# Anybody else pre-order an MSS spring kit?



## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

I've been chatting with William back and forth for quite some about the theory behind the different spring rates in the MSS kits. While it's clear from the math that the changes should be substantial, I've been a skeptic (naturally) about whether or not this really translates to real-world performance improvements.

I've continued to interrogate William about it and it's been pretty clear that he's spent a ton of trial-and-error time fine-tuning these springs on his own TT-RS on the track (more than I can say I've seen from any other spring vendor over the years).

Then more recently I've read more and more accounts from early testers that these things really made a notable improvement in handling (and comfort). I would normally expect a bias towards positive feedback (folks usually find what they're looking for), but the universal positive feedback from highly critical folks was unexpected.

What I also really like about the kit is that it has a very modest drop in the front (10-15 mm), and an adjustable rear perch so you can dial-in the exact look you want through adjusting the rear ride height.

So with all that I said what-the-heck, and pre-ordered a kit. The proof will obviously be in the pudding (and I will be really looking at any post-install "improvements" with a grain of salt). Hopefully I'll report back the same positive results that all the early testers have been seeing.

Anybody else pre-order a set?


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

Marty said:


> I've been chatting with William back and forth for quite some about the theory behind the different spring rates in the MSS kits. While it's clear from the math that the changes should be substantial, I've been a skeptic (naturally) about whether or not this really translates to real-world performance improvements.
> 
> I've continued to interrogate William about it and it's been pretty clear that he's spent a ton of trial-and-error time fine-tuning these springs on his own TT-RS on the track (more than I can say I've seen from any other spring vendor over the years).
> 
> ...


 Gotcha...!

Marty and on a serious note, it was a nice surprise to see your order pop in as you were the last person I thought would take up MSS because - and you know this offcourse - you have asked all the awkward questions...I doubt even a captured Spy (_007, James Bond, comes to mind_) has to go through the level of interrogation I went through from you and I was only looking to share genuine improvements with like minded car enthusiast...

Over the years I, offcourse, have played the role you played so well in questioning new products with what seems like far-fetched claims…some worked and others did not…what *I have never seen* is 1[SUP]st[/SUP] hand undistorted user feedback as I shared with you and over 50 people on email over the past 6-mths. I felt that approach was the right thing to do because we simply do not get that from any manufacturers as we all know...!


As one recent tester who purchased a kit at full RPP of £712.50 – _yep, all testers fully paid for a kit and thus had more of a reason to return the kit if my claims were not true as they all had the offer of money back, none returned their kits…! _- said and I quote…
(*posted as sent and the tester will notice his feedback here…)*

“As I mentioned, I had both a RSB and rear trailing bearings (034Motorsports) done at the same time as the kit. I have not done the front camber change yet. My mechanic was hesitant concerned about tire wear. Mechanic (Ferrari and Lambo certified Italian whose family races Alfas locally) thought it was MUCH better. 

The overall effect is dramatic. The sluggishness when trying to turn the car is gone with minimal understeer in daily driving. The squat and roll present in hard braking prior to a right angle right hand turn are resolved. The car is much more nimble in lane changes and freeway exits/entrances. Also the worse the weather, the happier it seems to be too. 

I will compare this car to any year round daily driver now. Highly recommended to owners who like to drive.”

_And his closing lines were…_

“The TT-RS really deserves this upgrade. Audiophiles talk about equipment which improves sound clarity as "lifting the veil" from the music and the effect of the kit is analogous to this effect.”


Offcourse, the kit will fit any Audi TT with MagneRide installed…you get KW v3 rivaling handling with MSS Sports kit though improved ride comfort and retain the ‘one-touch’ suspension mode functionality…so on track go for firm settings and on streets or daily driving go for soft settings or choose as you please…it is your car, you now have the full options/capability thanks to MSS so you do as you please.

Thanks yet again Marty and do feedback in due course.

For any interested parties the Pre-Order site is http://www.mssspringkits.com. 

See my signature for other on-line presence.

Your point of contact for North America and Canada is [email protected]. 


For other regions round the globe drop me a line to [email protected] and I will put you in touch with a representative.

William


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## Black BeauTTy (Jun 11, 2011)

Marty said:


> Anybody else pre-order a set?


I'm in and anxious to report back as well.


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

All the cool kids are doing it


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## Black BeauTTy (Jun 11, 2011)

Have you driven Jeff's? I don't have any locals by me with it, so I am going in blind and trusting the tester's feedback and William's tireless R&D on it.


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## Koa1 (Feb 21, 2012)

I thought about it but the preorder is for the Sports version only right? I think I'd rather err on the side of getting too hard a setup so I'm waiting for the sports plus or track version.


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## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2013)

Black BeauTTy said:


> Have you driven Jeff's? I don't have any locals by me with it, so I am going in blind and trusting the tester's feedback and William's tireless R&D on it.


That might be happening this weekend


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## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2013)

Koa1 said:


> I thought about it but the preorder is for the Sports version only right? I think I'd rather err on the side of getting too hard a setup so I'm waiting for the sports plus or track version.


You are correct, Pre-Order is Sports kit only. There will be options for upgrading later (details are being worked out)but you may be surprised at how capable the Sports kit is. We had testers thinking as you are and are very happy with Sports....


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

Koa1 said:


> I thought about it but the preorder is for the Sports version only right? I think I'd rather err on the side of getting too hard a setup so I'm waiting for the sports plus or track version.


 Hi Koa1,
Send me an email to [email protected] and I will pick this up...I just need to understand your requirements as Sports Plus is really aimed at a heavier car...it is same as the Sports version.

On track I expect Sports Plus to be perhaps less than 1-second quicker though that may even be closer.

Offocurse, if I get it wrong you will get an upgrade to what you want at no additional cost.


You may want to read the review below by Craig who also wanted a more Sportier version however he is staying put with *Sports* after testing that extensively as per his review.
Review by Craig – see http://fourtitude.com/news/aftermar...ng-kit-for-magnetic-ride-tested-in-audi-tt-rs.


Probably best to announce this here, if in doubt as to which version will work for you thus Sports; Sports Plus; Track Pack; Track Pack Plus just drop me ([email protected]) or [email protected] a line with your requirements and we can advise accordingly.

I developed the kits to fulfill the following roles…:
*Sports* for a car used as daily driver and also sees track even with slick tyres as tested by Craig in review noted in link above. This is a very versatile kit for the lightest MagneRide equipped TT in the range – TT-S – to the heaviest MagneRide TT in the range as in my case a TT-RS Roadster.

*Sports Plus* is essentially for cars that weigh as much as mine – thus above 1550kg (mine is 1566kg) though for a ‘Sports’ car mine is a little too heavy…!

*Track Pack* is for a car that sees track use 75% of the time and the owner is prepared to compromise ride comfort though you may be a little surprise how it rides in the softer settings. The firmer settings is a compromise in terms of ride comfort on the streets and that is coming from the creator, Ohh…that would be me then…!!!

*Track Pack Plus* is for cars that are trailored to track thus 100% track cars. Personally, I will not drive on the streets with this even in the soft mode…it is FIRM..!


My advice is always to define your requirement then choose accordingly. 

In real terms, I am not expecting many takers for *Sports Plus *as it really is for a heavier TT and even though mine is probably the heaviest TT around, I skipped *Sports Plus* and went for *Track Pack* for when I want to go on track. 

I keep *Sports* for all other times – changing from one range to the other is a swap of a single spring on each of the rear corners and that takes a total time of 30-mins...then quick Geo check and you are good to go.

Hope Above helps though get in touch so that we can get the correct kit out to you.

William


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## jibbed (Dec 3, 2011)

I pre-ordered the sports kit.

Have an 034 RSB and Sway bar links to fit too, was going to do it all at once, but I think I'll fit this stuff first, so I can quantify the difference b/w the mods.


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## croman44 (Jan 9, 2013)

I can not tell you enough about how much I am enjoying my kit.


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## Koa1 (Feb 21, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> Hi Koa1,
> Send me an email to [email protected] and I will pick this up...I just need to understand your requirements as Sports Plus is really aimed at a heavier car...it is same as the Sports version.
> 
> On track I expect Sports Plus to be perhaps less than 1-second quicker though that may even be closer.
> ...


Thanks William email sent.


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## sentari (Dec 4, 2011)

I pre-ordered with Sports kit... I likely have more power and mods than anyone doing this, so I guess i'll have to report at some point...


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## smack_ttrs (Mar 24, 2013)

i also ordered a set today.
if work slows down i'm hoping to get a trackday in on the bone stock setup with some data for comparison.
just need to work out a set of wheels


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## croman44 (Jan 9, 2013)

sentari said:


> I pre-ordered with Sports kit... I likely have more power and mods than anyone doing this, so I guess i'll have to report at some point...


Not so sure about that. I thought there was a stage 3 TTRS out there with the kit. 

Btw, was kind of surprised you did not want to test it first. Going to be at Nur Techniks new grand opening?


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## mageus (Sep 1, 2004)

Man, I feel like the loser odd man out. Unfortunately, I recently convinced the Boss to buy a GTI for commuting, so I've blown all my karma points for a while.

I will have these springs one day, one day . . .

Smack, it's good to feel how the car changes as you build it up in stages. You really appreciate how great the car is out of the box, and how much better it becomes with such simple changes.


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## jibbed (Dec 3, 2011)

Heh - my daily is a Mk6 GTi (DSG) too (leather, nav, 18" wheels and my own reflash). 

Must admit - it's a great car to put about in - especially with an extra 40kw. I miss not having streaming bluetooth in my TTRS too. 



mageus said:


> Man, I feel like the loser odd man out. Unfortunately, I recently convinced the Boss to buy a GTI for commuting, so I've blown all my karma points for a while.


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## sentari (Dec 4, 2011)

I'll be in Europe until the middle of May, so if it's after that I'll come.... And as for Stage 3 TTRS's... I don't believe in Unicorns! But to go from 400 or so HP/TQ to 500+ creates a lot of other expensive problems (tranny/clutch upgrades, brakes etc...).....



croman44 said:


> Not so sure about that. I thought there was a stage 3 TTRS out there with the kit.
> 
> Btw, was kind of surprised you did not want to test it first. Going to be at Nur Techniks new grand opening?


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## mageus (Sep 1, 2004)

jibbed said:


> Heh - my daily is a Mk6 GTi (DSG) too ... Must admit - it's a great car to put about in - especially with an extra 40kw. I miss not having streaming bluetooth in my TTRS too.


I'm loving it. It's really upscale and appointed well, unlike VWs of yore. Makes you wonder why a base A3 exists. Drives very nicely, but still with pep in stock form. DSG is actually quite versatile (the lifetime stick driver begrudgingly admits). Even the wife warmed up to it after driving it. Don't want to risk warranty issues with a chip just yet. If only they made a JSW GLI.

I have BT streaming in my TTRS . . . wonder how that guy likes the RNS-E I sold him.


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## jibbed (Dec 3, 2011)

Yeah - agree re: the A3... I'm thinking about getting the new S3 to replace it though, the new car definitely looks like it's got a deluxe interior.

Re: BT streaming in your TTRS - tell me more!! One of my biggest annoyances (yes - I know, first world problems! )



mageus said:


> I'm loving it. It's really upscale and appointed well, unlike VWs of yore. Makes you wonder why a base A3 exists. Drives very nicely, but still with pep in stock form. DSG is actually quite versatile (the lifetime stick driver begrudgingly admits). Even the wife warmed up to it after driving it. Don't want to risk warranty issues with a chip just yet. If only they made a JSW GLI.
> 
> I have BT streaming in my TTRS . . . wonder how that guy likes the RNS-E I sold him.


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## mageus (Sep 1, 2004)

jibbed said:


> Re: BT streaming in your TTRS - tell me more!! One of my biggest annoyances (yes - I know, first world problems! )


Aftermarket. Sorry, it's late, very tired to post links, but just search my login and you'll find the writeups.


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## [email protected] (Sep 28, 2004)

William, 
What spring rates do you run in each of your packages? Do you know what the OEM spring rate is? Do you know what the motion ratio is for the OEM suspension? 

I have not measured it yet, just curious if you have the numbers. Thanks :thumbup:


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

RTErnie said:


> William,
> What spring rates do you run in each of your packages? Do you know what the OEM spring rate is? Do you know what the motion ratio is for the OEM suspension?
> 
> I have not measured it yet, just curious if you have the numbers. Thanks :thumbup:


 Hi,
Hi RTErnie, responseis as follows...;
1) *MSS* RATES: fronts 40Nm / Rears 420Nm (to get rates in Ibs multiply by 5.71)

2) OEM rates were inconsistant when we measured a few springs thus fronts were from 28Nm to 32Nm for TT-RS. Rears were mid to late 20s. 

3) MR front is 0.92 and rear is 0.63

William


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

I met up with [email protected] today and he was kind enough to toss me the keys for a quick test drive. After he departed I immediately hopped in my car and retraced the route so I could get a nearly back-to-back comparison. 

I was surprised at first because the feel of MSS in normal mode is not as subtle as I thought it might be. The ride is better, just taking the edge off of impacts and letting the car feel more relaxed over bumps. In sport mode the very jittery feeling you get over a normal road surface is pretty much gone now. I think sport mode will be more useable now on less than ideal surfaces because the car doesn't seem like it will get as unsettled over mid-corner bumps. 

But, I don't think I'll be spending anywhere near as much time in sport mode because normal works so well. As soon as you turn the steering wheel the difference in roll stiffness is apparent. Where the stock setup really seems to overwork the outside front tire, with lots of lean and waiting for the car to settle, the MSS setup just turns and goes. This takes away that nervous feeling at turn-in where you're not quite sure if the car is going to track or fall into understeer. It seems like a very different car, and that was mostly at just normal cruising around town speeds. The steering felt just a bit heavier too but that could be due to tires or alignment. I did a couple of straight line acceleration tests too and the squat under power was definitely minimized. I've got one bit of road that I can almost always get the car to fall into understeer as I add power and unweight the front end, I am eager to trying that with MSS installed. 

I can't wait to get a set on my car. It really seems like it will bring back that go-kart feel that I had with the H&R coilovers on my mk1, it's what I've been hoping to get out of the RS.


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

[email protected] said:


> Hi,
> Hi RTErnie, responseis as follows...;
> 1) *MSS* RATES: fronts 40Nm / Rears 420Nm (to get rates in Ibs multiply by 5.71)
> 
> ...


 But the rears have a progressive rate! What is the range of rates for the rear MSS sport? (e.g., what is the initial softest rate when cruising at steady state)


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

Marty said:


> But the rears have a progressive rate! What is the range of rates for the rear MSS sport? (e.g., what is the initial softest rate when cruising at steady state)


 Hi Marty, 
rear rates are as follows...;
1) *Initial rate* is 40N/mm (225Ibs) - car rides here 5% of the time.

2) *Middle rate* is 63N/mm (360Ibs) - the car rides here 90% of the time
*
3) Top rate* is 90N/mm (500Ibs) - car rarely gets to this point thus this rate is engaged an estimated 5% of the time.

Due to the above rates, the stick ARBs will suffice simply because that upgrade often is to firm the rears however it is not required with MSS. The Stock ARB is more than adequate.

If however you have an ARB / RSB, my advice is to set it to the softest settings then fine tune from there.

Above comments are based on testers feedback which mirrors my own testing. I have the H&R ARBs which was set to hard rear and soft fronts though that did not reduce understeer...!

Anyway, post MSS I left it on same settings and MSS was fine. I then set it to soft all round and MSS was till fine. I will be purchasing back stock ARBs and test with these just to note the effect...which I expect will mirrors that of testers like Craig who had stock ARB all round and with MSS fitted he was able to use slick tyres on track no issues. On streets he runs standard tyres and car behaves comfy as expected.

I am about to purchase 034 RSB and drop links to test with MSS and I will feedback – my view is that the RSB would simply be OTT as MSS Sports does not need firmer rears...not with the above rates as per design...though I have always liked the look of the 034 RSB and drop links...just looks nice...

William


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

JohnLZ7W said:


> I met up with [email protected] today and he was kind enough to toss me the keys for a quick test drive. After he departed I immediately hopped in my car and retraced the route so I could get a nearly back-to-back comparison.
> 
> I was surprised at first because the feel of MSS in normal mode is not as subtle as I thought it might be. The ride is better, just taking the edge off of impacts and letting the car feel more relaxed over bumps. In sport mode the very jittery feeling you get over a normal road surface is pretty much gone now. I think sport mode will be more useable now on less than ideal surfaces because the car doesn't seem like it will get as unsettled over mid-corner bumps.
> 
> ...


 Interesting point ref not using Sports mode as much and I agree...the normal mode works well for streets though on track you will want Sports mode as things take on a sharper attitude.

Finally am glad you have tasted what you had an input to create...John you kit will not be long now...and am looking forward to a thorough review from you as per norm.


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

[email protected] said:


> rear rates are as follows...;
> 1) *Initial rate* is 40Nm (225Ibs) - car rides here 5% of the time.
> 
> 2) *Middle rate* is 63Nm (360Ibs) - the car rides here 90% of the time
> ...


 So the "top rate" is ~3 to 4x the OEM rear rate, while the "initial rate" is ~1.5x the OEM rate, correct? I assume those rates are N/mm and lbf/in. 

It's interesting that stiffer rates in both the front and rear end up improving ride comfort overall.


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

Marty said:


> So the "top rate" is ~3 to 4x the OEM rear rate, while the "initial rate" is ~1.5x the OEM rate, correct? I assume those rates are N/mm and lbf/in.
> 
> It's interesting that stiffer rates in both the front and rear end up improving ride comfort overall.


 Marty, 
That is correct and I have also corrected my lazy typing thus Nm should be N/mm. 

2400Ibs or 420N/mm comes from the actual spring rates implemented. 

When used in the combination this ends up with the 225/360/500Ibs rates noted above for the Sports Kit and these are the reasons why an uprated ARB or RSB is simply not required though may be necessary to fine tune for each buyer - for example, you may want MSS Sports ride comfort though aspire to the MSS Track Pack handling...use RSB to fill the gap in that instance...that is the fine tuning aspect where other mods *may *be necessary. 

I come back to the review by Craig - see http://fourtitude.com/news/aftermar...ng-kit-for-magnetic-ride-tested-in-audi-tt-rs - he wanted a track capable kit though he uses his car as a daily driver. Ideally Craig needed MSS Track Pack for when he is on track and MSS Sports for when he is using the car daily. He however opted for MSS Sports and when used with slick tyres on track (_this is the other fine tuning mod I mention above_) Craig found MSS Sports was more than capable on track knocking 4 seconds off his previous best at same track. He has now settled on MSS Sports and has no interest in the MSS Track Pack kit as MSS Sports fulfils his requirement. The interesting point to note here is that his car has the stock ARB front and rear...!

Offcourse, you could be '*extra*' like me and also buy an MSS Track Pack upgrade kit (_you get rear ONLY kit as the fronts remain the same_) and swap these accordingly...only takes 30-mins total to swap springs.

On my particular car, look further in to the above figures and that derives a wheel rate of 140Ibs per each rear wheel. Front wheel rate is 170Ibs per corner.


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## [email protected] (Sep 28, 2004)

William, 
Thank you for sharing! Might you also have corner weights for the TTRS?


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

RTErnie said:


> William,
> Thank you for sharing! Might you also have corner weights for the TTRS?


 Mine is below...;


 Corner Weight No driver
 kg
 Ibs
 % per corner
 RF - driver
 478.00
 1053.81
 30.52
 LF - passenger
 462.50
 1019.64
 29.53
 RR - driver
 322.00
 709.89
 20.56
 LR - passenger
 303.50
 669.10
 19.38
 rears
 625.50
 1378.99
 100.00
 fronts
 940.50
 2073.45


 1566.00
 3452.44


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## TRZ06 (Jan 20, 2013)

Holy cow batman!!! 

Just to consider all my options before I go ahead with doing the rear sway bar instead of the MSS spring kit, I called my dealer on a spring install... 

$1,260!!! 

They said they would have to take the suspension all the way off to swap the springs out and then do an alignment. 

Does that sound right?


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

TRZ06 said:


> Holy cow batman!!!
> 
> Just to consider all my options before I go ahead with doing the rear sway bar instead of the MSS spring kit, I called my dealer on a spring install...
> 
> ...


 That seems insane.


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## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2013)

TRZ06 said:


> Holy cow batman!!!
> 
> Just to consider all my options before I go ahead with doing the rear sway bar instead of the MSS spring kit, I called my dealer on a spring install...
> 
> ...


 Thats like 9 shop hours plus alignment!?! Thats sounds crazy...


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

Sounds like the whole team at the dealership are hoping to 'learn' a spring install using your car – which may not be a bad thing however the question here is why should you pay for their learning curve and using your car for that purpose?

The install time is 2-hrs for any of the MSS kit and that includes ‘_sanity checks_’. An over cautious tuner may take 2.5hrs though that needs to be challenged.

_‘Sanity checks_’ my tuner has implemented is essentially getting a peer mechanic to validate / QA their work ensuring each bolt tampered with has been correctly torque...keep in mind that we do this at least once a month as am on track at least once a month.

My tuner, admittedly he has done MSS install countless times now, takes 15 minutes each corner...then spends 30-minutes doing '_sanity checks_'. ..90-minutes total time though as stated, he has been working on MSS with me for over 2-years.


*TRZ06* - challenge that time quoted...the car is an Audi TT and not an F355 which requires engine out at major service...9-hrs for the F355 engine out and back would sound about right I suspect.

2-hrs for any spring kit install - not just MSS - is realistic.

William


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

R5T said:


> Nope.
> You don't need to take of the suspension all the way to swap springs. :screwy:


 You do have to remove the entire shock/spring assembly on the fronts. The rear is much simpler.


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## OldKenzo (Aug 14, 2012)

After reading another positive review:

http://fourtitude.com/news/aftermar...g-kit-for-magnetic-ride-tested-in-audi-tt-rs/

I preordered


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## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2013)

OldKenzo said:


> After reading another positive review:
> 
> http://fourtitude.com/news/aftermar...g-kit-for-magnetic-ride-tested-in-audi-tt-rs/
> 
> I preordered


Good thorough review for sure. Glad your aboard and thanks for the order. Ship date is getting closer!:thumbup:


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

*MSS Spring Kits shipping in less than 4-weeks...*

Quick note of appreciation to all those on the MSS Spring Kits pre-order list...;

*THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE, MUCH APPRECIATED. *

*THE FIRST KITS SHIP IN LESS THAN 4-WEEKS.*

William


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

Any more teaser pics??


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

Marty said:


> Any more teaser pics??


 Apologise Marty, Jeff and I missed this...blind leading blind in this case...!!!

No to more pix...the next couple of weeks are going to be the hardest and I have had a few queries on shipment. Eibach confirmed they are still on schedule with production.

Am on top of things though and pretty excited to ship very soon. I will offcourse post pix when I get the production kits here.

10-weeks ordering is a killer...and appreciate all those waiting...!


Am also finding out more about those on the waiting list for an MSS Spring Kit...and there are some pretty knowledgable buyers ready to put my claim and that of the testers feedback to some serious thorogh tests...


...am I nervous?
...YOU BET...!

Again, I really appreciate the patience shown by all waiting for their MSS Spring Kit.

William


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## Marty (Jul 14, 2000)

Got my kit!  And it even contained a few extra goodies:










The MSS hat and keychain was a nice touch. Now on to the real stuff:










The parts just ooze quality with tight tolerance and great fit and finish. The adjustable rear spring perches glide super smoothly, and the black anodized finish looks slick. My hats off to William and the rest of the MSS folks on putting together such a nice package for their first product offering. Can't wait to install these! Now I just need to find a free weekend...


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## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2013)

Marty said:


> Got my kit!  And it even contained a few extra goodies:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am jealous, Marty. I still have the prototype set up and not due a production kit until August:banghead: 

Thanks for the kind words and we will be very interested in your impressions on the kit once installed.

Enjoy


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> I am jealous, Marty. I still have the prototype set up and not due a production kit until August:banghead:
> 
> Thanks for the kind words and we will be very interested in your impressions on the kit once installed.
> 
> Enjoy


Jeff, 
I feel you Sir...am also on development kit and wish for a production kit on mine...!

@Marty,
Thanks for sharing. Kit looks better than I recall...

@Other MSS buyers, 
Come on, don't be bashful...show your kits off...assuming you have not fitted these as yet.


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## pal (Aug 16, 2000)

My kit came in today as well - very orange and black. My two fav automotive colors :beer:



















He even made sure we had no issues opening some cold ones post install.









QC checks in progress









And Minnie approves









Thanks William, Jeff and the MSS team. I will post a full review once this is installed.


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## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2013)

pal said:


> Thanks William, Jeff and the MSS team. I will post a full review once this is installed.


Your very welcome and enjoy! Looking forward to your review...


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## jibbed (Dec 3, 2011)

Well - figured given that everyone else was sharing, I'd post mine... All personalised like everyone elses  Free stuff is always good!

It's getting fitted tomorrow, I'll post feedback once I've fitted, plus a few before/after shots to measure the height difference.


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

jibbed said:


> Well - figured given that everyone else was sharing, I'd post mine... All personalised like everyone elses  Free stuff is always good!
> 
> It's getting fitted tomorrow, I'll post feedback once I've fitted, plus a few before/after shots to measure the height difference.


 Thx for posting and we appreciate the business and support.

Looking forward to the feedback.

William


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## jibbed (Dec 3, 2011)

NP! 

Well unfortunately I had Uni last night and it was pouring with rain, so no chance to get out and go for a drive... I did immediately notice a subtle increase in ride quality... I run quite high tyre pressure (36psi cold) so I can feel every bump (and pebble) on the road. I noticed that the car seems to soak up the bumps marginally better than stock, there's also less "wobble" or unsettling of the car when it hits a harsh bump. I might actually try lower pressures now, as it doesn't feel like the car needs it. 

Also, the car has much less tendency to dive under braking (admittedly I was only trying this from 40-50mph) and seems to sit much flatter through cornering. 

Front is no more than 5mm lower, the suspension guys said they lowered the rear to maximum to get a flat stance. It was dark so no photo's unfortunately, will get some tonight. 

Will report back once I've done the track day this weekend. 

Cheers, 
matt 



[email protected] said:


> Thx for posting and we appreciate the business and support.
> 
> Looking forward to the feedback.
> 
> William


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

jibbed said:


> NP!
> 
> Well unfortunately I had Uni last night and it was pouring with rain, so no chance to get out and go for a drive... I did immediately notice a subtle increase in ride quality... I run quite high tyre pressure (36psi cold) so I can feel every bump (and pebble) on the road. I noticed that the car seems to soak up the bumps marginally better than stock, there's also less "wobble" or unsettling of the car when it hits a harsh bump. I might actually try lower pressures now, as it doesn't feel like the car needs it.
> 
> ...


Matt, thanks for the short feedback.

The subtle changes expand as the speeds increase simply because of the way the MagneRide dampers function - damping forces (_rebound in particular due to MSS implementation_), increases with greater velocity. This in turn promotes stability and comfort.

Flatter cornering and lack of diving on braking is an MSS trait and that is something we commonly get feedback on. You will also note that stability on wet tarmac is also very well controlled with the change to MSS Spring kits.

Couple of points I want to cover to help as others fit their kits and these are as follows...;

1) *TYRE pressures;*
This is very much a personal preference and in some cases down to the tyre brand - for example, I run 30PSI and 28PSI cold on streets with the Michelin PS2 tyres. Both were *not* Audi recommendation though I found that worked best for me when the car was on stock springs and I carried that over when I fitted MSS. I subsequently changed to OEM pressures after much testing which for UK cars on 19”s are 32PSI fronts and 26PSI rears, both colds and the small change made a difference certainly to ride comfort. Tyre wear was even as expected though I do keep a strict regime of tyre rotation; checking Geo per quarter; checking tyre pressures once a week.

On track, I found the PS2 were happy at 36-38PSI hot fronts and above 30PSI hot on rears.


Fast forward to Michelin PSS that I now have and the OEM pressures for streets is still right and I did play around with various pressures over time and the OEM pressures works best. Tyre wear is even and marginal so all is well. We have covered about 5k miles to date.

On track, the story with Michelin PSS is entirely different – they are happy with 28PSI hot on fronts and 35PSI hot on rears after some testing of different pressures. Looking at pictures from my last track day posted here in another thread, it would look like the rear pressures are spot-on though the fronts are still a little high – I will shoot for 26PSI hot next to see if the centre tread gets less abuse.

So, your 36PSI – I presume that would be on the fronts - sounds a touch high to me though I understand why you did that with OEM springs...I also did that once J. Am not sure what the Audi recommendation for cars delivered to Australia will be however I would hazard a guess that it would be similar to UK pressures. In which case, give those a go now that you have the MSS springs on the car. 

On track, you will just have to try out and see what works best. Starting with OEM is not a bad place to be and you can always reduce or add more. As the car is biased towards FWD, I would look to lower the front tyre pressures when hot to below 40PSI and gradually lower to what works best for you. On the rears, you will probably get away with OEM for the track though, and again, tyre pressures are very much a personal thing and only you can decide what works best for you...starting from OEM pressures is the right way forward based on our experience.

*2) MSS Ride heights*
I purposely stayed away from lowering the car too much from stock so as to not cause clearance issues as owners round the globe fitted the MSS Spring kit. 

So, the kit keeps ride height lowering focussed on performance and ride comfort. We go low enough to make the MSS spring kits and MagneRide dampers function as intended thus ride comfort is improved and handling is improved by resolving the OEM traits we all do not want – specifically rear end squatting on acceleration; body roll; diving under braking; unsettling the car on rough tarmac. 

We have recorded a number of different ride heights as MSS Spring kits are fitted to cars. That is expected and normal as each car weighs different when it leaves the factory simply because of the addition or omission of certain options. The good point is that we are not seeing figures beyond the lowering points we quote thus up to 15mm fronts and up to 20mm rears.

On your car, I know one of your concerns was going too low as your front drive was steep. I will assume that post MSS Spring kits installation, those concerns have gone away. Advice if otherwise. 

Thanks for your review and let us know how you get on at the track.


Hope you have as much fun as our TT-S owner who has MSS Sports Kit fitted to his car - which incidentally, he is slowly turning in to a track car with weight down to 3100Ibs...

...erm, he is going to our fully adjustable MSS Track _Pack_ kit very soon to keep ahead on track as per usual and get lower lap times - see picture from our Facebook re-posted below...;


Photo courtesy of CaliPhotography - see www.caliphotography.com.











William


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## dlb678190 (Aug 10, 2013)

I'm not a big forum user, but I did find information about MSS and William via forums. After some emails back and forth, I decided to be part of the pre-buy. William continues to be very responsive to any emails or questions I have, and everything about the purchase went as promised. I was so happy with the results that I felt it only fair to give back to the forum community and William for helping me make my car better. 

Relevant car info- TT RS with MSS Sports Kit and about 50 extra pounds of stereo equipment all behind the back seat 

After the install, I had the car aligned and set it to the specs listed in the instructions, max negative front camber (tech was able to achieve -1.2), 0 toe front, and stock settings otherwise. I plan to let everything settle, make any necessary height adjustments to level the car out, and align again in a thousand miles or so. Since the car was about a 1/4" low in the rear, probably due to the weight of my stereo equipment, I had the levelers set +1/4", and it is roughly level. I've noticed about a 3/4" drop overall so far; The kit has been installed for about a week. 

Impressions with stock springs- 
Normal mode was a bit harsh, but the handling was aggressive and in my mind very good. The car bounced and crashed over normal road imperfections making daily driving a bit unnerving. 
Sport mode was essentially a waste, the car was nice and stiff, but it bucked and bounced if the road wasn't perfectly smooth. I rarely used it. 

After MSS install- 
Normal mode- Over normal road imperfections, the car is now buttery smooth for such a short wheel base, and the noise level is down. Handling is less aggressive than stock but very predictable and still a joy- great for everyday driving on normal roads. 
Sport mode is now a blast and really wakes the car up. Body roll and squat are still very minimal, but the car doesn't get nearly as unsettled as before. Now, I want to use it. 

I haven't tracked it yet, but I plan to in about a month to see how the performance is under more extreme conditions, but I'm sure I'll be pleased. Since this is my daily driver, I can't overstate how much more comfortable the car is to drive. As an engineer myself, I was skeptical that one passionate guy could out think a VAG engineering team, but I really think William and those that have helped him on his journey have done just that. This is a great product. 

Thanks! 
Brad from Memphis


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## MSS Automotive (Mar 20, 2013)

dlb678190 said:


> I'm not a big forum user, but I did find information about MSS and William via forums. After some emails back and forth, I decided to be part of the pre-buy. William continues to be very responsive to any emails or questions I have, and everything about the purchase went as promised. I was so happy with the results that I felt it only fair to give back to the forum community and William for helping me make my car better.
> 
> Relevant car info- TT RS with MSS Sports Kit and about 50 extra pounds of stereo equipment all behind the back seat
> 
> ...


 Brad,
you are welcome and thanks for dedicating your first post to MSS, much appreciated.

As you mentioned, there is a great team of people behind MSS and I know they, as I am, will be grateful to you for taking the time to share your experience here. 

Jeff - email is [email protected] - is our MSS KITS owner for the American region and is also available to field any queries. Jeff is based in Oregon and also has an MSS Sports kit fitted to his TT-RS and being US based is best placed to give a localised view or answer any queries.

I know he fields many queries on PM and emails so do continue to direct your questions at him or to me. We welcome the queries and are happy to help.

William


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