# MOFO/4 bar mod - help



## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

Hi all,

Question: what can I expect to gain from the MOFO/4bar mod with my setup?

I am faced with pushing the K04-020 as far as I can as I do not want to go big turbo... don't get me wrong, I do but do not want to put that much into it as I plan to go 911 turbo within 2-3 years and felt I would not get the money back not the satifaction with the money spent.

Anyhow, I have done about all the bolt on possible... the car is 95% daily driver, normal action between 20-100 mph, most of the time I am in light to med traffic. I don't dare to launch with stock rods. 
- 42 DP
- Jetex exhaust
- Yonaka FMIC
- custom intake with 2 x 4" tubing to front for cold air with stock look
- TIP
- pulleys
- Coolingmist Stage 2 Meth (pre-turbo and pre-TB)
- relo DV with Forge Splitter
- Hallman Pro RX MBC
- ECU at Stage 2+ with diode for MBC
- delete(s)
- catch can... etc

:beer::beer:


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## notoriouszig (Jun 14, 2010)

nothing4free said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Question: what can I expect to gain from the MOFO/4bar mod with my setup?
> 
> ...


i just ordered one, i'll let you know how i like it.


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## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

They can make the car run badly/rich, its an extra bar of pressure to "compensate" for the increased MAF, which the engine isn't calibrated for (unless you have a custom tune). From what I heard back in the day to now its not going to do a lot, and may make things worse; there are plenty of other things to consider, and if you're at the point of being done with bolt-ons (sure sounds like it) you either go BT or wait until the Porsche


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## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

l88m22vette said:


> They can make the car run badly/rich, its an extra bar of pressure to "compensate" for the increased MAF, which the engine isn't calibrated for (unless you have a custom tune). From what I heard back in the day to now its not going to do a lot, and may make things worse; there are plenty of other things to consider, and if you're at the point of being done with bolt-ons (sure sounds like it) you either go BT or wait until the Porsche


I understand the concern, I too wonder about this... as I understand how it can possible help with a stock setup but giving 10+% air and 10+% fuel to help bottleneck... but I wonder how it would if any... help a non stock setup. I am also wondering all the positive feedback on MOFO... could it be because of the less restricted intake and not so much about the MOFO?
I am thinking the turbo is now the bottleneck. I was considering a hybrid turbo but I am pretty sure not BT as I am sure I will not be satisfied with BT 1.8 or even 2.0 in the longrun. I am thinking that I will need minimum of 3.0+ turbo setup in the near further.

If anyone has feedback it would be much appreciated.

:thumbup:


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## notoriouszig (Jun 14, 2010)

I would like to hear from someone who has Modshack stage 3. I plan on doing it, so I'll report back. I just don't think that Steve Schwing is really capable of making a bad product, but that's just me.


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## coachvtt (Jan 16, 2008)

*4 fpr!*

I have the same set up and I tried the 4Bar and at times when I would hit the accelerator hard it would die! Scary ****. It happened several times. I then switched back to the 3bar.
Good luck!


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## notoriouszig (Jun 14, 2010)

coachvtt said:


> I have the same set up and I tried the 4Bar and at times when I would hit the accelerator hard it would die! Scary ****. It happened several times. I then switched back to the 3bar.
> Good luck!


are you still running the MOFO with the 3bar? and if so, how's it working. and i sure hope my car doesn't just putz out like that, i'll be peeved as hell.


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## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

notoriouszig said:


> are you still running the MOFO with the 3bar? and if so, how's it working. and i sure hope my car doesn't just putz out like that, i'll be peeved as hell.





coachvtt said:


> I have the same set up and I tried the 4Bar and at times when I would hit the accelerator hard it would die! Scary ****. It happened several times. I then switched back to the 3bar.
> Good luck!


I think he is saying that he ran 4 bar only... without MOFO which makes sense due to extra bar of fuel may adapt at normal driving but would be way to rich at wideopen... 

I would like to hear from people with a mod TT, prefer 225, and added MOFO/4 bar combo. Thanks


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## coachvtt (Jan 16, 2008)

*correct!*



nothing4free said:


> I think he is saying that he ran 4 bar only... without MOFO which makes sense due to extra bar of fuel may adapt at normal driving but would be way to rich at wideopen...
> 
> I would like to hear from people with a mod TT, prefer 225, and added MOFO/4 bar combo. Thanks


Correct I'm running Maffless, with the 4bar, well I tried it and it would choke out at acceleration!
scary as hell, not all the time just a few times but only takes one crash to be pissed.


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## JohnLZ7W (Nov 23, 2003)

Have been running the MOFO/4bar combination on my 225 for about 100k miles now. Fuel trims look good when checked via block 032 on the VAG. Seems to provide better low-end power, not sure that there's much difference on the top end.


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## notoriouszig (Jun 14, 2010)

JohnLZ7W said:


> Have been running the MOFO/4bar combination on my 225 for about 100k miles now. Fuel trims look good when checked via block 032 on the VAG. Seems to provide better low-end power, not sure that there's much difference on the top end.


how noticeable would you say the low-end gains are?


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## ManOfManyGTs (Dec 11, 2007)

I run MOFO with the 4bar fpr. When I installed it, I also installed an APR TIP. Really did not notice much difference. When I had my GTI, I ran a 4 bar fpr for a while and did not notice any ill traits.


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## TTschwing (Jun 23, 2002)

notoriouszig said:


> i just ordered one, i'll let you know how i like it.


Out today!



coachvtt said:


> I have the same set up and I tried the 4Bar and at times when I would hit the accelerator hard it would die! Scary ****. It happened several times. I then switched back to the 3bar.
> Good luck!



Likely you had a Bad MAF. Results like that are not a characteristic of the Mofo. It DOES need a MAF working at 100% to work correctly. You probably hit limp mode because there was an inadequate fuel signal to support your boost requests. Running a 3 bar will result in lean fuel trims. Recommend you fix the underlying issues!

Modshack Stage 3 review here: http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?p=16927726

I'm always availabe Via email to answer questions and troubleshoot. Over 500 Mofo's out there now with no issues... http://www.modshack.info/bamm.htm


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## 20v master (May 7, 2009)

I'd skip the MOFO. Intake mani would add horses or an intake cam would still add horses and shift the power curve to the right.


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## notoriouszig (Jun 14, 2010)

TTschwing said:


> Out today!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


yesssss! schwing, you're a quick worker! and how much would the mani & such run me?


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## notoriouszig (Jun 14, 2010)

notoriouszig said:


> i just ordered one, i'll let you know how i like it.


i did say i would let you know...

put in the MOFO/4bar today as well as a boost machine. I already had the VTDA installed from the previous owner.

I can't really break down whether the boost machine or the MOFO has a bigger impact, however the stage three kit is well worth it IMO. I am packing MUCH more low end power, which I really appreciate. I think it sounds a little nicer too. I'm also holding boost much higher than before, which is great. Good stuff.

Schwing really knows what he is doing, I'd say it's worth it. :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


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## blackfnttruck (Jul 4, 2004)

My block 32 numbers were high before the MOFO, so they were even higher, but not out of range, after the MOFO. I ended up putting a 3.5 bar in and the numbers are just about right now.


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## warranty225cpe (Dec 3, 2008)

notoriouszig said:


> I can't really break down whether the boost machine or the MOFO has a bigger impact:


I'd imagine the boost machine had more of an affect. Boost controller should be pretty noticeable.


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## notoriouszig (Jun 14, 2010)

warranty225cpe said:


> I'd imagine the boost machine had more of an affect. Boost controller should be pretty noticeable.


correct, but i am feeling more low end with the 4bar and mofo, i already liked my mid-high. i would say the BM is the icing on the cake.


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## warranty225cpe (Dec 3, 2008)

I haven't had any luck with my boost controller. It was a turboxs hpbc. It kept throwing me into limp during partial throttle. I think my waste gate was cranked, and that was the issue. Sold it..


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## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

warranty225cpe said:


> I haven't had any luck with my boost controller. It was a turboxs hpbc. It kept throwing me into limp during partial throttle. I think my waste gate was cranked, and that was the issue. Sold it..


I solved the Limp going pass 19-20 PSI with the 4.7 diode. 
My Stage 2+ tune allowed me to spike around 24/26 and hold 19/21 with n75 but with the MBC pass 20, it will limp... the diode trick eliminated the limp but I am thinking since ECU is reading 19-20 PSI though it is really doing 22+... I wonder if it is giving the wrong fuel % or the throttle is restricting it at higher gears. My 1-4 hits hard and stays that way until redline... but my 5/6 just hears the boost but feels like the wastegate is open or throttle is not fully open... or restricted somehow.

I do have a question for all the people with MBC... it seems that my 5th and 6th gears do not react the same as my lower gears though the boost is reading higher. My 3rd reads around 22-23 but my 5th and 6th will do 24-26 but does not have the kick like the lower gears. Is this common or is it lacking fuel, air, octane, or a leak... etc? 

Work has been hitting me hard and I probably will not have time to play with the TT until after then holidays but please keep feedback coming. :thumbup:


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## JettaRed (Aug 14, 2000)

blackfnttruck said:


> My block 32 numbers were high before the MOFO, so they were even higher, but not out of range, after the MOFO. I ended up putting a 3.5 bar in and the numbers are just about right now.


I'm running a 3.5 bar fpr and my fuel trims are about as good as you can get--both well below the 10% swing. I happen to like my MOFO very much. I also have the intake and together they make a nice combo for added responsiveness and top end. Actually, it's good throughout the range. While I have the 42DD downpipe, I have a stock exhaust. A high flow exhaust makes a big difference on our cars if you find one that doesn't drone at 70 mph. All said, the car scoots nicely when it needs to and doesn't want to stop before I do.


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## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

are you saying 225 MOFO is better batch with 3.5 then 4.0 FPR?


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## Nihuel (Mar 31, 2010)

yeah and is that the case for all our cars or does it depend on other mods and/or kind of chip and such??


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## JettaRed (Aug 14, 2000)

nothing4free said:


> are you saying 225 MOFO is better batch with 3.5 then 4.0 FPR?


It depends. If you have a 4 bar, try it and check your fuel trims. If you are pulling too much fuel back, then the 4 bar is too much. Then go for the 3.5 bar.


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## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

:thumbup:


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## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

any other feedback?


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## wrparrish (Nov 13, 2008)

I think what your noticing in regards to less pull in 5th and 6th, is that your final drive ratio's and gearing are starting to work against you. Your first few gears are higher ratio, and as such provide you better acceleration, the ratio drops as you go though, and is pretty low by the time you get to 6. Gives you that great acceleration early on, and still provides sane highway rpm's in 6th.


So point being, the great pull you feel in 1-4 isnt the power your engine is making really, its the good gearing.

A good case in point is on my Mustang, the stock rear end gear ratio is 3.2x, a upgrade to 4.10 rear end gears netted something like 6 tenths off my et's. So in your case, just imagine the situation being reversed as you row through the gears :beer:


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## nothing4free (Sep 6, 2008)

That makes sense and if that is correct then it give me even more reason to stay away from BT as most of my action is 20-100 mph which does not require me to go more then 4th which right now feels fine. I thought it may have been a limit with the turbo, fuel, etc but if it is the tranny then there is not much to do without big $ I am guessing.

Oh well, I guess the mofo/4bar will be the last mod... probably will not have it in until after the holidays.

I do appreciate the input, please keep them coming.

Thanks in advance.


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