# Has anyone done this yet??



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

Has anyone stuffed a turbo VR in the rear of a cabrio yet?....Well aside from mine..


----------



## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

Let's see it


----------



## nbvwfan (Aug 15, 2007)

Yeah, ic:'s or it's a figment of the imagination.


----------



## 1999.5GTIVR6 (Jun 15, 2011)

iv seen it done in a couple vans, one vanagon local (2ish hours away) 
Done the same way with similar parts ?


----------



## nbvwfan (Aug 15, 2007)

The OP asked if done in a Cabby.
Van hybrids abound, Subaru, Tico, TDI, Porsche, ABA, ect
I was considering the a 2.5 Subaru in mine, but kept it OEM and did what was needed on the WBX.


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

I was just curious if anyone has done it to the cabrio yet. I decided to resurrect an old project after spending years building fast diesel trucks. I've done Cummins swaps in fords and made multiple magazines.. No hurry on this build it will take a while but it will get the same every nut and bolt quality. It is A combo of the gti vr6 I bought brand new in 96 and a 95 cabrio that's been in the garage for years. The build has only been started but yes it looks to be similar to any other a3 mid engine aside from extra bracing and top considerations. I'll get pics up soon but the motor is already sitting in the back of it.. I'm welding everything up now.


----------



## nbvwfan (Aug 15, 2007)

Cool.
Looking forward to the pictures and updates as you make progress.


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

There's no hurry on this one...
A little history-
I bought a brand new GTI VR6 in 96. It was actually a 96.5 The car went through phases, coilovers wheels. etc. It had been to car shows from, Chicago to VA and Florida. This motor had the very second 2.9l clone intake ever made. The first was Ralph Gilles...google him and Viper see what comes up...Any old timers remember his Corrado? The motor has P&P head schrick 268's, Titanium this and that...Lets say it was a very strong NA motor. Back when VR's were first being turbo'd we installed one of ATPs first prototype kits. This was before cast manifolds! So after all the work with ATP I have an original cast manifold coated, stage 5 turbo, downpipe blah blah blah. Basically most everything for a rather quick VR. I then acquired an 01 motor with 629 miles on it.. lol its on a shelf disassembled ..pistons are all coated etc.. So there's a crazy motor waiting to be built between the two.
Well I stripped the GTI for a full tower to tower roll cage and then decided to shift gears. I went out of state and picked up a 95 Cabrio (the last year for the Karman from Germany) I sold the GTI shell a few years ago and all this has just been sitting in the garage....for a long time. So now I thought I would just kick around some time in the garage and see what I could with this.. I thought about syncro because lets face it a strong VR has no hope of off the line traction. A3 syncro stuff has been hard to find so ... a couple of beers later..









Into This...










Now My wife thinks I have a drinking problem...lol


----------



## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

Oh snap this is cool! First time I've seen this... It's gonna make for a fun car in the summertime.

I'm interested to see what your going to do for a firewall and whatnot.. I'm assuming this is going to be a permanent convertible now lol


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

Firewall will have metal framing with likely a thick viewing plexi panel. The top will be fully functional. It all works out when you look at the reinforcement that has to go back in to stabalize the walls of the car. Stock the cabrio has a lot going on compared to any Jetta or GTI. This is a fun project that I have to squeeze in between work and full time school... and warmer days in the garage lol..this summer will be a very interesting transformation for this car.


----------



## chrgdVR (Aug 2, 2004)

Very cool I'm real interested to see how this is going to work out


----------



## krafty-max (Aug 14, 2010)

any updates on this swap?


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

Slow going lol...a lot of stripping..then after the club...j/k almost a bare shell. Just received a large order of steel today.. This weekend I hope to have enough structural reinforcement work to begin to mount the drive train..then more reinforcing..planning etc.. Lots of stuff to locate and mount that I do not want to have to drill and weld after paint. I am also trying to find a reasonable second k frame/ spindles etc (VR6) to put back in the front.

I have been analyzing playing with the tunnel to potentially X frame tie the front to the rear basically like an s2000 frame. Not that the cabrio rockers cant support it with their internal truss framing.. But I am looking at what I need to reduce the potential for cowl shake... Having a weight in the rear corner (oem) will no longer suffice. I anticipate some framing in the front to assist with this as there will already be some framing to mount a fuel cell, and a fully sealed trunk in the front....with a front radiator! So yea there will have to be a shaved bay of sorts.

At this point its provision after provision on top of consideration over consideration.


I have also been playing with the convertible top back on to see how far I can set it down in the chassis..to tuck it if you will. I need to break out the new top with all the fabric and straps locating the window etc when collapsed as it appears that fabric may be the limiting factor.

All said there's no hurry...well except for warmer weather..it sucks to try and heat the northern garage for just a couple of hours here and there.. Warm working weather welcomed!! Should be an interesting summer.


----------



## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

Watchingopcorn: should stuff a 12v cummins in there:thumbup: I miss my 97' 12v sooo bad that truck was nastyyyy


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

CasuallyWreckless said:


> Watchingopcorn: should stuff a 12v cummins in there:thumbup: I miss my 97' 12v sooo bad that truck was nastyyyy




Well kinda did that already.. I put an 05 CR Cummins in my daily mustang eating 04 F350...:laugh: It has a billet trans, conv/flywheel, injectors, studs. tuned, gears...all kinds of supporting mods for twins.. I decided to put the twins on hold for this.. But I am sure they will end up on there this summer. 
There's another one I put together..made Diesel power 3x (1 being one of the ten best), Diesel world and is now undergoing changes to make 8 Lug. Its twins and everything purty you can do to it..
Needless to say I've loved the dubs before the diesels and this will see that same level of effort.


----------



## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

:thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

Interested in the suspension setup. Are you worried about lousy driving dynamics?


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

rstolz said:


> Interested in the suspension setup. Are you worried about lousy driving dynamics?


Not at all. VR6 front suspension now front and rear = 4 wheel independent. I have had my GTI slammed with 500lb race springs etc..I am not doing that here. It is going for function so it will not be slammed. Lowered does not always equal better handling. I will maintain coilovers though to assist in dialing it in. The trick becomes balancing the front and even more so braking balance.

I used to auto-X with the Corvette and Porsche clubs. The goal here is to have a stupid fast fun driver I can take from Michigan to Florida.. hit the drag strip and auto-x if I want..all while besting run of the mill c6+ corvettes. Will it who knows..but it sure will be fun trying!


----------



## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

Twin vr6 do ittttt search durocco its a twin 16v Rocco  something superrrrr boss:thumbup:


----------



## AJmustDIE (Dec 22, 2010)

Really glad curiosity got me on this threads title... GREAT stuff man. :beer:


----------



## vr6_rabbit (Jan 21, 2011)

*good job and good luck.*

i hate you so much... :beer: when i had the money and parts i was going to do a vrt swap into my mk1 rabbit trunk. the only thing i didnt have.... skillls to do so. im really excited to see the progression of this.:thumbup:


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

Hope to have a progress update this weekend...thinking of calling it the lead sled after all the metal going into it. Metal is not just for the rear but for the whole chassis to eliminate as much cowl shake as possible inherit to a convertible chassis. Just going to have to throw more power at it to make up for it :laugh:


AJ.. just noticed your in Ocala..if your there in ten years when this gets done you may see it..The plan is a fun driver that will make it to my retired inlaws in Ocala from MI. :beer:


----------



## VWDugan (Mar 22, 2001)

so badass...in for updates


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

LOL had my weekend cut short..ran out of welding gas fri night 

School started up again...this will slow things up.. Just looked at my pics..lol sooo blurry. I'll post up after I get back out there next weekend and get better ones. But so far.. The engine sits on its own mounts. seam welding started, lots of stripping undercoating. Interior out except dash and door cards...tan puffies for free if anyone wants them! Its good to find the only rust on the car is the bottom of the front passenger fender...nice clean car. Originally a NY/NJ car imagine that!
Acquired extra VR k frame spindles etc. Hopefully this weekend be able to push it out on its own wheels and power wash years worth of garage buildup out of it...weather depending.

Still lots of engine compartment to do, notch rails etc, build main tower bracing, seam welding. Plan mounts for battery blah blah blah...
The intent is to put jack rails under the bottom with ladder braces tying the sills to the inner subframe and tunnel (which will be reinforced) to the new engine compartment framing. Front towers along with firewall mods and maybe some interior rail bracing as well. Working how it will tie to a new front sub frame area for the fuel cell and trunk. All this is not due to an engine in the back but is aimed at taking the chassis flex out of a convertible. If it works out as I think it should I can flat bottom panel the car. I live near railroad tracks and I plan to cross them with next to no cowl shake. If I can do that I can then begin to consider putting it occasionally on a track. Lots of research happening here! Weight...I can make up for that with power...and what most fwd VR's lack.. traction with that power. Besides it will be a fun 2 seat convertible....no radio needed I will control that with my right foot!


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

Thought I would post a couple pix since they are up in the for sale thread.... for the manifold that is.. 
Just mocking things up as time, school and work permit. I need to work something out that will position the turbo lower. I'm thinking of just coming off the stock manifolds since they are already opened up massively and actually flow good. Besides they would center the turbo better for the hot side (discharge) to have a nicer shot over the trans if I go SRI. Thinking about reworking the clone intake though. I want to keep that low end/ mid range for driving and that manifold alone will challenge cross bar placement. One thing I hope to achieve is sinking the collapsed top lower into the body and that depends on that bar placement..we'll see as it all comes down to that little piece of fabric between the bottom of the rear window and the frame.. 
Please excuse the mess it's a sloooowww work in progress.


----------



## rstolz (Jun 16, 2009)

Looking good! like the plan too. Those things don't have a ton less rigidity than the hard tops as is due to extra bracing included from factory, and with the bracing you're planning that thing should be rock solid. 

I still worry about snap oversteer in a setup such as this. Throttle modulation, especially around corners will be tricky. Big power to the rear, short wheelbase and light front end; like an old porsche...


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

Lol....throttle steer ! Should be fun. The vr should make a good rear placement because of its forwardness to the wheels. That puts more of a weight shift on the front wheels wityh better balance compared to the Porsche having the motor behind the wheels. Either way overersteer is a lot more fun the the plowing undrsteer of a vr.


----------



## krafty-max (Aug 14, 2010)

any updates on this thing?


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

I have done quite a bit to it...then spun a bearing on the truck. Had to put the cabrio aside to rebuild the truck. Since its apart I'm building to support over 1000 HP. Needless to say all said its probably 10k deep motor alone. No hurry on the cabrio though.. This will be a very capable special car when done. I knew it would be a few winters worth of work though.


----------



## FER86GTI (Jul 22, 2010)

This thread needs more updates!


----------



## Benny The Jetta (Aug 9, 2005)

this is incredible, much respect, subscribed!!


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

LOL guys..

This one is on pause for a while. Likely until next winter. I had to shift the focus to getting the truck back on the road and that has turned in to a frame up 1000 hp rebuild. It is a lot of $$$ away from getting done! All said I'll have 6k into a short block alone! Diesels are expensive!!

Rest assured the cabrio is not going anywhere. It has a sweet spot for me.. The mock up motor and most all of the drive train bits are from a 96.5 GTI VR6 I bought brand new with 4 miles on it in 96. That car had been to shows and autocross events all over the place. Believe me my winter beater is a 98 TDI jetta.. the A3 is still fun to drive.. I just miss its ability to do it in a stupid fast manner!

I can say this about the stopping point. Motor is in, k frame everything in the front and rear mounted. It is nearly a rolling chassis. Fuel cell and all the metal is there to start the front. All the rubberized coating is half stripped from under the car. I will be adding additional under carrige bracing to reduce any chassis flex and act as a jack rail.. There will be under dash or front firewall bracing as well.

The engineering pause.. Rear suspension. FWD Macphearson setups have the tendency to change toe slightly when the suspension is compressed. Not an issue for fwd. However in the rear this can be a major problem especially with power squatting. In other words Loading it hard at 60 mph can squat the back and when the tires break loose it can induce an instant doughnut! Personally I think it sounds like fun but I am sure it will scare the **** of some soccer mom in the next lane. One major point of putting it back there is traction. It will be a driver with a conservative 500hp but built for more like 750. In order to use all of the 500 there is no room for error. So it must be right.

So I am at the point that I have to design an upper A-arm link. Not a problem as it will tie to the reinforcements that have to happen in the rear anyway. The largest part of the build was to try and maintain as many oem VW parts as possible. But I have to admit I started looking at tearing it all out and finding a complete Porsche rear suspension to put in there. That would be a whole new level though. Intimidated by that..no not at all. I just need to justify the requirement by exhausting the other options first i.e. audi parts syncro parts etc. They are just hard to find laying around in these parts.


Aside from that every now and then my pile of cool parts gets added to so it is not forgotten. Besides almost every time I'm in the garage it seems like I stop, look, ponder, rethink and re-engineer it lol. 

Believe me when I say I can't wait until I can put all efforts and cash flow into it.. but know I am not in a hurry because that's when you cut corners just to get it done... and that's just not my style.


----------



## veearesixT (Dec 15, 2005)

*Its for sale*

If anyone is interested LMK.


----------



## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

veearesixT said:


> If anyone is interested LMK.


I'm interested in how your goin to do the shift linkage


----------



## Ghizer (Sep 8, 2013)

*Shifter*

I would have been interested in how the shifter was going to be done as well because obviously this guy does great work. My project is the VRT Ghia and my plan is to use a Toyota MR2 shifter with a Boxter set of cables and a Passat trans bracket. Things will required some tweeking but I am optimistic it will work. 

However this discussion seems academic, if you will note the previous post to yours indicates he's looking to sell the project.
Cheers


----------

