# US spec Audi S3 sportback manual!- free VW badge included



## p.r.walker (May 31, 2000)

Sorry for the bait and switch, but VAG did it, not me. You can have your 290hp manual hatchback in the USA, as long as it has a VW emblem on the hood. 

http://www.vwvortex.com/news/volkswagen-news/volkswagen-golf-r-makes-north-american-debut/


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## Chuck2001 (Aug 12, 2011)

Torturing myself right now

GOLF R for the $ would be perfect !!! It's 6-9 months too late for my ideal timing. but would be great anyway.

I have 4-year old GTI MY10, and wanted to change car before kid pops out (August).

We were leaning S3....but now SQ5 (delivery possible in May).

But I'm sorry, for the $, fuel economy, and the performance / handling, I'll have a DSG 5-door R anytime.

***k off the fact it's smaller than SQ5.


VW give it to me NOOOW


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

The interior just doesn't cut it for me. I wasn't at all impressed with the MkVII interior in person.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## Chuck2001 (Aug 12, 2011)

I'll see interior myself in 2 weeks (MTL auto show) but only thing I dislike is touch screen NAV. For me, touch screen is not really the way to go in a car.


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## p.r.walker (May 31, 2000)

When I first read the specs of the Golf R, and they were identical to the S3, I was really confused by the overlap in The product portfolio. Now that I have slept on it, I have 2 thoughts-

1- To a stereotypical US shopper (not someone here or on VWVortex), there is not much separating the Golf R & S3 sportback, they are both sporty 5 doors, so they let VW have a Halo car to convince the fan boys that VW has not lost its fun sporty edge (contrary to the rest of the US lineup) 

2- with the top of the line Golf (R) using the same power train as a middle line Audi (S) , this opens the door for a top of the line Audi (RS) to balance the VAG product portfolio and go against the CLA AMG and M3 as the B9 A4 is still 2 years off. 

Bring on the RS3 (fingers crossed)


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

p.r.walker said:


> When I first read the specs of the Golf R, and they were identical to the S3, I was really confused by the overlap in The product portfolio. Now that I have slept on it, I have 2 thoughts-
> 
> 1- To a stereotypical US shopper (not someone here or on VWVortex), there is not much separating the Golf R & S3 sportback, they are both sporty 5 doors, so they let VW have a Halo car to convince the fan boys that VW has not lost its fun sporty edge (contrary to the rest of the US lineup)
> 
> ...


I think what you see here is an experiment from VW.
about 40% of GTI's are sold with sticks. there's demand there, but also demand for DSG's, too. The current Golf R is only available with a stick, and it's the single hardest model to move off the lot at the VW dealer (look it up, they sit there for weeks). So they're going to try it with both transmissions and see what happens. I'm sure VW thinks the stick is hurting sales. I think it's more that the Golf R is overpriced for what it is, treading into Audi territory, and the people who like it are either VW fanbois living in mom's basement or automovie journalists, also living in mom's basement.

Audi is doing what's smart for them and targeting the meat-and-potatoes demographic that I seem to always see in the dealership: middle aged women. And I don't know if you've noticed, but Audi has been _aggressively_ working at eliminating options from their vehicles over the past few years. Pretty soon, you will have your choice of 4 identical looking (but different sized) automatic sedans available in a wide variety of the color grey. Much like off the rack suits at a discount men's store.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

I really don't get this "same sausage, different lengths" mentality people seem to have about Audi. You have the A4 and A5 that look similar from the front post-PI ('cause they're the same damn car!), but otherwise, they're different cars. The headlamps are different on each car, the tail lamps are different on each car, the body lines are different on each car...

I understand that their "corporate face" is taken pretty literally internally, resulting in a similar overall design language across the line (A7 excepted... yuck), and I guess that, in a world where a Passat looks like a Camry to people, I shouldn't be surprised.

I don't disagree about the color situation; that's just downright frustrating. Look at allroad colors recently? What a truckload of _meh_.

I think they're still doing a relatively decent job of providing options. Hell, we'll be getting optional magnetic ride on the S3. I suspect that they'll have to keep the A3 and S3 a bit more fluid than their other cars, though. Let's face it... there's just not much "enthusiast" appeal to an A4 or A6. They're nice cars, but they're already borderline appliance, IMO. No love would be lost here were they to cut options on those cars. That said, I think they need to be doing everything they can to bring butts from other brands, and if offering fuschia whale skin seats with natural bubinga wood trim via Exclusive is one way to do that, they should be doing so.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

Chuck2001 said:


> I'll see interior myself in 2 weeks (MTL auto show) but only thing I dislike is touch screen NAV. For me, touch screen is not really the way to go in a car.


Yeah, I'm going that way as well. In fact, I really, really like that I can remove the S3's display from view if so desired. I'm hoping that the hand-off to the instrument cluster display is fairly rich; if so, the screen will remain in the dash most of the time in my car.

Honestly, what really bothered me about the MkVII interior, in general, was all of that damn glossy black plastic they're using now. The crap mars if you look at it funny, and it's all over the damn place. It won't be as hideous as their failed endeavors with soft-touch coating, but to someone with a keen eye, it'll still look like crap.

I also couldn't stand the laughable "window" in front of the front door, behind the A-pillar. There is no way to get into the opening to clean it, so as the car's interior components off-gas like every new car does, it'll begin to look exceedingly ****ty against the other windows. Thinking of tinting your windows? Better hope the installer can remove that pointless thing to tint it!

... and while I obviously can't claim to have seen the Golf R seats, the seats I did see at the auto show were meh-worthy at best. I have to give them credit for keeping bolsters around, but when taken as a whole, the design is just underwhelming. Frankly, though, they outdid themselves with the MkV "top sport" seats.. and now I'm measuring them against that benchmark.

Taken as a whole, I found the interior to be just _okay_. I'm hoping they will resolve the gross inconsistencies I've seen in some MkVIs, where the sheen, texture, and color of interior panels seems random at best. Of course, I did look at it after I looked at Audi's product, so... yeah.


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## brennok (Jun 5, 2007)

I really think this has sealed the deal on me skipping the S3.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

I believe the warranty is shorter with the Golf R, but with the advent of TD1, that's probably a perk for some of us. :laugh:


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## Rudy_H (Jul 6, 2012)

In all honesty, if it was out around the sametime as the S3, I would buy the Golf R over the S3 in a heart beat for the hatch alone (5-door /w DSG). On one side I like the S3 center console more until you pass your eyes past the automatic climate control then you are left with a hmmm. At least the Golf R and Mercedes C-Class don't have that 'uncompleted' look to it.

The other thing is seats. I have a feeling the Golf R will have a lot more of standard items that are options on the S3.

The manual / DSG, I think this is hinting at a S3 6-speed...

Hopefully the Golf R makes it to the Canadian Auto Show along with the S3. GLA, C-Class are also going to be looked at closely that's for sure.


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## davewg (Jul 30, 2001)

Rudy_H said:


> In all honesty, if it was out around the sametime as the S3, I would buy the Golf R over the S3 in a heart beat for the hatch alone (5-door /w DSG)


This.

Just have to see, as Brian says, how the interiors look/feel in comparison across the brands. It's nice to have all these competitive choices, that's for darn sure.


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## Maitre Absolut (Aug 5, 2009)

Chuck2001 said:


> T
> 
> We were leaning S3....but now SQ5 (delivery possible in May).
> But I'm sorry, for the $, fuel economy, and the performance / handling, I'll have a DSG 5-door R anytime.
> ...


you realize the SQ5 is 10-15k more expensive? If you honestly could swing it, go for it, its badass. Also an A3/golf sized hatch is only good for 1 kid. We got the Q5 for our second coming along this summer 



p.r.walker said:


> 2- with the top of the line Golf (R) using the same power train as a middle line Audi (S) , this opens the door for a top of the line Audi (RS) to balance the VAG product portfolio and go against the CLA AMG and M3 as the B9 A4 is still 2 years off.
> 
> Bring on the RS3 (fingers crossed)


if i bought an S3 and RS3 came out a year later i would be annoyed as ****


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## nahf14 (Jul 22, 2004)

Dan Halen said:


> I believe the warranty is shorter with the Golf R



Yes and no. VW bumper to bumper is 3yr/36k and Audi 4yr/50k, but VW power train warranty is 5yr/60k while Audi is 4yr/50k.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

I see. I think I'll take 4/50 across the board over 3/36 and 5/60 any day. They start making excuses for engine deficiencies well ahead of 4/50, anyway. Source: I own a BPY. :laugh:

That also means I can reflash the car a year earlier. Winning!


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## ChrisFu (Jun 9, 2012)

Dan Halen said:


> I see. I think I'll take 4/50 across the board over 3/36 and 5/60 any day. They start making excuses for engine deficiencies well ahead of 4/50, anyway. Source: I own a BPY. :laugh:
> 
> That also means I can reflash the car a year earlier. Winning!


Our VW dealer just tried to weasel out of covering bad injectors on the wife's GLI @ 37,500 miles (even after a mystery CEL at the 30k service...)

Luckily just today VWoA stepped up to the plate and covered it, but only after a good verbal wrestling match the past week.

VW Powertrain covers much less than most people think.


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## 02GOLFGTI1.8T (Feb 13, 2002)

Brian,

the 5yr/60k saved my bacon when at 55k 4.5 years into my GLI the wastegate on my turbo broke requiring a full turbo replacement. All i can say to people is, do not drive more than 12.5k a year so that you will stretch the coverage for the full 4 years...


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

02GOLFGTI1.8T said:


> Brian,
> 
> the 5yr/60k saved my bacon when at 55k 4.5 years into my GLI the wastegate on my turbo broke requiring a full turbo replacement. All i can say to people is, do not drive more than 12.5k a year so that you will stretch the coverage for the full 4 years...


At my current rate of driving, I'll have less than 25,000 miles at four years. :laugh:


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## cjmoy (Aug 23, 2000)

nahf14 said:


> Yes and no. VW bumper to bumper is 3yr/36k and Audi 4yr/50k, but VW power train warranty is 5yr/60k while Audi is 4yr/50k.


VW also gives 2yr/24k included maintenance.


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## ChrisFu (Jun 9, 2012)

cjmoy said:


> VW also gives 2yr/24k included maintenance.


Is that new for '13? We had 3yr/30k maintenace on the '12 GLI (3 services).


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## cjmoy (Aug 23, 2000)

ChrisFu said:


> Is that new for '13? We had 3yr/30k maintenace on the '12 GLI (3 services).


My 2013 also has the 3yr program. They switched to 2yr on the 2014 models.


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## EZ (Jun 22, 1999)

FractureCritical said:


> I think it's more that the Golf R is overpriced for what it is, treading into Audi territory, and the people who like it are either VW fanbois living in mom's basement or automovie journalists, also living in mom's basement.


I think you must not know many people that have a Golf R.


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## Chuck2001 (Aug 12, 2011)

Woah that thread got popular in a blink of an eye, got to work less....

- VW warranty in Canada is the same as Audi (4Y complete, 5Y mechanical,12Y rust holes)

- MK6 R is priced perfectly compared to a loaded GTI like mine. A friend got his MY11 GTI months after mine (loaded DSG), and a year later exchanged for R. You get the same equipment but more powaaa, 4motion, brakes, etc....

- SQ5 would be a compromise for family vehicule but with a 350hp engine (rated at, because we know it's got more umph)
We live downtown MTL, so we only need one car. We could get a pricey big car but we like ours sporty, nimble, and small usually, because parking etc... So Cayenne/Touareg/ML is no go for SUV, too big. But I could live pretty with a 30-40k car as well, I don't really care about pricing for now.

You know what Dan, the MK7 interior feels more mature than MK6. At first I disliked the steering wheel but now I get it, and I'm pretty sure in my hand it'll be very nice. Cluster is more simple than Audi (I like simple, sobre). I agree there's a s*** load of glossy plastic around the cluster and the middle section.

Exterior is growing on me. Still, the wheels feels not enough punchy to me, and the rear has something weird I can't explain quite well yet, maybe the lights, and the large stance at the base of the vehicule...


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## BClear (Jun 18, 2010)

Dan Halen said:


> The interior just doesn't cut it for me. I wasn't at all impressed with the MkVII interior in person.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


I was going to ask what makes you say this, but then you replied below.



Dan Halen said:


> Yeah, I'm going that way as well. In fact, I really, really like that I can remove the S3's display from view if so desired. I'm hoping that the hand-off to the instrument cluster display is fairly rich; if so, the screen will remain in the dash most of the time in my car.
> 
> Honestly, what really bothered me about the MkVII interior, in general, was all of that damn glossy black plastic they're using now. The crap mars if you look at it funny, and it's all over the damn place. It won't be as hideous as their failed endeavors with soft-touch coating, but to someone with a keen eye, it'll still look like crap.
> 
> ...


I circled between the A3/S3, CLA250, and MK7 GTI at the LA show four times consecutively comparing their interiors. Let me start by saying that I have no bias and am not at all invested in any vehicle for my next car. These three are all contenders, among others, and my mind is yet to be made up. That said, all three have comparable interiors in my mind, none are a deal-breaker and my ultimate decision will rest more on dynamic responses and packaging/pricing. However, I walked away ranking the CLA as the worst interior, the A3/S3 in the middle, and the GTI the best. Granted, the range between the three is rather small and I would be fine living with any of these three interiors.

I'll leave the CLA out from here forward because we're all probably not interested in it, nor is it relevant to this discussion. 

I do agree with Chuck that touch screens in cars aren't really great ideas. In that regard, the A3/S3 wins over the GTI. In reality, I'm more concerned with aesthetics of the interface. But I don't "play" much with these systems once I'm moving in the car, so it's really a moot point for me personally.

I agree with you Dan that VW could have done better than the glossy black plastic trim. When the first photos came out, I thought it was a carbon fiber pattern, but at LA in person, I saw it's more of a honeycomb type design. I'm not huge on it, and preferred the brushed aluminum in my old MK5 GTI. I consider myself a light user of almost every product I own, and take exceedingly good care of my cars, so I'd be more concerned of passengers scratching it than myself.

As for the front corner window, as long as I can tint it (relatively dark, ~15%), I'm fine. If it is untintable, deal breaker. The GTI/Golf R would be off the list.

Regarding the seats, the VW wins by a mile in my book. The A3 S-Line/S3 seats look fantastic, especially with the diamond stitching. They look very sporting. But the bolstering was a big disappointment. Conversely, I agree that the GTI seats look "meh", but the bolsters were much more aggressive. I'll take function over form in this case and favor the seats that look worse and function better (to my personal liking) rather than those that look better but don't function as well. I'd hope that if I go the GTI route, the plaid covering is available on the same seat and would be happy with that. If Golf R, "meh".

The door panels of the VW surpassed those of the Audi clearly to me. The soft-touch plastic on the upper portion seems to be of a higher grade on the VW (softer, more padding). Additionally, the pockets on the Audi door have plastic sides and a removable rubber insert at the bottom, whereas the VW has carpet on the sides and bottom. The Audi may be better for cleaning if you're frequently spilling liquids in there, but for my light usage, I can confidently say there will never be anything in my door pockets and thus the better covered VW door pockets win in my book, making it feel just a little more upscale. Two rather small differences, but together they make it feel a little bit nicer. And like I said, the range of differences is rather small so I'm obviously nitpicking.

I did find the plastics on the center console of the Audi somewhat disappointing. Specifically the brushed plastic trim around the cupholders and the kneepad vertical pieces on either side of the cupholders. The stitching would have you think that they're upholstered, but they're not. It wouldn't have cost much to upholster these pieces with the same grade vinyl on the door inserts. I wish they had.

At the end of the day, neither is perfect but both are plenty nice for their intended purposes.


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## KnockKnock (Jun 30, 2005)

Rudy_H said:


> The manual / DSG, I think this is hinting at a S3 6-speed...


That was my first thought. The S3 DSG will be earlier, but if VW is certifying the drivetrain/platform, the chances of a 6MT S3 arriving later just went up thanks to VW and the R. opcorn:


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## The DarkSide (Aug 4, 2000)

Dan Halen said:


> At my current rate of driving, I'll have less than 25,000 miles at four years. :laugh:


0_o I think I average about that once a year.

I envy you. If my commute was that nice I'd go manual. I'm a HUGE proponent of the DSG, but that's because of where I live and my commute. As it is, one of the biggest lures of the S3 is the adaptive cruise control in stop and go traffic. My commute 1 way is 46 miles.. but coming home, 12 of those miles can take as long as an hour. I've had nothing but manuals all my life until I bought my 2010 GTI (DSG) in 2011..Before that was an 05 Golf TDi with a manual. Nothing was wrong with the Golf, but I got the GTI because I took a different job with the longer commute and I'd go batsh1t insane if I drove a manual every day into the heart of DC.


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## The DarkSide (Aug 4, 2000)

cjmoy said:


> VW also gives 2yr/24k included maintenance.


My 2010 GTI was a CPO.. I think maintenance was included until 30k for me.. which was right before the "big" maintenance bill of needing to get the DSG fluid change, etc. -_-


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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

​oh my god! That car is hot....now I just have to decide, the golf R manual or keeping my 2 kids and wife...and all of their stuff.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

BClear said:


> *Additionally, the pockets on the Audi door have plastic sides and a removable rubber insert at the bottom, whereas the VW has carpet on the sides and bottom. The Audi may be better for cleaning if you're frequently spilling liquids in there, but for my light usage, I can confidently say there will never be anything in my door pockets and thus the better covered VW door pockets win in my book, making it feel just a little more upscale. *
> 
> I did find the plastics on the center console of the Audi somewhat disappointing. Specifically the brushed plastic trim around the cupholders and the kneepad vertical pieces on either side of the cupholders. The stitching would have you think that they're upholstered, but they're not. It wouldn't have cost much to upholster these pieces with the same grade vinyl on the door inserts. I wish they had.


I'll have to give the MkVII another chance once it's on sale. What's stuck in my head is the absolutely inexcusable lapse in consistency of the interior in the MkVII R, so I was extra critical of the MkVII. It also doesn't help that I've just not cared for the aesthetic of recent VW interiors.

The bold portion is funny to me. Back in the MkV days, VW removed the nice rubber pocket inserts and replaced them with cheap felt inserts. My GLI has the rubber inserts all around; the Rabbit, felt in the front pockets and nothing in the rear pockets. I think the mouse fur-type lining they're using now is a little higher quality than the felt they fell back on for the later MkV cars, but I question the longevity. Soft touch was supposed to add an aura of class as well, and then it all went to ****. :laugh:

Like you, I don't put much in my door pockets. I don't need that crap rolling and rattling as I'm, uhh... _driving_. But... the auto detailer in me cringes when I see something like felt-lined door pockets. People are inherently slobs, it seems.

And you know what? We're sitting here nit-picking about door pocket lining for cripes sake. I guess that's a testament to the overall quality and cohesiveness of these interiors.... except the CLA, which I'll just attribute to you now spending enough time with it to accurately assess it's shortcomings. 

Oh, and the knee bolsters...

There's a "mono pur" option in Europe that I hope we get. The S3 in LA did not have it, and I suspect the white A3 didn't, either, though I don't have photos to confirm for that one. The option can be seen *here*. Basically, it extends leather (or, more likely, leatherette) along the knee bolsters on the console and the armrests on the doors. It looks like it also upgrades the armrest between the front seats.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

kevlartoronto said:


> oh my god! That car is hot....now I just have to decide, the golf R manual or keeping my 2 kids and wife...and all of their stuff.


If you're half as obsessed with a row-your-own box in real life as you are here, I find it hard to believe your wife hasn't already rubber-stamped the Golf R, regardless of the small bind it may put on family duties. While it's certainly not an ideal car for transporting more than two people and their stuff, can't you rationalize a way to make your other car fill that gap? If you're a one-car household, well... sorry bud, you're hosed.

:wave:

If nothing else, I imagine she'd approve it to get you to shut up. I know I've really eroded my wife's ability to say no at this point. :laugh:


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

From audi.co.uk re: the mono.pur option:










_Visual accentuation of the knee pads and armrests in the doors, including stitching in the colour of the seat upholstery; the material of the interior elements underlines the high-grade character of the vehicle interior._


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## BClear (Jun 18, 2010)

Thanks for the info about the mono pur option Dan. Didn't know about that one. It sounds like it would fix my gripes with the knee bolsters. Hopefully it's offered here.


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## qtroCUB (Mar 22, 2005)

One thing I wish the A/S3 had that the Golf7 has is the climate windshield option. Living in a cold climate this would be great. During some of my cooler drives this winter I have had ice build up on the windshield just due to snowfall rate.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

Is that the glass with a very fine defroster grid built in, like what Range Rover has had for a while?

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## qtroCUB (Mar 22, 2005)

Dan Halen said:


> Is that the glass with a very fine defroster grid built in, like what Range Rover has had for a while?


No wires...



> Climate windscreen
> 
> Wireless electrically conductive layer in glass laminate. In Winter, accelerates defrosting and prevents fogging. In Summer, reflects solar radiation to reduce interior temperature. (Only in conjunction with advanced telephone connection).


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

That sounds ripe for exclusion on the US cars. We have confirmation that we'll get it?

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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

Hey Dan. I've never owned an automatic in my life. We own a house in the centre of Toronto. real estate and parking is a premium here to say the least. This means 2 cars is not going to happen. BUT, If I ever get a fun 2nd car it would be a s2000. I could probably convince her of a golf r if our kids weren't so young.


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

Pssh... kids. They can adapt and overcome. 

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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

Dan, the kids would fit fine, it's the endless baggage the wife requires to even go to the grocery store.  Funny, as my girls grow up my car requirement size will shrink. Directly inverse relationship.


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## Chuck2001 (Aug 12, 2011)

Directly inverse....damn that doesn't help me !

Worst is coming.

Keeping telling myself we'll adapt to whatever car size we have, but people keep telling me that doesn't work that way : - Car seat, Stroller, bags of supplies/equipment/clothing, bassinet/park, bouncer, high chair, WTTFFFF

Maybe we need a GL ?

Small fun incentive in my head : MTL Auto show next week, can't wait.
I'll probably go twice, with the wife, and then alone.
She's gonna whine after 1 hour...


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## kevlartoronto (Jun 10, 2012)

Hey chuck, you guys expecting? The rear facing car seat is a killer. Make sure you shop around for car seats because some take quite a bit more room than others. I couldn't sit in the front passenger seat with the car seat set up rear facing in our A4. Then the monster bugaboo stroller just fits into the trunk. Pile on all the other crap your wife insists on and the 8 pound child requires 45 pounds of gear! Mine are 5 and 2 so the stroller is almost gone. Wait til you want to fly somewhere on vacation!!!


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## Chuck2001 (Aug 12, 2011)

Plz dude.......really.....please....

Keep repeating : Love the wife, like my urban house (1 car household), love the w...... :banghead:


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## Dan Halen (May 16, 2002)

I feel your pain. If I didn't, I'd already be in a Cayman S. :-|

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## davewg (Jul 30, 2001)

Sorry to say it doesn't necessarily get any better as they get older. 

Maybe for a brief period after potty training, eating real food and before they get involved in sports/school stuff.

Mine are soon to be 13 and 14.5. Now its carpool, band equipment, family bike trips, taking them and friends hither and yon.


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