# Kessy and Keyless Access discussion (was: My loaner is a Phaeton...)



## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*My loner is a Phaeton-- but,*

My baby is in for a few issues- mainly sound system- and they gave me an '05 V8 Phaeton loaner. The car is fine, but it is a stripped model. No upgraded sound, automatic trunk, keyless access, etc. It's amazing how much I miss those things once I don't have them.
The V8 is a very good engine, but not as smooth and quiet as the W12. I also feel the 6 speed is a little jerky compared to my 5 speed, but it's still a helluva car.


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

*The lap of luxury*

Jack,
You don't realize how spoiled you are until you are Phaeton-less or at least W12-less...It could have been worse...like a Ford Expedition!
~PC


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## GripperDon (May 9, 2005)

I "only" have a "Stripped V8" but I still consider myself lucky to have it. 
Plus it is a lot better car than the Mercedes S 430 2001 that I used to have. Please don't be too hard on us V8 owners.
As soon as I get up the nerve I will install the keyless push button start as per Michael. I have a Murano with the intelligent key and it is wonderful. 
I got my Hex+Can from Ross Tech today and Now will down load the software into my Laptop and get rid of those annoying chimes.


_Modified by GripperDon at 12:29 PM 6-13-2005_


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

Don,
If you have a stripped V8 without Kessey (keyless access) I don't think that you can install push button start. The vehicle needs someway to read the active key onboard.
Please see Michael's helpful directions:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1683482
A stripped V8 2005 Phaeton would have 12 way driver and front passenger seats, no cooled seats, no DSP sound system, and no power trunk.

~PC



_Modified by PhaetonChix at 3:15 PM 6-13-2005_


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## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Re: (PhaetonChix)*

To clarify what I said-- I had no intention to run down a V8. It's just that the stripper version lacked some things I was used to. It's amazing how one gets used to things and then will find it difficult to settle for less..


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (GripperDon)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GripperDon* »_I got my Hex+Can from Ross Tech today and Now will down load the software into my Laptop and get rid of those annoying chimes.

Don:
Once you get familiar with using the VAG-COM, please run an 'auto-scan' and send me the results. Just press the 'copy' button when the scan stops running, and paste the results into a text file or word processing file, and email them to me. This will allow us to add the information to our VAG-COM Controller Lists from Phaetons collection, which is very useful for research purposes.
Some general suggestions for new VAG-COM users:
*1)* Always leave the engine running when you are using the scan tool - or, have a battery tender hooked up directly to the vehicle power supply battery, as illustrated here. Running scans will really deplete the battery quickly - super-quickly - because you are energizing every possible system in the car when you are opening controllers. Trust me about this, I learned about it the hard way.
*2) *Never make more than one software change per day. In other words, if you plan to turn off both the seatbelt chime and the key in ignition chime, space these activities out so you allow a day or two - and several trips, ideally about 100 miles or so of driving, between them. By doing this, you will be able to pinpoint the cause of any unexpected changes or problems that might arise as a result of recoding.
*3)* Be sure to save the very first scan that you ever do. This is your 'baseline', it represents how your car came from the factory. You want to have this information so you can revert to original settings if you wish to do so in the future.
*4)* It's OK to clear fault codes, *BUT:* Be fair to your Phaeton technician. Before you clear any fault codes, save the scan that has the record of the fault codes, being sure to note the mileage and the date. Print these records out and keep them in a binder, in chronological order. When you take your Phaeton in for service, leave the binder on the passenger seat, so the Phaeton technician can review the past history of fault codes. This information is very important for the technicians to know.
*5) *Best to leave suspension calibration alone for a few weeks, until you get used to using the scan tool. The suspension calibration process is such that you have to complete it, from start to finish, without any interruptions or errors, otherwise, the calibration will fail and your car will go into 'limp-home' mode.
Michael


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## whealy (Nov 15, 2004)

*Re: (PhaetonChix)*

Slummin' wiht a V-8 Jack. Will wonders never cease???









_Quote, originally posted by *PhaetonChix* »_Don,
If you have a stripped V8 without Kessey (keyless access) I don't think that you can install push button start. The vehicle needs someway to read the active key onboard.


I'm not one to usually challenge PC's comments, but I'm pretty sure every Phaeton has the Kessy necessary for the keyless start mod regardless of keyless entry options. Sorry if I'm confused, but I didn't want Don to run from the mod without as least saying something.

Of course I don't think this is W-12 wood ...










_Modified by whealy at 5:21 PM 6-13-2005_


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

It seems I am in error that the V8's do not have the Kessey module regardless of actually having keyless access. I'm going to defer to Michael on this one.
And that interior shot looks like a 2004 V8, though the 2004 V8 I had had W12 assist handles, Euro Spec glass and a 2005 head unit.
~PC



_Modified by PhaetonChix at 5:32 PM 6-13-2005_


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## Franklin2 (Apr 28, 2005)

*Re: (PhaetonChix)*

I agree, my 2005 V8 has wood-covered cup holders and the wood extends all the way back to the seating area. Plus, I cannot imagine having a smoother gear change than is in my car. Now I really need to drive a w12 sometime. Of course, I don't have to stop at every other gas station when driving in town. So maybe I will just be happy and imagine the smooth power of the W12. 
Larry


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## GripperDon (May 9, 2005)

I was only trying to add a bit of levity to the thread, I really do love my V8 BUT I do wish I had the phone prep kit and the 4 seat interior.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (whealy)*


_Quote, originally posted by *whealy* »_...I'm pretty sure every Phaeton has the Kessy necessary for the keyless start mod regardless of keyless entry options. 

That is a very sharp observation on your part, Whealy. To be honest, I really didn't know the answer myself until I went to the wiring diagrams and the forum library of VAG-COM scans to do the research - if I had to make a guess about it, prior to doing any research, I probably would have voted with PC and said "no Kessy - no start button." But - here's the fascinating part - "no Kessy - no start button" is a truthful statement, however, every single Phaeton ever made has a Kessy in it.
The Kessy module (more properly called the J518 Access and Start Control Module) is the controller at address 05 that does exactly what its name suggests - it's the 'gatekeeper' for the vehicle. As you can see from browsing through the VAG-COM scans, every Phaeton has such a module, and they all appear to be identical, in the sense that there does not appear to be a difference in part number suffix, etc., from car to car on any basis other than normal incremental improvements that take place from year to year.
The picture you posted above is also remarkable. It shows what appears to be a NAR car - this much is evident from the 4 radio control buttons surrounding the volume knob, and the presence of a 'NAV SET' button, which is exclusive to NAR - but, the car has a start button and an airbag control button.
The only external physical differences that I can see between a keyless equipped Phaeton and one without keyless is the exterior door handles - they will have the little buttons on the exterior to lock the car, and capacitance sensors on the inside surface of the handle to detect touch and wake up the car. I think, but am not sure, that the keyless equipped cars also have additional antennas on the exterior and interior (all hidden) to detect the presence of a key. Most likely, the non-keyless start cars won't have the required interior antennas to detect the presence of a key in the driver's pocket... - the only key detection system is that which is built into the ignition key receptacle. 
If the above theory of mine is correct, it means that you could refit a start button to a non-keyless Phaeton - but, the engine and ignition would not be authorized by the J518 to respond to this button being pressed unless a key was detected in the ignition switch.
The first photo below, taken from the Removing the Front Overhead Control Panel thread, shows one of the interior antennas that detects the presence of a key in the cabin. The second photo, taken from the How to replace the J605 Trunk Lid Control Module thread, shows another interior antenna, this one monitors the trunk cavity and area above the hatshelf.
Michael
*Antenna in front of cabin for detecting key*

__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view









*Antenna in trunk compartment for detecting key*
_The antenna is the oval shaped object at the bottom centre of the drop-down panel._


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: (Franklin2)*

I drove both before I bought, and i thought the V8 was smoother off the line and the W12 power was more noticeable above 40 mph. I was going to buy a W12, but I was a little disappointed in that here was really not a big difference and it seemed the amount to spend was not justified for me. (Current road tests have W12 at 5.9, V8 at 6.5 in camparos.) The W12 hesitates a little off the line. Not only is that my experience, but there have been reviews that have stated that as well. (Road and Track and Consumer Guide). Both reviews indicated the V8 felt livelier from a stop.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (dzier)*

Interesting comment, David. I drove both, and I thought the V8 was quicker off the line than the W12. I intended to buy a V8, and wound up with a W12 because my dealer happened to have one in stock, and it had 99% of the options I wanted on the V8 I planned to order. Although I really like the quiet operation of the W12, I envy the fuel economy of the V8.
Michael


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## dzier (Jun 19, 2004)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

The fuel economy is better than I expected...however, with gas proces the way they are... wish it was better...


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## copernicus0001 (Nov 30, 2004)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
... I think, but am not sure, that the keyless equipped cars also have additional antennas on the exterior and interior (all hidden) to detect the presence of a key. Most likely, the non-keyless start cars won't have the required interior antennas to detect the presence of a key in the driver's pocket... - the only key detection system is that which is built into the ignition key receptacle. 
If the above theory of mine is correct, it means that you could refit a start button to a non-keyless Phaeton - but, the engine and ignition would not be authorized by the J518 to respond to this button being pressed unless a key was detected in the ignition switch.


Michael,
Is there a way to verify this?? It would be interesting to retrofit a V8 without keyless access... I really like keyless access, however, I do not have it on the V8... From what you have posted, it sounds like a retrofit may be feasible.... What are your thoughts....
Thanks,
Douglas


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (copernicus0001)*


_Quote, originally posted by *copernicus0001* »_ It would be interesting to retrofit a V8 without keyless access... 

I can check further into it, but I suspect it would be hellaciously expensive. You would need to replace all the door handles, replace the key fobs, install a variety of antennas, and run a heck of a lot of new wires. This would necessitate taking apart all of the doors and removing the rear bumper assembly, not to mention removing the driver seat and front carpet. Then, there is the question of whether or not it would be possible to re-adapt the J518 Access and Start Control Module to the new configuration. Because of the important role that this module plays in ensuring the security of the car, it is 'locked up' pretty tightly via software.
From an academic point of view, it may be possible - though I think that reprogramming the Kessy would be a huge stumbling block. From a practical point of view, I think it would be an unrealistic project to undertake.
Michael


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

Michael,
Thank you for bailing me out on this one. I was wrong about the V8's having the Kessy module even if they were not equipped with Kessy. 
Funny how a simple conversation about features that are standard on a W12 and optional on a V8 can turn into a lively series of posts regarding Kessy. I’m curious to see if you can use a start button on a non Kessey button equipped Phaeton if you leave the key in the ignition. If the unit also has a Tech Package, won't you need to replace the trunk lock assembly too? As I recall, Kessy is integrated into the power trunk feature; just hit the VW emblem with your elbow if your hands are full to open the trunk (if the key is in your purse or pocket)
The Phaeton forum is very lucky to have a technical guru like you. I think the time has come for me to bow out here, I’ve been Phaeton-less for three months and have no access to a “lab” vehicle.
Eve



_Modified by PhaetonChix at 9:43 AM 6-14-2005_


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## whealy (Nov 15, 2004)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

I really didn't think about the kessy "key scan" not being "wireless" without keyless entry. That would seem a little strange to me. I would think all Phaeton's would do this security check the same way. But I Could see keyless entry being leveraged to assist.
I'm not pursing a "start" button in my NSX because the wiring diagram has the reader for the key chip located in the ignition switch. If the range was wide enough I would conisider disengaging the sterring wheel lock (like this prevents theft - except in the case of the Phaeton!) and going with a "start" button. So to me, if that was the way the Phaeton worked, I would not have installed the keyless start.
As for that unique car in the picture ... that's a ...er... mine. Not sure what is unique about it. I actually tried to post a different pic but could not get it to display for some reason. So this one is from the retrofit keyless start thread. I'll post links to wider pics.
http://www.prowleronline.com/s...9.jpg
http://www.prowleronline.com/s...7.jpg
http://www.prowleronline.com/s...7.jpg


_Modified by whealy at 9:33 AM 6-14-2005_


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## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

Michael, what are you doing differently? All of a sudden the pics you post are showing up on my screen!


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## 4meezy (May 24, 2002)

*Re: (Jack Orr)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Jack Orr* »_Michael, what are you doing differently? All of a sudden the pics you post are showing up on my screen!

Those pics aren't "clickable" like he usually post them.


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## chrisj428 (Feb 26, 2005)

*Re: (PhaetonChix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PhaetonChix* »_ I think the time has come for me to bow out here, 

Perish the thought!


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## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Re: (chrisj428)*

I just discovered the window sticker of my loaner V8 in the glove box.
The car has zero options!
I would think the dealer would have great difficulty in reselling this car.


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

Even a stripped out V8 Phaeton is still a well equipped, lovely driving and handling vehicle. It actually is a great loaner/demo vehicle...it encourages people to order the well equipped car they want.
Just my opinions...
~PC


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## Jack Orr (Mar 15, 2000)

*Re: (PhaetonChix)*

Makes sense, Chix--


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## copernicus0001 (Nov 30, 2004)

*Re: (whealy)*

Whealy...
Nice pictures...
Would you answer a couple of questions about your vehicle to help clarify its functionality.
1. Am I correct in assuming that the photos are of your V8 --- and you installed the keyless start modification that Michael describes elsewhere in the forum??
2. Do you need to place the key in the ignition to start the vehicle?? Or does the vehicle recognize the key's proximity - You just need to press the button while the key is in your pocket??
3. Did you perform any other modifications (other than in Michael's keyless start post) to obtain the functionality described your answer to #2.
Thanks William.... 
Nice job on the mod....

Douglas

P.S. isn't it interesting how some of these threads evolve into something totally unexpected.


_Modified by copernicus0001 at 1:19 PM 6-14-2005_


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## PhaetonChix (Dec 16, 2004)

Whealy's V8 is equipped with Kessy, the black buttons on the door handles. He confirmed this for me in an IM. Because the vehicle has Kessy, as long as the key is in your pocket, purse or elsewhere in the vehicle, the push button start will work.


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## whealy (Nov 15, 2004)

*Re: (copernicus0001)*

Douglas,
I take no credit for the mod. Without Michael's help, I would never have attempted this. You asked about complexity. I would say that this was perhapse the most complicated mod I have ever attempted on a vehicle. That being said, if I bought another Phaeton at some point, I would do this again.
So the answer to questions 1 is yes.
PC answered question 2 as I would have.
As for question 3, no, Michael's thread describes all that is needed.
Hope that helps. BTW - others have done this mod as well. Several have posted in Michael's thread describing the steps.


_Modified by whealy at 2:55 PM 6-14-2005_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (whealy)*

Wow. A lot of new and interesting stuff is turning up in this discussion. Let me try to address some of the points that have been made in the last day:
*PC wrote:* _"I'm curious to see if you can use a start button on a non Kessy button equipped Phaeton if you leave the key in the ignition."_ I think you mean 'non-keyless entry equipped', rather than 'non-Kessy equipped'. As we both discovered yesterday, every Phaeton has a Kessy, or, to call it by its proper name, a J518 Access and Start Control Module. (I guess it must be manufactured by a company named Kessy - I do agree that's less of a mouthful than the proper name).
I can't see any reason why a start button would not function in a non-keyless Phaeton, provided the key had been put in the ignition and it was, in fact, an authorized key. As far as I can tell, all that the start button does is provide the same signals to the Access and Start Control Module as the ignition switch does - it indicates that the driver wants to turn the ignition on, engage the starter, or turn off the engine. It is, of course, quite possible that the ignition switch does not poll the key for authorization until the key is twisted - and if that is the case, then a start button (something that is, for the most part, a duplicate of the ignition switch) would not work. But, in theory, it could be possible. It would be kind of a silly mod, though, because it would increase workload, rather than decreasing workload. You would have to put the key in the ignition, then move your hand elsewhere and push the start button. Not to mention remembering to remove the key from the ignition switch when you want to leave the car.
Let me qualify all this by stating that it is an abstract, theoretical discussion, not one that is directed towards actually trying out this modification.
*Whealy wrote:* _"I really didn't think about the Kessy "key scan" not being "wireless" without keyless entry."_ That's an understandable confusion, given that Phaetons with and without keyless entry both pass radio signals between the key fob and the vehicle. The key difference between cars with and without the keyless entry option, though, is what component initiates the radio signal.
If a car *does not *have keyless entry, then the *key fob initiates *the radio signal when the driver pushes the button on the key fob to send the remote unlocking signal to the car. This is the same as how most cars made in the last 10 years work - I think just about every car sold now has remote unlocking. When you put the key in the ignition hole, the ignition switch assembly polls a tiny transponder in the key, to make sure that it is, in fact, an authorized key. If the key passes the test, then twisting it will start the car. 
If the car *does *have keyless entry, then the *car initiates *the radio signal to poll the area for the presence of a key, in response to someone touching a door handle or pressing the button on the trunk lid. The same process is repeated when the driver presses the start button to turn on the ignition or start the car, and the same process is repeated when the driver exits the car and presses the little button on the door handle to lock the car. The engine can be turned off via the start button without the presence of an authorized key, but the car cannot be locked without the presence of an authorized key.
This brings to mind two very interesting bits of "Phaeton trivia":
*1) *The teeth cut into the key bit are not used by the ignition switch to identify and authorize the key. You could, if you want, stick a Popsicle stick into a Phaeton ignition switch, and it would work - meaning, you could twist the switch left and right, same as you could if you stuck the key in the switch. Nothing would happen, though, unless the Popsicle stick happened to have an authorized transponder attached to it.
*2)* If you use the key bit to unlock the driver door on your Phaeton - rather than using either the remote unlock button on the key fob (any Phaeton), or touching the door handle and using the keyless entry feather (Phaetons that have keyless entry), then you must stick the key in the ignition and turn the ignition on within 15 seconds of opening the door, otherwise, the theft alarm will go off. The lock cylinder in the driver door is an 'old fashioned' one - it recognizes the pattern cut into the teeth of the key bit, and only lets keys with matching teeth open the door - but it does not have a key authorizing system built into it. This is exactly the opposite of the ignition switch, which uses a transponder to recognize and validate the key, and pays no attention to the teeth on the key bit.
The primary difference* between a car with keyless entry and a car without keyless entry (forget about start buttons for the moment) is installation of a whole bunch of antennas all over the car that poll for the presence of a key. I have posted an illustration below that shows all these antennas. (* There are secondary differences in some markets - for example, in Europe, if you don't order keyless entry, you may not get interior monitoring, and you may not get an anti-theft alarm system.)
*Jack wrote:* _"Michael, what are you doing differently? All of a sudden the pics you post are showing up on my screen!"_ Ah-ha - most interesting. I formatted the code to display the above photos quickly and simply, just by typing in the URL of the photo, and encasing it with tags to indicate that it was a photo. This causes the photo to appear, but the photo is not 'clickable', in the sense that you can double click on it and go directly to the location on the photo server where the photo resides.
Normally, I use a slightly more complex type of formatting that encases the formatting code used for an image, which is [IMG], within the formatting code that is used for a hyperlink, which is [URL]. Doing it this way causes the photo to appear in the thread and also makes it double-clickable.
If anyone else has had trouble viewing photos - any photos - that I have posted, please let me know and I will change the way I format my posts. Jack, I am pretty sure that the problem you are having viewing my pictures is caused by either anti-spyware or ad-blocking software installed on your computer, or your web browser security settings. What is happening is that your security is such that is not allowing the Vortex web page to go outside of Vortex to another server (in my case, hostdub.com) to fetch the picture and display it within the post. My guess, if I had to bet money on it, is that ad blocking software is the culprit - it thinks that the Vortex web site is going to hostdub.com to fetch an advertisement, not a picture that you want to see.
[B]PC wrote:[/B] [I]"I think the time has come for me to bow out here..."[/I] No, no, please don't. You are a good friend, a kindred spirit, and a source of wisdom and good advice. All of us can appreciate that your current workload may not allow you to participate as much as you have in the past, but - please don't go. (Hmmm... wasn't there a song with lyrics like that - "please don't go?" Geez, I'm getting all teary-eyed).
[B]Douglas[/B] asked some questions about the start button retrofit for Phaetons that have keyless access, which is documented at [URL="http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1683482"]this post[/URL]. Douglas, it's not a 'complex' modification, in the sense that you have to do really complicated things, it's more of a 'time-consuming' modification, in the sense that you have to do a lot of things, all of which are fairly simple, but require time and a certain amount of patience. If you are thinking of retrofitting a keyless start button to your Phaeton (a Phaeton that already has keyless access), by all means, order the necessary parts, and go ahead and do it. If you are a little apprehensive about the level of disassembly required, just call your VW dealer, and perhaps make arrangements to use one of their service bays while you complete the modification. That way, you have access to experts in case you run into any problems, or are not sure how to do a certain task.
My VW dealer always invites me to come up to the dealership and use an empty service bay whenever the service department staff get wind that I am planning another modification or retrofit (the parts department staff can see it coming when I start ordering uncommon parts). I think their primary motivation is good old fashioned courtesy and friendliness - they don't want to see me get stuck halfway through a project - but, there is a certain amount of curiosity on their part, they want to see how the retrofit is done, and I think they enjoy having a fellow VW enthusiast in the shop for a day or so every now and then.
Once you have installed the start button, the key never leaves your pocket. In fact, you don't even have to touch the key to open or start the car, you just need to have it on your person.
Michael

[B]Additional Antennas needed for Keyless Entry[/B]
Note that the reception range of the interior and exterior antennas does not overlap. There are two different and distinct zones - inside and outside.
[IMG]http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae275/Paneuropean/KeylessAccessAntennas.jpg


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## chrisj428 (Feb 26, 2005)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_As we both discovered yesterday, every Phaeton has a Kessy, or, to call it by its proper name, a J518 Access and Start Control Module.

Just to split a hair - the J518 is indeed the Access & Start Control Module. KESSY is the trade name for the technology used by the door handles & interior antennas to detect the keys and someone wishing to open a door. The operation of KESSY is controlled by J518.







There you go -- clear as mud!


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## copernicus0001 (Nov 30, 2004)

*Re: (PhaetonChix)*

PC...
Thank you... This clears things up... I assumed that Bill's V8 did not have keyless access...

Michael...
Thank you for your time and effort creating such a comprehensive post! 
The only thing you left out is a link for PC: Baby, Please Don't Go


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_Wow. A lot of new and interesting stuff is turning up in this discussion. Let me try to address some of the points that have been made in the last day:............

This is an interesting topic and one that I had considered for V6 Touareg models a while back without coming to any final conclusion. One issue I saw was that there are 4 or 5 different versions of the J518 module listed in the parts catalog. What the difference is for each of these versions is unknown to me. Perhaps it is the "keyless" ability? 
On the Touareg forum we have a thread where owners can list VAGCOM output. Aside from one German V10 owner, a Greek V6 owner and a UK R5 owner, I noticed that all V6 models (which do not have "keyless" option), have the K version of J518. The V8 and V10 models have the M version of J518 (except one V8 with an R version). This information leads me to believe that the K version of J518 would not support any keyless features, even if they were installed.
However, the next question would be; is it possible to substitute the M version of J518 AND add the driver's side door handle with antenna and one interior antenna so that you could add keyless start? This wouldn't be nearly as expensive as adding ALL the external and internal antennae but still give you most of the keyless capability.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (spockcat)*

Hi Jim:
I'll try to do a little research on this in the next week.
I think that as far as these access and start control modules go, they have the capability to do a whole lot of things, but the big stumbling block will be the need to re-code or re-adapt the module. For very good reasons, VW has that module locked up pretty tightly. We can add start buttons to vehicles that don't have them, because the vehicles are already coded to work with the start button - VW just doesn't install the button on the NAR Phaetons and Touaregs. But, if we want to make significant changes to the vehicle configuration, then I think we will come up against a requirement to re-code or re-adapt, and that is where we might hit a brick wall.
Concerning your observation that all V6 vehicles have K suffix controllers - could that just be coincidental, in the sense that the V6 vehicle was a late introduction to the NAR product line, and therefore has newer components? This is the case with the V6 Phaetons, which were not introduced in Europe until late last year. I think the proof or disproof of this would be to look at the controller suffix on a very recent production V8, V10, or W12 Touareg.
Michael


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## spockcat (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PanEuropean* »_
Concerning your observation that all V6 vehicles have K suffix controllers - could that just be coincidental, in the sense that the V6 vehicle was a late introduction to the NAR product line, and therefore has newer components? This is the case with the V6 Phaetons, which were not introduced in Europe until late last year. I think the proof or disproof of this would be to look at the controller suffix on a very recent production V8, V10, or W12 Touareg.
Michael

I think you are misunderstanding my Touareg V6/V8 observation. NAR Touareg V6 models do not have keyless access as an option. Thus, the observation is that non-keyless access models use the K version. Keyless access models use the M version on the Touareg.
While I'm not the Phaeton expert, it appears that NAR Phaeton V8 models can have keyless access as an option. Looking at your thread on VAGCOM readouts for Phaetons, I noticed that NAR V8s that don't seem to have keyless access used the same K version used on the NAR V6 Touareg, which doesn't have keyless access. The V8s and W12s that do have keyless access used the same M version of J518. The ROW cars used completely different versions. 
So I am pretty sure the one conclusion you can draw here is that any attempt to add some of the keyless features to any Phaeton or Touareg would require the M version of J518.
One other thing that I forgot to mention in my first post here is that you will also need new keyfobs as the keyfobs for car with keyless access have a different part number than those without keyless access. I assume that these keyfobs broadcast some signal that the non-keyless access keyfobs do not.
As for recoding, on the NAR Touareg it seems pretty clear that the K version uses 232 as the coding and the M version uses 131304 as coding. Your Phaeton VAGCOM scans seem to be less consistant. So I wouldn't draw any conclusion without a lot more scans.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (spockcat)*


_Quote, originally posted by *spockcat* »_So I am pretty sure the one conclusion you can draw here is that any attempt to add some of the keyless features to any Phaeton or Touareg would require the M version of J518.

Hi Again Jim:
I appreciate your expertise here - I think you are correct in your analysis, above.
I had a look at the various (Phaeton) coding options for the J518. These are contained in the VAG-COM label file for the Phaeton Access and Start Control Module, which is 3D0-909-135.lbl. These files can be opened and viewed with any text editor, for example, Notepad. 
When I wrote that label file, I only included the coding strings that I thought would be needed by NAR and European users, there are additional strings for Asia. The most common coding strings are as follows:
0133356 = USA + Keyless access + 5 speed transmission, W12 engine
0137452 = USA + Keyless access + 6 speed transmission, V8 engine
0002280 = USA + Central locking and remote control but no keyless + 5 speed transmission
0006376 = USA + Central locking and remote control but no keyless + 6 speed transmission
0213228 = Rest of World + Keyless access + 5 speed transmission + left hand drive vehicle
0218348 = Rest of World + Keyless access + 6 speed transmission + left hand drive vehicle
0004328 = Rest of World + Central locking and remote control but no keyless + 6 speed transmission + left hand drive vehicle
0000232 = Rest of World + Central locking and remote control but no keyless + 5 speed transmission + left hand drive vehicle
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

Photos re-hosted.
Michael


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

Photos re-hosted.

*Archival Note: * See also this discussion about repair of the Access and Start Controller: Repairing the Access and Start Controller (controller 07) - resolving antenna 'open circuit' faults.

Michael


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