# 16V G60 - How to



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*ROUND 3*.

I decided to make this thread after again getting quite a few PM's from members asking me to do a 16V G60 thread similiar to my 20V G60 Thread.Now my reply was that I had never built a 16V G60 ,I only had the knowledge and know how of a 16V (either *9A* or *PL*) and a G60 engine (*PG*) and was unable to do a write up.After a while I thought about it and did the research,spoke to the guys that did it and decided I will do a write up.The following are useful links you can use when doing the Build up or you can accomodate all the 16V G60 information into 1 thread like what we did with the *20V G60 thread.*

*1.* *Bahn Brenner's* own build up process.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_
I have a PG G60 8V,How do I convert it to a 16V G60?


_Quote, originally posted by *Not2Fast* »_

Taken from this site:
*PG - 1.8 8V G60* : 
Compression Ratio = *8:1*
Rod Length = 136mm
Wrist Pin Diamater = 22mm
Bore = 81mm
*9A - 2.0 16V* : 
Compression Ratio = *10.8:1*
Rod Length = 144mm
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm
Bore = 82.5mm
*PL - 1.8 16V* : 
Compression Ratio = *10:1*
Rod Length = 144mm
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm
Bore = 81mm


According to the information posted above your going to have to get a set of custom pistons.Bahn Brenner sells a set of custom pistons for *$699.95US*


Or you can contact Rodney Huss for your custom application.
The reason you will need a custom set of Pistons is because placing a 16V head on an 8V Block lowers the CR approx 1.8 Points.Since the G60 engine is allready @ a CR of *8:1* then dropping that CR *1.8:1* points lower will bring it to about *6.2:1*,definitely too low for a *16V G60*.
Now for the Conrods you can use your stock *PG G60* rods but it is recommended that you use *PL 16V* Rods + Custom Pistons due to the fact that your rod ratio using the PG rods will be too short.
Now that the pistons and Rods are out of the way your going to need the obvious:
*1.* 16V Head,Either 9A or PL.9A has bigger Intake Ports.
*2.* 16V Lower Intake Manifold.
*3.* 16V Scirocco Upper Intake Manifold (pictured below)- This enables you to relocate the Throttle Body from the passenger side of the engine bay (LHD) to the drivers side of the engine bay.You can then still use your stock G60 filter box.
*4.* Distributor
Now you have *2* options for the Distributor set-up.

*1.*

_Quote, originally posted by *Distributor In Head* »_

*1*.16V Distributor, complete 
*2*.16V Distributor Block off plate complete 
*3*.16V oil pump, complete 
*4*.16V Secondary shaft and gears complete 
*5*.16V Timing belt and gears, complete 
*6*.16V Exhaust Manifold or 16V Header










*2.*

_Quote, originally posted by *Distributor In Block i.e. Retaining the PG setup* »_

_*1. CAM GEAR:*_
16V Cam Gear
Stock _20V/16V Cam_ Gear has_ *52 Teeth*_

_*2. CRANK GEAR:* _16v crank gear STOCK but an ABA crank pullye shaved 5.5mm with a new centering ring pressed in. Scirocco20v mods them for $10 if you supply it.or you can do it yourself.
Stock _8V Crank_ Gear has *22 teeth*
Stock _16V/20V Crank_ Gear has *26 teeth*

_*3. INTERMEDIATE SHAFT GEAR:*_
Combination of a 16V Cam Gear and an 8V Intermediate shaft.dont mod the gear...Mod the keyway in the IM shaft to fit the gear. The 8v used a press in half mood key way and the 16v cam gear uses a molded in 1/4 moon. It wont fit unless a path is cut in the IM shaft to fit the key on the gear to. 
If Building *PG 16V *Combination - Use PG IM SHAFT
If Building *ABA 16V* Combination - Use ABA IM SHAFT

_*4. TIMINT BELT:*_ 
16V OEM Timing Belt


Your Physical engine should be done @ this point.


_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_
I have a 16V and I want to make it a 16V G60,what do I do?

First the Compression Ratio of either the *9A* or *PL* needs to be decreased.As stated above the 9A and PL have a CR of 10.8:1 and 10:1 respectively so you can either machine/dish the pistons to lower the CR or get a set of custom 83mm units.Below is a picture courtesy of OttawaG60 showing machined *9A* units.









Now that the internals are dealt with,your going to need quite a few parts off of a PG G60.John Doe...meet John Betz










_Quote, originally posted by *John BETZ* »_

G60 G-Lader Supercharger or BBM Screw Compressor Supercharger kit 
G60 G-Lader mounting brackets and belt tensioner complete 
G-Lader outlet (silencer box) or BBM RSR outlet kit 











_Quote, originally posted by *John BETZ* »_

G60 Serpentine / idler pulleys for water pump and alternator 
G60 AC pump or European water pump pulley 
G60 Throttle body, complete 

Coolant flange so that the outlet pipe does not hit the Charger.








Throttle Body Adapter to enable clearance issues with Distributor in head.If you use the Distributor in the block setup.all you will need is a Peugeot distributor cap.










_Quote, originally posted by *John BETZ* »_

G60 Fuel Injectors and FPR 
G60 Idle stabilizer valve (ISV) 
G60 Digifant1 ECU and engine wire harness 
G60 Digifant control relay 
G60 Oxygen sensor 
G60 Water temperature sensor (blue) 
G60 CO% potentiometer 
G60 Relays, fuel pump 
G60 Intercooler, IC hoses to and from the G-Lader 
G60 Lower water pump pipe 
Upper and lower coolant hoses 
G60 Radiator and fan assembly 


_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_
Ok,now that I have a 16V G60,what do I do for my intake?
You have 3 Options:
*1.*Scirocco 16V Upper Intake to place the TB On the drivers side.








*2.* Audi S2 3B Intake Manifold chopped and modified to suit shown below.








*3.* Modify your upper Intake manifold resemble what you see below


















_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_
I want to retain my AC,Do I have to relocate the Alternator?
Yes,Lucky for you Bahn Brenner has an Alternator relocating kit.



_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_
What about tuning?Can I retain my Digi-I?
Yes you can,*SNS Tuning* seems to be the most favourable choice when it comes to Digi-I Chip Tuning and they can make a chip application for your 16V G60.
If you want to drift away from the whole distributor/chip set up then you can go with TEC3 from Bahn Brenner 







or Stage Ic from 034EFI

Hopefully if everything works out as planned you should obtain this Courtesy of John Betz @ Bahn Brenner Motorsports









This is the original from VW:








And this is one in an engine bay

















Special thanks goes out to:
OttawaG60,JBETZ and anyone else that allowed me to use pictures/info from there sites. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Please feel free to add any information possible as I am sure I left out of some.


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## Scott F. Williams (Oct 14, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Issam for VW Playa President!


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Scott F. Williams)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scott F. Williams* »_Issam for VW Playa President!

















The information is all that counts http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Bravo! Lots of good info here. I'm glad you made good use of the pics I sent you of the G60 charger brackets. Since I've already done this swap I was reading it for giggles and to see if I could add any info or answer questions and low and behold a spot a couple of my pics. Cool! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I do have a few words of advice for anyone contemplating this swap. First, just because a respected shop sells it as a "kit" doesn't mean that it will be a simple bolt in installation. I learned that the hard way







The devil is in the details. Once you get all the parts bolted in there are lots of details such as relocating many of the sensors and related wiring.
On the bright side, if it was easy everyone would do it. If you have moderate mechanical/electrical skill and a huge amount of patience you can end up with an engine swap to be proud of, like this...








9A 2.0L 16v Bottom end
- 9:1 JE 83mm forged pistons
- Fully balanced rotating assembly
- ARP rod bolts and main cap studs
- VW 16v windage tray w/ integrated oil pan gasket
PL 1.8L 16v head mildly ported 
- Stock cams
- Stock 16v dist on head
- ABA steel shim head gasket
- ARP head studs
BBM screw compressor and silencer "kit"
- At least these came with instructions. Even if they are for installation on a regular 8v G60.
- Custom battery tray and hold down made from parts sourced at Murray's Auto
BBM 16v integration "kit"
- You're on your own with this one kids. No instructions included with "kit". Not even a parts list describing what each part is or where it goes.
Link to a bunch of pics of my swap in progress http://www.hostdub.com/thetatau87_album02
Please feel free to IM or e-mail me if you want more info or have questions.

_Modified by thetatau87 at 1:29 AM 1-18-2005_


_Modified by thetatau87 at 1:36 AM 1-18-2005_


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (thetatau87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *thetatau87* »_Bravo! Lots of good info here. I'm glad you made good use of the pics I sent you of the G60 charger brackets. Since I've already done this swap I was reading it for giggles and to see if I could add any info or answer questions and low and behold a spot a couple of my pics. Cool! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Thanks alot Brad.
Ye was trying to get some cleaned up bracket pics but couldnt find any.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

I wrote the KK link above, I'll add some info to this post.

_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
According to the information posted above your going to have to get a set of custom pistons.Bahn Brenner sells a set of custom pistons for *$699.95US*

Or you can contact Rodney Huss for your custom application.
The reason you will need a custom set of Pistons is because placing a 16V head on an 8V Block lowers the CR approx 1.8 Points.Since the G60 engine is allready @ a CR of *8:1* then dropping that CR *1.8:1* points lower will bring it to about *6.2:1*,Definately too low for a *16V G60*.
Now for the Conrods you can use your stock *PG G60* rods but it is recommended that you use *PL 16V* Rods + Custom Pistons due to the fact that your rod ratio using the PG rods will be too short.


Easiest way to do this swap is start with a 9A, stack 2 ABA headgaskets.
Remember the G60 flows ~300-350 cfm, so the boost you get on a 2L 16v will be ~10 psi.

_Quote »_
*1.* 16V Head,Either 9A or PL.9A has bigger Intake Ports.
*2.* 16V Lower Intake Manifold.
*3.* 16V Scirocco Upper Intake Manifold (pictured below)- This enables you to relocate the Throttle Body from the passenger side of the engine bay (LHD) to the drivers side of the engine bay.You can then still use your stock G60 filter box.


9A has better exhaust ports, and for this application, it's probably the better choice.
IIRC not all 16v lower intake manifolds bolt up to the Scirocco.
If you plan to use the Scirocco and the Dist, you'll need an elbow to clear it as the recirc will interfere.

_Quote »_
*4.* Distributor


Stock 16v one is the way to go. Digifant will have no problems with it.

_Quote »_
Coolant flange so that the outlet pipe does not hit the Charger.


This is only for Lysholms, I'm using the stock 16v one.

_Quote »_
Throttle Body Adapter to enable clearance issues with Distributor in head.If you use the Distributor in the block setup.all you will need is a Peugeot distributor cap.


There is a drawing of an intake elbow on the yahoo group (dougG60)

_Quote »_
Yes,Lucky for you Bahn Brenner has an Alternator relocating kit.


There are also drawings of this on the yahoo group.
Or you can try and mount it under the G60.

_Quote »_
Yes you can,*SNS Tuning* seems to be the most favourable choice when it comes to Digi-I Chip Tuning and they can make a chip application for your 16V G60.
If you want to drift away from the whole distributor/chip set up then you can go with TEC3 from Bahn Brenner or Stage Ic from 034EFI


I ran SDS with my engine, and am now working on MegaSquirt, 2 other options that would work well.
Crankcase ventilation, make sure you vent the valvecover and the front of the block, and use a catchcan, some 16v's seem to spit oil.
Corrado downpipe matches up with the 16v exhaust manifold, if you're in a Corrado, you can use that for exhaust.
Fuel rail and injectors, plenty of good 16v fuel rails out there, injectors, try Ford motorsport green (#42), they are bosch.
Don't forget the inserts (G60 injector for manifold)
I'll keep adding as I remember things I've come across during my swap.


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

Modding the 16v G60








Cams, superchargers seem to be more tolerant of overlap than turbos, go for big lift, medium duration (don't want power band too high, have to overspin G60).
Try Catcams 260's or dual exhaust.
Porting charger and Pulley's, try 70 or 72mm and don't rev it to 8000








You've got more engine to fill now and a better flowing head.
P&P head
Engine management, worthwhile taking a look at.


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

Belt/Pulley routing
#1: 7 pulley








#2:6 pulley


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_I wrote the KK link above, I'll add some info to this post.


Sorry about that Jerome, didnt read the part @ the bottom.


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i am mounting my alternator under the charger , does anyone have a pic of that ? i have it mounted already , but it is only in mock up stage. i need to still play around with it just want ot see where you mount the belt tensenor onto the charger bracket.


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_i am mounting my alternator under the charger , does anyone have a pic of that ? i have it mounted already , but it is only in mock up stage. i need to still play around with it just want ot see where you mount the belt tensenor onto the charger bracket.

The smaller the alt, the better. 16v one fits very nicely, but hits the subframe (Corrado).
ABA fits, but I needed to make a custom bracket at the top and it hit (rarely).
I think the alt from a Suzuki sidekick might work, it's tiny.
Use a timing belt tensioner.


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

dame , i mounted a 16v alt. on it , your right , fit nice and neat , but it will hit the subframe ? thats no good. looks like i am gonna look for adodge colt one or maybe the sidekick one .


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_dame , i mounted a 16v alt. on it , your right , fit nice and neat , but it will hit the subframe ? thats no good. looks like i am gonna look for adodge colt one or maybe the sidekick one . 

Can you slide your hand between subframe and alt?


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

it is just on a stand, still mocking everything up , so i cannt check .
i am looking at this right now , a chevy alt brackets, they are adj. and i think that i can get them to mount to the rear of the motor , allowing me to move the alt to the rear . let me see if i can find a pic of the raket i am talking about. ( but the block has the wholes in the side where you would mount the a1 side motor mount, so i may be able to get it there . ) let me get a pic for you all.


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

THIS IS A BETTER PIC, picture this mount as if you are lookinf at the back of the motor, and i would just have to make a braket to bolt this part to , very easy, then find a point to bolt the adj arm to . the alt will be lower then the kits but it may work just fine. 








_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 10:15 PM 1-18-2005_

_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 10:15 PM 1-18-2005_


_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 10:22 PM 1-18-2005_


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

dame it , cannt get the photo to rotate.but you can get the idea, may go to a junk yard and pull one off an old chevy to try it . may be enough room for it , but it is close to the rear motor mount and down pipe.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

OttawaG60,this is your engine? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

hard to see the rear alt braket in it . is ther eany better pictures of it ? thanks and when i get a chance i will take a couple pics of my mock up , plus whne i can get one of those chevy brakets mounted and see if it really works.


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_OttawaG60,this is your engine? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


Nope, but exact same setup.


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Here is the setup of the alt (ABA) under the G60.


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

Here's my current setup.


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## Stealthpro411 (Jul 31, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

i have a really good link... ill send it when i restore all the files on ym computer t has lots of pictures of the alt. under the charger...


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_Here's my current setup.









Monsteel,did you allready chop this Intake?Why didnt you just make a hump for the G60 charger?


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

It's cut in that photo eh?
I have to make the hole a little bit bigger to allow me to fit a piece of pipe in there to clear the charger hump.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_It's cut in that photo eh?
I have to make the hole a little bit bigger to allow me to fit a piece of pipe in there to clear the charger hump.

So whose Manifold is this?Not yours?


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

Waterpump pulley.
This one seems to stall several people, I found that a factory ABA pulley fits perfectly (flipped).


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## 13LG60 (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
So whose Manifold is this?Not yours?

Judging from the Roma Tuning website it is taken from, it is Robert van Wijk's manifold http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by 1,3LG60 at 3:14 PM 1-20-2005_


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## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (1,3LG60)*

i think this one uses the honduh fuel rail:


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
So whose Manifold is this?Not yours?









Nope, it's from Roma Tuning, I just posted it as an interesting solution to the problem


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (mrkrad)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mrkrad* »_i think this one uses the honduh fuel rail:









I don't see the rail or injectors


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

heres a good one. i have been thinking about this for the last 2 hours and cannt see why it wont work. someone shoot this down if i am wrong.
i can use the bbm dist. block off plate on the 16v head , run my stock g-60 dist. on the block , ( granted i have to use the TT adaptor ring, 8v oil pump, 8v crank gear, 8v intermead. shaft. ) and then jsut run the car like stock. this will elimate the need to have the crank pulley shaved. i will have to use a 8v cam gear, intmed. gear , and 8v crank gear.
am i correct?
reason for this , is i build a monster motor for my old gti , and i am getting the motor back through a trade, it only has 700 miles on it. it is ( as in the gti now ) a 14:1 2L 8v, here is a list of what is in it 
je 9:1 2L 16v pistons
shaved and balanced 8v interm shaft
light weight interm gear
balanced and polished 9a rods
knifed and balanced crank
tt dist ring
8v oil pump
8v crank gear
so running the dis. in the block will save me time and cash from having another interm. shaft shaved, looking for a 16v oil pump ( i sold the one i had after i finished the motor )
i dont think that i am wrong , the only thing that may get me is will a 8v cam gear fit on a 16v cam. ( i am almost sure , just havent checked yet. ) oh and i will use a 8v timing belt. what do you think am i crazy? or am i on to something.


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

starting to anwser my own question, after looking around at 16v cams, doesnt look like a 8v gear will fit on it , but if i just take the center out of a adj 16v and bolt it to a adj 8v gear, it will work. 
now who is the wizard on this? IS THE CAM ROTATION RPM THE SAME FRO A 16V AS A 8V , GIVING THAT THE TWO BELTS HAVE MORE TEETH ?
ie: will the 16v cams move at the wrong speed because of the 8v belt being used. i see it as the same speed as long as i have the 8v crank gear and the 8v cam gear.
to much thinking








thanks for the help, i am sure this is helpping more then just me.


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## YeloCorado (Apr 13, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

I have one too.... FOR SALE 










_Modified by YeloCorado at 10:28 AM 1-12-2006_


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Oh Boy....*Page 2* http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_I have a PG G60 8V,How do I convert it to a 16V G60?

Well first of all your going to have to get a set of custom pistons.Bahn Brenner sells a set of custom pistons for *$699.95US*

Or you can contact Rodney Huss for your custom application.
The reason you will need a custom set of Pistons is because placing a 16V head on an 8V Block lowers the CR approx 1.8 Points.Since the G60 engine is allready @ a CR of *8:1* then dropping that CR *1.8:1* points lower will bring it to about *6.2:1*,Definately too low for a *16V G60*.
Now for the Conrods you can use your stock *PG G60* rods but it is recommended that you use *PL 16V* Rods + Custom Pistons due to the fact that your rod ratio using the PG rods will be too short.
Now that the pistons and Rods are out of the way your going to need the obvious:

_Quote, originally posted by *16V G60 Parts Needed* »_
*1.* 16V Head,Either 9A or PL.9A has bigger Intake Ports.
*2.* 16V Lower Intake Manifold.
*3.* 16V Scirocco Upper Intake Manifold (pictured below)- This enables you to relocate the Throttle Body from the passenger side of the engine bay (LHD) to the drivers side of the engine bay.You can then still use your stock G60 filter box.
*4.*16V Distributor, complete 
*5.*16V Distributor Block off plate complete 
*6.*16V oil pump, complete 
*7.*16V Secondary shaft and gears complete 
*8.*16V Timing belt and gears, complete 
*9.*16V Exhaust Manifold or 16V Header

The End Result courtesy of *Thetatau87*:


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_...if i just take the center out of a adj 16v and bolt it to a adj 8v gear, it will work. 
now who is the wizard on this? IS THE CAM ROTATION RPM THE SAME FRO A 16V AS A 8V , GIVING THAT THE TWO BELTS HAVE MORE TEETH ?
ie: will the 16v cams move at the wrong speed because of the 8v belt being used. i see it as the same speed as long as i have the 8v crank gear and the 8v cam gear.
to much thinking










Cam Gear rotation is the same.
I was wondering the same thing, (mod'ing the 44 tooth 8v cam gear to work on 16v cam using the adj sprockets). I know the adj cam gears guts likely won't interchange w/o some work, but that seems minimal.
Since (2 revs of motor = 1 rev of cam):
*8V* = 22/44 = .5 
*16V* =26/52 = .5
Is the 16V belt is wider and stronger than the 8V (thus the need for machining the back of the crank pulley to pull it back in)? ..maybe an alignment issue that can be corrected with the mod'ed cam gear?
Shawn



_Modified by sdezego at 2:08 AM 1-21-2005_


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (sdezego)*

As long as you use the same cam gear and crank gear the rotation will be fine.
The 16v belt is wider, probably because there is more load on the belt and higher revs.
Shave down a G60 pulley 6mm if you're worried about $$ otherwise order the crank pulley from BBM etc.


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## YeloCorado (Apr 13, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Did you custom make that TB elbow yourself?

Yeh because one night a kid broke into my car and stole my BBM one. ha ha. I wonder if he pitched it in the trash because he diddnt know what to do with it..


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (YeloCorado)*


_Quote, originally posted by *YeloCorado* »_
Yeh because one night a kid broke into my car and stole my BBM one. ha ha. I wonder if he pitched it in the trash because he diddnt know what to do with it..

I would hope thats not sarcasm
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_As long as you use the same cam gear and crank gear the rotation will be fine.
The 16v belt is wider, probably because there is more load on the belt and higher revs.
Shave down a G60 pulley 6mm if you're worried about $$ otherwise order the crank pulley from BBM etc.


i have a shaved interme. shaft in the motor now and i already sold the oil pump , interm shaft, oil pump gear for the 16v , so i am running 8v internals right now, so it will save me time and money to just swap out the center of cam gear. should be the same.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Angular 9A Machined Pistons (Wizard-of-OD)*

look just like my je pistons, ( as much shaved off them ) http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
good work


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

here is another one for you guys, i think that i have heard that a 20v crank pulley will work on this setup. is this true, i am looking at the turn2 power pulley and i think that i may use it, do you know if it will bolt up to a 9a crank, should but looking for thoughts. thanks
http://www.turn2usa.com/Mercha...ulley

theres the link to it


_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 9:14 PM 1-24-2005_


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_here is another one for you guys, i think that i have heard that a 20v crank pulley will work on this setup. is this true, i am looking at the turn2 power pulley and i think that i may use it, do you know if it will bolt up to a 9a crank, should but looking for thoughts. thanks
http://www.turn2usa.com/Mercha...ulley

_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 9:14 PM 1-24-2005_

Looks close, but you'd need to compare them for sure.
Anyone got a 1.8T crank they want to send me, I'll compare and let you know.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

That looks like plenty of customization, I'd perfer to see it lined up with the G60


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

maybe i can pick one up ( turn2 ) and if it doesnt line up just return it . looks like i have to do something , just not gonna be for sure on it till i have them in my hand. let you know how it goes.


----------



## Scirocco20v (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

the 1.8t crank pulley lines up with the vr6 water pump pulley and aba alt. set up when used on a 16v crank gear. So if you guys are shaving your G60 pullies or modding ABA units by 6mm IIRC then the 1.8t pulley will work.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Scirocco20v)*

so with that said , then the 1.8t pulley will bolt up to the crank and i will have to play around and see what other pulleys will line up with it to run a 8v crank gear . i also have to check mixing a 16v cam gear with a 8v one.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Scirocco20v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scirocco20v* »_the 1.8t crank pulley lines up with the vr6 water pump pulley and aba alt. set up when used on a 16v crank gear. So if you guys are shaving your G60 pullies or modding ABA units by 6mm IIRC then the 1.8t pulley will work. 

I shaved an ABA 6mm to line up with the G60.
If I understand you correctly.
If I take a 9A, bolt on the 1.8T crank pulley, it'll line up with the G60.
Correct?


----------



## Scirocco20v (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

Correct


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

Ottawa G60 do you have an ABA tensioner bracket knocking around? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Scirocco20v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scirocco20v* »_Correct

Very interesting, how come this hasn't popped up before?
Time to get me a 1.8T crank pulley


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Ottawa G60 do you have an ABA tensioner bracket knocking around? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

No, my place is an ABA free zone, check with Chad, I'm sure he must have one.
I'm using the stock G60 tensioner


----------



## lucmb94 (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

so i still am a little confused if i bought a kit like the one from bbm what else would if i bought a 16v head?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i got my old bottomend and mounted up the g bracket , then mounted my alt under the charger, i was using a 16v alt , after looking at it for about an hour , tere is no way this is gonna fit in the car , the subframe is right in thte way , i thought i may be able to skim by but no way . looks like on i am on the hunt for a rear mount , or a cult alt . still looking for a 16v adj cam gear to swap out the middle on a 8v gear . to many unknows right now , but i am happy to have my old bottomend back and only has 700 miles on it 
je 9:1 pistons
total seal rings 
polished and balanced rods ( 9a )
balanced and knifed crank ( RST crank)
arp rod bolts
all new bearings and thing when you do a rebuild 
bildon oil windage tray
lightened and balanced intermedate shaft.
eurosport light weight 8v intere. gear
dist. in block 
question , do i have to tap the oil pan for a return line on the oil ? where doe the ph block have the oil return ?


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

Tap the oil pan, or the block. Usually a boss cast into the block is drilled and tapped for a fitting, but as long as it dumps above the oil level, everything should be rosy.
Here is an unfinished web page that will be posted on the SNS site from a locally built 16V G60 that was put together in December. The dyno plot is a stock 2L 16V head with stacked headgaskets and Autotech cams. I'll get around to finishing it, sometime this week. Pretty damned fun in a mk2 GTi







.
http://www.snstuning.com/Digi1...h.htm


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

so should i tap the front of the pan or the rear , seieing that the oil will be pushed to the rear of the motor as the power hits ? i have a windage tray, or just do i tap it as close to the top of the pan as i can ? ( in the rear )


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

Draining into the front of the pan would be more ideal than the rear. It would also keep your oil drain line relatively short.
My pan is tapped in the rear, but I have a hair dryer hung on the back of my motor.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_Draining into the front of the pan would be more ideal than the rear. It would also keep your oil drain line relatively short.
My pan is tapped in the rear, but I have a hair dryer hung on the back of my motor.


LOL , TURBOOOO , DOES LOOK LIKE ONE


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_i got my old bottomend and mounted up the g bracket , then mounted my alt under the charger, i was using a 16v alt , after looking at it for about an hour , tere is no way this is gonna fit in the car , the subframe is right in thte way , i thought i may be able to skim by but no way . looks like on i am on the hunt for a rear mount , or a cult alt .


Like I said above, 16v alt will hit subframe.

_Quote »_
question , do i have to tap the oil pan for a return line on the oil ? where doe the ph block have the oil return ?

No, you can tap a hole in the block, just like the PG.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

*It's been awhile since I wrote this, so I'll update it here.*
http://www.kompressorkanada.ca/howto/16vG60.htm

_Quote »_
16vG60 Conversion 
READ FIRST - This is by no means a complete how-to on a 16v g60 conversion. This is just advice and guidance. We are not legally responsible for the information that is contained here. If through the process you come up with any further advice please forward it to us so that we can add it to this list. 
The best source of info on this conversion is the 16vg60 group on yahoo http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/16vG60/
I'm going on the assumption that you have a 16v (with alt, dist, exhaust manifold) and a G60 engine with charger, bracket, tubing and digifant) 
Parts needed 
1) alt doesn't fit in stock location. You have to options here, under the G60 or on the back of the block. I chose to do it under the G60, I recommend doing in on the back of the block, it's a real pain in the arse to try and get in under the G60, there is no room. You will need 2 mounting pieces for the back of the head/rear motor mount. Here are the specs for one of them, the other just comes straight up from the rear motor mount. 


I have since gone to a alt on the back of the block, couldn't get the tension right for the charger and the belt slipped.
Under G60, make sure you get a tiny alt, like one from a suzuki sidekick.
Back of block, there are plans for the mounting plate on the yahoo group. I think BBM also sells that part on it's own.

_Quote »_
2) With alt in different spot, serpentine belt needs changing. With alt under G60, you need an idler pulley between waterpump and alt to get grip on the waterpump (belt goes right across from crank) and you can use a 8v timing belt tensioner for tension, mounted where the old tensioner swing arm used to be. 
3) Crank pulley - G60 timing gear is narrower than the 16v one and offsets the G60 crank pulley. Get an 2L 8v crank pulley and get it shaved 6mm. 


You can now get them from places like BBM as well.
The Ford Escort one (EDIS) comes pretty damn close as well. It would have to be drilled out to fit, but it seems to line up (untested). And you could easily run MSnS.

_Quote »_
4) waterpump pulley - get one from a G60 Passat with no AC, fits there perfectly. 


I ended up getting one from an ABA and flipping over, fit perfectly and is cheaper.
It has no grooves.

_Quote »_
5) Fuel rail and injectors. You'll need an aftermarket fuelrail *available from Kompressor Kanada*. Get some #30 Bosch redtops to fuel the car. You will also need G60 injector inserts to put into the intake manifold. 


This engine can prove to be a little more thirsty, I'm currently running Bosch 42# green tops (Ford motorsport)

_Quote »_
6) Scirocco 16v intake manifold is a must. 


You can get an Audi S2 intake, it comes very close to fitting, bolts up and just needs one runner cut off and a TB place welded on.
Scirocco one is easier IMO.

_Quote »_
7) Digifant - need to get custom chip, talk to Dave at KK, he does SNS chips here in Canada and they can cut you a 16vG60 chip with 30# injectors. You will also need to change the watertemp sensor, I have the part number somewhere. Make sure that you can mount the CO pot into the upper IC tube. Digifant MAP vacuum tube MUST be 1 metre exactly. 


Engine management, if you don't have digi-1, MegaSquirt, SDS etc are viable options, especially if you plan to install cams etc.
You'll need an auto G60 TB.

_Quote »_
8) Intake elbow - custom part, I have a diagram for one, needed to clear distributor. 


BBM offers these now IIRC.
Not needed with short tube intake

_Quote »_
9) recirc tube, needs to be shortened...although I recommend removing it altogether and capping the charger off. 


I've since gone back to recircing, it can get a little noisy.

_Quote »_
10) coolant hoses - mix and match of G60 and 16v, upper rad hose needs to be lengthened. If going into Mk2, 16v set should work fine as motor came in that car. 
11) Compression, 16v engines have way to much for forced induction. I used stacked gaskets, you can either use forged pistons or a KK provided ABA metal gasket. 


A stack of 2 ABA metal gaskets is fine for this engine (long block 16v)

_Quote »_
12) Spark plugs, Bosch F5DSR or F5DP Plugs. 


I ran bosch 6's with no problems.

_Quote »_
13) Crank case breather in is now in the block, not the head, so you'll need to route that. 


I recommend venting the head as well and running a catch can.
Easiest method is probably to use the NB 2L breather oil cap.

_Quote »_
14) Block need to be drilled for G60 oil return line. 


You could run it to the oil pan as well, but the G60 factory return line probably wouldn't fit.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

it just looked so close to fitting








i looked on bbm site and didnt find the rear mount's on there alone . will take a look on the yahoo group to see the specs on making them . thanks - allen


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_
Here is an unfinished web page that will be posted on the SNS site from a locally built 16V G60 that was put together in December. The dyno plot is a stock 2L 16V head with stacked headgaskets and Autotech cams. I'll get around to finishing it, sometime this week. Pretty damned fun in a mk2 GTi







.
http://www.snstuning.com/Digi1...h.htm


So, does this mean that soon SNS will be selling a chip for a 16vG60?


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_
So, does this mean that soon SNS will be selling a chip for a 16vG60?










Please say YES!!


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*

A very nice chip, too.







.
42# 3.5 bar fpr, 68mm pulley (poor charger)
stacked Headgasket 9A block with 2L 16V head
stock cams, or Autotech Cams
214whp sounds promising when it's scratching the surface of the 16VG60 potential
In the coming weeks, the car should receive a 50mm intake, so we'll see what it's worth on this setup at the dyno.
Hopefully, by this summer, the car might have a worked 1.8L 16V head to throw down some even better #s.


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_A very nice chip, too.







.
42# 3.5 bar fpr, 68mm pulley (poor charger)
stacked Headgasket 9A block with 2L 16V head
stock cams, or Autotech Cams
214whp sounds promising when it's scratching the surface of the 16VG60 potential
In the coming weeks, the car should receive a 50mm intake, so we'll see what it's worth on this setup at the dyno.
Hopefully, by this summer, the car might have a worked 1.8L 16V head to throw down some even better #s.

Well, as soon as you'd like, I'd like to be the first customer for that chip. I have a very similar setup, except I have a G60 1.9 block and the 50mm intake. I'm weeks away from competing it but I'm sans chip so I'm REALLY looking forward to your chip.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

214whp, cool, very close to DougG60's numbers.
Any dyno sheet?


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

THis is the road tune. Had to add a bit of fuel at the very top since then, but nothing major.
Sorry 'bout the huge image.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

url?


----------



## StaggerLee (Mar 12, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_In the coming weeks, the car should receive a 50mm intake, so we'll see what it's worth on this setup at the dyno.


My my, but we _are_ an incestuous little bunch, aren't we.








Here's my dyno with an SNS 42# program on 13psi. (Lysholm)


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (StaggerLee)*

werd, you know where the intake is coming from







.
How far along are you on the new project??


----------



## DougG60 (Nov 4, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (StaggerLee)*

what engine are you running that you managed 211 with the lysholm. i made those same # on my very first dyno run stock cams, ic 30lb inj and digi around 6400rpm with the neuspeed chip


----------



## StaggerLee (Mar 12, 2001)

It's a PG block that's been bored to 83mm, 9:1 compression and a pretty healthy port job. Stock cams.


----------



## DougG60 (Nov 4, 2000)

*Re: (StaggerLee)*

you and everyone else need to try dual exhaust cams, the engine loves it. i was up to 219whp with a 72mm pulley at 7500rpm around 9psi. 268's would be fun but dual exhaust are too cheap to pass up


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Guys....good news : *$600US*


I JUST TALKED WITH BBM , I CAN GET THESE FOR 399 USD FROM THEM


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (DougG60)*

LEE, are the alt mounts ready to sell yet? just looking to get 1st dibs on them . thanks .


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_
I JUST TALKED WITH BBM , I CAN GET THESE FOR 399 USD FROM THEM 

What about just the Alt mounts?


----------



## StaggerLee (Mar 12, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_
I JUST TALKED WITH BBM , I CAN GET THESE FOR 399 USD FROM THEM 

I dunno man, I just talked to their sales guy 5 minutes ago and he called Bullsheet on that story...
First you call me out on a public forum, and then you want dibs on the brackets....


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (StaggerLee)*

hey lee, didnt mean to get anyone upset , but i have the email saved that i got from the sale tech. he said it is the brackets and the only thing it doesnt come with it the stock tensioner. yes i really want to buy your brackets , but i am not going to over pay for them .


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

does anyone know if the 16v timing belt is the same lenght as a 8v ? just checking , i can messusre the heads to see if the 16v is taller then the 8v but maybe you guys know for sure . i am almost sure they are the same size ( but with different teeth ) thanks and lets keep up this post .


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

Not sure if they are the same length. It depends on the tensioners and the pitch of the teeth. Why does it matter? The 16V requires a slightly wider belt, so they aren't really compatible with any 8V belts... unless you want to chance bending all 16pretty valves by possibly snapping an overworked belt.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

so you think that a 8v belt will be over worked? i have a 9a bottomend that i used to run a 8v head on ( supper high compresion ) and now i am building one of these for my new corrado , but i didnt want to have to change out my oil pump , inter. shaft ( it is shaved and balanced ) , and i have a l/w interm. gear . ( i was runing the 8v set up on the motor before ) 
plus i wanted to keep the dis. in the block not the head. i didnt think about the belt holding up to the power . what do you all think ? will an 8v belt hold up to a 16v g60


----------



## StaggerLee (Mar 12, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_ will an 8v belt hold up to a 16v g60

You can't run a 8v belt with a 16v cam gear. 
No worky.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (StaggerLee)*

found a way around it , i am useing the middle of a 16v adj cam gear and the out side of a adj 8v cam gear.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote »_ what do you all think ? will an 8v belt hold up to a 16v g60

I'd have to say use the 16v timing belt, VW must have gone with a wider timing belt for a very good reason.


----------



## StaggerLee (Mar 12, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
I'd have to say use the 16v timing belt, VW must have gone with a wider timing belt for a very good reason.

I'm inclined to agree; the 16v belt is much beefier than the 8v belt. Engineers don't just change things like that for no particular reason.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (StaggerLee)*

good point . looks like i got to find a 16v oil pump, pump gear, and intmed. shaft


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

wait , i thought there was a way to keep my dist. in the block , and not have it in the head? is this true and how do i do that ?


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
The End Result courtesy of *OttawaG60*:










Does ANYONE know where I can get that beautiful U-shaped G60 outlet piece. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I want to run a front mount on my G60 16v and that looks like the best piece to start with. I remember it being hard to fine, but anyone know where? Please help!


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_A very nice chip, too.







.
42# 3.5 bar fpr, 68mm pulley (poor charger)
stacked Headgasket 9A block with 2L 16V head
stock cams, or Autotech Cams
214whp sounds promising when it's scratching the surface of the 16VG60 potential
In the coming weeks, the car should receive a 50mm intake, so we'll see what it's worth on this setup at the dyno.
Hopefully, by this summer, the car might have a worked 1.8L 16V head to throw down some even better #s.

I have those 42# injectors with with a 3.5 bar FPR and a similar setup but more air (ported TB and head, Cams, 50mm intake, headers). Should I go 4.0 bar FPR or will that be overkill? After all, I wlll be using your chip.








Also, what's the deal with those FPR's that are boost sensitive, like EIP sells. Is that worth the time/money?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_
Does ANYONE know where I can get that beautiful U-shaped G60 outlet piece. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I want to run a front mount on my G60 16v and that looks like the best piece to start with. I remember it being hard to fine, but anyone know where? Please help!

I believe Bahn Brenner sells them,Or you can custom make one http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Now for the Conrods you can use your stock *PG G60* rods but it is recommended that you use *PL 16V* Rods + Custom Pistons due to the fact that your rod ratio using the PG rods will be too short.


Oops! I left the G60 rods in my conversion. Is that going to be a problem? What's the result of doing that?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_
Oops! I left the G60 rods in my conversion. Is that going to be a problem? What's the result of doing that?

Smaller Rod Ratio


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Smaller Rod Ratio

And that means... ?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_
Does ANYONE know where I can get that beautiful U-shaped G60 outlet piece. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I want to run a front mount on my G60 16v and that looks like the best piece to start with. I remember it being hard to fine, but anyone know where? Please help!

ebay.de, that's where I got mine from


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_
And that means... ?









Your building a *PL G60* or a *PG G60*?You always want to utilise the rod ratio (longer the conrod you can get,the better,in this case 144mm as apposed to 136mm)

_Quote, originally posted by *Not2Fast* »_
Taken from this site:
*PG - 1.8 8V G60* : 
Compression Ratio = *8:1*
*Rod Length = 136mm*
Wrist Pin Diamater = 22mm
Bore = 81mm
*9A - 2.0 16V* : 
Compression Ratio = *10.8:1*
Rod Length = 144mm
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm
Bore = 82.5mm
*PL - 1.8 16V* : 
Compression Ratio = *10:1*
*Rod Length = 144mm*
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm
Bore = 81mm


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
ebay.de, that's where I got mine from

Thanks for the tip! I never realized that such a great resource was out there. I guess I need to start learning German now


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Your building a *PL G60* or a *PG G60*?You always want to utilise the rod ratio (longer the conrod you can get,the better,in this case 144mm as apposed to 136mm)


I have a PG G60 block which has a 1.8 16v head on it. I kept the stock G60 rods. Why do I want to keep the rod ratio? What is the disadvantage of not doing so? Why do I want a longer rod? Sorry for me being so ignorant. I'm new to this. Thanks for understanding.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_I have a PG G60 block which has a 1.8 16v head on it. I kept the stock G60 rods. Why do I want to keep the rod ratio? What is the disadvantage of not doing so? Why do I want a longer rod? Sorry for me being so ignorant. I'm new to this. Thanks for understanding.

Woa...what pistons are you using?


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Woa...what pistons are you using?

The custom Ross pistons that BahnBrenner sells with its 16v G60 conversion kit. BBM never mentioned anything about changing the conrods.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_
The custom Ross pistons that BahnBrenner sells with its 16v G60 conversion kit. BBM never mentioned anything about changing the conrods.

Didnt know you were staying with the 1.8 Stroke.Rule of thumb is the greater the rod length the better the rod ratio.
Should be fine


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Didnt know you were staying with the 1.8 Stroke.Rule of thumb is the greater the rod length the better the rod ratio.
Should be fine

Yeah, same stroke, but little larger piston. One more question. "Better the rod ratio." What does that mean? Basically, in laymen's terms, what exactly is the benefit of good rod ratio??


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corrado79* »_
Yeah, same stroke, but little larger piston. One more question. "Better the rod ratio." What does that mean? Basically, in laymen's terms, what exactly is the benefit of good rod ratio??

*Rod Ratio = Rod Length/Stroke*
Since your stroke isnt changing (*86.4mm*) then the only thing you can do to increase your rod ratio is to increase the length of the con rod.A longer con rod creates a narrower Rod : Piston angle when the piston is halfway down the cylinder ,causing less friction which means a smaller force is needed to move the piston.With a larger rod : piston angle there is more vibration in the engine.
Just simple mechanics


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Corrado79)*

if i dont need the bbm water neck seeing that i will be runing a G not the twin screw. then where do i plug in the sensors ? i noticed that my 2L 16v head has two sensors on the side of the head , ( by that water neck , ) is that where i plug them in to . ? thanks


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
*Rod Ratio = Rod Length/Stroke*
Since your stroke isnt changing (*86.4mm*) then the only thing you can do to increase your rod ratio is to increase the length of the con rod.A longer con rod creates a narrower Rod : Piston angle when the piston is halfway down the cylinder ,causing less friction which means a smaller force is needed to move the piston.With a larger rod : piston angle there is more vibration in the engine.
Just simple mechanics

AH! I see now. Thanks for the explanation http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*









built a spacer to fit this VW flange to hold the blue coolant temp sensor for the Digi-1 setup.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

is that on the side of the head , or the front ( looks like the side ) so i cannt just plug the blue sensor connector into the sensors that is on the side of my head . it comes out of the side water neck , so it will read water . 
do you understand me , after reading this , it doesnt seem to be clean . let me know if yu understand what i am talkig about as for the plug on the side water neck . thanks


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

Side of the head, above the transmission.
The blue coolant temp sensor for the Digi-1 ECU has a different range of resistance between hot and cold than most of the 16V Motronic/CIS coolant temp sensors. A simple spacer and a new waterneck from VW will get the job done.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

what is the water neck from ? did you cnc the adaptor ? dont know how i would make one. thanks you had the right answer.


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

mr watts is all G'd up in the G-code y0.
maybe he saved his g-files, heh.


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (mrkrad)*

hahah... no CNC, just used the 16V flange and the other one to determine where the holes went. I did use a mill to pop the larger hole for the water passage, but a drill press, or a hand drill and vise with an appropriate sized bit can do the job. 
-Drill the larger, water passage hole first, then determine the locations for the bolt holes using both flanges. 
-Make sure the O-ring on the new flange will clear the big hole and mark location for the bolt holes. 
-Drill the bolt holes out.
-Bolt the new flange using those bolt holes and trace its outline.
-Cut it out with the band saw. 
-Test fit on the side of the head to determine if you need to notch it for clearance from the sensors bolted nearby.
-A belt sander, or flapper wheel on a hand grinder can be used to dress the cut edges. 
-Cut a paper gasket to go between the adapter and head, then bolt it on and go







.
I could use some G-Code to pop some adapters out, but I can't justify spending the time and effort on it when I can make one in about 30 minutes.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

thanks for the drections, what is the flange off of ? which car . so i can find one , sounds easy to make the adaptor. thanks again


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

not sure which car it came off of, or what the exact part # is. I just asked the parts guy to bring out all the water necks that would fit the Digi blue coolant temp sensor so I could choose the one with the same bolt pattern as the 16V waterneck. It's been a while, but it looks just like the one in the picture of my motor







.


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

what kind of time does this take? or shall i say, if you were to charge for it, what would you charge labor wise. i have a customer who would like this done and i'm learning about the process and stuff from this thread and others. just kinda wanna know so i can be competitive.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (CORRADOFREEK)*

From scratch or installing the kit?


----------



## G60RRADO (Nov 30, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_not sure which car it came off of, or what the exact part # is. I just asked the parts guy to bring out all the water necks that would fit the Digi blue coolant temp sensor so I could choose the one with the same bolt pattern as the 16V waterneck. It's been a while, but it looks just like the one in the picture of my motor







.

pn of waterneck 068 121 144
just read this whole thread. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for more 16v g60's


----------



## all-starr-me (Jul 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

I'm gonna use a 3A bottom end with a 9A head, anyone want to speculate on the compression ratio of that? I'd use an ABA but I want to fit it in a Rabbit.


----------



## all-starr-me (Jul 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

the 3A's clearanced for the 2 valves.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (all-starr-me)*

i love this post . 
just to throw it out there in here . any one have afuel rail for sale ? i have a little time till i need it so i am just looking around for one . thanks. just looking to save a little cash .


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (all-starr-me)*


_Quote, originally posted by *all-starr-me* »_the 3A's clearanced for the 2 valves.

3A Pistons dont need a clearance. 8V = Non interferance motor.I was just saying the 3A Block = 9A Block.Same Block,different stamp #'s


----------



## all-starr-me (Jul 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

I know the blocks are identical, I'm just looking for a lower compresion ratio using stock parts to handle the extra boost from the g-ladder and 68mm pulley.


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

That looks similar to what I got in the BBM kit, fitted both buts to my KR.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (KeithMac)*

anyone want to host a pic of my mock-up???
ABF G60...
anyone???


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*

When will yours be running?


----------



## r6fireman1996 (Jan 22, 2004)

W


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

it will be a few weeks yet...i'm currently trying to get a work visa for the united states...it's keeping me busy.
i have to finish the header (the reas of the mandrel bends arrived today in the mail) and i have to hit up my friend for an alternator and a corrado rad. the intercooler should only take a day or two (air to water) and the wiring should be another day or two. 
i'll keep everyone posted...
thanks for the chip danny...
m.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

herby53-akaherby53
i have one for sale...IM and we'll talk.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*

im returned , thanks .


----------



## Corrado79 (Jul 5, 2001)

*New Question - 16vG60 Engine is not level*

Not to change topics (actually, yes), but I dropped my 16vG60 into my Corrado and it looks like the engine is leaning toward the right (i.e. lower on the driver's side than passenger's side). Is this slant normal?? Thanks!


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: New Question - 16vG60 Engine is not level (Corrado79)*

My mk2 golf engine slants, later gearboxes have the oil filler hole 20mm or so higher to compensate..


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

specs:
-ABA OBD I block
-9A pistons on ABA rods
-9:1 compression (approx.)
-2L 16V head
-42# injectors
-stage 4 KK supercharger 68mm pulley, 3" outlet
-SNS digi I software (stock cams, 3.5bar FPR, etc.)
-all brackets/welding/machining done by me. including the fuel rail and header.
props to david at KK and danny at SNS for the hook-ups so far.
props to issam for hosting the pics. i don't have the time to hook up a host right now as all my spare time is going toward getting my work visa in the u.s.a.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*

MA_XXX, you bringing it to dyno day for a little 16vG60 head to head action?


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

we'll have to see if i can get it running first...it looks like we're going to be be ridiculously busy at momentum tuning this summer.
all the projects on the schedule are pretty involved and as always...our personal ones will have to take a back seat. i'm going to try my best to have this one running for the CVA spring dust-off in CT.
i have ALOT of work to do!!!










_Modified by MA_XXX at 8:29 AM 3-5-2005_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_MA_XXX, you bringing it to dyno day for a little 16vG60 head to head action?

where is Dyno Day going to be held? In Ottawa?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
where is Dyno Day going to be held? In Ottawa?

OVD annual Dynoday, we have it every year in late May or early June.


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Cracking work there! Noticed you mounted the alternator the wrong way round, have you altered it internally, will it still work? Never seen a 16vG60 with the alternator in that position, excellent idea!


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (KeithMac)*

it works exactly as it should without modification. 
i saw it done plenty of times by old school hot-rodders to clean up the engine bay and thought it would solve alot of problems.
thanks btw...
m.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*

Jerome seen this before?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Jerome seen this before?


Yep, I think they were posted to the 16vG60 group.
Interesting cogged belt setup.


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

hey Wizard of OD
where did you get these pics? 
i'm in the middle of doing a cogged belt setup, and am missing some stuff in order to make it work..... 
i wish i could use a smaller belt, but the pitch of the toothed belt and sprockets is unlike anything available out on the mkt.

any help much appreciated
david


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (N_TENSETUNING)*

I bought all my cog belts from SciroccoR.He doesnt have anymore though...
maybe if there was an interest a machine guy may be able to make them?


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

thank you for the prompt post,
i'm just curious.... what belt are you running, any part#'s .... mine is alot longer... and it is a gates t098.... nothing else matches this....
how many belts did he include with the cogs..... or did he tell you where you could get shorter belts... etc...

this is a pretty unique setup.... looks like just you and I are the only ones running this setup








david


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (N_TENSETUNING)*

I still have to buy my belt.I am actually looking for a belt that is longer than the original VWMS 64"

The pulleys I bought
I have not decided yet which path I am going to take.Either the original or the Red Path.Does gates have belts in all sizes?


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

that toothed belt in your setup doesn't look bad.... but there are only maybe 4-5 teeth grabbing the waterpump cog... 
mine is alot longer..... i've spent a good month trying to source belts that were in the same specs as the gates t098 belt.... nothing comes close..... 
i must have gone through several hundred belts at napa, acme, etc...
so I had to come up with various pullies to make the belt fit properly... but it still didn't work out quite good








take a look at the gates website http://www.gates.com and look at the t098 timing belt... that will give you the specs on my belt.... i'm sure we have the same cogs..... 
p/s if you gave me a number on your belt, we could do some further digging
david


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (N_TENSETUNING)*

yes but my setup is going on an 8V not a 16V
take a picture of your engine and maybe we can work out something.....would be nice to see the path you want to take.


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i'll take some pics soon.... 
but who's 16v-g60 with the cogged setup does that belong to?
any more pics of that?
so no part #'s on your belt? contitech or gates???
david


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (N_TENSETUNING)*


_Quote, originally posted by *N_TENSETUNING* »_
but who's 16v-g60 with the cogged setup does that belong to?
any more pics of that?

Some guy in Toronto,Jerome would have more knowledge of it than me.I just came across those pictures and I posted what I had

_Quote, originally posted by *N_TENSETUNING* »_
so no part #'s on your belt? contitech or gates???

Have not purchased the belt as yet.The VWMS gears have the same tooth pitch as the 16V/20V belts which are the same as the Honda Belts/many other Japanese brands.Take a piece of string and wrap it around your cogs and go into Pepboys/Napa and start searching.
Please post pictures of your gear setup asap
Kinda excited... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

okay ... then we have a totally different pitch in coggs.... because i checked every single timing belt that vw and audi use.... nothing comes close.... 
i'll I.M you
david


----------



## Kaddy (Sep 29, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_



I really like that setup, except for the amount of wrap (or lack there-of) on the waterpump. Definitely more likely to shear teeth of the belt at high rpm then with more wrap on the pulley. An idler would help out.
Where can the cogged pullies be sourced from?
I'm not so sure about the owner being from Toronto though, the pics are definitely look to be from europe, although the pics are hosted at VWoT..? Only 16vG60's in the GTA that I know of are mine and Marek's (not sure if he still has his).
Edit: Just looked at some more of the engine pics, looks like the car the engine has the MC mounted on the right side, so right hand drive. Definitely not a Toronto car.


_Modified by Kaddy at 10:50 PM 3-11-2005_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Kaddy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Kaddy* »_
Where can the cogged pullies be sourced from?

Jabba sport sells and I have seen kits on here once in a blue moon for as high as $800US.
I am wondering if gates can custom make belts?
More pictures I found on Hostdub:


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i'm not sure that the trouble of a cogged belt set-up is worth all the effort...if you have the serpentine belt routed properly there shouldn't be any problem with slippage. 
of course...if it's being done simply because it's BLING NASTY then alright


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i told ya (wizard of OD),
there is no way you will find anything vw or audi that will fit those belts.... the pitch is way off...
believe me ... i spent a good month looking into all of this.
the only way you are going to get the proper belts is to have (sciroccoR) read you off the part#'s off his old belts.
or use the one i'm using... gates t098
i did find industrial belts the proper sizing, but the teeth were not deep enough.... it would shread in a matter of secs.....

d


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (N_TENSETUNING)*


_Quote, originally posted by *N_TENSETUNING* »_
or use the one i'm using... gates t098

Does this belt come in 64" long?
My apologies before.I was going by what I was told until we actually carried out a practical.
This is all Peter had to say:

_Quote, originally posted by *SciroccoR* »_
The belt length is about 64”. The number on the belt is 58174X25mm. It is a gates belt Power grip HTD and was made in germany.


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i believe the gates t098 is much longer than that.... i have the specs at home... you can also find the full specs on it at http://www.gates.com
it's a pity that peter didn't have any actual part#'s though.... 
hey wizard of od.... maybe we should keep our stuff off this thread as it isn't relevant to any of the others. 
Feel free to I.M. me
look forward to getting the belts thing squared away
david


----------



## Volk14 (Oct 18, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Do you happen to have some info on this intake? It's obvious is a custom intake but it looks pretty clean, like it came from factory.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Volk14)*

Same intake I have.
Audi S2 or RS2, cut to fit


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Volk14)*

that is a factory audi 5cyl 20v manifold (came on audi 100's turbo)
they cut the 5th runner off and tigged a new flange on the end to accept that g60 tb
definately custom.... and nicely smoothed

oh... that fuel rail looks like a 1.8t one, with longer ends

david


----------



## CHRGD_MK2 (Aug 22, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (N_TENSETUNING)*


_Quote, originally posted by *N_TENSETUNING* »_that is a factory audi 5cyl 20v manifold (came on audi 100's turbo)
they cut the 5th runner off and tigged a new flange on the end to accept that g60 tb
definately custom.... and nicely smoothed

oh... that fuel rail looks like a 1.8t one, with longer ends

david

Almost right Dave







Audi 200's what kinda of audi parts guy are you?







200's were turbo's 100's were not.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Volk14)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Volk14* »_like it came from factory.

It did








Audi Inline 5 20V Turbo Intake Manifold that has been chopped.
Audi 200T - 3B
Audi S2 - ABY
Audi RS2 - ADU
Choose your engine code and go hunting


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

another way to do the cog belt set-up is to use timing gears from a TDi or something. the only problem with that is you're extremely limited as to the size of the supercharger pulley...momentum tuning solved this problem by running two G-laders to effectively double the boost...mated to an ABA block and head; this engine is a killer. walks all over M5's from 60-100mph. 
check it http://momentumtuning.com/site...ject2/


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*

oops.... typo..... i mean audi 200's turbo
thanks chiarappi/mk2 charged
p/s i'm now a parts guys that doesn't do audi ....to answer your question...

give me a call at home and i'll fill you in

david


----------



## LooseNut (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

It seems like some low end torque (off boost) would be lost with those short intake manifolds. Has anyone actually been able to compare? I like how the short ones look and that they're not over the hot valve cover but wouldn't want it to decrease performance at all.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (LooseNut)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LooseNut* »_It seems like some low end torque (off boost) would be lost with those short intake manifolds. Has anyone actually been able to compare? I like how the short ones look and that they're not over the hot valve cover but wouldn't want it to decrease performance at all.

That is the theory, but with a supercharger, as soon as you lay into the throttle, you're in boost, so I would assume that you could compensate with just adding a little more throttle, if there is a noticeable loss at all.


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

In my case, I did a short runner and AT cams at the same time. The midrange torque wasn't affected compared to the factory intake with stock cams (220-230ft-lbs ~4500 rpm for both). The new combo pulls much harder for another 1000 rpm, at least on the top end, though.


----------



## BlownGTT (May 14, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

Has anyone had problems of higher runing oil pressures on the 16v and causing damaged oil seals on the charger? Do 16v usually run higher pressures than the g60?
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## LooseNut (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_In my case, I did a short runner and AT cams at the same time. The midrange torque wasn't affected compared to the factory intake with stock cams (220-230ft-lbs ~4500 rpm for both). The new combo pulls much harder for another 1000 rpm, at least on the top end, though.

yeah, but you guys are talking about on boost. I really hate the sluggishness of a low compression/displacement motor while off boost in stop and go traffic.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (BlownGTT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BlownGTT* »_Has anyone had problems of higher runing oil pressures on the 16v and causing damaged oil seals on the charger? Do 16v usually run higher pressures than the g60?
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

If you get the feed from the back of the head, it's ok, I tried it from the front oil flange, popped a seal.


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
If you get the feed from the back of the head, it's ok, I tried it from the front oil flange, popped a seal.

thats when using the 16v block and not the g60 block?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (CORRADOFREEK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CORRADOFREEK* »_thats when using the 16v block and not the g60 block? 

Same difference.The Oil pressure @ the head whether 16V or 8V is going to be lower than that @ the oil filter flange.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (CORRADOFREEK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CORRADOFREEK* »_
thats when using the 16v block and not the g60 block? 

Yes, I am using the 9A long block.


----------



## BlownGTT (May 14, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

so you actually drill the block? WHere abouts is this? is regarding a 9a block http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (BlownGTT)*

there is a hole for it right where the one is for the g60 block , you just need to drill it all the way . ( it is right near the oil filter , tothe left of it ) 
i have a 9a and need to drill mine also . i chose to not drill the pan . 

sorry , thought you where talkign about the oil return line .








i was just gonna get my oil from the side f the head , but if this is the case , where do i get hte feed line from on the back of the head ?

_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 1:33 PM 4-19-2005_


_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 1:34 PM 4-19-2005_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_ where do i get hte feed line from on the back of the head ?

Where the stock Oil pressure switch is?


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

forgot to ask, using the pg block, can i use the 16v trans? for some reason my mind is saying no due to the clutch flywheel setups


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (CORRADOFREEK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CORRADOFREEK* »_forgot to ask, using the pg block, can i use the 16v trans? for some reason my mind is saying no due to the clutch flywheel setups

Clutch disc is all the you need to change, output shaft is different between the 2 trans.


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

disregard the statment made earlier, it was late, and i was looking at a vr6 flywheel instead of the g60 flywheel


_Modified by CORRADOFREEK at 5:20 PM 4-29-2005_


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

so i have a problem
i have some pistons that the customer supplied, that he was told were for the g60 block setup. so i started building the pg block and sent the block out to get bored and what not. now as i start assembling everything, i find the pistons are made for the smaller wrist pin of the 16v. now i know the rod journals are the same size so i could use the 16v rod on the g60 crank. but the rod is longer then the g60 rod. will the shorter piston and longer rod setup work in the g60block with the 16v head? this customer is getting pissed off at me here cause it's all ****ed up. so i just wanna get this done. anyone know?


----------



## candela (Oct 19, 2002)

beautiful..


----------



## phantommaggot (Mar 5, 2005)

*Re: (candela!)*

i asked about the best set up for my car a while back and was pointed here.
i was also told that i could use an aba block
is this true
and what is the best head to run on this block...
pref 16v
if not, what is the best, most stable setup for a 2.0 16v

its just a quick question sorry if i could have searched it, im studying for my exams dont really have time.. 
if im gonna start buying parts
i wanna get what works 
and there is nothing more important than double checking


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (phantommaggot)*


_Quote, originally posted by *phantommaggot* »_i asked about the best set up for my car a while back and was pointed here.
i was also told that i could use an aba block
is this true


ABA with a 16v head is known as an ABF, search the forced induction forum for the info thread on what's involved in building that motor.

_Quote »_
and what is the best head to run on this block...
pref 16v
if not, what is the best, most stable setup for a 2.0 16v


ABF (ABA block + 16v head) has about 8:1 compression, a bit low for a 16vG60, remember that the G60 can only flow enough to get about 10-12 psi on a 16vG60.

_Quote »_
its just a quick question sorry if i could have searched it, im studying for my exams dont really have time.. 
if im gonna start buying parts
i wanna get what works 
and there is nothing more important than double checking 

I'd recommend reading my howTo, it covers just all you need to know about this swap.


----------



## phantommaggot (Mar 5, 2005)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

thanks.. 
im gonna run a BBm screw chager on it 
and id like to be able to run alot of boost..


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (phantommaggot)*

remember that you don't need alot of boost if you're flowing enough.
incidentally... i own an ABF G60.
yes it's done. and, i'm driving it.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

i've misplaced your email address.
[email protected]


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

yeah i built that TB set-up for a customer of mine...i was going to use a similar set-up but it wouldn't have been right for my project. TB's shift the torque too far up the rev range.
the lower pictures are the current set-up. it seems to need some more tuning but, so far it's a real monster. 
thanks for the host


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*

I saw that car over the weekend, super clean install.
I can't get over how little wiring there is compared to mine.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_yeah i built that TB set-up for a customer of mine...

Jerry


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

i just received a compliment from jwatts too !!!
i tried to hide everything as much as possible. i like everything in life to be succinct!!!
some parts are a little gangster but, i have plans to fix all the little bits i don't like. basically the car is running and ready for tuning.
thank you!!!


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Jerry









yeah i guess so?!?! don't remember his name. haven't seen him since!!!
according to mr watts i'm going to have to adjust the WOT switch or, incorporate a hobbs switch since i'm using a 710N instead of a traditional recirc.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_
yeah i guess so?!?! don't remember his name. haven't seen him since!!!
according to mr watts i'm going to have to adjust the WOT switch or, incorporate a hobbs switch since i'm using a 710N instead of a traditional recirc. 

Interesting how much they have travelled.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*


_Quote »_
according to mr watts i'm going to have to adjust the WOT switch or, incorporate a hobbs switch since i'm using a 710N instead of a traditional recirc. 

Why is that?


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

the way the chip is written, it gets a bit more fuel with the WOT, even though the O2 is turned off at 1-3psi. We programmed it for 13:1 at WOT with the charger disconnected and interpolated to a stock 78mm pulley, then a 68mm to see 12-12.5:1 throught the rev range at WOT. 1-5psi can see between 13-14:1 without the WOT engaged. The bypass on the G60 TB makes you really move the pedal to get into the boost, while the diverter valve Maxx is using will give full boost at 1/4 pedal. The chip was also written on a stacked HG 9a with the 9a head while Maxx has a 9a-pistoned ABA 16V. 
Since then the local 16V G60 Golf has gone through a couple more iterations. The first being a set of Autotech Cams to make 214whp at roughly 6500-6800 rpm (rev limit that day) with a max of 8-9psi. The current setup is a 1.8L head with some very nice, back-cut valves and some port work, along with a 50mm intake and the same AT cams. Just cut a new chip for it and we'll see what it doesn when dyno time arrives. The boost level dropped again, too. The 68mm pulley only generates 6psi until above 6800rpm, when it sees about 7-8psi by 7200..... poor charger







.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (jwatts)*

jwatts you run SNSTuning?


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

Myself and Mrkrad.


----------



## rallye driver (May 30, 2003)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*

are those throttle bodies from a toyota 4age 20v? they look similar


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (rallye driver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rallye driver* »_are those throttle bodies from a toyota 4age 20v? they look similar

yup








...Toyota Integration never looked so good (at least it isnt Honda right?







)


----------



## rallye driver (May 30, 2003)

true! now are they silvertop(43mm) or blacktop(47?mm) throttlebodies


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (rallye driver)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rallye driver* »_true! now are they silvertop(43mm) or blacktop(47?mm) throttlebodies

Silver's are 45mm tappered into a 43mm plate and Blacks are 49mm tappered into a 45mm plate.Depends which client but those I believe are Silver's.Doesnt really matter in terms of performance.


----------



## 16v-g60 (Feb 3, 2005)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

yet some pictures of mine:


----------



## 16v-g60 (Feb 3, 2005)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

nope! its an original stock vw filter


----------



## corrado16vg60 (Jun 20, 2005)

yelocorado do you have any pic of the motor in the car
what's the hp
what would be the best cam for this conversion


----------



## Kameirocco (Dec 20, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

reminds me of a cosworth http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i actually like it! 
now for the questions...... 
if i do the g60 16v route... 
does the tentioner bracketry and everything bolt up to the 16v? or is there other modification needed?
what size injectors would be stable? 
can i go with a regular large single butterfly TB if i put the TB before the intake of the supercharger? 
and last...
would i be able to fab up an intake so the supercharger itself can be the an actual piece of the manifold if i use the above idea/question? (basically the exhaust port of the S/C would be welded onto a shorty intake or something similar that way there will be no need to track down all that bracket goodness


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (Kameirocco)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Kameirocco* »_reminds me of a cosworth http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif i actually like it! 
now for the questions...... 
if i do the g60 16v route... 
does the tentioner bracketry and everything bolt up to the 16v? or is there other modification needed?


I'm using the stock tensioner, and depends on what kit you do, but everything bolts up, including the G60 bracket. VW's are very Mr.PotatoHead.

_Quote »_
what size injectors would be stable? 


Without much info, that's hard to answer, depends on what other mods you have.

_Quote »_
can i go with a regular large single butterfly TB if i put the TB before the intake of the supercharger? 


I'm using a mustang TB after the SC. TB type doesn't matter, it's more important that it has the TB has the connections you need for your engine management.

_Quote »_
would i be able to fab up an intake so the supercharger itself can be the an actual piece of the manifold if i use the above idea/question? (basically the exhaust port of the S/C would be welded onto a shorty intake or something similar that way there will be no need to track down all that bracket goodness









Sure you could, the SC is bolted to the block, so it doesn't move. But why customize a G60 like that? Hoses and Pipes are cheap and plentiful


----------



## Kameirocco (Dec 20, 2002)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

for the injectors... i wanna do a 2.0l 16v g60, prolly a P&P, a 268 cam and an adj cam gear, and i wanna run about 15lbs...
also! for the intake manifold thing. i wanna run more of a custom look, plus it would be kinda fun to make something up if i have some extra time http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
i also want to run an eaton.. that way if it blows, they are plentiful and cheap, that way i can practice without screwing toooo much up, does anyone know what boost the stock m62 runs on a 16v?
do you have any pics of the mustang TB? 
thanks again http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

edit, also with the BOV, i mount it right before the TB correct?


----------



## Nuprin (May 24, 1999)

Man, I jsut want to "bolt on" a better head. Why does this stuff have to be so freaking complicated! AND expensive.
:mad


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (Kameirocco)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Kameirocco* »_for the injectors... i wanna do a 2.0l 16v g60, prolly a P&P, a 268 cam and an adj cam gear, and i wanna run about 15lbs...


G60 can't flow enough air for 15 psi with that setup.
injectors, try 42# Bosch

_Quote »_
also! for the intake manifold thing. i wanna run more of a custom look, plus it would be kinda fun to make something up if i have some extra time http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


Custom fab one then.

_Quote »_
do you have any pics of the mustang TB? 
thanks again http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
edit, also with the BOV, i mount it right before the TB correct?


I have pics of the engine, nothing specific on the TB itself.
BOV/DV needs to be between the G60 and the TB somewhere.


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

crankcase vent- does anyone know where this piece on the oil fill cap came from?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (CORRADOFREEK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CORRADOFREEK* »_crankcase vent- does anyone know where this piece on the oil fill cap came from?

VW Bettle.


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

sweet, new or old?


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

nevermind, i found it
VW part # 06A 103 465 
and the cap is
vw part # 06A 103 485C


----------



## CORRADOFREEK (Jul 12, 2000)

*Re: (CORRADOFREEK)*

ok, just wanna check a few things.
my oil feed for the charger is off the back of the 16v head. there is a tapped hole that fit the stock fittings and looked like an oil gally. next, can i run the autometer oil pressure sensor off this or does it need to be on the oil filter flange where the other sensors are?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (CORRADOFREEK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CORRADOFREEK* »_ok, just wanna check a few things.
my oil feed for the charger is off the back of the 16v head. there is a tapped hole that fit the stock fittings and looked like an oil gally. next, can i run the autometer oil pressure sensor off this or does it need to be on the oil filter flange where the other sensors are?

I have an Autometer sensor on the back of the head where my feed line is.


----------



## Mademan5284 (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

I'm going 16v top and bottom. Now this alternator hitting the subframe thing. I would like to know how big is the area of the subframe that is or will contact the alternator. By reading the thread I am proposing to bend the piece out of the way or cut the subframe and then add a thicker u shaped piece of metal to bridge the gap. This will strengthen the cut out and protect the alternator. Oh of course there is no a/c. As far as brackets do i use the PG stock charger and alternator setup or Can I use the charger bracket and a non a/c alternator bracket from a non a/c golf or jetta II. If this is accomplished there should be no need for all those extra brackets and pullies. Hook up digi line up pullies and get proper serpentine.Plus manifold , which I'm wondering about those fiberglass impregnated nylon manifolds like on a neon. Just not a neon one but one that fits. Imagine the weight savings. BY the way I calculated that by porting a 40mm scirocco intake .20 inches all the way around for a total of .40 inches bigger inner diameter you will have 50mm intake runners.


----------



## rug (Apr 18, 2003)

*Re: (16v-g60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16v-g60* »_









Is that someones integration kit, or did you do that yourself? I like the idea of the pulley on top of the long serp belt over to the alternator.
Hope mine will look like that http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
/Carl


----------



## rmn (Sep 12, 2003)

where are you all taking the feed for the oil for the charger from?
Also who is running stand alone as opposed to G60 managemnet?


----------



## 16v-g60 (Feb 3, 2005)

*Re: (rug)*

its to prevent the belt from jumping. my own work...


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (16v-g60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16v-g60* »_its to prevent the belt from jumping. my own work...

Did you have problems with it jumping?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (rmn)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rmn* »_where are you all taking the feed for the oil for the charger from?
Also who is running stand alone as opposed to G60 managemnet?

*oil feed* back of the head, I've tried it from other locations, ended up popping seals in the charger.
*stand-alone* I'm currently running MegsSquirtNSpark -E on mine, have run SDS in the past.


----------



## rug (Apr 18, 2003)

*Re: (16v-g60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16v-g60* »_its to prevent the belt from jumping. my own work...

same q as Ottawa, ever jump the belt? 
I think the VW engine had that pulley also (but you can't see it under that belt cover), but I haven't seen any of the integration kits use this.
/Carl


----------



## 16v-g60 (Feb 3, 2005)

*Re: (rug)*

no never jumped the belt. but the weel prevents the belt to be woren down when runing idle.


----------



## XKROMX (Apr 4, 2003)

*Re: (16v-g60)*

Hey If you guy's are interested I have a full custon set up for a 16v g60-Lysholm ready to go(for the record it was the first self built kit running in the us).Compleate motor,with Pauter rod's JE 9/1 pistons schrick oil pan custom built bracketry for the alternator below the charger unit and belt system done correclty no belt slip with alternator on the rear of head. .Im trying to find a stock G060 motor with charger and ecu to go back to stock,cause Im over this thing.


----------



## Samzik (Jul 8, 2004)

*Re: (16v-g60)*

What injectors should i run if im planing to use eaton m62, with cluch. As it is used on mercedes. I plan to do it this way, that when i hit throtle on the floor, then the charger will work (turned on, cluch closed) when i drive usual light throtle it will not work. Oh and i blan to do swich if i go past 3000 rpm it would turn charger on.
I think i go for megasquirt for fueling, cos as i understand the digi 1 cant handel 2 engine modes: one charged one not. i plan to run stock eaton/mercedes i think its 87mm pulley. they talk about 500cfm with this charger. So any sugjestions?
Thansk guyz, regards Rain.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (Samzik)*

I'm running a 68mm on my G60, and I'm running 42# injectors.
I worked it out using http://rceng.com/technical.htm#WORKSHEET


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: (Samzik)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Samzik* »_What injectors should i run if im planing to use eaton m62, with cluch. 
I think i go for megasquirt for fueling, cos as i understand the digi 1 cant handel 2 engine modes: one charged one not. 

42# w/ 3.5bar fpr has been a good match for most 16V charged applications. 
Not sure what modes you're talkin' about for digi-1. The maps are both pressure and rpm dependent... vac thru 0psi = non-boosted. 
IIRC, the stock merc m62 pulley was set for about 5-6psi on the 2.3. I'm guessing might get you 6-8psi, at the most on the dub 16V.


----------



## ntonar (Nov 21, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

I am getting ready to join the 16v g60 club... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I have a extra complete g60 swap I got for 300$ (charger is going to KK for a stage 4), and I am in the process of buying a 1.8 16v with 80,000 miles for 200$. That should get me started.


----------



## G60syncro (Feb 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (ntonar)*

Here's my effort:


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

Hello!
I have shaved some 16V PL pistons to be used with the forced induction.
So i shaved the head of the piston 1,55MM which is exactly the same hight of a 3-layer head gasket.
I measured the thickness of the head on a G60 stock piston and it is 8MM, the Stock 16V PL piston is 6,55MM and now shaved is 5MM thick.
So i want to know if someone else has done this and how it works?
I'm worried because i don't know if the piston head is too weak for 16VG60.








Well, i what peoples opinions. 
Image :


----------



## AXISMODE-PVAG (Sep 16, 2005)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

Word up to the wizard.







I have yet to see a thread as discriptive as this. I have a PG block topped with a ABA head and now I want to rip it out and go 16V 2.0L with and run my lysholm and SDS on that. Time to shop around for a engine and park the 'raddo again...the better half is gonna be pissed again!


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

My 16vG60`s goin great on MegaSquirt, just got the last few bugs ironed out. If you use a cambelt tensioner or similar make sure you tighten the bolt up well as mine`s span round twice now and I`ve lost belt tension (always seems to be when I plan it from 1k rpm).


----------



## Guillem (Feb 21, 2004)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Seems everyone is getting on the 16V G60 Bandwagon







...that is one serious Belt route!










that's crazy!!!


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

Que paso Guillem jejeje.
I think this is just a joke...why the hell you are using the servo at the back?..also G60 intake is closed hehe


----------



## Guillem (Feb 21, 2004)

Have you seen the alternator??? hehehe


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

Yeh, there more setups which use the Alternator there, no problem if you don't use stock airfilter box.


----------



## ntonar (Nov 21, 2000)

*Re: (DAMACGON)*

This might be useful in this thread


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

Yep, need to be here


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Hi all, Finally i finish my 16VG60 Setup.
Here are some Specs :
- 16V KR HEAD P&P
- 16V KR BLOCK 1.8
- AUDI RS2 PISTONS
- AUDI RS2 RODS
- SNS TUNING CUSTOM CHIP
- 440c.c. GREEN TOPS
- G60 MODDED + 68MM
- MOCAL OIL COOLER
PICS :
RS2 PISTONS AND RODS

KR BLOCK
 
PULLEY SYSTEM


FRONT

BACK 


Need to give thanks to the " HOW-TO 16VG60 POST " and all does people who post in it http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## T-hane (Mar 28, 2005)

So what are these engines capable of for power


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (T-hane)*

I'm still waiting on someone to post pics of ABA alternator under the G-Lader. NEVER EVER seen a pic, It's an Urban Legend


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

He's running a modified version of my setup.
I ran like that for a year


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

ah... my pics finally made it on her Isaam
dave


----------



## G60 CAB (Oct 26, 2003)

*Re: (ntonar)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ntonar* »_This might be useful in this thread









Not to be an ass or anything....but this sketch doesn't follow the rules. Those two circular dimensions should be in radii not diameters.










_Modified by redvdubvert at 1:31 AM 11-16-2005_


----------



## Peter Tong (Jun 17, 1999)

*Re: (redvdubvert)*

The primary TB butterfly portions (larger circular portions) are also on the wrong end...


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

that setup required a heavily modified lower core support. there are a few ways to do it but, i still like my way the best


----------



## G60syncro (Feb 7, 2001)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*

Just to add my 2¢... I got an ABF front coolant flange for my ABA G60 setup and it fits like a charm!! So there's an OEM solution to the old 16v coolant flange problem!! It even clears the rear G60 bracket without fuss... Now I'll mount it properly and snap some pics this weekend.
I can't be positive that it fits with a PG type block... I guess the ABA/ABF block raises the head just enough to make it possible.


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (G60syncro)*

































not my car, but I've got the same setup in mine. mines an early alt. and not the final one I decided to use. This would be what the kit would look like http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif that is if any body would be intrested. if not then It will stay between me and a certain black jetta.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (G60syncro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60syncro* »_Just to add my 2¢... I got an ABF front coolant flange for my ABA G60 setup and it fits like a charm!! So there's an OEM solution to the old 16v coolant flange problem!! It even clears the rear G60 bracket without fuss... Now I'll mount it properly and snap some pics this weekend.
I can't be positive that it fits with a PG type block... I guess the ABA/ABF block raises the head just enough to make it possible.

Where did you get the ABF coolant flange from???


----------



## G60syncro (Feb 7, 2001)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
Where did you get the ABF coolant flange from???

Some guy on Ebay... He told me he did'nt think it would work on a 16v-G60. So I played ginnea-pig and bought it anyways. Turns out it fits nicely but you _absolutely need _to have an ABA or ABF block to get the necessary clearance over the rear bracket.
He just told me he won't get them anymore because they're a huge pain to get from Germany. Search Ebay for "ABF" you might still be able to get one of the last ones.
Check with rhussjr on here, he told me he could get them too!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (G60syncro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60syncro* »_
He just told me he won't get them anymore because they're a huge pain to get from Germany. Search Ebay for "ABF" you might still be able to get one of the last ones. 

Your talking about dave bullsworth?He will still get them if there is a demand.I would just get them made,not worth the hassle for a plastic part that is prone to failure.
Gasket Paper + Billet Housing > Plastic German Garbage.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (G60syncro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60syncro* »_
Some guy on Ebay... He told me he did'nt think it would work on a 16v-G60. So I played ginnea-pig and bought it anyways. Turns out it fits nicely but you _absolutely need _to have an ABA or ABF block to get the necessary clearance over the rear bracket.
He just told me he won't get them anymore because they're a huge pain to get from Germany. Search Ebay for "ABF" you might still be able to get one of the last ones.
Check with rhussjr on here, he told me he could get them too!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Most 16vG60 guys don't use the rear bracket.
I have and S2 intake and need an ABF coolant flange.
If only I were in Europe...


----------



## G60syncro (Feb 7, 2001)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
Most 16vG60 guys don't use the rear bracket.
I have and S2 intake and need an ABF coolant flange.
If only I were in Europe...

I decided to keep the rear bracket... It fits there with minimal fuss, I milled out a notch to clear the ABA oil filter flange. I'll weld up the gap and reface the flange so it seals well against the block with a little silicone. I'll also tap it for my breather system.
*Edit*
Also, that fitting allows me to use the stock G60 syncro-specific upper radiator hose... If I did'nt use that one, I'd be pretty much stumped as to which one to pick in order to keep my engine bay clean and factory looking!!


_Modified by G60syncro at 5:18 PM 11-22-2005_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (G60syncro)*

quick question , has anyone run into any problems with a g lager cause of not usign the rear mount on them ? i knwo some guys with twin screws are having problems with out the extra mounting . just want to make sure you guys are running around with out it and no problems . 
thanks 
quick pic of mine that is going together right now .


----------



## pre 93 only (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: (G60syncro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60syncro* »_
I decided to keep the rear bracket... It fits there with minimal fuss, I milled out a notch to clear the ABA oil filter flange. I'll weld up the gap and reface the flange so it seals well against the block with a little silicone. I'll also tap it for my breather system.


Thats exactly what I did and tapped an AN fitting for the breather http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (DAMACGON)*

hey guys , i am bolting up my kit , and i ran into a problem last night . 
in the pic you can see the rear alternator brakets , the one that swings up behind the alternator, well it hits the fins on the alt. i cannt get any more room with it . am i supposed to change the fins with another model that is smaller , or do i have something wrongs ??
thanks for the help
allen #53 
and the pic


----------



## G60syncro (Feb 7, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

Befor digging too deep, let me ask the obvious... did you try swapping that bar end-for-end??? Me thinks the bend is not centered and having the long end below and the shorter end going up might gain you that 1/4" clearance you need. If that's not a solution, then we'll start looking elsewhere!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

i tryed that , but i just looked at bbm site , i have it up side down , gotta flip ends . should do it . thank you . now just need to get a few more parts and all done . cannt wait . there is som any things bolted to this damn motor it makes me laugh. 
thanks again guys


----------



## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

Swapping ends should work. That is how I got mine to fit.

BTW...good luck trying to get that to clear the AC lines if you're keeping the AC











Link to all my 16v conversion pics http://www.hostdub.com/thetatau87_album02


_Modified by thetatau87 at 2:20 PM 11-29-2005_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (thetatau87)*

great pics, ya i swape dends and it went right on today . dont knwo why it gave me a problem the other day , could of been the gases from the heater in the garage








my a/c has been deleted sinice i got the car , always the 1st thing i do when i get a car . CT doenst get that hot and i dont drive the car daily . but thanks for you help . should be droping it in early JAN.


----------



## cmoblingbling (Oct 8, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

im looken to build a g60 16v. what bottem end am i going to want to build for max power?? rods, pistions... everything. i dont know. any help would be a great start. also what engine management would i want to use. something not too complicated, but would work. thanks alot.


----------



## pistolay (Nov 29, 2005)

Hi, I am so glad to find this forum, I have wanted to build me a 16v g60, and have read all the messages here and have found them quite helpful… I have a few questions, I don’t plan on actually doing this project until next summer, but want to get all the information correct, and try to not get stuck trying to figure something out in the middle of the build.. 
I am starting with a PG block, and a 1.8 16v head.

So, here go the questions:
1.	Does anyone know what the compression ratio be if I put the longer 16v rods (144mm??) with the stock g60 pistons (with the 16v head of course)? I am not intending on using the stock pistons, but figured this would significantly raise the CR above the 6.1 with the g60 rods…. 
2.	I understand that in order to make the pulleys line up of the g60, you have to shave the crank pulley down 6mm… Does this mean that you have to run the 8v belt? I like the idea of keeping the 8v pulley set and merging the innards of the 16v adjustable cam gear with the outers of the 8v adjustable, seems like a lot less work if your starting with the PG block, especially with the intermediate shaft stuff, but am worried about the belt being weaker.
3.	Has anyone heard about boring a 16v rod out to fit the g60 22mm wristpins?
Any help would be greatly appertained!
Thanks, Pistolay….


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (pistolay)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pistolay* »_
I am starting with a PG block, and a 1.8 16v head.

So, here go the questions:
1.	Does anyone know what the compression ratio be if I put the longer 16v rods (144mm??) with the stock g60 pistons (with the 16v head of course)? I am not intending on using the stock pistons, but figured this would significantly raise the CR above the 6.1 with the g60 rods…. 


Seems like extra work, why not just use the whole 1.8L 16v?

_Quote »_
2.	I understand that in order to make the pulleys line up of the g60, you have to shave the crank pulley down 6mm… Does this mean that you have to run the 8v belt? I like the idea of keeping the 8v pulley set and merging the innards of the 16v adjustable cam gear with the outers of the 8v adjustable, seems like a lot less work if your starting with the PG block, especially with the intermediate shaft stuff, but am worried about the belt being weaker.


Use G60 width serpentine belt and 16v timing belt

_Quote »_
3.	Has anyone heard about boring a 16v rod out to fit the g60 22mm wristpins?
Any help would be greatly appertained!
Thanks, Pistolay….


I've heard of guys making ABA 16v G60's and using 9A pistons.


----------



## pistolay (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
Seems like extra work, why not just use the whole 1.8L 16v?
.

it's what I have at my disposal. its going to be all machined out, ect..

_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
Use G60 width serpentine belt and 16v timing belt
.

Ok, so is the g60 serpentine belt narrower??? or are you saying to use the 16v belt on a trimmed down pulley, leaving the other pulleys wide... if the latter is the case, dosent it rub on the now closer pulleys in the crank?

_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
I've heard of guys making ABA 16v G60's and using 9A pistons.

so does that consist of a g60 crank, 16v rods, and 9a pistons? what would the CR be on that combo with a 16v head?
i'm just trying to work through all my options, even if they sound odd... i appreciate all input!
Pistolay


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (pistolay)*

he is saying to use the 16v timing belt for a timing belt and use a g60 serp belt to run the charger and everything else
the compresson with a g60 crank and 9a rods and pistons would be the same as a stock 16v ( 10:1 )so you gonna have to stack head gaskets
hope that helps you


----------



## pre 93 only (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

You will need to machine down the crank pully so that it puts the serp belt back in line with the accesories. I used an ABA one, I dont think you can do it to the G60 one because of its steel multipart construction. The ABA one is alloy. You take off the difference in amounts between the 8v cogged crank sproket and the 16v one. If you are using the V belt dont forget to grab the ABA crank one also if you are using the serp pully.
I have an ABA 16v using the 9A pistons. Just have to rebush the ABA rods with 9A bushings and have them honed to spec to accept the 9A wrist pins.


----------



## cmoblingbling (Oct 8, 2003)

*Re: (pre 93 only)*

anyways... can anyone help me w/ what bottem end i should start to build? thanks


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (cmoblingbling)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cmoblingbling* »_anyways... can anyone help me w/ what bottem end i should start to build? thanks


use search


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (cmoblingbling)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cmoblingbling* »_anyways... can anyone help me w/ what bottem end i should start to build? thanks

see my sig.


----------



## pistolay (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
Seems like extra work, why not just use the whole 1.8L 16v?
.

I just have the parts and want to make'em work... any idea what the compression ratio be if I used 144mm rods, 16v head, and pg pistons? I know that the stock rods make the cr somewhere around 6, which is too low, but by using longer rods this should raise the cr signifigantly...


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (cmoblingbling)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cmoblingbling* »_anyways... can anyone help me w/ what bottem end i should start to build? thanks

Start with an ABA.Seems to be the most desireable bottom end to start any 4-CYL VW project with.


----------



## cmoblingbling (Oct 8, 2003)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

thanks


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (cmoblingbling)*

I recommend the 9A, using the ABA as the bottom end does introduce some complications.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_using the ABA as the bottom end does introduce some complications.

such as?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
such as?

You know the answer was well as I do, making and ABF is much more difficult and just taking a 9A and stacking gaskets.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

trust me... you want to use an ABA for this project. i speak from experience. 
it's not difficult at all... the only caveat is, you need both the ABA block and the 16V block... swap a few parts over and you're golden.
paying an extra few dollars for the ABA is totally worth it... especially if you decide to drop in the 9A pistons.
btw... a 16VG60 really requires proper engine management. consider 034 efi or something similar to get the most out of it.
good luck.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_trust me... you want to use an ABA for this project. i speak from experience. 
it's not difficult at all... the only caveat is, you need both the ABA block and the 16V block... swap a few parts over and you're golden.
paying an extra few dollars for the ABA is totally worth it... especially if you decide to drop in the 9A pistons.
btw... a 16VG60 really requires proper engine management. consider 034 efi or something similar to get the most out of it.
good luck.

I didn't say it was difficult, I said it was more difficult than a 9A


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_
btw... a 16VG60 really requires proper engine management. consider 034 efi or something similar to get the most out of it.
good luck.

Let's get down to brass tacks, who is running Digi-1 with the BBM chip for 16V60? Do you have a wide band O2 sensor, and what do you think in general of this setup? Obviously Digi-1 sucks when compared to stand alone (034EFI-yeah baby!!), but how badly?? Please quantify.


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

talk to SNS, Danny and Sam have a few 16v/g60's running under there belts http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif not to mention Danny's car, 13.1 1/4 16vt 350(+-) at the wheels.... Danny feel free to comment if I missed any thing 


_Modified by G60NUT at 8:40 AM 12-22-2005_


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (G60NUT)*

Use the 9A and roll out. I have seen no HP difference between a 9A and an ABA. Oh but people will swear to you that there friend on Mars put down 16000hp an on an ABA and only 3hp on a 9A. Use the 9A and save yourself the headache and don't worry about the taller motor. There is also the argument that the ABA has the longer stroke and can excite a turbo faster.... blah blah blah Ya, I can see the argument but if you are superchargering don't sweat it. The difference is minute and mod for mod will see little to no difference on a dyno. On my 16vG60 I went 83.5mm weisco's on a 9a and 3 finned charger with ported 9A head, larger valves, under cut stems, 265/262 cams on stock ratio's b/c i spin 8k rpms. Once everything gets buttoned up and dyno'd i'll be posting


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (1.9..16vTurbo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.9..16vTurbo* »_Use the 9A and roll out. I have seen no HP difference between a 9A and an ABA..........

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif true that, I have yet to see any body prove a substantial diff in the two botom ends. build the 9a and save the headaches.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Oh Please not the ABA vs 9A argument.Compare the dyno graph of an ABA 16V Turbo with that of a 9A Turbo.All things constant such as:
1. Size of Turbo
2. Wastegate size & consistancy of Boost Pressure
3. Diameter of Bore.
You will see where the ABA excells...same displacement with better rod ratio does have its benefits.


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

I have never seen this graph. I hear ya onn the argument and i understand the position but no-one has been able to up the anty on a graph. I just don't think the difference is there to justify.


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_..same displacement with better rod ratio does have its benefits.

I understand the argument, don't think it's enough to justify


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: (1.9..16vTurbo)*

In my experience, the 9A bottom is a bit more coarse than the ABA bottom when being revved above 6k. It just transmitted more vibration through the same motor mounts in the 16V G60 Mk2 here in the ATL. The previous motor was an ABA 8V 2L G60. The difference in vibration in the rear view mirror told the story. 
Power-wise... I don't think there is much, if any, more power to be had. If there is, I'm sure it would be less than 5hp. Saw a test a few years back with a 350 Chevy. IIRC, they went from 5.7" to 6.0" and saw a ~6hp gain. There would be less of an advantage on a motor with 1/2 the cylinders using the longer rods.
My main reason for choosing an ABA bottom end was to get a bit more of a life out of the block and pistons. It's hard to drive a boosted 16V with cams and a higher rpm intake and not buzz it up to the limiter (mine at ~7500 rpms). If the longer rods give me just a few more trips through the red-zone through the life of the motor, the trouble will have been worht it







.


----------



## Rocco_Phil (Nov 5, 2005)

*JWatts* - so you previously had a ABA 8v G60, is that correct?
I am curious because I would like to go this route.


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (Rocco_Phil)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rocco_Phil* »_*JWatts* - so you previously had a ABA 8v G60, is that correct?
I am curious because I would like to go this route.

G60Mikey did. Jwatts' G60 set up was only the PG motor


----------



## Rocco_Phil (Nov 5, 2005)

Danke.
Happy Festivus, belated.








EDIT: hmmm, can't find anyone with that name in Search. Think he is still on the boards?


_Modified by Rocco_Phil at 10:17 AM 12-25-2005_


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (Rocco_Phil)*

here it is...
g60mikey


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
Let's get down to brass tacks, who is running Digi-1 with the BBM chip for 16V60? Do you have a wide band O2 sensor, and what do you think in general of this setup? Obviously Digi-1 sucks when compared to stand alone (034EFI-yeah baby!!), but how badly?? Please quantify.









Lets put it this way, digi1 was on my car for 6 months, fitted MegaSquirt and never looked back. I wish I`d gone for MS in the first place (cost the same as a 2nd hand digi1 setup..). 
I suppose it depends if you live near someone who can map the car for you or wether want to have a go yourself. I`m not knocking the chip-tuners in the slightest but I`d rather spend a Sunday on the laptop.


----------



## Danno13 (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: (KeithMac)*









Just found this in the mk3 forum, now I know it is not a 16v, but look at the belt for the alternator, has anyone tryed this? not sure if it would work or not


_Modified by Danno13 at 7:41 PM 12-28-2005_


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: (Danno13)*

Personally I wouldn`t want to load the cambelt up with the alternator, if it snaps on a 16v you`ll bend a few valves.
My alt`s under the charger, nice short belt run..


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Oh Please not the ABA vs 9A argument.Compare the dyno graph of an ABA 16V Turbo with that of a 9A Turbo.All things constant such as:
1. Size of Turbo
2. Wastegate size & consistancy of Boost Pressure
3. Diameter of Bore.
You will see where the ABA excells...same displacement with better rod ratio does have its benefits.
 
I used the PG and am pretty happy with it! Strong bulletproof bottom end. And still have some OE Corrado soul...


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (clintg60-16v)*

i've realized the ABA vs.9A argument is a futile one, since anyone with one or the other of these 2 engines is simply not going to build an identical one with the other bottom end. trust me... i'm not going to build a 9A to put beside my ABA 16VG60








if you have the resources and the energy; take every advantage you can get and go with an ABA. even if it only makes 5 more lb/ft... IT MAKES 5 MORE lb/ft!!! (it'll definitely be smoother. on this there is no argument!!!) but, there are tons or good reasons for just using the 9A. 
tuning is the biggest part


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (KeithMac)*


_Quote, originally posted by *KeithMac* »_Personally I wouldn`t want to load the cambelt up with the alternator, if it snaps on a 16v you`ll bend a few valves.
My alt`s under the charger, nice short belt run..


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: (G60NUT)*


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (KeithMac)*

how did you do your mounts? any more pics? what type of alt?


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: (G60NUT)*

It`s BBM front brakets for the alternator, they bolt to the G60 bracket. The alternator`s off a Mk4 Polo Diesel (90amp?), and it uses the BBM belt tensioner and stock G60 belt shock absorber. Also got the power steering pump under there, it`s quite busy!
Will see if I can dig some pics out for you, had to take a lump out of the bottom rad support beam to clear the alt.


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (KeithMac)*

you use the surpintine belt for everything?


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: (KeithMac)*

Here`s a mate`s setup, I`m using the same alt brakets but a different belt run, I moved the idler up to give the belt more grip around the w/pump pulley and added a second idler to give G60 pulley more belt.. 












_Modified by KeithMac at 6:48 PM 12-31-2005_


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (KeithMac)*

WOW thats busy









I used the stock belt setup(duel belt) , and used the alt in place of the a/c compressor 








my page


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: (G60NUT)*

Yeh, my power steering pump runs off the normal v belt and offset pulley, quite easy to do a belt change when you get used to it


----------



## lucmb94 (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

okay i have a few questions that i need to ask. i am sure they have been previously asked but its been a year since i read all through this thread.
ok i have the bbm 16v kit, here are my questions.
1. is there any other forged 1.9l piston options besides bbms pistons or custom ones?
2. i want to have a custom intake manifold made, will there be clearance issues if it sits in front of the head? (i have a screw compressor with the stock bbm intake)
3. anybody else done a 1.9l 16v lysholm with hight boost?
4. is the 2.9 16v head a 9a?
thanks in advance for any help, and again. sorry if these questions have already been asked.








-Lucas


----------



## 631 Corrado (Jan 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (lucmb94)*

i have a question about the coolent temp sensor. i was going g60 on my engine now ive decided to go turbo... .but anyways can i just use the good old 16v cts on the side of the head... ive scene people make adapters and all this wacky [email protected] just to use the blue cts from the g60. .. why is that? and im assuming i can use the 16v cts for the guage cluster just make it a singe wire since it grounds to the head????????


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (lucmb94)*


_Quote, originally posted by *lucmb94* »_okay i have a few questions that i need to ask. i am sure they have been previously asked but its been a year since i read all through this thread.
ok i have the bbm 16v kit, here are my questions.
1. is there any other forged 1.9l piston options besides bbms pistons or custom ones?
2. i want to have a custom intake manifold made, will there be clearance issues if it sits in front of the head? (i have a screw compressor with the stock bbm intake)
3. anybody else done a 1.9l 16v lysholm with hight boost?
4. is the 2.9 16v head a 9a?
thanks in advance for any help, and again. sorry if these questions have already been asked.








-Lucas

My 16V Lysholm runs 18psi. I keep experiencing delays in getting my a** to the dyno. Going to drop a 3bar + adjustable FPR on it, and also have a CIS pump installed inline.
That should give me maximum tuning flexibility at the dyno this spring. 
I stopped short of saying Digi-I and "flexible" in the same sentence for fear I would be shot.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (clintg60-16v)*

So the 16V race head is almost done, now currently planning the bottom end.
My plans include:
-PG block punched to 1.9L
-Either Bildon, Crower's, or 034EFI 144mm H beam connecting rods
Bildon has ultralight H beam 475 gram rods-they look SWEET
-16V JE custom 1.9L pistons (intake valve radius 1mm oversize for valve clearance)
-Knife edged crank-fully balanced
All experienced builders are wecome to throw their $0.02 in. This motor will start as a G6016V, but WILL be going to turbo. That is the reason for the ridiculously strong bottom end, as I want to reliably run up to 25lbs. boost when the turbo and stand alone is on the motor.


----------



## Kaddy (Sep 29, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (631 JETTA)*


_Quote, originally posted by *631 JETTA* »_i have a question about the coolent temp sensor. i was going g60 on my engine now ive decided to go turbo... .but anyways can i just use the good old 16v cts on the side of the head... ive scene people make adapters and all this wacky [email protected] just to use the blue cts from the g60. .. why is that? and im assuming i can use the 16v cts for the guage cluster just make it a singe wire since it grounds to the head????????

















You can use the 16v coolant temp sensor (like the first one pictured) inplace of the blue g60 temp sensor, same resistance range, works just fine.
And like you said, for the gauge, use the other stock 16v sensor on the side of the head, like the lower one pictured.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (kindbudz91G60)*

Anyone know if there's a problem running a PG block with PL crank, IM shaft, rods, and oil pump. Is the PG crank the same as a PL? I will be doing custom pistons...
Basically the whole motor will be PL, I just like the PG block for the smaller PCV hole and oil return line hole.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

do you guys still use the the fule pump pressure switch ? i am pulling my motor out to drop in the new one and dont really understand where the fuel lines go . 
1 goes in to the FPR and the other goes on the other side of the BBM rail , but what do i do with the pump switch ?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_Belt/Pulley routing
#1: 7 pulley








#2:6 pulley









I want more info on this. I', buying the BBM kit, but with a small G-lader pulley it concerns me that there will be slip with the 6 pulley setup.














On the 7 pulley there is a lot more belt to pulley contact (like the factory setup)...
JBetz any info on this??


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_do you guys still use the the fule pump pressure switch ? i am pulling my motor out to drop in the new one and dont really understand where the fuel lines go . 
1 goes in to the FPR and the other goes on the other side of the BBM rail , but what do i do with the pump switch ?

pump switch?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
I want more info on this. I', buying the BBM kit, but with a small G-lader pulley it concerns me that there will be slip with the 6 pulley setup.














On the 7 pulley there is a lot more belt to pulley contact (like the factory setup)...
JBetz any info on this??









The 6 pulley setup is just like the factory setup, which came in the Limited.
The 7 pulley is SLS's version of the 16vG60


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

From their museum.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*

number 20 in the picture.











_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 10:07 AM 2-13-2006_


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

The Original VW setup came with 70MM pulley? or 78MM?
Someone knows?


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_
number 20 in the picture.


I'd talk to SNS, they are uber familiar with the digi-1.
I'm running SDS, so I have fuel in, fuel return, that's it.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (DAMACGON)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DAMACGON* »_The Original VW setup came with 70MM pulley? or 78MM?
Someone knows?

I suspect it was 78mm
hp rating was 210 from a 1.8L 16v.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

If you are running one of the smaller Lysholm pulleys you might want to use a tension-er cap.
This will get you that extra adjustment if more traction is required.
You might also want to buy a new tensioner.
Some of the old ones are a bit tired.


----------



## streetxpress (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

Hello,
I am going to do this same setup on my corrado. Can you tell me the part number for the belt or the length. Thanks
Jimmy

1990 CORRADO
16V/G60
PATEC SUSPENSION/ PORSCHE WHEELS


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (streetxpress)*


_Quote, originally posted by *streetxpress* »_Hello,
I am going to do this same setup on my corrado. Can you tell me the part number for the belt or the length. Thanks
Jimmy

1990 CORRADO
16V/G60
PATEC SUSPENSION/ PORSCHE WHEELS

there are a pile of belt options, just measure it with a sewing tape or string and get the closest belt to that size.
I'm running the 7 pulley one.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

So this is it guys, get them while they last.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2450782


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Thanks for the wealth of information.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*

just got mine bolted in last night , it is coming alone. 



























_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 5:54 PM 2-23-2006_


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

It may have been hard, but you see more and more 16v turbo setups. Its nice to see someone go through with something different for once, like a supercharger.


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*

Lol, neither way is easy, but both are totally worth it when you mash the go pedal







.


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

Sure! nice rides


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (DAMACGON)*

things are alittle easyer now , looks like i need to only extend the throttle body wire and the fuel rail wire . but as i was doing my coolant hoses and what not , i started to mock up a few things , like the intake . 
what throttle cable are you guys using , ( i have the BBM intake elbow ) the stock one doesnt reach , and it looks like it is gonna be a pain to get a new one through the firewall , looks really high up on firewall and looks likeit will be way under the dash , 
so which cabel are you using so i can order the correct one . 
thanks again guys for all the help i have gathered here and i hope to return it along the way . 
oh , and i ran my oil feed line off the back of the head , i was able to use the same hardware that was on the stock engine , so that was a happy suprise.


----------



## corocco (Jul 29, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

I'm curious Herby53, did you use the entire BBM integration kit for your install and if not, do you think that it would have made for an easier install overall.
Or, is the 16V conversion in whatever form just a tough install with or without a complete BBM integration kit.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (corocco)*

when i first started it , i was gonna do it myself , i mocked up the alt under the charger , and weas spending way to much time looking for parts and mocking up fabed up things . then i picked up jsut the brakets for a good price , after a while , i came across this intergration kit for a good deal , so i grabed it . it comes with lots of things you need , IE: the fuel rail , crank pulley , spacer for powersteering pulley, intake elbow, and a few more things you just need to do it . it saves time and money ( i think ) 
the conversion isnt to bad , but it takes time . the only thing that bothered me about the kit was the chip useless for me so i have to buy another one . i think they should jsut buirn you a chip when you tell them what your building , or maybe just hold off on the chip till you get it together . but that is no big deal as JWATTS is working on one for me now.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_
what throttle cable are you guys using , ( i have the BBM intake elbow ) the stock one doesnt reach , and it looks like it is gonna be a pain to get a new one through the firewall , looks really high up on firewall and looks likeit will be way under the dash , 
so which cabel are you using so i can order the correct one . 
. 


well i couldnt find the answer i needed and really didnt feel like replaceing the throttle cable. it is a good thing i have some much grab from so many cars laying around . i was able to fab up a braket to use the stock cable. here are some pics of it . 
the braket i used is off a mk2 throttle body , it is the one that holds the switches on it ( was off a mk2 gti throttle body ) , i had to drill one hole inthe throttle body and the other hole was one that is already on the side of the g60 throttle body. the casting is so soft , that the bolts just threaded themselfs in . then i had to drill 2 mounting holes for the cable holder . 
look close and you can see the screws that hold it in place. it is nice and firm 
















































then just put on a few more things


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Very nice work. I like what you did there.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scuba2001* »_Very nice work. I like what you did there.

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif thanks


----------



## corocco (Jul 29, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

Can anyone verify if the PL crank shaft and intermediate shaft timing belt gears are the same(fit & width) as the 9A timing belt sprocket gears. 
I know that the PL intermediate shaft, drive gear and oil pump won't work on an ABA but I wasn't sure if the PL crankshaft timing gear would work on an ABA crank shaft and if a PL inter. timing belt sprocket would fit on a 9A intermediate shaft.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (corocco)*


_Quote, originally posted by *corocco* »_Can anyone verify if the PL crank shaft and intermediate shaft timing belt gears are the same(fit & width) as the 9A timing belt sprocket gears. 
they are not the same , the 9A one toothed belt gear is longer , the intermedate shaft is the same length , but different on the ends to fit a 16v intermed gear, the 8v's and 16v's have different teeth setup, more teeth on a 16v belt 
I know that the PL intermediate shaft, drive gear and oil pump won't work on an ABA but I wasn't sure if the PL crankshaft timing gear would work on an ABA crank shaft and if a PL inter. timing belt sprocket would fit on a 9A intermediate shaft.

the same here , a 9A 16v interm. gear wont fit , the PL gear takes a woodrife key in the shaft and the 9A one has a tap build into it rather then a slot. wont fit . 
what are you trying to do ? 
when i first started this , i wanted to keep it simple and use a 8v timing belt setup , could of been done , but after talking to a lot og guys , they made one good point , VW changed the timing belts on 16v's to more teeth and wider belts for a reason , i didnt want to risk shearing the belt cause of to much power so i kept the 16v setup.


----------



## corocco (Jul 29, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

I'm doing a G60 16V ABA conversion. I already have a 1.8PL engine and an ABA block....originally going to run the stock ABA pistons and go with a somewhat low 8:1 compression ratio for my G-lader; however, I recently found a 9A block that I'm going to get the pistons from and also the intermediate shaft, drive gear and oil pump.
What I wasn't sure about is if I needed to get the 9A intermediate timing gear pulley and crankshaft timing gear off the 9A block or if I could just use the PL timing gears.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (corocco)*

oh ok , ya you need those from the 9A


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

jwatts , im sent about a chip


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for jwatts, you build it he will make it run


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (G60NUT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60NUT* »_ http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for jwatts, you build it he will make it run









looking forward to it , and jwatts , im replyed to sorry took so long , my computer was


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

SNS would make the job, they are the best ones. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## lucmb94 (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: (DAMACGON)*

i know this has been asked before but what about shaving a little of the 16v head to raise the compression rather than getting custom pistons? if it were shaved a little less than 1mm it would the cr go close to 8:1?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (lucmb94)*

your going the wrong way . shave the head and compression gos up.


----------



## ntonar (Nov 21, 2000)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

You will have to weld 1mm of material on the head.


----------



## lucmb94 (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

the 16v head on a pg block will drop the cr 1.8:1 so before the head would be shaved the motor would have 6.2:1, sorry i forgot to specify i am using the pg block.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (lucmb94)*

with pg pistons ? you will have to have the pistons cut for the valves. there was a compression calcutor somewhere on here.


----------



## lucmb94 (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

hmmm, never mind then, ill just get the bbm ones.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (lucmb94)*

i got my JE 9:1 for 450 with total seal rings from the vortex. look around , just make sure you ask about the pin size.


----------



## lucmb94 (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

are you using the pg block?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (lucmb94)*

na , mine are 2L 16v ones , so i am useing a 9A block. i wanted the bigger bore .


----------



## FaTT mk1 (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: (G60NUT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60NUT* »_










Am i missing some thing or is that a tooth belt kit on a ribbed alternator?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (FaTT mk1)*

anyone running a BBM intergration kit ? what serp belt are you useing on it ? i need the number from it . also if you r running a 65mm pulley that would be great , if not , let me know what pulley you are running on it and i will do the math to get the right size for a 65mm. 
thanks guys and i am hopeing to get mine running next weekend now due to not getting soem parts in time for this weekend.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

jwatts , IM sent about chip shippment . thanks .


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: (FaTT mk1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FaTT mk1* »_
Am i missing some thing or is that a tooth belt kit on a ribbed alternator? 

your missing something







its a Dayco belt,


----------



## FaTT mk1 (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: (G60NUT)*

LOL, Kool http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Deuce34 (Sep 16, 2003)

*Re: (FaTT mk1)*

Just gave all 10 pages or so a read. 
For the last year i've been really interested in going the G60/16v route. Lots of cool history and a super cool setup with mega hp.
All we're doing here is building motor's to handle forced induction. Everyone doign the different bottom end's and different head's. When it comes down to it, Your just buildling a motor that would best suite boost. As of now, I guess i'll start planning with the 9a motor and gear one of those up to take some PSI. but the original G6016v has G60 bottom end with 2.0L head....that can't be correct is it?
I'm just trying to gather parts as of now. Trying to snatch up one of the last few BBM kits.


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (Deuce34)*

No mega HP. I'm not happy with my 83.5mm fully worked 16vG60. As far as power. Was looking for a bit more power but the G-Lader is the weak point...


----------



## smokinjoe644 (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: (1.9..16vTurbo)*

Figured I would throw this in here for you guys as well... this is from my 20V 2.0 Vortech build up.
*Larger diameter Crank Pulley*
This is an OEM VW part. It has the proper offest to run with the 16V timing gears behind it. It will fit the same way as the billet units or the shaved ABA crank pulleys that alot of people run.
Quick comparison:
ABA
size: 5.5 inches size: 6.37 inches
weight: 3.1 lbs weight: 3.8 lbs
ribs: 6 ribs: 6
















This is a nice piece because it is a stock part, you dont have to worry about machining tolerances and it has a built in vibration dampener. It is also lighter the the G60 unit which weighs in at 6.4 lbs with the dampener.
Questions that people have had about this... mainly, yes it will over drive your accessories, but that is how it is also going to over drive you charger..... meaning you can run a larger charger pulley and have less belt slip and the same boost levels. Or higher boost levels then what were previously possible.
Really the only area of concern is the water pump, which is not all that efficient and should not build excess pressure. Power steering is still a V-belt situation so it will not change, and the alternator can be countered with a larger pulley that is already on the market to slow it down some if you are worried. 
If anyone is interested contact me I have them for $105 shipped http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (Deuce34)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Deuce34* »_Just gave all 10 pages or so a read. 
For the last year i've been really interested in going the G60/16v route. Lots of cool history and a super cool setup with mega hp.
All we're doing here is building motor's to handle forced induction. Everyone doign the different bottom end's and different head's. When it comes down to it, Your just buildling a motor that would best suite boost. As of now, I guess i'll start planning with the 9a motor and gear one of those up to take some PSI. but the original G6016v has G60 bottom end with 2.0L head....that can't be correct is it?
I'm just trying to gather parts as of now. Trying to snatch up one of the last few BBM kits. 

IIRC the original 16vG60 was a 1.8L 16v with custom pistons, thicker head gasket and different cams.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

BUMPIzzle


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (golf198v2.0)*

As * g60nut * has said . the DELCO CS130 alt will fit under the charger. Ive been researching the topic since i dont need that amperage. Ive found GM 2.8l v6's pre 94 may also work and come in 70A and 100A.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (golf198v2.0)*

should be trying some GM alts this weekend ill post back.


----------



## AUTOXRABBIT (Apr 11, 2006)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

I have a quick ? can the pg crank, rods and piston be installed in a 1.8 16v block?? they have the same bore size


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Oil Breather*

I have been reading a bunch of posts about the crankcase oil breather for the 16VG60 conversion and have not really gotten a clear picture of what options are out there. I am running a PG Block (custom pistons) with a 1.8L 16V head. I bought the BBM integration kit and was wondering how exactly those with this kit addressed the crankcase breather relocation. Anyone else with any other ideas besides the one that is suggested by BBM in there kit please give your inputs as well.
Thanks
Jason


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*

Mine breaths into a catch-can with sump return line, that`s a 16v bottom end though..


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (KeithMac)*

my displacer is shot







. im looking for another charger or blower type . might jus run a snail


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (KeithMac)*


_Quote, originally posted by *KeithMac* »_Mine breaths into a catch-can with sump return line, that`s a 16v bottom end though..

can you show me some pics?? Any Pics of any other setups would be helpful.


_Modified by FastCorrG60 at 2:23 AM 4-24-2006_


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*

So guys anybody want to share their crankcase breather setups (catch can, etc.). Pictures would be extremely helpful.
Thanks
Jason


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FastCorrG60* »_So guys anybody want to share their crankcase breather setups (catch can, etc.). Pictures would be extremely helpful.
Thanks
Jason

what i was thinking was from my N/B breather on top of the cam cover -----> Catch Can ---> return side of sharger . being im using a 16v block the block breather outlet is close to the same distance out of the g60 intake return so i was thinking of running a hose from the block breather to the return side of the charger to keep it lubed.


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*

I read a couple of posts that they have seen better results and actually seen longer charger life by venting everything in the catch can and eliminating the tube that goes from the charger to the TB and just putting a K&N filter on the opening left by removing the tube.
anyone have any feedback on this type of setup??
thanks
jason


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FastCorrG60* »_I read a couple of posts that they have seen better results and actually seen longer charger life by venting everything in the catch can and eliminating the tube that goes from the charger to the TB and just putting a K&N filter on the opening left by removing the tube.
anyone have any feedback on this type of setup??
thanks
jason

where does the return on the can go then? i wouldnt be runing the piping from the bypass to the charger . a block off plate would be made with a barb to take return from catch can or block but not directly from cam cover breather. in one of BBM FAQ's they state that the g60 uses the oil fumes and residue to lubricate itself.


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FastCorrG60* »_I read a couple of posts that they have seen better results and actually seen longer charger life by venting everything in the catch can and eliminating the tube that goes from the charger to the TB and just putting a K&N filter on the opening left by removing the tube.
anyone have any feedback on this type of setup??
thanks
jason

It sounds like that would work best. This also goes for turbo setups also. I ran a catch can on my 1.8T Passat and never had any issues. Cleaned out the intake track and was perfectly clean.


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_
where does the return on the can go then? i wouldnt be runing the piping from the bypass to the charger . a block off plate would be made with a barb to take return from catch can or block but not directly from cam cover breather. in one of BBM FAQ's they state that the g60 uses the oil fumes and residue to lubricate itself.

Well from what I read on those setups the catch can would not return to anything. There would just be a drain at the bottom of the can that you would empty out every time you change your oil.
All this feedback is great, keep it coming with everyones different setups.
Thanks
Jason


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*

ttt


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*

ttt


----------



## Sergio Syncro (Jul 21, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*

Phew, read all pages and this is very interesting !
Thank you all for contributing and helping others.
Please, DO host pictures safely so they won't be deleted after a while and cripple the thread.
Also, sometimes it easier to post pics of certain issues that seem to be of great interest, for instance the solutions for the 16V water flange.
There seem to be several solutions but i haven't seen any of them in this thread, sometimes a picture says more than a 1000 words.
Once more, thank you all for contributing and keep it alive http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (Sergio Syncro)*

i am finished with mine , had a few problems , but all is fixed . thanks to everyone here that helped and my build pages are finished also 
so if anyone wants to see what it takes to do the bbm conversion , go through the 18 pages . i tryed to get as detailed as i could . there is so much information in here and on the yahoo group , but i wanted to lay down my build in a plan order . it is not instructions , but how i did it . 
hope it helps out many of you that are gonna build these motors . 
herby53
the site is still getting built and sorry for the big pics , but the new pages will be much better when it is finished 
build site >> http://www.herbys53.com/06MOTORBUILD.html <<< and fallow to page 18


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

Nice webpage A LOT of info. Now for the block breather, is that foam filter that was included in the BBM kit especially for a block breather. Also is the way you implemented the filter the only way to go (with the TT block off plate).
Thanks
Jason


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*

the block should have a breather , you want to get the pressure out of there. the filter came with the kit , but check with john about it as i bought my kit unused , but not from BBM direct , it was a kit someone didnt get around to putting on . but i am almost sure it comes with the kit. 
the kit comes with a hose for the breather and i put it there due to being a nice pace and out of the way . oil whoud have to make it up really high to come out of the filter http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

I got the filter. Never got the hose though? Just wondering on whether it can be implemented differently. Also when would you implement a catch can. Since my motor is completely rebuilt I don't expect to see much oil blow by, but depending where you put the block breather you would have oil venting out anyways??
Thanks
Jason


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*

you could run that block breather into a can , but if you run the filter high ( like mine ) the oil wont go that high . if you run the bettel one , i would run a can , cause the lobes are right under it . i dont run the beattle one on mine .


----------



## FastCorrG60 (Jul 26, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

cool thanks, I guess it depends on what I am doing.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (FastCorrG60)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

Ok, the billet crank pulleys are hot off the CNC lathe.
Shipping out all the back orders.
We are ready to sell and ship the balance of the 16V integration kits that are left on the shelf.
Thanks again for your business and support
Have a great weekend


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (JBETZ)*

well i was wrong on the alt setup . Tried a late 80 early 90' blazer/jimmy alt and the stub is jus a little wide.


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*









like I said, the alt that I use dosen't exsist over the counter. its two diffrent case halves, mated with a single wire regulator. thats why its a little more expensive every thing has to be purchased seperatly. thanks for listening


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (G60NUT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60NUT* »_








like I said, the alt that I use dosen't exsist over the counter. its two diffrent case halves, mated with a single wire regulator. thats why its a little more expensive every thing has to be purchased seperatly. thanks for listening









its not a big deal bro.... i went to see if i could get a cheaper route made from what i had around and i must say its damn close. i just dont have 300$ to allot to a alt setup .


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_well i was wrong on the alt setup .

Why dont you modify the charger bracket to accept the ABA alternator?


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
thats why I decided to make a few extra and sell them. instead of having to purchase a $1500.00 kit.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Why dont you modify the charger bracket to accept the ABA alternator?

might be an option as i have one laying around . i could prolly sit er on the drill press and shave the bracket a bit. I understand where your coming from * G60Nut * as i think most of us arent striving to use a BBM kit for that price







. Sry jBetz


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Why dont you modify the charger bracket to accept the ABA alternator?

lol , i jus did actually , went to town with a die grinder.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*

Does anyone have any ignition and VE base maps for MS off there 16vG60 i can fiddle around with when i get it all wired. Would be greatly appreicated.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (Scuba2001)*

hey guys , i wanted to know if you are seeing the same boost as me 

i swaped on a stock head so it isnt my race head. 
i am running a 65mm pulley and only seeing .5 bar at wot . 
i was seeing 17.5 lbs on my stock set up , but not that i have the 16v conversion i am much lower , i have checked for leaks and cannt find any . 
just wanted to know if the reduced boost is cause of the 16v head flowing better then a 8v or should i still be getting more then .5 bar ( which i think is about 9lbs ) 
thank guys and it is still running http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_hey guys , i wanted to know if you are seeing the same boost as me 

i swaped on a stock head so it isnt my race head. 
i am running a 65mm pulley and only seeing .5 bar at wot . 
i was seeing 17.5 lbs on my stock set up , but not that i have the 16v conversion i am much lower , i have checked for leaks and cannt find any . 
just wanted to know if the reduced boost is cause of the 16v head flowing better then a 8v or should i still be getting more then .5 bar ( which i think is about 9lbs ) 
thank guys and it is still running http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

that sounds about right . IIRC bryson was getting 10lbs on his hogged out charger and a built head.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*

really , the charger is stage 4 and a front mount , but i thought i shoudl see more then this . 
if this is true , i will be going turbo before summer . i mean it is fast , but not what i expected . there has to be a leak .


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

if it's a stock head with stock cams, you should be seeing 10-13psi on the big end. probable something like 8-9psi until almost 6k, then it should climb a bit after 6k.
Built head with AT cams and Euro intake will see about 7 psi until about 6800 rpm, then will climb to about 9-ish psi by 7500 rpm with a 68mm pulley







.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (jwatts)*



jwatts said:


> if it's a stock head with stock cams, you should be seeing 10-13psi on the big end. probable something like 8-9psi until almost 6k, then it should climb a bit after 6k.
> QUOTE]
> this is with a 65mm ?
> i mean , i can be driving in 2nd gear and slam the gas and the tires break lose , but it doesnt feel like i have as much power as i thought i would . i was looking for over 200 , jwatts , you know my setup. guess i am gonna have to dyno it to get a true number . i dont have the stand alone in yet , so i am still running your chip . running a little rick due to you making it for the race head . and when the standalone gets in there will be more power , but i must say , i am alittle dissapointed with this conversion .


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

ok, converting my boost gauge to psi , i see .5 bar and a little more at redline , so that is 7.25 psi till redline and then a little more . so this is even lower , i am gonna redo all the boost tubes and check for leaks , and if there isnt any i will check my TB for one , but the TB was fine before so it shouldnt be that . 
just wanted to see where i should be with the 16v head and where eveyone else is with the same pulley


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

sorry, on the worked head, it's more like 6-7psi until 6800, then it climbed a bit.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (jwatts)*

heres a public gallery ill be adding to over time for the 16vg60
http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y62/LoN3R/16vg60/
i also have one on some MS diagrams .
http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y62/LoN3R/MS/


----------



## titosantana92 (Sep 11, 2004)

ok so. this is what i have gathered. I'm going to be doing this swap soon. i have a PL 1.8 16v head and a g60 bottom with little miles on it. so Im going to need some custom pistons form bahn brenner. i still have all the stock 16v components (distributor, oil pump, all the gears) could i just use that or would it be better just to grab a new set? Im going to need a 16v block off plate. a new timing belt. so far I have the turbo, injectors, turbo manifold, tial wastegate, and intercooler. I'm going to get a boss fuel rail and a short runner intake manifold too. what else do i need to make this happen? oh and Im not going to be running a/c.




_Modified by titosantana92 at 3:57 PM 5-15-2006_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (Scuba2001)*

dynoed today . 
and i want to say thank you to everyone that helped me work through the hard times i had with this . it pays off at the end and this is only the start of it . 
this is what i call my base run , and grow from here . 
i will be adding cams, my race head , 50mm intake , SM4 , and maybe a smaller pulley 
dynojet #'s
209whp/167 ftlbs @6300
185 ftlb peak at 5300
10.5 lbs boost
it was still pulling a little at 6300 but fuel was quiting alittle . 
thanks again guys for pushing me through those hard nights and nightmares . 
stock head , stock cams , and you know my bottomend by now


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_dynoed today . 
and i want to say thank you to everyone that helped me work through the hard times i had with this . it pays off at the end and this is only the start of it . 
this is what i call my base run , and grow from here . 
i will be adding cams, my race head , 50mm intake , SM4 , and maybe a smaller pulley 
dynojet #'s
209whp/167 ftlbs @6300
185 ftlb peak at 5300
10.5 lbs boost
it was still pulling a little at 6300 but fuel was quiting alittle . 
thanks again guys for pushing me through those hard nights and nightmares . 
stock head , stock cams , and you know my bottomend by now 

any documention of it ? i woulda loved to hear what it sounded like.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*

bull dog is working on hosting the vid and when i get home i am gonna scan the sheet.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_bull dog is working on hosting the vid and when i get home i am gonna scan the sheet. 

awesome . i wasnt doubting the #'s if you had taken it that way , jus wondering if you had pics or video to get my jolly's out of


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*









only pic i have right now , and i cannt wait to share the vid.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

here is the vid , and scans
















vid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSdkxoh1hJ0
turn it up load










_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 10:51 PM 5-17-2006_


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Alan, that thing sounds sweet. The best of both worlds, IMO. 16v, and a G60. Nice.


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

Nice curves







. Dyno looks good, how is it on the open road?








Sounds nice, too.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

















For comparison.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (OttawaG60)*








, they look the same .







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_Nice curves







. Dyno looks good, how is it on the open road?








Sounds nice, too.

it is nice , it bog's a little ( only i would notice it ) when it gets rich , but it is nice . can drive in 2nd and then mat it and holy hell breaks loss















jwatts , you think i can get more fuel up top from the chip ? i have #42s dont know how hard they are working .


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

yeah, we should be able to eek out a bit more fuel up top... among other things.


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (jwatts)*

I`ll be a different car with a 65mm pulley on there but the G60 can`t really hack it, mines gone back to get re oil sealed due to a trackday and a 65mm.. good while it lasted though http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 3rd gear wheelspins at 60mph


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

trackdays would be a pulley switch . i will probly run either a 68 or a 72 for the trackday . or just keep the rpm down to 5k max.


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (KeithMac)*


_Quote, originally posted by *KeithMac* »_I`ll be a different car with a 65mm pulley on there but the G60 can`t really hack it, mines gone back to get re oil sealed due to a trackday and a 65mm.. good while it lasted though http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 3rd gear wheelspins at 60mph









Sounds like fun.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

209whp @6300
185 ftlb @ 5300
203 @6500
176 @5500
you win








as for more fuel, I was running 42#, and didn't cross 80% duty, even @ 7100rpm


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
as for more fuel, I was running 42#, and didn't cross 80% duty, even @ 7100rpm

great to know http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif thanks


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

some dirty aba alt pics...


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

ok , so i am starting to look for more and where to go from here . i am looking into cams , i will put them on with the race head , but need to start seeign what is out there and what otheres are running . 
any ideas???? FI 16V cams. what is the best and what it working for everyone . ( also the reason you feel they are better then some )


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

Autotech Cams with a 50mm intake, some head work, and 68mm pulley on a stacked headgasket 9A bottom end peaked power at 7000+ rpm. They are definitely not the most aggressive cams out there, but how far do you want to spin the G-Lader? That was in the 220whp range, too. I'd really like to get ahold of a stock compression 2L 16V and see what the G-lader can do on top of that







.
Same cams with my shorty and 16psi peaked power at about 6900 rpm. I'm not saying that they are the only choice, but they are definitely a good choice







.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (jwatts)*

thanks , i am not looking to rev higher , but more mid power , i figure with tuning it ( cam timing ) i can get more power in the mid to high . i really dont spend much time over 5500


----------



## puebla (Sep 9, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


----------



## KeithMac (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (hazw8st)*

Kent 1602r`s for me, power kicks in at 3k rpm (you can definitley tell it`s cammed).
Get my charger back on friday and definitely not running any lower than a 68mm after having an oil seal failure (springs on the oil seals failed).
I had to replace the water pump on mine yesterday, even with the charger off for rebuild it was still a **** of a job. Anyone who`s still got theirs in bits fit a new waterpump before you bolt it all together







.
Chargecooler fitting at the weekend along with my freshened up G


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_ I'd really like to get ahold of a stock compression 2L 16V and see what the G-lader can do on top of that







.









as soon as brysons set up is finished


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (G60NUT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60NUT* »_







as soon as brysons set up is finished









i thought he dropped his comp with wiseco pistons??
anyhow.. where are you guys running charger oil return to?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_some dirty aba alt pics..

Is your crankshaft pulley machined?Also you might want to get some aluminum tubing and cut it just so your alternator sits snug inside the bracket.
Looks good either way. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Is your crankshaft pulley machined?Also you might want to get some aluminum tubing and cut it just so your alternator sits snug inside the bracket.
Looks good either way. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

yea my pulley has been machined down. bracket still needs some trimming ,just posted the pic to show how it was mounted ,.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_i thought he dropped his comp with wiseco pistons??
anyhow.. where are you guys running charger oil return to?

i drilled the block , there is a spot for it , at least on the 9a , you just have to drill it and screw in the fitting from the ph block 
also take a look at my build page on the herbys53.com site


_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 4:20 PM 6-1-2006_


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

would the oil pan work? i really dont feel like disasembling it right now..what about the holes on the oil filter neck?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*

i didnt pull it apart , just put a rag in there to stop shavings from getting in there . oil pan would work


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

ya . i dont really want to put a hole in the block as of now..i saw the caption in you build log .. ill just get a bung for the pan if no one else has any ideas.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

Hey what are you guys doing for a knock sensor? I'm running a PL bottom end for this motor and the PL has that stupid block off plate and plug for the hole...the only bumber is that the G60 knock sensor is bigger than the PL hole in the block.
Herbie I have been watching your build and I see the breather/block off plate you have. I need to use the rear charger bracket, as my U-bend won't let me put the black lower bar in to hold the charger... I had to custom make a plate, and then mill the bracket down to accept the plate, but now I need to put a knock sensor in extra hole.
Does your motor even have a knock sensor in it???


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: Oil Breather (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_Hey what are you guys doing for a knock sensor? I'm running a PL bottom end for this motor and the PL has that stupid block off plate and plug for the hole...the only bumber is that the G60 knock sensor is bigger than the PL hole in the block.
Herbie I have been watching your build and I see the breather/block off plate you have. I need to use the rear charger bracket, as my U-bend won't let me put the black lower bar in to hold the charger... I had to custom make a plate, and then mill the bracket down to accept the plate, but now I need to put a knock sensor in extra hole.
Does your motor even have a knock sensor in it???









what about the stock posistion of the knock sensor of the pl ? what happened to that?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
Does your motor even have a knock sensor in it???









yup , there is one , it is mounted behind the charger but you can reach it if need be to remove it . if you look at the early pics of it on the stand , you can see it bolted there .


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_
what about the stock posistion of the knock sensor of the pl ? what happened to that?

This bottom end does not have a knock sensor. I was going to use the hole that would be the knock sensor on the G60 (PG block. The block breather (rectangular cover) has a piece that extends from the side and plugs the hole where there would ordinarily be a knock sensor. The only problem is the hole is about 1.400" and the knock plate (threded aluminum plate insert into the cast iron block) is about 1.550". 
Herb, I noticed that your 9A has a knock sensor there next to the water pump....This PL is out of an '88 and there was no factory location!?...
Any ideas? Yes I took pics and am working on the posting...I am a little negligent about writing posts as I have all the pics but suffer from a bit of laziness and busy work/work on car schedule.











_Modified by kindbudz91G60 at 1:10 AM 6-4-2006_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (kindbudz91G60)*

i am pretty sure they are the same casting , there has to be a spot for it , get some pic up .


----------



## ozzman_g7 (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

Can this be a sticky?


----------



## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (ozzman_g7)*

It's been a long time since I posted anything in this thread because I haven't done any work to my 16v in a long while.
I finally got around to adding a support bracket to the rear of the twinscrew charger so that I don't become one of the guys posting about a blown charger. I also added a port to put the ISV back in the system so my engine will idle properly. Here are before and after pics of the bracket and ISV install.
Before

After


Now the charger/silencer intake is rigidly supported by the IC tube that is directly bolted to the intake manifold. This support increased the rigidity of the charger mount considerably. Adding the ISV back into the system has cured my idle problems. I used to have to sit in the car for about 15 min and hold the gas to keep the car at idle before it would stay running on it's own and it used to stall every time I took it out of gear and didn't blip the throttle to keep the RPM from droping to zero. Now it starts up and idles nicely right away and the RPM drops to 1k and stays there with out any throttle blips. 
Now I can finally drive and enjoy it!


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (thetatau87)*

THAT IS EXCELLENT WORK!
I've been thinking about adding the ISV back as I've had the same idle issues as you. My foot becomes very well-adapted to blipping the throttle and working the brake at the same time








However, you didn't have a support bracket for your charger? I worked w/ John and he made one up for me (during the prototype stage I suppose)...I've had it on there from day 1. I'm surprised you didn't have one?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (thetatau87)*








looks so clean . makes me want to paint some of mine silver rather then the black .


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Very nice work. I love the paint theme there.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*So clean so fresh...*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_yea my pulley has been machined down. bracket still needs some trimming ,just posted the pic to show how it was mounted ,.

Well let me know how much you trimmed yours down so I can add to the FAQ.I trimmed my PG bracket down about 5mm but that measurement will be useless for everyone since I am using 8V VWMS gears on a 20V engine so everything had to come forward in order to line up properly.
Is the distance between the 2 mounting ears (centre to centre) on that Alternator exactly 105mm?Also are you going to be adjusting the belt using the red line path?

_Quote, originally posted by *thetatau87* »_
After


Damn you should be on a BBM poster!Your still running an SNS chip right?
I wonder if that silenced Lysohlm set up will clear an Audi TT 225bhp Intake manifold.JBETZ?


----------



## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clintg60-16v* »_However, you didn't have a support bracket for your charger? I worked w/ John and he made one up for me (during the prototype stage I suppose)...I've had it on there from day 1. I'm surprised you didn't have one?

I tried working with John. He sent me 2 different brackets that don't fit a 9A with the breather block-off plate so I gave up and did it myself.


Adding the ISV back into the system will make it a little louder because the ISV allows some sound to escape when it is open, but it isn't too anoying. It is still much better than an unsilenced twinscrew with an open element cone filter.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clintg60-16v* »_THAT IS EXCELLENT WORK!
I've been thinking about adding the ISV back as I've had the same idle issues as you. My foot becomes very well-adapted to blipping the throttle and working the brake at the same time








However, you didn't have a support bracket for your charger? I worked w/ John and he made one up for me (during the prototype stage I suppose)...I've had it on there from day 1. I'm surprised you didn't have one?



Clint you can hook up your ISV with just an open hose connected to it with a check valve stuck into it.
It will open and let air in for the idle and then of course shut under boost.
So basically you do not need to add a fitting to the system.
I believe your block is a PG so we did not have any issues with the standard tail support bracket or we may have fabbed up something custom, not sure been some time now.
Brad is running the 9A, we did not have a good bracket solution when his was done.
Clint, Brad and Thane are the only three silenced G60 Lysholm 16V's that we have ever done.
Brad your engine bay looks beautiful as usual, glad you got the bracket all fixed up.


----------



## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_Clint you can hook up your ISV with just an open hose connected to it with a check valve stuck into it.
It will open and let air in for the idle and then of course shut under boost.
So basically you do not need to add a fitting to the system.


Where would he connect the hose? What set up is Clint running? I had to add a fitting because there were no unused fittings between the TB and the intake manifold that would allow the ISV to let air into the intake tract.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ISV itself a check valve? It opens to control idle and allow air in, but closes under boost. Am I missing something? I have no check valve and I don't leak any boost.
BTW...Thanks for the compliments John. My engine gots lots of







& http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif at Motorstadt III at Audi/VW World HQ in Auburn Hills, MI on Saturday.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Oil Breather (thetatau87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *thetatau87* »_
Where would he connect the hose? What set up is Clint running? I had to add a fitting because there were no unused fittings between the TB and the intake manifold that would allow the ISV to let air into the intake tract.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ISV itself a check valve? It opens to control idle and allow air in, but closes under boost. Am I missing something? I have no check valve and I don't leak any boost.
BTW...Thanks for the compliments John. My engine gots lots of







& http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif at Motorstadt III at Audi/VW World HQ in Auburn Hills, MI on Saturday.

Wow the Tex has been dead lately.
You can gut and hook up the isv to the end of the cold start rail.
Pretty sure Clint is running a PG 16V
Yes the ISV is a valve I believe it opens at about 10 psi and dumps boost. A check valve will help keep the extra boost.
Well deserved props that engine bay looks really nice!


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_

Clint you can hook up your ISV with just an open hose connected to it with a check valve stuck into it.
It will open and let air in for the idle and then of course shut under boost.
So basically you do not need to add a fitting to the system.
I believe your block is a PG so we did not have any issues with the standard tail support bracket or we may have fabbed up something custom, not sure been some time now.
Brad is running the 9A, we did not have a good bracket solution when his was done.
Clint, Brad and Thane are the only three silenced G60 Lysholm 16V's that we have ever done.
Brad your engine bay looks beautiful as usual, glad you got the bracket all fixed up.


I'll post up my "stealth ISV" in a bit...works awesome...mounted to the back of the manifold


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*

Dirty bay, but new rad hose







Apologies... try to find the ISV












Removed one of the plugs from the 16V manifold, and inserted a fitting from a 16V cold start valve. The ISV mounts up to the intake manifold support bracket with an ITG filter. No welding needed








John, remember that my 16V intake has the cold start valve area removed and smoothed/ welded shut. There is no opening there anymore....



_Modified by clintg60-16v at 6:03 PM 6-29-2006_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*

that is pretty , and i see more then the IVS back there , nice spot for the after run , i deleted mine , but that is really nice , i would of used it if i still ran mine . 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif clean stuff


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

any problems with it sucking in hot air from being back there ? granted , it onyl really opens when the motor is cold .


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (herby53-akaherby53)*

Seems to idle well...other than idle, the valve is closed. Not noting any problems yet! Nice that I don't have to "multitask" my foot between gas and brake during deceleration from high revs.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*

Anybody heard this? The back of the 16V head is a bad place to supply the charger (G60) as it is for an oil temp sender factory and is a lower pressure hole (higher in the head, 1.8 Bar oil indicator spot)







I was told the front oil flange is a better spot. What's the verdict?


----------



## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*

Nice clean work Clint! My manifold only has a small port that I didn't think was big enough for the ISV. I have it plugged in this picture.

What are you running for a crankcase vent? I'm still having problems with oil blowing out of my catch can at WOT. I think the location of my vent hose on the cam cover is getting oil thrown up in it from the cam.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Oil Breather (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_Anybody heard this? The back of the 16V head is a bad place to supply the charger (G60) as it is for an oil temp sender factory and is a lower pressure hole (higher in the head, 1.8 Bar oil indicator spot)







I was told the front oil flange is a better spot. What's the verdict?

Yes, I would also go with the top of the oil filter flange.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Oil Breather (thetatau87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *thetatau87* »_
What are you running for a crankcase vent? I'm still having problems with oil blowing out of my catch can at WOT.

The 16V's like to spew oil out of the valve cover vent and even some out of the block vent.
We always set these engines up with a catch can that drains back to the oil pan.
Have a great weekend!


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (thetatau87)*

I have my vacuum T in that capped port...for FPR and brake booster... amazing how all these setups evolve







My intake had a plug similar to a "freeze plug"...pulled it and literally screwed in a port.


----------



## vwbrandojavw (Nov 18, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i have a qusetion on how the g60 block and 16v head would work together with the different distributor setups/locations


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (vwbrandojavw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vwbrandojavw* »_i have a qusetion on how the g60 block and 16v head would work together with the different distributor setups/locations

From what I understand, you use the 16v dizzy port block off plate on the block and use a 16v distributor on the head.


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Scuba2001)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scuba2001* »_
From what I understand, you use the 16v dizzy port block off plate on the block and use a 16v distributor on the head.

You're correct. Once you replace the PG intermediate shaft with the 16V shaft, there will no longer be a drive for your old distributor location...


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (clintg60-16v)*

Hmmm, I wonder if our dizzy gizzy works in the PG???








I'll have to check this out.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
Yes, I would also go with the top of the oil filter flange.

I had an oil line from top of the oil filter, this was too much pressure and popped the oil seal on the exhaust side of the charger.
I did have the factory restrictor in place.


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (OttawaG60)*

That's odd.
I've had both the g-ladder and the lysholm on my setup fed from the oil filter flange, and never had problems all these years.
dave


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (N_TENSETUNING)*

Like this?


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (OttawaG60)*

exact-a-mongo http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

david


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (OttawaG60)*

I've fed my Lysholm from the oil filter flange for quite a while now w/ no issues...it's on the one closest to the front of the car, where the low-pressure sensor used to go... The high-pressure sensor is on the back port, is it not?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*

well i am moving on , 
if anyone is thinking about doing this conversion , i am selling my setup complete.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2705269









only selling to do something else now . http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_
I had an oil line from top of the oil filter, this was too much pressure and popped the oil seal on the exhaust side of the charger.
I did have the factory restrictor in place.


I talked to my charger builder and he thought the same, but now I've heard conflicting issues. I just drove to Dubwars from Colorado on the setup 2200 miles and the charger is still in one piece (61mm pulley) so I guess he was right....I dunno, seems like lots of different opinions.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_Hmmm, I wonder if our dizzy gizzy works in the PG???








I'll have to check this out.

Well it will not fit or work, the hole size for the dizzy is smaller.
Oh well


----------



## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
The 16V's like to spew oil out of the valve cover vent and even some out of the block vent.
We always set these engines up with a catch can that drains back to the oil pan.
Have a great weekend!









This is what I have and it still overfills the can when I go WOT for more then 2 gears. Short bursts are OK and the oil drains back into the pan, but if I stay on WOT into 3rd or 4th gear the oil blows out the catch can.
Do you have some pics of where you located the valve cover vent on 16v's?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Oil Breather (thetatau87)*

So you have it draining back to the pan and it still fills up?
We use the Beetle 2.0L breather with the oil cap on the top of it.
And run a hose over to the catch / breather / drain.
Where is your breather tied in?



_Modified by JBETZ at 2:16 PM 7-31-2006_


----------



## thetatau87 (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (JBETZ)*

My breather is connected directly to the valve cover. The other side of the catch can has a hose connected to the block breather plate.

My problem may be that there is no baffle to prevent the cam from slinging oil directly into the breather hose. I have a Beetle oil cap/breather, but I hate the way it looks. I may rig it up and see if the internal baffles in the beetle breather will solve my problem. Then work on making it look good after I confirm if it works or not


----------



## peter139 (May 4, 2005)

here another video from holland. Not mine car but an awesome ride!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7DN2cOgpaU


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: Oil Breather (clintg60-16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clintg60-16v* »_I've fed my Lysholm from the oil filter flange for quite a while now w/ no issues...it's on the one closest to the front of the car, where the low-pressure sensor used to go... The high-pressure sensor is on the back port, is it not?

Flange is high pressure, back of head is low.


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Oil Breather (OttawaG60)*

Ahh...so both flange ports are high pressure? Though one was low...maybeit was the spot for the temp sensor on the flange...old age kicking in for me a bit early...


----------



## LifeAsASuffix (Aug 24, 2005)

I've been following this thread, read as much as I can, now i have a question. I have been collecting parts to start my 16v conversion on my G60 rado, I have a complete 1.8 16v engine, the scirocco intake, and of course the g60 engine in the car. Ok, my question: I have been considering the 2.0 ABA route for the bottom end, I have a line on a complete 96 ABA. it's OBDII so I'm not sure if it's worth the attempt. I'm trying to make this a reliable powerful engine, nothing extreme. Am I creating more trouble for myself by adding an ABA into the mix or is it going to be the same amount of pain either way?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Oil Breather (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
We use the Beetle 2.0L breather with the oil cap on the top of it.
_Modified by JBETZ at 2:16 PM 7-31-2006_

Oh yeah, how does you Corrado's hood close with that John?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (LifeAsASuffix)*

By the way, now that my charger is blown, I have realized how gay it is to run a non-charger 16VG60. The charger bypass was a lot easier with the 8V....
Anybody with pics, ideas about a NA 16V setup? (aside from moving the alternator back up front, switching brackets, water pump bolts, pulley alignment, belt, and assorted wiring...) 
I've been banging my head about another G60 rebuild and I realize that this car really would haul-ass if it had a turbo that (like T3/T4 hybrid) hit 25lbs. boost. Is there a 16V60 to 16V turbo conversion thread??








No seriously though anybody that has had to do a rebuild and still had to drive their car? NE info?
Page 15 > what?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

Ahem, No-one with blown chargers?


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Ive not seen any info on switching back to N/A 16v from G60. I doubt it would be easy as you have to remove alot of the spacers and everything else. IMO, if at all possible it'd be best to park the car while the charger is getting rebuilt.
Steve


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*

Yeah, well that's not really an option. I've been running this thing now for a couple weeks, and it is lame, but to be fair much faster than a non-charged 8v.
I had to switch e-prom chips back to the stock chip to keep my car from choking on fuel. Still deciding on a forced induction setup....G-lader, Lysholm, or T3/T4 hybrid....


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

when i sold my intergratin lit , i was gonna run it NA for alittle to finish out the race year . switching it back seemed very easy , but i ended up selling the whole motor anyway. 
what i did before i pulled it to sell it ( motor ) , used a gti intake , aba alt setup and called it aday .


----------



## evil-e (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

Get an Eaton M90 blower from a Ford T-bird Supercoupe and make some brackets to make it fit. I just got one shipped with the outlet plate and the boost tubes for $200.00 shipped. I'm in the process of getting this all together for my ABA/16V M90. A few people are already running these on the stock G60's w/ pretty good results. Plus, even if you blow one of these up (which is pretty hard to do from the sounds of it), you can get another one for less than half the cost of the rebuild parts alone for a G60







. I know it's not as efficient as the Lysholm, or the G60, but for the price, it's worth it.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (evil-e)*


_Quote, originally posted by *evil-e* »_Get an Eaton M90 blower from a Ford T-bird Supercoupe and make some brackets to make it fit. I just got one shipped with the outlet plate and the boost tubes for $200.00 shipped. I'm in the process of getting this all together for my ABA/16V M90. A few people are already running these on the stock G60's w/ pretty good results. Plus, even if you blow one of these up (which is pretty hard to do from the sounds of it), you can get another one for less than half the cost of the rebuild parts alone for a G60







. I know it's not as efficient as the Lysholm, or the G60, but for the price, it's worth it.









its also a heatpump


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

We ran a few more parts to match up the remaining parts to make more full BBM 16V Ltd. integration kits.
We have 10 left and this is truly it for the 16V Supercharger Integration kit from BBM.
Thanks again for your business and support.


----------



## ozzman_g7 (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

If I did all this work, then wanted to put a 20v head later on, will it be easier to do this or would I need to change the pistons again, and relocate the alt again? etc.
thanks


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

I looking for these measurements so i know to send a radiator back or not.








*1.* Distrance from end of radiator support to end of charger bypass inlet.
*2.* Distance from end of radiator support to charger inlet body.
Let me know you exact starting points of the measurements aswell , such as if you started @ the fender end of the rad support or from the bolt. Also this is for a *Mk2. A2 . golf 2 , jetta 2 chassis only*


----------



## evil-e (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_
its also a heatpump









Just a couple of months ago, you said you had an M90 on your "watched list" on ebay.
Show me a form of forced induction that isn't a "heat pump".
You could still get an M90 and a liquid to air intercooler setup cheaper than a rebuilt G60, but to each his own I guess...









_Modified by evil-e at 10:15 PM 9-21-2006_


_Modified by evil-e at 10:17 PM 9-21-2006_


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (evil-e)*


_Quote, originally posted by *evil-e* »_








Show me a form of forced induction that isn't a "heat pump".
You could still get an M90 and a liquid to air intercooler setup cheaper than a rebuilt G60, but to each his own I guess...









compression causes heat, thats a simple principle . maybe if you run water/alky injection through the charger like the cobalt guys are doing.


----------



## evil-e (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: (golf198v2.0)*

Well, I know the Eatons' aren't the most efficient chargers out there, but they're def. affordable. Plus if you're not building for all out max. power and aren't going to be overspinning the thing with a good intercooler, it should work decently.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (evil-e)*


_Quote, originally posted by *evil-e* »_Well, I know the Eatons' aren't the most efficient chargers out there, but they're def. affordable. Plus if you're not building for all out max. power and aren't going to be overspinning the thing with a good intercooler, it should work decently.










exactly , if your going for a reliable daily driver , that you need online ALL the time itll work , its just not gonna be a performance monster.


----------



## evil-e (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_

exactly , if your going for a reliable daily driver , that you need online ALL the time itll work , its just not gonna be a performance monster.

Right, that's my goal. Get it up and running and (knock on wood) have it stay that way. Hopefully for a while. I'd be super happy if this motor I'm putting together makes close to 200 whp. Plus, if it doesn't make the power I want, or whatever, I can always upgrade to a Lysholm/Rotrex down the road.








I told myself 9 months ago when I picked up my GLI I wasn't going to do that much too it, and here I am. I've got serious issues. Before I know it, I'll have to get another car that I know will run every day to get back and forth to work. Oh well I guess it's just who I am, I just can't seem to leave things alone.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (evil-e)*


_Quote, originally posted by *evil-e* »_
Oh well, I guess it's just who I am, I just can't seem to leave things alone.










.
Ditto! Unfortunatly my other daily is a '48 Willy's jeep, so I must keep the C running...NA or boosted.


----------



## inkfreak74x9 (Sep 29, 2006)

You guys got some great stuff here. I am puting this engine in an 88 scirocco, rith the alternator relocation bracket. Anyone know wich rear motor mount bracket to use. The stock one wont accept the kit.


----------



## golf198v2.0 (Nov 6, 2005)

*Re: (inkfreak74x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *inkfreak74x9* »_You guys got some great stuff here. I am puting this engine in an 88 scirocco, rith the alternator relocation bracket. Anyone know wich rear motor mount bracket to use. The stock one wont accept the kit.
 
what bracket are you using?
id say a 2l 16v one.


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: (golf198v2.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v2.0* »_what bracket are you using?
id say a 2l 16v one.

A 1.8L and 2.0L bracket is the same. But I recall that BBM replaces that bracket in their "kit" that they make. I could be wrong though.


----------



## ozzman_g7 (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: (ozzman_g7)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ozzman_g7* »_If I did all this work, then wanted to put a 20v head later on, will it be easier to do this or would I need to change the pistons again, and relocate the alt again? etc.
thanks

Anyone??


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Thought you guys would like a peak at the latest incarnation of one of the local 16Vg60s here in the ATL.
2L head with supertech valves and portwork with some cat cams.
8.5:1 wiseco pistons
big fmic
78mm pulley and aobut 4psi boost... awaiting 68mm pulley.
notice that there's no welding on the intake


----------



## numbnuts (Jun 1, 2006)

Man this thread has been useful. Am in the mock up stage atm. Mk1 16v g60 here we come.


----------



## L8 APEKS (Feb 2, 2006)

*Re: (numbnuts)*

re: Eaton M90...
If you do use it, post pics/measurements of the brackets. That's the only thing holding many people back from using it...people do one-offs and keep everything a secret.








Make a few extra sets and sell them here, or post the measurements so we can fab them up locally! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_Thought you guys would like a peak at the latest incarnation of one of the local 16Vg60s here in the ATL.
2L head with supertech valves and portwork with some cat cams.
8.5:1 wiseco pistons
big fmic
78mm pulley and aobut 4psi boost... awaiting 68mm pulley.
notice that there's no welding on the intake


















What fuel rail is that?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (OttawaG60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OttawaG60* »_What fuel rail is that?

AWP 1.8T


----------



## inkfreak74x9 (Sep 29, 2006)

*Re: (golf198v2.0)*

One of my customers had the mount bracket that is in BBM's picture on his 2.0L, so I asked if he had another from his engine swap and he did. That fixed that problem so I knocked some $ off his repair bill for the part. He told me his friend did the same BBM kit on a Jetts III and told me he would stop by so I could take a peek. 9 days latter, I still aint seen it.


----------



## inkfreak74x9 (Sep 29, 2006)

I have an old Bosch air flow meter(vane type) that was originally in the car. What do I use for air metering now? 
I dont know if I skipped over that part in all the reading I have done. Also quick question,what alternator with serp. belt pulley will drop on to BBM's relocate bracket?


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

Hello and this is my engine!


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

_Modified by BI-G60 at 8:08 AM 10-14-2006_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (BI-G60)*

lol , like that catch can mounting


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_Thought you guys would like a peak at the latest incarnation of one of the local 16Vg60s here in the ATL.
2L head with supertech valves and portwork with some cat cams.
8.5:1 wiseco pistons
big fmic
78mm pulley and aobut 4psi boost... awaiting 68mm pulley.
notice that there's no welding on the intake


















ATL is now the new home of 16vg60's ... bryson , mike... now this guy


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

ok looks bad,but i must never empty the oil catcher!


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (BI-G60)*

BI-G60 - what radiator did you use with that intercooler?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (BI-G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BI-G60* »_ok looks bad,but i must never empty the oil catcher!

its just weird mounting thats all.


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

Hello! 
this is a Golf MK2 GTD radiator plus vr6 radiator fan!The original g60 radiator is smaller.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (BI-G60)*


_Quote »_Golf MK2 GTD radiator 

What is a GTD? do you have a part number?


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

@OttawaG60 
i have forget to say, it´s a turbo diesel 1,6l 80HP,engine code:SB.And i have installed the plastic side box from G60 radiator in these!!!


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (BI-G60)*

*4 kits remaining*
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2450792


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

This sucks so much, becaue I need a kit so bad to get my engine build underway, but dont even have any cash..
Im going to be left without a kit


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scuba2001* »_This sucks so much, becaue I need a kit so bad to get my engine build underway, but dont even have any cash..
Im going to be left without a kit









you dont need a damn kit..


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (golf198v3.0)*

thinking of putting a 16v head on my pg, but i dont want to pull pistons, or my motor... any other options?? great thread btw http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_thinking of putting a 16v head on my pg, but i dont want to pull pistons, or my motor... any other options?? great thread btw http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

The G60 pistons have a big fat scavenger boss sticking up.
You will need to swap out the pistons or go with a true 16V engine or an ABA 2.0L 8V engine.


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

thats what i was afraid of







ill prolly leave my jetta alone and build an 16v g60 for my caddy...


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*

heres mine so far, i think im going to go with the aba alt tho... does anyone have any more pics of alts mounted under the charger to the charger brkt? ...also, is it ok to run the waterpump backwards?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scuba2001* »_This sucks so much, becaue I need a kit so bad to get my engine build underway, but dont even have any cash..
Im going to be left without a kit









And we all know how awesome the BBM kit is... It doesn't come with one scrap of paper that tells anything about the products or how to install them. Also, the aluminum bracket that the tensioner mounts too (and slips on the charger bracket) is siezed on my G-60 bracket.
When the tensioner bracket siezed on the charger bracket it stopped the tensioner from doing anything and locked the serp belt under tension. This in turn was too tight on the supercharger and smoked the mainshaft bearings and seals. Now, the charger passes oil right down the mainshaft seals...sweet design BBM.
Then when I asked John about this he said "no that's never happened before, but I might put a grease zerk in the tensioner bracket if I were you". Well John, that would have been a good idea for YOU to do, since you're selling the kits. Oh yeah, sorry I don't have the $3K to buy your Lysholm, but my G-60 WAS working just fine.
Long story short the BBM "kit" gets you pointed in the right direction, but certainly is not a turnkey kit, nor is it engineered that well. For the cost I would try to source the components used on the net.








$0.02 exactly.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_heres mine so far, i think im going to go with the aba alt tho... does anyone have any more pics of alts mounted under the charger to the charger brkt? ...also, is it ok to run the waterpump backwards?


ahem 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2610427


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_...also, is it ok to run the waterpump backwards?

Considering the vanes on the waterpump are clockwise,I would not run them counterclockwise.In order to make the ABA alternator fit,you have to do some grinding of the AC supports on the charger bracket.The ABA alternator does work though and your going to want to run your belt system something similar to this:


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

ok, sweet! that looks alot less confusing and looks like pretty good routing... 
does it matter if the donor pg parts are from a '92 obd1???
what else will i need from the pg besides the following...
G60 throttlebody
G60 engine harness/ecu
G60 Fuel Injectors 
G60 Idle stabilizer valve (ISV) 
G60 CO% potentiometer 
G60 Lower water pump pipe 
Upper and lower coolant hoses 
G60 Radiator 
can you think of anything else?




_Modified by 2deepn2dubs at 11:56 PM 10-26-2006_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_ It doesn't come with one scrap of paper that tells anything about the products or how to install them.
the BBM "kit" gets you pointed in the right direction, but certainly is not a turnkey kit,
$0.02 exactly.


that is for sure . thats why i made my build pages cause i couldnt fin everything in one place . I spent hours looking at the BBM picture to figure out how to get it on right . The Yahoo group is good , but the information is so scattered around and hard to fine . this post helped alot for me .....

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for this thread
oh and http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for mine


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

Be careful with the size of the alt down below the charger, I know I had problems with it hitting (ever so slightly) the subframe.
There are some tiny alt's out there, might be worth whole looking at.


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_








this looks like the g60 alt... your right, looks like it will hit the subframe... ? ...i think the aba alt is smaller...


_Modified by 2deepn2dubs at 11:28 AM 10-27-2006_


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*

so anyone know, does it matter if the donor pg parts are from a '92 obd1???


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_so anyone know, does it matter if the donor pg parts are from a '92 obd1???

what parts are you planning on using?


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (golf198v3.0)*

Is there a difference in these parts between obd1 and obd exempt?
G60 Fuel Injectors and FPR 
G60 Idle stabilizer valve (ISV) 
G60 Digifant1 ECU and engine wire harness 
G60 Digifant control relay 
G60 Oxygen sensor 
G60 Water temperature sensor (blue) 
G60 CO% potentiometer 
G60 Relays, fuel pump 
G60 Lower water pump pipe 
Upper and lower coolant hoses 
G60 Radiator and fan assembly 



_Modified by 2deepn2dubs at 6:11 PM 10-27-2006_


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*

does anyone know can i use obd1 corrado parts for a 9a16vg60??
are they the same as obd exempt???


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*

dont know about your smag out there , but i used all obd 1 stuff when i did mine


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

ok kewl thats all i needed to know, smog not an issue with diesel title...


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*

next q... theres a coolant flange on the 9a that is in the way of the rear charger brkt... ?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_next q... theres a coolant flange on the 9a that is in the way of the rear charger brkt... ?

charger bracket goes to the passenger side rear mount . So i would think no.


----------



## gillano (Aug 4, 2005)

Wizard-of-OD.....who makes those cogged pulleys?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (gillano)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gillano* »_Wizard-of-OD.....who makes those cogged pulleys?


g-werks . rpm motorsport. all european


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (golf198v3.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v3.0* »_
charger bracket goes to the passenger side rear mount . So i would think no. 
no, im saying there is a coolant flange in the way of the rear charger brkt... what are people doing to delete it?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_no, im saying there is a coolant flange in the way of the rear charger brkt... what are people doing to delete it?

by the output side of the charger? i havent seen anyone run that bracket yet. most ppl here are running a block off plate of the breather and running it to a can aswell.
Some ppl run ABF coolant flanges to help route the hoses though . im running a wicked weird rad setup in working on right now so i cant be of much help with that.

* compliments of herby*


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (golf198v3.0)*

...you have to run the brkt otherwise there will be uneven pressure on the main shaft and will cause premature wear on bearings and seals!!!


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_...you have to run the brkt otherwise there will be uneven pressure on the main shaft and will cause premature wear on bearings and seals!!!

then there is gonna be quite a bit of worn bearings here.


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

I agree that instructions would be helpful. 
I also agree that it is not a turnkey kit, but only because some rad hoses and boost tubes need to be modified. 
You must have installed the tensioner improperly? It seems as though you may have failed to grease the assembly prior to installation. Or you used the improper grease?
I would think "assumptions" on assembly seemed to cause the part failure, not an engineering deficiency.
Bump for this thread http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (clintg60-16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clintg60-16v* »_ 
I agree that instructions would be helpful. 
I also agree that it is not a turnkey kit, but only because some rad hoses and boost tubes need to be modified. 
You must have installed the tensioner improperly? It seems as though you may have failed to grease the assembly prior to installation. Or you used the improper grease?
I would think "assumptions" on assembly seemed to cause the part failure, not an engineering deficiency.
Bump for this thread http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


I'm pretty sure I have an extra billet tension bracket if needed.
A little grease will keep this from happening again. I'd also have to say that this part locking up would not cause the problem you have with your g-lader. An extra tight belt that has a fixed tensioner heats the belt up, it stretches and then gets pretty loose.
This has been a difficult product to support, so many variables and different ways that you can configure the parts and engines.
If we did supply instructions I would need to spend at least one full year with several engines on a stand, a g-lader and Lysholm and also make every single simple little part to cover every little detail. I'm talking about the boost return and IC tubes. Oh I better get an MkI, II & Corrado and also fit up custom IC kits up in every one of these and also write instructions for them. Oh don't forget the European cars, better import some right hand drive cars for the Uk guys and also write up instructions for them. The manual would be thick and require on going updates for years, a full time job for a couple of guys in itself. The parts we make for this combo are pretty straight forward. If you cant figure them out this is not a project for you. The integration kit would way more money and not even sell or have existed at all. It is already a very low volume parts group and now discontinued. Believe it or not there are about 200 BBM integration kits out there, worldwide. We did this parts group run for 5 or mabye even 6 years now. The even funnier thing is 9 out of 10 customers don't even read fricken instructions anyway.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (2deepn2dubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2deepn2dubs* »_...you have to run the brkt otherwise there will be uneven pressure on the main shaft and will cause premature wear on bearings and seals!!!

i ran the bottom arm braket and it was fine . supports it enough . 
i have a pic somewhere 
take a look at my build pages as i made them for people wanting to do this . there is ( i think ) 17 pages and i tryed my best to get as detailed as i could. 
http://herbys53.com/06MOTORBUILD.html and on .....
this page shows the braket 
http://herbys53.com/06MOTORBUILDPAGE11.html


----------



## 2deepn2dubs (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

hey nice build info, i read all 17 pages great work! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vwbrandojavw (Nov 18, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

i have a g90 60 corrado, and a 87 16v gti. i want to put the 16v head on the g60 block and i want to turbo it, but not sure what to do about the distibuter internals? and do you need to relocate the altinator if you dont use the supercharger?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (vwbrandojavw)*

Yo, I finally put my thread up. Here's the link: 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2924071
Check the rear charger bracket and PCV hose...








Page 17...damn


_Modified by kindbudz91G60 at 8:29 PM 11-12-2006_


----------



## ZX6R1033 (Oct 5, 2005)

Late addition, quick question. If you are going to ditch the G-ladder in favor of a turbo, is there A reason why you could not relocate the alternator to the stock SC location?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (ZX6R1033)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ZX6R1033* »_Late addition, quick question. If you are going to ditch the G-ladder in favor of a turbo, is there A reason why you could not relocate the alternator to the stock SC location? 

youll just need to fab something..


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (golf198v3.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v3.0* »_
youll just need to fab something..

Fab nothin! Get a PL 16 valve alt bracket (the cast one that weighs like 20 lbs.)





_Modified by kindbudz91G60 at 8:30 PM 11-12-2006_


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Compression ratio*

Is anyone out there running stock PL compression (10.5:1) with a 78mm (stock) pulley? 
My setup was running a 61mm pulley with 9.5:1 compression. I have the headgasket spacer. I was thinking higher compression and a larger pulley would compliment each other. So if I ditched the spacer and ran the stock pulley do you guys think I would have knock problems? 
I was thinking that instead of more boost with lower compression that less boost with higher compression would be better







...maybe??
I know the charger would last a lot longer anyway. BTW what was the comp. ratio of the VWMS race 16VG60's that were made in '89?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
Fab nothin! Get a PL 16 valve alt bracket (the cast one that weighs like 20 lbs.)

_Modified by kindbudz91G60 at 8:30 PM 11-12-2006_


if you ran the stock g60 bracket setup you would.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Compression ratio (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_Is anyone out there running stock PL compression (10.5:1) with a 78mm (stock) pulley? 
My setup was running a 61mm pulley with 9.5:1 compression. I have the headgasket spacer. I was thinking higher compression and a larger pulley would compliment each other. So if I ditched the spacer and ran the stock pulley do you guys think I would have knock problems? 
I was thinking that instead of more boost with lower compression that less boost with higher compression would be better







...maybe??
I know the charger would last a lot longer anyway. BTW what was the comp. ratio of the VWMS race 16VG60's that were made in '89?



ANYONE??


----------



## zkillergt (May 29, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

sorry, i just flew over these pages, so i may have mist it, but has anyone tried using S2 rods and pistons in a PL block? they are easy to come by over here in europe.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Compression ratio (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_

ANYONE??

I did this exact thing on our very first 16V Ltd. customers car.
When we ran it at the stock compression with the stock 78mm g-lader pulley it was a bit finicky.
We would tune it in and it would be fine and then the customer called and said it would ping slightly on hills and mid throttle boost tip in.
We played with it a few times and finally just dropped the compression with the head gasket.
He still daily drives this car today.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: Compression ratio (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
I did this exact thing on our very first 16V Ltd. customers car.
When we ran it at the stock compression with the stock 78mm g-lader pulley it was a bit finicky.
We would tune it in and it would be fine and then the customer called and said it would ping slightly on hills and mid throttle boost tip in.
We played with it a few times and finally just dropped the compression with the head gasket.
He still daily drives this car today.









good to hear http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: Compression ratio (golf198v3.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v3.0* »_
good to hear http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Yes...
I'm hoping that the big FMIC and the altitude (5000ft.) above sea level will work with the 78mm.
John, if I wanted to switch back to the head gasket spacer can I order just the steel pieces (gaskets), w/ no alum. spacer?


----------



## DAMACGON (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: Compression ratio (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_

ANYONE??

Well i made a test and used stock 16V 1.8 PL/KR Pistons with the stock compresion, and try to tune the **** up with 70MM and 78MM...is a bit difficult, but it runs very nice, but if you have knock the pistons would crack, on a motor i tested i had a bit of knock and the pistons cracked







.. have to say PL Pistons are real **** .. i should take same pics














my 2cents mate, don't do it with ****ty pistons.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: Compression ratio (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
Yes...
I'm hoping that the big FMIC and the altitude (5000ft.) above sea level will work with the 78mm.
John, if I wanted to switch back to the head gasket spacer can I order just the steel pieces (gaskets), w/ no alum. spacer?

There is no aluminum spacer in the assembly.
It is stainless steel and assembled together.
You might get away with the stock compression and that IC at your altitude.
I loose 2-3 psi here in Bend Oregon and gain it back when around sea level.
Have a great weekend.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

_Quote »_BTW what was the comp. ratio of the VWMS race 16VG60's that were made in '89?


8.8:1


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

So in a typical build, it would be safe to run 9.0:1 compression and not have too many serious issues?
I ask this, because I see alot of people running 8, 8.5, and up to 9.5:1 compression. My head was shaved down .003" from what I recall from the machine shop.


----------



## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*

9.5 should be fine with the right tuning. Keep in mind the G60 can't push enough air to get the boost up to much more than 12 psi


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (OttawaG60)*

If I go hard up to 3rd gear I can peak 12.5 psi but it fails to 11 quickly. I am running 3 deg. cam retard. Was running @ 0 mark w/ only 9psi.


----------



## ozzman_g7 (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: (1.9..16vTurbo)*

I read some pages but didn't find any info, can I use a ABA block and 16v head and would it clear the hood, and use the g60 bracket and same motor mounts on a g60 corrado??


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (ozzman_g7)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ozzman_g7* »_I read some pages but didn't find any info, can I use a ABA block and 16v head and would it clear the hood, and use the g60 bracket and same motor mounts on a g60 corrado??

Yes it will clear the hood assuming its a Corrado engine bay.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

why can't you just use this head gasket/spacer on a 9A instead of swapping pistons?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brilliantyellowg60* »_ why can't you just use this head gasket/spacer on a 9A instead of swapping pistons?

You can but remember your trying to drop the CR by almost 2 points. (10.8:1 --> 8.8:1).Money spent on a head gasket spacer is better off spent on machining the piston crown.
p.s. Your reading the wrong thread.Your supposed to be reading the 20V G60 thread.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
You can but remember your trying to drop the CR by almost 2 points. (10.8:1 --> 8.8:1).Money spent on a head gasket spacer is better off spent on machining the piston crown.
p.s. Your reading the wrong thread.Your supposed to be reading the 20V G60 thread.









no cheap 20v's in the junkyards near me








so how much would need to be machined off 9A pistons to get them to ~8.5:1?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brilliantyellowg60* »_
no cheap 20v's in the junkyards near me








so how much would need to be machined off 9A pistons to get them to ~8.5:1?

9A pistons are flat tops.
You do not want to machine these down and make them thinner.
Just run a spacer gasket.
You could go ABA 2.0L with the 16V head and get around 8.5:1


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
You do not want to machine these down and make them thinner.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

Ah yes, there is a small squish band.
I'd still rather keep the squish band and run the thicker gasket.
A little squish band is better than no squish with boost.
Also there are countless engine calculators out there.
You can cc your head and piston and figure out just about any combination with a little research.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_









these are machined 9A pistons?

_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_Ah yes, there is a small squish band.
I'd still rather keep the squish band and run the thicker gasket.
A little squish band is better than no squish with boost.


Do you sell a spacer gasket setup?
The spacer seems like the way to go for me. I run a spacer in my VRT and am running double the stock whp on stock 140K used junkyard internals















Pistons are expensive










_Modified by brilliantyellowg60 at 12:36 PM 12-27-2006_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

ill be running a spacer on my 9a 16v. and we are local . Ill prolly get it dyno's @ morgans when its done so you can see how it works.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brilliantyellowg60* »_
these are machined 9A pistons?
Do you sell a spacer gasket setup?
The spacer seems like the way to go for me. I run a spacer in my VRT and am running double the stock whp on stock 140K used junkyard internals















Pistons are expensive









_Modified by brilliantyellowg60 at 12:36 PM 12-27-2006_

Yes we do
http://bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi....html


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
Yes we do


awesome and nice price, but it says it only drops the compression one point so it would go from 10.8:1 -->9.8:1
Can you make me a thicker spacer? I need it down to 8.8:1 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
maybe i will shave the pistons a bit and use the spacer............


_Modified by brilliantyellowg60 at 2:23 PM 12-27-2006_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
Yes we do
http://bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi....html









I had to drill the dowel hole on the left side of the spacer,


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (golf198v3.0)*

anyone have a part # or pic of the VWMS 16V G60 Syncro exhaust manifold?


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brilliantyellowg60* »_anyone have a part # or pic of the VWMS 16V G60 Syncro exhaust manifold?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*

all i have


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (golf198v3.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v3.0* »_all i have









thanks, i can kinda see it








anyone know what museum this motor is in?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brilliantyellowg60* »_
thanks, i can kinda see it








anyone know what museum this motor is in?

wolfsburg . dunno exactly . It reminds me of a ABA manifold.


----------



## yllwcorrado (Jul 1, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Anyone ever have their ecu fry itself and leave all four injecters open long enough to stall itself out, fill the intake manifold with fuel, spue fuel out of the throttle body and all while draining down to the intercooler??


----------



## RaraK69 (Jan 16, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (yllwcorrado)*


_Quote, originally posted by *yllwcorrado* »_Anyone ever have their ecu fry itself and leave all four injecters open long enough to stall itself out, fill the intake manifold with fuel, spue fuel out of the throttle body and all while draining down to the intercooler??

rofl.....yes. on a digifant 2 mk2. i was never able to 100% figure out the problem other than grounds, ecu once...fried 100 miles later. then replaced entire engine harness. and sold it







dont know if it ever broke again.
my assumption is always grounds with digifant.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (yllwcorrado)*

That totally sucks! No I've thankfully never had that happen. I think if it were me, that would be motivation enough for standalone...


----------



## hotrados (Jul 26, 2005)

bump to keep this on my watched topics when build time arises...


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

anyone looking for a 20V fuel rail?I have a couple for sale.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jimsG60* »_Aha.. took a photo of the ECU in Summer 05
















And here's the 16vG60!










_Quote, originally posted by *jimsG60* »_Some more of the car before I head off for the weekend. These are pretty much all I have. You can see the 'one off' arm rest on the interior shot. Its a bit of a hack but it was a "factory item" as Karmann did make it.
And yes - it was me who posted up about it being the car of the then Karmann CEO. He only did 11,000km's in it though.. I'd have been doing a LOT more in a 16vG60!!
























What I would give just to own that car.. or at least that engine! VWMS only made like 70 something of those engines.. so rare.. so cool..









_Modified by jimsG60 at 1:32 AM 2-24-2007_


----------



## ozzman_g7 (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

I'm starting my project right now, I have a aba block and a 2.0 16v passat complete engine, The aba motor that I have is made in mexico, it has the oil squirts, does this engine have the forged crank??? Thanks


----------



## 13f1p (Feb 16, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (ozzman_g7)*

should be. i've been working on same thing, but using a 1.8 head


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (13f1p)*

anyone have some MSnS MSq files for me ?
send them to ; [email protected]
TIA.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (golf198v3.0)*


_Quote, originally posted by *golf198v3.0* »_anyone have some MSnS MSq files for me ?
send them to ; [email protected]
TIA.

Check the Patatron forums http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Check the Patatron forums http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

been there.


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (golf198v3.0)*

currently working on a 16v lysholm
here is what i've done so far

















my only issue is the rear braket that does not align properly with the holes of the engin mount braket...i'll have to work on that

















_Modified by gti16v_87 at 7:19 PM 3-23-2007_


_Modified by gti16v_87 at 5:32 PM 3-24-2007_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

put the arm on the other side . should line up for you . http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## G60 CAB (Oct 26, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_put the arm on the other side . should line up for you . http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Exactly what I was thinking.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_put the arm on the other side . should line up for you . http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Actually I had that same problem with the BBM bracket not lineing up right. I tried it first with the G60 boss for the motor, then the 16V one. Neither boss on either side of the alt bracket worked (lined up correctly) I don't even run that bracket on mine. 
Also if you're putting that motor in a Corrado that gay-ass beetle PCV breather won't clear a G60 hood... Trust me, I've already let John @ BBM know what I thought of that part.








Nice to see another crazy mofo like me in the world building another 16VG60, or Lysholm.


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (kindbudz91G60)*

thank guys for all the good comments but i've tried putting the braket the other side even before posting and none of the hole line up so i guess i'll have to either bend the braket a little bit or else drill bigger holes








as for the engine it's going in a mark 2 golf so i think i'll have enough clearence for the beetle vent cap


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (kindbudz91G60)*

i ran mine on the other side and just had to have things lose , then get everything bolted up and tighten it all.
http://herbys53.com/06MOTORBUILDPAGE5.html


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

i had your web site for reference since the biginning
it has help me a few times thanks but still i will have to work something for the braket







...and it suppose to be a kit bolt on. for the price i paid i had a few issues that shouldnt have happen
i cant wait to finish it though


_Modified by gti16v_87 at 1:59 PM 3-24-2007_


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

i would not call it a bolt on kit . main reason is there is no instructions. glad you are using my site . i keep paying for it even though it hasnt been updated in a year. ( working on that part with a new web designer , hoping for big things with it as i have so much more to add to it . 20v BT swap, camber plate install , SM4 install, wide body kit, ....... and so on plus more cars to update on it . ) 
just good to know that i pay for it each month and it is getting used. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
good luck with the build . i had alot of fun building mine .


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

i got a little question for those of you who are using Power Steering.
which pulley do i have to use. i know it's a deep one since it goes on the BBM crank pulley but i dont remember which one


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

i used the stock g60 pulley for it . then you use the spacer that the kit comes with on the pump .








edit to clear it up better . i mean the stock crank pulley that turned the PS ,i still used the BBM crank pulley 


_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 8:12 PM 3-24-2007_


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

thank you for the precisions


----------



## oneunicrone (Jun 26, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

http://www.rp-motorsport.de/en...t.htm

the 16v limited kit caost 996 ueros so it like 1800 in us money check it out its reallt cool


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (oneunicrone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *oneunicrone* »_http://www.rp-motorsport.de/en...t.htm[/url





Wow thats a nice alternator relocation bracket

_Quote, originally posted by *http://www.rp-motorsport.de/en/g-lader/* »_


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (oneunicrone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *oneunicrone* »_http://www.rp-motorsport.de/en...t.htm

the 16v limited kit caost 996 ueros so it like 1800 in us money check it out its reallt cool 

i tired to buy that kit and they said 4-6weeks out due to part production
once it's in stock i plan on buying it http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (brilliantyellowg60)*

the local 16VG60 in the ATL has one of those intakes. Very nice piece, but it took like 4 or 5 months to get it. Unless you pick it up personally in Germany, plan on it being a long term project







.


----------



## oneunicrone (Jun 26, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*

well i just got run over at work and im going to get some crazzy amount of money i hope from worker come ill be out of work for 10-15 week and at 40hrs at 7 dollars and hour ill bauy a lot of crap fro my gti 16vg60 project7 and my killer corrado 
right now im have a big back issue but i have to be on my feet in know time


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (oneunicrone)*

i got a question about the oil pan
on my 16vg60 i was thinking about using a 1.6 TD oil pan since it already has the oil return flange. that way i wont have to drill a nice shrick pan.
would it be a good thing to do?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

nope , if you do that , your return line will have to rap around the motor . 
drill out the block ( it is threaded the same as a g60 block , but not drilled through all the way. ) 
simple and oem http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
if you need to know where , look at the g60 block and then your 9a block . or let me know and i can show you more detail. 
you didnt get a pan with your intergration kit ?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti16v_87* »_i got a question about the oil pan
on my 16vg60 i was thinking about using a 1.6 TD oil pan since it already has the oil return flange. that way i wont have to drill a nice shrick pan.
would it be a good thing to do? 
















BTW I have a Schrick pan...
Do what Herby said. Or you can look at my build thread =>> http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...24071
There is no reason you cannot drill the block. It's already threaded for you, just poke the hole through the block with a smaller dia. drill bit (so you don't f&^k up the threads.










_Modified by kindbudz91G60 at 8:42 AM 3-31-2007_


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (kindbudz91G60)*

no i didnt get an oil pan in the integration kit and i e mailed Jbetz and he said it doesn't come with it


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

if you get the kit for a twin screw it does. 
just drill out the block . you can thread in the oem oil return line . take you about 1 min http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti16v_87* »_i got a question about the oil pan
on my 16vg60 i was thinking about using a 1.6 TD oil pan since it already has the oil return flange. that way i wont have to drill a nice shrick pan.
would it be a good thing to do? 

The Shrick pan has a casted boss front and back that you can drill / tap for an oil return fitting.


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

john , have you gotten my emails ?


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

i did order the twin screw integration kit and did NOT get the oil pan
as for drilling the block is there any place where it's best to do it because i would feel much more confortable to drill an oil pan rather than a bloc...since Jbetz says i can drill a shrick pan no problem, i would much more consider this option


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

i would not drill a shrick pan . those are nice and $$ . 
if you have a g60 block to look at . look where the oil return is . ( if looking at the block , under the oil filter to the left ) . your 9a block has the same thing and it is threaded for your g60 return line already , you just need to drill it all the way through . very simple and takes less then a min. i put some rags in the block right behind it and then drilled . thinkg for you to hit back there , just to keep the metal out of the inside . 
here is a pic where i put mine , plus instructions on how i did it . 
http://herbys53.com/06MOTORBUILDPAGE10.html


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

if you really want . i have a intergration pan with returns on it already . it came with the it i bought . just found it today . 50 plus shipping , but would just drill the block . nothing wrong with making sure you return is higher then oil line anyway.


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

thank you for all the usefull infos.
i see the threaded hole for the return oil on my pg bloc but as i can see it goes all the way through. Do i have to make it bigger?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

bigger? i think you just use the fitting from the g60 line . i wouldnt make it bigger


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

What I am saying is that the Shrick pan has bosses specifically casted into it front and rear for oil fittings.
I would not drill and tap into a block unless you have it disassembled for a complete build. Drilling into your block will leave metal chips and the such, unless you tear it down and clean this out it could ruin your engine and charger.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

Update: I put my new VW motorsports steel head gasket in. Now it's 10:1 compression with the stock pulley and running strong. No obvious detonation, the car feels similar to the way it did with the BBM head gasket spacer (9:1) compression. 
I am in Colorado so it's 5000ft. above sea level and I have a big FMIC, but I wish I would've known that the head gasket spacer was extraneous BS and really unnecessary. I've got a Snow Performance (Stage II) WI setup that is going on this weekend, so we'll see how she responds to that. Hopefully I can get away with my 61mm pulley and 10:1 compression on pump gas.
Just throwing my $0.02 of free tuning info in for those still building or owning a 16VG60....


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_Update: I put my new VW motorsports steel head gasket in. Now it's 10:1 compression with the stock pulley and running strong. No obvious detonation, the car feels similar to the way it did with the BBM head gasket spacer (9:1) compression. 
I am in Colorado so it's 5000ft. above sea level and I have a big FMIC, but I wish I would've known that the head gasket spacer was extraneous BS and really unnecessary. I've got a Snow Performance (Stage II) WI setup that is going on this weekend, so we'll see how she responds to that. Hopefully I can get away with my 61mm pulley and 10:1 compression on pump gas.
Just throwing my $0.02 of free tuning info in for those still building or owning a 16VG60....









wow 61mm, how far are you spinning ? hg spacer may work for some with charger that can flow more air the the g60.


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (golf198v3.0)*

can someone tell me what the bend fetting is for?
i believe the big one underneath is the oil return but what is the other one or maybe it's the opposit







i dont know, i need direction pliz









_Modified by gti16v_87 at 4:33 PM 4-11-2007_


_Modified by gti16v_87 at 4:33 PM 4-11-2007_


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti16v_87* »_can someone tell me what the bend fetting is for?
i believe the big one underneath is the oil return but what is the other one or maybe it's the opposit







i dont know, i need direction pliz


both are oil returns
do you have directions ?


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (brilliantyellowg60)*

should i use both as oil return or would just one be enough?


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

you need to use both as oil returns.
If memory serves me correctly the reason one has a 90 degree bend is because if a straight barb would be used there the oil return line would be kinked from resting on top of the g60 support bracket.
On my setup, I actually run 2 90 degree elbows..... because I run my alternator underneath the lysholm









David


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (gti16v_87)*

The little one plugs into the spot that the factory g-lader plugs into. The larger one plugs into the diamond shaped oil return plate that comes with the kit. This larger return is right on the front of the engine block. Let me know if you have any other questions about your kit [email protected]
Thanks


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (N_TENSETUNING)*


_Quote, originally posted by *N_TENSETUNING* »_because I run my alternator underneath the lysholm


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*BBM 16V Ltd. Integration Kits*

I know... I know this was supposed to be closed out and dis-continued last year. The truth is that we had a ton more sales right before and after we ran out. In order to fulfill our over-run orders we made another small batch. The back orders from last year and early this year have all shipped out. We have some more kits left in stock.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: BBM 16V Ltd. Integration Kits (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_I know... I know this was supposed to be closed out and dis-continued last year. The truth is that we had a ton more sales right before and after we ran out. In order to fulfill our over-run orders we made another small batch. The back orders from last year and early this year have all shipped out. We have some more kits left in stock. 

what is the current price?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: BBM 16V Ltd. Integration Kits (brilliantyellowg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brilliantyellowg60* »_
what is the current price?

$1199
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/med...d=625


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: BBM 16V Ltd. Integration Kits (JBETZ)*

when i grab my s/c bracket to smooth it out ill take some more pics on the aba setup.


----------



## werder (Dec 23, 2006)

here is my mats 16V G60 conversion from south africa,
he is a mechanic at VW SA
here is the link to his build thread.
http://www.vwclub.co.za/vwforu...t=g60


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (werder)*


_Quote, originally posted by *werder* »_here is my mats 16V G60 conversion from south africa,
he is a mechanic at VW SA
here is the link to his build thread.
http://www.vwclub.co.za/vwforu...t=g60

I really like how he did the alternator belt set up.definitely http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

i was just wondering what crank sprocket do you guys use on a PG bloc with a 16v head on it. i've been told to use the 16v sprocket but just by looking at all the pulleys on my engine built up i dont think the serpentine belt will align properly.
oh and by the way i did use the spacer for the water pump pulley so the only thing i see would be my crankshaft sprocket that is not correct.
here is the engin so far


----------



## pre 93 only (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: (gti16v_87)*

I used an ABA crank pulley and had the mounting surface machined down the difference from the 8v sprocket and 16v.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (pre 93 only)*

FYI:
Now that I've finally had every different pulley size on my 16VG60 I can say that a non AC (euro waterpump) BBM setup requires the following size belts:
78mm pulley => 812K6
67mm pulley => 805K6
61mm pulley => 790K6
The first 3 numbers are the length...i.e. the 805 is 80.5 inches long, 790 is 79 inches long....


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

I came across this nice build up thread over on zatzy.com


----------



## pre 93 only (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

To anyone using the standard wiring harness, does every plug reach without lengthening anything?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (pre 93 only)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pre 93 only* »_To anyone using the standard wiring harness, does every plug reach without lengthening anything?

digi 1 harness?


----------



## pre 93 only (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (golf198v3.0)*

Sure, whatever comes in the Rallye


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (pre 93 only)*

i had to make the injector harness longer and one other , cannt remember , but it is all on my site . 
wwww.herbys53.com 
look for 2006 motor build


----------



## pre 93 only (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

The injector one is fine since thats a separate harness anyways and easy to replace. I am looking to keep my Rallye harness original and dont want to cut into that. Kinda anal but that is also part of the reason the original motor is coming out.


----------



## oneunicrone (Jun 26, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (pre 93 only)*

i still want rpm tunings kit but you have to wate wich suck and i dont like to wate


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (oneunicrone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *oneunicrone* »_i still want rpm tunings kit but you have to wate wich suck and i dont like to wate 

ive read posts that may make you think twice.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

We did an update on our old picture.
Here is the new one.
We have some of the last 16V integrations in stock and ready to ship.
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_....html


----------



## drew3164 (May 27, 2007)

Well I got my engine in the car. I’ve bin trying to start the engine for the last two days now and just cant get it going. I have spark, fuel, and I think I have the right time down. I know that the cam gear could be out 190 degrees, but I’m not to sure how I could tell. I’m not to sure how the injectors work, it almost like there not working….?
Thanks Dustin


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (drew3164)*

Bump for the guys asking 16V SC questions.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_









i'll start posting up photos/etc from my 16Vm90 build here pretty soon... 
some of it is VERY hacked & looks like azz,, but... that'll happen with a prototype setup, using what you have available...
this thread, and the yahoo group, have been VERY helpful in getting the parts to make this work out. Thanks all!






















-Nate


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_Bump for the guys asking 16V SC questions.









Bump for you making a cogged set up


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Bump for you making a cogged set up









I'd build it and the wont come


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
I'd build it and the wont come









You would be surprised.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
You would be surprised.

probably ,ill see if im sticking with the g60 when i get my setup done , but a cogged setup would be sweet


----------



## artspeed (Dec 19, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

John, can you give me the specs on the 16VG60 chip? What injectors, fpr, etc, is the chip mapped to run with?
Thanks


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (artspeed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *artspeed* »_John, can you give me the specs on the 16VG60 chip? What injectors, fpr, etc, is the chip mapped to run with?
Thanks

You can run it at stock boost with the stock injectors and fpr.
Or you can run it with the 3.5 bar at about 1 bar boost.
Or we can set you up with a chip for use with larger injectors and more boost.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_but a cogged setup would be sweet

Fired up the old solid works again...we will see what happens this time around.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Fired up the old solid works again...we will see what happens this time around.

Using geartrax?


----------



## Clownracer v2 (Sep 2, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (TehLonz)*

long thread tons of info http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60*

Our last run of 16V Ltd. integrations are about 50% sold out now.
Grab one of the last BBM kits while you still can
Thanks again guys for the business and support








http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_....html


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 (JBETZ)*

Just because we all like pictures:

_Quote, originally posted by *http://www.cft-motortec.com/stoppelfeldgolf.php* »_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 (Wizard-of-OD)*


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 (Wizard-of-OD)*

i really wish i had seen these pics before I did my belt routing on my 16V"g60" setup... crap.. 
i'll post pics of mine once i get them hosted up...


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Wow, a twin charged, 16v G60 Turbo. Thats some serious fabrication right there.
Anyone else have any spec's as to what was used in that buildup? Boost numbers? Horsepower?


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Thats a really, really clean belt setup. But where is the pulley drive for the alternator at? I see no other belts other then the charger belt and timing belt?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scuba2001* »_Thats a really, really clean belt setup. But where is the pulley drive for the alternator at? I see no other belts other then the charger belt and timing belt?

hell run it off the crank pulley, p/s pump, and alt. Like its shown above. He prollly just wanted to show of the cogged setup.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
I wish I had seen this:









you ain't kiddin!.. WOW... 
ssosoooooo jealous








-nate


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 (g60_c)*

Son of B*tch.....
Can't believe I never thought about using the same mounting point before.

Issam/Wizard-of-OD
Thanks for posting those pics.
Who's motor does this belong to here on vortex?

Love it








Dave


_Modified by N_TENSETUNING at 11:07 AM 8-25-2007_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 (N_TENSETUNING)*


_Quote, originally posted by *N_TENSETUNING* »_Son of B*tch.....
Can't believe I never thought about using the same mounting point before.

Isaam/Wizard-of-OD
Thanks for posting those pics.
Who's motor does this belong to here on vortex?

Love it








Dave


Its not from the Tex. I sent it to him in a aim convo one of these past nights


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 (N_TENSETUNING)*


_Quote, originally posted by *N_TENSETUNING* »_
Who's motor does this belong to here on vortex?
Love it








Dave

Some guy in Germany I assume.
p.s.Dave I have emailed you my drawings twice now...Would you prefer me to host them and you download them from my server?


----------



## N_TENSETUNING (Dec 5, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 (Wizard-of-OD)*

Hey Issam,
The only think I can think of regarding those dwgs is that my yahoo mail recognized them as Spam and deleted them.
I'll send you my work email address.

Thanks for keeping this thread alive and for giving us some eye candy/motivation.
Dave


_Modified by N_TENSETUNING at 11:07 AM 8-25-2007_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*

OH MY GAWD





























Corrado bi-g60

















































_Modified by TehLonz at 12:25 PM 8-26-2007_


_Modified by TehLonz at 12:25 PM 8-26-2007_


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 (Wizard-of-OD)*

This thread is great because apparently we all have the same sickness and it's just getting sicker!
I'm building a G60-16VT as the 16Vg60 is just not enough fun...








Thanks for the further inspiration to keep my project going. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 (kindbudz91G60)*

rather than post up all the pics AGAIN in this thread, i'll just reference my recent build pictures in the Eaton thread....
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...ge=12
-Nate


----------



## jetg60 (Jan 4, 2005)

I would like to know if someone here tried to built a 2.0L 16V G60 with a PG block?
I would like to built one by myself and I would like to know if I can built it with 9A crankshaft, with 16V rod and some 16V T pistons?
If some of have some specs or place to find informations, let me know!
Thanks!
Phil


----------



## Urieal (Nov 16, 2005)

Building 16V PG G60(PL Head)
If I keep the Distributor In Block, do I need the Throttle Body Adapter? What do I need to have IOT remove the Distributor from the Head?
Where can I find directions on how to Mod the keyway of the Intermediate Shaft Gear so that the 16V gear works with my PG shaft?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (Urieal)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Urieal* »_Building 16V PG G60(PL Head)
If I keep the Distributor In Block, do I need the Throttle Body Adapter? What do I need to have IOT remove the Distributor from the Head?
Where can I find directions on how to Mod the keyway of the Intermediate Shaft Gear so that the 16V gear works with my PG shaft?

I think if you keep distrib in block, you'll be fine w/out the tb adaptor (depends on what car it's going into).. if you're using the G60 TB.. in a corrado (not sure of others... just going from personal experience)... the boost bypass will hit on your brake fluid res








-Nate


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

FPR tap?
stupid question, but where have people tapped into for the FPR boost/vac reference signal?? I'm running the final wires & vac lines/etc on my 16V, and figured i'd ask.
Thanks!
-Nate


----------



## Urieal (Nov 16, 2005)

*Re: (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_
I think if you keep distrib in block, you'll be fine w/out the tb adaptor (depends on what car it's going into).. if you're using the G60 TB.. in a corrado (not sure of others... just going from personal experience)... the boost bypass will hit on your brake fluid res








-Nate

It is in a Corrado. Thx.
Another question...
Once again, PG BLOCK, PL HEAD
Piston options.
I currently can't afford forged pistons. What other piston options do I have? Any VAG OEM pistons that will work? I think the RS2 pistons + conrods create about a 8.5:1 CR, but I need more specifics on the size of the RS2 pistons and rods to calculate correctly.
My wife is trying to find out info on the pistons/conrods so I can do some calculations.
Will post up any info I find.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_FPR tap?
stupid question, but where have people tapped into for the FPR boost/vac reference signal?? I'm running the final wires & vac lines/etc on my 16V, and figured i'd ask.
Thanks!
-Nate

I used the fifth injector spot with the hose fitting that is on the piece that bolts to the int. manifold. Then I made a steel cap to cover the hole where the actual injector fits.
As for as piston options (for Urieal) use the factory 16V pistons. Put PL pistons into the PG block. The compression ratio is fine, unless you are having more than 15psi boost. (It just won't last 100,000 miles with that comp ratio), but c'mon a solid 20K on mine and running strong.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
I used the fifth injector spot with the hose fitting that is on the piece that bolts to the int. manifold. Then I made a steel cap to cover the hole where the actual injector fits.









nifty, i need to find that part in my boxes... i think that's why I was a little lost on options... didnt have it bolted on!








Thanks!
-Nate


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

hey john , i need to get just afew things from the intergration kit . 
can i just the water pump and power steering pump spacers ? besides that i need to get a crank pully but at over 100bucks







think i will have to find something else for that one . 

thanks in advance http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_hey john , i need to get just afew things from the intergration kit . 
can i just the water pump and power steering pump spacers ? besides that i need to get a crank pully but at over 100bucks







think i will have to find something else for that one . 

thanks in advance http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Sure, I can set you up with these spacers separately.
We also have new billet crank pulleys at the anodizer right now.
Really nice part and of course a great price.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_hey john , i need to get just afew things from the intergration kit . 
can i just the water pump and power steering pump spacers ? besides that i need to get a crank pully but at over 100bucks







think i will have to find something else for that one . 

thanks in advance http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

ABA + machine shop FTW


----------



## vr6boyirl (Feb 21, 2006)

Anyone know where i can get one of these set ups ?
I would be really interested in one








Sorry for small pics 


_Modified by vr6boyirl at 8:39 AM 9-27-2007_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (vr6boyirl)*

off that engine. 
Looks like a 1 off to me.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_off that engine. 
Looks like a 1 off to me.

what i want to know is... where to source those idler pulleys they are using for belt-wrap on the alt... i searched MSC and McMaster, but can't come up with anything... ideas?? and, what would they be called??? i tried flat-belt pulleys, idler pulleys, track rollers.. but none seem to have the RPM capabilities I'd need.
-Nate


----------



## vr6boyirl (Feb 21, 2006)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

Yeah thats what i was thinking








Time to start searching


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_what i want to know is... where to source those idler pulleys they are using for belt-wrap on the alt

Mazda or Toyota unit probably made by NTK.Check ebay,they should have.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Mazda or Toyota unit probably made by NTK.Check ebay,they should have.

aaahhhaa! thanks for the insight!!
-Nate


----------



## Urieal (Nov 16, 2005)

*Re: (g60_c)*

strange question...
So using PG pistons + PG rods in a PG Block will give me a compression ratio around 6.2:1
what would my CR be if I shaved off 2mm from the block? Wouldn't that let me use my PG pistons?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (Urieal)*

so.. minus my wiring... my 16VM90 engine is happy, and in my corrado








Final clean-up & such to happen this week... then register the car... inspect it... align it... kill a couple sets of tires... then put it away for the winter... and more upgrades








I'll pop up some pics when i can. when she goes away for the winter, i'll see what i can do about getting some measurements... and maybe even some brackets/drawings made... thank god for a GF that's a machinist








-Nate


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: (g60_c)*

got my engine in last week end. still far from being done but i'm getting there

































































and a post card pic


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (gti16v_87)*

IDLER PULLEYS!!!
So, wandering around the forced induction forums.. i came across this! 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3492061
dealing with a vortech charger setup... with idler pulleys for the serp belt...
it uses either these
http://www.worldimpex.com/part....html
or these
http://www.worldimpex.com/part....html
(also found @ germanautoparts.com for a few $$ cheaper)...
*edit* Just got pricing from my "local" Vw parts source http://www.rennenparts.com they can get them to me for $20 + tax & shipping... I'm in Maine, so for other New England people, they only make sense!
I'm ordering a pair of each, and going to see if i can fit them somewhere around my alternator to provide a little better belt-wrap, cause right now, i think i have next to none.
Just thought I would share so that people have another option for OEM parts in there... 
-Nate
*edit* alternative location to obtain!


_Modified by g60_c at 9:58 PM 10-15-2007_


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (g60_c)*

I noticed earlier in the thread, someone was asking about what throttle cable to use with the relocation elbow... there was no answer posted, and since i'm @ a point where i need to have a slightly longer cable than what is stock in my corrado, I decided to do some hunting.
I'm using the color of the plastic bushing @ the firewall end of the cable as a reference guide... Looking at the BBM 16V integration kit, they have a throttle cable w/a green bushing on it... searching all through germanautoparts, comes up with two options (i'm guessing they are actually the same part)... the 86-89 'rocco 16V has the green bushing







and the cable only costs $15 
http://www.germanautoparts.com.../42/4
I have ordered one up. I will post up a picture of the setup i currently have in the car, and then comparison pictures & results!
-Nate


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (gti16v_87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti16v_87* »_










Very nice http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Simple yet effective


----------



## corocco (Jul 29, 2001)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

The Scirocco throttle cable is what BBM provides in their kit.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (corocco)*


_Quote, originally posted by *corocco* »_The Scirocco throttle cable is what BBM provides in their kit.

sweet, thank you for the confirmation!!!
It's been kind of annoying that nobody ever responded to the question asking exactly that earlier in this thread








-Nate


----------



## CABNFEVR (Oct 29, 2001)

*Re: (g60_c)*

Anybody selling their 16vg60 short ram intake?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (CABNFEVR)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CABNFEVR* »_Anybody selling their 16vg60 short ram intake?

Check the classifieds or check Motorgeek.com for a 3B intake manifold.Cut it to suite and weld on the rectangular throttle body plate for a PG throttle body.


----------



## rdrocco (Oct 14, 2006)

If I use a 9a block and a PL head.
I will need to use 2 head gaskets to achive the desired crompression ratio to run a super charger?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (rdrocco)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rdrocco* »_If I use a 9a block and a PL head.
I will need to use 2 head gaskets to achive the desired crompression ratio to run a super charger?

i say.. get lower comp pistons.... don't mess with stacked gaskets (more possible leak points... bbaaaaddd).. but, that's just my thoughts on it... certainly is cheaper to do stacked gaskets though..
-Nate


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

*Re: (g60_c)*

Everyone keeps reffering to the 83mm pistons. If the stock bore is 81mm, isn't there a company out there that stocks a 81mm piston that will work? I only have 40K on my PG block, and didn't feel like sending it out. Why fix something that isn't broken.......


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (clove911)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clove911* »_Everyone keeps reffering to the 83mm pistons. If the stock bore is 81mm, isn't there a company out there that stocks a 81mm piston that will work? I only have 40K on my PG block, and didn't feel like sending it out. Why fix something that isn't broken.......

on a pg... i dont' believe you are going to have to worry about compression w/a 16V head, are you?? or.. did i miss some info somewhere? (i probly did.. since it didn't pertain to me..)
-Nate


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

*Re: (g60_c)*

According to the information posted above your going to have to get a set of custom pistons.Bahn Brenner sells a set of custom pistons for $699.95US

Or you can contact Rodney Huss for your custom application.
The reason you will need a custom set of Pistons is because placing a 16V head on an 8V Block lowers the CR approx 1.8 Points.Since the G60 engine is allready @ a CR of 8:1 then dropping that CR 1.8:1 points lower will bring it to about 6.2:1,definitely too low for a 16V G60.
Now for the Conrods you can use your stock PG G60 rods but it is recommended that you use PL 16V Rods + Custom Pistons due to the fact that your rod ratio using the PG rods will be too short.
Thats the info on the first page, so I assume I'll have too low compression?
To be honest I'm a little confused on the info anyway. One person tells me that I can tune to 300hp with digi1, another says that I will barely get 250. Someone says I will need pistons and rods, another doesn't. I am about to just do my head swap, make the turbo stuff work, and wing it. If I blow something up, I'll deal with it then. I was only hoping to get about 250-300hp to start, and upgrade turbo, fueling, and management later down the road for crazy power. 


_Modified by clove911 at 5:35 AM 10-26-2007_


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (clove911)*

ah, whoops... like i said, it didnt' apply to my situation (9A engine.. all the way through... and got 9:1 83mm wiseco pistons anyway)... so i wasn't sure..
sorry i couldn't be of more help








-Nate


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (g60_c)*

a new question....
running a 'rocco mani... and an intake relocation elbow... that 1m ECU line, JUST barely makes it to the correct port on the TB.. and that's with the line run in the most direct path i can manage....
where are the rest of you pulling your MAP reference from for the digi1 ecu?
Thanks in advance for ideas/etc!
-Nate


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

*Re: (g60_c)*

found new block, now i can put my motor together, while still driving my current setup, progress to come!


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (clove911)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clove911* »_found new block, now i can put my motor together, while still driving my current setup, progress to come!

nice!! good luck on the build!
-Nate


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_a new question....
... that 1m ECU line, JUST barely makes it to the correct port on the TB.. and that's with the line run in the most direct path i can manage....
where are the rest of you pulling your MAP reference from for the digi1 ecu?
-Nate

I drilled a new hole in the raintray that is more direct. I used an extra firewall grommet to make the hole have a factory finish. Yes the line barely makes it, but if you route it with a hole dead center of the raintray it should reach with about two inches to spare.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
I drilled a new hole in the raintray that is more direct. I used an extra firewall grommet to make the hole have a factory finish. Yes the line barely makes it, but if you route it with a hole dead center of the raintray it should reach with about two inches to spare.









yeah, that's kind of what I was thinking as well, just didn't know if anyone had drilled & mounted a new nipple on the intake mani, rather than using the one on the TB... didn't know if that would have adverse effects...
I will most likely do the re-routing of the vac line... thanks for the thoughts!
-Nate


----------



## numbnuts (Jun 1, 2006)

*Re: (g60_c)*

Just thought i would share some pics of my project and how i have set up my belt routing.......
















Cambelt tensioners, custom pulley, modded pony alternator + charger bracket.
Cheers for this so helpfull thread


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (numbnuts)*

Hyundai Pony?Mitsubishi makes that alternator.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (numbnuts)*

This looks great.
The only problem is that belts heat up and streeeetch.
You need a dynamic tensioner or you will loose belt tension when the belt heats up.
You could flog on the car heat the belt up and then tighten it up again.
If your not going for big boost this might be just fine for you.
Not meaning to dog on your s/u, just adding some information here.
Also that BBM billet crank pulley is best with the G60 crank pulley harmonic balancer installed in it.



_Modified by JBETZ at 3:13 PM 10-29-2007_


----------



## numbnuts (Jun 1, 2006)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Ooh, how much do the belts stretch by? Enough to make it slip? Hmm. I guess thats what the original set up has that damper/ spring assembly for eh?
If i have all the rotating parts balanced do i still need to run the harmonic balancer? I have been told not to bother.


----------



## numbnuts (Jun 1, 2006)

oh and its just running a 68 mm pulley so not big boost anyway?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (numbnuts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *numbnuts* »_Ooh, how much do the belts stretch by? Enough to make it slip? Hmm. I guess thats what the original set up has that damper/ spring assembly for eh?
If i have all the rotating parts balanced do i still need to run the harmonic balancer? I have been told not to bother.









Check it out, if you boost is creepy or low this might be an issues.
If your pushing Lysholm boost or above 18 psi, trust me it can be an issue. Yes, I would run the balancer insert.


----------



## artspeed (Dec 19, 2005)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

John, what spark plugs come in your integration kit or what is the recommended plug to run on the 16VG60 with Digi 1.
Thanks


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (artspeed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *artspeed* »_John, what spark plugs come in your integration kit or what is the recommended plug to run on the 16VG60 with Digi 1.
Thanks

They give you normal NA 16V plugs (Bosch), but I have found that running Denso Iridium 20VT (1.8T) plugs works even better. 
The 16V plug is a hotter plug and not built for boost. If you look at the electrode for a G-60 plug or a 1.8T plug it is vastly different than a 16V electrode.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## artspeed (Dec 19, 2005)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

Thanks kindbudz91G60. I am currently running NGK BKR6EIXs in my 16VG60 and NGK BKR7EIXs and DENSO Iridium IK22s in my 16VT. Are you running IK20s or IK22s and what gap have you found to work the best?
Thanks


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Making this close out deal even sweeter!
We are now also including our new solid billet crank pulley in this kit.
They are selling out fast, thanks again guys










_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_We did an update on our old picture.
Here is the new one.
We have some of the last 16V integrations in stock and ready to ship.
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_....html











_Modified by JBETZ at 8:22 AM 10-31-2007_


----------



## Pennywise (Oct 18, 2003)

if i'm running a stage 4 charger, what programming would i need to run?
tia
-gabe


----------



## jetg60 (Jan 4, 2005)

Did somebody tried to oversized a pg bloc to 83mm and put 2.0L 16V pistons in with rods and crank!??
I just want to know if it was possible to do a 2.0L 16V supercharged with this setup!
Thanks!


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (jetg60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jetg60* »_Did somebody tried to oversized a pg bloc to 83mm and put 2.0L 16V pistons in with rods and crank!??
I just want to know if it was possible to do a 2.0L 16V supercharged with this setup!
Thanks!

9A pistons have an 82.5mm bore.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

* cough , cough*


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

is that a sandwich IC for that intake mani???
what's the charger??
sweet setup! yours?
-Nate


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

*Re: (g60_c)*

Just incase anyone is interested
If you do this swap, shop for pistons. You can use a 144mm rod and pistons set from a 20V 5 cylinder Audi, and if fits perfectly. You won't even have to send your block out. I have two perfect low mileage blocks and didn't want to send them out. 
Secondly, the JE pistons are overpriced and usually don't come with rings. It is just as cheap to get a 81mm bore piston made, than to have to buy a 83mm bore piston, and not gain any advantage at all. Theres no displacement gain really, and unless your block is trashed, you don't need to get it machined. This is all info from myself and Euronationvw.com. Aaron eally knows what he's doing there, I would use them as a good source for all your parts and question needs on any 8V or 16V project.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_is that a sandwich IC for that intake mani???
what's the charger??
sweet setup! yours?
-Nate

More information please http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_









Got something issam?
Because I am afraid I may have lost my source on it


----------



## mallymal (Sep 22, 2004)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

Can you make a 16vg60 in a mk2 using mk3 ABA parts and not utilizing the 16v integration kit.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (mallymal)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mallymal* »_Can you make a 16vg60 in a mk2 using mk3 ABA parts and not utilizing the 16v integration kit.

what aba parts? you dont "need" the damn integration kit.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_* cough , cough*


















where do i send payment for this mani/ic?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

haha , 
I was looking for the thread last night..


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

So what are people running for clutches on these guys?


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

generally a VR Pressure Plate and Clutch disc will hold up fine for any supercharged 16V.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (jwatts)*

hmm. Ok .
Ive got a 228mm passat 16v setup sitting here from before my S/c plans.


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

ok...it's time for me to do the oil feed line from the supercharge to the engine but i was wondering if that would make a big difference if i would connect my feed line into the back of the head instead of on the oil filter flange where the oil sensors are.
I know as a fact that pressure is bigger near the oil pump so on the oil filter flange but on my setup it would look cleaner if i would connect behind the head.
What do you think?
thank you


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (gti16v_87)*

I think it is recommended to connect the feed from the back of the head to keep the oil seals together


----------



## btkjr40 (Nov 28, 2007)

*internals*

can someone tell me how strong the stock 16v 144mm connecting rods are? would it be a bad idea to re-use stock rodsmaybe new screws, with after market pistons. THANKS


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: internals (btkjr40)*

stock rods are fine. word has been that 16v rods are stronger than the 20v couterparts.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: internals (TehLonz)*


















Still awaiting schtuff.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: internals (TehLonz)*

We are now down to about the* last half dozen *integrations... that is it from BBM. This price is dirt low for the parts that you get, nearly 50% off from what they sold at the initial release. Thanks to you guys that are snapping them up. Once again this is it! Our production schedule is set past 2008 and it definitely does not include more of these integrations. Get the last of these ultra high quality CAD/CAM, CNC manufactured parts while they last.
Thanks again








http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_...n_Kit


----------



## btkjr40 (Nov 28, 2007)

*Re: internals (TehLonz)*

w/ g60 block and crank, and Mahle 16v pistons. what rod will give the stock, or best rod ratio? 144mm or the g60 136mm?
Also can anyone tell me how much the Mahle pistons would need to be dished to bring down the cm ratio?
THANKS!


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_* cough , cough*


















Now I bring this.

















































I've found the owner to possibly answer ques.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_
I've found the owner to possibly answer ques.









more importanly... will they answer $$?








for example that oil adaptor?








and that coolant system?!!?
yum!
-Nate


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_
more importanly... will they answer $$?








for example that oil adaptor?








and that coolant system?!!?
yum!
-Nate

i want the IC, charger outlet, and the intake manifold


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

Wow, that setup looks awesome. Some very nice CNC and machining work there.


----------



## europeanplates.com (Nov 23, 2002)

*Re: (Scuba2001)*

This is interesting the,
I will be looking for some updates.
Tyler


----------



## G9DUB (Jan 24, 2008)

*Re: (europeanplates.com)*

Hiya all, just been reading through and saw the pictures of my mates 2.0l 16v Supercharged engine in progress(the one above)















I will have a word and get him to answer some of your questions.. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
This engine will be awesome when finished everything you see has been made from solid lumps of billet alloy, the bloke who is doing the machining is second to none. Its been a long time about 5 YEARS..
But worth the wait...















I will get him to put up some more up to date pics too.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: (G9DUB)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G9DUB* »_I will get him to put up some more up to date pics too.... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

That's awesome man. Thanks for joining the boards and offering up some help and answers on the setup.


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*

Hello guys,mate said you were after some info on my conversion,the inlet manifold does have an intergrated chargecooler using 2 Laminova cores obviously a Lysholm charger that will be pushing about 1 bar to start.Internals are Pauter rods JE 9:1 pistons in a 9A bottom end with an ABF head,management is taken care of with a DTA S60PRO utilising sequential injection & sheite.
Guy doing the head scratching & machining used to be a big time drag racer back in the day think he was the first guy to break the 6sec 1/4 barrier in the UK,also did alot of supercharging R&D for some big companies,wish I had a fraction of his skill & knowledge.
cheers for the positive remarks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_Hello guys,mate said you were after some info on my conversion,the inlet manifold does have an intergrated chargecooler using 2 Laminova cores obviously a Lysholm charger that will be pushing about 1 bar to start.Internals are Pauter rods JE 9:1 pistons in a 9A bottom end with an ABF head,management is taken care of with a DTA S60PRO utilising sequential injection & sheite.
Guy doing the head scratching & machining used to be a big time drag racer back in the day think he was the first guy to break the 6sec 1/4 barrier in the UK,also did alot of supercharging R&D for some big companies,wish I had a fraction of his skill & knowledge.
cheers for the positive remarks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Looking good and welcome to Vortex! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Want to sell that "oil filter flange" ?


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

^^







no thanks Wizard just wanna get it finished 5yrs 3mths & counting







.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_^^







no thanks Wizard just wanna get it finished 5yrs 3mths & counting







.

Looks sick, nicely done custom set up http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

I was told if i got a bottom pulley from a 2l 8v engine i could get it machined down 6mm to line up with the other pulleys, but if i machine 6mm off, there wont be any mounting serface left?
Have i got the right pulley?
Also does anyone have the part number for the abf water flange thats houses the BTS?
Please help


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (flusted16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flusted16v* »_I was told if i got a bottom pulley from a 2l 8v engine i could get it machined down 6mm to line up with the other pulleys, but if i machine 6mm off, there wont be any mounting serface left?
Have i got the right pulley?
Also does anyone have the part number for the abf water flange thats houses the BTS?
Please help

press in a centering ring.


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_Hello guys,mate said you were after some info on my conversion,the inlet manifold does have an intergrated chargecooler using 2 Laminova cores obviously a Lysholm charger that will be pushing about 1 bar to start.Internals are Pauter rods JE 9:1 pistons in a 9A bottom end with an ABF head,management is taken care of with a DTA S60PRO utilising sequential injection & sheite.
Guy doing the head scratching & machining used to be a big time drag racer back in the day think he was the first guy to break the 6sec 1/4 barrier in the UK,also did alot of supercharging R&D for some big companies,wish I had a fraction of his skill & knowledge.
cheers for the positive remarks http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

I want to know how much $ and how soon can i get the parts








I am serious


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*

^^^Last time I spoke to him the conversation went something along the lines of "I'm never doing another f#@king one of these again"


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_^^^Last time I spoke to him the conversation went something along the lines of "I'm never doing another f#@king one of these again"






























Ask him nicely for me


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

I visit this thread on occasion to just look at those pics....
...on occasion = 8 times/day


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

Im using a kr(pl) block, how do i go about fitting the rear charger bracket? do i need to plug the other breather hole with a core plug? what size?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (sdezego)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sdezego* »_I visit this thread on occasion to just look at those pics....
...on occasion = 8 times/day

hahaha... it's a sickness isn't it? 
one i'm happy to have actually!








-Nate


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (g60_c)*

i put my whole build up in one place as it was alittle everywhere before. 
if it can be of use to anyone 
http://www.herbys53.com/forums...t=103


----------



## Peter Tong (Jun 17, 1999)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*

Yeah, and that was with 2 coolers







You probably would have driven him insane with 3 coolers









_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_^^^Last time I spoke to him the conversation went something along the lines of "I'm never doing another f#@king one of these again"


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_^^^Last time I spoke to him the conversation went something along the lines of "I'm never doing another f#@king one of these again"






























Does not mean he cant make some of those parts for us or at least share the files...what yuh say


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Does not mean he cant make some of those parts for us or at least share the files...what yuh say










Love the build http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*















I've got more chance of copping a 3 way with Eva Longora & J LO than there is of him sharing them files














but I will ask him if he's interested in selling parts http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_but I will ask him if he's interested in selling parts http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Thanks,would be nice for the community.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

Hi
Has anyone got any pics or advice as to how to integrate the ISV into g6016v vacuum system?
thnks in advance.


----------



## nontech327 (Feb 10, 2005)

what kind of clearances are you using for rod and main bearings? Im running a 9.5:1 9a block with forged pistons. Also what kind of ring end gaps?


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

iM GUNA RUN WITHOUT 1, THEY ARE NOTHING BUT TROUBLE oops capslock


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (flusted16v)*

I hear whay your saying flusted but i'd like to have the option.
Anyway,i'm gonna get the manifold tapped.
What manifold r u going to run mate?
Custom?


----------



## Shmee (Apr 21, 2001)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

So i've looked through and rest much of this thread but i cannot find any pics of a 16V G60 in a MK1.... anyone have any pics to show me how the made either the Integration alt bracket fit with the mk1 engine mount or of a different mounting of the ALT to clear the front frame rail!?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: internals (JBETZ)*

Sold a few more, now down to *(4) left*
Thanks again










_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_We are now down to about the* last half dozen *integrations... that is it from BBM. This price is dirt low for the parts that you get, nearly 50% off from what they sold at the initial release. Thanks to you guys that are snapping them up. Once again this is it! Our production schedule is set past 2008 and it definitely does not include more of these integrations. Get the last of these ultra high quality CAD/CAM, CNC manufactured parts while they last.
Thanks again








http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_...n_Kit


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Shmee)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Shmee* »_of a different mounting of the ALT to clear the front frame rail!?

What about mounting it @ the rear?


----------



## Shmee (Apr 21, 2001)

wont fit between the header and the frame rail in the rear... i have an idea but does anyone know if the BBM alt bracket is made from AL or Steel?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (Shmee)*

steel i think , dont remember when i had to drill mine but i think it was steel cause it wasnt that light


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*


_Quote, originally posted by *herby53-akaherby53* »_steel i think , don't remember when i had to drill mine but i think it was steel cause it wasnt that light 

The early ones now many year ago were aluminum.
They have been steel for pretty sure well over five years now.


----------



## Shmee (Apr 21, 2001)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

awesome.
so then in Theory, i should be able to stencil the MK1 PS motor mount bracket onto the BBM alt bracket using the bolt holes as a template and then cut out the shape of the motor mount out of the alt bracket, test fit everything, tack weld the 2 mounts together and then properly weld everything out of the car...
yes?
no?
maybe?
sorta?
kinda?
not really?


----------



## d-bot (Sep 6, 2004)

*Re: (Shmee)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Shmee* »_awesome.
so then in Theory, i should be able to stencil the MK1 PS motor mount bracket onto the BBM alt bracket using the bolt holes as a template and then cut out the shape of the motor mount out of the alt bracket, test fit everything, tack weld the 2 mounts together and then properly weld everything out of the car...
yes?
no?
maybe?
sorta?
kinda?
not really? 

Why do you need permission? Do it up!



_Modified by d-bot at 6:50 AM 2-13-2008_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

(whoops)


----------



## Shmee (Apr 21, 2001)

*Re: (d-bot)*

PS = passenger side.
i'm taking about a motor mount here, not power steering.

thanks.


----------



## gti16v_87 (Oct 9, 2005)

*Re: (Shmee)*

on a 16vG60 using a 16v head with a PG block, a 2.0l ABA head gasket and low compression ROSS piston supplied by BBM (226107663 part number). Is there clearance between valves and pistons in case of a broken timing belt?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (gti16v_87)*

mucho doubt.


----------



## eve_ill (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: (gti16v_87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti16v_87* »_on a 16vG60 using a 16v head with a PG block, a 2.0l ABA head gasket and low compression ROSS piston supplied by BBM (226107663 part number). Is there clearance between valves and pistons in case of a broken timing belt?

probably not.. even 8v bend valves not infrequently... and 16v are notorious for it.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Shmee)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Shmee* »_PS = passenger side.
i'm taking about a motor mount here, not power steering.
thanks.









I am not following you.This is going in a MKII? MKI?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (gti16v_87)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti16v_87* »_on a 16vG60 using a 16v head with a PG block, a 2.0l ABA head gasket and low compression ROSS piston supplied by BBM (226107663 part number). Is there clearance between valves and pistons in case of a broken timing belt?

No, definitly not. You will bend between 1-8 intake valves.


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: internals (JBETZ)*

Hey guys,
are any of you running the BBM crank pulley on your valvers?
reason I ask is am thinking of getting one but fella doing the charger conversion has commented although very nice quality there is no harmonic dampener like you would find in the standard items.
was wondering if long term use might show up issues with crankshaft?


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

ive just fitted a pulley from a mk3 1.4 golf, it lines up nicely but has no dampener, ive been told that it will be ok


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (flusted16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flusted16v* »_ive just fitted a pulley from a mk3 1.4 golf, it lines up nicely but has no dampener, ive been told that it will be ok

You really should invest in a dampener.I have the correct pulley that I sell for 75US,has a harmonic dampener in it.


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

can that be shipped to uk?


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

Have you got any pics of said pulley Wizard?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_Have you got any pics of said pulley Wizard?

This is the pulley:


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

Is that the factory ABF pulley or the Larger Diesel Pulley?
What Diameter?
Shawn


----------



## oneunicrone (Jun 26, 2006)

*Re: (sdezego)*

dose any body need a 16vg60 crank pully im selling one cheap


----------



## oneunicrone (Jun 26, 2006)

*Re: (oneunicrone)*

im also selling some stoke g60 injector with the rail and fpr


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (oneunicrone)*


_Quote, originally posted by *oneunicrone* »_dose any body need a 16vg60 crank pully im selling one cheap

All the for sale stuff you can post in here if you would like.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2549031


----------



## oneunicrone (Jun 26, 2006)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

thanks will do


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

Best cams to run? i heard ABF?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: internals (JBETZ)*


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: internals (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_










what.. exactly am i looking @ here?? i'm VERY confused... 
-Nate


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: internals (g60_c)*

16vg60...


----------



## eve_ill (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: internals (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_16vg60...









well, you could be a smartass or you could think that maybe he's looking at that very odd intake system. I assume that's what Nate is talking about.
edit: maybe the angle of the photo makes it look like the charger intake tube and the intake manifold tube are connected but they're not? I don't know. or... Maybe I'm just stupid and don't understand anything. I wouldn't be surprised.

















_Modified by eve_ill at 3:27 AM 3-7-2008_


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

Heres mine thats nearly finished










_Modified by flusted16v at 10:53 AM 3-7-2008_


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (flusted16v)*

^^^looking good,hopefully catch up with you at a show somewhere & have a closer look http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Did you go for the ABF cams?I am using a complete ABF head on mine understand there meant to flow better straight out of the box?


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: internals (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_what.. exactly am i looking @ here?? i'm VERY confused... 
-Nate

From the looks of things, it seems like it's 16v G60 with an air-water intercooler sandwiched between the charger and the manifold.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but that's almost what it looks like to me.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: internals (Scuba2001)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Scuba2001* »_
From the looks of things, it seems like it's 16v G60 with an air-water intercooler sandwiched between the charger and the manifold.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but that's almost what it looks like to me.

i assumed that, i guess I should be more clear...
what in the bejeebers is that y-pipe assembly.. thing... going on.. it looks like a twin-intake system.. but then it is "y'd" into the intake manifold?? 
the angle of the photo i def killing me for seeing what is going on. it's a nice-looking build.. if it weren't for that y-pipe... i just want to know what's going on...
-Nate


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: internals (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_16vg60...









no crap.. really?






















-Nate


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: internals (g60_c)*

Intake is fairly easy going back to the airbox , the y piece is most likely a boost bypass/return to the intake of the charger.


----------



## TightDub (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Subscribed http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Nice write ups in this forum








I am gettin a semi-complete G60 set up and thinkin about goin 16v or 20v with it. Wish me luck either way...I will be reading these threads for a while to get up to speed on the G60


----------



## artspeed (Dec 19, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (TightDub)*

My setup so far.


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

That looks sweet! what size injectrs are you guys running and also what chip?


----------



## TightDub (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (artspeed)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Very nice. I like the pipe routing. A bit cleaner looking than the standard g60 setup


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (flusted16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flusted16v* »_That looks sweet! what size injectrs are you guys running and also what chip?

In my 1.8L 16VG60 I had the stock green G60 injectors (280cc I believe).
I now have a 2.0L 16VG60 that I'm running 315 cc injectors. It is perfect. Just slightly rich @ wide open throttle.
I have the BBM chip...








Supposably it works with a 1.8, a 2.0 it doesn't matter what size pulley either...








When I asked John what the options are with the chip he said "none really". I've thought about SNS, but right now she's a strong runner with the setup I have.


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

so are 440ccs overkill?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (flusted16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flusted16v* »_so are 440ccs overkill?

Yes, you will be richer than Bill Gates.


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

i think g60mikey started to lean up top with 440's over 247whp. overkill nah? i know jwatts runs 60# to fuel that monster of his. we have emissions here so we have to pass the 15/25 asm tests (dyno wheel).


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
Yes, you will be richer than Bill Gates.









not with the correct programming


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_ not with the correct programming









Please advise: 
2.0 16vG60
Rallye Golf FMIC (big)
BBM 16V limited chip
61mm pulley - w/intercooler I only see about 10-11 lbs boost.
5000ft. above sea level - this might be why I'm a tad rich w/315cc's
Could SNS build me a better chip for Digifart 1? I'm sure they could, any idea on cost?


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (nontech327)*

Think I can see the light at the end of the tunnel,may not look like much but after nearly 5 1/2 yrs its a fairly big deal to me. No more mock up engine going together for final time







































clearance on piston rings bottom ring 18thou
top ring 25thou
blow by may be a slight issue but should be fine.
Does anyone know the correct crank end float for a 9A engine & what the clearance should be on the big ends on the crank journals?


----------



## G60NUT (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (artspeed)*

SNS is the only way to fly..... I run #60 in my 16vG60 w/SNS Chip Couldn't be any happier with it
















I dont have any good engine pics I'll have to take one. But one of the car on the last track day http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 









_Quote, originally posted by *artspeed* »_









How did you get the Butterfly to work for the bypass on the TB?


----------



## g60pops (Dec 20, 2001)

Have many 16vg60 owners have gone with a boost return to the charger?
Also anyone have contact details for BBM as they are not replying to my emails and i need to order one of their 16vg60 integration kits?


_Modified by g60pops at 3:27 PM 3-19-2008_


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (g60pops)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60pops* »_Have many 16vg60 owners have gone with a boost return to the charger?
Also anyone have contact details for BBM as they are not replying to my emails and i need to order one of their 16vg60 integration kits?

_Modified by g60pops at 3:27 PM 3-19-2008_

i'm sure that BBM is not replying to emails, because with john out of commission for a little while, the shop is probly a touch on the busy side, and people just dont' have the time to take care of emails (or perhaps john is the only one that does that?)...
-Nate


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (g60pops)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60pops* »_Have many 16vg60 owners have gone with a boost return to the charger?
Also anyone have contact details for BBM as they are not replying to my emails and i need to order one of their 16vg60 integration kits?

_Modified by g60pops at 3:27 PM 3-19-2008_

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/faq/
is what you're going to be told..


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (g60pops)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60pops* »_Have many 16vg60 owners have gone with a boost return to the charger?
_Modified by g60pops at 3:27 PM 3-19-2008_

I run the boost return. I just cut down the origional piping and made it work. I also tied my PCV into this (just like the factory G60). I'll throw up some pics, as soon as I find picture hosting. (hostdub crash)
With regard to the tuning (chip) and injectors....I'm open to suggestions. The main issue though is the altitude here in Colorado. Most setups that run fine at sea level are slightly rich here.


----------



## eve_ill (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: (g60pops)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60pops* »_Have many 16vg60 owners have gone with a boost return to the charger?
Also anyone have contact details for BBM as they are not replying to my emails and i need to order one of their 16vg60 integration kits?

_Modified by g60pops at 3:27 PM 3-19-2008_

dude, call them! they've got a phone number, and I've called it many times.
way better than crappy e-mails.


----------



## g60pops (Dec 20, 2001)

*Re: (eve_ill)*


_Quote, originally posted by *eve_ill* »_
dude, call them! they've got a phone number, and I've called it many times.
way better than crappy e-mails.


I'm on the other side of the pond


----------



## g60pops (Dec 20, 2001)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
I run the boost return. I just cut down the origional piping and made it work. I also tied my PCV into this (just like the factory G60). I'll throw up some pics, as soon as I find picture hosting. (hostdub crash)


pics would be great.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (g60pops)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60pops* »_
I'm on the other side of the pond









emails are still getting done while I'm a permanent fixture in this fricken lazyboy chair. Over the last year we have seen a big decline in emails going through do to servers blocking spam and junk mail ect... Pretty sure we have a couple left. We were going to keep two kits boxed up on the shelf for the archive now we are only keeping one. You can email me at [email protected] if you have any questions and you can order online. Thanks


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
emails are still getting done while I'm a permanent fixture in this fricken lazyboy chair. Over the last year we have seen a big decline in emails going through do to servers blocking spam and junk mail ect... Pretty sure we have a couple left. We were going to keep two kits boxed up on the shelf for the archive now we are only keeping one. You can email me at [email protected] if you have any questions and you can order online. Thanks









Maybe if you turned on your IM's you would not see a big decline in anything








How are you doing otherwise?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Maybe if you turned on your IM's you would not see a big decline in anything








How are you doing otherwise?

I've had to say this before and I'm not exaggerating.
When my IM's are turned on it fills my screen and darn near locks up my computer. This would become another near full time job. Sorry we already spend from 2-4 hours per day on emails. 
Oh I'm doing pretty good, the broken bones are healing and hurt like a mother sucker










_Modified by JBETZ at 10:36 AM 3-20-2008_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

I'll work full time @ proxy.
Kthnx.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (g60pops)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60pops* »_
pics would be great.

Herer you go, sorry they are old and I don't even have this motor in my car right now. I put in a 2.0 instead of a 1.8...
























I just cut down the origional plastic tube and used the fitting for the origional PCV to attach the hose from my charger rear tail bracket (new PCV).


----------



## rallyegolf driver (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: internals (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_
what.. exactly am i looking @ here?? i'm VERY confused... 
-Nate









This is a tall-block 2.1 litre with 95,5mm crank 16VG60 on ITB's ( in progress). 
It 'll run on DTA. The Y-piece you see is the double intake for the G-lader and also the boost return tube. The Sensor you see on the tube is for data-logging purposes.
The car is owner by the moderator of http://www.vw-speed.nl called Chris.
http://www.vw-speed.nl
The engine is being built by Supro engineering http://www.supro.nl 
There you have it!


----------



## g60pops (Dec 20, 2001)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
emails are still getting done while I'm a permanent fixture in this fricken lazyboy chair. Over the last year we have seen a big decline in emails going through do to servers blocking spam and junk mail ect... Pretty sure we have a couple left. We were going to keep two kits boxed up on the shelf for the archive now we are only keeping one. You can email me at [email protected] if you have any questions and you can order online. Thanks









got a reply


----------



## g60pops (Dec 20, 2001)

can someone kindly list the pros and cons on using a pg block versus a kr block as i am still undecided on which route to take?
I have a golf g60 with a pg engine obviously.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (g60pops)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60pops* »_can someone kindly list the pros and cons on using a pg block versus a kr block as i am still undecided on which route to take?
I have a golf g60 with a pg engine obviously.

To me this is really a toss up.
If you are running an SC and this is what the thread is all about you are not typically going for an ultra high rpm engine.
The 16v head will get you another 1500+ more rpm over the 8V
The pg has very heavy rods and the 16v conversion pistons are also a bit heavier. My opinion is that this is ok going to the extra 1500 or so rpm that the higher flowing head will yield. If you want to build an engine that will rip past lets say 7500 rpm do not plan on the pg. The extra weight does not really hurt all that much when combined with the supercharger. I don't believe you would see a significant gain or change between the two. The heavier engine might make hold more torque and the lighter might make slightly more hp. Another thing to consider is that the pg rods are built like a tank and can handle really high boost numbers such as from the twin screw. If you are running the g-lader maybe the lighter engine is the better way to go. Just my two cents. You will have fun either way


----------



## fishecuss (Oct 17, 2004)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

l aggree with john's 2 cents but l'm using pg block and kr head just for the torque factor and the fact l intend to run high boost....


----------



## rhussjr (Aug 7, 2000)

*Re: (fishecuss)*

Using the PG block for the foundation of the 16V-G60 is fine if the intent is to continue running a G60 or a BBM charger conversion. But, if you plan on a turbo system, then a KR or PL block will serve your just as well. The Advantage of the PG when running the charger is just that, it is setup for the charger support bracket and oil return. Also, the block has improved cooling on the #1 & #4 cylinders (hence the cover plate and expansion plugs). The plate allows for water circulation around the outside of the cylinder. 
The drawback, as mentioned to the PG block, is the heavy rods (which are an old school Audi design carried over from old turbo parts bins along with the pistons). Not a modern design. With the improvement of forged pistons and the introduction of affordable performance rods such as SCAT's, the G60 bottom end can be thoroughly improved. Ditching the 136 mm center to center rods and going with the 144 mm units and a set of custom forged pistons, a larger amount of reciprocating weight can be removed and the G60 engine can be awakened into a faster revving engine that will perform and be as strong and durable as was stock. With this in mind, by going to the 144 mm rods, the 16V conversion is now more performance oriented and the heavy piston weights are now well under the 285 gram weight, whereas with the 136 mm rod combination, you would be looking at a ~325+ gram weight.


----------



## Shylion (Mar 1, 2008)

Hey,
I do not have to worry about the compression if I am doing a 1.8 G60 16v head with a gt301r turbo?
I am just really confussed.
Should I go with a 16v head and 2.0 l block or 1.8 g60 block?



_Modified by Shylion at 7:37 PM 3-24-2008_


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (Shylion)*



Shylion said:


> Hey,
> I do not have to worry about the compression if I am doing a 1.8 G60 16v head with a gt301r turbo?
> I am just really confussed.
> Should I go with a 16v head and 2.0 l block or 1.8 g60 block?
> Ok, keep in mind that you cannot just slap the 16V head on a PG G60 engine and run the stock pistons. The G60 PG pistons have a big fat scavenger boss on them and will not at all work with this head conversion. We have custom low compression pistons made up and on the shelf that work in the PG G60 engine and for use with the stock G60 PG rods. Most of you know this already, you can slap the 16V head onto the 2.0L ABA and it will give you about 8.5:1 compression. This is perfect for boost and I believe to be safe to roughly 250bhp, maybe evern 300 with proper tuning. A sweet way to go and very inexpensive. We also make a ton of parts for this 2.OL ABA 16V head conversion. You can check it all out on our site under the hybrid parts section. Lot's of options


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Ok, here it is the day has come.
*We have ONE left and that is it.*
This product is no longer going to be manufactured and going into the archives. Once this last kit is sold the product will be removed from our web site. First come first served. Thanks for the many years of running this one and the business!
Thanks again








http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_...n_Kit







[/QUOTE]


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Found what i was looking for guys ... 

here is my 16vg60 pages that are still getting so many hits ever day . glad people are finding it and using it to help them.
http://www.herbys53.com/builds.php


_Modified by herby53-akaherby53 at 9:06 PM 3-31-2008_


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

For reference, the ABF water flange that incorperates the BTS: part number 037121145 H


----------



## G60ING (Jun 27, 2000)

*Re: (flusted16v)*

I've got some factory remanufactured 16V heads for $350 with cams and a head gasket kit, its no april fools joke either


----------



## A63YOH (Apr 1, 2008)

*Re: (G60ING)*

Just wondering what you lot think of my set-up so far:
16v KR block (bored to 83mm)
G60 Rods
BBM 16VG60 pistons
G60 Crank
ARP rod bolts
16V KR head
Scirocco intake manifold
Alternator under the charger
And a BBM 16VG60 chip on digi
That's it so far but i'm trying to sort out fuelling at the moment:
I have a 3.5 BAR FPR but I don't know what injectors will work best,
does anyone have any suggestions? Or see anything wrong with my set-up?


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

im using 440ccs


----------



## A63YOH (Apr 1, 2008)

*Re: (flusted16v)*

I'm thinking of sticking with the 3.5 BAR FPR i have and using 315cc's. Need to sort out what fuel pump now! Would the standard single in-tank G60 pump be man enough for the task?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (A63YOH)*


_Quote, originally posted by *A63YOH* »_I'm thinking of sticking with the 3.5 BAR FPR i have and using 315cc's. Need to sort out what fuel pump now! Would the standard single in-tank G60 pump be man enough for the task?

you'll probably need additional oomph...


----------



## A63YOH (Apr 1, 2008)

*Re: (g60_c)*

Yeh that's what I reckon, what can you get and from where that's a straight (ish) swap?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (A63YOH)*


_Quote, originally posted by *A63YOH* »_Yeh that's what I reckon, what can you get and from where that's a straight (ish) swap?

pop a standard high-flow inline pump in there (in addition to the in-tank)... lets the intank act as just a transfer pump... walbro 255, the bosch 044 (i think that's the number)... http://www.usrallyteam.com carries a good selection of pumps... lots of other places do as well... 
also, upgrade the wiring to your intank pump.. relay it & run #12 or #10 wire to it... gives it a better voltage @ high fuel-demand situations... helps to keep from starving the motor for fuel...


----------



## A63YOH (Apr 1, 2008)

*Re: (g60_c)*

Looks ideal, and I've managed to find somewhere that sells the set-up here in the uk - bonus


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*BBM 16v G60 Ltd. SOLD OUT*

It is now official, we are 100% SOLD OUT
BBM 16v G60 Ltd. Integrations are no more.
Pretty sure we have been making these for over 8 or 9 years now.
Please do not ask us to make more as we are absolutely not going to do it. And no, not doing the rear alternator brackets either. Also please do not ask us for prints on the parts that we developed.
We do have a few odds and ends in the hybrid parts section that might still be of help for some of you.
Thanks again for those of you that did this set up and for your business


----------



## corocco (Jul 29, 2001)

*Re: BBM 16v G60 Ltd. SOLD OUT (JBETZ)*

If anyone is interested, I have one new and complete 16v G60 kit never installed and still in the box for $1195 which is what I paid for it originally. IM or email at [email protected]


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

I'm looking to do this swap this summer and had a question.
If I just put the 16v head on top of my 8v body I have to replace the pistons... If I put an entire 16v motor in it (top and bottom), do I still have to put new pistons in it?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_do I still have to put new pistons in it?

No,you can drop the CR using 2 ABA head gaskets.


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Would you recommend doing this over new pistons?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_Would you recommend doing this over new pistons?

That all depends on how "tired" your block is.I am against oversized rings.Long term they do not work....
If your block is tired (worn) then bore it to 83mm pistons and give the engine a fresh new life.You will gain by having the CR you want as well as upping the displacement slightly.
Send me a PM if you want custom JE pistons. http://****************.com/smile/emgift.gif


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
That all depends on how "tired" your block is.I am against oversized rings.Long term they do not work....
If your block is tired (worn) then bore it to 83mm pistons and give the engine a fresh new life.You will gain by having the CR you want as well as upping the displacement slightly.
Send me a PM if you want custom JE pistons. http://****************.com/smile/emgift.gif 

I might just do that. It's still going to be a while before I do this (still have to sell the other car first







), so we'll see what happens when I get around to doing it.


----------



## chippievw (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Traverse)*

heres mine, 100% abf gota love living in ireland


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Traverse)*


----------



## chippievw (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (TehLonz)*

i know the third car down http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (chippievw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chippievw* »_i know the third car down http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









JD engineering baby


----------



## MKone4Life (May 6, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (TehLonz)*

other than the obvious (speed and hp) Is the 16v G60 a better choice than the stock 8v g60 motor in a mk1 gti? I am getting ready to completely rebuild my motor (a 1991 g60 stock), but if I'm going to get better results doing the 16v swap, I'm all for it.


----------



## TheFog (Mar 17, 2005)

i didnt't find in this whole thread which head gasket and bolts you reccomend? g60 fabric or...?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (TheFog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheFog* »_i didnt't find in this whole thread which head gasket and bolts you reccomend? g60 fabric or...?

ABA head gasket and ARP 16V head studs. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## TheFog (Mar 17, 2005)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

or in my case, since I'm using both KR, block and head, KR gasket?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (TheFog)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheFog* »_or in my case, since I'm using both KR, block and head, KR gasket?

Use the ABA or any Multi layer gasket


----------



## 91whitewolfsburg (Nov 10, 2005)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

okay I have some questions I was hopeing some one could help me with. I have a 9a 16V that i have converted to mega squirt and am in the process of rebuilding with the BBM low compression pistons and I beam rods and this weekend I got a 90% complete G60 motor minus the intercooler and the water pump pulley. I would like to run a front mount with the manifold on the passenger side like this

and i am having some problems understanding what i need to do this conversion because from what i can tell the BBM integration kit has alot of stuff I wouldn't need. I would also like to try to mount the alternator on the bottom of the front to eliminate the excessively long serpentine belt gap. I was almost thinking about seeing if it was possible to just use a V belt for the water pump and alternator and run the serpentine just for the charger.
sorry if this is confusing and if my grammar isn't very good. 
thanks
Robert


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

you can do what ever you want..
There are multiple people running the alternator underneath the the charger.


----------



## 91whitewolfsburg (Nov 10, 2005)

so since Im running mega squirt can i use my standard throttle body and use a BOV to control boost instead of the normal way the digi 1 system uses the ISV and the boost return.


----------



## mallymal (Sep 22, 2004)

*Re: (91whitewolfsburg)*

JBETZ do you know if BBM will be remanufactuering the silencer kit for the lysholm. and if not any suggestions to silence it. The lysholm must live on..


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (mallymal)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mallymal* »_JBETZ do you know if BBM will be remanufactuering the silencer kit for the lysholm. and if not any suggestions to silence it. The lysholm must live on..

Run the throttle body on the inlet side of the super charger..


----------



## eve_ill (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_
Run the throttle body on the inlet side of the super charger..

there's more to it than that... like getting a bracket for that side of the lysholm so the case doesn't flex and destroy the charger when you hang weight off of it.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_you can do what ever you want..
There are multiple people running the alternator underneath the the charger.

I'm one of them... can be done fairly easily too. just a little fab work with a welder, grinder/sawzall really
I used a mk3 alt, hung off a G60 charger bracket, in the AC compressor location.
-Nate


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (g60_c)*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_
I'm one of them... can be done fairly easily too. just a little fab work with a welder, grinder/sawzall really
I used a mk3 alt, hung off a G60 charger bracket, in the AC compressor location.
-Nate

As am I .
Die grinder, g60 bracket, aba alternator.


----------



## rocpet (Feb 2, 2006)

Hello from Greece







. I fixing a little bit my Corrado as you can see in those photos http://www.vwclub.gr/vwforum/i...34941







. And of course i fixing and the moter.I want to make it 16v turbo with stock G60 pistons.Has anyone done this before







?Is it possible?How much is exactly the compression














?
(Sorry about my English)


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

Bit more progress on the conversion


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

oohh baby!


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_oohh baby!

this guy is killing me


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*

^^^how's that?


----------



## brilliantyellowg60 (Aug 30, 2001)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_^^^how's that?

you have a sick motor and you wont make me any parts


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*

Ooohh how I wish I had the skills to be making those parts myself








If I did it wouldn't have taken 5 1/2yrs to get to this stage.
I'm just desperate to get the thing finished before I end up with a sweet conversion surrounded by a pile of rust with a split rim at each corner


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_Bit more progress on the conversion









Thats just insane Richard!
Let me know if you need some lightened pulley's for the rest


----------



## 3A_G60_MAN (May 29, 2008)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*



RichPhatOne said:


> Bit more progress on the conversion
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## machine_war (Oct 8, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


----------



## Project 88 (Jun 29, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (machine_war)*

I've leafed through these pages quite a bit over the past few months and have a few questions...
1. Can this conversion be done on an ABA bottom with a PL Head?
2. What head sutds/head bolts/head gasket are needed?

I have a complete G60 engine, harness, ecu, DIGI relay. I need to source a radiator/fuel pump. I also have the BBM kit, a rebuilt ABA bottom end, a complete PL 16V, Rocco 16V Intake, ABF 5 spd Trans, and all of the change-over cableshift parts out of a passat to make the trans work. I'm looking to get started building soon and just need a little advice.
Thanks


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Project 88)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Project 88* »_I've leafed through these pages quite a bit over the past few months and have a few questions...


I don't believe you.


----------



## Project 88 (Jun 29, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (TehLonz)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TehLonz* »_I don't believe you.
 
Let's not start on that kind of BS... I realize that I probably need the ARP head stud kit... Why head studs? Why not ARP bolts? a part number for the kit would be a big help. I'm actually not on here everyday of my life, which means I only catch bit's and pieces of threads. And to answer your statement... No I haven't read this entire thread word for word. Since some of it may or may not apply to my situation.


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Project 88)*

I'm going to do this with a 16v head onto an ABA block... Does it matter if I use the oil drive stuff from the 16v or from the ABA? Basically, which one will get me better results?
Also I saw a few pages back someone mentioned a thread on building an ABF... Can someone send me a link to that thread, seeing as how that's kind of the setup I'm doing?


_Modified by Traverse at 9:57 AM 6-24-2008_


----------



## Project 88 (Jun 29, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_I'm going to do this with a 16v head onto an ABA block... Does it matter if I use the oil drive stuff from the 16v or from the ABA? Basically, which one will get me better results?
Also I saw a few pages back someone mentioned a thread on building an ABF... Can someone send me a link to that thread, seeing as how that's kind of the setup I'm doing?

_Modified by Traverse at 9:57 AM 6-24-2008_

That's along the lines of my question.... I've acquired 90% of the parts needed. I just wanted some advice as to which way to go. Use the G60, PL, Or the ABA bottom. I'm fairly certain that either could be used but are there any major pitfalls to one or the other?


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Project 88)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Project 88* »_
That's along the lines of my question.... I've acquired 90% of the parts needed. I just wanted some advice as to which way to go. Use the G60, PL, Or the ABA bottom. I'm fairly certain that either could be used but are there any major pitfalls to one or the other?

I've been told that if you use the ABA bottom you don't have to upgrade the pistons until you're running about 30+psi.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_
I've been told that if you use the ABA bottom you don't have to upgrade the pistons until you're running about 30+psi.

The limit is not the piston...its the tuning associated with the pistons.You can have pistons made of Gold and they would melt if your tuning is trash.


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

Cheers Iss,tell me more of these lightened pulleys???


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_Cheers Iss,tell me more of these lightened pulleys???

These?








Also finally finishing up the G60 cogged gears.


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

Can I just use the pulleys from the ABA block/16V head, or do I have to buy special ones?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

you'll need to mill the aba crank pulley.


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

I just picked up my ABA block to start my build! Yay!
Can I still use my G60 waterpump/a/c compressor and power steering pump?
Also can you guys recommend a good place to order pulleys from?
I'm sure this has all been covered, but unfortunately I need to go to work and don't have time to search through the thread. I'll do that when I get home though http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Cookie16vG60 (Jul 1, 2008)

*New Build*

I have just purchased a 2 litre bottom end with a 16v head with a 50mm scirocco inlet manifold and also an 02A gear box thought i would start by showing you guys what i have got and what i am going to do with it.
























And this is the car im putting it in, correct me if im wrong but i dont think i have seen anyone put a 16v G60 into a Scirocco on this forum.








I've got alot of parts to get yet so its going to take me a while but from what i've read alot of help is at hand here.


_Modified by Cookie16vG60 at 2:28 PM 7-14-2008_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_
Can I still use my G60 waterpump/a/c compressor and power steering pump?
Also can you guys recommend a good place to order pulleys from?


Yes you can still use all of the G60 components.What pulley's do you need?


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Yes you can still use all of the G60 components.What pulley's do you need?

Basically all of the pulleys. I just picked up my ABA shortblock on Sunday.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_
Basically all of the pulleys. I just picked up my ABA shortblock on Sunday.

Check your PM http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

I'm finally getting this underway! I started yesterday morning with this:
























And ended with this:
























I also took it apart and checked the insides, and it was quite a pleasant surprise to find everything in good working order! 
Now I just need to get my head


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

For those of you that used it on the ABA, what fuel system did you use?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_For those of you that used it on the ABA, what fuel system did you use?

Most users source a Digi-I system + SNS chip but these days MS&S is proving to be a very effective affordable set up.
Look into Spitfire systems (valvecovergasket carries them)


----------



## oneunicrone (Jun 26, 2006)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

so your bones hurt like a mother sucker 
i know how that feel i broken my back my left and right legs and both my arm skateboarding do i still do it **** yeah life is all about pain we live with pain till we die and we only complain till are numbers up


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (oneunicrone)*

what kind of dstributor / cap is this?


----------



## herby53-akaherby53 (Dec 24, 2003)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

pretty sure that is a saab one but if i am wrong , i will be corrected


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (herby53-akaherby53)*

Looks like a Saab unit.Can anyone confirm?


----------



## TYLASTYLE (Jan 14, 2003)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

never posted in this thread before kind of kept my build quiet... 82 rabbit. 1.8 16v running 11lbs of boost still working out some quirks with the megasquirt...


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (TYLASTYLE)*

sweet car, just curious what are you running for the g-lader bypass


----------



## clintg60-16v (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Off-topic: John, good morning, it's been a while! I'll call you this week; my travel's local for a couple weeks so I'll have the time.
ON-topic: there are some badass motors and projects in this thread. Nice work all! I need to pick up a SAAB distributor...
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (clintg60-16v)*

Anyone got pics of the G60 power steering bracket? (the one that bolts to the block?)


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (brilliantyellowg60)*


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Anyone got pics of the G60 power steering bracket? (the one that bolts to the block?)


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (sdezego)*

Thanks Shawn,
thats what I feared....back to the ABA power steering bracket


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Thanks Shawn,
thats what I feared....back to the ABA power steering bracket









The ABA wont mount to the G60 Brkt w/o quite a bit of mods if at all. I already looked at that at one point.


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*FV-QR*

What are you cooking up Issam?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (sdezego)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sdezego* »_
The ABA wont mount to the G60 Brkt w/o quite a bit of mods if at all. I already looked at that at one point.

Its not for the G60 Shawn....remember your PM?


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*








oh, yea...


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (sdezego)*

back to the distributor / cap on the last page...someone said it was from a saab....
after checking the dist. that fits is from the Saab 900 (82 - 85) 2.0L 8V (non turbo). Which cap is that though? Someone said it's from a Fiat....anyone?


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_back to the distributor / cap on the last page...someone said it was from a saab....
after checking the dist. that fits is from the Saab 900 (82 - 85) 2.0L 8V (non turbo). Which cap is that though? Someone said it's from a Fiat....anyone?

I love how much random mixing there is on this motor








Sorry to jack from your question, but where did you guys get your head bolts from? I'm building this on an ABA, if that matters.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (Traverse)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_
I love how much random mixing there is on this motor










what's wrong with that? i'm running a 9a block & head, aba crank pulley, vr6 alt (well, will be soon anyway), PG throttle body, PG serp tensioner, vr6 h20 pulley (well, will be soonish), PG power steering pump, soon to be driven by a 1.8t ps pulley, a ford idler pulley, ford supercharger, new beetle breather... 
i think it's kinda fun.. the VW partsbin Lego effect







it's all mix-n-match








-Nate


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (g60_c)*

besides my dist. question...what is the piece going from the charger in towards the front of the car?


----------



## Scuba2001 (Jul 16, 2002)

*FV-QR*

Looks like a carbon fiber air intake duct for the G60 charger.


----------



## 13LG60 (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

thats a second inlet for the charger, dumping the hot air from the brv to atmosphear


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (1,3LG60)*

that's the inlet that can be blocked off right?


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_that's the inlet that can be blocked off right?

The one usually blocked off. I'm pretty sure you can block either . 















To J.D. engineering.


----------



## 1.9..16vTurbo (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

dpgreek and tehlonz are in bed together.
long live the moment of inertia displacer!


----------



## mrkrad (Nov 9, 2000)

*Re: (1.9..16vTurbo)*

equal air on both sides would result in the best theoretical situation. 
but why not just weld the sides shut and cut the top off and put the airbox right there. flip the K&N upside and do a trans-am ram-air(jet) airbox lid.


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (mrkrad)*

Hi guys i'm new to the forum.
I love the stuff you guys can get for the G60 and the motors you guys are building.Wish i could get my hand on the stuff you guys can.


_Modified by SA G60 at 1:07 PM 8-15-2008_


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (mrkrad)*

Hi guys i'm new to the forum.
I live in S.A.We don't have G60'S this side so after years i got a motor and rebuilt it.Then i rebuilt the car and went the 16v route with it.
The pic of it was posted here a few pages back.Its the one with black mani folds and red vernier pully.
I had to source parts from all over and i have not regretted going with the charger as its great fun and it's the only one in the country!!!!!
I wish i could get hold of half the stuff you guys can get!!!!
I will post pics and details.[once i get the hang of the forum]
It is a 9a 16v with flowed head,ADV eng pistons [t3 bus] ,full balance,260deg cams.The charger i rebuilt and flowed with 64m pully.
Parts for charger was sourced local but i'm getting new seals from BBM
as local ones don't last long.
Fitted the DIGI1 system that i got from the US.It still runs a 8v NUESPEED chip.[trying to find 16v chip for it]


----------



## deth_core (Jul 12, 2002)

saudi arabia?
nice setup.
oh, S Africa.










_Modified by deth_core at 3:58 PM 8-15-2008_


----------



## eve_ill (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: (deth_core)*

Looks awesome. Didn't know that you guys didn't get G60s there as you have all the other cool stuff (5-cyl T3's made until a few years back, mk1 Golfs, etc...)


_Modified by eve_ill at 7:01 PM 8-15-2008_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*Re: (deth_core)*


_Quote, originally posted by *deth_core* »_saudi arabia?
nice setup.
oh, S Africa.









_Modified by deth_core at 3:58 PM 8-15-2008_


South Africa


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (TehLonz)*

Yes we still get citi golf etc.They just went euro2 emission etc aswell
so they not even the same.[i work for a dealer]
What i wanted to ask was how much does the g60 boost with 64mm pully.Mine runs at 0.7/8bar.Is this correct?
Some one asked what rollers i'm useing close to the alt.Those are from the AHF 1.9tdi [mk4] cambelt rollers.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (SA G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SA G60* »_
Some one asked what rollers i'm useing close to the alt.Those are from the AHF 1.9tdi [mk4] cambelt rollers.

How have you mounted those rollers?
I will probably go the same route with my tesioner system.








thnks in advance.
Robert


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

Hi.
I used long studs then made spacers behind the rollers to space them correct.[8mm]
I removed the lower roller and made the water pump pully a bit bigger
so that the belt runs on it.The problem was that the pully was a mm or 2 too small and belt did not run on it.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (SA G60)*

Hiya.
So your nor running with the above setup now?
Any pics of your new setup or is it in the car now?
thnks.


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

Hi.
I'm running the same setup minus the lower small roller.
Sorry mate have no pics as it is in the car now.
With this setup i have no belt slip as that was my worst fear.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (SA G60)*

yeah coz you have a few degrees less belt contact,but you say its boosting fine eh?!!
Well I have mocked up your first setup so i'll see if I encounter the same probs.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
thnks for your input.


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

I'm going to try a nother setup when i recon my charger as i just got my APEX seals from BBM.Thanx John Betz you the man.
I will get you pics the minute i'm fin.
I have run this setup for 20000km and i have no problems.
Where could i get a map mailed to me for a 16v g60 digi1?
I can get it written to a chip.


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (SA G60)*

Hi got two pics that i took tonight to show the motor.


----------



## mirus (Sep 1, 2008)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For sale: Brackets that are needed to build a 16vG60.
The brackets are lasered and designed by copying the exact same brackets from vw motorsport. 
* Alternator bracket on back of the engine
* Bracket for belt tiedner
* Triangle shaped bracket for pullies
* feulrail rvs exact copy from vw motorsport
The brackets are beïng yellow galvanised or powdercoated and they can also be made in rvs but they will cost more. 
Price of the yellow galvanised brackets including rvs feul rail is 
350,- euro/ 282,- pounds/ 515,- dollar us 
Brackets without gas rail is 
250,- euro/ 202,- pounds/ 367,- dollar us



























_Modified by mirus at 9:13 AM 9-1-2008_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (mirus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirus* »_
Brackets without gas rail is 
250,- euro/ 202,- pounds/ 367,- dollar us









Now I wont feel so bad with my pricing!


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (SA G60)*

looks awesome SA G60.
Most impressive.


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

I'm building this on the ABA.
What do I do about the distributor? It doesn't look like it has enough space between the distributor and the head to be able to fit the cap and wires on it...
Pics of my motor, still awaiting pulleys and paint:


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*FV-QR*









?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (mirus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirus* »_--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For sale: Brackets that are needed to build a 16vG60.
The brackets are lasered and designed by copying the exact same brackets from vw motorsport. 
* Alternator bracket on back of the engine
* Bracket for belt tiedner
* Triangle shaped bracket for pullies
* feulrail rvs exact copy from vw motorsport
The brackets are beïng yellow galvanised or powdercoated and they can also be made in rvs but they will cost more. 
Price of the yellow galvanised brackets including rvs feul rail is 
350,- euro/ 282,- pounds/ 515,- dollar us 
Brackets without gas rail is 
250,- euro/ 202,- pounds/ 367,- dollar us

























_Modified by mirus at 9:13 AM 9-1-2008_

man those parts look familiar


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
man those parts look familiar









What from the VWMS Limited? I agree


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (sdezego)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sdezego* »_
What from the VWMS Limited? I agree









Yes almost like VWMS


----------



## mirus (Sep 1, 2008)

thanxx


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Traverse* »_
What do I do about the distributor? It doesn't look like it has enough space between the distributor and the head to be able to fit the cap and wires on it.

Use a Fiat X1-9 distributor cap. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 








http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...ZWD1V


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*FV-QR*

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm sexay


----------



## jwatts (Mar 11, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

is the waterpump driving the charger and the alternator?







.

_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_


----------



## TehLonz (Oct 5, 2006)

*FV-QR*

Conceptual belt routing , YO!


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jwatts)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwatts* »_is the waterpump driving the charger and the alternator?







.


Something like that.Just took the picture for the customer as he wanted to see the belt routing with my pulley & alternator relocation set up.


----------



## excreations (Jul 31, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

Anyone know where I can find a 16v-g60 kit these days, or anyone trying to get rid of there 16vg60??


----------



## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

*FV-QR*

does anyone have pics of the alt under the g60 in a mk1?


----------



## Danno13 (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (syracusegli)*









Could anyone point me in the direction as where to find an idler pulley like the one in the pic above. The pulley above the alt.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR (Danno13)*

i'm not certain but, it could be a toyota piece... it wouldn't surprise me; coming from issam


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

vw tdi


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (flusted16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flusted16v* »_vw tdi

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Sorry did not see this post until just now.It is from a MKIV 1.9TDI timing belt kit.Makes a pretty good idler pulley.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

are most of those pulleys, etc.. oem?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_are most of those pulleys, etc.. oem?

No
The only OEM pulley is the crankshaft pulley.The rest we make in house @ INA Engineering.


----------



## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

*FV-QR*

how did you get the mk3 alt under there?
i pushed out an insert on the g60 bracket.
is it offset to the left?
i even tried the mk2 one. im








and im doing this in a mk1 so i have no space!


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (syracusegli)*


_Quote, originally posted by *syracusegli* »_how did you get the mk3 alt under there?
i pushed out an insert on the g60 bracket.
is it offset to the left?
i even tried the mk2 one. im








and im doing this in a mk1 so i have no space!

Custom sets up I do.If you need one send me a PM.


----------



## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

*FV-QR*

ill have to mess with it more tomorrow, i got unmotivated after nothing worked. if nothing works out for me ill deff be getting in touch.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_









Ok, so it is conceptual...and cannot work as it is not routed to the crank pulley.
On another note, not using a dynamic spring tensioner can also be a problem. The belts heat up and streeetch way out...so unless you pull over every time you warm up your set up and tighten the belt it can and will slip when running a decent boost number. When it cools down it could make the belt dangerously tight. Just making an observation here, not bashing. Looks good for a lower boost set up.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

john, how are those billet displacers coming along? put me down for one asap...







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_Looks good for a lower boost set up.

And high boost set ups as proven by Peter Tong.
The image is for illustration purposes only.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
And high boost set ups as proven by Peter Tong.
The image is for illustration purposes only.

Hey just sharing my experience and a simple fact... Not saying you cant crank it down and overload all the bearings and run higher boost. If you want to run a fixed belt tensioner go for it!


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_john, how are those billet displacers coming along? put me down for one asap...







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Ah... right now we are pretty deep in a couple of other projects. I'd say if we continue with the displacer project it will be next year... so don't hold your breath!


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

damn...okie dok. keep us posted


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*

my experience with static tensioning is that it works just fine... i ran my set-up for 30 000km without any trouble. i only tore the engine down for something new








i think it looks groovy


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_my experience with static tensioning is that it works just fine... i ran my set-up for 30 000km without any trouble. i only tore the engine down for something new








i think it looks groovy









Yes, we know it can work... OEM's don't do it and I haven't seen any of the major supercharger kit manufacturers do it either. There is a reason, the bearings can get overloaded, your belt can slip more easily and it can also wear out prematurely, bearings and belt... that's all. Oh wait the belt is slipping so I'll just crank it down even more, the belt cools back down and now it is way to tight! I'm sure this is acceptable for some people and could run for awhile...how long...at what boost and at what tension, there is no "canned answer" I'm just making the point for the people that may not know these pit-falls


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
Yes, we know it can work... OEM's don't do it and I haven't seen any of the major supercharger kit manufacturers do it either.

Know your roots....
Your 2ZZ-GE may have been NA but the 4A-GZE certainly had a manual non spring loaded tensioner for the supercharger


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
Know your roots....
Your 2ZZ-GE may have been NA but the 4A-GZE certainly had a manual non spring loaded tensioner for the supercharger









I'm not familiar with this set up. I'll restate just for you... most OEM's, the ones that I have seen anyway. As I mention, with lower boost it can be fine. Still questionable at higher boost levels. Just curious, why are you out to defeat my simple point, or do you just totally not agree with it? I have no product revolving around this or any gain by adding this information in here. If you just plain disagree that's great, topic over. Now go run your supercharger with a water-pump


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_I have no product revolving around this or any gain by adding this information in here.

John I respect you and what you have done for this industry.I appreciate your input but lets not kid ourselves,the only reason you started adding information to this thread was to push your 16V G60 kit sales.When I emailed you and asked you to contribute you did not even bother replying to it.
Regardless as stated above the belt wraping system is for illustration purposes. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
John I respect you and what you have done for this industry.I appreciate your input but lets not kid ourselves,the only reason you started adding information to this thread was to push your 16V G60 kit sales.When I emailed you and asked you to contribute you did not even bother replying to it.
Regardless as stated above the belt wraping system is for illustration purposes. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

That's cool, maybe I missed it, your respect and the reply








"Let's not kid ourselves"...lol We have been sold out of these for many months now, don't plan on making anymore EVER! So why am I in here... you know why the heck am I in here, cya guys


----------



## Sciroccomann (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

good info here.. assuming with a longer belt this problem would be more severe. A short belt driving only the alt and charger may not be a problem, but a belt double in length driving all accessories, once tighted while warm, could shorten and put signifigant stress on components when cold. So now you're stressing cold bearings with the cold belt at a the next cold startup. one more cold for the hell of it.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Sciroccomann)*

I was just kidding in my previous post about being in here. I really like to lurk around and see peoples set ups and the such. keep em coming http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Sciroccomann)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Sciroccomann* »_but a belt double in length driving all accessories, once tighted while warm, could shorten and put signifigant stress on components when cold. So now you're stressing cold bearings with the cold belt at a the next cold startup. one more cold for the hell of it. 

Maybe you should tell Maxwell that his belt slipped....
















I enjoy the inputs from some of you but stating assumptions as facts will get you into trouble.
My set up is fine....


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_
I enjoy the inputs from some of you but stating assumptions as facts will get you into trouble.
My set up is fine....

This is no assumption my friend.
Should be fine for lower boost... will cause premature bearing and belt wear at higher belt tension and boost levels.
We can have a friendly disagreement on this one










_Modified by JBETZ at 3:44 PM 9-26-2008_


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

i used a 65mm pulley and saw 13psi all day long on my ABA 16VG60.
i always build to last. 
agree to disagree i suppose. 
if this were available at the time i built mine... i'd have bought it instead... building this engine isn't easy. 
btw... isn't the ABF serp belt system static?!?! i know there's a spring but that's only to tension the belt before tightening the nut on the alternator.
anyway... BUY THIS KIT!!!!


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Wizard-of-OD)*

that's not my old setup issam... it's very similar though with the outboard alt. you can post my pics if you like... i don't mind. i'll send you the whole folder... there're some pics with the toyota ITB's and the G60 as well.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*

It's all good, I wouldn't really consider around 15 psi that high of boost. I think a stock 1.8T makes around this. We pretty much maxed out the horsey power capabilities playing around with 6 rib belts along time ago now. You can only go so far with 6 ribs, traction and tension. Also played with several cog drive set ups...nightmare! Our new billet crank pulleys can run a six but have an additional 2 grooves so you can go 8 rib drive and traction. The other pulleys to go along with this are in the works. You don't really need all this with the more common g-lader set ups. Peace, have a great weekend guys... I'm going to Oktoberfest here in Bend, chase skirts and drink beers!


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

15psi is getting up there for "a more common G-lader set-up". most people run a 68mm pulley max. and, see 18psi on a PG if they're lucky!!! you're not going to see that on a 16VG60 because of the extra volume. besides... the point is moot; what does high-boost have to do with belt tension? 
maybe we should all change our static timing belt tensioning set-ups to 8 rib serp belts with dynamic tensioning since cogged belts and static tensioning systems are ticking timebombs.


----------



## Sciroccomann (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_what does high-boost have to do with belt tension? 

you can't make high boost without enough belt tension... 
now what I'm saying is for discussion, so don't call me out on making up facts especially when I use the terms 'assuming' and 'could'! also never said your buddy's belt slipped. I did however make a point that things will contract and expand. weather there is enough change in temp between hot and cold running conditions to change belt tension is up for discussion. I think belt length would be a factor. what do you think? 
now this may be a moot point if these auto tensioners were designed for drastic change in temperatures. ie, typical auto owner doesn't monitor belt tension between summer and winter where you have extremes (especially winter). plus belt wear and stretch.. No big deal for us to tighten the belt a little, but the average Joebob would get pissed off and find it unacceptable. 
i must say all OEM's i've seen use a sprung tensioner, and it's obviously we have no understanding of the reasons they do so. 
Is it to: 
1) maintain pressure during normal belt heat cycling? 
2) accomodate for extreme atmospheric temperature changes? 
3) Deal with stretch and wear? 
4) make me buy another tool to get to and depress the tensioner? 
who said cog belts are timebombs? I think we just don't like auto tensioners. hard to trust them. sure everyone here knows the new stupid aba auto timing belt tensioner... Every time I've seen it I remove and replace with the old school static version.. Same with the 1.8t! they're everywhere!! 
and quick back to the longer vs. shorter belt, I'm thinking it may not be more severe on longer belts. Although longer belts may contract more, the load would be distributed over more pulleys. so the tension increase per pulley may even out. 
your setup is probably fine (and definitely kick ass), but it makes more sense to defend it instead of mocking people and just saying it's fine without an explaination. I run at static tension serp pulling a lysholm on a 16v and I haven't toasted any bearings yet; however, I think John's claim has merit and should be evaluated. 


_Modified by Sciroccomann at 11:37 AM 9-27-2008_


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

MIne now ive tidy'd it up
















and its in this


----------



## Danno13 (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Danno13)*









I have 2 part numbers for the idlers in the tdi timing belt kit. Wiz, are you able to tell me which is the correct one? Maybe either will work
058 109 244
038 109 244E
Thanks


----------



## hotrados (Jul 26, 2005)

i dont understand the setup on the previous page with the power steering pump up top. how is the fluid going to get from the reservoir to the pump if the pump is higher than the reservoir?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Danno13)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Danno13* »_
058 109 244
038 109 244E

I will check tomorrow but 058 sounds like an AEB roller.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR (Wizard-of-OD)*

058 is a 20V relay tensioner... should be available individually.
038 E is a TDi relay tensioner... comes part of a kit.


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (hotrados)*


_Quote, originally posted by *hotrados* »_i dont understand the setup on the previous page with the power steering pump up top. how is the fluid going to get from the reservoir to the pump if the pump is higher than the reservoir?

I can only _assume_ that the reservoir will be mounted to the back of the pump like most american cars did/do. Either that or it will have to be mounted in some fashion so that it is higher. Hopefully the originator already thought of all of that.
When I was building my custom setup, I had considered moving it (So I had thought about the implications), but settled on leaving it in a semi stock location.
Shawn


----------



## Danno13 (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (MA_XXX)*

Both of the part numbers came from the TDI timing kit. I got the numbers from German Autoparts








Top left. Wiz, I hope your able to straighten this out


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Danno13)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Danno13* »_Both of the part numbers came from the TDI timing kit. I got the numbers from German Autoparts








Top left. Wiz, I hope your able to straighten this out

Yup,dealt with this today.
I use the one that does not have the extension.I basically make my own spacer.The bearing I have is the INA unit and it is the 038 109 244E
unit.
Does that help?


----------



## Danno13 (Mar 25, 2004)

Thats perfect, thanks, Have you seen the one with the extension? I wonder how close it is to putting it inline with the belt.
Ill get the one without and make a spacer, Thanks


----------



## syracusegli (Jan 22, 2005)

*FV-QR*

what size should my oil feed line be?
can my return line be bigger?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Danno13)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Danno13* »_Thats perfect, thanks, Have you seen the one with the extension? I wonder how close it is to putting it inline with the belt.
Ill get the one without and make a spacer, Thanks

I first got the extended one but didnt like it because the belt didnt sit right on it.
I will take more pictures tomorrow if I get chance.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

what does the kit cost??? is there anything else in the kit of any use?!!? seems like a bit of waste for one small idler. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_what does the kit cost??? is there anything else in the kit of any use?!!? seems like a bit of waste for one small idler. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif

Max you can get the idler for about $8US separate.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

HA!!!
PPPFFFFFFTTTTTT!!!!!!!!!!!
i've had poutine that cost as much!!!!


----------



## Danno13 (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_HA!!!
PPPFFFFFFTTTTTT!!!!!!!!!!!
i've had poutine that cost as much!!!!

But wasn't nearly as rewarding as those last few pounds of boost. I hope this bad boy eliminates my belt slip up top. Pics if you have them would be great


----------



## Danno13 (Mar 25, 2004)

Just got my bearing, and its got the spacer.
Its part number is the one listed above, so i'm guessing the other part number is the one without the spacer. Or I got the wrong part in the wrong right box, as the roller doesn't have a number printed on it. I will have to see how this fits.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (Danno13)*

thanks to issam at INA engineering... i just received my SCAT rods yesterday. 159 X 21
ordering my aluminum pullies tonight and, my pistons soon too


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (MA_XXX)*

Danno13 you have the correct bearing.
I just swopped mine out for the one from the newer TDI motor
eng code asz/bkc [pd motor].
I found that the small bearing sometimes bends the belt at too much of an angle and cracks the belt.The pd motor one is a bigger roller also with a spacer on it.


----------



## SA G60 (Jul 31, 2008)

*Re: (SA G60)*

I see that boost was mentioned on the 16v motors.
I just got two sets of apex seals from BBM [after i cut off my arm.lol]
Rand dollar exchange sux at this point.
What is the max boost on the 16v g60 with a 64mm pully?[bar please]


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (SA G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Wizard-of-OD* »_Quote, originally posted by Traverse »
What do I do about the distributor? It doesn't look like it has enough space between the distributor and the head to be able to fit the cap and wires on it.
Use a Fiat X1-9 distributor cap. 

I have a Fiat X1-9 dis cap if any one is interested
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4098911


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

How many miles do any of you have on this setup? 
Any record holders here?
I'm at 40K miles...


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

This thread was great a year or so ago but it seems that everyone has moved on from the 16V G60.Should rekindle that flame shortly.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

where is the easiest place to run your oil feed line from?
Is there somewhere on the 16v head?
What do most folk do?
thnks.


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dirtytorque* »_where is the easiest place to run your oil feed line from?
Is there somewhere on the 16v head?
What do most folk do?
thnks.

Run it off the back of the cylinder head. There is an oil pressure sensor on the driver (right) back side of the head. Use the one from the side of the head from a G-60 Raddo and boom there you go. Low oil pressure sensor and charger supply line hooked up about two inches away from where they were from the factory...


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

what are you guys using for your trannies? Stock G60?


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (Traverse)*

O2A for my Corrado (hydraulic clutch was factory on this car)
O2O for my Rabbit (linkage/cable tranny is much easier in this car)


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*

How many of you are still die hard G60 fans?


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

Think we might be finally nearing the end of my engines development,
modified the sump to take a dipstick,the original tube will need to be 
radiused but will do that when charger is bolted back up,anyhoo couple of pics.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

yeah were out there still.Still lots of people modding these engines.
:0)
btw is anyone running a DAIHATSU CHARADE Alternator.
They are quite small so would be good for mounting under the charger but not sure if the mounting holes are suitable.
Thanks.


----------



## s.l.c. (Aug 4, 2008)

*Re: (mirus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirus* »_--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For sale: Brackets that are needed to build a 16vG60.
The brackets are lasered and designed by copying the exact same brackets from vw motorsport. 
* Alternator bracket on back of the engine
* Bracket for belt tiedner
* Triangle shaped bracket for pullies
* feulrail rvs exact copy from vw motorsport
The brackets are beïng yellow galvanised or powdercoated and they can also be made in rvs but they will cost more. 
Price of the yellow galvanised brackets including rvs feul rail is 
350,- euro/ 282,- pounds/ 515,- dollar us 
Brackets without gas rail is 
250,- euro/ 202,- pounds/ 367,- dollar us


























As anybody bought these backects from this guy???


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (s.l.c.)*

can someone please tell me which alternators (besides the 90amp corrado alternator) will work with the BBM relocation kit? I need to upgrade the alternator and was wondering what some options are besides rebuilding the corrado one I have. Thanks


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

ttt


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

what alternator is this


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_what alternator is this

Thats the one I was telling you about.The ABA/AAA VR6 unit which is pretty much the standard for all alternators from the MKIII to the MKV+.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

rock n roll...so I guess it will work on the 16V G60 set up. I called BBM to ask if it will work and I never got an answer....I just want to make sure it will clear the hood/strut bar


----------



## Sciroccomann (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

what alt are you running now? I think these are smaller than the g60 alts.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Sciroccomann)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Sciroccomann* »_what alt are you running now? I think these are smaller than the g60 alts. 


Indeed they are and more "with the times" in the event that you need a replacement.VW's use this pattern of alternators on everything today and they range from 70A all the way to 140A.


----------



## mirus (Sep 1, 2008)

s.l.c.
you can get in contact with me via [email protected] if you want information about the brackets


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

Are there any oem solutions for a longer bonnet cable?
Thanks.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

sorry i mean longer throttle cable.
duh.


----------



## Traverse (Jun 16, 2007)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

What are you guys using for an IC, and if you have a FMIC what bumper did you use? If you have any, pics are also greatly appreciated http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

*Re: (Traverse)*

Can anybody tell me if the MFA in my 92 GTI can still work with a 16vG60 installed? If so how to do it, what wires need splicing, etc, etc? Just got my hands on a BBM kit so im just starting to build it and need a little help.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (92VW)*

/\/\
what engine management are you going to use????


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sciroccomann* »_/\/\

what alt are you running now? I think these are smaller than the g60 alts. 

I ended up using an iraggi alternator from ebay. He takes the factory ones and rewinds them for higher amp output...they offer it in 120 a, 180, and 200 a for the G60 alternator. I ended up with a 120 amp


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_
I ended up using an iraggi alternator from ebay. He takes the factory ones and rewinds them for higher amp output...they offer it in 120 a, 180, and 200 a for the G60 alternator. I ended up with a 120 amp

They dont make them.They just sell them...I can get any alternator you want with any Amp output.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (Wizard-of-OD)*

cool


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: (Traverse)*

My intercooler setup.


----------



## turtledub (May 10, 2006)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*

Can I use my JE forged pistons in a PG bottom end with a 16v head? I am trying not to buy new pistons.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (turtledub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turtledub* »_Can I use my JE forged pistons in a PG bottom end with a 16v head? I am trying not to buy new pistons.

If these are JE PG G60 1.8L 8v pistons, negative


----------



## turtledub (May 10, 2006)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Darn. That is what I thought. Oh well, guess I will run the 8v turbo until something happens then I will pony up the money to upgrade.


----------



## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

*Re: (dirtytorque)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dirtytorque* »_/\/\
what engine management are you going to use????

Digi 1. any help on how to wire up this harness to my CE2 harness would be great as well.


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

Can anyone confirm, with the rocco inlet, does the g60 boost return foul the dizzy? I wont be fitting the boost return piping, it will be to atmosphere.
Will it clear?


----------



## Sciroccomann (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (flusted16v)*

fail. doesn't clear. If the throttle body is relocated you can still use the g60 inlet with boost return (Facing down, but no TB), it will clear the dizzy with minor mod (removed a thing or two from it). supposedly a fiat dizzy cap which points all wires down will work, but that's just hearsay for me.


----------



## -AG- (Oct 22, 2008)

*Re: (Sciroccomann)*

Unless I am missing something the problem is not clearing the dizzy or cap, it is just one of the spark plug wires that the throttle body linkage fouls. I tried using the Fiat cap but it rendered the same problem. Right now I have the linkage piece tweaked just enough to clear the spark plug wire. I still have full movement of tb linkage and can not see where it is going to be a problem....yet. If people really are using the Fiat cap, I wonder if they even tried to hook up the stock one first because it is almost the exact same clearance or they had a different brand than me (I used carquest or napa) There has always been a big hoorah over this and I have wondered why, I had to only make a _minor_ adjustment.


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

Any pics?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

If any of your guys are running our G60 twin screw kit and want to go with a 16v head conversion. We can send you the parts to reconfigure your blower for use with the ABA accessory bracket and a 16v head. call me and or email me directly if interested. [email protected] Here is a pic of a Mk3 ABA running this set up... basically the same set up.


----------



## -AG- (Oct 22, 2008)

*Re: (flusted16v)*

I can get some pics up. Shop camera is at buddies house so it will take a couple of days. I do have this though, different solution to a common problem here. PN# 056919367
http://www.worldimpex.com/


----------



## flusted16v (Jun 13, 2004)

that looks a good idea.
Quick question, would a 42mm or a 50mm manifold suit the lysholm with 55mm pulley on a 16v PL??


----------



## mirus (Sep 1, 2008)

-AG- where did you find the blue sensor holder??


----------



## meanvw (Jan 1, 2005)

*Re: (mirus)*

Been searching for plans for the bracket for the alternator (mounting it behind the head). I re-scanned this whole thread, and didn't find them.
Can anybody steer me in the right direction?
If someone's got a used one... let me know.
Otherwise I've got access to someone that can build it so long as I can get measurements.


----------



## -AG- (Oct 22, 2008)

*Re: (mirus)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mirus* »_-AG- where did you find the blue sensor holder??

I saw a pic of one a while back, but I think it held two sensors instead of one, however my memory may be playing games with me. If anyone has a pn for a two sensor piece for the record please post up so I know I'm not going crazy.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4216595


----------



## -AG- (Oct 22, 2008)

*Re: (flusted16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flusted16v* »_Any pics?

Sorry, I am horrible with pics. However, it is _very very_ close, maybe fit a dime through the space I have between the linkage and spark plug boot. Next time the motor comes out I'm going to do a little playing with intermediate shafts, change some gears around and move the dizzy to the block.


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*

Bit more of an update on the slowest engine build known to man,
chargecooler intergrated into the inlet manifold is now buttoned up.
Should be able to make out the two Laminova cores in the pics,theory is water goes up through the first core is then sent back down the second core thereby keeping the charge temps equal across the bank,sounds good in theory



































_Modified by RichPhatOne at 12:48 PM 3-10-2009_


----------



## meanvw (Jan 1, 2005)

*Re: (RichPhatOne)*

Here's my contribution to the 16VG60 thread...
Sensor Mythbusters








If you're doing a scirocco or other car that you only need the blue water sensor for the ECU and not the black one which only drives the water temperature gauge in the corrado instrument cluster... 








pot of water, sensors, multi meter (ohms resistance), thermometer, fancy chart...








Testing in progress








Results















Turns out that the brown 16V sensor is pretty much an ON/OFF switch. once it's warm the circuit opens.... nothing else to track.
The lighter 16V sensor pictured on the other hand matches exactly to the blue sensor that is needed. 
So if you want to just use the 16V water neck on the side of the head, and the lighter colored sender, that's it.
Finally something I dont need to modify!
If you want to follow another 16vg60 build, or help a brother out.... follow the link:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4157368


_Modified by meanvw at 6:50 PM 3-16-2009_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (s.l.c.)*

who wants cogged gears? just got the tools in today for HTD 8mm pitch belts
will have some samples in the morning


----------



## vvdubg60 (May 20, 2007)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*

im definitely interested im working on a set up now ...you making cog pullys for the lysholm charger


----------



## vvdubg60 (May 20, 2007)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*

k sounds good


----------



## DAN16VG60 (Feb 1, 2003)

very interested for cog pully for lysholm


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

This has been a project with oh....4 years worth of planning








I really cant complain though as this year has been more than rewarding for me.
Enjoy...


----------



## MK2TDI (Feb 11, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

wow, that's a nice looking set of pulleys.


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_who wants cogged gears? just got the tools in today for HTD 8mm pitch belts
will have some samples in the morning









Issam, please IM me a price.
On a side note, my serp. pulley has a ford 36-1 ring welded onto it. Will it work on a 9A 16V G60 combo?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_
On a side note, my serp. pulley has a ford 36-1 ring welded onto it. Will it work on a 9A 16V G60 combo?

Not without spacing out the sensor bracket 6mm or so.


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
Not without spacing out the sensor bracket 6mm or so.

OK, so there shouldn't be any interference with the required machining that needs to be done to these when converting to 16V?


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (-AG-)*


_Quote, originally posted by *-AG-* »_Unless I am missing something the problem is not clearing the dizzy or cap, it is just one of the spark plug wires that the throttle body linkage fouls. I tried using the Fiat cap but it rendered the same problem. Right now I have the linkage piece tweaked just enough to clear the spark plug wire. I still have full movement of tb linkage and can not see where it is going to be a problem....yet. If people really are using the Fiat cap, I wonder if they even tried to hook up the stock one first because it is almost the exact same clearance or they had a different brand than me (I used carquest or napa) There has always been a big hoorah over this and I have wondered why, I had to only make a _minor_ adjustment. 


I've always wondered why, oh why do people use a relocation ELBOW. I try to follow the K.I.S.S. principle at all times. Seems to me the simple solution is to relocate the upper half of the mani. Not the throttle body. As I type this I'm waiting for a quote on this from Momentum. I'd like them to machine it in phenolic composite.








They use 1/4" stock but hopefully it is just enough to clear this (my buddy Nate's build):








The only extra parts you would have to buy in this case is longer studs and an extra gasket.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_

I've always wondered why, oh why do people use a relocation ELBOW. I try to follow the K.I.S.S. principle at all times. Seems to me the simple solution is to relocate the upper half of the mani. Not the throttle body. As I type this I'm waiting for a quote on this from Momentum. I'd like them to machine it in phenolic composite.
They use 1/4" stock but hopefully it is just enough to clear this (my buddy Nate's build):








The only extra parts you would have to buy in this case is longer studs and an extra gasket.


you done stole mah pitchah!







the only other problem you run into (conceivably) is the boost return... comes REALLY close-like to the brake master res on a corrado. I almost went with the fiat cap & just tweaked the linakge, but fortunately a friend offered his welding services to make a relocation elbow.
i like your thoughts though, would LOVE to ditch my relocation elbow.. would simplify a bunch of stuff!
-Nate


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (g60_c)*

edit: see pics below


_Modified by still_a_G at 8:06 PM 4-25-2009_


----------



## padmk2 (Feb 16, 2009)

*Re: (s.l.c.)*

i need to know the shipping price to the U.S. chicago il 60804 
for alternador braket end feulrail rvs


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (padmk2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *padmk2* »_i need to know the shipping price to the U.S. chicago il 60804 
for alternador braket end feulrail rvs 









\might help if you actually direct this to someone... BBM doesn't make the rear-alt bracket anymore... there are a few in here that might make you one, but you'll do better to send them an IM directly.
-Nate


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Re: (g60_c)*

Hey, guys, I have a question for you. I am doing my 16v conversion project on a G60 (PG) block (I own a 1990 Corrado G60). I will use a lysholm supercharger and a BBM liquid to air intercooler kit. I have all the parts to begin.
Here's the question: BBM sells a hybrid part called "BBM SC 16v coolant flange", that is "specifically for use with the 16V ltd. and ABA 16V head conversions to clear the BBM Lysholm type screw compressor kits". 
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_...lange
Do I have to get this for my project? If so, which of the two options I have to buy: the front port or the side port? 
Any help is appreciated. 


_Modified by rado4ever at 11:22 PM 4-13-2009_


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (rado4ever)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rado4ever* »_Hey, guys, I have a question for you. I am doing my 16v conversion project on a G60 (PG) block (I own a 1990 Corrado G60). I will use a lysholm supercharger and a BBM liquid to air intercooler kit. I have all the parts to begin.
Here's the question: BBM sells a hybrid part called "BBM SC 16v coolant flange", that is "specifically for use with the 16V ltd. and ABA 16V head conversions to clear the BBM Lysholm type screw compressor kits". 
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_...lange
Do I have to get this for my project? If so, which of the two options I have to buy: the front port or the side port? 
Any help is appreciated. 

_Modified by rado4ever at 11:22 PM 4-13-2009_

90% certain you will need the side-port... you DO need it (or something similar anyway), as the 16V front coolant flange sticks off the head at an approx 45 deg angle, and would protrude directly through the supercharger... the BBM pipe with the side-port will allow your coolant hose(s) to not go through the charger..
also, you will need to create a provision for a crank-case breather (the pg block uses the head-mounted PCV valve, the 16V had a giant box on the front of the block)...
good luck
-Nate


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Re: (g60_c)*

So I have to get one... a bit expensive (US$ 149)...
Thanks for your answer, Nate!


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: (rado4ever)*

Is it possible to use mk4 tdi crank pulley with vr6 waterpump pulley same way its done on 20V-G60 conversions?
thnx! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_Is it possible to use mk4 tdi crank pulley with vr6 waterpump pulley same way its done on 20V-G60 conversions?
thnx! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









Yes but you need a spacer for the crank pulley


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
Yes but you need a spacer for the crank pulley









thanks Issam and do u have such spacer for sale, perhaps?








also, will my v belt crank pulley work with that? i have to run PS off it.
thnx again! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_
thanks Issam and do u have such spacer for sale, perhaps?








also, will my v belt crank pulley work with that? i have to run PS off it.
thnx again! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









I can make up something to work with my pulley but I dont use the TDI pulleys


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*

Thanks Issam http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
so, what's the verdict on the exhaust cam as an intake cam mod on a SC engine? is it something worth looking into?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_Thanks Issam http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
so, what's the verdict on the exhaust cam as an intake cam mod on a SC engine? is it something worth looking into?









One of the oldest tricks in the book...


----------



## deathsled (Jul 6, 2008)

any dyno charts for any of these? i'm seriously considering scrapping my turbo aba 16v build for a lysholm or g60 route


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Re: (deathsled)*

Did anyone tried a head spacer gasket to decrease the CR?
BTW, is there any problem if I use 9.0:1 CR forged pistons with a 16v head and a G60 block? I will use a lysholm supercharger and a liquid to air intercooler kit from BBM.


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (rado4ever)*

A local V dub guy machined up my spacer as momentum motor parts was stalling.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_A local V dub guy machined up my spacer as momentum motor parts was stalling.










hey dude, i'm sorry about not getting you the info on the gasket... work has been... well.. hectic lately... and by the time i leave, the only thing i can remember is that i have to drive home, not enough left to snag a set of calipers...
looks good though!
-Nate


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (g60_c)*

It's cool dude. I just plan on shaving it down till it's just right. Thanks for the props. Unfortunately I won't know how well it will fit in the bay for at least another year. Well, that may change if I can't get a good tune on the ghetto rebuilt 8 valve. Still got 2 of your pistons in there.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_It's cool dude. I just plan on shaving it down till it's just right. Thanks for the props. Unfortunately I won't know how well it will fit in the bay for at least another year. Well, that may change if I can't get a good tune on the ghetto rebuilt 8 valve. Still got 2 of your pistons in there.









omg dude... i'm surprised to say the least








tell you what, take a trip up here some weekend, bring your spacer, we'll plop it onto my engine for test-fitting... should tell you exactly what will/won't work out for you, being that it's the same car, and same engine








-Nate


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_A local V dub guy machined up my spacer as momentum motor parts was stalling.

































That is pretty sick, anybody else thinking wet nitrous setup? That spacer would be perfect to mount the extra fuel and nitrous nozzles....


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
That is pretty sick, anybody else thinking wet nitrous setup? That spacer would be perfect to mount the extra fuel and nitrous nozzles....









I recall seeing a nitrous and G60 charger years ago....1999?2000?


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (kindbudz91G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
That is pretty sick, anybody else thinking wet nitrous setup? That spacer would be perfect to mount the extra fuel and nitrous nozzles....










Good idea. What size tap do you need to install a nozzle? The spacer is machined to .440" but I might have to take it down to .400 if the gaskets end up making it thicker than it needs to be. But if the TB doesn't hit the brake reservoir than it's game on as is.
EDIT: I looked up the thread sizes for common NOS nozzles and they're .313 to .405 thread diameter, sometimes less. So a spacer like this should work OK. 


_Modified by still_a_G at 7:59 PM 6-13-2009_


----------



## Lourado (Aug 30, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

what about converting my g60 8v to a 20v? what needs to be done


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Lourado)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lourado* »_what about converting my g60 8v to a 20v? what needs to be done

You use the search button I believe.


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Lourado)*

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1674618


----------



## Lourado (Aug 30, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (still_a_G)*

my bad noob here thanks


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

would a 16v 276 cam setup be overkill for this swap? 
I know the smaller pulley I run the faster it would die up top...


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_would a 16v 276 cam setup be overkill for this swap? 
I know the smaller pulley I run the faster it would die up top...


Whats the power range for the 276? TT cam?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

For what it is worth: I just redid the alternator brackets on my 16VM90 car... 
using the "stock" G60 charger/AC bracket: If you use a mk3 alt & pulley, a 3/8" plate will provide the correct (or really darn close) offset to space the alt off the AC mounting tabs (you will still need to trim the tabs a little bit to fit everything). I will try to put some photos of what i have done when i dig into it again.
-Nate


----------



## meanvw (Jan 1, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (g60_c)*

If anyone is looking to do this to a scirocco or other MK1, a bunch of info in this thread of mine for you:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4157368
Another 16V G60 lives!








Huge thanks to Dan and John at BahnBrenner!
Thanks to INA for awesome pulleys!
Thanks to you other Vortexers who posted in this thread, those that helped me with parts and advice!
Put this bugger together over the last winter. Just had her out today for the first time on a longer trip... and very excited!
Future plans.... Sleeping


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
Whats the power range for the 276? TT cam?


Techtonics Hydraulic 16V 276°. Soft low end power, good mid-range and great top end power. Works best with carburetors. Chilled hardened billets with timing gears installed. #109.083 HD Valve Springs Recommended. (235° duration @.050", .443" lift, 111° lobe center)










_Modified by LO-vw at 9:57 AM 5-31-2009_


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_
<img title="This image has been resized. Original size: 1017x446" style="border: 1px solid 
They use 1/4" stock but hopefully it is just enough to clear this (my buddy Nate's build):








The only extra parts you would have to buy in this case is longer studs and an extra gasket.


so is this with or without the spacer? and I cant tell is it hitting the dizzy or not?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_
so is this with or without the spacer? and I cant tell is it hitting the dizzy or not?

that is without any sort of spacer.. i'm not sure if i had even a gasket in there between the manifold halfs... and yes.. it does hit. the boost return linkage rubs pretty hard. The big complication is that if you slide *back* too much.. you run right into the brake res on a corrado (not sure on other cars... because i own a corrado). That distrib cap is from a fiat x-9... i ended up not using it cause i didn't feel like making completely custom plug wires up. also, clearance will depend on where the distrib is clocked to for timing (clearance on any "humps" that are on the side)
-Nate


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (g60_c)*

I'll be driving up to Nate as soon as my Rado is reliable enough to make the trip, sometime this month hopefully! We'll do a quick test fit with the spacer to see if it fits in the bay.
This is the clearance with the spacer








Working as fast as my schedule allows...










_Modified by still_a_G at 6:32 AM 6-2-2009_


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (still_a_G)*

that your rado?








Looks schweet.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_I'll be driving up to Nate as soon as my Rado is reliable enough to make the trip, sometime this month hopefully! We'll do a quick test fit with the spacer to see if it fits in the bay.


nice man!!!
for what it's worth... i *will* be in portland (hopefully) June 14th @ the maine-mall for an auto-x... the corrado will be there... in all it's 16vm90 glory (hopefully my new 2.7" pulley will be in too!!!!!!) you should come out & meet up! how far from there is your corrado these days? we could always (potentially) meet up & test fit/etc... i might make a weekend of it as well, not sure yet.
-Nate


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (g60_c)*

Thanks guys. The garage is a little far from Portland, about 40 minutes. But I'll definitely meet up with you at the auto-x. Not sure the car will be with me though. We shall see.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_Thanks guys. The garage is a little far from Portland, about 40 minutes. But I'll definitely meet up with you at the auto-x. Not sure the car will be with me though. We shall see.









nice! it'll be good to see you again!
-Nate


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (g60_c)*

Hi guys! I just started my 16v G60 project. I'm using the 1.8L PG block as the base with a PL 16v head.
What size is the appropiate for the serpentine belt? Will the G60 serp. belt work or do I have to get another one? If so, what specs (width, length)?
Sorry for the noob question, but must be sure










_Modified by rado4ever at 9:52 AM 6-8-2009_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (rado4ever)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rado4ever* »_Hi guys! I just started my 16v G60 project. I'm using the 1.8L PG block as the base with a PL 16v head.
What size is the appropiate for the serpentine belt? Will the G60 serp. belt work or do I have to get another one? If so, what specs (width, length)?

What accessories are you keeping?
Power steering and AC?


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

I will keep it the power steering but no A/C.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (rado4ever)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rado4ever* »_I will keep it the power steering but no A/C. 

Ok use the power steering on the v-belt and keep the water pump crank ,alternator & G60 on the serpentine belt.
I am not sure which length you need but if you can wrap string around the set up and take that length to Napa I am sure they can give you the belt in the right length.


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

Ok, Issam, I'll do that. Thanks!


----------



## dirtytorque (Feb 5, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (rado4ever)*

with power steering and no ac i am using the standard belt.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_I'll be driving up to Nate as soon as my Rado is reliable enough to make the trip, sometime this month hopefully! We'll do a quick test fit with the spacer to see if it fits in the bay.
This is the clearance with the spacer








Working as fast as my schedule allows...











I was thinking about making a spacer as well. how are you bracing the back of the manifold? worried with the extra lever arm and no support that the top half could break ? if leaned on or something.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_
I was thinking about making a spacer as well. how are you bracing the back of the manifold? worried with the extra lever arm and no support that the top half could break ? if leaned on or something.


break out the welder... and make new supports for the back of the manifold? the stock ones are just steel anyway... i think i made mine out of some 1/2" x 1/8" flat-bar.. 
-Nate


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

wish i had a welder. 
Im going to make some but idk if anyone was or thought it was necessary.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_wish i had a welder. 
Im going to make some but idk if anyone was or thought it was necessary. 

it may not be *necessary*.. but it's a darn good idea..
if you're good, you can use flat-bar, and drill & bend it to fit... make a cardboard template, then go to town.
-Nate


----------



## builtforsin (Nov 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_wish i had a welder. 
Im going to make some but idk if anyone was or thought it was necessary. 

I know a guy with access to a welder.... His names Josh and he's always at your house anyway...

















Let me know if you want me to bring it


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *g60_c* »_
it may not be *necessary*.. but it's a darn good idea..
if you're good, you can use flat-bar, and drill & bend it to fit... make a cardboard template, then go to town.
-Nate


Ya that was my plan just need to find aluminum around my new apt here... 

_Quote, originally posted by *builtforsin* »_
I know a guy with access to a welder.... His names Josh and he's always at your house anyway...

















Let me know if you want me to bring it


oh wow totally forgot you just got one!


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

Tim/ SilverSLC
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...42143
Has volunteered as a moderator to help clean up the threads http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

So what are the options for mounting an alternator under the charger. 
-That one guy is selling a kit for 300 120 amp
-aba alt? Mine seems to need heavy modification to one of the tabs under the charger to fit.
-Suzuki samari? anyone have any pictures of this? 
-70 amp polo alternator. I need something more powerful then this.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_So what are the options for mounting an alternator under the charger. 
-That one guy is selling a kit for 300 120 amp
-aba alt? Mine seems to need heavy modification to one of the tabs under the charger to fit.
-Suzuki samari? anyone have any pictures of this? 
-70 amp polo alternator. I need something more powerful then this. 


You can always get my kit?


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_So what are the options for mounting an alternator under the charger. 
-That one guy is selling a kit for 300 120 amp
-aba alt? Mine seems to need heavy modification to one of the tabs under the charger to fit.
-Suzuki samari? anyone have any pictures of this? 
-70 amp polo alternator. I need something more powerful then this. 


I think this one might be an option. And I only say that because someone in the classifieds was selling one and claimed that they had it mounted underneath.
http://www.bernardembden.com/xjs/altmove/index.htm


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
You can always get my kit?


What kit is that?

_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_
I think this one might be an option. And I only say that because someone in the classifieds was selling one and claimed that they had it mounted underneath.
http://www.bernardembden.com/xjs/altmove/index.htm


Ya ive been digging around for alternators and it seems like that one is a gm upgrade alt for the samurai. The Samurai one is only 55 amp so most people upgrade to that gm one and it fits and you have the option for 105 amp and even higher. 
I emailed a guy selling them on ebay and he says the mounting pad is 2" long, so then I measured my g60 bracket and it looks like you would have to push out that metal bushing and also grind about 1/4" off the alternator to get it to drop right in. 
Here you can see the mounting pad on the bottom 








And here is the measurement for the bracket 








from the kit the guy sells here on the vortex you need your g60 alt pulley to make it work. 
Actually his looks slightly different "CS130 Delco alternator"










_Modified by LO-vw at 11:35 AM 7-3-2009_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_
What kit is that?

The kit I did for Rue.


----------



## Dennis-G60 (Feb 11, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
The kit I did for Rue.









That's on hell of a good looking G-charger bracket.


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

I am a fan of the TB spacer option, maybe I skimmed a bit too lightly, but is everyone sure that the TB will clear the hood (MK2 or 'rado)?
Thanks!
Ron


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_I am a fan of the TB spacer option, maybe I skimmed a bit too lightly, but is everyone sure that the TB will clear the hood (MK2 or 'rado)?
Thanks!
Ron

That spacer is .440". I measured a .190" height increase. Using trig., I estimated the rearward shift:


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_
That spacer is .440". I measured a .190" height increase. Using trig., I estimated the rearward shift:


You sir, are awesome! Thanks again for the info!


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_
You sir, are awesome! Thanks again for the info!

Open source engine builds is where it's at my man. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

I just finished reading this entire thread...lets see four nights and one afternoon is all it took to really absorb just about all this info. Really really good stuff. And hopefully all you "pros" are still watching it. I just started my build with a 9a and two G60's and want to know if anyone is selling any integration kits, or parts of integration kits??? BBM/RPM/etc. or custom hardware?
Issam I didn't quite understand, is your alt kit only for down low AC delete?? 
Thanks guys.... Bump this thread!!!

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Got my spacer yesterday
















Still undecided if I really need to run this...
Im half tempted to run a early 1.8l 16v tb housing and run a 1.8t DV hidden somewhere. 
anyone run a bov or a DV?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_Got my spacer yesterday


uh oh!


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

hey guys...on my 16v g60 motor...to run a boost gauge - I'm supposed to tap into the vacuum line that goes from FPR to intake manifold correct? Can someone post some pics of this? Specifically where on the intake manifold the vacuum line connects?


----------



## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_hey guys...on my 16v g60 motor...to run a boost gauge - I'm supposed to tap into the vacuum line that goes from FPR to intake manifold correct? Can someone post some pics of this? Specifically where on the intake manifold the vacuum line connects?

I've always used a t fitting to tie into the vacuum line that does NOT go to the ECU. Just attach the "T" to the throttle body about two inches from nipple on the throttle body that is closest to the hose clamp side. Just cut two inches off that vacuum line and put it right there....


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (kainoasun)*

so one end goes onto the TB and the other end goes where?


----------



## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (dpgreek)*

Well, I still have my charcoal evac system in place.. and that vacuum line goes directly to the top of plastic valve for the charcoal cannister. Your's is probably long gone from what I recall.?? I just don't think you would want anything tied into your FPR line, so tapping the TB is the best place that I have found...
You can also use any vacuum line coming directly or indirectly off of the intake manifold.
I have no way to check this right now but I believe the difference between the two locations (TB or intake manifold) is that the nipple on the TB I'm referring to is tied to the intake. So that side will see what the charger is boosting from idle to red line. Any other spot after the TB will see the movement from vacuum to boost as the TB opens and closes. The TB nipple I'm referring to never sees vacuum... 
Once again I cannot check this right now.. but that what I recall. 

_Modified by kainoasun at 3:03 PM 7-12-2009_


_Modified by kainoasun at 3:22 PM 7-12-2009_


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (kainoasun)*

yes...my charcoal cannister is gone. I believe one goes from ecu to tb. I guess the other one you're referring to is the other spot - which is probably where I need to tap I guess


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_Got my spacer yesterday
















Still undecided if I really need to run this...
Im half tempted to run a early 1.8l 16v tb housing and run a 1.8t DV hidden somewhere. 
anyone run a bov or a DV?

Already pre-drilled for nitrous, good work.


----------



## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_yes...my charcoal cannister is gone. I believe one goes from ecu to tb. I guess the other one you're referring to is the other spot - which is probably where I need to tap I guess

Right. And it really doesn't matter where you tap.. but you definitely do not want to tap the ECU line. And you don't need to tap the FPR when you have other options. 
The nipple on the TB that is closest to the hose clamp is the one I used as I have a boost gauge that does not read vacuum. So it made sense to put it there. But if you have a vacuum/boost gauge then anywhere after the TB on the intake manifold works. You can also T into the brake booster hookup using a stock 16v scirocco brake booster hose thing cuz it has a couple 1/8 nipples on it.


----------



## El Groso (May 29, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (kainoasun)*

Please guys, help with a quick question..
I have a PG block and I´d like to put a KR 1.8 16V head (wich I already have).. that will work right?
Do I need to change the crank gear and mod the int. shaft?
Thanks!


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (El Groso)*


_Quote, originally posted by *El Groso* »_Please guys, help with a quick question..
I have a PG block and I´d like to put a KR 1.8 16V head (wich I already have).. that will work right?
Do I need to change the crank gear and mod the int. shaft?
Thanks!









WHat are you going to use for pistons?
You will still need to change the IM shaft gear unless you want to move the distributor to the cylinder head.


----------



## El Groso (May 29, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

I dont have the pistons yet, and yes I was planing on using the distributor on the head.. I think that would be easier, I think I just have to change the ring that sends the signal to the coil, right?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (El Groso)*


_Quote, originally posted by *El Groso* »_I dont have the pistons yet, and yes I was planing on using the distributor on the head.. I think that would be easier, I think I just have to change the ring that sends the signal to the coil, right? 

That is correct but again it depends on what ECM you are using and such.


----------



## 2925 (Dec 11, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

I got a bit lost with all the info in this thread, anyone one of you guys can just throw out a check list of the things I will need in order to put a 16v (9a or other) head on my PG block, with a lysholm. This way I can start to order up everything I'll need.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (2925)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2925* »_I got a bit lost with all the info in this thread, anyone one of you guys can just throw out a check list of the things I will need in order to put a 16v (9a or other) head on my PG block, with a lysholm. This way I can start to order up everything I'll need.

You know if this was 2004 I probably would have gone along with it but this is 2009...why 9A or PG block?
Availability?


----------



## 2925 (Dec 11, 2007)

I'm looking to retain the PG block just for the sake of saving myself some hassle, I don't have the equipment or the space for an entire engine swap. I figure the head will be enough for the first step, and later down the road I can get a 2.0L block in there.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (2925)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2925* »_I'm looking to retain the PG block just for the sake of saving myself some hassle, I don't have the equipment or the space for an entire engine swap. I figure the head will be enough for the first step, and later down the road I can get a 2.0L block in there.

* head
* pistons and rods
* IM shaft and timing belt gears.


----------



## 2925 (Dec 11, 2007)

well, I have a head lined up for around 80 bucks. From what I read, pistons must be custom from bbm or something, and the IM shaft and TB gears can be had from a 16v block?


----------



## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

*Re: (2925)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2925* »_I'm looking to retain the PG block just for the sake of saving myself some hassle, I don't have the equipment or the space for an entire engine swap. I figure the head will be enough for the first step, and later down the road I can get a 2.0L block in there.

I'm just a visitor to this thread but it seems like you might be in over your head. If you slap a 16V head on an 8V short block you're going to have a couple of problems. First, 16v pistons have valve reliefs cut into them so you're in danger of having the valves hit the pistons. Second, you're going to have VERY LOW compression ratio. Search JE Pistons and compare 8V and 16V pistons. They don't make a piston for your application but when you compare negative domes(dishes) between 8V and 16V it seems you're going to have a 5.0-6.0 compression ratio. Custom pistons are going to cost a load and rebuilding your 1.8 is going to take just as much room as building a 2.0 16V. Low(8.5-9.0) compression pistons are available for 16V as a stock item. Pricey but not as much so as what you'll be looking for.




_Modified by suburbangeorge at 9:38 PM 8-1-2009_


----------



## 2925 (Dec 11, 2007)

What I figured.
I guess I'll figure out a way to build a 2.0 16v with the space I have.


----------



## smockrw (Dec 11, 2001)

So for those that have a 16VG60 conversion with a MK1, using the BBM back mount for the Alternator, omission of the mk2 motor mount support is obvious but is it ok to put the mk1 motor mount over the alternator bracket on the rear? I've done this to test fit but have found that it leaves about 1/4 inch of gap on the motor mount,.
crazy? my mk1 is a cabriolet


----------



## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: (2925)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2925* »_I'm looking to retain the PG block just for the sake of saving myself some hassle, I don't have the equipment or the space for an entire engine swap. I figure the head will be enough for the first step, and later down the road I can get a 2.0L block in there.


I just learned that VW Motorsport used a 16v block to build their 16v G60 limited. Their decision had to do with the block breathing properly and I believe the comp ratio was 8.8 to 1. 
On the Corrado-net forum, on a forum called "The Forced Induction 16V Thread" many people are claiming a that a stock 16v is incredibly strong and that a stone stock 16v w/about 9.0 compression will handle over 300 hp! And that included using head gasket spacers????? Anyone else agree or dis-agree?
P.S. I'm building a 9a and am trying to convince my S.O. to keep it on the stand in our living room...cuz I have no space to work. 


_Modified by kainoasun at 2:04 PM 8-2-2009_










_Modified by kainoasun at 2:05 PM 8-2-2009_


----------



## smockrw (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: (kainoasun)*

good luck on the stand, my SO has problems with the VW parts collection that was her garage.... I would love to see the answers on this, also, I know BBM sells a thicker head gasket and some have double stacked abf gaskets; but I have seen cut spacers but can't seem to find out where or if they take a gasket per surface??


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

I'm going to be running a head spacer, its basically the top layer of an aba gasket, stainless steel metal spacer, then the bottom layer of the gasket. 
Only reason Im using a 9a bottom end is because I found one cheap that was just rebuilt and I was originally going N.A and then decided to go F.I


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (kainoasun)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kainoasun* »_Their decision had to do with the block breathing properly and I believe the comp ratio was 8.8 to 1. 
Or that it was easier to just slap a G60 onto a 16V motor








There are physically no differences in the structure between the common 220mm deck height 16V and 8V motors other than additional mounting points and the oil filter flange/crankcase breather flange.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...lated


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

Does anyone know where i can get the brackts i need for a 16 g60 project i wanna build? or anyone know of 16v g60 motor someone selling? VERY INTRESTED http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (jeffs vw)*

ironically, there is a guy local to me who has a very similar screen name to you








jeffr_vw iirc. He has a couple of posts in the Corrado classifieds and is parting out his entire ABA 16v G60 project corrado. I orig build the bottom end when it was going to be an 8v.
Good guy, hit him up on IM
S


----------



## TheFog (Mar 17, 2005)

where is it most convenient to take the oil pressure from, and where to take the oil return?


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: (TheFog)*

Guess he sold them.







i know there someone out there with all the brackets i need to do this g60 16v conversion. i need to buy this.


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

I am nearing completion of my 16vG60 build and have one fairly simple question:
Does anyone have an educated guess as to how many people have running 16vG60's past or present? I know there were only 70 (ish?) Golf Limiteds produced, but would like to know how many people have done it just for sheer bragging rights! Perhaps even if someone knows how many of the kits BBM sold?
Thanks!
Ron


----------



## TheFog (Mar 17, 2005)

*Re: (TheFog)*

ok, so in the meanwhile I solved the oil returned just like as it is on the G60 engine. 
still, I would like to hear an advice or two for taking the oil pressure to the charger - from the oil filter housing (oil pressure sensor) or from the oil pressure (??? or is it temp.) sensor from the engine head?
tnx http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

What I plan on doing and what most people do is pull it off the head. 
From what I have read the filter housing is high pressure. 
For the return there is a port on the block that all you have to do is drill a hole through the block and you your done. its already tapped and ready for the oil line.


----------



## TheFog (Mar 17, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

yes, that's just how I've done the return - it's done that way factory on the G60 block
















which sensor is it on the head, the one on the exhaust side?


----------



## smockrw (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (TheFog)*

the sensor on the head on the exhaust side? I can think of two, the O2 (which you would know) and the the afterrun temp sensor for cooling engine bay after the motor has been shut off. ???


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *smockrw* »_the sensor on the head on the exhaust side? I can think of two, the O2 (which you would know) and the the afterrun temp sensor for cooling engine bay after the motor has been shut off. ???









None of those are oil sensors
The oil sensor is on the back of the head on the right (if engine is in car and your looking at it from the front)


----------



## smockrw (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

read this wrong, I've been staring at digifant too long, thanks!


----------



## smockrw (Dec 11, 2001)

I've been having a side discussion regarding drilling block over using the breather cover plate or the pan; though it looks like in your case your being very careful, wouldn't be safer from a debris perspective to drill/tap a part that is removable?


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (TheFog)*

I just found out that i dont need brackets to do this conversion just need the g60 brackets for the charger and a mk3 alternator since i wont be running AC. is that true that its a complete bolt on then? or am i way wrong?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *smockrw* »_I've been having a side discussion regarding drilling block over using the breather cover plate or the pan; though it looks like in your case your being very careful, wouldn't be safer from a debris perspective to drill/tap a part that is removable? 


Ive been wondering about installing it in the breather. 
I dont feel like forking up the 60 bux it is for a new block off plate right now so im going to use the stock plastic breather.
I wonder if you could use one of those vr6 coolant freeze plugs in the breather freeze plug area to save from drilling/taping. 
That one guy drilled and re-tapped the hole on the block you don't even have to do that you can just drill it if you want. its already tapped. 
Doing the pan isnt a bad idea either but its extra work. as long as you do it in the right spot


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*








will this work?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

will what work?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (jeffs vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jeffs vw* »_I just found out that i dont need brackets to do this conversion just need the g60 brackets for the charger and a mk3 alternator since i wont be running AC. is that true that its a complete bolt on then? or am i way wrong?









Where are you going to put the alternator because it wont bolt direct to a G60 bracket.
As for the drilling and tapping, it is much better to drill and tap the crankcase or oil pan below the charger.Not sure doing that with the crankcase block off plate will be acceptable.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

What would be so bad with using the block hole as a drain?


----------



## smockrw (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

The drain hole in the block for the G60/PG motor is in line with the breather and they dump oil essentially in the same location, this assumes (bad I know) that you have already figured out another way to let the crankcase breath or this is an additional hole in the plate. I have seen what you have made so I am sure there is some reason you would recommend not but I have seen it done multiple times successfully. My logic on this is that its much simpler to control metal shavings on removable parts, and if by some strange quirk you make a mistake its not on your block. It certainly looks better when its tapped into the block though, looks stock


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (smockrw)*

What i was asking if it will work is the g60 brackets bolting on to a 16v and running a mk3 alternator under charger. do you know if i still will need to do some fabrication?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

im not using any kits and doing everything myself. 
You can use a mk3 alt but it takes a lot of grinding to the g60 bracket. 
Yes the g60 brackets will bolt to a 16v 9a


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

i thought it would work with any 16v motor? the g60 brackets?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

well you could do it on a 1.8l but why


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

would i need a 2.0 bottom end? or will a 1.8 be fine?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

its up 2 you but you can get 2.0 blocks real cheap either 9a or aba so why not get one of those...


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

would a 2liter bottom end with a 1.8 head be the best way to go? reason i ask is cause im getting a whole 16v motor running a 1.8 and a friend of mine is giving me a 2.0 litre bottom end for free. this is my first time doing this conversion..... i feel brainless here







Just want to do this as easy as possible. thanks for answering all my questions http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Have you read the first 2 pages yet?
I read this forum like 4 times trying to figure stuff out before I started asking. 
Its all in here...


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


----------



## Jans (Aug 7, 2009)

I am new in this Forum, and iI am sorry if i posted my question in the wrong theme.
I need a little help.
I use:
PG engine block
9a engine 16v top 
PG engine stock pistons and rods
Evo 8 (TD05HR turbo)
etc
Is true that the compression ratio is 6.2:1?
Setup is a suspicion that the compression ratio is too low.
What happens change PG standard pistons and rods to S2 stock pistons and rods? Is it possible?
I have read that it is possible to do so. But is this true info?
How big is the Compression Ratio when i use in the 16v PG engine (+16V 9a top) stock S2 pistons and rods?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

wrong forum read first page....


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Jans (Aug 7, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (jeffs vw)*

what is the right forum?
Help me please


----------



## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

*Re: (Jans)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jans* »_I am new in this Forum, and iI am sorry if i posted my question in the wrong theme.
I need a little help.
I use:
PG engine block
9a engine 16v top 
PG engine stock pistons and rods
Evo 8 (TD05HR turbo)
etc
Is true that the compression ratio is 6.2:1?
Setup is a suspicion that the compression ratio is too low.
What happens change PG standard pistons and rods to S2 stock pistons and rods? Is it possible?
I have read that it is possible to do so. But is this true info?
How big is the Compression Ratio when i use in the 16v PG engine (+16V 9a top) stock S2 pistons and rods?


This is not the wrong forum. What he should have said was that your question has already been answered on the first page of the thread. 
Partial quote:
"Quote, originally posted by John Doe » 
I have a PG G60 8V,How do I convert it to a 16V G60? 
Quote, originally posted by Not2Fast » 
Taken from this site:
PG - 1.8 8V G60 : 
Compression Ratio = 8:1
Rod Length = 136mm
Wrist Pin Diamater = 22mm
Bore = 81mm
9A - 2.0 16V : 
Compression Ratio = 10.8:1
Rod Length = 144mm
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm
Bore = 82.5mm
PL - 1.8 16V : 
Compression Ratio = 10:1
Rod Length = 144mm
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm
Bore = 81mm


According to the information posted above your going to have to get a set of custom pistons.Bahn Brenner sells a set of custom pistons for $699.95US

Or you can contact Rodney Huss for your custom application.
The reason you will need a custom set of Pistons is because placing a 16V head on an 8V Block lowers the CR approx 1.8 Points.Since the G60 engine is allready @ a CR of 8:1 then dropping that CR 1.8:1 points lower will bring it to about 6.2:1,definitely too low for a 16V G60.
Now for the Conrods you can use your stock PG G60 rods but it is recommended that you use PL 16V Rods + Custom Pistons due to the fact that your rod ratio using the PG rods will be too short."
He should have also taken note of the fact that English may not be your first language and answered more kindly. As someone who speaks little to no German but tries to buy off of German ebay, I know how hard it is to use a translation service and phrase your message so that it makes sense. Good luck.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *suburbangeorge* »_
This is not the wrong forum. What he should have said was that your question has already been answered on the first page of the thread.


Sorry Guess When he said Evo 8 *turbo* I should of known it was a code name for a G60.


----------



## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_
Sorry Guess When he said Evo 8 *turbo* I should of known it was a code name for a G60.


You're right he did say TURBO and this is the 16V G60 thread. That being said, I really thought his was a question about compression ratios and his question would be just as relevant regardless of his source of bost. As it turns out his answer was right there on page #1 so he's happy and you can have your thread back.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Regardless of who is right or wrong, 2 posts above his I JUST said read the first 2 pages. 
This guy obviously saw the title, 16v g60, thought oh i have a 16v head and a g60 bottom end :click: oh ill just ask my question its over 40 pages long and dont feel like reading :clicks reply: :types question:
No one helped me, when I came in asking information... I did my research and figured it out... 
Sorry for trying not to clutter this thread up even more. 
Just trying to help. :\


----------



## Jans (Aug 7, 2009)

Really, i saw the title and thought that this is the right place.
Anybody can refer to the right place, where can I get information about the S2 pistons and rods in the PG engine block? (how big is the compression ratio?)

Sorry, that i dont know the language so well.


....however, the car needs a building


_Modified by Jans at 11:40 PM 8-7-2009_


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: (Jans)*

i didnt see on the first two pages what head people were useing? i just picked up a 2.0 bottom end today from a passat. and also picked up a 1.8 head is that good or should i have got the 2litre head? thanks


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: (jeffs vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jeffs vw* »_i didnt see on the first two pages what head people were useing? i just picked up a 2.0 bottom end today from a passat. and also picked up a 1.8 head is that good or should i have got the 2litre head? thanks

Honestly, stop using this thread as a sounding board for your confusion.


----------



## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

*Re: (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_
Honestly, stop using this thread as a sounding board for your confusion.

The only person who has the right to make that request(demand?) is Issam Abed, who started the thread.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

Hey guys,
I want this thread to be the most helpful thread in the G60 forum.If you do not like a post/user simply report it.Makes reading so much easier....
Trust me after almost 5 years of this thread,it has been extremely difficult to service it.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_Hey guys,
I want this thread to be the most helpful thread in the G60 forum.If you do not like a post/user simply report it.Makes reading so much easier....
Trust me after almost 5 years of this thread,it has been extremely difficult to service it.


and those of us that have obtained info from it (pick me.. pick me!) thank you very much for maintaining it!
-Nate


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (g60_c)*

can someone show me via pics or diagram how I would hook up the ISV onto the 16V g60? brackets? where does the outlet go? inlet? I got the BBM elbow coming off the driver's side of the intake manifold and that's where the TB sits. page 35 owned...


_Modified by dpgreek at 3:30 PM 8-18-2009_


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

Looking to find out what hose / pipe do I use to go from the thermostat over to the rado Radiator. I know the g60 had that metal coolant pipe...but I don't know where it fits or if it does at all.


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*

you really need to use that pipe, because it has a sandwich section that squeezes between the oil pan, motor mount etc. It has about a 3" straight piece of hose that connects to the Thermo housing and then has a 90 elbow to connect the other end to the rad.
S


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (sdezego)*

here's what's weird....my tstat housing is coming out at a small angle...is that normal?


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_here's what's weird....my tstat housing is coming out at a small angle...is that normal?

Hmm, It should come out str8 because it needs to clear the AL P-Steering cradle brkt. Are you using the plastic G60 elbow?



_Modified by sdezego at 8:59 AM 9-3-2009_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_here's what's weird....my tstat housing is coming out at a small angle...is that normal?

You have a vw fox tsat housing?


----------



## ridinsteelies (Feb 9, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

does anyone know of 16vg60 threads that are how to's but a turbo set up instead the charger setup?








greatly appreciated if someone can point me in that direction http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (ridinsteelies)*

It maybe a fox tstat cover Issam....I swapped it out for the g60 one....and the g60 one runs parallel to the other lines on the water pump now. My big problem is the water pipe somehow will not fit/bolt up to the front motor mount housing. I think it's supposed to go there....but no matter how I angle it to fit....the water pipe doesn't line up with the tstat cover. What am I doing wrong?


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*

The WaterPipe will only work with the G60 Tstat cover (parallel with the other lines)


----------



## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (sdezego)*

what type of power can you expect to see from a 16v g60 with the stock g charger and boost?


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (92VW)*

Ok I have read so much of this thread that my eyes are brning. I am currently in the mddle of building my 16vG60. I just got my head back, rebuilt and ready. Pistons are needed. At the first part of this thread I read 8:1 ratio. I can find the following:
J.E 9:1
Wiseco 9:1
Bahn brenner 8:1
There are plenty more but would it hurt running a 9:1 CR?
Brent


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

I have a question concerning types of pistons
Wiseco sells a 9:1 CR piston in the following
Bore MM / Inch Over Sizes Stroke Rod Length . Ratio Pin Diameter 
83.00 / 8.268 .020 5.669 .787
84.00 / 3.307 .040 144 20mm 
J.E sells somthing similiar
Bahn Brenner sells a 8:1
Can I use a 9:1 ratio piston or do I need the keep the CR down?
Which one of the Wiseco is the better choose?
I do not plan boosting over 10 - 12 psi
Please help


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (pickardaudi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pickardaudi* »_I have a question concerning types of pistons
Wiseco sells a 9:1 CR piston in the following
Bore MM / Inch Over Sizes Stroke Rod Length . Ratio Pin Diameter 
83.00 / 8.268 .020 5.669 .787
84.00 / 3.307 .040 144 20mm 
J.E sells somthing similiar
Bahn Brenner sells a 8:1
Can I use a 9:1 ratio piston or do I need the keep the CR down?
Which one of the Wiseco is the better choose?
I do not plan boosting over 10 - 12 psi
Please help

I would go with JE's just because they are a better company to deal with (better company not piston).


----------



## TheFog (Mar 17, 2005)

any recommendations which cams are "best" to use? I'm building a 1.8L (KR) G60 and I'm not planning some enormous horsepower, so perhaps a combination of some OEM VW cams (ABF, 9A, KR???)
As I understand, for standard G60 (8v) asymmetric setup is best to go for.


----------



## smockrw (Dec 11, 2001)

Ok, a little off topic for some but on this setup, has anyone used 'non-standard' radiators? I am in a space crunch and in desperate need of a radiator inlet that is not directly in front of the charger, and an outlet that is somewhat in the normal position for a 16V (directly in front of the thermostat). Doing a air/water rig using the AC condenser so real estate up there is tight in my Cabriolet.


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

If you use a 1.8 16v head with an ABA bottom what timing belt do you use? Do you use a stock size 16v timing belt or do have to get somthing different because of the block height?


----------



## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

*Re: (pickardaudi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pickardaudi* »_If you use a 1.8 16v head with an ABA bottom what timing belt do you use? Do you use a stock size 16v timing belt or do have to get somthing different because of the block height?

i used a 1.8t 150 tooth belt, although i dont think that is the "correct" belt, but it worked for me. i think you would want to source a abf belt
ok, now ive got a question. i have an aba block with a 1.8 head and a knife edged tdi crank. would it be better to lose the extra stroke and run a standard aba crank? TIA


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (ryanarchy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ryanarchy* »_i used a 1.8t 150 tooth belt, although i dont think that is the "correct" belt, but it worked for me. i think you would want to source a abf belt

Dont need to source the ABF belt if the 150T belt works fine. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

_Quote, originally posted by *ryanarchy* »_
ok, now ive got a question. i have an aba block with a 1.8 head and a knife edged tdi crank. would it be better to lose the extra stroke and run a standard aba crank? TIA

Why do you want to go back to the 92.8mm stroke? Anything wrong with the 95.5 crank?


----------



## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_

Why do you want to go back to the 92.8mm stroke? Anything wrong with the 95.5 crank?


nothings wrong with the 95.5 crank. i just noticed most forced induction motors have a shorter stroke. but if you say it will work good ill take your guru word for it. Issam, do you have any pulley solutions for the power steering pump and water pump and crank? have you ever run a aba head with a g-lader? will it even fit?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (ryanarchy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ryanarchy* »_
nothings wrong with the 95.5 crank. i just noticed most forced induction motors have a shorter stroke.

No, people just prefer spending the money on pistons and a crankshaft elsewhere.
If you look at the Honda/Mitsubishi crowd, those guys try to stuff the biggest stroke crankshaft into there blocks.

_Quote, originally posted by *ryanarchy* »_do you have any pulley solutions for the power steering pump and water pump and crank? have you ever run a aba head with a g-lader? will it even fit?

I have pulley solutions for any VW-827 block.
No I have never run an ABA head with a G-LADER but I did mock it up for a customer a few days ago.To everyone that has never seen a PG motor with an ABA cylinder head and AZG intake manifold on it here you go:
































and 1 more for the road...


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*

Hello,
works this suppercharger on a 1,8, or 2,0l 16v engine??? its the kenne bell avalaible in 2,1l-2,8l or 2,8h size!!!! 










_Modified by BI-G60 at 10:57 AM 9-13-2009_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (BI-G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BI-G60* »_Hello,
works this suppercharger on a 1,8, or 2,0l 16v engine??? its the kenne bell avalaible in 2,1l-2,8l or 2,8h size!

Once you make brackets for it sure.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: (smockrw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *smockrw* »_Ok, a little off topic for some but on this setup, has anyone used 'non-standard' radiators? I am in a space crunch and in desperate need of a radiator inlet that is not directly in front of the charger, and an outlet that is somewhat in the normal position for a 16V (directly in front of the thermostat). Doing a air/water rig using the AC condenser so real estate up there is tight in my Cabriolet.

yeah... use a radiator from a passat syncro. it's huge and will definitely work for you. it might be a bit spendy though.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

To everyone that has been emailing me and phoning me about this thread. PLEASE take the time to read it.I have no problems helping any of you out but it is time consuming for me to be repeating myself when I know the information is here in this thread.
I will be updating the 1st post shortly with images of the 16V G60 parts people wanted and from there hopefully everyone can enjoy there build.
Again,PLEASE read the thread,if you have any questions ASK THEM in this thread.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

I read through and am dying to know where and how to bolt up my damn ISV with the BBM elbow on there and the 9A lower intake manifold. I can't seem to find a good location and have all my stuff fit in there. Unfortunately my FPR on the drivers side of the motor, so that complicates things. Any advice anyone?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_I read through and am dying to know where and how to bolt up my damn ISV with the BBM elbow on there and the 9A lower intake manifold. I can't seem to find a good location and have all my stuff fit in there. Unfortunately my FPR on the drivers side of the motor, so that complicates things. Any advice anyone?

Put it so that the inlet and outlet go across the throttle plate
Tap manifold
Tap post throttle body
join hoses to ISV


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

tap the upper intake or lower intake manifold. I have the rubber ring that fits around the ISV and the g60 AND MK2 version of the little bracket the ring sits on. It's just a tight fit


----------



## ogles (Sep 21, 2009)

Hi there, just finished reading the whole thing 236 pages (ish) if you print it off! ha ha!
Lots of very useful info the links to look at!
But I still have a couple of UN answered questions, if anyone can help?
Regardless of money, what is the best combination of block/ head? To get the most power/torque/free revving engine? 
I have a g60 corrado, with low mileage. Looking at 16v it? Wanted to do it for years and now the time has come! Would it be best to change the block to 2.0? I want to buy forged piston and con rods whichever wrought I take but don’t want to start/finish the conversion using the original pg block and someone to say you should have used the 2.0, you would of gained an extra 20bhp or on the other hand use the 2.0 and someone say that I only gained 2bhp and the 1.8 would of be more free revving and the better option!? 
If anyone has any advice on this then it would be most appreciated! 
Thanks Chris


----------



## NAVI51 (Aug 18, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

What would be the issues about using an 8V block from an 86 CIS GTI, mounting the 16V head, and do a 16VG60? What parts would be needed? and how well would it perform?


----------



## Dennis-G60 (Feb 11, 2006)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
No, people just prefer spending the money on pistons and a crankshaft elsewhere.
If you look at the Honda/Mitsubishi crowd, those guys try to stuff the biggest stroke crankshaft into there blocks.
I have pulley solutions for any VW-827 block.
No I have never run an ABA head with a G-LADER but I did mock it up for a customer a few days ago.To everyone that has never seen a PG motor with an ABA cylinder head and AZG intake manifold on it here you go:
































and 1 more for the road...









Awesome enigne mock up, Looks like a 16v-g60 with 8valves to less.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (NAVI51)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NAVI51* »_What would be the issues about using an 8V block from an 86 CIS GTI, mounting the 16V head, and do a 16VG60? What parts would be needed? and how well would it perform?

Running a G60 on CIS?

_Quote, originally posted by *Dennis-G60* »_
Awesome enigne mock up, Looks like a 16v-g60 with 8valves to less.


















_Quote, originally posted by *ogles* »_what is the best combination of block/ head? To get the most power/torque/free revving engine? 
I have a g60 corrado, with low mileage. Looking at 16v it? Wanted to do it for years and now the time has come! Would it be best to change the block to 2.0? I want to buy forged piston and con rods whichever wrought I take but don’t want to start/finish the conversion using the original pg block and someone to say you should have used the 2.0, you would of gained an extra 20bhp or on the other hand use the 2.0 and someone say that I only gained 2bhp and the 1.8 would of be more free revving and the better option!? 
If anyone has any advice on this then it would be most appreciated! 
Thanks Chris


Chris,
what country are you in? Do you have access to either 2E motor or similar?


----------



## NAVI51 (Aug 18, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

No just trying to use an 8V block so I don't run into any cost/compression issues and the performance of a 16V head. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif but I have never heard about it


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Question about the water pump pulley (non A/C)*

Perhaps this was asked and answered before, but I want to be sure asking here to you, the 16v G60 Gurus








So here it is. I will delete the A/C in my setup (9a 16v head and PG engine block), therefore, I need a water pump pulley for it. A vortexeer is offering me this VR6 water pump pulley:

























Its diameter is 4 5/8" and the width is 1 3/16", according to him.
Does this pulley fit in my setup without problems? Is the bolt pattern from the VR6 water pump pulley the same for the 16v? 
Just in case, I already have the BBM water pump pulley spacer.
Thanks in advance for the help!
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 



_Modified by rado4ever at 10:45 AM 10-28-2009_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: Question about the water pump pulley (rado4ever)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rado4ever* »_
Does this pulley fit in my setup without problems? Is the bolt pattern from the VR6 water pump pulley the same for the 16v?

This pulley fits


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

*Re: Question about the water pump pulley (Issam Abed)*

Which one?








Seriously, I need one for my setup ASAP 
Will the VR6 fit without any issue or do I have to machine it?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *Danno13* »_








I have 2 part numbers for the idlers in the tdi timing belt kit. Wiz, are you able to tell me which is the correct one? Maybe either will work
058 109 244
038 109 244E
Thanks


Anyone else have input on the roller with the spacer built in? Where can I get then for 8 bux? they are $25 on GAP. 
Also is that just a 16v tensioner or is their a better one to use that does not need modification of the bracket?



_Modified by LO-vw at 10:13 PM 11-2-2009_


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*









There's how mine is set up. Sans a GM spring tensioner/bracket that pushes in between the SC and alternator.








There's an overall of it. All stock parts with a bit of fabrication. Alt is from a Toyota or something.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (rte7x9)*

I have a 2.0L 9A set up. I have a regular BBM coolant flange coming off the front of the block. I also have another coolant flange on the side. Currently, the side flange has only one spot (to hold the blue coolant temp sensor)
A. do I need the one that houses both the blue and black sensor?
B. If I do, what car did that come off?


----------



## NAVI51 (Aug 18, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (NAVI51)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NAVI51* »_What would be the issues when using an 8V block from an 86 CIS GTI, mounting the 16V head, and do a 16VG60 using the Corrado's injection system? What parts would be needed? and how well would it perform?

Could anyone please answer???


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: FV-QR (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_I have a 2.0L 9A set up. I have a regular BBM coolant flange coming off the front of the block. I also have another coolant flange on the side. Currently, the side flange has only one spot (to hold the blue coolant temp sensor)
A. do I need the one that houses both the blue and black sensor?
B. If I do, what car did that come off? 

plug the blue ecu temp sensor into the coolant flange off the side of the head. use the screw in style in place of the black temp gage signal.


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

This weekend I will finally be swapping my 16v G60 into my A2, I'm excited, but given a recent discussion with a friend who does alot of tuning, I'm concerned about injector size.
I will be running a clean set of stock 'rado green tops (to my knowledge, they're 24lb'ers) with a 'rado wiring harness and some sort of chipped ECU.
Will these injectors be able to flow enough? If not, what would you guys suggest running? (I will eventually be switching to Megasquirt)
http://www.rceng.com/technical.aspx
I used the "Fuel Injector Worksheet" at the bottom of the page to calculate a need of 36lb injectors... (BSFC: .55, DC: 80%, 44psi) This is what generated my worry.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_This weekend I will finally be swapping my 16v G60 into my A2, I'm excited, but given a recent discussion with a friend who does alot of tuning, I'm concerned about injector size.
I will be running a clean set of stock 'rado green tops (to my knowledge, they're 24lb'ers) with a 'rado wiring harness and some sort of chipped ECU.
Will these injectors be able to flow enough? If not, what would you guys suggest running? (I will eventually be switching to Megasquirt)
http://www.rceng.com/technical.aspx
I used the "Fuel Injector Worksheet" at the bottom of the page to calculate a need of 36lb injectors... (BSFC: .55, DC: 80%, 44psi) This is what generated my worry.

If you are running the g-lader with about or under 15 psi your more than good. Be sure to run the 3.5 bar fpr.
Check out the tuning link at the top of this forum for dialing it all in. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (NAVI51)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NAVI51* »_What would be the issues about using an 8V block from an 86 CIS GTI, mounting the 16V head, and do a 16VG60? What parts would be needed? and how well would it perform?

You should do custom forged pistons for the correct compression ratio and valve reliefs. You will also need all the goodies from the 16v engine and also from the G60 engine.
You can get an idea of all of the parts by reading this entire thread.
We also have a pretty good list of the combinations here. The problem with using this engine is that you will still need to source a slew of parts from the G60 and from the 16v engine. It is better and easier to just start with one of these....then you don't need parts from three engines...lol
Good luck, here is a link with some parts that you will need for either combination.
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/abo...arged


----------



## kindbudz91G60 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (rte7x9)*

Is anyone running this setup with the U-bend and Rallye gold IC? My issue is that the alternator is a clearance issue with the 3" hose that connects to the IC. 
I would love to move my alternator to the front so I can ditch the hoola-hoop sized belt, but I think the clearance will not allow it. Anyone running this shizzle in a Corrado please speak up...

Thanks,
Keith


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_








There's an overall of it. All stock parts with a bit of fabrication. Alt is from a Toyota or something.

can u plz post a few pix with tentioner in place?
thnx!!!


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_
can u plz post a few pix with tentioner in place?
thnx!!!










I will be swapping the engine in this weekend, I'm sure I will have tons of photos to post. I'll be sure to include a closeup of the tensioner once mounted.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kindbudz91G60* »_
Is anyone running this setup with the U-bend and Rallye gold IC? My issue is that the alternator is a clearance issue with the 3" hose that connects to the IC.
I would love to move my alternator to the front so I can ditch the hoola-hoop sized belt, but I think the clearance will not allow it. Anyone running this shizzle in a Corrado please speak up...

Thanks,
Keith


Here's my set up (ubend and rallye golf FMIC)








BUT...it would be very difficult to run that alternator up front as there is no room. You gotta ditch the AC compressor to get the u bend on there.


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (dpgreek)*

Can the Scirocco 50mm intake be used to do this coversion or do i have to use the stock size?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (jeffs vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jeffs vw* »_Can the Scirocco 50mm intake be used to do this coversion or do i have to use the stock size?








Should be a non issue with clearancing the G60 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_Should be a non issue with clearancing the G60 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Does 50mm intake make a big difference with FI on a 16v engine? I was thinking of getting one, but those intakes are $$$$. 
thnx!


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*

i think they make the car breath different and also help with throttle response. me and a friend bought our manifold at orchideuro.com for $250.00 shipped and if you look on here everyone is asking 300+ for there's










_Modified by jeffs vw at 9:00 AM 11-15-2009_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_
Does 50mm intake make a big difference with FI on a 16v engine? I was thinking of getting one, but those intakes are $$$$. 
thnx!

They are $$$ because they are somewhat "rare".
Thats all.


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
They are $$$ because they are somewhat "rare".
Thats all.

So, u're saying I should spend my money elsewhere, no gain in power at all?








thnx


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_
So, u're saying I should spend my money elsewhere, no gain in power at all?








thnx

I cant answer that as I have never dyno tested the 2 manifolds together.That decision would be up to you.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

according to some local guys who have used the euro intake, there really is not much more power gain


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_
can u plz post a few pix with tentioner in place?
thnx!!!


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_
....pic


thnx man! now, did u manage to finish the swap? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif

Today I finally got around to doing a mock up! Luckily, my friend, who owns the shop, is a bit of a pack rat, so we got all kinds of misc. vw parts sitting in the corners collecting dust lol
After trying 15 different ways of belt routing, I figured this one would be the most easiest, yet solid setup. It's all oem parts, xpt the idler on the tensioner arm. It's a scooby part, but I might replace it for something vw. we'll see. anyways, I'm pretty happy with the results! I started my day with a bare 9a tall block and after a serious "scavenger hunt" round the shop n a few beers, of course, I ended up with this:
















I have another day off tmrw, I'm gonna try to figure out PS brackets n stuff. I might have to re-do the whole thing. We'll see.
cheers!


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*

That looks so good. i havent even started all i have is my 9a with jE pistons in it.


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_
thnx man! now, did u manage to finish the swap? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif

Today I finally got around to doing a mock up! Luckily, my friend, who owns the shop, is a bit of a pack rat, so we got all kinds of misc. vw parts sitting in the corners collecting dust lol
After trying 15 different ways of belt routing, I figured this one would be the most easiest, yet solid setup. It's all oem parts, xpt the idler on the tensioner arm. It's a scooby part, but I might replace it for something vw. we'll see. anyways, I'm pretty happy with the results! I started my day with a bare 9a tall block and after a serious "scavenger hunt" round the shop n a few beers, of course, I ended up with this:
I have another day off tmrw, I'm gonna try to figure out PS brackets n stuff. I might have to re-do the whole thing. We'll see.
cheers! 









My buddy had to go out of town for workk on Sunday, didn't have time to swap, just had time to tie up all the loose ends. As for your setup, looks good, but watch out with your clearances, if that's an ABA alternator (what it looks to be) it's too big.


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (rte7x9)*

cheers guys!








yea, it's an aba alt, its still smaller than the g60 one though. we got a milk crate full of random alts, I'm gonna see if there's anything smaller I could use...


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_I ended up with this:

You need more wrap around that alternator pulley.
If you need a set up to put the water pump and alternator back in serpentine mode then let me know.


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
You need more wrap around that alternator pulley.
If you need a set up to put the water pump and alternator back in serpentine mode then let me know.









You can also go nuts and run electric water and PS pumps. I know you can get the latter off of an old MR2 for decently cheap. Of course that doesn't solve the alt problem


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (rte7x9)*

thnx all for feedback and ideas! I know how it is - the more I think bout the setup, the more complicated it gets! Then I have to rrrrrrrrrrewind and start all over.








Anyways, I got the PS pump setup sorted. Mix n match of brackets n pulleys. Everything seems to be aligned perfect. Also, I got rid of the subaru item and put the aba idler on the tensioner arm cause of some minor clearance issues. I know the alt pulley needs more belt wrap, I'm going to try fitting a TDi belt roller where the top mounting bolt for the alt is.
ok, here's my setup v2.x








oh, can anyone plz confirm that an ABA alt causes clearance issues?
cheers! 







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*

confirmed.
it causes problems.


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_confirmed.
it causes problems.

this sux then http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (MA_XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_confirmed.
it causes problems.

Max
on a MKI or you are talking about on your Passat?
The bracket I made clears the rad support/cross member on a Corrado?


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

I just briefly checked my engine bay if there's space for an alt under the charger and it looks like there's plenty of room. I'll try taking more accurate measurements next week


----------



## 1slowVW (Sep 28, 2005)

*FV-QR*

I would love to know if mounting a mk3 alternator bellow the charger would fit in a mk1, I was under the impression it doesn't, but I would really love to be told otherwise.


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

issam,
your bracket works: MKII/Corrado + MKIII alternator.
MKI and passat: it's a no go. sorry. the MKI xmember is closer and the passat xmember is beefier. i tried. that's why i did my outboard.
maybe a VR6 alternator??? i don't think so unless you have solid mounts though.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1slowVW* »_I would love to know if mounting a mk3 alternator bellow the charger would fit in a mk1, I was under the impression it doesn't, but I would really love to be told otherwise. 


If you can find someone with an ABA swap into a MK1 utilising the ABA alternator then yes it will fit otherwise no.I can not confirm as I have never put a G60 with a bottom mount alternator in anything but a "MKII" chassis

_Quote, originally posted by *MA_XXX* »_issam,
your bracket works: MKII/Corrado + MKIII alternator.
MKI and passat: it's a no go. sorry. the MKI xmember is closer and the passat xmember is beefier. i tried. that's why i did my outboard.
maybe a VR6 alternator??? i don't think so unless you have solid mounts though.

Ah makes sense now! Well there your question is answered
Thanks for sharing Max as always. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Does anyone want a reverse Scroll water pump? I am making 10 of them now so you can run my water pump pulley with the belt on the backside of it.


----------



## Rocco R16V (Oct 7, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_Does anyone want a reverse Scroll water pump? I am making 10 of them now so you can run my water pump pulley with the belt on the backside of it. 

I do!










_Modified by Rocco R16V at 7:58 PM 11-22-2009_


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

I didnt see this on here. but if i use BBM stage 4 chip thats in my digi 1 ecu on my g60 16v build can i still use a 62mm pulley with an adjustable fpr?


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (jeffs vw)*

Is anyone running a bbm lysholm kit with an alt under the charger? I'm wondering if there's enough room between charger and alt for the oil return line?


----------



## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Has anyone built a mk1 golf with this conversion? Looking for advice on wiring if anyone can help?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_Is anyone running a bbm lysholm kit with an alt under the charger? I'm wondering if there's enough room between charger and alt for the oil return line?

yes and you can do this no prob, just use two 90deg drain fittings.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*

does the belt size change bw a 65 mm pulley and a 68 mm? or can you just adjust tension


----------



## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_does the belt size change bw a 65 mm pulley and a 68 mm? or can you just adjust tension

Not exactly sure, but BBM makes a tensioner adjuster that allows you to use one belt for all charger pulley sizes. It allows you to really dial in the spring tensioner position.
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_...r_Cap 
Edit: BBM recommends same size belt for 68 and 65mm pulley


_Modified by Hemingway'sToe at 9:52 AM 11-30-2009_


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Few general questions. 
Whats a good weight oil for the g60?
What spark plugs should be used? 16v or g60? or a range cooler of either?
Any belt better then the other? less strech? more grip?


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

this is where I'm at so far...








plz pardon the ugly cell pic and general filthiness - it's just a junk engine I'm using strictly for a mock-up.


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*

Crankwork, I'm liking the simplicity of that setup. Let's see some better pictures. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Belfegor (Dec 8, 2009)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

Hi all,
my name is Christian from Hungray and i'm looking for to buy and modifiCate a G60 to a 16V or 20V setup.
I haven't the time to Chek all the post in this Forum (i make if i have time) but i have one big question - dont see me stupid








What kind of profit i'm able to realise if i made this? Not easyer to Change the whole engine and put in the Car the originel 1.8T 20 V?
Or?
We have some advantage what dont know the original 1.8T 20V?

Sorry for my bad english http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (still_a_G)*


_Quote, originally posted by *still_a_G* »_Crankwork, I'm liking the simplicity of that setup. Let's see some better pictures. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

better pix comin soon!
The simplicity is what I'm aiming for - I'd like to build a solid setup using as many oem parts as possible. so far, it IS all oem with only a bit of fabbing. from mark 1 to "mmkay fore", from scirocco to passat - all these cars had something to contribute. lol
today wasn't such a productive day though - I got my mk3 beater back, had to make sure it's ready for the first snow storm that's coming tonite








I only made a 5th injector block off plate for intake, took some measurements for a few bushings I need to have made...


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Belfegor)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Belfegor* »_
We have some advantage what dont know the original 1.8T 20V?


Which 1.8T 20V engine are you working with?


----------



## Belfegor (Dec 8, 2009)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

In the moment nothing because i plan to buy the car only 2010 spring but i would like to know why better to change the head and lot of another thing, IF you are able to buy a 1.8T with 150 HP and build in the car the complet engine.
For me isn't clear why the head change is the "populer" version because i think so, to change the whole engine looks much easyer....or?
Thats why i asked you that the PG block with 16V or 20V head have some advantage what i dont know i the moment (stronger, better torque....)
If the answer only "because we dont want to change the engine and we will tune our G60" for me this is a good question, i would like to know that this head change have some "secret" profit what i dont know in the moment.
Thats all and thanks your answer


----------



## Belfegor (Dec 8, 2009)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Belfegor)*

"for me is a good answer" not a question as i wrote in the last post sorry.....BAD ENGLISH


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
plug the blue ecu temp sensor into the coolant flange off the side of the head. use the screw in style in place of the black temp gage signal.


What model comes with the screw in style? P/n?


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

things r taking shape!
today I test fitted an intake and a fuel rail, modded TB bypass linkage to clear the dist. cap


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (CrankWorkOrange)*

Mine is finally done and running in the car. I will take some pics later this week. It took awile to fab in the FMIC and all the rest of the goodies. My car has to completely warm up before it is ready for the highway. Is does not like to just take off. Which is to me a good thing. Oil gets above 168 and water just starts to come off the big mark and we are off to the races. Not just yet though because I have to break it in first. Slow and easy for about 1000 miles.
Post pics later this week.
Brent


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

What knock sensor is everyone using? g60 or 16v?


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

I am running the 16v knock sensor of the 9a block. I believe they are the same thing.


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (pickardaudi)*

ISSAM and to all with the 16VG60,
I have been driving my car for about a week to two weeks and I have worked out all the bugs but one. 
Scenario (1) Let the car warm up for about 10 minutes pull out and head down the road ( no problems) After driving about 25 miles to work. I get into town and start driving at lower speeds. about 1/4 throttle. If I hold the 1/4 throttle (no boost) It hit s flat spot and starts dieing off, Lets say 2500 rpms. Still Holding the throttle at 1/4 the car will kick back on at 1000 rpms. 
If you try to back off throttle or increase throttle it bucks and pops. 
Scenario (2)
Lets say I pull into AM/PM, in and out in 5 minutes *car is warm*, jump in the car and start off. Start increasing pedal to 1/4 throttle it starts bucking. 
In both scenarios I can pull over let it idle and pull away and everything is fine.
So any suggestions?
My temp never goes above 160 and currently I switched to stock G60 injectors. Bahn Brenner 16VG60 chip, 68 mm wheel. I am just breaking in th motor, motor has seen no boost yet and it idles fine. I have a narrow band oz gauge hooked up to the sender wire. "I know they are no good" Can that be giving me problems?
Also CO POT set at 500 ohms. Timing on the money! New Everything!


_Modified by pickardaudi at 6:57 PM 12-18-2009_


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

^ Wish I could help. Kinda sounds like a vacuum issue but idk. 

_Quote, originally posted by *MBRACKLIFFE* »_You can reuse the stock 16v CTS it is electronically compatible with the digi2 sensor however you should still make sure it is in good working order.
It is popular to swap in the single sensor digi2 flange and use the stock digi2 sensor but I have run my car off both and have found no difference.




Edit


_Modified by LO-vw at 7:41 PM 12-20-2009_


----------



## o2bad455 (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

Should a 16V head on a 3A (Audi 80/90 2L 8V) block/pistons have sufficient intake valve to piston crown clearance without cutting valve pockets into the 3A pistons? More or less than a 16V head on an ABA block/pistons? I'll measure before running it, but don't want to break down the perfectly good (and getting scarce) stock 3A if it's not going to have any more valve to piston clearance than an ABA would. 
This older post from way back on page 4 seems to be on point, but I'm not sure that it's answering my exact question:

_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
3A Pistons dont need a clearance. 8V = Non interferance motor.I was just saying the 3A Block = 9A Block.Same Block,different stamp #'s



_Modified by o2bad455 at 12:59 AM 12-21-2009_


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (o2bad455)*

Ok, switched the FPR and reinstalled my 37 lb injectors and everything seems to be running fine at the moment. Test drive was for 30 minutes. stop and go. I had no stumbling. When I pulled the sparks from the stock G60 injectors they were white. After I installed the 37 lb injectors they were carmel http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif .


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (pickardaudi)*

hey guys, gotta important question to ask...
I have a 9A motor for my 16v g60 set up.
I was testing out the coolant system for leaks by putting air into the system without coolant. We kept hearing a noise..couldn't figure it out. Added in the G12....put some pressure to it and realized that it was coming out of the charger oil feed line....
I had put the banjo bolt that holds oil feed line / sender into the side of the head on spot number 5 per this diagram: 








where is it supposed to go? 6?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

From what i've read everyone puts it on #6. 
That's where I bolted mine up last night.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

sweet, so that sender on that banjo bolt will read my oil pressure then?


----------



## Sciroccomann (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (pickardaudi)*

chances are your crank/cam timing is off. I had a dead spot at between 2k and 2500 when variable crank timing kicked in (sheered crank key).


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (Sciroccomann)*

WEll this is what I found. The O2 sensor was not wired properly. SO I corrected the wiring and presto car running real good. How I narrowed it down was checking everything throttle switches, co pot, blue temp, vaccum, and finally found to much voltage on my sender wire coming from my O2. 
Now my narrow band is reading lean when i coming into boost at higher rpms?
The main question is this if BBM 16VG60 chip is used they say use the stock injectors with their chip would larger injectors cause a lean problem? Would the chip not designed for the bigger injectors not allow enough opening and closing voltage in the larger injector?


_Modified by pickardaudi at 8:41 PM 12-22-2009_


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

Wait, I have my SC oil feed coming off of the port behind #8. 
I am immediately scared that I'm feeding coolant into the SC and subsequently back into my oil. Someone please tell me the port behind there flows oil....
I think I'm going to go put pants on now and look. How did I not triple check this like everything else.
EDIT: Wow, I'm so glad I went out and looked. Just changed the SC oil feed to the PROPER location on the back of the head and plugged the "useless" hole behind #8. I also had my coolant gauge wire hooked to the oil temp sensor in the back of the head, which explained why my coolant temp readings did not look right (I even put in a new thermostat tonight to "solve" the issue.)
Thankfully my 16vG60 has only been running for a few days, and I've only put a few miles on it. I am slightly worried that I may have cooked bearings inside the SC though.








Honestly I usually do more thinking than to make such a dumb mistake like this. I hope this small portion of retardation lapses soon and doesn't cause me anymore stupid issues like that. Feel free to harass, I think I deserve it.


_Modified by rte7x9 at 12:40 AM 12-23-2009_


----------



## Sciroccomann (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: (rte7x9)*

You're not alone... never thought I'd admit it, but I did the same thing on mine... so used to the 8v g60, and the feed line wanted to go on the side.... on the first warmup I wondered why I had so much steam coming out of the breather.. found milky oil and thought the stacked gaskets failed... then I got a reality check, wait, this is a 16v... DOH!! and this was on a lysholm with bn bearings... have fun flushing the motor! : )


----------



## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (pickardaudi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pickardaudi* »_Mine is finally done and running in the car. I will take some pics later this week. It took awile to fab in the FMIC and all the rest of the goodies. My car has to completely warm up before it is ready for the highway. Is does not like to just take off. Which is to me a good thing. Oil gets above 168 and water just starts to come off the big mark and we are off to the races. Not just yet though because I have to break it in first. Slow and easy for about 1000 miles.
Post pics later this week.
Brent

I for one would do what I could to change that. The best way to warm up your car is to drive it. Warms up fastest. Also A/F mixture on a cold idling engine is very rich. The extra fuel dilutes the oil film on your cylinder walls and causes extra wear.


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (Sciroccomann)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Sciroccomann* »_You're not alone... never thought I'd admit it, but I did the same thing on mine... so used to the 8v g60, and the feed line wanted to go on the side.... on the first warmup I wondered why I had so much steam coming out of the breather.. found milky oil and thought the stacked gaskets failed... then I got a reality check, wait, this is a 16v... DOH!! and this was on a lysholm with bn bearings... have fun flushing the motor! : )


Ah no fun! Yeah thankfully I put it on the one that doesn't flow anything, so luckily there was no oil/coolant mixing. Worst case is I've got some SC bearings that hate me.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (rte7x9)*

I figured out the same prob with oil / coolant plug. Dumb mistake, but it happens.
After moving the oil feed line to the right spot, tightening up a few last bolts, trying to put the timing mark in check on the camshaft gear / valve cover, and adding some gas - it was time to try and crank her up.
no dice..wasn't clicking...
after some trouble shooting, had to get a good ground to chassis for starter. Tried again with some clicking this time...
no dice again.
checked ignition coil for wiring....rearranged some stuff on coil...realized the spark plug wiring order was wrong. Switched those up. Tried again..no dice again.
Checked for spark - which we have, suffiecient fuel from lines - which was coming in ok, tried cranking with spark plug out - got spark from that....removed the first plug - checked...looked ok...
We also messed with distributor a bit.. but still nothing. 

My buddy thinks that the gas I put in (premium 93) had been sitting to long in my garage (which it has been there for a few months). Maybe lost some volatility. I didn't put a lot either...so that may be it. That mixed with the old crappy gas in the lines maybe the culprit. Anyone got any bright ideas?


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (dpgreek)*

You 100% sure your timing is set right between the crank and cam sprockets? Bad gas could be a culprit, but I would think you would at least get some hiccups rather than just nothing.


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (rte7x9)*

it may not be fully timed right...
I turned the crank by hand until the tick mark on the cam gear was in alignment with the valve cover mark. We opened up the tranny cover to find the tick mark for flywheel...didn't see it. what should I do step by step for timing it at this point? I don't have my lower gear cover to line up with crank tick mark on the BBM pulley


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_it may not be fully timed right...
I turned the crank by hand until the tick mark on the cam gear was in alignment with the valve cover mark. We opened up the tranny cover to find the tick mark for flywheel...didn't see it. what should I do step by step for timing it at this point? I don't have my lower gear cover to line up with crank tick mark on the BBM pulley

You need to get the motor at TDC. The easiest way if you don't know all the marks on the flywheel is to pull the plug out of cyl. #1, get a CLEAN rod/screwdriver/ratchet extension or something to put in there so it sticks far enough out of the top. Then slowly rotate the crank to push the rod out, you'll be able to see when the cylinder is as high as it can go, this is TDC.
I used this method on my 8v, it's not always the most accurate and you may get made fun of for it, but it definitely works in a pinch. Best of luck, keep us posted!


----------



## dpgreek (Aug 14, 2003)

*Re: (rte7x9)*

so once I get it to TDC with the rod sticking up highest...that is when I should crank it to see if it turns over? Don't I have to time dizzy as well?


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_so once I get it to TDC with the rod sticking up highest...that is when I should crank it to see if it turns over? Don't I have to time dizzy as well?

Yeah, what I suggested is how to set the crank to TDC, then set the head to tdc (valve cover arrow aligned with dot on sprocket) and the dizzy to TDC (rotate dizzy housing to align little notch with rotor.) Then you can throw the timing belt back on and try to start it.
Also, are you 100% sure your injectors are all firing?


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

oh wow there is a TDC for the dizzy !?!?! this is my 2ed 16v and never saw a notch.
Ya make sure you have 100% air, fuel, and spark. 
Then move on to the harder stuff timing of the engine.


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

CIS Fuel pump Changed my AFR for the better! That was the whole problem just not enough fuel to the 37 lb injectors. Probably went I get the cams I will jump to 440 cc and a SNS chip.


----------



## MXU (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (dpgreek)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dpgreek* »_hey guys, gotta important question to ask...
I have a 9A motor for my 16v g60 set up.
I was testing out the coolant system for leaks by putting air into the system without coolant. We kept hearing a noise..couldn't figure it out. Added in the G12....put some pressure to it and realized that it was coming out of the charger oil feed line....
I had put the banjo bolt that holds oil feed line / sender into the side of the head on spot number 5 per this diagram: 








where is it supposed to go? 6?

I'm using KR motor and sensors looks like same...? Few questions:
#7 Is this nessesary? I understood that this runs fuel pump after stop so that the fuel in fuel rail doesn't start to vaporise? 
#1 and #6 Why low pressure switc is moved to oil filter bracket and temperature sender to cylinder head? Compared 8V engine? Does it make any difference? 
#6 Is this the right place for compressor oil feed? Or from oil filter braket like here


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *MXU* »_
I'm using KR motor and sensors looks like same...? Few questions:
#7 Is this nessesary? I understood that this runs fuel pump after stop so that the fuel in fuel rail doesn't start to vaporise? 
*This is the after run switch for the fans only. *
#1 and #6 Why low pressure switc is moved to oil filter bracket and temperature sender to cylinder head? Compared 8V engine? Does it make any difference? 
*I would keep the pressure switches on the valve cover but can be moved, g60 runs one of them off the oil feed line. #6 is just a temperature sensor for the FMA, can be place anywhre oil will touch it. A lot of people dont like it back there, feeling that exhaust heat will sway results *
#6 Is this the right place for compressor oil feed? Or from oil filter braket like here
*From what I read that is everyone favorite place due to pressure and flow. People are worried too much flow and pressure will blow the seals on the g60. Putting it on the oil filter flage could create those problems. *


Answers in bold form what I have found.


----------



## MXU (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

Yes, it affects also on radiator fans but there is still another switch in radiator. Just thinking is it nessecary (#7) 
http://www.vaglinks.com/Docs/V...e.pdf
page 30...


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

totally up to you, Im keeping it. 
if you want to get rid of it you can also get a early rabbit radiator temp switch that only has one temp setting instead of 2.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Running into bit of a snag with the TB and brake Reservoir








Anyone have a solution? Will the rounded design yield me more room?
http://www.ecstuning.com/Searc...59823/


----------



## blown020 (Jan 9, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

you need the elbow


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

do not want to use the elbow at all costs


----------



## Rocco R16V (Oct 7, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_do not want to use the elbow at all costs 

standalone with waste spark or cop?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (Rocco R16V)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rocco R16V* »_
standalone with waste spark or cop?









Wont help his brake booster issue bro.
isnt there a shallower brake fluid resevoir on one of the other frames?
Another solution is relocating the bypass, i.e. cutting off that portion from the throttle body housing and caping it.


----------



## Rocco R16V (Oct 7, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

how did i miss that?
Remote mount the brake resivoir.
It just needs to seal it doesnt take any pressure. could tap the mc for a barbed fitting and then use a short length of hose to the resivoir.
may not be the best solution but he did say no elbow and i'm assuming he doesnt want to use a different throttle body and a bov/bpv.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

The remote idea isnt that bad of one actually! 
There is a mk3 res that is rounded like in the link i provided above (they discontinued the boxy style one so if you order a new res you get the round one now). 
My buddy in cali is going to send me one with some other stuff for muh car, If that does not work I have an early 16v throttle body half that will mount to the g60 and delete the bypass. Then I would just have to run a DV from an 1.8t. 
We will see. Ran into another issue, I knew it would be close but guess i cant run the oem golf g60 intercooler setup like I wanted







Its for sale if anyone is interested. 








I could still make it work just have to make my own brackets so we will see what happens.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Well running into another issue.. 
What radiator do people typically use? 
This is my mk2 rad I planned on using but ill have to move it all around unless there is a better option. 
Alt and rad
















Charger and rad


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

Gotta use the 'rado radiator, man. Is there any reason you don't want to use the elbow?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_
What radiator do people typically use? 

Corrado radiator.
Kind of silly but if you use the Golf 16V upper intake manifold and do a U on the throttle body you might avoid all those problems.Not sure how you would like that though with your OEM+ theme.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

I wanted to run the g60 mk2 Intercooler, that was the main reason for not wanting to run the elbow. But I do not like the look of it and it just adds more leak points. 
Ya i mocked up the golf intake last night and took some pics, kinda thinking thats how things are going to end up but still looking into all my options. 

I was thinking, the oem g60 Throttle body has like what a 2" inlet on it. Wouldn't it be better for flow everyone to run the 16v inlet half on the throttle body and ditch the g60 stuff?


----------



## o2bad455 (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
First the Compression Ratio of either the *9A* or *PL* needs to be decreased.As stated above the 9A and PL have a CR of 10.8:1 and 10:1 respectively so you can either machine/dish the pistons to lower the CR or get a set of custom 83mm units.Below is a picture courtesy of OttawaG60 showing machined *9A* units.










Thanks for the pic! Has anyone run stock 9A pistons machined like that under high boost? I'm considering dishing the 9A pistons (by about 30cc for 7:1 CR). Any thoughts on piston strength (either before or after dish)? I presume the dish should be as wide as possible while leaving just enough at the land for good squish and quench. But, how deep can the dish go without severely weakening the piston? I think for 30cc, I'd probably need to dish around 10 mm. Too much? 
If 10mm would be too much, would dishing an aftermarket piston be a better idea? Unfortunately, the lowest CR 82.5 or 83.0 bore piston I can find (9A, 3A, ABA, ABF, etc.) comes out to about 8:1 CR. 


_Modified by o2bad455 at 11:20 AM 1-5-2010_


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (o2bad455)*

any of our european buddies wanna help me/us out and source an ABF coolant flange for the side of the head? one that accepts blue/black sensor.
p/n is 037 121 144 M 
cheerios!


----------



## RichPhatOne (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (CrankWorkOrange)*

You on about the coolant flange in the pic further up the page? If so I think I have one kicking about down the garage.


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (RichPhatOne)*


_Quote, originally posted by *RichPhatOne* »_You on about the coolant flange in the pic further up the page? If so I think I have one kicking about down the garage.

very similar but the one pictured is an 8v digi item. 
here's a pic i found thru googli:


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (yellowstonepart)*

Well thats nice for yellowstone diesel....









I can source the outlet flanges
need at least 5 people for that.I have the ability to source any european part I want


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

I have a regular digi side of head flange if someone needs one, its used.


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_Well thats nice for yellowstone diesel....









I can source the outlet flanges
need at least 5 people for that.I have the ability to source any european part I want









I'll take 2. how much can u get them for? i saw em on ebay.de at 10 euro a piece
thnx


----------



## MXU (Dec 23, 2006)

What head bolts have you used? Other than ARP. Stock? Does S2 head bolts fit?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (CrankWorkOrange)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_
I'll take 2. how much can u get them for? i saw em on ebay.de at 10 euro a piece
thnx









Obviously cant match ebay.de pricing but you can be satisfied knowing you are supporting a local vendor


----------



## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

would an 8.5:1 compression ratio work for the 16v g60 or should it really be 8.0:1. does 0.5 really matter that much?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (92VW)*


_Quote, originally posted by *92VW* »_would an 8.5:1 compression ratio work for the 16v g60 or should it really be 8.0:1. does 0.5 really matter that much?
I cant say I am a fan of such low CR figures though.
IMHO 9:1 is more suited for these motors.


----------



## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Thanks for the help. 9.0:1 is ok to use with the BBM kit and software?


_Modified by 92VW at 3:02 PM 1-13-2010_


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (92VW)*

Hi








i use the abf coolant flange with(black sensor) and this part see pic and that works great!! I have paid 3,90euro for this part,nr. is 4A0 819 497 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## G60VeeDub (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (BI-G60)*

yea, they use that on the eurovan here, you can pick it up for like 11 bux.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Oh nice that inline one is slick!
Question tho. Why use the blue or black sensors anyway? 
From what I understand the blue one is fully interchangeable with the 16v white head sensor. 
So why couldn't you also use the 16v single pin cluster temp sensor?
Its already grounded to the head so you just need to run the one wire instead of two. 
This would also eliminate the usage for those special flanges.
Or is that cluster temp sensor not interchangeable?


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

Hi,the g60 wiring loom have a separate plugs for the sensors and thats a big different as the 16v looms,the 16v white head sensor would also fit on 16vg60 and they have the same results like the blue sensor but the 16v white sensor is too expensive! My VW-dealer want 30euro that is around 44US$ and i pay for the blue sensor only 8euro.What ever i prefer the sensor with O-rings







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

well what would be wrong with using the held plug 16v cluster gauge sensor. 
Price is understandable on the CTS sensor


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

Hi,i think thats not wrong its only the temperatur gauge but if that works.Have you a 16v or g60 wiring loom??


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_well what would be wrong with using the held plug 16v cluster gauge sensor. 
Price is understandable on the CTS sensor 

Completely different resistance curves/ranges between the gauge and ECU temp sensors. You can however use the default 16v CTS instead of the G60 CTS, they respond the same. 
(I have one on mine, everything is running quite well!)


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Think you are misunderstanding me. 
Im going to run the 16v gauge (not black digi) cluster and blue CTS


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

Folks with running 16vG60's, I have a few questions!
I've been DD'ing mine for a bit over 1k miles now, things are running well, now I'm looking to dial in/compare with other setups.
1) How much ignition advance are you running? (If I had to guess, I'd say 10 or so, I really need to mark my valve cover and break out the timing light)
2) What is your CO Pot set at? (I've been trying stuff between 300-450, still idling very rich)
3) How much vacuum are you pulling at idle? (I only pull 10 or so, but I see 20 while cruising around off throttle)
4) How much boost are you running? (I'm at 5-6lbs on a stock G60 pulley and 1.8t crank pulley)
Any tips for getting the most out of this setup, or how it differs from tuning a stock Digi1 'rado would be greatly appreciated. I've done my best to follow standard FAQ practices setting things up, now that I have an AFR, all I do is stare and worry!








Thanks much!
Ron


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_Folks with running 16vG60's, I have a few questions!
I've been DD'ing mine for a bit over 1k miles now, things are running well, now I'm looking to dial in/compare with other setups.
1) How much ignition advance are you running? (If I had to guess, I'd say 10 or so, I really need to mark my valve cover and break out the timing light)
2) What is your CO Pot set at? (I've been trying stuff between 300-450, still idling very rich)
3) How much vacuum are you pulling at idle? (I only pull 10 or so, but I see 20 while cruising around off throttle)
4) How much boost are you running? (I'm at 5-6lbs on a stock G60 pulley and 1.8t crank pulley)
Any tips for getting the most out of this setup, or how it differs from tuning a stock Digi1 'rado would be greatly appreciated. I've done my best to follow standard FAQ practices setting things up, now that I have an AFR, all I do is stare and worry!








Thanks much!
Ron

Bump with photos, forgot I still had not posted proof of completion!
























Once we get some sun down here and I have some time, I'll take more detailed photos. I also need to clean up the wiring harness.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

What injectors what with management are people using? 
First I read use g60's when I first got into this. 
Then I read 30's 
No im finding 42's are the way to go as 30's might be maxed.
So far right now I own the g60's and 30's and getting sick of hunting parts that I dont need. 
I did a quick calculation and just tossing in 250 at crank i would need #42's regardless of management.


----------



## o2bad455 (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_What injectors what with management are people using? 
. . .
I did a quick calculation and just tossing in 250 at crank i would need #42's regardless of management. 

Sorry, but you simply can't size injectors "regardless of management". For example, Digi-1 is a bit coarse, so you try to pick smaller injectors for cleaner idle and smoother torque. On the other hand, real sequential management requires much larger injectors for the same power output just because it all has to be injected in the smaller amount of time that the intake valve is open. If you have something that's semi-sequential, or that has better pulse resolution, all of that factors into injector type and sizing. So, I'd say first pick your management, THEN pick and size your injectors.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

well digi 1
either SNS chip if I can ever get a hold of j watts or bbm chip


----------



## o2bad455 (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

Input from others would be great, but don't forget to ask the tuners themselves for their injector sizing recommendations *for their particular tunes*. 
My last G60 exploded a long time ago. I currently run Digi-1 with SNS tune on a 16V BT with 60 lb injectors. I'm satisfied with the SNS tune, which I think is the best possible under the circumstances with Digi-1. Unfortunately, the Digi-1 itself isn't quite up to the task of accurately controlling such large injectors at lower RPM. Although power and reliability are great, emissions and fuel economy are problems. 
Fortunately, a G60 supercharger doesn't need such large injectors as a BT, at least not with a reasonable pulley. Match-flowed (aka blue-printed) injectors may help in marginal cases, but can't come close to solving the problem in other cases. My guess is that the 42 lb injectors might also be too big for low-rpm accuracy with Digi-1, but hopefully others with 42 lb experience will chime in on that. 
I'm actually on the verge of completely replacing the Digi-1 with a full MegaSquirt SFI system, not for more power, but mainly for better fuel efficiency and emissions. The upcoming MS3 is going to have even better resolution than MS2, which should fit the bill quite nicely, I think. If I get enough time (and find a spare harness header), I might even make it switchable between the Digi and the MS.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Great info, 
So what happens at low RPM with large injectors? Flooding? Stalling? 
ISV necessary then?


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CrankWorkOrange* »_Is anyone running a bbm lysholm kit with an alt under the charger? I'm wondering if there's enough room between charger and alt for the oil return line?


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
yes and you can do this no prob, just use two 90deg drain fittings.

What r the specs on those fittings? where can i get them? Also, what size is the barb fitting that screws into diamond plate for 2nd oil return line? I'd like to put one into the breather block off plate.
thnx!!! 
p.s. looking at LO-vw's pix I realized that remote brake res. is the way to go since I can't use the elbow either. Shouldn't be too much of a mission.


----------



## o2bad455 (Aug 22, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *LO-vw* »_Great info, 
So what happens at low RPM with large injectors? Flooding? Stalling? 
ISV necessary then? 

It usually just runs too rich for certain emissions tests and fuel economy purposes. The issue is that a relatively low resolution system, such as Digi-1 and other older technology systems, can only control the injectors using relatively large jumps in injector on-time. The larger the injector, the greater the *difference* in fuel flow for the two closest choices of on-time. A good tune shouldn't let it run lean, but the next step up in on-time is often too rich when using bigger injectors. The issue can sometimes be solved at idle by permitting a greater lean tolerance when an idle switch is closed, for example. It really has little to do with ISVs, which control extra air rather than fuel and which are generally ineffective above idle. Unfortunately, emissions tests on a rolling dyno, as my state now uses (with some exceptions depending mostly on year and drive configuration of the vehicle), usually fail with the larger injectors due to the necessary choice of the higher on-time. Similarly, fuel economy suffers as well. There are many possible "solutions" to the emissions tests, but the only decent solution to the fuel economy issue is to use an engine management system that allows higher resolution. The upcoming MegaSquirt3 seems to be such a system. 


_Modified by o2bad455 at 3:35 PM 2-4-2010_


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (o2bad455)*

Well I will chime in. It is based off the tune of the chip, LO-VW, I did get to email between Jwatts and the SNS tune requires #42 injectors. I can tell ya that over the past 2 months I have been fine tuning mine and we emailed on several different times. I started with #37 injectors and my cold idle was crap but once it warmed up it was fine. I was embarrassed of the cold idle. So then I thru in the stock G60's and my AFR was way too lean. It only took one test ride and those came out. My chip is BBM. So called BBM and spoke to them. They said the max injector for there tune is #30. So I bought a used set and sure enough I have great idle and great AFR's. I have hit 13 lbs of boost on car and I stay pretty close to rich. I need to do some dyno runs and really play with the timing. I hope this helps.
Brent


----------



## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (Issam Abed)*

x's 2


----------



## ozzman_g7 (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (kda33)*

I'm building a 2.0 ABA 16v Lysholm and wasted spark engine. Which MS do you guys recommend on getting?


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (G60VeeDub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *G60VeeDub* »_yea, they use that on the eurovan here, you can pick it up for like 11 bux.

are you referring to the inline gauge unit? if so.. got a part number? that would help me out alot!
-nate


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

would it be a good idea to hook up both valve and block breathers into the g60? I keep reading how the g60 needs the oil vapors to keep lubricated


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

I did not do this. I ran the return tube from the TB without any breather coming from my valve cover. I have a catch can installed for the block and every oil change I just shoot some WD-4 in the tube and call it good. I read it on the Vortex somewhere many moons ago about the WD-40.... haha... No problems yet and I have been doing this for about forever....
Brent


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

wd-40 is such a bad lubricant tho lol 
I was going to do the catch can but read every so often its not a bad idea to have the oil mist in there.


----------



## g60_c (Nov 15, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (LO-vw)*

well, for what it's worth, techtonics has the inline coolant sensor fitting, for approx $30 shipped.
-Nate


----------



## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (g60_c)*

Works for me, I been thinking about trying some other lube. I don't shoot it all the time, jst a coupe shoots in the tube and it probably works its way down over time. No problems


----------



## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (pickardaudi)*

Just wanted to say great posts here and wow have i learned alot reading all 39 pages. Want to also build a 16vG60 rig and havent found a post ( or missed it somehow ) on a couple things.
this was the plan..........
84 rabbit GTI
9a 2.0L 16v block and head ( double AB gaskets for comp. drop )
Rocco intake manifold with Auto G60 TB with TPS
MSnS II V3.0 to run fuel and spark using 42lb injectors and stock dist and hall
Questions I have are is the 16v ISV work the same as the g60 one?
Do I need to use a CO % Pot with MS ? Or is there something else in its place like a BOV or MS application?
Any help or leads to where I could find an answer would be great http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Keep this great thread going


----------



## Rocco R16V (Oct 7, 2008)

*Re: (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_










nice








what intake manifold is that? i can see its been welded on, an audi 5cyl cut down maybe, but which one, was the flange changed to?


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (Rocco R16V)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Rocco R16V* »_
nice








what intake manifold is that? i can see its been welded on, an audi 5cyl cut down maybe, but which one, was the flange changed to?


It's a stock 16v manifold, completely cut down and flipped around. I cut the TB part off my old 8v manifold, bent some tube to adapt it so the TB wouldn't hit the hood. It looks super hacked, but doesn't leak.


----------



## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

*Re: (rte7x9)*

Anyone had experiance with standard 10.8:1 comp ( 9a 2.0L 16V ) and a bigger pulley set up ie. 78MM? I have seen one mention of it from a european 16vg60 site ( that i could understand ) that did this with great success. Basically keeping all the NA hp with a mild 4-6 lbs of boost putting out the 200ish+ hp still ( im sure with cams etc. ).


----------



## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Does anyone know whats happening with the bahn brenner integration kits? there was a new run in production due out around now?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (daniboy1_2_3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *daniboy1_2_3* »_Does anyone know whats happening with the bahn brenner integration kits? there was a new run in production due out around now?

we are in production and accepting orders... 
many of the parts are available now.


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
we are in production and accepting orders... 
many of the parts are available now.










When the time comes I will be doing this http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Hi john, i have placed a deposit with you already, my name is daniel hudson, i was just after an update as to when i could expect it to be ready?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (daniboy1_2_3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *daniboy1_2_3* »_ Hi john, i have placed a deposit with you already, my name is daniel hudson, i was just after an update as to when i could expect it to be ready?

I've got most all of the parts running full tilt boogie and scheduled on our machines. Hope to ship your kit complete by the end of next month.... at the latest it will be in May. Now this ship date is only for our very first pre-order customers, customers that have deposits down. I think we have enough parts to do one or two more in this time frame. The following full integration kit orders will be at the very first of summer. If any one wants in on this run we are accepting $500 deposits to hold your integration kit on the run. The rear alternator bits are $349 for the set.


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

JBETZ i was wondering if you guys still sell the air to water ic setup.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (ewillard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ewillard* »_JBETZ i was wondering if you guys still sell the air to water ic setup. 

Yes, we can build one for you in 2-3 weeks.


----------



## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

I have left a deposit with you already and look forward to hearing from you soon


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (daniboy1_2_3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *daniboy1_2_3* »_I have left a deposit with you already and look forward to hearing from you soon









Oh yes, I know http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
And thank you for your business and your patience on the wait.
Have a great weekend


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

well i melted a piston in my 8v lysholm (i think not sure yet but motor is running on 3 cylanders and its an excuess to build my 16v) sns chip didnt cut it and i couldnt get it to run on my ms. so my 16v build is starting ealry i have been reading through these fourms for weeks trying to figure out what to do with alt and i think im going with putting it where ac goes. the motor i got is
ARP main studs
scat rods
83mm wiseco aba pistons notched for 16v. 8:1 comp
ARP head studs
ABA head gasket
rebult/ported 2.0 16v head
Autotech cams
Autotech high rev springs
ABF timing belt
All new gaskets
VW windage tray
new oil pump
new intermediate shaft bearings/9a intermediate shaft set up!!
im running my lysholm with 53mm pulley
55lbs delphin injectors
ms2 3.57 with 2.21 extra
still need to source a header (if you got one let me know) going in a raddo.
no power stearing. and i got the adjustble water pump pulley. 
bbm boost tubes. 
lc1 wideband. 
ill get pics up as soon as i can proly next weekend


----------



## javbb18 (Apr 12, 2010)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (herby53-akaherby53)*

i am thinking about putting a g60 in my mkII gti would i need a new tranny? fuel lines? motor mounts? etc.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (javbb18)*


_Quote, originally posted by *javbb18* »_i am thinking about putting a g60 in my mkII gti would i need a new tranny? fuel lines? motor mounts? etc.

It would be a good suggestion considering you are doing a motor rebuild


----------



## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

*Re: 16V G60 - How to (Issam Abed)*

I got my 9A torn down this weekend to get ready for the machine shop, and found something bad; One motor mount tab is broken off the block.








So I need to source a new bare block. I haven't found any 9As around my area but ABAs seem to be plentiful. Are both these bare 2.0 blocks the same? I've already got my forged Pistons for the 9A so would really like to keep the 9A crank/connecting rod set.
If not, I can get an ABA short block for more money and use the stock 9A pistons on the ABA rods, but then I won't have the good forged pistons to use with the boost from my G60.


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

how come everyone makes such a big deal about relocating the alternator its easy i made a bracket and everything in about 20 min. putting it where the ac goes im a little worried about the clearance on the sub frame but well find out this weekend when we but the motor in


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (ewillard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ewillard* »_how come everyone makes such a big deal about relocating the alternator its easy i made a bracket and everything in about 20 min. putting it where the ac goes im a little worried about the clearance on the sub frame but well find out this weekend when we but the motor in

Some people want to keep there A/C unfortunately


----------



## rte7x9 (Jun 11, 2008)

*Re: (ewillard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ewillard* »_how come everyone makes such a big deal about relocating the alternator its easy i made a bracket and everything in about 20 min. putting it where the ac goes im a little worried about the clearance on the sub frame but well find out this weekend when we but the motor in

Agreed. What alt. are you using? I'm rocking a denso alt. off of some camry or something. Got about 1/2" between the sub and the +12 post on the alt. Last time my front motor mount shattered it welded itself to the subframe before I could unhook the battery. Good times!


----------



## MXU (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: (ewillard)*

You can use rallye charger outlet, piping and intercooler if you relocate alternator.


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

im runing a lysholm not a grenade.


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
I really like how he did the alternator belt set up.definitely http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


















what alternator is that. im using my g60 one i have it mounted up and all but im having trouble getting the pulley off to grind it down to line up. and i like how that one mounts on both bolt hole up top


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (daniboy1_2_3)*

Daniel-
We are ready to ship your BBM 16v Ltd. package next week... 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Did you want us to run the credit card that we used for the deposit for the balance?
Thanks again for your business
Have a great weekend


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

How is the run on those displacers coming?


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (sdezego)*


_Quote, originally posted by *sdezego* »_How is the run on those displacers coming?









Funny you should ask.... we do have brand new magnesium displacers coming. I should have pricing up by the end of next week.


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (sdezego)*

Shawn-
I could use a set of your O2M mounts...for this


----------



## BI-G60 (Sep 1, 2006)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Nice intake







but u forget the us-flagg and the us-army logo http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

can some one let me know how much you have to get milled off a g60 crank pulley to have it line up properly. or will an 1.8T pulley work im going to go get one tomorrow at the junkyard and see unlees somone can tell me.


_Modified by ewillard at 1:01 PM 4-18-2010_


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (ewillard)*

You need to take 6mm off.... we do it to the ABA 2.0L pulley. Not sure how the G60 unit would turn out. You also need to insert a billet machined ring into a counter bore or the pulley will not run concentric. 
We sell them already done here.
We can also modify a used ABA pulley for $39 + sh
Here is a new one ready to bolt on.
Do you see the precision ring inserted...?
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_...v_20v


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

Jbetz do you think you could hook me up with a modify used one i also need a few other little things. the elbow for the manifoild. and a block of plate for the oil breather and coolant flange to run the lysholm im not runing digi so it dose not need the sensor holes. o and i need bbm stickers i have become a sticker whore.


_Modified by ewillard at 2:48 PM 4-18-2010_


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (ewillard)*

Yes, shoot us a call and we will get it all going for you.
Thanks


----------



## btk31 (Apr 20, 2010)

I have a 1990 red corrado in my garage ive been looking to part w/ for the right price. Its gutted interior and engine bay, all factory parts would be encluded in sale. $1500obo. pics available through email. Reading pa area. 
Also for sale is Brahn Brenner G60 16v conversion kit along with all parts needed for the smooth swap. Parts list available Message if interested.


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## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

hey jbetz i need 2 last things to get my 16v lysholm runninga and thats the front water flange and the TB elbow but honestly how can you charge 230$ for that elbow the is craziness


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*Re: (ewillard)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ewillard* »_hey jbetz i need 2 last things to get my 16v lysholm runninga and thats the front water flange and the TB elbow but honestly how can you charge 230$ for that elbow the is craziness

Ah I miss being 21, no disrespect here.
There are a few reasons for the price on this one part!
This single part is made up of three castings, one tight radius elbow and two custom low volume castings that are post CNC machined here at BBM. Then the assembly is hand fit into a jig by an American worker and tig welded, also here at BBM. The price is actually low for what goes into it and the volume of parts sales. Nice flowing high quality made in the USA parts cost some money... Maybe were not so crazy after all or maybe we are but not because of the price of our parts...lol. Now on the other hand where else can you even buy a silly part like this.
Enjoy the rest of the weekend.


----------



## vvdubg60 (May 20, 2007)

*Re: (ewillard)*

hey ewillard i sent you a pm i think i solved your problem....


----------



## fox-16v (Jun 30, 2009)

*Re: (vvdubg60)*

Ok, I have been snooping around this thread for a couple days now. I also noticed BBM is carrying the 16v/g60 integration kit again (yay) so I wanna do it. I'm pretty clear on everything with the pulleys and the fuel management. My question is this, do I need to build up the block with forged internals? Its a 2.0L 16V and its going in a mk2 gli.
Will this kit be fine or should I lower the compression?
http://www.intengineering.com/....html


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (fox-16v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *fox-16v* »_Its a 2.0L 16V and its going in a mk2 gli.


You will most certainly need to lower compression ratio for use with a G60. You have 4 options:
1. Get an ABA block and rebush the 159/21mm rods to 159/20mm and use the 16V pistons in there.
2. Take your stock 9A pistons to a machine shop and have the crown machined a little to lower the CR.
3. Get 2 ABA head gaskets + ARP head studs and raise the head to help lower CR.
4. Purchase a set of aftermarket pistons from JE. If you need a set I have an extra 9:1 CR 16V set for sale.


----------



## ozzman_g7 (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: (JBETZ)*

Hey John, I want to use a FMIC and I saw a guy from Canada running like this, is it safe? 
Or what other options do I have so I can run FMIC? 










_Modified by ozzman_g7 at 2:26 PM 5-2-2010_


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (JBETZ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JBETZ* »_
Ah I miss being 21, no disrespect here.
There are a few reasons for the price on this one part!
This single part is made up of three castings, one tight radius elbow and two custom low volume castings that are post CNC machined here at BBM. Then the assembly is hand fit into a jig by an American worker and tig welded, also here at BBM. The price is actually low for what goes into it and the volume of parts sales. Nice flowing high quality made in the USA parts cost some money... Maybe were not so crazy after all or maybe we are but not because of the price of our parts...lol. Now on the other hand where else can you even buy a silly part like this.
Enjoy the rest of the weekend.









i understand where you are coming from Mr. betz and no offence taken i was frustrated last week cause i couldn't get it to start with out being able to moving the TB so i threw a 16v one on today just to try and get it to start and it started right up. now have to finish up the cooling system and i can drive it again. and put the front end back on. im looking forward to hitting the dyno with it and see what it puts down ill get pictures up tomorrow


----------



## fox-16v (Jun 30, 2009)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
You will most certainly need to lower compression ratio for use with a G60. You have 4 options:
1. Get an ABA block and rebush the 159/21mm rods to 159/20mm and use the 16V pistons in there.
2. Take your stock 9A pistons to a machine shop and have the crown machined a little to lower the CR.
3. Get 2 ABA head gaskets + ARP head studs and raise the head to help lower CR.
4. Purchase a set of aftermarket pistons from JE. If you need a set I have an extra 9:1 CR 16V set for sale.









9.5:1 will be alright?


----------



## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

*Re: (rte7x9)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rte7x9* »_
Agreed. What alt. are you using? I'm rocking a denso alt. off of some camry or something. Got about 1/2" between the sub and the +12 post on the alt. Last time my front motor mount shattered it welded itself to the subframe before I could unhook the battery. Good times!


im running a ABA alternator i think it might be a 16v one. i found it in my shop. but i only had to grind the charger bracket a little and the alternator i got about 1/2 - 3/4" of clearance from the sub frame i was thinking go with a denso but it worked out with the aba ones


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Bump for the new forum


----------



## Chapel (Jun 23, 1999)

*ROUND 3*. 

I decided to make this thread after again getting quite a few PM's from members asking me to do a 16V G60 thread similiar to my 20V G60 Thread.Now my reply was that I had never built a 16V G60 ,I only had the knowledge and know how of a 16V (either *9A* or *PL*) and a G60 engine (*PG*) and was unable to do a write up.After a while I thought about it and did the research,spoke to the guys that did it and decided I will do a write up.The following are useful links you can use when doing the Build up or you can accomodate all the 16V G60 information into 1 thread like what we did with the *20V G60 thread.* 

*1.* *Bahn Brenner's* own build up process. 

*2.* *Kompressor Kanada* 

*3.* *OttawaG60's* own personal Yahoo group (you have to sign up) that has loads of information. 

*4.* *OR-Z Motorsport's* 

Well thats enough,onto the tech...wish me luck http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_ 
I have a PG G60 8V,How do I convert it to a 16V G60? 


_Quote, originally posted by *Not2Fast* »_ 

Taken from this site: 
*PG - 1.8 8V G60* : 
Compression Ratio = *8:1* 
Rod Length = 136mm 
Wrist Pin Diamater = 22mm 
Bore = 81mm 
*9A - 2.0 16V* : 
Compression Ratio = *10.8:1* 
Rod Length = 144mm 
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm 
Bore = 82.5mm 
*PL - 1.8 16V* : 
Compression Ratio = *10:1* 
Rod Length = 144mm 
Wrist Pin Diameter= 20mm 
Bore = 81mm 


According to the information posted above your going to have to get a set of custom pistons.Bahn Brenner sells a set of custom pistons for *$699.95US* 
 

Or you can contact Rodney Huss for your custom application. 
The reason you will need a custom set of Pistons is because placing a 16V head on an 8V Block lowers the CR approx 1.8 Points.Since the G60 engine is allready @ a CR of *8:1*then dropping that CR *1.8:1* points lower will bring it to about *6.2:1*,definitely too low for a *16V G60*. 
Now for the Conrods you can use your stock *PG G60* rods but it is recommended that you use *PL 16V* Rods + Custom Pistons due to the fact that your rod ratio using the PG rods will be too short. 
Now that the pistons and Rods are out of the way your going to need the obvious: 
*1.* 16V Head,Either 9A or PL.9A has bigger Intake Ports. 
*2.* 16V Lower Intake Manifold. 
*3.* 16V Scirocco Upper Intake Manifold (pictured below)- This enables you to relocate the Throttle Body from the passenger side of the engine bay (LHD) to the drivers side of the engine bay.You can then still use your stock G60 filter box. 
*4.* Distributor 
Now you have *2* options for the Distributor set-up. 

*1.* 

_Quote, originally posted by *Distributor In Head* »_ 

*1*.16V Distributor, complete 
*2*.16V Distributor Block off plate complete 
*3*.16V oil pump, complete 
*4*.16V Secondary shaft and gears complete 
*5*.16V Timing belt and gears, complete 
*6*.16V Exhaust Manifold or 16V Header 










*2.* 

_Quote, originally posted by *Distributor In Block i.e. Retaining the PG setup* »_ 

_*1. CAM GEAR:*_ 
16V Cam Gear 
Stock _20V/16V Cam_ Gear has_ *52 Teeth*_ 

_*2. CRANK GEAR:* _16v crank gear STOCK but an ABA crank pullye shaved 5.5mm with a new centering ring pressed in. Scirocco20v mods them for $10 if you supply it.or you can do it yourself. 
Stock _8V Crank_ Gear has *22 teeth* 
Stock _16V/20V Crank_ Gear has *26 teeth* 

_*3. INTERMEDIATE SHAFT GEAR:*_ 
Combination of a 16V Cam Gear and an 8V Intermediate shaft.dont mod the gear...Mod the keyway in the IM shaft to fit the gear. The 8v used a press in half mood key way and the 16v cam gear uses a molded in 1/4 moon. It wont fit unless a path is cut in the IM shaft to fit the key on the gear to. 
If Building *PG 16V *Combination - Use PG IM SHAFT 
If Building *ABA 16V* Combination - Use ABA IM SHAFT 

_*4. TIMINT BELT:*_ 
16V OEM Timing Belt 


Your Physical engine should be done @ this point. 


_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_ 
I have a 16V and I want to make it a 16V G60,what do I do? 

First the Compression Ratio of either the *9A* or *PL* needs to be decreased.As stated above the 9A and PL have a CR of 10.8:1 and 10:1 respectively so you can either machine/dish the pistons to lower the CR or get a set of custom 83mm units.Below is a picture courtesy of OttawaG60 showing machined *9A* units. 









Now that the internals are dealt with,your going to need quite a few parts off of a PG G60.John Doe...meet John Betz










_Quote, originally posted by *John BETZ* »_ 

G60 G-Lader Supercharger or BBM Screw Compressor Supercharger kit 
G60 G-Lader mounting brackets and belt tensioner complete 
G-Lader outlet (silencer box) or BBM RSR outlet kit 











_Quote, originally posted by *John BETZ* »_ 

G60 Serpentine / idler pulleys for water pump and alternator 
G60 AC pump or European water pump pulley 
G60 Throttle body, complete 

Coolant flange so that the outlet pipe does not hit the Charger. 








Throttle Body Adapter to enable clearance issues with Distributor in head.If you use the Distributor in the block setup.all you will need is a Peugeot distributor cap. 










_Quote, originally posted by *John BETZ* »_ 

G60 Fuel Injectors and FPR 
G60 Idle stabilizer valve (ISV) 
G60 Digifant1 ECU and engine wire harness 
G60 Digifant control relay 
G60 Oxygen sensor 
G60 Water temperature sensor (blue) 
G60 CO% potentiometer 
G60 Relays, fuel pump 
G60 Intercooler, IC hoses to and from the G-Lader 
G60 Lower water pump pipe 
Upper and lower coolant hoses 
G60 Radiator and fan assembly 


_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_ 
Ok,now that I have a 16V G60,what do I do for my intake? 
You have 3 Options: 
*1.*Scirocco 16V Upper Intake to place the TB On the drivers side. 








*2.* Audi S2 3B Intake Manifold chopped and modified to suit shown below. 








*3.* Modify your upper Intake manifold resemble what you see below


















_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_ 
I want to retain my AC,Do I have to relocate the Alternator? 
Yes,Lucky for you Bahn Brenner has an Alternator relocating kit. 
 


_Quote, originally posted by *John Doe* »_ 
What about tuning?Can I retain my Digi-I? 
Yes you can,*SNS Tuning* seems to be the most favourable choice when it comes to Digi-I Chip Tuning and they can make a chip application for your 16V G60. 
If you want to drift away from the whole distributor/chip set up then you can go with TEC3 from Bahn Brenner 







or Stage Ic from 034EFI 

Hopefully if everything works out as planned you should obtain this Courtesy of John Betz @ Bahn Brenner Motorsports 









This is the original from VW: 








And this is one in an engine bay 









Special thanks goes out to: 
OttawaG60,JBETZ and anyone else that allowed me to use pictures/info from there sites. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Please feel free to add any information possible as I am sure I left out of some. 



_Quote, originally posted by *Scott F. Williams* »_ 
Issam for VW Playa President! 









The information is all that counts


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## Chapel (Jun 23, 1999)

I've been using this: 
http://www.garyshood.com/htmltobb/ 

to fix the HTML issues the site has been seeing. It converts HTML to BBCode. 
pretty painless, just gotta check it afterwards


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## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

well got my 16v lysholm running today and drove it feels good to drive my raddo after driving a geo metro for the past month got some tweeking to do and i have to get it running on Megasquirt cause stock digi it runs like ****. hopefully tomorrow ill get it to start on MS then the fun of tunning starts.


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## PrimaVW (Dec 22, 2005)

I want to get this straight as I am doing a 16v swap in my Corrado and would love to retain the glader...

So far I am seeing a decent list of G60 items I must retain which luckily I have, so to make sure I'm on the same page...

-I need to dish the pistons to lower compression
-I do not plan on retaining the A/C so the alt will fit under the Glader?
-I have a Digifant, so will a bbm stage 4 chip work for the fueling issues, or do I need to get a CUSTOM chip from sns?
-What about belt sizes?


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## Crescent (Jan 2, 2004)

1


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## Crescent (Jan 2, 2004)

ozzman_g7 said:


> Hey John, I want to use a FMIC and I saw a guy from Canada running like this, is it safe?
> Or what other options do I have so I can run FMIC?
> 
> 
> ...


Thats my setup in my old Corrado...I have that engine in my new Corrado with a few changes and soon to have my RMR SRI on it.




BTW that setup is perfectly fine for the chargers placement...I have also decided to run this Lysholm self contained as per PSE advice instead of oil fed from the engine as my first Lysholm seized due to oil getting restricted through that ****ty pin hole of a feedline that comes with the BBM kit. Since PSE set me up I have now been runnin self -contained for over a year and I can actually touch my charger after a good drive and its not piping hot as it was when I chose to use the oil feedline. I sent my first charger to BBM and they could do nothin as they couldn't source new screws but were nice enough to send it for me to PSE after I contacted them to see if they had new screws in which they did and after lengthy talks with Edward at PSE he assured me this charger should be self contained...and all I can say is ever since I went self contained...its alot colder ...zero problems and I am not mixing dirty engine oil into my charger. I check my charger periodically for oil...never burns and is still crystal clear. I did a full flush as per PSE after 1 year and it was crystal clear as day 1.


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## PrimaVW (Dec 22, 2005)

Crescent said:


> - You need either get low compression pistons, low compression metal head gasket or double stack headgaskets.
> 
> - The alternator will fit under the G-ladder but modifications will need be done as its not a direct fit to where the AC compressor was. I personally have a 16v Lysholm so I had to opt for the ABA alternator which I located under the charger as its smaller then the G-60 one. I had to notch a 2"x1" section out of my subframe in order to attach the harness to the alternator. Keep in mind I run my Lysholm reversed so the outlet sits out front as I run a FMIC which in turn makes the charger sit another 2" lower....which i'm glad as I will be swapping my scirocco intake soon for my RMR SRI with a VR6 throttle body.
> 
> ...




-Ok being that I'm new to the 16v... are headstuds necessary to run a metal low compression head gasket or doublestack??
-Best way to mount the alternator?
-How do I convert the 16v to serpentine? Can I source pulleys from other vw's or do i need to buy a kit?
-What is the main problem with running single spray injectors? will the engine run lean?


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## Crescent (Jan 2, 2004)

PrimaVW said:


> -Ok being that I'm new to the 16v... are headstuds necessary to run a metal low compression head gasket or doublestack??
> -Best way to mount the alternator?
> -How do I convert the 16v to serpentine? Can I source pulleys from other vw's or do i need to buy a kit?
> -What is the main problem with running single spray injectors? will the engine run lean?




-Headstuds are 100% needed for forced inductionIMHO
-Best way to mount alternator is below the charger IMHO....I had the kit that mounted behind the head but there was way to much slack/belt travel from alternator to charger.
Contact Issam ant INA Engineering he has the serp conversion kit...its cheap and he can also fab up the charger bracket to hold the charger an alt where the AC compressor would go...yes you will lose AC by going under the charger...that is if you can't figure it out...its pretty damn easy if you have any skill at fabrication though and have access to a welder or someone who does.
-My engine never leaned out with single spray city driving but at high rpms it did. Single spray injectors just aren't big enough for the added boost levels...I guess it really depends on your boost levels...but most people run at least the ford green tops on charged 16v's


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## PrimaVW (Dec 22, 2005)

Crescent said:


> -Headstuds are 100% needed for forced inductionIMHO
> -Best way to mount alternator is below the charger IMHO....I had the kit that mounted behind the head but there was way to much slack/belt travel from alternator to charger.
> Contact Issam ant INA Engineering he has the serp conversion kit...its cheap and he can also fab up the charger bracket to hold the charger an alt where the AC compressor would go...yes you will lose AC by going under the charger...that is if you can't figure it out...its pretty damn easy if you have any skill at fabrication though and have access to a welder or someone who does.
> -My engine never leaned out with single spray city driving but at high rpms it did. Single spray injectors just aren't big enough for the added boost levels...I guess it really depends on your boost levels...but most people run at least the ford green tops on charged 16v's


 -So you are saying I can't use the stock G60 serp setup on the 16v? 
-Ok, I have the access to a welder. So just to double check this, I will be using a MK3 alt under the charger... this will NOT mount up into the AC bracket? 
-The boost level I will be running is 10 psi... ok for g60 injectors?


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## Crescent (Jan 2, 2004)

PrimaVW said:


> -So you are saying I can't use the stock G60 serp setup on the 16v?
> -Ok, I have the access to a welder. So just to double check this, I will be using a MK3 alt under the charger... this will NOT mount up into the AC bracket?
> -The boost level I will be running is 10 psi... ok for g60 injectors?


 
-No u need a 16v serp crank pulley from either BBM or INA (1.8t pulley with 6mm spacer) he has a kit which also includes the serp alternator pulley and water pump pulley. You can just run v-belt on water pump and power steering and just use serp on crank, charger and alternator...alternator pulley will be the same. 
- The alternator will not bolt up you just need modify the lower bracket..basically an extra tube welded on to mount the lower part of the alternator....very easy..when you mock up your alternator on the bracket below the charger you will see you can use the top mount but the bottom needs to come out more. more or less a 10 min project with a welder. 
-You can use stock G60 injectors..you might just lean out as the stock G60 injectors are single spray. This is where an A/F gauge is required. 


You also need a front coolant flange for the 16v that exits to the right (when looking at it from the front) as the stock flange will hit the charger...BBM sell this ..u also need another flange adapter for the for the side of the 16v head in order for the sensors to clear the throttle body...again another BBM product.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Found some info concerning the CS130 alternator (for mounting under the charger) 
First, credit where it's due: http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=32680&start=25 

Info: 

If we break down the code "DLG1395-6-11" The "5" is the bracket flange attachments. The "6" is the groove count of the pulley. The "11" is the phasing of the back cover. You can always remove the three bolts and rotate the rear body if you have to!!!! 

DLG1352-6-7 DLG1395-6-11 Autozone 
P79367,P7868-6-11 Advanceautoparts 

Used On: 
1989-1993 Buick Century With 3.3L Engine 
1985-1997 OLDSMOBILE FIRENZA With A/C Engine: L4 2.0 Liter FI Prt#P7868-6-11 
1990 pickup or van with 7.4L 
BUICK CENTURY 89 3.3L(204) V6 All 
BUICK CENTURY 91-90 3.3L(204) V6 All 
BUICK CENTURY 92 3.3L(204) V6 1st Prod 
OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS CIERA 89 3.3L(204) V6 All 
OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS CIERA 90 3.3L(204) V6 From Mid 1990 
OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS CIERA 90 3.3L(204) V6 To Mid 1990 
OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS CIERA 91 3.3L(204) V6 All 
REPLACES THESE ORIGINAL NUMBERS: 

AC DELCO 334-2325, 334-2325, 334-2369, 334-2418 
DELCO 10463117, 1101475, 1101608, 321-408, 10463177, 10463208, 10479898, 10479937, 10479938, 321-408, 321-469, 321-499 
DELPHI RM1011 

A stock GM CS130 ) (1990's) will produce between 50 to 60 amps at an idle.Need to be revved up to 2000rpm to get it to turn on 14-16volts. 

All CS130 Alternators are 105AMP 
All CS144 Alternators are 140AMP Cadillac Deville,Eldorado,Seville With 4.9L 

$100.00 + @ your local parts store, what i paid $15 @ pullapart and had it tested works 100% i'm goingback to get another 1 an rebuild it so i can have a spare or drop da 140 Amp kit in bigger stator is required from an cs144 $35.00 to rebuild. 

"How to Determine Ratio and Rotor Speed" 

The alternator rotor RPM is not necessarily the same as engine RPM. To calculate the actual alternator RPM, determine the ratio between the two pulley diameters. 

Ratio = Crankshaft Pulley Diameter/ Alternator Pulley Diameter 

Now that we know the ratio, we can now determine the rotor speed: 

Rotor RPM = Pulley Ratio x Engine Speed (example; 2.1 x 870 = 1827 Rotor RPM) 

Tech Tip: Generally, the alternator should be 1:1 with the motor for circle track racing. For drag racing, the alternator should be overdriven by a ratio of 1.75:1 or more. This will allow charging on the return slip and in staging. For street use, we recommend 3:1. 

Also: 

The CS130 / CS144 Alternators 
In 1986 GM introduced the completely new, 105-amp, CS130 Delcotron alternator (CS130 = Charging System with 130 mm diameter stator) because the SI series alternators could not keep up with the increased electrical demand and because overdrive transmissions were lowering engine and alternator rpms. The CS130 weighs less, is smaller in diameter but uses the same 6.6" mounting-hole, center-to-center distance, uses less internal parts, has a better voltage regulator system, has increased durability and is less noisy (audibly and electrically) than the SI alternator it replaced. 

There is also a 120-amp, CS144 version if you need more output because you're running large amounts of electrical equipment in your vehicle such as high-powered stereos. 

Typical CS Sources 

Delco CS130 Series (100-105 Amp /Single V groove pully) Delco 1101229, 1101275, 1101292 / Lester 7808, 7888 used on 88-90 5.0L Buick Estate Wagon, Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham (RWD), Chevrolet Caprice, Oldsmobile Custom Cruiser and Pontiac Safari. 
Delco CS144 Series (140 Amp/6-Groove Pulley) Delco 10479891, 10480201 / Lester 8112 used on 93-96 5.7L Buick Roadmaster, Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham (RWD), Chevrolet Caprice and Chevrolet Impala 5.7L 
The 105 amp version size is close to typical SI alternator. So you can use the original brackets. Typical SI alternator is only 63 amps and at higher RPM's than what the CS's need. In other words, at idle, the CS is putting out, where as the SI is just spinning. 

The 105 amp CS130 alternator is on late-80's GM truck or full size car with mounting ears that are 180-deg apart. Most will come with a serpentine belt pulley so you will have to change over your pulley if you are still using a V-belt. 

The flange for the tensioning bolt and the alternator bracket are tapped for metric bolts so you will need to get 8 x 1.25mm bolts. The alternator bracket may need to be modified and you will probably need a couple of washers to take up the space between the alternator bracket and the new alternator. 

Most of the connectors for the CS alternators are four wire but will only use two of them and the wiring is the same as the SI. 

CS series wiring pin-out: 

S = Heavy gauge wire to the battery supply usually red (loop back to post on back of alternator). 
F = small gauge brown wire - not used. 
L = Small gauge brown/red wire - comes from the dash light and energizes the alternator. 
P = Smal gauge brown/white wire - not used. 

CS Install Note: The switched 'light' (terminal 1 on SI or 'L' on CS), must have 12V switched power with between 35 and 350 ohm resistance (typically the light itself). If below 35 ohm, the CS units will not work. That resistance is normally the bulb! If you try to be "custom" and use a LED, there isn't the correct resistance and the alternator will not work correctly! You can't just by-pass the light! You may need to add a resistor to this lead. Some documentation suggests that a switched power source can be connected to the 'F' terminal instead, where there is supposed to be an internal resistor.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Solution for the pesky booster in the Corrado 
Courtesty of http://www.longstreet-engineering.com/


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## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

still_a_G said:


> Solution for the pesky booster in the Corrado
> Courtesty of http://www.longstreet-engineering.com/


 What Dizzy is being run here? No need for elbow or lower-to-upper spacer.


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## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

need to bookmark for my project


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## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

> BTW that setup is perfectly fine for the chargers placement...I have also decided to run this Lysholm self contained as per PSE advice instead of oil fed from the engine as my first Lysholm seized due to oil getting restricted through that ****ty pin hole of a feedline that comes with the BBM kit. Since PSE set me up I have now been runnin self -contained for over a year and I can actually touch my charger after a good drive and its not piping hot as it was when I chose to use the oil feedline. I sent my first charger to BBM and they could do nothin as they couldn't source new screws but were nice enough to send it for me to PSE after I contacted them to see if they had new screws in which they did and after lengthy talks with Edward at PSE he assured me this charger should be self contained...and all I can say is ever since I went self contained...its alot colder ...zero problems and I am not mixing dirty engine oil into my charger. I check my charger periodically for oil...never burns and is still crystal clear. I did a full flush as per PSE after 1 year and it was crystal clear as day 1.


How about some more info on the self contained setup it sounds pretty sweet. maybe some pics?


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Hemingway'sToe said:


> What Dizzy is being run here? No need for elbow or lower-to-upper spacer.


He's just got the bypass actuator modified, looks flipped. Probably the most simple solution actually. :thumbup: Just gotta make sure it works as intended.


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## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

well im sorry to say i am leaving the 16v g60 (well i had a lysholm) but its time for big hp so turbo time. lysholm stuff is for sale. and dibs will go out to you guys. for all your help. i have everypart youl need to swap the lysholm to your car and some extras 16v g60 stuff i will not need now that im going turbo.

was a g60 setup after i blew the pg motor i had it on a 2L 16V total has maybe 18000miles. was run with the 63mm pully most its life and a 53mm for the past 6000miles. no problems ever its always had royal purple in it. ill get pics this week. it will stay on my car untill its sold. resson is its getting old and cant make enough power. time for BIG HP so turbo time. 


charger
53mm 18+psi ,63mm 12+psi pulleys
g60 oil return line
all mounting bolts
oil feed line
i got more stuff let me know your set up and ill try and make as complet bolt on as possible

start at say $2000

will trade for 16v turbo stuff, manifold, wastegate, DP, turbos(must be good and large) air-water 
intercooler, 


i have some cool custom parts i made for this setup that i will sell with it if yall want them including a amazing tensoner setup. glader braket and under charger alt mounting. so other goodies i cant remember right now.


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## drew3164 (May 27, 2007)

*Valve cover over flowing with oil*

OK so i have done the conversion last year and now have e-manage and a msd box running the car. The one thing that I'm still having problems with is that at high rpm the oil is filling up the valve cover and filling up my oil cache can. I'm thinking of taping a hole in the valve cover and run down to the oil pane. Do I have to do this or is there something I'm missing ????:banghead:



Thanks


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

i run a valve cover breather tube with a "t" into the breather tube off the front of the block into a catch can that drains to the pan.


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## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

*A little help needed*

I found him.

Don't know if anyone can help me out or not. I had been sending IMs with a guy down in Georgia(I think) who had a low compression 16V for sale. I actually think that he was talking "turbo" rather than G60. The engine had not been assembled but he had a machined block and head. Head work was done by a shop in Atlanta, I think. Thread was like two years old and a couple of pages long. I know that there were posts this year. Lost track with the change over and I can't come up with the right search terms. If anyone remembers this thread and knows the actual title, the poster's username or actual name please let me know by posting here, sending an IM, at [email protected] or 510 375 2071. Thanks a lot.


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## pickardaudi (Jun 2, 2005)

*Selling a 034 Motorsport ECU in the corrado parts area*

Hey guys I sold my 16VG60 the other day and took off all the 034 motorsport stuff. Check out the ad in Corrado parts area. Selling it pretty reasonable. Here is the thread : http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...ies-for-your-16VG60-20VG60-G60-or-Turbo-C-car
Brent


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## Keppel (Oct 26, 2004)

JBETZ said:


> i run a valve cover breather tube with a "t" into the breather tube off the front of the block into a catch can that drains to the pan.



any pics of this setup?

interested in the valve cover end of the setup


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## Autounion_77 (May 8, 2008)

Great thread! Tons of info, so much in fact that I'm getting lost. I have some questions, but first I'll explain my intentions.

I'm trying to put together a toy for me and the fam to bring to the drag strip or to scca for fun.

what I already have:

1 complete PL from a scirocco
1 complete PG from a coraddo (KK stage 4 built + full porting, BBM Stage 4 kit)
2 complete ABA's (one from a '94, one from a '95)

I know the norm is to swap a 16v head onto a PG block. Now my father and I do have experience with costom fab, so I was thinking of adapting the the charger/AC/power steering bracket to bolt on the front of an ABA block with a 16v head on it. What management should be run? For innercooling I'd like to keep piping lengths down, but still have high efficiency. Would a Frozenboost AWIC be worth it, or should I just stick with the stock IC? What is a good cam setup for this? The crank will be balanced, and the whole bottom end will be blueprinted/balanced, so would a LW flywheel be overkill? How necessary are windage trays? Should I run an 020 or an 02a? This will all be in a MkI GTI, Is there such a think as tri-y header for a ABA 16v for a MkI? Any other advice or ideas?

Thanks guys!

P.S. I know turbo charging the PL would be just as fast with less work, but this project is also for the sake of me and my dad trying to see if we can pull off doing some more serious and complicated fab/ racing work (we might be opening a small euro speed shop sometime soon).


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

does anybody have the alternator behind the head bracket for sale ?
i searched but i figured i'd ask here too 

edit: i've got a scirocco so it has to go there i think


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## ewillard (Apr 21, 2007)

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/products/2530/G60_16v_Ltd_Rear_Alternator_Relocation_Brackets


here you go


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

i didn't see any centrifugal setups & now i'm thinking something like this for the alt:


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## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

*that's my old passat wagon ^^^^*

i ran the alternator that way for years without any problems. if you don't have good block ventilation you get problems with oil pooling in the valvetrain though. i welded a fitting onto the tail bracket of the supercharger after this photo was taken and the problem was gone. it's funny to see pics of that car still circulating sooo long after it was built and dismantled!!!


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

TehLonz said:


> all i have


 
Where can I get that exhaust manifold heat shield?


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## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

*boost bypass valve*

im using a modified rs2 intake manifold and throttle body and having a hard time figuring out what to do about boost bypasswhen running 13-16 psi. any suggestions? would a vortech valve work? i dont really want to rig g60 t-bodies. any help is greatly appreciated


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## toplessvw (Jul 31, 2003)

I am having issues locating any of the recommended manifolds for this conversion and I have a short runner I could use but have not really seen any short runner set ups in the thread any insite on this


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

works, 1 lb & the belt is 3' shorter
359 :screwy:












the 2.75" pulley i replaced the mk3 1.75" pulley with










more


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## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

> im using a modified rs2 intake manifold and throttle body and having a hard time figuring out what to do about boost bypasswhen running 13-16 psi. any suggestions? would a vortech valve work? i dont really want to rig g60 t-bodies. any help is greatly appreciated


nobody?


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

it kind of depends on your engine management, the recirc air has to remain in the system or it may not meter correctly, all behind the CO pot

also i'd be concerned with part throttle driveability issues with the BOV action not being stepless blend with the TB, maybe somebody else has actual exp

i've prev used the g60 TB with my ghetto CIS setup as metered air was critical, but i've never used digi 1


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## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

> it kind of depends on your engine management, the recirc air has to remain in the system or it may not meter correctly, all behind the CO pot
> 
> also i'd be concerned with part throttle driveability issues with the BOV action not being stepless blend with the TB, maybe somebody else has actual exp
> 
> i've prev used the g60 TB with my ghetto CIS setup as metered air was critical, but i've never used digi 1


im running sns em-4-e. i was thinking a bov could create the issue with the lack of variable reciculation dependent on throttle postion. Is a diverter valve any different than a bov?


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## Chapel (Jun 23, 1999)

JBETZ said:


> _Quote, originally posted by *sdezego* »_How is the run on those displacers coming?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


wtf... now when you blow your g-lader, it comes with fireworks


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

ryanarchy said:


> im running sns em-4-e. i was thinking a bov could create the issue with the lack of variable reciculation dependent on throttle postion. Is a diverter valve any different than a bov?


g60 being roots/direct displacement blower, i'd make sure it has adequate recirc flow properties

i'd be concerned with it continuously pumping through a restriction smaller than oe, in part throttle recirc conditions 

a centrifugal can hang out in the surge line & not have any bov/recirc @ all


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## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

what boost is expected with 68mm pulley, 2.5" boost tubes and FMIC. 
I hit 7 PSI but ive never had a g60 in anything else so idk if that is good or not.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

LO-vw said:


> what boost is expected with 68mm pulley, 2.5" boost tubes and FMIC.
> I hit 7 PSI but ive never had a g60 in anything else so idk if that is good or not.


I thought more like 10 psi with a 68mm pulley.


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## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

EL DRIFTO said:


> g60 being roots/direct displacement blower, i'd make sure it has adequate recirc flow properties
> 
> i'd be concerned with it continuously pumping through a restriction smaller than oe, in part throttle recirc conditions
> 
> a centrifugal can hang out in the surge line & not have any bov/recirc @ all


 what do you mean by "a centrifugal can hang out in the surge line & not have any bov/recirc @ all"? I was thinking a vortech recirc valve could work as they are desinged for suerchargered application. anybody run into this issue? i really dont want to ruin something because of something stupid. maybe get a forge valve a couple different psi springs to be progressive, cut them down to the length of a standard one and run that?


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

here's a pic of one that looks like same size as oe, (i compared mine to my g60 TB)

pm me if you interested in it


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## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

I just went though sizing a bov for my setup. 

1-Forge DV 1" opening= WAY TOO SMALL
2-Greddy type RZ 40mm opening (single spring mod)= eh still on the small side but could work with stock pulley. 
3-Greddy type R 47mm opening (modded with RS or RZ spring)= Perfect!

Here is a link with my discussions 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4996657-What-type-of-Dump-valve-DV-BOV-should-I-use

its not like the type R is only 7mm bigger its the way it opens and flows all the air out of it.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

EL DRIFTO said:


> here's a pic of one that looks like same size as oe, (i compared mine to my g60 TB)
> 
> pm me if you interested in it


Is that variable flow based on vacuum? That'd be sweet. I'd like to get rid of the stock bypass, it was designed to restrict flow. On a daily driver this is good, as you can operate with more vacuum but this is not good under boost. If you look at it, at part throttle, VW had all the flow going to the bypass. This is why there is a wedge on the smaller butterfly. The charger was simply putting too much air into the intake at part throttle....bad for economy.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

el drifto said:


> here's a pic of one that looks like same size as oe, (i compared mine to my g60 tb)
> 
> pm me if you interested in it


 oe g60?


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## meanvw (Jan 1, 2005)

Issam Abed said:


> oe g60?


 
http://www.procharger.com/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=20


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

Issam Abed said:


> oe g60?


 no, it doesn't open until there's plenty of vacuum

the oe g60 TB doesn't close until it's WOT

on second thought, i wouldn't try this if i had g60


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## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

my next idea is to use a single motorcyle/jetski carbuerator on a cable connected to the throttle cable that opens and closes as the stock g60 bypass would. i just have to flip the spring on the carb to be open when then the trhottle body is closed and close the carb butterfly as the t-body opens. i think this might be the way to get a bypass to work oe style. any other ideas or comments would be greatly appreciated:thumbup:


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

i think that's a great idea, it's just linear movement of another ID sized TB butterfly :thumbup:


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## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

Issam Abed said:


> Jerome seen this before?



does anyone have any more pics and details on this?


thanks


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## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

35i 2000 said:


> does anyone have any more pics and details on this?
> 
> 
> thanks


 thats a modified audi rs2 intake manifold with a g60 t-body flange welded on. good luck finding that. i stumbled across one and snatched it up. although mine has a rs2 t-body thats like a vr6 t-body(single butterfly) the pulley system is from ina? cogged belt setup. the fuel rail is a modified 1.8t. the alt is factory g60. as far as the headers go, looks like a custom equal runner. im using a bbm alt relocation bracket. for the right price i can fab one up out of steel for you


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## ryanarchy (Nov 27, 2008)

what kind of spark plugs work best for a 16v g60?


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## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

I was running NGK BKR6EIX-11 with no problem. 
Then i did some head work and a cam and started to see some knocking so I JUST put some NGK (6988) BKR7EIX-11 (one heat range cooler) in there. 

Going to go drive it here in like an hour. 

people say the 1.8t plugs work fine in here too.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Here's my belt routing. When the engine is done I will do a build thread. The tensioner is from a 98 Escort. Of course the question is will the spring rate be enough to keep enough tension on the charger. I'll measure what it is and determine what the design load is when that time comes. I'm just keeping my fingers crossed for now. Alignment is damn near perfect, btw. Oh, that's a CS130 alternator. I'll provide bracket details when done. It appears to protrude less than the ABA so it shouldn't t rub the radiator.

I'd just like to note that when doing your routing, typical practice is to achieve 180 degrees of belt wrap, no more, no less. And the correct amount of tension is the value that provides enough tension to keep the belt from slipping at max operating temperature and load. No more, no less. 

Escort routing:


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> Of course the question is will the spring rate be enough to keep enough tension on the charger.


 It will but the issue is your power steering and water pump.


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## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

how is it mounted and adjusted?


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Issam Abed said:


> It will but the issue is your power steering and water pump.



Why's that? There's no interference between the v-belt and the serp belt.

Reference:


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

LO-vw said:


> how is it mounted and adjusted?



First, I have to determine what the rotational deflection is per X amount of tension. Then I will constrain the mounting location. After it is mounted, there is no adjustment, just spring loading. Like I said before, when loaded the goal is to have 180 degrees of belt wrap and an adequate amount of tension. 

After I determine final mounting location I will simply have to drill 2 holes in the G60 bracket. In those 2 holes I will affix 2 large bolts. The bolts will each have one hole drilled into the head. In those two holes I will insert the tensioner:











I should also note that I had to drill out the I.D. of the tensioner a bit to get it to slide on. But this OEM style has plenty of meat in that location.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

damn
I was hoping to see it all on 1 belt.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Issam Abed said:


> damn
> I was hoping to see it all on 1 belt.


Technically, it would be better to have the charger on its own belt and to have the alternator, water pump and PS pump on their own belt. Not worth the effort here though. 

The charger takes like 25 HP to spin at full load, IIRC. The other loads are more like 3-5 hp each. Having them on their own belt would make pulley to pulley tension equal and lower, which is better design. Better for bearing and belt life.

It's funny how some people wrap a lot of belt around the alternator like it's a major load.


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

they can all easily take the load of whatever a 6rib can put out, no big deal

i got mine running & one thing about mine, is the front crank bolt came loose on the PO & the front of the crank is ruined & the serpentine crank drive warbles around, off axis & the serpentine lines go side to side

so then my spring tensioner had to go & i also found that running the SC 1 rib closer to the engine keeps enough of an angle to keep it all together

i'm getting ~8psi @ 7000 too & a 5 rib no tensioner is holding it all together so far so~15hp


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## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

lennart said:


> Hey guys!
> It's been a while since I've posted some work over here. I wanted to share this shoot I did for Golf+ Magazine.
> It's a 1983 mk1 with a mk2 Limited 16vG60 engine. WRD Mesh wheels, awesome Recaro interior and Audi TT paint.
> Well.. pics! Let me know what you think!
> ...


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## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

ryanarchy said:


> the pulley system is from ina? cogged belt setup. the alt is factory g60.


the pulley system is from INA, can you explain further


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## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*Me too....*



InSaneV said:


> Anyone had experiance with standard 10.8:1 comp ( 9a 2.0L 16V ) and a bigger pulley set up ie. 78MM? I have seen one mention of it from a european 16vg60 site ( that i could understand ) that did this with great success. Basically keeping all the NA hp with a mild 4-6 lbs of boost putting out the 200ish+ hp still ( im sure with cams etc. ).



Funny I have the exact same setup and have been asking myself the same question(s). The upside to leaving the stock comp ratio might be more low torque with the downside definitely being a narrow margin for detonation (error!!!) Haha. 

In this case I figured an efficient FMIC and possibly a thermosatat controlled external oil cooler to help keep those piston crowns cool might do the job. At least when atmospheric conditions were ok.

On the other hand, because we are losing boost pressure and possibly volumetric efficiency with this specific 9A G60 16v setup, a slightly larger (lower compression) combustion chamber would draw in more charged air, have a wider margin for detonation to possibly occur, and enable us to keep the stock oil cooler/heat exchanger that even 300 hp 1.8t's use in the stock location..

I have boosted my compression on my stock 8v G-60 up to 190 psi (about 9.5/1 comp ratio) and left the charger pulley stock. I got great mileage out of my charger and with a couple other tricks kept the charge air cool with stock oil/water heat exchanger and stock intercooler in stock location. And I live in hawaii where it is constant 80 degrees. That setup yanked but I might have missed the sweet spot??? I just know it ran flawlessly and was really quick.

It's all about the volumetric efficiency which is what we are all trying to dial in here...

Let me know what you come up with.

Where's the euro sites you got the info from?


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

kainosun, I totally agree about running a higher compression ratio with the low boost G60. I mean, people turbo their 16V's all the time at 9.0:1 ratio and that's got to run much hotter and with higher flow. I think it's a better idea to use the stock pulley and be able to rev it up. That's my plan anyways. We'll see how it goes. I'm starting a build thread here: 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5066014-Slow-but-hopefully-trusty-16Vg60-build


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## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*yeah*



still_a_G said:


> kainosun, I totally agree about running a higher compression ratio with the low boost G60. I mean, people turbo their 16V's all the time at 9.0:1 ratio and that's got to run much hotter and with higher flow. I think it's a better idea to use the stock pulley and be able to rev it up. That's my plan anyways. We'll see how it goes. I'm starting a build thread here:
> http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5066014-Slow-but-hopefully-trusty-16Vg60-build


 Yeah G!! The new Scirocco 2.0 TFSI has more than 9/1 compression ratio so it is possible. What I specifically want to know is if the horsepower used to turn a 78mm pulley G-60 blower will be offset by only getting like 6 or 7 psi of boost?? The G-60 takes around 15 horsies so if the net result is greater...I guess we will have to see. Basically keeping the charge air as cool as possible will allow the greater squish/higher compression in the cylinder. So thats why I'm thinking a good FMIC and oil cooler would really help widen out that margin of error.. I also know some other cooling tricks I learned along the way. 

Stoked to hear your input and see your build by the way! Thanks. J


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## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*oops....*

Meant to say the new TFSI has over 10/1 compression ratio. Its 10.3 to 1 to be exact.


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## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

im at 9.1 with a 68mm pulley...


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> It's funny how some people wrap a lot of belt around the alternator like it's a major load.


 LOL 
Looks like someone knows whats up  
I did a belt system that ran the supercharger on 1 belt but it was cogged.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

35i 2000 said:


> the pulley system is from INA, can you explain further


 Email me 
if I could get 10 people on board i can make cogged set ups for them


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Hey so what's the size of the freeze plug to plug up the breather box hole?


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

LoVWely...


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## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

kainoasun said:


> Funny I have the exact same setup and have been asking myself the same question(s). The upside to leaving the stock comp ratio might be more low torque with the downside definitely being a narrow margin for detonation (error!!!) Haha.
> 
> In this case I figured an efficient FMIC and possibly a thermosatat controlled external oil cooler to help keep those piston crowns cool might do the job. At least when atmospheric conditions were ok.
> 
> ...


Sorry been very busy with work.....least I know im not a complete nut in thinking this route  can not find a site per say but a name associated to the person that built it... Jarome Dik. Tried to google his name and 16vg60's but really havent fond anything that givesn me spec's on his build. I imagine it was done so long ago like many sites it has been removed/deleted.  

As you have stated I do believe a stock or 9.8:1 compression could work fine using 90% motor and 10% charger type idea making sure cooling is taken care of. I believe attitude will play a part in it too, as I have seen comments made about higher altitudes being able to run higher compression. though Jarome Dik's build was in Holland which is for the most part under the sea level


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

^^man that's a nice car :beer:



probably every car here has a knock sensor one way or another which means some will pull timing globally & some per cylinder, safely
i sure in the heck wouldn't lower my compression on something i wanted to make faster with a little sc
the higher the better & you probably won't hear otherwise
i'd be more interested in the na max torque timing with any boost
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5014440-mk3-on-E85

run a colder thermostat (71c)
colder plugs
a bit more e85
a bit of xylene if it needs it
seen 240+ out of compression tester with boost/race gas sc16v

had a car 15# on 11.5, 1/4 xylene, seamless powerband, probably pulled all 12 degrees by redline everytime

g60 16v is great idea, now don't mess it up by lowering the compression or ignoring how to tune all that vw goodness


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## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

still_a_G 
Hey so what's the size of the freeze plug to plug up the breather box hole? 

isnt it just like the others?

http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volkswagen/Passat/Engine/299/1


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

I dunno. I got one from the dealer and it was 37mm, that was way too big. So I measured the hole and it appears to be 35mm. I called Advance Auto and they listed it as 35mm. The link you sent me says 36mm. If the one from Advance doesn't work I'll order the 36 and report back.


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## EL DRIFTO (Jul 11, 2004)

it measured 1 3/8" for me 1.375"

also on my compression rant, i thought there was a post somewhere earlier in this thread about someone wishing they hadn't lowered their compression @ all

& more valve overlap will need more compression


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## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

hey guys i didn't see any good recommendations on whats a good return line would be when using a 9A 2.0L 16v block (with a G60 ofcourse)?

do you guys recommend i tap the front of the pan or the rear of the pan?

does anyone here recommend any other return line other then the stock G60 return line?

what size bung do you guys recommend i weld on the oil pan? (obviously the bung will go above the oil level, near the top of the oil pan so that the oil can easily return to the pan without any back pressure)


thank you for all the help


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

35i 2000 said:


> do you guys recommend i tap the front of the pan or the rear of the pan?


 Why would you tap the rear of the pan?


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

I just made a hole thru the threaded hole on the front of the block, it's in the same position as on the G60 block. I'm sure it's been mentioned at least a couple times in this discussion. Thread size is the same that the stock return line fitting uses so just be sure to not go any bigger than necessary. I used a tap and WD-40 to clean out the hole after drilling thru.


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## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

I will also be drilling that spot as from reading many threads on it thats the best spot .

I did remember someone posting about not wishing he dropped his compression on his build after it was done and said as well, thats what got me exploring the possibility of running a reg / close too comp. set up . From countless people who have done this set up with a g60 and dropped compression there getting 6-9psi at best, which to me seems like you should be able to maybe drop comp 1 point only at max and using more motor. Again nothing for sure no numbers that I have been able to find yet to prove the idea is practical. I have 2 9a's so i might be willing to try it out 

My thoughts on the motor would to be get it cleaned, refreshed and balanced. Then use either the AT cams or the dual exhaust cams, I'll prob drop the comp by 1 point using a aba gasket and use arp hardware to keep it together. The rest basically is the same, done a million times before with a FMIC and see what happens :beer:


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

EL DRIFTO said:


> it measured 1 3/8" for me 1.375"


 Yeah, so in regards to that hole, I am pretty sure that it is a 35mm or 1.378". 

It looks like the only place to get a copper plug without buying a block-off (I'm sure some vendors may be willing to part with just the plug) is to buy Dorman part #02523. It is a 35.21mm plug. At this dimension, it provides .008" oversize, which is just about right for an interference force fit. I'll be ordering one of those from somewhere. 

So Napa, Advance and Autozone can't get a 35mm plug in stores but Advance online can ship it to you. I got one and popped it in. Works perfect.


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## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

Anyone know of the top of there head what the ID of the alt. mounting bracket tube is? The part that the alt. bolt goes thru to attach it to the bracket. mines burried for winter atm and I can't seem to find a mention of this.


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## toplessvw (Jul 31, 2003)

does anyone have decent pics of how they mounted the stock G60 alternator under the charger. And what mods were done to the bracket. I have tried searching but most of the pics are dead. Any help iss appriciated


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

toplessvw said:


> does anyone have decent pics of how they mounted the stock G60 alternator under the charger. And what mods were done to the bracket. I have tried searching but most of the pics are dead. Any help iss appriciated


 stock G60 alt won't work. it is waaaay too big. get an ABA/VR6 one...


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## meanvw (Jan 1, 2005)

toplessvw said:


> does anyone have decent pics of how they mounted the stock G60 alternator under the charger. And what mods were done to the bracket. I have tried searching but most of the pics are dead. Any help iss appriciated


 http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4157368-Meanvw-16V-G60-Winter-project-V2.0 

Look at page 4


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## 2OVT (Sep 11, 2009)

will a 9A head fit on a ABA bottom end?


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## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

*9a lysholm bracket?*

what are you guys using as a tail bracket when running a lysholm on a 9A block?


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

92VW said:


> what are you guys using as a tail bracket when running a lysholm on a 9A block?


If you are running the BBM G60 kit with the G60 mounting bracket and the molded intake duct that puts the filter on the passenger side... US cars, you do not need any tail bracket.

If you hang more weight with a custom intake that takes off to the driver direction or a custom liquid air IC, you will need more tail support.

Be sure to run at least two tubes and three bump hoses from the outlet side of the compressor to you inter-cooler.
If you are running a liquid air be sure that the cooling core is fastened to the engine and moves with the engine. If it is hooked to the uni-body this can cause issues as the engine moves and the body does not. 

Now if you are running a silencer package like our old discontinued set up you will need a tail bracket. The silencer configuration puts the t-body and air intake at the inlet side of the compressor and going in the driver side direction

One slick way to set up a tail bracket is to use two adjustable rod end links. One can go to the engine and one going down, this will triangulate the tail end and support in nicely. Drill and tap the inlet plate for one link end and you can get creative on how to get the other end to the engine. I've seen one guy hook the engine end to our billet breather plate.

The main thing when you do any type of tail bracket, home built or the one that we made with our silencer package. Be sure that when you tighten the bracket it is not pushing pulling or distorting the compressor. Hope this helps.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

2OVT said:


> will a 9A head fit on a ABA bottom end?


Yes:thumbup:


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## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

thanks JBETZ. tons of help. ever gonna make another silencer kit?


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

92VW said:


> thanks JBETZ. tons of help. ever gonna make another silencer kit?


Nope, however I think we have two that are left over and for sale.
One is the original prototype... billet tig welded beaded ends all aluminum tubing, very nice.
Feel free to email me if interested [email protected]


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## 92VW (Nov 25, 2005)

> Nope, however I think we have two that are left over and for sale.
> One is the original prototype... billet tig welded beaded ends all aluminum tubing, very nice.
> Feel free to email me if interested [email protected]


you have email.


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## CORRADOABFG60 (Feb 18, 2011)

*Abf g60*

Hi. I am new to this forum. This thread forged me to do my corrado 16vg60. I started my project on december. I will make a list with the mods and I will post some photos. I want to ask some things for my project but I will do it later. Please correct me if I do any mistake in the future. Just wanted to say hi and thanks for this usefull thread.


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## kainoasun (Jan 27, 2005)

*Good stuff/Thanks JB!!*

Wow this thread has got to be one of the best on the Tex. Hope this post is not too long or boring

On the topic of compression; when the knock sensing systems came out VW claimed they could handle up to 12/1 compression ratio. 

Anyone know if there is a chart relating boost to static compression ratios? Isnt boost just a variable compression ratio?

Anyway, 8 psi seems to the max threshold of boost for a stock, non intercooled engine. Not sure what 8 psi translates into static compression or if that is close to 12/1. But what I do know is that when I took 50 thousandths off of a 10/1 engine compression GTI head, that we ended up with 225 to 235 psi in all cylinders. I assumed 225 in each cylinder was around 11.5/1 comp ratio. I ran that engine on super unleaded with a Rocco 16v brain and knock sensing system, external oil cooler, adjustable cam sprocket, and never heard a knock. In fact it could have used more timing advance than the 16v brain allowed, but it never knocked. Not on the hottest day. Only time I did hear a slight knock was when my girl put crappy costco gas in it so beware.

Then the G-60 arrived. It's 8 valve compression was upped to 190-195 psi, adjustable cam sprocket, 180 degree fan switch and thermostat, stock 78mm pulley, and some basic but VERY effective intercooler system tweaks. That engine yanked hard and both charger and engine are still in great shape. I remember racing an RX-7 to the top of this ten mile long crazy hill and at the top I rested my hand on the intake manifold and it was lukewarm..not even close to hot! With a stock G60 intercooler.... If anyone like me does not want or cant afford an FMIC, I have some awesome tips for maximizing the stock G60 IC system.

My present setup is a 9a (2.0 16v) with 200 psi in each cylinder which I believe is real close to the factory 10.8/1 compression ratio. Herby53 said in another thread that the stock 78mm pulley on a 9a will produce less than 8 psi. Stock 1.8t's produce around 8 psi with a 9.5/1 ratio in the real world of bad gas, jiffy lubes and teenage drivers... Haha. And the 1.8t intercooler is very similar to the stock G60 unit.

So this all leads me to think that a stock 9a with 6-8 psi (stock pulley) using only supreme fuel with low temp switch, thermostat and properly intercooled is more than doable. Only mods will be ARP head studs and an upgraded standard headgasket. I still will worry about the stock pistons but according to some they are good up to 16 psi.

To get accurate data I'm using an intake charge pyrometer and wideband A/F guage and maybe an exhaust temp guage. There is a road that goes from sea level to 14,000 feet to test effects of altitude using a digital altimeter. Once this engine is tested the plan is to then replace the stock pulley with a 71mm just to test the limits of the theory. As far as I know Jerome Dik is the only one that would have similar info. As far as i know..... 

Of course this is theory and until the engine is running in the real world its hard to say how it will run. Especially if the 16v does not run as cool as the 8v G60 did. I beleive this is the key; Proper cooling and intercooling combined with an external oil cooler should widen that margin of error. 

Just in case I'm waaaaay off with this theory I did buy the ABA thicker head gasket along with my 16V G60 kit and boost tubes from BBM, The plan is also to buy forged pistons in the future. 

But then theres always h20/alcohol injection too??....another topic.

Anyone wanna chime in?? Thanks for any input. 

And by the way I would like to thank Johnny G60 Master Betz for bringing back the 16v G60 kit!! As a former employee of BBM I can tell everyone that John puts everything he has into the parts he makes. His knowledge and metalurgical skillz are insane!! And running BBM effectively would drive anyone insane!! (just kidding JB) haha. :banghead: AND bringing back the most pain in the ass kit we sold with the most possible ways a customer can screw it up is a big win for all of us.:beer:

Thanks JB, keep tearing it up....

JK47


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## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

Hey Kain good to see you still working on this. Been reading and searching for info on this still myself. Found a few good discussions on stock IC numbers and CR + boost.

Stock IC 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5139816-G60-intercooler-specs

CR and boost

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5233014-2.0L-G60.-Is-it-as-easy-as-I-hope

With the stock ic one seems going by math and some investigating by Jbetz:

I had a very sharp engineer friend of mine, from Intended Acceleration work with me...now many years ago on this inter-coolers capacity.
We came up with about 280bhp, non sustained.
I've had good luck with the sock unit running up to 240+whp.
For most guys on the 8v running a g-lader it is plenty sufficient.
Hope this helps 

For me that`s where I wanted to be with my set up and so happens I have both types of g60 IC units so I`m happy with that.

Now the big topic of CR and specifically g60 boost. Have had a few people say that there running higher CR rates and boosted applications like Prof315:

I would have absolutely no fear running up to 15psi on a 10 to 1 motor, oh wait we are running 17 psi on a 10 to 1 1.8T on 87 octane. No knock sensor, just some common sense in the tuning.

as well as mrkrad:

Some dude up new gruven ran an RD block 1.8 10:1 with a 68mm pulley and put down 180/180 to the wheels. junkyard block. There is not a lot of room for error in a hot environment or low octane which ever you choose.

G60 Carat was nice to link a old post that had a formula on effective CR rates with boost:

+1 is (bar or atmosphere at sea level)
((boost psi / 14.7) + 1) x motor compression = effective compression. Then to find a rough hp output you times the motors effective compression by 10.8 (hp per CR ratio) 

The idea to play with higher CR and boost seems to have always been there but maybe old main stream thinking has always said it was not possible with the tech at the time who knows but a few have tried and have had success.

I personally am going to try it using a stock CR 9a 2.0 as well running a 70mm or 68mm perhaps. Using the formula above and using some feed back of ones that have done a standard 16vg60 build that at best they seem to get around 12psi ( avg was more like 9 or 10 seems like ) using a 68mm pulley I get

12psi \ 14.7 = 0.816 + 1 = 1.816 X 10.8 = 19.613 (effective compression ) x 10.8 = 211.81hp which seems to match or come close to the hp seen by those that do this conversion but also have done cams, bigger injectors and other mods. So you start adding the hp gains of those items on top of this higher CR it starts getting feasible to see 240ish hp numbers. Mind you will have to completely rebuild your engine head to toe and use good hardware, as well as use 93 + oct. gas to help this bad boy run smoothly. Guess my questions are more on what is the max psi this thing can handle and what mods are not going to play well with this idea. 

I`d like to get cams 260,268 ones, run #42 injectors, 3.5 FPR using a sirocco 16v exhaust header with TT down pipe. Would getting the charger ported or the head for that fact PP help or hurt a high CR build? That's kinda where I haven't found answers yet so not sure if i should get that done. I mean in NA cars and low CR high boost applications I see the reason but taking a g60 and putting it on a 16v from 8v basically doubling volume that it is designed for is better flow and such with a pp going to help as it does with the other applications?

Anyways that's my ramblings on the topic to date.........still doing the bloody body resto. and not even close to the engine part yet but it is good though's while grinding, blasting, swearing at Satan's snott stuff. God I need a :beer:


----------



## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

Wow finally found some info Jeroen Dik's 16vg60 ( helps if you spell it right )

Jeroen Dik

VW Corrado G60
Year: 1989 
Engine:
( Roughly translated from Dutch to English )

1850cc 16V-G60
Geflowede / edited cil.kop 2.0-16v
large valves, special valve springs + dishes
290 degree camshafts with mechanical tappets on the inlet and outlet
adjustable pulley's
Mahle pistons
Carrillo rods
larger oil pump
All parts balanced / balanced
special engine oil pan with baffles and splash plate
custom intake manifold with injectors 8 VWMotorsport
WeberMarelli injection, ignition distributor charge
Increased benz.druk, with 2 high pressure benz.pompen
G-charger modified / upgraded high-speed and geflowed
2 intakes on G-charger, with two carbon air boxes.
Drive, Pully G-toothed feeder approx 62mm
Large Intercooler rally wave
aluminum water cooler 
Traction Control with Launch Control 
AP synthermetaalkoppeling 200mm clutch / flywheel with special pressure group

and some more........

We know the 16v head is a custom creation by Jeroen Dik himself, mainly because he told us so. We also know the bulk of the engine was modified to match the work put into the head. Included in the insanely long list of engine parts added to the balanced and blueprinted 1.9L powerhouse are: Crane cams, Mahle pistons wrapped with Mahle piston rings, larger Schrick valves with matching valve springs and retainers, adjustable pulleys, mechanical cam followers, Weber Marelli fuel injection with eight 260cc injectors—two per cylinder—a Webber Marelli ignition system, a pair of Bosch high-pressure fuel pumps leading to a custom-fabricated fuel rail, and Crane adjustable cam gears. Not that that’s everything. Aside from the Jetex after-cat exhaust, and the custom-routed Rallye Golf intercooler, Jeroen also custom-fabricated an exhaust manifold and oil pan to add to the performance of the now tooth-belt-driven G60 compressor. Adding up the parts, the total comes to a hefty 353 hp at 8,100 rpm.

Still nothing on CR rates though but he has a company now www.JDEngineering.nl think I might ask him what he thinks....who knows he might just tell me.


----------



## spoileda4 (Dec 28, 2008)

Is it nessisary to have the custom made pistons for the PG block? Is there any production piston/rod combo that would give anywhere from 8-9:1 ratio? 

Thanks Guys


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

spoileda4 said:


> Is it nessisary to have the custom made pistons for the PG block? Is there any production piston/rod combo that would give anywhere from 8-9:1 ratio?
> 
> Thanks Guys


You can take PL pistons and give the dome of the piston a light pass on a lathe


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## spoileda4 (Dec 28, 2008)

how much are we talking here in turning them down?

EDIT: Could I just use a 144 rod with the 8.5:1 pistons from integrated engineering made for the 16v since the deck height and stroke are the same between the 16v engine and the G60 Engine?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

spoileda4 said:


> how much are we talking here in turning them down?
> 
> EDIT: Could I just use a 144 rod with the 8.5:1 pistons from integrated engineering made for the 16v since the deck height and stroke are the same between the 16v engine and the G60 Engine?


If you need JE 16V pistons we actively stock them.
You can use any 16V piston you wish. To determine how volume you wish to take off , get your head gasket figure out it's cc , get the cylinder head cc'ed and then work backwards.:thumbup:


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

*sns chip/injectors?*

quick question for Digifunk-one pros:

I got a SNS stg5 chip cut for an 8v g60 with 42lb injectors. Is it ok to use it on a 16V setup? What is the difference, if any, between 8v and 16v chips?

also, I'll be using 42lb Lucas/Delphi injectors. PN 01D030B. Same ones Racetronix sells. Anyone has any experience with those on their 16vG60 setup?

Thnx! :beer::thumbup:


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

How many guys are running the ABA bottomg end versus teh PG bottom end? Other than availability of parts and preference any real noticeable differemce?

Thanks in advance


----------



## LO-vw (Sep 24, 2001)

*FV-QR*

8v chip might not be calibrated for the extra air the 16v will let in so could run lean. 
Those 42lb injectors low or high impedance? Im using the ford ones as they are everywhere and cheap. 

aba bottom will work just is taller then the pg and 9a blocks and you will need play with your comp ratio or pistons iirc. its all on the first page bra


----------



## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

hey guys

thanks for the response above, any recommendations on where to get oil from
(oil feed line)
3 options 

1) the back of the 16v head close to the coolant temp sensor
2)low pressure oil sensor, include a "T" there
3) high pressure oil sensor, include a "T" there

i am leaning more towards the high oil pressure add a "T" there as its closer to the oil pump? any good suggestions?

thanks guys
:wave:


----------



## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

i got some great advice from a friend on here 

"High pressure switch is too high of pressure (to have your oil feed line attached to it) and may result in too high of pressure going to the charger. Low side it the side that oils the top and and the same circuit that was on the side of the head on the 8v. iirc, the 165v just has a port on the oil filter flange for that."

what are everyone's thoughts? and more importantly where can i read about this? i flipped through the Corrado G60 bentley and didn't find this or any explanation on the different oil pressures in the motor, i am not saying its wrong i just want to educate myself further

thanks for everyones help


----------



## MA_XXX (Apr 10, 2002)

use the back of the cylinder head. works fine in my experience


----------



## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

thanks i appreshiate all the help from everyone :thumbup:


----------



## CORRADOABFG60 (Feb 18, 2011)

*Abf g60*

Hi again.
I finished my 16vg60 project. I fired it up and it works very good at idle (my 8v g60 didn't).

My specs:
ABF engine stock internals
9.5 comp ratio (2 metal headgaskets)
Adjustable camgear
G lader fully rebuilded 20mm belt, rs ported
Digi1
Audi S3 380cc injectors
Lightweight flywheel
Short intake manifold
4 to 1 exhaust manifold and 60mm exhaust system 
Custom twin G intake (soon an SWG one)
Front mount intercooler
Oil cooler (stock water oil cooler removed)
Walbro fuel pump 
Fuel pressure regulator

I have 78mm pulley but I will have to decide which pulley to use 68, 70 or 72mm
I have stock chip.

I have to ask BBM or SNS?
I emailed SNS several times but they didn't reply to my massages
BBM answered immediately and told me that a custom stage 4 chip will be the one.


----------



## CORRADOABFG60 (Feb 18, 2011)

*Abf g60*

SOME PHOTOS:







LEFT INTERCOOLER PIPE IS TOO CLOSE TO THE ,BIG CORRADO, RADIATOR. I HAVE IT BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO REMOVE MY A/C. I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY 16V G60 WITH A/C. I THOUGHT IT WAS A PROBLEM BUT IT ISN'T.














YOU CAN SEE THE CUSTOM TWIN G INTAKE. NOT THE BEST ONE. I WILL BUY AN SWG SOON














I PUT THE FUEL PUMP IN FRONT IN ORDER TO HAVE A LESS THAN 1M FUEL LINE WITH 5-6 BAR


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Got the tensioner installed on mine. It's holding about 33 ft-lbs of torque with the current pulley and belt length. Technically not quite enough but will run it to try it out. I can always make bigger pulleys to get more tension on it. See sig for details.


----------



## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

Finish mine. Needs final ignition timing done, and it's running a little hot at the moment, I think there's some air still in the cooling system.


----------



## CORRADOABFG60 (Feb 18, 2011)

Looks very nice. Do you have any specs of this project.
I don't know if it is right but i set mine ignition timing to 12 degrees (g60 has 6 stock). What chip do you have? I think about bbm.


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## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

CORRADOABFG60 said:


> Looks very nice. Do you have any specs of this project.
> I don't know if it is right but i set mine ignition timing to 12 degrees (g60 has 6 stock). What chip do you have? I think about bbm.


9.5:1 JE Pistons
9A Block and Ported 9A Head
Ported G60 with RSR Outlet
30# Genesis Injectors
BBM 16VG60 Limited Managment
3.5bar (variable) FPR


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Some clean looking swaps in here:thumbup:


----------



## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

Hemingway'sToe said:


> Finish mine. Needs final ignition timing done, and it's running a little hot at the moment, I think there's some air still in the cooling system.




BBM fuel rail & FPR? Works fine, no problem? 

BTW nice build! Give some video! :thumbup:


----------



## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

MOTA BOY said:


> BBM fuel rail & FPR? Works fine, no problem?
> 
> BTW nice build! Give some video! :thumbup:


Aeroquip FPR, and yes BBM fuel rail. No problems to speak of.


----------



## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

HI there, I'm soon to start assembling my 16vg60 engine which will be going into a Mk
1 golf or rabbit as you like to call them . I'm from the uk and was wondering if there are many people with these engines that are successfully using digifant engine management with no fuelling issues. I have heard from a few people here who struggled with this set up and ditched it in favour of aftermarket systems. Maybe there are a few specialists who can advise me? Thants.


----------



## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

daniboy1_2_3 said:


> HI there, I'm soon to start assembling my 16vg60 engine which will be going into a Mk
> 1 golf or rabbit as you like to call them . I'm from the uk and was wondering if there are many people with these engines that are successfully using digifant engine management with no fuelling issues. I have heard from a few people here who struggled with this set up and ditched it in favour of aftermarket systems. Maybe there are a few specialists who can advise me? Thants.


 There are many who have successfully used the digi system. BBM makes a digi chip that many use, SNS makes a better one, but they're hard to get a hold of.


----------



## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Ok thanks for that, do you know why the sns chips are so hard to get hold of?.


----------



## bmxracerboy (Sep 9, 2007)

*MINE*

my 2.0 16vg60, hope you like


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

oh my.....very nice :thumbup:


----------



## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

I like:thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

bmxracerboy said:


> my 2.0 16vg60, hope you like


specs/numbers plz! :thumbup:


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

very clean, x2 on specs and numbers


----------



## bmxracerboy (Sep 9, 2007)

clove911 said:


> very clean, x2 on specs and numbers


2.0 abf block
je pistons
scat rods
lightened & balanced crank/flywheel
ported/polished abf head
abf cams
modified s2 inlet which is match ported to head
p&p and knife edged throttle body
440cc injetors
custom charger ported myself
65mm pulley
custom made equal length 4-1 exhaust manifold mated to 2 1/2'' single box system
g60 management

still running the engine in so not had the custom map yet but should be around the 300bhp mark with any luck 
glad you like


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

all the detailed painting/powedercoating is really nice. Makes it look super clean :thumbup:


----------



## julien000 (Sep 22, 2011)

Hi,
I've read all the thread and many fench forum thread (i'm french  ) and i'm asking myself a question.
About the crank pulley, i saw I can fit the ABF pulley that fits perfectly but I would like to fit a lightweight pulleu set.
The problem is that I only find 20vt kit like this one : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SEAT-TOLE...arts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3efa3c0595

I'm building a KR engine with a eaton M90...

Will it fit to my engine?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

:thumbup:


----------



## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

what size injectors were used on original 16v-G60 from vwms, also is BBM chip just a copy of vwms one?

thnx! :beer:


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

they are stock G60, green for the vwms tune.
yes we have the vwms program, however the chip we use and ship is not the same and improved.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

BBM has 16v Ltd. goodies on the shelf...
It has been some time since we have had these parts in stock!
Pretty sure you wont see the BBM Ltd integration for some time...if ever again.

Thanks guys and gals for your business and support.


----------



## bmxracerboy (Sep 9, 2007)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NH9V...youtube.com/watch?v=NH9ViSZEzyM&feature=feedu


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

If anyone is interested I have a few of the 90* distributor caps.:thumbup:


----------



## gti1977 (Oct 1, 2008)

Hello

which chip you are recomended? (bar-tek...bbm ?which is better to my setup)
i`m building engine based on 9A bottom and top
G-lader wheel -standard
CR-9:1

i don`t want it to be a racer car..just smooth powerful ride from which i expect about 210hp
what chip you have -what setup + dyno might help me

thanks in advance


----------



## Hemingway'sToe (Feb 13, 2009)

Well, I've got the inital break-in done of the engine and charger rebuild. 

How about some number comparisons for a couple things? 

Boost numbers for stock 78mm pulley and ported head? I'm only around 5-6 psi... about right for the increased head volume? I'm thinking I might have a slight boost leak. At the 1500 mile point I'll change to my 68mm pulley and I'm hoping for a good increase there. Then I'll go for my dyno and see what we're seeing at the wheels. Definitely is more fun than the stage1 g60. 

Vacuum? I'm pulling about 15mmHg at idle about 20mmHg under engine break. Seem about right? 

Oil pressure? Mine seems good... at 180 degF oil temp I have 1bar at idle and about 2.5 bar at 2000rpm. Certainly better than my PG. This is with 5W30 dino oil. I'll put my heavier synthetic in at 1500 miles.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

we have our 16v ltd. integration package on our old school price of $1199  

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/products/625/G60_16V_Limited_Supercharger_Integration


----------



## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

Hemingway'sToe said:


> ..I'm only around 5-6 psi... I'm thinking I might have a slight boost leak. ...


 I would think so. Numbers should be higher.


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

well reading all 44 pages has inspired me and answered alot of questions... doing some electrical work on mine today...although its roughly 20 degrees out...my hands get sort of numb...


----------



## gti1977 (Oct 1, 2008)

Issam Abed said:


> If anyone is interested I have a few of the 90* distributor caps.:thumbup:


 might be interested if looks same as original 
pm me photos and price 
cheers


----------



## ^panos^ (Jul 29, 2008)

Very useful thread, it was a big help for my project!


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

:heart: G60 16V!

It's been my dream for a fhew years, but I'm goin' 16VT because of less fuel consumption... As I was told. 

I lost my job, and now 16VT project will hold. :facepalm:


The sound of the PERFECT!


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## gti1977 (Oct 1, 2008)

Mine so far,measuring,fiting before complete resto


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## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

like the video. my 16vt is in progress. taking longer than i want but i'll post up a vid of that to give you something to look forward too. that is as long as the o2c tranny holds up for us...


----------



## rado4ever (Oct 15, 2008)

At last, I finished my 16v-G60 Lysholm project. Hope you like it:


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

That looks great!


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## G60VeeDub (Mar 4, 2002)

thought I'd add this for future reference.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...6vG60-tensioner-mount&p=76543055#post76543055


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## Lourado (Aug 30, 2008)

hows it going was wondering if the 2.0 16v head from a 93 passat will fit on my 90 1.8 g60? thanks


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

With the purchase of our new BBM Supercharger kit.
The BBM 16v Ltd. integration is $400 dollars off of the already low sale price.
You will need to call in your order for this VWVortex deal.
Thanks 

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/products/2652/NEW_BBM_G60_SUPERCHARGER_KIT


----------



## gti1977 (Oct 1, 2008)

Lourado said:


> hows it going was wondering if the 2.0 16v head from a 93 passat will fit on my 90 1.8 g60? thanks


fits without problems but you can`t use PG/1H pistons
read tread from the begining


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

gti1977 said:


> read tread from the begining


:thumbup:


----------



## 8716valver (Mar 2, 2007)

Does BBM make anything like this anymore? I have a 16v on Digi 1 and I'd like to run the blue Digi 1 CTS as opposed to the white 16v CTS like I am now.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

that part was a one off custom part. 
feel free to call us, we have a solution for you. 
thanks


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

for those with a running 16vg60 can you post what software you are running and the results if dyno'd....just doing some research...


----------



## SkootySkoo (Aug 8, 2004)

Can somebody explain why you have to use the scirocco intake mani?


----------



## jasonbend79 (Jul 19, 2007)

Puts throttle body on driver side, all other 16v manifolds put it on passenger side. Makes for a easy hook-up to factory parts, boost tubes isv ect.


----------



## SkootySkoo (Aug 8, 2004)

jasonbend79 said:


> Puts throttle body on driver side, all other 16v manifolds put it on passenger side. Makes for a easy hook-up to factory parts, boost tubes isv ect.


 
That's what I thought it was used for. Seems like it creates more problems than its worth just to keep a few stock parts. throttle body on the ps would make a front mount piping a lot easier. I've contemplated building a 16vg60 since I got my Corrado years go. Now I think I'm finally gonna jump in


----------



## jasonbend79 (Jul 19, 2007)

Yes, it would but there is no way to t-body adapter on there as, it hits the strut tower, and is a weird angle.


----------



## SkootySkoo (Aug 8, 2004)

jasonbend79 said:


> Yes, it would but there is no way to t-body adapter on there as, it hits the strut tower, and is a weird angle.


Yes I've noticed this. That is why I am currently searching tail supports for relocating the tb as it would be in a silencer kit as my Corrado is screwed


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

this thread is about to get a kick start


----------



## weejunGL (Feb 2, 2005)

i would love to do this with my golf, but there are some drawbacks for me 

i've got most the parts to do it, the real pain would be the exhaust manifold. it would be too pricy to get one custom made, and getting a Limited manifold just won't happen


sometimes it sucks having a syncro

16vG60 syncro on MS would be fun in the winter


----------



## clove911 (Jun 23, 2004)

just save more money. don't not do it just because of a manifold. took me 3 years to save up and buy parts for my syncro 16vt project, but i had a kid and it went on the back burner. 

either way it will be done when it gets done. motors in and engine management wired soon. most of plumbing done. I found a guy that did a manifold for my syncro for pretty cheap. log style but still. people out there make them, and i got in done in the US. If someone had the specs here, someone has it over seas for sure


----------



## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

I'm building my 16VT for 5 years now... :laugh:

It's gonna have all I want, or nothing.


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Does anybody have a set of water pump and power steering pulley spacers they don't need? I can't find any and BBM doesn't carry them anymore.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

still_a_G said:


> Does anybody have a set of water pump and power steering pulley spacers they don't need? I can't find any and BBM doesn't carry them anymore.


 if you are set up right.... you do not need spacers.


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

JBETZ said:


> if you are set up right.... you do not need spacers.



Well, I have a BBM modded Serp. pulley and I'd like to drive my power steering and water pump with the V-belt. I'm reusing the original G60 V-belt pulley, should I use a different one? It's about .080" too far out.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

still_a_G said:


> Well, I have a BBM modded Serp. pulley and I'd like to drive my power steering and water pump with the V-belt. I'm reusing the original G60 V-belt pulley, should I use a different one? It's about .080" too far out.


If you are running our crank pulley it will all line up. .080" is really not that much. If your water pump and power steering are factory correct it will line up...unless you have something strange with your set up. It sounds like your only off the thickness of couple of washers....


----------



## weejunGL (Feb 2, 2005)

i think somebody should make a VWMS 16vG60 limited exhaustmanifold replica


----------



## iZOTOPE (Jul 2, 2006)

*reply*

mine 1.8 16vG60


----------



## DutchMK1-16V-G60 (Dec 25, 2011)

*16v-g60*

hiya guys,

if anyone has got a Bosch FPR B280 500 844, or /and a VWM 16v-g60 bypass hose left, please pm me.

best regards Ad

p.s. Tezet is making awsome exaust for those who are looking for one.:thumbup:


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## gelandegolf (Feb 26, 2010)

weejunGL said:


> i think somebody should make a VWMS 16vG60 limited exhaustmanifold replica


I picked this up (just the manifold, already had the DP) from the UK awhile back...


----------



## weejunGL (Feb 2, 2005)

da fuuuuuck... how did you come by this? does more of them exist?


----------



## gelandegolf (Feb 26, 2010)

Sorry, it's a one-off. I'm not certain I'll use it however. My 16V G60 syncro uses a Scirocco exhaust manifold bolted to a modified Rallye DP. Just looking at the Scirocco manifold, I think it might flow better than the fabbed up one. I need to investigate this further, just haven't had the time lately...


----------



## weejunGL (Feb 2, 2005)

please do  the manifold is mainly what keeps me back from doing this, the rest is easy to come by (atleast here in europe)

a kit from Huber Rennsport isnt very expensive, and contains the bracketry and a SRI intake (if you don't go with the scirocco style inlet)


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

What is so special about the manifold besides being clocked to clear the angle drive? 
I have been looking for an ABF manifold for sometime with no luck.


----------



## gelandegolf (Feb 26, 2010)

That's about it... you either need a custom exhaust manifold or a custom down pipe. No factory pieces to make it work aside from the VWMS exhaust manifold used on the Limited. 

I gotta say tho, the shop that modified my Rallye DP to work with the Scirocco 16V exhaust manifold and tie into the twin cats didn't have much trouble with it, and it came out great...


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

*BBM 16v Ltd. Sale coming*

Heads up..., we are planning a sale on the last of our BBM 16v ltd. packages early next year.
Will be under $1k or 200-300 $$$ off
Happy Holidays from all of us at BBM


----------



## yip (Jul 14, 2003)

JBETZ said:


> Heads up..., we are planning a sale on the last of our BBM 16v ltd. packages early next year.
> Will be under $1k or 200-300 $$$ off
> Happy Holidays from all of us at BBM


Don't you DARE 

Please at least wait until tax return time


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

yip said:


> Don't you DARE
> 
> Please at least wait until tax return time


I'll bet we still have some left and on sale during tax season....


----------



## gti1977 (Oct 1, 2008)

Have someone ready recipe/tutorial how to make boost return pipe but i want it in original limited shape.Maybe you know if someone make them for sale?


----------



## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

first off I want to say thanks to JBetz for anwering all my questions....I know I can be a pain.. I would like some feedback on software, I'm pretty sure I am going to go with a stage 4 chip and a 65mm pulley, maybe a 70mm if I can get Bartek to make me a cooged one... anyone running a stage 4?? I cant remember too much talk about software back in the last 40 pages but I could be wrong...

also opinions on the oil feed line? some are doing it off the back of the block and others are doing it at the oil filter housing? I'm assuming Ting off the oil switch? 

thanks again...should have my little monster going in the next few months...


----------



## Rellim03 (Jan 11, 2011)

*here we go again. need advise*

Hey hey. 
So been building a 16vG60 since last summer. Won't get into all the details how we fell on the project but basically bought a Raddo G60 in horrible condition. 

Parts;
Everything from G60 motor a Gladder
BBM Intergration kit
2.0l 9a block
1.8l 16v head
Scirocco intakes and headers
Stock cams
Stock pulleys

Missing 
BBM CUSTOM PISTON
16V OIL PUMP 
LSD 

Our project is set to drive in early July. Ordering piston next month to start putting motor together. Looking for guidanceon Chip set up as I am realizing that the BBM one doesn't seem to cut it. We have a Ms2 sitting around but no clue on how to manage it or configure it for our setup. :banghead:

We are tapping the head for the return line sounds like the right thing to do. 

Help with MS set up please maybe a wire harness diagram to use as a guide. Giving we are sticking with the g60.
Help with step by step for what is better to start and finish with. 
Help from anyone running the same setup. How does it feel what would you maybe have done differently. What did you go back and change. 

I've read threw from page 1 and have most of my answers but with this type of build aparanty there is still plenty of unanswered question. 

Anyone seen this setup in Montreal Quebec? Would this be a first?

Thanks


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

alright, just to keep this thread alive:

Is the stock oil feed line restrictor really needed to run the first gen twin screw on a 16V (or an 8v for that matter), especially when BBM provides their kits with 2 MASSIVE return lines? 
I'll be feeding the charger off the back of the head, just like stock G60 setup. I can see it being needed when you supply oil off the filter flange but is there really that much oil pressure in the cylinder head?










cheers!!! :thumbup::beer:


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

yes and the oil feed line fitting at the charger has a small orifice restricter. The later ones have a filter at the orifice. Feel free to call me anytime during biz hours. thanks


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## OneSixV (Jun 27, 2002)

*Plugs?*

It may have been covered, but I'm too lazy to scroll through 40+ pages...what spark plugs are used ? The engine I'm putting back together has some craptastic Bosch platinums but I'm betting F6DTCs are not the answer. 

Anyone?


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## OneSixV (Jun 27, 2002)

Never mind. I found some used autolite plugs from a lawn mower and a single champion on the side of the road. That should do the trick!:beer: 

Now, if I can only remember where I put the sledge hammer and die grinder...


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## OttawaG60 (Apr 7, 2001)

i had a 16v60 running megasquirt, what do you want to know about setting it up?

Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk HD


----------



## INTERNETRACECAR (May 2, 2007)

an interesting thread, especially considering i have the vast majority of the parts already 







and a quantum syncro wagon to drop them into :V


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## OneSixV (Jun 27, 2002)

Who can tell me where to get one of the intake elbows? 

Thanks


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## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

Here's one: http://www.ebay.de/itm/16VG60-Dross...773565112?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item5653d39eb8 I see them often for 99 Euros on eBay.de and if you find a used one by a private seller, it could be much cheaper. You've just got to search.


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## OneSixV (Jun 27, 2002)

suburbangeorge said:


> Here's one: http://www.ebay.de/itm/16VG60-Dross...773565112?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item5653d39eb8 I see them often for 99 Euros on eBay.de and if you find a used one by a private seller, it could be much cheaper. You've just got to search.


 Thanks! Now I just need to find one here in the US or a seller willing to ship! (unlike the seller in the eBay auction)


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

contact HRT....they are super cool, I have a lot of their stuff and they always answer my questions...and they ship to the us..


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Yeah, trying to avoid the elbow is not worth it. There are ways to work around the distributor but that damn brake fluid reservoir gets in the way. I remote mounted mine with 2 half inch barbed fittings and flexible hydraulic hose but I feel like I'm just waiting for it to leak. And if it does then I have to take the master cylinder off and tap it for AN fittings. Then I'd need a new reservoir with threaded fittings as well. I also used a banjo bolt for one of the brake lines so that it doesn't bend into the bypass elbow. 

Not all that complicated to do but is it worth the time?

I kept mine there because I don't have a distributor and I need space for an A/W intercooler. BTW, it'll be a while before I try the bypass silencer seen below.

Alright, I'm gonna go start it up and do some more tuning. Almost time to get it inspected and actually drive this thing.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

:banghead::banghead:

I CAN'T GET THE NEW BEETLE BREATHER TO STOP LEAKING PAST THE GASKET. 

doubling the gasket doesn't work. A custom silicone GASKET doesn't work. I'm tired of smelling like oil!


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

So, some good news and bad news.

Good news: I found out why the breather is leaking and I think I found out why I was hearing a knock coming from the right front end.

Bad news: Leaking and knocking is coming from the New Beetle breather that everyone says to use. The hood lays right on it and when the engine shifts forward it gets pulled back, spraying oil everywhere.

Does the VR6 hood have more clearance? Has anyone actually used this in a 16VG60 Corrado?


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## SkootySkoo (Aug 8, 2004)

cant just notch that small area and or shave the top of the breather cap, or use a shallow cap?


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## OneSixV (Jun 27, 2002)

I've got the BBM elbow but apparently the thing isn't wanting to play nice with the distributor. It comes in contact with the cap and pushes it down slightly. Install the wires and the boot from #1 plug wire pushes it down even further.










I have a phenolic spacer and at this point I'm hoping, due to the angle of the intake, it will raise the plenums high enough to clear.

Would have been nice to have a part that could do the job it was intended to do.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

SkootySkoo said:


> cant just notch that small area and or shave the top of the breather cap, or use a shallow cap?



Yeah, I don't wanna cut the hood. Ima leave it off until I'm done troubleshooting and tuning. I can feel that the top end needs to breathe though. I'd say triple amount of air comes out the valve cover versus the block.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

OneSixV said:


> I've got the BBM elbow but apparently the thing isn't wanting to play nice with the distributor. It comes in contact with the cap and pushes it down slightly. Install the wires and the boot from #1 plug wire pushes it down even further.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


did you buy this from us....or did someone buy our parts and make there own? if you bought it from us i will fix any issue you are having for free, no problems. it looks backwards and does not have our brand tag on it.


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## petethepug (May 25, 2001)

Always nice to see you around the forum John. You guys are like a frik'n guardian angel for Corrado owners!


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## OneSixV (Jun 27, 2002)

JBETZ said:


> did you buy this from us....or did someone buy our parts and make there own? if you bought it from us i will fix any issue you are having for free, no problems. it looks backwards and does not have our brand tag on it.


1st, I purchased the car as a non-running project from a fellow vortexer so "no", *I* didn't buy it...I'm going off info from the PO. If it's not yours, sorry for the implication. 

2nd, backwards? I'm assuming you mean the pipe between the welds should be reversed making it push out over the transmission further. That probably would do the trick.

Great, now I'm stuck even longer before this thing gets on the road!:banghead:


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## Zotic (Oct 11, 2010)

I was wondering if you guys could help me,
I'm planning on building a 16vG60 engine with the base of a 2.0 ABF block and head,
I've found a site where i can order a complete kit to convert a 16v to a 16vG60, but i'm still wondering how this would work out in case of the compression ratio.

Do i need to get custom pistons to lower the compression ration to from 10.5:1 to 8.5:1
Or can this be done with a thicker headgasket so i wont need to change the stock rods and pistons?

(i'm a bit confused at this point)

(the kit in question http://www.bar-tek-tuning.com/lshop...16128,19,Tshowrub--1138132527.1262765087,.htm)


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

OneSixV said:


> 1st, I purchased the car as a non-running project from a fellow vortexer so "no", *I* didn't buy it...I'm going off info from the PO. If it's not yours, sorry for the implication.
> 
> 2nd, backwards? I'm assuming you mean the pipe between the welds should be reversed making it push out over the transmission further. That probably would do the trick.
> 
> Great, now I'm stuck even longer before this thing gets on the road!:banghead:


i'd need to see what you have there....feel free to ship it to me and we can have a look and fix it for you.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

Zotic said:


> I was wondering if you guys could help me,
> I'm planning on building a 16vG60 engine with the base of a 2.0 ABF block and head,
> I've found a site where i can order a complete kit to convert a 16v to a 16vG60, but i'm still wondering how this would work out in case of the compression ratio.
> 
> ...


im not sure about that conversion set up there at bar-tek
i just do not see how that parts group really gets the job done.
here is ours... 
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/products/625/G60_16V_Limited_Supercharger_Integration
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/about/15/G60_G_Lader_16V_Supercharged

if you plan to run lets say 8-9 psi you can get away with the thicker head gasket that we sell.
do not double stack. also recommend arp head studs too.
if you want to run more boost, then do the forged low comp pistons...we also have these
good luck and feel free to email me when you sink your chops into your project.


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## Zotic (Oct 11, 2010)

JBETZ said:


> im not sure about that conversion set up there at bar-tek
> i just do not see how that parts group really gets the job done.
> here is ours...
> http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/products/625/G60_16V_Limited_Supercharger_Integration
> ...


Thanks for the reply!


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## tesh0boy (Dec 7, 2009)

Bookmarked


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

Anyone wanna G75? XD 

http://www.roettele-racing.de/shop/...kelid=52&kategorieid=24&source=1&refertype=10


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

still_a_G said:


> So, some good news and bad news.
> 
> Good news: I found out why the breather is leaking and I think I found out why I was hearing a knock coming from the right front end.
> 
> ...


 
So the knocking wasn't all coming from the VC breather. Turns out the down pipe heat shield rests on the steering rack.  Wish I had known ahead of time, I would have removed the heat shield. :banghead:


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## appieG60 (May 9, 2013)

*Why 9A and KR and not ABF*

I like your take on this but in europe we make different choices.

We would have used an ABF 2,0 16V head/engine

or

For this setup you need to buy very expensive pistons. Over here whe use a simple 1.9 diesel engine block and bore it up 2mm and then use the diesel crankshaft and rods with 1.8 (KR) pistons and ABF head + digifant system. All stock items, overhere very available.

Now you have a 2.1L 16V engine with a very high compression because of using the diesel rods. Not high rev. but very torquey. This is a very powerfull setup which can be run with a G60 lader but then lowering the compression a bit would be wise.

If sombody thinks this is interessting, you can look for info on oettinger(german VW tuner) engines, they are bild this way using Schrik camshafts.


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## InSaneV (Oct 24, 2009)

appieG60 said:


> I like your take on this but in europe we make different choices.
> 
> We would have used an ABF 2,0 16V head/engine
> 
> ...


Which is what we wish we could do but we didnt get alot of this stuff on this side of the pond. We would spend even more money to make it that way.


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## SkootySkoo (Aug 8, 2004)

what are you digi 1 guys doing in order to keep the correct ecu vacuum line length?


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## corraptor_evo (Sep 22, 2006)

Hi, all!
I read all 46 pages but I couldn't find very explicit answer for some questions for my next project 16vG60 (or better saying G6016v?):

1. Can anyone tell me if I can use (successfully) a PG block, a KR/PL head, Audi S2 (3B) conrods and pistons? I must keep PG engine for official registry.
I find at (http://download.ms-motor-service.com/ximages/PDF_Kataloge/ko_audi_web.pdf) and (http://download.ms-motor-service.com/ximages/PDF_Kataloge/ko_volkswagen_web.pdf):
- PG rods has center to center length 136mm, compression height 39,2mm, wrist pin 22mm, big end diameter 50,6mm, stroke 86,4mm, dome +1,95mm, depth -8,6mm. That's mean a a length of rod+piston of 177,15mm.

- S2 rods has center to center length 144mm, compression height 32,5mm, wrist pin 20mm, big end diameter 50,6mm, stroke 80,4mm, dome +0,7mm, depth -1,2mm. That's mean a a length of rod+piston of 177,25mm.

So that mean both combination have the same (almost) length.
From where comes the difference (lowering) of the compression ratio from 8:1 to almost 6,2:1?

2. I don't find what kind of distributor I can/have to use because I need a Hall sensor not a Delco (for my PG Digifant1).

3. I don't find what spacers I have to use for Water pump and Steering pump pulleys, or what I need to shave from other pulleys.

4. Something about 16V Secondary shaft and gears?

Theese are some of a kind of bolt-on stuffs? Or there are some mods?

I hope to receive some good and usefull answers.
Thanks!


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## iZOTOPE (Jul 2, 2006)

*reply*



corraptor_evo said:


> Hi, all!
> I read all 46 pages but I couldn't find very explicit answer for some questions for my next project 16vG60 (or better saying G6016v?):
> 
> 1. Can anyone tell me if I can use (successfully) a PG block, a KR/PL head, Audi S2 (3B) conrods and pistons? I must keep PG engine for official registry.
> ...


 144mm rods, s2 pistons, metal head gasket, and the compression ratio should be ok, make sure the pistons do not touch the oil squirters from the PG block ... 

the g60 piston dish is way more deeper than that of a s2 piston, so if you keep 136mm rods and g60 pistons you'll end with a very low compression ratio. 

you need the intermediate shaft and sprocket from a kr engine, the crankshaft sprocket from the kr, an 16v ABF or KR crank pulley (6pk), if you can not find a kr or abf pulley just use a 8v pulley and take off 6mm so it will align with the rest, G60 water pump pulley, kr or abf oil pump and gears, distributor cap for the engine block from a kr ...


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## iZOTOPE (Jul 2, 2006)

ah, and i forgot, always use a crank pulley with harmonics damper!


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## iZOTOPE (Jul 2, 2006)

Rellim03 said:


> Hey hey.
> So been building a 16vG60 since last summer. Won't get into all the details how we fell on the project but basically bought a Raddo G60 in horrible condition.
> 
> Parts;
> ...


 if you have a ms2 i can help you with the config and wiring diagram, it should get you started but you'll need to dyno tune it afterwards.


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

Okay, I am still uncertain about the whole ALT question. I was able to modify the G60 Bracket to fab an ABA ALT on to it.To Replace the A/C compressor. However, this setup works, but once the motor is back into my MK1 Cabby I will be about 3 inches into the radiator support. Looks like I will have to notch the support to make this this setup work.

Now I remember back when the G60 was the thing to transplant. There was an article that said in order for the 8V version to work and run the A/C this was a must. Well I am not running A/C because its a 'Vert and I didn't have it in the first place. So that's not the case. 

I do not want to notch the radiator support and was wondering some other options. I would prefer not to run the ALT behind the block. So was wondering has anyone came up with an idea for this in a MK1 Cabby? 

Thanks


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## iZOTOPE (Jul 2, 2006)

kda33 said:


> Okay, I am still uncertain about the whole ALT question. I was able to modify the G60 Bracket to fab an ABA ALT on to it.To Replace the A/C compressor. However, this setup works, but once the motor is back into my MK1 Cabby I will be about 3 inches into the radiator support. Looks like I will have to notch the support to make this this setup work.
> 
> Now I remember back when the G60 was the thing to transplant. There was an article that said in order for the 8V version to work and run the A/C this was a must. Well I am not running A/C because its a 'Vert and I didn't have it in the first place. So that's not the case.
> 
> ...


well, don't have an mk1, but for my mk2 i fabricated a bracket for the alternator from 3mm stainless steel sheet, it looks ok, and all pulleys are perfectly centered.

you could make a bracket like this: 


























or like this:

































































i do not have measurements for the second one, i did it on the go when i was building my 16vG60  but hope the pictures help you to do yours.

:wave:


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

That totally helps me out. Thank you ! What did you use as a belt tensioner for this setup? I was considering using the timing belt tensioner from the 16V in place of the G60 tensioner as this works on my mock up. But what i don't know is will it still keep the tension the charger needs?


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

I fit a GM CS130 alternator with custom brackets. Smaller than the ABA. Plenty of clearance. See my sig for link.


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## iZOTOPE (Jul 2, 2006)

as a belt tensioner i used 3 timing belt tensioners from 8v. in the picture below you can see 2 of them, and one is in place of that plastic roller from the G60 bracket, i replaced those because i feel more safe if the belt has some guidance and more grip, also i can always fit a smaller belt and leave the compressor out of the way, but be advised, the crankshaft pulley must have a harmonics balancer otherwise you're asking for troubles 










the belt is gates 6pk 2128


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

I'll look at the option and see if it'll work for clearnance. Thanks for the info


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

As for the crank pulley I am using the ABA one? Will that be okay for balance or should I consider other options instead?


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## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

For those of you building this engine for a mk1 rabbit what serp belt tensioning system have you used as ive heard there can be clearance issues between the spring damper and the chassis leg?. I have a BBM kit but not sure if its going to be suitable for my mk1. Any pictures would be great. I want to retain the spring system as opposed to going down the fixed position route as in my mind this is how it was meant to be and it will take up any slack if the belt stretches and vice versa.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

daniboy1_2_3 said:


> For those of you building this engine for a mk1 rabbit what serp belt tensioning system have you used as ive heard there can be clearance issues between the spring damper and the chassis leg?. I have a BBM kit but not sure if its going to be suitable for my mk1. Any pictures would be great. I want to retain the spring system as opposed to going down the fixed position route as in my mind this is how it was meant to be and it will take up any slack if the belt stretches and vice versa.


I got your PM on CGTI. You don't have to go fixed at all and the spring system is 1980's Mercedes-Benz fail. Use the idler pulley on the bracket and retrofit a Ford or more modern tensioning system into the upper portion of the bracket.


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## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Im not sure what your saying here. Are you saying the standard tensioning system found on the 8vg60 isnt worth adapting to work on the 16vg60?. I already have the brackets that came in the BBM kit which i was hopeing to use, along with the tensioner cap they make which allows diffrent size pullys to be used with the same belt. Is this system not worth investigating further?


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## 8716vrocco (Feb 12, 2001)

I am running the BBM kit on my 16v in a mk2 scirocco it it fits just fine. The pulley on the tensioner sits below the frame horn and does not rub. I have only heard of issues when using the stock tensioner bracket, you have to make some room with a bfh. I don't have any good pics but I can take some if you like.


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## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Thats good to hear thanks. some pictures would be good thanks


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

daniboy1_2_3 said:


> Im not sure what your saying here. Are you saying the standard tensioning system found on the 8vg60 isnt worth adapting to work on the 16vg60?. I already have the brackets that came in the BBM kit which i was hopeing to use, along with the tensioner cap they make which allows diffrent size pullys to be used with the same belt. Is this system not worth investigating further?


I am saying the standard G60 tensioning system is not worth adapting even to another 8V G60. It is cumbersome , outdated and I am surprised none of the tuners in the industry have not taken the time to bring the design up to 2013 standard. I am working on a set up right now that will use the 305232 GM tensioner but it will require machining of the charger bracket. I have around 8 cores that I am going to use for a trial run but after that I am retiring from the G60 market.


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## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

If it aint broke dont fix it? From what im hearing the standard tensioning system seems up to the job. It certainly seems to work on the 8vg60. Am i missing something?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

daniboy1_2_3 said:


> If it aint broke dont fix it? From what im hearing the standard tensioning system seems up to the job. It certainly seems to work on the 8vg60. Am i missing something?


If it works for you then use it. I don't like the set up so I did one that worked for me.


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

I was looking at the Ford Focus one and it seams to be a no brainer for this setup. I'll work more of this setup when I get my motor back into the car so I can see the clearance I have with the frame. As I am doing this swap into a MK1 Cabrio.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

daniboy1_2_3 said:


> If it aint broke dont fix it? From what im hearing the standard tensioning system seems up to the job. It certainly seems to work on the 8vg60. Am i missing something?



It's just a spring. A clocksping can provide a smaller package area assuming you can mount it safely. I posted my mock up exactly 3 years ago. Crazy how time flies. I've been dailying it since July without the G lader. Glad I made that decision. With megasquirt, getting on and off throttle is wayyyy tricky. Throwing a charger into the equation just makes things harder. But the way I have it configured, installing it is super easy.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Overall Power*

Just a question? What is the max Power you can squeeze out of a 16v G60 or 16vg60 Lysholm?

Just wanting to know if it is worth building.


----------



## 8716vrocco (Feb 12, 2001)

jeffs vw said:


> Just a question? What is the max Power you can squeeze out of a 16v G60 or 16vg60 Lysholm?
> 
> Just wanting to know if it is worth building.


Check out post #24 of the G60 FAQ, Repoman has a list of dyno numbers for 8v and 16v engines. Might be outdated but it will give you an idea.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

What are people running for headers? Any clearance issues to look out for? I see that Raceland has one for the mk2 Golf and one for the mk2 Jetta. Wonder if one fits better than the other.


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> What are people running for headers? Any clearance issues to look out for? I see that Raceland has one for the mk2 Golf and one for the mk2 Jetta. Wonder if one fits better than the other.


Mk2 G/J are probably the same part. I wouldn't be surprised if the Mk3 were the same too, but if you are using the ABA block, def order the later to be safe.

I have the Mk3 SuperSprint Header and the Racelend Mk3. The Raceland is an exact rip off, but pretty damn good quality. SS is 304 SS and hand above better quality , but you could buy 4 Racelands for the price I paid for the SS.


There is a huge (OLD) thread in the 16v forum on the Raceland. First ones had small fitment between the 2-3 cyls. Laters fit perfect.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> What are people running for headers? Any clearance issues to look out for? I see that Raceland has one for the mk2 Golf and one for the mk2 Jetta. Wonder if one fits better than the other.


These are pretty amazing.

*037 253 031 AQ*









*037 253 031 BK*


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

issam abed said:


> these are pretty amazing.
> 
> *037 253 031 aq*
> 
> ...


where do we get these from????


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

Okay another question I have. The upper water outlet, what are people using? I have the ABF one and I was looking at the BBM one but the price is really making me thinking of some other options. So I ask you guys for any suggestions. Thx


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

sdezego said:


> Mk2 G/J are probably the same part. I wouldn't be surprised if the Mk3 were the same too, but if you are using the ABA block, def order the later to be safe.
> 
> I have the Mk3 SuperSprint Header and the Racelend Mk3. The Raceland is an exact rip off, but pretty damn good quality. SS is 304 SS and hand above better quality , but you could buy 4 Racelands for the price I paid for the SS.
> 
> ...



I read a lot of that thread. I'm wondering if the 2 donut gaskets they added interfere with the PS rack at all. Is the clearance in the Corrado the same as the Golf?


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Issam Abed said:


> These are pretty amazing.
> 
> *037 253 031 AQ*
> 
> ...



Those look great. Where from?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> Those look great. Where from?


OEM ABF units - extremely rare as most of them came with the same cast units we are all familiar with.


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

kda33 said:


> Okay another question I have. The upper water outlet, what are people using? I have the ABF one and I was looking at the BBM one but the price is really making me thinking of some other options. So I ask you guys for any suggestions. Thx


You mean the front flange? I cut an aluminium stock one and had my friend weld it. :beer:


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

CrankWorkOrange said:


> You mean the front flange? I cut an aluminium stock one and had my friend weld it. :beer:


Would a cast replacement of the ABF unit work for you?


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## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> Those look great. Where from?


Here's one: http://www.ebay.de/itm/SEAT-TOLEDO-1L-Auspuffkrummer-ABF-037253031BK-Bj-1996-147010-km-/271298413893?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item3f2aa54545


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

suburbangeorge said:


> Here's one: http://www.ebay.de/itm/SEAT-TOLEDO-1L-Auspuffkrummer-ABF-037253031BK-Bj-1996-147010-km-/271298413893?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item3f2aa54545



Actually, I just opened a Raceland box. Gonna test fit placement tomorrow.


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

CrankWorkOrange said:


> You mean the front flange? I cut an aluminium stock one and had my friend weld it. :beer:


Yes that would be the one. I'll give it a shot as see what I can find. Not sure if I still have a metal one still.


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

Issam Abed said:


> Would a cast replacement of the ABF unit work for you?


Issam, ABF unit would not work for me, unfortunately.


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

Those of u that r still on Digi - which software r u running? Which tuner is the best currently?

:beer:


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

CrankWorkOrange said:


> Issam, ABF unit would not work for me, unfortunately.


Going to do them in 2 configurations. Supercharged and then OEM ABF replacement.


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

Issam Abed said:


> Going to do them in 2 configurations. Supercharged and then OEM ABF replacement.


sounds interesting! :thumbup::beer:


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## gti1977 (Oct 1, 2008)

This is what i have made for myself incl fuel rail.If someone would be intersted in rail let me know via pm.
Brackets are from steel zinc plated and powder coated.I hope i can finish my engine in next year.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

As far as headers go, here's a MK2 Raceland header in a G60 Corrado.  Test fitting pictures only. The joints appear to float in between the power steering rack and the antiroll bar. I don't see any reason it won't work but I'll know for sure next week. The 3rd pic show how much the cat will have to be shifted back.


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## Pocket-Rocket-PR (Oct 15, 2005)

Hey man, just curious but what A/C condenser are you running with that setup?


----------



## Pocket-Rocket-PR (Oct 15, 2005)

CORRADOABFG60 said:


> SOME PHOTOS:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just curious what A/C condenser setup are you running there?


----------



## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Hello all, 

I'm about to tackle this project this coming summer and I've been reading on it since I can remember. Today, I just read through all 48 pages in a 4.5 hour sitting when I should have been doing homework (UT Austin student) and I learned SO MUCH. But I naturally have some questions and comments to what I didn't see explicitly talked about.

My situation is:
Stock 16v 9A Engine 
All the needed Corrado G60 Parts
BBM Integration Kit
Scirocco Manifold

I also have a NOS 16v 9A Engine head stored away. Would it be good to use that instead of my used 200K mile head? What steps would I need to properly install it and it running?

Please bear with how dense this post is. I'm trying to get as many questioned answered so that I can be readily prepared for this. I would greatly thank any and all answers :heart:

Also, I actually started writing this reply as I was reading through it, so I may have already answered my own questions later on down the post (as I got closer to the end), but I would appreaciate if you could point out what I answered myself on. That way I can really get my think on and research some more.

____________

From what I have been reading from all the posts and threads, there really isn't anything pretty dense to go through to get this hybrid right? From what I understand it's mostly bolting on brackets, finding parts (belts, manifold, ABA gaskets), and then replacing the engine management from Motronic (In my case) to Digifant I and that's just replacing harnesses. So I really downplayed that, I'm sure. So I'm going to attempt to dissect what I just said and see if it really is as easy as I think.



Are most of the holes for G60 brackets and pulleys already there?
Are there any hard to find parts that I can't get from a G60?
I have all the parts necessary already on the way, and I already sourced a Scirocco Manifold with hopes of saving up for the 50mm one.
Is the new ECU really just bolting it in and running the wires?

But I've got some general questions that I didn't exactly see mentioned. 

*First:*


OttawaG60 said:


> Fuel rail and injectors, plenty of good 16v fuel rails out there, injectors, try Ford motorsport green (#42), they are bosch.
> 
> Don't forget the inserts (G60 injector for manifold)


Are the Digifant I injectors and fuel rail not good enough for the 16vG60 with a BBM chip? And the inserts this post refers to are the seats that go on the lower manifold piece correct?

*Second:*


OttawaG60 said:


> 13) Crank case breather in is now in the block, not the head, so you'll need to route that.
> 
> I recommend venting the head as well and running a catch can.
> Easiest method is probably to use the NB 2L breather oil cap.
> ...


This is what I don't get. What is this about the crank case breather and catch can? _Why is this necessary?_ I'll do some reading to find out what that is (I have no idea what that means, but I'm guessing it's something specific that is meant to help ventilate the block from the oil pressure?) And does the 16v engine not have an oil return line? (I'm also guessing that this return line goes to the G60 to lubricate it while it runs correct?) Do I have to buy new hoses and what not to do that?

I kept on reading and found some conversations actually.

*Oil Feed for G60:*


BlownGTT said:


> Has anyone had problems of higher runing oil pressures on the 16v and causing damaged oil seals on the charger? Do 16v usually run higher pressures than the g60?





OttawaG60 said:


> If you get the feed from the back of the head, it's ok, I tried it from the front oil flange, popped a seal.





Issam Abed said:


> Same difference.The Oil pressure @ the head whether 16V or 8V is going to be lower than that @ the oil filter flange.





BlownGTT said:


> so you actually drill the block? WHere abouts is this? is regarding a 9a block





herby53-akaherby53 said:


> there is a hole for it right where the one is for the g60 block , you just need to drill it all the way . ( it is right near the oil filter , tothe left of it )
> i have a 9a and need to drill mine also . i chose to not drill the pan.





OttawaG60 said:


> *oil feed* back of the head, I've tried it from other locations, ended up popping seals in the charger





kindbundz91G60 said:


> Anybody heard this? The back of the 16V head is a bad place to supply the charger (G60) as it is for an oil temp sender factory and is a lower pressure hole (higher in the head, 1.8 Bar oil indicator spot)
> 
> 
> 
> ...





JBETZ said:


> Yes, I would also go with the top of the oil filter flange.





OttawaG60 said:


> I had an oil line from top of the oil filter, this was too much pressure and popped the oil seal on the exhaust side of the charger.
> I did have the factory restrictor in place.


So I've got conflicting views. What is really the best? 
And when I drill through it, I have to put a thread on the hole so the line can screw in right?


*Then for the Catchcan and Oil Return Line:*


herby53-akaherby53 said:


> sorry , thought you where talking about the oil return line. I was just gonna get my oil from the side f the head , but if this is the case , where do i get hte feed line from on the back of the head?





Issam Abed said:


> Where the stock Oil pressure switch is?





thetatau87 said:


> What are you running for a crankcase vent? I'm still having problems with oil blowing out of my catch can at WOT.





JBETZ said:


> The 16V's like to spew oil out of the valve cover vent and even some out of the block vent.
> We always set these engines up with a catch can that drains back to the oil pan.


So JBETZ answers the question for why, but how does it work and where do you put this so called can? Again, I need to do some reading on what exactly is a crank case breather, catchcan, and oil return line.

I'm really looking to OEM Limited engines so that I can make it look as close to stock as I can and I don't see where the catch can is! Or the intercooler.
(Ex: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5184688-A-rallye-Golf-limited-in-your-neighborhood)(http://s3.photobucket.com/user/LoN3R/library/16vg60?sort=3&page=1) 



Where are the two places I need to tap on for the oil feed? Here are pictures of herby53-akaherby53's block that are good for answering this question. Also the diagram on page 37 by _dpgreek._



























Now on to some other questions that I haven't seen already been talked about (for the most part). Also, thanks to anyone who takes the time to answer all my freaking questions. 

*A/C:* I know that this is possible as answered on the first post, but what about the lines, the evaporator on the firewall, the receiver drier and A/C condenser radiator? Can I use the 16v Compressor? All I need from the G60 is the pulley right? Is there anything special that needs to be addressed on that regard?
*Intercooler:* I know that some Mk2s in Europe got G60 engines from the factory, and those engines had intercoolers, so where does the one that I have from a Corrado G60 go? Does that just bolt on too?
*Cluster:* So I have a Digifiz cluster... As far as I know, the new hybrid engine shouldn't mess with any of that since the engine management still gives information through the fusebox and none of that really changes since everything is CE2. Disregard the Digifiz for a second. Would anything change for the normal cluster? Coolant gauge, MFA, oil temp, oil pressure, tach?
*Power Steering:* I've seen stock Limited engines and they have the PAS bottle in the small cylindrical looking container in front of the Washer bottle. My GLI has PAS. Would I have to do the same? Also, what happens for that pulley and the pump and the lines?
*Belts:* Crank pulley? Does the timing belt from the 16v still work just fine? What about the serpentine belt? I read this: _"The belt length is about 64”. The number on the belt is 58174X25mm. It is a gates belt Power grip HTD and was made in germany." - Issam Abed_ also this "gates t098" - _ N_TENSETUNING 
_*Spark Plugs:* I read on Page 21, Post #714 that _"Denso Iridium 20VT (1.8T) plugs works even better." - kindbudz91G60_ Is this true? What part number can I look for these? Also, what gap would work best? If I go with stock 16v spark plugs, what gap do I use for that?
*Misc. Stuff:* Motormounts, suspension, steering, extending wires, timing cover, clutch, fuel pump, head studs? What about porting and polishing the head, or manifold, or anything else to help refreshen my 16v base engine? Is that even really necessary? My current base engine has probably close to 200K Miles (I don't know for sure)


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Uh,


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Anyone? Sorry about the lenghtyness


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Anyone? Sorry about the lenghtyness


feel free to call me, I can help you with your questions.
thanks


----------



## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

JBETZ said:


> feel free to call me, I can help you with your questions.
> thanks


What are your hours?


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> What are your hours?



Didn't he just say "call me"? Holy sh!t, too funny.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> What are your hours?


Hi, the best time to reach me by phone is from 9AM to 11:30AM or 12:30PM too 2:30PM West coast time.
Our phones are open from 8AM to 5PM Monday through Friday
We all take 11:30-12:30 for our lunch break.
Thanks


----------



## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

JBETZ said:


> Hi, the best time to reach me by phone is from 9AM to 11:30AM or 12:30PM too 2:30PM West coast time.
> Our phones are open from 8AM to 5PM Monday through Friday
> We all take 11:30-12:30 for our lunch break.
> Thanks


You guys aren't allowed Lunch Breaks John:laugh:


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

I am really struggling with my build as to working the whole alternator setup. I am putting this into a MK1. I am not keen on the super big belt option by mounting the ALT on the back of the head. I just finished painting the car and really don't want to notch the front core support. So honestly is there any ALT options that will work under the charger? Remember this is a Freshly painted MK1 with limited space.


----------



## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

kda33 said:


> I am really struggling with my build as to working the whole alternator setup. I am putting this into a MK1. I am not keen on the super big belt option by mounting the ALT on the back of the head. I just finished painting the car and really don't want to notch the front core support. So honestly is there any ALT options that will work under the charger? Remember this is a Freshly painted MK1 with limited space.


From reading I believe people have fit smaller alternators under the charger so that it can clear.


----------



## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> From reading I believe people have fit smaller alternators under the charger so that it can clear.



ABA alternator. We have made brackets in the past to do this.
No longer do we have any or make them, please do not ask.
If you run any set up you want to use a spring loaded tensioner, not fixed.
The serp belts heat up at any decent boost level and can slip if using a fixed tensioner.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> From reading I believe people have fit smaller alternators under the charger so that it can clear.


AAA unit is what we used (same as ABA but 120A). Going with the 06A block has made this whole pulley/belt system a breeze!


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## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Can anyone tell me what cylinder head coolant flange works with the supercharger mounted just in front of it? My standard flange almost touches the g ladder and points in the wrong direction. Rather than have to fabricate something is there an off the shelf solution? . I thought there would be something in my bbm integration kit but all I can see are a couple of metal pipes which serve no purpose at the moment.


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## rado16vg60 (Sep 8, 2012)

daniboy1_2_3 said:


> Can anyone tell me what cylinder head coolant flange works with the supercharger mounted just in front of it? My standard flange almost touches the g ladder and points in the wrong direction. Rather than have to fabricate something is there an off the shelf solution? . I thought there would be something in my bbm integration kit but all I can see are a couple of metal pipes which serve no purpose at the moment.


BBM makes a flange that may help.

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/products/1667/BBM_Billet_Coolant_Flange


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## daniboy1_2_3 (Nov 22, 2007)

Thanks had looked at this but im running a standard block breather and this flange looks like it will foul on that :/.


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

I was able to fab the ABA ALT to fit the G60 bracket. However I am running into a space issue between the bracket and front support. Was just looking at other options as I am not willing to cut on the frame because my car is now painted and being put back together.












Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

I was able to fab the ABA ALT to fit the G60 bracket. However I am running into a space issue between the bracket and front support. Was just looking at other options as I am not willing to cut on the frame because my car is now painted and being put back together. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Schrick*

Anyone ever try Schrick 268 cams for 16v g60 motor on here? Feed back? I have a set and want to run them on Ported 1.8 Head and ported g lader with 65mm pulley 2.0 bottom end 9a with eurospec rods and JE 9to1 Pistons and custom plenum intake to make head flow better being ported. Thanks


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

kda33 said:


> I was able to fab the ABA ALT to fit the G60 bracket. However I am running into a space issue between the bracket and front support. Was just looking at other options as I am not willing to cut on the frame because my car is now painted and being put back together.


How did you mount it? Direct to where the A/C comp once was? On the MK1 kit I did , we used the lower tab on the A/C bracket to support the upper tab on the ABA alternator and then made a heim joint and attached it to the M8 boss to the right of the front crankshaft seal housing.
HTH


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## Brian.G (May 8, 2010)

gti1977 said:


> This is what i have made for myself incl fuel rail.If someone would be intersted in rail let me know via pm.
> Brackets are from steel zinc plated and powder coated.I hope i can finish my engine in next year.


Lovely rail:thumbup:


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Spark Plugs*

I have looked thru all these pages and haven't seen what kind of plugs people are using on this build? also as far as Cams i have Schrick 268's will these go good with this set up with 2.0 9a block and 1.8 ported head and throttle body.


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## iZOTOPE (Jul 2, 2006)

jeffs vw said:


> I have looked thru all these pages and haven't seen what kind of plugs people are using on this build? also as far as Cams i have Schrick 268's will these go good with this set up with 2.0 9a block and 1.8 ported head and throttle body.


i am using ngk bkr7esc, as for the cams 268 are for NA applications, but i think they will work 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

iZOTOPE said:


> i am using ngk bkr7esc, as for the cams 268 are for NA applications, but i think they will work
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk


I got a smoking deal on them so it was hard to pass up. But I found a link to Bar-tek tuning that said those are the cams they sell for that set up. only one way to find out:laugh:

Thanks:thumbup:


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Spark Plug*



iZOTOPE said:


> i am using ngk bkr7esc, as for the cams 268 are for NA applications, but i think they will work
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk


I just looked up that plug are those equivalent to w5dpo? I couldn't find the NGK bkr 7esc just seen ngk bkr 7e


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

Issam Abed said:


> How did you mount it? Direct to where the A/C comp once was? On the MK1 kit I did , we used the lower tab on the A/C bracket to support the upper tab on the ABA alternator and then made a heim joint and attached it to the M8 boss to the right of the front crankshaft seal housing.
> HTH



I'll look into mounting it lower on that tab. I was doing it on the upper tab :banghead: So when I get back into the garage I'll see what I can muster up by putting it there. Thank you


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

kda33 said:


> I'll look into mounting it lower on that tab. I was doing it on the upper tab :banghead: So when I get back into the garage I'll see what I can muster up by putting it there. Thank you


No Problem.
Right, so have been neglecting this thread for sometime and I know some of the images are broken but that will change soon as I am building both the 16V G60 and 20V G60 engines using brand new crate motors for images/documentation purposes. These images will be hosted on the website gallery unless VMG supplies me with a gallery for the forums.
That being said , I was almost done the motor when that silly bug bit me. Suddenly my Scirocco NA manifold wasn't enough and the hunt was on for the 50mm units. These are the part #'s needed for the conversion: 

Lower Intake manifold (50mm) : Scirocco - *027 133 206 M* / Golf - *027 133 202 F*
Upper Intake manifold (50mm) : Scirocco - *027 133 223 L*
50mm OEM gasket : *027 129 717*

Based on the rarity of the Rocco upper , I came to the quick realisation that they were going to be extremely hard to find AND expensive (one is for sale on ebay.de for 500 Euro's :screwy. I then began searching for the Golf 50mm units and buying them up to see if I could modify them using Scirocco plenums and Golf runners then as I was searching through instagram photos one day and I came across this on trimsport's feed:








A quick google search showed the item was created by forum resident Brian G. so I reached out to him to see what it would take to get some 50mm Golf units modified to Scirocco spec with a 16V G60 insignia on the upper plenum.

Long story short , how many of you would be interested in this if it was reasonably priced (say under $500 for the upper and lower) as shown above.
Thoughts? Feedback?


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## G60VeeDub (Mar 4, 2002)

Issam Abed said:


> No Problem.
> Right, so have been neglecting this thread for sometime and I know some of the images are broken but that will change soon as I am building both the 16V G60 and 20V G60 engines using brand new crate motors for images/documentation purposes. These images will be hosted on the website gallery unless VMG supplies me with a gallery for the forums.
> That being said , I was almost done the motor when that silly bug bit me. Suddenly my Scirocco NA manifold wasn't enough and the hunt was on for the 50mm units. These are the part #'s needed for the conversion:
> 
> ...


small world:wave: Love it! Here's mine on its way to me as we speak. Getting my hands on a real 50mm manifold is the tough part now.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

love it
oh that's the $h1t there, nice Issam :thumbup:


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## rado16vg60 (Sep 8, 2012)

Ok nice but what about us that are using the BBM twin screw set up? Technically they are not 16v g60.  I would love to see something for those. I am using the 'rocco intake with the 50mm lower. 16v limited, 16v twin screw, 16v lysholm. I don't know just throwing it out there.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

rado16vg60 said:


> Ok nice but what about us that are using the BBM twin screw set up? Technically they are not 16v g60.  I would love to see something for those. I am using the 'rocco intake with the 50mm lower. 16v limited, 16v twin screw, 16v lysholm. I don't know just throwing it out there.


What would you prefer it to say? 16V Supercharged with the supercharged in small script?


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## rado16vg60 (Sep 8, 2012)

Nice!:thumbup:


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Issam Abed said:


> No Problem.
> Right, so have been neglecting this thread for sometime and I know some of the images are broken but that will change soon as I am building both the 16V G60 and 20V G60 engines using brand new crate motors for images/documentation purposes. These images will be hosted on the website gallery unless VMG supplies me with a gallery for the forums.
> That being said , I was almost done the motor when that silly bug bit me. Suddenly my Scirocco NA manifold wasn't enough and the hunt was on for the 50mm units. These are the part #'s needed for the conversion:
> 
> ...


Ok 2 people so far.
Add your name to the list below:

1


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

That's awesome. Too bad I just painted mine.

Crappy cell pic


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Still not 50mm


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## G60VeeDub (Mar 4, 2002)

yes I know it will look better on the 50mm manifold, but here it is mocked up on an extra 41mm manifold I have laying around.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*16v g60 ISV QUESTION*

Does anyone know on the ISV for 16v g60 build ive been getting mixed info from guys in the states and the guys from Europe. So do I re route it which the guys from Europe said not to do and just add a filter on the side of isv that would be re route to intercooler pipe I know on the 8v engines rerouting it would normally give 2 or more extra psi out of it so not sure what to do here? Please help. Thanks


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## G60VeeDub (Mar 4, 2002)

I routed mine back into the intake like a normal isv re-route set up from an 8v would be plumbed.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*16v g60 cam question*

I have a set of auto tech cams 16v & Set of 268 Schricks which would you go with? My head is ported also.


----------



## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Hey all, 

I'm thinking of picking up a 944 intercooler for my 16vG60 instead of the stock G60 one. Thoughts? Would this work?

Cheers!


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## corraptor_evo (Sep 22, 2006)

Hi,
I have some questions, if you are so kind to answer.
1. For my G60 16V i'll use S2 pistons. But I don't have a set. I have 3 of a kind and 1 has a different notation on the head surface. A notation (for the three ones) is "- 05,10" and for the fourth is "05,14 +".
What is the meaning of this notation? Can I use this set of pistons together?
2. I don't have S2 conrods (unfortunately I have just one, not four). But I have a set of 16v KR conrods. Can I use them safe on my 16v G16 at 1,1 boost?
3. Can I use some TDI rods instead 16v rods, with better results?


----------



## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

For those of you who have not yet built your engine, I have a set of NIB JE low compression pistons for a better price than any shop: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6961519-FS-NIB-JE-16V-83mm-Low-Compression-Forged-Pistons-with-Total-Seal-Rings&p=85428631#post85428631 . They should be in the 8:1 - 8.5:1 compression range which is right there with the stock G60's 8:1.


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## rado16vg60 (Sep 8, 2012)

*9a block question*

when using the 9a block what do i do with the hole left after replacing the 16v breather box with the bbm early style block off plate? do i use a freeze plug? :banghead:


----------



## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

rado16vg60 said:


> when using the 9a block what do i do with the hole left after replacing the 16v breather box with the bbm early style block off plate? do i use a freeze plug? :banghead:



Page 43: 



still_a_G said:


> Yeah, so in regards to that hole, I am pretty sure that it is a 35mm or 1.378".
> 
> It looks like the only place to get a copper plug without buying a block-off (I'm sure some vendors may be willing to part with just the plug) is to buy Dorman part #02523. It is a 35.21mm plug. At this dimension, it provides .008" oversize, which is just about right for an interference force fit. I'll be ordering one of those from somewhere.
> 
> So Napa, Advance and Autozone can't get a 35mm plug in stores but Advance online can ship it to you. I got one and popped it in. Works perfect.


----------



## rado16vg60 (Sep 8, 2012)

Ok, in regards to the interference needed for the plugs under normal circumstances should not be as relevant "I think" because it has no coolant there, just block pressure. Right? If so would a 1-3/8 work? All I could find so I popped it in. It did take some influence.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

rado16vg60 said:


> Ok, in regards to the interference needed for the plugs under normal circumstances should not be as relevant "I think" because it has no coolant there, just block pressure. Right? If so would a 1-3/8 work? All I could find so I popped it in. It did take some influence.



Yeah, I'd think so.


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## rado16vg60 (Sep 8, 2012)

Ok so I have an 8v pg motor with stage 4 upgrade on my corrado now. I am almost done with my 9a 16v/twin scew build and have been worried that the chip that I received with the integration kit from bbm (BBMSTG4X) might not work with the twin screw, the upgraded fpr and pulley that I have. Can someone please shed some light on this for me? Do I need a new chip? If so should I just go with the bosch green 440's?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

rado16vg60 said:


> Ok so I have an 8v pg motor with stage 4 upgrade on my corrado now. I am almost done with my 9a 16v/twin scew build and have been worried that the chip that I received with the integration kit from bbm (BBMSTG4X) might not work with the twin screw, the upgraded fpr and pulley that I have. Can someone please shed some light on this for me? Do I need a new chip? If so should I just go with the bosch green 440's?


Won't know until you start the car and realise how it runs.
I would highly suggest investing in a wideband guage (Stacks or AEM) or monitoring AF while the car is idling. It has been known in the past that a few chips have needed to be redone changing configuration to configuration.
Food for thought , you can pretty much build your own chip flasher for under $1000 and configure it to suite.
If I ever get this engine dyno up and running I promise one of the first things that go on is a Digi-I


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

what are people using for the coolant hard line that goes from under supercharger around and over the tranny to the heatercore? Mine seams to just be floating around and doesn't line up to any good mounting points other than the front engine mount.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Swirved said:


> what are people using for the coolant hard line that goes from under supercharger around and over the tranny to the heatercore? Mine seams to just be floating around and doesn't line up to any good mounting points other than the front engine mount.



You put the engine in the car first.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

That is the goal... Anyone else? 16v scirocco or some other hardline work better than the g60 one? I found one but it looks like it has an extra port or two.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

There is no other mounting point for that hard line.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Pretty sure it mounts to the head under the distributor but I could be wrong. Also the pipe has a spot it just doesn't line up on the 16v head. Anyways on to fabbing up an aluminum bracket to hold it in it's proper place for now.


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## AKA001 (Nov 5, 2012)

*pictures of original G60 16v*

Hi all,

Can anybody help me with links or pictures of what an original G60 16V motor looks like complete without any after market accessories fitted, basically a original untouched motor.

I'm sorry if this is posted in the wrong place, the post can be delete if need be. I can't seem to find anything on here unless I'm searching incorrectly 

Please mail pictures to [email protected]

Cheers
Abdul


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*16v g60*



AKA001 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Can anybody help me with links or pictures of what an original G60 16V motor looks like complete without any after market accessories fitted, basically a original untouched motor.
> 
> ...


Google....... 16v g60 and go to images I believe there is one image with a stock 16v g60 in the vw museum. here is mine im still finishing it up





Looks stock but not really
Heavy ported 1.8 head with schrick 268s
2.0 9A block with Eurospec Rods and Wiseco 83mm 9.01 pistons
BBM Stage 4 Charger with 68 & 65mm pullies
42lbs injectors


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## AKA001 (Nov 5, 2012)

Thanks will go check on Google shortly, so wher did they put the alternator originally?
And what was the "boost pressure" with the standard charger on

And your motor looks really good I'm hoping mine looks that good and clean also:wave:


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

AKA001 said:


> Thanks will go check on Google shortly, so wher did they put the alternator originally?
> And what was the "boost pressure" with the standard charger on
> 
> And your motor looks really good I'm hoping mine looks that good and clean also:wave:


Not sure whats the boost on stock but I believe on here I read it was like 6 to 9 psi on a stock motor. Here is a little something I found.

A 16-valve G60 engine was used in the ultra-rare Golf Limited, of which only 71 were produced by VW Motorsport, all with four-wheel drive[2][3] Power was raised to 154 kW (209 PS; 207 bhp), and the car could now accelerate to 100 km/h (62.1 mph) in 6.4 seconds, reaching a top speed of 247 km/h (153.5 mph), which was Volkswagen's highest-performance production car ever, until the Golf R32 in 2004

And here is what the motor looks like with Alternator on it and was like this from the factory. You can call Bahnbrenner ask for Jason he is a really good friend and has the kit for you to do this. I have there kit.


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

Niiice! :thumbup:


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Any disadvantages to not running the transmission side SC bracket? I def like the look of the block off plate with breather instead of my modified charger bracket with breather that will most likely leak unless I fix the previous owners weak attempt at attaching a breather hose to the bracket.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

Swirved said:


> Any disadvantages to not running the transmission side SC bracket? I def like the look of the block off plate with breather instead of my modified charger bracket with breather that will most likely leak unless I fix the previous owners weak attempt at attaching a breather hose to the bracket.


No charger is secure if you use the bottom bracket also. you will be fine:thumbup:

That's what I was avoiding was using the back g60 bracket and having to modify it and oil everywhere. I also tapped my valve cover with NPT fitting and have that and the one from the block running to a catch can instead of using the beetle breather at oil caps. Leaves a mess and break all the time. Looks cleaner with out it.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Ok, by lower bracket I assume you mean the tube bracket that mounts under the oil filter and goes diagonally up to the charger?

Is it a must to have another vent spot coming from the valve cover? I was literally going to paint it today and would rather do the modifying first if need be.

Otherwise what I did was take the bracket that had been modified by the previous owner and put a new pipe thread/-10 AN fitting into the spot with some #1 gasket maker on the threads then torqued it in. Looks nice but man the bbm bracket would be much much nicer! I was just worried about SC support. Anyways thanks for the help!

Oh, I just remembered I also upgraded the 4 front mounting bolts on the charger from m8x1.25 to m10x1.5 bolts so there should be some added support there I would assume.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

Swirved said:


> Ok, by lower bracket I assume you mean the tube bracket that mounts under the oil filter and goes diagonally up to the charger?
> 
> Is it a must to have another vent spot coming from the valve cover? I was literally going to paint it today and would rather do the modifying first if need be.
> 
> ...


Yeah just use the pipe looking one under the oil filter you will be fine. As far as venting yes make it vent from Valve cover with a tap or you can buy the bbm beetle valve cover cap. but they tend to be messy from what ive heard and seen.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Hmmm well at 2nd look on BBM's site their block off plates won't work on my block.... So hopefully my modified bracket doesn't leak because it's all sorted and installed at the moment.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

Swirved said:


> Hmmm well at 2nd look on BBM's site their block off plates won't work on my block.... So hopefully my modified bracket doesn't leak because it's all sorted and installed at the moment.


That looks good. Im sure it will be fine:thumbup:


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Accessory mounts are designed to dampen oscillation forces. The weight of the actual parts is a secondary thought. 

You ever wonder what the critical speed of a G60 is? Use all the mounts and you won't have to.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*G Lader Bracket*

Well from what ive seen on the 16v g60 LTD I don't think they use that rear bracket. but to each there own. I will let you know if my charger falls off on the highway :laugh:


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

jeffs vw said:


> Well from what ive seen on the 16v g60 LTD I don't think they use that rear bracket. but to each there own. I will let you know if my charger falls off on the highway :laugh:



Oh you mean the 70 cars built by VW motorsports with a bucket of spare parts? I'm talking about the charger's rev limit. Like any rotating assembly, at certain speeds, it is not balanced and is subject to self destruction. You remove a damper; you lower its rev limit. But, alas, the G60 already has a natural cause of death. Knowing that it died unnaturally is not likely. It's really a moot point here. More just an academic gesture.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

still_a_G said:


> Oh you mean the 70 cars built by VW motorsports with a bucket of spare parts? I'm talking about the charger's rev limit. Like any rotating assembly, at certain speeds, it is not balanced and is subject to self destruction. You remove a damper; you lower its rev limit. But, alas, the G60 already has a natural cause of death. Knowing that it died unnaturally is not likely. It's really a moot point here. More just an academic gesture.


I agree. but I believe it was more like 71 cars. Im a risk taker.Guess we will see how long this charger will last..... I just found a hair line crack in my intake manifold super bummed. So I just ordered a new short runner from my homies at Turbo parts in Hamberg. they hooked it up. I will post pics as soon a I get.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Got the motor in yesterday, now to button up loose ends before putting bumper & radiator on.









So now that it's in, the 8v g60 coolant hardline that goes from water pump to the heatercore with 1 "T" for the coolant bubble drain back still doesn't fit. Took it to. BBM to compare with a 16v hardline and they are identical except for the 16v having one more port. So I have tried and tried to find a solution other than bending and or a custom bracket with no luck. There has to be someone out there with a running 16vg60 that doesn't have this problem.


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## NoFear (Feb 17, 2005)

*From Turkey 16V G60 Engine .*


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*16v g60*


```

```
Does anyone have the correct belt # to use 68mm pulley? Ive tried to use the BBM Adjuster and that thing pisses me off. when you try to use it with the belt they give for the kit it does not work its way to tight to the point the spring is all binded up. Ive tried a bigger belt and still no luck. :banghead:


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

jeffs vw said:


> ```
> 
> ```
> Does anyone have the correct belt # to use 68mm pulley? Ive tried to use the BBM Adjuster and that thing pisses me off. when you try to use it with the belt they give for the kit it does not work its way to tight to the point the spring is all binded up. Ive tried a bigger belt and still no luck. :banghead:


Hi Jeff, call me.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

JBETZ said:


> Hi Jeff, call me.


John I will call you tomorrow


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Why is a G60 oxygen sensor needed? Does it have a different range than the stock 16V one?


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

Another question I have for anyone that's done 16v g60 swap. How is the motor mount on passenger mounted if the bracket for Alternator is right there blocking 2 of the holes. Just trying to get answers before I get my truck back and try to install engine.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

jeffs vw said:


> Another question I have for anyone that's done 16v g60 swap. How is the motor mount on passenger mounted if the bracket for Alternator is right there blocking 2 of the holes. Just trying to get answers before I get my truck back and try to install engine.


I just did this part of it the other day. Check out my build thread for pics.

You take the alternator off when you are putting it in, then take off the lower alternator bracket, the one that sits on the motor mount so you can see the motor mount holes a bit better. Line up the other two mounting points and check to see if the rear engine motor mount is lined up. If it is, you have much better luck than I did. If not, you can try repositioning with the engine still supported but be advised that any rocking you may do may cause the car to become unbalanced and fall off the jack stands. This is why I attached the CV joints, refastened the ball joints and put the car back on the ground when I needed to reposition it. Shake it around, find some leverage points and keep trying to get at least one of the three bolts in. Took me like 8 hours, but it got done right. Don't forget the spacers on the bracket!

That was a bit lengthy, but it's all there.

Plus, on your belt question, I used a 6PK2236 belt. I had to buy another idler pulley identical to the one that is supplied in the BBM kit to make it fit though. $11 bucks on amazon with free shipping. Good stuff. I have a picture of my belt routing on my build thread. Almost the same as OEM 16VG60.

Finally, for the hardline, I used the stock 16V one. Fit just fine. No problems.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> I just did this part of it the other day. Check out my build thread for pics.
> 
> You take the alternator off when you are putting it in, then take off the lower alternator bracket, the one that sits on the motor mount so you can see the motor mount holes a bit better. Line up the other two mounting points and check to see if the rear engine motor mount is lined up. If it is, you have much better luck than I did. If not, you can try repositioning with the engine still supported but be advised that any rocking you may do may cause the car to become unbalanced and fall off the jack stands. This is why I attached the CV joints, refastened the ball joints and put the car back on the ground when I needed to reposition it. Shake it around, find some leverage points and keep trying to get at least one of the three bolts in. Took me like 8 hours, but it got done right. Don't forget the spacers on the bracket!
> 
> ...


Thanks for Belt number...... I should have mentioned I have a MK 1 not Mk2 which is much easier because the kit is ment for that rear motor mount un like the Mk1 where the motor mount goes on the passenger frame rail versus the rear. so my mount is on the side of the block like a mk1 8v motor


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

What is everyone doing for the G-Lader duct going from the G-Lader to the TB port pointing down? I just bought a stock G60 one but it doesn't fit, I'm thinking I have to plastic weld, fill, then paint to get it to work?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> What is everyone doing for the G-Lader duct going from the G-Lader to the TB port pointing down? I just bought a stock G60 one but it doesn't fit, I'm thinking I have to plastic weld, fill, then paint to get it to work?


I assume you mean the return? If so then what you can do is run a 90* off the throttle body , cut the pipe where it meets and plastic weld up a coupler onto the end to give it that OEM look.


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## cyberstasi (Apr 20, 2010)

Issam Abed said:


> Ok 2 people so far.
> Add your name to the list below:
> 
> 1


I know its been a while so i dont know if this is still possible.
I'd be up for one of these... IF I could ever actually figure out a list of all the parts I need. After reading 50 pages of this thread Im more confused than ever. BBM's site mentions the same motor stuff as the first post here. But then people are talking about different crank pulleys, coolant flanges, etc.
So I've got to figure out what all I need before I decide if I want to tackle this build over the winter.

Does anyone have a spreadsheet or something they've made listing everything they've bought for their build?
I've got 3 Spare PG blocks in my garage... so I figure I might as well do something with one of them.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

cyberstasi said:


> I know its been a while so i dont know if this is still possible.
> I'd be up for one of these... IF I could ever actually figure out a list of all the parts I need. After reading 50 pages of this thread Im more confused than ever. BBM's site mentions the same motor stuff as the first post here. But then people are talking about different crank pulleys, coolant flanges, etc.
> So I've got to figure out what all I need before I decide if I want to tackle this build over the winter.
> 
> ...


Hey there man,

I will be coming up with THE MOST comprehensive list for the conversion out there. Even down to the bolt sizes you need. I'll even be making a DIY. But keep in mind I did mine as close as possible to OEM so if you're wanting custom stuff, it will only help you get some of the way there. 

Keep an eye out for the thread, I'll post a link here when I'm done.

Cheers!


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## cyberstasi (Apr 20, 2010)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Hey there man,
> 
> I will be coming up with THE MOST comprehensive list for the conversion out there. Even down to the bolt sizes you need. I'll even be making a DIY. But keep in mind I did mine as close as possible to OEM so if you're wanting custom stuff, it will only help you get some of the way there.
> 
> ...


I look forward to it. Once I have a baseline to go with, then I can figure out what id need if I divert from your build.
It gets confusing reading this because someone would say 'hey I'm going to try ______', and then they never report back if it worked or if they went with something else. Or in several threads different people will say they are using different parts for the same task. I assume that's because of minor differences in their builds.... but since I don't know what those differences are... I'm not sure which I should use.

What I know I'm starting with: PG block and a Lysholm Charger. Everything else is up in the air. lol.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Ummm... I built it with a 16V base and G-Lader. So it's going to differentiate on A LOT of things. But I'm sure it will help on the detailed stuff. But then again, it's actually completely different. 

I'll still do a write up, and you can see where it may help you.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

cyberstasi said:


> I know its been a while so i dont know if this is still possible.
> I'd be up for one of these... IF I could ever actually figure out a list of all the parts I need. After reading 50 pages of this thread Im more confused than ever. BBM's site mentions the same motor stuff as the first post here. But then people are talking about different crank pulleys, coolant flanges, etc.
> So I've got to figure out what all I need before I decide if I want to tackle this build over the winter.
> 
> ...


Sorry the mention above was using 06A blocks not VW827 which you currently have.

As for crank pulleys:
*Timing belt* - you use the 16V unit
*Accessory drive pulley* - you can NOT use the PG unit unless you machine it 6mm (which is not possible since it is made from steel and the lip thickness is under 4mm). The best bet is sourcing an ABA unit and machining that or making an aluminum unit and using the PG hamronic dampner (but then you will need to space out the accessories you run on the v-belt as they will not be sitting in the same plane as though they were on a 16V not an 8V , hence why BBM supplies power steering and water pump spacers with the kit).

Coolant flanges:
*Cylinder head front* - you can either cap it off and depend fully on the side coolant flange or cut and weld to clearance the rear of the G60 charger
*Side coolant flange* - space it out 

HTH


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## cyberstasi (Apr 20, 2010)

Issam Abed said:


> Sorry the mention above was using 06A blocks not VW827 which you currently have.
> 
> As for crank pulleys:
> *Accessory drive pulley* - you can NOT use the PG unit unless you machine it 6mm (which is not possible since it is made from steel and the lip thickness is under 4mm). The best bet is sourcing an ABA unit and machining that or making an aluminum unit and using the PG hamronic dampner (but then you will need to space out the accessories you run on the v-belt as they will not be sitting in the same plane as though they were on a 16V not an 8V , hence why BBM supplies power steering and water pump spacers with the kit).


So if I get my hands on the BBM kit, am I correct in assuming that I'd then be able to use my accessory pulley? I was planning on purchasing their kit, just to make things simpler on myself.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

cyberstasi said:


> So if I get my hands on the BBM kit, am I correct in assuming that I'd then be able to use my accessory pulley? I was planning on purchasing their kit, just to make things simpler on myself.


Your current accessory pulley is set up for an 8V . I am not sure what crankshaft pulley is supplied with the kit but I would recommend one that has a harmonic dampner.
We have made in the past units using the Fluidampr with a machined aluminum power steering parasite pulley. Only issue is you need to space out the water pump and power steering pulley as the fluidampr is thicker than the OEM pulleys so no way to make it flush.
That being said you can try sourcing an ABA unit used and machine it down to be @ the right height.

Minor update:
VW PART # : *037 121 030 A* is now NLA. 

This is the water pump pulley for the Corrado / Passat G60 Non-AC where the water pump runs on the same serpentine belt as the G60 charger & Alternator. If you want to run a ribbed pulley on the water pump , there was no other option but :

finding a used one (rusted out)
using a smoothe OBD-1 VR6 unit and flipping it around
using a MK4 P/S pulley and correcting the offset to bring the ribs all into the same plane.
The issue with the OBD-1 VR6 water pump pulleys is on belts that have a long travel (ABA / AFN / etc) is the belt falls off and the MK4 unit is stamped steel.
:thumbdown:

So , we found one in Germany NOS and imported it. The list price was astronomical in comparison to other stampled steel VW pulley parts , however , Volkswagen can keep the NLA/NOS parts as these are now recreated in T6061  

















and are available from [email protected]
http://www.eaaengineering.com/serpentine-belt-conversion-kits-pulleys/

:thumbup:


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

:heart: Preetty!


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## gti1977 (Oct 1, 2008)

Brian.G said:


> Lovely rail:thumbup:


Thanks BrianG


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Parts*

I have a 16v g60 bracket kit and BBM charger for sale if anyone needs.


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## cyberstasi (Apr 20, 2010)

jeffs vw said:


> I have a 16v g60 bracket kit and BBM charger for sale if anyone needs.


Id love to buy that entire setup you have... somehow I think my bank is less interested in paying for it than I am in buying it.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

Shoot me an offer.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

What are people doing for the fuel pump after-run switch that is on the OEM G60 fuel rail? I've been combing through pictures of other 16VG60 setups, and none of them have it. Including the OEM 16VG60. Can someone please explain to me why it's not needed?


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

I am wondering the same thing^^^

Especially since I didn't take mine off my 8v before it went bye bye.....


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Swirved said:


> I am wondering the same thing^^^
> 
> Especially since I didn't take mine off my 8v before it went bye bye.....


I have an extra one if it turns out we need it. Which I'm hoping we don't?


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> What are people doing for the fuel pump after-run switch that is on the OEM G60 fuel rail? I've been combing through pictures of other 16VG60 setups, and none of them have it. Including the OEM 16VG60. Can someone please explain to me why it's not needed?



I'm installing mine this week. It's not required but it will keep the pump running for the correct amount of time. It is used in conjunction with the after run air temp sensor. They both need to be wired to work properly. I'll take pics later.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Please do! I really hate to have to add another thing to my list of needs to be done for car to run and run properly. 

And thanks for letting me know you have an extra volkswagoneer1990!


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

OK, so don't worry about it right now unless you live in the south. The idea is to keep fuel pressure high after the engine shuts off. So the temp sensor says: "hey, the fuel rail is hot" and the pressure switch says: "OK, I'll keep the pump on for a little while until things cool down." This prevents boiling. That's the idea anyways. Maybe I'm wrong. Another thing to keep in mind is that the 16V fuel rail is not under an intake manifold like it is on the 8V. This makes vapor lock less likely.


On mine, the switch is tee'd into the fittings at the FPR. I originally had a pressure gauge in this port:



















The sensor will be installed somewhere around here:


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

I live where it's rainy 8-9 months out of the year so screw all that extra non-sense! Lol


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Yeah I'm in Texas so I'll have to fit that...

Question: Does the switch have to be on the return side after the FPR? Can I add a T on the _supply line_ coming into the rail and then have the switch there?

This is the drawing I came up with...


Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr

But I am also wanting to put it on the other side of the rail (supply side) because it would look better aesthetically and I wouldn't have to extend a wire that far.

Thanks!


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Yeah I'm in Texas so I'll have to fit that...
> 
> Question: Does the switch have to be on the return side after the FPR? Can I add a T on the _supply line_ coming into the rail and then have the switch there?
> 
> ...



You need to install on the supply side so it will be exposed to the pressure in the rail. The return is not pressurized. Remember to put the temp sensor anywhere near the injectors. It just needs to know how hot the fuel is.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

still_a_G said:


> You need to install on the supply side so it will be exposed to the pressure in the rail. The return is not pressurized. Remember to put the temp sensor anywhere near the injectors. It just needs to know how hot the fuel is.


Awesome! Thank you! And I have the temp sensor under the ISV. :thumbup:


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Found a location for mine. Nice and hidden and the OEM screw threaded beautifully with a hole on the side of my 16V head. Going to replace the hose with a newer longer one to be able to reach the fuel rail T I plan to add on the supply side.

Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

:thumbup:

Last night I was extending the wires. I learned that if the temp wire is grounded the fan turns on. So the temp sensor is probably also just a ground switch. Without it the after-run logic thinks that the engine bay is always cold.

So as far as the pressure switch goes, its "no pressure" state is also an open circuit. The circuit closes above a certain pressure. With no switch, the after-run logic thinks the engine is cold and the pump was never turned on.

I'll take another look at the Bentley later to see if I can come up with an if-then-else statement.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> Remember to put the temp sensor anywhere near the injectors. It just needs to know how hot the fuel is.


:thumbup:
Also remember you are going from a plastic fuel rail to an Aluminum one so anywhere on the manifold will be fine.




Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Found a location for mine.


You are using the Aluminum crankcase vent . Why not modify it to accept the G60 rear support bracket? How are you supporting the rear currently? It really should not rely on the 4 bolts holding it to the Supercharger bracket.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> :thumbup:
> Also remember you are going from a plastic fuel rail to an Aluminum one so anywhere on the manifold will be fine.
> 
> You are using the Aluminum crankcase vent . Why not modify it to accept the G60 rear support bracket? How are you supporting the rear currently? It really should not rely on the 4 bolts holding it to the Supercharger bracket.


I've considered this. But I also look to the OEM 16VG60 and I see that it does not have the rear support bracket either. It would be nice to have it modified, I believe Bar-Tek does that. But I will have to save up funds for that. In the meanwhile, I can live with it.

http://www.bar-tek-tuning.com/cgi-b...6016125&file=26&gesamt_zeilen=0Tsuche--16VG60

This is what I ended up doing for the fuel rail. Exactly how I described it earlier. T at the supply side to incorporate fuel pump afterrun switch.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*16v G60 WHAT CHOICE CAMS*

:beer:


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## Superman (Dec 8, 2000)

Subscribed.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*mk2 16v g60*

Has anyone had any issues that have a mk2 gti that the motor sits slightly higher on the passenger side? Today I mounted motor in and wasn't sure if I was doing something wrong but checked everything and seems to sit higher im using 9a block mk2 motor mount and mk2 rear motor mount bracket with bbm limited kit.
Only thing I wasn't sure of is if the rear motor mount bracket that is on the block is the same as corrado g60?


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## Superman (Dec 8, 2000)

jeffs vw said:


> Only thing I wasn't sure of is if the rear motor mount bracket that is on the block is the same as corrado g60?


The part numbers are the same for the bracket and motor mount. Post a picture so we can see what's up (literally).


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## cyberstasi (Apr 20, 2010)

Finally getting around to this... http://i.imgur.com/ef9lcYM.jpg

Started breaking down my PL motor today... and look what I found... It was wedged in there quite tightly. 

http://i.imgur.com/Eqzprmi.jpg

When I checked the lower intake, none of the injectors were missing it. I wonder how long it was in the head. lol. Motor ran great before taking it apart.


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## Superman (Dec 8, 2000)

Wow, someone was very lucky with that one there.


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

Hello. I am writing from canada.

I just finished the marathon of reading all 71 pages.

I have a few questions and also want to double check assumptions I have made along the way.

Is there anyone with this motor in a passat b3 platform?

I plan to drop this into my 91 sedan .

I plan on keeping the a/c and power steering on it. 
I already did a proper serpentine belt conversion on it with 98 tdi parts and the abf harmonic balancer.

I have a complete corrado swap.
2 complete plug and play abf swaps. Down to the immo set-up and transponder keys.
Los of 16v performance parts.

I began reading with a aba/16v with double stack head gaskets in mind.

Later I read and decided on a 9a stock compression with the g-ladder strapped to it.
And near the end I hope the idea of putting the abfs to use.

I plan to run all oem evap systems due to bianual smog testing.

Not looking for a race car. I rebuilt the 9a 75000 kms ago. I know what that feels like. I want a tad more.

Which of the three should be the most rewarding?. Please look at the individual benefits of each one

Aba16v clone. Cheap to drop compression ration. Easy to get parts for.

9a stock plus g-ladder. A bit trickier to tune but it might have been done and I simply have to do less labour on the long block that is in the car already.

The abf is the biggest oem intake you can flow. I have 2 full swaps and I think I have a larger engine bay than most people here to accomodate the more intricate boost piping?


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

Just a thought.... Is there an electromagnetic pulley for G60 laderwhich could be turned on/off so 16V can be N/A or when needed - supercharged.


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

I guess with time and money anything can be made. But if you build an intake path for the charge of air as a supercharged motor and then you go ahead flick a switch and disengage the gladder, I dont think you will have the same performance out of that engine as if it was normally aspirated with a normally aspirated intake system.


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

:thumbup: Yes, I was thinking about that after posting the question...


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

Now if you throw more money and time to it; look at the variable length intake develop by brian.g over at clubgti in the u.k. then you could attemp what you want to achieve


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Apologies for not responding sooner!


134hpvw said:


> Hello. I am writing from canada.


So am I ! :thumbup:


134hpvw said:


> 1. Is there anyone with this motor in a passat b3 platform?
> 2. I plan to drop this into my 91 sedan .
> 3. I plan on keeping the a/c and power steering on it.
> 4. I already did a proper serpentine belt conversion on it with 98 tdi parts and the abf harmonic balancer.
> ...


1. 16V G60 in a Passat? Yes , infact they came OEM from VWMS , extremely rare but still avaialble none the less.
2. Ok
3. Ok
4. Not sure how you accomplished that considering the supercharger still needs to be on the serpentine. I assume your power steering and water pump are on a v-belt?
5. Ok
6. Ok



134hpvw said:


> Which of the three should be the most rewarding?. Please look at the individual benefits of each one
> Aba16v clone. Cheap to drop compression ration. Easy to get parts for.
> 9a stock plus g-ladder. A bit trickier to tune but it might have been done and I simply have to do less labour on the long block that is in the car already.
> The abf is the biggest oem intake you can flow. I have 2 full swaps and I think I have a larger engine bay than most people here to accomodate the more intricate boost piping?


Depends on your budget. Each one of those set ups will require some form of custom parts or you will be stuck with a hacked together set up.
For e.g. ABA 16V - timing belt covers will be needed - also depends on what you plan to do for management. You will need a 16V fuel rail (modified 1.8T) in order to run Digi-I , just as an example
9A stock + G-ladder , still need a rear charger bracket at least
and so on and so forth.



MOTA BOY said:


> Just a thought.... Is there an electromagnetic pulley for G60 laderwhich could be turned on/off so 16V can be N/A or when needed - supercharged.


At Waterfest 2010? I show cased a 2.0 20V Turbo + Supercharged motor. The supercharger used was a Rotrex C30-98 and what we did was we used the VW 1.4 TSI twin charged supercharger clutch.
For visual purposes imagine 2 pulleys in series. 1 pulley is on the supercharger and 1 pulley is turned by the crankshaft/accessories. When the clutch is off , the supercharger never spins . The clutch was on a bosch 2 pin solenoid that could be switched on and off in the cabin. Unfortunately because I wanted to run the motor on ME7.5 , there were no extra GPO's to tie the solenoid against say MAP or TPS input which made the kit ideal for someone on standalone but not someone on OEM management so I abandoned the idea and sold the kit to a guy who put it in a MK1 GTI.
All that to say , there is not an electromagnetic pulley but there could be if you made a whole new supercharger bracket.


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

Isaam thanks for getting back to me.

I read all pages and have figured that the rear charger bracket will be cut and welded to an early style 16v oil breather.

The abf clone timing belt covers are looked after. That is why I stated I have full swaps. Even the airboxes.

The fuel rail situation. Again I read all pages and I have a obx rail. Plenty of 1.8t fuel rails available. 

I am aware of all the mix matching and why for each of the 3 options I presented.

So leaving aside any custom fabrication or rare parts requirement. Which of the 3 will be the most rewarding?

I phoned bbm last week to see how much they pay for g ladder cores and I asked about running an abf intake. He told me to forget about it unless I wanted a big headache...

What do you think?

P.s. engine management will be digi1 with a chip unless abf management can be Chipped to recognze the co pot signal?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

134hpvw said:


> What do you think?
> 
> P.s. engine management will be digi1 with a chip unless abf management can be Chipped to recognze the co pot signal?


I think you have most if not all the parts to build an ABF G60 (ABF or ABA/16V clone) and that is the route I would go. Apologies if I came off firm , from your response , you most definitely know what you are doing or at the very least the direction you want to go in. The ABF manifold (true ABF) will require cutting and flipping of the plenum in order to bring the throttle body outlet to the distributor side , hence, the manifold being referred to as a "headache" . IMHO based on your skill set , it will not be an issue for you.

As for tuning Digi-III to run a co-pot? I wouldn't bother to be honest. If you are going to go through that much trouble to pair 1 component off one management system onto another management system then I would just go standalone from the get go. Would save you alot of headache in the future.


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

If you are planning on using the stock G60 IC or similar side mount location, then the Scirocco Intake is sort of a no brainer, so you have all of the piping on the driver's side.

Trying to get the alternator under the true ABF intake certainly sounds like a nightmare, if at all possible. Plus, the ABF intake (which I am sure you know) uses the ABA Throttle body, so you would have to figure out boost return when not using the G60 TB.

If you are in the mood for a MUCh more custom build and plan on running a front mount IC where it is beneficial to have the IC piping on both sides of the car, then you could craft a 16v manifold to match what I did for my 20v Hybrid (possibly keeping the G60 TB instead). Just note as a disclaimer (If this is the first time seeing them), when looking at these pictures, that Front mount that I assembled was a MASSIVE undertaking .

FWIW: I am building a G60 ABF for my son's car and it and I will use the SII intake.


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## cyberstasi (Apr 20, 2010)

sdezego said:


> FWIW: I am building a G60 ABF for my son's car and it and I will use the SII intake.


Do you have an ABF, or are you building a abf clone out of an aba block and a 16v head?


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

Thanks for the explanation and pictures. 

I wanted to use as big of an intake as I can. Thats why I insisted on the abf manifold. 
Yes I am aware the flange is different for the tb. I have the abf tb. Maybe I can cut and weld a cis style flange on it or buy an adapter plate .
But looking at your pictures I think a front mount inter ooler is not in my plans due to space and my desire to keep all ac and radiator shrouds in place and uncut.

The alternator would have been plaxe behind the hwad much like any other 16v intake set up


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

When you say "as big of an intake as possible" are you referring to Runner length or Diameter? Have you considered the Golf/Jetta 16v intake (much like the ABF, but has the correct TB flange)? Granted you will need a custom fuel rail, but that is easy. Just curios and sorry if that was already answered above.

Definitely tradeoffs when using short runner intake 16v with G60, since you will lose a little low-mid end torque, but might gain some hp up top if you plan on revving your G60 . The additional problems you will run into when trying to run any pass side manifold (if the alt will even fit) will be trying to keep A/C. The Expansion valve will be your other enemy. ...again I have pics to help illustrate (Since I am keeping A/C although Condenser is behind IC) 











My Alt Mount is completely custom and you will see that I am using the Mk4 Alt with is smaller than the G60. I still can't visualize there being enough room for any Pass side 16v intake.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

sdezego said:


> I still can't visualize there being enough room for any Pass side 16v intake.


Neither can I. I had to get rid of the ABF manifold in favour of a Rocco 50mm unit because there was no room for:

Alternator
Rear engine mount bracket
Alternator bracket
ABF intake manifold brackets
 ABF throttle body

...That is alot of components in a small space.


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Intake Manifold*



134hpvw said:


> Thanks for the explanation and pictures.
> 
> I wanted to use as big of an intake as I can. Thats why I insisted on the abf manifold.
> Yes I am aware the flange is different for the tb. I have the abf tb. Maybe I can cut and weld a cis style flange on it or buy an adapter plate .
> ...


You can also use this intake manifold. I believe I got this one for my mk2 from either Bartek or HRT. Easier to use cause eliminates injector extensions & wont be in the way of distributor.

This one is also 9a with Piston & Rods


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

We stock the HRT, made in Germany and includes the fuel rail to 
Feel free to inquire if you need one with the Mk2 t-body flange.

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/products/2761/16V_Intake_Manifold_Short_Runner_Turbo_w_VR6_Adapter


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

Thanks to all the people that replied to my questions.

I see a strong point of why NOT to use the abf intake. I will have to try and see if I can make it fit with the alternator back there and maybe have custom ac hoses made.

I wont know until I first build the front of the motor and be ready to move onto the ba k side of it.

It will be almost springtime b the time I am there.

In the meantime I will try a ro o 16v upper manifold and tb in a passat engine bay. Maybe I get away without the use of the bbm elbow I alread have.

If not I will cut and weld a kr intake with a roco 16v plenum to build a roco 50mm clone and use the bbm elbow in combination


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

JBETZ said:


> We stock the HRT, made in Germany and includes the fuel rail to
> Feel free to inquire if you need one with the Mk2 t-body flange.


John, does it clear the twin-screw charger? 

Thanks! :wave::beer:


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

CrankWorkOrange said:


> John, does it clear the twin-screw charger?
> 
> Thanks! :wave::beer:


Yes it does :thumbup:


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

still_a_G said:


> Why's that? There's no interference between the v-belt and the serp belt.
> 
> Reference:




I *LOVE* this setup, is the owner maybe here on Vortex, is there a build thread maybe?


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## CrankWorkOrange (Mar 15, 2004)

MOTA BOY said:


> I *LOVE* this setup, is the owner maybe here on Vortex, is there a build thread maybe?



Hey, that was my mock-up setup. It never actually ran but everything lined up perfectly. I got rid of PS and trying for a single serpentine belt. Reverse WP impeller and all...

:beer:


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

Okay. Today after work I took some time to mock up the roco upper intake with a g60 tb onto the passat engine bay.

It is still up in the air if it will work.

I have about 1/4" clearance between the recirculation port and the brake fluid reservoir. Just enough for the hose thickness to fit.

I took detail pictures from various angles and I might have issues with the shifting of the motor. Of course this was only a 15 minutes setion. I need more time to work it out.

Yes the linkage for the recirculation butterfly hits the distributor cap. That can be remedied bending the linkage a bit or once I put a Audi v8 cap on it which i have at home and forgot to take with me.

This motor had no gasket spacers at the head lower I take or between the two intake halves like my motor does. Changing also the radius the runners make and also displacing the tb from todays measurements. I hope for the better.

I will get pictures up in a day or 2


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

134hpvw said:


> Okay. Today after work I took some time to mock up the roco upper intake with a g60 tb onto the passat engine bay.
> 
> It is still up in the air if it will work.
> 
> ...


Here is a pic of a motor I built a year or two ago with Twinscrew and short runner intake manifold. Save yourself some money and go directly thru HRT or TurboParts.de and purchase from them. I got this one shipped to me for $335.21 to my door. :thumbup:


And my recent build with g lader and the intake manifold


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## MOTA BOY (Aug 21, 2007)

CrankWorkOrange said:


> Hey, that was my mock-up setup. It never actually ran but everything lined up perfectly. I got rid of PS and trying for a single serpentine belt. Reverse WP impeller and all...
> 
> :beer:


This is my current setup (pic). I was going for 16VT, but G60 is more attractive to me. All the info abut this setup please?


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

jeffs vw said:


> Here is a pic of a motor I built a year or two ago with Twinscrew and short runner intake manifold. Save yourself some money and go directly thru HRT or TurboParts.de and purchase from them. I got this one shipped to me for $335.21 to my door. :thumbup:
> 
> 
> And my recent build with g lader and the intake manifold





You have the Chinese version, that can be fine for some people.
There is a difference in quality.

We sell the German HRT version with fuel rail and if you calculate in the shipping from Germany we sell them for a great price to.
These are also in stock here on the shelf. We get these to people quickly in a few days, no long wait.

Love your new giddy up!


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

*Intake Manifold*

:laugh:


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

Custom Built BBM RS-500 Supercharger. This one is going on another PG 16v running on stand alone.
We will be posting progress updates on the BBM Facebook.

BBM RS500 SUPERCHARGER


















































BBM RS500 SUPERCHARGER


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## cyberstasi (Apr 20, 2010)

That charger is gorgeous.


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

*passat b3 16vg60 attempt*

as promised.

I took the engine bay of a parts car at my friend's yard to use as mock up .

pulled the upper Passat/mk2 intake manifold



slapped on a u.s. market roco 16v intake on the motor; no spacer gasket used like the one my car has on right now.




on this same thread earlier I read that the roco 16v throttle cable is used when doing this set-up on a mk2. well the Passat shows some additional benefits to being a larger car in some aspects...

the oem cable fits nicely



then I got a closer look at the area that causes trouble for any mk2 owner attempting this set-up



the Passat has a bit of extra room in the engine bay as evidenced here


I am happy with the upper view of the area; but then a friend had to rain on my parade by telling me that the engine will rock and maybe hit the brake fluid reservoir



and the obvious issue of the distributor cap. I will look into this further with the use of an audi v8 cap or maybe look into one of those fiat or other brand caps.

that linkage will have to be " massaged" into shape. ..


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

cyberstasi said:


> That charger is gorgeous.


Thanks


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

Hey guys...just fnishing my 16vg60... a few random questions... its a built 2.0 with a 1.8 head..

g60 oil feed? back of engine drivers side..star bolt? remove and it fits? right now its on the side of the head next to the coolant flange...I believe that is wrong!
non abs brake booster vac line.. to intake mani?
vac lines... one from ecu to intake mani or TB? what about the ports on the TB? confused about vac lines... 
Also which sensors are more reliable.. The 16v or the g60.. Blue/black temp.. As i recall my G use to eat a blue one every 6 mo.
JBetz ... I have an older version of the HRT intake... it does not have the two threaded ports like the newer ones but two welded male clamp on ports.. One large one small..what could I use to get a snug fit??

thanks again!


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

Okay I have a 2.0 G6016V, I am really close to mine being ready to start. However, I have a question to those who are running a BOV. I am running a Weber TB and plan on putting the BOV as close to the TB as I can. But what I am struggling with is the BOV The one I have doesn't open up until about 20 PSI. I have adjusted it like they say, but I feel that the required VAC to make this work isn't going to happen. Please correct me on this. Can someone give me some options as to where to run the VAC line to for the reference for the BOV. Off of the TB? Or should I look for another source. Maybe tap the manifold and run a port from there. Nobody has really said anything about this. 

Plus another question I have is about the FPR. Would it best to run a factory G60 one or find a 4.0 bar one or run an adjustable one. 

Again thank you for your advise and help.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

No BOV with SC
Unless you have a huge godzilla 1-3/4" + inch size or running in conjunction with the throttle body diverter.
Most are way to small for SC and will pressure spike the charger.


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

JBETZ said:


> No BOV with SC
> Unless you have a huge godzilla 1-3/4" + inch size or running in conjunction with the throttle body diverter.
> Most are way to small for SC and will pressure spike the charger.[/]
> 
> So, with that in mind should I run a diverter valve instead? I don't have a return tube going back to the charger. Plus I am running the Weber Big throat TB and its a 3" single butterfly setup.


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## JBETZ (Feb 17, 2000)

kda33 said:


> JBETZ said:
> 
> 
> > No BOV with SC
> ...


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## kda33 (Jan 27, 2005)

Sounds great thank you for the tip!!


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

What about the sensor located in the boost return? Is it needed?


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

My cis-e motronic system keeps giving me problems. So it has to go. Car gets put away for the winter this sunday.

Engine swap is a reality for me .

The one thing that is making me hold back on this hybrid swap compared to an abf is the need for a/c I have. I want to put a climatronic system in my car.

Anybody here has succesfully retained the a/c?

I mocked up a mk3 90 amp alternator there and it is almost a no go.

I grabbed what looks like a mk1 alternator ; by the diminute size of it, and still it looks lime a tough go.


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## G60VeeDub (Mar 4, 2002)

Their aren't any sensors on the boost return, their is a heater element at the transition from crank case breather hose to boost return pipe. Do you have to have it, I would say no if you are in nice weather but if you drive in freezing temps I would keep it.


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

Then I think that up here canada I ought to keep that in ? Eh ?


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

Ahhhhhhhhhhh heater....I will wait on that... I am still figuring out all my other lines

Can my Frp be T'd off the Tb line to Ecu?
What can I use the large port off the Tb for? Too small for ISVs return?brake booster? 
I feel like I have seen the ISV return in both the off throttle boost return to blower as well as the intake before the intercooler ...


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## G60VeeDub (Mar 4, 2002)

I would not mess the ecu vac line it must be an exact length.
I put a vac cap on it.
The isv can be re-routed into the intake plumbing, because the isv will bleed booster over a certain psi.


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

I was mocking up a mk1 alternator in my test bay at the shop Saturday. after I went home I started thinking.

once this limited engine copy is running. can trouble codes be pulled from it?

I have a snap-on scanner with the vw audi package .

but did the factory built car have on board capabilities?

how do you know if any sensors are faulty or out of specs for the idle mixture per say. more than just an air fuel ratio gauge.


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

I'm trying to figure out how to connect my Fpr and brake booster to the smaller intake port... Any ideas?


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

IMWALKIN said:


> I'm trying to figure out how to connect my Fpr and brake booster to the smaller intake port... Any ideas?


i had my manifold tapped for vacuum line for FPR its so much easier to do since that line to FPR is small and you don't want to run T's everywhere….. Looks ghetto and sloppy


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

I was hoping to use what I have but can not find any clean fittings that would clamp up....can I use the larger port off the TB for anything? Right now it's capped


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

I spoke to bbm yesterday. Apparently once this motor is built you can not get trouble codes out of the ecm. 
Funny because the g60 power cars in canada . Passat syncro or corrado; can blink out the codes.
The motronic 16v passats and mk2 cars have diagnostic capabilities.

So instead of forward we go backwards. 
I asked the guy what did vwms do for this and he said no idea. So I said what do I do to trouble shoot this hybrid engine when assembled and he said you have to kind of throw parts at it.

Literally. Thats what he said.

I asked if I coul have a chip made for the euro abf swaps I have so I can gain dtc readout that way and he told me they dont because the abf was never available in america.

I think I will scrap the whole idea then and go with a normally aspirated abf high compression


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

I have not the oportunity yet to work on the mock up of my engine bay. But I think I have a solution for the tb hitting the brake fluid reservoir. I have a eurovan reservoir. The severe angled back shape and low overhang of it looks like it will provide the clearence I need NOT To use the bbm elbow. We will see .


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

134hpvw said:


> I have not the oportunity yet to work on the mock up of my engine bay. But I think I have a solution for the tb hitting the brake fluid reservoir. I have a eurovan reservoir. The severe angled back shape and low overhang of it looks like it will provide the clearence I need NOT To use the bbm elbow. We will see .



I lifted mine up and out of the way. Used flexible hydraulic tubing and barbed fittings to relocate it. Not the prettiest setup but it works.

Edit: Start here at post #61 and scroll down for the final product. http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...Vg60-build&p=77363584&viewfull=1#post77363584


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

I saw your build thread. I rather not have the engine bay look to full with home made contramptions. Thats why I picked the eurovan fluid reservoir.


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

You can't see that it's been relocated when viewed from above. But really, when you get it built and drive it around you're going to feel silly for wasting time on making it look nice. In the end it's just an engine.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> You can't see that it's been relocated when viewed from above. But really, when you get it built and drive it around you're going to feel silly for wasting time on making it look nice. In the end it's just an engine.


Really can't fault that logic.


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## 134hpvw (Sep 6, 2013)

I hear you. I am a practical kind of guy over cosmetics. I am not going to try and reinvent the wheel with this. If the eurovan reservoir doesnt fix it. Then I will follow your course of action...


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## suburbangeorge (Apr 24, 2004)

still_a_G said:


> I lifted mine up and out of the way. Used flexible hydraulic tubing and barbed fittings to relocate it. Not the prettiest setup but it works.
> 
> Edit: Start here at post #61 and scroll down for the final product. http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...Vg60-build&p=77363584&viewfull=1#post77363584


Saw your relocation. Doesn't look bad to me. Probably makes adding fluid easier but "heater hose"? Is that rated for brake fluid?


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

It's alive!!!!! I took my first drive yesterday!!!!!! So many years!!!! What everyone doing for the ISV... Some are deleting some are rerouting???? Some drill a 1mm hole on the TB butterfly????


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## DigiMatrix (Apr 16, 2010)

134hpvw said:


> I spoke to bbm yesterday. Apparently once this motor is built you can not get trouble codes out of the ecm.
> Funny because the g60 power cars in canada . Passat syncro or corrado; can blink out the codes.
> The motronic 16v passats and mk2 cars have diagnostic capabilities.
> 
> ...


It is possible to add code to the chip and send out info via the MIL line. Once you understand it, not too hard to do. I did this for a guy in France for his father's VWMS Golf years ago. It does take a while to figure out everything you need to know to get there though.

Remember that the blink codes are not always accurate because the eeprom is limited to the number of re-writes and it wears out and can cause wrong info to be retained even after an issue is fixed.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

still_a_G said:


> You can't see that it's been relocated when viewed from above. But really, when you get it built and drive it around you're going to feel silly for wasting time on making it look nice. In the end it's just an engine.


I beg to differ!
I have a grin ear to ear every time I drive my MR2 let alone look at the engine!









Not to say there are not downsides because believe there is!


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

IMWALKIN said:


> I'm trying to figure out how to connect my Fpr and brake booster to the smaller intake port... Any ideas?


Do not hook them both up to the same port. The Brake booster should have it's own large port and the FPR should have a dedicated small port.

You don't want something that can cause fluctuations in the FPR signal but more importantly, you don't want to risk the chance of a T breaking or worse and loose a boost signal to the FPR unexpectedly.

You can run a T (like the factory did) off of the booster line to manifold to your cluster, HVAC, etc, but just make sure you have a one way valve to your vacuum ball/HVAC line.


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

Thank you...I did a T off the smaller port on the left.. To fpr and brake booster.. And u are right it does see interference... The larger port I did the ISV, but have since removed and think I'm going to run without... Engine feels strong but still needs tuning...


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

Holy crap... Removed the brake booster from the fpr line and WOW!!!!!


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

IMWALKIN said:


> Holy crap... Removed the brake booster from the fpr line and WOW!!!!!


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

Still tuning..... A few ??
I thought i read somewhere the corrado Blue temp sensor for ecu is superior to the 16v in head coolant sensor? Is that true?
Also which spark plugs are you guys running with a higher modified kit...
Thank u all...


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

IMWALKIN said:


> Still tuning..... A few ??
> I thought i read somewhere the corrado Blue temp sensor for ecu is superior to the 16v in head coolant sensor? Is that true?
> Also which spark plugs are you guys running with a higher modified kit...
> Thank u all...


I would be curious to know as well. I am having a custom water neck built so I don't have to use a plastic one with a aluminum spacer that isn't even close to the correct shape. Still not 100% sure what ports it will need though, right now my plan was to run a black temp sensor for the MFA in it and the 16v in head instead of the blue Corrado sensor. Anything wrong with that?


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## IMWALKIN (Mar 28, 2002)

So research just lets me find opinons...but all of which say the blue sensor is better???


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## DigiMatrix (Apr 16, 2010)

Does this help at all?
http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_138_352&products_id=2179


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Just installed my 50mm scirocco manifold in and got it up and running. Only problem is that my Cat is now running red hot. So as to not damage it further I am having to trouble shoot without running it which is very difficult. I predict I will have to bite the bullet and just run it to adjust things. 

How do you adjust A/F on the Digi 1 fuel system? I have red that a red hot cat can be a cause of a rich condition. 

Pics for clicks:


Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr

Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr

Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

If anyone ever needs a 16VG60 vacuum routing diagram that combines both the 16V base (assuming Mk2) and the G60 components, I just made this after I replaced all my lines with silicone hose.


16VG60 Vacuum Diagram - UPDATE by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr


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## DigiMatrix (Apr 16, 2010)

I have no experience with the 16V engine vacuum set-up, but I know on the G60, the FPR vacuum source is directly from the intake manifold, not the throttle body. The idea is that at idle (low vacuum) the FPR return to the tank closes reducing the system pressure to 2.5 bar. At full load, the return to tank opens raising the pressure to 3 bar. This process ensures that the pressure difference (3 bar) between the intake manifold pressure and the fuel pressure remain constant and the varying intake manifold pressure has no influence on the injection quantity.

Your diagram seems to have the FPR connected to the throttle body. I think you should connect it to the capped port on your intake manifold. The way you have it may be causing your rich condition at idle. Have you measure your fuel rail pressure to ensure 2.5 bar at idle?


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

I see! 

Does it it matter that the capped port on the Manifold is on the lower 16V manifold and is essentially a port to the head? Also, does it matter that the vacuum line coming out of that would be like a 10mm line while the FPR's is a 3.5mm? A reducer would be needed. The previous scirocco manifold that was installed had ports right next to where it said DOHC-16V. I'm thinking that would be a better spot, but the capped port is closer. Just wondering those first two questions.

And I have not measured the fuel rail pressure yet.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> I see!
> 
> Does it it matter that the capped port on the Manifold is on the lower 16V manifold and is essentially a port to the head? Also, does it matter that the vacuum line coming out of that would be like a 10mm line while the FPR's is a 3.5mm? A reducer would be needed. The previous scirocco manifold that was installed had ports right next to where it said DOHC-16V. I'm thinking that would be a better spot, but the capped port is closer. Just wondering those first two questions.
> 
> And I have not measured the fuel rail pressure yet.


Answered my own question by deciding to make two ports in the 50mm manifold (saddening though) to mimic the G60 manifold.

[url=https://flic.kr/p/HRkHLR]
16VG60 Vacuum Diagram - v4 by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr[/URL]


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## still_a_G (Jun 23, 2008)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Just installed my 50mm scirocco manifold in and got it up and running. Only problem is that my Cat is now running red hot. So as to not damage it further I am having to trouble shoot without running it which is very difficult. I predict I will have to bite the bullet and just run it to adjust things.
> 
> How do you adjust A/F on the Digi 1 fuel system? I have red that a red hot cat can be a cause of a rich condition.


Holy crap. Do not drive it like that. I had that happen after I built my megasquirt setup. I had loose wires at the injector harness. Only half the cylinders were firing. You'd think it would be running lean but maybe the other 2 were overcompensating. This is not just a rich condition, this is unburnt fuel lighting up at the cat. Your muffler is probably getting white hot, too. Not a good situation to have so close to the fuel tank and lines.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

still_a_G said:


> Holy crap. Do not drive it like that. I had that happen after I built my megasquirt setup. I had loose wires at the injector harness. Only half the cylinders were firing. You'd think it would be running lean but maybe the other 2 were overcompensating. This is not just a rich condition, this is unburnt fuel lighting up at the cat. Your muffler is probably getting white hot, too. Not a good situation to have so close to the fuel tank and lines.


Not to worry, it's not being driven like this. I know there's fuel in the cat, muffler is okay, I'm just tracking it down one step at a time.


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## doggydaddy (Apr 19, 2016)

Just curious, Ive seen alot of horsepower numbers thrown around for various tuned G60's, most are around 200hp. I checked out SNStuning's website http://snstuning.com/ and their dyno tests show approx 180hp peak on the graph with a stage 5 16 valve. I'm considering doing a 16V G60 on my 1990 but I'm not sure if it's worth it considering what I'm seeing from SNS's dyno graphs (stage 5). Just wondering if anyone can share their input on it. I want to keep my car as stock appearance as possible (no chopping up the front for huge intercoolers), Digi1 injection, and prefer no smaller than 65mm on the pulley. Is 225HP a realistic possibility?


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## DigiMatrix (Apr 16, 2010)

Have a look here:

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?2058422-official-G60-Forum-top-20-whp-list&highlight=top


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## boogsvr6 (Dec 3, 2006)

I am currently building a 16v g60 for a 90 corrado. Corrado guys, what header are you using? What brands and applications.


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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

boogsvr6 said:


> I am currently building a 16v g60 for a 90 corrado. Corrado guys, what header are you using? What brands and applications.


You pretty much have 4 choices.

- Stock
- Stock manifold with TT downpipe
- Raceland 16v header (SuperSprint Knock off)
- SuperSprint

I have both a Raceland and a Supersprint. You get what you pay for, but the Raceland is very well made. Not sure how it will stand the test of time and "may be more prone to crack", however, tons of people run them in the 16v forum. There is a big long thread dedicated. You can buy 4 racelands compared to one SS header :banghead:


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## jeffs vw (Apr 29, 2007)

sdezego said:


> You pretty much have 4 choices.
> 
> - Stock
> - Stock manifold with TT downpipe
> ...


Will agree i ran 16v Raceland! i liked it and was made well! that header is still in another car still since 2008. all i recommend is after you put header on without tightening it take a sharpie draw lines where the two joints will be then take to a fabricator and have them weld all the way around. you will never have problems! if you don't it will LEAK I promise you!!!!


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## boogsvr6 (Dec 3, 2006)

Has anybody used TaTechnix headers. They make headers specifically for the 16v Corrado because they are out of Europe. Thought they might fit better.


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## Lourado (Aug 30, 2008)

need help. what did u guys do to get ur injectors to fit. i got these bushings from BBM and the brown inserts are stock ones for the 16v manifold but they don't seal against each other










one with just the BBM bushing and the other with the stock brown insert









pic with just injector and BBM bushing. doesn't look right


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Lourado said:


> need help. what did u guys do to get ur injectors to fit. i got these bushings from BBM and the brown inserts are stock ones for the 16v manifold but they don't seal against each other
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Brown one is 16v CIS-E specific. You don't need it as that's with a different fuel system. All you need to do is thread the white one like you have done and that's it. You pop the G60 injectors into that and they will seat and seal when you tighten down the BBM fuel rail.

Cheers


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## Lourado (Aug 30, 2008)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Brown one is 16v CIS-E specific. You don't need it as that's with a different fuel system. All you need to do is thread the white one like you have done and that's it. You pop the G60 injectors into that and they will seat and seal when you tighten down the BBM fuel rail.
> 
> Cheers


what about that o-ring on the end of the white bushing? looks like it will just fall off into the head.

without injector









with injector. how does that o-ring stay in place









injector


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

That O-ring won't fall. It's integrated into the bushing. If you needed to replace it I'm sure you could but you won't need to. Have you tried threading it in in reverse, where the O-ring is facing up? Can't remember if you can do that or not.


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## Lourado (Aug 30, 2008)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> That O-ring won't fall. It's integrated into the bushing. If you needed to replace it I'm sure you could but you won't need to. Have you tried threading it in in reverse, where the O-ring is facing up? Can't remember if you can do that or not.


no i haven't tried that. if i can remember correctly it only goes in one way. i go to lunch in about an hour so ill go home and check. but i remember that o-ring being real loose. if the o-ring doesn't seat to anything y keep it in


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Anyone know what this darn blue/white wire is for? It's the only wire I can't figure out on the ecu/engine harness. It has a female spade on the engine side and a female spade inside a plastic connecter at the fuse box. 


















Any help is greatly appreciated!

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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Apologies for the late response people. Been rather busy trying to get a few websites running....one of which is Kompressor Kanada 


Swirved said:


> Anyone know what this darn blue/white wire is for?


low oil pressure
There are 2 ports on the oil filter housing. One pre filtered oil and one post filtered oil. Don't ask why VW does that , they just do.



DigiMatrix said:


> but I know on the G60, the FPR vacuum source is directly from the intake manifold, not the throttle body.


As much as I agree with the rest if your post , I disagree with the above statement. Vaccuum signal @ intake plenum or post throttle body flap will be the same. Pressure is pressure....does not matter where it is in the plenum.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

A2 Resource says: low oil pressure = blue/black wire?


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## DigiMatrix (Apr 16, 2010)

Issam Abed said:


> Apologies for the late response people. Been rather busy trying to get a few websites running....one of which is Kompressor Kanada


Do tell us more - any updates?


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Think I found my answer to the blue/white wire. It's an extra included in the harness for Corrado VDO gauges. It attaches to the twin pole VDO oil pressure sender that you install in place of the low oil pressure switch. 


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

My 16VG60 is running like crap currently. Won't idle and won't accept acceleration. When I pull the spark plugs, they look carbon fouled like crazy like the engine has been dumping fuel with no reservations.

*Specs:* 
9A block & NOS 9A head
BBM Integration Kit
Stock G60 injectors, FPR, ECU (with BBM chip)
Stock G-Charger with 63mm pulley and BBM RSR Outlet to FMIC
Stock G60 fuel pump with new fuel filter
The fuel system is pretty much stock G60 


Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr

Halp?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

How is the timing?
When you open the throttle plate (accel) does it make a droneing sound and not increase RPM?


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> How is the timing?
> When you open the throttle plate (accel) does it make a droneing sound and not increase RPM?


I set the static timing according to Bentley specs, lined up all the lines that needed to be lined up, then moved if 6 degrees BTDC. So correct. Couldn't get it running long enough to get the engine to operating temp and finish out timing.

I haven't noticed a sound yet, but you're correct, no RPM increase at all. If any, it's like a puny increase.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> I haven't noticed a sound yet, but you're correct, no RPM increase at all. If any, it's like a puny increase.


Don't go to OEM specs.
Align camgear to valve cover
Align crankshaft pulley to mark on timing belt cover.
Set TDC on distributor and try again. Report back.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Quick question, where does the brown ground wire coming from fuse box to engine harness mount? I for some reason assumed it went to the motor, hoping that's right since I already wrapped my harness and have it installed... Please tell me it doesn't go to the body of the car for the love of God!

16VG60 - Corrado

Pic for reference:










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## sdezego (Apr 23, 2004)

There should be a few brown wires. ECU ground and sensor grounds from cluster. They all went to a bolt on the coolant flange on the side if the head. Directly on the head is fine (def not body).


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Ok thanks. Was kind of confusing because it's actually brown/white, either way A2 resource says it goes to head and Bentley says it goes to transmission. Guess I will just leave it where it is!


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> Don't go to OEM specs.
> Align camgear to valve cover
> Align crankshaft pulley to mark on timing belt cover.
> Set TDC on distributor and try again. Report back.


Finally home to do this. Just set everything. Waiting for it to warm up to start.


Untitledby Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr

Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr

Untitled by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr

If it doesn't work, what's next?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> If it doesn't work, what's next?


Remove Cyl #1 Spark plug and ensure piston is @ TDC before you put that timing belt back on.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> Remove Cyl #1 Spark plug and ensure piston is @ TDC before you put that timing belt back on.


It was at TDC when I turned the crankshaft to the cover mark and verified it with the flywheel. 

Did everything you said, and behold, the car runs! In fact, it runs even better than ever before. 

Secondary question: The idle is a bit sporadic. How hard would it be to complete the timing and set the idle correctly? I'm scared to touch anything since it's running so nicely (minus the idle issue). 

Tertiary Question: My oil light keeps blinking... Does that indicate low pressure or is the wiring crossed? I used the oil sensor locations for the G60 and mimicked them on the 16V.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Did everything you said, and behold, the car runs! In fact, it runs even better than ever before.





Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Secondary question: The idle is a bit sporadic. How hard would it be to complete the timing and set the idle correctly? I'm scared to touch anything since it's running so nicely (minus the idle issue).


Timing is now fine . Just make sure you have the distributor locked down with the 4 bolts holding it to the cylinder head.
clean the ISV or do a smoke test to find a vacuum leak (if any)


Volkswageneer1990 said:


> Tertiary Question: My oil light keeps blinking... Does that indicate low pressure or is the wiring crossed? I used the oil sensor locations for the G60 and mimicked them on the 16V.


Wiring...unless you actually do have low oil pressure. Easiest test is getting a pressure sender on that M10 x 1.0 port on the cylinder head (next to your coolant flange) OR run a mechanical gauge there.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> Timing is now fine . Just make sure you have the distributor locked down with the 4 bolts holding it to the cylinder head.
> clean the ISV or do a smoke test to find a vacuum leak (if any)
> 
> Wiring...unless you actually do have low oil pressure. Easiest test is getting a pressure sender on that M10 x 1.0 port on the cylinder head (next to your coolant flange) OR run a mechanical gauge there.


Distributor hold down bolts - Check

Clean ISV - Not check. Will have to look that up because the Idle is still very bad in the sense that it doesn't idle at all. It won't stay running. I adjusted the Idle Screw to 5 full turns out, and adjusted the CO2 Potentiometer to 375 Ohms but it still won't stay. I have to keep my foot on the gas to keep it running in order to do the idle adjustment as per the Bentley. (80 degrees oil temp, raise to 3K RPM three times, unplug coolant temp sensor, adjust idle, etc). I feel it should also be mentioned that I have a Duostyling A/F gauge tapped into the OXS wires. Would that have an adverse affect?

So at the moment, my oil sensor configuration is mimicking the G60 configuration. I have the high oil pressure switch at the back of the oil filter flange, the oil temp sensor at the front of the oil filter flange, and the low oil pressure sensor on the back of the 16V head. Another symptom that has developed is that when I rev the engine past 2K, the oil light stops blinking.... I'm thinking that may have something to do with the location of the oil pressure sensor being on the back of the head?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> . Another symptom that has developed is that when I rev the engine past 2K, the oil light stops blinking.... I'm thinking that may have something to do with the location of the oil pressure sensor being on the back of the head?


Try relocating it to the feed side of the oil filter housing.
There are 2 ports on the oil filter houisng. Pre filtered oil and post filtered oil. Put it on the pre-filtered oil port (M10 x 1.0) and try that. What oil pump are you using? 30mm or 36mm gears?


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> Try relocating it to the feed side of the oil filter housing.
> There are 2 ports on the oil filter houisng. Pre filtered oil and post filtered oil. Put it on the pre-filtered oil port (M10 x 1.0) and try that. What oil pump are you using? 30mm or 36mm gears?


I'll try that. I think I have the temp sensor in that port. Would there be anything bad if I were to move the temp sensor to the back of the head? I have the stock 16V oil pump. Not sure what size that is.

What about the idle issue?


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Ha, 16vg60 issues if it doesn't work there, move it somewhere else, keep throwing money and parts at it until it works! Why the hell did I ever buy a VW!? Lol. On that note, I am a few steps closer to starting my Frankenstein Corrado!










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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> I'll try that. I think I have the temp sensor in that port. Would there be anything bad if I were to move the temp sensor to the back of the head? I have the stock 16V oil pump. Not sure what size that is.
> 
> What about the idle issue?


Oil temp sensor to the head? It is still measuring Oil temperature isn't it 
As for idle issue - either a vaccuum leak or a faulty idle control valve.

worse case scenario a poor tune but if you can't get a decent Digi-I tune by now in 2016 then you are doing it wrong. That ECU is as basic as a gameboy.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> Oil temp sensor to the head? It is still measuring Oil temperature isn't it
> As for idle issue - either a vaccuum leak or a faulty idle control valve.
> 
> worse case scenario a poor tune but if you can't get a decent Digi-I tune by now in 2016 then you are doing it wrong. That ECU is as basic as a gameboy.


Great point. Will move those sensors. 

Vacuum lines are brand new and all sealed up, so I doubt that could be it. Will clean the ISV also. I also want to test taking off the A/F gauge taps. 

I also bought a KKL Cable and 2x2 Adapter for VAG-COM to mess with the ECU as well.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Volkswageneer1990 said:


> I also bought a KKL Cable and 2x2 Adapter for VAG-COM to mess with the ECU as well.


That's ambitious!
Using a 2 x 2 adapter on Digi-1:thumbup:


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## BikeMutts (Apr 17, 2011)

I've just read all 75 pages of this thread. I'm in the beginning stages of building an ABA 16v g60. Basically an obd1 ABA bottom end with a 1.8l KR head and g-lader. This is going in my '90 G60 Corrado. I was initially going to build an ABF clone and throw a turbo on it. But recently coming up on a rebuilt g-lader and reading this thread have possibly changed my mind. Thanks to all of you that have trailblazed this path before myself.

Mike


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Don't do it unless your ready to modify and trouble shoot a lot of things during your build. If your down for that then jump on! Can't wait to see pictures of your build!


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## BikeMutts (Apr 17, 2011)

Oh yea. I'm more than prepared for that and am up for the challenge. This isn't my first "build". I acquired the Corrado by trading my stage 2 lysholm ABA mk2. O2O trans with CHE 5th gear and peloquin. Pretty much everything you can bolt on... Did it all myself in the street in front of my apartment. Below is a link to the photo bucket for that car. I will definitely be posting pictures of everything as I move along.

For now here's the car that I'm putting the engine into and, well, the block. Lol. Photobucket isn't allowing me to copy image codes for some reason. So here are two links to albums.

'90 Corrado build:
http://s58.photobucket.com/user/mbutts81/media/1990 Corrado/IMG_5025_1.jpg.html?sort=3&o=12

'91 GTI build:
http://s58.photobucket.com/user/mbutts81/library/91 GTI?sort=3&page=1


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Can anyone shed some light on how this bbm throttle cable bracket fits!?!








Also anyone have a solution to intercooler pipe routing with a mk4 shift tower in the Corrado? It makes my reverse light sensor stick out into what little space there is for piping as it is...


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

I didn't install it. I just used the original G60 TB cable holder.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Issam Abed said:


> That's ambitious!
> Using a 2 x 2 adapter on Digi-1:thumbup:


I just have to make sure that the connectors under the shift boot are still connected to things!


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Ok, I will toss my new (longer) cable in there and see how it works. Just makes me sad I can't figure it out lol. Should be super simple, but I guess anything VW related especially 16VG60 is far from simple. Just want to get this damn car running!


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Swirved said:


> Just want to get this damn car running!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Love the enthusiasm, will definitely come in handy when you need a little pick me up motivation. But I will say, that statement will also leave you quite disappointed. I started my 16VG60 2.5 years ago with the goal of finishing it in a summer. It's now been two summers and it just might hit 3 summers next year. Oh and I only got it to run in January--this year (2016). 

Please, by all means, march forward. This build and engine are extremely rewarding. But be ready for 1 step forward, 10 back. 

Just my 0.02 😊


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

I'm pretty much in the same shoes as you... wishing I would have gone with something easier. Atleast it will be cool when it's done right!


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Anyone know what this vac line is for?









It is to the left of the clutch pedal inside the car and goes towards the left.


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Might be for the vacuum resovoir bulbs or for the cruise control. Those are the two things that come to mind.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Vacuum reservoir bulbs? Can you explain more?


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Swirved said:


> Vacuum reservoir bulbs? Can you explain more?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Assuming you have a Mk2, it's this little plastic thing that looks like 3 tennis balls stuck together. It's located under the battery.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

It's a Corrado, sorry should have specified.

Also anyone have a decent way to route the 1m long ecu vac line when using this manifold/elbow/throttle body setup?










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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Swirved said:


> It's a Corrado, sorry should have specified.
> 
> Also anyone have a decent way to route the 1m long ecu vac line when using this manifold/elbow/throttle body setup?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Couple things:

Are you missing the idle screw?
I ran my ECU vac line through the grommet that holds the ECU harness going into the firewall
For more vacuum line stuff, take a look at my routing diagram below. **Disclaimer: This vacuum routing diagram is a combination of the 16v and G60 OEM routings and may be different accoring to your specific build


16VG60 Vacuum Diagram - v4 by Volkswageneer1990, on Flickr


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

- Idle Screw? Not sure, but most likely yes lol. 

- That's how I assumed people went about it, just figured that 1 meter wouldn't be long enough to reach because of where the TB has been moved to.

- Thanks for the diagram, but I have tried to make mine a lot simpler. I deleted the carbon canister, airbox, cruise control, AC, vac reservoir, and have cable operated heaterbox, all metal heater core.

Basically I only have these vac lines.
- ECU to TB
- FPR to manifold
- Brake booster to manifold
- MFA to check valve

The line in question has to be for like central locking, or something like that inside the car?


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## Volkswageneer1990 (Dec 19, 2009)

Swirved said:


> - Idle Screw? Not sure, but most likely yes lol. *Haha you might want that back :laugh:*
> 
> - That's how I assumed people went about it, just figured that 1 meter wouldn't be long enough to reach because of where the TB has been moved to. *It's a bit tight but it'll work. I'd recommend getting some new vacuum lines.*
> 
> ...


.


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Those are part of cruise control and have already been removed. The line in question comes into the car to the left of the clutch pedal and instantly goes off towards the drivers side fender/door area behind the carpet. It's part of that mess of wires to the left of the fuse box above the front hood latch. I'm wanting to think it's for central locking and ties into the hard vac line that travels across the dash over to the pass side. 

Def going to be getting brand new vac hose for ECU to TB! 

Purchasing one of these suckers!
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/vw_audi/..._Throttle_Body_051133432_037133432_067133432A

Edit: I do have a throttle screw, it's just hiding deep in the TB.




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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

To put this in my 83 MK1 GTI i believe i'll need these:

G60 Digifant control relay
G60 Relays, fuel pump

Anyone have the part numbers for them? i have i line on them but the guy wants to be sure he sends the right ones.

Thanks for the help


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

*pistons and rods*

can i use AAN pistons with 1.8T rods and a G60 crank in a g60 block for my 16v g60?

Does all that match up? i think the compression might be just slightly higher than a stock g60 but that probably just means i don't need to run such an aggressive charger pulley.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

mikesvwcorrado said:


> can i use AAN pistons with 1.8T rods and a G60 crank in a g60 block for my 16v g60?
> Does all that match up? i think the compression might be just slightly higher than a stock g60 but that probably just means i don't need to run such an aggressive charger pulley.


G60 = 48mm rod journal
1.8T 20V = 48mm rod journal but you would need rods from the AEB (or even 9A) to get the 20mm wrist pin required for the AAN pistons.
As for CR , G60 if I recall was in the 24-25cc range. AAN is -7 to 8cc range but then you need to factor in what your head volume will be after installing valves (if you install valves) , machining the head and the head gasket thickness.


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

*whats most common*

what tends to be the most common when starting with a g60 bottom end?


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## northendroid (Sep 16, 2014)

mikesvwcorrado said:


> what tends to be the most common when starting with a g60 bottom end?


Is this what you're asking?

Block = PG
Deck Height = 220mm
Rod Length = 136mm
Stroke = 86.4mm
ROD RATIO = 1.57
Bore = 81mm
Compression Height = 40.8mm
Wrist Pin Diameter = 22mm
Displacement = 1780cc

Info found on the first page.


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

northendroid said:


> Is this what you're asking?
> 
> Block = PG
> Deck Height = 220mm
> ...


No. i was asking what is the most common piston / rod / crank combo is when starting with a PG block. or do most people just go with the BBM pistons with stock g60 rods and crank cuz we know they'll work.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

mikesvwcorrado said:


> No. i was asking what is the most common piston / rod / crank combo is when starting with a PG block.


81mm x 86.4mm = AAN pistons w/ new rings all day long


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

with the G60 rods and crank?


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## vwpat (Oct 25, 2000)

mikesvwcorrado said:


> with the G60 rods and crank?


G60 or any 1.8 crank and the superior 144 mm non G-60 1.8 rods.


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## eastern.foreigner (Sep 18, 2012)

*Another 16VG60*

Probably the slowest 16VG60 build. But made some good progress:


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

*16V G60 / ABA Pulley*



JBETZ said:


> You need to take 6mm off.... we do it to the ABA 2.0L pulley. Not sure how the G60 unit would turn out. You also need to insert a billet machined ring into a counter bore or the pulley will not run concentric.
> We sell them already done here.
> We can also modify a used ABA pulley for $39 + sh
> Here is a new one ready to bolt on.
> ...


i saw this post from a long time ago. do you still machine down ABA dampener pulleys to fit over a 16V crank pulley and line up to a G60 setup? i think it needs like 6mm machined off.

I'm putting it in an MK1. no V belt due to no power steering. Already have a serp waterpump pulley.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...-How-to&p=65291530&highlight=6mm#post65291530
"You need to take 6mm off.... we do it to the ABA 2.0L pulley. Not sure how the G60 unit would turn out. You also need to insert a billet machined ring into a counter bore or the pulley will not run concentric. 
We sell them already done here.
We can also modify a used ABA pulley for $39 + sh"


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

mikesvwcorrado said:


> I'm putting it in an MK1. no V belt due to no power steering. Already have a serp waterpump pulley.


IMHO Do not use the ABA pulley. Last ABA left the factory over 20 years ago. Most of those crankshaft pulleys are worn out and cracked. 
If it was me , considering you are not running power steering , find a 1.8T crankshaft pulley and machine up a 6.2mm spacer (use the hub off the back off that ABA). Any machine shop should be able to take care of you.


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## mdelvallev (Nov 4, 2015)

*Image - Forums*

Dear Friend:

I am readindg many topics in the Forums, but many images can not see. Please what is the solution?

Bests Regards,

Martin.


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

*head block alignment*

i have my G60 head gasket still and i notice a couple imperfections in the line up of the 16V head to the G60 block. anyone else see this when they did their build? Don't have a 16V gasket so not sure the differences with that one. 

Mainly i'm looking at the one i circled, but alignment is a little funny on the edges too.

reason for concern?


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

mikesvwcorrado said:


> reason for concern?


No
You are using a later style block with an early style head. The small circle is for the anti-drain back valve / one way valve in the oil filter housing which your cylinder head does not have provision for. It is not a big deal since you will still be supplied oil from the primary channel.


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## NotLowNotSloMk2 (Jan 25, 2020)

*Red Hot Cat*

Question: Have you converted the Digi 1 injectors to the 16 v head

If so in my humble opinion it is running overly lean 
RED HOT (to me) means temperature, not heat...........too much oxygen and too little fuel 
I do not want to see a Fine VW burn up on you

If you have used the Digi 1 injectors the fuel is likely spraying against the long tube of the injector guide
walls and collecting there then running out the bottom no longer atomized and just dribbling most of the fuel
liquid form into the head.
I hope that you have not had a catastrophe before you see this 

Cheers




My E-mail is [email protected] Faster this way


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

*thoughts?*

thoughts on a setup like this? feels like another pulley between the alternator and the charger (maybe off that top alternator bolt) would be good. also, maybe not enough contact with the water pump pulley. car has no power steering so that isn't needed. also makes it so i can't run a v-belt since the ps tensions the v-belt.


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## Butcher (Jan 31, 2001)

There is not enough wrap on the alternator and charger. Those items have a lot of load so you must have a good amount of grip to keep them from slipping. An idler pulley close to the alternator pivot bolt may solve that problem.

As for the coolant pump pulley, I would think you need more wrap for that too. There is less load so maybe not. A larger diameter idler pulley is what I would be looking at for that. If I could not find something, I may just try what you got.


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## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

Butcher said:


> There is not enough wrap on the alternator and charger. Those items have a lot of load so you must have a good amount of grip to keep them from slipping. An idler pulley close to the alternator pivot bolt may solve that problem.
> 
> As for the coolant pump pulley, I would think you need more wrap for that too. There is less load so maybe not. A larger diameter idler pulley is what I would be looking at for that. If I could not find something, I may just try what you got.



The Tensioner is not fully engaged
More than enough belt wrap on that supercharger pulley . OEM had an AC compressor with a much larger pulley in the exact same location. 
Almost the same amount of belt wrap on the water pump pulley as the ABF alternator set ups.

p.s. this system works :thumbup:



mikesvwcorrado said:


> thoughts on a setup like this? feels like another pulley between the alternator and the charger (maybe off that top alternator bolt) would be good. also, maybe not enough contact with the water pump pulley. car has no power steering so that isn't needed. also makes it so i can't run a v-belt since the ps tensions the v-belt.


You can move the idler from the lower alternator tab to the upper tab Michael if you are concerned.





NotLowNotSloMk2 said:


> Question: Have you converted the Digi 1 injectors to the 16 v head
> 
> If so in my humble opinion it is running overly lean
> RED HOT (to me) means temperature, not heat...........too much oxygen and too little fuel
> ...


It amazes me that people still do this without re-calibration. 
Digi-I + Digi-I injectors are intended for a stock 8V G60 engine.
Adding them to a 16V is a band aid without some form of a chip. If you change the size of the supercharger pulley on an 8V G60 , you need a chip. The same applies if you are adding a 16V head to the equation.


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

*stand alone*

Most people here run Stand Alone ECU?

my swap is into a MK1 GTI so don't have digi already sitting in there.

people say a lot of good things about Mega Squirt. i see AEM Infinity in a lot of of other stuff.

people have recommendations? i'd love to hear what others used.




P.S i'm not sure the BBM chip is an option as my compression ratio with AAN pistons is different than what that chip is tuned for. i due have a guide for how to wire this set up, just no correct chip support.


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

*part number for coolant metal coolant pipe*

hey guys,

what metal coolant pipe have people used for going from the pump up to the heater core? 

maybe this one, but it has 3 points I'd need to cap. Pipe is 027-121-065/K with 055-121-324 to block off.

https://www.heritagepartscentre.com/us/027121065k-metal-coolant-pipe-16v.html

if it is this one it isn't easy to find in America. I called Heritage and its a 4 week back order.

Thanks


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

What do most do for PCV in the setup? I could guess people might drill and tap the right side charger to block bracket or maybe the valve cover somewhere?


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

mikesvwcorrado said:


> What do most do for PCV in the setup? I could guess people might drill and tap the right side charger to block bracket or maybe the valve cover somewhere?


I drilled and tapped the charger bracket then used aircraft grade sealant and threaded in an AN fitting that runs to a vented catch can below my intake. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Swirved (Aug 5, 2013)

Well my 16VG60 fired up for the first time in 6 years yesterday! Curious though what I should have my adjustable FPR set at? Right now I have it set around 40psi (converts to 2.758bar). I have 30lb injectors and a 4bar in tank pump.


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## Butcher (Jan 31, 2001)

Do you have a wideband? If not, I certainly would recommend one.


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## mikesvwcorrado (May 23, 2001)

Swirved said:


> I drilled and tapped the charger bracket then used aircraft grade sealant and threaded in an AN fitting that runs to a vented catch can below my intake.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


i was thinking maybe i can tap that bracket too and run it to the return inlet block of plate of the charger since that is where it directs to in the g60. i believe it offers some extra lubrication to the charger.


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## mirus (Sep 1, 2008)

does anyone know where this flange is from


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