# C2 Motorsports 2.5Turbo Review



## AcidVW (Jan 2, 2005)

Hi
I just finished installing my C2 Motorsports stage 1 Kit with stage 2 software on my 2005.5 Jetta 2.5. I supplied my own FMIC which is why I bought their stage 1 kit. Only difference between stage 1 and 2 is the intercooler, boost tubes, and software.
Overall the parts they sent me where of great quality. the manifold, downpipe and turbo were top of the line. However I do have a couple issues with this company.

1. They didn't include any kind of a parts list or packing slip with my shipments. Just a big box of parts. This led to me finding out I was missing hardware, gaskets, oil line fittings and other miscellaneous bits and pieces.
When i called C2 to ask for those missing parts they really weren't kind. When I told them I was missing bolts they told me they would credit me back a few dollars and that way I could go to home depot to buy my own hardware.
I replied by stating that for the amount of money ($2700) i spent with their company I shouldn't have to worry about hardware and making trip to home depot.

2. Their kit comes with no instructions. Chris the owner of the company sent me a few pictures to use as reference. However the photos he sent were of an outdated kit that C2 no longer sells. When I would call their company to ask any kind of technical questions they were short with me, sounded like they didn't want to deal with me, and said "if you took it to a shop they'd figure it out." I"m no amateur mechanic. My brother used to own his own VW shop, is a master mechanic. He said if I took what they sent me to a shop they would've charged me over $2000 to install this kit. Since i was missing hardware I would've been tying up a lift and the labor charges would've been huge.

3.The installation was a nightmare, in order to fit the assembled turbo behind the motor you need to remove the passenger side motor mount and dog bone mount and slide the engine forward. Also tightening the copper nuts they supply to their exhaust manifold is crazy. They don't leave any room between the flare of their manifold to the nut. Without special swivels and sockets you're going to be using a wrench and tightening about 1/6 of a turn at a time. They also include 5 new 550cc injectors, However the harness to these has 2 black wires coming out of them. No idea which wire was + or -. We just happened to make an educated guess and it worked out. kept the harness pointing in the same direction as OEM.

Without a few special tools this install would've been impossible. However overall we managed to get it in the car and running. No CEL's. Good boost and holding steady at 9psi. Their stage 2 kit includes fabricated boost pipes and costs about $1000, I bought a universal FMIC kit for $200 and had to create my own intake pipe to the throttle body with a nipple for the diverter valve.

I made this as just a heads up to anyone looking to buy a turbo kit from C2 motorsports. The parts are top quality. They say it only takes 10 hours for an experienced mechanic to install this. That's a joke, plan on a long weekend. And again that's if they send you all the parts at once. I had to wait a few days each time we were missing something which happened three times. We would be working, and find out we were missing something. Get that part get a little further and then realize we were missing another piece.
It also takes this company a few weeks to assemble your kit. Nothing is waiting on a shelf. It doesn't sound like they sell a lot of these. I'm not bashing C2 by any means. I just would like to recommend that they create some sort of writeup for their own kit, and also include a complete parts checklist.

Thanks for letting me rant.


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

onto the most important part: how do you like the boost?


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## AcidVW (Jan 2, 2005)

It's a totally new car. And pulls really nicely. 


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## [email protected] (Jul 1, 2009)

Thanks for the candid feedback. As you may know, we're developing a turbo hardware kit for the 2.5L engine as well, and solid info on installation challenges is really valuable. While our kit will be wholly different from the larger one sold through C2Motorsports, we work closely with them on tuning support. And I do want to state that they have been a valuable partner in our product development. I like them a lot.

Posts like this reinforce my belief we're going to need a robust beta testing phase for our F25 turbo kit. I really suspect we'll have our own list of kinks to sort out as well.

Doug Harper
FrankenTurbo


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## AcidVW (Jan 2, 2005)

I just feel that for $3000 you shouldn't have to worry about as much as I did. The manufacturer should do thorough research and development to make their kit complete.
I just hope they take my constructive criticism and improve. The car does run amazingly!


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## quaudi (Jun 25, 2001)

AcidVW said:


> I just feel that for $3000 you shouldn't have to worry about as much as I did. The manufacturer should do thorough research and development to make their kit complete.
> I just hope they take my constructive criticism and improve. The car does run amazingly!


Could not agree with you more. Your post has given me second thoughts on the C2 kit I was about to pull the trigger on. I was assuming it would be a complete bolt on with clear and concise instructions. Obviously this is not the case and not having that much mechanical aptitude or a relative with such, I would be at a trusted independent for the install. They are rather short with their potential customers, I have called them twice about SRI and their flash. It seems as if they really don't care to sell them. Think I'll sit it out and wait for another alternative, if any.


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## AcidVW (Jan 2, 2005)

From what I've heard the SRI is only good if you run a turbo, without boost the SRI kills your lower end torque and just makes your car fun above 6k rpm, and if your car has a lot of miles I wouldn't want to keep it in those upper rpm's constantly. The SRI will make a n/a car sound a little meaner, but is that sound worth $900. I had the GIAC flash done to my car before the turbo and it added maybe 6hp and a tiny bit of torque. Best part about the flash was the better gas mileage. If I had more money I would've gone with this kit, their manifold looks amazing.

https://jdlautodesign.net/shop/vw-2-5l-turbo-kit/


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## granth (Dec 5, 2001)

I unboxed a turbo kit from 034 last week and it also did not contain a complete parts list. I wasn't shocked by this, since the kit is a custom order, small-run product. However, they definitely took the time to ensure it was complete, regardless of supporting paperwork. No written instructions is fairly standard with this level of work. I did, however, receive a few high-res photos and tips for some of the tougher steps of the install. You should have a good understanding of everything involved, or take it to a shop and pay someone else to install it. It's a big job to install any of these turbo kits, and I don't know if anyone could get it done in 10 hours, or without a few headaches. I'm planning on 3-4 days to complete mine. 

Missing hardware is understandable, to some degree, but for them to tell you to go to the hardware store is bullsh*t. I would expect them to ship any missing bolts, clamps, lines, etc. to you that same day. I'd also expect them to happily answer any installation questions for ya. Anything less is just bad customer service, no matter how much you paid for the kit. :sly:

I'm glad I went with 034; the experience with them has been top-notch. Very friendly and helpful staff, even with me asking for updates every 2 days. I've also heard really good things about the JDL kit. 

Regarding the SRI, I recommend it for both NA and boosted cars. It really made my NA car so much better. :beer:


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## vr6-kamil (Sep 14, 2008)

Good write up and great info that will be taken for the future in mind


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## AcidVW (Jan 2, 2005)

I hadn't heard of 034 motorsports before today, but if I had I probably would've gone with them. One of their kits include the SRI.


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## DerekH (Sep 4, 2010)

AcidVW said:


> From what I've heard the SRI is only good if you run a turbo, without boost the SRI kills your lower end torque and just makes your car fun above 6k rpm, and if your car has a lot of miles I wouldn't want to keep it in those upper rpm's constantly. The SRI will make a n/a car sound a little meaner, but is that sound worth $900. I had the GIAC flash done to my car before the turbo and it added maybe 6hp and a tiny bit of torque. Best part about the flash was the better gas mileage. If I had more money I would've gone with this kit, their manifold looks amazing.
> 
> https://jdlautodesign.net/shop/vw-2-5l-turbo-kit/


I'm not sure where you have gotten your info on SRI's but it is incorrect. My car has 215k km on it and i rev it out all the time with zero issues. i have had my car with a basic flash and nothing else. then with the eurojet header. then the header and apr cold air intake. then with the 2 previously mentioned plus a custom exhaust. After adding the SRI with a proper tune the car was much more responsive all around plus way more fun above 4.5k rpm.


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## RBT-Tuned (Dec 24, 2013)

AcidVW said:


> Hi
> I just finished installing my C2 Motorsports stage 1 Kit with stage 2 software on my 2005.5 Jetta 2.5. I supplied my own FMIC which is why I bought their stage 1 kit. Only difference between stage 1 and 2 is the intercooler, boost tubes, and software.
> Overall the parts they sent me where of great quality. the manifold, downpipe and turbo were top of the line. However I do have a couple issues with this company.
> 
> ...


Did you do any research before picking up the kit? There have been countless posts and reviews stating that this kit was not complete/had fitment issues and that C2M wasn't helpful during the entire process. In fact they blew out a customers engine and then refused to fix his car while they were testing their kit early in development. I received a message from him directly after responding in the thread and he told me the entire story. That is why people don't really talk much about C2M.

Since we are talking about 034 Motorsport there was also a thread on here about someone who had their car worked on by 034 Motorsport and they kept delaying the install and the customer wanted his car back. It was ridiculous because they literally had the car for an extended period of time and kept making excuses about why they didn't have it completed. It took him posting on VW Vortex before they got a clue and gave him his car back. There was quite a backlash about how they treated him as a customer. You are warned about dealing with them.


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## granth (Dec 5, 2001)

RBT-Tuned said:


> Since we are talking about 034 Motorsport there was also a thread on here about someone who had their car worked on by 034 Motorsport and they kept delaying the install and the customer wanted his car back. It was ridiculous because they literally had the car for an extended period of time and kept making excuses about why they didn't have it completed. It took him posting on VW Vortex before they got a clue and gave him his car back. There was quite a backlash about how they treated him as a customer. You are warned about dealing with them.



I can relate to this, kinda... It took 034 four weeks to assemble a turbo kit that was "ready to ship" when I paid for it. Now, to be fair, I wanted a turbo that they didn't have in stock, so that took a week to get in. Tack on another couple days for a fabricator to weld on the 90 degree elbow. Also, the ECU I sent them had a beta SRI tune on it from another company, so the tuner had to obtain stock file rips to bench flash the ECU back to stock... that took another week. Little problems can have a big impact on turn-around time. 

I'm not at all complaining about 034. I think these delays were acceptable, and communication was pretty good the whole time. It could have been a lot worse. By comparison, JDL's kits usually take 6-8 weeks to ship. This trend can be seen throughout the performance sector, especially when you're talking turbo kits. A lot of these companies are small shops, with limited fabricators, and have a lot of orders to keep up with. Keep in mind that the wonderful people at these shops have lives of their own, so a lot can come into play. Think being sick, having kids, going on vacation, etc.. For those reasons, I can understand the delays with a product like this, but there's no excuse for poor customer service or communication.


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## mjb8482 (Mar 4, 2008)

Welcome to the 2.5T club! These things are so much fun!

Sadly, I had literally the same experience with C2. Missing parts, no support, etc... 

My first install was a nightmare like yours. It actually isn't too bad once you've taken the turbo off a couple times. It actually fits through the exhaust tunnel if you get the right angle. Makes it 100X easier to get it mounted. Remember for future reference.

It looks like you have their 1st generation kit--or is that a stock picture you found?

Cheers and good luck! :beer::beer:


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## mjb8482 (Mar 4, 2008)

Another bit of advice:

the boost kept killing my EVAP purge valve, which results in a gas cap light and gas spitting back at you when you fill up :banghead:. I went through 3 in a year. I suggest installing 2 check valves. 1 in front of the purge valve, and the other in the line that goes to the charcoal canister. Or you can T them together, use 1 check valve and cap the port on the throttle body. I did this to clean things up a bit. Pretty sure boost in the gas tank is not a good thing... 

Boomba makes great billet check valves. This is what I used. :beer:


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## Gunbunny08 (Nov 13, 2008)

First off, congrats on your new 2.5T! Now I mean absolutely no offense here, and I commend you for tackling this install without having experience with this level of work on top of dealing with a lack of hardware and support. However, if you're about to install your own turbo kit, removing motor mounts shouldn't be a nightmare for you. That's a rather small step in the grand scheme of what you were already doing. I don't mean that to be rude. The exhaust manifold is actually notorious for being a bitch to bolt on, regardless of which company it's from. Just a tight space, nothing anyone can do about it. 

It's always a good idea to lay everything out and identify missing components before taking anything apart, but more so with this kind of install. It's not any company's fault that it's a challenge to turbo NA engines and most kits don't come with any instructions, but ****ty quality control and customer service is another story. I'm sure you would've had it done in a weekend if you had everything you needed before starting. Really sucks when companies force you to rely on pros or expect you to think like one and pick up the pieces for them, especially with something this expensive. Props on having no codes right off the bat though. Nice work! :beer:

I'd also like to say JDL actually only took about 3.5 weeks to make my kit, and unexpectedly it came with a detailed parts list with Ronnie's check marks all over it. I looked through everything anyway to make sure it was right. The kit doesn't include injectors, software, vacuum line/fittings, or any gaskets, but I knew exactly what I still had to get to make it all work. My god the quality of these parts is absolutely amazing! Those guys are some truly talented individuals. Ronnie also helped me out with questions many times before I bought the kit and after I received it. I have yet to actually install it, but I know the fitment will be on point. I have a mental list of everything I need to do and I know for sure I have everything I need... except time to install all of it  I'll actually be starting a build thread very soon eace:


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

Gunbunny08 said:


> First off, congrats on your new 2.5T! Now I mean absolutely no offense here, and I commend you for tackling this install without having experience with this level of work on top of dealing with a lack of hardware and support. However, if you're about to install your own turbo kit, removing motor mounts shouldn't be a nightmare for you. That's a rather small step in the grand scheme of what you were already doing. I don't mean that to be rude. The exhaust manifold is actually notorious for being a bitch to bolt on, regardless of which company it's from. Just a tight space, nothing anyone can do about it.
> 
> It's always a good idea to lay everything out and identify missing components before taking anything apart, but more so with this kind of install. It's not any company's fault that it's a challenge to turbo NA engines and most kits don't come with any instructions, but ****ty quality control and customer service is another story. I'm sure you would've had it done in a weekend if you had everything you needed before starting. Really sucks when companies force you to rely on pros or expect you to think like one and pick up the pieces for them, especially with something this expensive. Props on having no codes right off the bat though. Nice work! :beer:
> 
> I'd also like to say JDL actually only took about 3.5 weeks to make my kit, and unexpectedly it came with a detailed parts list with Ronnie's check marks all over it. I looked through everything anyway to make sure it was right. The kit doesn't include injectors, software, vacuum line/fittings, or any gaskets, but I knew exactly what I still had to get to make it all work. My god the quality of these parts is absolutely amazing! Those guys are some truly talented individuals. Ronnie also helped me out with questions many times before I bought the kit and after I received it. I have yet to actually install it, but I know the fitment will be on point. I have a mental list of everything I need to do and I know for sure I have everything I need... except time to install all of it  I'll actually be starting a build thread very soon eace:


drop the car and parts by my house, and return in "10 hours"... i'll have your kit installed.
I desperately want to install and see a JDL kit, see how it drives, and so on.. That thing is artistic!

As for the 6-8 weeks: most companies for the 2.5 dont actually stock items to to their low volume nature. For this reason food is made to order, and that means: get in line, we'll do you when your number comes up.

As a customer i believe that transparency and communication are the most important things. I dont care if my kti were to come incomplete, even after waiting 5 months for it. But when i call you to ask whats missing, i expect you to answer, be nice and help me through it. 

As for the ECU delay that was mentioned, it shouldnt be as difficult, it sounds like you were lead to believe something was more complex than what it really is


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## granth (Dec 5, 2001)

thygreyt said:


> As for the ECU delay that was mentioned, it shouldnt be as difficult, it sounds like you were lead to believe something was more complex than what it really is


Ha, I wasn't saying it was a difficult fix... I think the tuner was busy working on other projects. Something worth noting - there are ~20 revisions of the 07k ECU, and they didn't have a stock file for the "BK" box I sent them. As usual, [email protected] hooked me up. :thumbup:


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## vr6-kamil (Sep 14, 2008)

I didn't know 034 offered a turbo kit for our cars. It's not on there website, maybe it's a custom thing.


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## Gunbunny08 (Nov 13, 2008)

thygreyt said:


> drop the car and parts by my house, and return in "10 hours"... i'll have your kit installed.
> I desperately want to install and see a JDL kit, see how it drives, and so on.. That thing is artistic!


If you're in VA anytime soon, I'll let you drive it for sure dude. I'm tired of staring at this beautiful turbo kit and imagining what it'll be like. The wait is almost over! I should be installing it in about 2 weeks :beer:


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## eatrach (May 13, 2004)

That is sad to see a company not to have a proper support. Good luck on your build.


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## brian81 (Apr 19, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Thanks for the candid feedback. As you may know, we're developing a turbo hardware kit for the 2.5L engine as well, and solid info on installation challenges is really valuable. While our kit will be wholly different from the larger one sold through C2Motorsports, we work closely with them on tuning support. And I do want to state that they have been a valuable partner in our product development. I like them a lot.
> 
> Posts like this reinforce my belief we're going to need a robust beta testing phase for our F25 turbo kit. I really suspect we'll have our own list of kinks to sort out as well.
> 
> ...


I'm waiting patiently for this for my 2.5 JSW. I thought about a FT for my '98 B5 but it was time to get something new (it was bought new and only has 118k on it). I did two Callaway systems 30 years ago and am looking forward to a turbo in the 2.5.



AcidVW said:


> Overall the parts they sent me where of great quality. the manifold, downpipe and turbo were top of the line. However I do have a couple issues with this company....
> 
> 1. They didn't include any kind of a parts list or packing slip with my shipments....I replied by stating that for the amount of money ($2700) i spent with their company I shouldn't have to worry about hardware and making trip to home depot....
> 
> 2. Their kit comes with no instructions. Chris the owner of the company sent me a few pictures to use as reference. However the photos he sent were of an outdated kit that C2 no longer sells.


Thanks for the thread on your experience. Glad you got your box of parts installed and sorted. My experience has been there is one big (huge for some people) difference between a "kit" and a box of parts:


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## GoHomeBroke (Nov 15, 2014)

i've got a bastard 2.5 in a 2009 Golf.

it's basically the Mk6 engine in a Mk5 body. basically, even with the part number off of the ECU, APR doesn't offer a tune for it. 

i've been toying with the idea of turboing or supercharging it (thanks to mldouthi's lovely thread) and decided if i did i'd turbo it simply because the parts are more readily available. after reading some of the comments here, i'm at a loss of where to go. my timeline is to have it turbo'd within the next year. if C2 gives so many people so many problems, and the JDL kit is wildly expensive (almost 2 times the cost of the C2 kit), where should i turn?


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

The C2 kit is less expensive for a reason.. or multiple.
with JDL you would be buying top quality parts/ hardware.

Turbo IMO is the way to go. This is only MY opinion (and yes im turboed... and therefore biased).
Its easy, reliable and since there are a few of us around, you have a decent support network


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## mjb8482 (Mar 4, 2008)

Definitely agree on that. ^^Lots of us have a good deal of experience and are always willing to help. Knowing what I know now, I'd either go JDL or buy a turbo manifold and go custom from there. At this point, most of my setup is custom less the manifold and intake. Such a great learning experience, too!


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

imma throw some logs to the fire...

While C2 has always been quick to respond in the past, they have yet to make any comments on this thread.

Would that be used as proof of their... lack of support/ availability?


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## mk5rabbit07 (Mar 20, 2011)

i couldn't agree more. The parts are good quality from C2 but i did purchase the stage 2 kit which was the worst idea i ever had. Nothing fit just as in your case and when it came to the intercooler set up, don't even get me started. Chris was not helpful when calling them to explain the situation and while spending almost $4,000 for my kit, i also had to spend another $2,000 to get custom intercooler and intake pipes made and installed. 

Im happy to know I'm not the only person who went through this same situation. 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?7180344-my-MKV-turbo-rabbit

this is my thread of how my instal went.


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## granth (Dec 5, 2001)

mjb8482 said:


> Another bit of advice:
> 
> the boost kept killing my EVAP purge valve, which results in a gas cap light and gas spitting back at you when you fill up :banghead:. I went through 3 in a year. I suggest installing 2 check valves. 1 in front of the purge valve, and the other in the line that goes to the charcoal canister. Or you can T them together, use 1 check valve and cap the port on the throttle body. I did this to clean things up a bit. Pretty sure boost in the gas tank is not a good thing...
> 
> Boomba makes great billet check valves. This is what I used. :beer:


Regarding those check valves... What size did you use? Pics of them installed? I'm curious where these are located. Without the throttle-body connection, how does the line get vacuum?


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## mjb8482 (Mar 4, 2008)

8mm works perfectly for me. I also have a 6mm but I don't need it anymore now that I connected the two lines. I used a Y connector to connect the charcoal canister line to the purge valve line. The check valve is between that and the port on the bottom of my intake manifold. On the stock manifold, the charcoal canister port is on the passenger side so you can do the same thing and use the throttle body connection for your DV signal if you'd like. I have it all tucked under the intake manifold, but I did the best I could to get a pic of it.









Hopefully this helps! An added benefit, is it cleans things up a bit in an already busy engine bay. 










Here are the original locations with stock manifold setup. 8mm is red and 6mm is black. They didn't have 2 of the same color in stock at the time. 











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## mk6matt (Jan 26, 2013)

Where did you buy those check valves?


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## mjb8482 (Mar 4, 2008)

MAPerformance. Not sure if they still sell them. Here's the link to the boomba site. 

http://www.boombaracing.com/check-valves/


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## RBT-Tuned (Dec 24, 2013)

thygreyt said:


> imma throw some logs to the fire...
> 
> While C2 has always been quick to respond in the past, they have yet to make any comments on this thread.
> 
> Would that be used as proof of their... lack of support/ availability?


From what we have seen and read this is definitely a clear indicator. That is a major reason why we cannot recommend their products.



mk5rabbit07 said:


> i couldn't agree more. The parts are good quality from C2 but i did purchase the stage 2 kit which was the worst idea i ever had. Nothing fit just as in your case and when it came to the intercooler set up, don't even get me started. Chris was not helpful when calling them to explain the situation and while spending almost $4,000 for my kit, i also had to spend another $2,000 to get custom intercooler and intake pipes made and installed.
> 
> Im happy to know I'm not the only person who went through this same situation.
> 
> ...


This is a pretty common issue with their kit. You are definitely not alone and C2M doesn't really seem to mind neglecting support. There are different options out there and C2M is usually near the bottom.


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## Hate-Trix (Sep 30, 2011)

Not to bring up from the past. But I bought their stage 2 full kit of a friend and had it installed on a freshly built motor and we slammed it in on a weekend but we had everything.

When my buddy bought it he was missing charge pipes. And when they were sent to him they weren't flanged. Called back they sent out new flanged ones. The welds look ragged. But if they work they work. 

But the problem I had with them is when my car started leaking oil out the rear main seal. I had my local vw/Audi shop in an email frenzy with them and their solution was that the pcv hoses were hooked up wrong. (They weren't.) And they refused to answer any questions after that. 

I am running United Motorsports stage 2 tune as c2 got testy with my questions. United Motorsports has been awesome and have answered all my questions. 

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