# Company review please read!!



## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

Hey guys I was recently ripped off and I want to share my story, this seemed like a good forum to start telling people in. I was taken for a serious ride by Drive shaft Shop and Bahn Brenner made it worse.

Click my signature, I made a website dedicated to my experience as I have no other recourse for what happend.


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## 6765VR6 (Jul 30, 2009)

I've had nothing but top notch customer service dealing with frank from DSS directly. He has made me personally 3 sets of axles, including a custom set and driveshaft for a Nissan R200 rear end in my Audi. That said, a1cvtech is the worst company I ever dealt with. Not only did their axles break easier than stock shafts, but they basically just said go ffff yourself in the end. Nick was friendly and nice to deal with, but the boss Marco is the worst. He's rude, and not helpful at all. DSS makes parts for the fastest cars in the world, they are very busy, so you have to stay on top of them. It sucks that you had a bad experience with them. I just wanted to warn people though, since you're putting in a good word for a1cvtech, my experience was among the worst I have ever dealt with. Poorly made products and even worse customer service. Just a warning to people.


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## 6765VR6 (Jul 30, 2009)




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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

Thanks for the reply, I had a fast easy hassle free experience with a1cvtech that is why i mentioned them. Im just under 400whp on there axles and will soon be cranking it up to 450whp.

If you read my whole page you will see DSS may be good if there is no problem but they sent me crooked
hubs and refused to admit it untill I purchased an ass load of parts to prove there hubs are poorly made 
and crooked.

I just want people to know if you have a problem with these guys they will definitely BS you.

Im glad you had a good experience with DSS and I have read lots of other people having simmilar experiences
but after this whole ordeal i googled DSS a little and found a good amount of simmilary un happy customers that had 
very bad experiences as I did. 

I just want fellow Vortexers to be informed before they decide to use these guys I dont want anyone 
getting ripped off by them and also a word of advice for anyone reading this dont buy DSS axles from
Bahn brenner. BBM makes good parts but they kept the profit they made on MY DSS axles even though
they were bad parts its all detailed in my emails back and forth with them.


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

Hey i just realized that was not last waterfest but the one before you broke those axles right? I was there
Really nice car man :thumbup:


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## sp_golf (Nov 28, 2007)

My friend had the same issue with the DSS hubs. You probably had the early ones which are really thin and have holes in them. He ended up getting a discount on the newer updated versions which are fine.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

KMSgolf said:


> Thanks for the reply, I had a fast easy hassle free experience with a1cvtech that is why i mentioned them. Im just under 400whp on there axles and will soon be cranking it up to 450whp.


When you crank it up to achieve 450whp and your axles snap then you will see what happens....
Enjoy the shipping back to Canada and the run around. 
I do not like throwing anyone under the bus and we are all human subject to making mistakes (some make countless mistakes) but like Justin I have had experiences with A1Cvtech that were simply unprofessional.
Just keep on top DSS. They have the best rep in the industry for a reason.:thumbup:


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

sp_golf said:


> My friend had the same issue with the DSS hubs. You probably had the early ones which are really thin and have holes in them. He ended up getting a discount on the newer updated versions which are fine.


Yea I had them send me a second set of hubs before returning everything. the second set had one crooked hub and one hub that was still crooked but not so crooked it seized my wheel from turning like the other three hubs.


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

Issam Abed said:


> When you crank it up to achieve 450whp and your axles snap then you will see what happens....
> Enjoy the shipping back to Canada and the run around.
> I do not like throwing anyone under the bus and we are all human subject to making mistakes (some make countless mistakes) but like Justin I have had experiences with A1Cvtech that were simply unprofessional.
> Just keep on top DSS. They have the best rep in the industry for a reason.:thumbup:



I guess this was unclear, my goal is not to have people buy from a1cvtech, my goal is to share my story with fellow vortexers so they can make an educated desicion before purchasing from DSS. Some have had good luck with them but other had had terrible luck. I got ripped and want to tell my story as thats all I can do as the money is gone now.

Anyway Thanks for your response Issaam


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## Scrubbs (Mar 14, 2006)

I still am curious why you didnt deal directly with BBM from the beginning. Who would have more clout the distributor or the guy installing it in his garage. ( not a dig just common reality) The distributors can get things to happen easier than customers alot of the time. I know we are the customers that pay their bills, but the distributors are the daily cashflow to manufactures. BBM would have been my first call. Plus they are closer than Canada. With no customs. And i still would have just gotten new hubs. And, i would have documented the run out on the hubs. An easy measurment, that could have been used in court if necesary, but i doubt it would have gone that far. Either way, its sorted out now. Dont let it get ya down, we all have had bad stories with our projects. its a rollercoaster sometimes. :thumbup:


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

Scrubbs said:


> I still am curious why you didnt deal directly with BBM from the beginning. Who would have more clout the distributor or the guy installing it in his garage. ( not a dig just common reality) The distributors can get things to happen easier than customers alot of the time. I know we are the customers that pay their bills, but the distributors are the daily cashflow to manufactures. BBM would have been my first call. Plus they are closer than Canada. With no customs. And i still would have just gotten new hubs. And, i would have documented the run out on the hubs. An easy measurment, that could have been used in court if necesary, but i doubt it would have gone that far. Either way, its sorted out now. Dont let it get ya down, we all have had bad stories with our projects. its a rollercoaster sometimes. :thumbup:


BBM was aware every step of the way. The emails i sent back and forth on the website were with a differnet BBM employee once i was looking for my refund because the first BBM employee was on vacation for some time and my money was out floating around for over three months. Also the second set of hubs they sent me had one unusable like the first two. Three bad hubs seems like there parts shouldnt be on my car at that point.

Yea ive been messing with cars for a long time and ive def had my share of rip offs as we all have but I felt this was above and beyond bad cumstomer service thats why Im paying to host that website


IT may be jerky of me but i lost a lot of money and more importantly the first sumer of my freshly bult VRT


Are you the same guy with screen name scrubbs on the mk2vr6 forums? You remeber my thread when i posted over there because DSS told me it was my spindles/wheel bearings right?


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## xpalendocious (Nov 28, 2003)

I had a great experience with DSS. I ordered custom axles for a 2.0t 6 speed Corrado I was building for a customer, and I measured wrong. When I called and explained that I ordered axles that were not the right length, they said they would send the correct length ones with my new measurement and to just return the first set. I had the new axles in only a few days with no additional costs.

You should link this thread to your dedicated website


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## Scrubbs (Mar 14, 2006)

His link is in his sig. On the vortex? I believe i replied a few times on the hubs and bearings. I think i remember saying it would be easier to diag it with out a keyboard. Sometimes we miss the little things and fresh eyes open up doors and windows everywhere. Wish i could have seen the stuff myself. Might have saved a ton of time and grief for ya. I dont know DSS personally, and how they check their work. But those hubs,from the final verdict, should never have left the shop the second time. Im surprised they havent chimed in on this. I could accept a bad machined part, but it should have been measured and documented. That would have solved everything. As far as losing money, its a tough call. I dont know all the transactions and communication that went on, But if my part was wrong, then i would do what it took to make it right. That doesnt mean i need to give the world to someone though. My interest is in the part. I will make up for the part. There are people that want time , money ,any frustration, first born children when they buy something. Mistakes happen all the time, but most every company tries to keep them at a minimum. How thay solve those problem defines their customer service. For example, i have a friend who orders iced tea, unsweetened, and no lemon. What do we see when the glass arrives at the table. Lemon wedge squeezed and sitting in the middle of the glass. Should he tip badly or get irrate and call the manager? All the above. ? Its a simple thing, but it drives him nutz. BUT he still tips her well. Its not a big deal to get wrong parts, inconveinent yes, but you should never press for time when your building your stuff, rushing leads to mistakes. I know its not always feasable. From the information yuo provided , i dont see a reason you shouldnt have gotten your money back, minus shipping stuff to them. They were on the shelf units correct? Unused and undamaged? aside from swapping new hubs, there shouldnt have been an issue reselling them. But i cant say why that didnt happen. Talk to a lawyer, Talk to them some more. Im still fuzzy why you communicated directly to DSS, when BBM should have been the prime contact. It even appears that way from the letters from who seems to be the manager/owner maybe. Tough calls i guess. But usually the best is to just not recomend the company.


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

Scrubbs said:


> His link is in his sig. On the vortex? I believe i replied a few times on the hubs and bearings. I think i remember saying it would be easier to diag it with out a keyboard. Sometimes we miss the little things and fresh eyes open up doors and windows everywhere. Wish i could have seen the stuff myself. Might have saved a ton of time and grief for ya. I dont know DSS personally, and how they check their work. But those hubs,from the final verdict, should never have left the shop the second time. Im surprised they havent chimed in on this. I could accept a bad machined part, but it should have been measured and documented. That would have solved everything. As far as losing money, its a tough call. I dont know all the transactions and communication that went on, But if my part was wrong, then i would do what it took to make it right. That doesnt mean i need to give the world to someone though. My interest is in the part. I will make up for the part. There are people that want time , money ,any frustration, first born children when they buy something. Mistakes happen all the time, but most every company tries to keep them at a minimum. How thay solve those problem defines their customer service. For example, i have a friend who orders iced tea, unsweetened, and no lemon. What do we see when the glass arrives at the table. Lemon wedge squeezed and sitting in the middle of the glass. Should he tip badly or get irrate and call the manager? All the above. ? Its a simple thing, but it drives him nutz. BUT he still tips her well. Its not a big deal to get wrong parts, inconveinent yes, but you should never press for time when your building your stuff, rushing leads to mistakes. I know its not always feasable. From the information yuo provided , i dont see a reason you shouldnt have gotten your money back, minus shipping stuff to them. They were on the shelf units correct? Unused and undamaged? aside from swapping new hubs, there shouldnt have been an issue reselling them. But i cant say why that didnt happen. Talk to a lawyer, Talk to them some more. Im still fuzzy why you communicated directly to DSS, when BBM should have been the prime contact. It even appears that way from the letters from who seems to be the manager/owner maybe. Tough calls i guess. But usually the best is to just not recomend the company.


THanks for the reply man. Thats the thing, if you read the web page carefully the reason I am so upset is I knew the hubs were bad but I decided to go with what they were telling me becuse they kept saying no way our hubs are bad. That is why I sent them there axles/hubs with my spindles and caliper carriers as well as my rotors so they could assemble the whole thing on a bench and tell me what was wrong and I could have my axles. I just wanted working axle/hubs so I was willing to pay the 85 dollars shipping for all that stuff so they could diagnose the problem. The isseu I have is that they said it was wheel bearings and charged me for new wheel bearings which would be fine if that was the problem. How could they allow the parts to leave there shop again without testing to make sure new wheel bearings fixed the problem. When i recieved the parts it took me 5 minuites to assemble everything on a bench and recognize the same problem was still present. If they had fixed the problem when i sent them everything i would have been fine with the situation and no harm no foul. Even after they still screwed that up but acknowledged something must be up with the hubs because i replaced everything else around them they still sent me a set of hubs that had one hub that you could not use and another that was barely functional.

All i wanted was for them to give me some type of refund for replacing the wheel bearings i didnt need for 100 dollar, and at least pay me the shipping to return the parts a total of 135 from them which they refused. Of course i also wanted bahn brenner to return the whole amount i paid them for the axles which they also refused. I was just bringing up the point that i lost much more then the 135 from DSS and 150 or whatver it was from BBM. I wasnt looking for anything crazy from them just full refund and for them to do something about the incorrect diagnosis and replacement of parts i didnt need. Not to mention you cant even use wheel bearings once you press the hubs out again and because the hubs were no good i had to press them out making the wheelbearings useless. I had to by three sets of wheel bearings total.

I was in contact with bahn brenner as soon as the parts were being sent back to DSS(telephone). Bahn brenner didnt make the parts so obvioulsy they couldnt diagnose the problem. 

I think in these circumstances giving my opinion on this company for others to hear is a very reasonable reaction. Also I think that just refunding my full amount and a them paying for the bearings i didnt need and the shipping to return there parts wasnt to much to ask. I never wrote what i wanted in my website as its not relevent what i wanted the idea was they didnt want to do anything for me even though it was understood there hubs were bad.


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

PS Scrubbs you were really helpfull on the MK2vr6 forums. Thats why i went there was for a fresh set of eyes to make sure i wasnt going crazy thinking it was deff hubs.

I Just want to post my story in a few places on vortex so people can read it as i think a good review on a bad company is justice enough for me

Even though it cost me money to get the website hosted


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## pileofredparts (Mar 20, 2009)

Tarik FWIW I had the same issue this year. 

$1500 for 2 custom DSS front axles. I was never told about the hub/stud change, so that was fun when i went to install them.... 

then i had the same issue with the hubs, the hub diameter is bigger than the inner diameter of the rotor, i tried several sets of rotors and none fit. i ended up machining a set of rotors to fit my $1500 axles :banghead: 

so Tarik is not out of line, when you spend $1000+ you shouldnt have these issues 

Issam can suck a fat one


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

pileofredparts said:


> Tarik FWIW I had the same issue this year.
> 
> $1500 for 2 custom DSS front axles. I was never told about the hub/stud change, so that was fun when i went to install them....
> 
> ...


 

Thanks for the response bro, I am not Tarik he is my older brother? How do you know Tarik? Glad to see someone who had issues with these guys posting becuase its all over other forum sites that they sell a bad product but for some reason everyone on vortex has had all good experiences. Rather people with bad experiences are not posting 

I assume I must know Isaam in some way also?


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

pileofredparts said:


> Tarik FWIW I had the same issue this year.
> 
> $1500 for 2 custom DSS front axles. I was never told about the hub/stud change, so that was fun when i went to install them....
> 
> ...


 


Edit: based on your cars in your signature, is this Dana? Two many VRT's mad man Dana? lol


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## pileofredparts (Mar 20, 2009)

KMSgolf said:


> Edit: based on your cars in your signature, is this Dana? Two many VRT's mad man Dana? lol


 its kevin, tarik and your other older brother know me  

DSS told me there was something wrong with my rotor 

NO DUMBASSES THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOUR HUBS!!!!


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

pileofredparts said:


> its kevin, tarik and your other older brother know me
> 
> DSS told me there was something wrong with my rotor
> 
> NO DUMBASSES THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOUR HUBS!!!!


 
Gotcha, Tarik just recenetly got a hold of you right? I was intrested in starting a syncro corrado build he said your the guy. Been thinking about an old Beemer lately though. GLI should be on the dyno next week shooting for 450whp. 

More importantly DSS gave me the same BS everythig but our hubs is bad on your car. Even after i sent them the whole rotating assembly to check which they didnt they still could not figure out they had bad hubs. Epic Failure. 


Why are you liquidating your hott as cars?


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## radoman57 (Jan 16, 2007)

I had the level 2.9 axles on my corrado vrt, snapped like twigs, $800 down the drain. 
Empi axles are better and around $60 each


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

radoman57 said:


> I had the level 2.9 axles on my corrado vrt, snapped like twigs, $800 down the drain.
> Empi axles are better and around $60 each


 whoa you got big time screwed man that sucks. How much HP were you putting down when that happend? Are you running stock empi's now with same HP level?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

pileofredparts said:


> so Tarik is not out of line, when you spend $1000+ you shouldnt have these issues


 No one ever said he was out of line. I simply stated the following: 


Issam Abed said:


> Just keep on top DSS. They have the best rep in the industry for a reason.:thumbup:


 If you are into drag racing only one name comes up for the VAG platform and that company is not in Canada.


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## radoman57 (Jan 16, 2007)

KMSgolf said:


> whoa you got big time screwed man that sucks. How much HP were you putting down when that happend? Are you running stock empi's now with same HP level?


 
Not sure on the hp, probably mid 300's. They both broke on the wheel side spline. And yes, I feel 
screwed by DSS


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

radoman57 said:


> Not sure on the hp, probably mid 300's. They both broke on the wheel side spline. And yes, I feel
> screwed by DSS


 Thanks for your input man just curious are stockers holding up to your 300ish horse now'? got plans for a solid 300 horse corrado and wondering if stocks will take that abuse as a daily driver.


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

radoman57 said:


> They both broke on the wheel side spline.


 That happens when you dont torquw the axle nut correctly.


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## Scrubbs (Mar 14, 2006)

I hate that spline sealant they used. It cause so many early failures of bearings. They were a PITA to remove and reassemble, unless you removed it all. Seen many loose axle nuts because of it. It would tourque to spec, till you drove it, then it would be loose because it never drew tight to the bearing.:banghead:


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

Scrubbs said:


> I hate that spline sealant they used. It cause so many early failures of bearings. They were a PITA to remove and reassemble, unless you removed it all. Seen many loose axle nuts because of it. It would tourque to spec, till you drove it, then it would be loose because it never drew tight to the bearing.:banghead:


 
Hey just thought you might be intrested dynod 424whp and 455wtq today was a good day. :thumbup::thumbup:


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## Scrubbs (Mar 14, 2006)

:thumbup::thumbup: Good stuff.


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## KMSgolf (May 9, 2004)

so far a1cvtech axles are doing very well, I dont really launch my car though.


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## Norwegian-VR6 (Feb 6, 2002)

Been using DSS mk3 02M conversion axels since 2009 on a Pro-Maf 35R 12V. 
Simpel bolt on, and no issues. They have just done the job i hoped for/paid for, and are still working fine. 20-30psi maxing out the 35R 1.06 :thumbup:


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