# new 2008 2.5s only have 147hp and 156tq????



## MKVJET08 (Feb 12, 2008)

i was looking at HP gains of a GIAC chip on the new 170hp motors and when looking at the dyno chart on the increase it shows the stock dyno at only 147 max hp and 156 max ft-lbs of torque...








http://www.giacusa.com/images/...k.jpg
thats pretty disappointing..


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## david8814 (Aug 14, 2007)

Keep in mind that there are drivetrain losses.


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## TheRogue (Mar 30, 2008)

*Re: (david8814)*

hey just think a civic has like 132hp and 101 tq lol we have tons of tq


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## Uber E (Feb 9, 2003)

*Re: (david8814)*


_Quote, originally posted by *david8814* »_Keep in mind that there are drivetrain losses.

People seem to forget.















Or never knew.


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## [email protected] (Aug 25, 2001)

*Re: (david8814)*


_Quote, originally posted by *david8814* »_Keep in mind that there are drivetrain losses.

Exactly, those numbers are AT THE WHEELS not the "170hp" that VW advertises @ the crank http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## [email protected] (Feb 6, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

It's also a Mustang dyno


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## TheRogue (Mar 30, 2008)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_It's also a Mustang dyno









yup mustang dyno;s are off by 2-4hp and tq.


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## Toiletcar (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: (TheRogue)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheRogue* »_
yup mustang dyno;s are off by 2-4hp and tq. 

true http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## cbrabbit (May 22, 2007)

*Re: (Toiletcar)*

so does any one know the whp of a stock mkv gti?


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## TheRogue (Mar 30, 2008)

*Re: (cbrabbit)*

197hp 197tq wheel hp


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## cbrabbit (May 22, 2007)

*Re: (TheRogue)*

how come our 150 crank hp goes down to the low 130's in whp but the gti's are only off by like 3 hp from crank to whp?


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## [email protected] (Aug 25, 2001)

*Re: (cbrabbit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cbrabbit* »_how come our 150 crank hp goes down to the low 130's in whp but the gti's are only off by like 3 hp from crank to whp?

WHP will vary greatly from one dyno to another, as well as one car to another; and on these motors environmental change will show considerable variances as well.
The GTI's really make closer to ~220HP instead of the 200 VW claims http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## cbrabbit (May 22, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

that makes no sense, why would you market one of your top cars at a lower hp than it is, im sure your right though, thnx for the info.


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## [email protected] (Aug 25, 2001)

*Re: (cbrabbit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cbrabbit* »_that makes no sense, why would you market one of your top cars at a lower hp than it is, im sure your right though, thnx for the info.

Who would want to spend another $10K on an R32 that only has 20 more HP? Its all about marketing each car for a certain "nitch" in the market share and not making one of your cheaper/lower end cars seem like it would/could out perform a higher end/more expensive car. 
It also helps w/ insurance rates


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## cbrabbit (May 22, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*

is that all an R has is just 20 more hp, your definitly right about tht who would buy it, i know an R has alot more cool features but 10k is alotta money, i just don't think an R has enough features and hp to fill its price tag personally.


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## Bart Simpson (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (david8814)*

thats bone stock with just a chip as ur 1st mod?


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## TheRogue (Mar 30, 2008)

*Re: (Bart Simpson)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Bart Simpson* »_thats bone stock with just a chip as ur 1st mod?
 yeap to the wheels. which is pretty good but i heard C2's chip is an extra 8-10hp and 10-14tq at the wheels on 93 octane program. but this giac i think is 91 so i dunno. depends.


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## halbwissen (Jul 20, 2001)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Who would want to spend another $10K on an R32 that only has 20 more HP? Its all about marketing each car for a certain "nitch" in the market share and not making one of your cheaper/lower end cars seem like it would/could out perform a higher end/more expensive car. 
It also helps w/ insurance rates









i concur.
this is why the ABF 2.0l 16v never came to the States in MkIIIs. 
the VR was out, it was a huge investment for Volkswagen and they had to make it worth the price to upgrade from a Golf to a GTI.


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## Toiletcar (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
WHP will vary greatly from one dyno to another, as well as one car to another; and on these motors environmental change will show considerable variances as well.
The GTI's really make closer to ~220HP instead of the 200 VW claims http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif

so true http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif in general you can calculate whp. FWD cars generally lose 15% hp. so take a 170hp rabbit X .15=25.5-170=144.5 whp. like said in the quote, WHP will vary greatly from dyno to dyno and car to car.


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## Vash350z (Jun 25, 2007)

Every dyno reads differently. Whats important is that significant power was gained.


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## MKVJET08 (Feb 12, 2008)

*Re: (Bart Simpson)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Bart Simpson* »_thats bone stock with just a chip as ur 1st mod?

oh thats not even my car lol. thats a dyno from GIAC. i was researching, deciding which chip im going with and saw the stock section on the 2008 2.5 engine and was like WTF!!?! but yeah i should have considered the fact that 170 is at crank, i dont know.. i always thought dealers claimed the hp amount as whats at the wheels


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## [email protected] (Jun 8, 2007)

*Re: (TheRogue)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheRogue* »_
yup mustang dyno;s are off by 2-4hp and tq. 

is that a scientific assessment?








The bottomline is that dyno's can all be very different. Even from mustang to mustang. It is all in how the end user sets it up. Ours was calibrated by mustang and is used to their exact specs. 
Dyno's are best to measure deltas and overall gains from your own car. Comparing your numbers to anothers across the country is rarely an accurate comparison. If you want to dyno your car, it is always key to get a baseline stock dyno before doing anything and noting the ambient conditions when you do this. If you dyno for the first time in 40 degree weather and its 90 when you go back for a power check, your numbers are gonna be skewed.


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## [email protected] (Jun 8, 2007)

*Re: (cbrabbit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cbrabbit* »_how come our 150 crank hp goes down to the low 130's in whp but the gti's are only off by like 3 hp from crank to whp?

because they are severly underrated.


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## oldschool86045 (Mar 22, 2005)

147 is actually pretty close. 
147x1.15 = 169.05...thats close to 170 no?
haha and i suck at math


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## TheRogue (Mar 30, 2008)

*Re: (oldschool86045)*

just to say a chip is a good deal if you gain tq and hp over the entire band


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## tanjetta98 (Sep 11, 2004)

*Re: (TheRogue)*

Strange i got 152hp this weekend with my 07 rabbit could be the dyno who knows


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## Idleone (Jan 3, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

European Car Magazine dyno'ed a R32 on an all wheel dyno and got ~200 whp. And adding an intake and exhaust only got it to 212 whp.
Feb 2008 issue, page 70.
Baseline: 199.6 whp at 6380 rpm with 192.2 lb-ft of torque at 2806 rpm
Adding Miltek cat back exhaust, GIAC chip and VF Engineering SRI took it up to 212.2 hp at 6157 and 201.4 lb-ft of torque at 2981.
If those numbers are correct and you don't NEED all wheel drive, you're better off in a GTI. Throw a turbo, chip and an exhaust on our rabbits and we got them beat.


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## TheRogue (Mar 30, 2008)

*Re: (Idleone)*

yeah 200whp for $30k+ not worth it r32 sucks. $15k with 150whp and another 6k to give it more than 250whp. I like my chances with the rabbit. and still cheaper than buying a gti


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## [email protected] (Jul 22, 2002)

*Re: (TheRogue)*

A stock GTI 2.0TFSI puts down about 187 hp on our mustang. Keep in mind we are on 91 octane here and our dyno is a little more conservative than many of the others out there.


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## gonyofam3 (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (TheRogue)*

Yeah I agree that is a lot of money,but its AWD and it gets all that power to the ground instead of spinning the tires through 2nd gear.


_Modified by gonyofam3 at 3:30 PM 4-25-2008_


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## halbwissen (Jul 20, 2001)

*Re: (TheRogue)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheRogue* »_yeah 200whp for $30k+ not worth it r32 sucks. $15k with 150whp and another 6k to give it more than 250whp. I like my chances with the rabbit. and still cheaper than buying a gti









R32 > Rabbit.
regardless if you're making more whp or not, the R32 is altogether much, much nicer.
i don't even have to go into details because everyone here knows it's obvious.


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## cbrabbit (May 22, 2007)

*Re: (DriveVW4Life)*

15k > 35k


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## VolksRacer2 (Aug 6, 2002)

*Re: (cbrabbit)*

FWIW VW advertises their HP figures based on a "worst case" situation to avoid possible suits due to overquoting (much like some of the Asian makes had a few years back). They take a high ambiet temerature, low fuel grade, reading for their claims. Pretty much any VW engine will beat its factory claims when using better fuel and cooler air temps for dyno testing. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## halbwissen (Jul 20, 2001)

*Re: (cbrabbit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cbrabbit* »_15k > 35k

business professional > teenager.
if all great things were affordable before twenty-five, what would you work for?


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## cbrabbit (May 22, 2007)

*Re: (DriveVW4Life)*

15k smart > 35k stupid
i think by 25 i'll be working for a nice home, not a car


_Modified by cbrabbit at 12:51 PM 5-8-2008_


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## jtablerd (Oct 9, 2004)

*Re: (DriveVW4Life)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DriveVW4Life* »_
business professional > teenager.


ummm...i'm a business professional who could've bought an r32, or a gti for that matter....
but i drive a rabbit...


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## jubeii (Apr 5, 2008)

yea i could have easily gotten either, but decided to go with the rabbit


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