# Piston Alloys....



## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

2618 vs 4032
in an effort to keep my knock sensors happy this time i have been leaning towards 4032 so i can keep those tolerances tight and have a quiet motor (yes even at cold start i dont want to hear em lol)....who has run the 4032 alloy at higher HP levels...above 450bhp? I guess the better question is, need i worry about the alloys supposed brittleness under high stress as opposed to say a stock piston? What are the factory 1.8t pistons made out of for reference?


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-BumpIt(1233282148519)*

bump


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## DonSupreme (Apr 11, 2006)

Mahle............


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## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (DonSupreme)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DonSupreme* »_Mahle............

x2


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## haenszel (Mar 14, 2004)

*Re: (DonSupreme)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DonSupreme* »_Mahle............
You must be answering another question... in a different thread.... about something other than this.


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *haenszel* »_You must be answering another question... in a different thread.... about something other than this.


yea...i would think so as well.


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the_q_jet* »_
yea...i would think so as well.

hahahahahaahah lol . Mahle.... JK
I may have a few engineering degrees but I'm no materials engineer, so I'm no expert on alloys. But I really don't think you should be too concerned with brittle alloys, unless you are afraid to experience a lot of knock (which still no material under the sun can protect against).
Only because a material is brittle doesn't make it weak, ie high tensile steels. Strength and thermal strength seems to me to be your most important characteristics, but I design brakes not engines.


_Modified by GTijoejoe at 10:27 PM 1-30-2009_


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *GTijoejoe* »_
hahahahahaahah lol . Mahle.... JK
Q- what is your over all objective here? I'm not a materials engineer, so I'm no expert on alloys.

forged pistons that are knock sensor friendly


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## Daskoupe (Oct 9, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*

Piston arent going change the baby turbo your running








jk


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *Daskoupe* »_Piston arent going change the baby turbo your running








jk









oh....you wait sir


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## Daskoupe (Oct 9, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*

HA!its all good.I'll be 20+psi soon


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the_q_jet* »_forged pistons that are knock sensor friendly


HAHHAHA sorry, I changed my post, reread...


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *Daskoupe* »_HA!its all good.I'll be 20+psi soon


damn so you'll FINALLY catch up with me!? oh wait...that means you need to run 28psi too










_Modified by the_q_jet at 12:21 AM 1-31-2009_


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *GTijoejoe* »_
hahahahahaahah lol . Mahle.... JK
I may have a few engineering degrees but I'm no materials engineer, so I'm no expert on alloys. But I really don't think you should be too concerned with brittle alloys, unless you are afraid to experience a lot of knock (which still no material under the sun can protect against).
Only because a material is brittle doesn't make it weak, ie high tensile steels. Strength and thermal strength seems to me to be your most important characteristics, but I design brakes not engines.


my concern is just that...knock...a brittle object wont have much in the way of ductility...or maybe i'm jus being overly concerned...damn things will still be MUCH stronger than cast pistons


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## NoMoreHonduh (Apr 24, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*









Factory 1.8t/2.0tfsi pistons are made of Mahle 142 material. I tried a while ago when I had a MKV to look up what exactly the composition of "Mahle 142" is but this is all I could find:
http://www.mahle.com.br/C12570...ARSEN
you might try sending them an email, but it's probably "proprietary" or something.


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*

ok that was good....that gave me somethin to work with... from what i found out.. its about 12% silicon with a lil larger concentrations of copper and Nickel compared to their previous alloy M124...but essentiall its very close to the 4032 alloy and as such answers my question and so i will run 4032. thank you sir.


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (NoMoreHonduh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NoMoreHonduh* »_








Factory 1.8t/2.0tfsi pistons are made of Mahle 142 material. I tried a while ago when I had a MKV to look up what exactly the composition of "Mahle 142" is but this is all I could find:
http://www.mahle.com.br/C12570...ARSEN
you might try sending them an email, but it's probably "proprietary" or something.









Since Mahle is an OEM supplier all across the board, you most likely won't find propriatory data composition of their pistons. 
$.02


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## Daskoupe (Oct 9, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the_q_jet* »_
damn so you'll FINALLY catch up with me!? oh wait...that means you need to run 28psi too









_Modified by the_q_jet at 12:21 AM 1-31-2009_

Hey bro i got a to4e,not no mitus junk


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *GTijoejoe* »_







Since Mahle is an OEM supplier all across the board, you most likely won't find propriatory data composition of their pistons. 
$.02

well i see your .02 cents and raise you five cuz i found it jus fine


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## the_q_jet (Mar 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *Daskoupe* »_
Hey bro i got a to4e,not no mitus junk










lol...yee of little understanding







its ok...let me know how shiny my license plate is


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## GTijoejoe (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the_q_jet* »_well i see your .02 cents and raise you five cuz i found it jus fine
















I call, I call


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## Daskoupe (Oct 9, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (the_q_jet)*


_Quote, originally posted by *the_q_jet* »_
lol...yee of little understanding







its ok...let me know how shiny my license plate is









you better ditch that heavy mkIv if we are talking any kind of racing








its all good,at least were not driven vr's


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## kevhayward (Mar 13, 2007)

Been running 4032 Wossner pistons for over 2 years with no problems.
They do not trigger the knock sensors, so I don't know what you're worrying about.


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## Turbo_Pumpkin (Feb 22, 2002)

*Re: (kevhayward)*

I don't under stand why you are getting pistons to withstand knock... get real management and tune so you don't have knock...








While you are at it, maybe you could get a real motor too!


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## haenszel (Mar 14, 2004)

*Re: (Turbo_Pumpkin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Turbo_Pumpkin* »_I don't under stand why you are getting pistons to withstand knock... get real management and tune so you don't have knock...








While you are at it, maybe you could get a real motor too!









The zing's are mighty in this thread.


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## Turbo_Pumpkin (Feb 22, 2002)

*Re: (haenszel)*


_Quote, originally posted by *haenszel* »_
The zing's are mighty in this thread.

I had too... sorry Q...


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## DonSupreme (Apr 11, 2006)

*Re: (haenszel)*


_Quote, originally posted by *haenszel* »_You must be answering another question... in a different thread.... about something other than this.

huh?


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## Turbo_Pumpkin (Feb 22, 2002)

*Re: (DonSupreme)*


_Quote, originally posted by *DonSupreme* »_
huh?

Q was asking what material the pistons should be made of. You told him a brand... 


_Modified by Turbo_Pumpkin at 1:24 PM 2-2-2009_


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## toy_vw (Feb 11, 2006)

do you mean knock or piston slap...
I find my engine to be somewhat noisy all the time with my wisecos..But I cant tell if its my engine or my tranny...the engines quiet as hell when cold but seems to get noisy as temps climb...at all situations...


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## Turbo_Pumpkin (Feb 22, 2002)

*Re: (toy_vw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *toy_vw* »_do you mean knock or piston slap...
I find my engine to be somewhat noisy all the time with my wisecos..But I cant tell if its my engine or my tranny...the engines quiet as hell when cold but seems to get noisy as temps climb...at all situations...

I thought that noisey pistons would be when they are cold. The heat should expand them and make them fit tighter/quieter...


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## kevhayward (Mar 13, 2007)

Yep. Even stock VR6s slap when cold and most forged piston lumps do aswell once 20+k miles has passed.... should be quiet when hot.
A worn layshaft bearing in the trans and / or aggressive clutch can make rattling noises when hot.


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## Turbo_Pumpkin (Feb 22, 2002)

*Re: (kevhayward)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kevhayward* »_Yep. Even stock VR6s slap when cold and most forged piston lumps do aswell once 20+k miles has passed.... should be quiet when hot.
A worn layshaft bearing in the trans and / or aggressive clutch can make rattling noises when hot.

Or O2M transmissions with single mass flywheels...


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