# petition audi to bring back a stick avant?



## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

I've read in a few places that in the height of the TDI popularity, Audi might be considering the 3.0 TDI motor for the 2011 or 2012 A4. I'd personally love to see this happen, but I'd also love to see it happen with a stick shift. The current A3 is not availabe in TDI with a stick, and the current A4 Avant is not available with a stick at all. I am a willing and ready buyer for an A4 Avant TDI with a stick shift, and I think there are others like me.
If Audi intends to federalize the 3.0 TDI for the A4 platform, then they might go the extra mile to federalize it with the manual tranmission, if the demand is there, so the time is ripe right now.
An A4 Avant TDI witha stick is a SMART CHOICE becuase: 
It reinforces the performance image of the A4 and the TDI all at once.
It doesn't cannibalize sales from the Q5 or Q7 diesel models, if offered 
It is a product that NO ONE ELSE offers, including BMW and M-B, potentially creating a niche following.

Consider that ALMOST ALL Jetta wagens sold are TDI's. Many of them are stick shift. People who may not want a wagon will buy one to get the TDI motor. People who buy wagons will want the TDI motor anyway (wagon buyers are efficiency minded people!). 
IS it possible to post up on the various Audi forums and start petition threads to get this heard? Or is a stick shift driver a dying concept?


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## bzcat (Nov 26, 2001)

*FV-QR*

If Audi is going to bring back a stick shift Avant, it will most certainly be the S4 because that engine is already calibrated for stick shift in the US for EPA and CA emission certification. 
3.0 TDI in only available with automatic in the US so mating it with a 6 speed manual in a low volume car like A4 Avant is going to bust the business case completely. I would love to see A4 Avant TDI... but I don't think it will be stick shift. You are asking Audi to combine 3 least attractive attributes for the US market (in general) into one car: station wagon + diesel + stick shift = sales disaster (!) 
It's a minor miracle that Jetta wagon TDI is available with manual... I don't see it happening with the A4.



_Modified by bzcat at 4:56 PM 2-10-2010_


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## mercury26 (Aug 20, 2004)

Current A4 2.0T is also calibrated for stick shift. You would think the S4 and A4 would be available in Avant form. Alas they are not.








I had to order a BMW wagon to get a German car with AWD and stick shift. Disappointing to say the least...


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (bzcat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bzcat* »_If Audi is going to bring back a stick shift Avant, it will most certainly be the S4 because that engine is already calibrated for stick shift in the US for EPA and CA emission certification. 
3.0 TDI in only available with automatic in the US so mating it with a 6 speed manual in a low volume car like A4 Avant is going to bust the business case completely. I would love to see A4 Avant TDI... but I don't think it will be stick shift. You are asking Audi to combine 3 least attractive attributes for the US market (in general) into one car: station wagon + diesel + stick shift = sales disaster (!) 
It's a minor miracle that Jetta wagon TDI is available with manual... I don't see it happening with the A4.
_Modified by bzcat at 4:56 PM 2-10-2010_

If Wagon+diesel+stick= sales disaster, how come VW sells every single Jetta wagon they can make that way?


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## bzcat (Nov 26, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (FractureCritical)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FractureCritical* »_
If Wagon+diesel+stick= sales disaster, how come VW sells every single Jetta wagon they can make that way?









VW sold about 18,000 Jetta wagon last year in the US. I don't know how many are TDI but I can almost assure you that the number of TDI + manual transmission is basically a rounding error when you look at the compact car market as a whole. Don't confuse shortage of supply with actual demand. 
http://media.vw.com/index.php?s=43&item=546
I'm glad you have one (I assume?) but this ain't exactly a high demand vehicle... it is a short supply vehicle. This is why I said the availability of such a beast is a minor miracle...
Audi sold even fewer A4 Avant than the Jetta wagon (it doesn't even bother to break out A4 Avant sales numbers from the rest of A4 range) and my guess is adding TDI _manual_ to the A4 range is not going to really move the needle.


_Modified by bzcat at 11:26 AM 2-11-2010_


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## [email protected] (Apr 9, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (bzcat)*

I wouldn't be surprised to see S4 Avant return after the facelift.


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## bzcat (Nov 26, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_I wouldn't be surprised to see S4 Avant return after the facelift.

You are such an optimist...















Seriously though... if S4 Avant comes back (with manual transmission), I would most definitely buy one. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## [email protected] (Apr 9, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (bzcat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bzcat* »_
You are such an optimist...















Seriously though... if S4 Avant comes back (with manual transmission), I would most definitely buy one. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

It's more a matter of timing. Audi of America chose to drop the S4 Avant because of lack of sales based on the previous model. Since then they were able to lock in more competitive pricing than originally assumed and it is expected that S4 volumes will grow considerably as a result of this pricing and the repositioning the S4 as the replacement for the A4 3.2 too. Greater volumes mean better business case and could likely see it's return. I know this is being debated currently though the outcome has not been decided.


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

I would find an S4 avant an acceptible substitute for for an A4 Avant TDI. Of course, if they only offer it with the DSG, then they can shove it


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## FractureCritical (Nov 24, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (bzcat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bzcat* »_
VW sold about 18,000 Jetta wagon last year in the US. I don't know how many are TDI but I can almost assure you that the number of TDI + manual transmission is basically a rounding error when you look at the compact car market as a whole. Don't confuse shortage of supply with actual demand. 
http://media.vw.com/index.php?s=43&item=546
I'm glad you have one (I assume?) but this ain't exactly a high demand vehicle... it is a short supply vehicle. This is why I said the availability of such a beast is a minor miracle...
Audi sold even fewer A4 Avant than the Jetta wagon (it doesn't even bother to break out A4 Avant sales numbers from the rest of A4 range) and my guess is adding TDI _manual_ to the A4 range is not going to really move the needle.

_Modified by bzcat at 11:26 AM 2-11-2010_

BMW seems to be able to find a market case for a stick 3 series wagon, but Audi does not. They'd rather turn away the customers to BMW it would seem. 
IF Audi keeps cutting choice and going to the center of the market instead keeping brand cheerleaders happy, they'll eventually end up making overpriced Camrys. Sure, it'll work for a while, it might even build sales in the short term. But when all they sell is the Camry 4 and the Camry 6, people will wonder why they're paying a premium for a generic car. And then what will Audi be? Audi will be What Buick was 10 years ago, and then no one will care what they make. Hell, I might give up and buy a Buick Regal Wagon with a stick. Hey, I think I heard Buick might be making one of those....


_Modified by FractureCritical at 5:57 PM 2-11-2010_


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## Knight2000 (Jan 5, 2010)

*Re: petition audi to bring back a stick avant? (FractureCritical)*

The reason Audi doesn't bring m/t's in most of its cars anymore is because they build what the general public is buying, and their sales of manual transmissions has been sinking like a rock.
Most of the dealers in my area are out of 2010 A4's already - only ones left are m/t's, and they just sit there collecting dust. As a former prof told me in college, "Money on the shelves collects dust, money in the bank collects interest." Don't stock what you're not going to sell.
When I sold Audi's, lots of people complained that we couldn't off this, or they didn't make that. When it came right down to it, I would ask, "When was the last time you bought a car with a manual transmission?" The answer would usually average about 4 - 6 years. "But I want one NOW!" Well, you're not going to get it because you haven't bought one in many years.
It's a stretch, but it reminds me of the bumper stickers that UAW members put on the back of their 1992 Silverado's -- "Out of a job yet? Keep buying foreign." Maybe people in the UAW are losing their jobs because they keep making $100,000 a year plus and NOT buying what they're building -- holding on to the cars and trucks for 15+ years. If you don't buy it, they can't build more, and you won't have work.
Sorry for the rant.


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