# Beware Pogea Racing!!



## billzcat1 (Sep 10, 2001)

This just in - a company called Pogea Racing is out there and has been ripping people off in the Audi community. They change ebay ID every few months. They currently claim to sell a reproduction Sport Quattro exhaust manifold. 
A business associate of mine purchased a "usable" RS2 transmission. Transmission arrived, and it had been run without oil and only the case was useable. 1100€ and all that was good was the case. 
Just a heads up. Pass it along!


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## nuugen (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (billzcat1)*

Will do....Shoddy businesses seem to abound here in the internet shopping mall...One plus is the ability to spread the word about shady practices much faster than in the "old days" without the web (anyone here remember those days







)...
Does your friend have any recourse in this matter??


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## POGEARACINGNYC (May 31, 2004)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (billzcat1)*

Dear Sir,
I read your post on VWVORTEX Forum. I am sure you can understand the seriousness of your accusations against our company that you posted on a public forum. Before I have our lawyers get involved with this I am going to try to address everything you wrote. POGEA RACING Germany and POGEA RACING NYC doesn't claim to sell a "reproduction Sport Quattro exhaust manifold", However we DO sell a BRAND NEW Sport Quattro exhaust manifold, and I can understand how you might have trouble believing this, but if you do you should have contacted us first before you write misinformation on a public forum.
You wrote that "a business associate" of yours purchased an RS2 transmission from us. 1) we have never sold any RS2 transmission in the U.S. 2)if you have documentation to prove that we did then can you please send me a copy, my fear here is that someone is illegally using our name. 3) if you do not supply me with this information and maintain the post on VWVOTEX, I will have to pursue legal action with regard to this matter. 4) every customer of ours has a right to return any product purchased from us for up to 30 days. 5) and any product that is not returned within 30 days has a full warranty for TWO years.
Pogea Racing, neither here nor abroad, does NOT have any official EBAY accounts. We DO NOT sell any of our products through Ebay. Myself and my partner do have private accounts, but they are not related to the business. Again if what you are saying is true then it is possible that someone else is using our name, and we will take legal action against any company, or individual that uses our name without our written permission.
Please contact me, Benjamin Abraham, so we can rectify this matter.
Awaiting your response,
Benjamin Abraham
CEO POGEA RACING
Eduard Pogea
CEO POGEA RACING
http://www.pogea-racing.com


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## Eduard Pogea (May 31, 2004)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (billzcat1)*

*STELLUNGNAHME DEUTSCHLAND*
Guten Tag,
wir wurden über dieses Posting hier in einem öffentlichen Forum
informiert und werden hierzu wie folgt Stellung nehmen. Wie mein
Partner Benjamin Abraham schon geschrieben hat, haben wir
weder einen Sportquattro Abgaskrümmer nachbau im Programm,
noch einen solchen jemals verkauft. Weiterhin haben wir in der
gesamten Geschichte des Unternehmens nie ein Getriebe verkauft.
Weder privat noch in Ebay. Sollte dies dennoch der Fall sein, dass
eine Person mit der angeblich von uns erworbenen Ware unzufrieden
ist, kann er diese jederzeit umtauschen, solange dieses offiziell
durch Pogea Racing verkauft wurde. Das deutsche Gesetz verpflichtet
bei geschäftlichen Kunden diesem auch bei gebrauchten Teilen
eine Garantie und ein Rückgaberecht. Das Rückgaberecht ist 30
Tage, die Garantie meisstens 2 Jahre - bei geprüften Gebrauchtteilen
meisstens 1 Jahr. 
*Hiermit gilt für Sie persönlich billzcat1:*
1. In jedem Land gelten die selben Regeln: Wenn eine Person
Behauptungen aufstellt, dann sollte dieser jene Behauptungen auch
Beweisen können, kann er das nicht nennt man das Verleumdung,
Rufmord und in diesem Falle Geschäftsschädigung.
_(Entsprechendes Urteil Landgericht Trier, EDV Recht, Internet und
Fernabsatzgesetz. Und 
§§186 Üble Nachrede:
Wer in Beziehung auf einen anderen eine Tatsache behauptet oder
verbreitet, welche denselben verächtlich zu machen oder in der
öffentlichen Meinung herabzuwürdigen geeignet ist, wird, wenn nicht 
diese Tatsache erweislich wahr ist, mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu einem
Jahr oder mit Geldstrafe und, wenn die Tat öffentlich oder durch Verbreiten 
von Schriften (§ 11 Abs. 3) begangen ist, mit 
Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe bestraft.

§§187 Verleumdung
Wer wider besseres Wissen in Beziehung auf einen anderen eine 
unwahre Tatsache behauptet oder verbreitet, welche denselben 
verächtlich zu machen oder in der öffentlichen Meinung 
herabzuwürdigen oder dessen Kredit zu gefährden geeignet ist,
wird mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe
und, wenn die Tat öffentlich, in einer Versammlung oder durch 
Verbreiten von Schriften (§ 11 Abs. 3) begangen ist, mit 
Freiheitsstrafe bis zu fünf Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe bestraft._
2. Sollten Sie bis zum 4. Juni 2004 ihre Anschuldigungen in diesem
Forum nicht widerrufen und klarstellen, werden wir auch in Deutschland
eine Klage gegen Sie anstreben. Da wir eine Vermutung haben, um
welchen Personenkreis es sich handelt, wird es auch nicht schwer sein
die weitere Person in Deuschland zu stellen.
3. Die Anschuldigungen sind gegen ein Rechtschutz Versichertes 
Unternehmen gestellt worden. Diese Beiträge sind von uns gesichert
worden und der Kriminalpolizei übergeben worden. Anders als in 
den Vereinigten Staaten von Amerika muss hier eine offizielle 
Anzeige bei der Polizei eingehen um die Person dingfest machen
zu können. Dh. Dieses Posting liegt zur Bearbeitung bei der Kriminal-
polizei in Ulm. Am Freitag, den 4. Juni 2004 erfolgt dann eine
internationale Strafanzeige.
4. Interessant ist auch, dass es sich hier um einen "Bekannten..."
handelt, und diese Person nicht selber schreiben kann. Mann nimmt
den angeblich anonymen weg einer anderen Person. Wenn diese
Person unzufrieden mit einem Pogea Racing Produkt ist, warum
schreibt diese Person nicht selber von seinen Erfahrungen mit
Pogea Racing???
Stichtag 4. Juni 2004.

Beste Grüsse, und nichts für Ungut:

*Eduard Pogea
Geschäftsführer 
Pogea Racing Deutschland* 


_Modified by Eduard Pogea at 5:38 AM 5-31-2004_


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## billzcat1 (Sep 10, 2001)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (POGEARACINGNYC)*

Hello Eduard and Benjamin.
I was told by an associate in Germany about these happenings and he told me it had been a recurring theme. I relayed the information he gave me, and likewise, I will relay this information to him directly. Hopefully you and he can work out a resolution. Personally, I don't have any vested interest. I looked over your webpage, and none of your products interest me anyway. Very nice looking site, though. 
I will have to argue that your sport quattro manifold IS a reproduction. You state it is a brand new casting from the original manufacturer with a new material, and a revised design to accomodate K26 turbo. Since it is not an OEM part, it is a reproduction. I don't see any problems calling it a reproduction - it doesn't imply any negative connotations. I'm sure it's a nice piece, but I don't want one.
I doubt this is the act of a fraudulent ebayer. Eduard's name was mentioned specifically in the email I received. 
Your question: "why didn't he contact you directly?" I know that he did contact Eduard regarding this junk CRB immediately after discovering its unusable condition, and he received no resolution or offer of compensation, nor the ability to return the item.
I have not named my source, only because I don't know how involved he wants to be with this bit of nastiness. For what it is worth, he is not the only person I have heard from regarding Pogea Racing's business practices.
Please do not issue legal threats. If people sued everyone about everything said on VWVortex, it would be a terrible and pointless burden on our legal system. "Defamation of character" is the buzzword of choice these days, but really all I have done is relay information of what has happened. 
Also note: my associate is located in Germany, and this would explain the discrepancy between your sales records and my story regarding RS2 transmissions. 
As for your note, Eduard - my German is fairly poor, so I'll write in English, which you obviously understand. First, in order to prove that I have committed the act of libel, you will have to prove that the information I have given is false. Then you will have to prove that I was aware that the information I gave was false and published it anyway. As I believe the information to be true, you have no case. It was recieved from several trusted sources.
Libel laws are not an international affair, and in America, it is not even a federal affair, so you'll have to use the Washington State laws. It is not a criminal matter. It is civil case and there is no possibility of jail time as you have mentioned. 
I hope we can come to a resolution quickly.


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## POGEARACINGNYC (May 31, 2004)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (billzcat1)*

Mr. Hoffman,
You are posting information on a forum that you know nothing about. Your information is second hand and sparse at best. If your “associate” has a problem he should take up with our company directly.
Once again I have to correct you, the Sport Quattro Exhaust manifold that we sell IS brand new and NOT a reproduction. We offer an adapter for the Exhaust manifold so that it can accept a k-26 turbocharger. As far as the material used in the casting, that formula is new based on new technologies, and it is an improvment over the original as far as durability goes, so yes it isn’t exactly the same material, but it is exactly the same cast and part.
Your accusations about EBAY and e-mail mentioning Eduard’s name in it doesn’t prove anything. There are quite a lot of people dropping names and making claims of different products and doing whatever it takes to sell or push the bidding higher on an item, so if someone used Eduard Pogea’s name or the name of our company, to say that it was our product then we would like to know about it, and it would be nice if you could forward this email to me. I don’t expect any e-mail to be forthcoming because you seem to be under a deep web of secrecy and like to promote rumors and false notions for other people to read.
Again, you make reference to your associate, friend, partner whoever, but you can’t tell me his name . . . I will offer the first few letters of the person’s name, if it is Mr. Braunxxxxxxx then he should give you more details of his transactions with us, he should also understand that we have all his correspondence as proof, and before he and yourself get into any legal trouble, please understand exactly what the problem is, none of this he said, she said nonsense. Again if it is the person I mentioned before then understand we never sold him a transmission, if your friend bought it from him and he told you it was from us, then once again you should know we never sold Mr. Braunxxxxxxx a transmission and it is not from Pogea Racing.
We started the company in the U.S. for this EXACT reason. There are people who are misusing our name and trying to claim that something is from our company which is not. We have no problem taking any and all legal action against those who try to ruin our reputation, it isn’t a threat.
Regarding international libel law, did you know that if it was proven that you slandered a company in Germany, you could be sued in Germany and then action could be taken against you in the U.S. I only know this because we had to do it to safeguard our reputation.
I consider this matter resolved, there isn’t enough factual information for me to bother with this further, unless of course you have something to add.
Sincerely,
Benjamin Abraham
CEO POGEA RACING
Eduard Pogea
CEO POGEA RACING


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## billzcat1 (Sep 10, 2001)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (POGEARACINGNYC)*

Well yet again I'm going to argue the semantics of "reproduction" - it is a new piece, reproduced from the original molds with new materlal. If it isn't original, it's a reproduction. If it was produced again, that qualifies as a reproduction! Thats not a bad thing, sorry I mentioned it.








The reason I posted this to a public forum is that my associate (who you are most certainly familiar with) had no success in dealing with your company directly, for whatever reason. Maybe he didn't buy a transmission from you but from someone claiming to be you. For whatever reason, he believes it to have come from you.
My associate has asked to remain anonymous, but he has has always been an upstanding businessman in the last 2 years since I've known him. His reputation among the USA Audi community is spotless. I've never heard any information that supported you as an honest, upstanding company. And I never relay information that was not first-hand. Sure, its second hand when I say it. It hasn't been diluted, this is not just a hear-say rumor. 
Listen - I've never had a bad experience with your company. But as Audi enthusiasts, we look out for one another. When someone has a bad experience or suspects fraudulent activity, we pass it on. Maybe this warning should be "beware of people claiming to be from Pogea Racing". In that case, I should watch out for people like you. I don't have any more proof in this post than anyone would receive in an email, whether through ebay or your website regarding your true identity. 


_Modified by billzcat1 at 1:40 AM 5/31/2004_


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## billzcat1 (Sep 10, 2001)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (billzcat1)*

One additional piece of factual information:
This is the manifold pictured on your website for Sport Quattro (new/repro whatever)








This is a picture of an actual stock Sport Quattro manifold. 








and the manifold as installed in the Sport Quattro








Why is yours so different if it's a brand new part identical to the original piece? Please don't view this as an attempt to damage your reputation. It's just a simple information request that you have the unique opportunity to answer in an enthusiast forum.


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## livi (Apr 27, 2001)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (billzcat1)*

The pictures don't look different to me? maybe your looking at them wrong? At one angle your looking at the waste gate side and in another angle your looking at the turbo side. How could you suggest they are different? The pictures are different angles, maybe the color of the casting is off but they look the same to me. 
I talked to ben from pogea racing a while ago and he seemed like a nice person and if his prices were right I probably would of done business with him but I am also unsure of the parts I want to order from him at the time.
Cheers
Josh
p.S. you probably should take this matter either offline or move it privately to some where else. I think we know what happens when heads inflame with opinions. Thats it for me.. This is none of my business anyways.


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## Fusilier (Apr 17, 2004)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (POGEARACINGNYC)*

I'd like to see a picture of the 55mm to 50mm adapter. The K27 to K26 adapter.


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## nuugen (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (POGEARACINGNYC)*

Just to clarify---A brand new sport q mani would be one that was manufactured by Audi AG...Anything other than that, new or otherwise, IS a reproduction of the _original_....And it looks like a very nice, new reproduction piece http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif --- and I don't believe the factory is producing these anymore, so kudos to any company that steps up and makes parts for the enthusiast...
Here's to a speedy resolution to this matter for all parties concerned...


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## Eduard Pogea (May 31, 2004)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (billzcat1)*

Here just 2 other pictures to proof your knowledge and your
force to damage our reputation. We will see soon 
*Eduard Pogea
CEO and Owner 
Pogea Racing Group oHG*
PS. The Pictures from the Adapter will come up soon.



























_Modified by Eduard Pogea at 10:38 PM 5-31-2004_


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## yumyjagermiester (Sep 20, 2002)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (Eduard Pogea)*

So how do you explain the difference in these pics?
Stock Sport EM.








Are you saying the above is not OEM and original?


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## Eduard Pogea (May 31, 2004)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (yumyjagermiester)*

Just the castmaterial itself. it is an OEM Part, made by Audi,
productionyear 2004, newest cast technologies - thats it.
orginal part numbers on it and production date - brand new,
best quality. nothing else. we have a contract with audi,
we decided to rebulid 25 pieces for enthusiasts and fanatics.
thats the difference. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









Eduard Pogea


_Modified by Eduard Pogea at 10:39 PM 5-31-2004_


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## yumyjagermiester (Sep 20, 2002)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (Eduard Pogea)*

So can you explain the different between the two pictures? I'm really curious as to why they look drastically different.


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## billzcat1 (Sep 10, 2001)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (yumyjagermiester)*

Thanks for the clarification on the Sport Q manifold. It looks totally different from other angles. Looks like a nice piece!
But you just changed your story about service! At first, it was 30 day return/2 year warranty for maximum customer satisfaction. Now you are too busy to satisfy every customer.


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## yumyjagermiester (Sep 20, 2002)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (yumyjagermiester)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yumyjagermiester* »_So can you explain the different between the two pictures? I'm really curious as to why they look drastically different.









NM, I can see the differnce now.


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## 84cgtturbo (Apr 3, 2003)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! (Eduard Pogea)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Eduard Pogea* »_*STELLUNGNAHME DEUTSCHLAND*
Guten Tag,
wir wurden über dieses Posting hier in einem öffentlichen Forum
informiert und werden hierzu wie folgt Stellung nehmen. Wie mein
Partner Benjamin Abraham schon geschrieben hat, haben wir
weder einen Sportquattro Abgaskrümmer nachbau im Programm,
noch einen solchen jemals verkauft. Weiterhin haben wir in der
gesamten Geschichte des Unternehmens nie ein Getriebe verkauft.
Weder privat noch in Ebay. Sollte dies dennoch der Fall sein, dass
eine Person mit der angeblich von uns erworbenen Ware unzufrieden
ist, kann er diese jederzeit umtauschen, solange dieses offiziell
durch Pogea Racing verkauft wurde. Das deutsche Gesetz verpflichtet
bei geschäftlichen Kunden diesem auch bei gebrauchten Teilen
eine Garantie und ein Rückgaberecht. Das Rückgaberecht ist 30
Tage, die Garantie meisstens 2 Jahre - bei geprüften Gebrauchtteilen
meisstens 1 Jahr. 
*Hiermit gilt für Sie persönlich billzcat1:*
1. In jedem Land gelten die selben Regeln: Wenn eine Person
Behauptungen aufstellt, dann sollte dieser jene Behauptungen auch
Beweisen können, kann er das nicht nennt man das Verleumdung,
Rufmord und in diesem Falle Geschäftsschädigung.
_(Entsprechendes Urteil Landgericht Trier, EDV Recht, Internet und
Fernabsatzgesetz. Und 
§§186 Üble Nachrede:
Wer in Beziehung auf einen anderen eine Tatsache behauptet oder
verbreitet, welche denselben verächtlich zu machen oder in der
öffentlichen Meinung herabzuwürdigen geeignet ist, wird, wenn nicht 
diese Tatsache erweislich wahr ist, mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu einem
Jahr oder mit Geldstrafe und, wenn die Tat öffentlich oder durch Verbreiten 
von Schriften (§ 11 Abs. 3) begangen ist, mit 
Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe bestraft.

§§187 Verleumdung
Wer wider besseres Wissen in Beziehung auf einen anderen eine 
unwahre Tatsache behauptet oder verbreitet, welche denselben 
verächtlich zu machen oder in der öffentlichen Meinung 
herabzuwürdigen oder dessen Kredit zu gefährden geeignet ist,
wird mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe
und, wenn die Tat öffentlich, in einer Versammlung oder durch 
Verbreiten von Schriften (§ 11 Abs. 3) begangen ist, mit 
Freiheitsstrafe bis zu fünf Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe bestraft._
2. Sollten Sie bis zum 4. Juni 2004 ihre Anschuldigungen in diesem
Forum nicht widerrufen und klarstellen, werden wir auch in Deutschland
eine Klage gegen Sie anstreben. Da wir eine Vermutung haben, um
welchen Personenkreis es sich handelt, wird es auch nicht schwer sein
die weitere Person in Deuschland zu stellen.
3. Die Anschuldigungen sind gegen ein Rechtschutz Versichertes 
Unternehmen gestellt worden. Diese Beiträge sind von uns gesichert
worden und der Kriminalpolizei übergeben worden. Anders als in 
den Vereinigten Staaten von Amerika muss hier eine offizielle 
Anzeige bei der Polizei eingehen um die Person dingfest machen
zu können. Dh. Dieses Posting liegt zur Bearbeitung bei der Kriminal-
polizei in Ulm. Am Freitag, den 4. Juni 2004 erfolgt dann eine
internationale Strafanzeige.
4. Interessant ist auch, dass es sich hier um einen "Bekannten..."
handelt, und diese Person nicht selber schreiben kann. Mann nimmt
den angeblich anonymen weg einer anderen Person. Wenn diese
Person unzufrieden mit einem Pogea Racing Produkt ist, warum
schreibt diese Person nicht selber von seinen Erfahrungen mit
Pogea Racing???
Stichtag 4. Juni 2004.

Beste Grüsse, und nichts für Ungut:

*Eduard Pogea
Geschäftsführer 
Pogea Racing Deutschland* 

_Modified by Eduard Pogea at 5:38 AM 5-31-2004_

"STATEMENT GERMANY good day, we were informed about this Posting in a public forum and position as follows for this here will take. As my partner Benjamin Abraham already wrote, we ever sold neither a Sportquattro exhaust elbow union reproduction in the program, still another such. Further we never sold a transmission in the entire history of the enterprise. Neither privately nor in Ebay. If this should be the case nevertheless that a person with the commodity acquired allegedly by us is dissatisfied, it can do these at any time conversions, as long as this was sold officially by Pogea Racing. The German law commits to this at business customers also with used parts a warranty and a return right. The return right is 30 days, the warranty meisstens 2 years - with examined using parts meisstens 1 year. Hereby personally billzcat1 applies to you: 1. In each country the same rules apply: If a person sets up statements, then this should know those statements also proofs, can it that does not call one slandering, character assassination and in this case geschaeftsschaedigung. (appropriate judgement regional court Trier, EDP right, InterNet and remote paragraph law. And §§186 bad Nachrede: Who maintains or spreads a fact in relationship on another, which is suitable the same to make veraechtlich or in the public opinion down-worthy, it becomes, if not this fact is provably true, with imprisonment up to one year or with fine and, if the act publicly or by spreading writings (§ 11 Abs. 3) committed is punished, with imprisonment up to two years or with fine. §§187 slandering who against better knowledge in relationship on another maintains or spreads an untrue fact, which is suitable the same to make veraechtlich or in the public opinion down-worthy or its credit endanger, becomes with imprisonment up to two years or with fine and, if the act publicly, in a meeting or by spreading writings (§ 11 Abs. 3) committed is punished, with imprisonment up to five years or with fine. 2. If you should not their accusations in this forum by 4 June 2004 recall and get straight, we will strive a complaint also in Germany against you. Since we have an assumption, in order it acts which circle of acquaintances, it will be difficult also not the further person in Deuschland to place. 3. The accusations were placed against a right protection insuring enterprise. These contributions were handed over to the kriminalpolizei by us secured and. Differently than in the United States of America an official announcement must be able to make secured at the police to be received around the person here. Dh. of this Posting is for treatment at the kriminal-polizei in Ulm. because of Friday, 4 June 2004 effected then an international charge. 4. Interesting it is also that it " itself here around a "Bekannten...; acts, and this person to write cannot do. Man takes the allegedly anonymous away to another person. If this person with a Pogea Racing product is dissatisfied, why this person does not write from his experiences with Pogea Racing??? Deadline 4 June 2004. Best greetings, and nothing for bad: Eduard Pogea managing director Pogea Racing Germany"
Damn! Them Germans are getting nasty! I like your cars, but your politics leave much to be desired!
Billz for Prez! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 



_Modified by 84cgtturbo at 5:20 PM 5-31-2004_


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## audipanzerwagen (Jul 11, 2003)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! Good Lord Man tread softly.....*

I dearly hope you know what you are doing?







They seem to be very upset with what you have done. Just be careful pal.


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## yumyjagermiester (Sep 20, 2002)

*Re: Beware Pogea Racing!! Good Lord Man tread softly..... (audipanzerwagen)*


_Quote, originally posted by *audipanzerwagen* »_I dearly hope you know what you are doing?







They seem to be very upset with what you have done. Just be careful pal.









I think he knows what he's doing, it's called keeping the enthusiasts informed and the "tuners" honest http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif .


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## LangsamKafer (Jul 17, 2001)

Please resolve your issues off of the forums. Thank you.


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