# Black Piano Lacquer (Klavierlack) - Includes TB 50-07-03 Klavierlack Paint Application Instructions



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Black Piano Lacquer (Klavierlack) paint*

Here are some photos of the long wheelbase Phaeton with black paint (code A1) with the 'Piano Lacquer' (Klavierlack) clearcoat option applied overtop of the black paint. This is the same paint and clearcoat option that I have on my own car.
The 'Piano Lacquer' clearcoat covering is available as an option on top of the following paint colours: *Solid Paint: *Black (A1) *Metallic Paint: * Mignon Green (A3), Coucou Grey (A4), Turca Anthracite (J3), Mazeppa Grey (N8) *Pearl Effect Paint:* Tarantella Black (B2), Nocturne Aubergine (L6), Luna Blue (S5).  Note that the paint code will change if the Klavierlack finish is ordered - see Derek's post of February 6, 2005, further down in this thread for additional details.
Michael
*Black Piano Lacquer paint*


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## rmg2 (Jan 23, 2004)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (Klavierlack) paint (PanEuropean)*

Michael,
I have that finish on my Phaeton and it does stand out when compared to the standard Black side-by-side.
Before I purchased my Phaeton I ask Phaeton customer care what the $2k paid for and was told that the paint color is sanded between each of the seven coats of paint and the clear coat is also sanded between each of the 7 clear coat application thus giving it the deep shine.
The standard Phaeton get 4 coats of paint and 4 coats of clear-coat. Hope I wasn't given bad info. Maybe you can clarify when you visit Dresden.
I will say that the finish is the best I've ever seen and stands up to bird droppings like no other finish I've ever seen. Bird droppings leave no stain on the clear-coat unlike my 2000 Black Audi A6 4.2 model.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (rmg2)*

I'm not too knowledgeable about paint issues. The paint is actually applied where the carosserie is fabricated, about 100 km's down the road from Dresden in the town of of Zwickau, at the huge body plant that is operated by Volkswagen Sachsen GmbH. This plant was chosen to fabricate and paint the Phaeton body because of the town's great history of building legendary German cars - they used to build Trabants there before VW took over the plant, following the amalgamation of the two Germanys.








Seriously - Zwickau was chosen to do the carosserie and paint for the Phaeton because it is VW's most modern European paint facility. The completed cars are then shipped to the Dresden logistics center inside sealed containers. The logistics center then takes the carosserie out of the container, picks all the interior components, puts the carosserie and components into a special 'tram-car' transporter, and sends the package to the assembly plant in downtown Dresden via the same streetcar network that is used for the Dresden public transit system.
As far as I know, the Phaetons with the Piano Lacquer clearcoat option (production code *FL1*) are given 2 applications of clearcoat, then they are sanded, then they are given another 2 layers of clearcoat. I have attached a file (below) that describes North American repair (paint refinish) procedures for Phaetons with the Piano Lacquer finish - this document appears to support the notion of 4 layers of clearcoat.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*

By the way - I have all 5 of the photos above in 1600 by 1200 pixel format, suitable for desktop wallpaper on a computer monitor. I think that was the original intent of these pictures - notice how the top and bottom thirds of the pictures are kept free of detail. If anyone wants one (or all), let me know and I will upload them at full size to a separate location that you can retrieve them from. I normally only post pictures here at 800 by 600 pixels to keep things manageable.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (Klavierlack) paint (PanEuropean)*

Many thanks to forum member Joe (VPRKLR) for sending in these great photos of his Klavierlack Black Phaeton. These are some of the best photos I have seen for the purpose of illustrating the depth and shine of the Klavierlack paint finish. As was mentioned in the first post at the top of this thread, the Klavierlack (Piano Lacquer) clearcoat finish can be ordered on top of several other colours - you don't need to order a black car to get it.
*Joe's Phaeton*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*

*Archival Note: * Here's a related thread, discussing the Klavierlack clearcoat finish in general: Klavierlack?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*

And, thanks also to forum member Stephen, who provided these pictures of his Klavierlack Black W12:


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*

Here's a link to a very nice set of photos showing a 'Premiere Edition' W12 Phaeton, also with Klavierlack Black paint:  Phaeton W12 with 20 inch Wheels
Michael


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## DCubed (Oct 25, 2004)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*

Michael,
I wanted to step in just a second....the Black Paint is A1A1, the klavierlack is 9010 paint code, when you get the K-Paint, the color codes change.....9050 is luna blue k-paint, and 9052 is nocturne k-paint....
D


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (CapoVWSales)*

Derek, thanks a lot for catching that error of mine. I was getting my paint codes from the current German Phaeton prospectus, and you are 100% correct - the paint code A1 is for a solid black car, without the Klavierlack clearcoat finish. Unfortunately, the prospectus does not give the paint codes when Klavierlack is added, which is why I missed the boat there.
It seems there is a moral to this story - if you want to see nice paint pictures, visit the forum, but if you want to order a Phaeton and be certain it will be delivered with the colour you want... visit Derek!








Thanks again for catching that. I have edited the errors in the post title.
Michael


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## PC Dave (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*

Michael, the photos at the top of the thread are beautiful. You mentioned in a post above from November that you had the five photos in 1600x1200 - are those posted anywhere on the site? If not, could you provide a link to them elsewhere or email them to me at deastman-at-huntercapital-dot-com?
Thanks, Dave


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## PerL (Jan 9, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_ the paint code A1 is for a solid black car, without the Klavierlack clearcoat finish. Unfortunately, the prospectus does not give the paint codes when Klavierlack is added, which is why I missed the boat there.

One little correction, Michael. The paint code for black is not A1, that is the sales term code for when ordering the new car from the dealer. The actual paint code for the black is L041. The complete list of colors (except Individual colors) are included in the parts catalogue, IM me if you want the list.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PerL)*

Here's a few more photos of a Black W12 with the Klavierlack finish, lifted from this thread: My New Phaeton W12 with 20 inch Antera Wheels. Many thanks to forum member Tim for taking the pictures of his car and posting them.
*Black Paint with Klavierlack Finish*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PerL)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PerL* »_One little correction, Michael. The paint code for black is not A1, that is the sales term code for when ordering the new car from the dealer. The actual paint code for the black is L041. The complete list of colors (except Individual colors) are included in the parts catalogue, IM me if you want the list.

Per:
Thanks very much for catching that error and providing the correction. I have posted a complete list of Phaeton exterior colours (both sales codes and production codes) at this link: List of Phaeton paint colours
Michael


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish...*

I have somehow missed the truth regarding the klavierlack finish- are there 14 total coats of paint, 7 black/7 clear (for the black of course...) or just 3 installed at the factory? I remember seeing both, but am not sure. The reason why I am wondering is that since my little rust bubbles appeared in the driver's side rear door panel and since the body shop will have to repaint the entire door to correct this problem(and they will be putting some sort of very thin foam insert between the steel door housing and aluminium trim to hopefully prevent this from happening again) I am wondering how close to specs this will be. I do not think there's any chance of them painting the door 14 times, but they do know the repair process for the klavierlack finish- which is I believe 3 coats or 2 coats ( Michael posted the repair specs a while back) and will be followed.I am just wondering whether the car will be losing anything through the process. Meanwhile they will also be repainting my hood, as for some reason the wipers have rubbed 2 tiny bald spots against the edge of the hood. I have never seen/felt/heard this happening and when I bought the car they were there, but since "fixed" and have now recurred. Since my wife manged to scratch the bumper I am having them repaint that as well ( I am paying for this one!). 
I must take my proverbial hat off to VW for doing the right thing to get these issues taken care of, and by a first rate body shop at that. When I bought the car also there were many many fine scratches all over, which the dealership was to take care of, but even though they tried it didn't work very well. The body shop mentioned above will be taking care of that as well which I am thankful for- I was expecting a fight between the dealer (since that job's about $500-600), but whoever authorized the cost to pay for it, either the dealer or VW they are doing the right thing. It great that they are doing what's right to make the ownership experience good, and while supporting this phenominal car building customer loyalty in the process. Since I am unable to attend the gathering this weekend (new baby at home!) please extend my warmest thanks to the people at Phaeton cust care and the VW execs for making this car possible and supporting it. I will be very interested to hear how the meetings go and regret not being able to attend. 
Thanks.
Ed.

_Modified by viscount at 7:39 PM 4-19-2005_


_Modified by viscount at 7:41 PM 4-19-2005_


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## dcowan699 (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*

Sorry you can't make the GTG but congratulations on the family addition nonetheless. Hope mom is doing great too. My car too had thin long scratches from the get go. I buffed them out but still from time to time I see them. No big deal as each time I wax the car, they seem to further disappear. I really was hoping to see those rust areas as I've checked mine all over and I don't see a problem. Of course , I don't ever see salt trucks either. Enjoy the baby!!
David


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (dcowan699)*

Thanks!!! Mom and Baby (Sophia, 6lbs 2oz) are doing well, thanks. Just a little too much for me to be able to abandon ship as my 5yr old son is a handful any my relatives are out for a wedding in DC this weekend so can't help either







.... 
Its a good thing you do not have salt and that you did not find any rust bubbles!!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif What I have is very small- maybe 1/4 inch wide my about 3-4" long just at the very edge of the door frame where it meets the bottom of the window. Its barely noticable, but i'm happy we caught it when we did, as it would only get worse. I have not seen it anywhere else, and hopefully the fix puts a stop to it, and it doesn't appear anywhere else. As I only have had the car for about 2+ months, I would be surprised that it could have been from the salt in such a short time, but you never know...the city just loves salt...
Have a great time this weekend!!








Ed.


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## rmg2 (Jan 23, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*

Congratulation on the family addition.
Regarding the K. Paint, my understanding is that there is normally 4 coats of paint and clear and that the K. Paint finish adds 2 or 3 additional coats of paint and clear with sandy in between each to give it the smooth and deep finish.
This is a question I will ask at the P. GTG this weekend.


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (rmg2)*

I had scrapedthe side of my car on construction barriers when a truck cut me off on I-90 heading in to chicago. The CouCou Gray is a metalic paint, and the body shop did a terrific job matching the paint. The side of the car that was painted looks as clear as the other side, no orange peel and a mirror smooth texture. it is the best paint job I have ever received.
My last Audi was Pearlescent White, and that never had any issues. If that had been damaged in any way, matching it here inthe US is almost impossible. I loved that color and would love a Phaeton in that color, but I do like my CouCou gray with the anthrecite interior. Fairly conservative, clean and does not stand out too much. I don't like people thinking I am driving an expensive car, but I do like that not many people have one, or have even seen one where I live.


_Modified by dzier at 4:58 AM 4-20-2005_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*


_Quote, originally posted by *viscount* »_...are there 14 total coats of paint, 7 black/7 clear (for the black of course...) or just 3 installed at the factory? 

Hi Ed:
I don't know how many coats of paint and/or clearcoat are applied when the carosserie is painted in Zwickau. I do have the repair instructions (I have attached the file below) - they call for two coats of clearcoat when repairs are made. That could be very different than how the Zwickau plant applies the surface finish.
Concerning wipers - I know for sure what is causing your paint scratch problems. If you are purchasing fuel at a full serve station - the kind where the nice attendant washes the windshield for you - the attendant is lifting the wipers to get those last drops of water at the bottom. That's what is scratching the trailing edge of the hood- the wiper arms are rubbing against the trailing edge of the hood when the gas station attendant lifts them to get the squeegee underneath them. The wipers should not be lifted unless they are put in the special "change blade" position, using the Front Information Display and Control Panel.
On the Phaeton, the wipers sit well below the clear area of the glass, and well out of the airflow. So, it is not necessary (and for sure, not desirable) to lift them and squeegee under them. Any water that remains at the bottom, near the wipers, will not blow up on the windshield once you start to drive the car.
Michael
Here's the Klavierlack clearcoat repair instructions:


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PanEuropean)*

Ed, 
Congrats on the newest member of your family. You will be missed this weekend, but we'll get you the Cliff notes.

_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
Concerning wipers - I know for sure what is causing your paint scratch problems. If you are purchasing fuel at a full serve station - the kind where the nice attendant washes the windshield for you - the attendant is lifting the wipers to get those last drops of water at the bottom. That's what is scratching the trailing edge of the hood- the wiper arms are rubbing against the trailing edge of the hood when the gas station attendant lifts them to get the squeegee underneath them. The wipers should not be lifted unless they are put in the special "change blade" position, using the Front Information Display and Control Panel.


I'm with Michael on the wiper situation. My former training vehicle had the same problem, caused by untrained and over zealous car wash attendants, sales people and service personnel. Funny thing, the new Jetta wipers are set up the same way.
~PC


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## dcowan699 (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PhaetonChix)*

I'm glad you mentioned this Michael as I totally forgot about that feature.


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## trekguy (Aug 16, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*

Hi Ed
I am th other Phaeton owner with the same rust bubbles on the side trim as yours, and mine is due to go in the body shop Monday. BUT, I was not happy to hear the entire door panel must be repainted to replace the black applique. I am always hesitant to have anything repainted, since I doubt a body shop can match the color and depth of shine as the factory. (I'm fussy about stuff like that.) Are you sure they must repaint the entire door? I did not ask my dealer what the process involved; I just assumed the black trim would be replaced and that would be that.
How did yours turnout?


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PanEuropean)*

Thanks for the post- that makes sense! I only take the car to a hand wash place, but once a week could be doing it I guess. I have to call the body shop tomorrow as I thought he said only 2 coats went on the repair and for this finish it looks like they should be putting 2 more clearcoats on...thanks for posting that link. 
Ed.


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PhaetonChix)*

Hi PhaetonChix, cliffs notes would be great!!
Ed


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (trekguy)*

Hi, I do not have my car back yet. The body shop is first rate- real professional but now I am having doubts about how many coats they will be applying....I have this ugly suspicion only 1 clearcoat which is not what is called for- there are 3 which are supposed to be applied. I wasn't happy about the whole door needing to be repainted either, but apparently its necessary. They will be putting some sort of insert in to seperate the steel and aluminum so it doesn't happen again. As you can tell, I'm a little crazy too...








Ed.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*


_Quote, originally posted by *viscount* »_ ...They will be putting some sort of insert in to separate the steel and aluminum so it doesn't happen again...

Wow. If the cause was contact between the aluminum door skin and the steel body, then that's galvanic corrosion, not something that is caused by any paint defect or body damage. But, it is serious nonetheless. I had no idea that was the cause, I thought it was as a result of water being trapped somewhere.
Tony, are you bringing your Phaeton to Auburn Hills this weekend? I would sure like to see that. Note also that there are some technical bulletins out from VW explaining the importance of using only the exact correct type of fasteners to hold the aluminum door skins (and hood, trunk lid) in place, otherwise, galvanic corrosion will occur at each fastener. Hope the body shop knows about this. I'll try to get the TSB's for you.
Michael


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PanEuropean)*

interesting...I've never heard of galvonic corrosion before







...hopefully they will be aware of the correct remedy... I'll give them whatever links if you find them. Thanks a lot!!!!
Ed.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*

Ed:
Below is the warning about galvanic corrosion from the Phaeton Service Manual. I thought it was a TSB, but it is actually part of the manual. The red arrow identifies the chapter in the manual - in this case, chapter 55 - so your dealer can print this out and send it over to the body shop that is doing the work. 
Galvanic corrosion WILL occur whenever two dissimilar metals are in contact with each other. For this reason, it is critical that the aluminum and steel panels do not contact each other. It is even more critical that a third, different metal (such as a fastener) is not introduced between the two dissimilar metals - this is what the manual is warning against.
Michael
*Phaeton Service Manual - Galvanic Corrosion Warning*


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## trekguy (Aug 16, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PanEuropean)*

Yes , Michael, I am driving the Phaeton up to A.H. There, you will see for yourself why I think this is a substandard-parts issue, unique to a few cars, and not something everyone should expect. The car is sitting in my garage now, recently polished, tank full, waiting to drive up into Michigan snow!
I am now having second thoughts about having this repaired at all; I just don't like having the doors repainted. You may want to bring your camera to take some photos for the benefit of other vortex users.


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (trekguy)*

I just had a long chat with the owner of the shop doing my repairs who said he took many pictures of the repair process. I'd be happy to post them when I get them, but don't know how...
Ed.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*

Just email them to me and I will host 'em and post 'em for you, then you can write the text.
Michael


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PanEuropean)*

excellent, thanks Michael. He did not send them tonight, so hopefully tomorrow.
Ed.


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## trekguy (Aug 16, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*

The rust bubbles on my B and C pillars were replaced today to my satisfaction. The owner of the body shop himself (Quality Body Shop 878 Bowery St. Akron Oh 330-376-5121) Dave Vincent Sr. oversaw the complete job, and assured me no painting of any kind would be necessary. In fact, he commented the job went along "very easily".
My car was in the parking lot of the Hampton Inn/Auburn Hills for 12 hours, and I wonder if Michael got a chance to take a picture of the defective appliques.
How did yours turn out?


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## dcowan699 (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (trekguy)*

Sure hated we didn't get to meet you. Glad to hear that the repairs went fine and dandy.


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## viscount (Jan 2, 2005)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (trekguy)*

Hello, I do not have my car back! Should be by end of the week. BTW I do not have the photos which were supposed to be emailed to me- the owner of the shop said that he would make a disk for me so when I pick up the car hopefully i'll have them. How did they repair the rust bubbles without painting?








Ed.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (trekguy)*

Hi Tony:
I got your note (the one you left under my windshield wiper), but I didn't get a chance to see you or your car. I'm really sorry I missed you, but honestly, I can't blame you for departing the fix - the epicenter of that snowstorm was Ohio, and things were pretty bad in Detroit, which was not hit as bad as Ohio. On the drive home (north from Detroit, through Port Huron), the median between the Interstate was just littered with vehicles that had spun out or otherwise lost control. I saw an elderly Cadillac - probably mid 80's vintage - start to do a drift about half a mile in front of me, then it went off into the grassy median accompanied by a massive flying cloud of snow and dirt. No-one appeared to be hurt, and the car didn't appear to be damaged in any way, but I'm pretty sure they'll have to steam-clean the front seat upholstery when they get home.
Anyway - if I ever get down through Ohio again, I'll look you up for sure. I passed through Akron on the way from Toronto to Detroit (dropping off a friend along the way). I like your state, it is very pleasant, and has nice low fuel prices and good highways.
Michael


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## dcowan699 (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (PanEuropean)*

Michael,
You just reminded me of something we forgot to do. We were gonna compare our scans to see how my car and your car faired based on the two different grades of gasoline. Tell me by email what to do and I will send you my scan results and we can make a comparison of the knocking sensors, etc. or whatever it was we were gonna check.
David


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## trekguy (Aug 16, 2004)

*Re: Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish... (viscount)*

It looked like the rust bubbles were just on the shiny black applique on the B and C pillars. Those were replaced with new parts. The old ones were not sanded and repainted, but either discarded or returned to VW for inspection. Dave Vincent Sr. (Quality Body shop ownwer) is a really nice guy (whoose wife drives a Phaeton I might add) and he will welcome a phone call if you want to know the deails of the repair... I was too busy driving the $56k Toureg loaner I had!
Michael, thanks for the kinds words about my state, but I'm not so sure all our roads are in the condition you described! This summer I hope to get to Toronto....


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Great Toronto Body Shop for Klavierlack Paint Work*

I got back to Canada yesterday, and was quite happy to see the result of the repair work done on my Phaeton after the little accident I had in late July. My VW dealer sent the car to the body shop around the corner from the dealership - they have been working together with this body shop for a few years now.
I made a post about it in the Canada forum (Excellent Toronto Area VW Body Shop), because this is more of a regional thing than a continent-wide thing. But, if anyone has worries about getting perfect repairs done on Klavierlack paint, this shop is proof that it can be done right the first time.
What really impressed me was that there was a little ding in the front corner of the hood, and they were able to repair it without refinishing the whole hood. Even with a magnifying glass, I cannot see where the repaired area ends and the original factory finish begins. Also, instead of putting a new bumper on, they repaired the existing bumper. I'm happy that they did it that way, because that strategy eliminates all the possible problems that come with fitting a new part on the car.
Michael


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## Four Speed Fox (May 16, 2005)

*Klavierlack repair?*

I went to see a Phaeton yesterday. In many respects it's the "right" car - four-seater V8 with most of the options - and I believe I can make an acceptable deal on it. Unfortunately, there are numerous paint defects which look like deep chips in the clearcoat (producing the appearance of bubbles in the finish) on the left front fender. 
As there were two salespeople leaning on the car when I walked in, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out how these defects occurred. If the car had a "regular" paint finish, I wouldn't worry about it - a wet sand and re-spray of the clear would eliminate the problem forever. Unfortunately, this car is a Klavierlack black car. I don't know much, if anything, about this finish. 
Has anyone on the forum experienced paint repair with one of these cars? Is there a special procedure which must be followed? 
I'd like to close the deal on *some* car this week lest I lose the chance to track it once before the winter. Yeah, I know it's no track car, but I am not terribly comfortable street driving a car I haven't run to the limits at least once or twice. Never know when someone will pull out in front of you. 
thanks all!


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## chrisj428 (Feb 26, 2005)

*Re: Klavierlack repair? (Four Speed Fox)*

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...35516
You will find your answer at the link above


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## PC Dave (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: Klavierlack repair? (Four Speed Fox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Four Speed Fox* »_I'd like to close the deal on *some* car this week lest I lose the chance to track it once before the winter. Yeah, I know it's no track car, but I am not terribly comfortable street driving a car I haven't run to the limits at least once or twice. Never know when someone will pull out in front of you. 

If you buy a Phaeton and track it, please post photos. That, I've got to see.. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Klavierlack repair? (Four Speed Fox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Four Speed Fox* »_Has anyone on the forum experienced paint repair with one of these (klavierlack) cars?

Hi there:
I banged up the front bumper of my Klavierlack Black Phaeton when I hit a Honda this summer, and had to have the whole front bumper refinished. The body shop that my VW dealer sent my car to did an awesome job - I cannot even tell what is new paint and what is factory original.
Refinishing Klavierlack paint is not difficult, nor does it require any special tools or special application techniques. All it requires is that the paint shop do a considerable amount more hand-work (sanding) between coats than they would do for a car with 'plain' clearcoat on it. You have to allow for the extra labour cost when the estimate is done. I think it was about $1,000 in labor to do all the work (including removal, reinstallation, etc.) on my bumper, compared to about $600 if it had been normal paint.
We have two posts here in the forum that might provide you with some useful guidance. One is Painting/ bodywork on the Klavierlack finish...  This post contains a VW technical bulletin (TB) that provides precise instructions for refinishing Klavierlack paint. If these instructions are followed, the result will be perfect - this is what the body shop that did my paint repair used as their guideline. The other post is in the Canada forum, it is a report of my experience with the body shop my VW dealer subcontracted the work to - that post is here: Excellent Toronto Area VW Body Shop.
Regards,
Michael


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## Four Speed Fox (May 16, 2005)

Hi Michael,
Thank you *very much* - and thanks to PC Dave as well!
I'm currently discussing picking up the car "as is" from them... now if only I could come up with some household agreement on five-seater v. four seater. I think the four-seater is "cooler"; she points out that it's impossible to nap across the back seat of a four-seater, and that long drives make her sleepy


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## GripperDon (May 9, 2005)

*Re: (Four Speed Fox)*

Maybe the seats recline enough to satisfy. Might be at least worth a try. I love the 4 seater, It's only disadvantage from my perspective is that if you pull up and park parallel to the curb someone may have to exit on the traffic side..
Don


_Modified by GripperDon at 10:09 PM 11-28-2005_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (Four Speed Fox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Four Speed Fox* »_...now if only I could come up with some household agreement on five-seater v. four seater...

Don raised a good point about the need for the left rear seat passengers to exit from the driver side of the car - it is not possible to crawl over the divider between the two rear seats. This might be a concern to you if you have more than one small child - however, keep in mind that the car does come with rear door 'child lockouts' that can be activated from the control panel on the driver door.
I think that in practice, the 4 seater is intended for transportation of adults, and might not be the best choice if you have children who are under 8 or 9 years of age.
Michael


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## Four Speed Fox (May 16, 2005)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
I think that in practice, the 4 seater is intended for transportation of adults, and might not be the best choice if you have children who are under 8 or 9 years of age.
Michael

We have no kids, and as the Mrs. and I are both 34 years old, I think the barn door is just about shut on the possibility of doing it without expensive medical help







There's really only room for one child in the family, and as Snoop said, "He is I and I am him". 
Sometimes we'll have guests in the car, but we'll primarily use it for long slogs to McLean, VA and Hilton Head; since they stopped letting me carry my Benchmade 975SBT I've stopped enjoying commercial flight.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (Four Speed Fox)*

Attached is an updated version (in TB format) of the PDF I posted on the first page of this discussion a couple of years ago. The new document is TB 50-07-03.
Michael


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## noahas (Dec 7, 2005)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (DCubed)*

I am a bit confused. I am ordering a touch up paint stick / marker from autovisuals.com (great product if you are not familiar with it) and I am unsure what color to order for my Premiere Edition W12 (Klavierlack black). I saw in an old post: the Black Paint is A1A1, the klavierlack is 9010 paint code, then I saw on another list that the code is L041 (which the L seems more consistant with the other color codes listed on the autovisuals site). Any ideas?
Thanks.


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## petermueller (Oct 20, 2006)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (noahas)*

Noah:
I'd purchase the VW OEM touchup!


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## car_guy (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (noahas)*


_Quote, originally posted by *noahas* »_I am a bit confused. I am ordering a touch up paint stick / marker from autovisuals.com (great product if you are not familiar with it) and I am unsure what color to order for my Premiere Edition W12 (Klavierlack black). I saw in an old post: the Black Paint is A1A1, the klavierlack is 9010 paint code, then I saw on another list that the code is L041 (which the L seems more consistant with the other color codes listed on the autovisuals site). Any ideas?
Thanks.


I purchased touch-up paint from VW and it came in a similar felt tip pen/marker, one for the paint color and one for clear coat. It was very easy to apply. You might want to order it from VW to avoid any color issues.
This (fairly) recently replaced the old style bottle and brush that was impossible to apply smoothly. Well, at least I couldn't do it. So make sure they get you the pens, not the bottle.


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## noahas (Dec 7, 2005)

Absolutely will purchase this from VW. I didn't realize the pen type applicator was an option from them or I wouldn't have even asked. I just assumed they only had the old brush type. Thanks for your help.
Noah


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (noahas)*

Hi Noah:
Actually, both types have their advantages and disadvantages. I prefer to have the paint in the bottle (the older brush-type applicator) for touching up tiny stone chips. I don't use the brush - instead, I use a toothpick to lift a tiny bit of paint off the end of the brush and I apply the paint to the stone chip with the toothpick. I find that gives me much greater control over the quantity of paint applied (and the placement of the paint), and lets me fill in the stone chip perfectly, so that the level (the depth) of the touch-up paint matches the level of the surrounding original paint.
My suggestion: Buy both a stick and a bottle of each of the two required paints (black, and the clearcoat).
Michael
*Paint Applicators*


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## paddyh (Mar 14, 2008)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (PanEuropean)*

Michael, 
Any chance of getting both the pictures rehosted and a copy of the 1600x1200...
Patrick


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Black Piano Lacquer (Klavierlack) paint (PanEuropean)*

Photos re-hosted.


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## ciscokidinsf (Feb 17, 2008)

Michael, in NA, what is the part number for the bottle set? (I have the pen already) but next week I'm having a body shop do a deep polish/restoration of the paint and I want the 2 bottles in the picture (black paint and clear coat) for the smaller chips in the body. When I call the VW dealers, what part number should I use?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (ciscokidinsf)*

Hi Francisco:
Both the black and the clearcoat are plain Jane, generic VW paints - in other words, the same black and the same clearcoat that is used for a black Golf or black Jetta.
Personally, I don't recommend using the clearcoat for tiny touchups - I have had the best results just using the black in the stick or the bottle, applying a few layers using a toothpick as an applicator, then wet-sanding with 2,000 then 2,500 grit paper and finally buffing it with swirl mark remover. This gives a result that is invisible. If I start trying to use the clearcoat all sorts of problems arise, so save the $3 you were planning on spending on the clearcoat bottle.
Michael


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## rrussell (Sep 9, 2003)

Michael, 

Where's the PDF file on the TechBulletin-ClearcoatRefinish.pdf for the Black Piano Lacquer (Klavierlack) paint? I need it bad to give it to the bodyshop. 

Thanks, 
Randy


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Here is the PDF file:


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## rrussell (Sep 9, 2003)

Thanks alot Michael.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Photos re-hosted.

Michael


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## AdW14 (Jan 24, 2014)

Where would we see the paint code? We may have that effect. The body shop's first attempt didnt match up....then they reworkked it and the orange peel was gone but it still looks different to me.

I see now...it says LO41 fl0 ...i saw on the document I t would be fl1...so does this mean we dont have this finish.


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## mikelaca (Aug 23, 2012)

Are the instructions different for Heliochrome paint application? My car has the 3 in 1 color shift. Would love to know how to touch-up my paint.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

I honestly don't know if VW even produces the touch-up bottles or touch-up pens for cars with the Heliochrome paint. If they do, I suspect that the application instructions would be the same.

Michael


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## cbh123 (Aug 25, 2013)

Might try here if vw does not have it 

http://www.paintscratch.com/touch_u...eton-Papillon-Silver-Heliochrome-LB4V-P3.html


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

I recently bought touch-up paint from here: http://www.automotivetouchup.com/ 
I suspect the actual paint probably all comes from the same source, the site named below looks suspiciously similar. Anyway, in terms of colour match (mirror silver in my case), the results were excellent, the only problem being a lack of skill on my part. I used the brush on a few minor chips and for a deep scratch on my bumper I used the spray (after filling the scratch).


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