# New VW Phaeton 2009 MFD3 RNS810 RNS 810 Navigation Units on Ebay



## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Retrofit ? - New VW PhaetonMFD3 RNS810 RNS 810 Navigation Units on Ebay 2009*

For anyone that fancies a go retro fitting one of these :
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayI...AX:IT
£999 seems like a good price for what you are getting, maybe get for less with a cheeky offer ? 
He says they work with 04 onwards cars I have seen it discussed on here before but costs quoted for the head unit at the time were $8000 so I dont thing anyone ever got as far as trying.
Surely more realistic prospect at this price ? Having seen some of the retrofit guides posted on here I am sure there is somone willing to give this a go or at least see if it would be possible !
For those in the states worried about the nav integration over there, you could explore using using the Tourag NA maps for the 510 system, its basically the same system, as the 810 I believe but without the integrated climate controls and a smaller screen.


_Modified by alera at 7:10 AM 1-10-2010_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Retrofit ? - New VW PhaetonMFD3 RNS810 RNS 810 Navigation Units on Ebay 2009 (alera)*

I am not certain that they will work with MY 2007 and prior cars.
Caveat Emptor.
Michael


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: Retrofit ? - New VW PhaetonMFD3 RNS810 RNS 810 Navigation Units on Ebay 2009 (PanEuropean)*

Fair enough he says they work but I know what you are saying seemed like a decent price for those that like their mods especially in the UK.


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## invisiblewave (Sep 22, 2008)

*Re: Retrofit ? - New VW PhaetonMFD3 RNS810 RNS 810 Navigation Units on Ebay 2009 (alera)*

I seem to remember this being discussed previously and there being a definitive opinion that although the unit might physically fit, the electronics won't work. So do some digging before handing over the readies!


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: Retrofit ? - New VW PhaetonMFD3 RNS810 RNS 810 Navigation Units on Ebay 2009 (invisiblewave)*

From another thread and poster this is the full list he thinks would be required :
RNS-810 3D0 035 005 eBay for $1,600 USD
Trim Wood 3D0 035 122 C CB4 $241
MDI Box 5N0 035 341 B $357
MDI Wiring Harness 5N0 035 558 A $117
Clip 3D0 035 239 $6
Instrument Cluster 3D0 920 983 AX Z01 $1,000

Not a cheap or easy mod for sure even if it would work, like I said I am just putting it out there do with it what you will, the seller says it will work I have no idea it it actually will to my knowledge no one has tried it on here maybe one of the German forums ?
I have seen people do quite insane levels of work stripping out virtually the whole interiors of their cars on here for far less beneficial mods thats for sure !


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: Retrofit ? - New VW PhaetonMFD3 RNS810 RNS 810 Navigation Units on Ebay 2009 (alera)*


_Quote, originally posted by *alera* »_I have seen people do quite insane levels of work stripping out virtually the whole interiors of their cars on here for far less beneficial mods thats for sure !

Yes, but those were mods that we knew (for sure) would work.


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## FastMover (Aug 22, 2003)

The rear camera wiring loom is available and replaces the existing wiring loom. Once the camera and the wiring harness are in place, just adapt the camera.


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (FastMover)*

What about the 810 head unit though there seems to be some question as to if this can be integrated into the 04 - 07 wiring. 
These things tend to be an evolution rather than a revolution I would be surprised if it was impossible, they have not made huge changes to the car afterall its mostly been cosmetic.
Re the reverse camera I wonder if the wiring loom on the 09 cars includes the camera input, probably not sure its not as simple as just fitting the camera a tv tunner and changing some setting on vag com....


_Modified by alera at 11:14 AM 1-11-2010_


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## Prince Ludwig (Mar 24, 2007)

_Quote »_These things tend to be an evolution rather than a revolution

True - I would usually expect that the simple economics of "change as few things as possible" would apply although sometimes you can run up against a brick wall...
Harry


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## FastMover (Aug 22, 2003)

I have it from two sources that virtually nothing has changed from the original Phaeton design due to the low number of sales and the lack of justification on major dollar outlays. What the Phaeton really was was a test bed for future technologies that you are now seeing across the VW, Audi, Bentley and other lines.
So while this means is while some componentry has been "Upgraded", more likely it was borrowed from somewhere else and applied into the Phaeton. For instance, Audi's MMI was light years ahead of anything VW so it was time to refresh it. However, the Phaeton hasn't had anything "New" added to it in years. So while it may get some new body metal, etc, its nothing of a change to the original design. 
The RNS-810, from Continental VDO, is really the RNS-510 with more capability to control the Phaeton as the J523 already does. And really, the significant change is in the instrument cluster where things are sharper, in color and a larger screen. In viewing euro ETKA, I do not see a new A/C control head that people were saying had changed. Its still in there. I am going to check the MAF's but that would be control my the Motronic ECU more than the J523. If they are changing MAF's, its because they are prone to failure throughout the entire VW lineup and certainly the Phaeton is subject to those failures as well (coil packs are another good example). 
VW had no choice but to upgrade the head unit as it was badly outdated. However, most everything else lives on with an adored affection. You either love it or leave it. No way VW was going to dump more money into it...


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (FastMover)*

Surely someone is going to give this a go at some stage, I almost bought a 04 w12 phaeton 3 years ago if I had that car now I would be buying the bits and giving it a go.
People that buy this sort of car love the machine and inherently want to tinker with them, see that often on here.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (FastMover)*


_Quote, originally posted by *FastMover* »_The rear camera wiring loom is available and replaces the existing wiring loom. Once the camera and the wiring harness are in place, just adapt the camera.

Uh, not quite that simple. The camera needs a controller of its own. Below is a picture of the camera controller from a 2009 or 2010 (not sure which, it was built in Sept 2009) Bentley Continental Supersports (basically, a stripped down Phaeton).
Honest to goodness, I think that anyone who attempts to fit a new (MY 2008 or later) front display unit into a first generation Phaeton is in for a world of wallet-hurt, frustration, and disappointment.
Michael


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

Well you know more than most people about Phaetons so thats good enough for me.


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## FastMover (Aug 22, 2003)

Actually, in another post, I noted that the Control Unit for the camera was 3D0 907 441 with a USD price of $395 and the camera itself was 3D0 980 551 with a USD price of $334. No need to guess when you have ETKA.


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## FastMover (Aug 22, 2003)

Michael:
It would seem that you could very easily contact the factory to confirm this one way or the other with your contacts. I mean VW's HQ is about 1/2 mile from where I work but your contacts in Dresden should have no issue weighing in on this topic given they build the cars.


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (FastMover)*

I've already discussed the subject at length while I was in Dresden several years ago, and the general consensus is that it is a hopeless task. Amongst other things, the new GP2 Phaeton uses a different communications protocol than the original Phaeton.
Anything can be accomplished provided that you are willing to throw enough money at it. Also, some things can be accomplished that the engineers don't think can be accomplished. For this reason I have been reluctant to flat-out state that such a retrofit is not possible. However, I will say (as I have hinted at in the past) that the probability of success retrofitting a new (GP2 spec) display unit to a GP1 Phaeton is very, very small.
Michael


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (PanEuropean)*

Primarily I posted this as I had seen it mentioned a couple of times and the prohibitive factor seemed to be the cost of the 810 head unit - $8000 I to remember being suggested at the time for those in the states, obviously way too much for it to be even considered so it was more of a theoretical discussion.
At this sort of price it can at least be considered but with what Michael has said it doesn’t seem feasible. He doesn’t think it can be done so it probably can’t. 
As the car is still on sale in UK and Europe the easiest, and probably cheapest overall option considering new prices of getting this functionality for those owners is just to buy the new model, this was more for people in the states and it doesn’t seem like a very good idea now, especially when you get into the ancillary items that would be required.


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## CLMims (Jul 13, 2007)

*Re: (alera)*

I don't want to stir a hornet's nest unnecessarily (I'm all for wishful thinking and have experimented with mods in the past!), but I did a bit of digging through the 11/2008 version of the Communications workshop manual and found the following pin assignments for the new J523; they seem to be the same as the RNS-510 pinouts (see here) with the exception for Connector 6, which is at the bottom of the unit (where the new A/C controls are):
*Connector 1* (4-pin)	Hazard warning light switch (no change)	
1	Warning lamp button
2	Terminal 31, negative
3	Warning lamp LED
4	Not assigned








*Connector 2* (8-pin)	Loudspeaker outputs	(*#1 in pic above*)
1	Rear right loudspeaker, positive
2	Front right loudspeaker, positive
3	Front left loudspeaker, positive
4	Rear left loudspeaker, positive
5	Rear right loudspeaker, negative
6	Front right loudspeaker, negative
7	Front left loudspeaker, negative
8	Rear left loudspeaker, negative
*Connector 3* (8-pin)	Voltage supply lines and CAN bus	(*#2 in pic*)
9	CAN bus, high
10	CAN bus, low
11	BOSE pin
12	Voltage supply, negative terminal 31
13	Not assigned
14	Not assigned
15	Voltage supply, positive, terminal 30
16	Anti-theft coding control signal, SAFE, positive
*Connector 4* (12-pin)	Telephone and microphone signals	(*#3 in pic*)
1	Microphone input, negative
2	Not assigned
3	Not assigned
4	Microphone output, negative
5	Telephone audio input signal left, negative
6	Telephone audio input signal right, negative
7	Microphone input, positive
8	Not assigned
9	Microphone output, positive
10	Telephone mute (mute switch for radio)
11	Telephone audio input signal left, positive
12	Telephone audio input signal right, positive
*Connector 5* (12-pin)	CD changer control and CD audio input signals	(*#4 in pic*)
1	AUX signal input, left
2	AUX signal earth
3	CD changer, audio signal earth
4	CD changer, voltage supply, positive, terminal 30, contact continuous load greater than 1A, temporary peak load 5A
5	Not assigned
6	CD changer, DATA OUT (data exchange for CD changer control from radio navigation system to CD changer)
7	AUX signal input, right
8	CD changer, left audio channel, CD/L
9	CD changer, right audio channel, CD/R
10	CD changer, control line, switched positive
11	CD changer, DATA IN (data exchange for CD changer control from CD changer to radio navigation system)
12	CD changer, CLOCK (internal check protocol for data flow monitoring)
*Connector 6* (8-pin)	CAN	(*NOTE: this is unique to the RNS-810*)
1	Terminal 30, positive
2	CAN high
3	CAN low
4	Terminal 31, negative
5	
6	
7	
8	








*Connector 7* (26-pin)	Audio and video	
1	Reserved for Debug RX protocol
2	Reserved for Debug TX protocol
3	Not assigned
4	Negative
5	Video signal output LF, right
6	Video signal output, screening earth
7	Video signal output, vertical and horizontal synchronization
8	Video signal output, green
9	Not assigned
10	Video signal input LF, right
11	Video signal input, screening earth
12	Video signal input, vertical and horizontal synchronization
13	Video signal input, green
14	Not assigned
15	Not assigned
16	Not assigned
17	Video signal output LF, negative
18	Video signal output LF, left
19	Video signal output, RGBS, negative
20	Video signal output, blue
21	Video signal output, red
22	Video signal input LF, negative
23	Video signal input LF, left
24	Video signal input, RGBS, negative
25	Video signal input, blue
26	Video signal input, red








*Connector 8* (Aerial, FM)	Aerial connectors	
1	AM and FM radio reception aerial connector, double Fakra, no coding, impedance 50 ohms (cream-white color)
2	FM 2 radio reception aerial connector, double Fakra, coding B, impedance 50 ohms, cream-white color
*Connector 9* (Aerial, Nav) 
3	Navigation aerial connector, double Fakra, coding C, impedance 50 ohms, blue color

As you can see, there is no connector for the Optic bus that the NAR Phaetons used for the Navigation and rear information control head unit (my guess is Connector 6 has something to do with the rear A/C control now); so a new nav unit (R41) would be on the expense ticket as well as a new rear information control head unit (J524), since these are no longer connected via optical cable.
As for a rear camera: the previous method of install required a camera (R189) connected to a control unit (J772) which was then tied in to the J503/J523. In looking at camera add-on DIYs from other forums, it appears that one VW camera can connect directly into the A/V port (26-pin plug in the pic above); see this write up...










_Modified by CLMims at 7:34 PM 1-12-2010_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (CLMims)*

Hi Chris:
No need to worry about stirring up a hornet's nest.
FYI, the pin assignments are DIN (German Industrial Norm), which means they will be the same on any VW radio connector plug. Likely the same on other brands of cars as well, although I have no first-hand knowledge of this.
Michael


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## FastMover (Aug 22, 2003)

The RNS-810 no longer has the slave CD-Nav unit in the glove box as at the very top of the unit, it has a slot for the DVD version of a navigation disk from NAVTEQ. What does replace the CD-Nav unit is a box called the MDI which is known as the Multimedia Instrument box. You connect all of the newest multimedia pieces through this box, just like the Audi MMI unit.


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (FastMover)*

FYI the maps are loaded onto the HDD on the 810 from the DVD drive presumably. Also not all the new Phaetons have the MDI its not fitted on the UK cars as standard I believe.


_Modified by alera at 10:20 AM 1-13-2010_


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## FastMover (Aug 22, 2003)

The RNS-810 does not have an "MMI" from an Audi but a box, called the MDI, that fits into the spot once occupied by the CD-Navigation unit. From appearance, it is where those additional multimedia connections are made versus the front of the head unit where it would clutter the necessary buttons.
I will try to capture a picture from ETKA and throw it up here so my explanation is cleaner.


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## FastMover (Aug 22, 2003)

And actually, the HDD is for music or movies and would be similar in operation to an iPod.


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (FastMover)*

Sorry I meant mdi (Media Device Interface). My understanding was that the UK Phaetons at least do not come with the MDI as standard. The mdi has the usb and av inputs I believe. Possibly the cars with TV fitted have the MDI ? I spoke to an OEM retrofit company locally that fits the the bluetooth kits to VWs he offers an MDI retrofit for other Vws, Tourags etc and seemed to think they could be fitted to the 09 Phaeton.
THe Nav Maps are DEFINATELY loaded onto the HDD, the Nav does not run off a DVD as in the current A8s for example. I would assume that the DVD drive is the mechanism for loading new maps onto the HDD.
It states in the 09 Phaeton manual how much is taken up on the HDD by the Nav maps and what is available for loading music on (from dvd or cd or via USB / ipod connector if the car has MDI)
The dvd drive can of course be used to play dvd movies, I was not aware that movies files could be played from the HDD I would be surprised but very pleased if this was the case.
There is at least one member on here with an 09 Phaeton with the new 810 system, I have seen him mention before the his Phaeton doesnt have the mdi with USB input etc I am unsure if his car has tv though maybe he will come along and shed some more light on this ?
Anyway I should be collecting my new Nov 09 reg Phaeton tommorow I will then be able to offer more information hopefully.
In regards to the seller with these 810 units, he also has VW rear camera units for a Tourag he seems to think these can be retrofitted to 09 Phaetons at least with the 810 system, I have asked for his thoughts on retrofitting the 810 to 2004 onwards cars he does say in his ad its possible but has so far been unwilling to elaborate so I am assuming his claims are unsubstantiated.
UPDATE
Interesting very interesting. I have had a reply from the seller re the 810 units :
"yes they can be retrofitted to 04 cars onwards and we can recommend installlers, at the moment we have none in, we are expecting them in about 2-3 weeks! We can sell the tv and bluetooth kits, they are £399 for bluetooth and TV is £699 but i would need to double check!"
So he has sold the ones he had and seems confident they can be fitted. I can find out who the UK recommended installers are and speak to them direct about what is involved....


_Modified by alera at 11:19 AM 1-13-2010_


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## PanEuropean (Nov 3, 2001)

*Re: (alera)*

It might be prudent to wait a bit and see what becomes of the three units that he has sold.
Michael


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## Realist42 (May 14, 2006)

*Re: (alera)*


_Quote, originally posted by *alera* »_Sorry I meant mdi (Media Device Interface). My understanding was that the UK Phaetons at least do not come with the MDI as standard. The mdi has the usb and av inputs I believe. Possibly the cars with TV fitted have the MDI ? I spoke to an OEM retrofit company locally that fits the the bluetooth kits to VWs he offers an MDI retrofit for other Vws, Tourags etc and seemed to think they could be fitted to the 09 Phaeton.
THe Nav Maps are DEFINATELY loaded onto the HDD, the Nav does not run off a DVD as in the current A8s for example. I would assume that the DVD drive is the mechanism for loading new maps onto the HDD.
It states in the 09 Phaeton manual how much is taken up on the HDD by the Nav maps and what is available for loading music on (from dvd or cd or via USB / ipod connector if the car has MDI)
The dvd drive can of course be used to play dvd movies, I was not aware that movies files could be played from the HDD I would be surprised but very pleased if this was the case.
There is at least one member on here with an 09 Phaeton with the new 810 system, I have seen him mention before the his Phaeton doesnt have the mdi with USB input etc I am unsure if his car has tv though maybe he will come along and shed some more light on this ?
Anyway I should be collecting my new Nov 09 reg Phaeton tommorow I will then be able to offer more information hopefully.
In regards to the seller with these 810 units, he also has VW rear camera units for a Tourag he seems to think these can be retrofitted to 09 Phaetons at least with the 810 system, I have asked for his thoughts on retrofitting the 810 to 2004 onwards cars he does say in his ad its possible but has so far been unwilling to elaborate so I am assuming his claims are unsubstantiated.
UPDATE
Interesting very interesting. I have had a reply from the seller re the 810 units :
"yes they can be retrofitted to 04 cars onwards and we can recommend installlers, at the moment we have none in, we are expecting them in about 2-3 weeks! We can sell the tv and bluetooth kits, they are £399 for bluetooth and TV is £699 but i would need to double check!"
So he has sold the ones he had and seems confident they can be fitted. I can find out who the UK recommended installers are and speak to them direct about what is involved....


Hi!
The MDI is a separate option, must be specified specially as VW UK do not carry this on the regular options list, it can be ordered, and I have been lead to believe it is an 'easy' (well, lets hope so...) retrofit to an 09 car.

rgds
J


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## alera (Oct 2, 2007)

*Re: (Realist42)*

This is along the line with what I have been told and experienced, I couldnt see MDI on the current UK options list in the sales pack I got from VW I wondered if it would be available under the "individual" program but the dealer seemed scetchy on this.
OEMretrofits Retrofit MDI on Tourags etc I spoke to them last week re this and Bluetooth, he was very confident he could get MDI into an 09 Phaeton and fully working within an hour. THe glove box and the 810 headunit has to come out though so it might be a while until a summon the courage to have one put in !


_Modified by alera at 3:32 PM 1-13-2010_


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## mfiloniello (Jul 22, 2010)

*Rns810 navigation unit*

Hi Again

i see a lot of post this forum regardin navigatio nunit.
i have a Phaeton 2005 but I REALLY DO NOT KNOW at the moment if exist a way to replace the old Navigation with this new one. I do not care about Rear Camera . What i want understand is:

There is a way for replace the old one without having problems with the car and have all the above functions ?
Thankz for all reply to this post.


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