# 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome



## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

OK, guys here is the scoop with the 02 CD/Cassette Double Din Monsoon systems in Jettas and Golfs. My dealer called me one morning because I have a pretty good relationship with one of the service guys. He said that his Body Shop Manager just got his 02 Jetta and also said that the Monsoon sucks, no highs, no bass, muffled sound and right side is louder. So... just that day the VW Tech from VW HQ was in at the dealer visiting, the service guy told me to bring it in, because the VW Tech said that he has a company car Passat that sounded really bad listening to radio stations and that all that was needed to be done is have the VAG 1551 hooked up and reprogram the radio with the correct codes to fix the problem. Welp, it works great in his Passat I heard it myself - the tuner sounds like a CD, BUT after trying 3 radios and 2 amps from other Monsoon Jetta cars the VW Tech was stumped!!! He told me himself that the radio sounds really bad and it should not sound that way. He said that it seems like a programming error in the Radios and that he would file it with VW once he got back. He literally sat in my car for almost 2 hours screwing around with the different codes for my radio thru the VAG and was just plain stumped. He said that obviously there is a problem and once VW has an update he would contact me personally. I really never say a "Manufacture Tech" so dedicated on fixing a problem and actually putting effort into investigating it! I'm glad that someone from VW actually knows about it now. I really hope that they come out with a software patch to fix the problem so I don't have to go out and buy an aftermarket radio.
I'll keep you guys posted with any more info!


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

I think that we all should make a call to VW and put in a complaint about the 2002 Monsoon Radio too, that could speed things up for a fix.


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## Farhvergnugen (Mar 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Agreed! The '02s that I test drove had the old HU in them and sounded fine. Of course, when my car showed up, it had the new HU. Thought that would have been a good thing.







Should have saved my money and done it right... done it myself! Thx for the info and let us know what you find out!


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Farhvergnugen)*

Just got off the phone with the dealer service advisor. They will be pulling in the body shop managers 02 Jetta and trying several different software codes on the radio. He will call me back sometime this week with the answer on a fix.


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## scr2000 (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

This thread MUST be kept active... the double din is seriously messed up. I know because I had the single just two months ago.


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (scr2000)*

ATTN DOUBLE DIN OWNERS:
PLEASE EMAIL ME WITH THE SUBJECT "VW DOUBLE-DIN"
I WOULD LIKE TO START COLLECTING NAMES AND EMAIL ADDRESSES. I WILL THEN SUBMIT THESE DIRECTLY TO VOLKSWAGEN. IF YOU WANT IT FIXED, PLEASE EMAIL ME, THE SOONER WE GET THIS LIST TOGETHER, THE SOONER THE RADIO WILL PROBABLY BE FIXED.
EMAIL ME AT: [email protected]
THANK YOU.


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## GTI_FEVER (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

just get an aftermarket deck. it is so worth the money. It will make your stereo sound better than the monsoon deck will ever be able to


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI_FEVER)*

CAN'T PUT IN AN AFTERMARKET DECK IN THE DOUBLE-DIN CONFIG WITHOUT RUNNING EXTENSIVE NEW WIRING. THEY RUN A CAN-BUS CONNECTION, THAT MEANS, NO POWER LEAD, NO POWER-ON LEAD, NO DIMMING. IT IS ALL CONTROLLED BY TWO WIRES COMING FROM THE ECU. A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE PAID $300+ DOLLARS FOR THIS OPTION AND IT SHOULD BE FIXED AND WORKING CORRECTLY WITHOUT BUYING SOMETHING ELSE!


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## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI_FEVER)*

quote:[HR][/HR]just get an aftermarket deck. it is so worth the money. It will make your stereo sound better than the monsoon deck will ever be able to[HR][/HR]​true dat...but personally i don't have the $ to spend on an aftermarket HU. plus if we all resorted to buying aftermarket HUs we let The Man trump us and that isn't right







so, on with the mission! everyone who is disappointed with their monsoon, sign up on the email list (see a few posts above this one) and let's get VW to take some action!


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## evilpat (Feb 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

The 01' Monsoon Radios sucked too if you didn't alerady know. Don't leave it to a car dealer to build a better radio. Swap your deack and leave the factory speakers. My system POUNDS with factory monsoon speakers and a Pioneer Premier deck. I still LOVE my 1.8t anyways!!!


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## scr2000 (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (evilpat)*

I don't know about the '01 Monsoons, but I KNOW FOR A FACT that the 2000 single din Monsoon set-up I had sounded MUCH better than this 2002 Double din I have now. It was good enough that I didn't feel the need to go aftermarket, now with the double-din I feel I do need to. That ****e aint right!!!








vw2.0gti,
You have an email!








I hope this can be dealt with.


[Modified by scr2000, 9:28 PM 3-4-2002]


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## GTI'nChick (Feb 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (scr2000)*

ttt - keeping it alive, I really want this fixed! 
vw2.0gti - you've got mail!
quote:[HR][/HR]This thread MUST be kept active... the double din is seriously messed up. I know because I had the single just two months ago.[HR][/HR]​


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## JUANCA"ELPAPI" (Mar 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI_FEVER)*

DUDE, I WAS TOLD THAT AN AFTERMARKET DECK PREVENTS THEIR DIAGNOSTIC COMPUTERS FROM WORKING PROPERLY WHEN YOUR CAR IS IN FOR SERVICE OR REPAIRS, AND IF YOU OWN A 2.0, YOU KNOW THAT'S QUITE OFTEN!


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## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JUANCA"ELPAPI")*

ttt
vw2.0gti, how many people have e-mailed you thus far?


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

So far 11 people... 
now I know that there are many more of you out there.. please email me so I can make a case to VW.


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (scr2000)*

same thing here scr2000, i had a 2000 jetta with the single and monsoon, and it sounded great. i have a 2002 jetta with the double and monsoon AND BAZOOKA TUBE 8" powered, and it still sounds muffled. it is louder than my 2000, but not the way it should be. i did not get the bazooka tube with the 2000 because i liked the way it sounded stock...


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## Ken1.8T (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Well, I recant my previous post where I thought nothing was wrong with my DD Monsoon...I did the balance to left and then fade to rear test and the system cracks like crazy....looks like it needs to be fixed...


[Modified by Ken1.8T, 11:22 PM 4-8-2002]


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## Denver1.8tWagon (Feb 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

My 02 Monsoon, is working fine so far. I am by no means an audiophile. But I have listened to aftermarket headunits that did sound better. But most of those people have more than $300 invested in their systems.


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## sacherel (Dec 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

My 02 Monsoon system sucks and you can hear a noticeable difference on the right. I hope VW fixes this.


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## scr2000 (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Ken1.8T)*

Before ANY of you and I mean ANY of you say that the 2002 Double Din is good you have to hear the single din. You have to compare apples with apples, remember?
The double din BLOWS compared to the single dins, and if this can be solved with software or a recall then by all means we should pursue this.


[Modified by scr2000, 8:57 PM 3-5-2002]


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## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

ok i'm posting a link to this thread in the golf/jetta iv forum. hopefully this will send more people our way


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## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

It had the single din in my jetta... sounded great.
I got the doulbe din in my gti... sounds like ass.


[Modified by steez, 9:49 AM 3-6-2002]


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## palmor99 (Dec 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

Count me in. Just picked up my 02 GTI last night and I am also disappointed with the stereo. My gf has a 01 Jette WE and it sounds much better! Actually the system I had in my 97 GTI VR6 that I just traded in sounded better.

John


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

I test drove a GTI this weekend with double din and by way of comparison to my single din NON-monsoon system it sounded like crap...keep us updated!!!!


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## blinkthisGTI (Feb 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

submit me!! my 02 double din sucks!!
Henry Bober
[email protected]


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## TO_DubR (Mar 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Oh man!!! I thought I was crazy or something. So it wasn't just me. I can seriously notice that the right speaker is louder then the left and even my buddy was complaining about the quality of the radio. I surely ain't no audiophile either, but I can really notice the difference. Alright people, let's get that 02 Double DIN fixed!!!


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## bluegreenturtle (Sep 14, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TO_DubR)*

bump


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bluegreenturtle)*

ATTN DOUBLE DIN OWNERS:
PLEASE EMAIL ME WITH THE SUBJECT "VW DOUBLE-DIN"
I WOULD LIKE TO START COLLECTING NAMES AND EMAIL ADDRESSES. I WILL THEN SUBMIT THESE DIRECTLY TO VOLKSWAGEN. IF YOU WANT IT FIXED, PLEASE EMAIL ME, THE SOONER WE GET THIS LIST TOGETHER, THE SOONER THE RADIO WILL PROBABLY BE FIXED.
EMAIL ME AT: [email protected]
INCLUDE YOUR FULL NAME AND COMPLAINT.
THANK YOU.


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## KEITH (Apr 19, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Ken1.8T)*

bump


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## scr2000 (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Ken1.8T)*

Someone let that man hear a single din so he can join the rest of us with out formal complaint to VWOA.


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## boraIV (Jan 8, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (scr2000)*

mine sounds muffled too. grrrr


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## cdn20VALVE (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (boraIV)*

I don't have my 2002 yet, but I will in 2 weeks.







I will let you know how the monsoon sounds then. 
BTW, shouldn't the vortex rename the monsoon, to something more like... GonSoon!


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## Beaker (Oct 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (cdn20VALVE)*

the stock BASE system in my sisters 2001 mustang sounds 100 times better.....i drove accross country in a focus, and its base system was much better.....the 2002 D-Din system = http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## rbenjami (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Beaker)*

Can we clean up our terminology. Monsoon is not the same as double din. I have a *non-monsoon double din*. The sound quality is nice, but the imaging is a mess. I have pleanty of bass. My only complaint is that sounds bounce around the cabin like nobody's business. If I move my head about two inches in any direction, it is like I have adjusted the balance/fader to play that speaker exclusively. This is a speaker placement problem, and has nothing to do with the headunit.
Is something different happening to those who spent ~$300 for the Monsoon? I'd like to hear from some *non-monsoon double din* owners.


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Not to say anything that hasn't already been said, but my '02 Jetta w/ Monsoon is muffled on the Left/louder on the Right and has a lack of real bass. Just adding my .02.







I've submitted my name to vw2.0gti to be part of the list.


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## Roboman (Jan 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Not to say anything that hasn't already been said, but my '02 Jetta w/ Monsoon is muffled on the Left/louder on the Right and has a lack of real bass. Just adding my .02.







I've submitted my name to vw2.0gti to be part of the list.[HR][/HR]​Same goes for me!


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## AVTech (Mar 5, 2002)

*D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat*

Sorry for the long post. 
As a professional in the field of automotive audio electronics (I design test equipment for servicing, repair and alignment of OEM car audio systems, but not for VW), and an owner of a new 2002 Passat (only 500 mi. on the odometer) with a DD NON-Monsoon stereo, I would like to offer my 5c of opinion.
I did not have a chance to listen to a Monsoon system, but the non-Monsoon DD in my Passat sounds just OK. Not better, but not worse then radios in my previous car (’99 Maxima, non-Bose), or any non-premium audio system I test at work (and I test a few a day). 
There are some problems with the Passat acoustics, but they are not related to the head unit. 
First of all, the speakers placement is unacceptable. The midranges are almost on the floor, and tweeters are placed high and far away from the midranges. It makes good stereo imaging almost impossible to achieve, because the sound sources are “blurred”, sound doesn’t propagate from one spot. As a result, the sound has to cover very different distances from 2 speakers on each side, which creates unpredictable phase difference between midrange and tweeter on the same side when sound reaches the listener.
Second problem, the rear speakers are placed in the doors, rather than on the rear shelf. There is not enough room in the doors to place large speakers or to create sufficient bass output. Therefore, there is no sound at all below 80 – 100 Hz, I listened to a couple of test CDs in the car, including my favorite IASCA Official Judging CD.
Otherwise, the sound is clear, free of distortions at reasonable volume levels, musical programs sound very good, it looks like an additional subwoofer, may be Infinity Basslink in the trunk, would improve this system’s sound dramatically.
But the problems described above are not related to the head unit. Is the head unit used in Monsoon system the same as non-Monsoon? Most likely, yes. I beleave that the problem is in the Monsoon amplifier and speakers. 
Could anybody tell what exactly sounds wrong with the Monsoon? Frequency range? Distortion, noise, etc.?


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat (AVTech)*

The Passat Monsoon sounds great compared to the Monsoon in the Jetta. I could only wish that Jetta/Golf Monsoon would sound like the Passat. The head-unit is coded differently. The best way to describe the sound is that it is very MUDDY. No highs, no lows, just everything mixed in together and sounding very flat and muddy. But once you stick a CD in, everything livens up! So... there is something obviously wrong with the Tuner in the Jetta/Golfs software.


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## JLJetta (Nov 24, 2001)

*Re: D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat (AVTech)*

AFtech:
Having "test benched" my '02 GTI system, there are a few heinous things that it does:
1) The headunit internally distorts with any signal -3dB or greater. This is NOT the output section being over driven. It will deliver a clean ~4.5volts clean from 20-20Khz with a -5dB test signal. So, any signal on a regular CD at -3dB or greater will distort. Looking at the wave form, it is definately not a normal "clipping". Nor does it appear to be a saturation of the DAC. Frankly, it's unlike anythign I've ever seen. The output of a digital processing/converter/etc should not clip. And just about any junk now-n-days does not. It could simply be that some potentiometer on the board is mis-aligned. 
Since the problem occurs irrelevent of the output volume.. I do not think it is associated with the analogue output section of the headunit. This problem also is not apparent in the output of the factory CD changer. 

2) There appears to be a slight time delay in the rear-drivers side output. I do not think this is intentional. If they were intentionally doing time alignment, they could have done a whole hell of alot better job!
3) the midranges simply "bork" too easy. Way too much compression, very poor output below ~300hz. I do not expect infrasonic-extension in a factory system.. but the total crud from in the midbass region with any volume is simply unacceptable!
This is sad, as the ergonomics of the new double-din unit is quite nice. The ergo of the cup-holders on the other hand.. suck!


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## rbenjami (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat (JLJetta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]AFtech:
Having "test benched" my '02 GTI system, there are a few heinous things that it does:
1) The headunit internally distorts with any signal -3dB or greater. This is NOT the output section being over driven. It will deliver a clean ~4.5volts clean from 20-20Khz with a -5dB test signal. So, any signal on a regular CD at -3dB or greater will distort. Looking at the wave form, it is definately not a normal "clipping". Nor does it appear to be a saturation of the DAC. Frankly, it's unlike anythign I've ever seen. The output of a digital processing/converter/etc should not clip. And just about any junk now-n-days does not. It could simply be that some potentiometer on the board is mis-aligned. 
Since the problem occurs irrelevent of the output volume.. I do not think it is associated with the analogue output section of the headunit. This problem also is not apparent in the output of the factory CD changer. 

2) There appears to be a slight time delay in the rear-drivers side output. I do not think this is intentional. If they were intentionally doing time alignment, they could have done a whole hell of alot better job!
3) the midranges simply "bork" too easy. Way too much compression, very poor output below ~300hz. I do not expect infrasonic-extension in a factory system.. but the total crud from in the midbass region with any volume is simply unacceptable!
This is sad, as the ergonomics of the new double-din unit is quite nice. The ergo of the cup-holders on the other hand.. suck![HR][/HR]​Interesting. These results are just for the double din headunit? If so, the monsoon aspect is probably not the problem


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat (rbenjami)*

Is the headunit itself different between the monsoon and non-monsoon systems?
And as for imaging...whoever designed in the speaker placement on our cars should be shot. At the very least they could have put the tweeters in the kick panels! Having used kick panel pods for years and won many IASCA competitions with them I can vouch for the effectiveness of this location. The only result you get when you put the mid and tweeter ALMOST 3 FEET apart is an incredibly bad sound stage that, at least on my car, was further exacerbated by the fact that the speakers came out of phase from the factory.
But, help is on the way...Q-forms has designed and will be releasing kick panel enclosures for our cars!!!!


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Roboman)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Not to say anything that hasn't already been said, but my '02 Jetta w/ Monsoon is muffled on the Left/louder on the Right and has a lack of real bass. Just adding my .02.







I've submitted my name to vw2.0gti to be part of the list.
Same goes for me![HR][/HR]​
Ditto. I have also called my dealer and VWoA and noone has any knowledge of this. I really hope this gets fixed! 
vw2.0gti, how goes the fight? How many names do you have?


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## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

i seem to have a problem with the volume...the volume doesn't seem to increase/decrease in a very linear fashion, if that makes sense...for example, 1 "click" above the minimum setting, the sound is still pretty loud. and, from about 1/2 to 3/4 volume, each turn of the knob doesn't seem to make the system go much louder. in fact, each turn of the volume knob barely seems to affect the volume, and according to the little volume bar i've "increased" the volume by 20%. and, the maximum volume is not very loud IMO. 
when i say the volume doesn't seem linear i mean that each rotation of the volume knob doesn't seem to increase/decrease the volume by the same amount, depending on how loud you have it. perhaps this is just my car...does this make sense? is anyone else experiencing this?


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## JLJetta (Nov 24, 2001)

*Re: D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat (rbenjami)*

Yes. This is measured at the connector from the radio, going INTO the amplifier.
I have not had a chance to bench-test the amp itself.


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat (JLJetta)*

Alright, here is the count so far... 49.
And I have an appointed to the dealer again this coming Monday, I will keep everyone posted. Please keep the names coming and only send 1 email per person/vehicle.
thanks!


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## 2002Bora (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: D-Din NON-Monsoon in 2002 Passat (vw2.0gti)*

TTT Let's get this noticed and fixed...


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## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]ATTN DOUBLE DIN OWNERS:
PLEASE EMAIL ME WITH THE SUBJECT "VW DOUBLE-DIN"
I WOULD LIKE TO START COLLECTING NAMES AND EMAIL ADDRESSES. I WILL THEN SUBMIT THESE DIRECTLY TO VOLKSWAGEN. IF YOU WANT IT FIXED, PLEASE EMAIL ME, THE SOONER WE GET THIS LIST TOGETHER, THE SOONER THE RADIO WILL PROBABLY BE FIXED.
EMAIL ME AT: [email protected]
THANK YOU.[HR][/HR]​
Just did it http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## wookie1 (Jan 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

I thought that the TSB was only to change settings that improve AM reception. I very rarely listen to AM, only when a non-televised sporting event is going on.


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (wookie1)*

Ok, I was just at the dealer today. Not just for the Monsoon system, but for my Oil Pan shield, the 5th time for buzzing. Anyways... the dealer printed out a list of people complaining about the radio and they only had 3 people total including me. The VW OTS guy has already listened to it and knows about the problem. The problem is that they do not have enough complaints about the Monsoon sounding, muddy, right side louder than left, no treble, no bass, too much mid-range.
What all of us need to do is we ALL NEED to go to your dealer and BRING THE VEHICLE in for service! The dealer cannot turn you down on checking your radio! PUT IN YOUR COMPLAINT, MAKE SURE THE DEALER WRITES UP EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAY. THEY HAVE TO, IT'S REQUIRED BY LAW. TELL THEM THAT YOU WANT TO COMPLAIN / CHECK THE RIGHT SIDE IS LOUDER, SOUND IS MUDDY, NO BASS, NO TREBLE, TOO MUCH MID-RANGE. MAKE SURE THEY NOTE THAT IN THE SERVICE REQUEST!!! Everyone has to bring your car in at least once for VW to actually take notice of the problem. I have approx. 58 names that have been emailed to me and they are being prepared for the next trip to visit the VW OTS guy. But EVERYONE needs to do their part and BRING YOUR CAR TO THE DEALER AND HAVE THEM WRITE UP A SERVICE REQUEST AND COMPLAIN TO THE EXACT POINT ABOUT YOUR RADIO.
Thanks everyone, will keep you posted on further developments.


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## scr2000 (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Damn, this looks like it is going to take a LONG ARSE time before anything is done by VW. I'll take my car in and complain about it, but if a wiring harness comes out before they resolve the monsoon issue I'll be going aftermarket. I just can't bear the sound of it much longer. Are there any other sites out there that we could notify to spread the word?


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (scr2000)*

I don't know of any other site. If anyone knows, please inform us!!!
But WE CANNOT give up!! I paid my $350+ for my Monsoon and what I want is a MONSOON! I'm NOT GIVEN UP ON THIS ONE. I getting sick and tired of getting screwed by huge corporations!


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

I definitely agree with you vw2.0gti. We paid for an upgraded sound system and actually got a half-a$$ radio that sounds worse than the basic stock unit. Not to mention I love the look of the factory double din unit, especially at night. We should NOT have to replace it (and if someone does it won't be me paying for it)!








I went to my dealer, along with my cousin (and his '02 Jetta), and filed a complaint on Saturday, the 9th. I put in a club/dance track and simply turned the balance knob from right to left. He heard it right away! You'd have to be deaf not to! Both a service rep and a sales person heard it. We have the paperwork. He said he wanted to call VWoA and see if they know about the problem and to try him back in about a week. He also said the same thing you said - if other people don't get off the fence and complain about this, then it might take awhile to get fixed! LET'S MAKE VW AWARE OF THIS! We plan on calling the dealer and VWoA regularly until this gets fixed!


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

i am taking my car in wednesday 8am 03/13/2002, for the 5k service, i am going to print out this post and take it with me (i suggest that everyone print and take this post with them too) and make them aware of the problem and file a formal complaint.
i am going to take it to Advantage Volkswagen here in Houston. i know the service guys there.
i am in agreement about it being fixed, but if VWoA is like anyone else, it will be along time fixing this if ever. (come on 2002 double-din wiring harness!!!!!!)


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## Green Goblin (Jun 14, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

I just laid into them in my JD Powers survey about the Monsoon. I suggest anyone who has bought a 2002 and gets this survey do the same.


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## HaterOfHondas (Nov 1, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Green Goblin)*

You've Got Mail...Im in because my wife has a 2000 jetta with no monsoon and it sounds better than my double din.........


----------



## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

I've posted a link to this topic in the Golf IV & Jetta IV discussion area to help spread the word.


----------



## agarc (Nov 19, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (evilpat)*

I have a 2002 single-din (Monsoon) with OEM indash CD and Panasonic 6disc changer and it sounds awesome! And I know what good sound sounds like because I am a musician. I've also heard though, that the single din radios with monsoon sound better in Jetta's than in Golfs, something to do with the levels in front and rear...
Good luck double-din owners... I've heard they sound awful!


----------



## Non_Affiliated (Feb 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

just remember Monsoons Blow.


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## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Non_Affiliated)*

i lub my old monsoon, new one sawks arse


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## MKvw (Jul 19, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

The NON-Monsoon double din in my sisters 2002 Jetta sounds great, I was actually looking to by the same for my 2001 NON-Monsoon Golf as an upgrade.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MKvw)*

I wonder if the problem is the internal electronics that supply the low voltage signal rather than the full signal. (sorry but brain can't think of the correct terms to use right now)
You can change the programming of the HU to either output low-voltage for the MOnsoon (or an amp) or you can have it output high voltage for connection directly to speakers.
Any ideas ?


----------



## newbiewithGTI2002 (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I complained a long long time ago directly to Monsoon, and they suggested I take a trip to the dealer because it may have been wrongly configured.
The same unit is programmed differently depending in which vehicle it is installed, so there may be something wrong with it.
I never went to the dealer and ditched it for a Blau and indash cd changer. The system sounds a lot better, espoecially since there is a digital equalizer. But it's by no means the best I've heard... (my Volvo had the best OEM system by far... Alpine-made deckwith Dynaudio speakers... all 10 of them







).


[Modified by newbiewithGTI2002, 3:34 PM 3-13-2002]


----------



## m_graphic (Mar 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

i contacted my dealer. they wont acknowlege the problem at all, says it is fine and that is how the monsoon 2din works/sounds. i find that hard to believe. i also gave vwc an earful. recall!!! 
mike
02 gti 1.8T


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## pinoy53169 (Feb 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

Once I read about this problem, I went to check my car and I'm having the same problem. When I called my local Service Dept, they said this problem was normal and is not considered a defect. I called VWoA and they said they never heard of this problem. .... So what do we/i do now?


----------



## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (pinoy53169)*

m_graphic, pinoy53169,
Did you guys take the car to the dealer? I would suggest to go there and make someone at the service dept listen to it. Tell them it will take all of 2 minutes to hear the problem. You heard it right? So, will they (unless they're deaf). They will take you more seriously if you're standing right in front of them. Remember, they don't want anybody creating a scene.
VWoA should have recommended that you take your car and have someone at the service dept look into it. That's what they told me. So I went to the dealer and told them to listen to it. They did and they agreed there was a problem and they are looking into it. DON'T GIVE UP! MAKE THEM LISTEN TO IT! 
You shouldn't have to, but if they just won't, you could try another service dept. 
Also, try calling VWoA costumer care at a different time. You'll most likely get someone else who should listen to your complaint. Tell them you want it documented that you called and to give your number (I'm not sure what she called it, but when I called, the person who answered gave me like a case number so if I had to call again they could refer back to it.)
Hope this helps.


[Modified by vmb7, 5:55 PM 3-13-2002]


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## sleepswitdafish (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (pinoy53169)*

We all know the D-Din Monsoon sucks! The real problem is that there is no harness as yet to allow us to replace that piece of garbage w/ a real HU. I have a Blaupunkt Hamburg which looks amazing in the vw and sounds amazing but i cant install it














Anybody hears of a harness please let us know! thanks.


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## luckeydoug1 (Feb 11, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (sleepswitdafish)*

One more to add! I have only had my Jetta for 2 1/2 months and listned only to CDs at first. I am an audiophile with a home system over $10,000 so I may be a bit hard to please. The CD sound my Jetta is really quite good for a stock system, but boy is it terrible when I switch to the tuner, either AM or FM. I have to completely readjust the l/r balance, f/r fade, as well as treble/bass settings and still have a radio that sounds worse than my antique Ramblers from the 70s. It doesn't matter much what station is selected. 


[Modified by luckeydoug1, 9:35 PM 3-13-2002]


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (luckeydoug1)*

Does anyone have the Bentley for the 2002's yet as this should show you how to use the VAG-COM to see what the HU setting are and change them.
I am still waiting for mine & it will be one of the first things I do when the Bentley arrives
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Okay,
i got my 5k service done today. i printed this thread and took it with me. i showed it to the guy that took my car and made him read the initial post to understand what is going on. then i showed him how many people have replied to the thread.
i watched the matrix on my laptop while sitting in the Turbo S in the showroom







NICE SEATS!!!!
A lady brought out my paperwork to sign, here is what the paperwork said:
...
-------------------------------------------
J# 3 52VWZ03 SOUND SYSTEM TECH(S):1928 $0.00
CUSTOMER STATE RADIO SPEAKER IS LOUDER ON PASS.SIDE RADIO
HAS NO BASE.
CK CAR FOR CODES NONE FOUND..CORRECT RADIO CODING
NO WORK PERFORMED
-------------------------------------------
...
i did not talk to anyone afterwards, i had a meeting to get to.


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## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

What you describe sounds like a phase problem -- maybe the wiring harness is hooked up wrong from the factory.
I have a single din '01 Monsoon and it sounds great. I have driven the doubledin and didn't like it either. If there is a problem with how the wiring harness is installed, or connectors mismarked/flipped, then no amount of reprogramming the codes would fix it.
What do you think?


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (HeyJude)*

quote:[HR][/HR]What you describe sounds like a phase problem -- maybe the wiring harness is hooked up wrong from the factory.
I have a single din '01 Monsoon and it sounds great. I have driven the doubledin and didn't like it either. If there is a problem with how the wiring harness is installed, or connectors mismarked/flipped, then no amount of reprogramming the codes would fix it.
What do you think?[HR][/HR]​
oh......my.....god !!!!!
I thought it was just something they had done on purpose, but, about 4 months ago I took out my D-Din Monsoon HU and noted the connector and wiring asking if anyone had any comments why it was like that









LOOK AT THE LF SPKR WIRE COLORS - they are REVERSED - OMG
DO you thing that VW did a major FU and made the harnesses wrong






















I am going to pull out my radio and swap over the wires and see what happens in the morning.


[Modified by UKAUSSI, 10:53 AM 3-14-2002]


----------



## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

WOW!!!...we'll just have to stay in suspense until you complete the grand experiment! 
If this IS the problem, it shouldn't take this forum long to check it out on a few different vehicles. I have a few buddies at the VW dealer here, they will be all over this!
Good luck!!!


----------



## MacPhisto (Mar 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (HeyJude)*

Maybe im wrong, but if this was the problem, the cd player would sound like crap too.
Anyways id' like to hear about it
thanx


----------



## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MacPhisto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Maybe im wrong, but if this was the problem, the cd player would sound like crap too.
Anyways id' like to hear about it
thanx[HR][/HR]​Maybe, maybe not. Depends on the kind of music you are listening to. Radio stations do change the signal when they send it out for compression, frequency, and other factors. This would make the problem of being out of phase worse when the signal is already not clear.



[Modified by BryanH, 1:43 PM 3-28-2002]


----------



## JLJetta (Nov 24, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]What you describe sounds like a phase problem -- maybe the wiring harness is hooked up wrong from the factory.
I have a single din '01 Monsoon and it sounds great. I have driven the doubledin and didn't like it either. If there is a problem with how the wiring harness is installed, or connectors mismarked/flipped, then no amount of reprogramming the codes would fix it.
What do you think?

oh......my.....god !!!!!
I thought it was just something they had done on purpose, but, about 4 months ago I took out my D-Din Monsoon HU and noted the connector and wiring.
LOOK AT THE LF SPKR WIRE COLORS - they are REVERSED - OMG
DO you thing that VW did a major FU and made the harnesses wrong






















I am going to pull out my radio and swap over the wires and see what happens in the morning.[HR][/HR]​I have verified that the color wires are in fact, correct. I used a test-CD with pulse/polarity checker signals, and used a Fluke 199 oscilliscope to monitor the input. The polarity on the output of the monsoon amp is also correct.
This is for my '02 GTI Luxury/Monsoon double-din radio.


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JLJetta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have verified that the color wires are in fact, correct. I used a test-CD with pulse/polarity checker signals, and used a Fluke 199 oscilliscope to monitor the input. The polarity on the output of the monsoon amp is also correct.
This is for my '02 GTI Luxury/Monsoon double-din radio.[HR][/HR]​So are you saying that the outputs on the radio pins are correct and the wires are connected incorrectly ?


----------



## m_graphic (Mar 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

you sound like you know what you are talking about. thanks. so is there a problem or isnt there? the dealer said that is just the way the monsoon is. i have nothing to compare it to...so i dont know. the dealer said they cant do anything about it. i filed a complaint with vwc. so is there a problem with the radio. if there is do you think vw will ever address it?
thanks
mike
02 gti 1.8T


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (m_graphic)*































SWEEEEEEEEEEEET. 

I just finished swapping the wires over as promised and it is WAAAAAY better.
The stereo imaging is MUCH improved and I now have BAAASSSSS





























I switched it back briefly and confirmed that it definitely was better.
COnsequently, I have started another post which will hopefully be made sticky so we can all get our wiring fixed and enjoy are CD's 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=282989 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## MichaelR (Feb 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]SWEEEEEEEEEEEET. 

I just finished swapping the wires over as promised and it is WAAAAAY better.
The stereo imaging is MUCH improved and I now have BAAASSSSS





























I switched it back briefly and confirmed that it definitely was better.
COnsequently, I have started another post which will hopefully be made sticky so we can all get our wiring fixed and enjoy are CD's 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=282989 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​I don't know what i'm talking about, but this simple wire reversal is the cause of the double din monsoon sounding like crap? how is that possible?


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## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MichaelR)*

I'm not a EE, but here's a fuzzy explanation of how I think it works: 
Basically, the speakers run off of 2 wires each, signal & ground. If they are switched on one speaker, the signal going to this speaker will be "out of phase" with the signal going to its complement. So, one speaker "pushes" and the other one "pulls", when they are supposed to push & pull together (ignoring stereo differences). This means that wierd wave forms are floating around in the car and partially cancelling each other out. Of course, this happens very fast and what you notice is "poor imaging" and muddy sound.


----------



## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (HeyJude)*

you are more right that you know....


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## buba (Mar 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Did this make a difference on the tuner or just the CD? I cant stand to listen to the tuner in my car it sounds so bad. The CD is ok but it is louder and more bass on the right side.


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## newbiewithGTI2002 (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]What you describe sounds like a phase problem -- maybe the wiring harness is hooked up wrong from the factory.
I have a single din '01 Monsoon and it sounds great. I have driven the doubledin and didn't like it either. If there is a problem with how the wiring harness is installed, or connectors mismarked/flipped, then no amount of reprogramming the codes would fix it.
What do you think?

oh......my.....god !!!!!
I thought it was just something they had done on purpose, but, about 4 months ago I took out my D-Din Monsoon HU and noted the connector and wiring asking if anyone had any comments why it was like that









LOOK AT THE LF SPKR WIRE COLORS - they are REVERSED - OMG
DO you thing that VW did a major FU and made the harnesses wrong






















I am going to pull out my radio and swap over the wires and see what happens in the morning.

[Modified by UKAUSSI, 10:53 AM 3-14-2002][HR][/HR]​I noticed that as well, and took a look at my Monsoon amp in the back and they too are reversed...


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (HeyJude)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I'm not a EE, but here's a fuzzy explanation of how I think it works: 
Basically, the speakers run off of 2 wires each, signal & ground. If they are switched on one speaker, the signal going to this speaker will be "out of phase" with the signal going to its complement. So, one speaker "pushes" and the other one "pulls", when they are supposed to push & pull together (ignoring stereo differences). This means that wierd wave forms are floating around in the car and partially cancelling each other out. Of course, this happens very fast and what you notice is "poor imaging" and muddy sound.[HR][/HR]​Indeed, if you have 2 speaker opposite each other producing out-of-phase sound waves thay would completely cancel each other out in an perfect simulation.
Note also that the LF signal affects BOTH LF speakers, a tweeter and a Mid/Bass.
YOu will be amazed by the sudden appearance of the low-freq bass that has been missing all along. Scour the CAR AUDIO forum and you will find many posts on people with 2002 VW's trying to get the missing Bass.
Finally, this out-of-phase would be amplified more in those cars that have the Monsoon amp.
If you want to do it yourself reply on the other post noted above so we can get some feedback and let VW know. 
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=282989

*Maybe VWVortex's connections with VW could alert VW to this MAJOR problem so it can put out a tech bulletin and dealers will cooperate more* 



[Modified by UKAUSSI, 12:53 PM 3-14-2002]


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## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (buba)*

The difference should apply to both the tuner and the CD. Because the CD is just another input device, like the tuner. The wiring problem is on the output side, where the sound signal comes out of the HU.
The tuner doesn't sound as good as the CD, for sure. I guess this is due to limitations of FM reception or antenna, plus signal processing "front end". FM = analog, CD = digital.


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

does this involve cutting and rewiring?
you have a step by step howto?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

quote:[HR][/HR]does this involve cutting and rewiring?
you have a step by step howto?[HR][/HR]​I think you should get dealer to do it as it is VW that made the mistake. That way there is no question about warranty etc..
I tried to figure out how to remove the pin from the plug but just couldn't get the last step. I got the large plug out, then got the single plug out of that but no further. I cut the wires about 4" back from the plug and switched them. Connected by twisting and electrical tape. Please take it to the dealer and let me be the only "Guinea-Pig" as I have seen electrical fires caused by poor wiring connections.


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Ok, so what 2 wires did you switch exactly? LF only coming out of the head unit? Swap the yellow and the black so that they are all the same like the others? all black on one side and color on the other? Please verify.
and, is all the midrange still there?? any highs?... 
thanks!


[Modified by vw2.0gti, 4:30 PM 3-14-2002]


----------



## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]does this involve cutting and rewiring?
you have a step by step howto?
I think you should get dealer to do it as it is VW that made the mistake. That way there is no question about warranty etc..
I tried to figure out how to remove the pin from the plug but just couldn't get the last step. I got the large plug out, then got the single plug out of that but no further. I cut the wires about 4" back from the plug and switched them. Connected by twisting and electrical tape. Please take it to the dealer and let me be the only "Guinea-Pig" as I have seen electrical fires caused by poor wiring connections.[HR][/HR]​i doubt the dealer will just switch the wires for me/anybody if there isn't something from VW directly. they'd never be convinced to go ahead and do something like that for me without word from corporate.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Ok, so what 2 wires did you switch exactly? LF only coming out of the head unit? Swap the yellow and the black so that they are all the same like the others? all black on one side and color on the other? Please verify.
and, is all the midrange still there?? any highs?... 
thanks! [HR][/HR]​
Yes, swap the wires as shown below. 








And yes the mid & High seem to be clearer. The biggest difference is in the much cleaner & punchier bass. Guess I'm not buying a sub-woofer anymore. More money for performance mods








clunkified - Technically, if the dealer has their service manual it will show the correct wiring. No real excuse from them other than lazyness. If you just can't wait then go ahead and switch them yourself


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Is the right side still louder than the left? is there still an over abundance of mid-range?


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
clunkified - Technically, if the dealer has their service manual it will show the correct wiring. No real excuse from them other than lazyness. If you just can't wait then go ahead and switch them yourself[HR][/HR]​good question actually...
does the service manual say otherwise i.e. does it have the correct wiring illustrated?










[Modified by clunkified, 10:47 PM 3-14-2002]


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## MichaelR (Feb 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
clunkified - Technically, if the dealer has their service manual it will show the correct wiring. No real excuse from them other than lazyness. If you just can't wait then go ahead and switch them yourself
good question actually...
does the service manual say otherwise i.e. does it have the correct wiring illustrated?









[Modified by clunkified, 10:47 PM 3-14-2002][HR][/HR]​does the service manual we can buy even have the wiring diagram for this radio? i thought they changed something, that's why we can't use the wiring harnesses already available. or was is all 2002's they change the wiring on?


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## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

so what is the procedure for doing the switch? i've never looked at the back of a HU. is it possible to switch the wires without cutting? also, what tools do i need to pop the HU out?


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
*Maybe VWVortex's connections with VW could alert VW to this MAJOR problem so it can put out a tech bulletin and dealers will cooperate more*
[HR][/HR]​I second that. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI,
Is there a special trick on taking it out? The dealer actually gave me the keys and I stick them in there and pull and they don't lock, they just pull out. I can feel a spring when I push it in, but it just won't come out. Any hints please?
thanks


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## 18Gman (Nov 8, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

I just swap the connector..
here the simple way.. 
just swap the connector on the trunk before the moonsoon AMP.
yellow and black pin.. 
its harder when you trying to swap on the HU connector


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (18Gman)*

hmmm...i'm going to investigate this...seems easier.







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (18Gman)*

the only connector that i am aware of in the trunk is the one that plugs right into the monsoon amp. it is really tight in there and i have to take the rear deck off to get to the amp. a bit more work... or is there another point before that to tap into??


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (18Gman)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I just swap the connector..
here the simple way.. 
just swap the connector on the trunk before the moonsoon AMP.
yellow and black pin.. 
its harder when you trying to swap on the HU connector
[HR][/HR]​
I considered this but the connector isn't setup in any logical way. It is very difficult to figure out which is the correct BLACK wire as there are at least 4.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]UKAUSSI,
Is there a special trick on taking it out? The dealer actually gave me the keys and I stick them in there and pull and they don't lock, they just pull out. I can feel a spring when I push it in, but it just won't come out. Any hints please?
thanks[HR][/HR]​
Not sure what the VW tools look like but I made my own. I made 2 sets of what you see below.








Make sure you insert them as shown so that the clips on the HU are pushed inwards --> <-- 
After pushing them all in I opened the cupholder flap and pulled the unit out using fingers stuck into the cassette slot and on the top of the unit (exposed by opening the cupholder flap)


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## Beaker (Oct 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

so can you access the wires from the trunk and do this swap? or do you have to pull out the radio?
...and if you have to pull out the radio, how do you do so? there is nothing in my bentley.


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## 18Gman (Nov 8, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Beaker)*

Yup there are 4 blacks but off course the one that we want to swap is twisted with the yellow one.. noo need to worry just take a look and you can tell easily..


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (18Gman)*

gonna go give it a shot.
i'll let everybody know what happens... (shorts out car...catches on fire...







)


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## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (18Gman)*

is there a how-to online somewhere? Its not worth my time to go to the dealer... ie: make appmt, argue with them for a while, finally get someone to look at it, have his smelly ass in my car, having them potentially damage something (ie: rims, seats), i could go on and on =D
thx


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

amp is a pain in the ass to get to...i'll have to do it this weekend a. when i have time b. when i have daylight. 
should be a simple switch once the wires are exposed.


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## Beaker (Oct 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (18Gman)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Yup there are 4 blacks but off course the one that we want to swap is twisted with the yellow one.. noo need to worry just take a look and you can tell easily..[HR][/HR]​i gave it a shot and it seems better....i did it on the grey plug....not sure if it matters which plug you do it on, as long as its reversed before it gets to the speaker.
anyone have an input? grey or green? (plug)


[Modified by Beaker, 8:54 PM 3-14-2002]


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Beaker)*

how the h*ll do you get at the wire plugs on the amp? i can barely fit my fingers around the cage, much less pull the plugs out. is there a way to get the cage off? i found 2 phillips head screws holding the cage near the trunk side of the cage, but i cannot see what is holding the cage on the back-seat side.
beaker, how did you get the plugs out of the amp?
ukaussi, what did you make HU removal tools out of?


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

quote:[HR][/HR]how the h*ll do you get at the wire plugs on the amp? i can barely fit my fingers around the cage, much less pull the plugs out. is there a way to get the cage off? i found 2 phillips head screws holding the cage near the trunk side of the cage, but i cannot see what is holding the cage on the back-seat side.
beaker, how did you get the plugs out of the amp?
ukaussi, what did you make HU removal tools out of?[HR][/HR]​
stnley - we both have GTI's which have easily accessible Monsoon amps. I here that the Jetta is a PITA to get to.
The tools were made from a small sheet of metal I pulled of the back of a blank that covers an empty drive bay on a PC







(my dad tought me to be resourceful)
They are a little thin but they were only meant to be originally used once or twice. Ideal thickness would be that of a credit card. If you have a credit card it may be stiff enough to use also.
FYI, if you do it at the AMP end it is the GREY plug as these are the INPUTS into the amp. I will take some pics tomorrow


[Modified by UKAUSSI, 9:47 PM 3-14-2002]


----------



## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

yes....before and after pics of the wire swap at the amp would be very nice, indeed. especially tips/pointers on how to get the yellow and black wires out of the clippy thing. i pulled on the yellow one a little but it didn't move so i didn't argue with it--i left it alone, thinking that a muddy stereo is better than a damaged, non-working one any day. anyone who's done this...does it help the sound quality? do we get more bass and better sound?
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by hjohns, 1:27 AM 3-15-2002]


----------



## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

An easy way to test this is to find a bass heavy cd and adjust the fade all the way to the front. Then adjust the balance left and right and if there is more bass with only one speaker than with both you know the speakers are out of phase.


----------



## beelp (Jan 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

Why are some of you trying to access the amp? Are we supposed to change the wires on the HU and the amp?


[Modified by beelp, 4:02 PM 3-15-2002]


----------



## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (beelp)*

from what i understand it the swap can be done at the HU or the AMP, but not both (one or the other). DAMN you GTI folks







it looks like the HU is going to be the easier method for me, but i cannot get the HU out. i also thought about using the PCI slot covers from my pc but i do not have enuff. i am going to try to slice up an old Blockbuster or Sam's card and see if that works. exactly how far do they need to go in (1", 2", etc) ???
i am going to try and get the wires out of the harness instead of cutting them (but if push comes to shove...)


----------



## GTI'nChick (Feb 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

has anyone figured out exactly how to do this for a GTI at the amp? would you be willing to write them down, step by step? Can any changes made be easily reversed? I'm electrically incompetent, but I really want to fix this if I can...


----------



## Brad_Jetta1.8T (Feb 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI'nChick)*

I just switched the wires on my 2002 Jetta. All I can say is damn. Made a huge difference. I thought the factory system was alright. Nothing compared to the one I put in my old car. I was probably going to put something else in when I had some money. I had concerns about matching the interior and stuff like that. I am not worried about that anymore. The factory system is adequate now.
I switched the wires at the amp. I took out the two screws closest to the trunk lid that secure the amp in place. I then pulled the amp toward me to pull it out of the clip holding the back. I could not remove the amp from the cage, but didn't need to. I slid it around until I could get a good grip on the wiring harnass and disconnected it. I switched the yellow wire with the black one adjacent to the yellow one that is toward the inside of the harness. The black one beside the yellow one on the outside of the harness is the wrong one. Plugged it back in and it sounds great.
I went ahead and cut the wires. I couldn't get the pins out and am not that uptight about cutting wires. Just cut them, stripped them and soldered them back together. Taped them up and wrapped the harness with zip ties. The whole process took less than 30 minutes. I do a lot of work on electronics, so I am comfortable with wires and soldering. 
I don't feel that any dealerships will be fixing this in the near future. Even if they did the time to make the appointment, drive 40 minutes to the dealer, wait hours for them to fix it, and drive 40 minutes back is more than doing it myself. For some it may be a good idea to get the dealer to do it though.
I looked at a friends 2001 GTI GLX that has a double din monsoon. It looked like the wiring harness on his amp was wired differently than mine. His had the yellow wire on the inside of the connector and the black wire on the outside. Just like how I modified mine. It is a 2001 so who knows.
Hope this helps someone. I can answer questions.
-Brad


----------



## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (steez)*

could someone post pics of which are the right wires to swap and the process of swapping them for the wires at the AMP?
is cutting and soldering necessary? i don't know if i'd want to undertake a risky process...but then again maybe it's not so risky and the description sounds worse than it is. i just want to be careful and not mess up my system. so if it is possible to switch the wires without cutting, someone tell us how.


----------



## Brad_Jetta1.8T (Feb 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

I should have taken pictures, but I didn't. The amp has a big wiring harness connected to it. Disconnect that harness and look at it. There is one solid yellow wire on the connector. That is a signal wire for the front left speaker. It has a ground wire associated with it. That wire is black and is directly adjacent to the yellow wire. It is connected to one of the middle pins of the harness. You just need to switch those two wires to fix the proplem. Another way to think about it. Hold the connector so that the pins are facing away from you and the yellow wire is on the bottom. The black wire right above it is the correct one.
Someone else can maybe post tips for getting the pins out. I couldn't do it. The wiring doesn't scare me. If it bothers you, maybe you shouldn't do it. I just cut the wires several inches above the harness. Used a wire stripper to strip about 3/4 inch of bare wire on each side. I then twisted the ends together. I put some flux on the wires. I used a soldering iron to cover the twisted ends with solder. Make sure to heat up the wires real well before putting touching the solder to the wires. I wrapped electrical tape around the wires. Finally I used zip ties to make sure no stress is placed on the joined wires. That is it.
Only supplies I used were a screw driver, wire cutter/stripper, tube of flux, spool of solder, soldering iron, electrical tape, and zip ties. I had all these things around my place. If someone needed to buy all these things, it would cost at most $20. If you can't get most of these things for free, you may just want to bug the dealer.
-Brad


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Brad_Jetta1.8T)*

OK, here it is...
I just got back from meeting with the Service Director (Greg Adams) and one of their Electrical specialists (Bobby Borchert) at Capo VW in San Juan Capistrano her in SoCA.
First, a big thank you to them both for their time. Greg was obviously hesitant at first but after giving him my background (see my profile) and explaining what we had been discussing here on VWVortex (which they both new of) they will be sending a WRITTEN report into VW this afternoon detailing the following:-
"Customer states that Radio/CD has poor sound quality, sounding "muddy" with a lack of bass. Also, stereo imaging is poor. Customer stated that the wiring harness plug that connects to the speaker outputs on the HU is pinned incorrectly. The LF+ (yellow) and LF- (black) are switched.
Upon inspection of customers vehicle the above statement was found to be correct and that re-pinning the wiring harness plug correctly eliminated all the previous problems"
Naturally this isn't word-for-word what Greg will be writing but near enough.
Also, there is a special very small tool they use to remove the pin from the plug so it is possible to switch the pins.
Once again I do NOT recommend that you cut the wiring harness yourself. I am not particulalrly happy about having to cut my wires but someone had to do it first to prove it works.
Thanks again to everyone who helped figure this out and we should see a bulletin of some kind soon. I figure that it will be at least a couple of weeks before VW confirms the error and sends out a bulletin.


----------



## phunkone (Jan 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I must say, you have made my day. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I am really not excited about waiting for VW to issue a bulletin so that my dealer can understand what the problem is. Truthfully, I feel more comfortable making the change myself. I would love to know what tool is required for removing the pins so that I won't have to cut the wires.


----------



## MichaelR (Feb 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (phunkone)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I would love to know what tool is required for removing the pins so that I won't have to cut the wires.[HR][/HR]​me too .. what is the tool?


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## 18Gman (Nov 8, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (phunkone)*

If you can remove the pin on the HU.. go do it that way if not.. hmmm
I tried to do it on the HU.. pain in the ass. really... 
I prefer do it on the trunk.. just open the cover unplug the grey connector, find the yellow and black (twisted together), cut the wire and swappp .. if you wanna look good, use solder.. thats it.. 10 min top..
It will not burn your car for sure. its only speaker wire .. if it gonna burn your car the original should do .. we swap the cable to make it right....


----------



## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MichaelR)*

forget that tool, is there a ghetto replacement for the tool? say like some sewing needles in the right place. describe what the tool looks like, is all i need.


----------



## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

here's my only concern, as i am not very electrical/wire savvy:
when i cut the black and yellow wires to swap them, wouldn't it leave several cm of the original wire there? in other words, if i cut the wire, can i just strip the insulator, swap, wind them together, and then apply electrical tape and go? is that all i need to do? 
say i cut the yellow wire and then wind the black wire onto the remaining yellow wire..would this be a problem? or does it not matter, so long as they are switched?


----------



## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

I have just pulled the HU and swapped the LF cables. Ok, here is my opinion.
It does sound better. There is actually bass now! BUT, there is still a little too much mid-range and no highs (treble) at all when playing the Tuner. This is not yet fixed folks.


----------



## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

you may not get it to sound like you want as we are talking about an FM tuner here...so please take into account tings like FM signal compression. But I am not there so I do not know what you are hearing...is it still worse than a single din monsoon? And how does the cd sound now?


----------



## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

quote:[HR][/HR]And how does the cd sound now?[HR][/HR]​i want to know this as well! i barely ever listen to the radio. is the cd's sound quality fixed...i.e. better bass, treble, mid, etc? more balance?


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

ditto, screw the radio, what is the CD like?


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## XracerX (Jan 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

i just switched mine and i give it http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
much better when playing cd's


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## m_graphic (Mar 13, 2002)

see my post....lets complain to http://www.monsoonpower.com via thier website. dont forget to mention that vw installed their product wrong. the button in under vw/feedback.
complain!!!


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: (m_graphic)*

done, complaint and link to this post sent.


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## JLJetta (Nov 24, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (XracerX)*

Not to doom and gloom, but mine is definately not helped by this.. and is substantially worse than the "stock" wiring. This is at the INPUT of the amp in the hatch.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JLJetta)*

OK, although I would prefer everyone have the deler do the modification I put together a quick overview of what to do:-
http://home.earthlink.net/~cogent001/vw/RadioRewire.doc 
Apologies for the fact that it is a 850kb WORD document but if someone wants to make it into a web page and post it on their FAQ's I give full permission to use the contents of my file. 
Have a great weekend and http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif to all.


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## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

hooray for me!






















i just got the dealer to pull the HU out. they wanted me to schedule a service appt in 2 weeks. i was like heck no...so i went home and then i swapped the yellow and black wires. yes, i cut them and then i twisted them together. slaped some electrical tape on it and then put it all back together. the sound is a million times better! it's like having a totally new sound system!!!!!!!!!
btw, i practiced a little before i put my monsoon under the knife. there was a CD->tape adapter (the thing you hook into a cd player so it can work in your car's tape deck) lying around that nobody was using. i carefully cut the wire and then spliced the smaller wires together and it worked when i tested my "fixed" adapter. if you are new at the wire thing, i HIGHLY suggest that you practice on something of lesser value first. you only need to practice for a little while, because it's not that tough. the main thing is TAKE YOUR TIME AND BE CAREFUL! when you do it correctly, congratulate yourself! your car's audio system will sound SOOOO MUCH BETTER YOU WON'T BELIEVE IT! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: (m_graphic)*

quote:[HR][/HR]see my post....lets complain to http://www.monsoonpower.com via thier website. dont forget to mention that vw installed their product wrong. the button in under vw/feedback.
complain!!![HR][/HR]​Sent them my complaint along with a link to this thread. Also sent one to VW Customer Care at http://www.vw.com/VwSFB/index .
[Modified by vmb7, 6:34 PM 3-15-2002]


[Modified by vmb7, 6:35 PM 3-15-2002]


----------



## DubberNix (Jan 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

quote:[HR][/HR]hooray for me!






















i just got the dealer to pull the HU out. they wanted me to schedule a service appt in 2 weeks. i was like heck no...so i went home and then i swapped the yellow and black wires. yes, i cut them and then i twisted them together. slaped some electrical tape on it and then put it all back together. [HR][/HR]​So you guys think the dealership would get mad if I tried to make this modification during a test drive?


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JLJetta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Not to doom and gloom, but mine is definately not helped by this.. and is substantially worse than the "stock" wiring. This is at the INPUT of the amp in the hatch. [HR][/HR]​No offense, so please don't take it that way but are you sure you got the right wires? And you do have a double din monsoon...right?
One sure way to tell if the phase was a problem I posted above...its worth a try to switch back and see if your was out of phase to begin with.
Good luck!!!!!


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JLJetta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Not to doom and gloom, but mine is definately not helped by this.. and is substantially worse than the "stock" wiring. This is at the INPUT of the amp in the hatch. [HR][/HR]​Make sure you do it on the GREY connector and swap it with the correct black wire that is behind the yellow in the photo








Do *NOT* swap it with the ones I marked with a RED X


[Modified by UKAUSSI, 11:49 AM 4-2-2002]


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## hjohns (Oct 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

beyond a shadow of a doubt this improved my system. my friends who have heard it before and after said the same thing. the bass actually exists, and the mids and highs are better as well! but by far teh most pronounced difference is BASS! no way i'm ever swapping back! this is what the monsoon is supposed to be like! night and day difference here! no more muddy sound for me!


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hjohns)*

Yep, the BASS was my biggest surprise. It is almost as if someone installed a mid-quality sub-woofer in your car















On one of my "ATB" cd's I could actually feel the bass through by seat back







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## scr2000 (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Just did the wire switch... sounds better I guess. Maybe I was expecting more. I still think my old single din Monsoon sounded better. Anyone feel the same?


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (scr2000)*

i can't get at my amp...is there a howto somewhere of how to get to the wires of this summbitch? or of how to remove the rear deck?
has anybody done this without cutting yet?


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## Roboman (Jan 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

*ATTN Jetta owners...*
Okay, it took me a while to figure out how to get to the amp... It's actually not too hard. 
This is what you need to do:
1) unscrew both screws holding the amp in
2) get out of your trunk and reach in with your right hand around the cage
3) push on the amp with your left had so you can get a hold of the connector
4) grip the top and bottom of the connector (the on furthest in)
5) pull it out

It shouldn't be incredibly hard... if it is, then you're doing something wrong.
I stlil haven't figured out how to remove the wires, though...








Anyone have any ideas?


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Roboman)*

so you're saying you didn't actually pull out the entire amp? you just unplugged the connectors? i was thinking about that but was worried i wouldn't be able to plug it back in...


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## Roboman (Jan 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

yeah... the amp doesn't come out.. just the connector.. it's not as bad as it might seem.


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Roboman)*

Okay, i did it on the HU side
check it here:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284911 
pictures included!


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

OK, for those who don't have WORD I posted the HOW TO here:-
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941


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## Roboman (Jan 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Alright... I just cut the wires and switched... there's definitely more bass... Now it sounds like a regular system.

It's not a world of change... But it's where it should be


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Roboman)*

I think the change is more noticable in a GTI due to the speaker positioning.
Also, if you have a Jetta I would make sure that your wiring IS crossed at the HU before making a change near the AMP as your wiring may be OK as they are a different wiring harness to the Golf.


----------



## MacPhisto (Mar 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Is it only applying to double din with monsoon ? Jetta 2002
and will it work with a passat with monsoon? (this one sound really bad on the tuner)
thanx


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## AlphaQuam (Nov 27, 2001)

I will be going to my local dealership tomorrow (in Albany) for an oil change and I will be armed with print-outs of pictures and posts. Hopefully I can convince someone there to just take out the head unit and switch the wires. Fading the sound from left to right makes it incredibly obvious that the speakers are out of phase. Hopefully they will take me seriously. With all this info I don't see how they cannot! Hopefully they've heard of VWVortex...








I'll let ya'll know how it goes...


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## a-hole ronald (Mar 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (AlphaQuam)*

AlphaQuam-
Which Albany dealer? Langan? Let me know if they listen to you and I'll see if the Nemer guys will talk to them and fix my Jetta. Either that or I'll just drive down to whichever dealer you took it to.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MacPhisto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Is it only applying to double din with monsoon ? Jetta 2002
and will it work with a passat with monsoon? (this one sound really bad on the tuner)
thanx[HR][/HR]​
It would appear to be both 2002 GOLF & JETTA. It is definitely on the ones WITH Monsoon but I have not seen anyone post who DID NOT have Monsoon.
I doubt it is in the Passat as this is a different wiring harness and different HU


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## AlphaQuam (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (a-hole ronald)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Which Albany dealer? Langan? Let me know if they listen to you and I'll see if the Nemer guys will talk to them and fix my Jetta. Either that or I'll just drive down to whichever dealer you took it to.[HR][/HR]​Well, I never got to the dealer (I was going to go to Nemer). I emailed GTIDAD last night and he was nice enough to provide me with further instruction this morning and I was able to swap the wires _*without cutting them*_. I was forgetting to push the pink locking pin out. After doing that, I followed the instructions GTIDAD posted and although I had to pull a bit hard, the wires popped out. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
If you have a 2002 d-din, you _must_ make this modification. Either take it to the dealer or do it yourself. You will be blown away at how much better the system sounds. There is actually bass now and the stereo imaging is great. After I switched the wires it was like night and day, it sounded like I'd installed a completely new stereo. With the proper instructions the whole process took me under 20 minutes. If anyone wants any help, email me.
Major props to everyone who contributed!


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (AlphaQuam)*

don't hold everyone in suspense. come on with the instructions on how to remove the wires from the plug without cutting!!!! what did you use???


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## AlphaQuam (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

quote:[HR][/HR]don't hold everyone in suspense. come on with the instructions on how to remove the wires from the plug without cutting!!!! what did you use???
[HR][/HR]​I wish I had my digicam! 
Well, first check out this post: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=282989 
Make sure you read the MSWord doc that UKAUSSI posted. Then check out what GTIDAD had to say at the end of that thread. Follow all of UKAUSSI's instructions up to cutting the wires. Now, you have to take out the brown wire harness. Find the clips and bend them back slightly, then push it out. Be gentle! Okay now you've got the set of 8 wires out. You will see a pink/purple "lock" threaded the length of the harness... you need to push this out from the back. It will be tough, but it will pop out. Then you use GTIDAD's paperclip method. Again, it will be tough, but get a firm grip and the wires will pop out. Then swap them and push them back in.
I hope that's clear enough! Here is a pic that GTIDAD made to show where to stick the paperclips:


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (AlphaQuam)*

CRAP! I KNEW THE PINK THING HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH IT, I WAS GOING TO TRY AND GET IT OUT BUT I WAS AFRAID I WOULD BREAK IT. DOH!!!!! i used the paperclip method before on disabling the daytime running lights on my old beetle (there was no pink thing on the headlight harness.
...man, oh well


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

disconnecting the HU has no effect on the anti-theft system correct? it's not going to activate my immobilizer is it?
just went to the dealer and had that mofo pull the HU out...it's out now, but i haven't disconnected it yet...
anybody?


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

not that i know of. i disconnected my HU and the immobilizer did not kick in.


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

word!
be back in a few minutes to let you know how it goes.


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## TO_DubR (Mar 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (AlphaQuam)*

Oh baby!!!! Sweet!!!!
I followed GTIDAD's paper-clip advice and it worked great!!! I swapped out the wires and the sound is so much better now. One note about trying to get the pins out; you shouldn't have to use any force when you are pulling the pin out. It should just slide right out once you depress the little hooks that are on both sides of the pin. The only place where I really used some force was when I was inserting the paper-clip. You have to make sure that those hooks get flattened out. It looks something like this:

__\___
---/-----

Yeah I know looks ugly, but just to show you where those "hooks" that I'm talking about are. They're really small and almost flush to the surface of the pin so if you can find something that fills in the slot perfectly you'll have less trouble getting those hooks pushed down.
By the way UKAUSSI, great work dude on figuring this out!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

[Modified by TO_DubR, 2:31 PM 3-16-2002]


[Modified by TO_DubR, 2:33 PM 3-16-2002]


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

woooooohoooooo!
did that sh!t and it sounds exactly how it should.
no cutting...took me about 1/2 hour.
the only problem is i can't get the HU back in...do i need to have the keys in the thing to put it back in?
it's meeting resistance when i just push so i want to be sure i'm not going to break anything.
thanks for the HOWTO on this... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## stnley (Nov 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

mine HU had resistance too putting it back it. i moved the wires into a good position and just crammed it back in (i thought i was going to break it too, but it is fine.


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## AlphaQuam (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

I still can't get my lower left corner all the way back in, but it's barely noticeable and the other three corners are all locked so I think I'll just leave it...


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

that's what i figured...let me go jam that summabitch in there.


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

well...don't be jamming too hard...
i looked closely and noticed from forcing it in there, one of the wires was chewed up. i can see exposed copper. need to tape it up and figure out how to get the HU back in there unscathed.


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## Scott P (Nov 13, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

When seating the HU, it is much easier if you remove the climate controls first. Remove the trim ring surrounding the controls and the bottom trim bracket (they are just a friction fit) and then unscrew the 4 torx bits and slide the climate controls out. This then gives you easy reach into all the wire paths from the HU and you can arrange them at will.
All this is assuming that the double din has climate controls mounted below...can't remember exactly.


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Scott P)*

gonna go look into that...

EDIT - ADDED --->
OK party people...
got the HU back in the dash w/ a little old school ingenuity. took a piece of twine and fed it around the wire bundle out through the dash down by the pedals. 
as i pushed in, i pulled the twine to keep the wires down in their little pocket in the far left corner of the HU hole. snapped right into place.
booyah.
after 2 hours of jimmy rigging, my stereo sounds as it should and it's back in the dash.
i still want my $300 back.










[Modified by clunkified, 9:56 PM 3-16-2002]


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

Monsoon=Crapy Radio.


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## phunkone (Jan 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (AlphaQuam)*

WOW!
Ok, let me just say thanks to UKAUSSI and everyone else who figured this out, because my stereo sounds great! It makes driving my car so much more enjoyable, its so nice to crank up the tunes and feel the bass thumping... 
What a great find, I have no idea how you figured this one out, but nice work!


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

I have now added some extra pics to my "HOW TO" showing how to get the pins out as I finally succeeded. Thanks to those who figured it out








http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941


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## Gozer (Nov 14, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Follow all of the techniques closely and you'll have no trouble getting the pins switched. It took me about 20 minutes from start to finish, and I am amazed at the difference. I was disappointed with the Monsoon from the first CD I played when I took delivery of the car -- this is a major improvement that everyone with the Monsoon should undertake.
Now, if I could just get that surging to go away . . .


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## GTI'nChick (Feb 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Gozer)*

I havn't pulled mine apart yet, but is there a way to get the wires out of the grey connector thingy in the amp? i.e. change the wires at the amp, without cutting?


[Modified by GTI'nChick, 5:05 PM 3-16-2002]


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## sjoback (Feb 3, 2002)

*Mission Accomplished!*

Thanks to UKAUSSI, and GTIDAD, and everyone else. I managed to swap the wires at the HU (much easier on the Jetta), with no cutting.
Stereo now sounds much better. There is actually the presence of some bass.


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## GTIDAD (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have now added some extra pics to my "HOW TO" showing how to get the pins out as I finally succeeded. Thanks to those who figured it out








http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 [HR][/HR]​Great job UKAUSSI. I didn't have access to a digital camera to photo the method. You got it spot on. I don't know what you do for a living, but you would make a great industrial engineer. 
One more thing to make it easier: As you push on both paper clips, push forward on the wire you are trying to remove before you pull back. That will prevent the back of the terminal lock tangs from dragging on the bottom of the connector cavity. That is what makes it difficult. As the paper clips are pushing the tangs in, those tangs are also getting hung up on the back of the cavity. A little forward pressure on the wire helps to push the tangs over the paper clips, then the paper clips hit the bottom of the cavity so the tangs can't get snagged on the way out. A backward pull at that point, and out it comes. It takes a while to get the feel. 
Anyway, thanks a lot for the fix. I was particularly embarrassed by the sound prior to this fix because the company that I work for makes the Monsoon stuff. I don't want to name the company, but if you follow indy racing look at the name on Scott Sharp's car.


[Modified by GTIDAD, 10:29 PM 3-16-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTIDAD)*

GTIDAD - Thanks, if you click on my name and scroll down to BIO you will see how long I have been around cars and now computers. I think you work for a division of the same company I worked for back in the UK. We have Mr. Lopez and the resulting legal agreement between VAG & GM to thank for the Monsoon parts in our VW's







I thought this was a bad thing originally as it sounded so crap but it turns out that it sounds really good when wired correctly








Anyway, I will add you extra titbit of info to my HOW TO if it's OK by you (I will reference you of course)
FYI, the digital camera is actually an Intel Web Cam plugged into a laptop. I then select "add picture" "from camera/scanner" in MS Word and take a pic and it pastes into Word


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## GTIDAD (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI - Just read your bio. Now I understand. And you're exactly correct about why the Monsoon is in the VW. I've got no love for Lopez though. His legacy has made GM purchasing pretty tough on us suppliers. 
Anyway, feel free to use the tips. I'm glad I could contribute. Nobody wants to be disappointed after a major purchase like this.


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## GTI'nChick (Feb 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTIDAD)*

Ok, try as I might, I simply cannot get my headunit out. Would someone please be so kind as to tell me the dimensions of the little tool thingys? How far did they go in? Straight in, or at an angle? 
Thanks guys!


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI'nChick)*

Make sure you push the radio IN before inserting the tools to ensure that the clips are not catching. You will get a feel for how far to push them in, I think a little over 1" is what I did. 










[Modified by UKAUSSI, 11:51 AM 4-2-2002]


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI, GTIDAD
Major props! Great work!http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif But do either of you know how to remove the wires from the amp without cutting them? I tried the paper clip thing but wasn't sure that would work there too.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

I took a look at the plug and it also has a pink insert but it does NOT come all the way out. It seems like you should be able to use the same paperclip method but you may need to move the pin insert back and forth to a set position.
Personally I would do it at the HU. If you are too far from a dealer then make 4 "keys" using the picture and instructions above. Use an old credit card or even one you don't use much and then call for a replacement








IM me if you need help as I will be around all tomorrow


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## Holicow (Mar 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Howdy, brand new owner/forum user here:
How about a stupid question:
If the wiring is reversed at both the HU and amp connectors, doesn't that correct the potential problem?
Have you also looked at the amp's wiring diagram?
I tried reversing the wires at the amp connector as a lark, and it made no difference in my case. By the way, the FL speaker also worked with only one wire ( the yellow, or supposed positive, wire) attached. How about that?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Holicow)*

The AMP PLUG wiring is kind of unusual in that it alternates (see pic below).
If you swap at the amp then make sure you swap the YELLOW with the CORRECT BLACK wire. This should PROBABLY be the one BEHIND the YELLOW wire in the pic and NOT the ones maked with red X. but I am not 100% as I don't have a wiring diagram









[Modified by UKAUSSI, 11:22 AM 3-17-2002]


[Modified by UKAUSSI, 11:51 AM 4-2-2002]


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## kt's_gti (Jan 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I LOVE YOU GUYS!!! (in Cartman voice)
I just switched mine at the amp and it sounds much better. There's actually bass!!! However, the back speakers still sound like poop. I hope someone finds another mistake that makes it sound super sweet (I can dream). I thank everyone who looked into this. One of my first questions/posts to vortex was on this issue and I'm glad to see it resolved. No thanks to VW though.


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## MichaelR (Feb 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (kt's_gti)*

well, i made the wire switch today .. and what a difference .. decent bass, but not spectacular. if the radio had worked like this before, i never would have had my bass tube installed .. but now it sounds even better!!!








thanks UKAUSSI!!!!


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## greenplaid5 (Dec 1, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

add me to the list. i didn't really notice too much of a problem until i checked each side and the right side is SO much louder.
[email protected]


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

Has anyone contacted the dealer or VWoA yet about this so maybe we can get an official TSB issued? I don't feel comfortable at all fixing thier mistake...why not make the dealers do it for free and not risk friggin up our stereos?


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Has anyone contacted the dealer or VWoA yet about this so maybe we can get an official TSB issued? I don't feel comfortable at all fixing thier mistake...why not make the dealers do it for free and not risk friggin up our stereos?[HR][/HR]​I know I have and so have others (see my post on page 2 and 4 of this thread). Problem is VWoA says that they never heard of the problem and the dealer will not do anything unless they are told to by VWoA, who again will not acknowledge the problem. I'm guessing as long as they don't get too many complaints, it would be cheaper for them just to ignore it.


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I know I have and so have others (see my post on page 2 and 4 of this thread). Problem is VWoA says that they never heard of the problem and the dealer will not do anything unless they are told to by VWoA, who again will not acknowledge the problem. I'm guessing as long as they don't get too many complaints, it would be cheaper for them just to ignore it.
[HR][/HR]​Does anyone have a contact on the inside there that maybe we can get this information to? It's certianly worth looking into.


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## Turmoil (Mar 3, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (blinkthisGTI)*

I work at a VW dealership and the Double din sucks Ball$ comapred to the single din. I will see if i can talk to my superiors and find out about a fix or something. I will keep all of you posted on this matter. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Has anyone contacted the dealer or VWoA yet about this so maybe we can get an official TSB issued? I don't feel comfortable at all fixing thier mistake...why not make the dealers do it for free and not risk friggin up our stereos?[HR][/HR]​YES, check my post at 11:42am on 3/15 above


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]YES, check my post at 11:42am on 3/15 above[HR][/HR]​Sweet. Question...I'm a new and first time VW owner, how do we go about finding about newly issued TSBs?


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

just wanted to follow-up...
i rewired my HU this weekend and it's made alllllllllllllllllllll the difference in the friggin' world. i had previosly played radiohead's KID A to my utter disappointment. bass was muddy and things were clipping and i couldn't crank it without getting distortion.
i just put that CD back in and at about 1/6th, 1/8th of the volume (i used to have to put it more than half way to get it loud), it is absolutely cranking. no clipping, no mud, no ****e --> only trim rattle








rewire your HU!










[Modified by clunkified, 10:47 PM 3-18-2002]


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## phunkone (Jan 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

Yeah, I am so psyched for this fix. I paypaled UKAUSSI a dollar to show my appreciation...


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (phunkone)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Yeah, I am so psyched for this fix. I paypaled UKAUSSI a dollar to show my appreciation...







[HR][/HR]​














phunkone, thats very kind of you. (FYI, damn PayPal took 33 cents of that







)
My reward was getting my own stereo sounding SOOO much better. Totally made my day as well as everyones kind comments. 
*Just remember that WE ALL did it together as a TEAM http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
*
Maybe VW will send me a reward for fixing their problem








(rear spoiler and performance exhaust would be great OR if they are really appreciative a complete exterior 337 makeover














)


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## GTI'nChick (Feb 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

ok, i'm gonna have to go home and try this again (ok - maybe tomorrow; there's a freak snowstorm happening out there today). i've tried twice, and simply cannot get the stupid headunit out. I sacrificed a CD-R to the cause to make the little tool things; maybe that's the reason - perhaps they're too thick? (I couldn't find a credit card i was willing to part with) I was going to see if i could beg/borrow/steal/buy the tools from my dealership, but...


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## swassguy (Jun 15, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

I'm having a lot of trouble with the paper clip thing - could I be using clips that are too big?
Has anyone found out what the actual tool is that's used? I'm thinking about the size that's used at the HU.


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## roly (Feb 2, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (swassguy)*

Holy Shmoly that was so freakin' hard. I have blisters on my hand cuz of this. Anyway, i shoved the paper clips in as fas as possible with some pliers, stuck my finger between them to apply pressure, then yanked on the cable, it came out pretty easily after that. It works so much better no. YIPPEE!


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## clunkified (Feb 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rolymoly)*

are people remembering to take out the pink lock?
the paper clip/wire pull out was the easiest part of this whole re-wire for me. took about a total of 20 seconds to insert paper clips, pop the wires, and switch. 
took me 2 hours to get that SOB HU back in the dash though...


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## swassguy (Jun 15, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (clunkified)*

I have that pink pin out - it's just I can't get the paperclips in far enough to do anything - I'll try again tomorrow... maybe I need smaller ones.


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## scr2000 (Jan 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (swassguy)*

Is there any reason why doing it at the head unit is better than doing the switch at the amp?


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## sacherel (Dec 3, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

What is the build date on the 2002 Jetta's that have experienced better bass after switching the yellow and black wires.
I think this may have been corrected by VW on the 2002.5 models.


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Has anyone contacted the dealer or VWoA yet about this so maybe we can get an official TSB issued? I don't feel comfortable at all fixing thier mistake...why not make the dealers do it for free and not risk friggin up our stereos?
YES, check my post at 11:42am on 3/15 above[HR][/HR]​I submitted feedback via the website last nite letting them know about this problem. I jsut got a call from a representative and she said she was going to pass the information (along with urls to here) to thier product/technical department. For what it's worth...


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (scr2000)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Is there any reason why doing it at the head unit is better than doing the switch at the amp?[HR][/HR]​Because that is where the error is. If for some reason yours is OK then changing at the amp may make it worse. 
It's the old "2 wrongs don't necessarily make a right" scenario


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## judoGTI (Mar 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

WOOOO HOOOOOO!!!!
It's fixed! Thanks UKAUSSI. That was a great find. And a fairly easy fix with cut up tupperware, 2 paper clips, a screwdriver and 30 minutes of free time. 
Anyone that has the double din, its an easy fix, without cutting any wires, and makes a world of difference.


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (judoGTI)*

UKAUSSI YOU'RE THE MAN!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'd also like to thank GTIDAD and vw2.0gti (for helping to make this such a hot issue)! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Yeah, I know this isn't an award show but I'm pumped! My radio sounds much better! This is the upgrade I paid for. Sounds like I added a subwoofer and the speakers sound in sink (no pun intended).








I did have some trouble with the whole paper clip part. That part took me over an hour but I was determined to get it fixed since I already had the HU out. I got it done with no cutting involved. I did not have any credit cards I was willing to part with so I used an old floppy disk. Used the inside paper/tissue element of the floppies to draw out my lines. Worked great. 
Thanks again to everyone who contributed to this find. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif (There are some companies that could learn from what happened here.)


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## judoGTI (Mar 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

Yeah just a tip... Use small paper clips in the application that GTIDAD recommended. I started using the largest peper clips I could find and spent amout 10 minutes trying. Then I switched to smaller ones (no idea of the size, but they seem smaller than the normal ones to me). And the things popped right out. I actually felt/heard a little click when I inserted the right sized paper clips into the holes then they slid right out. =D


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## swassguy (Jun 15, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (judoGTI)*

Oh my. Smaller paperclips and the connectors came right out. And the difference is amazing. I forgot that I was supposed to go somewhere right after I did the change - I just sat in my car listening for about 20 minutes!
I need to go and drive some more!


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## elequin (Dec 23, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (swassguy)*

I did the wiring change and was very impressed by the sound difference.







I also emailed my dealership about the issue, complete with links to these discussions. The service manager thanked me for the info and said he'd compensate me by giving me a 60% discount on my next (first) service appointment.


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## [email protected] (Oct 6, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (elequin)*

Just did the change. I'm already spoilt by my subwoofer, so the bass increase wasn't noticeable by me. HOWEVER, the imaging of the entire system now sounds like the Monsoon i expected it to be. When i first got my car, i couldn't believe i paid extra money for sound quality like that. I didn't really notice the right side being louder, since it all sounds fine and dandy from the driver's seat. However, after doing the wire switch, i can hear my music clearer and the system does not distort the way it did when i cranked it up. I am now even more satisfied with the stereo system now, and can safely say that i will never put in an aftermarket unit. Three cheers for UKAUSSI and all the rest that provided input! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (elequin)*

WOW, even your brand new, just released 24v V6 Jetta had the problem








Hopefully, they will catch it before the 337's get built








Maybe they will swap my 4 mth old leased GTI with a 337 (same price) for fixing their problem


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## Bimmer (Dec 15, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

As you all have already found out, out of phase speakers cause all sorts of imaging/cancellation issues. One way to experiment is to switch one pair of leads on a boombox and move the detachables around. Sometimes there will be reinforcement, other times cancellation.
Gary


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## ringerj (Aug 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I just swapped my wires, WOW! What a difference.. Thanks to UKAUSSIE and GTIDAD for the excellent pointers. It took me no time at all, and everything went smooth. Great job guys.. Good find.
Jon


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## RoughDobermann (Nov 8, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (ringerj)*

Did you do it at the HU or amp connector? I can't figure out how to get the damn wires out of the amp connector and I don't want to pull out my HU unless I have to!!


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

i'm taking my gf's 02 dd golf in tomorrow morning. i talked to the dealer today and they said that they're probably not willing to touch it in case anything bad happens as a result of them switching the wires e.g., short-circuit or something similar. they said until vw issues a tsb, the liability is all on them and they don't want to risk it. that being said, one of the guys there said he'd personally take the radio out and look at it.
i'll post the outcome tomorrow.
while it bugs me that they don't want to mess with it due to the liability issues, i sort of see their point. to that end, i'll definitely be following up with vwoa tomorrow after the trip to the dealer.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i'm taking my gf's 02 dd golf in tomorrow morning. i talked to the dealer today and they said that they're probably not willing to touch it in case anything bad happens as a result of them switching the wires e.g., short-circuit or something similar. they said until vw issues a tsb, the liability is all on them and they don't want to risk it. that being said, one of the guys there said he'd personally take the radio out and look at it.
i'll post the outcome tomorrow.
while it bugs me that they don't want to mess with it due to the liability issues, i sort of see their point. to that end, i'll definitely be following up with vwoa tomorrow after the trip to the dealer.[HR][/HR]​
All they need to do is look at the wiring diagram in their Workshop Manual and they will see it is wired wrong - NO EXCUSES !!
The REAL reason some dealers don't want to do it is that they don't have a "labor operation" and "time units" they can use for a warranty claim and would need to write a long explaination as to why they used "straight time" (I was an Asst Svc Mgr for 2 years)


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## Subhuman (Feb 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I went to my dealership this morning and informed them of the Vortex findings(I did name you perconally UKAUSSI and pointed the service manager to your threads)
Anyways they did a W/O and fixed it right then as I waited.
I invited myself into the shop area to help the poor 2 tech's that were fumbling around trying to figure it out only to have the shop manager kick me out.I let him have a piece of my mind I'll tell ya.
Fukken enlighten the bastards to the magic fix and the fokkers won't even let me watch my car having 2 frikken wires swapped.
After watching those 2 at work I can promise you I will never bring my car to them for any type of work period!


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## a-hole ronald (Mar 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]i'm taking my gf's 02 dd golf in tomorrow morning. i talked to the dealer today and they said that they're probably not willing to touch it in case anything bad happens as a result of them switching the wires e.g., short-circuit or something similar. they said until vw issues a tsb, the liability is all on them and they don't want to risk it. that being said, one of the guys there said he'd personally take the radio out and look at it.
i'll post the outcome tomorrow.
while it bugs me that they don't want to mess with it due to the liability issues, i sort of see their point. to that end, i'll definitely be following up with vwoa tomorrow after the trip to the dealer.[HR][/HR]​I got the same story from my dealer...funny thing is, when I called VWoA today to complain, I was told that was unacceptable behavior from the dealer. The nice lady then went on to tell me that my complaint had been noted and would be passed on to the proper department. She also told me that my dealer would be notified their customer service was lacking. Whether or not that'll do any good remains to be seen, I guess....


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## spoolin02GTI (Feb 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (a-hole ronald)*

just did the wire switch at my amp....WOW what a difference!








now it sounds like theres a bass tube in the car! mad props to UKAUSSIE!


----------



## 20Valve (Jan 8, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (spoolin02GTI)*

I've done the same fix to my monsoon, but it seems like the passenger side bass is still a bit stronger than the driver side. Is it just me or is everyone else having the same results?


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## RoughDobermann (Nov 8, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (20Valve)*

Swapped the wires (cut and soldered) at my amp last night. Notice a definite change, but, yes, my passenger side bass is still greater than the driver side (fronts). Rear speakers still sound like utter crap!


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## Code3Smith (Jan 10, 2002)

I did the fix last night on my car and my girlfriends car (we both have 02 gti's). I just cut and soldered the wires. Made a huge difference. The rear speakers are still garbage, but at least there is depth to the music now. The bass is not distorted and the balance is better. Very worth someones time to fix this. Thank you to all for the help in resolving this issue.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]All they need to do is look at the wiring diagram in their Workshop Manual and they will see it is wired wrong - NO EXCUSES !!
The REAL reason some dealers don't want to do it is that they don't have a "labor operation" and "time units" they can use for a warranty claim and would need to write a long explaination as to why they used "straight time" (I was an Asst Svc Mgr for 2 years)[HR][/HR]​thank you, thank you, thank you for that! i didn't know there was a correct depiction available. that certainly makes all the difference. i'm going to call the dealer right now! speaking of which, so far not so good with the dealer. they started by using a different looking tool than the one ukaussi crafted and while jamming the little metal blade like parts into the slots and forcing them in, i heard a few distinct sharp cracking plastic like sounds. then they switched to a tool that looked like the one ukaussi made and still couldn't get the unit out. then they asked me to leave the car for the day.
i'll post the follow up when it happens.


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## ringerj (Aug 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (RoughDobermann)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Did you do it at the HU or amp connector? I can't figure out how to get the damn wires out of the amp connector and I don't want to pull out my HU unless I have to!![HR][/HR]​I didn't want to pull out the HU either, unless I had to.. I tried the amp for like a half hour and couldn't get the "paper clip method" to work, so I tried the head unit. The wires on the head unit are like a thousand times easier to swap.. I couldn't get them out of the harness on the amp. 
Good luck! Taking out the HU isn't as big of a deal as I thought it'd be.


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## a-hole ronald (Mar 14, 2002)

*Attention those of you that have had success with getting your dealer to listen to you and swap the wires-* 
I would be very interested in having my dealer here in NY talk to your dealer. I figure if they talk to a dealer that has verified and corrected the problem they might be a little more willing to fix mine. So if you could kindly post contact info for your dealers, I'd appreciate it.
Otherwise I'll just rip into it and fix it myself. I just don't think I should have to.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (a-hole ronald)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Otherwise I'll just rip into it and fix it myself. I just don't think I should have to.[HR][/HR]​don't rip into anything just yet! while i had to take my car home today w/o it being touched, there were some positive results. the dealer here in virginia told me they talked to the vw technical assistance folks for the south east region and that the SE technical assistance folks confirmed the wiring error and gave the dealer instructions on how to fix it. the instructions were to swap the lf speaker wires at the harness connecting the hu. so, at least someone in the SE technical assistance office not only confirmed the problem, but instructed the dealer on how to fix it - and yes, under warranty.
so, i would see if your dealer can either contact their own region's tech assistance office, or at the very least, contact the SE office and have them contact that region's office.
my car goes back monday for the swap, and even though i wanted it done today, i didn't want to ruffle any feathers. it's my gf's ride anyway and truth is, i'm just happy the dealer did in fact get official confirmation. it's was looking doubtful that they were going to help me without it.


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## Vdub16v (Nov 14, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I just picked up my 2002 GTi 1.8t on the 20th.....Before I picked it up i was reading about the monsoon double DIN issue--I read how to fix it and decided after I got it (if the sound was bad) That I would take it to my local dealer. I have a good relationship with the guys in the parts department and a couple of the mechanics (I bought my 95 GLX from him). So--after concluding that my Monsoon sounded crappy







I drove over to Black VW in Greensboro NC and pulled Mike (my mechanic) out of the bay and asked him if he had heard anything about them sounding muffled--He said that one of the guys in the parts department had the same car that I did and he noticed that it sounded bad compared to the earlier ones and the single DIN--Well, He pulled the radio and let me borrow a couple of paper clips from him---i did the wire switch while he was standing there (5 mins max) and let him listen to it. I saw his jaw drop..........He went and got the parts guys and let them hear it.......So the guys at that dealership know about the problem and the fix--by the way I showed him the diagram on the back of the radio and how it was miss matched---He told his service manager and they are putting in a complaint to VWoA on our behalf.......If you have a good relationship with your local VW mechanic or parts guys please let them know!---do the fix in front of them and let them hear the results! We can hopefully get enough requests and complaints so that new Monsoon owners will not have to deal with this situation!


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Vdub16v)*

Everytime I put a different CD into mine now I am still amazed at the HUGE improvement in sound quality, Bass and stereo imaging.
I think even my 22mth old daughter noticed the difference when she was sitting in the front pass seat in the driveway with me yesterday nodding her head & shaking her arms to the music


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## dex (Nov 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]All they need to do is look at the wiring diagram in their Workshop Manual and they will see it is wired wrong - NO EXCUSES !!
The REAL reason some dealers don't want to do it is that they don't have a "labor operation" and "time units" they can use for a warranty claim and would need to write a long explaination as to why they used "straight time" (I was an Asst Svc Mgr for 2 years)
thank you, thank you, thank you for that! i didn't know there was a correct depiction available. that certainly makes all the difference. i'm going to call the dealer right now! speaking of which, so far not so good with the dealer. they started by using a different looking tool than the one ukaussi crafted and while jamming the little metal blade like parts into the slots and forcing them in, i heard a few distinct sharp cracking plastic like sounds. then they switched to a tool that looked like the one ukaussi made and still couldn't get the unit out. then they asked me to leave the car for the day.
i'll post the follow up when it happens.[HR][/HR]​They obviously used the single din radio removal keys and broke it. That's why your car is in the shop probably.. 


[Modified by dex, 6:02 PM 3-22-2002]


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## retzer (Feb 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

just did the fix ... was a bit gunshy because I can be klutzy with delicates sometimes but I have to say you guys really have this mod down cold. It was not hard at all and the result is really something. If you are ever out my way, stop by and collect on the







I owe you for this fix!


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## slay (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (retzer)*

All,
I just read this thread (all 7 pages) and I still am not 100% satisfied with the solution. I too have the same symptoms as the rest. First, I am not saying the the wires are not reversed but.... If I listen to the right front speakers (alone) they are clear and sound good. If I switch to the left front only those speakers sound attenuated. If it were only a phase problem then both would sound the same alone. In this situation no phase cancelation occurs. That is, the absolute phase of any one set of speakers would not matter. It is the relative phasing. So if it were just reversed polarity I would expect that separately, the two sides (front sets only) would sound the same alone but when mixed the sound would cancel and the base would be reduced.
Furthermore, I found that there is some signal leaking into the left side when the balance is all the way to the right. This is not a polarity problem. I have not studied the wiring schematic but I think that this wire change is more that just a polarity switch if it corrects all of these problems or perhaps as a few recent posts suggest the right speakers are still a little louder and the rears are muted. I did not mention that I also think the rears sound attenuated as compared to the right front.
Please take my remarks as they are meant and please feel free to offer any insights
Thanks 
Slay


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (slay)*

slay - don't forget that with the Monsoon equipped systems the signals from the HU are fed into the "200 watt - 8 channel Monsoon amp which is also a Digital Signal Processor with 103 poles of active equalization"
I too was confused and that is why I didn't do the switch back in November when I discovered the wires were switched. It didn't really seem to explain the resulting sound. If you take into account how much the DSP effects the final sound that it makes sense
As the wires ARE wrong I would switch them in your car and then readdress each of your previous finding to see if they are still present. I can assure you that once you switch the wires you will be pleasantly surprised to say the least.


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## slay (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI
I will swap the wires and again look at the other problems. My point was really that phase is not the real problem here it is something more subtle.
Thanks
Slay


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## GTI'nChick (Feb 23, 2002)

I did the swap at the amp over the weekend - there is a definite noticable improvement in the overall clarity and bass. Maybe not quite the dramatic improvement i was hoping for, but definitely worth the trouble! Thanks again to everyone who helped in this, and here's some more





















to UKAUSSI for all his efforts!!!


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

brought the car in this morning. they were very cool about looking at it right away. after approx. 50 min., they finally got the hu out. as expected, the attempt to remove the radio with the wrong keys screwed up the little tabs and apparently, the only way they could get the radio out was to trash the radio and much of the trim around it. personally, i would have tried going in from underneath first, but whatever - if i was a certified vw tech, i probably wouldn't listen to my customer's either ;-) 
they told me up front that it was quite likely that they would damage the trim around the radio. it's odd how much that hurt to hear - like hearing your dog needs surgery - and heck, it's my gf's golf, not even my passat








they ended up asking me to leave the car for the day. they said they're going to try and strip the parts out of another car and get my car fixed today. which was cool by me since they put me in a vr6 jetta loaner that seems to have a slightly stuck throttle - oh wait, maybe that's my foot


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (slay)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I will swap the wires and again look at the other problems. My point was really that phase is not the real problem here it is something more subtle.
[HR][/HR]​Slay
What you are forgetting is that VW uses a common ground scheme with, near as I can tell, one of the funkiest wiring arrangements I have ever seen. I have had to install DSP units before and when you have the DSP integrated into the amp, like the older audiocontrol's used to do for a center channel, you can get some really interesting results if your wiring is out of phase.

Not saying your not correct and there isn't something else wrong...its just that the wiring is definently wrong.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

Unfortunately, I left GM just after we started working on car specific DSP's but essentially they adjust all the input signal according to the accoustics of the car. 
Consequently, they may use some of the LF input signal in the DSP setting and send a small amount out of the LR as well as LF.


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

one quick question, if i decide to remove the factory unit and put in my own, will i have to do the wire switch also?


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## a-hole ronald (Mar 14, 2002)

Dropped my car off at my dealer on Monday (MIL keeps turning on







) which also happened to be the same day the area VW rep happened to be there...so he, the service manager and I had a conversation about the Monsoon problem. The Rep said that yes, VW has acknowledged the problem and a TSB will be issued (HOORAY!







), perhaps even as early as today or tomorrow. I am, in fact, supposed to call my dealer tomorrow to see if it's been issued so they can do the fix since my car will still be in the shop. Think I'm gonna call them today, too


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## DubFahrer (Mar 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (a-hole ronald)*

Let us know what they say! I already made the fix but I'd be interested in what the official word turns out to be.


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DubFahrer)*

that is def good news ... please keep us all inform ... in any case, im still interested in getting the radio replace with my new pioneer mp3 cd player, can anyone comment on whether i should have the radio replace in conjunction with the wire switch fix or will the new mp3 cd player resolve the issue also?


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## Corradodave (Feb 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Is it just me or is the reason the rear speakers sound like crap compared to the front is that they are wired
out of phase? The front and rear should sound almost the same. I checked into this today with my speaker 
phase checker and can verify that the rears are 100% out of relative phase with the front speakers. I recently 
listened to a monsoon system in a 02 TDI bug and it did not have this problem. Can anybody else verify this?


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## RoughDobermann (Nov 8, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Corradodave)*

That's exactly what I'd like to know! I swapped my left front wires at the amp, and the difference is quite significant. However, the difference that resulted made me realize how bad the rears sound!! It's like we may as well turn the fader all the way to the fronts, because the rears are basically non-existant!!!
Can anyone do any checking to see if there is a wiring problem with the rears???


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## DubFahrer (Mar 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (RoughDobermann)*

This same question was posed by another fellow and myself midway thru this thread http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=294245. The few replies basically said that is the way it is supposed to be. OK, I suppose. I'm by no means an audio expert but I have owned a number of cars (w/ and w/o custom sound systems) and have never seen one where one set of speakers (especially the rears) seem completely overwhelmed by the others. I haven't had a chance to do more investigating. I know the fix _does_ sound better but I'm still not sure things are completely _right_. I guess the best answer is to completely replace the system but I'm holding off on that - at least until the vendors have harnesses, etc. to make the job a bit easier. Just my depreciated 2 cents.











[Modified by DubFahrer, 12:02 AM 3-27-2002]


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## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (RoughDobermann)*

quote:[HR][/HR]That's exactly what I'd like to know! I swapped my left front wires at the amp, and the difference is quite significant. However, the difference that resulted made me realize how bad the rears sound!! It's like we may as well turn the fader all the way to the fronts, because the rears are basically non-existant!!!
Can anyone do any checking to see if there is a wiring problem with the rears???[HR][/HR]​Thats the way its supposed to be. You must create a sound stage, the focus of the music must be in the front. Actually... no tweeters should be in the rear... that would make it sound even better. Ahh well..it is a factory sytem afterall.. If only the tweeters were in the kick pannels instead of near the window...grrr
If you have loud rear speakers, lots of treble in the rear, then you have a crappy sound system. Rear is for bass, mid rear is for midbass, front is for highs and soundstage... =D


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (steez)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thats the way its supposed to be. You must create a sound stage, the focus of the music must be in the front. .... Rear is for bass, mid rear is for midbass, front is for highs and soundstage... =D[HR][/HR]​I am with ya on this one but the problem is that the rears don't put out much bass either....I am not really sure what they do


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## 02 GTI 1point8T (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

I just did the switch on my 02 GTI 1.8T. WOW!!! Huge difference. Just to let you know, I tried it at the amp first and gave up. It is a LOT easier doing the switch at the head unit, there is more room to operate. One thing: use small paperclips to pull the pins! The big ones are too big!!!
I also passed this info along to my VW service manager and he is going to call VW and push them to issue a TSB.
If you are comfortable with this sort of thing, try it. Otherwise wait for the TSB to come out so the dealership has to do it for you.
Good luck!


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## 1.8Dub (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02 GTI 1point8T)*

I want to try it..can someone point me to the link that has the instructions how-to


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## 02 GTI 1point8T (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1.8Dub)*

Here is the thread with step by step instructions with pictures.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 
Be careful and good luck!


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## a-hole ronald (Mar 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

quote:[HR][/HR]that is def good news ... please keep us all inform ... in any case, im still interested in getting the radio replace with my new pioneer mp3 cd player, can anyone comment on whether i should have the radio replace in conjunction with the wire switch fix or will the new mp3 cd player resolve the issue also?[HR][/HR]​The official word is...STILL no TSB. I talked to the service manager when I picked up my car and he had talked to the rep earlier and nothing had been issued yet. I hope it's soon, as I don't feel I should have to fix their problem myself, but the urge...to...fix...wire...myself...is...growing!








At least my MIL is off...we'll see for how long this time.


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## 1.8Dub (Nov 12, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (a-hole ronald)*

Did my pin switch last night...oh my lord..like having a new radio


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## m_graphic (Mar 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1.8Dub)*

my dealer just called me. vwa just issued a technical advisory on this matter.


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## Hayzus (Sep 9, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (m_graphic)*

do you have the tsb number?


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (m_graphic)*

i hope this is true. i just called my dealer/service and they told me that they haven't heard anything yet, and if it was issued today, they won't get anything official in writing for about 30 days. i just got my gti a week ago(1st car ever-4th vw in the family) knowing about the monsoon probs from you guys. i've been reading vwvortex for about 2 years and this site is a great resource-and one reason i decided to get a vw.


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## 02GTIDriver (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (a-hole ronald)*

I just got my car back from the dealer today, and THERE is a technical bulletin on this dated March 29, 2002. I'm staring at the official bulletin right now. The service manager thought I was full of crap until he called VWoA and they faxed him the technical bulletin. I'll try and find a scanner so you guys can see it.
I printed up the instructions that UKAUSSI put together, and gave it to the tech who was working on the car. Much more detailed than the technical bulletin issued by VW. Looks like you guys were instrumental in bringing this problem to VW's attention.


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02GTIDriver)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I just got my car back from the dealer today, and THERE is a technical bulletin on this dated March 29, 2002. I'm staring at the official bulletin right now. The service manager thought I was full of crap until he called VWoA and they faxed him the technical bulletin. I'll try and find a scanner so you guys can see it.
[HR][/HR]​If you can give us the TSB number, that would help also.


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

Its actually kinda funny that my 99.5 single din non-monsoon was wired out of phase from the factory as well(referenced on page 2 of this)...I haven't done the swap on my new car yet, but I will this weekend.


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## CD_PHX (Feb 22, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

I just called VW and the gal checked the TSB's and she said none had been issued regarding this problem. I called last week and opened a case number (Case # 20085200) and after pulling the case number the rep told me the same thing my dealer did when I called "VW can make the "modification" but it may void the warranty". 
I told her this made no sense if the schematic showed the wiring was performed incorrectly why would the warranty be in jeapardy? She gave a "I don't know, that's what it says". I asked her to have the original rep who assigned the case number to me contact me (he was gone for the day, will call next week) as he seemed to "get it" and actually requested that I email him a link to this thread (which I did).
In any event, I suggest each and every one of you that has not been able to get their dealer to fix the problem (who's not comfortable doing it themself or wants the dealer to fix it without "voiding the warranty") call VW at 1.800.822.8987, make clear that there is incorrect wiring and it is not a "modification" it is a "FIX", and get a case number assigned. 
As others have requested if someone could post the TSB # or a link to the actual document this will be a great help. I plan on escalating this issue to VW corporate if this is not properly acknowledged and actioned. 
Thanks to the clever guys that did the legwork to identify the problem, good luck!
-CD


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CD_PHX)*

I think I found the TSB-let me know what you think. After investigating online, I found this website: http://www.vw.ddsltd.com/ 

I searched under tech bulletins for 2002 gti with keywork "monsoon" the TSB numbers is V910202 . Is this it????


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## CD_PHX (Feb 22, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

tchockygti, terrific! I had no idea about that site, that is probably it (too bad they don't let you read the dang thing!). I called VW 800 and reviewed the problem blah blah blah and bottom line they cannot access this technical bulletin(!). I just so happen to have my car at the dealer today getting some unrelated work done so I am very motivated to get this resolved. I'm going to take your bulletin # with me and head out to the dealer in a few minutes, let you guys know later how it goes.
BTW, VW customer service seems to really blow.







Dealer sends me there, they refer me to the dealer, back and forth and no-one seems to be able to give a straight answer. Hopefully calls to them will be few and far between...
later


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## slay (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

I called my dealer today and suprise they had no clue. I did the search on the vw page and just email my service department with the tsb number. We will see how it goes.


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CD_PHX)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
BTW, VW customer service seems to really blow.







Dealer sends me there, they refer me to the dealer, back and forth and no-one seems to be able to give a straight answer. Hopefully calls to them will be few and far between...
later
[HR][/HR]​I agree. The same has happened with me. I don't understand why this is soooooooooooo difficult for them to grasp?!?!







http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## MarcinB (Jan 8, 2002)

OMFG I cant believe Im just now hearing about this, and feel sorry for all those people out there that have no idea about this wireing problem. I cant wait to do the swap tommorrow morning, what the hell was VW thinking when they had the wireing wrong the whole time. Props to everyone that contributed and figured out what VW quality control claimed to be normal.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MarcinB)*

OK, Please don't flame me if this is a stupid question---I have no audio electronics knowledge!








If I take my car to the dealer and they pull the wiring harness out, will they have the correct diagram to make sure that ALL of the speaker wires (front and back) are wired correctly?


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## Subhuman (Feb 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]If I take my car to the dealer and they pull the wiring harness out, will they have the correct diagram to make sure that ALL of the speaker wires (front and back) are wired correctly?[HR][/HR]​Let's see .... red goes to black .... white goes to brown ..... ummm...let's jsut tape off the rest and ground a couple and see what happens


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## GTI-337-Man (Mar 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Subhuman)*

Ok I found the Technical Bulletin on VWOA web site. Take a look at the screen shot below.








Hope this helps anyone trying to get this problem resolved. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by GTI-337-Man, 4:54 PM 3-31-2002]


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## GTI-337-Man (Mar 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TO_DubR)*

After spending a may hours in my 2002 Jetta the past 2 weeks, I can certainly say there is a serious flaw in the audio system. The right channel has more bass, more treble and is louder. 
I am a big time audio/music guy and it just pisses me off to no end listening to the double DIN Monsoon system. I spent a few hours analyzing the system (without taking anything apart.) 
First I threw in a few calibration CD's that I use to calibrate studio equipment with. The CD has a bunch of test tones that allow you to check the decibel level of each channel as well as testing the frequency output of each speaker. 
I also went as far a making a special diagnostics CD that had the same song played in phase then out of phase, in phase left, then in phase right. The song sounded better when it was phased right, however when the audio is phased right it is actually bringing the right channel down to the same output as the left. While it may “sound better” it was actually bringing the right channel down to the levels of the left channel therefore balancing the sound. 
Sound confusing? Well it wouldn’t be if Monsoon and VW got it right before it left the proving grounds. I love my Jetta, but I hate my Monsoon!


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## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI-337-Man)*

and how do you explain the increase in CLEAN bass? Certain sounds really sounded like crap and would distort at 70% volume on the default settings...now the same song can be played louder with the bass CLEANER and not distorting


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## Subhuman (Feb 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (steez)*

I'm beginning to think there is more to this whole issue than just 2 switched wires myself.Even after the switch I'm by far not happy with my '02 Monsoon system.It get's a mediocre sound system rating by me http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## GTI-337-Man (Mar 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (steez)*

There is a certain crossover and chipset in the the Monsoon amp preventing distortion to speakers. If everything isn’t they way it is supposed to be (wiring ect.) then the circuitry won’t be able to do its job properly. When everything lines up properly then you will have 0 distortion and better clarity. 
What are you doing listening to your Monsoon at 70% anyways? You’ll poke your ear out kid.


----------



## Bentlyman (Mar 22, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI-337-Man)*

There is a certain crossover and chipset in the the Monsoon amp preventing distortion to speakers. If everything isn’t they way it is supposed to be (wiring ect.) then the circuitry won’t be able to do its job properly. When everything lines up properly then you will have 0 distortion and better clarity. 


I tend to agree with this information. I just performed the "fix" on Thursday evening of last week, and, to be honest, I was initially disapppinted with the results. I only listened to it for a few seconds, but I didn't really notice much difference from the way it was stock (very poor sound quality).
However, I took a road trip on Friday, and all of a sudden the sound was drastically improved, both with cd's and radio. The only explanation that I can think of for this is that the Monsoon's digital signal processing will not work properly if the system is out of phase. From my experience, it seems that once you make the "fix" the system recalibrates itself and then the sound improves. 
All in all I am quite satisfied with the sound quality. I know that it will not rival a good aftermarket system, but I think it is certainly above average for factory equipment.


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Bentlyman)*

This is from Monsoon site which may help those who have not read into how the WHOLE system works:-
"Each edition of the Monsoon automotive head unit and amplification package is designed for the vehicle it's in. In most editions it's an 8-channel system with active crossovers to direct low, midrange and high frequencies to the appropriate speaker. Depending on the application, the amp generates in excess of 200 watts continuous power. But it's not the watts, it's how we handle them. Each of Monsoon's eight or more speakers is driven by its own amplifier channel with Dynamic Distortion Limiting (DDL). By measuring RMS voltage, a dynamic limiter "senses" whether a signal is approaching the level at which a speaker is incapable of clearly reproducing sound. 
Then it limits the amplitude of the waveform before the sound can distort. In some systems, the limiter is fixed, not dynamic, and applied to the signal universally-- so if one speaker can't handle the signal, the rest of the speakers are forced to do with less power. But in a Monsoon sound system, each channel has an independent limiter, so each speaker reaches the optimum performance for its size and power rating without being overdriven. You get all the sound the system can reproduce, without distortion - you only hear the distortion the guitarist wants you to hear."
ALSO:-
"A vehicle interior is an obstacle course for music. Oblique angles, a mix of hard and soft surfaces -- it's hard for music to make it through alive. But speakers in a Monsoon system are individually equalized so you get big, punchy bass without the unwanted resonances you used to have to live with if you wanted music in a car or truck. Monsoon helps your music survive the trip. Monsoon's dual voice coil subwoofers are optimized using Vehicle Transfer Function Analysis and Custom Vehicle Equalization. English version: Even vehicles without a lot of room for a bass cabinet get big, punchy bass. A summing network in the amp means you get satisfying bass at all volumes. Monsoon's High Sensitivity Speakers use the energy generated by the system more efficiently than conventional speakers would -- better cones, coils, magnets and mounting strategies make sure everything the system generates gets delivered to your ears. "


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

i was just checking out some radio coding info for a vag-com and noticed this (from ross-tech.com:
Look at the first two digits in the coding (sound field tuning):
01 - Golf/GTI
02 - Jetta
03 - Jetta Wagon
Look at the third digit in the coding (radio/speaker system):
0 - Premium V (Monsoon)
4 - Premium IV and Premium V (non-Monsoon)
Look at the fourth digit in the coding (sound correction):
0 - Premium IV and Premium V (non-Monsoon)
3 - Premium V (Monsoon) 2-door
4 - Premium V (Monsoon) 4-door
Look at the fifth digit in the coding (CD player/changer):
1 - Without CD Player/Changer
3 - With CD Player/Changer
i'm not sure how much the sound correction matters, but it's interesting that you can code the radio for 2 or 4 doors. i can't check my gf's golf until the dealer gets a new radio put in, but the selective unlocking is set wrong in her car - it's set for 2 door not 4 door - so it's quite possible that the radio coding is wrong as well. again, not sure how much the sound correction matters, but it could help tighten up the system even more post-wire swap. it would be nice if the tsb instructs the dealer to check the radio coding.


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

The info above is for pre-2002 models with Premium IV & V (4 & 5)
2002 D-DIN is Premium VI (6)
This is from the Official workshop manual for Premium VI:-


----------



## KMFurDM (Mar 19, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I am new to this so forgive me. I fixed my 2002 GTI D-DIN Monsoon already by swapping the cables at the HU. Now how would somebody input this code into the radio to adjust the sound field? And I guess...what would my "code" be? I am thinking 00031 is right...but then I go back to the "how to input" question.
Thanks
David


[Modified by KMFurDM, 8:59 AM 4-2-2002]


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

ross-tech has that info under 98-02 mkiv g/j/nb and i had a dyslexic moment with the roman numerals.
but still, it's probably worth checking your coding to make sure it's right. once i get my gf's golf back i was thinking i'd play around with it.
ukaussi - did you confirm your coding is correct and did you try changing it to hear if there was any impact?


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (KMFurDM)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Now how would somebody input this code into the radio to adjust the sound field?[HR][/HR]​using a vw diagnostic tool - commonly referred to as "vag-com". all the info you could want is here: http://www.ross-tech.com 
well worth the $.


----------



## KMFurDM (Mar 19, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Grrr...that's $200 I do not want to spend. Anybody in with one of these in SE PA (Philly Area) want to help me out with this for $20...just plug it in...make sure it's adjusted properly?


----------



## newbiewithGTI2002 (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (KMFurDM)*

I'm baacck !
Can anyone explain to me why the switch corrects the sound ??? I know about that phasing stuff, but when I installed my Blau way back when I noticed the switch, but I also noticed that the wires were also switched at the amp in the back...
So my idea is that they were wired correctly in the first place, and switching the wires at either end should cause out of phase, not correct it ...






















Also, I am kinda pissed off that finally this info comes alive... I talked to my dealer about it, Monsoon... It took VWVortex to solve this... 
Aren't we great or what http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif










[Modified by newbiewithGTI2002, 3:44 PM 4-2-2002]


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (KMFurDM)*

I have checked mine and it was correct - 00031 (no cd-changer)
I doubt the coding is incorrect but it is an outside chance.
I haven't played with my coding as mine works fine and I am dealing with my chip problems right now


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (newbiewithGTI2002)*



> I'm baacck !
> Can anyone explain to me why the switch corrects the sound ??? I know about that phasing stuff, but when I installed my Blau way back when I noticed the switch, but I also noticed that the wires were also switched at the amp in the back...
> QUOTE]
> 
> ...


----------



## KMFurDM (Mar 19, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have checked mine and it was correct - 00031 (no cd-changer)
I doubt the coding is incorrect but it is an outside chance.
I haven't played with my coding as mine works fine and I am dealing with my chip problems right now[HR][/HR]​I figured that's what it would be. But what still concerns me is that the rears just dont push out enough sound. Putting the "fade" all the way to the back at about 30% volume is hardly audible then when slowly turning the fade back to the middle it stays pretty quiet until about 20 degrees from the top when all the sound seems to come forward and becomes quite loud. Now...I understand that the rears are more for pushing out bass...but on songs that I know have a lot of relatively low frequency bass you can hardly hear it/feel it unless you turn the volume up past 50%. I still think there is something wrong.








This is all after the fix of course.
David


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (KMFurDM)*

quote:[HR][/HR]But what still concerns me is that the rears just dont push out enough sound. Putting the "fade" all the way to the back at about 30% volume is hardly audible then when slowly turning the fade back to the middle it stays pretty quiet until about 20 degrees from the top when all the sound seems to come forward and becomes quite loud. Now...I understand that the rears are more for pushing out bass...but on songs that I know have a lot of relatively low frequency bass you can hardly hear it/feel it unless you turn the volume up past 50%. I still think there is something wrong.[HR][/HR]​ah, that brings me to another observation about the double-din. on my single-din, there's a scale that tells you how far to the rear you've faded the speakers. it's not until i hit approx 7/9 that the sound of the system deteriorates considerably, but i'm thinking that's basically right since no audio system is going to sound good when you're pushing the entire signal spectrum primarily through your sub-woofers. on the double-din, the system seems to fade to the sub-woofers very quickly - what seems like it would be 3/9 on the single-din, so the sound of the system deteriorates much quicker.
btw - it's now almost 2 weeks from when i first took my gf's 02 golf in about this problem, which is when they ruined the radio and some of the dash trim trying to remove the radio with the wrong tool. the busted up radio is still sitting in the backseat and there's still a big hole in the dash. when should i call the dealer and express my concern?


----------



## vwsig (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I did the wire swap and it now ROCKS!!


----------



## Soy Bomb (Oct 23, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

bump


----------



## KMFurDM (Mar 19, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Soy Bomb)*

Hah...your bump was ineffective. The thread is sticky...
















Can you tell I am bored?


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (KMFurDM)*

NOPE


----------



## LightmanE300 (Mar 31, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

The problem is that even since the dealer fixed it, by putting the wires in the correct place, it STILL sounds like crap on the left side. If I put the volume up to a reasonable level, and use the balance to shift between right and left, the right side is 10 times better sounding, the left sounds all hollow and has half the bass. Has anyone else experienced this AFTER the fix? The dealer has just decided to order me a whole new monsoon head unit - which I doubt will help. Any thoughts??


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

So, has anyone in NOVA had any luck getting a dealer here (Stohlman, Fairfaix, Farrish) to do this under warranty?


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

Can anyone scan the actual TSB and place it online? My service manager still can't locate it and I don't want to risk doing the switch myself.


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

according to VW corporate they have a "draft" of the TSB but have not released the final TSB yet.... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## agies (Apr 9, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (LightmanE300)*

Just had my dealer "fix" the wiring in my stereo yesterday. They hadn't heard anything about this problem before (but to be honest I never thought the stereo sounded bad until I read other peoples problems with the monsoon).
Anyhow, it was fixed under warranty, and yes - the stereo definitely sounds better (louder, bassier - especially on FM) but the right side still sounds sorta muted when the balance is tweaked.
But hear is a thought - maybe this is what Monsoon had in mind? If you are driving in a car, you really don't want a whole lot of sound pounding off right beside you - it would be better to have the speakers to the right of you louder to compensate for the larger distance between you and the speaker. Sort of "enveloping" the cabin in sound? Anyhow that's just a thought.
Either way - I still think in terms of factory stereos (for the money) this is far and away the best stereo on the market.


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## Hayzus (Sep 9, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (agies)*

Just got my jetta back from the dealer, no luck with them. They wouldn't even call VW Tech to see if there is a TSB because I have a sub installed. Anyone have any advice?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Hayzus)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Just got my jetta back from the dealer, no luck with them. They wouldn't even call VW Tech to see if there is a TSB because I have a sub installed. Anyone have any advice?[HR][/HR]​DIY


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## Hayzus (Sep 9, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

that's my plan...had my car in for the 10k service, thought I'd try to get the dealer to do it...big waste of my time and breath. So yup...time to print out your instructions ukaussi. Thanks!!


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## TDiRoy (Apr 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

See TDIClub posts for VW Technical Service Bulletin V910202. Sounds like their gonna address the problem. Also found a diagram of transposed wires for the left front speaker. I'll be taking mine to the dealer with the TSB number and a copy of the wiring foul-up.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TDiRoy)*

TDiRoy, I've been getting all of my info from here to put on Fred's! (thanks Vortex)








The problem with the TSB seems to be that it is only in "rough draft" right now and some dealerships are having a hard time locating it. If your dealer can't get it, I would recommend finding someone that has gotten the fix and have your dealer contact their dealer!


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

I heard about a dealer in Ohio that had "it" but when I suggested to my service manager that he can get a copy faxed to him, he almost seemed like he took offense to the idea as if he didn't want my help.


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## LightmanE300 (Mar 31, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

I was the person who got the fix at the dealer in ohio - ganley westside imports. They were helpful, although they either didn't know how to do the fix right, or the fix isn't a fix, as my monsoon still sounds like crap.
Agies, can you please pass whatever crack you're smoking, it must be good!!
1. the sound problem is on the left side not right, 2. the sound is supposed to be balanced, aside from the monsoon's tendency to shift bass response to the rear. I think this stereo is decent for factory, but far from the best out there. You get what you pay for though, it was only 325.


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## newbiewithGTI2002 (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (KMFurDM)*

I just did the switch, and the sound is definitely bassier. I had to adjust the digital EQ to lower the bass output (don't look in your manuals, I have a Blau Heidelberg







).
Can't wait to drive that baby home tonight








Anyone else who has such experiences with aftermarket components ?


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## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (LightmanE300)*

Lightman: 
The sound is never supposed to be balanced.Having front and back speakers loud is the general pepboys r1cer sound system. The focus is on "loudness" with those crappy systems. 
True audiophiles go for a proper sound stage up front tweet n midbass on the kick pannels and bass for the rear. Thats the proper way to do it


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## agies (Apr 9, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (LightmanE300)*

My apologies - can't say if it's the crack or maybe just all that fresh spring air...
A correction to my previous posting - the LEFT side sounds muted.
Cheers!


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (newbiewithGTI2002)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I just did the switch, and the sound is definitely bassier. I had to adjust the digital EQ to lower the bass output (don't look in your manuals, I have a Blau Heidelberg







).
Can't wait to drive that baby home tonight








Anyone else who has such experiences with aftermarket components ?[HR][/HR]​just a question, since im in the market for a aftermarket HU, do i still need to do the cable switch even after putting the aftermarket HU? i was under the impression i didnt .... thanks


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## sanchin (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

Well, it took me long enough to get to it, but I fainally made the switch. My system had ok bass, but the apparent channel balance was really biased to the right. I cut, switched and re-soldered the wires at the amp. Wasn't too tough. I tried to find a pin extractor for that connector - got one that looked like it would work - it fit in the connector - but wouldn't release the pin.








The Verdict:
Better channel balance, though still slightly right-biased. Way more bass, w/ noticeable punch that wasn't there before. Almost too much when just sitting in the driveway w/ the engine off. Interestingly, now it seems like the tweets are too quiet... The curse of the sound engineer - balance is elusive. I'll need to spend more time in it going down the road before I make up my mind about keeping it that way. Fortunately, what's been soldered can be un-soldered...


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## Ken1.8T (Feb 16, 2001)

*THANKS AGAIN UKAUSSI!!!*

Hats off to UKAUSSI on the DD fix. It took me all of 20 minutes to do the fix. I did not have to cut the wires either! Stand by, we now have bass!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif










[Modified by Ken1.8T, 10:10 PM 4-10-2002]


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: THANKS AGAIN UKAUSSI!!! (Ken1.8T)*

grrrr, i wish i had just made the damn wire swap myself...
it's been 3 weeks since the owner of the dealership used the wrong removal tools and then the service manager followed up by having a tech go at the radio with a screwdriver...
there's still a big hole in the dash where the radio should be.
wouldn't you think that between the owner of the dealership and the service manager they could have gotten a new radio in already and fixed my damn car???????







http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Hey everyone.....
I just did it myself in about 12 minutes, following the kickass instructions linked earlier in this thread. Hats off to UKAUSSIE and all the others who helped! Thanks.
I decided to make the switch at the head unit in my 02 Jetta Wagon and I was able to extract the pins from the connector very quickly. I noticed that it's very important to make sure that the paper clips you are sticking in there are straight (brand new paper clips). I went through a few bent up ones before I noticed the difference. You can feel it click ever so slightly when you stick em in. And of course push the wire in a little, push on the paper clips and pull the wire.
In addition to this fix making the stereo sound 100 times better, I also noticed as I left the car and locked it with the remote, the horn sounded for a millisecond to let me know that the car was locked and the alarm was armed. I don't know for sure that this was directly caused by the phasing mistake and correction (I'm not a VW engineer)...but I can tell you that I've had this car for a month and that little horn sound has NEVER happened before. I had been wondering to myself why there wasn't some sort of audible alert that the car had in fact locked.
I had to wait three months for this baby and I thought it couldn't get any better than the day the car came....but now that my stereo kicks ass, I'm even happier!


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## dex (Nov 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

The reason you didn't hear the horn sound before is because your HU wasn't put in deep enough into the slot (May be from the factory or dealer messed with it before you got it). There is a clip with sensor at the bottom right side of the HU that if it is not engaged car would not honk at ya. Obviously you put it deep enough (as it should be) and now it's working. 
FYI this has nothing to do with the wiring changes you did. 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (dex)*

I checked out the status of the TSB on http://www.vw.ddsltd.com 
A couple of weeks ago when I found it, it was not in stock. Today I checked and it was in stock. Hopefully, that means that VW dealers will have an official copy in their hands soon. I was about to go fix it myself, but this give me a little more patience. I don't wanna screw it up myself, but then again, I am taking it to my dealer, so who knows what they'll do...


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## newbiewithGTI2002 (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I just did the switch, and the sound is definitely bassier. I had to adjust the digital EQ to lower the bass output (don't look in your manuals, I have a Blau Heidelberg







).
Can't wait to drive that baby home tonight








Anyone else who has such experiences with aftermarket components ?
just a question, since im in the market for a aftermarket HU, do i still need to do the cable switch even after putting the aftermarket HU? i was under the impression i didnt .... thanks [HR][/HR]​Yes you do. The black one is the negative, you have to hook it up to the proper negative wire from your aftermarket HU. When I swapped HU, I hooked the wires exactly the way they were originally, thus replicating the problem http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## timg (Jan 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (newbiewithGTI2002)*

I just tried to make the switch on the amp on my new '02 GTI, but I could only get that pink pin thing about half of the way out. Is there a trick to getting it all the way out? It seems to catching on something, but I can't see what.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (timg)*

As mentioned previously it does NOT come out.
Pin switch can only be done at the HU (someone correct me if they have been succesfull)
AMP switch can ONLY be done by CUTTING & swapping wires
Hope this helps any confusion


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (timg)*

Whoa! I just had my car in for service for non-monsoon related issues. The service manager knew that I wasn't happy with the radio and I brought up the problem & ukaussi fix to him a few weeks ago. Well, when I took it in earlier this week, they actually did have the TSB(I didn't know they did) and checked the wiring,etc according to the TSB and they said nothing was wrong. (?!?!?)But the system still sounds like (I'm not sure if I can swear) "doody"! Apparently nothing was ever wrong with it, but everyone(even the salesman) that's heard my system said it sounds like "doody" and you can definitely hear a difference between left and right sides, especially with bass. What else can I do? Should I just do the switch myself to make sure or just but a new system(new head unit maybe)? (The car was built in December) I read that people who've done that switch notice a big difference for the most part. I'm happy with the rest of the car, but I must thank VW or Monsoon for the super job with the radio. Gosh darn doody-heads! Fiddlesticks! [email protected]#$%^&* http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## dex (Nov 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

Follow the exact procedures from UKAUSSI and you will be fine. Do it yourself. If your yellow and black wires are correct in your harness than may be there is another problem.
I'm not sure what the TSB is supposed to include, but obviously ain't much.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Should I just do the switch myself to make sure or just but a new system(new head unit maybe)? (The car was built in December) I read that people who've done that switch notice a big difference for the most part. I'm happy with the rest of the car, but I must thank VW or Monsoon for the super job with the radio. Gosh darn doody-heads! Fiddlesticks! [email protected]#$%^&* http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif







http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif







[HR][/HR]​If you have any skills taking things apart, (and putting em back together) it's a snap. Do it yourself!
My car was built in mid-January and it had the crossed wires.


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

I tried this on my new car and cannot get the darn thing out...I think maybe I need to make the "keys" out of something stronger.
Anyone in NOVA done this?


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## timg (Jan 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

.QUOTE]As mentioned previously it does NOT come out.
Pin switch can only be done at the HU (someone correct me if they have been succesfull)
AMP switch can ONLY be done by CUTTING & swapping wires
Hope this helps any confusion







[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the explanation. It seems like cutting and swapping at the amp would be so much easier than pulling out the HU, etc., especially in GTIs where the amp is so accessible. My only concern is soldering, which is probably out of my rather limited league. What about just twisting the wires together and wrapping them in black tape? Or how 'bout those little plastic cap things that hold two wires together? (I think "little plastic cap thing" is the technical term.) Do I really need to solder? If not, this seems like about a three minute job.


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## dex (Nov 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (timg)*

It is not worth it to cut the wires. Just go to your dealership and ask them for this tools from this thread: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 Scroll toward the bottom and you will see them posted from "user name unknown" vortexer. These are the tools that the dealer has. Be kind and ask them if you can use them for 5 mins and do the swap outhere on the lot. Than volume UP and you will gather some crowd around you








Took me 1.5 mins with the tools, when I did it for a friend - sales rep in VW dealer with the tools. Took me 30 mins with home made tools








All dealers have these tools so they cannot say they don't have them. Just ask kindly and don't explain why.


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## 02 GTI 1point8T (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (dex)*

switch can be done at the amp without cutting wires, but removing the pins at the amp is a major pain in the you know what.
i tried it at the amp 3 times, then gave up and pulled the hu...it took me 5 minutes. the pins at the hu are 100% easier to pull than the pins at the amp.


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## dex (Nov 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02 GTI 1point8T)*

quote:[HR][/HR]switch can be done at the amp without cutting wires, but removing the pins at the amp is a major pain in the you know what.
i tried it at the amp 3 times, then gave up and pulled the hu...it took me 5 minutes. the pins at the hu are 100% easier to pull than the pins at the amp.[HR][/HR]​Yes, it could be done. I tried and failed with the paper clips, pins ... It's just too small. But with the right size pin extracting tool for the amp plug is easy.


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (dex)*

and where did you get this tool?


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## dex (Nov 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

From the dealer. Borrow it for 5 mins and do it on the lot. Look the thread above and see which tools you need. 4 pieces for removal of the HU and 1 pin extracting tool for the wires. That's it.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (dex)*

quote:[HR][/HR]The reason you didn't hear the horn sound before is because your HU wasn't put in deep enough into the slot (May be from the factory or dealer messed with it before you got it). There is a clip with sensor at the bottom right side of the HU that if it is not engaged car would not honk at ya. Obviously you put it deep enough (as it should be) and now it's working. 
FYI this has nothing to do with the wiring changes you did. 
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif







[HR][/HR]​That seems like a thoroughly retarded place for such a sensor. Am I missing something!? So far I've been impressed with the "superior German engineering", but this has got me stumped. Oh well!


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## nimhrat (Aug 23, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

quote:[HR][/HR]That seems like a thoroughly retarded place for such a sensor. Am I missing something!? So far I've been impressed with the "superior German engineering", but this has got me stumped. Oh well![HR][/HR]​The sensor is there so that if someone tries to pull your radio out when the alarm is armed, it will go off. Because the radio wasn't seated all the way in the first place, I'm guessing that the alarm never armed (that honk signifies that the alarm is armed). I suspect the alarm will only arm when all sensors report a given status -- all doors must be closed, the trunk must be closed, and the radio has to be properly seated. Otherwise, pressing 'lock' will only lock the doors...


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

I did the switch!! HUGE difference although my left front speaker doesn't seem to put out as much bass as the right side-it's not noticeable if you have the balance set in the middle. Yes, it's a Friday night and I should be drinking beer, but after I talked to my service manager earlier today and he explained that they checked the wiring according to the new TSB-blah blah blah-& it was "CORRECT". I didn't really believe him cos my system sounded like crap still. I tried to convince myself that maybe I am going deaf.
Anyway, this just got me kinda peeved so I printed out UKAUSSI's procedure and decided to just investigate the wires and see for myself. Low and behold, the wiring was INCORRECT- the b*stard flat out lied to me. Who knows what they did besides scratch my HU when they "serviced" my car?








So while I was looking at the messed up wiring, my friend told me to just make the switch and not trust my dealership anymore....makes sense to me. I did. I thought "F the radio warranty"-at least I know I did it myself.
I am happy with the radio-finally; but so angry with my service manager. Sorry if I'm venting; I just wanted to let people know my experience. This is my 1st car (3rd VW from this dealer for my family) and I can't believe the BS that me and other people have been getting for this. BTW anyone know a VW dealer with a GOOD service dept in the Chicago land area? 
For everyone who hasn't done it yet-do the switch yourself. 
Thanks to UKAUSSI - I'll drink a Foster's in your name tonight!
Thanks everyone else who put in their $.02 as well


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nimhrat)*

quote:[HR][/HR]That seems like a thoroughly retarded place for such a sensor. Am I missing something!? So far I've been impressed with the "superior German engineering", but this has got me stumped. Oh well!
The sensor is there so that if someone tries to pull your radio out when the alarm is armed, it will go off. Because the radio wasn't seated all the way in the first place, I'm guessing that the alarm never armed (that honk signifies that the alarm is armed). I suspect the alarm will only arm when all sensors report a given status -- all doors must be closed, the trunk must be closed, and the radio has to be properly seated. Otherwise, pressing 'lock' will only lock the doors...[HR][/HR]​can anyone confirm this??? isnt this a SERIOUS problem??? my jetta 2002 doesnt honk also (all i get is a flash on the lights but thats what the manual saids also, nothing about the honk going off)???


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Can anyone scan the actual TSB and place it online? My service manager still can't locate it and I don't want to risk doing the switch myself. [HR][/HR]​It looks like all of our complaining has finally paid off! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I was able to get a copy of the TSB from my dealer (even though I have already done the switch myself). It does exist! I have scanned it and threw it up on the web at http://www.mywebpages.20m.com . Hope this helps.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

Thanks vmb7! I have an appointment with my dealer Friday and would like to print this out in case they have trouble locating it. Is there anyway to reduce the picture?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

EXCELLENT
(just had to add my own advise at the end







)


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks vmb7! I have an appointment with my dealer Friday and would like to print this out in case they have trouble locating it. Is there anyway to reduce the picture? [HR][/HR]​If you're trying to print it out I would recommend saving the TSB to your harddrive. For Internet Explorer users: right click over the picture and select "save picture as". For Netscape users: right click over the picture and select "save image as". Then open the picture from the directory\folder you saved it in and print it out.


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## nidhal (Dec 17, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Didn't somebody post how to fix this on a different thread? Isn't it just a case of swapping to wires or some such thing?


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## VW Bobby (Sep 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Hey! Nice additional information on the tail of that TSB! About the Foster's, though: I wish you could still get the Australian stuff here. Check the label (burp): "Union Made In Canada".
Cheers!


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks vmb7! I have an appointment with my dealer Friday and would like to print this out in case they have trouble locating it. Is there anyway to reduce the picture? 
If you're trying to print it out I would recommend saving the TSB to your harddrive. For Internet Explorer users: right click over the picture and select "save picture as". For Netscape users: right click over the picture and select "save image as". Then open the picture from the directory\folder you saved it in and print it out. [HR][/HR]​Had no trouble saving it, but need to reduce it---any ideas?


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]EXCELLENT
(just had to add my own advise at the end







)







[HR][/HR]​Thanks for that post---I can copy that one and the guys in service can have a cold one when they're done if they do it right!
BUT, I wonder since two people now are reporting that their's were NOT fixed as reported by the dealer---do you think the TSB picture confuses them? Do you think they "think" the yellow wire is SUPPOSED to be in that spot instead of the black wire? Are the terminal's clearly marked 3 and 7? The photo only shows the wrong wiring and not the corrected wiring. 


[Modified by MaryP, 9:23 PM 4-14-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

Personally, I think the instructions are a little confusing. Uless you look up the pin #'s you may assume the picture is what it should look like.
My job is desktop & helpdesk support for our company and I do these sort of instructions regularly. These are NOT very good.
I would recommend that everyone take my instructions http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 along with them just in case


















[Modified by UKAUSSI, 7:06 PM 4-14-2002]


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Many thanks! Will let you know how it turns out. I am posting all this info over at Fred's too. 
You're the man!










[Modified by MaryP, 10:47 PM 4-14-2002]


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## DubberNix (Jan 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Many thanks to UKAUSSI for figuring this out and posting a solution. Thanks also to others who contributed. I just took delivery of my 2002 Jetta...and I drove it straight home and made the change. There's nothing quite like being armed with a cut up credit card and paperclips, and tearing into the dash of car that only has 12 miles on it.







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## sOnICtheBeEtLe (Oct 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

what brand is monsoon >??>> is it by clarion ???? please help me ..=]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (sOnICtheBeEtLe)*

"Monsoon" is a division of GM. The "Monsoon" portion is actually just the amp in the back. 
The HU is made by Matsu****a (division of Panasonic)


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## newbiewithGTI2002 (Oct 4, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI-
I'm tempted to get on a plane and go kiss you...






















OK OK not really








Thanks man http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## timg (Jan 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (newbiewithGTI2002)*

After ruminating Friday about how to go at the switch myself, I decided to call my local VW dealer to see what they knew. They had received the TSB, and they made an appointment for me this morning. I've just returned from the service department and . . . the radio is fixed! And I didn't even have to take about my brand new ride to get it done.
Thanks to UKAUSSI and everyone else for getting VW on the program.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## nidhal (Dec 17, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (timg)*

Ok, but how about some help for those of us who are having an aftermarket head unit installed. I had heard there was also a possible fix through the amp. Anyone know anything about this?


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nidhal)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Ok, but how about some help for those of us who are having an aftermarket head unit installed. I had heard there was also a possible fix through the amp. Anyone know anything about this?[HR][/HR]​OK, use your head here. It's wired wrong on the wiring side of the system, not the radio side. If you replace your head unit, it's still going to be wired wrong. Sure you can do it at the amp, where you have to cut wires...but since you're going to have the head unit out anyhow, just do it there. You can either swap the pins before you hook up the harness, or you can wire that speaker incorrectly on the radio side of the harness, thus negating the error on the other side. It's really not difficult...


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## nambraf (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (timg)*

Just got back from my dealer. Over the phone he said it was wired correctly according to the TSB. I then went there showed him UKAUSSI"s great instructions, and after promising I wouldn't sue him if my car blew up, he changed the wires. Now it sounds much much better, but it still seems fuller on the right. If I sit in the driver's seat and listen to talk radio, or a CD with a singer, the voices seem to be coming out of the passenger's side door, unless I adjust the balance towards me. Anyone else experiencing this or can think of why it's sounding like this.


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## blackturbowagon (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nambraf)*

Just picked my car up from the dealer where it was having some other repairs done (3 of the coils went bad at once on a car with 5500 miles, go figure). I asked the guy helping me out to check my radio to see if it was wired correctly. Seemed he hadn't heard of the technical bulletin. He told me looked it up and that the bulletin did not apply to my VIN and that my car did not need the fix. As far as I know, he didn't pull the radio to check. Does this sound legit? Do all the 2002's have this wiring error? Maybe I should pull it and check myself.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (blackturbowagon)*

Look at the TSB above, it says ALL 2002. He was obviously FOS








Also, I found that your legs block the lower speaker a little so if you really want to test the stereo imaging, get in the back seat of your car and stick your head into the front of the car between the front seats


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## 02VDubGTI (Apr 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

this seems to be the case too with some dealers here in the MKE area too. picked up my car today and i got the "we listened to it and we think it is fine" answer and a good friend who goes to a different dealer had almost same response. they are too lazy to even pull it out to see if it is right or wrong. they just listen to their ears what they think is ok...... it is for this reason i hope VW will just issue a recall so they have to check it or mayabe i will just break down an do it myself


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## JLJetta (Nov 24, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02VDubGTI)*

It applies to all the 2002 Monsoon double din systems. If your Jetta is either a single-din unit, or a non-monsoon double din unit.. then it would not apply to you.
But if it is a MDD system.. it should apply to you! At least they shoudl pull the radio and make sure it is correct.


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02VDubGTI)*

My VW service manager lied to me as well about checking the wiring-I posted what happened earlier, but basically I just wound up doing the switch myself. I can't believe VW! My GTI being my first car ever (new or used)at 23 yrs old, and my family's 3rd VW from the same particular dealership-how does VW expect me to be loyal? My family has since gone on to buy Japanese cars, but I still liked VW so I got one. I'm surprised VW can consider launching a +40k$ car if they can't even do a good job with their 20k$ cars. If people are going to seriously consider getting a VW over a BMW or MB, they've gotta change. It's surprising that this problem took so long to be rectified. Am I complaining too much? I love my GTI, but it's the little things(problems) that count.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

If anyone now has a problem call or email *VW Customer Service* and tell them that your dealer refuses to fix your car according to VW instructions


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

just made a appointment for tomorrow ... i have my tech bulletin in hand since 1 technician heard of the problem and the other havent (a little unnerving to say the lease) ... also told them my alarm does not arm (no honk at lockup) ... hope all goes well, ill let everyone know ...


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## blackturbowagon (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

After having no success at the dealer (I was told that the fix did not apply to my VIN), I decided to check myself. Guess what... I had the same problem as everyone else. The fix, start to finish, took me all of 10 minutes including the time it took to make the removal keys out of an old credit card. Sounds great now.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (blackturbowagon)*

quote:[HR][/HR]After having no success at the dealer (I was told that the fix did not apply to my VIN), I decided to check myself. Guess what... I had the same problem as everyone else. The fix, start to finish, took me all of 10 minutes including the time it took to make the removal keys out of an old credit card. Sounds great now.[HR][/HR]​The stories of incompetence and deceit exhibited by many of the VW dealers and service staff in dealing with these crossed wires is astounding to me. As a brand new VW owner, I'm a more than a little bit scared by this. The service manager from Gunther VW in Coconut Creek, FL never even returned my phone call regarding this issue. It didn't matter anyway...after reading this whole thread I decided it was _much_ safer if I did it myself.
What happens if the dealer has to fix something that is much more critical, like the brakes, engine or perhaps the airbags? Shoot, I wonder if the airbags are even wired correctly?? Who really knows? Anyone care to test???


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## bcruze (Jan 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (blackturbowagon)*

Here's my .02. I just did the swap in the parking lot here, took me all of 4min to get the HU out and back in again. That pink pin that everyone was saying they had trouble with...it came out all the way with minimal pressure. I almost lost it since i was going to press so hard on the one side...it just came flying out. Anyhow...the whole system sounds MUCH better. Thanks UK and all that contributed to the procedure. I'd be happy to fix anyone in the NOVA area if they want now...
By the way, I sent two emails to my dealership's (Stohlman's in Tysons Corner) service dept. and have recieved no response yet. I sent the first about 2wk ago, the second 1wk ago. After reading the dealership horror stories about this, I went ahead and decided to do it myself and avoid the B.S.


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## GTIOnce&Again (Mar 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

This fix was SOOO easy! Thank you, UKAussie and GTIDad! Much better bass response and channel separation. Took all of 10 minutes (I didn't think the HU was coming out at first, but then it just popped out). The paperclip trick worked with no problem, also. Thanks again!


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTIOnce&Again)*

I attempted a Monsoon fix today.....I mean my dealer did. I have a 2002 Passat GLS and noticed terrible audio from the moment I took possession of the car. They told me my wires were indeed crossed and fixed it. I could tell that they did in fact pull the radio....but I hear little difference.
After listening to this 'fix' I grabbed my salesman (car is only 10 days old) and asked if he heard the same thing I did. He shrugged. Then I asked him....'listen to us talk....now does that voice sound anything like a real voice?' He then reached for the treble, turned it all the way down, turned down the midrange, and turned up the bass. 
It's hard to believe this sound system is so well regarded. The CD and AM sound is absolutedly horrible....it's tizzy, glarey, devoid of body....the sound is a brightly lit laser beam aimed right at my head....Monsoon 'botique' sound.....it's spinach http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
Then again, most people rate a sound system by how many watts it pumps, how well it can be heard throughout the neighborhood and the 'thumpyness' of the bass. How well the sound resembles real people or instruments is inconsequential. 
{end of vent}


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I attempted a Monsoon fix today.....I mean my dealer did. I have a 2002 Passat GLS and noticed terrible audio from the moment I took possession of the car. They told me my wires were indeed crossed and fixed it. I could tell that they did in fact pull the radio....but I hear little difference.[HR][/HR]​did you see the harness before and after the wire swap?
there's at least 2 people on this thread that have reported that the dealer did not in fact fix the problem even though they reported it as fixed.
quote:[HR][/HR]It's hard to believe this sound system is so well regarded. The CD and AM sound is absolutedly horrible....it's tizzy, glarey, devoid of body....the sound is a brightly lit laser beam aimed right at my head....Monsoon 'botique' sound.....it's spinach[HR][/HR]​you should take a ride in my 02 glx variant that has the single-din and the little cubby that seems like it was designed to fit my wallet and a pack of smokes. the stereo cranks. lots of bass, lots of mid, lots of treble, and a really sweet overall sound. in fact, i was blasting some soul coughing and thinking about how damn nice the stereo sounded. best of all - it's relatively quiet from the outside, so i can be inside giving myself permament hearing damage and i'm not the guy at the traffic light shaking the entire line of cars.
now if you want to hear a post-swap much better but still not great sounding double-din monsoon in an 02 golf, you should take a ride in my gf's car. oh wait, she's still got a big hole in the dash where the dealer broke the trim and damaged the radio trying to take it out after using the single-din removal tools instead of the correct dd tools.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
oh wait, she's still got a big hole in the dash where the dealer broke the trim and damaged the radio trying to take it out after using the single-din removal tools instead of the correct dd tools.







[HR][/HR]​After reading your previous post about this, I called my dealer yesterday to make sure they had the 2002 removal tools. They said "yes" and that they had done one switch already. I am keeping my fingers crossed that they don't screw up! I don't really have the time to stand there and watch them do it, but I will be clear with them about the fix, which I have printed out. If it doesn't sound better when I pick it up, they will be pulling the HU in front of me to verify!


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (blackturbowagon)*

well just got back from the dealer ... let me tell you, even after giving them a copy of the VW tech bulltin, my dealer told me the best they could do was "swapped" out the radio with a new unit ... wat the hell is wrong wit these people ... im going to search for a old credit card now to do the damn switch myself ... (btw: swapping out the radio did fix my "no honk" problem upon locking the car) ...


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

quote:[HR][/HR]well just got back from the dealer ... let me tell you, even after giving them a copy of the VW tech bulltin, my dealer told me the best they could do was "swapped" out the radio with a new unit ... wat the hell is wrong wit these people ... im going to search for a old credit card now to do the damn switch myself ... (btw: swapping out the radio did fix my "no honk" problem upon locking the car) ...[HR][/HR]​That's absolutely pathetic. What's the dealership...so noone else goes there.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Ok, I have brought my car in for the second time to the dealer, I saw the wires which were crossed...
1: The dealer said that the TSB(which he showed me) states that slots 3 and 7 are the culprits(which jibes with the fix), but that the TSB states the wires are in the correct position if the 3should be black, and 7 should be yellow
(they said it was correct, and due to my impatience I couldn't see how it wasn't)
The black wire is in a row of multicolored wires, and the yellow is between all black wires...seems odd to me, so I asked them to do the swap against thier wishes..(they did, but said they couldn't gauranteeee the thing because it went against the TSB)
Somehow it sounds the same.(im not an audiophile, and haven't done extensive testing, plus to top it off, I just had ear surgery for a repair on the eardrum 2 months ago and its still healing)
BUT...
I had noticed earlier that my fader cut the front speaker out at about the 10'oclock position on the dial. and that the balance shifted sound instanenously to the left and right...(balance I didn't know was a problem)
I then asked to see another car with the monsoon system in it, and tested it. The balance had a delayed shifting reaction when balancing, and the fader worked correctly. Sound was somewhat the same...
When the car was in the shop, it seemed to sound fine on both sides, equal volume, but after I took it home and sounded it, for some reasont he left side (while not bad) still has a slightly lower volume, im not sure if thats because my legs are blocking sound or not, but I can live with it for now, and the big test will be when they get the new HU to replace mine with and see what that does for it...
Anyone have a tride and true test that I can conduct on it after I get my new HU?



[Modified by oto, 3:42 PM 4-18-2002]


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## fahrfrumlosin (Sep 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

Decided to do the fix-it myself with the help of some friends at a local stereo shop, since i have no idea how to solder. The fix took about 10min and the results were more bass response, NOTICEABLE mid range and sharp highs.
I came from 4 clean sounding MB Quarts and 3 12" subs, and now growing out of big stereos...this system is more than adequate now and I have no need to upgrade







.
Thanks to all for the tech tips to do this procedure!


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## 1st SilverOne (Feb 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (fahrfrumlosin)*

Well it seems as if this thread is not done yet. The TSB #V910202 is not correct. I took this to my dealership yesterday. 
The TSB #V910202 states: Terminal 3 color code should be "black" & Terminal 7 color code should be "yellow" (which is the incorrect state).
The technican and I looked at this together. He said the wiring was correct according to the TSB (and he was correct as I looked at this wiring too). We did the switch anyway since he and I are both familiar with "phasing".
Anyway the TSB#V910202 needs to state: Terminal 3 color code should be "yellow" & Terminal 7 color code should be "black" (which is the correct state).
I must admit the system sounds much better with the wiring switch. Also if someone could please re-scan the TSB without the "playing loud" and "drink foster's" it would be very appreciated. I liked the joke but the service manager thought kinda thought the TSB was a joke but I had to convince him it wasn't.
P.S. I didn't know who to contact on this mistake so hopefully someone can let me know (or rather do it themselves).


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1st SilverOne)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Also if someone could please re-scan the TSB without the "playing loud" and "drink foster's" it would be very appreciated. I liked the joke but the service manager thought kinda thought the TSB was a joke but I had to convince him it wasn't.
P.S. I didn't know who to contact on this mistake so hopefully someone can let me know (or rather do it themselves). 







[HR][/HR]​Posted for your viewing pleasure...
















A larger version can be found on http://mywebpages.20m.com/ 



[Modified by vmb7, 9:59 PM 4-19-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

Here is confirmation:-
*OFFICIAL DIAGRAM FROM VW SERVICE MANUAL 









This shows how mine WAS wired INCORRECTLY. *








As you can see :-
terminal 3 should be YELLOW
terminal 7 should be BLACK


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I have faxed the info to the Service Director at my dealer who I initially spoke to on this. I am sure he will let them know


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Unfortunately I can't figure out that diagram since it has no color coding...
how can I explain this to the service guys?
and that picture with the color coded dots and the arrows and circle? uhm, im not sure what that entails, since the yellow dot is covering a black, and the black one isn't covering anything...?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

FULL EXPLANATION:-
Here is a picture that shows you the PIN #'s that VW uses 








Here is the same picture showing the color of the wires that attach to those pins when the wiring is WRONG









Here is the same picture again with CORRECTED wiring


----------



## Spamjohnson (Sep 17, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I had the same arguement with the dealer, their TSB say's that the incorrect wiring is "correct". I couldn't convince them otherwise, the service rep even gave me the "Maybe the German's just wired them that way". UKAussi, who did you talk to at VW, can I give them a call and remind them that they need to fix the bulletin, otherwise I could fix it myself, but I would like to walk in and say "See, I told you so".
Sam, 02TDIWagon


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Spamjohnson)*





































Basically, VW has made a real "Pig's Ear" of this whole situation. We went to the trouble of finding the problem and showing them the solution and someone doesn't take the time to check that they write the tech bulletin correctly. It also falls on their bosses for not checking their work.
A VW dealer can do one of 2 things.
- They can stick by what VW says even though it is wrong (no effort on their part and no liability)
OR
- If they use LOGIC they can see from the OFFICIAL PIN-OUTS in the VW SERVICE MANUAL that what I posted 2 threads above shows that the black wires should all be on the right (5-8) as they are '-ve' wires. The only problem is that they are then liable in a world full of lawsuits.
My advise if you are half decent at doing things is if they refuse to fix it ask them nicely if you can borrow theyre radio & pin removal tools for a couple of minutes and do it in their car park, or on the street if they are worried that they may still be laible. 


[Modified by UKAUSSI, 8:45 AM 4-20-2002]


----------



## a-hole ronald (Mar 14, 2002)

Well, after seeing the bungled TSB, I dropped my "why should I fix their mistake" viewpoint and just did the freakin' swap myself. I didn't feel like waiting around for them to release a TSB for the TSB, you know?







Anyway, took me all of 10 minutes and my oh my it sounds sooooo much better! There's bass in places I didn't know bass existed!




























(one of those is a Foster's) to all for figuring this out!


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (a-hole ronald)*






























I was at the dealer yesterday and they looked at the TSB and inisisted that my wiring was correct even though it sounded bad. I didn't read the latest posts here, otherwise I would have insisted they read the manual. I didn't occur to me. They supposedly had a call into Tech Service at VWoA to see what they say, but I haven't heard back. I live over an hour away and I think I will try the fix myself. They wouldn't even attempt the switch for fear it would "blow" the HU. 
I think they rushed into this TSB without thoroughly investigating the setup and we are the guinea pigs!


[Modified by MaryP, 10:51 PM 4-20-2002]


----------



## Spamjohnson (Sep 17, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

Well, I bit the bullet and did the repair myself, sounds great, can hear passages on some of my CD's I've never heard before. When I got back after road testing it, in my mailbox appeared the new VW JDpowers questionare. Filled it in, and mentioned this problem and VW's mis info on the repair. Hope that helps. Monday I'll go back to the dealer and bring a CD in, invite the sales/repair staff out for a listen in mine, and one of theirs, see if they can figure out the difference. (Bitter, me?)
Sam '02TDIWagon Pizzycorners,SennaEuroswitch,UKAussiMonsoon


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## nambraf (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

A few days ago, I made the service guy change the wires, even though he insisted they were right according to the TSB. Of course it sounded much better, but there is still a definite problem with more bass and general power coming from the right front, than the left front. I just came back from a 120 mile trip with a friend, and we tested it every conceivable way, and there is definitely still a problem. If I don't shift the balance towards the left, I basically hear mostly right.
Anyone else experience this after having the wires changed? Any suggestions?
Thanks.



[Modified by nambraf, 1:56 AM 4-22-2002]


----------



## e_andree (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nambraf)*

Im glad I ran across this post....this LONG post. I have noticed this on my 2002 also, and will probably take it in tomorrow to get fixed. Im confident I wont run into a problem with my VW guys.....


----------



## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (e_andree)*

Ok so If I call up my dealer (unther VW in Coconut Creek) and If I tell them that I need to come in because of the Monsoon problem, there not going to be like, what problem....we havent heard of anything. Also my front right speaker is blown out! Urrrggggghhhh Im thinking of just upgrading my speakers and keeping the same head unit. What do you guys think.


----------



## e_andree (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

If i wanted to put a single din cd player in, id just have to get a a kit to close up the area around it, correct?


----------



## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Ok so If I call up my dealer (unther VW in Coconut Creek) and If I tell them that I need to come in because of the Monsoon problem, there not going to be like, what problem....we havent heard of anything. Also my front right speaker is blown out! Urrrggggghhhh Im thinking of just upgrading my speakers and keeping the same head unit. What do you guys think.[HR][/HR]​They should know about the problem by now, but unfortunately, if they compare the radio to the bulletin, they might say that it IS wired correctly (which is not true). I would blame that blown right speaker of yours to this Monsoon wiring issue. That speaker is the same speaker that was receiving all of the bass up at the front. You might want to wait until this is cleared up and a correct bulletin is issued, tell them to fix it and then have them replace that speaker.


----------



## Anton_box (Sep 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

everyone and there dog has posted in here so i thought i would to


----------



## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Anton_box)*

I have another question. Since I am deciding not to take my car to the dealer for this "FIX" Im going to do it my self. But what I was wondering was, can I add new aftermarket component speakers to my current Monsoon Double Din HU? Because I would rather upgrade my speakers than have to take the dealers crap and go about replacing the blown speaker.. 


[Modified by quailallstar, 8:13 AM 4-22-2002]


----------



## Dashbrd Confessional (Mar 19, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

I have a '02 1.8T Jetta. As far as I can gather, the mod CAN NOT be done on the amp end because of the housing that the amp is in. GTIs on the other hand don't have this housing.
Soo I started to make those "tools" from sheet aluminum and quickly found out that aluminum is too thin and bent too easily. So I used some harder kind of metal.. only needed 2 tools (did one side, then the other). By the way, if you have the tools in properly, there will be no doubt as to weather your doing it right or not, because the HU will slip out VERY easily. When you put the tools in, you will know if it is in place or not because you will feel a click.
Once the HU was out, I squeezed the black tab and pulled out the plug housing very easily. 
Getting the brown plug unit out was a bit confusing based on UKAUSSIE's instructions, because I didn't realize where the top retaining clip was. Once I found it, I needed to jam one screwdriver into the top clip and leave it in there while I stuck another screwdriver in the botom one. Once they were both in, the brown unit just pushed out.
The next step I screwed up on. The little pink pin that's supposed to get pushed out got pushed too hard and flew into the open hole where my HU was, falling into the depths of my car's console. Soooo I couldn't really figure how I needed that piece and said F**k it. 
The next step is easy if you know how to do it. I used 2 paper clips (bent them open once so I had a piece sticking out) and slid each one on either side of the bottom of the wire socket. (see picture in UKAUSSIE's instruction post). Like the edit says, push the wire down first, then pull the wire out. It's as simple as that. Got the wire out on my first try. Make the switch and put everything back. Just be careful when your removing that pink piece.
Before the switch I had very muddy sounds and unclear bass. Also when the mid and treble were turned up it would get TOO tinny and when putting the volume up past a certain point, there would be distortion which would soon lead to the destruction of my speakers. After I did the switch it is almost perfect. I just have to test out some different songs. Definitely an improvement. FYI: I have never done a mod on a stereo myself before..always brought it to stereo shops.. and it was VERY easy. Overall it took me about a half hour but only because I was running from my garage up to the computer to see the color instructions.
Someone let me know if this pink pin is OK to have lost.
By the way, if anyone needs this mod/fix done in the North NJ area, I'd be happy to do it.
[Modified by Dashbrd Confessional, 5:37 PM 4-22-2002]


[Modified by Dashbrd Confessional, 6:07 PM 4-22-2002]


----------



## UPSCWRU (Jan 31, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

quote:[HR][/HR]can anyone confirm this??? isnt this a SERIOUS problem??? my jetta 2002 doesnt honk also (all i get is a flash on the lights but thats what the manual saids also, nothing about the honk going off)???[HR][/HR]​I read my manual this weekend (brand new car and I'm a geek) - apparently the horn only works when the key is in the ignition. Or when the car's on. One or the other. Try that. I remember that one because my bf said that this way if you lock the kids in the car, they can't honk the horn for help...
I've just picked up my 2002 Jetta and the stereo sounds bad even to my non-audiophile ears (I just got out of a 2000 Passat with the single-Din Monsoon). I'm debating whether to truck on down to the dealer again (3rd trip in a week? 50 miles...) or see if one of the local dealers I didn't buy from would help me out.
Hilary


----------



## Vortech347 (Apr 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UPSCWRU)*

Well now I need to go check my wife's car. We took it in last Friday to have them look at it. I couldn't go with my wife so I armed her with the pics from UKAUSSIE's post. The sales rep said they had the pics and knew about the TSB.
When my wife got the car back they said there was nothing wrong with it and the wiring was correct. Of course we didn't know about the TSB being wrong. 
I don't know if it is just our dealer or all dealers but they sure do have a superior attitude. They act like they are a BMW or Mercedes dealership with how they talk down and are smug about the great VW's that they sell. THEIR VW'S FOR GOD'S SAKE. The sales rep even asked us what kind of cd's we were playing as if to imply it was the media that might be the problem. If this is how VW handles problems then this will be the last VW we buy.
Oh yeah, and the service writer gave me and my wife a lecture when we tried to purchase the removal tools. Said we could screw up the diagnostics if we put in a aftermarket HU and he was trying to protect us since the car was new and under warranty. I quickly reminded him that it was my car and I could take care of myself.
Man I hate it when someone talks down to me.
If anyone in Central Texas is considering a new VW send me an e-mail and I will be glad to tell you which dealer not to buy from.


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UPSCWRU)*

thanks hilary for the update ... i took my car to the dealer to get the honk fix n to swap the wires but ended up with a new HU instead ... the sound still stinks but the honk is working now ... can anyone confirm whether their 2002 jetta honks when they arm the alarm??? in any case, im still debating whether to put in a my new pioneer mp3 HU ... i been told that the arming mechanism is attached to the factory HU (can any confirm again???) ... in addition, i also heard that the dealer wont be able to run their diagnostic on the car without the factory HU??? i cant believe im the only person who thought of replacing his/her HU ... what was VW thinking???quote:[HR][/HR]can anyone confirm this??? isnt this a SERIOUS problem??? my jetta 2002 doesnt honk also (all i get is a flash on the lights but thats what the manual saids also, nothing about the honk going off)???
I read my manual this weekend (brand new car and I'm a geek) - apparently the horn only works when the key is in the ignition. Or when the car's on. One or the other. Try that. I remember that one because my bf said that this way if you lock the kids in the car, they can't honk the horn for help...
I've just picked up my 2002 Jetta and the stereo sounds bad even to my non-audiophile ears (I just got out of a 2000 Passat with the single-Din Monsoon). I'm debating whether to truck on down to the dealer again (3rd trip in a week? 50 miles...) or see if one of the local dealers I didn't buy from would help me out.
Hilary[HR][/HR]​


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

Ok I took out my Double Din Monsoon that's in my 2002 Passat. I pulled it out praying to god this S&%^ was not incorectly wired! And to much avail, its perfect. All the dark ones are on the right, and the yellow wire is in slot 3. Also the brown wires that are shown in this topic arent brown on my car, there red..oddd, but everything seems to be in its correct place. I didint bother to even ask anyone if they had Passats, but since It had to do with the DD Monsoon I was curius as to why I had blow two right speakers and my car is 3 months old. So I took apart both doors, and there not blown. I figured it out, all that damn music I listen to. Some sounds better than others.. I guess my car doesent like Dance, Techo, and Rave music because it sounds like carap and the speakers rattle with the slightest bass.. but when I crank up the ghetto stuff it does fine with the bass. Wierd huh? I hope you guys all have your Crapsoon problems fixed! And just incase VW surfs the Vortex *Your radios could still use more Ummpphh, for what you charge we schould get more!*








Thanks for all of your help, all of you. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif








Have a cold one on me.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Spamjohnson)*

As a Passat owner, I can tell you that the Monsoon problem exists for us also...lack of bass on the left side which creates the impression of excessive upper frequency energy. Anyway....the wiring is a bit different for us....the wires that are black for you are brown for us and they are all on the same side of the brown plug. This would seem to indicate that the wiring is correct but I know we are experiencing the same sound problems you Jetta/Golf owners are experiencing. Any ideas on how to tackle this with my dealer? I've already taken it in and they saw that the TSA did not match what they were seeing (i.e., black wires colored brown in Passats). I verified this....pulling the unit out and seeing for myself.
The sound is horrible....switching to aftermarket will do no good since the wiring is messed up....guess I could always cut the wires to the little tweeters which cuts some of the offensive sound out.


[Modified by DanoP, 11:00 PM 4-22-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Check wiring at AMP end and also pull AMP out and make sure it says PASSAT on it. 
I think it is on a small white sticker but not certain


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## 2002Bora (Jan 2, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Anton_box)*

quote:[HR][/HR]everyone and there dog has posted in here so i thought i would to[HR][/HR]​Not everyone! I have not posted yet... Well, I guess I just did








Anyway, I sure hope they get this problem fixed at the factory before my car is built


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

for real? Ohh damn.. do I follow the same wiring diagram as I did on the radio ? And the monsoon "amp" cross over I say.. anyway its a bitch to get to, its surounded by metal cubby hole that is bulted to the uper body of the car!!! urggghh Im gonna go check right now, since its still daylight.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

As it is a Passat I don't have any wiring info - sorry


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

ok we are cool. The amp wires dont say anything but (107) with a white sticker around all the cables with that black covering they bundle them with. I unpluged both connectors, the green one and the other one.. I looked for the yellow 3 and it was pink, but none of the colors match up with the head unit..and theres a ton of wires. about 30 something.. Seems to be working well. (if somethings not broke, dont fix it!) im leaving it at that.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

My experience so far has been that the wiring was switched at the HU per my request even with the wrong TSB telling the dealer not to do it...
Then I noticed something when comparing it to another monsoon on the lot...
The FADE, and BALANCE did not work like the other monsoon...
The fade cut out the front left speaker(right possibly) at 10oclock...
The balance did immediate switching of speaker balance...
The new monsoon in the other car fade worked all the way to 6oclock
The new monsoon balance had a delayed phazing deal going on...
I would have never noticed this if I did not have another car to test it out on.
Im wondering if the wrong wiring perhaps blew out the HU's abilities in these respects, or if the unit is just defective...Anyone else test these things on thier units and what are the results?
I am getting a new HU this thursday to see...and we are going to test the wiring out and I am informing them of the wrong TSB ect...


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## Vortech347 (Apr 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

Well I checked my wife's radio when I got home tonight and sure enough it was wired wrong. The dealer just blindly followed the tsb. They didn't want to look at the pics that UKAUSSIE took because they had the "official" pictures from VW. Pompous jerks. 
After the switch the highs are definitely clearer but I am still not impressed with the sound quality. It is definitely better than before though.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (quailallstar)*

None of the wires match in the Passat eh?.....what a frickin mess. I went to my dealer today and sat in a Passat, turned on the radio and the sound seemed fine...in contrast to nastiness I'm hearing in my car. Since there is no accurate TSA for the Passat, I'm practically left with no option except going aftermarket....a new head unit and a complete rewiring.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]None of the wires match in the Passat eh?.....what a frickin mess. I went to my dealer today and sat in a Passat, turned on the radio and the sound seemed fine...in contrast to nastiness I'm hearing in my car. Since there is no accurate TSA for the Passat, I'm practically left with no option except going aftermarket....a new head unit and a complete rewiring.







[HR][/HR]​If your system sounds bad compared to another, will they not honor the warranty and do something about it? Some of the other members have been able to get new HU, even before the TSB was put out.


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## quailallstar (Dec 2, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

NO, the wires in my Passat are OK. The radio sounds great, Im just picky and would like more bass, but the radio does its job.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]The FADE, and BALANCE did not work like the other monsoon...Anyone else test these things on thier units and what are the results?[HR][/HR]​i posted this comment in this thread back on 4/3/02:
ah, that brings me to another observation about the double-din. on my single-din, there's a scale that tells you how far to the rear you've faded the speakers. it's not until i hit approx 7/9 that the sound of the system deteriorates considerably, but i'm thinking that's basically right since no audio system is going to sound good when you're pushing the entire signal spectrum primarily through your sub-woofers. on the double-din, the system seems to fade to the sub-woofers very quickly - what seems like it would be 3/9 on the single-din, so the sound of the system deteriorates much quicker.


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## bruno_monk (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

Thanx to everyone on this thread! Problem is fixed!!
My 2k2 VR6 Jetta Wagon had poor sound from the getgo: it's only 1.5 months old.
Here is my dealer experience:
In the Los Angeles area I've got 7 VW dealers to choose from. I called 3 of them and got the regular party line: "never heard of the problem" "we'll give you a service appointment" "must leave your car here at least one day" "we don't offer a ride to your work."
Then I spoke to the Glendale, CA Internet sales manager about the problem. I called him becuase I had previously talked to him about buying a car and we had talked about the change from single to double-din and that he was not happy with the resultant sound.
Turns out that if you get someone at the dealer who drives the same car as you do, and has been annoyed with the poor sound quality too, then you are more less likely to get "the party line" about getting an "appointment" to 'perform diagnostics' on it and _maybe_ fix it.
Anyway, I stopped by the dealer this morning and this kind soul personally took me over to the service bays, talked a mechanic (who also drove the same model/year as me) into borrowing the HU keys, talked a passing parts guy (who _also_ had a 2002 jetta) into bringing along a pin-tool, and we had one big wire-swapping party in the service lot!
The difference in sound quality was substantial. 
As an additional step in the wire-swap, though, there was some sort of red/orange plastic locking pin which seemed to hold the metal contacts/pins in place. This had to be removed using a small flat-headed screwdriver (borrowed from yet another service dept. person who hung around for the wire-swap). 
The point of this ramble? 
1. the wire switch _does_ make a difference
2. good dealer experiences like the one I had today renew my faith in humanity!
Thanks again: I'll be reading vwvortex happily ever after!


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
The stories of incompetence and deceit exhibited by many of the VW dealers and service staff in dealing with these crossed wires is astounding to me. As a brand new VW owner, I'm a more than a little bit scared by this. The service manager from Gunther VW in Coconut Creek, FL never even returned my phone call regarding this issue. It didn't matter anyway...after reading this whole thread I decided it was _much_ safer if I did it myself.
What happens if the dealer has to fix something that is much more critical, like the brakes, engine or perhaps the airbags? Shoot, I wonder if the airbags are even wired correctly?? Who really knows? Anyone care to test???







[HR][/HR]​I retract my harsh criticism of the dealers in light of the fact that the TSB is incorrect. But whoever created and approved the TSB should stop getting high before going to work.



[Modified by rocketweb, 1:56 PM 4-24-2002]


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## Vortech347 (Apr 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

As a follow up to my experience, I drove my wife's car to work today. This is the first time I have gotten to listen to the improved sound since I did the wire swap 2 days ago. 
While the sound quality is still not up to good aftermarket standards it is substantially better than before. It is clearer and you can hear the left side now. I am going to add a subwoofer to be able to turn the bass down at the deck. That way the components will sound better. I am even considering putting in a 50hz cap on the separates so they won't even have to reproduce those notes.
What do you guys think?


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

With my Passat, all the black wires on the brown plug are brown....so when I brought my car in, they exchanged the yellow and brown wire on the harness....still the problem persists. No bass on the left side. My service department appears to be cooperative as I'm taking the Passat in at lunch tomorrow to replace the HU. I don't expect this to work but might as well try. No other VW service announcement to the best of my/dealer's knowledge. Well, I'm gonna take a positive outlook on this. If this fails, I'll buy an aftermarket HU (possibly XM radio) with the features I want....like a parametric EQ. Then I'll have them rewire the whole thing and use the deck's own amplifier for the speakers. Then I should be satisfied....I hope.
What would I do with my old HU? Either take it out to the firing range and shoot it to bits with my 9mm Glock.....or sell it on Ebay.










[Modified by DanoP, 2:24 AM 4-25-2002]


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## nambraf (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

I had the same problem after I switched the wires. Let me know what happens.


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## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nambraf)*

I've been following this since page 3, having noticed then that it sounded like a phase problem. Well, tonight I traded my '01 Passat with single din Monsoon for an early '02 Jetta TDI with SINGLE din Monsoon. I was sure I'd hear the same good sound -- but no, this HU lacks the clarity and separation and really good spatial qualities of my Passat Monsoon. Now, I am really stumped because I should have the old setup that had no problems, but it really sounds inferior. As in the DDin, the right front speaker is overpowering and brittle sounding and the spatial quality is lacking. ANY IDEAS? Anyone having '02 single din problems?


[Modified by HeyJude, 2:10 PM 4-25-2002]


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (HeyJude)*

I just came back from the dealership, the New HU did not fix any of my problems, which I didn't expect it to...(fade cutout at 10oclock and instant balance when it should be a delayed harmonics thing)
But from hearing the other monsoon on the lot, it sounded alot fuller, and had no issues with balance, and fade. So, how could this have happened selectively like this?
could there be some kinda miswire other than the afformentioned fix here?
Currently waiting for the dealership manager to call me back with 'word from volkswagen' as to clarification on all the issues, the wiring fix(which he says the other guys shouldn't have changed *chuckle*, and the fade balance issues)


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

I also visited my dealer today and three service guys sat in the car with me. I put on a CD and then moved the balance control left and right. They all acknowledged the fact that bass is missing from the left side....new HU plugged in and no joy (and I didn't expect it to work). Wiring fix per service announcement also did no good, though, as I have pointed out, the wire colors are a bit different in the Passat.
They tell me a VW representative will be in town next Tuesday (unfortunately I'll be out of town) and they will bring up the issue with him. The important thing is that they all aknowledged the problem so I would expect either a solution or some compensation (whatever the value of the sound system).
Even when listening to the right side only, I really don't like this system. I could live with it, though not happily. There is still too much push in the high end. I don't want a system that sounds 'crisp' or 'clear' or any other code word for too much high frequency emphasis. It would be nice if these audio designers attended a real acoustic concert sometime....I do all the time. And Monsoon sounds nothing like real music or voices of real people.



[Modified by DanoP, 11:42 PM 4-25-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

They should try replacing the Monsoon AMP


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

I JUST DID THE FIX! 

It sounds 100% better. Oto and others with no results, there MUST be something else going on. Mine is remakably better. I didn't realize how bad it was before.
And on a side note, for those that are worried about doing the job yourselves---it was a piece of cake thanks to UKAUSSI! So, it took me 35 minutes instead of 10---I am a girl after all, huh?!!!! LOL


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

My problem is a little more than just the poor left side audio, but it may be related, thats why I wanted people to check thier fade, and balance, to see if they experienced the things I am...ie balance is instanenous, and the fade cuts out the front speakers at 10oclock...
BUT...
I had the fix done, and actually, yes, it sounds the same as it did before I had it done. The manager said the techs shouldn't have switched the wires for me cuz of the TSB, but I believe the wires are still in the correct slot anyway.
MY problem though is a bit different. My fade doesn't work correctly, nor does my balance controls...
My one peeve is that the dealership doesn't seem to do the things that seem logical to me, step by step elimination of what the problem could be related to...
I woulda first...got a car that worked correctly, got a car that didn't, made sound checks, ect, switched the radios, to see if one radio was the cause or the other, if they did the same thing in the respective cars independant of the radio, then id be looking to wiring, if they went with the radio, then id be looking at the radio.
Then, if it was wiring, id be looking at the TSb, and trying it in both positions with both cars and eliminate some things that way, then if things didn't pan out there, id be looking at the amp and trying to eliminate that as a possibility...
but they haven't done such a thing, nor have any inclination other than to look at the TSB, and go 'tsk tsk, says here this is what it should be' and 'im gonna wait for a call from VW to clarify this stuff' or 'the service manual may have the correct diagram but it may have changed after they put out the car so it might be incorrect' BAH!
I am gonna give the dood one more shot, and then im gonna go into 'now im pissed off' voice...


[Modified by oto, 2:30 AM 4-26-2002]


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

Oto, Forgive me, but I don't remember.....have you seen the wiring yourself? Are you sure the correct wires were switched? There have been so many posts at this point that I don't remember who has done what! Anyway, if you are relying on your dealer---I wouldn't. I would pull the system yourself and compare it to the wiring diagrams in the Bently Manual. Maybe some of the other wires are out of wack?????


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

After the first visit I requested to look at the wiring before and after they did things. Today when I went in for the third visit, I saw the wires as they pulled the HU out, and they were indeed in the correct (not compared to TSB of course) positions. 
So I trust them to have done what they said they did...as for the manager, he seemed to scare the people I dealt with, the tech kept saying 'I can't do anything without his say so'


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## Bikoman (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

I did the wire switch a couple of weeks ago and the stereo sounds much better, but I have noticed that the entire left side is still weaker than the right side. I am assuming the output from the HU (I have not checked it yet), pre amp, is all balanced. So, I am thinking the amp is the cause, does anyone have a wiring diagram of the amp? I was going to check outputs from the amp to all speakers to make sure they are the same in respect to each other. I will also do the same at the HU.


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## reflex2002gti (Feb 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Thanks for all that contributed to this forum. I Actually I did the mod myself and with the diagram it was really simple. I have one question though. When I reconnected the power to the radio, it never asked for the anti-theft code. It just worked right away. Is that normal? I thought it was supposed to go to "SAFE" mode once you took the power off (this is what I assume happened when I pulled the plug from the back). I just want to be sure the anti-theft function is ok.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (reflex2002gti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks for all that contributed to this forum. I Actually I did the mod myself and with the diagram it was really simple. I have one question though. When I reconnected the power to the radio, it never asked for the anti-theft code. It just worked right away. Is that normal? I thought it was supposed to go to "SAFE" mode once you took the power off (this is what I assume happened when I pulled the plug from the back). I just want to be sure the anti-theft function is ok.







[HR][/HR]​I was wondering the same exact thing! Mine didn't ask me for a code....maybe it has to be unplugged for a certain period of time? (mine was only unplugged for 10 minutes)


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## ViperRT (Apr 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, follow up then rewire post procedure*

I just completed a wire-connector swap (no cutting) on the amp side.
Now I too notice a static/crackling in the sound. most notably at low volumes, and definitely when adjusting the volume.
I'm almost positive this wasn't there before the re-wire.
I'm tempted to re-wire back, take it to the dealer (again, the first time they wouldn't acknowledge the issue) and beat it into them.
anyone else experience the crackling/static?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, follow up then rewire post procedure (ViperRT)*

Radio code isn't turned on by default, you have to activate it yourself.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (reflex2002gti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks for all that contributed to this forum. I Actually I did the mod myself and with the diagram it was really simple. I have one question though. When I reconnected the power to the radio, it never asked for the anti-theft code. It just worked right away. Is that normal? I thought it was supposed to go to "SAFE" mode once you took the power off (this is what I assume happened when I pulled the plug from the back). I just want to be sure the anti-theft function is ok.







[HR][/HR]​I'm thinking either the HU has to be out longer, or the antenna has to be unplugged for it to go into "Safe Mode". My car still honks when I lock it and I was not asked for the code when I plugged the HU back in. If your car is not giving you the honk when you remote lock, then you may not have the HU pushed all the way in.


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## reflex2002gti (Feb 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, follow up then rewire post procedure (UKAUSSI)*

I see UKAUSSI's response above. So how do you turn on the code? (I don't have the manual in front of me, bummer).










[Modified by reflex2002gti, 9:48 PM 4-26-2002]


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## wr4269 (Apr 26, 2002)

*You might try this...*

Here's an experiment, particularly for Oto, and anyone else who still isn't quite satisfied.
Bear with me a little as I ramble.
Note: This experiment should be done with the wiring as it came from the factory. 
UKAussie's wiring change has, I think, a similar but not completely equivalent result, and you wouldn't want to do things twice.
A few things to think about, first:
Monsoon says the goal is a "3D audio" image. I expect 3D to mean near-far as well as right-left imaging. I also expect to hear the music, not the speakers.
This isn't a "front-seat/back-seat" system; all 8 speakers are (theoretically at least) designed to work as a unit, not as four fronts and four rears. There probably aren't very many pleasing ways to balance 8 speakers, but there probably is at least one way.
Something interesting happens at around the 10 o'clock position on the fader control on Oto's and my system.
As you sit in the drivers seat, there's a tweeter less than 10 inches from your left ear, and even though it isn't firing directly at you, it is the closest. If the audio image is too far to the right, and if all 8 speakers are supposed to be working together, this tweeter, at least, isn't pulling its weight. And if it isn't doing anything for your left ear, it isn't helping anyone else, either.
Accurately reproduced music is "tizzy", or "boomy" only if the artist intended it to be. It should have everything the artist intended, though. I want to hear Jennifer Warnes breathe on "The Hunter". Kick drums ought to punch me in the chest as Merle Haggard sings his greatest hits. Copeland's tympani on"Fanfare for the Common Man" should warm my soul. And listening to Wynton Marsalis or Chuck Mangione play the horn ought to be as fun as pourin' fresh cream.
Now for the experiment. Center all controls--bass, mid, treble, balance, fader. Put on some music that is imaged well, perhaps a solo singer, near center stage, maybe with one guitar, a bass, drums, keyboard. You pick, but keep it simple, and something you know. 
Turn JUST THE FADER, counterclockwise. Keep going toward that 10 o'clock interesting area. Listen ONLY for right-left balance. Oto's impression that the front speakers cut out at some point describes the sound change well. It's ok, let it happen. Stop just after it happens, turn up the volume a bit and listen to the right-left balance. If it's not quite centered, turn the fader control just a TINY BIT front or back until it is.
Now go away and take a nap, have your favorite liquid libation, or something more fun. Try to forget everything you've heard from this system. I know, I know...try anyway.
When you come back, don't touch the controls, just play that simple music again. Turn up the volume. After a bit, make sure the image is centered right/left by using the fader only. Small moves here...really small moves...of the fader control to adjust the image. Don't touch that balance control! (Oh, and by the way...you do have all the doors shut and the windows up while you're tweaking, right?)
Resist the urge to push the image forward. Leave it where it is for awhile. Listen for the things that are important to you. Try some other music. Don't be afraid to turn it up. Don't be surprised if it feels like the image is just a little behind you...remember, it's been up-front and in-your-face-harsh for quite awhile.
Something to note...with the fader adjusted this way, the front speakers are not completely off, just lower in volume than they were before. To confirm this, open the drivers door, and listen away from the rest. They're quieter, but they aren't whisperin'.
Hmm......


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## tchockygti (Mar 21, 2002)

*Re: You might try this... (wr4269)*

I did the wire switch and I noticed that as I turn the fader CCW, the left front tweeter cuts out completely at the 10:00 position. I keep the fader at about the 11:00 position cos it "feels" to loud in front. Left front bass is a little weaker than right front, but it isn't noticeable when balance is centered.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: You might try this... (tchockygti)*

ok, i've got the 02 golf back with a new hu and the wiring swap and while it's certainly better it's not good. i've got an 02 passat with the single-din and i had an 00 gti with the single-din before that. my gf used to drive an 00 golf with the single-din before we got her the new 02 golf we just got the new hu for. my point being, i've heard the single-din in a gti, a golf, and now in my 02 passat, and the dd is poor in comparison. 
some notes and observations culled from my experience with the dd in our 02 golf:
* as a handful of other people have also noted, the fader on the dd kicks almost completely to the rear at around 10 o'clock. just for perspective, i can dial my single-din to what would be approx. 7 o'clock on the dd and i still get full response from the entire system. i've also noticed that on my dd, i get a little static at the 10 o'clock position which coincides with the front speakers all but dropping out of the mix and the rear speakers putting out a weak muffled low end only mix.
* even while the hu was completely out of my gf's 02 golf, the horn honked upon locking.
* having the hu disconnected for almost 3 weeks didn't require inputting a code when i put the hu back in.
* i'm not happy with having paid extra $ for this radio.
other random musings:
* the single-din radio coding had vehicle specific codes, while the dd doesn't. maybe the monsoon folks designed different mixes and vw lost them?
* i wonder if the wiring swap is doing exactly the same thing whether done at the hu or the amp. i don't know enough about this stuff, but i keep wondering if the wiring swap could create different results when done at the hu vs. the amp.
isn't there a "scientific" regimen that someone can put the dd through? test all the wires at the amp, test all the wires at the harness, test the speakers, etc.? i wish i knew more about this stuff.


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## JDea (Apr 22, 2002)

*Re: You might try this... (amgvw)*

If you switch the wiring from the amp instead of from the headunit, is there any difference or do both methods produce the same result? How about the rear speaker quality after the wire swapping... eveyone seems to say that it's still crap...but is the difference after rewiring that much greater so that the bad quality of the rear speakers is overshadowed?















Btw, it's an 02 GTI 1.8T.


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## VW Bobby (Sep 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Aha! You have discovered the beauty of the new Monsoon software! As long as your double-DIN unit is plugged into the same car, the radio recognizes that it is plugged into its home. The control modules do indeed talk to eachother.
This makes servicing the radio system much simpler.
Don't worry, your theft protection does indeed work...just don't plug your radio into a friend's car. To do this operation, the manual code entry is required.
quote:[HR][/HR]Thanks for all that contributed to this forum. I Actually I did the mod myself and with the diagram it was really simple. I have one question though. When I reconnected the power to the radio, it never asked for the anti-theft code. It just worked right away. Is that normal? I thought it was supposed to go to "SAFE" mode once you took the power off (this is what I assume happened when I pulled the plug from the back). I just want to be sure the anti-theft function is ok.








I was wondering the same exact thing! Mine didn't ask me for a code....maybe it has to be unplugged for a certain period of time? (mine was only unplugged for 10 minutes)
[HR][/HR]​


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## daveg243 (Feb 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (VW Bobby)*

Tried the fix on my dd radio (2002 GTI) except there were brown and white striped wires, not black, so I changed nothing. I have the dd monsoon premium radio but didn't upgrade to the monsoon system(no amp). Does the fix still apply. Oh yeah...a week after unplugging the dd the radio died on me(no power/ no lights) after parking the car and returning a short while later. I just unplugged it again and replugged it in and viola, it works again. This ever happen to anyone?By the way it didn't ask for the security code either time nor was the fuse blown on the radio.


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## Jawilbur (Apr 27, 2002)

*Re: What do we want?*

First, thank you for all the information.
I picked up my 2002 Passat Wagon last Saturday and noticed on the way home that I wasn't getting any treble from the rear speakers (I didn't notice anything else yet).
I called the dealer and they ordered replacement tweeters (I was skeptical--two bad tweeters?), but last night, before going back, I read this thread and realized that the problem was much worse.
On my way back to the dealer this morning, I found all the other problems people had noticed. I showed the dealer the TSB and all the diagrams. The dealer wanted to look into the problem further before he attempted a fix.
Here's the question: ultimately, what do I want out of this? Does the "fix" get the Monsoon working the way it is supposed to work? 
Assuming that the dealer really wants to help me, what should he do?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (Jawilbur)*

Just a quick clarification for those joining late:-
Contrary to what the TSB says it does NOT apply to ALL 2002, it ONLY applies to GOLF/JETTA with the MONSOON. This is the upgrade on the D-DIN radio and includes a special AMP and upgraded speakers. The wiring harness is different if you just have the D-Din (Premium VI) HU

PASSAT OWNERS (2001.5&gt







- 
This does NOT apply to your vehicles as it is a problem with the the Golf/Jetta harness when the changed it for to the "Premium VI" (D-Din) HU. It is possible that there may also be a different problem with the Passat harness or coding of the radio but nobody has posted any info on the wiring on their harness plug.
GOLF/JETTA NON-MONSOON - 
If you do not have the "Monsoon" system and just have the "Premium VI" D-Din HU then you _*MAY*_ also have a wiring problem as shown on Dani's 2002 GTI http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=285496 Her RR speaker wires appeared to also be swapped.
Here are the pics from the thread (Dani, let me know if this is not OK)

















I hope this help people who joined late and maybe those not affected could find something else on their cars


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (Jawilbur)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Here's the question: ultimately, what do I want out of this?[HR][/HR]​that's a good question. personally, what i want is a stereo system that sounds as good as the system in my current vw and as good as the systems in my previous 2 vws.
quote:[HR][/HR]Does the "fix" get the Monsoon working the way it is supposed to work?[HR][/HR]​imo - no, the fix does not get the monsoon working the way it is supposed to work - or at least the way i think it *ought* to work. case in point, even post-swap, many of us are still unhappy with the sound and a few of us are reporting goofy fader control behavior as well as other problems.
quote:[HR][/HR]Assuming that the dealer really wants to help me, what should he do?[HR][/HR]​another good question. i'm stuck on this as well as i think i've tapped out what my dealer is willing to do for me - which included making the wiring swap and putting in a new hu (which was due to their ruining the first one, but still). the bottom line is, the stereo still does not sound good. 
i guess what i'm thinking now is that i'd like to have the monsoon package removed from the car and have my $325 refunded. i doubt that will happen, but if it does, i'm going to spend the money on an aftermarket system - something i've never felt was necessary with the previous monsoon system.


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## daveg243 (Feb 28, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (UKAUSSI)*

Thanks for the link and the response UK! That really helped me out.


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## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (UKAUSSI)*

The TSB as written for all 2002's may be more correct than we know. My brand new early '02 Jetta GLS w/S-Din monsoon has the same crappy sound problems. I know it shouldn't, but it does.
I realize the wiring harnesses are different, but there must be some explanation for the disappointing sound in my '02 S-din vs the great '01 S-din on my last car.
By the way, does anyone know how to remove the S-Din HU?


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (HeyJude)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I realize the wiring harnesses are different, but there must be some explanation for the disappointing sound in my '02 S-din vs the great '01 S-din on my last car.[HR][/HR]​have you ruled out your radio coding being set incorrectly? i believe an 02 jetta with monsoon and a cd changer should be 02043.
there's a special single-din removal tool that looks much different than the dd removal tool. if i remember correctly, the 2 single-din removal slots are vertically positioned on either side of the seek/track/tuning controls.
heyjude - i just caught this lonely post in the b5 forum, you should check it out: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zeropost?cmd=reply&id=2969303 



[Modified by amgvw, 9:34 AM 4-29-2002]


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## Zim (Apr 26, 1999)

*Re: What do we want? (HeyJude)*

This applies to the single-DIN non-monsoon in my 99 B5....
Find a hanging folder from a filing cabinet... remove the
2 long thin metal bars. Slip them in the slits along the side of
the radio, and you'll free the catches that hold the radio in.
Wow, and I thought we had it bad back in 99 when we had to put NB codes in








(over the protests of the VW techs)
Mike


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Amp*

Just got a call back from the manager at the dealership after the third visit to the dealership to try to fix this problem. He said he was calling VW to clarify issues ect...I didn't take the return call so I couldn't question him further, but they left message that they are ordering a new amp and will call when it gets in...
Anyone else getting this now, Or can someone try a new amp/check wiring ect on the amp and see...


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## e_andree (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: Amp (oto)*

I talked to the tech people over at Fitzmall, in Frederick....in regards to this problem with the Monsoon, they told me that its doesnt have to do so much with the Passat systems, but more for the Jettas and Beetles. He also told me that the problem has been circulating mostly on the internet...(haha), and that the wires are switched only on a few cars......so the problem isnt as widespread as it has been made out to be. 
This is what I was told my the VW techs...so.......(doesnt mean they are right though..lol)


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## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (amgvw)*

It's a good possibility the code is wrong because they added my CD changer at the last minute. Also, I stopped by the dealership today and the service manager is VERY familiar with the phase/wiring problem and knows the TSB is backwards. What a relief! Friday I take the car in to get it fixed (well...finger's crossed). 
So, wiring or code, I'll have it checked out soon. IF the wiring is the problem, I'll post a new thread, because there might be some other unlucky '02 S-Din owners out there.


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## FreeJay (Apr 29, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (UKAUSSI)*

Ok, 2002 Passat Monsoon D-DIN owners.... lend me your perfectly tuned ears... I noticed that something is amiss with the sound quality on my Passat (which I picked up Saturday)... couldn't put my finger on it, and I knew it was not just due to the poor sound stage... so being out of phase makes a great deal of sense... my question is....
Passat owners... have you performed the fix, and did you get better results... I ask because this TSB is now *only* for Jettas/Beetles?








Any insight would be greatly appreciated. By the way everyone, you all rock. I thought I was losing my mind.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (FreeJay)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Passat owners... have you performed the fix, and did you get better results... I ask because this TSB is now *only* for Jettas/Beetles?







[HR][/HR]​check the tsb posted here: http://mywebpages.20m.com/ 
reads: "Model(s): All with Monsoon Radio 2002"
hope that helps.


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## e_andree (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (amgvw)*

Thats the old TSB...dated March 28th.....a newer one was released in late April.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (e_andree)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thats the old TSB...dated March 28th.....a newer one was released in late April. [HR][/HR]​whoops, missed the new one. what was different about the new tsb from april? did it actually instruct the service folks properly as opposed to the one posted at the link above?
do you have a copy?


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
i guess what i'm thinking now is that i'd like to have the monsoon package removed from the car and have my $325 refunded. i doubt that will happen, but if it does, i'm going to spend the money on an aftermarket system - something i've never felt was necessary with the previous monsoon system.[HR][/HR]​I also did the 'fix' based on the service announcement posted here. I noticed the poor quality of the audio before I noticed the absence of bass on the left side. Also note that I didn't read anything on these boards prior to my impressions so my thoughts on Monsoon could not have been swayed by what I have read here.
Once the dealer made the wiring switch, I scrutinized the sound and noticed very clearly the lack of bass on the driver's side (as did three other service techs at my dealer). Did the wiring change make things worse? I don't know. My dealer was to have investigated this with a VW rep....I'll get back to him on the results of this on Thursday. If he has no resolution, I'll most definitely ask for a refund on the Monsoon system. The sevice people acknowledge the sound problem so I don't know how they can possibly refuse. I suspect they'll go for an amp change.....we'll see. I report what I find out tomorrow.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (DanoP)*

Re: above...
Well, thats what my dealer is doing, making the 'amp' switch when they get one in...
after a new HU didn't seem to be any different, and the wiring switch didn't seem to make any difference(to me) we shall see soons the new amp comes in...


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## rudyr (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (oto)*

Handed the TSB to my dealer when I went in for oil/brake fluid change. Anyway, needless to say I have the coolest dealer around, the head tech called me up and we BS'd about mods for a while, told him I was going the TT brakes this weekend, etc.
Anyway, back to the topic, when I asked whether or not my wiring needed to be reveresed, he said no. In fact, he said they've had a ton of people come in with the same TSB in hand and they've only had to swap the wires on 1 Jetta. According to him, it's not that widespread.
Normally, I'd say typical dealer being full of sh1t. However, they completly don't care about doing work and would fix it in a heartbeat if it was wired wrong.
Any thoughts?


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (rudyr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Handed the TSB to my dealer when I went in for oil/brake fluid change. Anyway, needless to say I have the coolest dealer around, the head tech called me up and we BS'd about mods for a while, told him I was going the TT brakes this weekend, etc.
Anyway, back to the topic, when I asked whether or not my wiring needed to be reveresed, he said no. In fact, he said they've had a ton of people come in with the same TSB in hand and they've only had to swap the wires on 1 Jetta. According to him, it's not that widespread.
Normally, I'd say typical dealer being full of sh1t. However, they completly don't care about doing work and would fix it in a heartbeat if it was wired wrong.
Any thoughts?[HR][/HR]​
Yeah....check it yourself. Takes 10 minutes!


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (rudyr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Handed the TSB to my dealer when I went in for oil/brake fluid change. Anyway, needless to say I have the coolest dealer around, the head tech called me up and we BS'd about mods for a while, told him I was going the TT brakes this weekend, etc.
Anyway, back to the topic, when I asked whether or not my wiring needed to be reveresed, he said no. In fact, he said they've had a ton of people come in with the same TSB in hand and they've only had to swap the wires on 1 Jetta. According to him, it's not that widespread.
Normally, I'd say typical dealer being full of sh1t. However, they completly don't care about doing work and would fix it in a heartbeat if it was wired wrong.
Any thoughts?[HR][/HR]​Chances are VERY high that they have the old, wrong TSB and the ONE Jetta they fixed was the only one that had correct wiring! Everybody that has checked on their own has found the incorrect wiring. Do yourself a favor---do it yourself!


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (e_andree)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thats the old TSB...dated March 28th.....a newer one was released in late April. [HR][/HR]​Anybody know about the new TSB? A link perhaps?


----------



## OrGaNiZeDKhaoZ (Feb 9, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (MaryP)*

~Bump~


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## M0 (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (OrGaNiZeDKhaoZ)*

I did the cable swap a couple weeks back,l I did notice the uneven bass prior to the fix. Once again *UKAUSSI* http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (M0)*

Just did the test and I have no bass on the left side. That is the problem, rght? So I too am affected in my new 2002 Jetta. Time for a trip to the dealer.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: MONSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON*

Well, With what was my FOURTH visit to the dealership...
I don't know why im being so patient, but I might even want this because its wasting thier time as well as mine, and they like to get paid for thier time...
They spoke with someone in 'detroit' who recommended an amp change.
Brought it in, they changed apparently both the amp and the HU, and then the service call was ended, they left it out side(kinda like they just wanted me to leave) and I checked it out, absolutely no change whatsoever to the sound quality, or the problems(fader cuts out instaneously at 10ish, if you raise volume to half you can hear some sounds from the front speakers if you put your ear to it) and the balance was still instant, not delayed and harmonic ect...It still sounds lower on the left when driving , its right heavy, but its still got left side sound, just I would say 3/4th to 2/3rd of the volume of the right. I can't really tell what kind of bass the system has, I don't notice any thumping as Im used to hearing in real base, but I feel the tonal quality of the base when turning up the bass level...theres some extra vibration from the bass, but I just don't feel the 'thump'...*ponders*
Ok, so the things are this...
They have looked at the wiring as of today, compared it to TSB(don't know what the new TSB is, and they don't know about it either), they changed out the HU, and the AMP, and everything is exactly the same...
SO, IF the wiring on 3 and 7 produces the same sound quality with with black in 7 and yellow in 7(ie they are switched back and forth to see sound quality), and both other components of the system(sans the speakers) have been swapped out for NEW ones(or so they tell me) Then, what could this possibly be...
The dealership manager seems content to just talk to the people in 'detroit' and not do any electrical diagnostics on thier own. Im wondering if I am just being too picky(I want what I paid for, and if I have heard the same system in another car sounding better and not having the quirks, then I want what it should be) Or should I keep bringing the thing back to them with each new 'try this' fix...
If I tell them 'wait till you get an absolute fix' then I could be waiting forever im sure...but if I keep bringing it in, either they are gonna say, we will call you when we have heard from someone, or they are gonna tell me they can't do anything for me, in which case, then I get pissed, and if they say we wait till hear(which is what the manager did today again) I still get pissed...
Arg...and I am not even a great audiophile of any sorts, but even I can hear the differences and quirks even with a just operated on ear, and a history of ear problems messing up my hearing *mumble*
Any suggestions as to what I should do from here? I am waiting for the service manager to call(he said a few days probly) after talking to the guys he talked to before...


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: MONSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON (oto)*

Very early in the threads it was stated that you should not do the change at the HU AND the Amp.......
IS there really a new TSB that is correct? Does anyone know????


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: MONSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON (MaryP)*

Hmm, I think you misunderstood...
They changed out The HU(new radio) and the AMP(new amp) 
not the wiring on both, they checked the wiring at the HU against the TSB...


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: MONSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON (oto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Hmm, I think you misunderstood...
[HR][/HR]​Yep, clear now! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I bet you are tired of this whole mess! 
Wish you were having a better outcome!


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: MONSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON (MaryP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I bet you are tired of this whole mess! 
Wish you were having a better outcome!







[HR][/HR]​we're all friggin' tired of this mess!!!
my mess started march 21st with the owner of the dealership trying to pull the hu using the wrong keys and finally "ended" on april 30th with the dealer coding the new hu correctly. so now i have a new hu with the correct wiring and i would describe the sound of my system much like oto did. 
the worst part of it is that i can sit in my driveway with the same cd playing in both my passat and the golf and hear exactly how bad the dd in the golf sounds.
the golf is getting ready to go in for its 5k and i think i'm going to see if i can get an ots sent to the dealership to listen to the radio and discuss the issue with me. then i think i'm going to press hard to get the amp removed and the hu recoded and $325 put back in my pocket.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (MaryP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Chances are VERY high that they have the old, wrong TSB and the ONE Jetta they fixed was the only one that had correct wiring! Everybody that has checked on their own has found the incorrect wiring. Do yourself a favor---do it yourself![HR][/HR]​maryp - in this post you reference the "old, wrong TSB", but in the very next post you're asking about a new one? i think it was e_andree that mentioned a new TSB in the first place, so...
is there a new TSB or what??????


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (amgvw)*

Went to the dealer today for the fix. The tsb was the same as posted but was wrong. They had black,black,yellow,black as being correct. The guy was getting ready to put the radio in when I went into the bay to check on it. I audibly let him hear the problem. So we switched the wires and sure enough, much better. Glad I went to check on it and they let me in the bay. The Service manager was very grateful for our assistance.
Thanks guys, you rule!


[Modified by Joe_R, 5:46 PM 5-4-2002]


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## DELISI (May 2, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif my o2 jetta has a monsoon and i am angry as well. It sounds muffled and also cracks on the mid/highs. put my name on the list.
[email protected]


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
maryp - in this post you reference the "old, wrong TSB", but in the very next post you're asking about a new one? i think it was e_andree that mentioned a new TSB in the first place, so...
is there a new TSB or what??????[HR][/HR]​I'm not sure if there is one or not, I was basing my info on what e_andree said. I'd like to know if there is a new one too!


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## e_andree (Nov 22, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (MaryP)*

Correct...apparently there is a newer one that narrows it down to certain jettas and beetles. I stopped by my dealership to ask about it.....


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: What do we want? (e_andree)*

Did you get to see the TSB? So, it narrows down the list; but does it now have the correct info? How can VW narrow the list if they don't even fully know the problem?












[Modified by MaryP, 2:22 PM 5-5-2002]


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (e_andree)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Correct...apparently there is a newer one that narrows it down to certain jettas and beetles. I stopped by my dealership to ask about it.....[HR][/HR]​so the dealer told you there was a new tsb? hmm, i'm not gonna believe it until i see it.
the problem most definitely involves the golf and the tech support for the southeast region confirmed that. i also find it hard to believe that vw would issue a new tsb and not correct it.


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## SoFlaTurbo (May 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

I went to my local dealer today, Gunther VW in Ft Lauderdale, FL. I had the tech. update posted in one of the messages on here and showed it to one of the service reps there, Enrique. After about an hour of debating it with the other tech gurus I was told the fix isn't VW authorized, and even though they heard the crappy bass coming out of the right side of my stereo, they stuck to their guns and wouldn't switch the wires.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (SoFlaTurbo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I went to my local dealer today, Gunther VW in Ft Lauderdale, FL. I had the tech. update posted in one of the messages on here and showed it to one of the service reps there, Enrique. After about an hour of debating it with the other tech gurus I was told the fix isn't VW authorized, and even though they heard the crappy bass coming out of the right side of my stereo, they stuck to their guns and wouldn't switch the wires. [HR][/HR]​I called Gunther about it and they never called me back. I wouldn't waste your time at the dealer...just do it yourself. It's so easy....


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

I just read this entire thread for the second time and besides being blind







I have come to the conclusion that despite some good folks here at the Vortex doing some great work detailing the problem AoA has yet to fix it or should I say fully address it.
Fortunately when I complained to my salesman today about the sound in my "upgraded" stereo that I had heard such great things about he was aware of the wire swap issue. I do not know how aware, as in do they know the March TSB is wrong, can they also fix FM quality, etc. This will be the true test for the service department. It will be my first visit.
I hope this is not the beginning of a long list of problems with my Jetta. It sure seems to be a helluva lot better built than my Audi TT and I have 3 manila folders full of service visit receipts on that car and only 3 say "could not reproduce."








I will post a full accounting of my trip to the dealer. It will happen later in the week.


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## jtcaraway (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

OK, so has anyone seen the "new" TSB??? Is it correct??
I asked my dealer about it and they basically held the party line that they would only follow the TSB eventhough it is wrong. The only way they would do different is if there is a corrected TSB from VW.


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## HeyJude (Mar 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

OK, get this! Here's a real Monsoon mystery. I have a knowledgeable dealer too, understanding what the TSB should have said. But I was having the poor sound quality with a SINGLE din '02 Monsoon. On this same trip to the dealer, they issued me a new key (one was broken at delivery), so they had to reprogram all my keys & radio/security. They also took out the HU and checked the wiring. 
Well, the wiring was correct, no change needed. When I went to pick up the car, the knowledgeable service guy said "I didn't listen to the radio before, but we checked the wiring and it was OK (and reprogrammed your key/security/radio), BUT I listened to it afterward and it sounds GREAT!".
So, I explain that I will show him side by side with the same CD's in my '01 Passat trade-in vs the new Jetta. I get in the Jetta, turn it on, and WOW! the radio sounds at least 10 times better! So I am mystified, but drive off happy.
There is no doubt that the sound is vastly improved, and pretty close to par with the '01 Passat. But they didn't change anything EXCEPT taking it out, plugging it back in, AND reprogramming all the keys/security.
Either a connector was not seated properly, OR taking the HU in and putting it back reset something, OR reprogramming the keys fixed the radio. I give up! But at least I'm happy while clueless!


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (HeyJude)*

Sounds like your radio might have been programmed wrong. I have no specific knowledge of Monsoon radios or car stereo but it makes logical sense with all of the factors you mentioned in your tale. 
I have new keys coming as well. Mine came without VW logos and the dealer insists I advertise.







Maybe when the reprogram the keys and check the radio codes they'll fix things. I called service today about the ABS recall and was told my VIN is not in the recall. I then informed him of the stereo problem and was told that is sounds like something is wrong with my head unit. This was not troubleshooting (the tone of his voice was not serious) just a comment from the service guy. We shall see.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: What do we want? (e_andree)*

hey e_andree, PLEASE clear up a few things about the "new tsb" since you seem to be the only one who has heard of it or mentioned it. you first posted about it on page 13 of this thread and when asked about it, you replied:
QUOTE]Correct...apparently there is a newer one that narrows it down to certain jettas and beetles. I stopped by my dealership to ask about it.....[/QUOTE]
so what did the dealer say? and you make it sound like you heard about it first *and* then went to the dealer to ask about it, is that the case? if so, where did you hear about, and if not, then back to the first question, what did the dealer say???
you've caused a bit of confusion and it would really help if you could clarify. thanks.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (HeyJude)*

quote:[HR][/HR]There is no doubt that the sound is vastly improved, and pretty close to par with the '01 Passat. But they didn't change anything EXCEPT taking it out, plugging it back in, AND reprogramming all the keys/security.
Either a connector was not seated properly, OR taking the HU in and putting it back reset something, OR reprogramming the keys fixed the radio. I give up! But at least I'm happy while clueless![HR][/HR]​OR they reprogrammed your radio code as well and set it correctly - did you ask about that? 
i'm kinda surprised you didn't ask them to check the radio code settings *before* they did anything else and tell you whether or not it was set correctly? i'm also surprised that you didn't ask them specifically whether or not they reprgrammed the radio code. that info probably would have left you much less "clueless." but the bottom line is that you're clueless AND happy








congrats on getting your problem resolved http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 



[Modified by amgvw, 11:36 PM 5-8-2002]


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Well, at this moment, sposedly there is a VW rep looking at my car for the radio issues that the dealership couldn't fix...*crosses fingers*
And a wierd thing happened, anyone know if this is something that is normal?
I was sitting in the parkinglot, getting the key off the ring for the dealership cuz I was leaving it there, I had my foot on the brakes(bout 1 minute) and the keys out of the ignition. I heard the car try to lock auto once, it didn't, then it tried to do it again, it didn't, then both blinker lights lit up, made a sound, and then I got out, and locked car, no honk. tried a few times, open door, close door, lock, no honk *boggle*



[Modified by oto, 7:09 PM 5-9-2002]


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

Hmm, just got the dealership call...
Apparently they recoded the radio, and the instrument cluster?
I will have to hear it to believe it...


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

yo oto, thanks for the updates. you've been an excellent source of info.
quote:[HR][/HR]Apparently they recoded the radio, and the instrument cluster?
I will have to hear it to believe it...[HR][/HR]​pls. get a *detailed* explanation of what they did (duh)? if they did in fact recode your radio, it'd be good to know what the incorrect coding was and what they used as the correct code. 
also, i can't remember and i'm on a dial-up and don't want to go back through this whole thread, but did you ever say whether or not you got the "monsoon" display when turning on the radio?
our golf didn't get an amp change, but it did get an hu change and the wiring swap, and it's coded correctly, and it's not cutting it. i'm still getting the problem with the fade dial abpruptly cutting out the front speakers at 10pm as well as a clear imbalance in volume and bass between left and right speakers - front and back.
i know my dealer is done with me, so i've been trying to see how things resolve for some of the rest of us here before i try to go the ots route (owner technical specialist or whatever).


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Back from the dealership.
I checked the balance and fading issues, and they indeed have been fixed.
The horn thing was incidental and they fixed that too..
They said they had to recode the radio and cluster, thats what it said on the invoice they gave me and thats what they said when I asked. 
I didn't get specific codes ect. but it was apparently a VW tech, not the dealerships techs that did it. I will call back to the dealership to get as specific info that I can. I have to ask them if they had to recode the HU because it was NEW(they had changed it along with the AMP) or they had to recode it because it was incorrect from the factory to begin with.
As for the left side audio, Im just not sure right now, due to left side ear problems I am having, so I am gonna have to chalk the imbalance I hear right now to that. Right now the balance of audio all straight gives more strength to the Right side. Balanc to 9:30 on the dial gives me a more even feel speaker wise, but the back speakers are also alot lower than the front, and dialing the fade to about 930 as well gives a more immersed feel which I like. 
Ive read that the back speakers being alot lower than the front is a design feature and not a flaw, so ill let that one go(even though I don't like that feature audio wise) 
On a side note, I do not currently know what position the 3 and 7 wires are in, I am going to have to assume its back to the TSB positions. Im tempted to pull the HU out and check *










[Modified by oto, 10:46 PM 5-9-2002]


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]They said they had to recode the radio and cluster, thats what it said on the invoice they gave me and thats what they said when I asked.[HR][/HR]​i totally get the radio recode, but i'm just not sure what could be involved with the "cluster". there's an "instruments" control module on the vag-com, but i don't know how it could impact the sound of the radio...
quote:[HR][/HR]I didn't get specific codes ect. but it was apparently a VW tech, not the dealerships techs that did it. I will call back to the dealership to get as specific info that I can.[HR][/HR]​any specific info on the codes would be great - as well as any info on the "cluster" coding.
quote:[HR][/HR]I have to ask them if they had to recode the HU because it was NEW(they had changed it along with the AMP) or they had to recode it because it was incorrect from the factory to begin with.[HR][/HR]​the only thing getting a code should be the hu (hence my confusion over this "cluster" coding issue). if they had to recode the hu because it was new, then it must have come from the factory that way right? obviously i'm missing something here.
anyhoo, i'm guessing a new hu comes coded non-monsoon since monsoon is an upgrade. that would explain why your new hu had to be recoded.
quote:[HR][/HR]As for the left side audio, Im just not sure right now, due to left side ear problems I am having, so I am gonna have to chalk the imbalance I hear right now to that. Right now the balance of audio all straight gives more strength to the Right side.[HR][/HR]​hmm, didn't you just say that you "checked the balance and fading issues, and they indeed have been fixed."????
quote:[HR][/HR]Ive read that the back speakers being alot lower than the front is a design feature and not a flaw, so ill let that one go(even though I don't like that feature audio wise)[HR][/HR]​monsoon does say that the rears are sub-woofers while the fronts are woofers, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the rears should alot lower.
quote:[HR][/HR]On a side note, I do not currently know what position the 3 and 7 wires are in, I am going to have to assume its back to the TSB positions. Im tempted to pull the HU out and check *[HR][/HR]​if it's back to the tsb positions than it's WRONG!!! the tsb is wrong and as of now, imo, the "new tsb" is a figment of someone's imagination.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

When I say that the problems have been been fixed, I meant just the fade (sound cuts out at 10oclock on front speakers to very low levels instaneously), and the balance was instaneous, but now its a gradual fade from left to right and back ect...
BUT, the same sound quality I had before is there still. I am not sure if its a problem, but my opinion says that the right side audio is stronger volumewise than the left. the left has volume, but to make the environment in my car sound 'balanced' I have to adjust the balance, and fade to 930 on both dials. 
Im not much of a sound expert, unfortunately, due to many infections when I was young, left ear right now is going through recovery after a tympanoplasty (almost an entirely new ear drum) and I think its got blown out somehow and my hearings getting worse...(edit: I am going in for checkup tommorow to see if theres any damage, and what they are gonna do about it, along with a hearing check, but sposedly my right side hearing was as good as a ten-yearolds hearing, they said that was good the last time I got a hearing test)
But, I had a friend in the back seat before I had the radio fixed, and he commented how the left side audio in the back seat was very low at the volume I had it at compared to the right...and hes got pretty good hearing, and hes a musician...The dealer said they couldn't reproduce what I told them, but it always seems to become lower on the left side when I am at driving speeds. 
could the cars vibrations be cancelling out the sound on one side to some degree?
Is there a programming option to alter the balance of power on one side to match the balance of power on the other?
Could the left side rear speakers wires be mismatched?
If the wiring on the HU is per TSB, then perhaps along with the recode, this is required to make it sound more normal...I am not sure, I need to get confidence up to pull out the HU and check...
Im a computer tech, so being able to compare and contrast is something I need, if I can replicate it ect. Thats how I found out my radio had problems with the fade and balance controls when I was in another vehicle. I think I need another vehicle again to drive, and check the audio out to see the overall feel of sound, thats the only way im gonna know if my cars audio is the same...I don't have a benchmark right now *sigh*



[Modified by oto, 1:57 AM 5-10-2002]


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

The only cluster problem oto seems to be having is the clusterf*ck in his HU.








It sounds like the new DDIN Monsoon HU's are pooched. Unfortunately we all have to fight the same battle that oto did before the OTS will agree to what I will call reparations. I want them to buy me a decent quality HU. I have not swapped my wires yet but I have no confidence this fixes all of the problems including (just to recap)
1. Fade goes over the cliff at 10 o'clock
2. no bass from left side
3. crackling from tweeters
4. no dynamic range from rear mains even bass
5. FM radio quality dismal (underwater sound)
Man I love my new Jetta Variant but I also love to listen to the stereo.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

My sentiments exactly...I never even noticed the fade issue until it was brought up here...and indeed, I have the same problem....in addition to no bass on the left side. But, there is also far too much upper frequency energy on most everything I play. Perhaps the absence of bass on the left side contributes to this. I'm almost tempted to pull the tweeters out and cut the wires. An installer at Circuit City even suggested this (and it's not hard to pull it out of the door/window assembly.) What's maddening is that I'm even willing to replace the HU with an aftermarket unit with my own coin...but with this whole wiring question still in the air, I might be wasting my money.
At my dealer, they acknowledge the problems I'm having and say that VW is working on it (apparently a rep visited them last week and agreed that the sound problems exist). But, I don't know how much time I should give them until I get ugly. I've been very cooperative and friendly so far but my patience does have a limit.


[Modified by DanoP, 5:14 AM 5-10-2002]


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]What's maddening is that I'm even willing to replace the HU with an aftermarket unit with my own coin...but with this whole wiring question still in the air, I might be wasting my money.[HR][/HR]​BINGO!!! i was just checking out afermarket HUs and the very observant installer guy pointed out that since i'm most likely having a wiring problem, a new HU might not work either - i had not thought of that previously








now i'm kinda kicking myself for not realizing earlier that this whole stupid mess could be a wiring problem which means it doesn't matter how many new HUs you throw at the problem - or amps for that matter.
the golf had this dtc when i checked yesterday (i cleared it and will check again later when my gf gets home from work):
17072 - Main Relay (J271): Load Circuit Open
35-10 - - - Intermittent
also, i ran the output test for the radio control module (#56), the test sends a low tone/high tone through each low/high speaker. having a consistent and single tone cycle through the speakers is like night and day over trying to demonstrate the problem with a music cd i.e., you'd have to be deaf (or employed by a vw service dept.) to NOT hear the problems.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

re: above...I had the HU changed out, the problems persisted with the new HU, and a new AMP...the recoding fixed it, or so they say *grin*


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

I did some hard listening with some very familiar music today. I played some selections from The Cure. Songs I know inside out and upside down. And I concluded this:
When the balance knob is in the center, bass is definitely coming from the left side of the car (and the right side, as expected). It sounds lower in volume than the right side, as does all music. If I move the balance knob right, I still get bass and OK dynamic range. If I move the balance knob left I get no bass. It was there when the knob was centered. Poof! It's gone.
I also realized how absolutely freaking bright this setup is...with the sunroof open. Try it. Open your sunroof only and play a familiar song. Close your sunroof while listening. Dampening is occuring of some kind to the high end with a solid roof.







The system is generating mucho treble.
I sat in my friend's Jeep Wrangler yesterday . he spent $450.00 on 4 speakers, a sub with built in 100w amp and a JVC HU and it sounds great. Clean sound all the way up with definition. $24,500 car and I can't get close to that. Hell the BOSE in my TT was not nearly as good as in the Jeep.
WTH is wrong with auto mfg's? I know that VAG is famous for unreliable HU's. But bad sounding? Yep, that too. I am not going to live with it like this. Dealer visit next week.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

*flapadlr* - has your wiring been checked as per my fix ? I ask because your symptoms seem like what I had before correcting the wiring problem. 
If they haven't I would HIGHLY recommend that you get it done as it is very apparent when corrected. I would even pay an radio installer to fix it if dealer won't as mine sounds great now.


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Thanks in huge bold letters for all of your work on this issue UKAUSSI. THANKS. *THANKS.*
I am close with my Audi dealer and they probably have the keys AND they are across the street from work so I will have them swap the wires. My dub dealer is 30 minutes away. 
It's hard to find time with a new baby at home to worry about car problems outside of the Vortex.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

ukaussi, definitely thanks for discovering this (i still think vw should be thanking you as well). 
so are you now completely free of ALL the stuff many of us are still reporting? the still present but somewhat less volume imbalance, the weird fade knob behavior, etc.
or are you just happy enough that it's ok now? i will admit, i was cranking lateralus by tool and it was sounding good and i was thinking, hmm, maybe it really is just me. but when i listen to lateralus in my 02 passat, it's so incredible sounding that it makes me realize that the dd in the golf still does not sound right. running the vag-com test-tones also helps make all the sound problems much clearer. anyway...


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I no longer have ANY "problems" per se.
I have run the test tones also with no noticable problems.
I would note that if you start messing with the balance and fader settings you will be altering the signal being sent to the DSP inside the Monsoon AMP and you may get weird results.


----------



## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]....so are you now completely free of ALL the stuff many of us are still reporting? the still present but somewhat less volume imbalance, the weird fade knob behavior, etc.........[HR][/HR]​I'm not very happy personally. I think after the wire swap it sounds a lot better but still not great. FM quality sucks on my double din and the balancing and fading are wacked too. I guess it's worth $300 as far as new car stereos go, but in the aftermarket world it aint worth that.


----------



## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

For some reason, the Passats are experiencing the same problems as the Golfs and Jettas but the wiring fix doesn't work. I called up VoA today......I found them to be very defensive and not customer friendly....at all. Well, they opened up a case file and will call my dealer today to investigate. In any case, I won't be satisfied till this is fixed. It seems like a pretty clear issue in the final analysis. VW sold me a sound system that is defective (the maintenace techs at the dealer agree), it is under warranty, and they are compelled to fix it....or write me a check. They can hem and haw all they want but they are legally bound to find a remedy.
This is not rocket science....they simply need to work with Monsoon to figure out what went wrong whether it be the wiring, the equalization, whatever. It's just a freakin sound system for God's sake. A defect in balancing, fading, lack of bass is not acceptable in any sound system.



[Modified by DanoP, 6:24 PM 5-10-2002]


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

I am not sure about the "lemon law" in each of your areas but 4 or 5 attempts at the same fix is usually called a lemon.


----------



## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

That would be rich. VW eating a car via lemon law due to a defective stereo. It could happen and if they don't give due attention to this problem it will happen. 
Bastages.


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## elequin (Dec 23, 2001)

*Thanks to UKAUSSI and about balance/fader problem*

Hey, just wanted to throw my thanks to UKAUSSI as well, you've been a great help! Hehe, where were you when I first found this problem and was trying to figure it out? ;-)
(Actually, we did get it figured out, but I never did a wire switch on my own - see http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=204688 for grins, and check the date on it. heh.)
Anyway, I wanted to say that for quite a while now I've been noticing the same thing oto noticed - the balance and fader controls seem to me to not work smoothly. It seems almost like if you turn the control just a little, nothing happens. A little more, nothing at all happens. A little more, and BAM, suddenly there's a big difference... A little more, nothing happens, etc... oto, I'm glad yours got fixed.. I want mine fixed!!!








Any ideas anyone?


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Thanks to UKAUSSI and about balance/fader problem (elequin)*

The trick is, keep taking it to the dealer, and when they go 'hows this' you go 'its the same, fix it' (course its got to be under that warranty thing :} ) I had to go 5 times before they had a vdub rep or something come out and 'recode' the things...im gonna be calling back early next week to get some more info on exactly what the recode did...but trick is persistance, and don't take the 'sorry we can't do anything' crap, if its under warranty, they CAN...


----------



## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Count me as one more frustrated new owner with the same problem. (By the way, DanoP, it sounds like you and I have the same car--2002 Passat GLS Luxury in Reflex Silver w/gray cloth interior and that godawful premium Monsoon. Mine's the wagon version.) I'm trying to work up the nerve to try UKAUSSI's fix, but is it pointless for us Passat owners to even bother trying?


----------



## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Five minutes after I posted my last message I realized something: are we, perhaps, talking about a couple of DIFFERENT Monsoon systems here? Because when I ordered my Passat (back last August) I ordered the Monsoon system. At the time, the Monsoon did not include a CD player, which was a dealer-installed option (and something I fully intended to buy). By the time the car arrived in February, however, VW had changed the specs and shipped the car with the "Premium" Monsoon, WHICH INCLUDED AN INTEGRAL CD PLAYER. (And boy was my dealer pissed that he couldn't find a way to charge me for it.)
So--how many of you, with which problems, have the Monsoon WITH integral CD player and how many WITHOUT? Is this another variable to consider?


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

AGAIN
Just a quick clarification for those joining late:-
Contrary to what the TSB says it does NOT apply to ALL 2002, it ONLY applies to GOLF/JETTA with the MONSOON. This is the upgrade on the D-DIN radio and includes a special AMP and upgraded speakers. The wiring harness is different if you just have the D-Din (Premium VI) HU

PASSAT OWNERS (2001.5&gt







- 
This does NOT apply to your vehicles as it is a problem with the the Golf/Jetta harness when the changed it for to the "Premium VI" (D-Din) HU. It is possible that there may also be a different problem with the Passat harness or coding of the radio but nobody has posted any info on the wiring on their harness plug.
GOLF/JETTA NON-MONSOON - 
If you do not have the "Monsoon" system and just have the "Premium VI" D-Din HU then you _*MAY*_ also have a wiring problem as shown on Dani's 2002 GTI http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=285496 Her RR speaker wires appeared to also be swapped.
Here are the pics from the thread (Dani, let me know if this is not OK)

















I hope this help people who joined late and maybe those not affected could find something else on their cars


----------



## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Not to doubt your veracity.....but how do you know this???? As what your suggesting is contrary to the TSB.


[Modified by DanoP, 5:14 PM 5-11-2002]


----------



## rudyr (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Ok, I pulled my head unit out and the wires are in fact still not fixed. For the life of me I cannot get them out of plug, so I'm just going to inist that the dealer do it the next time I go in.


----------



## kokoki (May 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

just want to add my thanks to ukaussie...the fix worked, i'm happy.


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## DaBrown (Sep 26, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (kokoki)*

Well It sure would be nice to know what the Official word is on this. Is it going to be a recall and are they going to fix it in the 2003 ?


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]So--how many of you, with which problems, have the Monsoon WITH integral CD player and how many WITHOUT? Is this another variable to consider?[HR][/HR]​for the sake of clarity, since this is already a confusing enough thread/subject...
what you're referring to as the "Monsoon WITH integral CD player" is the premium 6 double-din head unit ("double-din" because it takes up 2 spaces in the dash). it is now the standard vw radio. early model 02s still shipped with the premium 5 single-din head unit "WITHOUT the integral cd player" (such as my 02 passat with a july 01 build date).
there is at least 1 person on this thread reporting a problem with their premium 5 single-din head unit, but the problem seems to be *primarily* with the premium 6 double-din head units. so in a nutshell, the dd vs. sd doesn't seem to be another variable to consider.
except for the fact that the premium 5 single-din hus tend to kick so much ass it makes the premium 6 dd hus sound like utter crap.


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

FYI, here are 2 pics of the underside of my 2002 Monsoon AMP









*This one shows you that they are designed for each vehicle, hence the GOLF reference*


----------



## 628pm (May 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI,
Just received our 2002 Jetti GLS, TDI, on 5-10-02 (Friday), my son and I switched the wires on Sunday (5-12-02), what a difference 2 wires make. Thanks for sharing the information.


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## ralstonracing (May 10, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

ok count me in. i just traded my single din 00 golf in for a 02 gti.
02 d-din sounds like crap compared to the 00 golf.
More money less quality, sound cracks ans no fricking bass.
What can I do?
b


----------



## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

I tried out flapadlr's suggestion this weekend and I concur absolutely--with the sunroof open, the sound from the premium 6 unit was everything I'd expect from a $300 upgrade: bright, crisp, well-balanced sound with impressively pounding (not booming) bass. Could there be an acoustical engineering problem here in addition to/instead of any problems with the audio unit itself?
UKAUSSI--I'm still trying to work up the nerve to pull my unit out on my own. Since I definitely have the premium 6 and since I have EXACTLY the same sound problems you described, I still suspect that we new Passat owners are suffering from the same wiring problem. Can't prove it yet, of course. Will keep my mouth shut from now on until I see what's going on inside.


----------



## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

Audio note to everyone....the sonic characteristic known as 'brightness' is a fault, not an asset. I would agree that Monsoon is bright....far too bright. And that's bad. Real music doesn't sound bright and neither does voices....unless you're hearing it through the Monsoon system installed in my Passat.


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

DanoP is correct. My judging the stereo "bright" with the sunroof open was not meant as a compliment. I believe in some English speaking cultures that word is a pretty high complement so I understand the misunderstanding.








It hurt my ears. I had a headache that day so I listened to U2's "All that you can't leve behind" album today, another one I know by heart and found the same. 
It kills me that I haven't had time to take the car to the dealer for this yet. I am so used to working across the street from the Audi dealer.








Nothing substantive to add yet, just that clarification. Thanks.


----------



## hape (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI_FEVER)*

How did you connect the aftermarket HU? I tried with a Blaupunkt MP3 and experience trouble with the Monsoon amplifier, it simply sucks my battery empty when I connect the speaker connector. Any tips/hints? Should I get rid of the ****ty Monsoon system totally?
Please send answer to 
[email protected]
Thanks in advance
Hans


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## rudyr (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hape)*

Oh, this is going real well. I called the dealer today because the part to fix my seat frame is in. I mentioned that I pulled the HU out and the wires are not fixed. They INSIST that they are. I'm going to spell it out for them...reverse the yellow and black. I don't know how this is not obvious to them. The radio has the correct wiring pattern stickered right to it.


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## 02GOLFGTI1.8T (Feb 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

hey guys,
I just did the wire swap at the HU, the bass was much impressing afterwards, however i must say that when i play with the balance knob there is more bass coming from the right side than the left side, I don't understand????
anyone experience the same?


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Oh, this is going real well. I called the dealer today because the part to fix my seat frame is in. I mentioned that I pulled the HU out and the wires are not fixed. They INSIST that they are. I'm going to spell it out for them...reverse the yellow and black. I don't know how this is not obvious to them. The radio has the correct wiring pattern stickered right to it.[HR][/HR]​keep in mind that some dealerships will not perform a wire change without official vw confirmation as they are not willing to assume the liability for any potential resulting problems. in your dealer's view, your wires are correct according to the tsb - which is official word from vw.
HOWEVER, i'd like to think that your radio having the wiring pattern stickered to it makes a difference. is the wiring pattern sticker color coded?


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02GOLFGTI1.8T)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I just did the wire swap at the HU, the bass was much impressing afterwards, however i must say that when i play with the balance knob there is more bass coming from the right side than the left side, I don't understand???? anyone experience the same?[HR][/HR]​dude, YES, many people are reporting the exact same post-wire swap problems. go back and read at least the last 3 or 4 pages of the thread.


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## 02GOLFGTI1.8T (Feb 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

well it's not a post swap wire problem , the problem was there before. I am sure because that was the test that led me believe that something was wrong. SO i think there are two problems and this one may be related to head unit
Maybe we should start a petition so that volkswagen starts offering bose or harman kardon products like every other respectable manufuacterer....


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## jimmy-buffett (Apr 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02GOLFGTI1.8T)*

quote:[HR][/HR]well it's not a post swap wire problem , the problem was there before. I am sure because that was the test that led me believe that something was wrong. SO i think there are two problems and this one may be related to head unit
Maybe we should start a petition so that volkswagen starts offering bose or harman kardon products like every other respectable manufuacterer....[HR][/HR]​I thought Oto had posted about this, that the balance problem could be related to the fader problem (front speakers pretty much cut out at the 10 o'clock position). He said they recoded the stereo and it seemed to be fixed, I'm taking mine to the dealer tonight for the wiring change and I wanted to see if they could recode it too.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02GOLFGTI1.8T)*

quote:[HR][/HR]................
Maybe we should start a petition so that volkswagen starts offering bose or harman kardon products like every other respectable manufuacterer....[HR][/HR]​
Unfortunately, due to V.A.G.'s underhanded tactics when they headhunted Mr Lopez (one of GM Europe's Presidents) they also had him "allegedly" steal many GM corporate secrets. (I was working for GM Europe at the time and IMO he was guilty). V.A.G. eventually settled out of court and part of the agreement was for VAG to purchase $XXBillion in parts from GM over the next XX years.
Monsoon is a brand name of a division of GM in the USA.
SO, we end up with something VW has to take and, from personal experience with working with german engineers, something they didn't want forced on them. It wouldn't surprise me if some of these problems were put there on purpose by VW engineers to discredit the American GM "Monsoon" system.
This is obviously all IMHO and conjecture










[Modified by UKAUSSI, 8:46 AM 5-14-2002]


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## Non_Affiliated (Feb 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I sing the praises, All factory stereos suck, and I believe this 15 page thread proves it.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Non_Affiliated)*

There is a difference between systems that suck (my previous car....a Malibu







) and those that are defective....Monsoon is defective.


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## pdxtomct (Apr 4, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]There is a difference between systems that suck (my previous car....a Malibu







) and those that are defective....Monsoon is defective.[HR][/HR]​Yup


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## jimmy-buffett (Apr 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (pdxtomct)*

Had the wire swap done at the dealership today, 90 minutes of waiting and 15 minutes of work. Originally the guy said "pick it up tomorrow", I told him I'd wait and he got it moved up. Thanks to Stan and friends at Brad Noe VW/Audi in Tulsa for rushing this through. First experience with service department = http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
The system definitely has more punch to it now but it is still not *fantastic*, my Accord DX with after-market Alpine 6x9's and the factory HU had more bass. It does sound much better than before though, so thanks UKAUSSI for figuring this out. My salesman, who owns the same car, thanks you as well.








I didn't want to push my luck with asking them to try to troubleshoot the fader problem, hopefully it gets as much attention eventually as this wiring problem and a TSB comes out.
Time to hit the search page for "install subwoofer"







.


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## rudyr (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jimmy-buffett)*

Can you recode the radio with a VAG-COM?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

Yes, you can check it according to the factory option code chart








My GTI is 00031, Monsoon with no cd-changer


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## jimmy-buffett (Apr 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Does yours have the fader problems too? Oto posted before that his radio was "re-coded" and that seemed to fix his fader problems, I'd be very interested to hear everybody's radio codes to try to get an idea of if the radio being coded incorrectly can cause the fader problem or not.
D-Din Monsoon Owners, who has the fader problem and what is your radio code? Who doesn't have the fader problem and what is your radio code?


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jimmy-buffett)*

Gotta have a VAG-Com to check the hcode, right? It's not in the Mix button test menu? Or perhaps some other magical menu? I am a 00031.







I'd love to verify it.
Nice of VW to label the OBDII connector panel for us, Isn't it? It's at the bottom center of the dash. I love little discoveries like that.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

due to work, and the manager being busy the one time I called so far, I have yet to talk to him bout what was actually recoded...maybe tommorow, or thursday for the info if I can get the manager guy on the phone.


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## bruno_monk (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

OK, I'll bite: what is the Mix button test menu and how does one access it?


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## 02GOLFGTI1.8T (Feb 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bruno_monk)*

this is very interesting stuff, I had installed the cd changer myself without recoding, I should be a 00033 now how do i check it?


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bruno_monk)*

Hold down the mix button for 5 secons for all kinds of fun. :0)
I missed this earlier today but I must slap the hand of the person asking for BOSE in VW's. You know what they say about being careful what you ask for. My BOSE in my Audi was a $600 upgrade and another $600 for the 6 CD changer. It sounded excruciatingly mediocre. The single DIN 2001 Monsoon sounds a lot better. The D-Din 2002 Monsoon is just plain broken. I think VW will figure it and I think it's more than just wire swaps.
Where did that chart for radio coding come from, anyway? Official VW documents or a Bentley manual? Bentley is notoriously wrong.


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## Jitzo (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02GOLFGTI1.8T)*

I too would be interested in the Mix button test menu and how one might access it.
I just got my DDIN Monsoon 2002 and noticed something was wrong with the stereo...awsome that I could find the problem here so quickly.......I am new to the vortex I started reading it about a year ago but only made me want a dub more and more.......but to make a long story short I got mine and will soon be a regular here Im sure........
So thanks to everyone here on the vortex for all the great info.....


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02GOLFGTI1.8T)*

02GOLFGTI1.8T posted:
quote:[HR][/HR]well it's not a post swap wire problem , the problem was there before. I am sure because that was the test that led me believe that something was wrong. SO i think there are two problems and this one may be related to head unit[HR][/HR]​sorry i wasn't more clear - what i mean by "post swap problem" is just that many of us have had the wire swap done - and *confirmed* it was done, turns out there were a bunch of folks that were *told* it was done by the dealer when in fact it wasn't - anyway, many of us have had the swap done, confirmed the correct wiring, and are STILL having problems. 
i would *not* describe the situation as "two problems" - perhaps 2 symptons of the same problem or heck, 3 or 4 symptoms of the same problem. as for anything having to do with the HU, a few of us have had our HUs swapped and are still having problems.
jimm-buffett posted:
quote:[HR][/HR]Oto posted before that his radio was "re-coded" and that seemed to fix his fader problems, I'd be very interested to hear everybody's radio codes to try to get an idea of if the radio being coded incorrectly can cause the fader problem or not.[HR][/HR]​well, unfortunately, we don't really know what happened to oto's car as he was not given exact documentation by the dealer (the dealer apparently told him something about recoding the "cluster"). notice also, that oto is still reporting an imbalance problem.
i've played with the dd diagnostic mode and haven't discovered much of anything. i've hooked up my vag-com and tried to match #s from the diag mode to blocks from the vag-com, but to no avail. speaking of vag-com, that's the only way to know for sure what your radio coding is, however, it is safe to say that if your radio does NOT display "monsoon" when you turn it on, it is NOT coded for monsoon (regardless of whether you have the speaker upgrade and the amp that go along with the monsoon package).


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Yes, you can check it according to the factory option code chart








My GTI is 00031, Monsoon with no cd-changer[HR][/HR]​This is from the VW Service Manual reproduced by Bentley.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

I just got off the phone with the dealership manager.
He didn't have much info, but, he did say this...
The VW tech used something called the 1551 diagnostic machine to recode the radio itself. even though the info said 'cluster' as well, he wasn't sure if they did the cluster, just did a check of it. 
So, this seems to tell me that the premium monsoons aren't going out coded correctly, probly because the people putting them in think it works ect?
I asked about the wiring positions, and he stated that the wiring is in the correct position (per the TSB) and its the way it should be. They also checked it against a new jetta on the lot, and the wiring is in the same positions (yes yes, comparing bad wiring to bad wiring is still bad wiring *chuckle*) I made mention of the fact that the left side audio was weaker than the right side before I mentioned the wiring. 
I asked for more specific info on the diagnostic machine recode, and he said he would have to get back to me. So, I would say that the wiring issue, and the fade/balance issue are separate issues here. Maybe the people who are selling the monsoon aren't recoding them to the premium type, and just expecting them to be the system without recoding?
Anyone know about this 1551 diagnostic machine thing?
RE: post above
My radio has always lit up 'MONSOON" on the radio pre-re-code, and post-re-recode...



[Modified by oto, 6:07 PM 5-15-2002]


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## hotpprs (May 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

I just fixed mine the other day. I don't know if anyone suggested this before, but I used 4 paperclips to get each pin out, not just two. This is because the locking clip is centered in the middle of the pin. If you use just 1 paperclip (on each side), it tends to slip to one side or the other. If you used 2 paperclips(on each side), they fit snugly into the groove that you are sliding the paperclip into, thus you have a better chance at pushing that locking clip down. Especially being that you will be moving the connector a little bit as you fiddle with the wire. Also, don't be too afraid to push, then pull on the wire with a little force. It doesn't just fall out when the pin is released, you do have to use some force, just use your judgement so you don't break the wire off if the locking clip is in fact not released. But you should hear/feel a tiny click when the paper clips do disengage the locking tab.
Also, I have to thank UKAUSSI also. I wouldn't have attempted this if he didn't provide such great detailed instructions. And the difference is really unbelieveable.
I just bought my Jetta April 30th, 2002, so I would imagine the problem is still out there. I happen to have a German built Jetta wagon TDI, I'm not sure if these problems have been narrowed down to any 1 particular plant.
One more thing which I've seen in this thread a few times. After the fix, the sound on the right side still seems a little louder, or broader? But it makes the stereo sound that much better for the driver. On other cars I usually adjust the balance off the middle so I can hear the stereo evenly when no one else is in the car.
So I find it a little interesting that the difference in the 2 speakers, even after the fix, is so good for the driver when the balance knob is in the center. Could this possibly be designed like this to benefit the drivers listening experience? It sounds far fetched, but you never know what engineers dream up.
Anyway, thanks again UKAUSSI and good luck to all who may try this. But don't live with this if you don't want to risk it. Print out all these forums and bring it to your dealer, it's no fluke. Play something with lots and lots of bass and let him hear the difference when you move the balance left and right.
[Modified by hotpprs, 6:22 PM 5-15-2002]

[Modified by hotpprs, 7:37 PM 5-15-2002]

[Modified by hotpprs, 7:38 PM 5-15-2002]


[Modified by hotpprs, 7:39 PM 5-15-2002]


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## warp11 (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI's fix worked very well...I am forever thankful.
(BUT) Does anyone know why the rear speakers are in-phase with each other, but out-of-phase with the front speakers? This has been mentioned once before and if you look at the gray harness on the amp you can see this. It can also be verified by testing. 
I tried to switch this at the amp to see if this improved the sound, but couldn't get the pins pulled.


----------



## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

THe VAG 1551 is just the SIemens computer they use to program via the OBDII interface. It can talk to the cluster, the radio, the ECU. I assume VW's are the same as Audi's in this regard. Audis have 3 computer "systems" (new A4 is probably not going to fit this). One is the cluster, the second is the security and radio system and the third is the ECU itself. I think they may also talk to the tranny but my knowledge there is limited since my Audi model didn't come with an auto.
They are not going to tell you the exact code they used I bet. I will definitely have my dealer make sure mine is 00031 (if Bentley is correct).
BTW the new RUSH album is a great way to prove the ****tiness of the broken Monsoon. Lots of distortion from the left side and no imaging. Gives me a headache to listen too long. Great album tho.


[Modified by flapadlr, 2:28 PM 5-15-2002]


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (warp11)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Does anyone know why the rear speakers are in-phase with each other, but out-of-phase with the front speakers? This has been mentioned once before and if you look at the gray harness on the amp you can see this. It can also be verified by testing. 
I tried to switch this at the amp to see if this improved the sound, but couldn't get the pins pulled.
[HR][/HR]​This is really interesting. You could be on to something.... I don't remember hearing about this rear/front phasing issue previously in this thread...but the damn thing is 16 pages long so I might've missed it. Can anyone else verify this bit of info? Anyone enterprising souls out there willing to do more wire swapping?
I've got a Jetta wagon and the amp is damn near impossible to get at. Maybe more swapping at the HU is called for?


[Modified by rocketweb, 9:40 PM 5-15-2002]


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Audis have 3 computer "systems" (new A4 is probably not going to fit this). One is the cluster, the second is the security and radio system and the third is the ECU itself. I think they may also talk to the tranny but my knowledge there is limited since my Audi model didn't come with an auto.[HR][/HR]​with vw and the vag-com tool, there is pretty much just 1 "system", but the system has different modules that let you access the engine, the tranny, the brakes, the instruments, the radio, etc.
quote:[HR][/HR]They are not going to tell you the exact code they used I bet. I will definitely have my dealer make sure mine is 00031 (if Bentley is correct).[HR][/HR]​folks - you should absolutely INSIST that the dealer give you the little print-out from the vag tool that shows what your current radio coding is. there is NO reason for the dealer to hide this info from you.
AGAIN, as far as coding goes, if your radio doesn't display "monsoon" when you turn it on, then it isn't coded for monsoon.


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## rudyr (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Just got back from the dealer. This time one of the techs knew in advance that the TSB was wrong. Wow, massive improvement. I'm not an audiophile, but it was so bad before the fix that I was considering disrupting the clean OEM look of the dash with an aftermarket unit. Now, it is perfectly acceptable, even somewhat exceeding my expectations. (Then again, it was SO BAD before that maybe my perspective isn't the best but I'm happy)


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

A friend with a VAG-COM checked my radio code tonight and it was correct. I think my system sounds great. The fader does cut to the back at 10 o'clock, but I don't see that is a problem. I use my system front and back, so it stays at noon!


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## mmellblom (May 8, 2002)

*Low left Bass and 10 o'clock fade / POPPING*

My 2002 Golf TDI seems to be plagued as well. I will discuss the TSB with my dealer at the 5K service interval. I still don't see a consensus on the 10'oclock Fade problem. I DO HEAR a slight POP as it passes the 10oclock position.


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Low left Bass and 10 o'clock fade / POPPING (mmellblom)*

Have we added crackling from the left front tweeter as a symptom or do I have a blown speaker?







Wow this stereo is BROKEN!


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: Low left Bass and 10 o'clock fade / POPPING (flapadlr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Have we added crackling from the left front tweeter as a symptom or do I have a blown speaker?







Wow this stereo is BROKEN![HR][/HR]​ah yes, there have been reports of crackling. my left front only really crackles when i quickly move the fade past that 10pm spot, how about you?
here's a summary of reported problems POST-wire swap (and these problems are being reported by folks who have had an HU swap and/or an amp swap):
* abrupt cut-out of front speakers at the 10o'clock postion on the fader
* right speakers still louder/putting out more bass/left speaker still somewhat muffled.
* overall poor stereo imaging - muddy bass, lack of clarity on the highs.
* lf tweeter crackling


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: Low left Bass and 10 o'clock fade / POPPING (amgvw)*

I do not think the fader/balance issues were caused by the swap, or being post-swap.

I believe that the fader at 10oclock and the balance issue(fading from left to right and right to left ect) is a separate issue from the wire swap.


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: Low left Bass and 10 o'clock fade / POPPING (oto)*

UPDATE: Not sure if I have a crackling issue anymore. It seems the first pressing of RUSH: Vapor Trails is bad. Others are reporting the crackling outside of car forum land. Other CD's will be used to test. I did not have the crackling on U2: ATYCLB


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: Low left Bass and 10 o'clock fade / POPPING (oto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I do not think the fader/balance issues were caused by the swap, or being post-swap.[HR][/HR]​not trying to attribute any causes or what not, just pointing out some of the complaints that are still out there and the fact that thet exist even after the wire swap, even after the HU swap, and even after an amp swap.
note about the crackling left tweeter - i only get it when dialing the fade back and forth. it's just a little snap, crackle, pop when going back and forth over the 10pm position.
heard geddy and alex on rockline the other night. it was good to hear them again. 5 years is a long time.


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## caseyh (Apr 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

OK i am late to the party - picked up my 02 GTI with Monsoon a week ago - you are right it sucks!! So disappointed! Sounds OK with CD but horrific tuner. I hope mine is broke so it can be fixed! Please let me know what I should do!
Casey


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## warp11 (May 14, 2002)

*Try disabling "Speed Volume Control".*

I disabled the Speed Volume Control (SVC) on my Monsoon stereo and I like the sound much better...the treble is less irritating when driving. The steps are in the manual, but here is a recap:
1) Press and hold the "Dolby" button for longer than 3 seconds.
2) Turn the right knob to adjust the SVC compensation.
3) "0" means that the function is turned off.
4) Press the "Dolby" button again to confirm the setting.


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (caseyh)*

WELL, I'VE FIXED THE PROBLEM and I'm outta here. I realize that this will not be everyone's choice, but it was mine. Summer vacation travel season is coming up in a couple of weeks, and the thought of spending 4 or 5 hours at a time in my Passat with 2 kids and that *@#%*&$# sound system?....No way. So I went to my friendly local car stereo installer today (GLM Security & Sound, of Long Island, NY) and had them pull out the Monsoon HU and install a Blaupunkt RPD 555. Took them nearly three hours (instead of the 45 min. they had scheduled me for) because they ran into problems and ended up pulling out ALL the wiring--including to and from the amp and to the speakers) and redoing it all. (They had told me the price for intalling the unit ahead of time, and stuck to it, so this wasn't a case of bill-padding.)
I've was nervous as hell when I got back in the car, but YEEESSSSS!!!!! The replacement solved ALL the problems we've been experiening:
-Most important: NO MORE SONIC MUD in place of correct stereo sound. I had no idea how much I'd been missing: palpable, pounding base; crystal-clear highs; every sound distinct from every other.
-The fader works completely and linearly, from full left to full right (instead of from 10 o'clock to 2 o'clock on the Monsoon dial).
-No more tweeter crackling.
-Even the volume control is an improvement, since the increments are much smaller (0-100).
I can only repeat what so many others have said: this wasn't a subjective case of preferring one sound quality to another (the Alpine or the Sony radio? the Pioneer or the JBL speakers?) There is just something WRONG with the Monsoon double-DIN head unit and/or wiring. (And this applies to ALL Volkswagen models in which it is installed, including the Passat.) On the bright side, there's absolutely nothing wrong with the Monsoon amp and speakers. They sound great.
So I'm out $278.50 plus three hours of my time. I've gained a correctly functioning, pretty damn impressive car stereo system. Now that it's over and proven successful, I'm glad to have made the decision I did. I realize most of the rest of you will fight on, and I wish you good luck. If anyone wants to include me in any kind of legal action against Volkswagen in the future, my e-mail address is: [email protected]
Otherwise, I'm done. I'll continue to monitor this site for a day or two in case anyone has any questions (and if I can't answer them myself I'll call the guys at GLM, who seem pretty damn knowledgeable and professional. One of them is an '02 GTI owner, by the way.) Then, I'm outta here for good--a satisfied (if slightly poorer) customer.
(This final paragraph is only for people who care about the details of the VW-GM-Lopez affair as outlined by UKAUSSI. It explains why VW is using GM's Monsoon units in the first place. I used to work for a publication that covered this kind of thing, so I went back and looked it up: On Dec. 13, 1997 German prosecutors announced the details of an indictment against Jose Ignacio Lopez de Arriortua, a former head of global purchasing for GM who had gone to work as Volkswagen's purchasing and production chief in 1993. Lopez and three accomplices were charged with industrial espionage for allegedly supplying VAG with confidential GM documents concerning purchasing strategies and a proposed factory that was never actually built. Lopez was forced to resign from VAG two weeks before the details of the indictment were announced. GM subsequently filed a civil suit against VAG in the U.S. accusing VAG of espionage. On Jan. 9, 1997 VAG and GM settled the suit, with VAG agreeing to pay GM $100 million upfront in damages and to purchase $1 billion in GM parts (can anyone say "Monsoon stereos"?) over the next seven years. German prosecutors dropped the charges against Lopez and his co-defendants in July 1998 after the four agreed to donate 590,000 marks (about $330,000) to charity. The prosecutors were motivated partly by sympathy for Lopez, who had been seriously injured in a car accident in January 1998, and in part by uncertainty over whether they had enough evidence for a certain conviction.)


----------



## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

I've also thought of purchasing a new head unit and rewiring, bypassing the amp. The only problem is that I was told that the speakers were designed to work with the Monsoon amp. With my limited knowledge of audio (I've owned high end systems), I surmised that the speakers might be of the low ohm variety....thus if you don't have a head unit capable to pushing out adequate wattage, you could blow out the head unit (specifically, HU amplifier) and perhaps speakers in the process. As far as just replacing the HU and rewiring to the Monsoon amp I also see a problem there...specifically, you would be amplifying the signal twice...once at the HU and once at the amp. Spinach all the way around. 
I'm glad things worked out for you....and it looks like you got a nice price.


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## HurleyBoy (May 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

I just tried to get my HU out with a cut CD and a cut credit card...neither worked








I'll try again tomorrow when I have more daylight...wait a sec i get my windows tinted tomorrow-i wont see the Sun for a couple days








If only i didn't get so damn frustrated


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1stDub-GTI)*

It takes a little persistence....I went through 2 credit cards then found an old MCI calling card. It's thinner and more flexible but it did the trick.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

It sure took longer to read the whole thread than to do the actual wire swap.
At page 2 into the thread I called VWofA and I got the "We know nothing about this issue". I wish I had called them after I found the part about the TSB and other's case ID#. Oh well, it's all water under the bridge, I did the swap myself, I don't have the time and energy to take the car to a probably incompetent dealer and end up with a no swap.
This way I know it was done properly as I did it myself. Sound is much better, I have yet to check my balance/fade but overall I am happier with the system and the FM sounds better too with more bass and treble not as much mid range. It's still a little leftie (right is louder) but I can live with that for now...... If VWofA comes out with a fix for that I might take it in.... BTW mine says Monsoon when I turn the HU on so I'm guessing its set up right, but I have no way to verify, time to invest in one of those VAG-COM thingies......


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

I now have my Passat's double-DIN Monsoon head unit sitting on the desk in front of me. A couple of observations:
-Yes, the wire colors are different from those in UKAUSSI's diagram: the four wires on the right (positions 5-8) are all brown instead of black; and the four colored wires (positions 1-4) are, in order: green, red, yellow and blue (not red, green, yellow and white). My unit appears to be wired correctly, therefore.
-Regardless of the correct wiring, my unit clearly suffered from the same sound problems as everyone else's before I changed to an aftermarket unit and had the whole system rewired. The difference is night and day. I spent an hour or so riding around today and I am not merely satisfied by the change, I am thrilled! Even my non-audiophile spouse could clearly tell the difference.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

What HU/model did you use.....if it worked for you, I might try the same HU. BTW, how is AM reception? I listen to a good bit of talk radio. Did you use an antenna amplifier?


[Modified by DanoP, 11:02 PM 5-18-2002]


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

hummm.
for what it's worth, I let a friend who is into car audio listen to the radio when I first got it about 1 month ago. Then yesterday he listened to it (after the fix). He immediately could tell the difference. It's all thatnot bad for stock but I guess the issue is we paid so much for it.


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

I used the Blaupunkt RPD 555, which is one of the cheapest, least fancy Blaus. I picked it because it's powerful (55 watts x 4 channels peak; 25 watts RMS) and is a pretty good stylistic fit with the VW (brushed silver face, blue display--okay, it's not quite as "indigo-y" as the Passat's nighttime readouts, and it's a bit bright at night, but it's not bad--plus red illumination of the buttons at night that is a dead-on perfect match for the VW's nighttime display.) It's fairly plain and simple with few frills and none of those distracting "beam me up Scotty" displays. Can't stand 'em. By the way, it's last year's model and is currently in the process of being sold off to make way for the upcoming 2002 models. Prices on the Internet range from $98 to $159, but that's wihtout installation, of course. Mine was the last one my shop had.
Funny you should ask about the AM reception, though. There is NONE at the moment. I need to take it back on Tuesday for installation of a Metra "pocket mount" kit (they thought they had one on hand and included it in the price I paid, turned out they didn't have one, so they told me to call on Tues. to make an appointment to put it in--free of charge). So I will find out what the hell is going on with the AM reception at that time. Will let you know then.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

Thanks for the info....let us know how the AM reception fix works after you take it back in. My understanding is that the Monsoon system amplifies the signal enroute to the antenna....and more than likely your new HU does not (which is typical)....meaning that you would need an amplified antenna adapter.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Took them nearly three hours (instead of the 45 min. they had scheduled me for) because they ran into problems and ended up pulling out ALL the wiring--including to and from the amp and to the speakers) and redoing it all...The replacement solved ALL the problems we've been experiening:[HR][/HR]​first off, congrats! especially since you scored a MAJOR rewiring job at the cost of a regular install. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
good to know the speakers and the amp are cranking. for the sake of my "pseudo-science" approach to the dd problem, i'd love to know how your system sounds with the old dd HU, but the NEW total rewire. if it still cranked, that would pretty much boil the problem down to a wiring problem above and beyond the harness issue. we know that an HU swap alone does not solve the problem.


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

You've put your finger right on the problem: I (unintentionally) changed TWO variables--the head unit AND the wiring--so it's impossible to say which one is responsible for the improvement. I have no intention of asking them to put my old HU back in for the sake of science, however. Would anyone else want to try a complete re-wiring using the Monsoon head unit?


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

BTW......do you know if they rewired the HU directly through to the speakers (bypassing the Monsoon amp) or did they rewire from the HU to the amp?


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## chodite (Oct 11, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Ugh, this is sad. I took my GTI to the dealer, explaining the problem with my double-DIN monsoon ('02). I told the guy at the front desk that i was aware of the TSB and would simply like the wires switched. So when he's handing the keys to the tech, I overheard him say "he's complaining of muddy sound, mainly from the left side... take a listen and see if you can duplicate it and try to fix it" WHAT????
So I go back to the service area and hand the tech a printout from this thread... I told him that it should save him some time. Basically, I told him let's just check to see if the wires are reversed or not. After almost 1/2 hour, he couldn't get the HU out ! After getting a little frustrated, I just told him I'd reschedule for some other day. GRR!!
Any suggestions??


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## awetmore (May 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gti chodite)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Any suggestions??[HR][/HR]​Do it yourself. My wife just bought a new Jetta and I did the wire swap on Saturday morning. It took about 15 minutes using the UKAUSSI instructions, and most of that time was spent looking in the house for paper clips (I ended up using the small very cheap wire keyrings that came with the car and bending them straight).
alex


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## chodite (Oct 11, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (awetmore)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Any suggestions??
Do it yourself. My wife just bought a new Jetta and I did the wire swap on Saturday morning. It took about 15 minutes using the UKAUSSI instructions, and most of that time was spent looking in the house for paper clips (I ended up using the small very cheap wire keyrings that came with the car and bending them straight).[HR][/HR]​I hear ya.... but the VW tech. couldn't even get the HU out with the 'official' tools! He'd put the tool into one of the slots but the tool kept slipping out, like it wasn't catching onto whatever it was supposed to grab *??*


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## bruno_monk (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gti chodite)*

One thing to verify is that he used the red-colored HU removal keys.
Also, there could be a problem if you previously tried to remove the HU yourself using homemade tools and were unsuccessful in your pursuit. This problem, however, is not irreparable and the tech should simply 'fish around' to catch the latch.


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## KESET (Sep 1, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bruno_monk)*

i just picked up my 02' jetta on thursday night and thought the sound kinda sucked compared to other stock stereos.. even my 98 gti sounded cleaner i think. im gonna have a look at the wiring myself after work today and hopefully get some better sound..


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gti chodite)*

I used a cut up CD (regular, not thin). They fit in snug and when I pulled on them, the HU came right on out. Make sure you have the long points toward the outside of the HU. I did the fix in about 40 minutes---not as quick as most of these guys, but it was easy!


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## Ducky 2.0T (Jun 4, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I think that we all should make a call to VW and put in a complaint about the 2002 Monsoon Radio too, that could speed things up for a fix.[HR][/HR]​ let me know about this.. i am doing an english report on vw cs


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DuckyGTI)*

I have called VWofA last Friday and filed a claim with them (ID# 20146846) about the Monsoon issue. They said they have never heard of it. However the lady was very familiar with vwvortex and I pointed her toward the direction of this thread. Then after I have finished reading through the entire thread (over 2 hours) I decided to complete my own swap based on results that others had at dealers.
After the swap it clearly sounded better than before, but it is still nowhere near the quality I was expecting from a 200 W system. I still had the following gripes:
- FM sounds harsh, lot of mid range, no highs or lows
- Fade cuts off front speakers abruptly at the 10 o'clock position
- Right side has more bass and louder than left side at center balance as well as at the full extremes.
So I have called them up Monday again to make note of the TSB and the other case ID(20085200) that I have found here so they should have told me about all that instead of saying that they haven't heard about the problem before.
I have tried to explain to them that it is not a problem with my specific unit but all of them suffer from the above symptoms. The lady said that I'll have to take my car to the dealer and have it checked. I insisted that other's HU and amp has been replaced and that did not make a difference at all and I'd rather save my time going to the dealer getting HU and amp replaced to end up calling them again. The lady said there is nothing they (VWofA CS) can do until I have tried to get my problem resolved at my dealer. I know ahead that it will be a waste of time and new HU and amp but I have no other venue at this point.
So I have called up the dealer and the service advisor has heard about the problem and said that they have performed wire swap on another Jetta before. I told him that I already performed the wire swap but it still sounds like [email protected] So I said I'd take it down there so they can listen to it and confirm that it is still no good, but I wound not leave the car there.
So this is where I'm at. I have to go to the dealer to get the crappy sound confirmed, and probably they will order me a new HU and amp and put it in and it will still sound like the original one which is totally unacceptable, even my wife hears the difference coming from a stock Plymouth Neon, she said the radio is junk compared to the Neon.
I will try to get the car to the dealer sometime to have it checked and confirmed and we'll go from there, I was just really hoping that there are more presistent people here who would do the same to make VWofA realize that this is a real problem and they have to resolve it from their end ASAP.


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## rudyr (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

So, did anyone here listen to the radio before buying the car? Mine didn't sound great, but there were a lot of other things that made up for that shortcoming. Now, the wires are their fault, and they fixed it. Since then, my radio sounds pretty good to me.
However, if a Chevy Cavalier's radio sounds better, does that mean VW has to replace the Monsoon? No, if I really liked the Cavalier's radio so much, I should have bought a Cavalier. VW's obligation is to make sure everything in the car is first and foremost *safe* and functioning properly. If after swapping the wires, the radio is now installed properly and it's simply a matter of the radio/amp/speakers inherent performance, then that isn't their problem.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

During the test drive I was paying attention to the engine sound and noise and did not check the radio. I figured for $350 it should sound at least up to the level of my 2000 Neon's stock HU. Just before we took delivery of the car I tried it out with the sales manager as he was giving us the basic guidance how to operate the wipers etc. and I immediately noticed that something was not right. He agreed with me that the stereo does not sound up to its standard and I'll have to get it checked out later.
You're right that the reason I bough the Jetta was not because of the stereo but because of the 1.8T engine, the 5 speed automatic (only one in its class) the 8 airbags, ASR and ABS.
However there is no Jetta GLS 1.8T on the market without the Monsoon sound which means that I HAD to buy the Monsoon system, if I wanted this particular car, it was not a choice that I made. And for the extra $350 I was truly expecting something more than a sub par sound system that does not live up to other car's half the cost of the Jetta.
Also I did not relally want the Luxury package either, but there were only 8 (!) 1.8T GLS in Texas without the luxiry package and they all had Monsoon.......
The radio is BAD and everyone knows it. I am no audiophile but the FM hurts my ear!!!! I don't think that the single DIN non-Monsoon unit should sound better than the $350 upgraded one (which in fact does sound better).


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

The sound system is *not* functioning properly in my Passat after the wire fix. Fade cut-out beyond the 10/2 oclock positions is not a correct function nor is the absence of bass on the left side. Beyond those distinct malfunctions, I feel the same way as GTakacs.....the sound hurts my ears....it's that bad. I'm glad the wire fix worked for you but just because it worked for you doesn't mean it worked for everyone. I also opened a case with VoA a couple of weeks ago...no. 20138440. I'm not very impressed with their customer service.


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## ryeo (May 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

I'm picking up my 2002 1.8t GTi tomorrow. I haven't heard the stereo yet but with all this feedback on this forum, I'm dreading the moment I turn it on. 
Is there some way to bring legal action against VWoA to fix the problem? Or at least pressure them thru' some kind of consumer protection advocates (ie. Ralph Nader?) ?


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]However, if a Chevy Cavalier's radio sounds better, does that mean VW has to replace the Monsoon? No, if I really liked the Cavalier's radio so much, I should have bought a Cavalier. VW's obligation is to make sure everything in the car is first and foremost *safe* and functioning properly. If after swapping the wires, the radio is now installed properly and it's simply a matter of the radio/amp/speakers inherent performance, then that isn't their problem.[HR][/HR]​I would agree with you if this was the base/stock unit in question, but it's not. The head unit in question is the Upgraded $350 "Premium" Monsoon sound system.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

FYI, the HU is the same in ALL 2002 Golf/Jettas (don't know about Passats).
There is only one "Premium VI" radio.
The *MONSOON* option buys you upgraded speakers and a 200 watt DSP AMP. (made by Delta Electronics, Div of GM)
The HU is made by Matsu****a (division of Panasonic)
Indeed, does this look familiar. From 2000-2001 Audi. My bet is that it is the same unit with a different facia.








More details at the bottom of this page
http://www.ibiblio.org/tkan/audi/radios/radios.html


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

OK, let me rephrase that, then. I would agree with you if this was the base/stock sound system in question, but it's not. The sound system in question is the Upgraded $350 "Premium" Monsoon sound system.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

On the vw.com website it says that the GL trim Jetta and Golf come with Premium V not Premium VI system...... Of course, that can be wrong......
I'll take mine in to the dealer, let them swap everything out, and then I'll call VWofA to fix the friggin' thing...... I advise you all do the same......


[Modified by GTakacs, 7:35 PM 5-21-2002]


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

I spoke to the head guy at my car-audio shop today and I want to answer a couple of questions and clarify a couple of issues about my new aftermarket HU.
MOST IMPORTANTLY: They rewired the entire system because they HAD to--the new HU apparently just would not work with the installed wiring. (As the guy said to me, "Hey, you didn't think we did all that extra work just because we felt like it, did you?" Since they didn't charge me extra for it, the answer is obvious.) My car is a Passat. I cannot say whether the same rewiring would be required for other models.
Yes, they used the Monsoon amp as well as the speakers. I repeat: the Monsoon amp and speakers sound great. Nothing wrong with THEM.
They hadn't gotten my new pocket kit as of this morning, so I probably won't be going back in person for a couple of days. The guy told me there is no reason why the AM reception shouldn't be working, and they'll check it out when I bring it back.
Again--I don't think there is anything especially "right" about the particular aftermarket HU I bought. There is just something WRONG with the double-DIN Monsoon HU. If anyone out there is skeptical, here's a standing invitation: I live on Long Island, not too far from NYC, and I'll be traveling up to Boston at some point this summer. If you can find a way to connect with me so that you can hear my revamped sound system for yourself, you're welcome to do so.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

Thanks for the details, nbcosta. Please forgive me if you have already answered these questions previously, but I don't think you did.
1) Did you experience a distinct lack of bass on the left side of the vehicle before the HU upgrade? And do you now have a perfectly balanced sound after the upgrade?
2) Do you know if they used the speaker level outputs from your new HU to feed the Monsoon amp?
Thanks in advance!


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have called VWofA last Friday and filed a claim with them (ID# 20146846) about the Monsoon issue. They said they have never heard of it. 
.[HR][/HR]​That is such BS! Here is my case number from three weeks ago: 20124030. I cannot believe they don't have some sort of "system" for complaints of the same nature. *WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH THIS COMPANY!!! *


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

I just submitted a new complaint through the vw.com website as calling didn't seem to resolve the problem. I added the fact that the wire-swap didn't fix all the problems even though it has helped a little. I requested them to investigate the event on their own as it affects numerous cars and it is not an isolated case, and I included other's case ID in there for cross reference.
FYI here is a list of case IDs that were posted in this thread so far for easier reference:
20085200 CD_PHX's
20124030 MaryP's
20138440 DanoP's
20146846 GTakacs' no.1 (phone)
20150189 GTakacs' no. 2 (web with added info and cross reference)
I haven't received a response from the originator of this thread weather he has found a resolution yet, but his e-mail list has over 60 names on it with people of the same issue.
All I need to do now is wait for VWofA to give me a call within 48 hours and see what kind of BS they will come up with this time........



[Modified by GTakacs, 10:26 PM 5-21-2002]


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## stlgli (May 21, 2002)

I have a 2002 Jetta gli. I noticed the sound problem and checked the wires at the HU. They appear to be correct....3=yellow, 7=black. Anyone have any ideas. I called the dealer and they said they never heard of the problem.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stlgli)*

#3 should be BLACK and #7 should be YELLOW! The TSB is wrong.


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## TRBOGUY (Apr 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI,
I just want to thank you for the instructions. It took me less than 30 minutes to do the Monsoon fix, thanks to your detailed instructions. In contrary to what some people here feel after the fix, I think my stereo sounds pretty good. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]So, did anyone here listen to the radio before buying the car?[HR][/HR]​not only did i listen, but i noted it to the salesman.
quote:[HR][/HR]Mine didn't sound great, but there were a lot of other things that made up for that shortcoming.[HR][/HR]​so the things on your car that work correctly make up for the things that don't? did any of the other things that made up for the radio not sounding great cost an extra $350 upgrade charge?
quote:[HR][/HR] Now, the wires are their fault, and they fixed it. Since then, my radio sounds pretty good to me.[HR][/HR]​so you went from "didn't sound great" to "sounds pretty good" and you call that fixed? 
quote:[HR][/HR]However, if a Chevy Cavalier's radio sounds better, does that mean VW has to replace the Monsoon? No, if I really liked the Cavalier's radio so much, I should have bought a Cavalier.[HR][/HR]​that makes so little sense to me it makes my head hurt.
quote:[HR][/HR]VW's obligation is to make sure everything in the car is first and foremost *safe* and functioning properly. If after swapping the wires, the radio is now installed properly and it's simply a matter of the radio/amp/speakers inherent performance, then that isn't their problem.[HR][/HR]​the radio is NOT functioning properly - it is NOT "simply a matter of the radio/amp/speakers inherent performance."
since you're now happy with your $350 upgraded stereo system that sounds "pretty good" and you're convinced that vw has met its obligation towards making sure your radio is functioning properly, you don't really need to concern yourself with this thread any longer.


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## 1.8TurboGrin (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Just waited 1 1/2 hours at the local dealer, even armed with all the vwvortex info in hand. I was told the unit was wired correctly and that "they all sound like that" by the service manager who even said that he has the same car and same problem. Funny that he doesn't seem to concerned about it. Now it gets better....after talking to VW service for awhile, I left and went to my car and guess what? The tech left the 4 vw tools to remove the unit on the shif boot! When I arrive at my office parkin lot, I inserted the tools and slid the unit out ant low and behold.....THE UNIT IS WIRED WRONG AS SUSPECTED! I am going to do the pin removeal myself and fire off nastygrams to VW Consumer Service. I just got this car and am REALLY let down by the level of service once again, having bad past experiences with the stealership.
I didn't even want to get into the surging problem that has just started with the 1.8t!


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1.8TurboGrin)*

We are obviously dealing with service departments that are potentially competent just won't go beyond the TSB (which we know is f*cking wrong) because they won't get paid on work outside of an identified issue.
Unfortunately warranty work has pre-defined time periods set for a particular problem. This system, IMNSHO, discourages dealers from going deeper into a problem since they are not sure they are not going to be paid for time. If VW is run like Audi, techs are paid like lawyers, a base salary (which isn't much) and billable hours.
What we need is a tech with a big ego and mad skilz to go deeper into the problem. All my connections are on the Audi side and they are so busy I can't get a favor.
I have been massaging the local Sound Advice under the pretense that I would buy a new head unit (I just might if all technical issues are fixed with the Monsoon and it still sucks) and have an appointment today with the lead installer there. It's a new store and I am a past customer so we'll see how deep he is willing to go. 
I'd kill for a test CD to test phase. Is there something commercially available like Avia for home theater?
I firmly believe this is a warranty issue I will address it with my dealer. I have little confidence in that process since the existing TSB is obviously wrong. I do not believe there is a revised TSB at this time. Nobody has been able to produce it or give the name of a dealer that has it for our techs to call.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

Having worked for both manufacturer and dealer I can see why the dealer won't do it as they inded will not get paid, and even more importantly, can get repremanded by the manufaturer if something goes wrong.
It falls under the old *"more than my jobs worth"* scenario








We were lucky at my old dealer (Audi/Porsche/Chevrolet?) as I was Cust Svc/Asst Svc mgr so I had the time to go out and drive cars that tech were having problems with. I used this approach at my current VW dlr and Svc Director was very cool and they sent in a report, twice now as they also sent one when I pointed out and emailed them the info on the TSB being wrong


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

I just got off the phone with VWofA customer service. I have talked with a really nice guy who was trying too do everything he could to get this issue resolved. However he hit a brick wall just as all of us did before.
Basically his advice was, in spite of proving him that it was a problem affecting every dual DIN Monsoon owner by giving him other people's case IDs, to go to the dealer and try to get it resolved there. I will go to the dealer probably in a week or so to try to get it resolved by getting a new HU a new amp and after that a refund of my money as the unit does not live up to its standards.
I advise all of you who are still not happy with your dual DIN Monsoon unit to file a claim with VWofA (it takes about 10 minutes but hopfully will worth it) and write down your case ID. Please e-mail me your case ID and vehicle type so I can keep a list of these on hand so hopefully in some time we will be able to go to VWofA again with more than 5 names to enlighten them about the situation.
The e-mail address you would want to send your info to is [email protected]
Looking forward getting your mail. If you've already filed a claim please e-mail me your claim ID so I can keep track of those too. The only way we will get this issue resolved is if we get to the bottom of it by harrasing VWofA and your local dealer who has very little to do with the matter unfortunately....... The Internet is very powerful tool, let's use it to get this one resolved!!!


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## 1.8TurboGrin (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Boy did I already hit that brick wall of stupidity at the dealership today. Count me in on your quest! I just need to get the vin number of my car to log the complaint with VW. This system is so bad it hurts my ears too. I miss my 96 passat's premium stereo which was by far superior to the Monsoon unit. I reluctantly did not test the car with a cd in it when I bought it. Driving it off the lot with a cd I just put in did I realize that all the bass was coming from the right. Thank goodness for this forum and all the power it can give us in resolving these problems. I will be waiting for my call from VW within the 48 hour period to vent my fustration further. If I knew the Monsoon system sounded this bad, I never would have bought it. "Priemium"....my **s!


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## hotpprs (May 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1.8TurboGrin)*

I did the wire repair a few weeks ago and have been trying to convince myself that everything sounds great. (Believe it or not, I did not had a sound system in my previous car for 12 years, because I worked in an area where I had to worry about my car being broken into). So anything should sound great, I thought, especially a premium sound system. But right away I didn't think it sounded right.
The highs were always great, so I am not sure if my system is working better than other people who did the swap. Some have said that even the highs are crappy and they get crackling even after the wire swap. The only problem I feel I have now is poor overall bass. It is annoying to listen to CD's on high volume for too long. Being that I plan to have this car for a long long time, I can't see putting up with that, but I am not going to dump money into a car I spent over $25,000 on,(that's with the tax and finance charges over 4 years).
So I am hopeful someone can get to the bottom of this, maybe we should all copy this forum or send it to VW of America? Then they can't claim they aren't aware of a mass problem? I would think they would not want to get a reputation for having poor sounding music systems, so you would think they would want to resolve this before the 2003's come out. Also, you want to have loyal customers. It's much easier to keep an existing customer than to recruit a new one. This is my first VW and I am more than a little annoyed being that I have been waiting 12 years to get to listen to some good tunes while I am driving again, and now I have to keep the volume down so I don't get a headache.










[Modified by hotpprs, 6:36 PM 5-22-2002]


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hotpprs)*

hotpprs, please file the claim with VWofA and send me your caseID!!!


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## hotpprs (May 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

I'm not going to file a claim until I hear what a "normal" VW soundsystem sounds like from the last couple of model years. I don't want to look like a total idiot if that is just the best it gets. As I said, I haven't had a car stereo so I really don't know what to expect. Maybe I'm expecting the kind of bass you get from a subwoofer?
I think I will do what I suggested, send them a hardcopy of this forum, and see what reply they send me.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hotpprs)*

Good luck on that one! I've included a link to this thread when I filed my complaint and the rep said they were not allowed to look at it....... So good luck waving a hard copy to your dealer or sending a copy to VWofA. Also all you need to do is sit in a Jetta GL or Beetle that does not have the Double DIN or the Monsoon on the dealer lot and you will hear the difference. I know my Plymouth Neon sounds a LOT better than the system in the Jetta!
But feel free to do your own research, people who had stereos in their cars before know that the Double DIN HU is a joke and should be trashed.


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## Filmcan (Dec 9, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

I must add to this 17 page complaint...
Just got my car from the dealer, asked them to fix my DD Monsoon, told them the TSB was wrong, I was told my car was wired correctly, like its been said before, the dealer will not do anything if its not in a formal letter from VW. Even the service guy I spoke to said he has read this form (he was the only one there who knew what i was talking about) but still they will not change it. Guess I have to do it myself. 
I have sent GTakacs my Ref# from me talking to the useless VWoA customer service. They told me my dealer can help with this matter, my dealer won't do anything unless VWoA tells them its OK. 
Mother F***ers


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## 1.8TurboGrin (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Filmcan)*

Just reread my receipt for the 1 1/2 hour dealer visit today that did absolutely nothingto fix the sh***y Monsoon radio. It states " teminal 3 is black, terminal 7 is yellow. Okay. Wiring is fine" 
I pulled the unit out since the tech left the special vw keys in the car and guess what...the wiring is reversed. I echo Filmcan's comments....mother f***ers

























































To add insult to injury, it also says "there is base in both speakers in the front. No problem found with radio." Yeah...there is bass in both speakers, just way more in the right and almost nonexistant in the left.


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## TyperDude27 (Apr 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

I have no clue what the heck you guys are complaining about, i got a 2002 jetta 1.8T with the monsoon, and it sounds good too me, i blasted a few CD's, with full bass, and it sounds pretty clear and loud...then again, i don't know what a "good" sound system is supposed to be, my integra typeR had a ****ty sound system...
i called my vw dealer, and they have no idea what i am talking about for a monsoon fix... did this affect canadian cars as well?


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## J.R. Rogers (Dec 29, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Filmcan)*

Ok, here's my experience. One more to add to the pile. First of all, I have a great dealership with a great service department that actually cares about getting things fixed right. Once the wire swap was done (the service advisor DID know that the TSB was wrong and DID know the proper fix), I still get no bass on the left channel...
Pan right, good solid sub bass, pan left, the bass is completely scooped out and the speaker still sounds out of phase. The service advisor and the tech both agreed that something was wrong. They pulled it into the service bay and replaced the speaker. Same problem. Replaced the amp. Same problem. Replaced the HU. Same problem. Answer (from the service advisor): The VW Monsoon Head Units suck. He said that the amp and speakers were "decent" but that the Delco HU is trash and there's nothing more that he can do.
Conclusion:
Swapped wires = slightly better crap
Swapped Amp = Same
Swapped HU = Same
--------------------------
Monsoon=crap
VW is going to hear from me on this. I want my money back, dammit! Knowing what I know now, I wouldn't have bought the Monsoon. Problem is, it's very difficult to go change now because installing an aftermarket system is not that simple. Apparently, there's no ignition switch wire, meaning that your aftermarket stereo will always be on until you manually turn it off. 
*COME ON, VOLKSWAGEN! IF YOU'RE GOING TO PUT A CRAP STEREO IN A CAR, AT LEAST MAKE IT SO THE CONSUMER CAN EASILY CHANGE IT OUT!*
J.R.


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## J.R. Rogers (Dec 29, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

Just finished putting in my case with VW. Folks, *PLEASE* go to VW's website, click on Contact VW, then click on Customer Care and fill out the form.
VW owes us a decent stereo without problems, or they owe us our money back for the Monsoon option, and agree not to void the warranty of our cars when we take the money and go buy real stereos for these vehicles. This is the only fair answer to this problem.
J.R.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

J.R. Rogers and 1.8 TurboGrin, PLEASE send me your caseIDs!!! I need to collect more of these IDs to make a case...... I'd rather collect IDs and experiences here than go to the dealer and waste my time.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

heh, at least theres some people out there who realize the value of deductive reasoning...
One note though, I suggest you check your fade and balance controls, if they put in a new HU, chances are it needs to be recoded to correct the problems(fade cuts out front speakers at 10'oclock, and the balance is instaneous, and needs to be a gradual/delayed reaction kinda thing)
Im thinkin theres more wires that are out of wack myself. what we need is a complete working, good system that was re-wired, and works, (ponders the poster above that had an aftermarket installed and had the wiring rewired) and then get a monsoon HU put back in *grin* (wonder if the Monsoon installers would have to rewire...) and with the recode, see how things go, but ahh well, only people who have time to do that is VW itself...


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

yo j.r. - go back to page 16 and read the posts by nbcosta (also read my reply to him and his reply to me). nbcosta still has his monsoon amp and speakers, but got a new non-monsoon HU and a COMPLETE NEW WIRING JOB from amp to speakers to HU, etc. you'll see in his post that he is reporting excellent performance from his speakers and amp.
nbcosta confirmed for me beyond a doubt that the problem lies in the wiring AND not the wiring in the harness, but the wiring in the car. however, because nbcosta can't put his old monsoon HU back, we don't know whether the problem was the wiring AND the HU, or just the wiring. my best guess is that the HUs are probably ok and it's a wiring problem, but it could be both.
and oto - while you're right that j.r.'s new HU probably needs to be recoded since they seem to come from the factory with the default setting being non-monsoon, the recoding does NOT fix the fader problem - or at least, it didn't matter in my case.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I did switch out my HU with another Monsoon HU.....and there was no change at all. No left bass though I didn't check the fader.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

I think I am finally learning the ropes and the way WVofA customer service operates.......
So far I have collected case IDs from 7 people not including me. Armed with that information and the fact that this thread has been viewed over 20000 times and been responded close to 600 times I felt I have a case with VWofA. Unfortunately that is now how it went down tonight with the customer service supervisor (a very nice but authoritative lady).
I have called in one more time to VWofA customer service and presented my initial case ID as basis of conversation. I have then told the rep (another nice lady) that since my initial report I have done a fair amount of research and I have concluded that my case is not an isolated incident but one of many unhappy customers that own the Monsoon with the Dual DIN in their 2002 VW car. I have told the lady that I'd like them to review the cases together and start a research to find the problem.
She told me that I will have to contact the dealer to get my problem resolved as there is nothing they can do since there is no information in my file about a dealer having reviewd my problem (I never took it to the dealer). I have told her that I know at least 2 cases where the dealer has tried to replace the HU and Amp with no luck and it would be a waste of my time and VW's money for me to go to the dealer. She told me that even though I know the case IDs to similar cases she can not discuss those cases with me over the phone. Then I responded saying that vwvortex has been covering the issue for over 2 months now and there are a lot of pissed customers that use VW's name in the same sentence as the "F" word and such and it is probably not in the company's best interest to ignore my case.
I have asked for her supervisor as she ws unable to help me any further other than telling me I need to take my car to the dealership to get the problem fixed. She also advised that I can send a letter to the president but she also told me that the letter would probably end up in their department.
So I asked for the supervisor and since there was only one on duty I was put on hold for a while. She came and I told the same story all over again. This is where the interesting part comes. She stated that vwvortex.com is not associated by VWofA therefore whatever I read there is irrelevant to my case. She also stated that VWofA customer service reviews complaints on a CASE BY CASE basis and I have no way of getting it through to them as a global issue. It will become a global issue once they hear about it from the customers AND dealers and they cannot resolve it. Until then it is handled on the individual level. And since my complaint file has no signs of me ever taking the car to the dealer to address the problem there is nothing she could do, it is up to someone else to get the big picture, that she has no knowledge of who it is and the customers have no way of contacting them. For me the customer service center supervisor is as high as it gets.
She also stated that if a case becomes an investigation and a solution is found they will contact each individual who has filed a complaint via letter or phone call to tell them about the solution. I kindly remided her that there is a TSB issued by VWofA in the matter, yet when I called in, instead of telling me about that, they told me to take my car to the dealer. She said that TSBs are one of many tools that dealers utilize to resolve any particular case and them telling me to take it to the dealer was the proper response as the dealer will try different venues to find remedy to my problem (ie. looking up TSBs swaping HUs and amps and such). I completely understood that TSBs are really for the dealers and not for nosy customers who want to get the stuff done. So this is where VWofA customer service is coming from. Then my only complaint was that whoever wrote the TSB did not do a thorough job finding the real problem and the real solution to it. So naturally I asked how I could contact the person in charge of the particular TSB. Her obvious answer was that she has no way of finding that out and/or telling me.
So she told me one more time that my only venue at this point is to go to the dealer and get them to look at the issue. But she also told me that I should let the customer service know when I am going to the dealer and which dealer I am going to so they can collaborate with the dealer on a possible solution. She also told me that I should advise the dealer about my case ID with VWofA so they can contact them on the spot as my car is being tested. This was something new!!!

If you have managed to read through all my rambling here is your well deserved
CONCLUSION:
- The reason others have failed to get their problem fixed is lack of presistency. You have to insist that the stereo's quality is sub-par even after the wire fix and you have to let your dealer know that you do not consider your radio repaired.
- You need to contact VWofA before you take it to the dealer that you are experiencing this problem and you need to let them know that when and where you are planning on taking your car. You also need to let your dealer know that there is a case on file with VWofA for you.
- You must not beleive that "if all 2002 Monsoons with dual DIN sound like that, this must be OK". You have to stand up to your toes if needed to get it done!

I would like thank everyone who has sent their case ID to me even if it was no help in my case. I will take in my car to the dealer 6/3/02 in the morning and I will stand next to it until they figure out what kind of solution they can offer me to solve my case. I HIGHLY recommend you doing the same, and never settle for less than perfect!!! I will post about my case as I have more info......


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Great work Gtakacs trying to get to the bottom of this. I've been making my rounds to the various Best Buys and Circuit Cities talking to as many techs as I can to better understand how the Monsoon system works in the Passat....it seems like I get a different perspective each time. One guy says the speakers are designed to work with the amp and another says an aftermarket HU can drive them.







I'll give my dealer another call tomorrow....the manager says a VW rep is working on the problem, but of course, who really knows.


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## h2ovwdrvr (Oct 12, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Not everyone is having the same problems with there dd monsoon systems. My car is less than 3 weeks old and the monsoon in it sounds awsome it is simply the best stock system I have heard. A friend of mine has had problems with his 02 dd monsoon he took his to the dealership I bought my car from Miramar VW Audi and they did a wire swap and reprogrammed it and it sounds very good. I have a friend who works for a major car audio distributor he is a real critic and said it sounded very good. 
It seems to me that they have fixed the problem finnally my car had only been on the lot a day the build date is very recent


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## FLACOMAN (May 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (h2ovwdrvr)*

What was the build date ?
TIA


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## jimmy-buffett (Apr 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (h2ovwdrvr)*

h2ovwdrvr said:
quote:[HR][/HR]Not everyone is having the same problems with there dd monsoon systems. My car is less than 3 weeks old and the monsoon in it sounds awsome it is simply the best stock system I have heard. A friend of mine has had problems with his 02 dd monsoon he took his to the dealership I bought my car from Miramar VW Audi and they did a wire swap and reprogrammed it and it sounds very good. I have a friend who works for a major car audio distributor he is a real critic and said it sounded very good. 
It seems to me that they have fixed the problem finnally my car had only been on the lot a day the build date is very recent 
[HR][/HR]​oto said:
quote:[HR][/HR]heh, at least theres some people out there who realize the value of deductive reasoning...
One note though, I suggest you check your fade and balance controls, if they put in a new HU, chances are it needs to be recoded to correct the problems(fade cuts out front speakers at 10'oclock, and the balance is instaneous, and needs to be a gradual/delayed reaction kinda thing)
Im thinkin theres more wires that are out of wack myself. what we need is a complete working, good system that was re-wired, and works, (ponders the poster above that had an aftermarket installed and had the wiring rewired) and then get a monsoon HU put back in *grin* (wonder if the Monsoon installers would have to rewire...) and with the recode, see how things go, but ahh well, only people who have time to do that is VW itself...
[HR][/HR]​Did I miss something?  Has a 100% correlation been made between fader problems and reprogramming/recoding the radio to fix that? Can anybody quote another post where this has all been stated, with the right codes, etc? I seem to remember somebody checking their codes, having the right codes (00031 if I remember right) and still having the fader problems.
I'm still having the fader problem but I've just had the wiring swap done (at the dealer), if there is a definitive solution for the fader problem please link/quote/re-post it. Thanks!


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## 1.8TurboGrin (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Logged my complaint this morning. Here's the case number: 20152292 They didn't even ask for my vin number...hmmmmm. The woman interestingly enough suggested that I take it to another dealer to have them listen to it. Why can't the local dealer hear the same thing? Is their hearing better 20 miles further away at another dealer? She also said that since the first dealer found the unit supposively operating to specs, they cannot authorize additional work. When I go in for my next oil change, I will state my case once again. Problem is I really don't want to wait another 2 months for this to be looked at again. If I get more p**sed off, I might just march myself over there and ask to speak to the tech who so kindly worked on my car and left the removal tools in it for me. This person either did me a favor because they know the wiring is wrong and they could not repair it because of the dealership orders or they are just plain deaf and stupid! My suspicion is that the tech isn't stupid and did me a favor. 
I drive at least 2 hours a day in my car commuting to work and all the time I am in the car this stereo is constantly reminding me just how sh**ty it is and how good my old Passat stereo was. No problems with bass, muddiness, rightside balance, overly harsh at all. This stereo hurts my ears, more so on certain cd's, but overall there is something VERY WRONG.
Hopefully, with enough complaints, we can get to the bottom of this Has anyone ever had there car bought back under the lemon law because of a bad stereo...heh heh.


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## hotpprs (May 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Did you swap out the same model 2002 HU? Is it possible to swap in a single DIN HU into the 2002's without any major rewiring just for testing purposes? Does anyone in this forum have an older VW that can try this? It sounds like an easy way to determine if it is the HU or not. There must be someone out there who is technical enough to get to the bottom of this, since it appears that VW either isn't fully aware of the magnitude of the problem, or is stonewalling everyone because it would cost a small fortune to replace thousands of 2002 HU's.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hotpprs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Did you swap out the same model 2002 HU? Is it possible to swap in a single DIN HU into the 2002's without any major rewiring just for testing purposes? Does anyone in this forum have an older VW that can try this? It sounds like an easy way to determine if it is the HU or not. There must be someone out there who is technical enough to get to the bottom of this, since it appears that VW either isn't fully aware of the magnitude of the problem, or is stonewalling everyone because it would cost a small fortune to replace thousands of 2002 HU's.[HR][/HR]​That's exactly what I was just wondering. Swapping in a single DIN monsoon HU that supposedly sounds so great would be very useful as far as troubleshooting goes....assuming it was coded correctly for the car.


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## BenReich (May 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Cut my wires at the amp last night in my 2002 GTI 1.8T ... sounds much better now. The stereo separation is the most notable difference overall, and there is more bass. The left side still sounds different from the right if you listen to each individually, but with the balance set to the center, they sound pretty even.
I'm still not happy with the way FM radio sounds though, it's crap compared to what it should be. Like most have said here though, I listen to CDs more anyway, and they have gained 100% improvement from the wire swap.
Question though: if I get a new head unit now, say an Alpine or something, and I take my car into the place for them to install it, am I going to have problems since I switched the wires at the amp? Will they need to swap the wires back? Would my sound quality be improved by getting a new head unit at this point? 
Ben


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (h2ovwdrvr)*

It seems to me that they have fixed the problem finnally my car had only been on the lot a day the build date is very recent 
_______________________________________________________________________________
Not very likely at all since they haven't even acknowledged the problem! I would bet that you have one of the few that may have been wired correctly. Or, you need to take your HU out and see if it's wired correctly---you may be surprised at how much better it sounds even though you think it's fine now.


[Modified by MaryP, 11:17 AM 5-23-2002]


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## daven (May 20, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

quote:[HR][/HR]That seems like a thoroughly retarded place for such a sensor. Am I missing something!? So far I've been impressed with the "superior German engineering", but this has got me stumped. Oh well!
The sensor is there so that if someone tries to pull your radio out when the alarm is armed, it will go off. Because the radio wasn't seated all the way in the first place, I'm guessing that the alarm never armed (that honk signifies that the alarm is armed). I suspect the alarm will only arm when all sensors report a given status -- all doors must be closed, the trunk must be closed, and the radio has to be properly seated. Otherwise, pressing 'lock' will only lock the doors...
can anyone confirm this??? isnt this a SERIOUS problem??? my jetta 2002 doesnt honk also (all i get is a flash on the lights but thats what the manual saids also, nothing about the honk going off)???[HR][/HR]​To be specific, looking at the face of the HU, the switch is located on the lower right. The switch is a normally open switch. It is depressed (closed) when the little removal tool is inserted in the slot on the face of the HU. In some cases, it can also be depressed if the HU is not fully seated in the slot. If this is the case, the alarm will not be able to fully arm. The solution would be to reseat the HU.
Alternately, the alarm may be programmed to NOT beep and to only flash when activating. Your dealer can change this by uploading the proper codes.
If you want to test out if you radio is the fault, try following http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 instructions for removing HU. Once the radio is slid out an inch, the switch would be open. It only makes contact while the removal tool is inserted (or possibly if the little clasp on the side isn't fully seated in the HU frame). If you try this, remember to remove the insertion tool so the switch can open. 
You can actually see the switch (and maybe hear it click) if you look closely in behind the clasp. Good luck.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jimmy-buffett)*

I just got off the phone with my service manager at the dealer I go to. he says that he hasn't gotten any info on any specifics of the recoding. He gave me what I believe the typical run around, but I asked for general category, anything at all about region of recoding that should be looked at for the monsoon. 
I can't say that recoding will work in everyones case, but It worked in mine sposedly, the VWtech doing the recode apparently. 
I also told the service manager just now after he asked how it was working, that the left side audio is still weaker than the right. He said there was another tech in next thursday, so im gonna go then, and prove just how the sound works...
I can say that, from everything ive read, and everything ive had done to my system in attempt to repair it, that AMPS don't fix the problem, HU's don't fix the problem, BUT BUT BUT...if you are taking it to a dealer to get your problems fixed, LET THEM DO IT...The only way they are going to learn that it won't fix it, is if you let them do what they think is neccessary, then you can go, 'well, that didn't work, WHAT NOW' and then they get annoyed at you and call the vw techs to come down...If you can't be without cars ect, get them to give you a rental(they did the rental thing for me cuz they wanted my car for the day, and it was on thier charge I paid nothing obviously...)**note, my car is only 2 months old, 1800 miles at this point, others might be older and is there a 1 year everything goes warranty that they don't want to mess with? I don't know, it might make a difference
I think persistance as has been mentioned before (and practiced in my case) is going to eventually get satisfaction, but I don't personally like the amount of persistance that it requires for this issue...I am just glad that I have other sources of info(unlike others who know nothing of these sites and problems) otherwise they would just tell me, sorry, don't know what it is, and I would accept it for good enough audio...
I think something else might be required though..such as shlepping the email addresses of VWoA's corp execs, and bypassing customer service altogether.
I know somewhat of the corp structure. I work in a corp environment. If you pester the right people, someone might care just enough to raise it in internal dealings, and light a fire under someones butt, but if your dealing with the 'policies' of a customer service department, they are gonna go 'policy' and not bother to do much else, and no one else might know of it...or, if someone low down in the pole says something, they might just be slaped back into place, and the whole thing ignored...Gauranteeeeeed, if the president of a company says 'hey, we need to do something bout this' that something is gonna get done, policies get re-written...If I a lowly mis tech says to my boss something, he tells me, sorry I can't do much, look at policy...


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## hiphopcongress (May 23, 2002)

*RADIO = NOT BUY?*

So I was sure I was buying a 2002 Jetta GLS so I came here to see what people have ahd to say...
let me just say that I have read all 18 pages of this thread and it is really discouraging me from buying a Jetta...
SHould I make this jump? Overall, are you happy with your cars? Is it worth the headahce? or should I just get the standard stock system?
thanks


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: RADIO = NOT BUY? (hiphopcongress)*

Don't let this hold you up from buying a GLS. It's a great little car. The radio, once the fix is applied, sounds great with CD's. Just FM in my opinion is bad. There will be a fix to the fader problem, if you want to call it a problem. Us Dubbers are persistant if anything. 
Thank goodness my dealer was actually appreciative that I told him the TSB was wrong. He thanked me for bringing it to their attention.


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## h2ovwdrvr (Oct 12, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

Mine was wired right from the factory or the dealer rewired it in there prep on the car. I popped it apart today after cruising around Southern California with my boss all day he likes my car so much we had to stop at the VW dealer for him to look at one for his wife we listened to a stock system in a wagon if you want to talk about crap that is it. 
the sound is by no means as good as my yamaha home system but for a car system it is very good
as far as build date mine is in april I would have to run to my car to get the exact date and I don't know if my neighbors would enjoy watching my fat a** running across the parking lot in my boxers to my car


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (h2ovwdrvr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Mine was wired right from the factory or the dealer rewired it in there prep on the car. I popped it apart today [HR][/HR]​So you saw a row of 4 black wires with a row of 4 colored wires next to that? Remember, the TSB the dealers are/were getting is wrong.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jimmy-buffett)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Did I miss something? Has a 100% correlation been made between fader problems and reprogramming/recoding the radio to fix that?[HR][/HR]​NO!!! no correlation whatsoever has been made and there is no definitive solution to the fader problem. oto is the only one on the thread reporting that the recoding fixed the fader problem and no offense to oto, but the truth is, he has no idea what was done to his car in regards to recoding and i quote his post of 1:10pm 5/23:
quote:[HR][/HR]I just got off the phone with my service manager at the dealer I go to. he says that he hasn't gotten any info on any specifics of the recoding. He gave me what I believe the typical run around, but I asked for general category, anything at all about region of recoding that should be looked at for the monsoon.[HR][/HR]​


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

yes, I have stated that I don't know the specifics, only what they told me







, BUT...
For the fader/balance issues only (not the weak left side audio and the wiring issue)
New HU's don't solve the problem
New Amps don't solve the problem
Inference can be drawn, I think, to programming. I say, let the dealers do the swaps, let them do whatever they can to fix the problem, but you got to keep going back, and keep saying its not fixed, and your not satisfied, ect...
in closing, I have not said that there is a direct correlation between the fader/balance issue, and the reprogramming, just that I had the problem fixed with the reprogramming, and since I had both HU and AMP replaced, and neither worked, AS many here are reporting as well, then reprogramming is the next logical step for the fader and balance issues...don't you think?


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## J.R. Rogers (Dec 29, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]yo j.r. - go back to page 16 and read the posts by nbcosta (also read my reply to him and his reply to me). nbcosta still has his monsoon amp and speakers, but got a new non-monsoon HU and a COMPLETE NEW WIRING JOB from amp to speakers to HU, etc. you'll see in his post that he is reporting excellent performance from his speakers and amp.
[HR][/HR]​Thanks for pointing that out. I had read that post, but I don't believe it proves there are problems with the wires. Likely, the installer ran into the problem of no ignition switch wire, and had to do some creative wiring to get it to work right AT ALL. Sorry, I'm skeptical that there is a problem with the actual wires. I'm more inclined to believe that it's just a sorry A$$ head unit, and VW wants to keep us from upgrading to another HU by making it as difficult as possible. None of it makes any sense.
BTW: After the dealer replaced my head unit and it didn't solve the problem, they put the old one back in. So no reprogramming necessary I guess. The faders seem to be working fine.
J.R.


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## J.R. Rogers (Dec 29, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

GTakacs, thanks for your persistence. VWoA customer service is totally USELESS. I know how to save VW a million bucks a year. Sack the customer service department and replace them with a tape recorder saying over and over... "There's absolutely nothing we can do. We are useless. Contact your dealer. There's absolutely nothing we can do. We are useless. Contact your dealer." That's pretty much all they say, anyway. Here's how my story goes:
1. Go to dealer to get the problem resolved
2. dealer acknowledges the problem, replaces everything to no avail.
3. Dealer says that all they can do is replace parts. Recommends I call customer service
4. Call customer service, who says "There's nothing we can do. Call your dealer."
5. Call dealer, who says "We've replaced all the parts. There's nothing we can do. Call customer service."
6. Call customer service, who says "There's nothing we can do. Call your dealer."
Around and around we go! Weeeeeee!






















I am going to work with the dealer to schedule an appointment with the regional repair rep. I'm taking this as far as I possibly can. And I may write a letter to the president of Volkswagen in Germany.
What I find funny about this whole thing is that Volkswagen aggressively markets their vehicles to a segment of people that generally care about music, and audio quality. How this stereo system ever got out of their test lab is beyond me. I think they've got their customer service people stamp-approving changes to the vehicles. No product manager in his right mind would have approved this stereo system.
J.R.


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## Filmcan (Dec 9, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

I got my car back from the dealer, they would not swap the wires, they said mine are wired correctly. They said "thats the way it sounds" I have 3 reference #s through VW Customer service, they said the same, have your dealer fix it - yes.. around and around we go.
I spent 30 minutes yesterday, made my own pin removal tool and swapped my wires at the amp. Yes there is an improvement, seperation is 100x better, bass sounds better. It does sound like my right speaker is blown, I think its just a rattle in the door. 
I recommend the wire swap, much improvement from before. I'm still not 100% satisfied that is the only problem. If I have time next week I will bring it back to the dealer and let them hear it and show them the wire swap is a step in the right direction.
Thanks UKAUSSIE







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Filmcan)*

Just did the wire swap for someone. My time is getting better---15 minutes!








*Noticeably better sound.* Didn't have time to check FM or Fader issues, was in a hurry. 


[Modified by MaryP, 5:13 PM 5-24-2002]


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]yes, I have stated that I don't know the specifics, only what they told me







, BUT...[HR][/HR]​again, no offense, but the truth is, you don't truly know that there was in fact any recoding done to your car, much less what the recoding involved. you yourself said after your most recent discussion with the dealer, you believed you were getting "the typical run around." well, in this thread, "the typical run around" generally involves the dealer saying they did the wire swap when in fact they didn't, so i think it's a possibility that you were told there was recoding done when there wasn't. even if you give your dealer the benefit of the doubt and assume there was some recoding done, you still have no idea what that recoding involved (and the fact that your dealer said something about recoding "the cluster" makes me suspicious).
quote:[HR][/HR]in closing, I have not said that there is a direct correlation between the fader/balance issue, and the reprogramming, just that I had the problem fixed with the reprogramming[HR][/HR]​yep, no one is attributing that to you, in fact, i was trying to clear it up for j.r. that no one has made the direct correlation he was asking about.
quote:[HR][/HR]I had both HU and AMP replaced, and neither worked, AS many here are reporting as well, then reprogramming is the next logical step for the fader and balance issues...don't you think?[HR][/HR]​oto and j.r. - i do still have the nagging feeling that ultimately, this is an HU issue, however, nbcosta's situation raised the possiblity of a larger wiring issue outside of the harness and until we can rule that possibility out - like we've ruled out the HU swap and the amp swap - i'm going to keep it on the table. and j.r., apparently, they didn't just do some "creative wiring" on nbcosta's car, they COMPLETELY rewired it from the ground up (stereo wiring only of course). i wish to god that nbcosta could put a correctly coded dd HU back in his newly wired car as that would allow us to rule out a larger wiring issue, but it ain't gonna happen.
there have been some other more scientific posts dealing with phase issues and wiring and such that also make me think there is the possibility of a larger wiring issue. i'll have to go back through the thread and see if i can find specifics.


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## TreyS (Apr 18, 2002)

*Monsoon HU Hidden screens (EQ fix)*

Someone posted earlier that the MKIV DD HUs are made by the same company that made the Audi DD HUs. 










The Audi HUs have hidden screens, one is an EQ adjustment section. *Can someone test this on the Monsoon and see if it works?*
Here is the part on the EQ settings:
*Hidden Equalizer*
The following is the procedure on how to access and adjust the "hidden" equalizer feature in the Audi Symphony radio. 
1. Turn off radio. 
2. While pressing and holding the Preset 5 button, turn on radio. 
3. You'll see a series of 8 digits displayed. From the factory, it's set to "55555555". You will not hear any sound when running in this mode. 
4. The first four digits correspond to the four equalizer bands (low, low-mid, upper-mid, high) for the front speakers, and the last four digits are the same for the rear speakers. The level can be set from 1 (minimum) to 9 (maximum). 
5. Turn the volume control knob to increase or decrease the level for the band (which is blinking). To advance to the next band, press the P.Scan button. 
6. When you are done, turn off radio, then turn it back on to hear the results. 

here are the other hidden settings:
http://www.ibiblio.org/tkan/audi/radios/symphony.html 
This might not work but it's worth a try. I won't get my GTI for three more weeks so I'm hoping one of you will try this.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## chodite (Oct 11, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Funny story. I took my GTI to the local dealership svc. center for the wire swap for my 2002 monsoon system. They had no idea what I was talking about, which obviously scared me. So I'm back there watching him *attempt* to take out the HU... he can't get it out, after 1/2 hour of trying. 
I take the car to another dealership a week later. They tell me that they need to REPLACE the HU because 'someone' tried to use the wrong tool in there and damaged it. They charge it to VWoA and cover it under warranty. 
The great news -
They re-coded it and obviously replaced the whole HU and it sounds like a WHOLE NEW SYSTEM! Wow. They said the old one was wired correctly *?*, so who knows why it sounded like doo-doo b4. But it rocks now and I couldn't be more happy. Real thumping bass and just an overall amazing sound in my GTI now. If you have NOT got this looked at, I suggest you do.
Only problem now.... my alarm doesn't 'beep' when I press the button on the remote. GRRR.


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## M0 (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gti chodite)*

I had the same thing happen to me I lost the Beep. no biggie! 
quote:[HR][/HR].....looked at, I suggest you do.
Only problem now.... my alarm doesn't 'beep' when I press the button on the remote. GRRR.[HR][/HR]​


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## TreyS (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (M0)*

Try pushing in the radio a little. If it doesn't "seat" the beep function is lost. SO tech don't put the radio back in all the way and you will have a beepless alarm.


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

I won't be able to get back to my car-audio installer until after the Memorial Day weekend, so I still can't answer a couple of the questions some posters have asked, but I can point out a couple of things:
To ROCKETWEB: yes, I definitely experienced a "lack of bass" before getting the aftermarket HU. I didn't even realize how bad the problem was until I turned on the new unit and immediately said, "Wow!" (or maybe it was "Holy s***!", but let's try to keep things clean here.) I didn't notice whether the problem was especially worse on the left side than on the right. The sound is now the same on both sides.
HOWEVER--when sitting in the driver's seat of my Passat, the system sounds weighted to the left. When sitting on the passenger's side, it sounds weighted to the right. In other words, there is insufficient stereo mixing. Way back on page 1 or 2 of this thread, someone complained about the speaker placement on the Passat, saying the tweeters had no business being where they are. I suspect he is right. This information would not necessarily pertain to owners of other car models. And since the overall sound is so much better than with the Monsoon HU, I'm not going to bother having the old speakers ripped out and new ones installed someplace else.
J.R.ROGERS has raised another issue concerning the only problem (apart from the absence of all AM reception) that I've experienced with my aftermarket HU. VW/Monsoon have clearly made it as difficult as possible to replace the HU with an aftermarket unit. Thus the requirement of a complete rewiring to make the new HU operate at all. The lack of an ignition switch wire in the VW also means that the new HU cannot be operated with the key in the ignition but the engine turned off (in other words, there's no accessory position). I was given a choice between having the HU linked to the engine (meaning the engine would have to be running for the HU to work) or the battery (meaning the display, at least, is on all the time). I opted for the latter but am reconsidering.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gti chodite)*

quote:[HR][/HR]They re-coded it and obviously replaced the whole HU and it sounds like a WHOLE NEW SYSTEM! Wow.[HR][/HR]​helpful to this thread would be to know what it means by "they re-coded it". also, how is it obvious that they replaced the HU? did you get a new radio card with your new safe code? did you confirm a change in serial #s on the unit? last but not least, it'd be great to know if your wires in the harness are in the correct position. thanks!


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

In reference to the issue of VW not providing an ignition swithched 12v wire...I took off the cover to the fuse box area and noticed that there were 2 empty fuse locations (6 and 31) on my 2002 Jetta GLS. A quick test with my handy dandy voltmeter confirmed that both these terminals are indeed 12v ignition switched points which an installer could use to feed a new HU. I guess they'd have to use an inline fuse or something but it should work fine as long as the wire can be run cleanly from the fuse are to the HU. They are OFF when the key is out or just inserted, and ON when the key is turned forward and when the car is actually running. 
I hope info helps anyone who is about to replace their HU. If someone is able to keep the existing wiring intact and use this 12v line for a new HU...and if the new HU sounds good with the existing wiring, amp, and speakers...we will know that its just the HU that sucks and not anything else.
If anyone needs a picture, reply to this and let me know and I'll go take one and post it.

BTW - I could not access any hidden EQ stuff on my HU.....was anyone else able to?



[Modified by rocketweb, 5:00 PM 5-25-2002]


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Hmm, re the radio and on and off?
Is people saying that they can't turn thier radios on when the key is out of the switch? 
If so, then I can turn my radio on when the key is out, just have to hit the button to turn it on and the monsoon comes up...
If not, then im misunderstanding this...?


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

WOW. WOW. WOW-F-in WOW.
I just completed the wire swap. My friend came over to pick up a small part and mentioned that he had Audi Symphony radio keys. Guess what? Same keys as needed for the D-Din Monsoon.








The hardest part was releasing the wires from the harness. Those Germans over engineer everything. My tip: You don't have to push the paper clips down that far to release the holding clips. My other tip: Small paper clips without paint on them, not just small paper clips. The thickness of the paint made a difference. 
I must say that I was a huge skeptic that one cross wire could make a great car stereo sound bad but I am bowled over. It sounds really good. I heard things in songs I have never heard before.
Examination of the sound:
I do know that it wasn't just one thing the wires being incorrect were screwing up. It was more than one. I hear lots better imaging, lots better bass and cleaner bass (just don't go past 3pm then the speakers are over pushed), lots more information at the midrange, more highs and it's easy on the ears. Did you ever get the feeling your ears were curling up when you hear something you don't like? That was what I heard pre swap.
I am very pleased for my $300 now. 
The best one sentence comparison I can describe is:
Transistor radio (before) vs. Boom box (after) That's the gradation of difference. I did not say the Monsoon sounds like a boombox. I am illustrating the gradation of difference







Is now sounds a lot better.
Thanks UKAussi, AMGVW, J.R. and others. 
FOr those skeptical that a single wire swap can make drastic improvement to the sound of your Monsoon, just do it or have your dealer do it.
And for those afraid like I was of dealer runaround: There should be a black row of wires and a non-black row of wires on the brown terminal. Period. End of Story. Who cares what the TSB says, it's obvious to those of us with eyes.
Going back to my car to listen to more toonz...

P.S. The mfg date on my HU was 2/2002. My car was made 8/01. Whats's up with that?
Also, I do not think this is a procedural issue at the factories. Workers are just plugging in harnesses to stereos. I think it's a bad part from a vendor. I doubt Monsoon is the vendor, either. The harness had both the VW and Audi logos on it so no telling who made it. After 3 years of Audi ownership this is what is keeping VAG owners from having the same trouble-free ownership experience as Lexus owners: QC of vended parts. Otherwise these are GREAT CARS.



[Modified by flapadlr, 3:20 PM 5-25-2002]


----------



## J.R. Rogers (Dec 29, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

quote:[HR][/HR]In reference to the issue of VW not providing an ignition swithched 12v wire...I took off the cover to the fuse box area and noticed that there were 2 empty fuse locations (6 and 31) on my 2002 Jetta GLS. A quick test with my handy dandy voltmeter confirmed that both these terminals are indeed 12v ignition switched points which an installer could use to feed a new HU. [HR][/HR]​Thanks for the helpful information, RocketWeb. I wonder if these terminals are ON with the key in the accessory position, allow you to use the stereo without the engine running? You can certainly find a switched accessory wire to tap in to, but like nbcosta said, you have to have the car running to listen to the stereo. Regardless, I'm so unhappy with the Monsoon sound system that I'd probably consider an installation configuration like nbcosta has, just to save my ears and my sanity.








flapadlr - Great to hear you got your system fixed up! Are you getting equal bass response from the left channel when you fade all the way over, or is the bass still lower?
J.R.


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Hmm, re the radio and on and off?
Is people saying that they can't turn thier radios on when the key is out of the switch? 
If so, then I can turn my radio on when the key is out, just have to hit the button to turn it on and the monsoon comes up...
If not, then im misunderstanding this...?[HR][/HR]​They are talking about aftermarket setups.


----------



## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

J.R.,
I only spent about 20 minutes in the car afer fixing it. More detailed judgements like the one you asked about are to come after more listening time.


----------



## david equitz (Dec 7, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gti chodite)*

Having a heck of a time trying to remove the monsoon unit myself without screwin it up. Did you notice any special tools? The cut up credit card trick hasn't worked............


----------



## 67House (May 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

I'm really new to this car audio thing, but I was really disappointed when I bought my Jetta and heard the double din monsoon. My biggest complaint is that I don't think it puts out the bass like I think it should. All in all, the quality wasn't there. I'm glad it's not just me. Thanks for the wakeup call.


----------



## buddha1.8t (May 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Just got a 2002 Jetta wagon with the "Monsoon" system in it. There is definitely a difference between being faded to the front or rear but not so much left to right. Also, I have a buddy with a B-5 Passat that has had some experience with different VW stereos and thinks that there is definitely something wrong with it. The speakers seem like they are capable of decent sound but I don't want to go to an aftermarket deck yet. Do you know where the amplifier is located in the Jetta wagon? I can't find it anywhere though I'm not curious enough to start taking the dash off unnecessarily. Thanks for all of the time and research that you have done for this worthy cause and please keep us updated with any breakthroughs.


----------



## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (buddha1.8t)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Do you know where the amplifier is located in the Jetta wagon? I can't find it anywhere though I'm not curious enough to start taking the dash off unnecessarily..[HR][/HR]​In the left side compartment in the hatch area, there is a hard foam case that is made to hold the factory cd changer. If you reach your hand up inside there, I'm pretty sure the Monsoon amp is mounted up behind it. There is a wire harness plugged into a slim black box...that has to be it, methinks. I could not figure out exactly how to get that foam out to get to the Monsoon "amp" though. Let me know if you do!


----------



## Vdub16v (Nov 14, 2000)

*Re: Monsoon HU Hidden screens (TreyS)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Someone posted earlier that the MKIV DD HUs are made by the same company that made the Audi DD HUs. 










The Audi HUs have hidden screens, one is an EQ adjustment section. *Can someone test this on the Monsoon and see if it works?*
Here is the part on the EQ settings:
*Hidden Equalizer*
The following is the procedure on how to access and adjust the "hidden" equalizer feature in the Audi Symphony radio. 
1. Turn off radio. 
2. While pressing and holding the Preset 5 button, turn on radio. 
3. You'll see a series of 8 digits displayed. From the factory, it's set to "55555555". You will not hear any sound when running in this mode. 
4. The first four digits correspond to the four equalizer bands (low, low-mid, upper-mid, high) for the front speakers, and the last four digits are the same for the rear speakers. The level can be set from 1 (minimum) to 9 (maximum). 
5. Turn the volume control knob to increase or decrease the level for the band (which is blinking). To advance to the next band, press the P.Scan button. 
6. When you are done, turn off radio, then turn it back on to hear the results. 

here are the other hidden settings:
http://www.ibiblio.org/tkan/audi/radios/symphony.html 
This might not work but it's worth a try. I won't get my GTI for three more weeks so I'm hoping one of you will try this.
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​No, It does not work


----------



## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Don't bother trying to do it at the amp. It is procedurally easy at the HU. It is obvious, even to a dealer with the WRONGLY DOCUMENTED TSB that the black wire is supposed to be inline with the other black wires!
On the issue of fade: the rears are muted but I think they are sending only low mid and bass back there. When things are faded at 12:00 on the fader dial it sounds very good.
Stop speculating and do the fix at the HU. 
After more listening I still have issues with my HU. The bass knob crackles when moving it. That's all I have found so far. I like much of my music on bass settings of between 9pm and 2am. It has a ton of bass now and is overdriven when bass is above 3pm.


----------



## chodite (Oct 11, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]They re-coded it and obviously replaced the whole HU and it sounds like a WHOLE NEW SYSTEM! Wow.
helpful to this thread would be to know what it means by "they re-coded it". also, how is it obvious that they replaced the HU? did you get a new radio card with your new safe code? did you confirm a change in serial #s on the unit? last but not least, it'd be great to know if your wires in the harness are in the correct position. thanks![HR][/HR]​I'm sorry, but I didn't get the specifics of the "re-coding" of the new HU. I do, however, know the HU was replaced since the first VW tech broke mine by putting the wrong removal tool in it. Also, there was that protective tape on the new HU's display. 
And just for the record, I am SO happy with my Monsoon system now. Like stated above, I hear things in songs that I've never noticed before. The quality is great and the overall sound is now mindblowing. I definitely got my $300 worth now!!!


----------



## 1.8TurboGrin (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gti chodite)*

Ok...I made the wire swap myself. It was a 10 minute fix, using Ukaussie's excellent directions. THANKS! The system is 100% better now. Better, tighter bass and better imaging. It is also much more balanced in that voices don't appear to all be coming from the right side now on cds. Still don't seem to have great sound when I fade to the back, but I haven't listened to it in the back seat to be a real judge of that. The monsoon web site is interesting viewing and got me wondering if the rear speaker equalization was done that way intentionally. Anyway, the system rocks now and am happy with the extra $$$ I spend on it. If only VW Service would improve! 


[Modified by 1.8TurboGrin, 2:02 PM 5-28-2002]


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1.8TurboGrin)*

quote:[HR][/HR]The monsoon web site is interesting viewing and got me wondering if the rear speaker equalization was done that way intentionally.[HR][/HR]​the monsoon site is definitely worth viewing. as for the rear speakers, they do say that the rears are sub-woofers, while the fronts are woofers, so one would expect the rears to be primarily bass frequencies when dialing the fade 100% to the rear, but that's part of the problem some of us are still having with the dd monsoon i.e., you seem to hit 100% rear fade at approx. 10pm on the - which is no more than a 3rd of the way back on the dial. 
for comparison's sake, the single-din monsoon in my 02 passat has a numerical scale on the fader and i can go back to #7 of 9 and still have enough signal from the front speakers (both woofers and tweeters) to make a decent overall sound.


----------



## david equitz (Dec 7, 2001)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (david equitz)*

Would someone post a picture showing the latch setup on this unit? How does is lock in and release? Is it a pressure release that must be kept depressed at all four points? I've tried modified hard platic knifes and cut credit cards - no luck???????


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## nambraf (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (david equitz)*

Had the wire switch done a month ago. Sounds much better, but still have excess power on right side, and if I put fader to rear, left front stays on, and left rear is off. Also have slight static sound when changing stations.
Saw the VW rep today at my service place at Kings in Brooklyn. He said that he never heard of a problem with the double din on my model (02 GLS), but that he definitely hears a problem with my Monsoon, thinks "wires are crossed", and wants a technical person from VW to hear my radio, and that it "will be fixed". He's going to call me for an appointment.
I'll keep everyone posted.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nambraf)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Had the wire switch done a month ago. Sounds much better, but still have excess power on right side, and if I put fader to rear, left front stays on, and left rear is off. . . [HR][/HR]​Wow - are you sure you did the wire swap correctly? Sounds like you've got some serious issues!


----------



## ryeo (May 21, 2002)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Not being a techie & being new here, what would happen if I got an aftermarket HU and used the Metra wiring harness for the DD Monsoon-equipped VW's. I would then be using the Monsoon amp & speakers along with the DSP? How would that sound? I got the Golf 1.8T.....
Rod


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (david equitz)*

Try a CD cut up carefully with a scissor. Make the "keys" just the same width as the slots. Make sure the points are toward the outsides. Make sure you push the "keys" in as far as you can. You can't hurt anything. Then use the cut up CD to pull out the unit as well (if they fit in the slots tight). Hope this helps.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (ryeo)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Not being a techie & being new here, what would happen if I got an aftermarket HU and used the Metra wiring harness for the DD Monsoon-equipped VW's. I would then be using the Monsoon amp & speakers along with the DSP? How would that sound? I got the Golf 1.8T.....
Rod[HR][/HR]​You still have to do the wire switch. Try it first, you may like it!


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## 02GOLFGTI1.8T (Feb 13, 2002)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

hey guys,
I had left a message to customer service on the monsoon website, they just replied with the following technical bulletin. is this one correct?
also even after the swap i think the rear speakers get a weaker signal than the front speakers. if you fade to the rear speakers you can feel that the volume is way lower
91-A322
Technical Bulletin
Important!
Please give copies to all
your VW Technicians
C 91–02–02
_ 2002 Volkswagen of America, Inc. All rights reserved. Information contained in this document is based on the latest information available at the time of printing and is subject to the copyright and other intellectual property rights
of Volkswagen of America, Inc., its affiliated companies and its licensors. All rights are reserved to make changes at any time without notice. No part of this document may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system, or transmitted in any form or by any means,
electronic, mechanical, photocopying, recording, or otherwise, nor may these materials be modified or reposted to other sites, without the prior expressed written permission of the publisher.
1 of 1
Subject:
Model(s):
Group:
Number:
Date:
Premium VI Radio, Poor Sound Quality, Insufficient
Bass on Left Side of Vehicle
2002
91
02–02
Mar. 28, 2002 All with Monsoon Radio
Condition
Radio exhibits poor sound quality or
insufficient Bass on left side of vehicle.
May be caused by wiring reversed on
terminals 3 and 7 of tan connector on back of
radio.
Service
_ With key out of ignition.
– Remove radio See VESIS Repair Group
91-Radio, Telephone, Navigation, Trip
computer, “Radio, removing and installing”.
– Remove black connector block from radio.
– Inspect tan connector, terminals 3 and 7
(arrows) for proper placement.
_ Terminal 3 color code should be black
_ Terminal 7 color code should be yellow
If wire colors are incorrect:
– Remove tan connector block from black
connector block.
– Remove terminals in cavities 3 and 7.
– Install terminals into correct cavities.
– Reinstall tan connector into black connector
block.
– Reinstall black connector block to radio.
– Reinstall radio.
– Check radio for correct sound quality.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (02GOLFGTI1.8T)*

OMG, Are you serious?!!! MONSOON sent you a copy of the bassackwards VW TSB???


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: Help! 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

I have a sound meter. I'll have to do some tests with each speaker. I'll have to dig up some test tones. If anyone has any test tones, IM me.


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (J.R. Rogers)*

I apologize for posting incorrect information. It IS, apparently, possible to install an aftermarket unit so that its on/off works just like the stock unit (ON when the key is in the ignition and turned to the "accessory" position but without the engine running). There is also an option of having the power on at all times--even with the key out of the ignition--depending on how the installer chooses to wire it up. I simply misunderstood what the installer was telling me (hey, this was 2 hours into what was supposed to have been a 1/2 hour job, so all I could think of was getting the hell out of there as quickly as possible, so when he told me that most people went with the on-all-the-time option, I just said, "Yeah, sure, whatever.")
They STILL haven't gotten the correct pocket-mount kit, so I still haven't gone back yet, but I got this information from them over the phone this morning.
ryeo: I can't see why you would have to do the wire switch if you're thinking of ripping out the Monsoon head unit and replacing it with an aftermarket. All the wiring is going to have to be re-done anyway, so this would be a complete waste of time. As I said in my earlier post, replacing the Monsoon with an aftermarket HU (a relatively cheap Blaupunkt, in my case) is exactly what I did, and I can report EXCELLENT results. The Monsoon amp and speakers sound GREAT--nothing wrong wtih THEM. There's no reason why replacing the head unit should make such an enormous difference unless there is something wrong with the Monsoon head units in the first place (AND THERE IS!)
For what it's worth, I too contacted Monsoon (monsoonpower.com) and got the same VW TSB in reply. I e-mailed them back, however, to report my results with the aftermarket HU switch. Haven't heard back from them yet. The person who contacted me is one Shannon Lepper ([email protected]). Who the hell are Young and Laramore, anyway?


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## BenReich (May 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

Sorry for beating a dead horse here, but let me understand something: if I want to replace the head unit in my '02 GTI, then the entire car has to be re-wired?
What implications will having done the wire-fix at the amp have if I decide to get a new head unit? What if I want to add a Bazooka tube or something, am I able to do that?
Thanks,


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

Hey nbcosta,
Since it wasn't a 12V switching issue, did the installers tell you exactly why they had to re-wire the car? I am curious as to what problems they ran into that required the complete rewiring....If you know or can find out, tell us please! It might shed a bit more light on this situation....
Thanks


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## ryeo (May 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

Maybe I need to clarify my question:
I was considering ripping out the Monsoon DD HU only and installing an aftermarket HU while keeping the Monsoon amp, speakers and wiring. Would that work and how would that sound (assuming that the Monsoon amp has the DSP)?
Rod


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (ryeo)*

Just a reminder that D-Din HU is *NOT* a MONSOON component. It is made by Matsu****a (Panasonic) and not MONSOON (Delta Electronics - aka GM). The MONSOON amp has the internal DSP built in and is programmed to each body style (Golf, Jetta, Passat etc) according to the internal accoustics.
After the wire swap my system sounds great. It isn't as good as the Infinity system in our old 1998 Montero Sport but it is better that the system in our 2001 Yukon.
Once a good wiring adapter comes out I may consider swapping the HU as it is the same HU in all the models and isn't upgraded when you buy the "MONSOON" package. Swapping the HU with a quality replacement should make some difference


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## Jess Right (May 24, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

What a serendipidous experience this forum has been!!! After performing the left right balance test on my DD Monsoon. I saw immediately what you all were speaking of. And after performing the switch using the link to the new topic on how to same. I now have a stereo worthy of a name like "Monsoon". Thank you, thank you, thank you... It made it easy for me to disconnect the antenea and set the head unit aside. And the unit comes right out after the latches have been released (I did a corner at a time). Thanks a million. BTW, I picked my car up 9 days ago, and it had just gotten in.
After thought: why didn't I need to reenter my security code after removing the head unit??? I guess that function is provided elsewhere? Huh...


[Modified by Jess Right, 9:09 PM 5-29-2002]


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Hey nbcosta,
Since it wasn't a 12V switching issue, did the installers tell you exactly why they had to re-wire the car? I am curious as to what problems they ran into that required the complete rewiring....If you know or can find out, tell us please! It might shed a bit more light on this situation....
[HR][/HR]​No they didn't tell me--and I specifically asked the shop owner, when I spoke to him on the phone last Friday. When I go back to have the proper pocket-mount kit installed, I'll try to get more detail, maybe from the guys in the back who actually did the work. 
By the way, I noticed on the latest flyer from Best Buy that they're advertising a $99.99 Aiwa HU with "FREE INSTALLATION on all car decks '99 & up*" Then I checked the fine print and it says "*Applies to labor on Basic Installation only. Additional parts and extensive labor extra." Obviously some cars entail "extensive" extra labor. Like my Passat.


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon*

Ok. I think you guys were right. Even after the fix, the right side is still two to three db higher. I just tested with my sound meter. I put it in the center on the arm rest and played a CD and FM at a moderate level.
I played a few songs on a cd....faded left then measued...replayed and faded right and measured. Then to verify it wasn't the cd, I did the same on an FM station (which happend to be like 10-12 db lower than a cd). I just did left/right, not left/front, right/front, left/rear, right/rear. Again, overall, the right was about 2-3db higher than the left both FM and CD. While not scientific, it is a start in confirming our thoughts.










[Modified by Joe_R, 10:52 PM 5-29-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (Joe_R)*

Did anyone determine whether the bias is supposed to be slightly towards the right ?
I would assume that this would be the case in order that the driver wouldn't need to change any of the settings (fader/balance) to get optimal listening experience.


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## Jawilbur (Apr 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (UKAUSSI)*

1. It seems like many of us are beginning to wonder . . . what is a car stereo supposed to sound like? Balance, fade, etc.
2. Please forgive my laziness for not looking through the 19 pages of this thread again, but: has anyone posted the fix for the Passat (different color wires and all).


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## GREGSGTI 1.8T (May 3, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (Jawilbur)*

DID THE FIX MYSELF! THANKS UK AUSSIE







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif MY FIRST FIX & POST! ~ MANY MORE TO FOLLOW 
HATE DEALERSHIPS LOVE THIS FORUM!!
VWofA NEEDS TO PULL THE FINGERS OUT OF THEIR A$$e$
I'M ADDICTED TO VWVORTEX


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (Jawilbur)*

quote:[HR][/HR]1. It seems like many of us are beginning to wonder . . . what is a car stereo supposed to sound like? Balance, fade, etc.[HR][/HR]​besides the 02 golf with the dd - which my gf drives, i have an 02 passat with the single-din, so for me, there's no wondering about it. all i have to do is get in my passat to see what a car stereo is supposed to sound like.
but i do think you're on to something i.e., the improvement post-wire swap is significant enough that many folks are very happy leaving it at that. i'm convinced however, that if those folks knew that the difference between the post-wire swap dd monsoon and the single-din in my passat was as bad as the pre-wire swap dd compared to the post-wire swap dd, they would not be happy with their post-wire swap dd.


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (amgvw)*

My guess (not sure if I mentioned it previously) is that the Golf/Jetta setup is fixed by the wire swap but the Passat is screwed up somewhere else.
I suspect this because the non-Monsoon plug on the D-Din was also screwed up, although not the same wires.
It is almost as if there is some kind of sabotage going on within VW engineering to make the Monsoon (GM) look bad. (mentioned previously in this thread)
What is needed is for someone to obtain an up-to-date VW Service Manual (Bentley) with wiring diagram to check the wiring in the 2002 Passat. Even my new VW Service Manual (from Bentley) doesn't have the new wiring for Premium VI (D-Din) although it has the pin-outs and coding








Once the wiring is visually checked then continuity should be checked from the HU to the amp to make sure one of the harness plugs isn't screwed up between the HU and AMP.


----------



## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (UKAUSSI)*

I think I have a better grasp of how they fixed my fader/balance issue. But, I think it wasn't so much a real misprogramming issue, as it was, they put in a new HU, and coded it for the car, and it came online working correctly.
Whether the original HU wasn't programed correctly, I do not know unfortunately.
If it was the combination of the new HU and the programming, I do not know. But unfortunately, the dealer service manager, and the other VW rep weren't to helpful with the information. But I surmise that it was the programming of the HU to the car(whatever that entailed) and possibly the new HU which allowed it to work.
Just got back from what seems like my weekly/bi-weekly visit to the dealer to explain again the audio imbalance, with right side more powerful than left, as well as my concern that the back speakers were very low compared to front. and that the combined effect makes the back left speaker almost inaudible at times compared to all other speakers.
Spoke with a tech, then the tech spoke with the service manager, then I spoke with someone from VW as I understand it, and he was trying to see what I was saying, but as always, initially, without driving it around and experiencing it for a little bit, he expressed his concern that he couldn't hear what I was saying.
Irregardless of that fact my experience showed and heard what I was speaking, and I mentioned this extensive thread, and the other issues alot of people are having. He mentioned that he was reading vortex for another issue, but had not heard of such problems before, and that he hadn't been able to do the research on my specific issues. 
I explained that I would like something definitive, as in, the audio system is designed to be more powerful right side, the back speakers are sposed to be half the power of the front (with all dials in the neutral 12oclock position). He said that he would be emailing a Tech that deals with these types of issues to get a more definitive ruling on this. He tried to allow the possibility that the system could have been designed that way, but I expressed my concern that how could they make a system in all the other models that sound just fine, single dins ect, and with Aftermarket HU's installed sound quality improves immeasurably, some with re-wires, some without. He pointed out that it could just possibly be the HU and how it was designed, but was not certain, and again said he would be mailing who he had to to get a more definitive answer, and communicate that with the service manager to give me the info. 
I also spoke of the benchmark car that I had sat in once, with the same monsoon system, and how it sounded fuller, worked right off the bat. I did not get the model, but I believe it was a Jetta, Gas engine.(might have been a passat, but can't be certain, they are almost alike, without which I might not have known just what differences were there.
So, I will be awaiting information as I can for a more definitive answer.


----------



## david equitz (Dec 7, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (oto)*

Great post! With such a blatant difference between the two Monsoon systems ( ie, my sdin passat vs my ddin GTI) I'm wondering how VW will approach this..............


----------



## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (oto)*

I personally think the rear speakers, since they are labeled subwoofers, will not produce midbass like the front resulting in what is an apparent decrease in sound (fader problem). The crossover also plays a role in this. 
The point about the right being a bit higher to image better for the driver could be valid but probably unlikely.


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## bruno_monk (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (Joe_R)*

Just a quick reminder to all of (another?) problem pointed out on some distant page in this thread:
the highs from the front tweeters _hurt_ my ears.
There seems to be no way to compensate for this problem without turning the treble _way_ down. This results in having to turn the mid and low down too.
BTW: AFAIK, we are all be bound to the arbitration agreement contained in our purchase contracts if we wanted to pursue this thing through the "legal" process.


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## joesturbo (Jul 19, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (bruno_monk)*

One more thing.. Panasonic makes the Head unit correct? So this really is not a MONSOON issue, but a PANASONIC issue... 

ok that said I have had my wires changed for about a month now. I listened to it last night and I noticed one other thing that may have been posted. If you take the fader control and fade either rear or front to 9 and 3 oclock which ever way you are fading to i.e. fading to the rear, the front turn off. This also works of course fading to the front, rear turn off. It should be a constant step down but it is not, when you get to 9 o'clock fading to the rear it is off not a peep out of the front. when you then fade back to the front, you should NOT notice a Jump in volume when the front turns on, but you will. I guess because the amp sees enough signal to turn the amp back on, which may point to a bad fader or software.
Now I also noticed when I changed a track, or messed with the fader, balance, turned on or of the radio I would hear a slight static and pop. This indicates that either the radio was put together in an unclean enviroment and or the amp is recieving signals to turn on and off.. Can anyone else confirm the fader and static sounds>?>>




[Modified by joesturbo, 2:10 PM 5-30-2002]


----------



## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (joesturbo)*

quote:[HR][/HR].. Can anyone else confirm the fader and static sounds>?>>[HR][/HR]​My fader is one step up from an on/off switch....I think it might have a total of 5 positions at best. 100/0 70/30 50/50 30/70 0/100. Somethin like that.....

P.S. Monsoon went dead today and wouldn't turn on. I was kinda excited actually, which is pretty backwards. I found the radio fuse, unplugged it (it looked ok), plugged it back in and now it turns on. Strange.




[Modified by rocketweb, 10:16 PM 5-30-2002]


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (rocketweb)*

quote:[HR][/HR]..
P.S. Monsoon went dead today and wouldn't turn on. I was kinda excited actually, which is pretty backwards. I found the radio fuse, unplugged it (it looked ok), plugged it back in and now it turns on. Strange.
][HR][/HR]​
Check this out. Don't fix it yourself next time---take to dealer!
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=363324


----------



## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (MaryP)*

MaryP- You rule! Thanks.... A new HU would be nice... maybe it won't suck. The CD highs really are soooo harsh. And the FM is like being underwater.


----------



## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (bruno_monk)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Just a quick reminder to all of (another?) problem pointed out on some distant page in this thread:
the highs from the front tweeters _hurt_ my ears.
There seems to be no way to compensate for this problem without turning the treble _way_ down. This results in having to turn the mid and low down too.
[HR][/HR]​I hear you....in fact I have a bigger beef with this than I do with the fader and left side bass issues. One Best Buy tech suggested that I simply snip the tweeters. We actually pulled out the tweeters/baffle assembly from the front side windows...it's actually not difficult as it is simply jammed in there. However, I'm hesitant to use this fix as I'm not sure what impact it would have on the system electronics nor is it a clean fix to an obvious problem in the Monsoon system.
This is what I hear with respect to spectral balance....FM has the best balance of them all...I can actually listen to FM stations without much fiddling with treble/midrange/fader controls. The sound is not objectionable though the fader, left side bass problems are present, as it is with all sources. AM radio....people just don't sound real. Voices are shrill....way to much high frequency push. I set my fader to full rear, turn the treble to 0 and midrange goes to 9 oclock. CD.....very ugly high frequency push...or is it the near absence of bass? No fix for this. I don't play CDs....this hurts because my normal listening ratios are 50% AM talk radio/40% CDs/10% FM radio.
Blood begins to boil........







































[Modified by DanoP, 11:59 PM 5-30-2002]


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (UKAUSSI)*

What is needed is for someone to obtain an up-to-date VW Service Manual (Bentley) with wiring diagram to check the wiring in the 2002 Passat. Even my new VW Service Manual (from Bentley) doesn't have the new wiring for Premium VI (D-Din) although it has the pin-outs and coding 
____________________________________________________________________
My 2002 Bentley is supposed to ship to me in 10 days. Will it have the wiring diagrams? If not, would contacting Bentley do any good? I had contacted them recently about the manual and the customer service rep was very nice ----actually faxed a page out of the book to me! Don't have the number handy, but they are in Cambridge, MA.


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (MaryP)*

I doubt it will have it as they told me they didn't have the latest info as it was a running change for 2002 (switched over to Premium VI after about 1 month of 2002 production). They will probably issue an update on-line when it comes out


----------



## Hostile (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]they put me in a vr6 jetta loaner that seems to have a slightly stuck throttle - oh wait, maybe that's my foot







[HR][/HR]​I test drove a VR6 and it does have that effect.


----------



## Hostile (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

I'm buying my car at Farrish and I have made it clear that the wires need to be checked BEFORE i get tonight to finalize the sale. I told me salesman(who has been very good) that the SE Technical Assistance people know of the problem and have the fix. 
I refuse to go to Fairfax.


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Hostile)*

please for the love of god do not buy your car from farrish...


----------



## Hostile (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1.8TurboGrin)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I didn't even want to get into the surging problem that has just started with the 1.8t!







[HR][/HR]​Jesus chirst, I'm starting to dread picking up my new 1.8t tonight...


----------



## Hostile (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

quote:[HR][/HR]please for the love of god do not buy your car from farrish...[HR][/HR]​I'd buy it from Woodbridge but it's about an hour away... Farrish and Fairfax are closer but the people at Fairfax are...mean.
If I have any problems with Farrish I'll call Pat Goss and rail him, on the air, for recommending them to ALL his listeners.


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## biggierock (May 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

i've got the double din in my gti 2002. it sucks balls. consider me as a part of the email list.
you can check out what i've had to do so far to try and get some good sound coming out of my system right here:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=381018 

thanks for any input !!!


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## Hostile (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (biggierock)*

We picked up our 1.8t last night. I e-mailed my salesman the TSB and told him the correct way to fix it. When I got there he said itw as taken care of so I got in the car and turned on the stereo. He was driving a demo that was identical without the fix and said our stereo sounded 10x better. Considering he was always dealt with us real straight I'm inclined to believe him.
Our stereo sounds great. I put some bass through it and played with both fade and balance and everything seems to work fine. We have the DDin Monsoon and it says Monsoon when it turns on.


----------



## GTIjeffVW (Jun 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

my doulble din died yesterday. i was listening to skin lab and then i turned off the radio went back into work and came out at 4pm and it was a blank face when i turned the car on. i did not see the "SAFE" code like they said its just blank. so i am going to dealer on monday morning to bitch again. this is the second thing to crap out on my car. But i love my car and i just waxed her up all nice. i guess a radio isnt always important when ya have turbo and the windows are down and i get to hear her spool up. any info would help guys thankds. -jeffg


----------



## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTIjeffVW)*

GTIjeffVW - see about 12 posts back in this thread...I had the same problem--read the link posted by MaryP for information.


----------



## biker23nola (Jun 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (UKAUSSI)*

Just picked up the 337 on Friday, and tried the bass test as described on this forum. Left bass weak. Copied your instructions and found the mismatched wires today. Made the fix. Tool never sounded better to me. This is agreat site and thanks. This is my first VW. Drove an old bettle many years ago and my wife had a Carmen Gia. She turned me on to the VW. I also got real lucky in getting the 337. First to test drive at the dealership, just by chance. No real problem in making my decesion on getting it. Former Honda CRX owner. The 337 rocks!


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## GTIjeffVW (Jun 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (biker23nola)*

thank you rocketweb just curious i did the #42 fuse worked fine. can anyone link me to the rewired post so i can do that as well. i have heard so much about how great the monsoon system is but mine is kinda cheesy i think the wire fix will make it pump hard. thank you. jeffg







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (GTIjeffVW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]can anyone link me to the rewired post so i can do that as well. [HR][/HR]​ http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (GTIjeffVW)*

I have also added it to my signature


----------



## Winger (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (UKAUSSI)*

Hello... am a new Vortex member, and owner of 2001 GTI VR6 with Monsoon... but have read nothing about 2001s... I seem to have the same problem... severe lack of bass from rear and very harsh on ears when fader is set to full rear... have customer with VWofA of 20151645 and have contacted Monsoon... they sent back the VW TSB which I hear may be incorrect... do you know if this problem applies to 2001s too?
thanks!


----------



## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

Just got word from my car-audio installer today that they've finally received the right pocket-mount kit to adapt the double-DIN Monsoon to a single-DIN size unit. My appointment to have it installed is tomorrow (Wed, 6/5) at 10 a.m. EDT.
So--if there are any further technical questions about the installation of my aftermarket HU (in addition to the ones I've already received) post 'em tonight and I'll ask the guys tomorrow, cause (hopefully) after that, I'll be out of this forum for good.


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

I have just got off the phone with VWofA customer service and I'm pissed!
Yesterday I took my car in for the Monsoon issue to the dealer. The tech has acknowledged the fact that there was something wrong with the radio he even stated that he hated the new double DIN unit and he thought the old one sounded much better. Then he swapped the radio with one of their loaner cars and it sounded a little better but the fader problem was still there and the FM still sucks big time. He showed it to the Service Manager and he acknowledged to me that there is something wrong but at that point he could do nothing more, he'll contact his factory tech and try to work out the issue.
Then today I got a call from VWofA customer service and they told me that the Service Manager has called them on the issue and said that the "radio meets the factory standards" and there is no problem with it. So I have made it clear to the lady that I am still not satisfied and I do not consider the issue resolved. However the lady said it does not matter what I say at this point my case will be closed and forgotten since the Service Manager stated that the radio is working according to specs and I have no further recourse.
I told the lady that VWofA will have to do something about this issue as there are a lot of pissed customers out there and they will not let this slide (I sure won't). She said there is nothing she can do, my case will be reviewed and she thinks it will be closed and rendered solved as there is nothing there to be done. I told them there has to be a corporate response to all this, VWofA will have to step up to the plate and acknowledge the problem and solve it for everyone out there instead of sweeping it under the carpet.
Right now the only recourse we can have is to sign a petition that can be mailed to then so they will see that there is in fact a lot of unhappy customers out there who want their Monsoon fixed or get a refund as the radio does not meet customer standards. I have put together a petition and I am asking you all to sign the petition so we can act together and VWofA will not "deal with us on an individual basis".
http://www.petitiononline.com/VWofA/petition.html
Greg Takacs


----------



## hotpprs (May 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon (bruno_monk)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Just a quick reminder to all of (another?) problem pointed out on some distant page in this thread:
the highs from the front tweeters _hurt_ my ears.
There seems to be no way to compensate for this problem without turning the treble _way_ down. This results in having to turn the mid and low down too.[HR][/HR]​I think you've hit the nail on the head concerning the post wire swap problem. The system can produce very nice bass after the wire swap, I know mine did. I just can't turn it up loud enough to make my jeans vibrate like kickass bass should. If I did, I would need earplugs to protect my ears from the tweeters. The tweeters are just way too annoying at medium or high volume. The tweeters are almost at ear level, while the woofers are down by your feet. When the sound is turned up the way I like it, the woofers are too low in relation to the tweeters, and don't seem to be putting out enough volume to match the output that would mix nicely with the tweeters. If there was a way to turn turn down the tweeter output without turning the treble or midrange down, I think my system would sound great. Turning down the treble and midrange just muffles everything, I'd rather just listen to the music a little lower. I wonder if this can be done on a one time basis with a software fix developed by VW or Monsoon? You would think a programmable system would be able to put out a stronger output to a specific pair, or pairs of components such as the front woofers and rear subwoofers.
It's a shame because I actually think the components to this system are much better than people think, and I hope VW or some other tech genius on this forum can come up with a painless software fix to prove it.


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

greg - the TSB is *WRONG!* and i think it's very important to note that as the fact that VW made an attempt at resolving the problem, should be indicative of the fact that they are aware of the problem on a "global level" and in fact did try to implement a global solution i.e., the TSB. however, their solution did NOT work. now it's their responsibility to come up with something else.
i think it's important that the petition notes that the only solution VW has offered to date is WRONG.


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

AMGVW - Thisis verbatim from the petition:
quote:[HR][/HR]
Volkswagen of America has issued a Technical Service Bulletin to the service centers that are dealing with customers who have experienced the issue. While the outlined procedure (AKA ?wire swap?) of the Technical Service Bulletin improves sound quality of the radio it fails to address the following problems:
- FM sound is washed out, sounds very ?harsh?
- The Left speakers produce approximately -3db volume than the Right ones at center balance.
- The Fader cuts off the front speakers at the 10 o?clock position, sound does not fade gradually to the Rear
- Cracking noise from speaker while adjusting fader and/or volume
[HR][/HR]​So I think the petition pretty much covers that angle.......


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

IMPORTANT CORRECTION--
I went back to my car-audio installer today and it turns out that they did NOT use the Monsoon amplifier when installing my new Blaupunkt head unit. Their story is that "a high-powered radio [i.e. the Blaupunkt] won't work with the Monsoon amp." I'm not going to complain, since the sound is so much better, I wouldn't have known if I hadn't specifically asked. They wired the Blaupunkt directly to the speakers, which accounts for why they needed to do all the extra wiring. I have no idea whether a low-powered HU would work with the Monsoon amp. If anybody wants any more answers, they're going to have to call GLM Security & Sound at (718) 225-8800.
As far as my total lack of AM reception goes, it turns out they hadn't hooked up the antenna because the Passat needs a special adapter (Metra part #40-EU10). They've ordered it and expect it in a few days.
Frankly, now that I've got the pocket kit, I can't see the point of a double-DIN unit in the first place. I'll gladly give up the tape option (I use CDs) in favor of the extra storage space for sunglasses, Kleenex, etc.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

While the outlined procedure (AKA ?wire swap?) of the Technical Service Bulletin improves sound quality of the radio
_____________________________________________________________
I find this statement too confusing---You are saying the TSB fixes the problem and it doesn't---it is wrong altogether!


[Modified by MaryP, 6:59 PM 6-5-2002]


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

I think the fact that the TSB is wrong alltogether is irrelevant to the case. Even if it was right (lot of dealers will make the right swap, even though the TSB is wrong), the problem is not resolved. So stop splitting hair about the petition and just sign the darn thing!


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

The problem with using an aftermarket HU without the Monsoon amp is that the rear speakers present only a 2 ohm load.....which requires lotsa juice from the power source. The front speakers and tweeters are 4 ohm....much more manageable. So, we're looking at driving 8 speakers, 2 of which are power hungry....that's why some aftermarket shops balk at wiring around the Monsoon amp. I've also been told that the Monsoon amp only drives the rear 'subwoofers'. (BTW, those cones look awful small to me to be considered subwoofers.) It's a common misconception that too much power can hurt a sound system. Actually, it's too little power that's the problem. If an amp can't drive enough wattage in a power hungry low ohm load, you'll drive the amp into 'clipping'....literally, the tops the AC waveform are lopped (or 'clipped') off, potentially blowing out a speaker or damaging the amp. Glad things worked out for you though....it appears that your techs know what they are doing with the HU you chose. (I hope my somewhat amateur explanation is fundamentally correct....it's been a long while since the days I played with such stuff in my home audio system







)
As a comparison, the garden variety home stereo speakers drive 8 ohm speakers (and only two of them). As far as the wire fix is concerned, I don't doubt that the Jetta/Golf owners have been helped considerably....but for Passat owners, the wire switch does nothing and the frequency response is painfully tilted toward the upper frequencies for CD sound, not to mention no left side bass, the fader problem, yada, yada......



[Modified by DanoP, 1:57 AM 6-6-2002]


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I think the fact that the TSB is wrong alltogether is irrelevant to the case.[HR][/HR]​i disagree. i think VW thinks that they've dealt with the problem so now it's just a question of fending all of us off individually. i think the first step towards getting a fix from VW is making them understand that their current fix is just plain WRONG, which i'm hoping has the effect of making them reopen what they now seem to consider a closed case. worse case scenario is that they reopen the case, issue a corrected tsb, and close the case again, and we're right back where we started. best case scenario is that they reopen the case to correct the tsb, check the radio out again, and realize that even with the tsb corrected, there's still a problem.
right now - imo - the petition reads, "there was a problem, VW acknowledged it and fixed it, but we're not happy with their fix." what it should read - again imo - is "there IS a problem, VW TRIED to fix it, but did NOT, and we demand a fix to a problem that VW has acknowledged and has tried incorrectly to fix."
not to mention, that the idiocy of the incorrect tsb should play favorably for our "consumers vs. big stupid company" class action lawsuit should it come to that


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

AMGVW,
Did you sign the petition? Or are you waiting for a modified one that will state that the TSB is wrong and they should fix the TSB first?
I think the point is that even the proper wire swap will not fix the problem. If we'd petition for the TSB to be fixed first and then petition for further fix would set the whole thing back even more. We know that even a corrected TSB would not fix the issue (I and 22 others know at least). Not to mention the poor Passat owners who have no fix at all to work with.
So I agree that the petition should have stated that the TSB is wrong, but the bigger picture here is that the HU is POS that a wire swap will not fix and they need to do something about it. If you partially agree with it at least, just put your comments in the comment field on the petition just as MaryP did. Or you can write up a new one and get people to sign that one....... (I don't try to be smart @ss here, but I feel this is the first official organized step that might lead somewhere)


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## Nin009 (Nov 1, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

I went to my dealer for the fix about two weeks ago. The tech said the wiring was correct and signed off on the fix. I get in the car and the Monsoon still sounds like crap out of the left side. I make another appointment for broken hatch strut. While I am there I have the service advisor sit in my car and listen. Next we go to a new Golf with the "Premium" sound system with eight speakers. This is not a Monsoon. I put in the same CD and it sounds 10 times better. It takes about two seconds for the guy to understand what I am talking about. Then it gets interesting.
The guy claimed that because of all the trouble with the Monsoon VW is no longer "producing" them. Since it was clear that the sound sucked (my term) he would be happy to install the new version which replaces the Monsoon HU. He noted, however, it would not be a Monsoon brand HU. I told him as long as the sound improved to the level I heard in the Golf I would be happy. The Golf premium HU looked just like the Monsoon. The only difference I could tell-outside of sound quality-was that it didn't say MONSOON when the radio came on.
I set up an appointment for next week. They offered to squeeze me in today, but I didn't have a ride and I had off-site meetings, so I needed my car. I have to say Tynnan's VW has been accomodating and easy to work with. I will find out how VW acts next week when Tynnan's tries to swap the HU under warrenty.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Nin009)*

Nin009,
I am guessing the "Premium" radio that was in the Golf is the same double Din unit as the Monsoon double Din. What makes Monsoon Monsoon is the amplifier in the back. The HUs are the same. The reason why it didn't say Monsoon when you turned it on is because it was programmed differently, ie. it was programmed that it does not have the Monsoon amp in the rear. Again, to make it clear, the problem is probably not with the Monsoon amp but with the Panasonic HU. Now that is posible that the same head unit performs fine if it is programmed into non-monsoon mode, but I don't know how it will sound in your car with the Monsoon amp in non-monsoon programming mode.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Just got an email back from MONSOON the other day:-

Q: What I was actually asking was if the engineers equalized the DSP in the amp so the the sound would be balanced when sitting in the drivers seat ?
A: Regarding the equalization-- know that Monsoon systems are designed for a Driver preference, thus the balance will always be focused on you. 

I know this doesn't solve any ACTUAL problems but it does explain some PERCEIVED problems about balance. When the wires are corrected, there should be more volume from the right side.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Nin009)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Next we go to a new Golf with the "Premium" sound system with eight speakers. This is not a Monsoon. I put in the same CD and it sounds 10 times better.[HR][/HR]​darn, i hadn't thought to go listen to a car with just the premium 6 dd hu, which means it does not have the amp or the upgraded speakers that come with the monsoon package. i reprogrammed my dd hu to try it in non-monsoon mode, but since it came as a monsoon, it has the amp and upgraded speakers, so it's not the same as if it had come from the factory non-monsoon (and it still sounded like crap).
interesting note: 
1) nbcosta found out that his excellent sounding system was wired w/o the amp. 
2) nin009 heard a nice souning premium 5 dd hu, a system w/o the amp.
nice sound, no amp...








quote:[HR][/HR]The guy claimed that because of all the trouble with the Monsoon VW is no longer "producing" them. Since it was clear that the sound sucked (my term) he would be happy to install the new version which replaces the Monsoon HU. He noted, however, it would not be a Monsoon brand HU. I told him as long as the sound improved to the level I heard in the Golf I would be happy. The Golf premium HU looked just like the Monsoon. The only difference I could tell-outside of sound quality-was that it didn't say MONSOON when the radio came on.[HR][/HR]​i apologize in advance if i'm wrong, but...your dealer is probably FOS. the premium 6 hu is the premium 6 hu, end of story. the hu is made by matsu****a. if your car came with the monsoon package, you have the amp and upgraded speakers and a new matsu****a premium 6 dd hu without the monsoon programming isn't going to matter. i had my hu swapped out and the new hu wasn't programmed for monsoon and it still sounded like crap. but by all means, let me know if your mileage varies.


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## vw2.0gti (Nov 15, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

PLEASE SIGN THE PETITION!

http://www.petitiononline.com/VWofA/petition.html


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## BoostMiser (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

done


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## BobbyTropics (May 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Same here.


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## truckasaurus (Feb 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BobbyTropics)*

Sorry to be a pain for asking this seemingly unrelated question but, does the does the Double DIN Monsoon system read CD text. I put in a CD that had CD text on it and it didn't show up in the display.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Met with a VW rep today (he's responsible for Texas and Oklahoma). After about 5 minutes listening to a CD he admits there is a 'severe tonal imbalance' between the left and right side. I have an another appointment with him next Tuesday at a different VW dealer (these guys seem make the rounds at different dealers monthly) so that he can spend more time on the car and do a full diagnostic on my system.....including checking the wiring and ensuring that everything is 'working as it suppose to.' I don't know if I like that.....what if everything works according to spec and it still sounds bad. He says in the meantime, he'll speak to the designer of the Monsoon system (he says he knows him) to get the lowdown on how it suppose to work. He told me that this guy spent a couple of years designing the Monsoon system for the VWs. 
I sense this rep doesn't know a whole lot about sound systems (why am I not suprised) and he didn't seem all that sympathetic. I showed him a print out of the discussion topics on this board, pointing out the 700+ messages and 30,000+ hit. He kind of shrugged it off. I'll report back after that appointment.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

DanoP,
I'm in Fort Worth, TX. E-mail me if you want my coordinates in case this tech would like to listen in on mine too.......


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Met with a VW rep today (he's responsible for Texas and Oklahoma). After about 5 minutes listening to a CD he admits there is a 'severe tonal imbalance' between the left and right side.[HR][/HR]​do you have any of the other dd problems e.g., the fader problem (it's such a long thread, i can't remember)? i'm worried that if you've only got the imbalance, the rep will speak to the monsoon guy who might tell him that the system is designed to favor the driver balance-wise, and then the rep will tell you that your system is operating to spec.
also, while it sounds like the rep heard the imbalance problem, i've noticed that a test-tone shows off the imbalance much better than a cd. having a consistent sound source such as a single tone, cycling through the speakers really shows off the imbalance. there's a test tone in the output test of the radio module. get the shop to connect your car to the vag if you don't have a test-tone on cd.


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## jimmy-buffett (Apr 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]do you have any of the other dd problems e.g., the fader problem (it's such a long thread, i can't remember)? i'm worried that if you've only got the imbalance, the rep will speak to the monsoon guy who might tell him that the system is designed to favor the driver balance-wise, and then the rep will tell you that your system is operating to spec.[HR][/HR]​The fader problem and the muffled FM reproduction to me aren't so much "design" issues as much as quality problems with the HU itself, I think any of us would love to sit down with this designer for 5 minutes to tell him "listen to what the implementation of your design sounds like", he'd probably be furious.
Good work on getting to the VW rep, if you know anybody with even a low-end aftermarket HU with the Monsoon amp and speakers, I'd love to see his face when you put the two cars side by side and let the guy hear the difference.


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## nambraf (Apr 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jimmy-buffett)*

The VOA tech guy fixed it yesterday! I had the wire fix done a month ago, but it didn't help. Yesterday, I was told that the wire was put back according to the "incorrect" TSB, and when it it still didn't help, he looked at the amp in the trunk, and found out that there was a reverse wire screw- up leading to the amp!
When I put on the radio yesterday, the sound was equal on both sides, when I put the fader on the back speakers, it worked (as opposed to my left front and rear right prior to the fix), and vocals and talk radio now sounded centered with the balance set in the center. I do admit I notice a little too much brightness, but at least it sounds balanced now. Good luck to everyone.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Yes, I should have mentioned in my earlier message that I did demonstrate the fader problem to the tech...he seemed less interested in that than the tonal imbalance. The idea of passing a test tone through the system is a good one....I have a CD with white noise, tone, balance, et. al. tracks. I'll need to try that. 
I'm dissapointed that nambraf is still hearing the brightness after his system appears to be fixed....that's really my biggest beef....I can't stand the brightness. I'll make sure the VW rep checks the amp connection. If the fader/tonal balance problem is fixed but the system still sounds bright, I'll probably dump the HU for an aftermarket unit. I figure if I change it out now, with the wiring messed up, I'll end up with either or both of the fader/tonal balance problems.


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nambraf)*

Sounds like he just did the wire swap at the amp to fix it. Your note reads (if I read it correctly) that you had the HU wire swap done, the dealer put it back wrong (according to the TSB) and the VW Tech swapped two wires at the Amp. Yep, he fixed it via amp wire swaps to the same state as it was via the HU wire swap.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

As mentioned before, what we REALLY need is a pin-out for the connector on the amp so we can confirm whether they are also wired incorrectly.
I don't mean whether, if you assume the HU incorrect wiring is correct and you just do the same swap at the amp instead, I mean whether there is an additional different wiring screw-up at the amp.


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I was doing some phase/tone tests last night and ran across some interesting results:
a 1000hz tone in phase sounds in phase
a 3000 hs tone in phase sounds garbled
a 8000 hz tone in phase sounds out of phase.
I wonder if the tweeters are wired out of phase from the woofers and creating the absolutely horrendous sound stage we currently have?


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## bd1974 (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

quote:[HR][/HR]PLEASE SIGN THE PETITION!

http://www.petitiononline.com/VWofA/petition.html[HR][/HR]​Done!


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## hotpprs (May 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Yes, I finally got to hear a sound system in another VW, a 2001 (I think) NB with a single DIN system. I can't believe how good it sounded being it was just a six speaker standard sound system. I didn't even sit in it, I just listened to it with the doors open, a nice full bass sound. My system is just too bright. There has got to be a fix for this, this is ridiculous.


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## mjmi11er (Apr 8, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hotpprs)*

what will that petition do? i mean what can come from it?


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mjmi11er)*

Once we get a fair number of users' name on the list I will forward the petition to VWofA as well as to editors of several magazines. Then I will wait for their response and see what happens. They SHOULD respond with something, but agian the keyword is "should" and they can still pretty much do whatever they want to. So I am guessing that you don't have much to lose but you have a chance of gaining some kind of respolution by signing the petition.......


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (BryanH)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I wonder if the tweeters are wired out of phase from the woofers and creating the absolutely horrendous sound stage we currently have?[HR][/HR]​that would make sense to me since in my mind, i've always connected the fader issue to the tweeters in that my front tweeters seem to cut out at the 10 o'clock fade position and i've noticed that the rear tweeters seem to be missing from the complete rear fade (i think part of why my single-din sounds so much better is that even faded all the way to the rear, the tweeters are still kicking).
i've been thinking there's a deeper wiring issue involved for a while now, so i find your results very interesting. nice work! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Nin009 (Nov 1, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Well, this has become more unpleasent for me. The tech checked the wiring as per the TSB and decided it looked good. He now wants to trace the wires to the speakers and amp. Of course he plans on taking apart door panels and such. This scares me. I am one of the lucky few with a squeek and rattle-free VW. I am afraid it will not be returned to me that way. I basically begged the service advisor to talk with the tech and make sure the black wires are on one side and the colored on the other. What a pain in the a$$. He made some smarta$$ comment about whether I am a tech or not. I told him no, but I do know the difference between positive and negative wires and the result of having them crossed. I also questioned his tech's compitence when he had already returned the car to me once as sounding good. This leveled his attitude a bit.
Oh, and they want to keep it another day. This will now be the third day they have had to work on this in two trips. This is getting old.


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## Version2.0 (Oct 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Was there a problem with 2000 Monsoon head units too? My stereo sounds fine on CD and tape but FM is really muffled and has almost no trebles.


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## renegade43 (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Version2.0)*

wow.. cant read enough about this monsoon deal. I just got my 337 a week ago
and all the issues are there with the DD HU. this sounds like a major phase issues.
I have been a pro sound engineer for 12 years and i deal with this all the time.
speaker phase issues can "snowball" if they are not done right the first time. Its not that hard to figure out with the lower freqs, but the highs can be tricky. I can totaly see how this could happen at the factory.







This could also be the problem with monsoon owners getting "bright" or too much highs in the output.
The tweets may also be "out of phase" But without the proper tools Its hard to tell.
I have acess to phase checkers, but they are for large format sound systems. not sure if they will work wtih car audio....ill check on it.
Does anyone know how much of an issue it is to pull the door panels of a 2002 GTI? This is how we used to fix phase problems when I installed car audio at a shop years ago.... just switch the + and - on the door 6.5inch driver and this should fix it. But If its a nightmare....i will just pull the HU. Im down for whatever is quicker







I need to spend more time driving....less time screwing up my fingers, digging in the dash http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
This is my first new VW (last one was a 71 type III) and Im not impressed with the little things that have been overlooked. but i still love the car








Thanks again for all the info!!


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (renegade43)*

I would try this myself if I had a laptop.....does anyone else want to try?
http://www.purebits.com/appnote18.html


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## Propaganda (Jun 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Propaganda)*

Just bought an '02 Jetta, and was pretty dismayed with the stereo. At first, I chalked it up to being a factory stereo since I've had aftermarket for the last ten years. Each day, I hated it more and more. Then I found this thread, and since I was taking it to reprogram the alarm and replace a side marker that kept condensing water inside of it, I thought no big deal, it'll be fixed. I went it prepared for some arguments, even brought a cleaning cd with in-phase and out-of-phase tracks on it. The guy listened to me, and seemed to understand what I was saying(Black wires are always negative, right?) and listened to the radio. After everything was "fixed", they said "my stereo was wired correctly" (which I took to mean all black on one side since I had explained it for 10 minutes)and they hadn't changed anything. I had the manager sit in my car, and listen to it. He played with it, and said it sounded like his older Monsoon system. He pretty much convinced me that everything was OK, and I was just expecting too much from stock. Everyone was very friendly and helpful. As I drove home, calculating how much I was going to spend on a new stereo, I decided to double check for myself.
Yeah, you figured right. Wired correctly, a much improved stereo. Enough to prevent for a little while of buying aftermarket. Amp/sub will be put in right after I go and show the dealer why I'm disappointed that it wasn't fixed.
I recommend everyone go in to the dealer first. Have them either fix it in front of your eyes or at least do it on a rental jetta and compare it to yours. If they're afraid of damaging a customer's vehicle. A lot of cleaning cd's have the phase test, but a sound quality comparison "should"







be enough.
Don't expect the world, but at least expect a decent factory stereo, not that horrible thing they sold us. 
Questions.
Does the amp wire each speaker seperately or amp to woofer to tweeter? (sorry, haven't had time to look myself)
Has anyone checked to see if the tweeters are out of phase with the woofers?
Does anyone have or know of a sound check cd with individual phase tests at many different Hz? Didn't find anything local.
Thanks.
BTW, the dealer was EVS in Menominee Falls, WI. I'm not entirely blaming them since they had wrong info from VW, but still....


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## mclii (Dec 19, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

OK, it's time for me to chime in on this (first time poster to the topic, long time listener), but first, before moving on, my post is based on this web site - http://www.purebits.com/appnote18.html, which I thought was very cool, and a very cool idea to find problem speakers, and fairly simple.
I did something very similar to this, except I didn't have an oscilliscope, but to see things out of phase, this isn't necessary with audio software on a computer. If you use a stereo track, you can see two wave forms, and compare the peaks and valleys. Oh, by the way, this is all PRE-wire swap.
Anyway...
I used the right front woofer as the reference speaker, which on all of the graphs on the web site that I created, is the top waveform, and then the bottom one is the speaker that I am pointing the other mic to. I used a 250 Hz tone, and it worked very well, and produced nicely on all speakers except the left front tweeter, which I thought was very strange (I hope the wire swap will fix that)... 
If you look at the waveforms of the pre-wire swap speakers, the whole left front side, tweeter and woofer, are out of phase, the peak on one waveform matchs with the valley of the other waveform-- not good. Peak should be to Peak and Valley to Valley.
I'm not going to do the wire-swap myself, I'm going to take it to the dealer I go to, when I get my oil changed next, which might not be for a while, so I won't be able to test out the "post" wire swap speakers for a while, but I AM planning on posting that data once it happens. 
If anyone is curious how I did this, and wants to do the same for the post-wire swap test, I just took my four track mini-disc recorder, two microphones, and panned one right, and the other left, then kept one microphone on the right front woofer, and pointed it at all the other speakers, one by one. Then I digitized the audio, on my computer and zoomed in so far that I could see the waveform easily, screen captured those, and put them on the web.
Oh yeah, the data posted on the web... here yah go. Pretty interesting... looks like I need to sign the petition.
2k2 GTI 1.8T Monsoon 250 Hz test tone


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mclii)*

Nice job!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I understand if you don't want to do the wire swap yourself, but here's a thought: what are the odds that someone who might live by you and has done the wire swap, would let you test their VW? (I would gladly bring you my car but I live in CT.)


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## Propaganda (Jun 16, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mclii)*

mclii pretty much answered my biggest question. The wiring problem is between the amp and HU, not between the amp and the speakers. I was worried that we were missing a wiring problem where the left front woofer was out of phase, but the front tweeter was in phase. Thanks.


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## Das Vagon (Aug 12, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Damn. I just read this whole post. I decided that I wasn't going to add to it, but here I am. I just went out to check my HU to see if the wiring was wrong. Well it isn't. I'm not sure if you all have the same thing, but my HU has a wiring diagram right on it. It states what everyone here has said, positive on one side and negative down the other. Mine is correct, black on one side and colors on the other.
I thought I was a bit of an audiophile and I was upset with the sound, but it didn’t sound obviously out of phase. I was pissed because I might not be able to detect a major problem like that. Well it turns out that unless the terminals are crossed somewhere else, e.g. the amp, there is different problem than an out of phase pair. The right levels are definitely higher than the left, and the whole thing is too bright. Don’t get me wrong, I’m by no means saying it’s not a problem, it’s a huge problem and more annoying every second I listen to it. I have gotten to the point where I’m not listening to the stereo. That’s why I broke down and cracked it open.
Not even mentioning the whole fader/balance problem. The way I have mine now, to be bearable, is the treble and mid at about 10 o’clock and the balance around 11.
I know people have mentioned some problems after the “fix”, but I wanted to add another opinion. It’s still hosed up and you guys who still think it is are not crazy, it really is. Mine never was crossed and I heard a problem. Most of the other people who have ridden in it don’t hear it until I point it out.
I think the only way we are going to eliminate the variables is to rip the doors off and test the wiring from the speakers to crossover (assuming there are, or does the amp do this?), and from there to the amp, and then back to the HU. Of course I just got the car, and like others have said, I really don’t want to pull the panels off for fear of rattles. But, if I get to the point of needing a new system because of the junk we have now… I’m your man. I will rip everything apart and meter the whole damn car.
I got the GLI and wanted the sunroof so I was stuck with the Monsoon, and stuck, seems to be the word. I’m not happy, but not as pissed as I would have had it been a stand alone option. I feel for you guys who wanted one.


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## mclii (Dec 19, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mclii)*

Alright, I admit, I got impatient. Tonight I did the wire swap myself, on my 2k2 GTI with Monsoon, and here's the graphical data: Post Wire Swap. I'm happy to note that everything is in phase!!!
So for people that think that their Double Din sounds bad, and they've done the wire swap at the head unit (not sure about the amp swap, but it's the same thing) it's no longer phase issues. Everything post wire swap is in phase.
As for my opinion, I think the radio sounds a little better than it did originally, and I'm fairly happy, but my fiancée has the single din unit in her 2001 Jetta, and it's not monsoon, and I also had a 2001 Golf GL without monsoon, single din, and the single din still sounds a lot better, I think. My co-worker has a single din WITH a monsoon system and I think his system is awesome. I love the clarity of the monsoon amp, and the warmness of the single din unit... the double din makes everything sound pretty bright. It will do for now, but this is definitely something I'll want to pop out of my car eventually.
The wire swap was pretty fun to do, my first "mod" on my GTI, the hard part for me, was pretty much all of the procedures, getting the unit out, getting the bracket out, the speaker bracket out, and the pins out, but putting things back, like the pins and the unit itself was SUPER easy for me, I know some had expressed some hardships getting it to snap in. Overall fun, and thanks to UKAUSSI for the directions http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif and GTIDAD for the pin removal http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
One more thing, as far as other problems people have mentioned, does anyone know if the controls on the DDin are actually analog controls? Or are they analog controls, controlling digital functions? I find it hard to believe that a fader isn't a fader if it's analog, or a balance isn't a balance if it's indeed analog. All analog knobs would do is control voltage to a certain device correct? I don't think there is a way that analog controls would have such sharp cut-off features as on this unit. Kind of like the volume knob, I'm pretty sure that's not truely analog, because the steps between twists are pretty large. 
Hope my two posts have helped people and thanks for listening!


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## Nin009 (Nov 1, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mclii)*

I got my car back from its second trip to the dealer. The unpleasent person I had spoken with about the TSB and wires actually admitted that they called VW and were told the TSB was wrong and had a picture reversed. 
Anyway, I get in the car and it sounds the same...like crap. I go back in and tell the service advisor. He gets all pissy and exclaims they switched the wires and it is fixed. I say to him, "Indulge me. Lets sit in my car then put the same CD in that six speaker golf on the floor." He gets the keys for a 2002 GTI with Monsoon. It sounds the same as mine. We then get in the Golf and within seconds he admits that the base Golf system sounds way better than my Monsoon. He is confused and very humble at this point. However, he says they don't know what else to do with it and suggests I open a case with VW.
I call VW and open a case. They have me drop it off at another dealer for the fix. The tech is supposed to call VW and reference the case number to get walked through the fix. I should have the car back in a couple of hours.
I firmly believe that my Monsoon will sound just as bad when they return it to me.


[Modified by Nin009, 7:13 PM 6-18-2002]


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## Postman (May 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mclii)*

quote:[HR][/HR]One more thing, as far as other problems people have mentioned, does anyone know if the controls on the DDin are actually analog controls? Or are they analog controls, controlling digital functions? I find it hard to believe that a fader isn't a fader if it's analog, or a balance isn't a balance if it's indeed analog. All analog knobs would do is control voltage to a certain device correct? I don't think there is a way that analog controls would have such sharp cut-off features as on this unit. Kind of like the volume knob, I'm pretty sure that's not truely analog, because the steps between twists are pretty large.[HR][/HR]​I think the whole fader/balance issue has to do with the amp. The amp is not receiveing a power signal from the HU. It actually just receieves (slightly higher than) line level signals for the speakers. Once you have adjusted the fader beyond 10 o'clock th signal is probably too low to amp so it sends nothing to the speaker.
I have installed my Kenwood MP3 player in there with my normal speaker outs going to the stock Monsoon amp. The sound is excellent and much better than the Monsoon D-Din. No fading or balance problems. The only trick is balancing the rear/bass/mid/trable to get the besst sound. The amp crossovers everything so you only get bass and high tones from the rear, no mid. Front gets everything so you have to play with it.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Postman)*

Postman,
Can you connect line level signals to the Monsoon amp? I am seriously considering dumping the Monsoon HU and putting in an Alpine CDA-7995, but that one has no amp in it, line level output only.......


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## Postman (May 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Can you connect line level signals to the Monsoon amp? I am seriously considering dumping the Monsoon HU and putting in an Alpine CDA-7995, but that one has no amp in it, line level output only.......[HR][/HR]​Not too sure since I didn't try this. My line level outputs are RCA jacks and I had no converters and didn't want to cut the lines. It should be pretty easy to rig up, though. I actually rigged up my 2 Bazooka tubes and amp to see how they sounded. Hardly any difference in base once I tuned the bass/fader on my Kenwood and stock Monsoon Amp.
Give it a whirl and let the rest of us know.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Nin009)*

The ONLY way you will know for sure is to do the fix yourself! SOOOOO many people have gone into the dealer and are told that their car has been "fixed" only to pull the HU and see the bad wiring still there. You will be happier with the fix, but some are still having some other problems. I love mine since the fix and you may be just as happy. Do yourself a favor---do the fix yourself. It is amazingly easy. I can do it in 15 minutes now. Let us know what happens. Mary


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## MUSoccer (Jun 11, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Postman)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Can you connect line level signals to the Monsoon amp? I am seriously considering dumping the Monsoon HU and putting in an Alpine CDA-7995, but that one has no amp in it, line level output only.......
Not too sure since I didn't try this. My line level outputs are RCA jacks and I had no converters and didn't want to cut the lines. It should be pretty easy to rig up, though. I actually rigged up my 2 Bazooka tubes and amp to see how they sounded. Hardly any difference in base once I tuned the bass/fader on my Kenwood and stock Monsoon Amp.
Give it a whirl and let the rest of us know.[HR][/HR]​Did you actually hook the bazooka up the the Monsoon system? or to the Kenwood? I have a bazooka laying around and would like to install it, but being the car is a lease I'm hesitant to cut into any wires. You or anyone else have a good idea on the easiest way to do it?


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mclii)*

mclii, *thanks!!!* excellent work. this thread needed the scientific approach (wished you had shown up earlier). here's to you








also nice to hear someone else who knows from experience that the dd does not stack up to the single-din (and that the dd still has problems).
postman, i think you've probably nailed the rest of the problem(s), or at least offered the most plausible explanation to date. back on 6/6 at 7:02pm, i posted the following, though i had no explanation for it whatsoever:
interesting note: 
1) nbcosta found out that his excellent sounding system was wired w/o the amp. 
2) nin009 heard a nice souning premium 5 dd hu, a system w/o the amp.
nice sound, no amp...
since then i've definitely noticed that unlike the single-din, the dd seems to lose the tweeters when faded past 10 o'clock. anyway...
any idea at all what could be causing this possible problem with the amp not getting enough signal from the hu? would the analog/digital controls stuff mentioned at the end of mclii's post fit in somehow?


[Modified by amgvw, 11:16 PM 6-18-2002]


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## Nin009 (Nov 1, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I got my car back from the dealer and the Monsoon sounds better. The left side bass is still pretty weak, but there is no musical "hole" coming from-or not coming from-the front left side at high volume.
The system sounds better, but I am not happy with the results. After three trips to two different dealers, I give up. I am resigned to believe the Monsoon system is simply of poor quality and I will have to replace it to improve the sound.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Nin009)*

quote:[HR][/HR]After three trips to two different dealers, I give up. I am resigned to believe the Monsoon system is simply of poor quality and I will have to replace it to improve the sound.[HR][/HR]​i test drove a w8 with the dd monsoon set up today and it rocked. no balance problems, no fader issues. 
also, as per my last post and postman's post about the lack of signal being sent to the tweeters, that was the biggest thing i noticed about the dd monsoon in the w8, even faded all the way to the rear, there was plenty of signal coming out of the tweeters and that seems to make all the difference. just like the single-din in my 02 passat.
i think postman nailed it with his diagnosis.


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## s3GTI (Jan 21, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

just had to say that my monsoon still sucks after the wire swap. it really sucks.


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## kyleb (Jun 20, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (s3GTI)*

thank you very much for the info. i replaced the factory monsoon with a jvc kd-sh99 and it improved the sound quality considerably. there was still something odd about it but the improved respoce had me looking the other way. after reading this post i redid the wiering harness to correct the problem and now i have one sweet sounding system. thanks again


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (s3GTI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]just had to say that my monsoon still sucks after the wire swap. it really sucks. [HR][/HR]​I hope you have signed the Monsoon petition......


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## LeatherMK2 (Dec 30, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

oh man this is a big thread, DAIM!


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (LeatherMK2)*

We need to keep it active.....so I can show the BBB arbitrator the magnitude of this problem.


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## OakHillVariant (May 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

I'm a Passat owner, so the Golf/Jetta fix doesn't do it for me, but I am suspicious of miswiring back at the amp itself.
For reference, could some of you post pictures of your amp wiring (preferably so it is reasonably clear what color wires are gong to which of the connector pins).
This is request is for anyone, not just Passats. Especially, cars other than Passats so I can compare mine to yours. I realize the amps are "different" for each car, but I bet that is just a firmware difference, not a wiring difference.


----------



## kyleb (Jun 20, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (OakHillVariant)*

im prety sure there is not firmware in the amp at all, i would be shocked if i were wrong on this. also, you must understand that the wireing is between the amp and the headunit so it realy doesnt mater if you check one side or the other. im no expert here, however im prety sure this is an issue with all monsoon double din systems in vw's, inculding the passat. if you think there is an issue i highly recomend pulling the headunit and looking at the plug, it only takes a few moments and could well do your soundsystem a lot of good.


----------



## OakHillVariant (May 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (kyleb)*

>im prety sure there is not firmware in the amp at all
>i would be shocked if i were wrong on this
Hmmm --- in retrospect, I guess you're right. I was under the impression that there was a Digital Signal Processor in the amp. In checking the monsoonpower.com website, I see they claim the DSP is in the HU. I ass-u-me-d it was in the amp, since the amp is supposed to be tailored for each vehicle model.
(One *big* question I have is whether there is supposed to be a different amp for the Passat sedan and for the Passat wagon. I can guarantee you that the soundfield properties of the much larger wagon interior are going to be different than the sedan, especially on the bass end where I have my difficulties.
As far as the plug wiring issue goes, when I checked with a scope, the phase matches on all the signals coming from the HU. I checked back at the amp, comparing the phase on the signal wires from the HU. All the "colored" wires were in phase. 
Keep in mind, the Passat problem appears different than the Jetta/Golf problem. For all I know, they boffed the wiring at the amp side of the harness for the Passat!
My system sounds great, *unless* I am playing a track with a fair amount of bass. In that case, it goes into some sort of bass meltdown - totally boomy. Turning down the bass to like 25% _helps some_ but not enough.


----------



## kyleb (Jun 20, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (OakHillVariant)*

are you reading a different site than i am? all i know of is this here: http://www.monsoonpower.com/
not only does it not mention the 2002 model year but they make no claims of anything being diffrent in any sytem other than "speaker" location. i find that a little odd honestly as a sound company should refer to such item by its true name of "driver" and not "speaker" as that is a full range device inclosed in a single cabinet, but i supose i am geting away from the point here. i honestly doubt there is any difference in the amp they use for any of their products, they are all listed as 200w 8-chanel amps and i see no reason to suspect them to individualy designed for each vehicle, am i missing something here? 
also im afraid i dont folow your statement:
"For all I know, they boffed the wiring at the amp side of the harness for the Passat!"
are you saying that you think that the phase is wired wrong coming out of the amp and to the speakers? if so that should be just as easy to check as the wireing between the head unit and the amp, isnt it? if you are running into difficulities in this perhaps you might take the time explain them and myself or someone else around here is bound to be able to offer a good solution.


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (kyleb)*

Having worked for GM's Product Planning dept back in 1993 when they first released this in Europe on the Opel Omega (Cadillac Catera) the amp does have a DSP inside with 8 individual smaller amp for each speaker. 
As mentioned previously, if you look at each Monsoon Amp it has a sticker which says which model it is for (see below). Also, the HU is not a Monsoon component as it is the same HU in all models, whether you have Monsoon or not.
Check the amp on your car and post the type, VW part # and Delta Electronics (Monsoon) part#:-
- Golf 
- 1J6 035 456 C
- DE P/N 12214119


----------



## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I have finally given up on this monsoon POS and http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=404976
what a nice difference!


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

This one says JETTA WAGON


----------



## jagorny (Jun 3, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

Some extra input...
First of all, speakers aren't rocket science... if you reverse the polarity of one speaker out of three that doesn't make any sense... even reversing two speakers would cause problems in a four speaker system...
I did the swap thanks to UKAUSSI's super instructions... I almost lost the pink pin as well... after everyone talked about how hard it was to get out I put a little extra force into it.
If you need a song to test the effects of this poor wiring vs. good wiring, the best song I have been able to find is Radiohead's 'Paranoid Android' off of 'OK Computer'... The album has a lot of engineered sound in it, but that particular song has a point where it turns from soft to hard guitars... that clipping point TOTALLY scares the crap out of you because the acoustic portion is out of phase (making you turn up the volume to hear the song) and then once the electric guitars appear it is significantly treble heavy and thus louder (have to turn it down almost 3 notches)...
Post-wiring fix I played the song for a friend because I thought it was ingenius sound staging, but when I played the song, it just didn't happen... all of the parts of the song were of the same volume! That's the kind of difference that reversed polarity can make on a system, especially when crossover is involved.
Oh OH! I have to add one thing to UKAUSSI's instructions... if you happen to have the removal tools, it is very easy to remove the pins at the HU... I struggled with the paperclip alone, but then realized they were just pushing the barbs in... you can't push the barbs in and push the pin out with just the paperclip... instead of the barbs running into the plastic designed to keep the leads, in the paperclip hits the plastic... however, if you take a second pointy object (like the removal tool point or a ball-point pen) and push the lead connector while the paperclip is still on either side of the connector, it pops out effortlessly. That esssentially what the 'real' contact removal tool does...



[Modified by jagorny, 8:35 PM 6-22-2002]


----------



## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jagorny)*

I haven't chimed in for a while but I did want to say that Alicia Keys' "Fallin'" works as a great test song, too. The cascading fa-a-a-ah-ah-ah-aling plays around with sound placement and possibly even phase to get a cascade effect. Nice sound engineering in my opinion. It sounds find on my wire-corrected system.
FM still sucks and you cannot turn the base past 3:00 still. I am waiting for a birthday or something to replace the HU. Or, god forbid, VW finally admitting the D-Din HU is f*cked up.


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

Here is a link to one of Metra's discussions:
http://161.58.147.9/data/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=000075
It seem like the Monsoon amp powers on if it receives signal on the LEFT FRONT wire. So it seems like this can be the a reason why that paarticular wire is swapped in the first place and this could also explain why the left front speaker has the sound issues. So I am not sure what it means but it could be part of the problem, I just thought I'd share it with you......


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]It seem like the Monsoon amp powers on if it receives signal on the LEFT FRONT wire. So it seems like this can be the a reason why that paarticular wire is swapped in the first place and this could also explain why the left front speaker has the sound issues. So I am not sure what it means but it could be part of the problem, I just thought I'd share it with you......[HR][/HR]​i swear we are getting closer to getting this mystery solved! postman was the first to post about the amp not receiving a power signal from the hu, though there was no explanation given for why there was no signal. well, if the signal is supposed to come from the LF wire as greg just posted, and we know the LF speaker is the source of the phase problem, we can't be too far off from getting to the bottom of this.
we need need the same scientific approach mcii brought to the table in regards to the phase issue, but this time we need it directed at measuring the power signal being sent from the hu to the amp and the effect the LF speaker and wire has on it.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Well I personally no longer care if the mistery will ever be solved as I no longer have the Monsoon HU in my Jetta. Since the Monsoon amp and speakers work great with my new HU I can only conclude that the culprit is the HU in the whole matter. Again this is just another speculation but as far as I'm concerned the HU is the POS and the Monsoon seems to be OK.
On another note I just got a response from VWofA regarding the petition and they said what they have been saying all along that is the "radio meets factory standards" and this is how it's supposed to sound. So I have filed a complaint with the BBB Auto Line and hopefully I will get at least a refund on the Monsoon upgrade and about $200 for labor for a new setup. Again I don't know what will happen but I'll keep you in the circle.


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## altern8545 (Mar 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

GTakacs,
I am also interested in just ripping out he HU and replacing it with a market HU ... Can you tell me if a) needed to do the wire still? b1) did you do u take it to a auto shop? b2) was the installation straight forward or did they have to charge extra?
Thanks


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (altern8545)*

altern8545,
a) You have to do the wire swap still, but don't sweat it, it is no biggie.
b1) I just did the install myself it wasn't too difficult. The speaker wires are straight forward, for the rest of the wires (power, ground, ignition, dimmer) you have to play around. I got power and ground from the stock plug and ran the other two to the fuse box, no big deal.
b2) The sales rep at Car Toys scared me that I'd need a complete rewire, new speakers, amp and HU, but after reading success stories of others who only swapped the HU only I decided to go for it. If all you want to replace is the HU (I am happy with the results) then the install is basic, no need for rewire. If you want to replace the HU, amp, speakers then a complete rewire is in order which cost around $200-$300.
If you're replacing the amp, you'll have to replace the speakers, at least the rear ones as those are 2 ohm ones that not many amps can take. and since the original amp is an 8ch (separate channel for the tweeters) you'd need either a crossover or new components all around anyway. The of course new RCA line levels from HU to Amp and new wires from Amp to Speakers.
Good luck, if I'd have to do it again, I'd do it the same way in a heartbeat!


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

FYI, my D-Din still sounds great after the wire swap.
Just a reminder to:-
- check the Monsoon AMP to make sure you have the right one for your car (sticker says GOLF, JETTA WAGON, etc)
- check the coding of you HU if you have VAG-COM or get dlr to check it.
Also, here is a section from one of my previous posts which shows pin-outs from D-DIN HU. Hope this helps
This should help clear up a lot of question on the new 2002 Dbl-DIN HU's 









*8 pin multi-connector I*
1 - Speaker + right rear 
2 - Speaker + right front 
3 - Speaker + left front 
4 - Speaker + left rear 
5 - Speaker - right rear 
6 - Speaker - right front 
7 - Speaker - left front 
8 - Speaker - left rear 

*8 pin multi-connector II*
9 - CAN-Bus plus 
10 - CAN-Bus minus 
11 - Mute 
12 - Ground (GND) 
13 - Radio, Control signal 
14 - Contact alarm 
15 - Battery positive (B+) 
16 - Signal for anti-theft alarm 

*12 pin multi-connector III**
1-5 Open 
6 - Signal for telephone minus (-) 
7-11 Open 
12 - Signal for telephone plus (+) 

*12 pin multi-connector IV*
1 - Open 
2 - CD changer - left and right channel, Ground (GND) 
3 - Open 
4 - CD changer - Positive (B+) supply 
5 - Open 
6 - CD changer - DATA OUT 
7 - Open 
8 - CD changer - left channel, CD/L 
9 - CD changer - right channel, CD/L 
10 - CD changer - Control signal 
11 - CD changer - DATA IN 
12 - CD changer - CLOCK 
*) Where applicable


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Well, for anyone who has said 'I told you so' I have yet to recieve a response from the VW rep (suit and tie guy) after a month give or take, with a call each week to the dealer manager. he said to me 'honestly, I don't think your going to get an answer' which is what I expected.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

UKAUSSI,
I am guessing not everyone has the same threshold for sound quality. I like decent sound, but so far in all of my 4 cars I was satisfied with the OEM stereo. This is the first car where it was so bad I could not stand it. I think the CD sounded OK after the wie swap but the FM was still unacceptably bright, it was way too harsh to my ears.
So again, thanks for your wire swap tip, I can see how the resulting sound might please some (including VWofA), but it is still too bad for me along 60some other members of vwvortex......


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]UKAUSSI,
I am guessing not everyone has the same threshold for sound quality. I like decent sound, but so far in all of my 4 cars I was satisfied with the OEM stereo. This is the first car where it was so bad I could not stand it. I think the CD sounded OK after the wie swap but the FM was still unacceptably bright, it was way too harsh to my ears.
So again, thanks for your wire swap tip, I can see how the resulting sound might please some (including VWofA), but it is still too bad for me along 60some other members of vwvortex......[HR][/HR]​
I think you misunderstood what I was saying. 
My system now sounds great, I wasn't saying that you were all imagining things. 
As I have said many times before there may be other problems besides the out-of-phase speakers. In my experience there can be a lot of hidden problems that can appear to be something else. 
Although I am not an audiophile I have worked on stereos & speaker wiring since I was 8yrs old (almost 30 years now) and my dad had a quadrophonic sound system hooked up to a total of 16 speakers all designed for specific frequencies. From my BIO you will also see I worked a GM for 6 years and some of that was with the In-Car-Entertainment (ICE) as we called it in Europe.
Comparisons:-
- much better than 2001 Yukon system
- a little better than 1998 Honda Accord system with cd-changer
- better than 1996 Saturn with graphic eq and excellent rear bass speakers
- worse than 1998 Montero Sport "Infinity" system (best car stereo I have heard in a long time)


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]UKAUSSI,
I am guessing not everyone has the same threshold for sound quality. I like decent sound, but so far in all of my 4 cars I was satisfied with the OEM stereo. This is the first car where it was so bad I could not stand it. I think the CD sounded OK after the wie swap but the FM was still unacceptably bright, it was way too harsh to my ears.
So again, thanks for your wire swap tip, I can see how the resulting sound might please some (including VWofA), but it is still too bad for me along 60some other members of vwvortex......

I think you misunderstood what I was saying. 
My system now sounds great, I wasn't saying that you were all imagining things. 
As I have said many times before there may be other problems besides the out-of-phase speakers. In my experience there can be a lot of hidden problems that can appear to be something else. 
Although I am not an audiophile I have worked on stereos & speaker wiring since I was 8yrs old (almost 30 years now) and my dad had a quadrophonic sound system hooked up to a total of 16 speakers all designed for specific frequencies. From my BIO you will also see I worked a GM for 6 years and some of that was with the In-Car-Entertainment (ICE) as we called it in Europe.
Comparisons:-
- much better than 2001 Yukon system
- a little better than 1998 Honda Accord system with cd-changer
- better than 1996 Saturn with graphic eq and excellent rear bass speakers
- worse than 1998 Montero Sport "Infinity" system (best car stereo I have heard in a long time)







[HR][/HR]​I don't think you need to be an audiophile (I have been, owning over 10K worth of equipment) to be a judge of good sound, however, it does help to be a regular listener of live (preferably acoustic) concerts....whether it be jazz, classical, vocal performances, etc. I have attended many of those and Monsoon represents the closest thing I have heard to the antithesis of the real thing. I won't go down the list of auto audio systems I have owned....Monsoon is plainly the worst, and by a wide margin. The system is *far* too bright, specifically on AM radio voices and CDs. Monsoon makes voices sound unreal....emphasizing the upper registers and emasculating most anything below the midrange. I don't want a system to sound 'crisp', or booming, or bright because real music doesn't sound that way and because these characteristics hurt my ears. I've never cared much how a car audio system sounds, but Monsoon (and whoever makes that head unit), in their desire to create a boutique sound, has created an audio abomination in my Passat....that's why I'm taking VW to arbitration. And I highly suspect that the lack of left side bass and faulty fader control I *still* hear in my Passat despite three trips to the dealer (including an examination by a VW rep), has something to do with the crap that I have been hearing in my car.



[Modified by DanoP, 6:27 PM 6-25-2002]


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI,
I did not misunderstand you. My system sounds great too, now that I have finally dumped the POS Premium VI HU







.
To me the 2002 Monsoon sounded worse than my 95' Opel Corsa (European car, same as the Chevrolet Chevy in Mexico), my 95' Neon, and both of my my 2000 Neons. I think the 2000 Neon was my best system by far, and the Monsoon FM was just horrible and unacceptable to me. I can understand why others would not hear it as I hear it, but luckily for me there are a fair amount of owners who feel the same and I am sure that not every one of them is an audiophile and needs a full blown $2000 system in their car, they just want something decent like the one in the 2000 Neon.
So again, I understand that you think that the system is decent for an OEM after the wire swap, but to me and 68 others it is still sub par to other OEM systems found in much cheaper cars.
This Jetta is the most expenssive car I have ever owned, my dad had 2 Audis and he just got a New Passat 1.9TDI 4 motion with 6 speed manual that we'll probably never see here in the US, and I am ready to get my own Passat next year, but I really want to know that VWofA listens to their customers and tries to resolve their problems, otherwise I might end up going with something else.....


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

OK, this is my final attempt to explain what I was trying to say as it seems that a couple of people are misunderstanding.
My system sounds great in my professional opinion. (period) SEE BIO 
GTakacs - Mine sounds better that the 95 Opel Corsa as I helped design the specs for that radio & I also had 2 as company cars (SRi & GSI which had the top end radio). As you felt that your system was worse than your 95 Corsa you obviously must have/had a system/HU that sounded worse than my system and hence an additional problem other than the wiring.







sorry to hear that. I was also an Audi/Porsche Cust Relation mgr at a SoCA dlr and I would say it is on a par with the stock radio in a 97/98 A4 with a little better bass quality.

I personally think that there are other problems other than the HU wiring (not a 'tip' by the way but an actual fix to an actual problem







)
The fact that Passat owners are also experiencing the problem (different wiring harness to Golf/Jetta) indicates that it is probably a quality control problem with the HU.
Hopefully, those with problems will get some kind of resolution http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI,
I value your opinion greatly. You were the one who actually came up with one viable solution to the problem and your fix seemed to resolve many people's problem.
I don't quite recall how the sound actually sounded in my '95 Corsa but I sure was able to listen to FM without a problem. Since them I might have gotten too used to the very nice sound of my 2000 Neon and I might be pickier about the sound than before.
The Monsoon FM is just way too bright and harsh even my wife noticed it and she generally doesn't care at all about music but the FM sounded bad for her too switching over from the Neon.
I beleive that the problem is a quality control at the HU as well since my new HU with the Monsoon amp sounds great and I am happy with the system as it is. the only thing I am not happy about is that I had to fork out $500 for my new HU.
If you know something more about what else can be the problem child of this ill fated sound system, please by all means share it with us!
BTW the Dealer has replaced my HU with another one from car with 9/01 build (mine is 4/02) and it sounded just the same so it is probably a whole series of HUs that are affected. So I've had experience with 2 HUs in my car and they were both sub par in quaity when compared to other OEM or the new Kenwood I've just installed.
So again, thanks for your input, I understand that you've seen the other side of this coin as well, hopefully we'll all get some sort of resolution, if nothing else they will fix it so I'll have a decent sound system in my 2003 Passat







.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I value your opinion greatly.[HR][/HR]​of course, this whole matter really has nothing to do with anyone's opinion though does it? opinions are not going to get the problem solved (though i do enjoy reading what everyone has to say). what's needed are hard facts and scientific analysis e.g., the awesome work mcii did in proving the LF speaker is wired out of phase.
i think the next step is chasing down the issue postman first raised i.e., the lack of signal being sent to the amp and the resulting lack of signal being sent from the amp to the speakers. i'm willing to bet that therein lies the fader problem since in my case, when i fade to the rear, i lose almost all the signal from the rear tweeters and the front speakers. greg recently added some further information about the monsoon amp getting the necessary signal from the LF speaker wire. given the existing issue with the LF speaker being wired out of phase, i think we're finally onto something. now if we could only get mcii to go to work on measuring the signal between the hu, the amp, and the speakers.
also, i'm not so sure we should be blaming monsoon for our problems. first off, the hu is made by matsu****a and then of course there's the fact that the single-din in my 02 passat kicks major ass (as did the single-din in my 00 gti and the single-din in my gf's 00 golf).


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

quote:[HR][/HR]OK, this is my final attempt to explain what I was trying to say as it seems that a couple of people are misunderstanding.
My system sounds great in my professional opinion. (period) SEE BIO 
GTakacs - Mine sounds better that the 95 Opel Corsa as I helped design the specs for that radio & I also had 2 as company cars (SRi & GSI which had the top end radio). As you felt that your system was worse than your 95 Corsa you obviously must have/had a system/HU that sounded worse than my system and hence an additional problem other than the wiring.







sorry to hear that. I was also an Audi/Porsche Cust Relation mgr at a SoCA dlr and I would say it is on a par with the stock radio in a 97/98 A4 with a little better bass quality.

I personally think that there are other problems other than the HU wiring (not a 'tip' by the way but an actual fix to an actual problem







)
The fact that Passat owners are also experiencing the problem (different wiring harness to Golf/Jetta) indicates that it is probably a quality control problem with the HU.
Hopefully, those with problems will get some kind of resolution http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​It should be noted that the wire fix does not work with the Passat....I've tried it both ways and still have the fader and left side bass problems. I've made three visits to my dealer....have switched out the HU and had a VW rep spend a few hours with my auto. He claims that he looked at the wiring connections to the amp, HU and speakers and all connections are per spec. He also says he spoke to the designer of the sound system in order to better understand how everything is suppose to work. Despite all these efforts, these problems persist....everyone who has listened to my sound system agrees (including the VW rep).
As far as how a sound system *should* sound, any professional assessment must include a frequency response measurement....and as far as I know, that has not been done on any of the cars here. I have tried, but failed so far in finding someone who can do such a measurement. Absent that, we are left with opinion on how a system is supposed to sound, and more often than not, that opinion is based on what is pleasing to the listener rather than music itself and objective measurements. People who design decent audio equipment attend live concerts regularly....they know what real instruments sound like....and when you look at the frequency response measurements of the equipment they design they are almost always near flat from around 700 Hz to 15,000 Hz. I know almost for sure that if I could get a measurement done on my auto it would exhibit a rather terribly upwardly sloping db to frequency curve. Curiously though, many people would welcome such a bright sound. It would, however, by objective measurements be considered as a poor and inaccurate system and by professional judgement, unacceptable.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]It should be noted that the wire fix does not work with the Passat....I've tried it both ways and still have the fader and left side bass problems.[HR][/HR]​you need to do mcii's phase test. that will give you hard evidence of a phasing problem if one does in fact exist. i don't think there's anyone that would try to argue that having your speakers out of phase is within factory specs? you need to at least rule out that issue.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR]It should be noted that the wire fix does not work with the Passat....I've tried it both ways and still have the fader and left side bass problems.
you need to do mcii's phase test. that will give you hard evidence of a phasing problem if one does in fact exist. i don't think there's anyone that would try to argue that having your speakers out of phase is within factory specs? you need to at least rule out that issue.[HR][/HR]​Gladly, if I can get my hands on the proper equipment to do the measurement.


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## mclii (Dec 19, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I'm not sure how much my input on this subject has helped or hurt, but I'm glad at least someone got something out of it.
As for the fader and balance issues, that sounds to me like a headunit problem. I had/have those problems pre and post wire swap, with regards to a sharp cut-off of sound with both the fader and the balance. A way to deduct that it is actually the head unit that has the problem, I'd think, is to have someone using an aftermarket head unit run through the monsoon amp, test their fader and balance. Smooth transitions would probably mean the OEM head unit is the problem, not the amp. Same choppy fader and balance performance, I'd say it's the amp. I think the problems that are being experienced are head unit problems. The reason I say this is because the brightness associated with a sound is usually as a result of equalisation (right?), and not with an amp. My thinking is that the OEM head unit is the "preamp" in this situation, and the amp, is obviously the amp, or the thing that's making the sound waves have more amplitude. So my diagram as far as the sound signal is concerned, under my thinking goes something like this....
Signal Source(CD, FM, AM, Cassette)--->Preamp(OEM Head Unit)---> Amp--->Speakers
Pretty simplistic, but does everyone think this is on the right track? So in this case, the amp is just something that's passive(right?), something that's simply amplifying a signal that comes from a signal source from the head unit, which is "modified" through equalisation and balance and fader controls. This is why I think the problem is probably the head unit. In this case, the head unit is really the only thing that's altering a signal drastically, besides the amp that's amplifying it.
Is the thinking behind the left channel powering on the amp making the left channels have less amplitude than the right channels, making the right channels sound louder? I guess I'm as confused as everyone else on this topic.
It's my thinking that it's just a coincidence that the monsoon amp gets the "power" signal from the fact that there is an audio signal coming from the left channel, and the left front speakers being wired out-of-phase. But I could totally be wrong.
I wish I could help out more, like measuring signal to certain speakers, but I unfortunately don't know how to do that. I don't have a multi-tester at easy disposal, and even if I did, I don't know where I'd start to try to find out the signal strength to certain speakers. Also, I'm totally clueless about the Passat's double din problems, so I'm not sure if any of this applies to the Passat.
My thinking is that the head unit is the fault here, not the amp. I think I've read that people have had good luck with hooking up an aftermarket headunit to the monsoon and it sounding awesome.
I think I kind of like my Double Din now, after the wire swap. Listening to FM with any volume gets kind of difficult though, there seems to be a lot of bass associated with anything that is in a certain range, and really bright with anything that's in another. But CDs sound quite a bit better than before the wire swap. 
Maybe VW should start offering cars without a radio like they used too, and they wouldn't have so many complaints







ha ha! Just to put everything in perspective though, those same single din units that people talk about, saying that they sound good (I being one of them) other people say sound bad, and want to replace as well... It seems all relative...


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (mclii)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I'm not sure how much my input on this subject has helped or hurt, but I'm glad at least someone got something out of it.[HR][/HR]​your phase test was awesome














http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
quote:[HR][/HR]As for the fader and balance issues, that sounds to me like a headunit problem. [HR][/HR]​yes. after trying to chase down both addtl. wiring problems and amp problems, i'm now back to the hu. i was chasing down the amp as we had 2 reports of high quality sound where the amp had been taken out of the equation. however, after postman's post about the amp basically depending on the hu to send it a signal it can then send to the speakers, i'm back to the hu.
quote:[HR][/HR]It's my thinking that it's just a coincidence that the monsoon amp gets the "power" signal from the fact that there is an audio signal coming from the left channel, and the left front speakers being wired out-of-phase. But I could totally be wrong.[HR][/HR]​it just seems like an awful big coincidence that there's a proven problem with the left front speaker wiring and that the hu uses the left front speaker wire to send signal to the amp. 
of course, i have yet to verify that the hu does in fact send signal to the amp via the left front speaker wire and i still have not come up with an explanation for how the lf speaker wire could be failing to deliver the necessary signal to the amp when the fader is engaged. all in good time








quote:[HR][/HR]Just to put everything in perspective though, those same single din units that people talk about, saying that they sound good (I being one of them) other people say sound bad, and want to replace as well[HR][/HR]​judging by the vortex alone, there are far more people unhappy about their dd. in my own experience, the only folks i know that swapped out their single-dins were car audio folks that were gonna build their own system either way.


----------



## griddy (Jun 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Thinking logically: if 1) the amp turns on when there is a signal in the LF channel, and 2) you turn the fader to the rear, then 3) the LF channel does not get enough power to trigger the amp on, and 4) the entire Monsoon amplifier system should logically shutdown, which 5) results in no sound.
Make sense?


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (griddy)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Thinking logically: if 1) the amp turns on when there is a signal in the LF channel, and 2) you turn the fader to the rear, then 3) the LF channel does not get enough power to trigger the amp on, and 4) the entire Monsoon amplifier system should logically shutdown, which 5) results in no sound. Make sense?[HR][/HR]​that's way oversimplified and no one said the amp turns on when there is a signal in the lf channel. go back and read postman's post a few pages back. what i'm taking away from his post is that the amp needs a certain signal strength from the hu to then send signal to the speakers. i'm thinking that the fader is causing the signal strength from the hu to the amp to drop *too* low, therefore resulting in a lack of signal from the amp to the speaker. 
when i fade the dd in my 02 golf past 10 o'clock on the dial, it sounds to me like i lose all the speakers except the rear sub-woofers. this is not proper operation. yes, the front speakers should have reduced volume, but i'm getting no volume. make sense?


----------



## griddy (Jun 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

That's... basically what I said until step 4.


----------



## bmxvr6 (Dec 11, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (griddy)*


----------



## gregosh (Feb 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bmxvr6)*

Does this problem still exist for the 2003 monsoon systems???


----------



## CO Boy (Sep 24, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (gregosh)*

I went to the dealer today for the 5000 mile maintance. I asked the service manager to check the wiring on the radio. He said no problem. When I picked it up I asked him if they did the fix. He said no, your radio sounded horrible so we replaced the whole head unit. Sounds so much better than it did. Hows that for service?


----------



## timmybgood (Dec 12, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CO Boy)*

thats good service, but it sounds like this monsoon is a huge headache, i'm glad i have a mk3 and a pioneer! best of luck to yall http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CO Boy)*

So according to CO Boy's experience there are now good DDIN head units in the parts channel!?!?! Isn't that a major revelation or has everyone untracked this thread via email.








That is the fix _I_ am waiting for, a factory fix. Done the wire swap still sounds bad on CD horrible on FM. Which is an improvement over "Horrible/horrible" of course.


----------



## 2oo2 VW GTI Dood (Jul 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

I have a 2002 GTI I bought about 2 months ago in california.. I noticed from the first time i lostened to the stereo that it sounded like poop.. I thought it just sucked for 2002. After reading several posts on the issue and realizing my monsoon showed the same symptoms (****ty sounding left rear speaker, distortion) i decided to pull out my DD and take a look. I looked at the connector on my harness and I have a completely different color scheme. i swapped the two that were in the same position.. no real difference.. I played with it for about 20 minutes and all kinds of wierd poop happened.. my wiring sounds like it's seriously ****** up.. I've probobly installed over 500 stereos in my day and done about 20-30 hardwires and what it sounds like is that there is either a problem with the amp, the deck, or the wiring is terribly ******. I'm going to play with it again tomorrow if I have time before work and hardwire it from scratch. I'll let you guys know what comes of it. Has anyone seen a different color scheme for the wiring??


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]So according to CO Boy's experience there are now good DDIN head units in the parts channel!?!?! Isn't that a major revelation or has everyone untracked this thread via email.







[HR][/HR]​hmm, i would call that *unconfirmed* at best. vw still hasn't even issued a corrected tsb.
though from the post above, it sounds like maybe the wiring has changed?


----------



## 1.8TurboGrin (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

I'd bet money that they just did the wire swap and told him that they replaced the whole unit. What are the chances that they had a replacement one in stock? They never seem to have parts in stock anymore and I honestly don't trust the service department. Sounds a little bit too easy that they swapped out the HU in my opinion.
Still living with the dd unit and planning to swap it out.


----------



## CO Boy (Sep 24, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (1.8TurboGrin)*

"So according to CO Boy's experience there are now good DDIN head units in the parts channel!?!?! Isn't that a major revelation or has everyone untracked this thread via email."
Hold on there. The only claims that I am making are good dealer service claims. My orginal radio sounded worse than what everybody was posting. My dealer acknoleged the wiring problem. He stated when I asked about that out of all the ones he has checked only a few, actually, needed the fix. How many is that you ask? I have no idea. I'm sure 90% of the people who bought from my dealer dont even know about vwvortex.com. So with that said, my new radio sounds a s*#tload better than before. I have yet to really put it through a test since when I picked up the car I had no cds with me and I spent the weekend in Boston, great fireworks, btw. Ultimately, I think I had really bad radio in my car.
Cheers and I know I cant spell...










[Modified by CO Boy, 7:47 PM 7-7-2002]


----------



## hognozzle (Jun 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CO Boy)*

people in the GTI 337 forum are posting that their cars had the wire swap done at port. does this mean that there should now be a new TSB? anyway to find out? any dealers here?
-btw this thread has been very interesting. i too suffer from the crap balance and fader issues. SM acknowledged something was wrong but pulled the text book "i have no idea what you are talking about let's change the subject" when i mentioned the wire swap and "the internet".
they are going to look at it more on my next visit. like everyone, i'd love to see VW acknowledge this. gonna sign the petition.

-hognozzle


----------



## steez (Dec 2, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hognozzle)*

I wanna add that over at clubrsx.com the RSX's have the same problem as us with the Bose sound system. Wired wrong at the factory


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## Goodies1.8t (Jun 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (hognozzle)*

I just picked up my 2002 GTI (with the monsoon) and first thing I checked out was the radio, (after what I have seen posted here!!) It sounded ok, I asked the dealer if there had been any problems and he looked at me like I was screwed in the head. 
I played with it some more and the FM stations do not sound to good, it sounds like I have bumble bees in my speakers, the CD's however sound really good, I was impressed, good bass, so I am not to sure, but I am still going to check the wiring on the back just in case








I will post agian and let you know my results, maybe if mine is wired fine at this point if may be safe to say that they are fixing the problem














.... maybe, we will see.


[Modified by Goodies1.8t, 3:59 AM 7-10-2002]


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

I finally got my audio shop to install the Metra antenna adapter for my aftermarket HU and I'm sorry to have to report that the AM radio reception is still lousy. At least it exists now, but it fades in and out. FM reception is fine. So for anyone considering a switch to an aftermarket unit, you'll have to take into consideration the likelihood of AM reception problems. For me, it's not such a big deal, since I mostly listen to CDs, and I'm eagerly awaiting a drop in prices on XM digital satellite radio equipment--once that happens I'll install one in a flash.
With 20/20 hindsight, taking into account the cost of the new unit ($250 for a Blaupunkt RPD555, installed) and the AM reception problems, I'd still choose to do EXACTLY what I did. The sound on CDs and FM is terrific. Maybe not $2000 state-of-the-art, but incomparably better than with the d-DIN Monsoon/Matsu****a HU and amp. That's all I wanted, and it's what I've got. Now I grin instead of grimace when listening to my favorite music in the Passat.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

nbcosta,
have you considered filing a complaint with the BBB for a reimbursement for your HU? I am in the process of doing that, afterall I purchased a vehicle with "premium sound" and what I got was everything BUT premium!
As for the AM reception I am glad to report that tonight I have successfully managed to get good AM reception out of an aftermarket HU! It was a tad tricky but I did it


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## Corradodave (Feb 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

I too had the dealer do the wire swap. It sounds better but not correct. There is a problem for sure someplace else in the system. I listened to a system in a 2002 with the single din system and it sounds alot better.


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## ryeo (May 21, 2002)

Has anyone hooked up a, aftermarket HU to the stock Monsoon amp & speakers (discarding the DDIN HU) ? How does/will it sound? Thanks!
Rod


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## dmbrown (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (ryeo)*

Yesterday I took my 2002 Jetta GLX to Gossett Volkswagen/AUDI/Porsche in Memphis for the wire swap and the system sounds great. I noticed the right-side bias the day I drove the car home in February. Thank you, UKAUSSI!!! Another thing I noticed when I originally got the car is that I can't access the "turn-on volume level" function that the Monsoon manual describes. Here are the directions from the manual:
Setting the turn-on volume 
level and Speed Volume Control 
(SVC)
Turn-on volume level
The volume setting when the unit is turned 
on is the same as it was when the unit was
turned off. You can program the unit for your 
own personal turn-on volume level:
Press and hold the Dolby button 
(12, see page 10) for longer than 3 seconds.
You'll hear a signal tone, and "SET UP 
VOL ON LIMIT" will appear in the display.
The volume level is represented by a numer
-ical value in the display.
Turn the knob (6) to adjust the volume.
Whenever I press and hold the Dolby button, my Monsoon goes directly to the "SET UP SPEED DEP VOL" (Speed Volume Control) setting. When I press the Dolby button again it exits the menu. Why does it skip the turn-on volume setting menu described in the manual? Has anyone successfully adjusted their "Turn-on volume level" Thanks!

[Modified by dmbrown, 8:38 PM 7-13-2002]


[Modified by dmbrown, 8:40 PM 7-13-2002]


----------



## OakHillVariant (May 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (dmbrown)*

quote:[HR][/HR] Has anyone successfully adjusted their "Turn-on volume level" [HR][/HR]​It is not just _your_ radio. Mine also doesn't access the turn-on volume (as described in the manual).
Go figure ...


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## euro_vw (Jun 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CO Boy)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I went to the dealer today for the 5000 mile maintance. I asked the service manager to check the wiring on the radio. He said no problem. When I picked it up I asked him if they did the fix. He said no, your radio sounded horrible so we replaced the whole head unit. Sounds so much better than it did. Hows that for service?[HR][/HR]​If they replaced the whole HU, they should have given you a new radio code. Try to disconnect the battery for a min(or just pull the fuse for radio for 1 min), connect it back and see if the computer recognizes your radio right away, or you have to put a new code.


----------



## Couldnt think of one (Jun 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (ryeo)*

yeah can anyone hook up an aftermarket HU to the stock monsoon amp ?


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Couldnt think of one)*

Euro_wv,
If they replaced his HU he should have gotten a new code. However just by pulling the battery or the fuse or the Radio will not confirm the new code. The new Double-DIN actually "knows" which car it's hooked into and unless you try to "mate" it to a new vehicle it will not ask for the code ever again, it will recognize it's home car and just turn on as nothing has ever happened. It's fun to catch you talking about something you know so little about, as always.....
Couldn't think of one,
YES you can hook up an aftermarket HU to the Monsoon amp and it will sound fine. It sure fixed my sound problem in my Jetta.
Edit: second response was addressed to the wrong person+spelling...


[Modified by GTakacs, 10:58 AM 7-14-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Radio code is NOT activated by default. The owner has to decide whether he wants security code turned on and activate it


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI, please enlighten us how to do that


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]UKAUSSI, please enlighten us how to do that








[HR][/HR]​There are some instruction in the audio manual but I cannot confirm them as I can't find my radio code card. I have never used it even though I have had my HU out 4 or 5 times....sorry


----------



## euro_vw (Jun 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Euro_wv,
If they replaced his HU he should have gotten a new code. However just by pulling the battery or the fuse or the Radio will not confirm the new code. The new Double-DIN actually "knows" which car it's hooked into and unless you try to "mate" it to a new vehicle it will not ask for the code ever again, it will recognize it's home car and just turn on as nothing has ever happened. It's fun to catch you talking about something you know so little about, as always.....
[Modified by GTakacs, 10:58 AM 7-14-2002][HR][/HR]​I've got 2 stock HUs, one is the one that came with the car, when you unplug it and plug it back the car recognizes it. However, when I put another one it asked for a code. Plugging back my first hu didn't required it again, the car remembers it. So, if they switched the HU, every time he/she disconnects it from the car, it needs a code, unless it's possible to reprogram the ECU to recognize the new hu.


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (euro_vw)*

Euro_vw you do not own a 2002 Double DIN as we've already concluded that from a previous post of yours......
UKAUSSI,
Page 19 in the 3.4 Sound System, Premium CD / Monsoon manual
quote:[HR][/HR]
When the unit is turned off and the ignition key is removed from the ignition switch, the lfashing LED (9), indicates that the radio is equipped with an anti-theft coding system. See the radio card for the code.
*Convenience radio coding*
For technical reasons, the convenience coding is not available for all vehicle models.
In the past one had to recode the radio manually every time the unit was removed or when the vehicle battery has been disengaged.
That has all changed with the new convenience radio coding function: Once the code number has been input in the radio, it will then synchonise itself with "its" vehicle!
If the current supply has been interrupted the radio will automatically check to see if it is still in "its" vehicle after the ignition has been switched on. It if is happy, the radio will be ready for use after just a few seconds.
It is therefore no longer neccessary to disengage the electronic lock manually!
If the radio has been fitted to another vehicle, however, the electronic lock will have to be disengaged manually.
[HR][/HR]​So again, this is all automatic, not needed to be enabled and cannot be disabled by the end-user! And again, it's the radio that remembers "its" vehicle, not the vehicle remembers its radio. So again, euro_vw and UKAUSSIE, you both were wrong.
They have replaced my radio at the dealership and the new radio's code only had to be entered the first time it was put in my car(I have removed it since on numerous occasions). It came out of another car on the lot. And they had to enter the code into my old radio when they put that one into the other car. I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT, contrary to others who just prefer to run their lips......


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Sorry for any confusion but the coding was what I was led to believe. It would indeed seem to be automatic as GTakacs says
*GTakacs*
- you need to review your posts before you post them to ensure you don't aim unecessary comments at people directly just because you happen to be correct on something. I don't name people I just post my opinion and fix problems.


----------



## euro_vw (Jun 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Euro_vw you do not own a 2002 Double DIN as we've already concluded that from a previous post of yours......
UKAUSSI,
Page 19 in the 3.4 Sound System, Premium CD / Monsoon manual

When the unit is turned off and the ignition key is removed from the ignition switch, the lfashing LED (9), indicates that the radio is equipped with an anti-theft coding system. See the radio card for the code.
*Convenience radio coding*
For technical reasons, the convenience coding is not available for all vehicle models.
In the past one had to recode the radio manually every time the unit was removed or when the vehicle battery has been disengaged.
That has all changed with the new convenience radio coding function: Once the code number has been input in the radio, it will then synchonise itself with "its" vehicle!
If the current supply has been interrupted the radio will automatically check to see if it is still in "its" vehicle after the ignition has been switched on. It if is happy, the radio will be ready for use after just a few seconds.
It is therefore no longer neccessary to disengage the electronic lock manually!
If the radio has been fitted to another vehicle, however, the electronic lock will have to be disengaged manually.

So again, this is all automatic, not needed to be enabled and cannot be disabled by the end-user! And again, it's the radio that remembers "its" vehicle, not the vehicle remembers its radio. So again, euro_vw and UKAUSSIE, you both were wrong.
They have replaced my radio at the dealership and the new radio's code only had to be entered the first time it was put in my car(I have removed it since on numerous occasions). It came out of another car on the lot. And they had to enter the code into my old radio when they put that one into the other car. I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT, contrary to others who just prefer to run their lips......







[HR][/HR]​Have you tried to do it yourself? 
I switched those 2 hu back and forth, and the only hu which didn't require the code was my "original" hu. 
also from the description you provided:
"If the radio has been fitted to another vehicle, however, the electronic lock will have to be disengaged manually.
" <- and it means that if you put a HU from another car (or a new one) everytime you disconnect the power supplyyou have to input the radio code,' cause it'll display "SAFE".
I am telling this 'cause I HAVE DONE switching HUs PHYSICALLY, not THEORETICALLY. 
And for this:
"Euro_vw you do not own a 2002 Double DIN as we've already concluded that from a previous post of yours......"
The coding procedure is the same for SD or DD units. Check "the facts" before posting.


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSIE, I agree with you about me aiming unneccessary comments at some from time to time (I wasn't really aiming at you, sorry if I hit you too)...... I've been hurt by it at times, but since then I just carry a flame retardant coverall in my trunk for days like that







It's just hard to swallow when people question you without facts to back it up, that's all......


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (euro_vw)*

OK, this is getting into a flame war so here is my final take on this one....
Euro_vw, I wish you had read my post thoroughly..... In that case you would have realized that I DID have my HU replaced from another car and on the new HU the code had to be entered only the first time it was powered on, then it "mated" itself to my car (stored my instrument panel's ID in the radio) and it hasn't asked for the code since.
Also the radio that was pulled from my car and installed in another Jetta had to go through the same procedure.
So I wasn't theoretical, It was ACTUAL FACT.
quote:[HR][/HR]"Euro_vw you do not own a 2002 Double DIN as we've already concluded that from a previous post of yours......"
The coding procedure is the same for SD or DD units. Check "the facts" before posting[HR][/HR]​I don't know, but my manual is for the Premium VI/Monsoon system so I am not sure that the coding is the same for SD or DD. And I forgot which of the two HU you've allegedly own are VW Premium VI units......







I'd love to see your quote from the manual of your HU(s). I still thought that here we were talking about the Double DIN Premium VI HU, and not about the one or two that you own it whatever VW you have (sure not a 2k2 with Double DIN Monson)











[Modified by GTakacs, 12:31 AM 7-15-2002]


----------



## euro_vw (Jun 5, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Here is a quote from my manual for single DIN HUs:
""
Convinience radio coding
For technical reasons, the convinience radio coding is not available for all vehicle models.
In the past one had to recode the radio manually every time the unit was removed or when the vehicle battery had been disengaged.
That has all changed with the new convinience radio coding function: Once the code number has been input in the radio, it will then synchronise itself with "its" vehicle!
If the current supply has been interrupted the radio will automatically check to see if it is still in "its" vehicle after the ignition has been switched on. If it is happy, the radio will be ready for use after just a few seconds.
It is therefore no longer necessary to disengage the electronic lock manually!
If the radio has been fitted to another vehicle, however, the electronic lock will have to be disengaged manually.""
So as you see there is no difference. Also, I beleive that there is only one HU in a car that will require no code entering, it's "original" HU, that came from factory. There is maybe a way to reprogram ECU or HU at a dealer, but I know for sure its not possible in home environment (based on my experiments with 2 HUs).
"Euro_vw, I wish you had read my post thoroughly..... In that case you would have realized that I DID have my HU replaced from another car and on the new HU the code had to be entered only the first time it was powered on, then it "mated" itself to my car (stored my instrument panel's ID in the radio) and it hasn't asked for the code since.
Also the radio that was pulled from my car and installed in another Jetta had to go through the same procedure.
"
I think we have a little confusion here.
Yes the radio code need to be entered once, then it powers on as usual, without code entering. But, if you disconnect the HU, or the battery, then you have to enter the code again. However with "original" HU, you don't need to do it, 'cause the car will recognize its "original" HU.


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (euro_vw)*

Guys!---At this point, I don't care who's right or wrong, but I wish you would drop "the attitude"!








I would hate for this to get to the point that the thread gets locked, since we are still dealing with this issue!


[Modified by MaryP, 5:34 PM 7-15-2002]


----------



## mclii (Dec 19, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (dmbrown)*

quote:[HR][/HR]... Another thing I noticed when I originally got the car is that I can't access the "turn-on volume level" function that the Monsoon manual describes...[HR][/HR]​There's actually a Technical Service Bulletin about this, here it is...
*Subject: Premium VI Radio, Turn-On Volume Feature Removed
Model(s): All with Premium VI Radio 2002
Group: 91
Number: 01-05
Date: Nov. 7, 2001*
*Condition*
Radio maximum Turn-On Volume setting is inoperative.
In prior model years the radio allowed the Turn-On Volume setting to be customized. When the unit was turned on, the volume was the same as it was when the unit was turned off (original factory setting).
The Turn-On Volume feature listed on page 5 of the Owner's Manual has been removed.
*Service*
NO action required. Condition is normal.
The Owner's Manual shows this feature as a customer adjustable feature. This has been changed and all new radio user manuals will have the correction.
With Premium VI radios, when entering the selectable features program as described on page 5 of the Owner's Manual (holding the DOLBY button down), the Speed Volume Control (SVC) setting will be displayed.


[Modified by mclii, 8:03 AM 7-15-2002]


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (euro_vw)*

euro_vw,
There was no misunderstanding. I was stating that my NEW radio (the one that was pulled from another Jetta at the dealer when I complaind about bad sound) has been in and out of my car ( HAS BEEN DISCONNECTED FROM THE HARNESS), never asked for the code from me. I KNOW it is a different HU (not my old one), as I was standing right next to the guy as he was doing the swap, and he also gave me the new code sticker for the radio.
So again, on ANY double DIN Premium VI (which the guy above has) you only have to enter the code ONCE, it then "mates" it to the car. The radio stores the ID of the instrument panel, the car does not care what radio you have hooked into it, that would be pretty lame.


----------



## Tripp (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Wow...I just stumbled onto this thread. I, too, noticed something was "off" about the Monsoon sound system during the test drive for my GLI (~3 weeks ago), but I was too busy driving the car to deal with it at the time. I figured someone had screwed with the settings. At any rate, I am picking my GLI up Weds. I will be sure to "test drive" the Monsoon system & will also pull the head unit to see if the wiring problem was corrected in-port (not holding my breath, tho







). I will let everyone know.


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

hi maryp! i was just thinking about you...i agree with you about the 'tude! weird to pop back in this thread and see folks going at it. heck, part of what euro_vw said was true i.e., if they gave the guy a new hu, then he should have gotten a new radio code as well - regardless of whether it ever needs to be entered again. when i got a new hu put in my gf's golf, they wrote my new code on a piece of paper. tell you what, i don't give a rat's ass if i ever have to enter it again, I STILL WANT THE DAMN CODE!!!!
and really, if anyone ought to get called out on this thread, it ought to be e_andree. remember how he showed up on this thread and started the rumor about there being a new tsb? i noticed that while he still posts all over the place, he never came back here to address that issue.
so did you ever make any progress one way or another with your radio?
i never did get very far with mine. i did talk to a lawyer who told me my best bet was to go after vw on the incorrect tsb and hopefully force them to reopen the case and at least issue a corrected tsb. he said that maybe if they reopen it and look back into it, they'll find the other problem(s) and might go ahead and address them. he told me that if they didn't fix the tsb, that could go in my favor - something about vw having to offer a fix for a known problem. he also said that even if they did fix the tsb, it could still go in my favor since that would demonstrate some amount of incompetence on their part. funny thing is, i'm now getting ready to pursue a lemon-law claim as my gf's golf has now spent a total of 35 days in the shop - and we only took delivery end of january! hmm, did i really just say that that was a funny thing???


----------



## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

WHAT, I thought that VW had issued a CORRECTED TSB !!!!
OK, this is where our friends at VWVortex need to step in and send VW an email or make a call to get this ball rolling on the corrected TSB.


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

Sorry to hear of your car woes, amgvw! I bet the radio is the least of your concerns right now, huh? My radio is doing fine since the fix. I don't think it is worth the money I paid, but the sound is adequate. 
I've only had the "dead radio" syndrome once. Next time it happens, I am going straight to the dealer and demand a new HU. The hardest part will be going musicless until they can fit me in their schedule.
I hope that the petition that GTakacs sent will get somewhere, but with VWoA's history, I doubt it. Maybe the BBB arbitration will have better luck. I still can't believe that they won't, at the very least, correct the TSB. It is such a simple task. I can't believe how easy it was for us to get the TSB issued, why is it so hard to get it fixed?








Anyway, have a great day!


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Nope, no correction was ever issued. I've tried all I can to get them to look at it again and they sweep it under the rug. If you can get Vortex to help out, that would be great, but so far I don't think they've helped us address this.


----------



## CO Boy (Sep 24, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

I havent been in thread for a while. To answer some questions, I did not get a new radio code due to the fact that they forgot to give it to me. I will be going back sometime soon to get the "new" code. After I have the code I will disconnect the battery to check it out. 
After listening to different cds the radio sounds better, but not that great. There is an improvement over the original radio, but for a premium system its week. 1 step forward and 2 back as usual.


----------



## Tripp (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CO Boy)*

*2002 UPDATE*
Well, _someone_ has fixed this problem. I picked up my 02 GLI w/DDIN Monsoon today (build date: 05/02) and everything works perfectly. All of the wires are in the correct hole. So somewhere along the line, somebody realized the boo-boo. I don't know if it was on the assembly line, in port, or at the dealership...but it's fixed.
BTW, the Monsoon system sounds great. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif The only downside is that I was going to use this as an excuse to hardwire in XM Radio. Oh well.


----------



## TheCheeta (Jul 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Tripp)*

Wow I'm confused! Just to start, my '02 GLS 2.0 with Monsoon was manufactured in 03/02.
That said - has it been established when they started fixing this at the factory?
Even WITH the wire swap, are there still sound issues?
I jsut went to http://www.vw.ddsltd.com and searched for this TSB, and found V910204 (different than the other numbers I have seen floating around here), published 03/28/2002. Is this the right TSB, or is this one incorrect as well?






















This shouldn't be such a mess. Not sure if I am going to do the fix myself or let the dealer do it when I take my car in next week for a few delivery issues and a whistling engine (I just pretend it is the turbo!!)


----------



## DELISI (May 2, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

quote:[HR][/HR] funny thing is, i'm now getting ready to pursue a lemon-law claim as my gf's golf has now spent a total of 35 days in the shop - and we only took delivery end of january! hmm, did i really just say that that was a funny thing???







[HR][/HR]​I had toyota buyback my 01 celica--it is not an easy proposition unless you get ahold of the right cuctomer service managers!!!!GOOD LUCK!!!!!
(72 days in shop in 1 year!!!)
side note- since the dealer fixed my monsoon it has been sweet!!


----------



## Tripp (Mar 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TheCheeta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]That said - has it been established when they started fixing this at the factory?[HR][/HR]​Like I said, I have no earthly idea where it was fixed, but it came fixed. It confused the bejeezus out of me, as I thought they were still coming "out of phase."


----------



## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TheCheeta)*

I'm not convinced that they have started fixing them at the factory until we get several more CONFIRMED correctly wired HU's.
Several people that have done the wire switch are still having problems with fading and the FM, I believe. 
If you fade back and forth from right to left, you will notice markedly less bass on the driver side. If you don't, your system may be OK.
Can you make a copy of the TSB that you saw and post it here? Your link does not get us to the page. We have not seen a corrected TSB if there is one. I would not take the old one to the dealer and expect them to fix it. 9 times out of 10 they say that it is fine, when it's not. The INCORRECT TSB is 91-02-02


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## CO Boy (Sep 24, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

"If you fade back and forth from right to left, you will notice markedly less bass on the driver side. If you don't, your system may be OK."
I have that issue, I was playing with the balance and the fader yesterday and it is not right.








I'm thinking about replacing the head unit anyway since I want MP3 capabilities. Maybe even do a steath sub in the spare tire area. That should round out the system, after replacing and upgrading most of it...


----------



## TheCheeta (Jul 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Can you make a copy of the TSB that you saw and post it here? Your link does not get us to the page. [HR][/HR]​Okay... they code their pages there such that I cannot give you a direct. link. Here's what you do... go to http://www.vw.ddsltd.com/cgi-bin/default.pgm?ACTION=START&USERTYPE=C&COMPANY=VW
Under *-Model-* pick Jetta, under *-Year-* pick 2002, under *-Language-* pick English, and under *-Literature Type-* pick Technical Bulletins . Then click search. The very first one, #V910204 appears to superceed the old one. You have to buy it to view it. Any VW techs out there who can get their hands on this?
Hey... how come there aren't any VW techs on this forum? Do they not own & love VDubs?


----------



## TheCheeta (Jul 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TheCheeta)*

After reading more of the threads (it has taken two days to get to page 20 at my work computer!!!) it seems I have similar, but not exactly the same, issues.
I am very unhappy with the way my Monsoon sounds with FM. It has been a few days since playing a CD, but I recall being ok with that. With FM, though, I have my EQ set so that bass is at 50%, mid is at 0%, and treble at 100%... and yet I still do not get clear highs (as opposed to some other folks whose highs are too shrill), and the mid still seems a bit high, even though i have them set at 100% and 0%, respectively. Kinda muddy.
I did a total fader/balance/bass/treble test in my car, and everything seems to jive ok. No cut-outs, no immediate fades or balances.
I have not taken the radio out just yet. I will soon (maybe even during lunch).
(Edit: I realize that FM will always sounds worse than CD... however, sitting in my GF's '97 Camry, FM sounds great compared to my Jetta)


[Modified by TheCheeta, 1:02 PM 7-19-2002]


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TheCheeta)*

yep, this is the ORIGINAL *INCORRECT* Bulletin and it is 91-02-02 compared to 91-02-04 on the website. Same date though


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CO Boy)*

CO Boy, If I were you, I would pull the HU and check the wiring yourself. It is very easy following UKAUSSI's instructions (link found in his signature). I've done it myself twice now and it was a cinch. BTW, many 2002 owners were told by there dealer that either the switch was done (and it wasn't); or that they looked at the wiring, (and they didn't)! The only way to know for sure is to check it out yourself. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Mindflux (Oct 10, 2000)

I cannot for the life of me get the radio out to check the wiring. I cut up a cd (too thick), I cut up a credit card but couldn't unlatch the mechanism. I tried swiss army knives and nail files and what have you.







((((((
I cannot get the radio out.


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## rudyr (Nov 29, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Mindflux)*

Mindflux, I'll get it out for you.


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## DELISI (May 2, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rudyr)*

If you really want a true FIX for your $325.00 monsoon either take in and SHOW the tech the problem.......OR by a dv...youll forget about the radio and listen to boost all day


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## DBull (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (silver bull1.8t)*

ok my 02 D-Din monsoon sounds like crap. just got my 337. So i pull the radio out and the wires seem to be in the correct place. Now what???


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## Mindflux (Oct 10, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DBull)*

quote:[HR][/HR]ok my 02 D-Din monsoon sounds like crap. just got my 337. So i pull the radio out and the wires seem to be in the correct place. Now what???







[HR][/HR]​Now put in a new HU or get used to the sound


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## dnwhiteh (Jan 5, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Mindflux)*

I just took out the monsoon HU in my 2002 GTI [build date 05/02] and the wires were correct.
Don't know where the fix happened [brazil, houston, or dealer] but someone fixed it.
Probably gonna get an aftermarket HU anyway.
-_-


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## Mindflux (Oct 10, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (dnwhiteh)*

I just got my aftermarket HU, I havn't checked my wiring yet, let alone know how to go putting the new unit in. All the local installers are like "UHG, MONSOON FORGET IT!"








quote:[HR][/HR]I just took out the monsoon HU in my 2002 GTI [build date 05/02] and the wires were correct.
Don't know where the fix happened [brazil, houston, or dealer] but someone fixed it.
Probably gonna get an aftermarket HU anyway.
-_-[HR][/HR]​


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Mindflux)*

Bump.


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## OneSkinnyKId (Jul 2, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Bump.[HR][/HR]​dito


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## ashleync (May 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (OneSkinnyKId)*

My car didn't come with monsoon, and I don't feel like it should have, from reading this topic. I replaced the wimpy standard one with the Pioneer DHP-4400Fxm.
It kicks. 
Speakers are next....


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## digktialx (Jul 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I fixed mine and my car was built like 4/02 and it was miswired. I'm an audiophile so i noticed there was too much vibration. Its fixed now its actually a "decent" stereo but im tearing it all out and replacing it as soon as i figure out the wiring diagram what a freaking mess.
And I wanted the stock stereo but NOOOO if i wanted a sunroof i was stuck with the monsoon. BAH! Of course I knew there was no adapter so its splicing time for me #@%[email protected] thanks VW.
At least i can sell the whole setup on ebay.


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## nbcosta (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

GTakacs: can you give me any hints on how you managed to get decent sound out of the aftermarket AM reception, so I can enlighten my audio-shop guys? As you can see, I haven't been spending much time in this forum lately because, apart from the AM reception, I'm satisfied with my audio.
In answer to your question: no I haven't filed a complaint with the BBB because I figured that the first thing they'd ask me would be "What steps did you take to have the dealer resolve the problem?" And the answer is...none. Because after reading through this forum it was pretty clear to me that going to the dealer was just going to waste a MINIMUM of 3 hours of my time, not to mention time without the car, with no likelihood of an actual fix. So after thinking about it for a couple of weeks, I just decided to go straight for the quick/expensive solution of putting in an aftermarket HU.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nbcosta)*

nbcosta,
I have made a modified antenna adapter that will provide +12V to the center pin of the antenna cable so the amplifier will turn on and give you beter FM and AM reception. I am selling the modified adapters for $30 or you can get yours retrofited for $20. Both include shipping.
Filing a complaint with the BBB does not help as it is not a "manufacturing defect in material or workmanship" but a "design defect". BBB will not arbitrate design defects so I am going to court over it.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Gtakacs,
What is the quality of the AM/FM reception on your modified adaptor? You are selling them, so of course it's hard not to be biased....but maybe you could compare it to the reception you had previously with the monsoon.
Thanks in advance


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

rocketweb,
before the amp fix there was no AM at all and FM stations that were marginal would not come in perfect either. With the mod AM and FM are both great. all my cutomers have been happy so far, so I guess I must be doing something right.
Right now I am all out of adapters, just sold the last one today. I will have some more by Monday.....


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## Vaire (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

I bought an amplified antenna adapter from GTakacs recently and it works great. There is no noticable difference in reception between my aftermarket + adapter versus the stock head unit. Great work!


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## cad_man (May 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

To all.
I sent away and received T.B. Group 91 Number 02-04 Date March 29,2002
This Supersedes T.B. Group 91 No. 02-02 Dated March 28, 2002 due to a wiring diagram corection. This T.B. now has the correct Information and states the following:
Terminal 3 color should be Yellow.
Terminal 7 color should be Black.
cad_man


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (cad_man)*

Can you post it please so those who have still to take it in can now show the dealer the REAL tsb


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Confused....this latest TSB puts the wires back to where they originally were, no?


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DanoP)*

NO, it is putting them the way they SHOULD be
quote:[HR][/HR]I sent away and received T.B. Group 91 Number 02-04 Date March 29,2002
This Supersedes T.B. Group 91 No. 02-02 Dated March 28, 2002 due to a wiring diagram corection. This T.B. now has the correct Information and states the following:
Terminal 3 color should be Yellow.
Terminal 7 color should be Black.[HR][/HR]​


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## cad_man (May 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I tried from 10:30 PM till 1:30AM (I get up at 5:30am) to get my scanner to work. I will get it to work one way or the other tonight, and scan the TSB in. I will need to mail it to someone who can host it, maybe UKAUSSI. If some one can host it e-mail or IM me with the info, and I will get the JPG to them.
[email protected]
cad_man http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


[Modified by cad_man, 7:45 AM 8-8-2002]


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (cad_man)*

send it to [email protected] and I'll post it.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

I just got off the phone with the service department after giving them the info for the TSB.
He said that terminal 3 yellow, terminal 7 black is what the TSB says. and that they only have 1 date on the TSB or something like that.
I remember when I was getting the fix done, that the serviceguy was telling me that the single row of black, and multi colored row was wrong, but they changed it anyway cuz I said to. 
I am going back into the dealer to have the wire positions re-looked at, and to restart my 'dissatisfaction' with the radio, after 2-3 months of no response from the VW/mazda suit and tie guy.
and I think im gonna bring a bass heavy CD in to show what it sounds like


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## palpatine (Aug 9, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

I purchased a 2002 GTI last week and yes the premium Monsoon radio really sucks, including no bass on drivers side. After reading other peoples experience I decided today to yank out the Monsoon HU and replace it with an Alpine cd player c/o of Al and Ed’s in LA (I didn't even attempt to go to a VW dealership and complain - I know better from previous (Acura) dealership experiences). I did not replace the 8 speakers or the amplifier. Now, I can even use the cup holders since they no longer block access to the cd player!
The Alpine radio/cd sounds miles better than the Monsoon except for two things; I still have little or no bass on the drivers side and that the Alpine will not shut-off with the ignition off. The Alpine has to be switched on and off per use otherwise flat battery. Al and Ed’s said they can't do anything about it since it's just the way VW has the ignition setup. Frankly, I don't buy their excuse - can anybody help with how to solve this problem?


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (palpatine)*

quote:[HR][/HR]The Alpine radio/cd sounds miles better than the Monsoon except for two things; I still have little or no bass on the drivers side [HR][/HR]​In regards to the driver side bass problem, have you checked to see if the wiring is correct? Sounds to me like you need to swap those infamous wires per UKAUSSI's instructions...


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## palpatine (Aug 9, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

No. I aasumed the wiring problem was limited to conections to the Monsoon unit and that it would not be a problem with the installation of a new cd player. Wrong assumption?


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## eparusel (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (palpatine)*

Nope, it's a problem at the wiring harness... Check it out, you should see a row of black wires, and a row of coloured wires. I popped out the 2 incorrectly placed wires&pins and swapped them to complete the fix without any cutting of wires...
A few posts up there's a good picture of the problem and the fix! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I've still got the DD monsoon (blech.), but now it's only 1/2 as bad as it was before....!


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (eparusel)*

Here is the updated TSB for everyone's viewing pleasure:


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## cad_man (May 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Thanks GTakacs for posting the copy of the TSB I set you. I'm taking donations to pay the $4.00 it cost me to get the TSB from VW!!























cad_man


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (cad_man)*

Thanks for getting the TSB. I have done the fix, but that was after the dealer refused to do it for me. I went in April, well after the corrected TSB came out. I am going to copy it and send it to him and tell him where he can stick it! (Not really, I promise to be polite).
It would have been more ideal if VW had posted a picture with the CORRECT wiring as well to make sure some of the more "scientifically challenged" technicians didn't misunderstand the picture.


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## hognozzle (Jun 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

THANK YOU SOOOOOOOOOOOOO MUCH to all the parties involved in getting the new TSB up here.

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
-hognozzle


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## chris_gli (Jul 8, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Thanks for posting the updated TSB. I just pulled the double-din HU out of my GLI, and the wiring appears correct. But the sound still ain't what it should be given the Monsoon hype, and the 200 watt amp sitting in the trunk.


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## oto (Apr 18, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (chris_gli)*

I got my friend to listen to it, and he was listening to some CD's as well as the radio. He says the speakers are pretty good, the sounds alright, but somethings not right about it, the base isn't there. Adding bass with the tuner barely gives much added base to things that have alot of bass. Considering theres a 200W amp in the trunk, he wondered where the amp is spose to be outputing its power...is the power output to the rear speakers only, or split between front and rear?
Is the rear spose to be so low in volume vs the front? This system seems as is, to pump 2x to 3x the volume with all controls at the neutral 12oclock position to the front speakers, and this just isn't right to me. Is there a way to program the volume differences to be more equalized?


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (oto)*

The Monsoon literature states that the drivers in back are subwoofers so it would make sense that you wouldn't have much volume coming from the rear.
The amp is driving all eight speakers....with just 200W I have trouble believing it is up to the task of powering all eight adequately, especially the power hungry 2 ohm subs in back. Your garden variety HU is pushing 50W/channel which is far more than the Monsoon amp. It seems to perform well in the lower midrange, but below 80Hz to 90Hz, the system is gutless.


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## glidertowpilot (Aug 12, 2002)

*Was:02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome ...Missing some speakers?Amp?*

I just bought a 2002 Jetta TDI wagon with the double din unit. After reading the posts, I decided to make the tools from a CD and pull the head. The wires were wrong. I switched them around, and now it does sound better. It does have the "10 o-clock fader cutout" issue. What a piece of crap. 
The window sticker says "Priemum AM/FM casaette sound system with 8 speakers" 
Then under packages/options it says "Monsoon (R) sounds system"
Where are the 8 speakers? 
I count 2 in each door (woofer/tweeter) Am I missing the other 4?
Where is the amp? 
There is nothing but air in the rear compartments where the first aid kit and the triangle flare and the disk changer that aren't included go.
Why can I set the speed sensitive function, but not the turn-on volume level function?
WHat should I replace it with? Looks like a 2 meter radio will fit nicely in the extra spot.
Dan M
2002 TDI Jetta Wagon


----------



## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: Was:02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome ...Missing some speakers?Amp? (glidertowpilot)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I just bought a 2002 Jetta TDI wagon with the double din unit. After reading the posts, I decided to make the tools from a CD and pull the head. The wires were wrong. I switched them around, and now it does sound better. It does have the "10 o-clock fader cutout" issue. What a piece of crap.[HR][/HR]​welcome to the wonderful world of the new premium 6 double-din head unit.
quote:[HR][/HR]The window sticker says "Priemum AM/FM casaette sound system with 8 speakers" Then under packages/options it says "Monsoon (R) sounds system" Where are the 8 speakers? I count 2 in each door (woofer/tweeter) Am I missing the other 4?[HR][/HR]​2 speakers per door x 4 doors = 8 speakers. be advised, the non-monsoon comes with the same speaker layout, but different actual speakers i.e., you get 8 no matter how you slice it.
quote:[HR][/HR]Where is the amp? There is nothing but air in the rear compartments where the first aid kit and the triangle flare and the disk changer that aren't included go.[/qoute]
does the head unit display read, "monsoon" when you turn it on? if it doesn't, then your head unit is not coded properly. if you don't have an amp, than you don't have the full monsoon system REGARDLESS of the head unit coding.


> Why can I set the speed sensitive function, but not the turn-on volume level function?[HR][/HR]





> that feature was discontinued in the new premium 6 double-din head unit (welcome to the wonderful world of...).


----------



## glidertowpilot (Aug 12, 2002)

*Re: Was:02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome ...Missing some speakers?Amp? (amgvw)*

>does the head unit display read, "monsoon" when you turn it on? if it doesn't, >then your head unit is not coded properly. if you don't have an amp, than you >do't have the full monsoon system REGARDLESS of the head unit coding.
Yes, it says Monsoon when you turn it on. The window sticker says Monsoon (R) system. Should there be an amp? Did I get shorted? I sure can't find one.
Dan


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: Was:02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome ...Missing some speakers?Amp? (glidertowpilot)*

The monsoon amp on the wagon is in the back compartment on the drivers side, up behind the foam where the changer would go. You can feel it if you stick your arm in there, and you can kinda get a glimpse of it....but I don't know how to get to it, if you really wanted to. If you figure out how, let me know.


----------



## glidertowpilot (Aug 12, 2002)

*Found the amp*

Couldn't stick my arm in there, but I could see it through a window in the foam. 
A quick look tells me you must remove the side panel and the foam to get to the amp. Im not going there.
Thanx
Dan
2002 Jetta TDI Wagon 986 miles
Monsoon fixed (still crap)


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## foodart (Apr 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

I have a 02 Passat double DIN, no Monsoon, and the FM sounds worst than my $5 clock radio: dull and practically in mono. Oddly enough, the CD sounds fine.


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## lotzahp (Aug 9, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foodart)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I have a 02 Passat double DIN, no Monsoon, and the FM sounds worst than my $5 clock radio: dull and practically in mono. Oddly enough, the CD sounds fine.[HR][/HR]​I observed the same thing in my 02 Passat WITH Monsoon. I tried the balance/fader test and the sound is fine in all corners with CD. I'm led to believe the tuner just sucks, and everything else is fine in my car.










[Modified by lotzahp, 6:41 PM 8-14-2002]


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (lotzahp)*

Yeah, it is clear that the Premium VI hu is POS. No question about it! After putting in a new HU to wifey's Jetta everything sounds fine to my ears.


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## jdgoocher (Jul 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Hi all,
FYI, after a few of discussions between my dealer and VW I was told to bring my car in. Took it in this AM and they switched the wires. Sound quality is a vast improvement! Whew!
Funny though, I also received a call from VW Customer Service wondering when I was taking my car in for the switch. They said they would be contacting my dealer that day and then following up with me. Looks like they are definitely monitoring the situation.
My dealer said I was the first to come to them with this problem. Their opinion was that only certain dealers may have received models with this problem. Kind of made sense since they had to get the car from a different dealer to sell it to me.
JG


----------



## vdubsmitty (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

I did the swap on the wires from the head unit and it does sound better; but I need more bass! Its really pathetic that my wife's non-monsoon sounds 10X better than mine







! Has anyone hooked up a Subwoofer with an additional amp using the double din monsoon yet? If someone could point me in the right direction it would be greatly appreciated!


[Modified by vdubsmitty, 8:03 PM 8-14-2002]


----------



## foodart (Apr 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (lotzahp)*

Quote:
"I observed the same thing in my 02 Passat WITH Monsoon. I tried the balance/fader test and the sound is fine in all corners with CD. I'm led to believe the tuner just sucks, and everything else is fine in my car. "

I tried the balance/fader test, and it seems to be okay. I wonder if my non-Monsoon radio has the same wiring problem that the Monsoons apparently have.


[Modified by foodart, 8:11 PM 8-14-2002]


----------



## 1.8TurboGrin (May 14, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jdgoocher)*

The dealer just gave you a complete line of BS. According to my local dealer, when I had complained they said I was the first to have done that, yet when I finally ended up with the service manager, he stated he had the very same car and he "checked" the wiring himself because he too felt the Monsoon was a POS. Believe me, they know the problem exists! After arguing with the service rep because they said they found nothing wrong, I went out to get my car and the actual person that worked on my car left the removal keys on my seat for me to use to correct the problem myself. At the following trip to the dealer for an oil change, I asked to speak to the technician and thanked her for what she did. She said she had her hands tied becuse of the sh**y instructions on the TSB, which was confusiing her boss! She knew my fustration well and helped me the best she could. I made the swap myself in 10 minutes and the improvement is tremendous, but still bothers me everytime I listen to it...like a constant reminder how it was one of those options that I wish I could have deleted out of the luxury sport package that i wanted so bad. VW service is the worst, but I love the car!


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## Oblong Desoto (Feb 16, 1999)

I hope that these problems are resolved in the 2003 models. If they improve the HU, I'll wait until the dealers can order the new version and have them swap it out. I seem to recall someone a few pages back saying that they had it swapped, and the fader and sound quality issues went away. All I know is that my wife's 99.5 Golf with the standard stereo sound a hell of a lot better than this!








Otherwise, its aftermarket time... or I'll put up with it until the Mk5's come out.








OD


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (palpatine)*

i am not sure if this will work, but when i had a jeep i found the turn on wire out of the back of the head unit and ran it directly to the fuse box. i went to radio shack and bought a little clip that allows you to fasten the wire to the clip and then slip the clip around the fuse and shove it in. you need to pick a fuse that would turn on and off with the car. i think there are enough of options when you open up the box.... wipers, horn (maybe).... stuff like that. i think i did parking lamps or something in the old jeep. good luck...


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (chris_gli)*

chris, me too. new gli with the "correct" wiring.... did anyone find solutions to the monsoon that is supposedly wired right?


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nathanskal)*

Yeah, get an aftermarket HU







. VW won't even acknowledge the problem let alone repair it........


----------



## Engineer Guy (Aug 15, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

In the hopes of helping out a bit here, let me post some observations framed within the world of Electronics Manufacturing; where I've spent much of my working life.
The description of "weak bass" and "poor imaging" details exactly an out-of-phase audio signal. This is why simply swapping the yellow and black wires makes the system sound so much better. A test for the bored or curious: on a simple 2 speaker stereo system at home, swap the "+" and "-" wires to just one speaker, and hear the same Monsoon-type weirdness as the bass speakers move in opposite phase directions and cancel each other out, etc., lowering volume. The 1st rule of Sound Engineering: everything's got to be wired in phase!
Not to minimize for a moment the considerable grief this problem has caused folks, 2 wires were swapped in a harness made for VW. Guano occurs, as I like to say, and VW should have caught it pre-Production. A major QC muck up on their part. Faulty Engineering Documentation might even have called for it to be wired that way. The very strong push throughout Manufacturing is to have a select small group of "qualified" Vendors supply parts, like wiring harnesses, and QC these harnesses themselves before they even ship "just in time" to the VW Manufacturing/Assembly floor. This means that there is no independent person or group to catch harness errors like this one. This "self-certification" movement has been going on for years, but does lead to events like mis-wired harnesses making it out the door. Some Tester going through standard HU test steps in the noisy environment of the Manufacturing floor [if that's even done] won't catch "weak bass" problems, obviously. There might even be VAG Tool exercising of the HU via the CAN bus in which there is little human interaction. 
What jumps off the page that UKAUSSI helpfully posted is that all the colored wires should be on the left; all the black wires should be on the right. That is simply good design logic and settled quickly to me the murkiness surrounding "what should be" in a correctly-wired harness. Too bad that the first poorly-worded TSB made such a simple error even worse. The wire harness is very possibly made in the former East Bloc [Hungary] or India for German VWs, or in China or Mexico for US VWs [wherever cost is lowest for that harness assembly]. Designers try to keep the task of colored wire insertion simple: put all the colors on just one side; black on the other. This is also the type of wire color logic spelled out in VDA specs; a Commercial Group in Germany that defines the different functions in a VDA-compliant connector [the tan and black connector styles]. All positive speaker channels are on one side of the connector; all the negative or signal return wires are on the other. 
Just about all audio ICs for OEM vehicle applications now use "push-pull" outputs. That is, there is not speaker voltage all in one positive "+" lead to vehicle ground "-", the two outputs develop voltage relative to each other. However, those 2 leads still must be in phase, relative to any other speaker channels, and they weren't in the wiring harnesses that were assembled defectively. Nothing blows up, because nothing was shorted dead to ground, but the system simply sounds wussy as one set of speakers oppose the air movement direction of all the others, and the sound stage warps. Also, push-pull, balanced outputs reject Alternator and other noise electrical noise better. RCA line inputs/outputs are still a positive signal [center pin] to vehicle ground [outer RCA connector shell] with isolation or noise rolloff at the input stage of most good Aftermarket amps. 
Regarding the maximum output of the Monsoon amp and marginal bass, the Audio Amp ICs typically being used have a maximum power wattage output spec at the perfect 14.4 Volts of a perfect Alternator output, and this maximum IC audio output spec is given for a "high" level of distortion, like 2% or 5%. Add up this theoretical ideal of audio outputs from all the Monsoon channels and you have the maximum rated output as stated in literature from a Marketing group. Real World conditions, like a lower supply voltage than 14.4 Volts actually making back to the amp, or folks not turning the amp up to a 5% level of distortion means - no surprise here to anyone - that the Real World Monsoon wattage output is less than specified, and sounds like less. 
For the real Detectives out there who want a firm answer on wattage, you can find the Monsoon amp IC Manufacturer's logo here and then Search at the Manufacturer's site for the IC Amp part number, leading to the actual IC wattage output specs in .pdf sheet:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~ganswijk/chipdir/c/logo.htm 
The wimpy bass; poor FM; and - possibly - the fader issues are different, and I don't claim to explain them above. But, if we sort out these issues, there's a better chance of understanding and correcting some of the double DIN defects. As one Poster notes above, just listening to separate sources - CD vs. FM - gives a good indication of what the Monsoon will really do on a good day with the CD as the source, turned up to where you like it, with the harness wiring error corrected, obviously. That's as good as it's going to sound. Fortunately, the single DIN "Premium" Monsoon in Da Wife's '01.5 Passat works for her ears, and sounds "good enough" to this ex-Studio Engineer for an OEM System. My SUV has an Alpine HU to replace part of the OEM System.









If Monsoon cut cost corners on or tried a new FM decoder IC in the double DIN Monsoon and got worse FM sound than in older Monsoons, that will take a new Aftermarket HU to fix. Or, cut over to Satellite radio if that's a direction you were taking anyway... Being able to swap in a "better sounding" FM decoder IC into the HU is *very* unlikely.
As folks report in how various Aftermarket HUs drive the Monsoon amp, at least there will be solid information on how HU upgrades sound w/the Monsoon amp. My guess is that it will be a tough road, once wiring harnesses errors are corrected, to get VW to do any more about perceived poor Monsoon sound or FM tuner performance. Hence the standard VW reply "It works to Factory specs...".
Hats off to those who dogged this wiring issue through to correction... 


[Modified by Engineer Guy, 4:22 PM 8-21-2002]


[Modified by Engineer Guy, 3:44 PM 8-22-2002]


----------



## cad_man (May 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Engineer Guy)*

Engineer Guy, 
Excellent description, I have also spent the last 30 years in the electronic industry. You very eloquently explained the problems of mass-production, just in time and outside vendors. The electrical description was also right on.
Thanks for the time it took to write it in a way that was understandable by all.

cad_man http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Engineer Guy)*

Engineer Guy,
I think your post was very clear and made a good point. Here are some of my thoughts.....
- I took it bad that you compared the "eastern block" Hungary to India and other oriental labor forces. Hungary has been famous about high standards of manufacturing and high level of education among workers. Since Audi decided to make all their engines for the TT and A6 there as well as several other high tech parts I really don't think that they will waste professional labor on making wiring harnesses. Also IBM makes all their top of the line hard drives in Hungary before they transfer the plant to anywhere (China, Taiwan, Philippines) else later in the production. IBM also ships parts back and forth between Australia and Hungary as they need the high tech workers of Hungary to make some of the asemblies while they outsource the cheaper stuff to Australia. I am from Hungary so that is why I took it this bad, I hate to see Hungary meantioned on the same page with the unskilled oriental sweat shops.......... But back to the topic.
- The Double DIN HU is actually not a Monsoon product, it is a shady implementation executed by Panasonic (Mathusita co.). After replacing my HU with a Kenwood unit I can say that all the fader/sound/FM harshness problems are gone and the sound is pretty good for an OEM system. So it seems like Monsoon is getting the flame over it, yet it is another company that really made the boo-boo.
- As far as wattage of the Monsoon system goes I agree that writing 200W sound system on a sheet of paper might grab the attention and please the average customer but "educated customers" will know that a 200W rating means absolutely nothing without listing the THD% and source voltage as well as load ratings for such a system. Monsoon and VW clearly not trying to market to these customers unfortunately I am one of them......


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Engineer Guy,
I think your post was very clear and made a good point. Here are some of my thoughts.....
- I took it bad that you compared the "eastern block" Hungary to India and other oriental labor forces
[HR][/HR]​Ummm, hello chip on your Hungarian shoulder! Re-read his post!


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## Engineer Guy (Aug 15, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

GTakacs ~
Sorry for the perceived slight of Hungary, since none was intended [the same for India, et al]. I was thinking of at least 2 German Hands Free Car Kit Companies I worked with who specifically sourced assembled speakers and - yes - wiring harnesses from Hungary, due precisely to the good quality product they got and due to the regional Factory closeness within Europe. As a pal of mine says: "You and I are in violent agreement!" re: workforce and product quality in Hungary. That Audi sources engines there speaks for itself.
I don't characterize other Countries as "unskilled oriental sweatshops" as places to even lump Hungary in with simply because Taiwan is THEE largest Manufacturer Worldwide of Semiconductors; China is Motorola's largest emerging market for Cellphones - and they make boatloads of Semiconductors there, too - and India is well-known for excellent hardware and software output at ~1/2 the cost of U.K. or Silicon Valley U.S. Engineers. India is also known for a very well-trained workforce there since, like Taiwan, Government policies support a steady stream of good Graduates from Universities. 
Besides labor costs, geographical location, tariffs, and laws affect where Vendors locate. Case-in-point: the shiny new Seagate hard drive plant in N. Ireland was shuttered a few years ago while the one in Penang, Malaysia remained open. Been to 'em both, but Penang was nearer to where the hard drives were needed for further assembly and the Factory was in a special Tax-Free Zone at the Airport. 
This wiring harness debacle is a back-handed tribute, I suspect, the conscientiousness of the Vendor. They made hundreds or thousands of harnesses identically and perfectly, but wrong! But, they were made and tested identically, I would guess, before shipping to the VW Factory floor. Faulty Engineering Documentation or a translation error could have been the simple explanation for this apparently-widespread mistake, in my experience. Been there, done that...
I sincerely wish that the reported "weak bass" and "poor FM" Monsoon problems were as easy to solve as swapping 2 wires in an HU harness.
A tip of the hat to you BTW for your petition efforts!


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## Broadway Limited (Apr 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Engineer Guy)*

That was a very informative post, EG.
Perhaps you can answer a question for me: I played a few audiophile "test" CDs (Stereophile, XLO) in my '02 D-Din Monsoon to test the phasing and the results indicated the unit was in-phase. So... was this a legitimate test, or do I need to remove the HU and check the wires to be sure?
Thanks.


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## turbovw18 (Jul 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

monsoon double-din http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Broadway Limited)*

Could it be because the Stereophile CD can't simulate just one woofer being out of phase with all of the other drivers in system? I have a Chesky reverse polarity test and also noticed no difference in sound.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Engineer Guy)*

Engineer Guy,
I didn't take it all that seriously I just wanted to point out that Hungary makes high tech and quality stuff and you won't see many T shirts and sneakers saying "Made in Hungary". (BTW my mother in law actually works in a plant where they make wiring harnesses for microwave ovens







) No harm no foul so it's all good.
Unfortunately the wire swap does not fix the above mentioned problems, they exist even after the swap. Some people blame Monsoon, some blame the HU, I personally think the HU is inadequate to be in a "Premium" setup as VW claims it to be and probably the Monsoon amp and speaker combination would perform better with a decent HU (it does with my new Kenwood HU). Some people are not happy with the Monsoon even after replacing the HU (DanoP for one) I don't know what kind of remedy would be suitable for them.
All I wanted from VWofA was a refund for the "Premium" sound as it was everythign BUT premium. They denied my request so I will haul their butt to court and seek damages for an entire replacement of the HU with the Kenwood I got which was about $600 incluing parts and labor.


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

I would say that an aftermarket HU improves the sound considerably.....but the Kenwood revealed problems elsewhere. To my ears anyway, the amp and/or speakers are somewhat electronic sounding....this was fixed when I changed out the speakers and wired the HU to the front. So, yes, I think the system problems extend beyond the HU and involve the amp and system design. The failure of the Monsoon system can only be truely appreciated by listening to live, unamplified music. Only then can one understand how badly Monsoon skews the spectral balance of sound, emasculates the bass, and adds electronic artifacts.


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## Engineer Guy (Aug 15, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Broadway Limited)*

Broadway Limited ~
After all the grief this wiring problem appears to cause folks, my own technique would be to actually check the wiring and see for myself that it's correct by either borrowing the "slot keys" to pull the HU myself, or print out the finally-correct TSB to show the Dealer so that they can quickly pull your HU and show it to you. One Poster here mentioned that this process at the Dealer took only 15 minutes. Going this route of seeing the wiring for yourself has a couple of other advantages:
1. You'll be on the Dealer list and on their radar for further solutions re: Double DIN Monsoon HUs. It sounds like, from some Posts, that there still could be HU coding problems, etc., that are still lurking out there. It's important to identify these different issues and sort them out rather than just vent [also a useful function of this Board!]. Look at the relatively-quick progress made as soon as UKAUSSI and others really chased down this wiring harness issue and got a correct TSB... I've seen folks venting here about this bad audio problem for months and - Technically - was really stumped by it...
2. You can then contribute, if the mood strikes you, to one side of this issue or the other: those who notice almost no audio change, or those that notice a big change, when this wiring error is corrected [if that's your outcome]. Or, those who are happy w/the Monsoon sound. There's still a large statistical Owner population out there, not represented on this Board, and they COULD represent one side or the other of this Monsoon sound issue.
If you have the good fortune to work with a knowledgeable Tech at your local Dealer, perhaps he/she, too, is an audio nut and has followed this issue on his own [a long shot, but it COULD happen







]. He or she may have some corrective tricks, like re-coding, to share with you that you'll never benefit from unless you meet them while the Dealer checks the HU wiring. 
Plus, if you haven't worked with them much, you'll get calibrated on the helpfulness of your Dealer, cuz these Posts indicate that they sure vary








So, I'm sidestepping the issue of Test & Calibration CDs. I'd want to see the wiring for myself; just my nature.
Whether folks pay to join up at this site below or not, I think it's insightful to see a list of TSBs as they issue, and the topics thereof. If you see a string of TSBs re: Monsoon - I can see a similar TSB list on my SUV w/o joining up - then that tells you something right there... Of course, the Dealer is the ultimate TSB reference, but this site is easy to check in with on line in conjunction with topics raised here.
http://www.alldata.com/recalls/


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Engineer Guy)*

In view of the fact that mine has worked great since the wire swap (lots of bass & good imaging) the only other thing I can think of that I don't think has been mentioned is that you may need to reset the HU as it is supposed to learn & adjust for errors. 
This would be same as resetting your ECU by clearing the codes (even if there are none). This can be done in the VAG-COM by accessing the "Radio - 56" section and clicking on "Fault Codes - 01" and then select "Clear Codes".
Just a thought


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

UKAUSSI----does your FM sound good? I would describe mine as still very muddy with a distinct lack of imaging and depth of sound....like the frequency response is severely reduced. I *think* most people still have this problem after the wire switch. (from what I've read around here)
CDs are a whole different world....much better freq range (obviously it should be better, but the FM is so bad that the difference seems monumental). But the CDs sound very very harsh and the highs are almost intolerable with the treble and volume turned up at all.
So, I was just wondering if you did/still do have this problem (crappy FM sound)....your theory about resetting the radio is very interesting, and maybe some people with VAG-COMs can test it...if they havent already reset their radio after the wire switch. Anyone???


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

I don't listen to the radio, only CD's as I HATE commercials.
I spent 2 years as a BMW test driver and I listened to the radio from 5am to 2pm every day and I am DONE with it. (like eating chocolate every day for 2 years in a chocolate factory







)
I will however try it out and see how it sounds for test purposes and let you guys know


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## DCC (Oct 12, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

Any advise on how to remove the pins from the socket without cutting???


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## vdubsmitty (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (DCC)*

small paper clips and a leatherman


----------



## foreverreal (Aug 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vdubsmitty)*

Just picked up the Jetta on Saturday and noticed a huge difference in the amount of bass (more on right) in my car when listening to CD's that I am intimately familiar with. (FWIW, I feel well qualified to comment on this as I am an avid audio enthusiast and a professional engineer/producer.) After I first noticed these inadequacies, as well as the absolutely awful FM reproduction, I began experimenting with the balance, fader and EQ knobs while listening to some of my favorite reference CD's.
The vehicle was manufactured in March '02. Given that, and the fact that it definitely exhibits uneven sound staging and bass reproduction, I think it is safe to assume that the wire swap needs to be done. For me, this much will be easy, however, there are a couple of things mentioned in various posts that I am unfamiliar with, or not completely clear on. (BTW, I haven't had the time to read all the posts, so if I missed this info, I apologize.) First, what is the VAG-COM? Second, what is the procedure for recoding the HU? Third, is there a way to check the current coding on the HU before recoding? Thanks. Any clarification would be much appreciated.
Before I sign off, I did want to throw in my two cents on a few aspects of the discussion...
First is that I actually did not expect exceptional performance from a factory installed sound system. In my experience, even the "super-premium" name brand systems in various cars leave a lot to be desired when compared to a good aftermarket system. That said, all of us with this version of the Monsoon sound system did pay $325 for something and, given what I've read here, I don't think VW has delivered. My last two new cars were a 1995 BMW 525i and a 1992 Mitsubishi 3000GT and the stock stereos in both of those vehicles destroy the Monsoon where tonal balance and sound staging are concerned. Neither of those systems cost me a penny extra!
Second, as far as wattage ratings go, there are actually many methods used for rating the output wattage of various types of audio equipment. The standard in car stereo for years has been to use a "peak" wattage rating as opposed to "continuous" wattage ratings typically used for mid-fi and hi-fi gear. Low-end home audio (shelf systems, entry-level gear, boom boxes, etcetera) is often rated "peak" as well. In general, you can take the peak wattage rating and divide it by two to arrive at an approximate continuous wattage rating. Sometimes, you actually have to divide by four. Beyond that, the manufacturer gets to choose the acceptable level of distortion for the rated output which of course leaves the door open for them to make the rated output look a little sexier than what might be perceived by decent set of ears in the real world.
So, FWIW, the actual continuous wattage rating of the Monsoon system is probably somewhere around 35 watts, factoring in a minimum acceptable amount of harmonic distortion (say approximately 0.2%). This is still not bad for a factory installed car system unless you really want to listen LOUD. IMO, the problem with this system is not power, but poor sound staging. I'll chime in once I've swapped the wires on what changes I hear.
One last thing is for those of you who noticed a dramatic change in the overall EQ of the system when opening the sunroof. (Before I go any further, I want to say that, as delivered, the sound system in my car is nowhere close to flat in terms of overall frequency response. There is a ridiculous emphasis of low midrange frequencies (approx. 300 to 600 Hz) and some of it cannot be EQ'ed out. We'll see if the wiring/phase correction does anything about that.) Anyway, FWIW, where the sunroof is concerned, in my 525, it seemed that the system was actually optimized for flat frequency response with the sunroof open. This is just what my ears told me. No matter what though, one simple fact of acoustical physics (though some debate this) is that it takes a certain amount of distance for low frequency sound waves to propagate. Because of this, when you open the sunroof of your car, a good bit of low frequency energy is going to go straight up and out of the car before your ears ever get the chance to hear those notes. At the same time, listening with the cabin sealed will result in superior low end reproduction because the energy from the bass frequencies pressurizes the cabin. Bottom line: opening and closing the sunroof basically is like re EQ'ing the low end on your system.
Well, this post is long enough at this point, so thanks to UKAUSSIE and the rest of you folks for all the info and the effort you have put in to fixing a problem that VW apparently does not want to deal with. BTW, VW of A customer service is going to hear from me on this issue regardless of whether the wire swap works or not. Peace...
William


[Modified by foreverreal, 9:01 PM 8-28-2002]


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foreverreal)*

Keep the sunroof closed but open the cover to the sunroof. Now close it. Repeat.







I hear a difference there but I cannot pinpoint it. I think the highs are crisper with the cover open and it's a more pleasing sound. However, in Florida I cannot leave the cover open or my neck and noggin would fry.








I sure hope all of you are addressing these concerns to your dealers and to the VWoA 800 number because without that communication they are not going to know they have a huge problem on their hands and be motivated to go back to Panasonic to fix the HU.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foreverreal)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
First, what is the VAG-COM? Second, what is the procedure for recoding the HU? Third, is there a way to check the current coding on the HU before recoding? Thanks. Any clarification would be much appreciated.
William
][HR][/HR]​The Vag-Com is the computer software used to do the read-outs on the car. My car had the wiring problem, but my coding was correct. You will need someone with a vag-com to do the reading for you or the dealer can do it. Somewhere back in these 26 pages, UKAUSSI posted a page with the codes on it, but not sure which page---probably somewhere around April-May. If he sees this, or you can e-mail him, maybe he'll post it again. The code is different depending on whether you have steering wheel controls, Monsoon or not, ect.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*


----------



## foreverreal (Aug 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

OK, I hope I can get my dealer to check the code. They don't want to acknowledge the problem just yet. Is the only way to recode the deck to flash it from the VAG-COM? Thanks...


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foreverreal)*

GTakas put a link to the corrected TSB for the Monsoon wiring problem---it is on page 25 of this thread. This is the greater issue---get the wiring checked and then check your coding. The Vag-Com is hooked into the car---they can check and change the codes at one time.
With the corrected TSB, it should be easier now to get it fixed. If you get no satisfaction from your dealer, it's easy to do yourself.


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## foreverreal (Aug 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

Thanks again Mary...
Checked pp. 25 and saw the newer TSB. Anybody catch that they made the correction on the same date (03-28)?
Anyway, so far the dealer said that they can't officially acknowledge the wiring problem. They told me that they can replace the HU, but that the problem would persist. Then I talked to a CS rep at VWoA and she said that she wasn't aware of the Monsoon DD HU wiring defect but that she can and will check to verify that the TSB's actually exist. She didn't make any promises, but she said that she would call the dealership immediately and that she would get back to me probably within 48 hrs. She made it sound like they (VWoA) would authorize the repair if things were actually as I described.
I made her aware of the thread and the fact that numerous owners of the defective HU's were doing VW's job for them. I've read enough of the thread by now to see that the fix is pretty easy to do. I just want VW to do it as a matter of principle. After all, we did pay $325 for something and I think the more we make VW deal with their error, the more likely it is that future cases will not have to jump through hoops to get a simple problem fixed. I'm not griping about anybody who fixed this themselves, I just want to try it this way first.
Beyond that, given that VW has clearly been aware of the problem since March 28, they could have taken corrective action that would have allowed for dealers to fix the problem before delivering these vehicles to their customers. Wishful thinking, huh???
A couple more questions though...
1. Does anybody know if the petition was ever sent to VWoA?
2. Does anyone mind if I print this thread, or parts of it, to send to VWoA in a letter (or, is there a vortex policy that prohibits that)? Thanks...
PS - I will not do anything that violates vortex policy. I just checked and looks like reprinting any of this in a letter ot a third party is unacceptable...


[Modified by foreverreal, 6:40 PM 8-29-2002]


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foreverreal)*

Hi again,
Well, VW is telling you a load of crap! They DO know about the problem, they DO know about this thread, and they DO have the petition. While they did correct the TSB, any other help has been "nada". They completely ignore us. They completely ignored the petition. Every single Customer Service rep that anyone has called has said "Oh, we don't know anything about this!". They have big-time communications problems to say the least. 
Why does your dealer need any authorization just to pull the HU out? That's all you have to do to check the wiring. It sounds like they are giving you the run around! If you haven't had the "Dead Radio Syndrome", then there is no reason to replace the HU (unless there are still problems after the wire switch). All they have to do is switch two little wires. There is absolutely no cost involved! If there is an official TSB, there is acknowledgement on VW's part that there is a problem---your dealer only needs that document.
Don't mean to rant, but the dealers' (notice plural) reaction to this problem has been ludicrous! I am amazed at how apathetic they are to helping us with such a simple problem. They need to have a better system of looking up TSB's and ACTING on them!
Anyway, I hope you get somewhere with yours---most of us didn't. Let us know and Good Luck!










[Modified by MaryP, 8:20 PM 8-29-2002]


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## nitroVW (Jul 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

hey all ! i think we should go to a news network. like ABC or NBC. to see if they would like a HOT STORY about VW! on how they are manufacturing cars that are broke or will break soon after you buy it. i meet a few V dubbers the other week. they all thought they had a MONSOON system in their cars. when in fact they really did not! they had the DD head unit and the speakers. but NO AMP!!!!!!!!.
i showed them that my car had the amp in the trunck. and when you first turn on the radio mines says MONSOOON! but their did not. 
LIKE I SAID WE SHOULD GO TO A NEWS NETWORK ABOUT THIS TO GET VW`S ATTENTION! SHOW THE WORLD THAT VW IS SELLING GARBAGE...............
I USED TO LOVE VW BUT NOW I WISH I HAD NEVER BOUGHT A 02 GTI....


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## vdubsmitty (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nitroVW)*

I'm going to the dealer tomorrow to see if they will re code the monsoon. Quick question...sorry if this has been asked before but I don't have all day to read through this post. What exactly does re-coding do to the monsoon? Does it help out the sound quality?
BTW taking an american spec GTi to the VW dealership in the UK suks a hairy a$$.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vdubsmitty)*

Recoding doesn't do anything unless it is coded wrongly to begin with! They can check it out for you, but don't hold your breath that it is wrong and will need recoding. Have you had the wiring checked yet?


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## foreverreal (Aug 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
Well, VW is telling you a load of crap! They DO know about the problem, they DO know about this thread, and they DO have the petition...
Anyway, I hope you get somewhere with yours---most of us didn't. Let us know and Good Luck!








[Modified by MaryP, 8:20 PM 8-29-2002][HR][/HR]​You're probably right! I mean, I know that they know, but I am taking this course of action for now in order to have my complaint documented. VWoA CS has not called me back yet. (Big surprise he says sarcastically.) All the better I say 'cause the more the screw up, lie and so on, the more ground I/we have to stand on.
I checked vortex user policies and I won't reprint anything from the thread based on what I read there. At this point I am considering creating a web page where people can post there vin and the status of there Monsoon DD HU (i.e., still defective, end-user repair, dealer repair, etcetera). If we get enough legit names/vins/whatever, I think we can start to make VWoA grip a bit.
Here's the way I figure it... There are about 6 or 7 VW dealers in metro Houston. I know my dealer moves about 90 units/month. There are at least two others that move a comprable no. of units. If just 12 of those cars (per dealer) have these defective harnesses in them, that means that VW has sold just about 800 or 900 of those in Houston alone this year. That translates into $276,250.00 in VW's pocket (based on 850 X $325.00) just from this market. I'm not willing to let VWoA/VAG shaft me for $325 or any part of it.
I am particularly interested in culling the names of dub owners in Texas with miswired Monsoon DD HU's 'cause there's a nice little law called the Texas Deceptive Trade Practices Act which allows for treble damages for certain types of consumer fraud. I'm going to talk to an attorney next week and see if this qualifies. Meanwhile, I'm giving VWoA CS until Tuesday to call me. If they don't, they are going to have a (another) pissed-off, resourceful customer on their hands and the letter writing/website creation/something will start.
BTW, how many names were on the petition and when was it sent? Can I get a copy?
Thanks again MaryP and, yeah, I'll keep ya posted...
peace


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foreverreal)*

The Monsoon petition link is at the bottom of any of GTakas's posts. There is one at the top of this page.


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## foreverreal (Aug 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

Read and signed...


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## DanoP (Apr 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foreverreal)*

VWoA customer service is pretty useless....they are more like customer antagonizers than customer advocates. Their SOP is to call your dealer and report the problem and then send you to the dealer. Of course, this does no good whatsoever.
I had a regional VW rep spend a couple of hours with my car after he heard, what he called, a 'severe tonal imbalance' between the left and right side of the vehicle. He cut up the wiring leading to my harness, checked the connections, then declared my Monsoon system operating per spec....he even consulted with the VW Monsoon designer in his trouble shooting efforts. Of course, this makes no logical sense....to acknowledge that he heard the problems then later say everything is A-OK.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (foreverreal)*

Foreverreal,
You sound like just like I did about two months ago. I was all pissed about pyaing something extra for something such low quality. I have opened numerous cases with VWofA customer service, they denied that anyone else has ever reported the issue to them, they sent me to the dealer to get it worked out, I've been to two different dealers to get it looked at, they replaced my HU once, the regional tech (TX,OK) looked at my radio and NOTHING happened. At the end VWofA always states: "Radio meets factory standards" even though I have an invoice from the dealer stating "Radio replaced problem still exists"
So I think I am a bit ahead of you in this uphill battle...... I decided to put together a petition as VWofA denied that it ever happened to anyone. I have sent them the petition with 63 signatures on it, their reponse: "Radio meets factory standards".
I also sent to the BBB auto line (http://www.bbb.org) and filed an arbitration process with them. I asked for a reimbursement for my aftermarket HU that I put in the car shortly after purchase as the sound was unacceptable. They denies my request for arbitration on the basis of I was not alleging a manufacturing or workmanship defect I was alleging a DESIGN defect and they do not deal with those.
So I decided to file a small claims court case against them. I have gotten all the paperwork I will file next week (I've been saying that for a while now, but I REALLY will file next week). I've also talked to a lawyer and asked him about class action and such, and he told me that class action is generally good for the lawyers but not for the plaintiffs. So he advised against it.
To file a small claims court case all I needed to find out was their registered agent in Texas (I live in Ft. Worth). Their registered agent is a company in Dallas that deals with corporate legal issues for many companies, that is all they do. Their name slipped my mind but I have it written down at work and will post here next week. To find out who the registered agent is you need to call the Secretary of State in Austin and they can tell you.
Right now the only remedy is to file a case against them as they were non-responsive to any of my attempts to get this case resolved.
Good luck to you, I just wanted to give you a little heads up so you can avoid walking down the same path I did. Most people give up after doing the wire swap themselves and getting a new HU. I really think VWofA should be punished not only for their sub par stereo but the way they have been handling this issue by sweeping us under the carpet. I will try to get media coverage on my lawsuit for sure!


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## nitroVW (Jul 29, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

GUYS LETS GET INTOUCH WITH A TV NETWORK. IF WE ALL START MAKING SOME CALLS TO SAY LIKE "PRIMETIME LIVE" TO GET SOME PUBLICITY ON THIS THEY MIGHT DO A STORY ON CRAPPY CARS THAT VW IS MAKING...............


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## monsoon-bad (Jun 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nitroVW)*

quote:[HR][/HR]GUYS LETS GET INTOUCH WITH A TV NETWORK. IF WE ALL START MAKING SOME CALLS TO SAY LIKE "PRIMETIME LIVE" TO GET SOME PUBLICITY ON THIS THEY MIGHT DO A STORY ON CRAPPY CARS THAT VW IS MAKING...............[HR][/HR]​I think your overstating the problem. VW makes very good cars. 
What I believe is that VW makes and sells crappy stereos!
You do make a good point with TV coverage.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (monsoon-bad)*

I agree! I think VWs have awesome "preceived quality" and good "actual quality". The Double DIN truly sucks and the way they are handling the issue is typical for a corporation their size. I will fight the issue as song as I can but don't confuse one POS stereo (that was actually made by Panasonic) with the quality of the entire corporation..................


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## TDIJetta (Sep 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

I look for this TSB, 91-02-04, on http://www.alldata.com and couldn't find it. Any idea why?
DJ


[Modified by TDIJetta, 4:31 PM 9-2-2002]


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TDIJetta)*

Looks to me like they just may not have updated the site yet. The TSB came out at the end of the month of March. Notice that there are no others for last couple of months---it's hard for me to believe that there haven't been any more screw-ups that need a TSB.


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## WeirdEd (Jul 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

Not really a big piece of news, anyways, I tried a simple/stupid/senseless experiment today just to prove to myself how much the FM part of the double DIN Monsoon system sucks. I took my Sony portable mini-radio that I had picked up at Fry's and hooked the phones out up to one of those adapter cassettes, dropped that into the tape slot of the Monsoon. I then tuned both the Monsoon and my little Sony mini-radio to the same station - OMG, what a difference it was. The Monsoon FM just sounded AWFUL in comparison. 
Obviously, this is not what I paid $300 for and it's kindof dangerous to use. Also, not having an outside antenna, the reception is bad. So not really a solution. 
Since I don't really feel like spending any additional bucks on aftermarket parts, I am planning to give my dealer this little demonstration when I take the car to the 10k mile service (I'm now at 8k5). Let's see what they tell you. Has anybody else raised this issue with Bob Lewis Volkswagen in San Jose? How did they respond?


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## Analog Kid (Feb 20, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (WeirdEd)*

Are the 2003's shipping with defective Monsoon systems? Specifically the Passats. Sorry if this has been posted, but this thread is HUGE! The brochure clearly shows a single DIN Monsoon like my GTI.
I have an '03 Passat on order. We ordered it with the Monsoon, because I love it in my '00 GTI. After reading this post and similar posts at ClubB5, I am concerned. 
BTW - My brother has an 02 GTI (double-din Monsoon) and the difference between his stereo and mine is unbelievable. VW cut some costs here by going with a new supplier. And we get an inferior product.


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## vdubsmitty (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Analog Kid)*

After doing the wire swap on the HU my monsoon was better, but still no comparison to the Non-monsoon in my wife's Jetta. So I connected an amp and Subwoofer and I'm absolutely blown away by how awesome it sounds now! I'm still using my monsoon amp and Factory HU. I just spliced into the LT and RT speaker wires on the amp as well as the Grey wire on the CD changer harness. I got all the detailed instructions from recklessvw. Fairly easy install.


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## amgvw (Jan 13, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Analog Kid)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Are the 2003's shipping with defective Monsoon systems? Specifically the Passats. Sorry if this has been posted, but this thread is HUGE! The brochure clearly shows a single DIN Monsoon like my GTI.[HR][/HR]​the dd hu was a running my change in 02. sad to say, the single din hu like in your gti is gone








quote:[HR][/HR]I have an '03 Passat on order. We ordered it with the Monsoon, because I love it in my '00 GTI. After reading this post and similar posts at ClubB5, I am concerned.[HR][/HR]​luckily i got an 02 glx with the single-din - i also had an 00 gti with the single din. i got my gf a golf with the dd and it's horrible.
sorry.


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (amgvw)*

alright, i went to the dealer to fix my stereo, (DD crappy like everyone else) and get this. the service manager at autohaus of lancaster took the head unit out of his car and put it in mine. (his thumped before) so, the kid who did the work called me back in and said "check this out." i said that it sounds good, but why didn't it say monsoon? and why are the knobs for the treble, bass and other stuff slightly larger then what i had? (i have a GLI built on 5/02 that had the wiring done CORRECTLY) so, i whipped out the piece of paper i printed off of here with the correct wiring codes and told him that if this is a monsoon system, it should be 00031. my code was 00431. whoops. he changed it and it sounded awsome. now, i said is this a single DIN monsoon or a double? he swears a double. i don't know. how do you tell? the knobs on the head unit are definitely bigger and it was definitely from an 02 1.8T. I don't care at this point. It sounds AWSOME and the coding is right. Kudos to Dave, the service manager for giving up his head unit. 
I can't believe the difference but i still want to know if i got a single din or double din. and the other ? i have, are they still worth the same value? if not, i want the credit. i will take pics of the difference in the knobs when i get my digital camera back. the knobs on the working ones look like they have a slightly bigger diameter to them and the white tick on them is slightly more bold. oh well, who cares. it ROCKS now!
my sister has the monsoon and hers is an 02, and she didn't have a problem with it at all. i listened to hers and that is when i knew that my stereo was crap.
thanks guys for all your help. without this thread the dealer and i wouldn't have figured it out!


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nathanskal)*

quote:[HR][/HR]I can't believe the difference but i still want to know if i got a single din or double din. [HR][/HR]​The doube-din head units can play both cds AND cassettes and are twice the high of the single-din units (which normally can only play cds OR cassettes).
Check out http://www.installdr.com/TechDocs/999006.pdf for a more detailed description.


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

quote:[HR][/HR].....I can't believe the difference but i still want to know if i got a single din or double din.....[HR][/HR]​
*DOUBLE_DIN*


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

yeah, that is what i got. i didn't realize what "double din" meant. i can't believe the difference. this is what i paid for.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nathanskal)*

Check this one out!


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## hognozzle (Jun 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Nice work GTAKAS. glad this thread and your suit are still alive.

-----
i recently had the wire swap done at the dealer. sure it is better, but the fader issue and the peircing highs still leave a lot to be desired by the monsoon. the system is still FAR from premium
------
on a semi-related note. they totally gouged my interior trim when they were working on the radio. i was sooooo annoyed. i keep my car spotless. i can't believe the carelessness. they ended up replacing the damaged peice with little hassle other than me waiting for about 2 hours for the whole ordeal. i'm slowly finding myself much closer to being in the "never go to the dealership" camp.

------------
thanks again to the folks for posting the tsb and all those making a stink about this.


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## ^Doogie (Sep 12, 2002)

I just wanted to let the group know...
I bought a 2002 GTI 6-speed VR6 (I LOVE IT!) a couple weeks ago... traded in a 2000 Passat. The Passat had the non-Monsoon stereo, and, bearing in mind I'm not a HUGE audiophile (but can appreciate good sounding audio) I was always pretty happy with the sound.
...After driving my GTI with the Monsoon sound for a while, I came to realize that it just didn't 'sound good'. I don't like the way you have to choose bass, mid, and treble settings that are 'global' (vs in the 2000 Premium IV where bass, treble, and middle were input-specific, ie one setting for Radio, one for tape, one for CD etc), the fader is a waste of dash space, and the EQ (for want of a better term) settings themselves are a joke... I mean, the stereo sounds 'okay' (better than most factory units I suppose in other cars with comparable price tags), but it's nowhere near the quality of my old non-monsoon system.
There is no bass on the radio, the mid-range is deafeningly BAD, and the treble only seems to come out of the front two tweeters.
...I read this thread and became very excited that a simple harness error was to blame, so went to work cutting up my trusty worldcom phone card whose number I first committed to memory








...Well, the stereo was wired correctly. Never have I been so disappointed that the factory (or dealer, maybe) actually did something RIGHT. 
...So now I just have to live with the fact that there is nothing WRONG with my Monsoon system, it is SUPPOSED to sound bad








...Just wanted to share my experience with the group... Apparently someone somewhere IS correcting the wiring issue... but it doesn't change the fact that VW is charging people $350 for a stereo downgrade. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 


[Modified by ^Doogie, 5:33 AM 9-23-2002]


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (^Doogie)*

i have a 2002 gli and i was very fortunate.... my wiring was correct and i took it to the dealer. they gave me a head unit from a car whose bass thumped. i had the same problem as you. just make sure that the code is correct when they put the new unit in. the kid had put a code in that didn't reconize that it was a monsoon. as soon as i suggested the right code, it PUNCHED. 
absolutely no complaints from me. my official test track off a cd to make sure it was great was from a Sublime cd. sounds just like my old stereo did and i had a box and an amp.
the dealer was nice enough to give me his head unit from his car. we knew it thumped so it was just a 15 min switch. they now ordered him a new head unit, but i don't know if the new one made a difference for him or not...
good luck. its really frustrating.... trust me, i know....
nathan


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## UKAUSSI (Oct 21, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nathanskal)*

Whilst on a test drive with one of the Tech's at Capo VW he mentioned he had done my wire swap and found that it also didn't improve things. 
He discovered that the Monsoon Amp had been damaged by the wires being wired incorrectly and replacing the amp finally cured the whole problem.


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (bcruze)*

Now that certainly sounds interesting. But can a simple phase mistake like that really break an amp? I didn't think so, but I could be wrong.


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## Satchriani (Jul 17, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Not to beat a dead horse, but I scanned the thread, and didn't find my answer. 
Does the TSB that was released TRUELY fix the problem? I have a single din radio, and it's fine. My wife just got an 02 Jetta, and the radio sounds like steamy poop. Radio and CD are night and day. 
I know about the problem, and for some reason, my service dept was unaware of the TSB. If i bring it to them, and they do the fix as stated, will it fix the problem?


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Satchriani)*

NO, the TSB fixes some of the problem but FM will stay horrible, the fader will not work properly, the left side will stay muffled amongst other things......
Check the petition in my signature to read more......


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]NO, the TSB fixes some of the problem but FM will stay horrible, the fader will not work properly, the left side will stay muffled amongst other things......
Check the petition in my signature to read more......[HR][/HR]​Hey GTakacs, what's the latest news in regards to your petition and fighting VW?


----------



## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

vmb7,
Volkswagen's response to the petition was: "Radio meets factory standards, we're not going to do anything about it".
So I went to the BBB and filed a claim with them. They could not help because I was not alleging a "manufacturing defect" but a "design defect" and they don't deal with those.
So as you can see from my post above, I have filed a lawsuit againts Volkswagen and hopefully with the support of the petition, the proof from the dealer that they could not fix my car on numerous occasions, and a fellow vortex member as a witness it should be an open and shut case.
Edit: note that this is a civil suit so there is no need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt, I win as long as it's 51% more likely that this is a POS radio vs it is a great radio.
All I need to do now is wait for the court to serve their registered agent in Texas and set a court date for the hearing which would be in the next 6 to 8 months. I will keep everyone posted......
I really hope that my case will set a precedent and many others will follow suit. As soon as I have a court date and it is getting close to it I will contact the local media for coverage on "the little dude vs. big ignorant corporation", they love that stuff!


[Modified by GTakacs, 6:08 PM 9-24-2002]


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

Good luck man, and thanx for the update! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## vwneuser (Sep 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

I have a 03 jetta, and the speakers on the passenger side are significantly louder than the driver side. Is that a monsoon problem? Did they fix thet problem for the 03 model year?


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vwneuser)*

no, the system is designed with the driver in mind. they have the right side louder then the left for imaging (i think that is what it is called)
someone else on here can get 100x more technical but don't freak out, that is how it is supposed to be. sometimes i think it is too loud, and i normally have it 10% more to the left side just to balance it....


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## vwneuser (Sep 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (nathanskal)*

for a second, i thought i had a faulty system. Still dont make sense to me though. it's much too loud on the passenger side, but guess i'll have to live with it.


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## alaskagreenjetta (Sep 26, 2002)

*03 D-Din Monsoon, and Speaker*

This is my first day out on here. I love my VDub!! There is a problem with the speakers though. The back right passanger speaker bottoms out when the bass is up. I don't get it, none of my other spearkers do that?? And I did notice more output for my passenger side "thump" than I did on the driver. It can't be that bad until I read about it tonight. SO I think the EQU is fine on my '03. And I was wondering what I could do about adding a sub or subs in the trunk. The head tech at my VW dealership told me something about a computer chip that would have the check engine light come on if i changed anything on the system. I love my bass so hopefully someone could help me out. Thanks -BB


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## club18t.com (Sep 20, 2002)

*Re: 03 D-Din Monsoon, and Speaker (alaskagreenjetta)*

Hmmm well Ialready did the wire swap on my 02 GTI and it still sounds terrible. My girlfriend just got a 03 Passat with the monsoon in it and it sounds awesome in comparison. Wonder what I should do now????


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## ShErDiGgs gTi (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

hey guys, new vdubber here. whats going on with the monsoon system?







is there something i need to tell my dealer!?







i've had the static problems too... whats going on? is there really a defect with the D-Din. I have a 2002 gti 1.8t. also, i was looking to add a subwoofer. is it even possible to add a subwoofer with the complicated monsoon system? or would i have to take it to get the whole system yanked out and put a bigger and better system in?


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## Road Reptile (Sep 19, 2002)

*What about 2003 non-Monsoon (Premium VI), Double DIN systems in the Jetta?*

Are you collecting complaints/signatures for these stereos too? If so, please let me know, 'cause I've got some issues I'd like VW to settle.
Still love my Jetta TDI though...
Thanks!
Road Reptile


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## ShErDiGgs gTi (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (UKAUSSI)*

if somebody could make some suggestions.. i would really appreciate the input thanx


[Modified by ShErDiGgs gTi, 8:24 PM 9-27-2002]


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (ShErDiGgs gTi)*

I would recommend checking to see if the wiring is correct in your car. Check out http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 for a well written step by step guide on how to do this.
Also, in regards to adding a sub and amp, check out vdubsmitty's post above.


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## alaskagreenjetta (Sep 26, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

There are 27 pages of messages..







Where is vdubsmitty's mark at? I would like to have an amp and subs installd without dealer knowledge(check engine light) This is riduclous that VW would do such a thing, is it the Monsoon that makes it do that? And i noticed that the radio is really REALLY fuzzy!! What gives??


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (alaskagreenjetta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]There are 27 pages of messages..







Where is vdubsmitty's mark at? [HR][/HR]​It's on this very page.







Page 27.


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## jofus (Jul 17, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

We have to VWs at our house: a 2000 Golf GLS 1.8t with Monsoon single-DIN, and my 2002 GTI with double-DIN Monsoon. From day one, I have always wondered why my stereo sounds worse than the 2000 Monsoon system AND my 1999.5 Golf factory system!!
I have read about 50% of the posts here over the past couple days, and decided to go ahead and make the wire swap. I took all the supplies to the car (pre-cut credit card "tool," small paper clips, and flat-head screwdriver), and the swap took less than five minutes. This was surprisingly simple, and I must agree that doing it myself was MUCH easier than arguing with a mechanic.
I completely agree with the observation that the sound is significantly improved, but I now have a nice chirping sound coming through the speakers everytime I advance to a new track on a CD, like the system is amplifying the electrical noise from this operation. I guess I will put up with this, in exchange for the "fixed" audio characteristics.
My HU has succumbed to the "random episodes of dying" syndrome. It is scheduled for a 10k service on Oct 3 where they will also be checking on the radio "problem," and "maybe ordering a new HU," per the service manager (since I have had the radio die twice in the past month or two).
Has anyone else started hearing this extra "noise" after making the switch?


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## ^Doogie (Sep 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jofus)*

quote:[HR][/HR]...I advance to a new track on a CD, like the system is amplifying the electrical noise from this operation. I guess I will put up with this, in exchange for the "fixed" audio characteristics...
...Has anyone else started hearing this extra "noise" after making the switch?[HR][/HR]​Yep, yep yep..
My Monsoon system always made this noise (was always wired correctly). VERY noticable when the stereo is cranked... it was one of the first "Hmm this isn't a great stereo setup" things I noticed about my Monsoon... 
...It's a 'feature'... lets you know the laser pickup is moving... they just didn't add it to the manual yet


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## It's T-Man (Jul 7, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jofus)*

Hi Guys( and Gals)...I have read most of the posts on this thread. I just picked up my *03* passat GLX< yesterday and was wondering if VW has made the corrections for the  *model year 03* ? . I could only find two posts on this thread about the *03 model year* .
Most of the posts seem to talk about jettas, I am assuming that the dd radios are the same for all models... Anyone have any thoughts?









[Modified by It's T-Man, 2:44 AM 9-29-2002]

[Modified by It's T-Man, 2:45 AM 9-29-2002]

[Modified by It's T-Man, 2:45 AM 9-29-2002]


[Modified by It's T-Man, 2:46 AM 9-29-2002]


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (It's T-Man)*

T Man,
The "Monsoon" problem exists in all VWs (Jetta, Golf, Passat, Beetle) even in my lawyer's 2002 W8 Passat.
The 2003 models are just as doomed as the 2002s. I just replaced the stereo system in a 2003 GLI Jetta not too long ago and while the wiring was correct it still sounded like poo.
The wire swap however seems to only affect MKVI (Golf, Jetta) not the B5.5 (Passat). The wiring colors and the scheme are completely different on the Passat than on the Jettas. So this could be the reason why you hear more Jetta complaints than Passat complaints. While 2002 Jetta and Golf owners had the chance to make theirs sound better by doing the wire swap (it made it a little better, still unacceptable radio quality for me and 118 others, see petition) but poor Passat and any 2003 MKIV owners are just SOL.
So if you think your radio sounds like poo make sure you call VW about it, and sign the petition! I brought a suit against them, I hope to set precedent so they will poop into their pants instead of onto our head and into our radios......


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## vdubsmitty (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (alaskagreenjetta)*

quote:[HR][/HR]There are 27 pages of messages..







Where is vdubsmitty's mark at? I would like to have an amp and subs installd without dealer knowledge(check engine light) This is riduclous that VW would do such a thing, is it the Monsoon that makes it do that? And i noticed that the radio is really REALLY fuzzy!! What gives??[HR][/HR]​Here it is thanks to recklessvw http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
* Monsoon Sub and amp install (Golf/GTI)* 
1.) Signal. 
Open your hatch, and open the little trap door on the left side of your trunk where the Monsoon amp and the CD Changer live. If you don't have a changer, this is a bit easier. Look at the Monsoon amp, you will notice that is has two wiring harnesses plugged into it. Unplug them both. One will have about twice as many wires as the other. This is the output harness, and the one we will be screwing with. You will notice that the harness has 8 pair of wires, plus power and ground. Those 8 pair are for the 8 speakers in your car. The wires that we want to use are the ones running to the rear woofers. The Monsoon amp has already equalized the signal for low end mid and bass frequencies on these two channels, so you will not need to use a crossover unless you are really picky. The color codes for the rear woofers are as follows: 
Left (Drivers) side rear woofer: Red / Green is Positive and Brown / Green is Negative.
Right (Passenger) side rear woofer: Blue / Green is Positive and Blue / Brown or Blue is Negative.
On some ’01 and ’02 cars, there is no Blue / Green signal wire for the right side rear woofer. In this instance, Blue / Brown is Positive and Blue is negative.
You will need to unwrap some of the annoying black tape that covers the wires where they go into the harness. Unwrap about 6" away from the harness, then cut off the excess tape. You should now be able to use your fingers to separate the wires enough to splice them. If not, unwrap some more tape, or maybe you are just a *****. Take your wire cutters, and very carefully cut through the insulation on these wires. Only the insulation, NOT the wires.. Cut through the insulation just like you were going to cut the wire, but don't. Once you have cut just enough, use your fingernails or the wire cutters to push the insulation up a little bit on the wire, exposing the bare wire underneath. You will need to expose only about 1/8 to 1/4 inch of bare wire. Do this appr. 3 inches up from the harness, so if you accidentally cut through the wire, you can fix it. Once you have done this to all four wires, you will need to splice in the signal wires for your amplifier, according to polarity.(+ and -)
If your amplifier has high level (speaker level) inputs, than you can connect your amplifier directly to the Monsoon outputs that we have just spliced. Just run some speaker wire from the Monsoon harness into the trunk, and connect to your amp. If your amp has RCA (low level) inputs, than you will need to connect a Line Level / RCA converter to the Monsoon harness, then run RCA cables to your amp. 
Either way, you will need to remove about 1 inch of insulation from the ends of your wires (your speaker or converter input wires) and wrap it around the exposed wire on the Monsoon harness. Wrap it tight, and secure the connections with electrical tape to prevent any problems later. After all your wires are connected and run into the trunk, plug in your Monsoon harnesses and close the trap door. Make sure to tape off the ends of your speaker wires to prevent a short. If you connected a converter, dont worry about this. 
2.) Power
Power can be run from the battery, or from a hot point under the dash like I did. To get under the dash, remove the four torx screws that hold the lower dash panel in place. (The one by your knees) Pull it out and away from the dash, and look under the steering column. You will see a power relay block with 4 or 5 big red wires coming off of it. The thickest wire is the one you will need to use. Make sure the ground wire is disconnected from your battery before doing this so you dont kill yourself. Use a socket or a wrench to remove the nut that secures the biggest wire to the power terminal. Run your power wire from here using a good electrical connector, then put the nut back on tight. Run the wire under the dash towards the door, and underneath the dead pedal. Once under the deadpedal, run it under the door sills, into the trunk via your folding seats. 
3.) Ground.
Run your ground from the lower seat belt anchor for the rear left seat. To find it, do this. Pull up the back seat on the driver side. Look at the floor. See that little round plastic thing with the two little holes in it? It is a fastener that holds the carpet down. Unscrew it with your fingers counter clockwise, and pull up the carpet. Under it, you will see the large bolt that holds the bottom part of the rear seat belt to the cars frame. Loosen it with a socket or wrench, and connect your ground here.
4.) Remote Turn On for Amplifier
If your amplifier uses a remote-on lead, you will need to connect it to a wire that has power when the Head Unit is turned on. I used the CD changer harness, which is in the same little cubby that the Monsoon Amp lives in. If you don't have a changer, you will see the harness for it nearby, as all MKIV's are prewired for them. The GREY wire on the changer harness is powered when the Head Unit is on, and works perfectly. Connect (splice) your remote lead to this wire just like we did with the signal leads, and run it to your amp with the other wires.
Oh yeah and so far no check engine light http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## CaliBora (Sep 27, 2002)

I dunno guys I have a late 02 Jetta like made in umm april, and i work with guys who install high end car audios, and home audio systems, I love my monsoon, I will agree the subs dont kick like they should but if you turn it up a bit and put a high quality CD in it sounds like a $2000+ aftermarket system, maybe they fixed it???


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CaliBora)*

Your post is possible evidence that the HU's that had the wires wrong from the factory were somehow broken and swapping the wires back won't fix whatever internal problem the swapped wires introduced.
So, swapped back it sounds like poo. Those of you that were lucky enough to have a D-Din correctly wired from the factory, does your stereo sound the same as a corrected one? Or better? Can someone do a side by side? Is this as simple as getting the HU swapped for a new one from the factory if you have incorrect wiring?
I watch this thread so closely in hopes that anyone will announce that VW had REAL GOOD HU's in the parts pipeline. But not yet. In my experience with VAG, they do eventually fix bad sourced parts.


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## CaliBora (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

oops ok i officially retract my retarded statement, you guys were right not till today i got one of my car audio buddies in it and it really doesnt kick out of the left side then i saw the post about the messed up wiring u guys must be right my system sounds crisp but the bass is funky im gonna take it in tomorrow with a printout of that VW bulletin if they pretend like there is no problem, by the way did anyone add an aftermarket 6 disk changer and are the only options clarion or panasonic, cause i really really really dont wanna use panasonic


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## ^Doogie (Sep 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Those of you that were lucky enough to have a D-Din correctly wired from the factory, does your stereo sound the same as a corrected one? Or better? Can someone do a side by side? Is this as simple as getting the HU swapped for a new one from the factory if you have incorrect wiring?[HR][/HR]​My '02 Monsoon was wired correctly from the factory [or at least was correct at the time of sale], and it sounds assy compared with my non-monsoon '00 Passat's stereo. So I don't think it's a result of bad wiring. It's just assy.
...It kind of sounds like a wet sock being slapped against my ass by the CEO of VWoA. - In a bad way


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (^Doogie)*

Awww man!!! Did not need the mental imagery!!!


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## frank22 (Oct 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vmb7)*

Hello all
I am a newbie to this forum, just got an '02 jetta TDI sedan and the Monsoon sounds like crap. I have been through a lot of this thread (it is very lengthy) and it sounds like I have the typical problems described here- weak sound on the left side compared to the right, some crackling on the left side, weird fader issue (drastic jump to the rear speakers at the 10 o'clock position on the knob.) I'm glad to see the issue being dealt with here and still have a few questions left...sorry if these have been covered 10,000 times but I can't seem to easily find the answers in this thread (is there a general summary of this info anywhere?)
1. Is it still useful to sign the petition or was that just to get VW to release a technical summary sheet (the one posted by UKAUSSI)
2. Does the wiring swap only solve the left speaker issues? Has anyone found a solution to the fader issue? It seems to me that this problem remains unsolved
3. My wife has a 2001 Jetta GLS wagon with the monsoon and 6-disc changer, and that stereo had some issues as well. Different stereo than the '02, though. Did the 2001's have a wire-swap problem as well? Mine occasionally sounds crackly in the front, but I don't think it's only on the left side. 
4. While I'm at it, here's the other weird thing that happened with my '01 monsoon- the disc player occasionally makes a loud "whirring" sound over the music. It comes through the speakers, sounds as if the sound of the disc spinning is being amplified, it gradually gets louder and louder and eventually overpowers the music. Turning the power off and then back on makes it go away, but then it gradually comes back again. I brought it in for servicing and the guy who worked on it said he took the whole thing apart and put it back together and found nothing wrong. However, ever since he did that, it happens much less frequently. Anyone have a similar issue, or ever hear of it?
Glad to find you guys, I was really bummed by the sound of my '02 Monsoon. Can't wait to take it in and get the wires swapped. Even a litle bit of sound improvement would be nice at this point!
thanks a lot!
Frank


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## CaliBora (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (frank22)*

Hey i feel your pain with the new monsoon, but i this is what im doing i called my VW dealer and made an appointment. I was talking to the guy and said i want my monsoon fixed the bass on the left is weak and ive noticed that others have has this similar problem, and he replied as vague as possible that there may be a problem with the left firing a little weak compared to the right. Also IF the monsoon was working correctly it is a high end system or comperable to a high end system so put in a good quality cd and test it again low quality will sound even worse, but i dunno i didnt have that crackling problem untill i put in a MP3 burned CD good luck im going in to the dealership with the tech bulletin in hand incase...


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## frank22 (Oct 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (CaliBora)*

That's a good point, I have been having the crackling problem mainly with burned CD's. I wouldn't have expected that to make a difference but I'll check it out. A few of them were downloaded as MP3's and converted so that could be a problem. Others were burnt right from real store-bought CD's though. Thanks and good luck with your monsoon! Let me know how it comes out.
Frank


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## Satchriani (Jul 17, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (frank22)*

if you get crackling in the cd, it's the cd. Make sure you burn at 2 or 4. sometimes when you burn faster, depending on the machine, it crackles alot.


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## ^Doogie (Sep 12, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (frank22)*

Don't even get me started... about 30% of my 'burned' CDR discs don't even play in my system. (and they ALL played fine on my Passat's stereo) ...It reads the CD (takes longer than usual but not a huge amount of time), then sits at 00:00 on the first track and doesn't ever play. I skip forward in the track and it tries to play; plays a second of audio or so, but then either jumps back to 00:00, skips to the next track, or ejects the CD in a hissy fit.
...One of my commerical (non-burned) CDs (Sarah McLachlan - B Sides, Rarities, and Other Stuff - [flames welcome]) doesn't play at all... it says "CD ROM" in the display and ejects the CD. VERY annoying.
...Stopped at the Kenwood factory outlet store on the way home the other day


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## CaliBora (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (frank22)*

the prob is downloaded mp3's most of the time are not CD quality so when you turn around and put it back onto a cd you loose more sound quality, basically the mp3's that will sound the best are original cd rips @ 192k (hard to find)


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## frank22 (Oct 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (^Doogie)*

How's this for a weird one- in my '01 Jetta, I had a store-bought CD (AIR- soundtrack to The Virgin Suicides) that wouldn't play at all. It would say NO DISC when the disc was brand new. Plays in every other CD player I own. So I burned a copy of it and the CD-R copy plays fine. I don't get it!
Thanks for the tips, everybody!
Frank


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## egecko (Mar 27, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (^Doogie)*

quote:[HR][/HR]...It kind of sounds like a wet sock being slapped against my ass by the CEO of VWoA. - In a bad way







[HR][/HR]​ Please, no more ass slapping!










[Modified by egecko, 10:14 PM 10-1-2002]


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## jofus (Jul 17, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Update on my situation: my Monsoon DD HU has gone out twice, first time was the rear fuse, second time required removing/inserting #47. I performed the yellow/black wire swap about two weeks ago with phenomenal results.
Yesterday, in for my 10k service, I mentioned the radio going "out" twice, including my #47 "fix." When I picked up the car, the dealer had replaced the HU with a new one, because they said there was a TSB for the "going out/fuse" problem that mandated a new HU.
I got in the car, and the HU didn't say Monsoon when turned on and it sounded horrible. "Oh, it must be the wrong one." So they put in another HU, which needed to be "programmed to say Monsoon." (Why didn't they just program the first HU, then?) This one sounds better, but the sound coming out is just WRONG, especially through the rear speakers (as I have read about on this thread). I will be going back in about an hour to have them put the original HU back in the car. "Whatever you want, Sir."
I would rather have my HU go cold every few months and have to just R/R a fuse than listen to a tinny-sounding nasty HU all the time.
On the bright side, I LOVE everything else about my car!


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## jofus (Jul 17, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jofus)*

Okay. I got my original HU re-installed, but it no longer reads "Monsoon" when I turn it on. It also sounds HORRIBLE. The service rep told me that it can be programmed to display the word Monsoon, but that it won't sound any different. Is this true? Doesn't this mean that they didn't program it correctly to work with the amp? Advice will be greatly appreciated.


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## trismegistus4 (Aug 22, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (jofus)*

I hope this isn't too stupid a question but...
Why is everyone doing this fix themselves? Is there a reason you can't trust your dealership to do it? I mean, I realize people have other problems with the Monsoon that the wire swap won't fix, but as far as just the wire swap goes, why go to the trouble of doing it yourself when you can just have your dealer do it at your next scheduled maintenence (or next time your check engine light goes on







)?


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## frank22 (Oct 1, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (trismegistus4)*

I'm taking it to the dealer. But from what I've read on this post there have been a lot of people who have gone to their dealer and they don't really fix the problem.


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## CaliBora (Sep 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (frank22)*

i took it in and it sounds a lot better its definately not a 100% fix but its a lot better with the bass being distrubuted between both sides


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (trismegistus4)*

You'd have to read 28 pages of posts to figure it out. Believe me, we aren't all stupid, just persistent. The TSB's have been wrong, not easy to find, incompentent VW techs with poor hearing, and poor VW customer service. You name it, we all have been through it. I did mine and another 2002 Monsoon owner's.


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## wh1te_rabbiT (Sep 6, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rbenjami)*

nm










[Modified by wh1te_rabbiT, 7:16 PM 10-6-2002]


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (wh1te_rabbiT)*

alright, here is one solution to many of you last problems...
Q: cd crackles when playing cds??
A: get a new head unit. my old one did. my new one didn't. 
Q: cd player only plays 60-70% of burned cds?
A: get a new head unit. my old head unit played 60% of my cds. my new one plays them all.
Q: Right Side is louder then left side
A: That isn't a dealer issue, that is VW design issue. Answer is to adjust your balance. I keep mine at approximately "10 o'clock"
Q: Fuse 42 keeps kicking...
A: VWofA says in a TSB that if the radio fuse keeps blowing (or blows once for that matter) the Service Dept should order you a new head unit.
Q: Head unit still sounds crappy with a new head unit in...
A: Make sure the coding is right. I have a four spoke (not a multifunction) steering wheel, monsoon, without cd changer. My coding should be 00031. If the stereo is a supposed "monsoon" and when you turn the car on and it doesn't say "monsoon" then you know that the coding is wrong. I did the research and told the dealer what the code should be. i can post it when i get home but it is already in this forum somewhere. without me telling the dealer what the code was i would still be having problems. after him trying 3 times, it still didn't sounds great. i said "try this" and bam. 
And finally:
Q: The head unit doesn't have any bass even though the wiring is correct and it doesn't crackle and it plays all my burned cds?
A: Order a new head unit and make sure it is wired correctly. Tell the dealer to suck it up and to avoid any and every issue of getting a ****ty '02 unit to order you an '03 head unit. 

I have been following this thread for months now trying to get my system figured out. with the correct wiring, (it was correct coming from the factory,) the right code and a new head unit, i can't complain at ALL. it thumps when and where it should and i am very happy with the '02 monsoon. we shouldn't have to have a 28 page thread, VW should have stepped in but since we do here is the answers to most of the most recent popular questions asked. In my case, i didn't get a new head unit, but i took the head unit from a dealer car that had bass. i knew the head unit would work great under the right conditions because i heard it thump in the dealer demo car. if it still sounded like crap, then i could isolate it to be either the coding or the amp. 
sorry for the long winded response, but hopefully this hit a lot of questions that people still might be having...
and oh, FYI. if you find a dealership that doesn't seem to want to deal with this problem, keep searching for a new dealer. i tried 3 dealerships in my philly area, and i had to drive an hour (ok, normally an hour and a half to Autohaus of Lancaster... 79 miles.... but in my GLI i did it in an hour FLAT.) hell yeah GLI.
nathan
[Modified by nathanskal, 8:54 AM 10-7-2002]


[Modified by nathanskal, 8:54 AM 10-7-2002]


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## voiddweller (Dec 10, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tchockygti)*

quote:[HR][/HR] I'm surprised VW can consider launching a +40k$ car if they can't even do a good job with their 20k$ cars. If people are going to seriously consider getting a VW over a BMW or MB, they've gotta change. It's surprising that this problem took so long to be rectified. Am I complaining too much? I love my GTI, but it's the little things(problems) that count.[HR][/HR]​Agreed!


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (voiddweller)*

Just FYI a little update on the lawsuit that I have filed against VWofA. Their registered agent has responded to my suit on October 11th, I do not know what they responded but I assume they acknowledged the fact that I am seeking damages.
All in all I will see them in court in front of a judge in about 3 months. I will keep you guys posted how that will go.


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## Niterider (Oct 6, 2002)

*03 jetta with may build date*

like the topic says, is this a problem i should be worried about? or should i wait for which i hope is going to be a recall. I dont have a way to compare to another jetta, im the only one i know with one. Im a poor college student and music and my car is my life, like it should be. If anyone has any suggestions or anyways to go about doing this, im a newbie and young at that, any help is more then greatly appreciated.


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## vmb7 (Mar 4, 2002)

*Re: 03 jetta with may build date (Niterider)*

I believe VW resolved the issue before the 2003s came out. 
If you want to double check if the wiring is correct in your car check out http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=284941 for a step by step guide on how to do this.


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## str8chillin (Jul 23, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

my system sound ok, but when i took out the back seats my car sounded a lot better than before. i think its because the seats covered the back speakers so it muffled the sound a little. try it and tell me what u think. i have a 2002.5 gti 1.8t 2dr


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## likemypassat (Oct 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Roboman)*

This must just be a problem with the Double Din Decks. I have an 02 with the single Din Deck and it sounds really good. I just put in a Dash CD player and the trunk changer. The radio sounds good and clear, as well as the CD player. Sounds like maybe VW cheaped out on the Double Din unit to save the cost of including it with the built in CD player.


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (likemypassat)*

I finally got to the dealer today to have them address the HU issue. The short of it is read 6 posts up to Nathanskals post. He hit it on the head. The long of it is...
My HU died Monday. No power, no nothing just intermittent security light. Very intermittent like every few minutes. No "SAFE", just D-E-D dead.








First they tried to pull the radio fuse. Wait 30 seconds, reinsert. Nothing.
Then they tried to pull the fuse in the back of the radio. After some struggle to get the fuse out, 30 seconds out, reinsert...boom it works. Still sounds as bad as it did but it works.
I point out the following to the service advisor and technician:
-bass and midrange knobs crackle in speakers when moved
-FM sounds like the speakers are underwater
-CD sounds worse than the stock stereo in my base Trooper and my old Camry
-Something is amiss with the imaging but I am no audiophile. Sounds that move across the speakers L to R at home don't do that in my car.
The service advisor grumbles something like "I thought was already found all of these." Now we're getting somewhere. He goes further to say "you just named almost the entire list of issues with those bad stereos. We'll order you a new one."
He described a problem as an issue with the early 2002 stereos. He also said the last one he replaced was like night and day. He had to order one for me. I have no ida an ETA but you can be sure I will post back with the result. Night and day sounds good to me!
Forgive me this but
IF YOU ARE STILL SUFFERING THROUGH A BAD D-DIN 2002 STEREO GET THEE TO A DEALER. It's a known problem.
All my best,


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## Satchriani (Jul 17, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

My service department had not heard anything about this till I told him. They still didn't fix it right. I said "no one has called or complained about this?" He says no, this is the first I've heard. Oye, people must be deaf or just plain stupid


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## turbovw18 (Jul 5, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (str8chillin)*

str8chillin... i pulled my seats and i get a crisper sound... but i still hate my monsoon... i got some bass hooked up to it and the sound quality is ass. i just don't like how it sounds or houw the speakers react to the panning / equalizing. 
my solution is... get a new HU in a month or so... video tape me smashing my monsoon on the ground, then to post the video for everyone to enjoy.







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
in about a month


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## rocketweb (Mar 30, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (turbovw18)*

quote:[HR][/HR]
my solution is... get a new HU in a month or so... video tape me smashing my monsoon on the ground, then to post the video for everyone to enjoy.







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif [HR][/HR]​Although I would enjoy seeing you beat the hell out of it, you'd be better off just selling the damn thing on Ebay and getting a few bucks for it. I've seen some go for a hundred or two. Then you can buy some beer or apply it towards your new system or somethin.


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## 1.8turbo (Jul 20, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (rocketweb)*

Add me to the list. My DD is dead as well.


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## daveojeda (Sep 10, 2002)

*Re: 03 jetta with may build date (vmb7)*

Does anyone know for sure if the 2003 Monsoon are fixed. My 03 GTI Monsson sounds like crap!!! http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 03 jetta with may build date (daveojeda)*

I have now had to push my appointment for replacing my '02 DDin HU back to December 7 due to my work schedule and family committments. This was all my choice, Ash Tisdelle VW was willing to be very accomodating. Sorry folks, no answer until then. 
The HU took 2 business days to come to the dealer from the VW parts system. This tells me that the local VAG parts depot did not have them but they were in country, probably NJ or Houston. Houston has a huge VAG parts depot.
Anyhoo, no update until then. Mine has only gone dead that once.


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## jae (Aug 21, 2002)

*Re: 03 jetta with may build date (Niterider)*

if your car has a may build date, then how is it considered a 2003? my gli was made in may of 2002, and it's still considered to be a 2002. 
anyways, i didn't read 28 pages of comments, so pls be nice...








is it possible to detect this problem w/ a vag-com, or do i need to physically pull the head unit to determine this. 
--
responded to wrong person

















[Modified by jae, 4:58 PM 11-25-2002]


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## nathanskal (Jul 25, 2002)

*Re: 03 jetta with may build date (jae)*

jae,
i said that my jetta was build 05/02 but i never said it was an '03. mine is similar to yours, an '02. i didn't know if you were referring to me or not.... 
i didn't see anyone else that listed a build date so that is why i am responding.
nathan


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## jae (Aug 21, 2002)

*Re: 03 jetta with may build date (nathanskal)*

nope, not you. i'm going based on what the subject of the post is - "03 jetta w/ may build date" - i don't know know that is considered to be 2002.
cheers








did your car have this problem - i don't think mine does, but i want to double check. oh - i also think we have the bad window regs. when i had the door panels off, i looked at the parts and they were white. pretty sure those are the plastic ones, right?


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## TA373 (Aug 26, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JUANCA"ELPAPI")*

quote:[HR][/HR]DUDE, I WAS TOLD THAT AN AFTERMARKET DECK PREVENTS THEIR DIAGNOSTIC COMPUTERS FROM WORKING PROPERLY WHEN YOUR CAR IS IN FOR SERVICE OR REPAIRS, AND IF YOU OWN A 2.0, YOU KNOW THAT'S QUITE OFTEN!







[HR][/HR]​Not true. Just don't cut the -K- wire. And stop SHOUTING.


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## flapadlr (Apr 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (TA373)*

OK here it is, the long awaited result of my new D-Din Monsoon head unit!
It's a lot better, but FM still sucks. So does the two 2003's I sat in and tested.
What is better about my new HU:
crackling in bass knob gone
bass response more normalized. Before at about 1 oclock on the button it was pushing the speakers to distortion (this was after the wire swap correction). Now I can crank the bass and it stays clean without too much rattling of car parts (it is a VW after all, some rattling is expected).
Shrillness in midrange is gone. Norah Jones now sounds natural not hot-miked. Essentially the same setting required but it sounds more natural.
I don't need the treble setting nearly as high.
Balance is still somewhat biased toward the passenger side. As we have discussed here this seems to be by design or by acoustics.
Fader: fading rear still does not have the dynamic range of the fronts, but without the ability to isolate the tweeter-mids high up in the doors this must be as designed. With the old HU. fading rear was crackling and distorting.
Sound placement is very good. Strings on guitars come from the tweeter-mids not the mid-bassers in the doors. I can clearly hear them and they sound pretty good.
Dealer is willing to explore amp issues if I am unhappy with the sound still, but I am only unhappy with FM radio quality at this juncture. Service advisor went to great pains to show me that this is not a great sounding FM radio. He did say something to the effect of "people expect sound as good as aftermarket since they paid extra and it's just not the case with this stereo." He was not being a jerk, and he was sufficiently apologetic. I did mention that I didn't just blindly expect it to sound good, I was sold that idea by the sales staff!







He replied with something like "in Service we have to deal with all kinds of sales promises, some we can fix and others we are unable to."
At this point I am not going to go further with this. I recommend to shoppers of these cars that you save the money on the Monsoon. In my case I heard a single DIN early 2002 MOnsoon and was impressed so I made them find me a car with that feature. I have to take some responsibility, too.
That's all for now.


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## GTakacs (May 17, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

bump


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## GRVR6 (Jan 28, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTakacs)*

quote:[HR][/HR]Just FYI a little update on the lawsuit that I have filed against VWofA. Their registered agent has responded to my suit on October 11th, I do not know what they responded but I assume they acknowledged the fact that I am seeking damages.
All in all I will see them in court in front of a judge in about 3 months. I will keep you guys posted how that will go.[HR][/HR]​So, what happened?


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## BryanH (Apr 21, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (flapadlr)*

The only way to really fix your HU is to replace it...tyhe stock one stinks and replacing it won't really help as you are replacing one piece of junk with another. And I just happen to have everything you need.....


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## Kor (Mar 21, 2003)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

Two questions: 
1. Is there a harness for the Monsoon system that allows it to "plug in" to an aftermarket deck? 
2. Do you think its possible to wire the steering wheel controls for the monsoon into an aftermarket deck? I was thinking I could solder them into the "wireless remote" since on my last deck I never used the remote anyhow...


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## Ken93P-GLX (Aug 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Kor)*

Just bought a 03 GTI with the monsoon and man does the FM sound like ass. My friends 00 golf with the single din monsoon sounds great, what hell VW? Major disappointment!


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## Ken93P-GLX (Aug 15, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Kor)*

Just bought a 03 GTI with the monsoon and man does the FM sound like ass. My friends 00 golf with the single din monsoon sounds great, what hell VW? Major disappointment!


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## tcgtivr6 (Apr 24, 2000)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Ken93P-GLX)*

Interesting thread. My 03 GLI with the double-din Monsoon sounds great! FM reception isn't quite as good as the Alpine deck I had in my GTI, but 99% of the time it's fine. It sounds great, staging is excellent, tone controls WORK, nothing rattles (yeah, I must be lucky). I'm very happy with it. It could be that I got very lucky. After all the problems I've read about, I was reluctant to buy the GLI. So far, 7k later (brought it home on May 31st), everything is still awesome. Love the car and the stereo. Now I need the mp3 player (Phatnoise?) for the trunk.








Tom


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## White 1.8T (Jul 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tcgtivr6)*

I had my double-din head unit replaced shortly after I purchased my car about a year ago. I was pleased with the sound improvement but I just got a VAG-COM and am getting "open circuit" error codes on all my speakers that will not clear. They have probably been there since the dealer swapped head units. Someone suggested that my Monsoon head unit was coded incorrectly when it was replaced.
Here is the way my radio is coded now:
Address 56 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 3B7 035 180 
Component: Radio NP2 0007
Coding: *  00401  * 
Shouldn't the coding be as follows:  _ *02041* _  as I have a Jetta, Multi-function steering wheel, Monsoon head unit and no cd changer?
Here is a link to Ross-Tech. http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/cars/vwmkIV.html 
At the end of the page it provides these codes. As you read it, am I correct that my radio code should be *  02041  *?


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (White 1.8T)*

I have a 2002 Jetta with same set up as yours. The correct code for my car is 
*04031* Believe me, I've been through all this crap with the Monsoon and I know that is the correct code. I also have the Bentley manual with the codes. But, if you have a 2003 model Jetta it is possible your codes are different. The manual does not show any codes with an "02" in it, but I have the 2002 manual.
When I had my HU replaced the dealer tried to tell me it didn't need to be recoded. Monsoon wasn't working and they tried to convince me I didn't have it! Buncha BS. Finally had to have a friend with Vag-com do the recoding.


_Modified by MaryP at 8:16 AM 9-10-2003_


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## White 1.8T (Jul 27, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

I did enter the same code as you thanks to some help from the guys at Ross-tech. I ordered the Bentley CD but it is on back order. In the mean time they gave me the correct code and it works now. I can't believe I have been living without the Monsoon programming for a year now!!!


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (White 1.8T)*

Great, glad it worked for you!


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## Jimbob_1000 (Jun 30, 2003)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (MaryP)*

WOW!!!!!!! That's a lot of pages. LOL http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif















JIM


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## rromasko (Aug 8, 2002)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (GTI_FEVER)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GTI_FEVER* »_just get an aftermarket deck. it is so worth the money. It will make your stereo sound better than the monsoon deck will ever be able to

Agreed 100%
I pulled the monsoon system out 3 days after I got the car and sold it for $400.00 on ebay to a bettle owner.
replaced the entire system even the wiring harness.
BYE BYE MONSOON, HELLO ALPINE!


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## KeeperPA (Sep 17, 2003)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vw2.0gti* »_ATTN DOUBLE DIN OWNERS:
PLEASE EMAIL ME WITH THE SUBJECT "VW DOUBLE-DIN"
I WOULD LIKE TO START COLLECTING NAMES AND EMAIL ADDRESSES. I WILL THEN SUBMIT THESE DIRECTLY TO VOLKSWAGEN. IF YOU WANT IT FIXED, PLEASE EMAIL ME, THE SOONER WE GET THIS LIST TOGETHER, THE SOONER THE RADIO WILL PROBABLY BE FIXED.
EMAIL ME AT: [email protected]
THANK YOU.


DOES THIS AFFECT ANY 2003 JETTAs ???
are you still taking emails regarding the newer Monsoon HU's? 
I just upgraded from a 2000 Jetta VR6 with the old Monsoon to a 2003 with the new double-din one. Looks nicer at night, but without a doubt suffers from a severe lack of highs and lows. The older monsoon setup performed MUCH better than this one.

















_Modified by KeeperPA at 5:28 PM 9-27-2003_


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## joesturbo (Jul 19, 1999)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Jimbob_1000)*

After posting when this thread started, Finnally I have convinced my local dealer something was a foul...
They Replaced my head unit and this is the main differance that I have seen. 
1. The control knobs are coted in rubber and not hard plastic like my old deck. 
2. The volume and tuning knobs also have more resistance to turn them and seem to be of higher quality.
3. The bass, treble, fader and balance knobs same as above.
4. The mids and highs seem to be pulled out from under the blanket they have been hiding under.
5. This is the way the system should have sounded like in the first place, bass is MUCH improved.


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## wrongrobot (Dec 10, 2003)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (tcgtivr6)*

tom,
If you want to save some cash, and you don't want voice-attenuated HU-based navigation, you can pick up an auxiliary adapter that either plugs into the CD Changer harness in the back, or one that plugs into the radio and can be routed under the dash. I haven't done the tweak yet, but I will be doing so in January. This way, you can use an RCA to 1/8" miniplug adaptor, and use any HDD player in the car, controlling the input from the player, not the HU. I did this in Ghia using a Blaupunkt HU and it was very handy. 
Blitzsafe has one that seems well received by the installers i've called around to query about it. http://www.logjamelectronics.c....html (the rear) or the v5 for the front. 
thom


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## wrongrobot (Dec 10, 2003)

I have an 04 GTI and my impression of the double-DIN Monsoon has been that overall it sounded very good. I do notice a drop-off in when fading to rear, but assumed that was because the sweet spot is up front. I thought it could maintain highs and lows very well even at higher volumes (granted I only went about 40% on volume, which was more than enough for me) and the tweeters are very responsive, while the woofers are not too boomy for a factory system. 
I did notice after two days that my tweeters were sounding distorted, but since it was in all 4, I suspected it wasn't blown cones, so I took the car in, and the service guys say the right passenger woofer is blown, causing the Monsoon system to overcompensate with the other speakers. This seemed odd since i thought there was a signal limiter that kept the individual speakers from being maxed. Anyway, they're replacing both front speakers next week, and i'll take a listen. Does anyone know if there have been installation problems or double-din Monsoon HU problems reported in 04s so far? I'd like to go back to the service department properly armed, metaphorically speaking, with the straight skinny when we test the system.
thom


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## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

Anyone know if the '04 Double-Din Monsoon HU design has been revised in any way from previous '02 & '03 model years? Anyone have any pictures and/or part #'s of the Double-Din Monsoon HUs comming in the '04 models?


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## wrongrobot (Dec 10, 2003)

I can take a photo for you if you like. Don't have a part number for you YET, but I will when I pull it out. I was told they had fixed the problems of previous years. If that's true, then I'm just not satisfied with the sound quality of this HU.


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## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: (wrongrobot)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wrongrobot* »_I can take a photo for you if you like. Don't have a part number for you YET, but I will when I pull it out. I was told they had fixed the problems of previous years. If that's true, then I'm just not satisfied with the sound quality of this HU. 

Sure, that'd be great! I'm trying to see if I can get my dealer to order me in a 2004 version if it would help improve my current 2002 HU. I asked my service advisor to look into what he can do for me. He also mentioned that refurbished HU units from vw seem to sound better. Perhaps that might be a temporary solution until you finally decide to replace it with an aftermarket HU.


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## wrongrobot (Dec 10, 2003)

I'm told by the dealer service guys that I'm a 'unique' user because I complain about the distortion they claim other customers don't hear. But I replicated the same tweeter fuzz in EVERY 04 in the service lot. So I'm convinced it's a problem with the HUs or just the limits of the fidelity of the Monsoon. It's only triggered by certain frequencies, so you can be listening to electronic music with lots of trebly highs and lots of bass, and it'll sound crystal clear for several tracks, and then a single track will pop up that hits that frequency (not even very high, either) and the fuzz will be distracting. 
For those of you who want to risk being disappointed, do the test on your 02, 03 or even your 04 Monsoon:
Best track: Radiohead- You and Who's Army
If you hear what I hear (and proved to the dealer's people) it will blow your mind how distorted the highs are even at low volumes...


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## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: (wrongrobot)*


_Quote, originally posted by *wrongrobot* »_I'm told by the dealer service guys that I'm a 'unique' user because I complain about the distortion they claim other customers don't hear. But I replicated the same tweeter fuzz in EVERY 04 in the service lot. So I'm convinced it's a problem with the HUs or just the limits of the fidelity of the Monsoon. It's only triggered by certain frequencies, so you can be listening to electronic music with lots of trebly highs and lots of bass, and it'll sound crystal clear for several tracks, and then a single track will pop up that hits that frequency (not even very high, either) and the fuzz will be distracting. 
For those of you who want to risk being disappointed, do the test on your 02, 03 or even your 04 Monsoon:
Best track: Radiohead- You and Who's Army
If you hear what I hear (and proved to the dealer's people) it will blow your mind how distorted the highs are even at low volumes... 


I'm in the same boat as you....hear the same distortion/crackling/etc... I brought a test cd to one of my local dealerships the other day and tested every Double-Din HU in the showroom. Every single one exhibited the same problem as well. The only one I could find that sounded ok was in the Touareg, but it's got a totally different HU all together.
wrongrobot: If you've got the original Radiohead cd or a very good quality copy, try this:
Extract the songs onto your computer into raw wav format & normalize the volume level to like 50% for all songs. A program like Audiograbber should be able to do this very easily. Then burn a new cd using the normalized wav files. Pop the cd into your HU and let me know how it sounds. I did this to one of my cd's and it seemed to sound noticeably better, even when you adjust the HU volume to compensate for the low recording level. It still didn't sound great, but i noticed an improvement.


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## wrongrobot (Dec 10, 2003)

I'll try that when i get back from LA for the holidays.
I have been eager to try the majority of my music with the Monsoon, but unfortunately, I'm in a tight spot: I don't want to buy the Blitzsafe auxiliary adaptor for the Monsoon (to use with my Neuros Audio Computer) for fear of losing another $80 if I didtch the Monsoon altogether. Nonetheless, I've ripped my entire collection to 80% MP3 VBR and would like to hear how some of these different albums sound on it. I'll make a few lossless CDRs reducing the peaks, as you suggested, as well as play a few different lossy formats using a tape adaptor for thr Neuros (I can do a few MP3 grades, some Ogg files, and some WMA files through the Neuros) and see if there's any difference. 
Of course, this is neither here nor there. It's merely a stopgap measure. Reducing the fidelity of your recording by half in order to minimize the distortion in your Monsoon is ludicrously inadequate a long-term solution. As an immediate measure, though, that's a good idea.


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## Wpg1EhTee (Oct 16, 2002)

*How About Non-Monsoon?*

OK, I've been combing through this thread, and looking at all the pictures of wire swaps etc.
But my question is...what if you have a DD-Non Monsoon? This is what I have in my '03 Golf GLS. Right from day one I recognized that the speakers were out of phase. When I took my car in to fix the driver's window that had fallen, I asked them to check the stereo.
They said it was coded incorrectly, and that they recoded it. Sure enough, it sounded better - though still not enough bass, in my opinion. I also have more bass from the right side than the left.
Then yesterday, as I was driving, I noticed the sound quality suddenly switched back to the way it was before. When I went back to the car later, only my tweeters are working. It's going from bad to worse!!!
Anyway, is there any help for a non-monsoon dubber?


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## westcoastjay (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (Wpg1EhTee)*

Added to the list. My car is in the dealer right now. We will see what happens


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## collin gti (Nov 5, 2003)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (westcoastjay)*

I guess i'll ask the question again since it hasn't been answered - are the 03 monsoons wired correctly?


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## Ken93P-GLX (Aug 15, 2002)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (collin gti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *collin gti* »_I guess i'll ask the question again since it hasn't been answered - are the 03 monsoons wired correctly?

Mine is.


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## Dapp (Oct 23, 2003)

*Re: (wrongrobot)*

I have the exact same problem as wrongrobot (distortion at high frequencies), Please help!
Has anyone checked the wiring in the 2004 models?
Where is the amp in the trunk? I can't find it!


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## wrongrobot (Dec 10, 2003)

I asked my technician to check the wiring. Did he, when no faults came through the radio? Not sure.
The amp in my GTI is in the rear, in a compartment to the left.
Add yourself to my Sound Distortion thread over at vdubaddiction if you have time. I'm polling 04 owners about the sounbd problem, for use with VWofA once we can show that it's not a problem unique to me. Here's the addie: http://www.vdubaddiction.com/f...=8526 
Dapp, the techs say the radio is performing "to spec" for what that's worth, and VW has already rejected my greivance claim about it, saying I am a unique case of a user with unreasonable expectations. Having a similar problem, how unreasonable do YOU feel?


_Modified by wrongrobot at 6:15 PM 1-20-2004_


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## MOUH60 (Feb 13, 2004)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

hi..
i'm a FNG...i was reading on another site that one of the speakers on this year dd monsoon stereo is out of phase. the factory erred and crossed two wires. it is a simple wire switch in the back of the stereo. 
have you guys heard of this ?? if you haven'nt let me know and i will find the article and post it. 
thanks, 
dave


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## viper_chan (Sep 16, 2001)

*Re: (viper_chan)*

Well I went ahead and got my HU replaced with a so called "refurbished" one that was supposed to sound much better the other week. I even left a test cd for the tech to try out. I asked them to listen to the cd with my original HU first to clearly hear the distortion I was referring to before they swapped HUs and then again with the new HU.
When I went to pick up my car, they told me that the tech listened to the cd before and after the swap and that it sounded alot better than before. Surprise Surprise......it still sounds like crap.








I hooked up the vag-com to my gti afterwards and found some interesting error codes on the HU.
Control Module Part Number: 3B7 035 180 
Component and/or Version: Radio NP2 0007
Software Coding: 00401
Work Shop Code: WSC 00002
4 Faults Found:
00878 - Connection to Speaker Front Left
36-00 - Open Circuit
00879 - Connection to Speaker Front Right
36-00 - Open Circuit
00880 - Connection to Speaker Rear Left
36-00 - Open Circuit
00881 - Connection to Speaker Rear Right
36-00 - Open Circuit
After a little diagnosis, I determined that the tech that did the swap either didn't bother to check if the refurbished unit was coded correctly for my vehicle (never bother to check for any error codes) or just coded it wrong. It was coded for a non-monsoon setup, so I recoded it to the correct monsoon config. I cleared the error codes and they never came back afterwards, but it didn't seem to have any effect on audio quality.
To top it off, they managed to scuff up the top of my lupo gti shifter knob when they swapped HUs.







Are there any Dealers/Technicians left out there that actually care about the work they do? Is it that difficult to put some effort into doing a good job??








Anyone else have any progress on obtaining reasonable audio quality from the stock HUs? I think I've pretty much given up on whole the situation....can someone recommend a nice aftermarket HU w/ mp3 support? I was thinking maybe something from the Alpine product line...

_Quote, originally posted by *viper_chan* »_
Sure, that'd be great! I'm trying to see if I can get my dealer to order me in a 2004 version if it would help improve my current 2002 HU. I asked my service advisor to look into what he can do for me. He also mentioned that refurbished HU units from vw seem to sound better. Perhaps that might be a temporary solution until you finally decide to replace it with an aftermarket HU.


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## mrx10 (Feb 27, 2004)

*Re: (Dapp)*

Thank God someone else can hear this. I'm a newbie here, so I'm not up on all the issues and ways that a monsoon can be programmed. I just bought an '04 Passat GLS after having an '02 Jetta GLS. THe Monsoon sounded like crap compared to what I was accustomed to in the '02. I took I tback to the dealer and they ordered and installed a new HU. The right rear woofer was also completely dead and they replaced it. The only thing that got fixed is that now I have some bass in the rear. Otherwise, the sound is scratchy on AM/FM and any kind of music just overpowers the tweeters to the point that I have to turn treble and midrange way down. This does not sound anywhere near as good as the unit in the '02. Not sure what to do at this point...I can already tell that the dealer's techs are a bunch of bone-heads. 
What are these codes that I keep seeing in other posts and is there anyway to re-program the HU to use the correct codes?
Thanks for putting up with the ignorant first-timer.


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## MaryP (Jul 27, 2001)

*Re: (mrx10)*

You'll have to find someone with a scan tool to find out what code is entered currently. Then you need to compare your components to the different codes available. There are codes in the Bentley manual, but mine only goes to 2002. I don't know if you have a different radio.
But, for instance, I have Premium VI Monsoon DD head unit, with CD (not CD changer) and steering wheel controls. My code is 04031.


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## botttos (Jun 25, 2003)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (stnley)*

*"mine HU had resistance too putting it back it. i moved the wires into a good position and just crammed it back in (i thought i was going to break it too, but it is fine."*
I had the same problem, the wires are getting pinched in between the radio and the back wall. Try slinding the HU in and out about 3 inches so the wires can wiggle back in where they were originaly. Mine slid in real easy after I did that.


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## m1dalton (Jun 3, 2004)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (botttos)*

my rear speakers sound like crap and I just noticed this when I switch the balance between front and rear. my question is what do i need to do in order to work with the dealer to get this fixed? Thanks


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## melmandc (Oct 22, 2003)

ok i was thiking about buying a dd unit but after this post i might stick with my single din. I was goint to buy the dd from a 03 gti do you think the problem is fixed ?


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## Danny M. (Mar 31, 2004)

*Re: (MaryP)*

Should the coding have any effect on the poor FM performance??? I have an '04 GLI 1.8T and the radio is decent when playing CDs but sounds like the tweeters get disconnected when you listen to FM. Any ideas?


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## voiddweller (Dec 10, 2001)

*Re: (Danny M.)*

VW just replaced my HU with a new one because the FM performance (ie reception, image rejection, etc...) was terrrible. Guess what? This one sucks too... http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif What is it with the cheap Panasonic crap? Granted, they make a decent micro-system for my bedroom, but car audio is not their forte...


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## RABIDRABBIT1983 (May 13, 2003)

*Re: (voiddweller)*

The entire system lacks. The right front speaker blew the other day. The dealers hooked me up a few weeks back so i decided to just get some aftermarket speakers. For $70 the pioneer 3 ways blow the doors off the stock monsoon speakers in my 03 GTI. I already had a box with amp just running the box so i figured why not. I'm not going to fuss with VW warranty. I'm looking for a single din aftermarket Kenwood siruius ready/mp3 unit. I have a sirius kenwood FM tuner/modulator now, but i want to ditch the stock DD for better visibility over the placement of the fm tuner i have now. For $200 you can get some really nice aftermarket headunits. why bother the dealer when theres stuff out there. My cars a Lease BTW and i changed the front speakers myself....it's like all the mods ive done to my lease car. I'll take them off and sell them. What i dont make back i consider cost for added enjoyment while i drive my car. 
I work at a dealer so i guess i just hate being the whiney customer. I'd rather buy superior aftermarket products and improve accordingly.


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## supaflyVeeDubgal (Mar 26, 2004)

*Re: (RABIDRABBIT1983)*

My Monsoon has all the problems described in the 02 Monsoon. Passenger side is louder than driver side, no bass in driver side, radio sounds really really crappy. I've already been to the dealer once and they didn't find anything wrong. It's really driving me crazy, and I will go back to the dealer again. I'm no electronic whiz and I didn't really understand all that you guys mentioned before. My only question is, what should I tell the service guy when I bring i my car? All I said was driver side has no bass last time and they couldn't fix it. What should I tell them this time? Exactly how did you guys fix it? Oh, btw, I have an 04 GTI. Thanks.


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## bigmak (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: (supaflyVeeDubgal)*


_Quote, originally posted by *supaflyVeeDubgal* »_My Monsoon has all the problems described in the 02 Monsoon. Passenger side is louder than driver side, no bass in driver side, radio sounds really really crappy. I've already been to the dealer once and they didn't find anything wrong. It's really driving me crazy, and I will go back to the dealer again. I'm no electronic whiz and I didn't really understand all that you guys mentioned before. My only question is, what should I tell the service guy when I bring i my car? All I said was driver side has no bass last time and they couldn't fix it. What should I tell them this time? Exactly how did you guys fix it? Oh, btw, I have an 04 GTI. Thanks.

hey, sorry if i say something that has already been stated, but my 2002 monsoon dd was made a lot better by fixing the wires in the back of the unit. the front right speaker is out of phase with the rest of the speakers. do people still do this mod? or are you referring to something else? sorry if i sound crazy....


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## supaflyVeeDubgal (Mar 26, 2004)

*Re: (bigmak)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bigmak* »_
hey, sorry if i say something that has already been stated, but my 2002 monsoon dd was made a lot better by fixing the wires in the back of the unit. the front right speaker is out of phase with the rest of the speakers. do people still do this mod? or are you referring to something else? sorry if i sound crazy.... 

I'm actually not sure if my 04 Monsoon is like the 02 Monsoons, but it sure has the same symptoms. I don't think I can fix it myself, so I'm bringing it to the dealer (again). I just don't know how to explain to the dealers so that they can understand my situation. Basically, can you sum up the last 30 pages or so into say.....5 sentences? REally appreciate it! I'm no good when it comes to electronics and stuff.....







All I understand was something about out of phase (which I learned in physics)... lol.


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## supaflyVeeDubgal (Mar 26, 2004)

*Re: (supaflyVeeDubgal)*

help? Someone please help...







it makes me sad just to think about my "broken" Monsoon.


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## bigmak (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: (supaflyVeeDubgal)*

you have a 2004, so i realized my post doesn't apply to you. in the 2002 mkivs (jettas/golfs/gtis), they had two wires switched. but they fixed it by 2004.


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## tedcousens (Sep 17, 2004)

*Re: (Danny M.)*

did you get any relief with your monsoon sysatem? I have a 04 GLI and I need to get my sound on. If you fixed, how did you do it. 
Thanks.


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## supaflyVeeDubgal (Mar 26, 2004)

*Re: (tedcousens)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tedcousens* »_did you get any relief with your monsoon sysatem? I have a 04 GLI and I need to get my sound on. If you fixed, how did you do it. 
Thanks.

No...it still sounds crappy, and the dealer said it's suppose to be like that.


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## sbradley02 (Nov 28, 2004)

*Has anyone only replaced the Monsoon speakers?*

If I understand your post, you still have the stock Monsoon electronics, but have replaced the stock speakers. Is this correct? I went to two car stereo dealers today, who said you can't replace the stock speakers because the stock units are 2 ohm and aftermarket are 4 ohm, and you will blow the amp, the speakers, or both. This makes absolutely no sense, since less current will flow through the output stage with a 4 ohm load. The third dealer said you can replace the speakers, but you won't have enough power to drive them. This at least sounds reasonable, because power output will be lower into 4 ohms (though I don't really care, since I am not a "turn it up to 11" type). 
So basically, I want to find other people who have successfully replaced the stock speakers, and only the speakers.
Then I'll just have to find someone who will do the install, without a lot of BS.
Thanks,
Seth

_Quote, originally posted by *RABIDRABBIT1983* »_The entire system lacks. The right front speaker blew the other day. The dealers hooked me up a few weeks back so i decided to just get some aftermarket speakers. For $70 the pioneer 3 ways blow the doors off the stock monsoon speakers in my 03 GTI. I already had a box with amp just running the box so i figured why not. I'm not going to fuss with VW warranty. I'm looking for a single din aftermarket Kenwood siruius ready/mp3 unit. I have a sirius kenwood FM tuner/modulator now, but i want to ditch the stock DD for better visibility over the placement of the fm tuner i have now. For $200 you can get some really nice aftermarket headunits. why bother the dealer when theres stuff out there. My cars a Lease BTW and i changed the front speakers myself....it's like all the mods ive done to my lease car. I'll take them off and sell them. What i dont make back i consider cost for added enjoyment while i drive my car.


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## Russjameson (Dec 18, 2004)

*Re: Has anyone only replaced the Monsoon speakers? (sbradley02)*

Has anyone else had this problem with their 04 Jetta GLS with the D-DIN Monsoon HU?
I just ordered 2 pairs of the removal tools to check the wiring for myself.
It was said that they fixed the problem by 04 but mine sound like crap.
Let me know if any ones else out there has the same.


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## MasterHD (Dec 18, 2004)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (collin gti)*

I have a 2002 GTI with double-din Monsoon and it seems to be wired correctly. I bought it in July 2002 so that means VW mustv'e fixed the problem pretty fast. I couldn't see any of the pics that UKASSI posted because the links are dead, but i think the wiring is correct because when i use the balance on the rear speakers they sound louder and better when playing together. But the passenger side IS louder than the driver side







and the radio tuner sounds kinda muffled.


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## trbochrgm02 (Dec 11, 2002)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (MasterHD)*


_Quote, originally posted by *MasterHD* »_I have a 2002 GTI with double-din Monsoon and it seems to be wired correctly. I bought it in July 2002 so that means VW mustv'e fixed the problem pretty fast. I couldn't see any of the pics that UKASSI posted because the links are dead, but i think the wiring is correct because when i use the balance on the rear speakers they sound louder and better when playing together. But the passenger side IS louder than the driver side







and the radio tuner sounds kinda muffled.

i sent UKASSI as IM asking for a repost, of the great post he had up a few years back. Hopefully he comes through


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## MasterHD (Dec 18, 2004)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (trbochrgm02)*

Oh cool, thanks man.


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## PSquared (Dec 2, 2004)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (MasterHD)*

I have a 2004 Jetta GLS 1.8t, and I just recently noticed some discrepancies between the sound coming out of my front passenger door and my front driver's side door. When I turn the balance all the way to the left and the fader all the way to the front, there's a huge difference between the two doors. The left side is weak, and muddled, while the right side is working loud and clear (pun intended). I already took the car into the deal once to fix a subtle rattle in the rear right, (which, incidentally, didn't get fixed) and tomorrow I have to take it in again for the new problem. What makes it even worse is that sometimes the front left speakers (or at least the woofer) don't even work at all. There's nothing...it's like I want to a Jenny Craig meeting and told a fat joke. In any case, I'm not exactly sure about what to do, but I want to get the problem resolved, seeing as how I've just bought the car and I want to be able to enjoy it. 
Any ideas on how to handle this sichyashun?
"I never sleep, cuz sleep is the cousin of death..."


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## Seanathan (May 1, 2002)

*Re: How About Non-Monsoon? (PSquared)*

Does anyone still have the pictures of the wires in question? All the threads pictures are down.


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## Hostile (Nov 18, 2001)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vw2.0gti* »_CAN'T PUT IN AN AFTERMARKET DECK IN THE DOUBLE-DIN CONFIG WITHOUT RUNNING EXTENSIVE NEW WIRING. THEY RUN A CAN-BUS CONNECTION, THAT MEANS, NO POWER LEAD, NO POWER-ON LEAD, NO DIMMING. IT IS ALL CONTROLLED BY TWO WIRES COMING FROM THE ECU. A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE PAID $300+ DOLLARS FOR THIS OPTION AND IT SHOULD BE FIXED AND WORKING CORRECTLY WITHOUT BUYING SOMETHING ELSE!


What are you talking about?
I replaced the double-din Monsoon HU in my 2002.5 Jetta...








The only wire I had to run was power and it went straight to the fusebox on the driver's side and it had a connector that humped the wiper fuse.








As for the d-din HU...as has been mentioned there was a problem from the factory where two of the wires in the harness were reversed, mine was fixed before I took delivery and the stereo worked and sounded just fine.


_Modified by Hostile at 11:42 AM 2-15-2005_


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## theskunkwerks (Feb 26, 2005)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

i got the doub-din in my 02 passat,,,is ok....not what id expect for a 700 + dollar option...the fader is sh*tty...the bass control is allmost unnoticeable...i decided immediately to replace it and drop an Alpine into it along with a matched Alpine amp....i had to lay ALL my own wiring,(indipendant power for the head unit,,install all new spkr wiring,and crossovers for the tweeters.it took a weekend to do.and my passat sounds OODLES better!


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## gabedibble (Feb 6, 2003)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (Roboman)*

would this issue affect the US-spec 2004 .:R32?
i'm trying to find out if all MKIV have this problem; would like to fix mine if possible and required.
THANX!


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## actng (Apr 27, 2004)

wow this thread has gone on for 3 years and there's still no solution in sight???
i have a 2004 GTI 1.8T, double din non-monsoon and my left front speakers are lacking also. the dealer is replacing the speakers for me but they havne't gotten them yet.


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## GT-ER (Feb 23, 2005)

*Re: (actng)*

I come from a 98 Grand Prix with the AC Delco 8 speaker system which sounded OUTSTANDING to my new 05 GTI with monsoon double-din with sound only moderate/good. I LOVE my car but the audio has left me wanting more.


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## berniejay23 (Jun 13, 2005)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JUANCA"ELPAPI")*

Don't know if you're still around, but I was wondering if you found an answer to your HU problem. I was told the same thing about my '01 Jetta and can't seem to find anyone that's knows how to install it correctly.
holla


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## berniejay23 (Jun 13, 2005)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (JUANCA"ELPAPI")*

Don't know if you're still around, but I was wondering if you found an answer to your HU problem. I was told the same thing about my '01 Jetta and can't seem to find anyone that's knows how to install it correctly.
holla


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## gbstylez (Apr 6, 2005)

i dont know if this is an issue for mk4 05 gti's but i am somewhat disappointed in the monsoon sound system. i was wondering if this was fixed... and monsoon just sucks.. or do i need to fix it?
if it isnt fixed can we get some of the pictures back up, so maybe i can try to work on this? thanx!


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## [email protected] (Feb 20, 2002)

*Re: (gbstylez)*

It was fixed. All the new cars do not have this problem. The weak likn in the monesoon is the radio. You swap out the radio and it will sound much better.


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## kungfoojesus (Jan 10, 2005)

*Re: (bigmak)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bigmak* »_you have a 2004, so i realized my post doesn't apply to you. in the 2002 mkivs (jettas/golfs/gtis), they had two wires switched. but they fixed it by 2004.

my 2003 had the problem. I switched the wires and a new problem occured.


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## ReDGTI2EnVy (Oct 21, 2005)

*Re: 02 D-Din Monsoon Dealer, VW tech trip Outcome (vw2.0gti)*

can you still file this issue?


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## Unicorn01 (Jun 18, 2006)

*Re: (RABIDRABBIT1983)*

I'm not an audiophile and don't want some really good stereo, so why should I have to pay for something that the manufacturer should have included? I just want a decent stereo. That's what was promised, and it's what I expect.
If I wanted aftermarket, I'd have tried to special order my car with no radio at all.
I'm also not one let the maker get off easy shipping crap. I paid for it, I want what was promised. I shouldn't have to spend even more money as a "fix." Letting manufacturers get away with this crap just encourages them to keep shipping out under-spec, or lower quality items to us in the future, knowing that we'll just go aftermarket anyway.
This nonsense from manufacturers of all types, in all fields annoys the hell out of me.


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## FlyBy (May 27, 2004)

*Re: (Unicorn01)*

I know this is bumping an INSANELY old thread, but I just realized this is the same problem I've been having in my 2002 Jetta Wagon, and my fiance's 2003 Jetta Sedan.
Is there any way to get some pictures back of which wires to swap? TIA!!







http://****************.com/smile/emgift.gif http://****************.com/smile/emlove.gif


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## FlyBy (May 27, 2004)

*Re: (FlyBy)*

Ok, so I just figured this out today and took some shots in case others come here in the future.
Here's some shots of how the wiring should look *after* you change wires.
Note: the only wires that need to be moved are the *Yellow* wire and it's opposing *black* wire. Additionally, i just drove to the dealer and had a service rep pull the head unit for me.
Correct Negative:








Correct Positive: 








Properly Seated Back Into Radio:


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