# 2011 Hyundai Sonata 2.0t



## 1TsMeJP (Feb 3, 2009)

Idk if any of you have been reading the articles but it seems the new hyundai sonata 2.0t has been getting some serious press lately.. I was just reading this article on it on paper it seems to be rated at 274hp, 265lb torque 23/33mpg and its 3400 pounds. I was looking at the pictures its super similar to the cc. I must say i enjoy our VW interior much more but i must say i definitely think hyundai may have done some copy and pasting on there cad drawings. Opinions?? check out the article on autoblog http://www.autoblog.com/2010/10/14/2011-hyundai-sonata-2-0t-first-drive-review-road-test/


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## phantom2010 (Aug 3, 2010)

Looks to me like a TSX mated with a CC and this is their bastard child. I don't think it's a bad looking car, but the snob in me could never drive a Hyundai.


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## 1TsMeJP (Feb 3, 2009)

phantom2010 said:


> Looks to me like a TSX mated with a CC and this is their bastard child. I don't think it's a bad looking car, but the snob in me could never drive a Hyundai.


 haha now that you said that im starting to see your point it definitely robs styling from the two of them.. I just was reading another article on it i caught this quote "The engine is required to sip nothing more exotic than 87 octane fuel. That is, the 2.0T generates its 274 horsepower at 6,000 rpm and 269 pound-feet of torque from 1,750-4,500 rpm on the cheap stuff. Typically, elevated specific output and low octane are mutually exclusive, making this achievement worth talking about." so apparently there running those numbers on regular fuel thats seems quite far fetched.. But i agree i dont think i could drive a Hyundai either but id definitely take one for a test drive or as a rental.


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## TM87 (Dec 30, 2008)

This was my next choice if my wife didnt buy her jetta.I love new Hyundai,the only Asian car i would drive.


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## 56nomad56 (Apr 17, 2009)

*Hyundai*

Someone driving a $30,000 car saying they couldn't stoop to drive a $27,000 car. That's pretty funny, I'm sure many people with luxury cars say the same thing about VWs. 

I'd take the HP, TQ, and mileage from the Sonata's engine in my CC (and the 10-year powertrain warranty), 87 octane gas and no need for an aftermarket chip. The rest, I think I like my CC better. 

Hopefully this motor will help VW to free up some extra HP in the 2.0T in the future.


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## 1TsMeJP (Feb 3, 2009)

56nomad56 said:


> Someone driving a $30,000 car saying they couldn't stoop to drive a $27,000 car. That's pretty funny, I'm sure many people with luxury cars say the same thing about VWs.
> 
> I'd take the HP, TQ, and mileage from the Sonata's engine in my CC (and the 10-year powertrain warranty), 87 octane gas and no need for an aftermarket chip. The rest, I think I like my CC better.
> 
> Hopefully this motor will help VW to free up some extra HP in the 2.0T in the future.


 Agreed i would love to see VW start producing power like this out of their 2.0t and 87 octane would help the pocket plus the car starts at 24k MSRP 3 grand cheaper then the msrp of a cc. But i love my dub :thumbup:


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## arkijak (Jun 15, 2010)

either VW is under-rating their 2.0t or Hyundai is over-rating their engine. 

from Motor Trend: 
"The Sonata turbo is also faster than the V-6 Ford Fusion Sport (6.8 sec/15.2 sec @ 94.0 mph) and splits times with the V-6 Honda Accord EX-L (6.5 sec/15.5 sec @ 95.5 mph), V-6 Chevrolet Malibu LTZ (6.5 sec/15.1 sec @ 93.7 mph) and Passat 2.0T (6.7 sec/15.0 sec @ 93.4 mph). Those times were pulled from comparison tests we did in the February 2008 and June 2008 issues." 

Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests...nata_2_0t_test/performance.html#ixzz12N12znYu 

The Passat outperforms the Sonata in the figure 8 test.


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

Just before purchasing my CC, I test drove the new 2011 Sonata, 2.0. The Turbo wasn't out yet. I preferred the ride and price, along with the options and warranty, however, they were not offering any incentives, such as VW was. 

My previous vehicles, prior to the current CC VR6 and Eos 2.0t were a 2007 Azera and a 2007 Santa Fe Limited. Both were fantastic cars. No complaints what so ever. By the way, in 1986, I bought a brand new Hyundai Excel. Drove it for over 200,000 miles before donating it to our church. It is still being driven. 

Don't get me wrong, I love my VWs, but the Hyundai is far under-rated. They were the only auto manufacturer making money during the auto crunch last year. 

The body styling of the Sonata is superb but it has a much higher roof line. Great for ingress and egress, but compared to the low slung CC, no comparison for sleekness. 

One other thing. The only reason I got rid of the Hyundais is simply the fact that I wanted a convertible and my wife was getting bored and wanted a new four door sedan. 

If the Genesis Coupe came in an open top, I would probably be driving it right now. Drive one of those suckers and find out what 306 HP feels like with a 6 banger coupled to a 6 speed German tranny. 


http://i690.photobucket.com/albums/...era and 07 Santa Fe/Azera-SantaFeGroup004.jpg


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## arkijak (Jun 15, 2010)

forgot to add: 
the sonata does weigh 8 pounds more.


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## Biodome (Dec 7, 2000)

DavidPaul said:


> They were the only auto manufacturer making money during the auto crunch last year.


 Not to split hairs, but Ford never took a gov't bailout, and made its first profit in years in 2009, about $2.7 billion.


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## kitae (Jan 11, 2010)

I believe sonata cmae out before cc did...of course from there home country first.


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## Ali B (Feb 17, 1999)

I agree with the OP that VW/Audi need to bump up the hp/torque of their 2.0T engine. Heck, this Hyundai engine even puts out more power and torque than the high output 2.0T engine from the $50K Audi TTS and VW Golf R and gets better gas mileage too.


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## snow blind (May 16, 2007)

Ali B said:


> I agree with the OP that VW/Audi need to bump up the hp/torque of their 2.0T engine. Heck, this Hyundai engine even puts out more power and torque than the high output 2.0T engine from the $50K Audi TTS and VW Golf R and gets better gas mileage too.


THIS! Car is actually great! Had it on business in Chicago and I was SERIOUSLY impressed!!! I'm really leaning towards Hyundai for my next car in 2012... well that is if the world doesn't explode or anything :laugh:


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## bigmikeo (Jun 16, 2009)

I'm on a business trip in Minnesota. I flew into Minneapolis and drove a new Sonata to Crookston, MN just under 300mi. The drive yesterday was O.K. The interior is hard plastic, ie: door and center console. So it worked on my elbows and made them sore. The returning 4hr drive today made me want to roll out at speed, I was ecstatic to get out of when I got back into Minneapolis, even they guy with me complained about the poor support from the seats, they are on par with the Ford Taurus, pre Ford 500MY. About the only people looking at the car were last MY Sonata owners, mainly because I saw them everywhere, and saw one single CC while here. The only good thing was it got great gas mileage while doing 70+.


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## torpeau (Aug 22, 2009)

Ali B said:


> I agree with the OP that VW/Audi need to bump up the hp/torque of their 2.0T engine. Heck, this Hyundai engine even puts out more power and torque than the high output 2.0T engine from the $50K Audi TTS and VW Golf R and gets better gas mileage too.


 
Based on some other threads, the 2.0T engine likely does put out more than 200/207.


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## phantom2010 (Aug 3, 2010)

56nomad56 said:


> Someone driving a $30,000 car saying they couldn't stoop to drive a $27,000 car. That's pretty funny, I'm sure many people with luxury cars say the same thing about VWs.
> 
> I'd take the HP, TQ, and mileage from the Sonata's engine in my CC (and the 10-year powertrain warranty), 87 octane gas and no need for an aftermarket chip. The rest, I think I like my CC better.
> 
> Hopefully this motor will help VW to free up some extra HP in the 2.0T in the future.


 Has nothing to do with the cost. I came from driving BMW's for the past ten years I could have had any car I wanted I just liked the CC. The Genesis is 40k and I still wouldn't drive that. Nice cars, but when you're talking to someone and they ask "what kind of car do you drive?" and you reply Hyundai it just doesn't ring quite right. I'm still getting used to saying VW but it's definitely better. Thanks Sally.


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## bigmikeo (Jun 16, 2009)

People can't/won't warm up to a Hyundai. I would be surprised if the Equus will not be a failure. Will people shopping a NEW S-Class, A8, LS 460 also drive through a Hyundai dealer?

No different than Phaeton drivers telling people it's a 70k VW. Hard bite to swallow considering what else you could have in that range. 

Granted used Phaeton's were on my car list, as were A8's, S class, even 300 SRT8's but I love my choice. 

People can talk about original Excel's (good or bad) but you can have the same conversation about a Fox. It's a love/hate relationship.


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

I believe the 2011 Sonata was introduced in the U.S. in February, 2010. The Sonata is also built in the States, so it apparently came out after the CC. 

I am not sure when the CC was first introduced here or in Germany but I know it was before February of 2010.


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

Even the non-turbo 2.0 puts out 198 hp. 

I test drove an SE without a turbo last March and it was very quick, right off the line. I also loved the phony dual exhaust look.


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

Biodome said:


> Not to split hairs, but Ford never took a gov't bailout, and made its first profit in years in 2009, about $2.7 billion.


 I stand corrected, there were *two* car companies that made money, and yes.................you were splitting hairs.


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## Faramarz1 (May 13, 2010)

I went for a test drive of 2010 BMW 328i, Mercedes C300 and VW CC Luxury couple of months ago in order to decide for a replacement for my current 08 jetta. Hyundai dealership was close and I decided to try the 2011 sonata. Everything was perfect from outside and as well in the inside untill I started the car and drove it. I had the same feeling 3 years back when I drove the 08 Elantra after driving a couple of jettas and camrys. The car just didn't drive well. Steering wheel feel, gas pedal, gear shifting, engine noise. road noise, everything was almost the same as the 08 Elantra and nothing close to the CC, Jetta or even Camry. I was completely disappointed with Hyundai since in my opinion, they didn't do a single thing in three years to improve the comfort and driving dynamics of the majority of their lineup.


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## CC U L8TR (Aug 3, 2010)

bigmikeo said:


> The drive yesterday was O.K. The interior is hard plastic, ie: door and center console. So it worked on my elbows and made them sore.


 The VW design is awesome but the interior around dash and trim looks very plastic and cheap IMHO. 

I think the sonatas have the most bang for the buck. It's starts at 19k and a well equipped one is still less than a CC. But still, I would never trade my CC for a sonata, i prefer German engineerin over Korean and that is just my preference.


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## B6 Panzer (Jun 10, 2008)

The only Sonata that actually looks decent is the fully loaded one with the 18" wheels. But that comes in at $27K. 

no thanks, I'll stick with my CC Sport.


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## Converted2VW (Apr 8, 2009)

Hyundais are not bad...like every car out there they fill a market: 

Cheap / Bang for the buck... 

You can't expect the Sonata to have the feel / interior / overall experience of a CC in a car that is 10k cheaper. 
But then again, this is a matter of perception...different people will perceive the car differently...


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## [email protected] (Oct 30, 2007)

A couple of times now I've come across a Sonata on the road and we'd exchange looks... Good-looking cars. Pictures of this modded one have been floating around a while... 



















And _they_ have badgeless grilles available! :sly:


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## caj1 (Feb 16, 1999)

Aside from 4 doors and a crease down the sides this car looks nothing like the CC. It's also not a design that will stand the test of time.


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## rracerguy717 (Apr 8, 2003)

Ali B said:


> I agree with the OP that VW/Audi need to bump up the hp/torque of their 2.0T engine. Heck, this Hyundai engine even puts out more power and torque than the high output 2.0T engine from the $50K Audi TTS and VW Golf R and gets better gas mileage too.


 Like all VAG motors they go to Audi first 

I suspect that the CC might get the 2L TFSI from the Audi A4 with the VLV timing that would put them on a more level playing field with a little better tuning espec in the tq area . 
I would be interested in a CC + DSG with that motor  Bob.G


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## dsn112 (Jun 18, 2010)

I have both cars and really like both. The vw is for sure a better drive, but the overall repair costs and upkeep costs on the sonata will be far less. I have a limited sonata and got it in feb for 26k. I was the first person to buy it up here and it has been great in its first 12k. My CC has about 7500 and also has been trouble free except my wheel well plastic breaking from god knows what. 

I like the front of the cc and the rear of the Sonata.


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## snow blind (May 16, 2007)

Proper stance :thumbup:


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## CCRlineBlack (Apr 6, 2010)

I like the look of the new K5 Kia Optima better then the Sonata


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

*Sonata Repair Rate Extremely Low*

The repair incidence rate for the 2011 Sonata is *considerably* lower than that of the CC.


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

CCRlineBlack said:


> I like the look of the new K5 Kia Optima better then the Sonata


 IMHO, the Kia does not have the same fluid sculpturing as does the Sonata. Also, the Kia has a very strange looking grill. 

However, both cars are very reliable with low rates of repair requirements.


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## 08GraniteGreenPassat (May 16, 2009)

For What it's worth, That 2.0t engine makes that 270+hp and 270 torque on 17+ pounds of boost.  apr chip. VW's newer tsi are actually only running 10 to 11 pounds of boost stock and are making about 220 hp.


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

08GraniteGreenPassat said:


> VW's newer tsi are actually only running 10 to 11 pounds of boost stock and are making about 220 hp.


What is considered "Newer tsi engines"?

2009 and up?


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## 08GraniteGreenPassat (May 16, 2009)

DavidPaul said:


> What is considered "Newer tsi engines"?
> 
> 2009 and up?


2008+ 2.0t tsi ccta and others.


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## swansonvw (Feb 23, 2007)

This and most hyundai's are fantastic for the first year or two, then they become rattle boxes. The build quality/fit & finish of the German made CC is far superior. The team in Emden (the plant that produces CCs) sent a rep to our dealer and they are top notch guys.


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## nstabl (May 7, 2006)

I'll stick to German engineering, that alone is worth 100k to me. That's why this is my 4th VW, and in all seriousness, that's why I'm alive after a very bad accident


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## camarkim (Mar 11, 2004)

FWIW: The day I bought my CC, was the day I drove a Hyundai Genesis Coupe. I just had to know before I went with the "tried and true". (Had two B5 Passats over the past ten years.). I have to say that I was a bit disappointed with the Genesis. It wasn't bad, it just felt slightly...not quite THERE yet. And this was the Track model, with the big Brembo brakes, upgraded suspension, and Recaro seats. Still felt not quite right. Plus, as much as my two boys liked the look (and it's not a bad looking car) they are happier with having rear doors instead of having to crawl into the back.

Oh yeah...I like the look of the new Sonata, and I also like that they (like VW) at least OFFER a mid-sized sedan with a manual transmission. I would have test driven one, but they did not have any manuals in stock.


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## Ribz80 (Jan 18, 2004)

swansonvw said:


> This and most hyundai's are fantastic for the first year or two, then they become rattle boxes. The build quality/fit & finish of the German made CC is far superior. The team in Emden (the plant that produces CCs) sent a rep to our dealer and they are top notch guys.


Umm, my CC has quite a few dash rattles. Our same year Sonata limited with more miles does not. Initial fit and finish goes to the CC. But as to which car is the rattle box, that would be my CC.


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## piperpilot964 (Aug 25, 2009)

The Sonata is but ugly IMHO, the "styling" is gaudy over the top and way over done to be redundant, it is a subtle as a fire truck...yuk. Interior feel to me is cheap and they just do not have the feel of a well engineered vehicle at all. Maybe fine for a rental, but I would rather drive a CC or a Jetta for that matter.


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## g60_corrado_91 (Oct 25, 2004)

Ali B said:


> I agree with the OP that VW/Audi need to bump up the hp/torque of their 2.0T engine. Heck, this Hyundai engine even puts out more power and torque than the high output 2.0T engine from the $50K Audi TTS and VW Golf R and gets better gas mileage too.


I've been saying this for a couple of years now. I'm specifically talking about the GTI vs its competition which all pretty much have K04 turbos and at least 260hp (MS3, Cobalt SS/TC, SRT-4 Caliber). Now VW is starting to the same thing with it's other cars and there competition. VAG has always limited things for US customers especially. I just always think, imagine if a GTI or a CC or whatever had the same amount of power as its competition. They already rave about the cars with less power, imagine equal or more power! But the chances of that happening anytime soon are slim.

I don't think mileage is a concern though. I usually get 26-27mpg in my GTI driving in town and highway mixed and not babying it all the time. Doing that, I once got 450 miles to a tank (14.5 gallons). 

FWIW, it's not Hyundai's engine. I believe it's the bottom end of the Mitsubishi 4B11 which obviously powers the Evolution and the Ralliart. It does have better NVH control and it's obviously modified to suit the Sonata's image, but just search AMS Performance or Buschur Racing and you'll see what the block is capable of.



torpeau said:


> Based on some other threads, the 2.0T engine likely does put out more than 200/207.


Correct. The FSI and TSI are more like 215-220 crank hp and slightly more torque because they put out 180-190whp on a dyno stock. TSI's actually run lower C/R than FSI's, less boost, and they have a smaller IHI turbo than the Borg Warner K03S, so the timing must be completely different in order to have the same power as an FSI running slightly higher boost, higher C/R, and a slightly larger turbo. 



08GraniteGreenPassat said:


> For What it's worth, That 2.0t engine makes that 270+hp and 270 torque on 17+ pounds of boost.  apr chip. VW's newer tsi are actually only running 10 to 11 pounds of boost stock and are making about 220 hp.


That sounds great until tuners start coming out with flashes for the Sonata's version of the 2.0T. For instance, yes, my car will keep up with a stock EVO, but how many stock EVO's are out there? Obviously the Sonata does not appeal to the same market as an EVO, but I'll bet some customers will demand a tune/reflashed ECU. 



Ribz80 said:


> Umm, my CC has quite a few dash rattles. Our same year Sonata limited with more miles does not. Initial fit and finish goes to the CC. But as to which car is the rattle box, that would be my CC.


My dad's CC is rattle free at 25k, but my GTI has more rattles than my Mk3 Jetta did. I won't count stuff that's not stock, but the dash and the passenger side seat lever for getting into the back seats rattle continuously. It's enough to drive a person crazy.


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## MURPHYSAWG (Mar 5, 2008)

*0-60 in 6.8 seconds with 274 HP does not compute*



1TsMeJP said:


> Idk if any of you have been reading the articles but it seems the new hyundai sonata 2.0t has been getting some serious press lately.. I was just reading this article on it on paper it seems to be rated at 274hp, 265lb torque 23/33mpg and its 3400 pounds. I was looking at the pictures its super similar to the cc. I must say i enjoy our VW interior much more but i must say i definitely think hyundai may have done some copy and pasting on there cad drawings. Opinions?? check out the article on autoblog http://www.autoblog.com/2010/10/14/2011-hyundai-sonata-2-0t-first-drive-review-road-test/


This fine looking Korean copy cat with 274HP should be *much* quicker . 6.8 in the 0-60 department is the same as us with 200HP. Also the base price at $24K is way too high when you can have Germanic quality for a smidge more. Nevertheless I am sure it will find favor in the market.


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## Ribz80 (Jan 18, 2004)

MURPHYSAWG said:


> This fine looking Korean copy cat with 274HP should be *much* quicker . 6.8 in the 0-60 department is the same as us with 200HP. Also the base price at $24K is way too high when you can have Germanic quality for a smidge more. Nevertheless I am sure it will find favor in the market.


These are usually pre-production and have final tuning still to come. 

InsideLine tested one last week and got 0-60 in 6.2 which is in line with its power to weight expectations.


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## 06TornadoGTIPete (Aug 15, 2006)

Faramarz1 said:


> I went for a test drive of 2010 BMW 328i, Mercedes C300 and VW CC Luxury couple of months ago in order to decide for a replacement for my current 08 jetta. Hyundai dealership was close and I decided to try the 2011 sonata. Everything was perfect from outside and as well in the inside untill I started the car and drove it. I had the same feeling 3 years back when I drove the 08 Elantra after driving a couple of jettas and camrys. The car just didn't drive well. Steering wheel feel, gas pedal, gear shifting, engine noise. road noise, everything was almost the same as the 08 Elantra and nothing close to the CC, Jetta or even Camry. I was completely disappointed with Hyundai since in my opinion, they didn't do a single thing in three years to improve the comfort and driving dynamics of the majority of their lineup.


I agree with this. My dad came and visited a few months back and his rental was this Sonata (non turbo). I drove it quite a bit that week. It looked nice, the interior was adequate (for a $22k car) but it drove rather plain. Just regular. I didn't think it felt quick at all. I like the 200hp turbo in the CC better than the 197hp N/A engine in the Sonata. Hyundai can keep a few mpg if it means my drive is more enjoyable in the CC, which it is.

Now, FOR THE PRICE, the Sonata is a great car. They start at $22k and top out (for a non-turbo) at about $26k. That is a great value. But, you do get what you pay for...


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## aeproberts21 (Apr 10, 2007)

g60_corrado_91 said:


> I've been saying this for a couple of years now. I'm specifically talking about the GTI vs its competition which all pretty much have K04 turbos and at least 260hp (MS3, Cobalt SS/TC, SRT-4 Caliber).


If you increase the turbo, you also increase the turbo lag. I think VW goes with the turbo they selected to keep the lag to a minimum.


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## g60_corrado_91 (Oct 25, 2004)

aeproberts21 said:


> If you increase the turbo, you also increase the turbo lag. I think VW goes with the turbo they selected to keep the lag to a minimum.


Yes and no. I've driven both a K04'd 2.0T FSI and a bone stock Cobalt SS/TC and the Cobalt was much more laggy. Blame it on the tune or maybe the fact that it's got longer gears (5MT vs 6), but even so, a K04 isn't laggy IMO.


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## Pelican18TQA4 (Dec 13, 2000)

After having two very problematic VWs in a row ('06 Passat and '09 Jetta), the latter of which was bought back under the Lemon Law, my mom picked up a '11 Sonata SE with the navigation/sunroof package. For the $23k she paid for the car, you can't get a better new car, period. I'm what some might refer to as a VW fanboi but honestly speaking, mom's new ride is really nice. It's loaded with features, way more than my '09 Jetta TDI (ordered with sunroof, nav, 17" wheels) has, and she paid over $2,000 less than what I paid for my Jetta back in November of '08 which stickered at over $27k! I would be lying if I said that my mom's Sonata isn't growing on me. No, the driving experience isn't quite on par with the VWs in the same price range or other German cars, but it certainly drives nicer than any American car that I've had the "pleasure" of driving, and better than the segment-leading Camry and Accord as well. And honestly, the new Sonata isn't intended to compete with the CC, save for maybe the looks. The Sonata has a longer wheelbase, significantly more cargo volume, more headroom front and rear, more shoulder room front and rear, more front legroom, and a fifth seat. The CC, curiously, does have slightly more rear leg room than the Sonata. The Sonata gets better fuel economy, on 87-octane, and perhaps most important of all, has a much longer warranty (B2B and powertrain). And, statistics have shown that the new Sonata is much less likely to need the warranty, which is not a quality that the CC (or really any VW) possesses.

The reality is, I'm still a VW fanboi and love my Jetta and the multitude of VWs and Audis I've had before it including my '08 R32, but "haters" are only doing themselves a disservice by not looking at what else is out there. But I do love the CC!


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## DNF76 (Feb 7, 2010)

Isn't TSI stays for twin charged? I might be mistaken but I think it has supercharger (driven by belt for lower RPMs) and turbocharger (from Exhaust - higher RPMs)... at least 1.4 TSI in Europe build this way. BTW this 1.4 TSI produce 170 hp in Golf/Polo.


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## kitae (Jan 11, 2010)

DNF76 said:


> Isn't TSI stays for twin charged? I might be mistaken but I think it has supercharger (driven by belt for lower RPMs) and turbocharger (from Exhaust - higher RPMs)... at least 1.4 TSI in Europe build this way. BTW this 1.4 TSI produce 170 hp in Golf/Polo.


"Twin Sexy Inline"


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## Pelican18TQA4 (Dec 13, 2000)

DNF76 said:


> Isn't TSI stays for twin charged? I might be mistaken but I think it has supercharger (driven by belt for lower RPMs) and turbocharger (from Exhaust - higher RPMs)... at least 1.4 TSI in Europe build this way. BTW this 1.4 TSI produce 170 hp in Golf/Polo.


VWoA has the nomenclature all mixed up. You're correct, in Europe TSI represents the twin-charged engines. Here in the U.S., TSI represents the updated (i.e., chain driven cams, different filter/intake, etc.) version of the 2.0T and FSI represents the earlier version. Of course, even FSI was a misnomer in the U.S. and VWoA changed the meaning behind the FSI acronym to mean "fuel straight injection," whereas in Europe FSI stands for "fuel stratified injection." The difference being that the U.S. version doesn't run the lean-burn cycle that the European FSI engines do. Of course, I'm not sure even the European FSI engines still do that, but that was the original meaning and functionality that was behind the FSI acronym. What they really need to is just add TDI to the engines since TDI stands for "turbocharged direct injection"; that is, of course, what both the original and most recent version of the 2.0T in fact are after all!


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## g60_corrado_91 (Oct 25, 2004)

Pelican18TQA4 said:


> After having two very problematic VWs in a row ('06 Passat and '09 Jetta), the latter of which was bought back under the Lemon Law, my mom picked up a '11 Sonata SE with the navigation/sunroof package. For the $23k she paid for the car, you can't get a better new car, period. I'm what some might refer to as a VW fanboi but honestly speaking, mom's new ride is really nice. It's loaded with features, way more than my '09 Jetta TDI (ordered with sunroof, nav, 17" wheels) has, and she paid over $2,000 less than what I paid for my Jetta back in November of '08 which stickered at over $27k! I would be lying if I said that my mom's Sonata isn't growing on me. No, the driving experience isn't quite on par with the VWs in the same price range or other German cars, but it certainly drives nicer than any American car that I've had the "pleasure" of driving, and better than the segment-leading Camry and Accord as well. And honestly, the new Sonata isn't intended to compete with the CC, save for maybe the looks. The Sonata has a longer wheelbase, significantly more cargo volume, more headroom front and rear, more shoulder room front and rear, more front legroom, and a fifth seat. The CC, curiously, does have slightly more rear leg room than the Sonata. The Sonata gets better fuel economy, on 87-octane, and perhaps most important of all, has a much longer warranty (B2B and powertrain). And, statistics have shown that the new Sonata is much less likely to need the warranty, which is not a quality that the CC (or really any VW) possesses.
> 
> The reality is, I'm still a VW fanboi and love my Jetta and the multitude of VWs and Audis I've had before it including my '08 R32, but "haters" are only doing themselves a disservice by not looking at what else is out there. But I do love the CC!


I feel the same way. I really do love VW's, but if anyone besides me or another enthusiast personally owned my car, they would've been freaking out at VW. Cam at 46k, every TSB in the book, rattles, etc. Granted I do drive my car hard, but I take care of it with the scheduled maintenance too.

A lady at my work bought a new Sonata when it first came in and when I had to move it one day, it seriously reminded me of an Audi-like interior, but Lexus quiet. For the price, it's hard to say no.


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## sbkim (Mar 22, 2006)

Indeed. I was all set to get a CC but have been critical rethinking due to Sonata Turbo. Sure, CC looks better both inside and out but for the money it seems like Sonata may not be a bad alternative. Hard to believe but wife tells me we have to have three seater in the back so I guess CC was not meant to be for us


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## Jas-CC (Oct 4, 2010)

I see lots of these new Hyundia's driving around the north Chicago area, but So far I've only see 3 other CCs. I can't argue that the Sonata doesn't look pretty good, and it seems like a great value. But segment wise, I think the CC points to a different driver than the Sonata does. When I think of a Sonata I think Camry, Accord, Altima, the standard mid sized family sedans. The Sonata just happens to be the nicest looking one currently, and appears to be the best value. The CC to me falls towards the sport sedan and coupe market. You don't buy one if you need to use your back seats often. You buy one because it's gorgeous, cruises the highways at high speeds, and drives great. 

The CC (at least around here) is still something of a unique car. You see one about as often as a MB CLS, or a Jaguar XK. it may cost 60 grand less, but it turns heads like one of those super luxury cars. The Sonatas are getting to be pretty common. Nice car, but it doesn't have the "IT" factor the CC does.


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## g60_corrado_91 (Oct 25, 2004)

Jas-CC said:


> I see lots of these new Hyundia's driving around the north Chicago area, but So far I've only see 3 other CCs. I can't argue that the Sonata doesn't look pretty good, and it seems like a great value. But segment wise, I think the CC points to a different driver than the Sonata does. When I think of a Sonata I think Camry, Accord, Altima, the standard mid sized family sedans. The Sonata just happens to be the nicest looking one currently, and appears to be the best value. The CC to me falls towards the sport sedan and coupe market. You don't buy one if you need to use your back seats often. You buy one because it's gorgeous, cruises the highways at high speeds, and drives great.
> 
> The CC (at least around here) is still something of a unique car. You see one about as often as a MB CLS, or a Jaguar XK. it may cost 60 grand less, but it turns heads like one of those super luxury cars. The Sonatas are getting to be pretty common. Nice car, but it doesn't have the "IT" factor the CC does.


Haha, I actually see CLS's and Jaguar XK's more often in the Chicagoland area than CC's. And I agree, the CC seems to be a damn good highway cruiser.


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## sbkim (Mar 22, 2006)

Looks like 2011 Kia Optima (sister car to Sonata) is coming out in a few months with more amenities (HID, LED tail, Panoroof etc).

http://www.kia-newoptima.com/


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## goatman1 (Aug 12, 2007)

Biodome said:


> Not to split hairs, but Ford never took a gov't bailout, and made its first profit in years in 2009, about $2.7 billion.


I believe that you would find that Subaru was also profitable, although this may have been hidden under the Toyota banner.


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## 432828 (Nov 21, 2008)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eblyPUU2_CE


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## Jas-CC (Oct 4, 2010)

wogeboy said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eblyPUU2_CE


 The KIA looks nice for sure. But with any marketing campaign, you have to go and see and feel the vehicle yourself. The big question is, "how does it drive?" That's the real question. You can load a car up with various "amenities", but if it drives like crap, why bother? 

Take the BMW 3 series. Standard package on a 328I, it doesn't have a bunch of eye candy gadgets. Some might argue it isn't even that pretty of a car. But how does it drive? Simple put it's amazing. I think the CC brdiges the gap between eye candy, and driving experience. No it's not like a BMW in it's drivability, but it's certainly superior to non German cars, and as far as design, and amenities go, it certainly comes pretty loaded. 

The Hyundia, and the KIA to me represent a shift in the Asian manufactures to produce more european styled cars, but not european inspired driving cars. Not to say they are bad cars, they just market to a different buyer and driver. 

If I just wanted a car to get me from point A to Point B in comfort without breaking the bank, The Sonata would probably be my first choice. It looks good, it's got all the gizmos, and it's a whoel lotta bang for the buck. But if I want to DRIVE from point A to Point B in style without breaking the bank, CC all the way.


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## Jas-CC (Oct 4, 2010)

g60_corrado_91 said:


> Haha, I actually see CLS's and Jaguar XK's more often in the Chicagoland area than CC's. And I agree, the CC seems to be a damn good highway cruiser.


 I agree there. CC seems like one of the rarest cars around here (excluding super cars, but even then I still see Lambo's, Ferrari's, Porches, Masserati's etc). I see more M6s than CCs. I've had people either spped up or slow down on the highway to get a look at my CC. It's a 30 thousand dollar car, but I feel like I'm driving a super car the way people stop and stare.


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## LeBlanc. (Jul 15, 2003)

g60_corrado_91 said:


> I feel the same way. I really do love VW's, but if anyone besides me or another enthusiast personally owned my car, they would've been freaking out at VW. Cam at 46k, every TSB in the book, rattles, etc. Granted I do drive my car hard, but I take care of it with the scheduled maintenance too.
> 
> A lady at my work bought a new Sonata when it first came in and when I had to move it one day, it seriously reminded me of an Audi-like interior, but Lexus quiet. For the price, it's hard to say no.


 Agreed on the "if someone else owned it" part. If you remember, my GLI went through 3 FPRs, 2 HPFPs, two cam followers and an intake cam, plus the front and rear PCVs. If I hadn't owned more than a dozen VWs by that point, there would have been no way I could have taken it in stride, lol. 

The second day I had my CC, the plastic trim around the gauges started rattling. That's a VW for ya! 
My 2003 Merc with almost 70k miles doesn't rattle at all. 

And, honestly, now having a family, I just don't have the time or patience to have something with an annoying propensity to have little things break here and there. Sometimes I think I should just get a Lexus when the CC lease is up, lol.


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## LeBlanc. (Jul 15, 2003)

g60_corrado_91 said:


> Haha, I actually see CLS's and Jaguar XK's more often in the Chicagoland area than CC's. And I agree, the CC seems to be a damn good highway cruiser.


 Yup, went to Richmond and back with 5 in the car (car seat installed over the rear center console), and averaged 36MPG using regular gas.


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## MySilver2010CC (Sep 21, 2010)

LeBlanc. said:


> The second day I had my CC, the plastic trim around the gauges started rattling. That's a VW for ya!
> My 2003 Merc with almost 70k miles doesn't rattle at all.


 One bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch. Had mine for 3 weeks now, and it's as quiet as the first day I got it.


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## LeBlanc. (Jul 15, 2003)

MySilver2010CC said:


> One bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch. Had mine for 3 weeks now, and it's as quiet as the first day I got it.


 I've owned no less than 13 VWs. The CC is not the one bad apple in my (historical) bunch.


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## MySilver2010CC (Sep 21, 2010)

LeBlanc. said:


> I've owned no less than 13 VWs. The CC is not the one bad apple in my (historical) bunch.


 I hear ya man.


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## sbkim (Mar 22, 2006)

LeBlanc. said:


> Yup, went to Richmond and back with 5 in the car (car seat installed over the rear center console), and averaged 36MPG using regular gas.


 LeBlanc - is there a LATCH system inthe center console for baby seat? One of the reasons we are on the fence is not being able to accomodate two kids and one adult in the back. Thanks!


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## Ribz80 (Jan 18, 2004)

Wow, 3 weeks! j/k 

My car was perfect at first and during the first few thousand miles too. Rattles pop up later especially as seasons change.


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## g60_corrado_91 (Oct 25, 2004)

Jas-CC said:


> The KIA looks nice for sure. But with any marketing campaign, you have to go and see and feel the vehicle yourself. The big question is, "how does it drive?" That's the real question. You can load a car up with various "amenities", but if it drives like crap, why bother?
> 
> Take the BMW 3 series. Standard package on a 328I, it doesn't have a bunch of eye candy gadgets. Some might argue it isn't even that pretty of a car. But how does it drive? Simple put it's amazing. I think the CC brdiges the gap between eye candy, and driving experience. No it's not like a BMW in it's drivability, but it's certainly superior to non German cars, and as far as design, and amenities go, it certainly comes pretty loaded.
> 
> ...


 Totally agree with you on the BMW part. Before my dad got the CC, we test drove a 2007 BMW 328i sedan with the sport package, premium package, and the winter package. It was a 6MT too. It had almost 90k on it IIRC and the car still felt tight. It may have even been tighter than my GTI with 78k on it. It really changed my perspective for the "base" 3 series that in reality is essentially a 330i. It's a damn nice car and I think it gets over looked because of the 335i. Honestly though, it felt just as quick as a stock GTI and it doesn't have any of the HPFP that plagues the 3.0L TT engine. After driving it, I see why magazines love it so much. Sure they're expensive and somewhat bland if you don't get any options, but they still drive nicely. 

The CC falls under a lot of the same category but on a different level obviously. European cars will always be drivers cars and that counts for something at least for me. 



Jas-CC said:


> I agree there. CC seems like one of the rarest cars around here (excluding super cars, but even then I still see Lambo's, Ferrari's, Porches, Masserati's etc). I see more M6s than CCs. I've had people either spped up or slow down on the highway to get a look at my CC. It's a 30 thousand dollar car, but I feel like I'm driving a super car the way people stop and stare.


 Haha, M6's are dime a dozen around Chicago. Just in Crystal Lake/Algonquin area, I usually see at least one M6 a day. It's pretty screwy though because just in the last couple days I've seen a few CC's. Almost more than B6 Passats lol. 



LeBlanc. said:


> Agreed on the "if someone else owned it" part. If you remember, my GLI went through 3 FPRs, 2 HPFPs, two cam followers and an intake cam, plus the front and rear PCVs. If I hadn't owned more than a dozen VWs by that point, there would have been no way I could have taken it in stride, lol.
> 
> The second day I had my CC, the plastic trim around the gauges started rattling. That's a VW for ya!
> My 2003 Merc with almost 70k miles doesn't rattle at all.
> ...


 Haha yeah I recall. My car is the same way. New camshaft at 46k, new HPFP at 35k, a few PCV's, DV's, along with everything else. 



LeBlanc. said:


> Yup, went to Richmond and back with 5 in the car (car seat installed over the rear center console), and averaged 36MPG using regular gas.


 Very nice. I do love the 2.0T. And besides the waterpump on some of the TSI's, the TSI has proven to be more bulletproof than my FSI.


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## LeBlanc. (Jul 15, 2003)

sbkim said:


> LeBlanc - is there a LATCH system inthe center console for baby seat? One of the reasons we are on the fence is not being able to accomodate two kids and one adult in the back. Thanks!


 No, there isn't. Unfortunately, you're not going to be able to fit two seats plus an adult in the back. 

There are four under-the-seat LATCH points, only. We used the two inner points under the rear seats to put our son's seat in the middle. My nephew is 8, and doesn't need a booster any longer. According to the company that built our son's infant seat, our arrangement was fine, as long as the seat was installed with the proper angle and had no movement, otherwise. 

Edit: I should note that there also just BARELY enough room back there for that arrangement. I rode in the back for a four-hour stint, and I was very slightly uncomfortable (5'9", 44-in chest) with the shoulder room.


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## Jas-CC (Oct 4, 2010)

g60_corrado_91 said:


> Totally agree with you on the BMW part. Before my dad got the CC, we test drove a 2007 BMW 328i sedan with the sport package, premium package, and the winter package. It was a 6MT too. It had almost 90k on it IIRC and the car still felt tight. It may have even been tighter than my GTI with 78k on it. It really changed my perspective for the "base" 3 series that in reality is essentially a 330i. It's a damn nice car and I think it gets over looked because of the 335i. Honestly though, it felt just as quick as a stock GTI and it doesn't have any of the HPFP that plagues the 3.0L TT engine. After driving it, I see why magazines love it so much. Sure they're expensive and somewhat bland if you don't get any options, but they still drive nicely.
> 
> The CC falls under a lot of the same category but on a different level obviously. European cars will always be drivers cars and that counts for something at least for me.


 The 328I too me is a more "natural" BMW, since it's natuarlly aspirated. And yeah, it's just a few HP off from the old 330, you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference bwteen the two. Personally if I was going to buy a 3 series, I would stick with the 328. That being said, even the 328I doesn't represent much in the way of "value" compared to say a CC sport. And for me that was the difference maker.


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## chiro444 (Jun 8, 2004)

If you take all of the hp numbers out and just look at the real world numbers, the Sonata only outperforms the CC by .2 seconds 0-60, according to this month's Car and Driver. I haven't read the article but it seems that for all of the horsepower the Sonata has, it's not transmitting it to the ground for some reason. Maybe the tranny, who knows.


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## Jas-CC (Oct 4, 2010)

chiro444 said:


> If you take all of the hp numbers out and just look at the real world numbers, the Sonata only outperforms the CC by .2 seconds 0-60, according to this month's Car and Driver. I haven't read the article but it seems that for all of the horsepower the Sonata has, it's not transmitting it to the ground for some reason. Maybe the tranny, who knows.


 Exactly. Numbers are great, but they are no substitute for getting behind the wheel.


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## sbkim (Mar 22, 2006)

Turbo dynoes 234 @ the wheels. Not too shabby. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ddxBDAGhKc...be_gdata_player 

Vs. about 200 @ wheels for 2.0T GTI I believe


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## adrew (Aug 15, 2003)

Some trivia: I just flipped through the most recent C/D and noticed their Sonata 2.0T review says the car is governed at 153 MPH. 

Hopefully somebody'll get some good photo radar tickets to follow up Lawrence Pargo's 147 MPH ticket in the previous Sonata V6, a rental.


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## phantom2010 (Aug 3, 2010)

How is this thread still alive? It's a freaking Hyundai who cares.


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## DavidPaul (Nov 28, 2009)

phantom2010 said:


> How is this thread still alive? It's a freaking Hyundai who cares.


Maybe you should purchase a more updated computer. You know, one with a "delete" button.

Better yet, go to another forum, one that you are more approving of.

Now, to stay on subject; the Hyudai is a great car and the 2011 Sonata 2.0 Turbo is a real value.

Okay, bunky, you can either hit your back button now or keep this thread alive, your choice.


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## Marcpitch (Nov 3, 2010)

I am fairly new to the CC world, having been seriously looking at them for about 4 weeks. I currently have a 2006 Infiniti M45 Sport. I was surprised, pleased, and perplexed by the fun I had driving the 2.0 CC on a test drive. Coming from a 345 HP car, I could not believe the pep of the 200 HP car...I also loved the handling. I have not owned a VW since my 1971 Super Beetle Convertible in college. I know VW has come a long way since then and perhaps even a long way in the last 5 years.

Though the new Sonata is eye catching, to me I simply do not like the styling nearly as much as the CC. So, I will not drive one. I find it hard to believe it would have the same steering feel as the CC, but who knows. 

I have never had a car (Infiniti, Lexus, BMW, etc.) without problems, but I am a little concerned with those on here who point to rattling issues with the CC. That would drive me nuts. I want to thank all on this forum for their opinions and information. It is a great source of information for me. Since my last two cars have been Infiniti's (M45 and G Coupe), I have been on a similar Infiniti forum since 2002. Though that forum is busy, this one has more action. Keep the comments and information coming...


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## caj1 (Feb 16, 1999)

DavidPaul said:


> Maybe you should purchase a more updated computer. You know, one with a "delete" button.
> 
> Better yet, go to another forum, one that you are more approving of.
> 
> ...


I'd have to disagree. This is a forum dedicated to the discussion about the CC. If you want o talk about other cars ad nauseum take it to the Car Lounge. God knows there are no shortage of Hyundai threads there.


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## piperpilot964 (Aug 25, 2009)

caj1 said:


> I'd have to disagree. This is a forum dedicated to the discussion about the CC. If you want o talk about other cars ad nauseum take it to the Car Lounge. God knows there are no shortage of Hyundai threads there.


 good point....


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## milan187 (Mar 15, 2009)

I would never buy a Hyundai. Great value, looks good? Sure... I'm to much of a snob to drive one and probably will always be...

WIth that out of the way a guy at my work has 2011 Sonata 2.0T and he keeps checking out my CC. First morning I drove in he complimeneted me on the car


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## nstabl (May 7, 2006)

phantom2010 said:


> How is this thread still alive? It's a freaking Hyundai who cares.


Your comment reminds me of this commercial:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr-wISyGSW0&feature=related


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