# 1.6td engines....what are the differences quantum vs jetta, etc?



## case m (May 21, 2009)

I have a '81 audi 4000 turbo diesel, with the 1.6 turbo diesel 4cyl, engine code CY. 

Apparently Quantums had this exact engine as well. 

My problem is, my 4000 tossed a rod through the side of the block. Finding a CY engine, or even just the block, from a 4000TD is impossible. Finding the same engine from a Quantum TD is less impossible, but still pretty difficult.

It seems I could find an engine/block from a Jetta td of the same vintage much easier since they made more of those. 

My question is, aside from the longitudinal vs transverse parts that would be different, are there any differences otherwise? Could I just use a short block from a Jetta/Rabbit turbo diesel from the same era, then mount all of my longitudinal style parts on it? If so, which could I choose from? If so, this project will get started/finished much quicker.

Thanks!


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## tinworm (Oct 2, 2011)

I have "heard" that the bolt pattern to the transmission is different, but i haven't personally seen this. I had an 83 quantum TD for about 3 months, and the engine did look exactly like the 1.6 in the jettas. 

You will have to compare by pulling the engine out and looking at it I guess. I have 3ct 1.6 diesels sitting in my shop outside the car, so I can post pictures and help you identify physical differences once you have it out, but aside from that, anyone who actually knows for sure seems to be few and far between!


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## DubbinChris (Dec 15, 2005)

IIRC there is no difference in the engines. The differences lie in the accessories and the manifolds.


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## turbinepowered (Mar 19, 2007)

DubbinChris said:


> IIRC there is no difference in the engines. The differences lie in the accessories and the manifolds.


This is correct. Your accessory brackets, engine mount brackets, manifolds, and the flywheel/clutch assembly are all different. 



tinworm said:


> I have "heard" that the bolt pattern to the transmission is different, but i haven't personally seen this. I had an 83 quantum TD for about 3 months, and the engine did look exactly like the 1.6 in the jettas.


Bolt pattern for all the older I4 VW engines, gas or diesel, is the same. 70s-80s for sure, on into the nineties, stopping right about the time the water pump started being driven from the timing belt rather than a separate accessory belt (V or ribbed).

I installed a 1.5D from a '79 Rabbit in place of a 1.5D in an '80 Dasher. 

If you have the Quantum/Dasher and are just looking to replace an engine, strip everything off the donor engine and install everything from your present engine.


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## Volkswagen32B (Jan 12, 2012)

It's also possible to put an 1.9 TD in a Quantum. The only differences are the oil filter mount, carterpan and you have to put an bearing in the crankshaft. I've done this an have a topic on Volksforum (translated to English) with the details.


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## VW Fox (Aug 1, 2000)

As far as I know, what what others have posted here is true: just swap all of the stuff that's bolted on to the block and the longitudinal-specific parts. If using a transversely-installed engine remember to change the oil pump pickup snorkel too and install the pilot bearing into the crankshaft. Intake manifold is the same.

The transmission bolt pattern is the same between longtitudinal and transverse engines too.

Be careful when choosing a donor engine, though. The CY engine has mechanical valve lifters and the head won't work on a block from an engine with hydraulic valve lifters. The diesels aren't like the old 8v engines, you can't just swap heads. With the solid vs. hydraulic diesel engines, the cylinder head has a different number of oil drains. Read on vwdiesel.net for options; some have mixed a solid lifter head with hydraulic block, but it involves plugging oil returns and fiddling with head gaskets.

I had a CY head built for my Dasher before I knew of these differences. If I were doing it over now, I'd definitely go with a hydraulic valve lifter engine: quieter, metal head gasket available (from the 1.9LTD AAZ engine) and there are far more of them out there.

If your injection pump needs a rebuild, consider a performance rebuild while you're at it too. I've got one on my Dasher and am really glad I had it built. Big difference.

How about some pictures of the 4000TD? :beer:


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## zollie (Jul 11, 2009)

VW Fox said:


> The CY engine has mechanical valve lifters and the head won't work on a block from an engine with hydraulic valve lifters.


Not always! In my Passat I have built in a CY engine from a 1987 Passat, it has hydraulic lifters!!


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## VW Fox (Aug 1, 2000)

zollie said:


> Not always! In my Passat I have built in a CY engine from a 1987 Passat, it has hydraulic lifters!!


Thanks for pointing that out. I could be wrong or it could be a North America vs. Europe difference.

Anyway, I found a picture comparing the two types of cylinder heads in this thread:









Zollie, did any longitudinal 1.9TD engines come with a "windage tray" in Europe? The is a picture of one for a transverse engine:








I've always had to buy one for a Golf/Jetta/Passat and cut it (where the oil pan gets thinner) to make it work with the longitudinal oil pans.


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## zollie (Jul 11, 2009)

Maybe the CY is different in Europe, only the lifters... You could get one in your passat(quantum) till '88.

This "windage tray"... Why cut it? I got a Golf3 1Y engine built in a Passat, works fine, no cutting.


If you are looking for an original longitudinal tray, search one from an Audi 80 1Y/AAZ/1Z, these are longitudinal 1.9 D/TD/TDI engines.

Partnumber 037 115 220 B, exact the same partnumber as the Golf 3 tray... no difference!!


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## VW Fox (Aug 1, 2000)

zollie said:


> This "windage tray"... Why cut it? I got a Golf3 1Y engine built in a Passat, works fine, no cutting.
> 
> If you are looking for an original longitudinal tray, search one from an Audi 80 1Y/AAZ/1Z, these are longitudinal 1.9 D/TD/TDI engines.
> 
> Partnumber 037 115 220 B, exact the same partnumber as the Golf 3 tray... no difference!!


 Hmm, interesting. This wasn't for my Dasher but for my VW Fox, but I think that the oil pan shape is the same. I had 2 reasons to cut it. 
1) the windage tray touched at the shallowest part of the oil pan (bottom-left of this picture, already cut out): 









2) I was trying to use a B2 GT(?) 1-piece oil pan in my Fox, and the windage tray needed to be cut for the oil pan's baffles: 









Sorry to sidetrack your original post, case m.


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## zollie (Jul 11, 2009)

048 103 601 is the part number for oil pans for quantum AND fox... 

There should be no difference. I got my engine from a Golf3 and put parts on it from a 1.6 DT engine out of a quantum/passat. Everything fits just fine! 

cutting for the 'gt' pan I understand, but for a regular fox/quantum pan it shouldn't be needed..


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