# Air Suspension Technical Discussion Thread...



## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

Come this spring, I am fitting some 23" monsters on my dear Touareg. Some may think this is silly but it is my cup of tea.
My background is the MkIV Jetta platform. My project 2002 is equipped with an aftermarket air suspension that I allows the car to sit on the tires for show purposes. 
I do understand that there aren't many Touareg owners willing to get their hands dirty to really sort out the Touareg's ride height. I happen to have much experience with automotive controls and electronics. 
Let's start with this as a springboard into thought...
High end Merc's are equipped with air suspension. Their owner's fool the suspension control unit by building very simple longer or shorter linkages.
On the MB CL600:
http://www.mbworld.org/forums/....html
I know for a fact that the Touareg's suspension controller uses redundant control to monitor the condition. Both potentiometer and air pressure are in the feedback loop.
Anyone with experience in changing the potentiometer position via a similar method? Will the controller throw a fault when pressure is outside of the look up table's range?
Anyone with a couple of good images of the Touareg's suspension (with wheel off). I'd take a couple shots except its quite cold outside in the Great North.


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

*Re: Air Suspension Technical Discussion Thread... (square head)*

Just came across this:








http://www.adjustableairride.com

Although they provide products for high end cars, the product seems a bit sketchy. I take from all of the vehicles listed that pressure is not a concern in the feedback loop. Only position...
I recall hearing that the R32's don't like extreme lowering (rear drivetrain wear). Anyone with experience on the Touareg?


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: Air Suspension Technical Discussion Thread... (square head)*

Cheaper and easier to use a VAGCOM to adjust the suspension


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

Sorry Spockcat, I've failed to mention I've already VAGCOM'd it as low as she will go. I still have an unacceptable amount of fender gap.


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

Is it possible to change the coding on the controller?
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2055204
This appears to be the baseline for which the adaptation follows....


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

*Re: (square head)*


















http://www.solo-technologies.com/
I assume that this module somehow blocks the suspension controller from seeing the vehicle's speed (probably via the CANBUS).


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (square head)*


_Quote, originally posted by *square head* »_Sorry Spockcat, I've failed to mention I've already VAGCOM'd it as low as she will go. I still have an unacceptable amount of fender gap.

Photos of Touareg? Maybe you should have bought a Passat if you want to go lower.
All of these parts you are posting do the same as a VAGCOM recoding will do. There is only so much travel in the suspension. At some point you end up on the stops.


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

*Re: (spockcat)*

















I am fearful that the Touareg will hit the bumps before I am happy with the ride height as you mentioned.
There must be a service mode where the air suspension is completely deflated for dealer service. Perhaps there is a mechanical purge somewhere in the system if not activated via the VAGCOM.


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (square head)*

22"s in the winter in Canada.







And they look so wrong on that Touareg too. Now I know you bought the wrong car.


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## tripwalking (Apr 28, 2004)

I think he said 23", and most of the snow has been gone lately. 
Steve, since you bought the wrong car, how about a trade for my passat, the car you should have bought?


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

*Re: (tripwalking)*

Thanks for the constructive feedback








DW, you're the best








Here's a interesting take...
This module plugs into tire inflation hose port. When vehicle is in loading position the module is turned "on" which I assume simulates that the tire inflation hose is present (via electrical resistance).
From a control design perspective inflating a flat tire is more important than inflating suspension. The controller locks out the suspension solenoids when inflation hose is present. A very simple, clean solution!
I'll try attaching the inflation hose in loading mode this afternoon and report back.
This doesn't help me get any lower however...


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (tripwalking)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tripwalking* »_I think he said 23", and most of the snow has been gone lately. 
Steve, since you bought the wrong car, how about a trade for my passat, the car you should have bought? 


LOL, anything to get out of a W8.


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

http://www.egermanparts.com/so....html


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (square head)*

How are the potholes in Ontario this time of year with those wheels?


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## Tahoe12 (Mar 22, 2005)

*Re: (square head)*

Buy a Jetta. Low profiles on an SUV in the snow are POINTLESS. Here is a pointer for you: Chicks don't care what your car looks like. 

_Quote, originally posted by *square head* »_Thanks for the constructive feedback








DW, you're the best








Here's a interesting take...
This module plugs into tire inflation hose port. When vehicle is in loading position the module is turned "on" which I assume simulates that the tire inflation hose is present (via electrical resistance).
From a control design perspective inflating a flat tire is more important than inflating suspension. The controller locks out the suspension solenoids when inflation hose is present. A very simple, clean solution!
I'll try attaching the inflation hose in loading mode this afternoon and report back.
This doesn't help me get any lower however...


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

Come on guys... To each their own.
Can we please bring this back to a technical discussion of the Touareg's pneumatic suspension.
The wheels were installed as a test fit only in the snow. I already have a Jetta as well


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## Yeti35 (May 17, 2006)

*Re: (square head)*

Seriously, if you are in load level height I don't think you are going any lower. You are probably already on the bump stops. I have to say I am with the others and it does not make sense to slam a Treg. I would think it has to ride like crap with the next to nothing tires and no travel in the suspension anymore.


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## V10 (Nov 15, 2004)

*Re: Air Suspension Technical Discussion Thread... (square head)*

If you don't want the air ride which is obvious you can just cut a hose at each corner and let all the air out.







Seriously, this is not a matter of preference it is a matter of wanting a look that you can't achieve on this vehicle with your current wheel and tire combo...perhaps remove the stops and let the suspension hit metal to metal is the solution.
Not many 23" tires out there but if you could find a taller sidewall you'd fill the gap with rubber and it would look better and it would also look like your riding on actual tires rather than rubber bands.


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## Dreamstate (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: (spockcat)*

spockcat.. good grief, he's asking a serious question, if you haven't the technical skill or the insight to help him out, troll elsewhere.
may I suggest http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2508592


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## 2VWatatime (Aug 4, 2006)

*Re: (Dreamstate)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Dreamstate* »_spockcat.. good grief, he's asking a serious question, if you haven't the technical skill or the insight to help him out, troll elsewhere.


Accusing spockat of trolling - now that's funny right there.
Anyway - no offense to the OP, but this isn't a technical discussion on the air suspension.
FWIW, for easier visual reference, the max travel on any L7 is on a line drawn fore & aft thru just about the center of the negative curl at the base of the doors (go above that & you're into the the bodywork).
Search the intarweb - there's footage of a TransS Cayenne at full extension & compression, which will give you some idea of the max range possible.
HTH, 
J


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

*Re: (2VWatatime)*

Any negative effects on drivetrain of changing the overall rolling diameter of all the wheels? I've considered running a 30 or even 35 series tire instead of the rubber band 25 series








2VWatatime...
I'm assuming you are saying any L7 will be on the bump stop once the hub is at the cusp between the plastic rocker and body colored door correct?
I'm unable to find the footage mentioned. Any chance you have the link saved?


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## 2VWatatime (Aug 4, 2006)

*Re: (square head)*


_Quote, originally posted by *square head* »_Any negative effects on drivetrain of changing the overall rolling diameter of all the wheels? I've considered running a 30 or even 35 series tire instead of the rubber band 25 series








2VWatatime...
I'm assuming you are saying any L7 will be on the bump stop once the hub is at the cusp between the plastic rocker and body colored door correct?
I'm unable to find the footage mentioned. Any chance you have the link saved?


To your first Q, none that I'm aware of - there are overall diameter differences between the L7 models (Q, C, & T) - outside of the usual caveats, and second, no, just slightly above the line you describe - a fully parted out rear hub (center) will not quite line up w/the curve in the doors' metalwork (I don't have the materials handy, but it's somewhere between 1/2 & 3/4 inch above the door base).
Never did save the vid. Sorry 'bout that. 
HTH,
J


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## VARSIXC (Jan 24, 2000)

*Re: (Yeti35)*

Assuming the bumpstops were cut or removed, what's next to hit?


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## mk2driver (Feb 12, 2002)

*Re: (VARSIXC)*

looks dope man, I love it... im gonna run 21's on my TREG... your from the MK3 forum correct? at least we know how to do it








edit: your the one that bought my smoothies from me http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by mk2driver at 11:07 PM 2-25-2009_


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

Still got those smoothies on my 4








Thanks for the props.
Anyone else with input?


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## 03VDUB (Sep 13, 2003)

*Re: (square head)*

no offense, but if you were so worried about the ride height with your massively huge wheels, you should have bought the steel suspension.


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (03VDUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *03VDUB* »_no offense, but if you were so worried about the ride height with your massively huge wheels, you should have bought the steel suspension. 

Yes, I do recall someone got a steel suspension Touareg pretty low using a set of modified coilovers. Doesn't seem to come up on the search.


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

At H20i in Maryland this past September, I was parked beside a Black V8 on 22" with coils.
He had a 2 finger gap in the front which is quite acceptable.


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

*Re: (square head)*

Vehicle in question:


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

Confirmed - If you install the tire inflation hose in loading mode, the vehicle will remain at this ride height even when moving.
Ride quality is terrible though


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

Using the good old VAGCOM adaptation lowering technique I was able to achieve the following:
3 cm top of tire to fender FRONT
4.9 cm top of tire to fender REAR
For Reference Adaptation Channels:
Factory 497 mm front
Factory 502 mm rear
My controller would accept the following:
507 mm front (only 1 cm lower)
532 mm rear (3 cm lower - the lowest I`ve heard anyone claim)


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## V10 (Nov 15, 2004)

Needless to say, if there is limited to no travel in the suspension you'll likely be stressing the suspension components such as the air springs themselves at levels they are only supposed to be used for limited "non-driving" purposes. But glad you've got close to your objective visually. Look into higher profile tires if they make such and you might find a good balance of form and function.


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## NickM (Oct 20, 2001)

*Re: (V10)*

Not that I'm personally interested in doing this, but curious to know what tire life would be like with the suspension set up this low...the Treg eats a steady diet of rubber, I suspect lowering this much would only accelerate the wear?


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## ArtieLange (Sep 14, 2008)

*Re: (NickM)*

This is mine afyer vag-com'ing... Load height is on the bump stops. At comfort/auto it raises up to a very smooth riding height.
Pics are froma meeting spot for a 400+ car drive yesterday in Seattle. 








Sorry about the Porsche being in the way.


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

How low were you able to adapt your V10 from stock ride height? In other words, what are your adaptation vaues?


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## ArtieLange (Sep 14, 2008)

*Re: (square head)*

527 for the front, 532 in the rear, I think. Spockat's instructions have you adding 25mm, I added 5 more for fun. I need to get my vag-com back from a friend that borrowed it. It's been a while and I need to check some things anyway.


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## optiks (Mar 15, 2003)

*Re: (ArtieLange)*

post your pics in the 20"+ wheel thread! that looks ****ing sick


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## square head (Dec 8, 2003)

*Re: (optiks)*

Spring is here in the Great Canadian North!
The Rinspeeds are on. With VAGCOM lowering I have a 2.5 finger gap in the front when in loading.
Next - New height potentiometer linkages... Thankfully the front can be accessed without removing the wheel (Just put the Touareg in Xtra mode). Photos for reference:
Front:








Rear:


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## mk2driver (Feb 12, 2002)

*Re: (square head)*

sounds like fun, lemme know what u do to get that thing super low, so i can replicate


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## windsor96vr6 (Aug 3, 2005)

search the air suspension forum for anyone bagged a touareg. good info on aftermarket air ride . only way to slam it.


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## ArtieLange (Sep 14, 2008)

*Re: (windsor96vr6)*


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## 0320thGTI (Feb 28, 2004)

*Re: (square head)*


_Quote, originally posted by *square head* »_
















I am fearful that the Touareg will hit the bumps before I am happy with the ride height as you mentioned.
There must be a service mode where the air suspension is completely deflated for dealer service. Perhaps there is a mechanical purge somewhere in the system if not activated via the VAGCOM.

RINSPEED ... DROOL!!!!







ME WANT!! Wait I'm confused are the Rinspeed's 23's or 22's??


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## ArtieLange (Sep 14, 2008)

*FV-QR*

I think he said 23's, and they are sick, imo.


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## wide_load (Dec 6, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (ArtieLange)*

23s... and they don't fit in the back of a mk3.


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