# Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

I just finished road testing my car after bypassing the N249, in a much more direct and "clean" method than some of the ones I've seen suggested. It works great, partial throttle is MUCH smoother and predictable - no jerky boost.
All I did was this:
1. Trace the path of the top (actuator) hose from the DV. It goes to a metal tube that runs along the block, then to another rubber hose, then underneath the intake manifold to the N249. 
2. Remove the hose that connects the tube to the N249, at the side closer to the N249. There is a reusable clamp, just pinch it with pliers and pull the tube off.
3. Cap the tube to the N249 with a rubber hose cap (available at Auotzone, etc.) and clamp it on there with a hose clamp.
4. Tapinto the FPR vacuum/boost line, which is RIGHT NEXT to the hose you just disconnected. It's the thinner braided hose that goes to the FPR.
5. Using a 3/16" x 3/16" x 3/16" T fitting, connect the newly disconnected N249 hose to the T.
Voila. Instant, clean bypass. Works like a charm, looks stock.


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

All you need to do this is:
1. 2 hose clamps
2. 3/16" T fitting (plastic works fine)
3. 5/16" rubber cap


----------



## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

very nice man. for now I was just going to cap of the line from the dv valve, and run a new one.


----------



## nrml (Jan 21, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Seanathan)*

always good to see useful info on this forum http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## enginerd (Dec 15, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Seanathan)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I Just did it this way myself. Except I tee'd into the other Vac line right next to the FPR line on the underside of the manifold. I already tee'd the FPR line once for my boost gauge. Also, I used a ss bolt to plug the hose instead of capping it at the N249. Boost is much more predictable at part throttle.


----------



## turbovw18 (Jul 5, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (enginerd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *enginerd* »_ http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I Just did it this way myself. Except I tee'd into the other Vac line right next to the FPR line on the underside of the manifold. I already tee'd the FPR line once for my boost gauge. Also, I used a ss bolt to plug the hose instead of capping it at the N249. Boost is much more predictable at part throttle. 
 i took this route as well... works just fine http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## 1.8tizzle (May 22, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (turbovw18)*

I did it a more ghetto, easy way. The black vaccum box on the valve cover....... i unbolted it, and followed that line to where its plugged. Pulled that hose, and just put a cap over the tube where the line went to. Works fine for me.


----------



## DJKeebler (Dec 6, 2001)

Is this another possible solution to upgrading the N75 when surging is a problem? I'm still learning about my motor and saving for a VAG-COM setup so I don't want to do anything that will throw codes or cause more problems.


----------



## Mk4Jettaboy (Jul 21, 2003)

*Re: (DJKeebler)*

My car surges also, im running garrett software. It only surges at WOT in a high gear. Is this a remidy for my problem, Sorry im not the smartest at engines


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (1.8tizzle)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.8tizzle* »_I did it a more ghetto, easy way. The black vaccum box on the valve cover....... i unbolted it, and followed that line to where its plugged. Pulled that hose, and just put a cap over the tube where the line went to. Works fine for me. 

This doesn't actually bypass the N249 - the electronic valve still mediates what the DV sees. It helps because the valve can no longer introduce vacuum to the mix. 
What I did is plug the DV directly into the intake manifold. The DV now sees exactly what is in the manifold, there's nothing inbetween.
There may not be any practical difference - but I like knowing that the DV actuation is directly from the manifold.


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: (Mk4Jettaboy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Mk4Jettaboy* »_My car surges also, im running garrett software. It only surges at WOT in a high gear. Is this a remidy for my problem, Sorry im not the smartest at engines

Try bypassing the N249 as I suggested. It may help, it may not, but it's a very cheap mod that you should do regardless.


----------



## GTIMOLA (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dbrowne1* »_
This doesn't actually bypass the N249 - the electronic valve still mediates what the DV sees. It helps because the valve can no longer introduce vacuum to the mix. 
What I did is plug the DV directly into the intake manifold. The DV now sees exactly what is in the manifold, there's nothing inbetween.
There may not be any practical difference - but I like knowing that the DV actuation is directly from the manifold.

I did this and now have severe fluttering of my hyperboost DV. Cleaned and lubed it and that didn't help. I believe that the n249 also serves to assist in slamming the DV open as fast as possible via the extra vac in the black canister. I was not having any problems with the N249 opening the DV when I didn't want it to so I may be putting the canister back on and reconnecting everthing in a stock manner.


----------



## SlvrBllt (Oct 15, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (GTIMOLA)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GTIMOLA* »_
I did this and now have severe fluttering of my hyperboost DV. Cleaned and lubed it and that didn't help. I believe that the n249 also serves to assist in slamming the DV open as fast as possible via the extra vac in the black canister. I was not having any problems with the N249 opening the DV when I didn't want it to so I may be putting the canister back on and reconnecting everthing in a stock manner. 

The problem here is your hyperboost DV and too stiff of a spring. With a Forge valve, mine does the same thing. With the stock valve it works like a champ.
Have you tried reversing your DV?


----------



## JettaRed (Aug 14, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Is the sole purpose to eliminate surging or fluttering at high boost levels (>15 psi)?


----------



## GTIMOLA (Mar 19, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (SlvrBllt)*

I figured that this was the problem. Unfortunately, the stock dv failed and I would really like to use the Hyperboost. I wonder if there is a way that I could modify the current spring or get a softer spring.


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (GTIMOLA)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GTIMOLA* »_
I did this and now have severe fluttering of my hyperboost DV. Cleaned and lubed it and that didn't help. I believe that the n249 also serves to assist in slamming the DV open as fast as possible via the extra vac in the black canister. I was not having any problems with the N249 opening the DV when I didn't want it to so I may be putting the canister back on and reconnecting everthing in a stock manner. 

I have an older Forge 006 valve (it's almost 4 years old) and it works fine with the bypassed setup. Zero flutter. I'm holding 25-27psi in the lower rpms, 20psi at 5K, using an MBC.
If you had better performance with the N249/vac cannister then by all means go back to using it. Results are what matter. One thing that's nice about the setup I suggest is that it is easily reversible. The only "permanent" change is cutting the fpr line, and that's easily fixed with a plug on the T or a plastic hose connector.


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (JettaRed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JettaRed* »_Is the sole purpose to eliminate surging or fluttering at high boost levels (>15 psi)?

Main purpose is to reduce flutter and resulting jerky boost at partial throttle, between 0 and 5psi of boost, where the N249 seems to get confused and can make your throttle very sensitive and jerky. It worked well for me.


----------



## JettaRed (Aug 14, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

It amazes me how every car is soooo different.


----------



## hugemikeyd (Aug 28, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

that is a great way to do it, keeps it looking stock since you are changing an area normally hidden by engine covers...


----------



## coolvdub (Feb 19, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (hugemikeyd)*

I looked at my car an '02 Jetta and the small braided line goes to the Combi valve not the FPR. So my question is, did you actually tap into the FPR line which is braided also and very short or the line feeding the Combi valve, also braided, but longer and right next to the line that feeds the N249 valve.


----------



## hugemikeyd (Aug 28, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (coolvdub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *coolvdub* »_I looked at my car an '02 Jetta and the small braided line goes to the Combi valve not the FPR. So my question is, did you actually tap into the FPR line which is braided also and very short or the line feeding the Combi valve, also braided, but longer and right next to the line that feeds the N249 valve.

if you are talking from the intake minifold, its the same vaccum/boost source, so it doesn't matter...
but i would use the FPR line.


----------



## coolvdub (Feb 19, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (hugemikeyd)*

Okay, thanks for the advice. I will do exactly that.


----------



## turbotazzy (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (coolvdub)*

Okay, I just did this mod. Partial throttle is improved bigtime over what it was before. A couple times, I punched it and backed off the throttle. I had the lurch a couple of times but it went away after more driving.
However, I think I'm still getting a DV flutter. I have the 710N valve and it sounds like the DV is opening and closing rapidly at partial throttle while it hisses. Ssss-sss-ss-ss-sssss-sss-sss! Lol! Would a MBC help or maybe an adjustable DV (GReddy Type S) so that I can play with the settings and try to adjust it?
By the way, I tee'd into the fpr line. It was a b*tch to get to! 5 minute job? Yeah... okay.










_Modified by turbotazzy at 4:40 PM 5-8-2004_


----------



## VWJETTAVW (Nov 18, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (turbotazzy)*








to get to? The fpr line is like right there, it should take 2 minutes to cut it and put a t on it


----------



## turbotazzy (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (VWJETTAVW)*

Maybe I used the wrong T. I used3/16" x 3/16" x 3/16". It didn't go on very easily. That combined with what I found to be tight quarters (couldn't get a firm grip on it to push the hose on the t) didn't make it a 2-minute job... for me. That fpr line is short!!!


----------



## goualon69 (Dec 27, 2002)

some picture of what you are talking? because i plan to do it, i have to try everything to solve my problem! thanks


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (turbotazzy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbotazzy* »_
By the way, I tee'd into the fpr line. It was a b*tch to get to! 5 minute job? Yeah... okay.










I'm sorry, but a one-armed ape with downs syndrome and a butter knife could do this in 5 minutes. The line is practically staring you in the face if you are looking down at the point where you detach the hose between the DV and the N249.
The 3/16" T fitting is tight, but tight is good. It means it won't come loose, even if you don't use clamps on it.


_Modified by dbrowne1 at 12:45 PM 5-12-2004_


----------



## keycom (Sep 27, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Any reason for those of us unchipped (as yet) to do this mod? I don't have any noticeable surging or other problems.
P.S. I typed this with one hand, using my butter knife.


----------



## turbotazzy (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dbrowne1* »_
The line is practically staring you in the face if you are looking down at the point where you detach the hose between the DV and the N249.
_Modified by dbrowne1 at 12:45 PM 5-12-2004_

Just because it's staring me right in the face doesn't mean it's easy to work with. It took 1 minute to cut the line and put the tee on one end of the hose but to put the other tee on was a pain to me. You can't tell me you can put two hands in there without a problem. The fpr line is very short!
My setup doesn't look like this:
http://www.aurealanrealms.org/~tjboyer/PIPING.jpg
If it did, it would be much easier... but whatever. I'm 90% surge-free now. Thanks for the write-up. No thanks for the sarcasm.


----------



## Stroked1.8t (Jan 9, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (turbotazzy)*

be smarter then what you are working on. if you can't get it with the hose on, remove it, you can also turn the FPR to the side to allow you better access to the Vac line. this is a very simple thing to do.


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (turbotazzy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbotazzy* »_
If it did, it would be much easier... but whatever. I'm 90% surge-free now. Thanks for the write-up. No thanks for the sarcasm.









Well, you're welcome for the writeup. That's why I put it here. 
Please note that NOWHERE in the writeup did I say that is was a "five minute job," a term that you injected and which you sarcastically commented upon in your entirely unnecessary and unsolicited response. Also note that I have not one, but TWO 3/16" T fittings in my "short" fpr line. That's probably because it isn't really that short at all.


----------



## bump909 (Jun 30, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

awesome, thanks for the write up dbrowne. my part throttle is horrible.. hopefully this will improve it.


----------



## turbotazzy (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

My comment was never meant sarcastically and it wasn't directed towards you. Okay, I'll stop this unnecessary bickering and keep this thread on topic.
Question: How do I stop the lurching I get when I let off the throttle slowly? Is this a DV issue? This doesn't happen when I let off quickly. I've read that the DV opens when you're on boost and closes when you let off. I have the 710N valve so it's non-adjustable. Would an adjustable DV help resolve this issue? I thought bypassing the N249 would help but it hasn't.
Thanks in advance.


----------



## guywhoisjustin (Mar 17, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Would this mod be any good with stock engine?


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (guywhoisjustin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *guywhoisjustin* »_Would this mod be any good with stock engine? 

It is meant to solve a specific issue (partial throttle sensitivity) which is not usually an issue in stock cars.


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (turbotazzy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *turbotazzy* »_Question: How do I stop the lurching I get when I let off the throttle slowly? Is this a DV issue? This doesn't happen when I let off quickly. I've read that the DV opens when you're on boost and closes when you let off. I have the 710N valve so it's non-adjustable. Would an adjustable DV help resolve this issue? I thought bypassing the N249 would help but it hasn't.
Thanks in advance.

That sounds like a DV issue, not a N249 issue. Get a Forge/Bailey/Hyperboost/anything but plastic DV.


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Thanks for the write-up, and thanks turbotazzy for the picture http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'll give this a try this weekend hopefully!


----------



## turbotazzy (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

I've got a Hyperboost with an adjustable top sitting on the shelf. I'll give that a try. Thanks.


----------



## Stroked1.8t (Jan 9, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Sorry I am little lost, is this the hose to disconnect and T into the FPR vac line?


----------



## JettAffair (Jan 7, 2004)

That's one of the hoses that runs from the vac canister. that can be pulled out and capped off. So can the one next to it. So yes, when you do that you can then t into the fpr line for the dv.


----------



## SlvrBllt (Oct 15, 2001)

*Re: (JettAffair)*

Actually I think it was the one on the right for my car. I also tapped the vacuum source that goes to the PCV rather than the FPR. Its closer and larger.


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Stroked1.8t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Stroked1.8t* »_










I just came in from trying to do this mod. It was night time, so I was not able to follow the DV actuator hose much further than the hard tube it connects to. In the picture above, is it confirmed that the hose on the right is the one that is connected to the FPR line via a T-connector? This particular hose probably has a 3/8" I.D., I dont know how you could attach this to a 3/16" T.







Also to people attempting this for the first time, the job is easier if you move the smog hose out of the way by taking off the two 10mm nuts that hold it in place.


----------



## QT_GTI (Mar 20, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

pics to show?


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (QT_GTI)*

Of what, the two 10mm nuts I removed? Can someone who has already done this mod please answer the question I asked in my previous post.


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

?


----------



## JettAffair (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (4ceFed4)*

I don't see an earlier post from you? maybe I just looked over it.
As far as tapping into the fpr line with one of the existing hoses, why not just take those hoses out and use a new hose? It's much easier and then you are able to get rid of all the hoses left over from the n249.


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (4ceFed4)*


_Quote, originally posted by *4ceFed4* »_
I just came in from trying to do this mod. It was night time, so I was not able to follow the DV actuator hose much further than the hard tube it connects to. In the picture above, is it confirmed that the hose on the right is the one that is connected to the FPR line via a T-connector? This particular hose probably has a 3/8" I.D., I dont know how you could attach this to a 3/16" T.









What hoses are you talking about replacing? The one that originally goes to the DV?


----------



## DJKeebler (Dec 6, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (turbotazzy)*



turbotazzy said:


> Question: How do I stop the lurching I get when I let off the throttle slowly? Is this a DV issue? This doesn't happen when I let off quickly. I've read that the DV opens when you're on boost and closes when you let off. I have the 710N valve so it's non-adjustable. Would an adjustable DV help resolve this issue? I thought bypassing the N249 would help but it hasn't.QUOTE]
> Sounds like the same problem I'm facing. I don't know if another DV will help cause I have the Forge 007 in my car and still experience something like this. I was hoping that bypassing the N249 would solve this but it doesn't look like it will. If anyone has experienced this and found a solution, it would be appreciated. Must be common since I am using a lot of the same parts as other people.
> Also, has anyone tapped the FPR line twice with T-fittings? I have my boost gauge and am just waiting for my pod to install it. But if I tap the FPR line to bypass the N249, can I still install another T-fitting for my boost gauge?


----------



## BORABRYAN18T (Apr 16, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

do u disconnect the electronic part of the valve when capping both the dv vacuum line off and the vac cannister line off? 
in my case heres my situation, once a blue moon while i'm ripping it from 1st to 2nd, its seems as if the dv gets stuck open in between shifts. is this the n249's doing?








thanks


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (BORABRYAN18T)*

Please someone.... is the hose that is being T'd into the FPR line one of the two shown in the picture a few posts up, and if so, is the hose on the right the correct one?


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (JettAffair)*


_Quote, originally posted by *JettAffair* »_I don't see an earlier post from you? maybe I just looked over it.
As far as tapping into the fpr line with one of the existing hoses, why not just take those hoses out and use a new hose? It's much easier and then you are able to get rid of all the hoses left over from the n249.

Uh, because you already have a fully integrated hose and hardpipe installed that you can use, and it's much faster to reverse the process if you don't go ripping all the factory hoses out?


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (4ceFed4)*

It's whichever one goes directly back to the DV. I don't remember which one it is, but it's very easy to trace it back. It should take you literally 10 seconds.


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

I am unable to trace it back. I have tried during bright daylight since my first attempt at night and I can't follow it once it goes a foot dow the block. Maybe if I was underneath the car. If you dont mind, could you take a look at your car and see if it is right or left?


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (4ceFed4)*


_Quote, originally posted by *4ceFed4* »_I am unable to trace it back. I have tried during bright daylight since my first attempt at night and I can't follow it once it goes a foot dow the block. Maybe if I was underneath the car. If you dont mind, could you take a look at your car and see if it is right or left?

You have a different model and year - I don't want to say "left or right" and then have it turn out to be different on your car. Really, if you can't trace it back using your fingers at least, you shouldn't be doing this at all.


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

I'm assuming the layout on your model and year is different than mine, because unless your freaking Gumby there is no way you could trace this using your fingers. I'm 6'3", and have long flexible arms and I couldn't trace this back. I have done things with cars a lot more complicated than re-routing a vac/boost hose, I think I can say it's something I'm competent to do.







I'm just going to blow some compressed air in the hose that normally connects to the top of the DV and make sure I've got the right hose.


----------



## JettAffair (Jan 7, 2004)

One of the lines using the metal runs to the vac canister and the other runs to the dv, if I remember correctly. I took both of those lines out and the vac canister as well, and then t'ed a new line into the fpr hose and ran that to the dv. All of this only takes about ten minutes, depending on your luck with the hose clamps.
I t'ed into the fpr line for the dv and then further down the new dv line I t'ed into that for the boost gauge. It seems to work fine.


----------



## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

*Re: (JettAffair)*

Geez. I'll just take some pictures to post up. 
Its really damn easy to see. The stock dv line goes into a metal line. Then it meets up with another line (thus why you cant pull the original line out), then goes back into a rubber line straight into the n249.. 
I hardly ever say this, but if you can't follow a line, then I wouldn't be working on your car. Or at least have someone with you that knows what they're doing....


----------



## BORABRYAN18T (Apr 16, 2003)

*Re: (Seanathan)*

when doing this little mod, do u also plug up the hose running to the vacuum cannister?


----------



## turbotazzy (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re:*

Well I couldn't follow the line either. I'm no tech guy but everyone's making this out to be a piece of cake when it isn't for some of us. How the *hell* do you follow a line that disappears after you trace it for one foot? It goes UNDERNEATH the engine. I guess my frickin' x-ray vision is on the blink again...










_Modified by turbotazzy at 10:17 PM 5-23-2004_


----------



## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

*Re: (BORABRYAN18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BORABRYAN18T* »_when doing this little mod, do u also plug up the hose running to the vacuum cannister? 

The vacuum canister just unplugs. REALLY simple. Make sure to plug that hole too







Also, I have an AWP (2002) and the line is really damn simple to follow.. Look for the rubber going into a metal hardpipe (tiny tiny tiny).


----------



## DJKeebler (Dec 6, 2001)

All I gotta say is that ANYONE who works on their dub should have a Bentley manual for reference. Nothing is more important. If you don't have the Bentley, I honestly don't think you should be doing any modifications to your car.


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: (DJKeebler)*

I do own an bentley manual, and I agree that it is an essential aide.


----------



## RABIDRABBIT1983 (May 13, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Stroked1.8t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Stroked1.8t* »_Sorry I am little lost, is this the hose to disconnect and T into the FPR vac line?










K guys your making it more confusing then it is......see the shiney metal circular thing at the end of the fuel rail in that pic? that rubber line coming off that is what you want to splice into. Make it easy on yourselves.
1)cut factory clamp off FPR rubber line
2)dont worry about where the F-in line goes to
3)plug a "T" into the line you pulled off FPR and put a new piece of hose from the T back into the FPR
4)now your FPR is plugged in and you still have 1 portion of the "T" not used.
5)use that no used leg of the "T" fitting for your boost gauge and your DV
6)obviously a few more hoses and "T" fitting need to be created from the FPR "T" you installed so you can run to the DV & boost gauge 
your end result will look like this
http://www.aurealanrealms.org/~tjboyer/PIPING.jpg
7)pull line off DV follow it down to the N249 valve you can either put a bolt in this line or pull the line off the N249 and cap off the N249
8)the link i posted should explain the rest if not........
PUT THE WRENCHES DOWN AND STEP AWAY FROM THE VEHICLE!

_Modified by RABIDRABBIT1983 at 2:08 AM 5-25-2004_


_Modified by RABIDRABBIT1983 at 2:12 AM 5-25-2004_


----------



## outlaw (May 12, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (outlaw)*

I finished this mod and the results are noticable but not as dramatic as I was hoping for. On my car the correct hose ended up being the left hose in the picture on this post. The easiest way to determine which line to T into the FPR line is to disconnect one of them, and blow air into the hose that connects to the top of the DV, much simpler than trying to trace the line with your eyes or finger.


----------



## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (4ceFed4)*


_Quote, originally posted by *4ceFed4* »_I finished this mod and the results are noticable but not as dramatic as I was hoping for. On my car the correct hose ended up being the left hose in the picture on this post. The easiest way to determine which line to T into the FPR line is to disconnect one of them, and blow air into the hose that connects to the top of the DV, much simpler than trying to trace the line with your eyes or finger. 

WTF?? The line you T into the fpr is the line that was shown.. that line goes straight to the intake manifold..


----------



## 4ceFed4 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Seanathan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Seanathan* »_
WTF?? The line you T into the fpr is the line that was shown.. that line goes straight to the intake manifold.. 

I'm not sure what you're talking about... to clarify on my part, I used the line that is indicated by a red arrow in one of the pictures on this page of the thread. This was the hose that connected directly to the DV, and the one that is supposed to be used.


----------



## Stroked1.8t (Jan 9, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Seanathan)*

Settle down man!
The hard metal line is a little difficult to see much less trace with your fingers. I was trying to get someone to confirm that the line in the pic above or on the first page is infact the same line as attached to the DV. No this isn't a hard thing to do if you are certain that you are "T"ing the correct line into the FPR line. Everyone is not as mechanically inclined like you apparently are. Please don't take this the wrong way, I am not trying to be a ****, some just need a little help.


_Modified by Stroked1.8t at 5:34 PM 5-26-2004_


----------



## DJKeebler (Dec 6, 2001)

I finally did this mod this past weekend. The metal line is actually really hard to trace back to the DV. I had to try and follow it several times before figuring out which one it was. I was expecting much more of a difference but it wasn't really noticeable. Boost does come on a little more smoothly and I have less surging but it's still a problem. I think I may have a vaccum leak so I need to go back through and check all the clamps. Plus, I also had a hard time connecting the rubber DV line to the T fitting. Even with a clamp, I'm thinking I still have a leak. 
Can I also cap off the line next to the DV hose which is supposedly going to the vac cannister?


----------



## Nonlinear Optics (May 14, 2003)

*Re: (DJKeebler)*

I had an enlightening conversation with a buddy of mine, a master Audi Tech, about bypassing the N249 the other day.
He was curious how many people that do this also notice small backfires from the exhaust afterwards? Nothing huge (yet), but enough to be noticable ...


----------



## Don R (Oct 4, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dbrowne1* »_
It is meant to solve a specific issue (partial throttle sensitivity) which is not usually an issue in stock cars.

I still have yet to do this mod...


----------



## Nonlinear Optics (May 14, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Don R)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Don R* »_
I still have yet to do this mod...









Mine is still virgin as well. After the conversation I had with a tech yesterday, it just may stay that way ...


----------



## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

*Re: (Raman Gain)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Raman Gain* »_I had an enlightening conversation with a buddy of mine, a master Audi Tech, about bypassing the N249 the other day.
He was curious how many people that do this also notice small backfires from the exhaust afterwards? Nothing huge (yet), but enough to be noticable ...

First I've heard about this... 
I Have not noticed ANY backfires at all. Drive over 100 miles today too in CITY driving.







Only thing is I need a bigger t-fitting and possibly bigger ID vacuum hose because mine is having a small flutter. 
I'm sure the n249 is just another idiot proof device that VW put on there in case something went wrong. I thought the old 1.8t's in the Audi's didn't use a n249 valve.. and alot of people who do swaps and such get rid of the thing as well.










_Modified by Seanathan at 5:43 AM 6-4-2004_


----------



## Stroked1.8t (Jan 9, 2004)

*Re: (Seanathan)*

My 99 Passat, AEB engine, doesn't have an N249 and boost is very predictable and there isn't even the slightlest surging. DV signal line connect directly to the manifold. 
EDIT: Just got back from the auto parts store getting the few parts to try this on my 01 Jetta. I only had to drive for about 3 seconds before I could feel the difference. I gained one PSI of boost at initial spool up and it takes a little longer for the boost to fall off to normal levels. This is all on the stock programming. Samco TIP is the only mod I have. This cost be less then $5 so if it doesn't work then you aren't out much.
I remember a while back someone was having a problem with boost after a hard shift. Boost wouldn't build immediately after engaging the next gear. I was having the same problem, well that is no longer an issue. Boost is there when you romp it, hard shift of not.











_Modified by Stroked1.8t at 4:55 AM 6-6-2004_


----------



## SnowGTI2003 (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: (Stroked1.8t)*

I just got back from bypassing the N249. I am soooooooooooooo happy I did this. Boost was sort of chopping and unpredictable before, but now it's SMOOOOOOTH!








One interesting side effect though. My DV ( 710N ) noise has changed slightly. It has gone from a 'whoooooosh' ( stock ) to more of a 'pssssst' which sounds slightly higher pitched. No flutter at all now too which is nice.
Anyhow I love this mod. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Raman Gain - What did the tech tell you that made you not want to do this mod?


----------



## 4string (Sep 26, 2001)

*Re: (SnowGTI2003)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SnowGTI2003* »_ No flutter at all now too which is nice

I did this mod too and am very pleased with the performance of the car now. I used to have quite a bit of part throttle surging and now it is completely gone.


----------



## CaryC (May 10, 2000)

*Re: (4string)*

I just did this mod and as an added bonus, discovered that my FPR vacuum hose was badly cracked and leaking, causing the too-rich idle and too-lean boost.
Replaced that hose and did the bypass, and the car feels wayyy better than it has in months! Smooth part-throttle response, and much stronger pull at >4000 rpm.
BTW, I had trouble finding the 3/16" plastic tee, so I ended up creating one using 4 separate brass fittings purchased in the plumbing dept at Home Depot. Its a little heavy and bulky, but seems to work well so far.


----------



## SHUMopper (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: (CaryC)*

bypassed mine. Surging is gone.
Did this in conjunction with the addition of a Greddy Type S ran in DV mode from the charge pipe.
Very pleased with the results. Boost holds much better then with my Forge.


----------



## bump909 (Jun 30, 2002)

*Re: (SHUMopper)*

i'm doing this tonight.. just one question for those of you running boost gauges (hopefully all of you). my gauge is currently tapped into the fpr line.. did you guys just put another t in the same line or did you do something different?


----------



## ruba_dubdub (Dec 26, 2002)

*Re: (bump909)*

I tapped into that same line. I put 2 T's inline before it got to the FPR, then tapped one T to the line that goes to my BOV, and the other for my boost gauge.


----------



## jeller (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: (ruba_dubdub)*

I did this mod yesterday and the car is alot smoother in partial throttle, much smoother through 5-10psi. Tapped it into the line under the mani. Didnt want to put anoter T in the FPR line agian. Just wanted it to look neater/hiden. this mod gets a http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## bump909 (Jun 30, 2002)

*Re: (jeller)*

completed this last night.. i gotta say, my car is way more responsive now. throttle is smooth and crisp. question to everyone who has done this though.. did any of you remove the vac canister above cylinder #4? it's not being used anymore right?


----------



## DubThis (Apr 1, 2003)

I have a situation where my boost will hit 5psi under a very light load then drop to 10 InHg where it should be after a couple seconds. Has anyone else seen this? and will this mod cure it?
Thanks,
Kris


----------



## BORA 18T (Mar 17, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Raman Gain)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Raman Gain* »_
Mine is still virgin as well. After the conversation I had with a tech yesterday, it just may stay that way ...

Can you explain why your having second thoughts?


----------



## Royale5 (Oct 26, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (BORA 18T)*

I did this last night, wow the boost is so smooth, any surging is gone. I have a boost gauge already hooked up to my fpr line. So rather than having a 2 T splits hooked up i found 1 T with 2 outputs on in. Got it at advanced auto for like $2.50 It looks like this...... 

fpr line
|
|____ boost gague
|
|____ cut and capped hose
|
|
fpr line
Looks clean with out a bunch of extra hose or T connectors. I may be beating this to death, I just wasnt sure if anyone has used this method yet.


----------



## KoolAidKid (Jul 31, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Royale5)*

Well I finally did it today. What can I say, it was worth the $6. No more stutter at all. The DV sound did change as stated earlier. I used a 3/16, 3/16 to 1/4" tee. Did a better job fitting the stock hose. Also, i just ran it inline with my boost gauge. Just cut the line, put on the tee and reattached the gauge and clamped the dv hose to it. Too easy of a mod not that I have done it.


----------



## ruba_dubdub (Dec 26, 2002)

*Re: (bump909)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bump909* »_ question to everyone who has done this though.. did any of you remove the vac canister above cylinder #4? it's not being used anymore right?

The first time I did this mod I removed the vac canister and my car was running like poo. I had some bad flutter with both my HKS BOV and Strat DV. I put my car back to it's original configuration and did this mod again about 1 or 2 months later. I left the canister on and my car runs better now.


----------



## ACEdubs (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: (ruba_dubdub)*

I did this a STILL have surging around 5psi-10psi??? Sucks.


----------



## Italian GTI 1.8T (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: (ACEdubs)*

gonna do this tomorrow. hope it werks!


----------



## BORA 18T (Mar 17, 2003)

*Re: (ACEdubs)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ACEdubs* »_I did this a STILL have surging around 5psi-10psi??? Sucks.









Me too. It surges a hair less but still does at 6 psi.







Oh well, I;ll just have to reverse it all. BTW, the sound of the DV actually got quieter for me. I have the DV installed backwards.







Hope others have better luck then me.


----------



## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

Just wondering where you guys are sourcing your T connectors? I've tried a few places and can't seem to find any 3/16", 3/16", 1/4" Tees anywhere...


----------



## gtihoot (Aug 21, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

I did this mod yesterday and the boost comes very smooth and controllable at part throttle now! THanks for the write up!
The only problem I ran into was boost gauge buzzing after the install, Before this mod, I had a T (restrictor T from 42 design) tapped into the FRP and ran a line to the boost gauge. When I did this mod, I put another T in the line that goes to the boost gauge and connect the other side to the DV. It gives me all kind of buzzing when I am in boost. 
I had to swap out the 2 Ts so the restrictor T goes to the boost gauge. While I am doing the swapping, I noticed the vacuum tubing from the FRP to the mani was extremely brittle. It basically disintegrated while I was trying to yank the restrictor T out. For now, I just cut off the broken part and jam the new T in, but I think I need to replace the whole tube down the road. Anyway, this solves the buzzing problem and now the car is smooth as butter. 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif for this mod


----------



## laylomo (Aug 3, 2001)

*Re: (viper_chan)*

Same here, I called a million places.. no luck yet.
I'm getting flutters from the DV with the 3/16 T connectors, maybe I'll have to build my own from home depot..


----------



## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: (laylomo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *laylomo* »_Same here, I called a million places.. no luck yet.
I'm getting flutters from the DV with the 3/16 T connectors, maybe I'll have to build my own from home depot..









So your using a 3/16, 3/16, 3/16 T connector right now? Where did you buy it from??


----------



## turbo-oomph (Jan 19, 2004)

*hmmm, interesting*

I was getting really tired of the jerky part throttle
Actually switched to stock for the last 2 days in order drive a smooth car for while
Will try this and report how it worked
Thanks


----------



## BORA 18T (Mar 17, 2003)

*Re: (viper_chan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *viper_chan* »_Just wondering where you guys are sourcing your T connectors? I've tried a few places and can't seem to find any 3/16", 3/16", 1/4" Tees anywhere...

Any auto parts store has a small rack with vacuum fittings. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I had to hit a few to get all the right fittings.


----------



## M Diddy (Sep 25, 2002)

*Re: (BORA 18T)*

Why would a bigger T fitting stop the DV flutter??? 
I just did the mod today and car does feel much smoother. DV is quieter and also, intake doesn't seem as loud under throttle. Wondering why this is.....


----------



## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: (BORA 18T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BORA 18T* »_
Any auto parts store has a small rack with vacuum fittings. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I had to hit a few to get all the right fittings.









Thanks for the tip! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'll see if I have any luck over the weekend...


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

*New pics*

Hey guys, I finally did this yesterday on my Golf 1.8T (AWW). I'm also running an HKS BOV (recirculating thank you







). I was really confused by the directions posted, but I think that was just general brain freeze








To help out, I took some pix, since many of the ones on here have vanished now.
My engine bay (yes I know it's messy!







) :








This is the hose you want to disconnect and cap off:








This was taken facing the engine bay, the silver is the driver-front corner of the manifold. I removed the smaller L-shaped engine cover in this picture. It helps to remove that.
This is how I have mine set up:








What you can't see in this picture is the T-fitting I have coming off the FPR. You can see the black hose going to the other T-fitting, which I labeled in yellow. One line from that T-fitting goes to my Boost Gauge, the other goes to my HKS (the actuator line for the DV - the whole reason for doing this in the first place







).
So I hope this helps out anyone who was having trouble finding it.
As for the results, I wil simply echo other's statements.... It $&*)(@ rules! The car hasn't been this smooth since I first got it, surging is nearly gone (only a hint of it in 2nd gear 1/2 throttle). Boost is super smooth. A nice side effect is this actually eliminted 90% of the buzzing in my VDO!
It is defintely worth the few minutes of your time to do this mod; you won't be disappointed!


----------



## turbo-oomph (Jan 19, 2004)

*Re: hmmm, interesting (turbo-oomph)*

Did it this morning , throtle response is now smooth , no jerkyness in the middle range, THANKS!! 
Sset the sps3 on LB9 which was a pain to drive smoothly and it worked great. Have to try it now on High boost








... and it also seems to hold 1 additional PSI 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif














http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Wags (Aug 14, 2001)

*Re: (Raman Gain)*

All I can say is nice, I have an 01 AWW Revo'd and the difference is night and day. Seems my idle has smoothed out a little to, probably placebo effect. But I'll take it.


----------



## boostinvwgti (Mar 28, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

So I installed the Forge DV relocation kit tonight and I thought I would bypass my N249 while I was there. I installed the DV kit per the instructions except for the vacuum source for the DV. 
For the N249 bypass I simply capped the hose where that would normally plug into the DV as the vacuum source (its that thicker hose that is attached to the top of the DV and then runs down and is connected to that metal small metal pipe). Then I went under the manifold and T-ed into the FRONT tap (not the rear tap that the FPR is connected to) for the DV's new vacuum source.
I started the car up and it idled fine and didnt seem to be leaking vacuum. Didnt get a chance to test drive yet, though. I just wanted to know if theoretically, is everything I did correct and will it work right?
Thanks.


----------



## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: New pics (Voodoo.T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Voodoo.T* »_This is the hose you want to disconnect and cap off:










So the line your capping off here is for the vacuum canister, right?
The far left line (smaller braided line) is the orignal DV line, right? I see you left that line alone and didn't try to reuse it....so I'm assuming you just left the original DV line attached and just capped off at the end?


_Modified by viper_chan at 2:16 PM 8-7-2004_


----------



## vwgti1.8TT (Mar 12, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

I just did this mod and I got crazy DV flutter with my Evo. When test driving I couldnt pass 5 psi for nothing, damm limp mode. I just reversed the process as it was stock.


----------



## optikNurve (Oct 5, 2001)

*Re: (Stroked1.8t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Stroked1.8t* »_My 99 Passat, AEB engine, doesn't have an N249 and boost is very predictable and there isn't even the slightlest surging. DV signal line connect directly to the manifold. 
EDIT: Just got back from the auto parts store getting the few parts to try this on my 01 Jetta. I only had to drive for about 3 seconds before I could feel the difference. I gained one PSI of boost at initial spool up and it takes a little longer for the boost to fall off to normal levels. This is all on the stock programming. Samco TIP is the only mod I have. This cost be less then $5 so if it doesn't work then you aren't out much.
I remember a while back someone was having a problem with boost after a hard shift. Boost wouldn't build immediately after engaging the next gear. I was having the same problem, well that is no longer an issue. Boost is there when you romp it, hard shift of not.










Went this route. Worked really well, ended up using 4 clamps [capped off line, either side of the 1/4 x 3/8 link and the 1/4 side of the 3/16x3/16x1/4 T]... One thing to remember [and I was just brainfarting] is that you'll also need a few inches of 1/4 vacuum hose for this to work. So shopping list is:
3/16x3/16x1/4 T Fitting
1/4 -> 3/8 Enlarger
A few zip ties [to be on the safe side for FPR connections]
4 Clamps
6" 1/4 vacuum hose
12" 3/16 vacuum hose [my FPR line was VERY brittle]
Good luck!


----------



## caj1 (Feb 16, 1999)

*Re: New pics (viper_chan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *viper_chan* »_
So the line your capping off here is for the vacuum canister, right?
The far left line (smaller braided line) is the orignal DV line, right? I see you left that line alone and didn't try to reuse it....so I'm assuming you just left the original DV line attached and just capped off at the end?

_Modified by viper_chan at 2:16 PM 8-7-2004_

wrong.. the line removed is the line to the DV. That line is then tee'd into the FPR line (braided). The cap is place on the line that originally fed the DV hose.


----------



## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: New pics (caj1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *caj1* »_
wrong.. the line removed is the line to the DV. That line is then tee'd into the FPR line (braided). The cap is place on the line that originally fed the DV hose.

If you take a look at a bentley diagram of the turbo system....it seems to show the hose on the far left connects to the DV.








Is it incorrect, or am I just reading it wrong??


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

You are reading the diagram correctly, you are just adding in a line that isn't shown. Look carefully at the diagram. The picture I showed with the capped off line is indeed the DV line. The braided line is from the FPR. The line from the FPR is not shown in the diagram.


----------



## intricate976 (Jul 19, 2002)

*Re: (Voodoo.T)*

Ok tried the N249 bypass today and the car runs uber smooth with less jerkiness and helped eliminate some surging I had with my Up programming & H n75. One concern though...im getting major flutter with my 710N dv. I tried running the valve in both reversed & normal orientation and same result. I went over each line, zip-tied every end for a clean seal so vac leak shouldnt be a problem. Im achieving normal boost with smoother delivery, but just major flutter. Im really loving this mod, but the flutter is making me crazy. The only other conclusion I can get at is the addition of the 2nd tee into the fpr line. Would my 42dd "No buzz" restrictor Tee also be a factor? Help or recommendations would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## Rice-Eater (Mar 9, 2002)

*Re: (intricate976)*

Did this today too. Simply unplugged DV "soft line" from where it connects at the "hard" line and capped off the hard line. Ran DV reference directly off manifold. Not the "Stellar" results I had hoped for but I really just took it out for a test crash once the mod was done. I'll get a better idea of the results after my commute tomorrow.


----------



## Cptmorgemaker (Aug 9, 2004)

*Re: (Rice-Eater)*

Ok been readin all of this and havent noticed anyone sayin where the BG hose is located to splice into the T fitting with if someone could tell in easy terms or a pic thatd be great


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: (Cptmorgemaker)*

im getting flutter with this as well at low boost, and i think its because of both the bov and bg running off of the fpr line. can i tap the line off of the top of the tb for my bov?


----------



## vwgti1.8TT (Mar 12, 2003)

*Re: (ButteroJ)*

When I tried this mod this weekend I tapped into the bottom vac line under the manifold. I got crazy flutter and couldnt pass 6 psi for nothing. went back to stock mode after that.


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: (Cptmorgemaker)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Cptmorgemaker* »_Ok been readin all of this and havent noticed anyone sayin where the BG hose is located to splice into the T fitting with if someone could tell in easy terms or a pic thatd be great 

Was this English?
See my pix on Page 3
I'm running with both the boost gauge and the DV t'd off the FPR line. It flutters a bit but no more than usual for me. I am going to eff with the settings on my HKS and see if it goes away or not, otherwise I will tap it off somewhere else I guess.


----------



## DubThis (Apr 1, 2003)

*Re: (Voodoo.T)*

I did mine yesterday. Here's a pic of how I did it:


----------



## arootbeer (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: (DubThis)*

I did mine about like that. Images are here http://f1.pg.briefcase.yahoo.c...iew=l; sorry for the poor quality.
I noticed 2 things on my quick runs around the block. First off, the turbo takes much longer to spool down than it did with the stock setup, although it does come off boost much more smoothly than before. Is this bad for the turbo? (My turbo's on its way out anyway...whines like nobody's business. But I don't want to hurt the new one I'm putting in







)
Second, before when I had my boost gauge hooked up (directly from the FPR line), I would hit a spike to 15, and settle to 12 psi. Now it only shows a spike to 7, and settles to 5. Is this because of the way I set it up? I've got 3/16 line on the FPR, 1/4 line tee'd off to the DV, and 1/8 line tee'd off of the DV line for the boost gauge.


----------



## arootbeer (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: (arootbeer)*

bump for an answer


----------



## arootbeer (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: (arootbeer)*

And again. What's got me worried is that, if the boost gauge isn't seeing the same pressure as before, the FPR might not be either. The car does drive much more smoothly today, which is nice, but unless someone can help me out with this question, it's going back to isolated systems


----------



## Italian GTI 1.8T (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: (optikNurve)*

picked up supplies today. Tomorrow I'll see if it gets rid of the choppy throttle i am experiencing.


----------



## funkysole (Jun 20, 2002)

*Re: (Italian GTI 1.8T)*

you can also cap off the hose that the DV connects to and just put a t-fitting inline witht between the FPR and Manifold and run a new line to the DV.


----------



## vwgti1.8TT (Mar 12, 2003)

*Re: (funkysole)*

I'm gonna try this again this weekend. I tried it last week and capped off the piece coming out of N249, Put a tee on the line under the manifold and I couldnt boost more than 6 psi. Put it back to stock. I'm gonna try it now with capping off the DV line. and run a second T off the FPR line. I already have a T there for my Boost guage. Will a second T fitting do any bad. Should it go before or after the T going to the Boost Guage?


----------



## MRJWVW (Nov 7, 2003)

*Re: (vwgti1.8TT)*

just got doing it and I'm very happy with it. I noticed that my throttle response has made an increase and the onset of boost is smoother.
Also, it has gave my DV a louder sound kinda like cracking whip. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## ffej0427 (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: (MRJWVW)*

did this mod and I actually feel it was better the original way so I put it back.. Engine code AWD.


----------



## [TSR] 33seven (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: (ffej0427)*

My buddy and I tried it out on my 337, CRAZY FLUTTER! i put it back to stock, what causes this flutter? is it bad?


----------



## gelatin (Apr 26, 2003)

*Re: ([TSR] 33seven)*


_Quote, originally posted by *[TSR* »_ 33seven]My buddy and I tried it out on my 337, CRAZY FLUTTER! i put it back to stock, what causes this flutter? is it bad?









...maybe the DV isn't staying open long enough to release all the pressure? so the flutter you feel/see is maybe reversion? what do you guys think?


----------



## funkysole (Jun 20, 2002)

*Re: (gelatin)*

just did the mod yesterday and wow the boost curve is much smoother, the Type-s sounds way better. love it much better now then before, just run a vag to make sure all is ok then im golden. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## observer (Mar 24, 2004)

*Re: (optikNurve)*

If I read all of this correctly then I can just t into the top line that goes into the FPR and then run a line from it to the boost gauge (capping off the original line that went to the boost gauge)?
Is this correct?


----------



## jamesb (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

heh, why use a T when you can use a 90 degree and be done with it. tahts all I did.


----------



## [TSR] 33seven (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (jamesb)*

Alrirght, right now, i'm going to switch DVs from Hyperboost into 710N dv, i'll let everyone know...
I'm running UPsolute, AEm cai, ecs race H valve, overboost solution kit
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Italian GTI 1.8T (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([TSR] 33seven)*

done! awesom mod and onlytook $8 and 15 mins.


----------



## [TSR] 33seven (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Italian GTI 1.8T)*

damn it!!







i'm missing a cap, oh well, i'll do it tomorrow...but i just put back my 710N dv, and it's butterly smooth














http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







boosting at 19-20psi, i set my overboost solution kit to 1 1/2 thread...so far no limp!


----------



## [TSR] 33seven (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([TSR] 33seven)*

Today I'm going to rob's (03wolife) house to work onbypassing the n249 valve in the afternoon, I'll see how it goes! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## flanders (Apr 5, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([TSR] 33seven)*

I'm still curious as to why this would cause backfires...


----------



## SnowGTI2003 (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (flanders)*

Me too. I asked the same question earlier in the thread and there was no response. I've been running great for a while like this.


----------



## [TSR] 33seven (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (SnowGTI2003)*

ALrighty then, REVIEWs: very smooth, throttle is excellent, no flutter, just a loud woosh! My 710N Dv is handling pretty good, better than the Hyperboost DV that caused too much flutter! I"m boosting at 19psi, hit limp twice, but i'm still going to back off a little threads on my overboost solution kit! I"m at 2 threads, and i'll go from there! Today, i'm going to pick up my g/f at Aurora, IL...It would be a nice 45 mintue trip, I can't wait!?!?!?! 
I'll update later on http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [TSR] 33seven (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([TSR] 33seven)*

Alright, I just came back from Aurora, IL...I only hit limp 2 times...big improvement, I'm still playing around with the overboost solution kit...it's hitting 19psi or sometimes spikes at 20-21psi...My 710N dv makes a noise, not a flutter...weird?


----------



## mj6234 (Jan 24, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([TSR] 33seven)*

Hey, where can I get rubber caps? Home Depot?


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

I found them at the local auto parts store (Bumper to Bumper), they were over with the other assorted doo-hickeys. It was a variety pack, so I got a couple I didn't need and not enough of the ones I commonly need, but oh well...
Anyone else's gas mileage gone down? Trying to figure out if I got crappier mileage last time because of the brand of gas, if my BOV was idle tuned improperly, because of the n249 bypass, or because I can't keep my damn foot off the gas now


----------



## Nightrider (May 10, 2002)

*Re: (Voodoo.T)*

I'm waiting for my MBC to come in and I'm doing all this when I throw the diode into the mix of things also... maybe I should do one at a time to make sure everything is cool. But, anyways, surprised to hear that there is anyone that doesn't like this mod. Thanks to all sharing pics and instructions though, very clear and easy to follow!


_Modified by Nightrider at 1:51 PM 8-31-2004_


----------



## jamesb (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: (Voodoo.T)*

I am still wondering why everyone is bothering with a T and a endcap. Just buy a 49cent 90degree and put that in place of the n249. takes 5 minutes and does the job without the need of extra parts.


----------



## SnowGTI2003 (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([TSR] 33seven)*

I noticed the sharper DV noise too. Not bad, not flutter, just sharper.


----------



## heysuperman (Aug 17, 2002)

*Re: (arootbeer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *arootbeer* »_And again. What's got me worried is that, if the boost gauge isn't seeing the same pressure as before, the FPR might not be either. The car does drive much more smoothly today, which is nice, but unless someone can help me out with this question, it's going back to isolated systems









i don't see what's the big deal about the fluttter. i tapped the boost gauge and i see a whole pound more boost and that's because after doing this i went with a stiffer spring in my DV-R. i'm pretty sure my boost gauge is as acurrate as before. i saw the same levels of boost with this spring before bypassing the n249. it just surged like crazy. after bypassing it no longer surges.


----------



## heysuperman (Aug 17, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (flanders)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flanders* »_I'm still curious as to why this would cause backfires...

it won't


----------



## Timber (Oct 14, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (heysuperman)*

Well I just did this mod and I like it! Good Sh*t!


----------



## Spools at 3 (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Timber)*

ya ya


----------



## 1.8 skeet skeet (Aug 11, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Don R)*

This is a Great Mod http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## flanders (Apr 5, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (heysuperman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *heysuperman* »_it won't

I agree, I can't see why it would. 
I was just suprised to see a comment made in this thread regarding it, and would like a bit more explanation (ie. more than a "_it won't_".)


----------



## heysuperman (Aug 17, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (flanders)*


_Quote, originally posted by *flanders* »_
I agree, I can't see why it would. 
I was just suprised to see a comment made in this thread regarding it, and would like a bit more explanation (ie. more than a "_it won't_".)

it is simply just a selenoid that controls the diverter valve. the diverter still works even if you bypass it. from what i read it was a tech who speculated that it might increase backfires, but no reason was given. so in my opinion that's just







. so until someone gives me a damn good reason i'm sticking with "IT WON'T"


----------



## Spools at 3 (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

nice


----------



## TURBOJETTA420 (Mar 16, 2004)

So everyone seems to like it...does it cure all surging and did anyone notice gains or did it pull harder?


----------



## funkysole (Jun 20, 2002)

*Re: (TURBOJETTA420)*

no it will not cure all surging but will cure some, i also noticed a cure in surging by replacing my plugs with 1 heat range cooler then factory.


----------



## Nightrider (May 10, 2002)

*Re: (funkysole)*

N249 is gone as of this morning... $5, about 10 minutes, and less surging, quicker and longer boost (slightly), and partial throttle is so much smoother.


----------



## TURBOJETTA420 (Mar 16, 2004)

i'm getting my FMIC installed, so I might do this


----------



## intricate976 (Jul 19, 2002)

*Re: (TURBOJETTA420)*

Ok I re-tried this mod and im still gettin an odd dv sound. Boost delivery is smoothed and im lovin it, but I cant tell whether the sound is flutter or normal. The sound when I let off boost is not the normal dv+cai "whoosh", but more of a cracking whip sound like "whoo-cshhh". It is the same with my aftermarket piston dv and my 710N. Can someone help me out?


----------



## IY boy (Aug 19, 2003)

*Re: (intricate976)*


_Quote, originally posted by *intricate976* »_Ok I re-tried this mod and im still gettin an odd dv sound. Boost delivery is smoothed and im lovin it, but I cant tell whether the sound is flutter or normal. The sound when I let off boost is not the normal dv+cai "whoosh", but more of a cracking whip sound like "whoo-cshhh". It is the same with my aftermarket piston dv and my 710N. Can someone help me out? 

I wouldnt worry about it. Mine makes a louder sound as well.


----------



## intricate976 (Jul 19, 2002)

*Re: (cae92283)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cae92283* »_I wouldnt worry about it. Mine makes a louder sound as well. 

Ok just checking. My stock 710N sounds like a freakin bov more so than before.


----------



## vw pwn4g3 (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: (intricate976)*


_Quote, originally posted by *intricate976* »_Ok I re-tried this mod and im still gettin an odd dv sound. Boost delivery is smoothed and im lovin it, but I cant tell whether the sound is flutter or normal. The sound when I let off boost is not the normal dv+cai "whoosh", but more of a cracking whip sound like "whoo-cshhh". It is the same with my aftermarket piston dv and my 710N. Can someone help me out? 
 same thing happened to me.... i thought i had done something wrong. i honestly didnt notice any drastic improvement in my WOT surging problems... http://www.angelfire.lycos.com/linux/pwn4g3/boost...so i brought things back to the way they were.... if the surging went away significantly, i'd have kept it.. but since it hasnt really solved anything, i'd rather hear the nice whoooosh sound http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## jamesb (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: (vw pwn4g3)*

this is just how fast the vacume in your system works. the n249 does some strange stuff in slowly opening the valve rather then fully opening it. Wait till you go with a bigger turbo it sounds so weird.


----------



## observer (Mar 24, 2004)

*Re: (jamesb)*

Can someone please post a step by step guide to show the easiest way of bypassing the N249.........the current pics are not so clear to a non-technical guy like me


----------



## JRSGTI (Jul 22, 2004)

*Re: (observer)*

i have a diode and a mbc set at 16lbs of boost.i did the bypass but at half throttle is goes from 4 lbs to 15lbs of boost real fast. any ideas just seems like it dumps the boost at part throttle


----------



## vw pwn4g3 (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Stroked1.8t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *observer* »_Can someone please post a step by step guide to show the easiest way of bypassing the N249.........the current pics are not so clear to a non-technical guy like me








 everything is here, you just have to read between the lines. first step - find this hose and disconnect it, as shown in these pics (posted by others, thank you)














. 
next cap off the nipple (plastic fitting) that you just disconnected that hose from. 
next cut and tee into the fpr line (the tube that comes out of the fpr, the fpr is the silver canister looking thing above your intake manifold, located just to the right of your fuel injectors.). it is a black braided hose. personally i cut the hose clamp off and installed about 3" of new tubing from the fpr, so i didnt have to cut the stock tubing (just in case i wanna make things look stock). from the fpr whether you cut the existing line or installed a new one, install your 't' fitting. your 't' fitting should be 3/16" x 3/16" x 1/4", as the hose you disconnected in step 1 will be loose on a 3/16" fitting. if all you can find are 3/16" tees, thats fine.. just make sure that you get a 3/16" -> 1/4" changeover straight fitting. if you dont have any extra 3/16" tubing then make sure you get the tee that has a 1/4" port. pep boys dont have these fittings (or their staff were just dumb), home depot won't help you either, so go to autozone for all these fittings.
connect the hose you disconnected from the nipple in the first step to the newly installed tee fitting.
make sure you ty-rap all connections. you're done. without a boost gauge, this install requires a 3-way t. if you want your boost gauge hooked up as well, you can get a 4-way t... however i havent seen any 4-way tee's with 3x3/16" ports and 1x1/4" port... so you'll need to get the 1/4" changeover and a small piece of tubing to make the 4-way work. 
again, i didnt like the sound out of my CAI after i did this. i wouldnt have cared if it cured my surging... so it didnt... so i put things back the way they were


----------



## vw pwn4g3 (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (vw pwn4g3)*

and btw, it took me longer to write that post than it did for me to bypass the n249... you could be technically retarded and still get this one right http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## observer (Mar 24, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (vw pwn4g3)*

Thanks....it sound spretty clear!
If this solves my part throttle surging I will be in the 7th heaven! NOTHING has worked so far


----------



## vwgti1.8TT (Mar 12, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (observer)*

It worked for me. I had insane surging. Now i have very little & its only sometimes. Great mod. If you combine a MBC it should go all away. Mine is going back on this weekend. I had taken it out cause it was hitting the FMIC pipe. quick question for those that know. Would relocating the MBC away from the N75 (adding more hose) be a bad idea? thats the only way i can do it to make tuning it accessible


----------



## jamesb (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (observer)*

heh, I did it the lazy way. I took out the 2 5mm hex bolts pulled the two lines off the n249, connected them to a 1/4" 90 degree, and put it all back together leaving the n249 there with caps onit.


----------



## vw pwn4g3 (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (jamesb)*

i was thinking about that too but too lazy to take off that bracket seeing as all the other hoses are accessable once you pull the plastic engine covers. great idea dude. hows it workin for ya?


----------



## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (jamesb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jamesb* »_heh, I did it the lazy way. I took out the 2 5mm hex bolts pulled the two lines off the n249, connected them to a 1/4" 90 degree, and put it all back together leaving the n249 there with caps onit.

Sounds like a slick way of doing this mod. Very stealth and easily reversible back to stock. Got any pics?


----------



## Wayne92SLC (Mar 1, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (viper_chan)*

Must...have...pics...


----------



## jamesb (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (viper_chan)*


_Quote, originally posted by *viper_chan* »_
Sounds like a slick way of doing this mod. Very stealth and easily reversible back to stock. Got any pics?

They suck and this is before I went to a 90 degree.








Thats the only one I have. I am going to be installing a 20VT FMIC as soon as it arrives, I will get better pictures then while I take apart and put that section back together.


----------



## 20thIM#1721 (Jul 16, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (jamesb)*

just removed the n249 and entire secondary air injection system. car runs so smooth without n249. now its time to get an mbc and see how much boost i can push. hopefully i'll get a chance to hit the dyno at work tommorow and get some #'s.


----------



## jamesb (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (20thIM#1721)*

I could just remove it, but then I get a CEL. If I have a CEL I dont pass marylands emissions. However, if I leave it like it is I pass MD emissions and I dont need to worry about finding the right diode to kill the CEL light.
Additionally I dont trust MBC's on this car. There is a reason cars go into soft limp mode, im most cases something is wrong. My car makes great power and I dont need to trick the computer. Doing it right and letting the ECU do what its built to manage is so much safer on the motor then guessing and blowing it up anyway.


----------



## chaugner (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (jamesb)*

Just installed mine. At the same time I also removed N75 and adjusted about 2 more threads on the wastegate








partial throttle is a little better with MBC/N249 removed then MBC but I still have a slight on/off feeling. I am starting to think that this might alos be related to the FMIC since there is a lot more volumne of air to fill. I think that gives me the slight jerkyness when boost comes on.
Unfortunaly with MBC I get the MAF Singal too high DTC at higher rpms (6K) in the upper gears. This NEVER happens when I use the stock N75 but with MBC no matter how high/low the boost is I get this code.


----------



## roly (Feb 2, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (chaugner)*

removed mine also, the car never felt better.







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## chaugner (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (roly)*

one thing to add is that I have major DV flutter ... I used to have it before with the N75 but now its worse ... also the DV sounds a lot sharper now .. driving in the park house this morning with open windows and letting off the gas in the on ramp ... LOUD


----------



## chaugner (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (chaugner)*

unplugged the MAF and car runs like a champ. Better then ever. holding 22psi strong till 4500 rpms thanks to the wastegate being adjusted.


----------



## Blitzkrieg Tuners (May 8, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (chaugner)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chaugner* »_unplugged the MAF and car runs like a champ. Better then ever. holding 22psi strong till 4500 rpms thanks to the wastegate being adjusted.

Help, I do not understand. It is OK to unplug the MAF??


----------



## Blitzkrieg Tuners (May 8, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Blitzkrieg Tuners)*

I OWNED PAGE 6


----------



## PedroGringo (Sep 3, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Blitzkrieg Tuners)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Blitzkrieg Tuners* »_I OWNED PAGE 6

Don't you have to pay taxes on it?








Mod done. It doesn't suck. I wasn't getting a lot of surging, but I got rid of the little bit that was there. Went well with the n75j and boost gauge install that I did at the same time. 

_Quote, originally posted by *jamesb* »_
They suck and this is before I went to a 90 degree.








Thats the only one I have. I am going to be installing a 20VT FMIC as soon as it arrives, I will get better pictures then while I take apart and put that section back together.

I looked into doing the mod this way as it seems to be a cleaner way to bypass. According to bentley, *on the AWP Motor*, that thing is the secondary vacuum thinga-ma-bob (its an industry term, sorry to go techy on you). It looks like that whole panel of vacuum stuff is set up differently on the AWPs. So I went with the original way that the bypass was described. 
Thanks for a great write-up. 
Peter


----------



## jamesb (Mar 14, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (PedroGringo)*

Thats why I just did the bypass that way, I got tired of tracking vacuum lines around. I am lazy most of the time.


----------



## PedroGringo (Sep 3, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (jamesb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jamesb* »_
Thats why I just did the bypass that way, I got tired of tracking vacuum lines around. I am lazy most of the time.

yah yah. After looking at Bentley for the 2001 and the 2003, it just looked like I was bypassing the wrong thing by doing it your way. 
I'll post up my custom mod for bypassing the window washer resevoir later this week.








Peter


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (PedroGringo)*


----------



## PedroGringo (Sep 3, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_









I like that. I wouldn't have to use as much duct tape either.


----------



## Blitzkrieg Tuners (May 8, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (PedroGringo)*

Done....
Wow!!!


----------



## vw pwn4g3 (Jun 19, 2004)

anyone else get a horrible noise when the dv actuates? i tried this and it definitely smoothed part throttle slightly.... but the sound was horrible and annoyed me enough to reconnect it.


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: (vw pwn4g3)*


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_









I would not tee into that line, that is the line to the brake booster...wouldn't want to screw with that one.


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*

works fine for me. if your not a complete retard then nothing will go wrong.


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_works fine for me. if your not a complete retard then nothing will go wrong.

It's not a matter of being a retard, its the fact there are 6 other vacuum lines that you can tee into right there that are not ran to something as important as your brakes.


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*

who cares, stop arguing. i posted what has worked greatly for me. now get this **** back on topic.


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Blitzkrieg Tuners)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Blitzkrieg Tuners* »_Help, I do not understand. It is OK to unplug the MAF??

You can... I've seen several ppl on here do it. I only did it when my car was running ridiculously bad. I unplugged the MAF and everything was golden, so I bought a new MAF. Not sure what the reasoning is behind unplugging it otherwise.


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Voodoo.T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Voodoo.T* »_
You can... I've seen several ppl on here do it. I only did it when my car was running ridiculously bad. I unplugged the MAF and everything was golden, so I bought a new MAF. Not sure what the reasoning is behind unplugging it otherwise.
running a bov


----------



## vwgti1.8TT (Mar 12, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Voodoo.T)*

I did this mod cause i had really bad surging. helped alot. put in the MBC and it smooth it out alot. now it starting to come back. im gonna uplug the MAF and see what happens. I need to get a new MAF for my AWP. dont feel like paying a fortune (200+)for it though.


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (vwgti1.8TT)*


----------



## bump909 (Jun 30, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (vwgti1.8TT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vwgti1.8TT* »_I did this mod cause i had really bad surging. helped alot. put in the MBC and it smooth it out alot. now it starting to come back. im gonna uplug the MAF and see what happens. I need to get a new MAF for my AWP. dont feel like paying a fortune (200+)for it though.

aww and awp MAFs have come down in price big time.. around 70 when i called my dealer last week.


----------



## MrSkills68 (Sep 25, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (bump909)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bump909* »_
aww and awp MAFs have come down in price big time.. around 70 when i called my dealer last week.

theyre *REBUILT MAFs*


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (MrSkills68)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MrSkills68* »_
theyre *REBUILT MAFs*
yup, but all that means is they are taking the housing from one of the blown sensors they replace and putting a new sensor in it http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_running a bov

Uh... oh


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Voodoo.T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Voodoo.T* »_Uh... oh


----------



## Voodoo.T (Jul 4, 2002)

Nothing... I should've known that was why. I don't miss my BOV








I'm still waiting for dude's pix with the slicker, OEMish bypass. I may hit that on my gf's car. She won't let me do this unless it's hidden from dealerships


----------



## tim18t (Feb 1, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_



































dude clean set-up! that has to be one of the most sh!tty ghetto installs i have ever scene. give yourself credit for out doing yourself this time.


----------



## MrSkills68 (Sep 25, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (tim18t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tim18t* »_

dude clean set-up! that has to be one of the most sh!tty ghetto installs i have ever scene. give yourself credit for out doing yourself this time
 







wait a few


----------



## fouckhest (May 22, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (MrSkills68)*

sorry to bring this back...i really would like to do this mod,but i dont have a garage or a lot of day light, besides the weekends....
but where is the n249 located in the engine bay??...i like how some people are just bypassing right around it, that makes more sence to me, for peice of mind atleast....
just curious where about it is, i did my FMIC install about a month ago and forgot to look, but im going to have to take the bumper back off to do some trimming, so i figured i would do this while i was tearin shizzle up....
so could someone just point me in the general direction!!!
thanks


----------



## funkysole (Jun 20, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (gti_1_eight_T)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_1_eight_T* »_but where is the n249 located in the engine bay??...i like how some people are just bypassing right around it, that makes more sence to me, for peice of mind atleast....
thanks

the most simple route is this. just cap off the hard line that the DV connects to, and run a new vacuume line from the DV to the vacuum on the FPR and just insert a T-fitting on that line zip tie all ends of the vacuume lines and you are done. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif but the valve is located under a black bracket on underside of the intake manifold towards the end of the manifold, the opposite side of the throtlebody.


----------



## fouckhest (May 22, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (funkysole)*

thanks man....i honestly appreciate this....so much better than the normal...OMG THIS HAS BEEN GONE OVER....BLAH BLAH BLAH!!
but honestly thanks...saves me a lot of headache!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (tim18t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tim18t* »_

dude clean set-up! that has to be one of the most sh!tty ghetto installs i have ever scene. give yourself credit for out doing yourself this time.
Wow, give yourself credit for being a dick. My car is not a show car, so who cares how it looks under the hood. Bring you store bought stg3 up here to ct and Ill show ya my tail-lights. Not all of us are about the bling. Some care more baout going fast. Get outta here with your whiney ass.


----------



## fouckhest (May 22, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (tim18t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tim18t* »_

dude clean set-up! that has to be one of the most sh!tty ghetto installs i have ever scene. give yourself credit for out doing yourself this time.

and BTW....WTF....does every one mean by WHIP....this makes no sence at all....

if you mean WIP thats fine, but if you going to use an acronym use it right:








W: work 
I: in 
P: process/progress (which ever you prefer)
sorry do be a dick but you were a dick to dude....so i figure i would dish a little as well.....
and dont try and call me on it, im a manf. eng....and that is an industry standard term used on a daily basis...


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_Some care more baout going fast. Get outta here with your whiney ass.

Have you ever even ran your car at the track?


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Adam20v* »_
Have you ever even ran your car at the track?








Drag-racing is gay. I need some turns thrown in there sonny boy. Besides, who was talking to you? Not me. I was responding to Tim the Tool. Bye Bye.


_Modified by ButteroJ at 12:56 PM 10-7-2004_


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_Drag-racing is gay. I need some turns thrown in there sonny boy.

Bwahahahahah








So you plan on showing him your tail lights where?


----------



## MrSkills68 (Sep 25, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_Wow, give yourself credit for being a dick. My car is not a show car, so who cares how it looks under the hood. Bring you store bought stg3 up here to ct and Ill show ya my tail-lights. Not all of us are about the bling. Some care more baout going fast. Get outta here with your whiney ass.

ahahaha well said... just liek the other thread he started after the post he made here


















































since when do you show someone your engine...unless at a car show? does it increase hp???? NO


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (ButteroJ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ButteroJ* »_Besides, who was talking to you? Not me. I was responding to Tim the Tool. Bye Bye.

I'm asking if you race your car because you care so much about going fast. You put a big turbo on a car that you say you need twisties for







I've never even seen a dyno from your 'race' car... I've got money an APR stg3 walks you.
As far as having a non-ghetto engine bay goes, it's a matter of taking pride in your work.


_Modified by Adam20v at 12:06 PM 10-7-2004_


----------



## tim18t (Feb 1, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Adam20v* »_
I'm asking if you race your car because you care so much about going fast. You put a big turbo on a car that you say you need twisties for







I've never even seen a dyno from your 'race' car... I've got money an APR stg3 walks you.
As far as having a non-ghetto engine bay goes, it's a matter of taking pride in your work.

_Modified by Adam20v at 12:06 PM 10-7-2004_


daamn! did you see that dude get felched!


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (tim18t)*

a place like autozone, pepboys or even a napa would have the vac line fittings and caps?


----------



## MrSkills68 (Sep 25, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (screwball)*

got mine from autozone http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Adam20v* »_I'm asking if you race your car because you care so much about going fast. You put a big turbo on a car that you say you need twisties for







I've never even seen a dyno from your 'race' car... I've got money an APR stg3 walks you.
As far as having a non-ghetto engine bay goes, it's a matter of taking pride in your work.

_Modified by Adam20v at 12:06 PM 10-7-2004_
Dynos will be coming soon, as we are currently working on big turbo software that will work out of the box. Its called giving back to the people that have helped along the way. With an attitude like yours the scene would go no where. Ive run a stg 3, didnt walk me at all. Try again. And since when was I talking to you? My beef is with Tim, not you. Goodbye.


_Modified by Buttero J-Lo at 6:32 PM 10-7-2004_


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (MrSkills68)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MrSkills68* »_ahahaha well said... just liek the other thread he started after the post he made here


















































since when do you show someone your engine...unless at a car show? does it increase hp???? NO
That post is what made me write what I did


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Buttero J-Lo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Buttero J-Lo* »_Its called giving back to the people that have helped along the way. With an attitude like yours the scene would go no where. Ive run a stg 3, didnt walk me at all. Try again. And since when was I talking to you? My beef is with Tim, not you. Goodbye.

How is my attitude hurting the 'scene'? At least I get my car out and prove it in the real world.
As far you not talking to me, you are right now Buttero From The Block. You do realize that J-Lo is a chick right? And quit saying Goodbye to me Jenny, I'm not going anywhere.,


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Adam20v* »_How is my attitude hurting the 'scene'? At least I get my car out and prove it in the real world.
As far you not talking to me, you are right now Buttero From The Block. You do realize that J-Lo is a chick right? And quit saying Goodbye to me Jenny, I'm not going anywhere.,
Its an inside thing homie. And how is your attitutde hurting the scene? I havent heard a positive word come out of your mouth. Do you even know why I replied to Tim? No. Come back to me when you know what Im talking about.


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Buttero J-Lo)*

I know why you replied to Tim, because he called you on a ghetto ass install. You couldn't handle it, and reacted poorly. I'd get upset easily if my engine bay looked like yours also.
As far as your car being fast, I'm pretty sure you mouth runs faster than your car.


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Buttero J-Lo)*

you two should take this to IM.


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (screwball)*

I'll add something to the thread anyways...
When I bypassed mine I just purchased a cross and put it in the same place as I had my boost gauge tapped. That way I only have one line cut and the DV and boost gauge running off the cross. Everything is hidden under the manifold.


----------



## MrSkills68 (Sep 25, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Adam20v* »_I know why you replied to Tim, because he called you on a ghetto ass install. You couldn't handle it, and reacted poorly. I'd get upset easily if my engine bay looked like yours also.
As far as your car being fast, I'm pretty sure you mouth runs faster than your car.

one word..... Nerdspeed








get prepared to be owned


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (MrSkills68)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MrSkills68* »_one word..... Nerdspeed








get prepared to be owned
















exactly. and Adam, I replied to Tim not for this post, but something completely different. As for being ghetto, I would love for you to explain that one to me. Since when is a t ghetto? As for being slow, ha, you can come try me as well. We have auto-x every weekend. We'll see who gets a better time.


----------



## tim18t (Feb 1, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Buttero J-Lo)*

wow somebody got all crabby cause i called out how they "buttero j'd" their engine bay. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Adam20v (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (tim18t)*

Did I just get called out to auto-x? Hahaha








You gonna land on me at 30mph?


----------



## fouckhest (May 22, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (Adam20v)*

just did the direct bypass to the n249 on my AWP....and hell yeah!!!! SOOO much smoother!!!!
so i would say just directly loop around the n249, and dont worry about all that re routing...


----------



## richyrich212t (Apr 7, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (gti_1_eight_T)*

I just did the mod -=- oh so smooth -=- boost is very predictable !!!


----------



## Boost112 (May 8, 2002)

*Re: (Stroked1.8t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Stroked1.8t* »_My 99 Passat, AEB engine, doesn't have an N249 and boost is very predictable and there isn't even the slightlest surging. DV signal line connect directly to the manifold. 
EDIT: Just got back from the auto parts store getting the few parts to try this on my 01 Jetta. I only had to drive for about 3 seconds before I could feel the difference. I gained one PSI of boost at initial spool up and it takes a little longer for the boost to fall off to normal levels. This is all on the stock programming. Samco TIP is the only mod I have. This cost be less then $5 so if it doesn't work then you aren't out much.
I remember a while back someone was having a problem with boost after a hard shift. Boost wouldn't build immediately after engaging the next gear. I was having the same problem, well that is no longer an issue. Boost is there when you romp it, hard shift of not.








_Modified by Stroked1.8t at 4:55 AM 6-6-2004_

alright so i did this mos and it really does rock it felt alot smoother, but the only thing is that my greddy type-s sounds really wierd it kiinda flutters so i dont really know what to do, should i tighten the spring or loosen? anybody done this with a greddy type-s?

any help would be greatly appreciated, also i did the bypass like the picture above, for reference!


----------



## flanders (Apr 5, 2001)

*Re: (Boost112)*

I also finally did this to my car.
Can't say it really did a whole lot. My part throttle surge is still there... no earth shattering difference for me, but I'm not about to reverse it yet








AWW, upsolute, forge TIP, brullen 2.5" dp+cat.


----------



## TURBOJETTA420 (Mar 16, 2004)

*Re: (Stroked1.8t)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Stroked1.8t* »_








_Modified by Stroked1.8t at 4:55 AM 6-6-2004_

The one tha says 1/4 x 3/8(middle one) is that a T connecto or just a connector for two hoses....also, what is the hose that is one the bottom of the T connector going into the FPR?


----------



## TURBOJETTA420 (Mar 16, 2004)

also will a golf tee work to cap off the N249?


----------



## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: (TURBOJETTA420)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TURBOJETTA420* »_also will a golf tee work to cap off the N249?

Umm.....I'm sure i'd work for awhile, but it'd probably eventually fall out. I would find a better way instead.


----------



## Boost112 (May 8, 2002)

*Re: (viper_chan)*

has anybody done this to a a car with a greddy type s. now its making funny sounds!!


----------



## Italian GTI 1.8T (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: (Boost112)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Boost112* »_has anybody done this to a a car with a greddy type s. now its making funny sounds!!

I did, it does make a different noise. It does not wistle anymore. its more like a pshhhh


----------



## Boost112 (May 8, 2002)

*Re: (Italian GTI 1.8T)*

right!!!!! so like i ahve no idea why it does that, plus it sorta flutters but it doesnt, it make a weird psssshhhhh sound and then a little whistle. 
also if im at low boost and shifting then you get a little of the old whistle, then the higher the boost then more of the weird pshhhh sound. its kinda loud but it doesnt sound like other greddys.


----------



## Italian GTI 1.8T (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: (Boost112)*

try adjusting it, and make it slightly tighter. stop when it flutters.


----------



## Boost112 (May 8, 2002)

*Re: (Italian GTI 1.8T)*

its fluttering a little now so should i maybe loosen it? or should i tighten it, damn man i just got this thing tunned like three weeks ago!


----------



## DubAdicted (Jan 21, 2003)

*Re: (Boost112)*

I just capped both ends of the stock line, and ran a new line from the dv to the fpr t, total cost $4.63 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Buttero J-Lo (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: (Boost112)*

from my experience i would say tighten it. with the somewhat better vac signal you are now getting your valve may be open a slight bit at idle or wot, causing the flutter http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## TURBOJETTA420 (Mar 16, 2004)

*Re: (TURBOJETTA420)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TURBOJETTA420* »_
The one tha says 1/4 x 3/8(middle one) is that a T connector or just a connector for two hoses....also, what is the hose that is one the bottom of the T connector going into the FPR?
 Is it???


----------



## rex_racer (May 19, 2001)

*Re:*

has anybody tapped into the line that is on the throttle body??? my dv is relocated over there so keeping the vac line short would be nice, but i wanted to confirm that the line is vac, anyone know???


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 24, 2002)

*Re: Re: (rex_racer)*

So bypassing the N249 is only advisable for MBC use?


----------



## halchka99 (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Re: (rex_racer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rex_racer* »_
has anybody tapped into the line that is on the throttle body??? my dv is relocated over there so keeping the vac line short would be nice, but i wanted to confirm that the line is vac, anyone know???

yes its vac, ive done it.


----------



## Mr.Clean (Sep 5, 2000)

*Re: Re: (halchka99)*

My stock DV was shot, so I decided to replace it with the one off the Audi TT. I tried it forward. I tried it backward. I even tried bypassing the N249 to see which configuration worked best. I did some data logging as well. I finally came to the conclusion that it runs best backwards without bypassing the N249. Different strokes for different folks I guess.
My problem is that ever since I started messing around with it, the car has started throwing codes about an incorrect flow rate in the secondary air injection system! Well, I know the only two vacuum hoses I've touched are the one to the FPR and the one to the DV. So it seems obvious that the problem is with one of them.
My question is this... What's the best way to seal these hoses. The one to the FPR is small enough that typical hose clamps deform and don't work well. The nipple on the DV is recessed and a typical hose clamp doesn't work well here either. I tried zip ties in both locations, but the car keeps throwing the same code.








Are there any other devices which I can use to seal these vacuum hoses? Any suggestions would be appreciated!!!


----------



## rex_racer (May 19, 2001)

*Re: Re: (Mr.Clean)*

isn't the secondary air injection part of the egr system and such, and not the dv...???


----------



## IY boy (Aug 19, 2003)

*Re: Re: (Mr.Clean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Mr.Clean* »_My stock DV was shot, so I decided to replace it with the one off the Audi TT. I tried it forward. I tried it backward. I even tried bypassing the N249 to see which configuration worked best. I did some data logging as well. I finally came to the conclusion that it runs best backwards without bypassing the N249. Different strokes for different folks I guess.
My problem is that ever since I started messing around with it, the car has started throwing codes about an incorrect flow rate in the secondary air injection system! Well, I know the only two vacuum hoses I've touched are the one to the FPR and the one to the DV. So it seems obvious that the problem is with one of them.
My question is this... What's the best way to seal these hoses. The one to the FPR is small enough that typical hose clamps deform and don't work well. The nipple on the DV is recessed and a typical hose clamp doesn't work well here either. I tried zip ties in both locations, but the car keeps throwing the same code.








Are there any other devices which I can use to seal these vacuum hoses? Any suggestions would be appreciated!!!

zip ties http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Mr.Clean (Sep 5, 2000)

*Re: Re: (rex_racer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rex_racer* »_
isn't the secondary air injection part of the egr system and such, and not the dv...???

Not sure, exactly. But I know for sure that the only two hoses I touched were the ones to the DV and the FPR!


----------



## rex_racer (May 19, 2001)

*Re: Re: (Mr.Clean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Mr.Clean* »_Not sure, exactly. But I know for sure that the only two hoses I touched were the ones to the DV and the FPR!

if i were u i would try swapping back to stock and testing it out and seeing if u still have the same probs. i really doubt that u doing the n249 is causing the cel, i don't think they are related, but i could be wrong of course.


----------



## umbarth1 (Sep 30, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

why are you guys bypassing the N249?


----------



## MrSkills68 (Sep 25, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (umbarth1)*

to eliminate surging
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by MrSkills68 at 12:54 AM 10-22-2004_


----------



## Johnny Blaze (Oct 18, 1999)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (MrSkills68)*

This thread is so many pages to read through.. just curious if any of the BT users are running with a bypassed n249.. how did it help if so?


----------



## GT300318 (Mar 11, 2004)

*Re: (Raman Gain)*

how much more boost does it give you. i have already doen a "secret" mod of my own. i now spike 24 - 25 psi and hold 20psi to 5 grand. im at about 15 - 16 psi boost when i shift at 6500 ish.


----------



## IY boy (Aug 19, 2003)

*Re: (GT300318)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GT300318* »_how much more boost does it give you. i have already doen a "secret" mod of my own. i now spike 24 - 25 psi and hold 20psi to 5 grand. im at about 15 - 16 psi boost when i shift at 6500 ish.

bypassing the n249 does not add boost and if you are spiking to 25 psi you are way out of the efficiency range of the k03s if that was what you are still running


----------



## GT300318 (Mar 11, 2004)

*Re: (IY boy)*

when opening the car up and shifting faster, i only hit about 21 - 22 psi at spike and hold about 18 - 20 at 5 grand. when i shift at 6500, im at about 14 - 16 psi. i only spike 24 - 25 when it is in gear cruising and then lay into it without downshifting. im not sure if this mod would do anything. maybe help hold boost better to redline? not sure. ill try it and see.


----------



## warura (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: (GT300318)*

ok, I have been a long time away from the tex. And come back to a ton of these threads... bypassing the nxxx. I was shocked, finally something new to try jeje.....
ok so, just a rather stupid question.. when not in gear and your reving the motor(like for a good hard launch







), what keeps the DV open to avoid overboost? the n75 (I mean, once the other crap nxxx is gone) ?
and one other thing, a guy with a k04 said he was spiking like 26psi reaching redline with 20psi or something similar (on the first pages), DUDE what are your HP and TQ numbers!!!! would it not be an insane gain? I would like to see a graph with the curve on that boost... 
OK ACTUALLY THE guy that started the thread posted holding 26-27 psi at low RPMS and at 5k 20psi....











_Modified by warura at 6:09 PM 1-20-2005_


----------



## gtiiiiiiii (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: (warura)*

he has a k04


----------



## warura (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: (gtiiiiiiii)*

I know he has a K04, I said it on my post... but, thats a lot of pressure in all the RPM curve, no? what's the low end PSI and RedLine PSI operating a GT28RS?
on the other hand, Did the bypass... had a hard time, my fingers are too thick and big. I wanted it to look pretty and stealth, so making the T fittings to go under all the things was a biaaaatch. 
Anyway, I noticed a better response and smoother ride. I actually made some rough changes on the gas pedal (floor it - stop pushing the pedal), trying to force a "Surge" or somthing unwanted and just got good response... I am also holding about 2psi more at redline.







.
Still spiking at 21-23psi







, but then drops to like 16-18 psi







and graudally drops almost all the RPM range. I am just wondering when my k03 will give up on me....








I did have to change my DV-R to my old Trusty Baily Dv, the DV-R just did not open, and fluttered on the light tension spring. Need another spring.


----------



## VW1990CORRADO (Sep 30, 2000)

*Re: (warura)*

has anyone vaged their car aftre this? checkin for fault codes? i get n249 malf now. and offcourse the flutter, and better holding of boost.


----------



## dbrowne1 (Oct 31, 2000)

*Re: (warura)*


_Quote, originally posted by *warura* »_I know he has a K04, I said it on my post... but, thats a lot of pressure in all the RPM curve, no? what's the low end PSI and RedLine PSI operating a GT28RS?


I can get 27psi or more down low if I use an MBC, but I don't do that anymore. There's no point, and it's risky. My K04 is setup to deliver 20-21psi straight across 5K, tapering to 15psi at 6K, and just under 14psi at redline (6500).


----------



## ryccki jetta (Mar 3, 2004)

*Re: (dbrowne1)*

bump..
#1 what do you guys use to cap off the lines?
#2 how come no one has connected DV directly to the nipple on that intake manifold that the older n249 line was connected to? Is it hard to take off or something?


_Modified by ryccki jetta at 11:31 AM 3-27-2006_


----------



## kynko (May 6, 2005)

*Re: (ryccki jetta)*

bump for the answer to above


----------



## double0vr6 (Mar 16, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

nice write up

what kind of power you seeing with yur ko4 set up http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Black Magic VW (Dec 12, 2003)

*Re: (ryccki jetta)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ryccki jetta* »_#1 what do you guys use to cap off the lines?
#2 how come no one has connected DV directly to the nipple on that intake manifold that the older n249 line was connected to? Is it hard to take off or something?

Bump it again for an answer http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## j. Kush (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: (Black Magic VW)*

anybody wanna re upload their pictuers for this? i wanna make sure i do this right. i gotta AWW


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

*Re: (dox)*

ok question... why cant you just disconnect the line going to the top of the Dv (since it goes to the n249) cap or plug it with something run a line from the Intake Manifold/FPR and viola bypassed?


----------



## j. Kush (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: (theswoleguy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *theswoleguy* »_ok question... why cant you just disconnect the line going to the top of the Dv (since it goes to the n249) cap or plug it with something run a line from the Intake Manifold/FPR and viola bypassed?

you can. thats what i ended up doing to see if i'd like the way the car reacted. i just unplugged the hose on top of the DV, plugged it, and routed a new hose directly from the top of the DV to the FPR. worked.


----------



## theswoleguy (Jan 25, 2006)

*Re: (dox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dox* »_you can. thats what i ended up doing to see if i'd like the way the car reacted. i just unplugged the hose on top of the DV, plugged it, and routed a new hose directly from the top of the DV to the FPR. worked.

lol thats what i thought everyone going about a 45 min DIY when its done in 2-10min i was just wondering, i myself have it done by tapping right onto the vac at the TB but maybe i dont know 2nd guessed myself bc everyone does it that other way, can i attach it anywhere else beside the fitting atop the TB or FPR? maybe off 1 of the lines off the n75


_Modified by theswoleguy at 6:58 PM 8-1-2006_


----------



## TranAndy (Feb 20, 2005)

*Re: (dox)*

bump anyone want to reload some pix i got a AWP i just want to make sure i am doing everything right!


----------



## j. Kush (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: (MalakaiTran)*

i'm still getting a little bit of surging. gonna put the overboost MBC kit back in and try that. 
im afraid i'm losing a little bit of power bypassing the n249.


----------



## mschulte (Jul 14, 2002)

*Re: (dox)*

when do this mod and removing vacuum canister can one cap the metal line that connects to the vacuum canister with a rubber cap and remove it? then run a new line to the diverter valve? do you know what i'm saying?


----------



## mschulte (Jul 14, 2002)

*Re: (mschulte)*

TTT


----------



## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

*Re: (mschulte)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mschulte* »_when do this mod and removing vacuum canister can one cap the metal line that connects to the vacuum canister with a rubber cap and remove it? then run a new line to the diverter valve? do you know what i'm saying?









these are 2 seperate lines anyway, but capping the vacuum canister and using a source of the intake mani is what i did for my set up...works just fine


----------



## mschulte (Jul 14, 2002)

*Re: (18T_BT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *18T_BT* »_these are 2 seperate lines anyway, but capping the vacuum canister and using a source of the intake mani is what i did for my set up...works just fine

Respek.


----------



## 20AE-2306 (Jan 21, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Yo.
I just did this mod today and it cleared up all the problems I was having with boost at part throttle. I thought my car was always going to be wimpy at part throttle, now I'm afraid I can't deal with the loudness of the exhaust and the faster gear changes.








One question though. If I understand it, the vac box on top of the coilpacks has a hose that leads to the back of the n249, the front of which is where we patched. Any reason we need to keep the vac box there anymore? Maybe I didn't trace it right but that seemed to be the way. Since I capped the front of the N249, it doesn't really matter if the back has anything either does it? I hate having to deal with that box every time I have to get to the right two coilpacks and plugs. Not to mention that it probably adds to the coilpack failure of those two right ones due to added heat. Probably not but it certainly doesn't promote coilpack health does it?
Let me know if I can chop that nasty b***c off cause I'd be very glad to see it go.
Best,
-Benman


----------



## 20AE-2306 (Jan 21, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (20AE-2306)*

Another question, maybe this has been answered before but I couldn't find it, but isn't the N249 valve supposed to keep the turbo from being subjected to harsh changes in pressure due to letting off the throttle quickly and/or braking while in gear? How long is my new k04-001 going to last with this mod?
Best,
-Ben


----------



## 20AE-2306 (Jan 21, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (20AE-2306)*

Also, BTW, my parts list was a little different than what everyone else lists. I used a T at the FPR, a hose from there to the stock T on the leftover port that used to have a short hose going into the N249. I capped the N249 with a vac cap and that was it. I broke the stock T while trying to get the short N249 hose off, so I replaced it with a T that was more of a Y, allowing the hoses to flow to the right together a little neater. I used another T on my new hose to hook up my boost valve (which used to be connected to the FPR).
I think I could have done this a simpler way but it seems to work great. I've been having problems ever since I got my car and I finally got it almost perfect, but I couldn't figure out this part throttle issue and neither could anyone else.
This seems to have cured everything, though I'm scared that it might make me 'drive it like I stole it' rather than what I usually do, which is to 'drive it like it's about to break'.
Best Again,
-Benjomino http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## 20AE-2306 (Jan 21, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (20AE-2306)*

Another (yes) change I made was to switch to corbin clamps, the annoying kind of clamp that you have to pry open if you don't have a $100 tool to use them properly (or a $15 tool that doesn't work very well in tight spaces), and neither tool works on the tiny kind as far as I know.
The reason for going with these clamps is simple: it's difficult to have 3 screw-type clamps that close together on a small T junction. It also looks completely stock. Not like I have to change the hoses down there very often (hopefully).
Corbin clamps in hand, I also noticed another great application for them, the tight spot where the DV hose goes into most top-style nipples. I had a wire tie but it basically wasn't doing anything and one more click and it would have broken. These new clamps work great for this problem as I've had that pop out a bunch of times.
I never liked these clamps before but now I kind of see why they use them in some places.
Best,
-Benji


_Modified by 20AE-2306 at 8:17 PM 8-21-2006_


----------



## BigWoo (Aug 16, 2006)

can someone repost pics please?
i want to try this but would like to see exactly what lines your talking about.
edit: im chipped and get a little surge under part throttle and a little flutter of the DV


_Modified by BigWoo at 9:06 AM 8-24-2006_


----------



## 20AE-2306 (Jan 21, 2006)

*Re: (BigWoo)*

Hey.
Ok, here's my setup, which I'd also like for someone to double check. It did solve all the problems, so I'm assuming that it's correct. I've been running this way for several days, about 250 miles, without issue.
Pic #1: Overall area where the N249 is. The hose (red) is the new one that I purchased. It goes from there to the FPR line, which is in the 3rd picture. Normally the T here would be black, but I broke the stock one while trying to take off the N249 hose.








Pic #2: You can see the N249 on the left, it has a cap on it (green). There used to be a hose going from where the cap is to where the hose (red) is now.








Pic #3: The FPR is the chrome UFO on the left. My hose (red) goes into a new T in the line that comes out of the side of the FPR and down.








Pic #4: You can see my hose (red) coming from the T and going down through to where the N249 is.








There are probably easier ways of doing it but this one made the most sense to me.
Best,
-Ben


----------



## BigWoo (Aug 16, 2006)

i just got done doing it and man THROTTLE RESPONSE!! 
well i had my boost guage T-ed into the DV hose and i ended up running a new line from the DV to a T in the FPR line and just hooking up the boost guage to the line that was at the DV. i think im getting a false boost reading tho cuz its coming from the n249 and vacuumm canister. Would T-ing into the line i ran to the FPR, for the boost guage make my FPR read funny, like run rich or lean?
edit: just read that and it didnt make much sense..LOL
what i mean is have both the DV and the boost guage t-ed into the FPR line make it run rich or lean?
edit2: NO CEL!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

_Modified by BigWoo at 9:30 AM 8-27-2006_


_Modified by BigWoo at 9:32 AM 8-27-2006_


----------



## BigWoo (Aug 16, 2006)

*Re: (BigWoo)*

anyone?


----------



## polskaGKB (Aug 17, 2006)

*Re: (DJKeebler)*

Whats the ponit of bypassing the N249?


----------



## 20AE-2306 (Jan 21, 2006)

*Re: (BigWoo)*

BigWoo, I've been running that way since I diverted the N249. It seems to be fine, I think the boost gauge shouldn't loose any pressure in the line and it's already designed to share the line between the DV and the FPR so I'm sure it won't make a difference. Or at least so far it hasn't on my car.
I had some codes but I don't think they were caused by this. I'll check them again soon and see if they come back. I had a problem with my turbo outlet hose popping off and I'm pretty sure that is the cause for all my CEL's.
Best,
-Ben


----------



## BigWoo (Aug 16, 2006)

*Re: (polskaGKB)*

from what ive gathered, so the computer doesnt control the DV, only the boost/vacuumm from the intake.


----------



## BigWoo (Aug 16, 2006)

*Re: (20AE-2306)*

ok, im gonna get some clamps and try it and the plug the line to the N249. ill let ya know what happens.


----------



## 1QuickDub (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: (BigWoo)*

This seems like it's one of the most over hyped "mods" on vortex.
I've never noticed any difference in throttle response, I've never noticed any difference in valve response both with/without the n249 being used. I don't use it currently because I don't want that cannister on top of my valve cover.


----------



## 20AE-2306 (Jan 21, 2006)

*Re: (1QuickDub)*

Not true for everyone. It made my part throttle response a lot smoother.


----------



## BigWoo (Aug 16, 2006)

*Re: (20AE-2306)*

same here.
hooked up the BG to the DV line and plugged the one to the N249.
no changes and no CEL
edit: i g-teched it last night and got a 14.96 @ 100.5 spinning thru first. altho it was at idle for about 5 mins before the run, so i think the intercooler was way hot cuz it didnt feel like it was pulling as hard as it should have.


_Modified by BigWoo at 5:57 AM 8-31-2006_


----------



## SnowGTI2003 (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: (1QuickDub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1QuickDub* »_This seems like it's one of the most over hyped "mods" on vortex.
I've never noticed any difference in throttle response, I've never noticed any difference in valve response both with/without the n249 being used. I don't use it currently because I don't want that cannister on top of my valve cover.

Same here. It's never done anything for me. I run it as intended with the vac reservoir. If you stock system doesn't feel right check for leaks.


----------



## 18T_BT (Sep 15, 2005)

*Re: (1QuickDub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1QuickDub* »_This seems like it's one of the most over hyped "mods" on vortex.
I've never noticed any difference in throttle response, I've never noticed any difference in valve response both with/without the n249 being used. I don't use it currently because I don't want that cannister on top of my valve cover.


http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

and g-tech comment-just go drag your car!!!


----------



## j. Kush (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: (18T_BT)*

It doesn't do anything different for surging with me.


----------



## Blackfin (Mar 10, 2006)

What does the N249 present to the DV diaphram during its operation? Does the DV ever see positive manifold pressure with the N249 in place (like it would with the bypass) or is it vented to the atmosphere, with the ECU only switching the N249 to show it manifold vacuum?
I asked because I suspect I have a boost leak with my car (GIAC X+ tune.) All the hoses look good so I check the DV. I run an experiment where I use my aircompressor with the regulator turned right down to pressureize the DV and see if it's holding pressure. I arrange things so I can use my car's boost guage to monitor the effective "boost" I'm applying. With the DV diaphram exposed to the atmosphere (i.e. nipple left open), the DV was leaking like a seive in both directions even at just 12PSI. When I cranked up the "boost" to an indicated 18PSI it was much worse. I've actually got two DVs, one brand new, and they both do the same thing.
With the DV nipple connected to the same boost source, I heard no leaking. The added pressure on the diaphram is sealing the DV...
So with the bypass, the DV is sealed shut for sure and not leaking. The question I have is is the DV seeing boost pressure with the N249 working?


----------



## imthekiller (Apr 18, 2005)

*Re: (Blackfin)*

Rehost the pictures please...


----------



## 1.8TTURBO (Oct 1, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Does anyone have pic's for this mod???


----------



## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (1.8TTURBO)*


----------



## j. Kush (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([email protected])*

^^Really great diagram and informative post.
But that seems like a bit much work to bypass the n249. I just did the T FPR hose, run hose from T to the small nipple port on the DV, cap off old DV hose.
Isn't that doing the same thing, and easier to go back and forth on?


----------



## bpfoley (Nov 30, 2000)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dox)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dox* »_^^Really great diagram and informative post.
But that seems like a bit much work to bypass the n249. I just did the T FPR hose, run hose from T to the small nipple port on the DV, cap off old DV hose.
Isn't that doing the same thing, and easier to go back and forth on?

I tried said method however noticed that the DV would flutter (tried both stock and Bailey's).


----------



## middiesman (Jan 3, 2006)

I tried it with a 3/16 x 3/16 x 3/16 tee with 3/16 inch hose to the DV and it caused severe fluttering.
Thinking it could need more flow because the stock hose was 1/4, Today I went and got a 3/16 x 1/4 x 3/16 tee and it releases pressure and doesn't flutter. 
Has anyone else experienced this??


----------



## j. Kush (Apr 3, 2002)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (bpfoley)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bpfoley* »_I tried said method however noticed that the DV would flutter (tried both stock and Bailey's). 

Yeah, that's what I heard it supposed to sound like. Mine made a slight fluttering when I released the pedal under moderate to high boost.

Interested to hear more about the above post if anybody has input.


_Modified by dox at 9:29 PM 12-7-2006_


----------



## 1.8TTURBO (Oct 1, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach ([email protected])*

how much time does it takes to do this, is it so difficult as it seams?? will it improve performance on the engine or what's it for???


----------



## W_Jetta (Mar 5, 2004)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (1.8TTURBO)*

anyone have pictures for this setup??


----------



## MK3Monster (Jul 30, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (1.8TTURBO)*

i'll be trying this soon.


----------



## whiteasday420 (Jul 31, 2007)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

I know this is a old post, but i just did this and it worked great!!
01 jetta 1.8t stage one....
took away all surging and fixed all bov problems!! Very Easy To Do!


----------



## feltan (Sep 20, 2007)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (whiteasday420)*

I also did this mod on my Skoda RS 180hp. The car is stock exept an open airfilter.
Everything is very smooth til i Hit 4000rpm, after that the car cuts bosst. 
Coulde it be an increase in boost that the ecu don't like?
All this happend after i did thi mod.

Any ideas?


----------



## t0kie (Mar 18, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (feltan)*

I'm planning to do it, but seems alll pictures posted have been removed. Anyone done it lately have pictures & step by step may be? TIA


----------



## t0kie (Mar 18, 2006)

I did it, pretty simple & now seems smoother.


----------



## janjan (Jul 26, 2006)

*Re: (t0kie)*

i did this and wow the hks ssqv sounds way different, sounds better.. better release of pressure, faster. great budget mod.


----------



## Boosted96GSX (May 29, 2007)

*Re: (janjan)*

Is there a reason someone should not bypass this?
I have an APR Stage 3 setup, and my engine bay is cramped everywhere, so I want to start removing un-needed parts.
Anyone?


----------



## SB_Beetle (Oct 11, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Quick and simple. Definitely notice throttle is smoother. Running an ECS N75, Bailey DV30, and MBC. Had no surging issues prior, but trying to locate limp causes. Need to run actual vs. requested boost logs to see how this compares in relation to NOT bypassing the N249. Didn't resolve the limp so going to look elsewhere.


----------



## SB_Beetle (Oct 11, 2003)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (coolvdub)*


_Quote, originally posted by *coolvdub* »_I looked at my car an '02 Jetta and the small braided line goes to the Combi valve not the FPR. So my question is, did you actually tap into the FPR line which is braided also and very short or the line feeding the Combi valve, also braided, but longer and right next to the line that feeds the N249 valve.

Get rid of any braided lines you have and replace them with true vacuume lines. The braided lines are prone to rot and give you all kinds of seemingly invisible issues.


----------



## hootyburra (Feb 19, 2007)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (SB_Beetle)*

great thread, will be trying this soon.


----------



## J-tec (May 20, 2006)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (hootyburra)*

I did this about 6-7 months ago now, and could never figure out why i couldn't pass inspection.
I kept getting the P0411-35-00 - Secondary air pump incorrect flow detected and couldn't figure out why until tonight
I replaced the combi valve, n112, etc. thinking it could be something bad within those routes, lastly thinking about changing the actual pump.
After banging my head against a wall a few dozen times, i got a vacuum pressure tester and tested the vac lines between the combi valve and the n112 while the pump was on. I had no vac at all! I checked the expansion tank, no vac pressure there either!
I then check under the manifold to realize that a line i capped for the n249 block was actually blocking off all the vac pressure to the n249,n112, and expansion tank. The section i capped was the T section of the T valve in the vacuum line running to the n249. The port on the intake manifold where that n249 hose used to plug into was now the vac line for the DV. So i unplugged that, put the DV vac hose back to the position where it was stock on the hardline by the TIP and put the N249 valve hose back to the port on the intake mani. 
Fired the car up, logged group 077, got the SAI to turn on and yes! i have around 0-4.0 g/s flowing through the system! i had -100 g/s when there was no vaccum, just incase some of you might be seeing that. 
I just wanted to let everyone know because this was one of the most frustrating things to figure out. I was told over and over that blocking the n249 will not affect passing emissions, but IT WILL!
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

so you cap where the dv hose goes to the metal tube??


----------



## engineerd18t (Dec 12, 2007)

*Re: (weenerdog3443)*


_Quote, originally posted by *weenerdog3443* »_so you cap where the dv hose goes to the metal tube??
I capped the side that slides over the DV nipple. I'm ghetto and just stuck a screw in there with a little sealant and tightened it with a hose clamp....then routed the DV to an open nipple on the manifold.


----------



## FuzzyVW537 (Feb 22, 2008)

*Re: Bypassing the N249 - An Easier Approach (dbrowne1)*

Awsome http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## @lex20th (Jul 28, 2009)

i have a question.... i need to bypass the valve ‘cause it just went bad and throw a code... but after i bypass it, what do i do with the connector? (circled in blue)... should i leave it connected or disconnected


----------



## dtriforce (Oct 16, 2010)

dbrowne1 said:


> I just finished road testing my car after bypassing the N249, in a much more direct and "clean" method than some of the ones I've seen suggested. It works great, partial throttle is MUCH smoother and predictable - no jerky boost.
> All I did was this:
> 1. Trace the path of the top (actuator) hose from the DV. It goes to a metal tube that runs along the block, then to another rubber hose, then underneath the intake manifold to the N249.
> 2. Remove the hose that connects the tube to the N249, at the side closer to the N249. There is a reusable clamp, just pinch it with pliers and pull the tube off.
> ...


What size of vaccum hose(s) do you have to use? im planning on doing this tomorow.


----------



## dtriforce (Oct 16, 2010)

dbrowne1 said:


> I just finished road testing my car after bypassing the N249, in a much more direct and "clean" method than some of the ones I've seen suggested. It works great, partial throttle is MUCH smoother and predictable - no jerky boost.
> All I did was this:
> 1. Trace the path of the top (actuator) hose from the DV. It goes to a metal tube that runs along the block, then to another rubber hose, then underneath the intake manifold to the N249.
> 2. Remove the hose that connects the tube to the N249, at the side closer to the N249. There is a reusable clamp, just pinch it with pliers and pull the tube off.
> ...


what size of vaccum hose(s) are needed?


----------



## chaveezy (Jan 31, 2010)

...


----------



## zactastic (Dec 23, 2010)

is this a modification that you would do before upgrading the N75 valve to a N75J valve? or do this if you only notice inconsistant surging?


----------



## 10 Gauge (Dec 17, 2012)

zactastic said:


> is this a modification that you would do before upgrading the N75 valve to a N75J valve? or do this if you only notice inconsistant surging?


I just did the bypass as I noticed partial throttle surging on APR Stage 1 software. The bypass has almost 100% fixed it. I feel like the car builds boost a bit faster and is much smoother under partial throttle acceleration. Every now and again I feel just a bit of surging in 3rd gear accelerating but it's way better than it was. I currently have a stock N75 but have a J valve coming in this week, we will see how it works in conjunction with this.

Highly recommended bypass.

Update after a few days of driving. I have noticed that the surging is still there. I don't think it's quite as bad but still pretty noticeable on partial throttle acceleration. I also didn't notice any improvement after installing my n75 j valve either, but I am holding a few more PSI over the stock valve.


----------

