# lifters wont bleed out



## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

brand new lifters wont bleed out i tired everything trying to get the air out with no luck... the lifters just stay soild.... what could be the reason for this. i even tried useing a turkey baster to try and force oil into the lifter


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

bump


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## WtErKeWlEdUbbEr (Jun 20, 2005)

I just soaked them in oil over night and installed them.


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

did you notice if the inside on the bottom was springy or if they where solid


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

up


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)




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## echokid98 (May 18, 2007)

WtErKeWlEdUbbEr said:


> I just soaked them in oil over night and installed them.


 soak em in oil overnight like ^ said and you should have no issues.


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## WtErKeWlEdUbbEr (Jun 20, 2005)

They were solid. They will not get "springy" while soaking in oil.


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

still not having any lucky with my lifter situation


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## skip57 (Nov 7, 2008)

use a hypodermic needle


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

steven12345 said:


> did you notice if the inside on the bottom was springy or if they where solid


I had the same concern when I did mine, did soaked em for weeks actually while getting my motor together, some springy some not.... stuck em all in and 3k miles later I don't have any issues, nothing abnormal. 

Hope that helps


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## 30vw2011 (Apr 8, 2011)

*bleeding lifters*

try using a vice with a piece of wood to force oil out lifters should be able to squeezed freely before installing them could risk bending valve they will pump back up after letting idle for a few minutes


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

i tried soaking them again, even tried useing a medicine dropper to force oil into the lifter and still solid. i see no air bubbles when pumping them by hand submergerd in oil. but once i pull it out of the air one air bubble emerges but they also feel soild still.? if they dont squezz freely im guessing there broke right? well anyway i decided to put a set of used lifters in the my car they had spring to them.... and the car is still taping... my guess is that the lifters arent filling up in the head. but iv cheecked the oil presure at the head and at the oil filter houseing and the presure seems good... so..... any other advice


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

Do you have heavy duty valve springs?
My valve train has always been noisy with HD springs, larger cam, even with brand new lifters.... of course I can't judge how bad your 'tapping' is :sly:

With my intake manifold, because its a large volume, I have also noticed the manifold amplifies the valve train..... are you on stock manifold?


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

yea i am running HD springs,and a cam. i am running a mkiv intake mainfold... i dont get it like i said its as if the lifters dont wanna fill up with oil.... but i know i am geting oil threw out the head. i manual pumped the oil pump with a drill and it was comein out all of the holes in the head


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## Glegor (Mar 31, 2008)

steven12345 said:


> i tried soaking them again, even tried useing a medicine dropper to force oil into the lifter and still solid. i see no air bubbles when pumping them by hand submergerd in oil. but once i pull it out of the air one air bubble emerges but they also feel soild still.? if they dont squezz freely im guessing there broke right? well anyway i decided to put a set of used lifters in the my car they had spring to them.... and the car is still taping... my guess is that the lifters arent filling up in the head. but iv cheecked the oil presure at the head and at the oil filter houseing and the presure seems good... so..... any other advice


lifters are supposed to feel solid when you put them in an engine.

if there springy, or not pumped up, they will tick like a MOFO.. 

i would never re-use a set of used lifters anyways..


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## 30vw2011 (Apr 8, 2011)

i do not claim to know everything but i am going to have to disagree you should be able to move them two reasons off the top would be if they push in and do not return this would be a collapsed lifter secondly if you are not able to move them hydro lock from fluid could bend a valve call your local auto machine shop if you like just thought i would share


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## Glegor (Mar 31, 2008)

30vw2011 said:


> i do not claim to know everything but i am going to have to disagree you should be able to move them two reasons off the top would be if they push in and do not return this would be a collapsed lifter secondly if you are not able to move them hydro lock from fluid could bend a valve call your local auto machine shop if you like just thought i would share


when you pull them out of a car, they are not spongy and while running, they arent either.


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

well i know is that they are not filling up and are still taping like crazy


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## Glegor (Mar 31, 2008)

steven12345 said:


> well i know is that they are not filling up and are still taping like crazy


have you actually went out and ran your car up to the red line?

ive had loud lifters before, and i took the car out for a good hard run, and when i got back, they were pretty silent..

that wasnt only on one car either.. ive had a few VWs like that..


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## 30vw2011 (Apr 8, 2011)

have you ever actually worked on a motor before


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## 30vw2011 (Apr 8, 2011)

seriously have you ?


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

Yea iv built 3. All aba


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

it's possible you got a bad set of lifter, I have had a bad one before... but the amount of oil pressure it takes to fill them is higher than you'll ever get with a medicine dropper. install them, and hold the revs about 2K for a couple minutes to let the oil pressure build and cycle through. It they still tap like crazy, I'd say call whoever you bought them from and tell them the problem. If they won't help, you might just have to buy another set.

There really isnt' a lot to go wrong with them, and they won't cause an interference problem if they've got air in them, they aren't tall enough to keep the valve open.


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

well this is my 2nd set of lifters and i drove both sets for bout 100 miles with no success


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

steven12345 said:


> well this is my 2nd set of lifters and i drove both sets for bout 100 miles with no success


Well, either you have an issue with the engine that's not providing enough pressure to pump them up, the cam is worn beyond what the lifters are made to adjust to, you're installing them wrong, or its not the lifters making the noise.


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

brand new cam, checked oil presure at the head and it holds just fine. just had the head all cleaned up and such. the motor is all new parts and bearings... how would i tell if my oil pump where craping out


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

hum..... maybe i should pull the oil pan and start the car on jackstands and let it run for a sec or two to see if anything is hiting or doing anything of that sort


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

up


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

steven12345 said:


> hum..... maybe i should pull the oil pan and start the car on jackstands and let it run for a sec or two to see if anything is hiting or doing anything of that sort


I'm sure if you did that, everything would be fine..... To tell if your oil pump is crapping out, although I think that is pretty rare, you would need a pressure gauge..
What weight oil are you using?


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

10w40 with lucas mixed


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

steven12345 said:


> hum..... maybe i should pull the oil pan and start the car on jackstands and let it run for a sec or two to see if anything is hiting or doing anything of that sort


ya, I wouldn't do that, lol.

listen, a lot of people have replaced they're lifters and cam without issue. It sounds like you're in over your head, I'd take it to a shop where they can propperly diagnose the issue. Nothing good will come from continuing this path.


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

i ran it by a shop and they told me its the lifters but what i dont get is how they cant give me a reason why


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

Do you have a oil pressure gauge?

Lifters don't fill up with oil for a couple of reasons
1) they are the wrong lifters
2) there isn't enough oil pressure
3) they are siezed 
4) the cam is too big (compressing the lifter on the power stroke)

I personally don't know of any other reasons.


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

well iv put 3 sets of new lifters, my oil presure at the head sits at 20psi at flat idle, the cam i am running is a 270 cam. and everytime i install new lifters they seem to seize.... maybe i should just slap the head on a used motor i have laying around. the motor has something like 199,000 miles but ran just fine before it was pulled outa the car


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

Thats a good idea.... i'm curious if there is something blocking some of the passages... how many are rock hard?


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

all of them.. its as if they wont fill up...i know for a fact i have oil geting to the head. i hooked up my impact gun threw the distributor hole to oil pump and manualy pumped oil and everything was clear.oil was coming out of every hole in the cylinder head


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

Every single lifter is solid?
That is certainly not normal... where did you pick up the cam from?
Do you have a stock cam?

You don't have any other heads?


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

Yea there pretty much all solid no movement except that they spin good. The cam is new from TT I had the stock cam before and still had the same problemm this is the second head if tired


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## Glegor (Mar 31, 2008)

ive never had an engine get springy lifters right away. they stay pumped up for a while..


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

Its only cause my girlfriends drives the car and thinks its gonna blow upi


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## Glegor (Mar 31, 2008)

steven12345 said:


> Its only cause my girlfriends drives the car and thinks its gonna blow upi


how long do you run a set of lifters before you take them back out and decide they are bad?

if they were indeed bad, and pumping up, the car would idle like hell once it warmed up.. because the valves would be being held open..


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

I'd say atleast 200 miles


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## Glegor (Mar 31, 2008)

i know you said you checked oil pressure, but what was the actual number? cold? hot?

all readings can be taken at idle.. how did you check? mechanical gauge screwed in the head?


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

psi at the side of the head is at 22 psi at idle warm....at cold it starts at 80 and drops


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

This at least means your head is getting good pressure, it doesn't guarantee that your lifters are though....

I would think they are, but it is strange that all of them are :thumbdown:


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

yea i dont get it i even checked the presure at the oil filter houseing and it checked out good as well... so....i donno whats going on


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## steven12345 (Jul 18, 2006)

i checked some other lifters i had laying around.... i let them sit in a bowl of oil about a week ago and for some reason no matter how much i try and get all of the air bubbles out there still there. it wont fill up..... as soon a take the lifter out of the oil and press on the center part a air bubble comes out. i thought they were soppose to fill up and no have any air bubbles in then at all.


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## jsneed (Jan 26, 2011)

steven12345 said:


> i checked some other lifters i had laying around.... i let them sit in a bowl of oil about a week ago and for some reason no matter how much i try and get all of the air bubbles out there still there. it wont fill up..... as soon a take the lifter out of the oil and press on the center part a air bubble comes out. i thought they were soppose to fill up and no have any air bubbles in then at all.


What is going to make them fill up? do you understand how a hydraulic lifter works? it takes alot of pressure to fill them, and they only fill up enough to keep contact with the cam lobe when it's at the bottom of the lobe. Bottom line, you will never get the air out of them because sitting in a bowl of oil doesn't push or pull the pad. Either you are doing something wrong in the installation process or there is something wrong with your engine/camshaft (ie, incorrect base circle). If the base circle of the cam is too small, no stock lifter will be able to adjust to it, because they are only there to set the valve lash. If the circle is too small, even when the lifter is full, it will lose contact with the cam lobe and make noise. Trust me, they will not fill up with oil sitting in a bucket, and you'll never get them full with a medicine dropper or needle. Take it to a shop that knows something about VW's, and they'll figure it out.


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