# Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch



## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

I posted a description of my problem in this thread: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3513930 
Basically, about two weeks ago while up in the mountains I noticed that the tranny didn't seem to be shifting properly, especially when going up the large passes and the very cold weather. Then on our way home, the Check Engine Light came on, but went out on it's own the next day. 
Long story short, I've checked and cleared the codes three times now since then and the CEL keeps coming back on a day or so later. 
Here are the codes from the latest scan on Saturday:
Address 01: Engine
Control Module Part Number: 022 906 032 F
Component and/or Version: MOTRONIC ME7.1 G 0004
Software Coding: 00013
Work Shop Code: WSC 02743
1 Fault Found:
18032 - MIL Request Signal Active (Check TCM for errors too!) 
P1624 - 35-00 - -
Readiness: 0000 0000

Address 02: Auto Trans
Control Module Part Number: 01P 927 733 CE
Component and/or Version: AG4 Getriebe 01P 4841
Software Coding: 00000
Work Shop Code: WSC 00000
1 Fault Found:
01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch 
04-00 - Mechanical Malfunction

The Ross-Tech website says this about the 01192 code:
Possible Symptoms
* Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch slipping 
Possible Causes
* Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch faulty
* Valve Body faulty
* Internal Failure in Transmission 
Possible Solutions
* Check Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch Slip 

In searching the forums for this code, it doesn't sound like this is a very good sign. 
I was planning on doing the tranny service this week - either myself, or call around for prices - but don't know if it would be worth it if this is a sign of larger problems. Or, should I do the tranny service anyway and hope that it cures the problem? I have most records for this vehicle since new, but no record that the tranny service was done at 40k. It currently has 76k on it.
For the most part the van is running very well and the only time we really notice anything with the transmission is when it's cold. Although shifting from 1-2 seems to be a little "off", but it's hard to explain exactly what's "off" about it (maybe shifting a little too quickly from 1-2?).



_Modified by mdaniels at 11:54 AM 11-5-2007_


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## VW_Enthu1 (Oct 23, 2004)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*

I would walk into the service bay of a few of stealerships and ask the service manager what kind of history he/she has on this. Obviously, there is a problem...the question is: how bad is it? Maybe you can get lucky and find a shop that can repair these - althoug I have never heard of one. If it is a trans going bye-bye - and unless you have a good independant local shop - this is an ugly $5300 repair at the dealer unless you bought the car there new (they won't fix it - they only replace). You can then barter with the service manager to bring it down around the $4K+ range because you are a loyal customer, blah blah blah. *I hate these ****ing transmissions*.








Also, if you don't go to church....you might want to start....start moderate...a nice little Catholic church on the corner might give you a shot...nothing to *lose*....


_Modified by VW_Enthu1 at 7:40 PM 11-5-2007_


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (VW_Enthu1)*

I think I'm going to go ahead and do the tranny service (filter, fluid, etc.) and hope for the best (or, at a minimum delay the inevitable). My neighbor/mechanic could do the R&R if we got a rebuilt unit, but it's still would be quite a bit of $$$ to fix. Go Westy wants $4k for one of their rebuild units, and I'm figuring R&R would be another $1k on top of that.
We've only made 5 payments on this EV and honestly, we'd have to take out another loan to have the repair done - then we'd owe more than it's worth for quite a while. I'm not sure if we're prepared for that. 
If you happen to see a custom painted Vapor Blue '01 for sale at a dealership in Colorado, you may want to stay away. 
Hopefully will be doing the tranny service tomorrow, then we'll go from there.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*

Also do the trans pressure adjustment screw while you're in there. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_Also do the trans pressure adjustment screw while you're in there. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Do you have a link to that?
Edit: Never mind, I found it.


_Modified by mdaniels at 8:29 AM 11-6-2007_


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*

Just a FYI...looks like whatever you do, *never* unscrew that screw 'cause it'll break off the teeth that prevent it from loosening.
I haven't done this mod myself but I have yet to read anything from anyone that has done it and regretted it. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
While your code was a "mechanical issue", hopefully clean fluid, a clean filter, and increased pressure in the trans lines will somehow fix it. Who knows...maybe just the fluid running slightly cooler and at higher pressure will do it? Dunno.


_Modified by gti_matt at 10:37 AM 11-6-2007_


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*

Well, parts have been ordered from europarts-sd.com, including the dipstick. I wasn't able to get it scheduled into the shop until Friday, so I figured I would just order the parts myself and I'll probably do it myself this weekend, or if I'm feeling lazy, hand them over to my neighbor and let him take it to his shop and do it.
I'll keep my fingers crossed that this will at least help keep it alive for awhile.


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## VW_Enthu1 (Oct 23, 2004)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*

Keep us updated on this. I'm curious to see how this works out. Also, please note if there is any crud in the pan.


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## superkontiki (Nov 26, 2006)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*

Hi,
I came across this tranny fluid procedure today, from the Yahoogroups ev_update:
http://carboncow.net/eurovan/A...e.htm . This one is substantially detailed.
Also, I have heard that GoWesty's rebuilds are done by German Transaxle from Bend, OR. Google for their website;hope you don't need it.
Richard


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (VW_Enthu1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VW_Enthu1* »_Keep us updated on this. I'm curious to see how this works out. Also, please note if there is any crud in the pan.

I just got done doing the transmission filter/fluid/dipstick. I'm not to encouraged by what I found in the pan. A few photos to follow.
I did use the instructions from Garret. I downloaded the Word doc and edited to take out all the BS... However, I decided to drain the pan via removing the fill tube first, since one of my jack stands was in the way for the big rubbermaid container I use to drain into. I also left the engine running for the final fill - which I believe is the correct way to do it. 
Even though I did install the dipstick, I still did this fill via the drain tube. I wanted to make sure it was right the first time and to see where the level was on the dipstick for future reference. I'll use the dipstick from now on. 
I also adjusted the pressure screw slightly - not exactly sure how much though - I think I went all the way, but it sure didn't seem like I turned it that much. 
After getting it all back together, I was able to run over to a nearby VAG owner, he checked the codes (the same two) and reset everything. 
Now the bad news - while typing this my wife left to go to the store. She just called and said that the CEL came back on. That's probably less than 5 miles since it was reset. 
For the record, we bought it in May with just under 71,000 miles, it now has just under 78,000 mile. The previous owner had most of the maintenance records, but I don't see anything that the 40,000 mile transmission service was done. 
For the most part everything was great with this EV until we went to into the mountains three weeks ago. The CEL came on on our way home. Currently it still seems fine and other than the CEL, I wouldn't say it's any different. 
So I don't know what to do now. As much as my wife loves this vehicle, she doesn't sound interested at all in having to put a new transmission if it comes to that. If we drive it until it dies, then we'll be forced to deal with it. I have a feeling that we may trade it in for something else, which really kind of sucks. 
Here are the photos:
Jacked up and ready to start:








New fluid on left, Old on right. 








The inside of the pan. That doesn't look good. Not at all.








Closeup of the blob in the middle.








The magnet








The sludge off the magnet. The bits on the bottom are from the pan as well - good sized pieces of metal. I included a penny for size reference.








A better view of the pressure adjustment screw.








View of the dipstick tube installed.








_Modified by mdaniels at 3:34 PM 11-10-2007_


_Modified by mdaniels at 3:38 PM 11-10-2007_


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*

Does it drive any better at all? Same code or a different one?


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## p.bob (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (gti_matt)*

Does anyone have a picture of an 2003 Eurovan 01P trans pan? I just picked up a FRAM filter at SHUCKS but the pan gasket has only 4 bolt holes.







I haven't had the chance to pull the belly pan yet to get a close look.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (p.bob)*

4 looks right to me:
http://homepage.mac.com/msimin....html


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## p.bob (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (gti_matt)*

I count 5 on that pan. That's the pic that had me worried I picked up the wrong filter. But that's a 2001, mines a 2003 GLS.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (p.bob)*


_Quote, originally posted by *p.bob* »_I count 5 on that pan. That's the pic that had me worried I picked up the wrong filter. But that's a 2001, mines a 2003 GLS.

It doesn't matter. 01P is 01P, period, regardless of year. I checked 1997 and 2003 and it's the same part number for the gaskets.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (gti_matt)*

This may help?
http://www.shinseiauto.com/jap...4.pdf
Did they sell you one for a 01M? That one appears to have 4 holes.


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## p.bob (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (gti_matt)*

Yep







You can never trust those nimrods @ SHUCKS. The funny thing is that the gasket fits a 01M but the filter is completely different.
Thanks, I hate diving into a project like this only to find you've been given the wrong parts.


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_Does it drive any better at all? Same code or a different one?

Seems the same to me, but of course I only drove it about 5-miles after I did it. My wife did say it seemed to have the same "reverse" problem, which is always takes a second or two to engage, but that's kind of normal anyway...
I haven't rechecked the codes since resetting it yesterday, but I'm going to guess it's the same codes.


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## VW_Enthu1 (Oct 23, 2004)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*

Sorry to see the miscellaneous parts of the POS trans residing in the pan - I suspected you were going to find this. I was hoping you wouldn't, but figured you would.
Tough call that only you can make 'cause it is your wallet. My day is coming on mine. My first (also an '01) ate the trans at around 20K.


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (VW_Enthu1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VW_Enthu1* »_Sorry to see the miscellaneous parts of the POS trans residing in the pan - I suspected you were going to find this. I was hoping you wouldn't, but figured you would.
Tough call that only you can make 'cause it is your wallet. My day is coming on mine. My first (also an '01) ate the trans at around 20K.

So, to answer my original question. I guess this is probably the beginning of the end? 
I'll probably call German Trans Axle tomorrow and start to price this out. Then we'll have to make some decisions. 




_Modified by mdaniels at 8:47 PM 11-11-2007_


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## corpsedub (Aug 3, 2001)

that is quite a bit of metal in the pan. most definatly then end soon. any whining before geetting codes?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdaniels* »_Seems the same to me, but of course I only drove it about 5-miles after I did it. My wife did say it seemed to have the same "reverse" problem, which is always takes a second or two to engage, but that's kind of normal anyway...

Yep mine is lazy when going from D to R or R to D. I think it's typical.


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

Mine was lazy going to R or P as well. I adjusted the tranny pressure on Sat. and the 1st couple drives has yielded a very noticeable improvement. I'll need a few more to fully assess.


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

Interestingly, a week later the CEL has gone out on its own. I'll have to track down a VAG and see what it says...


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: (mdaniels)*

And now, almost another week later, we're having real problems with reverse on the fan. We'll shift into reverse and sometimes it won't engage, or barely engage....
It's been really cold the last few days and that may be part of it. But it still does it even after its been running awhile.


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: (mdaniels)*

Figure I might as well update this thread as well, even though I posted a update in this thread: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...24340 (Cut and pasted below).
The problem with our Van is we're slowly losing reverse and today for the first time today my wife had to get someone to push her out of a parking spot. Going forward is just fine!
*Cut and pasted for the above mentioned thread:*
You can add me to the list of those about to have a new transmission. We bought this van in May of last year and everything was fine up until we went up into the mountains last October. On the way home we got a CEL and ultimately it was revealed to be a Torque Converter mechanical malfunction code that made it come on. This was at around 78k miles.
The previous owner had real good records for the life of the vehicle, but I never saw one for the transmission being serviced, so it probably had the original fluid. I just killed it going in the mountains. Of course, I don't learn about the service intervals until after we started having problems. However, I would have waited until 80K anyway...
I changed the fluid/filter, increased the tranny pressure, and it did shift better. But we kept having problems with reverse. Sometimes it wouldn't not engage and when it did, it would sometimes "slip". Not a good feeling , but we never got stuck anywhere.
We were planning on trading it in, but I think we've waited too long. Today my wife called and said she wasn't able to back out of the Sonic Drive-in spot. She ultimatly had to have some employees push our back out.
However, this week I've had my mechanic start pricing out replacing the transmission, because even though we were thinking of trading it in, I was still contemplating fixing it.
I'm pretty sure I'll go with a rebuilt unit from German Transaxle. My mechanic has talked with Go Westy and has confirmed that they get their rebuilt units from German Transaxle, so I might as well go to the source.
The transmission w/ shipping should be around $3700-$3800. Labor is going to be another $900. I'm planning on doing the timing chain at the same time, since I don't think it costs too much more to do it now. Hopefully I'll be out under $5500.
I'll be honest, it makes my wife and I sick that we have to do this less than a year into owning it. I sometimes wonder if its the reason the other owner sold it, but again, we never had any trouble until we went on that one trip.
Even after we repair it, I'll be worried about taking it in the mountains from now on, which will suck.


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## unimogken (Jan 19, 2005)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (p.bob)*


_Quote, originally posted by *p.bob* »_Yep







You can never trust those nimrods @ SHUCKS. 

I totally agree!!
I have stopped going to my local Shucks unless they have a good sale on some kind of oil or car wash soap......hehe
I get all of my parts online now because i'm tired of parts monkeys giving me the wrong part and/or arguing with me if its right or not.


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## VW_Enthu1 (Oct 23, 2004)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (unimogken)*

Sorry to hear about the trans - welcome to EV transmission hell. This is one of about 20 reasons why I leave a homemade US VW dealer directory with us at all times in the van. Mountain trips are always a bit dicey.
I still say the guy or team at VW that designed that trans should be put in jail for a minimum of 5 years....


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (VW_Enthu1)*

I dropped off the van yesterday at a independent transmission repair shop that was recommended by a local VW repair shop. 
So far there is no firm diagnosis on what the problem is, the tranny is going to have to completely come out for them to diagnose. They said they had 18 codes off the transmission so far, but I didn't get into details. 
They seemed somewhat optimistic that it could be repaired under $2k, but they weren't going to be sure until it was out. Worst case if it needs to be replaced is about $4200. Or the price could be anywhere in between those numbers.
I guess on the positive side, the worst case scenario is still $1000 less than I was expecting/planning for. I still don't want to spend $4200 though...


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*

Well, finally heard from the transmission shop today. News isn't good, but it could be worse...
They are going to be able to repair my transmission, but it's still going to cost just over $4000. Ugh.








The major components being replaced are the valve body, a gear train set (or two) and the wiring ribbon. Plus all the various gaskets, fluid, filter, labor, etc. The warranty is the same as if they put in a new one (24/24). They did say it might be more reliable after the rebuild than the way it came from the factory, but obviously they can't guarantee that statement. 
Still, I guess it's cheaper than the $5000-$5500 I had set myself up for when we dropped it off. I was holding out hope it wasn't going to be a major repair though...
I did ask what they thought went wrong with the transmission to cause the failure. They suspect the valve body was the first to go, which then caused pressure and lubrication problems inside the transmission. This ultimately caused the gears to be damaged. 
I asked if it would have been cheaper to fix if we would have taken it in when we first started having problems, rather than waiting 5 months. He couldn't say for sure, but said it might have been cheaper.
So now we wait. The parts have to be ordered from out of state, so it'll probably be a few days before they arrive and then another day or two for the transmission to be rebuilt and reinstalled...
I'll update this post when its back on the road or if there is anything new to report.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*

This is the first trans repair on a forum that I have read where the owner has bothered to ask for details on the repair. I will be waiting for your next report with any further detail.


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (jets)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jets* »_This is the first trans repair on a forum that I have read where the owner has bothered to ask for details on the repair. I will be waiting for your next report with any further detail.

I'm going to try and get as much info as possible from them during the repair. If gears are stripped/damaged, I'll see if they'll let me take a photo or two of them before they get trashed (hopefully its not too late already).


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## conifer (Jan 26, 2002)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*

Since I'm also starting to have transmission issues, ie: hard shift from 1st to 2nd, high revving to shift to 3rd, weird shift points when down shifting off of the highway, I'll be needing repair soon. And I have changed the fluid 3 times in 78k miles!
I'm in Grand Junction, and the dealer in Glenwood Springs told me they found metal particles in the fluid when they did a diagnosis. They said that the tranny is going out and would of course the cost $7k-$8k!
When I called GoWesty, they told me I should first buy the tranny control unit a($600 to $1200) from VW because to them it didn't sound like a tranny failure! Now I'd like to believe that that would fix it, but If I'm going to spend that kind of money, I'd like to make sure it would go towards a fix rather than just guessing! $4k doesn't actually sound too bad based on GoWestys price ($3995) for just the rebuild alone. And I would have to do the labor!
I'm assuming since your name shows Parker, CO that the tranny shop you're using is in the Denver area? I'd like to take my van there and have a diagnosis done on mine that is independent of VW. And hopefully, since I'm just now starting to have problems, it won't cost as much?
Could you forward the contact name and info to me? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
Thanks,
Randal
2000 EVC


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (conifer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *conifer* »_Could you forward the contact name and info to me? http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Yes, the repair is being done in the Denver area by B&M Transmission (http://www.bandmtransmission.com/). They were recommended by Blazer Auto, which mainly works on older VW vans. I've never used Blazer, nor do I know anybody that has used them, but I found some online reviews that were all positive. Plus, they specialize in VW vans, so I figure that had to be worth something...
I'm pretty much taking a big leap of faith since I personally don't know anyone that has used either of these companies.
Anyway, I took mine to their location on Jordan just south of Arapahoe and the contact is Jeff Vik ( 303-693-1400). However, I understand that their european tranny tech is at their Denver location (Santa Fe & Evans Area) and my transmission was sent over there to be repaired. I had called that location first (that was the # Blazer gave me) and I believe the contacts name was James. You might save yourself a day or two by just taking it to that location.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (conifer)*


_Quote, originally posted by *conifer* »_Since I'm also starting to have transmission issues, ie: hard shift from 1st to 2nd, high revving to shift to 3rd, weird shift points when down shifting off of the highway, I'll be needing repair soon. And I have changed the fluid 3 times in 78k miles!

If i were you I'd do the reset procedure and see if that helps the shift points.


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## conifer (Jan 26, 2002)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (gti_matt)*

I've done both the EV_Group reset procedure and the "Official VW Factory reset using VagCom and neither worked!


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## conifer (Jan 26, 2002)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (mdaniels)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdaniels* »_
You might save yourself a day or two by just taking it to that location.

Thanks loads! I'll call today and see if I can pump some information out of them over the phone







, and then I'm sure I'll have to drive up to have them do an onsite.

Randal


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Conv ... (conifer)*

Nothing new to report yet. They had hoped to have it done last Friday, but a wrong part delayed that. The new, correct part was scheduled to arrive yesterday, or maybe today at the latest. Then they said it would be another day to get everything back together, tested, etc. 
One thing that caused me a little concerned is they said they were hopeful after the rebuilt transmission was in, that no new codes would show up and they wouldn't have to start doing electrical diagnostics. 
Now, I just assumed that they had done this already and what is currently being done is the final repair. I really hope they weren't implying that additional diagnostics may be required and the bill could still go up...








Hopefully I'm just getting worked up over nothing. Best case scenario is I should have the van back tomorrow, but hopefully by the end of the week no matter what. 
Tomorrow will be two weeks since we took it in.


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## TommyBoyee (Feb 1, 2005)

these auo trannies are the achiles heel of the Eurovan. I wonder how many more five speeds we could have had in North America had anyone known about this issue in the early nineties.
Sorry about your luck with the tranny.


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## Der Meister (Mar 19, 2002)

*Re: (TommyBoyee)*


_Quote, originally posted by *TommyBoyee* »_these auo trannies are the achiles heel of the Eurovan. I wonder how many more five speeds we could have had in North America had anyone known about this issue in the early nineties.
Sorry about your luck with the tranny.

Well, I just sold my '93 with a manual, but it's well known that in the early Eurovans the manual is much stronger (generally speaking).
I would have thought the Auto would be much better sorted by the later generation VR6's rolled into the US.


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*

Wow. 20 days later and the van is back in our garage. The repair was delayed by at least a week, if not longer, by them not being able to source one part (not sure which one). They ordered at least two, but both were wrong, in the end they had to order directly from VW. 
Here's a breakdown of the parts replaced:
M.O.K. L/ STEELS (have no idea what this is)
Drive gear w/ ring
Sunshell
Planet, reaction
Race, PL. Ring Gear
Planetary, Input
Ring Gear, Input
Torque Coverter
Kit, Bushings 
Housing, Output 
& 
11 liters (quarts?) of VW ATF.
Interestingly, I know they told me the valve body & wiring ribbon were going to be replaced, but I don't see them listed. I also don't see a pan gasket and filter, even though I know they were replaced. Maybe those parts are lumped in with something else listed above.
Total cost of parts was $2,630.43. Labor, tax, shop charges, brought the total to $4017.27. 
I did request to see any of the parts that has visible damage and the shop ended up giving me a box of most of the parts - including all the old seals, filter, pan gasket, etc. Some parts had core charges on them, they had already returned those and I never got to see them. 
Of the parts they did give me, only two had visible damage, neither looks all "that bad" - as my wife put it "THAT cost us four grand?"
The sunshell (I think) - you can see two small groves near the top of the gear. They actually look worse in person:









Not sure which gear this is (Housing, Output is my guess). You can see a small chunk out of the gear. I'd say there were half-a-dozen or so around the entire gear. 








Visually the damage doesn't look all that bad. But I didn't get the planetary gears, the torque converter or the valve body, so who knows what those were like. 
So, the big question: 
How does it drive? 
As of right now, I'm going to say the jury is still out. When starting out slowly from a stop, there is a hesitation/jerkyness that is definitely not normal. Best way to describe it is like someone learning to drive a manual for the first time - get a little bit of bucking then it goes. If you give it a little more gas, it doesn't happen. 
I'm going to give it a few days and see if it clears up on its own, but if not I'll take it back. As part of the warranty, I must bring it back in 15 days to be checked out (no cost), so I know that I'll be talking to them again.
Warranty is 24 mo/24,000 miles, so I feel good about that. Better than the dealer on a new one. It is a national warranty that will be honored by an ATRA member shop - although finding one that will work on at Eurovan may be difficult. Hopefully I'll never need it. 
I'll update this thread again in a few days to report on the jerkyness when starting off from a stop. I'll also update it if anything else is worth reporting.
We're glad to have the van back, but not glad to see our pockets $4k ligher. 

_Modified by mdaniels at 9:48 PM 4-15-2008_


_Modified by mdaniels at 9:55 AM 4-16-2008_


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## J_Westy (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*

This is awesome seeing real parts!
The chunks out of the sun and ring gear shouldn't be there... of course.
I wonder if the planet gears look worse?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdaniels* »_The sunshell (I think) - you can see two small groves near the top of the gear. They actually look worse in person:










There's also what looks like a BIG chunk missing from one of the teeth down near the bottom as well (5th tooth from the left in the pic), unless that's just a reflection...?


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

Thanks for the pics. Got any more to post?
I think the steels are the clutch plates.
11qts? How much does our tranny hold?


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_
There's also what looks like a BIG chunk missing from one of the teeth down near the bottom as well (5th tooth from the left in the pic), unless that's just a reflection...?

I thought that too when I saw the photo, but I think that is just a reflection - I looked closely at the gear and there doesn't appear to be any damage at the bottom.
Here is a photo of all the major parts I got back:








The sungear is in the center at the top, the other gear that had damage is on the left, but it was the inside gears which are on the bottom and you can't see in the photo. 
My wife drove the van quite a bit yesterday and said the jerkyness when starting is still there. Also, she said it didn't shift one time and revved like it was in neutral - until she took her foot off the gas then it shifted. 
I'll give it another day or two, but I have a feeling its going to be going back for another visit...


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

Safe to assume you've done a tranny reset since the repair? I think this is also called the TB adaptation.
Edit: I looked into it, and these are actually separate and different functions.
TBA has been discussed here, and proc.
The tranny reset, I saw a proc that is done with a VagCom.


_Modified by rensho at 11:11 PM 4-17-2008_


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (rensho)*

Tranny reset also is/can be done w/o a vagcom.
Turn on key - turn off - turn on again and depress accelerator to the floor (wot) and hold for at least ten seconds. Turn key and start engine. It's now reset to factory shift points.


_Modified by gti_matt at 4:31 PM 4-17-2008_


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

*sigh*
Van is going back to the shop today so they can look at it first thing Monday morning.
The jerking when starting has gotten better, but there are other problems. The transmission is either slipping in forward gears or not upshifting - resulting in high RPMs with no power going forward. It had happened once or twice since we had gotten it back, but yesterday it did it quite a bit and I was getting rather concerned for the last couple of miles back to our house.
To top it off, the Check Engine Light came on yesterday... 
I have the dip stick installed and I checked the fluid level yesterday (let it warm up for 10 minutes, then checked the level while the engine was running) - and unless I'm reading it wrong, it is way overfilled.
Hopefully that may be the problem - but I'm not going to speculate - I'm taking it back and I'll let them deal with it. 
Just hope it doesn't take three weeks...


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## onewiper (Aug 29, 2002)

Those grooves in that gear look factory as there is hardening still visible and they look machine cut as each groove is exactly the same as the others. I work with gears and planetary systems and whenever gears get damaged the damaged areas are nice and shiny and all the hardening is worn off and the ares are very irregular. It looks like this shop knows very little about VW transmissions and just replaced as many parts as possible hoping to fix the problem. Looking at the parts on the table the only thing that should have possibly been changed are the clutches and seals.


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## AzBarber (Jun 2, 2003)

*Re: (onewiper)*

Not to hijack this thread, but my transmission started acting up a couple days ago. I'm on my way to see about getting it rebuilt. It was doing the familiar rev up instead of engage third gear thing. Then it hits hard when it does finally engage.
There goes our vacation this year.
Az


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## VW_Enthu1 (Oct 23, 2004)

*Re: (AzBarber)*

Damn - hadn't you replaced that trans once already?


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## AzBarber (Jun 2, 2003)

*Re: (VW_Enthu1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VW_Enthu1* »_Damn - hadn't you replaced that trans once already?









Yep. 
Naturally, it quit doing it when I took it to the mechanic. 
I think I'm going to sell this thing. I noticed that the Mazda5 (similar to a Touran) comes with a manual 5 speed standard. I think I'm going to go look at one. It's not ideal, but it meets the major needs, gets good mileage, and is the only vehicle like it with a friggin' manual tranny.
Az


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## J_Westy (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: (AzBarber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *AzBarber* »_Not to hijack this thread, but my transmission started acting up a couple days ago. I'm on my way to see about getting it rebuilt. It was doing the familiar rev up instead of engage third gear thing. Then it hits hard when it does finally engage.
There goes our vacation this year.
Az

Again -- sorry to hijack, but I seem to have bought some time by turning up the line pressure adjustment screw. 
I also bought an extended warranty to cover the trans if (when) it gives up the farm.


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## J_Westy (Nov 27, 2001)

*Re: Is this the beginning of the end? Tranny code 01192 - Torque Converter Lock-Up Clutch (mdaniels)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mdaniels* »_
Here is a photo of all the major parts I got back:
...


I sent this thread to a buddy of mine who's a gear guru at one of the big-three. Here's his feedback:

_Quote, originally posted by *email* »_
Of course, the 2 lines on the major diameter are ID grooves (J_Westy: grooves to identify the part from similar looking parts during manufacturing). The sun gear is fairly worn but I don't know how many miles are on the trans. 
The picture of the internal gear shows that some debris went through the mesh and caused small chunks to break off. That debris could also explain the wear on the sun gear. 
They don't have the carrier with the pinions. Not sure if a pinion let go, a needle bearing/pin failed or a thrust washer between the pinion and carrier seized.


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

Just talked to the transmission shop and apparently the new valve body they put in isn't working properly. So they've removed it and are trying to figure out the problem. This is what tripped the codes and caused the CEL to come on.
Hopefully this fixes the problem(s). They said they're not 100% convinced the jerking problem was transmission related. Of course I told them it never had this issue before it went in for the repair and it seems like too much of a coincidence that it wouldn't be related.
Hopefully it's back on the road in a day or two...


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

Another quick update:
As of yesterday, the transmission is back out of the van and being torn apart again. I didn't get into specifics on what was wrong, they just said they found other problems after they removed the valve body and they needed to look at it again.
Guess they should have test drove it more when they first got it back together. We only drove it four full days before we decided to take it back for them to look at.
At least it's on their dime now, not mine. They offered up a rental car too if I need it, but I think we can get by without it (we did before for 3 weeks!).


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

Update 3 on the latest round of repairs. 
Van is still in the shop, almost 2 weeks after I dropped it off the 2nd time (which was only 4-5 days after picking it up from the first visit). 
I really didn't get into details with the shop, they just told me that it's burning up the 3rd & 4th gear clutches but they don't know why. 
Right now they're having a different tech look at it just to get a fresh set of eyes on it. No ETA on when they think it'll be done.
So, that's the latest... 
Glad that this shop offers a 2 year warranty on their work!!!!


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## mdaniels (Oct 10, 2001)

After another 3 weeks & 2 days, we have the van back again. I picked it up less than an hour ago and so far seems OK. 
Apparently the new valve body that went in wasn't working right and it burned out 3rd gear. So the whole thing had to come out and be rebuilt again along with a new valve body. 
They said they took it for an hour long test drive and all appeared to be OK. I drove it for about 30 minutes after picking it up and it seemed good.
God, I really hope this is the end of this story. I'll post again if anything comes up with it.


_Modified by mdaniels at 1:40 PM 5-13-2008_


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## CrispyVW (Feb 15, 2011)

*So do you still own the van...*

?

I have an '02 with 160k on the original trans and am starting down the road to trans problems. First sign is code #01192 torque convertor Lock Up Clutch 04-10mechanical malfunction intermittent.

It seems to drive well. Shifts aren't great but never were.

Mileage is in the toilet (12-13mpg) but we live in hills and all trips are quick drop offs for the kids. No other fault i can find to blame the poor MPG. 

CEL is not coming on (I was checking the codes for other reasons)


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