# need help with Megasquirt



## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

Ok, well after spending all day friday, saturday, and most of sunday installing ITB's and MS into my Jetta, i try to start it, and... nothing. so i double check everything and try again. i can smell fuel, and see fuel in the intake so i know im getting fuel, but im not getting spark. i have everything wired correctly, but there is no spark. 
well and to top it all off, i remembered that i needed to change the resistance values for the cts, and iat. well after doing that now the firmware will not reinstall















so now im stuck and cant figure out what is wrong with it. any help would be great, thanks


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## xr4tic (Dec 10, 2001)

Was it originally programmed with MSExtra? you might have to jumper the boot pins on the MS unit to get it to program.
Are you getting an RPM signal in MegaTune?
What MS board Version? Direct Coil or Ignition Module? Distributor?


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (xr4tic)*

yes it was originally programmed for MSextra.
im getting a rpm signal in megatune when im cranking, its a v2.2 that has been modified to fire the coil directly with out an icm
here's the wiring diagram im using:








here's some pics of the board to show thw mods


































_Modified by [email protected] at 5:39 PM 9-2-2008_


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

ok, so i redownloaded the firmware off the internet onto my laptop, and now it actually tries to install the firmware instead of just telling me it cant be done. but now it says to use a boot jumper, i dont know what that is or where it goes if anyone can help me out that would be awesome.
And i got word from the guy who built the ecu, and he said that it actually isnt setup to run without a icm. well now i just need to figure out what wiring diagram i need to use














. i really need to get this thing going so i have a few days to tune it before i go racing on sunday.


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## xr4tic (Dec 10, 2001)

The MSExtra firmware should ask if you need to put the boot jumper in, just say no.
V2.2 doesn't have the ability to fire a coil directly, you have to add a coil driver (VB921 or similar), and mount it to the case or an add-on board.
There's a lot of info on the MSExtra Manual site:
http://www.msextra.com/manuals...x.htm
What mods did you follow for the Hall input?
This is the preferred method for a V2.2 board with a 5V hall:










_Modified by xr4tic at 11:30 PM 9-2-2008_


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (xr4tic)*

i didnt build the ecu, SpitfireEFI did. i got the firmware installed. i said no when it said to install the boot jumper it didnt work. so i said yes, installed the boot jumper and it worked. so now i just need to figure out what wiring diagram i need to follow.
can someone figure it out by the pics of the board?


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## xr4tic (Dec 10, 2001)

judging by the pics, I'd say you have the right mod for the hall input.
You need to run an ignition module though, you aren't wired for direct coil control. If it doesn't work with the ignition module, then it's possible you fried something by trying to hook it up to the coil directly.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: (xr4tic)*

You definitely need an ign module. You can usually tell if you fry the LED circuit, as it will stop lighting/blinking.


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*

ok so i just got an e-mail from SpitfireEFI and they told me how i should wire it. so im going to wire in the icm and see if it works.


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_ok so i just got an e-mail from SpitfireEFI and they told me how i should wire it. so im going to wire in the icm and see if it works.

you can shoot me an IM on here and i can usually get back to you a bit quicker than via the SpitFire email. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Brendon had me set this thing up for a special setup he was doing for someone, and i missed in my notes whether the ICM was needed or not. like i mentioned in the email though, definitely use the ICM...the pinout i gave you via email should get you going, and everything else should work using that vintage watercooleds diagram. if it still doesnt work, send it on up here and well make it right








everything always works when we ship it, but i dont know where this thing has been since we sent it out


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

It Runs!!!!!







it runs like crap but it runs. now i just need to tune it.


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

glad you got it worked out.


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

ya, it runs, i got it to idle, and set the trigger angle and all that stuff. but i think that its still 2 lean. it just pops and crackles when i rev it. 
ive got aba injectors in there right now, but i have a set of 1.8t injectors too that i could throw in there. does anyone know what the values are for 1.8t injectors?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: ([email protected])*

You know you can just hit a button or change a value to give it more fuel.. right?


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: (need_a_VR6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *need_a_VR6* »_You know you can just hit a button or change a value to give it more fuel.. right?


















scope out the megamanual for tuning tips and how to get started


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

Ok ive been trying to tune this thing and just cant get it to rev past 4500 when free reving it. its like it hits a wall at 4500. ive tried everything, leaning it out, fatting it up it doesnt change anything. 
is there anyone in the Tacoma area that knows this system little better then me that could come help me try and figure this thing out?


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Ok ive been trying to tune this thing and just cant get it to rev past 4500 when free reving it. its like it hits a wall at 4500. ive tried everything, leaning it out, fatting it up it doesnt change anything. 
is there anyone in the Tacoma area that knows this system little better then me that could come help me try and figure this thing out?

you can bring it up here for a day or so


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

i'm close








just because i have doen this before...check the rev limits










_Modified by VWralley at 2:10 PM 9-5-2008_


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: (VWralley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWralley* »_i'm close








just because i have doen this before...check the rev limits










ah, yeah...tacoma is closer to seattle than it is to me


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

an im actually about 20min south of seattle


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (VWralley)*

I have my rev limiter set to 8000. so im pretty sure thats not the problem, but that is what i thought too when it was only reving to 4500. 
VWralley, would you be willing to come down to tacoma sometime next week and lend a hand tuning my car?


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## xr4tic (Dec 10, 2001)

Is it just when you try to rev it fast past 4500? Can you slowly increase the RPMs past 4500?
Do you have a wideband? what happens to the A/F ratio as you rev it?


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (xr4tic)*

it doesnt make a difference if i slow rev it, or fast to 4500 it just staops there. i dont have a wideband, but i do have an o2 sensor and it was reading lean when it did that, so i tried giving it more fuel, and now it says its stoich but it still wont rev past 4500


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

unfortunatly i cannot this week, i'm heading down to portland for a track day an a weekend of road racing. it's super tough to get to tacoma at a reasonable time for me during the week, but i will have some time 27th/28th if you want to try an set something up


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (VWralley)*

OK, ill let you know. im going to try a few things. im going to remove the ITBs and put on a standard intake, and then reset my trigger angle and distributor position. because the distributor int he position its in now would be like 30-40deg retarded, and even though the trigger angle is set and all checked out, i think its still too retarded.


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

as long as its sync'd up to the MS an the timing light shows the same as the MS is putting out, its fine


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## [email protected] (Sep 8, 2008)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Could you take a data log of it revving up like that and upload it?
Will it rev past there in neutral, or is this a problem that occurs both in and out of gear?


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

its worse when under load


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

here is the deal. without a wideband you will get no where. i can try an set-up a time to get down to help you but it will take a long time. the only way i will have the time to help you out sooner is if you can get the car driveable to get up by me. id highly recomend you pick up a wideband to run in the car, its more than likely in need of tuning an a narrow band simply wont cut it.


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (VWralley)*

Ok, i reset the Trigger angle just to make sure it was all correct and it checks out fine. it still wont rev past 4500rpm. i put back on a standard intake, and played with the fueling a little and now i can get it to rev to 4500 when driving. but no amount of adding fuel or subracting fuel will get it to rev past 4500. 
What could possible be causing this? i thought maybe the icm had a bad ground and thats why it wasnt reving up, but i grounded it strait to the battery and it still does it. so i tried anouther icm, same thing. to me it almost sounds like its misfiring. 
if anyone can think of anything i should try let me know. Thanks


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## [email protected] (Sep 8, 2008)

*Re: ([email protected])*

While a data log is better with a wideband, there's probably a few things you can learn from one without the wideband. You can access the data logging ability by going to File -> Data Logging -> Record in MegaTune. It'll prompt you for a name, then start saving everything the ECU sees to that file. Use this to record the engine revving up to 4,500 RPM and breaking up, then see if you can upload that file and share it with us.


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Ill see what i can do about the data log


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## xr4tic (Dec 10, 2001)

also post up a copy of your msq file if you can.


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (xr4tic)*

Well i was able to get a datalog, but dont know how i can upload it. but everything apears to be fine. 
it sounds like it is hitting a rev-limiter at 4500rpm, i have checked and double check that the limiter is set to 8000, and i have check launch control and its off, and everything else seems to be fine. someone must have some ideas about what it could be.


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Well i was able to get a datalog, but dont know how i can upload it. but everything apears to be fine. 
it sounds like it is hitting a rev-limiter at 4500rpm, i have checked and double check that the limiter is set to 8000, and i have check launch control and its off, and everything else seems to be fine. someone must have some ideas about what it could be.

you can email me that datalog and your msq file at the [email protected] address if you want


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

Ok, ill send that out to you as soon as I can.


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

got the files http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
first thing that jumps out is that it looks like youre holding ignition at 1*
go to the spark menu, click on spark settings, and that field that says "hold ignition" should be 0.
also, since youre using a v2.2 board and driving the bosch ICM, the spark output inverted needs to be "NO" (at the bottom of the same window as "hold ignition")

i think your issue is likely a combination of those...
let us know how that works


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

ah ha! good spot ved http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif those should def cure your issues dude


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (VWralley)*

Ill try that out right now and see if it works.


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ValveCoverGasket* »_go to the spark menu, click on spark settings, and that field that says "hold ignition" should be 0.


also on that note, be sure that the fixed igntion box says -10 an not 1







(under spark setting as well)


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: (VWralley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWralley* »_
also on that note, be sure that the fixed igntion box says -10 an not 1








(under spark setting as well)

indeed http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
edit, forgot to mention, if youve already adjusted your distributor with the output inverted set to YES, you may need to readjust the distributor so that the values will line up after setting it to NO.
ive noticed that the spark is kind of erratic when the output is incorrectly set, so its worth a look again to see how close you are or to make any adjustments after setting that value properly










_Modified by ValveCoverGasket at 10:35 AM 9-18-2008_


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

IT WORKED!!!!!!!!!!





















oh my god im so happy it works properly now. thanks guys for all your help. now im thinking i need to buy a wideband O2 so i can tune it better. well now its time to start tuning it. 
Ill go get my timing light and double check that its still correct
Thanks again guys for all your help
























_Modified by [email protected] at 10:59 AM 9-18-2008_


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## VWralley (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

VCG to the rescue!
yes you absolutly have to get a wideband in to tune the car http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i may be in sumner this weekend helping out on another install, if you want to come up an go for a drive i could probably help you dial in your tune pretty well


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: (VWralley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWralley* »_if you want to come up an go for a drive i could probably help you dial in your tune pretty well









i would highly recommend taking him up on this http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
good luck with the tuning guys


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

ya i could definatly use a little assistance with getting it tuned properly


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Well i spent some time with vwralley this past weekend and got it all tuned. big thanks to him for all his help. the thing is running great, and is way faster then it was on digi2. im very happy with the way it turned out.


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## ValveCoverGasket (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

excellent http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## v-[email protected] (Sep 18, 2005)

*Re: (ValveCoverGasket)*

ya, now i just need to get it to pass emissions. i took the test today and it past the cruise part, but it failed idle really bad. i think it might need a cat and then it should pass.


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