# Timing Chain TSB



## volksccsport (Apr 15, 2014)

OK OK OK. Soo... I have read everything on the internet (I'm pretty sure), and I'm not sure if this issue is being taken extremely light or if I'm overreacting. But, from reading all of this information on this issue and TSB, I'm getting a really uneasy feeling in my gut. Even though I haven't seen many threads in the cc section if at all, I have seen countless Golfs and Even audi TT's with this problem. Is this tensioner going to eventually claim all of our beloved VW's? or is this thing over hyped in those Golf forums ive been reading? anyone on here have their tensioner fail? 

I wouldn't put so much concern on this issue if this was a non-interference engine but driving a car with a defect that can mean one minute you have an awesome car and the next you have car ready for the junk yard is a pretty hard pill to swallow. i know this is an old issue that has been covered many times but I don't think the proper amount of urgency has been taken if it means that at 60001 miles my car can literally destroy itself from the inside out and I'm left with a car note and a very nice looking pleather couch. 

eh, I'm probably over reacting but it seems like we are driving a ticking time bomb here. and I for one don't have 8000 to spend on a car that is worth 12... 

What do the cc owners think of this? should we all be worried or should I take my tinfoil hat off? 

END RANT:beer::beer::beer:


----------



## 10CC (Oct 6, 2010)

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?7072229-Aand-timing-chain-tensioner-fail


----------



## GlowinPassat (Mar 6, 2003)

Mine failed at around14k miles on my 2010 lux. Dealer covered it under warranty after trying to get me to pay.


----------



## Cnyman (Jun 13, 2011)

*Keep the hat on...*

My 2013 CC R-Line is at the dealership under warranty having the head replaced for low compression on cyl 3. (They or I have no idea why, but that is a story for another post). Anyway, I asked them to identify what the part number is on the existing tensioner. The treated me like a freak but eventually complied. They verified that it is not the part number called for in the current parts lookup for the engine which is 06H 109 467 AE. When I get the old one back I will report that number here. I am paying for the part only since they have the entire system apart to get the head off. 

Bottom line is: As others have stated, this is a ticking time bomb that can be diffused by an 84.00 part. (and a lot of labor). Here's a decent DIY on the subject

http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55992

P.S.

I just "threw away" a 2005 Audi A6 3.2 that ate some valves due to tensioner issues (piss poor design, and if you are the audi engineer responsible for this part, I will personally punch you in the face). Probably lost 10,000 dollars on the car as the cost to rebuild it was more than it was worth.


----------



## volksccsport (Apr 15, 2014)

Cnyman said:


> My 2013 CC R-Line is at the dealership under warranty having the head replaced for low compression on cyl 3. (They or I have no idea why, but that is a story for another post). Anyway, I asked them to identify what the part number is on the existing tensioner. The treated me like a freak but eventually complied. They verified that it is not the part number called for in the current parts lookup for the engine which is 06H 109 467 AE. When I get the old one back I will report that number here. I am paying for the part only since they have the entire system apart to get the head off.
> 
> Bottom line is: As others have stated, this is a ticking time bomb that can be diffused by an 84.00 part. (and a lot of labor). Here's a decent DIY on the subject
> 
> ...


thanks for the info. I might just have to do this diy since im pretty experienced in rebuilding transmisions and other simple swaps. only problem is i live in a pretty strict apartment complex and would have to do this at night when no one could see and complain.. ah the perils of being broke..


----------



## Cnyman (Jun 13, 2011)

volksccsport said:


> thanks for the info. I might just have to do this diy since im pretty experienced in rebuilding transmisions and other simple swaps. only problem is i live in a pretty strict apartment complex and would have to do this at night when no one could see and complain.. ah the perils of being broke..


First off, good thought to DIY. Bad plan to try it in a parking lot, in the dark. There is way too many critical items to be dealt with poor lighting that could mess you up. Also, read the DIY through a few times and get the special tools required. The penalty for screw up on this is pretty severe. (just saying)

Anybody on the forum willing to help this Bro out with this? Somebody in the Palm Beach area that has at least have a driveway you could use?

Post in the golf6 forum asking for help with the project. I am guessing that there is someone that would be game to help you out with the project for some beer or the use of your girlfriend for the evening...(kidding).


----------



## zb44 (May 24, 2014)

my tensioner went out at 66,750 miles. out of powertrain warranty and no extended. since 52k ive gotten two intake manifolds ( covered to 120) 2 fuel injectors ( covered to 120) a new hpfl, water pump, so it was a tough pill to swallow that i could be facing catastrophic engine failure when i do my oil changes ever 5-7. but i filed a claim with VWoA and it was a back and forth game, saying at first not covered. then i eventually got them to pay for 50% of the cost. 1200$ this is a guideline i pieced together while i was on the phone with Vwoa..


----------



## volksccsport (Apr 15, 2014)

zb44 said:


> my tensioner went out at 66,750 miles. out of powertrain warranty and no extended. since 52k ive gotten two intake manifolds ( covered to 120) 2 fuel injectors ( covered to 120) a new hpfl, water pump, so it was a tough pill to swallow that i could be facing catastrophic engine failure when i do my oil changes ever 5-7. but i filed a claim with VWoA and it was a back and forth game, saying at first not covered. then i eventually got them to pay for 50% of the cost. 1200$ this is a guideline i pieced together while i was on the phone with Vwoa..


This is the stuff off nightmares. It sucks that you have to jump through so many hoops to try and get some help. At least they paid for half.


----------



## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

volksccsport said:


> This is the stuff off nightmares. It sucks that you have to jump through so many hoops to try and get some help. At least they paid for half.


True, BUT if you're out of warranty & there's no recall.....what obligation do they have to do anything for you?
None


----------



## volksccsport (Apr 15, 2014)

snobrdrdan said:


> True, BUT if you're out of warranty & there's no recall.....what obligation do they have to do anything for you?
> None


That's the legal crap they hide behind. If that tensioner breaks and your car bites the dust it's clearly a defect. But since not enough people complain they say " screw you pay me". I'm just not with the whole warranty sympathizing thing. of course I understand the need of a warranty. things are not expected to last forever, BUT a defect like this witch is a DESIGN flaw not manufacturing I feel it should be extended, or at least if it does happen within reasonable mileage and can prove services to VW's standards then it should be paid for by VW. I just think its poor etiquette for them to tell you "yea we know its defective but its too bad we aren't legally obligated to help you, bye bye". even though I saw a forum in the UK where VW paid for 100% labor and something like 50 to 70% labor out of warranty, that I believe is the absolute correct action to take. own up to your mistakes and help out your loyal customers. if you believe they are correct in telling you to hit the bricks I think that's just wrong. 

I think these companies using legal precedence to tell you oh well is utter BS. but then again im still under warranty so :beer::beer:eace:


----------



## Rum83 (Apr 14, 2012)

I have a 2011 Sport MT. Which I bought CPO at 38k miles. My tensioner failed at 41k. It was replaced at no charge under warranty. I was told that I was lucky it didn't damage any valves. I spoke with the technician that worked on my car. He said it is a fairly common issue but he hadn't seen any that caused damaged valves even though it is possible. Carbon cleaning is next up. Hope to take care of that next weekend.


----------



## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

volksccsport said:


> That's the legal crap they hide behind. If that tensioner breaks and your car bites the dust it's clearly a defect. But since not enough people complain they say " screw you pay me". I'm just not with the whole warranty sympathizing thing. of course I understand the need of a warranty. things are not expected to last forever, BUT a defect like this witch is a DESIGN flaw not manufacturing I feel it should be extended, or at least if it does happen within reasonable mileage and can prove services to VW's standards then it should be paid for by VW. I just think its poor etiquette for them to tell you "yea we know its defective but its too bad we aren't legally obligated to help you, bye bye". even though I saw a forum in the UK where VW paid for 100% labor and something like 50 to 70% labor out of warranty, that I believe is the absolute correct action to take. own up to your mistakes and help out your loyal customers. if you believe they are correct in telling you to hit the bricks I think that's just wrong.
> 
> I think these companies using legal precedence to tell you oh well is utter BS. but then again im still under warranty so :beer::beer:eace:


It sucks, but it's all on a case by case basis is the problem too....that is until (IF) they issue a recall

Out of warranty.....some people get help, some don't. So I just meant to consider yourself lucky that you did get SOME help

Some people just pay $4-6k or whatever for a used/replacement engine instead, since they don't know any better & that's what they're told they need by the dealer....crazy


----------



## ebk305 (Aug 11, 2013)

My tensioner failed on me at 70k  which i had to pay out of pocket ... that being said i would never buy another junk vw again this car has given nothing but probems it has eletrical bugs  ugghhh what a piece of crap i got my self into i wish i didnt dump so much money in to this crap....

the end of my rant ...........


----------



## jd14 (Apr 10, 2013)

ebk305 said:


> My tensioner failed on me at 70k  which i had to pay out of pocket ... that being said i would never buy another junk vw again this car has given nothing but probems it has eletrical bugs  ugghhh what a piece of crap i got my self into i wish i didnt dump so much money in to this crap....
> 
> the end of my rant ...........


I plan to keep my CC until the powertrain warranty runs out - which looks like I'll be hitting the 60k before the 5 years. So, it looks like I might get another 2 years of enjoying the car.


----------



## ebk305 (Aug 11, 2013)

Yes sir that's the smartest thing to do mines needed the intake manifold at 62k :facepalm:


----------



## volksccsport (Apr 15, 2014)

snobrdrdan said:


> It sucks, but it's all on a case by case basis is the problem too....that is until (IF) they issue a recall
> 
> Out of warranty.....some people get help, some don't. So I just meant to consider yourself lucky that you did get SOME help
> 
> Some people just pay $4-6k or whatever for a used/replacement engine instead, since they don't know any better & that's what they're told they need by the dealer....crazy


So how about you? Are you rocking the old tensioner without an extended warranty?


----------



## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

volksccsport said:


> So how about you? Are you rocking the old tensioner without an extended warranty?


See sig

I have a '14 Passat V6 and a '13 Tiguan (TSI) with only 22k miles on it....unsure if the Tig has the old tensioner or not, but it's a lease and we won't be keeping the car that long (the family is getting bigger)


----------



## Ghernz (Sep 8, 2012)

*TSB?*

Sounds like I am having the same problem with my 2011 CC 2.0 TSI with 52K miles. This morning had a hard time keeping the RPM up at stop light. I had to hold the brake and keep the RPM up to keep it from stalling. Got home and have the following codes: P0011, P0016, P0300, P0301, P0302, P0303 and P0304. 

So TSB 15 12 01 calls out 2008-2013 VW 2.0 with code CCTA or CBFA. Where do I find engine code? It also looks like power train warranty is 5 yr 60K miles. I should be covered for this repair by dealer correct?

My dealer is about 8 miles away. Should I drive it there? Only problem I am having right now is keeping the engine from stalling at the stop lights. Once the car gets moving I don't having any problems.

Thanks,

George


----------



## Rum83 (Apr 14, 2012)

Ghernz said:


> ..... Where do I find engine code?..... My dealer is about 8 miles away. Should I drive it there? Only problem I am having right now is keeping the engine from stalling at the stop lights. Once the car gets moving I don't having any problems.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> George


For the engine code, you can look towards the side of the engine block on the passenger side of the car. If it says CBF its CBFA. Also if you see a hose leading from your airbox behind the driver's side headlight its a CBFA.

As far as driving. You have been driving it like that already but it's up to you if you want to take the risk. It might make it but there is still a risk of engine damage.


----------



## Jhawkcclux (Mar 10, 2011)

I hate reading these kind of threads, just makes me nervous when I'm driving. So if you have tune (APR stage 1) is there any chance they cover this problem under power train warranty? I'm not having issue, just a little worried. Thanks


----------



## Ghernz (Sep 8, 2012)

Rum83 said:


> For the engine code, you can look towards the side of the engine block on the passenger side of the car. If it says CBF its CBFA. Also if you see a hose leading from your airbox behind the driver's side headlight its a CBFA.
> 
> As far as driving. You have been driving it like that already but it's up to you if you want to take the risk. It might make it but there is still a risk of engine damage.


I couldn't find engine code. I could only find white sticker on cover, but it didn't have code only serial #. I did see hose coming out of air box on drivers side. Will take to dealer and see what they tell me.


----------



## Ghernz (Sep 8, 2012)

This is what it sounds like. 

https://vimeo.com/120698629


----------



## Rum83 (Apr 14, 2012)

Ghernz said:


> I couldn't find engine code. I could only find white sticker on cover, but it didn't have code only serial #. I did see hose coming out of air box on drivers side.


It says CCT on the sticker as far as I can make out but the CCTA does not have the secondary breather. Take a pic of your airbox when you can.


----------



## Ghernz (Sep 8, 2012)

Rum83 said:


> It says CCT on the sticker as far as I can make out but the CCTA does not have the secondary breather. Take a pic of your airbox when you can.


Is CCT part of TSB. Here is pic of airbox


----------



## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

Ghernz said:


> So TSB 15 12 01 calls out 2008-2013 VW 2.0 with code CCTA or CBFA. Where do I find engine code? It also looks like power train warranty is 5 yr 60K miles. I should be covered for this repair by dealer correct?


*ALL* 2.0T CC's will be either CCTA or CBFA (in North America)...you're either one or the other, but both are under that TSB so it doesn't matter


Have you had the valves cleaned on your car? It's not listed as a maintenance item, but something that still needs to be done or else the car idles rough/misfires:
http://www.deutscheautoparts.com/newsarticle.aspx?NID=45

Or it could be something simple as spark plugs & coil packs, which are cheap & another maintenance item on these VW's

Or it could be a faulty intake manifold (covered under warranty)


----------



## CC'ed (Dec 1, 2009)

snobrdrdan said:


> *ALL* 2.0T CC's will be either CCTA or CBFA (in North America)...you're either one or the other, but both are under that TSB so it doesn't matter
> 
> 
> Have you had the valves cleaned on your car? It's not listed as a maintenance item, but something that still needs to be done or else the car idles rough/misfires:
> ...


Or a failed diaphragm in the PCV unit, which causes a significant vacuum leak, and an uncontrollable idle speed.


----------



## Ghernz (Sep 8, 2012)

The dealer called and said they thought it was the spark plugs and coil packs. They said I should change those and then they would check for codes again. If that didn't clear them the said it was probably a bad fuel injector. Only the fuel injector would be covered under 5yr/60k miles. 

I still believe it's the tensioner but we will see. When I checked the codes it showed all 4 cyl misfiring. They said they only had 2 cyl misfire.


----------



## lowpassat (Jul 15, 2008)

happened to me just last week.

They changed the intake, cleaned the valves and fix the tensionner wich had a guide broken.

All covered under warranty, appart from the valve cleaning


----------



## Ghernz (Sep 8, 2012)

So I just got a call back from dealer and they tell me it needs a timing chain tensioner. Big surprise I mentioned the TSB 15 12 01 to the service manager and he didn't think that was the problem. Now I have to pay $500 for new plugs and coils that they thought was the problem.


----------



## Ghernz (Sep 8, 2012)

Update: a couple of days ago the dealer asked me for oil change receipts. They said lack of service can cause these to fail! I sent them what I had and waited. They needed to get with VW for approval. I asked them what about the TSB's that have been issued and the new replacement part having a new design? He said that was mainly in older models 09-10 and that they hadn't seen much on 11. Long story short they finally called me back yesterday and said VW was going to repair under warrant, but they would not cover replacement of spark plugs and coil packs (~$500).


----------



## snobrdrdan (Sep 10, 2008)

Ghernz said:


> spark plugs and coil packs (~$500).


That's only ~$130 in parts _(the better/upgraded parts too)_ 

http://www.ecstuning.com/Volkswagen-CC-FWD-2.0T/Maintenance/Engine/Ignition/ES2539447/


----------

