# APH, AWW, AWP, AWV wiring harness comparison



## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

I plan to go Maestro7 and as my ECU from an AVC engine (similar to APH) is not managed actually I will have to do an ECU swap. That's why I decided to open my Bentley manuals... 

All those engine codes are using the Wideband O2 sensor except AWD (Narrowband instead). 

Find below the ECU wiring comparison. 


































Find below some pictures of my car I'm working on for several years.


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## VWBugman00 (Mar 17, 2009)

Hey, I noticed how you did your intercooler piping, and I imagine it was easier without the battery in there. Check this out: 










One more question for you though, I noticed a few things about your engine bay that makes me wonder if you've got any problems (or since its a work in progress, whether its even running or not). 1st thing I noticed is that you don't have a coolant temp sensor in there. Also, where your diverter valve is, there is a hose that looks very crimped bending around your intercooler piping, whats that for? And as bent over and flattened as the diverter valve hose is, I'm wondering also if that would cause a problem for you. Boost will probably take care of that though. Good luck with your build. Oh, what turbo did you go with?


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

Hi, 

My turbo is a GT2871R 0,86A/R. 
The green top CTS is there. You don't see it on those pics. 
Yes I know my DV hose is crimped but it works fine. Anyway, I'm going to change it ASAP. 

Find below a vid made by a friend of mine on Sunday at 1,3b boost pressure. 
This is a very bumpy road. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MURfBLR9E4 

Will try to find some time to update the wiring harness sheet this week.


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

I have just updated the ECU wiring comparison above.


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## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2008)

You have to also give schematics for the fuse box connections (especially on aph to awp conversions)... particularly pin 65 on the ecu to fuse box connector which is the acc pinout for the fuel pump relay. If this isnt circuit'ed properly, the fuel pump relay will not stay on and you'll get short to ground codes all over the place. Otherwise, good job


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

Thanks Arnold.

I tried to connect a used AWW ECU to my AVC harness without any success. I have no communication with this ECU using VAG-COM. I removed IMMO and I have no communication as well and the engine doesn't start (maybe due to the fuel pump issue you mention?). I can access the instrument cluster and the CAN Gateway calculators and they are both saying that there is no communication with the ECU through an error code.


However I think the ECU is working (or at least a little bit) because the fan are working without any reason (as already mentioned in another thread from this forum) because of the pin 61. When I removed this connection pin61, the fan doesn't work anymore which is fine.
The main issue I have is that I don't have access to the diagnosis with VAG-COM when I plug the AWW ECU.
If someone can help I would appreciate because when I have a look at the wiring differences I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work.

I have also ordered a used AWP ECU and I should receive it this week. I will plug it by the end of the week to compare.


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

I have plugged the AWP ECU to my AVC harness this afternoon. I succeeded to connect with VAG-COM.  (I don't know if my AWW ECU is out of order but I was unable to connect with the AWW 06A906032DL)
This AWP ECU is supposed to be a stock ECU but I can't read any fault code due to the IMMO which is strange I think. However the engine doesn't start.

My AWP ECU is a 06A906032HF on the case of the ECU but when I connect with VAG-COM I can read 06A906032LQ.
Does it mean that this ECU has been reflashed with a newer SW version?

ECU coding is 07550. So it means that it has been used with an auto trans car. I would like to recode it with 07500 for manual transmission but it seams that a login code is necessary for this ECU. I don't have the login code. Can someone help?
In any case, I can unsolder the EEPROM 95040 memory to change the coding and change the IMMO codes.

I will let you know my results tomorrow.


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

Finally the engine is running with the AWP ECU after removing the immo in the EEPROM.

Just 2 fault codes:
-The N80 valve which is strange as I have a resistor which worked fine with my AVC ECU.
-Pin21 is not connected on my harness so I have an ECU Power supply relay J271 error which is fixed by connecting this Pin21 to the Pin3.

but no fault code for the VVT which is not present on my harness. Strange!!!

It means that I will be able to use Maestro7!!!!


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## FastAndFurious (Feb 2, 2002)

hey does your engine light come on when you turn the key to ignition? Was wondering what year your car is. Im running a AWP ecu in my 99 as well but no check engine light will light up at all


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

Hi, 

The engine light is on when I turn the key without starting the engine. As soon as the engine is working the engine light turns off. 

Here is the list of Fault codes I have: 
- No communication with Airbag controller (I removed this calculator) 
- No communication with ABS controller (I removed this calculator) 
- No communication with TCU (Transmission Control Unit as this AWP ECU was working with an Automatic gearbow and that I use a manual one without any calculator). Even if I changed the coding of the ECU to go to a manual gearbox this fault code is still there. 
- ECU Power supply relay J271 due to the fact that the pin21 is not actually connected with my harness as there is no J271 relay on my car. 
- N80 EVAP purge 

I will save a picture with VAG-COM to show you the exact fault codes details. 

My Beetle has an AVC european engine code (ECU 06A906032CK) from 2000. It is similar to the APH (ECU 06A906032C) which was sold in the US.


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

NeverGiveUp said:


> Hi,
> 
> The engine light is on when I turn the key without starting the engine. As soon as the engine is working the engine light turns off.
> 
> ...



Can someone give me an explanation regarding the 2 fault codes that I have described above in bold?
Regarding the 1st one, I changed the coding to go to Manual instead of Automatic and I don't know why the fault code is still there. :banghead:
Regarding the 2nd one, how can I know if it is going to be a problem to have this fault code?


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## sledge0001 (Oct 7, 2007)

I still get the TCM failure to communicate error even after using a manual ECU and instrument cluster in my Beetle auto to manual swap. I have given up on trying to get it go away as it doesn't cause a CEL...

As for the N80 in the AWV it was located on the top of the valve cover. (could this have been cut in your harness??)


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

sledge0001 said:


> As for the N80 in the AWV it was located on the top of the valve cover. (could this have been cut in your harness??)



I use a resistor replacing this N80 valve but you are right I will check the harness.
Hopefully it is going to disappear as soon as I'm going to use Maestro7 as it is possible to delete this diagnostic.


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## Zealot (Mar 9, 2003)

Do you mind posting a link to the actual Excel file?


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

Let me know how to proceed to do so and I will do it. I know how to post pictures but for files I have no idea.


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## Zealot (Mar 9, 2003)

Try rapidshare.com. You can upload a file, and they will give you a link to post here


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

http://rapidshare.com/files/450821758/ECUComparisonPinOutFinal.xls


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## bhurstbreed (Mar 27, 2011)

nevergiveup said:


> i plan to go maestro7 and as my ecu from an avc engine (similar to aph) is not managed actually i will have to do an ecu swap. That's why i decided to open my bentley manuals...
> 
> All those engine codes are using the wideband o2 sensor except awd (narrowband instead).
> 
> ...



love the color..jet black?


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

Don't know what jet black color is but it is an automotive mat black paint I bought on ebay.
I chose a mat color for several reasons and especially because it is really easier if you want to do it yourself when you are not a profesionnal.


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

So wait...

for an AWP, which pins drive the coil packs?


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## elRey (May 15, 2001)

groggory said:


> So wait...
> 
> for an AWP, which pins drive the coil packs?


102
95
103
94

respectively


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

elRey said:


> 102
> 95
> 103
> 94
> ...


Awesome, thx.

Really weird how they number the coils. I wonder why they laid out the ecu pins apparently haphazardly


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## elRey (May 15, 2001)

even though the numbers seem far apart, they l lie on two rows and line up nicely in a tight group of four pins. 2 x 2


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## INA (Nov 16, 2005)

Ive asked this in the help forum but didnt get a response.
Do any coders in here know how you can implement an excel file into the post message window?

Build is looking great!:thumbup:


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

INA said:


> Ive asked this in the help forum but didnt get a response.
> Do any coders in here know how you can implement an excel file into the post message window?
> 
> Build is looking great!:thumbup:


http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/e...eb-using-excel-and-frontpage-HA001055277.aspx

...but I think that is kind of clunky.

Instead, I'd import the excel file into google docs and then use the google doc publishing tools. They are more web-friendly IMHO.


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## fish10782 (Oct 20, 2011)

what ecu would I need to convert an awd engine to wideband?. the wiring diagrams are very similar, but would one you have to move all the wires around that are not the same???? or is it as easy as jwalker1.8's thread?


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## mazen... (Sep 30, 2008)

are you driving the car now or still didn't started yet?


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

mazen... said:


> are you driving the car now or still didn't started yet?


 If you are asking for my car the answer is yes. I use Maestro7 now and I disabled those 2 fault codes with Maestro so that they don't appear any more when I read fault codes. Anyway those 2 fault codes didn't affect the engine behaviour.


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## mazen... (Sep 30, 2008)

i am runnnig another ecu with KO4 software and i am facing a problem with detonation. 

did you install a VVT in your car?


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

mazen... said:


> i am runnnig another ecu with KO4 software and i am facing a problem with detonation.
> 
> did you install a VVT in your car?


 I have just installed the VVT tensioner but I didn't connect it yet to the ECU.


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## mazen... (Sep 30, 2008)

i am facing detonation in my car. 

please check my thread: 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5561818-1.8T-AVC-detonation 

please help if possible. 

thank you.


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

mazen... said:


> i am facing detonation in my car.
> 
> please check my thread:
> 
> ...


 Reply on the other thread.


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## robbyrr (May 9, 2009)

@NeverGiveUp:
I have a similar problem..i have an Audi tt AJQ,1999,and im also missing the J271..that pin number is empty on my ecu. 
And i really want to go wideband..your solution to put in in number 3...how did it worked out?you still have the fault codes right?..any other negative effects?

also,my ajq has nothing in pin nr 121..and several widebands ecus i checked had it linked to N292...did you had the same problem?


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

robbyrr said:


> @NeverGiveUp:
> I have a similar problem..i have an Audi tt AJQ,1999,and im also missing the J271..that pin number is empty on my ecu.
> And i really want to go wideband..your solution to put in in number 3...how did it worked out?you still have the fault codes right?..any other negative effects?
> 
> also,my ajq has nothing in pin nr 121..and several widebands ecus i checked had it linked to N292...did you had the same problem?


I'm using Maestro. It is possible to deactivate some fault codes so that they don't appear anymore. That's what I did with this one. I didn't notice any impact on the behaviour of the engine which could be due to this fault code.


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## mk4boost (Jul 31, 2010)

this could come in handing during my wire tuck opcorn:


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## robbyrr (May 9, 2009)

NeverGiveUp said:


> I'm using Maestro. It is possible to deactivate some fault codes so that they don't appear anymore. That's what I did with this one. I didn't notice any impact on the behaviour of the engine which could be due to this fault code.


so you just resistored the vvt,instal the wideband O2 wires,cut out pin 61,resistored the sai and bridge pin 21 to pin 3...??

Why pin 3?...

Im hoping to do this swap next week,just trying to make sure it ll really work


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

robbyrr said:


> so you just resistored the vvt,instal the wideband O2 wires,cut out pin 61,resistored the sai and bridge pin 21 to pin 3...??
> 
> Why pin 3?...
> 
> Im hoping to do this swap next week,just trying to make sure it ll really work


I didn't have to install the wideband harness (my AVC engine already used a wideband).
I didn't resistor the vvt but no fault code
I cut out pin 61
resistored SAI N112
resistored Diverter Valve N249
resistored EVAP Purge N80
resistored Boost regulator N75
didn't bridge pin21 to pin3


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## robbyrr (May 9, 2009)

NeverGiveUp said:


> Finally the engine is running with the AWP ECU after removing the immo in the EEPROM.
> 
> Just 2 fault codes:
> -The N80 valve which is strange as I have a resistor which worked fine with my AVC ECU.
> ...



How and why did you connect pin 21 to pin 3 then?..that's my problem....i dont have the J271..and you didnt either right?


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

robbyrr said:


> How and why did you connect pin 21 to pin 3 then?..that's my problem....i dont have the J271..and you didnt either right?


I didn't connect pin21 to pin3 finally because I use Maestro to delete this fault code.


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## andrew1984 (Jun 24, 2002)

does this chart mean awp and awv are identical wiring harnesses?


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## builtvw (Sep 20, 2009)

bump very usefull to me


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## Guyver96 (Jan 17, 2007)

Bump... also very usefull for me lol... Geting my used ecu soon ... wondering if i should just swap out the harness as well and not deal with the j271 or any other difference in engine connections... 


Sorry for the dumb ass question but what is Maestro?


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

Guyver96 said:


> Bump... also very usefull for me lol... Geting my used ecu soon ... wondering if i should just swap out the harness as well and not deal with the j271 or any other difference in engine connections...
> 
> 
> Sorry for the dumb ass question but what is Maestro?


Eurodyne is a company that does software for our car.

Eurodyne makes a Windows based software called Maestro that hooks into this car software so you can tweak the car to your heart's delight. Maestro is an upgrade over their standard software. Their normal software won't let you use Maestro.


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## Guyver96 (Jan 17, 2007)

Seen it. not spending 800 bucks for something im only going to use once.. thanks tho.. .


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

i remember this thread, and i thought it could be useful to me, because i am over tearing my beautifully wrappe dand hidden harness apart.

i want to resistor these at the ECU:

SAI N112
Diverter Valve N249
EVAP Purge N80

can you email your excel sheet of the pinouts? it would be much easier than constantly flipping through the fukn bentley trying to connect the dots so i can do it in an easily accessible area like the ECU. 

TIA:beer:


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## NeverGiveUp (Jan 6, 2004)

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-yIxeERnkuxZnk4U1JPMWN5ZE0/edit?usp=sharing


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

:thumbup::beer:


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

so i'm missing a couple pin outs via the stuff you posted

know the missing colors and pin outs?

N112 Secondary air pump:
yellow/brown - pin 9
gray/orange? - pin 66?

V144 leak detection pump:
brown/yellow - pin 25
violet/green - pin 80


N80 Evap:
violet/red - pin 64


n249 recirculating valve:
violet/black - pin 105


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

i have my N75 plugged in though i don't use it. but i need the two missing wire colors and pin numbers at the ecu


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

ok so going through my ecu connectors..my AWP stuff doesn't completely match the sheets..my harness is out of a 20th.

i've been looking for colors but i'm still missing the pin outs for:

n249 gray/green pin 84??

n80 blue/yellow pin ????


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## side.werk (Dec 1, 2015)

super useful thread! wish i found it 2 days ago :banghead: before i started untangling my engine harness. oh well this should help me get through the instrument harness a little quicker. thanks for the info :beer:


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## groggory (Apr 21, 2003)

side.werk said:


> super useful thread! wish i found it 2 days ago :banghead: before i started untangling my engine harness. oh well this should help me get through the instrument harness a little quicker. thanks for the info :beer:


It's listed in the FAQ.  Always check the FAQ first.


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

Let me add to the "super useful thread" statements. I've used the chart to test my coil connectors to the ecu on my AWD engine using pins 94/95/102/103 (coil signal). I've just found that pin 108 is ground but I can't find the power. Can someone please tell me which pin the on the chart is power for my coils?


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## swimrr (Jan 8, 2009)

I'd really appreciate some help deciphering where the coil power is located on this chart.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

Bringing this back from the dead.

For AWP I don't see the trans VSS sensor in the pinouts and it doesn't match my car against my bentley. Anyone have any info to share?


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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Is there a full wiring diagram available, not just a pin out? Im in the middle of a 6 speed swap and have both harnesses. Wondering if the ecu will work without swapping more than just the engine harness. Doing a tuck and relocation of some things as well. 
1.8t AWW 2001 jetta 5spd
1.8t AWP 2003 GTi 20th 6spd


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

Yeah in a Bentley. Or via Google that you can download etc

Maybe the faq

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Vegeta Gti said:


> Yeah in a Bentley. Or via Google that you can download etc
> 
> Maybe the faq
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


Have you figured out the pinouts you needed? I could compare what i have if you want.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

I find mine. In a Bentley and some stuff I found online

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Has anyone deleted the SAI pump relay? Relay 428. 

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Rather has anyone removed the entire sai pump wiring from the harness


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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Anyone?

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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

I trimmed mine out, with many other things. 

Then did "illegal" coding to remove them, versus resistors.

But now, a new harness is being made and I run an ignitron ecu 

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Would you recommend ignitron over maestro?

Is the "coding" done through vag com? 

Are you being affected by the flooding out there?


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

We're in Texas. **** the trash barge. 

Ignitron can't pass emissions. But nothing compares for end user UI and awesomeness. 

I did mine with WinOLS. 


I tune ignitron, maestro etc.









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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Emissions don't matter for me in South Carolina, no inspection. So that's covered. I may need to hire you when it comes time to sort out the software on this monster. 

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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

3 more of these being installed.









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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

The wire tuck and shave is coming along









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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Ditching the fuse box that's on top of the battery. Found this for I think the fan circuit. I don't think it's water proof. Thinking about mounting it to the back side of the rain tray and solving the connections once it's in and functions.









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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

How I do battery relocation. This is on the frame rail where battery was. 

Because wire tucking and shaving is how **** goes wrong. I prefer to do functional streamline and tiding.









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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

i have a few of those mini anl fuse holders. the two circuits that are 110 amp, could i use a 120 amp fuse or go down to 100. The 110 amp rating is hard to find.


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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

im planning on testing continuity on all circuits before i heatshrink and wrap them. Will be soldering most connections and using the heatshrink solder combo things on others.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

I have no issues finding those fuses.

Want a link to where I go?

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Would really appreciate it!

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Found the right schematic in my bentley. Of course there is a model split in 2001. Can I just remove pin D103 from the harness connection at the ecu? Also wondering what the h line is in the bottom of the diagram.























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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Can anyone tell me where the wiring is listed for the radiator control module? I can't find it listed in my bentley.









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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Vegeta Gti said:


> I have no issues finding those fuses.
> 
> Want a link to where I go?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


Where do you get those mini fuses?

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

Vegeta, is this what you are recommending or does it look more like the plastic mini anl fuses?


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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

So the fuses from the stock battery fuse block fit mini anl perfectly









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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

my apologies, this thread dropped off my page, i use mobile 99% of the time.


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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

all good man. I will have to pull the trigger on tuning sometime soon. I have a short parts list left and it will be up and going. Certainly taking ignitron into consideration.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

IF you get ignitron, lemme know. I have 16 customers who have switched over(all but one is bigturbo) and I personally have had it for over a year. I love tuning it and it is packed with features that withother ecu's you would need to wirein and calibrate sooo much it would take much longer to get the same outcome.


Also, I have an updated version fo the ECU comparisons that can be printed and don't have colors and so on.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

Updated size, no colors and a few other things


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## USMCFieldMP (Jun 26, 2008)

Vegeta Gti said:


> IF you get ignitron, lemme know. I have 16 customers who have switched over(all but one is bigturbo) and I personally have had it for over a year. I love tuning it and it is packed with features that withother ecu's you would need to wirein and calibrate sooo much it would take much longer to get the same outcome.
> 
> Also, I have an updated version fo the ECU comparisons that can be printed and don't have colors and so on.


I'm definitely interested. I'm going to have to sit down and really go through this thread later on. I'm right about at the point of putting my swap and full MK4 wiring into the car. Definitely want to thin out any unnecessary wiring and connections. It's going to be a track car so the aim is to only have the bare minimum.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

USMCFieldMP said:


> I'm definitely interested. I'm going to have to sit down and really go through this thread later on. I'm right about at the point of putting my swap and full MK4 wiring into the car. Definitely want to thin out any unnecessary wiring and connections. It's going to be a track car so the aim is to only have the bare minimum.


If you want to go that far you should have a harness made if you can afford it. It is a TON of work to retro for the entire harness, 95% or more is unnecessary into an older car. 

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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

I see you're in Texas, I am as well. I have a couple Dallas based cars in the shop for builds and tuning currently. 

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## rbd2 (Jan 23, 2017)

That ECU pinout is gold and getting printed out as i type.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

rbd2 said:


> That ECU pinout is gold and getting printed out as i type.


it needed a little updating and the colors suck to be printed in B&W, I did NOT create that sheet, only helped modernize it just a tiny bit.


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## USMCFieldMP (Jun 26, 2008)

Vegeta Gti said:


> If you want to go that far you should have a harness made if you can afford it. It is a TON of work to retro for the entire harness, 95% or more is unnecessary into an older car.


Definitely a lot of unnecessary stuff; head/tail lights, blinkers, fuel pump - that's basically all there is other than the engine. I'm going to wire in an electrohydraulic power steering pump out of a Volvo (FoMoCo pump) and I already have the battery relocated to the rear seat bench area.

I've considered having a pro harness made and I've also considered making my own. But I think for now, I'll likely stick with a modified OEM harness. Simple and cheap for now. My main goal right now is to get the swap completed and running with OEM harness and PCM... and then modify it from there to standalone and minimalist harness.



Vegeta Gti said:


> I see you're in Texas, I am as well. I have a couple Dallas based cars in the shop for builds and tuning currently.


Yep, I'm on the Fort Worth side.


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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

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## Vegeta Gti (Feb 13, 2003)

bumping this


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