# Winter in the UK - tyres?



## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

First taste of real winter today... and my first in a Phaeton.
Snow a bit of a problem... but suspect that this is the Pirelli P Zero Rosso (19") that's the real source of the trouble.
They've done 20k miles so not that long to go and will probably be gone by next winter. Is there a good compromise tyre I can replace them with? Or is it worth getting another set of rims with some tyres much more suited to snow that I can put on for a couple of months in the Winter.....
Be grateful for any suggestions or experience.
Thansk
Mike


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

I fitted some Nokian WRG2 tyres last December for going skiing and had them properly tested during the snow ealier this year (drove from Dover to London without the ESP light flashing once). 
Because they're basically all-season rubber with a winter tread I've kept them on the car since then and have been very happy with them - they've done 12,000 miles and have worn about 2mm. They're also surprisingly quiet on the motorway. 
Harry


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (Prince Ludwig)*

Thanks Harry... having a quick look on the web, they have V rating... is this enough for Phaeton.... I need to check....
V=149mph... should be enough!


_Modified by n968412L at 10:56 AM 12-18-2009_


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Here's a snap from February this year


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## nh9095 (Mar 7, 2008)

*Re: (Prince Ludwig)*

great pic, and car


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## PeterMills (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (nh9095)*

Harry,
How do the Nokians rate for comfort? I am about to put new tyres on my wife's Golf Plus, and think I might try them, but the review I have seen suggests they do not perform so well on comfort/ride.
PETER M


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Peter,
The only tyres I have to compare them to on the Phaeton are Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetricals. The Nokians are probably about the same when it comes to comfort but the Goodyears do have quite a stiff sidewall. Road noise is also surprisingly low given their quite chunky tread.
That said, on the 1300 mile round trip to the Alps I was perfectly happy with the comfort and have been happy with their performance since - they've been good in snow, heavy rain and thick mud that defeated a Range Rover








The only complaint I have is that on very smooth motorways I've noticed a slight noise since I fitted them although it could be a wheel bearing - I'm getting it checked out after Christmas.
Harry


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: (PeterMills)*

Peter,
I recently installed a set of 17-inch Nokian Hakapalitta tires on my Phaeton. They are mounted on Borbet TS wheels, which look really great on the car. The tires have a speed rating of "R", so they are not suited for high speed driving. That's not really much of a concern in the USA, as the speed limits typically do not exceed 80 mph. The soft sidewall really improves the ride at the cost of some handling prowess.
As to the performance of the tires, they are incredible in the snow, slush and ice . They are also significantly quieter on the dry pavement than my Khumo summer tires.
Bill


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Bill, 
The main difference between the WRG2 and the Hakas is that the Hakas have a proper winter rubber compound which, although it will give you more grip on ice, will wear down much faster when temperatures are above 5 degrees.
Harry


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## PeterMills (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (Prince Ludwig)*

Bill & Harry,
Thanks both. Very useful info.
PETER M


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (PeterMills)*

Given the weather today... I think I need to get another set of rims and tyres ASAP..... probably....
Any good ideas about where to source some sensible rims from? Not bothered about appearance paraticularly...I'd be happy with black steel!


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: (n968412L)*

I purchased my set of wheels and tires second hand from another member on this forum who had recently turned his '06 V8 in at lease end.
The borbet TS wheels are appropriate to the weight of the car and are very good looking OEM style wheels. They look completely stock and are a pleasure to look at on the car. 
They can be had for about $170 US apiece. They do, however require different wheel bolts than my OEM "Performance" wheels.


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## PeterMills (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (n968412L)*

Mike,
Tony (Plastech) could be worth a try. He used to have several spare sets in fact he has more than one Phaeton too!
I bought my matching second set of wheels with winter tyres new in 2006 and that cost me £1,484.
I recently bought a matching second set of alloys for my wife's Golf Plus on Ebay for much less but it took several months of waiting for a set close enough to inspect before I bought, and I suspect Phaeton wheels would be too rare. 
When buying my Phaeton alloys I tried the black steel wheel route but that was not achievable at that time, certainly for any less money.
PETER M


_Modified by PeterMills at 5:47 PM 12-20-2009_


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (PeterMills)*

Thanks Peter - I'm sure Tony will shout if he has any spares....but I think I just missed out on his last sale in the Summer....
Regards
M


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## plastech (May 3, 2006)

*Re: (n968412L)*

I have a set of Ts wheels
5 18" BORBET TS Hyper Silver fitted with Dunlop SP sport 9000 
One of the rims has never been fitted 
Borbet is the company that manufactor wheels for VW





_Modified by plastech at 5:56 AM 12-21-2009_


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## plastech (May 3, 2006)

*Re: (plastech)*

I think these are the best looking 17"
Imagine 
Fitted with TPMs
7,5x17 ET45 LK5x112
Part Number 3D0 601 025 AA 



































_Modified by plastech at 9:24 PM 12-20-2009_


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## plastech (May 3, 2006)

*Re: (plastech)*

And I have a set of 5 inspiration


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## plastech (May 3, 2006)

*Re: (plastech)*

And four new Pirelli Sotto zero winter 210 99H M&S


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## PeterMills (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (plastech)*

Tony,
Do you think you should see the doctor about your habit of collecting wheels.............?
PETER M


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## miket1 (Dec 21, 2009)

Hi everyone this is my first post but I had the same issues as the first poster; Pirellis with 20kmiles, going into first winter with the car and even my name is Mike. I am based in Edinburgh and travel up to Inverness a lot so I need to get a reasonable winter tyre. This is a question for Harry, did you put the Nokian WRG2 tyres onto existing 19in rims or did you get a smaller rims?
My thought is to get the Nokians, which you can get in the 19in, and put them on my existing 19in rims. If I think I need summer tyres then I will get them later in the year and then consider getting an extra set of wheels as well to reduce the risk of damaging the rims each winter.
Great forum
Mike


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Hi Mike,
I've got 18" wheels so got 235/50/R18 tyres. If you like to drive "vigorously" then I'd change back to summer rubber when it warms up but otherwise you can probably keep the WzRG2s on all year.
Harry


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## miket1 (Dec 21, 2009)

Thanks for getting back Harry,
My local VW dealer has just phoned to say that they cannot source the Nokians. The suggested the Pirelli winter tyre instead. I'll search the main winter tyre thread to see if anyone has any experience of the Pirellis. Its just that the Nokian's ,potential, all year round capability has its attractions.
I could order them on the internet and get them fitted by a local tyre fitter.
I'll let the forum know how I get on.
Mike


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (miket1)*

Tony - any of these surplus to requirements and up for sale?
All - if Tony wants to hang to them all, and who can blame him... any ideas for a good retailer of suitable rims?
Thanks
Mike


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## plastech (May 3, 2006)

*Re: (n968412L)*

Hi Mike,
What set are you looking at?
I was in Middleton on sunday and could have done with a set of snow tyers










_Modified by plastech at 6:08 AM 12-22-2009_


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## culverwood (May 20, 2005)

I don't know that UK Phaetons really need snow tyres if you are only doing short runs in the snow. My Phaeton was passing stranded cars with ease last night and our 1/2 mile untreated drive was no problem.


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## 357Sig (Oct 9, 2008)

*Re: (culverwood)*

William,
I agree. The Phaeton has no trouble going in the snow with any sort of treads. I drove my previous Phaeton through the winter with Pirelli P Zero tires last winter and like you said, it handled the snow and ice with ease.
The significant advantage of the snow tires is gained in stopping and cornering. The Phaeton (V8s in my case) are very front heavy and that fact becomes frighteningly apparent when sliding out of control on the ice. The Pirellis essentially became skis at times, especially when cornering. 
With proper snow tires, the already excellent winter traction of the Phaeton in increased by an entire order of magnitude.
Bill


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## adamkodish (Mar 5, 2006)

*Re: (357Sig)*

I was driving the other day on sheet ice in some side roads where there were parked cars, trees and lamp posts. Ive got about 6mm on my Kumho KU31s ... had good traction as long as I was careful with the throttle, but it didn't take much throttle or braking to trigger ESP and ABS. 
On one hand I'd like to see what the car could do, but on the other hand the trees and lamp posts were just too scary








Adam


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## culverwood (May 20, 2005)

The original post was winter in the UK - tyres? My point of view is that as the UK is marginal in terms of the amount of snow we get that as long as you are only driving short distances which can be done at low speed they are unnecessary here. If you are travelling longer distances with time constraints then they are worthwhile.


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (culverwood)*

I thought I'd agree with that... but I find the cornering and stopping a bit unnerving on the current Pirellis and living in the Pennines their inability to go up hills is a bit of problem... as is their inability to stop when coming down.
From my experience of other 4x4s, the tyres make a huge difference. I don't intend to do much in the snow (when we get any) - but I don't like being beaten by my 2wd 17 year old golf!!


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (plastech)*

Agree with you re the Imagine wheels - I think they're my favourite too.
Regards
Mike


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## Aren Jay (Jun 9, 2009)

I guess it depends where in the UK. 
Performance snow tires would work best or the Nokian 4 season winter tyres are good. 
Michelin Pilot Alpin PA3, would be my suggestion. 

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/...aeton V8&autoModClar=


_Modified by Aren Jay at 11:37 AM 12-24-2009_


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (plastech)*

And this is what they look like on!


Indebted to Tony!
Regards
Mike


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

*Re: (n968412L)*

Nice! I miss the beer in the north of England, but not the bloody weather!


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (invisiblewave)*

Best weather we've had in 30 years apparently. All those who've always run two sets of wheels were right!!
Beer still very good!
Regards
M


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

*Re: (n968412L)*

I had to go to the airport in Dallas on xmas eve in the middle of a freak snow & ice storm. There's a short hill just at the entrance to the ramp for Terminal A, on which there were several SUVs (4WDs to you, probably, although I think these were more like 2WDs), trucks (Americans inexplicably think it's cool to drive Ford F150s), buses and one articulated lorry, all stuck fast. Two of the SUVs were stationary with wheels spinning. The Phaeton didn't even blink, I drove onto the shoulder and around them and on up the hill onto the ramp. It didn't slip once, in fact I couldn't even tell the road was slippery unless I looked out of the window. My car's fitted with 18" sport tyres! Deep snow might be another matter of course.


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## plastech (May 3, 2006)

*Re: (invisiblewave)*

Hi Mike,
Looks the part now , what is the medical center in the back ground for?
Ask Peter Mills what happened when he put his new wheels on .
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4341754
Rgds Tony


_Modified by plastech at 6:01 PM 1-5-2010_


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (invisiblewave)*

What we've had today in the North of Blighty is quite deep.... generally about a foot... and with my new boots, the P strode through it with ease. No revs, no spin, no nothing save sedate progress. I know on the Pirreli PZeros I've taken off I'd have struggled a lot more.
don't know if 1 foot is deep snow... but it's probably as deep as any of us expect to see this side of the end of global warming!
Regards
M


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (plastech)*

Tony - again thanks for your help. Wish I'd known about this thread before today. 
I'll add my experiences to it in due course!!
Regards
Mike


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (plastech)*


_Quote, originally posted by *plastech* »_what is the medical center in the back ground for?
Ask Peter Mills what happened when he put his new wheels on .


What I needed after changing 4 wheels and putting the fifth in the boot.
Regards
M


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## plastech (May 3, 2006)

*Re: (n968412L)*

LOL


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (n968412L)*

All - now I've got five 17" rims... I can put a spare in the boot... save it's full of foam that holds the stuff that came with the 4 19" rims from the factory... is there some place in this forum where it's laid out what I need to get to accommodate the jack/wheelbrace etc etc
Thanks
Mike


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Mike,
I wonder if you're feeling the same smugness I did when driving through the snow this February! It's usually followed by a perverse desire for more snow and ice just so you can continue driving past Range Rovers which are sliding all over the place








Harry


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (Prince Ludwig)*

Perverse desire has been in place since 1330 today!! But it looks like it's moving south... so you might get some more!
Regards
M


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## leedsphaeton (May 27, 2008)

The car drives like a dream in the snow. I have been driving through about 7 inches of snow for the last two days on all season rubber. Not one slip or hairy moment in the car, iv even passed a few stranded 4x4's


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (leedsphaeton)*

As I said in a PM to Tony Plastech - it takes me back to my days driving landrovers on S+M tyres.... not yet found an urban snow scene it can't handle with ease.... but not really had time yet. Still, bet it's not like this again for another 20 years!
Regards
M


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## leedsphaeton (May 27, 2008)

*Re: (n968412L)*

Sadly, i'v never had the experience of a landrover in the snow. Just old bmw's, which is tricky to say the least.


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

_Quote »_ Still, bet it's not like this again for another 20 years!

Isn't that what they said at the beginning of 2009?


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## PeterMills (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (Prince Ludwig)*

This is just to confirm that I was unable to source Nokian WRG2 tyres for my wife's Golf Plus via my VW dealer or other local tyre business, or any similar winter tyre, so I ordered the Nokians through mytyres.co.uk (actually a German company with literally hundreds of them) who proved excellent supplying the tyres from Germany over Xmas in 3 working days at £73 each all in. My friendly VW dealer (Wolsey Ipswich) fitted them and all is well!
Thanks for the lead, Harry.
PETER M


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

How have you found them so far Peter?
Harry


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## PeterMills (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (Prince Ludwig)*

Harry,
Should have said they seem great, thanks, but we have not had them long enough to give full view.
PETER M 


_Modified by PeterMills at 2:14 PM 1-8-2010_


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

*Re: (Prince Ludwig)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Prince Ludwig* »_drove from Dover to London without the ESP light flashing once


I did a deal with Tony Plastech for his Pirelli Sotto Zeros... and what a marked difference from the P Zeros.... in the little bit of a white dusting we had on 18/12 I barely made it out of the village - up a 1:4 with the ESP flashing continuously... 
With the Sotto Zeros either the ESP warning bulb has gone... or they really are much much better. Subjectively good on the tarmac too.. but will have to wait for the ice shelf to retreat before being sure about that. Last time I drove up the 1:4 out of the village a couple of days ago, I didn't notice it!
Regards
Mike


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (n968412L)*

*Archival Note:* Related post - Snow Tires – Requirements, Specifications, Detailed Explanation (content addresses tires that are available for purchase in North America, but still, it might be useful information).


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## Lecithin (Oct 21, 2010)

*Winter tyre kit UK?*

Hello everyone, this is my first post on this forum, do excuse me if this is a little long-winded.
Quite a few people have commented on a European VW Winter Tyre Package. My local VW dealers denied all knowledge-they're usually quite helpful, so I wonder if this is a continental European thing. The closest I could find something akin to this was Kwik Fit, offering new tyres and a tyre storage option (called Tyre Hotel) at their facility in Northamptonshire but no wheels. I haven't experienced a winter in the Phaeton yet, but my previous RWD Lexus gave me several grey hair over the past two winters on 18" P-Zeros, and this time I have decided to take the plunge and go in for a new set of wheels and tyres for winter. My 19" Omanyt are mounted on P-Zero Rossos and unsurprisingly I can't find any 19" winter tyres. Besides, the rims are polished at the edges and I would be quite cut up if they get scuffed during tyre swaps. I note on other posts that only some rims are 'snow tyre capable'. Can anyone recommend a wheel and tyre package they've used, and any dealer who agrees to store the rims and tyres (safely and carefully) over winter? My garage is full of 'stuff' sadly  Re Harry's post, did you just directly go for the Nokians in the first instance as an all-weather option? 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Welcome to the forum! I did indeed go for the Nokians on the basis of being able to use them all year round and after two years and 25k+ miles I'll be replacing them soon (I've been perfectly happy with them!).

As for wheel swaps, you can get WR G2 tyres for the Omanyt wheels (here) but looking at the price you might be better off getting a set of smaller wheels on eBay... 

From memory the two sets of wheels that are officially approved for snow tyres are the 18" Champion and 17" Inspiration wheels as their default tyres are the narrowest (235mm). I have a set of Champions going spare but they're in need of some refurbishment. 

Harry


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

I've been turned, by someone who shall remain nameless, into a wheel fetishist..... and I regularly see decent sets of Inspirations on ebay. Cheapest I've ever seen was £200 for set of 4, and £400-600 feels about the right price. Worth checking ebay.de too - although the shipping costs might be a bit offputting.

Harry's experience of running Nokians all year might be easier - 25k miles doesn't sound too bad!

Regards

M


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Although 25k isn't a huge amount by some standards, it's better than the Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetrics I had before which only gave about 15k before giving up the ghost. Having all wheel drive and a 2.5 tonne kerb weight means the Phaeton does tend to eat through tyres... 

As for wheels, I feel I'm also channelling the spirit of "He who shall not be named" and now have a set of 18" Aristoteles wheels, 18" Champion wheels, 17" Inspiration wheels and 7" Atlanta wheels...

Harry


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## Realist42 (May 14, 2006)

n968412L said:


> First taste of real winter today... and my first in a Phaeton.
> Snow a bit of a problem... but suspect that this is the Pirelli P Zero Rosso (19") that's the real source of the trouble.
> They've done 20k miles so not that long to go and will probably be gone by next winter. Is there a good compromise tyre I can replace them with? Or is it worth getting another set of rims with some tyres much more suited to snow that I can put on for a couple of months in the Winter.....
> Be grateful for any suggestions or experience.
> ...



Hi,

Better late than never...

I have a set of Pirelli Zottozero on a set of inspiration, superb winter tyre, kept me out of trouble in the winter, but as others have noted, above 10 or so degrees C it wears quicker. Has a slightly softer sidewall, so is rides a little better. As with most winter tyres (and I this is a good thing) there is a little movement in the rubber blocks (so that it can bite in to the snow), but the net effect is that the steering is a little more vague.

Regards,

Johan


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Prince Ludwig said:


> As for wheels, I feel I'm also channelling the spirit of "He who shall not be named" and now have a set of 18" Aristoteles wheels, 18" Champion wheels, 17" Inspiration wheels and 7" Atlanta wheels....


Not familiar with the Atlanta ones... and they sound very interesting at 7".... presumably lots of compliance in the enormous side walls......

Regards

M


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

They're from my W8 and I think they're 7.5" - I replaced them with a set of Inspiration wheels just because I prefer the look 

Harry


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Now you're confusing me! I thought 7" was a simple typo.... but is this some other dimension than diameter...I guess it must be. I further assume that these are 16" wheels from a Passat??

I have to say that I think Inspiration is still the pick of the bunch for me!

Regards

M


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

The 7.5" is the width of the alloy wheel between the points where the bead of the tyre meets the wheel. For the Phaeton, the recommended tyre size for the Inspiration wheels is 235/55/17 while on my Passat it's 225/45/17:










Harry


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Looks like you need a new wheel centre for nearside rear.... I've got some second hand ones.... although they're not dear new. Interested in a less than perfect 6 year old one?


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Thanks, but I've already bought a new cap from the dealer. £13 is pretty pricey for a piece of plastic but I suppose it's better than the £65 I had to pay for a rear air vent! 

Harry


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## Lecithin (Oct 21, 2010)

The 2010 Auto Bild and Auto Zeitung tyre tests seem to be favouring the Continental WinterContact TS and the Dunlop SP Winter Sports, although quite a lot of reader reviews point towards the WRG2s as a firm favourite. Anyone have any experience with these? Being a noob, I can afford to look foolish and ask; where do you store these spare sets of wheels? Just park them on a shelf in the garage over 5 months of winter? Tyres still fitted to them? What about those who, like Ettore Bugatti suggested, should have a heated garage, and don't? How much of a refurb do the Champions need, Harry?


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## Lecithin (Oct 21, 2010)

n968412L said:


> I've been turned, by someone who shall remain nameless, into a wheel fetishist..... and I regularly see decent sets of Inspirations on ebay. Cheapest I've ever seen was £200 for set of 4, and £400-600 feels about the right price. Worth checking ebay.de too - although the shipping costs might be a bit offputting.
> 
> Harry's experience of running Nokians all year might be easier - 25k miles doesn't sound too bad!
> 
> ...


I was going by the premise that a set of summers and a set of winters ought to last as long as 2 sets of all-weathers; with some added safety. Flipside being the swaps every spring and autumn. And another set of wheels. I shall look at eBay as well-the dealer had to offer me a seat prior to telling me the cost of a new set of wheels and tyres


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Yeh - the alloys are a bit dear from a dealer....! 

I think that stacking tyres inflated on their rims is fine more or less however it's done... but I think it's important to keep them out of sunlight. The cooler the darker the better - and I too hope that a set of summer and winter will last at least as long as two changes of a single set. We shall see....


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## Aren Jay (Jun 9, 2009)

Remember tires last 6 years and no more. 

Stacking them any way you want is fine. 

It would only really matter if you were to be driving at very high speeds and or racing on a track. Otherwise they are fine stacked anyway. Dark I agree is better than sunlight. 

I still chuckle when I think of snow and England. When I lived there it snowed in London once for two-three days. The entire country came to a halt. It was great as the M25 suddenly was car less. I could drive anywhere I wanted and had to drive as the trains were stopped (the wrong kind of snow apparently, that is what British Rail said). 

You have a Phaeton and AWD and a piddly amount of snow. It really doesn't matter what kind of tires you have unless you live somewhere where it gets COLD and stays COLD for a long time. Yes winter tires are much much better than All Season and Summer tires can be useless in Cold and snow, but unless the snow stays around for more than a fort night or you need to be driving everyday in it, newer all season tires will be just fine. 4 season Nokian Tyres or Performance winters are the way to go if you get intermittent snow. Full Winters if it snows all the time or get very COLD. Studded Winters if it gets icy and stays icy. 

The key thing is to slow down. Everywhere when it is snowy cold and or Icy. Going fast is just bad!


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

> 4 season Nokian Tyres or Performance winters are the way to go if you get intermittent snow.


 That's why I went for the Nokian WRG2s - you can use them all year round (they've been on my Phaeton for two and a bit years) and are absolutely fine for everyday driving. They don't get the best scores for snow performance on tyre group tests but are good in the wet and slush which I think is an acceptable trade off (given the proportions in which you'll encounter snow and rain in the UK...) 

Harry


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## Zaphh (Jul 5, 2008)

I also have a set of WRG2 and found them perfect during my last trip to the alps last year. We drove without a hint of a problem on an icy road where quite many people were stranded. 

I will put them on next week, and I am now using them as all year round tyres on my second car. 

The problem I have with them as summer tyres on the Phaeton is their speed limit of 230km/h (142mph), which, as all speed limits on tyres, is not a speed you can drive at in a permanent way (it will stand 230km/h for a handful of minutes, that's what the marking on the side of the tyre really says). 

Since I drive in Germany once in a while, and enjoy speeds up to 155mph (250km/h), I keep these tyres for winter only on my Phaeton. This is not a problem with my other car, which is why I keep them on all year long. 

As far as driving handling is concerned, I find them more comfortable than the Dunlop SP 9000 I use as summer tyres. The ride is smoother and they are more quiet. Then, I find them as precise as the Dunlop steering-wise, so I'll be happy to drive with them again by the end of the week (I'm switching to winter tyres in November, and switching back to summer tyres in April), although I'll now have to keep an eye on the speedo, which is not really easy (or advisable) at those speeds (I'd rather watch the road). 

So as a conclusion, I find them really perfect, but for the max speed limit... 

P.


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Anybody know if you can put 17" inspirations (as featured heavily in the photos in this thread) on a V10? Never offered as a factory fitted option.. so maybe they are not man enough? However, having cleaned the damn things back and front there is a lot of metal in them..... 

Thanks 

Mike


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## EnglishPhaeton (Dec 6, 2010)

n968412L said:


> Anybody know if you can put 17" inspirations (as featured heavily in the photos in this thread) on a V10? Never offered as a factory fitted option.. so maybe they are not man enough? However, having cleaned the damn things back and front there is a lot of metal in them.....
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Mike


 Mike, 

there should be a weight limit stamped on the inside of each rim. Though knowing VW they put a sticker on instead! 

Stu


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

EnglishPhaeton said:


> Mike,
> 
> there should be a weight limit stamped on the inside of each rim. Though knowing VW they put a sticker on instead!
> 
> Stu


 I'll go and have a look!


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Nothing obvious.... 

Checked a couple of my ten Inspirations... they are both the same so I imagine the other eight are too... 

 

 

Any of this look like a code for a load rating to you? Or am I looking in the wrong place? 

Regards 
M


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

n968412L said:


> Or am I looking in the wrong place?


 Dozy Lancastrian! What about the other side...... 

 

But none of these are obvious either...: 
3D0 601 025 AC - sounds like a part number 
JUL VW (I think)... month of manufacture? 
AlSi7Mg - what it's made of? 
7.5J x 17H2 ET 40 - maybe this is it? I know what it means as far as the 17... 
Austria AA3 K1 - ?? 

Didn't think this would be a very hard question..... 

Regards 

M


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## EnglishPhaeton (Dec 6, 2010)

Mike,

one set (ormanyt) have max weight stamped, my other set of (VW) rims have a sticker with a barcode and the max weight. Sorry it doesn't appear to have helped.

Out of interest what are the specs for the Pirelli winter tyres? The ones I looked at were not suitably rated for weight for the V10, am currently researching some Vredesteins.
Stu


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

I'm running 99H - whereas the speed rating ideally shoudl be Y. But as you know, I hardly every knock on... so 130mph for winter tyres seems OK. 

I might post this question again in a new post with a more meaningful title and see what response I get.

Cheers

M


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## stefanuk (Jul 7, 2010)

Mike,

Not sure if you're aware or not that if you use tyres without the correct speed rating and are involved in an accident the chances are that your insurance will not pay out as they will look at all and every way to avoid payment, and depending if the police become involved then you could well be prosecuted too.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news

Stefan


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Painfully aware!


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Just phone your insurer and ask about it. It's not uncommon for winter tyres to have lower speed ratings which is why quite a few German cars have an option to remind the driver when they get to a certain speed.

Harry


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## jkuisma (Nov 23, 2009)

> Anybody know if you can put 17" inspirations (as featured heavily in the photos in this thread) on a V10?


The answer is NO.



> Never offered as a factory fitted option.. so maybe they are not man enough?


It might have to do with load rating as well, but there is an even more obvious reason: European-spec W12 and V10TDI cars have the "large" brakes. They are so large in diameter that the smallers rim you can fit on a V10TDI is 18". V6TDI and V8 gasoline can be fitted with 17" and the (pretty rare) front-wheel drive V6 gasoline even takes 16". 

In the US, if I remember right, even the W12 comes with "small" brakes, therefore 17" rims fit. There's been a discussion on that topic earlier, I recall.

As far as I know, there is no official load rating indication on VW rims and the service manuals don't mention anything about it, either. The only "fitment guideline" seems to be the rim size. I guess we all understand that this is not the whole truth - there definitely are load bearing constraints in case of a V10 or W12.

Jouko


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Dear Jouko - that's a farily compelling reason - thanks for that. Very helpful.

Harry - thanks for the advice. I took the view a while ago that given all the nonsense being discussed in the press etc about winter tyres being effectively ruled as an inadmissable change by some insurers, I'd wait until the summer before raising it with my insurer.... and then forgot!! I'll do it this summer ready for next winter. I promise....

M


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

If you want to find out whether a change will affect your insurance policy you can always phone them up and ask whilst making sure never to identify yourself as a customer (lest they make a note about your inquiry in your file )

Harry


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## Zaphh (Jul 5, 2008)

The fact that you can't put 17" rims on a V10 poses a problem since snow chains are only possible with 17" rims (probably due to the thinner 235 tyres).

And at least in France, even if you have a 4WD car equipped with snow tyres, there are some roads on which you are not allowed unless you have snow chains on (and the police is there to make you go back, and they are not very understanding...).

This is why I specifically have 17" rims for my snow wheels, and why I also carry snow chains when I go to ski resorts even though with snow tyres, I really don't think our Phaetons would need them...

Right now, for instance the news often shows footages where the police prevents people from using some mountain roads leading to ski resorts if they don't have "proper equipment" (read snow chains).

I would be quite p*** off if, with a V10 or a W12 that cannot take chains because of the 17" limitation, the police prevented me to go skiiing...

P.


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

> snow chains are only possible with 17" rims (probably due to the thinner 235 tyres).


The 18" Champion wheels are 235mm wide as well. I completely agree with you about the need for chains - the only thing I've encountered that will stop a snow tyre-equipped Phaeton is being beached on thick snow and chains won't help there!

Harry


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

Time to rotate the winter tyres today. Broke my 18" socket bar. Well, to be accurate, I broke the large plastic hand grip on it. Had it for 30 years. Brittool. Thought they were the best back then. Got it when I used to do Land Rover trials. Broke a 3/4" guaranteed for life socket with it when trying to crack a Land Rover wheel nut. You wouldn't think that I'd see it off by hand just on the Phaeton...

Then the hose on the foot pump broke.... 

Who said it was a good idea to have winter tyres... or to rotate them for equal wear....

Still, on the bright side, at least it didn't fall off the jack like it did two years ago when I first put them on


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Don't look at me, I only got winter tyres because I go skiing 

To be honest, in the UK if you have AWD you're not going to get stuck on the three days a year we get snow...

Harry


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## n968412L (Apr 23, 2009)

It's usually a little more than three days here in the pennines.. and it's not just snow. Ice too - and they make a big difference getting out the village and up the hills. And then there's the stopping and steering... much safer!

So... I did it for me... but I'm b**gerd now. 

M


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

Sorry, I keep forgetting that there's lots of treacherous terrain outside the M25


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## EnglishPhaeton (Dec 6, 2010)

Prince Ludwig said:


> Sorry, I keep forgetting that there's lots of treacherous terrain outside the M25


And we can travel faster than a funeral cortege :laugh::laugh: Personally I think winter tyres kind of spoil the fun, F1 would be far more interesting if drivers had to keep slicks even in the wet :laugh::laugh:

Stu


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Archival Note:* Related discussion, with considerable additional technical information - Snow tires and wheels - Consolidated Discussions

Michael


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## Gabs08PHTN (Jan 6, 2011)

*Set of four winter tires and wheels for sale.*

Hi all,
More details here.

Gabriel


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