# GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available!



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

For all you Quattro A3 owners, here's a bit of good news:
An upgraded controller for our GENII Haldex coupling devices will soon be made available, by HPA.
This device (the brain of the Haldex) locks the center coupling system more agressively than the standard item, which translates into a more neutral attitude. Power can be reapplied sooner upon corner exits without inducing understeer, tight corner exits bringing on oversteer. Obviously, this is not something for everyone, and should be considered after tires, wheels and suspension have already been improved.
2007 should see the release of the "Competition" version, which is even more agressive, as it keep the driveline in awd mode even under braking







.

There is a lot of information available on the GENI version, in the R32 forums, on Haldex's own site, and on HPA's website. This info (effects on handling) applies to the GENII version as well.
I've placed an order on mine; no set date yet but shouldn't be more than a month. I'll very happily keep the board posted.
Ben.


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*

Thanks, interesting news! I'm very much interested in hearing how this upgrade would perform in real use, when available. Any ideas on the pricing? Please keep us posted! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## p.r.walker (May 31, 2000)

HPA has sustems for R32 and TT online now- $899 and $999. I can only assume the A3 aplication would be in the same price range.
http://www.hpamotorsport.com/p...x.htm


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## Misano (May 29, 2003)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*

The kit comes to solenoid's and the brain. I am pretty sure they are already out, i installed one a month ago on an 06 A3


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## eltonsi (Mar 17, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_2007 should see the release of the "Competition" version, which is even more agressive, as it keep the driveline in awd mode even under braking.

I like that feature... http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## .:R2theT (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_2007 should see the release of the "Competition" version, which is even more agressive, as it keep the driveline in awd mode even under braking







.



Am I right that the "Competition" version would not be recommended for winter driving? Also, did you put this on order from HPA? Just wondering who I will be giving my money to!


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

I'll be working with HPA and their UK partner, VAG-tech. Eip Tuning have been the NA importers of Haldex Performance Parts for some time now, so they might make them available as well.
Regarding the non-use of the "comp" version on snow, it's the same thing with not using summer tires or stiff suspension... You have to be ready for a less forgiving chassis. That being said, there is at least one R32 ("powermind") with FT-400 and comp controller, who hasn't found it bad on the snow...
I should have mine (a non-comp, as comp is as yet unreleased afaik) in a month. Excited? You betcha!!! ;-)


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## dan-phx (Dec 13, 2005)

Are the controller upgrades developed and manufactured by Haldex and distributed by HPA or is HPA doing it's own development and manufacturing by altering/reprogramming existing Haldex product?



_Modified by dan-phx at 7:59 AM 5/19/2006_


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Although I am not certain about it, I think they are HPP (Haldex Performance Parts).


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## ProjectA3 (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

HPA will be distributing the product. but it is developed by Haldex.
I also hope to hear from HPA soon about their soon-to-be-released DSG clutch upgrade.


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## dan-phx (Dec 13, 2005)

*Re: (ProjectA3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ProjectA3* »_HPA will be distributing the product. but it is developed by Haldex.
I also hope to hear from HPA soon about their soon-to-be-released DSG clutch upgrade.

Brian,
Are you noticing any shift issues or just want to bulletproof it?


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## ylwghost (Sep 30, 2004)

How does the "competition" unit work with ABS? (or does it?)


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## ProjectA3 (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: (dan-phx)*

not noticing any shift issues, but if APR is developing a KO4 upgrade for the 2.0T i want the tranny to be able to hold it with no problems.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (ylwghost)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ylwghost* »_How does the "competition" unit work with ABS? (or does it?)

I was wondering the same thing. ABS supposedly can't work with a locked center diff (which an engaged Haldex clutch is akin to), so I just don't know.

Regarding the clutch upgrade, it's been on the HGP site for a while:
http://www.hgp-turbo.de http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## justdanorm (Dec 14, 2005)

*Re: (ProjectA3)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ProjectA3* »_not noticing any shift issues, but if APR is developing a KO4 upgrade for the 2.0T i want the tranny to be able to hold it with no problems.

x2


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## ylwghost (Sep 30, 2004)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_I was wondering the same thing. ABS supposedly can't work with a locked center diff (which an engaged Haldex clutch is akin to), so I just don't know.

Exactly; with the front and rear diffs locked, it makes it difficult for ABS to work independently at each wheel. (at least to my understanding).
-and the lack of ABS would explain the "caution" regarding driving in the snow/ice.
However I can imagine how this upgrade would make for 1 hell of a demanding/rewarding car -


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## 200qandA3q (May 1, 2006)

*Re: (ylwghost)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ylwghost* »_Exactly; with the front and rear diffs locked, it makes it difficult for ABS to work independently at each wheel. (at least to my understanding).
-and the lack of ABS would explain the "caution" regarding driving in the snow/ice.-

Caution is reasonable for a disabled ABS system when driving on ice--for sure. But back in the day that Audi provided an "ABS On/Off" switch (as on my '91 200q), they recommended that ABS might best be disabled when driving in snow.


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## dan-phx (Dec 13, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote »_The sophisticated Haldex based all wheel drive system used in the VW R32 and Audi TT Quattro monitors throttle input, *ABS wheel speed sensors*, steering angle, etc to anticipate and distribute torque transfer from the engine to the driveline.
Specially prepared Haldex control units are able to alter the time in which the system reacts to these dynamic changes and and how it reacts to them; creating more favourable or aggressive handling characteristics.

http://www.hpamotorsport.com/p...x.htm
I thought the wheel speed sensor on the A3 is crippled on the US models. Is it active on a computer level but inactive on a user level?


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## crew219 (Oct 18, 2000)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (dan-phx)*


_Quote, originally posted by *dan-phx* »_http://www.hpamotorsport.com/p...x.htm
I thought the wheel speed sensor on the A3 is crippled on the US models. Is it active on a computer level but inactive on a user level?









um what? Haldex uses the wheel speed sensors to detect slip regardless of whether it's just the standard genII or HPP control module.
Dave


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## dan-phx (Dec 13, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (crew217)*


_Quote, originally posted by *crew217* »_um what? Haldex uses the wheel speed sensors to detect slip regardless of whether it's just the standard genII or HPP control module.
Dave

Yea, I guess I knew that. I guess it's Monday morning mental crippling on my part. I was confusing the threads you guys had about activating the TPS. 
Nevermind me. I'll go back to sleeping at my desk.










_Modified by dan-phx at 10:58 AM 5/22/2006_


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## PD Performance (Jul 1, 2004)

*Re: (ylwghost)*


_Quote, originally posted by *ylwghost* »_
Exactly; with the front and rear diffs locked, it makes it difficult for ABS to work independently at each wheel. (at least to my understanding).
-and the lack of ABS would explain the "caution" regarding driving in the snow/ice.
However I can imagine how this upgrade would make for 1 hell of a demanding/rewarding car -

Front and rear diffs are still open..


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## ylwghost (Sep 30, 2004)

*Re: (PD Performance)*


_Quote, originally posted by *PD Performance* »_Front and rear diffs are still open..

guess I didn't explian that properly .. I know the front & rears are open (only limited by EDL).
-I was refering to the front & rear having to spin together at the same variance when Haldex is engaged.
Are you saying having this unit will allow Haldex to stay engaged under braking w/o an impact on the ABS system?


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Thanks, interesting news! I'm very much interested in hearing how this upgrade would perform in real use, when available. Any ideas on the pricing? Please keep us posted! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Bringing this back from the dead: the postman just made a nice delivery:





























The GenII HPP:
































This item is made by Haldex. It quickens the coupling device's action, making for more torque to the rear sooner, i.e. more oversteer.
The cool part is that it will be able to be switched between "normal", "sport" or "race" (three levels of reaction time). The wiring diagram is available, but as of yet there isn't an Audi-specific switch setup. Default mode is "sport".

I _was_ going to do some vag-logs of the stock device vs. this, but I'm just burning to install it







.
I'll write more after the install.

Thanks Jon Watts @ Vag-tech and Jared & Marcel Horn @ HPA for taking care of me.

Cheers,


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*

Very nice! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Waiting for first impressions


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## A4Kevin (May 4, 2005)

Cant wait to hear your impressions on this one.


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## dan-phx (Dec 13, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*

Very nice!!!
What's involved in the installation? Any reprogramming with the VAG-COM?
http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (dan-phx)-IS AVAILABLE*

Purchased from Jared at HPA,only 2 days to deliver to So. Cal. from B.C. Installed by Jessie at AMS in Carson,CA. 1 1/2 hours, including cool down from 60 mile drive to their shop, installation, & test drive. Very neat , clean shop & installation. 
Striking difference in cornering, low speed handling, slow moving freeway lanes changes. BEST of all both ways over Hwy 74 (Ortega Highway) One of the best mountain roads in So. Cal. = GREAT FUN !!!
Feels like rear clutch locks up earlier & stays when off throttle. Feels much more like a rear driver. Also that annoying "clunk" when shifting from 2nd to 1st (full FWD engagement) is dampened. 
This is the "blue" HPP Gen 2 controller. Sport model, not Competition.
Obviously thos is one man's impressions. DO NOT mean to start any contraversy re:FWD,RWD,AWD,etc. etc.


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## xt0rted (Jan 8, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (dan-phx)-IS AVAILABLE (Hal_K)*

I'm liking this. I was looking into it but wasn't sure if the price was worth it. This might be where a RS4 type steering wheel would be good, that has 2 buttons on the left I think it was. Could wire those up to switch between the modes. Too bad you lose the paddles though. Anyone know if there's a wheel with paddles and the buttons on the one side (not the audio ones)?
Another idea might be to modify the shifter so when it’s in D it’s in the regular mode and when it’s in S it’s in sport and when it’s in manual it’s in race, or some type of combo like that. Replacing the ashtray with some buttons would be nice as well.


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## neonix (Nov 19, 2001)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Bringing this back from the dead: the postman just made a nice delivery:





























The GenII HPP: ...

Strangely that look different of the pictures that HPA has on their website.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (neonix)*

Picture at HPA site is of HPP Gen 1. Gen 2 is more compact & without a pig-tail. Direct plug in. Also US$ 170 more, but US$ 200 less than Haldex, HPP division MSRP. i.e. : $1069 + $35 expedited shipping = $1104 delivered.


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## neonix (Nov 19, 2001)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Picture at HPA site is of HPP Gen 1. Gen 2 is more compact & without a pig-tail. Direct plug in. Also US$ 170 more, but US$ 200 less than Haldex, HPP division MSRP. i.e. : $1069 + $35 expedited shipping = $1104 delivered. 

Awesome, thanks Hal. I better start saving


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## A4Kevin (May 4, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (neonix)*

Is this on their website somewhere?


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## neonix (Nov 19, 2001)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (A4Kevin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *A4Kevin* »_Is this on their website somewhere?

Seems not, or at least I can not find it.
I was thinking of sending them an e-mail.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (neonix)*

Jared responded to my initial e-mail. Then when he returned from "Waterfest" we spoke live. They had not updated their website when I last opened it. Very easy to deal with. I no longer "wrench" anything. HPA dealer in So. Cal was convenient for me. Also very easy to deal with & their hourly rate very fair.


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## chrisddo (Mar 17, 2001)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (Hal_K)*

Funny how "Misano" has already installed it into a car here in california and no one cares...everyone just goes on about HPA but it's the same thing that he installed. Snobbery at its finest.


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (chrisddo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chrisddo* »_Funny how "Misano" has already installed it into a car here in california and no one cares...everyone just goes on about HPA but it's the same thing that he installed. Snobbery at its finest.

Oh? Has he posted anything about the upgrade? If so, I have atleast missed it. Search didn't give any results either. Any and all information on these upgrades is most welcome, regardless of the brand. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (chrisddo)*

>>Funny how "Misano" has already installed it into a car here in california and no one cares...everyone just goes on about HPA but it's the same thing that he installed. Snobbery at its finest.<<

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To clarify. It is my experience with HPA. I have no proprietary interest in their business. The unit is manufactured by Haldex in Sweden. Neuspeed & EIP are HPP dealers too. VAG-tech in the U.K. also handles the product. Just as Ben stated months ago. Misano did not elaborate on where he had sourced his unit. Nor any follow-up. As I said in my first post,, I had no intention of starting a long discussion. Just one man's experience with one unit from one supplier.


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## crew219 (Oct 18, 2000)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (chrisddo)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chrisddo* »_Funny how "Misano" has already installed it into a car here in california and no one cares...everyone just goes on about HPA but it's the same thing that he installed. Snobbery at its finest.

Dude he barely posts and never follows up. . . 
Misano always gets the goodies first, but he doesn't always come on the forums to share his experiences. Most of the time, he just posts a comment and then doesn't return to the thread. I've pmed and emailed him a few times and he has never responded. AFAIK, he's [email protected] . . .
If he wants to promote the products his company sells, then he should post . . . but I'm assuming that has to do with him not having an advertiser account.
Dave


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (Misano)*


_Quote, originally posted by *chrisddo* »_
Funny how "Misano" has already installed it into a car here in california and no one cares...everyone just goes on about HPA but it's the same thing that he installed. Snobbery at its finest.

Wtf? What snobbery? Misano never posted any impressions, or pictures of the installation. I clearly remember searching Misano's created topics in the hope of finding more info, but to no avail. There was nothing to "care about"







.

---------------------------------------------


_Quote, originally posted by *Misano* »_The kit comes to solenoid's and the brain. I am pretty sure they are already out, i installed one a month ago on an 06 A3

Misano, could you tell us any more about this? Whose car did you install it in? Is he/she on the forum? Could he/she review it? TIA. 
----------------------------------------
I was going to do the install on mine yesterday, but decided to change my Haldex coupler's oil and filter at the same time. My dealer doesn't stock the oil & filter, so it probably won't be installed before the end of next week.
I'll take pictures and give a full review (hopefully with before/after Vag-com logs).
In the meantime, I'm going to try to scan the instructions that came with my HPP, and post them here.
Cheers,


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (dan-phx)-IS AVAILABLE (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_
... Feels like rear clutch locks up earlier & stays when off throttle. Feels much more like a rear driver. ...


Thats' exactly what I was hoping for http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Can't wait to put it on my car!


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*

Here are the five pages of clear, simple instructions provided by Haldex with the GenII "tuningkit".
Of particular interest is the fifth and last page, which explains the three "modes" and the switcheable nature of this HPP. Also, there is a graph depicting the level of torque transfer of each mode:
page 1









page2









page 3









page 4









page 5








Enjoy,


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*

Seems like a simple enough DIY job.









_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_The cool part is that it will be able to be switched between "normal", "sport" or "race" (three levels of reaction time). The wiring diagram is available, but as of yet there isn't an Audi-specific switch setup. Default mode is "sport".

Is this wiring diagram separate? If the wiring is simple enough, it might be possible to convert a TPMS switch or something similar to do the job.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Yeah, definitely an easy DIY. I'm waiting to have the oil and filter ready, as well as some lift time, before I do mine.
I'm really hoping for a converted in-dash button too. Maybe one with three leds, one for each position.
I'm trying to figure out how to vag-com log both the Haldex coupling pressure, engine torque, and throttle position at the same time. As soon as I've figured that out, I'll log, and then log agin after the install.


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Here are the five pages of clear, simple instructions provided by Haldex with the GenII "tuningkit".
Of particular interest is the fifth and last page, which explains the three "modes" and the switcheable nature of this HPP. Also, there is a graph depicting the level of torque transfer of each mode:
Enjoy,

Do the instructions say anything about how to wire it up for switching modes? 
Actually, I'm suprised they didn't couple it to the DSG shift modes. Make it VAG-Com programmable to link the coupling aggessiveness to the DSG modes in any way you want. No messing with switches.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (waggin)*

>>Make it VAG-Com programmable to link the coupling aggessiveness to the DSG modes in any way you want. No messing with switches.<<
HPP is Haldex. Driveline is independent of transmission. Interesting thought. Maybe someone with VAG-com access can check possibility/probability


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_
HPP is Haldex. Driveline is independent of transmission. Interesting thought. Maybe someone with VAG-com access can check possibility/probability

I suppose this would work only if there were DSG mode messages floating around on the drivetrain CAN bus for Haldex to intercept and decode. 
BTW: Neuspeed has it on their website, with some good pictures, but somewhat incomplete installation instructions:

http://www.neuspeed.com/produc...=1963 
One concern I have is how to check the oil level after installation, since they specify that the car be on a level surface. This would be difficult to do in my garage, unless I put it up on four jackstands.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: GENII Haldex upgrade soon to be available! (waggin)*

Those instructions are complete. Check oil while you have the vehicle up for installation. Temp only has to be 68 F. or higher.
Neuspeed is $ 200 more than others. EIP tuning in Maryland has the Gen 2 controller, although not yet at their website. Forgot who I spoke to there. He got back to me with the item & price about 10 days after I had ordered from HPA. About same price as HPA. I don't know about their shipping fee.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

No, I don't have the wiring diagram yet. I most definitely won't do it myself: I trust my mechanical skills on my 1967 Land-Rover, but not on my A3 ;-)
I'd like to see one of the unused buttons next to "ESP OFF" attributed to the Haldex.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)-Gen 2 Contoller*

Now have put 1000 miles on So Cal freeways. Stop & Go ( 2mph-80mph) + Mountain roads (Ortega Highway & Angeles Crest) = GREAT fun."Awesome" handling. I think one of the best investments I've made in a very long time


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## lvader (Jul 23, 2006)

Do you have a button for the various options?


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (lvader)*

No, I just have it fixed set in sport (middle) mode. I don't track. I think Ben will be setting up all three modes. I'm rare certain he will post when figured out/installed


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (Hal_K)*

You bet http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
As of right now, HPA, Eip, Neuspeed or any other HPP supplier should be able to provide the wiring diagram necessary to switch the HPP between its three preprogrammed modes (standard, sport - which is what it's set at by default - and race).
I'm going to wait until someone actually puts out a kit with a nice, OEM in-dash switch. 
I still haven't installed mine (waiting for oil & filter). But I'm dying with aniticipation


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Most fun I've had in the front seat of an automobile in a long time !


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Finally! Audi dealership called to say they had Haldex oil and filter in stock, so I'm putting it in tomorrow (not necessary to change out the oil, but since it has to be done every 60,OOOkm I'll do it early this time (@ 85,000km).

Did some vag-com logs: with a hard launch, the Haldex coupling was applying a max of 40 bar of pressure.
In a tight 2nd gear turn, going WOT just before the apex, it applied a max of 38 bar.
We'll see what it does in "sport mode" ;-)


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

It's ON and it's farking great!
The faster and larger transfer of torque to the rear really gives the car a new attitude in turns:
Power can be applied much earlier, and in great big dollops, without fear of understeer.
In roundabouts (they're all over Europe, and especially France), the line can be adjusted purely with the throttle.
High-speed, high-load turns, a lot more throttle can be applied, making for much faster progress.
I can't wait to try the "race" mode, and I really can't wait for rain/snow/or a big fat turbo!
Will post vag-com logs tomorrow.
WOOOT ;-)


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Damn you Ben! Now I want one too!!








Seriously though, great to hear that the difference is indeed that much noticable, especially on the sport mode alone. Keep us updated once you've had a chance to track the upgrade http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
When pushing out of corners now in the sport mode, do you get oversteer, or is the balance closer to neutral? If neutral(ish), can you get it to oversteer if you apply sufficient power? Mine is atleast next to impossible to get to oversteer with the stock Haldex unless the road is very wet/snowy.
Cheers!


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Moogs,
Like you, in the wet with very bad tires (or snow/ice), I could get it to oversteer when stock. On dry pavement, (especially at the track) when reeeeaaaallly pushing it, I could get just a little bit of power-on oversteer. In that situation, I'd have to bring back the steering wheel (counter-steer) just to hold the line.
Well, in all those situations, with the HPP, oversteer is more present. Although I haven't been to a racetrack with the HPP yet, I have driven all last night on deserted country roads. Oversteer is a LOT more present! I am having to redefine the proper line on all my favorite turns. I take them differently now, coming out of them significantly faster, and without a hint of understeer. 
On street intersections, when turning hard right from a stop, you have to be prepared to counter-steer. Not as much as you would with a BMW or even a Subaru, but much more than stock.
Moogs, get it! As soon as possible. The earlier you get it, the more enjoyment you'll get out of it. And I'm sure that with the lighter 2.0T up front it'll do wonders.
Cheers bud,


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Sounds absolutely great! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Like you, I can get a slight hint of oversteer out of the stock setup if I really push it into corners, but even then, as you said, you have the counter-steer immediately to hold the line.
I've forgotten - how much was the price? Or did you get it at a special price


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

To quote Will Smith in Independence Day:
"I have got to get me one of these!"
- Chuck


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Where did you get it? I keep e-mailing AMD, but they keep ignoring me








Andy


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Hi guys,
After ordering from HPA/vag-tech http://www.vagtech.co.uk (Jon Watts in the UK), I found out they were also available from http://www.ace-competition.com in Sweden (even if it isn't mentioned on the website). They quoted me 985 Euro, including about 80 Euro of shipping (UPS priority). They will install a switch on your car too, but obviously they need the vehicle there. They are not yet selling a switching kit on its own.
I was not given any sort of rebate or discount by HPA or Vag-tech or Ace-competition. My posting here is purely to share my enthusiasm, as my g/f really couldn't give a rat's ass.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

We don't have many roundabouts in So Cal. But hard on the throttle, rear end squats & turns (especially right hand) become 90 degree in & out = BRILLIANT !!!!!
Price with shipping was USD 1104


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Thing is, the more you push it, the more active it gets! Very cool, and I can't wait to track it!
Hal, we really need to get a working switching solution. Do you have any leads? (No pun intended ;-)
I asked HPA if they'd forward the wiring diagram so I can get started (card-tray "project" has been indefinitely postponed, ha!).
What would be just perfect is an OEM button next to "ESP off", with two leds: zero lit for std, one for sport and one for race.


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Ben No I have no leads, but I will attempt to source. Has not been high on my to do list. I'm having so much fun as is. Going to "competition mode" will be awesome ! I've agree with your idea about the unused "box" next to the seat belt "box" being the best location. I'll attempt to reach Jared Monday or Tuesday for wiring schematic. Hal


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*8 more pins in large connector. Stock = 6. Is there an adapter?*

In the pictures earlier in this thread, it shows eight pins in the large connector, but the Bentley wiring diagram says there are only six. 
Does the kit come with a 6-8 adapter harness that also brings out the two control leads? 
If so, does it come with the pins & wires already installed, or are we going to have to obtain these items separately if we want to install the switch?
I suppose if the two wire's combinations are None, A, or B grounded, then a center-off double-throw switch could do it. 
If you wanted an Audi pushbutton in the dash, with LED's, you'd need a microcontroller to do the sequencing for each press.
(It would be nice if they also made the modes switchable via Vag-COM so we could try them all without messing around with the wiring.)



_Modified by waggin at 11:34 PM 8-5-2006_


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (montrala)*

Great...
I've get responce from AMD Technik (UK). They said that my 2004 8P A3 3.2Q DSG uses.... 1G Haldex.
What is more funny, is fact that year ago they said that my car uses 2G Haldex.
I'll try this company from Sweden, they are closer to Poland at least


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## .:R2theT (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_Great...
I've get responce from AMD Technik (UK). They said that my 2004 8P A3 3.2Q DSG uses.... 1G Haldex.
What is more funny, is fact that year ago they said that my car uses 2G Haldex.
I'll try this company from Sweden, they are closer to Poland at least









The original HPP upgrade is still a excellent mod.


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (.:R2theT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *.:R2theT* »_The original HPP upgrade is still a excellent mod.

My point is, that all 8P A3 use 2G Haldex, no only since 2005 and Sportback model


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## eltonsi (Mar 17, 2005)

I'm still a little confused, perhaps Ben could clarify this for me. So can I order it from Canada? Is there a distributor who would send it here? Is the switch available yet? Without the switch, is it possible to change the setting from sport to track mode?
All these reviews sound awesome. 
added: Just found out neuspeed carries them at $1299. And they are the "exclusive" distributor in NA. Would it be possible to order it from somewhere else to save a few bucks?


_Modified by eltonsi at 9:38 AM 8-7-2006_


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (ylwghost)*

Elton: 
I would contact HPA in Canada, since that would save you import duty. No-one seems to have a ready-made switch assembly, just a simple wiring diagram from Haldex. Without the switch, it is not possible to switch modes. By default, the GenII HPP is in Sport mode.
Montrala: 
I've had good luck with AmD (their remap for the 3.2 is good), but sometimes you get weird answers from them. On their website, they show the MkIV dogbone mount and GenI HPP for the 8P A3, when neither of those parts fit our cars. 
You are correct Montrala: your car has a GenII controller! Try Ace-competition, and please tell them a wacky frenchman sent you: I am trying to get them to email me the switching wiring diagram.
Waggin:








The connectors are plug and play (the HPP ones are the same as the normal Haldex controller), so I'm not sure which ones serves which purpose. 

We need to get this wiring diagram! First one to gets it wins a case of


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_
Waggin:
The connectors are plug and play (the HPP ones are the same as the normal Haldex controller), so I'm not sure which ones serves which purpose. 

So, along with all of it's other errors and omissions, the Bentley manual is wrong about the number of pins in the large connector. (Next person to install one: Get the part# from the harness plug shell, and see if two of the eight holes are empty. (Assuming Bentley is correct in stating that only six wires are used in the stock setup.)









(I'd check it on my car, but I can't get a grip on the plug to pull it with the controller in place)
If the pins (and wires) aren't there, we'll need to find the correct repair wire part# for the extra two contacts. 
My guess is that Haldex will come out with a $200 plug & play switch kit, and they aren't releasing the wiring diagram because they're afraid that DIY builders will cut into it's sales.



_Modified by waggin at 7:39 PM 8-7-2006_


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

You're probably right about the non-release of the diagram. 
I wish I'd thought of taking pics of the connectors during the install. If you have the inclination, taking off the Haldex controller and puting it back on is a matter of only two allen-headed screws. Unscrew, pull the unit back a little, and you have access to the plugs.
I don't see how we could route a wire from that general area to the dash... I've looked and haven't found any obvious path?


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (waggin)*

I have the OEM Haldex controller in my hand. that coupled with the schematic appears that all 8 pins have purpose. No blanks awaitng use.As Ben said it's plug & play. Appears all 8 pins play. I put a call in to Jared at HPA re: kit or wiring diagram. I left a voice mail message. I think his work week starts on Wednesdays. I'm still interested although the "sport" setting is all I want. I don't track.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Cool. I hope Jared replies and forwards the diagram.
The switch could still be used if the car were to be loaned to the ms. or kids, in inclement weather...
Plus, once you get a taste of the "sport" mode, you will most likely want to try "race" ;-)


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (Hal_K)*

Now that I've actaully read the last page of the installation instructions. The one with the torque graphs. It clearly states that with Option2 "Installing a switch that can then be mounted on the dashboard and the driver will have the possibilities to choose between 3 different parameter settings." Would suggest IF we do not get a response from any of the suppliers this week, I will call/write Haldex-traction division for information on HPP Gen 2 switch.


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_
Montrala: 
I've had good luck with AmD (their remap for the 3.2 is good), but sometimes you get weird answers from them. On their website, they show the MkIV dogbone mount and GenI HPP for the 8P A3, when neither of those parts fit our cars. 
You are correct Montrala: your car has a GenII controller! Try Ace-competition, and please tell them a wacky frenchman sent you: I am trying to get them to email me the switching wiring diagram.

I've sent mail to Ace yesterday. No reply since. Maybe it's something wrong with me?
CORRECTION!! Ace contacted me. I'll put an order with them!










_Modified by montrala at 12:18 AM 8-9-2006_


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_that coupled with the schematic appears that all 8 pins have purpose. No blanks awaitng use.

This is good - it indicates that there probably already are wires at the Haldex end, they're just not connected to anything up front. If we can find them (and the wiring diagram, of course), adding the switch should be much easier.
- Chuck


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Audi dealership called to say they had Haldex oil and filter in stock

Ben, how much did your dealership take for the oil and filter? And would you happen to have the partnumbers somewhere? If (yeah yeah, it's still _if_







) I should choose to do this upgrade, I'm guessing it wouldn't be a bad idea to change them too. How was the change procedure itself?
Cheers!


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## Spidee (Aug 6, 2003)

*Re: (moogie)*

I was leaning on getting the B7 A4 Avant to sit next to the B7 A4 sedan. After reading this thread, the A3 is on my list of test drives. With the Haldex GenII mod, I could see this as my mini RS4. It just needs a Streetwerks turbo to go with it.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Now that I've actaully read the last page of the installation instructions. The one with the torque graphs. It clearly states that with Option2 "Installing a switch that can then be mounted on the dashboard and the driver will have the possibilities to choose between 3 different parameter settings." Would suggest IF we do not get a response from any of the suppliers this week, I will call/write Haldex-traction division for information on HPP Gen 2 switch.



Hal, yeah, switching would only be a matter of running wires from the correct connectors to a switch. In essence, all that is needed is a good installer, and the diagram.
Sorry I didn't make that more clear from the onset.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_
I've sent mail to Ace yesterday. No reply since. Maybe it's something wrong with me?
CORRECTION!! Ace contacted me. I'll put an order with them!









_Modified by montrala at 12:18 AM 8-9-2006_









Let us know how the order/delivery process goes.
As far as the install goes: it is a CINCH ! A little bit of oil does come out when you take out the cylinder, but not much: maybe 10cc's. Changing the Haldex oil and filter is super-easy too, but you need a good "syringe" (sp?) : a tool that looks like a syringe in much bigger, with which fluids can be pushed up through a tube. What I mean is that there is no room to pour the oil into the Haldex: it has to be fed from a tube and from underneath the car. Phew


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_What I mean is that there is no room to pour the oil into the Haldex: it has to be fed from a tube and from underneath the car. Phew









Usual way to top or change oil in things like gearboxes, differentials etc.
I'll send fax with order today or tomorrow and will see.
Any luck with diagram for mode switch?


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (montrala)*

Just sent order!
I also talked to Per Johansson from ACE about wiring diagram. He said that they are working on it, probably will made complete wiring harneses. But becouse lot of work on customer cars that they have now, he expect it to come out in some 2-3 months earliest


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (montrala) (a3 3dr Q)*

Andy & Ben. No answer from Jared at HPA Canada, perhaps he's on holiday. E-mailed Haldex Traction division in Michigan. He's on holiday until next week. Also e-mailed Haldex AWD Club tech. line in Sweden Hopefully someone will answer. I'm having so much fun with the Controller in "sport" mode I wonder if I would remain sane with "competition" mode.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (Spidee)*

HPA makes 2 turbos for the 3.2 L. Single side draft & double side draft intercoolers. 400hp/380ftlb for single US $ 11,999 + 15 hours installation. Other is 450hp/400ftlb. US$ 14,500 + 18 hours installation. They have a few dealers around North America. Then would need really big Brembo brakes.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Andy & Ben. No answer from Jared at HPA Canada, perhaps he's on holiday. E-mailed Haldex Traction division in Michigan. He's on holiday until next week. Also e-mailed Haldex AWD Club tech. line in Sweden Hopefully someone will answer. I'm having so much fun with the Controller in "sport" mode I wonder if I would remain sane with "competition" mode. 

Good job! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_ Just sent order!
I also talked to Per Johansson from ACE about wiring diagram. He said that they are working on it, probably will made complete wiring harneses. But becouse lot of work on customer cars that they have now, he expect it to come out in some 2-3 months earliest


Hi Andy; yes, Ace seems to be very busy. I look forward to hearing your comments on the HPP.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Although the controller itself has the ability to switch programs the ability to manually toggle between those programs has not yet been finalized. I am, however in discussion with my supplier and hope to have this added feature available within the next few weeks. I will follow-up with information as it becomes available.
E-mail received from Jared at HPA this A.M. I will post when I hear (see) an update.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (Hal_K)*

Ok, this shop in the UK: http://www.autops.co.uk/news.php *have developed a switch and installed it in a MkV R32*. 
While speaking with Ed Jackson (seems like a real good guy http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif ), he mentioned that a physical three-way switch was mandatory. Electronic toggling seems to be out of the question. Hence their clever use of an VAG OEM rear-view-mirror adjustment knob:

[from their website]
_Other MKV R32 upgrades available
Other upgrades which we have been trying include the Haldex Generation II controller. The benefits of the controller are very high, it transfers more torque to the rear wheels very quickly, far more quickly than standard. Therefore there is greater traction out of corners and reduced understeer. We find it is particularly effective in damp conditions too.
Also available is a cabin mounted switch which allows you to alternate between three different settings on the Haldex: Comfort, Sport and Race. The three settings provide more and more torque to the rear with each increment, Race allows some over steer characteristics as well. The switch is housed just next to the ESP button in replacement of one of the blanks and will use an OEM quality switch for factory appearance. This can be viewed and tested on our own car.
_









I can soooo see that in my car, on the dash









Cheers,


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## 200qandA3q (May 1, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_While speaking with Ed Jackson (seems like a real good guy http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif ), he mentioned that a physical three-way switch was mandatory.

A "physical" 3-way switch? Probably you mean "mechanical".


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Ben, Excellent ! I know you will post after installed & tested. Interesting they've mounted the switch in the position you first described.


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*I wrote to Bently Publishers about the 8 pin large connector, and*

Their reply was that the large connector has six pins, and the small one has two, making a total of eight. Apparently, they never looked at the image I attached, which clearly shows the 8 pins in the large conn. 
It appears if Audi anticipated the introduction of the HPP controller and built the 6-wire harness with an 8-pin plug. (Or, are there 8 wires and pins in the harness, with the extra two routed to some convenient spot inside the car? 
(I don't really want to try to remove the plug until I get the new controller. It's very easy to break the clips on them if you;re not careful. )
http://webpages.charter.net/dw...t.jpg 
Also, it looks like I was right before. None of the dealers wants to release the schematic because they all want to sell switch kits instead








Of course, the first person to buy one will check it with a meter, draw a schematic, and post it here.


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Ben, Excellent ! I know you will post after installed & tested. Interesting they've mounted the switch in the position you first described. 

Unfortunately, I've already used my spare position for the TPMS switch. 
I suppose I could just stuff the useless airbag disabled indicator back inside the console and put the mode switch in it's spot


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## A4Kevin (May 4, 2005)

Guys. I am considering this upgrade as well. Can you please tell me if you feel any difference under 'normal' driving conditions?


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Ok, this shop in the UK: http://www.autops.co.uk/news.php *have developed a switch and installed it in a MkV R32*. 

Could you convince them to make wiring harnes plus switch? Trip from Poland to UK just to have switch installed seems like litlle overkill


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (A4Kevin)*

>Can you please tell me if you feel any difference under 'normal' driving conditions?<
Kevin, not certain of what you mean by normal driving conditions. Here in Southern California that's 2mph-80mph on so called freeways. 25mph-50mph on surface streets. 30mph-50mph on canyons roads. All in all the vehicle is more responsive. Less throttle input to lock-up of driveline clutch, so more RWD feel sooner. I don't understand micro-processors, sensors, etc. BUT I do know this changes the driving dynamics to where the bias FEELS much more like RWD than FWD. Also SEEMS quicker in lane changes & crash avoidance. On cornering & canyon roads it definitely is much more stable, without coming off throttle. Thereby higher speeds (e.g.: canyon curves at 45mph-50mph instead of 30mph). Hal


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_
Could you convince them to make wiring harnes plus switch? Trip from Poland to UK just to have switch installed seems like litlle overkill











It's a long drive for me too so yes, I've asked them for a kit that would be as "plug & play" as possible. They said they would look into it... We'll see how responsive this shop is.
There remains the question of routing the wire from behind the dash to the e-brake area, finding a proper grommet to come out of the car, and wiring the whole thing *cleanly*. It's something my Audi dealer will be doing. 

_Quote, originally posted by *A4Kevin* »_Guys. I am considering this upgrade as well. Can you please tell me if you feel any difference under 'normal' driving conditions?

Yes, it's noticeable even in everyday driving. Don't get me wrong, it won't feel like a BMW Motorsport Z3, wagging its tail at every ocasion; it _will_ feel like more torque is being sent more quickly to the rear diff. If you're nutty enough to even consider this upgrade, you _will_ feel it!


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_I've asked them for a kit that would be as "plug & play" as possible.

Now there's something you could bring with when you're here next month.
Did you get my e-mail?
Just got back from 2 track days at Blackhawk Farms - the DSG and Haldex really help to get through the back section, much much better than the TT did. Will definitely want to try it with the upgraded controller.
- Chuck


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (n828cl)*

Just spoke to Ed Jackson: they are going to try the switch on an A3's dash and will get back to me next week. Chuck, I did get your email, did you get my reply?
I vag-com'd my HPP in the by-default "Sport" mode today, and it was applying 40 N/m of pressure to the coupler's discs, versus 30 N/m in standard form (5,000 rpm clutch drop). I also noticed the front wheels were spinning a lot less, and that rpms had to be raised in order not to avoid the dreaded 4wd bog at launch. 
Powering out of a turn, it applied 38 N/m where it applied 28 N/m previously (mid-rpm 2nd gear upon turn-in, WOT just before apex).
So it's applying 10 more N/m than before, therefore transfering more torque to the rear. Pressue ramp-up has sped up significantly, says butt-dyno and vag-com Logs. I still can't change my base logging data to graphs so sorry: can't post those.
What I can post is a few more pics:

The standard controller, which comes off with two Allen screws:









Removed, the two multi-pin connectors are accessible (a little Haldex oil falls out):









The 8-pin connector, up close & personal:









The Blue GenII HPP http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif :









There ya go


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

1. Did you notice if there were wire terminals in the 7 & 8 positions of the harness plug? The car wiring diagram only shows six pins, so I suspect that the extra two are for the mode switching. 
(If there are wires for those two pins, the next thing to find out is where they go.. Is it possible that Audi already ran the mode select wires to the inside of the car's cabin?
If not, then the DIY switch builders will also need a part number for the connector pins or repair wire needed to add them.)
2. Is it possible to set the mode with Vag-COM? If so, are the values labelled?


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_The car wiring diagram only shows six pins, so I suspect that the extra two are for the mode switching.

I only count five pins currently in use:








Looks like #s 4, 7, and 8 are not connected (or perhaps just not documented).
- Chuck



_Modified by n828cl at 7:08 PM 8-16-2006_


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Chuck, I did get your email, did you get my reply?

Nothing since 8 August.
- Chuck


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_1. Did you notice if there were wire terminals in the 7 & 8 positions of the harness plug? The car wiring diagram only shows six pins, so I suspect that the extra two are for the mode switching. 
(If there are wires for those two pins, the next thing to find out is where they go.. Is it possible that Audi already ran the mode select wires to the inside of the car's cabin?
If not, then the DIY switch builders will also need a part number for the connector pins or repair wire needed to add them.)
2. Is it possible to set the mode with Vag-COM? If so, are the values labelled? 


1.: Sadly, I did not look/notice, and the tech really wanted me out of his way. The shop I usually go to was closed for holidays, so I wasn't free to hang out under there as much as I would have wanted.
I may have a switch and harness by end of next week (if the R32 switch fits our A3 dashes). So I'll be able to tell you more then.

2.: I have looked at the HPP through vag-com. It is clearly labeled "Haldex Tuning", but I haven't found any adaptation values or such. Do you have any pointers to get me looking in the right direction?
In any case, this may be a moot point, as Ed Jackson clearly stated the HPP needs a mechanical "_physical_"







switch to toggle between modes.

Chuck, I'm sending you an email asap.







(----> in three weeks @ Sample Room







)


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Looks like I just cant keep on drooling and dreaming over this upgrade, so most likely will order quite soon







I've been talking with Ace regarding the switch - let's see if I can convince them to through together a DIY kit, they haven't totally dismissed the idea yet.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Yeah, Mr Johansson emailed today saying he was working on it. And for you, it makes sense to work with Sweden.
I forget what suspension mods you have done, if any. If I hadn't done the coilovers already, I would have hard time deciding between the two. 
Nah, scratch that: I think I'd do the HPP first!


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## yam (Jul 18, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_I forget what suspension mods you have done, if any. If I hadn't done the coilovers already, I would have hard time deciding between the two. 
Nah, scratch that: I think I'd do the HPP first!


I'm surprised your that impressed with it. I may just end up keeping my stock sport suspension and go this route. Eventually hope to end up with FSD, Haldex upgrade, and VF Engineering, and nothing else. Now if they would only release 2 of the 3...


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_I forget what suspension mods you have done, if any. If I hadn't done the coilovers already, I would have hard time deciding between the two. 
Nah, scratch that: I think I'd do the HPP first!

I have H&R springs and rear swaybar. I'm actually quite happy with the combo, and not missing coilovers as much as I thought I might. HPP being quite a bit cheaper than good coilovers makes the choice even easier


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Connector pinout photos*

First, the front: You'll need connector pins or repair wires.. 









And the back: Here, you'll need grommets for the wires. The tiny filler plugs will be very hard to drill out. 








And the part# of the connector shell. Perhaps this can be used to find what pins fit in it:








The easiest place to run the new wires inside the car will be through the fuel tank sender openings, under the rear seat.. This looks like where the existing harness runs to. 

Also, I'm not suprised to find that the actual wiring does not match the Bentley manual's diagram. 
Here's what I found:
Pin#------Actual color------Bentley color------Function (Bentley)
1----------Blk/Blu----------Blk/Grn--------------+12V
2----------Brn--------------Brn-------------------GND
3----------Blk/Red---------Blk/Yel---------------Brake light switch
4----------None------------None-----------------None
5----------None------------Org/Brn--------------CAN-Low
6----------None------------Org/Blk--------------CAN-High
7----------Org/Brn---------Bentley = 6 pins
8----------Org/Blk---------Bentley = 6 pins
So, it looks like the CAN bus leads have been moved to pins 7&8. and pin 1 is probably 12V because it's about the same size as the ground wire.
Perhaps I'll just wait for a kit









Edit: CONNECTOR PINS: I stopped at the dealer this morning. The 06-07 ETKA catalog has a page that cross-refenrences connector shells to repair wires. He picked one fromt he list, and it showed various wires (with 2 pins each) with three different wire sizes. 
So, finding the pins shoudl be easy. (I forgot to ask about the sealing grommets..)



_Modified by waggin at 1:28 PM 8-18-2006_


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Waggin: Wow, great info and awesome pics! 
Yam: Yes, I am well chuffed with the HPP (btw, I paid full price for mine, no rebate, no discount, no sponsorship: I blabber about it here because my g/f really couldn't give a dead rat's ass). 
When I changed my suspension and went with V3s, the difference was hugely obvious (as it would be with any shock/spring/rear arb swap). The HPP isn't as "in-yourr-face", the change it brings is quite subtle. But feeling the rear become more alive, to feel the front being less burdened, to be able to get back to WOT before the apex is just great!


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## crew219 (Oct 18, 2000)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_
When I changed my suspension and went with V3s, the difference was hugely obvious (as it would be with any shock/spring/rear arb swap). The HPP isn't as "in-yourr-face", the change it brings is quite subtle. But feeling the rear become more alive, to feel the front being less burdened, to be able to get back to WOT before the apex is just great!

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Moogie, I'd at least throw on new dampers before upgrading to the HPP. Mods such as these are synergistic; the KW V3s allow a much higher degree of body control as well as grip. Therefore, Ben is able to get on the throttle much sooner to utilize the HPP. If you want to keep your H&R setup, I'd either throw on some Bilstein Sports (I think they're called B8s in europe, maybe B6) if you're more interested in a performance shock, or Koni Sports for a blend of daily comfort and performance. 
Dave


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (crew217)*


_Quote, originally posted by *crew217* »_Moogie, I'd at least throw on new dampers before upgrading to the HPP.

I don't think that is really necessary. The S-line dampers (different from the sport ones you have) seem to work very well together with the H&R springs. Would coilovers be better? Absolutely. Necessary to benefit from the HPP? Not so sure. As soon as I have some spare cash, I'll get myself a proper kit such as the V3's, but until then, I'm quite happy with the current setup.
And then ofcourse there are reasons outside the track too to want this upgrade. Namely the long, cold and snowy winter season we have over here. Just thinking of the fun I could have with this upgrade during the winter alone is enough in my mind justify it. You'd pretty much notice it every day while driving to work with the silly grin on your face


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_
I don't think that is really necessary. The S-line dampers (different from the sport ones you have) seem to work very well together with the H&R springs. Would coilovers be better? Absolutely. Necessary to benefit from the HPP? Not so sure. As soon as I have some spare cash, I'll get myself a proper kit such as the V3's, but until then, I'm quite happy with the current setup.
And then ofcourse there are reasons outside the track too to want this upgrade. Namely the long, cold and snowy winter season we have over here. Just thinking of the fun I could have with this upgrade during the winter alone is enough in my mind justify it. You'd pretty much notice it every day while driving to work with the silly grin on your face










So you had the S-Line chassis option, as well as the "styling" package? Back when I bought mine, it was a great option: 350 Euro for -25mm springs, uprated dampeners and arbs http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I did find the springs were of a very high rate, very stiff. The KW's springs are much softer, but the dampening is much firmer.
Moogie, will you keep the H&R springs for snow, or will you switch to a softer spring? 
I already envy your winter, and the snow it will bring you (Is this the year Sebastien Loeb finally wins the Finnish Rally?).


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_So you had the S-Line chassis option, as well as the "styling" package? Back when I bought mine, it was a great option: 350 Euro for -25mm springs, uprated dampeners and arbs http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
I did find the springs were of a very high rate, very stiff. The KW's springs are much softer, but the dampening is much firmer.
Moogie, will you keep the H&R springs for snow, or will you switch to a softer spring? 
I already envy your winter, and the snow it will bring you (Is this the year Sebastien Loeb finally wins the Finnish Rally?).

Back when I bought mine, the S-line Exterior package wasn't even available. And in Finland, neither was the S-line chassis package. The S-line "plus" package, which was available, had both S-line chassis and interior. The Exterior package was retrofitted after I had a little bit too much fun last winter, and ended with some damage to the front bumper








I agree, the S-line springs were very stiff - too stiff to be exact. The H&R springs are softer. H&R beats the S-line springs in handling and even comfort in every way. I'm too lazy to swap springs for the winter, but with the H&R's, there actually no real need to do so.
Let's see what happens with the rally. Loeb has been driving well, but Grönholm is atleast still leading


----------



## covenant (Jul 22, 2006)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_I agree, the S-line springs were very stiff - too stiff to be exact. The H&R springs are softer. H&R beats the S-line springs in handling and even comfort in every way.

Hmmm, might have to save up for H&R then - finding the S-Line springs a bit severe, and if I can lower at the same time it seems like a win-win situation to me.


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

FITTED!!
Lancer Evo it is not, but definitelly goes right way with HPP








I have no mods, S-line package (chasis, interior, exterior). Diference in handling is noticable even in normal commuting, especially on 90dgr truns. Car is more eager to go into corner, it somehow feels easier to turn. When hard pressed on wery wet and ESP off is suprisingly neutral. Waiting impatiently for switching solution! Maybe "Race" should we wired with "ESP" swith to make it instant "off" when Race is selected?
As to S-line chasis it's stiff, not very stif I'm used to stiffer setups, but for eg. BMW E46 M-package chasis was more comfortable, while seemed to "hold-on" better. For next season I must consider KW V3 coilover.


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_FITTED!!

Congrats!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I'll really need to order mine first thing next week..

_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_As to S-line chasis it's stiff, not very stif I'm used to stiffer setups, but for eg. BMW E46 M-package chasis was more comfortable, while seemed to "hold-on" better. For next season I must consider KW V3 coilover.

Sure, there are much stiffer setups too. But something just isn't right with the S-line chassis as it is. I suspect that the dampers are too soft for the stiff springs, causing all kinds of wobling and other problems. High speed braking especially caused the whole rear of the car to behave erratically, when with the H&R's it's very stable.


----------



## 200qandA3q (May 1, 2006)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_But something just isn't right with the S-line chassis as it is. I suspect that the dampers are too soft for the stiff springs, causing all kinds of wobling and other problems. High speed braking especially caused the whole rear of the car to behave erratically, when with the H&R's it's very stable.

That may be a true in regard to your 2.0T version of "S-line chassis", but that was not my experience tracking the 3.2 S-line (NA version with with stock suspension). Hard braking at 185-200 KPH has been quite stable. The 3.2 has (proportionately) more weight in the rear, I believe. And then there are the variables such as rear pads--I had track pads in front but not for rears.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (200qandA3q)*


_Quote, originally posted by *200qandA3q* »_
That may be a true in regard to your 2.0T version of "S-line chassis", but that was not my experience tracking the 3.2 S-line (NA version with with stock suspension). Hard braking at 185-200 KPH has been quite stable. The 3.2 has (proportionately) more weight in the rear, I believe. And then there are the variables such as rear pads--I had track pads in front but not for rears.

Sure, but it's the early-model S-Line Chassis option we're talking about: VERY stiff springs, and upradted dampeners that _still_ weren't up to the task. After May 2005, the S-Line Chassis option was softened up, so it's even worse than what Covenant is experiencing.
I had high-speed in-turn braking rear instability with the Pre-May 2005 S-Line setup too.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_FITTED!!
Lancer Evo it is not, but definitelly goes right way with HPP








I have no mods, S-line package (chasis, interior, exterior). Diference in handling is noticable even in normal commuting, especially on 90dgr truns. Car is more eager to go into corner, it somehow feels easier to turn. When hard pressed on wery wet and ESP off is suprisingly neutral. Waiting impatiently for switching solution! Maybe "Race" should we wired with "ESP" swith to make it instant "off" when Race is selected?
As to S-line chasis it's stiff, not very stif I'm used to stiffer setups, but for eg. BMW E46 M-package chasis was more comfortable, while seemed to "hold-on" better. For next season I must consider KW V3 coilover.

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Congrats my friend! You must have the badassest Polish A3







Did you go with Ace-Competition or another company?
I told Ed Jackson from http://www.autops.co.uk , who's working on a ready-to-fit switch that there were at least four people highly interested: two guys in the US, one in Poland and one in France







, and that Finland was on its way too















We should have more info by the end of next week, as Ed has ordered OEM Audi blank switches to modify....


----------



## .:R2theT (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_
I told Ed Jackson from http://www.autops.co.uk , who's working on a ready-to-fit switch that there were at least four people highly interested: two guys in the US, one in Poland and one in France







, and that Finland was on its way too















We should have more info by the end of next week, as Ed has ordered OEM Audi blank switches to modify....


I hope I am one of those US guys! I also emailed with Jared at HPA last week. He said they are working on a switch as well. I asked he keep me abreast of their progress. I hope someone can come up with something that works in our empty dash buttons.
So In the meantime, do you think the HPP in the default sport mode would be too much for our Minnesota winters? Or would it make me look forward to many inches of snow on my commute up to Shoreview? 


_Modified by .:R2theT at 3:42 AM 8-19-2006_


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (200qandA3q)*


_Quote, originally posted by *200qandA3q* »_That may be a true in regard to your 2.0T version of "S-line chassis", but that was not my experience tracking the 3.2 S-line (NA version with with stock suspension). Hard braking at 185-200 KPH has been quite stable. The 3.2 has (proportionately) more weight in the rear, I believe. And then there are the variables such as rear pads--I had track pads in front but not for rears.

Actually, the 3.2 is heavier in the front. The only major difference between a 2.0TQ and the 3.2Q is the engine, which is some, iirc, 120-130lbs heavier in the 3.2.
The reason why you haven't had any problems is because the NA S-line has the same suspension as the Sport. The Euro S-line chassis option has Quattro Gmbh modified suspension components, which is what my experience was about. Sorry for the confusion









_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_I told Ed Jackson from http://www.autops.co.uk , who's working on a ready-to-fit switch that there were at least four people highly interested: two guys in the US, one in Poland and one in France , and that Finland was on its way too

Good stuff Ben







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Actually, the 3.2 is heavier in the front. The only major difference between a 2.0TQ and the 3.2Q is the engine, which is some, iirc, 120-130lbs heavier in the 3.2.

I suspect 200qandA3q was thinking of the 2.0t FWD vs. the 3.2 quattro (i.e., vehicles available in North America). The 3.2q is noticeably better balanced than the FWD 2.0t, albeit some 250 lbs heavier. Your 2.0t quattro would definitely be the best for balance and weight.
- Chuck


----------



## 200qandA3q (May 1, 2006)

*Re: (n828cl)*

Yes, I was thinking of the weight distribution of the FWD version. In any case, owners of the NA-spec 3.2q can expect (and will get) decent handling and braking capability in track events. Of course some mods (like the Haldex upgrade) sure wouldn't hurt.
BTW, I had such a blast driving the 3.2 at Watkins Glen last month that I've convinced its owner (my long-suffering spouse) to let me drive it again at the Glen later this month. There's no better way to really break it in, I tell her. She knows better, of course.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (.:R2theT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *.:R2theT* »_

I hope I am one of those US guys! I also emailed with Jared at HPA last week. He said they are working on a switch as well. I asked he keep me abreast of their progress. I hope someone can come up with something that works in our empty dash buttons.
So In the meantime, do you think the HPP in the default sport mode would be too much for our Minnesota winters? Or would it make me look forward to many inches of snow on my commute up to Shoreview? 

_Modified by .:R2theT at 3:42 AM 8-19-2006_

As soon as I have an update, I'll post here.
With regards to driving in snow:
Even in stock mode, you can get oversteer with the 3.2Q. Especially on left-hand turns (because of the direction of rotation of the driveshaft, natural tendency is for the rear to slide right).
I think the HPP, even in Sport mode, would make winter driving safer by reducing power-on understeer. Of course, one would have to be ready for the oversteer and the necessary counter-steer.
In Race, it should just plain be fun!


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_ Congrats my friend! You must have the badassest Polish A3







Did you go with Ace-Competition or another company?

ACE, very fast and competent. AmD still didn't answered my inquires







I was thinking to go to them to do remap and exhaust. Now I rather look for other company.


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (.:R2theT)*

Slight Update. Neither Haldex North America nor Haldex AWD Club Sweden have responded to me inquiries re: any sort of switch to get all 3 functions from HPP Gen 2 Controller. Also waiting to hear from Jared at HPA
On lighter note. Now with 2000 Southern California miles it is such a pleasure to drive with this modification I smile a lot. 
Now I need advise on tires. The vehicle came with Pirelli P6000 M+S 225/45/17 With "excaliber" rims. I don't like the look of the rims & the tires are disappointing. Ran Pirellis back in the day on my Porsches & these are very inferior. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thinking of going to 18" rims. Input invited. In the meantime the AWD is very definitely rear bias which pleases me greatly. Amazing coupled with the DSG, it's just "point & shoot" Really has added a safety dimension to driving So. Cal. Highways & Byways.


----------



## KnockKnock (Jun 30, 2005)

*Re: (Hal_K)*

If you like getting it loose a bit, then wider tires would thwart that a bit, so maybe stick with 17's... but 18's look better. But in either case, I'd quickly move to summer performance tires - especially in SoCal.
http://www.caranddriver.com/ar...10252


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Slight Update. Neither Haldex North America nor Haldex AWD Club Sweden have responded to me inquiries re: any sort of switch to get all 3 functions from HPP Gen 2 Controller. Also waiting to hear from Jared at HPA
... 


Hal, I find that strange to say the least, especially when page 5 of the instructions Haldex provides with its "Gen2 Tuningkit" clearly states that a switch can enable toggling between the three modes. I posted those instructions on this thread, page 2 iirc.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

"Option 2"







:


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Ben, Yes as you've pointed out the Controller has the capability BUT the manufacturer does not respond to inquiry. I guess must wait for UK or Canada to do it.


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (KnockKnock)*

Thank You ! I've bookmarked the reference. Will take my time to digest.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Would Monsieur like a sniffter of '73 Armagnac, to make the process more pleasant? ;-)


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (KnockKnock)*


_Quote, originally posted by *KnockKnock* »_If you like getting it loose a bit, then wider tires would thwart that a bit, so maybe stick with 17's... but 18's look better.

The diameter of the wheel does not affect the width of the tire. You can still put 225s on an 18" wheel. What you do get is a stiffer sidewall, with better turn-in and sometimes a slightly harsher ride.
- Chuck


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Thinking of going to 18" rims. Input invited.

I'm in the same boat. Without going to forged, the lightest wheels out there that have an acceptable offset for the A3 appear to be the OZ Ultraleggera and the Flik Hornet. The only real concern is the durability, especially with the 18s, where more road shocks will be transmitted to the wheel due to the narrower sidewall. The Fliks are cheap enough, you could buy a spare or two.
For OZ: http://www.tirerack.com
For Flik: http://www.edgeracing.com
- Chuck


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Would Monsieur like a sniffter of '73 Armagnac, to make the process more pleasant? ;-)
Yes Please ! Ah, Ben you have good taste in things other than automobiles. Hal


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (n828cl)*

Chuck, I also am looking at Ronal after market. Their North America facility is only 45 miles north of my home. Hal


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Slight Update. Neither Haldex North America nor Haldex AWD Club Sweden have responded to me inquiries re: any sort of switch to get all 3 functions from HPP Gen 2 Controller. Also waiting to hear from Jared at HPA


1. What dealer did you get yours from?
2. I don't know why they're not releasing the wiring diagrams.
Many owners will buy the kits anyway, and the DIY'ers will build their own. (Once one of us buys the kit, creates a diagram from it, and posts it everwhere


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Chuck, I also am looking at Ronal after market. Their North America facility is only 45 miles north of my home. Hal

Certainly convenient and they have frequent sales, but they're pretty heavy wheels. I'm trying to find something to reduce unsprung weight and rotational inertia that will also survive riding on curbs at the track (and not cost anything, of course







).
- Chuck



_Modified by n828cl at 10:40 PM 8-22-2006_


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (waggin)*

What dealer did you get yours from?
Got mine from HPA. They had them in stock & at US $ 200 less than MSRP. Arrived in So Cal from B.C. in 2 days.


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (n828cl)*

Chuck, Follow up with Ronal = yes too heavy. Although I don't track, quick response in So Cal is a survival essential. The Tire Rack package of 18" ASA JH8 with Goodyear F1 appeals to me. The stock Pirelli P6000 M+S were bad initially. How with the HPP installed they're tragic. Hal


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*

Andy, has ACE given you any more information on their switching solution?


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Andy, has ACE given you any more information on their switching solution?

Not.
In meantime I had week in mountain area. Defintelly more neutral on enter going into slight oversteer on exit. Lot of fun


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I had a lot of fun on a country road covered in mud left by tractors... With a little rain, the asphalt turned into a giant "Slip 'n Slide"









On my end, the switch isn't available yet. I just can't wait


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Just got mail from Ace Competition - they have shipped my order!







I should also get a little something extra included in the package - namely the wiring diagram for the switch. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Now just to wait until it gets here..


----------



## yam (Jul 18, 2005)

*Re: (moogie)*

Please make sure to post up schematics. It should be simple enough to get a remote switch working properly.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Just got mail from Ace Competition - they have shipped my order!







I should also get a little something extra included in the package - namely the wiring diagram for the switch. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Now just to wait until it gets here.. 


WOOT!
Looking forward to the diagram too... Did Mr Johansson mention developing a kit with an OEM switch?
TIA,


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Looking forward to the diagram too... Did Mr Johansson mention developing a kit with an OEM switch?

Nope. As far as I know, the switch Ace uses is custom, which they install hidden somewhere close to the hood release lever. Per did not mention that they would have been working on a kit with a OEM look'n'feel switch. Sure, it would be cool, but I think I'll manage just as well with a hidden switch too


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Hey,if it gives access to the "race" program I'm all for it! The guys working on an OEM-like switch haven't gotten back to me yet...


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Just when I was having one of those Monday's, a little something came to cheere me up








I'm off to find all the stuff I need to go and install the kit, but to start with, here as promissed is the wiring diagram Ace sent me:


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (moogie)*

Interesting. But rises two questions:
1. What are modes for each position?
2. Why swith is wired for position 4 (mode "1-1")?


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_I'm off to find all the stuff I need to go and install the kit, but to start with, here as promissed is the wiring diagram Ace sent me:

Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Besides the previous questions, I've got one more: Waggin found that the existing pin 3 is connected to the brake light switch (wiring diagrams 112/16 and 136/3), although I haven't measured yet to see if the signal is high or low with the brake pedal depressed. Disconnecting it (as called for in the above diagram) would seem to completely eliminate the normal mode of disabling the Haldex when the pedal is pushed; that doesn't seem to make sense to me.
- Chuck


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_2. Why swith is wired for position 4 (mode "1-1")?

The 01-1261 is a 6-position switch with lockout capability. Looks like you're supposed to put in the stop pins to preclude selection of the other 3 positions. Doesn't really answer your question about what the HPP does if you hit it with 12v on both pins or why the switch diagram shows connections on A4 and B4. Any guinea pigs out there?
- Chuck



_Modified by n828cl at 12:37 PM 9-4-2006_


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (n828cl)*

Thanks for the diagram! really looking forward to getting this switching sorted out.


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Good questions there, unfortunately I don't have any answers at the moment. I can send Ace an email about these, but I'll wait until I can combine most that come up in the next day or so








One issue which still needs to be resolved is ofcourse how to route the wires from the haldex unit to somewhere inside the car. I'm guessing there has to be some routes that the factory wiring use, but whether these are easily accessible is a different story.


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_
One issue which still needs to be resolved is ofcourse how to route the wires from the haldex unit to somewhere inside the car. I'm guessing there has to be some routes that the factory wiring use, but whether these are easily accessible is a different story.

The best routing to the inside of the car will above the fuel tank, If you remove the lower seat cushion, you can see the plastic access hatches for the fuel tank senders and their wiring. This appears to be the general direction taken by the conroller cable as well, and will probably the most convenient route inside the car.
Still, the bit about removing the wire in pin 3 makes no sense, if you believe that it's a brake light output (+12 when pedal is pressed). 
Unfortunately, I can't depend on the Bentley electirical diagrams any more, since I found mismatches in both connectors I've compared to the ones in my car. I just can't believe they're recommending that the brake input be disconnected. 
Maybe the plan is to allow it to remain engaged under braking, and disengage via CAN messages when the ABS is activated. 
If we assume that pin 4 (B) floats high when disconnected (stock condition), then pulling it to GND signals the controller to use pin 3 as a mode input instead. 
(Would you ever WANT it to engage during braking?)
I think I'll just have to wait until someone buys a prewired kit and probes it with an ohmmeter before installation, to get the real connections for each switch position. 
I wish Haldes would release an official diagram, with what mode goes with which connections. They could have sold one to me already if I had this data. (I'm not crawling under the car twice, once to install the controller, and another to do the wiring..)


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Waggin, that's the weird part: afaik, the above diagram is the one sent to the retailers by Haldex themselves...


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (n828cl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *n828cl* »_The 01-1261 is a 6-position switch with lockout capability. Looks like you're supposed to put in the stop pins to preclude selection of the other 3 positions. 

But still. If only 3 positions are needed, why use 6 position 30dgr switch with 2x6u contacts and lock-out??!!








Why not just use 60dgr swith with 2x3u contancts, and no lock out (foolproof solution)? GND to A1, A2, B1, B3 while +12V to A3 and B2, finito. Strange.


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

I found an easier option for the DIY'er. An on-on-on three-position DPDT toggle switch will provide the states shown in the Haldex diagram:
The center postion of the switch is the 0-0 state, which I assume is normal mode.
A search for "on-on-on toggle" reveals that these are a very common item in electric guitars, so they should be readily available.. Just make sure it's the right type, since they look identical to the much more common on-off-on switch. 








Also, the 2006 US ETKA catalog (I need one of these) has part numbers for the rubber connector wire seals. They're not linked tothe connector shells, but by wire size, length, outside diameter, and color code. 
_Modified by waggin at 8:53 AM 9-6-2006_


_Modified by waggin at 8:54 AM 9-6-2006_


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_ Just make sure it's the right type, since they look identical to the much more common on-off-on switch. 

Make also sure that it's non-shorting (with "u" type contacts), as one originally specified is. For delicate electronics it's important.
By the way... I started to think, why bother with "normal" setup? Wouldn't "sport" and "race" enought? I now have "sport" all the time. Evertyday drive is not worse or harder, also fuel economy didn't drop.


_Modified by montrala at 3:43 AM 9-7-2006_


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*

...having an "off" position could be useful for those icy days when you lend your car to a fwd - driving gf... and for remembering why you spent all that cash


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Ohhh! I tought that "race" is for icy days


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_Ohhh! I tought that "race" is for icy days









It is, at least sometimes. But we had to cancel a couple of frozen lake "track" days here this past winter - ice not thick enough.








- Chuck


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (n828cl)*

What's ice ? this post is from ecodetuning here in So. Cal. :"Sale: Haladex Gen 2 ECU - $999 Shipped!" That's $ 107 less than I paid. I e-mailed Jeremy there,. He responded that will send schematic for switch when he gets it. Did not say they were interested in doing switch. Seems only kit will be from Ace, if at all. Hal


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_this post is from ecodetuning here in So. Cal. :"Sale: Haladex Gen 2 ECU - $999 Shipped!"

Yup, mine's ordered and is on the truck for delivery Tuesday, 12 September. Didn't think to ask for the wiring diagram, but will on Monday.
- Chuck


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (n828cl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *n828cl* »_It is, at least sometimes. But we had to cancel a couple of frozen lake "track" days here this past winter - ice not thick enough.









No such problems here. We have ice and snow covering main roads allright! All becouse "winter suprised road services again". But becouse officially roads are clean, so studded tires are banned. This can be fun, but if you get 500km of such fun plus some big trucks goind sideways from other direction it starts to be less funny


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (n828cl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *n828cl* »_
Yup, mine's ordered and is on the truck for delivery Tuesday, 12 September. Didn't think to ask for the wiring diagram, but will on Monday.
- Chuck



That's a great price, and a lot cheaper than what I paid for mine in Europe. Chuck, I just got in from CA: I'll call this afternoon. Maybe we could go have your HPP installed tomorrow at that place on Quattro Drive?
I got another email from the guys in UK, regarding an A3-specific switching kit. They say they're close to completion. I should be receiving it when I get back to France, late next week.


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re:*

Finally had a chance to go tracking with the HPP installed







Now I'm left with slightly mixed feelings.
There's no doubt that the mod wouldn't have changed the haldex behavior. I was exiting the corners clearly faster than before. Not by a huge margin, but still, there was a difference. Unfortunately the choice for the track of the day was one were the last time I drove was over two months ago, so how the car behaved earlier wasn't exactly in fresh memory.
So, as said, there is a difference in how the car accelerates out of corners. What I didn't experience however was oversteer. Nada. None. Zip. Zero. If pushed to the limit (and beyond), the car would still safely understeer just like it did earlier. Yes, the limit is raised, but no oversteer for me







I tried a few things to try and get the rear loose, but wasn't really successful. There are ofcourse many other things at play too, must importantly tires and tire pressure, but unfortunately I didn't have enough time to experiment with those.
Hopefully we'll have the switch sorted out soon so that we can give Race-mode a try. I'm still hoping that it will provide the added punch to get the car to exit-oversteer











_Modified by moogie at 8:26 PM 9/12/2006_


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Got mine today. from ecodetining = Neuspeed?*

I ordered the $999 sale item from ecodetuning.com, and it arrived today, in a Neuspeed box, with Neuspeed's return address??) I'll install it soon. 
One item: Haldex needs to pack these things better. It came in a Haldex box, which was about 2X taller than the thickness of the controller, which was packed like this:








Just the plastic bag, no padding, so all the parts were free to rattle around against one another.
I closely inspected all the parts. None of the sealing rings are damaged, and the machined surfaces are clean. The only damage is a bent pin on the large solenoid connector, which is easy to straighten.








One other item: No instruction sheet. no switch schematic. 
No big problem, since both are available here.. 
Was the packaging the


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: Re: (moogie)*

Hmm ? I don't track but So. Cal. driving is hazardous. Staying on the throttle cornering, the tail definitely kicks out. Similar to my old air cooled Porsche days. Perhaps I'll keep these less than adequate Pirelli P 6000 M+S. Adhesion is awful


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: Got mine today. from ecodetining = Neuspeed? (waggin)*

Perhaps ecodetuning is a Neuspeed subcontractor & repackaged. Mine came with controller body in one plastic bag & remainder in another. Instructions included, as Ben had posted some time ago. Tight fit in Haldex outer box.


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: Got mine today. from ecodetining = Neuspeed? (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Perhaps ecodetuning is a Neuspeed subcontractor & repackaged. Mine came with controller body in one plastic bag & remainder in another. Instructions included, as Ben had posted some time ago. Tight fit in Haldex outer box. 

Here's my old controller and the box.. Looks like an original, but very loose..








I finished the install, with the rear end simply jacked up, supported by stands under the rear suspension arm pivot points. 
I only lost 7 cc of oil, which I didn't replace because I couldn't loosen the fill plug with a long-arm allen wrench without risking breaking it.
I'll let the dealer check and top it off on the next service.
One item: There's no way you can fit a standard torque wrench and hex drive bit on the upper screw. I had to make a short version using a cheap 3/8-1/5" adapter, cut down, drilled, and a length of 4mm hex pressed into it. 
I'll have to buy a set of those cheap one-piece 3/8 drive hex bits.. 
First test drive, rush hour, I was only able to take one non-stop left turn with the throttle on. Rear end definitely steps out more than before, something I haven't felt since my last RWD car in 1984. 
After the rush-hour traffic dies off, I'll have to take another drive with VAG-Com recording the clutch pressure. (I run an audio recording program on the laptop at the same time, and narrate what I'm doing. 
Later, at home, I play both recordings back simultaneously, and the audio portion tells me what actions produced the results on the graph.


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: Got mine today. from ecodetining = Neuspeed? (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_I ordered the $999 sale item from ecodetuning.com, and it arrived today, in a Neuspeed box, with Neuspeed's return address??)

Got mine today as well, with the same questionable packaging you reported. No apparent damage.
Don't have it installed yet, but I did poke at the contacts with a meter. Between pins 1 & 2 (power and ground), resistance oscillated, finally stabilizing at about 68 KΩ as time progressed. Pin 3 appears to be open, but that could change with power applied to the unit, which I may do tomorrow on the bench if I have the time. Pin 4 shows a resistance of about 4 MΩ vs. both pins 1 and 2, but again this was with power off.
Jeremy at ecodetuning does not have the wiring diagram yet - he's waiting for Neuspeed to send it, then will forward it to whomever asks. He did warn that it requires tapping into the existing harness, but did not elaborate.
- Chuck


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: Re: (Hal_K)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Perhaps I'll keep these less than adequate Pirelli P 6000 M+S. Adhesion is awful

It may well be the tires causing the more pronounced movement at the rear end. With less traction up front, more torque may be pushed to the rear, causing slippage there as well. I'll be driving with the HPP on the P6s for a while, then getting real tires for next summer. Should be an interesting contrast.
- Chuck


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: Hal_K*


_Quote, originally posted by *Hal_K* »_Hmm ? I don't track but So. Cal. driving is hazardous. Staying on the throttle cornering, the tail definitely kicks out. Similar to my old air cooled Porsche days. Perhaps I'll keep these less than adequate Pirelli P 6000 M+S. Adhesion is awful

M+S tires are much more likely to power oversteer than proper summer tires. I have the Michelin PS2's, which are without doubt one of the best non-R tires for track use. The grip from these tires is simply amazing, but then again, it might be more fun to run with something "lesser"








So, who's going to be the first to give this switch a try? Just waiting for the first guineapig







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: Got mine today. from ecodetining = Neuspeed? (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_
...
(I run an audio recording program on the laptop at the same time, and narrate what I'm doing. 
Later, at home, I play both recordings back simultaneously, and the audio portion tells me what actions produced the results on the graph. 




Cool idea. Did you ever record a "panic" situation? Like "oh snap" and the ensuing sounds of a crash









Chuck: looking forward to seeing whatever info the bench provides http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## RyanA3 (May 11, 2005)

big ben is the man.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: Hal_K (moogie)*

>it might be more fun to run with something "lesser" <
Ah, so far, a portion of the joy for me is the tail kicking out ! these things are almost like running slicks. I might not be so excited when the So. Cal. rains start & the oil, grit, & grime become the surface coating. Like driving on "black ice"


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_Make also sure that it's non-shorting (with "u" type contacts), as one originally specified is. For delicate electronics it's important.
By the way... I started to think, why bother with "normal" setup? Wouldn't "sport" and "race" enought? I now have "sport" all the time. Evertyday drive is not worse or harder, also fuel economy didn't drop.

_Modified by montrala at 3:43 AM 9-7-2006_


I was thinking of a mini-toggle switch, which, by design, can't be shorting because the moving contacts "rock" on the common terminals. They can't connect all three terminals at the same time, like a sliding contact switch. 
Also, on my first test drive in the rain, I managed to break the rear end loose in a corner, which was never an issue with FWD. I suspect that retaining standard mode might be an advantage in slippery conditions.


----------



## jack422 (Sep 15, 2006)

hi chaps. I have been following this topic and I am putting in an order to AMD UK.
Question about the installation----> do I put the original throttle valve O-ring to the new throttle valve? And where is the Haldex oil level check plug?
TKS !!!


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re:*

I've been thinking about the results I had with the HPP at the track, and why I didn't seem to get oversteer like many of you have been reporting. Yes, tires are propably one reason, but recently I've mostly been thinking about the suspension alingment.
I haven't really paid that much attention to how the suspension alignment was done when my H&R springs were installed. Yeah, I know, I should have.. I did some digging, and managed to find the report from the shop which did the alignment. According to this, my suspension is currently setup as follows.
Front:
- Camber: -1'00 (not adjustable as we know)
- Toe: +0'03 (I'm guessing this is in degrees, but the paper doesn't really say..)
Rear:
- Camber: -1'40
- Toe: +0'14
Looking at the values of the rear axel, they don't really seem like ones to encourage oversteer behavior. I'm thinking of changing them so that the camber would match the front, and toe to either as close to zero as possible, or perhaps even slight toe-out (say somewhere between 5 and 10 degrees). Any thoughts? Is anyone running with toe-out at the rear? If so, what if any change has this made in the cars straight line stability?
Cheers!


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (jack422)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jack422* »_Question about the installation----> do I put the original throttle valve O-ring to the new throttle valve? And where is the Haldex oil level check plug?

Although its not that long ago that I did the installation, I have to say I'm not 100% sure, but I think the throttle valve came with a new O-ring, which was already attached to the valve. Someone please correct me if I remember incorrectly.
I'm not quite sure how you would check the Haldex oil level. The only plugs are the drain plug and the fill plug, but you can't really see the level from those. Well, atleast I couldn't. If in doubt, just change the oil entirely and the filter too while you are at it. That's what I did







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_or perhaps even slight toe-out (say somewhere between 5 and 10 degrees)

Minutes, not degrees. 5 degrees would be undrivable. The original TT suspension (before the revision due to the fatal Autobahn crash) had slight toe-out in the front, and that helped the turn-in immensely.
Ben may have the most experience among us in tweaking A3q alignment settings, but I think he's off in the north woods of Minnesota right now. As I recall, rear toe-out in the snow can make life "interesting"







.
- Chuck


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_I'm not quite sure how you would check the Haldex oil level.

Warning from the repair manual if you're going to do it yourself:
*If oil gets on the crossmember or enters the perforations in the crossmember, it must be carefully removed.*
Must be something strange in the clutch oil to provoke that statement. The directions insist on laying a protective cloth over the crossmember before opening up the oil plugs.
Again from the manual:
*Oil level is correct if Haldex clutch is filled to lower edge of oil filler hole or up to 3 mm below oil filler hole.*
The filler hole is the one on the same side of the unit as the controller. There is a special VAG tool normally used to add Haldex oil; it's essentially a hose attached to the oil container and screwed into the filler hole, with an opening to prevent over filling.
- Chuck


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (jack422)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jack422* »_do I put the original throttle valve O-ring to the new throttle valve?

No, the new valve has the O-ring already mounted on it. The old O-ring will likely stick in the coupling and have to be removed after the old valve is taken out.
- Chuck


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## TD22057 (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: (n828cl)*

I'm primarily interested in speed on curvy mountain roads. So if you could do either the Haldex upgrade or a suspension upgrade, which would it be?


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (TD22057) HPP v. Suspension*

I'm not aware of what, if any suspension upgrades are available for North America 3.2L Q DSG BUT now having driven Angeles Crest, Ortega Highway & Old Mullholland the HPP Gen II Controller is an incredible addition. !! GREAT fun !!


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## jack422 (Sep 15, 2006)

thank you everyone, you chaps are wonderful!!!


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## yam (Jul 18, 2005)

I know KW offers coilovers for the 3.2Q.


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: Re: (n828cl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *n828cl* »_Minutes, not degrees. 5 degrees would be undrivable. The original TT suspension (before the revision due to the fatal Autobahn crash) had slight toe-out in the front, and that helped the turn-in immensely.
Ben may have the most experience among us in tweaking A3q alignment settings, but I think he's off in the north woods of Minnesota right now. As I recall, rear toe-out in the snow can make life "interesting"







.

Duh! I should think and type instead of just typing







I "ofcourse" meant between 0.05 and 0.1 degrees, which should be the same as 3-6 minutes if I remember correctly.
Tweaking the front toe might produce good results too, so it is definitely one option too. I however think that it may not have much of an effect with the current rear settings. Ben, any thoughts?


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: Re: (moogie)*

Moogie: I tried slight rear toe-out and 0 camber and it made aHUGE difference. However, it was just too scary for me (and I am quite a stupid/cazy driver). Turn-in was razor-sharp, but spins were never far away. Furthermore, with no rear camber and ET 45 8" wheels with 225/40/18 tires, rear rub was a BIG problem.
The front suspension has a bit of camber gain in compression. It goes from .5 neg at stock sport height to 1.3 neg with a 40mm drop. Once dropped, there is no camber gain left for turns (so someone _please_ design a raised ball joint for our front suspension).
The rear has even more camber gain, and it also has toe and caster gain. I like my rear camber set at 1.0 negative, with 0 toe. Front toe is also set at 0. This makes for fast steering response, good lift-throttle adjustability, and yet is pretty safe. I have yet to spin it in this configuration.
recap: 
front: 1.3 negative camber, 0 toe, stock 7 deg caster
rear: 1.0 neg camb, 0 toe


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (TD22057)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TD22057* »_I'm primarily interested in speed on curvy mountain roads. So if you could do either the Haldex upgrade or a suspension upgrade, which would it be? 

I'd say suspension first. My rationale is that all aspects of handling, including emergency braking, will be enhanced by a properly setup suspension. KW coilovers are great if you want to retain some comfort. If you like playing around on your car, the Variant 3s offer a lot of adjustability. Other coilovers, such as Bilsteins, are preffered by some, while others stick to stock springs but go with quality dampeners, such as Koni's FSDs. 
Adjustable dampeners allow to stiffen up either end individually, which also helps fight undesteer. A stiffer rear arb does the same thing.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: Re: (n828cl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *n828cl* »_
Minutes, not degrees. 5 degrees would be undrivable. The original TT suspension (before the revision due to the fatal Autobahn crash) had slight toe-out in the front, and that helped the turn-in immensely.
Ben may have the most experience among us in tweaking A3q alignment settings, but I think he's off in the north woods of Minnesota right now. As I recall, rear toe-out in the snow can make life "interesting"







.
- Chuck


The north woods of Wisconsin... Love it up there! Did a lot of fishing, chainsawing to keep the cabin nice, and a LOT of drinking







My brother and I were't as crazy as last year, so we didn't race his leased A4 "supersport" down the ATV trails









Chuck, did you install yours? How was the trackday? 
Got my Alcons... they're silly HUGE


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## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Chuck, did you install yours? How was the trackday?

Not in yet - no time and don't have the oil until I visit the dealer. Still trying to diagnose the TT cluster electrical short.
Not going to Road America (it's this coming Monday and Tuesday) - no track days until I get the brakes sorted. Canada Corner is exciting enough without a mushy pedal. Also want to get the speed limiter removed. 

_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Got my Alcons... they're silly HUGE









Now you just have to get them through airport security...








- Chuck



_Modified by n828cl at 10:06 PM 9-16-2006_


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_recap: 
front: 1.3 negative camber, 0 toe, stock 7 deg caster
rear: 1.0 neg camb, 0 toe

Thanks Ben! Sounds like zero toe is the way to go, atleast at first, and then see if I'd like to change it further. Although I don't like to categorize myself as a crazy driver, I do drive the car pretty hard on the track. Sometimes the drivers the limit, but more so recently it has been the car


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (n828cl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *n828cl* »_No, the new valve has the O-ring already mounted on it. The old O-ring will likely stick in the coupling and have to be removed after the old valve is taken out.
- Chuck

This will depend on when the car was built. My old valve had the attached O-ring. same as the new one. There was no ring left in the hole.


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_This will depend on when the car was built. My old valve had the attached O-ring. same as the new one. There was no ring left in the hole.

Probably you are right. My car is rather old (2004) and I had to remove old o-ring from coupling body.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*

Anyone geting close to solving the switching problem?
The firm that claimed I would have one by mid september is giving me the run-around


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

No progress here with the switch.
But I did have a chance to tweak with the suspension alignment. Rear is now at -1.0 degrees camber and zero toe, front camber obviously unchanged and 0.15 degress of toe-out per side.
Had a chance to go tracking again yesterday, and these settings definitely improved the handling http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif With cold tires, my rear was going all over the track







However, as soon as the tires warmed up, the handling changed back to neutral and/or understeer if pushed too far. 

_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_so someone _please_ design a raised ball joint for our front suspension

x2.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*

Awesome!








Looks like we went tracking on the same day, and only what? 2000km apart








With that set-up, I get lift-off oversteer: Approaching a turn, I lift off and turn in at the same time, which gets the rear out and the car sideways. I hold it like that to the apex, then set the car straight again with power. I'ts pretty similar to a fwd car, except that during power-on you can keep oversteering.
At the Nîmes-Lédenon track yesterday, there was another 3 door 3.2 A3, with DSG and OEM sports suspension/alignment. He couldn't get it to oversteer nearly as much. Sadly, he didn't want to trade cars for comparison's sake (his _was_ brand-new). 
I want to try the "race" program, badly!


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

I'm really anxious to give the race mode a try too. I'm just afraid that there won't be many trackday's left before the winter, so most likely won't have a chance to try it on the track this year







Luckily the snowy winter roads should provide a nice alternative testing ground








Sounds like you have a somewhat different style to taking the corners than I do. I typically brake quite heavily before turn-in, turn, and immediately get back on the gas pedal. If I'm not able to get back to WOT at the apex, something went wrong







This, atleast to me, feels like the quickest way 'round the corners, maximing the exit-speed. I'm not quite sure if I could get the car to turn enough at speeds required for lift-off oversteer - although I have had it happen a few times, but not on purpose


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*

Your approach is definitely the faster, more efficient way. The lift-off oversteering antics I described above are a result of my taking to the track as one would take to a jailbreak: freedom to do do whatever








It still remais unclear whether the "race" mode is akin to the GenI "Orange" HPP as sold by HPA. That one stays locked even under braking. Methinks it isn't, and that the "race" mode is just more of the same as the "sport" mode. 
Who could answer this for us?


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Right, well: just got off the phone with Ed Jackson from http://www.autops.co.uk 
He received a set of switches as shown on page 2 or 3 of this thread, but they weren't of the desired finish: too shiny of a plastic. The looms (that's English for harness ;-) are ready to go, so all that is missing is a nice switch. Hopefully, October will be "race mode month"!
I also asked him about the "locked under braking" condition of the Orange GenI HPP, and he did say that the "race" mode of the GenII does not provide lock under braking. So it really is just more of the "sport" mode.
I believe the Orange HPP has different hardware, as well as different software, to provide lock under braking.


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Good job Ben in getting an answer to this. Although the answer was expected, it's good to have it confirmed.
Reading the Haldex installation manual, the point that catches my eye regarding the Race mode is "and also react faster depending on how fast the driver pushes the throttle". 
The way I understand this is that the Race mode actually starts to transfer power to the rear as soon as the driver pushes the pedal, and not only when the front wheels can't handle the torque anymore. Now the question ofcourse is whether the same also applies to the Sport mode, or if this feature is unique only to the Race mode? If it is, then the Race mode should be quite interesting to try!


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*

It is my understanding that's the way it works in all three modes; Each successive mode only steepening the reaction curve.


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Right, well: just got off the phone with Ed Jackson from http://www.autops.co.uk 
He received a set of switches as shown on page 2 or 3 of this thread, but they weren't of the desired finish: too shiny of a plastic. The looms (that's English for harness ;-) are ready to go, so all that is missing is a 

Remember that I'm in for one set!! I have backup plan with one used switch I found, but I'll definitelly like OEM-like solution!
As to "Race mode" - Active Ceter Diff in Lancer Evo goes into 100% open mode under brakes. It's more important how unit behaves off-throttle.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Good point Andy. It would be interesting to do a vag-com log of Haldex pressure while going in a circle and cycling the throttle open/closed. That would tell us how it's behaving off-throttle, and whether there is a difference in "quality" between the modes, or just a difference in "quantity".
Cheers,


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Has anyone been talking with HPP directly? Maybe we should throw these questions at them?


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

I have tried emailing Haldex, to no avail. I even "subscribed" to their web page, but never got a response.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

I also had "subscribed" to their website. "Tech help" =no response. E-mailed the North American director, who would respond when returned from holiday. No response. Wrote again, still no response. No further info from Jared at HPA. Would appear that this is a very small market with little interest from suppliers/manufacturers.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

But the "market" is in perpetual expansion: sharing the same GenII Haldex, we now have: the MkV R32, MkV Golf TdI 4-Motions, Audi A3 in 3.2, 2.0T, TdI, the MkII TT, Seat Leon awd etc etc...


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## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_It is my understanding that's the way it works in all three modes; Each successive mode only steepening the reaction curve.

I thought about it. If it's true, maybe before swithes arrive easier way is to make permanent wiring for Race mode?


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Maybe... 
The company working on an A3-specific OEM-like switch http://www.autops.co.uk are sending me a pre-production switch. I should receive this no later than monday, and hopefully it will be installed by end of next week. 
Ed Jackson has gone the extra mile and sent me his own switch, as the release of the first production batch has been postponed by switch availability.
I will ask him for switching/wiring instructions, and if I can they'll be posted here.
Page 7 OWN3D suckaaaaas! 


_Modified by 3dr A3 3.2 at 1:09 AM 10-6-2006_


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## jack422 (Sep 15, 2006)

........ finally I have installed the GEN II Controller yesterday. Thank you for answering my questions and I am looking forward to reading more good information from you chaps.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (jack422)*

How do you like it?
I was supposed to receive my switch saturday and have it installed this week. But the transport company has LOST IT








The guys that made the harness and switch for me also sent a wiring diagram (luckily via internet so at least I got _that_. It seems different from the ones in the previous pages. I'll try to upload it.
I can't wait to try the race mode...


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Damn, that sucks Ben. Hope that they find the package somewhere.
If you haven't had time to scan the diagram yet, can you briefly try and summarize the differences in it? I'd atleast be interested http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*








the French courrier, who was supposed to deliver this to me a week ago - last saturday - still hasn't come forth with the goods. Furthermore, my Audi dealer kept my car for 3 days without doing any work on it (VF mounts and a bunch of 'warranty work'









Anyways, the diagram sent to me is the same one as on page 5. So, all the excellent questions raised by yourself, Waggin, Chuck and Montrala still remain.
Here it is again, so that we don't have to go back to page 5.









Of course, as soon as I get the switch and harness from Ed at Auto Performance Services, I'll chime in here.
In the meantime, anyone make sense out of this diagram?


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_In the meantime, anyone make sense out of this diagram?

Looks like a fairly simple logic switch. When pin 4 is high (12v), it's in sport mode, regardless of the state of pin 3; when pin 4 is low (ground), pin 3 selects either standard or race. I don't think there's enough information here to definitely determine whether 12v or ground on pin 3 selects race.
The suggested switch is a bit of overkill; as Waggin pointed out earlier, a double-pole on-on-on rocker or toggle is all that's needed. Could even use a standard A3 console button with a bit of electronics behind it to cycle through the three modes.
- Chuck


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Got my switch in the mail today!!!
Of course, it's saturday so the install won't happen this weekend (no-one works here saturdays & sundays). 
It's a pre-production item, with a shiny black plastic rotating switch mounted to an OEM button face... 
Wiring looks very simple, now it's only a matter of routing the wires.


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_It's a pre-production item, with a shiny black plastic rotating switch mounted to an OEM button face... 
Wiring looks very simple, now it's only a matter of routing the wires.

Can you post pictures of the front and back of the switch? And also any specific wiring instructions that came with it other than the HPP page?
Thanks.
- Chuck
P.S. Got our first snow on Wednesday, but it didn't stick. I presume you've forgotten what Minnesota winters are like


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Already!! And no I haven't forgotten: the painful months of January and Februrary, when the last warm days are long forgotten and spring still seems so very far away; the amazing cleanliness of the air when it's 50 degrees below, etc...
I'll post pics up asap. The switch is basically an (ugly) three position rotating affair mounted onto an oem switch facia (a blank from beside the 'esp off' button). 
There are no other wiring instructions beyond the above diagram, and as Ed says, it's really straightforward.
Pics will be up tomorrow morning, in the early hours of your AM.
Cheers!


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

As promised here are the pictures. Please keep in mind that this switch, made by APS in the UK, is not the definite version: indeed, the knob just does not match Audi's interior. It is very solid however, and has a nice positive action to it. Looks as though it were sourced from a mil-spec supplier.

Front view; The switch is to be mounted to the left-most blank (left of "ESP off" button):









Rear view; The harness is heavily insulated in a high-silica sleeve, and all connections are protected by industrial shrink-wrap:









10" behind the switch, the harness splits in two, with two wires going to 12v+ and Grd, and the other two going to the HPP:








Although I haven't tested yet, the switch should work just as shown in the above table. I hope to have this in next week, and will test with vag-com as soon as possible.
mods mods mods mods


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Thanks for the pics Ben. Seeing these pretty much finalized my decision, which is to go with a hidden switch. Just don't want something like this poking out of my dash








Btw, do you have a single or double din centre console configuration? As you might know, the buttons, although similar to the outside, are in fact different in these two setups. So a switch engineered with the button from a single din setup won't work with a double din console, and vice-versa ofcourse.


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

How long are those two separate wirings?


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Thanks for the pics Ben. Seeing these pretty much finalized my decision, which is to go with a hidden switch. Just don't want something like this poking out of my dash








Btw, do you have a single or double din centre console configuration? As you might know, the buttons, although similar to the outside, are in fact different in these two setups. So a switch engineered with the button from a single din setup won't work with a double din console, and vice-versa ofcourse.

Excellent point regrding the buttons. I haven't checked








I definitely want a visible switch, right next to ESP Off, but I would rather have a more stubby OEM button.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_How long are those two separate wirings?


Good question. I'll measure it for you tonight and let you know tomorrow


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Anyone have the partnumber for the repair wire needed for the connector at the Haldex unit? One wire should be enough for the job, given that they usually have the pins on both ends. 
I didn't take that close a look at the connector when I installed the unit, but I'm guessing that removing the existing pin 3 should be doable.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (moogie)*

Moogie, you were right about the different part #s for the switch blank: double-din and single-din are different. Of course I hadn't checked this and of course I got the wrong one.
Luckily, the switch's button can be easily removed so here's my plan: remove ugly shiny per-production button, replace with a mirror adjustment knob, place on appropriate switch blank. I might even be able to get the button to illuminate in red http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

If it were possible, *here's what I'd really like * a button just like the "ESP" except it would say "HPP", and would include two leds. 0 on for standard, 1 on for sport, and 2 on for race. Toggling would be done by repeat push.
I have no idea if this is possible









Back to your question: what do you mean by "repair wire"?


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_Back to your question: what do you mean by "repair wire"? 

Audi parts carries repair wires for each connector with the proper pins already installed on each end. Installing pins usually requires a specific crimping tool for each kind of pin. If we had the part number for the repair wire for the Haldex controller, it would be a simple job of cut in two, splice to the switch wires, rather than installing our own pins.
- Chuck


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (n828cl)*

Found this page, which documents quite a few of the connectors, pins and repair wrires: http://www.nsxjr.com/Audipins.html
It's quite likely that the correct repair wire is somewhere among these..


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_How long are those two separate wirings?


Montrala, the 12v wire is 170cm, the HPP wire is over 500cm. Both were made with extra length in mind, to be cut upon installation.


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Anyone have the partnumber for the repair wire needed for the connector at the Haldex unit? One wire should be enough for the job, given that they usually have the pins on both ends. 
I didn't take that close a look at the connector when I installed the unit, but I'm guessing that removing the existing pin 3 should be doable. 

Take the connector sheel part# to the dealer. The current ETKA catalog has a cross reference of shell part#s to repair wires.








Also, they list the rubber plugs/grommets by wire diameter, outside diameter, and color. I'd suggest pushing out onr of the blank plugs to get the size and color. (You'll need these to keep water out of the controller)
Suggestion: Buy a spare connector shell, and..
1. Make a wedge to release the catch. It's nearly impossible to press the release and remove it at the same time with the controller mounted. 
Also, it's very easy to break the catch by pushing it too hard. (The one in the photo is a replacement for the one I broke on my brake fluid resevoir)








And, buy the correct tool for releasing the connector contacts from the housing. I tried making my own, using pieces of music wire, but all they did was bind the pins tighter into the housing. If you can't get the tool, have a shop do it if they have the tools.
In my case, I had to break the connector shell apart and cut it away from the two pins with a dremel saw blade:








I don't even want to think about doing this on an 8-pin connector overhead, under the car.
At least the wires used in the Haldex connector are larger, and will withstand more pulling than the tiny ones I had to deal with here.
If I ever add a switch to mine, I think I'll buy male and female connector shells (if available), and repair wires,.
Then, on the bench, build an assembly that just plugs up between the controller and existing harness, making the proper connections to the switch in the process. This will greatly minimize the time spent under the car, and remove any risk of damaging the existing connector housing / wires.


_Modified by waggin at 4:29 PM 10-21-2006_


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (n828cl)*


_Quote, originally posted by *n828cl* »_
The suggested switch is a bit of overkill; as Waggin pointed out earlier, a double-pole on-on-on rocker or toggle is all that's needed. Could even use a standard A3 console button with a bit of electronics behind it to cycle through the three modes.
- Chuck

I also thought of this. Use an 8-pin microcontroller and LED's.. An advantage of this is that you could have it default to sport mode every time the car is powered up. 
The simple way, easy to hide anywhere:


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_If I ever add a switch to mine, I think I'll buy male and female connector shells (if available), and repair wires,.
Then, on the bench, build an assembly that just plugs up between the controller and existing harness, making the proper connections to the switch in the process. This will greatly minimize the time spent under the car, and remove any risk of damaging the existing connector housing / wires.

Now if we only knew if a female connector exists somewhere.. I suspect that finding one from Audi/ETKA might be difficult. We might have better luck finding one directly from the manufacturer of the connector shells. That is if we know/find out who the manufacturer is..


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Now if we only knew if a female connector exists somewhere.. I suspect that finding one from Audi/ETKA might be difficult. We might have better luck finding one directly from the manufacturer of the connector shells. That is if we know/find out who the manufacturer is..

One option: The female half has a part # (in the photo)..
If there is no corresponding male half, you could cannibalize your old controller for the one on it. Solder the repair wires to the pins, seal with silicone / epoxy, and plug the other ends into the new F conn..


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_One option: The female half has a part # (in the photo)..
If there is no corresponding male half, you could cannibalize your old controller for the one on it. Solder the repair wires to the pins, seal with silicone / epoxy, and plug the other ends into the new F conn.. 

I did mean to type *male*, but somehow that came out as female. Go figure








Obviously the female connector should be available, as it has a part #, and is not a fixed part of any other larger part. I did think about cannibalizing the old controller for the male part, but somehow that doesn't strike as something I'd like to do. I'd prefer to keep the oem controller stuff available in case I need to swap them back.
If we only had a contact at Haldex, we could quite easily ask them who is the manufacturer of the connectors..


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Still haven't gotten around to getting mine installed. The Audi elec tech I showed the switch to said it "shouldn't be a problem". I'll try to find out more about how he plans to go about connecting at the HPP.
As far as the switch itself, what would it take to have a push/push/push switch like the ESP OFF one? Is this even remotely possible?
One last question: could an entire rear-view mirror controller be used to switch the Haldex? Or is that controller only directing low voltages? 
TIA,


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_As far as the switch itself, what would it take to have a push/push/push switch like the ESP OFF one? Is this even remotely possible?

The electronics required for somethling like this should be quite trivial in the end. I'm not an electorics engineer myself (although I did study for a while to become one), so I don't have the exact details, but as waggin already wrote, a microcontroller together with some simple wiring should do the trick. Someone who actually understands this stuff should be able to draw a diagram with all the necessary parts in just a few minutes.
The more difficult part would be modifying an existing "clickable" switch to fit the custom micro-switch/controller, led, and possibly other needed parts. The TPMS switch is ofcourse available, but I have no idea how difficult would it be to remove the existing hardware from the backside, and mount our own.

_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_One last question: could an entire rear-view mirror controller be used to switch the Haldex? Or is that controller only directing low voltages? 

Voltage should not be an issue, although the current might. Both the mirror-switch and the haldex controller propably run with very low current anyway so that should not be a problem either.
However, the design of the mirror-switch may be different to what is needed for the haldex-switch. The haldex switch needs to be able to pull either or both of the two lines to up/down. If the mirror-switch is similar in design, then it should work, but it's impossible to say without actually having the switch at hand and measuring it.


----------



## n828cl (Feb 12, 2006)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_as waggin already wrote, a microcontroller together with some simple wiring should do the trick

Probably don't even need the microcontroller, just some 12v latching relays. That would avoid having to fiddle with a voltage regulator, PC board, etc.
It would be extremely simple to do a 3-button design, similar to the Homelink setup done here:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2887680
With 3 LEDs, of course. A one-button cycling version is a bit trickier, but shouldn't be too hard.
- Chuck



_Modified by n828cl at 7:10 AM 10-23-2006_


----------



## Jack_Smackus (Jan 18, 2006)

So have any of you guys hooked up your switches and tried Race mode yet???


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (Jack_Smackus)*

I sure haven't and I'm going







My Audi dealer is turning out to be utterly unreliable, and I'm looking for another tech to do it for me. 
Monday I will go to the parts counter and order all the repair wires I think we'll need. I'll be going with what Waggin was saying, and go from there. 
If Justdanorm hooks us up with an Austrian custom in-dash switch, that'll just be icing on the cake for a later date.
*On a side note:*
I asked Jared of HPA when a competition (aka "orange") GenII hpp would become available. He answered that the regular GenII hpp acts like a GenI competition/orange hpp when in Race mode, meaning awd is maintained even under braking








We'll have to get this switch in and test with vag-com... I thought it wasn't even a possibility? 


_Modified by 3dr A3 3.2 at 2:03 AM 11-4-2006_


----------



## KKR32 (Apr 15, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *3dr A3 3.2* »_ 
*On a side note:*
I asked Jared of HPA when a competition (aka "orange") GenII hpp would become available. He answered that the regular GenII hpp acts like a GenI competition/orange hpp when in Race mode, meaning awd is maintained even under braking








_Modified by 3dr A3 3.2 at 2:03 AM 11-4-2006_















That is very good news


----------



## downboysit (Nov 6, 2006)

*Re: (KKR32)*

hi,i thought the hpa site listed under its product description of the orange controller that there was one important difference b/n the blue and orange controllers- that only the orange kept both axles engaged under braking. could have misunderstood
http://www.hpamotorsports.com/....htmd
btw the orange controller will fit the mk5 r32 wont it? is it 3way adjustable(with switch) like the blue or is it only calibrated for track (or even sport) setting
i also notice occasional concern on the forum that the orange controller may be risky in wet/snow conditions but surely this would be closer to say an evo's handling under brakes(full time awd) which is excellent
cheers


----------



## .:R2theT (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: (downboysit)*


_Quote, originally posted by *downboysit* »_btw the orange controller will fit the mk5 r32 wont it? is it 3way adjustable(with switch) like the blue or is it only calibrated for track (or even sport) setting
i also notice occasional concern on the forum that the orange controller may be risky in wet/snow conditions but surely this would be closer to say an evo's handling under brakes(full time awd) which is excellent
cheers

Nope. You need the Gen2 HPP for the MKV R32 and A3. The Gen2 has switching capabilities. The orginal(both blue and orange) do not.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (.:R2theT)*

I *still* don't have mine installed! I won't go into lengthy details, but I may end up doing it myself. 
I started looking at the "repair wires" necessary, we'll see how it goes...

As far as GenII "race" = GenI comp/orange, it's still unclear whether they behave the same. We'll see...


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Update ? re: install- Any one else ?


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Not here: still haven't gotten around to doing it. 
Anyone else?


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Considering. I have switch, I know what I want to do. I know how to do it. I even can do it myself. I just need to find some free time to do it


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Cool! What's your switch like? Any pics?


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Slightly uglier than yours








But I found some nice ones in Conrad catalogue. I must visit their shop to see them.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (montrala)*


_Quote, originally posted by *montrala* »_Slightly uglier than yours








But I found some nice ones in Conrad catalogue. I must visit their shop to see them.


LOL !!!!








No ****, mine's pretty *nasty* and that's probably why I haven't installed it yet...
I did get an extra rear-view-mirror adjustment thing. That thing could be placed (for Euro consoles) in the hole right behind the cigarette lighter. The four "lights" could be labeled "0 S R" for the top and "HPP" at the bottom. 
Alas, it's a lot of "if's",and we're still waiting for Justdanorm's Austrian friend...


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Wiring diagram differences.. 6-pin conn is NOT the one on the controller*

As I posted earlier, the Bentley manual shows thw Haldex controller with an 6-pin connector, but my A3 (and the others pictured here) have an 8-pin connector. 
I dropped by the dealer today to see if they could find a female 8-pin connector that I could use to make a switch adapter cable, that could plug in between the controller had car's harness. 
I didn't find it, but there was one interesting item in the ETKA catalog. An adapter cable with a 6-pin male connector on one end, and 8-pin female on the other. 
Since the Bentley manual said the 6-pin conn was "near the fuel tank sender", I decided to check that area. I pulled the rear seat and the driver's side tank sender accesss hatch, and found this:








The converter cable is a standard item. 
After checking the pin numbers and wire colors from my previous photos, here is the mapping:
Pin#........6-pin-A........6-pin-B........8-pin...............Function
1............Blk/Grn.........Blk/Blu........(1) Blk/Blu.......+12V
2............Brn...............Brn.............(2) Brn............GND
3............Blk/Yel..........Blk/Red......(3) Blk/Red.....+12 via Brake light switch
4............Blank............Blank..........(4) Blank........5&6 also blank
5............Org/Brn.........Org/Brn.......(7) Org/Brn.....CAN-Low
6............Org/Blk.........Org/Blk.......(8) Org/Blk......CAN-High
Since there is no connection for pin 4, the mode switch connections for 3/4 must be on the controller's 8P connector itself. 
I still wonder if the switch diagram is correct though, since there are 3 empty holes in the 8P connector, yet the diagram says to use P3, the one from the brake light switch. This just doesn't seem right. 
Personally, I'd confirm this with Haldex before hooking it up.
And, if you're interested in the "official" connector release tools (or the whole kit), go here: (Expensive..)
http://buy.equipmentsolutions.com/eqs_va/net/catalog.aspx 
and search for: "VAS1978"
_Modified by waggin at 9:01 AM 12-5-2006_

_Modified by waggin at 9:03 AM 12-5-2006_


_Modified by waggin at 9:11 AM 12-5-2006_


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: Wiring diagram differences.. 6-pin conn is NOT the one on the controller (waggin)*

Nice detective work there waggin, although unfortunately this doesn't seem to help that much with the wiring since pin 4 is empty.. But atleast it solves the puzzle of the 6-pin connector








Haven't had really time myself to think too much about this recently, I've been sort of hoping that someone would sort this out and I could just follow a ready guide








If both the female and male connector for the Haldex controller would be available, I could give this a try, but I am not too anxious to start cutting into the factory wiring - especially with the location of the unit, I'd imagine working there would be a major pain in the *ss.


----------



## Jack_Smackus (Jan 18, 2006)

You guys still happy with your purchases. Anything new to report? Haldex upgrade still worth the coin?


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Woah, Waggin! I had missed your post! 
That's some nice work, but it still leaves a couple Qs unanswered. I'm seriously contemplating driving to UK to have mine installed. I could watch during the process and do a DIY... 
JS: yeah, I love the HPP every day. Wish I could have had it since day 1.


----------



## montrala (Oct 24, 2005)

*Re: (Jack_Smackus)*

Yes, I like it. However for DSG equipped car it seems to go in work with ESP off and box preferably in S or manual. With D and/or ESP on it works more like stock controller. I have yet to find out how it's with Race mode.


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (Jack_Smackus)*

Now with 10,000 miles on the HPP Controller + finally a nice heavy rain in So Cal. Yes worth every penny. Great agile machine. Very "tossible". Variable is that I have DSG, but only use manual shift. Corners flat, at speed, on throttle.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

+1: the HPP really makes the car feel more "together". Can't wait to try out "race" mode!!!!!


----------



## Jack_Smackus (Jan 18, 2006)

Do the people with the HPP plan on doing any extra or more frequent maintenance in regards the Quattro and Haldex components?
For example change the oil more often?


----------



## In an Audi (Dec 14, 2006)

Just read through this entire thread - curse you guys for making me want this















Haven't even had the car a week and have barely driven it yet here I am thinking about digging into my empty wallet. Really though, it sounds great, thanks for all the good info. Waiting to hear about switch developments...


----------



## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (Jack_Smackus)*

Yes, I do. The Audi "included" service for 2006 North America is change Haldex oil at 35,000 miles. Haldex corporation ( HPP division that is) says oil & filter at 20,000 miles. Seems more reasonable to me. But then I find it hard to believe engine oil actually holds up for 15,000 miles, that's a different issue.


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

No joke! I change mine every 15,000 kilometers (approx 9,000 miles) and sometimes in-between if there's a track day...
I'll be changing my Haldex oil every 20,000 kilometers or so...

Still no switch: have a harness ready, but waiting on a different switch...


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Has anyone had one progress on this?
Ben, since you have had contact with HPA already, would you mind dropping them an email and asking if they know if the connector shells (especially the male, which is part of the controller itself) for the 8-pin connector would be available somewhere?


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Hi Moogs, I asked already and haven't had an answer. My car is in for the 105,000km service right now, so I'll ask the parts manager about this.
I'm getting closer to having a go at it myself... Are you too?


----------



## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Has anyone had one progress on this?
Ben, since you have had contact with HPA already, would you mind dropping them an email and asking if they know if the connector shells (especially the male, which is part of the controller itself) for the 8-pin connector would be available somewhere?









Available at your local dealer. 
The 1J0-972-741 grommets/wire seals are a very tight fit. You'll probably need to buy/make the tubular pusher tool to get them into the connecotr shell holes.
One note: Recently, I noticed that the adaption values for my ABS-based tire pressure monitoring system are all stuck at the initial values of 50000. I suspect that changed data from the new Haldex controller may have caused this problem. I'll have to reinstall the old controller to test this theory, unless someone with the new Haldex controller and Vag-Com wants to try something...
Go here: http://oooo-a3.blogspot.com/2006/04/tire-pressure-monitoring-system-tpms.html
If you have a matching ABS controller P/N, enable TPMS (switch not required) and check the block 31 adaption values after a few days. 
If they remain at 50000, then the updated Haldex unit is somehow blocking the TPMS feature.
 (My ABS controller P/N is 1K0 614 517 AD)
_Modified by waggin at 7:57 AM 1-18-2007_

_Modified by waggin at 6:35 PM 1-20-2007_


_Modified by waggin at 7:59 PM 1-20-2007_


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (waggin)*

Waggin, excellent stuff!! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif I guess I'll pay a visit to my parts dealer very soon, and have them order these (I'd be suprised if they had everything in stock).
The winter so far here in southern Finland has been crap - little to no snow, so I haven't had many chances to play with the Haldex upgrade in snowy conditions. Well, luckily there's still some 2 months or so until spring, so with luck, this will still change.
Edit: I would give the TPMS a try, but unfortunately I think my ABS controller doesn't support the functionality. I have 1K0 907 379 E.
Also, regarding the 4B0 972 840 "Plug" - are these to block the unused pins?


_Modified by moogie at 2:16 PM 1/17/2007_


----------



## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Sweet find Waggin!
Now for the love of God, will someone do this?


----------



## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

I'm guessing Waggin is well on his way towards this goal








Now that the connector issue has been solved, I'm pretty sure that I'll follow soon. I just need to consult a friend of mine regarding the switch, so that I can decide on the type..


----------



## In an Audi (Dec 14, 2006)

So most of you guys are getting the blue and the is the controller that has switchable modes yes? The orange competition one does not have modes and it seems like people are not getting that for street use?
I know I'm not mechanically inclined enough to try installing the switch or know of any shops I trust enough to be the guinea pig for trying it out, and am generally trying to determine which controller might be the best for us. Can't wait to hear how the switches turn out 


_Modified by In an Audi at 8:56 AM 1-17-2007_


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## .:R2theT (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: (In an Audi)*


_Quote, originally posted by *In an Audi* »_So most of you guys are getting the blue and the is the controller that has switchable modes yes? The orange competition one does not have modes and it seems like people are not getting that for street use?
I know I'm not mechanically inclined enough to try installing the switch or know of any shops I trust enough to be the guinea pig for trying it out, and am generally trying to determine which controller might be the best for us. Can't wait to hear how the switches turn out 

_Modified by In an Audi at 8:56 AM 1-17-2007_

I think you are confused. The Gen1 had different units, blue and orange. Then Gen2 has one unit that allows switching between programs. We have Gen2 Haldex in our 3.2Qs.


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## In an Audi (Dec 14, 2006)

*Re: (.:R2theT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *.:R2theT* »_
I think you are confused. The Gen1 had different units, blue and orange. Then Gen2 has one unit that allows switching between programs. We have Gen2 Haldex in our 3.2Qs.

Yes, evidently I am confused, thanks for setting me straight


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (In an Audi)*

Another wiring option: Build a new 6-pin - 8-pin adapter harness, and add the switch wires to it.
This would make for a neater installation, and avoid introducing two extra interconnecs into the system. 
If there's enough space above the fuel tank to pass the connector through, I'll probably take this approach instead of using the male 8-pin. 
Or, just buy the whole 6-8 converter harness, which will come with the covering tube, and modify it by adding the switch wiring. This has the advantage of a factory-like installation, without a nest of yellow wires around the moving parts below the car, and it's easily reversable. 

(I'm still holding off on the mod though, since I have doubts aobut disconnecting the brake light wire. This makes me wonder if the original switch wiring diagram is correct. )
And, I have to try reinstalling the old controller to see if the TPMS feature starts working again. If it does, then I'll have to start talking to Haldex to find out what the problem is with the new ctlr. 

_Modified by waggin at 8:06 AM 1-18-2007_


_Modified by waggin at 8:57 AM 1-18-2007_


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## eltonsi (Mar 17, 2005)

Patiently waiting... We are cheering for you!


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (In an Audi)*

If you think you might be interested in the HPP controller , it can be purchased from several dealers in North America. Then check out Griffin Motorwerke on San Pablo in Berkeley for installation. I have not dealt with them but my son has & liked their work. The Gen 2 controller is plug & play, so easy install.


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_I'm still holding off on the mod though, since I have doubts aobut disconnecting the brake light wire. This makes me wonder if the original switch wiring diagram is correct.

It is indeed a bit suspicious, but I would somehow assume that they wouldn't have made a mistake of this caliper on the diagram...


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Right, the 'caliper' would stop them in their tracks!!
I'm just messin' with ya Moogie ;-) ;-)
Waggin, we are all waiting for you to show us the way (two Audi techs have shied away from this over here in France, and I don't want to have to drive to England to get this installed!)


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Pin 3 IS connected to the brake light switch (metered it.)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_It is indeed a bit suspicious, but I would somehow assume that they wouldn't have made a mistake of this caliper on the diagram...

I just checked it now, I disconnected the 6-pin conns, attached meter probes to pin 3 and GND. It goes to 12V when I press the brake pedel, so the Bentley diagram is correct.
Now, I'd just like a confirmation from Haldex that pin3 is the one to use, especially since pins 4,5,6 are currently unused. It would make far more sense for the switch wires to go to these.

Also, as far as replacing the 6-8 harness goes.. The connector end of the cable cannot be threaded through the space between the top of the tank and the body. There's a notch molded into the tank for the existing wire, so the left end of the tank will have to be dropped a few inches to pass a new cable, with connector through.


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: Pin 3 IS connected to the brake light switch (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_I just checked it now, I disconnected the 6-pin conns, attached meter probes to pin 3 and GND. It goes to 12V when I press the brake pedel, so the Bentley diagram is correct.
Now, I'd just like a confirmation from Haldex that pin3 is the one to use, especially since pins 4,5,6 are currently unused. It would make far more sense for the switch wires to go to these.

Excellent work again!







I just thought about this a bit more, and one possible explanation came to my mind.
Didn't Ben mention that the Race mode was supposed to enable the Haldex also during braking? Could it be that this is implemented simply so that when the switch is in Race mode, the brake signal simply won't go through? I'm not that good at reading the switch diagram, so I can't say what happens to the signal in pin 3 in the different modes, but maybe you can waggin?


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: Pin 3 IS connected to the brake light switch (moogie)*

Waggin, good stuff there! Moogie; maybe that's the case regarding the brake wire... We just won't know for sure before someone actually does this and vag-coms it.
I'm over on the british forum http://www.tyresmoke.net , where several MkVR32 owners have the GenII... no-one there has worked this out either!
Waggin will be an international HERO if he figures this out


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: Pin 3 IS connected to the brake light switch (moogie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *moogie* »_Excellent work again!







I just thought about this a bit more, and one possible explanation came to my mind.
Didn't Ben mention that the Race mode was supposed to enable the Haldex also during braking? Could it be that this is implemented simply so that when the switch is in Race mode, the brake signal simply won't go through? I'm not that good at reading the switch diagram, so I can't say what happens to the signal in pin 3 in the different modes, but maybe you can waggin?

My only thought is that the new controller may get braking data from the CAN bus.. But, I can't imagine that it's constantly polling the ABS controller for it. If it's already on the bus, then OK..
I have all the parts (except the on-on-on toggle switch), so I can do a test setup, manually connecting the wires to +12 and GND before each run. VAG-COM it and see if it ever decouples while braking. I suppose I'd have to brake with the fronts or rears on paint or sand to cause the differential rotation needed to build pressure. 
Or, perhaps it always remains active during braking unless ABS is triggered, but then, how would it know?
I've asked Haldex about this, via their website wmail form. (I dont' really expect an answer, but I had to try.)
BTW: I took it out for a short drive today with the 6-pin plug disconnected. The ABS controller lit the traction control light and posted an AWD communication fault. TPMS still didn;'t begin to adapt after about 5 miles. 
Also, it was very easy to break the front wheels loose when accelerating from a stop on dry pavement. I'll never go back to 2WD (either end)


_Modified by waggin at 12:55 PM 1-20-2007_


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: Pin 3 IS connected to the brake light switch (3dr A3 3.2)*

I was just reading the Haldex training PDF.. Here's the CAN bus communication diagram:








And, text on an earlier page: 
"If an ESP or ABS intervention occurs, the four-wheel drive control unit J492 will open the Haldex coupling."
So, if wire 3 is disconnected, it won't know if the brake pedal is being pressed, but it WILL know via the CAN bus to disengage for ABS or ESP activity.
Without the switch, pine switches between 0V and 12V (braking), but pin 4 is disconnected. (0V?) Per the switch diagram, pressing the brake would effectively change it from switch position 1 to 3.. 
(Has anyone figured what actions the 3 switch positions actually do, and which one is what??)
To do a temporary test hookup, I need to make a connector extraction tool. I've figured out that the tool blades (for the F connectors) need to be .015" thick, .045" wide, and .095" apart.
Side note: It also watches the handbrake.. I suppose this means that with the handbrake set, it disengages the coupling, allowing you to run the front wheels only on a dyno..



_Modified by waggin at 2:54 AM 1-21-2007_


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Waggin, you're getting closer & closer to sorting this out. When speaking to the only people I know who have switched the GenII ( Ed Jackson @ autops.co.uk ), he said it was very simple, that you only had to follow the diagram. He wishes i'd drive to the UK for him to install it for me, and to be honest, it's looking like a worthwhile trip!
What i'm getting at, Waggin, is that if you are going through with this, just stick to the diagram. Ed says it's correct.
Cheers bud, hope you get through this!


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

OK, I believe the diagram is correct, and my homebrew extractor tool works. Tested on the spare shell & wires) 
Now all I need is the switch. I'm going to use an on-on-on toggle switch for now. I'll probably just hide it in the ash tray for now. 
Does anyone know what switch position sets what mode yet?
(I want to try "normal" mode first and see if my TPMS starts working again,. If not, I'll have to reinstall the old controller to see if the new one is disabling it. If it is, then I need to start writing to Haldex for a fix.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (waggin)*

Kudos on the extractor!
From what I gathered from conversations with Ed, I'll bet the positions are straightforward: 1-standard 2-sport 3-race.
Looking forward to seeing this!
PS, have you vag-com'd your HPP yet? Have you looked at how it responded to brake inputs in "sport" mode? I'll be logging this as soon as I get my car back from the shop (60,000mile service).


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Looking good Waggin, I really hope that you'll be successful with this!
Ben, did you have a chance to ask Ed on his impressions about the Race mode? Obviously it would be very interesting to hear what the differences compared to the Sport feel like.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Well, I don't mean to be a tease, but what he said sounded JUST like what Orange HPP users are saying: noticeable increase in lift-off oversteer.
Also, and from the graphs supplied by Haldex with the GenII HPP, it seems given that "race" sends even more tq, even "more faster" to the rear. ;-)


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*New Haldex controller disables TPMS!*

Before I bought the new controller, I enabled the Tire Pressure Monitoring (TPMS) function in my ABS controller, and added the reset switch. It worked fine. 
After I installed the HPP Haldex controller, I discovered that it had not detected a low tire, and all the adaption values (ABS block 31) were at their initialized values of 50000. 
Today, I reinstalled the stock controller and took a 20 mile drive. The adaption values are beginning to set already. Conclusion: The HPP contoller disables the wheelspeed-based TPMS function in the A3. 
Now, to email Haldex and see if they know about this. It could be a problem if Audi uses the same TPMS system after Sep 2007, when it becomes mandatory in all cars. 
Tomorrow, if I have time, I'll put the new controller back in and do a temporary switch setup if I can find a place to run the wires inside the car.


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## moogie (Jan 26, 2006)

*Re: New Haldex controller disables TPMS! (waggin)*

Been pretty busy lately, so haven't had time to check on the progress here. But looks like not much..
Waggin, how's it going on your end? I'm still keeping my fingers crossed and hoping you'll sort this out


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

I feel *ashamed* for not having it done yet...
My only excuse is that I am having Audi do all kinds of warranty work on my car before it runs out end of this month. That and the fact that I crashed the loaner VW Fox... I can't "get on their ass-es" anymore lol
Waggin, we're rooting for ya!!!


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Is this project dead ? I've so enjoyed the handling with the Gen II HPP in the sport mode, My curiosity is amping up re: track mode. However I don't understand schematics . Any progress on dash switch ? wiring ? IF it comes about I would need a package & have it installed. 
Hal


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## waggin (Dec 26, 2005)

*Re: (Hal_K)*

Right now, I have th eoriginal controller instlaled (To confirm that the HPP was responsible for my TPMS not working. For now, since I have a plugged hole in one tire, I'm leaving it in until I need new tires and can find a good aftermarket direct TPMS system, (Hella TC-400 is one candidate)
Also. I'm currently wrestlling with a does-not-fit trailer hitch.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Hal, it's by no means a dropped subject, it's just that no-one makes a plug & play switch.
Those of us that are getting close are being held back by other stuff; In my case, I'm having a bunch of warranty work done before it expires at the end of this month...


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

Douglas & Ben. Thanks to both of you. We finally had some real rain in So Cal. HPP Gen II Controller is almost beyond description in mere words. Great Fun !! Very stable, if you love a bit of oversteer.


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Sweet!
I just reeeallly want to get this switch installed (just have to do a bunch of other stuff before).


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## dan-phx (Dec 13, 2005)

Get your free Haldex Performance badge here.








Haldex have made a limited amount of Haldex Performance vehicle badges so you can show that you are a proud owner of a Haldex equipped vehicle. The badge have a chrome/brushed chrome finish and measure 1"x2"


_Modified by dan-phx at 9:26 AM 3/1/2007_


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

Got mine already!
It's always fun to receive something for... FREE!


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## dan-phx (Dec 13, 2005)

*Re: (waggin)*


_Quote, originally posted by *waggin* »_Now all I need is the switch. I'm going to use an on-on-on toggle switch for now. I'll probably just hide it in the ash tray for now. 

Have you found a switch yet? Here's a nice on-on-on switch but it's a little pricey.
LT-003 at the bottom of the page.








The Toggle Switch Guard might be a bit much


















_Modified by dan-phx at 12:45 PM 3/1/2007_


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

*Re: (dan-phx)*

Guys, here is some VERY good news from HPA:
_ [...] 
The competition controller for the Haldex GenII is actually built into the switchable program on the GenII sport as you suspected. Race mode will give you all that the orange controller provided in the MKIV vehicles and the added benefits of the better communication in the new systems.
[...]
_

Here's a little more explantion:
The MkIV platform (MkIV R32) was the first to have a Haldex Performance Part. Painted blue, this unit provided more torque to the rear, and faster, than the standard unit. HPA then released another unit, the "Orange" or "Comp" HPP. The OHPP does everything the Blue one does, but it also _keeps the haldex locked under braking_. This makes for more turn-entry-oversteer, a huge plus for performance driving. Neither the Standard MkIV controller or Blue HPP, or standard MkV controller do this: brake in a turn and the Haldex uncouples, leaving you fwd. Going 'round in circles and going on/off on the throttle makes you go fwd/awd/fwd/awd etc... Not good!
Our GenII HPPs have three modes, standard, sport and race. Unswitched, they are by default in sport mode, which sends more torque faster than standard, but also unlocks the rear (reverts to fwd) in braking. As no-one has vag-commed a GenII in race mode (or even switched it for that matter), it was unclear if "race" was akin to OHPP or not. Well, it is now confirmed that it IS !!!!!
WOOOOHOOOO !!!! 
Now I'm even more







for not having it switched yet! 

HPA: http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Hal_K (Jun 6, 2006)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

I received an e-mail with regard to the "Haldex" badge. I submitted my request , but again got no response to my inquiry re: switch, harness, etc. Perhaps I'm a simpleton BUT I really do not understand why they manufacture something & do not offer the ability to fully utilize the product. 

Any word from any distributor anywhere on this planet ?
Hal


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## 3dr A3 3.2 (Dec 28, 2004)

[email protected] in the UK made a switch and sent it to me. I did not install it because a) I don't want to do it myself and haven't found someone willing to do it and b) the switch itself is an ugly protorype version (see higher up on this thread).
I'm really hoping for Justdanorm to do an in-dash switch...


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## JJT (Feb 4, 2007)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

something new ??
Thanks


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## ProjectA3 (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: (3dr A3 3.2)*

I got my haldex performance badge with my blue HPP upgrade for the R32.
i put it under the hood after i took off the noise blanket. don't expect the badge to stick nicely to much. the glue is very weak.


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