# What the heck happened to these once top notch brands?



## 02GTI-VR6-same1 (Nov 18, 2004)

When I got into car audio in the late 80's early 90's these brands used to be cutting edge or at least were considered top quality equipment. What the heck happened to the reputation/product quality of:
Hifonics-once considered on par with with the best amps now on par with Audiobahn
Phenix Gold-Once considered competition worthy. whats with so many "entry level" products. Do they even make high end stuff still?
Precision Power-once the amp of choice in probably one of every three competition systems now while their rep might not be as bad as the above their popularity has gone way down hill. Why?
Soundstream-once considered right up there with the best now an ebay special. Hardly hear a word about this brand anymore. what happened?
Orion-for a long time you couldn't mention SPL without mentioning Orion in the same sentence. Where are the high current competition products?
Pyle-yes if your 21 you laugh but in the 80's Pyle subwoofers were reasonably reputable and popular, about what MTX is to subwoofer's now. How in the world did they sink so low (right there with Pyramid and Boss).
What ever happened to Linear Power, Boston Acoustics, audio control, Denon head units/car audio and ADS
What happened to wave guide speakers? werent these suppose to be the next best thing since slice bread? werent they paired image dynamic subs the next hot set up after the JL audio/MB quart band wagonist moved on. Where they not so great afterall?
What happened to systems that ran one amp to run a whole 10 speaker competition car system and use all passive X-overs? This set up used to be damn popular.
and lastly does audio equipment sound better today then it did 10yrs ago? stuff you'd rate a 10 in sound quality then shouldn't it still be a 10 now. Your ears havent changed


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## Zoso (Sep 19, 2000)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (02GTI-VR6-same1)*

Many companies have been bought out and are part of a large audio company. In an attempt to get into more sales volume many brands have cheapened their lines or added new entry level lines too.
A good amp should not degrade over time. There are no moving parts, but caps and what not do break down over time.
I think many amps haven't gotten better in quality, just mcuh more efficient and much smaller.


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (02GTI-VR6-same1)*

hifonics = fired their engineers and made an poor product for many years. maxxsonic bought them out a few years ago, and hired back some of the original amp engineers, from what i've heard, and they are back on track to being great amps. their XX series are some sick amps








phoenix gold = i'm not totally sure. they are still good, just not excellent like previous days. their xenon amps are made by the same company that makes JL amps.
PPI = bought out by DEI, who turned many great companies into good and ok companies.
pyle = sorry, WAY before my time.
LP = still high end, just not very common anymore.
Boston = still high end. check out their Z line of components.
Audio Control = still one of the best, if not the best, processing company around.
Denon = really damned hard to get if you want their high end stuff. you need over a grand for one of their HU's.
A/D/S = bought out by DEI, same thing that happened to PPI and Orion.
not sure what to tell you about wave guides. ID still makes HLCD's. USD has some as well. from what i understand, they are awesome, if you know what you are doing with them.
nowadays we tend to use multiple amps/channels along with active x-overs, since active is much easier to adjust the freq points and slopes. plus i can have one setting for SQ listening, one for SPL testing, one for daily driving, and another for parking lot show offs.
has SQ changed? nope. good speakers back then are still good speakers. good clean amps are still good clean amps. i was actually looking to pick up a set of older PG MS series amps for an SQ setup. the biggest difference with todays equipment, IMO, is subs. back then you didn't have the monster subs like the brahma, XXX, w7, IDMAX, etc, which are capable of extremely long linear movement with low distortion. a single 10 capable of accurately playing below 20 hz, with plenty of volume


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## PyroPopTrt (Oct 10, 1999)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (2.ohh)*

Linear Power closed their doors the latter part of 2004. 
Directed Electronics (DEI) bought out PPI, Orion, A/D/S/
Denon is still around, very expensive unless you were able to grab one of the rebadged as Rockford Fosggate (8240 & 8250 if I remember correctly) headunits.


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (PyroPopTrt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PyroPopTrt* »_Linear Power closed their doors the latter part of 2004. 



they did finally close down?







i heard rumors earlier in the year, but i hadn't heard a final verdict on it. that sucks


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## Aquaholic (Apr 16, 2003)

Sound Stream: Had such a great product when they were hand made in the USA, but they sold their design and started producing in china or japan...huge quality control issues.


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## Jason_Reuben (Jan 15, 2005)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (02GTI-VR6-same1)*

Well i have a friend that works for Phenix gold. They make extremly good high end stuff but most places dont carry it because of cost. A comp quality amp from them will break a lawers wallet. Plus to top it off how many people realy buy the high end stuff. If you are a small company like PG and want to stay alive you need to sell stuff. One comp amp a week will not pay the bills.


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## mtltdi (Apr 10, 2003)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (Jason_Reuben)*

I have an old a/d/s/ amp, I love it!
I'm looking for a nice vintage amp to run a new sub idea that I have floating around. Possibly an old soundstream reference, or a PPI.


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## Aquaholic (Apr 16, 2003)

I love my Soundstream Reference 405...but I might be willing to part with it.
I just had it cleaned up and re-soldered, but I haven't re-installed it yet.


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## Lewie94Passat (Jul 26, 2004)

Hifonics is still around, they now belong to a company by the name of maxxsonics. They still have top notch hardware. Infact i just purchased a couple of their 12" Goliath subs. Here's the link to their website.
http://www.maxxsonics.com/hifonics/


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## Non_Affiliated (Feb 12, 2002)

*Re: (Lewie94Passat)*

I'll tell you what happened with alot of these companies. Everyone wanting it cheaper. There is nothing wrong with that but there is a dividing line between quality and cheap.
When you want it cheap and lots of power, most often then not it's gonna lose out on quality. If you wnat lots of power and quality, your gonna lose cheap.
The old addage in the electronics world "You don't get some something for nothing"


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## VWsEatRice (Jan 13, 2004)

*Re: (Non_Affiliated)*

I have been running a Soundstream MC300 for around 8 years with only shutting it down after running it hard for extended periods on hot sunny days
My friend had the big brother MC500 for around 5 years he got well used before it 1 channel kept popping fuses


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## Mex gti (Sep 18, 2001)

*Re: (VWsEatRice)*

I still run 3 Rockford Fosgate oldschool amps, a pair of 200 DSM and one 4080 DSM 4 channel, and a Coustic XM 3 xover http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Dub20thae#1763 (Oct 7, 2003)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (02GTI-VR6-same1)*

ADS was sweet man... haha I wanted to buy one of their amps before i could even drive...haha


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## jedimindcontrol (Apr 7, 2003)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (Dub20thae#1763)*

Don't forget about Sony. Their ES line in the early 90's was awesome. I remember when I got my 910 HU, CDX-91 changer and the 210 digital eq/processor it totally blew me away when combined with my old PPI Art Series amps and Boston Pros Series speakers. And of course they had that insanely expensive setup I forget the name of.
Of course now Sony is bordering on complete crap.


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## 02GTI-VR6-same1 (Nov 18, 2004)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (jedimindcontrol)*

I didn't want to go here but damn it I had to pull out my old dusty trusty circa 91' Hifonics Volcan 2 channel amplifier. stiffly regulated power supply 50x2 watts rms 4ohms, 90x2 watts rms 2ohms, 180x1 bridged 4ohms. I asked about sound quality then and now because I swear maybe my ears decieve me but when I substitute if to run components instead of my 02' MTX thunder and 02' JBL Power series it just sounds better. Might not sound better or more accurate to anybody elses ears but to mine the two newer amps sound a tad hard and cold in comparison. The replacement to this model a year or two later was the LAST quality hifonics amp I can remember.
























This amp was used from 91' til 01' daily and has seen about 10 different subs and headunits. Never even a hiccup. Its last mission was a JL Audio stealth box for a 2nd gen eclipse/talon powering one JL 10W4 (yes they made a 10W4 way back when). It outlasted the sub by far (dust cap blew off, hole formed in the foam surround after about 3yrs of use).
Oh yeah what happened to Carver amplifiers. Cant remember what technology they used bit it was different from everybody else. They were a but bulky but they were considered quality.
One last Question, does Audiomobile speakers (EVO and MASS) still exist? If not shame that is cause they were so good for their price.



_Modified by 02GTI-VR6-same1 at 12:32 PM 2-22-2005_


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (jedimindcontrol)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jedimindcontrol* »_Don't forget about Sony.

Of course now Sony is bordering on complete crap.


check out their new select brand. i'm still trying to get more info about it, like where it's manufactured, but they've got a few units with 24 bit burr brown DAC's in them


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## mpetro (Aug 15, 2004)

I remember when they used to have sound competitions with brackets like: 0-100, 101-250, 251-500 etc. A lot of guys would hand make thier own crossovers and use 20 spealers at 1 ohm or something like that. It made it harder to compete and people had to use the right combo of speakers, amps, gain, etc.
Those where the old days. Is that still done, I have not been to a comp in years.
Matt


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (mpetro)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mpetro* »_I remember when they used to have sound competitions with brackets like: 0-100, 101-250, 251-500 etc. A lot of guys would hand make thier own crossovers and use 20 spealers at 1 ohm or something like that. It made it harder to compete and people had to use the right combo of speakers, amps, gain, etc.
Those where the old days. Is that still done, I have not been to a comp in years.
Matt


not really, since there isn't as many brackets. 1-600 watts and 601+ is pretty standard. 600 watts could be achieved with a couple amps and active x-overs.


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## jeff piwonka (Sep 1, 2003)

*Re: (2.ohh)*

i have a soundstream picasso800 on my highs and a PG ms2125 for my sub.
i don't know if the soundstream would still be considered one of their quality amps, but it sounds pretty good.
the PG amp has a huge burn in the top of the paint where someone melted the inputs and the cable burned on top of the amp








it was sent to PG to be fixed and now its making my diamond M5 pound real nice








my crazy brother runs an ms2250 on his 5.25" front spekers









so who are the quality amp builders these days????


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (jeff piwonka)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jeff piwonka* »_ 
so who are the quality amp builders these days????

the best companies? brax/helix, sinfoni, genesis, zapco, US amps (possibly going overseas since their buyout







). there are other great companies as well.


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## jedimindcontrol (Apr 7, 2003)

*Re: (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_
the best companies? brax/helix, sinfoni, genesis, zapco, US amps (possibly going overseas since their buyout







). there are other great companies as well.

Damn, I never even heard of brax, helix, sinfoni or genesis. I used to know almost everything about car audio and now I am sooooo out of the loop since I am in the home audio industry now.


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## Galvatron (Jan 10, 2003)

*Re: (jedimindcontrol)*

Does anyone remember M&M Godfather subwoofers?


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (Galvatron)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Galvatron* »_Does anyone remember M&M Godfather subwoofers?


i don't remember them (too young), but i've heard of them. anyone remember velodyne servo driven subs?


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## LSinLV (Nov 25, 2001)

*Re: (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_

i don't remember them (too young), but i've heard of them. anyone remember velodyne servo driven subs?









I have one in my home theater!! VA12-10 it rocks!!!
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Larry


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## red98j3glx (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (02GTI-VR6-same1)*

I'll add:
PPI and Orion were bought by ADS Technologies, mismanaged and sold with A/D/S/ to Directed.
Soundstream had bankruptcy issues.
Pyle didn't get better when the rest of the industry did.
MTX still makes some good stuff and some cheap stuff as well.
As far as how stuff sounds now vs 10 years ago, I'd say it's much better, mainly because speaker quality has improved so dramatically.
As a side note, JL Audio makes their own amplifiers, and I don't believe they make anyone elses, i.e. PG.


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## JMPRUN (Feb 23, 2005)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (red98j3glx)*


_Quote, originally posted by *red98j3glx* »_I'll add:
PPI and Orion were bought by ADS Technologies, mismanaged and sold with A/D/S/ to Directed.


You don't know the half of it


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (red98j3glx)*


_Quote, originally posted by *red98j3glx* »_As a side note, JL Audio makes their own amplifiers, and I don't believe they make anyone elses, i.e. PG. 


JL does not make their own amps. never have, never will. both series of amps where designed by Bruce McMillan at JL's facility in AZ. the amps are made in either china or korea, and it's labeled on their boxes.
here's a link to one of the build houses:
http://www.fydco.com/sams/index.htm
the original 500/1's had a tolerance problem with a resistor that manifested itself in cold weather. oddly enough PG's xenon amps had a very similar problem (along with burning up).
course it doesn't really matter where they are assembled, if it's a solid design and they have good QC. but i'm not happy that JL has started manufacturing subs overseas now, too


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## midnightbluegli (Apr 5, 2004)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (2.ohh)*

im rockin a set of soundstream SPL mules cant complain


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## red98j3glx (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (JMPRUN)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JMPRUN* »_
You don't know the half of it
















I hear ya...I work for an ex-a/d/s/ and ex-PPI dealer.


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## red98j3glx (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_

JL does not make their own amps. never have, never will. both series of amps where designed by Bruce McMillan at JL's facility in AZ. the amps are made in either china or korea, and it's labeled on their boxes.
here's a link to one of the build houses:
http://www.fydco.com/sams/index.htm
the original 500/1's had a tolerance problem with a resistor that manifested itself in cold weather. oddly enough PG's xenon amps had a very similar problem (along with burning up).
course it doesn't really matter where they are assembled, if it's a solid design and they have good QC. but i'm not happy that JL has started manufacturing subs overseas now, too










I stand corrected...actually I'm sitting corrected.








Curious, did Bruce design PG's amps also or do they just share manufacturing locales?


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## JMPRUN (Feb 23, 2005)

On a side note... There is an old company getting ready to Rise from the ashes... More to be revealed


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (red98j3glx)*


_Quote, originally posted by *red98j3glx* »_
I stand corrected...actually I'm sitting corrected.








Curious, did Bruce design PG's amps also or do they just share manufacturing locales?


i don't believe bruce designed the PG's, they just share the same build house.


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (JMPRUN)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JMPRUN* »_On a side note... There is an old company getting ready to Rise from the ashes... More to be revealed


RF is already rising from the past 5-10 years. SS is still owned by power acoustik (well, their group). hifonics was bought out by maxxsonics, who owns crunch (yeah, they were great back in the day as well) and now autotek. their colossus amps are sick. PPI isn't changing anything, that i know of. PG isn't either.

who are you referring to?


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## JMPRUN (Feb 23, 2005)

*Re: (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_PPI isn't changing anything, that i know of. 

PPI & Orion have both been raped every-thing but name... They are now completely built by Chung Lamb...

_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_who are you referring to?









Can not say any thing until they Offically come out at the upcoming show... But I am very excited... Not only have the made some of the most unique drivers, which they have re-vamped and improved, they are also doing amplifiers this time


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (JMPRUN)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JMPRUN* »_
PPI & Orion have both been raped every-thing but name... They are now completely built by Chung Lamb...


i was referring to that they aren't going to change anything, anytime soon, since they have been cheapified










_Quote, originally posted by *JMPRUN* »_
Can not say any thing until they Offically come out at the upcoming show... But I am very excited... Not only have the made some of the most unique drivers, which they have re-vamped and improved, they are also doing amplifiers this time









now you got me thinking. i saw a lot of new stuff from the CES pics that looked enticing. damn you for making me think first thing in the morning


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## this_dubs4u (Nov 14, 2003)

*Re: (2.ohh)*

There are very few true "high-end" electronics around anymore; OZ Audio, Zapco, Butler Audio, Audison, Focal, Image Dynamics, Audiocontrol, Phoenix Gold, Tru Technolgy, Genesis, Helix, Braxx, Morel, Dynaudio, and Canton
The problem started with consumer demand for lower prices, add big box stores like Circuit City, Best Buy, Tweeter, etc killing profit margins for independent retailers, and the internet whores, couple that with OEM's making it harder to replace or integrate electronics, and the Autosound Industry competetion circuits inability to find common grounds with each other and constantly changing rules, and you end up with what we have today----mostly cheap junk from asia- Audiobahn, Alphasonik, Swiss Audio (all from the same crap manufacturer-Audiobahn), Pyramid, Legacy, Powerbass, Crunch, MA Audio, and the like.
Other companies make decent stuff but it is not high end, Memphis, Crossfire, MTX, Polk Audio, to name a few. Really there are very few independent audio manufacturers left, companies like DEI- bought and degraded A/D/S, PPI, Orion, Clifford, MTX- bought Xtant, Coustic, Rockford- degraded their own stuff by going into Worst Buy, also bought and degraded MB Quart, bought already degraded Lightning Audio, Kicker is now going into circuit city which will probably degrade their products to fit into circuits price categories because everytime a product goes big box it changes, I guess my point to all of this is car audio will never be the same again and before too long there will not be any true "High-end" left, just mediocre and cheap junk


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*

i'd take oz audio and phoenix gold off that high end list. above average, but not high end.
if there's a chick or some extreme sport athlete promoting an audio product, it probably sucks (read anaba group, owners of audiobahn and the bunch).
rockford has made a good come back with their new lineups. their power series amps and subs are very well built and very competition worthy. more on the spl side, but still high end. same with memphis. their mojo equipment has won a ton of spl comps, which a product has to be very well built to handle that abuse. even before that the LVS subs won a few world records. i just wish they'd bring over the big amps that spl dynamics has (i'm guessing they are a sister company of memphis).


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## this_dubs4u (Nov 14, 2003)

*Re: (2.ohh)*

Oz Matrix is still high end, and I would still consider the Phoenix Gold Titanium amps high quality, sorry but just because Memphis and Rockford have done a lot for SPL doesn't mean they are high end, you can take crappy equipment and build the right enclosure and still hit a high spl # for a 1 or 2 second burp, not saying that the 2 aforementioned are crap just that they are not high end


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *this_dubs4u* »_Oz Matrix is still high end, and I would still consider the Phoenix Gold Titanium amps high quality, sorry but just because Memphis and Rockford have done a lot for SPL doesn't mean they are high end, you can take crappy equipment and build the right enclosure and still hit a high spl # for a 1 or 2 second burp, not saying that the 2 aforementioned are crap just that they are not high end


titanium amps are nothing like what they had back in the day. xenon is a joke, imo. 
so amps that are VERY overbuilt and put out well over their rated power are not high end? if something can take the abuse of serious spl comps, i cosider it high end. most SQ equipment isn't pushed half as hard, so you don't really know it's limits.
lower end equipment can be used for spl comps, but they have a much higher fail rate. i'd also add DD to the list of high end companies.
the oz audio components left me disappointed. good, but nothing compared to the other high end brands you mentioned (i'd put PG in that list of components, but they didn't make their high end comps). the oz matrix elite subs are very good, but nothing compared to w6/w7, brahma, xxx, and idmax. oz did have the delta amp, but i don't think they still make it.


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## this_dubs4u (Nov 14, 2003)

*Re: (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_
the oz audio components left me disappointed. good, but nothing compared to the other high end brands you mentioned (i'd put PG in that list of components, but they didn't make their high end comps). the oz matrix elite subs are very good, but nothing compared to w6/w7, brahma, xxx, and idmax. oz did have the delta amp, but i don't think they still make it.

 funny, OZ is the ONLY speaker company to have a car compete at IASCA world finals and get a perfect SQ score, and 95% of the comparison tests that have been done on all their speakers they have come out on top including W7 (which costs twice as much as Matrix), even when the installer challenge used their speakers a couple of years ago, both of the vehicles got the highest SPL and Sound Quality scores of any other cars that had been done since the installer challenge was created, the delta amps are supposed to be back this year, they were shown at CES this year, as for Rockford they have never been the same since they sold out to worst buy and wayne harris left, and memphis will always be mid grade to me, Fultron with a new name and updated technology from a company that started out making hairbrushes and motorcycle helmets, they offer very good service to it's dealers which is a plus


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *this_dubs4u* »_ funny, OZ is the ONLY speaker company to have a car compete at IASCA world finals and get a perfect SQ score, and 95% of the comparison tests that have been done on all their speakers they have come out on top including W7 (which costs twice as much as Matrix), even when the installer challenge used their speakers a couple of years ago, both of the vehicles got the highest SPL and Sound Quality scores of any other cars that had been done since the installer challenge was created, the delta amps are supposed to be back this year, they were shown at CES this year, as for Rockford they have never been the same since they sold out to worst buy and wayne harris left, and memphis will always be mid grade to me, Fultron with a new name and updated technology from a company that started out making hairbrushes and motorcycle helmets, they offer very good service to it's dealers which is a plus


like i said, the oz components left ME disappointed. i've only heard one set in a competition vehicle, the other 3 where just regular people that had their system installed at various shops. i'll take morel, canton, focal, dls, and a few others over them.
SQ judging has soooo much to do with the install and tuning. hell, even vehicles with sony speakers have placed at major comps.
the installers challenge is a joke to me. yeah it's good publicity and good for the crowd, but take the time to pick apart those vehicles and you'd be suprised what you'd find. saturn of daytona had to send back one of the cars used in last years SBN's installer challenge since under the skin it was a hack job.
got links to all those comparison tests? i can't say i've seen many reviews of them. i'll keep my brahma with it's xbl2 over a matrix








have you taken apart one of the new power amps from RF? used one at all?
sounds like you are a little biased against memphis. i guess all the world finals wins aren't good enough


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*

ah, just clicked the link in your sig. sponsored by oz, that explains a lot. when are you going to step up to the digital age of EQ and x-overs?


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## this_dubs4u (Nov 14, 2003)

*Re: (2.ohh)*

am not biased towards memphis at all, I think they make decent stuff, once again just not "high-end", I also said they offer great support for their dealers, as for my processors I will move to the digital ones when Audiocontrol gives them to me. Don't see that happening anytime soon, cause they are very cheap with their give-aways. I bought them at a discount and have recycled them from my last install. I am old school and like using the knobs anyway







The only other digital setup I would use would be either of the Alpine pieces the 700 or the F1, but then I would have to change out the headunit, dvd changer, etc Even though I am sponsored by OZ I still like other brands as mentioned before. I have been in the car audio industry for 19 years so I have seen a lot of stuff change. I still have a lot of the "good ole stuff" too. Still have 2 sets of protoype horns, have a Dynaudio 3 way set, some Soundstream MC amps, and PPI DEQ 230s, just to name a few "artifacts"


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *this_dubs4u* »_am not biased towards memphis at all, I think they make decent stuff, once again just not "high-end", I also said they offer great support for their dealers, as for my processors I will move to the digital ones when Audiocontrol gives them to me. Don't see that happening anytime soon, cause they are very cheap with their give-aways. I bought them at a discount and have recycled them from my last install. I am old school and like using the knobs anyway







The only other digital setup I would use would be either of the Alpine pieces the 700 or the F1, but then I would have to change out the headunit, dvd changer, etc Even though I am sponsored by OZ I still like other brands as mentioned before. I have been in the car audio industry for 19 years so I have seen a lot of stuff change. I still have a lot of the "good ole stuff" too. Still have 2 sets of protoype horns, have a Dynaudio 3 way set, some Soundstream MC amps, and PPI DEQ 230s, just to name a few "artifacts"


i heard audio control was pretty stingy. i've been trying to get info from as many sponsored competitors as far as what companies are willing to do for you, and their support, especially at the major shows. i'm looking heavily into image dynamics for when i get ready to build a sponsored vehicle. i'm hoping to have something for the '06 season.
the EQT's are great pieces. i'm still kicking myself in the ass for getting rid of my PG EQ232







you wouldn't happen to have, or know someone, that has an old beat up 30 band EQ that is willing to part with it for a good price? i've got a buddy that's on a tight budget, but really wants one.
i've got the PXA-H701 coming in this week







awesome unit. i almost picked up the F1 processor, but couldn't come up with the funds for it







i'll be running the H701 from the D300, so it'll be untilizing an optical cable for pure sound







my only complaint with the H701 is that it's such an old Ai-net interface that it's extra input can't be used for anything except a cd/dvd changer







that means no XM or ipod adapter, unless i shell out $100 (dealer cost) on the Ai-net splitter. and the alpine rep had no idea if they were going to have a software upgrade for that Ai-net protocol on the H701.


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## this_dubs4u (Nov 14, 2003)

*Re: (2.ohh)*

what about the old AI net plug that has the RCA's on it? or you could always run a KCA-801B in line on the AI Net cable, as for EQs the only thing I have is an old JBL GTE 22, 22 band EQ, I want to keep my DEQs


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *this_dubs4u* »_what about the old AI net plug that has the RCA's on it? or you could always run a KCA-801B in line on the AI Net cable, as for EQs the only thing I have is an old JBL GTE 22, 22 band EQ, I want to keep my DEQs


i want full control of either an ipod or XM from the d300. i'm not so worried about the ipod, since i'm just gonna burn all my music to DVD







but i was bummed to find out that XM had issues







i'd rather get the ai splitter than the kca-801b, so i'd have that control, but i'm trying to decide if the xm is worth the hundred dollar ai splitter







course then i would have 2 sets of RCA inputs along with the ai splitter.... that kca-410c is looking a little more attractive.


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## phd-12v (Jun 13, 2001)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *this_dubs4u* »_ funny, OZ is the ONLY speaker company to have a car compete at IASCA world finals and get a perfect SQ score, and 95% of the comparison tests that have been done on all their speakers they have come out on top including W7 (which costs twice as much as Matrix), even when the installer challenge used their speakers a couple of years ago, both of the vehicles got the highest SPL and Sound Quality scores of any other cars that had been done since the installer challenge was created
that car scored a perfect rta, not a perfect score in SQ---and i disagree with the sq of the vehicle in the installer challenge---you obviously didnt hear about the recent SEMA one


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## 02GTI-VR6-same1 (Nov 18, 2004)

*Re: (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_

titanium amps are nothing like what they had back in the day. xenon is a joke, imo. 


titanium amps are and were high quality amps built in america to the same standards they always were until the day they discontinued them sometime in 2003/2004 and start selling Xexon and octane crap. They never improved them any, just changed the model numbers and changed the chasis color (ex old 475ti same as ti500.4 same chasis, same amp, different chasis finish) but up til the last one they used only 1% and high temp capacitors and high quality circuit boards ect.
same goes for their titanim components. They are rebadged Morel components with the same exact shallow mount midbass with 3" voicecoil (tweeter may be different. x-over is definately different). For some reason they chose not to discontinue the titanium components ( I guess since they dont make them) but have dropped the titanium amps with no suitable replacement. All they have now is one mega dollar Elite Titanium 250x4 amp which if they can afford to keep that on the market I dont see why not affordable titanium amps. For the most part though they've dropped about 90% of their titanium line in favor of garbage badged as Xexon and octane. Hell the octane is okay, they dont pretend to be anything but mass market equipment but they should be ashamed of themselves passing off Xexon products as quality Phoenix Gold gear.
Thru buying and researching products to buy over the last few months its so appearent mainstream car audio has gone straight to hell in the name of either high volume sales and cheap chinese production. Rockford Fosgate (although like you said the newest power line of amps are nothing to sneeze at), Phoenix Gold, ADS, Orion, Precision Power, Soundstream, Hifonics, Autotek ect have all gone to hell to the point where name recognition has actually become a negative instead of positive. Who would have thought that one day MTX would be building amps with higher quality internal components and build quality then ALL the above's main line of amplifiers. Its true!
For the record I did end up buying a pheonix gold amp for my system: Titanium 500.4 circa 2003. Probably buy one more while the stock is still available.


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## this_dubs4u (Nov 14, 2003)

*Re: (02GTI-VR6-same1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *02GTI-VR6-same1* »_
Who would have thought that one day MTX would be building amps with higher quality internal components and build quality then ALL the above's main line of amplifiers. Its true!

 That's because they are one of the few companies left who still make their amps in the USA


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (02GTI-VR6-same1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *02GTI-VR6-same1* »_
titanium amps are and were high quality amps built in america


i was actually referring to the much older amps, like the MS series and their limited edition amps. the titanium amps where/are good amps, and i'd certainly recomend them to anyone, but i don't consider them high end.


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *this_dubs4u* »_ That's because they are one of the few companies left who still make their amps in the USA


RF power amps are made in the US


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## Non_Affiliated (Feb 12, 2002)

*Re: (Galvatron)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Galvatron* »_Does anyone remember M&M Godfather subwoofers?

I remeber when they were the shizzle, remember when Pyle was a reputable brand.


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## Non_Affiliated (Feb 12, 2002)

*Re: (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_
the EQT's are great pieces. i'm still kicking myself in the ass for getting rid of my PG EQ232







you wouldn't happen to have, or know someone, that has an old beat up 30 band EQ that is willing to part with it for a good price? i've got a buddy that's on a tight budget, but really wants one.


Why not run a Behringer ULTRA-CURVE PRO DSP8024 and mod it for a 12V enviornment?
Just like they used to do with the Rane 1/3 Oct 31 Band Mono EQ.


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## Charles R (Oct 26, 2001)

*Re: What the heck happened to these once top notch brands? (02GTI-VR6-same1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *02GTI-VR6-same1* »_

















_Modified by 02GTI-VR6-same1 at 12:32 PM 2-22-2005_

Ooh, the old series7 stuff! I still have an Odin and the Triton EQ in a system for my old '77 Civic. I still regret selling my Zues, and passing up an early Colossus.


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (Non_Affiliated)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Non_Affiliated* »_
Why not run a Behringer ULTRA-CURVE PRO DSP8024 and mod it for a 12V enviornment?
Just like they used to do with the Rane 1/3 Oct 31 Band Mono EQ.


that's still a bit out of my buddy's limit. i know robM on carsound can take care of all the mod issues, but originally my buddy was wanting to spend $75 on a 30 band EQ







i started laughing my ass off







i told him maybe he'd get lucky and find a working 30 band EQ that's been beat to death on e-bay for around $100.


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## .the cap'n. (Jan 29, 2005)

*Re: (2.ohh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2.ohh* »_

RF power amps are made in the US









Actually every RF amplifier and subwoofer is made in the USA.
Amps in Tempe, AZ, and subs in Grand Rapids, MI.


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## this_dubs4u (Nov 14, 2003)

*Re: (.the cap'n.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *.the cap’n.* »_
Actually every RF amplifier and subwoofer is made in the USA.
Amps in Tempe, AZ, and subs in Grand Rapids, MI.
 hmm that's funny cause on master cartons of the entry level stuff is clearly says "Made in China"


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## 2.ohh (Jun 21, 2002)

*Re: (this_dubs4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *this_dubs4u* »_ hmm that's funny cause on master cartons of the entry level stuff is clearly says "Made in China" 


you are correct. only the higher lines are made in the US. everything else is china.


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