# Grille Design Changes for 2005 and 2006 (NAR LWB Phaetons)



## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Grille Design Changes for 2005*

I saw a 2005 short wheelbase Phaeton in the VW dealership in Zürich today - the very knowledgable salesperson pointed out to me that there has been a very slight design change in the front grill of the short wheelbase model for 2005. The horizontal band across the top of the grille is a bit wider (thicker) than before.
Below are three photos. The first photo was taken at the Geneva auto show in March of 2003, when the Phaeton was first presented publicly, so I guess we can assume this is a 2003 model. The second photo was taken today of the 2005 short wheelbase Phaeton in the Zürich showroom. Please disregard the rippled lines on the hood of the car in the second photo, they are only reflections of ceiling panels in the showroom, above the car.
The third photo shows the grille from a 2005 long wheelbase Phaeton - I took this photo in Dresden two weeks ago. Effective with model year 2005, the short wheelbase and long wheelbase cars will have different grilles. As most of us are aware, we can only order the long wheelbase vehicle in North America, so the bottom photo shows what we are going to get from here on in.
PanEuropean
*2003 Grille (all vehicles) *








*2005 Grille (short wheelbase) *








*2005 Grille (long wheelbase) *


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

I discovered something interesting today when browsing through the electronic parts catalog with the Parts Manager at my dealership.
Every Phaeton ever made has the same part number of hood, in other words, even though there are three different choices of front grille available (as shown above), they all fit onto the same hood, so they are interchangable.
In North America, we can order, as a stand-alone part, either the 'original' grille style (installed on all Phaetons worldwide that were built before May of 2004), or the newer 'long wheelbase' grille, which is installed on long wheelbase Phaetons that were built subsequent to May of 2004. The North American parts catalog does not list the part number for the post May 2004 'short wheelbase' grille, which is understandable, because this vehicle is not sold in North America.
This means if you prefer the appearence of the newer grille, but have a Phaeton built before May of 2004, it is a very simple task to just order one (about CAD $ 400, not sure what the US prices are) and swap it out.
Michael
*Part Numbers for the two different grilles*








*Original Grille design - November 2003 to May 2004 North American Phaetons* Part Number *3D0 853 651 G*








*Newer Grill design - June 2004 and later North American Phaetons* Part Number *3D7 853 651*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

There are quite a few pictures of the newer grille at this post: Photos of David's new 2005 Phaeton, and they are better quality pictures than the one I posted above.
Michael


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## agnos (Jul 20, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

Michael, your devotion to this board is truly w/o bounds...many kudos for your many insightful and informative posts. I, for one, look forward to your posts every time I check the forum.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (agnos)*

Thanks for your kind words. I am fortunate to have the type of work in which I have a month or so off, then a month (or longer) back on. At the end of November I head out to Sudan, Somalia, Zimbabwe and Kenya for about 8 weeks - likely very little internet access there, no Phaetons either - so I figure I'll make hay while the sun shines...
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

Here are some much better photos of the 2005 MY grille for the extended wheelbase Phaeton. Thanks to the VW of NA media team for these photos.
_*Post Edited:* I discovered today that rather than taking new photos, VW just "Photoshopped" the 2005 grille onto the existing 2004 photos. Shame on them!







Well, it certainly makes it easier for us to compare the designs, and decide which one we like most._
*2004 MY Grille for extended wheelbase (North American) Phaetons*








*2004 MY Grille for extended wheelbase (North American) Phaetons*








*2005 MY Grille for extended wheelbase (North American) Phaetons*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PassaTT)*

This is truly funny - I discovered today, when looking through an old photo CD that VW put out when the Phaeton was first introduced to North America, that the pictures they currently have on their media website of the "2005" Phaeton are just the 2004 photos with a new grille Photoshopped onto the front.
So, I amended my post above to present you with the "before" and "after" photos, courtesy of the art department at Volkswagen.
Michael


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## PassaTT (May 24, 2003)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*








That is too funny. Can they photochop a badgeless grill on for me?


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PassaTT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PassaTT* »_







That is too funny. Can they photochop a badgeless grill on for me?









You really think it would look better badgeless?


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## PassaTT (May 24, 2003)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (spockcat)*

Not with the new grill, it looks like an Acura








Thanks for doing that.


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PassaTT)*

So you like this?


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## PassaTT (May 24, 2003)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (spockcat)*

Actually, yes, I do like that. Three or four single bars would be cleaner. Thanks for posting that.


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## AusSalzburg (Nov 4, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PassaTT)*

You Gentlemen are very good at changing the photos.
Could you please try an Idea that I have. I've been wanting to manufacture an add-on to the Phaeton. 
I would like to see what it would look like with the VW emblem on the hood of the Phaeton just like a Mercedes. Can you cut and paste a Mercedes hood emblem onto the Phaeton hood?
I think it would be easy to modify the Mercedes Hood emblem by removing the "Star" in the middle and replacing it with "VW". I'm thinking of a Kit that would look exactly like the grill in the last photo above. Then a small hole drilled in front of the hood to install a "VW" hood ornament just like a Mercedes.
Lets see what it would like first. This may be a good idea or bad idea.
Thank you very much to the gentlemen that take time to make a photo for me.
Werner.


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (AusSalzburg)*


_Quote, originally posted by *AusSalzburg* »_You Gentlemen are very good at changing the photos.
Could you please try an Idea that I have. I've been wanting to manufacture an add-on to the Phaeton. 
I would like to see what it would look like with the VW emblem on the hood of the Phaeton just like a Mercedes. Can you cut and paste a Mercedes hood emblem onto the Phaeton hood?
I think it would be easy to modify the Mercedes Hood emblem by removing the "Star" in the middle and replacing it with "VW". I'm thinking of a Kit that would look exactly like the grill in the last photo above. Then a small hole drilled in front of the hood to install a "VW" hood ornament just like a Mercedes.
Lets see what it would like first. This may be a good idea or bad idea.
Thank you very much to the gentlemen that take time to make a photo for me.
Werner.

Is this what you mean? Perhaps the existing badge is too big to put on the hood.


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## AusSalzburg (Nov 4, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (spockcat)*

Spockcat
Yes, pretty close. The emblem I think should be about 25% smaller. 
Are you able to give it the appearience that the emplem is on a neck/stand like the Mercedes? 
Very good work. (I have no clue how you do this)
Werner


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (AusSalzburg)*

This is as close as I can get. I don't think the emblem on a stand would look very good anyway (my opinion that is) But a smaller emblem on the hood might look OK.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PhaetoninPA)*

Interesting. I have been toying around with the idea of getting a 2005 LWB grille for my 2004, thinking exactly the same thing, but in the other direction - that the 2005 grille is cleaner, simpler, because it has fewer horizontal lines in it.
I still have not made up my mind. Maybe I will order the 2005 grille, then just change them around every month or so, kind of like what kids do now with the snap-on cell phone covers. That'll confuse everyone...








Michael


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## A8inPA (Dec 8, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

hey michael,
9 times out of 10 when i see a car for the first time
that imprint is what usually sticks with me as being
my favorite. i like how the straight lines make the
car appear wide. plus it seems that black is the
color for this car. it gives it an elegant look...
it's just so hard to keep clean. and
call me crazy but i like the vw emblem standing
on the hood. why not? 


_Modified by PhaetoninPA at 5:27 AM 1-15-2005_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PhaetoninPA)*

Hi Jeff:
Well - emblems that stand up on the hood can look OK, I suppose, if they are part of the heritage of the brand. Mercedes has done this for a long time, so has Rolls-Royce. It's part of their corporate identity.
VW has not used emblems on the hood since the Wolfsburg city crest appeared on the hood of the old beetles in the '60's and '70's. I think if they put an emblem on the hood of the Phaeton, it would look pretentious, as if they were aping Mercedes or Rolls-Royce.
The Phaeton grilles - any of the three - are consistent with VW's overall styling theme. You can see the family heritage with their other products, such as the Golfs, Jettas, and the Passat. I like that, I think it shows integrity on VW's part.
Michael


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## dcowan699 (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PhaetoninPA)*

I'd like to see pictures of your Audi. How are you liking it? What color is it?... I like the grille of the Audi A8 V8 better than the the W12 Audi. I think the W12 Audi grill is just too prominent. Isn't it just the 12 cylinder that has the new grill design? The Audi web site shows the V8 with the regular shaped grill like the previous year models. I looked at that just the other day. 
David


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## A8inPA (Dec 8, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (dcowan699)*

hi david,
so far so good. i haven't been able to drive the car 
as much as i would like so i can't provide too many 
details just yet. one thing i can share is this...the car
definitely has a more sporting nature than i think most 
people would expect. the color is akoya silver(light steel 
grayish/blue). i am 50 50 with the upcoming new grill 
design. for some reason it makes the front end of the
car appear to extend out further....to my eyes at least.
keep in mind i have yet to see one in person. only in 
photos for now. from what i've been able to gather on 
the net the new grill will be showing up on the v8 a8
before fall. my guess it will be on all 06 models. like
you said "prominent". i guess audi wants to stand out
more. kind of counter to the culture that already exists
with audi customers. here is a link to a photo of the 
car. i suck at posting photos on forums. i hope this 
works. 
http://img.photobucket.com/alb...4.jpg


_Modified by PhaetoninPA at 8:40 PM 1-15-2005_


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## dcowan699 (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

Absolutely beautiful. Now that's the grille I like







The newer one I guess will grow on me eventually.


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## rmg2 (Jan 23, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

Maybe you were thinking of the fish mouth fronth end. The W12 model has the fish mouth front end as will all the new Audi's.


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## DCubed (Oct 25, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (bobm)*

Bob, who did you deal with a commonwealth? (if I may ask, and if possible, PM me, I am just interested on who they picked as their phaeton expert.)


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## bobm (Mar 2, 2004)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (CapoVWSales)*


_Quote, originally posted by *CapoVWSales* »_Bob, who did you deal with a commonwealth? (if I may ask, and if possible, PM me, I am just interested on who they picked as their phaeton expert.)
 I'm not sure if you're referring to the salesman or Service agent. Paxton R. Krichmar sold me the car. It was his first one and the first one that Commonwealth sold. He went to another dealership shortly after he sold the car. Carl has been my service agent but the last time I took it to the Huntington Beach dealer. When I'm up for my next scheduled maint, I'm going to call the hot line because I have yet to receive the type of rental I was sold. The worst was the Huntington dealership because they had an Enterprise guy pick me up and after about 45 minutes I got a lovely Toyota Echo.


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

That is so wrong. Why add anything that would add drag and/or wind noise to a Phaeton....Then again, with my 22" spinners...and it would match the rest of my bling...I have the diamond V-Dub insignia Jacob the jeweler made for me...same size as the one on the grill...jk...


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## rscharf (Jan 19, 2004)

*Re: (PhaetonChix)*

AusSalzburg-
Here's the emblem above 'installed' on the Phaeton digitally. Tell me what you think.
http://home.earthlink.net/~keu...t.jpg
Robert


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (rscharf)*

I think it looks kind of 80s, if you know what I mean. No offence meant.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (CapoVWSales)*

Well - it looks like the grille design has changed again for MY 2006, at least, in North America, anyway. Jonathan sent me these pictures of his new 2006 Phaeton, which is a NAR spec LWB car, and it appears that it is fitted with the grille that has been used in Europe for the SWB Phaeton during MY 2005.
I actually quite like this grille, I think it looks great. The bars across the middle appear to be a tiny bit lighter in weight than the MY 2004 grille that was provided on the NAR Phaetons, and the upper chrome band is just a tiny bit thicker than on the MY 2004 grille. The bars across the middle don't touch the sides of the grille, as they did on the MY 2004 grille.
As mentioned above, all three grilles (2004 - 2005 - 2006) are fully interchangeable, so if you prefer one over another, you can just order the one you want at your VW dealer, and either install it yourself (quite simple), or have your dealer fit it for you.
Michael
*MY 2006 Grille for North American Region*
This is the same as the MY 2005, 2006 SWB Grille for the ROW.
























*The roofline looks much nicer without the OnStar antenna.*


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (rscharf)*

Here are some close-up pictures of the 2006 NAR market front grille. This is actually the same grille that has been used on the SWB Phaeton during model year 2005 and 2006 in the rest of the world.
Michael
*2006 NAR Market Phaeton Grille*


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## dcowan699 (Nov 22, 2004)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

I like the 04 and 06 grilles. Didn't like the 05's.


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## nowlinee (Nov 5, 2006)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

What is the difference in a LWB and SWB Phaeton and is there any designation in the model name like "Phaeton L", for example?


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (nowlinee)*

Hi Edwin:
Welcome to the Phaeton forum.
The LWB Phaeton is about 12 cm (6 inches) longer than the SWB vehicle. The stretch is just aft of the B pillar, and it provides more legroom for the rear seat occupants. All of the Phaetons imported to North America were LWB versions - VW of America did not ever import the SWB version, although you can take your choice of a SWB or LWB vehicle if you buy one elsewhere in the world.
There is no exterior designation indicating that the LWB vehicle is, in fact, a LWB vehicle. In the ROW (Rest of World, meaning, outside North America) market, the LWB vehicles get a unique grille. However, VW of America used the ROW unique grille on the 2005 Phaetons, and the newer SWB grille on the 2006 Phaetons - so that each model year that was sold in North America (2004, 2005, 2006) would look slightly different.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Grille Design Changes for 2005 (PanEuropean)*

Photos re-hosted.

Also, here is a link to a post about changing the grille from one style to another: Retrofitting a different Grille to a Phaeton.

Michael


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## 73blazer (Feb 19, 2020)

I just ordered this grille which said it was for NA 2004-2006 Phaeton.
3d0853651hpwf 

It is different from my current grille, which I would think is OEM but who knows someone may have swapped it. 
Mines cracked and the logo teeth are broke and has ripple marks on the chrome and the top piece keeps coming off from the plastic backing. Some stragically places tape has been keeping it together but i'm tired of it, and a new one was as much as used ones I've seen most of which have broken tabs and missing logo or something. 

Mine:









3d0853651hpwf 










Is this a case of service parts consolidation, whatever we have left that fits is now the "correct" one? I havn't looked yet but I assume it fits. I don't really care I guess, just seems odd.


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## 73blazer (Feb 19, 2020)

and vw really needs some help with their packaging. Loose in the box and no wrapping or protection at all. It was the same with the radiator of which the first two were busted up when they arrived. Luckily this made the trip from Germany without incident


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## ravenflies (Oct 31, 2013)

73blazer said:


> I just ordered this grille which said it was for NA 2004-2006 Phaeton.
> 3d0853651hpwf
> 
> It is different from my current grille, which I would think is OEM but who knows someone may have swapped it.
> ...


I think I got one of the last ones left of the original look for the LWB as in your upper image a few years ago. Since then it is replaced in ETKA with the standard grille, all the same except for the look of the stripes 

Lennart


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## 53PL-50AAA-VW611BAN (Feb 10, 2015)

Your original grille looks like a 2005 grille. The replacement looks like a 2004 or 2006 grille.

I know there are differences, but I can't tell the 2004 and 2006 apart.


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## luzt (Jul 20, 2021)

ravenflies said:


> I think I got one of the last ones left of the original look for the LWB as in your upper image a few years ago. Since then it is replaced in ETKA with the standard grille, all the same except for the look of the stripes
> 
> Lennart


As I can't PM you for some reason I'll write here insteaed.
I to live in Linköping and currently looking to buy a Phaeton, would it be possible to have a real life discussion about the car, and maybe get a look at yours to experience it first hand?
Living in Sweden it's a really rare opportunity as these cars are not common, to see one up close before arriving at a seller/dealer (where only the positives are presented). 

Best regards, Erik


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