# Nitrous ? what can the 1.8t handle and any one have a setup.



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

i cringe to even start this but its cheep HP for the drag strip. 

Ok so how much HP can you get from a Nitrous bottle on a stock k03 turbo? foged rod and ceramic coated C-chamber and forged pistons a given, & arp head studs of course. 

what would be needed to reach 700 crank hp? 

any one have a nitrous setup? 

and no i would never use this on a daily street car. im talking drag strip only. 

------------------------------------------ok wow edited for info below:------------------------------------- 

now if any one has good info on boosting a 1.8t or any 4cly to 500-700 hp id be interested in the info. if your just here to flame on "NOS" lol congradulations you win i agree with you turbo is better. but i dont wanna put that much money into a striped down shell of a VW. that ill prob crash. just to see what happens, lol thanks.


----------



## zrau17 (Apr 21, 2010)

If anything could be done to pull 700bhp from a ko3 at any given point I think the turbo itself would physically explode and leave nothing but fragments of shredded metal. 

You will not get 700bhp from a ko3. Most people on here with BT have loads of time, effort, and money into their cars and are probably no where near 700bhp aside from a select few.


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

The cost of a well thought out and functional Nitrous setup rivals a high quality and well thought out turbo kit. 

Why reinvent the wheel for 700wheel? 

To be lazy you could Copy Turbodubs setup from the DragRacing forum and that'll basically hit your goal on turbo. 

Generally Nitrous + cheap = boom.


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

screwball said:


> The cost of a well thought out and functional Nitrous setup rivals a high quality and well thought out turbo kit.
> 
> Why reinvent the wheel for 700wheel?
> 
> ...


 dont hate lol i plan BT for my daily. 450hp goal. 

but i got a spare 1.8t laying around and was thinking about doing a drag car, no interior, no lights, welded diff, plastic windows, tube frame front, ect..... built from a $200-800 wrecked vw/audi. i just wanna see 9's for cheep.


----------



## Turbo freak (May 9, 2005)

Ceramic coated C-chamber??? You want to get rid of heat not to keep it. 

125HP shot is the most i´ve heard from a stock engine/turbo.


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

zrau17 said:


> If anything could be done to pull 700bhp from a ko3 at any given point I think the turbo itself would physically explode and leave nothing but fragments of shredded metal.
> 
> You will not get 700bhp from a ko3. Most people on here with BT have loads of time, effort, and money into their cars and are probably no where near 700bhp aside from a select few.


 i was thinking about the k03 part and agree i would need a f-ing large wastegate to bypass the k03 

here is a quick est: 
The Fuel jet size should be 0.034" or 0.865mm @45psi and a Nitrous jet size of .062" or 1.5748mm @900psi should produce: 694.40 HP with 4 ports


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

Turbo freak said:


> Ceramic coated C-chamber??? You want to get rid of heat not to keep it.
> 
> 125HP shot is the most i´ve heard from a stock engine/turbo.


 ceramic keeps heat in the C-chamber and out the exhaust instead of into the head and piston.


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

maybe do a NA 1.8B 

B=bottle 

if i built it it would only see WOT or IDLE


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

We should call you screwball if you think 9s and cheap are on the same continent let alone neighborhood. 

That's hating...


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

screwball said:


> We should call you screwball if you think 9s and cheap are on the same continent let alone neighborhood.
> 
> That's hating...


 sry lol i ment cheep-er


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

basicly its only cheeper caust you dont have to spend ?,?000.00 on a 700hp turbo setup. just build up the base engine and juice it a nitrous kis runs


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

You think 700 hp is happening on a small port head? stock intake manifold? stock throttle body? 

How you controlling the nitrous? Engine Management? 

That's all gonna put you in the same range as a turbo setup.


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

screwball said:


> You think 700 hp is happening on a small port head? stock intake manifold? stock throttle body?
> 
> How you controlling the nitrous? Engine Management?
> 
> That's all gonna put you in the same range as a turbo setup.


 lol i have no f-ing clue lol why not, its not like boost its not volume alone it also volatility. stock TB sould not matter because direct port wet Nitous is post TB and provides more volatility then air. as far as manifold and head IDK thats why i asked if any one was running nitrous. :beer: 

as far as engine managment im sure one of the BT tuners gould get me close and for the nitrous 3k rpm activation 6200 cutoff. you might even be abble to use the stock tune depending on ignition timing.


----------



## Harry Sax (Apr 21, 2011)

OH but where do i start??? 

what was the guys name who tried the 250shot and killed it all???? remember that ordeal? and the resulting flame fest? oh yeah.... UntouchableGTI. never to be heard from again. 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3584742-Results-of-My-Broke-Motor-Teardown 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3089064-Figured-id-post-some-carnage 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?2760018-Advice-on-Nitrous-shot 

and 9's? easy killer. there are not even 10 cars running 9's in the US on a 1.8T. maybe 5. lets see if i can name them. 


Todd (has not hit 9 with 20v but did with 16v and will shortly with the 20v). 
Marc (almost 8's, really low 9's, even on ME7) 
Joel (is the only guy in the 8's) 
Ed (traction is his worst problem, not making the power) 
Aaron (all wheel drive) 

did i miss anyone? nope i dont think so. so that makes 4. and nobody uses nitrous. bottles are for babies, real men get blown. there is one 20v A4 on the bottle with a huge turbo in Europe somewhere, only running 9.85 or so. 

now 700 on a small port head is doable..... but not on a stock turbo or anything small for that matter.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

skip the nitrous and just run a big turbo :facepalm:


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

Harry Sax said:


> OH but where do i start???
> 
> what was the guys name who tried the 250shot and killed it all???? remember that ordeal? and the resulting flame fest? oh yeah.... UntouchableGTI. never to be heard from again.
> 
> ...


 
LOL thats kinda funny, sucks for his car but im not that daft. ive already said to remove turbo. i bet his wastgate couldent flow the added exhaust from the nitrous and eventuly raised the CR till it cracked the pistons, and i did not see any ignition timing eather est +2deg every 50shot also a progressive controller might have helped. 

also ive seen BT blow blocks as well, when trying to go fast there really is not any care free way. 

and kudo's to thoughs in the 9's i was at pacific waterland when that 2.0 20v 90s quatro pulled 9.9... it was cool as f=== 

thanks for the 700hp on small port contrabution.


----------



## moparfan90 (Oct 14, 2008)

just do it and video everything


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

moparfan90 said:


> just do it and video everything


 lol even if it blows it will be a hell of a show. if i build it it will be on camera


----------



## jettaglx91 (Jul 27, 2004)

taverncustoms said:


> LOL thats kinda funny, sucks for his car but im not that daft. ive already said to remove turbo. i bet his wastgate couldent flow the added exhaust from the nitrous and eventuly raised the CR till it cracked the pistons, and i did not see any ignition timing eather est +2deg every 50shot also a progressive controller might have helped.
> 
> also ive seen BT blow blocks as well, when trying to go fast there really is not any care free way.
> 
> ...


 Im usually not a d*ck but please stop posting and read(start with middle school grammer and spelling) 

You clearly have no idea what you are talking about, ill just list a few: 
1. you will not build a 700hp capable nitrous kit for under $1000 
2. you will need a full stand alone fuel supply for said 700hp 
3. you will not go 9's for anything considered cheap(at least $5K to build a car that is legal and capable of going that fast, not including the actual drivetrain itself) 
4. the wastegate has no effect on compression ratio. 
5. general rule is remove 2deg of timing for every added 50hp not +2 
6. you do understand n20 is way more dangerous then the same power boost wise. a millisecond of error is a trashed motor there is not lee-way with nitrous 
7. IF the motor can make 700hp what about clutch, trans, axles, etc, etc, etc. 


Please do some research before going all John Wayne up in here. I would guesstimate $20K+ on the low end to make that kind of power and attempt to run 9's 

*Oh also forgot to factor in that you can only mathematically make so much power with nitrous on a given motor. I dont know the engineering behind it but there is a point that you cant get anymore into the cylinders as its not being forced it. Something to do with more n20 then the displacement. GM did it years ago when they started testing the ECO-Tec's to go drag racing. I think they got to about 450hp of n20 and if they added more nitrous it actually made less power. 
* 

K im done being rude, its just that this thread is ridiculousness lol


----------



## xxsur3shotxx (Sep 24, 2009)

el. oh. el. 

700 hp. where 200 of it is motor+boost (ko3?) :sly:. The other 500 from the bottle? There aren't many motors that could handle a 500 shot of N20. The few that can are usually big block V8's. Seriously worked up. 

A 500 shot on one of these motors would probably lift the head right off and make a nice blowtorch under the hood. There's no way you could build a 1.8t block to handle a 500 shot on a budget. Idk if it can be done period. 

What's more, is even if you COULD make that kind of power, you'd never put it to the ground with your stock drivetrain setup.


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

jettaglx91 said:


> Im usually not a d*ck but please stop posting and read(start with middle school grammer and spelling)
> 
> You clearly have no idea what you are talking about, ill just list a few:
> 1. you will not build a 700hp capable nitrous kit for under $1000
> ...


 LOL its all good i never said i knew anything, and i spell like im in 5th grade so what. im not writing a novel. 

but let me just respond. 
1. you will not build a 700hp capable nitrous kit for under $1000 

not for every thing. but you would be a lot closer then a BT build 

2. you will need a full stand alone fuel supply for said 700hp 

WET Nitro port injection like they use on nitro dragsters.it provides its own fuel 

3. you will not go 9's for anything considered cheap(at least $5K to build a car that is legal and capable of going that fast, not including the actual drivetrain itself) 

Legal im talking drag race ONLY and i was really thinking 10k 

4. the wastegate has no effect on compression ratio. 

 i was thinking that maybe the back pressure was so great that he was over boosting. 

5. general rule is remove 2deg of timing for every added 50hp not +2 

TYPO: -&+ are close together on the num pad. 

6. you do understand n20 is way more dangerous then the same power boost wise. a millisecond of error is a trashed motor there is not lee-way with nitrous 

and your point? i never said it was safe. and i clearly stated not for daily use. 

7. IF the motor can make 700hp what about clutch, trans, axles, etc, etc, etc. 

Prayer. lol 

8. Oh also forgot to factor in that you can only mathematically make so much power with nitrous on a given motor. I dont know the engineering behind it but there is a point that you cant get anymore into the cylinders as its not being forced it. Something to do with more n20 then the displacement. GM did it years ago when they started testing the ECO-Tec's to go drag racing. I think they got to about 450hp of n20 and if they added more nitrous it actually made less power. 

i had actully just found that out before loging back in to find your post. you are veary correct you canot get 700hp out of a 1.8l enging with just N2O and if i cant then there is no point in continuing this thread. to bad no one knew that when i first asked 
Q: "what would be needed to reach 700 crank hp?" 
A: More Cubic inches 

this thread would have been 2 POSTS LONG thanks.


----------



## jettaglx91 (Jul 27, 2004)

I'm not gonna require the whole thing cuz that's a mess

The spelling and grammar matter because it makes it difficult to read and makes you look dumb especially when combined with crazy off the wall incorrect info

I know how a wet system works, yes it injects fuel with the n20, unlike a dry which is added by stock injectors, however its not magic it needs to get the fuel from somewhere and the stock fuel system can not move enough volume for 700 nitrous hp

The legal thing is in regards to drag racing, you do know it has to be legal safety wise right? Cage, suspension, fire protection, clothing, etc all need to meet certain criteria to be legal for 9's

And as far as prayer bout the rest of the drivetrain, HA, it has problems at 300-400hp what makes u think it will take 700

Please research before starting another thread


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

praying is what you do when you were in my boat... big turbo stock rods 400whp daily on an 02j... 

praying worked for about 4 months then the 02j died... 

then i went 02m (didnt pay tithes) 

that worked for a while 

then i went road racing 15 min sessions, 25psi 50trim... for not paying my tithes :laugh: i had an exhaust valve asspload... either egts or maybe 8200 rpms  

Point is, prayin well you can pray to all the gods you want from budda belly rubs to hail marry's, it only works till about 400 lol 

for the record i dont even spray the diesel that hard and im good on motor till around 1000rwhp :what: and its all stock internals 180 all day every day though i could sleep happily


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

moparfan90 said:


> just do it and video everything


 lol :thumbup:


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

jettaglx91 said:


> I'm not gonna require the whole thing cuz that's a mess
> 
> The spelling and grammar matter because it makes it difficult to read and makes you look dumb especially when combined with crazy off the wall incorrect info
> 
> ...


 did you not understand that i was asking for information because i did not know what i was talking about? how does asking a question make me look like an idiot. peplole so narrow minded that when you mention Nitrous they assume your an idiot. and start trolling. 
I was not asking how to build a drag car that would be a question possed as "hey any one know NHRA regulations for 9s?" 
secondly i never mentioned what car or drivetrain i was thinking of useing. 
i simply wanted to know if you could get 700 hp with just a Nitrous kit on a 1.8. im thinking your just looking for an argument. get a girlfriend or wife they work well for that. quit making simple questions into a debate with somone who clearly nows nothing about the subjet. you dont look smart you just look like an ass. at least from this end. 

please read the compleate tread before you post in it.


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

theswoleguy said:


> praying is what you do when you were in my boat... big turbo stock rods 400whp daily on an 02j...
> 
> praying worked for about 4 months then the 02j died...
> 
> ...


 lol thats awsome. i was thinking i would try and find a wrecked r32 so the power would be split by 2 axles, welded haldex, welded diffs,


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

you need to step away from the welder bro... :facepalm: 

btw fix your sig to force FED


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

theswoleguy said:


> you need to step away from the welder bro... :facepalm:
> 
> btw fix your sig to force FED


 lol yeah. oops


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)




----------



## IAmTheNacho (Oct 26, 2003)

Are you gonna put rods in it? Im really excited to see this build and videos of the car running 9's!


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

IAmTheNacho said:


> Are you gonna put rods in it? Im really excited to see this build and videos of the car running 9's!


 lol no cause im not gonna built it its not possable to get more then 400 or so on a 1.8 with nitrous as the only power adder not enuf volume in the clyenders to hold 600 shot of nitrous so no point. it would be possable to do with a nice turbo and nitrous but why mess with N2O if you got to put a turbo on anyway. TURBO>N2O


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

taverncustoms said:


> lol no cause im not gonna built it its not possable to get more then 400 or so on a 1.8 with nitrous as the only power adder not enuf volume in the clyenders to hold 600 shot of nitrous so no point. it would be possable to do with a nice turbo and nitrous but why mess with N2O if you got to put a turbo on anyway. TURBO>N2O


 you were lost, but now you're found :thumbup:


----------



## xxsur3shotxx (Sep 24, 2009)

Big_Tom said:


> you were lost, but now you're found :thumbup:


 the community saves another...... :laugh:


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

^^^ yup lol it makes my work worth it :laugh: :thumbup:


----------



## Navydub (Sep 30, 2006)

I think this thread made me dumber :banghead:


----------



## jettaglx91 (Jul 27, 2004)

taverncustoms said:


> did you not understand that i was asking for information because i did not know what i was talking about? how does asking a question make me look like an idiot. peplole so narrow minded that when you mention Nitrous they assume your an idiot. and start trolling.
> I was not asking how to build a drag car that would be a question possed as "hey any one know NHRA regulations for 9s?"
> secondly i never mentioned what car or drivetrain i was thinking of useing.
> i simply wanted to know if you could get 700 hp with just a Nitrous kit on a 1.8. im thinking your just looking for an argument. get a girlfriend or wife they work well for that. quit making simple questions into a debate with somone who clearly nows nothing about the subjet. you dont look smart you just look like an ass. at least from this end.
> ...


 


* 
im not saying the questions made you look like an idiot it was after the initial question you made a ton of statements which sure came across as you thought you knew what you were talking about. * 



i was not trying to spout about the nhra rules, i made the comment about making the car legal, which you clearly didnt know what i meant as your response was "legal? its gonna be a drag car" hence why i mentioned whats involved in that 

the car doesnt matter, 9's are 9's, and as far as drivetrain there is only so much you can do with a 1.8t lol 

i did read the complete "tread" hence the next response lol 





taverncustoms said:


> lol thats awsome. i was thinking i would try and find a wrecked r32 so the power would be split by 2 axles, welded haldex, welded diffs,


 im pretty sure you were just jokin but really man?!? r32's have 4 axles and you cant weld a haldex, im not even gonna say why not because again you are making statements without researching first 

I know alot about nitrous and making high horsepower 1.8t's and will gladly answer any questions, but ask the questions dont just start posting crazy statements 



:facepalm:


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

jettaglx91 said:


> *
> im not saying the questions made you look like an idiot it was after the initial question you made a ton of statements which sure came across as you thought you knew what you were talking about. *
> 
> 
> ...


 lol I know you cant actully weld a haldex unit, but you can lock it. i know the haldex is a hydralic slipper cluch system AKA no gears to weld, and by axles i ment the diff, but im sure you knew that. 

But if you dident: im not sure if welding a halfshaft would do anything, and an axle is left and rite halfshafts conected to a diff, making one axle. so 4 halfshafts + 2 Diff's = 2 Axles. i will try to be more detailed in the future. thanks 

:facepalm:I kinda knew this was gonna be one of thoughs threads :banghead: but my curriosity got the better of me:sly::sly: lol. I'm a guy that wants to know why it wont work. If its difficult it just makes me more interested. "we do these things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard" 

thank all of you who contributed to the origanal question including you jettaglx91 aside from your nitpicking you did give some info.


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

oh and thanks HARRY SAX for the info, awsome car btw. but you knew that already....9.90


----------



## tedgram (Jul 2, 2005)

A stock 1.8T can maybe take an 80 shot of nitrous any more and you would need at least rods.


----------



## Turbo freak (May 9, 2005)

A simple rule of thumb for nitrous: The bigger the shot the higher in RPM you should turn on. I mean a 35 HP shot can be triggered from 2500 RPM but a 100 HP shot should be triggered above 5500 RPM. That is because at lower RPM the shot provides big amounts of torque and by triggering at high rpm you help the engine avoiding that torque surge. 

In that case a RPM window switch is your best friend.


----------



## rebjetta (Nov 5, 2004)

you also have to retard the timing for large shots above 75 by about 2 degrees per 50hp too if i remember right


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

with the correct nitrous system its no longer a "shot' its a progressive fed so it starts out at 0 and after a ajustable amont of time it progresses to 100% flow so a 200 "shot could start at a 1 "shot" avoiding the imedate burst of tourqe. it would feel more like a turbo.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

This should be a sticky...


----------



## taverncustoms (Feb 18, 2011)

http://www.holley.com/15975NOS.asp


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)




----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

A lulzcat is just about in order.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

screwball said:


> A lulzcat is just about in order.


 Its on you John. I got a warning last week, and don't want to lose this username


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Its on you John. I got a warning last week, and don't want to lose this username


 LOL :facepalm:


----------



## Harry Sax (Apr 21, 2011)

dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> Its on you John. I got a warning last week, and don't want to lose this username


 WHAT???? a WARNING??????


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

I got you dubs! 


dubinsincuwereindiapers said:


> (





Big_Tom said:


> LOL





Harry Sax said:


> WHAT???? a WARNING??????


 :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

Oh damn, snoretex is hatin'!


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)




----------



## Balomo41 (Apr 2, 2009)

Hey, how many cans of this stuff can be mixed wit 93 to get racing octane? I one time bought this NOS and mixed with regular 87 and it was amazing.
I have full APR but I most of the time run on 93 due to unavailability of 100.


----------



## builtvw (Sep 20, 2009)

Big_Tom said:


>


love it


----------



## SB_Beetle (Oct 11, 2003)

If people are going to speak on grammar you sound more intelligent and believable if you use the correct word.

"then" is a continuation
First you open the bottle, (then) you drink.

"than" is a comparative 
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me (than) a frontal lobotomy.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

SB_Beetle said:


> If people are going to speak on grammar you sound more intelligent and believable if you use the correct word.
> 
> "then" is a continuation
> First you open the bottle, (then) you drink.
> ...


:laugh::thumbup:


----------

