# Please help me with these multiple engine codes, rough idle



## m88recovery (Feb 8, 2014)

My 2005 VW jetta 2.5 Is hard to start and shutters terribly in idle but seems to be ok when I hit the gas. Below is from my scanner:

DTC

P0300Random Misfire Detected

Stored Codes

P0016Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation Bank 1 Sensor A

P0300Random Misfire Detected

P0301Cylinder Number 1 Misfire Detected

P0302Cylinder 2 Misfire Detected

p0303Cylinder 3 Misfire Detected

P0304Cylinder 4 Misfire Detected

P0305Cylinder Number 5 Misfire Detected

P2279Intake Air System Leak

Freeze Frame Information 
Close Details
Parameter Description Results
DTC for which Freeze Frame was Stored P0300
Fuel System 1 Status Open Loop - due to detected system fault
Fuel System 2 Status Not Supported
Calculated LOAD Value 46.67 %
Engine Coolant Temp 190.40 °F
Short Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1 0.00 %
Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1 -3.91 %
Intake Manifold Absolute Pressure 24.58 inHg
Engine RPM 628.25 rpm
Vehicle Speed Sensor 0.00 mph
Ignition Timing Advance #1 Cylinder 16.50 °
Intake Air Temperature 95.00 °F
Air Flow Rate Mass Air Flow Sensor 1.42 lb/min
Absolute Throttle Position 16.08 %
Commanded Secondary Air Status Atmosphere / Off

I am thinking about taking the housing off of the PCV on the valve cover to check the diaphragm as described in other posts but the cam position sensor and multiple misfires worry me. This car has always ran like a champ over the last nine years. It just suddenly started to have issues. 

Any help would be appreciated. Its been a rough week with all three of my cars breaking down.......ugh. At least my 2004 jetta seems to be ok after just changing the plugs..


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## iowarabbit (Mar 29, 2007)

Dollars to donuts it's a vac leak, multiple misfires due to a persistent lean condition at idle. Richens up a bit when you rev, leans back out when it returns to idle. Happy hunting.


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## killerbunny (Jul 10, 2008)

I agree the first place to look would be a vacuum leak. 

Sent from my KFTHWI using Tapatalk


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## m88recovery (Feb 8, 2014)

*PCV test*

Taking that PCV housing off is a little nerve raking considering the cost if that's not it.

So, I found this on another forum:
If you have the stock PCV system, an easy way to check to see if it's blown is to do the "blow" test. Where the PCV hose hooks to the intake manifold, remove it from the intake manifold and blow air into the hose. If air passes easily through the hose and through the PCV, then it's blown. If you try to blow in the hose and there is a lot of resistance or you are unable to pass any air through it, then your PCV is fine and its not that.

I took off the hose at the pvc and blew into it. The result was that air did not flow into PVC or rather valve cover in this case.

So, just out of curiosity I got the car started (Still a hard start) and the following results happened:

Air is blowing out the valve cover and vacuum is present at the hose. Idle was still bad but significantly improved (with hose disconnected).

So, I put my thumb over the vacuum hose and the car got far worse.

Also, I put it in gear with hose disconnected and although there was rough idling (again not as bad as before) it did not shutter and shake as before. I did this in my garage so I only moved the car maybe 6"

Any thoughts? or is this normal and I am going down the wrong path here.


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## m88recovery (Feb 8, 2014)

*Vacuum leaks checked and MAF checked*

This morning I re-hooked up everything and did the following:

1) Sprayed all vacuum hoses with Carb cleaner (Its all I had on the shelve). There was no difference in idle at any time.
A) Followed the vacuum hoses diagram sticker on the front of the engine compartment and followed along hose paths three times to be sure.

2) Disconnected MAF while running in idle which promptly killed the engine.

Any ideas where I should go from here?


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## m88recovery (Feb 8, 2014)

*Changing the valve cover*

Since I don't know where to go, I decided to check the diaphragm for the PVC and broke a piece off of the valve cover while trying to get the round diaphragm cover off.  Ordered a new valve cover from Amazon just awaiting it to be delivered). My diaphragm looks fine with no tears. However, at the center of the diaphragm where it seals to the hole that the vacuum goes through looks really rough. So I will post after I get it in with my results.


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

2005 2.5l? wow, get your timing inspected. you may be getting ready to change the tensioner/chain if you've never done it before on that engine.

how many miles?


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## m88recovery (Feb 8, 2014)

*milage*

My mileage on this vehicle is 72000.


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## Geo (Nov 14, 2000)

Did you try restarting the car with the maf unplugged?

anyone have any thoughts on why the car would shut off after unplugging the maf?


also, why is the calculated load at 46% while the car is at idle? 


M88, have you inspected the intake manifold for cracks?


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## le0n (Jun 12, 2013)

Try clamping shut your house that comes off of your purge valve (n80). Then see if it starts and idles better.


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## m88recovery (Feb 8, 2014)

*Installing new valve cover and tests today*

I am putting my new valve cover on today. Then I will do the following as requested by Geo and leOn.

1) Inspect the intake manifold for cracks

2) Restarting the car with the maf unplugged

3) clamping shut the house that comes off of the purge valve (n80). Then see if it starts and idles better.

I am also going to check Timing (TDC and cam position) while I have the valve cover off.

M88


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## m88recovery (Feb 8, 2014)

*New valve cover installed. Still the same issues*

The new valve cover did nothing, but I didn't think it would (that was a $150 mistake)
However, on a bright side fault 
P2279Intake Air System Leak
No longer shows on my reader

So, I did the following: 

1) Inspect the intake manifold for cracks

None found

2) Restarting the car with the maf unplugged

Still ran rough but it did sound better and my engine wasn't surging and jumping around like it was when it was connected. I plugged it back in while it was running and it went back to surging and violently shaking. It was still a hard start when I started this test.

3) clamping shut the house that comes off of the purge valve (n80). Then see if it starts and idles better.

No difference in engine idle or hard start


Here are the new results from my reader:

Stored Codes
P0016Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation Bank 1 Sensor A
P0300Random Misfire Detected
P0301Cylinder Number 1 Misfire Detected
P0302Cylinder 2 Misfire Detected
P0303Cylinder 3 Misfire Detected 
P0304Cylinder 4 Misfire Detected
P0305Cylinder Number 5 Misfire Detected

Parameter Description Results 
DTC for which Freeze Frame was Stored	P0300
Fuel System 1 Status	Closed Loop
Fuel System 2 Status	Not Supported
Calculated LOAD Value	54.12 %
Engine Coolant Temp	62.60 °F
Short Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1	-6.25 %
Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1	0.00 %
Intake Manifold Absolute Pressure	23.39 inHg
Engine RPM	868.75 rpm
Vehicle Speed Sensor	0.00 mph
Ignition Timing Advance #1 Cylinder	0.50 °
Intake Air Temperature	64.40 °F
Air Flow Rate Mass Air Flow Sensor 1.34 lb/min

Anymore help would be appreciated

Oh, I did not check TDC and cam position. I know how to do it on my 2.0 engines but I was a little baffled on the 2.5.....


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## donjuan1jr (Oct 8, 2008)

m88recovery said:


> The new valve cover did nothing, but I didn't think it would (that was a $150 mistake)
> However, on a bright side fault
> P2279Intake Air System Leak
> No longer shows on my reader
> ...



You need to take the vc off lock the cams in position with the tool and check timing, sounds like a timing issue. If you have access to vagcom test the vvt adjuster as well to rule that out. (doubtful tho)


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## travis3265 (Nov 15, 2003)

any result? I have the identical codes on my 05 jetta 2.5 as well. I am at 137,000 miles, that being the difference...and cylinder 4 is somehow not misfiring.

i am thinking the timing is messed up and will be taking it to the dealership, but would love to hear any updates you may have, thanks!


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