# interested in building up a 2.0 head



## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

me and my machine shop have been working on 2.0 8v head for the past few
cutting up a few so we could determine what we could port and were the gains on the flow bench were made..any way for right around $500 my machine shop will flow the head .provide custome ss valves ,custome valvesprings,deck the head
weld and reshape the runners on the ports to provide maximum flow.(we have exceeded our own expectations)
basically im posting here because these guys have produced a ton of 6 sec race cars and have gone completely out of there way to help me on my journey to the 10 sec club...now due to there efforts im trying to pass on what we have learned to you at a reasonable price to try and make there efforts pay off by having the vw comunity try and keep them interested in further developing our cars 
with the head you will receive a flow charrt for all the cylynders ect...hp may varry from application to application and we will need some information from you to customize each head for your application ...mine is for a turbo charged rabbit(so my exuast will flow 80% of the intake --in na versions this should be aroud 70%) dyno gains and charts will be posted as soon as i can get the car together...
allen


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

here is my car and old dyno sheet on a stock head


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

here are some timeslips before with mild porting im allen


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

and here is my car


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## MikeBlaze (Aug 9, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Is this a one time thing or will they be available for a while?


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (MikeBlaze)*

hey man, thats crazy power for only 16psi. are you using nitrous also? you must be!
is it an 8v head?


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## need_a_VR6 (May 19, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (speed51133!)*

Allen, I heard your car is fast, any truth to this?








AFAIK, all Allen's times were on race gas, no nitrous, junkyard 8.5:1 blocks and xflow heads.


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (need_a_VR6)*

what about that dyno run?


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (speed51133!)*

the dyno run was on c-10 race gas no nos but it wasnt pump gas..
the heads will be available when ever (its a rebuild of your head or i can junk yard you one might be like $100 more ) I never dynoed on pump gas sorry
and like i said im trying to send these guys work they had to make up alot of addapters (for the flow bench ect...) try and retry on different junk yard heads that i supply to get the best ###'s on the bench ..so im trying ti keep them interested in vw's and you can benifit from what i had to pay for (alot mire than $500)if interested email me and ill give you the address to ship or drop off the heads...
i have run up 24 psi on my motor but it didnt live for all that long i never got to get it to the dyno im geussing 300 and a little by my mph in the 1/4 was 121
at 16psi its like 115mph and alot of 12.0 and 11.9


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## gannonGTI (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

those are some impressive numbers http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Scubastevie00 (Feb 13, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (gannonGTI)*

Wow... Nice numbers man... The whole reason I want a mk2 or mk1... $100 blocks from the yard







.. You gonna look into xflow heads? Thanks..


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## MikeBlaze (Aug 9, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (Scubastevie00)*

quote:[HR][/HR] You gonna look into xflow heads? [HR][/HR]​He is running a x-flow head so i'm assuming thats what all this is for. Correct me if i'm wrong Allen.


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## CuCo33 (Oct 23, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

quote:[HR][/HR]and here is my car







[HR][/HR]​







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif








500 and u guys would PnP, etc... AND give me some charts and all?
HMMMMMMMMMMMMM
how faraway is this shop from ghetto Newark NJ area?

33


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (CuCo33)*

i have been running a 2.0 srossflow head on a 1.8 bottom for a few years and finnally decided to work with a machine shop and get all that we could out of the cross flow...(they have helped me since the early 90 's with projects)
the main reason is money the 20 valve head is big bux to up grade in compairison(although it kicks ass i cant afford it ) 
so you guys can get what im running for around $500 you supply the head. if i supply it it will be a little more but basically its a great deal ..
p&p head welded &reshaped runners(flow tested)
ss valves 
upgraded valve springs 
valve job,guids and seals
decked head(meaning resurfaced)
cc 'd combustion chamber it will be slightly altered youll know you new cc
we will reuse your lifters unless specifeid or there f-ed up
ect....there are a few more expensive options depending on your preference in aftermrkt companys but $500 is real damn close
why waste your money on a socalled stage 3 head from jonny corperation this is bang for buck tuning cause i aint rich...
after shipping and tax still a good deal
im about 2 hours from newark 
allen
youll have all the ### flowed for each cylynder within 5% of each other


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## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

allen, this seems like a killer offer(no relation to paul).

im also assuming on that dyno run you really advanced the crap out of the timing, and diddnt use your same timing maps as you would run for pump gas.
is this so?
I should have some funding in like a month, think it will still be offered, what about oversized valves?


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## TheTrader (Oct 25, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (speed51133!)*

How long do you think i will have till this offer is no good?
I really need somthing like this, and the deal is great? I dont want to miss out.
Any idea of downtime?


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (TheTrader)*

this would be very cool.
i have just begun to look for more power. I have done mild bolt-ons so far but the head was somepalce i was hoping to get lots of power from.
i dont wanna go crazy race just a good bump in power for a NA street app.
this would be going with a 268/272 cam on an obd2 car. is this going to be worthwhile for a more daily driven/weekend warrior situation?
any idea of the NA gains possible?
if i go with your shop... I would probably prefer to source the head from your side, since I cant be without my car during the work. is there anyway to do core/exchange once i get the head on i ship mine back to you for credit or something?
plus I assume your shop could mill a bit so I can bump compression at the same time.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (speed51133!)*

we are not using oversizes valves just better ss valves with the proper backcutting.
this offer isnt going anywhere its not a special .the machine shop fabricated all the stuff to put the heads on the flow bench and spent some time with the porting and valve sizing to see what works(we gained absolutly nothing with bigger valves every thing was limited to the port work) ..i had been having a hard time finding a company that would spend the time on a vw head for a decent price so now we have one. so try and make there investment in time benifit all of us ,, good deals on heads for us extra, buissness for them..
as far as my timing i never run pump gas i drive on the race gas (this is a weekend car for me i work in center city philly its too likley to get broken into)but i run right around 28 degrees total timing at that boost....i would probably just run less boost and like 24 deg total on 94 octain...


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Bump, cause I will be a customer


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## TheTrader (Oct 25, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

What all is included in the work, sorry if your repeating yourself, but do you mind listing it out? Im wonderinf if lifters and guides are also going to be replaced.... (somthing i will have to do either way... just wonderin if its included in the origonal price)


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## MikeBlaze (Aug 9, 2001)

quote:[HR][/HR]p&p head welded &reshaped runners(flow tested)
ss valves 
upgraded valve springs 
valve job,guids and seals
decked head(meaning resurfaced)
cc 'd combustion chamber it will be slightly altered youll know you new cc
_we will reuse your lifters unless specifeid or there f-ed up
ect...._ there are a few more expensive options depending on your preference in aftermrkt companys [HR][/HR]​


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: (MikeBlaze)*

bump for having a fast 2.0


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## aatap (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

I can't see any of the images. I just get the red Xs'


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (aatap)*

The images are of his bad ass wabbitT. You can see them at the links he lists.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

is this something i should even think of for a street driven obd2 car?


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

yea, why wouldn't you. its my daily dirver


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

i live in seattle so the car has to pass emissions.
i also would not want a CEL or to kill gas mileage.
just trying to find out what i can before doing it.
if i do go this route i would possibly have the head milled to bump compression and throw in a bigger cam and adj cam gear.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

im not sure on the emissions part i buy my sticker i have no cat..
but the head work will do nothing but amplify the the improvements of a bettercam
i have a feeling they will kick ass on nos cars as whell ..given a good cam selection
allen


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## smokin (Apr 25, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]this would be very cool.
i have just begun to look for more power. I have done mild bolt-ons so far but the head was somepalce i was hoping to get lots of power from.
i dont wanna go crazy race just a good bump in power for a NA street app.
this would be going with a 268/272 cam on an obd2 car. is this going to be worthwhile for a more daily driven/weekend warrior situation?
any idea of the NA gains possible?
if i go with your shop... I would probably prefer to source the head from your side, since I cant be without my car during the work. is there anyway to do core/exchange once i get the head on i ship mine back to you for credit or something?
plus I assume your shop could mill a bit so I can bump compression at the same time.[HR][/HR]​^^^
what he said 
anything about core/exchanges
Id be running a 270 cam in an obd 1, cam gear, chip, etc etc...bolt ons


[Modified by smokin, 1:50 AM 2-11-2003]


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (smokin)*

Yea, that does sound like a good question. Would you provide a head if you received one later? It would be cool but if that does work then we understand. I have a feeling that everyone will want you to supply a head, so better start head hunting.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

i picked up 5 heads this week they will be $100 or so give or take $25 it all depends on the yard i get them from...allen
i have two of em sold ....


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## the12for12 (Jul 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Allen,
what about my DCOE aba Xflow..... could U guys help me out?


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (the12for12)*

ttt


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## the12for12 (Jul 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (the12for12)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Allen,
what about my DCOE aba Xflow..... could U guys help me out?[HR][/HR]​any ideas yet? I'm runnin' Webers... would U guys have applications for my project?


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (the12for12)*

bump for my future head


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

I was going to ship my head to L & R Engineering in FL - but voorhees is in my backyard - I will be in touch in very shortly.


[Modified by WolfGTI, 7:31 PM 3-6-2003]


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## CuCo33 (Oct 23, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

due to me gettin fired and having problems finding a job cuz the economy sux, i will be postponing this head work... i will be head hunting in som local areas around me. if i come across anything within the next month or so, i'll post on here for ny/nj people... am SOOOOOOOOOOOOO wanna do this up!
problem is money right now is tighter than a small sized g-string on a 300lb stripper








33


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (CuCo33)*

ive had really good response from this add i hope every one is happy with what they have received there is no rush this wasnt a limited time offer and now i have cores sitting around i will do echanges but i havent hooked up with a real suplier for heads so the core cost wil varry slightl on the cores .email me with all your info and when you are ready to go and we will hook it up all payments are throughthe machine shop not me i just grab the cores they reimburse me when your billed.....
so your down time will be at a MINIMUM as long as we are not swamped
allen


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

I live in Mt.Laurel NJ, I already have my head that I want done - what i wanted to know - does your shop include valve seals with the job ?


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

bump..
anyone out there do this yet? i am still thinking and saving $$$..
any results to report?


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

I'll let you know when i do, need to get closer to the end of school so I can make sure my finaces are set


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

I need some contact info - I'm ready to send in my head.


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## KrautFed (Jan 9, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Biddy bump. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Through hail, tornadoes, and torential rain... I got my motor home last night.








The head is coming off tonight. Allen, I need to talk to you/the machine shop about those further options.








Go fast. Go cheap. Go 8v.


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (KrautFed)*

Allen's email is the best way to reach him, let me know how those heads come out and how long the labor takes. I am still waiting to see what my $ making plans for the summer are so I can spent what is in the bank now.


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

bump - email sent to allen - awaiting reply


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

Anyone hear from Allen yet - I am waiting to send the head in. (It sits in my living room crying for surgery).


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## VolksRacer2 (Aug 6, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

I'm thinking that, after more than a month with no word from this guy, I'm starting to get pretty suspicious.







I hope he's on the up-and-up, this is a great deal.


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VolksRacer2)*

I've seen his Rabbit run once - I don't think he's blowing smoke - I hope he contacts me soon so I can send the head in.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

sorry guys not trying to blow anyone off will answer all your emails ive got like 50 i havent even read ...the 1st vortexer to get his head back should be jetta3turbo in about 2 1/2 weeks they ordered the parts for his head on last weds i believe so he should be getting it shortly ..ill try and get back to every one, iv had alot of justwant to talk emails so i try and answer them all...
but its race season im trying to get the race car done as well ( i have 2 race cars and a nos bike )ive been verry buisy..
sorry for the delay ill get with you all this week


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## KrautFed (Jan 9, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Thanks Allen, keep up the hard work.







Looking forward to the email.


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## dubass (Mar 26, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (KrautFed)*

bump for a sweet deal that i will keep in mind. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## momotaro (May 7, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

In the process of re-vamping a head myself for some bizarre and masochistic reason. What all are you having done again? My own calculations didn't offer much in the way of porting work and larger valves didn't seem like they would do much for flow (mostly seemed to be constricted at the port). Not to mention that the valves would be more shrouded and effectively reduce the available valve size (I couldn't find too much room to try to open up the area between the valve and the cylinder wall before it became a head gasket interference problem). Also, a mm or two on the ports was about the largest I could grind before it started to interfere with the intake gasket.
For new parts (valves, seats, lifters, springs, guides, etc.,...) and the machine work you are looking at close to that ($500) from what I have seen. 
I'd be interested in seeing what you got for a before and after on the flowbench.
Heck, its' an EDUCATIONAL experience, right? Right???


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (momotaro)*

soon ill have my new dyno sheet...


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

My head was picked up by Allen on Sat. I ordered my cam today - fun fun.


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## dubass (Mar 26, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

sweet yeah i def would like to see some dynos or flowbench figures. even 1/4mi. anyone building up a 2.0 in a mk3?


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dubass)*

I will hopefully be turbo by the end of the summer, where in NOVA are you?


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## XthetraderX (Feb 23, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

allen has email








Im ready.


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (XthetraderX)*

bout to e-mail Allen too as soon as the gov't gives me my $ back


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## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (momotaro)*

quote:[HR][/HR] In the process of re-vamping a head myself for some bizarre and masochistic reason. What all are you having done again? My own calculations didn't offer much in the way of porting work and larger valves didn't seem like they would do much for flow (mostly seemed to be constricted at the port). Not to mention that the valves would be more shrouded and effectively reduce the available valve size (I couldn't find too much room to try to open up the area between the valve and the cylinder wall before it became a head gasket interference problem). Also, a mm or two on the ports was about the largest I could grind before it started to interfere with the intake gasket.
For new parts (valves, seats, lifters, springs, guides, etc.,...) and the machine work you are looking at close to that ($500) from what I have seen. 
I'd be interested in seeing what you got for a before and after on the flowbench.
Heck, its' an EDUCATIONAL experience, right? Right???[HR][/HR]​I haven't dynoed my car, and didn't get it done through Allen, but I recently threw on an ODBI head, P&P'ed with a 5 angle valve grind, and the difference has been quite good, especially above 4500 rpms. Has really complimented my cam very well - my next project on the agenda is to P&P the lower intake manifold; that's kind of a bottleneck. I would love to see the difference in a FI application.....


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

we also port the lower intake ...wolf gti sent gave me his..yes it definitly restricts flow..
jetta3turbo...
send me an email if you get this i do not have a lower intake for you 
i sourced the head also i need the info on what cam you wound up with you close to completin but i need this info...
[email protected]
i will post dyno charts and flow bench results from my car when i get to that point 
every one will varry we all have different set ups we are working to egt you the best settup for your needs i recommend tt 260/268 cams for fi ..


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

does anyone here have the knowledge or experience to explain what would be the pro's or con's of running a TT 268/260 vs. a TT 268 cam on a NA engine??


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## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

Because the the exhaust lobes on the cam are a shorter duration (the "260" part), while the intake (the "268" part) has the longer duration. This reduces the amount of air that just blows through the head without being used for the air/fuel mixture.....with a FI application and your garden-variety off-the-shelf aggressive cam and no real engine management, this would result in a lot of air just passing through the head and out the exhaust as there would be too much overlap in the intake/exhaust valves.
In regards to getting the lower intake mani ported - I didn't have a spare one at the time, and couldn't be without my car for more than a day....sooooooo, that kinda limited my options at the time







. 
*edit* Nevermind my above babbling....I thought you meant for a FI engine.


[Modified by VW97Jetta, 3:18 PM 4-22-2003]


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

thanks for the response either way.
i know about the over lap issue in a FI motor, so therefore the 268/260 cam is the way to go... but i am trying to determine what it would do from a naturally aspirated engine point of view.
maybe i will have to buy some software, like desktop dyno or something.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

bump and a question
will an odb1 head go replace a odb2 head without issues?
(i am in the process of searching to see if I can find it on my own also)


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## turbojeta3 (Feb 23, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

yes you can slap on a odb1 head on a odb2 motor. the only think you will have to keep is the tb. you can even slap in a whole odb1 motor if you like.
i was odb1 went to 2 back to 1 lol


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## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (turbojeta3)*

I'm still using my ODBII throttle body with an ODBI head....I didn't change out the manifold.....


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## 1fastmk3 (Aug 6, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

For all on this Thread.....
Anyone know where I can get this deal in So-Cal Area....
Preferably Sand Diego or L.A. ?????? I will do it now if so !!


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (1fastmk3)*

?que?


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

huh??


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## XthetraderX (Feb 23, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Cant wait to get my head done... gonna be a nice adition to the package. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (XthetraderX)*

Allen you alive? UPS has tried to delivery my head 3 times. I hope you can get it before they send it back.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

anyone got their new head installed yet??


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## XthetraderX (Feb 23, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

Nope... still waitin on the local junkyard to have a head so allen can pick it up.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (XthetraderX)*

i didnt get a chance to get there yet but i got you a head ...ill drop it off by the weekend ....we can discuss your setup...


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dunhamjr* »_anyone got their new head installed yet??

Not yet - based on talking to Allen my head will be done in a a little over a week, I should be ready to put it in before end of the month.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

well i talked to the machine shop today and wolfgti is really getting the works he is getting almost as much work as me..yikes








inkindel valves ect...cant wait to see it done..


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

lol Allen you flatter me


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

i just found out about the price being so high we will work somthing out ...
i wasnt expecting it to be so high closer to $1,000 ....
ill eat some of it ....not trying to mislead any one...


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote, originally posted by *81 vw pickup* »_i just found out about the price being so high we will work somthing out ...
i wasnt expecting it to be so high closer to $1,000 ....
ill eat some of it ....not trying to mislead any one...


price being so high??








edit:
is the price high because of the additional "stuff" we can do or is the base price for the work you originally stated higher then expected?


_Modified by dunhamjr at 4:28 PM 5-7-2003_


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

I don't think you tried to mislead anyone - don't think that way.


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## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

Damn....what the hell are you guys doing to these heads that warrants nearly $1,000??????


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

well wolfgti got the same valves i did they are inkandel (sp??)verry high quality a little less expensive than titanium..
-he got a pressure test on the head($60)
-inkandel valves($260 set of valves)
-tt valve springs (because of the high lift cam we used there springs for there application)(around$80)
-port @polish--flow benched and matched runners(also ported lower intake manifold) 
-clearanced the head for the new cam($??)
-new lifters($70)
-decked the head bringing his compression up (i had to cc an aba block to determine the correct cc for the head combustion chamber to up the compression)
-3 angle vj
-new guides 
-new seals
-retainers 
this thing should rip... 
allen id like to see it get some spray on it....


----------



## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Yeah, I guess that's a little under a grand.....sounds like my setup, minus those valves (I paid $100 just for the exhaust valves - nothing special). I didn't deck my head for added compression as I wanted to keep my options open, and I got a 5 angle valve job. Still looking for a lower intake manifold to port, though.....
Sounds like that setup should scream....what did you bump the compression to, and what cam will be put in?


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

The cam will be a TT276, the compression should be 10.5:1 - didn't want to push it too much more because of the lift of the cam, and leave room incase future decking/hi compression pistons go in.


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

I'll have a spare lower intake manifold off my car when I put in the ported one - if you want it we can work something out.


----------



## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

You will be quite happy with that setup, especially if you just have a stock cam in there now http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Let me know about the lower intake manifold...


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

The engine is pretty much stock now - cept for an Autotech chip and a TT cat back. As soon as I put on the new setup I will contact you about the lower manifold.


_Modified by WolfGTI at 9:14 PM 5-7-2003_


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

Just talked to Allen today. Everything sounds great. I too am looking for that lower intake manny so if any one spots one I'm here


----------



## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

the basic hasnt changed it has been comming out to around $550-650 depending on application and condition of the head.
wolfs head has been a lot different than the turbo cars heads....
i will list an entire pricing post so you can see what options you want.....ther are a ton


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: (81 vw pickup)*

Yup I am a little troublemaker.


----------



## XthetraderX (Feb 23, 2003)

*Re: (WolfGTI)*

god, i cant wait.


----------



## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *WolfGTI* »_The engine is pretty much stock now - cept for an Autotech chip and a TT cat back. As soon as I put on the new setup I will contact you about the lower manifold.

_Modified by WolfGTI at 9:14 PM 5-7-2003_

Dude...throw on a cold air intake while you're at it - you won't believe the difference when you get above 4500 rpms with that head if you're basically stock now (well, besides the chip and the exhaust). You getting an adj. cam gear as well? Take some weight out of your car too.....will get even more of a "wow" factor.
Unfortunately, when you're N/A, you'll get used to it in a very short time, and will then want more. You should do a before and after dyno....


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

I did a before dyno already - its without the TT cat back though. I put 102.7 to the wheels with 122.1 lb/ft. I definitely will do an after dyno. I know I will get used to the power after a while, but for a daily driver that does 44 miles round trip a day I'll leave it like this. 
I prefer NA power - although turbo's will always be faster - as Gordon Murray (designer and head engineer on the F1 McLaren) said - NA is more the driver's balanced machine - smooth consistent power delivery. 
For all you FI guys - I am not flaming you - I just prefer NA.
I have the adjustable cam gear, it will go on with the head. As far as the lightening goes - the rear seats will be gone (gotta make a nice light false floor). Any other recommendations for lightening? What do you recommend for the CAI - the turn2 or the Eurosport ?



_Modified by WolfGTI at 9:19 PM 5-8-2003_


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

Moving it up so I can find it


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

Thats why it's at the top of my favorites list. Just started my job yesterday, looking forward to what the paychecks will bring.


----------



## XthetraderX (Feb 23, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

cant wait to hear from allen.


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

weekly bump


----------



## XthetraderX (Feb 23, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

anyy updates allen?


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (XthetraderX)*

It seems like allen is really busy during the weekends. It took him a few days to get back to me but when he did it was ahead of schedule and had everything under control. Its best to reach him by e-mail or on his cell after 430 during the week.


----------



## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

updates any one??


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

Saw Allen at bug-out this last Sunday, didn't get to talk to him much. However I was able to hear him rev it up on his way to the strip, it sounded so bad ass. Was excited to see him race cause all the rest of the water-cooleds, even the VR6Ts, were getting beat by the air-cooleds. Had the digi video cam setup by the track and it started rainning 3 races before Allen. Sucks!


----------



## dubass (Mar 26, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

oooohh man, you mean that blue rabbit 2.0t at manasas bugout was allen's? damn, i was gawking at that thing most of the day with my brother and didnt really talk to him. that kinda sucks. oh well, that bitch sounded MEAN as hell though! i wanna rabbit project sooo bad.
and as for air beating water, a lot of that is launch on an 1/8mi track, but there are some crazy bugs out there.


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dubass)*

Has anyone talked to Allen recently? I have called him a few times to check up on the head and recently I haven't been able to react him. He said that the process should take a month and its been a month.


----------



## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

I got an email from him yesterday - he went to FL to attend some races after Bug Out, hopefully he will get back to you soon. On the positive side I am picking up my head this Fri and she goes in for surgery this weekend.







I spoke to Allen on the phone this evening - so I would suggest you try to call him or email.


_Modified by WolfGTI at 7:51 PM 6-2-2003_


----------



## purplejettahondaeater (Oct 29, 2000)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

post that individual pricing list up








man if i can swing this and a piper cam i think project 20v won't be happening








i'd be happy if i could pull 145-150 at the wheels N/A


----------



## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (purplejettahondaeater)*

well a few buyers fell through on heads that are done ..if interested they are ready asap ...here is the breakdown 
- resurface head $60
-complete port&polish and a competition 3 angle valve job $500 flows 174cfm or better (flow test data sheet $75)
-pressure test $60
-valve guides and seals (magnese bronze)$40
-we decided unless you buy the inkandel valves your stockers as long as they are german are as good as any aftermarket low buck ss valve
---inkandel valves $256
-lifters like $7 each
valve springs $80
retainers $40
thats the run down im ready to ship well not me the machine shop..
and yes some late model heads are definitly worse ....
ill source a head for around $100
all orders will be through paypal 50% upfront im tired of getting left holding the bag ..


----------



## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

also pleese respond through emails i get them when im away from home ..it is your best way to reach me thanxs allen


----------



## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote »_so you guys can get what im running for around $500 you supply the head. if i supply it it will be a little more but basically its a great deal ..
p&p head welded &reshaped runners(flow tested)
ss valves 
upgraded valve springs 
valve job,guids and seals
decked head(meaning resurfaced)
cc 'd combustion chamber it will be slightly altered youll know you new cc
we will reuse your lifters unless specifeid or there f-ed up
ect....there are a few more expensive options depending on your preference in aftermrkt companys but $500 is real damn close

one the 1st page you said right around $500 for all of the above...
plus a possible $100 more if you supplied the head.
and now below it looks like the $500 is just for the p&p and valve job.
with all the stuff you listed as "included" above at extra cost??


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

1000th post and what a good way to have!!! Just got my IM from Allen saying my head is done. He said the final price was a little over 600, which is a little more than I thought. I'll talk to Allen to see how it got up there. No worries, I know sometimes stuff is a little more $$$ than we plan on, but I am also saving for a turbo kit and that is as tight as it is when you go to school full-time and only have a summer job. 
Why would people leaving Allen hanging like that, THATS BEAT GUYS!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif I am gonna put an advertisement in my sig to help Allen out.


----------



## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

I dont have much of a problem if the price for the package laid out goes from about $500 to $600... but if you add up all the stuff allen just laid out pricing wise, the total gets up over $800.


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

in that 800 are you including the inkandel valves?


----------



## wintrode (Aug 2, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

That would be for:
Item.......................Subtotal.........Running Total
Resurface...............$60...............$60
P&P/Valve Job.........$500..............$560
Guides& Seals.........$40...............$600
Valve Springs..........$80...............$680
Retainers................$40...............$720
Lifters (8 x $7)........$56...............$776
So not far off from $800.
If you add a pressure test and flow bench sheet, you are up to $900



_Modified by wintrode at 9:14 AM 6-4-2003_


----------



## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

nope.
edit: but i did add in the $60 for the pressure test, so $836


----------



## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

maybe that 500 includes everything he mentioned in the first post, P&P, springs, SS valves, etc and the rest is the flow test, lifters, etc. That was my understanding when we set up the work.


----------



## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*


_Quote »_so you guys can get what im running for around $500 you supply the head. if i supply it it will be a little more but basically its a great deal ..
p&p head welded &reshaped runners(flow tested)
ss valves 
upgraded valve springs 
valve job,guids and seals
decked head(meaning resurfaced)
cc 'd combustion chamber it will be slightly altered youll know you new cc
we will reuse your lifters unless specifeid or there f-ed up
ect....there are a few more expensive options depending on your preference in aftermrkt companys but $500 is real damn close

that may be the understanding... but from this post (beginning of this thread) the things allen broke down into pricing by separating out the valve springs, retainers, guides, resurface... it just sounds like we need some clarification.
because at the onset this sounded like we were getting a great deal at $500-600 but now if we do all the things he listed above that was supposed to require a $500 price... we are up over $800 and near $900. not as great of a deal at that range.


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## dubass (Mar 26, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

damn that does suck for allen hes a cool dude and went out on a limb to get these heads to vortexers. i was giving it thought at 1st when it was supposedly in the 500-600$ range, but after following this thread and seeing the prices gradually go up i cant afford it now. i can see why some people pussed out, but thats still not cool to leave a vortexer hangin. the shop is behind the prices not allen.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dubass)*

thats why I was waiting to hear the power improvement, customer service experience and prices that the shop was able to provide before putting anyone out by getting an order in and then not following through.
heck there is still a good chance I will buy a head here. even if the price is a bit more then expected.


----------



## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

well the beginning i was really going out of my way to keep the pricing as low as i could get it but after being screwewd by the 3rd vortexer (im not going to mention names thats not cool)..i get theses heads with no profit at all and i have personally bought all the cores gone well above and beyond what i need to do to help people out, but ive been stuck holding the bag for a good amount of money ....
so now the prices have gone up a little and the origional heads i have kept around the respective prices..1 problem when i recieve a core someone buys we do not know the condition of it its your word where its been so i dont feel good about sending it back to you without replacing the lifters($60) and retainers($35) ...the last thing i want is for someone to be unhappy about somthing breaking...and it be on me ,.lazy lifter ect...some of the cores have come with mexican castings and flow like crap and and the valves and retainers are significantly diffeferent (poor quality) so there have unfortunatly been some bumps in the road but the heads still flow great ...and the inkandel valves are verry nice hence the price and are needed on high reving applications (lighter stronger) but not necessarry just an add on....the ss german /fererra are still great im running them now but i was adding another option ..
what im getting at is you can still get a head like the one i have on my car but its like $60-100 more than i expected to step into(if it doesnt need a pressure test and the valve seals and guides are not the magnese bronze there only $16 for german )..and im relustant to pay out of pocket for things anymore ....i got stuck with a head exactly like mine for the new car that costs $900 it has every thing its badd ass(flows wicked) but the kid fell through i paid for it up front now im stuck eating the costs..just send and email i have pricing sheets so i acn evaluate every thing better now upfront so youl know what we can do and for howmuch upfront )
wolf gti will be getting his head on friday he went way over in price but his head is baaad ass ..cant wait to see it they really spent alot of time on it bumped his compression clearanced head for big ass cam really nice saw it yesterday..


----------



## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

so yes the origional deal still applies there are just other options ( but i was off b about $100 in the origional pricing sorry.... )
i would plan on 650 and be happilly surprized ha!ha! 
sorry just my gay ass sense of humor...
oh and the heads will flow 174 cfm of better tt flows 165-168....



_Modified by 81 vw pickup at 11:15 PM 6-4-2003_


----------



## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

thats fine, i just wanted a bit of clarification on the pricing. thank you very much for the replies on this.


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## Sahale (Apr 9, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote, originally posted by *81 vw pickup* »_
oh and the heads will flow 174 cfm of better tt flows 165-168....
_Modified by 81 vw pickup at 11:15 PM 6-4-2003_

what lift is this at again?


----------



## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (Sahale)*

with 28" water we were using the 260-268 cam profile i cannot remember the lift off the top of my head (its techtonics turbo/charger cam)like 4??ill get the ## when i get a chance but its not at like 500(crazy lift to get the ## up kinda thing its real world we use your cam specs ) its the lift on the cam im suggesting for the fi cars to use..


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote, originally posted by *81 vw pickup* »_
wolf gti will be getting his head on friday he went way over in price but his head is baaad ass ..cant wait to see it they really spent alot of time on it bumped his compression clearanced head for big ass cam really nice saw it yesterday..

Lol thanks Allen (Beavis voice) *Yeaaaah bad ass* *baaddd asssss * lol


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## Sahale (Apr 9, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

cool, thats what i was looking for. yeah 268/260 lift is 432


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## purplejettahondaeater (Oct 29, 2000)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (Sahale)*

what's the dealie on the heads people bailed on, get flow #'s on them and post'em up with what ya want for them


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (purplejettahondaeater)*

yeah a list of the head you got, with the work done and some $ figures might get them sold.


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

I needed new retainners and lifters because Allen wasn't sure on the origin of my core, that makes sense, might as well have everything replaced.


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

Just a question, I am going to have to use the stock cam for now and go with the TT260 later due to me having to maximize all my cash for this turbo. How will the stock cam perform in the head? Also where is the best place to buy gaskets and ARP head studes? What else do we need when replacing the head?


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## dubass (Mar 26, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

if i can get the $ together i would still love one of these heads man they sound awesome. yeah allen i say try and sell the heads with specs and all that, you could at least make most of the $ back. it really does suck that when a vortexer gets something good going some people gotta make it difficult, but hey, whadayagonnado eh?


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## GreenGawker (Nov 6, 2000)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dubass)*

I am looking at building a 2.0 turbo. I am really considering buying one of your heads. I was just have some questions for all you guys running these heads with turbo's. Is this changing your compression ratio? Should i build a forged piston bottom end to go with this head? I want to build a 2.0 turbo in a mk2. Any info about turboing with this head would be helpful. thanks


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (GreenGawker)*

i will build complete turbo motors for any one interested exactly what i am running ive done 2 already they were not really that cheap but i think the bottom and head with arp every thing shot peened ect wound up being aroun 1800 but that included cams to oil pan with the oil return welded in ...
and as for the cam ??? i ran 11.55 on a stock cam this year my motor blew up at waterfest last year when i got greedy with boost on a hot day and i f-ed the head pulled the cam and ive been running the stocker since my cam is at the machine shop being used as the template forthe heads....


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

oh and the heads are interchangeable with parts so i can mix match the parts i have with any combination the valves are the same diameter as stock just much better weight and quality (i got stuck with 2 sets of inkandel valves they are 256 a set exactly what i paid) it will put the head in the $900 range with the good guides and retainers ..without a flow sheet but the one i have was like 178-180 cfm with the tt cam its settup for turbo and nos.....i copy of mine just a little less flow ...
and the other head is like $665 it has the racing valve springs, retainers,and good valve guids. just ss valves .and flows 174cfm..also set up for turbo..
when i say set up for turbo i mean there is a higher flow rate in the exaust side than on a naturally asp motor


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## turboit (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Can you get sodium filled valves as an option too, or do you think those are overrated? 
TIA
-Bill


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (turboit)*

sodium filled valves are outdated compared to todays moder alloys


----------



## turboit (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote, originally posted by *81 vw pickup* »_sodium filled valves are outdated compared to todays moder alloys

damn learn something new everyday. Thanks for the advice http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Maverik869 (Jan 3, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (turboit)*

on a stock 2.0 motor how much gain are u looking at after u get the p&p ? if i bought one of these and put it on my car... how much more power will i be making...


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## dubass (Mar 26, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote, originally posted by *81 vw pickup* »_sodium filled valves are outdated compared to todays moder alloys

im not doubting your knowledge, but if that is true, why do some sport turbo cars like the audi rs4 still use them?


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dubass)*

beacause of the cost i would assume ..regaurding valves ...also they are heavy eventhough they disspate heat well (dont see any hondas running them
and i cant give you a straight answer to bolt this on and it will give you this much hp it doesnt work like that every car is different ..
also on a side note if the head is for a naturally asperated application the head will flow 171-172 cfm we are trying to let you keep some kinda tourqe (esp for street cars ) 
my motor will be in by water fest so ill post my dyno sheet as soon as i have one and we can compare dyno ### to what i have now so you can see what kinda gains i make and what is possible with an 8 v keep in mind im turbo charged.


_Modified by 81 vw pickup at 11:18 PM 6-6-2003_


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

I got head














- I'll put it in next weekend since my buddy and I originally were going ot put it in this weekend but forgot about his gf's graduation arty







. Will post impressions of the head once in. I spent about 45mins at the machine shop this morning watching Dave Jr (the machinist) put my head together - and chatting with him - really nice guy and very professional in his approach to his work. They build a hell of a lot of V8 motors there and lots of pics of cars with their engines running big #'s. Thumbs up to them for service, and more than likely for quality of work.


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## GTIRACER2.0t (Aug 23, 2000)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

ok so whats the stock head flow? if these head are flowing over 170cfm how much gain in flow over stock is that?


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## dubass (Mar 26, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (GTIRACER2.0t)*

i believe in the 150's at best.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dubass)*

yea 150 is about right the later model 96 and up castings receive the biggest gain as they aRE IN THE LOW 140
the biggest gains are in the exaust side the stockers only flow at like 61 % of what the intake flows so you receive a great gain here esp on turbo cars.
allen


----------



## jettaboy2001 (Oct 22, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

is this for real


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (jettaboy2001)*

Is what for real ?


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## Turbodub17 (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dubass)*

would you mind listing what you've done to your engine and what you would build for $1800. Is that parts and labor? Thanks. I look forward to seeing you at waterfest, hoping in the 10's.


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## jettaboy2001 (Oct 22, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *WolfGTI* »_Is what for real ?
25-35hp from a head job.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (jettaboy2001)*

wolf gti not only added a port and polish he went with a header ,big a$$ cam,and a custom chip,and bumped the compession a good bit, i believe 30 hp shouldnt be that hard of a goal to reach with proper tuning of timing and the cam gear..


_Modified by 81 vw pickup at 6:33 PM 6-13-2003_


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote, originally posted by *81 vw pickup* »_wolf gti not only added a port and polish he went with a header ,big a$$ cam,and a custom chip,and bumped the compession a good bit, i believe 30 hp shouldnt be that hard of a goal to reach with proper tuning of timing and the cam gear..
_Modified by 81 vw pickup at 6:33 PM 6-13-2003_

I think 30 might be a little excessive - maybe possible with standalone and a custom throttlebody setup- but we shall see.


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

Well the head went in today - will post impressions etc in a day or two. 



_Modified by WolfGTI at 11:49 AM 6-23-2003_


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

*June 23, 2003*
*Ok* - time for some butt dyno impressions. The car idles like a v8 - it is pretty lumpy, the chip Techtonics burned for me has the idle stuck at 1000 rpms, and its not bad at all, no complaints there. I will try and post pics of the old ports versus the new ports if the pics turn out decent. While idling the car is louder on the exhaust side and it really pushes out air on the exhaust side - the pulses are hard and fast.
*Driving* - the car is definitely a bit softer in the lower rpm's but the compression bump helped that situation. Once the engine crosses 3700 rpm or so its builds power very smoothly and pulls really well to 7000 rpm. However since my headers are not on yet (stock exhaust manifold ports are tiny) I think I am being held back a bit once over 6000. I will have to see how it feel once the header is on. Overall the car is fun although I do have to shift down a gear where as with the stock cam I did not. The standard A3 gear ratios are perhaps not best suited to the way my engine's powerband is now. When I swap in the 16v tranny I think the car will definitely surprise some people. 
Besides the head I replaced my cam tensioner, belt and water pump. Total job minus a run to Sears hardware and 2 meals took 9.5 hours, this included stopping to talk and just messing around. Not bad at all - to take off the head took 2.5 hours.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

any chance you are planning a trip to the dyno?


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

When and where is this dyno - I've been a bit lazy and not read everything lately.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

no idea where a dyno would be in your area. I am on the west coast, we have them scattered about.


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

Oh - I apologize I thought you were referring to a specific dyno day event. I do intend to go and dyno as soon as I have the header on.


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## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

You can hit the 2.0L GTG/Dyno Day on June 28th....there's a thread on it.


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

If the header is on I will come.


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## cptnsloni (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

hey man.....never talked with you bore...but it would be awseom to see you at the dyno...i'm sure a lot of valuable info could be exchanged. I know i'd like to see ya there.....hoepfully you can make it even if you jsut come without dynoing....anyays....if you need more info about he GTG...there is another post in this forum about it allmotor8v(Jeff) is setting it up


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (cptnsloni)*

What the hell, there's a possibility of a family commitment on Saturday - if it doesn't happen then I'll head up. Maybe we can plan some sort of caravan for cars leaving the Philly/South/Central NJ area.


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## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

I feel your pain.....I have the same deal - have to go to a stupid engagement party for my girlfriend's brother and his fiancee


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (cptnsloni)*

On an interesting note - the 276 has not given me a CE light yet - which I find to be interesting on a car that is OBDII.


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## cptnsloni (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

hows that 276 feelin for ya....jsut spoke with someone whop upgraded fdrom a 266 to a 276, and said it was a ncie difference up top without much sacrifice down low....compared to the 266 cam


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (cptnsloni)*

Its nice - I think the stock exhaust manifold is definitely holding it back above 6000 ,once that is freed up it will be even better. I don't find i have lost that much low end - definitely compared to the stock cam, but not enough to where the car is undriveable - I am going to play with the timing gear and see where I want it to be permanently.


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## VW97Jetta (Sep 5, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

Hmmmm.....maybe it's time for yet another cam swap and another $200 down the drain...


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (VW97Jetta)*

i am curiose to see some dyno ## from wolf gti as well ...
i thing you need an egt gauge or a good af gage and a adj fpr ..so you can add the fuel you need up top..try slightly advancing your cam timing ... 
i didnt get a ride in the car before so my but dyno wont be able to tell where the gains are...


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Hel Allen, I tried calling you but got your voice mail - I'll try to get intouch with you- I'm really pleased with how the car feels now.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

so wolf, you gonna go to the dyno day??


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

Yes I will be there - hopefully I will be able to install the CAI tonight, but the header is a 2 week wait.


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## tdogg74 (Mar 1, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

I just read through this post and dynoed with WOLFGTI on the 28th. I am running a 276 cam as well (found that out...long story), but without any head work and stock exhaust manifold. I layed down 128.8whp @ 6300rpm and could have made way more if my car could have revved faster (like 20 7000rpms). I think if I had a P&P and a header, 140whp would have been _very_ easily attainable. WOLFGTI had issues at like 5000rpms, so he didnt dyno all that well, but I am confident his car would have surpassed my numbers.
And I have to add, that my OBDII has NEVER pulled a CEL running this fat-ass cam either. Ishint that veird?


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## ryansjetta (Nov 20, 2002)

I plan on getting the 276 cam but first i need the head work done along with new lifters, lighter vavles, new springs, and retainers. How much would you charge and do you take credit cards?


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: (ryansjetta)*

Got my head today







It looks very good and can't wait to put it on. Course that won't be for some time cause its part of the turbo install. Allen did a great job and I am totally satisfied with how he ran everything. Good job Allen and thanks for the T http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: (veedub11)*


_Quote, originally posted by *veedub11* »_Got my head today







It looks very good and can't wait to put it on. Course that won't be for some time cause its part of the turbo install. Allen did a great job and I am totally satisfied with how he ran everything. Good job Allen and thanks for the T http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Glad to see someone else echo my sentiments


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: (WolfGTI)*

info on heads email me its easier to keep who is who straight for me..if your looking to mock wolf gti,s settup around $950 w/t out the flow data sheet and a few little extras he wound up with he was in the 1000 dollar range you can thank him for most of the na cars he was the 1st that wanted a bullet proof head we had done 3 na cars before him but they werent interested in alot of the little stuff (example comp bump, inandel valves, (ive only been mispelling them for 3 months)..)..
veedub11 head works and will support 300whp if he can tune to get it ..
but his head is proven.. i did it and used it on the street as a weekend driver for a year (beating it to death out living 4 motors only 1 head and 2 bent valves the piston contacted them) .
the turbo heads i will be going on the dyno july 15th so we will see what the new runners and port work will make ...
allen


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: (81 vw pickup)*

Where are you dynoing Allen ?


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: (WolfGTI)*

ida automotive by e-town ,,,
great great place verry knowledgable guy ,,datlogging wide band awd dyno ..
sweet


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: (81 vw pickup)*

What kind of dyno - is it a Dynojet or Mustang ?


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## bahnblitz (Jan 18, 2002)

*Re: (WolfGTI)*

not sure if i want to go trubo or NA vw pickup what kind of injection are you running? Any chance the head can be fitted with solid lifters for a little extra cash fro a NA engine?


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: (bahnblitz)*

bump


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: (veedub11)*

the heads can be fitted with solid lifters but i wouldnt reccomend it unless you are trying to make 500whp my hydros are still alive w/t no problems....


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: (81 vw pickup)*

oh and i dynoed with the new head ..at the same boost level 20 lbs i made about 60whp difference ,same cam, bigger turbo ,and bigger injectors....with the new head...


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: (81 vw pickup)*

Allen - I called you @ Waterfest - but I am guessing you were occupied - how did you do at the 1/4 mile ?


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## KrautFed (Jan 9, 2002)

*Re: (WolfGTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *WolfGTI* »_Allen - I called you @ Waterfest - but I am guessing you were occupied - how did you do at the 1/4 mile ?

























































Allen, it was nice to meet you in person. Thanks for accepting the parts at the show. I was only able to see Round 1 Elim's... how'd you do?



_Modified by KrautFed at 12:12 AM 7-23-2003_


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: (KrautFed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *KrautFed* »_
:Allen, it was nice to meet you in person. Thanks for accepting the parts at the show. I was only able to see Round 1 Elim's... how'd you do?
_Modified by KrautFed at 12:12 AM 7-23-2003_

I saw Allen around 2pm on Sunday, every time he was up to race I heard the announcement when I was at the venders or at the show, so I always missed his runs.







Anyways I saw him at his pit and he said that he had just ran a 12.0 due to his boost control valve f-ing up. With the messed up valve he was only able to run 15psi. Hopefully he was able to fix it and run more boost for a better time.


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## kickster (Aug 15, 2000)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (veedub11)*

I see that prices have changed since day one. How much does it cost for stage 3 race port job? What does the stage 3 race port job envolved? 
I am planing on building a semi race 2.0 crossflow engine. It would be running on digifant I or carbs with 282 catcams race camshaft, brospeed header, short intake runners. 
Thanks in advance


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (kickster)*

the port job is the the same on all the heads ecpt /na vs fi
email me for inquiries


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## GTibunny16v (Aug 12, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Squealing the slicks at the 1/8mile







Good runs, I hope my bunny will be as quick in a year or so.


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## 81 vw pickup (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (GTibunny16v)*

sorry for the dissapointing showing at waterfest my best on the day was [email protected]
my 1st pass grannying he car out of the hole was a 12.2 @120 mph it was all down hill from there..
but two weeks ago i ran [email protected] so im getting there just alot of personal stuff been happening death in the family so i just returned a crap load of emails ...
all the heads that i was left holding are gone and i have two cores left ...it would be easyier for me if you provided me with cores for the next few weeks 
and kroughtfed (sp) we are trying somthing a little different on your head its looking good should be ready in a few i know your in no rush just giving you an update
allen


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## KrautFed (Jan 9, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*


_Quote, originally posted by *81 vw pickup* »_kroughtfed (sp) we are trying somthing a little different on your head its looking good should be ready in a few i know your in no rush just giving you an update








Thanks. Sorry to hear about your loss.


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

Sorry to hear about the personal loss Allen - will talk to you soon.


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## dunhamjr (May 21, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

bump... cause I need Allen to email me back as soon as possible.
my head has a bent valve(s) and would prefer to do a little work before I put it back together.


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (dunhamjr)*

Incase anyone cares - I will be dynoing at the NGP dyno this month - will post #'s - hope I do ok.


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## bajan01 (Nov 26, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (kickster)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kickster* »_I see that prices have changed since day one. How much does it cost for stage 3 race port job? What does the stage 3 race port job envolved? 
I am planing on building a semi race 2.0 crossflow engine. It would be running on digifant I or carbs with 282 catcams race camshaft, brospeed header, short intake runners. 
Thanks in advance 

I'll have some flow bench results and dyno results in a few months for you NA guys and gals
















Sweet A1 by the way










_Modified by bajan01 at 10:19 PM 9-3-2003_


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## smack (Dec 28, 2000)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *WolfGTI* »_Incase anyone cares - I will be dynoing at the NGP dyno this month - will post #'s - hope I do ok.

I care, good luck and I'm looking foward to your #s!


_Modified by smack at 2:55 PM 9-4-2003_


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (smack)*

Next month seems to be the time. Thats when my turbo kit and head gets installed


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (81 vw pickup)*

bump http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## kickster (Aug 15, 2000)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (bajan01)*

when would you be able to get the dyno results?


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## bajan01 (Nov 26, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (kickster)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kickster* »_when would you be able to get the dyno results?

Not until early in the new year for me. The head isn't even put together yet








Here is a new pics


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## RTW Rally (Jun 12, 2003)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (bajan01)*

hows this?








this is for our rally car


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## SSj4G60 (Aug 13, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (RTW Rally)*

so how have the heads come out


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## WolfGTI (Jun 16, 1999)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (smack)*

My dyno's were 110 hp and 118lb ft with the cam gear at +4. Setting the cam gear to -1 my results were 120 hp and 122 lb ft. I like my motor alot with this head.


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## J.Owen (May 31, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (WolfGTI)*

holy old topic.... but i wanna know too ..


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## veedub11 (Mar 10, 2002)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (bugasm99)*

Allen's the man


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## bajan01 (Nov 26, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (SSj4G60)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SSj4G60* »_so how have the heads come out 

I hit the dyno tomorrow. We'll see what happens


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## J.Owen (May 31, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (bajan01)*

and... what happened...


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## bajan01 (Nov 26, 2001)

*Re: interested in building up a 2.0 head (bugasm99)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bugasm99* »_and... what happened...









...this happened








http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1369366


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