# Max boost on a stock vr6 block



## Dorrado (Dec 12, 2001)

ok so my engine is being rebuilt, new everything basically(timing chains, piston rings, yadda yadda yadda) and im going with sds
im just curious how much boost i can run without blowing stuff up(everything in the tranny is being taken care of)....
what will let go first? connecting rods? piston blow up?
with proper tuning how far can i go







http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 
i knwo i will blow up an engine but i wanna make it last for awhile at least


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## mattstacks (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (Dorrado)*

I am running 15 lbs with low compression and stand alone it is all in the tuning but... ringlands, pistons and bearings ca only take so much. 
You shouldn't expect to blow a motor, maybe have to tear it apart but not blow it. 
The first to go, once you have the power and proper fueling, is the drive shafts, at least when drag racing. 
With a little lower compression and the proper amount of fuel and timing you can easily run 15.
I think Brian's jetta was running upwards of twenty and putting down 500-600 WHP before he through in the built motor. 
You may also want to get some head studs. 
Mine is, 8.5-1 compression with ARP headstuds, rod bolts. running 15 LBS with SDS and 42# injectors along with other misc.


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## Dorrado (Dec 12, 2001)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (mattstacks)*

im close to yours.....
have the arp stuff, sds, head spacer and 2 headgfaskets for ~8.5-1
but i only have 30# injectors


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## eiprich (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (Dorrado)*

During our testing of our Stage-3 Stand-alone management setup we discovered that the stock pistons tend to crack the ring lands at around 420+whp after repeated runs. They will last a while but they will eventually fail. (this of course is why our Stage-3 includes forged pistons) 
With our drop-in forged Turbo pistons we discovered that we bend the stock rods at about 460whp and since our kit brings power on very rapidly we also were making 460 wheel ft. lbs. of torque which was more likely the cause of them bending. We discovered that at around 480 wheel torque the rods will bend enough to then tear the big end off of the crank and punch large holes in the block. This is bad and why we recommend upgrading the rods for anything above 440 wheel hp & torque. 
Technically as the thread title refers to the "stock VR6 block", we have just run over 48psi on the stock block and crank and they both are holding up fine. So I suppose over 48psi would be our answer. 
-Rich


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## VRQUICK (Sep 20, 2000)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (eiprich)*


_Quote, originally posted by *eiprich* »_Technically as the thread title refers to the "stock VR6 block", we have just run over 48psi on the stock block and crank and they both are holding up fine. So I suppose over 48psi would be our answer. 
-Rich

Dam, I guess Turbo Lou is going 9's or bust. Hey Rich, what kind of whp was 48psi?


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## mattstacks (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (eiprich)*

Nice information Rich, all the information you have provided us has been very helpful. 
A definite way to show people in here that you guys are trying to push this scene forward. 
48 PSI here I come!
Dorrado, I am using a eurospec head gasket. 3.5 regulator, a Bosh CIS inline pump, and a billet fuel rail that came with the ATP short runner manifold.


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## D Wiz (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (VRQUICK)*

and what kind of gas? C16?
_Quote, originally posted by *VRQUICK* »_
Dam, I guess Turbo Lou is going 9's or bust. Hey Rich, what kind of whp was 48psi?


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## plohip (Sep 12, 2001)

For all the 8.5-1 people, how is your call off boost?


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## [email protected] (Aug 25, 2001)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (plohip)*

i'm running 8.5:1 from a eurospec sport HG, very happy with it... off boost its fine, a lil sluggish, but once i hit full boost(right round 3000rpm) everything starts moving quite well.


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## Vento FI (Apr 19, 2001)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (Anand20v)*

Basically I believe that the key for good boost with stock VR6 is "Head and Rod bolts ARP or Raceware) with a good standalone (SDS, Haltek, Motec, MicroTech ect) 
I have seen close to 420whp on a stock comp VR6 with the proper fuel and set up...


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## benzivr6 (Feb 16, 2001)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (Vento FI)*

Wow I am alittle off I have JE's 9:1 ARP HD and a balance and blueprinted block http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## eiprich (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (VRQUICK)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VRQUICK* »_Dam, I guess Turbo Lou is going 9's or bust. Hey Rich, what kind of whp was 48psi?

We are sure going to try...as for hp, we have plenty of that, we always have had, it is the other things that we need to work on. 
We will talk about the hp and et's when and if we achieve our goals








-Rich


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## eiprich (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (benzivr6)*


_Quote, originally posted by *benzivr6* »_Wow I am alittle off I have JE's 9:1 ARP HD and a balance and blueprinted block http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif 

We have found that 8.5:1 is a bit low for most street application VR6's. It reduces efficiency and slows the turbo's response time and requires that more boost be run to acheive the same hp of a 9:1 engine at lower boost. 
If the goal is over 500hp then I would agree with running below 9:1 but otherwise for our Stage1, 2, or 3 I would say 9:1 is ideal. 
-Rich


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## GoGotheParrot (May 14, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (eiprich)*

When your running 500+whp your going to be running race gas also, so why not run 9:1 c/r?


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## eatadodge (Jul 14, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (GoGotheParrot)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GoGotheParrot* »_When your running 500+whp your going to be running race gas also, so why not run 9:1 c/r?

You can run that and higher, but when you go with higher compression and boost. your tunning window starts to get very small and you have no room for ANY ERRORS. 
and i wouldn't reallythink of it on how much boost can my block handle. i would think of how much POWER can the block handle.. at the same boost lvl you can have way diferent HP #'s with different turbos.
isn't that jetta running 9's with a VR6 have a stock low end??? not 100% on it but i was told it did


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## eiprich (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (GoGotheParrot)*


_Quote, originally posted by *GoGotheParrot* »_When your running 500+whp your going to be running race gas also, so why not run 9:1 c/r?

There is only so much race gas can do to control cylinder temps and pre-ignition, otherwise we would be running 12:1 compression + 30lbs. of boost. 
We have tested many different combinations and for the street car running 93 octane, moderate boost (under 26psi) and sub 500hp, 9:1 works very well. 
For really high hp applications running 106-116 octane and high boost (28+ psi) we prefer below 9:1 compression for longevity and reliability. 
You should build your project to your own specifications, just be prepared to spend lots of $$ testing, tuning, and rebuilding just like we did years ago until we figured out what works and what doesn't. Remember that failure is a very necessary and often a very expensive part of success, unless you have someone else's experience to draw from.








-Rich


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## purple-pill (Feb 2, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (eiprich)*

WOW 48 psi on pump not bad







syke
oh yeah what are the goals for this next up coming season


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## eiprich (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (purple-pill)*


_Quote, originally posted by *purple-pill* »_WOW 48 psi on pump not bad







syke
oh yeah what are the goals for this next up coming season

Funny Joel...we have been using the Red (116 octane) for this VR6 Turbo, it's good stuff and it allows us to run more timing up top which is good for power. 
Future goals







, well I only know what the current goal is, everyone knows what are current goal is...
-Rich


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## 50CENT (Sep 15, 2002)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (eiprich)*

I had and still have a stock motor that has run for 30,000 miles at 18psi when my car was street (354whp 374tq on pump dynoed at EIP) then into a A2 which ran 10's on 18psi street driven (428whp 440tq on c-16) then back into my drag car which made 516 whp and 495 tq on 24 psi c-16 . This motor has 8:5:1 comp, ARP headbolts, and ARP rod bolts all the rest of the internals are stock. The bottom end has never been disasembled from the factory which has over 50,000 miles on it overall boost and N/A. It is my back up motor right now still 100% assembled longblock. We are currently building a stock engine to run low 10's and make massive HP we shall see.
I dont know what our fedish is with stock blocks but NO ONE has ever pushed the limits like we have and had good results and reliability. Every time we would do a pull on the dyno and the car would pop or jolt people would run and I even made a believer out of my tuner which never believed. If you tune it right and treat it right it will last built or stock. I blew 2 built motors like it was nothing. Even my friends with Hondas are making well over 400whp on stock motors running 10sec ETs. Something the Honda community does not believe either
Brian


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## Jefnes3 (Aug 17, 2001)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (50CENT)*

I'm running ~13-14 psi on a stock block
and NO head gasket... stock 10:1 comp
conservative fueling, and timing that's all, nothing special.
plenty of WOT tuning runs on the highway.
Jeffrey Atwood


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## eiprich (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (50CENT)*


_Quote, originally posted by *50CENT* »_...NO ONE has ever pushed the limits like we have and had good results and reliability...

Exactly why we upgrade to forged pistons with a 4340 chromoly rod option for our Stage3 and higher Turbo Systems, to ensure longevity for every day use on 93 octane fuel. We have never gone beyond 450whp on 93 octane with stock pistons, but we get 500+whp and torque all day long on 93 octane pump gas with our forged piston design. 
-Rich


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## Dorrado (Dec 12, 2001)

*Re: Max boost on a stock vr6 block (eiprich)*

this has been very helpful!
thanks alot guys! http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## simple_man (Jun 18, 2006)

Great thread, free bump


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## simple_man (Jun 18, 2006)

Up to the top!:thumbup:


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## lugnuts (Jul 26, 2001)

LOL at this thread. Times have changed.

700+ whp. Here is the best ET on a stock motor (turbo lost boost this pass), and the best MPH was 152.

http://youtu.be/cQftDv3e-e0



Now running stock rods to well over 900 whp and 169 mph in the 1/4 mile.


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## simple_man (Jun 18, 2006)

lugnuts said:


> LOL at this thread. Times have changed.
> 
> 700+ whp. Here is the best ET on a stock motor (turbo lost boost this pass), and the best MPH was 152.
> 
> ...


DYNO plot & specs PLS :wave:
I would imagine max torque coming at about 6000RPM?


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## lugnuts (Jul 26, 2001)

Don't have a dyno plot from any of the last 2 set-ups, the car is tuned on the track. This is as close as I have:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10152110994969398&set=vb.127297379397&type=2&theater



Here are the specs from last year when it ran [email protected] 
http://www.braunstadt.com/lugtronic/node/52

Now it has a Tubular Divided Manifold made by Caste Systems Performance, and a Precision 7285 turbo.
It ran [email protected] mph on its second pass, and looks to be going faster soon.


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