# Is my catch can just horribly ineffective?



## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

Car is a 3 liter with about 250 miles on it so far. It started running rich, so I was checking a few things and noticed this. 

 


I was thinking of adding some steel wool into the catch can to see if it would help. 

 

Any other suggestions? I thought it was a little strange that it was kinda milky like that, almost like the stuff that accumulates on the oil filler cap when taking a short drive.


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## BoostedDubVR6T420 (Dec 4, 2009)

The milky oil is from condensation. I noticed in the picture you have no air filter on your catch can, how does it breath?


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## BLSport (Dec 24, 2005)

nuclearaddict said:


> I was thinking of adding some steel wool into the catch can to see if it would help.


 What type of baffling, if any, is inside of the catch can? 



BoostedDubVR6T420 said:


> I noticed in the picture you have no air filter on your catch can, how does it breath?


 Doesn't need one and shouldn't have one in this case, if it's configured as it appears to be; recirculated post-MAF.


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## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

This can has no internal baffling, and that was the thinking of using the steel wool. But open to any other suggestions. The can had a breather on the top where the black cap is, but I plugged it so it wouldn't draw unmetered air. 

The can is made by ATP, should I look into getting a better can or just work with this one to make it more effective?


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

If there's no internal baffling (or only the center capped vent is baffled) then there's no reason why you would not pull that stuff straight through....


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## lilnick (Feb 15, 2005)

on a turbo car you DONT recirculate your breather :screwy:


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

Yes, you can. Pre-turbo


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## sp_golf (Nov 28, 2007)

The milky stuff is normal, it's oil mixed with condensation, if you don't want it in your IC piping you should vent it to the atmosphere, I think you'd have some condensation even with steel wool or a baffled can, some of the vapors will still get thru. 

How's the blowby out of the breather at idle/when you rev it?


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## dub_slug (May 12, 2008)

I spot a hallman  :thumbup: 

I've got the evo rX and love it. I had the same problem with my vrt, switched to 5w30 conventional valvoline and it cleared up a bit


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## blackvento36 (Mar 17, 2003)

I'd get a different can, you need some baffling in there so the moisture condenses in the can and falls to the bottom. I never liked the idea of using steel wool though. 

I use 2 pieces of perforated stainless to baffle mine, I'm sure there's cans on the market that use perforated sheets too. 









Stuck mine in the bumper and use an electric solenoid valve to dump it at the push of a button


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## BoostedDubVR6T420 (Dec 4, 2009)

blackvento36 said:


> I'd get a different can, you need some baffling in there so the moisture condenses in the can and falls to the bottom. I never liked the idea of using steel wool though.
> 
> I use 2 pieces of perforated stainless to baffle mine, I'm sure there's cans on the market that use perforated sheets too.
> 
> ...


 Nice!:thumbup:


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## ForVWLife (Nov 12, 2004)

blackvento36 said:


> I'd get a different can, you need some baffling in there so the moisture condenses in the can and falls to the bottom. I never liked the idea of using steel wool though.
> 
> I use 2 pieces of perforated stainless to baffle mine, I'm sure there's cans on the market that use perforated sheets too.
> 
> ...


sowhat your saying is you have an oil slick button? :laugh:


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## Capt.Dreadz (Jun 4, 2003)

ForVWLife said:


> sowhat your saying is you have an oil slick button? :laugh:


Yea...slick HIMSELF into a tree :laugh:


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## dasbeast3.0 (Aug 15, 2007)

Get rid of the recirculation. No matter what you do some of it will always make its way into the compressor, I/C & piping and nasty it all up. Catch can with a breather works fine 4 me:thumbup:


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## BoostedDubVR6T420 (Dec 4, 2009)

dasbeast3.0 said:


> Get rid of the recirculation. No matter what you do some of it will always make its way into the compressor, I/C & piping and nasty it all up. Catch can with a breather works fine 4 me:thumbup:


X2, screw recirculation.


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## Pat @ Pitt Soundworks (Nov 14, 2008)

You guys are using open vent on a daily driver? How do you like the fumes? LOL


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## toy_vw (Feb 11, 2006)

some states have emissions testing..along with provinces in Canada and what we call the smog patrol..aka the MTO...those bastards look for things like atmosphere vented crankcase vents.

So I understand venting back into the intake, as thats what the manufacturer did...and thus is what the SMog police will be looking for.

Now If you vent down to the ground with a tube....then you wont get the smell associated with crank gases.

you can run PCV post turbo, with special PCV valves such as the ones found on SRT4's and NIssans turbo vehicles...but I dont recommend it and have done a few pre turbo vent swaps locally..simply because I dont trust the valves.


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## -:VW:- (Jan 27, 2006)

toy_vw said:


> Now If you vent down to the ground with a tube....then you wont get the smell associated with crank gases.


Oh yes you will... This is how mine currently is and if you sit still long enough you'll smell it. Actually it doesn't take long at all...


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## toy_vw (Feb 11, 2006)

tis...true..at a stop yes...but while driving...it wont be as bad as "filtering" it with a ghetto pcv filter...

but ya...valid point...im running mine with a tube to just under the passanger floor...and generally speaking..I barelly get a wiff of anything unless im reversing or stop and go traffic mid summer...


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## -:VW:- (Jan 27, 2006)

w3rd


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## lilnick (Feb 15, 2005)

i didnt say you cant . i said you dont


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## NumberOne 2nd2none (Jan 30, 2010)

So whats better??? Open vent or recirculate it to the regulator valve located on TIP?? :beer:


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## toy_vw (Feb 11, 2006)

NumberOne 2nd2none said:


> So whats better??? Open vent or recirculate it to the regulator valve located on TIP?? :beer:


its not like ones better then the other...really..keeping any garbage out of the engine and intake is best....but when done properlly, recirc. is barelly noticable..and the only legal choice...


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## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

So I have switched to a different weight oil (haven't driven the car yet to see if it helped.) I am still having an issue with this. I am now venting the catch can to atmosphere as I was sick of it getting into my intake. Unfortunately I get oil all over my engine bay when boosting. I realize some blowby is normal ( I plan on doing a compression/leak down.) Do I just need to add another valve cover breather? Any of you guys dealing with this issue? Here are some videos below, one idling and running, the other is with the car shutoff. The vapor coming out after its shut off - is that just oil cooking?


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## MRosier (Sep 17, 2006)

how are the rings?


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## sp_golf (Nov 28, 2007)

Sounds like the rings or ring lands
Do a compression and leak down test and I bet you'll find at least one cylinder is bad. The car starting to run rich is just that one or more cyl being down on compression.


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## TIGninja (Mar 21, 2010)

Gasoline or E85?


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## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

It is gasoline. So the car has about 900 miles on it. It is built with JE low comp pistons, Pauter rods, ARP hardware. The car was running rich originally because the oil in the intake tract would work its way onto the MAF and throw off the reading. Once it was cleaned it would run just fine and under boost would be high elevens on the A/F. I plan on doing a compression and leak down to rule in or out the rings. I hope its not that since the motor is brand new. The car acted similar to this before the motor was built.

Edit: Bit more information. 

I remember the first time the car was started after putting in the motor it continued to smoke after it was shut off. I figured it was all the assembly lube and such being burned off. It would smoke out of the intake since at the time it was recirculated. I have been a bit skeptical of the head since the start. A question I have is, should exhaust come out of the hole in the head in the picture below? When I put the turbo kit on I had the head rebuilt at the same time. When I had it all buttoned up and started, exhaust was coming out of the side of the head. Turns out the freeze plug was gone and when I called the shop they told me to just put a freeze plug back in. So I did and eventually noticed a bit of oil coming through hence the sealant on there. Does that seem normal? I can't find any cutaways or diagrams that show the inside of the head right there to see.


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## TIGninja (Mar 21, 2010)

nuclearaddict said:


> It is gasoline. So the car has about 900 miles on it. It is built with JE low comp pistons, Pauter rods, ARP hardware. The car was running rich originally because the oil in the intake tract would work its way onto the MAF and throw off the reading. Once it was cleaned it would run just fine and under boost would be high elevens on the A/F. I plan on doing a compression and leak down to rule in or out the rings. I hope its not that since the motor is brand new. The car acted similar to this before the motor was built.


Cars with forged pistons have alot more blowby then cast piston ones. I would vent to atmosphere.


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## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

I know they expand when heated up. Its a pain because when I hit boost it would shoot oil out of the catch can vent all over the engine bay. I have had to clean the bay twice and hope I don't have to every time I boost the car. I added steel wool into the catch can in a different way than I have in the past and just changed the oil with a slightly lower viscosity yesterday. But I haven't driven it since doing those things. If everything is as it should be then I will just deal with emptying the catch can every couple hundred miles, assuming the steel wool technique will trap all the oil before it explodes under my hood.


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## TIGninja (Mar 21, 2010)

nuclearaddict said:


> I know they expand when heated up. Its a pain because when I hit boost it would shoot oil out of the catch can vent all over the engine bay. I have had to clean the bay twice and hope I don't have to every time I boost the car. I added steel wool into the catch can in a different way than I have in the past and just changed the oil with a slightly lower viscosity yesterday. But I haven't driven it since doing those things. If everything is as it should be then I will just deal with emptying the catch can every couple hundred miles, assuming the steel wool technique will trap all the oil before it explodes under my hood.


Steel woll is very bad. It will eventually end up inside your engine.


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## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

Even when the can is not recirculated? The valve cover shouldn't have a vacuum at any point should it, if I am understanding it right.


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## sp_golf (Nov 28, 2007)

nuclearaddict said:


> I know they expand when heated up. Its a pain because when I hit boost it would shoot oil out of the catch can vent all over the engine bay. I have had to clean the bay twice and hope I don't have to every time I boost the car.


Too much blow by. The only time I've seen that much blow by from VRs is with cracked ring lands.
Do a leakdown test, it's probably the rings never seated properly or were gapped wrong.


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## TIGninja (Mar 21, 2010)

nuclearaddict said:


> Even when the can is not recirculated? The valve cover shouldn't have a vacuum at any point should it, if I am understanding it right.


it also sucks it out of the can and into the intake. That steel wool breaks apart into fibers alot easier then you would think.


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## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

Something I was thinking about. If the rings were not seated properly, wouldn't I get oil sucked into the combustion chamber on the intake stroke? I haven't seen any smoke out of the exhaust, only smoke/vapor out of the valve cover breather.


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## sp_golf (Nov 28, 2007)

nuclearaddict said:


> Something I was thinking about. If the rings were not seated properly, wouldn't I get oil sucked into the combustion chamber on the intake stroke? I haven't seen any smoke out of the exhaust, only smoke/vapor out of the valve cover breather.


Depends on which ring it is.. if the compression rings you'll get lots of blow by, especially in boost.


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## Gigitt (May 26, 2004)

try using stainless steel scourer as a baffle media - it is made of nice thick ribons of stainless steel.

steel wool is fine and worse off as it will rust and brake down - potentially some fibres can be sucked back into the intake.


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## nuclearaddict (Feb 1, 2002)

Update:

168-175PSI across all cylinders and 4-5% leakdown across all cylinders as well. My search for why I am getting smoke out the breather continues. It is just vapor at first, once it warms up smoke comes out of the breather on acceleration and under boost. Any ideas from you guys of what to look at?


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## vergessen wir es (May 12, 2010)

Is the vapor coming out under normal or increased pressure. Once, due to a sensor problem I was running very hot and it looked the same. Never saw it on the water temps. There was only normal crankcase pressure behind the smoke because it was the heat causing the smoking. Once the overheat condition was fixed no more smoking. Even with recirc I wouldn't expect to smell oil out the exhaust once fully warmed up.


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

Gigitt said:


> try using stainless steel scourer as a baffle media - it is made of nice thick ribons of stainless steel.
> 
> steel wool is fine and worse off as it will rust and brake down - potentially some fibres can be sucked back into the intake.


100% correct, you get a big metal rusty oily mess after awhile.
There are SS cleaning pads which are thick ribboned pads which work much better.

In my experience, some of the best media to use is aftermarket air intake material. If you had an old cone (or K&N pannel) filter or something, that material seperates oil vapor very well.


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## wabbitGTl (Jan 2, 2007)

here's what I'm going to be running. seems to be a pretty good solution to most of these issues. i just put a filter on one of the ports and have a petcock on the bottom to empty it. 

http://www.efiexpress.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=3&products_id=52


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