# Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

I'm looking at replacing front & rear brake pads on my wifes daily driver - 99 Passat Wagon 1.8T. We are looking for a step up in performance from OEM with less brake dust, emphasis on less brake dust.
Any feedback and opinions regarding the above listed brakes would be appreciated. Also your favorite sources for purchasing the above listed brakes. The Hawk ceramics can be purchased from several sources but the suppliers for the Porterfields and Carbotechs seem very limited.
Sources for Porterfield other than the manufacturer that I have found are http://www.myroadster.net and http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com
For the Carbotech Bobcats I found http://www.pure-motorsport.com
Thanks - Mark


----------



## osbornsm (May 7, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

As i recall... the Hawk HPS are not very dusty, and are a good all around pad.
The Portefield R4-S will profide the best stopping power, and they dust less than our crazy R32 pads... but not sure how they compare to your setup








Even Larry at Carbotech said to get the Porterfields instead of the Bobcat Pad. 
So what else you wanna know ?


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (osbornsm)*

I was leaning towards the Porterfield R4-S until I saw a few posts in this sections archives regarding members R4-S pads delaminating and the poor customer service response they received from Porterfield.
I'm curious to find out if other members have had this type of problem with their R4-S pads recently. I would hate to shell out $119 fronts and $69 rears only to have them delaminate after a few months of use.


----------



## Tjax (Feb 20, 2003)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

Running the Bobcats and I'll be getting another set when these are done. They brake real nice. Very first application is a bit soft but they work great after that. Absolutley quiet. Good solid pedal feel. Great bite. And the best part... no noticeable dust. I mean none. I posted a pic a while back of my wheels after 2 months. You could barely see a trace of dust. I can't explain it, but I know it's true. 
I love these pads. Just using them on the street though, can't comment on track use.


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (Tjax)*

Hi Tjax,
The zero brake dust sounds great along with the positive performance. How long have you been driving on the Bobcats? Have you given them a good workout yet to see how they holdup when heated?
Where did you purchase them?
Thanks - Mark


----------



## bmxp (Aug 10, 2003)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (Tjax)*

I have porterfield R4-S on my car....but....I got a different set up. Running hte 11.3" wilwood brake kit from RPI. 
But my opinion is that they have little to no dust, and they have bite slightly better than OEM and don't fade. I'm sure it's fine for a daily driver. But I think there are better pads out there.
Compairing them to the Wilwood pads I used to have, these are weak. Only reason why I switched was the dusting problem. WHen I had the wilwood pads, they would cake your wheel in 1hr of driving....

Anyway...I think my next set will be Hawk pads...


----------



## Tjax (Feb 20, 2003)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brew1* »_
How long have you been driving on the Bobcats? 


Not exactly sure. Round 6mo. I believe.

_Quote, originally posted by *brew1* »_ Have you given them a good workout yet to see how they holdup when heated?


Not really. 2 speeding tickets in 1 month means no fun for me on the street!

_Quote, originally posted by *brew1* »_
Where did you purchase them?


Straight from them:
http://www.carbotecheng.com


----------



## MikekiM (Aug 21, 2001)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

I'm running the Bobcats and love them.
No dust, very good pedal feel. The very first bite isn't real firm, but the pedal feel is very linear and good. They seem to last forever. I've had them about 18 mos 30k, and they're barely half gone, including 2 track days at Buttonwillow, where they held up great.
They're quiet for the most part, you may get a very very light squeel when manuevering in or around parking lots. But otherwise they're pretty silent. MUCH better than my wife's HPS pads which squeel like pigs.
I'm very happy with them, and have previously used Mintex, EBC Green, and would definetly rank the Bobcats higher. I got mine from purems.


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (MikekiM)*

Thanks for all your feedback. 
Sounds like the Bobcats would be a worthwhile upgrade with little dust, little squealing and excellent durability when driven hard. 
Now I just wonder how they would do in below freezing temperatures.


----------



## Tjax (Feb 20, 2003)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

Yeah I say give them a try. I see you're not getting many responses about other pads, probably because this topic has been beaten to death and everybody seems to have a different opinion. I can't figure out why you don't hear about more people using Carbotech pads. I push them on here whenever I get the chance because I have been SUPER happy with them. Good luck and post back at a later time with your review of the pads!


----------



## a2gtinut (Dec 2, 1999)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (Tjax)*

my Dad (99 Passat 1.8T) has Hawk HPS and he likes them.
HPS are almost dustless.
On my 16v with big brakes i use R4S and I like them. R4S dust less than Mintex.



_Modified by a2gtinut at 3:05 PM 5-25-2005_


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (a2gtinut)*

I finally decided on and installed the Hawk HPS pads front & back along with new cross drilled and slotted rotors all around.
Much better than OEM, no squeal yet. Jury is out on the dust, haven't put enough miles on them yet.
Neuspeed supplied the pads and Phozen Motorsports supplied the rotors. Both were easy to deal with and quick to ship the parts.
Mark


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

Forgot to mention, shipped price on the Hawk HPS pads from Neuspeed.com were:
$54.09 Rears
$81.63 Fronts
Drilled & curve slotted rotors from Phozen Motorsports-Ebay were:
$159 for front & rear plus shipping.
These were relatively inexpensive rotors that have champhered holes and curved slots and a zinc oxide coating. 
I'm interested to see how well they perform for braking/wear/rust.
Mark


_Modified by brew1 at 6:33 PM 8-6-2005_


----------



## homeless (Oct 17, 2001)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

let us know how the dusting goes with those pads. i was thinking of getting those or the Carbotech Bobcats


----------



## a2gtinut (Dec 2, 1999)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (homeless)*

My Dad loves Hawk HPS with ATE rotors. They work great. 
My Dad is not some ordinary Dad. He has 99 Passat 5spd which is chipped (he wanted it) with dual A-pillar pod. No flashy rims- pure sleeper.
So, if you see a Passat with extra gauges driven by 50+ guy - it might be my Dad.
IMHO No need for x-drilled and slotted rotors. Just slotted are ok. They work great during rain.


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (homeless)*

Just reporting back on the performance of the Hawk HPS pads and the Phozen drilled & slotted rotors after a few months of driving.
Superior stopping power over the stock brakes, no squealing, very minimal brake dust. No rust on the rotors. Well worth the time and $ spent on both these products. I would purchase them again.


----------



## aaonms (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

Sounds like you are pleased w/ your set-up.
Not like it really matters @ this point (unless someone actually uses the Search and sees this), but I have Porterfield R4-S pads on my Jeep that has heavy wheels/tires (~80 lbs per wheel/tire). Big improvement in stopping distances over stock and they work well whether cold of hot. After approx 30K miles, still plenty of pad left and they seem to be easy on the rotors. Minimal dust.
Have Hawk HPS on my GTI: 38K miles on the fronts and 33K miles on the rears. So far, so good. Much less dust than OEM. Stopping-ability at or slightly better than OEM.
OEM rotors on both vehicles.


----------



## GTI-DOMINICAN-STYLE (Jan 26, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (aaonms)*

i had the carbotech xp8's which is the second pad above the bobcat. and it was the best pad i ever had in a car. awesome initial bite as well as modulation. dust was at a minimal. and the only time they made noise waz in a cold day and before they were warm. i would have them on now but their more exp than the usual buy.


----------



## f1forkvr6 (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *brew1* »_I was leaning towards the Porterfield R4-S until I saw a few posts in this sections archives regarding members R4-S pads delaminating and the poor customer service response they received from Porterfield.

I've not experienced this.
I've used the R4S compound on the street for several years - great feel/modulation, very good fade resistance, less than OE dust levels ... AND, on the street they last a long, long time. Very rotor friendly too. At brake time, I'll get these again in a heartbeat.


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (aaonms)*

So far the Hawk HPS are performing well in the freezing temps. I would have given the Carbotechs a try but just couldn't justify the extra expense for a daily driver that rarely sees aggressive driving.
The xdrilled & slotted rotors were not much more expensive than OEM and look nice with the forged mirror polished 19" Acari Racing wheels. I just wonder how well these rotors will wear compared to OEM.


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

Long term report on the Hawk HPS pads is pretty good. Very little dust, no squealing, better than average wear, good in cold weather and they are not tearing up the rotors.
The rotors are holding up better than I expected considering the price I paid for them.
Looks like I be installing the HPS pads on my Jetta TDI Wagon next month.


----------



## gfindon (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: Porterfield R4-S/Carbotech Bobcat/Hawk Ceramic Feedback & Opinions (brew1)*

Better late than never - I've been running the R4-S in the front on my 2001 VW GTI VR6. Had them since mid-2005 with NO problems with delaminating or excessive dust. I might've gotten a good pair or something, but thought I'd chime in on my experience with these awesome pads thus far. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
I should also point out this is a daily driver, no auto-x or race action of any kind, and that I'm ridiculously easy on my brakes in general. I am running Hawk HPS in the rear, all on stock calipers and discs.


_Modified by gfindon at 4:15 PM 4-7-2008_


----------



## brew1 (Apr 6, 2004)

This probably won't matter much unless you're using the search function, but the Hawk HPS that I installed a while back on my Jetta TDI wagon held up extremely well, over 50% pad left after a few years and 70,000 miles. I wish the slotted/drilled rotors would have held up as well as the pads.

I replaced the Hawk HPS pads and rotors last week with EBC Red pads and EBC slotted rotors. Awesome bite compared to the Hawk HPS pads, no noise and they do well in freezing temps. Still gently breaking them in and haven't really given them a good workout yet.

Mark


----------

