# s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY????



## dutchbro (Oct 11, 2009)

Ok so there are two different audis in my area, both awd. Anyways my pops and his friends tell me people have nothing but problems with S4's and i should stay away from twin turbo setup. But i love s4's and that wont change lol he thinks i should go for the cheaper 1.8 gt2871 with slightly less miles...So any ideas...whats 2.7t life like...any remarks appreciated...also coming from a mk4 gti BT so either will be better!


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## jettasmooth (Aug 7, 2002)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (dutchbro)*

the 2.7T is gonna cost you more in maintenance, but you really gotta consider the overall condition of both vehicles. Control arms, tranny, suspension and exhaust all are big factors in long term repair costs. If the maintenance record is good on the 2.7T and you like the S4's then go for it, but keep in mind that the repairs would probably be cheaper on the 1.8T.


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## dutchbro (Oct 11, 2009)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (jettasmooth)*

The s4 has 105k miles... the a4 has only 80k. I finally drove both and i still feel like the s4 was a night and day difference in all a lot of ways lol the condition of the a4 was probably better then the s4...and the s4 has had a ton of owners...ive just had so many problems with the 1.8t in my gti... but that said i know zip about the s4's really.


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## AggvGtivr6 (Aug 4, 2002)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (dutchbro)*

you want an S4 with as few of owners as possible and a very long list of service records. Miles are less important than those 2 other factors


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## dutchbro (Oct 11, 2009)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (AggvGtivr6)*

Did the carfax on the s4 its a 01 and has had 7 owners







thats almost a new owner every year...kinda scary...maybe the search should continue.


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## AggvGtivr6 (Aug 4, 2002)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (dutchbro)*

sounds like each owner was putting off maintenance and getting rid of the car. Which if you can get the car cheap, drop the motor and do everything at once it might not be a bad deal. however who knows what else was neglected, and these cars need more attention than a j.a.p. with a drug problem.


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## dutchbro (Oct 11, 2009)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (AggvGtivr6)*

^^^^ ya i agree...i think i should get it on a lift and take a look at it more in depth...while im here at the 2.7t area, ive got a question...besides the obvious differences from S4 to A4 what would be some losses(performance, handling,anything else) that I would take with getting the a4 do you think?


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## nikitynick (Jan 14, 2007)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (dutchbro)*

is the A4 FWD? that would be huge for me if choosing. just know to expect more frequent maintenance, more expensive maintenance, and just more expensive in general. (6 coilpacks vs 4, lower MPG's, ect). however if you like working on your car all the time, then i would consider the S4. However I would strongly recommend educating yourself more on the B5 S4, its no walk in the park type of car.


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## dutchbro (Oct 11, 2009)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (nikitynick)*

^^^ yes sir spent all of this week and weekend researching... the a4 IS a quattro. my cousin who races in the dutch supercar challange in holland finally emailed me back about this and this is what he said,
"There is a reason Audi stopped selling cars with the 2.7 liter engine. The engine is flawed BY DESIGN. The 2000-2002 S4s all came with K03 turbo chargers. Given the way the 2.7 liter engine in the S4 was designed, this turbo does not have adequate cooling to prolong it's life. IT WILL FAIL, even if you don't race or chip the car. When the turbos fail, it requires removal of ENTIRE ENGINE to replace them. This is close to $4-5k in labor and parts. The problem can be avoided in the future by replacing the K03 with K04 turbos, but it's expensive. This design has contributed to the lousy resale value. DO NOT BUY THIS CAR JARED!"
thats all he had to say lol i asked him as he used to have a b5 s4.
I am just curious as to what it would take a a4 to get to s4 times...I dont see how a simple eliminator kit reaches that on the A4..


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## Jurjen (Oct 9, 2002)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (dutchbro)*

Hey, I'm bias, owning an S4, but I've owned one for 4 years, been chipped for 3 years, and stage 2+ for the last year, and I would definitely recommend the S4, especially if you're looking for big power down the road. 
Just get the car checked out thoroughly, and keep a few grand in the bank for repairs. The turbo issues with the S4's are way overblown, it just doesn't happen as often as you think. Pop over to Audizine and do a search for K03's, and there's lots of people in the mid to high 100k miles with original turbos (mine included)

Just get the car checked out thoroughly, treat it properly, and save up for k04's or Rs6's...or Tial 605s! SO many options for this platform now.


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## dutchbro (Oct 11, 2009)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (Jurjen)*

^^ that sounds good...but I in no way have a few grand in my account for random repairs...at any given time either. I need a daily driver that is reliable...I keep reading whore stories about the s4 but it seems it takes quit a bit to get a a4 to s4 specs...Im a student and graduate in june...so cash flow is pretty low right now...would any of you still go for it and get a s4 or am i getting in over my head... 
Mechanic know how
Myself=5/10
Dad 10/10
let me know guys im counting on some 2.7t feedback, thanks


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## AggvGtivr6 (Aug 4, 2002)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (dutchbro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dutchbro* »_Im a student and graduate in june...so cash flow is pretty low right now...

go buy a accord/camry/Japanese****box and wait till you have the money for an S4


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## dutchbro (Oct 11, 2009)

*Re: s4 2.7t or A4 BT...RELIABILITY???? (AggvGtivr6)*

hell no. I would never buy ANYTHING JAPANESE! I still have a job right now and make decent money...im just not wealthy at this moment...
any useful feedback?


_Modified by dutchbro at 1:05 PM 4-28-2010_


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## Frankenpuppet (Aug 27, 2006)

dutchbro said:


> hell no. I would never buy ANYTHING JAPANESE! I still have a job right now and make decent money...im just not wealthy at this moment...
> any useful feedback?
> 
> 
> _Modified by dutchbro at 1:05 PM 4-28-2010_


I had a 2000 Audi A6 with the 2.7, and I chipped it right away. FANTASTIC power, and decent mileage. (for a big heavy 4 door) Then, the right side turbo blew, and I spent thousands of dollars getting a new set of turbos used, stock) put in. It never ran right after that. I think one of the replacement turbos had a bad blow off valve. (I"m no mechanic, tho) To drop the motor again to fix the turbo was prohibitively expensive. I sold it, lost BIG money on it, and even tho it looked super clean, probably needed that right side turbo R and R'd again. (about 3 Grand Labour)
I still think about that car. Real neat when it was running, but an absolute PITA when ANYTHING broke. The labour to change the alternator was around 700$! The motor bay is super tight, and to fix this car is very labour intensive. 
If I could do it again, I wouldn't.


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## Corradokcid (Nov 6, 2006)

s4's are bigger money pits then corrado's stay away unless you make good money


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## Gtiupb2002 (Jun 4, 2007)

If you know what your doing you will save thousands in labor. I have wanted a b5 S4 since I sold my mk4 GTI. I have only had my S4 for about a month and a half but love every moment of it. I also have another car just in case. It takes alot more to get an A4 in S4 times and nothing beats the sound of an S4. If an S4 is what you want then get one, just be prepared to work on it. I would also look around a little bit depending on how much you plan on spending, you can find a nice stage 3 for a decent price and most of those cars will have all the major maintenance done. GL


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## VEE-DUBBER (Nov 22, 2000)

never own an S4 if you are scared of pulling out engines. i just did this on my back in the gravel for a guy because an S4 had a "bad" valve(according to the dealer). 53k, car is in almost immaculate condition. 1 tiny dent smaller then a dime, interior is still new inside. 









guy picked up the car for what he thought was going to be a great money maker @ 5k. well after $xxxx in labor and then the cost of a new motor, he should have bought one all ready running. and how many 2.7T motors are laying around with lower mileage. 

Things you really want to of had the PO do recently if you pick up one of these.. 

Clutch with a NEW flywheel (dual mass doesn't resurface well) $1500-2500 depending on shop 

Timing Belt/90k service. and all of them up to the mileage the car is at. quad digit bill again. 

Fuel filter (pain in the ass, inbetween the gas tank and the body, have to lower the gas tank) depending on the shop, but anywhere from .5 hour labor to 2 hours labor @ shop rate 

Turbos which I have heard is possible without pulling the motor, but i don't see how after pulling the motor to pull the head off the car i showed pics of, and i've worked on quite a few of these. which a lot of shops charge 30-40 hours of labor time. 

(A4's and S4's)All the control arms and steering stuff, needs to be replaced regularly as they are very high wear items on the cars and they seem to go through wheel bearings alot too. 

all the LEDs work in the cluster display? 

I'm not posting this stuff to deter you, I would love to own one. This is all stuff i have done to S4's and just letting you know the rough cost it can be. Get the car on an alignment rack before purchase to make sure everything is straight. and oil leaks, broken spider tubes, etc. are all very common and a pain to get at with this motor. But in good working order they are awesome cars and extremely nice to drive. 

getting a A4 1.8T to 240 crank hp takes ...chip, intake, turboback. S4 is heavier, and better (although still pretty lame) brakes. cost of owning is way way down on the a4 for sure.


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## CE (Jan 21, 2001)

72,000 been flawless. Stock, no monkey business. Bi turbo is cool. My GTI 2.0T is also, never had any turbo issues, it's been perfected, oil is key.


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## jc_bb (Sep 27, 2005)

went through this same choice myself 4 years ago.
went with a 1.8t and have built a 2.0l block with 2871 to go in within a month or so (been saying that for years.

2.7t is very nice and has potential for more power and better curve but it is going to cost you three times as much to get there unless you own a tuning shop and do all the work yourself.

twice as many turbos, 50% more rods, pistons etc, need to pull an engine everytime you want to do ANYTHING to it.

car is cheaper to buy, cheaper to maintain, cheaper to run, easier to work on...........

no brainer IMO.


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## VAGjunkey (Sep 13, 2009)

I've owned an s4 for over a year. Driving that thing is like wiping my a++ with silk. Everytime I go somewhere I always take the longest road possible. I love every minute of driving it. then comes the bad. Maintenance is a pita. I can not understate that. That car will fight you all the way. if you cannot keep at least 1500 in your bank or have a reliable backup car, then good luck and get an account with aaa. I used them 4 times this year for my audi. Based on your situation I would wait on getting a more stable situation before you take a plunge into the b5 s4 world.


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