# How a VW Fox Wagon sucked me back in...a build thread.



## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

This build thread has been a long time coming. When I first got the Wagon - I had no intention of it being worthy of it&#146;s own thread (the car itself as well as re-kindling my obsession with VW)...Luckily I have complied a bunch of photos since I got it (though I lost some due some nitwit at the Apple Store Genius Bar) - but here it goes...

I had an ~89 Fox in High School (1997) for about 2 months. PO hid some serious problems from an inexperienced teen that I was - and it had to be junked before I ever got to really enjoy it. I don&#146;t remember much - but I still have a key: (image to come)

Then I got a &#145;74 Super Beetle and that was my car for the next few years...sold it in 2000.

I didn&#146;t have a car again until last summer when I decided it was time to get something that would be dependable and can haul (backyard stuff, camping, road trips, 4 of us and a dog to visit family on LI often, etc). Zipcar doubled their fees since I started using it - so I started looking for a dependable used Wagon. I don&#146;t even think I knew the Fox came in a Wagon body style - until I saw it and knew I needed to have one. Sure I should have searched around a bit - and knowing how much needed to go into this one before it was drivable (I got it looked over by a local VW mechanic) - and the PO was asking more than it was worth. I could only get him down so much - but something was telling me this was the one...and whatever that something was - it was right. It is not perfect - but a trooper nonetheless. It has been treating me really well so far and I am learning a bunch working on it and being part of this community.

Here&#146;s the basic rundown. I bought it from this guy in NJ who is in the Marines - and from Brazil - he bought it from the original owner 3 months before selling it to me (his wife put the kibosh on his project). he had plans to do all this work on it - mentioned putting carbs and all these other Brazilian spec mods that I was clueless to at the time - I should have kept his info, because he probably had some in to get parts shipped up here - but anyway - he wasn&#146;t so personable.

Original owner was this old man from Nassau County, Long Island, NY - that really took care of this Wagon and the records show it. Receipts and handwritten documentation of oil changes, etc. It shows road trips to Florida and Arizona.

The Carfax on it was clean - besides some strange stuff with the odometer - which I figured out once I looked through the paperwork. The Wagon was given to me with 48,XXX miles on the clock - looking through the receipts I found where the information was not consistent. At around 22,239 - he had the speedometer replaced - which equals me getting the car with around 78,XXX miles. It seems it was sitting around for a while before he bought it. Dry rotted tires, hoses, etc. and rodent made a home in the dash - that's all cleaned out now. The hand written oil changes records stopped in the late 90s - inspections up until June of 2010.

Purchased on 8/12/2011 this is how she looked when I got her: 


















Found some pictures on my girl's phone from when I brought it home from the DMV - with a full tank - leaking all over my street :banghead:










First and foremost it needed a gas tank. There were pinholes in the top half. The gas gauge didn&#146;t work either. After looking for a sending unit for a couple of weeks to no avail - I dropped it off at a mechanic (GT Precision in Massapequa, NY) suggested by someone on the Vortex. They helped me get it so it was drivable and pass inspection. Unfortunately - living in Brooklyn, I didn&#146;t have the space to keep it off the road and learn to do some of these things myself - but I quickly learned that I would have saved a lot of money if I had researched the parts and tackled a few things myself. That&#146;s when I got a Bentley and started doing my homework. 

*General Fixes and Upgrades 9/3/2011:*
valve cover gasket
timing belt and tension
alternator belt
distributor cap, rotor and spark plugs (Bosch)
gas tank - new Spectra Part #SPIVW1
fuel filter (Bosch)
front rotors
rear shocks (CofRAP)
oil change/filter
air filter
new lock cylinders and 3 keys to match ignition
wiper blades

Passed inspection on 9/2/2011 and it&#146;s driven great since. And this is when the disease hit again.

What went from needing a car to save money in the long run instead of renting cars and for more freedom became an obsession. I started spending all of my free time researching and ingesting what a Fox is and it&#146;s capabilities.

It needed hatch struts - so I ordered a OEM replacement from a dealer in San Diego through vwpartsdepartment.com and put them in right away.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

*Part 2.*

I ride my bike daily - so the first thing it needed on a practical level was a roof rack - then I realized it needed it on an aesthetic level too! The Wagon (and all Foxes IMO) are not complete without a roof rack!

*Thule Roof Rack:*
LB50 Bars
300 Feet


















I found a used Techtonics Tuning Stainless Cat-Back Exhaust with Manifold and Downpipe being sold just outside of Phildelphia a few days before we had plans to visit family and friends down there. $80 later and I brought it home and purchased all the gaskets, bolts, studs, O2 sensor, etc I needed for this upgrade. I also bought a new Catalytic Converter from Techtonic Tuning (environmental reasons more than anything) - as well as all their clamp kit with all the hanger hooks welded to them.

First I sanded and ceramic paint coated the entire Exhaust System: 



































































































I used VHT:









I would have done a few things different if I had a 2nd go at it - but I learned a lot!

-----

Around this time I started looking into replacing all the hoses and flushing out the coolant system to replace with G12. A few of the hoses were dry rotted and I wanted to have a timestamp on when this car got a makeover. 

*Coolant System (10/29/2011):*
G12 - Pentosin Pentofrost ++ (G12++)
All new hoses
Temperature Sender Switch; For Gauge - Bosch OEM
Coolant Temperature Sensor - Bosch OEM
Thermostat; 80 Degree C and seal - Wahler OEM

--------------------------------

The car&#146;s 80s aftermarket stereo no longer worked - so I got a decent system for $160 shipped.

*4x 4" Kenwood KFC-1062S - 3-way 120 watt
Sony CDXGT550UI Head Unit*

My dad and I spent an afternoon installing the system along with a few other things. This is one set of pictures I am pissed that I lost in the &#147;Genius&#148; Bar mishap...I took time to Peel n Seal all the sheet metal behind the rear panels and under the rear seat. I also covered the rear Wagon area under the carpet. It made a noticable difference already. I plan to do the inside of the doors and rear walls as well.

I picked up a Tach Cluster and ordered form LEDs from SuperBrightLEDs.com - I practiced breaking the plastic bonding on an extra cluster - and once I figured it out - I pulled the green diffuse out of the Tach Cluster. I replaced it with a lightly scratched up clear piece of plastic.

*Tach Cluster & Stereo Installed: *









*Small Interior Upgrades:*
door lock knobs - used
hatch struts - new OEM
Rear View Mirror - Junkyard (newer looking)
Spare Wheel Cover - Junkyard (cleaner and all the seams are intact)
Dino Steering Wheel - needs some love, but it&#146;s night a day difference in handling and comfort from stock:










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I loved the smoked lights look - and was determined to get rid of all the amber lights (and eventually red side markers too). So, I placed an order with Zarrir at BrazilShopping.com for

*Smoked Corners: *

















I also picked up smoked blinker covers from Memo Imports:









Started making the front end look really nice...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

*Part 3.*

We got news that my girlfriend&#146;'s High School she works for would be moving to a part of Brooklyn that would require her to travel for 1.5-2 hours by public transportation - so I had my eyes peeled - and within a week found an &#145;89 Coupe in absurdly good condition with just as absurd a price tag. After one test drive I knew I had to make this happen. After dropping more than I should have on the Wagon at this point - this seemed to even things out. Some people started to think I had lost it at this point - not having a car for nearly 12 years and then having two all of a sudden - but it felt like the right thing to do - and it sure was.

*And then there were two: *










I couldn&#146;t stand the plastic hubcaps anymore - So, I picked up a set of pretty clean Tarantulas with Nexen tires with 90% tread left: 


























Winter is coming (or so I had hoped)! Time for the Thule Snowboard Carriers:









The shifter needed bushings BAD - getting into reverse was always a pain - and it was generally sloppy. I had gotten in touch with Felipe from iMohr and ordered a short shifter and a 4 Speed Bushing Kit. I also ordered a set of Extra Wide Side Trim for a 91-92 Voyage - they will go on after paint.










*iMohr Parts:*









*New bushings and wooden shift knob (Redline MTL gear oil too): *










*Wheels and Tires:*
*Summer*
Yokohama S.drive 195/50R15 - Purchased from Discount Tire Direct on 2/3/2012 - Mounted 3/10/2012
Konig Feather - 15X6.5 4x100 ET40 w/ 57.7>73.1mm Hub Rings
McGard Wheel Locks: 28175

















*Winter*
OEM Snowflakes (have a clean set waiting for me to pick up in CT)
Not sure what tires yet...










At this point I dove deep into researching upgrading the suspension - I started buying parts here and there - but wouldn&#146;t get them installed until March. I also start gathering parts for a complete brake system overhaul including Scirocco 10.1&#148; Girling 54 Calipers - also not installed yet. I just lined up an MK3 brake booster already modded for the Fox that will come with the upgraded Master Cylinder...this will happen soon.

Vogtland Sport Lowering Springs :









*Suspension (installed 4/7/2012):*
Front Strut Insert: KYB - GR-2/Excel-G - 365008
Front Strut Mounts: KYB: SM5024 - else OEM - ZBA-412-351
Rear Struts: KYB - GR-2/Excel-G - 343191
Rear Strut Mounting - KYB - SM-5376
Rear Spring Isolator - upper spring seat for MK2
Rear Lower Spring Seat - (x2): KYB - SM5558
Strut Boot Front: KYSB101 (bumpers cut ~1&#148; section)
Strut Boot Rear: KYSB115 (bumpers cut ~1&#148; section)
Front Strut slotted nut/bushing (x2): 811 412 365
Springs: Vogtland Sports - MK2 1985-1992 - 2.4&#148; 60mm - 956656
Ball Joints: OCAP - (L) 307 407 365 2 and (R) 307 407 366 2
MK1 Rear Strut Covers

Future Plans:
Tie Rods Assembly: (not installed yet): (L) 307 419 801 1 and (R) 307 419 802 10
AutoTech Rear Beam Sway Bar (not installed yet)
AutoTech 22mm Front Sway Bar - I need a solution to replace the outer bushings that are NLA
iMohr or other comparable Front Strut Tower Bar

Disclaimer: _I wish that I can claim that I installed this setup - but I can't. Living in Brooklyn and not having the space and the right tools for the job - I needed to get someone else with way more experience and a professional garage to handle this. His name is Mike and he works at an Audi dealership (and had been working on VW/Audi since 1985). On the side he does work out of his incredible garage. He's in Eastern Long Island - if anyone wants his contact info - he is extremely reasonable and a real nice guy._

-----------------------------

Intake/Fuel System Upgrade (2/24/2012):
Digifant II Throttle Body from 1993 Fox
K&N Air Filter: 33-2002
Deleted Pre-Heater Hose (10/29/2011 during Exhaust Upgrade)
Deleted Cool Air Intake Hose and connection w/ flapper to airbox
Cold Start Valve: Bosch OEM 0.280.170.423 - lightly used/like new
Cleaned throttle plate
New vacuum hoses where needed
Idle, Timing, Mixture Adjusted
Fuel Injectors - all 4 new - Bosch 0 437 502 045 (3/17/2012)

This is where I *FINALLY *started to see the impact of all the work that had been going into the Wagon. Saw increase in mileage as well as the performance and added pickup throughout all gears.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

*Part 4.*

ripemdry introduced to me his buddy at Axiom Auto Body in West Babylon on Long Island, NY - so I started to learn about body work and plan to tackle as much of this project as I can handle. Carl will take care of all the professional stuff at this point - when it comes to paint or major patch work - but I am learning a lot - though I haven’t been in a couple of months - here are some initial results:


*Adhesive Removal:*

24 year old adhesive was caked on pretty hard (first I cut all the small aluminum rivets out with wire cutters):

























I used a heat gun and a sharp straight razor to get off what I could:

























Then with a bit of lacquer remover and elbow grease:










*Antenna Removal:* 

















































































































Temporary primer until the entire car get sanded down and painted (looks pretty clean IMO):









------------------

I had some free time at the shop - so I cleaned the engine bay: 
*Before:*








*After:*









--------------------

New Wiper Arms:


















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*Side Marker Delete (more on this to come - I need to organize photos):*


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

*Part 5.*


*Front End:*
I worked on installed the Brazilian front end over a course a few days. First step to making this set up work is removing the upper and lower horizontal pieces of trim off of the stock US grill (unfortunately I didn’t get a shot of stock before I started cutting them off - but here is what it looks like after a little plastic surgery: :laugh:










I wanted to paint all these pieces one color - so I got some Rustoleum Primer/Paint Combo made for Plastics. I took the Gol trim and lightly sanded it down with a scouring pad so that the paint would adhere to it. I did the same to the grill. I then cleaned up both with some wax/grease remover and painted them with a few nice even coats.










































*Starting to look more and more like a Parati!!!:*









----

Just after this I took the Wagon on it's first extended road trip - to Montreal from Brooklyn. It had been upstate NY, Philly and DC - but had done no more than 500 mile round trips. We visited Alain and went to see Radiohead! (sadly no pics of the Wagon in that beautiful city - it was pretty much parked the whole time outside the apartment we stayed in and we biked all over the city)

Packed and ready to go the night before:









At Litchfield Bug-In '12 w/ my Dad's 2008 Rabbit 2.5 (The Fox and the Hare):









------

Back home I continued progress on the front end...

*Fog Lights:*

Installing the Fog Lights was a pretty big project - now that I have done it once - I could probably do it again in half the time - but I guess that’s how it goes.

First unbolt all 6 bolts holding your bumper to the frame and slide it off:









I brought it indoors where I planned on working on it (AC is your friend in 96 degree weather). You have to cut off the one set of tow hooks - the ones furthest to the side of the car (if you have only this pair - then you will end up being tow hookless up front):

















My first cut was not enough - you live you learn - make sure you cut ABOVE the bumper rebar:



























In the middle of cutting they tow hooks off - I had to pull the skin off - it made it easier to maneuver the Dremel - probably better just using a sawzall - which I would advise you to take off the skin before you even start cutting.

You will have to cut out the section of grill for the lights to sit in - you will cut this - and then sand down a bit more to get it to fit right - I feel like I can sand even more - and get them to sit in just a bit deeper. I may do that once I have the bumper off for paint.


























Oh yeah! before you pull the skin off - mark the rebar/metal bumper where you will be drilling two holes for the mounting bolts to go in. I used ¼” wide galvanized - not sure the length - and I probably went too long, but they can always be cut. I drilled the holes straight through the bend in the lip.










Once you have your holes drilled in your bumper for the bolts - you can put the bumper skin back on. You would slide the fogs on to make sure they are fitting right - take them off an add 4-5 nuts onto the bolt. I used loctite once I had it all figured out - these bolts will act as spacers.

I didn’t like the way the fogs sat at first:


















So I took them back off and bent those long bolts down a bit - I had to take the spacer bolts back a centimeter or so - bend the bolts with a hammer and then tighten them down...installed the lights back and they fit more flush in the grill:


















Almost complete Brazilian Front End!









I still need to come up with a solution for the seam between the top ad bottom grill pieces - I have a strip of aluminum I plan on bending into shape and paint, but haven’t gotten to it.

*Lighting:*
Smoked Rear Taillights: Imola Acrilico - Made in Brazil
Smoked Corner Parking Lenses:
Smoked Turning Signal Lenses: A1 Cabriolet Bumper Part # A1CA-1004
Voyage Headlight Lamps: RCD - made in Brazil
Headlights: Hella H4 Bulbs: Xenon +50 - http://www.rallylights.com/detail.aspx?ID=267
Fog Lights Brazil; RCD - made in Brazil
Fog Lights: H3 Bulbs: Narva H3 - Xenon +50 - http://www.rallylights.com/detail.aspx?ID=5137

*Electrical Upgrades:*
Fog Light Switch: 307.941.535.3 (not installed yet)
Alternator - 90 amp - OEM from 1993 Coupe
Wiring Harness for Headlights and Fog Lights - w/ relays - custom built from Susquehanna Rally Lights


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

Finally!

Thanks for all the pointers on the fogs, this should help my install immensely. I really like the progression on your car, I can't wait to see the future.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Thanks Steve! Yeah - it's really nice to have this all in one place. I am really psyched on how it's turning out! 

:beer:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

*FUTURE PLANS:*

Picked up parts for the PSA swap:

Lightened Stock Flywheel: 13.5 lbs









Spent some time cleaning the PSA on a day that I wish I was installing it (for some reason I never shot a before pic):


















Brake/Wheel/Hub Parts list:
bearing kit (front) - Timken SET39
bearings kit (rear) - Timken Inner: SET1/Outer: SET8/Seals: 1174S
front hubs - 
caliper guide pin: OEM
caliper bolts - ordered from Dealer on 2/2 OEM #: N-900-689-02 (x4)
drum shoes - Febi Drum Shoes 
drums: black oxide coated
drum hardware - Made in USA 
wheel cylinders - F A G Made in Germany (x2)
vented rotors - Meyle - 256mmX20mm - 10.1 inches OEM #: 321-615-301D
front pads - Mintex Red Box MDB1570 - else: OEM #: 357-698-151A
parking brake cable - Made in Italy 
Autotech stainless hydraulic brake lines - 4 line set- 10-611-205K 
MK3 Brake Booster 
Upgraded Master Cylinder 

Interior:
Audi 4k front seats (or some other tan/brown velour)
Re-upholster the rear Wagon pleather area - haven't decided on fabric yet
VDO gauges (just need to start accumulating rest of the senders)

Body/Exterior Upgrades:
Door handles (MK2) & seals
Window Seals
Hatch Seal
Door Seals
Window Seals
Gol Wide Side Molding
Sunroof?

Saveiro Front Vent Windows and Seals - I plan to install with “new” doors I got ready to be sanded and primered










Engine Upgrade (When:?)
Corrado G60 (MK2) Counterflow Big Valve Cylinder Head: Ported & Polished - needs some work
AutoTech 270 Hydrolift Cam
Neuspeed Adjustable Cam Sprocket
Lightened Intermediate Shaft
Windage Tray Oil Pan Gasket


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

Jealous of the wing windows.


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## voxwagen88 (Dec 9, 2001)

redone17 said:


> Passed inspection on 9/2/2011 and it’s driven great since. And this is when the disease hit again.
> 
> What went from needing a car to save money in the long run instead of renting cars and for more freedom became an obsession.


Wow. It took you about 10 months to get done most of what took me 10 years.
And my fog lights and fat trim are still in storage:banghead:.
You've got it bad. And that is good.
Good stuff.

Tell me about the S-drives. How do you like them? How do they compare to other tires?


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Nice to see your build thread Chris!! Congrats, the Wagon is looking awesome :thumbup: excited for the future of it!


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## insanebuslady (Jun 9, 2010)

Wow man, inspiring to see what can be done without so much as a driveway. The sidewalk is my shop as well, but I'm a lot further behind than you

Really really jealous of the vent windows..


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## novws (Dec 17, 2005)

I've followed your posts almost from the beginning. Great work, Chris! It's nice to see it all chronicled here in one place.


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## dacolino (Jun 1, 2002)

redone17 said:


>


Hey that looks like my interior! Haha, Chris looking good man, glad you enjoy the wheel. Look like you also made it up through storm king as well. Pretty neat overlook of the hudson right? Car is coming along well, good luck with it:thumbup:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

thanks for all the kind words guys! I sure have gone nipple deep in VW once again - it's interesting getting back into it being a little older and wiser from my teenage VW years - though I missed out on a lot. I have a LOT to learn. I am not nearly half as mechanically savvy as I'd like to be - but the Fox is a nice car to learn on :thumbup:

Regan - as for the S.drives - I don't have much to compare to. Besides the dry-rot crap that was on there when I got the car - I only had the Nexens on for a few months - and those are pretty generic. The S.drives feel fantastic - they handle well in wet conditions, they are a nice quiet ride and handle turns and breaking well - they never chirp on gear changes which is more than I can say about the Nexens...for $350 a set (w/chrome valve stems and warranty) - I am a happy FOXer. I like the way they look too! They are a bit soft - so, we'll see how long they last. I don't drive that much - coming in at like 10k during the first year.

I recently (June 14-17) took it on a 1000 Mile Trip up to Canada and it loved the ride. In fact - I think it has been running better than ever since that haul. 

Chicago/Wisconsin with all stops in between it's next big trip!


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## ripemdry (Dec 17, 2007)

Looks good makes me miss the wagon big time.


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## JGWarner (Oct 22, 2009)

:thumbup:

I like where this is going.

needz deezul tho...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Started the PSA swap. Many thanks to ziddey for his insight, tools and hard work. We are about halfway through the process. A couple of snags along the way, but more on that later. 

Transmission Upgrade
PSA 5-Speed Transmission from a 1993 Coupe (THANKS 5-7-0!)
Lightened Stock Flywheel: 13.5 lbs
Clutch/Pressure Plate: NOS/OEM 
Throwout Bearing - OEM
Throwout Bearing Guide Sleeve - OEM/Porsche
Flywheel Bolt - Febi
Redline MTL: 70W80 GL-4
Shifter Lower Support Rod: iMohr
Shifter Short Throw: iMohr
Techtonics Tuning - front snub mount
Engine/Trans Mounts: 034 MotorSport - Track Density (2 engine, 1 trans) 

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Backup Parts:
Pilot Bearing - F A G 
Selector Shaft Seal - Victor Reinz
Main Shaft Oil Seal - Elring Klinger

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We opted for the full Brazilian experience and waited for the 100 degree Brooklyn weather. Wouldn't be a day of hard work without 3rd degree burns from the street :thumbup:










My awesome neighbor (thanks Paul) not only gave us a hand throughout the day (and provided power for the 3 gal compressor ziddey bought in preparation of this project - he also brought over a cooler filled with limeade, lemonade, waters and most importantly beer and ice! (greasy hands = no pic #1) 

Removing the dual downpipe proved to be a pain in the arse - as expected. We had to drop the entire exhaust so that we could get the air gun on the bolts at the cat. We also had to remove the O2 sensor to maneuver the downpipe out. Once that was done every other step of the transmission removal went smoothly...










CV bolts were a breeze, bell housing bolts were easier to get at then expected, mount just needed a little breaker bar action, and once we took out the 3 little shield bolts - it pretty much dropped right out. 










So, old flywheel, clutch and pressure plate are out - Ready to put the PSA in?!?! NOT SO FAST! We started checking out the PSA and making some obvious comparisons...at first glance we noticed the lack of a spring on the clutch release shaft. After a quick lifeline call to alaincopter (thanks Alain!) to confirm that yes, the 5 speed SHOULD have one - and a quick glance through the Bentley proved that post 1991 Foxes had this spring closer to the petal. Yay! This should be fun. But FIRST - a BEER and RIBS break! (greasy hands = no pic #2 - this time BBQ sauce) :beer: - I dry rubbed the night before - my roommate braised them in beer and whiskey for a while, smoked them for 2 hours and charred them on the grill - HIT THE SPOT!

It wasn't actually all that bad - obviously removing and reloading the spring was the hardest part. The arm itself on the PSA was definitely tampered with - there were big globs of weld that didn't look trustworthy - so I decided to make a bit of a hybrid of the two. As well as the arm, I took all the minor parts from the PW that the PSA was missing - throwout guide collar and lock washers, the plastic guide sleeve/bushing that holds the arm in place had seen better days - and the one on the PW was like new. Also grabbed the boot at the end of the tranny that covers the seal (which was also like-new) and the front mount brace. 

All set up and ready to go in (just needs a bit of MoS2):









To be continued...


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## Beetle.freak (Apr 16, 2009)

Dam nice progress ! I'd love to snag a set of those wing windows myself....what/what year did they come off of ?


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Love how the swap is going, keep up the good work man! Your wagon deserves it and you'll love your road trips with it even more :thumbup: Looking forward to your driving impressions!


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## 89fox_^ (Apr 5, 2011)

yea samething here i actually had the tranny down in less than an hour with out taking out the exhuast then i got stuck on the pilot bearing :facepalm: yea then i decided to take the downpipe off to put the tranny back on pain in the a$$ indeed i was actually suprised on how easy the tranny comes down,good luck bro :beer::beer:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Prep for Part 2 of PSA swap w/ iMohr parts: 

I started getting a few things done indoors in anticipation of finishing the swap tomorrow. 

First I Dremel'd the off the ball from the linkage plate and gave it a grind on both sides until it was nice and flat/even. 


























Then I drilled a 1/4" hole that ended up needing a 5/16" bore to fit the iMohr bolt. 









Regan/voxwagen88 mentioned the bolt being just too short and he's right - it just barely doesn't reach the lock ring. He suggested a 35mm which is about 1.38" - I plan to go get a 1.5" bolt that will suffice. 









It seems from others experience I need the rod bolted to the bottom of the plate - I guess I have to play with it once I'm under the car. 

iMohr short shifter itself needs the hole to be drilled a bit bigger (23/64") to fit the tube - otherwise there is too much play without it:









(have to drill/finish this part in the morning - people are sleeping)

So, I started cleaning up the flywheel with a scouring pad:



































Until next time...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Let me start Part 2 off by saying: SCREW the 4 speed PW. What a waste of metal! Instantly more fun to drive with the PSA. 

Secondly, many many thanks to ziddey and his willingness to help me with this swap. Without him I would have probably dropped it off with Mike - but this is one thing I really wanted to get my hands dirty with. It was such a great experience - I learned a TON - and most importantly: the rewards and satisfaction in saying "I did that" are priceless. So, thanks again ziddey for this experience - your hard work and guidance made this possible. 

Lightened flywheel, and new Sachs clutch/pressure plate installed:









Using the clutch alignment tool is so helpful! Afterwards we were kicking ourselves for not observing top center on the flywheel and making a noticeable mark on it. There was some weight taken off where the numbers are usually visible - hoping some daylight will help us find it next time. 

034 Motorsport mount and throwout bearing installed - all lubed up with MoS2 and ready to go!

















Not many pictures to post of the mating and final steps of this process - here is what a Wagon looks like with a PSA:









Haha. 

First test drive and we need to adjust the linkage slightly, first is a little tough to get into - since the car was already off the jacks and it was getting dark - we opted to adjust the shifter housing loosening the two bolts and sliding it to the right a bit. I plan to get under there again - but more importantly we needed a beer. 

I was afraid the 034 Motorsport engine mounts and Techtonics Tuning front snub were going to rattle my teeth more than I would liked it, but I was wrong! WHAT a great feel. I look forward to really getting to cruise around a bit, but on first impression I already felt a difference in shifting and even taking turns...more on this later :thumbup:

The iMohr lower support rod added and nice stiffness and accuracy that I am already loving. I meant to take a picture of it - but will have to next time I have the car lifted - but there is NO way the arm would bolt on UNDER the linkage plate like suggested in QuantumSyncro's DIY thread as well as voxwagen88's post in the Shifter Bushing Madness thread. I have it bolted in above the plate just like its pictured on iMohr's site (it DID need a slightly (1/4" more did it - of in metric it was said to get 35mm) longer bolt than provided, which I thank voxwagen88 for the advice):










OH - how can I forget? This also wouldn't have been possible without our trusty cobblestone brick and wood block (which cracked in half) - all jacked up Brooklyn style:


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

redone17 said:


> OH - how can I forget? This also wouldn't have been possible without our trusty cobblestone brick and wood block (which cracked in half) - all jacked up Brooklyn style:


:laugh::laugh::laugh:


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Congrats to you and ziddey! After tackling a project this big, there's really not much on a Fox you can't do yourself :beer: brooklin style jack gave me a good smile!

Looking forward to hearing more driving impressions, especially on the lighter flywheel - can you tell how much faster it revs up in neutral?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I lost plates and lock nuts from both bike carriers due to the new mounts :laugh:

Thanks Alain! I'm really excited about where this is going. The engine revs up nicely all around - all gears have significant pickup increases. I must say the longer arm on the clutch release made a HUGE difference. So smooth and easy and engages with little effort. 

I want to drive all of the time right now.


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## denver_fox (Oct 15, 2011)

Chris, your really learning some crazy ish now! Very impressed!:thumbup:


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## voxwagen88 (Dec 9, 2001)

> Let me start Part 2 off by saying: SCREW the 4 speed PW. What a waste of metal! Instantly more fun to drive with the PSA.


HaHaHA. 



> I was afraid the 034 Motorsport engine mounts and Techtonics Tuning front snub were going to rattle my teeth more than I would liked it, but I was wrong! WHAT a great feel.


Glad you were not steered wrong on those.

Smooth, easy, accurate shifting.

What a reward for your efforts.

:thumbup:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I took the PSA Wagon on it's first trip yesterday. We did a 200 mile trip to Eastern PA to go tubing and have a 400+ mile trip planned for this weekend up to Cooperstown. I am exponentially more excited to drive with the PSA. So much fun!

Just to keep this all in one place - I started this thread asking about the idle screw and some issues I have been having with it. I have some homework to do.

The Street Peep scoped out the Wagon! He posted his pics on Saturday. He goes around taking photos of old/obscure cars/trucks and leaves a business card saying "You've Been Peeped" with his site on it. Great concept. I feel honored!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

After consistant recommendations I put in a Mahle (OC47) oil filter along with 20w50 for the first time. Seems happy so far. 

I was running 15w40 for the last year - seemed to love it over the Bentley and original mechanic recommended 10w30 - but figured a long summer drive could use the higher viscosity this time around. Preparing for a 3k mile road trip.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Last night we got home from the Wagon's longest trip so far. 2,745 miles without a hitch. Such a great vacation. 

So rewarding being able to take a 24 yr old car out on the road - especially compared to the state this car was in a year ago. Got a lot of looks of course! Only saw 1 early Rabbit the whole time and it was on the last day in Detroit. 

I hit 10k miles in the last year (almost to the day) on our way to Ohio. 

This is my favorite pic during the trip - in front of our cabin in Interlochen, MI (was supposed to rain this night, so we opted for a cabin instead of tent - but of course it was a perfectly clear night) 









The Wagon has a history of long road trips. The PO's notes claim he drove to Florida a few times and it even made it out to Arizona once or twice! I plan to keep it happy and trek it around the country some more. 

This trip:
Brooklyn > LI NY (drop off our dog with my folks) > Roxbury, NY > Allegany State Park camp > Ohio 2 night camp and Cedar Point Roller Coasters > Chicago for a long weekend of amazing biking, beer and food (incl a trip to Three Floyds in Munster, IL) > Founders for lunch > Cabin in Interlochen, MI > Sleeping Bear Dunes 2 night camp, biking, hiking and swimming > 2 nights in Detroit > Brooklyn

--

Next: Brake upgrade


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## 1993vw fox (Jan 15, 2011)

Sounds like a great trip. Glad the wagon was pleased to take the trip.


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## kerensky (Mar 5, 2001)

One of the guys in the Scirocco forum hit all 48 contiguous states a couple of summers ago. He actually had a map of the country painted on the hood and filled them in as he traveled. It was epic.


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Awesome trip man, would love to see more pics if you have them! What a reliable Wagon. All your hard work with preventive maintenance and new parts sure is paying off. I'll be doing a trip with my Fox soon and hope it performs this good also :thumbup:


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

Wagon looks great, you've done a great job on it.

Steve


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## JGWarner (Oct 22, 2009)

So much win, in this thread.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Thanks Jon & Steve!

It's nice being able to actually enjoy it all summer...now that fall is around the corner I should be getting back to the body work. I have a hood and fender lined up. I may even take it off the road for a few months during winter.

First, I need to install my new wire harness w/ relays and Fog Light Switch...even though it looks good - I'd prefer them to be functional :facepalm:

Been on the hunt for a nice set of 15" wheels that are from the 80s...slim pickings - but not in a rush.


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## ERROL (Apr 28, 2001)

hahaha.. love the 'Brooklyn Style' jacking technique. good work my man. thank you for sharing this.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

I was going to bump this thread today but *ERROL* beat me to it, thanks man!


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

I used the same front struts (KYB GR2) when I replaced the suspension last month.

Are the rear shock specific for the fox, or did you order them for a different model VW?
I had to order rear shocks for a jetta or a golf because the wagon units weren't available.

Nice work on the wagon. I took mine from South Carolina to Florida about 5-6 times for extended road trips. It's really a good traveling car.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

thanks guys!

I actually used Audi 4000 Fronts (Part# 365008) and MK2 Rears (Part #343191)

I need to get the KYB lower spring seats installed - right now I am sagging a bit and bumps are a bit rough. I need that annoying $50 socket tho - someone have one I can borrow?

I haven't done much in terms of the 'build' lately - got to enjoy driving it a bunch all summer. It is great on the highways. I'm looking forward to installing the rear sway bar - just need to buy a few quality steal bits to get through the beam. Then I want to take it to Harriman State Park - which I've been putting off.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Unfortunately my selector shaft seal was leaking. Not having the right tools (or knowledge) when we did the swap - we opted to leave it out. Old oil was over 2 quarts - figured it was fine. 










It was only seeping a very little bit - but enough to piss me off. 

I got some Permatex 82099 Spray Sealant and put a couple of coats. Made a bit of a mess and found bits of this crap on my arms for days. BUT it seems to be holding!


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Are the 4k front inserts different than the Fox? I'm surprised you guys like the GR2's. I've got them on all corners on my Fox and don't really like them. I wouldn't say they're too harsh (in a nice firm way).. more it seems they don't really dampen anything and I'm always banging around like it's a solid suspension (the backs anyway).


What tool are you referring to? I probably have it.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

That is the same "feel" I have - I am not 100% psyched about it (in fact the Lady HATES them and wishes she had two sports bras on every time we take it anywhere) - but they were cheap. I wish I sprung (no pun intended) for the Bilsteins or Koni - but that will have to be my priority when these sh*t the bed.

This tool: http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_22_319&products_id=1685


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Ah, instead of that, I use an offset 22mm wrench + allen key. Good ol' Harbor Freight. I'll bring them over sometime.

http://www.harborfreight.com/8-piece-metric-offset-box-wrench-set-32042.html


Christ, $50 for the TT tool. :screwy:


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

redone17 said:


> That is the same "feel" I have - I am not 100% psyched about it (in fact the Lady HATES them and wishes she had two sports bras on every time we take it anywhere) - but they were cheap. I wish I sprung (no pun intended) for the Bilsteins or Koni - but that will have to be my priority when these sh*t the bed.
> 
> I got mine b/c they were cheap, but not too cheap. I'll buy the spendy parts when these are shot.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

redone17 said:


> That is the same "feel" I have - I am not 100% psyched about it (in fact the Lady HATES them and wishes she had two sports bras on every time we take it anywhere)


And now we know why Chris chose the GR2s...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

:laugh:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Also, I decided to put to use the Digi cylinder head I have collecting dust. The G60 head potentially needs more work than I can afford at the moment. I want to put to use the 270 cam, adjustable sprocket and lightened intermediate shaft. 

I'm going to look into getting the head cleaned and resurfaced (as well as pressure tested) and maybe getting the intake ported. 

While I am doing this I would really like to put in a new oil pan gasket. I'm not leaking a lot - again more like seeping (never have to top off or anything). Just gets messy down there. 

It was suggested I get a ECS Oil Pan Baffle With Gasket for an MK3. Anyone have experience with these? Seems like a great idea. (Thanks Steve): http://www.ecstuning.com/Volkswagen-jetta_III--2.0/ES260120/

I have head gasket, injector seals and cups, and have to go through a gasket set I have to identify what I'm missing for this swap. 

Where can I find a good rubber valve cover gasket? All the ones I have on hand are some sort of cork material. 

Do I use a CIS-e valve cover or the Digifant one?

Any suggestions or impressions with using this type of head and a swap in general would be appreciated. 

Cheers,
Chris


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

I used the update kit (second choice from top) when I replaced the VC gasket. You'll have to replace the studs in the head with the new parts, but it's worth the effort. No leaks, and the rubber make a better seal than the cork variety.

http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volkswagen/Fox/Engine/102/1


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Use the CIS cover.

As for the oil pan gasket, good luck . It's not like the transverse VWs where the pan can drop easily. Having the head off doesn't really make things easier in terms of changing that gasket. Might as well get an ABA block 

I'm sore the oil pan gasket leaks like crazy on my build.


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## dacolino (Jun 1, 2002)

The rubber valve cover gasket is sourced from a 90-92 corrado g60, or most of the places like german auto parts just list it as an option if you looked it up on the site. In order to do it right you need to replace the studs as well, the cork ones have little shoulders that support the gasket, where as the rubber gasket has metal rings around the holes and just a typical stud. Highly recommended, I do it on every 8v. 

Oil pan gasket...I also do this on every 8v. Again, I think GAP, other online sellers also list this as an option, and I believe its oem on 93-95 mk3 2.0l engines, or maybe even all mk3 ABA's. Just remember, when installing the baffle, the oil pump needs to come out and be reinstalled. After so, you will have to prime the oil pump, and then also reset your iginiton timing being you will be removing the distributor.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

thanks for the tips guys!

seems the oil pan gasket is more of a pain than it's worth at the moment - especially without a garage to do the work in...I guess there is a chance that oil is seeping from a different seal...

I'll plan to start with the top end...

What goes into removing the oil pan? Do I need to lift the engine - or just move the control arms? what about the transmission - that can stay bolted on?


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

When I did mine, I was able to disconnect the motor mounts and lift the engine with a floor jack. It gave me enough clearance to get the pan out. Unfortunately, I used a cheap gasket at the time and managed to strip two of the holes in the block so it still weeped after I replaced the gasket. It's not quite as hard as it sounds but was definitely more of a pain than a car with a transverse engine.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

so, no need to move control arms at all? that doesn't seem too bad.

now if only I could find an aluminum oil pan...


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> so, no need to move control arms at all? that doesn't seem too bad.
> 
> *now if only I could find an aluminum oil pan...*


That's going to be a needle in a haystack. Can't say I've ever seen a perf oilpan for an Audi 4k 4cyl....ever.

I wonder if they every made one, the clearance between the subframe and the oil pan is so thin at the back that aluminum might have been too thick. 

Besides, do you really want one? I would think the front would be very vulnerable to large road debris, kind of like the VW Mk4 tdi's were. Bust out your oil pan and your engine is toast.

I wanna see a picture when you find one! Good luck

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

yeah, I guess it's pointless/overboard. 

There were a couple of 3 piece ones for sale in the classifieds recently...

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...an-live-on-through-your-car.&highlight=speedy

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5578319-FS-Rare-oil-pan&daysprune=365

I think that baffle ECS gasket will work out nicely...now I just need to sell a few parts to justify the cost of the head swap...


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

QuantumSyncro said:


> That's going to be a needle in a haystack. Can't say I've ever seen a perf oilpan for an Audi 4k 4cyl....ever.
> 
> I wonder if they every made one, the clearance between the subframe and the oil pan is so thin at the back that aluminum might have been too thick.
> 
> ...


They were found on Audi 80 GTEs...










With the design of the subframe on a Fox and how well protected the pan is, I would feel comfortable running one. Better oil cooling and more capacity.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

doppelfaust said:


> They were found on Audi 80 GTEs...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's definitely better protected than the Mk4 but did we ever get the GTE in the US? I can't recall whether we got that model or not, nor have I found production figures for the GTE models.

I still say needle in haystack.

steve


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> yeah, I guess it's pointless/overboard.
> 
> There were a couple of 3 piece ones for sale in the classifieds recently...
> 
> ...


Wow, more common than I anticipated, and a very cool pan to have. I wasn't aware that those made it to this side of the world.

Does this pan increase capacity at all?

steve


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

No, not found in the US as far as I know. The last one I found was on eBay but it shipped from Lebanon, needless to say, I didn't purchase that one.

They seem to pop up from time to time and from what I understand definitely increase oil capacity. They're also baffled to help prevent oil starvation to the pump.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

doppelfaust said:


> No, not found in the US as far as I know. The last one I found was on eBay but it shipped from Lebanon, needless to say, I didn't purchase that one.
> 
> They seem to pop up from time to time and from what I understand definitely increase oil capacity. They're also baffled to help prevent oil starvation to the pump.


nice...increased capacity would definitely be a benefit!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

From Adam's Fox Site: _VW made a cast aluminum oil pan that will fit the Fox. It is made of three pieces, has baffles and cooling fins. The part number is 049 103 603E. It was used on the B1 Passat GLi and the Audi 80 GTe.
_
they are out there somewhere! :screwy:


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Nice looking piece, definitely one for the dream list!

I used the updated baffle + rubber gasket on mine and and have had a positive experience with it so far, I'd say go for it. Mine hasn't leaked (though I had the luxury of installing it with the engine on a stand).

Adding to doppelfaust's info on replacing the gasket, another way to do it would be to undo the two side motor mounts only, then remove the two front subframe bolts, loosen the rear ones a bit, and lower the front of the subframe while the car is jacked up (supported elsewhere other than on the subframe). Doing it this way would cost you some subframe stretch bolts, though.

Oh, and congrats on the new purchase! :beer:


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

alaincopter said:


> Doing it this way would cost you some subframe stretch bolts, though.


I have never heard that they're stretch bolts...really? I would never have suspected that the torque amount would be enough to stretch them.

steve


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

I didn't think so either, but I did read that they were in a couple of different places - I could have mistaken stretch for simply one-time use, though.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

alaincopter said:


> I didn't think so either, but I did read that they were in a couple of different places - I could have mistaken stretch for simply one-time use, though.


One time use I believe, the Mk2 subframe bolts are the same as lower control arm bolts and they aren't stretch.

Good to know though, for one time use I typically locktite if I'm really ambitious that day.

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Thanks all around. This is all great info! I am sure I will have a LOT of questions when I go to tackle this. I will start acquiring parts for this upgrade over the next month or so.

MKIV TDi Wagon Thread!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Today I got around to installing the AutoTech rear sway/torsion bar. The drilling was easier than I expected due to good bits - but getting the holes in the perfect spot - even though I checked and double checked - I still needed to widen them a bit. So much so - that one of the holes made the remaining metal at the edge so thin - I'm a bit worried about it. I plan to weld a little support there just in case. 

I also finally wired up the new headlight/fog light harness and relays! I still need to finish the fog light wiring to the cluster/switch - but the headlights have a significant increase in power. The wiring is pretty clean too. 










Unfortunately the selector shaft seal is still seeping :banghead:

Next time I have it on a lift - I'll have to spray it with that stuff again - and do it right with a generous 4-5 coats. It was difficult being squished under there with a lowered car on ramps.


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Glad to see the harness installed, Chris - looks like a clean setup. I might just order the same harness one day.

Hit me up if you need any help with the fog light switch wiring. Enjoying your new TDi wagon too, nice choice! Especially like the interior, beautiful


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## eurolicious (May 13, 2009)

Growing up in Brazil I always wanted a parati or a saveiro for myself once I turned 18 and could drive. This takes me back :thumbup::thumb up: and maybe one day I will be able to build a fox wagon into a parati or maybe bring over a saveiro!!

Great progress and fantastic job on bringing it back to live :beer::beer:

Thiago


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> Unfortunately my selector shaft seal was leaking. Not having the right tools (or knowledge) when we did the swap - we opted to leave it out. Old oil was over 2 quarts - figured it was fine.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Surprisingly when I went about to doing the conversion I remembered to replace the selector shaft seal and the engine rear main seal. Unfortunately I should have also replaced the front crank seal and I didn't...but I think I can get to that fairly easily without taking anything out!

Like you a little leak back there would drive me nuts.

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

you have to take the whole back end off the transmission to replace the selector shaft seal, correct? In turn, I'd have to take the whole transmission out to do that? :banghead:


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> you have to take the whole back end off the transmission to replace the selector shaft seal, correct? In turn, I'd have to take the whole transmission out to do that? :banghead:


Heavens no....you just have to take off the shift linkage, rubber boot and you can pry it out. At least that's what my audi 4k Bentley said...I think. Well that's what I did anyway...lol

I'll look in the 4k Bentley and see what it says when I'm across town. It might also have something in the Fox book too.

I'm fairly confident that no where does it say you have to take off the tail housing.

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

oh? I have the seal already...I will have to tackle this if that's the case. I guess I was under the assumption you either needed a special tool or to take the housing off the back...I will check my Bentley tonight as well...


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

:banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:


hahaha I'm sorry. That's great news then.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

The manual (Audi 4k) shows seal replacement with the tail housing removed (no selector shaft in the way) but I distinctly recall replacing it without taking it apart and I don't remember having any difficulty getting the old one out or installing the new one. Just remember to lubricate the seal before installing it.

Basically it's about the same as replacing the drive shaft seal on a diesel injection pump, and that can be done without dismantling the pump. If you don't have a hook tool that can lever the seal out you can make a tool out of an old scab screw driver. Here's some pics of the IP drive shaft seal removal, which is going to be very similar to the selector shaft seal situation.


























Oh and if you're doing this in the car park the front end downhill so there's no chance that your trans oil will come gushing out the back at you!

good luck

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

oh wow. I have to try this method...my dad has some ramps at the house and we'll be there all weekend. maybe I can get to it at one point over the next few days. Thanks Steve :thumbup:

I am hoping to squeeze in wiring the Fog lights up as well. Been putting this off for too long.

In other news - I am going to drop off the G60 head I got from JGWarner to a machine shop to have them give it a once over. FFE Racing in Deer Park, LI. Anyone have experience with them?

It started off as MK2 era counterflow big valve head that's German casting from a Corrado G60. It has been port matched, ported and polished. It has HD valve springs installed and a three angle valve grind.

Reason for Machine Shop:


pressure tested
It needs new valve guides. The person who ported the head shaved the guards way down, JGW suggested I just use tapered guides. 
2 manifold bolt holes are torn up, will need to be reamed, threaded and helicoiled. One cam stud is also stretched - but I have a new stud (thanks to novws!)
needs new lifters - thinking Light lifters from 99.5 - 02 golf/Jetta 2.0l AEG?

I plan to call TT and get the right parts to do the job. 



This will be going on along with an AutoTech 270 Cam, Neuspeed Adj Sprocket, a lightened intermediate shaft, and a G60 Valve cover (along with upgraded gasket).


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

redone17 said:


> This will be going on along with an AutoTech 270 Cam, Neuspeed Adj Sprocket, a lightened intermediate shaft, and a G60 Valve cover (along with upgraded gasket).


Keep in mind the G60 valve cover does not have a provision for our throttle cable... I am following what Regan did for his wagon and switching to a 16v Scirocco cable and making a hybrid TB so I have a spot for the throttle cable, WOT and idle switches.

Here is his thread...
http://forums.motivemag.com/showthread.php?4522225


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

redone17;79787409
[* said:


> needs new lifters - thinking Light lifters from 99.5 - 02 golf/Jetta 2.0l AEG?


http://www.autohausaz.com/search/pr...ts, Seals & Gaskets&[email protected] Lifter

Looks like VW switched to the newer lifters midway through 95 in the ABA.

the 309H is the one you're after I imagine. A little under $3/lifter extra. NBD. I didn't realize there was such a lifter upgrade when I bought my set years ago.

Also, I believe valves in the ABA and later have 7mm stems, vs 8mm stock. Not worth buying the valves new ($$$) but they're available for cheap from the junkyard. Since the JY scene sucks around NYC, maybe someone could pop some out sometime and ship them. If I had more time and done more research, I would have gone this route as well. You'd need the associated guides for the ABA (and retainers too?).


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I think I'm going to place an order from German Auto Parts - since they have the upgraded valve cover gasket. 

So I want the lifters from which? 
Jetta 3, 2.0L 8V, all '93-95:
http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volkswagen/Jetta/Engine/133/4

Or 

Jetta 3, 2.0L 8V, all '96-99:
http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volkswagen/Jetta/Engine/133/5

Heading to the machine shop in a few...I'll report back.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

As for the throttle cable issue - dacolino provided a bracket I can customize to hold the cable. I will be able to bolt it into the rear two valve cover studs on the driver side. I'll take pics when I am home.


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## j-boogie253 (Nov 30, 2009)

The lifters for the 96-99 are the lightweight ones

Jetta 3, 2.0L 8V, all '96-99:
http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volkswagen/Jetta/Engine/133/5


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

About $3 cheaper at autohausaz.com. Free shipping on orders over $50 every day. No tax.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Autohaus has the valve cover gasket - made by Victor Reinz - and for $1.50 less! Glad I checked! Thanks for the reminder ziddey. I always lean towards Autohaus - unless in in a rush for parts. GAP delivers next day for their standard ground shipping - which was free today for Oh So Black Friday. The Devil's Day. 

Dropped head off with Fabian at FFE - should have pressure test results back by Tuesday and we'll get a parts list together from there. 

I think I have everything except the valve cover gasket, lifters, manifold bolts and a timing belt. I always lean towards Continental - but the kit is SKF. Is SKF a decent brand?


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> Autohaus has the valve cover gasket - made by Victor Reinz - and for $1.50 less! Glad I checked! Thanks for the reminder ziddey. I always lean towards Autohaus - unless in in a rush for parts. GAP delivers next day for their standard ground shipping - which was free today for Oh So Black Friday. The Devil's Day.
> 
> Dropped head off with Fabian at FFE - should have pressure test results back by Tuesday and we'll get a parts list together from there.
> 
> I think I have everything except the valve cover gasket, lifters, manifold bolts and a timing belt. I always lean towards Continental - but the kit is SKF. Is SKF a decent brand?


I would bet that the SKF kit comes with a Conti belt. I don't believe SKF makes their own. I think the tensioner is prolly skf but the belt is not. It could also be a Roulunds 'rodrive' belt which I think is part of Conti industries now but also a very good belt. I think I'm running a rodrive belt on the TDI right now.

As for the lightened lifters, is there really a big benefit to running those later lifters? How will they stand up to the HD valve springs?

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

good question oh how they will stand up - it was just suggested by some people running a similar setup. I guess I will see what the guys at FFE have to say about that. 

thanks for the tip on the belts...

**fingers crossed** the machine shop comes back with some good news within the next 24 hours...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I'd be interested in using a 16V Scirocco Throttle Body (to alleviate the bracket issue) - but what if I don't plan on upgrading the ECU for a WOT switch? will it still work?

This could be a good solution to fixing my leaky idle adjust screw too


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> good question oh how they will stand up - it was just suggested by some people running a similar setup. I guess I will see what the guys at FFE have to say about that.
> 
> thanks for the tip on the belts...
> 
> **fingers crossed** the machine shop comes back with some good news within the next 24 hours...


Hopefully they have good news. Also, forgot to mention that Goodyear makes a good timing belt, and I believe it's still made here in the US.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

looks like I am able to get all the parts I need from AutoHaus for around $100, including lifters, valve cover gasket, intermediate shaft seal & o-ring, head bolts w/ washers, and timing belt kit. 

Only part I am not seeing they carry are the intermediate shaft bearings...

I am going to wait out placing the order until I hear back - and want to confirm which lifters I should pull the trigger on - only a $10 difference for all 4 - so, not a big deal. Any input is appreciated.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

redone17 said:


> looks like I am able to get all the parts I need from AutoHaus for around $100, including lifters, valve cover gasket, intermediate shaft seal & o-ring, head bolts w/ washers, and timing belt kit.
> 
> Only part I am not seeing they carry are the intermediate shaft bearings...
> 
> I am going to wait out placing the order until I hear back - and want to confirm which lifters I should pull the trigger on - only a $10 difference for all 4 - so, not a big deal. Any input is appreciated.


You need 8 lifters... you can run a 16v Scirocco TB and remove the throttle switches.

My plan is to use a G60 throttle body (with switches) and a Golf/Jetta 16v throttle body adapter. The throttle body on the 16vs is two piece with the oval portion separate from the throttle butterflies, I will just be using the oval adapter to connect to my G60 tb. I have two extra G60 tbs if you you want one. One is even missing the switches... you would just need to source the 16v adapter piece.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

only a $20 difference for all 8 :facepalm:

ha. thanks for the correction...so looking at $160 in parts

I'd take that TB off your hands - thanks for the offer.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

FWIW, http://www.autohausaz.com/search/pr... Seals & Gaskets&[email protected] Cover Gasket

there's a Continental VCG, but no required studs.

I'm imagining I'm running the VR VCG and probably have been using the same one for quite some time now. I think I "borrowed" it from my last Fox when it died, and have been reusing it since.


I wouldn't worry too much about the IM shaft seals, and especially bearings. I've never pulled the IM shaft out with the block in situ, but it _might_ be possible, if it were angled enough for the shaft to come out through the grill area (undo snub/tranny mounts etc)

Although did you have a lightweight/balanced IM shaft to use?

That's very cool you've found a nice shop. I might have to pay them a visit eventually..


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Interesting - that rubber VC gasket that's doesn't "require longer studs" I imagine that the G60 head has longer studs than a stock Fox head? Does a Corrado come with rubber from the factory? Maybe I just need the rubber then?


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Yeah, the upgraded gasket was originally used on the Corrado IIRC.

The studs aren't so much longer. Rather, they don't have shoulders; instead, they're built into the rubber valve cover gasket.

Some people find it a pain to swap the studs, and instead poke out the shoulders in the rubber gaskets. I've definitely started a thread when I first did it and could only get a few out. I wouldn't follow advice at the same, thinking it was too dangerous. Now, I see they were right, and I absolutely assault the old studs with a hammer. Works every time. Last time I did the swap, I didn't use any tools but a hammer :laugh:


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## j-boogie253 (Nov 30, 2009)

redone17 said:


> Interesting - that rubber VC gasket that's doesn't "require longer studs" I imagine that the G60 head has longer studs than a stock Fox head? Does a Corrado come with rubber from the factory? Maybe I just need the rubber then?


That rubber gasket *does* require the proper longer studs. Stock studs are shouldered and won't work with the rubber gaskets because the gasket comes with the shoulders built in. 

The stud kit required for the rubber gaskets are slightly longer and don't have shoulders

And ziddey is right. Don't think twice about the studs, do whatever to get them out! Hell I used vice grips on my stock studs to get them out


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

j-boogie253 said:


> Hell I used vice grips on my stock studs to get them out


That's what I did too. Worked for one stud but just mangled the rest. Tried the double nut approach first and got a handful. In the end, I posted for help on Craigslist and gave a guy $30 to whack the rest with a hammer :banghead:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

good news! the head is in good shape! pressure test came back positive. 

just placed an order for some parts. 

1 026103085D Auxilliary/Intermediate Shaft Oil Seal; 32x47x10mm 
1 026198025C Valve Cover Gasket Set; Rubber with Replacement Studs 
10 049103384B Cylinder Head Bolt; With Washer; 11x98mm 
8 034109309AD Hydraulic Lifter 
1 056109119AKIT Timing Kit 
1 N90353501 Timing Kit; O-Ring Front Seal; 56x2mm; At Countershaft/Balanceshaft


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Ahh, so you went with the regular lifters? 

VW uses the same seal for the cam/IM/front crank. That timing kit looks like it already comes with 2. 

If you're looking to replace the front crank one, you'd need a front carrier gasket, crank bolt, and faith that none of the oil pan bolts will strip the threads on the carrier :banghead::banghead::banghead: 

To change the IM shaft seals, you'll need to remove the IM shaft gear.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I have a Sabo gasket set at home - so I think I have that front carrier gasket in there - I will take a pic to confirm with y'all. 

I realized I need a few things from GAP anyhow (exhaust manifold gaskets & nuts, cold start gasket, throttle body gaskets, v-belt, oil filler cap for G60 cover) - and I am awaiting a call back from FFE Performance - to discuss the valves/guides. 

anyone ever use this camshaft baffle? 

crank bolt?? 

I am going to check w/ Fabian at FFE and see if he has oil pan bolts on hand...I'd think so. 

Getting this  windage tray gasket


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Why not reuse the one from your original head?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

the camshaft baffle? 

does it have one from the factory?? 

I don't remember one in the G60 head - but I guess the Fox head has one?


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Yeah take your oil cap off and shine a flashlight in there. Shouldnt be able to see your cam


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I'll do that! Thanks :thumbup:


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

ziddey said:


> Ahh, so you went with the regular lifters?
> 
> VW uses the same seal for the cam/IM/front crank. That timing kit looks like it already comes with 2.
> 
> ...


 Yes, be very careful of the front carrier, you don't want to strip those bolts out. Actually the same applies to the rear too. 

As for the camshaft baffle, you should have one already, if you don't someone forgot to put it back at some point. You should have one though it's good for keeping oil from flailing around. It's important because it keeps oil from attacking the low side of the valve cover gasket where it can eventually start to leak out. 

What's the difference between the G60 oil filler cap and the multitude of other VW/Audi oil fill caps? 

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Oh, nothing. I actually don't need one. 

The one on my Fox looks different than any I'd seen on a G60 valve cover - that I was just looking for that style - when I realized the cover dacolino sold me has one already. Ha. I could have sworn it didn't. 

Fox:









G60:


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> Oh, nothing. I actually don't need one.
> 
> The one on my Fox looks different than any I'd seen on a G60 valve cover - that I was just looking for that style - when I realized the cover dacolino sold me has one already. Ha. I could have sworn it didn't.
> 
> ...


 Ah yes, that cap, I have a new one of those somewhere. I end up switching caps sometimes just to be a lil different. 

You know I think my G60 valve cover has one like that...I'll have to look when I'm over there.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

so, the head is just about ready to be picked up... 

FFE is getting the head prepped for me to install by performing these tasks: 



pressure tested 

cleaned 

replaced 2 bent valves 

cut valves and seats to match 

replaced all valve stem seals 

reamed, threaded and installed all new exhaust studs 

removed valve cover studs (for upgraded rubber gasket) 

replace one stripped cam stud with new (provided - thanks again novws!) 

replaced old injector cups with new brass units (provided) 

 

I am just placed an order with GAP for a 16v throttle cable, CSV gasket, throttle body gaskets, v-belt, exhaust manifold gaskets and nuts - that should just about wrap up my parts list for this swap!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I'm going to paint that valve cover this weekend! 

I am thinking flat black - maybe with some reflex silver details? only because I have an OEM touch-up pen for the Jetta...I guess white details would go better with my theme...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I got my AutoHaus parts and I'm not too psyched about the contents of the SKF Timing Kit. I can't break the seal if i have any intention of returning - to see which is the German part - assuming the belt itself...









Thoughts?


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## woodardman (Sep 13, 2012)

??? Thats weird it has porteguise (i spelled that wrong?) lettering, but its made in sigapour an taiwan? But only one thing is made in germany


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

Was there a reason you went with the kit instead of individual pieces?

I have no idea what they mean by an "oil pump seal" in the break down of the kit. When done timing belts I've only changed the cam seal, intermediate shaft seal, front crank seal, tensioner and belt. When I priced those out individually they came to $25 or so...


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> I got my AutoHaus parts and I'm not too psyched about the contents of the SKF Timing Kit. I can't break the seal if i have any intention of returning - to see which is the German part - assuming the belt itself...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I wouldn't be excited about that either. 

My experience with autohausaz recently hasn't wasn't all that good, and I've asked them before where the parts were made and they just won't answer.

It's hard to know what the german part is....skf makes tensioner pulley and seals. I think it's hard to justify the price of the kit when it contains 90% parts manufactured by companies that whose name we don't recognize or companies that have farmed out their production to PRC.

As I said in another post somewhere I (and others) are not too thrilled with Meyle stuff produced in PRC and I wonder if Meyle isn't likely to be the next URO?

I'd send it back personally.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

yeah, but the individual tensioner is SKF as well...

rockauto has like 10 brands to pick from in terms of kits.

should I replace the bolt/nut?: http://www.germanautoparts.com/productdisplay/122154


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

searching those numbers w/o opening the box...

12724: transfer case seal
13709: camshaft seal
14125: timing cover seal
337042AA: tensioner 
T017: belt


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

Transfer case seal? Weird...

Camshaft, intermediate and front crank are all the same. I'd return that kit regardless, something seems hinky.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> yeah, but the individual tensioner is SKF as well...
> 
> rockauto has like 10 brands to pick from in terms of kits.
> 
> should I replace the bolt/nut?: http://www.germanautoparts.com/productdisplay/122154


Yeah, I think that's what I said about the SKF parts, tensioner and seals? :sly:

Anyway, not sure why this kit includes a 'transfer case seal' unless the kit applies to other vehicles as well and it's just easier to produce one kit...which sounds crazy but it's done frequently.

I don't think it's necessary to replace the bolt / washer. Sometimes I don't even replace the tensioner if it hasn't made any suspect noises. I have known people who replaced a perfectly good tensioner with a new one and the new one went south pretty quickly...food for thought.

Why not just buy the individual components and get the manufacturer you want for each item?

T017 is Gates numbering system, not sure if they make their belts in Singapore now or what. Same belt by Goodyear is a 40017.

steve


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

here's some info

Applications

1977-79 AMC Concord, Gremlin, Spirit w 2.0L engine
1988-90 Audi 80/90 with 2.0L engine
1980-83 Dodge Omni, Charger, 024 with 1.7L engine
1980-83 Plymouth Horizon, TC3, Turismo with 1.7L engine
1978-79 Plymouth Horizon with 1.7L
1977-82 Porsche 924 with 2.0L engine

This is besides the usual 'suspects' (VW with 1.7 and 1.8L engines)

TBK017P
DESCRIPTION PART NO. QTY.
Belt.............................................................. T017............................1
Camshaft seal............................................... 12724..........................2
Kit instruction sheet.................................... 457TBIS17P...............1
Seal installation sheet................................. ACC017.......................1
Tensioner (337042AA).............................. TBT11000..................1
Timing cover seal......................................... 13709..........................1
Timing cover seal......................................... 14125..........................1

I'd send it back, there's stuff in there you don't need and not enough of what you do need. You're paying for stuff that's not relevant to your car. You need three of the 12724 and this kit does not have it.

Order separately and you'll be better off.

my .02

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Yeah - bummed I jumped the gun here. 

Gotta look into returns/exchanges. 

I'd probably opt for the Goodyear or Conti belt. 

Thanks for the help guys.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

ahh not like it's an interference motor :laugh:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Yeah, it might be more of a pain and waste of $ than its worth to return it. So, I'm going to assume there are two seals in the kit - and I accidentally bought another - so...

The components AutoHaus have provided haven't let me down yet... but, yeah - try and call them and ask questions - they are no help at all.


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## bluetoes591 (Apr 3, 2009)

QuantumSyncro said:


> here's some info
> 
> Applications
> 
> ...


Those ARE the usual suspects! Guess what powers a Concorde, Gremlin, Spirit, Omni, Charger, Horizon. Yup you guessed it, Chrysler bought 1.7 and 2.0 motors from VAG. Same goes with the 924, VAG engine. Post 1983 Chrysler replaced the base VW engine with a Simca developed engine. The Horizon/Omni is in fact a European design, Simca (part of Chrysler Europe at the time) was originally responsible, but the North American switch to the Simca engine came rather ironically after Simca had been sold to Peugeot. Well optioned examples came with a 2.2 of Chrysler origins.

My car currently sports a Gates timing belt and tensioner from RockAuto TCK017. The belt is marked Made in USA, the tensioner I'm pretty sure was made in China.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Going to pick up the G60 head in an hour. I'll report back...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Fabian at FFE (Forced Fed Engineering - Deer Park, NY) took care of me. Stand up guy guy with tons of info and experience. 

Head was tested and cleaned. It was fitted with new valves and seals. It's now got new brass injector cups. Replaced the stripped cam stud and installed the longer valve cover studs as well as a new tensioner pulley stud/nut/washer. 

Dropped in new lifters and the Autotech 270 cam is installed with a new seal and torqued to spec. I need to pull the camshaft sprocket off the Digi head I have - since I don't have an extra cam bolt. 

Next I have to strip and paint the G60 valve cover (thanks dacolino) and prep and paint the new shiny BFI exhaust manifold (thanks KRAMMIT). I cleaned out and polished a Digi intake manifold and capped the extra little vacuum port. 

I'm going to be using that throttle body (thanks doppelfaust) combination mentioned earlier with an adapter along with a Scirocco throttle cable bracket (thanks PunchTheFish) and cable. 

I got a 16v ECU to wire up the WOT switch. Have to find some small spades or a harness connector for the switch. 

New gaskets, seals, studs, nuts and bolts are acquired - just need to get painting and another 50+ degree weekend to get this all installed. 

My last remaining question - What do I do about the breather hole in the valve cover?


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

You aren't going to run a crankcase breather? I would caution against that, you need some type of crankcase ventilation in there. 

If you're not going to use your OE vent attachment you should consider something like this: 










Is there a reason you're not pumping crankcase ventilation back through your intake? 

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

no no - I planned to use one - just unsure if the Fox one will work on the G60 or if there were aftermarket/upgrade options. Worded that poorly.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

which Buell model is that above?


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Awesome!! Got any pics of the ports showing the guides / combustion chamber? You said they put new valves in?? 

That's going to be a lot of fun  


That breather port looks similar to the one on the Fox 2, a hole instead of a nipple like on the Fox 1s. You should be able to get a grommet and plastic L piece from autozone. 

http://www.carpartsdiscount.com/aut...pcv_system/pcv_valve_grommet.html?3593=261078 

That's the grommet, although I'm curious why it's listed for the Fox 1. 

aside: http://www.carpartsdiscount.com/aut...cv_system/breather_hose_elbow.html?3593=54856 don't know how much I trust that but neat that it's still easily available. I chucked mine out a long time ago.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

what's not to trust?


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

durability of unknown brand rubber, especially since it's constantly subjected to crankcase fumes and heat from the engine.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

well, I am going to place an order for them - $18 shipped I can get both. I gotta check my rubber hose collection and see what sizes/lengths I will need for this swap.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Rock Auto also stocks them I think. May be more items you'd be interested in there. I wonder how much it costs at the dealership. I know I got a similar grommet for a Saab one time at the dealership and it cost $15. $%^$&%^&^&


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Rock Auto just has the Grommet and it's the same Dorman brand. I tried to find info on the breather elbow brand (RPM) without much luck... 

I know there are a few people that have run a G60 VC on a Fox, I need to read into some old threads and see what they came up with.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I like the look of this...









(pic courtesy of Adam's Fox page)


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

what are thoughts on switching out the fuel pump relay with a horn relay - or "removing the rev limiter" - seems like a worthy and easy way to take advantage of the sportier cam and ported head.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I am liking the idea of using this K&N Crankcase Vent Filters 

Though it seems the ID of the grommet is 0.641" Maybe using the Steel Base Crankcase Vent Filter with the metal tube is best - but 5/8" is too small and 3/4" is too large... 

http://www.knfilters.com/vent.htm 

Grommet has an OD of 1.158" - so, maybe going with this one makes more sense.


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## voxwagen88 (Dec 9, 2001)

The rev limiter can be removed on the CIS-E Foxes by replacing the fuel pump relay with VW Part Number 321 906 059F. 

As the guy at the parts counter said when I picked mine up. 
"Go blow up your motor." 

Seems like a better plan then the horn relay as it will still turn the pumps off. 

I think you will be grinning while driving the sportier Wagon that sucked you back in...


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

Looks like they are expensive through the dealer... Techtonics lists one though. 

http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_22_479&products_id=1022


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## novws (Dec 17, 2005)

doppelfaust said:


> Looks like they are expensive through the dealer... Techtonics lists one though.
> 
> http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_22_479&products_id=1022


 I don't even think you can buy a "Fox" fuel pump relay anymore. They just sell the relays that cut the fuel off later. 

Here's one for $23: http://www.germanautoparts.com/Volkswagen/Fox/Fuel/170/1 

IIRC, partgeek sells it for less than $20, but I am too lazy to go to their website.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> I like the look of this...


 Yeah, but hopefully not that box manifold....that thing has to have some weird turbulence inside it. 

Is there a reason you aren't going with the standard crankcase breather unit? I would think that would be fine, unless you're really set on the small breather filter. The only thing is that they can produce a lot of stink....and with cabin air intake not that far away you could smell it more inside. 

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Good call. I was going to ask what the advantage/disadvantage is over stock vs vent filter. I guess the only advantage I was considering is the ability to have options on case the no-name rubber is crap. 

Thanks for the input guys! Can't wait. Too bad it's in the 20s this week.

And, yeah - I was just talking about the G60 head and breather from that pic.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

oh, and ziddey - I'll take some pics of the ports showing the guides / combustion chamber - I will post them tomorrow. 

they did replace the valves - two of them were bent. I need to look into what size he used. I realize there is the option to use wider ones as opposed to stock...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

stock sized valves...should I have upgraded?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

picked up the Fuel Pump Relay w/o RPM limiter from Techtonics along with a few feet of Cloth 3.5mm Vacuum Hose 

:thumbup::thumbup:


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

https://www.autohausaz.com/search/product.aspx?sid=0i2l1t450n25haeu2xez1zr1&partnumber=028103500 

That's the one I bought and it fit my G60 valve cover perfectly.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

$1.84!? bummed I didn't realize I would need a solution for that when I placed other orders. 

paid $11 for shipping for two rubber parts that weigh a few ounces :banghead: 

doppelfaust - what's your plan for the breather?


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

redone17 said:


> $1.84!? bummed I didn't realize I would need a solution for that when I placed other orders.
> 
> paid $11 for shipping for two rubber parts that weigh a few ounces :banghead:
> 
> doppelfaust - what's your plan for the breather?


 I intend on using the stock breather setup. I'm using an ABA bottom end and plan on retaining the crankcase and valve cover breathers. I don't know how exactly I will accomplish that but I assume if VW designed it that way, it should probably stay that way. 

Oh, and I saw it mentioned earlier about valve size... since you have a G60 head you should have fairly substantial valves in there already. I wouldn't have went larger.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

doppelfaust said:


> Oh, and I saw it mentioned earlier about valve size... since you have a G60 head you should have fairly substantial valves in there already. I wouldn't have went larger.


 that's what I was thinking. I was unsure if they were already larger than Jetta/Golf/Fox valves. good to know. 

hoping this 20 degree weather is just for a week or so...I know we've been spoiled, but I am ready to finalize this part of the project. I guess I can start assembling the TB and bolt it onto the intake. it will keep myself occupied and feel like I am progressing somewhat. 

Would you guys suggest bolting the manifolds onto the head before dropping it on the block? seems logical. 

--- 

on a side note - I think I missed ONE last thing - the coolant flange to head. I will need a new o-ring - should I assume I will need a new flange? with or without sensor? I have a set of VDO gauges I eventually plan on putting in the cubby hole - but, I assume I need the sensor installed during the swap - even if I wire it at a later date. Or is this sensor just for the gauge in the cluster? 

GAP has what I need - but plastic flanges? 

Isn't there a flange of some sort connected to the back of the head as well? 

Should I plan for a new water pump too? 

So much for thinking I had acquired the final parts for the swap :banghead:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

also - Fabian mentioned priming the engine once I have it filled with oil - turning the ignition without the spark plug wires connected or the injectors in the seats - to get some oil moving around the engine a bit - before I fire it up for real. 

any input on this process?


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

redone17 said:


> on a side note - I think I missed ONE last thing - the coolant flange to head. I will need a new o-ring - should I assume I will need a new flange? with or without sensor? GAP has what I need - but maybe I can add to my Techtonics order before it goes out.
> 
> Isn't there a flange of some sort connected to the back of the head as well?
> 
> ...


 I wouldn't replace the flanges, keep the ones from your Fox head. Unless they're in rough shape... I know my Fox has one that is metal and the other looks to still be in good shape. I would definitely get new o-rings, they deform substantially when torqued to the head. 

As for priming the oil system... 
http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=634&products_id=1614


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

perfect! thanks for the quick response. I was able to add two seals and that tool to my order.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

You're looking for the fuel pump relay off a 5cyl Audi. In a 4cyl application, it effectively raises the rev limit beyond what you'd ever hit. https://www.autohausaz.com/search/[email protected] & Air System&[email protected] Pump Relay 
I know you already ordered from techtonics, so it's probably not worth canceling. Otherwise, it's never hard to hit the $50 needed for free shipping from autohaus  

I wouldn't worry about priming much if it's just the head in question. I didn't realize TT sold the tool, and "only" for $5. I would have definitely gotten that. Instead, I tried to use one of those gator sockets, but obviously didn't have any luck. I ended up pulling the fuel pump relay and ignition coil, and not installing the spark plugs. Then I just cranked the starter until the low pressure light went out and cranked some more, but that's not the best option. Again, for just the head, I wouldn't worry too much about it. If anything, add the oil directly over the cam and then install the valve cover. 

As for valves, the stock are fine. The upgrade would have been going with ABA valves. Usually, people would just grab some valves from an ABA from the junkyard, and get the appropriate valve guides. Buying new gets expensive. 

Use your original coolant flanges. They're metal, compared to the plastic garbage you can buy new. 

Sorry I didn't check autohaus for the grommet. I thought I couldn't find it last time I looked. 

You can definitely keep the stock setup. Or hook it direct to the intake manifold, or direct to the airbox port. When I drove my first Fox cross country, I "simply" had the port on the valve cover open. It sure stank, especially since I was trying to get better mileage by keeping the windows shut and using the vent. I used one of those dinky little filters, but it seemed too restrictive. Of course, this was based on idle conditions. It'd probably vent fine with higher pressure at higher rpms. Thing got soaked in oil right away, which didn't help at all. 

doppelfaust, I've also kept the ABA's block breather. The only issue is that the coolant hoses off the water pump are bent in a way that they really hug the block, so at least one of them will kink a little as it makes its way by the breather plastic. Don't think it'll cause any stress down the road, but something to consider. I haven't figured out what I want to do about my breather setup yet, so I just got some vinyl hose from Home Depot, and ran both the valve cover and block breather down to the ground below the air filter box. 


It is cold in Brooklyn right now.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

I have a dual outlet PCV I was planning on using off of the valve cover, I am trying to decide if I want to run that to a catch can or directly to the intake boot. 

The problem with stopping spark and fuel and cranking the motor is that you are still rotating all the parts. If you prime the engine by just turning the oil pump you should have good pressure to the lifters and have the oil properly circulated through the rest of the head and block. I am going to pick up one of those oil primers as well, since I know that the few engines I have built the lifters can be pretty angry until they get proper oil pressure.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

The OE vdo gauges for the center console are oil pressure, oil temp and amps, so the sender you need mounts to the oil filter stand. Make sure you have a filter stand that's tapped for the large sender. If you get a filter stand with the extra port you can always block it off with a bolt like they did on a lot of mk3 cars. 

As others have said reuse your flanges if they're metal. If they're plastic I would replace them, the plastic ones always seem to crack after they've been reinstalled, perhaps because of the heat of running them previously. The metal ones are significantly better and should be reused with a new o-ring. 

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

ok, reused metal flanges is what I am going to bank on. I am certain they were never changed/removed. 

I guess now is a better time than any to wire up these VDO gauges. I will have to double check which gauges I got - but if I remember correctly - those are the ones. 

I have to look into oil filter stand options. 

As for the water pump, from recent posts in other threads it's suggested I get a new one (w/ metal impeller) while I have the block emptied out - agreed? Block only has ~85k on it.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Will this MK3 Oil Filter Flange/Stand work?


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

The Fox's "filter stand" is specific to the Fox, so it can't be replaced with one from a MK3. You'll need to tap your filter stand for your sender unit per Banned wagon's instructions.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

ah, yes. I had that thread bookmarked. 

alright - so, a few senders and a water pump - I see the finish line.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

redone17 said:


> ah, yes. I had that thread bookmarked.
> 
> alright - so, a few senders and a water pump - I see the finish line.


 Until you decide to replace your bottom end.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

NO! :screwy: 

Seeing a lot of options in terms of brands for water pumps. What's the consensus? 

I found a German made ANNEX-TECHNIK for cheap. Never head of them.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

doppelfaust said:


> The Fox's "filter stand" is specific to the Fox, so it can't be replaced with one from a MK3. You'll need to tap your filter stand for your sender unit per Banned wagon's instructions.


 Wasn't suggesting replacing with mk3, it will not fit. The only thing I suggested was using the mk3 style torx bolts to cap unneeded ports or a port you needed to tap for a later oil press / temp sender for vdo gauges. 

The Fox stand is not specific to Fox, the quantum / 4k B2 models share the same filter stand and since we know that the 4k's often had gauge clusters in the console...some more gauges than others, it would be preferable to obtain a stand from a 4k that was already tapped for and may include the correct sender for press/ temp. That's the easiest route that I know of at any rate. 

just a clarification of sorts 

As for water pump the one thing I've read about with regard to that is always get one with a cast impeller versus plastic. A German pump would be desirable also in my book. 

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

QuantumSyncro said:


> Wasn't suggesting replacing with mk3, it will not fit. The only thing I suggested was using the mk3 style torx bolts to cap unneeded ports or a port you needed to tap for a later oil press / temp sender for vdo gauges.


 
yeah, I re-read your previous post and realized what you were saying. my fault. thanks for the clarification and the input. 

--- 

GRAF water pump seems promising too - found another good price shipped and it's the same as AutoHaus has... 

metal impeller is a must!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I went with ANNEX-TECHNIK - read up on them a bit and seems like a solid German company that's been around for longer than my parents (and their CEO is a Doctor) :laugh: 

...and for $35 shipped w/ housing and seals - can't beat that.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

There is a 3 angle valve grind and some porting done. I tried to get a few shots - but need better lighting. 

































































Adjustable Sprocket that I wish was a different color - but was cheap.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

A three angle grind refers to the way the seats are ground for the valves, it doesn't have to do with the porting done on the intake and exhaust ports. The puppy definitely had a serious port and polish done though... 

Here is a visual aid for the "valve job."


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

ah ha! schooling me every day. thanks steve :thumbup:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

too good to be true - dude's inventory was wrong and they sold out of that particular water pump. ended up getting the GRAF (made in Italy) for $43 shipped - anyone have experience with these?


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## j-boogie253 (Nov 30, 2009)

redone17 said:


> too good to be true - dude's inventory was wrong and they sold out of that particular water pump. ended up getting the GRAF (made in Italy) for $43 shipped - anyone have experience with these?


 Graf is a good pump for VW's. I used to sell tons of Graf pumps for VW's when I was in auto parts. Never had one come back. This was in '04 and '05 so hopefully they still hold the same quality. Graf would be one of my top choices for sure


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

:thumbup::thumbup: 

same one that AutoHaus sells for $57, so I'm happy.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

I think I mentioned it earlier, but I remember reading once that you'll want to get the upgraded gasket and throw the one that comes with the pump away. Might be getting confused with a Volvo water pump I did recently


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I saw that some of them come with a paper gasket - that seems so dumb considering its a WATER pump. I'll look into it. From the pictures it looks like a black rubber seal - but who knows. 

Thanks for the reminder :thumbup:

Going to pick up my VDO gauges from my old apartment on Saturday - see which senders I have to order.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

http://www.autohausaz.com/search/[email protected] System&[email protected] Pump Gasket 

Goetze more like goatse.cx 

yeah I just checked my old order and it looks like I got the Graf unit as well. So if memory serves right, it comes with the regular gasket


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

oooh. it's metal. 

add another part to the list :banghead: 

or a few... 

thermostat seal, oil filter stand gasket...what else? 

I know you guys can come up with something!


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## j-boogie253 (Nov 30, 2009)

Get 2 of those thermostat seals. 

I'm not sure if your pump came with a rubber o-ring but the thermostat o-ring and the pump housing outlet o-ring are the same. So when you do the pump you just need to order two thermostat o-rings


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

looks like the pump has two o-rings included - one of those is for the thermostat? I am going to get a couple anyhow - just to play it safe - they are $0.97


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## j-boogie253 (Nov 30, 2009)

OOH...Page 6! 



redone17 said:


> looks like the pump has two o-rings included - one of those is for the thermostat? I am going to get a couple anyhow - just to play it safe - they are $0.97


 :thumbup:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

yeah, and there has just been a whole lot of jabber from me and not much *build*ing - progress will commence soon! I am antsy.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

We got so far off topic I don't even know what your original plan was anyways... 

So, you're doing a head swap, new TB, and what else?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Haha. A few things here and there. 

Picked up the gauges:









As expected - oil pressure and voltage - but, water temp?! Isn't that in the cluster already - albeit not as precise. I guess there is a oil pressure light too. Oil temp gauge would be more desirable. 

I have a plate (though I'd have to figure out how to mount it in the cubby hole) and an oil pressure switch/sender.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

D'oh. Seems that sender is only 5 bar. 

 p/n: 035-919-561


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## j-boogie253 (Nov 30, 2009)

redone17 said:


> As expected - oil pressure and voltage - but, water temp?! Isn't that in the cluster already - albeit not as precise. I guess there is a oil pressure light too. *Oil temp gauge would be more desirable*.
> 
> I have a plate (though I'd have to figure out how to mount it in the cubby hole) and an oil pressure switch/sender.


 I do believe I have an extra in that exact style. We could trade, as I would be interested in the coolant temp gauge 

That gauge plate looks like the ones JGWarner was making. He gave me one when I bought his steering wheel. If that is the same one, installation is super easy. You may need to round some corners a little bit though


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Picked up the snowflakes finally. Plan to use these with snow tires next season since I'll have 10.1" brakes by then (therefore the 13" Yokohama Ice Guard and black steelies will be up for grabs in the next month or two - practically new). 










They should clean up nicely. No curbage at all: 

































Also picked up a set of gold tarantulas (that I have no use for - so they are up for grabs for cheap - they were just part of the deal) 


Also, sold the Konig/Yokohama set. All in all a good day for wheels :thumbup:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

j-boogie - I'll probably take you up on that offer! Let me research prices on senders/sensors.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Snow tires in Brooklyn??? Not a lot of faith in Bloomberg :vampire:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

There's like an inch of salt on every road of NYC right now. It's absurd. 

Thankfully it's not 0*F anymore.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Is this what I'm looking for? This will work on the Fox? Audi 4000 flange with oil cooler and gauge sender. The mating surface looks the same. 

http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n509/zolykk/IMG_3152_zpsd4077169.jpg 

http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n509/zolykk/IMG_3151_zps82cc9e88.jpg 

http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n509/zolykk/IMG_3153_zps40127dd3.jpg


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Don't think you'd be able to fit the cooler. The filter stud/pickup/what-you-call-it needs to be swapped for the shorter stock cooler-less one.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Yeah, I was concerned about the cooler...ah well.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Starting to take care of a few things I can do indoors in preparation of the head swap. 

Got the GRAF water pump as well as the upgrade metal/rubber gasket. The gasket that came with the housing seemed rubber to me - but having the upgrade - I took it apart anyhow. 










It's definitely not paper - I'm not sure if the unit I got is NOS and they recently changed over to cheaper materials - I guess it's useless - but I'll hold onto the orig anyhow. 










Upgrade gasket:

















Assembled w/ all bolts torqued to 15 ft/lbs:









Tomorrow: assemble throttle body components. 

I couldn't start the Fox today. That 20w50 ain't working out in this weather. It wouldn't turn over. I gotta dump what I can tomorrow and replace with some room temp 10w30 and hope it will be enough to get things flowing. I have been neglecting it a but and haven't driven it much at all the last couple of months. Needs to stretch it's legs.

Hibernating Fox:


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

Looks like a good water pump, and the metal / rubber gasket is a much better choice but it looks like the one they included with the pump was decent, much better than the super thin paper gaskets.

You're right, 20w50 is not a good winter choice. I run 15w40 and that's bad enough but I use the block heater a lot.

steve


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Haha how old is your battery? I've started my old Fox2 with 20w50 as low as 2*F (yeah I really didn't care much for that car then). It sure wasn't happy, but Digifant is a remarkable winter starter (perhaps the only compliment)

I didn't realize you got the water pump with the housing. The pump-only version probably comes with the lousy gasket then.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I usually don't run 20w50 in winter - but because I planned the head swap and have only put a few hundred (maybe 1k) miles on it since the last change - I was trying to wait it out and not waste the $ on the oil. But now I need to move my car due to street cleaning tomorrow and there's an in of snow on the ground :banghead:

Hoping enough will drip out that it will turn over w/ the room temp 10w30. I'm sure I could use a new battery too. I've been putting that off with hopes of relocation (awaiting doppelfaust's how-to for a wagon). This isn't a battery issue though - the starter is trying its hardest. Do you think I've caused damage turning the key a few times? Sure hope it's not flooded. 

I'm planning to remove the lower portion if the back seat anyhow - making the back area have permanent haul status. I figure the battery can just go on the floor if the passenger side behind the front seat. I want to build a nice indestructible platform by cutting some sort of board or plywood and covering it with a rubber or durable fabric.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

10w30 is in and the Wagon seems much happier. I did need a jump - so, likely my battery is at it's end. But, it turned over nice and easy and I could tell the engine appreciated the thinner oil. I've been neglecting it and only moving it from one side of the street to the other for the last two months. 

Started messing around with the throttle body setup. I need to clean some parts up a bit more before mating them with the gaskets and all - but wanted to make sure everything fit together nicely. 

Here is the Digifant intake with the G60 throttle body on the left - the 16v TB and the adapter and bolts that I needed from it to fit the Fox intake boot on the right:









Should have taken a picture of it before I started scraping it off - but the old gasket is caked on there good (I'll be sure to take a picture of it once it's all cleaned up):









I don't like how the WOT switch is pressing against the vacuum hose on the back of the intake. Not sure what to do about this. doppelfaust - have you found a solution for this?









Otherwise it will fit nicely:









Have to tap the holes for the cable bracket - as well as source some bolts:


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

That's weird. I'll try to take a picture of the Fox2 throttle body tomorrow. The plug doesn't interfere with any vacuum ports. Maybe you could get by with a different bracket or just have it free floating / ziptied down somewhere.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

Looks like good progress, yeah 20w50 never works out too well in the winter.

As for the battery issue I'm sure that if you ran it a little longer the battery wouldn't drain so much, and as for maintaining the charge I suggest wiring in an alternate 12v power point or converting the lighter socket to constant power and getting yourself a VW solar panel charger. I have three and have used them over the years to maintain charge on batteries / vehicles / motorcycles that I don't use often enough or have stored. Hook them up and lay the panel on the dash or suction cup to a window and you're good to go. At one point I was experimenting to see whether I could charge the cell phone with them...lol.

steve


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

I don't see why you couldn't just bend the bracket the connector attaches to, that will probably be my solution...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

yeah, not a bad call - bend it out so it runs horizontal. guess I didn't put much thought into it - I was kinda watching a movie at the same time 

I should have some time to clean this all up and bolt it together tonight - I will report back with photos :thumbup:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Got some steel wool to clean up the TB parts and mating surfaces. 

Before:

























After:









































As doppelfaust suggested - I just bent the WOT bracket a bit to fit the vacuum hose under it:

















But I need to replace this pressure hose (037 129 724 5) - hoping I can find a new one or the one in the Fox is in better shape:

















Had a little trimming of the rear gasket to do where there is a bit of a notch:

















Gasket (x2):

















Looking good!


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Sweet! Since you're switching to a full blown CIS-E ECU, you could switch out the AAR / idle boost valves for an ISV  bzzzzzzzzzz


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

What's that? 

It's a Frankenstein CIS-E intake:
Corrado G60 Throttle Body
MK2 16v Intake Boot Adapter
MK2 16v ECU
Scirocco Cable and Bracket
Fox II Digifant Intake Manifold


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

seems that hose is NLA :banghead:

I guess I can just use standard hose that size, but it looks slicker with the exact bends.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

redone17 said:


> seems that hose is NLA :banghead:
> 
> I guess I can just use standard hose that size, but it looks slicker with the exact bends.


https://www.partswebsite.com/1stvwparts/oemparts/volkswagen-157/0371297245.html

Usually if they are NLA it won't show them but maybe you're right? It's certainly worth a shot if you really want to replace that hose...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

yeah, I tried them - they are my usual go to if my dealer buddy can't see any in his system. Zeb says they are OBSOLETE.

not really stressing it. I will take a look at the one in my Fox currently - as well as the rest of the vacuum hoses involved with this swap - may have to just use some standard rubber hose along with the few feet of braided stuff I got. 

next weekend looks like 50s!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

question for you guys - was interested in a low temp fan switch - but all I ever see are the ones for A/C cars - can I just pull the extra prong out? or just use it as is?


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

Is that big storm going to miss you?

Honestly, I don't see the benefit to the low temp fan switch unless you're running some large power adders like a turbo where you are producing a lot more heat or using the car for something it wasn't intended for, like autocross/drag/track. In that instance, you would probably run a lower temp thermostat as well. I think these motors have a "happy temperature" and it is slightly warm. I've never seen any empirical data that shows lower operating temp helps performance or efficiency.

If someone has information to the contrary, I would love to be proved wrong.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Perhaps it'd help with oil life? Wasn't that the issue with the recent sludge motors of the late 90s / early 2000s? High temperatures for emissions purposes resulting in premature oil breakdown and sludge buildup?

As for the fanswitch, you should be able to use an AC one just fine. Match up the fanswitch with the appropriate thermostat.

Snow doesn't look too bad over here. How're you doing, Chris? Friends in MA are having fun today-- driving ban still in effect :facepalm:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I *think* I am using the low temp thermostat already. Pointless w/o the corresponding switch?

I guess it is a bit excessive. Just assumed cooler engine is a happy engine.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> I *think* I am using the low temp thermostat already. Pointless w/o the corresponding switch?
> 
> I guess it is a bit excessive. Just assumed cooler engine is a happy engine.


Engine needs to achieve a certain temp to be efficient, and needs to maintain that temp. Within a certain range you're fine, but too low can be a problem. Generally the 195F (87c) thermostat is standard and good. Only reason to run lower thermostat is if you live in a very warm climate or use your vehicle for towing.

The sludging issue with the late 90's early 2000's 1.8T engines (resolved in 2004?) was also due to smallish oil pan capacity as well.

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Just picked up a set of these:









Two are like new, one has some very slight curbage and one has some scratches in the clear coat. Shouldn't be too much work to get the other two cleaned up. 

Looks like my Fox is undergoing a change of plans in terms of color details. 

This guy also has a possible hook for me to get a set of tan GTI seats...


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## Oldsoul (Nov 13, 2012)

Nice wheels! Those are my favorite. 
Did you get your guages installed yet? I have a similar set waiting in a box, in the trunk, till I figure out where to mount them. I can't seem to figure out a clean spot to put them without losing my radio or heater vents...?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Thanks! I am excited about them. I need to find 1 or 2 more clean/like new ones to make an immaculate set. 

I haven't dealt with the gauges yet - plan on tackling that with the head swap - which reminds me - I need to look into senders still. 

Today I started cleaning up the G60 valve cover - getting it ready for paint. I need one more round of removing the last little bits of paint. I need some heavy duty pipe cleaners to clean out all the holes. A little engine cleaner underneath is necessary too. 

Before:









Stripper applied:

















3 rounds later:









I noticed the mating surface has some indentations from a previous rubber gasket. I assume I should sand/grind that down a bit until smooth?









Next: exhaust manifold gets a few coats of POR-15 Black Velvet


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## Oldsoul (Nov 13, 2012)

I'm no pro but id GINGERLY sand down the high spots. 
Lookin forward to seeing how your por 15 turns out. That stuff is rad


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

have you considered black "wrinkle finish" , I love the look of it.

you will have some difficulty keeping the paint from peeling due to Aluminium being a material that absorbs oil. 

Powdercoating may be an option to consider.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I have - I think I'm just going matte black with glossy Flash Red details to match my new wheels. 

I'm thinking of just using the same POR-15 for the VC as well. It seems super durable and withstands heat. I plan on taping off the edges - so hopefully oil will never touch the painted surfaces.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Getting quotes around $125 per wheel to refinish - not *too* bad. Have to touch base with my body shop's rim guy.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I just got my head wrapped around the Eastwood/POR-15 products I got in preparation of painting these parts. Decent project. Got the VC stripped last night - but when I start using the Eastwood Etch and Pre - I gotta be ready to tape off and paint. So, don't think I'll start tonight - need a full day and 2nd coat the next 24 hrs. I'll shoot for this weekend.

Just ordered a 12oz can of 1992-1996 Volkswagen Cabriolet LP3G Flash Red Aerosol Touch Up Paint for any details I'd like to match the teardrops.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

valve cover and exhaust manifold painting goes down this weekend. stay tuned for photos!

I ordered a Febi German made Oil Pump and longer bolts to mount it. Figured while I have the oil pan dropped - might as well. Found the pump for $45 - seems like cheap insurance.

Found this while looking through the Corrado parts on GAP - seems like exactly what I need to connect the WOT to the ECU:









Ordered all the senders I need from 42 Draft Designs (oil temp, oil pressure and water temp).

Picking up a case of Brakleen and Motor Oil tomorrow. It looks like the head swap will commence next weekend. It's supposed to be in the 50s and clear!










I am going to rent an engine hoist to do the bottom end work (oil pan gasket/pump, etc). Found a couple of places that range from $35-50 per day. Seems like a worthy investment.


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## VR6 Rage (Jul 19, 1999)

This looks like one heckuva build! :thumbup:


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## 89fox_^ (Apr 5, 2011)

redone17 said:


> Getting quotes around $125 per wheel to refinish - not *too* bad. Have to touch base with my body shop's rim guy.


Not bad down here they charge me 120 to refinish my p-slots powder coated silver & black, btw love what you're doing good luck with everthing


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Nice score on the seats, Chris - and everything else is looking real good, too :thumbup: 

As for the connector for the WOT switch plug, if memory doesn't fail me, it's similar to the one that plugs onto the distributor, and also the same that goes to the potentiometer on the FD.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Thanks Alain! Coming along. Should see some nice progress over the next few months. 

Did some painting this weekend:

The manifold had a dusting of rust - plus I wanted optimal adhesion:

















...so, started with a coat of Eastwood's Fast Etch then one last cleanup with their PRE - read for paint:

























I used Black Velvet (made by POR-15) - looking good:

















Some final clean up on the VC. Lightly sanded the mating surface and sprayed down with PRE to remove any grease:

















I used VHT Flame Proof Flat Black again:

















I have to wait 7 days for those two coats to cure. Ordered a can of Flash Red for some details to match the Teardrops and found a can of Satin Clear VHT Flame Proof for a final few coats :thumbup:

I'm thinking eventually I'll give the Timing Belt Cover the same treatment.


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## Oldsoul (Nov 13, 2012)

Dead sexy... Good work!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Thanks!

Forgot to mention HOW I painted the manifold. I didn't have a great experience painting POR-15 on the calipers with a foam brush. Looking for an inexpensive spray solution that wouldn't require a compressor and hundreds of dollars of equipment (which I'd like to invest in one day - but not with a wedding and baby on the way) - I found this! For $16 Eastwood offers a Spray Tool Kit that is essentially canned air and an empty container for paint. Mimicking an airbrush - this seemed like a perfect option...and it was. 









Mixed 8 parts paint to one part POR-15 Solvent:









I was extremely pleased. The kit comes with 3 nozzles - normal, low and high velocity. The normal seemed to work for this application. I plan on stripping and repainting the calipers this looks and worked so well.


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## vwbunny (Mar 11, 2004)

What about the POR did you not like?


Sent from my iPad


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I loved everything about the product - highly suggested - just needed a way to spray it. This is the perfect solution. If you want a nice clean evenly distributed cover - spray is the way to go. Their caliper paint is really thick - so, I'm leaning towards this same process - but probably using the high viscosity nozzle.


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## vwbunny (Mar 11, 2004)

Got it. I have always loved their products. :thumbup:


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

How'd it go today?

When you're done with *ziddey*, can you send him my way? I need help with a tranny swap...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

It's going. Didn't actually start until 12:30p - so lost some daylight - but we'll be back at it bright and early. Decided to tackle the bottom end first and it's taking longer than expected. Got a hoist so that made it easier to get the oil pan off - but there have been a few setbacks. 









One of the oil pan bolts will not thread in straight. No idea why. They all came out easily - some a little TOO easily. Thinking we may just get a thinner bolt and use a nut on the other side as to not strip a bolt. Otherwise I did just get a tap/die set - just but certain what size and if I want to take the chance. Thoughts?

Other tips! You have to install windage tray BEFORE oil pump - THEN pan. 









More updates tomorrow! Still have a LOT on our plate for one day of sunlight. Hope we can get it up and running before dark.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

I love that headlight setup Chris... If I wasn't so attached to my stock setup I would definitely go that route.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

We got a lot done today - but need one more day - or a few hours. Looking at Wednesday or Thursday. 

Finishing the oil pan proceeded to be a pain in the arse. It took forever to get all of the bolts going in straight. Not sure if it was the rubber gasket or what - but I finally got them all to sink. It was an exciting moment. All torqued and ready to proceed with the head swap:








(one of these things is not like the other - one went MIA)

Old water pump:









New water pump mounted:









Tapped the preexisting holes in TB w 6mmX1:

























Overall there was minimal sludge and everything was in considerably great condition for a 25 yr old car. But then we noticed this: Is thus a blown head gasket?

























Head mounted and torqued:









We got a bit further than this - but I'll save some photos for once it's all put together.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Alright - I'll share a WIP photo!


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## denver_fox (Oct 15, 2011)

Looking sexy! Very interested to hear your thoughts on the butt dyno.:thumbup:

Whats going on with your dipstick? Methinks you need a fox2 dipstick with a REAL handle.

You should paint a little red fox on top of your intake to really set off the whole red vibe! Red spark plug wires too would look awesome.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I got some Flash Red rattle can - I plan on adding some red details here and there. Was thinking of painting the negative space of the VW symbol and the recessed lines along the sides of the top face of the VC...

I'll may be cleaning up the timing belt cover as well - debating on whether it will go back on.

You got a digi dip stick laying around? I'd take one if so...

Bay/Engine needs a serious cleaning. But, first I need to get it running.

Ran into a few of these: :banghead:
- transmission mount bolt spins in place. It's all the way in and mount is tight - but...
- one of the exhaust manifold studs spins - I gotta call the machine shop that worked on the head - because they installed those studs and should have taken notice...
- one of the studs in the exhaust manifold (to downpipe) needs to come out - it seems the stud itself threaded passed the middle point and is not closing the gap 100%. 

otherwise everything is going pretty damn smooth, I must say.

---------------

I just ordered a gasket for the airbox/distributor. I got a SUPER clean setup from California. It's in FANTASTIC shape. unfortunately USPS didn't handle the package with care and the plastic top of the airbox part is broken on one of the corners.

So, now I have to order a gasket to attach my current airbox...MK1 Autohaus makes a rubber gasket reproduction w lifetime warranty - seems the way to go! esp for $18!


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Anyone have any input on retorquing head bolts? I can't remember the brand head gasket Chris got, but the directions it came with said to retorque after initial warmup, and then again after some miles. I've heard of people doing this, but thought it was technically against the mantra of TTY bolts? I believe the Bentley makes no mention of retorquing, and neither did any of the brands of head gaskets I've used in the past. That said, I've reused head bolts many times before and never had a case of a "stretched" one, so I'm sure it'd be "fine." Chris, it may be worth asking this in the 8v section. I'm curious what WaterWheels and the rest of them would say about this..


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

NO re-torquing required - as suggested by WaterWheels post to my thread in the 8v section. 

Glad we asked.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

lmao :sly:

were those the head bolts that were "loose"?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

thanks for that :thumbup:

meant to elaborate. The guys over at 8v may have some input as well. I will copy over there.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Fox Wagon x G60 is up an running! Sort of.

- Exhaust/Downpipe studs/nuts are all set. No leaking at all!
- still need to get a hose/elbow for PCV to airbox
- still need to swap in 16v ECU and wire up the WOT
- deleted idle boost valve and all of it's lines (looks clean - meant to be temporary...but we'll see)
- NOTE: if you are using BFI exhaust manifold - the two ports that usually hold your hot air hose/shield - need to be plugged with 8mm studs! I was bugging out that there was a major exhaust leak...ended up taking a few downpipe studs from the old manifold
- I need an Accelerator Cable Bushing/Grommet.

Camshaft, Intermediate and Crank are all in time. Ignition time set same as it was previous to this work - about 8 degrees before TDC. Here it stuttered so badly it was not drivable.

Set the ignition/distributor to ear and now timing is showing 30 degrees BTDC! It's starting somewhat instantly. Idle just above 1k. There is currently a slight stutter accelerating/opening throttle which is indicative of late timing/lean condition - but it's drivable and at it's best running condition. We took it for a spin. Unfortunately only got it into 5th once (Brooklyn rush hour :banghead. We noticed that stopping at a light idle revs at 1500 and then dips down to 1100. 

Stumped! What would cause a need for excessively advanced ignition timing?! Mixture seems to be fine - DPR oscillating around 10mA - nothing wild. O2 sensor is working. 

Distributor busted?


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

I struggled to get the timing belt on my car this afternoon. The problem I had was this: When turning the belt tensioner, the tightening of the belt would turn the crankshaft. I've been driving the car for months wondering why it was driving "flat". It was the mechanical timing.

After you've checked the timing marks before you tighten the tensioner, check them again. I guess I took the belt of 10 or more times before I got it right.

I hope this helps!


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

How will you connect the crankcase vent with the G60 valve cover. I have one in storage waiting to put on the fox. What kind of throttle bracket did you use?


Nice work so far.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

I've always had to take off the timing belt and re-time multiple times whenever I've done the job. However, Chris held the IM sprocket in place this time while I got the belt on the cam sprocket. After tightening the tensioner, we spun the crank around by hand and verified that everything still lined up. I've never been too confident in judging when the notch in the crank pulley lines up with the dot on the IM sprocket, and have always relied on the flywheel mark for TDC... The assumption was that there was no mark on Chris's lightened flywheel, but we later found out it does have one...

It does now sound reasonable that the cam sprocket is retarded one tooth. 44 teeth, so that's 8.2 cam degrees, or 16.4 crank degrees. Considering we're "seeing" the ignition timing at 29*BTDC, it'd actually be 12.6*BTDC, which would be OK if not a tad too advanced.

Chris, do you have a 19mm 12-pt socket / wrench? Turn the crank clockwise until you get the cam lined up. Since there are indeed flywheel marks, check how things line up. There are actually two marks on the flywheel: TDC and 6*BTDC. It's just impossibly hard to see because of the orientation of the distributor, having the vacuum canister block the view-hole on the bellhousing.

If the TDC mark on the flywheel lines up (likely to be O|T), then the cam is indeed actually in time. Otherwise, you'll have to re-time everything. Or if your adjustable cam gear offers 8* of adjustment, you could just compensate for it there (although you'd lose on any further potential advance).

I had figured that having the cam retarded one tooth would just result in flat performance down low (I always assumed my old 85 gli had the cam retarded a tooth. It was anemic down low and then exploded up high and seemed to pull forever. Completely calm idle though, so I assumed the cam was stock.). But it can cause stuttering?? Unless it's actually somehow off by two teeth (I've never had that happen before...), in which the ignition timing would still be at 3.8*ATDC. Has too much power down low for the cam to be retarded that much though???

That said, I only have a passenger's perspective on the current state of things, and it's been close to a year since I last drove my Fox... But it seems fine down low past the initial stutter (which I know most familiarly from late ignition timing or lean mixture).

What's a good paint / marker to use on the flywheel? Chris, you really need to mark the TDC line on the flywheel. Way too hard otherwise. Might not be a bad idea to pull the distributor, turn the oil pump a bit, adjust the distributor accordingly, and drop it back in. Get it so the vac canister doesn't obstruct view of the flywheel, and the hall sender plug doesn't interfere with anything. It seems like someone yanked it out in the past and didn't put it back in properly. Ideally, you want the unit to be rotated clockwise more. Currently, the hall sender plug hits the engine when you're somewhere in the high 10's / low 20's BTDC (not that you'd ever be setting it that advanced anyway..). Of course, this is assuming your cam timing is retarded, and you're not actually at 30*BTDC. No way in hell the car would be able to start with that much advance.

Kind of an unfortunate revelation. I didn't consider it earlier since we "verified" everything was in time.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

wow. alright - this all makes sense. I am not sure about that socket - I have to check. 

I probably won't get to look into this until Sunday. 

what goes into changing the front seals (Intermediate and Crank)? I have a feeling I will have to tackle this during the next oil change...


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

Thinking about it all again, when aiming the timing gun at the cam mark, we saw 29*BTDC advance. At the same setting, when aiming at the flywheel, it seemed to line up with one of the marks as well, which shouldn't have happened if the cam were off time, since adjusting the timing light to the flywheel would show true ignition timing, regardless of cam timing... Verify TDC on the flywheel and go from there.

As for the IM seal, it probably isn't leaking. But if you really wanted to change that seal, you'd have to remove the sprocket. Hopefully, you'll be able to wedge something through the sprocket to keep it from turning so you can remove the sprocket bolt. Then, there are two bolts that hold the carrier onto the block. The carrier then comes off and houses the seal. You should be able to press that out with a big socket or whatever you find appropriate and a mallet. Install the new seal the same way. Then, there's the thin green o-ring that seals the carrier.

To get to the IM sprocket (and carrier), you'll have to remove the lower timing belt cover. This requires removing the crank pulley and at least loosening the water pump pulley, along with the two bolts that hold on the cover.

To remove the front carrier for the crank, you'll need to remove the crank sprocket. The crank bolt is HIGHLY TORQUED, and is a stretch bolt (needs to be replaced). Your best bet at removing this is by resting a wrench on the ground while you give the starter a quick blip (crank rotates clockwise, so wrench needs to rest on ground on right side).

Once the crank bolt is off, you should be able to remove the associated carrier bolts to the block and through the oil pan. Carrier comes off, and you use the same technique as for IM seal (it's the same seal after all). Front crank carrier to block uses a paper gasket that needs to be replaced as well. When installing carrier, again, remember that it's soft aluminum, so do not strip the threads when installing oil pan bolts.

It is a bit of a job, so I'd say don't do it unless it actually is really leaking. Although, if your cam is off time, and you're looking to do it by the book (care about IM time), you'll be doing a lot of the steps required anyway.. That said, removing the front carrier obviously dumps all your oil, so wait until you're changing your oil.

Installing the new crank bolt again requires an INSANE amount of torque. I'm talking long wrench, lying on the ground, and using your foot to apply as much torque as you can. Car should probably be in 5th gear, possibly with someone holding the brakes if it insists on moving.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

:banghead: I hope these seals are doing their job


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> :banghead: I hope these seals are doing their job


Front main seal is a bear to replace. I didn't do it on the 1.6 before I installed it, now I wish I would have, seems to be some leakage there now. 

The gasser flywheel 0|T mark is TDC, it lined up perfectly with the TDC mark on the diesel flywheel.

If you have trouble with the crank moving when attempting to tension the belt try wedging a screw driver into the teeth on the flywheel at the timing port.

Sounds like most everything has gone pretty will with your work though....good job!

steve


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I think THIS  should do the trick for marking the flywheel...now just have to find that mark. 

kicking myself all the way to Brazil for not setting a distinct mark when we installed the damn thing.


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## bluetoes591 (Apr 3, 2009)

Paint pen is awesome too. Different brand than I used, but you get the idea http://m.michaels.com/Sharpie-Oil-Based-Paint-Pen/gc1650,default,pd.html


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

perfect! going to Staples during lunch. Seems you can get just ONE of those as opposed to a dozen of what I posted. 

I just ordered an upgraded Accelerator Cable Bushing from these guys - made of Ultra-High Molecular Weight Poly-Ethylene.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

ONE of these has to do the trick:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

mike in SC said:


> How will you connect the crankcase vent with the G60 valve cover. I have one in storage waiting to put on the fox. What kind of throttle bracket did you use?
> 
> 
> Nice work so far.


 
Thanks :thumbup:










I am using this PCV valve grommet and going to get a generic elbow and pipe the hose to the back of the airbox. Using a Scirocco 16v Throttle Bracket - tapped into the G60 TB. Also used a Scirocco 16v Throttle Cable. It worked out well. It was a little bit of work getting the green tapered plastic into the grommet in the firewall - but once it went in - it worked great (spray silicone is your friend). It's a tad longer than stock - so I tucked/fed it under the booster. 

I'll take some photos of the final setup!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Just picked up the refinished teardrop. Looks great! Kwicksilver Brooklyn has my loyalty. I'd definitely go back. 

Before:









After:









Edit: On closer inspection - the outer lip has a significant change that I'm not 100% satisfied with. They used a CNC lathe to remove the surface oxidation/scratches - but it flattened out that nicely half painted lip. Seems there is no way around it. 

Doubtful fixing the curbed one would result in anything different - from these guys anyhow. 

So, that being said - I'm still looking for two "like new" replacements :beer:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

And the fact that the center portion is painted all wrong :banghead:

Edit: they offered to fix their mistake.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Falkens and Flakes mounted. 









Feels great. Big fan of how 14s feel already. 

Ended up cam sprocket was ONE tooth off. Needed to be turned clockwise. Marked the flywheel nicely with white paint marker and am now at around 8*BTDC. Idle isn't perfect yet - awaiting new seals - in the mail Monday. Drove a good 60+ miles mostly highway - handled well, but had a bunch of extra weight that really dampened the fun. I need to spend some time adjusting a few things - but overall pretty happy with the power in the higher RPMs. I feel there is a lot more potential and after well adjusted tune I'll be very happy. 

Came up with a solution to keep the hood rod clip in place. Just found a random short screw with decent thickness. Working almost like a dry wall anchor it was just enough to spread out the clips and hold it in place. I needed to be sure the rod would not come loose since I have not reinstalled the TB cover.


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## voxwagen88 (Dec 9, 2001)

The Flakes look hot on the white wagon with smoked corners. Comes together nicely.


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> And the fact that the center portion is painted all wrong :banghead:
> 
> Edit: they offered to fix their mistake.


wagon looks good with the snowflakes

I noticed that issue with the center paint but didn't say anything, thought maybe you wanted it that way. I wondered how they did their resurfacing. The CNC lathe is a good idea as long as you don't go overboard with it. I think polished teardrops would look nice but maybe a bit too much, one reason I always liked snowflakes.

steve


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## novws (Dec 17, 2005)

Looking good, Chris. Your car is so low! I'm really interested to hear how it runs once it's sorted. And it sounds like your making some great progress on that front.


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## myboxyfox (Nov 27, 2011)

Looks excellent with the Snowflakes!


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

those flakes look awful on your car....should trade them for somethign else!!


take care!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Haha. I really do like them. They certainly need some work - looks good from 10ft away. Even just a good scrub would do some justice. Gotta read up on how I can polish them w/o full strip and re-clear. Not sure if that's possible. Might be best to strip them completely and powder coat the black. We'll see. 

Adjusted the mixture to fluctuate around 8-9mA and drove home. Definitely a bit better - but once I replace the idle screw seal I need to locate this vacuum leak. 

There is a decent stumble from idle through the start of acceleration. Then it powers through the gears - but certainly not getting all the benefits of the upgrades. 

To be continued...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I have yet to spend time looking for that vacuum leak - but this ticking has got me annoyed. I thought it would go away after the oil moved around a bit. I did use 10w30 - and plan to go to 20w50 after 500-600 miles, but do you think I got a bunk lifter?

[video]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1586174/VW_Fox/IMG_4463.MOV[/video]

Exhaust doesn't sound ideal either:

[video]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1586174/VW_Fox/IMG_4464.MOV[/video]


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

redone17 said:


> I have yet to spend time looking for that vacuum leak - but this ticking has got me annoyed. I thought it would go away after the oil moved around a bit. I did use 10w30 - and plan to go to 20w50 after 500-600 miles, but do you think I got a bunk lifter?
> 
> [video]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1586174/VW_Fox/IMG_4463.MOV[/video]
> 
> ...


Could be, you'll have to pull the VC and turn the motor by hand (clock-wise) to see which one isn't pumping up, that'll be your bad one.

Did you glance at the underside when you got them? Did they all look like they were pumped up?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

They were covered in oil...didn't take notice otherwise. 

I have to check this out. 

Hopefully we get back from our trip early enough on Monday to work through these things before the sun goes down.


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

dump in some STP-its a short term fix-good stuff


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

puchfinnland said:


> dump in some STP-its a short term fix-good stuff


really?! I always stayed away from that type of stuff. 

I gave a call to the machine shop that worked on the head. He suggested that one of them is probably stuck as well...is it possible to get in there w/o removing the cam and losing the timing? I guess first step is taking of VC and hearing/looking - but would like to have a plan on how to fix this rouge lifter if I need to force it out or something.


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

stp is great stuff, gets thicker when hot

I have used and seen this on a collapsed lifter-it will shut it up.

there is no funny business about it.

timing and cam removal is childs play on a vw 4cyl.
just need a torque wrench-you could even put in a mild cam if you wanted.

if you swap cams-new lifters-they wear together

you have done far more challanging work Chris!

stp-then when the weather breaks swap the lifter.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I just put in 270 cam and adjustable sprocket - just was hoping I didn't have to take it apart :banghead:


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

you got new lifters in w the cam?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

brand new from AutoHaus - hence the :banghead:


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

lifters are pretty easy to change (at least in relation to changing valve springs..), but you will have to remove the cam.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

figured as much. but what if I don't have to change it - and it's just stuck...any chance it just needs a little assistance?


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

no physical assistance you could provide that would be more than what the cam can do. as far as "sludge" clogging it up, people recommend MMO or ATF but I don't know... it doesn't seem like it's causing you to effectively run on only three cylinders though (although the exhaust pattern...). I'd take the valve cover off to have a looksie and go from there. That and do a compression test if you'd rather hold off on changing the offending lifter.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

No need to hold off. Gotta do what I gotta do. Just wrapping my head around what my options are.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Good news in this thread: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6000309-Engine-ticking-noise

Picked up the teardrop. Looks great.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

my Fox is running like ****.

I replaced the idle screw seal - that seemed to work out great. holds a nice seal now - actually had to screw it in with some resistance.

I realized I never torqued the TB bolts all the way ::bonehead:: was really hoping that was the vacuum leak...didn't seem to make much of a difference.

I got Starting Fluid and sprayed it around - but couldn't find anything...we really minimized the vacuum hoses by deleting the Idle Boost Valve - so, I am not sure where the heck this leak is...I even hear something...it's driving me crazy. I hope to have a few morning or afternoon hours this weekend. It really stumbles on initial acceleration - which leads me to believe it's vacuum or fuel related...


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

do you have a dwell meter to check the air/fuel ratio?

have you changed the injector o-rings?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

O-rings are new - I even sprayed starting fluid near them to see if I have any leaks.

DPR reading is floating around 8mA.


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## novws (Dec 17, 2005)

Could it be an ignition or cam timing problem? Also, if it went from bad to worse, it may not hurt to pull and inspect spark plugs to see if they tell you anything.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I'll definitely check the plugs - but I had it set at 8*BTDC last week - I'll double check everything again this weekend. Just frustrated when I moved it this morning for street cleaning.


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## myboxyfox (Nov 27, 2011)

Here's a fun way to check for vacuum leaks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMok2y05jNE

and hey, humor never hurts in these situations. I hope the solution is a simple one! 

But could it be the fuel is weak? Maybe you're just running through a bad batch.....try some high test?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Hahaha. Smoke test WAS my next solution!

I used Hess 87 - filled up with a bottle of Techron. I know some guys use the adjustable sprocket to advance and run higher octane - but right now it's centered. How does that work exactly? If I am actually 8* - what would require the higher end fuels?

I'm going to start from the ground up. Checking all manifold bolts/nuts, DPR and timing. Something is falling short. Even though the injectors are new - I guess it wouldn't hurt to check them as well.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Got the ignition timing, idle and mixture set. I'm about to go for a spin - but as far as I can tell - its no longer stumbling on acceleration. 

Exhaust is spitting a bit - not sure the cause of the minor misfire. I need to run a compression test too.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

It's not running right. Acceleration isn't stumbling as much - but something's amiss. I gotta spend some more time under the hood. Maybe tomorrow if I get out of work early enough.

Put in the upgraded gas pedal bushing:









I cleaned up the flakes a bit too. They look much better.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Oh, and many thanks to DragonMike for the OEM oil pan bolts from his parts car! No more crappy AutoZone replacement.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I lied. It's still stumbling. 

Thought of something. Should the cam be advanced a bit due to being 270? It's almost like the firing is off by the tiniest bit. It's only from stop. Otherwise it powers through the rest of the gears. 

Still no sign of a vacuum leak. I double checked everything. 

I'm stumped.


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

how are your injectors' how is the fuel side of the situation?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Injectors are all new - though I guess I should check their spray pattern.


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## myboxyfox (Nov 27, 2011)

redone17 said:


> I lied. It's still stumbling.
> 
> Thought of something. Should the cam be advanced a bit due to being 270? It's almost like the firing is off by the tiniest bit. It's only from stop. Otherwise it powers through the rest of the gears.
> 
> ...


270 can make for a rough idle I've heard. I'd say tinker with the timing.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

especially if we pulled the idle boost valve :sly:


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

redone17 said:


> Injectors are all new - though I guess I should check their spray pattern.


So you changed out the #1 injector?

Nah, the idle boost valve would only serve to up the idle by allowing more metered air. It doesn't really have a "stabilizing" effect.

A 270* cam should still be plenty mild, and if anything would be a little lopey at idle; it wouldn't cause the stuttering off idle.

Have you tried disconnecting the o2 sensor and manually fiddling with the mixture? I guess it's really kind of pointless though, since it'd just point to an issue we already know exists.

Were you able to narrow down the misfiring cylinder by watching the timing light strobe?


Where'd you get that accelerator pedal bushing?? Looks like I gotta make a trip to MA at the end of the week. Not really trusting the Volvo right now so I might actually work on the Fox this week :screwy:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I tried the strobe on each wire - all steady. 

I pulled the VC and can't hear a clicking noise rotating the crank by hand. All the lifters were moving as they should. Got me. Back on - clicking as before. I then thought it was coming from the rotor. I guess I need a stethoscope or something. 

Pedal bushing: http://www.4crawler.com/Diesel/ForSale/AccelPedalBushing.shtml

It seems to stumble in any gear after coasting as well as from stop. So - increased speed after stumble its fine. But if I coast for a bit - maybe downshift - it will stumble again when I put my foot on the gas until it picks back up. So - at this point it must be either vacuum or fuel delivery related. I don't know what else to do tonight.

Oh, I should mention that the car starts great - every time. Ignition timing, mixture, cam/crank timing are all set.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

oh, also...my interior light just stopped working. changed bulb - nothing. any ideas? not a fuse because a few other components would go out along with it.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

you got the gl map light unit? That switch tends to oxidize. Two screws/bolts and the thing comes down. Play with that switch


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

thanks :thumbup:

that will be a good time to swap out my non-faded rear view with working night flip that's been sitting around for over a year.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

So it looks like my throttle body has the vacuum leak...not sure if the adapter plate is surface isn't straight or what. I gotta take it apart and use some liquid gasket or something. Thing is - one of the bolts hex is stripped. I can get it out, but won't be able to torque it. Does anyone have any extras? They are the longer ones from 16v TB (N10073701 - bolt, with hex. socket - M8X60). 

ziddey and I exhausted all other possibilities. 

edit: seems World Impex can get them for $1.84 ea and 1stVW for $1.12 - just annoying to spend $12 on shipping.


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

I'm not sure how things work in Brooklyn, but would you be able to get to a hardware store? I could stop by some places on my way home if you're in a pinch.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Metric is a little iffy - but I have one trustworthy place I can check out. Though, they close at 12:15pm on Saturday and are closed Sunday.


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## voxwagen88 (Dec 9, 2001)

redone17 said:


> oh, also...my interior light just stopped working. changed bulb - nothing. any ideas? not a fuse because a few other components would go out along with it.


 I had water leaking onto the switch in the door jam. Rusted. Had to replace the switch. 
Hopefully your issue is not a leak.


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## bluetoes591 (Apr 3, 2009)

voxwagen88 said:


> I had water leaking onto the switch in the door jam. Rusted. Had to replace the switch.
> Hopefully your issue is not a leak.


 Those switches are kinda dodgey in general, would definitely be worth a look. Had to replace both in my Jetta and the drivers side in my Fox.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

If the switch in the door went bad, wouldn't I still be able to turn the light on to the constant position? I have yet to look into this further.

I put a good 200 miles on her this weekend. Once it's going - warmed up and on the highway it moves along nicely. Take my foot off the pedal and the RPMs drop almost to stall and levels out at around 950-1000. I feel there is a lack in power I should be getting from the recent upgrades. I need to run a compression test and check out the fuel pressure. Something is amiss. Still getting the stumble on acceleration. 

I have a like-new top half of an airbox along with distributor, braided lines, fuel pressure regulator, DPR, air flow plate, etc from a California car...I haven't had a chance to install it - but may see if that helps next...


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## novws (Dec 17, 2005)

Hey Chris, I seriously doubt this is your problem, but I just replaced the coolant temp sensor and my car runs a lot better. It was getting progressively worse, but the symptoms were stumbling and low power, first at low revs and eventually across the powerband. A lot of other things were in play (timing, cam, 02 sensor and exhaust changes), so I assumed it was related to one of those. Runs much better now, although I get the very occasional stumble off the line. I'm hoping this disappears with a little more running time.


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

Is the picture of your wagon with your Vogtland springs? 
When I was having fueling issues replacing the fuel filter helped.

Are you sensors working well? CTS, o2, etc..


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Which picture? Any pictures I have posted in the last year have the springs installed.

o2 is definitely working correctly...that's been tested. CTS may be the culprit. Is there a way to test it, or just replace? I'm using a K&N air filter and it looks fine. Couldn't hurt to clean it I guess.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Here is a decent side view when I still had those ugly Konigs:









I feel it has settled a bit better at this point. Also it looks and handles a lot better with 14" OEM alloys. I will take a more recent photo from the side.


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## novws (Dec 17, 2005)

redone17 said:


> CTS may be the culprit. Is there a way to test it, or just replace?


I *think* you can unplug the CTS temporarily. If it runs better, it's your culprit. If not, probably something else. However, you may want to verify whether or not this is true.


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

I checked the CTS on my motor by testing the ohms. I think this is in the service ( blue one, I forget the name) manual. 
Sorry redone, I wasn't specific about the picture I was writing about.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Ok. Gotta do that. Also need to run through the fuel delivery tests.


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## ziddey (Apr 16, 2006)

CTS should be fine, at least as far as the issue is concerned. It's going into closed loop properly, and the car drives fine with cold enrichment?

A failing CTS may not scale properly with temperature, causing poor cold running. Or it may stay "cold" possibly preventing the ECU from going into closed loop.

It's Digi2 where you unplug the CTS to compare how it runs. With CIS-E, it should run like trash/stall if you unplug it (80ma dpr current or something like that)


edit: you could always shunt the CTS plug (or get an appropriate resistor) to take it out of the equation without buying a new one.


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

bump...


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I'm still around. Hate to be a stranger. My Fox ain't doing much but moving from parking spot to parking spot these days. Oh, also storing most of my parts since I lost my storage. Have some big plans to start working on it again in the spring at my father in laws. 

This guy has been keeping me occupied on the weekends:


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## EBlomster (Aug 11, 2013)

*Roof racks*

Hey, I love your thread, I'm learning so much.I just got a VW 89' Fox sedan. What roof rack did you get for your skis? I'm thinking of adding one to my car.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Hey man! Welcome - and just in Hoboken! We should meet up at one point. 

This is the setup that fits the Fox:
Thule:
300 - Feet
LB50 - bars
873XT - fairing


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## puchfinnland (Feb 16, 2013)

bump...hey...need some updates! lets see them seats!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

The seats are being stored in my in-laws shed. They'll see the day of light this spring. 

Trust me. I miss messing around with the Fox myself. Hoping for lots of progress in 2014. 

It's literally a garage at the moment. Entire car is filled with parts. I need to go through is all and get rid of some extra stuff.


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## connorbrotach (Jan 22, 2014)

could you please give me a link or any info on where/how you ordered those headlights? i just got my first fox about a week ago, it needs a drivers side headlight assembly, im having a hell of a time finding it.. :banghead:

great build man!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

you could buy the whole car


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

D'oh! Giving up on the ole Fox?


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I won't unless someone comes to grab the whole package. I may have to find somewhere to store it otherwise.

It's too much with some plans the lady and I are striving towards. It just doesn't make sense that I spend as much cash on this hobby as I'd like to. 

I'm disappointed and excited at the same time.


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## connorbrotach (Jan 22, 2014)

Could you please reply with any or all information on how & where i can order headlight assemblies? i really like the ones you got. ive had a hell of a time trying to find them, thank you


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## vwfoxlife (Feb 14, 2014)

*parting out what!!!*

I see u just put a thrend up about parting everything out! If u have a fb let me know.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

aaaaand - change of plans. 



I have a 2 car garage in my near future.



Just signed contract on a house.



THE FOX IS NOT FOR SALE.



Funny turn of events, I might end up getting the Blue Sedan back too...since I will need a daily commuter. The Wagon will suffice for a bit - but it will be in pieces soon enough.


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## doppelfaust (Aug 15, 2007)

Woohoo! I needed some good news after this month...


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## insanebuslady (Jun 9, 2010)

Awesome dude. Mine is in long term storage as I continue trucking ahead with my bike shop. No plans of getting rid of him (her?) in the near future though. Glad to hear you're doing the same


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## alaincopter (Oct 2, 2007)

Those are some great news, Chris!! Congrats on so many levels :thumbup:


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## QuantumSyncro (Apr 28, 2000)

Congrats Chris, hope you're up to the task of home ownership. The nice thing is that it gives you a home base to plant your tool box.

I am glad to hear that you're not selling the wagon!

Steve


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## Donnie Dub (Apr 21, 2011)

"The PO's notes claim he drove to Florida a few times and it even made it out to Arizona once or twice!"

Definitely do-able... i've driven my Fox to Florida & back twice myself when it was around 125k. She's starting to show some wear & tear now at 176k, and some things are finally starting to go here and there, so i probably would be less likely to try it right now, but we've been there and done that. I still take it on trips up into VT and down to the bottom of CT pretty often. Worst case scenario, thats why i have AAA Premier.... umpkin:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I'm back! Driving the wagon daily 4.4 Miles each way to the train. I'll be on here more often updating my progress (it will be slow, but hopefully steady)

I missed you guys. For real. I missed driving the Fox even more!


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

That sounds like my commute. Lat year I drove 120 miles a day-that was terrible. I put a few thousand miles on the fox last winter. Good times.

Did you get my PM? I'm asking about windows.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

I replied! Looks like I never hit send last night or it didn't go through - check your inbox now.

My first order of business is putting the idle boost valve and all related vacuum lines back in. I need to return the vacuum setup to stock from the boot to intake and also to air box. It runs decent once it's warmed up, but it idles like crap beforehand. 

I'm warming the car up each morning for a few min and it cruises fine - still doesn't have the pickup I would expect with the upgrades. I'm hoping that once all the vacuum lines are intact I can pin point any other issues. It seems like it's running a little rich, due to a slight fuel smell - but last time I did all the readings it was coming up fine - but smelled the same. It's possible the one braided line I replaced isn't torqued correctly. 

I have a whole fuel distributor w/ clean lines and no rust from a Cali car. I'll plan to install that at the same time. Hoping these minor fixes get me better results. 

Next: brake upgrade that has been sitting in boxes for years (also, sucks not having an emergency brake living on a hill)


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

besides my idle and hot start issues (not to mention leaks) - I seem to have a minor electrical issue too. My wipers go on sporadically when I have my headlights on - and only after the car has warmed up/been driven a few miles. 

yay. 

The weekends have been busy, but I hope to get under the hood in July.


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## mike in SC (Apr 29, 2004)

Hey! I did get your message. Sorry for sounding rude too. 

Hope you get those problems worked out. I spent a few week tackling some of my own.


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Mike - no worries! I didn't think that for a sec.

Oil change this weekend - should have done it 500 miles after the head swap - reaching 1500...also replace the broken emergency brake cable if it's not too much of a pain. Living in the hills w/o an e-brake is a pain in the arse. Nitwit at some valet parking in Detroit broke it on me as we were headed home from our trip a few summers ago and I have been putting it off until I did the brake upgrade...which I still have the pile of parts waiting to for an enthusiastic weekend. I need to strip and re-paint the front calipers


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## nbvwfan (Aug 15, 2007)

opcorn:
Bookmarking this for reading later.
Lots of good pictures, and glad to have found your build.
I'd like to find a fox-agon at some point. My 88 4 door never intrigued me, but it was a solid (ugly) mode of transportation for over a year before I traded it in at 198K.
Replied in your other post, hope you sort out the CIS-E issue. 
:thumbup:


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

:beer: CHEERS!


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## redone17 (Aug 17, 2011)

Well, I got Popouli back (the 89 Coupe). The damn thing still runs like new. What a difference. He'll be my daily from here on out. I'd like to upgrade the suspension and put the red teardrops on it. Other than that it's staying stock. I guess I'd drop a 5 spd in if I came across one. I'll plan to put the vent windows in next summer for the time being. 

I'll be clearing out space and organizing the garage so I have somewhere to work. Maybe I'll have the wagon restored by the time our son is 18 :laugh:


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