# Brake Install, With PICs



## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

i have had it with the piss poor brakes on this thing, so i made a call to my friendly neighborhood parts store. (tirerack.com)

Purchased Centric Rotors, Hawk HPS Pads. The Installation was very easy, except for the fact that my rotors were rusted to the hubs. Even with soaking them with PB Blaster, i still needed a hammer to get them off.

What was just a little out of the norm, was the way Chrysler attaches the caliper pins to the carrier. It is some sort of dual bolt setup. Being that this is an american car, i busted out a pair of vice-grips for help.

The Hawk HPS pads, even tho brand new, have a much more aggressive initial bite which helps the spongy petal feel as the stock pads.

I Still have a slight pulsation in the pedal, so i will be doing the rear rotors next week.

Some Pics of the install...


















































Oh yea, check that nice rusty-red Brake fluid!!!


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## TCM GLX (Jan 2, 2000)

What did this set you back?


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

Pads, 71$
Rotors, 56$

Shipping was 19 bucks


**UPDATE.

Well after a decent bed-in process, pads are looking great. nice layer of black brake dust on the wheels (got a non-ceramic)

I did notice that the rear brake rotors are scored up quite badly. and on the drive home today, in traffic, i started noticing a shimmy in the pedal, so, it looks like im back to square one. I will be putting my stock setup back on, and i will be calling the dealer tomorrow, and be demanding that 4 rotors and pads be replaced. and i want the brake fluid flushed also.


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## 71sbeetle (Apr 12, 2002)

you mean your new front rotors are warped ???


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

71sbeetle said:


> you mean your new front rotors are warped ???


maybe i was a little wordy on my update... 

but unless i killed rotors during the bed-in process, i believe the rear rotors were the culprit all along.


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## 71sbeetle (Apr 12, 2002)

oh ok so why did you put your stock brakes back on ? for warranty purposes ?


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

yep, i will go to the dealer to get all new rotors and all new pads, i also will demand that the brake fluid be flushed.

i will go home, and swap out to my Centric Rotors that i just purchased, and put the Hawk Pads on that i just purchased.

i might even get a set of Akebono pads for the rear, and swap out to some Super-Blue Dot4 Fluid, depends how motivated i get on Friday.

There is a woman on the Facebook Group that is trying to organize a Class Action Lawsuit against Chysler for the Brakes issue. I believe she had a failure that made her crash her Routan.


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## 71sbeetle (Apr 12, 2002)

redzone98 said:


> yep, i will go to the dealer to get all new rotors and all new pads, i also will demand that the brake fluid be flushed.
> 
> i will go home, and swap out to my Centric Rotors that i just purchased, and put the Hawk Pads on that i just purchased.
> 
> ...


I'm in !


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

Same here !


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## irishpride (Feb 2, 2006)

I have an 09 T/C not the Routan but we all know its the same...

anyway I had to replace both front and rear rotors and I got a letter from chrysler a few months later explaining; they extended the 12/12 wear and tear to 24/24 and no includes the brakes and rotors.

since i had already replaced mine they are going to reimburse me for the total cost minus labor..since i did it my self. I'm still waiting on the check but i will let you guys know what happens.


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

Got Back from the Dealer, complete Brake install, 4 new rotors, 8 new pads.

glad to say that my brake woes have ended... atleast for the next 1000 miles.

I do have to say, it seems that the rotors have been re-manufactured somehow... first off, they are coated in a powder coat grey color. 2nd it seems that the brake pads have went to a semi-metallic compound. Brake dust is a very dark black. Also the pads have a set of different part numbers on them completely different from the OEMs.

So can it be these are "new and improved" well, rite now, they are at least new...


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## irishpride (Feb 2, 2006)

sounds like the rotors i got from autozone... i can check if you want me to..


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

sure, post up a few pics, and ill do the same


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

so far so good with the brakes, i DO notice that the Hawk HPS bads do bite harder then these OEMs.


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## AaronX (Sep 1, 2010)

was going to try to do my brakes tonight but couldn't get the carrier off. Getting the caliper off and pads out was easy but damn that bracket which the caliper bolts onto would not come loose. Any tips?

I also need to get a jack with more height to it. The additional ground clearance of this vehicle means the jack I had wouldn't lift the car enough to get the tire off... fun fun.


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

AaronX said:


> was going to try to do my brakes tonight but couldn't get the carrier off. Getting the caliper off and pads out was easy but damn that bracket which the caliper bolts onto would not come loose. Any tips?
> 
> I also need to get a jack with more height to it. The additional ground clearance of this vehicle means the jack I had wouldn't lift the car enough to get the tire off... fun fun.


i used a generous blast of PB Blaster on everything! the i used my 24" breaker bar. they came off with muscle, but they came off regardless..

i use 2 2x6 squares to help out the ground clearance issues


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## Jettn1 (Jun 9, 2010)

irishpride said:


> I have an 09 T/C not the Routan but we all know its the same...
> 
> anyway I had to replace both front and rear rotors and I got a letter from chrysler a few months later explaining; they extended the 12/12 wear and tear to 24/24 and no includes the brakes and rotors.
> 
> since i had already replaced mine they are going to reimburse me for the total cost minus labor..since i did it my self. I'm still waiting on the check but i will let you guys know what happens.


Hello, I have a friend needing some help. She has a Routan 09 or 10 and she is having really bad brake and rotor issues. She said when she puts the brakes on it shakes very bad and lots of grinding. I told her sounds like warped rotors and pads are shot. She has 21k miles on the van. She took to VW dealership in Clarksville, TN (right outside of Ft. Campbell, KY) and they would not replace anything under warranty. I just read your post, and thought I would pass info to her. Is this a known warranty extension to VW??? I am clueless when it comes to the Routan and it's warranty. I am a VW car person. Sounds like to me she is getting the run around and just trying to help a friend out.

Thanks in advance!!


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## RoutanDaddy (Apr 25, 2009)

*Here's what i know*

I own a 2008 Chrysler Town & Country Touring and a 2009 Routan SE. These are the same vehicle for all intents and purposes, certainly the brakes. I am a wholesaler of auto and truck parts specializing in brakes, so i have some fair insight into the business. 

The 2008 model year trucks used metallic front brakes, but ceramic compound rears. There is definitely some kind of engineered trouble here, as my vehicle's front brakes were completely shot after 22000 miles. I replaced them with Aimco rotors and Wagner Thermo-Quiet pads and did the abutment clips as well, and they have been great for the next 22000 miles ( my wife commutes a lot on the suburban Boston loop highway). I did the rear brakes at 39000 miles, and they were down to the metal. So far, no troubles with performance or longevity. 

The 2009 Routan uses ceramic compounds both axles. I had some trouble with the rear brakes on one side, but it worked itself out and the brakes are fairly smooth now, not perfect, but not actionable. I have not had to shake a fist at my dealer yet. 

Certainly, you could use the 2008 front metallic pads in place of the ceramics, if you felt the need. 

Ceramics tend to cause issues with heat dissipation on heavier vehicles, which qualifies the Routan. Ceramics are not good heat sinks, rather they focus heat back into the rotor, which really is not engineered for all this thermal shock, consistent to the operation of these brakes. So eventually, a higher percentage of the vehicles will develop shudder, judder, or warpage. It is an engineering nightmare, clean wheels that the people want, or dirty wheels that come with carbon metallic compounds. Fashion has been dictating clean wheels, which is fine for light weight vehicles, but as the mass rises above 4000 lbs or so, the higher momentum ripples the equations away from fashion and towards function. Yet the OEMs haven't paid this sufficient attention. 

I received a letter from Chrysler in July about the three year warranty extension on the brakes for wear, and submitted that front brake claim replaced at under two years age and 22000 miles... I got back a check for $355 which was the retail value of the repair minus a $50 deductible. 

I have heard that VW would follow suit, but have not received any letter like my Chrysler document. I have heard that Chrysler has followed up with letters for the 2009 model year, but can't confirm this. Bringing a copy of the Chrysler letter into the VW dealer might elicit a service response. The info may be available on Chrysler's website, or from Chrysler customer service. 

If anyone wants replacement brake parts like I have installed, please PM me and I can work out details. I would be happy to assist anyone to deploy what I know now to be a great solution. 

Geoff


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

Nice Post ~!


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## Jettn1 (Jun 9, 2010)

RoutanDaddy said:


> I own a 2008 Chrysler Town & Country Touring and a 2009 Routan SE. These are the same vehicle for all intents and purposes, certainly the brakes. I am a wholesaler of auto and truck parts specializing in brakes, so i have some fair insight into the business.
> 
> The 2008 model year trucks used metallic front brakes, but ceramic compound rears. There is definitely some kind of engineered trouble here, as my vehicle's front brakes were completely shot after 22000 miles. I replaced them with Aimco rotors and Wagner Thermo-Quiet pads and did the abutment clips as well, and they have been great for the next 22000 miles ( my wife commutes a lot on the suburban Boston loop highway). I did the rear brakes at 39000 miles, and they were down to the metal. So far, no troubles with performance or longevity.
> 
> ...


 Thanks for the all the info, I will for sure pass this on to my friend!! 

Tammy


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## VWHACK (Jan 10, 2001)

redzone98 said:


> i have had it with the piss poor brakes on this thing, so i made a call to my friendly neighborhood parts store. (tirerack.com)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## irishpride (Feb 2, 2006)

on the rear just remove the to bolt securing the caliper to the hub and press in the piston install new pads and done.. this brake swap took less than 20mins per corner.

BTW:

I received an automated call from Chrysler saying my first refund check of 145.00 (front) should be received in 7-10 business days, and my second for 112.00(rear) is still in precessing. For whatever reason I was not charged the 50.00 deductible as stated above or that was expressed in my notification letter. FWIW mine is an 09 just confirming the info that was posed above by the other guy that yes the 09s are included.


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

nice, getting $back is always great !


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## RoutanDaddy (Apr 25, 2009)

*At 27,000 miles going strong with the solution to excess judder*



RoutanDaddy said:


> I own a 2008 Chrysler Town & Country Touring and a 2009 Routan SE. These are the same vehicle for all intents and purposes, certainly the brakes. I am a wholesaler of auto and truck parts specializing in brakes, so i have some fair insight into the business.
> 
> The 2008 model year trucks used metallic front brakes, but ceramic compound rears. There is definitely some kind of engineered trouble here, as my vehicle's front brakes were completely shot after 22000 miles. I replaced them with Aimco rotors and Wagner Thermo-Quiet pads and did the abutment clips as well, and they have been great for the next 22000 miles ( my wife commutes a lot on the suburban Boston loop highway). I did the rear brakes at 39000 miles, and they were down to the metal. So far, no troubles with performance or longevity.
> 
> ...


I wanted to follow up now that my wife's vehicle has 27,000 miles on the Wagner front brakes, and 8,000 miles on the rears. Brakes are great, without the judder troubles of the full ceramic systems the Routans come with. OE is Akebono, so replacing ceramics with more ceramics is pointless. Two issues: ceramic pad choice, and undersized brake rotor. Overall, the issue isn't quality, it's material's choice. Only factor we can control is pad choice. A metallic pad is the only reasonable choice to minimize aggravation from these brake systems. 

Good luck!


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