I type those settings into the req_fuel calculator, it tells me 7.4... 
I played with the timing some... it didn't want to turn over on it's own power with a trigger angle of greater than 69 or so... 
I'm in need of some help, because I'm SO close... I thought I was on the right track when it was burbling for a few seconds, but now I can't get it to even do that anylonger... I think the battery is in need of a good charge, and then I'll try again this evening. 
I'm using your settings, Paul (thanks, by the way for the msq from msruns), but something just isn't clicking. 
Again, thanks for everyone's help.


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (majic)*

If you're using my msq as a base, you using a distro one or my coilpack one? Make sure it matches your hardware and all three ignition outputs are firing. The easiest way to do this is just throw a timing light on each wire for the coil pairs and make sure they hit during cranking. 
The req_fuel looks right.. does it seem to be getting a clean rpm signal during cranking?


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*

I think it is, but I can't be certain. I had the damndest time getting a signal off of the g28 sensor... according to the bentley, I'm having to put one wire to the shield, and the other to one of the VR sensor leads, whereas conventional wisdom says you're supposed to hook both leads to the vr sensor itself. 
The starter is turning the engine at around 170 RPM's on crank, and occasionally it will fire and jump up to 500 RPM. 
I wired my ignition in a sort of strange way... I have a pull-up resistor so that when the LED transistor is triggered, it pulls the ignition to ground... so I have spark output inverted: no.
Just so we're clear, the firing order is 1-5-3-2-6-4, right? So that means that spark a goes to coil bank 1/6, spark b goes to 5/2, and then spark c goes to 3/4, right? Could someone verify which goes to which, because I'm sort of at a loss there. People cite wiring diagrams for the AAA or mkIII wiring harness, and the MKIV wiring harness is totally different.
not totally sure it's getting spark on each cylinder, I guess I need to invest in a timing light just to see. 
Other people out there say that a trigger angle of 60* is what they've used... I've also seen the following trigger settings:
trigger a: 5
return a: 14
trigger b: 25
return b: 34
trigger c: 45
return c: 53
I noted that yours, Paul, use a trigger angle of 78*, and have completely different trigger/return points. 
Once again, ideas and help would be greatly appreciated.


_Modified by majic at 6:50 PM 6-16-2009_


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (majic)*

The firing order is 153624, you should have SparkA to 1/6, SparkB to 2/5 and SparkC to 3/4. One 'strange' thing about MS is that Spark A,B,C do NOT go in order of the LED's. D14 is A, D15 is C and D16 is B. Make sure you have that right.
That method for the ignition output is correct and works for me (I have a 1k pullup to 5v from the transistor collector) and inverted=no.
I've never used a trigger of 60 (on a crank trigger car) but it's possible. Your trigger angle and your trigger positions interact and there are quite a few that can be used successfully. Triggering on 3 with a 78deg offset has worked a few times. For a trigger of 60 you'd have to have your first trigger on tooth 6 I think. 
The 60deg number I always see, and use, is for distributor cars.
Also, make sure you have your cranking timing set to time based, if you have the return positions wrong it can make the car hard to start.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

Okay... I rechecked the wiring, and I'm good there... now, again... it will sound like it's catching, and it will burble a little bit and then die. 
What should I check next? I guess I need to verify it's firing on all cylinders, right?
It's a 3.0L with 9:1 C/R, so should I try adding more timing advance? Also a note -- I'm running FI DSR 256 cams... would I have to make adjustments for those for startup as well?


_Modified by majic at 6:26 AM 6-17-2009_


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (majic)*

Try changing the offset instead of the idle timing, and see if you can get it to hiccup and fully catch. Also, you have the tb bypassing any air at idle through either a stock idle valve, or something else?
If you get nothing from timing, try upping the req_fuel in small steps.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

I have no idle valve setup yet... I mean, the circuit is in place, but I don't have any of the ducting so I just capped it off.
Try adjusting the offset, in both directions +/-? I'll try that as well. I wish there was some good way of telling if it was burning lean or rich.. one good indicator, I guess, was that I pulled the plug after yesterday's bout of start attempts and they were dry, so perhaps it does need more fuel.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

One last thing... when you say "offset", do you mean the cranking advance angle on the spark settings? And what is the purpose of "hold ignition"?
Okay... maybe just one more "last thing". I'm having a bugger of a time getting the tachometer to function... any insight on which pin I was supposed to feed on the dash? I did some research, and I know that they figured it out for MKIII, but of course the pinouts are totally different for the MKIV cars... I can tell you (after I check this evening), which pin I used... or, does anyone happen to know which pin it is from their own experience?
P.S. Another problem I think I have right now is I have an undersized battery... it's a lightweight battery with not enough CCA, so I have to hook up a jumpstarter to it every time I try starting (for now) because of the extended crank periods. I think I need to just pull the trigger and go out and get a full sized battery for a) the greater cranking amps and b) the longer experimentation periods it will afford me so I can try starting it more times.


_Modified by majic at 6:38 AM 6-17-2009_


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (majic)*

Offset = trigger angle, I swear it was called offset somewhere at some time!! Usually I have cranking advance angle set to 10 and leave it there. I can't remember what hold ignition does but 1 always works!
No idea on a Mk4 and it might be a CAN based tach signal, sorry I can't be more help. 
Usually I hook up a charger the night before I want to try and get a car running. I leave it on until it's running decently to avoid the problems you're having. If you have a bigger battery and jumper cables, just hook it up in parallel.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

Shoot... I think I may have discovered another problem -- I think I have my board wired for vrout (non inverted). Megasquirt may be misinterpreting the missing tooth portion and may be reading two gaps erroniously. (as per explaination here if you scroll up just a little: http://www.msextra.com/manuals...rin30)


----------



## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (majic)*

Yep, it could easily be that. I had my setup backward by accident and it took all sorts of tweaks to get it to 'sorta' work. Switched it to inv and it was fine with both pots counterclockwise.


----------



## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

Damnit... I did some research on the MKIV dash, and 2001+ have can-bus controlled speedos and tacho's. I'm tempted to try something like this: http://www.kufatec.de/shop/pro....html, but not knowing the actual functioning of the device kind of worries me. The other options are a) live without a tacho (damnit), or b) get a 2000 dash (called the "919" dash, versus the latter which is the "920" dash). That will involve lots of recoding because the older dashes use the immo2 immobilizer and the latter uses the immo3 immobilizer. 
Why the hell am I going stand-alone again, instead of just ordering a chip??








Edit: Issam from 034motorsport says they get around this problem by "sharing" the G28 signal with the motronic ECU so it can still run the tacho... I'll investigate later, see what I come up with... for now, I'd be happy to get the engine started.


_Modified by majic at 9:45 AM 6-17-2009_


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## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

One thousand curses... that timing light was a good investment... turns out -- one of my coil drivers wasn't working properly. I didn't have time to test it after some cleaning and rework, so crossing my fingers that it will work tomorrow. Also, a bigger battery has improved the cranking 100%... now low voltages to contend with, and I get a lot of tries at the crank. It all looks good, except it sounds horrible (no wonder, cylinders 1 and 6 are just dead weight right now). I noticed it with the timing light, but I could have determined it a lot sooner had I just placed my hand on the exhaust and felt that cylinders 1 and 6's manifold tubes weren't hot at all. 
I think switching to inverted vrout helped somewhat, too... I've got the trigger angle at 68... seems to be what the engine likes. I've got the req_fuel at 8.6 I believe, but I think with more timing and tweeking the VE table once it is running should help that. 
More to come...


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (majic)*

Sounds like you're making progress! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_



Could you explain this setup please? (if you don't mind)
What exactly does the trig pos and trig return represent? Are the numbers teeth count or degrees? 
Great post!
Thanks.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (Audi4u)*

The numbers are in tooth count. Trigger positions are where the spark events happen, the return positions are used for calculating cranking events (dwell, timing). There's more info here: http://www.msextra.com/manuals...asted and here http://www.msextra.com/manuals...eldec
The first trigger and the offset angle work together to set your main ignition timing. For the other settings you just need to add 20 teeth (60/3) to the previous one to make sure they're even.


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

Thank you sir.


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## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

ttt


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## starnet (Feb 15, 2007)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (hasnfefr)*

I am a little stupid, but I do not understand "Both VR pots fully CCW" 
is someone has a photo for bord change??

















_Modified by starnet at 11:25 AM 11-23-2009_


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (starnet)*

On the V3 there's two blue potentiometers just about in the center, R52 and R56. Both those just should have the little pot screw turned fully counter clockwise until they emit a small click.


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## starnet (Feb 15, 2007)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

tnx now i understand








tomorrow in my time I will try.


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## starnet (Feb 15, 2007)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (starnet)*

engine is turned on and working, but only 4 seconds. at 1550rpm. 
and turn off.
I think the problem is Pwm idle valve.
i do something wrong, because there is no power on pwm idle valve connector, on same places i find thet D8 need to be remove


_Modified by starnet at 11:36 AM 11-25-2009_


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (starnet)*

Yes, remove d8, q4,q20, install tip 120.


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## starnet (Feb 15, 2007)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

I had problems around the work. engine worked for 4 seconds and then shuts down.
there was no other than I completely removed factory motor installation.
combined fuel pump and put the relay. also made for the Oxygen sensor, ignition coil.
I removed PWM valve. I have to manually adjust the work. and now the engine is running.
The biggest problem is that in my VR6 engine is not factory.
my car is 1996, engine 1992
and the end, This was the easiest and best solution.
A big thank you (need_a_VR6) and all others.
and I hope that my post will help someone.


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## valverde (Jul 7, 2004)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

hi,i need to buy a megasquirt the latest for my 1984 modified engine 2.1 lt 8v with extrudabody itb , can you sell me that with all the sensors and program made to be a plug and play.
i need to be ship to miami florida 33122
any othe information you need could be ask at : [email protected]co.cr
regards


_Modified by valverde at 5:53 PM 12-13-2009_


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## acidvr6 (Jan 2, 2010)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

Hi. I'm going to set up ms1 v3 and extra code on my distributor vr6.
What are your board mods? In your first post you wrote that it was:
VRIN - TSEL 
TSEL - VROUT INV 
If you do this, wouldent you jump the VRIN directly to VROUTINV ?
When I read the msextra manual, it says for vr sensor wiring you need to jump TSEL - VROUT INV and TACHSELECT - VRIN. If this isnt correct, do you have a picture of your boardmods?

Vr sensor wiring V3.0 PCB


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (acidvr6)*

VRIn goes to TachSelect, it's a typo in the first post. Thanks for noticing!


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## acidvr6 (Jan 2, 2010)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (need_a_VR6)*

Hi
Another question








Do the distributor based vr6 coils have a built in driver?
I noticed that your setting are "spark out inverted = no" and in the manual it says if youre going to use "single coil direct drive" (dizzy) you must set this setting to yes. 
http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms1...ecoil
this confuse me. If the orginal coil has a built in driver its logical....


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*FV-QR*

Yes, the ABA and VR6 coils both use an igniter as part of the coil assembly.


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## drag_vw (Jun 12, 2009)

*Re: VR6 Distributor (need_a_VR6)*

I have a costumer that is moving to maryland and I Install a ms2 extra in his fiat the car runs great, but he may need a litlle tuning help, can you send me your email or phone # to referyou this good friend? I call you monds ago but I lose your #


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*FV-QR*

You got PM.


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## hasnfefr (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (need_a_VR6)*

I love this post


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## jity86 (Sep 6, 2002)

*Re: Megasquirt on a Distributor VR6 (hasnfefr)*

im looking to do this exact setup on my mk2 vr6, i was looking at preassembled kits on diyautotune.com, which version of the ms is going to work best with my dist. vr6.


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## majic (Mar 10, 2005)

Back from the dead. Put the project down for a while and I'm trying to get it started again. It started up with a little gas peddle, ran under it's own power for a little while, now it's hard to start again. Is there any kind of logging one can do in the moments of startup to see what you need to adjust? I have a wbo2, would that be helpful or would it give me garbage while cranking?


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

Well I have been itching to get into megasquirt for a while now for my distributor turbo VR. I am wondering now that MS3x is out with sequential fuel and spark , is it possible to run sequential fuel with the ignition setup described in the earlier posts? I read in the sequential fuel section of the manual that it is required to have a cam sensor input.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

Yeah no problem, just wire in the cam sensor. The 3x outputs will fire a stock 12v coilpack with no mods, also.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

Thanks . my stuff is on the way. I should be working on it this week, so I might have a few questions in the days to follow. Any advice other than what is listed in this post?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

I have a few MS3 install threads, but it was when it was in alpha still, not sure how much will still apply! Everything is fairly straight forward on a distro car, but post up any questions you might have anyway.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

Thanks, I will need it. My really good friend is proficient at soldering boards and does a lot of ardiuno projects and things for musical equipment. He will be helping me with the boards and stims. I have been reading up the last week or so on the MS3 manual page to refresh my memory from previous reading. I am starting to understand it but once it becomes more hands on I will grasp it a little more.


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Nastyboost35 said:


> Thanks, I will need it. My really good friend is proficient at soldering boards and does a lot of ardiuno projects and things for musical equipment. He will be helping me with the boards and stims. I have been reading up the last week or so on the MS3 manual page to refresh my memory from previous reading. I am starting to understand it but once it becomes more hands on I will grasp it a little more.


 If you get stuck on anything let me know. I have been known to make housecalls.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

Ill let you know, if you are in melborne my shop is in north lakeland so not too far away from you. We actually go to cocoa beach to surf a lot . Maybe we could meet up sometime to talk shop .


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Sounds good :beer: :thumbup:


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

alright so for the cam signal would the hall sensor for the distributor work as a cam reference signal ? I understand I have to get "a" signal to the ECU but I can't see using anything else as the signal reference. I have been assembling the stims the last couple nights. I have found out I am pretty good at soldering, must be all the welding practice.


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

Nastyboost35 said:


> alright so for the cam signal would the hall sensor for the distributor work as a cam reference signal ? I understand I have to get "a" signal to the ECU but I can't see using anything else as the signal reference. I have been assembling the stims the last couple nights. I have found out I am pretty good at soldering, must be all the welding practice.


It works just fine. That's what I use on dizzy VR6s and ABAs when I want sequential. It IS the Cam sensor.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

Cool. That is what I figured. Learning a lot about this stuff just reading can't wait to get it running.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

so ... questions. 

I will list them as numbered on the MS3 v 3.0 assembly page.

#8 - Do I install D1 as I am running a single high current coil (stock Distributor VR6)

#26 - Idle valve setup: I was planning on running my factory idle valve, because that is what i have at the moment. I might want to step up to an OBD II vr throttle body later if it works better? I like the idea of having all in one for space . I guess my question is are you guys using the output on ms3x card now , or is setting it up like paul originally outlined it the perfered method?

#27 Tach input I assume is what is outlined earlier

#28 is the part about d14 on the first page on spark output

#31 ms3x expansion card mods, this is set up for the hall effect sensor in the distributor correct? What type of pull up are you using for this?


Thanks for everyones help. I am trying to make sure this stuff is correct before I get any farther in builing this thing.


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

#8 No don't install D1. That's for getting your tach input to MS from the coil -

#26 You can build the TIP 122 Fidle mod or not. The MS3x idle pin works fine but if you do the mod you have another med current PWM output.

#27 You'll use the VR conditioners but I alway build the opto/hall conditioner too.

#28 No need to do this the MS3X spark outputs will work fine

#31 simply install the jumper on JP7 and set the pots as described. That's all that needs to be done for using a hall effect cam in


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

8 doesnt matter if you are using 3x for cam in. I would leave it out.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

you guys are awesome. Thanks. now on to more soldering.:beer:


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

On number 27 (tach select) on the first page it is outlined a little different than what is outlined on the ms3 manual. 

For the vr sensor they have it set like this: 


V3.0 board - VR Input for VR (magnetic) sensor 
a) Solder a link between VRIN and TACHSELECT 
b) Solder a wire between VrOUT and TSEL 
c) With a small screwdriver, turn the pots, R52 and R56, about 12 turns anticlockwise (sometimes you may feel a "click" when the end position is reached, they can't be damaged by turning too far.) This sets them up for most VR sensors. 


On the the first page it is setup: 

VRIN - TachSelect 
TSEL - VROUT INV 
D14 with pullup to IGN (no VB) 
Both VR pots fully CCW 

Now I am going to use one of the spark outputs to control the stock distributor vr6 coil so I understand I won't be using the D14 pullup. but the tach input is different and I just want to get your opinions of the correct way for the VR6. Thanks guys. I am almost there, just have the mods to do.


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

For MS2/MS3 builds using a VR crank sensor connect VROUT to TSEL. VROUTINV to TSEL is for MS1 mostly.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

cool . that is what I figured . I just wasn't sure. I thought I read somewhere in paul's posts that he used the vroutinv because the number would be to low if the vrout was used. I am really digging the assembly. stuff is really small but once you pick up the soldering it is really challanging. Well thanks again. I should have it done soon. maybe once i get it going you could come by the shop and give me a good tutorial on how to use this thing. I will pay you for your time. Thanks again, everyone on here has been a huge help.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

Jeff nailed it, ms1 needs inverted, the rest you use vrout and select the trigger edge in software. 

For the 3x ignition out with a stock coil you run direct to the middle pin and use inverted output.


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## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

well guys with your help I have managed to get this thing to comunicate with my computer on tuner studio. I started inputing some settings and started to get familiar with the software. Next is the wiring. I am taking the stock engine harness and I hacked it off behind the big engine connector and am going to graft it into the ms harness. I envisioned having only one major connector in the engine bay for ease of working on this thing if it needs to come out. I am going to get some connectors from the junkyard to play with so I will be able to get it all through the firewall. This is my plan, If you guys have any words of wisdom lets here it. I know this is a little more indepth than just using a modded harness but I like doing stuff like this, I think it adds that little extra that sets it apart . And really for anyone that has contributed to this thread Thank you, as it has been a huge help. eace:


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## Prof315 (Jan 5, 2009)

We did basically the same thing with my best friend's SLC Corrado. We cut the 68 pin Motronic connector off right at the ECU and rerouted the harness into the car and then pinned the Megasquirt mainboard and MS3X DB37 connectors directly to that. It was a pain rerouting the harness but the end result is very very nice.


----------



## Nastyboost35 (Mar 26, 2007)

Well guys I have been working on my Corrado wiring and getting everything tightened up in there. I have a question about a connector on the CE2 fuse box. 

1) G1 connector
g1/07 
mine is a black/brown

a2 resource states it is g60 ecu power supply, In the Bentley for my year(1992 up to 1993 AAA) The path is for the ECM power supply relay. Now my question is, is this what will power up my MS?

Next...

2) Same G1 connector
g1/03 yellow/blue 
a2 resource - "ECU- fuel pump turn on" 
Do I use this for the fuel pump signal from the MS to power up the relay or should I use another method?

Thanks guys.


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## EnIgMa '06 (May 13, 2004)

Does anyone have the pinout for hooking MS up to a stock, OBDI VR6 with a distributor? The OP has placeholders for the pinouts but they are not there.

I just bought a MegaSquirt setup that was on an OBDII VR6 and would just like to compare. I have the plug and play harness from the OBDII car.

Thanks in advance, I'm just starting to learn about this stuff.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

Should be in post #8 it looks goofy on my phone but it should look fine on a real screen.


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## EnIgMa '06 (May 13, 2004)

Wow. Derp. Thanks man, I guess I'm blind! That was a super quick response.

I think the guy I bought it from originally bought it from you. Are there identifying marks on the board that would let you uniquely identify exactly what I have?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

There should be a serial number on the bottom. I cant remember offhand ever doing an obd2 pnp though.


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## EnIgMa '06 (May 13, 2004)

I think that you are correct. It's not OBDII, but he may have been running it with an OBDII throttle body and it was definitely a coilpack car. What is the format of the serial number? I can't find anything obvious other than "1708".


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

If its old its 2 digit. Newer ones are year and 3 digit sn. Like K&P2011079


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## EnIgMa '06 (May 13, 2004)

Strange. Maybe it wasn't built by you. I don't see anything that looks like a serial number anywhere.

Edit: Sorry for all the questions... I can't find a definite answer to these two (maybe I'm looking in the wrong places).

1. Is the wiring of the board (jumpers) any different between a coilpack and distributor setup? My wiring harness is setup for single spark output and was used with single spark output with coilpacks (I think...is this possible? They were not the stock coilpacks).

2. If I want to run this on my distributor-equipped car, do I need to make my distributor into a six window unit? I plan on running all factory sensors.


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## Ldub_Mk1Vdub (Nov 22, 2017)

With all of this wealth of VR6 Dizzy knowledge contained in this forum, would it be possible someone has stumbled across this one? I just picked up a vr6 dizzy in a 93 passat, the darn thing will only run on two cylinders, only getting spark to those two cylinders. Everything is new from the ecm to the spark plugs minus the coil. So, it has a new ecm out of a canada spec vr6 dizzy car, new crank sensor, new dizzy, cap and rotor, new hall sender, new plug wires, new plugs etc etc. I've verified fuel and timing but I'm lost at this point. Any ideas?


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## Ldub_Mk1Vdub (Nov 22, 2017)

Ldub_Mk1Vdub said:


> With all of this wealth of VR6 Dizzy knowledge contained in this forum, would it be possible someone has stumbled across this one? I just picked up a vr6 dizzy in a 93 passat, the darn thing will only run on two cylinders, only getting spark to those two cylinders. Everything is new from the ecm to the spark plugs minus the coil. So, it has a new ecm out of a canada spec vr6 dizzy car, new crank sensor, new dizzy, cap and rotor, new hall sender, new plug wires, new plugs etc etc. I've verified fuel and timing but I'm lost at this point. Any ideas?


Anyone??? Note that it makes no difference if the hall sender is plugged in or not.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

Other than this being about the crappiest place to ask your question...

Hall sender is only used to id cyl compression stroke for sequential injection. Without it it defaults to batch fire and you get no ignition advance. As far as two cylinders it would help troubleshooting as to which two, or not as that is an odd symptom. Could be fuel spark conpression...


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## Ldub_Mk1Vdub (Nov 22, 2017)

need_a_VR6 said:


> Other than this being about the crappiest place to ask your question...
> 
> Hall sender is only used to id cyl compression stroke for sequential injection. Without it it defaults to batch fire and you get no ignition advance. As far as two cylinders it would help troubleshooting as to which two, or not as that is an odd symptom. Could be fuel spark conpression...


I suspected it probably wasn’t the best place since the last post was like 5 years ago. Lol. It’s only firing on 1 and 6. I have fuel on all cylinders. I’m not even getting spark from the dizzy cap on any of the other holes such as 2,4,3 or 5 even though it appears the coil is firing on every compression stroke. 


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

New cap and rotor would be a good start. Before that you can put a plug on the coil wire, ground it and see if you get consistent spark while cranking. If so its almost definitely something after that.


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## Ldub_Mk1Vdub (Nov 22, 2017)

I have several caps and rotors, I’ve tried different combinations of them with the same result. However, I will try as you mentioned with the spark plug directly on the coil lead and see what I get. 


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## Ldub_Mk1Vdub (Nov 22, 2017)

need_a_VR6 said:


> New cap and rotor would be a good start. Before that you can put a plug on the coil wire, ground it and see if you get consistent spark while cranking. If so its almost definitely something after that.


I did like you said, spark is looking pretty orange and sounds pretty weak. The coil is the only part of the ignition system that hasn’t been replaced yet. Guess that’s first on my list.........now to find one. 


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