# Ultimate Timing Belt DIY!



## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

I did this for everyone who didn't feel comfortable doing this on their own. After reading this you should feel 100% sure you can accomplish it on your own. I think anyone can do this themselves and save a ton of cash!
This timing belt change was done on my 2002 GTI 1.8T
*Product Needed*
Timing Belt
Timing Belt Tensioner
Timing Belt Idler Pulley
Water pump (with metal impeller)
Coolant G12
Distilled Water
Accessory belt (optional )
Thermostat (optional DIY does not cover)
New engine mount bolts
**Note** Kits are available from ECStuning.com, from mjm, as well as many other places. Most don't come with new stretch bolts so you need to ask for them. Can't say anything about anyone elses kits because I only dealt with ECS but i would highly recommend them. Make sure you get a metal impeller water pump as well!

*Tools NEEDED*
Jack
Jack stands
Phillips head screw driver
Flat Head screw driver
T25 Torx bit Screw driver
8mm allen wrench (Preferably 8mm allen head socket)
3mm allen wrench
19mm twelve point, 18mm, 16mm deep, 16mm, 12mm, 10mm deep, and 10mm sockets
16mm and 13mm wrenches
2x4 approx. 2 feet long
small breaker bar (unless you're Bruce Lee then don't worry about it)

**HINT** For the 13mm wrench go buy a craftsman ratcheting wrench. This is to remove the Accessory belt tensioner and this tool alone will save you at least 30 minutes when taking that stupid thing off and back on. HIGHLY RECOMMENDED 
*Step #1*
Jack the Car up, put it on some stands, and remove the passenger side wheel as well as the plastic fender liner. Hopefully your wheel looks as good as this one.









*Step #2*
Remove - Both engine covers, Upper timing belt cover (with the 2 spring clips), and belly pan.








^Belly pan
*Step #3*
Remove the lower charge pipe (pancake pipe) using a flat head screw driver or a 7mm socket to losen the clamps and a 10mm socket to remove the nut holding the bracket in place. I suggest removing the clamp on the intercooler and pulling the silicon connection off the IC with the pipe, much easier then removing the clamp on the pipe and trying to pull the pipe out.








^ pancake pipe
*Step #4*
Remover the sound dampening shield behind the lower IC pipe by prying each one of those little tabs back with a flat head screwdriver then pull straight done. OR get violent and just pull down super hard.
*Step #5*
Remove the timing plug on the transmission so that you can visibly see the flywheel TDC mark. The Plug is located here.








*Step #6*
Release tension on the accessory belt using a 16mm wrench to pull back the tensioner enough to align the two holes so that you can slip a 3mm allen wrench through both of them. As Illustated.








Now the accessory belt tensioner is locked in place and you can easily remove the belt. Then remove the intake pipe to the throttle body hose. When finished with all that, use your ratcheting 13mm wrench to remove the accessory belt tensioner and place that out of the way.
**Note** The Black Bracket goes between the bolts and the tensioner not the tensioner and the head! Remeber this or your belt will not be aligned properly.
*Step #7*
Remove the harmonic balancer pulley. Then crank the engine to TDC with a 19mm twelve point socket. I looked at the cam gear mark to see when i was getting close, then went super slow to align the flywheel mark perfectly.








^ Here is where the cam gear lines up with the valve cover. You can also see the mark on my cam gear and my new belt from the nail polish. They don't line up because the car has been running.








^ Here is where you will see the TDC mark on the flywheel (Behind the timing plug on the Trans) You can't see the mark on mine cause it's not on TDC. Your flywheel may look a little different as mine is a new lightweight one with that sexy blue spec clutch as you can see.
*Step #8*
Using a jack and a 2x4 crank the jack just so that the engine has support. Make sure the release valve on your jack is tight so that the jack doesn't slowly lose pressure.
*Step #9*
Remove two screws holding the colant reservoir down as well as the bolt holding down the power steering reservoir (10mm deep socket needed there).
















^ unclip that black clamp and take it off the bolt
**Note** Removal of the coolant res and power steering res and/or lines is not necessary but would make the job easier. I didn't remove anything just pushed everything around.
*Step #10*
Remove the six bolts holding the mount to the body and the bracket located here.Then slide the mount out from the top.








^ The bolts are close to those circles
*Step #11*
Jack the engine up a couple of inches. Then remove the rest of the engine mount which is attached to the block by removing 3 bolts. You will need the deep 16mm socket to remove at least one of them. After removing the bolts if you can't find a way to get that other piece of the mount out from the bottom don't sweat it. I just left it in there and moved it around as needed, as many others have done it this was as well.
*Step #12*
Remove the 5 - 10mm bolts holding the middle and lower timing belt covers on.
*Step #13*
At lucky step thirteen you get to take the timing belt off, but FIRST...
make sure you mark the position of the belt on the crank gear and the cam gear. I used nail polish to do this and i made two marks on the bottom (crank gear) and 1 mark on the top (cam gear) so that it was impossible to screw it up.








^ Here is what my belt looked like after i took it off and it was marked
Now remove the little timing belt tensioner pulley. Then remove the whole Tensioner and finally remove the tensioner idler pulley. Now slip the belt off.








*Step #14*
Remove the water pump. It is held in with 3 10mm bolts. At this point it's not just gonna fall out. Wrap a rag around the gear and get two hands down in there. Wiggle the pump while pulling as hard a you can. When it starts to leak you're almost there. In the end your prize will be a mess of coolant on the floor and ,if you're doing this timing belt swap because your waterpump broke like me, a cracked plastic waterpump impeller which you will need to reach into the block to retrieve.
*Step #15*
Replace the water pump. Make sure to moisten the O-ring with some coolant before bolting it back up.
*Step #16*
Get your new timing belt out and transfer the marks to the new belt from the old belt. Before throwing it in there put the new tensioner idler pulley in there. Now align the mark on the cam gear with the belt. Next route it down to the crank gear and line those marks up. Most difficult part of the whole job right here. Put the New tensioner in. I noticed my old one left an imprint on the block which helped me out with the way it was oriented in there. Then i put that 3mm allen wrench to good use and stuck it through the top bolt hole on the tensioner to line that one up. Then I put the bolt in the bottom hole and shifted the tensioner around until i got it to screw in. Then i bolted in the top one. Make sure the marks on the cam gear and the crank gear haven't moved and when you're confident that you've got that belt on perfect pull the pin on the tensioner. After you pull that pin there is no turning back unless you have the blot to untension the tensioner.
*Step #17*
Crank the engine over, by hand, at least two times so that you can match up the flywheel TDC mark and the Cam Gear TDC mark, They should match perfectly.
*Step #18*
Install the middle and lower timing belt covers and bolt the mount back the the block. Then replace the harmonic balancer pulley and the accessory tension pulley.
*Step #19*
Attach the engine back to the mount and bolt it down.
*Step #20*
Repeat the steps in Step #6 to get the accessory belt back on. Make sure you have a space between the pulley and the timing belt cover. I didn't the first time, had to tear everything down again to fix it, And got the fright of my life the first time i turned the car on and heard that.








^ Blury picture but you need a space there
*Step #21*
Finish up by putting the belly pan and the sound dampening shroud back in place, as well as the lower IC pipe. Also reinstall the TB hose and bolt down the coolant reservior and the power steering res. Put your wheel back on and lower the car.
*Step #22*
Fill your car with coolant before starting. You may want to fill the res about 3/4 full because the engine is going to suck alot in when you start it.
**Note** Mix coolant with distilled water only
*Step #23*
Start the car and check for belt alignment as well as top off your car with coolant. If you did everything right it's time to give yourself a pat on the back. You did good http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
*Torque specs*
Engine mount to cylinder block - 45Nm
Engine mount to Body - 40Nm + 90
Engine mount Bracket - 25Nm
Engine mount to Engine Mount on Block - 100Nm
Timing Belt cover bolts - 10Nm
Vibration damper/belt pulley - 25Nm
Timing Belt Tensioner - 25Nm
Coolant pump - 15Nm
If I left anything out or you have suggestions please let me know I'd like to make this as 100% complete as I possibly can!



_Modified by Tim_1.8T at 2:41 PM 12-16-2006_


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## trbochrgm02 (Dec 11, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Nice work http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## under boost (Apr 22, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (trbochrgm02)*

this should be a sticky. excellent write up! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## VWAUDITECH (Jul 29, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Good job!Although I recommend putting reference marks on the cam/valve cover,and crank gear/engine block,since things may get messed up putting marks on "the belt".If you use the correct service tool,then you can lift the motor enough to completely remove the motor mount bracket,which makes things a lot easier.
A word of warning to those reading this.....although the OP makes this look "easy",it is not,if you do not have a modicum of engine knowledge (crank/cam timing)and are easily frustrated,do not attempt this yourself,even though the internet post makes it seem like a breeze,which it is NOT.
I say this,since this job is similar to a brake job,it seems "easy" but you HAVE to do it correctly the first time or you will encounter dire consequence (just like F'ing up a brake job),if you are going to attempt this,atleast know a little about wrenching!


_Modified by VWAUDITECH at 4:39 PM 9-24-2006_


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## O2VW1.8T (Jul 9, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (VWAUDITECH)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWAUDITECH* »_Good job!Although I recommend putting reference marks on the cam/valve cover,and crank gear/engine block,since things may get messed up putting marks on "the belt".If you use the correct service tool,then you can lift the motor enough to completely remove the motor mount bracket,which makes things a lot easier.
A word of warning to those reading this.....although the OP makes this look "easy",it is not,if you do not have a modicum of engine knowledge (crank/cam timing)and are easily frustrated,do not attempt this yourself,even though the internet post makes it seem like a breeze,which it is NOT.
I say this,since this job is similar to a brake job,it seems "easy" but you HAVE to do it correctly the first time or you will encounter dire consequence (just like F'ing up a brake job),if you are going to attempt this,atleast know a little about wrenching!

_Modified by VWAUDITECH at 4:39 PM 9-24-2006_

Yep put a peice of wood block under the engine and lower the car until you can unscrew all bolts from the engine mount. No need to take off the wheel and stuff


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (O2VW1.8T)*

Well i got all the bolts out of the mount just couldn't jockey it out of there, as for the wheel It's not 100% needed but its a 2 second deal


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## Ken_C (Nov 20, 2005)

Wow, I wish you would have done this a few months earlier. Woulda saved me about 800 bucks.
Good write up http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## black2001aww (Sep 30, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Good write up sir. It's nice when Vortex can be helpful for people! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Craig King (Dec 30, 2005)

How much would this ordinarily cost to get done at a dealership or garage?


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## O2VW1.8T (Jul 9, 2003)

*Re: (Craig King)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Craig King* »_How much would this ordinarily cost to get done at a dealership or garage?

dealer is around 500 for labor plus parts


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## MJM Autohaus (Oct 20, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Tim_1.8T* »_ 
**Note** Kits are available from ECStuning.com, from mjm, as well as many other places. Most don't come with new stretch bolts so you need to ask for them. 

Our kits do come with the 4-piece stretch bolts. No need to ask for them.
http://www.mjmautohaus.com


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## Blue.Jester.02Gti (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (MJM Autohaus)*

this is indeed a very nice write-up, thanks for taking the time to do it, im sure you will save a lot of people a lot of money (or in some cases give them the opprotunity to spend a great deal more














)
I will definitely use this as a reference when doing mine!


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## pasha (Aug 16, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Blue.Jester.02Gti)*

"9mm twelve point"
- may i ask why 12 pint. may sound lame, but why is that prefered? easier to get the socket on the bolt? is this a must, a 6 point wont work?
thanks for the diy


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## oj1480 (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

looks easy, but i know it isn't so.


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (oj1480)*

If you're talking about the 19mm twelve point it is required because thats what it is to turn the engine over. The DIY i used said he used a 21mm socket i quote him " i don't know if this is the right tool" but he said it worked fine for him. Here is a pic off Audiworld of the crank, you can see its a 12 point.


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## pasha (Aug 16, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

ok, wow.. didnt realize that could be. thanks for the explanation and the pic!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## rod_farva02 (Jan 19, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (pasha)*

thanks this really helped http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Tetzuoe (Nov 30, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (rod_farva02)*

excellent DIY, definatley going to print this out when i do mine


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (rod_farva02)*

Your welcome http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Bluebomber (Jan 2, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

nice http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 1.BillyT (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Bluebomber)*

No need to put the car at TDC if you mark the belt and the pulleys. 

Also, there is a TDC reference on the crank pulley.


_Modified by 1.BillyT at 10:56 AM 12-17-2006_


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (1.BillyT)*

Well you can't see the TDC mark on the pulley unless you remove the passenger head light which means removing the front bumper; extra work. As for the TDC in the first place when you crank the car over by hand twice the marks on the belt will no longer line up however the TDC marks will so if you don't like to make sure you did it right then you don't have to move the motor to TDC center. Otherwise i'd advise it considering it's a 2 second deal and it could potentially save you thousands http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## PD Performance (Jul 1, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Tim_1.8T* »_ Well you can't see the TDC mark on the pulley unless you remove the passenger head light which means removing the front bumper; extra work. As for the TDC in the first place when you crank the car over by hand twice the marks on the belt will no longer line up however the TDC marks will so if you don't like to make sure you did it right then you don't have to move the motor to TDC center. Otherwise i'd advise it considering it's a 2 second deal and it could potentially save you thousands http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

You can see it right from the top straight down between the powersteering resivour and the engine.
I never use the flywheel especially on aftermarket setups since I have way to many that are not marked correctly or marked at all.
The factory manuals don't even reference using the flywheel on any new cars just the crank pulley and cam gear.
your method does work but is not as reliable as using the actual crank.
No need to even mark anything, there is a notch on the valve cover and mark on the cam gear. And a mark on the crank pulley and notch on the lower engine cover.
Never done it any other way.

excellent detailed writeup http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## skydaman (Dec 16, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (PD Performance)*

Nice writeup! This will save people hundreds of $$.


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## 1.BillyT (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (PD Performance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PD Performance* »_You can see it right from the top straight down between the powersteering resivour and the engine.
I never use the flywheel especially on aftermarket setups since I have way to many that are not marked correctly or marked at all.
The factory manuals don't even reference using the flywheel on any new cars just the crank pulley and cam gear.
your method does work but is not as reliable as using the actual crank.
No need to even mark anything, there is a notch on the valve cover and mark on the cam gear. And a mark on the crank pulley and notch on the lower engine cover.
Never done it any other way.

excellent detailed writeup http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

This is me, agreeing with Chris... hell must be freezing over.








we mark the belt and pulleys instead of putting the motor at TDC. Different path to the same place.


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## Tetzuoe (Nov 30, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (PD Performance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PD Performance* »_
No need to even mark anything, there is a notch on the valve cover and mark on the cam gear. And a mark on the crank pulley and notch on the lower engine cover. 

ok so im working on this right now (going to take a break to sleep and whatnot else) 
Ive aligned the cam to TDC and the crank is very close (just left of the valve cover mark, half a tooth i guess).
removed the harmonic dampener pully and the lower cover, took off the belt and am in the process of getting the new belt in and tensioning.
once i get the tensioner pully and piston back in with the timing belt on, should i:
remove the pin to tension the belt
put the lower cover back on
put the acessory pully back on (harmonic damping pully)
see how out of alignment the crank and cam are (# teeth) 
re-un-tension the belt
adjust for the # teeth
tension the belt
rinse and repeat
seems correct... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif ??
should i readjust the crank so the two marks are exactly aligned? or go with the alignment that was origonally there.
thanks for the help and the diy is great, fun thing to do over break


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tetzuoe)*

once you pull the pin unless you have the tensioning bolt there is no turning back. If you mark the original belt like it says to in the DIY and transfered them, then they should match perfectly to the marks left on the crank gear and the cam gear, if they're not lining up perfect don't pull the pin. There is no rinse and repeat make sure you do it right the first time or you're gonna be in deep **** http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Tetzuoe (Nov 30, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

sooo... for the sake of argument... lets say we didnt mark the belt....


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## AaronAnderson (May 26, 2006)

Then use all of those marks stated above.


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## Tetzuoe (Nov 30, 2005)

*Re: (AaronAnderson)*

did all the steps that i said above, when the m5 bolt depresses the tensioner you have to put the pin back in, then to move the belt it helps if you take the tensioner out (leave in the pully). anyway everything works now http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## thetwodubheads (Dec 6, 2004)

*Re: (Tetzuoe)*

Are there any techs in here that have a hint on how to get the damn mount out of the bay? People have said that they just jacked the motor all the way up, but on my car it still didn't come out. I absolutely haded having to put the mount to one side then the other to work that damn tensioner!








Now I have to do this again to replace my cam tensioner seal.


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## anthony_g (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: (thetwodubheads)*

I'm also in the process of replacing may cam seal (a month after the TB job). moving that mount bracket around was the only difficult part of the whole TB job. wouldn't come out for me either (2001 AWW). don't think I have to muck with the mount for the cam seal though.


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## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (anthony_g)*

Bump because these threads are great http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## whizbang (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: (thetwodubheads)*

Here are some thoughts from my recent timing belt install.
If you are going to replace the water pump and/or thermostat drain the coolant first. It makes a big mess if you don't.
Unless you want to pull the motor leave the motor mount in the car loose. It will come out with the tensioner removed but will NOT go back in with the tensioner installed.







I got distracted by friends stopping over to 'help' and forgot to re-position the motor mount before I bolted up the tensioner and pulled the pin. I had to unbolt all engine/trans mounts and lower the motor/trans nearly out of the car to get the mount reinstalled. 
Other than the motor mount issues the install is fairly straight forward with the DIY.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

My brother just had his timing belt replaced at a local shop and they said his old belt ('03 GTI 1.8t) was off by a tooth. They also said being off by a tooth was very common on '02 and '03 1.8t's from their experience in the shop.
Anyone else with an '02 - '03 notice this?
Also, how can I be sure I am aligning the timing belt properly compared to just aligning it how it was before?
Thanks,
Greg


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## whizbang (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: (groggory)*

Don't mark the belt just use the timing marks on the cam, crank and flywheel. If the marks line up the motor is in time.


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## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (whizbang)*

While that is true, it does help to mark the belt and transfer the marks to the new one so you have no doubt how many teeth are between each pulley. Sometimes it is very easy to be off just one tooth once everything is on and tightened up.


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## Tetzuoe (Nov 30, 2005)

*Re: (White Jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *White Jetta* »_While that is true, it does help to mark the belt and transfer the marks to the new one so you have no doubt how many teeth are between each pulley. Sometimes it is very easy to be off just one tooth once everything is on and tightened up.

if you lign up all the marks everything should be fine and you dont have to mark be the belt BUT, in my case after two revolutions the marks were off by about two teeth, i marked the belt simply so that if it fell off id have some kind of reference. 

_Quote, originally posted by *whizbang* »_
Unless you want to pull the motor leave the motor mount in the car loose. It will come out with the tensioner removed but will NOT go back in with the tensioner installed.







I got distracted by friends stopping over to 'help' and forgot to re-position the motor mount before I bolted up the tensioner and pulled the pin. .

LOL ditto, i had the mount in there but the tensioner blocked it from going to the right position








oh, and the pump made a huge mess, even with coolant drained, luckily the water ejected all the peices of the broken impeller










_Modified by Tetzuoe at 9:23 PM 1-1-2007_


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

I am about to start on a timing belt job today and my brother pre-emptively pulled the pin on the Tensioner. I put the tensioner in a vice, squeezed the pin shut, and replaced the pin.
Did I damage it by compressing the pin all the way again? Is compressing the pin not a big deal because it was designed to compress?
Am I safe using this tensioner, or should I go buy another one before the job is the question.
Thanks,
Greg


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## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (groggory)*

You should be fine because i've done exactly what you did on my old DSM several times. Always pulled the pin out too early


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## Tetzuoe (Nov 30, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (White Jetta)*

the haynes manual says thats exactly what you should do, except they say put a small drill bit or something in there instead of a pin. plus they use the M5 bolt and washer to compress it via the pulley. long story short your fine http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## verboten1 (Jun 30, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tetzuoe)*

where are the marks on the crank side?


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## standard (Oct 17, 2001)

if you jack the motor up all the way, the mount WILL come out. we do about a dozen of these a week


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## thetwodubheads (Dec 6, 2004)

*Re: (standard)*

thanks, i'll have to try that when I do the seal probably next week.


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## Tetzuoe (Nov 30, 2005)

*Re: (standard)*

how high can the motor go? i was reluctant to go past a few inches.


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## VeroDubs (Apr 26, 2006)

Bump...also curious about how high the engine can go as I am about to start this job!


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## chefdave (Feb 9, 2003)

*Re: (gsusmaniac)*

I'm not following the reasoning behind marking the old belt. I'm guessing there are registration markings or some kind of indication that lets you match it exactly to the new belt?


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## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (chefdave)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chefdave* »_I'm not following the reasoning behind marking the old belt. I'm guessing there are registration markings or some kind of indication that lets you match it exactly to the new belt? 

It's just to transfer the marks to the new belt and be able to put it back on exactly as it came off, tooth for tooth between the pulleys. The marks would go from the belt onto the pulley before removing it. It's just for another measure of safety on this "get it right once or be sorry" operation.


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## IAmTheNacho (Oct 26, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (verboten1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *verboten1* »_where are the marks on the crank side?
There is a notch on the cover plate of the timing belt that lines up with a mark on the accessory drive pully off of the crank, You can check it there but if you need to adjust it you kinda have to take it all apart again. Not sure where the one is on the flywheel never really needed to look at it.


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## verboten1 (Jun 30, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (IAmTheNacho)*

well thanks to this writeup and some over the phone help from a local guru (an awesome chick BTW) I got the job done in 9 LAZY beer drinking and cigarette smoking hours


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## 1.BillyT (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: (White Jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *White Jetta* »_It's just to transfer the marks to the new belt and be able to put it back on exactly as it came off, tooth for tooth between the pulleys. The marks would go from the belt onto the pulley before removing it. It's just for another measure of safety on this "get it right once or be sorry" operation.

That, and since it is easy for the cam to bump over one way or the other withthe belt off, the marks are just a fail safe to make sure everything is where it ought to be. The new belt doesn't just "slip on", it takes quite a bit of force to get it on, and it is real easy to move things around. But if you make sure all of you marks line up, you know you are good to go.
Like I said, we don't even put the engine at TDC. Just mark the belt and the gears, transfer the marks to the new belt and put it back on. Keep the makrs all lined up and you know it is right. Once everythig is back together, we do turn the engine over by hand, just to verify that it is indeed in time.
As for 02-03 cars being consistantly a tooth off... I'd be a bit leery of the shop that told me that.


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## T-Boy (Jul 16, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (White Jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *White Jetta* »_You should be fine because i've done exactly what you did on my old DSM several times. Always pulled the pin out too early









Man, I don't wanna be around you guys with gernades....


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## 1.BillyT (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: (Tetzuoe)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Tetzuoe* »_if you lign up all the marks everything should be fine and you dont have to mark be the belt BUT, in my case after two revolutions the marks were off by about two teeth,

The marks on the belt are only good for reinstallation. Once you turn over the motor, they are useless, unless you go back the same number of turns you went forward or vice versa.


----------



## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (1.BillyT)*

1.BillyT is the man to listen to, thanks for clearing things up a bit http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

*Re: (1.BillyT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.BillyT* »_
As for 02-03 cars being consistantly a tooth off... I'd be a bit leery of the shop that told me that.

All I know is that my brother had his belt replaced at that shop, and after the new belt his car pulled better, idled better, and just felt overall stronger. 
But then again, they did replace a cracked hose too. (the Y hose that comes from the PCV and sits on top of the engine)


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## 1.BillyT (Aug 2, 2000)

*Re: (groggory)*

yeah, it's realy possible that your brother's jumped time. But to say they are consistantly off a tooth just isn't true.


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## 911sp (Nov 23, 2005)

*Re: (1.BillyT)*

One question...
How do you release the tension on the old belt before removing it.


----------



## wavinwayne (Jul 18, 2004)

*Re: (911sp)*


_Quote, originally posted by *911sp* »_One question...
How do you release the tension on the old belt before removing it. 

I just removed the roller from the tensioner. That seemed to do the trick.


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## wynler (Jan 17, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Excellent write-up. I just did mine this weekend following these instructions (with a bentley for reference). 
-I would say to definitely mark the belt, cam and crank with fingernail polish. I would've been one notch off if I hadn't.
-The coolant from the water pump IS going to make a mess, prepare for it. 
-Before putting the tensioner back on, drink a couple beers and smoke a cigarette. You'll really be angry trying to get that thing aligned with the pully if you don't.
-Might want to have an extra set of hands for putting the engine mount back on. So that one set can adjust the position of the engine while the other puts the two bolts in
-definitely change to a metal impeller water pump. I just tapped my old plastic one on the ground and it shattered.
-I used my stock tire iron as an extension to my ratchet to loosen those stubborn bolts. 








Cheers for an excellent DIY!!


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## wavinwayne (Jul 18, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wynler)*

I just finished my TB job today. I couldn't have done it properly without this DIY. Thanks a million to the OP who took the time to post this DIY. You da man!
A few things I learned while doing this job:
*This is not an easy job. Unless you do jobs like this all the time, you need plenty of time & LOTS of patience. A proper engine hoist would also make this job soooooooooo much easier, since you'd be able to completely remove the engine mount. It's a PITA to keep moving that thing around.*
A can of Seafoam spray makes removing & reinstalling the intercooler hoses much easier. Also, one of my screw-type hose clamps broke when re-installing it. I recommend buying new hose clamps. O'Reilly Auto Parts has very good hose clamps for a good price. They are a little wider than the OEM clamps, which gives you a little more clamp area.
Removing & re-installing spring clamps from coolant hoses is a PITA if you don't have a pair of small vise grips, or a proper spring clamp compresser tool.
A plastic bicycle tire lever is a good tool to help get the timing belt onto the crankshaft sprocket. I definitely couldn't have gotten it on by hand.
If you're replacing the thermostat at the same time as the timing belt, you will almost certainly have to remove the generator, to access the thermostat housing mounting bolts. If I had this to do again, I would remove the top generator mounting bolt, and only loosen the lower mounting bolt. I would then try to swing the generator toward the radiator, to gain access to the thermostat housing bolts. I'm not sure if this works, but it's what I would try if I were doing this job over again.
*The OEM water pump impellers are as crappy as everybody says. My OEM water pump only had 88k miles on it, and 2 of the impellers shattered in my hand when I removed the water pump from the block. A pox on the house of the VW engineer that spec's the plastic impeller water pumps!*
That's all I can think of right now. If anyone is interested, I did a play-by-play of this job, and posted it on another forum. Here's a link: http://theoildrop.server101.co...&vc=1
I did the job in my spare time, over the course of a couple of weeks.


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wavinwayne)*

Thanks, I'm glad it helped! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## bread1 (Jul 20, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Thanks for the post Tim I did it on about 5.5 hrs after work the other night. Other that the motor mount it wasnt to bad. Your post deff helped out a ton.
Ryan


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## Tcatt (Jun 12, 2006)

I have been workin on my timing belt since 3:00 still don't have the belt off well just about to pull it off


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## sinigang20 (Jan 11, 2005)

*OMG*

I just got done with the job and I must say I hope I don't have to do it again. I got a late start and didn't end till 1:00 am







I had to also put in a thermostat but that was easy. 
I am really glad I had this or else I'd have to work on it for days. Thank you so much for the write up. The car is running fine now and all is well.


----------



## BrandonSS (Nov 23, 2005)

*Re: (1.BillyT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.BillyT* »_yeah, it's realy possible that your brother's jumped time. But to say they are consistantly off a tooth just isn't true.

Actually it makes sense. When you release the tension it pulls the cam gear and crank gear toward each other.. Some more extreme than others. That could easily move it enough to be about 1 tooth off. Even in the Bentley it states that once tension is applied it can cause the TDC to be off. Obviously not ALL, but he didnt really say ALL anyway.
BTW... great write up.. it definitely helped me through this. And that side engine mount is a serious pain in my ass. Always getting stuck and in the way.


----------



## 337GTiAndrew (Jun 23, 2005)

*Re: (BrandonSS)*

this is good stuff http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## SaucemanVR6 (Jan 20, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Thanks for the great writeup!








Did my timing belt and other related stuff over the weekend - definitely be prepared to be cursing








What a PITA that engine mount bracket is. I also had to make an adjustment after pulling the pin, so I bought a 5m x 50 mm bolt from lowes (fully threaded) and a large fender washer to compress the tensioner. (I believe the VW tool is 5m x 55mm. )

If you do the thermostat at the same time, here is a good little writeup I found:

_Quote, originally posted by *4ceFed4* »_So here's how to get the thermostat out for any searchers who are curious like I was. This is what I did at least...
1) get the SAI hose out of the way by removing the 2 10mm nuts holding it to the bracket on the intake manifold.
2) remove the black braket itself by removing the 2 5mm allen bolts. Disconnect the n249 plug and whatever else is under there so you can get it out of the way.
3) Slide the alternator out of the way by removing the 2 13mm bolts on the passenger side holding it to the bracket and disconnecting the electrical plug. This was a pain for me as the metal bushing were seized up good. I used a pry bar and hammered on it some using a hammer and a 2x4.
4) remove the coolant hose off the plastic thermostat housing/flange.
5) now you have easy access to the 2 5mm allen bolts holding the t-stat housing to the block. _ can also use 10mm socket _
6)Remove the housing, then the thermostat by rotating it 90 degrees CCW and pulling straight out.
7) install is the reverse of removal, don't forget to put a liitle coolant on the new o-ring. I sanded down the metal alt bushing a little and rubbed some while lithium grease on there to ease reinstallation. Still a pain. Don't forget to reconnect the n249 like my buddy did...


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## spoof3r (Jan 27, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (SaucemanVR6)*

dang that looks super easy. how long does it take?
so if it's as easy as that looks, then WHY THE CRAP DO PEOPLE WANT 400-600 BUCKS FOR LABOR?!?!?


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## wreckedmyteg (Mar 23, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (spoof3r)*


_Quote, originally posted by *spoof3r* »_dang that looks super easy. how long does it take?
so if it's as easy as that looks, then WHY THE CRAP DO PEOPLE WANT 400-600 BUCKS FOR LABOR?!?!?

It took me about 10 hours, and I consider myself a good wrench turner.
I'll take it in next time. It was a major PITA.


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wreckedmyteg)*

It's easy in the sense that the steps are straight forward but it is a lot of work. I know some people claim to be able to do them in about 2 hours after doing like 50 of them but those people are few and far between. It took me about ten hours to do it as well.


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## anthony_g (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (SaucemanVR6)*

SaucemanVR6: what adjustments did you make after pulling the pin?


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## SaucemanVR6 (Jan 20, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (anthony_g)*


_Quote, originally posted by *anthony_g* »_SaucemanVR6: what adjustments did you make after pulling the pin?

The belt was off a tooth when I doublechecked it the next day, (I worked on it over the course of a weekend) so I had to address that.


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## desertfx (Jan 22, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (SaucemanVR6)*

I was searching for this post recently, and here she is! Great


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## toywolf (Sep 28, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wreckedmyteg)*

man, i think i might just take it in even after reading this. i've done the timing belt/water pump on my past vehicles including a jeep, MG, mazda and a v6 toyota, was NOT fun. this doesn't look any more fun...
i have 65k miles on my 1.8t and need to do the belt soon. i'm assuming it would be a good idea to replace the water pump at the same time right?


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## SaucemanVR6 (Jan 20, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (toywolf)*


_Quote, originally posted by *toywolf* »_i have 65k miles on my 1.8t and need to do the belt soon. i'm assuming it would be a good idea to replace the water pump at the same time right?

yes, since the belt drives the waterpump and the plastic impeller is garbage. make sure you get a waterpump with a metal impeller to replace it.


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## Coralmouse (Jul 6, 2004)

*Re: (groggory)*

Where is the cheapest kit to do this job? Direct link to the kit?
Nate


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## Phobos337 (Sep 6, 2006)

*Re: (Coralmouse)*

I would like to add when putting the timing belt back on it's a bish and a half. I didn't like stretching the belt out so I went old school and put it on as I used too with my bike chain....made it easy, felt dumb after spending an hour trying to get it on every other way though.


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## anthony_g (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: (Phobos337)*

I tackled this myself. after about 1 K miles the outer edge of the T belt seems to be fraying a little. after talking to the belt manufacurer (Contitech, very nice folks) they suggest that one of the rollers may be tilted slighty causing the edge of the roller to wear the edge of the belt. i.e. if i didn't properly clean the block (not sure that I did, or needed to) before installing the new tensioner or tensioner pulley. Could be. cant tell without taking it all apart again (not fun). one thing: the upper T belt cover seems to come *really* close to that same outer edge of the belt. i wonder....


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## BG73395 (Apr 15, 2004)

*Re: (anthony_g)*

thank you for making this DIY. A friend and I just did this a few days ago and it went well. Its crazy how fast the car comes up to temp now.


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## Coralmouse (Jul 6, 2004)

*Re: (BG73395)*

How long does this take to do average? Doing it on saturday wish me luck.. wanna know how much time i should play on putting away.


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## spoof3r (Jan 27, 2007)

*Re: (Coralmouse)*

they're saying it takes like an average of 10 hours....
i have no idea how those like 28 or so steps take 10 hours but i guess i'll be finding out as well here soon.............







?


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## toywolf (Sep 28, 2004)

*Re: (Coralmouse)*

ECS Tuning has an "Ultimate" kit for $250. includes everything. if you price the stuff indivudually from ECS, NAPA or any other place i looked at it comes to well over $300. its recomended that you replaced all these parts at the same time.
# OEM timing belt made by Continental
# OE tensioner Roller made by Ruville in Germany
# OEM tensioner assembly made by Ruville in Germany
# OE Idler roller (comes on the tensioner assembly)
# Hepu water pump with metal impeller
# Conti-Tech accessory drive belt
# Behr thermostat
# ECS/OEM motor mount bolt kit


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## sKasse (Nov 10, 2005)

*Re: (toywolf)*

I think it takes so long for most people because when they are doing it, it is their first time. They are only doing it to save money. And they are cross referencing everything they do with multiple DIY printouts and Vwvortex








I did mine last fall in about 6 hours from start to finish with only this DIY.
The hardest part by FAR is getting the belt back on. It was a total biff. I no isht ended up using a shoe horn to help lever the belt onto the cam gear.















OH... and if don't forget to tighten the hose clamps on your pancake pipe


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## Coralmouse (Jul 6, 2004)

*Re: (sKasse)*

Oh man this is prob going to take me like 15 hours haha
naTe


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## spoof3r (Jan 27, 2007)

*Re: (Coralmouse)*

i have no idea how they say this is jsut as hard as doing a clutch. the clutch was hard and that took forever but the DIY i followed had like 100 steps give or take a few i can't remember.
this looks so simple....i must be in for a bad surprise







lol


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## anthony_g (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: (spoof3r)*

IMO, the hardest part is removing, working around, and reinstalling the pass side engine mount bracket.


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## anthony_g (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: (anthony_g)*

so, any tricks for helping with that would be much appreciated (as I have to do this job again cause I think my belt is rubbing or something).


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## tihol (Jan 5, 2005)

2 minor pointers:
Re: A T-belt tooth being off:
Recently did the T-belt with a friend (much easier with 2 pple) and after the MIL came on - code says relationship between cam and crank is off. The car (2K Beetle) feels more responsive at lower RPM than before and has been this way for about 4K km. Can be a tooth forward, though marks were all aligned. No plans changing it for now.
Re: water pump with plastic impeller - just pulled one out after 270+K km on a 2.0. Sure enough, a piece broke off upon touch - it was only 1 and smaller than the pieces that came off on the 1.8T water pump. Seems like the coolant cooks the brittle plastic, more so on the turbo.


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## tnova (Jun 12, 2007)

*A few tips from a beginner*

Nice DIY for the 1.8T timing belt, it is very good. I also consulted the Bentley manual and Haynes. I actually thought the Haynes book did a better job explaining than the Bentley which was a suprise. Here's a few notes \ tips from my experience:
- Two people makes this easier, but probbably not faster
- Taking the lower bolt off the intercooler makes getting the pancake off much easier, also replace the clamps if they are rusted.
- Be SURE to seat the hex head properly on each of the 4 crankshaft pulley bolts, my friend stripped mine and we tried everything to get the bolt out, jb weld, larger sized hex, what ended up working was a BOLT-OUT from Irwin (sold at Home Depot) and a manual impact driver to seat it first, then a socket wrench with a cheater (even though the head is round). The Craftsman bolt remover has thick walls that prevent you from getting on the bolt because of the clearance to the sides of the pulley.
- PB blaster, lighly around the crankshaft bolt, helped get the pulley off since the crankshaft collar just under the bolt was rusted pretty bad (I lost my plastic belly sheild.
- Replace your crankshaft pulley bolts, apparenly VW / Audi changed to a triple square (12-point) design to maximize bolt head surface area to grip, since these bolts are frequently stripped. It's worth the $2-3 to do this.
- Supporting the engine from the bottom sounds nervewracking so I posted to craigslist in the LA area to borrow an engine hoist for cheap, and I got a response and was able to borrow it ffor a weekend. I used a shackle on the engine block to the chain on the hoist, worked perfect.
- The belt was a pain to get on so I loosened the water pump bolts to get the belt seated which relaxed the tension alittle.
- Almost forgot to tighten the bolt from the side engine mount back into the block- since it stayed in the mount, inside the body and never came out of the body it was easy to forget to tighten the bolt.
_Modified by tnova at 2:31 PM 6-12-2007_


_Modified by tnova at 2:34 PM 6-12-2007_


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## spoof3r (Jan 27, 2007)

*Re: A few tips from a beginner (tnova)*

oh my gosh, that was the hardest thing i think i have done. Ok so it wasnt that hard but it's taken me at least 10 hours total, but im guessing alot more since i've been working on it since yesterday and i've just now completed it at 11:30pm
for those debaiting on taking it in, do it yourself.... it feels really good once you've done it on your own.... then again if you have the money take it in







MAJOR PITA!!!!


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## Twintigklepper (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: A few tips from a beginner (spoof3r)*

It isn't that hard you can do it in a few ours, but there is a risk of alot of damage...
It is easy to get the belt on if you put on the belt first, tensioner pulley mounting at the end.


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## kawai1231 (Nov 12, 2006)

how long might this take roughly? I JUST did my a/c compressor a week ago, and now my water pump just went out.. would it be easier than an A/c job? possibly take less time? Thanks


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## John V (Jul 14, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Just wanted to post my thanks for your DIY. I found it very helpful when doing the belt on our 1.8T this weekend. FWIW, it took me 5 hours start to finish. That included doing the thermostat which was not in your writeup.
A couple things to add (sorry if these were covered)... the tming belt tensioner is easy to do, except the pulley (the tensioner pulley, not the tiny idler on the tensioner itself) is in the way. I used a long piece of piano wire to wire it up in the "tensioned, but not too tensioned" position. This gets it out of your way, but doesn't put so much tension on the timing belt that it's hard to install the tensioner. 
I would not do this job without also replacing the thermostat. If you're already draining the coolant, why not? It's cheap insurance, and it's easy to do. You need a large prybar to get the alternator off.
also, you mention that you "need a gap" between the harmonic damper pulley and the timing cover. What did you do that led you to not have a gap there the first time around? My car didn't have much of a gap before I disassembled it, but I didn't see any way to install the timing covers / pulley any different than how it came off - so I'm curious.
thanks again for the writeup.
John V


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## arch_ed0421 (Aug 12, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (John V)*


_Quote, originally posted by *John V* »_ That included doing the thermostat which was not in your writeup.


did you happen to find a write up for the thermostat?


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## John V (Jul 14, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (arch_ed0421)*

No, but it is so painfully easy that it doesn't really need one.
1) Remove accessory belt tensioner (described in the timing belt DIY)
2) Remove both alternator bolts (13mm hex head)
3) Move alternator towards radiator (don't need to pull it out)
4) Unbolt thermostat housing (2 x 10mm hex head bolts)
5) Remove thermostat
6) Install thermostat
7) Lube new o-ring with coolant, install o-ring
8) Install thermostat housing 
10) Install alternator
11) Install accessory belt tensioner (don't forget the belt)
12) Drink beer


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## arch_ed0421 (Aug 12, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (John V)*


_Quote, originally posted by *John V* »_No, but it is so painfully easy that it doesn't really need one.
1) Remove accessory belt tensioner (described in the timing belt DIY)
2) Remove both alternator bolts (13mm hex head)
3) Move alternator towards radiator (don't need to pull it out)
4) Unbolt thermostat housing (2 x 10mm hex head bolts)
5) Remove thermostat
6) Install thermostat
7) Lube new o-ring with coolant, install o-ring
8) Install thermostat housing 
10) Install alternator
11) Install accessory belt tensioner (don't forget the belt)
12) Drink beer

ok thanks John V...one more ?
at what point during these steps should i change the thermostat? does it matter?
i imagine towards the end while my engine is still raised with the jack but i just want to make sure....
im starting this DIY tonight http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## John V (Jul 14, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (arch_ed0421)*

Doesn't matter, I did it as one of the last steps. I would want the engine bolted back down becuase you might have to apply force to remove the alternator.


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## Fixxxer (Nov 15, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (John V)*

Although it's good to know that your thermostat is new, it's probably one of the most reliable parts on a VW. I've worked as a VW parts tech and now as a VW mechanical tech and I have never sold nor installed a thermostat in a VW. They never break, they never seem to wear out and there are still thermostats sitting on the shelf at work collecting dust from the days I ordered the damn things. They just don't quit.


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## John V (Jul 14, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Fixxxer)*

Now you've done it, everyone's thermostat is going to fail.








It came with my timing belt kit, and the coolant was already drained, so I couldn't resist replacing it.


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## Fixxxer (Nov 15, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (John V)*

If your thermostat fails, come see me. I'll put one in just to see what's involved!


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## arch_ed0421 (Aug 12, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Can someone tell me how to remove the timing belt idler pulley? is there a screw im not seeing or do i just pull it out? im having trouble with this one










_Modified by arch_ed0421 at 7:53 PM 7-16-2007_


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (arch_ed0421)*

bring the motor down a bit if needed and get an allen in there (IIRC 8mm) and and take it off


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## Fixxxer (Nov 15, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (18T_BT)*

Yeah, that [email protected] allen bolt you see there is what's holding it on. While you have it all apart, check your tensioner to see if it needs replacement. If you can push down on the little piston that tensions the roller, you NEED to replace it. There should be enough tension on that piston that you can't push it down by hand.
When shipped to the dealer, they come already compressed and held in place with a pin. Just install all the gear, set the timing and pull the pin.


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## arch_ed0421 (Aug 12, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (18T_BT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *18T_BT* »_bring the motor down a bit if needed and get an allen in there (IIRC 8mm) and and take it off

thanks...i didnt notice that
im in the process of putting everything back together now and i forgot how the tensioner and idler pulley were placed in there? 
was it something like this?...
*Old Tensioner/Idler Pulley* 









_Modified by arch_ed0421 at 9:10 PM 7-17-2007_


_Modified by arch_ed0421 at 9:12 PM 7-17-2007_


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## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (arch_ed0421)*

this is how it should look:


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## arch_ed0421 (Aug 12, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (18T_BT)*

1 more ?
how is the bracket supposed to be placed back for accessory tensioner...i noticed the op's instructions but is it 1 or 2?
I could of swore it was in position 1 before i took off the original belt
*1* 









*2*









_Modified by arch_ed0421 at 8:46 AM 7-21-2007_

_Modified by arch_ed0421 at 8:47 AM 7-21-2007_


_Modified by arch_ed0421 at 8:48 AM 7-21-2007_


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## rocketrich (Jun 17, 2000)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (arch_ed0421)*

Bracket goes on the outside, your second picture. I"m in the middle of this now. Got stuck trying to get the belt back on. Good luck, Rich


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## spoof3r (Jan 27, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (rocketrich)*

oh gosh this was a PITA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That tensioner sucks to get on!


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## arch_ed0421 (Aug 12, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (spoof3r)*

thanks...i already put it on with the bracket on the outside...my car started....no problems


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## JEEP VS GTI (Mar 27, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

just did mine over the weekend!! so glad i did it myself! 8 hours including lunch and a drive out for distilled water..
some things to clarify..
dont be afraid to jack the motor up or down for easier access to bolts..
the hardest part is re-installing the timing belt.. here are some tips..
forst off, the engine mount is 2 piece.. the one that actually goes to the block is the PITA one.. i left mine in the engine bay, but disconnected and moved it around as the OP stated.. when reinstalling the belt, this is the best order to do it in...
water pump
idler pulley
timing belt (line up marks)
rotate tensioner pulley to tighten belt
get the motor mount and tensioner in there, install tensioner bolts(hardest part)
install motor mount

also, the easiest time to install the thermostat is any time that you have the body half of the motor mount still removed. this allows better acess to the alternator bolts.
if you have any mechanical skills, this should be a pretty straight forward DIY.. but as others have said, it sure as heck isnt as easy as a 23 step process.. prepare for some bloody knuckles.


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## alleghenyman (Nov 20, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Good writeup. Frankly this is taxing my tool inventory in ways I've never thought possible, since my father and I have spent 40 years building it up. It't not so much weird sizes as different size wrenches and socket depths in order to get into the nooks and crannies. If you enjoy taking things apart to see how they work and want to gain an appreciation for your car's engineering, I heartily recommend setting aside a weekend to do this. It's the evening of day two and I've just turned the corner of putting on the new tensioner, water pump and timing belt, but I've worked slowly in order to avoid getting stressed out and making a mistake. The job itself is as straightforward as the writeup, but I have small hands and I still have trouble getting them in there to work. 
Honestly, the next time this needs to be done, I'm pulling the engine out on a hoist - it will probably take the same amount of time in the end with less strain on my back and fewer busted knuckles. I hope grime and antifreeze aren't toxic in trace amounts. 
I have to hand it to VW - the tensioner and the belt are in great shape despite 70k miles in the northeast, being parked outside all winter. No cracks in the belt, no play in the idler shafts, stif spring in the tensioner. Whatever complaints there were about the early MkIV's, they must have uprated the componentry. None of the bolts were even frozen and none stripped (so far). The water pump impeller was plastic (2003 model year) and a few hairline cracks but wasn't brittle. I decided to skip the thermostat since everything else was in pretty good shape, and the alternator wouldn't budge once the bolts were out. 
I will warn you though, if you're (a) not good with your hands, (b) don't understand how things work, or (c) generally impatient, pony up for a mechanic. I'm none of the above, but between the tight clearances, sharp edges on the drive pulleys, and dire consequences of a mistake, there have been times when I wondered whether mechanics make housecalls. There are some times when you're just doing things based on feel since you can't see, and if you just have a basic tool set you'll need a few additions to make things easier. 
Now I just have to put things back on. The "bicycle chain" method was the easiest for me and involved the least amount of force on the belt. Let's just hope there aren't bolts left over at the end! 


_Modified by alleghenyman at 9:19 PM 8-12-2007_


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## gtivdubdude (Mar 20, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (PD Performance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PD Performance* »_
You can see it right from the top straight down between the powersteering resivour and the engine.
I never use the flywheel especially on aftermarket setups since I have way to many that are not marked correctly or marked at all.
The factory manuals don't even reference using the flywheel on any new cars just the crank pulley and cam gear.
your method does work but is not as reliable as using the actual crank.
No need to even mark anything, there is a notch on the valve cover and mark on the cam gear. And a mark on the crank pulley and notch on the lower engine cover.
Never done it any other way.

excellent detailed writeup http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


Good write up but i agree with you on this timing belt marking stuff, go with what marks are there from the factory, not nail polish..
Chris


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## Elvir (Oct 18, 2004)

*Re: (groggory)*

one thing i think this DIY does not do well is explain how to put in the timing belt very effectively..I spent about 2 hours trying to figure it out..
But, when you take off the timing belt and put in a new water pump as explained in DIY, make sure that the both cam and crank pulley are both at the TDC. After that, if you have already put in new marks on the new belt, you can proceed to put the timing belt form cam and rout it down to the crank. Now, this is the crucial part. Everything on your left side is ok to be loose, it has a tensioner, and a tensioner pulley that will tighten it up later, BUT on the right side, as the belt routs from the cam to the water pump down to the crank pulley, it needs to be tight.
One problem that occurred with me, and im sure it will occur with everybody else is that the marked points on the belt will not align with the points on the crank pulley. you MUST align them to make this work. If you don't your right side will be lose, and most likely would cause the belt to skip and damage will occur.
Now, when i did it, i was literally short by half a tooth on the crank pulley. What i had done is, i moved the crank CCW just a tad bit in order to be able to grip the timing belt at the marked point. Don't worry, this will not have an effect on the cam pulley because the belt on the right side is slightly loose. when you put the belt over, position the crank pulley back to its TDC by moving it back CW the same amount that you moved it CCW. you can check this on the opposite side of the engine, where the rubber plug was. 
Now, when you position it back to its original place, the cam pulley will move slightly clockwise by half a tooth. That is ok. You still have not put in the tensioner and the tensioner pulley. Once you do that, the TDC on the cam will align back up again. continue with the rest of the procedure in the DIY section.
NOTE: most part of this job is easy for one person. I would highly recommend doing this with two people when it comes to the timing belt work. The reason behind this is because, i, as many others have not removed the part of the engine mount that bolts to the engine block. There was just not enough room. This will constantly get in the way of everything. you need an another individual to keeep moving this mount around so that it does not get in the way of your work.
hope that helps..
Elvir


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## GiddyGTI (Sep 28, 2005)

i decided to get mine replaced at a shop. 
i noticed to get the tdc marks he removed a spark plug and put a long rod down there. don't know how accurate this might be. 
also the belt hangs off the cam gear about 1mm or less. i don't like that. 
plus i taste burning from my vents. 
anyone know why?
i wish i did this job myself. but for 225 for the labor, i guess it isn't too bad.
from inspecting my old belts it looks pretty good. i think i could have gone another 20k miles. i have 65k now. 
are contitech belts OEM? cause i think i'll replace them when i reach 150k



_Modified by GiddyGTI at 3:36 PM 8-24-2007_


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## SlowpokeGLI (Sep 25, 2006)

hi
I’m going to changing T-belt soon my car 60,000mile.This’s going to be my first job changing the T-belt and by reading this it seem a lot of work. I‘ve couple question about cam gear and crank gear I don’t thinks I fully understand the principles need advice and educated more….
1.Cam gear and crank gear have mark where is it located at ?
2.before take the T-belt off need to turn engine to TDC first ,where/how do I turn the engine, crank gear ?
In which way do I turn clockwise /counter clock or only spin one way?
3.What happen if I turn the engine and past TDC mark keep on turning same direction until reach the mark?
4. Once the T-belt off, cam gear and crank gear can it be in dividable moved around by hand or only with the belt is on? 
5. Ok, T-belt on everything line up release the tension inspected and found out the belt jump one or two teeth, what do I do ? Do I need go back to step#2 over again and take the belt off.
6. I don’t understand why do you need to line up to TDC first before took T-belt off, in the end you going to turn the engine two time anyway.
7. Where is the coolant drain plug at ?since I’m going to changing water pump need to drain coolant out.
I have reading this DIY 2-3 times I thinks I can do it just a matter time and patience .I like working on car and have a little basic skill changing the brake, suspension ,oil change….I need to step up to the next level the engine parts….
Thanks..


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## oempls (Aug 9, 2004)

*Re: (SlowpokeGLI)*

About how long did this install take you guys?


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## kamikaze2dope (Apr 26, 2003)

*Re: (Island20V)*

Me 10 hours for the swap (ECS ultimate underdrive kit)
I followed this tread point byt point and its great DIY.
One thing i would say is that it needs more info and pics on some critical points of the job.

_Quote, originally posted by *Island20V* »_About how long did this install take you guys?


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

First, thank you for the write up. I will be using it to do my timing belt in a couple of weeks. I ordered the parts already so I am just waiting to have two days off in a row.
Here are a couple of questions that I would like to have clarified. 
1. Bentley and other DIYs talk about marking the direction of the belt. I looked at the timing belt, glanced actually, and it seems as if the belt can be mounted either way,. meaning it is not unidirectional. Any answer to this? 
2. I will be using both the TDC and marking procedures to make sure I have everything lined up correctly. 
For the TDC, I assume you just turn the crankshaft clockwise until the marks line up. Correct?
3. Any problems in refilling coolant? Bentley is talking about VAS 6096, which I have no clue about. I would think that you would be able to just pour coolant into the overfill tank until full.
Thank you for your answers.


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## JEEP VS GTI (Mar 27, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (StoicDude)*


_Quote, originally posted by *StoicDude* »_
1. Bentley and other DIYs talk about marking the direction of the belt. I looked at the timing belt, glanced actually, and it seems as if the belt can be mounted either way,. meaning it is not unidirectional. Any answer to this? *non unidirectional.*
2. I will be using both the TDC and marking procedures to make sure I have everything lined up correctly. 
For the TDC, I assume you just turn the crankshaft clockwise until the marks line up. Correct?*correct. use the 12 point socket (and preferably a pipe on the end of a socket(its hard to turn)(removing plugs makes this part easier, i didnt, and wouldnt) turn the crankshaft till the campulley mark gets close. then watch for the mark on the flywheel.. the flywheel mark is much more sensitive due to the bigger diameter of the flywheel.*
3. Any problems in refilling coolant? Bentley is talking about VAS 6096, which I have no clue about. I would think that you would be able to just pour coolant into the overfill tank until full. *here is what worked for me.. fill the overfill tank to the brim, turn on car till the coolant light comes on, refill coolant overfill tank to 2/3s full and turn the car on for a few min. refill coolant to proper level.*
Thank you for your answers.*no worries. once you get in there it makes much more sense then it does on a computer monitor. just be sure that after you have the belt and all its periferials back on, make sure to turn the crank pully a few rotations.. if you screwed it up, youll for sure know now before you blow your valves apart. then double check to be sure TDC marks are still in sync,*


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (JEEP VS GTI)*

Thank you for the explanations.


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## BIG DUB (Feb 13, 2001)

nice write up


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## kellmk (May 22, 2003)

I just finished the install. I would recommend removing the coolant res. and power steering res. It will give you alot more room to work.
Also I supported the motor with wood blocks when jacking jusr in case the jack slipped. I really didn't like having my hands in there while the motor was jacked seemed real dangerous. Do yourself a favor and use some blocks just in case!
I used the markings on the belt and TDC marks on cam, crank and flywheel worked out real well.
Thanks for the DIY! VW quoted me $850 - $1000. I brought all the tools/parts and still saved about $400.


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Quick question for you guys. 
I finished the job and the car was driving fine until my pancake pipe connection blew apart. 
The connection was on the pancake pipe facing the rear of the car, away from the intercooler. I was pretty sure I tightened it well, but apparently not.
Question is: Anything special I need to do?
It seems that the pipe and the hose do not go in too far. And it is a bitch to fit. 
Thanks for the answers


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## vwk2 (Mar 21, 2002)

_Quote, originally posted by *StoicDude* »_
It seems that the pipe and the hose do not go in too far. And it is a bitch to fit. 

mine slipped right on... there is a thin peg that sticks out so you dont slip the hose on too far... just lubricate a tiny bit inside that hose, have the clamp real loose, slip it on and tighten uip that clamp...


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## kamikaze2dope (Apr 26, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (rocketrich)*

Are you 100% sure of this?









_Quote, originally posted by *rocketrich* »_Bracket goes on the outside, your second picture. I"m in the middle of this now. Got stuck trying to get the belt back on. Good luck, Rich


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (kamikaze2dope)*

The bracket does go on the outside. I put it between the tensioner and the engine and my tensioner is crooked. I have to fix it now.


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## BlackGLiMagic (Dec 21, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## tochtli83 (Nov 15, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (BlackGLiMagic)*

I'm working on a 1998 Passat 1.8T with the AEB motor in it. The car has a long history (150K), but looks nice. I'm doing the timing belt, as the old one was shredding along the front edge against an ECS underdrive pulley. Not sure of the cause, but I'm replacing everything.
Anyway, I lined up the mark for the cam just fine, then following the book, I went to line up the crankshaft pulley mark to the lower timing cover: they were off by a country mile. So, I compared to the mark on the flywheel. It's hard to see on the automatic trans edge, but the mark there looked OK.
I guess my question is: has anyone else noticed that the crankshaft serpentine pulley marks do NOT line up with the lower timing cover arrow, even with the cam marks, and flywheel marks lined up? I mean, which is less (or more) accurate: the flywheel or the crankshaft pulley? Is it possible to time these things back a tooth and still not bend the valves?
The car was running fine when it got here, and I did the marker/white-out trick on the new TB when I installed it. I spun it over 3 times and no binding. But it almost looks like I could rotate the crank back a half a tooth to have the cam mark line up a touch better with the flywheel mark.
Thoughts?


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## SteveSt (Oct 12, 2007)

I've done this project and everything was going like clockwork...'til I went to put the passenger side motor mount back in. (already have the belt and tensioner installed. What's the best way to do it without taking that tensioner back out?
Thanks.


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## SteveSt (Oct 12, 2007)

*Re: (SteveSt)*

Just an update for the next schmuck in the same crunch as me (unable to get the motor mount back in):
I dropped the motor down as far as I could. No luck.








Tried getting it in from the top. No go.








Tried from the bottom. No way.









Took the driver side motor mount off (just the two bolts that attach to the body). Nope.








Finally decided to tip the motor toward the driver side. (two jacks required. Lower the drive side more than the passenger side. EUREKA! Success. Very easy after that.


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## bodo920 (Dec 13, 2004)

*Re: (SteveSt)*

Did this last night with a buddy and it took 5 hours, but could have easily been less. But having all the right tools and this DIY certainly helped. Thanks very much for the writeup and saving me a bundle.
We actually put in the belt last, after the idler pulley and tensioner, because we were having a tough time putting the tensioner on with the belt in place. As long as you route it properly and still have your marks lined up, it will still work, but do whatever is easiest.


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## kamikaze2dope (Apr 26, 2003)

*Re: (bodo920)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
For all of you who did this:
Do you need to unbolt the lower torque arm mount before jacking the engine up and down?


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (tochtli83)*

would pay attention to the Crankshaft and camshaft markings. Forget about the pulley. The ECS one might not even have the proper markings. Also, the person who owned the car before you (I assume you are not the original owner) might not have lined up the pulley correctly. 
Steve: The motor mount goes inside the belt. Well, actually one of the arms (the motor mount has three of them that bolt to the engine) goes right inside the loop, so the best thing is to place the one arm inside the belt and put the belt on. 

_Quote, originally posted by *kamikaze2dope* »_ http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
For all of you who did this:
Do you need to unbolt the lower torque arm mount before jacking the engine up and down?

I didn't. There is noting in any of the DIY regarding this and even the Bentley does not mention it. You are not jacking the engine that high up.


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## dpeter51 (Sep 27, 2007)

My first (or second?) post....I killed myself last night doing this job until 3:30am. I should have waited for a weekend with more time...it took me about 8 hours and I started at dinnertime on a Sunday. Whoops.
Thanks for the instructions and photos, I haven't turned on the car yet but everything is installed and it didn't bind when I turned it over by hand so (please, Lord) I think it shouldn't blow up when I start it later today.
It sounds like there are a few different approaches to this, with people saying the timing belt was hard to get on, "I used the bicycle chain method", etc. I personally just followed the instructions here and put on the T-belt before the tensioner, and that was a 1-minute job. The very difficult part for me was figuring out how the tensioner and the motor mount fit together so I could try to get holes lined up and get the tensioner fasteners in there! I was extrememly aggravated, with my wife trying to hold the mount from above while I jockeyed the tensioner from below (this is with my wheel on because my wheel lock key is lost). If someone can somehow get a photo of how that tensioner fits around the motor mount, it might help some other folks avoid wasted time (I spent at least two hours on this one item). The key is that the top of the tensioner has a curvy thin piece that fits around and *over* the motor mount (well, one of it's three attachment locations, anyway). Also, if you're confused about how the tensioner pulley mates up to the tensioner, don't assume that the tensioner rod mates to the fork thing on the pulley. It mates to the flat piece just below the fork. Look at your old one and you'll see a worn spot.


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## nippaero (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Did my timing belt/water pump this weekend using the ECS kit. This DIY made it a snap.







84K on an '01 Wolf and the water pump had three cracks when I removed it.
A couple things. Don't bother trying to remove the lower engine mount. You can shove it around and get the job done. I used the timing marks on the cam gear, crank gear and flywheel. Works like a champ.
Did the whole thing over a weekend with time to spare.
I started to replace the thermostat but getting the alternator off was turning into a real PITA! So I bagged it. There's nothing wrong with my thermostat anyway.


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## BlackGLiMagic (Dec 21, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (nippaero)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Russjameson (Dec 18, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (BlackGLiMagic)*

Can't wait to do this on my GLI....thanks for a great write up.


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## rewi9d (Oct 9, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

thanks tim! this was hugely helpful. way easier than i thought it was going to be. 6 hours, 6 beers, only 1 busted knuckle.


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## mrstlouis7 (Dec 9, 2007)

How do you release the tension on the T-belt when removing it? Or do you just unbolt the tensioner?


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## mrstlouis7 (Dec 9, 2007)

anyone


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## capsaicin (Apr 1, 2007)

*Re: (mrstlouis7)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mrstlouis7* »_How do you release the tension on the T-belt when removing it? Or do you just unbolt the tensioner?

I removed the small pulley that is on the tensioner first, then took off the belt.
PS - Great write up. I did this a few weeks ago http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## mrstlouis7 (Dec 9, 2007)

everybody else do the same


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: (mrstlouis7)*

I removed the roller bolt first. I think i is a 8mm hex(allen) key.
After that it is really cake.
Problem is putting it on, not taking it off.


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## AdamF (Apr 30, 2002)

*Re: (StoicDude)*

I have a dead (well, runs at idle, I believe it has a separated impeller) car right now and im in the philly area. I have a friend who's more then capable of doing this, but was looking at having it done at a shop. I live in willow grove (just north of northeast philly) area. Anyone have any recommendations? I bought my car from Colonial VW at Street / Bustleton but they've been nothing but hacks on my car, don't really trust them with a job like this and want $1k to do the job. 
Anyone have any good experience with specific dealers/people around here? I have some codes on my Vag-com I wanted the dealer to look at (ABS, airbag, etc) so a dealer would be cool, but who can u trust these days!
I just completed my GT28RS upgrade and this happens, bahhhh humbug!


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## tamorgen (Dec 1, 2003)

*Re: (AdamF)*

Hi all,
I believe I have either a bad water pump, or bad thermostat. Either will basically require me to do the timing belt, which is way over due anyway. I bought the parts several months ago from ECS, but have been a little reluctant to do it myself until now, the issue is forced. I have access to a shop that I can do the work, along with some guidance from the people who run the auto hobby shop, but they aren't VW experts by any means. Before I get started, I still have a few questions.
1) The bently manual tells me to take out the passenger headlight. Why do they do this? Is it simply to get the stock intercooler and hoses out, which they say to remove.
2) Back to number 1, is there any real reason to remove the intercooler and hoses from the turbo to the throttle body?



_Modified by tamorgen at 8:11 AM 12-26-2007_


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: (tamorgen)*

1. No real need to remove the headlight. It might give you some more space to work with, but I, and most other people on here, did fine without removing it. 
You can remove the headlight and the front bumper, but I think it is unnecessary.
2. The only hose you will need to remove is the pancake pipe, which is located in the passenger wheel well. This does connect the turbo and the manifold and needs to be removed to gain access to the timing belt. You will remove the pancake pipe and the wheel well plastic to get to the belt.


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## Twintigklepper (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (StoicDude)*


_Quote, originally posted by *StoicDude* »_
Problem is putting it on, not taking it off.

Its no problem....just a simple thing http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Just put it half on the lower pully, half on the camshaft pully 
Now you can mount the tensioner pully hex a few turns and carfull slide the belt on.















Sorry for my english


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## tamorgen (Dec 1, 2003)

*Re: (StoicDude)*

Okay, that's what I thought, but I wanted to make sure. It seems like the Bentley goes overboard sometimes.
One other thing, does anyone have a photo or diagram of where the lower mark is? I see in the Bentley and the pictures where TDC is, but numerous posts refer to the another alignment mark, and I haven't been able to find that in the Bentley, nor the posts.
Sorry to ask the stupid questions, but I don't want to have to pay $3000 to have the engine rebuilt for my mistake. I'm a little apprehensive about this thing, so I want to make sure everything is crystal clear before I start.


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: (tamorgen)*

Here is the upper timing belt mark (camchain):








Here is the lower (transmission). This one is a bit harder to spot, so you will have to on top of your transmission and find a black plug. Take this out to expose the hole with the mark.








Thanks to PhilW for the photos.
To line them up, turn your crankshaft with a wrench until you get close to aligning the upper marks. When you get close, move it very slowly and check the TDC on the transmission. 
Good luck.


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## tamorgen (Dec 1, 2003)

*Re: (StoicDude)*

Oh, I didn't understand that the second one was the transmission. I thought that they were both cams on the timing belt. So, they should both align at this same time, is that how I understand it? So, when I put the belt back on, I'll turn the cam twice, and when I hit TDC on the camchain, the transmission should hit TDC as well?
All is beginning to make sense. Thanks for the clearer pictures. Pictures are worth 1000 words in this case.


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: (tamorgen)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tamorgen* »_Oh, I didn't understand that the second one was the transmission. I thought that they were both cams on the timing belt. So, they should both align at this same time, is that how I understand it? So, when I put the belt back on, I'll turn the cam twice, and when I hit TDC on the camchain, the transmission should hit TDC as well?


Correcto mundo.









If you have any other questions, post it up.


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## tamorgen (Dec 1, 2003)

*Re: (StoicDude)*

Thanks loads. It should be an exciting weekend. Brand new belts, new coolant pump, new thermostat, rollers, and shiney new undersdrive pulleys :-D It's like my VW is getting a botox injection!


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## tamorgen (Dec 1, 2003)

*Re: (tamorgen)*

Day one of the Timing Belt change:
Well, I got to the garage at 8:00 to let the engine cool down. They opened at 9. By the time I got my car into the bay, up on jacks, it was 9:30.
The walkthrough helped quite a bit, but I'd have to say some was in a different order than I think it should have been done. For instance, I had to remove the coolant resevoir and put the power steering resevoir aside (step 9), before I could begin work on the harmonic balancer pulley (step 7), because I needed to remove the motor mount. (step 10 & 11).
The other thing I found out, that I wasn't completely clear going into this, either from the DIY or the Bentley, was the removal of the engine mount attached to the engine block. What a pain in the a! To top it all off, the Bentley had the same illustration on how to remove the first engine mount (frame side) listed twice, so they didn't illustrate properly on how to remove it. I think I spent an hour and a half to two hours trying to remove that, along with the rubber hose that attaches to the pancake pipe, so I could swing the mount out. Personally I think whoever at VW designed that setup should have to go out and service everyones timing belt.
After that, everything went pretty smoothly. I believe I found out the root of my problem with the engine overheating, and that was the thermostat. I really thought it was going to be the pump, but it was in good shape.
The only real issue I ran into today was the lack of an alternator clutch tool to remove the the pulley from the alternator, so I could install the ECS Underdrive pulley kit. So, tomorrow morning I'm going to head up to World Impex when they open, and pick up the $30 socket, so I can use it for 20 minutes. If anyone needs one, it'll probably be up for sale tomorrow night.
Otherwise, thanks all for the great DIY. I'm doing it almost all by myself, so I spent about 7 hours today working on it, and I'm just starting to get everything put back together. At least I'm going into a long weekend.


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## StoicDude (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: (tamorgen)*

Cool. You seem to be going through what everybody else went through. 
Let us know how the timing belt went on. That was the hardest part for me. 
Also, when you install the pancake pipe back on, make sure you have it seated properly and tightened, because it will come loose under boost. Happened to me.
Make sure you look at the pictures on how to put the accessory belt tensioner back on. The small plastic piece goes on the OUTSIDE, NOT BETWEEN the engine and the tensioner.
Hope it works out for you. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (StoicDude)*


_Quote, originally posted by *StoicDude* »_1. No real need to remove the headlight. It might give you some more space to work with, but I, and most other people on here, did fine without removing it. 
You can remove the headlight and the front bumper, but I think it is *unnecessary*.

Very Much so!
Just did a VW Golf 2.0 AEG for a customer.Car had the following symptoms:
* eratic idle
* temperature would go past the 90*C mark into the 130*C range even though the fans were running.
I diagnosed it as a faulty water pump impeller.Client pulled into the shop @ around 9.30 and car was done around 12.45 or so....
With the right tools this job is very easy even for a novice.My advice is the following....get one of those old time engine jacks like this:








I have access to rotray hoists and all the correct tools but that does not mean with the above jack you cant do this in a decent time frame.
Start with removing the power steering and coolant resevoirs (when you remove the 2 rubber hoses stuff them with spark plugs) and toss the resevoirs to the side so that you dont waste any of the fluid in them.
* remove the serpentine belt
* remove the engine mounts with the 16 & 18mm deep sockets
* remove the engine mount bracket held in by 3 16mm long bolts.
After that lower the engine as much as possible with the jack and align the crankshaft accessory pulley with the mark on the lower timing belt cover.
From there everything is pretty much a walk in the park.I have alot of pictures to host up but my camera is on the fritz....lets hope these images are not lost.


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## tamorgen (Dec 1, 2003)

*Re: (tamorgen)*

Day two of Timing Belt Change:
Did pretty well today. I got the timing belt back on, put the new underdrive pulleys on, put the timing belt covers back on, and of course put the bugger engine mount (mounted to engine) back on. I ran into sort of a brick wall however, with the pulley for the alternator. I bought the splined tool to remove the old pulley, so I could put the pulley from ECS on. However, once I got it off, I couldn't see a way to fasten the new pulley back on. Does anyone know if there is a way to remove the center part of the stock alternator pulley from the pulley itself, so I can attach the new pulley?
Other than that, spent a bit of timing cleaning up the engine compartment, degressing parts that I would need to reattach, etc. The good news is that when I cranked the engine around, the TDC marks lined up perfectly. I still need to do a coolant flush, and obviously reinstall the alternator, so I don't know if it'll crank up right, but I have a good feeling. I probably have about 3 or 4 hours work tomorrow, just taking it slowly.
If anyone knows how to attach the ECS pulley to the alternator, please let me know.
Day Three:
I put everything back together today, put distilled water in to do a coolant flush once started, and cranked er up. It worked perfectly. I'm almost wondering if the timing was a bit off before (belt stretched a bit maybe?), because it is just purring now, almost like new. Flushing out all of the old coolant took a bit longer than I expected, but it is nice to know that all of it is new now, and I had added a valvoline radiator cleaner during the process, so it should be super clean now.
Thanks for the great DIY and all the little tips from everyone. Now I just need to contact ECS and ask them how the hell I'm supposed to attach their alternator pulley. 


_Modified by tamorgen at 8:46 AM 12-31-2007_


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## VWFREQ (Oct 17, 2001)

Another BiG Thanks for this write up, very helpful. It took me 8 hrs to do it myself over 2 days. The takedown took 3 hrs and 4 to put it back together. That mount bracket is a real bastard. If I had someone to hold it, I could have shaved off 2 hrs easy. A second set of hands would have been helpful to keep the tension on the new belt when installing the idler and tensioner. For reference, I am semi pro mechanic. I have worked mostly on Vw's. Several timing belt jobs on 16 and 8v's. This job was much easier than the last big job I tackled; the timing chain, guides and tensioners on a 99.5 Jetta GLX VR6. That was hands down harder that a full swap.
If you have the tools, patience and common sense, go for it.
-cat


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## carpejr2 (Dec 31, 2007)

We replaced the Timining belt and water pump this weekend on my 2000 NB 1.8T but getting a check engine light. Code read it was off by one tooth. We tore it down again (3rd time) and corrected it. Everything lined up (belt and on transmission). checking engine light still on. Any ideas!!!! My hubby said it just needs to be reset, but worried about taking it to dealer (they will want to charge me a fortune to verify everything was done right and just needs to be reset).
JJ


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## tamorgen (Dec 1, 2003)

*Re: (carpejr2)*

Ouch. Most of the time once those codes hit the ECU, they don't go away, even after the problem is corrected. How did you get the code to begin with? Do you have a VAG-COM? If so, you should be able to reset it. If the code comes back, then you know that your timing is still off.
I did mine this weekend as well. I was fortunate enough that everything went according to plan, with the exception of loosing a good portion of my power steering fluid. Now I need to either go to the stealership and pay $39.95 for a liter of Pentosin 11s, or wait it to come in from World Impex or ECS. Guess it all can't go perfect.


----------



## carpejr2 (Dec 31, 2007)

We took it to Autozone and they read the code, which said the belt slipped one tooth. How do I reset computer - can we do that ourselves or have to take it to the dealership (hope not)? If the code does not come back on, we would know it is now fixed.


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## carpejr2 (Dec 31, 2007)

I called Autozone this morning and they told me that I need to drive my Beetle for 30 to 50 miles and the computer will reset itself if the problem was corrected. I am curious to know if this is true or not?


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## lardstax (Aug 1, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

nice write up! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## slojetta03 (Mar 3, 2007)

*Re: (StoicDude)*

i lined mine up with the hash mark two teeth before the white mark and it runs great with no codes .... after i had to change it because the crank was marked wrong!!!


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## getabetterdub (Oct 6, 2005)

Just wondering something. When I did my TB change last weekend, I lined up the cam gear to TDC. But then the flywheel would be off (by less than a tooth). I know it was less than a tooth because I took the belt off and put it back on about 20 times trying to get it perfect







Anyways, its running good and no codes, just curious if anyone else had run into this.


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## SlyTDI (May 5, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Is replacing the timing tensioner and pulley required? If I am planning to replace the water pump and the timing belt only, what if any problems will I have?


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## ericj (Dec 6, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (SlyTDI)*

With a lot of help from some friends i got my water pump replaced over the weekend, along with the timing belt of course. 
Myself I'm a piker. I'm mechanically talented but don't spend much time working on cars. I was assisted by my friend Dan, who is an experienced shade tree mechanic, and my friend Roger, who is a master engine builder (works full time building engines at a machine shop). 
A few observations: 
1: It's mighty foolish not to drain the coolant before pulling the water pump. Honestly what's the idea? You only lose about half a cup of coolant pulling the pump if you drain it in the normal way before you start ripping things up. 
2: This DIY doesn't mention automatic transmissions at all. We wasted an hour and a half looking for a timing mark that does not exist on my car. There is no TDC mark on the 5-speed tiptronic flywheel. And of course there is no timing plug either - just a view port that is immediately visible after pulling the belly pan. 
3: It's not a sound shield, it's a splash guard. 10 minutes were lost to "what the heck does he mean by 'sound shield'? all i see is this ABS resin splash guard."
4: The motor mount bolts are not stretch bolts, and do not require replacement. I bought my parts locally (Parts For Imports on state street in Orem gave me a kickass deal on a nice german water pump w/ metal impeller) but nobody carries the engine mount bolts locally. Eventually I called the parts desk at Ken Garff VW/Audi in Orem, who told me that they do not stock the engine mount bolts because the factory manual does not recommend their replacement and their technicians always reuse them. And further that they are aware of the rumor that they are stretch bolts, but VW America disagrees. 
5: When marking the timing belt and the pulleys, use a color that clashes with the engine. Lacking white-out we used silver model paint. This was megastupid. The first time i got the tensioner mounted and went to check everything, it turned out that the belt had slipped two teeth while i was fighting with the tensioner, and this was not immediately obvious except on close inspection. If we'd used bright orange paint, it would have been more obvious. 
6: I say "the first time i got the tensioner mounted" because between myself and my friend, we mounted it three times. It turns out that there are at least two wrong positions for the motor mount to be in when you mount the tensioner. Guess how we know. Pay attention to where the motor mount will have to bolt down when you are bolting in the tensioner, and don't be afraid to raise and lower the engine a few inches to help you get things aligned. 
7: There must be a trick to getting the tensioner in place. I don't know what it is. Every time we got it mounted, it was an hour of fiddling and cursing followed by an unexpected and immediate snap into perfect position. WTF?! any ideas here? 
That's all I can think of right now. 
My water pump impeller failed due to, imho, a design defect. It's obvious that the impeller is molded directly onto the knurled steel spindle of the water pump. In my case, a tiny amount of rust formed between the impeller and the spindle, and this expansion was enough to break the impeller neatly in half in just 33,000 miles. It's obvious because much of the rust is stuck to the impeller parts. This is inexcusable, and if i ever visit germany I'm going to track down the engineer who made this decision and smack him around a bit.


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (ericj)*

its ok to just replace the timing belt only? Just making sure that all the timing is lined up?


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

I'm about 4-6 hours deep into the install. And I'm stuck now. I am in the process of putting the new belt on. The water pump is already installed and I'm iffy on the tensioner and the idler pulley. According to the guide it says to install the idler pulley first then the belt then the tensioner. But I tried that and couldn't do it so I installed the pulley then the tensioner. Now the belt is too tight. Any suggestions or possible faults in my plan?
Also, the motor mount, after being worked around 90% of the time thought it was an appropriate time to drop. Should I jam it back into approximate place before putting the belt on? I don't want to put the belt on then realize I have to take it off and feed the mount through again.
Thanks guys


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## getabetterdub (Oct 6, 2005)

*Re: (brandtson)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brandtson* »_I'm about 4-6 hours deep into the install. And I'm stuck now. I am in the process of putting the new belt on. The water pump is already installed and I'm iffy on the tensioner and the idler pulley. According to the guide it says to install the idler pulley first then the belt then the tensioner. But I tried that and couldn't do it so I installed the pulley then the tensioner. Now the belt is too tight. Any suggestions or possible faults in my plan?

When i did mine, i put the pulley and tensioner, then put the belt on using the "bicycle chain" method i.e. put the belt on the cam and water pump, over the pulley, then put the first few teeth on the crank and turn the crank, thereby engaging the other teeth.

_Quote, originally posted by *brandtson* »_Also, the motor mount, after being worked around 90% of the time thought it was an appropriate time to drop. Should I jam it back into approximate place before putting the belt on? I don't want to put the belt on then realize I have to take it off and feed the mount through again.
Thanks guys

I read in someone else's reply that you must put the motor mount back on before installing the tensioner, otherwise it will not go. I wouldn't know first hand since I kept mine in the entire time.
I realize that you are probably (hopefully) already finished, but perhaps this will help someone else.
Daniel


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

werd. i'll try the bicycle chain method. I was hesitant to do it last night because i was afraid I was going to shear the belt by doing that. But I'll give it a try. Thanks.


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (brandtson)*

im about 3 hours into the install, and we cant get the center bolt out, or 2 of the allen bolts out. Any tips?


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (MCSKIIER)*

i forgot to say its for the crankshaft pully. That has to come off right? From the way it sounded in the instructions it does.


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

the center bolt does not need to be removed. just the 4 allen bolts. are you using regular allen wrenches to remove the bolts? if so, go to sears or vatozone and get some sockets with hex drives on the end of it. if they still won't come out use the sockets on a breaker bar. if memory serves me right I think I used a 8-10 inch socket wrench and got it out relatively easy


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (brandtson)*

your lucky they came out that eay. The first time my dad rounded 2 of them off, we we welded an allen in there, and broke the allen off twice. THEY ARE IN THERE!


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

i'd say get a pair of bolt extractors from sears before it's too late.


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (brandtson)*

we hard extractors hopefully we will find something to work...


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## twocupsofbutter (Feb 5, 2008)

any info on installing a new camshaft seal while doing this? or did I miss it?


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## XClayX (Apr 30, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Would this work on a Passat 1.8t? I have Several Tbelt jobs coming up. A Buddy of mine is due in 5k. I'm at 45k but I might do it this summer. It's a 2001 low miles. Then my dad's TDI is at 12k but the way he's racking them up it will be due in a year.


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

try the soaking the bolts in penetrating liquid or hitting it with pb blaster before trying the extractors or welding something to the bolt again. if you're still stuck, it looks like you'll have to cut off the bolt head and drill out the bolt and then tap it.


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## twocupsofbutter (Feb 5, 2008)

anyone have a idea on where the timing plug is in a mkiv r32/20th anniversary?


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (twocupsofbutter)*

used some different extractors to get the 4 allen heads holing on the crank pully to get at the timing belt. Released the tensioner, and have the timing belt off. I marked up the new one and its ready to go. Hopefully the reinstall will be ok, i tried my best to keep things organized.


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## twocupsofbutter (Feb 5, 2008)

i am having trouble getting new belt back on is there a special secret i am unaware of? 
I am using the crank and cam gear TDC they should both be at the top of every send turn of the cam correct?


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (twocupsofbutter)*

im having the same problem right now. How does the timing pulley come off?? Need help asap!


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (MCSKIIER)*

by the way it was the ideler pulley, does this need to come off to get the belt back on? and then put back on?


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (MCSKIIER)*

heres where im at right now.
how does this come off? Would it make it easier to take this off, put the belt on and then put this pullwy back on. Are timing belts always really really hard to get on at first? I suppose the old one was stretched a little.


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (MCSKIIER)*

Bump before class!


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## getabetterdub (Oct 6, 2005)

*Re: (MCSKIIER)*

Don't take the pulley off. I used the 'bicycle chain' method and worked fine all the 13 times I put the belt on (wasn't sure about the timing). Put the belt on the cam gear, between the tensioner and pulley, and the other side over the water pump. Then get about two or three teeth around the crank. Use the 19mm 12point ratchet to turn the crank while holding the belt on it. It will advance the belt onto the crank. Double check after it's on to be sure your marks still line up (or ensure both the cam gear and flywheel are still both TDC).


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## twocupsofbutter (Feb 5, 2008)

I put the tensioner on last while some put tension on the crank gear up top. Mine crank gear jumped a few teeth after I removed the belt (this made things harder) Finally got it on after trying every imaginable way. 
I got my car back together runs good and check engine lights on , the engine is slightly louder and there is clicking noise (cant tell exactly where its coming from) now any ideas on what it might be?


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (twocupsofbutter)*

i did the "bicycle method" worked great! One big mistake i made was we put the timing belt back on, and for got about the motor mount. Had to pull the belt back off get the mount in there and put everything back together. Thanks for the tips.
As for the guy above me, your timing sounds off, it might be your pistons tapping your valves.


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## twocupsofbutter (Feb 5, 2008)

don't you think my engine light would have come on then or the car would not run well?
My marks lined up every second rotation(checked it twice)


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## VR6'D (Oct 5, 2005)

Nice DIY


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (VR6'D)*

oh from the way i read it it sounded like you do have a check engine light. idk... VW's tend to have noisier valves.


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## bootymac (Apr 19, 2005)

*Re: (MCSKIIER)*









I'm about half way through my change and this guide was great for referencing. I did a lot of the steps in different orders, but in the end it's the same difference. 
Just some stuff I noticed, for other members' reference:
1. For those who can't get the engine block portion of the motor mount, try lowering the engine and squeezing it out from below, in between the charge piping and tensioner. This was the only method that worked for me, and I'm not even sure how I'm going to put it back in








2. I had no problems removing my accessory belt tensioner [3x 13mm bolts] with a regular socket wrench, despite the guide suggesting a ratcheting wrench.
3. It's a good idea to drain your coolant before you start. With the coolant drained, you can also remove the coolant reservoir for extra working space by simply undoing two hoses from the reservoir if I remember correctly.
4. The harmonic balancer pulley [4x 6mm hex key bolts] is torqued on very tightly. I used a hex key and my tire iron as a breaker bar to get them off. Careful not to round off the bolts!
That's it for now. I'll try to finish the job up next weekend










_Modified by bootymac at 2:57 AM 2-10-2008_


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

i have everything installed but my dad thought it'd be a great idea to turn the crank and check if it was hitting anything and I didn't have time to check if the timing was straight.
i have the spark plugs out and every like 180~220 crank degrees it gets really hard to crank. do you think that's the crank hitting the valves? or is it the oil pump?


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (brandtson)*

mine is that way too, i think it might be where a piston is TDB. I started my car up for the first time yesterday after the belt instal, and it seems to be running fine.


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

never mind i'm retarded. it takes a lot of force to compress the valve springs so when you're turning the cam gear it's hard as hell to do.


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## 2002JettaMike (Jan 20, 2008)

*Re: (brandtson)*

I just finished this job this weekend. Great writeup and posts. It made the job so much easier.
I had the belt on 5 times before i was happy with it, using BOTH belt marks and cam/crank marking. Finally got both systems to agree belt was on correctly and locked her down by pulling the "pin".
I found the tensioner went in easier the same way it came out, pull the roller off, then install the tensioner. After fussing for a hour, i pulled the roller and the tensioner holes lined up. Use the side of a screwdriver to push the belt back to install the roller. 
I changed the thermostat and it's cover (?). The alternator fought me all the way, not wanting to go back on the car. This took 90 minutes.
All told, this took 12 hours, thermostat included.
But it ran fine, did 90 mph this evening and drove for 1 hour. No noises, no lights, no problems.
Thanks to everyone who contributed, I couldn't have done this without this writeup.
And I hope I helped someone as well.
Thanks


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## FitchHollister (Apr 28, 2004)

I'm with twocupsofbutter. Did anyone replace the crakshaft seal or camshaft seal? ECS sells both seals with the ultimate timing belt kit. Does anyone thingk this NEEDS to be done? Any inuput would be great.


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## MCSKIIER (Dec 1, 2007)

*Re: (FitchHollister)*

i didnt...


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## XClayX (Apr 30, 2005)

*Re: (MCSKIIER)*

Fill me in. Bicycle Chain method. Link>?

Also. Is this for ANY 1.8T I have a passat and jetta due. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Also. There wouldn't happen to be a Timing Chain Conversion for the 1.8t?


_Modified by XClayX at 10:14 PM 2-11-2008_


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

bicycle chain method: install the timing belt tensioner and the timing belt idler pulley, put the belt around the cam gear, water pump, and idler pulley, and put a few teeth on the crank gear. then turn the crank until the belt catches and seats itself. you may have to use the shaft of screwdriver to slightly twist the belt so it catches easier. once it fully seats, turn the crank in the opposite direction to make sure all the marks are lined up at TDC


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## brandtson (Jun 14, 2007)

one more thing, very very very doubtful there's a timing chain conversion. however if there is one, put me down for one, i never want to do that again.


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## bootymac (Apr 19, 2005)

*Re: (bootymac)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bootymac* »_
I'm about half way through my change and this guide was great for referencing. I did a lot of the steps in different orders, but in the end it's the same difference. 
Just some stuff I noticed, for other members' reference:
1. For those who can't get the engine block portion of the motor mount, try lowering the engine and squeezing it out from below, in between the charge piping and tensioner. This was the only method that worked for me, and I'm not even sure how I'm going to put it back in








2. I had no problems removing my accessory belt tensioner [3x 13mm bolts] with a regular socket wrench, despite the guide suggesting a ratcheting wrench.
3. It's a good idea to drain your coolant before you start. With the coolant drained, you can also remove the coolant reservoir for extra working space by simply undoing two hoses from the reservoir if I remember correctly.
4. The harmonic balancer pulley [4x 6mm hex key bolts] is torqued on very tightly. I used a hex key and my tire iron as a breaker bar to get them off. Careful not to round off the bolts!
That's it for now. I'll try to finish the job up next weekend










Got around to working on the timing belt again today. Removed and replaced the tensioner, idle pulley, waterpump, and of course the timing belt. Took a few hours of wrestling to get the tensioner in place, especially with the motor mount constantly in the way. The timing belt took longer than I expected to get on perfectly, but the bicycle chain method worked out for me, along with some improvising along the way (see below). Everything is lined up, and both crank and cam are at TDC, but I'm too scared to pull the tensioner pin








On a side note regarding the waterpump, my dad's 2000 2.0 AEG's waterpump impeller failed at 90000km (56000 miles). However, my 2000 1.8T AWD's impeller was perfectly fine at 85000km (53000 miles) and probably could've lasted a while longer. Strange.
Oh, and if you're putting the timing belt on and you're working by yourself, I found quick grip clamps to be extremely useful. Align the timing belt on the cam gear and lock it into place using a clamp, and repeat with the crank gear. The belt kept moving around as I was trying to line up the marks, and the clamps worked perfect.








Unfortunately I'm doing all the work myself as my friends don't like to get their hands dirty










_Modified by bootymac at 10:39 PM 2-16-2008_


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## FitchHollister (Apr 28, 2004)

Well, I just got done. I had difficulty getting the hose off of the oil cooler to drain the block so I had to take the water pump off without draining. I put a pan under it and caught all of the coolant. 
I bought the lightweight harmonic balancer but I didn't put it on. It serves a purpose and the loss in reliability does not outweigh the performance gain for me. 
There has been some debate about marking belt vs. using the marks on the flywheel and two pulleys to make sure the belt is put back on correctly. 
I did both and I am glad I did. It is easier to see TDC on the flywheel than on the camshaft gear. My camshaft gear moved a little and I caught it when I noticed the marks not lining up. Using both methods helped me out.

I bought the special tools to change the crankshaft seal and the camshaft seal and I ended not replacing them. The job was labor intensive enough and neither seal was leaking. I'll wait until the one of the seals leaks before replacement.
The write up was great and it helped a lot. Thanks for everyone's input.


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## sheimbach (Mar 12, 2006)

you will be pissed when the leak soon and you have to pull the belt off or worse yet have to buy a new belt because it got all oily


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## bootymac (Apr 19, 2005)

*Re: (bootymac)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bootymac* »_
Got around to working on the timing belt again today. Removed and replaced the tensioner, idle pulley, waterpump, and of course the timing belt. Took a few hours of wrestling to get the tensioner in place, especially with the motor mount constantly in the way. The timing belt took longer than I expected to get on perfectly, but the bicycle chain method worked out for me, along with some improvising along the way (see below). Everything is lined up, and both crank and cam are at TDC, but I'm too scared to pull the tensioner pin









Finished the deed today. Reinstalled everything and started it up with no problems! What a relief. I'll have to check for any fraying once I start driving again.
When reinstalling the metal timing belt covers, make sure the edges aren't close to the edge of the timing belt! I noticed mine were very close (almost touching) so I took them out and bent the edges outwards. 
Thanks to the OP and everyone that offered advice and help. My experience definitely wouldn't have been this smooth without this thread!


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## Vlkruzr01 (Feb 2, 2004)

*Re: (bootymac)*

used this DIY this weekend and got it done in just over 8 hr's. I used the ecs tuning kit. I ended up pulling the charge pipe off the turbo and managed to just rotate the motor mount back there without lifting the motor way up.


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## FitchHollister (Apr 28, 2004)

*Re: (bootymac)*

My edges were bent too. I've read all 500 pages of this DIY and I've seen it happen a few times. Hopefully people who plan to do this read this far down the thread.


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## complexe_GTI (Jun 12, 2007)

*Re: (FitchHollister)*

Ok..I have a question for you guys....Please bare with me, as I am still learning about these cars...-I have a 2002 GTI-....I recently had my timing belt go out on me while I was driving about 60mph, now I did the opposite of what your not supposed to when this happens....I tried to start my car several times once the belt broke on me (I didnt know it was the belt at the time)..








Now I got my timing belt and tensioner replaced, and my car still would not start.. My mechanic said that my valves are probably bent.
He mentioned I have 16 valves on the head..but the prices he mentioned me are kind of high...the 1st eight are about $100 each, and then next eight about $40 each.








Does this sound reasonable, or not?..Also what exactly is the name for these valves, and/or part number.
All help is greatly appreciated, and welcome to looking elsewhere on the forum, that providing the information needed..
Thanks!


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## FitchHollister (Apr 28, 2004)

*Re: (complexe_GTI)*

You have twenty valves. Five valves for each piston. You have three intake valves and two exhaust valves. This is the beauty of the 1.8T. Unless you need new valves. You should only have to replace the valves that were damaged.
Go to the link below and price intake and exhaust valves. They are about half way down the page. There are cheap and expensive ones of each.
http://www.ecstuning.com/stage...nical


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## FitchHollister (Apr 28, 2004)

*Re: (FitchHollister)*

Well, unless you have the VR6. Then you have 24 valves, two in two out. Either you can find replacement valves on ECS.


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## complexe_GTI (Jun 12, 2007)

*Re: (FitchHollister)*

Yea thanks man...Yea i heard that you dont have to change ALL the valves if just a couple are messed, just the ones that are need to be changed. So does this mean, that my mechanic doesnt know what he's talkin about?...Should I be worried into payin this guy money if he might not do it right?
I'm pretty sure being a mechanic he must know how to change them, its pretty much a straight forward thing if your a mechanic right?
...Thanks again for your help


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## sheimbach (Mar 12, 2006)

he might mean u have 16 bent valves, 4 of the intake valves dont normally bend


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## Jtgti18t (Jan 11, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

i just did my timing belt,water pump, and t-stat a week or two ago. this helped alot 
take your time and follow this step by step and everything should work out fine http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## complexe_GTI (Jun 12, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Jtgti18t)*

Yea thats probably what he meant, if your sayig 4 of them dont usually bend...we dont know for sure how many I bent, becuase we havent took it apart yet...thats just what he told me I could be facing!.... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
Yea im takin my time with this..cuz I dont want anything else to happen...its bad enough i gotta spend my taxes on this!!!!..
I saw on ECS tuning the valves and they arent that much...so hopefully everything will work out!!
Thanks again dudes!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## afholderman (Dec 3, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Did this yesterday, took 10 hours when upon hour 8 we started the car and had a massive coolant leak from the thermostat. After tearing that down and putting everything back together, I forgot to reconnect the n249 valve sensor, and thought all hell was going to break loose on my engine, luckily I figured it out and now all is well and running great.


----------



## mankongde (Mar 16, 2008)

Just did this job stretched into three days. Great DIY but the job its self is still a major pain. 
I'm pretty sure the car's previous owner never did the belt job. The car was running fine (except a whirring sound at about 3200 RPM that I took to be the Turbo) until the tensioner pulley just exploded; had burnt-out ball bearings all over the place >_<.
As much of a pain this job was and as pissed and frustrated as I got at the white-coats in Germany, I'm impressed that none of the valves got screwed up and it didn't skip a tooth after that pulley went. 
If I own the car for another 60k miles, I'll prolly find an indi shop to do it next time


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## Vr6Jamesgti (Apr 21, 2006)

*Re: (mankongde)*

any experience their belts showing signs of cracks with in a week after replacing the belt? I just did it...now i have to do it again.....I just checked it after a week, and i found 1 tiny crack on the belt.


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## gypsyjetta (Jun 25, 2006)

Ive got to taking the engine mount apart, but before I do this should the car be on four jack stands or can I jack the engine like I have it now with the front jacked up only.
If the answer is no where is a good point to jack and stand at the rear ? Sorry for the rudimentary question.


----------



## gypsyjetta (Jun 25, 2006)

*Re: (gypsyjetta)*

little help...


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## kamikaze2dope (Apr 26, 2003)

*Re: (gypsyjetta)*

You can and thats the way i did mine.
Jack stands up front (sub frame) and my jack to up and down the engine.
Over all the process you need to up and down the engine to gain access...
Just make sure to close the jack release valve correctly and to block the rear wheels.
GL

_Quote, originally posted by *gypsyjetta* »_Ive got to taking the engine mount apart, but before I do this should the car be on four jack stands or can I jack the engine like I have it now with the front jacked up only.
If the answer is no where is a good point to jack and stand at the rear ? Sorry for the rudimentary question.


----------



## gypsyjetta (Jun 25, 2006)

I started at dinner yesterday and got done at 4:18 this morning. Took my time and followed the instructions. I couldn't belive it when I got everythin g together and it started right up !
Oh, my water pump impeller was detatched and broke in pieces when touched.


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## mokiblue (Jun 14, 2005)

everything was so easy.... until I pulled the pin and noticed that I had left too much tension on the tensioner side and not enough on the water pump side... and the belt has slipped a tooth to the right on the cam gear, but nowhere else. 
now for the life of me I can't figure out how to recompress the tensioner with an m5 bolt and washer!?!?
Greatly appreciate any help.


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## 2002JettaMike (Jan 20, 2008)

*Re: (mokiblue)*

The tensioner has to come out and go in a Vice to compress it and get the spring back in it.
Or so I've heard. I've never done that. 
Good luck.


----------



## mokiblue (Jun 14, 2005)

*Re: compress timing belt tensioner*

wow, things are so much easier to see in the light of day.
the m5 bolt and washer fit right into that forked part on the large pully and down into the a threaded hole on the tensioner housing.
it's all good now. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## ruetzal (Dec 17, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

just saving this in my watched


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## RIVWMKIV (May 27, 2004)

Did mine a few days ago...some tips:
I removed my engine mount completely and had no problems getting it back in (it is so much easier with that thing outta the way!). All in all it is really pretty straight forward, just make sure to mark the belt to the crankshaft pulley and camshaft pulley (and don't play around with the pulleys at TDC, that is just asking for trouble). And another suggestion, wear mechanic gloves!!! My hands had hundreds of little tiny cuts on the backs of them.

Also, use a torque wrench where applicable, the parts you will be messing with require proper torque as they are very vital parts that you don't want becoming loose or to tight!

edit: and the clamp suggestion further up in this thread was an excellent idea, if it's just you working on it, the clamps are essential to hold the belt where you want it to stay...
Here is the basic install that I used:
I put the belt and the tensioner on, lined up the marks (belt to pulley marks), clamped the belt in place on the camshaft pulley, wedged a screw driver wrapped in a rag in the crankshaft pulley and then installed the idler pulley by sorta getting the belt half on it, and then positioning it on the tensioner and then bolted it on and then after triple checking the belt marks THEN pulled the pin. All this while the engine was jacked up and the overflow tank and motor mount completely removed.
The whole process took me about 6 hours (first time) although I did not replace the thermostat. It is so straight forward though I'm sure I could do it in 4 hours the next time without rushing.
There is no way I would trust anyone but myself with a job like this, I care about my car, some random mechanic does not. I will do it again without hesitation in another 60,000 miles.
Any questions, just ask I will walk you through it! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 



_Modified by RIVWMKIV at 9:54 AM 4-11-2008_


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## Nihilator (Nov 6, 2004)

*Re: (RIVWMKIV)*

Did mine on Tuesday night through Wednesday morning. *That* was a long job. It took me a lot longer than expected, and I must say that swapping Climatronic into my car was less of a pain...figuratively and literally.
A question: When you pull the pin from the tensioner, should the tensioner snap forward? I ask because when I pulled the pin (an apt phrasing), there was absolutely no resistance to it coming out. In fact, I was able to slide it back in and out without problem. I was surprised because I thought the tensioner would snap forward and put pressure on the idler pulley.
When just playing around with the tensioner before installing it, I *did* feel resistance when pulling on the pin (testing it to see how much I had to worry about accidentally pulling it out), just so you know the tensioner was good to begin with. I guess.
--Chris


----------



## vdubN228 (Aug 14, 2006)

*Re: (groggory)*


----------



## vukmad1 (Apr 24, 2007)

*Re: (RIVWMKIV)*

Just finished a couple hours ago. Had everything in place but couldn't fit the mount back in. (my neighbor decided to "help" while I wasn't there, I didn't want the mount out, because I had read a previous post by someone who experienced this exact problem) I had to take out the tensioner, put the mount back in, and then do it over. 
So my question to you is, how did you put the mount back in with the belt in place? Jack the engine way up? I wasn't comfortable doing that but I don't know how else it's possible....


----------



## vukmad1 (Apr 24, 2007)

*Re: (vukmad1)*

Nevermind....I just re-read this entire thread and I see someone already posted the answer. Something about using two jacks to tilt the motor. Thanks anyway.


----------



## rono1 (Apr 23, 2002)

*Re: (vukmad1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vukmad1* »_Nevermind....I just re-read this entire thread and I see someone already posted the answer. Something about using two jacks to tilt the motor. Thanks anyway.


yup. undo the tranny side mount and tilt.. piece of cake. 
oh btw. my oem belt had not one crack, nothing. it could of gone to 100k+. 
IMO. If your snapping timing belts, you way to jerky on launches, downshifting, upshifting, etc.


----------



## vukmad1 (Apr 24, 2007)

*Re: (rono1)*

Same here - belt might have lasted even 150k ( I'm at 85k now) but I didn't want to take any chances....not with the potential for messing up all the valves and everything. Anyway, now I got the new water pump as well.


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## FaelinGL (Nov 28, 2004)

*Re: (vukmad1)*

Just finished this last night. After having done two timing chain replacements on VR's, I can say that the 1.8t is not nearly as hard, but it is much more frustrating and time consuming. Getting from step to step simply took longer. Places where we spent a lot of time:
1) Removing the timing belt. We fiddled around with the M5 bolt for about 15 minutes before we just decided to remove the idler pulley. Then the belt came right out.
2) The T-stat housing. I don't know how you guys removed that bottom bolt, but even with the alternator slide to the front, we wrestled with that bolt for a good 2 hours, both in removing and installing.
3) The alternator. Until we put a pair of vice-grips on the rusted bushings and pressed them to the side, we couldn't get it back on. Another hour there.
All in all, I could probably do the next one in half the time, but I'm not exactly looking forward to it!


----------



## ruetzal (Dec 17, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

saving this one


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## Hirobo (Nov 18, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Great DIY just used it this weekend http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif The only pita i found was the engine mount and lack of space







I cant beleave how cheap the stock water pump was mine was broken in half both pieces where sitting in the block







my two cents to anyone trying to do this, is to make sure you have a friend help you it makes it alot easier. and make sure you have alot of patience, and know when to walk away when you get frustrated. cause there are alot of times that you will want to say why did i start this or why can't i get this [email protected]#@!# part in there LOL. other than that it is not so bad.


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## airspeed (May 25, 2008)

*This is a great DIY writeup and thread!*

I just finished it last night on my 225 hp roadster.
A couple of thoughts and a tip or two...
You have to give credit where credit is due - someone in the Audi design department really has a wicked sense of humor!







Who ever came up with that engine mount (a.k.a. "The Evil Thing", or "TET") - man, that was wicked!!!!
It does come out - EXACTLY WHEN YOU NO LONGER NEED IT TO COME OUT! What a winner! I sat there a couple of times and actually cracked up at the whole thing - thanks to this thread, I was emotionally prepared, and took it somewhat with ease, but also with awe and amazement!
So here is a tip when putting the IQ Test/Puzzle back together again: Imagine TET never being fully removed (the Bentley manual assumes working around it. Though watch it - when the belt, pin-pull detonator, etc are all gone, it may actually fall out, and if you are below the car, land on your nose with unfortunate consequences...) So The Evil Thing needs to be back in its quarters, though loose, BEFORE you put in the new pull-pin, belt, etc. Sequence is extremely important in this. One way to do this practically, without a second pair of hands, is BY STICKING AN ALLEN WRENCH INTO THE LOWEST SCREW HOLE OF THE TET, ALL THE WAY THROUGH TO THE ASSIGNED SCREW HOLE IN THE BLOCK. This will keep the evil thing in exactly the position it needs to be, and loosely so, allowing you to do the rest of the job.
Other notes: I found no frozen or seized bolts whatsoever - this may have been the first for me on any car I have ever worked on. Kudos to Audi for that. However, putting in the chassis side of the engine mount ended up being more difficult, partially because of the alignment, but also because the new bolts felt like they were stripping the thread as if going in crooked, which they were not. It took a lot of torque (too much in my taste) to get them in, but in the end they were good - torqued down to the right value, and flush.
YOU HAVE TO HAVE A SENSE OF HUMOR TO DO THIS JOB - OTHERWISE YOU'LL END UP IN A STRAIGHTJACKED!


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## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: This is a great DIY writeup and thread! (airspeed)*

I just got around to doing mine today, about 10 hours with 2 of them for running out 3 times for allen sockets and lunch:laugh: 
All in all it was fairly straight forward, and yes the engine mount was a hassle. I opted to leave it in there and work around it, but when it came time to put it back into place it wouldn't get by the water pump part that sticks out, so i had to redo a few things and hold the mount in place and installing the new tensioner pulley.
I used the PD Performance kit that eliminates the hydralic tensioner and uses the older 8v & 16v version of just a pulley and bolt.
I have almost 106,00 miles on the original setup, and no i am not crazy. I did 5k mile checks for wear on the belt and prayed that the water pump was ok, it was. The impeller was in excellent condition and looked new to me, but swapped it out for a metal impeller unit. The timing belt itself was in excellent condition with no cracks or odd wear.
I guess the only thing that could have gone wrong was with the tensioner itself, but even that seemed fine. I like playing against the devil.


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## 1.8tNdahaus (Jan 14, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

now i think i can do it


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## the_journalist (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (1.8tNdahaus)*

Another tip:
While doing the job, it's a perfect excuse to pull the throttle body for a good cleaning. I've done this on the last five timing belt jobs I've done on my cars and for friends. Having it out gives you a little extra room to work as well, especially if you are replacing the thermostat. To clean it, just use your finger to push the butterfly open and use a rag with some carb cleaner to wipe the goo out of there. A new gasket is just over a dollar.


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## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (1.8tNdahaus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.8tNdahaus* »_now i think i can do it

I used some nail polish to mark through the side of the belt and onto the cam pulley and did the same at the crank gear, twice. When i released the tension, the cam gear did move back one tooth, and when installing the new belt with the transfered marks, i set it straight by using a 13mm wrench and turning the cam gear forward one tooth.


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## PhilW (Jan 3, 2006)

Whats the best way to release the tension on the belt, my belt is out a tooth on the crank gear and needs to rotate. The pin has been pulled as well.


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## airspeed (May 25, 2008)

*Re: (PhilW)*

I haven't had to do this, but others on this thread have taken the entire assembly out again, put it in a vice to compress the tensioner, and re-inserted the pin.
I also suspect the m5/55 sud method might work, though in order to remove the belt and my old tensioner (which I was not re-using), instead of compressing the tensioner I simply removed the to be discarded small tensioner roller.
One other note to people planning this: I bought a kit from Blauvergnügen (www.blauparts.com), including a special tool rental that was about $40. With these tools I was able to replace the camshaft oil seal while I was in there, because it was leaking. I found the crank seal to be ok, and did not disturb it, but the kit did come with a new seal for that too, so I could have done it as part of the job. The rest of kit included the standard - improved water pump, tensioner assembly, etc. It also came with a new thermostat and housing, but having read that the thermostat is rarely a problem I also left this undisturbed.


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## 03GTIK04 (Dec 2, 2007)

so in short...what are the main things im looking to line up ? and if the pulleys are lined up the belt shouldnt matter ?


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## whiskeyDog3 (Sep 29, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Im still unclear on how exactly to line up the markings for TDC. I believe that I use the wrench to turn the center of the crank pulley and then look for markings on the flywheel and cam? Which markings precisely and how? Sorry for the ignorance Im an amateur.


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## billibum (Jun 19, 2008)

now i think i can do it . Thanks for the information.


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## 73sinistervw (Sep 21, 2005)

Excelent Writeup! just got done with the teardown part of everything on my friends 01 Beetle.
H20 pump was broken, but all pieces were there!
The tensioner was shot!!! I had 3/4" of timing belt deflection on the cam/ pump side!
Timing was still on luckily!
Just waiting on parts from MJM!


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## jduarte (Sep 5, 2006)

*Re: (73sinistervw)*

Just replaced mine yesterday. Ran the car on a test drive, went to my parents, then went home for the night (about 15mi total). Started it this morning and got a check engine light. Did it jump a tooth overnight? I need to do the plugs and oil as well, but I doubt that's what's causing the light...any ideas?


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## ejg3855 (Sep 23, 2004)

Thank You Sir.


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## Rabbit Farmer (Sep 22, 2003)

*Re: (billibum)*


_Quote »_Im still unclear on how exactly to line up the markings for TDC. I believe that I use the wrench to turn the center of the crank pulley and then look for markings on the flywheel and cam? Which markings precisely and how? Sorry for the ignorance Im an amateur.

There are three marks to work with. 
Camshaft (1.8t): There is a mark on the cam sprocket which should be aligned with the hashmark on the valve cover.
Crank: If you have a stock flywheel (or an after-market flywheel with a proper mark) you can open the rubber door over the timing mark (on the transmission) to align the mark on the flywheel with the arrow on the transmission. OR.... if you do not have a flywheel with a mark, you can remove the alternator belt (S-belt) and align the hard to see mark on the inner edge of the crack pulley with the mark on the timing belt cover. This requires you to lay on your back under a jacked up car with flashlight and mirror to see the marks on the top of the wheel. Once you line up those marks, make sure to make a TDC mark on your flywheel.
Steve


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## Barca19 (Oct 19, 2007)

quick question:
Would you recommend I attempt this? I've read this whole thread and I *think* I can do this. However I have limited experience. Previous jobs include changing oil; spark plugs/coil packs and oxygen sensor. I am pretty good with tools but again I am inexperienced. I just want to know whether I should attempt this.
Thanks.


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## Rabbit Farmer (Sep 22, 2003)

*Re: (Barca19)*

If you know what you are doing you will save yourself money. If you don't, an engine is very expensive.


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## VWAUDITEK (Dec 26, 2006)

*Re: (billibum)*

This may sound negative,and I apologise if it comes off that way......however I see this thread doing more harm than good..
It seems to be giving a lot of people a false sense of confidence in undertaking a job such as this.
I understand it is not rocket science,however it is a job that requires everything be done PERFECTLY and with some of the posts I have read I am laughing and cringing at the same time at the thought of people doing this job and fubar-ing their motors.
This is a 2 hour job for me,I use a lift and a engine support bar and have NEVER mis-timed a 1.8T timing belt,however when reading posts like "the spark plugs are out,but it gets difficult to turn every 180 -200 degrees".....







That is your valves hitting your pistons buddy!
Some guys were never meant to be mechanics,just because you are computer savvy and can read posts on the internet does not mean you have instant skillz........good luck!










_Modified by VWAUDITEK at 7:15 PM 7-1-2008_


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## Rabbit Farmer (Sep 22, 2003)

*Re: (VWAUDITEK)*

I completely agree. It is cheaper to spend more money to let a mechanic who knows what he is doing than to replace an engine.


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## bodyboarder20 (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

A HUGE thanks to Tim_1.8T for such a great write up! Got the Ultimate Timing Kit from ECS Tuning and did the job today in roughly 10 hours.... along with a coolant flange and some other stuff too :-D

My 337 is now a happy 337! Much quieter too :-D


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## jaks1.8t (Jul 27, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

just a quick thank you for this thread. i was able to get mine done in about three to four hours! after reading this i could actually see where things could or would go wrong as i went along. Thanx again!


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## stevec1.8t (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

ive been lookin for one of these but ever since my friend messed his car up doin it him self im to scared lol call me a chicken..


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## Herman01 (Aug 25, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Does any one know if this timing belt DIY would carry over for a 2002 tdi engine?
where would I also find torque specs for the tdi engine?
Thanks
Herman


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## red_rock_beetle (Sep 9, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Herman01)*

































































COMPLEATLY DIFFERENT!!

how long do you think it would take? i'm a little gun shy because last time i had to do it its because it sheered the teeth off the old belt








and it took a couple weeks after school and waiting for parts, so how long did it take you?
how diffrent would it be on an '02 a4? thanks


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (red_rock_beetle)*

The engine faces a different way, check for a longitudinal DIY...there has to be one out there...


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## Corradodave (Feb 18, 2002)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (l88m22vette)*

I have also just completed the entire procedure with the dieselgeek kit. A total of 12.75 hours. The main problems were the motor mount and getting the timing belt on. I used the bicycle chain method of belt installation (last resort as it was impossible to get the belt on any other way), everything lined up the first time, it started right up and no problems so far. I would highly recommend the diesel geek kit over others as it comes with a set of extractor screws to remove the water pump. This made it a easy job to remove it with no damage to the pump or threads to the block. 80,000 miles on the car, original timing belt in excellent shape, water pump had no impeller damage.


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## r_wiggum01 (Jan 1, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Corradodave)*

so i started attempting this job today, and I think I may have effed myself. I began to crank the crank pulley to TDC to make sure the cam gear lined up before I removed the old belt. The belt seemed to have gotten caught on the engine mount(which i was trying unsuccessfully to hold out of the way). the cam gear mark is now WAY off when the crank is lined up. if i hand-turn the crank and cam gear slowly once the belt is off to get them lined up again, am i still likely to bend the valves? is there another safe way to get them lined up again, or is this engine doomed? any help would be appreciated.


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## zeusenergy (Feb 25, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (r_wiggum01)*


_Quote, originally posted by *r_wiggum01* »_so i started attempting this job today, and I think I may have effed myself. I began to crank the crank pulley to TDC to make sure the cam gear lined up before I removed the old belt. The belt seemed to have gotten caught on the engine mount(which i was trying unsuccessfully to hold out of the way). the cam gear mark is now WAY off when the crank is lined up. if i hand-turn the crank and cam gear slowly once the belt is off to get them lined up again, am i still likely to bend the valves? is there another safe way to get them lined up again, or is this engine doomed? any help would be appreciated.

Another dissatisfied engine mount positioner. Check my sig for an easy engine mount moving trick, for all others wanting to DIY it's a huge help. Click on Timing Belt DIY below...


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## zeusenergy (Feb 25, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (r_wiggum01)*

Slight movements on either cam or crank can be done when they are not in time. Be gentle and take your time. It can't be too far off, and you will be okay at hand-cranking speed.


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## pressed (Jul 16, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

In hopes of clearing up any fog around the crank pully bolt/four allen bolts that do...or do not have to be removed.
The sprocket does not need to be removed from the crank pully, just the four allens.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...54776
Nice write-up. The allen in the tensioner hole helped tremendously. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by pressed at 6:56 PM 9-19-2008_


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## steve05ram360 (Aug 14, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (pressed)*

if swapping the crank seal would I need a puller to pull the crank sprocket? 
In the middle of getting the tb swapped and may just swap the seal(s) while I'm at it. Overall this job is not difficult if you have the right tools. I havent run into anything yet relating to the tb swap that would cause a







situation. I did yank the intake and found some previous wrencher decided it was a good thing to run the map sensor connector thru the fuel rail







a quick disassembly of the headlight & bumper allowed me to gain access to it (audi tt).
Having the jetta to continue to commute in is allowing me to take my time on this swap so I'm in no hurry here. (that's a 1st...)


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## vdubN228 (Aug 14, 2006)

Thanks for the write up.


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## dubsee (Aug 23, 2008)

*Re: (vdubN228)*

i just finished this on my car. About to do this again tomorrow for a friend. the problem i ran into was the engine mount. did you guys bolt up the tensioner first or the engine mount?


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## elrich_d (Aug 6, 2008)

*Re: (dubsee)*

is it necessary to crank the eng again (step 17) after putting on the new belt. i dont get why this is necessary seeing that we cranked the eng to TDC before removing the original belt.
hope that makes sense


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## Red MK4_GLI (Dec 25, 2007)

*Re: (elrich_d)*

Not so sure its necessary, I think that step is more or less a fail-safe just to ensure that the marks line up properly before putting everything back together. If you crank the engine over a couple times and the marks all line up every full crank around, then you know youre on time.
I just did my timing belt Friday, and I didnt need this DIY, though I was planning to use it. Luckily I had the help of someone to guide me through it, though he actually ended up doing most of it himself. I got a CEL the day after I had it done (after about 200 miles) and had it cleared at Autozone, and so far its been fine http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif No more CEL.
Thanks for the great write-up. If I ever attempt this myself without guidance, which I may the next time around, Ill definitely use this for guidance


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## forced fed (Mar 16, 2000)

*Re: (Red MK4_GLI)*

Thanks for the guide http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Just finished and it was spot on.


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## EF9Si (Dec 12, 2003)

*Re: (forced fed)*

Easy cake, did t-belt twice in one day!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







Just make sure all the timing are dead on and cyl 1 is in TDC! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 4runner1988 (Oct 30, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

About how long did it take you to complete this job. BTW thanks for the great write up!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## MilanoMike (Mar 5, 2000)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (4runner1988)*

Well I finally completed the timing belt and water pump swap out on my AWD engine. Recall, I originally posted a few months back cause I could not get the mount out. I threw in the towel at that time and regrouped. This time I used the Harbor Freight engine support tool (50 bucks and well worth it as the engine can't slip or anything). Anyway here's a rundown of the job, adding info about the mount and belt to help what's already been written. FWIW, I've done quite a bit of wrenching over the years, numerous belts, a few engine builds etc, but I still needed a 3rd hand, who was also an experienced wrench turner.
In my opinion, this is not the timing belt job for a first timer, those that think they understand engine timing, but don't or those in a hurry. VW tech's do the job in 2 hours, but they do 10 a week, we do one, maybe 2 of these over the life of the car, so figure on 10 hours give or take. I broke it up over several nights along a week, but then I have a back up car. Again, if you do not understand engines, pay someone to do it, or you'll pay big time.
Basically follow the write-up, but here's some extra info:
- I raised the engine as high as it would go and the stupid oversized mount still would not come out of my car, yours may be different. Lowering it was worse, so I raised it up all the way and loosened, but did not remove the 2 tranny mount bolts. This gave me another 1/2 inch or so and did the trick. Also, remove the intercooler duct (just the flexible piece, no need to unbolt the hard duct). With the duct out and the tranny mount loose it takes about 5 mins to remove or take out the mount (does not count installing/removing the bolts). No need to attempt job with mount in, that would be an unbelievable pain.
- With mount out, life is good, you've got a straight shot at the belt. Do you need to mark it with paint, no, but I'll explain why it's good to do for the guy/gal who doesn't earn their living doing VW/Audi timing belts. The damn sprocket (crank) will move, it's nice to know you have the crank to cam relationship spot on. So, first rotate engine to TDC (line up flywheel mark and cam sprocket with cam cover). On my AWD, when the crank was lined up at the flywheel, the cam mark was dead nuts with the mark on the cover, not even off a tick. Is this necessary, not really, is it a best practice for the DIY'er, maybe, why take a chance, your in for 10 hours, what a few more minutes. Next, mark the cam/belt (I did 2 teeth several teeth apart bracketing the mark on the pulley), then mark the crank pulley/belt.
- Remove the little tensioner wheel or just remove the whole tensioner, note that the old belt has stretched. On my AWD, I had about a middle finger thickness (smallish hands) of the hydraulic piston extended (finger between tensioner body and idler wheel bracket). Take belt off, carefully mark new belt after carefully counting the teeth on the belt, maybe do this 3X if your wrapped around the axle like me and my helper wrench. Remember, your messing with your engine timing, so it must be correct, or else.
- Do the water pump, yada, yada, see write up/bentley book, etc. for this.
- Reinstall belt, button up and drive away..,,LOL. You will find as others have reported that the new belt seems a tick short (recall comment above about belt stretch). Here's is why you marked the new belt, this ensures the cam to crank relationship is not changed (trust me, as many on this forum have learned, changing the relationship will cost you some money). Start from cam, down to water pump and then to crank, you may find that the crank sprocket has to move 1/2 a tooth or less (don't worry), just keep the marks you made on the new belt at the proper location on each sprocket. 
- I could not get the belt on with the idler pulley in the way, so I held the belt and installed the pulley, then had wrench #2 hold the pulley in place, while I installed the hydraulic tensioner. Put one bolt in first and pivot it into position with the piston underneath the idler pulley bracket and put in second bolt. You should be at most 1/2 tooth off, trust me your about there. Torque/tighten everything properly at this point (tensioner bolts, idler whell allen bolt). At this point the belt will be quite tight, at least it was on my AWD engine, pulling the pin clearly wouldn't do anything (I was worried about the pin/piston causing problems, but it doesn't). Rotate the crank 720 degrees (2 rotations), set crank at mark on flywheel end and you will see the cam mark is dead nuts with the mark on the cover. Note, if on your car the belt isn't tight after installing all bits and pieces, you may need to pull the pin first, but from what I've read here, the damn thing will be tight. After the full rotation I pulled the pin, no loud bang, no movement, nothing, done. I rotated again just to be sure, recall comment about wrapped around the axle. It was dead nuts lined up. Keep in mind the hydraulic tensioner also allows for expansion/contraction of everything.
- Your there, reinstall mount, note that to remove mount you generally rotate aft and then rotate it past the power steering line and out the bottom. A bit of a pain, but doable once you realize how to do it. Start at bottom and fit between hard lines and block, rotate into position, making sure you don't catch/nick the belt while installing the ignorant mount. I've worked on lots of cars over the years and as an engineer, I've got to wonder what they were thinking. Anyway, button it up as the DIY says and go. This job is 900 - 950 in my area, so I saved an easy 600 bucks.
Hope this helps someone,
Mike


----------



## brian1973 (Aug 17, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (MilanoMike)*

my god this thread is way too long for a timing belt DIY!!!!! lol. just look at the pictures people.


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (MilanoMike)*

As an ME in New England, I have to concur with your comments. What were they thinking with this design? Service is not easy. It pays to have a little wrench experience and a decent tool box to get this job done without driving yourself insane.
I bought the full timing belt service kit from blauparts and did this job on my brother in law's Jetta 1.8T. I had previously done the timing belt on my Audi 1.8T and quite frankly i thought that was an easier job due to the longitudinal orientation of the engine (even though it required putting the car into the service position).
A couple of pointers:
For belt alignment, I lined up the marks on the camshaft housing and camshaft pulley. Then I lined up the mark on the crank harmonic balancer with the indent mark on the lower metal cover. They line up perfectly if you are careful. I also recommend marking your old belt prior to removal so that you can double check your work. Take your time with this. You don't want to mess up and be off one tooth and then have to tear everything all apart to fix your work.
Special tools:
The 13mm ratcheting wrench did help a bit although you can access the serpentine belt tensioner bolts with a regular 13mm socket once you remove the engine mount. A full set of deep sockets will help with some of the more 'challenging' bolt locations.
Time:
If you replace your timing belt & tensioner components along with your water pump & thermostat, the job will take about 6 hours. You can do it in 4 hours if you have done this job before and you have no setbacks, but you will be moving pretty quick.
The pictures from the orignal poster and the tips were excellent. This is a great DIY thread. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## rusak (Dec 2, 2008)

*lack of compression*

Ok, i got a 03 beetle 1.8T
just did a head gasket job on it, 
ong story short, i believe my timing jumped after an attempt to start the car.
now i have reset the timing belt and all the marks in the right place, BUT I HAVE NO COMPRESSION. i believe that can mean only two things,,, timing not correct or bent valves.. (sure hope its first)
here are the questions!!
1. the timing mark on the cam pulley, is it the notch on the side of the pulley?? (i also have couple paint marks on the pulley in different place)
2. will valves bend on these engines if timing jumps??
any help is appreciated.


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## slow85golf (Sep 17, 2006)

*Re: lack of compression (rusak)*

I would like to know if anyone has done the timing belt with the motor mount out of the car then install the motor mount after having the timing belt tensioner bolted up? and if so how high did you jack the motor up thanks


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## MilanoMike (Mar 5, 2000)

*Re: lack of compression (slow85golf)*

My post, which is a couple of posts before yours, tells you exactly what I had to do to get the mount out. Remove the intercooler rubber duct and loosen, but don't remove the 2 bolts holding the tranny mount. The mount will come. Much easier without mount in the way.
Mike


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## MilanoMike (Mar 5, 2000)

*Re: lack of compression (rusak)*

If the belt jumped when you started the car (not sure how that would happen as the belt is tight on the sprockets), you bent valves. If you incorrectly timed the engine (numerous teeth off) and started the engine, you bent valves. If you have no compression in one or more cylinders, and you know the engine is timed correctly, you bent valves. Use camshaft pulley and flywheel mark to check timing. Hope it all works out, but it doesn't look good.
Mike


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## rusak (Dec 2, 2008)

*Re: lack of compression (MilanoMike)*

the way my timing jumped is, a washer accidently fell into the timing belt/ crank pulley area and when i tried to start it, it got in between the belt and crank pulley, but it looks like it only jumped one tooth.
what scares me is now that i got timing belt off and before i put the new one on,, i could turn crank with just one hand
i wonder if the chain between cams could jump when i had cylinder head off, because it is tightened by oil pressure.
when i put everything together, with the new belt and everything aligned, tried to start it again,,,, it just spins, doesnt even think about catching/ starting, i checked for spark/ fuel,,, both are present


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

*Re: lack of compression (rusak)*

If it only skipped one tooth it is unlikely that you did any valve damage. Ensure that you are truly in time. You have 3 timing marks to work with:
1. align the notch on the cam pulley w/ the notched line on the valve cover
2. align the notch on the crank pulley w/ the indent on the lower timing belt cover
3. pull the rubber plug on the transmission so you can see the notch on your flywheel
All 3 of these will be perfectly aligned at Top Dead Center.
I have done a couple of these timing belt jobs and the markings can be slightly different on different model years, BUT they all align at TDC, regardless. I did an '00 ATW engine Audi and the timing cover was plastic w/ an arrow marking that aligns w/ the crank pulley. I did an '04 Jetta 1.8T and the cover was metal with an indent that aligns w/ the crank pulley.
I would check the timing of your cam chains. It sounds like that is where you have a problem. It is possible that the chains between the two cams got out of synch when the head gasket was replaced.



_Modified by olaf at 5:23 PM 12-3-2008_


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## rusak (Dec 2, 2008)

*Re: lack of compression (olaf)*

alrigh, i didnt check the flywheel mark, but i will now
and if thats correct, i'll pull it apart and check my cam markings.
thanks for the advice! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

*Re: lack of compression (rusak)*

I really don't think you bent any valves because usually when that happens things get very rough or even seize and this is accompanied by loud noises. It sounds like metal slamming into metal. You'd know.
If you dropped the washer from the tensioner roller, I have had that happen before too.







You have to get it out of there. 
If you did somehow manage to bend the valves at start-up, you probably did very minor damage as the car was not running. These cars can be off by as much as several teeth before the interference occurs. In fact, after reading so many of the prior posts of people have CE light problems after their timing belt job, I would bet they are off by 1-2 teeth and that is why the car is not running perfectly smooth.
The car should start right up just like normal after a timing belt job w/ no CEL.


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## rusak (Dec 2, 2008)

*Re: lack of compression (olaf)*

man i looked all over for the flywheel plug to align the mark on the flywheel, the only thing i found is a plug on the bottom and it looks like it just to take off bolts that bolt flywheel to torque converter didnt see any marks. i'll look some more, but i'm assuming if my first cylinder is at TDC and my crank and cam marks align, then my flywheel mark should automatically be aligned....i'll also be checking cam chain to see if it skipped.
Thanks!


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

*Re: lack of compression (rusak)*

Look at the picture under step #5 of this thread on the first page. The plug is rubber and it is on the driver's side of the car on the bell housing. You don't need to remove anything to get at it and you can pull it out with your fingers. You can see it by looking down into the engine bay near the transmission and engine interface from the driver's side of the car. It is a bit difficult to see the mark (use a flashlight), but you will be able to see into the housing if you look carefully.
Provided you have mounted the crank pulley onto the crank properly and the marks line up with the cover, your flywheel will be aligned. I assume you have never removed your flywheel. Double check that your have your crank pulley properly aligned. There are two holes in between the four mounting holes for the M6 bolts. They should line up with the pin and marking on your crank.
My bet is that your cams are off. It is also possible that everything is okay and that you have an electrical problem or something?!


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## rusak (Dec 2, 2008)

*Re: lack of compression (olaf)*








Bent valves on every cylinder








might be easier/ cheaper to replace the head..


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## rusak (Dec 2, 2008)

*Re: lack of compression (rusak)*

i installed new head gasket and cylinder head bolts, tightened the head down and assembeled everything... could not start the car, now i need to take it apart again, do i need to get new head gasket and bolts again? or can i use those from previous?


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## skisoccer13 (Jun 1, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Well I just finished up this DIY and it worked successfully so far (the card started up and nothing unusual happened). I did a couple of things differently though.
Because I reused the old idler pulley and timing belt tensioner I followed these steps to get the belt, idler pulley, tensioner on:
1. Put on the timing belt around the crank gear, cam gear, and harmonic balancer.
2. Put on the idler pulley.
3. After compressing the piston with a c-clamp, put on the timing belt tensioner (the 2 bolts) but not the tensioner pulley just yet.
4. Now put on the tensioner pulley.
I found it much easier to align the 2 bolts holding on the tensioner without the pulley on it. The pulley is easily put on but pulling the belt back a little bit.
I don't know if this is standard procedure but it worked for me. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

_Modified by skisoccer13 at 10:23 PM 12-28-2008_


_Modified by skisoccer13 at 10:24 PM 12-28-2008_


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## shwinbmx321 (Dec 23, 2008)

*While im doing this...*

About to encounter this timing belt on my own but just a quick question... any bolt on mods recommended to do while i have some of this apart? ex. pancake pipe replaced...


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## cmitchelli (Jan 10, 2005)

This is the second attenpt at installing a timing belt. Why it is so difficult to get the belt on the cam sprocket?? A friend and I literally had to pry the Effer on the sprocket. I hate these bastards so much. Do they ever slide on for any of you guys?? Are there any tips to simplify the installation of the belt???


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## NEP (Sep 12, 2003)

*Re: (groggory)*

danke, will be using this.


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## vee_dubb_gti (Nov 17, 2004)

*Re: (NEP)*

G please dont screw up... you wouldnt want to buy a new head!


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## victor great (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

your the greatest








saved me $800


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## wowie81 (Jan 4, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Does anyone think you should change the camshaft seal when your in there? 
I have to do the water pump this weekend, car has 95000 on it, wondering if i should just do the seals too? 
Is there any thread on timing besides the mark and macth system?


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## wowie81 (Jan 4, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wowie81)*

bump


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wowie81)*

I didn't change mine at 85k. If it is leaking then change it for sure. If it looks dry (or close to dry) I recommend that you leave it alone. You can mess up those seals if you do not use the proper installation tools and if you do not properly seat the seal. You can probably get away with leaving it alone this time and make a note that you will want to replace it the next time around (after another 60-80k, your choice).


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## Burnitwithfire (May 14, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wowie81)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wowie81* »_Does anyone think you should change the camshaft seal when your in there? 
I have to do the water pump this weekend, car has 95000 on it, wondering if i should just do the seals too? 
Is there any thread on timing besides the mark and macth system? 

When I did the TB on my old 1.6TD I replaced the crank, intermediate and cam seals even thought they were not leaking. They are easy to access once you remove a few things. I plan to replace the ones on my 1.8t when I do the TB. Heck replacing the TB on a 1.8t looks a LOT easier than on a 1.6TD. No farting around with the injection pump timing.


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## TeeRedGeeElEye (Jun 27, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Black Smokin' Diesel)*

How important is it to replace the tensioner?


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## grttrochanter (Jan 21, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (trbochrgm02)*

Did mine this wekend. About 6 hrs. Thanks for the post. Coud not have done without it.


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## Burnitwithfire (May 14, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (TeeRedGeeElEye)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TeeRedGeeElEye* »_How important is it to replace the tensioner?

It's kind of useless to replace the timing belt without replacing the tensionner. It can fail too even though it seems to be in good shape.


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## wowie81 (Jan 4, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Black Smokin' Diesel)*

thanks guys


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## wowie81 (Jan 4, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wowie81)*

How do you find the flywheel timing on an automatic tranny? 
Doing it tomorrow, so a quick reply would be cool ; )


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wowie81)*

Auto trannys don't have a flywheel







STOP RIGHT NOW, put down that torque wrench, you have _no idea_ what you're doing. Just say


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## wowie81 (Jan 4, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (l88m22vette)*

Thanks, I was a little drunk and high when I asked that








This DIY kicks ars though, did mine in 9hrs, next time I will shoot for 6! 
Thanks for everyone help!


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## blazenbass713 (Feb 9, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (wowie81)*

do the pictures show up on the first page of this forum in any of your guys' browsers? i have tried opening it in firefox and internet explorer and the pics are dead links..


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## blazenbass713 (Feb 9, 2009)

weird, now the pics work. sorry guys.


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## stagg (Feb 15, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Black Smokin' Diesel)*

I know you should replace the belt tensioner, but how about the tensioner roller? (the seperate roller not attached to the tensioner)


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## alanspalls (Oct 14, 2008)

just changed my timing belt, idler pully, belt tensioner, and water pump. great write up! helped out quite a bit. btw I ordered the stuff from ECS tunning. They shipped everything very quickly and on time. And for a great price. I highly recommend them.


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## rallyemore (Aug 27, 2006)

Wonderful write-up! I used it for the second time this weekend; once a year ago on a friends GTI and this weekend on a Jetta. 
The first time I did it, it took two of us 12 hours to do.
This time it only took myself 11:50 minutes. Not bad, not bad at all I say.


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## BuildMoreTrails (Feb 21, 2009)

Any reason why this is still a sticky? I wouldn't trust anyone who had to come back and do it right a 2nd time. With all the pages of babble someone needs to go through, pickout all the helpful RIGHT procedures, create a new offical thread and lock it.


_Modified by BuildMoreTrails at 2:57 PM 2-22-2009_


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## Faststang70 (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: (BuildMoreTrails)*

Did my Second one on Wednesday. Only took about 6 hours of actual working on the car. 
*HELPFUL HINTS:
WHEN PUTTING ON THE TIMING BELT LOOSEN THE WATER PUMP BOLTS AND SPRAY A DASH OF WD-40 ON THE GEAR TO SLIP THE TIMING BELT ON. *
Took 5 minutes to put the new belt back on and then cleaned everything with a little rubbing alch to remove the WD.
*ALSO PLACING A JACKSTAND UNDER THE TRANNY BELL HOUSING FOR EXTRA SUPPORT REALLY PAID OFF IN THE END TO RE-ALIGNING OF THE MOTOR MOUNT.*
Again saved so much time.


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## hybridriftt (Jul 4, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (l88m22vette)*


_Quote, originally posted by *l88m22vette* »_Auto trannys don't have a flywheel







STOP RIGHT NOW, put down that torque wrench, you have _no idea_ what you're doing. Just say









Then what does the torque converter bolt to?????


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## nbkkb7x (Jan 12, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (hybridriftt)*

Did mine this weekend. This walkthrough went a long way. Saved 800 Bucks too! 
Sidenote: I would stress the need to make sure the timing covers are on tight, and that no bends are in them. Had to take mine off because it (middle timing cover) was missing the top bolt and caused it to wiggle. Not a good sound it makes against the belt.








-MP


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## New2theGame (Aug 14, 2008)

*Re: (BuildMoreTrails)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BuildMoreTrails* »_Any reason why this is still a sticky? I wouldn't trust anyone who had to come back and do it right a 2nd time. *With all the pages of babble someone needs to go through, pickout all the helpful RIGHT procedures, create a new offical thread and lock it.*
_Modified by BuildMoreTrails at 2:57 PM 2-22-2009_

x2. I am trying to educate myself on this process, and build the confidence to do it myself by making sure I will have all of the right tools and knowledge, but it's kind of hard to do when there are so many pages of different opinions on how to do it differently.
Can we get all of *the correct* info gathered into one post and lock it?


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## stagg (Feb 15, 2003)

*Re: (New2theGame)*









When I saw this I scratched my head wondering why I wasn't doing a head as well. I couldn't believe I actually got lucky for once in my life. 
Car is a 00 with 107,000 mi.
Anyways, started the job today at 9:30 am and finished at 5 pm working slowly so I woudn't get frustrated. I had a shop to use, and having a lift makes things so much more pleasant to do work. I was able to remove the entire motor mount, which I'm sure saved a lot of aggravation. I pretty much did most the work on my own, except when I needed an extra set of hands or didn't know exactly what to do next. I was lucky to have a mechanic friend of mine, who curses VW's eccentric engineering, help me through it. 
I did the water pump as well, and I found that the plastic impeller was still very strong. I couldn't even break it. Probably would have lasted another 100,000 miles. The tensioner, idler pulley and tensioner pulley all seemed to be fine too. I couldn't compress the old tensioner by hand at all. I think the belt took all the abuse (as you can see). So I don't know if it was a waste of time and money to replace everything else, or if I'm better off safe than sorry. 
Biggest pita for me was getting the motor mount back in. Other than that, everything else went pretty smoothly. I took off the idler pulley to get the belt on, which worked pretty well. 
Thanks to the OP for the DIY, otherwise I probably wouldn't have been as motivated to do it and my head would have went boom anyday. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## JJ2K1 (Apr 10, 2003)

*Re: (stagg)*

damn you got lucky


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## irish1967 (Jan 8, 2008)

*Re: (JJ2K1)*

Hey guys - I started this project this weekend and used the directions..very helpful so far. Im having a real time getting off the crank pully. Am I missing something and dont need to take it off? I dont see any other way of getting the lower timing belt cover off..i removed the 3 bolts on the pully using a strap wrench but cant get the big middle one off. I read in the Haines manual that if i take the sprocket off, then i might have to replace the seal..is that right? if i take that big bolt out of the crank pully will the crank sprocket come off too?
also, im taking off the head too or trying too...taking off the intake manifold looks a lot easier then taking off the exhaust...since i have the whole turbo to worry about...any quick advice for that part of the process would be great..i have not found much on this topic elsewhere on the site unless im just not searching properly.


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## rochas (Mar 17, 2009)

2003 1.8T
Can't find the plug for viewing timing marks on flywheel!
I've been looking for an hour but it's not there!
I've found where it should be, according to pictures, but there is absolutely nothing there.
Any suggestions?


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## irish1967 (Jan 8, 2008)

*Re: (rochas)*

with me this weekend i was doing the same thing - but i didnt find it because it was missing ! there was just a hole there...keep looking, you might just have a hole too....im sure you are looking in the right spot but it was hard to find...its buried


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## vicvill (Feb 17, 2009)

I'm looking where the starter connects. If there is just a hole, is it a circle or what shape would I be looking for? Thanks in advance!


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## gumourq (Mar 17, 2009)

*Re: (stagg)*

wow,
dont know how that didnt mess things up. 
Just did mine last saturday... took me about 8.5 hours from start to finish. my water pump impeller WAS broken though. And it was super flimsy, i can snap little bits off of it really easy. only 60K miles on it. My belt looked fine, and same with the tensioner and idler.
Blasted motor-mount was what killed me. everything was fine until it was time to put it back where it belonged. ate up about 3 hours of my time. But finally, i bolted all the components in (except the mount) and i lowered the engine ALmost as far as I could and then in increments of about 1/2 inch moved it up along with the mount until it fell into place.







what a pain in the ass.
other than that, everything went smooth.
oh yeah, thanks to those that contributed. couldnt have done it without this.


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## BuildMoreTrails (Feb 21, 2009)

*Re: (rochas)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rochas* »_2003 1.8T
Can't find the plug for viewing timing marks on flywheel!
I've been looking for an hour but it's not there!
I've found where it should be, according to pictures, but there is absolutely nothing there.
Any suggestions? 

Don't even bother with the timing mark! As long as your main two TDC's line up it's correct. my mark was very, very fant.


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: (BuildMoreTrails)*

The plug should be under the intake, maybe even under the drivers side of the intake mani on the tranny itself. Also, you MIGHT NOT have one and instead be looking for a hole. Go the extra mile, all it can do otherwise is hurt you http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## vicvill (Feb 17, 2009)

I found a window and the flywheel, instead of notch on it, letters DCD are on it. I got a compression gauge and determined the when the piston 1 is in compression. I also got a rod and inserted it in the sparkplug hole 1, and started marking when the piston was at the lowest and highest. Will this plus the determination of compression work to figure out TDC? The odd thing is that at my calculation of TDC with my methode the letters DCD showed up. Any suggestions?


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## timmay14 (Jan 6, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (rocketrich)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rocketrich* »_Bracket goes on the outside, your second picture. I"m in the middle of this now. Got stuck trying to get the belt back on. Good luck, Rich

Made the mistake of putting the tensioner assembly bracket on the inside (like picture #1) and about 2 weeks later the accessory belt flew off... oops. Found out that the tensioner pulley doesn't line up with the acc. belt. when running if the bracket is on the inside. Moved it to the outside and it's perfect now!
Just an FYI for the DIY..


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## Veedubgti (Mar 5, 2001)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (timmay14)*

Any tips on getting the upper timing cover back in there. Seems like I'm hung up between the metal line and the camshaft sprocket. I just can't seem to sneak it back in there.


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## guanatozridez (Jan 8, 2008)

at wat point should I change all of these things, im at 40k now on my 1.8T.


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## wowie81 (Jan 4, 2009)

*Re: (thetwodubheads)*

Remove/unbolt the IC hose and it will drop out after you jack up the motor. Worked like a charm for me


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## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

by following another diy for the 1.8 tt on screwing in the m5 stud it says to of course screw it into the timing belt tensioner, and then it says to only tension the piston of tensioning damper as far as necessary to secure it with a pin. By tensioning the piston does it mean tightening the stud? What piston? I plan on changing my belts and accessories soon and want to make sure I have everything straight before doing it.


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## BuildMoreTrails (Feb 21, 2009)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cap10morgan* »_by following another diy for the 1.8 tt on screwing in the m5 stud it says to of course screw it into the timing belt tensioner, and then it says to only tension the piston of tensioning damper as far as necessary to secure it with a pin. By tensioning the piston does it mean tightening the stud? What piston? I plan on changing my belts and accessories soon and want to make sure I have everything straight before doing it.

when you screw down the screw once it's placed in it's little "hole" it will push the tensioner piston into the tensioner body. if you lookat your new tensioner you'll understand it better but you'll need a new pin to place into the piston/tensioner to lock it in place but don't take the pin out of the new tensioner.


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## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

ok that gives me a better perspective, thanks! I was also wondering if there are any tools or methods used to hold the cam and crank in place while installing the new belt so that they wont move?


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

Anyone have any ideas? and which one is more prone to moving?


----------



## HollywoodsBug (Sep 13, 2003)

*Re: (groggory)*

Great how-to! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## frostythesnowguy (Nov 28, 2008)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cap10morgan* »_Anyone have any ideas? and which one is more prone to moving? 

I just finished this yesterday the crank is way more prone to moving, I took an old door hinge and cut the one side off put a bolt from the timing cover threw it and screwed in then took a bolt that holds the harmonic pully on and screwd that in so the crank gear was held firmly in place. Also if you get a new tensioner with it put the rest of the belt on then screw the tensioner on last its the easyest way to get the belt on in my opinon


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

about the timing. i know to line the cam up you use the timing mark on the valve cover, is the flywheel mark only used to align the crank? so like when you align the cam the flywheel mark should be aligned simultaneously?


----------



## TimsGTI (Mar 12, 2009)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

yes, the flywheel and cam gear will line up simultaneously


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (TimsGTI)*

ok well lets say i have the belt off, and i move the crank accidentally does that mean that the flywheel will also move? so i could just turn the crank back until the flywheel mark is aligned, and by that i will know that the crank is aligned? Im just not sure which one moves the flywheel in the transmission.


----------



## JJ2K1 (Apr 10, 2003)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

there are three places you want to check for top dead center. The valve cover, the flywheel, and the crank.


----------



## TimsGTI (Mar 12, 2009)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

yes, if you accidentally moved the crank the flywheel will move and yes you can then just realign the flywheel mark


----------



## irish1967 (Jan 8, 2008)

*Re: (TimsGTI)*

Not sure if this was said already but as long as you didnt take the crrank sprocket off and return the crank pully the way it was, theres a hash mark on that too and also on the lower timing belt cover...align these two marks.


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

nice, that helps alot, thanks!


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (irish1967)*

I also received the crank and cam shaft seals. noone really explained how to put those on. how would you to either off to put the seal on without moving the sprocket and disrupting the timing?


----------



## HollywoodsBug (Sep 13, 2003)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

It is necessary to change these?


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (HollywoodsBug)*

its not as imperative as changing the other parts, but i heard stories of faulty seals, so if its not too much of a hassle id like to change those too.


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (irish1967)*

do you have to have the m5 bolt to remove the tensioner from the old belt, or can you just remove the allen bolt from the roller and slide it out then take the belt off?


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

just changed my t belt ribbed belt and accessories. as far as i know I timed it perfectly. i started it up and everything sounded ok. then after a while i heard a very feint tapping noise and thought it could be a piston hitting a valve but then it stopped again so i took it up the road to test it out and all went well as far as the driving response. although i had to stop on the side of the road to add more coolant. Also i had to drain the power steering fluid before i changed the belt so the steering was pretty terrible and it was making an awful noise. But my main concern now is that when i start the car i hear a noise similar to the sound i hear when i turn the wheel without the fluid, but it does it when im not turning the wheel. Could this be because the timing is off? or probably just the ps fluid? Wouldnt the car fail very quickly if the timing was off? Please respond quickly if you have any ideas, because this is really worrying me. Thanks!


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## CorradoFuhrer (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

im in the middle of doing this now. I am doing mine outside of the car, I did not have my flywheel on and the damn crank and cam gears kept moving on me while trying to put on the Tensioner. It got kinda late so I bagged it, make sure you got a heavy flywheel on there to keep the two things from moving off TDC.
The bicycle chain method is very useful, I can't wait to try it tomorrow. I don't know how your guys' belt were, but mine was extremely tight with or with out the pin pulled. There was like no slack once I put the belt on with out the pin even being pulled. I pulled the pin and was able to get it in because I thought when I did this my cam gear would line up to TDC perfectly (it was a hair off). Well it didn't, but i was able to get the pin back in there. Just bolt the tensioner back to the engine and use leverage with like a big screw driver to get the tensioner down to be able to put the pin back in. Or if your belt is like mine the belt didn't even appear to tighten when the pin was pulled because the belt was already tight (which would in turn cause the cam and crank to misalign due to how tight the belt was already... is this normal?)


----------



## CorradoFuhrer (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: (CorradoFuhrer)*

belt was bad, too small, new belt worked great.


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## irish1967 (Jan 8, 2008)

*Re: (CorradoFuhrer)*

This isn't exactly on topic what the hell. I'm replacing my head this weekend (which started as a simple timing belt project)..my question is, once i get the block cleaned off..do i put any kind of sealant on the block or head gasket? also, what do i use as guides when putting the head down on the block? i didnt do anything with the old bolts to be able to use them. Also, do i put sealant on any of the other gaskets? head cover, the one surrounding the coils, or the intake or exhaust manifold ones? any help would be great.


----------



## irish1967 (Jan 8, 2008)

*Re: (irish1967)*

Got the head on ok - and no sealant on the head gasket..realized that after i read some other stuff. Now i have a differnet problem.
I put the belt on and pulled the pin, on the piston and then realized i was a tooth off...so i took the belt off and after much frustration and cursing was able to get the piece with the piston out again but i cant get it to budge to resent the pin in there...how much pressure should have to be put on it to get it to depress..the old one was pressable with my thumb but with this one i cant get it to move one bit. Could it be bad or is it supposed to be really really hard to pressdown? i already used the 5mm bolt and broke it off. Any thoughts would be appreciated..im working on this now.


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## EF9Si (Dec 12, 2003)

*Re: (irish1967)*


_Quote, originally posted by *irish1967* »_Got the head on ok - and no sealant on the head gasket..realized that after i read some other stuff. Now i have a differnet problem.
I put the belt on and pulled the pin, on the piston and then realized i was a tooth off...so i took the belt off and after much frustration and cursing was able to get the piece with the piston out again but i cant get it to budge to resent the pin in there...how much pressure should have to be put on it to get it to depress..the old one was pressable with my thumb but with this one i cant get it to move one bit. Could it be bad or is it supposed to be really really hard to pressdown? i already used the 5mm bolt and broke it off. Any thoughts would be appreciated..im working on this now.















Easy, if you have bench vice press, you need the bigger one because you have to retract the vice till you can sit the tensioner in there. Then set it to the vice make sure it straight then you press it slowly.. So press it then count 4 seconds then press it again till you see the hole line up then you get a small allen key(or the old key) that will go in there, put that in then release the press now you compressed your tensioner.. The key is slow pressing because this unit is hydraulic and if you press it to fast it will leak out and it will loose tension and bam you know the rest..


----------



## EF9Si (Dec 12, 2003)

*Re: (EF9Si)*

Btw, you will never press that tensioner with your thumb!


----------



## irish1967 (Jan 8, 2008)

*Re: (EF9Si)*

thanks for the help..I could press the old one with my thumb so maybe this was the cause of the failure. Can i use a big c clamp to do this?


----------



## irish1967 (Jan 8, 2008)

*Re: (irish1967)*

damn brother - you saved my life - i had no idea how hard that thing was to move- i was gonna buy a new one. I now have it installed and the belt on - so tight that thing is - my hands are like two pieces of meat right now. One more question - when i got the head back..the notch on the cam gear was slightly to the left of the notch on the cover even though he said all was aligned properly on the cam chain on the other side. Is this ok or should i still be trying to match the marks on the cam gear and the cover perfectly?


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (irish1967)*

there is a much easier way to get the belt on, because i know i had tons of trouble with every other suggestion.First you take the tensioning damper housing off leave the idler roller on( this is still with the engine support out). put the new belt on and line up both of your marks. whenever you put the belt on make sure its on securely bc i know some ppl were saying to put it only halfway on the sprockets. If you dont teeth will slip during the next step. Now you need to get some heavy duty string(like the thick nylon kind). Now that the belt is on securely roll back the idler roller by hand and tension the belt manually. Your gonna need alot of tension on it so tie the string very tightly around the little clamp on the roller, or you could just loop the string around it. Once you do this bring the string up in the direction that will add more tension to the belt. I tied mine around the little loop on the engine. You will see the loop in step 10 on this diy( its on the very right side of the picture, to the right of power steering and hoses). Youll have to do a tying method that allows you to add tension to the roller. once your satisfied knot it up and make sure the tension doesnt change while your tying it. The next step would be to put the new engine support into position(Be careful while putting it in since the new belt is on, also dont put the bolts in yet bc you will need some wiggle room while putting in the tensioner housing. Now that the engine support is in place its time to put the tensioner housing in. Youll need a hammer to tap the tensioner into place. It doesnt take much force. Just barely tap it until all the screw holes line up. once the screws are in( * dont put the engine support bolts in yet, because you will need room to release the pin on the tensioner) leave the string tied and come up and release the pin. By releasing the pin before you untie the string you prevent the tensioner from making a sudden jolt on the belt that could cause teeth to slip. Now that the pin is out You can come up and untie the string(do it slowly and release the tension slowly so that it doesnt cause any teeth to slip * just a precaution.*. Now that the belt is tensioned you can go ahead and put in those engine support bolts. It may sound like a really long process but it's just because I was trying to be descriptive as possible. all in all this step took me like 20 minutes while taking my time. I came up with this after trying to use the bicycle chain method bc that just wasnt working for me and i was afraid if the belt slipped while i was doing it then the sprockets might move too far and screw up the timing. Good luck!


----------



## robihood000 (Apr 2, 2009)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

I am new to all of this and i am looking to time my car. it seems that it might be off by one tooth. i have a couple questions. first will i need to buy a new tensioner and second do i absolutely have to remove the water pump. thankyou for your help


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (robihood000)*

you will definitely need a new water pump. the impeller on the stock water pump is made out of plastic so it breaks really easy. if it does break then you have a whole other set of problems to deal with, so i would just replace it. It isnt that hard to replace. its just a pain trying to take the old one out. youll have to wedge it out with some flat heads or a crow bar if you cant get it out with your hands. thats how i got mine out. as for the tensioner, i would replace that too because i hear that they lose tensioning power, the older they get. If you get a timing belt kit all that stuff will be included with it anyway. I got my kit from ecs for around 300, but i think you could get a cheaper one then that if you dont want to replace the thermostat, cam, and crank seals. which you need special tools for the seals anyway. As for the thermostat, i heard from a volkswagen tech that the thermostats last forever so that wouldnt be one of my main concerns.


----------



## robihood000 (Apr 2, 2009)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

i wasnt looking to replace all of those things just yet. i know the belt was done in the last year or so. i assume the tensioner was done as well because when the belt was done a new head was put on. i dont want to replace anything i dont absolutely have to because i am short on money and trying to get some out of the dealer that sold my car to me. are there any indicators as to what has been replaced and what hasnt on the car. i mean if the tensioner is replaced would it look different or have the part number stamped somewhere else. any help would be awesome


----------



## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: (robihood000)*

If the original owner had it taken to a dealership to replace the parts, then they would be OEM. If they did it theirself then the parts should be aftermarket. Contitech makes many of the aftermarket belts, so the t-belt should have contitech stamped all over it. the OEM tensioner had the audi rings stamped right under where that pin hole is, so if its aftermarket i dont think that it will. You can see what im talkin about if you go to page 1 of this thread. About half way down someone posted a picture of their old tensioner. so maybe you could use that to compare. if you think that they may have had it done at the dealership and all the parts are OEM, if i were u i would prob. look at the waterpump first. the old one should be pretty rusty. look at the first page for this also. near the bottom of the page there is a posted pic. of an old waterpump. Maybe you could compare that to yours, bc mine was really rusted too when i changed it. well hope that helps any at all!


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: (cap10morgan)*

I am in the middle of doing this and just had a few questions:
1 - I have a tiptronic transmission so does anyone know where i can find the tdc mark? I have located the flywheel under the car but not on top of the engine
2 - I can't seem to get the alternator off to get at my thermostat, i already took out the two bolts and tried prying and pulling etc and it won't budge still
Cheers


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: (MechEngg)*

****TDC Mark for a Tiptronic transmission****
Look under the car, just to the drivers side of the oil pan and a bit towards the front of the car. You will see an opening on the transmission (don't know why it is just open) and you will see the flywheel. there is also a little hole above that (towards the front of the car. When there is a white dot in this hole the flywheel is at TDC
Pic of it (i painted the flywheel so it was easier to find)










_Modified by MechEngg at 11:12 PM 5/1/2009_


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## Macks04GLI (Jul 20, 2007)

*Re: (MechEngg)*

I'm about to this timing belt kit to my GLI and was wondering if anyone had any opinions about this company and its products:
http://www.blauparts.com/prodd...4%2DC
There is also a tool kit for rent also.


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## Twintigklepper (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (Macks04GLI)*









1 First put the belt on the bottom pulley the same way like it is mounted on the picture top pulley.
2 Then put it on the top pully like the picture
3 Mount the tensioner pulley bolt like the picture!
4 Slide the belt on the top and botten pulleys with your fingers and bolt down the tensioner pulley.
TADA mounted without any force or .. bicycle methods.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## jmrpage (May 6, 2009)

I have been told that i should replace the new style tensinor with the old cam style . is this true .


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## graviator (May 3, 2009)

*Re: help*

I just did my timing belt/WP and I got everything back together and I've driven for a few days thinking everything is great. I started to smell some rubber smells so I check the accessory belt and nothing....I popped open the TB cover and I can see little fuzzys on the side of the TB. This is a brand new belt and they were not there when I installed. 
Is there some belt alignment thing I missed? I made sure that it was lined up to the edge of the teeth and everything before I pulled the tensioner. 

What should I do? tear it back apart and check alignment. I can do that but I really don't know what else I can do to keep it aligned. In thoughts????????
Thanks


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## cap10morgan (Apr 3, 2009)

*Re: help (graviator)*

it must be the timing belt rubbing against something metal. it wouldnt be the timing. whenever I put my belt back on I put the belt on the center of the sprockets instead of the outside. maybe you could try positioning the belt a little further onto the sprockets. it could be rubbing on the vibration dampener on the crank for instances.


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: help (cap10morgan)*

the belt shouldn't wear on the outside, mainly the inside. I lined it up against the outside of the gears and its fine after 2K kms


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## fbomb (Nov 2, 2003)

*Re: help (MechEngg)*

so were doing the Tbelt on a 2004.5 gi, awp motor. We had everything lined up b4 we took off the belt. took it all apart, putting everythin back and notice the camsprocket 1 tooth off. belts not back on so for curiousitys sake mounted the crank guard and pulleyto check and its off about 1/3 of a turn. its me and my dad, we arent mechanical idiots, but this is both of ours 1st t-belt. were makin some calls, certaintly dont wanna go foward with this until its cleard up. any help/ ideas ?


_Modified by fbomb at 4:23 PM 5-16-2009_


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## sleeply337 (Apr 13, 2008)

*Re: help (graviator)*

After you pull the pin on that tensioner is it screwed up ?..like could i put tension back on it put the pin back in and try and line up the belt again and pull the pin out a second time ? or is the tensioner done for


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## BeLOW ME (Oct 25, 2008)

*Re: help (sleeply337)*

havent pulled the pin on the tensioner. boltd the new tensioner up and had everythin ready to put the belt back on. did a double check and realised cam was off 1 tick and crank was of 1/3 of a turn. so belts not on, stoppd doin what we were doin and tryin to get answers


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## FuzzyVW537 (Feb 22, 2008)

*Re: help (BeLOW ME)*


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## BeLOW ME (Oct 25, 2008)

*Re: help (kaipyroami)*

so got it all together, turned the motor by hand over 2 full rotations and crank and cam marks both dead on and lined up. wonderful. put everythin back together, took our time, refilled antifreeze. start car and its running a little rough, go to release the clutch in nuetral so it can idle and makes a little bit of noise and i feel it in the pedal. turn the car off, wait a few minutes and try it again, idles for a second, and in this sequence, CEL then red temp light then a STOP in center display, light up all within a few seconds. read the code and it p0012, cam timing. that was 3 minutes ago. now the temp light is cuz i know it takes a little for the antifreeze to circulate and i put more in, but havent restartd the car


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## BeLOW ME (Oct 25, 2008)

*Re: help (BeLOW ME)*

any help ? is it gonna just start fine if it is right or does it take a minute for the ecu to adjust ? i dont wanna take any (MORE) chances


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## evan_aggie (May 28, 2009)

Sorry for asking what might be a dumb question, but what is the entire purpose of lifting the motor up a few inches to remove the motor mounts?
I did the timing belt on my 300zx (DOHC), so I guess I'm not really clear on why you'd need to do this, but I'm guessing it is to access something: timing belt covers? belt? 
Thanks.


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## FuzzyVW537 (Feb 22, 2008)

*Re: (evan_aggie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *evan_aggie* »_Sorry for asking what might be a dumb question, but what is the entire purpose of lifting the motor up a few inches to remove the motor mounts?


to unload the tension on the motor mount so It can be removed.


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## evan_aggie (May 28, 2009)

*Re: (kaipyroami)*

Thanks, but let me rephrase:
Why do you need to remove the motor mount?


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## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: (evan_aggie)*

One of the bolts to the engine from the mount is in the center of the belt, meaning without removing the mount you can't remove the belt.


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## evan_aggie (May 28, 2009)

*Re: (Tim_1.8T)*

Thanks. That is strange. 
Two other questions:
1.
The car is in park during this entire procedure right, so isn't that going to prevent you from being able to rotate the gear to test the belt rotation? Or do you remove the bolt in park and then switch to neutral when you need to rotate the belt?
My 300zx is a 5spd, and I switched between 5th gear and neutral for these steps (with someone on the breaks in 5th gear) to do the same.
2. I'm surprised the belt doesn't come marked with lines indicating where each tooth should fall on the gear. On my 300zx, it had 5 marks: one for the crankshaft TDC, 2 for each intake gear and 2 for each exhaust gear, all of which had a mark on the back side of the timing belt cover (similar to the 1.8T pictures)...meaning it was REALLY hard to screw up. Is it impossible to count the correct number of teeth that should be between the cam gear mark and the crankshaft? Some would do this for an added measure of accuracy on my nissan.



_Modified by evan_aggie at 5:59 AM 5-28-2009_


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## Jwile (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: (MechEngg)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MechEngg* »_









_Modified by MechEngg at 11:12 PM 5/1/2009_

Does this also exists for the 4Speed autos ? I am doing my tbelt on my BT setup and was not aware there was a marking for this on the automatics ... Are there markings on the crank from VW or just on the Crank ? thanks guys


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: (Jwile)*

the little hole you see has a marking straight from vw on the flywheel there...I have an 09a transmission so i don't know if the 4 speed auto will have the same markings but look under the car and let us know.


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## Jwile (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: (MechEngg)*

To my Knownledge NO , But I was just double checking because I honestly thought the Tiptronic didn't have it either but I was just showed different haha . 
I'm pretty much just going to go by the markings on cam/cover and the crank/cover . Either way you do this job ( either Markings or not ) This writeup is a incredible reference . I'm glad it stuck around this long , I remembered when it was made but I personally never had to use it yet . ha
I'll drop a note if for some reason I do find the 4spd Autos have the marking . 
Now I gota ask the dumb question , I turn the crank by hand with no belt on right ? this will move both crank and cam or we have to do each separate ? last t-belt I did with a friend and we just marked and swapped . This time I have to TDC motor 


_Modified by Jwile at 1:06 PM 6-8-2009_


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: (Jwile)*

The best way to do it is to turn the crank with the old belt still on. This will ensure that both the crank and the cams are TDC. You can do both seperately but with no marking on the 4 speed auto transmission i don't know how you could tell when its tdc. If you don't have a tdc mark on your flywheel then make sure you mark the old belt with mail polish or similar before you remove it. Thats what i did anyways and it worked out very well. 3K kms and its still running better than ever.


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## Jwile (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: (MechEngg)*

Theres at least the Cam and Crank Marking ( with the balancer on the crank at least ) , Just was curious how others were doing it if say the old belt wasn't there or was removed before was marked. Ill go check it out again in morning , just cleaned up for the night . I'm a backyard guy o have to work with daylight and weather . 
could be dumb but I could put the new belt on and just TDC motor with those markings right ?
Thanks again for the pics , Ill post any If I come across any on the 4spd tranny 


_Modified by Jwile at 5:30 PM 6-10-2009_


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: (Jwile)*

yeah as long as you make sure that the crank shaft and cam shaft are both TDC at the same time you can put a new belt on without marking it


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## supersoaker50 (Aug 4, 2005)

*Re: (MechEngg)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif to this DIY.
just did t-belt/wp, t-stat and such and was super confident coming in and out of the install. 
only hang up was getting that damn belt on, so after fiddling, i found out a tip..
once crank and cam are in TDC, get the belt on everything except waterpump then use two small screwdrivers and use them as leverage onto the waterpump, slid right on







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Jwile (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: (MechEngg)*

Mech , Thank you very much . Thats the answer I was lookin for , I was trying to explain it to another best I could and honestly .. figured I was but he didnt get what i meant . hahaha anyways thanks for the reply .


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## Jwile (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: (Jwile)*

Out taking advantage of the beautiful day ... Just to toss in another note for doing this job . PUT THE TRANNY IN NEUTRAL , I personally never knew that so i guess my stupidity but makes the job 100 times easier for the hand cranking . 
I'm going over some notes in this thread and others , but my marks are off when I'm TDC cam/valve cover wise . but the crank/lower cover marks are off a good tooth or 2 , gona search around ... Just never had this sort of issue doing a belt job on my rides . All in all this thread is a savior


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## XClayX (Apr 30, 2005)

*Re: (Jwile)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jwile* »_Out taking advantage of the beautiful day ... Just to toss in another note for doing this job . PUT THE TRANNY IN NEUTRAL , I personally never knew that so i guess my stupidity but makes the job 100 times easier for the hand cranking . 
I'm going over some notes in this thread and others , but my marks are off when I'm TDC cam/valve cover wise . but the crank/lower cover marks are off a good tooth or 2 , gona search around ... Just never had this sort of issue doing a belt job on my rides . All in all this thread is a savior









I'm doing this next Tuesday. Did you remove the Spark Plugs. Easier to turn by hand? 
Also is there a need to LOCKTIDE any bolts?


_Modified by XClayX at 6:52 PM 6-18-2009_


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: (XClayX)*

You definitely DONT have to remove spark plugs. You again do NOT have to locktite any of the bolts, they are stretch bolts that you need to torque to certain specs (somewhere in this thread they are listed). 
The way a stretch bolt works is that the both stretches a small bit as you tighten it, putting even more friction force on the bolt and thus preventing it from loosening due to vibrations....Just be careful not to over torque the bolts past their yielding point or else their strength greatly deteriorates and will more than likely snap off in a very very short time frame (for instance when you start you car for the first time or release the engine jack) haha. 
Good luck though http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 001_vw (Nov 9, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Say does anybody know much about the part number for the Tensioner? The last 3 numbers are 243 but i'm finiding a lot of kits onine that have 243, 243D, 243F etc etc. I know that the letter is based on the generation of the part but sometimes i've found it to be model specific too. I was told by the dealer that it should be the 243 or 243F for my car. And this has been hard to find a kit with that designation. Most are 243D that i find. Has anybody run into this before? The engine code in my car is AWW (01 GTi) if that helps.
Thanks 



_Modified by 001_vw at 1:13 PM 6-21-2009_


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## XClayX (Apr 30, 2005)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (001_vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *001_vw* »_Say does anybody know much about the part number for the Tensioner? The last 3 numbers are 243 but i'm finiding a lot of kits onine that have 243, 243D, 243F etc etc. I know that the letter is based on the generation of the part but sometimes i've found it to be model specific too. I was told by the dealer that it should be the 243 or 243F for my car. And this has been hard to find a kit with that designation. Most are 243D that i find. Has anybody run into this before? The engine code in my car is AWW (01 GTi) if that helps.
Thanks 

_Modified by 001_vw at 1:13 PM 6-21-2009_

The from the tbelt kit I ordered from Blauparts is, "For a 2001 1.8t AWW Jetta"
Tensioner Pully
Brand: Meyley OEM
Reference # 06B 109 243D 
Art. No. 100 109 0054
Tensioner Damper
Brand: Ruville
Numbers from the top of the label down, "doesn't say what they are"
55493
Ruville
Tensioner Damper
9D2A1
Made in Germany
Part is Stamped
NTN L
JP GEA
"Which i'm guessing means it's from the NTN company in Japan" Maybe assembled in Germany.
Best of luck. I'm doing this tuesday. I'll report my thoughts, from what I read I might not want to change another T-belt. I guess it's a huge pita.


----------



## burnsmoney (Jun 14, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (XClayX)*

I did my t-belt on friday, start to finish it was a 9 hour job with almost no breaks (I waited until after to have the beer







) 
I found it a lot easier to take the side motor mount right out of the car, it made putting the water pump and new tensioner on a lot easier. I moved the charge pipping to move the mount out through the back, it was pretty easy with two people it just took a little moving around. 
Also if anyone is looking for a good kit with great parts I got mine from blauparts for $260 and the same kit at ecs was over $500! Shipping only took two days and was free, plus they threw in a free oil filter. 


_Modified by burnsmoney at 8:51 AM 7-6-2009_


----------



## meltorment (Jan 20, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (burnsmoney)*

x2 on the kit from blauparts! did my tb plus valve cover gasket over 4th of july wkend w/ much trepidation...hardest part was turning the key!
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for this thread and this one: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...age=1! wouldnt have done it w/o them!


----------



## ovsa (Jan 30, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

thanks for all the info on the timing belt change over. Just completed mine using all the info and pics provided.
jut one last question....Is it necessary to "break in" the ew belt or can i just let her rip?
thanks


----------



## doovy (Jul 19, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Hi there tim. 
I have read your post on 
changing the time belt on vw golf mk4 1.8T
and i was wondering if you 
could clarify a thew fings for me.
I allso have a 2001 vw golf mk4 1.8T 
with 72000 miles and i want to change the timing bet on it but i dont undestand 
a couple of things.
1- i dont understand this bit about the timing plug 
on the transmission. do i align the transmition with the cam gear?
2- the 
timing belt tensioner pulley and timing belt tensioner when do i click it in 
before i put the new belt or after the new belt has been put 
on? 
3- on step 1 you said this (Here is where the cam gear lines up 
with the valve cover. You can also see the mark on my cam gear and my new belt 
from the nail polish. They don't line up because the car has been running) 
why doesen't the mark on the cam gear much up with the mark u've done on the 
belt? 


_Modified by doovy at 4:11 PM 7-19-2009_


----------



## Tim_1.8T (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (doovy)*

PM sent


----------



## XLR99 (Jul 3, 2009)

I did mine this weekend-took probably 6 hours, not including beverage breaks. This thread with all the pics was a big help!
I also spent almost 3 hours trying to get some kind of rubber gasket thing (?part of a coilpack) out from around the hex area of the #4 plug to get the plug out. Man was that fun!!
As with everyone else, the motormount was a PITA. I made the mistake of letting the mount fall out after the tensioner came out, then put the new tensioner back in before the mount. Ended up pulling the tensioner out again to get the mount back in position.


----------



## JDNW (Apr 27, 2007)

just finished mine after about 6 hours of actual work... Lots of breaks with the wifes nagging and the kids bothering me... However I'm having an issue with the accessory belt falling off now, it'll run great for about 10 minutes and the belt just falls off.


----------



## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (JDNW)*

Sounds like something isn't lined up correctly. Check everything, especially the crank pulley, and check out that tensioner.


----------



## JDNW (Apr 27, 2007)

the spacing on the tensioner is not correct. not sure why it's off but it is... the tensioner pulley on the accessory belt is rubbing the timing belt cover. melted the **** out of the pulley... Ran up to Napa this morning and got the new pulley but cant find what exactly is causing the spacing issue. I do not remember taking off any kind of washer/spacer when I originally took the pulley assembly off.


_Modified by JDNW at 6:30 PM 7-23-2009_


----------



## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (JDNW)*

The black bracket goes on the outside of the tensioner under the bolts, not between the tensioner and the block.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3515140


_Modified by White Jetta at 10:47 PM 7-23-2009_


----------



## XClayX (Apr 30, 2005)

*Re: (JDNW)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JDNW* »_the spacing on the tensioner is not correct. not sure why it's off but it is... the tensioner pulley on the accessory belt is rubbing the timing belt cover. melted the **** out of the pulley... Ran up to Napa this morning and got the new pulley but cant find what exactly is causing the spacing issue. I do not remember taking off any kind of washer/spacer when I originally took the pulley assembly off.

_Modified by JDNW at 6:30 PM 7-23-2009_

IT's to tight. It's only suppose to be like 7 ftlbs. Same thing happen to me. I loosened all the bolts, and tighten them very lightly compared to what I did prior. Works just fine.


----------



## 05JettaGLIGuy (Apr 11, 2008)

The ECS kit come with a crankshaft and camshaft seal. Are those necessary to change. Or can you skip that part?


----------



## kingstrider (May 24, 2009)

I started mine yesterday and finished today, about 10 hours including a run for another too, bathroom breaks etc. Altogether it wasn't too hard to do but the lower engine mount is a pain, I couldn't get it out either so just worked around it. I ordered my parts from Blauparts and had them 2 days later on a Saturday no less. Very high quality stuff and virtually the same kit for a lot less than ECS or MTM. Thanks for the tips, you saved me well over $400 for what the stealership wanted for the timing belt & water pump job! 


_Modified by kingstrider at 4:19 PM 7-27-2009_


----------



## Macrotechie (Jul 26, 2009)

The Blauparts kit (highly recommended) also came with the crank and camshaft seals, but I skipped them. Kinda wish I didn't. 
Mine took me all weekend as I went slowly and methodically. Had to replace the front fans as one was burned out. 
Need to say a general thanks to all people on here who have contributed to this and other DIYs. I literally saved thousands.


----------



## rdwong (May 30, 2009)

alright, i'mma first year mechanic, first time attacking a timing belt...... cuz of the darn water pump..... curse them buisness men!!!!)@_(#*$()*@#$%(&*
wish me luck!
and tim, thanks so much, i was so worried i'd be working off scratch that I wanted to somehow scratch up a grand to get vw to do it for me.... now i'm gonna get a friend to watch over me incase of stupid moves or forgets a bolt or two and plus, its always better to have another man to share the beers with


----------



## kdiver58 (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (rdwong)*

for me sliding the stupid timing belt on was a pain .. I still don't have it on and it's been 3 hours .. pulling prying ..


----------



## vdubguy97 (Sep 13, 2003)

*Re: (kdiver58)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kdiver58* »_ for me sliding the stupid timing belt on was a pain .. I still don't have it on and it's been 3 hours .. pulling prying ..
















Try installing the bottom bolt off the tensioner not completly tight then install belt then push tensioner up and install top bolt.


----------



## Evenodds20 (May 2, 2005)

*Re: (vdubguy97)*

i right about at this point right now. what i did was slide the belt on the cam gear and line the teeth up with my markings. then i ran it down to the crank pulley any lined the teeth up with that too. then on to the water pump where i hand turned the crank gear counter clockwise as i pulled the belt over the water pump pulley. try that and see what happens! as far as i remember the engine turns counter clockwise anyways so you dont mess up the order of the gears as long as you have the belt lined up correctly. someone chime in if im wrong. i would really love to know.


----------



## amgtorre (Apr 28, 2000)

*Re: (Evenodds20)*

great DIY ! 
I did it the first time , took me a long time
second time around I took it to a shop, since then the car has not been the same, I'll check timing marks , if off I'll go back to the shop


----------



## Looney_Tuner (Aug 14, 2005)

i dont understand this bit about the timing plug 
on the transmission. do i align the transmition with the cam gear?
I can't find the timing plug either... can you see it from the top or the bottom? also do you have to remove anything to see it? a picture zoomed out a bit with the plug highlighted would be awesome!


----------



## Varooom (Aug 5, 1999)

*Re: (Looney_Tuner)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Looney_Tuner* »_ i don't understand this bit about the timing plug 
on the transmission. do i align the transmition with the cam gear?
I can't find the timing plug either... can you see it from the top or the bottom? also do you have to remove anything to see it? a picture zoomed out a bit with the plug highlighted would be awesome!


If you have an automatic transmission, there is no timing mark on the flywheel. Manual transmission only. If it's manual transmission, there IS a black rubber plug on top where the bell housing meets the engine block. Remove that plug and you will see the teeth of the starter ring gear. Use a flashlight, there is a tiny triangle above the ring gear. This triangle is the mark that matches up with a tiny triangle notched into the ring gear itself, just below the teeth. When these two line up, the cyl # 1 is at TDC, and the timing marks at the drive belt pulley and t belt cover will line up too. (other end of crankshaft, front of motor). My feeling is that the flywheel mark is a little more accurate because it's a much larger circumfrence.


----------



## Looney_Tuner (Aug 14, 2005)

Auto FTL!!
ok, so I have got the old belt marked, off, and transfered over my marks to my new belt, but can't seem to get both my marks on my cam and crank shaft sprockets to line up. i pulled the belt back off, checked and double checked my marks on the old belt. i even counted the teeth and marked the new belt, but if i count from the other side, its 1 tooth off... does this mean my new belt has an extra tooth? i counted them twice


----------



## rdwong (May 30, 2009)

JUST did the tbelt/wp!
my buddy mechanic at clarkdale vw, (credits to rob boznack) gave me a tip, to make life easier, line the tbelt to the cam pulley, zapstrap or maskingtape the belt to the pulley so it won't skip, then go align the wp and crank and tentioner. And as for the tentioner..... a bit of a pain. I used the bolt from the old tentioner pulley and tied a wire to it, then if you look closely at your tentioner idler pulley, the big one, the end of the lip thing has a weird thing, i found out i could put a bolt there and have the wire go through the gap in the middle, then pull it up and tie it to something above, this hole on the top of the head for my case... That holds the pully up as you try to install the tentioner! it works so much better that way! and when its all set, just untie the wire or what i did was just yank at the bolt slightly and it comes off that hook thing on the pulley! easy! and pop the tentioner on, off you go!


----------



## Cryptovirology (Mar 27, 2009)

Just got done with mine but 2 problems, my cel came on with something about my cam pos sensor yet car sounds and runs fine ? And after inspecting the new belt the ends are starting to fray 0.o any ideas?


----------



## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (Cryptovirology)*

You are off one tooth, and not aligned properly. That code always pops up because the cam pulley need to be slighty bumped forward onto the belt or it's off one tooth, common mistake.


----------



## Cryptovirology (Mar 27, 2009)

*Re: (White Jetta)*

How much time before my engine turns into Micheal jacksons face? Should I let it set till I have time to rip the bitch apart again or what?


----------



## 98vrsick (Aug 10, 2003)

*Re: (Cryptovirology)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Cryptovirology* »_How much time before my engine turns into Micheal jacksons face? Should I let it set till I have time to rip the bitch apart again or what?









dont let this go... same thing just happened to me. If you know what your doing you can just remove the cam gear, reset the tensioner using a 5m-50 bolt (hardened) and washer and pop the pin back in. Check your bottom crank pulley marks to be sure that everything is aligned, and repeat the process staging the cam gear a bit more forward towards the front of the car rather then dead on.


----------



## 98vrsick (Aug 10, 2003)

*Re: (98vrsick)*

which brings me to a question... i am hesitant to pull the pin again (after a reset and timing realignment. All timing marks are now dead on.... once i let the tensioner rip, will it move the cam gear back a smidgen causing me to be a tooth off?


----------



## Varooom (Aug 5, 1999)

*Re: (98vrsick)*

I lost a timing belt so I was starting from scratch, had only the cam and crank timing marks to go by. When I got the belt on, it was off by two notches. The way I got it set right was to MARK the belt and pulleys with whiteout... that way I had something to orient by and wasn't guessing when I placed the belt the second time. I knew I had to advance the belt on the pulley by two notches. Use paint or whiteout to mark, it helps a LOT.


----------



## 98vrsick (Aug 10, 2003)

*Re: (Varooom)*

Alright just posting a quick update and things i ran into...
-took 2 full days to do this job along with seals, etc. (quaddruple checked everything)
-made my own crank and cam markings with yellow paint
-car started perfect and ran fine except for the p0011 code or whatever
-Accessory belt flew off going down the road
-i made the famous error of putting the bracket inbetween the block and tensioner instead of outside the tensioner. i saw that as soon as i popped the hood. 
Wanted to make it right sooooo....
-got a new accessory belt
-verified that i was off a tooth for timing
-took off timing gear and belt, attempted to compress the tensioner with a m5-50 bolt while on car. 
-tensioner compress bolt broke so i removed everything once more and used a vice to reclamp the tensioner and removed broken bolt
-this time i installed the tb by using the timing marks on the crank pulley and cam
-checked tension, even pryed up on the tensioner wheel with a prybar just a bit to make sure the tensioner was engaged to eliminate a tooth skip
-hand cranked the engine over 163 times (lol jk) then started it up
-total amount of time to redo everything was about 5 hours. 
-car runs perfect now. just need to clear the codes


----------



## Col. Sandurz (Aug 23, 2009)

Starting now. Let's see how this goes. Exhaust on last night.
EDIT: Done in 10 hours. Thats redoing the tenisoneer belt 2x and the thermostat a second time after I found a leak.
Actually pretty easy job. Just time consuming. Especially when you take two breaks ot eat, and more to relax.

Do it yourself. Save the $500 in labor.


_Modified by 2ndvw-audi at 7:16 PM 8-29-2009_


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## elrich_d (Aug 6, 2008)

confused about this part:
"Step #6
Release tension on the accessory belt using a 16mm wrench to pull back the tensioner enough to align the two holes so that you can slip a 3mm allen wrench through both of them. As Illustated."
where is the 3mm allen wrench going...? which two holes are being alligned


----------



## White Jetta (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: (elrich_d)*

There are two holes on the acc. belt tensioner, so when you take the pressure off with the wrench the allen key or something similar can go though the holes to hold the tension off of the belt. Their right on the top side area of the tensioner, can't miss it.


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## jpepin (Feb 18, 2008)

I'm in the middle of doing my TB right now as a result of a bad water pump (46k miles and it's cracked with chunks broken off). 
Question: I set the timing by lining up the flywheel marks exactly as told in the DIY. I also marked the belt and gears with paint marks before removal. I have everything removed now, and have replaced the water pump. I'm ready to put it all back together, and noticed that the flywheel mark is no longer lined up. Is this normal? I don't think I did anything "wrong", but do I need to do anything special other than line up the new belt (with transferred marks) with the marks on the gears? 
Thanks in advance for the help!


_Modified by jpepin at 9:55 PM 9-13-2009_


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## Music Man (Dec 22, 2000)

*Conti Tech?*

Anyone ever use the contitech timing belt water pump kit? If so do you know what actually comes with it? Bap Geon has it for $215
Thank you, Andy


----------



## jpepin (Feb 18, 2008)

*Re: (jpepin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jpepin* »_I'm in the middle of doing my TB right now as a result of a bad water pump (46k miles and it's cracked with chunks broken off). 
Question: I set the timing by lining up the flywheel marks exactly as told in the DIY. I also marked the belt and gears with paint marks before removal. I have everything removed now, and have replaced the water pump. I'm ready to put it all back together, and noticed that the flywheel mark is no longer lined up. Is this normal? I don't think I did anything "wrong", but do I need to do anything special other than line up the new belt (with transferred marks) with the marks on the gears? 
Thanks in advance for the help!


Well, I figured it out myself. I made sure the marks i transferred to the new belt lined up. Once the belt was on, I cranked it by hand to ensure that the camgear mark and the flywheel mark both lined up exactly, which they did. Good thing I followed the advice to mark the old belt before removing it!


----------



## jpepin (Feb 18, 2008)

*Re: Conti Tech? (Music Man)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Music Man* »_Anyone ever use the contitech timing belt water pump kit? If so do you know what actually comes with it? Bap Geon has it for $215
Thank you, Andy

I don't have a Bap Geon in my area, but I got this deal from ecstuning.com:
http://www.ecstuning.com/Volks...S2286/ for $239 with free shipping. Had everything I needed for a complete job, except for the G12 coolant. Not sure how it matches up to the kit you're looking at, but here are the components...
Kit Contents
Description	Brand	Qty
OE Timing Belt Continental - 1
Timing Belt Tensioner Roller Ina - 1
Timing Belt Tensioner With Small Roller Mission Trading Company -1
Water Pump With O-Ring Graf - 1
Thermostat - 87C Vemo - 1
Accessory Drive Belt Continental - 1
Thermostat O-Ring CRP - 1
Bolt M12x1.5x65 Genuine Volkswagen Audi -2
Shoulder Self Locking Bolt -Genuine Volkswagen Audi - 2
Camshaft Seal Elring -1
Crankshaft Seal - Priced Each Victor Reinz -1
Thermostat Housing Meyle - 1


----------



## jakeishere24 (Jun 6, 2007)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (trbochrgm02)*

Nice write up but the wheels are not that nice as you claim Enkei= Japanese>>>


----------



## nbkkb7x (Jan 12, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (jakeishere24)*

I used this back in February for my timing belt job. A few days ago I started hearing a faint rubbing. From I could make out, it was coming from the timing area. When I got my oil changed, I asked the VW tech to take a look at it. He came back and said the tensioner pulley and idler pulley were making the noise. Said I should replace them...again. Will I be able to swap out the tensioner and tensioner pulley WITHOUT taking the timing belt off? Anyone ever done this? Also, anyone have these two items fail, or begin to fail after only 8 months? Thanks.
-MP


----------



## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (nbkkb7x)*

So you did your own timing belt change in the freezing cold weather and you don't change your own oil??


----------



## nbkkb7x (Jan 12, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (MechEngg)*

Hahaha! I got an oil service plan with my GLI when I bought it. Oil changes are free for me...







Timing belt changes, not so much the free.
-MP


----------



## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (nbkkb7x)*

haha cheers. I got really confused there for a second. I was like, my sister cant turn on our tv in our house but she can change oil on her beater haha. (TRUE STORY)








Anyways something to check would be that the belt hasnt travelled inwards towards the block and started to rub on something. i have heard of that before and it makes a rubbing noise


_Modified by MechEngg at 8:36 AM 10-16-2009_


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## 78turbolader (Jan 16, 2003)

*Re: (rono1)*

I have never found these Timming Belts to have cracks at all!! I always find them to rip the teeth clean off the belt!! So be-care-ful on judging the belt from the out side like a old rabbit T-belt.. It dont work like that any more. The one i just did looked like it had just been done recently and yet it took off 12 teeth!! Bam! happy little dents in the pistons.. ouch Just for info car had 89K on it when it did this, so I would mos-def change these belts around 70-75k


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## 78turbolader (Jan 16, 2003)

*Re: (78turbolader)*

After a T-Belt fails.. Have you ever found that the head was OK after this?? I talked to a local machine shop and they told me that quite a few have come in with no problems at all,, no bent valves.. Have you encountered this? Just wondering..


----------



## dococ (Feb 22, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Finally did mine (05 GTI - AWP 65K miles). Took about 10 hours off and on - 4 hours to get the old belt off. Zeusenergy's suggestion about removing hard charge pipe was key. Had to jack the engine several inches up to completely remove the engine mount bracket - engine mount was already out of the car.
Bought a new water pump (HEPU) to replace the existing pump but the original OEM pump already had a metal impeller! PN was 06A 121 031C - can't find this in PartsLink so I don't know which vehicle/engine this is from.
Biggest difficulty was getting new belt on - old belt was stretched approx 1/2 tooth (from CAM to CRANK marks) so new belt was really tight - after lining all the marks up and installing tensioner, the idler pulley was the last to be installed. Wedged it so I could start the screw threads and then tightened it into place.
BTW the VW tool (T10092) used to compress the tensioner worked nicely.


----------



## Cetvorka (Dec 27, 2009)

I'm in the middle of this job right now... The motor mount makes me want to go out and kill


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## jspeedmkiv (Dec 3, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Cetvorka)*

x2
Are you going to do the cam and crank seals? They came in my kit, but with as much headache as this has been so far, I'm thinking I'm going to wait on them. 
At least I'll know all the tricks next time!


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## Cetvorka (Dec 27, 2009)

I didn't buy the seals, but I'm thinking with how much of a pain this is, I should probably do them, so I don't have to go back and do it again.


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## jspeedmkiv (Dec 3, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Cetvorka)*

I read the crank is a beast and requires a new crank bolt. (Am I right?)
What the heck would you even use to stop the crankshaft from advancing while you got the bolt off?

I also read this in a thread... "pppplleasseee dont change out your cam seal, if its not leaking... do you have any idea how hard it is to get that dam intake camshaft back into place? I still can't get it back on till this day. camshaft off allocation, whatever... And i also stripped my screws camshaft screws. did u know that i am screwed now? " http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4443273 
I guess I'm at the point where I'm deciding whether I'm going to do them or not. I can leave the car apart this week and continue next weekend if need be, but I'd really like an idea of what I'm looking at and can't seem to find much in the way of conclusive information on all those seals and their accompanying labor insanity...


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## Andy8 (Dec 7, 2007)

i dont know if anyone has done this or mentioned it in this thread but for the tesioner giving people trouble whn trying to put the tensioner in. insteaded of fighting the timing belt i used one big zip-tie and puwraped it around the belt and tightened it to pull it away from where the tensioner must go once i did that it was a direct bolt on affair with no trouble at all.


----------



## motorowlands (Dec 28, 2009)

Could someone tell me what the lever/handle in the 4th photo, step#5, is/does? It is the cast aluminum piece with all the numbers and the audi symbol on it right in the middle of the photo. 
Just got the car and it doesn't have a manual and could not find any info with a search just came across this photo reading all the posts.
Thanks


_Modified by motorowlands at 6:00 AM 12-29-2009_


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## Andy8 (Dec 7, 2007)

part of the shifting mechanism


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## motorowlands (Dec 28, 2009)

*Re: (Andy8)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Andy8* »_part of the shifting mechanism 

What does it do when moved between the two positions? It has to change something?
Thanks


----------



## jspeedmkiv (Dec 3, 2008)

*Re: (motorowlands)*


_Quote, originally posted by *motorowlands* »_
What does it do when moved between the two positions? It has to change something?
Thanks

Gears?









Couldn't resist!


----------



## Bajabug72 (Mar 24, 2006)

*Re: (jspeedmkiv)*

just finished doin the TB on my 02 GTI. not as bad as i was expecting. started at about 11:00 am and finished right @ 10:00 pm, but I ate, messed around with some other stuff, etc. actual wrench time was roughly 8 hours or less and thats taking my time. I've done one on a 2.0 AEG, but this is the first time on a 1.8t. mine has a FMIC and some other stuff so I didnt have to worry about the pancake charge pipe or whatever for the stock SMIC. biggest pains were the mount and the crank pulley. the mount would not come off until I got the belt loose and the tensioner off. I was finally able to work the mount back in after it was all back together. the crank pulley refused to part ways with the crank. I had to pry it off with a crow bar and then straighten the lower cover back up when I got it off. while out on my test drive after making sure all was good, I schooled a Tiburon.







he didnt have a chance.


----------



## jspeedmkiv (Dec 3, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Is it possible the TDC mark isn't as pronounced on the flywheel? I've got the cam gear set to TDC for sure, but the TDC mark on the flywheel looks like it's just lightly stamped on mine? Should it be a deep groove like I see in all the pictures I've found, or could it just be the stamped line? I'm so clueless at this point... Every other vehicle I've done this on, it seemed like there was a very pronounced mark; every single picture I find of TDC marks on here or the web, it shows a groove, not just a stamped line. On this ridiculous car all I can see is a stamped line and I can barely see it anyway! I've gotta get down at a funky angle where my chin is touching the battery to be able to see down there. 
I got everything off kilter with the 'bicycle chain' method and need to get it all back in sync. The stamped line is all I can find, is that correct? 'Bout to go nuts here...


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## Andaloons (Apr 16, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (jspeedmkiv)*

When I replaced my cylinder head, I tried to use the TDC mark on the flywheel too and I couldn't see diddly squat! 
So, I went ahead and used the "dipstick in cylinder 1" method and that worked fine for me. I just cranked back and forth until the dipstick was at the very highest position and went from there. No problems now for over 40,000 miles. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## jspeedmkiv (Dec 3, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Andaloons)*

Whoa. Ok, this one is a new one for me...
Pull cylinder 1's spark plug to do this? Cylinder 1 is on the end closest to the timing belt, right?


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## Andaloons (Apr 16, 2004)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (jspeedmkiv)*

Yes, Sir.


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## jspeedmkiv (Dec 3, 2008)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Andaloons)*

I'm going to try it in the morning! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Thanks!!


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## hollywoodman (May 26, 2009)

*Re: (groggory)*

wow people are funny, i would not recommend this the average joe. just an fyi if you are off a tooth the check engine light is on and the car runs rough, also if you are off more than a tooth you will cost your self thousands a lot of money to rpelace the valves you guys bent. so when the shop sais it was normal it is not. what happened in passat 1.8t, they came out with a new updated tensioner ( old style was a bal;l socket and it would brake) and the new t-belt has one more tooth. just to all the people, be careful and don't htink that job is cake work.


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## stv1der (Feb 3, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (trbochrgm02)*

bump http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## kmg108 (Jan 24, 2003)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (stv1der)*

I took the following pic for another reason. However, now that I look at it, did I install the timing belt cover backwards? Is the top supposed to overlap the bottom, or vice versa?


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## BlaktOut02 (Sep 4, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

great diy! did this on my awp and turned out great. saved me loads of $! Thanks! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

Just banged out another one of these at 140k on the '01 AWW GTI. This job never fails to impress. The plastic impeller on the water pump was cracked of course. All of the seals were perfect.


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## drewnashty (Jun 3, 2009)

No free slack to install new timing belt all the way, Tensioner still has the pin in it? ...
I got stuck on getting the T-belt installed all the way, maybe I'm not thinking rationally anymore from lack of sleep, but yea I think I missed something here when installing the timing belt with the new tensioner, roller and water pump installed, how do I free the slack to get the new belt all the way on?
PS the pin has not been pulled (so I thought there would be slack), I know I'm just overlooking something here but I'm at work now just back at the drawing board sort of speak.
Should I install the belt first with the tensioner off and then install tensioner?



_Modified by drewnashty at 5:59 PM 1-20-2010_


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

*Re: (drewnashty)*

The new belt will not have stretched yet so it will be tighter than the old one and more difficult to put on. Make sure you mark the new belt like the old one so that you get it put on exactly the same.
There are a couple of techniques to get the belt on. I put the belt on clockwise starting at the camshaft, then around the waterpump and then I get it partially onto the crank sprocket. Then I very carefully rotate the crank and push the belt further onto the crank sprocket as it rotates and wraps around. I think some people call this the bicycle chain method.
If this doesn't work for you, you can keep the tensioner loose and then rotate either the crank back a bit or rotate the cam forward a bit(like 1/4" is all you need), just enough to provide more slack to get the belt on. This will free up some tension. Make sure you observe your alignment marks so you don't get off alignment by 1 tooth. It is real easy for this to happen w/o marks. Then when you get the belt on you can go back and tighten down the tensioner.
With either method, once you have the belt in place, you pull the pin on the tensioner. Now you want to rotate the whole belt clockwise at the crank for a couple of revolutions to make sure the belt is properly seated. At TDC, your Cam and Crank sprockets should always line up perfectly. 


_Modified by olaf at 5:44 AM 1-21-2010_


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## jspeedmkiv (Dec 3, 2008)

*Re: (olaf)*


_Quote, originally posted by *olaf* »_The new belt will not have stretched yet so it will be tighter than the old one and more difficult to put on. Make sure you mark the new belt like the old one so that you get it put on exactly the same.
There are a couple of techniques to get the belt on. I put the belt on clockwise starting at the camshaft, then around the waterpump and then I get it partially onto the crank sprocket. Then I very carefully rotate the crank and push the belt further onto the crank sprocket as it rotates and wraps around. I think some people call this the bicycle chain method.
If this doesn't work for you, you can keep the tensioner loose and then rotate either the crank back a bit or rotate the cam forward a bit(like 1/4" is all you need), just enough to provide more slack to get the belt on. This will free up some tension. Make sure you observe your alignment marks so you don't get off alignment by 1 tooth. It is real easy for this to happen w/o marks. Then when you get the belt on you can go back and tighten down the tensioner.
With either method, once you have the belt in place, you pull the pin on the tensioner. Now you want to rotate the whole belt clockwise at the crank for a couple of revolutions to make sure the belt is properly seated. At TDC, your Cam and Crank sprockets should always line up perfectly. 

_Modified by olaf at 5:44 AM 1-21-2010_

The bicycle chain method worked best for me. I had to do it twice though, as either the cam or crank gear skipped a tooth the first time. Just took it off, put everything back at TDC and gave it a shot again... Cake. Car has been running strong for 500 miles so far.


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## bdew70 (Feb 2, 2010)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

I have followed these instructions and those in a Hanyes manual. I am at the point where I am to install the engine mount. Step 18 of the write up. However I cannot get it into position. I even tried removing the crank pulley and belt covers but no success. Could you help me out? How did you get it in there?

Thanks


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## PalmettoDub (Aug 10, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

@ Tim_1.8T , How much to come over to Naples and do my 1.8T Passat? Need any custom bodywork done? Need a Boser Hood done?








Oh and I have all the tools!!!!


_Modified by PalmettoDub at 8:04 AM 2-3-2010_


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## drewnashty (Jun 3, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (bdew70)*

Did you jack the motor up? it is much easier to move around the mount with the motor jacked up. I loosed the motor bolts on the other two just to help it raise freely.


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## maddenbowler (Dec 17, 2006)

is there a trick to removing the lower timing belt cover. i've removed the 5 bolts but it just doesnt want to come out. Do i need to move the engine mount to get it out?


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## olaf (Jun 8, 1999)

*Re: (maddenbowler)*

The lower sheet metal timing belt cover is a two piece cover. Sometimes it just gets stuck onto the motor. You should be able to get the top piece off first and then the lower piece comes out the bottom. You need to have the motor jacked up a bit to get at all of the bolts. 


_Modified by olaf at 3:39 AM 2-4-2010_


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## BlAcK20AE3088 (Jul 1, 2008)

*Re: (olaf)*

just finished mine 60,xxx. great diy i only had 2 problems obviously the motor mount sucked to work around. but i stripped the allen head bolt on the harmonic balancer pulley nbd just had to wait 2 days for the dealership to order it only 1.27 each.
wondering if anyone else ran into this though. i didnt undo any hoses or anything. but once i got everything buttoned up the fuel lines going from the rail back to the box behind the coolant ball. the 3 lines going back arent sitting flush like i thougt they were there sticking up like 2 inches and i couldnt push them down? are they ok if there not sitting down they appear to be secured to the line?


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## daryl2.slo (Apr 9, 2009)

*Re: (BlAcK20AE3088)*

when doing the timing belt and tensioner do you guys recommend doing the water pump to or na?


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## BlAcK20AE3088 (Jul 1, 2008)

*Re: (daryl2.slo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *daryl2.slo* »_when doing the timing belt and tensioner do you guys recommend doing the water pump to or na? 

yes..........might as well then you wont have to dig in there again


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## lazyozzygli (Nov 13, 2008)

*Re: (BlAcK20AE3088)*








my friend was kind enough to let me leave my car in his garage while we did this and spread it out over 2 days, it wasnt the most fun install but we used and engine hoist to move the engine around, made it alot easier and we were able to get that engine mount out after some moving it around but wasnt too diffiult to do thanks for the great DIY


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## jonny5r6 (Mar 12, 2010)

so i have my new timing belt on and i cranked the engine over but the cam mark and the crank mark are not lining up. (not the marks on the belt itself the actually timing marks on the engine) it seemed that the cam was off by one tooth. so i took the belt off to move it and now i have it back on, but the crank mark is like way off to the left. but i know the crank didn't move at all so how is it possible that it's not lined up anymore? i lined off both marks before i took the belt off in the first place so they should line up. any help would be awesome!


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## jonny5r6 (Mar 12, 2010)

so i have my new timing belt on and i cranked the engine over but the cam mark and the crank mark are not lining up. (not the marks on the belt itself the actually timing marks on the engine) it seemed that the cam was off by one tooth. so i took the belt off to move it and now i have it back on, but the crank mark is like way off to the left. but i know the crank didn't move at all so how is it possible that it's not lined up anymore? i lined off both marks before i took the belt off in the first place so they should line up. any help would be awesome!


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## 1.8turbolader (Jul 27, 2006)

Getting the new belt on is a PITA. treat it like a bicycle chain. treating it like a bicycle chain is the trick. get it on the cam and water pump and started on the crank and then turn the motor over clockwise working the belt on as you go. makes all the difference.


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## LMHConcepts (May 28, 2006)

*Re: (1.8turbolader)*

I know the process is pretty close to being the same, but how close is this diy to the timing belt exchange on a 2.0?


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## msdg137 (Mar 22, 2009)

*Tooth off...*

I changed the belt on my wolf yesterday and I noticed I have a roller left over







The tensioner already had a roller on it so Im not sure what my spare is for
















Any suggestions? 
Also the check engine light is on so I KNOW why...







Shes off a tooth counter clockwise Im sure... The original belt that I removed was clockwise a tooth according to the timing marks and after I installed the new one I felt that It would be fine that it was counterclockwise a tooth... The car disagrees... She runs like a champ starts fine has gobs of power but Im selling it and want it perfect... Tonight I shall ratchet strap the tensioner to the A-arm and try to negotiate the cam to it's proper position. wish me luck. Any advise before I tackle this endeavor?


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## AudiTToR (Nov 27, 2008)

*Re: Tooth off... (msdg137)*

go get a M5x55 bolt from home depot or lows and use that to tighten the tensioner....it will save a lot of anger issues later


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## sx2tmd (Dec 29, 2009)

*Re: Ultimate Timing Belt DIY! (Tim_1.8T)*

Does this steps work for a 03 jetta 2.0, automatic trans?


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## DrewDS (Apr 5, 2010)

So anyways, I have what appears a faulty tensioner.
When the car is cold, there is slack on the belt. It's not EXTREMELY loose, but if I gave it some effort I could definitely pull it off of the cam sprocket. As the car warms up, the belt tightens up, I guess the heat causes the fluid to expand slightly and push the piston the required 2-3mm further to make the belt de-facto tight. 
At cold, I can stick a screwdriver below the little protrusion where the piston of the tensioner puts the tension on the idler pulley and lift it slightly and the piston does indeed follow. It's almost like the tensioner wasn't filled with the correct amount of hydraulic fluid or something (I had the TB job done less than a year ago). 
Anyways, I guess the question is, the tensioner is obviously faulty and I'm sure it's not losing fluid, I think it was just never full enough to start with. I know this cause i can jack the idler pulley further than the piston on the tensioner extends and get my finger in there and there is no wetness. 
The first and most desirable option is to replace the whole tensioner. I didn't do the entire timing belt job originally because I don't have all of the tools, however I MIGHT be able to get away with doing just the tensioner itself with the tools I do have. Has anyone attempted this? 
I was thinking of this itinerary - get the cam sprocket and transmission markers at TDC first by cranking them into place with the electrical starter - then I could keep tension on the belt so it doesn't jump any teeth, remove the motor mount, jack the engine enough to get some room to get the old tensioner out and the new one in? Then check that everything is still lined up. This could probably be done pretty quickly too, couldn't it?
The second option I was thinking about is putting some sort of metal cap on the piston to give it those extra couple of MM required to give the tension required in like what I mentioned seemed like lack of hydraulic fluid from the factory. This would be very easy and only take a few minutes as I can easily get enough clearance to slip a cap on by lifting the idler pulley hard with a screwdriver, I can get it up beyond the length that the piston extends and then slip on a cap.
Any suggestions, and most importantly has anyone been able to do just the tensioner (someone in a similar situation as me with a faulty new tensioner) rather quickly?
Cheers.


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## felsen890 (Apr 17, 2010)

*Re: (DrewDS)*

Just completed timimng belt change after engine died and I found the timing belt lost teeth right at the crank gear. Hopefully lucky happened at a complete stop in the driveway. All done and cam and crank aligned with their marks.
Engine turns over but does not start. What could have happened?


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## Andaloons (Apr 16, 2004)

*Re: (felsen890)*


_Quote, originally posted by *felsen890* »_Just completed timing belt change after engine died and I found the timing belt lost teeth right at the crank gear. Hopefully lucky happened at a complete stop in the driveway. All done and cam and crank aligned with their marks.
Engine turns over but does not start. What could have happened?









Dude, what you had on your hands in the first place was a timing belt failure which caused valve damage. The 1.8t Volkswagen motor is an interference engine which means that if the timing is wrong then the pistons occupy the same space as the valves. 
Simply changing a timing belt after a timing belt failure is getting you NO WHERE. You are back to where you started this wild goose chase. If your pistons hit your valves due to timing failure your pistons (which are 100 times stronger than your valves) bent your valves causing lack of compression and in turn lack of combustion. 
You need to do some serious reading and find a nice rebuilt head or get your current head rebuilt with new valves. Go ahead an pull you cylinder head and find out how many bent valves you have and go from there.
Good luck!


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## mtnbrdr (Aug 16, 2008)

So I just tackled this job but ran into problems of my own at the end. Basically I didn't set the car to TDC because I had read elsewhere that it wasn't a big deal, as long as you mark everything. So I did and double checked my marks about a thousand times. But when I go to put the belt back on it was off by a tooth...took everything apart and tried the old belt, still off by a tooth. I'm very confused and looking for any good advice you guys can give me


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## woody258 (Sep 18, 2009)

*Re: (mtnbrdr)*

When doing mine, with crank sprocket at tdc mark, the cam sprocket due to valve placement and valve springs I guess, stay about a tooth counter clockwise from where it needed to be. I had to put a wrench on it and turn it clockwise to line up marks and hold it there while my dad got the belt on correctly. We then zip tied it to the sprocket so it couldn't move while I positioned the idler pulley in place.


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

First, I have to plug www.dityautorepair.com in Kissimmee, FL. You can rent a full lift for $20 and hour and have access to all their tools (Air tools are $1 per tool, all others are free). They also have ASC certified techs available for $70 an hour to do the work for you or provide a helping hand. Open late Mon-Sat and will open for you upon request for Sundays. Nice guys and great shop for the DIY novice and savvy.

I followed this guide pretty close and read every single reply to make sure I caught all the little tricks. Took me 8 hours with no breaks mostly because I didn't know if I could get better access from above or below so I was constantly raising and lowering the car. Also slowing me down was using and overhead engine brace; it might have been easier supporting it from underneath and not bother with the lift. 

One note: I wasn't able to follow this guide's recommendation to put the tensioner on last. The mount kept putting tension on the belt and I couldn't hold the mount, position the tensioner pulley, and attach the tensioner all at the same time. I had to ask for help from the tech who ended up putting the belt on for me. Basically, he took the belt off, attached the tensioner and forced the belt on using the bicycle chain method. He looked at me funny because of the belt marking technique I used from this guide. He kept checking TDC while positioning the belt, but in the end, my marks worked and he seemed surprised. Note: he didn't charge me for his time so that's why I'm plugging his shop at the top.

So, $220 for parts (ESC Ultimate kit), $171 for renting the shop for 8 hours =


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## ypsetihw (Nov 20, 2008)

gonna use this next week to put on my ECS ultimate t-belt kit with my friend. looking forward to it!


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## bass4usall (Aug 12, 2007)

I've done some wrenching in my day, but now I live in a town home and my garage doesn't have space and I don't have the patience to do this job anymore. I did have an 83 and an 84 Rabbit that I did the timing belt on many years ago, it was a pain in the ass then I can only imagine what a pain a 2004 GTI will be.

Some guys asked what the job costs at a dealer in an earlier thread from 2007. I checked with my local VW Dealer which is Palisades VW, in Nyack, NY, and they estimated $1350.00! I said, "You gotta be ****in' ****tin' me!" Rapid Parts and Service in Monsey NY estimated $850.00 and International Auto Works in Blauvelt NY estimated $700.00. All theses estimates include a new water pump and all the tensioners and rollers. 

My questions is: My 2004 GTI has 74,000 miles on it. Like 1/2 of the nation, I've recently lost a job and I can't afford to pay any of these places and since I do have a warranty until 100,000 miles, how much damage will I do to the engine if I wait until the timing belt goes and then have it repaired under warranty? 

Can any of you guys recommend a mechanic in Rockland County New York? Any of you guys wanna do the job for me for less? I was right. It didn't hurt to ask. 

Thanks to any who reply!

bass4usall


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

Well, from what I've read, damage would be to the valves, valve seats, and possibly pistons. Good luck getting that all fixed under warranty. Again, from what others have said, repair costs have been $3k-$5k. You'll probably work harder fighting your local dealership than doing it yourself. I was at 106,500 when I did mine and I know I was on borrowed time. I kept the RPMs low and drove soft till I got the parts in.


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

I followed this write up.. I found the motor mount easy to slide out after I removed the tensioner, idler pulley, and belt. I have the mount back on and trying to put on the tensioner.. I can not do it for the life of me.. It was easy to put it on without the mount..

I try to jack up the engine with the mount in there.. It just gets wedged in between the chassis and the motor.. I'm like at the end of my rope


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

DowNnOuTDubin said:


> I followed this write up.. I found the motor mount easy to slide out after I removed the tensioner, idler pulley, and belt. I have the mount back on and trying to put on the tensioner.. I can not do it for the life of me.. It was easy to put it on without the mount..
> 
> I try to jack up the engine with the mount in there.. It just gets wedged in between the chassis and the motor.. I'm like at the end of my rope


When I did mine, I put the mount on last (after the belt is done). If it's not already in place just floating around, you might have to jack the engine up quite a bit to get the mount back in.


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

I'm not sure if it was because I had a 6 speed giving me less room or what not.. Although I couldn't get it from the top with the motor jacked up as high as it goes. I tried to unbolt all the motor mounts. Also someone suggested that he left the trans mounts in but put a jack on the trans and jacked part of the oil pan (closet part to trans) which did give me the most amount of clearance and height. Although I couldn't get it in from the top. So, this is how I did it.

First put water pump back on.

Then idler pulley.

Align belt to marks and put on.

slide motor mount underneath (I had the motor dropped all the way down). I slid it under by the charge pipe.

Then moved the belt sideways to get the mount by, then slipped it up past the water pump pulley post and idler pulley.

Hold motor mount out of way. I first got the lower bolt in on the tensioner hand tight. Then went on to the upper
bolt and got it in.

tighten tensioner bolts

check timing marks.

Crank it over by hand a few times, if timing marks line up, pull the pin!

With the mount loose in there you can get the two rear bolts in with the motor lowered all the way. Then I jacked it all the way up to get the center bolt by the water pump pulley.


DONEEE!! 

I would personally do it this way if I had to do it again. I hope it might help some people :beer:


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## Silver1.8T. (Mar 11, 2009)

did the timing belt earlier. everything looked ok but after the second start up i had a cel light. code was 16395

6395/P0011/000017 - Bank 1: Camshaft A (Intake): Retard Setpoint not Reached (Over-Advanced)

Possible Symptoms
Power Loss
Possible Causes
Camshaft Adjustment Valve 1 (N205) faulty
Fuel Pump Relay (J17) faulty
Possible Solutions
Check Camshaft Adjustment Valve 1 (N205)
Check Fuel Pump Relay (J17)
Special Notes
When found in Engine: 4.0l W8
Check TPL 2010059(RoW)
Check/Replace Oil Sieve in Timing Case (Camshaft Adjuster)


could this mean that i am off by a tooth?


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## VDub Dan-O (Mar 24, 2010)

*Thank You*

A big thank you to the OP for this thread. 
I did my timing belt today on the Beetle. 
:beer: 
I love the design that uses the 3mm wrench holder for the accessory belt, what a great idea. 
Took a few minutes longer than 4 hours including taking my time, soda and back breaks. 
It's tight under that Beetle bonnet! 
I highly recommend using the nail polish method for lining up the timing marks!! 
I would've been a tooth off if I didn't do that trick. 

Once I get home from my sons soccer practice I will enjoy a cold adult beverage. 
:laugh:


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## Silver1.8T. (Mar 11, 2009)

Silver1.8T. said:


> did the timing belt earlier. everything looked ok but after the second start up i had a cel light. code was 16395
> 
> 6395/P0011/000017 - Bank 1: Camshaft A (Intake): Retard Setpoint not Reached (Over-Advanced)
> 
> ...


 this was user error caused by me 
i did not disconnect the battery cause i wanted to listen to the radio. i guess when i manually cranked the engine over to check timing the sensor saw the cam movement 

i erased the code on saturday night and it never came back 

thanx to the OP for the detailed instructions


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## VDub Dan-O (Mar 24, 2010)

BlAcK20AE3088 said:


> just finished mine 60,xxx. great diy
> wondering if anyone else ran into this though. i didnt undo any hoses or anything. but once i got everything buttoned up the fuel lines going from the rail back to the box behind the coolant ball. the 3 lines going back arent sitting flush like i thougt they were there sticking up like 2 inches and i couldnt push them down? are they ok if there not sitting down they appear to be secured to the line?


 My EVAP line pulled up a bit and it still looks OK. 
I didn't move the fuel line around though.


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## gtimitch (Nov 20, 2006)

getabetterdub said:


> Don't take the pulley off. I used the 'bicycle chain' method and worked fine all the 13 times I put the belt on (wasn't sure about the timing). Put the belt on the cam gear, between the tensioner and pulley, and the other side over the water pump. Then get about two or three teeth around the crank. Use the 19mm 12point ratchet to turn the crank while holding the belt on it. It will advance the belt onto the crank. Double check after it's on to be sure your marks still line up (or ensure both the cam gear and flywheel are still both TDC).


 This method is effective and sounds easy but it was also easy for me to get it a tooth off. Never the less, I believe it is the best way to get the belt on -- thanks for the DIY. The thread came in handy at just the right time.


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## Dub-Nub (Sep 27, 2005)

Question: If the previous timing belt job was done and a metal water pump was put in, should i go ahead and replace it again?


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

I would.. When I pulled my water pump the bearing wasn't riding too smoothly.. I assumed maybe the bearing seal was broken and it leaked in coolant. 

It's better to be safe then sorry :beer:


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## Dub-Nub (Sep 27, 2005)

Im going to i suppose. 

Trying to order from ecs tuning but their 'Free shipping" is being a little bitch. Trying to order fk streetline coilovers that have free shipping, ultimate timing belt kit that has free shipping, a coolant tank and upper strut mount kit. With two items that have free shipping i can only include one other item with it LOL. 

Don't know how they do their phylosaphy. I will probably place two orders.


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## toastforbrekkie (Sep 4, 2009)

*My water pump made it to 91,000*



ericj said:


> This is inexcusable, and if i ever visit germany I'm going to track down the engineer who made this decision and smack him around a bit.


My guess is the engineer wanted a proper metal impeller, but the bean counter (who, to be fair, is just trying to keep the price of the car low enough to sell) told him to use plastic because it's cheaper. That or, considering they manufacture millions of cars, they were seeking the profit savings of pennies x millions.

That said, it is inexcusable. Just don't go after the engineer.

My 2003 GTi 1.8T overheated on the way into work this morning (the thermostat sailed north after a 2nd gear pull to redline...can't imagine why). I limped it home, and I'll hopefully be using this DIY to fix it this weekend. Looking forward to all the motor mount/belt replacement problems everyone else had.


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## bicycleboy58 (Dec 18, 2009)

thank you so much. 2.5 mornings of work with lil to know frustration and my car is ready for another 90k miles thanks to your help.


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## greenhorn999 (Aug 15, 2010)

*Where is the harmonic balancer pulley?*

I'm making good progress for a guy who likes to work with his hands. I own a 2000 VM New Beetle and replacing a timing belt that completely stripped out of nowhere. Cletes on the floor - the whole nine and car just stopped running while driving and now it won't start.

I believe I'm on Step 7 which says to remove the harmonic balancer pullet before aligning the TDC on the flywheel and camshaft (crankshaft?). But I can't find it. Here's some pictures of what I'm seeing and hopefully someone can tell me where this thing is? The middle/lower timing belt cover hasn't been removed (yet) or the engine mount. As it stands, I align the top but that puts the flywheel out of sync. I align the flywheel and that puts the top out of sync.

Your comments are greatly appreciated!


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## greenhorn999 (Aug 15, 2010)

*Where to place jack under engine when lifting it up?*

Where is the best place to jack up the engine when removing the engine mount without damaging parts below? And where does the 2X4 go? I have it all - just want to make sure I don't assume anything. Thanks again everyone,


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## greenhorn999 (Aug 15, 2010)

*Harmonic balancer pulley*

I believe I found the harmonic balancer pulley (I _think_) but when I turn it to adjust the flywheel, both wheels are off the ground which is fine I guess because the notches line up perfectly. If I try to remove the pulley, the same 12-point bolt I use to adjust the timing is going to screw up the flywheel alignment. Any tricks to prevent this from happening? And how to remove the keep the wheels locked while removing the 19mm 12-point bolt that holds the pulley in place?


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## epeephile (Jul 13, 2010)

The harmonic balancer pulley is the bottom pulley that the serp. belt goes around.

You can remove it by taking off the four inside hex screws (6mm I believe). You are right that it is where the 12 point wrench went. The balancer pulley is the one that sits on top of the crank pulley.

-w


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## epeephile (Jul 13, 2010)

I just wanted to say thank you very much for this thread.

Replaced the TB in my gf's jetta over the weekend using this write up.

The biggest issue we had was the damned motor mount. Kept getting in the way, and then eventually we got it out, put the tensioner in, and then found out we had to take it back out in order to put the mount back in.

Took us a long time (myself and a friend), but we got it done.

-w


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## six sigma (Jun 22, 2007)

I used this thread with good results a couple of weeks ago, so cheers Vortex! Saving money by diy = good.

ps - when I pulled the water pump out, about a third of the plastic impeller was fragments. Guess I got to this just in time.


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## greenhorn999 (Aug 15, 2010)

*update*

I got it - thank you very much. I removed the screws but it APPEARED the 12-point 19" nut was holding it on and I didn't want to pull off a bolt that need to be replaced. A little tug on the pulley and it came right off. Thank you very much!


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## Jeffus13 (Apr 12, 2009)

O2VW1.8T said:


> _Quote, originally posted by *Craig King* »_How much would this ordinarily cost to get done at a dealership or garage?
> 
> dealer is around 500 for labor plus parts


i paid around 1098 for it in Arkansas in 2007 on my 1.8T. Had the local Audi dealer do it... i did my own 2.8L passat a couple weeks ago for 350 bucks plus a 35 dollar tool kit rental from Blau...


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## greenhorn999 (Aug 15, 2010)

Major props to the OP for posting this DIY. I wish there were more like how to replace bent valves. 

But my car had everything replaced (thank you MJM AutoHaus for the "PLUS EXTRA" DIY timing belt kit!) and still wouldn't start. Now it's at the VW dealership because I not only want this damn thing fixed but get a warranty behind it. Sucks but if you're gonna pay out the nose, might as well pay it out the ears, mouth and bellybutton as well.

Again, I wouldn't have been able to do this without your walk-through so THANK YOU.

For those looking to replace their valves as a result of a bad timing belt or a belt that that broke (mine stripped), there is another excellent walk-through with visual step-by-step to fix that as well. That get's pretty wiggy but well documented, annotated photos and decent explanations.

Thanks again!


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## mrianti (Dec 13, 2009)

TDC mark on flywheel 03 GTI Tiptronic 

I was not able to locate the bottom one .


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## schwartzmagic (Apr 29, 2007)

Gonna tackle this next week because my water pump finally failed after 84K LOL. Thank God it was the pump and not the belt. Either way it wouldn't have mattered. I have a p&p head with Supertech valvetrain and IE rods that were waiting around to be put in. It's gonna be a big job but it's all necessary for the BT that's gonna be installed in a few months. Wish me luck. :laugh:


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## evolmachine (Sep 5, 2010)

Thanks for the write up, it helped immensely. I'd just like to add for my 03 1.8T:

Remove both passenger and driver's side engine mounts and tilt the engine so its lower on the drivers side to get that passenger side mount out of the way. You have to remove the air box to access the two bolts for the driver's side mount but it'll save you *so much time* its completely worth the extra 5 minutes to go this extra step!

Careful jacking up and down your engine. I wasn't paying close enough attention and the wood block slipped out! The engine dropped 2 inches onto the jack and punched a hole in my oil pan. I'm trying to see it as cutting into my profits with the money I'm saving on labor  Plus I get to check for sludge when I drop the pan! yay!!

I also broke my oil dip stick tube trying to gain access to the thermostat. It was brittle as hell and the smallest bump completely shattered it at the base. Oops. The wife is not thrilled with how much this "maintenance" is costing me in money and time on the holiday weekend :laugh:


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## schwartzmagic (Apr 29, 2007)

evolmachine said:


> The wife is not thrilled with how much this "maintenance" is costing me in money and time on the holiday weekend :laugh:


Oh God tell me about it. I haven't even started and the wife is already complaining about how much money I've spent between parts and tools for the t-belt, build head and rod install I'm gonna do.


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## mikebergy (Dec 2, 2007)

*Thank You!*

Thanks for the writeup. My water pump failed on my 337 at 77000 miles, so I decided to do the timing belt as well. The writeup is excellent, leaving nothing uncovered. This was the first time I've had to work on a German car, and must say that there is a lot more room to work around than my Integra. The stock motor mounts are just as klunky though, and if I ever end up playing with the car more, will look for aftermarket mounts to clean-up the bay, and give a little more room to work in the engine bay.


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## renata (Oct 1, 2010)

*Timing belt*

This sounds great!!! Can we do it on New Beetle 1.8T 2001? Thank you


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## MI_canuck (Dec 21, 1999)

Finally did the timing belt on my '04 Jetta 1.8T over the weekend... 97,300 miles... was about due. 

Belt didn't look bad at all, but I don't know if they show signs of anything before they let go... 

In any case, did it with a buddy that has done a few of them. Took about 4 hrs. The longer part is taking all the stuff out (wheel well panel, IC pipe, degas bottle, power steering reservoir, disconnecting all the hoses, and removing engine mount)... the job itself isn't bad, especially with a shop manual. Lining up the timing marks was straightforward. Just need patience since you have to bias the marks a bit so that when the belt is fully on, the marks all line up. First time they were off, so we just clocked things a bit and redid and was right on after that.

Scarriest thing was discovering that my timing was OFF by a tooth or two. Something the DEALERSHIP had done back at around 47,000 miles when they replaced a failed water pump (under warranty). Of course, at the time, they just put a plastic impeller pump back in and didn't replace the timing belt.

The ECS kits are extremely well put together and have all you need. Down to new engine mount bolts and some G12 coolant. Serpentine belt included too.

Now with the timing marks aligned CORRECTLY... car runs very smooth and can feel a bit of midrange (that was lost from having the timing off (retarded) by a tooth.

Probably won't wait until another 97,000 miles for the next one though.  If I keep the car long enough, will do at around 175,000.


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## Schnook (Mar 4, 2009)

Yup yup. I did my timing today and overall happy its done. My gti has only 69k on it but was anxious to get it finished before it gets colder. The B***H of the job was the engine bracket to the mount out...Ended up leaving it in the bay after I pulled the belt. My AWP 1.8t was at least a tooth off by using the fw mark. I wasn't anticipating this but was happy I used the FW mark. The coolant indeed dropped at least a gallon pulling the waterpump. Since I got a kit from ECS Tuning, got it with two literes of G12 coolant. The next thing I found was the engine mount looked it tore minorly from wear over time so thats the next task:laugh:


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## mk2michal (Sep 26, 2009)

for a guy that never changed a timing belt how hard would it be for this guy (ME )


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## Schnook (Mar 4, 2009)

mk2michal said:


> for a guy that never changed a timing belt how hard would it be for this guy (ME )


Well, its a job and it sucks Best thing to do is plan a full day so you can take a few breathers. Some people can get this done in several hours. Most enthusiasts take 10 hours if this is their first timing job. But as long as you did it right, you won the race:thumbup:


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## evolmachine (Sep 5, 2010)

your the best judge of your own skill level, ability to follow directions, and _patience_. I've only done two timing belt jobs in my life, one on an accord and one on a jetta. they both sucked, but I would do it again to save myself some money.


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## MI_canuck (Dec 21, 1999)

Schnook said:


> My AWP 1.8t was at least a tooth off by using the fw mark. I wasn't anticipating this but was happy I used the FW mark.


hmmm.. really??

We just lined up the pulley marks for both the cam and crank... Was off by about a tooth when we pulled it apart - dealer was last to work on car when they replaced water pump at like 47,XXX miles. So we put new belt in, (along with tensioner and metal water pump), and ligned up the pulley marks correctly this time. But didn't bother checking the FW mark.

Car does run smoother and pulls stronger now (assuming pulley marks are correct). My impression is the dealer screwed up.... but I do wonder now about the FW mark. Should checked. But as I said, car feels noticeably better now, not only power wise but smoothness.

I'll try and check the FW mark at some point when I have time.


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## Schnook (Mar 4, 2009)

MI_canuck said:


> hmmm.. really??
> 
> We just lined up the pulley marks for both the cam and crank... Was off by about a tooth when we pulled it apart - dealer was last to work on car when they replaced water pump at like 47,XXX miles. So we put new belt in, (along with tensioner and metal water pump), and ligned up the pulley marks correctly this time. But didn't bother checking the FW mark.
> 
> ...


A lot of people don't use the flywheel marks. I think it boils down to point of preference. I marked both the belt and used the marks to see if they line up which they didn't. So I utilized the fw as a reference point for TDC at the crank. I also replaced the clutch and flywheel in the spring so I was more confident using it.
However, I believe a lot of shops are not as precise as we pay for (not saying all, there are techs and shops that take pride in their work like any trade). However, I spent way too much money on parts/labor and came out much behind. Just a bad skidmark of luck on my part and thats why I now do my own work. At any rate, my car runs much better than before as well as yours...here's a :beer::thumbup:


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## FLA-BORN (Oct 20, 2010)

Very helpful thread going on here!

First let me say, I don't want to be redundant in asking these questions, I have read almost every word in this thread from page one to page fifteen over the last two days but still have some gray areas.

I am getting ready to do the timing belt and water pump on my wife's Passat 2003 1.8T. Like I said, I have read this thread from the first page to the last and made notes etc to assist me, so I don't have to search for pertinent information when I actually get involved...in doing so, I have developed a few questions/concerns.

1) It appears that there is no mark on the flywheel if you have an automatic transmission. If this is so important then what is our option? I'm no "timing expert" but it seems to me from reading here, that, it is not good enough to simply set the cam and crank gears to the marks. In other words, is it enough to simply set the to gears to the indicator marks, mark the belt, remove and replace with a new one? Does the engine need to be set to TDC as long as you mark...pull a belt and replace a belt? It doesn't seem to me that using the "dipstick method" in the #1 cylinder is accurate enough for something so critical.

2) I read not too far back that the new belts have an "extra tooth from the original ones". Doesn't this affect everything immensely?

3) This marking procedure doesn't seem like it would be too accurate since you are using an old belt to mark a new one, maybe I'm thinking too much here. Do you simply lay the old belt down and try and position the new one on top of it to match marks? Do you need to spread the belt out with a couple of weight plates for instance to take up slack while making the marks? What if the belt is stretched when you go to match them up? Wouldn't this throw you off? What about the "extra tooth"?

4) It appears that there are different kits depending on engine codes stamped on the block somewhere; it this true or are all kits the same as long as they are for a 1.8T? 

5) I've read conflicts on whether the motor mount bolts are stretch bolts or not (or other bolts for that matter) are they or aren't they?

6) I guess I'll find out but I am having a hard time understanding how you could line-up your marks when replacing the belt and end up "one tooth off" if the new belt is as tight as everyone says. It seems if you match your marks (crank and cam) and get the belt on and then release the tensioner (on a belt that's already tight) that it couldn't possibly jump a tooth (or spline). Am I missing something here?

7) I've read where the tensioner may need to be re-compressed; I understand it can be done with a m5x55 bolt, however I've read where people have broken this bolt. I've also read where people have put the tenioner in a vise to compress it, this seems very dangerous to me, is there a possibility of it jumping out of the vise and taking your head off? 

8) I guess my main concern is, what is a fool proof way to be absolutely sure I am at TDC without having the mark to go by on the flywheel?

I guess these are all questions I have for myself for when I get started, but if anyone wants to help me get a better perspective on one or all of them, it would be greatly appreciated. Some of these things seem a little vague to me, as I'm trying to picture it all without having begun yet, I'm out of town and won't even start until this weekend when I get home, I'm just trying to get as ready as possible before I get home. I got an estimate from a mechanic whom I've used many times over the years that is fully capable, I thought was a good price for the amount of work involved, $360.00 for labor only (WP & TB, etc) (I would supply the parts/kit). It is a price that has given me one more thing to think about, if it were $460.00 I would even hesitate to do it myself or of it were $300.00 I wouldn't hesitate to have him do it but, boy, that $360.00 is right there at the "should I or shouldn't I amount".

Thanks again for ANY input!


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

FLA-BORN said:


> I guess these are all questions I have for myself for when I get started, but if anyone wants to help me get a better perspective on one or all of them, it would be greatly appreciated. Some of these things seem a little vague to me, as I'm trying to picture it all without having begun yet, I'm out of town and won't even start until this weekend when I get home, I'm just trying to get as ready as possible before I get home. I got an estimate from a mechanic whom I've used many times over the years that is fully capable, I thought was a good price for the amount of work involved, $360.00 for labor only (WP & TB, etc) (I would supply the parts/kit). It is a price that has given me one more thing to think about, if it were $460.00 I would even hesitate to do it myself or of it were $300.00 I wouldn't hesitate to have him do it but, boy, that $360.00 is right there at the "should I or shouldn't I amount".
> 
> Thanks again for ANY input!


1. There is a notch on the inside of your harmonic ballancer. The metal cover behind the harmonic balancer pulley, there is a VERRRRY small bend in the metal where you align the mark on the harmonic balancer. When I saw the mark on the cover, I thought it was just a imperfection or someone slightly banged it and it bent.

(see the VERY slight indent on the cover behind the pulley)









2)I haven't read that, if that was the case the timing would be thrown off further and further every revolution. 

3)You can barley get the belt on with the tensioner applying no pressure to the belt. My old belt didn't even stretch much at all. I'm sure the belt would last another 65k+, although my water pump was about to blow. Or your idle roller bearing will go out. The marks you painted on the belt help (makes it more obvious if you are 1 tooth off), but I rely on the timing marks provided from the factory. Once everything is lined up check your timing marks crank the motor over a few times by hand and check after each revolution.

4)I got mine from ECStuning.. However, I'd just make sure it's for a transverse engine. They probably could be the same (logistical and transverse) but I wouldn't take my word. ECStuning will give you the right kit and from me doing my research it was the cheapest.

5)The bolts *ARE* stretch bolts. Anything colored green is a stretch bolt from Vw/Audi. Also most anything that has an extra turn after torqing is a stretch bolt.

7) I've had to press the tensioner back in and just used a bench vice. Don't worry it's not that much pressure, otherwise it would snap your belt. Or be extremely hard on the timing belt idle roller bearing.



All in all you will have most issues with the motor mount that bolts to the block. $360 isn't bad for labor.. It could put you towards the end of your rope.



DowNnOuTDubin said:


> I'm not sure if it was because I had a 6 speed giving me less room or what not.. Although I couldn't get it from the top with the motor jacked up as high as it goes. I tried to unbolt all the motor mounts. Also someone suggested that he left the trans mounts in but put a jack on the trans and jacked part of the oil pan (closet part to trans) which did give me the most amount of clearance and height. Although I couldn't get it in from the top. So, this is how I did it.
> 
> First I put water pump back on.
> 
> ...


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## Znsale01 (Jul 9, 2010)

Mounting the engine and putting everything back on today! My first timing belt/ water pump replacement has been a huge success so far and it was also the first time fixing something complicated (at least to me) under the hood (replaced a pcv hose and a coolant line or 2, upgraded exhaust, and custom SRI... Thats all the work I've ever done on a car!) 

If you can read, turn a wrench, and have plenty of patience you can do this yourself and save 300 or more! For me thats 300 more towards a new chipped ECU  Take the time to read the posts after the DIY and search for other DIY's as well. I only used the DIY here and posts after for clarification and everything went very smooth in only 9ish hours split in 2 days.


Thanks a ton for this DIY you saved me and a lot of other people tons of money! I also learned a lot more about my car as well 


:beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer:


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## evolmachine (Sep 5, 2010)

how critical are the stretch bolts? If every green bolt is a stretch bolt I took like 6-8 of em out and put em right back in. Most had white marker on them so I would just torque em down with my torque elbow till it felt about right and then a bit more or less to line up the old marks... I didn't replace a single bolt. 

I'm trying to remember exactly how many there were. I think I took 3 out for the passenger side mount and 2 for the drivers side, and then there were 3 more? for the second part of the passenger mount... thats a lot of ****e to have to replace!


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## FLA-BORN (Oct 20, 2010)

DowNnOuTDubin, thanks for your reply!

I think there MUST be some way to mark TDC on this car with automatic tranny! Why would VW put the mark on the flywheel of a car with a manual transmission and not put it on cars with automatic transmissions?

It does, however, seem like a fail-safe procedure to get things back correctly if you start out with the cam and crank on the indicator marks and end up that way at the end, as long as you don't inadvertently rotate the cam independently and forget which way you rotated it or if you went around more than one revolution. Anybody agree?

Am I understanding correctly, that, the ONLY stretch bolts are the ones on the motor mounts? Or are there more you would encounter while disassembling other things (i.e. water pump, tensioner etc)?

Does anyone know if there is an accessible lifting eye on the top of the engine? Like I said, I won't be back to the car until this weekend so I'm not there looking at it right now. I have an engine hoist but I will have to drive 40 miles to go get it. It seems like it would be well worth it though if there's a lifting eye. It seems like there will be plenty of time spent under the car!


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

Well the timing marks are fail proof on the cam sprocket and crank pulley. If you used the flywheel it would be a lot easier to be off a tooth. Just crank it over a few times by hand and make sure the marks line up each time on the factory marks :beer:

ECStuning has a kit that gives you all the stretch bolts that are needed to be replaced. There are 3 on the mount that bolts to the block and 2 that bolt the other part of the mount to the chassis. That's the only ones I can think off the top of my head that needed to be replaced. Like I said anything that is slightly green needs to be replaced. FYI some of the water pump and the cover bolts (same ones) are easily stripped.

There is no need for a hoist. An extra jack might be helpful to help you get a bit of extra room (10-15mm tops :laugh

Also both of your intake and exhaust cams are on a chain. So the camshaft sprocket aren't easily turned. Also the same with the compression you have on your bottom end with your crank moving. There shouldn't be an issue of those turning.


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## FLA-BORN (Oct 20, 2010)

Thanks! Good information!


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## Znsale01 (Jul 9, 2010)

Just to clarify, you have to put the side motor mount piece on the engine before getting the timing belt on the cranks right? If so I had my timing perfect (marked old belt and cam and lower crank 2 top marks 1 lower mark) and everything up to the timing cover put on then read by other people on here that the side mount had to be on first.


Also what could I use as a t-belt tensioner pin since I pulled the original and misplaced it. VW shop said I would have to buy a whole new tensioner!


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## Znsale01 (Jul 9, 2010)

someones gotta know I'm starting in 2 hours and would love to have this info by then!


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## evolmachine (Sep 5, 2010)

Znsale01 said:


> Also what could I use as a t-belt tensioner pin since I pulled the original and misplaced it. VW shop said I would have to buy a whole new tensioner!


I used a very small allen wrench. a drill bit that size would work too. btw, the allen wrench bent a little under the pressure, but not so much that it couldn't be pulled out.


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## FLA-BORN (Oct 20, 2010)

There is no need for a hoist. An extra jack might be helpful to help you get a bit of extra room (10-15mm tops :laugh


I see you are laughing but I get the feeling you're quite serious.


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## Znsale01 (Jul 9, 2010)

Everything is connected and the cam and flyweel marks line up and the belt is ready to be put on. I was able to put the belt on perfectly the first time i got it on, so it should be smooth sailing from here :thumbup:


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## ypsetihw (Nov 20, 2008)

*great writeup thanks!*

used this a few months back and it went off without a hitch. I definitely wouldn't have tried this by myself, but with my mechanic buddy and a couple aderol we tore it through in about 7 hours start to finish. 

worst part, of everything that could have gone wrong, I LOST MY WHEEL LOCK :banghead:


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## FLA-BORN (Oct 20, 2010)

It appears this whole thread has been about a "Transverse" engine" not "Longitudinal". I presume everything is the same (as far as the procedure goes) with the exception of having to deal with the engine mount. 

Mine is Longitudinal, I wonder how common this is and why VW would make the same car with different orientation in engines! Or maybe they didn't make the car in '03 with transverse engine?? I don't know.

Also, I couldn't find the three character code that is supposed to be stamped on the tab on the block, the tab IS there but it is slick with no stamp. ECS told me it also may be found in the trunk under the mat near the spare tire, I did find the code but it was off by itself on a tag and didn't indicate that it had anything to do with the engine. ECS also told me that you need that code, the entire kit is the same for different engines (i.e. tensioner, idler, water pump etc), with the exception of the timing belt, one belt is longer depending on your code. There are four different 3 character codes that pertain to this engine (1.8T). They are as follows...AEB, ATW, AUG, and AWM. Mine happens to be AWM (or at least I hope it is because that's the kit I ordered). Like I said, there was nothing near the code to indicate it had anything to do with the engine but it was the only code I could find that matched any of the four!

In other words...My timing belt is towards the front of the car behind the grill and the fans, NOT facing the passenger side of the car!


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## biggoodjohn (Dec 7, 2006)

*Engine mount*

If not for the engine mount, this job (although it takes a lot of time) would be a piece of cake.


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## biggoodjohn (Dec 7, 2006)

*What model do you have? All mkiv Jettas should be transverse.*

What model do you have? All mkiv Jettas should be transverse. 



FLA-BORN said:


> It appears this whole thread has been about a "Transverse" engine" not "Longitudinal". I presume everything is the same (as far as the procedure goes) with the exception of having to deal with the engine mount.
> 
> Mine is Longitudinal, I wonder how common this is and why VW would make the same car with different orientation in engines! Or maybe they didn't make the car in '03 with transverse engine?? I don't know.
> 
> ...


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## FLA-BORN (Oct 20, 2010)

biggoodjohn said:


> What model do you have? All mkiv Jettas should be transverse.


 I have a 2003 Passat 1.8T, and since I posted earlier I decided to have this done by my mechanic, due to available time lately, not ability. I went by Friday to take him another part and he had the grill and bumper, headlights, etc off and had it up on a lift a little so it was basically at chest height to make it easier to get to. It appears that the biggest part of this job is taking those items off to be able to access everything. Once you get the front tore down this is a piece of cake (if you have mechanical experience).


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## aforsberg (Nov 11, 2009)

So I just finished mine and my new belt frayed on one of the edges when I started it for the first time...


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## boosted05 (Aug 18, 2007)

aforsberg said:


> So I just finished mine and my new belt frayed on one of the edges when I started it for the first time...


that sucks bro....did you make sure it was on all the pulley's flush? either way, i just did mine as well along with a metal impellar water pump, took 5 hours from start to finish. i didn't install the middle cover though, i forgot. :banghead: i can't get it back on either without removing the acc belt tensioner and the motor mount.... is this ok to run like it is or do i need to tear it back apart?


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## Vrjetta14 (Mar 4, 2004)

Just did this this past Saturday. Stared 8:00am with one buddy, a few distractions, and some yelling at the new tiing belt not wanting to go on, but finished up at 3:30pm. Not to bad for the first time.

the ECS tuning kit really was super helpful. I didn't really lose any coolant when I pulled the water pumpso the extra coolant will stay on the shelf but it's always nice to have extra.

Harest part was getting the new belt on since the old one was sorta stretched. I ended up putting the belt on the cam gear, then around the roller, then around the crank, and then took a pry bar and yanked on the belt until it slipped over the water pump. I chose the water pump because the gear had the least surface area on it...?

Definately doable for someone who has some patience. Just remember to double, and triple check those marks because while putting the belt on, you can see the crank gear moving and the cam not moving sometimes, so you have to pull it all off, re align the marks, and then try again.

Best of luck,

-C


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## Iangti7777 (May 23, 2010)

Here's a tip to get the new belt on. 
It was told to me by a VW techy that does these belts all day (2 hours a belt change !!)

The techy told me to put the belt on all the sprockets except the water pump (with all marks lined up TDC). Then rotate the bottom crank sprocket anti-clockwise JUST ONE TOOTH. (easy to see if you have a mark on the sprocket).

What this does is move all the slack in the timing belt from the compressed tensioner side to the pump side and you can "just about" pull the cam belt over the water pump sprocket using your hands (wear leather gloves as the pump sprocket is really sharp).
Note at this point the belt should be correctly situated on the top and bottom sprockets so you are not affecting timing, just moving belt slack towards the pump. (If I remember the top sprocket did not even move).

NB I knew the timing was OK, as I marked the old belt and both sprockets and transferred these marks to the new belt.


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## evolmachine (Sep 5, 2010)

Iangti7777 said:


> Here's a tip to get the new belt on.
> It was told to me by a VW techy that does these belts all day (2 hours a belt change !!)
> 
> The techy told me to put the belt on all the sprockets except the water pump (with all marks lined up TDC). Then rotate the bottom crank sprocket anti-clockwise JUST ONE TOOTH. (easy to see if you have a mark on the sprocket).
> ...


This is EXACTLY what I had to do, kinda figured it out by trial and error. Every time I tried it without doing this method my timing would be off by one tooth. Do it this way and rotate the engine around by hand a few times and you'll see it comes out dead nuts every time. I did not transfer any marks from my old belt to my new one either.


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

does anybody possibly have a picture of the harmonic balancer pulley? idk where thats at. i jus got done taking the accesory belt off and the accesory belt tensioner. next it says to take the harmonic balancer pulley then align the TDC. (sorry for repeating but giving as much info as possible)

thanks in advance!


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## Iangti7777 (May 23, 2010)

You cannot miss it, its the big pulley on the crank (at the bottom of the engine).
It drives the accessory belt, its held on with four allen bolts. 
Make sure you fully locate your allen key sockets in the bolts otherwise they are easy to round out.


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

alright thanks man! so its the pulley at the bottom of this picture? the one on the right or the left?



accessory belt diagram


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## Iangti7777 (May 23, 2010)

Left (on the crank), the three pulleys on the right are alternator, Aircon pump and steering pump.

No disrespect meant, but are you sure your up to doing this job.
The DIY makes it sound a breeze, but it can be a pig of a job due to the lack of clearance.


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

yeah haha i jus didnt know what the harmonic balancer pulley was thats all... other than that i know all the other stuff. but thanks dude and no offense takin haha :beer:


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

i jus put the belt back on and matched up the marks on the belt and the gears. they matched perfectly. and then i cranked it over by hand twice and the first time it went around it didnt match up. the second time it didnt match up either. is that normal? i counted teeth and they are both off by 12 teeth. but when i put it on it matched perfect.


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## Iangti7777 (May 23, 2010)

Its Normal.
Once you crank the engine any belt to sprocket marks get out of sync.
To check the timing,use the TDC mark on the Cam sprocket and on the flywheel.
They should perfectly aligned when piston one is at its compression stroke (TDC) and again every two rotations of the crank.


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

Iangti7777 said:


> Its Normal.
> Once you crank the engine any belt to sprocket marks get out of sync.
> To check the timing,use the TDC mark on the Cam sprocket and on the flywheel.
> They should perfectly aligned when piston one is at its compression stroke (TDC) and again every two rotations of the crank.


alright thanks man i jus checked it and when the cam is aligned with the valve cover mark the flywheel is off by a teeth. do i need to re put the timing belt back on again??


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## Iangti7777 (May 23, 2010)

Did you look at the TDC marks before you did the job (to get an idea what you were aiming for). When I did mine they lined up exactly, both with the old and the new belts.

Make sure you PRECISELY line up the cam mark, as small movements on the cam sprocket equate to large movements on the crank. 
Have you pulled the tensioner yet. If not its possible that the slight slack in the belt could make the the timing appear to be out very slightly.

How much movement of the Cam sprocket does it take to align the crank mark, if its a tooth then your timing is definitely set set wrong. 
If its less than a tooth you need a second opinion from others on the forum ?


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

Iangti7777 said:


> Did you look at the TDC marks before you did the job (to get an idea what you were aiming for). When I did mine they lined up exactly, both with the old and the new belts.
> 
> Make sure you PRECISELY line up the cam mark, as small movements on the cam sprocket equate to large movements on the crank.
> Have you pulled the tensioner yet. If not its possible that the slight slack in the belt could make the the timing appear to be out very slightly.
> ...


honestly it was a late night when i was putting the belt back on and i dont even think i looked at cam or the flywheels TDC before i put it back on. :banghead: and no i havent pulled the pin out the tensioner yet.


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## bootymac (Apr 19, 2005)

alwazkul said:


> honestly it was a late night when i was putting the belt back on and i dont even think i looked at cam or the flywheels TDC before i put it back on. :banghead: and no i havent pulled the pin out the tensioner yet.


You could take the belt off and line everything up at TDC just to be sure


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

bootymac said:


> You could take the belt off and line everything up at TDC just to be sure


yeah i think ima do that today. thanks :beer:


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

alwazkul said:


> alright thanks man i jus checked it and when the cam is aligned with the valve cover mark the flywheel is off by a teeth. do i need to re put the timing belt back on again??


NO! The flywheel is more sensitive than the valve cover when lining up marks. It's better to attempt to line up the flywheel first, then check the valve cover. If the valve cover mark is off, then you might have a problem. The flywheel and mark are closer to each other and more precise then the cam and valve cover and less susceptible to Parallax


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## jennekke (Jan 8, 2010)

Just got a quote from a local shop for $760 just in labor for this, I bought the kit a while back. 

I'll spend the weekend doing this myself before paying that much for this job. I just wish there was a place a bit closer and reasonable i could take it into...


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## jcramsey5 (Dec 12, 2010)

im having the same problem with the serpintine belt tensioner not being straight how did you make it straight


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

jcramsey5 said:


> im having the same problem with the serpintine belt tensioner not being straight how did you make it straight


 you probably have the black bracket that holds the hose for the res sandwiched in between the tensioner and the block, its supposed to be on the outside of the tensioner. look at it and you will se what im talking about.


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## jcramsey5 (Dec 12, 2010)

yep that was exactly it thanks


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## alwazkul (Dec 22, 2009)

alright well i did my timing belt and it turned out a success (its been about 2-3 weeks so far now since it was finished), and now i have a coolant problem again. :banghead: one of my hoses bent and it tore. it was right where this is stated on step #6 **Note* The Black Bracket goes between the bolts and the tensioner not the tensioner and the head! Remeber this or your belt will not be aligned properly.* and i think i know what the problem is but i gotta make sure real quick. on top of that bracket theres a little hook where the coolant hose is supposed to be. which way does that hook supposed to be? towards the front? or towards the back?


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## Adina (Nov 6, 2010)

Noob Question....

Are all the sockets 12 Point??!!

The way I am reading the list is that the 19mm is the only 12 Point.

Advanced appreciation!!


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

yes the 19mm is the crank bolt, its the only 12 point. everything else is regular


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## mdrrandall (Dec 23, 2010)

I just did my timing belt on my 2002 1.8t jetta and I have done over 200 timing belt jobs on 2.0turbo mitsubishi motors but never did one on these. I had a cam sensor code because the timing belt was apparently done improperly so I removed everything and installed the belt properly so the marks are perfectly aligned. I went to start the car and it will not start. I just did a compression test and it was good so I am now concerned with why it will not start. I sprayed ether into the intake to see if fuel was the problem and it still did not start and the fuel pump does come on when I oopen the door.


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## mdrrandall (Dec 23, 2010)

I also just checked and I have spark, is it possible that it is 180 degrees out? It is very difficult to get to the bottom of this.


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

if you have spark, check fuel, if you were a tooth off, it will still start but run like crap. make sure all the sensors are plugged in correctly. i had the same issue when i was fooling around with my intake manifold and i forgot to connect my camshaft position sensor.


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## mdrrandall (Dec 23, 2010)

Thanks for the response. I did check the connections I even unplugged the cam sensor and plugged it back in to be sure I had it in correctly. The timing marks are dead on. There is no way to have the crank 180 degrees out is there. I assume if the marks are on that is the only way it can be. There has to be something stupid here. It just does not make any sense. It will run if it is low on coolant right. I know it has a sensor on the reservoir but I can't see low coolant not making it run.


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## mdrrandall (Dec 23, 2010)

Found the problem. It was stupid. The fuel lines were backwards. They are the same size and I did not mark them when removing I just figured they would fall back into their respective positions but apparently they did not. I was laying in bed last night thinking about it and thought I wonder if those are reversed? I got up this am and tried it and the car started right up. Unbelievable!


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

glad it worked you for you. :thumbup:


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## youngunavw (Aug 27, 2010)

awesome write up...doin mine soon


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## MKS13 (Jul 30, 2007)

This thread was extremely helpful. The 1st AND 2nd time I had to replace my w pump. 1 question tho, my cel came on and I'm 95% certain my timing is on point. I had the code checked and it seems to be my cam angle sensor. What are the chances its NOT the sensor and my timing is just off a tooth?? Could the code checker be misreading??


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

is there an difference in how your car preforms ?


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## MKS13 (Jul 30, 2007)

Its very hard to start (abt 3 cranks before turning over) and a bit sluggish on take off. Ususally by 2nd gear it drives fine


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## Larsmeister32 (Aug 11, 2010)

I am wondering if doing one of these kits http://www.ecstuning.com/Volkswagen-Jetta_IV_GLI--1.8T/Engine/Timing/Timing_Belt_Kit/ES5138/ while doing your timing belt would be worth it, replacing the pulleys, water pump, and thermostat while having everything apart would make it a helluva lot easier right? And not to mention replacing the stock pulleys would free up some power. Or is it better to go by that "why fix what isn't broken" mentality?


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

MKS13 said:


> Its very hard to start (abt 3 cranks before turning over) and a bit sluggish on take off. Ususally by 2nd gear it drives fine


check timing marks. if its off by one tooth, it would cause it to run like SH**


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## bootymac (Apr 19, 2005)

Larsmeister32 said:


> I am wondering if doing one of these kits http://www.ecstuning.com/Volkswagen-Jetta_IV_GLI--1.8T/Engine/Timing/Timing_Belt_Kit/ES5138/ while doing your timing belt would be worth it, replacing the pulleys, water pump, and thermostat while having everything apart would make it a helluva lot easier right? And not to mention replacing the stock pulleys would free up some power. Or is it better to go by that "why fix what isn't broken" mentality?


I went through the same thoughts when I changed my timing belt and decided against it. Why spend money on something that has no proven gains? Then there's the whole argument about the stock pulley acting as a harmonic balancer. Not worth it IMO


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## Jmhockey1920 (Aug 12, 2010)

Anyone from the middle Tn area want to make some extra money changing my timing belt for me, or know of someone good? Thanks!!


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## vwturbo76 (Jul 1, 2005)

i might have missed it, but whats the average time it would take for the TB replacement on my mothers NBC 1.8T? I've done my Passat, just wondering the average time this takes?


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

if you have all the proper tools, about 4 hours give or take. this is with the thermostat and coolant housings replaced.


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## gplume (Sep 16, 2004)

Great write up...way better than the shop manual. Worked like a champ, but boy did I struggle getting the tensoner in...( as predicted) 

Thanks for sharing the info!


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## carlb79 (Mar 21, 2011)

I just paid $700 to have this done to my 03 1.8T Jetta and found out the mechanic did not replace the tensioner! How easy is it to just replace the tensioner only. I had the roller, belt, seals, water pump all replaced but no tensioner. Should I worry?


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## Dub-Nub (Sep 27, 2005)

carlb79 said:


> I just paid $700 to have this done to my 03 1.8T Jetta and found out the mechanic did not replace the tensioner! How easy is it to just replace the tensioner only. I had the roller, belt, seals, water pump all replaced but no tensioner. Should I worry?


 The tensioner is what usually fails so yes, that does need to be replaced!


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## carlb79 (Mar 21, 2011)

Is replacing the tensioner only just as involved as replacing the entire timing belt?


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

no need. just replace the tensioner.


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## carlb79 (Mar 21, 2011)

> crazymoforz
> 
> no need. just replace the tensioner.


 If I just wanted to replace tensioner would all of the steps involved with replacing the timing belt still have to be done? I know the belt wouldn't have to be replaced but I wasn't sure if there is another way to just replace the tensioner.


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## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

Pretty much have to redo everything to put on the tensioner. :thumbdown: I hate messing with that damn engine mount.


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## carlb79 (Mar 21, 2011)

What I find interesting is that when I called a VW dealer and talked to the parts dept. they told me that unless the tensioner was leaking oil that they rarely replace them when they change the timing belt. They change the idler roller and the water pump and seals but rarely the tensioner. This wasn't the dealer I had change mine either.


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## Dub-Nub (Sep 27, 2005)

You may be able to get away with just removing the engine mount. When doing a timing belt you pull the pin on the tensioner last, once its pulled it tightens the belt. If you are going to replace the tensioner then you just need to remove the old one, make sure the belt doesnt move. Snap the new one on and pull the pin. 

Take what the dealership says with a grain of salt. We have seen many timing belts fail here.


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## zachearp (Mar 26, 2011)

how long does this job generally take when you do it this way?


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## [email protected]! (Dec 22, 2010)

*Help!!! Can't get belt on my marks - 1 tooth off*

Well after reading all 17 pages I'm still having problems getting my belt on. Taking everything apart was a breeze and then the fun began. 

For the life of me I can not get my marks to line up. No matter what I do the best I can get is one tooth off. Any thoughts why I can't get my marks to line up??? I haven't even managed to get to the fun part of trying to get the sucker over the tensioner, blah. 

I appreciate any help!


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

I can't for the life of me figure out how to get the timing belt cover back on. Any tips to get it to slide any place easier?


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## electrocreative (Apr 12, 2011)

*'99 Passat 1.8T - Intermediate sprocket*

This thread has been a wealth of knowledge. I'm about to wrap up my project, but I want to make sure of one thing.

I've read all 589! posts to this thread, but see no specific reference regarding alignment of the_ intermediate sprocket _(right above the water pump pulley). I think I know the answer to this, but want to make absolutely certain.

Is there any specific orientation or alignment of the intermediate sprocket in relation to the cam or crankshaft positions?

Thanks.


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## Rockwilder (Jul 24, 2003)

I'm going to do my timing belt in a couple days and was just wondering one thing. When you pull the pin, how possible is it that the timing would go out a tooth or so, with the added tension? Just wanted to compensate the first time to lessen a re-re. Might be a stupid question, but it just popped into my mind when thinking about adding tension to the T-belt.

Huge TY to everyone that has added to this post, it's been a great help understanding everything and preparing oneself.:thumbup:


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## GTIgozoom (Mar 3, 2008)

Having trouble getting the harmonic balancer pulley off. The 19mm 12 point bolt will not come out. I even tried a impact gun with a non impact socket. The bolt will not budge at all. There is 4 allen bolts on the outer diameter of the 19mm bolt. Are those supposed to be removed before this bolt comes out. From what I can tell these are not keeping the 19mm bolt from loosening. Any suggestions. I have ordered a 19mm 12point impact socket and will try again. Also I was using jack stands so I may just try using a normal lift and and putting a cheater pipe on a breaker bar. Any suggestions other than that? OH and what are the stretch bolts used for?


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## tractorsosa (Aug 19, 2009)

GTIgozoom said:


> Having trouble getting the harmonic balancer pulley off. The 19mm 12 point bolt will not come out. I even tried a impact gun with a non impact socket. The bolt will not budge at all. There is 4 allen bolts on the outer diameter of the 19mm bolt. Are those supposed to be removed before this bolt comes out. From what I can tell these are not keeping the 19mm bolt from loosening. Any suggestions. I have ordered a 19mm 12point impact socket and will try again. Also I was using jack stands so I may just try using a normal lift and and putting a cheater pipe on a breaker bar. Any suggestions other than that? OH and what are the stretch bolts used for?


u dont need to loose the 19mm 12 point bolt to remove the harmonic balancer, just the 4 allen bolts unless u want to replace the crnk seal u will have to remove the big one


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

Rockwilder said:


> I'm going to do my timing belt in a couple days and was just wondering one thing. When you pull the pin, how possible is it that the timing would go out a tooth or so, with the added tension? Just wanted to compensate the first time to lessen a re-re. Might be a stupid question, but it just popped into my mind when thinking about adding tension to the T-belt.
> 
> Huge TY to everyone that has added to this post, it's been a great help understanding everything and preparing oneself.:thumbup:


You've probably done the job by now. But, if anyone else is wondering, by the time you get the belt on you'll notice that it's so tight that when you pull the pin, nothing happens. My old belt was getting loose and when the new belt was on, I had a hell of a time trying to get it on the cam gear.

Let us know if your experience was different.


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

electrocreative said:


> This thread has been a wealth of knowledge. I'm about to wrap up my project, but I want to make sure of one thing.
> 
> I've read all 589! posts to this thread, but see no specific reference regarding alignment of the_ intermediate sprocket _(right above the water pump pulley). I think I know the answer to this, but want to make absolutely certain.
> 
> ...


What "intermediate" sprocket are you talking about? The only things with teeth are the cam , water pump, and the crankshaft. Everything else is a smooth roller that touches the backside of the belt.


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## builtvw (Sep 20, 2009)

bump for myself


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## haskinsgarage (May 11, 2011)

*Along similar lines*

1. I replaced timing belt & water pump (1.8 T)
2. Drove car maybe 25 miles a few miles at the time
3. Then had to replace cam chain tensioner (aftermarket with no solenoid control)
4. Drove car 6 miles or so with all fine
5. One week later crank engine and find much noise
6. Check reveals that timing BELT is off one tooth and tensioner chain still appears to be ok

why would it jump a tooth? is it coincidental with the tensioner replacement? and why would one tooth off make noise? one tooth does not cause valve interference, does it?
thanks for any help


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

haskinsgarage said:


> 1. I replaced timing belt & water pump (1.8 T)
> 2. Drove car maybe 25 miles a few miles at the time
> 3. Then had to replace cam chain tensioner (aftermarket with no solenoid control)
> 4. Drove car 6 miles or so with all fine
> ...


That is odd. Which indicators did you use to determine that it was off by a tooth?
Also, why are you using a non-VVT cam tensioner?


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## haskinsgarage (May 11, 2011)

MarksManB said:


> That is odd. Which indicators did you use to determine that it was off by a tooth?
> Also, why are you using a non-VVT cam tensioner?


I used the marks on the exhaust cam at the valve cover and on the harmonic balancer and lower cover.
I got the non-VVT part because it was sold to fit (EBAY) and I had thought the solenoid was to activate tension not valve timing. Another way of saying that I am an idiot.
Thanks.


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

haskinsgarage said:


> I used the marks on the exhaust cam at the valve cover and on the harmonic balancer and lower cover.
> I got the non-VVT part because it was sold to fit (EBAY) and I had thought the solenoid was to activate tension not valve timing. Another way of saying that I am an idiot.
> Thanks.


Those are good marks to use. I was just making sure you weren't using the flywheel as a reference. Are you going to get the VVT version to replace it?

As far as being off a tooth, it's near impossible to jump a tooth once that belt is on with the tensioner. Have you fixed it yet?


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## rokkin (May 16, 2011)

*what a headache*

I have an 04 gti 1.8t and I am a mechanic for a living so I found this forum, thought wow this is well written. so I ordered all my parts t-belt, water pump, tensioned idler pulley and thermostat everything I would sell if I was doing a customer car. Came in this sat. to do it on my lift and air tools. it started out vary smooth, then I found the vagueness of this write up....who knew that the harmonic balancer and the bottom crank pulley for the t-belt were bolted together. I work on toyotas, hondas and nissans and normally I pull the crank pulley bolt and pull off the crank pulley then a gear slid onto a shaft. there is no pic of him pulling the four allens first, and it seems like an easy pic to take.. Anyway so when I took the nineteen out I worked the crank pulley off like I normally would then the bottom gear came off with it. At this point I didn't mark the belt yet I was pulling the gear off to mark it. So at this point I didn't the motor to tdc yet so I had a mini freak out, then went to ask another tech in my shop nobody had done this belt. I checked all-data and the net nothing helpful so we just used mechanics logic. I believe the the flywheel mark is tdc for the crank and I hope the cam mark it the tdc mark. So that's how I timed it from nothing. Also a tip for putting the belt on (no pics for this and its the hardest part) I had a lift so its easier for me but the tensioner going in last is the only way this works (hydraulic tensioner) the belt is so tight. I set the crank back a tooth then had someone hold a wrench on the cam so it would move I had to use a pry bar to pull up on the eccentric pulley then and only then could I slide the tensioner in and the marks be on. It runs fine but I haven't driven it much since I am selling it

Is the flywheel a good mark?


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## tractorsosa (Aug 19, 2009)

rokkin said:


> I have an 04 gti 1.8t and I am a mechanic for a living so I found this forum, thought wow this is well written. so I ordered all my parts t-belt, water pump, tensioned idler pulley and thermostat everything I would sell if I was doing a customer car. Came in this sat. to do it on my lift and air tools. it started out vary smooth, then I found the vagueness of this write up....who knew that the harmonic balancer and the bottom crank pulley for the t-belt were bolted together. I work on toyotas, hondas and nissans and normally I pull the crank pulley bolt and pull off the crank pulley then a gear slid onto a shaft. there is no pic of him pulling the four allens first, and it seems like an easy pic to take.. Anyway so when I took the nineteen out I worked the crank pulley off like I normally would then the bottom gear came off with it. At this point I didn't mark the belt yet I was pulling the gear off to mark it. So at this point I didn't the motor to tdc yet so I had a mini freak out, then went to ask another tech in my shop nobody had done this belt. I checked all-data and the net nothing helpful so we just used mechanics logic. I believe the the flywheel mark is tdc for the crank and I hope the cam mark it the tdc mark. So that's how I timed it from nothing. Also a tip for putting the belt on (no pics for this and its the hardest part) I had a lift so its easier for me but the tensioner going in last is the only way this works (hydraulic tensioner) the belt is so tight. I set the crank back a tooth then had someone hold a wrench on the cam so it would move I had to use a pry bar to pull up on the eccentric pulley then and only then could I slide the tensioner in and the marks be on. It runs fine but I haven't driven it much since I am selling it
> 
> Is the flywheel a good mark?


it is a good mark if is the oem and never has been removed or reinstalled but if is an aftermarket i dont think it does have the mark

i think u took the pin before put everything on position that i why is tight just keep check it for a few more miles to make sure is not rubbing against something but my main concern will be if u did not damage the hydraulic tensioner already. but since u use ur common sense as a mechanic u should be good all the motors work the same way but all they ar built and set but u can also set the piston at tdc using the cilynder 1 and take the valve cover gasket to check the cam marks has to be 16 rolls distance betwen both cams ut one will always be lil bit offset


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

rokkin said:


> I have an 04 gti 1.8t and I am a mechanic for a living so I found this forum, thought wow this is well written. so I ordered all my parts t-belt, water pump, tensioned idler pulley and thermostat everything I would sell if I was doing a customer car. Came in this sat. to do it on my lift and air tools. it started out vary smooth, then I found the vagueness of this write up....who knew that the harmonic balancer and the bottom crank pulley for the t-belt were bolted together. I work on toyotas, hondas and nissans and normally I pull the crank pulley bolt and pull off the crank pulley then a gear slid onto a shaft. there is no pic of him pulling the four allens first, and it seems like an easy pic to take.. Anyway so when I took the nineteen out I worked the crank pulley off like I normally would then the bottom gear came off with it. At this point I didn't mark the belt yet I was pulling the gear off to mark it. So at this point I didn't the motor to tdc yet so I had a mini freak out, then went to ask another tech in my shop nobody had done this belt. I checked all-data and the net nothing helpful so we just used mechanics logic. I believe the the flywheel mark is tdc for the crank and I hope the cam mark it the tdc mark. So that's how I timed it from nothing. Also a tip for putting the belt on (no pics for this and its the hardest part) I had a lift so its easier for me but the tensioner going in last is the only way this works (hydraulic tensioner) the belt is so tight. I set the crank back a tooth then had someone hold a wrench on the cam so it would move I had to use a pry bar to pull up on the eccentric pulley then and only then could I slide the tensioner in and the marks be on. It runs fine but I haven't driven it much since I am selling it
> 
> Is the flywheel a good mark?


Sucks that you had probems with the write up. This was the first job I ever did to my 1.8t and the first thing I ever did under the hood and I got through it no problems. 

This reminds me of a theory I've heard many times before. People who have never fired a gun before tend to shoot better than those who have. Newbies, who have 0 experience, don't have preconceived notions or prior experience that they try to use in a new situation and they listen and follow directions literally without falling back on habits they haven't yet learned. Basically, because you are an experienced mechanic, you tried to use experience from working on a different engine to this one. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to say that the write up is perfect and you were wrong. I'm only sharing my observations.


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## Prime_Time_Bora (May 12, 2011)

*What Kit*

:banghead:What kit did you use for this change? i know its been a while since you have done this and im just wandering how it held up? If anyone can suggest any complete kits please do. I plan on doing this in a few weeks. :beer:


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

Prime_Time_Bora said:


> :banghead:What kit did you use for this change? i know its been a while since you have done this and im just wandering how it held up? If anyone can suggest any complete kits please do. I plan on doing this in a few weeks. :beer:


I went with this ECS kit.
But this one from MJM is just as good.

You will need coolant if you do either the T-stat or the water pump. They have kits with G12 also.


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## builtvw (Sep 20, 2009)

bump for me


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## Turbo Bruin (Apr 23, 2001)

Check out this write-up for a TT. Lots of pics much more detail for those of who are less experienced. Car is slightly different but I believe the steps are pretty much the same. 

http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?t=1961739


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## Powdered Toast Man (Feb 16, 2010)

electrocreative said:


> This thread has been a wealth of knowledge. I'm about to wrap up my project, but I want to make sure of one thing.
> 
> I've read all 589! posts to this thread, but see no specific reference regarding alignment of the_ intermediate sprocket _(right above the water pump pulley). I think I know the answer to this, but want to make absolutely certain.
> 
> ...



this is for an AEB motor. and no, there is no relation. the intermediate shaft operates the oil pump, and it is non-timed for this procedure.


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## izz (Aug 5, 2010)

the T10092 special tool is required if you are *not* replacing the tensioner, right?


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## TheBossQ (Aug 15, 2009)

First, you should be replacing the tensioner. Do not re-use it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fpq9lgrygbg

This is what these garbage tensioners are known for. Once you lose tension, that's when belts skip teeth, shear teeth ... and that's when worlds collide. Or rather your valves and your pistons.

But ... if you insist ... you do not have to have the special tool.

M5 x 55 stud (that's what worked on my AWP engine) threaded into the tensioner body, washer and nut will allow you to compress the tensioner rod and de-tension the belt.

But do yourself a favor and replace the tensioner.


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## izz (Aug 5, 2010)

TheBossQ said:


> First, you should be replacing the tensioner. Do not re-use it.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fpq9lgrygbg
> 
> ...


oh no dont get me wrong i am replacing it, im doing the whole kit, water pump, roller, mount bolts, but i was reading the bentley and says you need the T10092 to release the tension off the belt and then put the pin, so that led me to the question, since i am replacing the tensioner i should not need the t10092


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## TheBossQ (Aug 15, 2009)

izz said:


> oh no dont get me wrong i am replacing it, im doing the whole kit, water pump, roller, mount bolts, but i was reading the bentley and says you need the T10092 to release the tension off the belt and then put the pin, so that led me to the question, since i am replacing the tensioner i should not need the t10092


Correct. I just used what I posted. Even though I replaced the tensioner, I found the easiest way to get the belt off was by de-tensioning. Some people are cutting them off, or prying them off. I didn't want to do that.


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

just un-bolt the tensioner. why are people prying them. lol.


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## Turbo Bruin (Apr 23, 2001)

Doing this right now. Stupid question but where is the TDC plug?! Can't find it.


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## Turbo Bruin (Apr 23, 2001)

nm found it.


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## builtvw (Sep 20, 2009)

haha i didn't listen to the *note* with the little black bracket and my belt flew off...but i found it good thing cause its brand new stupid things cost 50bucks.


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

builtvw said:


> haha i didn't listen to the *note* with the little black bracket and my belt flew off...but i found it good thing cause its brand new stupid things cost 50bucks.


accessory belt, I assume?


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## jonpwn (Aug 13, 2010)

How long would this take for a skilled mechanic who has never worked on volkswagen but has done timing belt changes on other cars?


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## bayotte (Jun 4, 2011)

Great tutorial! I'm looking at ordering from ECS tuning. What do you recommend - an ECS brand kit for $249.95, or an OEM kit for $579.95?

http://www.ecstuning.com/Volkswagen-Jetta_IV--1.8T/Engine/Timing/


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## Irishguy951 (Sep 11, 2006)

*I hope I didnt bend a valve!!!!*

ok so I have a 2004 AWP. I did the timing belt tonight and now my car idles like crap and wants to stall... I did the line on the valve cover and the line on the flywheel. It seems to be right there... What gives? will a tooth or two bend the valves? How do I know what way to move the belt? HELP!!!!


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## MarksManB (Jul 2, 2002)

Irishguy951 said:


> ok so I have a 2004 AWP. I did the timing belt tonight and now my car idles like crap and wants to stall... I did the line on the valve cover and the line on the flywheel. It seems to be right there... What gives? will a tooth or two bend the valves? How do I know what way to move the belt? HELP!!!!


did you crank it over several times by hand when you were done?

1 tooth, no. 2 teeth, maybe/yes. 3 teeth, definately and wouldn't idle.

Line up the flywheel first, then check the valve cover/cam gear.


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## tractorsosa (Aug 19, 2009)

jonpwn said:


> How long would this take for a skilled mechanic who has never worked on volkswagen but has done timing belt changes on other cars?


 in the shop should take u about 3 hrs or lil less in the driveway maybe 4 hrs or lil more


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## car54 (Oct 9, 2000)

After reading this guide, I replaced the T-belt on a 2002 Jetta today. The car belongs to my boss, the station manager of the airline I work for. her waterpump failed on Friday and I ordered the kit from dieselgeek.com who overnighted it to me. 

She's lucky that her Maintenance Manager just happens to do TDI timing belts on the side. I pulled her car into the hangar today and got into it. Three hours later, it was purring like new and pumping coolant. I found the impeller actually broke into two large chunks and I fished a few smaller chips of plastic out of the block. 

It's a 2002, but only has 60,000 miles on it. Ive done at least 500 TDI timing belt jobs since I started working on them in 2001, but this was my first 1.8t. The guide helped a lot in understanding how the timing marks, tensioners and belts differ from the TDI. It was quite a bit easier than a TDI, but very different and took me longer than a TDI. 

Hopefully the metal impeller pump will let her get another decade or more out of this car with no problems. 

The pump:



















Ive never seen such a spectacular failure of a pump on a TDI. they leak, sometimes they even spin loosely on the shaft, but Ive never seen one actually crack. 

Thanks for the guide!


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## Sc0 (Feb 1, 2002)

Crap, 18 Pages......... 

Some thoughts:
T-Gassers run hotter than TDI's, hence the plastic impeller being more fragile and oil coking problems... (Popped a WP off of a 11mm/.205 ALH TDI at 200k miles and the plastic impeller was fine.) As for the seals, I am not sure how hard they are to replace on the AWP but I would replace them. (I also have bad luck with the newer Teflon crank seals, 038103085E, and prefer the older rubber/spring lip variety, 054115147B.) An interesting Notion about unbolting the tranny side mount to tilt the engine enough to get the engine mount back in, this can also give you more room to work with when installing the belt/changing seals/WP. (Good TIP!) If you have a leaking front crank seal, Metalnerd sells a NICE crank holder that can be used to break loose the 19mm bolt. If you google FranksVWtdi, he also has a "kit" that includes the seal, sealant, and crank holder if you need to replace this seal. The #3265 seal installer tool is also nice to use, it's plastic but I don't foresee wearing it out...

FYI: Integrated Engineering sells a manual tensioner for the timing belt, (beware of the gap where the OEM tensioner goes).

I have done many timing belts on TDI's, 951's, 968's, and a B5 Passat 1.8T... now I am about to do a GTI 20th 1.8T. Different cars have their own peculiarities but align the marks and hand turn the engine 2 or 3 times and check the marks with each rotation then adjust the belt if needed. If everything is good then button her back up. :thumbup::thumbup: For Dieselgeek parts!


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## MMJJTI (Apr 17, 2007)

I did this job yesterday, only real issue was aligning the tensioner to mount it, other than that everything went smooth and she runs great, thanks for a great diy:thumbup::beer:


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## latreche34 (Nov 24, 2009)

Beside using the flywheel method of timing the belt where are the marks on the crank pulley and the block, I'm replacing mine on 1.8T 2002 tomorrow and my TB is loose due to a broken tensioner, so marking the belt is not going to work for me because it is loose now and it may have jumped few teeth arround.


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## latreche34 (Nov 24, 2009)

Never mind I turned the crank shaft with old belt on to align the cam poley with the mark on the head, and then removed spark plug from 1st cyl and stick a long screwdriver to rest on piston 1 and turned crankshaft to the highest point with belt removed, actually the timing was off about 3 teeth had to keep turning the crankshaft alone for about 10 degrees more to acheive the highest point on the piston dome, it worked pretty good, the engine is even quiter now.


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## vwdave92 (Nov 26, 2003)

*6 hours*

thanks all... did it this weekend

6 hours... no real issues

thanks

dave


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## Jm-Productions (May 12, 2009)

*Could not find flywheel mark for the TDC*

I match crankshaft and cam there a lined up...but could find TDC on flywheel did a lot of turns and couldnt find it.I have Stage 1 Sachs clutch and flywheel...i start tge engine and it does not start up...you think that could be the problem that the started of the far could not find TDC on Trans alined with the others 2 marks and it does not let the car stars...help me please!... Cannot figure out wats wrong with it.


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## coupe81 (Sep 1, 2011)

latreche34 said:


> Never mind I turned the crank shaft with old belt on to align the cam poley with the mark on the head, and then removed spark plug from 1st cyl and stick a long screwdriver to rest on piston 1 and turned crankshaft to the highest point with belt removed, actually the timing was off about 3 teeth had to keep turning the crankshaft alone for about 10 degrees more to acheive the highest point on the piston dome, it worked pretty good, the engine is even quiter now.


 Thank you for this post! I was having a hard time finding info on how to align the marks.


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## CAVU Mark (Sep 2, 2011)

*Starting tomorrow in San Fernando Valley*

So, my friend and I both have 1.8Ts. He is a savvy mechanic and works on Crown Vics. I am an A&P and don't like to work on cars but need to save the $. (Dealer quoted $1100) He already ran into a problem with trying to remove the motor mount and hitting an AC line... any comments or help is appreciated. He stated that he thought no one had AC when doing these DIYs but that can't be true. Or if you are in the SF Valley email me and let me know and we will supply the cold ones.

Mark


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## SologigoloS (Sep 7, 2011)

Is this anything similar to the procedure required on a 2001 golf 2.0? Im ready to pull my hair out over this overheating issue!


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

SologigoloS said:


> Is this anything similar to the procedure required on a 2001 golf 2.0? Im ready to pull my hair out over this overheating issue!


its almost identical, but easier on a 2.0 make sure you know how to tension the pulley when installing the new belt.


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## billbraski (Jul 26, 2011)

So, I just put on my rebuilt head and did the timing belt job today. (timing belt got stripped, all exhaust valves bent) It was a PITA, but not as bad as I thought it would be.

Still have to put the rest of my car back together (dealership took the head off and made a mess of things.)

I made sure that my crank TDC mark and my cam mark were perfect and got the belt back on there. I was never able to see any kind of marks on the flywheel. I hand crank from the crank gear and every thing still lines up after several rotations.

My question is exactly how hard should it be to crank the engine by hand? There are parts where it turns very easily, and parts where it gets more difficult. It doesn't take a whole lot of strength to get past the hard parts, but definitely some.

Is this just the cam pushing the valves down? I can't be bending the valves by turning it by hand right? (Unless I really He-Man it)

I just really want to be sure the timing is right before I start it up. Keep in mind that the head was just rebuilt and the only oil in there is the bit I poured over the cams.


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## billbraski (Jul 26, 2011)

lebump


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## woteg (Apr 7, 2009)

*FV-QR*

valve springs take quite a bit of force to push down, i was super paranoid about it too and cranked it over like 20x checking marks on crank and cam everytime. fired it up and everything was fine and that was ~3k miles ago


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

I would still check the mark on the flywheel. You still might be off a tooth.


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## VWGuyCT (Jan 23, 2008)

*How far should the tensioner pop out after pulling the Pin?*

I pulled the pin on the tensioner and it didn't come out much. I'm wondering if I have a defective tensioner. I can place a screw driver in the area where the tensioner piston is and pry the lever on the pulley up without much force. The little piston comes out more but after a minute goes back down but not completely. I can't push it fully down. Is this normal? Should the tensioner piston eject fully?


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## moatt (Sep 24, 2011)

Awesome writeup! I've been working on it for two days (for my 2001 1.8t New Beetle). I've run into a problem that I can't find anywhere else, though.

How do you get the water pump out if the "wiggle and pull hard" method doesn't work? I'm a big guy...almost 300lbs. I've been wiggling, pulling, jumping up and down, jerking...all for about an hour. Hasn't budged. I'm afraid the previous owner may have replaced before and used a sealant on it. I know he did on the thermostat. And through the thermostat I've confirmed that the plastic water pump is shattered.

So...thoughts? I'm getting desperate. I'm about half an hour away from going after it with a sledge hammer. Any suggestions greatly appreciated.

Chris


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## woteg (Apr 7, 2009)

Diesel geeks makes some backout bolts


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## moatt (Sep 24, 2011)

Interesting idea, but can't wait on shipping. Have to have this car running by tomorrow. I appreciate the post, though. 

This thing is SERIOUSLY ticking me off. It's my first time working on a VW, and a broken waterpump is taking longer to change than the entire drivetrain in my previous car. Literally. I feel like walking up to the first german I see and just smacking him. lol


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## STOICH (Jun 21, 2010)

You can get a crow bar or large flathead between the cog and block and work it out of its seat.

I don't even try to get it by hand as it's just easier to get it started with a crow bar then wiggle it out.


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## moatt (Sep 24, 2011)

Well, prybars didn't work. Neither did screwdrivers or chisels. Devised a system of steel wire and pulleys. Didn't work either.

2 pound sledgehammer on the gear popped it right out. Only took two hits.  lol


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## Tylerb137 (Sep 12, 2011)

*timing belt tensioner*

Can anyone tell me out of these steps on this DIY what exactly I'd need to do to replace only the hydraulic tensioner? I am new to this site and new to these cars, i bought a jetta GLI recently and the timing belt and water pump were replaced within the last 10,000 miles but from talking to people and having people look at the car, my hydraulic tensioner is bad, i bought the new one I just need to install it. I am very mechanically inclined, just not sure exactly what i need to do with replacing only this and not the belt. any help would be greatly appreciated!


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

Tylerb137 said:


> Can anyone tell me out of these steps on this DIY what exactly I'd need to do to replace only the hydraulic tensioner? I am new to this site and new to these cars, i bought a jetta GLI recently and the timing belt and water pump were replaced within the last 10,000 miles but from talking to people and having people look at the car, my hydraulic tensioner is bad, i bought the new one I just need to install it. I am very mechanically inclined, just not sure exactly what i need to do with replacing only this and not the belt. any help would be greatly appreciated!


go all the way to step 13. remove the tensioner and replace with the new one without removing the belt. mark the belt just in case it decides to jump a tooth.


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## mkiv05gli (Sep 26, 2011)

Just did my timing belt/ water pump at 101k. Couldn't have done it without this write up, so thanks for saving me some major cash! 

Just a quick note, when the write up says to take off the hose from the IC to Intake manifold, just undo it from the intake, don't undo it on the IC side. May sound dumb, but when reading the write up it sounded like the whole thing had to come out and I ended up having to take out the headlight to get it clamped back up to the IC. 

Other than that, it all went pretty smoothly.


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## rains (May 30, 2008)

thanks for DIY :thumbup:

I thought this would be a lot more difficult, but after swapping the timing chain/ replacing the head on a saturn SC2, this seems pretty easy :beer:


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## greatgatzby (Jan 28, 2011)

anyone have a tip on getting the motor mount that bolts to the block back in? i've been trying for close to 3 hours and cant figure it out. ( the belt and tensioners are installed, as well as the covers). I raised the motor, but not alot, still no luck. anything would help 

:beer:


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## greatgatzby (Jan 28, 2011)

erevlydeux said:


> Raise the motor some more and keep wiggling. That's really the simplest way to go about it that I could see when I did mine.
> 
> Good luck... and make sure you have some :beer: :laugh:


did you wiggle it in from the top, back, under? or what ?


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## Naibaf (Jul 9, 2005)

First off, I want to say thanks for this awesome write up. It made the job so much easier. Also I read most of the thread prior to doing the job. 

As for the motor mount, that also gave me some trouble. I had to lower the engine then slide it in from underneath, without the two lower covers on. Then I lifted the engine while working the mount up. Finally I was able to slide a bolt in and hold it in place. 

Just took some time but you can get it in there!


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## evolmachine (Sep 5, 2010)

I had to take out the drivers side mount to get the passenger side mount out of the way, as well as get it back in.its the only way to lower the engine enough to get the clearance you need


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## greatgatzby (Jan 28, 2011)

erevlydeux said:


> Details are foggy at this point but I'm pretty sure I moved the engine up a bit to get the mount back into place and then lowered it and got underneath the car to put in one of the bolts.
> 
> I should say that I never got my support mount all the way out.. just wiggled out of the way. If yours is entirely out... not sure. Sorry dude.


not big, i raised the motor as high as i would comfortably raise it, but still no luck getting it in after a hour or so. I ended up taking off the tensioner again and putting the mount in first. it was a piece of cake after that. just kind of depressing to rip it all apart again. haha

thanks though man :beer:


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## palmasi1 (May 21, 2001)

moatt said:


> Awesome writeup! I've been working on it for two days (for my 2001 1.8t New Beetle). I've run into a problem that I can't find anywhere else, though.
> 
> How do you get the water pump out if the "wiggle and pull hard" method doesn't work? I'm a big guy...almost 300lbs. I've been wiggling, pulling, jumping up and down, jerking...all for about an hour. Hasn't budged. I'm afraid the previous owner may have replaced before and used a sealant on it. I know he did on the thermostat. And through the thermostat I've confirmed that the plastic water pump is shattered.
> 
> ...



I beat on mine with a rubber mallet and pried on the tabs that are on the side of the water pump for this purpose. It took around 10 minutes of whacking and prying and it came out.


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## palmasi1 (May 21, 2001)

*Got everyhing back together, then I was off a tooth! Not hard to re-do with the 5x50mm stud*

Well folks I just completed this job for the second time on my 1.8T AWW Jetta . The first time was at 65K, and the second time was at 151K. It just just as hard as the first time. Although now I feel as if I could do it in a few hours. 

The big drama this time was that when I got it all back together I was off 1 full tooth and got the CEL with the code saying "Cannot advance to the required setpoint". Man was I horrified. The car had GREAT power after the belt, if a little slow off the line, and I was shocked to see that it was in fact 1 full tooth retarded. 

SO, instead of taking the WHOLE THING apart, I got a 5mm x 50mm M5 bolt and a few washers from Lowes, and cranked that tensioner back down, where I had only pulled the pin a few hours before. The bolt worked to the point where the yellow metal fingers of the tensioner roller were pegged against the cylinder head and I knew it was a good as it was going to get. 

So I the removed the harmonic damper pulley and the lower timing cover, then pulled the belt off the cog. I retarded the engine EXACTLY ONE TOOTH and forced the belt back on bicycle-style. 

AND IT WORKED. I was terrified I'd have to pull the coils, the plugs, the engine mount, all that crap, and all I had to do was crank down the tensioner and move the belt one tooth. 

I feel I got off easy because it took me only two hours to correct my horrendous error. 
You know how this happened? I didn't find the FLYWHEEL timing mark, so I used the screwdriver in #1 cylinder method. It wasn't close enough. 

Anyway, lesson learned. And get that 5x50mm bolt in case you screw this up too and have to move the belt by a tooth.


Other not


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## glxjunky (Mar 12, 2009)

Nice write up man. It made for an easy install! If your having problems getting the mount in after the timing is set just manipulate the a/c lines a hair. It should all fall in place.


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

I have already done 3 timing belt changes in the past, but decided to make a change this time and had a question. I changed the hydraulic tensioner in for a manual tensioner and i am concerned that something is wrong. 

First of all i lined up the tensioner correctly with the cogs on the camshaft and crankshafts using 3 spacer washers. This has caused the belt to run on the INSIDE of the cogs towards the engine block. Will this be a problem?

Anybody have experience in how tight the belt needs to be? I may have tightened it too much because one of the bearings is squealing. 

Thoughts?


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## 1.8TURTOL (Jun 13, 2011)

as many others have stated, thanks a lot for the write up i had my laptop sitting on top of my tool box the whole time and i went step by step with your write up. couldn't be any more straight forward and accurate. took me about 3.5 hours to take everyhing apart and i am now waiting on my parts to arrive. i ordered my parts from MJM AUTOHAUS. i ordered the "basic" kit with metal impeller and new motor mount bolts. i am also taking advantage of this to put in a new thermostat and housing. here's a pic of my old water pump:


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## 1.8TURTOL (Jun 13, 2011)

just finished my timing belt last night and might i say the hardest part was NOT putting in the tensioner but instead it was getting the belt on. What a pain in the A**! i ended up putting the flywheel and camshaft at the TDC mark and aligning the white marks and then spinning the crank using a rachet and meanwhile having someone pushing the belt onto the water pump. other than that, quite easy  done by 2 18 year old kids with only some mechanical experience and simple tools (rachets, jack, jack stands, screwdrivers)


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## ibbw (Nov 23, 2011)

In the middle of it now. Just did a Tiburon V6 last week. This one is much tighter. Hats off to the DIY originator. Its a hard job to help everyone out huh?


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

what exactly is the TDC Mark? (what does the TDC stand for) and what do you line the flywheel mark up with? 

Also, I am looking into the timing belt kits at ecs and mjm. 

http://www.ecstuning.com/Volkswagen-Golf_IV--1.8T/Engine/Timing/ES5954/

http://www.mjmautohaus.com/catalog/...ng_Belt_Kit_"PLUS_EXTRA"_OEM&products_id=2412

from what I can tell, the only differences are that the ecs kit (being $25 more) comes with some extra motor mount bolts. Are those necessary? Should I just save the money and go with mjm? :thumbup:


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

bboy_jon said:


> what exactly is the TDC Mark? (what does the TDC stand for) and what do you line the flywheel mark up with?
> 
> Also, I am looking into the timing belt kits at ecs and mjm.
> 
> ...


TDC mark = top dead center. It refers to, atleast for our cars, that a particular pair of pistons are at the very top of the compression cycle/exhaust cycle. However you want to look at it. For the purposes of doing your timing belt, it serves as a mark to make sure you're still in time after swapping in your new belt/tensioner.

If you have the stock flywheel, there is a notch in the bellhousing, after you pull the timing check plug, that lines up with a notched tooth on the flywheel. Because this can be hard to see, it's usually easier to line up the cam gear mark with the valve cover and the crank pulley notch with the indentation in the lower timing cover. This is described on previous pages.

As far as which kit to go to... I've heard a lot of anecdotal stuff about ECS and their timing belt kits. Most of it was centered around the fact that it will inevitably break... and early. I'd personally swap to an IE manual tensioner if I were you... I love mine, and I didn't deal with the hassle of the hydraulic tensioner and have to **** around with it to get it installed.

IE's kit w/ belt and pump is $255... but it doesn't include motor mount bolts. I know ECS has their Ultimate Plus kit for the same price that has the thermostat/thermostat housing plus motor mount bolts plus coolant plus accessory belt. It's really up to you on how you want to spend your money, but I'd just be careful about buying stuff that isn't genuine VW/Audi.

Also, don't **** with the camshaft/crankshaft seals if they aren't leaking. I see the ECS kits and MJM kits include them, but you don't want to change too much stuff at once if you're just doing this type of maintenance work for the first time.


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

I see, mind posting up a link to the ie tensioner? I see the kit for $250, although that is for pre-2000 engines, I have an 02 and the kit is only $209

Also, the mjm kit is apparantly oem. What extra bolts does the ecs kit come with though? For the timing belt change, only one mount needs to be removed/moved right?

also, in this picture

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g116/Tim_18T/TDCmarkonvalvecover.jpg

It says "Here is where the cam gear lines up with the valve cover. You can also see the mark on my cam gear and my new belt from the nail polish. They don't line up because the car has been running." Now is it just me, or does the cam gear not line up with the valve cover mark? Or is it supposed to be offset like that? To crank the engine you just take a socket/ratchet and turn right? 

Later on in the guide, step 17, it says "Crank the engine over, by hand, at least two times so that you can match up the flywheel TDC mark and the Cam Gear TDC mark, They should match perfectly." 

How can you match the fly wheel mark with the cam gear mark? (the cam gear is the top gear right?) There are 3 notches correct? One for the cam, crank and the flywheel? Do all those need to match up at the same time?


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## rychas1 (Mar 2, 2004)

any ideas on how to remove a stuck tensioner pulley bolt? if i push any harder, it will strip. it feels like some concrete-strength loctite was used:sly:


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

bboy_jon said:


> I see, mind posting up a link to the ie tensioner? I see the kit for $250, although that is for pre-2000 engines, I have an 02 and the kit is only $209
> 
> Also, the mjm kit is apparantly oem. What extra bolts does the ecs kit come with though? For the timing belt change, only one mount needs to be removed/moved right?
> 
> ...


So the cam gear, crank pulley and stock flywheel all have a mark on them... it's more of a notch, really. Respectively, the valve cover, lower timing cover and bellhousing all have marks/notches, too. This is your reference for making sure things are "in time." Basically, everything should line up pretty darn close.

Now, that picture is useless. The cam gear indeed matches up with neither the nail polish marks or the timing mark.... it's just confusing to people more than anything, I think. Now... a popular method of doing the belt change is to put marks, usually with nail polish, on the belt that overlap to the cam gear and timing belt gear. You then transfer the marks to your new belt, tooth for tooth, so everything matches, and apply the belt... matching the marks on your new belt with the marks left on the cam gear and timing belt gear. These marks do not deal with the TDC marks at all. The TDC marks are the true "in time" indicators... but the nail polish marks are simply there for getting the belt back on easier and keeping things "in time."

As far as checking your work when you're done... you could do with only checking two of the timing marks. If you have a stock flywheel, you could check that too. They'll all be very close but not entirely lined up. Don't let this freak you out. We're talking... the flywheel mark might be off by 1mm or less but the crank and cam TDC marks will be dead on. That's fine. Ideally you should still be at TDC when you get your new belt on... if you're not though, and you can still turn back slightly and line up the timing marks, you're still OK.

When you turn the crank over (which can be done with a socket/ratchet, yes) to check that the belt is turning smoothly, etc - give it atleast 2 turns indeed. Your nail polish marks will not line up anymore... they shouldn't. The timing marks, however, should all still be in sync. After your 2 turns, line up the cam gear mark again and check the crank and flywheel marks... they should line up. Assuming the tensioner stuff is tight and installed correctly, this means you have just changed your timing belt successfully. 

EDIT: Yes, you only "need" to undo the passenger side engine mount... but in retrospect, an engine hoist would lend a helping hand to raising the engine and holding it in the necessary positions. Don't let that stop you, though. It's very doable with just one person... just takes time. Have a beer or two mid-way through to keep the nerves tamed.


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

Awesome. I appreciate the info man. So when you are making sure everything is aligned...the belt marks will be off and that doesnt matter as long as they started at the right marks correct?

I hate to make my self sound like an idiot, but I really dont understand why the belt needs marks? Is the belt not consistent all the way through or something? How can you transfer the marks from the old belt to the new? Are you just picking a random tooth to start at and lining it all up or is there a starting point on the belts? 

OR, are the marks just there to keep the proper spacing between the marks/notches and to make sure the tension is set properly? 

Also, is it necessary to remove the spark plugs and coil packs? 

What direction is the engine supposed to be cranked; clock wise or counter clockwise, or can you go either way?


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

bboy_jon said:


> Awesome. I appreciate the info man. So when you are making sure everything is aligned...the belt marks will be off and that doesnt matter as long as they started at the right marks correct?
> 
> I hate to make my self sound like an idiot, but I really dont understand why the belt needs marks? Is the belt not consistent all the way through or something? How can you transfer the marks from the old belt to the new? Are you just picking a random tooth to start at and lining it all up or is there a starting point on the belts?
> 
> ...


Right... once you start cranking, the belt marks will be off but you should be able to line up the timing marks and everything should be in time. 

The reason you mark the belt and gears is because you could look in time but be off a tooth. Also, you could be an entire revolution off on the crankshaft and look "in time. " The assumption is that you're in time now so transferring the marks ensures you stay in time. Belt tension is a separate issue from things being in time. 

You can remove the plugs but I didn't bother. Also, I cranked clockwise - towards the front of the motor.


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

bboy_jon said:


> Awesome. I appreciate the info man. So when you are making sure everything is aligned...the belt marks will be off and that doesnt matter as long as they started at the right marks correct?
> 
> I hate to make my self sound like an idiot, but I really dont understand why the belt needs marks? Is the belt not consistent all the way through or something? How can you transfer the marks from the old belt to the new? Are you just picking a random tooth to start at and lining it all up or is there a starting point on the belts?
> 
> ...


The marks don't need to be there but are a safety net so to speak. It is very easy to transfer marks to the new belt. You just set one belt on top of the other and make the marks. Sometimes the belt can be difficult and the crank will want to move on you so as long as the paint marks line up you know you are good even if it moves a little.


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

hmmm...I dont quite understand. Are you supposed to line everything up first then put the belt on while matching the marks? I guess I just dont understand how the belt keeps everything in time. 

When taking off the belt, are you supposed to line up the crank and cam marks right? Than you just mark your current belt where the crank and cam marks are? I feel like the marking of the belt is just kind of random...are the markings pretty much to ensure proper spacing between the two teeth (that need to be at the crank/cam marks) ?

I feel like its random because, first, everything is lined up, put the belt on etc. Cranking the motor a couple rounds, and the crank/cam marks are lined up, but the belt is now off. 

When you are first marking the belt (to remove it for replacement) are you trying to line the belt up so that it is in the same position as when you are first putting on a new belt? Or are you just making the marks randomly? I doubt this will make any sense...:banghead:

Should I already have marks on my belt since this will be the second timing belt job done on my car? (first one was done by the PO) or does the nail polish tend to disappear after a while (if thats what he used)?


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

bboy_jon said:


> hmmm...I dont quite understand. Are you supposed to line everything up first then put the belt on while matching the marks? I guess I just dont understand how the belt keeps everything in time.
> 
> When taking off the belt, are you supposed to line up the crank and cam marks right? Than you just mark your current belt where the crank and cam marks are? I feel like the marking of the belt is just kind of random...are the markings pretty much to ensure proper spacing between the two teeth (that need to be at the crank/cam marks) ?
> 
> ...


OK, for the sake of this example, let's assume your timing belt is stock and there are no marks at all and your engine is in time and running perfectly.

Now, your timing belt is keeping everything in time by holding the associated gears respective to each other. At this point, you should have cranked your engine to TDC and have the timing marks lined up.

So, you want to change your timing belt.... first, make marks on the original belt and the gears it wraps around. This is best done by making two marks on one gear and one on the other. This lets you distinguish one gear from another. So, make two marks on the cam gear and one on the crank gear. Literally take like white nail polish or a valve pen and make a mark that touches the belt/gear.

Now you can take your original belt off. Now, you take your original belt and transfer the marks to your new belt. This is basically... you overlay your belts and match up the teeth and transfer the marks to the new belt so it all matches up. Picture pinching the belts together to keep the teeth lined up and then work your way until you transfer all the marks.

Now, you've transferred all the marks. Your new belt is ready to go. You line your new belt back up to match the marks on the cam and crank gear. Your engine should still be in time at this point.

computer dying.... be back soon


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

bboy_jon said:


> hmmm...I dont quite understand. Are you supposed to line everything up first then put the belt on while matching the marks? I guess I just dont understand how the belt keeps everything in time.
> 
> When taking off the belt, are you supposed to line up the crank and cam marks right? Than you just mark your current belt where the crank and cam marks are? I feel like the marking of the belt is just kind of random...are the markings pretty much to ensure proper spacing between the two teeth (that need to be at the crank/cam marks) ?
> 
> ...


You need to set the car at TDC(Top Dead Center) before you start.

This is where the cam gear lines up with mark on the valve cover and the crank lines up with the mark on the lower timing belt cover. TDC is when the 1 cylinder is all the way up and flush with the top of the block. 

Once the car is set to TDC you could just remove the old belt and put the new one on. Then you should rotate the motor over twice by hand and check to make sure the cam gear is lining up and also that the crank gear is lining up. DO NOT ROTATE THE MOTOR WITHOUT THE BELT ON!!!!!!!!!

The purpose of the timing belt is to keep the head(valves) in time with the block(pistons) so they do not contact each other. 

Putting paint marks on the old belt before you take it off is just a extra step that some people take to make sure they don't get the belt off by a tooth or more. If you get the belt off some teeth your valves will contact your pistons and you will have to take the head off and replace the bent valves. Mark the old belt and cam gear with 1 mark and the old belt and crank gear with 2 marks and then transfer the marks to the new belt. Then when you put the new belt on make sure all the marks line up before releasing the tensioner and you can be sure everything is good. You still need to rotate the motor over by hand twice and check your cam and crank marks. Keep in mind that the paint marks will not line up but the factory marks should. If you rotated the motor over by hand like 5 times eventually the paint marks would all line up again. 

I would strongly suggest you use the paint mark method since you don't fully seem to understand TDC and what the timing belt does. That way when you are wrestling the belt on you can just look at the marks for reference. You don't have to use the mark method but if you screw this up you will be looking at a few thousand dollars to repair.


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

oh yeah, I will definitely be using the marks 

This is making more sense, I think I am just thinking too hard about it and trying to understand how it all works.

I appreciate the help guys. Oh, yeah Tobz, were you able to find a link to that manual tensioner? How do the hydraulic tensioners even work? From what I got from the guide, you bolt it in, place an allen wrench somewhere, and pull a pin? :banghead:


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

bboy_jon said:


> oh yeah, I will definitely be using the marks
> 
> This is making more sense, I think I am just thinking too hard about it and trying to understand how it all works.
> 
> I appreciate the help guys. Oh, yeah Tobz, were you able to find a link to that manual tensioner? How do the hydraulic tensioners even work? From what I got from the guide, you bolt it in, place an allen wrench somewhere, and pull a pin? :banghead:


Here is a link to the IE manual tensioner. BUT you don't need to buy the full kit listed here, you only need the round tensioner, stud, spacer, washer and nut. You can take your old hydraulic tensioner, pull the hydraulic middle piston out and still use the same idler. Seen below is the hydraulic tensioner which has the same idler as the red idler in the IE kit.

HYDRAULIC TENSIONERS:
these work as shown in the first picture. The piston facing upward is originally retracted into the cylinder and held in place by a pic placed in the very tiny hole as seen in the piston (very top of the tensioner). This pushed the circular tensioner guide thingy into the belt and tensions the belt.

MANUAL TENSIONERS:
As seen in the second picture. All you do is put the stud into the engine block, then spacer nut and then the tensioner (round bearing with 2 small holes) then washer then nut. Don't tighten up the nut yet and install the red idler (or old hydraulic idler with the pin pulled out). To tension the belt all you need to do is put the tensioner tool in the holes and pull until the belt is tensioned correctly and then tighten the nut. 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...ioner-Solution-from-INTEGRATED-ENGINEERING!**


















I used the manual tensioner and you need to play around with it a bit to get the exact correct tension but after that just check the belt every oil change to make sure that it is the same tension and you should be good. It is easy to re-adjust from the top of the engine bay with just the cover off so if you have any problems you can just retension or untension it a bit. It has worked for me so far, just make sure everything is lined up good and don't tighten the belt too tight or it will squeak and wear out your bearing faster :thumbup:


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

Basically what MechEngg said. The hydraulic tensioner is a hydraulic unit that, over time, loses its hydraulic "power" and lets the belt slack up, causing it to prematurely skip teeth and in turn smash valves into your pistons. The manual tensioner uses an old-school 16V design (I believe) where a manual lobe is turned to apply proper tensioning and is then torqued in place to hold at that angle.

The IE kit, plus the manual tensioner tool, is a little more than the "all-in-one" kits from ECS or MJM... but you'll never have a weak hydraulic tensioner and it will be better-than-OEM parts. Assuming you do your due diligence of checking the belt tension, which is easy, you'll have a trouble-free timing belt experience.

IE kit w/ pump (06A block): http://www.intengineering.com/Integrated-Engineering-p9327074-1-2.html
Tensioner tool: http://www.intengineering.com/Mechanical-Timing-Belt-p9768569-1-2.html

You'll also want to pick up the motor mount bolts for the passenger side.... altogether the manual kit, done right, comes out to like $320 - $340 depending on whether you get the motor mount bolts locally or shipped from an online store.

In the end, it's up to you on what you want to do. The OEM tensioner works good for a lot of people, but some people have had bad failures. If we replaced every piece that has ever, even if only once, failed terribly... we'd have replaced every part in our cars by now.  You should be fine with either kit... it just depends on how much you want to spend to do this job and what you think your car is worth. Whatever the choice, replacing the belt is a good thing. :thumbup:


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

PD Performance said:


> I never use the flywheel especially.....your method does work but is not as reliable as using the actual crank. No need to even mark anything


highlights....x2


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

interesting, I will have to look into it more. For the hydraulic tensioner, to get proper tension in the belts is just a matter of properly torquing the nut to 25nm? Or am I missing something?


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

bboy_jon said:


> interesting, I will have to look into it more. For the hydraulic tensioner, to get proper tension in the belts is just a matter of properly torquing the nut to 25nm? Or am I missing something?


Nope the hydraulic tensioner has the pin you pull out. The tensioner bolts to the block and you just pull the pin on the side and it automatically tensions due to the springs inside the tensioner. The 25nm torque is just mounting the tensioner to the side of the engine


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

oh ok. Well thats simple than  I think I might just go ahead and do the hydraulic one. I doubt I will check the tension if I get the manual one, plus its super expensive :laugh:


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## rychas1 (Mar 2, 2004)

Thank you for the advice from this thread. I just finished my timing belt/ water pump swap and that was the most nerve-wrecking experience I have ever had on my cars. Headgasket on my vr6 wasnt this bad. Nonetheless, for others (newbs) like myself with this job, I will share some pointers.

1. timing marks: honestly this is what took me the most time. i watched videos on youtube and read this thread over and over, but due to fear, I exaggerated my timing checks. What worked for me was a) setting the cam mark b) looking at the flywheel TDC "0" mark and c) pulling out #1 spark plug, putting a long extension in, and finding TDC at the piston peak. I marked the belt, but that only helped a little, as I was off by half a tooth with the new one and I couldn't figure out why (hence the nervousness!). Once I cranked it over manually twice, and the extension was at its peak, cam mark was on and I saw the TDC "0", I was set. Nervous, but set.

2. tensioner: that was a PAIN! I was tired. That is a good resting point. I could not get that top bolt in if it saved my life! But, I came back the next day, but a 5mm allen in to line up the hole-working from the bottom-and held the tensioner in place while screwing in the screw with some force. My problem was that the screw wouldn't catch. I was not applying enough force.

3. idler pulley bolt: I have no idea why, but that bolt wouldn't budge! Lube, leverage, nothing. I didn't want to risk more damage like a broken bolt in the block, so I left it. It wasn't noisy so I trust that it's fine for the time being. I can always change it later.

4. belt: that was tricky, especially when trying to keep those marks on. I kept the front a little tighter than the rear, but once the tension is on, marks don't really matter, as long as the cam and crank have not moved (which takes effort itself). I spent too much time trying to perfect those marks, and they just didn't matter, to me. My belt was and fairly snug before I pulled the tensioner pin, so that was easy.

5: motor mounts: moving the engine up and down made this simple, but tricky. I found that the block mount goes in easiest with the engine very low. There is just no other way. Tighten the lower bolt then. Then, raise the engine all the way up and do the long bolt and the rear one. Done.

the rest was straight forward. Started fine. :thumbup:


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## dubau2 (Mar 17, 2010)

I am interested in the Mechanical tensioner. so you just bolt it to your block and tighten the tensioner pulley to 25nm and its good? also i emailed MJM and they just said i didn't need motor mount stretch bolts? did something change from the first post? do i really need to replace the Crankshaft Seal and the camshaft seals? Im just trying to make sure i have everything down before i get into it.


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

dubau2 said:


> I am interested in the Mechanical tensioner. so you just bolt it to your block and tighten the tensioner pulley to 25nm and its good? also i emailed MJM and they just said i didn't need motor mount stretch bolts? did something change from the first post? do i really need to replace the Crankshaft Seal and the camshaft seals? Im just trying to make sure i have everything down before i get into it.


Replacing the cam seals is way more work and you don't replace them when doing the timing belt.
The mechanical tensioner works just like you said it does. You need the spanner wrench to rotate the pulley so it puts tension on the belt and then you tighten it down. This idea comes from vw 16v motors, they had this tensioner for years working flawless:thumbup:
You don't need new motor mount bolts, you can re use...


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## STOICH (Jun 21, 2010)

Twopnt016v said:


> You don't need new motor mount bolts, you can re use...


Some of them are TTY. On something like a mount you should be replacing:










On the point of the t/belt install: if you are that worried about TDC, just mark you belt/cogs appropriately and count teeth/transfer...don't even worry about TDC. Not that that's the way I do it, but it seems to confuse some when that's thrown into the mix with belt marking.


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

STOICH said:


> Some of them are TTY. On something like a mount you should be replacing:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that those were over torqued:facepalm:
When I worked at the dealer they never got replaced by anyone...never had a failure in years..
Sure it is a good practice if you can get them but it's not a must...


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## STOICH (Jun 21, 2010)

Twopnt016v said:


> I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that those were over torqued:facepalm:
> When I worked at the dealer they never got replaced by anyone...never had a failure in years..
> Sure it is a good practice if you can get them but it's not a must...


The one that broke never met full torque. Other was on the verge of breaking. Those bolts had been installed for roughly 30K miles and that is what happened when trying to reuse. I reuse some TTY bolts, but they sure as hell aren't going to be on major mounting points.

I understand some people get by, but it should not be a suggestion to a weekend warrior about to take on a t/belt job. Spend the extra $12-15, get new bolts, be reassured. I just don't personally feel that a mount point like that should be taking the chances on reusing bolts are are technically defective upon removal.


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

STOICH said:


> The one that broke never met full torque. Other was on the verge of breaking. Those bolts had been installed for roughly 30K miles and that is what happened when trying to reuse. I reuse some TTY bolts, but they sure as hell aren't going to be on major mounting points.
> 
> I understand some people get by, but it should not be a suggestion to a weekend warrior about to take on a t/belt job. Spend the extra $12-15, get new bolts, be reassured. I just don't personally feel that a mount point like that should be taking the chances on reusing bolts are are technically defective upon removal.


I understand where you are coming from...
But as the guy above me already stated, I'm not the only one that has reused them...
If you can get them then do it....


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## dubau2 (Mar 17, 2010)

ok thanks! sounds like ima go with the integrated engineering timing belt kit with the manual tensioner. i like to keep it as simple as possible. not a fan of over engineering a simple piece. and i can get some motor mount bolts i gotta stealership 5min away from my house. id feel safer getting new ones. also on the mechanical tensioner. do you just turn it till the belt is snug? any tips on judging that?


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## STOICH (Jun 21, 2010)

^^^You should be able to pinch the belt and twist it no more than 90*.


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

STOICH said:


> ^^^You should be able to pinch the belt and twist it no more than 90*.


What he said. You should be able to twist the belt about 90 degrees... if you can easily twist it more than that, it's too loose.


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

Twopnt016v said:


> I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that those were over torqued:facepalm:
> When I worked at the dealer they never got replaced by anyone...never had a failure in years..
> Sure it is a good practice if you can get them but it's not a must...


exactly, you can clearly see if threads are distorted after removal. On my own cars i've reused bolts with 2-5% more torque.


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## dubau2 (Mar 17, 2010)

[email protected] said:


> What he said. You should be able to twist the belt about 90 degrees... if you can easily twist it more than that, it's too loose.


alright sweet that sounds pretty easy! well time to get ordering!!!! thanks guys your saving me a lot of money


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## dubau2 (Mar 17, 2010)

Anybody know if a Kevlar timing belt would be worth it?


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

I would recommend people not to preform this task until they understand what TDC means! The paint on belt should be more for reference than anything else, (ex. shortcut) but check timing mark on valve cover and crank on flywheel side because pulley on crank cannot always be an accurate reference point.



Twopnt016v said:


> You need to set the car at TDC(Top Dead Center) before you start.
> 
> This is where the cam gear lines up with mark on the valve cover and the crank lines up with the mark on the lower timing belt cover. TDC is when the 1 cylinder is all the way up and flush with the top of the block.
> 
> ...


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

dubau2 said:


> Anybody know if a Kevlar timing belt would be worth it?


Nope, because you're going to have to do the job anyways again to replace your water pump.


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

crazymoforz said:


> I would recommend people not to preform this task until they understand what TDC means! The paint on belt should be more for reference than anything else, (ex. shortcut) but check timing mark on valve cover and crank on flywheel side because pulley on crank cannot always be an accurate reference point.


How is someone supposed to check a mark on the crank on the flywheel side? Gonna drop the tranny to do a timing belt?  Flywheel is the least accurate of all three spots to check because it could be a new, different flywheel. More people have their stock crank pulley than stock flywheel.


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

Crank over flywheel:thumbup:...


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## crazymoforz (Jan 19, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> How is someone supposed to check a mark on the crank on the flywheel side? Gonna drop the tranny to do a timing belt?  Flywheel is the least accurate of all three spots to check because it could be a new, different flywheel. More people have their stock crank pulley than stock flywheel.


5spd has a plug that could be removed, flywheel has a notch that you could line up. aftermarket flywheel (well, most that i have installed, have an existing mark) 6spds do not have the plug. What crank mark are you guys referring to? serp pulley? HA! loosen those 4 bolts and tell me how much that pulley moves around. One tooth off and the car will run like Sh** and have a never ending CEL.


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

Quick question(s), only the passenger side motor mount needs to be loosened/removed correct? No messing with the dogbone or anything? How are you guys lifting the engine? Just jacking up by the tranny? Just curious because when I was doing my dogbone bushings, jacking up in different spots moved the engine differently. 

Ordering my kit today!


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## Iangti7777 (May 23, 2010)

Only one mount needs to be removed. 
I used a small piece/plank of wood under the sump to distribute the load to a hydraulic trolley jack. I found it necessary to adjust the engine height at times to wiggle things in and out, so a hydraulic jack made things easy. I also had an axle stand positioned under the plank to catch the engine in case the jack gave way.


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

crazymoforz said:


> 5spd has a plug that could be removed, flywheel has a notch that you could line up. aftermarket flywheel (well, most that i have installed, have an existing mark) 6spds do not have the plug. What crank mark are you guys referring to? serp pulley? HA! loosen those 4 bolts and tell me how much that pulley moves around. One tooth off and the car will run like Sh** and have a never ending CEL.


6speed trannys have the plug also But by your logic how would you set the timing up on a 6 speed car??? Use the crank just like vw recommends...


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

would somebody here be a pal and message me their phone number? I will be doing this tomorrow and knowing me, will probably take an extra day or so and I will probably end up running into a problem here and there. Just as a precaution it would be nice if I could talk to someone about it if I end up running into something; it would definitely be easier than posting the question on the forum and awaiting a response. Id appreciate it


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## blkgti505 (Apr 18, 2009)

the first time i did a timing belt job on my 1.8t i had no issues. no power loss, no timing issues... and this was not looking at the flywheel marks. now the second time i did my timing belt job (for the premature water pump failure) i looked at the flywheel marks and turned out i bent cyl1 and cyl3 intake valves. after trying to get everything lined up for 4+ hours. sooo i decided to go BT with gates belt and manual tensioner . 

good write up man! ill use this when i get my engine done.


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

whats all the commotion in here about lol.....20 pages geezzz.....


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

I did it. Took me two days but it was a pain, but honestly, not too horrible. Thanks to everyone who helped, especially MechEngg, couldnt have done it without him. The guide was very helpful, but also somewhat difficult to understand. 

The guide said to just unbolt the harmonic balancer, but no pics or info was provided  The 4 allen bolts that hold it to the crank are on there tight. I had to go out and buy some allen key sockets and ended up snapping the dam key, as well as rounding out a couple of those bolts. Someone in the earlier pages of this thread had something similar happen to him and thank god for that. He suggested to use Irwin bolt removers 

http://www.amazon.com/Irwin-Industrial-394001-Bolt-Grip-Extractor/dp/B0000CCXVZ 

Only $16 at home depot and worked like a charm. So if anyone has trouble with those allen bolts, just buy that little kit. I also had to buy some new bolts from my vw shop so for anyone about to pull this job, might want to get some of those ready. 

The motor mount was actually super easy to take out. The mount that attaches to the car slipped right out and once the tensioner is out, the motor mount (to the block) comes right out allowing you to take out the roller. I am glad I read up on this entire thread to by informed to put the motor mount back in before the tensioner, otherwise I would have been screwed. 

For putting the belt on, MechEngg suggested this 



> 1 - Do not put on the tensioner or roller circle thingy yet.
> 2 - Crank the crank counterclockwise about 15 degrees. This will give you the slack you need to put the belt on and line up the timing marks.
> 3 - line up the timing belt marks and put the timing belt on the gears, get your friend to hold the belt in place on top of the gear while you get the bottom marks lined up. If necessary rotate the crank a bit more.
> 4 - With holding the belt marks in place firmly crank the crank clockwise and tighten up the belt on the front side of the engine that passes by the water pump. Tighten it up fairly firmly. The reason for doing this is to create lots of slack on the backside of the belt so you can now fit in the tensioner and roller.
> ...


 I tried to put the belt on as suggested in the guide but it didnt take long for me to realize it wouldnt work, especially since I still had the motor mount out. I followed mechengg's instructions; It was a little nerve racking turning the crank independently from the cam but it worked and was pretty easy, I made sure to place many marks near the teeth just for peace of mind. I lined up the belt marks, had my brother place a finger on the cam marks than cranked the crank pulley back into position, thus tightening up the belt. I stuck a small 3/8 drive extension inbetween the belt and the case, as shown in this pic 










This keeps tension on the belt/crank marks and frees up both of your hands, which you will need (remember to have your buddy or whoever keep pressure on the cam mark). From here, I grabbed the roller, bolted that in. Than threw the motor mount in, followed by the tensioner. Took a while, and your buddy will get tired but it was pretty simple...probably would have helped if I lowered the engine as i had it set as high as it could go and my arm length is pretty short. 

I was kind of worried since when I would crank the crank pulley back to its original position, the cam gear moved a wee bit and the marks I made were slightly off. Fortunately, everything works (so far) and my motor is still in time. 

IMHO, the hardest and most frustrating part was putting that dam timing belt cover back on...geez what I pain, I actually broke a sweat trying to force it on because of a dam hardline in the way. All in all, pretty simple job, just a few problems here and there. 

ALSO, it would probably help to just remove the coolant ball and unbolt the power steering reservoir in the begining. I didnt do it until I got to the steps in the guide but it sure could have saved a bit of time getting the accessory tensioner off. Also, if you can, drain your coolant. I didnt do it (since I dont know how) and ended up getting destroyed when I pulled the water pump out...I was soaked and had a bunch of **** end up in my mouth...it was pretty funny though. Good luck everyone!


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

Also, here is another guide. Would have been nice to have 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5174517-Timing-Belt-DIY-for-1.8T-motor-another-great-diy


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

To get that upper timing belt cover on and off all you need to do is simply remove the sensor right in front of the cover. Pull out the retaining clip and the sensor plug just slips out. Then the timing belt cover can easily slip on and off. Should have mentioned that too haha


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

Yeah, the sensor eventually ended up disconnecting itself and it got a bit easier. The hard part was that steel line (not sure what it is) but it just kept getting in the way. Once I figured out how to get the cover up and over it I felt like a dummy


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## toby lawrence (Dec 12, 2011)

I broke my upper timing cover trying to get it back in after a routine tension check. **** that metal hard line. I want to chop that **** up. :banghead: :laugh:


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

haha not surprised. I broke a piece when I pulled it out and I ended up cracking it getting back in. What is that line anyways?


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

IIRC it's a coolant line for the turbo


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

ahhh, I am leaking there :banghead:


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)




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## blue02gls (Sep 20, 2010)

I am about to tackle this next week over my spring break. Anything else you guys would suggest buying beyond the ECS ultimate plus kit?


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

the kits come with everything. Unless you want light weight pulleys, it wouldnt be a bad time to do those...but I dont think they do much from what Ive heard. Motor mount spacers would be good to put on (if you are low) since you have to undo the motor mount anyways :/


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## blue02gls (Sep 20, 2010)

Thanks for the suggestions! I was looking at the underdrive sets but sadly am a little lower on cash than I would like to be. Same goes for not being low yet. Maintenance first.


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

blue02gls said:


> Thanks for the suggestions! I was looking at the underdrive sets but sadly am a little lower on cash than I would like to be. Same goes for not being low yet. Maintenance first.


Just get the kit with OEM tensioner, roller and belt and you will be fine  
I wouldn't necessarily recommend anything else with the kit. An upgraded dogbone mount bushings (uprated durometer rating) never hurt though while you have the car jacked up along with a transmission fluid change and oil change


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## blue02gls (Sep 20, 2010)

Thanks MechEngg I'm doing the job tomorrow morning. Then if all goes well installing my TBE afterwards! Tomorrow should be a good day!


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

Start bright and early man. Good luck


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## WiscoVR6 (Jul 25, 2008)

thanks for all the great info in this thread, did this yesterday and so far so good. I do have worries though im getting a wobble noise it seems like the harmonic balancer pulley may not be on tight enough? anyone else ever have a noise? ( its not a grinding or rubbing noise) The belt went on extremely tight, IMHO that was the hardest part of this job.


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## superstew17 (May 4, 2011)

just wondering if there are any specialty tools required for doing this job 
thanks


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

not really...all the tools needed are listed on the first post. The most "special" tool needed is probably the 19 mm 12 point socket.


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## superstew17 (May 4, 2011)

and just to confirm only 4 new stretch mount bolts are needed?


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

yup, all 7 would have been nice but the other 3 arent 100% necessary :/


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## Esevw (Dec 27, 2002)

I just did the timing belt and the water pump and all new tensioners using this thread and another one I found and everything turned out great. :beer::beer: Took me a whole day to do the work about 10hrs but I was a bit paranoid about the timing being set dead on. Last thing I wanted was some bent valves and $5K repair bill. So it was definitely work taking my time and triple checking everything, glad I did. This was done on my gfs car, she's now super happy to have saved a good amount of cash and have her car running perfectly.


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## superstew17 (May 4, 2011)

ok so what does this torque spec mean from the DIY
"Engine mount to Body - 40Nm + 90"


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

The motor mount is a 2 piece deal. One piece attaches to the holes in the engine bay than to the other piece of the motor mount which is attached to the motor. 

"Engine mount to Body - 40Nm + 90"

Torque the bolts that bolt the mount to the engine bay to 40 nm and give it an extra 90 degree turn. At least thats what I took it as, couldnt think of anything else it could be when I did it


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## superstew17 (May 4, 2011)

thanks! yepp that seemed to work!!


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## dan_wolf (Nov 15, 2006)

Hello, I recently changed the timing belt on my Golf IV 2.0 8v, idler roller, water pump, alternator belt, tensioner and thermostat. I have a question before replacement timing belt gear sitting on the camshaft toward the engine, now stands out is normal? I attached a picture.
I put Contitech belts, rollers Ina, water pump and thermostat Hepu Behr (I do not think this has to do with the belt).
Belt tensioner distribution differs in scope to the old, this new strain is a wrench.
Thank you.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/580/timingbelt.jpg


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## jedge1.8t (Jan 27, 2012)

how can you take the belt off to reset it back a tooth? i didnt pull the pin but im trying to pull it off the sprocket but it wont budge. i put the mounts back on already so i dont think i can take the tension pulley off.


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## jedge1.8t (Jan 27, 2012)

Im having trouble getting the timing right, no matter what i do, once i finally get the belt on it still it hits more 5/8ths tooth forward via cam. I do my alignment, 1st belt tooth- cam to notch, 68th tooth - flywheel mark to crank. but it still looks off

here it looks like its right before the next tooth?








flywheel dictates the TDC along with crank


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

how are you getting the belt on? Just muscling it? 

Set your cam mark to tdc. Retard the crank a few teeth, then slide the belt on. You shouldnt be able to (or it should be difficult) to get the belt on all the way so slide the belt on as much as you can, then rotate the crank a bit and it should get the belt on and all of your marks should line up.


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## jedge1.8t (Jan 27, 2012)

damn, i already pulled the pin and put the mounts back in. i was bicycle chaining it on. 

guess ill take them off and retry :banghead:


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## M_K_4_GUY (Sep 30, 2011)

im having diffilculties with my timing, i timed it well and all of sudden is 2 tooth away after i had the car on for atleast 15 minutes .im assuming that the problem is the tension damper .the reason i believe is the tension damper is because the pin can be easily press down .is it normal for the pin to be easily press down ?


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

M_K_4_GUY said:


> im having diffilculties with my timing, i timed it well and all of sudden is 2 tooth away after i had the car on for atleast 15 minutes .im assuming that the problem is the tension damper .the reason i believe is the tension damper is because the pin can be easily press down .is it normal for the pin to be easily press down ?


Question, how do you think the belt is 2 teeth off? You know that the lowest common denominator between the teeth on the cam and the teeth on the belt is around 115 or however many teeth there is on the belt. That means that the "marks" you made on the belt for timing will only match up with the timing mark on the gear once every 115 or so turns of the belt.......


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## M_K_4_GUY (Sep 30, 2011)

the pulley line is two thread away from the valve cover line this is why is 2 teeth away


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

M_K_4_GUY said:


> the pulley line is two thread away from the valve cover line this is why is 2 teeth away


Does it run like ****?


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## M_K_4_GUY (Sep 30, 2011)

after i finish the job it turned on , i took for a drive and it ran well , wen i turned it off and tryied to to turn it back on it didnt turn on it just crank


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

M_K_4_GUY said:


> after i finish the job it turned on , i took for a drive and it ran well , wen i turned it off and tryied to to turn it back on it didnt turn on it just crank


step by step solution.
reset the timing, turn over the motor twice by hand, check timing marks, run the motor with the crank pulley on and without covers, check timing again.


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## M_K_4_GUY (Sep 30, 2011)

tom8thebomb said:


> step by step solution.
> reset the timing, turn over the motor twice by hand, check timing marks, run the motor with the crank pulley on and without covers, check timing again.


clockwise or counter clockwise ?


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## DowNnOuTDubin (Jun 21, 2006)

M_K_4_GUY said:


> clockwise or counter clockwise ?


Doesn't matter, either way it'll do a full 4 stroke turn.


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## M_K_4_GUY (Sep 30, 2011)

DowNnOuTDubin said:


> Doesn't matter, either way it'll do a full 4 stroke turn.


:thumbup:


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

M_K_4_GUY said:


> :thumbup:


NO!, always in the direction of the natural rotation, clockwise. Reversal would put unnecessary slack into the belt opposite of the tensioner.


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## Jetta509 (Mar 22, 2012)

can someone explain how and why to mark the timing belt 
a video or something
i dont get it


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

Jetta509 said:


> can someone explain how and why to mark the timing belt
> a video or something
> i dont get it


It's just a method to double check your work and to make aligning the crank pulley with the cam pulley easier.

Here's the basic process...

Bring your engine to TDC using the cam gear mark.

Double check that your engine is at TDC using the crank gear mark. (if it is off then your timing is off before you started) In this case, do not bother marking your belt as it is WRONG.

To mark the belt put a mark on the cam gear at TDC with a paint pen and put it on the belt in the same spot. Put a mark on the crank gear and/or crank gear cover and drag it across onto the belt. Allow the paint to dry.

Use the bentley process to remove the belt, tensioner, and water pump.

Take your old belt and lay it on top of your new belt on the ground. Transfer the paint marks so they are in the same spots on the new belt. Be very careful. Even one tooth off is the difference between an engine running well and an engine running poorly.

Replace belt, tensioner, and water pump per the bentley. When it's time to slip the belt onto the crank and cam pulleys, use your marks to help line it up. Right now there is no tension on the belt because you haven't pulled the pin on the tensioner yet. Without the marks this step is tricky because when you pull the pin it has a tendency to move the two pulleys a bit and can make you have a hard time getting your timing spot on. The paint is there to tell you EXACTLY which tooth fits into which tooth on the pulleys. As long as the paint matches, your timing will be on.

Once the belt is in place and the paint matches up, pull the pin on the tensioner.

Double check timing. Check that cam gear is at TDC, crank gear is at TDC, and if desired...flywheel is at TDC. 
If you are off you can only rotate the gears a few degrees in either direction!!!! Only rotate them so they're back to where they should be if they're off. Do not rotate them a full rotation to bring them back into spec!!! This is an interference engine and if you mess this up you will spend a lot of money and timing fixing it (valve job)!!!

Check timing again.

Walk away.

Check timing again.

Ask your friend to check the timing too.

Take a wrench and turn the crank 4 or so rotations via the center crank bolt. Align the cam gear to TDC. Ensure the crank still lines up at TDC.

Have your friend double check this.

Go crank the car with the ignition.

Enjoy your new timing belt. :beer:


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## Jetta509 (Mar 22, 2012)

^^^^Thanks for clearing things up:beer::thumbup:


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

Groggory

You are wrong. The engine does NOT need to be TDC if you are just transferring marks from one belt to the next. If you would like an explanation i can provide one, but i have done ~8 of these timing belt jobs and never once had it at TDC.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

MechEngg said:


> Groggory
> 
> You are wrong. The engine does NOT need to be TDC if you are just transferring marks from one belt to the next. If you would like an explanation i can provide one, but i have done ~8 of these timing belt jobs and never once had it at TDC.


You don't need it to be tdc, I agree...

But I preach it this way to give people a way to double check their work


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## Shacho (Jul 8, 2011)

*02 Jetta 1.8T Timing Change*

First off...Big Thanks for This Thread (Step-by-step guide)  

I completed the timing change on my 02 Jetta 1.8T; however, I did run into 1 problem with the idler tensioner. I am going to safely assume the previous owner changed the belt because the belt is/was in good condition and he/she attempted to change the idler pulley but stripped out the bolt and left it as is. Oh yeah, the primary reason for tearing it down was for the water pump failure. Since I didn't have the proper tools to remove the stripped bolt, I left it alone and continued changing the water pump. Completed the belt installation...etc...all marking lined up dead-on...cam pulley, crankshaft and tranny. Car started as expected, however, now I am getting the reaper code P0340 (CSP). I checked and doubled check the marking before and after the first start. I reset the ECU and drove the car around without the code popping up again. Started engine again this morning and the same code (P0340) appears. I'm thinking it jump timing, maybe a tooth off. Back to the shade tree ....:banghead:


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

Shacho said:


> First off...Big Thanks for This Thread (Step-by-step guide)
> 
> I completed the timing change on my 02 Jetta 1.8T; however, I did run into 1 problem with the idler tensioner. I am going to safely assume the previous owner changed the belt because the belt is/was in good condition and he/she attempted to change the idler pulley but stripped out the bolt and left it as is. Oh yeah, the primary reason for tearing it down was for the water pump failure. Since I didn't have the proper tools to remove the stripped bolt, I left it alone and continued changing the water pump. Completed the belt installation...etc...all marking lined up dead-on...cam pulley, crankshaft and tranny. Car started as expected, however, now I am getting the reaper code P0340 (CSP). I checked and doubled check the marking before and after the first start. I reset the ECU and drove the car around without the code popping up again. Started engine again this morning and the same code (P0340) appears. I'm thinking it jump timing, maybe a tooth off. Back to the shade tree ....:banghead:


 Did you remember to plug in your camshaft position sensor? If the car runs (doesn't sound like it is going to blow up) then the timing is usually fine. If you are off by even one tooth you will nearly **** the bed when you start the car up, and since you didn't bring that up i assume it runs fine but you just have a code. Look around just under the engine code marking by the front of the upper timing belt cover and see if you remembered to plug that back in.


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## Shacho (Jul 8, 2011)

With that said, the timing is dead-on...the engine idles and runs smooth (no vibrations at all). Q: Other than changing out the sensor, are there any other troubleshooting I can do to convict the CSPS? I know it will take more time to remove the top cover than it would changing sensor.


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## EmKay IV (Dec 22, 2011)

did you need any special tool to take off the harmonic balancer ?


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

EmKay IV said:


> did you need any special tool to take off the harmonic balancer ?


6mm allen key, preferable one that goes on a ratchet because it is on pretty tight. Holt the big middle bolt in place with a 19mm regular socket :thumbup:


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

^^^ what he said. You will NEED allen keys with the socket/ratchets since they are on there pretty good. Be very careful with them and make sure you seat them all the way because they are very easy to strip. If they do, go to lowes or home depot and buy a irwin bolt extractor kit (i think it was less than $20) and it works like a charm.


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## radlynx (Jan 4, 2007)

start disassembling it on a Friday evening so you have more time and patience in a Saturday for reassembly. 



Coralmouse said:


> How long does this take to do average? Doing it on saturday wish me luck.. wanna know how much time i should play on putting away.


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

radlynx said:


> start disassembling it on a Friday evening so you have more time and patience in a Saturday for reassembly.


I have this down to around 3 hours for the whole thing including thermostat and housing. 

If it is your first time you should plan to spend 8-10 hours on it


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

^^^ What he said. Definitely took a while to figure everything out and its good to leave yourself plenty of time; this isnt the job that you want to rush.


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## Shacho (Jul 8, 2011)

MechEgg,
I finally got around to tearing everything down again because of the cam positioning circuit code and the timing was off by ONE tooth. As I stated before, the engine ran perfect and had it not been for the code popping up...it would still be one tooth off. Re-timed engine again (dead-on) and now I can feel a slight increase in performance. Oh yeah, on the second time of tearing it down, it only took about 2.5~3 hours. 

-Next-
Engine tune-up - I bought some Bosch plugs and later learn from the dealer that the 1.8T is not designed to run on these particular plugs. He (dealer) did try to sell me the recommended plugs (NGKs) at $17 dollars each. Gap 

Once again, this thread (DIY) has saved me a lot of money that I use for other mods.


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

Shacho said:


> MechEgg,
> I finally got around to tearing everything down again because of the cam positioning circuit code and the timing was off by ONE tooth. As I stated before, the engine ran perfect and had it not been for the code popping up...it would still be one tooth off. Re-timed engine again (dead-on) and now I can feel a slight increase in performance. Oh yeah, on the second time of tearing it down, it only took about 2.5~3 hours.
> 
> -Next-
> ...


That sucks, at least this time you knew exactly what to do!


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## EmKay IV (Dec 22, 2011)

bboy_jon said:


> ^^^ what he said. You will NEED allen keys with the socket/ratchets since they are on there pretty good. Be very careful with them and make sure you seat them all the way because they are very easy to strip. If they do, go to lowes or home depot and buy a irwin bolt extractor kit (i think it was less than $20) and it works like a charm.


No harmonic balancer puller needed? Cause I know some cars that's the only way you'll give them off is with that special tool to pull it off.


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

Nope. Its held on by four allen head/hex key type bolts.


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## kdiver58 (Jan 25, 2004)

*Motor Mount NFI*

I have to give some of you credit .. I have no idea how you get the motor mount out before you get the tensioner off. I have a scissor jack under the engine I jacked it up 2.5 inches .. Down a half inch it didn't matter .. I was bound and determined to get it out and video tape it with exact instructions. I failed miserably .. Once I took the tensioner off it was no problem .. I got the farthest by trying to go back towards the firewall but it got wedged every time. Epic Fail ... :banghead:


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## kdiver58 (Jan 25, 2004)

*Just do it !*

I would encourage everyone and anyone to replace your own timing belt. It's not easy but it will save you a lot of money and you will know what you have in it. I found the last person who did mine put a cheap plastic impeller pump in when I had paid him to put in a metal one. 
Here are a few things I will add that I feel will help anyone tackling this. 
#1 CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN before you start 

 

#2 My 2003 VW GTI 1.8t had a drain spout for coolant. I added a hose to the spout, twisted the knob and pulled it out and the water drained. Once it stopped draining I pressurized my reservoir with 5 PSI of air and blew out even more. I also used a turkey baster to get the last little bit out of the reservoir. 

 

#3 Mark the timing belt, crank and cam pulleys like everyone has said. And transfer those marks to the new belt. 

 

#4 Take everything apart like the OP says .. BTW the Harmonic balancer is a 6mm 

Now this is the order of assembly that gave me the best results and worked the best for me. 
#1 install the upper tensioner roller 
#2 install the plunger part of the tensioner (DON'T PULL THE PIN) 
#3 Lower the engine or raise it and put the motor mount in position 
#4 install the water pump (the motor mount is much easier to install without the long snout of the water pump getting in the way) 
#5 start putting the timing belt in place 
#6 align the marks on the timing belt and the CRANK pulley once they are in the right location I folded plain old cardboard and wedged it in between the block and the timing belt to hold it in place. 
#7 feed the timing belt around the tensioner pulleys and the water pump 
#8 you may find that you can't get the belt on the cam gear to line up with the marks. DON'T sweat it . Put and wrench on the bolt in the center of the cam gear and rotate the cam gear slightly clockwise until your marks line up. Remember you can be a tooth off and the engine will still run. I'm just mentioning this to let you know you will be okay if you have to rotate a tooth or two distance wise to get your marks to line up. 
#9 once the belt is on and your marks are lined up put a cable tie around the gear and belt to hold it in place. 

 

#10 rotate the cam gear back in place 
#11 bolt the motor mount in place 
#12 CHECK ALL OF YOUR MARKS OVER AND OVER 
Once you pull the pin make sure you cut the cable tie and remove the cardboard


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## BoostedGLS0218 (Dec 10, 2011)

So I just did my belt replacement earlier this week. It went great! And this guide definitely saved me a crap load of money. The whole thing took me about 8 hours and the hardest part was basically working with the bottom piece of the motor mount. It's hard as hell to get our or put back in and is typically always in the way so I had to constantly shift it around. Everything else was fairly easy as long as I took my time.


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## mrpowerlines (Jan 21, 2012)

Awesome Write up!! thanks!!!!


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## buddylight (May 8, 2011)

this has helped me so much this weekend replacing my water pump and belt. i wouldve been lost with out it


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## Bruno Molly (Mar 3, 2011)

*Timing Belt Change....and Timing CHAIN tensioner change for this job..*

My Background..been working on my own cars for years...from Triumphs to BMW 12cyls, Volvo, Toyotas, Lex, Mazdas, american cars.. My most recent task was reassembling a Volvo S80 T6 I bout for pennies, and it has VVT..Never had to deal with variable timing procedures before but got it done on the 1st try. I have a shop in the back yard with a Lift..getting too old to be laying on my back working on stuff..so I bought one... NOW on to the meat...

*Ok.. 01 Wolf, 1.8T *
Car was overheating...top hose was Hot, Lower hose Cool as beans with Temp Gage almost pegged...Coolant was Gurgling in the Expansion Tank and running out a bit.. So we've begun the Tear down. Kinda glad it happened this way since it is my son's car, and it NEVER stays in the Driveway long enough for me to even remember what color it is... LSS, It has been plagued with the timing chain Rattle when it get hot for quite some time now.. I suspect from what I've been reading is that the plastic impeller is shot on the WP. So, New belt, Pump, Tensioner, and Timing CHAIN Actuator I have here in the box.. This was an excellent write up BTW and I have read most of the difficult tasks when it comes to reinstalling the new belt. I have the engine partially disassembled to where I need to mark the old belt, and Crank before I remove the belt... My thing is this: 

1. Having lined up all the marks, most critical is the Crank mark...I used the spark plug removal method and watched the piston push the rod I used up to TDC as I do most logically designed cars... (The S80 was nowhere near logical) 
2. Since I doing the CHAIN tensioner Also with the new Belt, I plan on Marking the Sprockets BEFORE I start to do the CHAIN Tensioner.. I don't want to get the Intake Cam out of position whatsoever... not sure if the 1.8T has any marking on the Intake Cam itself...so, unless recommended otherwise I will make my own reference marks.. 

my question is, should I remove both or just 1 of the Camshafts to change the CHAIN tensioner, THEN do the Timing Belt? Or should I do the Timing Belt 1st, THEN in the process change the CHAIN tensioner? I have a nice Write-up on doing the CHAIN tensioner but it was written in the context of NOT disturbing the timing Belt... mentioning the loosening of the Intake Cam Cam Stands in a certain order to gain enough slack in the chain to get the tensioner out... So should I go Balls out and just remove one of the Cams (preferably the Exhaust Cam since it has a dedicated mark reference) to get the CHAIN Tensioner out, Install the New one putting the Cam back in and lining the Marks....THEN do the Timing Belt last?.. Like I said, I'm not scared of work, I just want to do this most efficient way correctly. I've never had a mishap working on Engines that was in ERROR on my part...it was always a mechanical failure or using cheap @$$ed parts... So Hit me with Reality Experts! Thanks..sorry to be so wordy but It's the most thorough way I can explain it.. 

*-=BM=-*


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## Billburt (May 2, 2006)

keeping this and sharing it in my DIY thread in case people don't know how to search


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## speed69 (Jun 21, 2012)

O2VW1.8T said:


> _Quote, originally posted by *Craig King* »_How much would this ordinarily cost to get done at a dealership or garage?
> 
> dealer is around 500 for labor plus parts


Dealer quoted me $1200, so i took it somewhere else who did belt and water pump for $600


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## Billburt (May 2, 2006)

speed69 said:


> Dealer quoted me $1200


sounds about right


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## 20vRocc (Mar 19, 2006)

this was very helpful, took me 5 hours total with smoke breaks.


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

Great info, my son and I are doing the belt,water pump etc on his 2005 GTI. I think we messed up the timing doing the bicycle method while putting the new belt on. I thought I had done it right (had everything lined up, flywheel mark, cam gear mark and mark on top of engine) but I cannot get the belt marks, cam mark and notch on top of the engine to line up....I now think I better take the belt off and try again. My question is, after i take the belt back off how to I get everything in time again  do I just put a wrench on the cam gear and move it till it lines up with the notch on the top of the engine.

I have no idea where the mark is on the crank .....crapola


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

To the top for some HELP....please!


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

wait, so did you test it out? Or did you just start hand cranking and the marks arent lining up? 

Mine was the same way, everything lined up when I put the belt on but once I started cranking (i went 5 cranks, 10 cranks, etc) the marks never lined up....Mecheng informed me that it was fine iirc...so I started it and it all works :/


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

*Timing belt screw up*

The cam gear and fly wheel mark (TDC) don't match up when I turn the crank... should I turn it more? 

As far as I've read, It sounds like my engine is off time.

Or...is it possible to align the cam and the flywheel, and then adjust the crank appropriately to match the marks on the belt?


In short, is it possible to put your engine back in time? DIY style

Anything helps!


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

Based on my experience, and what ive learned here and from mecheng, the fly wheel mark doesnt really matter. Ill be honest, I couldnt even find my fly wheel mark. I didnt even have a crank gear mark. All I did was line up the cam gear mark, and made my own mark on the crank gear. Dont even worry about the fly wheel mark. 

I marked the belt where it meets the cam gear, as well as where it meets the crank gear mark (which I placed my self) then took it off, transferred the marks to the new belt, backed up the crank gear a bit so I could get the belt on and presto, worked out fine. I never got the marks to line up after that; it says in here (dont remember, dont want to reread everything) that a few cranks and it should line up, but mine never did. 


Now if you are asking how to get everything back in time, after the gears have been moved without the belt...you might be sol  I cant really help you there


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## zrau17 (Apr 21, 2010)

Getting the car back in time is not hard at all. There's a few little tricks to help you do so as well.

If the problem you are running into in saying the marks don't line up, are you talking about the marks you made on the belt? If so, they're not going to line up...they're not supposed to.

This is what I do. Line the cam gear mark up with the notch on the valve cover, put the lower timing cover on along with the damper pulley IN THE EXACT ORIENTATION THAT YOU TOOK IT OFF (you don't need to put all the bolts in and tighten them, just enough to have it be on there for alignment). There's two holes in the pulley aside from the four bolts holes, you can probably look at the back of it to see where the little notch on the crank gear was. Once you've done this, the little notch on the damper pulley should be lined up with the notch on the lower timing cover, at the same time the TDC mark on the flywheel should be visible. This means the head and bottom end are TDC. If you want to be sure, take the coil pack and spark plug out of cal number 1 (closest to the timing belt) and put a pretty long ratchet extension in it. It shouldn't be long before sticking it in the hole (get your laugh out) that you hit the top of the piston. That's a good thing, it's at the top of the cylinder.

Now is when you want to put the belt on. Take the damper pulley and timing cover back off first, duh. Now go ahead and (assuming the marks are still there on the belt on cam/crank gears) put the belt back on with those marks all aligned. It's okay to use the bicycle method to get the belt on, I did too. Also, if you have to rotate the crank BACK the slightest bit to get the marks on the belt/gear to align, that's fine. Just when you do so, watch the ratchet extension you stuck in there earlier to make sure it doesn't move down any. Now, once the belt gets on...you'll notice if it jumps a tooth doing so. Just take it off and start over, but if you go slowly and keep pushing the belt on pretty hard while rotating it'll go on. Once it goes on, continue to rotate the crank over via the crank bolt to get the belt on center with the rollers and water pump etc. Once you've done two full rotations you should be back at TDC. THE MARKS YOU MADE ON THE BELT WILL NOT LINE UP. That is what's important. Once you've done two full rotations, check the cam gear and valve cover marks, damper pulley and timing cover marks, and the flywheel. If they're all lined up and visible the car is in time. The marks you make on the belt are purely there for getting the belt on right.

I know that was long and maybe useless to some but I hope it helps. The marks on the belt ordeal is often misunderstood. I didn't get it either at first. If you think about it, the only way to get them to line back up is some function of how many teeth are on the belt and gears and probably won't happen for a few hundred maybe even thousand revolutions.

Also, no..you can't adjust the crank and flywheel separately, they're technically bolted to each other with the crank...turn one and you turn the other.

*Forgot this as well, but if you have to keep turning the crank and cams separately...if you feel any resistance that seems harder than normal STOP. You're pistons and valves are touching and if you crank hard enough you can bend the valves.*


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

When I was putting the new timing belt on, I turned the crank on the bottom (with a 12 point 19MM socket) and the belt slipped a few notches/teeth. This is why I believe my engine is NOW out of or off time.

I'm going to reread a couple of posts, but I think I screwed it up.

Shouldn't the flywheel mark (which I found) and cam gear mark (as per the manufacturer's designation) match up when you turn the crank?


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## zrau17 (Apr 21, 2010)

Yes, when the crank is at TDC..the flywheel mark should be at TDC. The crank mark is well, the crank mark. SO, when that is at the top...the flywheel being bolted to the crank will be too. You're dealing with circles. It doesn't matter if the crank gear is 2 inches across and the flywheel is a nine foot disc, if they're bolted together any mark you put at an equal degree on them will be at the same exact spot no matter how you do it.


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

Ok, but the cam gear and crank are not the same, or are they? 

I was under the impression that the mark on the cam gear and mark on the engine cover should line up when the mark on the flywheel comes in to view.

NOT the marks I made myself, I'm talking about the marks made by the manufacturer. Actual notches in the metal from the factory.

But..mine do not line up. The cam gear tick and mark on the engine cover do not all match up with the flywheel. This is the problem. 

Can they line up again?


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

Will the engine start with just the timing belt on, not putting anything else back together? I just want to make sure it starts first before proceeding. Thanks y'all


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

Well....I timed it wrong with the help of my 70 year old neighbor mechanic. He was down below under the car and said the crank was all lined up, I had the top (cam gear ) all lined up. Thought we would try and start it. No go, it popped like it was out of time and I heard a little ticking while I turned it over Briefly :banghead: I rechecked everything and found out my old timer helper had not lined up the crank marks properly  I took everything back off to start over....this time for sure I got the flywheel TDC, crank mark lined up with the mark on the cover and the cam gear lined up with the mark on the top of the engine. All is like its suposed to be, now. 
Tried to start it....no luck. Did I ruin my sons car?  
I feel like a dumb a$$. :screwy:


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

bump for me, the dumb a$$


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## Three3Se7en (Jul 2, 2007)

Bottom end could be 180 out. If you bent valves it would have shut itself down I'd think?


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## sailUSVI (Nov 19, 2005)

The remedy is....? 

Thanks for the suggestion 


At no time during cranking did it even try and start


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## Downeywu (Apr 27, 2005)

if you started the engine when it was out of timing, then you just caused a buncha damage.


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## Downeywu (Apr 27, 2005)

i just completed the timing belt, thanks to all the info in the posts, took about 5 hours start to finish...I ended up using the bicycle chain method to get the belt on, not gonna lie the whole entire job was a breeze...i purchased all the stuff to do the job 2 years ago, i just now finally got the confidence to do it.


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## Dakotabuds (Aug 3, 2012)

*great stuff here*

Just followed this guide step by step was able to do the timing belt and broken water pump in 11 hours:thumbup:. Water pump was so messed up, had to flush pieces of it out of the system, and it just crumbled in my hand once I got it out:banghead: I have minimal experience with mechanics, oil changes brakes, all your average maintenance. Was kinda worried about doing this one myself but thanks to this guide, it was a breeze. So I wanted to thank you for the great work and documentation. Saved me $1,300 that the local vw dealer offered to fix it:facepalm: and that was just labor. now the car is running like a clock and looking to get another good 100k miles out of it:laugh:. just passed 96k, bought it new in 2003, one of the funnest and best cars I have ever owned, I am hard as hell on my cars so Im glad I bought one that could put up with me....lord knows pontiac, chevy, ford, and mercury have not treated me well in the past. Except for that 87 S10 that thing is bullet proof, 300k miles on the sucker, just throw a quart of oil in every month and she is good.....for now.....


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## 2003.VWJ (Jul 28, 2010)

everything is lined up but lining up the flywheel are you supposed to stop when you see a hole..?? now back to my question, the idle tensioner is in and i can't get the new belt to fit around crankshaft..http://i1172.photobucket.com/albums/r564/Ohce/eea2ab1d.jpg here mine is..


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## 2003.VWJ (Jul 28, 2010)

nevermind i got it..


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## Dstiedeman (Aug 27, 2012)

Anybody know the exact bolt specs for the engine mount bolts and the engine mount bracket bolts? One of my engine mount brackets bolts was sheared in half and I want to see if I can source the bolts besides the dealer. Thanks


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

Dstiedeman said:


> Anybody know the exact bolt specs for the engine mount bolts and the engine mount bracket bolts? One of my engine mount brackets bolts was sheared in half and I want to see if I can source the bolts besides the dealer. Thanks


I'm not sure, but I would just go to the dealer. The OEM bolts work and these are critical bolts.

When you pull out the old bolt make sure the threads are all ok before you put it back in. If the threads are damaged the new bolt may work it's way loose. In this case you'll want to figure out a good game plan.


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## 2003.VWJ (Jul 28, 2010)

hello..
where is the line on the crankshaft to line up with the mark on the engie..?? would it be the white dot i have on my crankshaft from a previous owner..??


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## 2003.VWJ (Jul 28, 2010)

this is the marks on my pre-owned camshaft and is this pic of the flywheel TDC cuz errrything is back on and all i have to connect is the coolant bubble and power steering...VW Jetta 

http://i1172.photobucket.com/albums/r564/Ohce/ba1f03dc.jpg
crankshaft
http://i1172.photobucket.com/albums/r564/Ohce/347c3cf8.jpg
flywheel


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## MechEngg (Jan 13, 2009)

2003.VWJ said:


> everything is lined up but lining up the flywheel are you supposed to stop when you see a hole..?? now back to my question, the idle tensioner is in and i can't get the new belt to fit around crankshaft..http://i1172.photobucket.com/albums/r564/Ohce/eea2ab1d.jpg here mine is..


Hi,

Which pieces are you replacing? From the looks of it you are not replacing anything except for the belt. I highly recommend you start replacing more parts including the tensioner, the hydraulic piston, and the water pump to start with. 

To help get the belt back on simply unbolt the hydraulic piston and put the belt on, hold it in place and then bolt the piston back up in place. Super simple this way


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## 2003.VWJ (Jul 28, 2010)

thanks, i found that way to be ALOT EASIER today, but where is the line up marks for the crankshaft at the bottom of the motor.??


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

2003.VWJ said:


> thanks, i found that way to be ALOT EASIER today, but where is the line up marks for the crankshaft at the bottom of the motor.??


Crank pulley (harmonic dampener) mark -> crank cover dimple


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## vigilante_zen (Feb 17, 2010)

I have a auto trans 1.8t did this today and all went fairly well. How would I know if something was wrong with timing? Car is running great and drove around 5 miles or so not a single problem. Would I know right away if timing was off when I started it? That is probably a stupid comment but for some reason this car intimidates me....


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## vigilante_zen (Feb 17, 2010)

No one?


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

vigilante_zen said:


> I have a auto trans 1.8t did this today and all went fairly well. How would I know if something was wrong with timing? Car is running great and drove around 5 miles or so not a single problem. Would I know right away if timing was off when I started it? That is probably a stupid comment but for some reason this car intimidates me....


 Timing that is off by a tooth will run 'ok' but will be low on power and give poor fuel economy.

2 teeth and it'll run like junk

3 teeth and you're in danger territory


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## vigilante_zen (Feb 17, 2010)

I didnt see a reference on the crank so I mark the crank gear and belt then transferred marks to new belt and of course had the top @ timing mark.... lined up with marks on new belt to crank gear and cam mark on top... was this correct?


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## th3 cavalry (Nov 3, 2011)

Well, I have to replace only my tensioner and damper... My hydrolic thingy went out. I have the parts to do it on my AWP jetta.

WHat would be the best way to replace the tensioner and the damper? Can it be done without having to take everything apart?

My timing belt and water pump was done right before I got the car at 119k(car has 137k now, so no point in redoing the belt and everything else) and i dont beleive they changed the tensioner and damper.

Any help would be appreciated.

Both parts are brand new btw.


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

th3 cavalry said:


> Well, I have to replace only my tensioner and damper... My hydrolic thingy went out. I have the parts to do it on my AWP jetta.
> 
> WHat would be the best way to replace the tensioner and the damper? Can it be done without having to take everything apart?
> 
> ...


You have to do the entire job again..


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

sailUSVI said:


> Well....I timed it wrong with the help of my 70 year old neighbor mechanic. He was down below under the car and said the crank was all lined up, I had the top (cam gear ) all lined up. Thought we would try and start it. No go, it popped like it was out of time and I heard a little ticking while I turned it over Briefly :banghead: I rechecked everything and found out my old timer helper had not lined up the crank marks properly  I took everything back off to start over....this time for sure I got the flywheel TDC, crank mark lined up with the mark on the cover and the cam gear lined up with the mark on the top of the engine. All is like its suposed to be, now.
> Tried to start it....no luck. Did I ruin my sons car?
> I feel like a dumb a$$. :screwy:


i wanna hear how bad the damage was....

never rely on someone else. i almost always do all work myself unless i need someone to just "HOLD THIS"...


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## mtm#1 (Aug 14, 2007)

*Correct torque specs?*

So, doing the timing belt install and when I went to put the part of the engine mount that mounts to the engine I sheared a bolt. :banghead:

I have an AWD engine (AGU really since it's european) and the mount is fastened by 3x M10 bolts.

Now, according to the OP AND my factory Bentley the torque spec says that they should be torque'd down with 100NM.

So that's what I did.

I use a Gedore torque wrench ($$$) which is calibrated so I did not overtighten, and the bolts were brand new originals from the stealers.

Now, I'm not blaming anyone but after doing some research, it's just impossible to tighten these bolts to a 100NM.

M10x1.5 8.8 bolts have a max torque of ~50NM, unless they have the little "built in" flange/collar (which these do), then they can handle another 10%. Still not anywhere NEAR 100NM.

Source 1 (table is in ft. lb)

Source 2

coincidentally my Haynes says 50NM. :screwy:

Could anyone please explain this? 

Why is the Bentley wrong and Haynes right?? Do I have a weird engine??

Pretty pissed off right now, getting a sheared bolt out is a PITA :banghead: Getting a sheared bolt out in this location with VERY limited room to work is 100x worse!


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

the bolt could break due to the threads being dirty, not lubricated, cross thread, any number of reasons...

mine were a PITA to thread in....im positive there was facrtory applied loctite in the holes gumming it up

also your numbers are for 8.8 bolts...is the factory bolt 8.8???
they are stretch bolts which never have a torque number and are torqued to a certain torque then a certain amount measured in angle....

ps my motor mounts do not have 3 m10 bolts, but two on the engine and two on the chassis and a much much smaller bolt on the top


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## mtm#1 (Aug 14, 2007)

speed51133! said:


> the bolt could break due to the threads being dirty, not lubricated, cross thread, any number of reasons...
> 
> mine were a PITA to thread in....im positive there was facrtory applied loctite in the holes gumming it up
> 
> ...


Yes, my bolts from the stealer are 8.8 bolts.

According to the Bentley and the Haynes, these bolts (the one between the mount and the engine) are NOT stretch-bolts. They only have a torque spec, no angle/degree.

Well, if VW changed the setup to maybe use 2 M12's or something that would explain the discrepancy in torque. Maybe they figured out that the original design with 3 M10's and that huge ass mount was totally effin' "unmaintainable".

I practically had to lift the motor completely out of the car to remove that mount.


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## signalwarrant (Oct 18, 2012)

Tim,

In Step 20 you said you didn't have any space between the timing cover and the tensioner pulley but you never said what the fix was? I have the same problem. I put mine back together with the hose bracket between the engine and the tensioner and I still don't have any space between the pulley and the timing cover.

I thought maybe the cover was on wrong but I don't see anything wrong there, any ideas?


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## mtm#1 (Aug 14, 2007)

signalwarrant said:


> Tim,
> 
> In Step 20 you said you didn't have any space between the timing cover and the tensioner pulley but you never said what the fix was? I have the same problem. I put mine back together with the hose bracket between the engine and the tensioner and I still don't have any space between the pulley and the timing cover.
> 
> I thought maybe the cover was on wrong but I don't see anything wrong there, any ideas?


I don't have a space there either. The acc. belt lines up perfectly and the engine has been run w/o any noise or breakage. So I wouldn't worry about it too much.


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## signalwarrant (Oct 18, 2012)

mtm#1 said:


> I don't have a space there either. The acc. belt lines up perfectly and the engine has been run w/o any noise or breakage. So I wouldn't worry about it too much.


Mine just broke yesterday because it was rubbing so bad. I can't for the life of me figure out why it was fine when i took it off and i put it back on the same way and now there is no space there.


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## tjjoiner (Jul 25, 2012)

What size(s) are the motor mount bolts removed in the timing belt change?


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

tjjoiner said:


> What size(s) are the motor mount bolts removed in the timing belt change?


There are 4.
2 that are m10x1.5 that are 3.5" long
2 that are m12x1.5 that are 3" long


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## tjjoiner (Jul 25, 2012)

Can this be done without jacking up the car?


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## RodgertheRabit II (Sep 13, 2012)

Yes, Ive done it with all 4 on the floor :thumbup:


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## tjjoiner (Jul 25, 2012)

RodgertheRabit II said:


> Yes, Ive done it with all 4 on the floor :thumbup:


Great! I live on a slope, so I'll do just about anything to avoid lifting it. How'd you do it, just go in from the top and squeeze in underneath without doing anything from the wheel well?


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

tjjoiner said:


> What size(s) are the motor mount bolts removed in the timing belt change?


If you plan on replacing them with non-OEM, make sure you get high quality bolts of the correct hardness


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## tjjoiner (Jul 25, 2012)

groggory said:


> If you plan on replacing them with non-OEM, make sure you get high quality bolts of the correct hardness


I nosed around the motor mount a few weeks ago, just to see what I was dealing with, and the heads of the bolts are stamped with "10.9." That confused me a bit. Are these the stretch bolts everyone says to replace (are the stretch bolts grade 10.9?) or are these the grade 10.9 bolts that can be used in place of the stretch bolts?


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

I think I have something re this in the faq under timing belt


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## Twopnt016v (Jul 5, 2009)

tjjoiner said:


> Can this be done without jacking up the car?


I'm gonna say no. It could be possible but you would never want to attempt that on your first tb job. Removing the lower plastic piece that covers the right side of the motor and the pancake pipe would be really difficult. turning the motor over to TDC by the crank pulley will be much easier without the right wheel on. You will need to be able to get a low profiled jack and wood block under the oil pan to hold the engine up when you remove the motor mount. Like I said...it may be possible but it is 
f-cking nonsensical...


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## RodgertheRabit II (Sep 13, 2012)

haha I forgot about the whole crank part. I stand corrected:facepalm:

But if you have a wrench that'lll squeeze in between the frame rail and pulley you are all set :thumbup:


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## Gettaguy1.8t (Dec 3, 2012)

Heres my question, just bought an mk4 jetta 1.8t. I have 3k worth of shop recipts done to this.car 4 months ago. Timing was done. But my fear is that the timing belt is not tight enough. I can push it down (wheres theres free space) a little more than the thickness of the belt. And after the engine runs hot the belt becomes more loose. I cant physically pull belt off pulley, but then again I havent tried. Also itbaits to the left, but doesnt hang off.









Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2


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## iliaonabike (Apr 30, 2011)

Great DIY! First timer and took me about 9 hr over 2 days. Definitely saved me some $$$ :beer:


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## Bann (Aug 1, 2012)

Ok, I'm at the breaking point of doing this myself. Really need to get this done. Have this planned to get this done but soon but I'm afraid to wait any longer. Would anyone say this job is less difficult than swapping transmissiins? Done this twice on my Eclipse, definitely was a PITA (I know, 2 different task and cars).


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## bboy_jon (Jan 19, 2010)

This is such an easy job...seriously. Just set aside a weekend and get it done. If you start early enough, you can have it done before dinner


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## 3WheelnGTi (Jan 19, 2008)

Bann said:


> Ok, I'm at the breaking point of doing this myself. Really need to get this done. Have this planned to get this done but soon but I'm afraid to wait any longer. Would anyone say this job is less difficult than swapping transmissiins? Done this twice on my Eclipse, definitely was a PITA (I know, 2 different task and cars).


Its a pretty straight forward and an easy job. Get to it!!!


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## Bann (Aug 1, 2012)

Just brought a tb kit from dieselgeeks. I have the entire Christmas week to do it. I've done several big jobs so I will give this a shot. After reading this a few times, can't be worse than other work I've done. Hopefully it'll be warm.


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## Bann (Aug 1, 2012)

Have to give credit
Done this over the weekend, honestly it was not that difficult. Wasted most time getting the motor mount on and the thermostat. Got it done in 2 days. Could have not done it without this diy. Car runs great, no more noises coming from the belts, no more worrying. 
Kudos!!!


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## Space Christ (Dec 10, 2011)

Does anyone know if the "Ultimate Plus" kit from ECS tuning includes stretch bolts?
Thanks


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## galaxyGTI (Jan 13, 2013)

Thank you so much to this thread! It took me about 20 or so hours before I was available to do this due to the god damn engine mount!!!! :banghead:

The problem I ran into was, I couldn't install the tensioner with the engine mount pushing up against the belt and being in my way, and I couldnt get the mount in there with the tensioner installed.


*FOR THOSE OF YOU WANTING TO GET THE MOUNT IN WITH THE BELT TENSIONED, PLEASE READ BELOW!*

It took me about 3 hours to figure this out! What you do is lower the motor quite a bit to the ground, install the tensioner, roller and so on and torque it all down. Now, get the mount so the mount's LEG closest to the front of the car, is right below the water pump sprocket. Line it up as it would look normally, so level and facing the same direction, just 5-6 inches below its original spot. This is doable from the bottom.

Now, I used a tethered rope to tie it so it doesn't move, since there are no bolts you can insert at this point. Regardless, find a way to hold the mount in place, now, *JACK THE MOTOR UP REALLY REALLY HIGH! * You will want to have the motor high enough that you can clear the mount from the bay-frame where the top part of the mount bolts to. Once you clear that, you can just level it out and put it in place!

I really hope anyone having this headache can find the above post useful. I was ripping my hair out since I was stuck at this part for about 10 hours (no exaggeration)

I tried every order possible. Installing mount first, then tensioner, then roller - NOPE, I tried doing the belt last, NOPE! I don't know how anyone could get the tensioner bolted with this damn mount in the way. 

GOOD LUCK! I hope even ONE person finds this useful. I literally signed up for this forum to thank those of you giving me advice indirectly through posts, and to help one poor bastard in the future, 


PS. When installing the accessory belt tensioner right before finishing the job, I dropped a bolt INSIDE the timing belt cover, and had to remove the harmonic balancer pulley and lower timing cover to get it out. PUT A PIECE OF PAPER TOWEL IN THERE so you don't drop a bolt!!!! Wasted an hour on a stupid blunder there :facepalm:


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## All_Euro (Jul 20, 2008)

I've used this DIY twice now - thanks OP!

The first time I couldn't get the engine mount by the TB completely out but the second time it came out easily… I just jacked the engine up a little more and pulled the mount towards the firewall.

I went for IE's manual tensioner this time but didn't realize I needed the tensioner tool until it was too late. Here's what I did instead…


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

you guys do know the IC piping has to be removed to get the side mount in/out in seconds...:what:


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## All_Euro (Jul 20, 2008)

tom8thebomb said:


> you guys do know the IC piping has to be removed to get the side mount in/out in seconds...:what:


You mean as it is in my photo above?


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## \/DubMKIV (Nov 18, 2012)

so i got my parts from a VW dealer, 1st mistake they gave me the wrong pulley and tensioner, now i have to wait 4 days with my car in pieces, so i went just to double check if they gave me the right belt and they said it was, something tells me not to trust them though, so if anyone has the part number for the timing belt for a 2005 gti 1.8t AWP motor thatd be nice


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## All_Euro (Jul 20, 2008)

\/DubMKIV said:


> so i got my parts from a VW dealer, 1st mistake they gave me the wrong pulley and tensioner, now i have to wait 4 days with my car in pieces, so i went just to double check if they gave me the right belt and they said it was, something tells me not to trust them though, so if anyone has the part number for the timing belt for a 2005 gti 1.8t AWP motor thatd be nice


 A good source for part numbers is ECS's website… just type in your car and the appropriate searches will come up :thumbup:


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## \/DubMKIV (Nov 18, 2012)

thanks, they got 1/2 the parts right >.> i guess thats good enough


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## tjjoiner (Jul 25, 2012)

Instead of using a floor jack to support the engine, has anyone supported it from above with one of these: Engine Support?


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## iliaonabike (Apr 30, 2011)

tjjoiner said:


> Instead of using a floor jack to support the engine, has anyone supported it from above with one of these: Engine Support?


Are you asking because you don't have a floor jack or are you trying to find an easier solution to support the engine while changing the belt?


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## tjjoiner (Jul 25, 2012)

Both. Mostly the lack of floor jack.


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## iliaonabike (Apr 30, 2011)

tjjoiner said:


> Both. Mostly the lack of floor jack.


I think you'll get more use out of a floor jack when it comes to taking out the engine mount when changing your TB. When I first did my TB I had to lower and raise the engine up and down to try to wiggle the engine mount out of the bay. I think it will be a lot harder to do that with the engine support bar. Not saying it's not a usefull tool to have but I think you'll be better off in investing in a floor jack. If you have a Harbor Freight store around look into their jacks. This is the one I have: http://www.harborfreight.com/low-pr...rapid-pump-25-ton-heavy-duty-steel-68049.html 
One of the most useful tools you can have when working on your car. GL:beer:


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## Mattrp44 (Oct 23, 2010)

I found a pretty useful thread for a guy doing a 1.8t belt change on a beetle and as a result I got the motor mount out in like ten or fifteen minutes. Basically loosened the charge pipe, jacked the engine up high, rotated mount towards firewall and get it loose and moved down lower. Then I lowered the engine and wiggled it out from the bottom rotating the bottom towards the firewall. On another note I ordered my kit from MJM on January 9th and I just now receive the correct parts earlier today. :banghead: They first had delays, then sent me the wrong tensioner and belt, and finally fixed the problem. It was by far the worst customer service experience I've ever had. That beng said I will order from them again and I think some of their employees wanted to be helpful, but it was just ridiculous. Finally will get to finish the instal this weekend and get my 337 back on the road after a month of being on jack stands. :thumbup:


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## hotmod23 (Feb 19, 2012)

Hey I was wondering if I could use this instead of the one from ECS. Is there anything extra I would need to do a timing belt change? 

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...p-kit-dayco_10023644-p?searchTerm=timing+belt


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## duskey (Aug 19, 2012)

*Cam timing off by 5 teeth or so....????*

Ok, I started this job as my engine started running rough after the engine mount bolt broke and left my engine sitting cocked in the bay. I repaired this put it back together and started it up. I immediately heard the clicking/slapping type noise, shut off the engine. Discovered the lower engine mount bolt had fallen into the timing cover area and had basically ripped through part of the timing belt, causing the belt to slip most likely on the crank gear (my own deduction based on where I found the bolt.
I'm thinking I've got a bunch of trashed valves/guides, etc.... 
I've set the timing back to as close to normal as it will get, (see pictures, but I can’t figure out how to upload a picture).
The cam gear will not line up with the mark on the cover seems to be about 5 teeth off with the crank gear at TDC. See pictures; I've rotated the engine manually and after 2 turns the cam sprocket mark does not align with the mark on the cover; each time I turn it twice I get the same alignment, off by 5 teeth or so. I know this bad!!!
So, what should be the next step.....just go ahead and take off the head as all the valves are junk or should I remove the belt, align the cam forward to the mark, put the timing belt back on, check for proper timing and do a compression check and hope for the best? or do we know that being this far off that the head is ruined and needs to be rebuilt and examined for all the damage that may have occurred?
Is it worth attempting the adjustment of the camshaft and hoping the head/valves are not totally damaged? With all you experts out there could I get lucky and not have an issue after adjusting the cam geart forward, can i just remove the belt and turn the cam gear forward with a large socket and re-install the belt and perform the compression check? or is this not the right thing to do?
It’s worth fixing as this motor only has about 36K miles on it (2002 Jetta 1.8T). Although I know it’s been a hard 36K as I know the previous owner, that’s probably why the engine mount bracket bolt broke in the first place.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/irbfriends/8528804201/in/photostream/


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## jmtyndall (Jan 20, 2012)

I think I'm about to jump into this myself. Thanks for the write-up. I'm throwing 16725 and I replaced the sensor, still throwing the code. Car doesn't want to start the first try, usually takes a couple, sometimes takes a lot. The wires look great. Is there a way to verify the timing without tearing it all down? I want to verify before loading up the parts-shotgun.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Did you do this DIY? How did it go and any advice for someone thinking about doing it this week?

TIA.


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## jmtyndall (Jan 20, 2012)

I haven't yet. I tore it down and checked the timing. Looks to be spot on, but now I'm confused. Here's my timing: 








approximately half a tooth retarded, but pretty close to dead on. 
But here's my data log:








Timing appears to be between .5 and 1 tooth retarded.

And here's what other people's factory timing looks like:

















These appear to be half a tooth FORWARD of the valve cover mark. If the case is that my mark should be there, then I am in fact 1 tooth retarded, and hence my camshaft position implausible code. Otherwise, I'm looking for something else. The belt looks good, tension is tight, so I'm not sure what's going on here.


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## Zinc (Dec 8, 1999)

*this guy...*

Finished up my car's 2nd TB at ~173k w/ the ultimate kit from ECS. I held off on doing the thermostat for now. I did do the intake cam seal, as mine was leaking after i fuggered it up last week doing my cam chain tensioner replacement. It was easier taking off the valve cover and loosening the cap, rather then pounding it in with a makeshift seal installer that i did not possess.

I pretty much just followed the OPs DIY and had great success. I didn't bicycle chain anything, just left the water pump, tensioner, & idler loose, routed the belt about 1/4" on all the way around everything (using a cheapo spring clamp on the camshaft pulley so my mark didn't jump a tooth), then kind of slipped it on each pulley a little at a time. Once it was on, torqued everything down, and all my marks were on. I had feared that part a bit as people seemed to have a lot of trouble getting the belt on. The hardest parts for me were getting the mount out (just leave it flopping around until the tensioner comes out - the mount will fall right out after that), and then back in, but this guy...:



galaxyGTI said:


> Thank you so much to this thread! It took me about 20 or so hours before I was available to do this due to the god damn engine mount!!!! :banghead:
> 
> The problem I ran into was, I couldn't install the tensioner with the engine mount pushing up against the belt and being in my way, and I couldnt get the mount in there with the tensioner installed.
> 
> ...


...I owe this man beers.:beer::beer: This part had me the closest to throwing a temper tantrum than any other. After following those directions, it took literally 30 seconds to get the mount back in.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Thanks for the above post, gives me confidence to do this myself.

I feel like an idiot for asking, but can someone please explain to me where I find the flywheel TDC plug? I can't find it anywhere on the top of my transmission on my 2000 1.8T! Does anyone have a panned out pic they can show?

TIA.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

swimrr said:


> Thanks for the above post, gives me confidence to do this myself.
> 
> I feel like an idiot for asking, but can someone please explain to me where I find the flywheel TDC plug? I can't find it anywhere on the top of my transmission on my 2000 1.8T! Does anyone have a panned out pic they can show?
> 
> TIA.


It's at the top center of the transmission, directly under the coolant flange, right where the transmission case meets the head. It's a black plug. There are a lot of hoses and stuff right there so look closely..it's there. It's like 1 1/2" in size or so...

Honestly though...I have a hell of a time finding the mark on the timing wheel. I just use the crank mark to get it close, then I stick a wood dowel in the #1 cylinder and manually verify crank TDC.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Thanks, I'll look closer, it's probably right in front of my face. How do you tell TDC with a wooden dowel?


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Well, the wooden dowel makes sense now, it's pretty obvious. And I figured out why I couldn't find the flywheel plug - there isn't one. Now I have to deal with a stripped 6mm on the harmonic balancer. 3 were no problem, but one was chipped and rusted, so it stripped right away. I don't have the correct size extractor so I need to go and get one. Hope it fits with the 19mm 12 point next to it.


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## damnjetta (Dec 22, 2011)

I'm pretty nervous to start this... But I'm going to give it a go. Please everyone wish me luck...eace:


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

damnjetta said:


> I'm pretty nervous to start this... But I'm going to give it a go. Please everyone wish me luck...eace:


Don't do it if you're not 100% confident. Have someone who's done it before help you out along the way.

Saving a few hundred on labor can be offset by a cylinder head rebuild if you screw it up.

FYI...I've screwed this up once and bent valves by turning it over by hand. FYI


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## damnjetta (Dec 22, 2011)

groggory said:


> Don't do it if you're not 100% confident. Have someone who's done it before help you out along the way.
> 
> Saving a few hundred on labor can be offset by a cylinder head rebuild if you screw it up.
> 
> FYI...I've screwed this up once and bent valves by turning it over by hand. FYI


Yeah, I chickened out. Going to have someone do it for me.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

*Can't get harmonic balancer off*



bboy_jon said:


> ^^^ what he said. You will NEED allen keys with the socket/ratchets since they are on there pretty good. Be very careful with them and make sure you seat them all the way because they are very easy to strip. If they do, go to lowes or home depot and buy a irwin bolt extractor kit (i think it was less than $20) and it works like a charm.


I've got the bolt extractor but can't get it on the 6mm because the 19mm is too close to it. What are my options to get this pulley off? Is removing the 19mm an option without having marked the belt at this lower pully?


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

swimrr said:


> I've got the bolt extractor but can't get it on the 6mm because the 19mm is too close to it. What are my options to get this pulley off? Is removing the 19mm an option without having marked the belt at this lower pully?


snap-on impact driver is the best bet by far. yes you can take the 19mm 12 pt off after the belt tensioner is removed.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Is removing the 19mm going to make getting the timing belt back on correctly more complicated? Seems like it will b/c it won't be possible to mark the belt at the lower pulley.


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## damnjetta (Dec 22, 2011)

Whooo! Done! 3.5 hours. Running strong


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

*Stripped engine mount*

I must have completely missunderstood the torque specs for the engine mounts because I thought the 100 Nm was for connecting the two engine mounts to each other. Now my engine mount is stripped and I have to get a new one, nevermind the PITA of having to get it out again. 

Can someone please confirm for me the torque for these bolts? And do I now need more new bolts since I've already used these to strip the mount?

Please clarify the following parts for me:

Engine mount to cylinder block - 45Nm - has 3 bolts?
Engine mount to Body - 40Nm + 90 - attaches to frame?
Engine mount Bracket - 25Nm - not sure which part this is?
Engine mount to Engine Mount on Block - 100Nm - connects 2 mount pieces? This is what got stripped. 100Nm seems like a ton of torque, so I must be mis-understanding something here. 

TIA


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## tom8thebomb (Nov 28, 2002)

swimrr said:


> Engine mount to cylinder block - 45Nm - has 3 bolts?
> Engine mount to Body - 40Nm + 90 - attaches to frame?
> Engine mount Bracket - 25Nm - not sure which part this is?
> Engine mount to Engine Mount on Block - 100Nm - connects 2 mount pieces?
> ...


100% correct
You'll need a recoil kit; and two new bolts. Use a good torque wrench.
-tom


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

So you think the threads can be repaired for use at 100Nm? I'm still not sure about this 100Nm torque though, that's almost as much as a lug nut and I've already stripped the mount threads once. I also can't find that 100Nm torque anywhere in my manual. 

Do I need to get all new bolts again (all 7) since I've torqued these once?


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## Zinc (Dec 8, 1999)

Those torques are correct. 

10-11 in the Bentley. You're having some bad luck with the bolts on this job...:banghead: 

The times I've over-torqued things have been to my dumb ass not being careful with the torque wrench, mixing up Nm w/ ft-lbs, etc...


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Yeah, I think I may have beena dumb ass and not threaded these bolts correctly, thereby stripping the mount threads much earlier than100Nm.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Thanks to everyone for their help and advice on this DIY! Finished the job on the weekend and she's purring like a kitten. I did, however, throw a CEL this morning, 55 miles after completing the TB, so I need to pull the codes. Hopefully it is the intermittent O2 sensor code I've been getting on occasion. 

The idler pulley torque is 20 ft-lbs and the tensioner is 15 ft-lbs, which didn't seem like very much torque at all to hold these parts on. Any reason to tighten them a bit more than spec? 

Thanks again for all the advice!


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## padwalz (Sep 8, 2008)

Awesome DIY
Did on a Sunday afternoon without any issues


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Took me much longer, but to do it again I could do in an afternoon.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

galaxyGTI said:


> Thank you so much to this thread! It took me about 20 or so hours before I was available to do this due to the god damn engine mount!!!! :banghead:
> 
> The problem I ran into was, I couldn't install the tensioner with the engine mount pushing up against the belt and being in my way, and I couldnt get the mount in there with the tensioner installed.
> 
> ...


 I didn't try to re-install the engine mount any other way, so thank-you for this tip. I'm sure it saved me many, many hours. :beer:


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## 1.8turbolader (Jul 27, 2006)

Didn't read all 25 pages so this may be old info. Putting the new belt on is a pain. Here are my steps to make it easier. 


1. tensioner must be completely compressed. I had a small gap (business card thickness) if you're re-using a tensioner. 
2. roll crank 1 tooth clockwise. 
3. Place TB on crank, cam, tensioner pulley
4. when you pull the belt on the water pump you will receive some slack from the crank as it rolls back 1 tooth which allows you to slide the belt on the water pump pulley. 
5. double check marks. turn motor over 3 times by hand and recheck.


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## h0yitsdom (Sep 25, 2009)

I ordered the complete kit from Blauparts, will be arriving tomorrow hopefully. I am planning on purchasing a Godspeed FMIC soon and was wondering if I should wait to do it at the same time as my timing belt? 

Car has 150k miles so would rather do as much maintenance as I can all at once while I have everything apart :screwy:

also planning on doing a valve cover gasket replacement too


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## Bikerboy324 (Jan 12, 2010)

Cam upon a problem. Just finished putting everything in right and the cam gear tdc mark is lined up and so is the flywheel tdc. When i crank it, it won't turn on. Is it timing issues or something else?


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## VWLauren (Mar 23, 2003)

Bikerboy324 said:


> Cam upon a problem. Just finished putting everything in right and the cam gear tdc mark is lined up and so is the flywheel tdc. When i crank it, it won't turn on. Is it timing issues or something else?


 What do you mean it won't come on?


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## Bikerboy324 (Jan 12, 2010)

Just cranks. No spark 
I'll take pics right now of the cam gear and flywheel tdc.


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## VWLauren (Mar 23, 2003)

Bikerboy324 said:


> Just cranks. No spark
> I'll take pics right now of the cam gear and flywheel tdc.


 Did you plug everything back in?


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## Bikerboy324 (Jan 12, 2010)

Yes, Just wanted to see if my timing was off . Here are the pics.


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## VWLauren (Mar 23, 2003)

If you're not getting spark and you were before then you had to have disconnected something. I only recall disconnecting a connector near the timing belt cover. Not sure what else you might have disconnected? Timing marks look good. Just retrace your steps.


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## Bikerboy324 (Jan 12, 2010)

Thanks just needed some reassurance on that timing. :thumbup: 
I'll check everything again.


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## h0yitsdom (Sep 25, 2009)

Did my belt today :thumbup: 
everything went smoothly minus me losing my 8mm allen head before i even started :banghead: 

couple of notes from my job 

1/2" drive is necessary for the bigger bolts like engine mount 
top of power steering fluid tank will leak if you leave it sitting sideways next to the radiator :banghead: 
be prepared with rags/towels/some type of device for when you get the water pump out 
8mm allen head socket seemed neccessary, attempted to use a regular allen head and a ball-end allen head on the tensioner pulley which all resulted in a no-go 



I purchased my timing belt kit from Blauparts with the upgraded 'racing belt'. kit came with everything i needed however I wasn't able to change my thermostat  i think my cover has some issues with the bolts so i wasn't able to remove it 

Only real negative I have with the blauparts kit is the instructions they give the pictures are TERRIBLE :thumbdown: can barely tell what i'm looking at 


I used this DIY, combined with Blauparts printed DIY, and THIS DIY which has GREAT pictures and details http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?t=1961739&highlight=bluettop 




My new blue belt 









blauparts metal impeller water pump


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## -=WOLFSBURG=- (Oct 25, 2007)

I'm snagging that same kit to do mine in the next couple of weeks. Looking forward to having my car back :beer:


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## MaSeDoGG (Jan 22, 2004)

h0yitsdom said:


> I purchased my timing belt kit from Blauparts with the upgraded 'racing belt'. kit came with everything i needed
> 
> I used this DIY, combined with Blauparts printed DIY, and THIS DIY which has GREAT pictures and details http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?t=1961739&highlight=bluettop


Nice DIY link, those pictures are excellent!
I'm gonna tackle this job soon. A local VW shop quoted me $474 labor to do the job if I provided parts. I'm confident I can do it.

Any reason or benefit of the Blauparts Blue Belt??


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## Slayer (Aug 8, 2000)

My buddy and I did his jetta's belt over the weekend, and it ended up being a nightmare :banghead:

First the hood latch wasn't operating
One of the serp belt tensioner bolts pulled some threads
Crank pulley allen bolts stripped (had to weld another bolt to get one out)
He has no mark on the flywheel for tdc
The mount attached to the motor is a PITA to get to the rear bolt since there's no room on that car
Got it all back together, then realized that we had let the mount drop too far, so it was trapped below the idler, and the water pump, so we had to remove the belt, waterpump, tensioner, and start over again since we had pulled the pin already :facepalm:

It all worked out in the end, and the car runs fine, but man, what a cluster**** that was :banghead:


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## h0yitsdom (Sep 25, 2009)

MaSeDoGG said:


> Nice DIY link, those pictures are excellent!
> I'm gonna tackle this job soon. A local VW shop quoted me $474 labor to do the job if I provided parts. I'm confident I can do it.
> 
> Any reason or benefit of the Blauparts Blue Belt??


just says its a racing belt, i think it is more reinforced then the standard OEM belt, not sure if it's kevlar or not like the ECS tuning upgraded belt. 

i think it was only a $20 difference so i figured what the hell since i'm saving so much for labor


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## MaSeDoGG (Jan 22, 2004)

h0yitsdom said:


> just says its a racing belt, i think it is more reinforced then the standard OEM belt, not sure if it's kevlar or not like the ECS tuning upgraded belt.
> 
> i think it was only a $20 difference so i figured what the hell since i'm saving so much for labor


I went ahead and ordered that kit too. Good price for the race belt and coolant!!

It is indeed the Gates Racing belt (blue). It's the best one you can buy. :thumbup:

Fast shipping! They gave me a free oil filter too!


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## vw4tube (Oct 1, 2007)

Just did my gti last night all went well. 

Thanks for the post


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## GE-TE-EYe (Jul 17, 2013)

*Off a half of tooth on cam*

First amazing write up, I hope to see many more from you. 

My issue is a discrepancy in my TDC alignment. It would appear I am at TDC in my fly but not on the cam or crank.

- Is this timing position acceptable ?

- What are the steps to correct? 













Thanks! 
:bs:


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## H_C (May 4, 2007)

MaSeDoGG said:


> Nice DIY link, those pictures are excellent!
> I'm gonna tackle this job soon. A local VW shop quoted me $474 labor to do the job if I provided parts. I'm confident I can do it.
> 
> Any reason or benefit of the Blauparts Blue Belt??


$474? Not bad, where do you live?
I'm in Cali so everything is more expensive. Out of the first 5 shops I called that did German cars only 1 would use customer parts. I was quoted $1000 but mine included everything from the premium kit on ECS like the thermostat, thermostat cover, and thermostat senseor (sensor not included in the kit so the the price quote was + the part).

Unfortunetly I don't really have anywhere to do it myself nor the tools so I'll probably be stuck paying for this.


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## MaSeDoGG (Jan 22, 2004)

H_C said:


> $474? Not bad, where do you live?
> I'm in Cali so everything is more expensive. Out of the first 5 shops I called that did German cars only 1 would use customer parts. I was quoted $1000 but mine included everything from the premium kit on ECS like the thermostat, thermostat cover, and thermostat senseor (sensor not included in the kit so the the price quote was + the part).
> 
> Unfortunetly I don't really have anywhere to do it myself nor the tools so I'll probably be stuck paying for this.


I'm in Charlotte, NC. This quote is from a local VW/ Euro car tuner shop. They've done it a million times I'm sure. 
You should check the regional forums or do some research to find a local tuning shop that will do it. I'm sure there are a ton around there. 

Also, what do you mean by thermostat sensor? coolant temp sensor? or radiator therm switch? 

coolant temp sensor is like $10


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## SheldonR311 (Jul 23, 2005)

Just finished my first ever 1.8T timing belt, water pump, and thermostat thanks to this guide. Was a smashing success, polished it off in about 3 hours.


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## goldenoldies (Jul 22, 2013)

*questions on my own timing belt job, 90 Jetta*

Soon to embark on timing belt replacement, certain i will have lots of progress questions, so...hello.
im glad to see so much DIY info with photos here, been pouring over the web for details. 
my only web problem is that ive found tons of info and guides for 96 and up jettas, but not specifically a *90 NON-DIESEL JETTA.*

my initial questions are
1. for this older car, do i also need to jack engine, remove engine mounts?
2. because my belt went out while driving, and tensioner pulley snapped -spilling its bearings etc, i would assume the timing marks will be off, and would maybe need a timing gun to find TDC? 
3. not sure if this is a non interference motor, not sure if there was valve damage, but gonna give her a try anyway

I have printed a few DIY guides, including this threads initial guide. Thanks for that, b-t-dub.

ANY feedback welcome, thanks!!


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## goldenoldies (Jul 22, 2013)

*oh, and also*

What I do have as far as guides is a 77-84 Bentley. 
There is a applicable section on Camshaft Drive Belt. 
The removal/installation seems to be similar to timing belt removal. Is this the same thing?

Do I need to remove valve cover to get to fly wheel to find those notches?


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## SheldonR311 (Jul 23, 2005)

A 1990 non diesel Jetta, as long as it's an 8 valve and not a 16 valve, is a non interference motor, and the timing belt is extremely simple. But you will need a special tool to put tension on the idler pulley.


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## stockstatus (Jun 4, 2012)

Did this today it was really nice having this to reference. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk 2


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## MaSeDoGG (Jan 22, 2004)

FWIW: 

in the kit that I received from BLAUPARTS: 

the tensioner pulley bolt would NOT thread into the block. I reused the stock one. 

the thermostat they sent me was defective and leaked. Not even an issue of o-ring. I replaced it with an OEM one.


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

Has anyone else gotten owned by the engine mount bolts? Got 4 out of the 6 out but the last two are a pain. 

I sprayed with PB blaster and let it sit overnight. Using a deep well 18mm, extension and 3/8th with a pipe on the end of it.

Should I switch to a half inch ratchet? Really not looking to use an impact gun.


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

GE-TE-EYe said:


> First amazing write up, I hope to see many more from you.
> 
> My issue is a discrepancy in my TDC alignment. It would appear I am at TDC in my fly but not on the cam or crank.
> 
> ...



I'm in the middle of this process (doing it over a few days instead of one day) because i have a shiny new GLI to play with 

Just set my timing before i take my belt off just to see if I could do it properly. I couldn't get the cam gear and transmission timed perfectly at first. Took me about 5 or 6 revolutions to figure out the smallest turn of the crank made the transmission move A LOT.

Get close on the cam gear but stop before the notch on the cam and valve cover meet. Once you get here the transmission notch will just be barely visible from the timing plug hole

Then literally just tap your tool of choice attached to the crank gear. Tap once and check the transmission timing. Tap again until you are just there. It might take a few tries but you get there.


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

h0yitsdom said:


> Did my belt today :thumbup:
> everything went smoothly minus me losing my 8mm allen head before i even started :banghead:
> 
> couple of notes from my job
> ...


Thanks you just answered my question about the mount bolts.


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

So I'm at the part where I'm trying to remove the mount bracket and it's making me smash bananas like donkey kong.

I tried jacking the motor up all the way but eventually the bracket hits the metal AC lines. I tried lowering it all the way and it won't clear from the lowest part of my car. 

Once thing I noticed is the motor is very loose after the bracket is disconnected.

Has anyone tried pushing the motor towards the driver side in order to get enough space to get that PITA bracket out? This sounds like a bad idea so I have not done it yet.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

IliketoGolfIV said:


> So I'm at the part where I'm trying to remove the mount bracket and it's making me smash bananas like donkey kong.
> 
> I tried jacking the motor up all the way but eventually the bracket hits the metal AC lines. I tried lowering it all the way and it won't clear from the lowest part of my car.
> 
> ...


You have to get the motor up high enough to remove some of the bolts and low enough to remove the other bolt, then the motor mount can be finagled out.

This is much easier when you have a proper engine support bar up top instead of trying to maneuver a jack down underneath


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

groggory said:


> You have to get the motor up high enough to remove some of the bolts and low enough to remove the other bolt, then the motor mount can be finagled out.
> 
> This is much easier when you have a proper engine support bar up top instead of trying to maneuver a jack down underneath


Thank you sir 

I actually did get the 3 bolts out of the bracket by moving the motor up and down. No problem there. I'm getting owned by finagling the bracket out. I did re read a lot of the thread and some guys removed the transmission mounts to get more space to play with getting the bracket out.

I'll try this. But man, getting the at hex bolt on the idler pulley with the bracket in the way is a total pain. This is so much easier on a Honda lol.


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## glücklich (Sep 4, 2013)

Is the timing belt job on the 1.8t 20v same as on a 1.8 8v mk2 ? just more things to take off to get the job done ?

and say you do not have the engine in time from messing up on installing the new timing belt and you try to start the car will this do damage to your engine ?


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

Ok took a few days off from the nasty heat in PA. I'm done with the timing belt and used the bicylcle chain method to get the belt on. Piece of cake. However, I'm now 2 teeth off on the cam gear when the transmission is aligned. Any idea other than I may have let the camshaft gear move when doing the bike chain method to get the belt on? Should I keep rotating by hand or am I screwed??


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

My advice would be to take the belt off, align everything up, and try again. 2 teeth is too much from what I've learned on the forum.

It took me a while to get the belt on with everything aligned, you have to be patient and don't rush it. It is too important and you need to get it right.


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

Yea I thought about doing that but I already pulled the pin on the tensioner. I think I will regroup today and just look at it again tomorrow. If anyone has been fine with 2 teeth off please let me know


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

I too had pulled the pin, so I had to take the tensioner off again and use a c-clamp (or vise) to slowly compress the piston to get the pin back in. It took some time but was worth the peace of mind to get it right.


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

Thanks so much for that advice. I'll give it a shot on my old tensioner tomorrow to see if it sticks. Question for you or anyone else who can answer. To properly align the transmission timing with the cam do I simply rotate the crank gear until my marks match? I want to do this right. Saw pictures of valves 2 teeth off and I'm definitely doing it over.


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## treinei (Feb 2, 2011)

just did mine yesterday worked great step by step thanks a lot youre the man!:thumbup::beer:


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## diamono (Apr 26, 2008)

*Timing Off One Tooth*

Car is 03' Jetta. Car has had the 17748 - Camshaft postion sensor (g40) / Engine speed sensor (g28) coming on since purchased a few months ago. The previous owner did recently replace the timing belt. The code always comes back after clearing. Watching the measuring blocks with vag-com, I can see the the crank angle sensor is constantly bouncing around at idle. Bought a couple of cheap G40 and G28 sensors off of eBay to see if it would solve the problem - and it didn't. Checking the timing today, it appears that I am off one tooth, needing to come clockwise. I checked using the cam sprocket mark and a marked shaft (to check depth) in the #1 spark plug to check for physical TDC. I also tried using the mark on the flywheel with 09A transmission, but not too sure about the markings.

Read the whole DIY, but didn't see an example of adjusting the belt one tooth without taking everything apart. Of course, with 26 pages, I may have missed it. Is there some way of levering the tensioner pulley enough to allow me to spin the camshaft sprocket one tooth? Just wanted to ask before I make the attempt.


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## MaSeDoGG (Jan 22, 2004)

diamono said:


> Car is 03' Jetta. Car has had the 17748 - Camshaft postion sensor (g40) / Engine speed sensor (g28) coming on since purchased a few months ago. The previous owner did recently replace the timing belt. The code always comes back after clearing. Watching the measuring blocks with vag-com, I can see the the crank angle sensor is constantly bouncing around at idle. Bought a couple of cheap G40 and G28 sensors off of eBay to see if it would solve the problem - and it didn't. Checking the timing today, it appears that I am off one tooth, needing to come clockwise. I checked using the cam sprocket mark and a marked shaft (to check depth) in the #1 spark plug to check for physical TDC. I also tried using the mark on the flywheel with 09A transmission, but not too sure about the markings.
> 
> Read the whole DIY, but didn't see an example of adjusting the belt one tooth without taking everything apart. Of course, with 26 pages, I may have missed it. Is there some way of levering the tensioner pulley enough to allow me to spin the camshaft sprocket one tooth? Just wanted to ask before I make the attempt.


You have to take the belt off and put it back on correctly. That means pretty much doing the job over...


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## IliketoGolfIV (Feb 8, 2010)

Forgot to post an update. Took my belt off and redid everything. Luckily I kept that pin you pull from the tensioner and wound it back using a C clamp like swimrr kindly suggested. Keeping the pin around is a good idea. 

I was only 2 teeth off so I wound the crank back a little until my timing marks on the cam and transmission slightly mismatched. Then put the belt on using bike chain method. Put it all back together and she's purring like a kitten. 

This wasn't hard as much as it was just a PITA. At 240K miles I may pay someone to do it for me but glad I tackled it. Very satisfying.


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## liquidvw (Mar 20, 2003)

Thanks OP. Did the job this weekend and all went well. Was a little worried as when I tried to slip the belt on to the water pump, I felt the crank turn. Removed the belt, reset the crank, and tried again. I crossed my fingers the first time I started it. :beer::thumbup:

Got my parts from ECS. Perfect. Thanks ECS!!!:thumbup:

I still dont understand nor did I do this step.

Step #4

Remover the sound dampening shield behind the lower IC pipe by prying each one of those little tabs back with a flat head screwdriver then pull straight done. OR get violent and just pull down super hard.

Finally if I have to find fault with something, the torque specs should be in foot lbs. We live in America. NM wasn't much help with my American made torque wrench.


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## vdubluvinn (Jul 15, 2011)

liking this thread.


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## scousa (Aug 16, 2007)

liquidvw said:


> Finally if I have to find fault with something, the torque specs should be in foot lbs. We live in America. NM wasn't much help with my American made torque wrench.


Mine too - ha.

For anyone else out there with a ft-lb only - just use the 3/4 method.

It's actually: Newton Meters x .73756 = Foot Pounds, but 3/4 is close enough for me.

The number of beers I owe people on Vortex is growing.


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## Salad Fingers (Jul 9, 2011)

Thanks for the write up :thumbup:

I have a question though. How much tolerance is there between the difference in the crank shaft TDC mark on the flywheel and the TDC mark on the camshaft? The reason I ask is that with both set bang on the marks, if I go a combustion cycle and come back to cam TDC, the crank tdc will be a little off on the flywheel, but not much at all on the crank pulley mark. So if I turn back a little to align the flywheel TDC, I can get it aligned before the cam moves at all. There is no slack to take up on the 'tight' side, the belt is on nice and tight over the cam, water pump and crank pulleys. The difference isn't even a tooth difference, as if I were to take the crank pulley TDC mark as gospel, then it'd be bang on every time. It's perhaps that the flywheel is a lot larger, that there's some 'drive' to take up before anything else moves?

I note however, that the crank pulley TDC mark isn't all that accurate as when you fit the pulley, there's a bit of movement either way before the bolts are tightened up, but not to the difference of a tooth out. Even if I were to move a tooth advance or retard, basically the same difference of take up would still occur, just in a different place.

Does this sound normal at all? Thanks.

Edit: I should add, this is an aftermarket flywheel I fitted when changing the clutch. Some research suggests that TDC marks on aftermarket flywheels aren't always in the same place as an OE flywheel. TDC marks on harmonic balancer always line up with camshaft TDC marks, so maybe all's well? I'll see if I can get a DTI gauge on or use a dowel to check the piston is as far up as it goes.


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## Kiyokix (Dec 16, 2005)

Thanks for a well done write up. :beer:

If it wasn't for the 34 degree 15mph windy weather when I started (24 when I finished) I'd finish in 2hrs no prob, it's an easy job to do. 

Kei


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## T.biii (Jan 12, 2014)

Olllldddd thread but I'll tell you, I jut did my timing belt with and because of this thread. Saved me! I would recommend telling people that you turn the crank until the cam AND crank are at tdc. I had to figure that out. Obviously I don't know much about cars. But someone else might not either. Perfect DIY!


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## Kjukk21 (Feb 27, 2014)

*Finished?*

So after your done how do you time everything?


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## T.biii (Jan 12, 2014)

There's a mark on the head and on the cam shaft. You line those up. And the flywheel has timing marks as we'll and to get those put the 19mm-12 spline socket on the crank and turn it. There are timing marks on the harmonic balancer and the gaurd. Mark them with something so you can see them good.


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## T.biii (Jan 12, 2014)




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## vag again (Jun 22, 2010)

thanks a lot! awesome thread
and so helpfull, It takes more or less 6 hrs to finish all job succesfull!eace:eace:eace:

greetings from Mexico!


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## XClayX (Apr 30, 2005)

Finished swapping out the timing belt this weekend... Went ok, took a while. Taking out the engine side engine mount is hell. :thumbup::thumbup: DYI


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## T.biii (Jan 12, 2014)

Haha I left it in there!


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## ^GaMbi (Oct 9, 2013)

Awesome guide! I started 3pm and stopped around 10.. loads of breaks, weekend and all 

But I Need some help, as soon as possible!
Im kinda stuck at the T-Belt tension pulley.. how fare do you have to drive the nut? (I wish I had one of these craftsman ratcheting wrench)
Im scared to tighten it any further, but I still havent felt the hole? how many turns do you think I should give it?
I hope I havent overtightened it 

Any help on this is much appreciated !
...
Doh, I just remembered that I left the engine on "jacks" (2 tires) with a "less than reliable" jack.. better go fix it.

*Edit
Oh yea.. I also noticed that my crankshaft was one or two teeth off :S has it jumped or should I set my new belt the same way? :S
Will post pic tomorrow.

*Edit2 
nvm.. when I lined up the flywheel mark, the two others lined up fairly good (no teeth off)
also found out what to do with the tensioner


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## JettaBuff (Oct 25, 2003)

Stumbled on this video of the TB job done in Full Metal Jacket drill sergeant style


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

*FS: 1.8T Timing Belt Damper*

I have a brand new timing belt damper for a 1.8T. I'm not sure the exact engine configuration because ECS sent me the wrong one, there are several different ones with the same manufacturer part # 06B 109 477A. The one I have is this one by NTN with the flat release pin - http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/06b109477a/ES1306806/. The one I needed for my 2000 1.8T GLS car had the smaller release pin. Someone responded to my FS thread that this is for a B5.5 Passat (late 01 to 05), but I can't confirm that myself.

Asking $40 including shipping.


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## LeoA86 (Jun 3, 2014)

JUST DID MY TIMING BELT CHANGE THIS PAST FRIDAY ALONG WITH MY VALVE COVER GASKET AND CHAIN TENSIONER GASKET(FLAT SEAL AND HALF MOOMN SEAL). DID BOTH OF THEM IN JUST ABOUT 5-6 HRS TOTAL. BOUGHT THE KIT FROM DIESLE GEEKS. GOT TO SAY THEY HAVE THE BEST OEM QUALITY PARTS IN THE MARKET. EVERYTHING I REPLACED THAT I TOOK OFF WAS IDENTICAL REPLACEMENT FROM DIESLE GEEKS. CAR RUNS SMOOTHER AND WARMS UP FASTER! :laugh::thumbup:


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## zero (Aug 7, 2001)

I used this write up to change out my timing belt this past weekend as well, using the Urotuning kit that was on sale a couple months ago. I got to say it there were very few times I had to go to the manual, this is an excellent walkthrough. It probably took a leisurely 8 hours to complete. The only trouble I had was getting the new tensioner on due to the engine mount getting in my way, but I was able to knock it into position with a couple hammer taps.

I also did my thermostat at the same time, and I lost brake assist after I completed this. Turns out the vacuum line the booster is disintegrating and I dislodged it while getting to the cap on the transmission. So I have that to look forward to now.


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## stellaroh3 (Mar 15, 2010)

*Cannot get the Tensioner Idler Pulley off to replace with new one*

I managed to remove everything else - the timing belt, tensioner, even replaced the water pump but I cannot turn the bolt on the Tensioner Pulley! I'm a strong guy and this thing does not budge, has anyone ever run into this issue before? Do you know what I would need to do to get this beast out?


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

swimrr said:


> I have a brand new timing belt damper for a 1.8T. I'm not sure the exact engine configuration because ECS sent me the wrong one, there are several different ones with the same manufacturer part # 06B 109 477A. The one I have is this one by NTN with the flat release pin - http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/06b109477a/ES1306806/. The one I needed for my 2000 1.8T GLS car had the smaller release pin. Someone responded to my FS thread that this is for a B5.5 Passat (late 01 to 05), but I can't confirm that myself.
> 
> Asking $40 including shipping.


Still have this sitting around. How about $20? Anyone....anyone....Bueller?


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## scousa (Aug 16, 2007)

*A year later and the tensioner is shot*

Anyone having issues - MTC brand hydraulic tensioner is shot after 11 months and not many miles. So im going to replace it and the belt since it has been bouncing in and out of tension. But has anyone else had issues with parts giving out.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

swimrr said:


> I have a brand new timing belt damper for a 1.8T. I'm not sure the exact engine configuration because ECS sent me the wrong one, there are several different ones with the same manufacturer part # 06B 109 477A. The one I have is this one by NTN with the flat release pin - http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/06b109477a/ES1306806/. The one I needed for my 2000 1.8T GLS car had the smaller release pin. Someone responded to my FS thread that this is for a B5.5 Passat (late 01 to 05), but I can't confirm that myself.



Okay....I just don't want to throw this in the garbage now....just pay shipping and it's yours!


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## T.biii (Jan 12, 2014)

Wonder I it would fit my audi tt


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## valet (Apr 21, 2002)

trying to resurrect a 1.8t (180hp) tt that I just picked up. Previous owner swapped in a low mileage engine (AWP to AWP) and did the timing belt. He couldn't get it to run. When I try and start the car, I can just hear (what I think is the starter - whir). I set the bottom end to TDC and noticed that the cams never line up (multiple rotations of the crank). cam timing with bottom end at tdc (as confirmed by piston at highest point) I get exhaust cam at 11:00 and intake at about 7:00. When I try and time the car off of the cams, (exhaust is 1:00 and intake is 11:00) bottom end has piston 1 at downstroke. I cannot feel any resistance while turning other than from compression stroke - so I hope valves are still good.

Do you think that my cam timing is off (and by extension so is the wheel for the cam position sensor) and that is why the car isn't starting? I have at least some spark as confirmed by holding coil with plug to valve cover and seeing spark upon crank of key, and I can smell gas (I have at least fuel and spark). I think that my timing (most likely electrical) is off 

thoughts? Thanks


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## T.biii (Jan 12, 2014)

Timimg can be a little tricky with these. There are marks that should both line up on the tranny (undercover) and cam. Other than that if vagcom it.

I have the same car resurrecting mine as well. It was bad!


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## valet (Apr 21, 2002)

T.biii said:


> Timimg can be a little tricky with these. There are marks that should both line up on the tranny (undercover) and cam. Other than that if vagcom it.
> 
> I have the same car resurrecting mine as well. It was bad!


got timing dead on (cam and crank (I never mess with flywheel timing if I didn't personally install f/w and clutch)). Car is sitting outside so no garage for it (and we've been having crazy rain out here) - so not much opportunity to work on it. Hoping to try and start her on tuesday


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## EricB8 (Feb 24, 2014)

Thank you so much for the write up!!! was enough info to get it done! Took me and my 16yr old 4.5 hours to replace the water pump and timing belt on his 2003 Golf GTI. I had him wrenching while I told him what to do and handed him tools. I helped of course when it required 2 sets of hands.

Our only concern (and it has come up many times in this thread)... the cam timing mark seemed half a tooth off. the mark on the cam pulley was an eighth inch or so to the left of the mark on the engine with the flywheel spot on, but it was the closest we could do. Put the belt on twice using the bicycle technique and could not get it closer to lining up. We put it all back together and it runs perfect. motor mount was not really an issue (did not remove it completely, but let it flop around), and we decided to totally remove both the coolant tank and the power steering reservoir to make more room. 

on a side note, and this is HUGE for us... his car always had a loud tick at idle (like it needed new lifters), and a loud rattle when driving at low RPM (like a heat shield was loose and rattling) ... the timing belt tension actuator was weak. I could move it with my fingers. The new actuator totally eliminated both noises and the engine sounds GREAT!!! Woohoo!!


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## T.biii (Jan 12, 2014)

Damn that sucks... I know how you feel though. Nothing but rain everywhere!


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## valet (Apr 21, 2002)

valet said:


> got timing dead on (cam and crank (I never mess with flywheel timing if I didn't personally install f/w and clutch)). Car is sitting outside so no garage for it (and we've been having crazy rain out here) - so not much opportunity to work on it. Hoping to try and start her on tuesday


car runs and drives and doesn't appear to have suffered much from previous owner's mistake on the timing. However, engine sounds like a printing press when I run it (pretty consistent clicking noise). Also sometimes when driving, the car hesitates a bit when getting close to 3xxx rpm - almost as if I missed a shift (didn't) - then the car sounds like it has a large blow-off valve, and she continues on her merry little way. I can avoid this if I shift up before 3k, but who wants to do that!!?


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## drscott (Jun 13, 2015)

*Great instructions !*

I wanted to add a problem I had in installing the tensioner from Auto parts whse. I needed to grind the lower bolt flange down a little to be able to slide the plate behind the crankshaft cover for the insertion of the bolt. The bolt holes would not line up. MFG part # was REPV319802 timing belt kit. Additionally, I have everything in place accept the motor mount upper and lower parts. Can these be fitted in after the timing belt is in place. Can the engine be lowered enough to fit the lower motor mount in place after the belt is on. What is life of the rear oil crankshaft seal and the camshaft seals? I have 109,000 on my 2000 Turbo GTI. Do you just wait until it starts leaking to change them? Thanks, Donald


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## Cader57 (Feb 14, 2008)

Going to bring this back from the dead. But Thank you so much for this DIY. My buddy and I cranked it out today. Overall, took about 8 hours but that included about 3 hours for beer, bs, daughter dropoff, and more beer. But everything went together great. Car is sitting on all fours, just need some more coolant as she is a thirsty girl now that shes empty. But other than that. 100% complete! 



galaxyGTI said:


> Thank you so much to this thread! It took me about 20 or so hours before I was available to do this due to the god damn engine mount!!!! :banghead:
> 
> The problem I ran into was, I couldn't install the tensioner with the engine mount pushing up against the belt and being in my way, and I couldnt get the mount in there with the tensioner installed.
> 
> ...


Can't post without thanking you for this man. I hope you see this, because you saved our asses today. All day the mount sat in the car and we just moved it where we needed it with no issues, then during a beer break the thing just falls out of the car on its own with no one near it! Two hours we fought it until I popped on and thank god, found your post. Got it back in with your tip and a little persuasion from a 2x4 in about 20 minutes. Thanks again man!


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## kg_jettaIV (Oct 31, 2007)

I'm hopefully going to be replacing the timing belt, water pump, thermostat and alternator on my MKIV Jetta this weekend. I thought I recalled something about removing the passenger side fender to give easier access. Is that right or am I completely mis-remembering from years ago?

Also it hasn't been running smoothly lately and feels like it is surging periodically when stopped/idling. Is there a possibility the timing is off (belt skipped) and I should be using the TDC marks or should I just rely on them as much as a reference and use the marks on the old belt?


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

kg_jettaIV said:


> I'm hopefully going to be replacing the timing belt, water pump, thermostat and alternator on my MKIV Jetta this weekend. I thought I recalled something about removing the passenger side fender to give easier access. Is that right or am I completely mis-remembering from years ago?
> 
> Also it hasn't been running smoothly lately and feels like it is surging periodically when stopped/idling. Is there a possibility the timing is off (belt skipped) and I should be using the TDC marks or should I just rely on them as much as a reference and use the marks on the old belt?


Don't pull the fender.

Don't worry about the old belt marks. Just line it up fresh. That's a sure fire way to get it right.

Mark it if you want just to give you some piece of mind.


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## kg_jettaIV (Oct 31, 2007)

Thanks, took another look last night after I got home and it didn't really look like pulling the fender would do me much good. I'm guessing my brain was just remembering pulling the fender liner as one of the steps and over the years warped that into the fender. I'll mark the old belt as a reference but I'll focus on the TDC marks.


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## looshin (Dec 8, 2010)

First Post!:beer:

Great DIY! 

Recently bought an 04 Jetta 1.8T that was overdue for a new timing belt (99k miles-11 years). Job took about 6 hours (not including tstat), biggest pain was fitting the torque wrench for all the bolts. Also did the tstat - what a PITA getting that alternator back on was :banghead: finally realized I had the anti-seize nearby to ease the fitting.

Started the car up. Runs great. Put 50 miles on the new belt so far. The one issue I am noticing is a ticking noise coming from under the valve cover while idling...I convinced myself that it was probably there before but also trying to figure it out. Thinking might be the cam chain tensioner.... 

Anyone have any ideas what it could be?

Belt is on time, no engine codes, and runs great so I doubt I messed up the valves.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

looshin said:


> First Post!:beer:
> 
> Great DIY!
> 
> ...


It's probably all in your head. The injectors are loud, as is valvetrain noise. Put some Lucas Synthetic Oil stabilizer in there and see if that quiets down the valve assembly.


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## looshin (Dec 8, 2010)

groggory said:


> It's probably all in your head. The injectors are loud, as is valvetrain noise. Put some Lucas Synthetic Oil stabilizer in there and see if that quiets down the valve assembly.


I just changed the oil this past weekend, but will keep that in mind for the next oil change. Thanks!


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## kunkernator (Feb 7, 2016)

Bringing this thread back again.

My timing belt tensioner pulley sheared off at the bolt. Fast forward a bit, I have the cylinder head rebuilt, everything cleaned up, and ready for reinstall.

One thing I cannot figure out, or rather, just want to double check.

The old pulley that was just floating in the cover, also had this washer near it. My new timing belt kit had a similar washer with it. Does it belong between the tensioner pulley and the cylinder head?

Pics are below, if it allows a new member to post them.


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## GLIck (Jul 24, 2005)

Just my two cents on the issue. 

Did this last week. Took me a while to get the gumption to do it, since it's way out of my wheel house. I used this thread, Bentley's, and Haynes to check and double check during the process. Surprisingly, now that it's done, this was pretty easy and I would definitely do again. I'm comparing to replacing bushings on the rear axle, which was not fun at all.

Anywho, a couple of notes.

1) The 5x55 screw to compress the tensioner needs a little foresight. Don't wait until the last minute to get like I did. 
First, anything above 50mm in my area for a hex head bolt is special order, if it exists at all. I had to get a Phillips head screw, which was not easy threading into the tensioner because the screw kept falling off the screwdriver. A hex head would have been much easier.
Second, 55mm was not nearly long enough for me. I ended up going with 5x70. This accommodated the gap to be compressed, which was almost 60mm, and the extra washers needed to span the "forks" of the tensioner.

2) I struggled quite a bit with putting the belt on and keeping everything TDC. I was much too scared at first to budge anything off TDC, so tried to muscle it on. All that will get you is bloody finger tips. I ended up finding this video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfDoRbLwMqw&list=LLsK5ezUoWU_pB_RY86HNdRg , which was immensely helpful in calming my nerves and making the process quite easy. It makes perfect sense, but I was so absorbed in following directions to a T. None of my other resources quite described how to get the belt on.

I looped the bottom belt around the crankshaft, lined up the marks, and held it in place with a socket bit. Then looped around the water pump to the camshaft as tight as possible. Then backed the crankshaft slightly to line up the mark on the camshaft. Once aligned, I finished the belt route and then pulled the crankshaft back to TDC. Everything lined up and all the slack was at the tensioner, where it needed to be.

3) I was unable to get the side engine mount out before the tensioner and idler. But that did not present any other problem. It came out afterwards. I'm not sure if having the alternator/throttle body off made a difference. I happened to have those off because I was originally after the thermostat for the resolution to my problem.

4) No mention was made of replacing bolts, except in Bentley's for two of the engine mount bolts (from mount to body). I got them all anyway (engine mount bolts only): it was quite expensive. I asked a tech while at VW about the hardware; they remarked that they never replace any of the bolts when doing this job, so you may be able to save the money on this.

5) Of concern is that, even after flushing and searching with a scope, I never found any of the broken fins of the water impeller. I will be so glad to happen upon the inopportune time that this issue manifests in an obstructive way. I'm sure it will be fun. Thanks VW. I went through two plastic impellers in 125K. Nothing but metal impellers from here on out. I preferred the Graf model since the impeller was all one piece. The Hepu impeller seemed to be two pieces and I felt that the cap would eventually break off the same as my plastic one did.


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## Kp5609 (May 14, 2013)

*Stupid Timing Question*

Just wanted to confirm that i actually have the car in TDC, i know the Cam and crank are.... but the timing on the flywheel is tough to see because all the debris. Im 99% sure its timed properly, but i could be wrong... my first time lol. But just wanted to make sure this wasn't like a faux mark lol. Yes, i know i need to clean it up down there, just removed the splash guard, pancake pipe and pinned the serpentine tensioner. Will hopefully finish this all up tomorrow problem free. Will be doing new transmission and engine mounts as well. Shocked to find out, shops don't use new tty (Torque to yield) bolts. This will be getting the IE Manual Tensioner!  

Cam:


Crank:


Flywheel: (That little rust thats more orange, is that the timing mark? lol)


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## JettaBuff (Oct 25, 2003)

If those pics were taken with the original working TB then that flywheel mark would "have" to be correct. Brake Cleaner and wire-brush it to highlight the notch.


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## Kp5609 (May 14, 2013)

JettaBuff said:


> If those pics were taken with the original working TB then that flywheel mark would "have" to be correct. Brake Cleaner and wire-brush it to highlight the notch.


So i did try that, it seemed not to help so much because there really is a lot of debris down there. Honestly too busy with this being my final year in school, and i hate myself for not cleaning it all up but this car I'm keeping forever (Fingers crossed it does not get totaled). if something goes majorly wrong where i have to pull part of the motor, i plan on pulled the whole motor out, tear down block and tranny, rebuild motor for a Daily 350/400 WHP to possibly go up to 600 or whatever with the change of a tune and turbo lol, but thats not until far far far away. For a build like that, id do the whole 9 yards, dip the block cleaned, stripped and then painted etc.. while i clean the bay and everything. ANYWHO.... got the belt on and everything with ALOT of frustration, but its on, now there is a VERY slight high frequency vibration about 3k rpm, have not yet redlined, in fear of **** going wrong lol but i want the belt to get some heat cycles and wear in. No using the manual tensioner, i think i put the belt on EVER SO tight, to check tension, its a general consensus that the belt must turn a FULL 90 each way. and it may seem loose but it is not, well my belt turn like 80 degrees lol and is clearly tensioned, but a matter like this is all by "feel" so to say. Maybe my motor mount is mis,aligned ever so slightly, maybe I'm super paranoid and its all in my head lol not sure but when i get at least 1k miles, i will re check the tension etc. but for now, i gotta rack up the miles! Next time, i will gladly pay the dealer 1k to do this job lol. Gladly!


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## wrenchtosser (Oct 25, 2010)

1.8t solid tensioner

Sent from my Commodore 64 using Tapatalk


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## CWorthington (Sep 2, 2009)

Bump for awesome DIY
Note, I used tiny pair of vice grips to Gently keep belt from moving on the cam gear while working down below. Worked perfectly. Getting that tensioner to line up was the hardest part, but not that hard. 
Thanks for the write up!


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## Neeper1.8t (Jun 23, 2017)

I'm an intermediate wrencher new to VW (and Vortex)...plan on giving this a go on my Jetta Wolfsburg on my day off, ONLY W/ this great DIY. It would be awesome if I could see ANY of the pics tho!So far I've looked on the last few pages and seen that some of the pics/videos were available...any help? Thanks in adv.!

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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## g2091 (Jun 14, 2013)

+1 on the pics. I will be doing my TB for the first time next week and it would be great to see the pics from the first post.


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## Neeper1.8t (Jun 23, 2017)

So I'm right in the middle of doing mine...again 1st timer on timing/pump, VW, And even a Euro for that matter! So I been going back and forth between this great DIY and this one with 60+ GREAT pics, http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?t=1961739&highlight=bluettop .Good luck, mine SHOULD have been done already but I keep doing cosmetics to it en route (then going to work, sleep, etc..)

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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## austinhealey (Mar 10, 2010)

Thanks again for this writeup. 

I do suggest though that putting a mark on the cam pulley to mark it at TDC as well as the crankshaft pulley, that way you are certain they have not moved once you get the new belt on, since getting it on isn't the easiest thing to do, but then you know nothing has moved. The cam pulley obviously has its own mark but the crankshaft doesn't, and I couldn't ever see my TDC mark through the window due to debris.

Only thing that I had an issue w/ was the hand cranking after installing the belt and tensioner. I mistakenly was thinking that the marks on the belt (not the pulleys) would automagically align again, but as I've read and studied the math that happens only after some mathematical formula of turns has been reached, which is far more than you would ever want to hand crank. It would be helpful to state in the instructions "Hand crank at least two full revolutions to check that the engine is not interfering. Your marks on the belts will not align again; only those that mark TDC on the pulleys will." So when you see your alignment marks on the belt totally not match up after a few hand cranks, that's ok. They won't. Only the marks of TDC should match, which is why having TDC marks top and bottom is very helpful.

I did also remove the coil connection prior to starting to just turn it over to be absolutely sure. 

Beer tastes sweeter after a timing belt change, that's for sure.


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## Wiytboi (Jun 14, 2020)

Tim_1.8T said:


> If you're talking about the 19mm twelve point it is required because thats what it is to turn the engine over. The DIY i used said he used a 21mm socket i quote him " i don't know if this is the right tool" but he said it worked fine for him. Here is a pic off Audiworld of the crank, you can see its a 12 point.
> [/IMG]


When you get to the bigger size metric.. a 21mm 6 point fits a 19mm 12point..


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## mouldybagel (Jun 3, 2019)

Nice thanks


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