# So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be?



## VR6ix (Oct 27, 2003)

The 3.2 sounds well suited for a swap into a MK4, bringing a handfull of extra power and torque. How much trouble would it be to lift one of these engines from a Tourag or 3.2 TT and then install it into a Jetta/Golf? I guess the transmision would be the biggest headache?


----------



## DiscoStu (May 8, 2001)

*Re: So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be? (VR6ix)*

You could save yourself the headache and buy a R32. Swapped in for you by VW.


----------



## SN00PY (Mar 3, 2003)

*Re: So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be? (DiscoStu)*

How bout a MK2...


----------



## VR6ix (Oct 27, 2003)

Sooooooooo glad I use the Vortex. What with all this useful information, I'm sure to become a true Dub Enthusiast and invest money into Volkswagen cars and aftermarket parts.
How about: are the transmission mounting points on the 3.2L block the same as the 2.8L block?
'Cause VW won't be making any MKIV 3.2L Jettas any time soon.


----------



## LilBlkCL (Aug 23, 2001)

*Re: (VR6ix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VR6ix* »_Sooooooooo glad I use the Vortex. What with all this useful information, I'm sure to become a true Dub Enthusiast and invest money into Volkswagen cars and aftermarket parts.


meow


----------



## FLY-GTI1 (Dec 28, 1999)

*Re: (VR6ix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VR6ix* »_Sooooooooo glad I use the Vortex. What with all this useful information, I'm sure to become a true Dub Enthusiast and invest money into Volkswagen cars and aftermarket parts.
How about: are the transmission mounting points on the 3.2L block the same as the 2.8L block?
'Cause VW won't be making any MKIV 3.2L Jettas any time soon.

The internet shouldn't be the determining factor of whether or not you become a VW enthusiast.
That being said, you do have a good point in that MKIV Jetta's would be pretty damn cool with the 3.2l VR6. I'm not sure about the tranny mounting points...you might try to post in the R32 forum (just b/c it gets a lot more traffic now)


----------



## VR6ix (Oct 27, 2003)

Yeah I won't base my enthusiasm for VW's solely on the Vortex.
Maybe no one (here) actually knows if a) the blocks are the same, or b) the blocks are interchangable into the MKIV chassis. Any possible swap would undoubtably use the Toureg engine.

There is no replacement for displacement.


----------



## SilberArrow6 (Jul 28, 2002)

*Re: (VR6ix)*

This is my take on the situation because a) I don't know but b) I've been wondering the same things.
I doubt the mounting points are the same for the Toureg as for the Mk IV chassis but what you should be able to do is (if you already have a VR6) use the crank, rods and pistons in a 2.8l block. You would have to bore the cylinders to 83(?)mm. If you have a 24v 2.8 that should have you 95% of the way to an R32 motor. The only thing missing would be variable exhaust timing. If you are a 12v VR like me you would have what is basically called an ABT 3.2 as ABT first developed the long stroke crank that VW then bought to make a production stroker VR.
I've been thinking and realized I'd (or anyone with a 12v motor) have to use some aftermarket piston as the 24v pistons are not the same as 12v.


_Modified by SilberArrow6 at 9:44 PM 1-21-2004_


----------



## VR6ix (Oct 27, 2003)

I talked breifly with an Audi salesman today when I was checking out a yellow tt 3.2 DSG coupe. He seemed to think that the 3.2L block and the 2.8L block are the same, hence no problem mounting a 3.2 into a MKIV Jetta. I was all set to crawl under a Toureg and look at the block, but they only had a W8 inside the showroom.
I was thinking that the best way to get a 3.2 VR into a Jetta would be by swapping in the Toureg engine from a scrap yard (







). Then boost power through bolt-ons for the R32... if such parts would be compatible with the Toureg 3.2. Might be easier than boring out a 2.8 block, but that is another way.
Unless Audi could trade me a tt 3.2 coupe with a 6 speed for the Jetta... straight-up!


----------



## DubGeek (Aug 29, 2003)

*Re: (VR6ix)*

This would be cool. I'd be interested in doing a swap like this. Somehow I doubt that VW would bring over a 3.2l in the Jetta. But who knows.


----------



## VertigoGTI (Apr 1, 2001)

*Re: (DubGeek)*


_Quote »_I was all set to crawl under a Toureg and look at the block, but they only had a W8 inside the showroom

I thought there were 3.2 VR6's and 4.2 V8's, no 4.0 W8


----------



## SilberArrow6 (Jul 28, 2002)

*Re: (VertigoGTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VertigoGTI* »_
I thought there were 3.2 VR6's and 4.2 V8's, no 4.0 W8

Yup.


----------



## ATL_Av8r (Oct 17, 2002)

*Re:*

Since the 3.2 is going into the Golf R32, wouldn't it be kind of implied that it will bolt right up to the A4 chassis? Or am I thinking down the wrong lines here since it will be 4Motion and a completely different frame?


----------



## WasserTuner (Oct 14, 2000)

*Re: Re: (ATL_Av8r)*

your on the right path...


----------



## SilberArrow6 (Jul 28, 2002)

*Re: (VR6ix)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VR6ix* »_I talked breifly with an Audi salesman today when I was checking out a yellow tt 3.2 DSG coupe. He seemed to think that the 3.2L block and the 2.8L block are the same, hence no problem mounting a 3.2 into a MKIV Jetta. I was all set to crawl under a Toureg and look at the block, but they only had a W8 inside the showroom.
I was thinking that the best way to get a 3.2 VR into a Jetta would be by swapping in the Toureg engine from a scrap yard (







). Then boost power through bolt-ons for the R32... if such parts would be compatible with the Toureg 3.2. Might be easier than boring out a 2.8 block, but that is another way.
Unless Audi could trade me a tt 3.2 coupe with a 6 speed for the Jetta... straight-up!

Reading this raises my optimism http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif It won't be long before someone explores this option. Wiring and ECU are my only major concerns. That and axles. Who knows what I'll do when the current lump craps out on me


----------



## VR6ix (Oct 27, 2003)

OK my bad, there is no such thing as a W8 Toureg. All those V's and W's got confussing there. It is a V8.
I, unfortunatly, won't be able to try out this kind of swap for a while, maybe a long while. I think I'll wait to see what kind of parts become available for the 3.2, but overall it seems to be a better path than sinking money into 2.8 specific parts right now.
I wonder where the R32 3.2 gets the extra power from, and how different the two ECU's are. I, for one, am pretty much clueless.


----------



## SilberArrow6 (Jul 28, 2002)

*Re: (VR6ix)*

Programming and plumbing are the key differences between tehm, I'm sure. The R32 has a very well developed exhaust and the TT 3.2 even more so. I doubt there was as much development in the Toureg exhaust. The same is true for the Eurovan VR6s in both 12v and 24v. They are tuned for more torque over a broader lower rpm, and less so for the top of the rev range. There should be very few if any physical differences between the 2 motors.


----------



## LeBlanc. (Jul 15, 2003)

*Re: (SilberArrow6)*

I thought the 3.2 in the Toureg was a longitudinally mounted engine, even though they are the same block as the R32 3.2? Also, I thought ABT does a 3.1L stroker engine?
Just curious about the details myself.


----------



## Daemon42 (Feb 9, 2001)

*Re: (N2N)*

Yes the 3.2 in the Touareg and Cayenne are both longitudinally mounted. 
ian


----------



## SilberArrow6 (Jul 28, 2002)

*Re: (Daemon42)*

ABT only made their stroker crank for a short while originally. Rumor had it that VW bought their crank and developed the Beetle RSI from it. I've heard that for years but of caurse I have no proof. If they have begun producing a stroker again then they may be making the same crank again or another on, I'm not sure. They could be using a smaller bore for that 3.1l. I remember that the ABT motors used to be a hot comodity a few years ago.


----------



## SleepyTT (Jul 15, 2003)

*Re: So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be? (VR6ix)*

You can save the hassle of dropping a new engine in and just buying and installing the R32 Vr6's 96.4mm Crank and Bore the Block and put some 85mm Pistons in. Thats should make your displacement 3282cc aka a 3.2l 24v Vr6.


----------



## VR6ix (Oct 27, 2003)

Can anyone recite the 2.8L bore and stroke, and the 3.2L bore and stroke?
The big question would be: how much can the blocks be over-bored? How big could the VR grow with the VW 96.4mm crank?


----------



## SleepyTT (Jul 15, 2003)

*Re: (VR6ix)*

81mm Pistons with a 90.3mm Crank are the standard VR6
8*mm Pistons with a 96.4mm Crank
Im not 100% sure of what the r32 pistons are. PM a guy nammed Joshuamurray on the Tex he's works with building up engines.


----------



## Daemon42 (Feb 9, 2001)

*Re: (Sleepy007)*

R32's 3.2l VR6. Displacement is 3189 cm3, 
Bore 84.0 mm 
Stroke 95.9mm 
ian


----------



## TeamTHP (Mar 7, 2002)

*Re: (Daemon42)*

Anything is possible, in the right hands.


----------



## scottb15 (Jun 14, 2002)

Alright....Remember the Blue Jetta coupe? It had the 24v VR6. The motor bolted right up because VW kept the same mounting holes on the block. I even believe he used an 02A tranny. The tranny you have now will fit the 3.2, I'm sure of it. The 2.8l 24V VR6 is the same block as the 3.2l VR6. Swaps should not be too much of a problem on MK2-MK4.


----------



## Prefekt (Apr 1, 2002)

*Re:*

here's your motor for the swap...lol: http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAP...28606


----------



## scottb15 (Jun 14, 2002)

*Re: So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be? (VR6ix)*

I say from looking at the pics of it it should be no problem.


----------



## SRGTI (Dec 21, 2001)

*Re: So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be? (scottb15)*


_Quote, originally posted by *scottb15* »_I say from looking at the pics of it it should be no problem.









Interesting, if I may ask, where's the R32 that came with it?


----------



## scottb15 (Jun 14, 2002)

*Re: So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be? (SRGTI)*

Probably ran into a tree. It is off german ebay.


----------



## 15DGR V6 (Jan 29, 2002)

*Re: (SilberArrow6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SilberArrow6* »_ABT only made their stroker crank for a short while originally. Rumor had it that VW bought their crank and developed the Beetle RSI from it. I've heard that for years but of caurse I have no proof. If they have begun producing a stroker again then they may be making the same crank again or another on, I'm not sure. They could be using a smaller bore for that 3.1l. I remember that the ABT motors used to be a hot comodity a few years ago.

They did use a smaller bore for the ABT engine. The ABT crank is 95.6mm, the VW 3.2L crank is 95.9mm.


----------



## corpsedub (Aug 3, 2001)

*Re: So, how difficult would a 3.2 swap be? (scottb15)*


_Quote, originally posted by *scottb15* »_I say from looking at the pics of it it should be no problem.









well it looks like at least the passenger side motor mount is the same


----------



## rastta (Feb 22, 1999)

*Re: (SilberArrow6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *SilberArrow6* »_The R32 has a very well developed exhaust and the TT 3.2 even more so.

Well - the ONLY difference in the two exhausts is the legnth. The TT's wheelbase is shorter and hence so is the exhaust. Other than that they are IDENTICAL. In fact, the only difference is the published numbers. Emphasis on the word published. The Touareg engine IS tuned to bring the torque curve down lower in the power band and due to differences in intake and exhaust etc. It was tuned this way on purpose.
The 3.2 block and 2.8 block are different but use the same mounting points. The 3.2 block is slightly taller if I remember correctly and hence sits slightly lower in the engine compartment due to this. Therefore the engine mounts would probably be different as well, but i'm not sure about that.
A 3.2 swap wouldn't be difficult at all, especially with the right ECU and wiring harnesses. 


_Modified by [email protected] at 3:58 PM 2-27-2004_


----------



## am1899 (Mar 17, 2001)

*Re: ([email protected])*

So when is HPA going to build an A2 3.2 VR6TT?







Their twin turbo R32 does 0-60 in....umm...3.2? I can't even imagine what the A2 could muster up.


----------

