# Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Hello All:
I visited the Geneva Auto Show yesterday, and was happy to see that the Phaeton had pride of place at the show, with two models on display - a black W12 and a blueish (Coucou Grey) V6 TDI. The two vehicles appeared almost identical, save that one was a LWB and the other a SWB, but the W12 cost almost twice what the V6 did. I think this shows that Volkswagen has really done a great job of carefully observing what the customers want in the luxury car segment, and offering a very wide range of choices and customizations to cater to the different interests and desires of Phaeton purchasers.
I was also really happy to see that VW had representatives from both the Transparent Factory and from VW Individual in Wolfsburg on hand at the display, thus ensuring that customers could get expert answers to any questions. This is uncommon at auto shows - normally, once the press days are over, the expert staff go home and the booths are staffed with relatively unskilled local help. Not so for the Phaeton display.
The changes made at the mid-life refresh have been evolutionary, not revolutionary. Although considerable thought was given to the idea of redesigning the front grill and bumper cover to incorporate the VW 'family' look, in the end the decision was made to make only the most minor exterior changes - an excellent decision, in my opinion.
The new Phaeton will go on sale late this spring in the ROW (Rest of World) market.
So, here are the photos, with comments attached:
Front View
_The MY 2006 SWB grille is used for all vehicles now._








_Chrome accents on the lower grille are discreet and look great. Fully retrofittable if you wish._
















*New Headlights*
_These appear to be a bi-xenon design, with the inboard light being a turn signal._
















_Note integrated cornering lamp_








*One new wheel design*








_...with a very clever security bolt system_







>
*3D perspective on the DVD navigation system*
















*Street names displayed at high-detail zoom levels*








*A more intuitive display of radio stations within range vs. stored presets*








*New design for the three round dials *
_standard design - metal with ribs_








_another alternative dial design available from VW Individual_








*Small, thoughtful improvements and enhancements everywhere*








*Note the push-button on the left stalk to arm the "follow to stop" full authority autobrake*








*Colour palette*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

And, to answer the inevitable question: I don't know if the new nav system is retrofittable. I will have to ask next month.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Ooops, almost forgot: A tiny change to the lens used on the rear lights - it is a deeper red, sort of a cherry red now. Like every other change, it is very subtle.
*Rear Lights*


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## OEMplus.com (May 27, 2003)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Arigato Michael-san! Thank you so much for sharing this with us!








BTW - Please take a look at this photo and tell me if I'm seeing things...










_Modified by OEMpl.us at 8:08 AM 3-16-2007_


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## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Michael, did you happen to notice the tires being used on the new W12?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (OEMpl.us)*


_Quote, originally posted by *OEMpl.us* »_
BTW - Please take a look at this photo and tell me if I'm seeing things... _(question regarding wheels on the black Phaeton)_

Omaynts, I think. See this post to double-check: Phaeton Wheel Photos
Michael


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## fhq547 (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Will the new alloys they've released be able to be fitted to the heavier Phaetons? i.e the V10 and W12?


_Modified by fhq547 at 11:16 AM 3-16-2007_


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## murphybaileysam (Dec 29, 2005)

Now if VW would only open up some new stores handling just the full line of Phaetons and Touregs!!
As a matter of fact, I would consider investing in one. Just think, classic showrooms with salespeople who know how to serve luxury buyers and a service department that does the same. I know Toyota and Nissan figured that out long ago with Infiniti and Lexus, but I'm sure VW could catch up with a vehicle line as great as the Phaeton.


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## OEMplus.com (May 27, 2003)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_Omaynts, I think.

Bingo, thanks for the addt'l photograph! 
Thanks also for the little item that arrived yesterday. Great stuff!


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## uk_nick (Mar 31, 2006)

Yep, those look like Omanyts, with 275/40 19s, like Fred's Bentley wheels: I think that's what they're putting on the Edition 5 isn't it ? Gorgeous.
I can feel another Phaeton purchase coming on !


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (uk_nick)*

It is a larger than normal tire - not really sure what the advantage of it would be. Photo of the inflation sticker is below, note the new size added along the outside edge of the flap.
Michael


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## Highline (Mar 13, 2003)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
*New Headlights*
_These appear to be a bi-xenon design, with the inboard light being a turn signal._

















Evolving from this:


















_Modified by PanEuropean at 12:17 AM 2-10-2008_


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## phaeton (Nov 30, 2002)

Thanks Michael http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I was telling a Citroen fan last night, I sat in the latest C6 at the Melbourne International Motor Show, then he turns around and says he sat in the Phaeton @ Geneva I was jealous he won


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (jimay)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jimay* »_No start button on the show cars..?

Correct. Those two vehicles are built specifically for auto shows - the start button was deliberately not installed, because ignition power (fed by AC converters) is normally left on the car during the show.

_Quote, originally posted by *jimay* »_I notice the software version screen. Is there some way to call that up on my older phaeton?

Here: How to determine what version of software is in your J523.
Michael


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## Paldi (Sep 4, 2004)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

Wow, 45/44 guess I'll raise mine when I put them back on. Thanks!
[edit] That's on a W12 - so I assume a V8 will be a little less?


_Modified by Paldi at 1:22 PM 3-17-2007_


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## vwWHEELS (Feb 6, 2007)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

thanks for sharing the pictures guys http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## fhq547 (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (murphybaileysam)*


_Quote, originally posted by *murphybaileysam* »_I know Toyota and Nissan figured that out long ago with Infiniti and Lexus, but I'm sure VW could catch up with a vehicle line as great as the Phaeton.

They already have such a line. It's called Bentley. 
All they have to do is tart up the Touareg as a Bentley which will happen in due course. It's going to be called the 'Cross Continental'. Rumours are that not only will it be available with the W12 bi turbo engine but also with the V12 diesel Audi have developed. 








This will complete their range. Special showrooms for Touareg and Phaeton are irrelevant to VW beyond this. 


_Modified by fhq547 at 7:44 AM 3-17-2007_


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## murphybaileysam (Dec 29, 2005)

I still think there's a place for a higher end VW owned brand niche somewhere between an $18,000 Jetta and a $180,000 Bentley.


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## Paldi (Sep 4, 2004)

*Re: (fhq547)*


_Quote, originally posted by *fhq547* »_
They already have such a line. It's called Bentley. 
All they have to do is tart up the Touareg as a Bentley which will happen in due course. It's going to be called the 'Cross Continental'. 
_Modified by fhq547 at 7:44 AM 3-17-2007_

Maybe they will also tart up the Phaeton as a Bentley and call it the 'Flying Cross'.










_Modified by Paldi at 3:56 PM 3-17-2007_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (murphybaileysam)*


_Quote, originally posted by *murphybaileysam* »_I still think there's a place for a higher end VW owned brand niche somewhere between an $18,000 Jetta and a $180,000 Bentley.

I agree as well, and so does the marketplace outside of the USA. The Phaeton is doing well in Europe, and spectacularly well in some Asian markets. When compared to progress made by other manufacturers when they introduced a luxury car to their offerings (8 series from Audi, various luxury offerings from Asian companies), acceptance and sales are quite satisfactory after 5 years in the marketplace.
America is an exception to this, for a number of reasons. The most significant is that in America, VW has always been perceived as an 'econo-car' brand by non-VW owners. This is probably due to the spectacular success of the air cooled Beetle in the 60s and 70s, and God only knows how many 'Herbie' movies potential buyers saw when they were kids. In Europe, VW has long offered a much broader line of cars and no-one had any difficulty with the concept of VW introducing a new luxury car to their portfolio.
There are other 'unique to America' reasons why the Phaeton did not do well during the first offering in 2004 to 2006 - those include considerations such as the priority American luxury car buyers place on image and status as perceived by others (geez, Vance Packard had that pegged back in the 60s), an ineffective marketing campaign for the car, and so forth. However, we have hashed this over many times in the past - a search of the archives will save having to re-hash it again.
Michael


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## fhq547 (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (fhq547)*

I'll re ask the question since I got not response the first time: 

_Quote, originally posted by *fhq547* »_Will the new alloys they've released be able to be fitted to the heavier Phaetons? i.e the V10 and W12?


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## uberanalyst (Sep 13, 2004)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_And, to answer the inevitable question: I don't know if the new nav system is retrofittable. I will have to ask next month.

Please do!!! I'm salivating at the thought of replacing my CD-based NAV with the new DVD-based one, even if it costs $3K for the parts.
This looks to be an even bigger/better upgrade than I experienced going from a Touareg with CD Nav to a new one with DVD Nav (however this required buying a new vehicle ;-) As you may know, Touareg owners have been unable to simply replace an older CD Nav with a European DVD one -- for some reason the DVD Nav won't let you enter a destination even when loaded with a North American DVD. Hopefully this situation won't apply to the new Phaeton European DVD Nav.
I'd also be interested in learning what Bluetooth phone capabilities exist with the new Phaeton unit.
- Dave


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: (murphybaileysam)*


_Quote, originally posted by *murphybaileysam* »_I still think there's a place for a higher end VW owned brand niche somewhere between an $18,000 Jetta and a $180,000 Bentley.

Isn't this Audi?


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Before we atart replacing ourCD based Nav for DVD based NAV, if it is possble, which DVD would we order?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (dzier)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dzier* »_Before we atart replacing ourCD based Nav for DVD based NAV, if it is possble, which DVD would we order?

David, settle down, you are WAY AHEAD of things. We don't know if it is possible to retrofit DVD navigation - there are many things that need to be considered, including significant differences in the software that runs the J523, differences in CAN controller software, and possible hardware differences in the J523.
Let's not even discuss retrofit / upgrades of the navigation system until we can get the answers to these questions.
Michael


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## CyanSunday (Oct 7, 2004)

I just want the chrome trim pieces!


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## Mirage11 (Mar 25, 2005)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Thanks for the pictures Michael. What changes were made to the instrument panel? I couldn't find it.


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
David, settle down, you are WAY AHEAD of things. We don't know if it is possible to retrofit DVD navigation - there are many things that need to be considered, including significant differences in the software that runs the J523, differences in CAN controller software, and possible hardware differences in the J523.
Let's not even discuss retrofit / upgrades of the navigation system until we can get the answers to these questions.
Michael

I had indicated if this were possible. My concern was, after knowing if it were possible, to make sure there was something to use (e.g., any NAV DVD would work, or if something sspecific would work) Otherwise, the effort would be lost.


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## chrisj428 (Feb 26, 2005)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (dzier)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dzier* »_My concern was, after knowing if it were possible, to make sure there was something to use (e.g., any NAV DVD would work, or if something sspecific would work) Otherwise, the effort would be lost.

I think I see David's point...will there be NAR DVDs for the new system in the Phaeton? If the only discs that are going to work in the Phaeton's system are encoded with European data, then any retrofit of this technology to our cars in the NAR will be worthless, regardless of feasibility.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (chrisj428)*

Ah, OK, now I understand. Sorry for interpreting David's post the wrong way. I am going to take a guess (totally unfounded) that *IF* a MY 2008 generation navigation system could be fitted to a prior MY Phaeton, the cartographic media (DVD) for North America could probably be sourced from some other car line (e.g. BMW, as is the case for updated CDs for the MY 2004 to 2006 Phaetons). I really doubt that VW has gone to all the trouble of creating a unique specification for encoding DVD cartographic media just for the MY 2008 Phaeton.
In any case, we are still way, way ahead of ourselves here - first, we have to determine what component(s) would need to be replaced to retrofit such a system. If we are very lucky, the answer will be the J401 Navigation Controller (the navigation CD reader). If we are not lucky, the answer will be the J401, the J523 Front Information Display and Control Head, the J285 Instrument Cluster (because it also contains the CAN bus gateway), etc., etc.
We also need to keep in mind that there are two different versions of the J523 Front Information Display and Control Head - a NAR version and a ROW version. It is quite possible that the J523 will require a software update (if we are lucky, it will only require a software update) to cope with the new Navigation Controller. But... there is no software update available for NAR spec J523s because the car is no longer being sold in NAR. This means that if a retrofit of a new (MY 2008) navigation controller is possible, it may also be necessary to procure and install a ROW spec J523 to support it.
Like I said earlier - there are too many variables - hang on until I next get to Dresden and can get the answers. It's kind of pointless to speculate without any knowledge of how extensive the 'under-the-skin' changes on the MY 2008 car are.
Michael


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

In reality, the navigation as is really is pretty good. I just dial in a location, and point the car in right direction. You can't read the map while driving anyway. I think we are probably blowing this up too much. My previous 2 audi's had navigation, just the driver information in the center of the speedometer and tachometer like the Phaaton and voice commands. There was no map displayed anywhere. I thought it was just fine. I never use the map as it is too small to read while driving. Just the directions are really all you need. The streets displayed on the geneva show car would be hard to read while driving. I am not one to stop and then look at the map, as the directions have always been great.


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## Paldi (Sep 4, 2004)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (dzier)*

I'm a Realtor, I show houses in places I've never visited before. The navigation system makes it possible. Still, I want more! I hate having to enter letters starting at "a" when scrolling and I really want to see the destination and surrounding streets named on the map. A "where am I" button would be nice to have too...


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## murphybaileysam (Dec 29, 2005)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (Paldi)*

A "where am I" button would be nice to have too...[/QUOTE]]
All potential purchasers should have to know where they are before being allowed to drive, especially realtors!


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## W126C (Jan 27, 2005)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_It is a larger than normal tire - not really sure what the advantage of it would be. Photo of the inflation sticker is below, note the new size added along the outside edge of the flap.
Michael

Finally an answer to what the 19" tire psi. factory recommended for the W12. Good to know. I'll print this out for my tech. He keeps setting my tires to the 18" recommended psi.
Regards,
Brent


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Someone put a bug in my ear saying that the reason why the Phaeton is pretty much the same is because it will be phased out and replaced with a totally different, smaller car with a different name. Almost like a competetitor for the Toyota Avalon/Buick Lucerne. I had heard about more of a wagon type vehicle, but even those were more speculation. 
Currently, because it is made and sold overseas, I feel confident in keeping mine because parts are available. What happens after the next few years if it is repaced with a totally different car in name and price. What does that say about Phaeton parts availablility in NA?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (dzier)*

I have no idea what VW's plans are for the next generation Phaeton.
I do know that parts availability for the current generation Phaeton is not going to be a problem. Not only is there a Federal regulation in place that mandates automakers to supply parts for vehicles for a certain period of time after discontinuing the model (10 - 15 years? not sure...), there is also the past history of Volkswagen in North America to go by.
Visit any VW dealer in America, and ask for a part for a VW Fox, or a VW 411, or a VW Thing (you have probably not heard of any of these, but they were all sold in America at one time or another in the 70s and 80s), and see what the result is. Chances are, you will get the part.
Michael


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## Spectral (Dec 21, 2005)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Here's another pic:


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## 12dunlin (Jan 21, 2007)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (murphybaileysam)*

boody estate agents...


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## OEMplus.com (May 27, 2003)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_...there a Federal regulation in place that mandates automakers to supply parts for vehicles for a certain period of time after discontinuing the model (10 - 15 years? not sure...)

FWIW - It's ten years.


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## SVESSA (Jul 16, 2007)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Are the pics no longer availible? not coming up.
Scott


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## Paldi (Sep 4, 2004)

*More photos of the face lift!*

Does anyone have others?


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## PhaetonPhenomenon (Mar 23, 2007)

*Re: More photos of the face lift! (Paldi)*

looks the same to me........


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## Itzmann (Jan 16, 2006)

*Re: More photos of the face lift! (PhaetonPhenomenon)*

...still waiting for someone to sell me the bling for the front airscoop & foglights....


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## GripperDon (May 9, 2005)

Hard to improve on perfection!


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## stevieB (Jul 15, 2006)

*Re: (GripperDon)*

 DOH !!


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## thomas b. (Dec 17, 2006)

check out http://www.volkswagen.de/vwcms....html
or
http://phaeton-abholung.waschb...p.com


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (SVESSA)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SVESSA* »_Are the pics no longer availible? not coming up. 

That was a problem with the photo hosting site, I have corrected it.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Photos re-hosted.


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## SVESSA (Jul 16, 2007)

*Re: Geneva Auto Show 2007 - Detail Photos of MY 2008 Refresh (PanEuropean)*

Thanks Michael!
Scott


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## JVD (Feb 14, 2008)

is it possible to replace the frontlights with led lights into a phaeton of 2004
THX


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (JVD)*

It is possible, but it is VERY expensive - in the order of about $4,000 for the parts.
Michael


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