# 2.5L Twin Turbo??



## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

So, I was throwing this idea around with the recent release of the C2Motorsport staging Turbo, and I got to thinking. What if you could make a ported Header set, or a cyl head delete Header set, and make a Twin Turbo set? I know this would require a massive amounts of time and effort, and in the end it might not even be worth it. I know the 2.5L have a good Torque / HP ratio and they are quick off the line and they have good top end, but what if it is possible to set it up for the TT to give you more lower end, and then just N/A , port and polish the PC, blueprint the block, and all that for the top end. To be honest I'm looking at it from the angle that I wanna be one of the few people who drag race with the 2.5L engine, not many people put the time and or effort to making the 2.5 a powerful motor, and thats why I think it has ALOT of untapped potential. What do y'all think? By the way, when I talked to my dad about this ( he is a BIG gearhead, one of the best OEM / aftermarket mechanics I know ) he thinks its possible, but it would really only help on the lower end, which I am aware, but that it would give you the lower end boost so that you wouldn't have to focus on the mid to top end. I couldn't stop thinking about this all day at work ( ironicly I work at a bodyshop haha ) and I really think its an untapped potential marker...

So that all you would have to do is focus on the mid to top end, not wouldnt have to, my bad haha.


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## eatrach (May 13, 2004)

yes, it is possible, and yes it will help low end power; however, you would probably need to upgrade to an AWD setup. Otherwise, the torque will not be utilized properly.


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## TylerO28 (Jul 7, 2008)

Yeah single turbo alone makes wheel spin pretty nasty.

If you went with a sequential small to large bi turbo set up that would be good. 

However if it were possible I'd look into a charger and turbo. Supercharged low end for immediate torque and then once you peak the blower, would have enough pressure spooling the turbo.
And shazam! Fast!


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

single turbos are always very very efficient.


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

My only deal with doing a combo of the super / turbo is ... where is the crank shaft on the I5? It's inline, and I haven't seen many ads for a super for the I5 at all. If you could give me a link for a super then yes my dad and I would jump on the thought of building a combo set up. I'd love to stuff like this and really make Vokswagens place on the NHRA, thats what I really want, I have seen some wicked looking VWs but I have never seen one place on an NHRA board.


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

I'm really gonna look into, and that AWD swap will be a PiTA, but if this is plausible, I REALLY wanna do it. I'm getting all excited haha.


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

ihavent seen anything good for an AWD swap... i mean, the AWD system used istn the best, nor it will give you all the performance you'd want out of an expensive set up


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## TylerO28 (Jul 7, 2008)

It would be truly impossible to super/turbo...
I was only dreaming lol
No way could you get a pulley set up!

My idea is nearly as outrageous as op! But hey it'd be crazy fun!


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

Well, I was turning it over in my head, and I was going over the thoughts and ideas in my head, and I wouldn't want an AWD for draging, I'd want to convert it from FWD to RWD, more power to the wheels and more control. The more I think about it, the more I know its plausible, look at some of the posts on here from projects past, people have been rebracketing things in MKVs ever since they came out. Granted, the rebracketing I'd have to do would be a huge task and take forever but I really think it'd be worth it. Like I said VWs have ALOT of untapped power, they just need someone to tap into it. A few beers and a cell call to my dad and I'll draw up some plans. A concern is the engine bay size, I'd probably have to tuck the turbos under the engine and put some thermal wrap around em so they don't overheat haha. An air-to-water intercooler with the mixing unit in the trunk would save some room for a little radiator, and better pipping...


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## MK5CNY (Sep 4, 2007)

Midship RWD with turbo's, Bimoto, cheaper to supercharge and NOS?


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## nothing-leaves-stock (Mar 1, 2005)

TylerO28 said:


> It would be truly impossible to super/turbo...
> I was only dreaming lol
> No way could you get a pulley set up!
> 
> My idea is nearly as outrageous as op! But hey it'd be crazy fun!


not true. if you have money, WE can supercharge your 2.5L we have a few ideas and drawings for it for the past year


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## GTACanuck (Feb 20, 2009)

thygreyt said:


> ihavent seen anything good for an AWD swap... i mean, the AWD system used istn the best, nor it will give you all the performance you'd want out of an expensive set up


Unitronics has an AWD bunny, I wonder what setup they are using there.


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## TylerO28 (Jul 7, 2008)

GTACanuck said:


> Unitronics has an AWD bunny, I wonder what setup they are using there.


R 32 awd set up.it requires cutting out the rear floor pan because the spare tire section is to low.then welding in the same space saver tire section.
They claim the rear end is really bolt on and go after the cut weld issue


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## TylerO28 (Jul 7, 2008)

fnewell1990 said:


> and I wouldn't want an AWD for draging, I'd want to convert it from FWD to RWD, more power to the wheels and more control...


no there would be less control...short wheel base, it turns like a top.
Search for a video of top gears test on the vw w12 bi turbo 650gti rwd I believe that is its name. This will give you an idea of how crazy power for a short wheel base vehicle like ours really performs.

More power is not always better.nor is rwd.


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

It would be a straight drag car. I'd weld the axles so I wouldn't have to worry about spin. As far as the set for AWD, if you set up an AWD, you cant really drag it cause you can't put high walled slicks on 4 tires haha, let alone get the power to burn out all 4 tires for the grip, I've only seen one Skyline R32 that was able to spin all 4 tires and he blew his engine big time within 3 seconds of the engage light, and I've been to countless drag races in FL, and NJ. I just want to swap the drive train and TT it, I'd set everything up as it goes. The .:R is the same set up as the Rabbit cause they are on the same platform right? So the wheel kit is in the same location? Plus getting rid of the wheel kit is like 35 pounds lost, thats like .05 of a second which isnt bad at all.


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

Ok, so I saw the video. They took parts from like 4 different cars and combined them into their smallest platform to date, thats why the guy was spinning like crazy. It looked like the car has a lot of understeer. I wouldn't be dropping no 6 cyl engine in it, I'd keep the 5 cyl, and work around the drive train. The TT part I think I could do, with some effort. I've wrote some details on it. Now its the train swap that I gotta look around and into. By the way, that W12 GTI looked sexy!


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

fnewell1990 said:


> It would be a straight drag car. I'd weld the axles so I wouldn't have to worry about spin. As far as the set for AWD, if you set up an AWD, you cant really drag it cause you can't put high walled slicks on 4 tires haha, let alone get the power to burn out all 4 tires for the grip, *I've only seen one Skyline R32 that was able to spin all 4 tires and he blew his engine big time within 3 seconds of the engage light, and I've been to countless drag races in FL, and NJ.* I just want to swap the drive train and TT it, I'd set everything up as it goes. The .:R is the same set up as the Rabbit cause they are on the same platform right? So the wheel kit is in the same location? Plus getting rid of the wheel kit is like 35 pounds lost, thats like .05 of a second which isnt bad at all.


HAHAHAHA This post and thread is epic :laugh: Obviously you've never been to a DSM shoot out, where John Shep, runs 8's all day long with awd spinning like crazy.... :snowcool:


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## dmgraz (Jan 3, 2008)

i thought about doing this kind of setup awhile ago...even bought a pair of cheap Maserati (IHI) turbos but thought it over and decided not to. i think an awd would have to be a must.


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

No, I really haven't been to any DSM shoot out, I only watch drags that involve older muscle cars ( not saying if DSM does or doesn't have them ) but usually I go to Mustang days, Corvette days, Camaro days etc...


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

Haha, DSM is all tho Lancer EVOs and GSXs haha. Mistubishi isnt a great car, I've seen turbo'd B18C Civic whoop GSXs and EVOs and half the people there couldn't break 10 seconds...


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

fnewell1990 said:


> Haha, DSM is all tho Lancer EVOs and GSXs haha. Mistubishi isnt a great car, I've seen turbo'd B18C Civic whoop GSXs and EVOs and half the people there couldn't break 10 seconds...


You have no idea what you are talking about... Typical hillbilly drag racer.... There are plenty of sub 8 sec talons, evo's, sure eclipse's suck but then again you dont know what your talking about.
John shepherd:




I was there for this one and I see 4 slicks:




I was there for this one:




One more Evo with again 4 slicks:


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

Again this thread is sooo retarded. You wont and cant take your new rabbit daily driver, build it, twin turbo it (which is pointless), convert it to rwd (again stupid) :facepalm: If you want a fast drag vw the best thing to do would be grab a mk1 gut it, tube it, cage it, fiberglass the front end swap a 24v 3.2 vr6, built and boosted with 6 speed dogbox with some slicks.


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

First off, who said I was a hillbilly, secondly I know there are 8 second JDM cars out there I'm not stupid, and yes I know what I'm talking about. Don't call me stupid or a hillbilly if you don't have any evidence, just because I grew up on American Muscle does not make a hillbilly, I lived in South Florida, the most industrialized place in Florida. People like you are annoying.


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

fnewell1990 said:


> First off, who said I was a hillbilly, secondly I know there are 8 second JDM cars out there I'm not stupid, and yes I know what I'm talking about. Don't call me stupid or a hillbilly if you don't have any evidence, just because I grew up on American Muscle does not make a hillbilly, I lived in South Florida, the most industrialized place in Florida. People like you are annoying.


Sure maybe there are sub 10 sec jdm's but they arent daily drivers like the talon and evo... 

*Why don't you throw a small block chevy in there while you're at the rwd swap *:facepalm:

You are a hillbilly, just because you live somewhere doesnt make you a hillbilly, it's how you act in society, I live in an industrial city as well, and frankly there are plenty of hillbilly trash. :thumbup:

Silly n00b :laugh:


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

Explain to me how I am a hillbilly? RWD setup is possible but its gonna take effort. I couldn't care less about Eagles, last I heard they weren't being made anymore, and every JDM / DSM car I have seen looks like crap with bondo spots all over it and that stupid primer look. I would never drive a car like that, or one with 20 in tires that I see all the time, looks like crap, drives like crap, smells like crap, and the driver is probably crap.


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## DerekH (Sep 4, 2010)

Wow, whats with all the hate on here today. Take it easy on each other, just because his dreams are lofty doesn't mean he is dumb.


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

i just laugh :laugh: everytime i read it...


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

fnewell1990 said:


> Explain to me how I am a hillbilly? RWD setup is possible but its gonna take effort. I couldn't care less about Eagles, last I heard they weren't being made anymore, and every JDM / DSM car I have seen looks like crap with bondo spots all over it and that stupid primer look. I would never drive a car like that, or one with 20 in tires that I see all the time, looks like crap, drives like crap, smells like crap, and the driver is probably crap.


HAHAHA someone is salty, If you build you rwd rabbit, it will contain lots of bondo becoming one of those crap cars you speek of :thumbup:

I consider you a hillbilly because you think rwd is optimal for drag racing, and your reasoning is that you can fit them(read with southern accent) dang bigg'n slicks up in that there cubby well. I proved to yout that awd can be used to accomplish sub 8 sec 1/4, and that crap talon holds the awd, street legal, daily driven, 1/4 mile world record! 

If you are gonna rwd the rabbit answer these questions:
1. What rear end are you gonna fit in there without extensive body modification
2. What transmission are you gonna use that will hold up to the torque transfer using slicks, and also allow rwd setup
3. Why do you think two turbo's on an odd cylinder motor will be better than a single larger more efficient turbo


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## fnewell1990 (Mar 28, 2011)

I'm not saying that two Turbos are better. It was an idea I thought about. Secondly, I think RWD is better for dragging because I grew up on RWD cars, I've seen FWD, and AWD, and so far, I have yet to see any compete against say, a Mustang? As far as the bondo goes... no it won't I work at a bodyshop, I'd do it proper, and I'd do it clean. You as far as I can tell just like to call people names w/ no basis. Your one of those people that if I met irl, I'd probably wanna punch in the face just because you have that look that everyone just wants to punch in the face. Oh well its done, I'm done talking to you, I thought and still think its a good idea, when I posted this I knew I was gonna get flack, I got my flack, I'm not discuraged, your just a kid with nothing better to do. I'm not hillbilly, or *******, I'm country ( meaning the respectful part, the way I treat girls, how I don't call people names or start fights when theres no point to. ) as for this thread, idrc anymore. I'm gonna look into it, I'm gonna see what it would take, and I'm gonna draw up a plan of action and commit to it.


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

fnewell1990 said:


> I'm not saying that two Turbos are better. It was an idea I thought about. Secondly, I think RWD is better for dragging because I grew up on RWD cars, I've seen FWD, and AWD, and so far, I have yet to see any compete against say, a Mustang? As far as the bondo goes... no it won't I work at a bodyshop, I'd do it proper, and I'd do it clean. You as far as I can tell just like to call people names w/ no basis. Your one of those people that if I met irl, I'd probably wanna punch in the face just because you have that look that everyone just wants to punch in the face. Oh well its done, I'm done talking to you, I thought and still think its a good idea, when I posted this I knew I was gonna get flack, I got my flack, I'm not discuraged, your just a kid with nothing better to do. I'm not hillbilly, or *******, I'm country ( meaning the respectful part, the way I treat girls, how I don't call people names or start fights when theres no point to. ) as for this thread, idrc anymore. I'm gonna look into it, I'm gonna see what it would take, and I'm gonna draw up a plan of action and commit to it.


1/4 mile times are 1/4 mile times doesnt matter if you've seen something race a mustang 

Anyways converting to rwd is gonna be"More than you can afford PAL"


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## nothing-leaves-stock (Mar 1, 2005)

lots of worthless banter here...one question....how would you plan on running twins on a 5 cylinder? 2 to 1 turbo 3 to the other? 2.5 to1 2.5 to1 with one cylinder split? 4 to1 and 1 to1?
or split all the cylinders so the have 2 pipes for each cylinder and run 5 and 5. making 10 exhaust pipes...oh thats baller! do that! pleaze do dat!!!!111!1!11:wave:


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

kevin FaKiN spLits said:


> If you are gonna rwd the rabbit answer these questions:
> 1. What rear end are you gonna fit in there without extensive body modification
> 2. What transmission are you gonna use that will hold up to the torque transfer using slicks, and also allow rwd setup
> 3. Why do you think two turbo's on an odd cylinder motor will be better than a single larger more efficient turbo





nothing-leaves-stock said:


> lots of worthless banter here...one question....how would you plan on running twins on a 5 cylinder? 2 to 1 turbo 3 to the other? 2.5 to1 2.5 to1 with one cylinder split? 4 to1 and 1 to1?
> or split all the cylinders so the have 2 pipes for each cylinder and run 5 and 5. making 10 exhaust pipes...oh thats baller! do that! pleaze do dat!!!!111!1!11:wave:


I want to know the same thing... Maybe do it like nightshift1983 did and run 1 k04 per cylinder :laugh:


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

i'm thinking on going the nightshift1983 route and do a killer set uP:

im going to buy and install 2 stage 3 clutch set up so that my tranny can become a DSG properly, with the 2 clutches.

then imma buy 6 turbos... obviously precision 6262...

so that tehre is 1 turbo per cylinder, and then the there will be a turbo just before the throttle body, so that the cooled air cam be re compressed before entering the pistons... then i will take a mustang tranny and plug it into mine to have a rwd car...

and to stop my rocket i'm going to install TWO(2) bbk per wheel so that i can haz brakes. 

that way i'll always brake.

but the killer mod will be this:

i'm going to make some pipes so that they can suck the air OUTSIDE of the engine may...
so i'm planning on having all 5 intakes on the roof.... yes, on the roof.

i betcha no one can repeat my set up.

did i forget to add nos?


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

thygreyt said:


> i'm thinking on going the nightshift1983 route and do a killer set uP:
> 
> im going to buy and install 2 stage 3 clutch set up so that my tranny can become a DSG properly, with the 2 clutches.
> 
> ...


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## spdfrek (Feb 28, 2002)

A lot of hate in here but on the flip side a lot of stuff to hate on. :laugh:

OP if you are serious about building a drag rabbit cheack out the drag forum here to see what setups other people have done on both awd and fwd drag vws. It is also a place where you can get info from people who have actually built and raced a dedicated drag car.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/forumdisplay.php?124-Drag-Racing


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

I just came back to this thread to show my buddy how fast his evo can be :laugh: This thread was good for something afterall :thumbup::thumbup: OP :wave:


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## 08Drabbit (Feb 3, 2011)

this idea seems very far fetched...


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

08Drabbit said:


> this idea seems very far fetched...


:laugh::laugh::laugh:


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## 08Drabbit (Feb 3, 2011)

kevin FaKiN spLits said:


> :laugh::laugh::laugh:


maybe add another motor/drivetrain in the trunk+2 c2 kits makes a better 2.5tt...then it would be a 5.0TT


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

08Drabbit said:


> maybe add another motor/drivetrain in the trunk+2 c2 kits makes a better 2.5tt...then it would be a 5.0TT


Its doable :thumbup:


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## how much is 5 plus 2 (Mar 19, 2007)

thygreyt said:


> i'm thinking on going the nightshift1983 route and do a killer set uP:
> 
> im going to buy and install 2 stage 3 clutch set up so that my tranny can become a DSG properly, with the 2 clutches.
> 
> ...


How could you forget da 20z and da spoiler?


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## Schwarz_Jetta (Jul 31, 2011)

anything is possible :beer:


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## eatrach (May 13, 2004)

Ditch the Twin turbo for this: 



:laugh:


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## eatrach (May 13, 2004)

or this:


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## 2pt5_20v_pwr (Jul 19, 2011)

kevin FaKiN spLits said:


> HAHAHA someone is salty, If you build you rwd rabbit, it will contain lots of bondo becoming one of those crap cars you speek of :thumbup:
> 
> *I consider you a hillbilly because you think rwd is optimal for drag racing*, and your reasoning is that you can fit them(read with southern accent) dang bigg'n slicks up in that there cubby well. I proved to yout that awd can be used to accomplish sub 8 sec 1/4, and that crap talon holds the awd, street legal, daily driven, 1/4 mile world record!
> 
> ...



If RWD isn't optimal for drag racing, why are top fuel dragsters, pro stock, etc... RWD?? I guess it depends on what you are dragging... one would assume that AWD is better for 1/8th mile or shorter wheel base cars that can't keep the front end down?? Just voicing my $0.02


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## Teknojnky (Jun 1, 2002)

5 cylinder?
Turbo?
AWD?
All 4 wheels spinning?

Shame its not quite a vw, but almost.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9PGxLS-eTY


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## TylerO28 (Jul 7, 2008)

That white audi coupe quattro in the video.... Used to own one...and my God I miss that thing!
In all honesty, the reason I bought the rabbit, was because of my serious LOVE of that audi 5 cylinder... The second I got into the audi I knew that 5 cylinder motors were amazing!

Now I've just got to finish my stage 2 turbo install...eventually i will probably get into the all wheel drive build I've dreamt of since day one...then I'll have all the refinement of a modern car...and the nasty sound of 5 cylinders going crazy! And 4 wheels spinning in a fit of fury! 

One can dream right?


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

TylerO28 said:


> One can dream right?


if so, i want mine to either be:

permanent all wheel drive (no haldex or quattro isht)
or RWD


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

thygreyt said:


> if so, i want mine to either be:
> 
> *permanent all wheel drive *(no haldex or quattro isht)
> or RWD


Doable :thumbup: Pretty much found the answer. Lambo Gallardo front diff. Pretty much mounts up to mkv subframe, well close and add a 800 dollar custom rack and pinion all you would need is a custom drive shaft and axles and awd hubs and your done, no wiring at all


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## TylerO28 (Jul 7, 2008)

kevin FaKiN spLits said:


> Doable :thumbup: Pretty much found the answer. Lambo Gallardo front diff. Pretty much mounts up to mkv subframe, well close and add a 800 dollar custom rack and pinion all you would need is a custom drive shaft and axles and awd hubs and your done, no wiring at all


Didn't realize it was that simple...
So I just ordered myself an entire lambo drive train...it wasn't a big deal... Oh and I called lamborghini directly and they said they'd build the sub frame for me...should have it in a few days!

On a side note...god if I had money like that to blow...i doubt i'd be dreaming about my rabbit build, but still...again
One can only dream....


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

TylerO28 said:


> Didn't realize it was that simple...
> So I just ordered myself an entire lambo drive train...it wasn't a big deal... Oh and I called lamborghini directly and they said they'd build the sub frame for me...should have it in a few days!
> 
> On a side note...god if I had money like that to blow...i doubt i'd be dreaming about my rabbit build, but still...again
> One can only dream....


Me no understand your sarcasm... You can pick up the diff for $1500. Underground Racing puts them on Ebay all the time... You need an R32 subframe and need to weld 2 brackets and its in... The thing I found out you have to fix is the reverse drive the rack and pinion is cut for. A machine shop in Toledo that builds all Titan motorsports Supra motors as well as all Bushur Racings motors, can make a custom cut rack and pinion for $800. You can run a modified r32 drive shaft and modified Lambo axles, the hub spline should be the same thread pattern


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

kevin FaKiN spLits said:


> Me no understand your sarcasm... You can pick up the diff for $1500. Underground Racing puts them on Ebay all the time... You need an R32 subframe and need to weld 2 brackets and its in... The thing I found out you have to fix is the reverse drive the rack and pinion is cut for. A machine shop in Toledo that builds all Titan motorsports Supra motors as well as all Bushur Racings motors, can make a custom cut rack and pinion for $800. You can run a modified r32 drive shaft and modified Lambo axles, the hub spline should be the same thread pattern


so, according to you, between the lambo diff, r32 rear frame, custom shaft, and custom lambo brakets, one could have a NO WIRES needed for coding,and you have a permanent all wheel drive?

whhich tranny? or thats the lambo diff..?? im confused..!


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## kevin splits (Aug 23, 2010)

thygreyt said:


> so, according to you, between the lambo diff, r32 rear frame, custom shaft, and custom lambo brakets, one could have a NO WIRES needed for coding,and you have a permanent all wheel drive?
> 
> whhich tranny? or thats the lambo diff..?? im confused..!


Ill pm you then post it here. But yes thats what Im saying


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

i'll wait for said info...

and if possible, list part numbers, where available! cause this is a tech forum.... if info isnt posted, then this is nothing!


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## VeeDoubleYouGuy (Nov 4, 2003)

This is ridiculous. Awd? Twin turbo i-5? Crazyness. Big ars single turbo makes more sense. As I know it the twin turbo in sequential form helps turbo lag. Not really a concern with drag racing. Why worry about two turbos spooling to break traction. Seen lots of fwd turbos do the 1/4 mile they kinda limp off the line then punch it at chew tires like crazy. You can make some pretty good numbers thast way cuz you kill the trans and shift really fast and then keep the one turbo spooled up. Twin turbo drag racing inline 5 is just stupid


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## TylerO28 (Jul 7, 2008)

VeeDoubleYouGuy said:


> This is ridiculous. Awd? Twin turbo i-5? Crazyness. Big ars single turbo makes more sense. As I know it the twin turbo in sequential form helps turbo lag. Not really a concern with drag racing. Why worry about two turbos spooling to break traction. Seen lots of fwd turbos do the 1/4 mile they kinda limp off the line then punch it at chew tires like crazy. You can make some pretty good numbers thast way cuz you kill the trans and shift really fast and then keep the one turbo spooled up. Twin turbo drag racing inline 5 is just stupid


Yeah we've kinda all determined the twin turbo set up is stupid... We tend to jump off info random conversations on threads like this...


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## thygreyt (Jun 7, 2009)

but now that you say it... hum

mid engined, twin turbo i5 with the lambo AWD... imagine the posibilities! :laugh:


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