# Volkswagen Alltrack Concept at 2012 NYC Auto Show



## [email protected] (Feb 16, 1999)

Wagons always get enthusiasts and motoring journalists excited. Funny for some of us that grew up with family wagons with woody sides and couldn't imagine every owning one back then. Anyway, VWoA is dipping their toe in the water with a concept version of the European-only Passat Alltrack to gauge reaction here on this side of the pond. So let's break this down a bit and try and make some guesses as to what VWoA is potentially up to...

*FULL STORY...*


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## TREGinginCO (Jan 4, 2004)

If VW had this car in the U.S....I wouldn't be looking to buy the all new Audi allroad when it arrives here in a couple of months.


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## GLS99 (Jul 18, 1999)

It'd be the closest competitor to the Subaru Outback, and I'm sure people who dig wagons and need AWD capabilities would cross-shop them, especially given the efficiency of the TDI engine versus the Outback. 

Audi A4 Allroad and Volvo XC70 would cost at least 10k more than the Outback / Alltrack.


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## renato (Aug 11, 2002)

Looks OK but really not my thing. I'd much rather have a sport version... gimme a Passat Wagon with the same specs as the Golf R. In fact, give me ANY Passat wagon with a 6-speed manual  #vwignoringUSminoritymarket


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## 3rdtime (Jan 28, 2005)

Yes please.


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## strictlyvanagons (Jan 20, 2007)

When the Subaru Outback diesel is finally brought to this country and the Mazda (Tiguan) sized DIESEL little SUV arrives here soon maybe VW will be shamed into bringing us a six speed DIESEL all wheel drive Passat-Tiguan. Better yet==== bring us a small engined TDI/electric/plug in hybrid. Why not offer a 300 or 400 hp hybrid for the stupid car buyers and a much less horsepower diesel/electric plug in for those who would trade 0-60 figures for 55 -110 mpg. VW SHOULD be the first manufacturer of cars that offers a 100mpg diesel/electric hybrid (3 cyl. TDI motor please VW)in a smallish super lightweight rugged body. Perhaps in a Jetta sized or less wagon with the capacity to carry the added weight of the hybrid components. VW could easily outpace and outclass the Prius line of economical hybids with their years of TDI evolution. I vote for VW bringing out the FIRST Tiguan,CRV,Outback etc. sized all wheel drive small SUV that the Tahoe owners are trading in in droves. VW===Bring us ECONOMICAL===50-100 plus mpg Prius fighters and bring us 40-80 plus mile per gallon SMALL CRV/Outback size 4WD diesel/electric POPULAR wagon/SUVS PLEASE!!!!!!!! WE KNOW YOU CAN DO THIS and we would prefer the VW brand be KING of the hill and the first with these products. I rest my case. VW should rule the WORLD in inovation and sales!!!!!!!


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## 02tdiblk (Jul 30, 2003)

YES please. TDI and some sort of all wheel drive. THANK YOU.. Now please bring it here!


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## [email protected] (Aug 21, 2008)

TREGinginCO said:


> If VW had this car in the U.S....I wouldn't be looking to buy the all new Audi allroad when it arrives here in a couple of months.


I am still on the fence with the Allroad!


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## ClownCar (Feb 16, 1999)

I'll buy one. Gas or diesel. Take my money!!!


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## simple (Mar 29, 2001)

Needs bigger tires. Same goes for the Audi Allroad coming out. Low profile tires should not be specified.

BTW, the concept car is beautiful.


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## strictlyvanagons (Jan 20, 2007)

Vortex readers. For info and pictures of a YOUNG low mileage Subaru DIESEL motor being installed in a Vanagon go to smallcar.com in Washington state. Happy motoring!!!!


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## vr6fanatic (Apr 5, 2003)

I would purchase one! How ever, This seems to be another forbidden fruit for the United States!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## renglish (Jun 30, 2004)

if Subaru does bring their diesel to North America, I would most likely buy theirs for the AWD.
but if VW does AWD/4Motion and diesel in a Tiguan size SUV or Passat/Jetta/Golf Wagon, I will definitely stay in the family when we next buy a car.
Currently in a JSW TDI 6M and absolutely love driving it. 

Please bring this, my boss even wants an Allroad, but won't pay Audi prices.


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## ScottieDucati (Feb 17, 2005)

Yep, I'd trade my '09 Jetta TDi in on one of these in a heartbeat, but please provide a manual transmission option!!!


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## R11S (Mar 11, 2006)

*'07 Passat Wagon owner feeling left out in the cold...*

I've wished many times that the new German Passat Wagon would be sold here but so far not. We have on '07 Passat Wagon that now has >110K Miles...still a GREAT Car!!!

If I had to choose I'd rather not have All-Track versus what we have now. I'd want a Diesel and the big Open Sky Sunroof for sure!

We test drove a new JSW with Open Sky...nice car but our 5'11" Daughter didn't have enough leg room in back.

VW - you're new car dealer lot currently has nothing to interest me in trading in my '07 Passat Wagon. I'll keep right on driving it because it suits our car needs perfectly.

And yes, I've looked closely at the Subaru Outback as a replacement one day...


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## groupracer (Apr 15, 2002)

F' again... :facepalm:


"Currently, there are no plans to bring this vehicle to market in the U.S., but the concept is set to gauge market reaction to a potential future model that is similarly sized and combines offroad ability with wagon versatility."


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## Peter_Rabbit (Aug 9, 2005)

VW need only look at the subaru outback and the volvo xc70 to realize that there is a niche market in the USA.

Since I can't get a diesel passat wagon, I would consider the alltrak with diesel (and hopefully a manual transmission). VWoA should bring this stateside.


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## abeR (Sep 13, 2002)

:thumbup::thumbup:


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## AsianDude (Sep 17, 2007)

The exchange rate is not so bad anymore


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## Buran (Apr 21, 2000)

Refuse to bring over German Passat wagon, refuse to build US Passat wagon.

BMW has said they're still going to support their wagon lovers.

No A3 hatch anymore. No A3 wagon.

VW has aimed straight at its toes and pulled the trigger.

My next wagon will probably be a BMW after 12 years of VW ownership.

Good job, VW.


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## epic d (Feb 16, 2010)

I don't see this concept happening... I don't even see volkswagen selling many 4motion equipped cars in the us in the future... Other than the R32/Golf R niche, I think it's well known that Audi offers Quattro already and the enthusiasts seeking a more economical volkswagen won't want to pay more for awd.


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## RG.Jeff (Apr 16, 2011)

:thumbup::thumbup:


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## gti dreamn (May 18, 2002)

*just bring us the flipping Passat wagen...I mean Alltrak*

VWoA, just bring us the Passat Wagen, Alltrak or whatever you want to call it. :wave:

If you are too concerned about it not selling, bring it over in a limited run, like other "special" VWs.

If you are concerned about it digging into T'reg, Tiguan and JSW sales, see my comment above.

If Audi is concerned it will take away from their Avant sales, again, see my comment above the above comment.

Some of US still want a wagen to drive and maybe the JSW just doesn't do it and a $45k SUV doesn't answer the need either. The Alltrak fills this want.

Oh, can we have it with the 6-spd manual and the TDI? That's how I would want mine.


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## chuque (Aug 25, 2006)

WTF? i am on my 2nd passat wagon....... guess i am heading for another MB next.


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## 3 dubber (Feb 24, 2002)

Build it, we will buy it!!
My 02 Passat (sport) wagon is still going strong but not forever. The Jetta Sportwagon is a bit of a downsize for me, this would be great. 
But this is the Passat Alltrack they are offering in Europe. Which VW says it's too $$ to import to the US.
Read a rumor that a SUV was going to be built on the US Passat platform in Tenn which has plenty of capacity. A SUV would sell many more than a wagon, so why are they teasing with this?


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## Junius Spencer (Aug 15, 2009)

I have an AWD Passat wagon. I want a new AWD Passat (or Jetta) wagon with a TDI. Where can I put down my deposit?


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## feels_road (Jan 27, 2005)

Junius Spencer said:


> I have an AWD Passat wagon. I want a new AWD Passat (or Jetta) wagon with a TDI. Where can I put down my deposit?


That's really a big problem for many of us: VW has neglected to offer something we can buy into, now that our cars are 7-12 years old. VW is forcing us to look elsewhere.

_>>So we suppose it is possible that VWoA *could* build a Jetta Sportwagen Alltrack in the future. That would likely mean the successor to the current Sportwagen._


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## VR6Now (Dec 31, 2000)

Well regardless of market reaction I don't believe we'll ever see this. VW loves to show us stuff they'll never bring unless people go utterly nuts about it and then it will be 4 years after the fact after all the excitement has died down. Still showing the Bullie concept but no product after how many years? Still teasing a Tiguan diesel after 4 years and we have still have a couple more to go at least. 

I'd buy it but there will never be a chance to do so I'm not going to even ask VW to send it over. Instead of waiting for the inevitable VW rejection of the car for the US market as shown (TDI, 4motion, & DSG), lets just thank them for the distraction. It can join the Jetta Coupes, Amoroks, Bullies, and unicorns of myths and legends.


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## Not2FastNot2Serious (Jun 30, 2003)

*Bought an Outback, wish we had the choice of an Alltrack*

We are a long time VW family. Needed a wagon. Looked at JSW (too small) and Audi A4 Avant (too expensive). So we bought a 2012 Subaru Outback 2.5 Limited. Nice car, plenty of cargo space. But missing VW attributes like good handling, upscale interior, VW design language, many little details that make VWs so satisfying.

If only the Alltrack were available in the US. :banghead::banghead:


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## John Y (Apr 27, 1999)

Would love to see this in the US; would consider it in the future. In fact, I can "see it" at the dealer over here any day now...


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## CorradoMagic (Apr 11, 2008)

I'd luv to have this.. price the right price. 
AWD, Wagon, Diesel, a combo Audi doesnt currently offer.
I want the A3 tdi.. in quattro. I'm not buying a FWD Audi, ever.

That combo plus manual is the ultimate win.. & manuals are cheaper, that makes good sales sense


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## dr. pimento (Nov 22, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Wagons always get enthusiasts and motoring journalists excited. Funny for some of us that grew up with family wagons with woody sides and couldn't imagine every owning one back then. Anyway, VWoA is dipping their toe in the water with a concept version of the European-only Passat Alltrack to gauge reaction here on this side of the pond. So let's break this down a bit and try and make some guesses as to what VWoA is potentially up to


blah, blah, blah. My family has owned VWs for almost 50 years and my Dad has always had a wagon (412, Dasher, Quantum, Passat). He currently has a 2008 Passat V6 4Motion (70K miles) and the JSW doesn't hold a candle to it.

We looked at the Volvo XC70 (too expensive and I think relaibility will suffer under Chinese ownership) and the Subaru Outback (think of a car with the technology of a fifteen-year-old VW). The V6 Passat sedan is very nice but without 4Motion it's no good to us...

I understand the wagon market has shrunk to almost nothing in the US --- but why show us a concept and _actually tell us_ it will never be sold here. 

Also, how does a concept vehicle offer options...it hasn't even been built yet let alone been set with any option packages...


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## ValidUsername (Mar 29, 2012)

I think that thing looks pretty sweet, wouldn't be bad as a daily driver or something I'd feel comfortable with in any conditions


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## Plasticar (Sep 5, 2003)

I already forwarded the article to my dealer contact, letting him know that if they ever actually do announce bringing this one, I'll rush right over with my deposit check. 

I am personally on my 4th VW/Audi AWD wagon (B5.5 A4 Avant, B5.5 Passat wagon, original allroad, B6 A4 wagon). My wife is on her 2nd B5.5 Passat sedan, this one with quattro / 4mot. She bought hers off lease because she wanted to keep the AWD.

I am the fringe nutcase that desperately wants a AWD wagon (not SUV / CUV / truck), and would defect to anyone who would offer that with a diesel. Bring this, with the higher powered tdi. As much as I would be happy with a manual, I already know it would come with DSG or auto. I can live with that. Make it a single model to eliminate the permutations. Get behind tdi for REAL!

You mean to tell me VW couldn't sell at least as many of these as the Golf R? With a little ad support at least. Probably better to base it on the US Passat, adding the backend sheetmetal. I hear a rumor that the US Passat does have the floorpan allowances for AWD, should they want to incorporate it.


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## zuma (Jul 30, 2006)

8 veedubs and 5 audis so far in my household. 
Bring the alltrack in jetta or passat version please
Oh yes....diesel please!


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## Aonarch (Dec 4, 2006)

I think the Alltrack would be decently popular. As said earlier in the thread, the Subaru's get ****ty MPG, for the most part. 

TDI + 4Mo + Ground clearance + Popular NA Passat = Greatness.


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## SWheat (Feb 1, 2003)

I've driven nothing but VW/Audi since 99. Had two Jettas, a Treg, GTi, R32, Passat Sedan, Passat Wagon, and two A3s between the wife and me. She's currently in the 08 Wagon and I was lamenting a lack of a viable VW/Audi option.

The JSW is nice, but not even close to enough to replace the Passat Wagon. The Tig is too heavy and get's crappy mpg with not much more space than my A3. Tregs are too big for her and JSWs too small. This concept is the Goldie Locks in the lineup. It's also pretty down to Earth for a concept. Just a Passat wagon with 4-Mo and Allroad-esque fender flares. Looks like something that could be rolled out pretty fast if they want to do it. Also, considering the attention the Allroad is geting, this would be a good stepping stone for families that aren't quite as upper-crust yet.

Definitely should be built and imported. I see no reason to bring it to a North American auto show if they weren't going to test the waters for selling it here. It's not a radical concept and does not really break any new ground for VW or Audi. It just fits nicely in a product gap.


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## ClownCar (Feb 16, 1999)

Just looked at the full gallery of pics and I like it even more.

A wagon / allroad version of the current North American Passat would suite me just fine. It does not have to be the European model as I do appreciate the space now offered by the NA version.

I'm trying to visualize a 7 passenger crossover based on the NA Passat with styling cues from this concept because I believe this is where the whole thing is going...all to replace the Routan...and hopefully soon.

Remember the 'Roccan' is coming.


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## randomkoreanguy (Jul 20, 2002)

I think it would be great as an affordable alternative to the higher priced A4 Allroad and the much loved Suburu Outback. If I were in the market for an all wheel drive softroading wagon, the VW would stand a good chance of luring me in with its nicer interior and higher quality compared to the Outback. The prospect of having it be Jetta based though concerns me because it falls into a lower class than the midsized Passat. Given that fact, I suspect that a Jetta Alltrack would compete more with Subaru's new Impreza based wagon CUV thing (called the XV Crosstrek). I think a Passat based wagon would be much more appealing despite VW's previous statements that a US based wagon would never see the light of day. The Outback is the rival to shoot for and offering better interior appointments and a nicer German feeling cabin would go a long way towards luring away those seeking a more premium feel on a tight budget. Nothing against Suburu, the interior isn't bad but it's not fantastic either.


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## Tregger (Mar 9, 2004)

*Bring to US in both gas and definitely TDI*

Audi trying to get my wife into a new Allroad.....but she likes this better and as a TDI.

"If you build it, they will come" 

Please bring !!


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## cthrall (Sep 20, 1999)

I'm in, seems like a great idea to me. I'd like more room than the Jetta wagon, and 4Motion would be great. Could be a serious competitor to the Outback...


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## epic d (Feb 16, 2010)

Not2FastNot2Serious said:


> We are a long time VW family. Needed a wagon. Looked at JSW (too small) and Audi A4 Avant (too expensive). So we bought a 2012 Subaru Outback 2.5 Limited. Nice car, plenty of cargo space. But missing VW attributes like good handling, upscale interior, VW design language, many little details that make VWs so satisfying.
> 
> If only the Alltrack were available in the US. :banghead::banghead:


The 2.5L 4cyl boxer engine in the outback is more true to vw form than any passat. My Room-mate owns one as well, and in retrospect.. I'm glad I talked her out of paying that much more for an a4 wagon with quattro. For both price and mechanical reliability.


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## gti dreamn (May 18, 2002)

Plasticar said:


> I am the fringe nutcase that desperately wants a AWD wagon (not SUV / CUV / truck), and would defect to anyone who would offer that with a diesel. Bring this, with the higher powered tdi. As much as I would be happy with a manual, I already know it would come with DSG or auto. I can live with that. Make it a single model to eliminate the permutations. Get behind tdi for REAL!


just to let you know, you aren't the only one (fringe nutcase) out there. :sly:

at the rate car selections are going, my 8 year + Mk4 GTI will only get replaced with a TDI Golf 4-door, a GTI 4-door, or the JSW...all with 3 pedals because I like to DRIVE the car, not ride in it.


I say, give these their own racing series, ala Jetta TDI Cup, and that should be about all the advertising VWoA needs. It had me sold on TDI power, except for the fact the Jetta has a trunk and I want a hatch and not a trunk lid.

Sure, I realize this post/thread will be useless in the end, but at least we're trying.


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

If this was a regular Passat wagon then YES! The Alltrack is overkill and a little hard on the eyes. 

Just bring a regular Passat (not the NMS flavor) wagon in TDI form.


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## MeineFolks'wagen (May 8, 2002)

groupracer said:


> F' again... :facepalm:
> 
> 
> "Currently, there are no plans to bring this vehicle to market in the U.S., but the concept is set to gauge market reaction to a potential future model that is similarly sized and combines offroad ability with wagon versatility."


X2 

It's OK - you know that VW can be the number one car seller in the world by excluding the U.S. market out of many of their models  We can't get the cool small cars or vans, but we do get a rebadged Dodge van as the Routan :banghead: 

I used to be a Volkswagen driver, now I'm just a fan of the old air cooled models. My 2003 Wolfsburg Jetta was my last VW. I can't afford your newer models anymore, so I will probably end up buying Korean for my next car. I'm even considering a Forcus or Fiesta and I NEVER thought I would ever consider buying an American car. Here's to the good old days! :beer:


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

MeineFolks'wagen said:


> X2
> 
> It's OK - you know that VW can be the number one car seller in the world by excluding the U.S. market out of many of their models  We can't get the cool small cars or vans, but we do get a rebadged Dodge van as the Routan :banghead:
> 
> I used to be a Volkswagen driver, now I'm just a fan of the old air cooled models. My 2003 Wolfsburg Jetta was my last VW. I can't afford your newer models anymore, so I will probably end up buying Korean for my next car. I'm even considering a Forcus or Fiesta and I NEVER thought I would ever consider buying an American car. Here's to the good old days! :beer:


Feeling you 100+% here. I'm liking the Focus hatch in Titanium trim; shame it's missing Xenons and a 6-speed manual option at that spec for the US market. I would buy a Ford (new Focus and upcoming Euro Mondeo replacement, the Fusion I believe?) without looking back and this is coming from a hardcore VAG-head.


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

I'm a long time owner of many VW/Audi vehicles. I still love them, but I'll burn in hell before I own another Jetta TDI, so I won't be buying a butched-up version of one of those. 

That being said, a Passat alltrack for the US market is a complete no-brainer. The ONLY competitor left in the market at the price point is the Outback and Subaru sold 67,000 of those last year. *SIXTY-SEVEN THOUSAND* of what is quite possibly one of the ugliest cars on the road. I know many people who have bought these things for years and continue to do so due to a lack of a credible alternative. VWoA, if it has any market sense (proof exists for a "yes" and "no" answer here) would be foolish to not to bring this car over in at least the short term to test its market value, and if it works, start production in the US to meet demand. Federalizing the current Passat Alltrack for three years gives VWoA a full market year to gauge interest and two full market years to design a wagon version of the US Passat variant and prep the assembly line. This is no different than what GM is doing with the very popular Regal, which is imported from Germany until the US plant comes on line.

The most logical place to build it is Chatanooga. Wagons are a simple variant to produce on an assembly line, and it's much simpler to add a parallel body line of robot welders than it is to do the same with the drivetrain line. Ford did this for years in the Edison plant where the Rangers were built. 

the Jetta wagon, in my opinion, is a little on the small side to compete against the Outback, and its far, far too small to compete against the real threat of mid-range CUV's like the Traverse, Edge, and Venza. The Passat is the only credible platform from which to base this car. A bonus, I think would be to offer the car with the pumped R20 motor from the Golf as the base engine. It costs VW nothing to do this and will cement the idea of a hot wagon in the public mind. Wagons, in base form, cannot compete against CUV's in the US market. The car needs an additional differentiator to raise awareness and get butts in driver seats.

and one last thing - put a stick shift on the option sheet. again, this is a near-zer cost thing for VW to add, and it doesn't matter if only 5 people buy it, the blogosphere and press will love it and for that alone it will be worth it in free advertizing for a new model.


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

FractureCritical said:


> I'm a long time owner of many VW/Audi vehicles. I still love them, but I'll burn in hell before I own another Jetta TDI, so I won't be buying a butched-up version of one of those.
> 
> That being said, a Passat alltrack for the US market is a complete no-brainer. The ONLY competitor left in the market at the price point is the Outback and Subaru sold 67,000 of those last year. *SIXTY-SEVEN THOUSAND* of what is quite possibly one of the ugliest cars on the road. I know many people who have bought these things for years and continue to do so due to a lack of a credible alternative. VWoA, if it has any market sense (proof exists for a "yes" and "no" answer here) would be foolish to not to bring this car over in at least the short term to test its market value, and if it works, start production in the US to meet demand. Federalizing the current Passat Alltrack for three years gives VWoA a full market year to gauge interest and two full market years to design a wagon version of the US Passat variant and prep the assembly line. This is no different than what GM is doing with the very popular Regal, which is imported from Germany until the US plant comes on line.
> 
> ...


What is an R20? LOL sarcasm. You mean 2.0T from the Golf R / Audi TTS


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## RSDA (May 20, 2004)

Six-speed stick
TDI
4MOTION


Sign me up.


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## Stevesvws (Apr 12, 2004)

I definaltely want one. VW send me the brochures as soon as its released. 

I have a 2004, 1.8t, passat wagon 4 motion, manual. its got plenty of life left in it, but, this all track is right now the only viable replacement out there. 

I would put my order in for 1 with a TDI please, 4motion and manual trans of that can be done. Dont really care about the color combo either.


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## brekdown29 (Jun 26, 2007)

Love it, would likely be the next car I get. VWoA please wake the f*ck up and sell some wagons in the states!:laugh:


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## simple (Mar 29, 2001)

Stevesvws said:


> I have a 2004, 1.8t, passat wagon 4 motion, manual.


Loved that car. Wanted one but never could find one. Got a turbocharged Subaru Outback and love it. The only downside is the gas mileage. I average 21 mpg. The upside is my maintenance bills are significantly less when compared to my 2001 Passat.


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## TWinbrook46636 (Apr 18, 2003)

It would have to have a TDI option for me to consider it. I'd be more interested in the TDI-Hybrid Cross Coupe but we all know that will never happen.


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## mark_d_drake (Aug 17, 2006)

This or a Tiguan 4wd Deisel Plz


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## vwbugstuff (Mar 27, 2004)

Roccan TDI (built in TN) for me please....:thumbup::thumbup:


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## brianfox (Nov 11, 2008)

*=D*










Just a quick photoshop!


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## feels_road (Jan 27, 2005)

FractureCritical said:


> A bonus, I think would be to offer the car with the pumped R20 motor from the Golf as the base engine.


The latest engine generation is quite different -- two generations advanced from that engine. So, this cross-over would likely get the 2.0T version of the new 1.8T in the Audi A4. A bit more power, a lot more torque, and much more frugal than the current 2.0T.


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

feels_road said:


> The latest engine generation is quite different -- two generations advanced from that engine. So, this cross-over would likely get the 2.0T version of the new 1.8T in the Audi A4. A bit more power, a lot more torque, and much more frugal than the current 2.0T.


If you're referring to the same motor that's in my 2011 A4, then it's not good enough. The extra torque is nice, but it only serves to make up for the extra weight of the car. Don't get me wrong, I love the car, but my 3700 lb A4 Quattro with the 211hp/258tq (ish) engine is a touch SLOWER than my 2008 3100 lb Passat wagon with the older 200hp/201tq (ish) engine. Something tells me the alltrack is going to be closer in weight to the Audi than the Passat.

Edit: the Passat got better fuel economy, too. I never went under 30 mpg on a combined driving tank of gas, the Audi, if I hypermile the hell out of it, occasionally breaks 30 on a combined driving tank. I will admit that clear straight highway numbers are about the same: the Passat got me about 33 mpg, the Audi gets me about 34.


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## Essayon (Feb 14, 2000)

*Use the NA Passat chassis*

If you build a Station Wagon on the NA Passat chassis, I will buy one! I don't care about the AWD, but I do want the extra space and a TDI. Kids have a tendency to keep growing and I am tired of being kicked in the back! VW SUVs are too small. I can carry three kids and Grandmother or three kids and a friend for each with my Suburban. We would use a Passat Station Wagon when it’s only the five of us. Bigger is better with Station Wagons!

Now that VW has a DSG TDI 4Motion drive train put together it is time to build an Audi A3 Sportback DSG TDI Quattro!


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## [email protected] Caprara (Feb 23, 2012)

I have lost count of the people that have asked me about a new Passat wagon. Build it in Chattanooga, price it right, sell a few and recoup the costs. It shouldn't cost too much if a majority of the components are shared with the sedan. I think they could make it work.


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## RidinRetro1973 (Jan 25, 2008)

VW NEEDS to bring this to the US!!!


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## definition56 (Jan 8, 2005)

MeineFolks'wagen said:


> X2
> 
> It's OK - you know that VW can be the number one car seller in the world by excluding the U.S. market out of many of their models  We can't get the cool small cars or vans, but we do get a rebadged Dodge van as the Routan :banghead:
> 
> I used to be a Volkswagen driver, now I'm just a fan of the old air cooled models. My 2003 Wolfsburg Jetta was my last VW. I can't afford your newer models anymore, so I will probably end up buying Korean for my next car. I'm even considering a Forcus or Fiesta and I NEVER thought I would ever consider buying an American car. Here's to the good old days! :beer:


Haha. I'm right with you. I've been a VW guy for a VERY long time...never owned anything but for over 17 years. I swore up and down that I'd never own a Japanese or American car. Now I'm the VERY (check that...EXTREMELY) proud owner of a 2012 Toyota Tundra Crew Max (for the family). I still own an '03 Gli, an '83 Gti, and an '80 Scirocco. Guess which one's getting replaced next. I'll keep the old.

I still have a hard time understanding the logic of wanting to be the number 1 car manufacturer and not even offering a complete line-up of cars. Keep "dipping your toes in the water" VW cause you just lost a very loyal buyer....wife wants another Toyota. 

...to the good ole days. :beer:


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## Brimjolt (May 16, 2008)

I love it, I want it. Manual? Take my money!!!


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## bigstu (Mar 6, 2008)

Junius Spencer said:


> I have an AWD Passat wagon. I want a new AWD Passat (or Jetta) wagon with a TDI. Where can I put down my deposit?


This is awesome, love the color!!! 

I love the idea of a Passat Alltrack, especially with that drivetrain combo!!! And it looks really good too! I LOVE VAG AWD!!!!! Still really disappointed VW didn't release the Tiguan in TDI AWD in the US, or sell the A3 with a TDI AWD combo.


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## Tarik (Jun 21, 1999)

ClownCar said:


> I'm trying to visualize a 7 passenger crossover based on the NA Passat with styling cues from this concept *because I believe this is where the whole thing is going*...


I believe you are right.


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## 85GTI (Dec 19, 2000)

Aonarch said:


> I think the Alltrack would be decently popular. As said earlier in the thread, the Subaru's get ****ty MPG, for the most part.


+1 to that. I had a 2000 Outback which was a decent car, but the mileage was horrible for such a small vehicle. My sweet '88 Volvo 760 wagon was much bigger and got about the same MPG.

I like the idea of an Alltrack, even one based on the US Passat. But a BlueMotion version would be appreciated by those of us who care about MPG.


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## vr6fanatic (Apr 5, 2003)

I truly believe that Volkswagen doesn't think that there isn't a market here in the United states. It showed with the MKIV R32, It was never meant for our pond, how ever with a collaborative team of jurnalits they conviced Volkswagen that it would sell like HOT cakes, And it did.


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## 85GTI (Dec 19, 2000)

vr6fanatic said:


> I truly believe that Volkswagen doesn't think that there isn't a market here in the United states. It showed with the MKIV R32, It was never meant for our pond, how ever with a collaborative team of jurnalits they conviced Volkswagen that it would sell like HOT cakes, And it did.


Operative word here is "think". VW doesn't "think" it would sell. Isn't that what marketing departments are for? And ad agencies? Hire a killer ad agency and you can sell anything. Something is just not right with VW in North America. They are either held back by the Vaterland or they just don't have the guts to go for it. If Subaru can sell 76,000 of their funky wagons I truly believe VW could do the same or better. Snap out of it VW.


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## Sixtysomething (Aug 7, 2003)

As gas prices go up, I would think wagons would make a comeback here . The Jetta Sportwagen is cool, but a bit small. The Passat Alltrack would be a good alternative to an SUV.


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

fiftysomething said:


> As gas prices go up, I would think wagons would make a comeback here . The Jetta Sportwagen is cool, but a bit small. The Passat Alltrack would be a good alternative to an SUV.


 IF VW throws a set of jump seats in the back of the Alltrak ala the current M-B E Class wagon, it would go a LONG way to giving the car a real differentiator over the Outback and boosting sales. Being able to say you have a car that seats 7 and gets 30 mpg would be a big deal.


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## rutabaga40 (Oct 3, 2011)

We are leaning towards the XC60 as our next family hauler, but this would be my personal first choice if they'd bring it. Love it! 

:thumbup:


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## Blue Golfer (Feb 4, 2003)

It almost looks like a Dodge Journey.


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## Jedidub (Oct 6, 2010)

I've owned two vw wagons a 2008 passat 2.0t & currently have a '10 jsw TDI these cars offer an intelligent alternative to the huge fuel slurping SUVs' that every other company offers. I say bring it vw I live in flat Florida so I really don't need awd, but I would still choose it if it were an option IMO its the best all around vehicle for a family guy. I absolutely love my jsw, and mods are endless c'mon vw we need this I love Audis, but I'm not fond of their service nor the prices they come with.


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## spaz_666 (Jan 28, 2001)

Oh look, a Volkswagen Outback. 

Doesn't matter, we won't get it anyway. 

VWoA... stop forcing me to buy Subarus! *PLEASE*!


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## ronin1 (Feb 5, 2006)

Once again it's frustrating to be teased with things like this that I think would have a market here. 

Wagons are on the comeback. Even Lexus has one now. I know all wheel drive wagons may not appeal to some segments of the US, but with the success of things like the Legacy/Outback I don't know why they don't think it would be worth it to sell them here, even if they have to manufacture it in the US? :screwy:


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## uhrgenau (Oct 3, 2003)

*Is VW Bi-polar?*

Sometimes I think there are two VWs. There is the VW that operates in Europe and much of the rest of the world and then there is VW in North America (US and Canada). The former builds and sells interesting and innovative cars. The latter is all about limiting customer choice and really odd product planning. 

Case in point. This winter I was in Australia. What did I see in a small rural dealership in this country of 23 million people? A GTD, two Sciroccos, and a range of models that would put the VW North America product line to shame. Not only that but the salesman I spoke with was quick to point out that the full European option list was available for order. No silly packages but the real deal. Were the cars expensive? Yes, but at least they were available. 

Fast forward back to North America. VW builds a new factory to produce a unique Passat model for the US and Canada. OK our needs may be different from the rest of the world but does that include leaving out modern technologies like HID headlights and advanced driver assists? Huh. Who buys the Passat. I bet it's families and mature adults who benefit from these technologies. And what happened to the wagon. Can't a modern, state of the art assembly line build a wagon as well as a sedan? I don't get it. 

When I read about VW technology on Vortex I get excited. Diesel electric hybrids, Yeah bring 'em on. Then I go to my local dealer and I see a product line that is at least 5 years behind the 8 ball. What gives? I have to conclude that there are two different VWs out there. One for them and one for us. Too bad.


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## gt-ire (Jul 13, 2010)

bring to U.S. please - I've got a tdi jsw, and would def be interested in stepping up to this in tdi form


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## CorradoMagic (Apr 11, 2008)

looks good in person. 
This was a fully functional model, not a prototype. 

If they were judging 'customer feedback' you'd think that it would not have limo tint on ALL the windows. People would like to peep the interior ya know.


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## SUVAGEN (Aug 13, 2011)

*YES!*

I adore my 2008 Passat Wagon 3.6 4Mo. I have had it two years (CPO purchase) and I drive 20K miles/year. I need a replacement and with tall children (currently 5'10" at 13 and 6'2" at 17) this 5'10" mom needs space. Audi's are smaller; Beemers, not my style; and Suburus, well... not enough passenger space and not enough farfegnugen! I'm closing in on 80K miles and I need a replacement right about 2014.... 

Take my money. I am ordering Candy White, beige interior, diesel preferred. Passat sized. We have a Jetta Sportwagen TDI too and it is neither as solid nor big as the Passat, and I prefer both. I would even pony up for the German made version (in fact I would prefer it).


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## SweetRide (Jan 7, 2004)

This car is amazing, and just so you know the interior is nothing amazingly special, just euro spec and features we would probably never see over here but I love it! I would love to have this car!


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## sbachmeier (Mar 2, 1999)

Passat wagon owner since 2000. I am hooked on the wagon format (no crossover trendiness factor needed for me). I would buy this car. 2.0 TSI or 2.0 TDI. Base it off the US Passat platform if you have to. VWoA, just do it!


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

So if this thing makes it state-side - will it be based on the Euro Passat wagon? Please say yes. :laugh: 

Hear it is COMING in a TDI  This might be the next [future] family hauler!


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## gonavy (Mar 31, 2000)

*Once Again, VW dangles the carrot in front of our nose*

and then proceeds to beat us with the stick.... 

I'd trade my GTI on a TDI AllTrack tomorrow. 

For all the good it would do....:banghead:


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## randomkoreanguy (Jul 20, 2002)

CorradoMagic said:


> If they were judging 'customer feedback' you'd think that it would not have limo tint on ALL the windows. People would like to peep the interior ya know.


 Rather than build a Passat Alltrack from scratch based on our larger North American Passat, they did the cheaper, easier, sensible thing and imported their European Passat Alltrack. I suspect that the exceptionally heavy tint was so that we wouldn't get envious of all the extra stuff the Euro market gets to pay for that we don't. So this way, they get to show it off and just give people the line that the interior is similar to the Passat and not have to explain that this is actually a European spec car or why there's all these extra buttons and features that will never see production on a potential NA market variant. 

As for all the extra features in question that have been removed from the NA spec Passat, I'm sure that as it becomes more and more common for a typical midsize sedan to come equipped with this tech, VW will be pressured to add it as at least an option. With the midsize segment being as competitive as it is, there's no way they wouldn't eventually add something that every other competitor in the segment had. It's just a matter of how long until the tech trickles down from the more premium automakers to the average consumer product level for our market.


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## teton (Nov 19, 2005)

yes, I'd buy one. Prefer a manual and more than 1.2 inches extra ground clearance.


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## cwescapexlt4x4 (Jan 2, 2003)

Count me in! - I don't need AWD, but would love the 190HP TDI wagon as a future vehicle for us. The JSW we have is nice, but a bit on the small size. 
We came from a 91 Passat wagon, to a 2001 Focus Wagon to the 2011 JSW TDI and who knows what is next. IF there is a Passat Wagon, you can bet it will be SERIOUSLY considered!


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## BetterByDesign (Sep 7, 2004)

Subahroo produced and successfully excuted this "concept" 15 years ago... 
Is VW's product cycle based on dog years or a calendar cycle the rest of us dont know about?


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## erick.s (Feb 2, 2001)

I've been looking for an AWD vehicle to replace my Golf TDI with. My wife has a Tiguan, so I don't want two of the same thing in the house. Other than the Tig, VW doesn't offer an "affordable" AWD car here in the US. Honestly, my only real option if I want to stay under $30K and keep to a hatchback/sedan (not an SUV) is to go Subaru. I've been giving the Legacy a really long look lately. The only thing stopping me from pulling the trigger is the so-so fuel economy. If VW said today with 100% certainty that this concept would be released in the US priced around $27-28K base I would put down a deposit within 10 minutes of the announcement.


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## nater (Apr 10, 2000)

quailallstar said:


> If this was a regular Passat wagon then YES! The Alltrack is overkill and a little hard on the eyes.
> 
> Just bring a regular Passat (not the NMS flavor) wagon in TDI form.


I agree. To me, it looks almost identical (except for some small visual improvements) as the B6 Wagon. The interior is only slightly different than the B6 Wagon VR6. 

I don't get it. What's the deal with this "Allroad" phenomenon? It's just a B6 Wagon sitting a bit higher with some goodies to protect the engine and trans if you go offroad. And who actually takes these wagons off road anyway??? 

I'm all for a new VW...hell I love almost everything VW, but the reason this won't ever be built is because they just removed the Passat Wagon from USA...why would they essentially bring it back in a rebadged "all road" variation?

Correct me if I'm wrong but maybe I'm missing some vital differences between the two??? opcorn:


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## SweetRide (Jan 7, 2004)

randomkoreanguy said:


> Rather than build a Passat Alltrack from scratch based on our larger North American Passat, they did the cheaper, easier, sensible thing and imported their European Passat Alltrack. I suspect that the exceptionally heavy tint was so that we wouldn't get envious of all the extra stuff the Euro market gets to pay for that we don't. So this way, they get to show it off and just give people the line that the interior is similar to the Passat and not have to explain that this is actually a European spec car or why there's all these extra buttons and features that will never see production on a potential NA market variant.
> 
> As for all the extra features in question that have been removed from the NA spec Passat, I'm sure that as it becomes more and more common for a typical midsize sedan to come equipped with this tech, VW will be pressured to add it as at least an option. With the midsize segment being as competitive as it is, there's no way they wouldn't eventually add something that every other competitor in the segment had. It's just a matter of how long until the tech trickles down from the more premium automakers to the average consumer product level for our market.


You are correct on the interior! I have seen buttons that I have never seen on a VW before! Also they have been doing market research for 2 days now....so just keep your fingers crossed seems most people want it just depends on price!


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## BsickPassat (May 10, 2010)

funny... that VW marketing....

when they asked how it compare to the Crosstour.... did they not realize the existence of the Outback? or XC70... and the old A6 Allroad (and the new a4 allroad)???? this is for the $5 starbucks gift card survey

wasn't too bohered by the limo tint.... since I do have a B6 Passat wagon....and people could just walk to the 2013 CC on display

if it costs less than the old VR6 4Motion.... ie maybe $35k .... i would buy it


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## nater (Apr 10, 2000)

BsickPassat said:


> if it costs less than the old VR6 4Motion.... ie maybe $35k .... i would buy it


Not trying to sound like a troll but I'd recommend you "lower it" once you buy it. 
And I doubt it'll cost ~$35k. By the way, it won't be sold here in the US because Vw has made it clear they won't cannibalize Audi sales. Least that's my opinion but I'm no expert. 
Seems (as you mentioned) a bit too close to the Audi wagons.


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## ColoradoB5 (Dec 27, 2001)

These "teases" from VW are why I own Audi's now.


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## Daemon688 (Mar 23, 2005)

This thing is not coming to the US. I was just at the booth at the NYAS and there was hardly anyone even giving this thing a look. There were far more people looking at the new beetle right next to this thing. Honestly this vehicle is larger than I would need, but I am looking for a VWAG AWD, TDI, CAR. If this came, I would put my money down on it. Till then, I'm driving my golf till the wheels fall off. Which is a verrrry long time from now.


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## SweetRide (Jan 7, 2004)

Daemon688 said:


> This thing is not coming to the US. I was just at the booth at the NYAS and there was hardly anyone even giving this thing a look. There were far more people looking at the new beetle right next to this thing. Honestly this vehicle is larger than I would need, but I am looking for a VWAG AWD, TDI, CAR. If this came, I would put my money down on it. Till then, I'm driving my golf till the wheels fall off. Which is a verrrry long time from now.


I am not sure when you came, but since I work the booth for VW I was there all week and I can't believe how many people actually want it! I had hundreds that said bring it and I was only 1 of 19 that was working the booth. I also talked to the marketing people and almost everyone they talked to wanted it just worried about the cost!


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## kimmers71 (Jan 22, 2002)

Bring it PLEASE!!!!


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## randomkoreanguy (Jul 20, 2002)

nater said:


> I agree. To me, it looks almost identical (except for some small visual improvements) as the B6 Wagon. The interior is only slightly different than the B6 Wagon VR6.
> 
> I don't get it. What's the deal with this "Allroad" phenomenon? It's just a B6 Wagon sitting a bit higher with some goodies to protect the engine and trans if you go offroad. And who actually takes these wagons off road anyway???
> 
> ...


It's a matter of perception. Does everyone realize the Outback is really just a Legacy wagon on stilts? Probably. (I mean, it's hard to miss the obvious.) The Passat Alltrack is essentially the same thing: a Passat wagon on stilts with a bit of extra soft-roading bits thrown in for good measure. Does it make a huge difference compared to a normal 4Motion wagon? Realistically, no. But in the minds of the buying public, it's just that extra half step closer to being a full on SUV and that's what makes the difference. Just ask Mercedes, they're the kings of manipulating perception. Take a good hard look at the G-wagen... it's borderline obscene what they charge for what's essentially just an old German military vehicle with a ton of luxury bits thrown onto it, but people buy it, people want it, and the darn thing actually sells in decent enough numbers that they keep postponing its retirement. (I mean, at this rate they'll never retire the thing.)

The extra SUV bits give people a sense of ease, comfort, and security that they're making a good compromise on something that's SUV-ish enough to suit their desire to go soft-roading, but keeps the significant portion of its car DNA so that it retains most of the benefits of owning a sedan/estate/wagon. I mean, most people's idea of off-roading is driving down an unpaved gravel road, so technically even a GTI could realistically perform equally well but again, it's not about that, it's about perception. In a capitalist free market society, companies will sell what people are willing to buy and gosh darnit, if they want to buy an all-wheel drive wagon on stilts, who is VW to deny them the right to spend their hard earned money the way they want to?  

It's been a pretty fantastic formula for Subaru. I think it's about time someone else finally offered a real alternative. Considering the fairly miniscule numbers of wagons other automakers sell, Subaru just might be onto something and they've been pretty much hogging this niche all to themselves. Last year Subaru sold something like 100k+ Outbacks. That's not just great for a wagon, that's pretty good sales numbers compared to a mainstream midsize family sedan. (By way of comparison, I think Acura predicted it would sell 5000 TSX Sportwagons the entire year. VW hasn't sold 100k Passats per annum in our market in nearly a decade.)

-- And as an aside, it's also a great opportunity for the enthusiasts to get a hold of a wagon again and since it's only a few steps removed from a regular Passat wagon, I'm sure there'll be people who'll lower it back to 'normal' height (or lower), swap the Alltrack specific bumpers and such for standard ones or .:R Line bits and such. Any excuse to get a wagon over here again, right? 

I should probably also state somewhere that I find it to be strangely appealing. If it came with the full features of the Euro version (skid plates, off-road program, diff lock), I would seriously consider getting one. I've always loved hatchbacks and wagons and the idea of having a go-anywhere wagon is very alluring. (I use the term 'go-anywhere' very loosely. It's clearly not a Jeep Wrangler. That being said, I would personally rather compromise on the side of comfort than on the side of greater off-roadability, but that's just me.)


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## M this 2! (Feb 8, 2012)

This car is SO lame! I really hated it when companies do this re badging of an idea. Oldsmobile Bravada/GMC Blazer or what ever the hell names they had. It even has 'ALL' in it's name like the Allroad. To me it just looks like a complete rip off w/o any ingenuity at all. Maybe Audi can make a smallish, hip van and name it the Eurofan


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## TWinbrook46636 (Apr 18, 2003)

The article suggests that they would base it on the US Passat or perhaps more likely the Jetta if it actually comes to pass. The only reason they are showing off a concept based on the Euro Passat is because it already exists so it's a quick and dirty way to get general feedback about the idea. One could argue that it also shows they are not very serious about it.


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## BsickPassat (May 10, 2010)

Suprised no one mentioned... so close to Toyota's Alltrac


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## MeineFolks'wagen (May 8, 2002)

I'm so glad that Volkswagen isn't bringing all of their new innovative models to the U.S. - I owned my last Volkswagen back in 2004  Your loss guys!


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

TWinbrook46636 said:


> The article suggests that they would base it on the US Passat or perhaps more likely the Jetta if it actually comes to pass. The only reason they are showing off a concept based on the Euro Passat is because it already exists so it's a quick and dirty way to get general feedback about the idea. One could argue that it also shows they are not very serious about it.


 the Jetta wagons sell exceptionally well, they don't need the fluff of the "AllTrak" effect. The Passat wagon, though near and dear to my own heart, has never been a big seller for VW. VW needs to fill a slot between the Tiguan and the Toureg in terms of ize and price, and this car fits nicely. A Jetta wagon would be too small for the type of people VW is looking to attract, exp, when SUV-ish alternates like GM's Chevy/GMC twins get good mpg with the 4 banger and sell like hotcakes.


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## 16vsilverstreak (Dec 5, 2001)

*Who do we need to contact at VW to get the alltrack to the states?*

I'm probably going to go the way of the Subaru if VAG doesn't get something that is comparable to a Forester. Please build it in Chattanooga!


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## VW_Hippie (May 14, 2010)

I think VW is going to be left in the dust in north america. They are always too late to the party or they don't care. VW NA new marketing slogan "stripped down and decontent flashy german engineering". VW desperately needs to bring more selection and more innovation. VW keep this German built or German built quality. The passat I rented in munich last week really shows what kind of scam VW is running here. May 14th we have the appointment with Audi and MB. Volkswagen too slow again!


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## GTINC (Jan 28, 2005)

VW_Hippie said:


> I think VW is going to be left in the dust in north america. They are always too late to the party or they don't care. VW NA new marketing slogan "stripped down and decontent flashy german engineering". VW desperately needs to bring more selection and more innovation. VW keep this German built or German built quality. The passat I rented in munich last week really shows what kind of scam VW is running here. May 14th we have the appointment with Audi and MB. Volkswagen too slow again!


 So, their current sales success in the USA is just a fluke? 

I too want all the premium models VW AG has, but not at the expense of them leaving the USA market completely due to bad sales.


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## R11S (Mar 11, 2006)

Too slow is right. Why haven't they brought over the Scirroco already? 

VW marketing is about Darth Vader and Crashing cars...scraping the bottom of the barrel if you ask me. If your product is what people want it sells itself...get a clue VW-NA!!!:banghead:


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## R11S (Mar 11, 2006)

While attending our Daughter's Math Competition in Auburn Hills MI, I stopped in for a quick visit at the VW of North America Headquarters yesterday. 

They have a large building and parking lot. They seem to be doing well since the parking lot was mostly full. There's also a substantial scetion in front where only VW/Audi cars are allowed to park. It's obviously closer to the building than the Brand X parking lot. 

I spoke to the "receptionist" - a young man wearing a Security Uniform. I informed him that I was a Passat owner and asked if it would be possible to speak to a marketing person. He said that would not be possible and refered me to the company website. He pointed to a large door off the right side of the Lobby and said there used to be some cars to look at there but they did away with it a while back. He also volunteered that he owned a GTI. 

There are two old VW Beetles parked in the Lobby. One is robins egg blue and the other is black. Both are in excellent condition. I took pics of both...there's absolutely nothing else of interest beyond these two cars. Maybe Chattanooga is the VW Place for customer excitement now? 

I was hoping the visit to VWNA would be along the lines of the AutoStadt in Wolfsburg, Germany or at least something to engage visiting VW customers...but it wasn't even close to that...mostly I was disappointed and think it's pityful that a VW owner in the building is no cause for the marketing department to do anything. 

No wonder they seem so out of touch? Or maybe they're frustrated as I am? I wonder if VW is mainly focused on the home market and China? If the Chattanooga investment doesn't do well for the foreseeable future I predict we'll get only more of the same lackluster treatment of the US Market concerning the VW Brand.


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## GTINC (Jan 28, 2005)

R11S said:


> ....I was hoping the visit to VWNA would be along the lines of the AutoStadt in Wolfsburg, Germany or at least something to engage visiting VW customers...but it wasn't even close to that...mostly I was disappointed and think it's pityful that a VW owner in the building is no cause for the marketing department to do anything.
> 
> No wonder they seem so out of touch? Or maybe they're frustrated as I am? I wonder if VW is mainly focused on the home market and China? If the Chattanooga investment doesn't do well for the foreseeable future I predict we'll get only more of the same lackluster treatment of the US Market concerning the VW Brand.


 Are you serious? You expect a walk-in to be treated in some special way? Don't you think they would need to be concerned about security and protection from industrial espionage? Do you think that the Marketing Department has anything to gain from greeting strangers in the lobby? I would hope they have better things to do.


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## Memphis R32 (Dec 13, 2004)

And PLEASE make it have some towing capacity!!! I need a vehicle to tow my race motorcycle and really hate the idea of having to purcahse a truck or SUV to tow less than 2000lbs a few times a year.


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## BsickPassat (May 10, 2010)

Memphis R32 said:


> And PLEASE make it have some towing capacity!!! I need a vehicle to tow my race motorcycle and really hate the idea of having to purcahse a truck or SUV to tow less than 2000lbs a few times a year.


The only hitches available for us are 1-1/4" AND will not fit the Alltrack....


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## VW_Hippie (May 14, 2010)

Please VW don't suck the german life out of passat alltrack like the jetta and passat is now.


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## feels_road (Jan 27, 2005)

uhrgenau said:


> Can't a modern, state of the art assembly line build a wagon as well as a sedan? I don't get it.


They did offer a wagon, and no one bought it. If they build one in the US, that could help reduce the price, sufficiently. At any rate, I think VW has more important cars to worry about, in the US: a larger-than-Tiguan CUV, and a 7-seater, for example.



CorradoMagic said:


> This was a fully functional model, not a prototype.


That's because VW brought the car over as is - as it is sold in Europe.



R11S said:


> While attending our Daughter's Math Competition in Auburn Hills MI, I stopped in for a quick visit at the VW of North America Headquarters yesterday....
> 
> I spoke to the "receptionist" - a young man wearing a Security Uniform. I informed him that I was a Passat owner and asked if it would be possible to speak to a marketing person. He said that would not be possible and refered me to the company website.
> 
> ...


Your problem is that you in fact did _not_ visit Volkswagen Group of America's headquarters. That's located in Virginia. I think it's you who is out of touch.


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## randomkoreanguy (Jul 20, 2002)

feels_road said:


> They did offer a wagon, and no one bought it. If they build one in the US, that could help reduce the price, sufficiently. At any rate, I think VW has more important cars to worry about, in the US: a larger-than-Tiguan CUV, and a 7-seater, for example.


 After a bit of reading on this whole subject, I've decided that the Alltrack wouldn't be bad as a Sportwagen successor if implemented correctly. It's closest competitors would be from Subaru in the form of the Crosstrek and the Outback. (The Crosstrek being a lifted Impreza, and the Outback being a lifted Legacy.) Offering an estimated 33 mpg via CVT, the Crosstrek doesn't offer much in the way of extra offroad goodies besides the higher ride height. Assuming this comes as a TDI and with the fancy offroad mode the Euro market Alltrack comes with, that already gives it a huge advantage in features, offroadability, and fuel economy. Moving onto the larger Outback, near as I can tell it doesn't have any kind of special offroad mode program either, but it does have skid plates standard on some trim levels. It also gets worse fuel economy than the Crosstrek at 29 mpg for the smaller 2.5i and 25 mpg for the 3.6R. 

Assuming that the North American Alltrack will be based on the current Jetta platform, that should make it bigger than the old Sportwagen, but smaller than the current NA market Passat, and pretty close in size to the Euro market Passat. Given VW's history of offering fantastic, upscale interiors, an Alltrack would (hopefully) have a much nicer interior than a same priced Subaru competitor vehicle. That, in addition to the better fuel economy and overall nicer offroad tech toys, would be enough, I think, to steal away a good percentage of potential customers who are flocking to Subaru in part because they don't really have any true alternatives. 

What puzzles me is why all the other automakers are apparently sleeping while Subaru quietly runs off with all of these offroad wagon sales from right under their collective noses. Subaru has had very poor sales with its full blown SUV, but its offroad wagon keeps increasing its sales numbers year over year and somehow none of the other manufacturers have figured out the pattern therein.


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## feels_road (Jan 27, 2005)

randomkoreanguy said:


> What puzzles me is why all the other automakers are apparently sleeping while Subaru quietly runs off with all of these offroad wagon sales from right under their collective noses.


 Those sales aren't all that great, actually, when compared to the big ones. Subaru sold 26,310 vehicles in April, versus 37,525 for VW. The past two years Subaru and VW were head-to-head, most of the time. VW's gains are completely outside the AWD market. Also, on the flip side, Ford sold 180,350 in the same period. 

Of course, outside the US -- world-wide and unlike Subaru -- VW Group is a big player in the top three, destined to become number one, shortly.


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## VW_Hippie (May 14, 2010)

Through some VW connections I'm hearing JSW alltrack is being considered for next gen, has anyone else heard the same?


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## randomkoreanguy (Jul 20, 2002)

VW_Hippie said:


> Through some VW connections I'm hearing JSW alltrack is being considered for next gen, has anyone else heard the same?


I'm guessing that bringing the "concept" to New York (and by concept, I mean the European spec Passat Alltrack) is pretty much a public admission on VWoA's part that they're considering it pretty heavily. Audi's already done it by replacing the A4 Avant with the A4 Allroad in our market, and Subaru did the same thing much earlier with their Legacy wagon and the Outback. Killing off wagon variants in favor of lifted offroad wagons seems to be working for everyone else. Since Audi won't offer a TDI on the A4 Allroad and the Outback only offers gasoline boxer engines, a TDI JSW Alltrack would be a really nice alternative.


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## rev18gti (Sep 15, 2002)

I have been thinking about this car ever since I saw it posted on the front page. Coming from a GTI, I am now in the market for a larger car, and would like to stay with VW, but the Tiguan is too small and the Touareg is too much $$$. My wife leased a Passat and loved it, but does not like "station wagons" though she doesn't mind the "raised" wagon look, since it's kinda CUV-ish. I just came back from a weeklong trip in western NC/Asheville. I saw so many Subaru AWD wagons there and they all reminded me of the Alltrack. That got me thinking that if VW doesn't bring the Alltrack over, I might have to jump ship and consider a Subaru. This is coming from someone who has had VWs in the family since the mid 80s. Please VW, make it happen!


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## cwescapexlt4x4 (Jan 2, 2003)

The one really downer for me of the Outback is the CVT transmission.... :banghead:


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## definition56 (Jan 8, 2005)

rev18gti said:


> I have been thinking about this car ever since I saw it posted on the front page. Coming from a GTI, I am now in the market for a larger car, and would like to stay with VW, but the Tiguan is too small and the Touareg is too much $$$. My wife leased a Passat and loved it, but does not like "station wagons" though she doesn't mind the "raised" wagon look, since it's kinda CUV-ish. I just came back from a weeklong trip in western NC/Asheville. I saw so many Subaru AWD wagons there and they all reminded me of the Alltrack. That got me thinking that if VW doesn't bring the Alltrack over, I might have to jump ship and consider a Subaru. This is coming from someone who has had VWs in the family since the mid 80s. Please VW, make it happen!


 Sounds like we have a similar story. I just jumped ship, sold my wagon, and bought a Toyota Tundra. We wanted a Touareg for the family but when we realized how small they actually were for what they cost...it was a no go. We ended up at the auto show with our tails between our legs at the VW booth and said "screw it" we're looking at everything. Looked at the Tundra Crew Max and was super impressed with the room in the cab plus it has the utility. Ended up getting it for almost $7k under invoice which was almost $15k under the Touareg. I couldn't be happier with it. Touareg's are almost the same price as a Q7....which I'd rather have anyway. Crazy. :laugh:


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## BsickPassat (May 10, 2010)

cwescapexlt4x4 said:


> The one really downer for me of the Outback is the CVT transmission.... :banghead:


 if you get the 3.6L... you get a 5-speed auto 

or with the 2.5L motor... as long as it's the the Premium Trim, you can still get a 6MT


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## VW_Hippie (May 14, 2010)

We are looking to jump ship as well. The new jetta and the passat do not turn our crank either. We were hoping VW or Audi would come out with TDI AWD wagon built to euro spec fit and finish. VW's recent interiors make us RUN to Audi and that's until we see total price of a gas wagon with all the bogus dealer fees - I now know why they call them stealerships. Just looking at the limited product offering of VW & Audi. We've come to the conclusion that North America is an afterthought for VAG.


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## my1stvw1 (Apr 26, 2012)

*After browsing...*

...this thread, I'm in agreement with just about everything that's been said about what seems to be VAGs' hesitation when it comes to introducing Euro spec'ed models to the US. After taking my trusty '10 JSW TDI to northern Georgia this past week and experiencing it struggle on dirt and gravel inclines, I began to wonder immediately about the AWD option. I knew that VW offered at one time an AWD option. 
Now seeing this prospect of a Jetta Alltrack model, I too would like to have one in TDI fashion. But after years for the Passat wagon to return to the US and seeing it not materialize, I've begun to let my eyes wander over to the Subaru line, specifically the Outback. 

I'd like to see VW bring it over, but I'm not sure that's going to happen :banghead: . 



> cwescapexlt4x4
> 
> The one really downer for me of the Outback is the CVT transmission....


 What is it about the Sub CVT transmission, that you don't like?


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## randomkoreanguy (Jul 20, 2002)

my1stvw1 said:


> ...this thread, I'm in agreement with just about everything that's been said about what seems to be VAGs' hesitation when it comes to introducing Euro spec'ed models to the US. After taking my trusty '10 JSW TDI to northern Georgia this past week and experiencing it struggle on dirt and gravel inclines, I began to wonder immediately about the AWD option. I knew that VW offered at one time an AWD option.
> Now seeing this prospect of a Jetta Alltrack model, I too would like to have one in TDI fashion. But after years for the Passat wagon to return to the US and seeing it not materialize, I've begun to let my eyes wander over to the Subaru line, specifically the Outback.
> 
> I'd like to see VW bring it over, but I'm not sure that's going to happen :banghead: .
> ...


 I think CVT's are one of those things that take getting used to. I'm not very fond of them myself, but I've always preferred a traditional manual. I'd actually much rather have a DSG than a CVT, because it behaves more like a manual whereas a CVT feels really strange if you're not used to it. Also, I'm not entirely convinced it's all that great for performance, especially since there isn't a single serious performance car that uses one. Great for fuel economy, though. 

Also, what always keeps me away from Subarus are their interiors. After owning so many VW's, I just find their interiors to be a bit lacking. It's a bit noisy as well inside their cabins. The symmetrical all-wheel drive is, by all accounts, fantastic, and their whole engineering philosophy attracts plenty of enthusiasts, but I would really like a more refined cabin. Just my personal preference.


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## GCAutoparts (Aug 25, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> Wagons always get enthusiasts and motoring journalists excited. Funny for some of us that grew up with family wagons with woody sides and couldn't imagine every owning one back then. Anyway, VWoA is dipping their toe in the water with a concept version of the European-only Passat Alltrack to gauge reaction here on this side of the pond. So let's break this down a bit and try and make some guesses as to what VWoA is potentially up to...
> 
> *FULL STORY...*


Jamie what's the word? Are we going to get this for North America?:beer:


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