# Curious Speedometer / odometer / fuel indicator issue...



## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

Hello guys!
My speedometer and odometer is dead, and the fuel gauge became goofy when I make a turn. 
Tachometer and water temp has NO problems!
I have made a scanning in my *2001 Jetta* with VAG-COM, and then, it show the following faults:
*16885* - _Vehicle Speed Sensor: Implausible Signal_ 
P0501 - 35-00 - -
*00849* - _S-contact at Ignition/Starter Switch (D)_
25-10 - Unknown Switch Condition - Intermittent 
*00953* - _Interior Light Time limit_ 
25-10 - Unknown Switch Condition - Intermittent 
*00944* - _Heated Exterior Mirror: Passenger Side (Z5)_ 
35-00 - -
*The Check list I did*
- VSS replaced for a new one [OK]
- Sensor wires are powered [OK]
- Gauge fuses are ok [OK]
... however the speedo remains dead and Vag-Com keeps with the same faults








So guys, any idea what is causing that malfunction?








Please, any thought to help me to solve that issue, is very much appreciated!
Thanks!!!
*Pic: The VSS replacement*








The Car: (CRAPPY PIC, I KNOW!)










_Modified by EuroFlavored at 10:09 AM 9-23-2009_


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## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

C'mon guys... lets share the knowledge!
Thanks!


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## nwvwgli (Aug 18, 2007)

i just did an 02a swap im my mk3 and havent hooked the speedo up yet and my gas gauge goes everywhere like if engine load is higher it will go to emty then as soon as i lift the gas pedal goes back to normal reading lemme know if you find anything ill post back if i fix mine first


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## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

*Re: (nwvwgli)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nwvwgli* »_i just did an 02a swap im my mk3 and havent hooked the speedo up yet and my gas gauge goes everywhere like if engine load is higher it will go to emty then as soon as i lift the gas pedal goes back to normal reading lemme know if you find anything ill post back if i fix mine first

I dunno the level about your engine swap, but one of the possible causes that you have to check first is regarding the Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS)... check the fuse, the harness and then the sensor itself.
If you got no deal when checking and maybe replacing the VSS, like i did, and have no related issues to speedometer when you scan with VagCom, like i do, we have to wait more contributions from this forum...
I have heard about the ABS speed sensor, that must be damaged. But, I have no Vag-Com fault codes from ABS controller, the ABS light is off and the car is breaking good... I dunno... Any tought?






















Please, keep this topic updated with your progress also!








Good luck http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## ghoxt (Jun 9, 2006)

*Re: (EuroFlavored)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TJ99MKIVVR6* »_I believe there is a second sensor located on the passenger side somewhere. Same thing happened to me. My speedometer stopped working; I bought a new VSS and installed it myself and it worked for about 20 miles then quit. I then brought the car to my mechanic and he said he replaced another sensor somewhere on the passenger side and that corected the problem.

Quote from another topic... hope it helps! *^*


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## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

*Re: (ghoxt)*

I dunno wich speed sensor the quote guy is talking about, because in the Bentley Manual is related to ABS Speed Sensor, but I got no fault in VagCom regarding that one, so... I am waiting for more contributions...
*PS: I still have no speedo...*








Thanks a lot! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## ghoxt (Jun 9, 2006)

*Re: (EuroFlavored)*


_Quote, originally posted by *EuroFlavored* »_I dunno wich speed sensor the quote guy is talking about, because in the Bentley Manual is related to ABS Speed Sensor, but I got no fault in VagCom regarding that one, so... I am waiting for more contributions...
*PS: I still have no speedo...*








Thanks a lot! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Wheel Speed Sensor = ABS Speed Sensor








...however your ABS light should be on, warning a malfunction in the sensor.


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## independent77 (May 23, 2003)

*Re: (ghoxt)*

incorrect.
abs and vehicle speed(VSS) are 2 different systems

Edit for clarity.


_Modified by independent77 at 3:21 PM 9-10-2009_


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## ghoxt (Jun 9, 2006)

*Re: (independent77)*


_Quote, originally posted by *independent77* »_incorrect.
abs and engine speed are 2 different systems



You right, however I was talking about WHEEL speed sensor, not the ENGINE speed sensor as you mentioned!


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## I_JUST_LOVE_VAGS (Sep 10, 2009)

I had a VSS isue too. I was getting an 'implausible signal" I think is what vag com calle dit. My speedo worked in the car perfectly. It turns out that the ECU was not being told the speed of the car though. To check this, open vag com and go to the measuring blocks. I forget which number, but one of them will tell you car spped. See if that is registering when you drive. 
Mine was not registering, therefore the ecu did not know my car speed and it threw a code. Now i dont why this happend, but it did. To get me by for a bit (i needed to pass inspection and could not w/ this code) I just hard-wired it to the ecu. Its two wires. I forget which pins, but all i did was jump the vss to the ecu. So, try that to see if it fixes the problem.
dont know if that helps, but maybe it will get you in the right direction.


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## independent77 (May 23, 2003)

*Re: (ghoxt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ghoxt* »_
You right, however I was talking about WHEEL speed sensor, not the ENGINE speed sensor as you mentioned!









ABS wheel speed sensor is much different than the engine 'wheel' speed sensor(located on the trans)
and yea, you got me. I meant to say wheel not engine.


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## ghoxt (Jun 9, 2006)

*Re: (independent77)*


_Quote, originally posted by *independent77* »_
ABS wheel speed sensor is much different than the engine 'wheel' speed sensor(located on the trans)
and yea, you got me. I meant to say wheel not engine.

We are talking about 3 differents sensors:
*Engine speed sensor* _(mounted near the crankshaft)_ - where the tachometer reads from.
*Vehicle speed sensor (VSS)* _(located on your drivetrain)_ - where the speedometer reads from.
*ABS Speed Sensor (aka Wheel Speed Sensor)* _(located behind your wheels)_ - where the ABS system reads from.


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## independent77 (May 23, 2003)

*Re: (ghoxt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ghoxt* »_
We are talking about 3 differents sensors:
*Engine speed sensor* _(mounted near the crankshaft)_ - where the tachometer reads from.
*Vehicle speed sensor (VSS)* _(located on your drivetrain)_ - where the speedometer reads from.
*ABS Speed Sensor (aka Wheel Speed Sensor)* _(located behind your wheels)_ - where the ABS system reads from.

right. and..... We are not dealing with an ABS issue. 
For the original poster... Trace wires. if you have already replaced the VSS, trace the wires. find the fault.
there also exists the possibility that your cluster is f*cked. 
(may not apply here but..... the aba ecu gets the VSS signal from the cluster. no cluster, no vss signal to the ecu) i realize yours is a mk4 but the same logic may apply.


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## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

*Re: (independent77)*


_Quote, originally posted by *independent77* »_
right. and..... We are not dealing with an ABS issue. 
For the original poster... Trace wires. if you have already replaced the VSS, trace the wires. find the fault.
there also exists the possibility that your cluster is f*cked. 
(may not apply here but..... the aba ecu gets the VSS signal from the cluster. no cluster, no vss signal to the ecu) i realize yours is a mk4 but the same logic may apply.

Many thanks for the assist!
OK, I already have checked the wires, unplugging the harness and measuring its contacts, I got the results as can be seen in the pic:








Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the VSS is receiving power enough (12V) and the signal input (9V). 
About the cursory inspection in the wires, I did not notice any burned, melted or broken wires, but if you can tell me how I can dig it a little more, I'd appreciate.
And, I still getting the same fault from the scanning:
*16885 - Vehicle Speed Sensor: Implausible Signal*















I am not assuming my cluster f*cked, because so many people had exactly the same issue in the speedo and the VSS was the guilty. I still have tachometer, water temp and clock, but I really dunno anymore...
If you have any though, please share with us! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## jettatech (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: (EuroFlavored)*

The fuel gauge dampner inopertive is a result of the speedo malfunction. Is it a manual or auto trans? Auto trans has the fluid level indicator/gear rod assembly that can crack/auto also see alot of final drive plastic gear cracking on diff. Did you run the sensor using a cordless drill? That may let you know if problem is in trans or after the sensor...... Fuses tested ok, then i would read data blocks to see if modual are seeing the vss. Output diagnostics on cluster work? Bang the dash area with your hand while driving, common on A3 golf jetta, bang speedo will work for a second...Just throwing some ideas out there....


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## Obi-Wan (Sep 12, 2009)

had same problem with my 96 Jetta III. It was bad contacts with one of the two instrument panel plugs.
Have fun with the dash...


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## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

*Re: (I_JUST_LOVE_VAGS)*


_Quote, originally posted by *I_JUST_LOVE_VAGS* »_I had a VSS isue too. I was getting an 'implausible signal" I think is what vag com calle dit. My speedo worked in the car perfectly. It turns out that the ECU was not being told the speed of the car though. To check this, open vag com and go to the measuring blocks. I forget which number, but one of them will tell you car spped. See if that is registering when you drive. 
Mine was not registering, therefore the ecu did not know my car speed and it threw a code. Now i dont why this happend, but it did. To get me by for a bit (i needed to pass inspection and could not w/ this code) I just hard-wired it to the ecu. Its two wires. I forget which pins, but all i did was jump the vss to the ecu. So, try that to see if it fixes the problem.
dont know if that helps, but maybe it will get you in the right direction.


Can I ask you to tell us more about your issue, please? 
Assuming that this is the problem, can you tell us how did you solve that issue? Just a hard-wire from ECU to VSS??? Can you explain more about it?
Thank you!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by EuroFlavored at 11:32 PM 9-23-2009_


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## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

I think I got no signal... 
Maybe a harness issue???


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## independent77 (May 23, 2003)

*Re: (EuroFlavored)*

definatly a harness issue.


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## Obi-Wan (Sep 12, 2009)

*Re: (Obi-Wan)*

I was able to successfully troubleshoot the instrument panel plug issue by driving about 10' at a time in my drive way, whilst manipulating the connector plug and watching the speedo at the same time.... It may have been safer with the front wheels off the ground (and no kids playing in the driveway). I now have a plastic drywall anchor holding the plug in a slightly cocked position to maintain contact... works great for a few months and ~ 10K mi. so far










_Modified by Obi-Wan at 7:29 PM 9-26-2009_


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## jkoorts (Oct 29, 2008)

*Re: (EuroFlavored)*

EuroFlavored, how did the story end?


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## EuroFlavored (Nov 22, 2006)

*Re: (jkoorts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jkoorts* »_EuroFlavored, how did the story end?
 
Actually this story is not over yet... I'm still with my speedometer dead!
I tryed to check the harness, but I got no malfunction detected.
I am lost! Help!


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## naconi (Nov 1, 2009)

*Re: (EuroFlavored)*

If you have the 01m automatic transmission there is a plastic gear in the transmission that drives the VSS. It is fairly common for this to break. It is expense to have it fixed because it is 6-7 hours of labor and about $100 in parts.
To test the connection from the VSS to the speedo remove the VSS like in your first photo and connect a cordless drill to the VSS so you can spin it. Turn the ignition on but do not start it, have someone watch the speedo while you spin the VSS with the drill. If the speedometer works then the problem is in the transmission.


_Modified by naconi at 2:01 PM 1-27-2010_


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## kebze (Mar 24, 2010)

*Re: Curious Speedometer / odometer / fuel indicator issue... (EuroFlavored)*

Hi I have the exact same problem with my 2001 Audi A4. Speedo and odometer is dead and fuel gauge actiung funny. If you managed to get the problem fixed please please help me out it would be very much appreciated. 
also when i call up the audi main dealer asking for the VSS thy tell me which one? 
Crankshaft sensor,
Camshaft sensor,
or ABS Speed sensor?
would like to know which one you was reffering to?


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## GLI_Joe (Sep 3, 2006)

Same problem here on '03 Jetta. Just want to hear if anyone finds a fix.


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## naconi (Nov 1, 2009)

*Re: (GLI_Joe)*

I already posted the fix for my car. What else are you looking for? What transmission do you have? Is the Check Engine light on?


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## vwhotrodder 2 (Feb 10, 2003)

*Re: (EuroFlavored)*

Check-out the Ross-Tech forum and Faq as there is a thread on this but i believe replacing the VSS will solve your problem... It's worth the read... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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