# 10,000 mi oil changes = major repairs



## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

I just had my car in for a normal 10 k oil change and had air cleaner changed same time. The tech suggested to have new plugs , due at 60k any way , which i am at, and because he had the cover off for air cleaner easy to do.
Well he was checking and found major problem, the cam lobes were wore off and the lobe for the fuel pump was gone. (wore off) He asked me about my oil changes and if I ve ever ran it low? I said no , and I even check it and top it off if half quart low.
He suggested that when ever its low , that means oil break down and should have the oil changed at that point no matter the miles
which makes sense .Just something you should be aware of and checking on. Usually they make noise be fore they totally blow, but he caught mine before any noise.
damn lucky i have the extended warranty, close to $2,000 repair bill


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## Doedrums (Jun 14, 2003)

*Re: 10,000 mi oil changes = major repairs (minnvw)*

This has nothing to do with 10k mile oil changes. It is a known issue on 2.0 turbos.


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## ialonso (Aug 26, 2006)

Checking the Cam follower is not normal procedure at 10K or at any mileage (thought it ought to be, at least at 30K given the history of the engine)
but It seems unusual that the tech would go thru all this trouble to check on all this without any symptoms...
Also a plug change at 10K seems premature.
Am I the only one that suspects the tech as not being upfront ? (of course I have never seen the guy or the car, so he could be awesome....but it sounds unusual for him to check so far in without symptoms)


_Modified by ialonso at 8:14 PM 8-27-2009_


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: (ialonso)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ialonso* »_Checking the Cam follower is not normal procedure at 10K or at any mileage (thought it ought to be, at least at 30K given the history of the engine)
but It seems unusual that the tech would go thru all this trouble to check on all this without any symptoms...
Also a plug change at 10K seems premature.
Am I the only one that suspects the tech as not being upfront ? (of course I have never seen the guy or the car, so he could be awesome....but it sounds unusual for him to check so far in without symptoms)

_Modified by ialonso at 8:14 PM 8-27-2009_

NO your confused I DO HAVE 60,000 miles on this car, and yes it has alot to do with running oil that has too many miles on it, plugs are suppose to be changed at 60 k read your owners manual,
very reputable dealer, no reason to second guess these men they do this for a living . Not fly by nighters


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: 10,000 mi oil changes = major repairs (minnvw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *minnvw* »_
He suggested that when ever its low , that means oil break down and should have the oil changed at that point no matter the miles which makes sense .


It this is the case I would be changing my oil every 1000 miles because that's how often I have to add a full quart!! 

_Quote, originally posted by *minnvw* »_
damn lucky i have the extended warranty, close to $2,000 repair bill









This and the AC compressor is the reason I purchased one too.


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: 10,000 mi oil changes = major repairs (solarflare)*


_Quote, originally posted by *solarflare* »_

This and the AC compressor is the reason I purchased one too.


Solar you know why ibought the extended? because of that top, i just knew that was going to be problems, ha Ive never used it for the top.
I did use it for the new a/c system a month ago, ha
Wow yours sure burns allot of oil, you must be able to see a blue cloud coming out the tail pipe? a qt in a 1000 miles? that's allot
Im loosing faith in these 2.0 t engines


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: 10,000 mi oil changes = major repairs (minnvw)*

Well I don't really notice smoke normally but when I press the peddle to the metal I do leave a smoke screen behind but it's not blue. Yeah, I think this engine left the design table a bit prematurely. Probably why it was replaced so quickly...


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

Well I have been reading up on this engine(fsi) and yes they have had problems with the cam follower and I do plan on keeping the car a few more years, so i am going to start changing the oil at 5,000 mile intervals and see if i dont get better service out of this new cam,? time will tell


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## ialonso (Aug 26, 2006)

*Re: (minnvw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *minnvw* »_
NO your confused I DO HAVE 60,000 miles on this car, and yes it has alot to do with running oil that has too many miles on it, plugs are suppose to be changed at 60 k read your owners manual,
very reputable dealer, no reason to second guess these men they do this for a living . Not fly by nighters

You are right, I was confused.
Sorry, The subject was 10K service, I figured you had 10K on the car.... I can see now you meant 10K interval change...not that the car had 10K
I'm sorry to hear this has happened, but I am not surprised having read a lot on how common this failure is on our BPY motors...
I would at least try to talk to VWOA to see if they help with any of the repair bill...
I'm at 25K after 3 years, When my car hits 30K I plan to pull out the CAM follower and inspect. Your experience and that of others tells me while this should be totally unnecessary, it might be worthwhile.
Best of luck.



_Modified by ialonso at 6:22 AM 8-30-2009_


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: (ialonso)*



ialonso said:


> I would at least try to talk to VWOA to see if they help with any of the repair bill...
> QUOTE] Yes I will contact VWOA and see what they have to say, this is quite a common problem with our particular engines. They should actually cover it all even though its off warranty.
> I feel sorry for people that this happens to unexpectanly and are slapped with a $2000 repair bill. These followers should be check on a regular maintance check and added to the list of things to check by the dealer.
> I am very lucky to have the extended warranty, w/ a $200 deductible, I am going to at least try to get that 200 out of VWOA
> thanks


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## cb391 (Mar 12, 2006)

I wonder if the dealers know something. I have had my Eos serviced by two different dealers and both want me to do 5k oil changes but won't say why other than driving in the city is harder on the oil. They also don't want to set the reminder to 10k even though that is what VW recommends in the owners manual.


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: (cb391)*

CB, yeah , Id say they are trying to sell you a oil change, Even after my cam follower took a dump, and the mechanic that worked on it and showed me the pooched part, and he was the man that recommended not waiting the 10k between oil changes,
ON the work order and receipt I got when I paid, it says right on there the next O change due in ten K miles, ha
OH city driving could be harder on the oil, im sure your engine gets allot hotter I drive mostly highway, who knows? If the oil even has anything to do with these followers braking? I don't really think the oil causes it. just a piss poor design.


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## just-jean (Sep 14, 2006)

*Re: (minnvw)*

i just changed the cam follower on mine at 27,000 preventatively. for a 42 dollar part it sure beats the problems if you wait till it wears out, i doubt the dealer would just "look at it" if you asked them to and while you have the whole thing open you might as well put a new one in.


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: (just-jean)*

Cam lobes and followers wear together. If you change one without the other then expect one to not last nearly as long as it would have otherwise. But what else are we suppose to do, right. Wait for VW to come out with a fix? But I guess they did, it's called the CCTA engine







I believe I read somewhere in the 2.0T forum that a Tuner is experimenting with a fix for this problem. I have no idea what that would involve or the cost but $50 every 20,000 miles or so is cheap insurance against a multi-thousand dollar repair. How did your follower look?



_Modified by solarflare at 4:31 AM 8-31-2009_


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## ialonso (Aug 26, 2006)

*Re: (solarflare)*


_Quote, originally posted by *solarflare* »_Cam lobes and followers wear together. If you change one without the other then expect one to not last nearly as long as it would have otherwise. 

Are these two parts made of similar metal ? or is the follower made of softer metal ? I would not feel so bad replaing only one if the follower is softer, but still, I have a feeling, chaging the lobs every 30K is not practical, even though I'm not exactly sure what they are


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: (just-jean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *just-jean* »_i just changed the cam follower on mine at 27,000 preventatively. for a 42 dollar part it sure beats the problems if you wait till it wears out, i doubt the dealer would just "look at it" if you asked them to and while you have the whole thing open you might as well put a new one in.

Jean do you do the work yourself? I wonder because for42 dollars I cant even get my air filter changed. Just wonder how you arrived at that number? Most of us don't have the knowledge or the tools to open up one of these engines ourselves.


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## just-jean (Sep 14, 2006)

*Re: (solarflare)*


_Quote, originally posted by *solarflare* »_ How did your follower look?
_Modified by solarflare at 4:31 AM 8-31-2009_

i don't think it looked too bad
i do not do the work my self. i have 2 brothers who take very good care of me.....one with a high mileage 2.0T that has ALL the problems go AND out of warrenty, and one who does my work and doesn't want to have to bail me out with bigger problems








http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4165431







his at 85,000
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4433854







why i already sucked the ventylsauber thingy thru my injectors









mine at 27,600








there has to be a happy medium 30K is OK, 90K is shot, 60K might be the right time to check but by then it is already out of warrenty. i am coming up on 3 years by the winter which is no fun to find out problems. 
i bought the part 06D109309C from Getvwparts.com for $43
and a spare ignition coil for $16 just to keep in the trunk


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: (just-jean)*

Well the coating is gone so it's only a matter of time now. I get a kick out of that expiration date. Seems many are expiring much sooner then that


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## liquid stereo (Feb 26, 2003)

*A more poorly worded post*

The original post takes the prize - I have not seen such a poorly worded post in my history on Vortex. 
You are/were not the only one confused.

_Quote, originally posted by *ialonso* »_
You are right, I was confused.
Sorry, The subject was 10K service, I figured you had 10K on the car.... 
_Modified by ialonso at 6:22 AM 8-30-2009_


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## just-jean (Sep 14, 2006)

*Re:*


_Quote, originally posted by *minnvw* »_I just had my car in for a normal 10 k oil change and had air cleaner changed same time. The tech suggested to have new plugs , *due at 60k any way , which i am at*, and because he had the cover off for air cleaner easy to do.
Well he was checking and found major problem, the cam lobes were wore off and the lobe for the fuel pump was gone. (wore off) He asked me about my oil changes and if I ve ever ran it low? I said no , and I even check it and top it off if half quart low.
He suggested that when ever its low , that means oil break down and should have the oil changed at that point no matter the miles
which makes sense .Just something you should be aware of and checking on. Usually they make noise be fore they totally blow, but he caught mine before any noise.
damn lucky i have the extended warranty, close to $2,000 repair bill










i thought this was clear.....as well as the title that indicated that 10Kinterval oil changes ( = ) will lead to disaster


_Modified by just-jean at 4:33 PM 9-1-2009_


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: Re: (just-jean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *just-jean* »_

i thought this was clear.....as well as the title that indicated that 10Kinterval oil changes ( = ) will lead to disaster

_Modified by just-jean at 4:33 PM 9-1-2009_


I agree with you jean, thank you, In all my history of vortex Ive never seen people so easily confused.
By the way jean, your sure lucky to have a couple of nice brother, who are mechanics and so knowledgeable of these cars. I still havent learned how to change my own oil yet, but do plan on doing it the next OC .


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## Kong99 (Jul 3, 2008)

*Re: Re: (minnvw)*

Interesting, my '08 has been burning oil. I have read of the 2.0T FSI doing this so was not alarmed. Also since I have a Stg 2 set-up assumed this was part of the reason. I just passed 20k and got the full service treatment for the 20k milestone. No problems found.
I've come from changing oil every 3k miles. Going to 5k was difficult, 10k seemed insane. I had the oil changed at 16k because I checked and it was very low (no reading on stick) and just decided to have it changed and the car checked. On this visit they replaced the 'pressure regulating valve' claiming that the "crankcase breather letting oil flow into intake system".
Seems the car is still using the same amount of oil after this change. I'm going back after 600 miles for them to look at the oil usage.
Frankly for my peace of mind I think I'm just gonna change the oil every 5k.
It seems these Cam lobe/follower issues have just sprung up recently, assuming correlating to a % hitting the same mileage milestone. I think I am going to check mine at 30k and replace if needed.


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: Re: (Kong99)*

I would agree with you Kong. to have that cam follower checked at 30k I guess its not a big deal to check it, and have it replaced if needed part runs about $55
I think even at that point if the cam has a small groove wore in it it wont hurt. Id leave the cam in then get it it just at 59,999 miles and have it done again under warranty then if the cam is bad have them fix it complete then.
I wonder when your oil didn't even show on the stick, there was no idiot light on? You should have them check that circuit also. when you have a oil burner your idiot light should at least work. I wonder if these oil burners will keep burning as the miles increase ?


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: Re: (minnvw)*

Mines at about 35,000 miles. Pretty steady burn of 1qt every 1000-1200 miles from the first oil change at 5k. Interestingly I don't remember having to add a quart during that first 5k and if I did it was no more then a quart. I believe there are 2 idiot lights for oil. One is low oil pressure, if that lights up you have big time trouble and need shut off the engine immediately. The other is low oil level but that doesn't come on for a quart low. It's more like 2 or 3 quarts low. Can't seem to find info on this in the manual. Just from what I've read here in the forums.
I think the issue with oil burning has to do with the piston rings. Their either soft or installed wrong. I haven't decided if I should press this issue with VW though. I don't know what would be worse burning a quart/1000 miles or letting some dealer mechanic rip apart my engine.


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: Re: (solarflare)*

Wow Solar those idiot lights don't give you much advance warning do they? I am sure if you pressed the issue much with vwoa they would just tell you that's normal for that engine. end of discussion, 
I agree that's terrible for a new car to burn that much, when i used to run Toyota I had 5 of them , bought them new different years. I would change oil at 5 or 6 k, and they would still be on the full mark


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## [email protected] (Jan 23, 2009)

Also as crazy as it sounds 1qt consumption per 1000 miles is withing in VW's spec and not to be worried about too much, just keep an eye on it and top off your oil.


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: Re: (minnvw)*



minnvw said:


> I am sure if you pressed the issue much with vwoa they would just tell you that's normal for that engine. end of discussion,
> that's what I said ,I dont think Id ever buy another new vw. If they wont stand behind their product. Atleast they could do would be give us all a free case of oil for these oil burners
> 
> 
> ...


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: Re:*

Actually, per TB, the VW spec for "normal" oil consumption is 1qt/1200miles. Normal in that VW doesn't want to spend the money to fix the problem which would mean new rings for these oil burning engines. I just don't know what the long term effect will be burning that much oil; plugged catalytic, fowled O2 sensors, spark plugs or fuel injectors, but so far I've had no issues related to the high oil consumption except adding about $3 per gas tank fill-up to add 1/2 quart of synthetic to the crankcase tank


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## mrcozy (Jun 7, 2007)

I complained about the oil consumption every time I took mine in for service, especially given that it had been accelerating. It started at 1qt/5000mi, and had reached 1qt/1600mi by the last service (40,000mi). VW apparently got tired of the complaints and authorized the dealership to investigate. Their conclusion was that it was the oil cooler, and they're adding (or replacing?) an oil cooler adapter to correct the problem.


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

*Re: Re: (solarflare)*

Solar, If your using that much oil I dont think you have to worry about changing oil in that car Its getting a good supply of new, clean oil on a regular basis ,


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## sdafins (May 25, 2007)

*Re: (mrcozy)*

I would like to know how the oil cooler plays into the car using so much oil. Is there a leak? My 06 2.0t uses about 2 qts between 5k oil changes. 53k. Though this may not be excessive--I remember cars I had in the 80s that required the same, its just oil isn't .79 a qt now , for the proper synthetic its $7 a qt.


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## ChavinKnight (Sep 21, 2009)

Is this level of oil consumption a consistent issue with this car? I only have about 900 miles on mine, and so far, I can't tell that there has been any consumption. Actually, my obsessive checking of the oil level has become akin to a neurosis of sorts, and I know that more oil is being lost in the checking (wiping the dipstick) than the engine is consuming. I talked earlier today with the guy who sold me the car on an unrelated matter. He asked how things were going with my car. I told him great, and I mentioned more oil being consumed by checking the level than by the engine, and he asked why I was doing that. I said because the car is known to use excessive amounts of oil, and because the owner's manual says to check it with every fillup, although I check it more frequently. You can bet that I'll be screaming bloody murder if the car starts to use a lot of oil. I just don't think that is healthy on so many levels. Re: the oil change interval, I am ok with that. My last car was a Honda Civic, and the recommended interval was all electronically determined; I easily got 7,500 plus miles between oil changes. I have also done some research on oil breakdown, etc. I've gathered that 1) there is often still life left in oil at the end of a long interval, 2) frequent oil changes, i.e., the 3,000 miles branded into the arrogant American psyche, actually are not good for an engine (paradoxically there is an INCREASE in engine wear following an oil change), not to mention the environment (no explanation needed), and 3) there absolutely are differences in oil performance and life depending on all sorts of factors that I am too uneducated on to explain with any coherence. So I will stick with the weight and brands that meet the VW standards. Sometimes, it feels a little overwhelming being in this car because my reference for a VW is the 1979 Rabbit that was my first car.


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: (ChavinKnight)*

The car is awesome and I suspect the oil burning problem is not as wide spread as one might think reading these forums. But the percentage is higher then most cars. You have an '09 so probably have the new 2.0t (CCTA) I have not read anything about an oil consumption problem with this engine, just the older BPY 2.0t. In fact, I'm off to add a quart right now


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## ryandougherty (Jun 14, 1999)

*Re: (solarflare)*

My 2007 Eos, with 36500 miles seems to be burning more and more oil as the miles increase. 
Since new, I've gone from having to put 1qt of oil in between oil changes to 3-4 qts. For example, in the last 6,000 miles, I've put 3.5qts in to keep the engine topped off.
Oddly enough, I've never had any lights or messages come on - which is a bit nerveracking. 
Does everyone have an oil light that lights up when they first start their cars, then go out? Mine doesn't... (a bunch of other warning lights briefly light up, then go out).


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## solarflare (Mar 28, 2007)

*Re: (ryandougherty)*

I've looked for this light too. The owners manual mentions one but I have not seen it. I read in another forum it lights after a 2 or 3 quarts low. Can't remember the exact level. Surprised you didn't see it 3.5 quarts low! It really should come on at the 1 qt low mark. The less oil in the crankcase the more thermal stress on the remaining oil. I just added 1.5 qts after 1300 miles! I'm gonna get VW after this during my next oil change interval. This is above their "normal" burn level of 1qt/1200 miles.


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## oasis (Apr 22, 2003)

*Re: (solarflare)*

Holy cow! I see most of the posters here have an '07 Eos. I hope that has something to do with it.
I check the oil level of my '09 at almost every fill-up, and the level hasn't budged from the top line one iota. I took it in on Friday for a free check-up, and everything was hunky dory for the dealership as well.
Now having said all that, I am inclined to change the oil and filter every 5,000 miles as I have done with all of my cars (except the air-cooled Super Beetle at 3,000 miles). I can't see where I would be doing any harm.
I have seen this thread before. I am sorry it remains an active sounding board for some of you.


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## VR6boi65 (Jan 29, 2004)

*Re: 10,000 mi oil changes = major repairs (Doedrums)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Doedrums* »_This has nothing to do with 10k mile oil changes. It is a known issue on 2.0 turbos. 

Yep. Just did one on a customer's 07 GTI with 60k on the clock. $2000 customer pay.


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