# Laying frame and keeping FSB intact on a mkv?



## shortwave360 (Jul 6, 2008)

Over the next couple of months I should have my car finished and I will know for sure, but for now I haven't seen or heard of the set up I am putting together. My goals are simple to say, but making it work will prove to be tricky surely. I want to lay frame and retain my FSB. I am trying to combine handling and style into a package that is not often seen as of yet. I didn't want to "kill" my gti by going air... lol 

My system is as follows: Ride Tech w/4 sensors, 5 gal, 3/8", FK endlinks, BY supremes and firestone rears, WALK, Audi TT a-arms and stock FSB. Most of the stuff is still trickling in through the post over the next couple of weeks. 

I have read a bit about the fk COs set-up being able to go low enough to necessitate a notch if you wanted to go lower. My frame will be notched before install, but I want to know if I should just bite the bullet and buy a H&R FSB now due to it supposedly being designed to clear controls and suspension on ultra low cars. I am thinking they used their Ultra lows for a point of reference. I am not afraid to fab something up, but I was hoping someone could shine some light on the issue for me if they have dealt with it already.


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## GnarPassatWagon (Mar 7, 2009)

:thumbup:mk5's on the airlift set up with out a FSB drive amazingly.... Better than with coils and FSB in. Just saying if you do it right and get good parts from quality company's you will be more than satisfied.


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## Rat4Life (Oct 14, 2004)

i think on mk5 body you should be able to get away with sway bar in place and laying the frame. 
you have to make sure your bagyards will have attachments for the sway bar,not all of them do. 
also what kind of a firestone kit you running for mk5 rear? 
to lay the frame with sway bar your will have to notch and tire size is critical. 
i say if you running 18s 215/35s will def help you to get down. 
why do you think removing sway bar will kill your car? 
i am on mk4vr bagyards supreme front and firestone rears without swaybar and handling is great. 
in fact i m thinking on entering for autocross at waterfest and see how it will do.


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## _Dirty_ (Sep 30, 2009)

Rat4Life said:


> why do you think removing sway bar will kill your car?
> i am on mk4vr bagyards *bombers* front and *RE-5s* rears without swaybar and handling is great.


 X2


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## shortwave360 (Jul 6, 2008)

Rat4Life said:


> i think on mk5 body you should be able to get away with sway bar in place and laying the frame.
> you have to make sure your bagyards will have attachments for the sway bar,not all of them do. *I had the mounts included in my options.*
> 
> also what kind of a firestone kit you running for mk5 rear?*Undecided and not ordered yet. Any advice from experience is appreciated. Was doing a masontech rear sleeve, but now more set on the convoluted design.*
> ...


 :thumbup:


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## shortwave360 (Jul 6, 2008)

I checked out the powergrid site. :thumbup: 

I am stoked you posted it cause I was looking around for adjustable links and coming up nil for this platform. The FKs were on backorder and I canceled it and ordered them up just now from their ebay store. 

:beer::beer::beer:


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## AlexsVR6 (Jul 24, 2007)

BklynMKV said:


> appears you and i are after, ahem, similar things.
> 
> first, removing the front sway on at least the MKV is not a good idea in regards to handling. the front end becomes more drifty, and torque steer is more pronounced. you can counter some of this by powering through turns - and yes even lane changes - but its definitely not as 'on rails' without it. also, i run a 28mm solid RSB (H&R/AWE), so the handling is further changed from removing the front bar. I did the SoWo mountain cruise a few weeks ago, and while the car did exceptionally well on the bombers and accuair e-level, i def missed the front sway -- and my Z1 star specs.
> 
> i'm currently running bombers - but a first gen set that did not have the tab for the front sway. i should have new ones in the next couple weeks from the fine folks in austria, and will be rehooking up the stock sway with the adjustable powergrid endlinks, going for corner balancing, and see if we can find the right mix in this thing. :beer:


 I think it rides pretty well without the FSB. Usually when your doing bags your not looking to track the car. Just take it out.


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## Retromini (Nov 7, 2004)

AlexsVR6 said:


> I think it rides pretty well without the FSB. Usually when your doing bags your not looking to track the car. Just take it out.


 But why take it out when you could just do a little work and keep it in? Then you'd still have a fun handling street car. :thumbup: 

Adjustable end links should definitely do the trick, but I'll be interested in hearing whether they are the correct length for a drop as low as airride provides. I found that with my air setup, the available aftermarket end links were still too long to provide the proper swaybar position so I'm making some up out of some threaded rod and rod ends.


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## mikebbugn (Sep 19, 2006)

i dont have a gti, but my mkv rabbit handles good on the airlifts without the FSB. not as good as it did with the coils, but feels much better over bumps  good luck getting it to work :thumbup:


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## Rat4Life (Oct 14, 2004)

shortwave360 said:


> Undecided and not ordered yet. Any advice from experience is appreciated. Was doing a masontech rear sleeve, but now more set on the convoluted design.


 def don't go with mason-tech firestone rear,by far its the worst mk5 rear kit IMO . it doesn't go low when aired out and you have to keep 90 psi just to get up to ride height, i really dislike that rear kit. 
i really recommend bagyards rear kit nice top notch anodized aluminum brackets and a nice large size sleeve bag,very comfortable ride with a nice pressure in the bag. 
airlift has something very similar to bagyards,but the thing i do not like about it is plastic top and bottom bag brackets that were probably tested and will work without any problems, but i will have to see that in a year or so after driving all winter trough salt and freezing cold to tell how good or bad they are.


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## Hokie GTI (Sep 22, 2006)

shortwave360 said:


> rear: et50 10"x18"


 there's a good chance the wheel will make contact with the shock with that width and offset. If you plan on increasing rear camber you'll definitely need to space it out at least 5-8mm.


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## shortwave360 (Jul 6, 2008)

Hokie GTI said:


> there's a good chance the wheel will make contact with the shock with that width and offset. If you plan on increasing rear camber you'll definitely need to space it out at least 5-8mm.


Thanks, I kinda forgot to mention I had a spacer solution in mind. I have a two piece wheel that I am reverse mounting the center from the rear or the barrel that acts as 10mm+ spacer.

You are spot on with your estimate though! I had them mocked up w/o reversed center and that is just about exactly what was going to be needed to clear my shock body.


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## shortwave360 (Jul 6, 2008)

Rat4Life said:


> def don't go with mason-tech firestone rear,by far its the worst mk5 rear kit IMO . it doesn't go low when aired out and you have to keep 90 psi just to get up to ride height, i really dislike that rear kit.
> i really recommend bagyards rear kit nice top notch anodized aluminum brackets and a nice large size sleeve bag,very comfortable ride with a nice pressure in the bag.
> airlift has something very similar to bagyards,but the thing i do not like about it is plastic top and bottom bag brackets that were probably tested and will work without any problems, but i will have to see that in a year or so after driving all winter trough salt and freezing cold to tell how good or bad they are.


I just saw them on ORT's site! When I ordered my supremes last month they weren't being offered yet it seemed. I have no doubt they are a great product, but still kinda feel the sleeve design might not hold up as well after being air out 1000 times. Can you bang plates with a sleeve and not hurt it? lol


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## Skin88 (Oct 16, 2008)

sorry if been answered i didn't feel like reading all the responses but mkv's can keep the FSB and still lay subframe. it doesnt get in the way or going low so if u have the choice to keep it do it.


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## Rat4Life (Oct 14, 2004)

shortwave360 said:


> I just saw them on ORT's site! When I ordered my supremes last month they weren't being offered yet it seemed. I have no doubt they are a great product, but still kinda feel the sleeve design might not hold up as well after being air out 1000 times. Can you bang plates with a sleeve and not hurt it? lol


 not quite sure what "bang plates "means but if you dont want to go sleeve bag i suggest airhous 2 with s10 brackets and some fk or any shorter then stock shocks. rides great , goes low and very inexpensive.


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## shortwave360 (Jul 6, 2008)

Rat4Life said:


> not quite sure what "bang plates "means but if you dont want to go sleeve bag i suggest airhous 2 with s10 brackets and some fk or any shorter then stock shocks. rides great , goes low and very inexpensive.


Thanks for the great bit of info on the rear bracket! My friends installing the system have mentioned fabing up whatever it takes to contain the rear bag, so I am not too concerned with an off the shelf fitment. They weld, I don't. 

"Bang plates" was a term I heard to describe how a convoluted bag has a design that allows the top and bottom plates to touch without malformation of the bag itself vs a sleeve design that will scrunch & bunch unevenly and eventually cause undesirable wear that could cause premature failure.


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## shortwave360 (Jul 6, 2008)

Skin88 said:


> sorry if been answered i didn't feel like reading all the responses but mkv's can keep the FSB and still lay subframe. it doesnt get in the way or going low so if u have the choice to keep it do it.


awesome :thumbup: thanks for the reply!


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## [email protected] (Aug 22, 2006)

As BklynMkV said, the BagYard rears have an internal guide that allow the bags to fold/crumple/fall (whatever you like to say) in the sample place every time you compress them. This feature is great in conjunction with their patented upper crush nut design - it basically allows no movement as the bag collapses and you are pretty much guaranteed to never blow a rear bag. :thumbup:

Felix, the sleeve design BagYard uses on the rear bags has been the same for over 3 years now and there have been no major issues with ripping, tearing or over use. I daily drive my car and the bags look used but not worn out. The Conti-Tech sleeves are very durable and are able to withstand lots of use. :beer:


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