# Help please....



## QuantankSyncro444 (Apr 21, 2020)

Ok guys, I'm at a total loss. Lemme give you the shpeel. 

After doing my clutch, and putting it back together, I managed to get a new starter cheap enough to get (and might as well do) an ignition kit. Installed, the parts, put it all back together, starter won't engage.... Installed a toggle switch system for the starter. Engages but no start. Compression tested it, zero compression in cylinders. Rechecked engine timing, it's perfect. Pulled the engine apart, removed the 5 Pistons, and replaced the rings on all of them, slapped it all back together, AND!! No start..... -.-

I'm beginning to lean towards thinking it could be fuel related? Maybe fuel distributor timing? Could my vacuum harness layout be incorrect? 

Again the engine timing is perfect, I've quadruple-checked it. 
Spark is also there, before anyone asks. 

Can someone link a vacuum diagram

Oh yeah, standard 10 valve, single-overhead cam, inline 5 SOHC engine. '86 Quantum Syncro


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## cuppie (May 4, 2005)

First things first: 
Welcome to the forum! Dasher/Quantum doesn't get a whole lot of traffic here - don't be surprised if a thread sits for a while. 

The no-crank / no starter power means that you need an ignition switch. Full stop. Replace it. I've also seen them drop terminal 15 (ignition Run power) when turned to Start. That'll ufck up your diagnosis of things right there.  

Car ran fine before doing the clutch? Not sure how doing a clutch resulted in a zero compression issue. But, crappy spark could - if it can't light the cylinders, fuel will wash the rings down (they need oil to seal), and can cause low-to-no compression. 

You said that it has spark. Is it strong, consistent spark, on all five cylinders? Is the ignition timing correct? It doesn't need to be *exact* to start - but, with the engine at #1 TDC, the rotor needs to be pointing to the timing line on the housing (lines up with the #1 tower on the cap.) 
Good condition plugs? 

Vacuum routing: I don't have a diagram handy. Might have one in my Quantum Bentley manual, though. Your vacuum routing label (on the hood) missing / destroyed? 
That said.... I could strip the (very small amount) of vacuum hoses off of that engine, and it'll start just fine - _so long as all of the ports are capped_. CIS engines are very sensitive to intake leaks, particularly when it comes to startup. (fun fact: Pull off the brake vacuum hose from the engine, and it won't start. BTDT.) 

"Fuel distributor timing": no such thing. It doesn't spin, it isn't timed to engine rotation. All five (in your case) ports are opened at the same rate - metering rods are lifted via the airflow sensor plate. Hence the name Continuous Injection System. 
A few readings on how it works, and troubleshooting it: 
http://mastertechmag.com/pdf/1996/11nov/199611IS_BackToBasics.pdf 
https://audi.humanspeakers.com/tuning-cise.htm
https://www.benzworld.org/threads/bosch-ke-jetronic-overview.1553096/
https://ncr-pca.org/index.php/club-activities/technical-sessions/48-cis-fuel-injection-operation
NOTE: The QSW uses CIS-E (KE-Jetronic.) CIS (the OG system) and CIS-Lambda (K-Jet_Lambda) are different (more parts); CIS-E3 (KE-Jetronic w/ knock control) is similar fuel-wise, but with electronic ignition timing control (this is what my Scirocco 16V has.) -E and -E3 don't use an aux. air regulator (AAR) or a warm-up regulator (WUR.) 

The single most important thing that any CIS setup needs to work is correct fuel pressure.


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## QuantankSyncro444 (Apr 21, 2020)

By any chance can I get you how to maybe photocopy my email some of the excerpts from your Bentley? I only have two different manuals for an Audi Quattro from the same era and a Chilton's manual for all Volkswagens of that time frame with excerpts on the quantum. I don't have really any solid information for my car. Particularly anything that has to do with troubleshooting and the fuel system and ignition systems. It would be really appreciated


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## QuantankSyncro444 (Apr 21, 2020)

So it appears that my issue now with starting the car is strictly isolated to gas related. It would seem that I'm not getting fuel from my tank to my distributor, and it is spraying out the hose connections on either side of the fuel filter. Now I've got a Bentley, and reading it has helped some of the issues I was facing but still can't seem to help me get around this unknown gas problem


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## B1-16V (Aug 5, 2002)

You mentioned that you had 0 compressions, so you tore apart and replaced the rings and put it all back together. You did not mention if you did another compression test after that.


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## cuppie (May 4, 2005)

QuantankSyncro444 said:


> So it appears that my issue now with starting the car is strictly isolated to gas related. It would seem that I'm not getting fuel from my tank to my distributor, and it is spraying out the hose connections on either side of the fuel filter. Now I've got a Bentley, and reading it has helped some of the issues I was facing but still can't seem to help me get around this unknown gas problem


 Well, that's a major problem.... Are the copper or aluminum washers present on each side of each banjo fitting on the filter? 
Two washers per fitting. And, if that filter uses the size adapter on one end (some models use it, some don't - and, I don't remember if the Quantum uses it), a 5th washer between the adapter and the filter. 
A missing (or damaged) crush washer will equal one severe fuel leak. Same if one of the banjo bolts, the filter, or the fittings are dirty or damaged (think: nicked or pitted.) Anything but FLAT = leak.


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## QuantankSyncro444 (Apr 21, 2020)

Would said leak be sufficient enough to cause a no start issue though? I dont recall it having been an issue before it stopped running and I replaced the filter early on.


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## klim (Sep 5, 2011)

Shouldn't. Old VWs run at a super high fuel pressure, but ive had Sciroccos leaking fuel from right there and running fine.


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## cuppie (May 4, 2005)

Depends on just *how* severe the fuel leak is (we aren't there to see it, after all...) 
I could see it making startup difficult, due to needing to purge air out of the fuel system (if it leaks, it'll drain, after all.) But, it should still (eventually - like, <20 seconds of cranking) start, even with a severe pressure leak - that pump only has one speed: 100%. And, that'll move enough fuel, at ~80psi, to feel the engine at 100% load at redline, *with* a safety margin. 

Fix the fuel leaks (because, well, they need to be fixed), and check the fuel pressure. That is, literally, Step 1 in CIS diagnosis.


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