# Bled brakes but still very soft.



## kmiv (Mar 20, 2013)

I was referred to this section from my thread in the mkiv section. Here's the thread if anyone wants to read all the details(brake problem starts at post#10): http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5991621-Got-a-01-Jetta-VR6-handed-down.. 

:wave: 
2001 Jetta VR6 
I had to replace my rear-right pads+rotor, when trying to push the caliper back, it wasn't going anywhere. I even got the special tool from advance auto parts - and actually bent the little T handle because the piston wasn't moving. After hours of trying i was so mad i disconnected the caliper(thinking i'd need a new one anyways) leaving the hose dripping and started hammering it. Finally i got it to move and the caliper is fine now. 

So meanwhile i was reading up on some brakes stuff and stupid me - thought i could just pump the brake a few times to get that old fluid out and then pour new brake fluid later on and it would be fine - silly guy. BUT, instead of hitting the brake i hit the clutch:banghead:, i'm not sure if that's the problem right now or not. So i put everything back together, i pour new brake fluid and try the brakes and bam they go down to the floor.. 
So i read up on bleeding the brakes, and i did it; TWICE. In the correct order, with someone pumping/holding down the pedal, and until a steady flow of fluid is coming out. I heard/saw some air come out a few times. But they never go hard when pumping.. i'm always able to push them half way down while the car is off. And once i turn the car on i'm able to push them almost all the way in.. 

What it is right now - if i pump the brake while the car is off the pedal stops about 1/2 the way down, it gets a little harder but i can still press it half way down. And then i turn the car on - i can ALMOST press it fully down. I drove it around the block that way and it stops, the brakes work, but i just have to push the pedal much further than should be normal and i know that's not good. 

Thanks for any help in advance, the guys in the other section were pretty helpful too but said you guys here are specialists for brakes.


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## XClayX (Apr 30, 2005)

You have air some where still in the system. Did you bled all 4? If not you really should. Any leaks? Brakes need to be atleast changed in sets. Rears both sides etc. 

Edit: Replace the siezed caliper... Seriously, if its that bad its done. You'll just blow through brake pads trying to get it to work.


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## kmiv (Mar 20, 2013)

I did all 4 tires fully. I did the whole procedure on all 4 tires twice. And in the correct order rr, rl, fr, fl. 
I called my local repair shop, asked him about what if it's the master cylinder, they said if i get them a new master cylinder they'll charge me 180$ for the labor which is pretty cheap i'd say. So i'll get one and just do that.


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## germancarnut51 (Mar 23, 2008)

You have ABS. You need to do an ABS Pump bleed. 

You need VAG.com OR a trip to the VW Dealer to accomplish this.


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## kmiv (Mar 20, 2013)

germancarnut51 said:


> You have ABS. You need to do an ABS Pump bleed.
> 
> You need VAG.com OR a trip to the VW Dealer to accomplish this.


 ,I dropped it off at the shop its a vw/ Audi shop and told him that some people think it might be the abs he said they'll try to bleed the whole system and then see from there what's wrong


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## kmiv (Mar 20, 2013)

Bump. 

The shop called me the first day saying they bled the brakes and there's no air in the system so it's the master cylinder, I had them replace it, the next day when he called me to say that it's ready he said the brakes still a little soft, so I picked it up and: while the car is off if you pump the brakes they get hard, but never to the point where you can't push them like in most cars. When I turn the car on and drive, I have to push the brake about 2/3 to 3/4 ways down. 
the brakes work and the car stops, but I'm afraid of the long traveling distance of the pedal in case of an emergency like coming to a sudden stop on a highway or being cut off and the brakes tnot respond right away.. 

Ideas anyone? Just to throw it out there, would the fact that I only changed ONE brake(pads+ rotor, rear right) have any effect on this? The rear right brake pads were gone, but my rear left one's are still pretty much fully there. (Also the car was standing for 10 months outside without being moved before this) 

TIA 

Edit: he also said they bled the abs pump.


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## hakershermarkt (Oct 31, 2009)

Your car does have disc brakes all around, right? 

I know that my car, with drums in the back, has had the similar issue when one of the shoes/drums is out of adjustment. It can throw the whole system out of whack and the pedal will feel really soft. (Reason being that the shoes aren't running up against the drum even when brakes are fully applied, and so the rest of the system doesn't have pressure). 

Not many of us are still rocking mk3s or earlier around these forums though, so I suspect that this information doesn't help you entirely.


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## kmiv (Mar 20, 2013)

They are disc brakes. It's a 2001 jetta it's an mk4


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## germancarnut51 (Mar 23, 2008)

You didn't take the car to a VW Dealership did you? I'm guessing that you did not take the car to a VW Dealership. 

Did you ask the mechanic at the shop how they bled the ABS Pump? the reason that I wrote for you to take the car to a VW Dealer is because the ONLY the Dealer Diagnostic Computer and VAG.COM can take control of the ABS Pump and turn it on so it can be bled properly. 

You cannot effectively bled the ABS Pump with a Pressure Bleeder OR by manually bleeding the brakes. 

The shop should not have let you leave with bad brakes after they told you the problem was the master cylinder and charged you to replace it. 

If you did not adjust the rear brake pad clearance after you replaced the rear brake pads, the brakes (whole car) are still going to be mushy, because the rear brakes must be properly adjusted for the brakes on the car to work. The parking brakes on the car must work in order for the rear brake pad clearance to be adjusted (rear brake adjusters work automatically when you use the parking brake). After working on the rear brakes, you must cycle the parking brake handle all the way up and down 100-200 times to adjust the rear brake pad clearance. 

If the parking brakes are not working properly, you need to repair the problem before you can hand cycle the parking brakes to adjust the rear brake pad clearance.


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## Drewdownkali (May 8, 2011)

Did you use the tool that rotate the cylinder as it compresses it?


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## Drewdownkali (May 8, 2011)

The rears have to be rotated as they are compressed.


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