# koni coilover spring rates



## MKllllvr28 (Sep 15, 2005)

would anybody happen to know the spring rates of these koni coil overs? http://www.namotorsports.net/detail.cfm/part_cd/KO1150.5057 i'm trying to get in touch with koni usa but they wont pick up the phone.


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## MKllllvr28 (Sep 15, 2005)

well koni managed to dodge all 15 of my phone calls for the last hour and a half.... you win today koni.... you win today...


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## mbaron (Aug 21, 2008)

TireRack

progressive rate lowering springs


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## MKllllvr28 (Sep 15, 2005)

thanks baron i read that earlier today. i just thought it was really weird that they would use progressive springs up front. one of my rear springs cracked and i'm looking for replacements. and i was looking at going linear but i dont know whether 600lb or 800lb will match the front springs better.


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## PLAYED TT (Oct 17, 2010)

I want to say 600....let me go look quick


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## PLAYED TT (Oct 17, 2010)

PLAYED TT said:


> I want to say 600....let me go look quick


EDIT: they are caked in black gooey ****. I'll clean them and have a look tomorrow


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## MKllllvr28 (Sep 15, 2005)

lol i didnt think to see if anything were written on mine :banghead: thanks played :thumbup:


edit: no good info there but part numbers the fronts say 2230 1350
and the rear says 1533 04 7120


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## MKllllvr28 (Sep 15, 2005)

koni usa still not picking up the phone...

wrd did pick up the phone they told me the fronts are linear at 230 lb
and the rears are progressive 400 to 630lb


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## PLAYED TT (Oct 17, 2010)

Yup just part numbers lol :banghead: The box is useless also  
Are you calling 859-586-4100?


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## MKllllvr28 (Sep 15, 2005)

yeah i called a few times today also and they didnt pick up. its ok tho wrd got me the info i needed. i ended up ordering 600lb linear springs. i guess now i just have to wait and see how it rides.


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## madmax199 (Oct 28, 2009)

The default spring rate on the konis are 230 front, 533 rear.

A 600 or better yet a 650 rear spring would be a nice upgrade, they are only valved with a narrow window than can accept +/- 2k springs without falling out of the valving curve.


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## MKllllvr28 (Sep 15, 2005)

thanks for the input max i was waiting for you to chime in here


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## 20v master (May 7, 2009)

madmax199 said:


> they are only valved with a narrow window than can accept +/- 2k springs without falling out of the valving curve.


Can you clarify that? 2K springs?


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## madmax199 (Oct 28, 2009)

20v master said:


> Can you clarify that? 2K springs?


Sure, most of "off the shelf coilovers", including the Konis, are generic wet shock(not inserts) and as a general rule have a pretty narrow valving curve. As a result, the manufacturers only recommend a spring increase/decrease of +/- 2k (about a 114lbs) to keep the coils whithin the range where the shocks are still able to control the forces exerted by the springs. Koni does have many shocks that can do that but they unfortunately aren't used on these coilovers.

My take, they just suck(I'm refering to off the shelf coilovers in general). I've been such a cheerleader for Bilstein's inverted monotube(pss/pss9, H&R street and RSS) for that same reason also. They offer, besides the almost bullet proof inverted design that also does not overheat like the rest, a wider valving range. Bisltein inverted monotube can comfortably take a +/- 5k spring bump without riding the edge of the curve and IMO that's great. I'll stop there because I don't want to sound like I'm pushing for Bilstein stuff and I'm not affiliated with them in any way.

I would post independently dynoed valving curves on my RSS but you already know what these curves look like and I don't want to give away all my secrets yet(my exotic digressive specs must remain voodoo:laugh.

Probably off topic but IMO, and that's just my opinion, nothing else. The only coilovers worth using are the following(I have them in that particular order for a reason):

-*Moton* (yes they make a set for the platform but is probably more than your car is worth)

-*Penske* (they can make anything as long as you provide them with a used set of shocks)

-*Ground Control Advance Design *(they make a nice set of nitrogen filled double adjustables for us)

-*AST* ( they are a new with the platform and make a set of their 4100 series for the MK4, I already contacted them and they could also make a 5100, if someone is interested. I'll probably be running a set of fronts in my car in the future)

*Koni true choice* ( they are, like the Advance Design, custom made and can be built around your need. I comtemplated them for a while but the pricing was not justified. You could get similar product for a lot less if you go the Bilstein way.)

-*Bilstein* inverted monotube based coilovers (PSS and H&R use them and there is a flavor for anyone. Also the *best bang for the buck*)

-*KW* (V3, clubsport and motorsport are from street-double duties-full track. I didn't mentioned V1 and V2 because they are not worth mentioning).

-*Koni* (I give them the benefit of the doubt because Koni has been great over the years with many of their shocks. The non-linear spring rate is questionable. I guess they are trying to "have their cake and eat it too" by having comfort at the begining of the stroke and performance at the end. We both know what that does on the valving end of things, especially with the narrow curve)

If a coilover did not make the list is because, design wise, they don't work. That does't mean there isn't a market for them(dollar stores sell as far as I can see).


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## 20v master (May 7, 2009)

I already knew what you meant, your units on the spring rates threw me off. 2 kN/m is what you meant?


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## madmax199 (Oct 28, 2009)

20v master said:


> I already knew what you meant, your units on the spring rates threw me off. 2 kN/m is what you meant?


No, not Kilo-Newton meter (kN/m) but *kilogram-force millimeter (kgf/mm)*

Pound-force/inch (lb/in) is what I use (curent setup is 685lbs/in and 1300 lbs/in, front to rear). Manufacturers sometimes list their rates in kilogram-force/millimeter (kgf/mm). The 2k I was talking about is 2 kgf/mm or exactly 111.99486627 lb/in.


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## 20v master (May 7, 2009)

Not that I'm an expert by any means, and you obviously have more experience with different brands, but I've never seen a spring rate for a car listed in kgf/mm. My KW's are listed at kN/m, and as you know, the more common unit is lbs/in, hence my request for clarification. :thumbup:


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## madmax199 (Oct 28, 2009)

20v master said:


> Not that I'm an expert by any means, and you obviously have more experience with different brands, but I've never seen a spring rate for a car listed in kgf/mm. My KW's are listed at kN/m, and as you know, the more common unit is lbs/in, hence my request for clarification. :thumbup:


I found it strange that you say they are listed in kN/m. Usually, they are listed(including KW) in either kgf/mm(japanese brands) or N/mm (european brands). What was the amount listed, in kN/meter, on yours so I can see if it's plausible?

I also confirmed that the default springs listed in KW's kit for the TT is *60 N/mm *in the front.


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## 20v master (May 7, 2009)

So I'm off by a factor of a million. Damn metrics. I could be wrong, I used the KW specs in a vehicle dynamics project based on my GTI a few years ago, so I apologize as it's been a while since I've used these metric units. :banghead:


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## warranty225cpe (Dec 3, 2008)

Ive got Eibachs, but Ive never seen anyone else with them. $450 on Tire rack closeout


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## madmax199 (Oct 28, 2009)

20v master said:


> So I'm off by a factor of a million. Damn metrics. I could be wrong, I used the KW specs in a vehicle dynamics project based on my GTI a few years ago, so I apologize as it's been a while since I've used these metric units. :banghead:


I had a feeling you were wrong but didn't want to say anything . Listing spring rates in kN/m would make for some pretty interesting numbers since 1 kN/m = 101 971.621 298 kgf/mm:laugh:.


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## madmax199 (Oct 28, 2009)

warranty225cpe said:


> Ive got Eibachs, but Ive never seen anyone else with them. $450 on Tire rack closeout


Don't get me started with Eibach's coilovers. Like I said before if it's not on the list it's IMO crap.

My personal experience with them
Last year I convinced my co-driver to get a set of eibach pro R2 coilovers for his evo X. They are the top of the line coilovers that Eibach makes(user servicable, nitrogen filled, double adjustable, external reservoir with separate rebound and compression adjusters). They ended up being the worst coilovers I had to deal with, ever. The valving was all over the place, when I sent them out to be dynoed. The hardware was cheap but I still put them on the car. After only a few autocross, I took them out of the car to be inspected, only to find out that both front coilovers were bent. I still have them sitting in my garage and will post some pics in a few minutes. I can only imagine what kind of quality is to be be expected out of their entry level coilovers listed for the TT.

Don't get me wrong, Eibach makes the best springs(ERS) and their spacers are decent but coilovers is just not their thing.


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## madmax199 (Oct 28, 2009)

Eibach coilover crap I had to deal with, they looked great on paper but may as well have been made out of glass. The valving also wasn't right from the get go(big variance between shocks on the dyno at the same setting).

*The 3rd pic shows the bend where the shock body meets the lower bracket*. The genius who designed them had the brillant idea of welding a lower bracket at the bottom of a wet shock body, instead of using a longer shock that get fully inserted and welded to the bracket :screwy:.




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## PLAYED TT (Oct 17, 2010)

Now that's quality :sly:


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