# NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE.



## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

Dear all my 2.5L driving peoples.

The prototype is almost complete!
Testing will be taking place over the next couple weeks, so NST can make sure we're getting the best pulley.
Wish me luck people!!!! =]
WE NEED THIS!
P.S.
Thanks to all the people that have posted in my thread, and believed in the people over at NST. I really appreciate the support. =]


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## Snow-Jet-MK5 (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (iiktownii)*


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## KoF (Jun 24, 2006)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (iiktownii)*

keep us updated http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## VWguy73 (Dec 20, 2000)

this is exciting!


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## bweed83 (Feb 25, 2007)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (iiktownii)*

am i wrong but wouldnt you want to have a normal size pulley for the crank and underdrive all the accesories and just have the crank pulley be ligthweight? im guessing this is just a typo or im totaly off base?


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## esp (Jun 11, 2007)

can someone explain what this does for newbs like me


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (bweed83)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bweed83* »_am i wrong but wouldnt you want to have a normal size pulley for the crank and underdrive all the accesories and just have the crank pulley be ligthweight? im guessing this is just a typo or im totaly off base?

what do you mean?
the NST Underdrive Crank Pulley is lightweight, thats where the gains come from.
The OEM 2.5L pulley weighs 65 oz. the NST pulley will be in the 20's.
Check the NST websites for information of what they do and how they get it done.
http://www.nonstoptuning.com


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (esp)*


_Quote, originally posted by *esp* »_can someone explain what this does for newbs like me 

Check out the NST website.
http://www.nonstoptuning.com
They explain EVERYTHING there.


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

I'm running 800 watts in the trunk. Is this pulley not for me?


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## Snow-Jet-MK5 (Jan 20, 2006)

*Re: (dumbassmozart)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_I'm running 800 watts in the trunk. Is this pulley not for me?

Your probably going to want the alternator pulley. It raises the voltage by at least 1. If they come out with that i'll probably pick it up too since I have over 1000w in my trunk.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (esp)*


_Quote, originally posted by *esp* »_can someone explain what this does for newbs like me 

Nothing but cause long term problems.If volkswagen did not feel the crankshaft was supposed to have a harmonic balancer they would not have implimented one into the stock unit.
Why is it that every single time a new engine is released people feel the need to do the following:
* CAI
* Under drive pulley's
* "headers"
thinking that it is actually going to help.


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

they do help. if you're happy with your stock heap that's great. you offered nothing to back up your statement except a vague contempt. go admire your warranty.


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## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Nothing but cause long term problems.If volkswagen did not feel the crankshaft was supposed to have a harmonic balancer they would not have implimented one into the stock unit

So you are implying that without this piece of mechanical trickery the engine will run alot more coarse and not be as balanced without it, correct? And how do you know if the NST package does not integrate one onto their pulley or if the kit calls for you to reuse the stock unit? Did you talk to NST and ask them? Just curious how you "know" that tid bit of information. And actually, a CAI really does help on this motor since the stock unit is so bad.
Ok for all you true believers, I spoke with an NST representative and they said they are currently in the testing phase and will be undergoing testing during the next 3-4 weeks. This will essentially start as a crankshaft pulley only (not a complete underdrive kit). They said they plan to go into full production by the fall and intend to have this product available within the next 3 months. Yay! They also said to keep checking back on their website regularly because they will be updating it with new pictures, crank pulley specs, and release dates very soon!


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (dumbassmozart)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_they do help.

You know this because you have tested them correct?Of course its going to show MINIMAL gains as your lightening the rotating mass,but @ what cost?Tests were carried out on an underdrive aluminum pulley kit from Neuspeed and the results were not surprising....dyno comparison here.....(CLICK ME)

_Quote, originally posted by *dumbassmozart* »_go admire your warranty.

Do yourself a favour and research what I have posted on this website before you put your foot in your mouth.

_Quote, originally posted by *_V-Dubber_* »_
So you are implying that without this piece of mechanical trickery the engine will run alot more coarse and not be as balanced without it, correct? And how do you know if the NST package does not integrate one onto their pulley or if the kit calls for you to reuse the stock unit? Did you talk to NST and ask them? Just curious how you "know" that tid bit of information. And actually, a CAI really does help on this motor since the stock unit is so bad.

I actually know nothing about NST the company.They could build superior products for all I know.
What I do know is that VW/Audi engineers place a beefy harmonic balancer onto the stock crankshaft pulley.Research what the effects of not having a harmonic balancer could do.VIBRATION can be a real bitch.Long term effects include increased wear on the connecting rod bearings & main bearings.I bet all you new "2007" members will be crying @ the dealers door when you find out you have to pay for the engine repairs...


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## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

I admit it. You're right. If you screw up the balance of the engine then yeah thats bad. But NST says the only ways they differ from the stock pulley(s) is because theirs is made out of aluminum rather than steel or cast iron, which makes them lighter and lowers the amount of energy the engine needs to generate in order to turn them. Thus resulting in more freed up horsepower that the engine can now deliver to the transmission. But I think they also said the crank pulley was underdrived as well meaning it turns slower than stock, duh. But even if they did eliminate this mechanical balance piece built into the stock crank pulley, if the pulley only spun half as fast wouldnt that cancel out any added roughness generated by the "unbalanced" pulley? And I clicked that link you supplied and some of the people argued that the balance is only there to quell underhood noise and not necessarily to counterbalance anything. But neither one of us can be sure of its true purpose since neither one of us designed the car.
I think what I am gonna do is talk to NST again tomorrow and ask them whether or not they were aware that the 2.5 has a harmonic balance piece built into the stock crank pulley and if they eliminated it entirely or if they have one on their new pulley. And if they eliminated it, I will voice our concerns and tell them we are worried this would upset the balance of the engine and thus installing their product would do more harm than good to our engines. I'll let you know what they say guys!


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## dumbassmozart (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
You know this because you have tested them correct?Of course its going to show MINIMAL gains as your lightening the rotating mass.

sure an underdrive pulley isn't going to do anything stellar to your car. don't say that a CAI and headers are useless to an admitted "newb" asking a question. not everyone is on your superior wavelength yet.


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## dazekiel (Sep 11, 2006)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Why is it that every single time a new engine is released people feel the need to do the following:
* CAI
* Under drive pulley's
* "headers"
thinking that it is actually going to help.


And why is it there are always people that feel that if they don't do something, it must not be worthwhile? And THEN feel compelled to open their virtual mouths to pontificate about it, trying to make the people that DO do it seem like idiots.
Despite your undoubtedly impressive knowledge and experience gained over your 5 to 7 years of driving, the parts you are maligning have been in use for a long time in the motor-sport industry. 
To counter your dyno chart, here is another.. 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...ge=10
Unlike you I won't imply that every CAI is going to give substantial gains because this one does (or will...when it gets finished!). The truth is. Not all designs are create equal, not all engines respond the same to each type of mod. If you look around I bet you can find an engine that makes great gains from a pulley, and one that shows minimal improvements from a CAI. Heck, look at one for a Toyota Matrix XRS. I got very minor gains from a CAI on mine, (though it DID make the engine easier to live despite such modest improvements).
So, dude, sit back. Relax.







Have a beer.







We are all dubbers here!
btw I have none of the mods referenced in this post. As a newly engaged, instant Daddy, I have found my funds to have gains even worse than the pulley dyno you linked!


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

why is it that theres always a jackass in one of these threads that wants to ruin it for everyone? 
IM THE DRIVER OF THE FIRST 2.5 THATS GOING TO HAVE THIS PULLEY IN MY ENGINE.
LET ME BE THE ONE TO SAY IF IT HELPS OR IF IT DOESNT. OR IF EVERYTHING IS SCREWED UP OR WHATEVER MAN. JUST WAIT TIL I GET IT ON AND WE DO THE TESTING UNTIL THEN GO FIND SOMETHING ELSE TO SCREW WITH.
FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO ARE INTERESTED, ONCE AGAIN THANK YOU.
AND V DUBBER, THANKS FOR BACKING UP NST. 
THIS WAS MY IDEA. I WENT TO NST AND ASKED WHAT THEY THOUGHT ABOUT THIS PROJECT. IF I DIDNT TRUST THESE GUYS, I WOULDNT HAVE POSTED THIS THREAD OR ANY OTHER THING CONNECTED TO NST.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dazekiel* »_Not all designs are create equal, not all engines respond the same to each type of mod.

An engine is an air pump.Its design has not changed in 100 years...you want to do your 2.5 a favour,get it chip tuned to change the mapping of the stock ecu.THEN do the other modifications.
My post above was worded wrong,you guys should be saving your $$ for when a true tested FI kit becomes available.That way a CAI,an exhaust system,etc will really prove beneficial to you.

_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_why is it that theres always a jackass in one of these threads that wants to ruin it for everyone?

Jackass?
No need for that kind of language on this website.When I was fixing volkswagens you were 10 years old.








Unless you plan on engaging in a meaty discussion then pipe down and learn rather than asking a company for free parts.
Why dont you guys try drilling or boring the centre's of your camshafts?How about making your flywheels 1lb?Its all good for lightening up the parts right?








Gotta love vortex @ times.Everyone and there mother can now modify this engine.This will be my last post in this thread.Excuse me while I have better projects to work on.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
An engine is an air pump.Its design has not changed in 100 years...you want to do your 2.5 a favour,get it chip tuned to change the mapping of the stock ecu.THEN do the other modifications.
My post above was worded wrong,you guys should be saving your $$ for when a true tested FI kit becomes available.That way a CAI,an exhaust system,etc will really prove beneficial to you.
Jackass?
No need for that kind of language on this website.When I was fixing volkswagens you were 10 years old.








Unless you plan on engaging in a meaty discussion then pipe down and learn rather than asking a company for free parts.
Why dont you guys try drilling or boring the centre's of your camshafts?How about making your flywheels 1lb?Its all good for lightening up the parts right?








Gotta love vortex @ times.Everyone and there mother can now modify this engine.This will be my last post in this thread.Excuse me while I have better projects to work on.


yeah man i can understand that youve fixed/worked on your set of cars.
but people learn from their mistakes.
therefore let them make their mistakes, if buying this pulley will be one. and learn not to invest money into this performance part or whatever again.
dont try to convince them otherwise, this isnt speech & debate.


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## esp (Jun 11, 2007)

So is there a downside to underdrive crank pullies?


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## p c (Oct 26, 2006)

*Re: (esp)*


_Quote, originally posted by *esp* »_So is there a downside to underdrive crank pullies?

They are bad. End of story...
here is some good reading regarding them:
http://www.machv.com/tip11cranpul.html


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## VW_tayder (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: (p c)*

can someone post a pic of this "balancer" last i checked most newer cars were interanlly balanced and the only thing on the end of the crank is a pulley. thats all that was on the end of my vr6 and my buddies 1.8t
even my sb chevy was interally balanced and the only thing there was something that resembled a balancer and was only used to check timing.


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## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (VW_tayder)*

Last I heard, correct me if I'm wrong, the 2.5L 5-cylinder didn't have/need any balance shafts or "harmonic balancers" or anything of that nature? It's only the 2.0T FSI that needs them


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (VW_tayder)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VW_tayder* »_can someone post a pic of this "balancer" last i checked most newer cars were interanlly balanced and the only thing on the end of the crank is a pulley. thats all that was on the end of my vr6 and my buddies 1.8t
even my sb chevy was interally balanced and the only thing there was something that resembled a balancer and was only used to check timing.

you are correct, so is V Dubber.
newer cars are internally balanced.
i started off knowing nothing about pulleys and the balancer stuff.
but thosse of you who believe "pulleys are bad"
just check out the NST website. which is http://www.nonstoptuning.com
it doesnt hurt to read.
they specialize in pulleys.
why would they research and develop something thats "bad" for your car?
be serious.


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## VW_tayder (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

so then what is everyones problem..its just a pulley...not brain surgury ppl. pretty sure its just one of those vortex legends that start with one of the "lead sheep" and everyone beleives him cuz he/she is cool...i will def be ordering pulleys when they come out


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_
newer cars are internally balanced.

Again...you have no understanding of the basic concepts.They are balanced as a system.Remove a component of said system and you affect the balance.Mechanics 1002...take a course in it.
This is what a stock pulley looks like:








See that big black ring?Thats the harmonic balancer....you will not find a 10s Honda Civic B18C,etc with a "lightweight" or "under drive" crank pulley.Infact you will find the opposite where companies/privateers spend $100's on aftermarket crankshaft pulley's with harmonic balancers that suite there needs.One such company is Fluidampr which I am 200% positive has ALOT more experience than you in this field








Infact this is what they have to say:

_Quote, originally posted by *Fluidampr* »_
Why your engine needs a damper
Each time the air/fuel mixture inside a cylinder is ignited, the combustion that occurs creates a torque spike that is applied to the crankshaft through the piston and rod. This torque spike is so severe that it not only turns the crankshaft, it actually twists the crankshaft ahead of its normal rotation and then the crankshaft rebounds. This twisting action is known as torsional vibration. *When these torque spikes and forces get into phase with the natural frequency, critical torsional harmonic vibrations occur and can be seriously destructive to the bearings and the crankshaft. Dampers are designed to control those destructive vibrations.*










Good Luck with your pulley but I wont let this thread go into the archives without adding some useful content.


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## p c (Oct 26, 2006)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

okay we will just have to see.
but when it is installed, the gains are good, and there are no problems, i dont want to hear anything.
If you are correct and there is a problem. Then so be it, next time i pick up on something so "stupid" ill ask for your advice. Thanks for sharing your information though.


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## VW_tayder (Oct 4, 2005)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

ok . great info..but i'm still gonna do it..i have seen way to many ppl do this and NEVER have a problem. not to mention i have done it my self and never had a problem. 
thanks for lookin out though.








btw how long does it take for this damage to take effect? i have driven cars that have had pulley kits on them for 60k and they were fine.


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## Kooder (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: (VW_tayder)*

you may have seen this on many other cars, but how many of them had an odd number of cylinders? in the case of our 2.5s, the ignition pattern goes 2 cylinders, then 3. Since it is not 2 then 2 or 4 then 4 like a i4 or v8, there is already an unbalance in the crank. this is why the 2.5 needs a harmonic balancer while other new cars are internally balanced.


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## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (Kooder)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Kooder* »_ in the case of our 2.5s, the ignition pattern goes *2 cylinders, then 3* 

Actually, ours goes 1-2, 4-5, 3. So its more like 2, 2, 1.
So a few weeks ago I started emailing NST with our concerns right? And then a week ago, the frickin president emails me and is like "I've personally read over your inquiries and I feel it would be better if we talked in real time." I was like







because how many presidents do you know will talk directly to their consumer? Usually its just some representative that emails you back. Not this time. 
So I chatted with Mike, president of NST for over two hours a week ago. And I told him alot of things. I told him that we're concerned about damages to our engines and we're afraid that if his design eliminates and doesn't incorporate this "harmonic balancer" we keep speaking of, that it would potentially damage our engines. I told him that ya know the 2.5 community is weary these days because I remember months ago when the aftermarket for these cars was almost bone-dry. And finally VWPartsMTL came out with an intake and everyone bought it up because that was all there was avaialble at the time. And then it had alot of problems. And then VF CAI was said to have CELs and the Carbonio had installation and quality issues. So I made it clear to him that we feel cheated and lied to. And that we felt somewhat duped by companies selling substandard products. And now the deciding factor for us these days is quality and reliability. And I said quality is more important to us than maximum power gains. And I asked how he planned to maintain the integrity of our engines.
Here is what he replied. First of all, it's true our engine is internally balanced. There is *NO* harmonic balancer on the end of our crankshaft pulley. There is however something called a harmonic damper. This is basically used to lower NVH (noise vibration harshness). It's basically a piece of rubber that goes around the pulley like a rubber band and is less than 1/8" thick. It hardly does anything and in a few years it'll be so worn and weathered that it wont be capable of doing it's job anyway. Many cars report running smoother after installing NST products. And even if removing it makes the engine slightly louder let me just say this. Our 2.5s are already pretty loud stock. And secondly, the average enthusiast is willing to put up with a little more noise in exchange for more performance anyway. Intakes and exhausts anyone? Furthermore, how much of your engine's lifespan is going to be spent at redline? I'm guessing not very much at all, espescially if these Rabbits and Jettas are your daily drivers. And I could understand you being worried about your engine having too much internal vibrations but I think it's more of a concern for a 500bhp 12,000 RPM race car that spends almost its entire life under full-throttle acceleration and is constantly at or approaching redline. But our cars have what is it again? 150hp and can only rev up to 5,800RPM before we bounce off the redline?
If you still don't believe me or anything Mike has said, check out what other people are saying about NST products. I DARE YOU to find one single person who has something negative to say about the NST products on their car. Here are some links to check out. http://www.scionlife.com/forum...wners http://www.yarisworld.com/foru...ge=14
Believe me, I talked to the guy and I have never met a president as dedicated to his customers as Mike. He listened to everything I had to say and responded politely and professionally to each of my inquiries and concerns and addressed them appropriately. Nor have I ever seen a president willing to talk directly to their customers in real time. Can you talk to the president of HKS or Revo Technik or OSIR or APR right now? I highly doubt it. Though you can surely get a hold of a measely representative








I think NST's interest in our engine is a good thing. Think about this. NST was the first to release pulley kits for the Scion tC. And that was a brand new car (albeit not with an all new engine) and those owners had the same problem. There was scant to make their tCs go faster. But look at the tC market now. It's practically exploded. Heck, TEIN has a Scion tC as a company car! More interest in our motor will only encourage other manufacturers to release more products for our engine. Why? Competition. If NST comes out with pulley kits, then surely others will and soon we will have a market explosion for the 2.5. Hopefully NST can do for us as they did for the tC or the Yaris. And don't be so worried about your engine being destroyed because Mike understands your concerns and will surely take them into account during the design and testing phase. Obviously NST will not release a piece of junk to the public and jeopardize their reputation. And the success or failure of this depends solely on us guys. If this product does well, NST will absolutely make more products for our cars (this is from Mike himself). But if the response to their product is poor, then they will have no choice but to explore other viable markets. So if this crankshaft pulley is something that interests you, don't listen to the nay-sayers and let NST help you to enjoy your 2.5 just that much more!
P.S. Testing of several different prototypes will conclude by the end of this month. Then expect to see this product for sale within the next two months. Target release date is early fall. Keep checking NST's website as they will be adding new pictures, prices, and specs very soon!


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## esp (Jun 11, 2007)

+1 for NST customer service!


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (esp)*


_Quote, originally posted by *esp* »_+1 for NST customer service!

Thanks man, ill let them know.
They really do answer ANY QUESTION you ask them.
Anyways people!
The prototype is finished! 
here are some pictures from Mike @ NST.
btw the NST pulley weighs 20 oz. opposed to the OEM pulley that weighs 65 0z.








also the NST pulley will cost around $150. 
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h168/ktown******/VW25-B.jpg
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h168/ktown******/VW25-A.jpg




_Modified by iiktownii at 6:28 PM 9-18-2007_


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## Rh3017 (Sep 8, 2003)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

i hate to sound like a noob but does that pic show the stock and the new ones... they look different sizes, which is the red and which is the black one.


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## Reflex-Rabbit (Jul 7, 2007)

What's the estimated installation time? How hard ( can an amateur do this?)


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (Rh3017)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rh3017* »_i hate to sound like a noob but does that pic show the stock and the new ones... they look different sizes, which is the red and which is the black one.

good question.
The stock (OEM) pullley is the giant black one and the NST pulley is the shiny red one


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (Reflex-Rabbit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Reflex-Rabbit* »_What's the estimated installation time? How hard ( can an amateur do this?)

Ill get back to you on that 'cause im not really sure, I'm gonna have to ask Mike @ NST.


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## blackoutjetta (Jul 3, 2006)

so if i have a 1200 subwoofer system will this be a bad thing (more light dimming, less power) or what// thanks


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## MattWayMK5 (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: (blackoutjetta)*

Bump for an update


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## soon2bw (Jan 22, 2006)

why don't they just make a stock size pully but lightwieght. =(


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (Reflex-Rabbit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Reflex-Rabbit* »_What's the estimated installation time? How hard ( can an amateur do this?)

Installation time should be less than one hour for anyone with a good set of tools. 
All that is required is the removal of 5 bolts that hold the pulley in place, replace with the NST pulley, and install the new belt. 
NST will also have the new belt number listed on their website. 
You can pick up the new belt at any AutoZone, Oreilly, PepBoys, Napa, etc parts store for about $15.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (soon2bw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *soon2bw* »_why don't they just make a stock size pully but lightwieght. =(


Why does it matter?
NST's pulley is smaller in diameter and lighter in weight, a 15% underdrive.
Which is good.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (blackoutjetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blackoutjetta* »_so if i have a 1200 subwoofer system will this be a bad thing (more light dimming, less power) or what// thanks

No it will not. 
The NST crank pulley is a 15% Underdrive Pulley. 
This amount of underdriving is considered minimal when compared to many other pulleys (30+ %) built by other pulley companies in the past.
So you wont need to worry unless you have a MASSIVE system.
MASSIVE = 3000+ watts.


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## racinrabbit12 (Apr 27, 2007)

Bump for an update.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (racinrabbit12)*

NST has started production on the Underdrive Crank Pulley. Red, Blue, and Graphite Gray pulleys will be ready for sale within the next couple months.
Target price is currently set at $125.
Keep an eye on the website, over the next couple
weeks, for a new page for the Rabbit. This page will have product info, weight comparisons, pricing, and ETA listed.
Dynos will be up soon!


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## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

Sweet dude! Can't wait. Thanks for keeping us posted Kev!


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## dee ess kay (Dec 30, 2004)

*Re: (_V-Dubber_)*


_Quote, originally posted by *_V-Dubber_* »_I admit it. You're right. If you screw up the balance of the engine then yeah thats bad. *But NST says *the only ways they differ from the stock pulley(s) is because theirs is made out of aluminum rather than steel or cast iron, which makes them lighter and lowers the amount of energy the engine needs to generate in order to turn them. Thus resulting in more freed up horsepower that the engine can now deliver to the transmission. But *I think they also said* the crank pulley was underdrived as well meaning it turns slower than stock, duh. But even if they did eliminate this mechanical balance piece built into the stock crank pulley, if the pulley only spun half as fast wouldnt that cancel out any added roughness generated by the "unbalanced" pulley? And I clicked that link you supplied and some of the people argued that the balance is only there to quell underhood noise and not necessarily to counterbalance anything. But neither one of us can be sure of its true purpose since neither one of us designed the car.
I think what I am gonna do is talk to NST again tomorrow and ask them whether or not they were aware that the 2.5 has a harmonic balance piece built into the stock crank pulley and if they eliminated it entirely or if they have one on their new pulley. And if they eliminated it, I will voice our concerns and tell them we are worried this would upset the balance of the engine and thus installing their product would do more harm than good to our engines. I'll let you know what they say guys!


NST said add a turbo to your exhaust cause it's better to run it there


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## dee ess kay (Dec 30, 2004)

*Re: (dazekiel)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dazekiel* »_
And why is it there are always people that feel that if they don't do something, it must not be worthwhile? And THEN feel compelled to open their virtual mouths to pontificate about it, trying to make the people that DO do it seem like idiots.
Despite your undoubtedly impressive knowledge and experience gained over your 5 to 7 years of driving, the parts you are maligning have been in use for a long time in the motor-sport industry. 
To counter your dyno chart, here is another.. 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...ge=10
Unlike you I won't imply that every CAI is going to give substantial gains because this one does (or will...when it gets finished!). The truth is. Not all designs are create equal, not all engines respond the same to each type of mod. If you look around I bet you can find an engine that makes great gains from a pulley, and one that shows minimal improvements from a CAI. Heck, look at one for a Toyota Matrix XRS. I got very minor gains from a CAI on mine, (though it DID make the engine easier to live despite such modest improvements).
So, dude, sit back. Relax.







Have a beer.







We are all dubbers here!
btw I have none of the mods referenced in this post. As a newly engaged, instant Daddy, I have found my funds to have gains even worse than the pulley dyno you linked!









you know what...i honestly think that everyone is getting too amped up over the fact that a CAI was able to net some gains on the 2.5L. I honestly think that the only reasons why we are able to gain such a gain from a CAI is because of our stock airbox restriction. I mean ****....throw a K&N drop in, im sure you will net some gains as well.


----------



## dee ess kay (Dec 30, 2004)

*Re: (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_why is it that theres always a jackass in one of these threads that wants to ruin it for everyone? 
IM THE DRIVER OF THE FIRST 2.5 THATS GOING TO HAVE THIS PULLEY IN MY ENGINE.
LET ME BE THE ONE TO SAY IF IT HELPS OR IF IT DOESNT. OR IF EVERYTHING IS SCREWED UP OR WHATEVER MAN. JUST WAIT TIL I GET IT ON AND WE DO THE TESTING UNTIL THEN GO FIND SOMETHING ELSE TO SCREW WITH.
FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO ARE INTERESTED, ONCE AGAIN THANK YOU.
AND V DUBBER, THANKS FOR BACKING UP NST. 
THIS WAS MY IDEA. I WENT TO NST AND ASKED WHAT THEY THOUGHT ABOUT THIS PROJECT. IF I DIDNT TRUST THESE GUYS, I WOULDNT HAVE POSTED THIS THREAD OR ANY OTHER THING CONNECTED TO NST. 


ill sell you a tanabe hypermedallion for your rabbit....NST said you could gain at least 80whp and 615wtq from it


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## dee ess kay (Dec 30, 2004)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_

yeah man i can understand that youve fixed/worked on your set of cars.
but people learn from their mistakes.
therefore let them make their mistakes, if buying this pulley will be one. and learn not to invest money into this performance part or whatever again.
dont try to convince them otherwise, this isnt speech & debate. 


well he's here to try and save you guys from making that mistake, is he wrong for that? If you read what you typed, can you not say it sounds kind of ignorant? "No i dont care if you're right, just let us f*ck it up first".


----------



## dee ess kay (Dec 30, 2004)

*Re: (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_okay we will just have to see.
but when it is installed, the gains are good, and there are no problems, i dont want to hear anything.
If you are correct and there is a problem. Then so be it, next time i pick up on something so "stupid" ill ask for your advice. Thanks for sharing your information though. 


lol i don't see why people have so much ego in themselves. Ignorance is the key work here. I hope you have at least 4-5grand after you screw your motor up.....all that for a pulley


----------



## MattWayMK5 (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: (dee ess kay)*

Everyone talks so much smack on here. If you wanna take the risk go for it, if it works out best of luck and if not tough luck. Just becuase you personally dont wanna try it yourself dosent mean you have to gang up on people who are willing to. People can make their own decisions and if it turns out to be a mistake then there is no one to blame but themselves, but all the haters need to calm themselves talking how its gonna cost so much to rebuild their engine when it breaks. You dont have to worry about it so keep your two cents to yourself


----------



## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (dee ess kay)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dee ess kay* »_
lol i don't see why people have so much ego in themselves. Ignorance is the key work here. I hope you have at least 4-5grand after you screw your motor up.....all that for a pulley










I'm not going to sit here and waste my time on you.
All i have to say is just wait and see.
If you're right, so be it.
Ill pay more attention to things next time.


----------



## racinrabbit12 (Apr 27, 2007)

Not to be a martyr or anything but an underdrive pulley is not going to screw up your car. All it does is take power away from your accessories (A/C compressor etc) and return it to the wheels. Its not that hard to understand. I had an underdrive kit on my '03 ford ranger and nothing happened to that. So im giving big ups to NST and iiktownii for sticking with this project and i cant wait for it to be released.


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## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

Well I'm excited about it, but I do wanna see what others have to say about its operation first. If it gets a thumbs up, I'm definitely in!


----------



## Jimmy Russells (Feb 4, 2007)

*Re: (Kooder)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Kooder* »_you may have seen this on many other cars, but how many of them had an odd number of cylinders? in the case of our 2.5s, the ignition pattern goes 2 cylinders, then 3. Since it is not 2 then 2 or 4 then 4 like a i4 or v8, there is already an unbalance in the crank. this is why the 2.5 needs a harmonic balancer while other new cars are internally balanced. 

I may be wrong on this, but I HIGHLY doubt any new cars (other than very expensive stuff) are using an internal balance. Very expensive, and under 7000 RPM or so, not really necessary. Even with an internal balance, a car still has a harmonic balancer... It just doesn't have an imbalance built into it.


----------



## corradoken (Jan 19, 2003)

*Re: (RedRabidRabbit)*

Almost no new cars are internally balanced, it's too expensive. IIRC, The advantage to external balance is that the crankshaft pulley/dampener and flywheel/pressure plate can be replaced without needing a full rebalance. Most dealers don't want to drop the internals just to do a clutch. Also, all the new VW engines, from the base 2.5L up to the Touaregs and Phaetons, all of them have vibration dampeners on their crankshaft pulleys.
I'm sure a good company who makes pulleys would be sure to include a vibration dampener and would properly balance their pulleys. If not, they just aren't serious about their products.


----------



## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (corradoken)*

Actually, the 2.5 is internally balanced despite what some people may think or say. No, there is not a harmonic balancer on our crankshaft pulley. There is, however, a harmonic damper, but it's only there to reduce noise and harshness and not necessarily prevent the engine from meltdown and jackhammering itself apart. You shouldn't worry about removing this piece though. 
Think about it: The 2.5 is lightyears ahead of the old 1.8T I'm coming from in terms of refinement. 5,000 RPM is smooth as butter whereas a megere 2,500-3,000RPM in the old 1.8T and you could definitely feel a vibration in the wheel. This just doesnt happen with the 2.5.
There's always going to be someone telling you what you should and shouldn't do to your car. But guess what? It's just that: *Your* car, not theirs. So do whatever you want as long as it makes you happy and don't worry about what anyone else thinks.


----------



## travis3265 (Nov 15, 2003)

*Re: (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_Dynos will be up soon! 

aside from all the jibbber-jabber....i have a serious question.
when can we expect the dyno? soon is a very relative term.


----------



## Jimmy Russells (Feb 4, 2007)

*Re: (_V-Dubber_)*


_Quote, originally posted by *_V-Dubber_* »_*Actually, the 2.5 is internally balanced* despite what some people may think or say. No, there is not a harmonic balancer on our crankshaft pulley. There is, however, a harmonic damper, but it's only there to reduce noise and harshness and not necessarily prevent the engine from meltdown and jackhammering itself apart. You shouldn't worry about removing this piece though. 
Think about it: The 2.5 is lightyears ahead of the old 1.8T I'm coming from in terms of refinement. 5,000 RPM is smooth as butter whereas a megere 2,500-3,000RPM in the old 1.8T and you could definitely feel a vibration in the wheel. This just doesnt happen with the 2.5.
There's always going to be someone telling you what you should and shouldn't do to your car. But guess what? It's just that: *Your* car, not theirs. So do whatever you want as long as it makes you happy and don't worry about what anyone else thinks.

Do you have a link to proof of this? I just can't see it being the case for such a low revving motor.


----------



## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (RedRabidRabbit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RedRabidRabbit* »_
Do you have a link to proof of this? I just can't see it being the case for such a low revving motor. 

This is the consensus of most 2.5ers on Vortex, Mike @ NST and I asked one of the techs, the parts manager, the service department manager and service advisor at my local dealer and they all said no, it doesn't have one.
Hey Kev, when you get this thing on your car, can you take a picture of the stock pulley removed to either confirm or deny the existence of a harmonic balancer?


----------



## Jimmy Russells (Feb 4, 2007)

*Re: (_V-Dubber_)*


_Quote, originally posted by *_V-Dubber_* »_
This is the consensus of most 2.5ers on Vortex, Mike @ NST and I asked one of the techs, the parts manager, the service department manager and service advisor at my local dealer and they all said no, it doesn't have one.
Hey Kev, when you get this thing on your car, can you take a picture of the stock pulley removed to either confirm or deny the existence of a harmonic balancer?

I've seriously never heard of a motor that did not have a balancer. Maybe I am way behind the times, but my old n/a 690 horse internally balanced small block Ford still had a balancer, and the balancing cost me $1500. This was three years ago. I have seen the damper integrated into the pulley before though.


----------



## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (travis3265)*


_Quote, originally posted by *travis3265* »_
aside from all the jibbber-jabber....i have a serious question.
when can we expect the dyno? soon is a very relative term.


expect dynos in a couple weeks to a month.


----------



## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (_V-Dubber_)*

Finally I can let it alllllll out.









I've had the NST Underdrive crank pulley on my car for almost 3 weeks now.
I was asked to wait and see how things go with the pulley on my car, before I told anyone i had it on.
Well its great, i feel the pull. i feel the horses. i feel the torque. throttle response is much quicker. 
I havent had any problems whatsoever.
All this "balancer" stuff that these folks are talking about.
Our cars are internally balanced, so it doesnt affect us.
Like i said.
Dynos will be up soon.
I have two pics of the pulley on my car.
I will post them when i get home.
Thanks,
are trust me guys. ITS WORTH IT.



_Modified by iiktownii at 6:57 AM 10-12-2007_


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

V DUBBER:
I have the OEM pulley sitting in my closet.
I will take pictures of it as soon as i get home.


----------



## kaner05jetta (Dec 16, 2006)

how much is this?


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (kaner05jetta)*

Not more than $125


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## kaner05jetta (Dec 16, 2006)

that's a good price.

I think. Well, anything that gives me horsepower that's under $300 is a good price for me


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (kaner05jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kaner05jetta* »_that's a good price.

I think. Well, anything that gives me horsepower that's under $300 is a good price for me










lol it's worth it man, i promise.


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## ENRGZR (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

i will definitely be getting one of these.


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## kaner05jetta (Dec 16, 2006)

So, Mr. NST Pulley Expert from Houston, TX...
when can I buy this thing?


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## DaVisionz (Jun 25, 2007)

*Re: (kaner05jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kaner05jetta* »_So, Mr. NST Pulley Expert from Houston, TX...
when can I buy this thing?

you can't yet... but I'd imagine once you can, that information will be provided ;-)


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## kaner05jetta (Dec 16, 2006)

He has one, so I thought he'd know


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## _V-Dubber_ (Jan 30, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_ Well its great, i feel the pull. i feel the horses. i feel the torque. throttle response is much quicker. 
I havent had any problems whatsoever.
All this "balancer" stuff that these folks are talking about.
Our cars are internally balanced, so it doesnt affect us.
Like i said.
Dynos will be up soon.
I have two pics of the pulley on my car.
I will post them when i get home.
Thanks,
are trust me guys. ITS WORTH IT.


Sweet dude, glad to know your car is still running strong after the install. Like someone else said earlier, adding extra ponies and lb-ft for something like $125 ain't bad at all. And there aren't any noticeable added vibrations being transmitted into the steering wheel or interior and the engine isn't "bucking" anymore than usual?
Did you do the install yourself or did Evolution Tuning do it for you? If you did it yourself, how easy/difficult is the installation process? Time to complete the task for an amateur enthusiast like me and not some mechanical savant?

_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_
V DUBBER:
I have the OEM pulley sitting in my closet.
I will take pictures of it as soon as i get home.


Finally we can dispel this rumor once and for all and put everyone's mind, including my own, at ease.
So any word from Mike for a target release date? I know he said early fall, but does that mean early fall as in by the end of October or as in sometime in November? And is NST going to offer this product for sale directly from them (off their website) or is it going to be sold through dealers? Any special pricebreak for Vortexers?


----------



## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (_V-Dubber_)*

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h168/ktown******/100_2042.gif
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h168/ktown******/100_2041.gif
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h168/ktown******/100_2040.gif
Here are some better pictures of the OEM underdrive crank pulley, I don't see any harmonic balancer, do any of you?








_Modified by iiktownii at 3:55 PM 10-16-2007_


_Modified by iiktownii at 4:03 PM 10-16-2007_


----------



## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (_V-Dubber_)*


_Quote, originally posted by *_V-Dubber_* »_
And there aren't any noticeable added vibrations being transmitted into the steering wheel or interior and the engine isn't "bucking" anymore than usual?


Nope, actually ride is much smoother. Hard to explain how cause the ride was smooth also with the OEM pulley, maybe it just my imagination lol but the ride is not worse.


_Quote, originally posted by *_V-Dubber_* »_
Did you do the install yourself or did Evolution Tuning do it for you? If you did it yourself, how easy/difficult is the installation process? Time to complete the task for an amateur enthusiast like me and not some mechanical savant?


We went to a shop down here called Carboy, it took them about 30 mins.
Mike prefers you professionally install the pulley, but if you prefer to do it yourself he said it would take about 1 or 1.5 hr. and he prefers you use air tools.
Target date, yeah late october, production is under way, just up to Mike and NST to give the word!



_Modified by iiktownii at 4:13 PM 10-16-2007_


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## daschrier (Oct 17, 2007)

I see it.
It's the big pressed in rubber insert.
So many misunderstood people in this thread.
A harmonic balancer and dampener is the same thing, and has NOTHING to do with the engine being internally or externally balanced. We're talking about harmonics here, not weight.
The harmonic balancer/dampener controls the torsional effects on the crankshaft during the combustion cycle in the engine.
Any OEM crank pulley these days incorporates a harmonic dampener which is what that big rubber insert is in the OEM pulley.
By taking this out you WILL damage the engine over time.


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## VAGMeister (Sep 7, 2005)

powned.


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## halbwissen (Jul 20, 2001)

*Re: (VAGMeister)*

i read every post and everyone is bickering back and forth about harmonic this, engine blowing up this..
here's the real question:
lets assume the pulley _does_ accelerate wear on the crank. 
at what mileage does it become a problem?
you may be able to drive 150k miles without experiencing any problems related to this pulley.
or there may be repercussions at 50k.
who knows.
furthermore, with current manufacturing technologies, crank balancing and metal treatment is light year beyond what it was in yester years.
who's to say the damper in the crank pulley does anything but quiet the engine these days?
or moreover, the need for a crank damper may be abolsutely required on one engine and not another, but is put onto both vehicles.
no one's a Volkswagen engineer in here, right?
if you're skeptical, let one of these other guys buy one, run it for awhile and report back after a significant amount of miles have been logged.
then we'll know if there's any negative long term effects.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (DriveVW4Life)*

NonStopTuning, Unorthodox Racing, Nuespeed, and others have been building solid pulleys for years and years. If these pulleys were as destructive as some say, these companies would have gone out of business long ago. 
Look at these three links and read a bit for yourselves. Take a look and see if you can find ONE person who has ever had any issues of any kind with NST pulleys. 
I DARE YOU!!! 
Take a look at these 3 links!!!!
ALL of this information is from people who ACTUALLY have owned and used NST pulleys over the past few years, not internet scientists sitting behind computers! 
http://www.scionlife.com/forum...light=
http://www.yarisworld.com/foru...=4737
http://www.8thcivic.com/forums...43168
NST users, different makes, different models, all saying one thing. No problems. What is more important to you guys? Theories and horror stories? Or actual first hand data posted up by users
_Modified by iiktownii at 7:33 PM 10-17-2007_

_Modified by iiktownii at 7:35 PM 10-17-2007_


_Modified by iiktownii at 7:38 PM 10-17-2007_


----------



## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

Look at the second link I put up... 
http://www.yarisworld.com/foru...=4737
This thread was started by the president of NST himself. Would he really be so stupid as to start a thread on a public forum, asking his customers to put in information, if he knew he was selling a garbage product?
if he was selling garbage, would he invite people to talk about it?
hmmmm.... 
THE END


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## halbwissen (Jul 20, 2001)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

i think everyone needs to read this, especially the haters:
cognitive dissonance
just because you've read that it's wrong to put a lightweight pulley and you've read that removing the stock crank pulley with its damper causes premature engine failure, doesn't mean it's true.
open your mind, think outside the box, question conventional wisdom.
if not, you're probably suffering from cognitive dissonance.



_Modified by DriveVW4Life at 10:57 PM 10-17-2007_


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## h-townjetta (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (iiktownii)*

I don't know how many have read the November issue of ET but it has an article about underdrive crank pulleys. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (iiktownii)*


_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_NonStopTuning, Unorthodox Racing, Nuespeed, and others have been building solid pulleys for years and years. If these pulleys were as destructive as some say, these companies would have gone out of business long ago. 


Really?Ever heard of a company called EIP?Took them 16 years to go out of buisness.Call up Neuspeed right now and tell them that one of there light weight pulley sets caused your engine failure.They will laugh @ you and hang up the phone.No one is bending your arm telling you to buy there products and bolt it onto your engine.Its up to you to use your common sense and understanding.

_Quote, originally posted by *iiktownii* »_I don't see any harmonic balancer, do any of you?









You dont even know wtf your looking @.If there was any single time you made yourself look like an ass in this thread,it is most certainly now.All your simply doing is taking information from NST and regurgitating information back onto vortex without understanding the mechanics of the situation.

_Quote, originally posted by *daschrier* »_I see it.
*It's the big pressed in rubber insert.*
So many misunderstood people in this thread.
A harmonic balancer and dampener is the same thing, and has NOTHING to do with the engine being internally or externally balanced. We're talking about harmonics here, not weight.
The harmonic balancer/dampener controls the torsional effects on the crankshaft during the combustion cycle in the engine.
Any OEM crank pulley these days incorporates a harmonic dampener which is what that big rubber insert is in the OEM pulley.
By taking this out you WILL damage the engine over time.

Thank You Sir


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## sclick55 (Sep 13, 2007)

Just a thought, but how many people here, after they really start tuning a car for power, expect it to last as long as it's stock counterpart? If you are on a quest for pure power, you sacrifice longevity. Everything you tweak will add more stress to the engine. So, eventually, be it an underdrive pulley, too much boost, too much nitrous, something is going to cause engine failure. Don't we all expect it to happen at some point? If the guy wants the pulleys, has decided it's an acceptable risk, and is willing to make the possible mistake for others here, why give him a hard time? Think about it, from this point on, if you are against pulleys, just sit back and wait and one of two things will happen. Either the engine will grenade and you can say "I told you so" or maybe it all works out and he can say "I told you so" is it really so important? It's an engine, not a person.


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## daschrier (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: (sclick55)*

Sure....understanding that what you're doing to your car might sacrifice longevity is one thing, but to be told that the aftermarket part will do nothing to harm your engine is wrong and unfair to the customer.


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## ninety9gl (Nov 27, 2005)

*Re: (akdakota)*

... This thread got a little out of hand... It comes down to this, cars that don't require an actual harmonic balancer are fine when it comes to just swapping out the crank pulley for an aftermarket replacement (provided the part itself is completely, _perfectly_ even and balanced) but cars that do require harmonic balancing have major issues with pulleys causing bottom end damage... the same way a car with even a slightly cracked/damaged pulley will spin lopsided.
You see plenty of pulleys for cars that are naturally/internally balanced, but on cars that do require a physical part to actually balance harmonics you will find plently of people who have had major issues as a result of trying such a part... And I'm not going to say jack about the 2.5, I'm just saying that each application is or may be different... you can't assume there won't or will be damaged based on if it does or doesn't work with another motor.
If NST wants to say it's safe, then they should have an independent engine builder test the balance of the bottom end.
daschrier is right, it's not so much an issue of "I told you so" as much as people who may be interested in the product need to _know_ it's safe, not just take a gamble.


_Modified by ninety9gl at 1:00 PM 10-22-2007_


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (ninety9gl)*

I'm supposed to get the dynos from NST this week. So they'll be up.
Also look out for a new page for the 2.5 on the NST website which will include some more information about the pulley. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
http://www.nonstoptuning.com


----------



## Rh3017 (Sep 8, 2003)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

there is no information other than "coming soon"


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (Rh3017)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rh3017* »_there is no information other than "coming soon"









um...sorry bro, but i dont work for NST so i cant speed up their process.
Whenever they're ready, they're ready. 
I cant do nothing about it.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

It's what you all have been waiting for.

http://www.nonstoptuning.com/pKitVW25.htm
go crazy. buy 2 or 3. lol =]
you will not be dissapointed i guarantee it http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## kaner05jetta (Dec 16, 2006)

Excellent. It's about time








But I have to order it sometime in November...damned credit card bills


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## sclick55 (Sep 13, 2007)

*Re:*

While I wrote earlier about accepting that you are affecting longevity by anything you do, I will throw this link in, just for people to read. I'm not saying that no one should buy the product, I just found the article informitive.
http://www.atiperformanceprodu...n.htm


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## CA dub (Oct 27, 2007)

*Re:*

This is one of the best and most affordable modifications in my opinion. I've had crank pulleys like this on several of my older cars for thousands of miles. No problems whatsoever, better acceleration and better overall response. I plan to buy one when they come out.


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## racinrabbit12 (Apr 27, 2007)

Ok, here is the final word. I spoke to the shop foreman at the dealership that i work at and he says that the 2.5L DOES NOT have any EXTERNAL balancing. It is all internal. End of problem. Yay! Now everyone go buy one cause pulleys are an awesome mod.


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## husm (Sep 4, 2006)

so is it out now, or out in dec.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (racinrabbit12)*


_Quote, originally posted by *racinrabbit12* »_Ok, here is the final word. I spoke to the shop foreman at the dealership that i work at and he says that the 2.5L DOES NOT have any EXTERNAL balancing. It is all internal. End of problem. Yay! Now everyone go buy one cause pulleys are an awesome mod.

NST has been trying to say that, but some people just dont understand. 
Thanks for adding that http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (husm)*

Order it now, will ship beginning of Dec. 
They like to have enough in stock before they start shipping so people dont have to wait even longer. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## thumper87 (Sep 11, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

Any dynos? Pleeeeeaaaase? Also, I haven't heard a single thing about underdrive pulleys causing someone's accessories to malfunction, but does it happen? You and I both live in Houston, so I'm SURE you know that A/C is more valuable to us than horsepower. Any problems there? Also, are they in Houston? Do you know what they'd charge to install one of these things if I drove up there? Thanks for all your posts! I'm totally interested in this product. I think this is where my Christmas bonus is going!


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## daschrier (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: (racinrabbit12)*

But we have a pic of the stock crank pulley to show that it does have a dampener...balancing is a different issue than dampening you people.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (thumper87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *thumper87* »_Any dynos? Pleeeeeaaaase? Also, I haven't heard a single thing about underdrive pulleys causing someone's accessories to malfunction, but does it happen? You and I both live in Houston, so I'm SURE you know that A/C is more valuable to us than horsepower. Any problems there? Also, are they in Houston? Do you know what they'd charge to install one of these things if I drove up there? Thanks for all your posts! I'm totally interested in this product. I think this is where my Christmas bonus is going!

I was supposed to get the dynos last night, but i couldnt get in touch with NST because i was at work.
But im off tonight so they should be up. 
Yeah i know A/C for us is important and the pulley does not affect the A/C or any other components as far as i know. 
The company is Houston based. and the place in houston that installed my pulley is called CarBoy. took about 30-45 min install. then we dynoed before and after. 
i say it's a good gain for $125.
so it's worth it.
NST deals with these folks who think otherwise all day.
They say there is no problem, i believe them. Not only because i know Mike it's becuase they have installed pulleys on many cars, including race, highly tuned vehicles. no complains at all.
I do not work for NST, nor am i getting paid to do this.
I went up to Mike with an idea, he liked it and took up the project. 
I shared it with all of you hoping that you all would be excited and interested in the product. some of you are, some arent. in the end the $125 is worth it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## racinrabbit12 (Apr 27, 2007)

Ok, so the 2.5 does not have external balancing but it does have a dampener in the pulley? What does removing the dampener do to the engine?


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## thumper87 (Sep 11, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

OK... So I'm not trying to bother you or anything, but I'm under the assumption that they probably have a few of these already made, so do you think I'd have luck trying to get one before they "ship?" As soon as I call my dealer and find out what it would do to my warranty, and provided it's not a huge liability, I'm placing my order.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (thumper87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *thumper87* »_OK... So I'm not trying to bother you or anything, but I'm under the assumption that they probably have a few of these already made, so do you think I'd have luck trying to get one before they "ship?" As soon as I call my dealer and find out what it would do to my warranty, and provided it's not a huge liability, I'm placing my order.

Well like i said i dont work for NST, so thats not up to me.
but i guess you can email Mike @ NST and see what he says. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## thumper87 (Sep 11, 2007)

*Re: (iiktownii)*

Well I'm toooootally excited about this pulley. I talked to Mike from NST and he assured me that they cover all their pulleys with a 1 year warranty and they've never, ever had to replace one. He also told me that his pulleys have a great track record with dealer warranties. The day these things come in, I'll be at the shop waiting. I was reeeeaaally trying to resist modding my engine to stay stock for autoxing (like the sig says), but this is just too tempting. Next is an intake and then a chip.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (thumper87)*

You will find three dyno sheets. First you will see HP and TQ graphs on the same page. Then you will find HP and TQ separately. 
In each case you will find that the mid range has improved very nicely. The NST lines (red) are higher by roughly 5 whp and 5 wtq in the mid range. Very nice gains for a $100 item. 
http://www.nonstoptuning.com/i...q.JPG
http://www.nonstoptuning.com/i...p.JPG
http://www.nonstoptuning.com/i...q.JPG
http://www.nonstoptuning.com/i...t.JPG
This graph is plotted on an axis of time. You can clearly see that peak power is reached almost half a second faster with the NST pulley. More power comes on sooner and peak is reached more quickly. 
Dynos done on the same day, same car, same dyno. No other modifications. My Automatic 2007 Rabbit.


_Modified by iiktownii at 6:46 AM 11-3-2007_


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## husm (Sep 4, 2006)

links are all dead...


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## VWguy73 (Dec 20, 2000)

yes, and when will it be available for purchase?


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (VWguy73)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWguy73* »_yes, and when will it be available for purchase?

December.


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## iiktownii (Mar 10, 2007)

*Re: (husm)*


_Quote, originally posted by *husm* »_links are all dead...

My bad, i fixed them.


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## esp (Jun 11, 2007)

Why doesn't NST just add dampeners on the pulleys....wouldn't that solve everyone's problems?


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## MattWayMK5 (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: (esp)*

Any word on a release date for this? i def wanna get it


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## CA dub (Oct 27, 2007)

*Re: (MattWayMK5)*

I'm on the list! I talked to Mike online (NSTonAIM is his SN) and he says they expect to have them by the second week of December


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## MattWayMK5 (Dec 17, 2006)

*Re: (CA dub)*

Awesome, thanks for the info


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## rabbit07 (Feb 22, 2007)

*Re: (MattWayMK5)*

how much are they going to cost? I am very interested.


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## rangerbrown (Jul 12, 2007)

100$
but you lose the harmonic dampanor(spell)
that's where you save wieght.


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## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

*Re: (rangerbrown)*

I think the point some people were trying to make here is not the quality of NST's products, but the fact that a 5 cylinder engine is already unbalanced. This is a reason why alot of 5 cylinder engines *do not* rev very high. 
I personally would never recommend adding a lightened underdrive pulley on a 5 cylinder car, ever. Thats me personally. 
I love seeing more products on the market and good companies working hard, but pulleys are tricky. Some engines respond very well, some respond very poor. 
If you are really curious to see how it will affect your car, then send your oil out to be analyzed. Keep an eye on the LEAD content. If it doesn't rise significantly then you'll be fine! But if it rises then I would be concerned. As lead in the analysis is from your bearings. 
The thing is that your crank sees tiny vibrations from various reasons. The rubber ring on the crank pulley is there to help minimize these.
In the 1.8T forums a long time ago this was of some concern. There was a huge thread about this, and there were some lab reports posted that showed huge increases in lead content after the installation of underdrive lightened pulleys.
Now like I said before, I'm not discouraging these. Just trying to make people aware. And if you get these, it wouldn't be a bad idea to send out some oil samples to keep an eye on the bearings.










_Modified by Seanathan at 3:37 AM 11-9-2007_


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## dr.dodds (Mar 11, 2006)

*Re: NST UNDERDRIVE CRANK PULLEY UPDATE. (iiktownii)*

THE MKv'S ARE HEAVILY DEPENDENT ON THE ALTERNATOR BEING ABLE TO PERFORM AT STOCK RATIO. USING AN UNDERDRIVE PULLEY AT THE CRANK WOULD ALSO REQUIRE A OVERDRIVE PULLEY AT THE ALTERNATOR.
WHAT ARE ALL OF YOU GOING TO DO WHEN LOAD INTERVENTION MANAGEMENT STARTS TO KICK IN?....!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WILL THE PULLEY MANUFACTURER PAY FOR THE TRIP TO THE DEALER?


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## [email protected] (Sep 14, 2006)

*Re: (travis3265)*

Knowing that we offer a lot of performance parts (suspension, intakes, headers, software, etc) for the 2.5L cars and because we are so close to them in Houston, NST has recently contacted us about offering their pulleys to our 2.5L customers. We now have a shipment of them on their way to us and will be offering them as package deals with intakes, exhausts, etc.
https://www.mjmautohaus.com/ca...=2565


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## whatsyourbeef (Jan 2, 2007)

*Re: (Seanathan)*

_Unbalanced 2.5L_: some info from VW :
Indeed, a usual band-aid for engine imbalance—balance shafts—isn't necessary for this new engine from VW spokesman Patrick Hespen, this new transverse-mounted engine has connecting rods that are equally positioned at 72 degrees on the engine crankshaft help do away with imbalance issues. Together, the connecting rods and the crankshaft work to convert the reciprocating motion of the engine pistons that go up and down in the engine cylinders into rotary motion that's used by the transmission. THE 2.5L, I5 HAS NO INTERNAL BALANCING SHAFTS


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## 07bunny (Nov 21, 2007)

*Re: (_V-Dubber_)*

our motors and any other 5 cylinders dont have companion cylinders. i know this because i use to work on the Mercedes cdi 5 cylinder. im also pretty sure that all newer motors are internally balanced from the factory. and we have a vibration damper which means it has nothing to do with the inside of the motor only the shaking of the motor like vibrations in cab.


_Modified by 07bunny at 2:20 AM 12-10-2007_


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## MJM Autohaus (Oct 20, 2003)

*Re: (07bunny)*

After a short backorder on the black units, we've got them back in stock.
Blue and red ones also on the shelf. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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