# Lease Payments...



## Domdog31 (Aug 30, 2006)

whats the typical lease payments going around for an eos? i know mine is way too expensive for the car (but i love it) i priced around and I put 2k down and for the price i pay i could lease a BMW, Caddy, AudiA4s, and countless other higher lux cars....but just wanted to see what people are paying if u dont mind give me a range...my range is with 1750 miles a month 2k down around 475-515 a month (yes HIGH for a VW)
just wondering!!


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## Small5 (Jan 19, 2007)

i lose
NJ
2k down
5 yr lease
12,000 miles a year
$634.XX
by the time I signed the papers, i needed a car and had no time to go anywhere else....oh well so be it.


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## jgermuga (Jan 11, 2007)

*Re: Lease Payments... (Domdog31)*

In figuring out if a lease is a good deal or not, you must consider all the factors, not just the monthly payment. So it makes no sense to compare the Eos to higher priced cars based on advertised lease rates. 
From my experiance, I have never been able to get close to any of the advertised deals. They are usually for base models and once you deviate from the "special" deal, all bets are off. And since there are more factors involved in a lease, it's easier for the dealer to "hide" costs. 
Of particular note is the money factor which essentially equates to the interest rate. Most of the advertized deals are based on an exceptional rate and it is easy for the dealer to excuse this by saying you do not have top notch credit. I sometimes wonder if the anyone qualifies for these rate because doing the math, some are around 2% APR.
Another variable they can sometimes play with is the residual value. This has pros and cons, some of which were discussed in another post here. 
However, none of this applies specifically to the Eos and should have no bearing in comparing it to other cars. The level playing field is the price paid for the car, and this is as true for leasing as it is for buying. Anything after that is purely an element of the financial deal you are able to make.


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## jgermuga (Jan 11, 2007)

BTW, one of the car mags did a great article on this. I can't find a link to it but you might be able to google it.


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## Small5 (Jan 19, 2007)

Please dont get me wrong, I'm absolutely loving the EOS.
I just wasn't expecting the lease price jump from my RSX.


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

hey small, " it costs big bucks to play with trucks" what ever thats got to do with it ? ha whats a rsx? is that a nissan? I had a good buddy was a car salesman and they get ya either way lease or buy, they just look at the car look at the miles, ive never leased ,but its a horse apiece. doug


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## Small5 (Jan 19, 2007)

what's an rsx? wow really...ok...
my previous car was a 2004 Acura RSX Type-S


_Modified by Small5 at 3:31 PM 4-20-2007_


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## Domdog31 (Aug 30, 2006)

*Re: (Small5)*

smalls...atta boy...ill admit it i pay 515 a month 39month lease


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

domdog, wow that is high,, itd be cheaper just to hire a limo? ha honest i didnt have the foggist what the hell a rsx was, ha, naw those car dealers get ya one way or the other. Doug


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## wkc (Mar 25, 2007)

Just got a base Candy White 2.0T with Auto. With zero down and all in (with tax and all fees go into the lease payment), $513 a month for 48 month. (about $440-$450 if pay tax and fees up front). $721 total out of pocket at delivery.



_Modified by wkc at 6:17 PM 4-20-2007_


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## rockmtnvwboys (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: Lease Payments... (Domdog31)*

Don't usually post money-talk, but my partner and I are newbies to the forum but not to VWVortex-- he's a VW convert (I've had Jettas since I was 16) and can't get over the Eos.
Frankly, neither can I. I never dreamed I could afford a German convertible, not to mention THE COOLEST CAR EVER.
Thanks to VWVortex's hosts and all of you who post. 
Lease:
4 yr
12K mi
$536 down
$511/mo w/Denver tax


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## darien (Oct 28, 2006)

*Re: Lease Payments... (rockmtnvwboys)*

Ok, my lease for my EOS Sport package is
3 yrs
$650/month w/TTL and Texas Tax
$2K down
12K miles
I know mine is a little expensive, but I had it since October '06 (when the dealers were not talking deals at all). Having a blast since then. With that monthly payment, I could gave gotten a Touareg. Hehe. But heck, I am saving money from the gas.


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## jgermuga (Jan 11, 2007)

Found that link... 
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/....html


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## minnvw (Oct 16, 2006)

very interesting article jgermuga, no wonder my dad never leased a veichle or advise us boys to lease one. thank you Doug


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## wkc (Mar 25, 2007)

good link, jgermuga!
That's why I always put zero down and even have the tax and all the fee roll in.
I just drove away my EOS from the dearler today with just $700 out of pocket.


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## jmg3637 (Jul 17, 2006)

*Re: Lease cost of a 3.2*

I have seen many people giving terms of their lease for a 2.0, but I have not seen anybody who was getting a 3.2. Since the cost is much higher I am sure that the payments go up at least proportionately.


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## drewster (Feb 20, 2000)

*Re: Lease cost of a 3.2 (jmg3637)*

Just got my base Eos yesterday. Yay!
My deal is as follows
48 month lease
up to 12k miles/yr.
$2K down
$461/month for the first 10 months (tax credit on trade-in), then $503/month after that with Washington State tax.


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## passat06boi (Feb 1, 2006)

$1000 down
-$6000 Neg. Equity
15,000/year
48 months...
$554/month.


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## blachman (Mar 5, 2007)

Here are the terms I got for a 2007 EOS 2.0T Sport DSG w/18" wheels, Eismeer Blue/cornsilk beige
MSRP 35915
Invoice 33431
Invoice + Calif. destination, etc. 33850
Dealer holdback 1075
My price was 33431 (straight invoice). Since I bought this only 4 weeks ago and I understand the invoice prices increased $500 at the 1st of the year, and my EOS was manufactured in October, I think the dealer did ok.


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## blachman (Mar 5, 2007)

Oops. Sorry, I forgot the lease terms. Here's the complete information:
Anyway, here iare the terms I got for a 2007 EOS 2.0T Sport DSG w/18" wheels, Eismeer Blue/cornsilk beige
MSRP 35915
Invoice 33431
Invoice + Calif. destination, etc. 33850
Dealer holdback 1075
My price was 33431. Since I bought this only 2 weeks ago and I understand the invoice prices increased $500 at the 1st of the year, and my EOS was manufactured in October, I think the dealer did ok.
My lease is with US Bank and is zero down, money factor of 0.00241 (5.8%) with 20,474 residual (57% vs. 58% through VW even though my payment is lower than it would be with VW). I paid title and tag fees up front of $350.00. That was my total initial outlay (plus 1st lease payment).
Monthly lease payment includes tax and the costs of the lease ($795 bank acquisition, $195 broker fee, $295 documentation and courier fees). Gap insurance is standard. Total payment is 536.27 at 15,000 miles per year, 3 year lease, mileage penalty of 18 cents/mile.
Needless to say, I'm having a blast with my EOS.
Branton


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## T-Tail (Aug 8, 2006)

Considered a lease, but the corresponding interest rates (money factor) was just too high to convince me. Traded in our 99 Miata, put $8k more down to make the loan 20-21,000. Payment is $400/month, which is near the top of my subjective "what I'm willing to pay monthly for a car".
considering the lease payment (from VW) for a $37,000 Toureg was the same as the $28,500 Base Eos, it's hard to imagine you're getting a good deal. I know, apples and oranges, but money is money.


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## ialonso (Aug 26, 2006)

I think that since the Eos actually made the list of carbs better conserving their value after three years, we are getting robbed at leasing, since the leasing folks are adding a large margin in case the cars don't hold their value.
I would like to hear some info on the ballon payment option at the end of the lease if you were to keep the car. This may end up being much lower than the actual value of the car, so maybe you can recoup some money by purchasing and reselling the car at the end of the lease.
Regards,
Israel


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## kpiskin (Apr 6, 2007)

*Re: (ialonso)*

I have always believed that unless you own a business and can write off the cost of a lease as an expense, then you're truly better off buying the car. The thing that gets me now is that dealers expect down payments with leases. The whole idea in the lease was to be able to get a person into a car who could not otherwise afford it and make it more affordable on a monthly basis (not the long term). Of course customer never ends up owning the car. So they constantly keep the little guy down by forcing the him to make payments for eternity. Basically it's jut a cheaper form of a rental car. The dealer gets the car back and sells it to someone else more than they tell you it's worth of course or give you the option of buying the car from them at an elevated price so they can get you coming and going. Sorry, I really don't like leases.
The other thing that always gets me is when the dealership tells you that you're making a good investment in buying a particular car. Only 0.1% of the cars out there ever actually become worth more than when you originally bought them, so in my mind each and every car you buy is a liability. Sorry, I've bought too many cars.......


_Modified by kpiskin at 5:50 AM 5-11-2007_


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## WolfsburgerMitFries (Jul 4, 2005)

*Re: (kpiskin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kpiskin* »_I have always believed that unless you own a business and can write off the cost of a lease as an expense, then you're truly better off buying the car. 

You are much better off buying the car, just do the math. If you buy something with low demand/low resale value, like a minivan, then it might make sense to lease it. But any high demand car is just too easy to sell and recover a lot more of your costs. Just put an ad in Autotrader.com or Cars.com or if you're in a big city, you could probably unload the car with a free ad on Craigslist.
Everybody looking for a used car wants a *1 owner* car. You're just in too perfect of a position to give the car back to the dealer and let them make a big profit on your clean, low mileage, 1 owner car. A lease is a tool that's designed to beat you up.




_Modified by WolfsburgerMitFries at 10:47 AM 5-11-2007_


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## jgermuga (Jan 11, 2007)

*Re: (WolfsburgerMitFries)*


_Quote, originally posted by *WolfsburgerMitFries* »_
You are much better off buying the car, just do the math. If you buy something with low demand/low resale value, like a minivan, then it might make sense to lease it. But any high demand car is just too easy to sell and recover a lot more of your costs.


This is factored into the lease as the residual value and actually the opposite of what you state is true, you are better off leasing a high demend car with a high resale IF you are able to negotiate a good deal.
In fact, if you were to look at the amortization table on each payment stream, you will pay more in the short term for purchasing the car because the interset paid is based on the entire cost of the car, whereas the interst paid on the lease is calculated on the "rent", which is the amount the car will depreciate over the term.
Where buying the car makes sense is when you keep the car for longer than the term of payment.
This can also be negated by banking the difference in the purchase and lease payments and buying the car at the end of the term. You may even come out ahead if there interest rates rise during the period of the payments.
Really the best possible scenario is to lease a used car, since you are not paying rent during the time period where the car depreciates the most.
Also, if you look at Branton's post, he did a great job with negotiating his lease, used a third party and is getting a decent market interest rate.
The reason the Toureg is so much cheaper is that the dealership is eating the interest rate. I ran the numbers and the interest rate on the Toureg lease deal is below 1%. I actually used this to my advantage when I negotiated my deal because I pointed out that VW had some "cheap money" available, and asked if could be used for the Eos? After some deadpan looks, the sales manager left and came back with a payment of more than $100 a month less under the exact same terms we were working on.
What helped me is I walked in knowing exactly what the numbers should be on a fair deal.
And although I am not a tax expert, I find leasing a car is _easier_ at any rate for a business as there is less paper work involved. If you lease, you just multiply the portion of the miles driven for business use by the payment and you're done. In a purchase, you have to track all your receipts for service, do your own calcs for depreciation, and live with what uncle sam says is the depreciation schedule. I am sure there are some scenarios where it may cost more or less depending on how long you hold onto the car, but I didn't dig that deep into it.


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## archiea (Nov 29, 2006)

great thread...
I lease so that I have a lower cost of ownership for the first three years if I don't have a steady stream of income (freelance) and if I want the option of just walking away from the car at around the time most factory related reliability issues crop up (3 years). Its a higher cost of ownership in the end, but I am paying for that conveneience. So you lease nay-sayers, the benefits are a lower monthly cost, an no long term car maintenance (all under warrenty period) for a relatively consistant monthly cost. Unlike houses, car's don't gain equity, so "renting" does have its benefits.



_Modified by archiea at 11:37 PM 5-12-2007_


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## kpiskin (Apr 6, 2007)

*Re: (archiea)*

I'm not saying there aren't good reasons to lease. I think leasing is also good if you want to replace a car every couple years and know you'll be making a payment no matter what or want to avoid losing a boat load of money during the period of greatest depreciation.


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## archiea (Nov 29, 2006)

just wondering for you california folks.. have you heard of SCUDA fees? What fees should we be charged beyond the MSRP, destination fee and taxes?
Thanks!!


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## mark_d_drake (Aug 17, 2006)

*Re: (archiea)*

Never heard of them, neither has google apparently...


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## neweosowner (Nov 25, 2006)

*Re: (archiea)*

Just a guess, but those are probably advertising fees - i.e. fees charged to cover the cost of "Southern California (Volkswagen?) Dealers Association" advertising in newspapers and on television that you probably don't even watch, and certainly advertising cars you don't buy. Advertising fees are a relatively common fee across the U.S. I believe...doesn't mean everyone pays it.
See if it's a "V" not a "U", and if it's around $200 or so.


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## aflaedge (Jun 27, 2006)

*Re: (neweosowner)*

To get the first one sold in Virginia..

8000 down
609 a month
sold my soul

not leased... purchased.



_Modified by aflaedge at 6:06 AM 5-18-2007_


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## Craige-O (Mar 1, 2002)

*Re: (aflaedge)*

$2134 down
$399.00 month
4 years
That is a current lease program from VW on the east coast...


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## archiea (Nov 29, 2006)

just wondering for you california folks.. have you heard of SCUDA fees? What fees should we be charged beyond the MSRP, destination fee and taxes?
Thanks!!


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## jmg3637 (Jul 17, 2006)

*Re: (archiea)*

I just picked up my EOS today, and am certainly happy with it. 
I just wanted to be sure that others are very careful in looking at the lease terms.
They tried to go with VW financing that was using a .00465 money factor for a 48 month lease. while I do not totally undrstand the conversion between money factor and interest rate, I do know how to analyze a financial transaction and knew that the residual was way too high for the payments I was making.
after much discussion they reshopped the transaction and ended up at US Bank which came in at a a money factor just below .003 This will save me over 5000 over the next 4 years.


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## wkc (Mar 25, 2007)

Multiply the money factor with 2400 is roughly your interest rate. .003 is about 7.2%. .00465 would be about 11.16%


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## archiea (Nov 29, 2006)

I think its a clear message: DON'T FINANCE WITH VW.


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## itsmejerry (Jan 31, 2003)

*Re: (wkc)*

Great thread. 
I glanced at it last night before it really got going, and was going to say that the topic is inconsequential as a comparative topic because lease payments are determined by MSRP, and since not everyone has the same car, comparing payments would be apples/oranges....
However...
Since it's gone sort of to the "is it better to lease or buy" discussion, I'll chime in.
Leasing makes sense if:
1. You're the kind of buyer who is in and out of a car every 2-3 years (60% of American buyers) and who does not want a (higher) 36 month car payment. Since most people who finance cars do so with a 60 month loan, it doesn't make sense for them to finance 60 months, trade out at 36 months and have a car that's worth less than the remaining balance of the loan. (what most people call negative equity or being upside down). 
2. You want a lower payment and/or a nicer car. 
Buying(Financing) makes sense if you plan on keeping the car long after the loan period ends, or if you drive more than 20,000 miles a year and you're not leasing for a business. Remember-- it is a depreciating asset. It will never be worth more than what you pay for it, unless its a Shelby Cobra. 
That being said, If you're financing, I'd recommend financing no more than 48 months. At least at 24,36, or 42 months you're on the positive side of the equity equation. 48 months is "iffy" in certain car models but most cars financed for 48 months should be in a positive equity situation after the first year to year and a half of payments. 
Paying cash for a car makes sense only if you are making less interest on the money you have invested/ in the bank than the current interest rates being offered. 
I've talked people into keeping their $30,000 in their investment accounts which is making 12-15% annually, and financing a car at 4.9%. 
Another advantage to leasing: 
If you wreck the car, you are only responsible for getting it fixed. Once you do so, there's no additional deprication. 
If you buy a car and wreck it, even if it's fixed, when it's appraised for trade-in, it won't be worth what a non-repaired, non-repainted car would be and will appear on Car-Fax as a wrecked vehicle.


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## DCubed (Oct 25, 2004)

*Re: (blachman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *blachman* »_Oops. Sorry, I forgot the lease terms. Here's the complete information:
Anyway, here iare the terms I got for a 2007 EOS 2.0T Sport DSG w/18" wheels, Eismeer Blue/cornsilk beige
MSRP 35915
Invoice 33431
Invoice + Calif. destination, etc. 33850
Dealer holdback 1075
My price was 33431. Since I bought this only 2 weeks ago and I understand the invoice prices increased $500 at the 1st of the year, and my EOS was manufactured in October, I think the dealer did ok.
My lease is with US Bank and is zero down, money factor of 0.00241 (5.8%) with 20,474 residual (57% vs. 58% through VW even though my payment is lower than it would be with VW). I paid title and tag fees up front of $350.00. That was my total initial outlay (plus 1st lease payment).
Monthly lease payment includes tax and the costs of the lease ($795 bank acquisition, $195 broker fee, $295 documentation and courier fees). Gap insurance is standard. Total payment is 536.27 at 15,000 miles per year, 3 year lease, mileage penalty of 18 cents/mile.
Needless to say, I'm having a blast with my EOS.
Branton

Invoice on your car is 33850, not 33431...just FYI. All regions have their fees, since they very, there is a baseline, but that is not an actual invoice price.


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