# VR6 turbo VRTpart throttle, low boost lean issue - obd1 c2 software



## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

Hi guys I decided to start a new thread since I fixed all my issues except one. Running the 36lb file. The setup is a genuine one from Kinetic

Basically when I'm trying to accelerate in part throttle right after entering boost, the ECU enters into lean mode, my AFR goes out of scale, stops accelerating and boosts falls back to 0. When this happens my vagcom log shows O2 at 1???, weird.
This happens between 30 and 50 degrees throttle angle. When I'm trying to run below - runs fine, boost oscillates close to 0, above 50 just pulls hard as in WOT.

I even PMed Jeff, but unfortunately received no response...

here is a video (4th gear):








and here is a short piece of VAGlog file:















what has been done so far:

checked for leaks - none, 
new plugs gapped at 0.7mm
new plug wires
runs the same with O2 connected or disconnected
tried new MAF - no change
checked blue temp sensor - OK
checked MAF as per bentley with DMM - OK
checked TPS with DMM - OK


car runs awsome at WOT.

what else should I be looking at? thinking about putting a new TPS and O2 - I'm pretty conviced it won't change a thing....


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## kushdubber (Jun 8, 2010)

No idea how to fix that issue but I was told Jeff is no longer with C2


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

Jess is no longer with C2, but that doesn't change anything, since he was the one designing the software for FI vr6.

a short update:




checked fuel pressure @ idle reads 50psi and around 58psi under load, or when revving the engine at idle. So I guess fuel delivery is fine



put in a stock ECU with stock software - same thing happening


any ideal where and what else to look for?


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

The car appears to be stuck in open loop in the graph, once it's warm, the o2 voltage should vary above and below 1 back and forth rapidly at idle and shouldn't be stuck at 1 at idle or part throttle.


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

hey,

It might look so by looking at the chunk of the log I have attached, however O2 works as designed (I believe). I have been reading all posts I could find on vortex in regards to lean/rich issue. Especially the ones where Jeff had something to say.
Seems like the version of software I' using disregards oxygen sensor depending on load and throttle position - hence a 1 under O2 column. I do get values for O2 in the lower rev range and low load percentage.

The later versions behaved somewhat different...


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

over the weekend I run some other tests. 

Bypassed a turbo to run as stock. Had to leave ISV disconnected (had no place to hook it up to since intake tube I used did not allow any connection)

anyway, aside from the vacuum leak from ISV and somewhat poor idle, the car ran fine, full anf part throttle, using stock and turbo file.

Could boost pressure be causing some sensors to go wild, or something?, can't really figure it out.

guys, HELP!


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## SVTDanny (Aug 8, 2005)

What are you running for a DV/BOV?


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

Since this is a genuine Kinetic kit (except for intercooler and piping) I am running a brand new VW DV valve - the stiffer one I think it's coded "N".


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

guys,

Any tips what this could be?.... unfortunately Jeff did not respond to my PM 
Is it possible that boost pressure is triggering software to behave this way? or maybe it is one of the sensors?


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

ok, done some more troubleshooting.....

The issue does not appear when I disconnect TPS(!). I thought that it's bad, although it measured fine, and I ordered a new one (the one from audi is just fine 037 907 385 H - measures the same as the Q and it's plug and play)
After I installed the new TPS I get the same thing again!, $hit, I'm really frustrated.
I've taken out the wiring diagrams and everything checks out. WTF? I'm running out of ideas here...


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

Hey man, aside from any inherent software shortfalls that you may have, I still think that there's something else wrong that's causing you to be in open loop when you want sensor control. If unplugging your o2 sensor makes no difference, that's a small clue, and looking at the above log and the tps angle vs. O2 sensor input , I'm usually seeing active o2 sensor input then on mine. This is with either of my c2 chips that utilize o2 sensor input for fueling.


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

well, disconnecting o2 makes a huge difference. The car runs super rich dumping extra fuel in the exhaust, which smells really bad and my mpg is scary, so - it does work. Unless there was supposed to be some other thing happening once you disconnect it that I am not aware of?
Actually I just installed a brand new Bosh sensor like 3 weeks ago....

not sure which version of software are you using? as I mention before older version of c2 software disregarded o2 at certain rpms and engine load.


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

You're in open loop at what appear to be lower load and throttle percentages in your chart, my car would not be in open loop then. Usually you arent going to see a "1" until the tps is above 70% on the vagcom, with a higher load % as well. As far as I know the obd1 coilpack c2 stuff that uses o2 control is pretty similar in how it switches between open and closed loop across the atwood versions. Im not saying youre wrong, but thats what stands out to me in the chart.


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

well, even if I were running in open loop, that would not cause issues I am having. ECU would just dump more fuel, that's about it.

What I am experiencing is somehow TPS/fuel related - I believe.
I need to log files when driving around with TPS connected vs disconnected and look at injector duty cycle. I believe this is where the problem is.
It looks as if turbo would spool up, blowing more air into the intake and while at certain TPS level ECU would decrease injector timing/fuel flow hence a lean issue.

what worries me is this....why do we have this forum if there are only a handful of people trying to help with pretty complex issues?.
If I wanted to solve it on my own I would n't be wasting time trying to share it with others, that could possibly encounter a similar issue in the future...


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

Here's another update, 

Not sure if i mentioned, but the car is a european Corrado 2.9L vr6. 
in order to run the C2's software I replaced stock ECU with EA American ECU. 
I also had to change 5pin MAF to the newer type 4pin MAF, (spliced into the wiring), check voltage- all OK in order to run the EA ECU as per http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?2397193 

I have narrowed the issue down to TPS!! I have replaced it with new one, same thing, part throttle lean, car loosing power (only seems to happen between 3k and 4k rpm). When I disconnect TPS car runs great in boost, no lean issue. This is happening for both, stock chip and C2 chip, WTF? 

has anybody experienced anything like that after conversion?


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

Sounds like MAF turbulence to me. The air will be denser near the edges of the MAF sensor with lower pressure near the sensor film. To lower the turbulence move the sensor further from the turbo and consider adding the honeycomb flow controller pre and post sensor. 

-Andrew


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

thanks for your input....interesting, I read about this topis in other threads, however, wouldn't the MAF turbulence appear also when the TPS is disconnected????? 

I am only experiencing that issue when TPS sensor is connected to the harness, when I remove the plug, the car runs fine in boost, 
also when I disconnect the MAF, the problem is still there (although the ECU is not measuring it) - so I guess it disqualifies turbulent air?? 

It is not happening at WOT at all... 

Honeycomb flow controller is already in place, pre and post MAF...


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

Just because it doesn't present itself when you've unplugged the TPS doesn't necessarily indicate a TPS issue. I would suggest moving the MAF further from the turbine and plugging / bypassing the BOV for testing only. Avoid hard throttle closing to prevent compressor stalling. If you haven't cleaned the MAF sensor lately then start there first. I had to clean mine every other tank of fuel for the car to run perfect on C2 software (recirculated crankcase vent).

-Andrew


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

makes sense....but just to be clear, I wanted to share the photo of my intake setup. Filter and MAF are separated, I am not running the MAF right off of the filter, can't remember if it matters or not. 

MAF location is exactly as per kinetics spec, (length for which the pipe is designed)


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## BarryV (Apr 23, 2001)

That actually looks like a pretty good install. If you went with Kinetics specs, you should not need to modify the mounting location of the MAF.


Like Andrew mentioned, try cleaning the MAF, or even swapping the MAF element with another unit. 


Jeff Atwood (who I assume you are trying to contact) is now the operator / owner of United Motorsport.

Look them up - He is very approachable about helping the enthusiasts that are his potential customers. :thumbup:

-Barry


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

BarryV said:


> Like Andrew mentioned, try cleaning the MAF, or even swapping the MAF element with another unit.


 I already did  no go, tried cleaning, got a new piece to install, same thing happening....:banghead: 



> Jeff Atwood (who I assume you are trying to contact) is now the operator / owner of United Motorsport.
> 
> Look them up - He is very approachable about helping the enthusiasts that are his potential customers. :thumbup:


 I also tried contacting Jeff through vortex and even facebook (UM is there) to no avail... so I'm a bit stuck and out of ideas....


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

I've never seen a 36lbs setup with a 4" MAF. Every one that I've seen is 3" housing. That could cause your problem...

-Andrew


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## [email protected] (Sep 2, 2011)

Ref. the pic 

get rid of the piping before the MAF houisng. 

Put filter on the end of the MAF. 

Just a suggestion. That elbow before the maf changes the maf readings. 
The software was created with 4" filter directly on MAF houisng. 

Usually the trick to these cars is copying the 'original' setup. 

-Jeffrey Atwood


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

3" on a 36lb file? are you sure people are running that????? 

copied from C2 website: 

Stage 1.5 EPROM 
Price per Unit (piece): $349.00 

If you are tired of spending your time trying to "dial" in your system, maybe it is time to plug in the power of C2 Software! Our EPROM, along with* 36# injectors and our 95mm billet MAF* housing, is all you will need to support 350whp in your OBD1 car. 

*Must use 95mm MAF housing*. 
Use stock FPR. 
Specifically for the EA/BM ECU of the '95 Golf/Jetta


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Ref. the pic
> 
> get rid of the piping before the MAF houisng.
> 
> ...


 Jeff!! thanks for the input, will do, I'm about to go standalone since I can't get this setup working correctly..... 
if changing the intake piping won't do the trick....is there anything else I could look into?


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## llanowar (Jun 26, 2008)

lugtronics is when you actually want to get if the c2 doesnt work for u


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Reihenmotors


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

OK, another update... 

I removed the elbow where air filter was located and placed it right after the MAF no change.... 
the issue happens right when the car enters boost (when you feel the car is pulling) and when you stay on the throttle at exact same position, after a second or two after turbo spools up (as if the boot peak is reached at that throttle angle) this is when it leans out. Happens at around 3k and over up to 5, 6k at part throttle, tested that today... 
when I try it from 3k or 4k, I get a lean signal from the gauge right after slight throttle movement, and this is when the car stops accelerating, jerks as if it wants to go and then studders, lean at gauge, steady rpms, no acceleration, car jerks.... 

any more ideas guys?, I'm really tiredwith this thing, have been trying to sort it out for a year now...:banghead::banghead:


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

Standalone seems to be the answer with these older setups. That's what I'm doing once I make sure my car is ready for it. I will say that placing the 90 elbow in front of the maf usually led to rich conditions during cold startup and idle would take a lot longer to get to 14.7 to 1...I tried all of that **** and the best setup seemed to be either moving the maf in front of the 90 bend, but then its still right after the air cleaner but further from the dv return, or just put a flow straightener after the air cleaner but before the maf and just run the kit supplied tubing.


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## vergessen wir es (May 12, 2010)

:thumbup: 4" MAF housing - 36# on OBD1 coilpack - filter on MAf. :thumbup: 

I suspect that most of these OBD1 deals don't fully survive the desolder-resolder.


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

Even on an early batch? I may be wrong but I thought the first versions were 3"...

-Andrew


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## vergessen wir es (May 12, 2010)

Op went to OBD1 coilpack (4-pin MAF) which is 1995 spec 258 EA ecu same as me...so yep 4".


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

How old is ur version vs. Op version. Revisions change ...

-Andrew


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## vergessen wir es (May 12, 2010)

definitely worth looking at 

OPs version below if anyone knows the cutoff from 3 to 4 

VAG-COM Version: Release 311.2-N 

Control Module Part Number: 021 906 258 C2 
Component and/or Version: C2 v30k 607 3 
Software Coding: 0261203223


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

All of the obd1 coilpack software uses the 4" housing and 36lb injectors, the early dizzy five wire maf chip used the stock housing and 30lb injectors iirc. Maybe the only exception where a stock housing was used with the obd1 coilpack tune could be an early one that used the split second piggyback box, although I'm not sure where that box came into play exactly to be honest.


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

If we match the MAF sensor to the software then let's also check the FPR.


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

Good point, across the board the c2 Obd1 chips should be run with a 4 bar, obd2 is 3 bar. Basically whatever the car had from the factory there is what I have learned,


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

One thing that I'm trying to clarify is what evap purge valve came with what cars, and I guess what software is tuned to which valves. There seem to be two that could have been included on obd1 vr6s, blue or black. They work opposite of each other, one being normally open with no voltage (blue), and the black is normally closed with no voltage. My car is from Cali, CR ecu, and has a black valve, which I cannot say came with it originally, but was there when I got the car. I just talked with a corrodo guy with obd1 vr6 coilpack setup and he switched to the BM or EA ecu, I forget what he said but he has one of the two main known ones that can be used, he has the blue valve, and has good drivability so maybe theres something to that. (I also have switched my ecu to the proper one as well, I can say that the CR ecu does not work properly with the c2 software.)


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## vergessen wir es (May 12, 2010)

Corsten said:


> checked fuel pressure @ idle reads 50psi and around 58psi under load, or when revving the engine at idle. So I guess fuel delivery is fine


 I am not near my car now so can't verify, but your fuel pressure seems low for 4 bar. Pretty sure I idle at 57 and go up from there. Could indicate a bad fpr for you.


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

vergessen wir es said:


> I am not near my car now so can't verify, but your fuel pressure seems low for 4 bar. Pretty sure I idle at 57 and go up from there. Could indicate a bad fpr for you.


 are you sure about that? I believe I was doing the test against the DIY I found on vortex, can't remember now.... will dbl check later on


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

guys, here's another update..... 

I did a few more runs from over 3k rpm (or 4k rpm), so , even a slight throttle movement at high rpms causes the problem - no matter whether in boost or still vacuum , again, no problem at WOT, 
I'm actually led to believe this is the software problem or incapability after switching to 4pin MAF and a matching ECU. - can't really digest it, since it is known to work on North American VR6 cars. 

I don't know how the european vr6'e differ from NA ones hardwarewise ,but as far as I know they are exactly the same apart from EGR and SAI (non existant on EU cars) - both have been coded out from the software in order to run. O think the problem i am encountering might be load related, since ECU get's that information based on the throttle position? 

Jeff, any pointers? 

btw, car is at original 4bar FPR


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## Mrimstad (May 11, 2011)

Hello!.

Dont know if you hve solved your problem yet, im sry i didnt read the entire page 1 or page 2
But i have some inputs for you. If you solved the problems thats fine.

On the basics of what you said haflway down page 1
I also had these issues. I didnt notice lambda values at the time, but the power loss and general area sounds the same.

I tried lots of lots of error searching and testing to no avail. 
Heres what did it!
The honeycomb, it realy is a vital piece on these maf sensors. My maf is way far from the turbo, no its not a kinetic kit, but it is praety close. I have a 3" to the 4" maf housing then down to 3" again all the way to the turbo, suboptimal i know but ewen so. I took out the 3" mesh from the original vr mafhousing and stuck it in the silicon coupler right beefore the maf housing. end what do you know, smooth on\off accel at all ranges. i was praety amazed to say the least.

Now, if you wanted to try this or have. Dont! buy the ones online, there might be many of these. but the ones i faund (and bought to try sadly) are honycombed in theyr diverting surfaces. This believe it or not actualy has an effect. I tried it and it had varies results. The square dividing of the stock mesh works like a charm, the other not so much.

So please try this if you did not yet fix this issue.
Good luck


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## Mrimstad (May 11, 2011)

Also!

This is kinda vital for you!

If your car is a: obd 1 coilpack engine, with c2 36lb software you are supposed to run 3bar 380cc injectors with 3bar fpr. No matter if the car came stock with 4bar fpr .
Dont even start an agrument over this guys, c2 america told me to run 4bar fpr on this setup and the producers of th software united motorport (c2) uk told me 3 bar fpr.
Common sence and maths tell you? Run 3 bar!
why? Well your stock fpr is 4 bar, pump delivers safely to 4 bar, so with 1bar boost it has to deliver 5 bar with a 4bar fpr, thus leaning out the fuel delivery and shortening the lifespann drasticly from the pump.
Also 4bar pressure will make your 380cc injectors somethin like 425cc ish. wich is not what your software is made for, thus your overfueling.


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## masterqaz (Oct 5, 2007)

Mrimstad said:


> Also!
> 
> This is kinda vital for you!
> 
> ...


Noooppe


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## Mrimstad (May 11, 2011)

Yes sir.
All injectors are rated at 3 bar 
So dont even start that one


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

I think that you are wrong about being ok with a 3 bar fpr because Jeff told me that I should run what was in the car from the factory that he used to construct the tune off of, which I believe he said was an obd-1 coilpack corrado.
I think that if you are pushing a bar of boost, you will be running an inline booster pump in addition to the stock pump anyway. I think that you may be getting away with a 3 bar fpr due to your having a 3" tube in front of your 4"maf housing. Maybe that is slightly increasing the velocity but reducing the volume of the air in that section of tube being pulled past the maf by the pistons and it still works out, I'm not sure though.


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## Mrimstad (May 11, 2011)

I dont know jeff, but it sertainly seems wierd to make software arround your fpr and not the injectors.
Ive worked with loots of tuners and newer herd of one who generaly makes software arround fuel preassure.

Im not on here to try and start a fight over whos wrong or right, im just saying you should try.
If you have a wideband, vagcom and know how your engine acts and not to floor it if it sounds funny ,then your all good.


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

You have to consider the regulator pressure as it changes your injector flow.

-Andrew


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## Mrimstad (May 11, 2011)

Yes ofc. But that doesnt change the fact that it will drasticly overfuel troughout the powerband.
c2's biggest software for obd1 cars is 36lb, sure you could grab a 42 before but not anymore.
Kinetics kit comes with 36lb injectors to match this. Now if you put a 4 bar fpr inn, your changing the static flow of the injectors aswell, making them not 36lb anymore but somewhere along th elines of 40 somwhere. Get my point?
Well anyways. you got wband, check it out. Learn from it yourself.
Try the wiremesh thing also. Gl


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## masterqaz (Oct 5, 2007)

It was written for 4bar, doesnt matter if the injectors are rated 36lb/hr 3bar. I know what you mean by static flow difference, Ive run a 4 bar reg on software written for 3 and have seen 4bar regs run on the 36lb hr.

Needless to say they run properly with the 4 bar when its the 36 tune. On a 42 tune written for 3 bar with a 4bar in theres some issues up top and down low.

Just cause it says 36 doesnt mean they didnt take into consideration that its a full bar above what the manufacture rates them at.


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

Hi guys,

I'm back from the dead.....the car is at the local tuner and......
well, he wrote his own software using Bosh motronic - guess what, same thing is happening :banghead: now I'm really pissed and starting to thing that it might be a hardware issue..... can't believe it though since I double checked everything....
well from what he says he believes that something is happening around the MAF area - he's not sure of that since he can't really diagnose it - it's obd1, so I'm thinking, either go standalone or go obd2.
However I can' really understand how would this have anything to do with the TPS?, when I disconnect it there is no driveability issues in boost - of course it idles crappy, dies at lights, runs rich over 3K and won't start up when it's cold, aside from thath it's great.
I'm a bit afraid to go ahead and slap on the standalone system spend $$$$ just to find out it's still the same. So I was thinking to go obd2 and diagnose it further from there.....

as for the honeycomb filter, well it's in front and rear of the MAF housing - so I guess that should be fine?


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

The hiccups and maf lag on any chip car will eventually drive you nuts. Go MAP/standalone and be done with it. Just my $.02 after owning all different kinds.


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## hoodita (Jul 25, 1999)

Ive had the same issue as you. And havent found a fix. I replaced every component 4 times. I got my C2 chip when Jeff was still with C2 as well. Ive tryed a 1/2 a dozen different maf setups and no change.

the only difference between your setup and mine is that my motor blew up cause of the bad tune. So im on my second rebuild.

Do yourself a favor and throw that chip in the trash and go standalone.


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

hoodita said:


> Ive had the same issue as you. And havent found a fix. I replaced every component 4 times. I got my C2 chip when Jeff was still with C2 as well. Ive tryed a 1/2 a dozen different maf setups and no change.
> 
> the only difference between your setup and mine is that my motor blew up cause of the bad tune. So im on my second rebuild.
> 
> Do yourself a favor and throw that chip in the trash and go standalone.


 have you also experienced that same issue with the stock tune? I do, when I swap them around.... so it's definitely not a software issue. 
I"m pretty desperate so I guess standalone it will be....


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## hoodita (Jul 25, 1999)

Corsten said:


> have you also experienced that same issue with the stock tune? I do, when I swap them around.... so it's definitely not a software issue.
> I"m pretty desperate so I guess standalone it will be....


 No I havent. before I went turbo I was running a GIAC chip and it ran flawless!!! I was very happy with the chip tune. But going turbo with the C2 chip tune was the biggest mistake I ever made with the car. Ive had problems from day one. Ive been running Kinetics turbo setup for 3-4yrs now. 

So with OBD1 turbo chip tunes. Your very limited. So really your only choices are either going standalone or doing a OBD2 swap. I would highly recommend "Lugtronic" for standalone. Im running DTA PRO P8 and I so wish I went lugtronic. I was on a budget at the time and couldnt afford lugtronic. 

If you have the money go lugtronic. If your on a budget do a OBD 2 swap. still would cost some loot. but way cheaper than standalone. It really boils down to what your goals are with your car.


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## youlostme21 (Aug 12, 2008)

Old thread but try doing a log with a MAF reading and see where that is at during the event if possible. 
Does it do the same thing with the MAF unplugged? The MAF and the TPS are used together to calculate load so if one or the other are not accurate it can affect the other. 
I wonder what would happen if you ran a BOV instead.... 

Just some thoughts if anything.


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## pubahs (Apr 2, 2002)

*FV-QR*

Obd1 vr6 turbo... go standalone. 

I swapped in lugtronic ECU and the car runs perfectly


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## loweritvr6 (Aug 16, 2011)

Ngp gave me 30lb injectors not realizing c2 doesn't make a 30 lb tune for obd1 coil pack so c2 gives me the 36 lb tune for no additional charge and tells me if I run 3 bar and stock maf, then Il be fine and when I wanna upgrade just put 36lb injectors in and 4" maf and turn up my fuel pressure(afpr). Is it fine to run 30 lb injectors on a 36lb tune. need some advice. Finishing up my build and c2 says one thing bit the next day turtle turn around and tell you another.


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## loweritvr6 (Aug 16, 2011)

Just to understand this correctly. Ngp gave me 30lb injectors not realizing c2 doesn't make a 30 lb tune for obd1 coil pack so c2 gives me the 36 lb tune for no additional charge and tells me if I run 3 bar and stock maf, then Il be fine and when I wanna upgrade just put 36lb injectors in and 4" maf and turn up my fuel pressure(afpr). Is it fine to run 30 lb injectors on a 36lb tune. need some advice. Finishing up my build and c2 says one thing bit the next day turtle turn around and tell you another.


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## vergessen wir es (May 12, 2010)

C2's Obd1 is 36# and 4 bar.


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

problem solved, C2 - out, stand alone system installed, runs fine.... tires brake loose starting with 3rd gear on at 12PSI. Next step is the dyno. Damn clutch is slipping too (stock)

I guess C2 didn't work specifically for my car.... will have the software and ECU for sale...


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## SVTDanny (Aug 8, 2005)

Corsten said:


> I guess C2 didn't work specifically for my car



It's not your car - _C2_ doesn't work. The best part, is that they didn't write the tune, they have no way to tweak the tune (Not that it can really be "fixed," the only option for OBD1 cars is to go OBD2 or stand alone), yet still sell it to anyone with money knowing full well that it runs like ****.

**** C2. Scumbags. :thumbdown::thumbdown:


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

Nothing like writing your own tune and feeling the reward in the power it puts down. It's a level of satisfaction chip swingers don't know.


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## C2Motorsports (Nov 25, 2003)

> C2's Obd1 is 36# and 4 bar


Depends on which OBD1 application you are referring to, we have both 30# and 36# options depending on ECU. All of our software, from 1993 to 2012 uses OEM as base fpr. General Rule: run the FPR that the car came equipped with from the factory. 



loweritvr6 said:


> Just to understand this correctly. Ngp gave me 30lb injectors not realizing c2 doesn't make a 30 lb tune for obd1 coil pack so c2 gives me the 36 lb tune for no additional charge and tells me if I run 3 bar and stock maf, then Il be fine and when I wanna upgrade just put 36lb injectors in and 4" maf and turn up my fuel pressure(afpr). Is it fine to run 30 lb injectors on a 36lb tune. need some advice. Finishing up my build and c2 says one thing bit the next day turtle turn around and tell you another.


We do make both a Distributor and a Coilpack OBD1 software, please feel free to refer to our website. We have been supplying software to the VR6 market for years.
We also have OBD1 coilpack software for EA/BM ECUs that utilize both the 36# injectors and 95mm MAF. 



SVTDanny said:


> It's not your car - _C2_ doesn't work. The best part, *is that they didn't write the tune, they have no way to tweak the tune (Not that it can really be "fixed," the only option for OBD1 cars is to go OBD2 or stand alone), * yet still sell it to anyone with money knowing full well that it runs like ****.
> 
> **** C2. Scumbags. :thumbdown::thumbdown:


This response to the post is 100% incorrect information. After doing this for many many years, we realize that it is very easy to post inaccuracies on the Internet, either intentionally or from themselves being misinformed. Unfortunately the relaying of this incorrect information does nothing for the enthusiast or the community. 

In response to stating that we cannot modify software: we would be more than happy for any customer to bring his car to our facility, and we can tune/tweak your OEM ECU based system on our in house Mustang Dyno. If you are looking for a custom tune over the Internet, that we will not do.


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## 'dubber (Jun 15, 2004)

Corsten said:


> problem solved, C2 - out, stand alone system installed, runs fine...



Funny how that goes, isn't it? I had the same results when moving to stand-alone.


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## mk3vrtjetta (Oct 10, 2013)

Bump... my car has this issue... #42 chip anybody guide me in the right direction?


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## Corsten (Sep 26, 2005)

do you really want to lose time over this? I've tried to fix my problem for over a year and a half - no success.
I wish you good luck with yours


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## DieGTi (Jun 19, 2001)

mk3vrtjetta said:


> anybody guide me in the right direction?


http://www.vems.us
http://www.diyautotune.com
http://www.lugtronic.com

eace:


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