# Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS



## Parklife (Feb 23, 1999)

*Wolfsburg / Detroit, January 2008*— Volkswagen is opening the year 2008 with the world premiere of the Passat CC. Its identifying characteristics: coupé design, yet with four doors; impressive comfort, yet pure dynamics; sporty interior, yet space without compromises. The interplay of these contrasts has resulted in a car whose concept and design set a new course beyond the mainstream. At the same time, the Passat CC is a progressive technological platform with high-class engines (103 kW / 140 PS to 220 kW / 300 PS) and innovative assistance and driving dynamics systems. These include world firsts in the "Lane Assist" lane keeping system and the "Dynamic Drive Control" electronic chassis control system. No less innovative: the "Park Assist" parking assistant and "ACC Automatic Distance Control" with stopping distance reducing "Front Assist" . . . *Full Story and Gallery*


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## odwyerpw (Dec 28, 2000)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

love the boat tail. this is what the Phaeton should of been.


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## mk2-ing-it (Jan 28, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

looks like the cls mercedes


_Modified by mk2-ing-it at 6:01 PM 1-13-2008_


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## _Steve_ (Dec 14, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (mk2-ing-it)*

Love it. Bring it here with a V-6 TDI.


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## JIIP (Apr 20, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (_Steve_)*

thought this was a S class before i read the title, I like the looks alright though + it seems they stepped up the interior alot.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (JIIP)*

Like it quite a bit, prettier than the CLS imho although the tails are little on the large side...maye 7/8ths the size would be better. The phrase "4-door coupé" still makes me







just because the car being swoopy doesn't make it a coupé; that describes the number of doors, not the shape. I wish marketers and auto journalists would quit calling it that.


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## [email protected] (Aug 1, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_ I wish marketers and auto journalists would quit calling it that.

The auto journalists call it what the manufacturer calls it.


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## hiegear2 (Feb 4, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (gti_matt)*

Passat Carrosse Coupé
coupe 
1834, from Fr., originally pp. of couper "to cut (in half)" (see coup), from early 19c. carrosse coupe "cut-off carriage," a shorter version, minus the back seat. First applied to *closed two-door automobiles* 1908.
They have gone above and beyond just calling it a coupe'. I agree this coupe term has got to stop.


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## stripethree (Jun 4, 2004)

I thought I remembered a post by Jamie saying the four door coupe wasn't going to carry the Passat name. Any knowledge on why they chose to do that?


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: (stripethree)*

Start saving my pennies NOW! I know what my next car will be.


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## WannaCorrado (Apr 30, 2000)

*Re:*

Too bad it doesn't have "going the wrong way on a one way street" detection system


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## EMunEEE (Mar 28, 2005)

*Re: Re: (WannaCorrado)*


_Quote, originally posted by *WannaCorrado* »_Too bad it doesn't have "going the wrong way on a one way street" detection system










Haha
A really nice car. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Though that new window technology scares me lol ala MK3/MK4 window regulators...








I'd buy one.


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## AK TUNING (Aug 7, 2007)

*Re: Re: (EMunEEE)*

Nice car and great technology, the only issue i have is it being a copy cat of mercedes, mix of cls and new c class.
Still a http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## TenthJustice (Jan 9, 2008)

*Re: Re: (AK TUNING)*

Looks terrific!!!
...but here's a question: Why don't we get the DSG with the higher output V-6? Delayed intro for the US? (I hope!).
This is the first VW I would seriously consider in a long time!


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## B_artman (Jul 28, 2001)

*Re: Re: (AK TUNING)*

wow.. i am very pleased with this car! design wise, its very elegant, classy AND sporty. the front looks a little busy in the pictures compared to the rest of the car, but i think that might just be the pictures. it looks a LOT better IMHO than the CLS. the interior is fantastic. i love the bolstered rear seats. i was worried there would be no pass through for skis when reading the article, and that was laid to rest with the pictures and further details. wonderful use of colour and contrast within the cabin. i am also very glad that they will be offering a manual transmission in north america! too bad there doesnt seem to be a plan for the tdi as well, however i would be more than happy with the 2.0T.








the whole 'coupe' naming is kinda weird, especially when seeing the car from the side, it really looks like a regular sedan with a slightly sloping trunk. whatever they call it, i love it! i just hope VW doesnt murder us canadians with pricing


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## amerikanzero (Jun 6, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

holy crap...i didn't i wasn't sure i'd be saying this about the Passat "coupe" but this is absolutely beautiful! they pulled it off amazingly! I love the CLS progressive design and VW is really showing us that they can compete (although indirectly







) ! Thank you VW, found my next car!
edit for:





























Oh and when is this going to be released?


_Modified by amerikanzero at 7:44 PM 1-13-2008_


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## scotaku (Sep 3, 1999)

No TDI or 'other' diesel option for North America?
GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ARSE, VW.
Just once, try listening to your enthusiast market for something other than a $35,000 sports hatch.


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## amerikanzero (Jun 6, 2004)

*Re: (scotaku)*


_Quote, originally posted by *scotaku* »_No TDI or 'other' diesel option for North America?
GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ARSE, VW.
Just once, try listening to your enthusiast market for something other than a $35,000 sports hatch.

in VW's defense, they didn't listen to the enthusiasts with the MKV R32 either.










_Modified by amerikanzero at 7:44 PM 1-13-2008_


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## hermitizer (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

more live pics here from the detroit auto show:
http://jalopnik.com/344225/det...-live


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## [email protected] (Feb 16, 1999)

*Re: (amerikanzero)*









More photos from the show *HERE*


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: ([email protected])*

AHHH They kept the craptacular North American cup holder!!


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## groupracer (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Although a very good looking car, it will ultimately fail to sell because no one wants to pay $ 45,000 or more for a VW car. I wish VW would stick to it's roots and sell a well made car like Honda and Toyota does. They (Honda and Toyota) don't try to push the Accord or Camry upmarket. They as we all know have their respective up market brands that sell extremely well and so does VW, so why try to push VW up? (of course for the money) Audi does a fine job with car up to and ove $100,000. Just my 2 cents.


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## davedave (Feb 20, 2001)

*Re: ([email protected])*

looks nice but I'm curious how heavy and expensive the 3.6 model will be.
and who exactly is VW targeting with this car? Even though the 2.0 is a great motor, will "200 hp" really cut it in terms of marketing against comparably-equipped cars?
No DSG offered in North America? What is that all about? That transmission has done alot for VW's reputation, it would be a shame not to capitalize on that for this model.
Hopefully the product placement(pricing, etc), marketing and dealer service dont sabotage it for what appears to be a potential winner for VW.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

_Modified by davedave at 12:10 PM 1-13-2008_


_Modified by davedave at 12:13 PM 1-13-2008_


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## LaFerrari (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: (quailallstar)*

I _really_ like this car but one thing that kinda bugs me is the from the B pillar forward it looks like a large car but rear of the pillar it almost looks like a hatch. Also, did I miss a price announcement yet?


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## phaeton (Nov 30, 2002)

This is the Most Beautiful Designed Volkswagen Ever








Yeah VW has a Blingmobile


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

The rear end bugs me a bit. It's got some type of similarity to one of the new Chryslers, and I think it's the taillamps.
I would like to grab that headlamp switch for my car, though.


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## FreshBaked 24 7 (Sep 15, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_Although a very good looking car, it will ultimately fail to sell because no one wants to pay $ 45,000 or more for a VW car. I wish VW would stick to it's roots and sell a well made car like Honda and Toyota does. They (Honda and Toyota) don't try to push the Accord or Camry upmarket. They as we all know have their respective up market brands that sell extremely well and so does VW, so why try to push VW up? (of course for the money) Audi does a fine job with car up to and ove $100,000. Just my 2 cents.

making this the more expensive Passat give VW room to make the regular Passat cheaper by about 10k which i think was the goal of the new management... so yes the Passat CC is expensive, but this makes the regualr Passat a lot cheaper... plus i assume the CC to be produced in much lower volume than the regular Passat


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## Cluemanti (Jun 17, 2003)

*Re: (BRM10984)*

Wow, great job on this one. Interested to see how many Camry/Accord owners will be converting... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Njaneer (Oct 2, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_Although a very good looking car, it will ultimately fail to sell because no one wants to pay $ 45,000 or more for a VW car. I wish VW would stick to it's roots and sell a well made car like Honda and Toyota does. They (Honda and Toyota) don't try to push the Accord or Camry upmarket. They as we all know have their respective up market brands that sell extremely well and so does VW, so why try to push VW up? (of course for the money) Audi does a fine job with car up to and ove $100,000. Just my 2 cents.

I agree, I don't know why VW continues to do this? In the US, Audi is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota. Why compete against your own "luxury" branded product?








VW has a hard enough time selling $36K+3.6L Passats as it is.


_Modified by Njaneer at 3:23 PM 1-13-2008_


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## amerikanzero (Jun 6, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Njaneer)*

now that the excitement has simmered for me, i started thinking about VW's history of giving us the shaft and i've come to the conclusion that if those sports seats/sport package, and xenons aren't an option on the 2.0t, and if a well equipped 2.0t CC starts at over 26k count me out.


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## davedave (Feb 20, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (FreshBaked 24 7)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FreshBaked 24 7* »_
making this the more expensive Passat give VW room to make the regular Passat cheaper by about 10k which i think was the goal of the new management... 

I seriously doubt that... if VW offered the regular Passat at 10k less, which will never happen, it then would infringe on Jetta sales. I dont think any management in the world would make such a goal. Sorry to rain on your parade, but its an unrealistic series of assumptions you make here.


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## GoFaster (Jun 18, 1999)

I love this car, BUT ... I want TDI.


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## haunted reality (Apr 18, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (davedave)*


_Quote, originally posted by *davedave* »_
I seriously doubt that... if VW offered the regular Passat at 10k less, which will never happen, it then would infringe on Jetta sales. I dont think any management in the world would make such a goal. Sorry to rain on your parade, but its an unrealistic series of assumptions you make here.

As sad as it is, I think this does make some sense. I thought the idea was to push the Jetta down back into the compact segment and have it compete with Civic, Corolla, etc. Then there is supposed to be a new car between the Jetta and I guess this new vehicle, maybe that would be the old Passat name. What I don't get is why would you name both Passat, that would be confusing. Anyway, I don't see this car in my future anyway, so it doesn't really matter what I think.


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## navybean (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

the cls from benz has a wierd but nice shape, the cc just looks perfect though!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Bill212 (Apr 21, 2006)

*Re: (scotaku)*

Left Lane had this engine spec listed;
"Two engine choices are available to U.S. buyers. The first is a 2.0-liter TSI diesel delivering 200 horsepower at 5100 rpm and 206 pound-feet of torque starting from 1800 rpm. with this motor,"


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## bryanb5.5 (Jul 19, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

I like it. Looks more like the Acura RL than a CLS to me.


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## ajz9415 (Feb 7, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (bryanb5.5)*

by by W8 hello CC.


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## Becket (Sep 21, 2007)

beautiful car. after seeing the spy shots i never thought it would turn out like that. interior looks just as good as some leading luxury manufacterers. hopefully that doesnt mean a luxury price


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

It's hilarious just how much less "piss and vinegar" the responses are here than in the CL thread about the same topic.


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## 155VERT83 (Aug 1, 2000)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Looks good! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## zerovdub (Aug 15, 2003)

*Re: (BRM10984)*

I like the look alot! I think there does need to be a step-up in hp however. 200hp is not going to cut it!


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## Njaneer (Oct 2, 2006)

*Re: (Becket)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Becket* »_ hopefully that doesnt mean a luxury price

Price ideas have been listed on some sites, one say's under $30K for the base model with little options but that seems like a pipe dream since they stated 4 Motion is standard. I'm thinking more like mid $30's to $40+ for the 3.6L.
No DSG, the new 7 speed DSG it's not yet certfied for the US. So it may show up later? Looks like manual or 6 speed tiptronic as an option.
It's shorter in height then the current Passat, anyone that has sat in the MB CLS will know the back seat is a PITA to get in and out of, headroom is equally bad. Just hope they corrected that issue.



_Modified by Njaneer at 5:14 PM 1-13-2008_


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## Mr K (Aug 7, 2002)

*Re: (Njaneer)*

OK, it looks nice and easy on the eyes, but I can't help but see derivative styling from the BMW 5-er (headlights) and Mercedes S-class and CLS. Beautiful, but not brand-defining. Without the VW badge, it looks like a BMW/Mercedes hybrid. I'd like to see it in person.


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## weirdvw (Feb 22, 2003)

looks great.


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## 83Caddy16v (Jul 31, 2000)

*Re:*

Very nice looking Passat.
As some one else mentioned about the mid $40s, I hope this doesn't become another W8 Passat and Phaeton sales failure. 
But getting a used Phaeton now for $30k doesn't seem like a such bad deal


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## where_2 (Jul 21, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Europe wins again! Europeans may order it either of two common rail TDI options, coupled to a DSG. I like the lines of it, but wouldn't buy it without a TDI option.








VW should bring the CC TDI to america and put the Lexus hybrid sedan out to pasture. Oh Wait, I forgot that VW doesn't know how to actually market anything in America. Take the 2006 Jetta_TDI as an example. When I fill mine up, people question that it's a diesel, and what it gets for fuel economy.


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## 20aeman (Jun 8, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (where_2)*

I have a feeling that it's not going to be too sporty with a front overhang like that.


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## familydub (Mar 28, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (20aeman)*

Looks great to me! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Avus (Sep 20, 2000)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (familydub)*

So is this Passat CC should be compete with Benz E. C or CLS??


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## Zackjoe15 (Jul 21, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Avus)*

I like it! Wonder how much it will cost.


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## nater (Apr 10, 2000)

*Re: (quailallstar)*


_Quote, originally posted by *quailallstar* »_AHHH They kept the craptacular North American cup holder!!

Indeed.
Not only that, but most of that interior is IDENTICAL to the B6 (or at least the 3.6L B6). I guess what is different is the technology and outside sheet metal/design.
Since I just got my B6 I was sweating when I saw this article.








Now that I see that the inside is about identical I'm not as worried.


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## Green Hare (Oct 21, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Zackjoe15)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Zackjoe15* »_I like it! Wonder how much it will cost.

Anything more than $10 is too much for me... not a fan of the CLS, not a fan of the Passat CC either... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## g60_corrado_91 (Oct 25, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Green Hare)*

I like it a lot. Definitely agree that the Phaeton should've been a bigger version of this car.


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## groupracer (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (g60_corrado_91)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_corrado_91* »_I like it a lot. Definitely agree that the Phaeton should've been a bigger version of this car.

Ah let's see now, about two years ago we saw the Golf morph into the Rabbit, and now thinking of it, lets take the pricey Phaeton, remove a few do-dads and VOILA, we now have the "new" Passat CC, of course at a much reduced price, but then again the Phaeton was probably way over priced to be "exclusive".
Re-badging a car with a different name is typical. Let see, Ford Taurus= Ford 500 not selling=Ford Taurus, without so much as a single styling change except for the badge. The crazy thing is the people bought that, they will buy the Passat CC.


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## 1.8turboB5 (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Re: (83Caddy16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *83Caddy16v* »_Very nice looking Passat.
As some one else mentioned about the mid $40s, I hope this doesn't become another W8 Passat and Phaeton sales failure. 
But getting a used Phaeton now for $30k doesn't seem like a such bad deal











vw is supposedly distinguishing the price points for all the cars. and i see a 3.6 passat 4motion sedan being taken away from the US market (38.6k, just over 40k with the nav) so that the CC 3.6 can occupy that spot and will top out at 41-42k which will be a very fair price.. for such a car. the base price is expected to be 26k as told to us by VW.. im guessing 26,990 + destination for a base CC 2.0TSI 

With the Tiguan at 22k-33k and the Diesel Jetta and Sportwagen coming, VW can afford to experiment with this new segment. When the Phaeton or the W8 came out, VW did not have any volume (or semi-volume) selling cars releasing at the same time to bolster the experiment of a car VW doesn't "need" in this market like the w8 or the Phaeton.
However, if VW from now on introduces "niche" cars like the CC with cars The US will buy for sure, like a minivan or a polo size car etc etc.. they can afford to wait it out till the "Niche" car finds a customer base. 
ex. the A8 sold around 1000 cars a year the first few years but with the introduction of the A4/S4 and the A6, VW/Audi was able to wait til the A8 was received as the supreme luxury car it is. The same would have happened with the Phaeton if they could have been patient.


_Modified by 1.8turboB5 at 3:03 AM 1-14-2008_


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## 1.8turboB5 (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_
Ah let's see now, about two years ago we saw the Golf morph into the Rabbit, and now thinking of it, lets take the pricey Phaeton, remove a few do-dads and VOILA, we now have the "new" Passat CC, of course at a much reduced price, but then again the Phaeton was probably way over priced to be "exclusive".
Re-badging a car with a different name is typical. Let see, Ford Taurus= Ford 500 not selling=Ford Taurus, without so much as a single styling change except for the badge. The crazy thing is the people bought that, they will buy the Passat CC.









this is in NO WAY a Phaeton rebirth.. or rebadge... no way no how.. this is much smaller than the Phaeton and a new car top to bottom .. save the passat interior carry overs... The Phaeton was not at all overpriced..(Bentley flying spur and and continental GT are Phaetons) if you have driven one you would not say that... should they have saved money and shared chassis's with the A8 so that it was lighter faster and able to be less expensive?.. absolutely..


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## groupracer (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (FreshBaked 24 7)*

and...

_Quote, originally posted by *FreshBaked 24 7* »_
making this the more expensive Passat give VW room to make the regular Passat cheaper by about 10k which i think was the goal of the new management... so yes the Passat CC is expensive, but this makes the regualr Passat a lot cheaper... plus i assume the CC to be produced in much lower volume than the regular Passat

how is making a $45-$50K car, make a car selling now at $36K cheaper? Oh by having a more expensive car, it makes the other, at the same old $36K pice "look" cheaper? 
Unless VW plans on selling the "cheaper" Passat for even less, like $25K, and then what will the Jetta and Golf be priced at, $15K? No, I think as VW has planned, to move VW up and to make more money. It will backfire just as the Phaeton did, and when it does they will they will still scratch their respective heads and wonder why.
I could go on. The CC is a good looking car, there is no argument here, but VW AG just doesn't get it about the perception of their cars here. Bring in a new "Bug" or something the general car buying public "thinks" VW's should be and they will sell well. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 1.8turboB5 (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_and...

how is making a $45-$50K car, make a car selling now at $36K cheaper? Oh by having a more expensive car, it makes the other, at the same old $36K pice "look" cheaper? 
Unless VW plans on selling the "cheaper" Passat for even less, like $25K, and then what will the Jetta and Golf be priced at, $15K? No, I think as VW has planned, to move VW up and to make more money. It will backfire just as the Phaeton did, and when it does they will they will still scratch their respective heads and wonder why.
I could go on. The CC is a good looking car, there is no argument here, but VW AG just doesn't get it about the perception of their cars here. Bring in a new "Bug" or something the general car buying public "thinks" VW's should be and they will sell well. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

dude, whats wrong with you?.. why does the price speculation keep getting more expensive..?.. lol. In all likleyhood in a possible extreme instance the 3.6 passat sedan may be eliminated all together.. this car will not even flirt with upper $40s.. VWs goal for the car was 25-38 but realistically it will be 27-42... VW is taking DSG and most of the cool techno features from the US version to keep the price down..


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## Kid Hobo (Sep 4, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (odwyerpw)*

yes... Yes... YeS... YES... YES!... YES!!!!!!! God VW gives it to me good. I think it's beautiful. 

(I better go clean up now.)


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## RobertoGL (Apr 17, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

I agree it looks a bit like a Merc. I like the attempt at a M3 Roof, also the front looks great, BUT the rear lights are from the Hyundai assembly line just stretched out! .. they can never get the back end right... last one was ugly too. Still waiting for that perfect VDub!


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## groupracer (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (1.8turboB5)*

Tell me why then would VW price a car smack in the SAME price range a their "luxury" Audi A4? VW wouldn't sell the Audi A3 here for ages because they always said it was too close to the Golf in price etc. They were afraid it would take sales away from the Golf. Many people think an Audi is just an over priced VW, and THAT'S further from the truth than my thinking the CC is a "smaller" Phaeton would have been. The real question here is why is VW competing with it self here?
Like I said before, it is a great looking car, and it's nice to see a another good looking car from VW, but not in this market segment. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Iceberg Slim (Apr 2, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (davedave)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FreshBaked 24 7* »_
making this the more expensive Passat give VW room to make the regular Passat cheaper by about 10k which i think was the goal of the new management... so yes the Passat CC is expensive, but this makes the regualr Passat a lot cheaper... plus i assume the CC to be produced in much lower volume than the regular Passat


_Quote, originally posted by *davedave* »_
I seriously doubt that... if VW offered the regular Passat at 10k less, which will never happen, it then would infringe on Jetta sales. I dont think any management in the world would make such a goal. Sorry to rain on your parade, but its an unrealistic series of assumptions you make here.


_Quote, originally posted by *haunted reality* »_
As sad as it is, I think this does make some sense. I thought the idea was to push the Jetta down back into the compact segment and have it compete with Civic, Corolla, etc. Then there is supposed to be a new car between the Jetta and I guess this new vehicle, maybe that would be the old Passat name. What I don't get is why would you name both Passat, that would be confusing. Anyway, I don't see this car in my future anyway, so it doesn't really matter what I think.









I too doubt this new car will drive down the price of our current Passat. If they reduced the price of the current Passats by $10K, that would further decrease the sale of this new CC. I know if I could get a 3.6L 4Mo for 10 Grand less, that completely takes me out of the market for a CC, Lane Assist or not. The car looks great, and I like the new doo-dads {Technologically Speaking} that are offered but I too am interested to know what the actual price will be. Lets just hope VW is thinking further ahead than we are and that there is something we are not considering.
Have a great 08 everyone...
~ Slim ~


----------



## groupracer (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (1.8turboB5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.8turboB5* »_
dude, whats wrong with you?.. why does the price speculation keep getting more expensive..?.. lol. In all likleyhood in a possible extreme instance the 3.6 passat sedan may be eliminated all together.. this car will not even flirt with upper $40s.. VWs goal for the car was 25-38 but realistically it will be 27-42... VW is taking DSG and most of the cool techno features from the US version to keep the price down.. 

I don't think DSG is coming out of this car as they have just come out with a 7 speed version. I believe the goal is to eliminate all manual transmission cars anyway. Autos are by nature easier to control by computer today for emissions. 
I do think that VW will not abandon their goal of moving VW up and my saying the prices will approach $50K is very realistic, but as with the Phaeton, it will back fire on them and I don't want to see VW flounder by forgetting there real roots.


----------



## Chapel (Jun 23, 1999)

I really dig it.


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## euromaxituning (May 30, 2004)

*Re: (Chapel)*

"4-door Coupe" LOL I laugh everytime! Nice accomplishment by VW http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## wagon. (Aug 8, 2006)

*Re: (euromaxituning)*

omg its beautiful!!! the first new VW I've liked as soon as i saw the pictures. no more of this letting it grow on me crap!
2 complaints after a bit of review, the hood, and tail lights. other than that, wow.


_Modified by wagon. at 9:27 PM 1-13-2008_


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

the sheetmetal is nice... except for the Sebring meets Tiguan rear end.
..i dunno, but does VW really need a Passat CC? 
All the money they spend on this.... they could of spent it on improving their bread & butter cars for the regular folks VW normally targets


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## g60_corrado_91 (Oct 25, 2004)

*Re: (GT17V)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GT17V* »_the sheetmetal is nice... except for the Sebring meets Tiguan rear end.
..i dunno, but does VW really need a Passat CC? 
*All the money they spend on this.... they could of spent it on improving their bread & butter cars for the regular folks VW normally targets*

You're right. They could've found a way to R&D the K04 into the 2.0T GTI/GLI with making the base price $2500 higher.
The new TTS is going to have ~275hp and ~260 torque with the K04. 
Seriously, I'm sure people would be willing to shell out another $3000 for a factory K04, but then I guess it would really blow the R32 away.


----------



## feels_road (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_Tell me why then would VW price a car smack in the SAME price range a their "luxury" Audi A4? VW wouldn't sell the Audi A3 here for ages because they always said it was too close to the Golf in price etc. They were afraid it would take sales away from the Golf. 

VW was not afraid of the more expensive, higher profit-margin version of these two taking away from the less expensive. They just thought that the business model for an A3 (semi-luxury hatch) was marginal, and the current low sales numbers prove it.
The Passat and A4 are too different and serve different buyers, IMO. The Passat, with the transverse engine and Haldex, is less about ultimate balance between sporty handling and highway cruising, but more about what you can do to an economy platform to squeeze a higher profit margin out of it, by _making it look_ sporty and upscale. Since it is a VW, it will still have great handling and a nice ride, anyway --- more than enough for Accord or Camry buyers, just not quite where Audi and BMW are located.
As to the 7-speed dry-clutch DSG, that one is currently limited to low-torque engines, like the 140hp TSI and the 160hp "TSI" (Which is a TFSI engine).
I am happy to see that VW in their latest press release has reduced to three the wrong translation of "schon" to "already", although there are still too many "even", and now we find "entscheidend" translated with the simply wrong "decisive", where something like "most important" would have been just fine. Can't they hire a native speaker to proofread this stuff? Not that I am one...










_Modified by feels_road at 10:00 PM 1-13-2008_


----------



## sys3175 (Jan 26, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*

I think that is a stupid remark, most car companies wish to bring their products up market since the higher upmarket you go the more money you make (since at some point you pass the point of simply adding more features). Keeping VW in their "historical" price point would be a great thing, and if the US dollar wasn't so bad would probably be possible.. but right now the only way VW can sell a car profitably in the US is to move it up market. (or make it in mexico)

_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_Although a very good looking car, it will ultimately fail to sell because no one wants to pay $ 45,000 or more for a VW car. I wish VW would stick to it's roots and sell a well made car like Honda and Toyota does. They (Honda and Toyota) don't try to push the Accord or Camry upmarket. They as we all know have their respective up market brands that sell extremely well and so does VW, so why try to push VW up? (of course for the money) Audi does a fine job with car up to and ove $100,000. Just my 2 cents.


----------



## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (sys3175)*

Volkswagen AG site up for the CC








http://www.volkswagen.de/vwcms...on=no
Microsite
http://www.volkswagen.de/vwcms....html
You can register and it unlocks the site to 360 views, videos, pics and funky music! I'm liking this car a lot.....
_Modified by quailallstar at 6:36 AM 1-14-2008_


_Modified by quailallstar at 6:41 AM 1-14-2008_


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## B5Speedo (May 2, 2001)

*Re: (scotaku)*


_Quote, originally posted by *scotaku* »_No TDI or 'other' diesel option for North America?
GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ARSE, VW.
Just once, try listening to your enthusiast market for something other than a $35,000 sports hatch.

X infinity. What a bunch of marketing boneheads! http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
No 3.6L manual? Boneheads X infinity.


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## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_and...
Bring in a new "Bug" or something the general car buying public "thinks" VW's should be and they will sell well. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

No it won't. VW can't compete against korea on price...they absolutely can't compete against china on price...nobody can. And why buy a VW if there are a dozen other cheaper (and probably better) competitors?...your vision of VW is stuck in 1984...VW hasn't been cheap and hasn't been low end since the introduction of the 2nd gen watercooled models.
Making money is not about selling the most cars, its about being the most profitable. Case in point Porsche buying a majority stake in giant VW.


----------



## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Stunning in photos and VWs tend to look better in the flesh! Nicely done, although M-B defined this look with the CLS its good to see a german designed derivative before asia floods the market with lookalikes http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## liquid stereo (Feb 26, 2003)

*How fug...*

This thing looks terrible. The german AMC pacer.


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## DMS_SLiC (Jul 11, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (NickM)*

I agree,great looking car.
The only "cheap"car that VW ever made was the original Beetle.Since then VWs have been about value.


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## cej (Aug 26, 2002)

Passat CC means - Passat Carbon Copy [of Mercedes]


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## Jim07044 (Apr 16, 2002)

Looks like a German Oldsmobile [Aurora].
That being said, I would buy one if the 2.0TSi with 4Motion had a MSRP around $30,000. Anything higher, and I would rather have an Audi (A4) or Mercedes (C-Class).
If they try to sell this at $45,000 in the US as I read here earlier, it will fail. Didn't they learn anything from the W8, Phaeton, and Touareg models in the US?! No matter what the marketing guys say, no one wants a Volkswagen that costs more than a Honda Accord, Nissan Altima, or Toyota Camry.
In the same vain, watch how Hyundai's $35,000 Genesis sedan will fail, too.


_Modified by Jim07044 at 4:06 PM 1-14-2008_


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## 2 doors (Jun 18, 2003)

*Re: (Jim07044)*

A sloping rear roof-line so there's only enough rear seat headroom for those under 5'6" combined with a trunk opening so small it can only accept plastic grocery bags. No thanks. So I get all the disadvantages of a true coupe without the car actually having appealing coupe-like side proportions? I don't get it.
This and the CLS always remind me of the Infiniti J30. They look like sedans that sat in the sun too long and melted.


----------



## sengert (May 26, 2000)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Yyyyuuuuugghhhh!
I guess I don't fit VW target demographics with this one, 'cause I think it is down right UUUUUGLY.
Sorry, but at its best, it is a copy of a Mercedes, which is also unfortunately ugly.
Sorry VW, but you still just aren't getting it in my book... Wish you'd learn a thing or two from the other makers about brand management.


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## TREGinginCO (Jan 4, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (sengert)*

The car looks great in these photos. I especially like the crease from the back of the front wheel well to the back along the belt line. Gives the car a great looking presence in the side profile.
Well done VW!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Boogety Boogety (Jun 22, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (NickM)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NickM* »_No it won't. VW can't compete against korea on price...they absolutely can't compete against china on price...nobody can.

You're absolutely right. Buy _most _people _don't _buy the _lowest _price, the buy the best _perceived value_ for their money. Or else, the highways would be clogged with Hyundais and Kias, instead of higher-priced (meaning, virtually any other) makes. And we'd be getting the dollar burgers down at your local artery-clogging grease pit instead of having a medium-rare filet at Ruth's Chris' on your anniversary.








The way they can compete in any market is to provide the buying public with something different and reliable and desirable. If they can do that, and by "they" I mean any provider of goods or services, they will make money and stay in business. But it won't necessarily be because they charge the least for their product...








No, VW ain't cheap and low-end, and hasn't been for decades. Thank goodness, look where that got American Motors, Montgomery Wards, W.T.Grant, Plymouth... etc. etc. etc...











_Modified by Boogety Boogety at 11:14 AM 1-14-2008_


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## crazy88 (Jul 11, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

i think it looks pretty nice... should do well as an upscale mid-size


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## DHill (Jan 8, 2002)

*Re: (Bill212)*

Beautiful. Love it. Looks better than the cookie cutter 4 door sedans from Japan, and has elements of more upscale German sedans.
I think VW has the ability to bring vehicles with the folllowing features to the US market:
1. 4 cylinder turbo engines *with* 4Motion and a manual transmission
2. an aluminum block VR6 (with a manual transmission too, please) to reduce weight in the front
3. A rear wheel drive vehicle (also with a manual transmission)
Cut down on the weight, make the nose lighter to reduce understeer, and give us a stripped down Rabbit with a manual transmission and all wheel drive. 
C'mon. You can do it.


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## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Boogety Boogety)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Boogety Boogety* »_
You're absolutely right. Buy _most _people _don't _buy the _lowest _price, the buy the best _perceived value_ for their money. 

Right on...people who think a Touareg, Phaeton, Passat 3.6 4mo, or Jetta GLI are expensive have not been shopping for something comparable. All are about 25% less expensive than their real competition, while offering more at every price point...usually being as good and sometimes superior in performance or ability.
VW is not infringing on Audi...once you get over the need for a badge on the front of your car you'll realize that there is no overlap...VW buyers don't x-shop Audi and vice versa. 
VW is making a full range product, in the same way Chevy makes a low end $10K Aveo all the way up to a $100K corvette ZR1, with plenty of $50-$60K SUVs and trucks in there...A Cadillac buyer won't buy a chevy, and vice versa...same for Audi and VW. ie: I can afford any current Audi south of the R8, I like driving a VW and will buy them. I am not interested in driving an Audi.


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (NickM)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NickM* »_
VW is not infringing on Audi...once you get over the need for a badge on the front of your car you'll realize that there is no overlap...VW buyers don't x-shop Audi and vice versa. 


Actually the whole point of VW's "upmarket strategy" was to prevent VW owners from "upgrading" to an Audi. This is why there is overlap with VW and Audi. However, people are still badge snobs... a bare bones Audi A4 2.0t still has more prestigue than a loaded VW Passat 3.6L 4Motion, for one main reason.... the 4-circles.


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## aircooled (Jul 30, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Volkswagen is brain dead if they think offering a new vehicle to the US market WITHOUT a diesel option is a good idea.


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## audivwguy (May 10, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

My first look at the CC created love at first sight.








Without a TDI in the U.S. that love bubble burst like when you see what looks like a beautiful woman from behind and then, upon closer inspection, you find she is toothless and has a nose like a wild boar.
As with the Tiguan, leaving the CC without a diesel will position it right in the middle of a very large heard........... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## groupracer (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

here's the real reason VW needs the higher profit margin cars...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/germ...tinue

Pieche's comments about "irregularities" speaks volumes about how some people percive things...


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## Jim07044 (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (NickM)*


_Quote »_VW is not infringing on Audi...once you get over the need for a badge on the front of your car you'll realize that there is no overlap...VW buyers don't x-shop Audi and vice versa.

I disagree with this statement. Do you think Toyota could have sold a $40K luxury sedan in 1990 instead of the Lexus LS400? You have to respect consumer's affiliation for luxury brands (you are what you drive). Only engineers can look past the badge. Plus: you can't argue with the facts, the $80K Phaeton V8 and $100K Phaeton W12 failed to sell well here in the US not because they weren't good values (they were) but because buyers would rather have a Mercedes (S-Class) or BMW (7-Series) at those price levels. When the dealer is used to selling $25K cars and you bring in your $80K+ car for service, what kind of treatment do you think you're going to get? VW failed to look at the total experience package.


_Quote »_VW is making a full range product, in the same way Chevy makes a low end $10K Aveo all the way up to a $100K corvette ZR1, with plenty of $50-$60K SUVs and trucks in there...A Cadillac buyer won't buy a chevy, and vice versa.

Chevy is to VW as Cadillac is to Audi. Many would argue that Corvette is its own brand, its so niche. And to be fair, most Corvettes sold are the garden-variety $50K coupes and convertibles (not the ultra-premium ZR1 which isn't even on sale yet).


_Quote »_I can afford any current Audi south of the R8, I like driving a VW and will buy them. I am not interested in driving an Audi.

Well, if you look past the badge, Audis are very good cars ...


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Jim07044)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim07044* »_
When the dealer is used to selling $25K cars and you bring in your $80K+ car for service, what kind of treatment do you think you're going to get? VW failed to look at the total experience package.


Actually, only a select number of VW dealerships are authorized to sell & service Phaetons.
In a similar story, with the Maybach, only a select few Benz dealerships are authorized to sell & service Maybachs


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## Jim07044 (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (GT17V)*


_Quote »_Actually, only a select number of VW dealerships are authorized to sell & service Phaetons. In a similar story, with the Maybach, only a select few Benz dealerships are authorized to sell & service Maybachs

I would wager to say that could be one reason why those cars did not meet their sales expectations: if the nearest dealership for routine service is more than hour's drive from your home of residence, that could be very inconvenient.


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## monkeyrun (Dec 4, 2006)

Sweet








This will be my next car!


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## wagon. (Aug 8, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (quailallstar)*

put this engine in it.
http://www.fourtitude.com/news...shtml


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (wagon.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wagon.* »_put this engine in it.
http://www.fourtitude.com/news...shtml


yeah, like it's gonna fit.
It be great if the 3.0L V6 TDI motor fit....


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## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Jim07044)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jim07044* »_
Plus: you can't argue with the facts, the $80K Phaeton V8 and $100K Phaeton W12 failed to sell well here in the US not because they weren't good values (they were) but because buyers would rather have a Mercedes (S-Class) or BMW (7-Series) at those price levels. When the dealer is used to selling $25K cars and you bring in your $80K+ car for service, what kind of treatment do you think you're going to get? VW failed to look at the total experience package.


I agree VW didn't handle it well, but many folks bring in their $10K Aveo into the same dealership that people drive their $70 XLRs, $50K Tahoes and Vette's into...don't see the difference between this and a VW dealer servicing Rabbits and Phaetons. I agree VW failed on marketing and the total package...but the concept can work. Just because a brand crosses a specific price does not suddenly mean "they must sell it as a high end brand".

_Quote, originally posted by *Jim07044* »_
Chevy is to VW as Cadillac is to Audi. Many would argue that Corvette is its own brand, its so niche. And to be fair, most Corvettes sold are the garden-variety $50K coupes and convertibles (not the ultra-premium ZR1 which isn't even on sale yet).


my point was VW is going full range and this does not mean they are trying to move into Audi territory. Chevy sells plenty of $50K Tahoes and the $55K Escalade still does well. Different strokes for different folks.

_Quote, originally posted by *Jim07044* »_
Well, if you look past the badge, Audis are very good cars ...










agreed










_Modified by NickM at 5:10 PM 1-14-2008_


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## 1.8turboB5 (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (groupracer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *groupracer* »_
I don't think DSG is coming out of this car as they have just come out with a 7 speed version. I believe the goal is to eliminate all manual transmission cars anyway. Autos are by nature easier to control by computer today for emissions. 
I do think that VW will not abandon their goal of moving VW up and my saying the prices will approach $50K is very realistic, but as with the Phaeton, it will back fire on them and I don't want to see VW flounder by forgetting there real roots.

well i can tell you for a fact that this car wont come to these shores with a DSG at first. Besides that i have confirmed this with my regional rep, it also says it in the VW Press release that the US version gets the Tiptronic 6speed.. as for the price i also know that this car will not penetrate $45k .. probably not even $42k.. so stop speculating.. if the Phaeton was $66k..there is noway this car would get even close to $50K this car is barely more than half waht the Phaeton was.. this is a lower market CLS competitor and is designed to be such so it will be about half the price.. as for the Phaeton it was a pound for pound (so to speak) legit competitior for the Sclass, 7er and A8.. so the price reflected such.. VW doesnt have such delusions for the CC..


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## THE KILLER RABBIT (Jun 2, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (haunted reality)*

those back seats are to die for
when is the release?


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## sys3175 (Jan 26, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (aircooled)*

I disagree.. If they offered a decent performance diesel with decent mileage I would jump on it, but the average consumer would not. Diesels simply do not sell well in the US. There are federal and state restrictions on how many diesels you can sell. In many NE states diesel sells for 25-30% more then premium through the winter months because it steps on fuel oil's toes. 
I wish the vortexers who want a diesel would drop the "it needs to be diesel to make it" argument.. because in the US that is simply not true.. it is nice if you want one in diesel.. I am with you.. but stop thinking that an engine option is going to be the savior of the brand. 
VW will only sell more cares in the US by offering cars with the right options and the right prices and rebuilding their tarnished reliability reputation... (I don't claim VW''s are any less reliable, and I think over the 150k miles my car has done well.. but right at this moment it is sitting in the parking lot of my office and won't start







)

_Quote, originally posted by *aircooled* »_Volkswagen is brain dead if they think offering a new vehicle to the US market WITHOUT a diesel option is a good idea.


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## scud6661 (Nov 27, 2000)

i'm damn surprised car manufacturers are taking the risk of having park assist, lane change assist and speed control o their cars. i mean, aren't they having enough problems from people sueing them for miniscule issues which don't belong to the car manufacturer's fault? having these new features involve safety and is essentially putting the driver and passenger's fate onto the car's hand. even if its faultless, i can see the driver/user doing something stupid to ruin it for all of us who enjoy this technology. 
i.e- some dude did not have intentions to turn off the lane change but then accidently does so when moving his knee or brushing his arm over while changing radio stations. car detects movement from steering wheel and lane assist is turned off. car goes straright ahead and hits the car across the lane. after the accident, of course the dude will claim that he never turned off the system and sue for millions instead of admitting that he must've steered the steering wheel, cancelling the lane assist.
VW better include a 7" LCD monitor on its dashes stating disclaimers everytime a user turns on one ofits cool functions. either that or include annoying voice files stating disclaimers everytime these systems are turned on.
sorry for being so grey here but i can see those lawsuits coming from a couple of bad apples.


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## DanGreco (Mar 23, 2006)

ITS SO OBVIOUS VW NOW DEFITNITNLEY OWN MERCEDES BENZ FOR SURE, JUST LOOK AT THAT CAR, IT SAY S550 ALL OVER IT, THIS JUST MEANS THAT VW IS BIGGER, BADDER, CONFRIMS THEY ARE THE BEST. I HATED BENZ, BUT NOW, THEY'RE ALRIGHT..............GO VW!!!!!!


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## Blue Golfer (Feb 4, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Njaneer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Njaneer* »_
I agree, I don't know why VW continues to do this? In the US, Audi is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota. Why compete against your own "luxury" branded product?








VW has a hard enough time selling $36K+3.6L Passats as it is.



Right now I'm trying to contemplate the idea of a Passat CC cheaper than an Audi A3.


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## dubracer84 (Nov 13, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

I like it... very nice car.. I would most definitely drive that.. very nice VW http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## ftillier (Nov 30, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

The "Lane Assist" is going to piss off a ton of American motorists who don't know that turn signals exist, or what they are used for, when changing lanes - probably cause accidents, even: "I tried to change lanes, but the car didn't let me so I rear ended the guy"








Shame that all these techno fixes to allow people to get distracted by the Nav, cell phone, makeup, burgers, or whatnot. These cars just help stupid people drive faster.


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## yannb (Jan 14, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (dubracer84)*

I love it. Much better looking than the benz cls. The CC is what the CLS should have looked like. Now I want to see a passat wagon with that front end. I've been wanting an audi A6 sedan or wagon, but now I think i may have to wait for the CC. Although, the A6 has very nice lines, simple sheet panel, it is very classy. I could do without the blinged wheels and side mirrors on the CC.


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## B4WrNd (Nov 15, 2004)

Come on now this is going to be another disaster like the phaeton only to a lesser extent. Look at the 3.6 passats, they just dont sell. How on earth do they think this car will be any different?


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## Blown Wide Open (Feb 5, 2001)

*Re: (Bill212)*

When my B6 passat lease s up, I found my new car...
PAtrick


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## MrGTI (Feb 14, 2000)

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Looks really nice. Nice job Volkswagen.


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## VWYankee (Jan 13, 2000)

It will be interesting to see how well this does with being a different shell Passat (and slightly more interior room).
I can't believe no one has commented about how an "upscale" Passat this is to be doesn't have LED tails when the regular Passat does. At least it doesn't appear they're LED....
*edit*
I also think the diesel comments that only diesel owners want them is a bit narrow. Things are changing on diesel awareness (so to speak) with more knowledge and print of biofuels. There's already other car makers that are going to be bringing diesels to our shores very soon (that they've had in Europe for some time), so it would only make sense that VW, the company that's had diesels already, expand that throughout their model line-up to keep the capital on being the number one diesel passenger car company in the US.


_Modified by VWYankee at 9:00 AM 1-15-2008_


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## gizmopop (Feb 6, 2000)

*Re: (VWYankee)*

My only gripe is baggage that the Passat name brings with it. People associate the Passat name with a Camry/Accord fighting family sedan...(and that level pricing). They should have seriously considered calling it something else. I see this car as maybe $2000 to 5000 more than the comparable Passat.


----------



## audivwguy (May 10, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (sys3175)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sys3175* »_I disagree.. Diesels simply do not sell well in the US. There are federal and state restrictions on how many diesels you can sell. In many NE states diesel sells for 25-30% more then premium through the winter months because it steps on fuel oil's toes. 
I wish the vortexers who want a diesel would drop the "it needs to be diesel to make it" argument.. because in the US that is simply not true.. it is nice if you want one in diesel.. I am with you.. but stop thinking that an engine option is going to be the savior of the brand.

I agree that diesels alone will not be the "savior of the brand". 
However having clean, quite, high mileage TDIs (like the new Jetta TDI coming here this year, could be an excellent way for VW to differentiate itself in the U.S. market especially now that Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel arrived here about a year ago and biodiesel is on the way. Automakers strive every day and to differentiate themselves from their competitiors and VW, as the world leader in passenger car diesels, has a hugh opportunity right now to have something Toyota, Honda, Nissan etc. do not yet have: diesel cars in the U.S. market.








Bye the way, are you sure about "federal and state restrictions on how many diesels you can sell"? I haven't heard of any limits nor have I seen any discussion of such limits on VWvortex. Perhaps you are referring to the 4 or 5 states where VW could not sell their old TDIs due to higher emission standards in those states. If so, the good news is that the coming VW TDIs are expected to be 50 state compliant.
Also, your diesel fuel price differential seems a bit high. If true and say premium is now selling at about $3.35 per gallon, diesel would be priced at $4.19 to $4.35 per gallon or about $1.00 more per gallon then I know it is selling for now in at least some areas. Even if true, odds are diesel will drop in price relative to gas during the other 9 months of the year as it has tended to do historically. Plus diesels tend to get 25 to 35% better mileage and have other substantial advantages vs. gassers. 
I started this post with a point on which we agree. I'll end it by saying the new Passat CC is a one good looking vehicle - which I believe is your view. I, like many others, just wish VW offerred a TDI option on it like they plan to do outside North America. Doing so would give U.S. buyers yet another reason to increase diesel's market share from about 3% now to something closer to the roughly 50% share they have in Europe.


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## hi_racing (Jul 6, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Forty-freaking-five thousand dollars? Listen up, VW! You're INSANE! My $45K will buy a loaded CTS with GREAT service from the dealer. When I take my 2000 DeVille in for an oil change they give me a free CTS loaner for the day and fully detail the car before I pick it up. They kiss my butt like it's gold plated! 
It's one thing for VW to copy/steal design elements from Merc and BM-trouble-U, but they have a huge mountain to climb with their dealer network before I'll consider buying an "upmarket" car from them.
Peace!


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## sys3175 (Jan 26, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (audivwguy)*

I know that Chevrolet a few years ago stopped marketing diesel suburbans and pickups because they could only sell a certain amount of diesels in a particular year. 
Now, I don't think VW could easily approach the volume that GM sells in their commercial division but it may be atleast a conern.
I think the TDI would be a great way to differentiate the brand, as well as showing that you can match or exceed hybrid mileage with a car which doesn't require batteries (which go bad, and a hard to dispose of). 
This is a great looking car. I was really turned off by the newer Passats and now that VW is stripping down the jetta they are either pushing me to a GLI or into a Passat.. This car I could see myself driving. Would really like a 4motion 2.0t (not that it is going to happen) or TDI. Where I am living now pretty much any car I purchase will be a AWD..
Before I saw this I was waiting on the introduction of the Tiguan.. to see when the AWD diesel would be coming out.. 

_Quote, originally posted by *audivwguy* »_
I agree that diesels alone will not be the "savior of the brand". 
However having clean, quite, high mileage TDIs (like the new Jetta TDI coming here this year, could be an excellent way for VW to differentiate itself in the U.S. market especially now that Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel arrived here about a year ago and biodiesel is on the way. Automakers strive every day and to differentiate themselves from their competitiors and VW, as the world leader in passenger car diesels, has a hugh opportunity right now to have something Toyota, Honda, Nissan etc. do not yet have: diesel cars in the U.S. market.








Bye the way, are you sure about "federal and state restrictions on how many diesels you can sell"? I haven't heard of any limits nor have I seen any discussion of such limits on VWvortex. Perhaps you are referring to the 4 or 5 states where VW could not sell their old TDIs due to higher emission standards in those states. If so, the good news is that the coming VW TDIs are expected to be 50 state compliant.
Also, your diesel fuel price differential seems a bit high. If true and say premium is now selling at about $3.35 per gallon, diesel would be priced at $4.19 to $4.35 per gallon or about $1.00 more per gallon then I know it is selling for now in at least some areas. Even if true, odds are diesel will drop in price relative to gas during the other 9 months of the year as it has tended to do historically. Plus diesels tend to get 25 to 35% better mileage and have other substantial advantages vs. gassers. 
I started this post with a point on which we agree. I'll end it by saying the new Passat CC is a one good looking vehicle - which I believe is your view. I, like many others, just wish VW offerred a TDI option on it like they plan to do outside North America. Doing so would give U.S. buyers yet another reason to increase diesel's market share from about 3% now to something closer to the roughly 50% share they have in Europe.


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## monkeyrun (Dec 4, 2006)

*Re: (B4WrNd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *B4WrNd* »_Come on now this is going to be another disaster like the phaeton only to a lesser extent. Look at the 3.6 passats, they just dont sell. How on earth do they think this car will be any different?

Phaeton looks like a granny's car, this one looks cool.
Even if it doesn't sell, it'll be positive for the VW image http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I know I want one.


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## monkeyrun (Dec 4, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (hi_racing)*


_Quote, originally posted by *hi_racing* »_Forty-freaking-five thousand dollars?

Where did you get that freaking number from?


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## amerikanzero (Jun 6, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (monkeyrun)*


_Quote, originally posted by *monkeyrun* »_
Where did you get that freaking number from?









someone stupidly stated it a few pages back and now people are following the stupidity (as usual) without knowing the facts.


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## DTMVDUB (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

I knew this car looked familiar.
This is actually the production version of the Concept D.
http://www.netcarshow.com/volk...ept_d/


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## DTMVDUB (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (hi_racing)*


_Quote, originally posted by *hi_racing* »_Forty-freaking-five thousand dollars? Listen up, VW! You're INSANE! My $45K will buy a loaded CTS with GREAT service from the dealer. When I take my 2000 DeVille in for an oil change they give me a free CTS loaner for the day and fully detail the car before I pick it up. They kiss my butt like it's gold plated! 
It's one thing for VW to copy/steal design elements from Merc and BM-trouble-U, but they have a huge mountain to climb with their dealer network before I'll consider buying an "upmarket" car from them.
Peace!

I've written to VW's Marketing group in Germany in the past to find out why certain models (specifically the MKIII Color Concepts) where not brought to the US and they were very receptive. I received an informative letter explaing why and they through in brochures of all their models at the time and some CDs.
I'd recommend that you voice your comments to them. They rely heavily on marketing statistics and dealer input rather than their customers. It would be good for them to hear what a customer thinks.
I almost agreed with you about not paying $45K for this, but after looking at it carefully, I think I would. It's no Caddy, but it isn't badly priced compared to the Japanese competition. 

VW has come a long way in terms of quality and design. They continue to be innovators in the automotive market, but have neglected the customer service experience. I have yet to find a VW dealership, in the US, that has given me that ooh ahh, experience.

So how did VW copy from MB or BMW. I'm not sure which design you're refering to, but I can say that all 3 marques are world innovators. Merc has been setting standards that have been used by all marques. VW has done the same. Just take a look at the Phaeton. It may not have been a blockbuster but it's technological specifications surpassed most cars on the market. 
Another VW tech advancement that caught the automotive industry off guard was the development of the VR6. Yes. Believe it or not. No one had ever created a narrow angled v6 that could fit into a car of the GTI class. I know non-vw mechanics that are still amazed by this configuration and output. Others such as Mazda tried to duplicate it with no success.
VW's 16V was another innovator, but that's another story.

_Modified by DTMVDUB at 7:27 PM 1-15-2008_

_Modified by DTMVDUB at 7:36 PM 1-15-2008_


_Modified by DTMVDUB at 7:40 PM 1-15-2008_


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## DTMVDUB (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (B4WrNd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *B4WrNd* »_Come on now this is going to be another disaster like the phaeton only to a lesser extent. Look at the 3.6 passats, they just dont sell. How on earth do they think this car will be any different?

You have to consider the other markets of the world, not just the American market. This car may not sell well here but it may sell well else where.
I think it will sell well. It looks grown up and the interior is very classy. Sales for the current Passat have been strong. If VW can improve its end user service experience (taking lessons from Lexus) it may have a shot at challenging the Japanese Luxury marques.


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)




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## fincher (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: (B4WrNd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *B4WrNd* »_Come on now this is going to be another disaster like the phaeton only to a lesser extent. Look at the 3.6 passats, they just dont sell. How on earth do they think this car will be any different?

Excellent point. I think it will sell but its a narrow market. If the 3.6L is replaced with the CC, then it might do a little better than the current 3.6L. My dealer has an Artic Blue/Black 3.6L Sport in the showroom (rare color for Chicago)...looked so sweet...dealer says its been there for 4 months and few are willing to pay close to $40k for a Passat -- maybe its the color.


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## crazy88 (Jul 11, 2003)

*Re: (fincher)*


_Quote, originally posted by *fincher* »_If the 3.6L is replaced with the CC, then it might do a little better than the current 3.6L.


that might a good move to help separate the 2 models... and the next gen passat is supposed to more value oriented


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## hi_racing (Jul 6, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (amerikanzero)*


_Quote, originally posted by *monkeyrun* »_Where did you get that freaking number from?


_Quote, originally posted by *amerikanzero* »_
someone stupidly stated it a few pages back and now people are following the stupidity (as usual) without knowing the facts.

So I decided to not be quite as stupid/gullible as yesterday and went to VW's site this morning and got a total of $39,679 for a VR6 Passat with DVD Nav and 18" wheels. I don't think the new one is going to be cheaper, but I don't know that for a fact.
Since I was already wasting work's time, I decided to price out a CTS as well. Picked the 304 HP V6, DVD Nav, 18"s and sunroof for $43,135. Picking the same options with the 263 HP V6 drops the price to $40.835.
I've owned/driven VW's since 1979. I would LOVE to see VW really compete in this market. Selling a less-capable car for nearly the same money with a HUGE difference in dealership quality isn't going to do it.
To each his own. Whoever earns the funds gets to allocate the spending -- I'm just glad I've taken my myopic VW glasses off. There are really some great cars out there!
Peace!


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

G35 GMT with the 306hp motor with Tech, Premium & Nav pacakges (18" wheels std): $38,865.00
G35x with similar options: $40,765.00
G35 Journey: $38,915.00

Since I prefer shifting for myself I'd go for the barely cheaper (with destination) 6MT-- and it's a car that really rivals a BMW 3-series... granted the Passat CC is a much larger car than the 3-series, CTS, G35, etc.


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## Jarn01 (Aug 5, 2005)

*Re: (GT17V)*

Nice car, but the taillights do look very Chrysler Sebring


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## hi_racing (Jul 6, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (DTMVDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DTMVDUB* »_I've written to VW's Marketing group in Germany<snip> 

I'll be happy to write to them and share my thoughts. Do you still have the address?

_Quote, originally posted by *DTMVDUB* »_So how did VW copy from MB or BMW. I'm not sure which design you're refering to, but I can say that all 3 marques are world innovators. 

GT17V's post of the CLS and the Passat CC above show what I call copying. 

_Quote, originally posted by *DTMVDUB* »_Another VW tech advancement <snip>

I definitely agree (without doing any research, of course) that VW has made some great technical advances. I love my TDI. I love the safety features. I was so impressed my my 93 Corrado being compliant with 96-97 safety regs -- 4 years ahead of time. 
To bring this back on topic of the Passat CC, even as much as I want VW to succeed, they're NOT a premium brand. Compare VAG to GM -- you don't see Chevrolet trying to build a CTS. VAG has Audi and GM has Cadillac. Don't forget the impact of pricing as well. Automotive writers wouldn't be raving about the CTS if it cost the same as a 5 series or E class, IMNSHO.















Peace!


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## charlier (Mar 9, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (hi_racing)*

Once these vehicles hit the ground at US dealerships it will be interesting to see them in the flesh. It will also be interesting to see the Real World Price on the actual sticker as opposed to any "announced" or "forum" based pricing.
The use of the word "coupe" to describe this vehicle does make me


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (charlier)*

Here is a video from Detroit that I uploaded. Its in English and you can see the car in real life. Opens the trunk, doors and shows other parts of the car. 
http://video.google.com/videop...hl=en


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## audivwguy (May 10, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (sys3175)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sys3175* »_I know that Chevrolet a few years ago stopped marketing diesel suburbans and pickups because they could only sell a certain amount of diesels in a particular year. 
Now, I don't think VW could easily approach the volume that GM sells in their commercial division but it may be atleast a conern.


If you are right and there is some type of limit on the number of diesels that can be sold in the U.S. (which I don't think there is), it might help explain why VW seems VERY SLOW to bring back diesels to the U.S. market while selling diesels in Europe like hot cakes.
I am with you on the Tiguan TDI - I sure hope it comes here and soon!


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## Njaneer (Oct 2, 2006)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (audivwguy)*

Looks like minimal headroom for the driver and passenger watching the video, not to mention the back seat is even worse. Guy had to tilt his head for clearance lol.
The CLS has this same problem even for people of average height.


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## TREGinginCO (Jan 4, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Njaneer)*

The reasons for not bringing huge numbers of TDI's to the U.S. is purely economics.
The TDI engine is expensive to produce and the bulk of the buying public isn't really willing to bite the bullet on cost.


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## JohnTT (Dec 7, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (TREGinginCO)*

I love it! Heading to the auto show on Sunday. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## B5Speedo (May 2, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (TREGinginCO)*

That's naive.








When VW could sell diesels in all 50 states over 30% of total VW sales in the US were diesels. They are desperate to get more here.


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (TREGinginCO)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TREGinginCO* »_The reasons for not bringing huge numbers of TDI's to the U.S. is purely economics.
The TDI engine is expensive to produce and the bulk of the buying public isn't really willing to bite the bullet on cost.

The bulk of the buying is willing to bite the bullet on cost, even when the dealership marks up the price according to "market value".
The exception is the Touareg V10 TDI--- that was really the only instance where the public was not receptive to its price. I would expect the V6 TDI to do a lot better in sales.


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## Varooom (Aug 5, 1999)

The tail of this car looks like an older Ford Taurus/sable.. i forget which year. It's a personal thing.. but I'm one of the few that really doesn't like the looks and I think it's another example of how VW has lost their brand image as of late. You know how Hyundai's look like they're made of pieces of other manufacturers models? The CC has the same sense about it. 


_Modified by Varooom at 1:36 AM 1-17-2008_


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## feels_road (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: (Varooom)*

I really don't get why anyone would say something like this. Whether you like the CC or not, it is clearly evolved from the VW/Passat design philosophy of the past 10 - 15 years, or so, and it shows. Nothing Mercedes, nothing BMW. Simple, old VW design, almost identical to the 10-year old "Concept D"


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## captain coordination (Nov 4, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

well first of all i love it.
but i think the price vw will ask for it will be what kills it.
i loved the phaeton but it was super over priced and too rare. if they marketed it better, it would sell better, also. maybe i was living under a rock, but i never saw a phaeton commercial. u see, mercedes, bmw, lexus, and acura commercials all the time.
basically this car is a top of the line Acura RL (because of all the gizmos coupled with luxury) with a Mercedes look on the rear.
if they price it more than the RL it'll fade out like the Phaeton
if they price it less, and actually spend some $ on commercials aimed at a luxury crowd, then it will sell.
oh yeah and make it just as easy to get. that's another factor that killed the phaeton. i actually knew someone that was in the market a few years back, but he chose the RL instead cause it was easier to get, when he went to the vw dealership they told him he'd have to be on a waiting list for over a year. that's not how you seil luxury cars unless they're Italian and have horses or bulls on the logos.
*it's a sexy car but i think they will find a way to screw it up just like the phaeton.*


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## TREGinginCO (Jan 4, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (captain coordination)*


_Quote, originally posted by *captain coordination* »_well first of all i love it.
but i think the price vw will ask for it will be what kills it.
i loved the phaeton but it was super over priced and too rare. if they marketed it better, it would sell better,


Overpriced!!!.... The Phaeton is everything the MB S-Class is, the BMW7-series is and a lot more!!! Plus, you get it at 20 to 30-grand less than those vehicles!!
The Phaeton by luxury car standards was a screaming deal.
It didn't fly here in the U.S. for two reasons. One, it was terribly marketed... VW seriously dropped the ball on that.
Second: Ignorant consumers who couldn't get passed the VW badge on the vehicle. If they had educated themselves on the vehicle rather than just trash it... they would have learned what the vehicle really is about.


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## Chico (Jul 26, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (captain coordination)*


_Quote, originally posted by *captain coordination* »_i loved the phaeton but it was super over priced 

Congratulations. That's the dumbest thing I'll read all day. While the Phaeton was priced higher than other VWs, it was priced below its direct competitors (7 series and S class). For the amount of car you got, the price was very reasonable.


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## audivwguy (May 10, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (TREGinginCO)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TREGinginCO* »_The reasons for not bringing huge numbers of TDI's to the U.S. is purely economics.
The TDI engine is expensive to produce and the bulk of the buying public isn't really willing to bite the bullet on cost.

Add me to the list of those who question the above statement on TDIs in the U.S. market. 
In Europe and elsewhere overseas VW is selling TDIs like crazy and, I would bet, making $$$ on every sale. In the U.S. we just got clean diesel fuel and U.S. buyers have yet to see how great the new generation of quite, clean, high mileage diesel car engines are (except for the $50,000++ Mercedes Ad Blue diesel which is beyond the reach of most of us).
So please give us U.S. car buyers some credit. With fuel at $3.00+ and heading higher, once we see how much mileage we can get with the now very quite and now very clean TDIs, we should buy them in volume. This starts for real in September when VW begins selling their new Jetta TDI, with estimated 35mpg city/50mpg highway, followed soon thereafter with their new 6 cylinder Touareg TDI. After that Honda, BMW and Audi have already announced plans to join the diesel parade in the U.S. market. Why? Because it now makes sense!


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## HunterRose (Feb 16, 1999)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (audivwguy)*

And I don't really recall the TDI Passat, Beetle or Jetta's costing that much when they were around. It's just the fact thet everyone has visions of the old 80s Benz's with the rattling and ominous black smoke and rear ends. Diesels have come quite a ways since then.
Sean


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## littlejohnsVWheads (Oct 25, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Chico* »_
Congratulations. That's the dumbest thing I'll read all day. While the Phaeton was priced higher than other VWs, it was priced below its direct competitors (7 series and S class). For the amount of car you got, the price was very reasonable.

i don't think it was that dumb for a car that no one other than vw enthusiasts really knew about. if they actually had marketed it, then yeah it would be a great deal, but just throwing out a car at a price like that with a vw badge on it and not marketing it to anyone at all does make it overpriced. 
you say phaeton, and unless you are a vw fan no one knows what you are talking about.
so again, i say that for a car a normal person has never heard of it was overpriced. it was a really cool car, but marketed extremely poorly in the US.


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## captain coordination (Nov 4, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Chico* »_
Congratulations. That's the dumbest thing I'll read all day. While the Phaeton was priced higher than other VWs, it was priced below its direct competitors (7 series and S class). For the amount of car you got, the price was very reasonable.

yeah thanks buddy.
i gotta agree with the post above.
if no one knows about it, and it carried the sticker price it did, then is it really a bargain?
if you can't go to a vw dealership and get one in a reasonable amount of time compared to the other carmakers, is it still a bargain?
it was a great car, and it's a shame that VW didn't do more to let the general public know it even existed. if you're gonna go after a whole new sector such as the luxury class, then how do you expect to sell any and compete with other luxury carmakers if you don't promote it? i never once saw a phaeton commercial, and i really don't remember seeing any ads for it in magazines-if they existed there weren't many. i see rabbit and golf commercials all the time.
so if they are gonna try to compete in this area, they must promote it to the people that would buy it. that big ole vw badge on the front isn't screaming luxury car to the people who buy 7series bmws, high end japanese cars, or similarly equipped mercedes. you have to convince them that vw is capable of producing a proper luxury car, and without some fancy commercials and ads you're not going to create a demand. word of mouth sucks when your're trying to sell vehicles and enter into a new class.
it's almost like they wanted it to fail in the US.....
i just hope they do a much better job promoting the CC, i'd love to see vw be successful in the luxury class.......


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## audivwguy (May 10, 2005)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (HunterRose)*


_Quote, originally posted by *HunterRose* »_And I don't really recall the TDI Passat, Beetle or Jetta's costing that much when they were around. It's just the fact thet everyone has visions of the old 80s Benz's with the rattling and ominous black smoke and rear ends. Diesels have come quite a ways since then.
Sean









Yes, I agree completely. VW wisely, IMHO, priced their TDIs just a bit (about $1,000) over equivalent gassers - unlike Mercedes, GM & Ford who demand a premium 4 to 5 times larger for their diesel engines. 
Also, fortunately VW is aware of the out of date mindset of the U.S. market concerning diesels and is actively trying to change that with their Dieselution Tour and with their Audi division winning back to back LeMans races with, of all things, super high performance diesel race cars. What they need here is product, product, product.
It would have been a great U.S. quadruple play for them to introduce the:
1. New Jetta tdi (already announced 4thQtr2008),
2. New 6 Cylinder Touareg tdi (1stQtr2009, I believe),
3. New Tiguan tdi (very iffy at this point) and 
then top it off with the, 
4. New Passat CC tdi.
It looks like they might drop the ball on the 3rd one and they have dropped the ball on the 4th one. Perhaps they will bring the Tiguan tdi and the Passat CC tdi over here in 2009 or 2010 after they see how well the high mileage new Jetta tdi and Touareg V6 tdi sell in this market.


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## Chico (Jul 26, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (captain coordination)*


_Quote, originally posted by *captain coordination* »_if no one knows about it, and it carried the sticker price it did, then is it really a bargain?


I stand by my earlier statement. Saying that the Phaeton was overpriced and not a bargain is, at best, just plain ignorant. Now if your argument is that VW did a poor job of marketing the car or building awareness of it, that's perfectly valid.
A bad bargain would be paying Phaeton prices and getting a Jetta. Paying Phaeton prices and getting a Phaeton is a pretty good deal. Whether people know about it or not doesn't change the facts.


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## 1.8turboB5 (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Chico* »_
I stand by my earlier statement. Saying that the Phaeton was overpriced and not a bargain is, at best, just plain ignorant. Now if your argument is that VW did a poor job of marketing the car or building awareness of it, that's perfectly valid.
A bad bargain would be paying Phaeton prices and getting a Jetta. Paying Phaeton prices and getting a Phaeton is a pretty good deal. Whether people know about it or not doesn't change the facts. 


great comment, i agree.. by the way.. 
if anyone is iterested.. offical pricing on the base CC is going to be $26,990. top price.. $41k


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## OOMPH (Nov 1, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (odwyerpw)*

stunningly handsome!!! i agree,this is clearly what the Phaeton should have been! auch du liebe,this aint ure daddys 411!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## littlejohnsVWheads (Oct 25, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Chico* »_
I stand by my earlier statement. Saying that the Phaeton was overpriced and not a bargain is, at best, just plain ignorant. Now if your argument is that VW did a poor job of marketing the car or building awareness of it, that's perfectly valid.
A bad bargain would be paying Phaeton prices and getting a Jetta. Paying Phaeton prices and getting a Phaeton is a pretty good deal. Whether people know about it or not doesn't change the facts. 

*
if you can't sell them it's not a bargain*


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## captain coordination (Nov 4, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Chico* »_
I stand by my earlier statement. Saying that the Phaeton was overpriced and not a bargain is, at best, just plain ignorant. Now if your argument is that VW did a poor job of marketing the car or building awareness of it, that's perfectly valid.
A bad bargain would be paying Phaeton prices and getting a Jetta. Paying Phaeton prices and getting a Phaeton is a pretty good deal. Whether people know about it or not doesn't change the facts. 

jeez ok whatever im a tard








they did an awesome job of promoting it so that made it well worth the money for the first time anyone heard of any production vw with a sticker price like that.
i loved the phaeton i just think to ask for that much $ at the introduction of a luxury class and not creating demand for it made it overpriced, regardless of whether anyone else considered it a bargain. yeah sure, there were bmws and benz's that had the same fluff that were priced higher, i'm well aware of that fact. maybe that's just twisted logic but it's how i see it. it was silly of them to jump from whatever the highest priced car they had on the lots at the time to one of the phaeton's sticker price. ok yeah, in some eyes it was a bargain, but it had a vw badge on it which made those typical buyers leery of investing in it, so to them it was just an overpriced passat because they didn't really know much about the vehicle to reach an informed decision. they are rare cars, i've maybe seen 5-6 total in real life since they were released. a friend of mine went to look at one when he was in the market for a new car, but since none of the dealerships he went to had one he could test drive, and they told him it would be a lengthy wait to see or get one unless he wanted to drive 2 hours to another dealer that actually had one which was already sold to someone else and had just been arrived-he could just come look at it-he couldn't test drive..why even bother driving the 2 hours for a car you don't know anything about?
so to me, that makes it overpriced and rare-and not rare because they were being sold like hotcakes, but rare because it was hard to get one. if you release a car like that and throw the highest sticker price ever for that brand and make it hard to get or test drive and don't promote it, it's overpriced to me-regardless of the bang for buck factor. i guess that's just how i see it.


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## goacom (Mar 3, 1999)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*

From an engineering point of view, the Phaeton may have been a bargain, who does one buy a car based soley on its engineering? One needs to look at the entire package: customer service (or lack of), brand elasticity, brand recognition, depreciation etc.
Clearly, VW failed in all these points. It may have been value priced to begin with (compared to the established premium market), but its high depreciation pretty much pulls the rug under the notion that it was a good buy.
Building an upmarket reputation cannot be done overnight as VW tried to do. One only needs to look at Audi's long fight spanning several decades to establish itself as a premium brand.

_Quote, originally posted by *Chico* »_
I stand by my earlier statement. Saying that the Phaeton was overpriced and not a bargain is, at best, just plain ignorant. Now if your argument is that VW did a poor job of marketing the car or building awareness of it, that's perfectly valid.
A bad bargain would be paying Phaeton prices and getting a Jetta. Paying Phaeton prices and getting a Phaeton is a pretty good deal. Whether people know about it or not doesn't change the facts.


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## DMS_SLiC (Jul 11, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*

Chico,I totally agree with you,but,you guys have completely strayed from the original topic of this thread,the Passat CC.Now this car,Passat CC, will be a great VALUE at $26,990 base.


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## Heinrich (Jul 14, 1999)

Wonder if they will go Wagon CC


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## randomkoreanguy (Jul 20, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Lots of differing opinions about the new Passat CC, so I'll just throw in my two cents. The entire point of a 'four door coupe' seems to be the sporty aspects of it. Being that that's the case, why is the US market getting a lower performing top range engine and no DSG? The US version six cylinder range-topper is a full second slower than the European market version, and I think I speak for a lot of enthusiasts when I say that the DSG transmission would be perfectly suited in this application because of its ability to perform like a manual while retaining the comfort of an automatic. The old tiptronic auto, while fine for the original Passat, seems out of place here within the context of what the Passat CC is supposedly trying to represent. At the least, DSG should be an option. And I still can't wrap my brain around why they're reducing the power for the engine on the North American version.
All in all, I think VW is taking a calculated risk with this new model and they'll definitely attract a lot of attention from people outside the normal VW fan base with the styling and wider appeal of the CC, but that being said, I'm certain the more hardcore drivers will be disappointed that the American version is less sports coupe, and more family sedan. The luxury sedan market is littered with tons of cars from all kinds of manufacturers that offer similar options as the Passat CC. What would really mark the CC as different is exactly what they've stripped from the American market version. The DSG transmission coupled with the European spec six gives the CC exactly the performance kick it needs to grab people's attention, especially in a market like the US that focuses so heavily on things like performance, and especially in a car that's supposedly a four door sports coupe. If they leave the specs on the US car as is, it'll be just another face in a veritable sea similarly optioned and priced luxury sedans.


_Modified by randomkoreanguy at 6:55 PM 1-20-2008_


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## Ereinion (Aug 14, 2002)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Congratulations VW!You've designed a good looking car for a change.I'm sure it's just a mind bogglingly HUGE coincidence that it looks the same as a Mercedes-Benz...








Oh well...


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## HunterRose (Feb 16, 1999)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (randomkoreanguy)*

In light of the rumor that they want to add another car above this and below the redsigned Phaeton. Is this a high end Passat in addition to the current body style?
Sean


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## Toyin (Feb 18, 1999)

I like the look. It may bring me back into the VW family. 
The Phaeton was a failure because it was overpriced. The price a car sells at has a lot more to do then engineering. It has to do with recognition, reputation, exposure, quality, style, uniqueness. The Phaeton had none of the 1st 3 and arguably very little of the last 3.
Was it a bargain/good value? Yes. Bargain and good value are not necessrily synonymous. For the amount of engineering and the quality it was better value then cars costing twice as much, but since it was an unknown it was overpriced.


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

*Re: (Toyin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Toyin* »_The Phaeton was a failure because it was overpriced. 

If that's the case.... then history will a chance to repeat itself, for a fancy passat.
The Passat W8 was a sales disaster also... the CC is basically a Passat in Benz CLS sheetmetal.
A Passat 3.6L 4Motion already hovers close to $40k (similar to the price of the old W8). The CC is supposed to be placed above the regular Passat.....
Interestingly enough... look at Toyota when they introduced the LS400.

_Quote »_The price a car sells at has a lot more to do then engineering. It has to do with recognition, reputation, exposure, quality, style, uniqueness. The Phaeton had none of the 1st 3 and arguably very little of the last 3.


The Lexus had none of them. The saving grace was since it was a Toyota... it might be reliable, however the marque had no prestigue yet.
When you look at the Phaeton, yes, the VW badge was in the way for the US market buyers, however it undercut its competition considerably, even within VAG, which the Phaeton was heavily based on the A8 (minus the space frame, etc). 
VW basically used a similar strategy to Toyota, minus creating a new marque. Toyota heavily copied the S-class. VW looked within at the A8. Both undercut the competition considerably. Both badges have the reputation for the common "people". VW stuck with its badge. If the Phaeton didn't wear the VW badge-- it may have stood a chance to do better.
that was going too OT.



_Modified by GT17V at 12:57 AM 1-24-2008_


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## pubahs (Apr 2, 2002)

Am I misreading this:
"Set to be called simply CC here in the States, the four-door is larger than the Passat, though much closer to the VW sedan than the larger Phaeton. The Passat CC shares the same transverse engine layout and scaleable architecture as the Passat sedan and wagon models. Though significantly larger than the Passat, don’t expect it to be significantly larger in price. We hear a 2.0T-powered Tiptronic base model is only expected to cost in the mid $20,000 range. "

??? mid-20k range?


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## [email protected] (Aug 1, 2002)

*Re: (pubahs)*

No. The lowest-tier CC is expected to come in at the mid-$20k point, but the car is expected to be configurable upwards of $40k.


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## Toyin (Feb 18, 1999)

*Re: (GT17V)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GT17V* »_
Interestingly enough... look at Toyota when they introduced the LS400.
The Lexus had none of them. The saving grace was since it was a Toyota... it might be reliable, however the marque had no prestigue yet.
_Modified by GT17V at 12:57 AM 1-24-2008_

You are absolutely correct. 
I said " The price a car sells at has a lot more to do then engineering. It has to do with recognition, reputation, exposure, quality, style, uniqueness" 
I should add the preconceived reputation, recognition, exposure, quality, uniqueness and styles can negatively impact a new vehicle. 
Lexus and Infinity were brilliant to dissociate there upscale class with Toyota and Nissan. It allowed them to start with a blank slate, so the cars were evaluated mostly on engineering. They also advertised the HELL out of the LS400 and Q45 (though the later didn't show the car....big mistake). They also led dealerships of that era in customer service. They quickly established a reputation of excellence which today is still unmatched. VW did pretty much the opposite of Lexus. They also didn't develop a new brand.
If Hyundai was smart they would follow Toyota and Nissan, not VW. 



_Modified by Toyin at 3:16 PM 1-25-2008_


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## 85GTI (Dec 19, 2000)

The CC is not bad looking, but I think it has too many lines and creases on the sides. The nose is very busy. It's okay, but not a "wow". It does sound like it has a lot of features for the price. I just wish it looked more clean.
I agree with some other comments: Where is the DSG?
That tranny should be available on all the VW models.


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## performula (Apr 10, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Gorgeous!


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## performula (Apr 10, 2003)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (1.8turboB5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.8turboB5* »_

great comment, i agree.. by the way.. 
if anyone is iterested.. offical pricing on the base CC is going to be $26,990. top price.. $41k

Really? This looks like a lot of car.


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## Kar98 (Apr 21, 2002)

*Re: (Toyin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Toyin* »_VW did pretty much the opposite of Lexus. They also didn't develop a new brand.


The stupid thing is, they already HAVE a brand. Audi for luxury, Skoda for el cheapo budget cars, SEAT for sporty, low price, Bugatti FFS, for high end sports. And VW for reasonably priced, reliable non-frilly cars.


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## amerikanzero (Jun 6, 2004)

*Re: (Kar98)*

^^let's not forget Lambo and Bentley








seeing how we are getting completely screwed over in the first MY as always, I won't be buying this for my next car. Bravo VW. You sure as hell know how to alienate your core.


_Modified by amerikanzero at 9:06 PM 1-27-2008_


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## Samtron (May 23, 2007)

*Re: (amerikanzero)*


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## 4MoPassat (May 12, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

I really like the design, heavy MB C-class design elements.
This car should only be equipped in the U.S. with 300hp direct injected V-6, Full time All wheel drive, and 6-speed DSG. The CC should be at the top of the VW sedan line up. I would buy one if equipped this way.


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## B6Passat (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_No. The lowest-tier CC is expected to come in at the mid-$20k point, but the car is expected to be configurable upwards of $40k.

All I can say on the other side of the world is your cars are insanely cheap. Golfs start around that price where I come from and people are prepared to pay it. I'd buy 2 CCs at those prices.


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## Boogety Boogety (Jun 22, 2003)

*Re: (B6Passat)*

It's due to the incredible strength of the dollar versus the euro and virtually any other world currency. As the world's leading currency...
[offstage whisper]
[stunned silence, 30 seconds]
[more offstage whispers]
Uh.... never mind...


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## audivwguy (May 10, 2005)

*Re: (B6Passat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *B6Passat* »_All I can say on the other side of the world is your cars are insanely cheap. Golfs start around that price where I come from and people are prepared to pay it. I'd buy 2 CCs at those prices.

Maybe, just maybe, I can help you feel a bit better about high car prices in your part of the world.
If your prices include some type of Value Added Tax, as I understand happens it in some or all of Europe, that could explain much of the price differential since we do not have a VAT here in the U.S.
We do, however, pay sales tax (7% in some places) that is added to the price negotiated with the dealer. Also, while we don't have a VAT, we do have pretty heavy Income Tax, Estate Tax, etc., etc. etc.
Plus, if Hillary Clinton is elected U.S. President, there is no telling how much more in taxes we Yanks will be paying......








Hope that brightens your day.


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## Chico (Jul 26, 2004)

*Re: (audivwguy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *audivwguy* »_Plus, if Hillary Clinton is elected U.S. President, there is no telling how much more in taxes we Yanks will be paying......









That is depressing thought to start the day with.


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## Toyin (Feb 18, 1999)

*Re: (Samtron)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Samtron* »_









http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif That's hot!


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## Toyin (Feb 18, 1999)

*Re: (Kar98)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Kar98* »_
The stupid thing is, they already HAVE a brand. Audi for luxury, Skoda for el cheapo budget cars, SEAT for sporty, low price, Bugatti FFS, for high end sports. And VW for reasonably priced, reliable non-frilly cars.

That's why the Phaeton and the other 'luxury' models from VW don't make sense to me. 
Nissan/Infinity has the best separation of these automakers at this point. Though there's platform sharing and engine sharing, the Infinity brand is all rear wheel and AWD vs Nissan which is mostly front wheel drive.


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## B6Passat (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: (audivwguy)*

Actually, I'm glad people somewhere can get them cheaper. !


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## Kar98 (Apr 21, 2002)

*Re: (Toyin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Toyin* »_
That's why the Phaeton and the other 'luxury' models from VW don't make sense to me. 


Hell, even Mercedes failed with the super luxury attempt Maybach.


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## Mr. EüroMatt (May 9, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (odwyerpw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *odwyerpw* »_love the boat tail. this is what the Phaeton should of been.

Huge agreement! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
up the wheel base length by 5-inches, increase the width by 2-inches - *BOOM* Phaeton 2 - as long as they don't make the body out of steel - again


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## Mr. EüroMatt (May 9, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (1.8turboB5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.8turboB5* »_well i can tell you for a fact that this car wont come to these shores with a DSG at first. Besides that i have confirmed this with my regional rep, it also says it in the VW Press release that the US version gets the Tiptronic 6speed [...] 

That's pretty screwy of VW, I'll admit. I've read where VW wants to ditch the Tiptronic in favor of the DSG auto in the next 5 to 6 years - I would've thought that VW would start fitting the DSG in the new models and do replacement in the current line up later.
By that I mean, go ahead and sell the upcoming models (Jetta SportWagon, Tiguan, Routan, Scirocco and Passat CC) with DSGs, then replace the current models with DSGs after about a year or two after generating some sales traffic with the new models.
At least that's the strategy I would've suggested at the meeting.


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## 4MoPassat (May 12, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (97JettaGLXVR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *97JettaGLXVR6* »_
That's pretty screwy of VW, I'll admit. I've read where VW wants to ditch the Tiptronic in favor of the DSG auto in the next 5 to 6 years - I would've thought that VW would start fitting the DSG in the new models and do replacement in the current line up later.
By that I mean, go ahead and sell the upcoming models (Jetta SportWagon, Tiguan, Routan, Scirocco and Passat CC) with DSGs, then replace the current models with DSGs after about a year or two after generating some sales traffic with the new models.
At least that's the strategy I would've suggested at the meeting. 

VW doesn't want to trump Audi in regards to DSG.
After all, VW is the entry level vs. premium Audi brand in the world of VW Group. 
In regards to the Tiguan, VW is already years behind the competition in the CUV market. The Murano and CR-V already in their second generations while VW still has no CUV for N.A. market.
Ten years late, VWoNA gets their mini van-a Crapslyer http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## Mr. EüroMatt (May 9, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (Chico)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Chico* »_
I stand by my earlier statement. Saying that the Phaeton was overpriced and not a bargain is, at best, just plain ignorant. Now if your argument is that VW did a poor job of marketing the car or building awareness of it, that's perfectly valid.
A bad bargain would be paying Phaeton prices and getting a Jetta. Paying Phaeton prices and getting a Phaeton is a pretty good deal. Whether people know about it or not doesn't change the facts. 

Let's not forget that the Phaeton failed not only because of poor marketing, but also from (IMHO) its generic design. The Phaeton is the the only VW I'll admit had a generic design - classy and well put together - but still generic compared to the Passat and it's BMW and Benz competition - and the Japanese luxury sedans.
Another failure point with the Phaeton was it's offerings - W8 or V12 engines. The W8 was under powered for the weight of the car, and the V12 was just priced out of *conventional* mind sets and those in the market are going to think Lexus, Benz, BMW before they even thought of VW - again due to marketing. And those that found the Phaeton, knew of it's Audi cousin and the conventual market has taken Audi as the "better brand name" - after all, Volkswagen is 'the peoples car' - basic brain washing, and now they're trying to undo it.
Last May, I replied to a posting on http://www.VolksBloggin.com regarding the Phaeton's return to U.S. in 2010. This is what I posted then and this is what I still believe this today:
*"*While I agree that the “luxury” model should stop at the Passat, I’d also like to see VW attempt to tackle the extra-large, extra-luxury market segment in order compete with the Benz S-class and BMW 7-Series sedans.
The downfall I noticed with the Phaeton was that (a) it was over priced, and (b) the frame was made from steel - not aluminum as it’s A8 cousin. Now, if VW can offer a more powerful (and fuel-efficient) W8 and V10 TDI engines, and use either aluminum body or a combination aluminum and titanium (maybe? I’m not sure how Ti will work in the automotive world.) to construct the body, then maybe the 2nd Gen Phaeton will be more accepting in the US market.
As for the design and size - my thoughts on the 1st Gen Phaeton were “Honey, I blew up the Passat.” It needs it’s own distinct styling to separate it from the Passat. If they make it smaller, then it’s just an over-priced Passat.*"*
I noticed a reply back on the page later on:
*"* _"Honey, I blew up the Passat"_
DUDE - That is freakin’ hysterical! I love it! That’s a perfect way to size up the Phaeton. *"*

Just my couple of pennies on the table, but they are pretty shiny pennies.


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## Mr. EüroMatt (May 9, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (4MoPassat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *4MoPassat* »_
VW doesn't want to trump Audi in regards to DSG.
After all, VW is the entry level vs. premium Audi brand in the world of VW Group. 
In regards to the Tiguan, VW is already years behind the competition in the CUV market. The Murano and CR-V already in their second generations while VW still has no CUV for N.A. market.
Ten years late, VWoNA gets their mini van-a Crapslyer http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 

Oh absolutely.
I understand that VW doesn't want to out-do it's premium Audi brand, but if the VW Group wants to move more VW Brand models - they need to do more than just add new models to the line up. 
The Tiguan is going to going to have to face the CR-V, Rav4, Murano, and Suzuki CUVs, and it's not going to be easy, but I think it'll have an appealing price to those who have hatchbacks, but want an SUV and can't afford a Touareg. It has great competition, which is a hefty challenge to face. I think VW can handle the Tiguan - so long as it's marketed right. The market is accepting of it, it's just getting people to look at VW as a serious player, with a full line up from hatchbacks to luxury SUVs and mini-van.
11 years is a bit of a gap for VW in the mini-van/van market - no doubt about that, but as long as it's priced competitively, they keep it away from the Audi brand, and have everything from base models up to 4-Motion luxury models with all the fixing's - then it'll be alright.
VW needs to give both the Tiguan and Routan something that separates them from the rest of the market - and I don't mean just by tossing in a DSG and TDI. I don't know what they could do to separate it - maybe an air-suspension on the Routan's top-of-the-line model or something.
Maybe VWoA should start shipping VWs with some of the same technology options they have in Germany - like remote window roll-down feature, press the unlock 3-times and all the windows roll down - or have the rain sensor auto-close the windows. Just ideas off the top of my head. Maybe an option for power-folding seats in the Routan - if it doesn't have it now.


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## Chico (Jul 26, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (97JettaGLXVR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *97JettaGLXVR6* »_
Oh absolutely.
I understand that VW doesn't want to out-do it's premium Audi brand, but if the VW Group wants to move more VW Brand models - they need to do more than just add new models to the line up. 
The Tiguan is going to going to have to face the CR-V, Rav4, Murano, and Suzuki CUVs, and it's not going to be easy, but I think it'll have an appealing price to those who have hatchbacks, but want an SUV and can't afford a Touareg. It has great competition, which is a hefty challenge to face. I think VW can handle the Tiguan - so long as it's marketed right. The market is accepting of it, it's just getting people to look at VW as a serious player, with a full line up from hatchbacks to luxury SUVs and mini-van.
11 years is a bit of a gap for VW in the mini-van/van market - no doubt about that, but as long as it's priced competitively, they keep it away from the Audi brand, and have everything from base models up to 4-Motion luxury models with all the fixing's - then it'll be alright.
VW needs to give both the Tiguan and Routan something that separates them from the rest of the market - and I don't mean just by tossing in a DSG and TDI. I don't know what they could do to separate it - maybe an air-suspension on the Routan's top-of-the-line model or something.
Maybe VWoA should start shipping VWs with some of the same technology options they have in Germany - like remote window roll-down feature, press the unlock 3-times and all the windows roll down - or have the rain sensor auto-close the windows. Just ideas off the top of my head. Maybe an option for power-folding seats in the Routan - if it doesn't have it now.


You left out the best option they don't offer in the U.S. that would differentiate the brand: the VW Individual program.


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## hockeyizlife94 (Mar 1, 2007)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS (odwyerpw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *odwyerpw* »_love the boat tail. this is what the Phaeton should of been.

yea, i would take it before a phaeton in a second...i thnk its an amazing car, i saw it at the autoshow and its just simply beautiful


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## argh32 (Apr 8, 2004)

*Re: Volkswagen Introduces Passat CC "Four-door Coupe" at 2008 NAIAS ([email protected])*

Simply beautiful. It would be nice to have a Passat like base price. 
Will the US version have 4" of additional wheel well clearance?


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## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (Bill212)*

wow. its so beautiful


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## HunterRose (Feb 16, 1999)

*Re: (mujjuman)*

TopSpeed.com had a nice bit from the CEO of VW USA:
Volkswagen is doing its best to consolidate its power on the US market. In order to do this, the company is considering a luxury vehicle as its technical and environmental flagship, as well as a family of small cars. Also Volkswagen has an ambitious plan to increase sales to 800,000 units by 2018.
CEO of Volkswagen Group of America, Stefan Jacoby sayd the Touareg and the coupe-like Passat CC luxury sedan will be part of the brand’s lineup of premium vehicles. The CC will be priced below $27,000.
When asked about a new Phaeton to the US market, Volkwagen CEO did not provide any details about the flagship. But he said the Phaeton could premiere in several years when the range is redesigned. The only Phaeton model sold in the United States was a $70,000-plus, long-wheelbase version.
Sounds like VW might have thought this through.


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## Chico (Jul 26, 2004)

*Re: (HunterRose)*

I'll start getting excited when a Polo (or similar-sized car) GTI shows up. Something about the size of a mkII Golf GTI would be perfect.


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## brian81 (Apr 19, 2007)

I'll be getting one with a stick and sending it to APR for a Stage III 2.0 FSI system.
Unless they screw it up like they did with the B6, making a sunroof, leather or cloth, xenons, etc unavailable in a manual car.


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## peachypotpies (Feb 6, 2008)

Once I'm outta college and if they're still selling these new, I'm totally ditching the Jetta.


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