# VR6 '87 Cabriolet



## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Hope I'm not in over my head, but I have decided to swap a VR6 out of a 1994 Passat into my 1987 Cabriolet. 
So far, there has been no engine pulling. Both are still where they belong. I am not going to touch the Cabby until next winter so I can drive it this summer. In the mean time, I want to have the engine and wiring prepped and ready to go in.
To eliminate extra wiires, I am rebuilding the fuse box in front of the car and only moving wires that I need forward. Right now, I have no power to fuel pump or injectors. Keep in mind, I am not sure I have all of the wires I need yet. My question is, does the immobilizer disable this. I am trying to eliminate the immobilizer and looking at wiring diagrams, all it does is disable power to the starter. Am I wrong and does it interface with the ECU? Or should I start looking elsewhere for my problem?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

*Re: VR6 '87 Cabriolet (MOBOZO)*

Also, I will admit that I am not completely familiar with the VR6 yet. The engine I am working with has 143,000 miles on it. It ran strong and had good compression before I started missing around with the wiring, but is there anything I should replace before I drop it in the Cabby? I already plan on replacing timing chains and most seals. Should I consider head gasket, oil pump, water pump? Any of this or anything else common to go out on this age of a motor?


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## brian500 (Mar 24, 2008)

*Re: VR6 '87 Cabriolet (MOBOZO)*

hope this helps
http://mk2vr6.com/board/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=7831


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

*Re: VR6 '87 Cabriolet (brian500)*

Might find something useful there, but mine is MK1. I actually figured it out, though. The red and yellow wire mentioned in the sixth pic of that site was the problem. Fed it 12 volts and it fired right up. Gauges aren't working but at least the engine runs.
According to that forum, I will not be able to just swap out the fuse box and plug all of my MK1 stuff into this one. I don't want to do a bunch of rewiring in the car so I am considering two things. Run the VR6 fuse box under the hood as a second fuse box. Build a custom harness to eliminate the fuse box allowing me to plug into my MK1 box. 
Currently leaning toward the second option. I do not want to wedge this Passat gauge cluster into my MK1 dash, so I am considering aftermarket gauges.


_Modified by MOBOZO at 8:08 AM 3-29-2010_


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

*It's been a while*

Was so wrapped up in the build, I kinda forgot about this.
Maybe time for an update.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

So here are the before shots. Yes, it already had a 16V swap. But I want something bigger.
She's a little rough around the edges, but solid.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

I did manage to seperate the engine wiring from everything else and eliminate the immobilizer.
Once I had it running with minimal wiring, out it came.

After a little research, I found that the weak point on these engines is the timing chains, so I thought I should take a look.










Good thing I did.










Rear main missing the spring


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

RIP


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

With the engine and wiring prepped and not ready to park the Cabby yet, I started building my guage cluster. Got a good deal on these Sunpro guages. Also have matching gauges for the three below the dash.










Just need to fill in with styrene around the guages.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

So the whole point of this project is to create a unique vehicle and shave a little off my quarter mile time.

While running a 16.1, the exaust hammered so hard against the body that it cracked.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Took some time off to just drive and heal a broken arm. Now almost to the present day. Pulled the 16V then hauled her to my brother's shop for motor mount work.

Before Cutting


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

After a bit of cleanup.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

We got the engine positioned with a little help from some wood blocks, jack stands, and ratchet straps. It seemed a little hokey but it was the best we could come up with.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

The original plan was to do something like this.










But it did not seem like it was going to fit very nicely. We decided to go completely custom.










Some assembly required.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

I give all credit to my brother for the next few posts. As of this moment, I have not seen these mounts other than pictures.



















We found some hard rubber bushings to fit into these tubes.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Passenger side.



















Obviously, the bolt goes through the bushing in the tube. Similar to the 4 cylinder motor mounts.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Driver side.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

For the front, we went a little more traditional.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

It actually fit.




























Hopefully not too close.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

There, six months summarized in one night. The motor mount work only took two weeks.

:beer:


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## MikkiJayne (Jan 1, 2007)

Nice work on the mounts!


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Kinda strange watching a build on my own car like this.

For the clutch, we decided to go with a cable/hydraulic hybrid. Figured this would be easier than trying to find all the parts for a full cable setup from the Eurovan. And much easier than trying to swap in the Passat pedal assembly. Remember, trying to keep this swap as simple as possible. Don't want to loose that MK1 charm.

So, here is what he came up with to actuate the clutch master cylinder. Not sure where it will be mounted yet. The cable gives us a lot of freedom on that. Also not sure what he has in mind for holding the cable housing yet. The anticipation is killing me.


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## younganimater35 (Apr 29, 2008)

subscribed :thumbup: wish i had the knowledge to do this


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Ha. You and me both. Like I said, all credit to my brother. Today he modified the VR6 downpipe to fit into the cabby. All he did was cut it apart and weld it back together with all the bends in the opposite direction. He makes it sounds so simple.

Will post a pic tomorrow.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

A non modified VR6 downpipe. Not mine, just a pic I found on the forum.










Modified to fit the cabby.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Those mounts look like about the hardest possible way to mount a VR6 in an mk1.
Mine took me about 5 hours to get mounted. 

Looks like quality work though. :thumbup:


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## Dave926 (Mar 30, 2005)

I agrree, defintely not the KISS method. But they look sturdy as all hell, some mk1 vr6 mounts make me question how long they will last


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## hellrbbt (Sep 17, 2006)

I'm liking the ingenuity behind your mounts. What kind of bushings are you planning on running?

:beer:


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

Bushings are simple control arm bushings that sleeve inside 1.5" ID tubing. The point of going this route was for some additional strength and the smaller size. We couldn't see cutting up the frame to make stock mounts fit and these allowed us to add to and plate the stock frame. Also, looking around how others have done the VR6 swap, many mounts have looked... well... less than trustworthy (especially the rear mounts!). I agree, "some mk1 vr6 mounts make me question how long they will last". Which is exactly what I wanted to avoid. For what was there to work with and with the possibilities of going with something different, why not? Over engineered?... perhaps. KISS?... well, definutely not the easiest way to go, but absolutely sturdy!

Having a ton of fun with this little car!


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

neohic said:


> Bushings are simple control arm bushings that slieve inside 1.5" ID tubing. The point of going this route was for some additional strength and the smaller size. We couldn't see cutting up the frame to make stock mounts fit and these allowed us to add to and plate the stock frame. Also, looking around how others have done the VR6 swap, many mounts have looked... well... less than trustworthy (especially the rear mounts!). I agree, "some mk1 vr6 mounts make me question how long they will last". Which is exactly what I wanted to avoid. For what was there to work with and with the possibilities of going with something different, why not? Over engineered?... perhaps. KISS?... well, definutely not the easiest way to go, but absolutely sturdy!
> 
> Having a ton of fun with this little car!


As amazing as the mounts look that youve built, the mount area on the car is the weak point. The mount you built is definitely beautiful but the location theyre attached to is very thin to hang the motor under without reinforcement.
Your mount area is questionable in the long run, IMO. Even most people that put mounts on the side of the horns (mk3 style), as you have done, beef up the horn and I would say you need to. Again, its a very thin place to hang the motor from without reinforcement.

Mk4 mounts would have been a lot easier and reliable.


__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view










Most mk3 and b4 VR motors have the mk4 mount holes but I cant see in the pics if yours does or not. If it doesnt, it probably has the pad for the mount and just needs to be drilled.
Here's my b4 AAA VR showing mk4 mount attached.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Thanks for all the input on the mounts. I know it was not the simplest way we could have done it. But it seemed like the best option for this project.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

So here is what happens when I spend a day working on the project. Let's call it, getting back to simple.





































Forgot to take a pic after the carpet was back in. A little help with that Neohic?

Looking for ideas on how to cover this thing up. Now, I do not have a center console in this car. The previous owner took out the knee pad to reduce weight and left the console loose. I'm 6'3" so I liked it without the knee pad but I did not like the floating cosole. I moved the gauges to a standard bezel hanging from the bottum of the dash and put a rubber boot around the shifter. 

My thoughts so far are building a console that would be independent from the dash or covering it with a large boot. Not really excited about either of these options. Any ideas or pics of what others have done would be appreciated.


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

deathhare. said:


> As amazing as the mounts look that youve built, the mount area on the car is the weak point. The mount you built is definitely beautiful but the location theyre attached to is very thin to hang the motor under without reinforcement.
> Your mount area is questionable in the long run, IMO. Even most people that put mounts on the side of the horns (mk3 style), as you have done, beef up the horn and I would say you need to. Again, its a very thin place to hang the motor from without reinforcement.


On the right side, the reason that the motor mount went where it did was because it was almost in the same place that the stock 4 cyl. mount was. Figured it'd be as good as any since the factory put it there also.

I can't tell in your picture, but it looks as though your mount is in about the same place (just on top of the frame). Do you have any additional pictures with any additional reinforcement?


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

neohic said:


> On the right side, the reason that the motor mount went where it did was because it was almost in the same place that the stock 4 cyl. mount was. Figured it'd be as good as any since the factory put it there also.


True, but the vr6 motor weighs a lot more. 



neohic said:


> I can't tell in your picture, but it looks as though your mount is in about the same place (just on top of the frame). Do you have any additional pictures with any additional reinforcement?


Thats not my install. Im doing just a regular 12v.
This are some pics of my passenger mount.


















Here is the link to the thread of the red car.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...e-with-MK5-R32-Turbo-Lump-(Under-Construction)


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

deathhare. said:


> True, but the vr6 motor weighs a lot more.


Doesn't the VR6 weigh less than 70lbs more than a stock 8v? With the added gussets and plating on the frame, I think the additional load will be distributed evenly.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

neohic said:


> Doesn't the VR6 weigh less than 70lbs more than a stock 8v? With the added gussets and plating on the frame, I think the additional load will be distributed evenly.


I heard it was 80lbs more than a 1.8T swap. 

Would like to know the real answer.


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## mafosta (Dec 24, 2007)

opcorn:


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Demand updates.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

All I can tell you is I have a radiator. Fans and clutch reservoir are on the way.

There was a break in at the garage, so that might be holding him up a bit. :banghead:

Don't worry, the car was not damaged. They only took a few tools.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Good thing I am not there to help with this part. 










The shortened driver side axle.


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## mafosta (Dec 24, 2007)

is that balanced?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

It was not balanced after shortening. 

talked to a guy at a place that builds custom shafts like this, he said as long as it was straight it would not matter since it is so short.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Needed a place to put the battery, fuse box, and clutch reservoir. All in one.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Looks great. 
Why not just run the clutch off the brake master reservoir?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

trying to keep the cable as straight as possible. The master ended up closer to the battery. Did not want to run a hose that far and there is no nipple on the brake reservoir. 

Found this reservoir on ebay for $8. Can't complain about that. And it is a brake reservoir for a 1961 - 1966 Beetle or Ghia. Go with factory parts where ever possible.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Did you see how I did mine? 
Agreed on the factory parts thing. Which is why I used an mk3 non-abs reservoir.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

My clutch master in a completely different place. 

What are we looking at here? MK1? How is the clutch pedal moving the master? 

Got a shot of the inside?


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

MOBOZO said:


> My clutch master in a completely different place.
> 
> What are we looking at here? MK1? How is the clutch pedal moving the master?
> 
> Got a shot of the inside?


 Yeah its a rabbit. These pics should have it make sense I think.


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## old_skool_jetta (Jul 20, 2007)

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

deathhare. said:


> Yeah its a rabbit. These pics should have it make sense I think.


 
I actually like how you did it better. I didn't think there was enough room down there for the clutch master. Maybe I have a different brake booster.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

MOBOZO said:


> I actually like how you did it better. I didn't think there was enough room down there for the clutch master. Maybe I have a different brake booster.


 Ive seen a dozen of them mounted where mine is. Its just where everyone puts them. 

How did you mount it?


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

New stuff... got everything mocked up in the car where it'll go. I still need to make up a bracket for holding the clutch cable in place (regaurdless of how different it is than everyone else's) but everything works where it is. The radiator was another "probably not the same way that everyone else does it" since the rad support is now made of 1/4" material. I had to cut away and rebuild the factory header panel. The hood still closes and the upper rad neck fits up inside a little pocket in the hood. Undecided if I'll make a fancy cover for the battery to match the new fuse box cover... perhaps the owner of the car could chime in on that one...


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> Undecided if I'll make a fancy cover for the battery to match the new fuse box cover...


 Only if it is easily removable. They like to inspect that when I go racing.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Thats the wackiest clutch set up Ive ever seen. :laugh: 

Looks like quality work though. :thumbup:


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## mafosta (Dec 24, 2007)

deathhare. said:


> Thats the wackiest clutch set up Ive ever seen. :laugh:
> 
> Looks like quality work though. :thumbup:


 +1


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Here is the completed clutch actuator.



















Yeah, I know, wacky.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

If anyone is really watching this build, keep an eye on it between Xmas :grinsanta: and New Year's. We are spending the entire week working on the project. I hope to have all of the major parts together, with no more than just a few small thing to finish up. Also hoping to fire it up for the first time since it was in the Passat. I am planning on nightly updates during this time.


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## alextjoe (Aug 7, 2008)

opcorn: watching for sure!


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Definitely watching. :thumbup:


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

As promised, nightly updates. We are not yet done for the night, but this is better than watching paint dry.


In primer











Got some color matched shaker cans from the local paint store.





























Doing undercoating on the lower section. Hoping to get that on yet tonight.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)




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## alextjoe (Aug 7, 2008)

you never thought of putting in a 1.8t ?.. iv had both a mk2 vr6 and a mk2 1.8t awp..

obviously power is no competition but...i do alot of track days..and i had the exact same suspension/swaybar set up as well it was the same car..it started with a vr then i swaped in a 1.8t..

and the car handles like a fat big with the vr in it..it was crazy how nose heavy it was compared to the 1.8t...understeer was complete **** and when the front end did hook up the back end got so tail happy...

now that i have the 1.8t its crazy..no more understeer and i add about 100lbs in the back to help the rear stick to the ground a bit better...

vr6 are sound great and are fun in a straight line but god forbid theres a corner.. never going back to a vr


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

alextjoe said:


> you never thought of putting in a 1.8t ?.. iv had both a mk2 vr6 and a mk2 1.8t awp..
> 
> obviously power is no competition but...i do alot of track days..and i had the exact same suspension/swaybar set up as well it was the same car..it started with a vr then i swaped in a 1.8t..
> 
> ...


I only race straight line (so far).
I was not sure exactly what I was going to do with this car. I came across a great deal on this Passat. That settled it.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Did get the undercoating done last night.

Today, got the engine in and most of the hardware bolted on. Got slowed up by the passenger side axle. It got some dirt in it at some point and had to disassemble the inner joint to clean it. 

Waiting for Neohic to upload some pictures.


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

Day two of the epic week went well with a small set back with the left side axle... seemed to us that it should be cleaned as it crunched with dirt and sand. The undercoat finished nice which paved the way for putting the engine in the car... FOR THE LAST TIME!!! (For this engine anyway.)










































Finished the day with rewiring the original wiring to the car that was removed and got a start on new enging wiring.


























Until tomorrow...


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

Okay, it's tomorrow... more wiring to do yet, but it turns over!!! Not much else...

Went from this:









To this:

















High hopes of getting the little guy cleaned up and running tomorrow.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)




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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Ups and downs today. Got most of the wiring and the exhaust done. We were able to start it, but it as a major tick. It sounds like a lifter tick. Is it common for these lifters to collapse? Any input on this would be appreciated. :banghead:










Had a couple of codes on it. Hmm, I think these parts might be missing.









Ended the day with a leaking power steering line.


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

Power steering line fixed... MOBOZO can elaborate if he wants... The ticking (we hope) is a lifter that is compresed on itself. We tore down the top end, took out all of the lifters and found one that was solid as a rock. For now, we'll take one his other donor engine and run with it. Otherwise, we've got brakes to do and... uh... I think that's it... hu...










The "rotten egg":


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## alextjoe (Aug 7, 2008)

these vw hydro lifters are very common to drain of oil when sitting for an extended period of time..

when i swaped my ABA in my mk2 3 years ago..it had not ran for almost 4-5 months and on first start up i thought the engine was blown it was so lound...let it idle for almost 10 min and although the noise had reduced a bit was still very loud..

my buddy told me to take it around the block and see if it goes away and indeed a little 5 min drive and all the noise went away..

these lifters once drained take a very long time to fill up and sometimes they dont and you have to change them out...

anyways looking good!! :thumbup:


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

No progress today. Had planned on working on the brakes, but decided against it since we could not finish it. 

Overall, the week went pretty well. We did reach the goal of starting it. The only thing that did not get done that I wanted to was the brakes.

Unfortunately, I needed to go home today. Neohic has a couple of small things to work on. Other than that, this project is on hold until I can get back there with the flare tool to finish the brakes and the lifter.


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## 35i 2000 (Jan 27, 2005)

great build!!


watching this:thumbup:


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

I am trying to do some research to see how I can clear the codes I have set. 

01247 EVAP Purge Valve 

01265 EGR 

I found the resistor trick for the EGR code. Is there a similar trick for the EVAP code? 

Also, I was reading through the VR6 FAQ and came across the part about removing the TB coolant lines. It did not say why you would want to do this. I am assuming that the coolant lines are actually warming the incoming air and I can see why this would be bad. But why would VW want this? And is my assumption correct?


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## alextjoe (Aug 7, 2008)

MOBOZO said:


> I am trying to do some research to see how I can clear the codes I have set.
> 
> 01247 EVAP Purge Valve
> 
> ...


 those coolant lines are to warm up the TB on cold days/ winter to prevent it from sticking...metal shrinks when cold obviously and a tb is a tight fit to begin with..so with any etra dirt and a freezing TB they can stick... 

ive never had a problem by removing those coolant lines..they dont reach in a mk2 anyways so thats the only reason i removed them


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## mymotown (Jun 22, 2010)

Is that my Wide Boy?


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## mymotown (Jun 22, 2010)

deathhare. said:


> As amazing as the mounts look that youve built, the mount area on the car is the weak point. The mount you built is definitely beautiful but the location theyre attached to is very thin to hang the motor under without reinforcement.
> Your mount area is questionable in the long run, IMO. Even most people that put mounts on the side of the horns (mk3 style), as you have done, beef up the horn and I would say you need to. Again, its a very thin place to hang the motor from without reinforcement.
> 
> Mk4 mounts would have been a lot easier and reliable.
> ...


 Is that my Wide Boy?


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## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

Watching this lookin fuken awsome:thumbup: when you did the front mount did you cut out a section to box it?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> when you did the front mount did you cut out a section to box it?












He cut out everything and replaced it with 1/4 inch angle iron. Maybe a little strong. The original plan was 1/8 but there was a piece of 1/4 in the discount bin at the local steel yard.


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## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

Y angle iron and not square tubing?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

If we had gone with square tubing, it would have had to have been much smaller and welded at only the ends to fit into the space we had. Using the anle iron, we were able to just replace what was there with heavier metal. It also has a stock look to it.


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## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

Ahhh, :thumbup: I'm kinda puttin along on my swap doin research.. Are you seam welding as well to add strength?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

sweetrocco420 said:


> Ahhh, :thumbup: I'm kinda puttin along on my swap doin research.. Are you seam welding as well to add strength?


No. we did not do a complete tear down like most do during a swap like this.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

By the way, did venture out into the cold the other day to collect a few lifters from the spare engine. Just waiting to get back up to the car to finish it up.


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## alextjoe (Aug 7, 2008)

MOBOZO said:


> By the way, did venture out into the cold the other day to collect a few lifters from the spare engine. Just waiting to get back up to the car to finish it up.


let the lifters sit in a jar of fresh oil..which ever you are going to put in the motor..so when its time to put them in the motor they are not empty..

plus it will clean them..the oil will turn black


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

alextjoe said:


> let the lifters sit in a jar of fresh oil..which ever you are going to put in the motor..so when its time to put them in the motor they are not empty..
> 
> plus it will clean them..the oil will turn black


:thumbup:


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## mymotown (Jun 22, 2010)

The pic of the car show belongs to me. All the info you need is on my thread. Please go there for direct info as some of the stuff being said on the page aren't the facts. 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...-(Under-Construction)&p=68990737#post68990737


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Finally got back up here to work on it again. 

Got the replacement lifter in and the top end put back together. We started it up and it still had a small tick, but not nearly as bad. Let it run for a while to warm up. Sounded fine once it was warmed up. 

But, of course, a new problem came up. As it was running, the motor would jerk about once a minute. It was kind of like a misfire, but stronger. Felt more like an impact. It seemed to be coming from around the bell housing so we took off the inspection plate and starter to look at the flywheel. The flywheel was just machined so all of the teeth had a nice square edge. We found a section of about six teeth that the edges were worn. Looking at the starter, the gear did not retract all the way back without help. Thinking this is the problem. Need to see what a rebuild will cost. 

Also got the brake line run to the rear and everything bled out. 

So close to having this done.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Very nice.  

Waiting for the videos...


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> Waiting for the videos...


 Just running? Boring 

Right now, it'll get stuck trying to get out of the garage. 

Might have to wait till it makes it to the track. :laugh:


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

On that note, did run into one other big hiccup this weekend. The tach I use racing does not have a one cylinder option. Guess that means I need a new tach.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Not sure what you have but maybe this will help. 
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index....tegory_id=287/home_id=59/mode=prod/prd127.htm


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> Not sure what you have but maybe this will help.


 Thanks, but I have an aftermarket tach I put it when racing. Talking to the tech guys, it turns out it might work after all. I currently have the tach running off the coil pack. I forgot that a coil actually fires twice per engine revolution. Therefore, the tach needs to be set for a 2 cylinders, not 1.


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## Damian Grihalva (May 19, 2008)

opcorn: ~ fully watching this.


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## 1.8TRabbit (Nov 15, 2004)

Coming along nicely.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Neohic spent some time on it this weekend. He made the final adjustments on the clutch and sent me a video to prove that it works. He also got the horn working. Not sure what was going on there, but it didn't work after the VR6 was in.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

:thumbup:
Well done.


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

I dunno... I'm starting to like this little thing. 90% of ownership is possession, right?

Too bad these's even more snow now and even less of a chance of finding some good, dry pavement!


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

MOBOZO said:


> Neohic spent some time on it this weekend. He made the final adjustments on the clutch and sent me a video to prove that it works. He also got the horn working. Not sure what was going on there, but it didn't work after the VR6 was in.



not even a 4K Rev off the VR... boo


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> 90% of ownership is possession, right?


I still hold the title




> not even a 4K Rev off the VR... boo


Wait till it's nice out. We'll see if the clutch, and the neighbors, can handle a 5k dump.


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## 1.8TRabbit (Nov 15, 2004)

looking good. opcorn:


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## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

How bout a 5k drop where it sits:laugh: came along Nicely sir...:beer:


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## neohic (Nov 21, 2010)

MOBOZO said:


> I still hold the title


Only rivets...



sweetrocco420 said:


> How bout a 5k drop where it sits:laugh: came along Nicely sir...:beer:


Maybe if it wasn't a wall 20' in front of it. :banghead: For real... it already has a flat enough front!


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

First drive was disappointing. No power steering and no power. I know the exhaust manifold gaskets are leaking. Not sure how this could cause this much of a power loss.


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

fuel issue ?


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## 1.8TRabbit (Nov 15, 2004)

MOBOZO said:


> First drive was disappointing. No power steering and no power. I know the exhaust manifold gaskets are leaking. Not sure how this could cause this much of a power loss.


Describe your issues. We will help decipher them. :thumbup:


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## alextjoe (Aug 7, 2008)

well no power steering is not disappointing at all in my opinion lol.. i hate P.S to being with..

but no power deff sucks!! 

symptoms?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

It runs fine at idle. Beyond that, there is an over all lack of power. When I snap the throttle it hesitates reving up. Would the Cabby fuel pump have any trouble keeping up with the VR6's demands? Also getting some backfiring through the exhaust. I don't think there are any internal mechanical issues. I checked compression before starting this whole project and it was good on all six.

I am planning on starting with exhaust manifold gaskets, plugs, and cleaning the MAF. All things that should be done any way. But not sure that they would cause this big of a problem. 

I did not check codes ofter the drive, but since putting the resistors on the EGR, the only code I have seen is EVAP. 

Since all of the fabrication work is done, I am hoping to get it back to my place next week. I should be able to give a better explanation once it is home.

Any input is greatly appreciated.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Since that car came with CIS, the stock fuel pump should be fine.
Have you looked for big vacuum leaks?


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## alextjoe (Aug 7, 2008)

lack of power but no misfires?? at idle it runs smooth but any misfires under load? i have seen plenty of vr's with minor coil pack issues and it obviously created a large lack of power but with some noticeable misfires..

the cabby fuel pump can be very much the culprit although the psi ratting of the pump might be good enuf the flow can be to low..also we are talking about a 25 year old pump...can be dead as its also been sitting for a long time..

i would check Fuel pressure and most of all make sure this is a nice flow..

i would lead me to think a fuel issue as it run "fine" at idle but has no power and hesitates under load..

also if you have a vag com and the obd2 port is wirred up i would check maf reading o2 sensor readings and so on to maybe find and odd/off reading


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> also if you have a vag com and the obd2 port is wirred up i would check maf reading o2 sensor readings and so on to maybe find and odd/off reading


I have access to an OTC Genisys. Almost as good on VW as the Vag com. This one has the 2+2 and is hooked up. Any idea what group number I would look in for this data? And what normal reading on the MAF should be?


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

i Would agree with the MAF issues


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

The car will actually run with the MAF unplugged you know.
Not sure how well but I dont think its a MAF issue just because Ive never seen one backfire with a bad MAF.
Large intake leaks can cause that for sure.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

It actually would not idle without the MAF. Accidentally left it unplugged once and it kept dying.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Is there a chance the intake plastic elbow has a problem you didnt see?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> Is there a chance the intake plastic elbow has a problem you didnt see?


Just one more thing I need to check when I get it home.


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## redzone98 (Jun 10, 2004)

MOBOZO said:


> It actually would not idle without the MAF. Accidentally left it unplugged once and it kept dying.


:thumbup:


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Well, it is home. Parents dollied it down this weekend. Should be much easier to work on with it here.
Also have a gasket set on the way. Got a whole head gasket set since I need just about everything but the head gasket. 

I'll get to work as soon as I have a slightly warmer day. 13 days till spring. It better start to feel like it soon.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

Did you figure out the problem?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> Did you figure out the problem?


No, that is why it was brought down here. So I have more time to work on it.


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## Mr Black (Jan 20, 2002)

alextjoe said:


> you never thought of putting in a 1.8t ?.. iv had both a mk2 vr6 and a mk2 1.8t awp..
> 
> obviously power is no competition but...i do alot of track days..and i had the exact same suspension/swaybar set up as well it was the same car..it started with a vr then i swaped in a 1.8t..
> 
> ...


What do you expect the guy to do, scrap his entire project at this point  ?

Your points are all valid, and I have also gone from VR ownership back to 4-cyl in order to have a better balanced car....however this thing will be a monster on the street and will put a smile on the OP's face every time he punches the gas.

As for the running issues, I note you messed around with the timing chains/guides. Any chance your cam to crank timing is off now?

You might want to swap MAFs too, a faulty one will make a VR run like absolure garbage.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> As for the running issues, I note you messed around with the timing chains/guides. Any chance your cam to crank timing is off now?


I found that nice DIY chain replacement guide in the forums. Very nice. I followed it exactly and double and triple checked all of the marks. I will be replacing intake gaskets as soon as they get here. I will quadruple check the marks when I have the intake and valve cover off.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Had a little bit of time to play tonight. Rather than starting the big job of all the gaskets, decided to tackle the starter problem. Just cleaned all of the clutch goo off of it. Seems to be much better. Hopefully won't be a problem anymore.


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## vrcabby (Oct 6, 2006)

did you keep the stock hubs and 4 lugs? im having an issue trying to figure out what kind of bearing to get for my car. I have basically the same set up as you...


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> did you keep the stock hubs and 4 lugs? im having an issue trying to figure out what kind of bearing to get for my car. I have basically the same set up as you...


Yes, kept the stock 4 lugs. Also using the stock wheel bearings.


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## CasuallyWreckless (Aug 27, 2007)

U went the 16v Axel route no?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> U went the 16v Axel route no?


The '87 Cabby already has the 100mm flanges. They bolt right up to the VR6 trans. So I just stuck with them.


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## vrcabby (Oct 6, 2006)

MOBOZO said:


> The '87 Cabby already has the 100mm flanges. They bolt right up to the VR6 trans. So I just stuck with them.



Hey i got a question, im in a sort of a dilema. I had replaced my passanger side wheel bearing im assuming the mechanic ordered a oem one. When we tightened the axle nut the wheel bearing locked up the wheel, looks like on the back side it was touching the axle whic made it lock up. I have a sock 4 lug set up im assuming the stock axles were left but how would i now this? does a vr6 bearing fit the od of the oem spindle? or whats the difference from a vr6 to a 1.8L wheel bearing?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

> Hey i got a question, im in a sort of a dilema. I had replaced my passanger side wheel bearing im assuming the mechanic ordered a oem one. When we tightened the axle nut the wheel bearing locked up the wheel, looks like on the back side it was touching the axle whic made it lock up. I have a sock 4 lug set up im assuming the stock axles were left but how would i now this? does a vr6 bearing fit the od of the oem spindle? or whats the difference from a vr6 to a 1.8L wheel bearing?


 If you are using stock axles, hubs, bearings, etc, you should not have a problem. You may want to snap some pictures of this and start a thread on it. See if anyone has any ideas.


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## vrcabby (Oct 6, 2006)

MOBOZO said:


> If you are using stock axles, hubs, bearings, etc, you should not have a problem. You may want to snap some pictures of this and start a thread on it. See if anyone has any ideas.


 good idea! i will do so...


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Success!!! 

I replaced all intake and exhaust gaskets. I did find the exhaust leak and the new gaskets took care of that. It still ran like crap after, though. I decided to inspect the coil pack. I took it off, took it all apart so I could see the bottom. There was nothing significant. I put it all back together and it ran great. Had to have been a bad connection on one of the plug wires to the coil. Stupid to have missed that one. Oh well, not like I want to drive it yet anyway. And those gaskets should have been done before. 

One engine problem still remains. No power steering. I have the terrible feeling the pump is shot. I'll worry about that later. I still need to finish the gauge cluster, and unrelated to the swap, replace a tie rod end, align front and back, and get at least two tires before I can get it on the road.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Looking for a little help here. I am trying to wire in my oil pressure warning light. Keep in mind, I am using the MK1 light and the vr6 pressure switches. 

There are two pressure switches. One closes the circuit when there is low oil pressure (0.3 bar). This one seems to work properly. When the engine is not running, circuit is closed. When engine is running, circuit is open. 

I do not understand what the second switch is for. Is it looking for high oil pressure? If so, at what pressure does it open the circuit? This switch is staying closed at all times. 

Maybe I should only care about the low pressure switch?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Another question. 

I am trying to use the MK1 OXS light as a MIL light. I am feeding it keyed power and the other side is going to pin 5 on the ECU, which is supposed to be for the MIL. KOEO the light comes on as I would expect it to. KEOR the light goes off as I would expect it to. 

However, when I disconnect a sensor to set a code, it does not come on. When I read codes with my scan tool, I can see that there are codes there. Also, as I read or clear codes, the light flashes twice. This leads me to believe that it is hooked up properly. 

Does it just take some time for the ECU to turn on the light after disconnecting a sensor?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

And lastly, does anyone know how the alternator/battery light works? 

The wiring diagram I have from Alldata does not show which wire, if any, feeds it. I am guessing that either it is controlled by the ECU, or that is controlled by the IPC itself just looking at the incoming voltage. 

If it is controlled by the ECU, anyone know which wire controls it? 

If it is controlled by the IPC, I know I'm screwed. 

Or am I completely wrong?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Ok, I'm giving up on the alternator light. Looking at the printed circuit for the Cabby, I can see that it is handled in the IPC. There is a whole circuit on there with multiple resistors and other things just for this light. I have a volt gauge, who needs a dummy light, right?


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

What? No wiring gurus out there?

I think I got the MIL light. I am convinced now that the ECU is just waiting to turn the light on.

Think I also got the battery light. Had two MK1 clusters. One was a little less complicated than the other.

As for the oil light, can someone at least tell me what the second oil pressure switch is for? I think I may just disconnect it. Then at least I'll have a low pressure indicator.


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## deathhare. (Apr 1, 2008)

There is a high and low pressure sensor on the VR.
On my swap I just wired up the low pressure one to the light in the dash. :thumbup:


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Now I know for sure that the MIL works. I've been driving it around all day and it keeps coming on.
Engine speed sensor, vehicle speed sensor, and EVAP solenoid.

Had a spare engine speed sensor. VSS is on the way. Plugged the EVAP solenoid in and let it hang.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

So, here are a few pics of the finishing of the cluster.



















Neohic also made me a tach mount. I only put it on for racing.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

Took it for a nice drive today, even though I did not have power steering or a speedometer.

Wow, it is a completely different car. Power right away instead of at 3 grand. I like it. Cannot wait to get this thing the the drag strip.


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## MOBOZO (Dec 14, 2009)

There are still a couple of loose ends to finish up, power steering pump and VSS, but I am going to consider this project complete.

Thanks to all who have watched and contributed to this thread. Thanks especially to Neohic for all of his fine fab work.

If you would like to continue to keep up with this little Cabby, I started a new thread on modifications I have done and am planning to do and how they affect my 1/4 mile.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5228135-Modifications-and-Drag-Times-87-Cabby


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