# Going through too much meth !!!!



## Sam C (Sep 9, 2002)

I recently installed a water meth kit from Lebonte:
http://www.labontemotorsports.com/store/ccp0-prodshow/ISG-25.html

This is a progressive controller and I'm injecting at about the middle of the hose feeding the intake ... throttle body. 

The kit came with a DO7 nozzle and it runs off the MAF.

The Car is a 2004 1.8T Jetta GLI running APR tuned ECU with 91, 93, and 100 octane options.

There are no other mods other than a 3" down pipe sans CAT. 

I have set my onset spray to come on at 2.8V and full pump at 4.6V.

The problem is I am going through a lot of fluid. I just gulped down 3 liters of -40 washer fluid in 20 minutes of spirited driving. The car also boggs when I take extended pulls in 6th gear, sometimes it even misfires. 

Take a look: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2bYkJk1lMM

Is this too much spray? Does the pattern look good? Should I drop to a DO5 Nozzle or adjust the onset and full open voltages even further?

Thanks


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## BLSport (Dec 24, 2005)

The DO7 nozzle seems a bit big for your application, and your results would appear to support this.

Additionally, what is the water/meth ratio of your fluid? If it's a bit more water than meth, this will exaggerate the quenching effect to some degree.

Here's a chart that should help you find a good nozzle size as a starting point, and you can tweak it from there.


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## Sam C (Sep 9, 2002)

BLSport said:


> The DO7 nozzle seems a bit big for your application, and your results would appear to support this.
> 
> Additionally, what is the water/meth ratio of your fluid? If it's a bit more water than meth, this will exaggerate the quenching effect to some degree.
> 
> Here's a chart that should help you find a good nozzle size as a starting point, and you can tweak it from there.




Thanks for posting the chart. I did look at it before but wasn't sure what the M3 nozzle's flow rate is. Is it closer to a DO3? If I pull back the onset I do not get bogging but I am going through a lot of water/meth. Will dropping it down to a DO5 be enough? Or should I go lower?

I am running 100 octane program with 93 gas so I don't want to error on not having enough there when the timing is advanced.

Worse, Lebonte does not seem to be responding to emails to clarify.


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## BLSport (Dec 24, 2005)

The number reference in those nozzle ID numbers (e.g., the "7" in DO7 and M7), corresponds to the nozzle's flow rate in gallons/hour at 100 psi injection pressure. The nozzles will flow more or less than advertised, depending on your actual injection pressure, and the manifold pressure into which you are injecting.

I'd run some timing-pull data logs on the 93 octane program with 93 octane fuel in the tank and the water/meth system turned off, as a baseline to see if you're pulling any timing. From there, I'd start with the recommended nozzle based on the chart, turn on the water/meth system, and tune as required to eliminate timing-pull, if any, on the 93 octane program.

If it took very little or no water/meth injection on-time to eliminate timing-pull with this nozzle on the 93 octane program, then it will likely be sufficiently sized to tune for the 100 octane program. If however it took a lot of water/meth injection on-time to accomplish this, then you might want to step up to the next-larger-sized nozzle to tune for the 100 octane program.

Either way, when you begin tuning for the 100 octane program, be cautious in your approach: Watch timing-pull very closely as boost comes on, and if you see timing-pull ramping up, get out of boost immediately, adjust your water/meth system accordingly, and repeat this test/tune cycle until timing-pull is under control.


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## Sam C (Sep 9, 2002)

BLSport said:


> The number reference in those nozzle ID numbers (e.g., the "7" in DO7 and M7), corresponds to the nozzle's flow rate in gallons/hour at 100 psi injection pressure. The nozzles will flow more or less than advertised, depending on your actual injection pressure, and the manifold pressure into which you are injecting.
> 
> I'd run some timing-pull data logs on the 93 octane program with 93 octane fuel in the tank and the water/meth system turned off, as a baseline to see if you're pulling any timing. From there, I'd start with the recommended nozzle based on the chart, turn on the water/meth system, and tune as required to eliminate timing-pull, if any, on the 93 octane program.
> 
> ...


Brilliant advice!:beer:


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