# My Thoughts on the C2 Turbo Kit for the MK5 Rabbit and NGP



## JPatt (Oct 1, 2007)

After 3 ½ months or so of playing the in my newfound boost, I’ve finally gotten around to posting about it. 
A little bit of background, I’ve never been much into the performance mods, or any mods for that matter. Aside from a new head unit and components in my old MK4 Golf, I never did much to my cars. I bought my rabbit in September of 2007, after having enough of the old golf, and not being able to stop rubbing one out every time I saw the new Rabbits and GTIs on the street, I took the plunge. I test drove 
the GTI and the Rabbit and liked both. I was impressed with the 2.5 and the 2.0T, but I couldn’t pass up the phenomenal deal they gave me on the Rabbit. After driving it around and spending way too much time on the vortex, the bug bit and the rest is history. After coming from the 2.slow, the 2.5 planted that seed of performance and now I’ve spent entirely way too much money on my car.








So, I had the C2 Stage II Turbo kit installed at the end of March this year by NGP in Aberdeen. I was lucky enough to be the first customer and got in on the amazing deal they offered to the first few buyers of the kit. 
From the beginning, I was in contact only with NGP’s owner Dave Graff, aside from a few emails that I sent to Nate (who was always prompt with his replies). Dave is great and he knows his ****. He does need to come up with a new line for his employees to give out when you call and ask for him. Every time it’s: “Dave’s on the other line, can I take a message”. Haha, never before have I met someone who is on the phone so damn much….unmarried at least. In all seriousness though, either I would hold for all of like 10 seconds, or I would get a call back within the hour or so…can’t really beat that for customer service. 
I called to schedule the install at the end of February and was scheduled to bring it in the middle of the March, as the kits wouldn’t be shipping until then. One of my main concerns was not being away from my car for that long. Dave was very accommodating and initially estimated the car would be in the shop for a week or so. However, I think if I was just going to have the turbo installed, the timeframe would have been much shorter. But unfortunately for my wallet, the turbo was only the beginning of what was being done. Dave told me the car should be fine with no additional mods, but I wanted to do it right and make sure my car was capable of the additional 100 HP/TQ that the turbo kit would lay down. My initial dyno runs showed me at 157.4HP/168.8TQ. That number was with a VF Engineering intake and AWE exhaust, I think the stock numbers are like 146ish. 
With a potential 250WHP that the turbo would bring it to, I thought a new clutch, brakes, engine mounts, and most importantly, smoked sidemarkers would be a worthy upgrade to start off with. As you might imagine, Dave didn’t disagree. Dave was very helpful and I decided on the SPEC Stage II Clutch, Eurotech Slotted/Cross-Drilled Rotors, Pidgid Brake Pads, and VF Motor Mounts. After all those mods, a week didn’t sound that bad after all. Especially, when you take in that Dave arranged to have my flywheel overnighted to SPEC. There wasn’t anyone around Aberdeen that would resurface dual mass flywheels, so Dave talked to the guys at SPEC and arranged it. A week definitely was a push, but Dave pulled through, as did Jesse, the tech who worked on my car for that whole week. 
That week couldn’t possibly have gone by any slower. I stopped in throughout the week to check on the progress, and Dave and Jesse were real cool about keeping me updated and letting me take pictures. Jesse showed me some of the intricacies of the install and I was quite impressed with the kit’s fit and finish and Jesse’s ability to make it work for the ’08. I think the kit was tested on an ’06 or ’07, so there was a few differences that Jesse had to accommodate. When it was all said and done I think I picked up the car the Monday after it was dropped off. Originally, it was planned for Friday, but I made some last minute changes to the brakes. Seven days of anticipation, and **** was it worth it. 
Unfortunately, the wait wasn’t completely over as I had to wait to break in the clutch. SPEC Clutches have a really long break-in period and I found myself just driving around, trying my damnedest to stay out of boost and baby the clutch. I swear to god it was worse than playing “just the tip.” :Head Bang:

:Laughing:
But the wait was worth it, and I had an excuse to drive to Atlantic City seeking out traffic, and driving around Baltimore at 2 in the morning trying even harder not to play “just the tip”, with all the ladies of the night out strolling. The 750 miles on the clutch are long gone and I’ve put like 6,000ish miles on the kit since the install and every one of those miles is a blast. This car is fast as balls. I don’t have any official data yet, but I’ve broken up a few egos since I’ve had the kit. Don’t get me wrong, I love GTIs but there isn’t much better than pulling on a GTI in 3rd gear. Especially when there’s no indication of the kit from the outside, although that might not last as a 2.5T badge is calling my name. Aside from a few software issues that are going to be fixed at Waterfest by the C2 guys, the kit has been flawless. The software issues don’t affect drivability at all, I just think they need to address a couple of the differences between the ‘08s, so I can clear up that pesky CEL. 
I have nothing but good things to say about NGP and C2. I haven’t really interacted with the guys at C2, but their kit is amazing, it is so well built and it looks so stealth, and to be honest, I just want to molest it. Dave and the other guys at NGP, were nothing but a pleasure to deal with. Jesse and Chad who have worked on my car seem genuinely interested in quality, and actually give a damn, which is a character trait hard to come by elsewhere. If you’re anywhere near NGP, I would highly suggest using them. 
I’m actually writing this at NGP while waiting for my new Coilovers to be installed, and the final dyno run to be done, so I will post later with the new dyno.


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## C2Motorsports (Nov 25, 2003)

*Re: My Thoughts on the C2 Turbo Kit for the MK5 Rabbit and NGP (JPatt)*

This has been a fun project between NGP and C2; and appears to be a car that is being well _pampered_ with aftermarket goodies. I had the pleasure of being at NGP when Jesse was installing our Turbo Kit. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif to Jesse for his professional work.
I want to thank the owner for the GREAT review....we always love hearing from happy 2.5T customers.

C2


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

I'm guessing this post wasn't planned.
I don't what to say about c2, the more I want to work with them .....uuhh 
*YOU GUYS MAKE ME SICK*
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3881751


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## JPatt (Oct 1, 2007)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

Audi4u, I'm guessing your first sentence was sarcasm. As for "planned", I guess you could say the post was planned, insofar that I was planning to write about my experience in the same way I'm planning on fixing the hole in my wall. Being a full-time flight instructor and college student doesn't afford me much time to sit down and write a post like that, and frankly the last thing I want to do is write; I hate it. What better use of the four hours of wait time than to write this post I've been meaning to get around to. Not a waah post per se, but just thought i'd enlighten you. And like I said earlier, I haven't had any contact with C2 except for an email I sent a little while ago outlining the specifics of when I could meet them. If that's what you're trying to get at. 
I can only speak of my experience with NGP and C2 and I have been nothing but satisfied with both companies. I can only hope that anyone considering either company does their research and makes an informed decision. I have friends that absolutely love outback steakhouse, but every time I go there, I have a terrible experience. Does that mean that my terrible experience is the norm? I'm guessing no, as they're stock is going nowhere but up. 


_Modified by JPatt at 10:12 AM 6-30-2008_


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

Now you're really gone off the deep end.
Of course this post was planned and the timing more than coincidental, but why does that make you sick? C2's getting creamed in that thread you're referring to and there's nothing in there to fault them for! Why wouldn't they want people in this forum to know that Gabe's issue is an aberration and not the norm for these kits? Should they just cease all marketing, even though all but one or two customers are loving their kits?
Damn, man. Maybe it will be found that they're at fault somehow for Gabe's issue, and maybe they'll man up then and do the right thing. But until that happens I honestly don't get why you'd post something so harsh.


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## rangerbrown (Jul 12, 2007)

Audi4u jsut has his pantys ina bunch because of past issues imo.
dude you need to relax and let them handle it


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (rangerbrown)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rangerbrown* »_Audi4u jsut has his pantys ina bunch because of past issues imo.
dude you need to relax and let them handle it 

That must be it, that's why I recommended the the kit to everyone that emailed me about it.


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (Audi4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi4u* »_
That must be it, that's why I recommended the the kit to everyone that emailed me about it.

And if I emailed you now, would you say something different? If so why?
All I'm getting at is that you seem to be pretty knowledgeable when it comes to turboing the 2.5







so what specific part of this kit could cause the issues you've seen in that other thread? IOW, what part of the kit has the potential to make multiple engines run so lean in one cylinder that the engine fails? I don't know what you know when it comes to this stuff, but I can't think of anything in the kit (outside a faulty injector, and those have all been checked) that could do that and not do it in other kits as well...


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_
And if I emailed you now, would you say something different? If so why?
All I'm getting at is that you seem to be pretty knowledgeable when it comes to turboing the 2.5







so what specific part of this kit could cause the issues you've seen in that other thread? IOW, what part of the kit has the potential to make multiple engines run so lean in one cylinder that the engine fails? I don't know what you know when it comes to this stuff, but I can't think of anything in the kit (outside a faulty injector, and those have all been checked) that could do that and not do it in other kits as well...

What we need to clear up is everyone keeps saying it ran lean. Running lean is not the only condition that will blow a motor. High egts can be a combination of a bunch of thing. 
too much timing
not enough timing
Basically if it was a boost issue the way they are trying to make it seem his target air fuel wouldn't have been on point.


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

Yeah, that's a good point.
So what part of the kit could be responsible if the issue isn't related to boost? Software? Wouldn't that also get ruled out due to afr being okay? Also, how or why would C2's standard software affect only one cylinder?


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## Mein_GTI (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: My Thoughts on the C2 Turbo Kit for the MK5 Rabbit and NGP (JPatt)*

I had a problems with *NGP*. I ordered a C2 turbo kits from Dave, the owner of NGP, over the phone. *Dave LIED to me on a $4500 deal*. He said that he only had one kit and wanted to sell it to me. After I ordered it,* Dave called *"another guy" who was interested in the same kit and since the other guy was driving up to get it, he was going to sell it to him instead of me. *WTF??????* How hard would it have been to box up the kit and ship it to me???






















*Beware of NGP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (nascent)*

LOL
you can pick my brain all day long if you choose to.
There are a couple things that could attribute to that from a hardware point of view. You have to remember this is not 1985. The stock ecu can add/remove fuel and timing on a cylinder by cylinder basis.
A bad flash/tuning could change that.
Think about it this way, from the factory the engine was tuned to get each cylinder to the same performance output with the HARDWARE it CAME with.
That's the reason why sometimes if you change hardware, you actually loose power.
So if the cylinder fuel/timing trim wasn't tuned for the hardware it could complex a situation.
If the air intake temps are too high it could cause a high egt situation. 
also take a look at cylinder 3 location on the manifold. could it's location impede air flow because of exhaust collision? 
or is cylinder 3 getting the most intake air?




_Modified by Audi4u at 2:21 PM 6-30-2008_


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

Thanks.
I totally understand what you're saying, but that's why I suggested software could be ruled out due to afr being tested and okay. Also, I would assume that C2 uses a standard tune for this kit, and though variations could exist, I doubt there'd be such an extreme like this. Of course C2 can tune for individual cylinder fuel and timing, but whatever changes they make would affect all cylinders the same.
Do you know if Gabe's ECU got checked by C2 to make sure the proper software was loaded?
Again, though, there are more than a few cars running perfectly using the same hardware and the same software, so while your theories make sense in an abstract context, IMO they do not for Gabe's situation.


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_Thanks.
I totally understand what you're saying, but that's why I suggested software could be ruled out due to afr being tested and okay. Also, I would assume that C2 uses a standard tune for this kit, and though variations could exist, I doubt there'd be such an extreme like this. Of course C2 can tune for individual cylinder fuel and timing, but whatever changes they make would affect all cylinders the same.
Do you know if Gabe's ECU got checked by C2 to make sure the proper software was loaded?
Again, though, there are more than a few cars running perfectly using the same hardware and the same software, so while your theories make sense in an abstract context, IMO they do not for Gabe's situation. 

So why is it then impossible for the kit to be defective?
How many cars come from the manufacture with defects. They are all made the same exact with same hardware. I know it not 0% or there would be no need for lemon law or recalls.
All I'm saying is the kit can't be ruled out as the culprit.


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

No, no; I'm not saying the kit can be totally ruled out. But instead of simply suggesting there could be a defect in the kit somewhere, let's try to narrow it down a bit, right, because obviously defects in certain parts couldn't cause this issue. I'll admit that outside of software and injectors/harnesses, I'm not really coming up with other parts that would cause this issue.
I hope it doesn't come across like I'm challenging you or trying to back you into a corner, I'm just using deductive reasoning to get closer to the answer. Since the issue is so specific (damage to #3 cylinder) and has happened to two unrelated engines, I simply have to believe this is something that can be solved sooner than later.


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## C2Motorsports (Nov 25, 2003)

*Re: (Audi4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi4u* »_
So why is it then impossible for the kit to be defective?
All I'm saying is the kit can't be ruled out as the culprit.



Anything is possible
If the original purchaser of the C2 Kit (Gabe) would like to proceed in that direction, he needs to please contact us and let us know. He will need to ship us the entire kit for review/inspection of defects; we will do our best to move this ahead of the workload so that we may provide him with a timely report.
We will discuss with our vendors regarding thier policy for review , for all of the non-C2 manufactured parts. If individual vendors need to have the items shipped back to them for testing, we will help Gabe and facilitate this.


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## sl33pyb (Jan 15, 2007)

i love that game just the tip....i usaly win. still dont know if i want to put 4 k into FF car thats is about 3000 lbs. cause a 2200 lb fr car would be a hell of a lot better


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## 2000 vrsiiick (May 10, 2006)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*

i like hearing good reviews on the trubo kit for the rabbit.... i dont even have my rabbit yet (being delivered to the dealership tomorrow) and im already wanting the turbo kit.... gotta pay off that credit card first though. 
all-in-all, OP, how much was the "turbo experiance"? meaning cost of turbo and install? just wondering how much i have to save up over the next two years as my warantee fades.


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## happy vw bunny (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: (2000 vrsiiick)*


_Quote, originally posted by *2000 vrsiiick* »_i like hearing good reviews on the trubo kit for the rabbit.... i dont even have my rabbit yet (being delivered to the dealership tomorrow) and im already wanting the turbo kit.... gotta pay off that credit card first though. 
all-in-all, OP, how much was the "turbo experiance"? meaning cost of turbo and install? just wondering how much i have to save up over the next two years as my warantee fades. 

If all goes well and as it should, you could spend up to about $5,500.00 installed. It should not run more than that.
Good Luck!


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## kiserhd (Feb 2, 2008)

*Re: (2000 vrsiiick)*

I was able to get the introductory deal as well $4350 shipped. I did the install myself and between tools I didnt have on hand and some expendable parts I probably spent another $200 or so. I have not had any problems with the kit, least none I didnt bring upon myself from overlooking an item here or there. I cannot say I recommend doing the install yourself unless your a mechanic by trade. It gave me quite a few headaches along the way. My previous experience is centered around GM V8's specifically the LS series motors. I'm used to having a significantly larger work area. It was a very rewarding experience, and thus far I am happier with my Rabbit in its current state than I have ever been with my previous project vehicles.
On a side note I hope those that have had problems with the kit get everything resolved in a timely fashion.


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## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_
Do you know if Gabe's ECU got checked by C2 to make sure the proper software was loaded?

It was checked at Cult Classic, everything was fine.
The fact that Gabes thread got locked and then this one coincidentally pops up makes me laugh and says alot.

C2 http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif 
Vortex Moderators http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif


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## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

Hey Gabe, how is your situation


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## digitaltim (Apr 17, 2007)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corruptkid* »_







they are things that just seem to happen in a weird way, however http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif to the vortex moderators for locking a thread that was going to prove to be informational for all of us and shed light on all possibilities and things to check for when deciding to mod in the sense of a turbo upgrade for this motor.
More research should have been done with all of this to prevent any of my issues.









_Modified by Corruptkid at 3:52 PM 7-2-2008_

I have to agree that locking that thread immediately after the blame went to C2 seems chitty... C2 is one of the forum sponsors right? I wanted to see how C2 handles the situation.
And for them to insist that you send them back the kit???? That's like OJ asking for the glove..... I'm not saying C2 is dishonest, but when there's $ at stake weird things happen. Like threads locking.








It's not our court, we just play here.....
This is just as much a forum for making $ as it is one for information.
Hopefully if it is their fault they will take care of you and the shop that tried to make you whole. 



_Modified by digitaltim at 4:43 PM 7-2-2008_


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## Mein_GTI (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: (digitaltim)*


_Quote, originally posted by *digitaltim* »_
I have to agree that locking that thread immediately after the blame went to C2 seems chitty... C2 is one of the forum sponsors right? I wanted to see how C2 handles the situation.
And for them to insist that you send them back the kit???? That's like OJ asking for the glove..... I'm not saying C2 is dishonest, but when there's $ at stake weird things happen. Like threads locking.








It's not our court, we just play here.....
This is just as much a forum for making $ as it is one for information.
Hopefully if it is their fault they will take care of you and the shop that tried to make you whole. 


Agreed on how VW Vortex will not allow people to express their concerns about business practices that seem to be questionable. Unfortunately, they will NOT bite the hand that feeds them. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif to Vortex for violating the freedom of speech and the ability to protect fellow consumers.
As for C2, they are more like Bart Simpson: "I didn't do it! Nobody saw me do it! You can't prove a thing...man!"


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## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Mein_GTI)*

Same "people" in every 2.5T thread saying the same stupid stuff.
Modifying cars is compared to this, Little kids shouldn't play with fireworks, they can get hurt if they don't know what they are doing. but adults are fine, they can do it with reason and knowledge.
Just because you had one problem with a company, or "built" one car does not mean your god.


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## Mein_GTI (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: (elitist)*

Stupid adults still blow themselves up with fireworks.


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## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Mein_GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Mein_GTI* »_*Stupid adults* still blow themselves up with fireworks.

http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_Just because you had one problem with a company, or "built" one car does not mean your god. 

Just because you've seen one persons car, or thread, does not mean you know their life story.
Not everyone lives on vortex.


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## conejoZING! (Nov 25, 2007)

*Re: My Thoughts on the C2 Turbo Kit for the MK5 Rabbit and NGP (JPatt)*

eventually, when all this drama and such is sorted out...
there will be an awesome, solid formula to creating 2.5 Turbo Rabbits. 
Until then, I'm naturally aspirated GIAC Thunderbunny lol. This engine is quick... a few days ago, I raced a nitrous freak turbo Rhiycer (kind of a brave, crazy move on my part) and it turns out that a N/A 2.5 GIAC is nearly as quick as a nitrous turbo Rhicefreak. If the Rhicer did actually ruin his wheels then I won... oh well... point is, keep working at it because this 2.5 engine is RAD.
C2 keep working.
LNT keep working. 
It's a process, make the formula solid - you learn along the way. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 


_Modified by conejoZING! at 11:00 AM 7-4-2008_


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## Stephen McTowlie (Mar 13, 2007)

*Re: (Mein_GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Mein_GTI* »_
Agreed on how VW Vortex will not allow people to express their concerns about business practices that seem to be questionable. Unfortunately, they will NOT bite the hand that feeds them. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif to Vortex for violating the freedom of speech and the ability to protect fellow consumers.
As for C2, they are more like Bart Simpson: "I didn't do it! Nobody saw me do it! You can't prove a thing...man!"

Both you and this punk..Corruptkid...should be dope slapped for being ...Well just plain stupid.
I simply can not understand people....
You will shell out the 5,000.00 cash for a turbo kit..Knowing full well ..YOU JUST VOIDED THE Warranty on a brand new car......
Then refuse to spend a few bucks for something important...Like a 35 dollar boost gage.....or god forbid 330 for a wide-band display.......
To keep watch over the box of parts you just bolted under the hood
Serves you right for being stupid.......the only person to place blame on is the end user...PERIOD.....If you wanted a turbocharged car ...you should have purchased it that way. 
If you do not understand the in's and outs of adding forced induction to a vehicle that was never intended to be ..and the risks involved....you should not alter you vehicle at all.
Leave it stock...and be happy.
And I read the other posts as well....to say 2 psi will destroy an engine is ...well just an silly uninformed response.....learn more post less...
And Mein GTI ....I don't know how your wife deals with raising kids and dealing with a full grown child such as yourself..She must be a saint....
You sir need to grow up and stop whining like a little girl.


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## veedubb87 (Mar 28, 2006)

*Re: (Stephen McTowlie)*

take your flame war somewhere else, why post here if you don't even own a 2.5 and have nothing useful to add


_Modified by veedubb87 at 2:55 AM 7-5-2008_


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## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (Stephen McTowlie)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Stephen McTowlie* »_
Both you and this punk..Corruptkid...should be dope slapped for being ...Well just plain stupid.
I simply can not understand people....
You will shell out the 5,000.00 cash for a turbo kit..Knowing full well ..YOU JUST VOIDED THE Warranty on a brand new car......
Then refuse to spend a few bucks for something important...Like a 35 dollar boost gage.....or god forbid 330 for a wide-band display.......
To keep watch over the box of parts you just bolted under the hood
Serves you right for being stupid.......the only person to place blame on is the end user...PERIOD.....If you wanted a turbocharged car ...you should have purchased it that way. 
If you do not understand the in's and outs of adding forced induction to a vehicle that was never intended to be ..and the risks involved....you should not alter you vehicle at all.
Leave it stock...and be happy.
And I read the other posts as well....to say 2 psi will destroy an engine is ...well just an silly uninformed response.....learn more post less...
And Mein GTI ....I don't know how your wife deals with raising kids and dealing with a full grown child such as yourself..She must be a saint....
You sir need to grow up and stop whining like a little girl.


I hope somebody punches you in the face today.


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## zakattak (Apr 28, 2007)

*Re: (das pui)*

jesus. i like locking threads as much as the next guy, but usually i do it in the regional forum.
imo it is the purpose of the technical forums to make progress in the field of the forum.
i do have a 2.5 and love it and want to turbo it, but haven't said anything because so far this isht isn't my business.
i want to hear everything that transpires, so please keep the hate/love to the cars/people involved.


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## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (zakattak)*


_Quote, originally posted by *zakattak* »_jesus. i like locking threads as much as the next guy, but usually i do it in the regional forum.
imo it is the purpose of the technical forums to make progress in the field of the forum.
i do have a 2.5 and love it and want to turbo it, but haven't said anything because so far this isht isn't my business.
i want to hear everything that transpires, so please keep the hate/love to the cars/people involved.


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## Salsa GTI (Aug 29, 2000)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corruptkid* »_
I will keep my comments and response to this to myself. One thing is that you have no idea what has gone on or what happened, so you should not come in here and completely bash someone for what has happened. Don't claim that 2psi will not ruin an engine as with the correct wastegate installed, everyone does not even hold 10, they hold a steady 8. when it comes down to things, the incorrect wastegate was provided which puts said company above at the very least liable.


Hello All.
This is really a hot topic.
Lots of blame being thrown around.....
Owners of cars taking non of it...
How typical...of the world today...
If something bad happens....it must be some body's fault...but not your own...
And don't say this does not concern me...because it does.....
I own a VW with a turbo and C2 software...
TO bash Company's and shops and take no part in the situation is silly.... 
TO post these things on a public forum and complain when people have a different opinion than your own is also silly.
To say you want some one to get punched is also child like.
Plenty of people know me.....
If you feel the need to punch some one...
Give me a call.....
Everyone knows where I live...
But lets talk common sense first....if that fails...we race our cars....
if you don't like the outcome of that.....well ...I guess we fight....or agree to disagree.....
If we destroy all the aftermarke companys...what wil be left...stock cars?
What fun is that........
Its' better to see the look on somone's face after they got beat by a VW.. when they are driving a car that's suposed to be all that.


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## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (Salsa GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Salsa GTI* »_

Hello All.
This is really a hot topic.
Lots of blame being thrown around.....
Owners of cars taking non of it...
How typical...of the world today...
If something bad happens....it must be some body's fault...but not your own...
And don't say this does not concern me...because it does.....
I own a VW with a turbo and C2 software...
TO bash Company's and shops and take no part in the situation is silly.... 
TO post these things on a public forum and complain when people have a different opinion than your own is also silly.
To say you want some one to get punched is also child like.
Plenty of people know me.....
If you feel the need to punch some one...
Give me a call.....
Everyone knows where I live...
But lets talk common sense first....if that fails...we race our cars....
if you don't like the outcome of that.....well ...I guess we fight....or agree to disagree.....
If we destroy all the aftermarke companys...what wil be left...stock cars?
What fun is that........
Its' better to see the look on somone's face after they got beat by a VW.. when they are driving a car that's suposed to be all that.

If im not mechanically inclined and I purchase a bolt on turbo kit from a company, then pay a shop to do the installation. How is it MY fault if my motor blows up? Did I do something wrong? Thats really all it boils down to here.



_Modified by das pui at 2:37 PM 7-5-2008_


----------



## Tbugsy (Nov 11, 2007)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*


_Quote »_i want to hear everything that transpires, so please keep the hate/love to the cars/people involved.

X2
Please no more locked threads. Those of us interested in purchasing this kit and/or turbocharging our car are interested in seeing how this all plays out. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## zakattak (Apr 28, 2007)

*Re: (Salsa GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Salsa GTI* »_ If we destroy all the aftermarket companys...what will be left...stock cars?
What fun is that........

i couldn't agree more. i just want as many facts as possible. i will probably still get this kit.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (zakattak)*

Gabe what i would do in your situation is spend the money to send the car complete directly to c2 and let them figure it out, once the problem is determined that will tell you who is paying for the latest repair bill http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## stirfriedx9 (Apr 23, 2005)

*Re: ([email protected])*

i work on vws for a living. after gabe's motor blew up the first time, the shop that installed it the second time should have put a makeshift boost gauge and an air fuel gauge on it before letting it go. i read the old posts and realized that this was never actually done (with the exception of reading some o2 lamba readings which can be misleading sometimes). regardless of wether or not the kit came with a boost or air fuel gauge, performing these tests would have been the necessary thing to do. plus, no one can solve a problem without properly diagnosing it. there is an old saying....let the buyer beware. however, i know how the dealership works, and how tough working on cars can be. gabe is actually very fortunate that the shop that installed his kit, paid for a new engine. i think c2 is also paying for his second engine. in this respect gabe is cursed but also blessed. although things could have been better...they could have been alot worse. i think everyone who purchases an aftermarket turbo kit should always get an air fuel and boost gauge, but that just comes from experience. another rule of thumb would be never to go W.O.T if the cel comes on after your turbo is installed regardless of wether or not it is flashing. at this point, go get it scanned and diagnos the problem before you do anything else. it could be a loose gas cap, or something much worse. from an unbiased perspective, gabe should take repsonsibility for putting aftermarket parts on his car (remember it is not meant to be there...even if it is supposed to be reliable there is always a chance something can go wrong), the installed shop should take responsiblity for not doing the proper diagnosis after the first incident, and c2 should take repsonsibily for not double checking the waste gate spring before it was shipped out even if it should have been double checked after the first motor blew. in this situation, there really is no one to blame...but everyone needs to learn from this and make sure something similar never happens again. im still skeptical that 2 extra psi of boost blew the motor because im assuming no one drove it wot after the cel came on...in this regard c2 is correct in asking for the kit back to inspect all the componets. i actually feel bad for all parties involved because it benefits no one. no...i dont believe c2 to out to get anyone. no i dont believe the installer is out to get anyone or incompotent either. no, i dont think gabe will be mistreated in the end although it has already left a bad taste in his mouth. from my personal point of view...this all should have all been conducted privately until the end result is reached. then you can post a one million page thread on it. you may find that one month from now gabe has a brand new motor and the kit is running perfect...and hes happy and content to leave the past behind...then what will all this bickering be for. we, as a community, do not need to "learn" about what is going on right now only because it is not, at least in my mind, even close to being settled. i hope it all works out in the end. good luck to everyone.


----------



## 2point5 (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corruptkid* »_
Bottom line is that * THE WASTEGATE THAT WAS SENT TO ME WAS INCORRECT AND THERFORE THE CAR RAN A MINIMUM OF 12PSI AND POTENTIALLY SPIKED HIGHER THAN THAT. I AM NOT TO BLAME NOR AM I AT FAULT. I THINK YOU CAN AGREE WITH ME ON THAT.*

did you have a boost gauge to verify what boost preasure actually was.... or are you just assuming that it was 12psi.....
and if it was going to spike higher with the .8bar spring.... it would spike higher with the .7bar as well...


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## BlackRabbit2point5 (Sep 6, 2007)

I've noticed only one person has had a problem with the kit which is good. Nice to see another good review. I bought the kit a month and a half ago and it should be going in this week. I've been running a spec stg 2 for umm well my car has only worked for a week and a half of the month I've had it thanks to a defective tank of gas and waiting for my claim to be paid by the gas station


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (BlackRabbit2point5)*

more than one person has had a problem, but thats besides to point..read deeper


----------



## 2point5 (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*

how many miles did you put on the car before it blew the first engine?


----------



## GT42R32deepblue (Feb 29, 2008)

audi4u.. thats all i gotta say


----------



## 2point5 (Apr 19, 2007)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*

ouch....yeah not much diagnosis you can do in that short time... sorry dude that sucks...


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (2point5)*

Question,
The wastegate spring that was "wrong" was ONLY 2psi higher then the one that should have been installed?
If that is correct, do you really think that 2 psi over specs will cause death that fast? I can see that if it was a 1bar spring almost double the boost but not just under 2 psi more. 
If you swapped a .7 for a .8 spring, you could hardely tell. In turn, neither could your motor. Besides i think if i heard correctly the TUNE is made for a much higher boost level the specs so upgradeing is possible. Which means it would NOT lean out if it over boosted 2 psi.


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (elitist)*

2 psi is a big difference denpending on the size of the turbo.
It's about flow vs pressure and the efficency of the turbo at the boost.


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

So a well built company will put a turbo setup right at its limits? 2 psi. no, wait just 1.45 psi will push it over the cliff? No, not happening at all. Again, if it was a 1bar spring, I wouldn't be posting this. Cool air, differnt WG pickup points, humidity, differnt styles of exhaust or even a dirty airfilter will all make differnt boost levels by a LITTLE, as in a little like 1.45psi. theres is so many factors that can chnage boost spikes, level, regularity etc. It is 100% foolish to say that 1.45 blew up the motor. No company, not even EIP would make a bolt on kit at the limit. This motor and C2 software has been tested up to the 15 psi level, so thats more then 1.45 psi, right? the tune itself can go higher. That leaves a 5 to 7 psi range well before the limitations of the software and injectors. Which means something else is making it lean out or over boost.
In my opinion, the wastegate was not checked and should have after the 1st melt down. who is saying thats not at fault because of being damaged? it could leak, be warped,not opening correctly etc. when the "shop" said that "the glowing red exhaust manifold is normal for aftermarket turbo setups." -Oh thats a funny joke.


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (elitist)*

I dont want to argue with you because I'm tired after a long weekend. 
You said 2 psi is not alot when in fact it is.
Did you know that the stage 1 and stage 2 has a difference of 1psi?


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

Yes, Plus an intercooler setup. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
*
1.45 psi* is only a lot of boost when you are at the limit, AKA breaking point. Which 10 psi is not the "breaking point". If they put a boost controller on a turbo setup and cranked it higher then the companies specs and found the it started to lean out at 15psi and they set it there, then 1.45 psi is "a lot" of boost. But given the lehway of 5 to 7 psi before a possible limitation point, 1.45 psi IS NOT alot.


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_Yes, Plus an intercooler setup. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
*
1.45 psi* is only a lot of boost when you are at the limit, AKA breaking point. Which 10 psi is not the "breaking point". If they put a boost controller on a turbo setup and cranked it higher then the companies specs and found the it started to lean out at 15psi and they set it there, then 1.45 psi is "a lot" of boost. But given the lehway of 5 to 7 psi before a possible limitation point, 1.45 psi IS NOT alot. 

You do know that the rabbits fuel system doesn't increase fuel pressure as boost increase RIGHT?!


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

You act as if you are the only one that "knows" these cars and drivetrain.


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_You act as if you are the only one that "knows" these cars and drivetrain. 

sorry didnt mean to hit a nerve


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corruptkid* »_
Bottom line is that * THE WASTEGATE THAT WAS SENT TO ME WAS INCORRECT AND THERFORE THE CAR RAN A MINIMUM OF 12PSI AND POTENTIALLY SPIKED HIGHER THAN THAT. I AM NOT TO BLAME NOR AM I AT FAULT. I THINK YOU CAN AGREE WITH ME ON THAT.*

Ok even if they sent you the wrong parts or parts are installed wrong, you still drove the car while it was running like ****. You said you drove the car from Rt.22 to Rt.21 all with the check engine light flashing and the car running really rough. What else do you want the car to do to tell you to turn it off and tow it back? So yeah it is a bit your fault the engine blew.
These are the risks you take when you do that big of a mod to a car. You have to be ready for something to fail, because it usually does. No matter how expensive it was. I'd love to strap that kit on my car but I need my car to be able be used as a daily driver and can't risk having my car down for that long. I wish you the best of luck and hope everything works out for you.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (vw93to85)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vw93to85* »_
Ok even if they sent you the wrong parts or parts are installed wrong, you still drove the car while it was running like ****. You said you drove the car from Rt.22 to Rt.21 all with the check engine light flashing and the car running really rough. What else do you want the car to do to tell you to turn it off and tow it back? So yeah it is a bit your fault the engine blew.
These are the risks you take when you do that big of a mod to a car. You have to be ready for something to fail, because it usually does. No matter how expensive it was. I'd love to strap that kit on my car but I need my car to be able be used as a daily driver and can't risk having my car down for that long. I wish you the best of luck and hope everything works out for you. 

i could not disagree anymore with what you have to say, because he turbos his car he should expect it to fail?? that makes no sense..the C2 kit "should be" bolt on and go, never have to worry bout the engine..we have built many of cars that have been under tons more abuse and have yet to break..here are a couple examples
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3246798
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3601844
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3918434
just because you take something and do things outside from what it was designed for doesn't mean it "should" fail simply for that reason, the 2.5 is an awesome motor that you can make 400whp on all day long and have no issues..i am pretty sure me and andre already proved that with his rabbit seeing up to 20psi stock motor on a GT35R


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

If you disagree with him, then you can say that a FLASHING or even any check engine light is ok to drive with? 
Yes the C2 kit is a bolt on kit. Yes it will bolt on a stock car and works.
But with all aftermarket things, there are other things that are VERY wise to install. boost gauge, wideband, motor mounts, clutch upgrade, exhaust, better brakes etc.
Whould you not agree that if you boost a car, you should do a clutch upgrade because sooner or later it will slip and die? Do you not agree that it is MORE then wise to have a boost gauge and wideband to watch the cars workings? some things are needed to be added, included or not. C2 is not going to give you exhaust, boost gauge, wideband and a clucth setup WITH thier kit. but its recomened! does ANY company?! NO. What makes C2 differnt then? They shouldn't need to either.
So if you own a new beetle and the car over heats and blows the motor because the car from factory does not have a temp gauge, are you going to blame VW because it overheated? I'd love to hear the laughing on the other end of the phone call.
Everyone love to play the blame game, not me not me! yet no one takes the blame or repsonciblity. 
Flashing cel. Cel coming on, glowing red manifold, faulty installation, using the same BAD parts, etc. but yet its the manufactures fault. Sure it is.


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## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_Flashing cel. Cel coming on, glowing red manifold, faulty installation, using the same BAD parts, etc. but yet its the manufactures fault. Sure it is.


The first time the part was installed incorrectly. It was only after the second motor went that it was discovered the part was bad/incorrect.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (das pui)*

you should not need a boost gauge or wideband for a simple bolt on kit..you see APR saying you need either of those with their APR stage 3 kits?? no because they have the research and devolpent behind it and are confident the end user does not need to make sure the car runs right...APR takes care of that before the kit leaves the door. C2 is trying to step up to the plate so what makes their kit any different that you have to keep you eye on every tuning aspect of the car?? makes no sense he is not building a turbo kit, he bought one that should be problem free


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_you should not need a boost gauge or wideband for a simple bolt on kit..you see APR saying you need either of those with their APR stage 3 kits?? no because they have the research and devolpent behind it and are confident the end user does not need to make sure the car runs right...APR takes care of that before the kit leaves the door. C2 is trying to step up to the plate so what makes their kit any different that you have to keep you eye on every tuning aspect of the car?? makes no sense he is not building a turbo kit, he bought one that should be problem free

Now things are getting silly for sure. Plain and simple, there are enough C2 2.5 customers out there who HAVE just bolted on their kits and driven thousands of miles with no issues, so I really have to question why anyone is suggesting the kit is unreliable over all. What's at issue is the kit was installed incorrectly and the discovery of a non-spec part. Looks like a case of sh*t happens more than anything else.
And JC proves my point when he compares this kit to an APR Stage 3 kit. How many of those do you think have been installed improperly? How many of those kits were sold with missing or incorrect parts? You're kidding yourself if you think APR is immune to this sort of thing.


----------



## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_
Now things are getting silly for sure. Plain and simple, there are enough C2 2.5 customers out there who HAVE just bolted on their kits and driven thousands of miles with no issues, so I really have to question why anyone is suggesting the kit is unreliable over all. What's at issue is the kit was installed incorrectly and the discovery of a non-spec part. Looks like a case of sh*t happens more than anything else.
And JC proves my point when he compares this kit to an APR Stage 3 kit. How many of those do you think have been installed improperly? How many of those kits were sold with missing or incorrect parts? You're kidding yourself if you think APR is immune to this sort of thing. 

You are absolutely correct. So why isnt C2 stepping up to the plate when '**** happens'?
There are plenty of C2 turbo rabbits out there running fine, but if I were in the market to get a turbo kit I wouldnt want to go with a company whos going to give me the run around when something goes wrong.


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_
And JC proves my point when he compares this kit to an APR Stage 3 kit. How many of those do you think have been installed improperly? How many of those kits were sold with missing or incorrect parts? You're kidding yourself if you think APR is immune to this sort of thing. 

How many blow after the installation has been corrected?


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (das pui)*


_Quote, originally posted by *das pui* »_
You are absolutely correct. So why isnt C2 stepping up to the plate when '**** happens'?
There are plenty of C2 turbo rabbits out there running fine, but if I were in the market to get a turbo kit I wouldnt want to go with a company whos going to give me the run around when something goes wrong.

Yeah, that is the actual issue, IMO, and not the reliability of the kit.
Can't speak for C2 but last we heard, didn't they say they were going to get him another engine? If so, I think that's impressive and would/will make me buy a kit (R32, but my girl's got a Rabbit we're working on







).


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## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (Audi4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi4u* »_
How many blow after the installation has been corrected?

No offense, but that's what's bugging me here. You yourself are of the opinion that the extra boost is to blame, and like I said in my post, that was supposedly due to a non-spec part that got sent out by mistake. Since no one else has the prob I'd say it was an isolated incident. So why try to make it seem like the kit is unreliable? Is C2 the only company to ever ship the wrong parts? C'mon, now; this is looking like a witch hunt more than anything else.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_
No offense, but that's what's bugging me here. You yourself are of the opinion that the extra boost is to blame, and like I said in my post, that was supposedly due to a non-spec part that got sent out by mistake. Since no one else has the prob I'd say it was an isolated incident. So why try to make it seem like the kit is unreliable? Is C2 the only company to ever ship the wrong parts? C'mon, now; this is looking like a witch hunt more than anything else.

hmmm that sounds similar to when c2 said andres rabbit was going to be unreliable without their every being 1 failure







strange huh


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_
No offense, but that's what's bugging me here. You yourself are of the opinion that the extra boost is to blame, and like I said in my post, that was supposedly due to a non-spec part that got sent out by mistake. Since no one else has the prob I'd say it was an isolated incident. So why try to make it seem like the kit is unreliable? Is C2 the only company to ever ship the wrong parts? C'mon, now; this is looking like a witch hunt more than anything else.

I agreed also it was due to the incorrect part, but your buddy said that 2 psi wouldnt blow an engine. I thought you were on the same campaign.








What bothers me about c2 is that they didnt want to get the problem fixed in a timely manner. Sure now they want to cause they are in the spotlight. The otherthing is Im not sure if you were around when I had my little issue with the c2 staff but i remember the word reliabity being thrown around. Thats supposedly what separated c2's kit from my project.
I tried to explain to people that any modified engine is not %100 reliable. Installing a boost gauge don't stop engine from blowing. 
I have a complex warning system installed on everyone of my turbo cars. It cost about $600 but it makes the setup as safe as stock. 
There is no witch hunt here. Its just funny that when the wastegate was incorrectly installed and the motor blew the mob was out. 
When the 2nd motor blew, oh its cant m=be c2 and even after a critical part was found out of spec, people are saying they shouln't have to pay. THATS my beef. (which by the way c2 tried to blame on the car being open dump







)


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Got no idea what you're talking about. Does all this negativity go back to past issues with you and C2? If so, man, I don't know why you're letting it get to you so bad or why you're bringing it up in here.


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: (Audi4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi4u* »_
I agreed also it was due to the incorrect part, but your buddy said that 2 psi wouldnt blow an engine. I thought you were on the same campaign.








What bothers me about c2 is that they didnt want to get the problem fixed in a timely manner. Sure now they want to cause they are in the spotlight. The otherthing is Im not sure if you were around when I had my little issue with the c2 staff but i remember the word reliabity being thrown around. Thats supposedly what separated c2's kit from my project.
I tried to explain to people that any modified engine is not %100 reliable. Installing a boost gauge don't stop engine from blowing. 
I have a complex warning system installed on everyone of my turbo cars. It cost about $600 but it makes the setup as safe as stock. 
There is no witch hunt here. Its just funny that when the wastegate was incorrectly installed and the motor blew the mob was out. 
When the 2nd motor blew, oh its cant m=be c2 and even after a critical part was found out of spec, people are saying they shouln't have to pay. THATS my beef. (which by the way c2 tried to blame on the car being open dump







)

I do give you credit for arguing without getting nasty and calling names.








I don't disagree with anything you say, maybe you wanna go back and reread what I wrote? I'm not saying C2 shouldn't pay! I don't even think they are, since they've offered an engine, right?
As for the 2nd engine, I don't care what you say, it doesn't seem to me like an extra .1 bar of boost would blow a motor so quickly and since Azevdo screwed up the wastegate install, I can't help but wonder if they did other things. Hell, I'm from that area and I sure as hell have heard about their past history, history bad enough to cast doubt.
You guys want this to be a black and white issue but the facts that have been offered do not make that likely to happen. Too many questions.


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
i could not disagree anymore with what you have to say, because he turbos his car he should expect it to fail?? that makes no sense..the C2 kit "should be" bolt on and go, never have to worry bout the engine..we have built many of cars that have been under tons more abuse and have yet to break..here are a couple examples
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3246798
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3601844
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3918434
just because you take something and do things outside from what it was designed for doesn't mean it "should" fail simply for that reason, the 2.5 is an awesome motor that you can make 400whp on all day long and have no issues..i am pretty sure me and andre already proved that with his rabbit seeing up to 20psi stock motor on a GT35R










I never said it's destine to fail at all. So stop twisting words around. I'm just saying that when ever you start changing things from factory or even when replacing factory parts for that matter, you might run into problems. My cat-back didn't fit my car right at all, and when I brought it up to AWE they told me they've never had any problems before, but anything can happen. So who's to say what really went wrong. I deal with parts everyday at a dealer level, and I've seen all kinds of mix ups. I know C2 makes a great product, and even said I'd love to have this kit on my own car.
But hey your 100% right I'm sure.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (vw93to85)*

i am right and i work at a "dealer level" too i have worked as a tech and in parts..to be honest people at the dealer are clueless of what works and what doesn't out side of what elsaweb tells them http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif get your panty's out of a bunch your not an expert because you look up parts anyone can do that..hell a trained monkey could look up parts..i know i do it for a living http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_i am right and i work at a "dealer level" too i have worked as a tech and in parts..to be honest people at the dealer are clueless of what works and what doesn't out side of what elsaweb tells them http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif get your panty's out of a bunch your not an expert because you look up parts anyone can do that..hell a trained monkey could look up parts..i know i do it for a living http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Whatever, my car runs fine..... Not my problem


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_i am right and i work at a "dealer level" too 

Great! Now I know where to turn when I need an answer.








"dealer level" is not a thing to brag about. More dealer hire little high school kids and try to train them becuase the "know" VW's because the payu 19.95 a year for eurotuner magazine. Thus making dealership daig. and "craftmanship" turn to crap. Aftermarket and small shops are where its at to get good work done.
So if your a "shop" or have a linked website selling parts and saying you can do work and know all of this and answer so many questions, why are you two not forum sponsers? 
Just another reason to stay out of New JerZey


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (vw93to85)*

So you guys deal with model electronics too huh? Good choice.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_
Great! Now I know where to turn when I need an answer.








"dealer level" is not a thing to brag about. More dealer hire little high school kids and try to train them becuase the "know" VW's because the payu 19.95 a year for eurotuner magazine. Thus making dealership daig. and "craftmanship" turn to crap. Aftermarket and small shops are where its at to get good work done.
So if your a "shop" or have a linked website selling parts and saying you can do work and know all of this and answer so many questions, why are you two not forum sponsers? 
Just another reason to stay out of New JerZey


"dealer level" was in quotes showing that i know anyone can work at a dealer, its most likely the place you will find the worst tech's out their http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
and why would i need to be a forum sponser when we already turn more than 2 million in parts a year? we are not small time we are 3 building with 40+ bays








edit: just checked my sales for last year not including internal sales was over 2.3 million and i am on pace this year to kill that..still feel like i need to be a forum sponser?


_Modified by [email protected] at 1:59 PM 7-7-2008_


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
edit: just checked my sales for last year not including internal sales was over 2.3 million and i am on pace this year to kill that..still feel like i need to be a forum sponser?


Congrats to you....








yes I do. Pay to play the game.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_
Congrats to you....








yes I do. Pay to play the game. 

funny you say that, i am not here to play the sales game. i don't want to touch any mod'd cars threw the shop ever, stock cars is where the money is at http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

Yet your "king" of the 2.5T?


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_Yet your "king" of the 2.5T?

i don't even own a 2.5







these cars are simple you don't need to be all that smart to understand how they work


----------



## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_
Yeah, that is the actual issue, IMO, and not the reliability of the kit.
Can't speak for C2 but last we heard, didn't they say they were going to get him another engine? If so, I think that's impressive and would/will make me buy a kit (R32, but my girl's got a Rabbit we're working on







).

They _said_ they were, I wonder what ever happened.
C2?


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (das pui)*

i know what happened but im not at liberty to say since it's between gabe and c2, gabe is getting the short end of the stick although c2 did reach out a hand they have yet to go above and beyond yet


----------



## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_i know what happened but im not at liberty to say since it's between gabe and c2, gabe is getting the short end of the stick although c2 did reach out a hand they have yet to go above and beyond yet

Yeah I know the whole story too, Gabes a good friend of mine. Im surpised C2 hasnt chimed in this thread yet, come out from the dark guys. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## chikubi (Jan 14, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_i know what happened but im not at liberty to say since it's between gabe and c2, gabe is getting the short end of the stick although c2 did reach out a hand they have yet to go above and beyond yet

That's pretty lame, man, saying you can't say but then going ahead and saying that Gabe is getting shorted. I bet you can't say why Gabe is getting shorted, because, you know, you're not at liberty to say... And the term above and beyond is pretty subjective, so I'll take that with a grain of salt.
Sorry, JC, the more you and Andre speak the more it just looks like this is some personal thing between you and C2 and that Gabe is caught in the middle. You guys want blood and that's all there is to it. I sure hope your baiting C2 like this doesn't backfire and wind up screwing over Gabe.
I only wanted to play devil's advocate here because I thought only one side was getting presented and that a real effort to find the problem wasn't happening. I know my way around turbo issues and things just didn't seem to be adding up and I thought I could help. But now it's just back and forth bickering and I apologize to everyone for my part in it all. I'm done.
Gabe, I wish you nothing but the best, man. You deserve an equitable resolution and I honestly hope you get one.


----------



## Tbugsy (Nov 11, 2007)

C2 issued a official company reply, so for good or bad that is probably the last word from them on this. 
Is Gabe under legal obligation not to say anything? 
Also, was/is Andre's project a strictly private one, or will he look for other tuners and sell? (Sorry if that has been asked before).










_Modified by Tbugsy at 5:36 PM 7-7-2008_


----------



## das pui (Aug 30, 2004)

*Re: (nascent)*


_Quote, originally posted by *nascent* »_Gabe, I wish you nothing but the best, man. You deserve an equitable resolution and I honestly hope you get one.


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (nascent)*

Ok again, because people will hear/read what they want to.
I used to have decent relations with [email protected]
Then something happend last year that involes. And unannounced turbo kit released by c2, my car and $2000








That is all I can say about that.
Evidentally while i thought the matter was settle [email protected] couldn't sleep at night and decided to make a public post, calling me a thief.This came right after my setup was making almost 200whp over the c2 kit.
They told everyone my setup is unreliable and would be blown up soon, so buy thiers because you would have no check engine light and is reliable. 
I am not out for c2 blood. Nothing c2 does puts food on my table or can take money out of my pocket. I have A full time career AND tune standalone engine managements on the side.
In my opinon after the 2nd motor blew, thats i sign something is wrong. These motors are not expensive. Thats one of the reasons I love it.
The point i been trying to make to the ones that will listen is: If you suspect the kit may have issues put another motor back in his car and send him on his way. It took half a page of people bashing Azevedo for them to say ok we will change the motor and not charge you labor.
But it take c2 2 locked thread and maybe three for them to say will do it.(and of course i don't believe it until it done.)
I met Gabe in person very nice guy. Actually alot of vw guys are very nice when they are not behind a keyboard. He went with c2' kit after others told him not too. I told him it would be decent but in my opion is not worth the money for the power output.
I drove my car from PA to NJ and hit boost a few times. Car didnt couldn't blow up becuase they was not enought fuel to make it detonate. That was a 2hr ride. 
I have nothing to gain from c2 paying for Gabes kit. But if there could be a fault with a kit, and you keep saying the rest are fine. That just make sense.
Imgaine if Bestbuy didnt have return polices. There would be a lot of people with bummed plasma screens. And I would be one of them. By the way my xbox 360 never crapped out so I guess the other customers having issues just plugged it in upside down.








Thats my point.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (das pui)*

i have nothing personal against c2 or their product i actually like their interest in the 2.5L motor, if you look around at other companys having issues like this they take charge in the situation and get the car right and going on track..not just leave the customer hanging. i am not out to c2 bash the only thing i don't like about the whole kit is the size of the turbo other than that i have no problem with c2's kit, but thats me i am the type of person that is all or nothing i could care less about check engine lights and a crap idle what i want out of a turbo kit is to be able to break the tires loose when i step on it doing 90 in 3rd gear...thats my personal look on it however i understand that me and andre are of a dieing hardcore breed and most people aren't as "nutty" as us and do like to be conservative and that is truely where the market is. with that said i hope you understand my problem isn't with c2 or their product my problem is that now that this has happened a second time c2 should go beyond their normal business and correct the situation even if it is not entirely their fault (not saying any is their fault) because that is what seperates good companies from great ones http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*

if anything i truely want to see the c2 turbo kit be a success, i am a vw nut the more quality performance out their the more cars i get to build and beat the crap out of


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_if anything i truely want to see the c2 turbo kit be a success, i am a vw nut the more quality performance out their the more cars i get to build and beat the crap out of









Not lieing about that at all.....*cough* clutch abuser


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

the origonal post said the car would be dynoed and he would post up a sheet when it was done. where is it?


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (Audi4u)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Audi4u* »_
Not lieing about that at all.....*cough* clutch abuser 
















southbend covered my ass their


----------



## GT42R32deepblue (Feb 29, 2008)

i shouldve gotten a 2.5 so u could turbo it andre..lol


----------



## kiserhd (Feb 2, 2008)

*Re: (XXX008XXX)*


_Quote, originally posted by *XXX008XXX* »_the origonal post said the car would be dynoed and he would post up a sheet when it was done. where is it?

Mine pulled 245hp 239tq running between 7.1-7.8 psi, depending on where he has the boost line to trigger the waste gate he might be running more.


----------



## kiserhd (Feb 2, 2008)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Corruptkid* »_
Where are the logs of the C2 car running 15 psi without issue?

You're asking the wrong guy. I didnt even know they had one running 15PSI, NGP's Bunny maybe.


----------



## JPatt (Oct 1, 2007)

*Re: (XXX008XXX)*

So the day of the expected dyno run, the dyno at NGP broke. As soon as it's back up and running, I'll have dynos up. 
And never before have I seen worse thread creep.


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (GT42R32deepblue)*









-Audre and jc have unlimited knowledge of, not only the 2.5L motor, but everything.
-No one can take blame for themselves.
-Unrelaible shop is "golden" here.
-1.45lbs of boost can now blow motors.
-All aftermarket companies have a lifetime warrenty on anything and everything.
-Need to stay out of New Jersey.
-No proof of anything has been given-and don't say the .7 to .8 bar spring.








-A good company is being painted bad.
-Another broken, poorly built, not finished car done by this shop-long list behind it.
All in all? worthless thread for 2 internet "hero" to brag on.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (elitist)*

ride c2's **** much?
go back and read what i wrote about c2 i am not bashing them, but gabe did nothing to break his car, it's not his fault and their is nothing wrong with the turbo kits company stepping up to the plate to fix the situation whether they are right or wrong in the situation plenty of real time companys do it all the time, like i said this is what seperates a good company from great ones


_Modified by [email protected] at 5:23 AM 7-8-2008_


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*

No, but thanks for asking so nicely.
I have ZERO association with C2. I've used thier software before and it was great, thats all.
I just hate it when good companies get killed by uneducated post on here.
The vortex is a great place to find info and gather with like minded people. BUT its a terrible place to get the WRONG info and meet all the interweb hero's. The guys that built one car and post pictures a million times, the guy that cut his springs and dropped his mk5 to the ground and rolled his fenders with a baseball bat- the car is junk now but heck-he's the man. Or the guy that makes a deal for a crazy turbo setup and gets screwed by one company but blames another. The guy that runs BBS wheels sticking way out of his car cause poke is mad cool yo!!1!1
Vortex, Welcome to dream land, where anything you want to say or act is ok. Till you show up in real life and you know nothing, you make $5.75 at burgerking and your mom stole your car back cause she's making the payments.



_Modified by elitist at 8:28 AM 7-8-2008_


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

lol lol
I think elitist works for c2
hmmmmm
is that you [email protected] .....


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Audi4u)*

Nah, I wish. The brains that guy has, geeezzzz!
Told you before, I'm just a guy thats sick of good companies painted bad, internet know-it-alls and bad info suppliers. I've used thier software and loved it. end of story.


_Modified by elitist at 8:40 AM 7-8-2008_


----------



## Audi4u (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_Nah, I wish. The brains that guy has, geeezzzz!
Told you before, I'm just a guy thats sick of good companies painted bad, internet know-it-alls and bad info suppliers. I've used thier software and loved it. end of story.

_Modified by elitist at 8:40 AM 7-8-2008_


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Audi4u)*


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*

far from GOD and far from jeff and far from working for C2.
I have an idea. take it to another shop to have it all checked out and a 2nd opinion.


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (Corruptkid)*

I've used software and a turbo kit, sorry to misinform you. My bad.


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (elitist)*

Based on what the Vortex community has seen in posts:
Fact: The car experienced a "result". 
Fact: There was not testing to determine "cause".
Fact: There were issues with the installation.
Fact: The kit was modified from it's original design.
Fact: No testing was done in regards to component part failure.
Fact: The manufacturer offered to help by supplying a motor, eventhough none of the above had been proven or disputed.
Yet C2 is the bad guy?
No proof, no money should be served. Easy as that. oh...IMO.


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_The guys that built one car and post pictures a million times

i hope your not talking about me and andre seeing that we have built way more than one car








here are just the couple in the last 2 years
















































































































































are we still one hit wonders in your eyes?


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (elitist)*

So you are saying that C2 had not turned there back on you, and wanted to work with you to diagnose the issue, correct? But, it wasn't the way YOU wanted them to do it? I don't know any companys that make "house calls"
It is standard operating procedure that when a consumers have a potential warranty claim, that a consumer needs to work with the manufacturer within thier policies to have the part inspected. Did this happen? No. The "shop" NOR you worked with c2 to follow thru with diagnoises. Infact from what i saw, the shop "says" it was over boosting but nothing was checked. Just "another" motor was installed with all old componants. But thats just from what I've read it was offered. You are correct I don't know the full story but i do know enough from here that there is no proof either way.


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: (elitist)*

You guys could only dream of *building* a car like this. farmed out to APtuning, i believe.










_Modified by elitist at 9:20 AM 7-8-2008_


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_
are we still one hit wonders in your eyes?









yup. you used the same motor in most of the cars pictured


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (elitist)*

their is 3 different motors in 5 different cars their..are you seriously retarted







and not one car has the same setup...please show me what you have to offer you must make every part you use yourself maybe even build the car from the ground up nothing from vw since having a company make a manifold is not a crime







your an idiot i am done here i could careless about any car other than mine and andres http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## elitist (Apr 18, 2006)

*Re: ([email protected])*


_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_ having a company make a manifold is not a crime 

thats ALL they made?









_Quote, originally posted by *[email protected]* »_ i am done here i could careless about any car other than mine and andres http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

Finally your done posting? Then my job is done here. Thanks you and good night!


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_
thats ALL they made?








Finally your done posting? Then my job is done here. Thanks you and good night!









Well lets not forget the hand jeff and andre have put in my car. i have the FASTEST all motor street VW in the country. [email protected] proves that. Not to mention they have helped me in my other projects. my 800wheel pump gas turbo mustang, my 450 wheel talon.. i think you get the idea. The pictures they post are of their own cars, leaving others they have helped make power on out of the question. i think the "AP tuning farmed" project would have never gotten to where it is today without andre and jeff. 400 wheel is the most powerfull rabbit on the tex so you cant hate on that. the fabbed up some nice stuff, but the tuning and engine management was all these guys, and tuning makes power hands down. so lets make a list
they have made more power the 90% of people on the vortex. 
they run fast times with thier cars
They work out of a 2 car garage with hand tools NO SHOP
they are always willing to help people out no questions asked
so elitist, what have you done that you can talk all this trash?


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: (XXX008XXX)*

and i guess them helping me be the first to have a r32 motor in a mk3 doesnt prove anything either. so not only do they have the first 2.5 mk4 under their belt, they also had a hand in the first r32 mk3. that right there is something to brag about IMO


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: (elitist)*


_Quote, originally posted by *elitist* »_You guys could only dream of *building* a car like this. farmed out to APtuning, i believe.









_Modified by elitist at 9:20 AM 7-8-2008_

and this picture shows what? APtuning didnt even build it, they farmed it out themselves!!! so what your saying is that if andre went to a non vw related shop to get this done he would have more credit? i am sorry but a lot of people can build a turbo header and a short runner last time i checked. heck get me a tig welder and i can build one too.


----------



## XXX008XXX (Mar 26, 2002)

*Re: (XXX008XXX)*

i will throw one more in here for you jeff, so we dont get this whole 3 motor 5 car thing twisted


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (XXX008XXX)*

Damn internet gangsters


----------



## kiserhd (Feb 2, 2008)

Loud noises!


----------



## zakattak (Apr 28, 2007)

*Re: (kiserhd)*


----------



## [email protected] (May 13, 2005)

*Re: (zakattak)*








best laugh of the day


----------



## GT42R32deepblue (Feb 29, 2008)

ELITIST= big C2 peenis rider


----------



## Stephen McTowlie (Mar 13, 2007)

*Re: (GT42R32deepblue)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GT42R32deepblue* »_ELITIST= big C2 peenis rider









More words of wisdom from "The Garbage State"


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (Stephen McTowlie)*

Oh man another New Jersey joke, that's so original. Honest i've never heard a New Jersey joke before. Tell me more.


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (vw93to85)*

Pennsylvania, where the men are men and the sheep are scared.


----------



## Salsa GTI (Aug 29, 2000)

*Re: (vw93to85)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vw93to85* »_Pennsylvania, where the men are men and the sheep are scared.

Thats for sure.....
Cant wait to move away from here.......The entire North East Can eat from my ass


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (Salsa GTI)*

I lived in West Chester pa for a while. It sucked. When it snows the road dept just seems to not give a crap. And most of the highways are only 2 lanes in either direction. I for one might be heading to Chicago in September


----------



## 04RSR32 (Feb 20, 2004)

*Re: (vw93to85)*

What were the numbers this thing put down?


----------



## 4door1.8T (Oct 13, 2007)

*Re: (kiserhd)*


_Quote, originally posted by *kiserhd* »_Loud noises!


----------



## Mein_GTI (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: (Salsa GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Salsa GTI* »_

Hello All.

Owners of cars taking non of it...
How typical...of the world today...
If something bad happens....it must be some body's fault...but not your own...
And don't say this does not concern me...because it does.....
I own a VW with a turbo and C2 software...
TO bash Company's and shops and take no part in the situation is silly.... 
TO post these things on a public forum and complain when people have a different opinion than your own is also silly.
To say you want some one to get punched is also child like.
Plenty of people know me.....
If you feel the need to punch some one...
Give me a call.....
Everyone knows where I live...

If we destroy all the aftermarke companys...what wil be left...stock cars?
What fun is that........
Its' better to see the look on somone's face after they got beat by a VW.. when they are driving a car that's suposed to be all that.


Salsa, *Lets face it, if the Company C2, and the shop, Nothing Leaves Stock, has either a design flaw or a bad install, why can't they accept blame/fault!!!!*

If we do destroy the aftermarket companies / shops, then maybe it's their own fault, due to a poor quality of parts/design or poor workmanship. *Why should it be the sole responsibility of the consumer to bear the financial responsible for their mistakes?????????????* I'd rather have the money in *my pocket*, than an undriveable/not running POS that's not worth taking it to the junk yard. Who ever wants to throw they money away.......Hey, I've got 4 kids to put thru College. I'll take it. BTW, I only take U.S. legal tender.









"TO post these things on a public forum and complain when people have a different opinion than your own is also silly."
On the contrary, some of us here, like myself, are trying to protect other consumers from making a very costly MISTAKE. If we don't put out the information we have, we can't protect others from the same mistakes we have induced upon ourselves. If by some chance , others choose to disregard that info, then that’s the chance they take. *But at least they will be informed on the dangers.*
And if you want to race your green turbo Rabbit, I have a normally aspirated blue 4 banger ready to go.


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (Mein_GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Mein_GTI* »_And if you want to race your green turbo Rabbit, I have a normally aspirated blue 4 banger ready to go.


Haha That's gotta be the Gsx-R your talkin about. I'm going to look at a 05' R1 Raven after work tonight. Nothing like 100+ in 1st gear with a top speed of just under 200.


----------



## happy vw bunny (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: (vw93to85)*


_Quote, originally posted by *vw93to85* »_
Haha That's gotta be the Gsx-R your talkin about. I'm going to look at a 05' R1 Raven after work tonight. Nothing like 100+ in 1st gear with a top speed of just under 200. 

The Blue one is My 4 banger. The Yellow and Black 750 is hubby's. *They are monsters. * WHP = 135 Weight = 350 That's 2.6 pounds per HP. On a track, doing 160, the bike was at 12000 RPM. So he still had another 3000 usable RPM and lots of throttle. So it should do 185-195. What he really wants, is one of those 500 2-stroke Moto GP bikes.


_Modified by happy vw bunny at 6:50 AM 7-12-2008_


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (happy vw bunny)*

Yeah now that I'm not all busted up and I can ride again, I need a new bike.


----------



## esp (Jun 11, 2007)

*Re: (Mein_GTI)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Mein_GTI* »_

Salsa, *Lets face it, if the Company C2, and the shop, Nothing Leaves Stock, has either a design flaw or a bad install, why can't they accept blame/fault!!!!*

If we do destroy the aftermarket companies / shops, then maybe it's their own fault, due to a poor quality of parts/design or poor workmanship. *Why should it be the sole responsibility of the consumer to bear the financial responsible for their mistakes?????????????* I'd rather have the money in *my pocket*, than an undriveable/not running POS that's not worth taking it to the junk yard. Who ever wants to throw they money away.......Hey, I've got 4 kids to put thru College. I'll take it. BTW, I only take U.S. legal tender.









"TO post these things on a public forum and complain when people have a different opinion than your own is also silly."
On the contrary, some of us here, like myself, are trying to protect other consumers from making a very costly MISTAKE. If we don't put out the information we have, we can't protect others from the same mistakes we have induced upon ourselves. If by some chance , others choose to disregard that info, then that’s the chance they take. *But at least they will be informed on the dangers.*
And if you want to race your green turbo Rabbit, I have a normally aspirated blue 4 banger ready to go.

I think you have to realize that any modification to your car has the potential to do damage. This can be seen ranging from aftermarket suspension to engine modifications. What suspension companies warn against using their aftermarket shocks, springs and coilovers, saying it could increase stress on other suspension components due to the car being lower than factory specs? Every modification should be taken with a grain of salt, knowing there is the potential for something "not-so-fortunate" to happen. To say, "Why should it be the sole responsibility of the consumer to bear the financial responsibility for their mistakes?"...well, you need to take into account that the consumer does need to take responsibility if they are modifying the original design of a product. That's why VW won't support their warranties if something in your car fails and you've made modifications, whether slight or not, to OEM parts, because you as the consumer have taken responsibility in the results brought on by modifying an original product. This would be the case with any company, as products are designed to work under certain conditions, and if simple changes are made, they cannot stand behind the results of their products when used in ways they were never intended to be.
That is why the consumer would be at fault, particularly in CorruptKid's instance


----------



## BlackRabbit2point5 (Sep 6, 2007)

*Re: (XXX008XXX)*









I'd eventually like to have something this crazy. looks real nice. thinkin those headers are gonna be on my list of stuff I need soon


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (BlackRabbit2point5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BlackRabbit2point5* »_










Prob a stupid question, But would that intake work on a N/A setup?
It looks amazing.


----------



## happy vw bunny (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: (BlackRabbit2point5)*


_Quote, originally posted by *BlackRabbit2point5* »_








I'd eventually like to have something this crazy. looks real nice. thinkin those headers are gonna be on my list of stuff I need soon

SWEEEEEEEEET!!!!!!!!!


----------



## sl33pyb (Jan 15, 2007)

yes that intake manifold would work on a NA setup..even an intercooler would work on a NA setup.


----------



## BlackRabbit2point5 (Sep 6, 2007)

ok so I tried posting this to the thread that spilled into this one but its locked which is why it spilled over here. Since the c2 bashing thread was started the dealers are being extra careful because its obvious the waste gate is the easiest part to screw up that can cause serious damage to your engine. Also who runs a turbo setup on an n/a motor without a boost gauge. Just to protect the consumers I'm gonna hold h&r responsible for debris taking out the cat on my lowered rabbit


_Modified by BlackRabbit2point5 at 6:36 PM 7-12-2008_


----------



## vw93to85 (May 10, 2007)

*Re: (BlackRabbit2point5)*

I think H&R should pay to have my bumper resprayed and new exhaust tips. And Kicker should pay for the glue to hold my review in place


----------



## mujjuman (Jul 29, 2004)

*Re: (happy vw bunny)*


_Quote, originally posted by *happy vw bunny* »_
The Blue one is My 4 banger. The Yellow and Black 750 is hubby's. *They are monsters. * WHP = 135 Weight = 350 That's 2.6 pounds per HP. On a track, doing 160, the bike was at 12000 RPM. So he still had another 3000 usable RPM and lots of throttle. So it should do 185-195. What he really wants, is one of those 500 2-stroke Moto GP bikes.

_Modified by happy vw bunny at 6:50 AM 7-12-2008_

wait wait wait..... sorry for OFF TOPIC-ness here...
ur a chick? with a fast bike and a fast car?





















http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
[EDIT]
also the cars that jc posted were awesome http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif










_Modified by mujjuman at 1:39 AM 8-5-2008_


----------



## happy vw bunny (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: (mujjuman)*


_Quote, originally posted by *mujjuman* »_
wait wait wait..... sorry for OFF TOPIC-ness here...
ur a chick? with a fast bike and a fast car?





















http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
[EDIT]
also the cars that jc posted were awesome http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif









_Modified by mujjuman at 1:39 AM 8-5-2008_

That is correct!!!


----------



## 08jackrabbit (Oct 5, 2007)

*Re: (happy vw bunny)*

I also have a C2 Stage II kit which I installed on my 08 Rabbit about 2K ago. Only problem I encountered was a few heat cracks on the ss Turbo manifold which Chris @ C2 resolved very quickly. Car has been running strong at 8lbs and spiking at 9.5lbs. I am very interested on cranking it up to maybe 13 or 14lbs with a manual boost controller...... any suggestions on fuel ? Do you think I would need to upgrade my fuel pump ? I am running cooler NGK plugs.


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## kiserhd (Feb 2, 2008)

*Re: (08jackrabbit)*

I think some larger injectors would do the trick. If not you might want to consider methanol to supplement the current setup.


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