# 2003 beetle just fixed now won't start



## scienceguy151 (Apr 29, 2004)

I just got the timing belt and water pump replaced on my wife's beetle. I drove it home last night from the shop (30 miles) with no problems. This morning it won't start. It turns over once then feels like it will be fine then dies. Battery and ignition coil are 2months old so I don't think those are the problem. Could the timing belt have slipped overnight? Any advice would be great before I call the shop back and have it towed. It has gas in the tank.


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## MyOtherRidesAVette (Nov 13, 2010)

Not knowing what else they may have done (typically in addition to replacing the tensioner on the tb, ppl also replace the serpentine belt and that belt tensioner when they do the tb and wp), or what they may have disconnected and then re-connected, it could be a number of things. Perhaps the serpentine belt is not tight, the car ran home on the battery, and the alternator is not charging. Call the shop who did the work, have them send someone out or send a flat bed tow truck. I would have to believe the problem is related to something they did or didn't do. Or call them, and try to speak to the mechanic who did the work, he will know what HE did exactly, and can tell you what to check. 

But in the meantime (and you can do no damage), since it is the weekend, throw a charger on the battery (leave it in the car and connected), slower charge, for a couple hours, and see if that doesn't solve the problem. If it is, getting the battery back up, will at least give you enough "juice" to get it back to the repair shop. Cars can run about 34-40 miles, even at night, on just the battery. Been there, done that, except in my case it was a bad alternator. However, you should have gottten a BAT light, as that is the warning light that monitors the alternator, not the battery.

MORAV


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## scienceguy151 (Apr 29, 2004)

Well the shop has it back and they say all the lines/hoses are hooked up properly, battery is good and they say that the only code that comes up is for the immobilizer.

That doesn't make sense though becasue the car turns over, fires once then dies like it is starved for air/fuel. If the problem was with the alarm then nothing would happen when I turn the key right? 


Any halp would be great. Thanks


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## Rockerchick (May 10, 2005)

Do any lights come on in the dash when you try to start it?


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## scienceguy151 (Apr 29, 2004)

Unfortunately no. I forgot the code# that the mechanic has, but he says it's the immobilizer. The mechanic comes highly recommended from multiple sources for VWs so I trust him. It's very frustrating. I'm driving up to try other keys tonight??? I think it recognizes the key in the door lock though because it doesnt set off the alarm if you use that key. Something in the computer iS telling the car to shut off. I personally think it has something to do with the timing belt repair because the problem started the day after I got it back. He disagrees. 

If that doesn't work he'll tow it to the dealer for a computer reprogram... Or whatever they'll do to it for $1000+. It never ends with this car.

Thanks


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## Rockerchick (May 10, 2005)

I'd get the actual code. If its the immobilizer, there should be a light that comes on when you try to start the car...I think its a car with a key through it or something. Only deals with starting the car, not unlocking it.


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## scienceguy151 (Apr 29, 2004)

The coder is 17978. After the car shuts off the 3 lights on the dash are battery epc(amber) and oil pressure. no lights come on before the car dies. It takes about a second to die.


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## Rockerchick (May 10, 2005)

Looks like it is immobilizer related: http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/17978/P1570/005488


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## IndyTTom (Oct 23, 2007)

scienceguy151 said:


> The coder is 17978. After the car shuts off the 3 lights on the dash are battery epc(amber) and oil pressure. no lights come on before the car dies. It takes about a second to die.


Have you tried to disconnect both battery cables and then touching them together for about a few seconds and then reconnecting the battery and then start it. That should boot the ECU and hopefully recognize your key. If not the dealer may have to rematch the key to the ECU. But since it worked prior to the timing belt installation I bet a cold boot of the ECU should fix your problem.
Don't spend 1000+ for a key match. That is just totally crazy. :screwy:


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## scienceguy151 (Apr 29, 2004)

Well it was the keys.... The dealer charged us 50 for the recode after we tried all the tricks to recode/reset the keys ourselves.

The newest problem: the alternator. It crapped out the same say I picked it up from the dealer. I was stranded by this piece of junk again. I'm on a first name basis with the tow truck guys now.

It's sad. The car only has 90k and it's had so many problems. My Forrester with 190k is supposed to be the trouble car... And it just keeps going. I thought my 80s vintage olds in high school was the worst car of all time. The new beetle has finally dethroned it. From now on when I reference a bad car this will be it. The thing was designed by idiots. 

VW is so out of touch with its customers. They think people stopped buying the beetle because it had the reputation of a chick car... No. People stopped buying them because they have the reputation of a lemon. The drain plug tearing the oil pan after 10 oil changes??? Come on!!! VW needs to get it's act together or it will suffer the fate of Saab.


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## richardbachman (Jul 18, 2002)

So, you have an eight year old car and you're starting to have things fail on it? That's what 

happens to all cars when they age. Want some cheese with your whine??


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## scienceguy151 (Apr 29, 2004)

Normally I would agree, but this last few months has been the icing ing the cake with this car. Everything has been replaced. Things have been going for years. The only thing left to go on this car is the clutch and engine. I'm sure they aren't far behind. I've never had a car leave me stranded like this car does. It would have more miles on it if it wasn't in the shop all the time.

My 89 cabby is more reliable... I wouldn't trust it to go to Florida, but at least it remembers what it's key looks like and doesn't leave me stuck in a parking lot. My Subaru that's 2years older with 2x the miles has less problems. 

Vw blew it with this design.


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## MyOtherRidesAVette (Nov 13, 2010)

No question about it. It's a NOVELTY CAR and comes with a price. Where they really effed up was trying to build a really affordable car with all the bells and whistles of a high priced brand/vehicle. Had to cut every possible corner, and then cut some that weren't cuttable, e.g. plastic impeller water pump. Funny though, except for not being a novelty car, you can get most of that in an Hyudai at a very affordable (well, by today's standards, anyway). 10 yr/100k mile warranty at half the price, or less.

M.


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## richardbachman (Jul 18, 2002)

Possibly a lemon. My 04 has never had any issue of any kind. 

Chin-up, I hope it gets better for you.:thumbup:


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## IndyTTom (Oct 23, 2007)

scienceguy151 said:


> Well it was the keys.... The dealer charged us 50 for the recode after we tried all the tricks to recode/reset the keys ourselves.
> 
> The newest problem: the alternator. It crapped out the same say I picked it up from the dealer. I was stranded by this piece of junk again. I'm on a first name basis with the tow truck guys now.
> 
> ...


 I have a 2000 VW Beetle with 160k + miles on it and so far there have been very little issues except for normal wear and tear like tires, brakes and the muffler went out at around 150k. But other than that it has been pretty much problem free. It doesn't use or burn a drop of oil between changes and the engine is as strong as it ever was. I believe there are lemons out there no matter what brand of manufacture. VW will never go the way of SAAB. Heck, VW is one of the largest and probably will be the largest Car manufacturer of this free world. They already own Audi, Porsche, Bentley, Lamborghini and companies like SEAT and other Auto companies that we probably here in the states have never heard of are using VW/Audi engines/transmissions and other technologies. So I am not too worried about VW's future. They will be around long after we are all fish food and soylent green.  Any car that hasn't been properly cared for can have problems especially if it is an older vehicle or had a lot of miles on it. It is tough to buy a used car because you just don't know how it was treated prior to you taking possession. 
I am sorry you are having so many issues with the beetle. Perhaps it is time to let it go and buy a brand you are happier with. But there are no guarantees. The next one could be an even bigger lemon. Good Luck with whatever you decide.


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## IndyTTom (Oct 23, 2007)

MyOtherRidesAVette said:


> No question about it. It's a NOVELTY CAR and comes with a price. Where they really effed up was trying to build a really affordable car with all the bells and whistles of a high priced brand/vehicle. Had to cut every possible corner, and then cut some that weren't cuttable, e.g. plastic impeller water pump. Funny though, except for not being a novelty car, you can get most of that in an Hyudai at a very affordable (well, by today's standards, anyway). 10 yr/100k mile warranty at half the price, or less.
> 
> M.


 The plastic impeller water pump was suppose to last a lot longer than it did and VW not only installed it in the VW Beetle but also in the Audi TT so I don't think it was to cut cost. 
I do think they did design that on purpose with longevity in mind. Thinking that a polymer/plastic 
 water pump would not corode as quickly has a metal one. However the impeller did weaken with time and failed prematurely in several vehicles. I do believe this design flaw was improved upon in later years and replaced with a metal pump. Even VW does learn from it's mistakes.


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## Rockerchick (May 10, 2005)

The plastic impeller was on other VWs as well, not just the Beetle, FYI. 

But I will say, now that I'm driving a GTI, VW really did cut corners with the NB. Not the same features or parts sometimes, and the other Mk4 cars do seem to just be built a little better.


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## richardbachman (Jul 18, 2002)

Rockerchick said:


> The plastic impeller was on other VWs as well, not just the Beetle, FYI.
> 
> But I will say, now that I'm driving a GTI, VW really did cut corners with the NB. Not the same features or parts sometimes, and the other Mk4 cars do seem to just be built a little better.


 
I disagree. Like what exactly do you mean? As far as corners being cut.


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## Rockerchick (May 10, 2005)

The cloth seats in other Mk4s are much nicer and don't stain nearly as easy, they got a coolant temp gauge as opposed to a dummy light...the car just feel of a higher quality than the NB did. I had my NB for 6 1/2 years and planned on keeping it many, many more. An accident took her from me and trust me, I loved that car. I still wish I had it over my GTI. But the Mk4s are not created equal. The NB was the forgotten Mk4 by many.


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## richardbachman (Jul 18, 2002)

Rockerchick said:


> The cloth seats in other Mk4s are much nicer and don't stain nearly as easy, they got a coolant temp gauge as opposed to a dummy light...the car just feel of a higher quality than the NB did. I had my NB for 6 1/2 years and planned on keeping it many, many more. An accident took her from me and trust me, I loved that car. I still wish I had it over my GTI. But the Mk4s are not created equal. The NB was the forgotten Mk4 by many.


 

Dam, I forgot about the temp light, you're right. The leathers in my nb are the most comfortable seats that I've sat in as far as vw though. When my family and I take a long road trip or vacation we take the nb over the Jetta wagon every time.:laugh:


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## Rockerchick (May 10, 2005)

I have Recaros in my GTI  (LOVE the 20th) Love having the adjustable lumbar support in them. Super comfy. Haven't driven the car longer than an hour straight yet but I look forward to a road trip in it. 

I know a lot of NB get upset about people saying "bad" things about the NB, but I did love the car and had it for a very long time. She was a '99 with only 102k on her and I wanted her to see 200k+. But VW really didn't care about the car as much as they seemed to the others. Its sad, because it could have been an even better car if they put more care into it, IMO.


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## Cadenza_7o (Jan 23, 2001)

Scienceguy - if the car isn't reliable anymore, get rid of it. Save yourself the frustration and $$$. 

It's really not the NB but VWs in general. The consistency of quality in Mk4 cars are iffy.... that's why VWVortex.com is such a hit!!!  You'll have those who have one problem after another and those with very few. BTW, some of the maintenance guideline set by VW for Mk4 cars are actually counter-productive if you're keeping your car for a long time.... ie 105k timing belt change, lifetime transmission fluid. Anyone who followed these schedules is bound to be pissed off when the car hits 6 digits. 

Here's a thread I started in '03: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...Lifetime-auto-transmission-fluid-(baloney!!!)

My '01 NB 1.8T has been a good daily driver... knock on wood!!! But to be honest, the seat heater smoked the day I drove it off the dealer lot. That was scary funny. They kept it for a month before I got to drive my "NEW" Beetle but threw in about $400 of accessories to say "sorry". At 11k, I had it towed due to bad coil packs. At 40k the MAF and DV had to be replaced. Good thing the Emission Warranty covered the $365 MAF. At that point, I didn't think it would make pass 100k. Low and behold, 11 years later and it's still running. Good thing I can tinker a bit and learned to do maintenance and minor repairs.... and saved a few bucks in the process. So far I've spent $6330 for EVERYTHING except registration, insurance, gas and the cost of purchase. That works out to $575/year, which is quite decent. 

AAA did a study and calculated the average cost of ownership over 5 years for the Civic, Corolla, Sentra and Focus to be at $0.42 per mile, 17.5k per year. Using the AAA method, my cost is $0.34 per mile, 17.8k per year and 11 years of ownership. Of course, doing my own work helped. However, ask me if I would recommend a VW? I'd probably say "HonDuh". It's not just VW but any Euro car. We have Porsche, Audi, MB, BMW, Mini, VW, Lexus, Honda, Toyota and Nissan in the extended family. Those with German cars have the most to complain about. In a couple of years, I might roll the dice with the Mk6 Beetle. Sadistic or lucky.... I'll find out. 




Rockerchick said:


> _I know a lot of NB get upset about people saying "bad" things about the NB, but I did love the car and had it for a very long time. She was a '99 with only 102k on her and I wanted her to see 200k+. But VW really didn't care about the car as much as they seemed to the others. Its sad, because it could have been an even better car if they put more care into it, IMO._


Sorry to hear about your NB. Two of my fellow club NB drivers also had accidents. One was T-boned, the other rolled over. Both ended up buying NB again. 

Mine currently has 193k and I hope it goes to 250k. It's done 3 long trips this year, with the longest (2000 mile) trip from SoCal to the Oregon border and back. I'm planning to replace most of the suspension bushings with the tires early next year. These tires will be the 5th set. 

Mendocino coast









It's seen more dirt roads than most SUVs... here in the Redwood Natl Park


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## scienceguy151 (Apr 29, 2004)

The saga continues. It just stranded my pregnant wife again. The issue was the brand new alternator that Vw put in a month ago. It was running really well so i thought we were in the clear. They said they couldn't find anything underlying that's wrong with it that is causing these electrical problems. At least they said they would fix it for free... I don't know if that's worth it though.

Can't buy a new car though because we're in the process of buying a house. Another loan on the credit is not an option, and we need 2 cars.

Is there anything I should tell them to look for that might be an global issue causing these problems.

At this point I call the car my "gold digger.". It's cute, then it took all my money then broke my heart.

Edit: Vw dealer won't even give me a loaner car. That's customer service you can count on.


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