# Navigation System inaccurate, gets lost, does not show correct vehicle position



## mkla2000 (Sep 25, 2004)

*navigation calibration?*

I seem to recall reading a post on this, but can't find it, so I am re-starting a new one....

The "car" symbol on the nav screen seems to lag the actual position by up to 1/2 block.... when I make turns onto another street, for example, the map will sometimes indicate that I am turning into the block itself (instead of the street that I am on), and about 1/4 mile later, it will mysteriously "shift" the car location back onto the correct street.
I think I read that there is a fix for this... anyone recall?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: navigation calibration? (mkla2000)*

That problem came up before (on my Phaeton, actually). The cause of the problem was nothing to do with the nav system, it turned out there was an intermittent connection between the vehicle speedsensor input and the nav system.
Have your Phaeton technician do a diagnostic scan of your car, and check to see if there are any fault codes relating to the vehicle speedsensor. In my case, the problem turned out to be caused by a loose connector - all that had to be done to fix it was to just remove and reseat the connector.
Hope that works for you.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: navigation calibration? (mkla2000)*

Just a postscript: I note that you live in a big city. If you park underground (meaning, when you start the car up and start moving, the nav system has been unable to get a position fix from the satellite constellation), then the plotting of the vehicle position will be based on dead reckoning and inputs from acoustical gyroscopic accelerometers in the car, as well as inputs from steering wheel position.
The logic of the nav system is such that it assumes you will always be 'on the road' (the Phaeton not being an off-road vehicle), so, if there is a discrepancy between the calculated DR postion and where the streets are on the map, the vehicle position symbol will 'snap to the road on the map'.
It might be that what is happening is that you are starting your trip with no satellite reception, and as a result getting erratic DR until the car gets a good lock on the satellite constellation. It needs 4 satellites (with decent geometry) to define a postion. 
So - before heading to your dealership and asking them to check speedsensors, see if the problem happens when you are in a non-urban area (meaning, no 'urban canyons' to block satellite reception). For example, see how the nav system performs after you have parked in a big shopping mall parking lot. In a big mall lot, there will be no tall buildings to block the satellite signals, and no trees either. See if you can establish any correlation between satellite reception and the erratic vehicle position sensor. Be aware that the GPS satellite constellation works on line of sight only (strict line of sight) - you can sometimes have problems on a heavily tree-lined street.
The key issue is whether the car picks up a good position fix from the satellite constellation within the first 30 seconds of operation.
Let me know what you find out.
Michael


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## mkla2000 (Sep 25, 2004)

*Re: navigation calibration? (PanEuropean)*

I live metro LA area, but my house is actually in a suburb 25 miles from downtown (no high rises) - it seems to go on whenever I drive (and doesn't go away after driving on the open for a while - e.g. on the freeways) - I had ocasions where I actually missed an exit on the freeway because I thought I still had a way to go before hitting it (there were a few off-ramps close together, and based on the map, it looked like I still had some way to go before hitting the desired exit).
I will have the tech take a look at the connections (my car is in for 10K service right now).
Thanks for our reply as always, Michael.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: navigation calibration? (mkla2000)*

Hi John:
Based on that additional information, it seems unlikely your problems are related to satellite reception. If I was doing the troubleshooting, I would look at these three items, in this sequence:
1) Speedsensor input to nav system
2) Optical databus function from CD reader to nav system
3) GPS antenna function and connection to nav system
The first two are easy to troubleshoot, if there are any problems, the Phaeton will record a fault code that will be present when the Phaeton technician scans the vehicle with a 5051 or 5052 scan tool.
Correct function of the GPS antenna can be visually checked by going to the nav setup page on the infotainment display, and observing the number of satellites that the nav system picks up (and how quickly they are picked up following power-on). If the car is in an unobstructed area with a clear view of the sky, it should pick up at least 8 satellites within 2 minutes of power-on. This is a standard performance specification for a contemporary GPS navigation system, not Phaeton specific.
Michael


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## mkla2000 (Sep 25, 2004)

*Re: navigation calibration? (PanEuropean)*

my car is still in the shop - will advise the tech about your comments!
Thanks as always.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: navigation calibration? (mkla2000)*

Hi John:
How did it eventually get resolved?
Michael


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## mkla2000 (Sep 25, 2004)

*Re: navigation calibration? (PanEuropean)*

not solved yet.... just got a call from the service advisor that the CD Nav reader part that he was waiting arrived - they will replace the unit and see if that takes care of the problem. Keeping fingers crossed.


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## mkla2000 (Sep 25, 2004)

*Re: navigation calibration? (mkla2000)*

my dealer replaced the CD-ROM reader, but the problem is still there....


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: navigation calibration? (mkla2000)*

John:

Ask your dealer to give you a printout of a diagnostic scan for your Phaeton, that shows what fault codes are present in your vehicle. Then, let us know what the fault codes are. All of us can then have a look at them, and see if we can contribute any troubleshooting suggestions from our own experience.

Below is an example of an excerpt of a diagnostic scan, showing fault codes. This is from my own Phaeton. In this particular example, the car is reporting an intermittent problem with the reliability of the connector from the roof control module to the sunroof, and a steady problem with a short circuit in the rear cabin roof light. These two problems were easy to solve - the sunroof connector just needed to be re-seated, and the rear cabin roof light had a small manufacturing defect in it, it was replaced.

My guess is that the diagnostic scan report for your car will show problems with either the connection between the CD reader itself and the infotainment screen (this would indicate a possible problem with the fiber optic cable, maybe something as simple as a connector that is not seated properly on the back of the infotainment system), or, an intermittent speedsensor signal to the infotainment system. Either of these would explain the problems that you are encountering.

Another option is to invite your Phaeton technician to just post the results of the scan here, along with his or her observations, and we can all try to help out, according to our experience.

Michael


*Sample of a Diagnostic Scan Report, showing fault codes*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: navigation calibration? (mkla2000)*

For those of you who are having problems with your navigation system "getting lost" - in other words, with the GPS not showing the accurate location of the car:
The cause of that problem is communication errors between the different controllers in the vehicle. The fix to that problem is having your instrument cluster software (controller 17 software) flashed up to the most recent software level, which is xx21 (where xx refers to two numbers, typically 04, that will not change as a result of the update).
Please see the additional information contained in this post: TB: Distortion in the Display Unit in the Instrument Cluster (MFI, or Y24). Get that software update applied to your *instrument cluster*, and your navigation problems will go away. Don't attempt any troubleshooting or parts replacement related to the navigation system, because the cause of the problem lies in the network communications controller that is part of the instrument cluster, not in the navigation system.
Michael


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## aubergine2004 (Oct 2, 2009)

*map drift*

Hi This is my first here. Does anyone experience a drift of car location , by a few miles, on the map and in the navagation system?
...and are there remedies?


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## Auzivision (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: map drift (aubergine2004)*

Not sure why, but one time mine drifted out over a lake... good think it didn't sink. System reboot fixed it for... that turn off, get out, lock up and come back later... works for a lot of things.


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## Motorista (Oct 28, 2005)

*Re: map drift (aubergine2004)*

There's an area of approximately three city blocks near where I work where the car thinks it's "off road" approx. a mile to the right of where I actually am (albeit going in the same direction). Interestingly, I drove by the other day with the Acura and had the same effect. Perhaps some strong electromagnetic field. In any case, I've never had any drift except for this.
Stefano


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## ArtWarshaw (Feb 15, 2006)

*Re: map drift (aubergine2004)*

I have experienced this twice, once with four golf bags in the trunk. Removing the bags cured the problem. 
Second time it seemed to cure itself. I took it to the dealer on one of these occasions and I don't remember them doing anything to resolve it but it went away


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: map drift (aubergine2004)*


_Quote, originally posted by *aubergine2004* »_ Does anyone experience a drift of car location ...and are there remedies? 

To answer this question properly, we need to look at what the possible causes of inaccuracies could be. In order of probability, they are:
*1) The antenna has a poor view of the satellite constellation.*
The antenna for the Phaeton GPS receiver is located on the inner side of the rear window glass, approximately in the middle of the vehicle, about two inches down from the roof. There is an illustration showing the antenna location at this post: Antenna Locations. It is unlikely that anything on the vehicle or attached to the vehicle would block the antenna, unless there was some kind of decal attached to the rear window glass. Driving in 'urban canyons' (streets with high buildings on each side) can result in a loss of satellite reception, but the car will normally cope with this by using dead reckoning - it measures distance travelled by using information from the anti-lock brake system, and yaw (change of heading) by using information from the stability sensor.
The 'worst case' situation would be an obstructed view of the sky right after vehicle start-up, such that the car does not have an accurate position to begin with, and has to use DR right from the get-go. This could happen if you start up in an underground garage, make a few 180 or 360 degree turns to get out of the garage, then emerge onto a street with tall buildings on either side.
It is possible to see how many satellites the system is tracking by looking at the navigation data on the large screen between the two passenger seats. The owner manual explains which page contains this information. The system can track a maximum of 8 satellites, which is more than sufficient. It does not use SBAS (satellite based augmentation services, WAAS in the American implementation, or EGNOS in the European implementation).
If the rear window glass has been replaced on your car, investigate the possibility of antenna problems (loose connection to antenna) first.
*2) Early Version Communication Software in the Car*
This applies only to MY 2003 and 2004 cars. Two software upgrades are available for these model year cars to solve communication problems within the CAN (Controller Area Network) data bus. These communication problems can result in information not being passed quickly and reliably between the navigation controller (the CD reader) and the rest of the car. One software upgrade is available for the communications hub in the instrument cluster (the instrument cluster upgrade to a software version ending in '21') and that is discussed in great detail here: Instrument Cluster (MFI, or Y24) - How to reset the Display Screen . Another upgrade is available for the navigation CD reader (to software version 0168), that is discussed in great detail here: Navigation System inaccurate, gets lost, does not show correct vehicle position. Both of these upgrades are available from your VW dealer, however, due to the small number of Phaetons in North America, you will probably need to do your own research and explain the problem (and the fix) to your dealer.
*3) Degradation of Satellite Reception caused by EMI (Electro-Magnetic Interference)*
If you drive past a very high powered broadcast station - particularly one that uses frequencies close to those used by the GPS system - you might encounter _momentary_ degradation of GPS signal reception. There are several such locations in the area of the American National Capital region, they are well known to aviators. If you always encounter the same inaccuracy in the same location, this is likely the cause of the problem. Generally speaking, the problem will not extend beyond about a 2 mile radius, and there are relatively few of these areas in the USA. Close proximity to very large electrical installations (e.g. a generating station, a high voltage switching station) can also cause reception problems, but in this case, the problems usually disappear once you get more than 500 feet away. This means you should not even notice the problem unless you start the vehicle up in the parking lot of the electrical installation.
*4) Satellite System is intentionally transmitting degraded information*
The NAVSTAR satellite constellation (that being the formal name for the GPS system operated by the American military) is capable of providing highly accurate position information, however, that highly accurate position information can be intentionally degraded within very specific areas whenever the operator of the system deems that to be in the best interests of their security. In other words - if you are driving past sensitive military installations or locations that present a national security concern, you may find that the position information broadcast on the civilian signal (what we use) may be intentionally fuzzy. 
My guess - for most Phaeton owners - is that the problem will be caused by item 2, software. Have your VW dealer run a diagnostic scan of your vehicle and determine the software version present in controller 17 (instrument cluster) and controller 37 (navigation CD reader), then, read the information in the previously cited discussions that explains how to flash-update this software.
Michael


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## sachverhalte (Sep 16, 2007)

*Re: navigation calibration? (PanEuropean)*

Hi Michael,
I reported the NAV position lag to my dealer. They claimed that there was no tech bulletin for the flash-up to rev xx21. They insisted that the units go out of calibration from time to time...and said I needed a GPS recal. I refused the service. I have no faith in Boston VW on this issue.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: navigation calibration? (sachverhalte)*

Well, let's give the dealer the benefit of the doubt, in the sense that the TB does not specifically mention 'fixing GPS problems' as one of the problems that it solves.
That notwithstanding, there are *TWO *technical bulletins that may be applicable to your vehicle, they are as follows:
*1)* TB to flash the instrument cluster software (controller 17) up to a software version number ending in 21. This resolves communications errors across the CAN bus, which can be responsible for a multitude of problems - GPS navigation position errors included. You can find all the information about this TB at this link: TB: Distortion in the Display Unit in the Instrument Cluster (MFI, or Y24)
*2)* TB to update the software in the navigation controller (controller 37) and in the front display and control panel (controller 07). Be sure to read this entire thread very carefully - you have to match the software to the hardware version of the J523 (big front display) that is installed in your car. TB 90-07-01 "Clock Runs Too Slow" (Was: TB 90-05-05)
Michael


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## aubergine2004 (Oct 2, 2009)

*gps antenna problem*

Hi

I am having problems with my navigation and the vag com indicates the following:





Address 37: Navigation Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 887 A
Component: NAVIGATION 0147 
Coding: 0400000
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000

1 Fault Found:
00862 - Antenna for GPS Navigation (R50/R52) 
012 - Electrical Fault in Circuit

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 38: Roof Electronics Labels: 3D0-907-135.lbl
Part No: 3D0 907 135 B
Component: Dachmodul 0605 
Coding: 0000047
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000

2 Faults Found:
00220 - Connection to Sunroof 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00222 - Connection to Rain Sensor 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


My question is: Can you give some details about how i could reseat the sunroof connection which you said was easy to do ( earlier in thread)... plus some ideas about how to fix the gps connection? Aslo, do you think that these two issues may be related?

Thanks, Paul


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## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

*Navigation/Map unresponsive in a 2004*

Hi all, 
I'm less than a week into ownership so I'm still learning. 
Between last night and this morning I've had some unresponsiveness problems with the navigation. 
The infotainment system has even rebooted a couple of times. The navigation would do a variety of things and continually changed it's behavior. Sometimes certain soft keys would not function, when selecting the "map" hard key the unit would automatically go back to nav. I got messages several times in German and English that the "navigation" wasn't available. 
I shut the car down completely twice on the side of the road but may not have let the navigation CD reader go all the way off (of course it did overnight), nothing helped including using "reset" and switching CDs. 
I shut down at the hockey rink (son's game), let everything shut down including the nav CD reader and everything returned to normal ops. 
Was the Phaeton just displaying its ability to self-heal that I've been reading so much about here? 
Any other ideas? 
I'll put it on the Vag-Com when I get home to check for codes. 
Thanks, 
John


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Your problem is most likely caused by having software version 0147 in the navigation CD reader and software version 0312 in the instrument cluster. 

Let us know the software versions present in those two controllers. 

Michael


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## steveskinr (Oct 31, 2007)

John, 

I have the infotainment CD/DVD if you need it. I look forward to seeing your car. Come by soon since my checkride is finished. 

Steve


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## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

Thanks for offer Steve, I'll take you up on that. And thanks for all your advice up to this point! 
Michael, although we haven't officially "met", I feel like I know you on account of the hundreds of posts that I've read of yours! I cant say enough about what you do, simple awesome! 
I copied the autoscan of the car when I got it below, I'm not sure if that will show the software version, I see 07 shows 188. I searched around some, what's the easiest way to retrieve the software versions, I'm very much a beginner with the Vag-Com, I use it mostly for service resets on my TDI and small coding and adaptation changes to both. 
All the codes from the original scan have been cleared and stayed that way since except the 05 fault in the bumper attenna. The car goes to a Phaeton mechanic at the local VW dealer this week for state inspection and to check on a few things such as the plastic tube separating from the ball on the trunk harness, replacing both 6 year old batteries and look at the right headlight washer that is missing it's first tooth and won't extend. 
Its under platinum warranty until the end of the month, I am still undecided on extending, I have talked to Chris...we'll see what they cover on this visit! 
Thanks in advance for any advice! 
VCDS Version: Release 10.6.2 
Data version: 20101123 
* 
Wednesday,08,December,2010,11:04:24:52583 
* 
Chassis Type: 3D - VW Phaeton D1 
Scan: 01 02 03 05 06 07 08 09 11 13 15 16 17 18 19 23 27 28 29 2E 
* * * * *34 36 37 38 39 46 47 55 56 57 65 66 68 69 71 75 76 77 
* 
VIN: WVWAF63D448010588 * Mileage: 89460km/55587miles 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 01: Engine * * * *Labels: 4D0-907-560-BGH.lbl 
* Part No SW: 4D0 907 560 CS * *HW: * * * * * * 
* Component: 4.2L V8/5V * * *G * 0030 * 
* Coding: 0007873 
* Shop #: WSC 09460 444 999999 
* VCID: 79F2EA6549A5 
* 
No fault code found. 
Readiness: 0000 0000 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 02: Auto Trans * * * *Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl 
* Part No SW: 09L 927 760 C * *HW: GS1 9.0 4.1 * 
* Component: AG6 09L 4,2L V8 * * 1003 * 
* Coding: 0001102 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: 37762C5D3F31 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 03: ABS Brakes * * * *Labels: 3D0-614-517.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 614 517 R 
* Component: ESP 5.7 allrad *H33 0043 * 
* Coding: 0008376 
* Shop #: WSC 09460 000 00000 
* VCID: 31621245D155 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 05: Acc/Start Auth. * * * *Labels: 3D0-909-13x-05.lbl 
* Part No SW: 3D0 909 137 G * *HW: 3D0 909 137 G 
* Component: * *Kessy * * * * * *6850 * 
* Revision: 00H22070 * *Serial number: VWZ3Z0C7144693 
* Coding: 0137452 
* Shop #: WSC 09460 444 999999 
* VCID: 2B5E002DF379 
* 
* Part No: 4E0 905 852 E 
* Component: ELV * * * * * * * * 2141 
* 
1 Fault Found: 
00181 - Access/Start Authorization Antenna (in Rear bumper) (R136) 
* * * * * *011 - Open Circuit 
* * * * * * Freeze Frame: 
* * * * * * * * * *Fault Status: 01101011 
* * * * * * * * * *Fault Priority: 4 
* * * * * * * * * *Fault Frequency: 0 
* * * * * * * * * *Reset counter: 123 
* * * * * * * * * *Time Indication: 0 
* * * * * * * * * *Date: 2010.10.13 
* * * * * * * * * *Time: 10:24:22 
* 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 06: Seat Mem. Pass * * * *Labels: 3D0-959-759.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 959 759 B 
* Component: Sitzmemory D1 BF * *1520 * 
* Coding: 0000003 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 356A2655253D 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 07: Control Head * * * *Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 035 008 M 
* Component: * *ZAB COCKPIT * * *0188 * 
* Coding: 0500305 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 244CEB119EA7 
* 
1 Fault Found: 
00384 - Optical Databus 
* * * * * *004 - No Signal/Communication 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 08: Auto HVAC * * * *Labels: 3D0-907-040.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 907 040 G 
* Component: Climatronic D1 * * *1144 * 
* Coding: 0000002 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: 2240ED0984B3 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 09: Cent. Elect. * * * *Labels: 3D0-937-049.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 937 049 G 
* Component: STG.Bordnetz * * * *5001 * 
* Coding: 0000002 
* Shop #: WSC 09460 444 82797 
* VCID: 2E580939C06B 
* 
1 Fault Found: 
00907 - Intervention load Management 
* * * * * *000 - *- 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 15: Airbags * * * *Labels: 3D0-909-601.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 909 601 E 
* Component: 0G Airbag 8.4E+ H10 0934 * 
* Coding: 0012359 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 254AF615959D 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 16: Steering wheel * * * *Labels: 3D0-953-549.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 953 549 E 
* Component: Lenksäulenmodul * * 3401 * 
* Coding: 0000232 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 2F66143DC761 
* 
1 Fault Found: 
01752 - Heated Steering Wheel (Z36) 
* * * * * *010 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 17: Instruments * * * *Labels: 3D0-920-xxx-17.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 920 981 H 
* Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT RB4 0411 * 
* Coding: 0007221 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 2C5C0331F677 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 19: CAN Gateway * * * *Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl 
* Part No: 6N0 909 901 
* Component: Gateway KCAN * * *0101 * 
* Coding: 0000006 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: F0E457419ADF 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 28: HVAC, Rear * * * *Labels: 3D0-919-158.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 919 158 F 
* Component: Klima-Bedienteil D1 0117 * 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: 2E580939C06B 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 29: Left Light * * * *Labels: 3D0-909-157.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 909 157 
* Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(l) *X012 * 
* Coding: 0000001 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: E6C83119A81B 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 34: Level Control * * * *Labels: 3D0-907-553.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 907 553 B 
* Component: LUFTFDR.-CDC- 3C1V0 1101 * 
* Coding: 0017700 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 2648F119E89B 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr * * * *Labels: 3D0-959-760.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 959 760 B 
* Component: Sitzmemory D1 F * * 1520 * 
* Coding: 0000004 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 2D5A0E35CD6D 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 37: Navigation * * * *Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 919 887 A 
* Component: * *NAVIGATION * * * 0147 * 
* Coding: 0400000 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 32601D49D453 
* 
1 Fault Found: 
00625 - Vehicle Speed Signal 
* * * * * *004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 38: Roof Electronics * * * *Labels: 3D0-907-135.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 907 135 B 
* Component: Dachmodul * * * * * 0605 * 
* Coding: 0000047 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 2240ED0984B3 
* 
1 Fault Found: 
00222 - Connection to Rain Sensor 
* * * * * *004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 39: Right Light * * * *Labels: 3D0-909-158.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 909 158 
* Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(r) *X012 * 
* Coding: 0000001 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: E7D63C1DAF11 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 46: Central Conv. * * * *Labels: 3D0-959-933.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 959 933 F 
* Component: 1A HSG * * * * * * *0100 * 
* Coding: 0000040 
* Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
* VCID: 336E184D2B49 
* 
* Part No: 3D1 959 701 E 
* Component: Tuersteuergeraet FS 0104 
* 
* Part No: 3D1 959 702 E 
* Component: Tuersteuergeraet BF 0104 
* 
* Part No: 3D0 959 703 E 
* Component: Tuersteuergeraet HL 0104 
* 
* Part No: 3D0 959 704 E 
* Component: Tuersteuergeraet HR 0104 
* 
* Part No: 3D0 909 610 B 
* Component: 3I HDSG * * * * * * 2320 
* 
* Part No: 7L0 907 719 
* Component: * *Neigungssensor * 0020 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 47: Sound System * * * *Labels: 7Lx-035-4xx-47.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 035 466 
* Component: 12K-AUDIOVERST * * *0115 * 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: DFC624FD7741 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 65: Tire Pressure * * * *Labels: 3D0-907-273.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 907 273 C 
* Component: Reifendruckueberw. *0021 * 
* Coding: 0010204 
* Shop #: WSC 09460 444 53726 
* VCID: 2648F119E89B 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 66: Seat, Rear * * * *Labels: 3D0-959-860.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 959 860 B 
* Component: Sitzmemory D1 H * * 1524 * 
* Coding: 0000001 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: 2E580939C06B 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 68: Wiper Electr. * * * *Labels: None 
* Part No: 3D1 955 119 
* Component: Front Wiper * * * * 2005 * 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: E6C83119A81B 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 71: Battery Charger * * * *Labels: 3D0-915-181.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 915 181 C 
* Component: Batteriemanagement *2700 * 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: 234EE80D9BA9 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 75: Telematics * * * *Labels: 3D0-035-617.lbl 
* Part No SW: 3D0 035 617 * * HW: 3D0 035 617 
* Component: Telematik NAR1 * * *0101 * 
* Coding: 0061860 
* Shop #: WSC 09415 444 53506 
* VCID: DDBA1EF57D4D 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 76: Park Assist * * * *Labels: 3D0-919-283.lbl 
* Part No: 3D0 919 283 C 
* Component: 03 Einparkhilfe * * 0807 * 
* Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000 
* VCID: 2A500529FC83 
* 
No fault code found. 
* 
End * ---------------------------------------------------------------------


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

Here's some things that came up with the latest scan after the Nav. incident: 
Also, could someone point me to information on how to post photos here, do I have to host them on line somewhere first? 
Some are repeats such as the steering wheel heat and intervention load management. If the software looks OK could some of these be spurious due to a failing comfort battery? 
Thanks for all the help!! 
------ 
Address 01: Engine Labels: 4D0-907-560-BGH.lbl 
Part No SW: 4D0 907 560 CS HW: 
Component: 4.2L V8/5V G 0030 
Coding: 0007873 
Shop #: WSC 09460 444 999999 
VCID: 79F2EA65495F 

1 Fault Found: 
17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer 
P1570 - 008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent 
Readiness: 0000 0000 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 05: Acc/Start Auth. Labels: 3D0-909-13x-05.lbl 
Part No SW: 3D0 909 137 G HW: 3D0 909 137 G 
Component: Kessy 6850 
Revision: 00H22070 Serial number: VWZ3Z0C7144693 
Coding: 0137452 
Shop #: WSC 09460 444 999999 
VCID: 2B5E002DF383 

Part No: 4E0 905 852 E 
Component: ELV 2141 

1 Fault Found: 
00181 - Access/Start Authorization Antenna (in Rear bumper) (R136) 
011 - Open Circuit 
Freeze Frame: 
Fault Status: 01101011 
Fault Priority: 4 
Fault Frequency: 0 
Reset counter: 201 
Time Indication: 0 
Date: 2010.12.09 
Time: 11:45:52 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 07: Control Head Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl 
Part No: 3D0 035 008 M 
Component: ZAB COCKPIT 0188 
Coding: 0500305 
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
VCID: 244CEB119E5D 

1 Fault Found: 
00384 - Optical Databus 
004 - No Signal/Communication 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 3D0-937-049.lbl 
Part No: 3D0 937 049 G 
Component: STG.Bordnetz 5001 
Coding: 0000003 
Shop #: WSC 09460 444 82797 
VCID: 2E580939C091 

1 Fault Found: 
00907 - Intervention load Management 
000 - - 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 16: Steering wheel Labels: 3D0-953-549.lbl 
Part No: 3D0 953 549 E 
Component: Lenksäulenmodul 3401 
Coding: 0000232 
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
VCID: 2F66143DC79B 

1 Fault Found: 
01752 - Heated Steering Wheel (Z36) 
010 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 37: Navigation Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl 
Part No: 3D0 919 887 A 
Component: NAVIGATION 0147 
Coding: 0400000 
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
VCID: 32601D49D4A9 

1 Fault Found: 
00384 - Optical Databus 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Address 38: Roof Electronics Labels: 3D0-907-135.lbl 
Part No: 3D0 907 135 B 
Component: Dachmodul 0605 
Coding: 0000047 
Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000 
VCID: 2240ED098449 

2 Faults Found: 
00222 - Connection to Rain Sensor 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent 
00220 - Connection to Sunroof 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi John: 

Thanks for your kind words. 

There is a pretty comprehensive article that explains the significance of various statements (conditions, readouts) on a diagnostic scan at this thread: VAG-COM Controller Lists from Phaetons. There is also additional interpretive and explanatory information about network topology and how the various controllers interact at these two threads: General Information - Use of VAG-COM (VCDS) Software with Phaetons and Controller Area Network (CAN) data buses in the Phaeton. All of those posts are listed in the Phaeton Forum 'Table of Contents' (FAQ by Category), in fact, the three of them are grouped together - just do a "FIND" with your browser software (Control +F) using the search criteria "Vag". 

I'll do my best to give you an interpretation of the MOST RECENT diagnostic scan you posted (in other words, not the first one with all the asterisks in it, that is something I have never seen before), but, I won't reiterate what has already been explained in those three posts I referenced above - so, it might be best if you read them first, then came back here and read my comments below. 

--------------------------------- 

_Address 01: Engine 
17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer 
P1570 - 008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent_ 

It's an intermittent fault code, which means it was present in the past but not present at the time you did the scan. Could be something as simple as not sticking the key far enough into the ignition slot one morning when you attempted to start the car. Disregard it unless you are having repetitive problems attempting to start the car. 

The same concept applies to all the other fault codes that have the word 'intermittent' beside them - if you are not having problems with that particular controller, disregard the fault. Save a record of the diagnostic scan so you can refer back to it in the future, then clear all the fault codes. 

_Address 05: Access and Start Controller (KESSY, or '*K*eyless *E*ntry and *S*tart *Sy*stem) 
1 Fault Found: 
00181 - Access/Start Authorization Antenna (in Rear bumper) (R136) 
011 - Open Circuit_ 

Means there is an open circuit (broken wire, or more likely, a pin not fully inserted) in the wire between the access and start controller under the driver footwell floor and the antenna behind the rear bumper cover. Not a big deal, but you will have difficulty unlocking your doors or opening your trunk lid using the key fob if you are at the back of the car. It is noteworthy that you have software version 6850 in your Access and Start Controller (the KESSY). This is a very high software revision number, I have never seen one that high before. This implies that the controller was replaced very recently (probably in the past 2 years). 

_Address 07: Front Information Display and Control Head (J527) 
Software version is 0188_ 

If your Front Information Display and Control Head (the big display between the front seats) does not have a hard-key on it labelled PHONE, this is as high as you want to go with this software, DO NOT UPGRADE FURTHER! If you have a PHONE hard key, then you need to upgrade to a higher version, 0223. See this post for an exhaustive discussion of the subject: TB 90-07-01, TPL 2010404, "Clock Runs Too Slow" (Was: TB 90-05-05). That is a very long and complex thread, and there is a 50 question test at the end of it with a passing mark of 99.9%.  So, make some coffee before you start into it, and make sure you have about an hour of undisturbed time to absorb it all. 

The 'optical databus' fault reported by Controller 07 is a direct result of controller 37 (the navigation CD reader at the other end of the optical databus) having software 0147 installed in it. Controller 07 is innocent. More on that in a moment. 

_Address 09: Central Electrical Controller 
1 Fault Found: 
00907 - Intervention Load Management _ 

That just means that the car has decided to shed electrical load. Could be something as innocent as turning off a dome light or trunk light if you left a door or trunk lid open for a long period of time. Unless you are having electrical problems, disregard it. This particular statement (Intervention Load Management) is NOT an indication of a fault, it is a statement that the car has behaved as it has been programmed to do - it has shed loads automatically at some time in the past. Review this thread for more information: Intervention Load Management on the Phaeton. 

_Address 17: Instrument Cluster 
Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT RB4 04*11 * 
No fault code found._ 

There may be no fault code, but there sure as heck is a huge problem here. You are running xx11 software in that controller. The instrument cluster (thing with the speedometer and the tachometer) also contains the communications hub - the router - for all the databusses in the car. It MUST be updated to software ending in 21 in order to solve a host of known problems and glitches. Your controller is at the same software version that it had when it left Dresden in 2003. See this post for the explanation of how to solve this problem. It is a simple fix, I have had it done on my car (in fact, the photos at this post show my car): Instrument Cluster (MFI, or Y24) - How to reset the Display Screen (Includes TB C-90-04-01 and TB 90-05-04) 

_Address 37: Navigation CD Reader (the reader also houses the navigation controller) 
Component: NAVIGATION *0147* 
1 Fault Found: 
00384 - Optical Databus 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent_ 

This is also a contributing cause to your navigation problems, in particular, slow acqusition of the satellite constellation and occasional inaccurate position reporting. Navigation controller software version 147 has known troubles that cause interruption of communication along the optical databus between the navigation CD reader and the Front Display (between the seats). This software MUST be updated to 0168, but with the very important caveat that you do not want to upgrade your Controller 07 software beyond 0188 unless you have a PHONE hard-key. The software upgrades for both controller 07 (from anything --> 0223) and controller 37 (from 0147 --> 0168) are on the same CD. The person doing the upgrade must be very careful about how they proceed if it is desired to only update the CD controller and to not upgrade the Front Display. Refer to that hour-long read that I mentioned earlier. If you score greater than 99.9% on the test at the end of that thread, then you will understand what I mean. 

_Also from controller 37 
1 Fault Found: 
00625 - Vehicle Speed Signal 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent_ 

There is nothing wrong with the speedsensor. If there was, the speedometer would not work. This problem is caused by a combination of the 0147 software (old, known problems) in the navigation CD reader, and the xx11 software (original 2003 issue, serious network communication problems) in the instrument cluster. Update those two and you will never see this message again - nor will you encounter navigation problems again. 

Hope all this helps... 

Michael


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

steveskinr said:


> Come by soon *since my checkride is finished*.


 Hmmmm... Sounds like you and I are in the same industry... :laugh: 

Michael


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

John, Steve: 

Since you folks have a VAG-COM handy, I recommend that you change the coding of your instrument cluster controller (controller 17) away from the existing 0007221 that was standard on all cars shipped to the USA, and insert the new coding 0005121 in place. 

That will get rid of the seat belt chime and also get rid of the "key in ignition when driver door is open" chime. It will also slightly change the appearance of the icon that appears when the cruise control is active - instead of seeing the word CRUISE, you will see the ISO standard icon. 

Basically, the 0005121 coding makes the car a heck of a lot quieter - it gets rid of the vast majority of nuisance bongs and annunciations. 

The only disadvantages to doing this are: 

*1) *Fuel mileage (as displayed in the trip computer section of the large front information display and the small screen between the speedometer and tachometer) will now be calculated based on imperial gallons, not US gallons. But, you can solve that problem by just switching over to metric measurement (number of litres per 100 km) for fuel consumption, or, by applying a conversion factor manually when you read the "miles per imperial gallon" that the car calculates. 

*2)* You will lose the 'valet lockout' function of the electric trunk release. Instead, if you press the valet lockout button, you will see a rear foglight icon, but there will be no rear foglight functionality. 

See these posts for a more complete explanation: How to get rid of the seat belt warning message and chime and Turn off the "Key in Ignition" warning chime. 

Michael


----------



## steveskinr (Oct 31, 2007)

Michael, 

I flew an A-300 into Vancouver and during the layover, snagged a ride on a Beaver on floats up to Nanaimo. Then got on a bus down through Ladysmith and into Victoria. Grabbed a bite to eat and a Twotter on floats back to Vancouver. 

Seeing your picture on that particular airplane reminded me of that wonderful summer afternoon a few years ago. The ferry was my backup plan for getting back to work. 

I love that part of your country. My dad - from Sydney, NSW - was on the tugboats up there in the mid 50s. Sydney and Vancouver/Victoria are sure hard to beat. I want to take my family to Butchart Gardens someday. I saw it in years of yore and loved it. 

Cheers 
Steve


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

Thanks Michael! 
That's a lot of info., I'll try to get through it all!! I think Steve has the software update disks, I'll have to read up on exactly how to update those units, it doesn't sound "pilot proof", I'd better pay attention! The asterisk problem on the first scan was some kind of cut & paste issue, the original doesn't look like that. 
I'm not sure how I missed all that Vag Com info on the TOC, I thought I had that page memorized! 
I already updated the instrument cluster to 5021 using the TOC (no DRLs either), great improvement! I didn't fully understand the imperial gallons thing, it appears that the MPG average and instantaneous were correct, I guess not! 
As far as DRLs, when I'm waiting for my kids at pick-up spots I don't like my lights shining in everyone's windshield. It's too bad that someone dropped the ball on the DRLs not going off with the P brake or transmission park positioning, very annoying! I like to run with my parking lights and fogs on for DRL purposes. 
My wife (a UAL Pilot, I fly Corporate, Gulfstreams for a large multinational) is picking up a proper Euro headlight switch in Munich this week. I use the fogs and parking lights as DRLs when appropriate and like to have a parking lights only position, I upgraded our TDI the same way. 
Neat aircraft you've got there Michael! 
I'll wade through that section of TOC while I'm sitting on my layover this week. 
I'll have the VW Tech. look at the antenna issue when it's in for inspection. 
Thanks Again!


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

Ok Michael, 
I finished the big read. 
Should I have the VW dealer attempt to update the software on controllers 17 and 37 through an Internet connection to the tech line? Do they still do that? I will just ask them to leave controller 07 at 188 so the buttons match. 
It appears that controller 17 has to be updated by the dealer because the update is not on the CD, correct? 
I could do controller 37 from Steve's CD (carefully) but I was thinking that the dealer could do both? 
What do you think? 
Did I pass the test or fail miserably?  
Thanks!


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hello John:

Controller 17 (the instrument cluster) must be updated by VW Head Office in the USA via an internet link to the dealership. All that the staff at the dealership will do is call the Techline and make an appointment to hook the car up to the internet and have Head Office do the work.

To facilitate this, I suggest you take the TB that describes this update to your VW dealer ahead of time - have the service writer make the required phone calls, ask the questions of the Techline staff, do the research, etc. (because the staff at your dealership will likely not have done this before), then, they can set up an appointment for you to bring the car in to have the flash done. Although the flash normally only takes about half a hour to do, I recommend you encourage the dealer to set the appointment up in the early morning, or in the early afternoon just after lunch. Don't even think about a 4:00 PM Friday appointment...

Get the instrument cluster update done before you do the nav controller update. 

I don't particularly recommend that you have your dealer do the nav controller update - unless they have done this several times before and are quite familiar with the process, they won't add any value or expertise (beyond what you could do yourself).

I think you can do the flash of controller 37 (the nav controller) yourself, using the CD. Just be sure that you have a full tank of gas and that you leave the engine running all the time so you don't get into a low-voltage condition. Pay very careful attention to the prompts that will appear on the big front display to ensure that you do not carry out an update on controller 07 (the front display itself), because both updates are on the same CD. They are carried out in sequence, but I cannot remember which one is offered first.

Set aside at least 2 hours for this, although if I recall correctly, the last time I did one of these updates, it only took about 45 to 50 minutes to complete. There will be a display of numbers on the screen showing completion progress. Be very patient with the car and do not interrupt the process, even if you think it has stalled.

I think you have passed the test with high marks. 

Michael


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

Thanks for the quick response Michael! 
I have an appointment to take the car in tomorrow and will leave it for the week while I'm out on a trip. They should have plenty of time to get the updates and some other issues taken care of. This dealer apparently regularly services a "number" of Phaetons and also is a Porsche and Audi facility, I'm hoping they are up to speed! I have used them many times in the past for Porsche and Audi work. 
BTW, the TSB and other PDF files never seem to be "attached", am I missing something? 
Thanks Again!


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi John:

When the Vortex bulletin board migrated from running on the "ZeroForum" software to running on "VBulletin" software about a year ago, a number of PDF attachments got lost in the process.

I'm going to go back to the original threads and attempt to re-embed the PDFs in the original locations, so, please go look again (give me about an hour to get this done).

On a related (but different) matter, be aware that VW made a significant change in the manner that they reference internal documents several years ago. "Technical Bulletins" issued by VW of America with numbers constructed similar to "90-05-04" and "90-06-02" are now filed according to the original "Technical Solution" number that was attributed to them when they were released by VW Engineering in Europe (the 'ElsaWeb' number). This means that it might be difficult for dealership personnel who were not around at the time of this change to easily locate older TBs issued with the VW of A TB number.

For example, the document formerly referred to by the reference "TB 90-06-02" issued Dec. 13, 2006 - this being the document that superseded "TB 90-05-04" dated July 8, 2005 - is now found under the original European Technical Solution reference number of 2010402 due to inclusion into ElsaWeb.

So, if you are trying to get your dealer to carry out the actions in TB 90-06-02 (the instrument cluster software flash - it might be helpful to provide them with both that reference number and the Technical Solution reference number 2010402 used in ElsaWeb. That should enable them to find it.

Michael


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

Thanks for the TSB info. Michael. 
I put together a concise document about what I wanted the technician to look at and the software update with the references that you gave me. They were quite busy so I said to give me a call if the writer or technician wanted to discuss the work, the car would be there all week. 
They called about an hour later, I'm thinking great they had a chance to review my requests. 
They called because they couldn't find my car which I cleverly hid in the line-up with all the other cars parked for service. 
Should I be worried yet!!  
Maybe the lot man had never seen a Phaeton before, I trust the technician has!!


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

johnt26 said:


> Maybe the lot man had never seen a Phaeton before, I trust the technician has!!


 Insha'Allah...


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

PanEuropean said:


> Insha'Allah...


 Amen!


----------



## steveskinr (Oct 31, 2007)

John, 

I found out today that Garnet VW has two mechanics that are in the final twelve contestants for best VW mechanic of the year. They are just north of Delaware in the Glen Mills area. 

Maclane - one of the contestants - did a good job on my flash/flush. 

Steve


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

Hi Steve, 
That's good to know, I have Maclane and Garnet in my phone as my fall-back position thanks to you. 
If the dealer can't find the car in the lot by Friday I'll move it to Garnet! 
This dealer has done good work for me on a number of different cars and it's so convenient to my house, I need to give them a shot at my business.


----------



## johnt26 (Dec 3, 2009)

OK, I may have failed the test after all.
The technician says that the TB for the instrument cluster software update to XX21 does not apply to my
car as my VIN is not in the range.
I have VIN 10588 the TB says 2004 > 48009042.
He said he printed it out for me.
I didn't see anything in the TOC read that talked about this TB being VIN specific.
Thoughts?
Thanks!!


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

With respect to the technician, this TB does apply to your vehicle.

The end of the VIN range provided indicates the point at which new software was cut-in on the assembly line. In other words, beginning with the vehicle manufactured directly after the VIN ending in 48009042, new build Phaetons were equipped with instrument clusters that had the updated software (ending in xx 21) installed.

How your vehicle came to have an instrument cluster with earlier version software installed, I do not know. I can only guess that perhaps your instrument cluster was replaced at some time after manufacture, and the part that was pulled out of warehouse stock to replace it was an earlier production part that had the earlier version of the software installed.

I encourage you to have your technician look up the service history of the car and see he/she can find any record of instrument cluster replacement - this would, of course, explain why you have an out-of-sequence instrument cluster. He or she could then talk to the staff at VW Techline (VW headquarters in North America) and explain what has happened.

Michael


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Attached is a Technical Solution (Campaign 66C4) that was circulated in the rest of the world (meaning, outside of the North American marketplace) that more fully addresses reprogramming of the 'combination instrument' (instrument cluster, or controller 17). Note the VIN range addressed at the top of the first page. The instrument cluster reprogramming is discussed within "Criteria 06" of this TS.

And, before anyone gets carried away running down rabbit holes as a result of reading the other Criteria on this TS, let me provide a bit of background information:

*1) Criteria 01* (side pillar trim, short wheelbase vehicle) does not apply to any North American car because the SWB vehicles were not imported to NAR.

*2) Criteria 02* (side pillar trim, long wheelbase vehicle) has been raised in North America, further discussion can be found at this thread: TB 66-06-02 - Exterior Pillar Trim Corrosion on Phaeton Doors

*3) Criteria 03* (modification of lower engine cover on W12 Phaetons) has been raised in North America, further discussion can be found at this thread: W12 (only!) Underbody Cover Attachment Modification

*4) Criteria 04* (replacement of W12 dipstick) has been raised in North America, further discussion can be found at this thread: Broken Oil Dipstick - W12 Engine

*5) Criteria 05* (heating system performance check) appears to be a non-issue in North America. This could be because this problem was resolved on the production line prior to build of any vehicles destined for North America, or it could be because the engines and/or heating system components affected were never shipped to North America. In any case, I have never seen a post here on the forum that raises problems with heater performance, so, forget about this criteria.

*6) Criteria 06*, the instrument cluster software flash, is the topic under discussion here. It is discussed at great length at the original post about this topic, which is TB: Distortion in the Display Unit in the Instrument Cluster (MFI, or Y24)

Michael


----------



## BltVWF (Oct 19, 2009)

*NAV Controller update from the CD*

Greetings!

Yesterday I updated my NAV controller from the CD - thank you, Michael, for pointing it out. Even though it is straighforward, below is the exact procedure from VW TB for those who will be doing it.
It took about 30 min on my car though the VW says it's about 45 minutes.

Eugene

+++++++++++++++++++++++
Note:

During update, no other work (including maintenance) can be performed on the vehicle.

Update Programming Procedure

• Verify the flash CD has no surface damage (scratches etc) or foreign substance (oil, grease etc) on it. If damage is discovered, order a replacement flash disc before proceeding.

• Remove key from ignition.

• Switch on the display using the ON / DARK button.

• Insert update CD PhaetonNavSW9923 in to the navigation drive (in place of the map CD).


• Press Confirm to start the update.


Note:

The software update will take 45 minutes. Make sure the car is not disturbed including opening doors, hood, turning the key on etc.


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Photos re-hosted.

Michael


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Attached is a remarkably recent (2011!) technical bulletin from VW of North America that describes a software flash that can be carried out on model year 2004 to 2006 NAR Phaetons to solve an uncommon and isolated problem that might arise if RDS (Radio Data System) signals that do not conform to North American broadcast standards are being transmitted by a local radio station.

I want to emphasize that this TB is a 'hotfix', something that should only be carried out if the affected Phaeton already has software 0223 in the J523 (the big display screen in the center of the car, controller 07) and already has software ending in '21' in the instrument cluster (controller 17).

99.0% of the problems with the navigation system in North America are caused by the *instrument cluster* software not being flash-updated to a version number that ends in '21' - for example, '0321' or '0521'. The requirement for this update is fully discussed at this post: TB: Distortion in the Display Unit in the Instrument Cluster (MFI, or Y24), and the instrument cluster software update described in TB 90-06-02 must be carried out (if necessary) prior to any other troubleshooting efforts. It is extremely easy for a technician to check and see if this update has been done - just look at controller 17 (the instrument panel) with a diagnostic scan tool, and confirm that the last 2 digits of the software version are '21'.

Of the remaining 1.0% of navigation problems, 9 out of 10 of those can be carried out by ensuring that the J523 (Front Instrument Display and Control Head, controller 07) software is at the appropriate version number (0188 for displays without a PHONE hard-key, 0223 for displays with a PHONE hard-key), and ensuring that the J401 Navigation controller (controller 37, the navigation CD reader) software is at or above the appropriate matching version number in relation to the J523. That process is fully explained at this post: Phaeton Technical Bulletin (TB) 90-05-05 "Clock Runs Too Slow".

The remaining "1 in 1,000" navigation system problems with a Phaeton that has been fully updated to address the above two mentioned software updates can be solved with this new TP, which is TP 2025707. But, once again, be aware that this TB is only intended to be carried out if the vehicle is experiencing problems. If the navigation system works fine, don't embody this TP.

This document is not applicable to the Rest of the World, because the RDBS/RDS technology used outside of North America is different, and the software for the J523 is also different outside of North America.

Michael


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Archival Note:* See also Navigation Problems, Nav Software Update (TS 2025707).

Michael


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## pabraham100 (Nov 8, 2011)

*Navigation Software update*

How do I get this software update CD PhaetonNavSW9923?

Thanks


----------



## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Hi Paul,

You can order the CD through any VW parts desk for less than $10, although there may be a few weeks delay while they order new stock. The 3D0 ... part number is shown printed under the software version on the CD in the photo in this post:

Navigation System Split Screen Function

I refer to the post because it contains some remarks about the applicability of the update for particular NAR central display units.

Chris


----------



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Here is a picture of the update CD to bring North American Region (NAR) J523 units up to software version 0253.

To the best of my knowledge, this software update only fixes one very rare problem, that being the J523 (big front display and control unit between the two front seats) locking up when a radio station transmits a malformed RDIS signal. I've never encountered this, nor have I heard of anyone else in North America encountering this.

Michael


*NAR Region J523 Software Version 0253 update CD*


----------



## Itzmann (Jan 16, 2006)

PanEuropean said:


> To the best of my knowledge, this software update only fixes one very rare problem, that being the J523 (big front display and control unit between the two front seats) locking up when a radio station transmits a malformed RDIS signal. I've never encountered this, nor have I heard of anyone else in North America encountering this.



Wow, amazing information Michael.

Our nav system only ever crashed three times, that I now recall, and all three times were on highways in the middle of nowhere during out-of-town trips. To consider that it may have been due to malformed FM transmission is sobering, particularly for those of us eagerly awaiting self-driving cars.

While annoying, all we did was wait for the next stop, turn off the engine and shut down the electronics (via the second half-depress of the keyless start button), and things were fine afterwards. And it hasn't happened again in many years, which is good.

Perhaps U.S. stations are finally getting it together with regards to RDS transmissions? Although here in FL we still see some stations transmitting the name of the current song or program in the field where the station name should appear.


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## pabraham100 (Nov 8, 2011)

Hi Michael
How can I get a copy of the disk.

thanks
paul


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hi Paul:

I don't know if it is available for sale from VW or not. Often VW will sell the firmware update discs, although they don't advertise them. I just asked my dealer if I could have the CD for a moment to take a picture of it.

Probably the best way to start would be to inquire at the parts department of your local dealer - perhaps take along a photo of the CD so they know exactly what it is you are after.

Be aware, though, that if you do not have a PHONE hard-key on your big front display unit, installing this update will mess up your button assignments.

Michael


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## jyoung8607 (Feb 14, 2006)

It does not appear to be for sale to the public. It's treated as part of VW's dealer tools catalog rather than a vehicle part like the others. Nobody has been able to get hold of a copy, so we don't know what version is on it. Here is a breakdown for GP0 style vehicles, which covers all North America region vehicles and I believe through MY2007 elsewhere. 



*Part Number**Infotainment**Nav Computer**Application**Notes*3D0 919 27701880147Old NAR J523Latest version for older NAR infotainment units3D0 919 27802230168All except old NAR J523Latest publicly available in North America3D0 919 278 B02530188All except old NAR J523Latest publicly available in Europe, works in NARPhaetonNavSW9923?????????Dealer-only part, fixes corrupt RDS crash in NAR

I have physical copies of the first two, and a verified-working ISO image of the last one thanks to Chris. This is NOT a complete table of every version out there, just the ones that can be ordered on CDROM. Michael has posted a more complete version table in another thread.

I've recently developed a good relationship with the service manager at my dealer. We've had some adventures getting Fidelity to pay for my engine repairs, which are just now starting after four weeks of waiting. Now that we at least have a picture of this mythical RDS-fix disc, next time I'm there I'll ask to borrow theirs for a few minutes.

Jason


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## jyoung8607 (Feb 14, 2006)

PanEuropean said:


> To the best of my knowledge, this software update only fixes one very rare problem, that being the J523 (big front display and control unit between the two front seats) locking up when a radio station transmits a malformed RDIS signal. I've never encountered this, nor have I heard of anyone else in North America encountering this.


I have experienced the problem for sure. There's a particular radio station near the KY-TN border along I75 that triggered it for me during a road trip last year. There are other owners who probably experienced the RDS problem as well.

Jason


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## jyoung8607 (Feb 14, 2006)

I just had my dealer apply the fix for the RDS crash. I can now confirm that "PhaetonNavSW9923" is an actual independent software update, not just the more current 0253 build from RoW. It appears to update the FU-RAD (radio) software component in J523. For some reason it also updates the navigation computer; I was previously on 0188 from the RoW disc. Based on the version numbers it seems likely they took the older 0223/0168 build and patched that for the RDS problem -- hence 9923/9968 -- rather than base the fix on the more current RoW build.

Jason


*Part Number**Infotainment**Nav Computer**Application**Notes*3D0 919 27701880147Old NAR J523; RoWLatest version for older NAR infotainment units3D0 919 27802230168New NAR J523; RoWLatest publicly available in North America3D0 919 278 B02530188New NAR J523; RoWLatest publicly available in Europe, works in NARPhaetonNavSW992399239968New NAR J523 onlyDealer-only part, fixes corrupt RDS crash in NAR


```
Address 07: Control Head        Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 035 008 QX
   Component:    ZAB COCKPIT      9923  
   Coding: 0500305
   Shop #: WSC 03207 444 84420
   VCID: 0005FB405017A33A0B-5120

No fault code found.
```


```
Address 37: Navigation        Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 919 887 F
   Component:    NAVIGATION       9968  
   Coding: 0400000
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 3777509C45592482FA-5120

No fault code found.
```


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

Sounds like the new radio I just flashed to my Galaxy S4. Took my LTE download speed to 92mb/s!


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## lelievre12 (Nov 25, 2015)

When I collected my Phaeton in Indianapolis there was no problem with infotainment.
However now in San Francisco (Marin County) my Phaeton infotainment resets ALL the time. :banghead: I guess because the car grew up in Indiana, the local dealer never did the patch. The car does have the 223 software but not the patch.

Here is the last VAG of the relevant codes.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 07: Control Head Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl
Part No: 3D0 035 008 Q
Component: ZAB COCKPIT * 0223 * 
Coding: 0500305
Shop #: WSC 03325 444 57519
VCID: 2855E4089848AB7E03-5140


No fault code found.



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 3D0-920-xxx-17.lbl
Part No: 3D0 920 981 H
Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT RB8 0421 
Coding: 0007221
Shop #: WSC 03325 444 84671
VCID: 2C5D18188CB0875EE7-5140


1 Fault Found:
00457 - Control Module for Network (J519) 
004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 37: Navigation Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl
Part No: 3D0 919 887 F
Component: NAVIGATION 0168 
Coding: 0400000
Shop #: WSC 03325 444 84671
VCID: 3777377445F634869A-5140



No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I'd be interested if anyone has an ISO of PhaetonNavSW9923 disc so I can burn my own. I did contact the local dealer about the update but no joy yet. 

I thought the issue was related to me replacing the audio CD player (not the nav one) however when I remove the CD, the rebooting persists. When I drive out of town (say Petaluma) the system becomes stable again. 

If you have the software 9923 ISO please PM me!


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## Paximus (Aug 26, 2011)

Regarding the NAR update CD, I asked the factory but they have had a giant clear-up and no-one can find a copy of it.

If anyone in NAR can get hold of one, or somehow get a dealer to download the data from the central support systems, it can be posted on-line for future use. I can't find it listed anywhere in the European catalogues.

Chris


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## lelievre12 (Nov 25, 2015)

I have the same issue. My dealer (SonnenVW) cant find the CD either. 
Please let me know if anyone finds this disc!!


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## zoltan99 (Jul 22, 2013)

Maybe this TSB will help find it?
I live in the Bay Area and mine never crashes, it's on 223-168 FW. The GPS is usually wildly inaccurate and I've replaced the booster at the rear window, too. Pretty irritating.

http://www.corners.plus.com/downloads/TB2025707v911107_Nav_Software_Flash.pdf


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