# Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! ("new" 1.8T intake manifold hits the market)



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

Well, it looks like OBX has officially ripped off the RMR intake manifold. At $400, who's gonna be the first one to try it?








Given their track record, it's likely a leaky POS. Though, I wonder...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...3a101


----------



## cincyTT (May 11, 2006)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*

Thats priceless








The rmr isnt much more


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (cincyTT)*

I know lol! RMR had one listed on ebay the other day for $599. I think I'll pay the extra $200 for an american made product
really though, I just want to see this happen to someone:










_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 12:24 PM 1-8-2010_


----------



## 8valvesofFURY (Dec 31, 2006)

ugh obx is such ***** garbage.


----------



## cincyTT (May 11, 2006)

*Re: (8valvesofFURY)*

you know you want their tube manifold, turbo, catback, pulleys, and this intake man.


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*

hahaha


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*

buy it n flow bench it see how it compares


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*

damn other goodies they got 
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...ories
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...ories


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (weenerdog3443)*

oh dear lord, an OBX LSD???
I would maybe consider an IM, only because the chittiness of the part can likely be cure by a little cutting/grinding/welding on my part. But, I wouldn't even take an LSD from them if you offered it to me for free.


----------



## burkechrs1 (Dec 1, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*

I have an obx downpipe. Seems fine. THough how hard is it to make something out of 3" pipe with a bend and a flex tube..


----------



## 04VDubGLI (May 20, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_oh dear lord, an OBX LSD???
I would maybe consider an IM, only because the chittiness of the part can likely be cure by a little cutting/grinding/welding on my part. But, I wouldn't even take an LSD from them if you offered it to me for free.

A local VW guy ran an OBX diff in his o2m... needless to say I think after like 1000 miles it was out and he had to pony up for a real diff. I'd never use anything that was internal from them. Frankly, I wouldn't be opposed to the intake manifold, but it's not big port or cheap enough for me to try haha


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (04VDubGLI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *04VDubGLI* »_
Frankly, I wouldn't be opposed to the intake manifold, but it's not big port or cheap enough for me to try haha

the ebay add says both large port and small port variations are available. If this was $100 cheaper I would buy it and see, but I'm not spending $400 for a questionable part


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*

So i emailed them asking about the wall thickness, plenum design, ect and here's what they said:

_Quote, originally posted by *ebay guy* »_
hi,

we have worked with the RMR manifold before and it is indeed similar to that; velocity stacks of the RMR design is also in this design. i'll try to get pictures this afternoon fo ryou.

thanks


----------



## 20aeman (Jun 8, 2006)

maybe 400 is the intro price? do they have the fpr adapter for this thing or will people need to run an aftermarket fpr? In which case, might as well go sem, as your obx+fpr will cost the same.


----------



## IzVW (Jul 24, 2003)

*FV-QR*

Ooo get one and try it NOLA! lol


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (IzVW)*


_Quote, originally posted by *IzVW* »_Ooo get one and try it NOLA! lol

I'm waiting on more detailed pics from the seller. Seeing as how OBX normally lists their mani's for much much less, I wonder why this one is so high?
As for the FPR, Ross sells an adapter for $70 that allows you to use your stock FPR. So for roughly $500 shipped you can get this mani, fuel rail, and FPR adapter. You still need to more than likely deck the head flange, but that's not too bad if you have the tools to do it.
idk, you can get a bejan special or forcefed one-off for not much more in the end.


----------



## cincyTT (May 11, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_So i emailed them asking about the wall thickness, plenum design, ect and here's what they said:


worked with = stole


----------



## l88m22vette (Mar 2, 2006)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*

Those runners look awful


----------



## GLI_jetta (Jan 3, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (burkechrs1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burkechrs1* »_I have an obx downpipe. Seems fine. THough how hard is it to make something out of 3" pipe with a bend and a flex tube..

x2 I had one also, worked great for 25+k


----------



## velocity196 (Feb 19, 2006)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*

How awesome would it be if it flowed better than the apr and abd manifold lol. To bad it wasn't a big port too. 


_Modified by velocity196 at 3:00 PM 1-8-2010_


----------



## EF9Si (Dec 12, 2003)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (velocity196)*

I would stick with my stocker, thank you!! That thing looks horrid and prolly flows like crap!!!


----------



## boosted b5 (Nov 1, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_oh dear lord, an OBX LSD???
I would maybe consider an IM, only because the chittiness of the part can likely be cure by a little cutting/grinding/welding on my part. But, I wouldn't even take an LSD from them if you offered it to me for free.

im sorry man, but ive seen an OBX diff go in the 10s consistantly on a Honda
all they did was re-torque the diff housing and it performs great.
yes they are cheap, yes its a company with a rep for being cheap and chincy but like anything, you can make it work if you have the means to do so.

EDIT**
personally, id run this manifold. its only 400$. they say its available big port and small port. why not. i cant imagine a loss of power would occur.


_Modified by boosted b5 at 6:56 PM 1-8-2010_


----------



## cincyTT (May 11, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (boosted b5)*

there is a guy selling rebuild kits for these LSD's since the bolts are supposedly sub par. WIth the bolts replaced they apparently last.


----------



## vteciswack (Feb 19, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (cincyTT)*

i know of 4 big power cars running obx diffs since 06'. no problems.


----------



## vert1 (Sep 13, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (vteciswack)*

We run OBX diff in our car with GT3071, all good so far.


----------



## Lou_Y2mK5 (Apr 6, 2008)

who is buying stuff like this? How do they make money?


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 2, 2009)

Well, for one thing, they don't do any design, r&d, or engineering work- so that saves them a bundle right off the top..... 
That thing is awful. It makes me laugh that they are so narrow minded that they copied the RMR one exactly instead of doing a casting. I'd rather have Chinese casting then Chinese aluminum welding any day.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Lou_Y2mK5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_










I love it when companies copy parts....they even copied the plate wrong








http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif to OBX and there bull**** parts.

_Quote, originally posted by *Lou_Y2mK5* »_who is buying stuff like this? How do they make money?

$25 bet that in 1 month some clown is going to put one of these on there car and post a dyno that they made X whp gain over the manifold.I have no doubt in my mind that this will make power but I really do question the loyalty.
Maybe for 2010 we should all start ripping each others products off...that will sure get the products we want developed.


----------



## boosted b5 (Nov 1, 2004)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
but I really do question the loyalty.
Maybe for 2010 we should all start ripping each others products off...that will sure get the products we want developed.









loyalty? are you kidding me? going fast is the name of the game.
when it comes down to buying manifolds and other enginer/turbo parts my money is on arnold. but i wouldnt be opposed to testing the manifold if my car was operational and it werent winter. VW/Audi people are too damn narrowminded for their own good. because the company name is OBX and it doesnt cost you 1000$ its junk and shouldnt be used. nonsense.


----------



## 20aeman (Jun 8, 2006)

I agree. If a stock drivers side mani sells here for 200 bucks, why not spend another 200 and get a fancy one like this that'll make a bit more power.


----------



## PimpMyRide (Apr 30, 2004)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
I love it when companies copy parts....they even copied the plate wrong








http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif to OBX and there bull**** parts.
$25 bet that in 1 month some clown is going to put one of these on there car and post a dyno that they made X whp gain over the manifold.I have no doubt in my mind that this will make power but I really do question the loyalty.
Maybe for 2010 we should all start ripping each others products off...that will sure get the products we want developed.









Name of the game. They do it with everything, clothes, shoes, stereo. It will always happen no matter what you do.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 25, 2007)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*

The plenum is seam welded rather than an extruded aluminum profile like that of RMR's...


----------



## GarrettsDad20v (Jan 5, 2010)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*


----------



## burble X2 (Dec 9, 2009)

*Re: (boosted b5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *boosted b5* »_
loyalty? are you kidding me? going fast is the name of the game.
when it comes down to buying manifolds and other enginer/turbo parts my money is on arnold. but i wouldnt be opposed to testing the manifold if my car was operational and it werent winter. VW/Audi people are too damn narrowminded for their own good. because the company name is OBX and it doesnt cost you 1000$ its junk and shouldnt be used. nonsense.

x2
loyalty my ass, you can't tell me IE, APR, et al don't make a ass ton of money off their parts. if they were smart, they'd lower the price to make it somewhat competitive with the chinese. to bash the enthusiast of not being loyal is ridiculous. 
want my money? be more competitive. i bet that mani flows just fine, won't break or leak (what stresses do an intake mani deal with anyways?) and at 1/2 the price. hopefully apr and whoever else sets a competitive price point. they've already made tons of profit off their original "R&D". 


_Modified by burble X2 at 7:11 AM 1-9-2010_


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: (burble X2)*

APR doesnt make parts in China I dont believe. Neither do I. I have years of experience w/ parts in general and manufacturing processes. I employ many techniques that maximizes quality while minimizing costs. Its a tough balancing act. When you start a car and let it idle and warm up. The 'settling' in noises that you hear on a build is unsettling. The heat and vibrations that emanate from under the hood makes you realize that inferior parts arent going to stand the test of time, let alone having it move, vibrate, heat cycle through its life. The OEM's realize this so they must carefully not skimp on crucial parts. Anyone that has gone through a build and daily drive it quickly realizes what they cant or cannot get away with. A cheap build is usually a nightmare of maintenance. These are mostly the horror stories that you hear about. Ppl spending time and money piecing together a car that should've never been and complaining about how much of a POS it is and wanting to sell it.
Ppl are also fooled by what they see. I machine parts regularly. I purchase very expensive tooling made from exotic materials on a regular basis. Bits and end mills that may cost over $150 each. I can machine out a fuel rail, vac bosses that would look great to the naked eye. Weld runners together quickly, take a picture of it and have a customer buy it. What he may end up getting is a warped flange, fittings that may not fit properly, thus causing vac leaks and injector bungs that will leak vac and fuel under certain pressures. I've seen it all and have actually fixed some of my errors due to hurrying and trying to meet deadlines...
Anyways, I hear hear about ppl thinking that the quality companies rip ppl off... Ha, that is funny. When I build an FMIC kit utilizing US made endtanks of my design (tooling), garrett fmic cores, quality clamps, silicone, I have some manufacturing expenses that I'm dealing with. I dont fart this stuff out. I think the guys that are really laughing to the bank are these guys that buy by the container load and post it on ebay...


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (boosted b5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_
to bash the enthusiast of not being loyal is ridiculous. 

Absolutely not... RMR did the R&D,I have seen 20 maybe 25 people run these manifolds.Why support the company that copied it? All to save $200 USD?

_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_
hopefully apr and whoever else sets a competitive price point. they've already made tons of profit off their original "R&D".

Really? Do you know what an APR exhaust manifold COSTS to make?
APR makes there money on SOFTWARE not HARDWARE.If you knew what production in this industry took then you would know what that kit costs to make.

_Quote, originally posted by *boosted b5* »_because the company name is OBX and it doesnt cost you 1000$ its junk and shouldnt be used. nonsense.

Before we continue let me restate the obvious.

_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_I have no doubt in my mind that this will make power

The RMR manifold price point is in check due to the cost of machining the components involved.I still will never understand the mentality of some of you in here.
"going fast is the name of the game"








How do any of you expect quality products to be developed if you are outright endorsing that it is fine to run a copied product.You only hurt the community with such statements.No one else....
Let me know when either of you start producing your own parts.


----------



## burble X2 (Dec 9, 2009)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_APR doesnt make parts in China I dont believe. Neither do I. I have years of experience w/ parts in general and manufacturing processes. I employ many techniques that maximizes quality while minimizing costs. Its a tough balancing act. When you start a car and let it idle and warm up. The 'settling' in noises that you hear on a build is unsettling. The heat and vibrations that emanate from under the hood makes you realize that inferior parts arent going to stand the test of time, let alone having it move, vibrate, heat cycle through its life. The OEM's realize this so they must carefully not skimp on crucial parts. Anyone that has gone through a build and daily drive it quickly realizes what they cant or cannot get away with. A cheap build is usually a nightmare of maintenance. These are mostly the horror stories that you hear about. Ppl spending time and money piecing together a car that should've never been and complaining about how much of a POS it is and wanting to sell it.
Ppl are also fooled by what they see. I machine parts regularly. I purchase very expensive tooling made from exotic materials on a regular basis. Bits and end mills that may cost over $150 each. I can machine out a fuel rail, vac bosses that would look great to the naked eye. Weld runners together quickly, take a picture of it and have a customer buy it. What he may end up getting is a warped flange, fittings that may not fit properly, thus causing vac leaks and injector bungs that will leak vac and fuel under certain pressures. I've seen it all and have actually fixed some of my errors due to hurrying and trying to meet deadlines...
Anyways, I hear hear about ppl thinking that the quality companies rip ppl off... Ha, that is funny. When I build an FMIC kit utilizing US made endtanks of my design (tooling), garrett fmic cores, quality clamps, silicone, I have some manufacturing expenses that I'm dealing with. I dont fart this stuff out. I think the guys that are really laughing to the bank are these guys that buy by the container load and post it on ebay...

i hear what you're saying. however, there is a general misconception that all these chinese parts are crap, and that's simply untrue. i personally had an obx diff in my old 450 hp eg hatch, golden eagle rods (made in china) with a china made intercooler and ebay piping kit. the car went mid 11's for less than 2k. never had a single problem with any of it, and i paid probably 300% less than i would have had i gone name brand.
the problem i have here is when people like [email protected] start saying stuff like "http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif to OBX and there bull**** parts" and "$25 bet that in 1 month some clown is going to put one of these on there car and post a dyno that they made X whp gain over the manifold.I have no doubt in my mind that this will make power but I really do question the loyalty."
no enthusiast owes a company jack ****. it's a for profit industry, you guys make the parts, we buy them at a substantial markup. it's capitalism, not UNICEF. necessity is the mother of invention. it's becoming well known that chinese parts aren't the crap they used to be, including their turbos (ask [email protected] racing about his chinese 600 whp single cam build using a chinese turbo for multiple 10 second passes.)
you guys building parts here definitely have a challenge to overcome, there's no question about it. but to bully the consumer into buying parts by questioning their "loyalty" is ridiculous.


----------



## burble X2 (Dec 9, 2009)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
Absolutely not... RMR did the R&D,I have seen 20 maybe 25 people run these manifolds.Why support the company that copied it? All to save $200 USD?

that's exactly it. we don't owe you a thing, it's capitalism.

_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
Really? Do you know what an APR exhaust manifold COSTS to make?
APR makes there money on SOFTWARE not HARDWARE.If you knew what production in this industry took then you would know what that kit costs to make.

i don't have an exact figure, no. but if you're going to tell me that THEIR cost is over 200$ for casting and materials, i'm going to call bs. same thing with their 1000$ exhaust systems.

_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
"going fast is the name of the game"










you're exactly right. doing it for less money is CAPITALISM AT IT'S FINEST. 

_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
How do any of you expect quality products to be developed if you are outright endorsing that it is fine to run a copied product.You only hurt the community with such statements.No one else....
Let me know when either of you start producing your own parts.

how is it not fine? you stated yourself they would make power, at several hundred dollars less. the only thing being hurt here is your profit margin, not the community. you're in the part making business dude, not me. the consumer doesn't care about ethics, they care about saving money.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: (burble X2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_
i hear what you're saying. however, there is a general misconception that all these chinese parts are crap, and that's simply untrue. i personally had an obx diff in my old 450 hp eg hatch, golden eagle rods (made in china) with a china made intercooler and ebay piping kit. the car went mid 11's for less than 2k. never had a single problem with any of it, and i paid probably 300% less than i would have had i gone name brand.
the problem i have here is when people like [email protected] start saying stuff like "http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif to OBX and there bull**** parts" and "$25 bet that in 1 month some clown is going to put one of these on there car and post a dyno that they made X whp gain over the manifold.I have no doubt in my mind that this will make power but I really do question the loyalty."
no enthusiast owes a company jack ****. it's a for profit industry, you guys make the parts, we buy them at a substantial markup. it's capitalism, not UNICEF. necessity is the mother of invention. it's becoming well known that chinese parts aren't the crap they used to be, including their turbos (ask [email protected] racing about his chinese 600 whp single cam build using a chinese turbo for multiple 10 second passes.)
you guys building parts here definitely have a challenge to overcome, there's no question about it. but to bully the consumer into buying parts by questioning their "loyalty" is ridiculous.

For every success story, there are equally as many horror stories. I have the piles of junk at the shop to prove it. I have taken off turbos that were days old. I have decked flanges that ended up costing $200 to fixture and machine it along w/ some hole alignment only to have the mani's crack a few weeks later. I've bought raw materials from questionable sources... Here is a picture.. I have 30 of these, brand new, in boxes that I REFUSE to pass on to the customer...








My industrial machinist that I collaborate w/ when my machines cant handle a particular job laugh about this all the time. You kiddies really dont know what you're buying. Performance parts w/ a Wal-Mart mentality.
You can put a car together w/ anything and it may perform on the track, sure. You put a diff on a car that doesnt make a ton of torque. Probably a car that doesnt see much mileage. But own it and drive it for a couple of years consistently. Put 10k+ miles on it a year and see what happens. I've pressure tested some setups at the shop that would come in w/ tuning problems. EVERY SINGLE cheap intercooler kit had leak(s) somewhere. I've had to take a soap spray, identify, mark. Reweld. Some even split the bar on a 30psi test....
Most chinese parts are crap. Alot of the metals that they are constructed of are the same materials used to make kitchenware that litter your neighborhood 99cents store (nirosta as far as ss, aluminum grade who knows).
I'm not commanding loyalty. That is like begging for money. Just wanted to shed a light on misconceptions on proposed misconceptions and left wing theory
BTW, a couple of years, ago, I bought a chinese derived mill. Thing is USELESS. Since you have such faith you can purchase it from me, I'll give you a BIG discount







HEY, this ebay thing can be quite fun. A $6000 price tag w/ $25000 machine aspirations is just wishful thinking. Reality has sure hit me that I WASTED $6000 LOL.


_Modified by [email protected] at 8:57 AM 1-9-2010_


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (burble X2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_
i don't have an exact figure, no. but if you're going to tell me that THEIR cost is over 200$ for casting and materials

YES
There manifolds are not sand casted for mass production.Why do you think no one has copied it as yet for cheap? 
Simple answer : because they can not.

_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_
the consumer *OF VWVORTEX* doesn't care about ethics, they care about saving money. 

Fixed for you. Many countries around the globe understand business ethics and business models.A few people on this forum lack the basic concepts.Capitalism aside , you are right about a couple of things though and I will elaborate on one.
Hurting profit margins = less money for product development.
This is not the Honda EG crowd.We have alot less people modifying there cars in the VW scene so every single company that does develop products feels the pinch when scenario's like this happen.
You want a $400 part that looks like ass then be my guest but do not expect others to think the way you do. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 25, 2007)

I completely agree and support our local vendors...and it is indeed essential to support them. Place aside the fact you will spend an extra couple of $100 for profit margin, but consider that they are taking into account their product and their customer's best interest.
Speaking from outside the box with years of experience and managing large engineering projects for global companies like ExxonMobil, BP Castrol and the like...Not trying to showboat here but I can tell you that not even a bolt or nut is allowed to be used from China aside from a few others even IF it is a non-integral part of the product.
Alternatively, some local vendors who indeed have their resources located in china and finish the product here in North America can do it as they employ a great deal of quality assurance, insuring their manufacturer comply with the contractual specifications.


_Modified by [email protected] at 11:57 AM 1-9-2010_


----------



## kamahao112 (Nov 17, 2007)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*

i have a car in my shop right now for a full body kit install and paint (240 w/a rb25 swap) and literally it was built by e bay "NOT BY ME" and it totally screams it http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif from the knock off manifold both intake and exhaust ,turbo and HKS wanna be blow off valve ..oh wait it was broken from the beginning so now it has a real Greddy bov on it now...
the owner is hoping to hit 500 whp and he just might but the real question is for how long??
you maybe able to BS the fans all you want but you cant bs the players!!! 



_Modified by kamahao112 at 7:19 AM 1-9-2010_


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_I completely agree and support our local vendors...and it is indeed essential to support them. Place aside the fact you will spend an extra couple of $100 for profit margin, but consider that they are taking into account their product and their customer's best interest.
Speaking from outside the box with years of experience and managing large engineering projects for global companies like ExxonMobil, BP Castrol and the like...Not trying to showboat here but I can tell you that not even a bolt or nut is allowed to be used from China aside from a few others even IF it is a non-integral part of the product.
Alternatively, some local vendors who indeed have their resources located in china and finish the product here in North America can do it as they employ a great deal of quality assurance, insuring their manufacturer comply with the contractual specifications.

_Modified by [email protected] at 11:57 AM 1-9-2010_

Its crazy Don. I go into Radioshack to purchase a LAN phone. A corded one w/ a wireless buddy. Apparently, you cant buy a phone in there that isnt made in China anymore. I purchased one as I was in a pinch. Out of the box, the cordless buddy is defective. It wont hold a charge for more then 30secs before it cuts out, dead. Lost the receipt, so I'm stuck w/ a brand new companion phone that lost a companion...
I bought a small rollable tool tray from a tool supply outfit online. Made in China. Had to go to the hardware store as the fastener kit was crap. 8 out of the 10 fasteners stripped as they were of some material I cannot understand why it had any business being in the package.
Has consumer expectations gone completely down the crapper in the hopes of saving a few bucks? Perhaps I should rethink my manufacturing practices and just give ppl what they want to pay for..


----------



## 20thAEGti1009 (Jan 28, 2005)

*FV-QR*

I don't see why anyone would want to put junk parts on their cars and then expect them to last. Anyone ever heard the saying "You get what you pay for"? or what about "You gotta pay to play"? I understand you work hard for your money and want to make it go as far as possible, but come on people. Support the people that support you. If it were not for these companies out there making these products those POS chinese companies would have nothing to copy. 
So man up work a little bit of overtime and buy your damn parts somewhere that will sell you quality parts and actually back them up if you have a failure. And who the hell really cares about profit margin, not me, because guess what.. the people making these parts (no the chinese junk) probably have over 50k in Mechanical Engineering degrees or another useful degree. The people at OBX and other companies like them dont need to have an ME degree to copy a **** ing part. So if wanna talk about profit margin lets talk about the big picture..
[/rant]


----------



## xpxhxoxexnxixxx (May 17, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (20thAEGti1009)*


_Quote, originally posted by *20thAEGti1009* »_I don't see why anyone would want to put junk parts on their cars and then expect them to last. Anyone ever heard the saying "You get what you pay for"? or what about "You gotta pay to play"? I understand you work hard for your money and want to make it go as far as possible, but come on people. Support the people that support you. If it were not for these companies out there making these products those POS chinese companies would have nothing to copy. 
So man up work a little bit of overtime and buy your damn parts somewhere that will sell you quality parts and actually back them up if you have a failure. And who the hell really cares about profit margin, not me, because guess what.. the people making these parts (no the chinese junk) probably have over 50k in Mechanical Engineering degrees or another useful degree. The people at OBX and other companies like them dont need to have an ME degree to copy a **** ing part. So if wanna talk about profit margin lets talk about the big picture..
[/rant]

As much complaining as i have done over the 3 cars ive built in the VW world, none will be more expensive than when i built my evo. And, in the end, im glad that quality parts cost as much as they do , because it really does separate the people that work and save the money and do the research to have those parts, from everyone else. And it makes me appreciate the occasional sale







Im glad every VW owner doesnt have a 500whp car..id shoot myself 
Most of these kids should spend their money on driving classes first anyway


----------



## Hybrid VW (Jan 18, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (xpxhxoxexnxixxx)*

It's all about risk vs. reward. Is the risk of having a total investment of ~$1400 in an intake mani and unknown hassle from buying from a company that has no customer support worth the potential reward of saving $200? I say do it once, and do it right. Buy from people that will support you, and QUIT SENDING OUR MONEY TO F-ING CHINA!!


----------



## surfo (Jan 6, 2006)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_

Let me know when either of you start producing your own parts.

I have, and yes... it`s very expensive!!!!


----------



## surfo (Jan 6, 2006)

Ask me why I havent oppened my big car shop and just sell on my little motorcycle store all my auto-performance parts and do the mechanical stuff on a friends VAG service shop?....
yes, because people DO NOT understand what good product and good service really costs!!!... "YEAH MY CAR DOES SWOOSH SWOOSH, JUST DON`T LOOK AT MY CRAPPY IDDLE OR 3PSI BOOST LEAK" hahahahaha
want to save money? Buy real parts and use them for life with real warranty!!! and not 3 bad quality parts! and pay more at the end!


----------



## boosted b5 (Nov 1, 2004)

*Re: (burble X2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_
x2
loyalty my ass, you can't tell me IE, APR, et al don't make a ass ton of money off their parts. if they were smart, they'd lower the price to make it somewhat competitive with the chinese. to bash the enthusiast of not being loyal is ridiculous. 
want my money? be more competitive. i bet that mani flows just fine, won't break or leak (what stresses do an intake mani deal with anyways?) and at 1/2 the price. hopefully apr and whoever else sets a competitive price point. they've already made tons of profit off their original "R&D". 

_Modified by burble X2 at 7:11 AM 1-9-2010_

now youre taking what ive said and twisting it around. 
i have supported my "local" shops for as long as i could. since i got into making a 1.8t fast ive been buying parts from Arnold solely. even if it means waiting for something. i find someone i like working with a stick to them. arnold has done me well. has taken calls on sundays, given me tons of advice. even gone as far as sourcing parts for me, to make something exactly as i want it. without a doubt arnold and pagparts is one of the best companies/resources in the 1.8t and vw turbocharging world.
now back to this manifold. yes its a cheap replica, sure it will make power.
no i wont buy anything from INA. yes i would run this. 
first choice to run this eBay gem ? no
for intake manifolds:
APR gets my vote for an off the shelf, mass produced item.
custom sheet metal, id get an inlet dynamics or have arnold fab one up for me. again, back to supporting a New York business/small guys(ID)


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

wow what a complete piece of chit. Anyone who runs this is A) a retard B) cheap C) waiting for intake leaks
All to save a couple bones. Jesus Christ some of you are so fing cheap it's unbelievable. And it's not even a nice or decent looking manifold, I've seen homebrews that look to have more potential then that pos. 
That mani + 20psi = fail IMHO 
http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


----------



## 20thAEGti1009 (Jan 28, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_wow what a complete piece of chit. Anyone who runs this is A) a retard B) cheap C) waiting for intake leaks
All to save a couple bones. Jesus Christ some of you are so fing cheap it's unbelievable. And it's not even a nice or decent looking manifold, I've seen homebrews that look to have more potential then that pos. 
That mani + 20psi = fail IMHO 
http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 


im glad there are still some people around that have some common sense. anyone that would be willing to run this should just sell there car and buy a Honda and a nice ebay fart can


----------



## zerb (Mar 18, 2005)

*Re: FV-QR (20thAEGti1009)*

someone man up and buy this thing and push some psi through it and see when it lets go just for fun.


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (zerb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerb* »_someone man up and buy this thing and push some psi through it and see when it lets go just for fun. 

I will put in $50 to buy one
who else is in? I would love to test it next to a true RMR unit.


----------



## -Khaos- (Dec 22, 2003)

*FV-QR*

lol, you guys wanna send me a late Xmas, birthday gift? I'll hook it up.








Stock turbo FTMFW!


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Has consumer expectations gone completely down the crapper in the hopes of saving a few bucks? Perhaps I should rethink my manufacturing practices and just give ppl what they want to pay for..



You know they have al... perfect example is mcdonalds... thed double cheeseburger use to be on the dolalr menu and they take a slice of cheese from it to save money and then turn around and make the double cheeseburger up... 
and second please dont rethink your practices i like your high quality work


----------



## coreyj (Aug 18, 2006)

motice the people who argue that this is a good product are noobs. lol and they have probably all come from the honda scene.
most of the older guys have been there done that and changed for the better.
o yea and issam i have $30 for that manifold. whos next?


_Modified by coreyj at 11:21 AM 1-10-2010_


----------



## ghostinc1 (Jan 3, 2010)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*

those manifolds look hot http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif but i agree with the earlier posts that have been made. good points made btw


_Modified by ghostinc1 at 9:37 AM 1-10-2010_


----------



## boraturbo01 (Jul 21, 2006)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (ghostinc1)*

i am all for saving money but this is not what i had in mind, i would just save up a few money bucks and get a name brand that is proven.


----------



## coreyj (Aug 18, 2006)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (boraturbo01)*


_Quote, originally posted by *boraturbo01* »_i am all for saving money but this is not what i had in mind, i would just save up a few money bucks and get a name brand that is proven.

exactly, or do what i do And buy name name brand parts that are slightly used for cheap.


----------



## 1.8t67 (Dec 7, 2008)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (coreyj)*

the only way i get to save money is when i get hooked up for being loyal to the few companies i do business with. QUALITY companies. if they feel like passing along a discount, cool. if not, thats cool. they know i won't order from anyone else in the industry. people have families/bills and themselves to support. i wouldn't be ok with our client coming to me and asking me to discount my craft for them...lol. only way i would buy this part, is if i were paying for it by weight. 


_Modified by 1.8t67 at 5:00 PM 1-10-2010_


----------



## Bug_racer (Oct 13, 2002)

*Re: (Issam Abed)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Issam Abed* »_
Really? Do you know what an APR exhaust manifold COSTS to make?
APR makes there money on SOFTWARE not HARDWARE.


APR makes money on everything . I dunno if you guys have seen prices overseas but here is an example :
APR dogbone mount : $85
http://www.goapr.com.au/products/18t-em.html
APR Cat back : $1950
APR Downpipe : $1100
http://www.goapr.com.au/produc....html
shall I continue ?


----------



## Issam Abed (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: (Bug_racer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Bug_racer* »_

APR makes money on everything . I dunno if you guys have seen prices overseas but here is an example :
APR dogbone mount : $85
http://www.goapr.com.au/products/18t-em.html
APR Cat back : $1950
APR Downpipe : $1100
http://www.goapr.com.au/produc....html
shall I continue ?

Apples to Oranges....
that is APR Australia which is not run by APR in the US.
When you order from Guy (or whoever it is now) you are paying for the import taxes + duties + his mark up. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vwjunkie68 (Feb 17, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*











_Modified by vwjunkie68 at 2:34 AM 1-11-2010_


----------



## yohimbe (Jun 13, 2005)

*Re: (vwjunkie68)*

I am curious when whoever (obx ..) sells copies from APR, SEM intake manifolds.
I only have seen a Dahlbak clone, but not very often offered


----------



## Savvv (Apr 22, 2009)

*Re: (burble X2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_blahblahblah 

You couldn't be more wrong. When people decide to buy cheap products (doesn't matter what market), you force the quality-parts/items companies to figure out ways to cut costs to lower their prices. One of the absolute worst and most devastating ways they do this is to outsource their production. Aren't Craftsmans tools made in China now, or have been for a few years? I bought a $200 tap/die set from Sears and after using the M8x1.25 die a few times the starter teeth chipped off.







Garrett...supposedly now their turbos are assembled in China. Now how can we have the same great trust in a company who stood out as being one of the top turbo manufacturers? How does this happen? Oh, here's how. You don't support the companies that support YOU with better products. Hell why don't we just get rid of American production all-together and allow the Chinese to do the R&D? It'll save everyone this drama/hassle of arguing over who to buy from b/c so and so did this much work but the other guy just copied it. Oh wait, then if production is gone that means people will lose their jobs. This sounds familiar, but then again who are we to argue, we all drive Volkswagens, not GM.








You can't afford a $12,000 American-made build for 450whp but you can afford a $6,000 chinese build for the same power, then you deserve every single bit of misfortune that comes with it.


----------



## bootymac (Apr 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*

lol
Why don't we just talk about the manifold at hand here and save the "business discussion" for people who actually know what they're talking about. My brain is going to explode just from reading some of the comments in this thread


----------



## 1.8t67 (Dec 7, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (bootymac)*


_Quote, originally posted by *bootymac* »_lol
Why don't we just talk about the manifold at hand here and save the "business discussion" for people who actually know what they're talking about. 

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## mescaline (Jul 15, 2005)

america vs china again







people don't realize that america would make products just as cheap if they could...they can't...China beats any prices anywhere, cheap manpower...that's about it.
There is no doubt that product can be made in China with exact same quality but that product will cost close to the price that will cost in USA...well not exactly but close, some companies will ignore this difference so they can say "made in USA" but some companies that move lots of stuff like Garrett (or VW) will do this in China because they will save a lot. 
It's very simple math...


----------



## 636glx (Jul 17, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (zerb)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zerb* »_someone man up and buy this thing and push some psi through it and see when it lets go just for fun. 

its likely someone has bought one on hear but will not admit to it in fear off all you talking $hit


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

Don't worry guys, reasonable costing manufacturing will come back here after the economy tanks and we have hyperinflation then a ton of deflation.
It will cost too much to import this stuff.
On a side note, if this thing stays straight it probably makes better power than stock, but I am willing to bet it is made from recycled faygo cans and will warp under some good heat.
I just did a ford 4.0l I6 and the plastic composite lower manifold was warped bad enough to need hondabond HT all over it to seal.
That was a well researched plastic composite, arguably better than chinese aluminum.


----------



## xilovelsdx (Feb 18, 2008)

Id slap this on my car. Someone want to start a fund for 100 bucks for me and ill buy this **** asap.


----------



## UF DUB (Aug 28, 2003)

*Re: (xilovelsdx)*

Too many products that are designed in the USA are copied in China and then sold back to us, or in their domestic products at lower prices than those that originally designed it. It is well known that they rip off intellectual property, patents, new desigs, everything. And, yes, they have lower costs due to cheaper labor and lower quality control. But, they also benefit from a government that purposefully deflates the value of their money (the Juan I believe) so that their products are cheaper to global markets. Do a little research.
I would be happy to buy a Chinese product that was originally designed in China, if it was competitive. Let me know when you find that combo.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (UF DUB)*

ru-roh















..
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...ories


----------



## yohimbe (Jun 13, 2005)

general question about the rmr or rmr-clone. it looks like the manis do have shorter runners . does these manis have a worse low end or does this only look that short


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

*FV-QR*

I have a real RMR and the runners are pretty short.


----------



## G-radoT (May 20, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (screwball)*

Could they possibly put anymore welds on this thing?
Buy quality parts with REAL engineering principles and trial fittings to back them up. There are no shortcuts to making quality performance products.
_In response to the APR exhaust manifold comment:_ 
Who else in the VW world is using Inconel? This is what F1 exhausts are made of and very hard material to machine and clean up after the casting. Wanna bet it cost big money to have multiple prototypes made, dynoed, remade, test fit etc before releasing the final iteration.
_Business discusion:_ 
This is 100% a business discussion. The US economy since WWII has slowly been shifting to Chinese made product. As it has moved it has allowed consumers to consume more products for less money. Sub prime interest rates helped keep the economy going, and allowed the consumption of more Chines stuff unitll the debt was no longer able to be hidden. 
Guess who owns the bulk of the US fiscal deficit? You guessed it; China.
So US policy is between a rock and a hard place:
US can't increase duty on Chinese product in order to create US manufacturing because China will cry foul as they have in the past. No US manufacturing left to pick up the slack and the economy will falter if the product prices increase...
Nutshell:
1-Don't support crap products because some has to make the good one for the other guy to rip off. 
2-If you do, remember, you are selling out your own job and lively hood. 
Signed,
IE rods, APR Intake mani, GT2871R. 
(Soon to be FFE manifold and Autotech Wavetrac LSD) 
I put my money where my mouth is.


----------



## yohimbe (Jun 13, 2005)

I agree with the patriotic guys here, funny for me is I am hearing the same discussion in my company, but the difference is my company outsources the jobs to a "low wage country" called the united states, ok to be fair the US are not low as asia and a big reason for my company is to have a production in the dollar region because of the high euro. but it is a little dejavu.


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

http://www.rossmachineracing.com/20vVWintake.html
By the time you have the manifold at your door it is now 800$ with shipping.
So this is a little over half the cost, and likely will end up cheaper after a while.


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*

FYI - the OBX only comes in a small port configuration currently


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*Re: (technician)*


_Quote, originally posted by *technician* »_FYI - the OBX only comes in a small port configuration currently









Not according to their site
Small Port Head Engine Codes:
ADR, AMB, AMU, APT, APU, ARG, ATC, ATW, AWM, AWW, AWP, BEA
Large Port Head Engine Codes :
AEB, AGU, AFYC


----------



## coreyj (Aug 18, 2006)

to be honest obx might actually buy all there parts from RMR and just assemble it themselves because they are identical parts.


----------



## BiH (Nov 27, 2000)

*Re: (coreyj)*

I just have a hard time buying cheap crap stuff like that cause it has bit me in ass before! I have broken cheap tools before on more than one occasion. I use mostly craftsman stuff just cause its decent and I havent broken anything yet. allthough craftsman needs to hire my brother in law to test their tools, he breaks stuff like its made out of butter, unreal! 2 18mm sockets split taking of a caliper, I wonder what would they say when I show it to them? 
most of the time the rule "you get what you pay for" applies! 


_Modified by BiH at 8:11 PM 1-26-2010_


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*FV-QR*

True the get what you pay for thing but really, if it doesn't leak it should be fine. The temps it sees wont be crazy high and there isn't a whole lot of stress put on the thing so really what is going to happen? I would like to see how it performs back to back dynos from someone who has NOTHING to gain either way: eg: someone who is an average joe and not a vendor or affiliated with the vendors


----------



## BiH (Nov 27, 2000)

*Re: FV-QR (jwalker1.8)*

thats why I said "most of the time"
welds on it look crappy but hey im just picky at times!


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: (jwalker1.8)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwalker1.8* »_
Not according to their site
Small Port Head Engine Codes:
ADR, AMB, AMU, APT, APU, ARG, ATC, ATW, AWM, AWW, AWP, BEA
Large Port Head Engine Codes :
AEB, AGU, AFYC 

Yep any logical person would come to the same conclusion, I did, but they don't. . .
"With either a large port or small port design, both head variations are covered [by one size]."
They mean with the current small port size they have. ridiculous huh. I just got one (because I've run out of $$ for my rebuild) and it was a small port, even though I ordered an AEB. Contacted them and they informed me that they (OBX) only have the small port right now and they are going to revise their listing to be more clear/accurate about this.
Although I want the RMR. . . my funds, or lack there of prohibit it. The quality of the OBX was fair. The welds were some what rough and the inside of the plenum along with the runners was not as smooth as the RMR appears to be. There is also a seam that runs along the plenum where the runners connect that is a bit rough. The RMR is a true extrusion and thus doesn't have this problem. Although I didn't pressure test it, it would certainly have held. All the welds were complete, it is just of a lesser quality finish than the RMR. I guess my project will take a bit longer than I thought. . . $$. If SEM is a 10 and RMR a 9 this would be a 6.5-7.0, it would definetely function but the finish leaves much to be desired.


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Hmmm, so I can only assume by your post you returned it. Wish you would have taken pics...actual pics not their web pics


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (jwalker1.8)*

Yeah, I actuallly still have it - it looks just like the photos, but if you really want and for the sake and prosterity of Vortex I can pull it out and shoot it. It came today and I wanted to send it back ASAP so I could gets me $$ back. Still waiting on a return tag. I'll take some pics. . . LMK if you have any requests


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (technician)*

How's the taper on the runners from the large opening in the plenum down to the head flange? That is, is the taper long and smooth like the factory runner, or does it go from very large to very small in a short distance?


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*FV-QR*

I would be interested to see actual pics


----------



## carsluTT (Dec 31, 2004)

wow....... after reading all of this wow..... manifold seems a bit overly cheap. is the American way really saving money at the sake of saving sanity? this manifold seems like a headache waiting to happen.


----------



## nopistons (Mar 4, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (jwalker1.8)*

when i do buy a manifold, i wont be buying this peice of crap. look past the price tag. the $400 difference is for the R&D this product lacks, you guys are telling me you're fine with running a manifold that could flow +/- 10-15% between each runner?


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (nopistons)*

I would be extremely surprised if that were the case. I think it would be near identical to the RMR that is 3% across the runners


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_How's the taper on the runners from the large opening in the plenum down to the head flange? That is, is the taper long and smooth like the factory runner, or does it go from very large to very small in a short distance?

All of the tapering occurs at the top of the runner where it joins the plenum, after that it is a parallel untapered tube. I will post pics tonight or by the AM http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (technician)*


_Quote, originally posted by *technician* »_I would be extremely surprised if that were the case. I think it would be near identical to the RMR that is 3% across the runners


Look at the inside of it. That is a good part of why the Ross unit flows so well. Gouges, bumps, and the fact that the runner sticks up 1mm or so is a big deal. 
Junk.


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*

so anyone buy this thing et and test it....


----------



## tedgram (Jul 2, 2005)

Most of their stuff on ebay has a buy it now price and a make offer also.


----------



## coreyj (Aug 18, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (technician)*


_Quote, originally posted by *technician* »_Yeah, I actuallly still have it - it looks just like the photos, but if you really want and for the sake and prosterity of Vortex I can pull it out and shoot it. It came today and I wanted to send it back ASAP so I could gets me $$ back. Still waiting on a return tag. I'll take some pics. . . LMK if you have any requests

please please please send it to INA for testing.


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (coreyj)*

Hey I thought about that but I really needed to get this back to them so I can find another solution. FYI- Regarding the "offer" tuning depot did $390 shipped.
































































































As promised! Well you get what you pay for!


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (technician)*

Thanks for the pics!


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*

No worries http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## EugeneDubbin (Aug 31, 2008)

hah, disgusting. ill build my own thx


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

That is better than stock, and would show gains..... but I am disgusted by it somehow, and not just because of the poor worksmanship and super cheap aluminum.
The welding, that looks like something else for sure. 
That thing would need to be pressure tested and likely has some leaks.
It looks like it was made by children in sweat shop conditions, but doing fabrication work


----------



## coreyj (Aug 18, 2006)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*

Id run it.







looks better than what i could work up. 


_Modified by coreyj at 2:13 AM 1-28-2010_


----------



## not SoQuick (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*

I could care less how the welds look on the outside,but look at how they made the runners go into the plenum








If you guys want to be cheap go make it yourself,
this mani here is one case of where being cheap will cost you more.
if you want a good cheap mani that is worth using why not buy the parts from RMR use a stock flange or better yet one from INA and make your own.
Take a welding class and take some pride in your ride being built not bought .While saving money and supporting the sport










_Quote, originally posted by *coreyj* »_Id run it.







looks better than what i could work up. 



worried about how your welds would look? just add some extra,grind smooth and polish,takes time but looks 1000 times better










_Modified by not SoQuick at 1:30 AM 1-28-2010_


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

*Re: (coreyj)*


_Quote, originally posted by *coreyj* »_Id run it.







looks better than what i could work up. 

_Modified by coreyj at 2:13 AM 1-28-2010_

Hope you like pressure testing and then trying to have that garbage aluminum welded to make it seal. There are a lot of questionable spots there on that manifold.

I get the feeling that when these threads happen the people who would run total garbage parts and spend time polishing turds are young.
Once you get to about 30 and you have some children and other responsibilities you try to do things right the first time because you know time is very finite and short.
The last thing I feel like doing is fixing a piece of crap like that which was made by some kid strapped to a tig welder in taiwan.
I will spend that time tweaking my car, enjoying it and relaxing.


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*

Is that the 1000hp manifold *blackedoutaudi/fatjonperformance/victory* made ?


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*

has one been tried out yet


----------



## Lou_Y2mK5 (Apr 6, 2008)

OMG that looks like craaaaaap!!! Those velocity stakes are retched!


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (Lou_Y2mK5)*

I think there's a lot of e-engineering in this thread. Those making claims of horridness need to back them up a bit more. I'm in no way defending this peice, but just because it was manufactured in china does not mean its crap.
1) Yes, the welds are not as nice in appearance as the lovely TIG'ed stack of dimes coming out of Ed's shop. However, the penetration looks to be up to par given this part will see minimal temp variations (as compared to an exhaust mani) and almost no loading. The MIG welds on my Boost Factory SMIC are just as "unsightly" yet are doing just fine.
2) There's nothing wrong with not using extrusion for the plenum body. Since the stacks are welded in, there's not that much extra welding that needs to be done to close up the plenum.
3) There's nothing wrong (relatively speaking) with the machining grooves left in the stacks or the way the stacks do not sit perfectly flush in the plenum floor. The velocity of the air approachs zero the closer it is to the static walls of the plenum and stacks (according the laws of fluiddynamics). Therefore, these small defects likely do very little to disrupt the flow...given the velocity ranges one can expect this manifold to be operating in (i.e. 300-400whp range)
The only problems I see are:
1) They ripped off RMR's design.
2) The runners are not tappered but simply straight through to the head flange.
In summation: yes, it's unfair they ripped off RMR's design. However, this is something that is to be expected and considered normal in a product's overall life cycle (take generic drugs for example). Yes, it's a small port-only design as of now. That might be OK however for those who do not wish to get a new head or port their existing one, yet who are looking for something with a tad larger plenum and *gasp* something a bit more attractive than the pop-log factory manifold. Ultimately, it's a sub $400 intake manifold that potentially offers small port head users a chance to affordably increase the plenum volume and clean up the engine bay a bit. To get costs down, some concessions were made; it's up to the end user to determine if they are worth it.
I'm all for picking a peice apart that's not up to par, but some of the critisisms in this thread are rather retarded.


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

I wonder if RMR's got grounds to do anything? I know they know about this manifold.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *http://images.google.com/imgre...m%3D1* »_
1. Introduction -- A product is developed and comes to market.
2. Growth -- Consumers learn about it and more people buy it. It becomes more competitive through modification, price adjustments, wider distribution and other initiatives.
3. Maturity -- The product generates profits with less "tinkering." But problems can arise, such as the arrival of competing products in the marketplace. The product maybe modified or marketed in a new way to keep profits strong.
4. Decline -- Sales decrease because of market saturation, obsolescence or other factors.
Placing a product on this timeline suggests strategies for keeping its profitability high. Example: If profits sag during the Maturity stage, the manufacturer might offer discounted pricing or wider distribution.









This is in response to the massive econ argument on the first two pages. Yes it sux that people rip off other peoples design. There are ways to prevent this from happening (patents and copyrighting), but even those only last so long. In the end, it is to be expected that the profitable life of any product is finite.
Again, look at the generic drug market for an example.


----------



## TheBossQ (Aug 15, 2009)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_
In summation: yes, it's unfair they ripped off RMR's design. However, this is something that is to be expected and considered normal in a product's overall life cycle (take generic drugs for example). 

Are you serious? Did you just compare stealing patented designs and intellectual property to the manufacturing of generic drugs?
Generic drugs are legal. They can be made once a company's patent has expired. And if you are referring to the Mexico pharmacies, then you only supported everyone else's arguments. If you end up getting an infection, I invite you to cross the border for your antibiotics.
You made sense up until that ludicrous statement.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (screwball)*


_Quote, originally posted by *screwball* »_I wonder if RMR's got grounds to do anything? I know they know about this manifold.

They most certainly can if their design is patented. However, fighting it will cost tons and I doubt it would be worth it since those buying this likely would not have bought the Ross one had it not been on the market.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (TheBossQ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheBossQ* »_
Are you serious? Did you just compare stealing patented designs and intellectual property to the manufacturing of generic drugs?
Generic drugs are legal. They can be made once a company's patent has expired. And if you are referring to the Mexico pharmacies, then you only supported everyone else's arguments. If you end up getting an infection, I invite you to cross the border for your antibiotics.
You made sense up until that ludicrous statement.

Is their design patented? Has it expired? If it is patented and not expired, then I take that all back. I'm not condoning stealing patented intellectual property, however once patens expire (or if you never bothered to protect your design in the first place) all bets are off.
I work as a design engineer and deal with this all the time. Our designs get reproduced all the time without our consent. Some are protected while others are not. Our company has to rely on a combination of lawyers and added value (through intangibles like customer support, etc.) to keep our customers from going to the dark side.



_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 11:05 AM 1-28-2010_


----------



## Lou_Y2mK5 (Apr 6, 2008)

lol call it what you will. It still looks like crap. Dont' care where it's made or who made it. 
Just open your eyes and look. There will always be a market for the budget builders that end up getting burned and end up selling/parting their car. 
The only way this would be worth buying with any one that has common sense is proof in the flow numbers and testing AS WELL as long time use without issues. What's the point in saving now if you need to end up buying another one if it breaks. Are they going to warranty it? uhm no. Why not? APR has lifetime warranty on all their parts. Is there no value in lifetime warranty any more? 
There are my two pennies. As you were people! Lol


----------



## TheBossQ (Aug 15, 2009)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_Is their design patented? Has it expired? If it is patented and not expired, then I take that all back. I'm not condoning stealing patented intellectual property, however once patens expire (or if you never bothered to protect your design in the first place) all bets are off.
_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 11:04 AM 1-28-2010_

Now we are in agreement.








To be fair, I don't know if Ross patented the design. But the point I was making is that you can't compare what a lot of the Chinese companies do in terms of design theft to the manufacture of generic drugs.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (Lou_Y2mK5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lou_Y2mK5* »_lol call it what you will. It still looks like crap. Dont' care where it's made or who made it. 
Just open your eyes and look. There will always be a market for the budget builders that end up getting burned and end up selling/parting their car. 
The only way this would be worth buying with any one that has common sense is proof in the flow numbers and testing AS WELL as long time use without issues. What's the point in saving now if you need to end up buying another one if it breaks. Are they going to warranty it? uhm no. Why not? APR has lifetime warranty on all their parts. Is there no value in lifetime warranty any more? 
There are my two pennies. As you were people! Lol


Again, "open you eyes and look" is not an argument. Flow number testing is also not an argument since the other manifolds avaiable in this price range are homebrews. I'll happily concede the point on warrenties. That is something that may or may not be worth the extra $300 to some.
Let me reiterate I have absolutely no interest in buying this thing. Just playing devil's advocate here.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (TheBossQ)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TheBossQ* »_
Now we are in agreement.








To be fair, I don't know if Ross patented the design. But the point I was making is that you can't compare what a lot of the Chinese companies do in terms of design theft to the manufacture of generic drugs.

100% agree


----------



## Lou_Y2mK5 (Apr 6, 2008)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_
Again, "open you eyes and look" is not an argument. Flow number testing is also not an argument since the other manifolds avaiable in this price range are homebrews. I'll happily concede the point on warrenties. That is something that may or may not be worth the extra $300 to some.
Let me reiterate I have absolutely no interest in buying this thing. Just playing devil's advocate here.

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I know you are. I like technical debates. makes this forum interesting asside from the sales and "my turbo don't make boost" threads.


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

I guarantee you that the manifold would have leaks if you pressure tested it, and probably would not idle worth a ****, since those leaks would be post map.
Factor in your time spent welding to correct them, or paying someone if you do not have the equipment and then welding that garbage aluminum, you have a lot of risk to mitigate.
That aluminum looks much worse than my godspeed intercooler.
Again if you guys want to screw around and play lets make this part work properly and take that risk, go ahead.
I am not rich, but one thing I can not afford is wasted time and BS


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gdoggmoney* »_I am not rich, but one thing I can not afford is wasted time, *re buying parts* and BS


http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Lou_Y2mK5 (Apr 6, 2008)

^ Sig worthy!


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *gdoggmoney* »_I guarantee you that the manifold would have leaks if you pressure tested it, and probably would not idle worth a ****, since those leaks would be post map.
Factor in your time spent welding to correct them, or paying someone if you do not have the equipment and then welding that garbage aluminum, you have a lot of risk to mitigate.
That aluminum looks much worse than my godspeed intercooler.
Again if you guys want to screw around and play lets make this part work properly and take that risk, go ahead.
I am not rich, but one thing I can not afford is wasted time and BS


what type of guarantee are you gonna put that this thing leaks... will you guarantee that it it leaks you'll fix it for free for me


----------



## cincyTT (May 11, 2006)

*Re: (Lou_Y2mK5)*

This mani is close in design but not on the same quality as a RMR. We all know it will still improve power and probably last for anyone running under 30psi for a long time to come. Id still probably pick this up over a ABD if i was to choose. THe only part that looks worrisome to me is the inside where the RMR is clean and smooth and the obx has a large gap between runners and down the middle that could cause an issue. The only thing i dont like about the RMR is that you still have to buy a fpr or an adapter for it.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gdoggmoney* »_I guarantee you that the manifold would have leaks if you pressure tested it, and probably would not idle worth a ****, since those leaks would be post map.


If it did have a few pinhole leaks, I'm not sure how you can conclude it would run like chit. Pinholes would not be enough to cause pressure drops. Granted I still run a MAF file, I've had a few rubber port plugs deteriorate on me after a year or so on some of the unused bungs on my stock IM. Even though they were leaking like no tomorrow, the system still pressurized under boost since the turbo could flow enough to make up for the loss. The only side effect was an occasional pop on decel and hiccup in the idle.
With that being said, there's a very good chance that there are no leaks. even if there were, it would cost $20 at most to have someone spend 5min taking care of it.

_Quote, originally posted by *gdoggmoney* »_
That aluminum looks much worse than my godspeed intercooler.


You've got a very good eye then. What specific things about the metal can you see wrong?


_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 12:31 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## cincyTT (May 11, 2006)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_
If it did have a few pinhole leaks, I'm not sure how you can conclude it would run like chit. Pinholes would not be enough to cause pressure drops. 

I have to agree here. A while back i read a David Buschur post on evom that claimed their garrett ic cores come with pinhole leaks in it. Whats funny is there solution is if you find one is to use a drop of super glue which works fine on 40+ psi drag cars


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (cincyTT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *cincyTT* »_This mani is close in design but not on the same quality as a RMR. We all know it will still improve power and probably last for anyone running under 30psi for a long time to come. Id still probably pick this up over a ABD if i was to choose. THe only part that looks worrisome to me is the inside where the RMR is clean and smooth and the obx has a large gap between runners and down the middle that could cause an issue. The only thing i dont like about the RMR is that you still have to buy a fpr or an adapter for it. 

Exactly. Due to it's price point and quality, this should be compared to the ABD manifold. For me, *as long as the RMR mani is either not patented, has an expired patent, or this does not violate the RMR patent* (the stacks are indeed different), then this manifold is the clear winner. Let's face it, the ABD manifold is butt ugly and does not offer you the ability to sawp TB locations.
If it does in fact infringe on the RMR mani, then I say fu(k the chineese manifold and the thieving pony it rode in on. 


_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 12:38 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## bootymac (Apr 19, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_I think there's a lot of e-engineering in this thread. Those making claims of horridness need to back them up a bit more. I'm in no way defending this peice, but just because it was manufactured in china does not mean its crap.

Couldn't agree any more. I just wish we had the opportunity to impartially test the manifold and get objective results.


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_
If it did have a few pinhole leaks, I'm not sure how you can conclude it would run like chit. Pinholes would not be enough to cause pressure drops. Granted I still run a MAF file, I've had a few rubber port plugs deteriorate on me after a year or so on some of the unused bungs on my stock IM. Even though they were leaking like no tomorrow, the system still pressurized under boost since the turbo could flow enough to make up for the loss. The only side effect was an occasional pop on decel and hiccup in the idle. 

And vacuum leaking into the motor post map.... Yeah..... Why do we build race cars and attempt to attain high levels of efficiency and sealing again?
So what if your piston rings leak by 5-6% of the charge!
Because those 5% gains here and there are cumulative. 
Pop stutter decel hiccup at idle natural lean condition forced compensation by the ecu and fuel trims, which constant trimming on large injectors = stuttering. That is stupid, I refuse to drive some stuttery ****box around that is constantly carboning up and has spark knock because of poor hardware, and larger injectors.
I guess you could tune around your child labor manufactured leaky manifold, or you know fix the root cause of the issue which would be the leaking ****ty manifold.

_Quote, originally posted by *Nola* »_With that being said, there's a very good chance that there are no leaks. even if there were, it would cost $20 at most to have someone spend 5min taking care of it.

Yeah, good luck with that. Did you look at the welds and the material surrounding? Go ahead and try to have that tig'd up proper. When the guy is done swearing and burning through that garbage, and patching your raggedy anne looking manifold all those nice efficiency gains will be gone.
And yes that metal will be hell to weld, just like all the chinese garbage that comes over here, with no exceptions. It took bribing and a very very skilled guy to weld my 50mm tial flange to the godspeed intercooler piping. He had a lot to say, and I could see while watching how the puddling went and just how the inconsistency in the material made it an act of almost futility. Fine here, blow through there, consistent Miller Syncrowave welder done 100% proper.
That stuff makes my godspeed piping look quality. The welds on my godspeed chinese junk core and piping are lightyears ahead of that.
I guess even China is going down in quality.

























This is likely a better looking weld too, that is laughable...









See all that discoloration and garbage? Yeah, my godspeed super chinese intercooler that has seen winters and roadsalt looks much better than that. 
Don't even try to tell me the only difference is due to the RMR's procedure for making their manifolds vs the welding on these. It is in areas 1-2" away from welds.
This looks like it is made of recycled RC soda cans and they polished the outside to make it flashy. I can see what look like pores in some critical areas in the welds too.


_Quote, originally posted by *Nola* »_You've got a very good eye then. What specific things about the metal can you see wrong?


See above.
Other things I note about metal on the vehicles I own. My pagparts manifold? It has seen the most extreme abuse I have ever put any exhaust hardware through in my life, without boring details at a point it was almost see through.
It has aged in an identical manner to the Garret OEM turbine housing casting, and both do not leak. 
My nice leakproof v-band wastegate extension, do you think that could have been done well on a chinese iron manifold? 
My old iron ebay manifold? yeah, the thing was powdering with rust, totally different way of aging, constant warping due to inferior materials. You know why they look different? Because they are made from different materials, and are DIFFERENT QUALITY. They age and act different throughout their life.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*

First, you are assuming there will be leaks at the welds. Pinholes not detectable by the naked eye are not going to make a bit of difference. The only argument one could make in terms of leaks would be that there is a potential the flange is warped beyond what a gasket can compensate for. If that's the case, then you will have to deck it yourself.
Second, the heat affected zones around the welds look pretty normal given this was MIG welded by hand. I'll concede there is def some inclusions/porosity in areas, however given the heat fluctation and loading this will experience it may not matter. People are free to post up personal experiences that show otherwise (insert cracked manifold pics here). 
Third, you do not have x-ray eyes therefore there's no way you can tell me what quality aluminum was used by looking at pictures over the internet. Even if they did use a lesser quality material, how can you prove the lower cost doesn't outweigh the perceived need for a higher grade material? These parts do not operate anywehere near the point of yeild, so unless there are some other added benefits to using a high grade alum in this case (beyond say 6061 or 6063) there's really no point.
Remember, this is a small port manifold that cost $400. People in this market can most surely go out and spend money on a nicer piece, however the benefits of a nicer design (say the SEM) are likely not worth the extra $400 to those who this manifold targets, namely small port head, small frame turbo people who don't like the ABD manifold.
Again, I'm just trying to be objective here. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 25, 2007)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gdoggmoney* »_
This is likely a better looking weld too, that is laughable...









Duurty...


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_First, you are assuming there will be leaks at the welds. Pinholes not detectable by the naked eye are not going to make a bit of difference. The only argument one could make in terms of leaks would be that there is a potential the flange is warped beyond what a gasket can compensate for. If that's the case, then you will have to deck it yourself.
Second, the heat affected zones around the welds look pretty normal given this was MIG welded by hand. I'll concede there is def some inclusions/porosity in areas, however given the heat fluctuation and loading this will experience it may not matter. People are free to post up personal experiences that show otherwise (insert cracked manifold pics here). 
Third, you do not have x-ray eyes therefore there's no way you can tell me what quality aluminum was used by looking at pictures over the internet. Even if they did use a lesser quality material, how can you prove the lower cost doesn't outweigh the perceived need for a higher grade material? These parts do not operate anywhere near the point of yield, so unless there are some other added benefits to using a high grade alum in this case (beyond say 6061 or 6063) there's really no point.
Remember, this is a small port manifold that cost $400. People in this market can most surely go out and spend money on a nicer piece, however the benefits of a nicer design (say the SEM) are likely not worth the extra $400 to those who this manifold targets, namely small port head, small frame turbo people who don't like the ABD manifold.
Again, I'm just trying to be objective here. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

These "people" in the sub $400 market (for an intake manifold) shouldn't even be considering an aftermarket manifold simply due to the reasons that,
A) There entire setup is budget and will most likely stay that way.
B) They won't gain any hp since they are not running efficient enough setups to need a larger volume plenum.
C) Their money can be spent well elsewhere FAR before they'll ever need an aftermarket intake manifold.
P.S That manifold is TIG welded not MIG welded. Probably by a sub 13 year old child in a sweat shop...just saying.
My $.02 is that if a person has a setup that will yield power from such an upgrade, then they have surely covered all other aspects of a high hp BT setup, and at this point an aftermarket manifold will be beneficial. If this person covered these aspects PROPERLY they would hopefully realize at that point to run a $400 FAIL manifold would only take them one step back in the game. 
Not to say eBay stuff is all 100% chit, but I'm sure most of the people who will buy this manifold have stock turbo's and no idea what they are doing. Simply due to the reason that this thing is so cheap, it's going to attract an uneducated individual. Those of us who know what works and what lasts will stay well away from such a product. This goes for most of the eBay replica pieces.


----------



## not SoQuick (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_
Remember, this is a small port manifold that cost $400. People in this market can most surely go out and spend money on a nicer piece, however the benefits of a nicer design (say the SEM) are likely not worth the extra $400 to those who this manifold targets, namely small port head, small frame turbo people who don't like the ABD manifold.
Again, I'm just trying to be objective here. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

in your objective opinion would the gains seen from this mani be worth the $400 over keeping your stock one? or spending the money elsewhere to optimise your setup??
I know I could swap out a small port head for a big port with a little digging for $400










_Modified by not SoQuick at 1:59 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

*Re: (not SoQuick)*

if your BT you will most likely see 30+ wheel depending on your setup, head, cams, compressor efficiency, etc.. If your still on a stock turbo; spend your cash elsewhere


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (16plus4v)*

I'm one of those people in the market for an affordable manifold. The reason at the top of my list is, dare I say it, to replace the rediculously ugly stock manifold with something that looks better. I'm running a 28RS, have no plans of ever going bigger, and am perfectly content with my current power level around 300whp. I will stay with the small port head and will continue to run the stock TB. 
Therefore, while the smallport versions of the RMR and SEM manifolds are beautiful and likely outperform this one in all areas, the added expense may not be worth it to someone like me. It's a cost/benefit thing. If I'm not going to take advantage of the added value a more expensive manifold offers, it makes no sense for me to buy it.
So, my qualifiers are:
1) must look good
2) must not perform worse than the stock manifold
3) must be affordable (i.e. meet my needs for a price I think is appropriate)
4) must not break in the next few years under normal daily driving conditions.
5) must be small port and accept the stock TB
6) must not be made illegally (by stealling patented designs)
Using these criteria, it's easy to rule out the nicer manifolds in my case.


_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 4:14 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_I'm one of those people in the market for an affordable manifold. The reason at the top of my list is, dare I say it, to replace the rediculously ugly stock manifold with something that looks better. I'm running a 28RS, have no plans of ever going bigger, and am perfectly content with my current power level around 300whp. I will stay with the small port head and will continue to run the stock TB. 
Therefore, while the smallport versions of the RMR and SEM manifolds are beautiful and likely outperform this one in all areas, the added expense may not be worth it to someone like me. It's a cost/benefit thing. If I'm not going to take advantage of the added value a more expensive manifold offers, it makes no sense for me to buy it.

_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 4:08 PM 1-28-2010_

I want to stress to you the importance of a quality setup. If I remember your car correctly it is very clean. That POS doesn't even look good. If looks are what you're looking for than why dont you do a home brew, or powder coated/polished home brew ? or get one of the many guys on here to make you a home brew ? I think 90% of the home brews I've seen looks tons better then this manifold.


----------



## Punchdance (Jun 19, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*

This whole thread is a laugh. People getting so bent over something like this. I remember a time on here when people used to do the same thing when someone asked about ebay downpipes and such....Now, people actually have no problems with the ebay downpipes in most cases. Another thing I see is an attempt to compare things with unlike characteristics and act as if it applies to everything ie: You get what you pay for and if you skimp on x, it is going to be the same thing as skimping on y, which is simply not true. Lets take ebay intercooler piping....does it matter if I skimp out and buy cheap intercooler piping? Probably not because its function does not require that its quality be that high. This is not an exhaust manifold or a mechanical device that needs to be held to a higher standard based on its function and stresses often seen.
I'm not going to get into an ethical debate as I just want to talk about the manifold in question. So setting that aside, do you honestly think that on your daily driver, the few bumps and machining messes are going to make your drive to work any less impressive (im not talking about longevity). If there is indeed a gain in performance that comes even remotely close to that of the RMR manifold, well then it may very well be an acceptable 3% loss to someone looking to save money. You are bringing up things that to the average user are not important. THIS IS NOT COMPETITION RACING where every second counts so arguing over the minimal performance hit you would take because of a bumpy weld or whatever is just silly. As for the welds....I dont care how dirty they "look" to you, if they hold, they hold. This is not a part that takes much stress. Even at 30psi, the pressure in there is close to nothing compared to gas and water lines that see WAY more than that...remember, plastic pvc with glued joints is rated up in the 200psi range







. I brazed my Tial BOV fitting onto my intercooler piping using the cheap aluminum brazing stuff from home depot and a blow torch. it is holding just fine on a daily driven 24psi 3071r car. I'm not saying it's the best piece of equipment, but I think everyone has their panties in a bunch over something like this.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (16plus4v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_
I want to stress to you the importance of a quality setup. If I remember your car correctly it is very clean. That POS doesn't even look good. If looks are what you're looking for than why dont you do a home brew, or powder coated/polished home brew ? or get one of the many guys on here to make you a home brew ? I think 90% of the home brews I've seen looks tons better then this manifold. 

I'm 99% leaning towards an FFE homebrew; this just piqued my interest. The only two things I can think of that would put the OBX over a homebrew in my case is one: it's ready for shipment now, and two: the OBX has a lifetime warranty (at least I know other OBX manis do)


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_I'm one of those people in the market for an affordable manifold. The reason at the top of my list is, dare I say it, to replace the rediculously ugly stock manifold with something that looks better. I'm running a 28RS, have no plans of ever going bigger, and am perfectly content with my current power level around 300whp. I will stay with the small port head and will continue to run the stock TB. 
Therefore, while the smallport versions of the RMR and SEM manifolds are beautiful and likely outperform this one in all areas, the added expense may not be worth it to someone like me. It's a cost/benefit thing. If I'm not going to take advantage of the added value a more expensive manifold offers, it makes no sense for me to buy it.
So, my qualifiers are:
1) must look good
2) must not perform worse than the stock manifold
3) must be affordable (i.e. meet my needs for a price I think is appropriate)
4) must not break in the next few years under normal daily driving conditions.
5) must be small port and accept the stock TB
6) must not be made illegally (by stealling patented designs)
Using these criteria, it's easy to rule out the nicer manifolds in my case.




x2 im in the same boat as you... cts 50 trim im staying small port and have no plans for ever going bigger and im on a semi budget so this is a very possible option... i could care less if this thing breaks at 40psi its never gonna get there on my car


----------



## Bug_racer (Oct 13, 2002)

*Re: (Punchdance)*

So I was thinking , this is only available in small port . if your running an AEB head would you be better off sourcing an AGU big port stock intake manifold or this one ?


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (Bug_racer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Bug_racer* »_So I was thinking , this is only available in small port . if your running an AEB head would you be better off sourcing an AGU big port stock intake manifold or this one ?

more than likely


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (Punchdance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Punchdance* »_THIS IS NOT COMPETITION RACING where every second counts so arguing over the minimal performance hit you would take because of a bumpy weld or whatever is just silly.

Your absolutely right. This is NOT competition racing. This is people who drive their cars every day to and from work. People who need reliability. I see this too often with friends that own honda's and dsm's. They buy these eBay intake and ex mani's for dirt cheap and within months end up cracking or BREAKING right off. I warn them and they kick themselves later.
You say this should hold 30psi ? maybe it will, but what happens if you have a serious backfire ? Or a nitrous backfire ? get my point ? Its not always going to be a simple 30psi failure, there are many variables as to why manifolds are engineered in the fashions and materials used. Not just to be expensive.
This very company copied the DSM manifold that Magnus made back in the day and the plenums were blowing right off at only 20psi. The welds were seperating from the sheet metal itself as if it were bonded (this is how it looked). I just hate to see people buy these things just because they are cheap. That is the wrong way to build anything!!. Chances are if you go cheap you end up spending twice as much in the long run.
You wouldnt put 1/4" drywall in your home would you ? It looks the same as 3/4" from the outside and will probably do the trick. But you will be repairing it quite often and in turn spending more in the long run. 
If you cannot afford a well built manifold then dont buy one. Wait to find one used or whatever. Dont settle for a chitty alternative. 
If this manifold actually looked like the RMR and appeared to be a 100% replica with the same materials etc then I would say for $400 GO FOR IT, but its clearly a cheap POS put out for the market of uneducated people who buy on impulse. And get flamed by people shortly after for doing so.


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (16plus4v)*

What's interesting though is that OBX may offer a lifetime warranty on this. I say "may" because I have yet to hear back from them. I did check out some of their other manifolds for other platforms and it seems they offer the warranty there.
Whether or not OBX really honors such a thing, and whether or not they are even around by the time you need to take advantage of it, well...that's another question


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*

you are also missing the fact that what this is going to do for competitors.... the same thing happened when the ebay downpipes and IC's started going crazy the prices of "the good stuff" goes down due to competition.. its how a market works it was bound to happen eventually..... look at the first ebay downpipes and IC's they were crap when they first came out and now they are a decent quality, not perfect quality. Eventually this will get of better quality..


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (weenerdog3443)*


_Quote, originally posted by *weenerdog3443* »_you are also missing the fact that what this is going to do for competitors.... the same thing happened when the ebay downpipes and IC's started going crazy the prices of "the good stuff" goes down due to competition.. its how a market works it was bound to happen eventually..... look at the first ebay downpipes and IC's they were crap when they first came out and now they are a decent quality, not perfect quality. Eventually this will get of better quality..

No. Actually, the quality companies dont produce any longer. The good stuff doesnt go down in price. The gap/margins generally shrink. A part like this or anything that has a bit of work on it such as this will not remain in the market in its quality version if ppl opt to cheap out. Soon, you'll have nothing but garbage to choose from. Go to any electronics store. Try to buy a good phone and battery that might last more then one year. You cant...
Ebay downpipes arent of good quality. They are just not a very stressed part. I've seen my share break however, including their headers and turbo manis on various platforms. Their IC's.. ugh... I've shown the raw pics of those cores in the past. They just arent very good. If buschur thinks the Garrett cores leak, I wonder how his testing was on the budget IC's as EVERY single one of those cheaper systems I've put compressed air to has leaked. Everywhere... from the clamped joints, to the bars on the cores, to the endtanks. I've never had a problem w/ a Garrett core and I refuse to use anything else. They arent that expensive, but they arent for the ppl that are looking to buy $100 cores w/ endtanks...


_Modified by [email protected] at 3:31 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

I think an argument can be made that the only ones losing customers because of this manifold are ABD. I just don't see how this manifold (at least in it's current small port configuration) can be marketed to any other group. The people shopping for an RMR or SEM class manifold would never consider this, and those considering the OBX would likely not have bought the RMR or SEM had it not been available.
As long as they did not violate any patents, OBX merely brought a product to the market that fills the void for an affordable small port passenger side IM that does not look like a hunk of poop (aesthetically speaking). I really can't see how this undercuts any product currently on the market when you factor in build quality, customer service, etc.
How about this analogy:
The Hyundai Sonata is not driving the price of a BMW 6 series down, nor does it's existence take incentive away from BMW to keep on making nice cars. 
i'm no economist though

















_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 5:55 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*

I just want to post this again as well. The arrival of competition is something that should be considered before a product even hits the market. Every design has a finite life and will go through a product life cycle. Good designs last longer than others, but a products profitability will likely not last forever. This is what drives innovation. Good companies will be the first to come to market with the next best thing, and if the designs are protected and market value high, then they will make money yet again.

_Quote, originally posted by *http://images.google.com/imgre...m%3D1* »_
1. Introduction -- A product is developed and comes to market.
2. Growth -- Consumers learn about it and more people buy it. It becomes more competitive through modification, price adjustments, wider distribution and other initiatives.
3. Maturity -- The product generates profits with less "tinkering." But problems can arise, such as the arrival of competing products in the marketplace. The product maybe modified or marketed in a new way to keep profits strong.
4. Decline -- Sales decrease because of market saturation, obsolescence or other factors.
Placing a product on this timeline suggests strategies for keeping its profitability high. Example: If profits sag during the Maturity stage, the manufacturer might offer discounted pricing or wider distribution.


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*

Thing is... OBX attempted to copy a thorough design and failed. It's not aesthetically pleasing in any way shape or form. That being said I think it's clear that the manifold is only there for two reasons. First being cheap in price, second being the only eBay intake manifold available for the 1.8t.
Who knows if the fuel rail even fits properly, or if the injector bosses are sized properly, or if the head flange holes will line up well ? Many of you are so gullible it's unbelievable.
So who's gonna be the sucker that bites the dust on this one?







not me 


_Modified by 16plus4v at 7:07 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_I think an argument can be made that the only ones losing customers because of this manifold are ABD. I just don't see how this manifold (at least in it's current small port configuration) can be marketed to any other group. The people shopping for an RMR or SEM class manifold would never consider this, and those considering the OBX would likely not have bought the RMR or SEM had it not been available.
As long as they did not violate any patents, OBX merely brought a product to the market that fills the void for an affordable small port passenger side IM that does not look like a hunk of poop (aesthetically speaking). I really can't see how this undercuts any product currently on the market when you factor in build quality, customer service, etc.
How about this analogy:
The Hyundai Sonata is not driving the price of a BMW 6 series down, nor does it's existence take incentive away from BMW to keep on making nice cars. 

I guess the Hyundai Sonata vs BMW analogy is apt. Two cars, two totally different demographics. I have an original RMR mani here. Its a work of art. Very well done piece of equipment. I look at this clone and it does look like a hunk of poop, sorry. Anyways, I guess for the guy working for $6/hr would have a hard time affording the SEM/RMR manis. But the $300 difference to me considering the craftsmanship/fit/finish is negligible.
In this case, as well as alot of custom parts that arent meant for general consumption, like drugs, the product perception is dictated by the demographics. Younger ppl with less disposable income are able to afford these cars now. A discerning consumer is replaced by anything-to-save-a-buck mentality..


_Modified by [email protected] at 4:16 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_
Who knows if the fuel rail even fits properly, or if the injector bosses are sized properly, or if the head flange holes will line up well ?


That's a good question

_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
I guess the Hyundai Sonata vs BMW analogy is apt. Two cars, two totally different demographics. I have an original RMR mani here. Its a work of art. Very well done piece of equipment. I look at this clone and it does look like a hunk of poop, sorry. Anyways, I guess for the guy working for $6/hr would have a hard time affording the SEM/RMR manis. But the $300 difference to me considering the craftsmanship/fit/finish is negligible.


I guess that's the million dollar (or three hundred dollar) question. I'm sure some most will agree with you, though I bet there are many out there (myself included) that, regardless of income, don't see enough of a return to justify the extra price. It has nothing to do with being cheap and everything to do with my requirements for a manifold versus what I feel these requirements are worth.
the reason I've gone so long without replacing the stock one is not that there isn't a manifold on the market that can do what I need it to, it's that the manifolds currently on the market do more than I need, thus they command a price that, while completely in line for what they offer, is a too high to drive me from my current situation.



_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 6:22 PM 1-28-2010_


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_
That's a good question
I guess that's the million dollar (or three hundred dollar) question. I'm sure some most will agree with you, though I bet there are many out there (myself included) that, regardless of income, don't see enough of a return to justify the extra price. It has nothing to do with being cheap and everything to do with my requirements for a manifold versus what I feel these requirements are worth.
the reason I've gone so long without replacing the stock one is not that there isn't a manifold on the market that can do what I need it to, it's that the manifolds currently on the market do more than I need, thus they command a price that, while completely in line for what they offer, is a too high to drive me from my current situation.
_Modified by NOLA_VDubber at 6:22 PM 1-28-2010_

Well, there you go. You're allowed to think however you want as in the end, its your decision, your money. I guess, in these kinds of threads, most ppl are really just thinking out loud. I can buy whatever I want, build w/ whatever I want, provide ppl w/ whatever I want. I dont think I'll ever take the short road as I've always believed in an honest days work and that there is no substitute. I know what it takes to produce something that is goes beyond just something that you can bolt on. Producing, testing, R&D and augmenting if need be. Hell, I've spent thousands on products that I've never put to market... I can see this thing for what it is. I see the RMR for what it is. There really is no contest.
If its too much to begin with, there's really no reason to purchase and use a poor facsimile of something. Its like buying a fake gucci or prada. Just lame...


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

*Re: (Punchdance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Punchdance* »_This whole thread is a laugh. People getting so bent over something like this. I remember a time on here when people used to do the same thing when someone asked about ebay downpipes and such....Now, people actually have no problems with the ebay downpipes in most cases. Another thing I see is an attempt to compare things with unlike characteristics and act as if it applies to everything ie: You get what you pay for and if you skimp on x, it is going to be the same thing as skimping on y, which is simply not true. Lets take ebay intercooler piping....does it matter if I skimp out and buy cheap intercooler piping? Probably not because its function does not require that its quality be that high. This is not an exhaust manifold or a mechanical device that needs to be held to a higher standard based on its function and stresses often seen.
I'm not going to get into an ethical debate as I just want to talk about the manifold in question. So setting that aside, do you honestly think that on your daily driver, the few bumps and machining messes are going to make your drive to work any less impressive (im not talking about longevity). If there is indeed a gain in performance that comes even remotely close to that of the RMR manifold, well then it may very well be an acceptable 3% loss to someone looking to save money. You are bringing up things that to the average user are not important. THIS IS NOT COMPETITION RACING where every second counts so arguing over the minimal performance hit you would take because of a bumpy weld or whatever is just silly. As for the welds....I dont care how dirty they "look" to you, if they hold, they hold. This is not a part that takes much stress. Even at 30psi, the pressure in there is close to nothing compared to gas and water lines that see WAY more than that...remember, plastic pvc with glued joints is rated up in the 200psi range







. I brazed my Tial BOV fitting onto my intercooler piping using the cheap aluminum brazing stuff from home depot and a blow torch. it is holding just fine on a daily driven 24psi 3071r car. I'm not saying it's the best piece of equipment, but I think everyone has their panties in a bunch over something like this.

If this is not competition racing where every second or tenth counts why are you moving off the oem manifold?
That metal is full of stains pitting and other garbage inside, and likely will age horribly. I would also hate to find out the fuel rail is a little big inside so when your o-rings degrade and shrink you piss fuel everywhere starting a fire.
If you are lucky it would just be hte injector boss bores into the intake stream versus an area fuel could leak.
Hope you guys mic this thing top to bottom before installing and think about random crap like that, because that is what it takes to engineer a quality manifold. Your SEM or RMR is guaranteed to have 0 issues like this.
How stupid would you feel if that happened and you tried to save a few hundred bucks?
Yeah, I am not even going to risk wasting my time putting this thing on to find out at best that I am tuning around a bunch of post map vacuum leaks because this child slave labor manifold has welds that are like a sponge. 
All you people think about is boost, and well if it works ok enough run it. 
For me ok enough is not ok enough. My end goal is a highly reliable full interior, power steering and a/c street car that I can bolt slicks on and take to the track then drive to work the next day. No questions, I bolt a manifold on it needs to seal 100% For the life of the car until the gasket goes. 
lol ebay downpipes...... I am sure it is just like people having no problem with ebay turbo kits, "Yeha it has been great for 4000 miles at 5psi" 
Ask them if they straight edged anything with feeler gauges, or smoke tested to look for exhaust leaks, of course they did not. Or wait until the boost is up to 20psi and you are moving some serious heat and the metal starts to fail and degrade because it shows its true colors then under the heatsoak conditions of high boost and a large turbos worth of EG pouring through the manifold and turbine inlet. 
Just like most people buying this manifold would probably never know if they had a leak post map, and ignore the stumbles or other issues claiming "Oh yeah it is daily drivable!" "This thing totally rocks and chicks melt their drawers over my ebay stuff it is all 100% reliable trust me!" And no proof or verification...
that is another good one, the ebay parts users with the emperor wears no clothes mentality!
They are my favorite!
I love the vortex.


----------



## 20aeman (Jun 8, 2006)

when I look at that fuel rail, I only $$$ going to an fittings/braided hose/fpr adapter. The initial price is deceiving. It's still a 600+ dollar manifold.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 25, 2007)

Other aspects of value from a manifold besides quality and power gains is how well flow is distributed and the Break Specific Fuel consumption over the gain in power.
SEM intake may cost more but you also have to consider what other aspects could be of value to your setup.
It has been tested to flow at 275 cfm with a distribution of 1.5% from highest to lowest. Break Specific Fuel Consumption showed to be lower as seen in this dyno conducted by INA & Unitronic








Small details as such count


----------



## Punchdance (Jun 19, 2003)

*Re: (gdoggmoney)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gdoggmoney* »_
Just like most people buying this manifold would probably never know if they had a leak post map, and ignore the stumbles or other issues claiming "Oh yeah it is daily drivable!" "This thing totally rocks and chicks melt their drawers over my ebay stuff it is all 100% reliable trust me!" And no proof or verification...
that is another good one, the ebay parts users with the emperor wears no clothes mentality!
They are my favorite!
I love the vortex.
Oh, this is rich. When did you change your tune? If I recall, it was not too long back that you were arguing whole heartedly with people about using an ebay exhaust manifold. I could be mistaken, but I even recall you PMing me saying how silly everyone was for saying that an ebay manifold wouldn't work. Wasn't that you? 
You are still missing the point. Nola has summed it up well enough. If you want to keep arguing over this because you can't grasp that not everyone has the same needs\wants then by all means........I don't know anything about this manifold, nor do I really care. What I do care about is that you have the same evidence everyone else has....a picture, yet you speculate about the horridness of the product as if you have inside information.


----------



## gdoggmoney (Feb 21, 2004)

*Re: (Punchdance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Punchdance* »_Oh, this is rich. When did you change your tune? If I recall, it was not too long back that you were arguing whole heartedly with people about using an ebay exhaust manifold. I could be mistaken, but I even recall you PMing me saying how silly everyone was for saying that an ebay manifold wouldn't work. Wasn't that you? 
You are still missing the point. Nola has summed it up well enough. If you want to keep arguing over this because you can't grasp that not everyone has the same needs\wants then by all means........I don't know anything about this manifold, nor do I really care. What I do care about is that you have the same evidence everyone else has....a picture, yet you speculate about the horridness of the product as if you have inside information. 

You are correct, that was me. 
Go ahead and search, I had major problems and i was wrong. I even started a thread over it because of my exhaust hardware problems once the car was moved above 1 bar of boost on a 3071R with cheap cast iron.
I posted all about it and then some. It is all public vortex record here under my users postings. You make mistakes and you learn, being stupid and keeping your head buried in the sand or repeating the same thing and expecting different results is insanity.
I have 0 issues with trying to save money, but you spend it twice and waste time, you lose money and time. 
I have 0 pride or emotional attachment to some manifold, I tried saving a few dolars and you know what? It does not work.
I have the same wants and needs, I like having no problems with my car unless I did something stupid. This thing has stupid written all over it. 
Do it right once, or do it multiple times spending time and money again. It all depends on what you value. Me personally, I have other projects I spend money on and time on, I do not feel like fixing a bunch of failures in a cheap inferior product to get it to functional let alone optimal.


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

*Re: (Punchdance)*

this may not be the best manufactured mani.. however it will most likely work out just fine for NOLA's setup.. 


_Modified by dubinsincuwereindiapers at 3:26 PM 1-30-2010_


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (dubinsincuwereindiapers)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dubinsincuwereindiapers* »_this may not be the best manufactured mani.. however it will most likely work out just fine for *weak* setups..


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Why does everyone even care really. If you want it, buy it. If you dislike it don't. Why is there 5 pages of debate of whether or not someone should buy this.
Isn't everything about building your car "to each his own"?
I get the quality thing but you would at least think there would be some kind of numbers or testing to go with 5 pages of b.s.
IDK


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*

im sitting in the united states patent office right now. i can tell you with 99% assurance that this piece is not patented, and that OBX is in the clear legally speaking.
there is nothing patentable here. maybe the manufacturing process of they way they make the parts slip into eachother to make welding easier, but do you really think NOBODY has ever done this before to any manufactured part???
it is crappy rmr got cloned, but its a fact of life when you sell parts, someone may copy you. thats why you cant just sell the same part for 10 years (like rmr did) and expect nobody to copy.
i know it seems real crappy, but seriously, if nobody copied, and nobody did this in other markets, we would still have zac morris cell phones, and only the rich would have them.
to make an analogy....
do any of you have flip phones? how many of you have a flip phone thats NOT a motorola?? Well motorola came out with THE FIRST flip phone through probably millions and millions of dollars or research and design and marketing. you just did the same thing as buying obx.


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*FV-QR*

Exactly...then you get everyone saying it's UNAmerican to do so...How much BS do you own made in China? seriously this thread is killing me. Lets get some numbers and pressure tests and see where this thing has a blow out. That is what should matter.


----------



## cincyTT (May 11, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (jwalker1.8)*

Lets not forget all the companies that make the same log manifold that ATP made forever...


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

I don't think many people care that it was copied. More so then it wasn't even copied properly. The quality is substantially lower than rmr and the materials are inferior to those of a well built manifold. I do agree however that some testing should be done... but to what extent ? And with what funding behind it ? 
As said before, those who buy such a product to save a couple bucks really need to be weary of long term structural defects. It's clear the materials used and welding were not sought out well. But I guess if you want to save... Go for it ? What are you really saving though ?




_Modified by 16plus4v at 10:26 AM 1-31-2010_


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: (16plus4v)*

you think 20 psi in that manifold is going to make it break? or the sheer weight of the throttle body and fuel rail will make it crack?
there is oxidation in the welds, yes, but for a product like this, we are talking cosmetic issues. i havent tried to bolt one on, but assumin it does bolt on and the ports line up well, i cant see how it would give different numbers than a rmr.


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: (16plus4v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_I don't think many people care that it was copied. More so then it wasn't even copied properly. The quality is substantially lower than rmr and the materials are inferior to those of a well built manifold. I do agree however that some testing should be done... but to what extent ? And with what funding behind it ? 
As said before, those who buy such a product to save a couple bucks really need to be weary of long term structural defects. It's clear the materials used and welding were not sought out well. But I guess if you want to save... Go for it ? What are you really saving though ?



_Modified by 16plus4v at 10:26 AM 1-31-2010_


Government Funding I Say!!! LOL


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (speed51133!)*


_Quote, originally posted by *speed51133!* »_i cant see how it would give different numbers than a rmr.









vs


----------



## TAIVWAUDITECH (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: (16plus4v)*

In the real world,on a VW 1.8T that is 10 years old,there is probably no performacne difference than a RMR one.If it has good gasket surfaces,the fuel rail doesn't leak,etc......it probably works JUST FINE.
The computer yuou are on now,flip it over,read the label......IT IS MADE IN CHINA!!!
IMO this manifold more than likely would work just as well as any out there.........


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

*FV-QR*

you guys are still beating this to death?


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *screwball* »_you guys are still beating this to death?


you know it screwball


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (TAIVWAUDITECH)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TAIVWAUDITECH* »_ In the real world,on a VW 1.8T that is 10 years old,there is probably no performacne difference than a RMR one.If it has good gasket surfaces,the fuel rail doesn't leak,etc......it probably works JUST FINE.
The computer yuou are on now,flip it over,read the label......IT IS MADE IN CHINA!!!
IMO this manifold more than likely would work just as well as any out there.........









Sure it may just work fine... But who the fück buys an aftermarket intake manifold for it to work just "fine" ? You eBay nutswingers can buy whatever you like. But your not saving anything buying that POS or anything those eBay replica companies have to offer.
Nobody is contesting that good quality parts can't be made in China. It's more the poor craftsmanship and shìtty materials that are used. 
For years these are the guys that continue to bring NEW Innovative products to the table. If it weren't for them we would still all be freaking out about making 350whp. You do realize that supporting them allows for growth and development right ? If we don't support them they cannot move along with the rest of the industry.
You wonder why DSMs and Hondas are so far ahead ? It's because the support from tuners for growth is much higher then that of a VW tuner. You guys are so fücking cheap and rely on sales and discounts or eBay and classifieds for your builds you forget where it all came from. I have nothing against a budget build. But if we all were as degenerous as some of you, there would be no option for A vs B manifold or A vs B turbo kit.
VWpoortex at it's best.


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (screwball)*


_Quote, originally posted by *screwball* »_you guys are still beating this to death?

Did you buy one yet ?


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (coreyj)*


_Quote, originally posted by *coreyj* »_to be honest obx might actually buy all there parts from RMR and just assemble it themselves because they are identical parts.

Sorry, just saw this now. Are you fücking serious ? Is your brain that cloudy ?


----------



## technician (Jun 29, 2009)

*Re: (16plus4v)*


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (technician)*

Only nutswingers


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: (16plus4v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_








vs

















whats your point? that one is shiney and more reflective??


----------



## Bug_racer (Oct 13, 2002)

ha ha ha , you guys are funny . Get an AGU intake and a thick phonelic spacer and do the match porting from big port manifold to small port head and it will probably flow better than this junk .


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (speed51133!)*


_Quote, originally posted by *speed51133!* »_
whats your point? that one is shiney and more reflective??

Yes you're absolutely right !








You sir, are incompetent.
And you have poor grammar.
Stop swinging dīck. Mr *SHINY*


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (16plus4v)*

six pages


----------



## Durbo20vT (Apr 30, 2006)

*Re: (16plus4v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_
Sure it may just work fine... But who the fück buys an aftermarket intake manifold for it to work just "fine" ? You eBay nutswingers can buy whatever you like. But your not saving anything buying that POS or anything those eBay replica companies have to offer.
Nobody is contesting that good quality parts can't be made in China. It's more the poor craftsmanship and shìtty materials that are used. 
For years these are the guys that continue to bring NEW Innovative products to the table. If it weren't for them we would still all be freaking out about making 350whp. You do realize that supporting them allows for growth and development right ? If we don't support them they cannot move along with the rest of the industry.
You wonder why DSMs and Hondas are so far ahead ? It's because the support from tuners for growth is much higher then that of a VW tuner. You guys are so fücking cheap and rely on sales and discounts or eBay and classifieds for your builds you forget where it all came from. I have nothing against a budget build. But if we all were as degenerous as some of you, there would be no option for A vs B manifold or A vs B turbo kit.
VWpoortex at it's best. 

I totally agree with this, but DSM & Honda owners are also amongst the top in utilizing ebay parts... plenty of evo & hondas running ebay FMIC, ebay piping/mani etc.
It's more the guys who want to push the envelope on a platform (like Ed) who "set the limits", it's just there are a lot more of them on honda and DSM land...
With that said, if you want to take a gamble and run the OBX version, go for it. Just dont expect the world from a subpar mani as you would from a proven product.


----------



## Punchdance (Jun 19, 2003)

*Re: (16plus4v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_
Yes you're absolutely right !








You sir, are incompetent.
And you have poor grammar.
Stop swinging dīck. Mr *SHINY*








Wow, the mk4 forums has spilled over into this one. It's nice to see that you can have a discussion and treat people with civility. I cannot for the life of me figure out why you are so upset over this subject that you are turning to insults and name calling

__
Image uploading. Refresh page to view








. The person above may have poor grammar, but at least he is not an a55hole.


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: (Punchdance)*

sorry, i dont really care about grammar here.
anyways, how about a wager where we flow bench the two intakes back to back and the winner keeps them both, looser pays for the flow benching???
im willing to buy one of them for it.
im also willing to bet the clone will flow within a point or two.


----------



## [email protected] (Dec 29, 2003)

*FV-QR*

Im happy with my RMR now I just need to install it LOL. My room mate wants to try the OBX. I wouldnt run it but thats me. Ill post pics and results if he does pull the trigger on one


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

looks nice man.
dont get me wrong, if money were no object id get the rmr because it looks nicer and you know it would fit. any welds penetrating into the flow area in the clone could be easily cleaned up with a die, but id rather not do that.
take a look at the epic thread of the flow rates of all the different intakes for a 1.8t, maybe we should submit a clone!


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_Im happy with my RMR now I just need to install it LOL. My room mate wants to try the OBX. I wouldnt run it but thats me. Ill post pics and results if he does pull the trigger on one 









y lie???? We know that is why you took the pic with the mani blurry and the tb focused...OBX spray painted black for sure!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## [email protected] (Dec 29, 2003)

*FV-QR*

50mm lens with a 1.8 Fstop LOL. I dont roll knock off parts or rep wheels but you can thing what y ou want 


_Modified by [email protected] at 11:07 AM 2-1-2010_


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*FV-QR*

I keed I keed...looks good black.


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (Punchdance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Punchdance* »_Wow, the mk4 forums has spilled over into this one. It's nice to see that you can have a discussion and treat people with civility. I cannot for the life of me figure out why you are so upset over this subject that you are turning to insults and name calling







. The person above may have poor grammar, but at least he is not an a55hole.

Call it what you want to call it. I tell it how it is, no sugar coating for the weak. I have nothing to hide or protect in here so I may as well be this way. Most guys here know me for the projects I produce or tips and advice I donate from time to time. 
This thread started with the viewing of the OBX manifold, great. Then the eBay nut swingers came in here boasting about how this POS is just as good as the more expensive units. I do not agree and explain reasons for price differences an post possible fails on the OBX unit and all of a sudden the nut swingers return. So of course I'm going to continue to defend my points.... Since this a forum and such debates are going to arise from time to time ? Better this than posts for dash pods and brake products right?








I could care less if anyone buy this pos or any other manifold on the market. It's your money and you're free to do as you wish with it. I just don't see and gain in the consumption of this product. Even saving a couple bucks doesn't put you any further ahead. The pos still looks like anüs and will probably fail with given time. 
To each his own, and to the eBay nut swingers I applaud you. You might just save a couple dollars. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 


_Modified by 16plus4v at 8:46 PM 2-1-2010_


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

*Re: FV-QR (16plus4v)*


_Quote, originally posted by *16plus4v* »_
Did you buy one yet ?

I run a real RMR.


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (screwball)*


_Quote, originally posted by *screwball* »_
I run a real RMR.

I saw that. So you're half way to a back to back dyno comparison


----------



## not SoQuick (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: FV-QR (jwalker1.8)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwalker1.8* »_Exactly...then you get everyone saying it's UNAmerican to do so...How much BS do you own made in China? seriously this thread is killing me. Lets get some numbers and pressure tests and see where this thing has a blow out. That is what should matter.

its this attitude that has killed american pride.I refuse to buy vice grips now since they started making them in china.I will pay more for something up too a pointe if i can find it made in the USA and I only once made the mistake of driving my







german sh*t box(as my uncle called it) back home to MI to save on gas money over taking my chevy truck.Also if you think it won't blow out as soon as you put pressure to it,you are probably right as it'll take time and stress to cause it to fail.Even with that I could care less as the transitions inside the thing SUCK!!!!!!!!
end of drunken rant










_Modified by not SoQuick at 3:07 PM 2-2-2010_


----------



## VWAUDITEK (Dec 26, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (not SoQuick)*

Oh,S.T.F.U.!!!!,you are driving a GERMAN CAR made in Mexico/Brazil with parts manufactured all over the world.You would be amazed how many OEM VAG parts are made in China,LOL!!!!
You shop at Wal-Mart??3/4 of that s**t is made in China!!!
Harley Davidson?How about that MIKUNI carburetor onthere,from the factory??Japanese brand,made in China buddy!!!
the computer you are typing on?? MADE IN CHINA!!!


----------



## VWAUDITEK (Dec 26, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (VWAUDITEK)*

Order anything from Robert Bosch gmbh recently???MADE IN CHINA!!!!


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (VWAUDITEK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWAUDITEK* »_Order anything from Robert Bosch gmbh recently???MADE IN CHINA!!!!

There's a difference b/w global corporations operating in china and adhering to strict standards and companies that copy racer car parts. Not in the same league, sorry.
Its like saying Toyota, Nissan Motor Co., Mercedes, Honda, Kia, Subaru manufacturing in the US are manufacturing domestics. Manufacturing plants are stationed around assembly plants and most of the car is manufactured here. 60-80% of the foreign vehicles assembled in the US are made here headed by foreign companies that employ US workers.
Most of VW isnt made in China. I'm sure there are minor things that are which make fiscal sense, but for the most part, I would think the majority of the components are not manufactured there. Aftermarket parts from various suppliers may have you fooled into thinking that it is...


_Modified by [email protected] at 4:59 AM 2-3-2010_


----------



## TAIVWAUDITECH (Dec 23, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR ([email protected])*

I was laughing at his "buy American" rant,when 3/4 of the crap Americans buy/own are made somewher else!!!
Garrett turbos & intercoolers??MADE IN MEXICO!!!!! Ariba!!Ariba!!!!















As long as that manifold has no flange leaks and HOLDS BOOST it would work right?I am not buying one,but what is this attitude like everybody here buys the best s**t made for cars,this is VW POORTEX where people buy used turbos and buy CHINESE RODS!!!















I bought $800.00 + Pauters back in the day.........now I rock the Chinese $300.00 rods.THEY WORK,just like that manifold does!!!








So if you hate this manifoldl,then don't buy anything from ATP/PTE that have their turbine housings cast in China!!!As do most of the turbo companies.
Remember TURBLOWNETICS??100% Chinese parts put together in California!(Those turbos did suck however) 
I remember when Garrett was made in England










_Modified by TAIVWAUDITECH at 9:33 PM 2-2-2010_


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (TAIVWAUDITECH)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TAIVWAUDITECH* »_ I was laughing at his "buy American" rant,when 3/4 of the crap Americans buy/own are made somewher else!!!
Garrett turbos & intercoolers??MADE IN MEXICO!!!!! Ariba!!Ariba!!!!















As long as that manifold has no flange leaks and HOLDS BOOST it would work right?I am not buying one,but what is this attitude like everybody here buys the best s**t made for cars,this is VW POORTEX where people buy used turbos and buy CHINESE RODS!!!















I bought $800.00 + Pauters back in the day.........now I rock the Chinese $300.00 rods.THEY WORK,just like that manifold does!!!








So if you hate this manifoldl,then don't buy anything from ATP/PTE that have their turbine housings cast in China!!!As do most of the turbo companies.
Remember TURBLOWNETICS??100% Chinese parts put together in California!(Those turbos did suck however) 
I remember when Garrett was made in England









_Modified by TAIVWAUDITECH at 9:33 PM 2-2-2010_

Understood. There are excellent factories in China and abroad. Alot of skilled manufacturers tend to go beyond the borders and set up shop where they can produce product cheaper to remain competitive. Name of the game at times. In certain countries, however, there are companies that do not possess the skill set and equipment to develop quality product. Your rod example is a good one. There are so many variations. Some are good, some arent. You'd be surprised at the variances of machining tolerances from one rod set or even rod to another. I've had some experience w/ this throughout the line (Scat, Eagle, cheap crower, etc etc) and experienced destroyed examples of each mfr not just once (mostly spun bearings/wrist pin failure) due to incorrect machining or poor tolerances. Lets be honest, ATP/PTE dont really have the best castings in the world. Garrett is much better and in respect to machined product, Garrett is world class. Honeywell does not skimp on product no matter where it may be mfr'ed.


----------



## burble X2 (Dec 9, 2009)

i still love how all the "ebay nutswingers" are idiots when the product hasn't even been tested.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: (burble X2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_i still love how all the "ebay nutswingers" are idiots when the product hasn't even been tested.

Hard to really 'test' product like this. I would venture to say that every manifold is different in one way or another judging by the pics. Its not done very well, but in a lot of ways, an intake manifold can get away w/ alot other then sealing injectors and having leaks. Throw it on your car, pressure test it. It leaks at the welds, have someone go over it. If it leaks at the injectors, send it back and get a new one


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

RMR mani's down one hundred bucks and it looks like once the stock's done, they're discontinuing them.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: (screwball)*


_Quote, originally posted by *screwball* »_RMR mani's down one hundred bucks and it looks like once the stock's done, they're discontinuing them.

There you go.


----------



## ParanoidTT (Apr 29, 2009)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Nooo


----------



## Punchdance (Jun 19, 2003)

*Re: (burble X2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_i still love how all the "ebay nutswingers" are idiots when the product hasn't even been tested.
Nobody is ebay "nutswinging", they are just trying to think about it from a different point of view. Please explain to me how making an assumption that it may work out just fine makes a person more idiotic than the people making assumptions that it will not work? Or were you defending the "nutswingers", I can't tell.


_Modified by Punchdance at 8:37 AM 2-3-2010_


----------



## burble X2 (Dec 9, 2009)

*Re: (Punchdance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Punchdance* »_Nobody is ebay "nutswinging", they are just trying to think about it from a different point of view. Please explain to me how making an assumption that it may work out just fine makes a person more idiotic than the people making assumptions that it will not work? Or were you defending the "nutswingers", I can't tell.

_Modified by Punchdance at 8:37 AM 2-3-2010_

i'm on the side of the nutswingers. check page 1 and 2 .


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (burble X2)*

since when does ebay have nuts?


----------



## 20aeman (Jun 8, 2006)

*Re: (NOLA_VDubber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *NOLA_VDubber* »_since when does ebay have nuts?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...47531


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: (20aeman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...47531* »_the "Your Nutz" brand of truck nuts are the only ones made in the USA, all the others are made in China! Buy American!!! 

Looks like ebay has American nuts. No chineese nuts round here!


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: (burble X2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *burble X2* »_i still love how all the "ebay nutswingers" are idiots when the product hasn't even been tested.

tested as in what? flow bench? stress tested? finite elemental analisys??
i mean is a darn clone! its going to perform probably the same except if it were different!!! the only differences are some oxidation in the weld and also some welds penetrating into the flow area.
the amount of weld penetration is negligable at best, and any restriction it introduces is worth the 100-200-300 or whatever price difference there is. PLUS you can always grind it out in 20 minutes!
as to it failing.....if you think this will fail, i dont know what to say. without actually cutting it apart and doing failure testing nobody can tell. but do you know that the SAME can be said about the RMR intake? Just because a weld is shiney and and has little oxidation on the surface doesnt mean it wont fail in use either. bottom line is the amount of force the manifold will be exposed to is not that much, and even a ****ty weld will hold. pin hole leaks can be another story, but even with that, the manifold will still work, keep good boost, and is just as easy to fix as the weld penetration issue.
for the people that can affort to pay the few extra hundred to support RMR and help more products come, great. youll know youll have a nice intake without having to worry about weld penetration or pinhole leaks (you hope at least). but for people who cant afford 800$ for an intake, this is a way for them to get into the engine modifactions and have an intake that very might well make some power and look custom, and lets be honest, is NOT an ugly POS.
cant we just leave it at that?


----------



## Lou_Y2mK5 (Apr 6, 2008)

No sorry we can't. lol
Oh and correction, it's not a clone. Clones are identical to each other in every way. This here is a POS. 
/thread.


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

*Re: (speed51133!)*


_Quote, originally posted by *speed51133!* »_
tested as in what? flow bench? stress tested? finite elemental analisys??
i mean is a darn clone! its going to perform probably the same except if it were different!!! the only differences are some oxidation in the weld and also some welds penetrating into the flow area.
the amount of weld penetration is negligable at best, and any restriction it introduces is worth the 100-200-300 or whatever price difference there is. PLUS you can always grind it out in 20 minutes!
as to it failing.....if you think this will fail, i dont know what to say. without actually cutting it apart and doing failure testing nobody can tell. but do you know that the SAME can be said about the RMR intake? Just because a weld is shiney and and has little oxidation on the surface doesnt mean it wont fail in use either. bottom line is the amount of force the manifold will be exposed to is not that much, and even a ****ty weld will hold. pin hole leaks can be another story, but even with that, the manifold will still work, keep good boost, and is just as easy to fix as the weld penetration issue.
for the people that can affort to pay the few extra hundred to support RMR and help more products come, great. youll know youll have a nice intake without having to worry about weld penetration or pinhole leaks (you hope at least). but for people who cant afford 800$ for an intake, this is a way for them to get into the engine modifactions and have an intake that very might well make some power and look custom, and lets be honest, is NOT an ugly POS.
cant we just leave it at that?

I guess you've never seen an intake manifold break. I guess you never had a car w/ a questionable tune backfire thru the intake before. Or a car on the dyno pop a runner while trying to hold 30+psi.. It happens.
If you look at the RMR vs this one.. there is a distinct difference. The RMR tank is extruded 1/4" seamless aluminum. The ebay one is folded sheetmetal that is stitched together mid runner w/ questionable welding at the ends and runners. Now for 90% of the ppl out there just looking to put a manifold on for the sake of putting a manifold on, it'll serve its purpose (I'm speculating of course). But on a serious build w/ some serious boost and tuning, I would put my money on the RMR...


----------



## Punchdance (Jun 19, 2003)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
Now for 90% of the ppl out there just looking to put a manifold on for the sake of putting a manifold on, it'll serve its purpose (I'm speculating of course). But on a serious build w/ some serious boost and tuning, I would put my money on the RMR...

Ding Ding Ding......Someone finally gets it. Can this be over now.


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: (Lou_Y2mK5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Lou_Y2mK5* »_No sorry we can't. lol
Oh and correction, it's not a clone. Clones are identical to each other in every way. This here is a POS. 
/thread. 

This is what people need to realize. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [email protected] (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: (16plus4v)*

Finally got around to installing my RMR


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

*Re: ([email protected])*

looks nice ronnie http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif one of my favorite bays by far... what happened to the dual dv setup you were running


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*

so to whoever bought one how is it


----------



## dubinsincuwereindiapers (Jan 16, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (weenerdog3443)*

i dont believe anyone has http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (dubinsincuwereindiapers)*

^^^I ended up buying Ronnie's old homebrew, so someone else is going to have to be the guinea pig


----------



## JettaJoeMan (Aug 18, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*

I will give it a try. less work then to try to port match the ABD manifold I am running now. I will take some good close up photos of the thing and let you know how well it work. 
One on order... maybe be able to make a something work.
Anyone from Maine / NH with a flow bench I will stop it by to get figures. hahaha


----------



## speed51133! (Aug 5, 2002)

*Re: FV-QR (JettaJoeMan)*

the obx will have large port soon...fyi, but id go with the new cast sem


----------



## clarksongli (Nov 4, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (speed51133!)*

large port is already available. For the price it looks acceptable, i'm considering it atleast....i'd like someone else to take the first step though


----------



## JettaJoeMan (Aug 18, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (clarksongli)*

I got OBX and they told me it was a large port and it wasn't. Quality wasn't too bad. Runners and port were all SMALL even though they told me it was large !!!! 
I sent it back and got me a RMR Large port and fixed that problem. I should have saved me some time and bought the RMR to begin with !!!


----------



## 1.8t67 (Dec 7, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (JettaJoeMan)*

there is not comparison in quality comparing to the RMR.


----------



## JettaJoeMan (Aug 18, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (1.8t67)*

no RMR is much better every where !! the OBX wasnt any worse then the stock.
thats why I got a RMR my self !!!


----------



## 1.8t67 (Dec 7, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (JettaJoeMan)*

except oem is cast, and has proven to withstand higher boost pressures. i don't know if i would want to push 30psi through this obx manifold.....


----------



## JettaJoeMan (Aug 18, 2008)

I guess your right.. Junk all the way around.!! although I can say I have seen one my self !!! and give honest opinion because I held one in my hand ...
JUNK


----------



## clarksongli (Nov 4, 2003)

*Re: FV-QR (1.8t67)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.8t67* »_except oem is cast, and has proven to withstand higher boost pressures. i don't know if i would want to push 30psi through this obx manifold.....

if aluminum can fail @ 30psig, there is something very wrong. .1875" aluminum is rated to [email protected] per ASTM B210 and FEDWW-T-700/2....ugly maybe....functional probably.
i do not believe there is any evidence that this OBX manifold cannot perform, it may be of lower tolerance than RMR, but it is half the cost.

On a side note on RMR, the 1.8T manifold is 800 dollars....that is quite a mark up....yes there is R&D, but that is considered a NRC so it should not become a large factor in product cost. I consider the RMR manifold to be one of the best, but i also consider it an example of poor design for manufacturability and assembly. This is why in the automotive industry, manifolds are cast...because machining has a poor value return.


----------



## 16plus4v (May 4, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (clarksongli)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clarksongli* »_
if aluminum can fail @ 30psig, there is something very wrong. .1875" aluminum is rated to [email protected] per ASTM B210 and FEDWW-T-700/2...

I think people are concerned of the poor welding quality. No one is contesting that the aluminum will fail. But thanks for the equation. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Rideforlife_33 (Oct 18, 2008)

*Re: Watch out RMR, here comes OBX! (NOLA_VDubber)*

It does say it has a lifetime warranty...
Thats sort of a plus. I want to see someone try this thing out.


----------



## 20thAEGti1009 (Jan 28, 2005)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *clarksongli* »_
.1875" aluminum is rated to [email protected] per ASTM B210 and FEDWW-T-700/2....


this may be true but what what about the sub par welds that are on the manifold.. just because the material is rated to 490psig does NOT mean that the welds can handle it


----------



## 1.8t67 (Dec 7, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (clarksongli)*


_Quote, originally posted by *clarksongli* »_
if aluminum can fail @ 30psig, there is something very wrong. .1875" aluminum is rated to [email protected] per ASTM B210 and FEDWW-T-700/2....ugly maybe....functional probably.
i do not believe there is any evidence that this OBX manifold cannot perform, it may be of lower tolerance than RMR, but it is half the cost.

On a side note on RMR, the 1.8T manifold is 800 dollars....that is quite a mark up....yes there is R&D, but that is considered a NRC so it should not become a large factor in product cost. I consider the RMR manifold to be one of the best, but i also consider it an example of poor design for manufacturability and assembly. This is why in the automotive industry, manifolds are cast...because machining has a poor value return.

wait, lol. you do know rmr is primarily a machine shop. they carry large contracts for the government, petro, etc...their performance side is more for fun. they certainly don't try and pay the bills with manifold sales. it may be a poor design of manufacture to YOU, but i assure you, it goes together like legos. the fitup is amazing, and you don't have second guessing welds. i'm guessing you haven't held one of their manis. 


_Modified by 1.8t67 at 4:17 PM 3-20-2010_


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (1.8t67)*

fwiw the OBX manifold has a lifetime warranty, and is coming in to the market as the RMR is heading out.
on a side note, here's my new manifold:
I got tired of trying to find a decent PS mani so I just got a DS one


----------



## macosxuser (Jul 26, 2007)

*Re: FV-QR (NOLA_VDubber)*

I now realize why my car is almost completely stock. I refuse to cut these kind of corners. I've been looking at the RMR since it came out and lusting, but so many other things are higher on my list. I'd never even consider the OBX after looking at the pictures.


----------



## JettaJoeMan (Aug 18, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (macosxuser)*

yeah... I love the RMR I also was running ABD before I loved them both.. I had the OBX in my hand and it was JUNK.. !!


----------



## weenerdog3443 (Jul 5, 2007)

*FV-QR*


_Quote, originally posted by *JettaJoeMan* »_yeah... I love the RMR I also was running ABD before I loved them both.. I had the OBX in my hand and it was JUNK.. !!


not even worth it eh


----------



## mattevandavis (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (weenerdog3443)*

Ok so RMR is $800 and everyone agrees that if your going to do it do it right then why not SEM for $50 more? Definitively its the best though RMR is close. So why not spend the extra $50?








And FYI Im not being an SA It is an honest question Im looking at getting one and want to know what people are thinking. 
To put my 2 cents in on the topic OBX makes decent knock off stuff. I have a catch can that looks just like a greddy for 1/2 the cost. Quality is fine. I have silicone hoses from them. Quality is fine.
The real question here is do you trust a part that is produced in an unknown manner from a worker that has unknown skill level or do you trust the craftsman that takes pride in their work because an actual reputation depends on it?








I am all for saving a $ but Im going for quality in this case. For the same reason I dont have a Chinese knock off turbo.


----------



## 1.8t67 (Dec 7, 2008)

*Re: FV-QR (mattevandavis)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mattevandavis* »_Ok so RMR is $800 and everyone agrees that if your going to do it do it right then why not SEM for $50 more? Definitively its the best though RMR is close. So why not spend the extra $50?








And FYI Im not being an SA It is an honest question Im looking at getting one and want to know what people are thinking. 
To put my 2 cents in on the topic OBX makes decent knock off stuff. I have a catch can that looks just like a greddy for 1/2 the cost. Quality is fine. I have silicone hoses from them. Quality is fine.
The real question here is do you trust a part that is produced in an unknown manner from a worker that has unknown skill level or do you trust the craftsman that takes pride in their work because an actual reputation depends on it?








I am all for saving a $ but Im going for quality in this case. For the same reason I dont have a Chinese knock off turbo. 

it's not just $50 upgrade for the sem over the rmr. you also have charge piping that needs redone, bov/dv placement, etc. if you're not set-up driver side tb, you're paying more than $50. rmr is currently offering their 20v manifolds for $699. thats damned good. 
i don't know why people say they're phasing out the 1.8t manifold. i spoke with scott and he asked to email him back in 2 weeks. 2 weeks later, i emailed him, and they had it boxed in 3 days. they are super busy doing contract work, and the performance side is a do it for fun business. 
you go on to compare a catch can to an intake. interesting. lets be straight, a ****ing catch can is meant to hold fluid. not contain/direct/distribute air evenly among 4 cylinders! it's not a comparison! i don't care how awesome your chinese knock off can works. it has nothing to do with this thread. nor does it cred obx. ****ing castrol makes a kickass can too! i'll prove it.


----------



## jwalker1.8 (Mar 4, 2008)

*FV-QR*

The reason some opt for the rmr mani has nothing to do with the $$$ it is about being versatile. You can mount the throttle body on the passenger side OR the drivers side with RMR...Cast manifold do not have this option. 
Edit: I got beat to it. 


_Modified by jwalker1.8 at 11:38 PM 3-29-2010_


----------



## mattevandavis (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (1.8t67)*


_Quote, originally posted by *1.8t67* »_
it's not just $50 upgrade for the sem over the rmr. you also have charge piping that needs redone, bov/dv placement, etc. if you're not set-up driver side tb, you're paying more than $50. rmr is currently offering their 20v manifolds for $699. thats damned good. 
*Thanks*
you go on to compare a catch can to an intake. interesting. lets be straight, a ****ing catch can is meant to hold fluid. not contain/direct/distribute air evenly among 4 cylinders! it's not a comparison! i don't care how awesome your chinese knock off can works. it has nothing to do with this thread. nor does it cred obx. ****ing castrol makes a kickass can too! i'll prove it. 
*That was kind of the point if you read past that. I said it was fine not good. And I said I would buy quality in the case of a vital part. 
Sorry you missed that. Im aslo sorry I hurt your feelings well that or you have anger management issues. I got insulted yelled at and whined to for having the same point of view.







*


----------



## mattevandavis (Jun 15, 2006)

*Re: FV-QR (jwalker1.8)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jwalker1.8* »_The reason some opt for the rmr mani has nothing to do with the $$$ it is about being versatile. You can mount the throttle body on the passenger side OR the drivers side with RMR...Cast manifold do not have this option. 
Edit: I got beat to it. 

_Modified by jwalker1.8 at 11:38 PM 3-29-2010_

Thanks for the great answer with out extra fuss. 
I am interested if any one will admit to buying one of these. Im more interested to see if any one will admit when it fails.


----------



## screwball (Dec 11, 2001)

*FV-QR*

Mirror, I was the one that added they're fazing out the 1.8t manifold. Scott's been helping me out w/ some bits for their fuel rail on my setup and he said that once they run out of stock on the manifolds that are shelved, they're not making any more.
To the other guy it doesn't seem fair to be commenting on either of these pieces w/out seeing either of them or having first hand experience w/ either of them. The RMRs proven to perform, you can run the orientation on which ever side you'd prefer and it's built like a tank.


----------



## Nevaeh_Speed (Jul 9, 2004)

Anybody get their hands on one of these yet and try it? Just wondering...


----------



## iTech (Dec 29, 2008)

VWAUDITEK said:


> Oh,S.T.F.U.!!!!,you are driving a GERMAN CAR made in Mexico/Brazil with parts manufactured all over the world.You would be amazed how many OEM VAG parts are made in China,LOL!!!!
> You shop at Wal-Mart??3/4 of that s**t is made in China!!!
> Harley Davidson?How about that MIKUNI carburetor onthere,from the factory??Japanese brand,made in China buddy!!!
> the computer you are typing on?? MADE IN CHINA!!!


 Exactly....I am probably the biggest Apple fanboy alive...guess what...everything they have is made in China. I honestly cant tell you when if ever have I had a quality problem with any of their PC products. 

Now on to the manifold...seriously is RMR chose to stop production on theirs then shame on them. Does this manifold look like it may be poorly slapped together? Yes. Will I buy one and re do the welds cause I want to practice with my new TIG.? Yes. Will I remove it from the box and have the flange milled as the first step? Yes. Will I bitch if it's a pile of crap ? NO..I get what I paid for.


----------



## badger5 (Nov 17, 2003)

iTech said:


> Exactly....I am probably the biggest Apple fanboy alive...guess what...everything they have is made in China. I honestly cant tell you when if ever have I had a quality problem with any of their PC products.
> 
> Now on to the manifold...seriously is RMR chose to stop production on theirs then shame on them. Does this manifold look like it may be poorly slapped together? Yes. Will I buy one and re do the welds cause I want to practice with my new TIG.? Yes. Will I remove it from the box and have the flange milled as the first step? Yes. Will I bitch if it's a pile of crap ? NO..I get what I paid for.


Do you care if you undermine the innovators from your own country to just buy a copy cheaper?
Shame on you

:thumbdown:

Its attitudes like that which will finish the "West" and domestic innovations and creativity. Nothing creative from CN, just copies.. Well think about what happens when there's nothing to copy , because the local domestic shops shut after they got undermined by Low Cost Country sources? No more products, which will suk.

Surman over.


----------



## DurTTy (Aug 14, 2007)

hmmm stumbled on this while seeing if rmr was for sale on the tex. 

decided to check it on ebay. searched seller feedback to see if any1 ever bought this manifold at all.

found that some1 bought this 

sold sept 22nd 2010

*AND* 
_OBX Intake Manifold VW Volkswagen Beetle Audi TT 1.8T (#200476855700) sold to *koba4454* on July 7 2010 _

_ OBX Intake Manifold VW Volkswagen Beetle Audi TT 1.8T (#370371377999) SOLD TO Member id *scott_day_hull *on 18-Jun-10 08:29_

so if you want some serious feedback one can just msg him and see what he has to say about it after a summer of driving


----------



## Boosted96GSX (May 29, 2007)

I know this is old, but I thought bringing it back might help some potential buyers of an upgrade manifold option.

I recently was able to take a personal look at this manifold. It's very clear to see that the quality is not as good as the RMR, but it definitely looks like a very capable manifold. The head flange was cut off and a different flange was welded on to be used on a 16v i think. The welder/builder of that very fast drag car that was recently at the Daytona Car show this month said the quality of the aluminum was very good. He had no issues welding on his flange. The injectors fit perfect and there were no leaks anywhere.

I will try and get some more photos up next time I make it to the shop, or will see if I can get him to chime in himself.


----------



## mattevandavis (Jun 15, 2006)

*If I do this...*

Ok so i've been watching this thread and considering options for this. I am at a point where Im considering getting one of these "large port" knock offs and reporting back on the integrity. I have wasted way more money doing stupider stuff (like getting a home brew intake mani that will not fit the car) and I think that it may just help someone out on here. 

So the question then becomes is where can i get someone to help make the boost pipes for a PS intake? I ant weld and i could it would be worse quality than the manifold I am looking at buying.

Any one have experience doing this and want to help me throw my money at the flames?


----------



## NOLA_VDubber (May 24, 2007)

damn, I'd totally scoop one up now if I didn't already have an IM


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 2, 2009)

clarksongli said:


> _Quote, originally posted by *1.8t67* »_except oem is cast, and has proven to withstand higher boost pressures. i don't know if i would want to push 30psi through this obx manifold.....
> 
> if aluminum can fail @ 30psig, there is something very wrong. .1875" aluminum is rated to [email protected] per ASTM B210 and FEDWW-T-700/2....ugly maybe....functional probably.
> i do not believe there is any evidence that this OBX manifold cannot perform, it may be of lower tolerance than RMR, but it is half the cost.
> ...




Uh, that's a fun pile of specs and all- but they have nothing to do with aluminum in an intake manifold... Those are tube / pipe specs- in fact, B210 is for seamless tube... An intake manifold 1) is not round 2) is not seamless. The disparity is even more apparently in this case, where the aluminum is in "as welded" state with little or no heat treatment remaining. Aluminum welded manifolds can, and do, frequently fail at 30psi, especially when there are square corners.


----------



## Big_Tom (Aug 19, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Uh, that's a fun pile of specs and all- but they have nothing to do with aluminum in an intake manifold... Those are tube / pipe specs- in fact, B210 is for seamless tube... An intake manifold 1) is not round 2) is not seamless. The disparity is even more apparently in this case, where the aluminum is in "as welded" state with little or no heat treatment remaining. Aluminum welded manifolds can, and do, frequently fail at 30psi, especially when there are square corners.


i concur, i have seen it happen recently myself with cheap aluminum manifolds. not even at 30psi, car was run at 23 psi or less on a 20g turbo. :what:


----------



## gangstajett89 (Dec 31, 2008)

http://forums.fourtitude.com/showth...rge-port-intake-manifold-pictures-info/page2&


----------



## gangstajett89 (Dec 31, 2008)

the last comment was in 2011 but i didnt ever read anyone running this thing... found someone...


----------

