# 001109 - EVAP System: Large Leak Detected, running out of ideas why am I getting this code



## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

So basically I killed my cam follower, and had no choice but to replace the cam, cam follower, and hpfp. While I had everything apart I'd also did my timing since I'm @ 80k. I assembled everything back together; car runs like a charm all with the exception of one annoying code. I keep getting a warning light that my fuel cap is open on the dash, followed by a cell. When I scan the car with my vag com I only have this in the memory:

001109 - EVAP System: Large Leak Detected 
P0455 - 001 - Upper Limit Exceeded

I never had this code in the past, so I'm puzzled why am I getting this code now after I did this extensive job and everything is put together back like it was. None of the hoses have any cracks visually. 

I changed out the simple things as a new fuel cap, and a new n80 valve. But the code keeps coming back, and I’m running out of ideas. Anyone one has any other ideas? Smoke machine, but I don’t have access to one


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)




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## Krieger (May 5, 2009)

im in the same boat man.

i cleaned my valves and i keep getting a CEL even after resetting it. :banghead:


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

have you tried anything to find the leak?


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## Krieger (May 5, 2009)

yeah, we used a smoke machine a while back and found a line was leaking above the mani. replaced it, worked fine for like 6 months, then bam, it all went to hell again.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

Got a pic of the exact line you swapped out?


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## VDubGTi08 (Jan 31, 2008)

Can you run a test of the EVAP system? Its basic settings group 71. It should say system okay or system not okay or something to that effect. If it fails try pinching the hose from the evap purge valve to the intake manifold and re run the test. If you pass your purge valve is most likely leaking or not sealing 100%. If it still says system not okay try other evap hoses in your engine bay. 

You may need to have it tested by someone that can use nitrogen to check for leaks and smoke the entire system if its not easily found.


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## VDubGTi08 (Jan 31, 2008)

I just re-read what you posted and noticed you already replaced the N80 purge valve. When reconnecting the hoses for the EVAP system are you sure you didn't cross the lines? Its happened before as I dont think they are color coded. Try swapping the two lines where they connect near the fuel line in the top right hand corner of the engine bay. Retest using basic settings/MVB 71 and see if the system is okay. Hope this helps.


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## GolfRS (Feb 4, 2006)

VDubGTi08 said:


> I just re-read what you posted and noticed you already replaced the N80 purge valve. When reconnecting the hoses for the EVAP system are you sure you didn't cross the lines? Its happened before as I dont think they are color coded. Try swapping the two lines where they connect near the fuel line in the top right hand corner of the engine bay. Retest using basic settings/MVB 71 and see if the system is okay. Hope this helps.


Could you please post a pic of the hoses you are referring to ?

Just wanna check something....


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

.


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## VDubGTi08 (Jan 31, 2008)

GolfRS said:


> Could you please post a pic of the hoses you are referring to ?
> 
> Just wanna check something....













Those were the two hoses I was refering to.


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

So this code has only started since you did the work on the car?

If that is the case then it probably is a loose or damaged connection. Check everything you pulled off to do the work and work from there.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

Bringing this back from the dead as I am still having the same problem. 

I dropped my car of at a local tuning shop and had the whole system smoked tested. Everything after the fuel tank was smoke tested and passes (all the lines, purge valve, charcoal canister, etc.). 
So the shop tells me that when they connect all the lines back to the fuel tank and check group 71 the system fails. So now they are thinking since all else passes it’s something to do with the fuel tank and I need a new one. I have a very hard time believing them that I have a leak somewhere within my tank as ass this problem occurred right after I changed my cam follower. I got mad and picked up the car back from them as I got charged for labor and problem still exists.
Does anyone have any ideas on what else I can try?


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## IMAN973 (Jun 1, 2006)

Evap delete
Thats what i did


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

That is exactly what is on my mind now. How did you disable the leak detection pump?


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

turboborra said:


> That is exactly what is on my mind now. How did you disable the leak detection pump?



There are no gains to be had by removing the evap system. Most states are switching to a new emissions system that not only checked readiness but also then clears codes and verifies that readiness tests reset. There is no way to pass emissions with your evap system removed, I know it sucks but fix it and fix it right, ripping it out will just result in much bigger headaches down the road.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> There are no gains to be had by removing the evap system. Most states are switching to a new emissions system that not only checked readiness but also then clears codes and verifies that readiness tests reset. There is no way to pass emissions with your evap system removed, I know it sucks but fix it and fix it right, ripping it out will just result in much bigger headaches down the road.


No argument with you Chris and I know I would get any gains. I'm not an expert with the evap stuff, but all I want to do is get rid of the warning light on the dash. I don't even feel like removing any of the components. Disabling the pump might get rid of the light, I think .


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

removing and disabling anythign will result in the same or even more codes thrown and not fix your problem unless you had code specific to writing those codes out for those items. which then leads to you never passing readiness so it is really still in your best interest to fix it. I knw its not easy and even harder for us to figure out on the internet with this sort of thing so we'll all just be guessing. With evap issues especially one could could mean any number of things so what "worked" for one person doesn't mean it works for the next 9 people. 

Without going back through the thread have you replaced the gas cap? checked the seal to the fuel pump under the back seat? Tried another N80 valve?


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> removing and disabling anythign will result in the same or even more codes thrown and not fix your problem unless you had code specific to writing those codes out for those items. which then leads to you never passing readiness so it is really still in your best interest to fix it. I knw its not easy and even harder for us to figure out on the internet with this sort of thing so we'll all just be guessing. With evap issues especially one could could mean any number of things so what "worked" for one person doesn't mean it works for the next 9 people.
> 
> Without going back through the thread have you replaced the gas cap? checked the seal to the fuel pump under the back seat? Tried another N80 valve?


Yes I have purchased a new gas cap, and a new n80 valve already. The shop has inspected the seal around the fuel pump and claimed they saw nothing when they smoked tested the lines. no smoke was seen around the seal.


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

turboborra said:


> Yes I have purchased a new gas cap, and a new n80 valve already. The shop has inspected the seal around the fuel pump and claimed they saw nothing when they smoked tested the lines. no smoke was seen around the seal.



Seal is only like 6 bucks.. personaly worth just replacing to be safe.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> Seal is only like 6 bucks.. personaly worth just replacing to be safe.


You know what I will purchase one since its that cheap. Is it a pain to replace?


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

turboborra said:


> You know what I will purchase one since its that cheap. Is it a pain to replace?


pull seat out remove plastic cover and unplug pump. Techinally you need a special tool to get the ring off but a large flat head and a hammer works just hte same. pump pops up, remove seal reinstall seal push in place and the hardest part is getting the plastic retaining right in place and starting to thread down.

I suggest doing it with less then a 1/4 tank of gas, not that it over flows in these cars like the A4s do but easier to deal with the less fuel there is. Some even jack up the passenger side so the bulk of the fuel is on the other side.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> pull seat out remove plastic cover and unplug pump. Techinally you need a special tool to get the ring off but a large flat head and a hammer works just hte same. pump pops up, remove seal reinstall seal push in place and the hardest part is getting the plastic retaining right in place and starting to thread down.
> 
> I suggest doing it with less then a 1/4 tank of gas, not that it over flows in these cars like the A4s do but easier to deal with the less fuel there is. Some even jack up the passenger side so the bulk of the fuel is on the other side.


Snap, I just tanked up yesterday. Thanks for the suggestion about the fuel capacity being at ¼ tank of gas. I will swap the seal out next week and post back my results.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

turboborra said:


> Snap, I just tanked up yesterday. Thanks for the suggestion about the fuel capacity being at ¼ tank of gas. I will swap the seal out next week and post back my results.


So I waited until I practically had no gas left in the tank, changed the seal. Tested group 71, SYSTEM FAILED. SOB :banghead:

So having no gas in the car I went to fill to her up; and figured ehh what the heck let me test it again for the million time, SYSTEM OK.
I still refuse to believe it is something with my fuel tank, especially when this started immediatly after I changed my cam, cam follower, hpfp. I have already swapped the following items because of this dam code:


I dont know what to do with this any more


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

Fuel cap warning light has turned on this morning on a full tank of gas :banghead:. So I dont think its something related with my fuel tank.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

anyone got any ideas


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## ChuckieTodd (Sep 8, 2010)

*Same Issue*

I have the exact symptoms on my 06 GLI as you do but the car starts hard when I fill up and there's also a strange clunking sound when the car is warming up in the morning. My wife complained of it for a while so I thought it was something rolling around in the trunk. Nope. i drove it one morning alone and pulled up to a light and heard it start clunking away - like something tapping on the fuel tank randomly every few seconds.

Have you had the leak pump tested? I found this article http://repairpal.com/OBD-II-Code-P0455 that may help find the problem.


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## Krieger (May 5, 2009)

Todd, that is my exact set of summons. I've been dealing with thee hard starts tho by letting the pump prime for a minute.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

ChuckieTodd said:


> I have the exact symptoms on my 06 GLI as you do but the car starts hard when I fill up and there's also a strange clunking sound when the car is warming up in the morning. My wife complained of it for a while so I thought it was something rolling around in the trunk. Nope. i drove it one morning alone and pulled up to a light and heard it start clunking away - like something tapping on the fuel tank randomly every few seconds.
> 
> Have you had the leak pump tested? I found this article http://repairpal.com/OBD-II-Code-P0455 that may help find the problem.


 How can you test the leak detection pump if its faulty? Everytime I check group 071, I hear the pump.


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## turboborra (Jan 23, 2004)

Does anyone know if there is any way to fool the leak detection pump, so that the check fuel cap and cell wont be triggered? I hate having the dame check engine light on.


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## ChuckieTodd (Sep 8, 2010)

*Solved - for me anyway*

I removed the N80 valve and tested vacuum against it. It passed air straight through. I sprayed it full of cleaner and shook it around several times. Finally I got it to hold almost all the vacuum my pump would muster. Back on the car, no check engine light and no hard-starts at the pump after fill. If the symptoms return, a new N80 will be first on the list.

I also asked my wife to NEVER again top-off the tank.


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## Krieger (May 5, 2009)

is the n80 valve just under our mani, on the driver side?

im going to pull that sucker and clean it out. hopefully i can go more than 2 months with this car without a CEL popping up for one reason or another.


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## FMX_DBC (Feb 15, 2010)

same exact issues on my '06 GTI. Looks like I'll start with the N80....anyone know where I can find it in the engine bay? (GTI newb) and should I just go to the stealership to purchase it?


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## Marble (Nov 20, 2002)

Zombie post is zombie.

Seriously though, I have the same symptoms as listed above. In fact ChuckieTodd's reply would be the same exact post that I would make.



ChuckieTodd said:


> I have the exact symptoms on my 06 GLI as you do but the car starts hard when I fill up and there's also a strange clunking sound when the car is warming up in the morning.


My wife described that she heard a clunking noise right before the gas cap error and following CEL. Each went away: CEL came on, pulled the code (001109), cleared. A few days passed, light came back, light went away, light has come back now.

From reading the posts above, I will start with the N80 valve.

Anyone else who posted resolve their issue? If so, what steps did you take?

Thanks.

:thumbup:


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## ninohale (Jun 9, 2010)

I'm bringing this back to life as I have thrown this same CEL. I swapped the N80/Purge Valve and replaced the Gas Cap w/ a brand new one... Cleared the codes and a few days later... Gas Cap Warning light followed by a CEL.

Any other suggestions gentlemen?


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## ALRDesign (Nov 5, 2008)

Bringing this back from the dead. Anyone figure anything out on how to solve this issue? I'm currently going through the same BS. Also in a bit of a jam because my car is now overdue for inspection. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## azunderg (Apr 29, 2009)

Having the exact same problem, wife is taking the car to the shop this morning to figure out what they say. 

Gas cap light came on, then turned off, and the next day my check engine light came on...

From everything that I've read online it seems like it's the purge valve, breather hose, and maybe the charcoal canister?

I'll post again after i hear from my wife.

ic:


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## ninohale (Jun 9, 2010)

azunderg said:


> Having the exact same problem, wife is taking the car to the shop this morning to figure out what they say.
> 
> Gas cap light came on, then turned off, and the next day my check engine light came on...
> 
> ...


Yea keep us posted :beer:


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## TCFGLI08 (Apr 6, 2011)

NEVER TOP UP THE GAS TANK
It will ...kup the charcoal canister
believe me
to the click,then stop
Terry


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## azunderg (Apr 29, 2009)

ninohale said:


> Yea keep us posted :beer:


The mechanic is saying it was just a loose gas cap. I guess we'll see.

:laugh:


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## ninohale (Jun 9, 2010)

azunderg said:


> The mechanic is saying it was just a loose gas cap. I guess we'll see.
> 
> :laugh:


I call bs 

German mechanic or just universal?


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## azunderg (Apr 29, 2009)

ninohale said:


> I call bs
> 
> German mechanic or just universal?


German from Germany? I don't think so, but he's the owner of a local shop that only repairs Audi/VW and he's a certified VW mechanic. 

I hope he's right, but everything I've seen online states that after you clear the code it just comes back.

:snowcool:


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## ninohale (Jun 9, 2010)

azunderg said:


> German from Germany? I don't think so, but he's the owner of a local shop that only repairs Audi/VW and he's a certified VW mechanic.
> 
> I hope he's right, but everything I've seen online states that after you clear the code it just comes back.
> 
> :snowcool:


Just a VW/Audi mechanic... My gas cap light was on an off for 6 months before it turned into a perminant CEL. The only thing I havent replaced is my EVAP Canister.... which will happen over winter :beer:


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## azunderg (Apr 29, 2009)

The guy cleared the code, it's been a couple of days and no more gas cap light or check engine light, but now i'm getting like 2 mpg less.

idk i'm about done with this car, i'm beginning to understand why the gti's with the fsi are so cheap...


:snowcool:


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## ninohale (Jun 9, 2010)

azunderg said:


> The guy cleared the code, it's been a couple of days and no more gas cap light or check engine light, but now i'm getting like 2 mpg less.
> 
> idk i'm about done with this car, i'm beginning to understand why the gti's with the fsi are so cheap...
> 
> ...


I'm not suprised. Mine gas cap light went away for 5-6 months before coming back :beer:

I'll give you $500 for it :thumbup::thumbup:


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## azunderg (Apr 29, 2009)

ninohale said:


> I'm not suprised. Mine gas cap light went away for 5-6 months before coming back :beer:
> 
> I'll give you $500 for it :thumbup::thumbup:



I know you're joking, but if things keep breaking I'll take you up on that offer...


:banghead:


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## AlbGuy40 (Jun 23, 2005)

I have been having the exact same problems on my A4 ever since I bought it (35k km ago).

I already got a new gas cap when I first got it, however the problem didnt go away. A "check gas cap message" followed by a CEL 2-3 days later... Every time I reset it, it just repeats itself. I havent done much about it mainly because it does not seem to affect fuel economy or performance...

However, I want to get on top of it due to the changing emissions requirements in my province, since they will start doing readiness tests and expect people to have no CEL and pass all tests.

I had some time on my hands today and got the N80 valve out. I just had a quick question with regards to "testing" the valve...

When I try blowing air through it I can definitely hear and feel air going through it, although it is doing it slowly (as if 1/8th-1/16th of the hole is allowing air through). 

Would this cause a Large EVAP leak (P0455), or is it too small of an issue and the valve is not expected to stay closed when you try pushing air hard through it...

Thanks in advance


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

AlbGuy40 said:


> I had some time on my hands today and got the N80 valve out. I just had a quick question with regards to "testing" the valve...
> 
> When I try blowing air through it I can definitely hear and feel air going through it, although it is doing it slowly (as if 1/8th-1/16th of the hole is allowing air through).


It should not allow air to blow through it period in one direction. So if no air blows through either direction its clogged, if it blows through in one direction but not the other its fine, if it blows through in both directions it is bad.

You can try tapping it on a hard surface (like white paper on a bench) and see if carbon chunks come out from the canister, sometimes that blocks it from closing and can get you some more time out of it.


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## AlbGuy40 (Jun 23, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> It should not allow air to blow through it period in one direction. So if no air blows through either direction its clogged, if it blows through in one direction but not the other its fine, if it blows through in both directions it is bad.
> 
> You can try tapping it on a hard surface (like white paper on a bench) and see if carbon chunks come out from the canister, sometimes that blocks it from closing and can get you some more time out of it.


My understanding was that the n80 is a electrically actuated valve and that when its unplugged it should be in a sealed condition... Air is getting through slowly when I try blowing in the flow direction... When I try to blow through the other end there's no air going through... 

I'm picking up a new valve today and will see if that does it...


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## [email protected] USA (May 17, 2007)

AlbGuy40 said:


> My understanding was that the n80 is a electrically actuated valve and that when its unplugged it should be in a sealed condition... Air is getting through slowly when I try blowing in the flow direction... When I try to blow through the other end there's no air going through...
> 
> I'm picking up a new valve today and will see if that does it...



If its sealed one way and not the other then the valve is in theory fine. Although i have seen some that are fine because you took it out and handled it but a day later back in are acting up.


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## miki2006 (Jun 18, 2010)

Bringing this forum to life to see If is any solution to EVAP large leak detected!!✌


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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

miki2006 said:


> Bringing this forum to life to see If is any solution to EVAP large leak detected!!✌


Have you recently worked on the vehicle as the original poster? 

Have you looked at the N80 Valve ? 
This is the most common cause of this evap faults

http://www.deutscheautoparts.com/Vi...ndVacuum/06E-906-517-A/06E-906-517/773/139725


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

i am having this same issue for the past month....already changed the gas cap and n80... was this resolved op? :banghead:


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## SleepyDubVR6 (Dec 4, 2007)

had the same issue. it was a bad leak detection pump


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Thanks for the reply. I figured it was that after I tested with vag. Ordered one yesterday. I hope it's that

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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

P0455/001109 - EVAP System: Large Leak Detected

I have been battling this code for a few weeks now, car is running 100% fine.
2007 Audi A4 B7 2.0t Quattro

I have changed the Gas Cap w/Seal, N80, & Leak Detection Pump in that order and still getting this code right after the receiving the infamous "Close Fuel Tank Cap!"

Change Cam Follower also...

PCV Valve & HPFP Fuel Sensor replaced a few months ago under recall from Audi.

I don't know what to do next......:banghead::banghead:

any help would be greatly appreciated.....thanks


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## Bo Toichi (Jan 15, 2013)

EVAP purge valves ALWAYS crap out in these cars. Chris @ REVO is wrong,you cannot low in it "one way",that would be a check valve. These are electrical solenoid valve. They have to be perfectly sealed/air tight in the off/non powered state. Try sucking on one of the ends and stickingit to your tongue,if it cannot hold vacuum it is bad. These cause smal and large leak problems. You can install one,go to basic settings on Vag com and run the EVAP test,it will tell you instantly if you have fixed it or not.


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

I changed the purge valve with a new one when I first saw the code but still coming up even after replacing the LDP....anyone know of anyone in the NYc area that can do a smoke test? Or any other ideas?

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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> I changed the purge valve with a new one when I first saw the code but still coming up even after replacing the LDP....anyone know of anyone in the NYc area that can do a smoke test? Or any other ideas?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4


What is your fault?


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

p0455/001109
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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> p0455/001109
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


Have you ever replaced the fuel pump in the tank on your car?


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Nope

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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> Nope
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4


Def need to smoke test


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Anyone know where in the NYC tristate area I can go for smoke test?

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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> Anyone know where in the NYC tristate area I can go for smoke test?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


Try these guys

http://www.tyrolsport.com/


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

so i dropped my car off at Phantom Autowerke in Elmsford,NY since it was closer to me than TyrolSport who i have used before....Phantom said they had a smoke machine and was able to test, i did not physically see them do it, but i left the car there and picked it up the following day....one of the guys i spoke to said they did "smoke test" and didn't find any leaks...then they just asked me what i replaced and i told them what i posted above....purge,ldp,gas cap.....what was left was the charcoal canister. The guy said it has to be that, not sure how good these guys are at diagnostics, but they wanted to charge like $470 to change plus the diagnostic fee of $100 .... i figured let them do it, if it was reasonable, since they "diagnosed" it ,but talk about rape....., i just ordered it online for $180 and it in less than 5 min, just ran group 71 on vcds and i am still getting Large Leak Detected......now what??? :banghead: now i am wondering if they actually did a smoke test or not.


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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> so i dropped my car off at Phantom Autowerke in Elmsford,NY since it was closer to me than TyrolSport who i have used before....Phantom said they had a smoke machine and was able to test, i did not physically see them do it, but i left the car there and picked it up the following day....one of the guys i spoke to said they did "smoke test" and didn't find any leaks...then they just asked me what i replaced and i told them what i posted above....purge,ldp,gas cap.....what was left was the charcoal canister. The guy said it has to be that, not sure how good these guys are at diagnostics, but they wanted to charge like $470 to change plus the diagnostic fee of $100 .... i figured let them do it, if it was reasonable, since they "diagnosed" it ,but talk about rape....., i just ordered it online for $180 and it in less than 5 min, just ran group 71 on vcds and i am still getting Large Leak Detected......now what??? :banghead: now i am wondering if they actually did a smoke test or not.


Have you checked the n80 valve. I have seen people put them on backwards before. The n80 is a one way valve so if it was backwards it would be as if you didn't have one at all.


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

yea that is the first thing i changed since i have changed that one before...definitely on right...put it on the same way it was in before


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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> yea that is the first thing i changed since i have changed that one before...definitely on right...put it on the same way it was in before


Try clamping off the line at the n80 and run the test


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Connector is facing towards the rear of the vehicle

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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> Connector is facing towards the rear of the vehicle
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4


yes this looks like its the correct way. Do me a favor and try to clamp that line off and run the test again. I have a feeling this is the part you need 

http://www.deutscheautoparts.com/View/06F-133-781-L/06F-133-781-D/0/139968


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## donjuan1jr (Oct 8, 2008)

Shadow if all else fails shoot me a pm, ill run this issue through my foreman, he loves a challenge. (if u dont mind a drive)


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

should i clamp the line on the connector side or after? might do this tomorrow since i already pulled the car out of the garage for work tom.....getting tired lol thanks for the replies guys


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## [email protected] (Oct 26, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> should i clamp the line on the connector side or after? might do this tomorrow since i already pulled the car out of the garage for work tom.....getting tired lol thanks for the replies guys


Either side should work but I would suggest the back end on the gas tank side as it has a longer hose that would be easier to clamp. 

The part I sent a link to is a check valve and vacuum pipe assembly. If that check valve has gone bad that is likely the source of your issue.


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Okay...I will try it later when I get home thanks

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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

so i actually never got to do this test until now, ....i just did the test of clamping the hose and running test but still no go....large leak detected. any other ideas? should i just chang this part anyway?


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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

I've been fighting an EVAP leak for about 6 weeks now without success. Decided to post in this thread as I find it the most informative related to this subject on this forum.
So far I replaced the N80, fuel cap seal and then replaced the entire fuel cap.
The leak behavior is varying in my case though.
When the tank is full or almost full there are no problems, I don't get the close fuel tank cap message, no CEL. If I do the group 071 test with vagcom it passes most of the times, but on some occasions I do get a small leak detected. 
I noticed I get the fuel cap message on the screen when the tank is about half full, it disappears after a few seconds and I only get the CEL the following day.
If I do the group 071 test with half tank or lower I get a large leak detected.
So the leak varies from non-existent to small and then large as the fuel level gets lower.
Also ran some group 071 tests and during that time I sprayed some soapy water on EVAP hoses/tubes/connectors around the engine, pulled the rear seat and did the same for the tank pump connectors, but I couldn't see any air escaping anywhere.
I could really use some input as to what to try next.


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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

Still fighting with this.
Does anyone have any idea what to try next? I know there's also a leak detection pump and a canister. Not sure where they are located though,


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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

UPDATE:
I used a vacuum pistol with gauge to test the line coming from the N80 all the way back to the charcoal canister. No leaks here.
Checked the leak detection pump tubes/connection points and tried a new pump assembly and it still fails the EVAP test.
So now it's either the fuel tank or charcoal canister. Will try to remove the canister this week and for that I have to drop the rear subframe. Fun times :banghead:


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Yea...I'm still having same issues....I've already changed n80,gas cap,leak detection pump,charcoal canister (This was changed after I brought it to a shop and they said its definitely that....since they did a "smoke test" not sure if they really did or not),check valve hose that connects to n80,fuel filter....no luck.....fuel pump and gasket is next maybe.....or just drop it off to another shop....battling this almost a year now...

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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

Forgot to mention that I also replaced the gasket for the gas tank pump. It didn't help in my case.


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Damn.....not sure what to do next lol

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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

Replace the fuel pump seal and if that doesn't work then your last option is the actual fuel tank. But a smoke test done properly should clearly point to a tank leak. Make sure you get one done properly before forking out the cash for such a big job.


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

no bueno on the fuel pump gasket....still getting large leak on group 71 with full tank and 3/4 tank, i never tried it with half tank or almost empty....also the charcoal canister is easy to change, just 3 10mm bolts on the underside under trunk to remove cover and it's there....looks like imma have to drop the tank to see whats up.....unless someone out there has any other suggestions. :banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:


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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

But the canister is right behind the subframe. Can you slide it out?
I went there and it's super tight and according to official removal instructions the subframe has to be lowered about 50mm to be able to take it out. Have you changed the canister without doing this?

In your case if I we're you I would go and have another smoke test done (different shop) as your only option now is the fuel tank and that will cost you $900 just for the part. You don't want to spend this kind of cash unless you know 100% it's leaking.


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## BlueDevil504 (Jan 19, 2012)

http://www.deutscheautoparts.com/View/06F-133-781-L/06F-133-781-D/0/139968[/QUOTE]


don't forget to check the vapor canister check valve. Part #06F133781L


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

I'm assuming u have the same car Audi a4 b7 quattro 2.0t

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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

BlueDevil504 said:


> http://www.deutscheautoparts.com/View/06F-133-781-L/06F-133-781-D/0/139968



don't forget to check the vapor canister check valve. Part #06F133781L[/QUOTE]

changed that already....


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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

shadowinfector said:


> I'm assuming u have the same car Audi a4 b7 quattro 2.0t
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk


Now I see why you are saying it's easy. I don't have the same car. On the A3 it's under the subframe unfortunately.


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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

BlueDevil504 said:


> http://www.deutscheautoparts.com/View/06F-133-781-L/06F-133-781-D/0/139968



don't forget to check the vapor canister check valve. Part #06F133781L[/QUOTE]

There's no need to replace that check valve as it is after the N80. During the EVAP test the N80 is closed and the LDP is creating pressure on the system from the back all the way to the N80 and not further.


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

FINALLY FIXED!!!! 

I used a Transfer pump purchased from Harbor Freight
http://www.harborfreight.com/multi-use-transfer-pump-66418.html

http://www.harborfreight.com/multi-use-transfer-pump-66418.html

and pumped into all 3 lines coming off the Carbon Canister......2 of the lines pressurized fine. the line coming off the Leak detection pump did not so i kept pumping and feeling around the hose because air kept coming out, followed the hose a few inches and found a small hole (i mustve drilled into when doing my air setup):banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead: , Used some good ole duct tape, ran the EVAP Test and Passed!!!


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## FinderRO (Sep 17, 2012)

At least you've found your problem. Good job. But you should have used some plastic weld compound to fix it. Duct tape might leak again over time.
I actually have a pump like that too. What did you use to cap off the other end of the line when testing?


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## shadowinfector (Jun 12, 2007)

Duct tape to close off around the tube....u don't need to close off the other end since that's the hose to bring in the air.....yea.it was a temp fix.....might do the jb eeld

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## vtraudt (Mar 1, 2010)

[email protected] USA said:


> removing and disabling anythign will result in the same or even more codes thrown and not fix your problem unless you had code specific to writing those codes out for those items. which then leads to you never passing readiness so it is really still in your best interest to fix it. I knw its not easy and even harder for us to figure out on the internet with this sort of thing so we'll all just be guessing. With evap issues especially one could could mean any number of things so what "worked" for one person doesn't mean it works for the next 9 people.
> 
> Without going back through the thread have you replaced the gas cap? checked the seal to the fuel pump under the back seat? Tried another N80 valve?


We remove and tune out the EVAP system on ALL our cars (we do not have government test here in MI) as part of a performance tune.
Properly done, it has NO effect on the car. It is purely a government gimmick that causes a lot of headaches on aging cars, and it is difficult to trouble shoot.


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