# 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT



## fahrfrumlosin (Sep 15, 2000)

I understand the kelvin spectrum, but in driving conditions, how would visibility fare with these 2 temperature lights. I am considering replacing my bulbs to 3000K once stock dies.


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## dennisgli (May 17, 2003)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (fahrfrumlosin)*

I'd prefer 3000kelvin - but which specific bulbs are you comparing? If you want to compare light output you should be comparing lumens and not kelvins!


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## sleepygti28 (Feb 24, 2005)

3000K is extremely yellow and is normally used for bad weather conditions. Normally this color K is used for Fog Lights and the rated Lumens is around 3200lumens.
4100K is extremely white and is normaly used for Low Beams. The normal rated Lumens is around 3000lumens.
I don't know if that answered your question but that's to the extent of my knowledge of those 2 Ks.
later


_Modified by sleepygti28 at 9:19 PM 10-14-2005_


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## dennisgli (May 17, 2003)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (sleepygti28)*

Kelvin is just not a very meaningful metric for HIDs. And it doesn't really apply much better to tinted halogen bulbs.
Anyway, what bulb are you refering to that is 3000K and 3200lumens? Just curious.


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## fahrfrumlosin (Sep 15, 2000)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (dennisgli)*

Well the bulbs I am considering are Phillips Ultinon 3000K








I figure since LeMans race cars use similar lighting systems, it would be great for road use. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## sleepygti28 (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (dennisgli)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dennisgli* »_Kelvin is just not a very meaningful metric for HIDs. And it doesn't really apply much better to tinted halogen bulbs.
Anyway, what bulb are you refering to that is 3000K and 3200lumens? Just curious.

I don't remember which bulb company it was but I read it off several websites that sell 3000K H3 HID Kits.
And most of the 3000K HID bulbs are just 4100K HID bulbs colored with a yellow film inside or outside the bulb. Is that right? please correct me if I'm wrong.


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## sleepygti28 (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (fahrfrumlosin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *fahrfrumlosin* »_Well the bulbs I am considering are Phillips Ultinon 3000K








I figure since LeMans race cars use similar lighting systems, it would be great for road use. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

The thing is that I don't think the bright yellow is DOT Legal for Low Beams. But if these bulbs are used for a secondary lighting source then you'll be fine. Like the Lexus IS300s use the Yellow Lighting as Fog Lights.
On the other hand if you don't care for the law. Go Ahead! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif








And those 3000K HID Bulbs are pretty DAMN Bright!!! Almost like High Beams.


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## gregom (Mar 29, 2005)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (sleepygti28)*

3000K is yellow, yes... it is designed for use in poor weather because yellow makes the road easier to see than white or bluish headlamps. This is only during rain really, and fog. In fog, you use fog lamps only, and turn off your main lights. The low to the ground fogs cut underneath the fog so its easier to see the road. The main beams are between the road and your eyes, so a lot of light is reflected off the fog and you can't see crap.
For main driving lights, about 4100K is the brightest you will get. Yes it is the whitest and isnt as cool looking as blue, but if you are at all interested in performance and not just looks, its the best way to go. A proper setup using HID projector housings will give you the best, brightest output compared to all other options. If you like blue that much, a 5000K or 5400K kit might be okay, but you will lose some brightness. Anything above 6000K is illegal for street use in most states and countries.
I myself have 6000K aftermarket HID's in my VW Fox in regular aftermarket Euro halogen reflector housings. Needless to say the output is TERRIBLE and causes lots of glare to oncoming traffic. It is also to blue for my tastes and isnt super bright. I am currently in the works of retrofitting some projectors to solve this. I also have some Sylvania X1010 Aux driving lamps (HID) to help with wide-beam for good cornering. I bought them from http://www.suvlights.com but they are now discontinued, so limited stock left.
If your curious to see my light output see this thread: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2227417
Plenty of pics in it I assure you.


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## dennisgli (May 17, 2003)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (sleepygti28)*

3000Kelvin isn't very yellow - a regular incandescent bulb is about 2800K. But again, Kelvin is not an accurate way of specifying the color of anything other than incandescent bulbs. "Legal" headlights have to be "white" so it really gets down to how yellow they look. See Daniel Stern Lighting.


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## fahrfrumlosin (Sep 15, 2000)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (gregom)*

My car is already set up at 4100K, I was asking about 3000K, and I don't believe anyone posed the question of 5000K or greater or performance vs. looks...
I'm just asking about 3000K, its brightness compared to 4100K, and perhaps its legalities.
Thanks







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Jeraass (Aug 6, 2003)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (fahrfrumlosin)*

You can view some pics of 3000K HID drop ins on the picture page of
http://www.xenondepot.com


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## gregom (Mar 29, 2005)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (fahrfrumlosin)*

My bad... I didn't know exact what you were looking for. I'd guess the visible light output is very close in terms of strength. I have little knowledge of the 'yellow' bulbs, but I have seen that they have really good output on the road. Those HIDs appear to be filtered, but are probably still really bright. I saw a guy who did this at http://www.hidplanet.com in their forums and it was very bright and looked pretty damn cool at the same time. If you like the blue/yellow lights mix, and IMHO i'm partial to it as well, do it right or it looks really funky/fake.
As long as that HID is put in a proper housing, i'm sure you'll get great output. Its a quality known brand too, so thats a plus.
As for the legalities... As long as the are in FOGS ONLY, you'll be fine. They are illegal in your mainbeams as far as I know. You can have them on all the time if you want and probably be fine, but dont drive with them primary unless its foggy or raining. Otherwise i'm sure some pissy cop will pull you over. That however, is my opinion...


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

Legality??? Probably won't pass inspection in NJ with them in your low beams and high beams.


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## gregom (Mar 29, 2005)

*Re: (GT17V)*

That's what I'm saying... they are fogs only...


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

Do get the deep yellow output... you need a tint (filter)... anytime you have a tint or filter... it decreases lumens.
The Phillips HID 3000K capsules for example will have less lumen output than the 4300K HID capsules.


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## gregom (Mar 29, 2005)

*Re: (GT17V)*

True... but it will work better on roads that are wet from rain. The yellow light wont reflect as much, leaving more on the pavement so you can see better.
True fog lights are yellow. But you need pretty damn bright ones for them to be effective.


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

The shorter wavelengths of "yellow" light-- our eyes work better with it.


_Modified by GT17V at 9:52 AM 10-17-2005_


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## Gigitt (May 26, 2004)

*Re: (GT17V)*

Yellow lights for Fog Lights work best because of the fact that Yellow lights penetrate further into the fog, sleet or snow conditions than a white light. It is not because they are closer to the ground... but fog lights closer to the ground does help!
Comparing a yellow fog to a white fog you will see a remarkable difference in distance seen vs glare!!! White lights tend to reflect off of the water particles in fog/sleet/snow more so than yellow light so you will see better and further.
As for using 3000K Yellow light as a low beam VS a white 4100K in normal night time driving conditions, you will probably not see any better or further down the road with a 3000K yellow globe.
Although a Yellow 3000K low beam will be easier on the eyes as a lonely driver on a road... this is because your eyes are adjusted to said lower light output (your eye's iris will be larger to let more light in) and this can cause you problems with oncomming traffic causing a momentary dirver blindness... this maybe why it is a illegal - a safety issue.
Also... Oncomming cars and pedestrians see cars with white light better for safety.


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## GT17V (Aug 7, 2001)

The primary reason why "French" yellow is no longer produced back in the mid-late 80's was the coating was carcinogenic.
Yellow light is better for oncoming traffic because it's not quite as distracting.


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## EternalMind (Jun 8, 2005)

*Re: 3000K vs. 4100K in terms of VISIBLE LIGHT (gregom)*



gregom said:


> As for the legalities... As long as the are in FOGS ONLY, you'll be fine. QUOTE]
> yellow in a foglamp is OK, but I can almost guarantee that HID in a foglamp (even if yellow) will NOT be legal; too much light to meet legal photometric test points.


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