# Meet Herman the German. (And gti_matt is back!)



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

gti_matt here and I am back in the Eurovan action!
Previously had a 2000 MV that I owned from 2002-2008. Wonderful van but sold it because we didn't think we needed such a big (and expensive) 3rd vehicle and I wanted the cash out of it to finance the Mercedes. However over the past year or so, we did realize that the Eurovan was indeed so very handy because stuffing 3 people in the back of a BMW X3, or any SUV for that matter, really isn't that comfortable, especially when one is a car seat (we go a lot of places with my sister-in-law and her family and they have one kid and a 2nd on the way). So a MPV vehicle really makes sense.
So my thought, while sounding like a downgrade from a 2000 VR6, was to find a '93 I-5 manual transmission Eurovan in clean overall shape for not a ton of money. We kept our search to GL models because of the standard seating. We liked our MV but we never camped in it and the rear-facing center seats were actually a liability - the fronts couldn't be adequately reclined and the rear-facing seats were always too upright.
So after looking on autotrader.com, craigslist, ebay, the winning candidate was Herman the German! (These were the seller's pics...haven't had time to take my own pics since I got home at 10pm last night with him, but heck...he looks the same.) Herman got his name from the previous owner and I like it, so I'm gonna continue calling him that.
































He's a '93 with 125K on the clock. Herman appears to have first went into service in New Mexico and spent a good chunk of his life in Las Cruces, NM. He also has spent some time in ABQ and most recently in Tucson, AZ. He's dinged up a bit, rough around the edges outside, pretty clean inside condition-wise for the age but still could use a good wipe-down, but he's generally rarin' to go!
He currently is sporting a MV rear seat and rear shelf and cabinets but I have the original rear seat and will be swapping that back in since I want them to match (MV seat is gray, rest of Herman is tan inside) and I've no use for the MV bed. If the GL seat doesn't interfere w/the MV shelf and cabinets, I might keep those in.
He appears pretty good under the hood...fairly dry everywhere for the most part. Underneath looks dry too. He is missing his belly pan though. I'll probably wait to find one until after I have someone steam clean his engine bay. Got some rust all around the battery area...may have had a battery bubble over at some point. Lots of dusty dirt though from living in the desert.
His A/C needs attention. Drove back in 100F+ heat and the rear A/C was moderately cool (maybe 60F) and the dash A/C maybe about 90F. I got the best results under the circumstances by putting the rear air on high fan, front air on 3 or 2, and hitting the recirc button. I figure that would make the best of what he had given the rear was cooler than the front and so he'd re-cool previously cooled air rather than always be working on 105F outside air. However having passed a few stinky agricultural areas on I-8 driving home, I'm not sure that recirc really worked all that well 'cause I smelled a bit too much manure, etc. from outside.
He's rather leisurely around town, but he's a fabulous highway cruiser. I was worried about the cruising since these rev a bit high but he was revving about the same as RPMs as my old Mk2 GTI and he's not as loud in general, so he was OK for such an old car. For those of you that know the route, I had to take I-8 west from Casa Grande, AZ to San Diego and I was really worried about the steep climb from Ocotillo, CA up ~4100 feet to Jacumba, CA. Herman performed flawlessly and didn't even break a sweat. I had him on cruise at 65mph (speedo reads an optimistic 72mph at that speed according to my TomTom GPS) and he flew up that grade in 5th the whole way. He didn't lose speed on his own at all but I had to tap my brakes to pass someone (truck in front of me and someone flanking me to my left rear that I had to slow down and slide in behind). When I resumed, he didn't really gain speed again though but I just kinda let him do this thing and not push him hard. I also kept the A/C off on this grade as well. His temp needle didn't move very much at all either. (And I believe it's working correctly - in general his gauge seemed to respond realistically with the hills and whatnot...going downhill he cooled off quite a bit, going up he heated up a bit but nothing unrealistic.). When cruising in the desert his gauge usually read at the center tick mark or a little above it. I am estimating this to be about 190-210F based on the 160F and 230F markings on the gauge and assuming the markings are fairly linear. When in the mountains (this was by now at 9pm at night and 4000 feet up and so cooler) and going downhill his temp dropped to about 165-170F and when cruising near sea level in San Diego as I approached home he hovered at the center tick mark and at traffic lights in town went up a little above that. I'm so glad he got me up that grade; that was my #1 fear getting stuck out there in the middle of nowhere. I did have water for me and two bit 2.5-gal containers for him from a grocery store just in case he needed it.
As I said, he's a great cruiser. Lazy around town but on the highway he doesn't so much as accelerate to pass, but he more like "gathers speed" gracefully and reasonably. Not neck-snapping, but while I would rather he cruise at 2500rpm rather than 3500rpm for fuel economy reasons, 3500 does seem to be his "sweet spot" for highway passing. The noise level was acceptable. He was always there as a faint drone, but never too loud. He also just "sounds like a Volkswagen", sort of like if they were ever to make a 5-cylinder Mk2 "JumboGolf", that's exactly what he sounds like. He also rides well. His shocks seem good and he doesn't bob around too much. He doesn't feel that much lighter than my 2000 VR6 did except for feeling less nose-heavy.
Oh and I got 20mpg from Tucson to Yuma too. Pretty good for 100F heat and A/C going the whole time.
I played w/him this morning and gave him a more detailed once-over now that I'm home and in a garage and not in 100F heat on a gravel driveway in Tucson.
In no particular order of anticipated expense and priority:
-- Fuel smell near the tank. Either a leaky cap or something else. I did notice when I filled up in Yuma I made a hard right into the station with 1/2 tank of fuel that when I took the fuel cap off, it was wet inside w/fuel. Also in Tucson when I filled up at the start of the trip, when I took the cap off, I got a "whoosh!" of pressure equalization (but didn't get that in Yuma). Any thoughts? I might fail smog on this in CA if they notice a fuel smell








-- Needs front wipers (getting them today). The desert turned them into spaghetti.
-- Get engine bay steam cleaned. Dust, dust, dust from the desert everywhere.
-- Needs belly pan
-- No reverse lights. Checked the driver's side bulb (easy reach) and is good. Might be a fuse or switch.
-- Needs better spare tire. It's old, dry-rotted, etc. One edge is worn to the belts (from a previous misalignment issue). He tracks fairly well now (slight drift/pull to the right but then again most cars do b/c of the roads being crowned for drainage).
-- Hazard switch came off in my hand and is inoperable
-- GL 3rd row seat missing the plastic shroud around the base. I see lots of GLs missing these so I guess they go missing a lot or break?
-- A/C barely there. Prev. owner said possibly a bad expansion valve. Will have an A/C place look into this.
-- Need to check the timing belt. P.O. says at last mechanic says it was good but I want to check myself and put my mind at ease.
-- Right rear taillight has a small crack/hole.
-- Headlamp pattern is surprisingly good for old-school USA 9004s but intensity could be better. Think I'm gonna add a relayed harness if the voltage drop to the lights is significant. Probably not going to go e-codes b/c of the expense and it's not a huge priority right now.
-- Tires are good but are 94s. I am keeping the air pressure up to the max for now and just being cautious.
-- Seller said he recently did front brakes but I dunno they don't seem that grippy to me. I get some scraping noises too but haven't figured out if it's front or rear. Pedal feels fairly normal though, just nowhere near as grabby as I'd like.
-- P/S fluid flush - kinda looks dirty and given all the dust out there in the desert, don't want a steering rack going bad on me.
-- Grille at the top of the hood cracked
-- both rear cabin interior lights don't seem to stay in very well. not sure if they have broken tabs or...?
-- Missing 1 headrest in back (I think...GLs should have 3 headrests across the back, no?)
-- Would like to swap front seats L --> R. They're mostly OK but just showing slight wear. Since they wear on the outside edges due to getting in/out I'd like to swap 'em before they really get worse.
-- One dash vent grille busted. There was another one with an inoperable thumbwheel to open/close but I took it out and found it was just disconnected...fixed it this morning.
-- Right outer CV boot gooey. Probably torn...happens to all FWD vehicles at some point. Others look OK.
-- Right rear bumper cap appears to have been replaced with a pebble-grain CL cap and painted but I need to tighten it.
-- Front bumper cover loose at right front corner but fixed that this morning...just was off its guide.
-- General vibration when starting him up and some vibration at low RPMs. Might have a bad engine mount or two.
-- Occasionally get a "clunk!" on sharp turns from the front. Could be engine mount (above), CV joint (see above, but those are usually click! click! click!"), or possibly ball joint or some other suspension bushing.
-- Shifter is VERY floppy. Can get all forward gears but reverse is very tricky. Feel is terrible. it's almost as if you get the gear and then when you release the shifter from your hand, it almost feels as if it releases itself from the linkage. When you shift again, it feels as if it almost reconnects itself to the linkage and then engages a gear. I dunno what is "normal" for a MT T4 on this though, given the tall lever. Anyway, could be mostly just a general bushing replacement.
-- Brakes (one more thing). While the pedal feels good, if I'm at a standstill and suddenly stomp on it hard and fast, I feel a "clunk!" in the pedal. Possibly a sticky caliper? Loose caliper? Pedal doesn't sink at all; just feels like there's a blockage or something sticking and a hard stomp unsnags it.
Anyway, that's it! He's getting a bath today after I pick up the new wipers. He's covered in bugs from the trip.










_Modified by gti_matt at 10:16 PM 9-27-2009_


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

Welcome back Matt! We love having you around. Congrats on finding your van. 
What was the price paid?
What were the rpms on the hwy? 3500/65mph?
You adding the lower 5th gear as an upgrade?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (rensho)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_Welcome back Matt! We love having you around. Congrats on finding your van.

Thanks!

_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_What was the price paid?

$3000. IMHO not super-cheap screaming deal but not awful either. KBB showed "good" condition as $3300 so I deducted $300 for the A/C issue. Seller didn't mention the fuel smell problem though







and discovered the CV joint issue this AM. Everything else is sorta cosmetic/minor really and not worth counting - they're longer-term "project items".

_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_What were the rpms on the hwy? 3500/65mph?

Yep.

_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_You adding the lower 5th gear as an upgrade?

Would like to in theory but it's lower on the priority list. I dunno what's involved but if it's anything like my Mk2 (which I didn't do but investigated), it was intimidating to swap out...too many little parts to remove/lose/mess up and outside my comfort zone. Unless it's way easier than I think, if I do it at all I might find someone else to do it...I'm kinda scared to do it to be honest.


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## VWestlife (Sep 29, 2004)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Looks like you have some work on your hands, but nothing too major! I wonder if any mods are possible for the 5-cylinder engine. I can't find any good info on whether it's based on the Audi 5-cylinders or of it was VW's own design.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (VWestlife)*

Yeah everyone says Audi but I wonder if that's an assumption b/c Audi from the late 1970s to the 1990s put 5cyl. in lots of things and I wonder if people just assumed it was Audi-derived?
Found this site for mods:
http://www.hartmann-motorsport.de/html/bust4l.html
Although I'm not that interested in modding it. It's a weekend workhorse and weekend people hauler really. Wanna just keep it running clean, efficient, and dependable.http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
And yeah on Herman, the A/C and the CV joint and the fuel smell are the main mechanical things that could be pricey. Everything else is lower priority, cosmetic, etc. or "needs attention eventually but is fine for now".


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## pwschuh (Mar 4, 2009)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Nice van and nice find. Looks like it was fairly well kept. 
But I never understood how someone could prefer those minivan interiors. The MV is so much more convenient and flexible. We never have problem getting the right amount of recline on the fronts or the rear facing seats. Just move the fronts forward a little to get separation. Having the table and the ability for the passengers to face each other and have more legroom far outweighs any disadvantage. The only drawback we have found with the MV is that sometimes (but rarely) in a group seven people, you can't find two that can ride backwards without getting car-sick.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (pwschuh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pwschuh* »_Nice van and nice find. Looks like it was fairly well kept.

It's not as mint as i kept my mk2 at that age/mileage but it's not bad; I have seen worse for sure.

_Quote, originally posted by *pwschuh* »_But I never understood how someone could prefer those minivan interiors. The MV is so much more convenient and flexible. We never have problem getting the right amount of recline on the fronts or the rear facing seats. Just move the fronts forward a little to get separation.

U lose legroom then in front. I found myself sitting far too close to the steering wheel when we did that. We just need this for passenger duty and that's it so it works for us.


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## J_Westy2 (Aug 12, 2009)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Welcome Herm and welcome back to the madness!
I wondered why you've been lurking w/o a van in your stable








Hopefully everything $spendy from the ev_update pre-purchase checklist looks good:

_Quote, originally posted by *ev_update* »_
Things to look for in a 92/93 Eurovan:
- stay away from the Automatic, unless you really need the auto
- check for piston slap(Most common in 1992 Canadian EV's)
- check for oil in the distributor cap
- check fuel lines for leaks at cold start (Subject of recall, make sure its done)
- check for rust at rear left body seam
- check for coolant leaks at plastic fittings in block, front & left side
- check CV joints and boots
- check fuel and temp gauges for proper operation
- check headlights for internal moisture
- check heater fan for proper operation
- check exhaust, especially the catalytic converter
- check for exhaust manifold leak
- check plastic coolant pipes to rear heater for leaks
- check service history, brake fluid changes, etc...



P.S. If you want to sell the latches and hinges from the little doors under the MV rear package shelf, I'm looking for another set. Wanting to make a Westfalia'ish closet for the EVWK.


_Modified by J_Westy2 at 4:05 PM 9-27-2009_


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (J_Westy2)*


_Quote, originally posted by *J_Westy2* »_P.S. If you want to sell the latches and hinges from the little doors under the MV rear package shelf, I'm looking for another set. Wanting to make a Westfalia'ish closet for the EVWK.

OK I'll think about it and let you know. If the GL seat works OK with it we might keep 'em but I'm not sure yet.


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## bigfatgeek (Feb 5, 2005)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Nice find, it will be fun watching your progress on Herman. I like the name too. My "Klaus" was also named after my van's previous (German) owner.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

After spending a good chunk of the day with Herman (got new front wiper blades for him, Seafoamed his engine in preparation for a smog check, cleaned him up pretty good inside, and washed him to get the bugs off), he might be a little more project than I originally thought. Not insurmountable, but he's got issues. Mostly what I noticed driving him around town is that his front end is very clunky. Probably needs new ball joints and assorted suspension bushings. Not looking forward to that. Floppy shifter takes getting used to and eventually want to tighten that up, but for now it's tolerable although reverse is a bit tough. Basically anyone that doesn't "understand" he's a 16 year old car might think he's a pile of crap. But I know deep down under all the creaks and clunks and groans he's a good boy.
Don't get me wrong...I like him ok and I kinda feel like we're bonding, but it's a relationship I think that will be quite a bit of work.


_Modified by gti_matt at 10:17 PM 9-27-2009_


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## [email protected] (Oct 24, 2002)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Glad to have you back Matt!


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## AzBarber (Jun 2, 2003)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Welcome back Matt. The force is strong in you.
Az


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (AzBarber)*


_Quote, originally posted by *AzBarber* »_Welcome back Matt. The force is strong in you.
Az


_Quote, originally posted by *SMOOTH* »_Glad to have you back Matt!

Thanks and Thanks!


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## borellsoffun (May 26, 2004)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

welcome back to the club ev_matt!


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## PurpleGODZILLA (May 10, 2008)

Very nice, the interiors look very clean.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (pwschuh)*


_Quote, originally posted by *pwschuh* »_The MV is so much more convenient and flexible. We never have problem getting the right amount of recline on the fronts or the rear facing seats.

For whatever reason, I swear this '93 GL's front seats even slide back further than our 2000 MV's front seats ever did. Even with the center rear-facing seats removed, IIRC I drove around in the 2000 MV with the driver's seat all the way back and could still reach the pedals whereas in this '93 GL if I put the seat all the way back I can't reach them.


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## VWestlife (Sep 29, 2004)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_For whatever reason, I swear this '93 GL's front seats even slide back further than our 2000 MV's front seats ever did. Even with the center rear-facing seats removed, IIRC I drove around in the 2000 MV with the driver's seat all the way back and could still reach the pedals whereas in this '93 GL if I put the seat all the way back I can't reach them.

Probably on the newer model with airbags they wanted the seats at a certain distance away... not too far and not too close.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (VWestlife)*


_Quote, originally posted by *VWestlife* »_
Probably on the newer model with airbags they wanted the seats at a certain distance away... not too far and not too close.

Seat bases could also have some effective difference being GL vs MV and having the extra hardware on the back for the MV rear facing seats to attach.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Just discovered via his horn that Herman has a cold. He must have caught it from Oliver.
















(Top Gear reference for those that don't readily know.)


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Oh my he's now Herman the Money Pit.
Took him for a smog yesterday and it's bad. Really bad.
Gross polluter. Now I did get him done at a test-only station so it's not like they have services to sell me. The issues/failures are very consistent really with my Mk2 GTI four years ago. Only this time one of the causes is expensive.
His HC and CO were a little high and past the max but not incredibly so. NOx was 7-9x the legal limit. He apparently has a cracked exhaust manifold (not unheard of in these) and as we know those are made of solid gold or something. His price for the part is actually the same as europarts-sd.com. Says the crack allowed exhaust out and air in, screwing up the reading from the O2 sensor in turn screwing up the engine's fuel mixture in turns screwing up the cat. Based on the experience I had with my Mk2 GTI I do find it believeable. Also would like to do a tuneup while at it (plugs, cap, rotor) and replace O2 sensor. At 125K miles it's probably original and bad.
Parts for all of that if I were to do it total about $1000 (manifold, cat, )2, tuneup, all assorted nuts and bolts and gaskets. it's 4 hours labor for the manifold (did this on my Mk2 GTI and I spent at least 8 hours trying to get that damned thing out) and about 6 hours for the rest of it (cat, tuneup, etc.) oh and also in there is a CV joint too. Even if I did it myself, it'd cost me $1K in parts and then it'd take me 2x as long to do it than him and countless hours out of my weekends. Plus I gotta get herman legal.
And yes I know generic cats can be had for less, etc. but in CA you cannot any more use non-OEM products related to emissions. So unless I did the work myself, that is not an option. Also with the experience with my Mk2, I did have a generic cat on that and it passed smog once and failed the next one 2 years later. IDK why but you kinda get what u pay for. Many places will not even ship to CA either such parts due to the law.
Yeah I could do it all myself for less but I don't have the time for this larger project like this, esp. when I gotta get him on the road and legal and registered. I can do shifter bushings, engine mounts, etc. but all this emissions stuff I don't really want to mess with myself to be honest.
Oh yes...owning an old Volkswagen again...


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Matt-
Welcome back to the nuthouse. You have always been an asset to this site. Glad to have you back. 
You might find the tranny mount is the culprit at idle.....a common problem and easy to replace. The rubber insert gives out. I couldn't find a source for the insert, so I bought the assembly from Europarts. 
About 25k later the insert didn't fail, but developed some play that I could notice. I just shimmed around the perimeter of insert so it was tight in the housing and it is good as new.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (tds3pete)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tds3pete* »_Matt-
Welcome back to the nuthouse.

Thanks! Yes it takes a crazy bunch to deal w/these vans I agree and I'm fully one of them now I think.

_Quote, originally posted by *tds3pete* »_You have always been an asset to this site. Glad to have you back.

Thanks again!

_Quote, originally posted by *tds3pete* »_might find the tranny mount is the culprit at idle.....a common problem and easy to replace. The rubber insert gives out. I couldn't find a source for the insert, so I bought the assembly from Europarts.

Yeah these things are usually one pressed inside the other and not really meant to be separated. I get vibration at idle a little bit but the worst is really starting the car and when starting from a standstill. If the RPMs are below idle (during startup of when starting motion), the car shudders audibly big time. 
Think it's just the trans mount or should I get the kit of 3 and do 'em all?


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

If it is an exhaust leak, and if you can find out where, it may be able to be welded in place.
My O2 showed no signs of being bad/worn. After the replacement, the van was a lot smoother to drive.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (rensho)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_If it is an exhaust leak, and if you can find out where, it may be able to be welded in place.

It's the exhaust manifold...classic 1993 T4 crack.







I didn't see where myself though...the mechanic said it was cracked but I do believe it b/c in retrospect I swear I could hear it while driving.


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Sorry, I meant to say exhaust manifold.
Not sure if it is cast iron, or steel tubular. Steel is easy to weld close. Cast is tricky, but a good welder and still close the hole for you.
It may just be a gasket/interface leak. either tighten bolts, or new gasket and new bolts.
Here's a







towards hoping it is an easy fix.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (rensho)*


_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_Sorry, I meant to say exhaust manifold.
Not sure if it is cast iron, or steel tubular. Steel is easy to weld close. Cast is tricky, but a good welder and still close the hole for you.

I got the cast iron one. Oh joy.

_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_It may just be a gasket/interface leak. either tighten bolts, or new gasket and new bolts.

Tech says crack. From my past experience, a loose bolt or interface leak makes the gasket flap around and makes a tap-tap-tap-tap sound on acceleration usually (this happened on my Mk2 GTI after I replaced the manifold on that and didn't torque it enough).

_Quote, originally posted by *rensho* »_Here's a







towards hoping it is an easy fix. 

Thanks, but it's an expensive fix. The OE one is cast iron. Judging from the price of the replacement, the new one is solid gold.







Yes I checked europarts-sd and it's no cheaper there than what the mechanic is getting it for.
Yes I know there might be other options (welding, etc.) but would that really last? I intend to keep this van for 4-5 years at least if not more so and never want to deal w/the manifold again. In fact after doing the manifold on my Mk2, I swore I never want to touch any exh. manifold ever again myself. This is one of those things that I'd just rather have someone else do. Like what if I break a stud (yeah, happened on Mk2)? Just don't want to repeat the process myself. Plus if I didn't have a full time job to go to, I'd try it, but being I wanna get this thing legal and registered, I just don't have time to do it myself on this issue.
He also looked for a used one and couldn't find one. Would I really want that anyway? Nah...if it ain't cracked now, in 2-3 years it would be and I'd go thru this all over again. Yeah the new replacement might crack but it'd probably take 8-10 years to crack and not 2-3 like a used one or a repaired one.
Also thought of switching to a tubular one but IIRC the '95 tubular is a dual outlet and so that means a downpipe change and that also appears to be made of solid gold judging by europarts-sd prices.
Seems like this car has the same defects as my Mk2 GTI did but at parts prices 4x the Mk2 price.


_Modified by gti_matt at 4:46 PM 9-30-2009_


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## uncommonvw (Mar 13, 2004)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Reading this post makes me rethink getting an EV at all.
There is a 92 EV with a 5 speed advertised about 1.5 hrs away that I was thinking about. Now, I'm not so sure....I'd can hear the "I told you so" from the wife already


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (uncommonvw)*


_Quote, originally posted by *uncommonvw* »_Reading this post makes me rethink getting an EV at all.
There is a 92 EV with a 5 speed advertised about 1.5 hrs away that I was thinking about. Now, I'm not so sure....I'd can hear the "I told you so" from the wife already









Local to you is easy to walk away from if you don't like it, and easier to take it somewhere to get checked out. 400 miles from home via airplane on a Saturday and I was looking for about 4-6 weeks and not finding any meeting my specs locally and getting a pre-purchase inspection remotely all in one Sat. afternoon PLUS in time for a DMV visit before 5pm just isn't possible; it's all logistically more difficult. Plus had this been a car in California, the seller would be required to produce a passed smog no more than 90 days old for me and all this would have been avoided.
In this case, I rolled the dice and I lost. But I'm dealing with my decision. Just don't gamble quite like I did and you'll be fine.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman is back! All smog-related repairs have been done and also I had them replace the CV joint boot while at it. He passed smog pretty cleanly too. My NOx before was something like 3300ppm now ridiculously low at like 44ppm. CO also good now. HC good although still a smidge higher than I'd like but hopefully after some driving his exhaust system will clean itself out a little.
Spent time under Herman last night and did some investigating. The rear transmission mount is defintely shot; I can reach up and shove the trans/engine around and see it bounce inside the mount quite a bit. Visually checked ball joints and tie rod ends and they don't look great, but they look "good enough" for now; I think my clunking is really the mount and not the suspension. I jacked up each front wheel and tried to shove it back and forth sideways and didn't get any clunking or movement to speak of so I suspect the balljoints and tie rod ends are not my clunking. If the mount truly is the culprit, I'll get that in this weekend and hopefully that'll be it. If that's it, the ball joints and tie rod ends will fall lower on my priority list.
Looked at the hazard switch and it sure enough is snapped off. So I'm in for a new T/S lever (it's all one thing). Since I have cruise, it's the pricier lever.








Tested the weak horns and both are working but are kinda "sick" sounding. Cleaned the contacts at the steering wheel and still weak. They're probably full of dust and crap, so I ordered two new horns (along with the trans mount and 1m of fabric-covered vacuum line (a few lines are a little frayed, can't hurt to have 1m on hand for misc things)).
Oh after the tune-up, his idle is still lumpier than I'd like. The tach is solid and he has decent power and not misfiring on acceleration. However at idle is almost sounds as if he's misfiring even if he isn't (I would think he would have failed smog if he truly was misfiring and the repair place I'm sure would have caught it). Is this just a normal 5-cyl sound that I'm not used to? At idle he just kinda makes a "chugga-chugga-chugga" sound that sounds like a misfire even though he doesn't feel like he's misfiring.


----------



## Seano (Jan 2, 2003)

Wait and see what the new transmission mount does to the idle feel too.
As for the horns....I'd have gone for one of the Stebel Nautilus horns. I replced my dinky OE horn with one of these puppies (not much bigger than the OE) and it's quite an improvement! http://www.griotsgarage.com/pr...ns.do
As for the turn indicator....is it this one? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...ories


_Modified by Seano at 11:48 AM 10-7-2009_


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (Seano)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Seano* »_Wait and see what the new transmission mount does to the idle feel too.

Yep that's what I'm hoping for.
Thanks for the recommendation on the horns but I already ordered two OE ones from europarts-sd.com.
On the turn signal, that's almost it. I need the version w/cruise control. I found them at europarts, 1stvwparts.com, but trying a few people parting out used ones first.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman got two new horns installed tonight and sounds much better. Also got a little vacuum line replaced. Trans mount arrived too but putting that in this weekend sometime.


----------



## luckeydoug1 (Feb 11, 2001)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

We looked very hard this past summer for a replacement for Evie, our 2003 Eurovan MV with just over 70K. Bottom line... there is no adequate replacement for this vehicle currently available for this vehicle. Not one that drives and handles as well as it does, with plenty of power, people capacity (7), and load rating with decent mileage.
So, we took it to our favorite, trusted mechanic with a list of what we thought should be looked at, and looked for his recommendations... Bottom line: new tires, shocks, tranny fluid and a couple of tie rods. 
This is the longest we have kept a first line vehicle, but like I said, there is no good substitute for the vehicle.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (luckeydoug1)*


_Quote, originally posted by *luckeydoug1* »_like I said, there is no good substitute for the vehicle.

Agreed. Actually as far as driving goes, the '93 with it's more slanted steering wheel feels ever so more like a van or bus than the newer models. Mine doesn't desperately need a new suspension, but new shocks and lowering a bit would help a lot; right now it drives like the tall top-heavy van that it is.
However I am still impressed with the power. It's no drag racer but the I-5's 109hp feels like quite a bit more than it really is for moving a two-ton brick. I got a lot of noise issues b/c of the bad trans mount and missing belly pan, but I suspect those will subside somewhat after I rectify them.
But you just can't beat the interior design and layout from a practicality and comfort standpoint. On my drive back from Tucson I was so pleased that the 17 year old seats were still supportive and far better than the seats in my one-year-old SLK (we hesitate at taking that car on anything longer than a 60 minute trip which is a shame). The same 6-hour drive in the SLK would have probably sent me to the chiropractor! Gotta love VAG-designed seats; IMHO VW has made some of the industry's best seats for the past three decades.
The suspension overall is modern enough that it's not an ox-cart, yet simple enough to be maintainable by a DIY-er.
The only downside is some of the major parts are just insensibly expensive. $700 for an exhaust manifold is just







.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman got a new rear trans mount and OMG what a difference. His front end is still a little noisy (probably ball joints) but nothing like he was. So much less vibration and so far in the short drive from the shop to work today he didn't make the random "ker-THONK!" noise from below the driver's area. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
The other two motor mounts could possibly stand replacement too but they fall lower on my priority list since there's no blatant symptoms of looseness from them.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman now has working backup lights. New switch on the transmission and some minor flesh sacrifice to the automotive repair gods (due to the tight space and sharp edges on hose clamps, etc.) was the fix.


----------



## aebad (Dec 28, 2000)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Late to the party, as usual, but glad to see you posting here and back on the EV bus!


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (aebad)*

Thanks, it's good to be back. It's frustrating in terms of the $$$ needed and when a repair doesn't go right, but I'm actually sort of enjoying the Herman Project overall. I sometimes curse that he takes up a chunk of my weekend(s), but at the same time I like having an old VW to play with too. My current daily ('09 SLK) just isn't the kind of car that I ever really bonded with and it's also something that I just don't feel like tinkering with or modifying, mostly because a $50K car under warranty kinda says to me "don't mess with it!". But w/Herman it's waaaay different. While he has far more wrong w/him than I originally was led to believe, I am looking forward to his improvement. Not that I'm totally restoring him, but just getting him back to "drives almost like new" status is kinda fun.


----------



## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I am enjoying this thread Matt so keep us informed as you sort out the things that the PO had not bothered to maintain.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jets)*

Tonight Herman got new brake and clutch pedal pads from europarts-sd.com.
I also received the following recycled items parted out from a van in Kentucky:
U-shaped brackets for the 3rd seat's backrest to latch to.
Middle seat side cupholder cubby (mine was cracked and loose but wanted a better one).
One headrest (was missing one)
Turn signal/hazard switch (all in one; my hazard switch was broken)
Armrest screw cap and 2 other misc. screw caps that were missing.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman let us down! Well it turned out not so bad in the end. His ignition coil/ignition module failed. We took him for a detailing and left him for the day. Went to pick him up, no start. Turns out he had no spark. Fortunately once we figured it all out, it was $120 from Napa and a 5-minute swap.
Details here:
http://forums.thecarlounge.net...12372
It just sucked because we were going to meet family up in Orange County and they hadn't seen Herman yet so we got him all dolled up and detailed for the occasion. We ended up leaving him in the driveway of the carwash off to the side (they were cool about it) since it was 4pm and we were due in the OC by 6pm. We went back this AM to troubleshoot the problem and I figured out no spark. Had this been in front of our house I would have waited a few days and got one from europarts-sd for half the Napa price, but that's how things work out. Nevertheless, he fired right up after the new coil/module was put in.
At least now I know he's good on the coil for another 17 years.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

The other thing I did today was work on the shift linkage. I got the rebuild kit from europarts-sd.com. Turns out it's quite hard on the T4 to replace these bushings and I really only needed one part for Herman's floppy shifter. Details are here: http://forums.thecarlounge.net...12397
Not only was one particular part missing altogether, but I found that after I fixed that I could shift into reverse w/o pressing down. After thinking a few minutes that this in no way could be right, I pulled up the shift boot and found the rubber block on the shift lever for the reverse lockout was turned 90-degrees pointing south towards 4th gear.
I think what happend was that the previous owner lost the nylon ball, didn't figure it out, couldn't get reverse, so they twisted the reverse lockout thing so that they could get reverse again despite the loose play in the shifter.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Tonight Herman got a recycled turn signal/cruise control/hazard switch (the hazard on the old one was busted off) and a new plug in the transmission case that covers the flywheel inspection hole. I have a recycled 2nd row cupholder cubby that I almost installed because I thought miine was broken. Turns out it's cracked (not too bad) and missing 1 of 2 snap-in fasteners, so I'm just gonna get some new fasteners and keep the recycled cubby for later if this one fully breaks.
I also tested the voltage at the headlamps since I thought they were pretty dim and might benefit from an aftermarket relay harness. With the engine running there is over 13 volts at the headlamp plugs, so there's really no room for improvement there. Probably gonna start saving for some E-codes and some good H4 bulbs as these USA-spec 9004s are quite weak. http://****************.com/smile/emthdown.gif We have two other cars in the household that have real HIDs and going from them to these USA 9004s is night and day and not in a good way.


_Modified by gti_matt at 9:35 PM 10-20-2009_


----------



## VWestlife (Sep 29, 2004)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I put upgraded GE "Nighthawk" 9004 bulbs in my last Mk2 in an attempt to get better lighting, but didn't see any real improvement. My B4 Passat came with similarly weak DOT-spec headlights and I had to get real glass Euro-spec lamps shipped over from Germany (because I didn't trust the cheap plastic "Shanghai Hella" lamps sold on eBay), but in the end they were well worth it.


----------



## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (VWestlife)*

I would love to hear about a source for really good headlamps for the T4. 
I replaced the bulbs with GE Silverstars, and washed out the bulbs so the reflectors were bright....it made things a bit better but still not great.








I am probably spoiled since I have Xenons on my Audi which are amazing. But even my wife's new Beetle stock lights are way better than the T4.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*

The thing with early T4 USA headlamps is that VW didn't do anything they could have done better in 1993. By 1993, the superior 9003 bulb (a near twin of the H4) was legal and some automakers were sending vehicles to the US with a lamp designed around the 9003 (Toyota Previas for example got new headlamps using the 9003 bulbs even though nothing else changed on the Previa's nose at the time (they didn't even wait for a restyle of the nose to design new lamps for the USA)). The then-new Mitsubishi Expo and Expo LRV also appeared in the US with 9003 bulbs and optics to match.
The short-nose T4 for the US and Canada got stuck with a lamp that went back to 1983 technology based on Fords big bright idea of 9004 lamps. The 9004 is a poor light source, period.
http://www.danielsternlighting....html
9004 = 720 lumens on low beam
H4 = 1000 lumens on low beam
9003 near-twin of H4 = 980 lumens on low beam
VW also had Hella design these lamps leaning towards the old-school design of not throwing much light close to the car, throwing it fairly far out there instead, but with a weak light source, they end up looking very dim. I found on my drive back to San Diego from Tucson that out in the middle of the desert they did OK actually when it was pitch black outside and the beams were not competing with any other lights. However around town, the beams are just weak enough that streetlights and ambient light drown out the beams almost totally. Since they put almost no filler light closer to the car, I find myself thinking "did I even switch them on?"
My driver's side lamp is actually almost pristine. There's one rock chip but it broke a small piece of glass inside the lamp and didn't go through. The passenger side lamp has a rock chip that did make a tiny hole and I have some condensation inside of it. Nevertheless, since I have >13V at the sockets with the engine running, there's not really any voltage drop there (surprisingly good for a 17 year old VW that AFAIK doesn't have relays in the headlamp system).
Brighter bulbs don't help. Looking at the link above, the higher output 9004 only gets you 20 more lumens. The naked eye isn't going to notice that. And of course all those HID-look blue-tint things are all hogwash anyway.
Anyway, my original plan was to get a relay harness under the assumption that I was experiencing a lot of voltage drop and I was going to end it there. But since there's really no room for effective improvement w/the 9004s after all, gonna start looking for some H4s. 9004s also have almost no truly effective bulb upgrades available, especially in recent years as more and more USA cars have used 9003s, H7s, etc.
The main manufacturers seem to be Hella (OEM for short-nose headlamps) and DEPO (aftermarket imitation replacement). If the DEPOs are really effectively the same, I might go w/them since they tend to be less pricey. However if I fish around and people say their DEPO versions aren't that great, I'll stick w/Hella. I would consider used (e.g.: ebaymotors.de) if in good condition. Not looking to do any of the crazy crystal-clear look ones, expensive hacked bi-xenon projectors, etc. Kinda looking to keep Herman mostly stock looking.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 2, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Cool stuff Matt! It sounds like you are hard at work on this project. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


----------



## Seano (Jan 2, 2003)

*Re: (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_The main manufacturers seem to be Hella (OEM for short-nose headlamps) and DEPO (aftermarket imitation replacement). If the DEPOs are really effectively the same, I might go w/them since they tend to be less pricey. However if I fish around and people say their DEPO versions aren't that great, I'll stick w/Hella. 

The Oz short nose T4's have a Hella headlight lenses fitted with H4 globes. I use Phillips Plus 50 globes in mine which is a big improvement on the stock globes. But then I also have the 3M adhesive 2millimetre thick lens protector on my lenses to prevent demolition through rock strikes - they work because it's holding together one of my blinker lenses after a golf ball size rock had a shot at them!!
Non genuine here will set you back about AU$110 so I hate to think how much the Hella units might cost.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (Seano)*

Tonight Herman got a recycled cowl grille (the one on the hood near the wipers, old one was cracked), a recycled dash air vent grille (old one busted), and a recycled owner's manual.


----------



## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

What are s/hand parts prices like in the states Matt?
I have found in Aust. the wreckers[auto parts recyclers] are greedy.
I priced a s/hand headlight & they wanted A$150. I bought a new one through VW for just over A$180. Smaller parts are even worse value & I don't even bother to try them. The problem isn't just VW but seems to be any late model car.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jets)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jets* »_What are s/hand parts prices like in the states Matt?
I have found in Aust. the wreckers[auto parts recyclers] are greedy.
I priced a s/hand headlight & they wanted A$150. I bought a new one through VW for just over A$180. Smaller parts are even worse value & I don't even bother to try them. The problem isn't just VW but seems to be any late model car.

Depends on the seller of the parts. I found someone in Kentucky that advertises on thesamba.com a lot for Eurovan parts and his prices seem to be fair. I've bought a bunch of misc. interior parts from him for definitely cheaper than new, and I have a second order from him on the way.
Exterior body electrical parts like headlamps, taillamps, etc. aren't too bad either secondhand.
But every once in a while I run across a greedy seller. There was one guy locally here in San Diego that was parting out a late model (2002 I think) T4 on Craigslist. I called him wanting a radio antenna, taillight, and the engine belly pan. He wanted $300 USD for all that and I thought that was kinda expensive. Antennas are NLA but some places still have them in stock, usually around $60 new, so used IMHO should be about $30. Taillamps aren't that hard to find used for about $40 each. So if we break down his $300, that means the used belly pan alone would be $230 which I thought was way too much for a used one, especially since I'd go have to pick all the parts myself too.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

My father-in-law was in town this weekend and he's a car guy and looked over Herman with me (I impressed him with Herman's swing-out radiator support







); he thought that was pretty cool.
Anyway, we looked at the ball joints, outer tie rod ends, front brakes, shocks, and remaining engine mounts.
He thought the ball joints were fine (didn't look great but couldn't find evidence of play in them). We jacked Herman up and he put a pry bar under the front tire and lifted up the tire and checked for any play/clunk and nothing. Wiggled the tire via grabbing at the top and bottom and it also seems tight (no wheel bearing issue). However grabbing the tire and moving it left-right there was some slight clunk/movement. Also if you grab the tie rod itself and twist it, it moves a lot and clanks against something.
The left front shock is leaking though and the bushing at the bottom is shot (eaten by fluid from the shock). So this week I'm gonna order outer tie rod ends and two front shocks.
Front brakes have lots of meat on them. I gave them a good spraying w/brake cleaner anyway though. Actually we could only get the left front wheel off - all the others are torqued ridiculously tight; can't even budge them with a x-shaped tire iron. Since I need a oil change, gonna take it in this week for an oil change and will have them rotate the tires too (it needs it) so that'll break those overtorqued bolts free for me.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I think there is another joint at the inner part of the tie rod[next to the end of the rack] that would be worth checking for play as well, you may need the whole assy.
When I bought my first T4 I travelled around 2,000km to bring it hame. The wheels had been tightened so tight I split a socket on the end of a 1/2in breaker bar. I finally gave up & took it to a tyre fitter where they used a length of pipe over their tool. Hate to think what would have happened if I had a flat on the way home & tried to use the tool supplied with the van.
The owners book says you must not use grease on the wheel studs. I checked with VW Aust & they said it is to stop any chance of too much grease being used & bottoming the screw in the hole before the correct torque is reached. I use a small amount of never- seez on both the thread & the cone face.


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Matt- It is your inner tie rod ends. I had the same issue...clanking. I bought the inner/outer assemblies from Europarts. Easy to install, but you need an alignment after. 
The nice thing is that all of my steering wheel play was gone after the R/R.
Also, I bought a set of the Depo H4 bulbs and will let you know how they work when I get them in.
Pete


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*

Herman got a lube and oil change today and a tire rotation + balance. Allegedly 6.6 (!) quarts...wtf? Manual I think said 4.8, a VW pdf I found online says 5.7. I checked and it is correctly filled on the dipstick. Is it really 6.6? Didn't expect that from the I-5, although the oil pan on Herman does seem a bit larger than I expect to see on a 5-banger. His suspension seems to creak a little less (still clunky/clanky though), so I guess they lubed stuff.
Tie rod ends, two front shocks, and new front shock donuts arrive tomorrow!


----------



## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I always change my own oil and filter. There is no way I could get 6.6 quarts into my I-5!
Just my .02


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*

About how much do you usually put in?


----------



## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I just fill, start and check the level until it's right. As I recall, it takes about 5 quarts with a filter change. 
Pete


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*

OK thanks. They charged me for 6.6. Not sure if that's what they actually put in or not. The level appears to be correct though. Ah, whatever...thanks.
Just put in two new Bilstein HD shocks in front and doing the tie rod ends shortly..,.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Finished the tie rod ends. I'm still getting a strong "ker-THUNK!" in the front end though (thought this was solved w/the new trans mount, but no). Seems to happen when turning left rather sharply and when hitting bumps, like turning left through a bumpy intersection. I can feel it in the floor and in the steering wheel. It's a very heavy "ker-THUNK!", not a light clanking. Spent an hour under Herman yesterday trying to figure it out. Sometimes I can duplicate it if I push on the passenger fender or bumper corner and shake the van hard side to side (not up/down). I'm mystified at this point.








Also haven't quite solved my idle problems yet either.







http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4629306


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Are the top mounts on the Bilsteins tight? I used my old donuts and ended up adding a thick washer to shim them tight on the top mount. 
This doesn't sound like your solution, since I had more of a banging that a loud clunk.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tds3pete* »_Are the top mounts on the Bilsteins tight? I used my old donuts and ended up adding a thick washer to shim them tight on the top mount. 
This doesn't sound like your solution, since I had more of a banging that a loud clunk. 

Clunk was there before and after the Bilsteins.
I also bought new rubber donuts with them just in case the old ones were shot (which they appeared to be fine if a just a little crushed/deformed from being in the vehicle).
The order in which I assembled the shock and mounting parts IIRC was:
1. Big flat washer on top of Bilstein (came with it).
2. (New) rubber donut on top of that with spacer in the center of the donut.
3. Mounting plate from vehicle.
4. (New) rubber donut.
5. Metal disc (from vehicle, like a slightly curved/dished washer) covering top donut.
6. Nut w/locking nylon.
I tightened that nut down tight, compressing the donuts slightly.
Then I bolted all that into the vehicle.


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## rensho (Jan 21, 2002)

My clunk was the inner tierod end, on both sides. Worst on the driver side. Love the quiet ride now. I had thought it had to be upper/lower ball joint, but the sure clue was jacking up the front and feeling the play on the front wheel. You could feel the play in the steering, rather than the ball joints. Then if you try and pry on the outter tierods to see if they moved. Mine did not. Then I just grabbed the tierod with my hands and moved it and could feel the play.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

More fun stuff arrived today.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Taillight went in tonight, tightened up the RR bumper cap while at it, and put in a new (recycled) idle stabilizer valve.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

Herman got new OEM VW rubber front floormats (I'm a smidge unimpressed by them though for being OEM VW and fitment - there's room for improvement) and a new radio aerial tonight.
However I did discover that sure enough I have been hearing an exhaust leak at the cat and putting my hand there (yes, the engine was stone cold) I could feel it. Gonna hafto take him back to the place that did my smog work to have 'em fix that.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: Meet Herman the German. (gti_matt)*

What a frustrating weekend it's been with Herman (and of course he likes to break when we have company from out of town and could have used him for the passenger-carrying ability that he has).
Drove up to the OC and met a friend of mine for Cars-n-Coffee. On the way back his front end got clunkier and clunkier.
I parked on the street (a very busy one) and didn't want my mirror to get whacked by any traffic, so I folded. it. This was the result.
























Both mirrors had felt a little loose and now I know why. The spring retainers in each of them (one per post) are gone/missing on the lower post of each and on the upper post, the driver's one let go when I folded it in. Right now it's ghetto-taped in place while I search for a used mirror.
Back to the clunking. So the clunking got worse and worse. But I figured out it went away when:
1. Stepping on the brakes going forward.
2. Occurred at any movement in reverse and stepping on the brakes.
That led me to the passenger-side brake caliper. Took the wheel off and of the two 19mm bolts, one was totally just hanging there (almost lost it). Screwed that back in and checked the other one which I did get a slight turn out of it (so both not torqued correctly by whoever did the last brake change...I think the PO said he did it earlier this year). Checked the driver's side as well and both bolts I got a little more turn out of each, so all four really were not torqued enough. Also the little M6 bolt to support the brake line bracket on one side was gone so I replaced that.
But both the mirror and the brake caliper made him useless this weekend for our out-of-town visitors. Grrrrr....
On the plus side, he did help jump-start a poor guy in an early 90s Tempo so I have to give Herman credit for that. And his A/C is now working. I put in one can of R134a and while I still have bubbles in the sight glass, it's enough to get the front A/C working again. I'll monitor that situation for a few weeks to see how it plays out.


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## 93eurovanChris (Nov 24, 2009)

Awesome story...so familiar!
I replace the driver side mirror with a very cheap recycled one.
I think I've got every problem you listed or corrected, but, so far only fixed the idle problem. Mine was a bad fuel pump. Yep. The clue was that it ran better with a full tank than with less than half a tank and over a few months got so bad that it would only run intermittently with less than half a tank. Great improvement when I replaced the pump with a recycled one. I get 20-21 mpg consistently (16-18 before).
Please keep the reports coming in!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (93eurovanChris)*

Last Friday I took him back to the place that did the smog work to fix the exhaust leak. Cracked weld on the cat they had welded in, so no $$$ there out of my pocket.
Other than that, I took a break from fixing Herman this past weekend. We did use him for grocery and Costco errands though on Saturday and he did fine and the taped-up mirror stayed put so far. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif Am looking for a good used one.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman FINALLY came through for us by being a good boy today and ferried me and my partner, my sister and brother in law and their 18 month old from SD to Orange County for the holiday. Due to traffic, the drive from SD to Corona Del Mar (normally 90 minutes at most) was a painful 2:50. Spent a huge chunk of time from northern SD county to about San Clemente in bumper to bumper traffic (from SD to the border patrol checkpoint on I-5 was 2 hours in and of itself...ugh).
Anyway, it was a warm-ish day (high 70s, maybe 80) and Herman didn't even break a sweat, engine temperature stayed reasonable. I had even thrown in another can of R134a since yesterday his A/C still seemed a tad weak. I got complaints today from my passengers being too cold.








His only hiccups were going up there he stalled 4x. He has a random issue with when you push in the clutch the idle sometimes passes through normal and dips too low and he sputters and dies. Always starts right back up though. (Maybe I can just tell people he's a hybrid







.)


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## eric2006 (Sep 24, 2008)

*Re: (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_
His only hiccups were going up there he stalled 4x. He has a random issue with when you push in the clutch the idle sometimes passes through normal and dips too low and he sputters and dies. Always starts right back up though. (Maybe I can just tell people he's a hybrid







.)

I have this issue too.. thought it was the ISV, but maybe not. Let us know if you find a fix!


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (eric2006)*


_Quote, originally posted by *eric2006* »_I have this issue too.. thought it was the ISV, but maybe not. Let us know if you find a fix!

I am thinking it probably isn't the ISV in this case since he did this before and after a ISV change (my first ISV failed so I replaced it with a used one (cheaper)). Granted, that's not as black-and-white as if I had put in a brand new ISV but to have the exact same issue on both with no change is highly unlikely if it is the ISV. I'm going to guess maybe a vacuum leak somewhere but until I dig more, I won't really know, and it's just not high on the list right now.
I'm hesitant to clean the used-but-new-to-me ISV since that's what I was doing to the first one that killed it.


----------



## eric2006 (Sep 24, 2008)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Yeah, I've been following your thread so I'm tempted to rule out the ISV. I cleaned out mine too (no or little change). I have replaced all vacuum lines (except perhaps the one inside the ECU if this ECU has that), but I could have missed something. I think that I can "save" it when it cuts out by pressing on the gas, but I can't verify this. This problem was especially troubling when I was maneuvering in a wooded lot, using the clutch a lot. I guess I'd need to understand the idling system better to find out what is doing this.


----------



## 93eurovanChris (Nov 24, 2009)

mine did that before i replaced my fuel pump (besides having the more serious problem of running rough when low on fuel). the van has never stalled like that since.


----------



## eric2006 (Sep 24, 2008)

*Re: (93eurovanChris)*

Looks like the oem fuel pump can be expensive for early '93s, but europarts has a new retrofit for less. Still, at over $200, it might be something I can live with.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (eric2006)*

What might help really is if it's a weak pump but still working 90% correct most of the time, a clean fuel filter might mitigate the situation at least for a little while. They're much cheaper than a pump at $12.95. Maybe I'll try that.


----------



## 93eurovanChris (Nov 24, 2009)

pulling the pump and cleaning the screen can help too. maybe inaccurate fuel supply messes up the auto timing advance/retard, if this motor has that?


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (93eurovanChris)*

Am getting closer on figuring out the "ker-THONK!" in the front suspension.
My father-in-law and I spent some time poking around Herman's right front suspension today.
When it happens, it's like everything shifts one way, is loose, and when it happens again the other direction, it's tight again, because we cannot 100% of the time reproduce the noises when the car is stationary and we shake/rock it side to side.
What we found at one point is if I press on the tire sidewall *hard* with my foot at 12 o'clock and rock the van really hard via the sidewall of the right front tire, I sometimes can get a good thunk-thunk-thunk going. Did that outside on the street, but after pulling the car in the garage, it didn't want to do it again. Drove it around some more and got it a bit clunky again.
So one of us got under the van while the other rocked it side to side either by the tire's sidewall at 12 o-clock, the corner of the bumper pushing hard side to side, or the top of the fender at the base of the A-pillar.
We were able to see some movement and feel thunking at the upper swaybar link. This thunking transmits itself to the body via we think via other mounts for the swaybar in the center of the vehicle.
So not having a new link or bushing on hand, we tried for a while to jam something....anything...into the bushing to take up space. Not any permanent fix but just to even see if there was any change. I also sprayed some PB Blaster on the bushing which softened up the very hard rubber. After trying several random items that didn't fit, we took three small zip ties, cut the ends off, wrapped them around the end of the swaybar, and stuffed them into the bushing with a flat screwdriver.
Bolted everything up and took Herman for a drive, particularly aiming for bumpy left turns. The thunking is noticeably reduced. I think that while not a permanent fix, we are finally on the right track now and this confirms looseness on the swaybar bushings which is very hard to detect at a standstill b/c of tension on the swaybar. The right side is worse than the left (making right turns, loading the left wheel isn't a big source of clunking) but I'm now putting swaybar end links on my list of things to replace since the thunking is reduced.
We did look at the (inner) tie rod ends again since it was suggested earlier in this thread by a few people (we had put on new outer ends a few weekends ago w/no change) and come hell or high water we can't seem to shove on the tie rod hard enough to make any significant movement or noise, so we're not convinced right now that it's inner tie rods. Gonna go with swaybar end links for now.


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## jms336 (Feb 15, 2004)

Wow, you are doing a lot of the things I did to my 93 a few years back. Fun memories!
Mine too had the clunk on left turns through bumpy intersections - turned out to be ball joints. Can't remember if upper or lower, it was the one that is not so DIY friendly, you need a big press. The boot on the joint looked fine, but once out, the play was evident, very very loose. New joints and the front end felt infinitely better.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jms336)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jms336* »_Wow, you are doing a lot of the things I did to my 93 a few years back. Fun memories!

Most of this doesn't really bug me really although the hit to the wallet kinda hurts after a while.

_Quote, originally posted by *jms336* »_Mine too had the clunk on left turns through bumpy intersections - turned out to be ball joints.

I haven't ruled those out entirely yet, but since shimming up the right-side swaybar end link bushing reduced the noise's frequency and intensity (it clunks less and when it does it's not as loud) I'm going to attack those first.

_Quote, originally posted by *jms336* »_Can't remember if upper or lower, it was the one that is not so DIY friendly, you need a big press.

Does using one of those wedge-shaped big "pickle forks" not work? That's what I currently have access to.

_Quote, originally posted by *jms336* »_The boot on the joint looked fine, but once out, the play was evident, very very loose. New joints and the front end felt infinitely better.

I had my father-in-law check them (he knows the tricks to that more than I do) and what we did was jack up the front of the car so that the tire was barely touching the ground and then he stuck a prybar under the tire and pried the tire upwards. When doing this, we got no play. Also with the car fully on the ground, one of us shook the car very hard laterally so it was essentially wiggling side to side on the tire sidewalls and we listened for noise/clunks. When we got noise/clunks, the other person got under the car and felt the various joints and whatnot and we didn't find any ball joint play, but that is how we found play at the swaybar end link.
I may eventually do the ball joints because over all bumps in a straight line I have more of a general impact sound (not quite a clunk but more the sound of a not-well-damped suspension) than I'd like and a few of the ball joints have bad boots but the lack of obvious play in them so far has put them lower on my priority list. The general front noise (not the big ker-THONK!, just general lack-of-refinement noise) I think also might be just most of the various bushings are now old and very dry/hard and not absorbing sound well, even though many of them still don't have play in them.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Did some more work on Herman tonight.
Replaced more of the fabric-covered vacuum line under the hood. Still have some to go but I ran out. FYI...if you are doing this, http://www.europarts-sd.com has 1m lengths of it pretty cheap. Looks like you need 2m total to do the job (I only had 1m, hence why I ran out).
I got tired of the passenger side door squeaking (squeaky-rattle) while driving, so while I had adjusted the latch to pull the door tighter, it didn't totally solve the problem and the door is getting harder to open and close (tighter would make the squeak go away but the door would almost be inoperable). So with a little oil (will get to that in a moment) in a shot glass to dip my finger in, I painted all the door seals (front doors, slider, hatch) with oil. No more squeaks!
The possibly bad part? Not really knowing and thinking "oh it's safe 'cause we can eat it and I know not to use petroleum products on rubber", I used vegetable oil (specifically soybean oil). Hmmm...I then read that veggie oil deteriorates rubber seals when biodiesel WVO are run through injection pumps. Well, I guess time will tell if I fubared my door seals for good now.
Anyway, if you have door seal squeaks that adjusting latches don't fix, lube the seals. (Just make sure you use something safe for lubricating them.)


----------



## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_
Anyway, if you have door seal squeaks that adjusting latches don't fix, lube the seals. (Just make sure you use something safe for lubricating them.)

I think I would use silicone spray.


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## jms336 (Feb 15, 2004)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

As far as the Ball joints, the smaller ones (uppers??) can be popped out with an extractor, but the bigger ones (lowers??) need some kind of big hydraulic press - not a pickle fork. I remember being skeptical that they were bad as I couldn't detect any play at all while the front end was jacked up, but the clunk on left turns was unsettling, and new ball joints fixed that. My van had about 180,000 miles on it at the time, mostly highway on good southern roads, so the ball joints are a definite wear item on these vans.
I had the joints pressed out and new ones installed by a local tire place (using my parts), and they seemed to know how to do it. The Bentley shows a retaining clip that must be removed to do the job. I agree with you too that a number of the bushings are probably hardened, but that alone isn't going to give you the big clunk from the front end.
Somewhere on the 93_eurovans group is a description of a guy whose ball joints failed while driving. Sounds like he needed new underpants after that incident. Luckily no one was hurt.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jms336)*

More Herman fun today.
Replaced the swaybar end links and swaybar bushings. Not super hard except getting the old end links off of the bar because they have a ridge that goes into a slot in the bar and getting them to let go of that was a pain. I managed to wrestle the metal link off of the rubber and then removed the rubber bushings from the bar.
Sliced up my wrist when a tool slipped and pinched my finger in a pair of pliers in the process.


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

If you don't slit your wrists from owning an 18 y.o Volkswagen, not to worry; your 18 y.o. Volkswagen will do it for you.


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Geez Matt.........I know Herman is giving you fits







but don't go slitting your wrists over it


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tds3pete* »_but don't go slitting your wrists over it









Aw heck, all of this is only money flying out the door.
Don't get me wrong...I still like Herman and all that, but it's just coming out of the holidays and we're going on a huge NZ/AU trip soon, it's just bad timing for Herman part$.


----------



## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*



gti_matt said:


> we're going on a huge NZ/AU trip soon, QUOTE]
> I would love to catch up with you if you come near our way.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jets)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jets* »_[I would love to catch up with you if you come near our way.

Thanks but not going to be near Adelaide. Brief stop in Melbourne, then overnight in Sydney, off to Cairns for 2 days, then back to Sydney for our flight out.


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_
we're going on a huge NZ/AU trip soon,

Matt- When you in NZ, drop by a VW dealer and take a spin in a T5 diesel.............see how the other half lives. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## Seano (Jan 2, 2003)

*Re: (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_ Brief stop in Melbourne, then overnight in Sydney, off to Cairns for 2 days, then back to Sydney for our flight out.








planning on seeing a lot of Oz are we? 
Hope you are spending more than a few hours in NZ!!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (Seano)*

We're actually on a cruise so it's largely driven by the cruise stopovers and itinerary.
By the time we end in Sydney (Mardi Gras weekend), we're just about out of vacation time. We figured that we'd at least see Cairns and do some snorkeling there since the reef is unique and not sure we'd get another chance to come back there. Spending longer periods of time in Sydney, etc. we're saving for another possible future trip. Not to minimize Sydney and Melbourne, etc. but given that we have only a couple of days in Oz this trip, we figured it's more important to see the reef this time around and save the cities for a possible future trip. had to prioritize and work with the time we got.


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## Seano (Jan 2, 2003)

Have fun.....
Not to minimise Sydney or Melbourne.....but they are places that I'd recommend largely avoiding on any trip to Oz anyway. These days they are not that representative of the Australian experience (such as it is)...at least in the eyes of this Australian.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (Seano)*


_Quote, originally posted by *Seano* »_Have fun.....

Thanks!

_Quote, originally posted by *Seano* »_Not to minimise Sydney or Melbourne.....but they are places that I'd recommend largely avoiding on any trip to Oz anyway. These days they are not that representative of the Australian experience (such as it is)...at least in the eyes of this Australian.

Well, that plus apart from the Opera House, we thought zoo? Nah. We got the SD Zoo here which is one of the best in the world. Botanical gardens? Seen plenty of 'em in our travels. We couldn't think of too many things that were that unique really that we can't see/do/get here at home. Cairns on the other hand is another matter.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman the German got new tires yesteday. Continental Vanco 2s from tirerack.com. Price was great ($88, 195-70-15, 104 load rating (a bit overkill)). So far I love them. Great price, VERY quiet (most new tires are and get noisier as time goes on but hopefully these won't), and they don't ride like the cheap concrete donuts that were on there (a mish-mash of incorrect no-name brand 92 and 94 load-rated tires that the P.O. had on there).
I had put tires on my list as a lower priority since the old ones did still have good tread and I figured I'd just avoid potholes and watch the air pressure religiously. However the right-front one suffered separation and developed a big bulge in the tread surface, so I could push my luck no further on these. Nevertheless, 4 tires mounted and balanced and installed for under $500 on these vans is very good.


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## 93eurovanChris (Nov 24, 2009)

hey matt,
i labored for hours over the tire issue with the eurovan. i ended up getting a good deal on two used ones which almost matched my goodyear "C" rated tire (195 in the front 205 in back...and yes it still brakes very well!).
do you know how to determine if a heater core is shot in the 1993 eurovan? i'm losing some coolant but not able to find a significant leak. it's the pink coolant, so, it's not hard to see. heat is not scorching hot in the front, but, very hot in the back. just passed emissions, so i'm somehow figuring that it is not a coolant leak via head gasket into the exhaust.
thoughts? how difficult it is to replace the front heater core?
thanks for any help.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (93eurovanChris)*

For the heat issue, I would suspect that your blending doors that change from hot to cold and back again are either not fully moving or are not sealing properly when in the full-hot position. This would be a matter of getting up under the dash and seeing what's what. I don't know how accessible that is, but seeing that the cockpit floor vent is either side of the panel under the center of the dash, I'd start there. I don't know how much of the dash will need to come apart on that.
For a coolant leak, unless it gets really bad so it's plainly visible and/or is a true problem (leaks really bad that you're fillng up every week), I wouldn't bother too much chasing it down just yet, but *do* keep an eye on you coolant level more religiously. I know on mine that I have a leak at the after-run pump (I think the hose clamps are just a little weak or off), but in nearly 4 months now I have yet had to even fill it up once (filled it up once when I got the van in late September and now it's at the MIN mark), so I'm not really worried. I just keep an eye on it.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

Matt, do you think you are near the end of the jobs to do? I am wondering what your thoughts are now after selling your 2000 model with the time & money you have spent with your current van. Has it been worth it?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jets)*

It's been totally worth it. On paper it looks like a disaster, but in reality it's worth it.
Or maybe I'm just a glutton for punishment.








The thing with the 2000 is that we here in the US were stuck with only automatic versions. The 2000 also to me felt a but more nose-heavy than the '93 (although the engine size isn't that much more). The 2000 was a pleasant and smooth cruiser but yet was also a bit too soft and numb. It got the job done but it was, to me, not very much like driving a VW.
The '93 by comparison, even though they're the same platform and nearly the same body as the '00, so much more reminds of the good ol' days of 1980s watercooled VWs. Despite sharing what it does with the later T4s, somehow it feels linked to the past so much more and looks and feels like driving a jumbo-sized Mk2 Golf. To me, that's a good thing.
Having the 5-speed makes all the difference in the world too as a driver. I'm very old-school in that I love to change gears myself. It feels like *driving* should.
My regrets really are buying an out-of-state vehicle that you don't really have a chance to check out properly due to the inconvenience of the distance. If this were a local vehicle when I bought it, I probably would have passed it by instead of rolling the dice (and losing).
But we plan to keep this vehicle 10 years, so after we get the neglect sorted out, if it smooths out trouble-wise, it'll all be worth it.
As for the work to be done, I do hope I'm nearing the end of the more "serious" stuff. But I'm far from done. I would just move on to the less serious and not-so essential stuff. Like headlamps (the tired USA candles are begging to be replaced by e-codes) and lowering springs in back...things that aren't desperately needed but sure can offer a lot of improvement for not an incredible amount of money.


----------



## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*



gti_matt said:


> Having the 5-speed makes all the difference in the world too as a driver. I'm very old-school in that I love to change gears myself. It feels like *driving* should.
> I totally agree. My first T4 was an auto. I never really came to terms with the computer deciding for me when to change gears. I bought it because it was cheaper & wasn't sure at the time whether I would like the camping experience. My current camper is manual & I love it, be even nicer if it was a six speed.
> 
> My regrets really are buying an out-of-state vehicle that you don't really have a chance to check out properly due to the inconvenience of the distance. If this were a local vehicle when I bought it, I probably would have passed it by instead of rolling the dice (and losing).
> ...


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jets)*


_Quote, originally posted by *jets* »_I am pleased that for you it has been worthwhile. IMO too many people dismiss a car a few years older because it's not the latest & greatest. I also like you plan on keeping mine for a long time.

Worthwhile, yes, but in retrospect I do wish that it was a $1000 purchase price and not a $3000 purchase price given it's initial smog test disaster. Oh well, live and learn I guess.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Just replaced the last engine mount (right side) and finished replacing all the fabric-covered vacuum hoses, hoping that will solve the occasional random idle/stalling problem.


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*


_Quote, originally posted by *gti_matt* »_ Like headlamps (the tired USA candles are begging to be replaced by e-codes).

Matt- 
If you find some decent headlights for the short nose T4 spread the word. Some time ago I responded to your thread that I had some Depot H4's coming..........that became a long story with the vendor that took me three months to get my money back and no headlights.







The vendor was Import Vision in California. 
I agree that the stick T4 is a lot more like the old VW van days. I have driven the newer automatics but like the 5 speed in my 95 EVC. I also like not having to wait for that $5-6k shoe to drop if the automatic bags out.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*


_Quote, originally posted by *tds3pete* »_If you find some decent headlights for the short nose T4 spread the word.

Will do. I'm holding off for now because of the more urgent issues w/Herman but it's still on my radar to get new headlamps eventually. So far my plan is one of these:
1. Used genuine Hellas from Gemran ebay.
2. New imitation DEPOs. Thanks for the tip on (against) importvision...kinda wondered about those guys. For the DEPOs, there's a guy on USA ebay selling what appear to be DEPOs and he's in Latvia. I currently have a LH mirror on order from him and waiting for it to arrive. If that goes OK, he might be my choice vendor for the DEPOs if I go the DEPO route.
What happened with your headlamps? They didn't have them in stock and they just never arrived?


tds3pete said:


> I also like not having to wait for that $5-6k shoe to drop if the automatic bags out.
> 
> 
> > Instead it's just $2500 when the exhaust manifold, O2 sensor, and cat crap out.
> ...


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## eric2006 (Sep 24, 2008)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I think I have the german hellas. My van was actually bought in the US, shipped to Europe then back. From what I understand, the van was required to update headlights over there. I can try to get some pictures of them if you need something, but I'm afraid I don't have any before/after light pictures.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (eric2006)*

Thanks but that's OK (don't need pics). I know that any e-code (Hella or Depo) is bound to be better than the USA candles that are on mine now.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (93eurovanChris)*


_Quote, originally posted by *93eurovanChris* »_how difficult it is to replace the front heater core?

Found this...instructions for a '93:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4486867


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## 93eurovanChris (Nov 24, 2009)

awesome. i had searched and missed that topic.
i have lost all the foam...slowly through the vents, which leads me to believe this is exactly the problem.
the bentley seems to suggest i need only go through the glove box.
i'm mostly worried about coolant leaks. driving me crazy that i'm not finding any leaks and the car runs fine. and of course i think i sense a slight coolant smell in the car but no one else does. 
thanks!
btw, the 5spd is the world. makes the 93 BETTER than my 2003 (both weekenders).


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (93eurovanChris)*

Yeah the search somehow doesn't get everything that I know it should (I can search on a keyword, not find the thread, and then later find it with the keywords in it but it still doesn't always get picked up).

_Quote, originally posted by *93eurovanChris* »_i have lost all the foam...slowly through the vents, which leads me to believe this is exactly the problem.

That happened to my 1991 GTI as well. I sold it before I fixed it but the heat was weak. The new owner, which I keep in touch with loosely, pulled the dash and fixed all that up and said the heat was all toasty again.

_Quote, originally posted by *93eurovanChris* »_btw, the 5spd is the world. makes the 93 BETTER than my 2003 (both weekenders).

I agree although I think that it's because I (and presumably you) really enjoy driving a stick. For those that don't care to, or can go either way, the later vehicles are indeed smoother/quieter and "better". But the MT in the '93 to me cancels out and overrides the old-ness of the '93.


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## 93eurovanChris (Nov 24, 2009)

i'm not a stick fanatic at all, but, the problems in the longterm with the auto (having experienced failure at 60,800K with no relief from VW) and the improved fuel economy is worth it to me for sure.
i think that my 93 weekender is QUIETER than my 2003. it might be the tires, but, the 93 has the CARGO and I think (but don't recall for sure as I didn't change them) the tires on the 2003 were Continentals.
btw, i think the 93 has a speedo for the 205s even though mine shows 195s on the door. i rotated and noticed "better" mileage with the 195s in front. 18 versus 20 around town and 30 mile jumps between tacoma and seattle at 65 mph.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I'm glad to report that Herman'$ "ker-THONK!" in the front end i$ $olved. I got all the ball joint$ replaced a$ well a$ the tie rod assemblie$ which I'm told had too much wear and play in them. He'$ quieter in a $traight line now (regular bump$ don't produce the metallic clang/thunk and hitting a bump in a turn no longer produce$ a loud "ker-THONK!"). Al$o got an alignment, $teering wheel i$ dead-on $traight, etc.
The down$ide wa$ the price. Don't a$k. But thi$ wa$ a job that I wa$ not willing to break my knuckle$ on my$elf ($ee previou$ pic$ of the carnage from my $waybar repair). At lea$t he'$ the way he $hould be now and he feel$ much $afer to drive.
On the upside, what arrived at my doorstep when I got home was a experienced rear defogger switch (mine was bad), some experienced interior trim fasteners, and a new (possibly aftermarket imitation) driver's door mirror assembly from an ebay seller in Latslovakiaczehcoestonlithuobia or wherever it was.


_Modified by gti_matt at 11:04 AM 1-28-2010_


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 2, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Good to hear Matt except for the $$ stuff.


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*



gti_matt said:


> Will do. I'm holding off for now because of the more urgent issues w/Herman but it's still on my radar to get new headlamps eventually. So far my plan is one of these:
> 1. Used genuine Hellas from Gemran ebay.
> 2. New imitation DEPOs. Thanks for the tip on (against) importvision...kinda wondered about those guys. For the DEPOs, there's a guy on USA ebay selling what appear to be DEPOs and he's in Latvia. I currently have a LH mirror on order from him and waiting for it to arrive. If that goes OK, he might be my choice vendor for the DEPOs if I go the DEPO route.
> What happened with your headlamps? They didn't have them in stock and they just never arrived?
> ...


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (tds3pete)*

Herman got new "ears" today. Got a brand-new left hand mirror and a used (but better than the loose/flaky one that he had) right hand mirror.
Also while I had the door panels off I tightened up the front door pockets a little (kinda creaky).


----------



## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Herman continues to improve. The last big $$$ repair (above...tie rods and ball joints) took care of a lot of his noises. He drives pretty well now overall and can actually be fairly quiet on the road as well. The biggest rattles/noises are the passenger door has a squeaky-rattle that goes away for a while if I adjust the latch and/or lube the door seal, although it usually comes back in a week or two. Grrrrr. The next biggest offender is the passenger seat is a big rattler. I think the nylon guides on the tracks are a little worn and have enough play in them to allow too much movement and rattling. When someone's sitting in the seat, he's much quieter. The driver's seat probably suffers from this same affliction, but I'd never know since I"m always sitting in it.
I also had been bugged by another faint front-end "clonk!" over bumps that wasn't bad, but just never sounded quite right (my '00 didn't have this noise). I think I chased it down to something very simple...a maladjusted hood latch. I lowered the big hook/handle on the radiator support a mm or two and it took a little play out of the hood in the closed position and I don't think I've heard the noise since. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
Mechanically he's pretty sound now. The only thing that's bugging me mechanically is that when I let up the clutch, about 65% of the time it engages rather abruptly with a "bump!", even if I try to let it up very slowly. It feels just like bad engine mounts (to give you an idea) but I've already replaced those so they're not it. I also have in gears 3, 4, and 5 a faint "thunk" just when engaging and disengaging the clutch and I can feel it slightly in the clutch pedal and in the gear lever. All gears are also a little notchy. I wonder is my throwout bearing worn? Would a new clutch and bearing solve the rough gearchange? Or maybe the slave cylinder is going out?


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Sounds like a bit of wear in the transmission somewhere. Could be wear in splines & clutch plate. My experience with release brgs is they get noisy or break.
Also check for play in drive shafts & tightness of screws into drive flanges.
Check all bolts between gearbox & motor for tightness.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (jets)*

Herman got a new washer pump tonight. About two months ago I was replacing the chewed-up front washer hose when I managed to snap off the nipple from the existing pump while trying to detach the hose.







Fortunately, new pumps aren't that pricey (pump and gasket were something like $28 shipped to my door from europarts-sd.com).
The pump is a little tough to get at though. The new pump supersedes the old pump and is a different shape, but it fits fine. The kicker is that I swear I matched up the colors (both pumps were black and blue plastic and the black nipple on the old pump was for the front washers and the blue nipple for the rear). When I installed the pump, it was oriented so that the same colors were pointing front and rear, respectively, as the old pump, so I just hooked up the tubing in the same way.
Then Murphy's law kicked in. Got it all back together and wouldn't ya know it, the new pump is reversed.







I found myself washing one window while wiping the other.








Rather than undo everything, I just swapped the wiring in the plug socket and that did the trick w/o having to swap the hoses. Then I spent the next 30 minutes aiming the jets (a bit frustrating, as the adjustments have to be very minute to not overstate the effect on where it hits the window).
It's all working good now though.








On another note, on the way from Germany via ebay.de I have a pair of new genuine Hella H4 headlamps for what I thought is a reasonable price including shipping. They should arrive this week or early next week.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

I'm pleased to report that Herman behaved himself today on a 200+ trip from San Diego to up and around the O.C. and back. He got an impressive >21mpg (something like 21.27) on the trip. Speeds were 65-73 mph more or less and including about nearly an hour w/the air conditioning going. And part of this trip involved fetching a set of OE 1993 full wheel covers (he had on him from the P.O. a blingy set of Pep Boys wheel covers that I didn't like) that I scored for $60 for the set in reasonable condition.
I also have most of the parts now for a relayed Hella e-code conversion sitting in my garage but kinda tired. Might get to it tomorrow or maybe next weekend but not right now.


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

*Re: (gti_matt)*

Hella e-code lights, if you do any amount of night driving, will be one of the best upgrades you do. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif


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## tds3pete (Mar 27, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> I also have most of the parts now for a relayed Hella e-code conversion sitting in my garage but kinda tired. Might get to it tomorrow or maybe next weekend but not right now.


 

Matt - Fill us in on the details of the e-code upgrade when you are done. I would love to junk out the stock T4 lamps. Thanks, Pete


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Will do. I didn't attempt them yet, partially because I'm waiting for more stuff and mostly because I haven't had the time on weekends due to various family events and whatnot. Won't get to them this weekend either (got a wedding to go to). Anyway.... 

So what I now have is: 

1. New Hella E-code lamps not mounted to frames (will re-use the old USA frames after I remove the old lamps from the van). 

2. Phillips XtremePower (or whatever they're called) H4 bulbs. 

3. H4 relayed harness from suvlights.com. 

4. 9004 male adaptor from suvlights.com 

5. H4 ceramic (a little overkill) pigtail socket from Pep Boys 

(#4 and #5 will be used to convert one 9004 socket on the van to a H4 socket). 

Still waiting for: 

6. E-code dust caps from worldimpex.com (USA lamps don't have an equivalent of this) 

7. City light sockets from worldimpex.com. 

I plan on hooking up the power feed for the H4 harness right off the alternator directly and getting in there to do that looks like I should remove the negative battery cable (tight clearance, don't want to hit a wrench on the car and zap myself). That now opens the issue that my negative battery cable is held snug to the battery post with a zip tie (wtf?) from the previous owner. That now means to replace it (got a new generic one from Napa) I need to disconnect the other end from the engine mount bracket. One thing leads to another... 

Anyway, so that's why I've been a bit delayed on this...wanna do it right the first time and needing the remaining parts and a few hours to do it.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman got a new negative battery cable today.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...lacing-negative-battery-cable-on-a-93-Eurovan


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

And got a set of genuine Hella E-codes.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...l-E-codes-and-a-relay-harness-on-a-93-Eurovan


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

More Herman updates, although he's been a good boy lately and not a lot going wrong (thank goodness). He's also graduated from being a 3rd car to my daily since I sold my daily and not going to replace it for a while.

Two weeks ago I installed an Alpine CDE-103BT Bluetooth stereo. So very cool to have integrated Bluetooth. The installation was pretty much a piece of cake. I spent more time screwing with getting the stereo paired to my phone than putting the thing in to begin with (poor instructions for pairing were confusing, or maybe reading comprehension > me...who knows). I kept the stock speakers. Sounds good enough if you don't have super high expectations of booming bass. CDs, MP3s, USB memory stick input, and BT sure beat the AM/FM/tape player of yore.

Just ordered some misc. coolant parts (flange, o-rings, thermostat) for some upcoming work. I have a few small leaks and he doesn't cope with the desert heat well at all, so I'm planning a coolant flush/change, t-stat change, and replace the leaky coolant flange.

The BEST fix I did recently was free. Lube the throttle cable! His driveability wasn't that great on/off the gas pedal, so with the engine off I pressed the pedal a few times to the floor and heard "crunch! crunch!" as I did it. I sprayed WD40 on the throttle mechanism on the intake manifold and also up under the dash into the sheath that the cable runs. Pressed the pedal about a dozen times and it loosened up a LOT and all noises went away.

The problem I have now is re-training my right foot. Since the pedal is very loose and light now, I have to really retrain my foot to treat it as if stepping on an egg w/o breaking it or I end up lurching the van forward. I also removed the throttle potentiometer and cleaned the electrical connections on it and reinstalled it (not sure if that also has anything to do with any improvement in driveability). My right foot aside (still re-learning the pedal feel), his driveability has improved quite a bit from a standstill and when shifting gears. The cruise control also is a bit more responsive with less delay on set and resume since it doesn't have to fight a stiff throttle cable anymore.


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## eric2006 (Sep 24, 2008)

Do you have any pictures of the new head? I might have to try this throttle lubrication, also rocking the EV as a daily atm. Thanks for the tip!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

eric2006 said:


> Do you have any pictures of the new head? I might have to try this throttle lubrication, also rocking the EV as a daily atm. Thanks for the tip!


Head unit, switchable button lighting to green (a requirement for me).









Bluetooth microphone I clipped in the dash. The T4 visors are too thick for most clip-on things and I wanted the microphone to be placed between the driver and passenger so both of us could talk on the phone. Had to dremel a few edges of the pop-out blank though to make it happen.









Head unit again with a USB stick in the front.


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## eric2006 (Sep 24, 2008)

Looks good! Defiantly a fan of the matching lights.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Thanks! Yeah so many radios now use the blue/red theme and it looks out of place on an old-school green-light dashboard. The display though is still white-on-blue (only the buttons are green-color-switchable). I do wish that aftermarket stereos were more conservatively styled and retained more traditional two-knob design for primary functions (source/power, volume, tuning, bass, treble, balance, fader) and put the more one-time-configuration of other functions (bluetooth on/off, set clock, display preferences, lighting color) on smaller buttons. IMHO too many functions are lumped together on tiny buttons that it's hard to deal with while driving. Even with the matching button color, it's still a bit disco for an old Eurovan.

On the plus side, the unit functions well and the Bluetooth so far leaves no disappointment at all. The voice activated dialing is awful though but I believe that's my phone's fault (Samsung Alias 2) since I can't get it to effectively work outside of the car either. But the radio even downloaded my address book to it and I can dial from the address book via scrolling through it w/the radio knob.:thumbup: It's kinda pimp to have integrated Bluetooth in a 17 y.o car :laugh:, especially a stickshift. Makes calling so much easier (and so much more legal).


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

My latest thing w/Herman the German was to change his coolant. What a pain. Well, if you have a house and a garden hose, it's not so bad. But I'm in a condo and while I have a garage, I don't have a garden hose nor anyway of flushing out the system, so it became a pain.

The system holds about 3 gallons total. The first place I drained was undoing a hose between the after-run pump and the radiator. Undo this hose and you will get about 2 gallons out. Run the engine for about 30 seconds and it will dribble out a little more. Then I stopped the engine and undid the big lower coolant hose between the engine and radiator. This got maybe another 1/3rd gallon out. (This assumes though that your engine was still warm enough that the thermostat was open. I had then refilled the system with water and repeated this procedure a few times (yes, a pain...if you had a garden hose you probably could undo a hose and just keep flushing the system with running water much more effectively, but I couldn't do this). I then discovered that it's not too hard to undo the lower of the two rear heater hoses, thread it up and over the exhaust system, and point it downwards and you'll get a lot of stuff out of the rear heater core. All in all, this got nearly all three gallons out of the system. I suspect the only amount I couldn't directly drain was the front heater core.

I then refilled the system with water and Peak coolant flush and drove the car for a good week or two (although 6 hours is recommended but I just didn't get back to draining it). If you can stand it, drive with the heaters on (fan speed not necessary to be high, but keep the temperature at full hot) to ensure flow through the heater cores. If it's a warm time of year, drive w/the heat on and windows down as much as you can stand it.

I then drained and refilled the system a few more times with just plain water to try and get the flush chemical out. I did a final fill with distilled water and Peak Global Lifetime coolant (the stuff in the gold bottle and it's a light amber color, almost like light beer). The previous owner used it and I didn't want to risk mixing anything wrong and allegedly this stuff can be mixed with anything. I actually went a bit on the high side with it (2 gallons of the coolant and the rest with distilled water), but since I am not sure I did a great job getting all the flush chemical out effectively, the corrosiveness of the flush and the anti-corrosiveness of the coolant I think will cancel each other out so while I have 66% coolant in there, the effectiveness of it will be reduced a little bit if I didn't truly get all the flush chemical out.

While I was at it, I also replaced the thermostat (I am not sure if mine was bad or not but I had some evidence of possibly some minor leakage at the housing so as long as I had the housing out for replacement, I replaced the thermostat), the coolant neck coming out of the head between cylinders 2 and 3 (it definitely was leaking), and the coolant after-run pump (also had evidence of a small leak).

So now I have fresh coolant and no leaks (the level has been holding rock-steady for several weeks now).

All in all though, it's not a convenient procedure if you can't flush it out with a hose. But if you do, it's not too tough to do.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

Do the early models not have a drain plug? My '01 TDI has & is much easier than removing hoses.
My after run pump also has signs that it has leaked from time to time. Did you replace yours or just clean it up?
How are all your hoses, are they still OK after all this time or do you think they may have been replaced in the past?


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## paulpap (Mar 4, 2010)

Does the flush help the car run cooler? Do the fans come on less frequently? Does the temp gauge read less at freeway speeds?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

It definitely runs no hotter. The car actually ran fairly cool most of the time even before the change, but a trip to Palm Springs in 105F June heat a few months ago and the car just couldn't cope, running at an indicated 230F everyplace I went (too hot for comfort). I am planning another PSP trip in a few weekends and will get to try it out again. Hopefully it will run cooler out there.

The fans do come on less though around here and even sometimes the coolant after-run pump doesn't kick in as much either and the after-run fan I think has maybe only come on once since the coolant change. Everything points to it running cooler so far so I'm hopeful it does well out in PSP in a few weeks.

If I run both heaters while on the freeway, the needle barely goes above 160F. If I'm not running the heaters on the freeway, I don't think it even gets to midpoint on the gauge. Around town in heavy traffic on a warmer day it will get up to the tickmark before 230F (whatever that is...like maybe 215F) but the fans keep it from going any hotter.

This car seems to react the most (according to the gauge) to temperature swings the most of any car I've had. Running the heater, cool days, etc. seem to provoke huge temperature swings that on other cars make the gauge only move a little bit.

One consistent thing about this car is that, if the gauge is right, it takes forever to warm up. I can drive it on the freeway for about 15 minutes before it even hits 160F. I do think the gauge is working OK because it will register the engine getting hot in traffic, so I've no reason to believe I'm suffering from the finicky early fuel/temp gauge issue. I did change the thermostat, thinking the old one might be stuck open, but the new one yields the same behavior.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> Do the early models not have a drain plug? My '01 TDI has & is much easier than removing hoses.
> My after run pump also has signs that it has leaked from time to time. Did you replace yours or just clean it up?
> How are all your hoses, are they still OK after all this time or do you think they may have been replaced in the past?


There's no drain on the '93, hence why I had to undo hoses.

My after-run pump always had a drop or two dangling from it after I would park the car and it also had some crusty white stuff on it, indicating a small leak, so I replaced it.

Nearly all my hoses look great but I don't know if they're original or not (the previous owner may have replaced some but I don't know for sure). My 1991 GTI that I had went a good 10 years on the hoses with only one replaced in there due to a bulge but I replaced them all after 10 years regardless as "insurance". The only hoses on mine right now that look bad are the two rear heater hoses. They are right above the exhaust system (go VW! what idiot thought up that layout?) and are pretty dry/crusty on the outside. I am going to keep an eye on them and replace them maybe in 6 months or so.


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## paulpap (Mar 4, 2010)

my 93 ev has a drain plug. It's not on the radiator. It is a hex head plug, about 10 to 12mm, on the bottom of a steel black tube. Bentley shows it. It works well but removing the large lower hose gets some more out.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

paulpap said:


> my 93 ev has a drain plug. It's not on the radiator. It is a hex head plug, about 10 to 12mm, on the bottom of a steel black tube. Bentley shows it. It works well but removing the large lower hose gets some more out.


Hmmm ok I hadn't noticed that. I guess that's fine for draining and replacing a radiator but if you are changing coolant, undoing the lower hose at the t-stat housing ensures that you get more out of the block itself.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Weekend before last we went out to Palm Springs. Weather was about 102-105F during the day (about the same as when we went out last June). Last June, Herman ran around 230F consistently everywhere. After the coolant change a few weeks ago, and also after trying to run a garden hose through the radiator fins from the inside out (the fans blocked a lot of access though - they really need to come out to do this effectively), he ran around in the desert less than 230F. Assuming my gauge is marked linearly, he ran about 212.5 (the mark before 230) and a little hotter (about 220F I would guess).

Freeway, about 65 mph for about 10 minutes, about 220F:









Shortly after the freeway, sitting at a red light after being on surface streets for a few minutes.









Yes, A/C was running in both instances. I also had recharged his A/C with a few cans of R134a and it was much more effective this trip.

Still kinda running a little hot for my preferences though. Had a done a more thorough job with the coolant change he might do a little better.

For you '93-ers in hot climates, what does your van run in 100-105F temperatures?

(Also how many of you have a coolant gauge with actual numbers on it instead of 'C' and 'H'? I notice it varies among 1993s. Mine is production number 40399 (last 5 of VIN). Some sort of mid-year change?)


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## blaster88 (Sep 6, 2010)

My 92 (Canadian) has 70 and 110 on the guage....


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Ok thanks...the celsius version of mine then. So if 92s have it and my 93 has it, I'm gonna guess that later 1993s have the C/H gauge.


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## irsa76 (Mar 28, 2003)

Love reading your threads matt, and great to see some old names in this thread.
Speaking of which, looks like I might be returning to the VW van fray in the next year. Just got back from a 2500km road trip in a Rav4 and the wife said we need a VW Multivan! Funny thing is, the Rav replaced a Chrysler minivan which we bought because I couldn't find a manual TDI T4 a couple of years ago, found no less then 3 V6 T4s but I knew I'd kill the auto!

BTW, if you are still having idle issues, give the MAP sensor a clean. I recall having a couple of I5 vans with bad idle at the dealer having clogged MAP sensors. Oh and pulling the trans in these isn't "that" bad. Having pulled more autos out of the TDI then most people, 10-12 iirc!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Thanks for the tip on the MAP. It had x-ed my mind, yes, but didn't know you could clean it. Is it just spraying it w/some fuel injector/carburetor cleaner? 

I am thinking it's either the MAP or a still-not-found vacuum leak, but almost definitely airflow related in some way from how it behaves.


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## irsa76 (Mar 28, 2003)

Can't remember how you clean it, never did it myself as I was always doing newcar prep. As for vacuum leaks, have a look around the HVAC system under the dash. Iirc it was vacuum operated.


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

This is a bit off topic Matt but just curious what sort of MPGs the I-5 is getting? Best and worst?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

irsa76 said:


> Can't remember how you clean it, never did it myself as I was always doing newcar prep. As for vacuum leaks, have a look around the HVAC system under the dash. Iirc it was vacuum operated.


 Yep, it is vac operated. If I'm ever under there for something I'll look around. However might not go under specifically for that b/c under-dash stuff is a huge pain.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

CdnVWJunk-e said:


> This is a bit off topic Matt but just curious what sort of MPGs the I-5 is getting? Best and worst?


 How timely. 

So I cleaned the inntake air temp sensor, tightened a clamp on a hose from the intake manifold to the brake booster, and cleaned what I think was the MAP sensor. Reset the ECU and the car did crazy things. Went to the OC from SD yesterday and I think it ran rich the whole way. I am guessimating 15mpg maybe. Thought I messed it up somehow but this morning it's running great again (normal idle, doesn't seem to be rich, etc.). Under these conditions, I get as high as 21mpg highway driving it sanely. 

Around town I'd say 16-17 is typical. 

My '00 VR6 auto got about 20 highway (driven sanely) and 15-16 around town. All in all the I-5 is about 2mpg better all around. Oh this is with a MT though. AT could be less, more like the VR6 auto. 

The other thing is that the I-5 runs on regular grade fuel, the VR6 requires premium. So you save there too.


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

Matt, do you feed Herman regular 87 all the time, or do you mix it up every now and again, or based upon where you might be going and the type of driving?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Regular all the time.


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

gti_matt said:


> How timely.
> 
> So I cleaned the inntake air temp sensor, tightened a clamp on a hose from the intake manifold to the brake booster, and cleaned what I think was the MAP sensor. Reset the ECU and the car did crazy things. Went to the OC from SD yesterday and I think it ran rich the whole way. I am guessimating 15mpg maybe. Thought I messed it up somehow but this morning it's running great again (normal idle, doesn't seem to be rich, etc.). Under these conditions, I get as high as 21mpg highway driving it sanely.
> 
> ...


 That's what I've figured. What do you consider sane on the highway. 120 km/h /75 mph is about "normal" around here unless you want to get run over.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

I do an indicated 72-74 which is about 65-67 in reality (due to the optimistic T4 speedo). Yeah I'm one of the slower vehicles on the road but I will do this in the right lane or the next one over. I stay to the right as I should. 

Also on my morning commute parts of it are congested enough that doing 65 isn't that slow anyway.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

And it looks like I didn't reset the ECU correctly or something. The car is sometimes running fine, other times it's running too rich. Gonna try resetting the ECU again tonight. If that doesn't work, I'm going to replace the coolant temperature sensor.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

gti_matt said:


> And it looks like I didn't reset the ECU correctly or something. The car is sometimes running fine, other times it's running too rich. Gonna try resetting the ECU again tonight. If that doesn't work, I'm going to replace the coolant temperature sensor.


 Yup, I had reset the ECU wrong. I had done one, maybe possibly two things wrong: 

1. During the process, I revvved the engine up to about 3000 rpm 3x. Don't know if that's wrong for the reset but this time I just let it idle the whole time. I think the revving thing is for when you are resetting the ignition timing but maybe not for the ECU reset...? 

2. I probably had the climate controls on before. Definitelly wrong. I think that screwed up the baseline vacuum readings. 

He's all reset now but I still have the occasional stalling problem and drop in idle when pushing in the clutch. Gonna start looking for more vacuum leaks. 

FWIW, this is the ECU reset procedure that worked nicely for me. 

1. Get engine up to operating temperature, even better if you drive the van a bit to make sure the oil is also warm Let the cooling fans cycle on/off once. 

2. Stop the engine and disconnect the hose from the PCV valve atop the valve cover. Plug the hose (I used some spring loaded pliers to pinch it off). 

3. If you can't reach the coolant sensor wiring (I couldn't), put the radiator in the service position now for more room. 

4. Make sure all accessories and lights are off, incl. the climate system. 

5. Start engine and let it idle. 

6. Disconnect the coolant sensor wiring connector from the blue coolant sensor. 

7. Let idle for at least a minute like this. 

8. Reconnect the coolant sensor connector (the clip is fussy...don't need to do the clip right now), however do not reconnect if the fans are running. Might want to let the fans run on/off once and then connect the sensor again so that you know you have a little time before the fans come on again. 

9. Stop the engine. 

10. Reconnect PCV hose, button things down, done. If you didn't use the clip on the coolant sensor above, do that now.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman has been generally calm and quiet with no noticeable issues in recent months until this past Monday when his driver's side window decided to not operate anymore. Fortunately it was stuck in the "up" position. Long story short, it was a broken wire (fairly common problem). It wasn't readily obvious to me from just looking inside the rubber boot between the body and the door because it broke a little further into the door. Didn't find it until I had removed the door panel and did some testing with a meter and found no continuity on one of the two wires for the PW motor. If you follow the wire colors (one black w/red, one brown w/red) into the car, you find they connect to another connector above the fuse/relay panel. So I disconnected that and then tested for continuity between the door end of things and the car end of things. One wire didn't have continuity, so I looked closer and found the broken wire in the door. Spliced it up with a butt splice connector and working great now. Also lubed the window regulator track with some silicone paste while I was in there. 

And speaking of quiet, I've been exorcising as many squeaks and rattles as I can find. He's now about as quiet as my '00 was, believe it or not. The key not only is finding loose fasteners and screws, but also lubricating things. More noises than I thought were coming from noisy joints, etc. I spritzed some WD40 into the hinges of the second row seat (where it folds flat) and put a little silicone paste on the mushroom bolts on the floor that anchor the seat. Squeaky rattles from that are now gone. Anything that latched also got some grease or silicone lube. 3rd row seatback latches, all door latches, tailgate latch. I also removed both front door handles and lubricated the inside of the door latches as well. The passenger one in particular was awful. I'd get a relentless squawking from that door that drove me bananas. Adjusted the latch to pull the door in tighter, no change. Lubed the door seal with silicone paste, no change. The culprit was the latch. 18 years of drying out and dirt meant that the slightest movement of the door from vibration, etc. made the latch squawk. The worst rattle I have now is the passenger seat (the nylon slider guides on both front seats are a bit worn and when unoccupied the seat bottom rattles) but I don't have a solution for that. My other few rattles are the slider (some trim piece there is buzzy) and the front brake calipers (probably worn caliper guide pins, causing a muted clunk over bumps, the slightest braking action stops it, confirming it's the calipers/pads). But most other rattles are now gone.:thumbup:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman decided to give up access to R, 1, 2, and 5 today. Only can get gears 3 and 4. Shifter linkage at the transmission end started falling apart. I got the bag of bushings in the glovebox and just hadn't done anything with it yet. No more procrastinating now I guess and looks like i have a little project for Sunday afternoon.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Looks like it's the large nylon bushing that the small ball on the 'T' goes in completely gave out. Not a huge deal...I even have the part...but just a pain to reach in there 'cause it's so tight (coolant hoses, etc.) to get the fingers in there to work it.


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

Matt, my experience with the nylon shifter balls is that it's the same one you're having issues with; take a look on the tranny end and see if there's not a nut/bolt(s) that you can loosen to allow you to move the metal ball to a more favorable position for you to pop the ball over.

Failing that, you could always resort to violating child labor laws.


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## Seano (Jan 2, 2003)

Perhaps you should do the short shift conversion whilst you are under there. The how to is on the Brickwerks forum in the UK from memory


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

I messed with it for an hour yesterday and gave up. Yes there are two nuts holding the bushing's bracket but they looked equally difficult to access. The issue is pressing the bushing into the bracket that holds it and also pressing the ball into the bushing. Seeing as I also have to access (unrelated issue) the shift housing to get my busted backup lamp switch out (it broke off 1/2 in there)) and it's all tight down there, I took the car to my favorite indie shop to have a crack at it. I was kinda fed up and hit that "pay for convenience" limit yesterday with it all.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Thought I'd share a little story about how well Herman did for a trip to the desert last weekend.

We went from SD to Palm Springs for the 2011 Tour de Palm Springs bike ride.

On the trip out we got caught up in 90 minutes of bumper to bumper traffic in this mess at 3pm on a Friday afternoon:









Herman heated up a bit and it was a warm-ish day (had his A/C on) but he came through just fine and didn't overheat.

He performed well all weekend in the desert and on the way back we drove the "Palms to Pines" highway 74 from Palm Desert to I-15 via Anza and Temecula. For those not familiar with it, here's a stretch of it called "The Seven Level Hill":










Now we came *up* that stretch and it's the kind of hill that they put up signs warning to turn off your A/C to avoid overheating. It was a warm-ish day (about 82F at least, maybe more) so we did see how far we could go leaving it on. Herman chugged right up that hill full of esses and switchbacks with the A/C going and he barely broke a sweat. Got a bit warm near the top but I had shut off the A/C by then since the ambient temperature dropped as we reached the higher elevations. He chugged right up that hill in 4th and even 5th gear at a lazy-ish 2000-2500rpm. The engine never bogged and he never lost speed (I only had to slow down for some of those hairpin turns) and traffic didn't pile up behind him either.:thumbup:

The AAF engine continues to impress me. While it's definitely agricultural in sound, its ability to pull so well at low RPMs is amazing given that it's not a very big engine saddled with two tons of weight. VW did a great job on the gearbox for making the most of what the engine offers, although I still take issue with 5th gear being so short. I would gladly downshift to 4th for the power if I could cruise in 5th about 900 rpms lower.

At least half of the trip was driving w/the A/C on since it was a bit warm that weekend and also since we were in the desert. Despite the b2b traffic and running the A/C and going over this mountain on the way back, he still managed 18.7mpg overall. I don't think I would have gotten that with my previous VR6 auto.

Near the end of the most recent tankful (about 1-2 gallons left in the tank), I dumped in a bottle of Seafoam. Usually when used in the tank, you put it in a full tank, but I wanted to really make sure it did some good cleaning, so in the 1-2 gallons it was fairly concentrated. I drove about 10 miles like that on city and highway driving and then filled him up. That 10 miles I suspect did some good injector cleaning because he sure seems to run like a scared rabbit now. Not that he was slow before at all but seems he now has an extra kick in the pants. Despite the issues of neglect that I had to deal with during the first year of ownership of Herman, his engine seems to run strong as it ever has.

On the downside though, about a week ago the backlight behind the clock in the instrument cluster decided to burn out. :-(


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman started acting up a little bit last week and more consistently tonight. He was sometimes hesitating and losing power when coming off idle and accelerating. Today, I cleaned his spark plugs (they are about 1.5 years old) and found they looked quite good, although the last set that was put in were Bosch Platinum ones and I wasn't too happy about that but whenever they're done I'll replace them with something else. Gap on all of them were about 0.032-0.033 which IIRC sounds acceptable although I couldn't locate the specs offhand.

But then tonight he started more hesitation and a little faster idle. Just cleaning the plugs shouldn't do that. He also was running a bit rich judging from the exhaust smell when I pulled him into the garage tonight.

So I thought about it a bit and checked the coolant temperature sensor wiring. I'm no Digifant expert but it seems that 4 out of 5 times that I've had issues with my Digifant vehicles running rich it's been the CTS or the wiring associated with it. A previous owner had done some repair to the CTS wiring, as it was wrapped near the connector in duct tape (WTF?). I pulled the tape off and sure enough there was a broken wire inside. What kind of silly repair was that? It was broken right at the connector so there's nothing hanging out to work with really. It all was probably barely hanging together and when I cleaned the spark plugs I must have disturbed it just enough to break the connection. I dug around in the garage in my potpourri of electrical connectors and was able to rig up something temporary until I can get to VW and pick up one of their wiring repair things (basically an overpriced piece of wire with the correct terminals on it that pops into the various VW connectors). Fired him up and just drove him around the parking garage and he seems better so far (idling normal) with my temporary fix.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So my above coolant temperature sensor wiring fix (since the above fix I have made a better permanent fix) may have done a VERY good thing. The wiring may have been flaky for a long time. Today I went from SD to Long Beach and back again, about 90% highway driving. 22.4 (!) mpg. I also recently cleaned the spark plugs and rotated my tires so the fronts are a tad meatier than the back and the PSI right now on all of them are probably 3-5PSI higher than the PSI on the door sticker, but I am very pleased with that number. I have never gotten that in a T4 before (my '93 does get slightly better MPG than the 2000 VR6 auto did but this is a new record for the '93 for me).


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman made Google street view. This was from about 7-8 months ago that I pulled in behind the google car and it was recently posted up.









Link to actual street view in case you're really dying to get some more views of Herman.
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=5208+...117.184268&z=17&panoid=SBGEMY6fNF-J6HjfferMQQ


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## borellsoffun (May 26, 2004)

Herman's famous now! Maybe a Hollywood producer will come calling


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

He's famous and cranky. Right now he's over by my brother-in-law's house because he decided he didn't feel like shifting into anything but 3 or 4. Something at the shifter base doesn't look like it's moving correctly. Will look at it more this weekend.

These high-maintenance celebrities....sheesh.


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## paredown (Oct 5, 2005)

I've been following your adventures with Herman the German, while looking for an MV of my own.

Did you see this long link on Bentley Forums about idle problems--eventually (long thread) he narrowed it down to a bad ECU--but the trouble shooting reminded me of some of what you have been through.

The idling symptoms sounded similar to the ones you have been having.

HTH,
dean


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

gti_matt said:


> He's famous and cranky. Right now he's over by my brother-in-law's house because he decided he didn't feel like shifting into anything but 3 or 4. Something at the shifter base doesn't look like it's moving correctly. Will look at it more this weekend.
> 
> These high-maintenance celebrities....sheesh.


This turned out to be simple. The clamp on the shift rod was loose. It's actually my fault. I had tried adjusting it a few weeks ago to solve the tendency to block 1st gear and I didn't tighten it enough and it came loose enough such that side to side movement of the shifter didn't translate to proper pivoting of the rod beneath it.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

paredown said:


> I've been following your adventures with Herman the German, while looking for an MV of my own.
> 
> Did you see this long link on Bentley Forums about idle problems--eventually (long thread) he narrowed it down to a bad ECU--but the trouble shooting reminded me of some of what you have been through.
> 
> ...


Yes thanks I have seen that thread. It's in the back of my mind that the ECU might be the culprit. However I do have the allegedly crap Bosch Platinum plugs in there now and a new set of better ones to go in and so I'm just trying to find the time (and motiviation) for that. If that isn't it, I might attack the ECU, if anything just to see what the MAP sensor looks like. And if nothing good comes of that, I'll replace the ECU. Just kinda trying to eliminate a few other possibilities first.

Today (after I got the shifter fixed, he stalled about 6x on me...all during the warmup period. During that time when he comes off the cold/fast idle and before about 160F on the gauge his idle is very low and stumbles and stalls when coming to a stop. He also stalled once when warm but I had the A/C on which aggravates the problem although usually when the A/C isn't on and he's warmed up his idle is nice and solid at about 750rpm. That warmup period is where he as most of the problems.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Threw in some new plugs today since it had the Bosch Platinums that everyone seems to hate. Runs the same thoughincluding low idle during the warmup period and stalling during warmup (warm idle still generally good and stalls a lot less when warm).


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## EuroDub93 (Jul 22, 2011)

I am wondering, what if you do find oil in the distributor cap? Noticed some in mine when I did my last tune up. One more thing to spend money on I guess....:facepalm:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EuroDub93 said:


> I am wondering, what if you do find oil in the distributor cap? Noticed some in mine when I did my last tune up. One more thing to spend money on I guess....:facepalm:


Hoepfully just some oil that weeped from the valve cover gasket? I say clean it out and see what happens. If it takes a long time to build up, might just not worry about it.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman was a good boy today and passed his smog test. I was worried because of all the grief 2 years ago but he's doing quite well.

15mph
HC(PPM) Max 86, Avg 18, Meas 37 (40 2 years ago)..decreased
CO% Max .6, avg .05, Meas .1 (.03 2 years ago)...increased
NO(PPM) Max 494, avg 149, Meas 156 (33 2 years ago)...increased

25mph

HC(PPM) Max 51, Avg 12, Meas 16 (42 2 years ago)..decreased
CO% Max .73, avg .04, Meas .01 (.03 2 years ago)...decreased
NO(PPM) Max 747, avg 144, Meas 14 (14 2 years ago)...same

Overall the numbers look pretty good and I'm not worried. Doesn't look like he's deteriorating quickly or anything like that as most of the numbers were not hugely different.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Had probably about 80% success with Herman's idle problems and I wasn't even the one that did it.

I took Herman in for an oil change on Friday to my usual place. Dropped him off the night before and so he sat overnight. When they started him up the next morning to drive him in, they noticed his terrible low idle, stalling, etc. and took him around the block a few times and he stalled on them at least 2x. So they did the oil change and gave me a call. Suggested a few things (that I had already done like spark plugs, cap and rotor, etc.) and then suggested cleaning the throttle body. I had never done it, so sure what the heck. Called later in the afternoon to tell me he was ready and that they thought I'd be impressed with the changes. Said the low idle came up a good 150 rpm or so and hadn't stalled on them.

Well, well, well. What an improvement! The idle is indeed where it should be at nearly all times. Throttle response from closed-throttle to open-throttle is much smoother and he's esier to drive smoother. From cold to fully warm his idle is very good and smooth.

Is he totally fixed? No. While he's great most of the time, having the A/C on still confuses him. I may very well have two idle problems (A/C on vs. off) and the "off" was fixed. With the A/C on, the idle occasionally dips below normal and at other times even when the engine is revving up there, pushing in the clutch after decelerating is like someone turned him off, as the revs fall on the tach much faster and then he dies.

But overall he's doing much much better. I am thinking now I have to find out what about the A/C being on should be kicking up the idle a little bit, but possibly isn't.

I did, just for the fun of it, did a smoke test with an incense stick and found no obvious leaks. Cleaned his ISV (but wasn't very dirty) and cleaned the ground connection for the ECU (not very dirty but can't hurt to clean it).


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

I only have one petrol/gas car, a VW Polo. The cleaning of the throttle body comes up quite regularly on the Polo Club forum in the UK that I read. I spoke to a friend who is a mechanic & he said that cleaning the throttle body is something that should be done on a regular basis, or at the very least, inspected.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Just bought one of these on ebay.

http://www.drapertools.com/b2c/b2citmdsp.pgm?pp_skmno=68081&ipadd=










All of $13.02 USD total shipped. It appears to be a code reader compatible with the 2x2 connectors (and presumably Digifant 1). For those of us with a 49-state Eurovan with no "check engine" light to blink out codes, this looks like it'll do it.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Replaced the clock backlight in the instrument cluster today. Uneventful.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5235666


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

Matt, lemme know if you ever decide to resolder all the [email protected]#$%^& legs on the PCB of your instrument cluster. I thought I'd revisit that special rebonding moment with mine and apparently cross-mojonated (as Austin Powers would say) a trace or two because now instead of an intermittent coolant level LED flashing, I've got it and the oil pressure/level LED on all the time, and the clock went on vacation. :banghead: But, on the plus side, all the instruments are working great. :screwy:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Gotta love these clusters huh? They are so similar to B3 and B4 Passat clusters; wonder if Passat owners have the same gauge problems?


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## irsa76 (Mar 28, 2003)

Just had a thought, at the dealer we used to use Subaru upper cylinder cleaner on cars which were running rough, it was actually an official VW Australia procedure! Have been told it's similar to seafoam if that's any help. 
As for poor idle when A/C on, the Australian A/C kits used an idle up solenoid iirc. Sounds like either yours is bad or you don't actually have one, not sure since the Aussie system was very different to the factory fit A/C.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

I have done the Seafoam thing before (2 years ago) but it went through the stalling behavior off and on the whole time. The throttle body cleaning seems to have been the one thing that made the most difference.

The stalling when A/C is on seems to be a tad random although so far he's only done it once since the TB cleaning and I've used the A/C many more times. The idle does actually go up when the A/C is switched on so it is working (unless it's intermittently working?) at least some of the time.

Offhand I don't recall what on the Eurovan 2.5 AAF kicks up the idle when the A/C is on; I'll have to find wiring diagrams or study the Bentley (don't currently have one). Offhand I suspect it might kick up the voltage to the idle air valve so that it gives more air which in turn the ECU should sense and kick in with longer times that it keeps the injectors open, this increasing idle speed. But that's just a guess on my part as to how it works. When it does stall w/the A/C on and I'm coming off coasting in gear with throttle closed, the revs drop really fast as if the engine was just switched off; it's not like they fall normally and just continue to fall past idle.

The past two days or so, he's had an increased idle when warming up and when warm so I have almost the opposite problem.:banghead: He did fine for the 10 days or so since the TB cleaning. Now, he behaves until about a little after the temperature gauge gets up past the white area. His idle at first (cold) is a touch high as it should be, then he warms up a little and it settles to a nice 750rpm or so, but then shortly after the gauge gets out of the white (so a little shy of 160F), he suddenly starts idling at about 1100 rpm and it also occasionally lopes up and down a bit between normal and 1100.:banghead::banghead::banghead:


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> The past two days or so, he's had an increased idle when warming up and when warm so I have almost the opposite problem.:banghead: He did fine for the 10 days or so since the TB cleaning. Now, he behaves until about a little after the temperature gauge gets up past the white area. His idle at first (cold) is a touch high as it should be, then he warms up a little and it settles to a nice 750rpm or so, but then shortly after the gauge gets out of the white (so a little shy of 160F), he suddenly starts idling at about 1100 rpm and it also occasionally lopes up and down a bit between normal and 1100.:banghead::banghead::banghead:


I haven't reread your thread, but have you changed the coolant temp sensor that gives an input to the ECU?
Have you seen this before? Might be of some help to you or others with a '93.https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=5f6718f4449e755e&sc=documents&id=5F6718F4449E755E!227


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Yes, changed the coolant sensor about 2 months ago and reset ECU. No change. Thanks for the link though to that zip file, lots of good info in there.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Cleaned the ISV a little more thoroughly today, reset and readapted the ECU:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5442640

The hose inside the ECU to the MAP looked fine to me.

After the reset, he briefly went through a period of a few minutes of idling at about 1100rpm, loped up and down a little bit, but then after the next engine restart he was fine. Idles at about 750rpm now. Who knows...in a week or so he might decide to idle faster again. These things seem to have a mind of their own.:screwy:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

gti_matt said:


> Just bought one of these on ebay.
> 
> http://www.drapertools.com/b2c/b2citmdsp.pgm?pp_skmno=68081&ipadd=
> 
> ...


This thing arrived last week and so far it's not working for me. It's either defective or it's not compatible with the T4. The T4 wasn't listed among the years/models on the box but the manual inside mentions Digifant, which the T4 is, but I can't even get it to blink out the expected 2312 for the coolant sensor (which I should have gotten from my ECU adaptive procedure) nor will it even blink out 4444 (no faults) for me. Oh well.


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

Can you try it on a, I dunno, some generic MkII Golf or Jetta to see if it spits anything out? Well, you know, some other Digifant engine? Maybe it just needs some small adaptation to be hip with T4s?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

I thought about that but I don't have a nearby volunteer/guinea pig Digifant Mk2.

Also wouldn't mind testing it out with a Motronic 2.0 16V of 1990-1995 vintage because if it doesn't work with the T4, I still want to know what OBD1 USA cars it works with because I would want to just turn around and sell it (don't need a useless-to-me code reader sitting around).


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

We've got a 2.0 16v Motronic in the form of a GLI that you can use as a guinea pig, but we're not exactly neighbors.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Good and bad with Herman this week.

Good:
Left rear shock was groaning and driving me nuts. Long story short, these were the no-name ones that came with the VMaxx lowering kit that I got as a "tester". I got two new Bilstein HDs from Europarts and they went in day before yesterday. I also reinstalled a pair of front Bilsten HDs that I had on the car for about 10K miles before I got the VMaxx kit. The car rides firmer and not as bouncy as with the VMaxx ones. The ride also seem quieter. When I took the front ones off from VMaxx, the upper rubber donuts (a little different from stock) were already splitting after just 10K miles of use.:thumbdown: So it's "good" in that I'm very happy with the results.

Bad:
Herman threw his timing belt tonight.:banghead: Got towed to my favorite repair place and I guess I'll hear how bad in the morning I guess. It was fairly undramatic really. I was accelerating onto the freeway kinda hard actually since it was from a standstill at one of those on-ramp signal controls and was just about up to speed and revving kinda hard, about to go from 4th to 5th and he suddenly just shut off. Instantly I thought timing belt and after he was towed I popped the hood and sure enough, no belt. I have heard conflicting stories that these engines are non-interference on the AAF version and OMG I hope I have heard right because others say they are interference, I guess if there's some valve play/float and maybe if any carbon buildup that reduces any gaps (although he is pretty clean AFAIK inside) that the valves and pistons might have met. I can only say that I didn't try to restart him at all and I shoved in the clutch immediately, revs dropped "normally" as if I had just shut off the key, and there was no funny noises at all (would I have at least heard clatter if the valves and pistons kissed?). I guess we'll see in the morning though.


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## borellsoffun (May 26, 2004)

Good luck and keep your fingers crossed!!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Thanks. They just called about 10 minutes ago and said that really the only way to tell is to put a new belt on (bare minimum) and do a compression test to find out if it's a terminal case or not. If good compression, then remove belt, replace the usual water pump and tensioner and idler pulleys too (and I would have them also replace the serpentine belt too in a preventive fashion here as well)) and put belt back on and button it up. All sounds like a reasonable path of action to me really.

If it's terminal...well that's a whole other conversation about pulling the head, etc. and how bad to I want to keep this PITA VW. We love this S&M relationship with our T4s don't we?


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## WannaCorrado (Apr 30, 2000)

time to put a 1.9TDI into your van, Matt


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

No word yet; I guess they didn't have time to finish up on Friday with trying a new belt. I guess I should know Monday how bad it is then.

I'd love a TDI swap but the thing is that shops generally won't do such a swap for you and I don't really have the facilities or knowledge to do it myself. I live in a townhome and have my own garage, but I think it'd still be a bit noisy, etc. and messy to really "hide" it well from the HOA so I don't think they'd be happy with me. Plus when you have to do things like drain the fuel tank, etc. there's no way I'll get away with that here. I would only have time to work on it during weekends anyway so it'd be a many months long project as well and I'm not really up for that. Plus I'd still have to find an engine or donor car, etc. and so I"m gonna have a donor car and Herman in my garage? That won't fly.


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## WannaCorrado (Apr 30, 2000)

that's too bad. I'm thinking of finding a nice 5-speed EV and putting a TDI into it. I have a good donor car already..


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

And honestly (and provided the I5 didn't self-destruct), I kinda like the I5 engine. Paired with the MT it's actually got some punch. Yeah the fuel efficiency is 2/3rds of what a TDI would be in that van, but at least it's regular fuel and I do well on MPG for what it is (I've gotten as high as 22 highway).

If the engine didn't self-destruct, longer-term I might opt for the tall 5th gear conversion as the easier and cheaper way to better fuel efficiency.


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

Yeah, Matt, if the I5 didn't choke and puke, I guess the 5th gear conversion would be the way to go, plus maybe sticking tall, skinny tires on to drop the rpms some more.

Does your HOA say anything about installing air dams and smoothing out the bottom of your van?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well Herman is back in my care and sick.

The shop timed up the motor and put a new belt on. He runs (good) but poorly (bad), so we believe he does have one or more bent valves.

He idles on less than 5 cylinders (not sure if 4 or 3 but kinda feels like 4 to me, recalling one time a long time ago where I left a spark plug wire unplugged). Once you get him up to 2500 or 3000 rpm he starts smoothing out a bit, and also as he warms up he starts smoothing out a bit. I am guessing that the bent valve(s) are not severely bent but only slightly and as the car warms and/or revs increase, the valve seals ever so slightly better, thus explaining the smoothing out.

(Gee wouldn't it be nice if under the heat and pressure of being forced in and out of the sleeve that the valve would straighten itself out? Ha...no chance of that I guess...)

He's also driveable (though not that you'd want to drive him in this state much) and made it 2.5 miles home. However since I have at least one cylinder effectively not firing and burning fuel, that's unburned fuel going into the cat so I don't want to kill the cat.

So "Plan A" I rejected. That was to continue to have them fix him. Labor to pull the head was somewhere around 10 hours, plus whatever bill from an outside machine shop to fix up the head and valves, then labor to put the head back another like 10 hours or so. The bill could easily approach $3K. No thank you. If I hadn't sank so much money into this car since buying it, I might consider paying for convenience and having them do it, but right now $3K is just insane.

So on to "Plan B". I am not sure what that is yet.

A self-swap is semi-tempting (TDI 1.9, gas 4-cyl like a 2.0 ABA maybe, direct AAF swap from a donor) but some of those also will run into the thousands really when all is said and done and I don't have the experience for such a thing (this would be my first). However bearing in mind not wanting to spend thousands, I may rule out a swap.

Taking it to another shop is a possibility to see if they can come in any better on the price, but it's still going to be expensive and not like 50% off. So I may not even bother with that.

The last "Plan B", which is the one I am tempted to try, is to get a Bentley, remove the head myself, send it out to a machine shop, and I reinstall it. This is a third car for us and not "necessary" to have, so I can make this a many-weekend project and work at my own pace. This is where I am leaning at this point...to have a slow-go of it myself as my goal is really to simply get him back to the same state he was in a week ago for as little $$ as reasonably possible.

So much for these being non-interference. At lower revs maybe, but at higher ones...it's a gamble and I lost.:banghead:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

WannaCorrado said:


> that's too bad. I'm thinking of finding a nice 5-speed EV and putting a TDI into it. I have a good donor car already..


If I had the money that I was willing to spend, this would rank higher on my list. But while these vans are almost never an investment where you do get a positive ROI (like a dead MV Weekender that you swap a TDI into and then sell at a profit), not only does the logistics of the swap pose a problem for me because I don't live in a house with the nearest neighbor 1000 feet away (so noise and oh say draining a fuel tank wouldn't be an issue and having some non-running donor car parked somewhere), but just the cost involved is not in my budget. My goal is to just get him back to "like it never happened" status.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So does anyone have any last-minute parting thoughts about his misfiring issue possibly being *not* a bent valve and things I should check before I commit myself to planning on pulling the head?


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> So does anyone have any last-minute parting thoughts about his misfiring issue possibly being *not* a bent valve and things I should check before I commit myself to planning on pulling the head?


Was a leak down test ever done?


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

EV99 said:


> Was a leak down test ever done?


or even a compression test?
If it was mine & the compression was down, I would remove the head myself & fix it. By todays standards these engines are very simple. While I haven't reconditioned the 5 cyl. I have completely reconditioned a Golf engine & that was very straight forward. I am sure you could do it & if you get stuck there is plenty of help on forums.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> or even a compression test?
> If it was mine & the compression was down, I would remove the head myself & fix it. By todays standards these engines are very simple. While I haven't reconditioned the 5 cyl. I have completely reconditioned a Golf engine & that was very straight forward. I am sure you could do it & if you get stuck there is plenty of help on forums.


The shop said they tried to do a compression test and "kept getting inconsistent results" (their words, and I have no idea really what it means):screwy:. They then asked me if the enigne burned oil and I said not really that I know of. I had to add a quart or maybe a quart and a half between oil changes (and I stretched my oil changes a bit almost to 10K miles because I was running full synth. That doesn't sound like that much oil to burn to make a big difference in compression readings. If it wasn't a big oil burner, they should have been able to compression-test it right? That's what I don't get and I'm kinda not sure they really tried.

I am (very reluctantly) game to pull the head but before I go that route there are a few other basics I still want to check first. Next time my father in law is visiting I'm gonna have him bring his tools and do a compression test at least and see if we can find out what the shop could not via a compression test.


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## bigfatgeek (Feb 5, 2005)

How about the used head that moderator The Brit is selling for $150?

See post here - http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...block-head-manifolds-Lights-etc.-East-PA-area.

It's supposedly been rebuilt. Best of luck, hope you get Herman back on the road quickly.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Yep I did see that. Not out of the question but shipping to SoCal could make that $150 a lot more.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> Next time my father in law is visiting I'm gonna have him bring his tools and do a compression test at least and see if we can find out what the shop could not via a compression test.


Sounds like a good idea. If you get any low readings, remove the spark plug & squirt some oil into that cyl. If compression remains the same you then know that the valves or head gasket is gone.
You should also be talking to the repair shop or investigating why the belt came off , if you don't know already, so that it doesn't happen again.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> The shop said they tried to do a compression test and "kept getting inconsistent results" (their words, and I have no idea really what it means):screwy:.


I would like to say "been there done that" and it typically means that they're not doing it right. Be it the tools they are using (cheapo) or the way they are doing it. Just sounds like they don't really have the "hang of it". It should be cranked few times until it stops "rising", some just crank a turn or two, and that isn't going to do it. It has to "pump up" the compression to the max value, this can take a little different amount of time per cylinder, whoever is cranking it needs to see the gauge.



gti_matt said:


> They then asked me if the enigne burned oil and I said not really that I know of. I had to add a quart or maybe a quart and a half between oil changes (and I stretched my oil changes a bit almost to 10K miles because I was running full synth. That doesn't sound like that much oil to burn to make a big difference in compression readings. If it wasn't a big oil burner, they should have been able to compression-test it right? That's what I don't get and I'm kinda not sure they really tried.


The burning of oil or not should be irrelevant to this, since A) some damage to any valve(s) should be evident in a rather noticeable deviation in values B) even if there is a serious deviation without head damage it is usually a sign that some serious repair should be done. 



gti_matt said:


> I am (very reluctantly) game to pull the head but before I go that route there are a few other basics I still want to check first. Next time my father in law is visiting I'm gonna have him bring his tools and do a compression test at least and see if we can find out what the shop could not via a compression test.


Compression test is good but a leak down test gives so much more information, as to where the compression is leaking (*if* it is leaking), while a compression test is great to get an idea of the overall condition of an engine, that's not really the main agenda here, but to find/locate/identify if/what damage was done from the incident.

As for pulling the head apart, it sounds and seems a lot more serious and "specialized" than it really is, I personally feel people make a more serious deal about rebuilding a head than it is (I felt the same way myself not very long ago) aside from some special tools needed (random quick Google search gave me this http://www.ebay.com/itm/VW-Audi-Val...or-Tool-Kit-Set-1620-/370562876625#vi-content ) I myself actually use a bench top press and O2 sensor socket myself  just because it gives me TWO free hands http://www.ebay.com/itm/6-Ton-Hydraulic-Bench-Table-Top-Shop-Press-Bottle-Jack-/120750358527

I like this video gives quick overview of what's involved with a cylinder job (I believe they use a press drill and a modified wrench to press down the spring)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAIUXnP4NU8

The only other special tool you would need is the valve seal & guide tool:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Valve-Stem-..._Automotive_Tools&vxp=mtr&hash=item58912b09bb

Though the valve guide tolerances are so large on most VW heads, it's often not worth the extra work of removing them, since when you put new ones in you would have to hone them to get them exactly round again (they will dis-form to some degree upon installment)


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Yep I did see that. Not out of the question but shipping to SoCal could make that $150 a lot more.


The shipping of heads is actually not very bad as they typically don't go "oversize" by UPS' etc standards. $35-40 or so should do it, though yeah it's one cylinder longer than most.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Thanks. They just called about 10 minutes ago and said that really the only way to tell is to put a new belt on (bare minimum) and do a compression test to find out if it's a terminal case or not. If good compression, then remove belt, replace the usual water pump and tensioner and idler pulleys too (and I would have them also replace the serpentine belt too in a preventive fashion here as well)) and put belt back on and button it up. All sounds like a reasonable path of action to me really.
> 
> If it's terminal...well that's a whole other conversation about pulling the head, etc. and how bad to I want to keep this PITA VW. We love this S&M relationship with our T4s don't we?


I am not sure I understand why they wanted to put a belt on? Just as you're always supposed to hand turn an engine two revolutions or so after putting on a new TB to make sure everything is "just right" and where it should be, they could've done the same by putting the cam at TDC and turning the lower end without the belt, and making sure it spins freely without ANY "extra" resistance.

Since the head and the lower end already are "out of sync" it wouldn't matter any more, and it would have in minutes given the answer if there was any serious damage.

Also it is a VERY bad idea to (if this is an interference engine?) to just slap a new TB back on the car and start and/or drive it. Because there can be damage to the cam followers but not enough for it to not run. This is typically what happens to the followers in "milder" cases:










But this turns into a VERY serious problem if not fixed (my TDI donor car for my EV99 went through this prior to me buying it, with the result that the head is _now_ "beyond repair" etc..) it typically ends up with a lifter (aka follower) cracking open, damaging the cam *and* the head cast itself!


















None of the pics are mine but I have a very similar looking TDI head on my donor car from the very situation that the previous owners had the TB snap, then some shop told them "no damage" to the head and put a brand new TB kit on, and they drove exactly 1200miles and "boom"!  then I bought it... 

So what I would say is to FIRST THING to do is pop the valve cover (that actually uses the identical fasteners as the Mk3 TDI engine I mentioned ) and look CLOSELY at the center of the followers with a good flashlight and look for ANY hairline cracks OR dents (either way meaning in or out!) the down/in would be from the cam pushing into it and up is from the top of the valve pushing up. A good cam follower should be 100% flat without any crack lines or dents!

[EDIT] not->now


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## bigfatgeek (Feb 5, 2005)

A somewhat-local head for you to consider (as of Jan 23): 

http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/pts/2777488010.html 

If you still need one...


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

^^^ thanks. For right now just kinda (still) taking a break from the issue but I'll keep my eye on CL.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well today I psyched myself up a little and used a borrowed compression gauge to do a compression test.

Here's the cylinders in reverse order (because 1 and 2 are kinda curious/odd), done cold with only the respective spark plug of the tested cylinder removed while all the others were in place. I also parked the car 2 weeks ago and when I did I had pulled the fuel pump fuse and let it die/burn off residual fuel. The test was done with the fuel pump fuse disconnected so the engine wouldn't start up on me.

5: 150

4: 140-145 (fell in between the tick marks on the gauge, so like 142 or 143 really)

3: 140-145 (same as #4 fell in between the tick marks on the gauge, so like 142 or 143 really)

2: 175 best reading out of 4 tests (due to the location of the water neck fitting I had a hard time getting the gauge in there and sealing good but after 4 attempts the best reading was 175, the worst was like 50 and I believe that I didn't always get a good seal).

1: 0 (but the alternator was in the way and every stroke of the engine I got a bit of a puff of air coming out so I am not even sure that I sealed at all for any good test). The spark plug for #1 also seemed a tad damper than the others.

So I guess my question is...#2 is a bit high, and the firing order of this engine is 1-2-4-5-3 too, does the higher reading on #2 mean that the prior cylinder (#1) is indeed dead because its lack of compression allows it some more easy-spin which carries momentum over into cylinder #2 such that #2 reads higher?

Or should I go find a gauge with a longer neck so I can fit it in there better and retest?

Is there anything about the timing belt installation currently (like if it's off a tooth) that could cause the compresson to be out of whack on cylinder #1 but OK on the others? (Probably not but yes I'm kinda reaching...haha...)

Thoughts? I guess I'm feeling like my tests on #1 and #2 are a little inconclusive because I had a hard time getting a good seal.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Thoughts? I guess I'm feeling like my tests on #1 and #2 are a little inconclusive because I had a hard time getting a good seal.


I would agree with that part. I remember having the same "results" when I did my first compression readings, for very similar reasons. If it truly was zero it would be very obvious in how it runs, didn't it run "sorta ok" now? As for timing belt being off a tooth then the timing for all cylinders (read compression as well) would be off, since the timing at which the valves open is closely tied to compression obviously, since with opened valves = no compression.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Am now thinking I should get a new gauge that "fits" better (has a longer neck or a flexi-hose so I can position it real good w/o it bumping into the alternator or coolant neck) since the cylinders that gave the strangest numbers are the ones that I had the most trouble reaching.

Also (and this is a stretch)I am a little suspicious that #1 right now appears to be the dead one and this is the one that you "key" off of to set the timing up. If the new belt was installed 180-deg off, that might explain the symptom of a dead #1, wouldn't it? Although the others seem to fire alright (the car simply feels like it's running on 4 out of 5 cylinders. I guess I'd to think about that one more.

But I think I'll start with a new gauge. The gauge I borrowed is a good 35 years old and hasn't been used in the last 20 I'm told, so it could be very sensitive to imperfect sealing.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

What I got is something like the center one. I think I need something like the outer one.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Am now thinking I should get a new gauge that "fits" better (has a longer neck or a flexi-hose so I can position it real good w/o it bumping into the alternator or coolant neck) since the cylinders that gave the strangest numbers are the ones that I had the most trouble reaching.


Isn't it just a matter of getting an adapter (end) that could fit? What is it that's in the way?



gti_matt said:


> Also (and this is a stretch)I am a little suspicious that #1 right now appears to be the dead one and this is the one that you "key" off of to set the timing up. If the new belt was installed 180-deg off, that might explain the symptom of a dead #1, wouldn't it? Although the others seem to fire alright (the car simply feels like it's running on 4 out of 5 cylinders. I guess I'd to think about that one more.


Isn't the car running? I mean the engine runs it's not "dead" right? The engine would NOT run at all if 180 deg off.



gti_matt said:


> But I think I'll start with a new gauge. The gauge I borrowed is a good 35 years old and hasn't been used in the last 20 I'm told, so it could be very sensitive to imperfect sealing.


"Cheap" (but not totally worthless) that could be worth it for this time?
http://www.harborfreight.com/flex-drive-compression-tester-92697.html


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> What I got is something like the center one. I think I need something like the outer one.



 see link in previous post...


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> So I guess my question is...#2 is a bit high, and the firing order of this engine is 1-2-4-5-3 too, does the higher reading on #2 mean that the prior cylinder (#1) is indeed dead because its lack of compression allows it some more easy-spin which carries momentum over into cylinder #2 such that #2 reads higher?


No2 is high probably through carbon buildup. Bentley says the compression of the AAF is 131 to 174 when new so you are ok. Permissible difference between all cylinders is 44psi which is more important. The wear limit is 102psi.
To do a compression test engine coolant temp. must be 86F minimum.[although your test is a guide]
Throttle valve must be wide open during cranking.
Camshaft position sensor disconnected at ign. distributor. 
You are leaking at the gauge seal on No1 so you need the better compression gauge as you have said


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Did another test today with:

1. A new gauge w/hose (can get into the #1 cylinder spark plug hole better).
2. Engine warm-ish (not real hot but not stone cold)
3. All plugs removed.
4. Fuel disabled via pulling fuel pump fuse.
5. Ignition disabled via pulling the connector from the coil/ignition module.

Results:

#1 - zero/zilch/nada/bupkus/dead/muerte/mort
#2 - 160
#3 - 170
#4 - 155 first reading, suspiciously low, did another reading got 170
#5 - 165

I am encouraged that apart from #1 which took it for the team that the engine's compression looks pretty good, so I'm feeling good about VW's 80s and early 90s engines there. Bummer though that the AAF turns out to be interference after all (at least at high revs 'cause I was over 4000 rpm when the thing went).

Next weekend my father-in-law is gonna be down and giving me a hand with this (I need someone like him to be a confidence builder for me on this) and then we're diving into this thing.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> I am encouraged that apart from #1 which took it for the team that the engine's compression looks pretty good, so I'm feeling good about VW's 80s and early 90s engines there. Bummer though that the AAF turns out to be interference after all (at least at high revs 'cause I was over 4000 rpm when the thing went).


I've never seen only one cylinder having damage after a interference engine has had a TB breakage, since there's more than one piston always at/close to the top at the same time.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> I've never seen only one cylinder having damage after a interference engine has had a TB breakage, since there's more than one piston always at/close to the top at the same time.


With the 5-cylinder IIRC there is no time (unlike a 4-banger) where two cylinders are at the tops of their strokes at the same time.

And/or perhaps the clearance (or lack of) is so minimal that it's enough for one piston/valve clash but the others cleared because after the first clash the cam and valvetrain were stopped by the collision and no valve was fully extended in this position? Well IDK but we'll find out next weekend when we open it up but so far I've no reason to suspect anything amiss with cylinders 2-4.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> With the 5-cylinder IIRC there is no time (unlike a 4-banger) where two cylinders are at the tops of their strokes at the same time.
> 
> And/or perhaps the clearance (or lack of) is so minimal that it's enough for one piston/valve clash but the others cleared because after the first clash the cam and valvetrain were stopped by the collision and no valve was fully extended in this position? Well IDK but we'll find out next weekend when we open it up but so far I've no reason to suspect anything amiss with cylinders 2-4.


Ok makes sense, I've only had my I5 open (or any I5 for that matter) once and that wasn't for TB reasons. So what's the plan? Another head or repair this one? Trust me there's "nothing to it" once you've done it once, see what tools I pointed out on previous page(s).


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> Ok makes sense, I've only had my I5 open (or any I5 for that matter) once and that wasn't for TB reasons. So what's the plan? Another head or repair this one? Trust me there's "nothing to it" once you've done it once, see what tools I pointed out on previous page(s).


Crank throws on a 5-cyl are 72 degrees apart so when one cylinder is up, any others are not at all near being "up" at the same time (unlike a 4-cylinder which IIRC when one cylinder is fully up say at the end of a compression stroke, another cylinder is also up at the end of an exhaust stroke I bet) and this probably implies that no valves were fully open except for one cylinder's valve(s). I am guessing that being a 5-cylinder benefitted me actually in this way because when the first collision happened in cylinder #1 it probably stopped the cam and valvetrain there and while the crank was still going, the rest of the cylinder's valves were all probably not fully open so the pistons missed the other valves.

Unless I have piston damage (which I guess a leak down test might help tell me but the head probably has to come off no matter what so I'll just pull the head as a gamble anyway), gonna pull the head and see what's up. As one of the first things though when we pull the valve cover I'm going to check the cam followers first in case they're damaged (as you mentioned before) to get some new ones ordered as needed.

I see no reason to actually get a rebuilt head at this point. The car was running great before all this, the other cylinders have good compression, so I think we're gonna just see what's up with that one cylinder's valves and go from there. My goal with this is to get it back to where it was and not to do a full rebuild if I don't need it. The goal is to "make it like it never happened", not "make it like it rolled off the Hanover assembly line".

I am worried about some of the oil wetness I see under there though. IDK if it's just leakage from the valve cover that made its way down or if it's the camshaft seal and/or crank seal.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

More likely than having piston damage (I believe you're thinking of like a hole or something in it?) I think the bigger risk would be a bent rod, which the only way to find out (without removing it and measuring it in a special tool) would be to measure the piston protrusion.
http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu107/kaputtschlagen/ProtrusionRig.jpg

Still though on the pistons hitting the valves, it's not usually an instant stop so you usually have the "hit" and then at least another half turn after that...

Leak down test wouldn't tell you anything on the piston end, it would reveal IF and through which valve it leaks (sound out the exhaust or out the intake manifold). 

Yeah even if you end up having to swap a valve or two it's not really a big deal!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> More likely than having piston damage (I believe you're thinking of like a hole or something in it?) I think the bigger risk would be a bent rod, which the only way to find out (without removing it and measuring it in a special tool) would be to measure the piston protrusion.
> http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu107/kaputtschlagen/ProtrusionRig.jpg


The van runs a little smoother when warm and/or at higher RPMs so I am thinking a bent valve that isn't too terribly bent (but any bend is bad really) but tends to seal better with heat and/or RPMs whereas a bent rod I would think would be non-smooth all the time.



EV99 said:


> Still though on the pistons hitting the valves, it's not usually an instant stop so you usually have the "hit" and then at least another half turn after that...


Although given the AAF was officially listed as non-interference but apparently can be (as I've now experienced), I am banking that the lack of clearance is so minimal that it take full extension of a valve and full throw of the crank to make a collision and I am banking that it didn't happen after the first collision.



EV99 said:


> Leak down test wouldn't tell you anything on the piston end, it would reveal IF and through which valve it leaks (sound out the exhaust or out the intake manifold).


Would kinda tell me though if a piston is holed though, no?



EV99 said:


> Yeah even if you end up having to swap a valve or two it's not really a big deal!


Am hoping it's just swapping a valve, yeah. I"m gonna buy a gasket set (valve cover, intake, exhaust, etc. all those misc. pieces encountered during the teardown), one exhaust and one intake valve (seeing as I don't know which is bad right now and they're not that pricey I'll buy one of each), timing belt kit, and go from there. Might need more stuff yeah if I find more damage but if I have just one bent valve I don't need to make this more complicated than that. Oh maybe a serpentine belt too as long as I'm at it.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Would kinda tell me though if a piston is holed though, no?
> 
> Am hoping it's just swapping a valve, yeah. I"m gonna buy a gasket set (valve cover, intake, exhaust, etc. all those misc. pieces encountered during the teardown), one exhaust and one intake valve (seeing as I don't know which is bad right now and they're not that pricey I'll buy one of each), timing belt kit, and go from there. Might need more stuff yeah if I find more damage but if I have just one bent valve I don't need to make this more complicated than that. Oh maybe a serpentine belt too as long as I'm at it.


Leak down test usually is to see if the valves are leaking or perhaps the rings, don't know if I have ever heard of it being used to "find" a hole in a piston. But 99.99% sure you have no hole in no piston, that doesn't happen unless the valve actually breaks into pieces, and yeah after that the engine is NOT running without a complete overhaul. You might have an indention from a valve or two on the piston(s).


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> I"m gonna buy a gasket set (valve cover, intake, exhaust, etc. all those misc. pieces encountered during the teardown), one exhaust and one intake valve (seeing as I don't know which is bad right now and they're not that pricey I'll buy one of each), timing belt kit, and go from there. Might need more stuff yeah if I find more damage but if I have just one bent valve I don't need to make this more complicated than that. Oh maybe a serpentine belt too as long as I'm at it.


Not sure I would be buying parts until you have removed the head & inspected everything, unless your father in law has to go home straight away.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> Not sure I would be buying parts until you have removed the head & inspected everything, unless your father in law has to go home straight away.


Sort of. He's only here for the weekend. But the aforementioned gaskets aren't that expensive are are necessary for reassembly so I don't think it's a waste to have them on-hand ready to go.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

I was thinking more about the valves. You will need to check valve guide wear as well. These tend to wear out on German cars.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

jets said:


> I was thinking more about the valves. You will need to check valve guide wear as well. These tend to wear out on German cars.


Actually with VW's definition of what should be considered "worn out" on the guides is fairly generous, whereby I am pretty sure they will NOT have to be replaced:










From the Eurovan Bentley manual for 2.5 gasser.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Bit of an update: Herman the German is slowly getting better and coming back together. After getting the head out, I took it to a machine shop for rework. Replaced three exhaust valves, new stem seals, acid-cleaned, and resurfaced. 

Today we put the camshaft back in, attached the exhaust manifold to the head, and dropped it into the van and tightened it down. Attaching the exhaust manifold to the head first was a great idea rather than mess with it in the engine bay. Tried to do the same with the intake manifold but it was just too bulky and with the radiator still attached, it couldn't go in at the same time. 

I also replaced the coolant hoses to/from the oil cooler as they looked pretty bad and look nearly impossible to reach while the exhaust manifold is in the car. 

Still to do: 
Intake manifold 
Water pump 
Front crank oil seal 
Reinstall timing belt 
Replace serpentine belt (looks a little aged) 

While I have the coolant emptied, I think I'm also going to replace the hoses to/from the rear heater core (they look rather toasty and crispy).


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

Thanks for the update. I was about to ask if there had been any progress. Looks like you are on the home stretch now.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Work on the van is kinda limited to my father-in-law's availability because on a job like this I don't quite have the same suite of tools that he brings along nor the know-how/confidence, so I don't like to do any of this sort of job alone.


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## kcowboy421 (Jul 20, 2011)

I saw the name of this thread because in the city of New Ulm, Minnesota, where I used to live there is a statue named Herman the German here is a link to a small article about it http://www.roadsideamerica.com/story/11260.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Work on the van is kinda limited to my father-in-law's availability because on a job like this I don't quite have the same suite of tools that he brings along nor the know-how/confidence, so I don't like to do any of this sort of job alone.


 Update?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> Update?


 Head and exhaust manifold are on, but not intake. Front crank oil seal replaced. Gotta clean things up a bit around the pulley end of things (various misc. oil leaks from valve cover, maybe camshaft seal leaked too IDK but new seal is in it now, and crank oil seal just made things around the pulley end of things all yucky), replace water pump and idler pulleys, put timing belt on, put serpentine belt on, put intake on, connect all hoses and stuff and then should be done. Just haven't had a free weekend to get going (and to get motivation!) on it.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Just haven't had a free weekend to get going (and to get motivation!) on it.


 I know what that's like!  But I did find some motivation just recently


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

^^^^^ 
Hey, Matt, ya want a VR engine in Herman?


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

miguel indurain said:


> ^^^^^
> Hey, Matt, ya want a VR engine in Herman?


 
...already sold that was in fact my motivation to pull it


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

VR6 timing chain, premium fuel, no thanks. The old I5 does just fine.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> VR6 timing chain, premium fuel, no thanks. The old I5 does just fine.


 ..a tad of irony in this reply in the light of the latest events?  

But my engine bay being empty should show what_ I_ think of the VR6..


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> ..a tad of irony in this reply in the light of the latest events?


 Agreed...I thought that as I typed that. 

But I still sort of prefer timing belts over chains because belts are actually designed for intentional replacement. 

Chains are usually designed to be lifetime (and therefore expensive and difficult to replace) but then (sadly) come with design or material deficiencies that make them a horrific-to-fix non-lifetime item. Witness the VR6 12V chain guide deficiencies and also the (limited number of) sprocket wear and failures on some of the VR6 24V motors.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Agreed...I thought that as I typed that.
> 
> But I still sort of prefer timing belts over chains because belts are actually designed for intentional replacement.
> 
> Chains are usually designed to be lifetime (and therefore expensive and difficult to replace) but then (sadly) come with design or material deficiencies that make them a horrific-to-fix non-lifetime item. Witness the VR6 12V chain guide deficiencies and also the (limited number of) sprocket wear and failures on some of the VR6 24V motors.


 Yeah I am hoping I get out my 12V (done already) and 24V before I encounter anything like this. Ironically though while both this I5 and VR6 still lives on within VW (in a way) they no longer install any I5 nor VR6 engines into the current vans...


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> Yeah I am hoping I get out my 12V (done already) and 24V before I encounter anything like this. Ironically though while both this I5 and VR6 still lives on within VW (in a way) they no longer install any I5 nor VR6 engines into the current vans...


 The T-based vans are all diesel now aren't they? I think it's just a sign of the times. The 1990s through the mid 00s were sort of a transition period for Europe from gas to diesel where gas engines, though efficient and small, were slowly replaced by diesel. While diesel has always been reasonably popular in Europe since the 1970s, it really started taking off in the 1990s with DI technology. It's no surprise that in a larger vehicle that diesel is just about the only powertrain option now, and of course the trend is turbo 4-cylinder in place of larger displacement naturally aspirated motors.


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## Seano (Jan 2, 2003)

gti_matt said:


> The T-based vans are all diesel now aren't they?


 Nope. You can get a couple of versions of the 2.0 litre TSI gas engine across the range in some Euro markets. There's 110kW and 150kW versions...both available across manual, DSG and 4Motion drivelines 

I've heard that they'll be more widely offered in English speaking markets that take the T in the 2013 model year


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> But I still sort of prefer timing belts over chains because belts are actually designed for intentional replacement.


 I have read somewhere recently that VW are going back to belts for all their engines, no reason was given though.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> I have read somewhere recently that VW are going back to belts for all their engines, no reason was given though.


 Cheaper to make?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well FML.

Continued work on Herman today and got a new water pump in.

Then went in the direction of the timing belt and while installing the new idler pulley, the 10mm bolt for it snapped.

I think what was happening is that the idler pulley fits into a collar (sort of) on the oil pump housing and it's a very tight fit. I thought the bolt would draw the pulley in as I tightened the bolt. Nope. I should have tapped the pulley into place first and then installed the bolt. I think as I was tightening the bolt it was stretching until it snapped.

F

M

L

:banghead:

So the plan now (for another day though) is to undo the right-side motor mount bolt so that side of the motor will drop below the frame rail enough to get a drill and an easy-out in there.

Argh. Did *NOT* need this.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

Seano said:


> You can get a couple of versions of the 2.0 litre TSI gas engine across the range in some Euro markets.


The TSI350 [2 litre 150kw] is currently available in the Caravelle & Multivan in OZ.
It puts out 350Nm of torque from 1500 to 4000rpm.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> while installing the new idler pulley, the 10mm bolt for it snapped


Was that a new bolt or the original? If original, was it a clean break or were there signs of metal fatigue?
I have read on the OZ site where a stud through an idler or tensioner [can't remember now] on a mk5 TDI broke on a high mileage car.As you can imagine it brought the whole house down.
On some timing belt kits, they supply new bolts with a blue coating on the thread to help stop the bolt undoing. This obviously important if the idler runs in a counter clockwise direction.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> Was that a new bolt or the original? If original, was it a clean break or were there signs of metal fatigue?
> I have read on the OZ site where a stud through an idler or tensioner [can't remember now] on a mk5 TDI broke on a high mileage car.As you can imagine it brought the whole house down.
> On some timing belt kits, they supply new bolts with a blue coating on the thread to help stop the bolt undoing. This obviously important if the idler runs in a counter clockwise direction.


Old bolt, didn't have a new one. Looked like a fairly clean break.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

Doesn't say "always replace" on that one:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

When it comes to the timing belt, I believe it's a good idea to replace all the moving parts since failure of any one of them can stop things dead. Hence, why I attempted to replace.

But then again, there's a certain degree of truth to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" too.:banghead:


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

10Nm is not very much. Did you use a lot more force to break it?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

No idea at this point. Seeing as how tight the idler fits into the oil pump housing w/o the bolt I really think that my error was not pressing in the idler first and then installing the bolt after it was seated. I thought (erroneously) that the bolt would just draw in the idler into the housing but it's a very tight friction-fit that I underestimated I bet.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Very minor update on this. My strategy now is to remove the oil pump (which means removing the oil pan) to deal w/the broken bolt. Drained the oil and began trying to unbolt the oil pan. Got most of the small bolts removed from the pan except for two of them that are somewhat obscured by the part of the passenger-side driveshaft (damn you VW for being geniuses at stuffing so much hardware into a small space :banghead. This is also the first oil pan I've seen where some of it is secured by the transmission bellhousing (or maybe it's the final drive? it's something "big" near the trans) and I didn't take those bolts out yet. After a few facefuls of sand from under the car while working on it I decided I had enough for one day (and it was kinda hot too).

So not a lot of progress but better than nothing.


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

Matt, I hate to be the bearer of bad news but I don't believe you can remove the oil pan without separating the trans from the engine. I know this to be certain on the AAB and can only presume it's the case on the AAF.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Holy hell, seriously?!

I know I saw a couple of bolts between the trans and oil pan but figured once those were removed the pan could be dropped.

Really did VW do this?


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

The Bentley does not mention removing the trans to take off the sump.[thats not conclusive though] It does say rotate flywheel so that recess is aligned flush with bolts.
In the Peter Russek manual[I only have the diesel version] it says " To remove the bolts on the gearbox side, rotate the flywheel until the cut-outs are in line with the bolts" Also no mention of removing the trans. in this manual so you might be lucky.


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

I have an AAF sitting here. The flywheel is off but I still have it. I'll have a look. Hopefully I'm wrong


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

OK thanks although I suspect you are right. I googled and found a post somewhere that referenced an ACU engine that said more or less the same thing, so if a AAB is that way and an ACU is that way, I'd be shocked if the AAF was different. I guess the $64K question is, what's the minimum required amount of work/removal required to get to the remaining oil pan bolts?


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

Matt, I looked at two different flywheels I have here. One is the single mass from an AAF. It has the slots. I looked at an AAB dual mass, it has both slots. It looks like you're in luck. Me, well that job's done ;-)


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Dumb question...how do I access these slots? BTW I have a manual trans if that makes any difference.


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

It's not a dumb question. I didn't even realize they were there until someone here mentioned them. LOL. 

Rotate the bottom end over. Using the crank sprocket would be best. There's two slots. 180 degrees opposite to one another.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

CdnVWJunk-e said:


> It's not a dumb question. I didn't even realize they were there until someone here mentioned them. LOL.
> 
> Rotate the bottom end over. Using the crank sprocket would be best. There's two slots. 180 degrees opposite to one another.


Bummer I'll lose TDC though (haven't put the timing belt back on yet) doing this but sure sounds better than separating engine and trans. Nothing to remove to see them other than rotating the crank?


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Bummer I'll lose TDC though (haven't put the timing belt back on yet) doing this but sure sounds better than separating engine and trans. Nothing to remove to see them other than rotating the crank?


 Why would you loose TDC if head is off? Isn't head off??


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> Why would you loose TDC if head is off? Isn't head off??


 Head is back on but timing belt not on.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

gti_matt said:


> Head is back on but timing belt not on.


 Ok I haven't followed much, but you can still find TDC through the spark plug hole if you don't trust the markings? 

Did you figure out the oil pan removal? I just pulled a 93 I5 2.5 engine myself couple of days ago, looks like the oil pan has "holes" to access the bolts that is on the transmission end, no? I haven't pulled the oil pan myself yet (nor do I know if I will)


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Gave up on dropping the pan but the bolt is out!

My father-in-law made it down with his easy-out. He also bought a M7 (I think) bolt and put it in a die and hollowed it out to use as a guide to help center his drill when drilling. Got it dead center, then used the easy-out. Stub came out nicely and no thread damage. Had to undo the passenger side mount to drop the motor about 3/4" for clearance to drill straight in.

He's good at this sort of thing. I would have messed it up more for sure 'cause I'm accident prone that way lol.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Argh.....soooo close! Thought we'd be turning the key today, but no.

I got three things left to sort out:

1. Fuel line connections at the fuel rail...which goes where?

2. Got a blue wire in a 2-pin connector hanging off the wire harness that goes on the back of the alternator. No idea where this connects to. Anyone know?

3. Poured coolant in him only to have it dribble right back out of the water neck fitting on the head (the one that has a couple of hoses and sensors). Probably an o-ring problem.


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## kauboi (Nov 3, 2004)

As I understand it, the fuel pressure regulator goes on the return to the tank. Im not familiar withe the early vans, but my 02 has two lines connecting to the fuel rail (loop) .Mine have different size fittings and theoretically cant be reversed. If I wasnt sure which line came from the pump, maybe cycle the key and see which one fuel comes out of? (into a bottle of course)

I think the blue wire is the alternator exciter, is there a small open terminal on your alternator? I think it feeds a small voltage to start your alts charging function.

No clue on the leak.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

kauboi said:


> As I understand it, the fuel pressure regulator goes on the return to the tank.


Hmmm OK I think that is consistent with the ETKA diagram which seems to indicate that one line (return) going back to the tank goes on the pressure regulator and the other line (supply) that tees into two goes one on the fuel rail and the other half of the tee goes to the cold start injector on the intake manifold.



kauboi said:


> Im not familiar withe the early vans, but my 02 has two lines connecting to the fuel rail (loop) .Mine have different size fittings and theoretically cant be reversed. If I wasnt sure which line came from the pump, maybe cycle the key and see which one fuel comes out of? (into a bottle of course)


Mine has two lines as well (one on the rail, the pressure regulator goes on the rail, and then another line connects to that). My fittings are the same size though. Yes I can probably tell which hose is the supply one but I already can guess that because the supply one is the one that tees into two (one for the fuel rail and one for the cold start injector). It's guessing supply and return on the rail and PR properly that is the question.



kauboi said:


> I think the blue wire is the alternator exciter, is there a small open terminal on your alternator? I think it feeds a small voltage to start your alts charging function.


That makes sense. I'll look again. It's probably right in front of my face and I didn't see it because I was looking *around* the alternator and not *on* it.



kauboi said:


> No clue on the leak.


Thanks but that's OK...that's a o-ring thing I bet or I may have cracked the hose flange when tightening it on. I'm not worried about solving that one; it'll be easy.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well dummy me. The blue wire connects to a terminal on the alternator itself, just didn't see it because it's dark and obscured by another harness. Hiding in (nearly) plain sight. D'oh!

So that leaves my coolant leak (probably o-ring) and the fuel lines. Almost there!


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> So that leaves my coolant leak (probably o-ring)


I hope that's all it needs. If it's a plastic housing on your model, they can crack & leak. Try a new O ring first though.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Yes it's plastic. It's probably only two years old that I replaced it but who knows...I could have overtightened it and cracked it (I sometimes can be a bit of a gorilla when it comes to wrenching things). Or I could have had a brain failure and forgot to put in the o-ring. I find I'm getting forgetful in my semi-old age LOL.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Water leak fixed. I replaced the hose flange and o-ring together.

Fuel lines connected (I looked at someone else's Eurovan locally to get the right connection order).

Coolant back in, oil back in, battery hooked up.

Turned the key today and........


No go. Doesn't sound right. Motor turns too smoothly is the best way I can put it and it just doesn't sound right. We might have something 180-degrees wrong. I didn't crank it a lot, but I did turn the key at least a half dozen times just to get the fuel to squirt a few times since it's been sitting forever and has air in the lines but even if the fuel hasn't really made it to the motor yet, it just doesn't feel or sound right while cranking. It sounds the same as when I had all the plugs out to do compression testing before the teardown began if that's any indicator of what's wrong.

Gonna retrace steps and do some compression testing this week.:banghead::banghead:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Been thinking about this some and since I know we put the distributor back 180-degrees wrong (but switched around all the ignition wires accordingly), I think we overlooked one significant thing and it's the distributor being 180-degrees off and remapping the wires on the cap isn't correct...it's also the Hall effect sensor is physically mounted 180-off too (for example, the plug is now at the bottom where it should be at the top). I am thinking that I gotta flip it all around back to where it was.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

Keep going, you will get there in the end & learn plenty along the way.


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## CdnVWJunk-e (Jan 25, 2004)

Pull the cap and turn the engine over to TDC and inspect where the rotor is pointing to verify it's on cylinder 1. If it isn't then correct the distributor.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> Keep going, you will get there in the end & learn plenty along the way.


Already more than I cared to!



CdnVWJunk-e said:


> Pull the cap and turn the engine over to TDC and inspect where the rotor is pointing to verify it's on cylinder 1. If it isn't then correct the distributor.


Did that already when we put the cap on and that's when we found that the #1 was 180-degrees off (and bear in mind we know the dist is upside down too because the plug for the Hall sensor is on the bottom now and should be on the top). We thought just "remapping" the wires would be enough (moving the #1 wire to the new #1 position and then going around the cap 1-2-4-5-3) but I guess not.:banghead:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Ok guys...tell me if this is right (crank and cam timing and making sure I'm not 180-deg off between cam and crank)

I loosened the #1 spark plug so that it was barely threaded (so as to let air escape with an audible "pfffft!" sound).

Starting with the cam and crank lined up (notch in crank vibration damper lined up with the mark/line on the lower timing belt cover which is IIRC roughly at 2-o'clock (bearing in mind how the motor is tilted forward in this car) and the camshaft sprocket's notch was visible in the slot on the back of the upper timing belt cover and level with the valve cover....

I hand-cranked the motor. The first revolution of the crank I heard nothing from the #1 cylinder. As of the 2nd revolution, I heard the "pfffft!" I expected all during cranking that 2nd revolution of the crank. Then at the end of that second revolution where the audible "pffft!" came to an end, both crank and cam marks were visible again.

So this is correct right? After the compression up-stroke is when the crank and cam sprocket marks are both aligned again, correct?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well hot dayumn the mystery is solved! The car isn't running yet and I don't have time right now to deal with it but I know where we went wrong. 

It kept bugging me that when the cam and crank are timed at (what we perceived to be) TDC that the distributor rotor was about 60-70 degrees off from #1 according to the nick on the distributor rim. "No way in hell is that possible!" I kept saying to myself. 

So I hand-cranked the motor to our TDC setting (with distributor misaligned). I then had a helper hand-crank the motor. I watched the rotor come around and as it approached the notch in the distributor rim (which is about 4-o'clock), I had my helper slow down the cranking and I then looked at the cam sprocket through the slot in the timing belt cover. 

Lo and behold what shows up right about then? Another mark!:banghead::banghead: 

There are TWO marks on the cam sprocket, not one! We timed to the wrong mark! 

Now who the hell knows what that second mark is (is it factory? is it damage from us removing the cam sprocket months before and we had to muscle it off?) but we timed to the wrong one is the bottom line. 

This explains everything. 

1. The distributor we marked before removal and you can pretty much only put it on right or 180-degrees off, maybe +/- a few degrees but certainly not as far off as it was. This implies that the cam had to be timed wrong. 

2. Compression was pretty even on all cylinders but only at about 25psi or so. This means we were getting a full stroke of the piston during which the valves were closed only some of the time but not all of the time. Again, cam timing is suspicious in this case. 

So in the interest of not having to undo too much, I think it's a matter of putting the crank at TDC, removing the upper TB cover, getting the TB off the cam sprocket, turning the cam to the correct mark in the window, and getting the belt back on, and triple-checking EVERYTHING and also doing some hand-crank checks before firing it up. 

Phew.


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## EV99 (Nov 27, 2009)

Whenever in doubt you can check that the lobes on cam for cylinder one point up 
or lay flat upward (one forward the other towards back of car) simple way to always make sure you're at the right place.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

EV99 said:


> Whenever in doubt you can check that the lobes on cam for cylinder one point up
> or lay flat upward (one forward the other towards back of car) simple way to always make sure you're at the right place.


 Something like that occurred to me as the next step in the event that finding a 2nd mark (still :screwy didn't come to fruition. I want to "undo" as little as possible so that's why I did the test I just did, rather than start unbolting the valve cover, but yeah eyeballing the cam in action would probably have eventually led me to the same conclusion. 

And FWIW, the other thing I tested tonight (as long as I was at it), I checked yet again that I am reading the crank TDC mark correctly and I think I am. I put a straw into the #1 hole and it goes up/down as expected as what I believe to be TDC nick mark on the vibration damper pulley rim passes the mark on the lower TB cover.:thumbup: I was pretty sure I had it right but as long as I was verifying two (cam and distributor) of the three marks, I figured I'd verify the third one as well.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

YYYYYEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

He's alive!






Good lord it's a PITA to switch around the cam and crank timing (which was off) without taking everything apart (we tried to not undo too many things so we worked with taking the upper cover off and the serpentine belt off and took the belt off and retimed things), but he's back together and RUNNING!

He cranked for about 10-15 seconds three times and right after starting the 4th set of cranking he came right alive smoothly on all five cylinders.:thumbup:

Right now the ECU is doing all sorts of odd things (without me touching anything, revving to nearly 3000 RPM, back down again, up, down, then idling kinda fast at about 1300, etc.) but I'm sure it's all part of the re-learning process, and I need to do the proper reset-base-settings procedure, but that all should be minor now that he's actually running.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Moved him out the garage (so nice to have it back!) and onto the street. Crazy-revved at 2500-3000 rpm the whole time. Also noticed I had no power brake assist (aha!). Parked him and found the brake booster hose undone near the firewall somewhere. Must have knocked it loose at some point. Anyway, it's one of those "it's dark out, I'm hungry and haven't had dinner yet, deal with it tomorrow before sundown" things. But a huge vacuum leak like that explains the crazy revving...lots of extra air going into the intake = lots more fuel = revving.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

This is the post I have been waiting to read. After all you have been through, well done.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> This is the post I have been waiting to read. After all you have been through, well done.


And it's the post I've been waiting to write!

Hopefully there are no more "gotchas" with this and as I drive him over the coming days that I don't find leaks or a bad head gasket (or improperly installed head gasket) or anything stupid like that.

All in all I think we did pretty good but OMG we are S-L-O-W :laugh: Can't believe swapping out a head took this long.:screwy::laugh:


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## bigfatgeek (Feb 5, 2005)

Congrats!


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## WannaCorrado (Apr 30, 2000)

awesome!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Found that I simply failed to reconnect the brake booster hose from the intake manifold. Done!

Started him up and the difference was night and day. By the time I finished resetting the clock and the radio, pairing my phone (I have an aftermarket unit with BT), etc., he was fully warm. Well why not follow the reset computer procedure now then (which requires the engine being warm)!

Shut him off, disconnected the CTS, unplugged the PCV hose and pinched it off, started car, let idle for a minute, revved it a few times too (the first time he didn't want to rev which tells me the timing was off...and a bit later I revved him again and he revved OK I guess as he "learned"). Let idle some more. Shut off, reconnected everything.

Went for a drive. Mostly good! The idle then wanted to idle around 1200rpm most of the time. Went by the gas station and put 1/2 tank of fuel in him. Still idled high. However it came down to normal twice...once when I came to a stop sign with him left in gear until I got to about 800rpm and also when I parked him in front of the house...just moving him with no throttle and with the clutch instead knocked the idle down. I suspect it'll hopefully smooth out over the next few days.

No leaks (so far...knock on wood), no overheating, pretty much drives like it never happened.

There's a funny squeak I can hear while the window is down and I hope it'll go away...we'll see. Could be something from him sitting for so long.


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## Seano (Jan 2, 2003)

There goes a happy man....


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Just for grins, I went back through my bills over the past year and totalled up anything automotive (Napa, Europarts, German Auto Parts, Pep Boys, etc.) as an estimation of what this job cost. Total...$1275 USD. $300 of that alone is for the head work. The rest were some tools (all of which I can use again though not sure when...and sort of hope I never have to), whatever necessary parts for a timing belt replacement, and a lot of "while I'm in there" things like water pump, pulleys, some coolant hoses, serpentine belt, coolant hose tee, etc. etc. etc.

Original estimate from the shop was 10 hours to tear down, 10 to assemble (and at over $100/hour for labor that's over $2K alone), plus whatever the head would have cost to send out and have done and whatever over "can't re-use" parts that would have been in there. So I am guessing my wallet saved about 55-60% at least.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> Original estimate from the shop was 10 hours to tear down, 10 to assemble. So I am guessing my wallet saved about 55-60% at least.


Normally it takes a lot longer to assemble compared with the time to tear down, particularly if a torque wrench is used. There is also time taken for cleaning & inspecting carefully.
You will find that most of the tools will be used again. There will always be the next belt change.
I have just adjusted my pump timing[TDI engine] in between belt changes & the results are worthwhile.
Most of the time I am saving at least 75% of the cost by DIY. For example it cost me 80UK pounds for a timing belt kit + 28 pounds postage, that's under A$200. General cost for this engine to have belts changed & timed is around A$1400, & I don't have to worry if they have turned the tensioner backwards or overtightened it breaking the alumiium casting or all the other things that can go wrong by careless work.
Once again, well done for persisting & achieving a good result.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Took him in yesterday for fluids to be changed.

1. Oil Change (I do full synth)

2. Coolant flush

3. Brake fluid flush

4. Transmission check/fill/whatever.

While doing the coolant flush they found the coolant globe was leaking (although I wasn't losing coolant but maybe under a pressure test it may have leaked slightly). I admit the seam half-way around was kinda crusty and brittle looking. I was a little miffed they went and ordered that w/o asking me though because it's a mere $40 at Europarts and an easy install on my own to save some $. Then again, I don't have to crawl under the van and drain the (new) coolant, make a mess, etc. But I guess that's the kind of mess I would be willing to make for the $ saved since coolant can go right back in (the other fluids I hate having to store and recycle somewhere which is why I usually don't bother changing those myself).

On the transmission I had complained about my abrupt clutch engagement and sometimes crunchy gearchange. They said the gearbox was filled with very thick gear oil and it looked quite black and dirty. They drained it and filled it with Redline MT fluid (thinner pinkish stuff).

The result after the MT fuild change and brake flush (bear in mind the hydro clutch shares the brake fluid)? The clutch engagement is much smoother. Not perfect but the improvement is indeed noticeable. I've been annoyed ever since I got him about the clutch action that just never seemed right to me. I would expect that any leftover roughness (not much) that I may have will be taken care of one day when I do need a new clutch but for right now there's no reason for that kind of teardown yet.

And under the hood looks a lot better with the new coolant bottle and pretty colored  coolant.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

I'm very pleased to report that the poor ol' boy (going on 21 years old now...production date of 10/92) passed the California smog test with flying colors.

I had doubts going in as we never truly set the ignition timing officially after the head rebuild; we had just marked the distributor body prior to removal and tried to match it up as best as I could, but I figured knowing that Digifant systems don't like timing messed with (it often overrides your minor adjustments), that implies to me that Digifant effectively does its own fine-tuning of the timing as long as your "major" adjustment isn't far off. At least that's what I tell myself. 

Anyway, so here are the results (worse (but not by much) in only two categories, the bolded ones are improvement):

15mph
%CO2 14.4 measured (14.7 2 years ago)
%O2 0.2 measured (.1 2 years ago)
HC (PPM, max, average, measured) 86/23/*13* (37 2 years ago)
CO% (max, average, measured) 0.60, 0.10, *0.02* (.10 2 years ago)
NO (PPM, max, average, measured) 494/179/200 (156 2 years ago)

25mph
%CO2 14.4 measured (14.7 2 years ago)
%O2 0.2 measured (.1 2 years ago)
HC (PPM, max, average, measured) 51/16/*8* (16 2 years ago)
CO% (max, average, measured) 0.73, 0.09, 0.02 (.01 2 years ago)
NO (PPM, max, average, measured) 747/164/*12* (14 2 years ago)


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

Congrats. Always nerve wracking going in for the smog check.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So this weekend I dug around a bit to solve an electrical issue (which has turned out to be I think two issues that are actually unrelated).

Ever since my headlamp relay install a few years ago, I get some odd behavior with the headlamp switch some of the time. But I'm still digging on that one with no solution yet and will get into that another time.

The other issue is that at random times when I turn the key to the "on" in preparation to start the car, the tach needle will jump to about 2000 rpm momentarily as if spiked by something electrical. The key also would get really hot and the lock cylinder hole also got hot. I think I noticed that the two were probably related...when the tach didn't spike, the key didn't get hot during the subsequent drive. Can't say if I noticed it 100% of the time but it sure seemed like it a lot of the time.

So I replaced the electrical portion of the ignition switch. Surprisingly not that bad given that some people have really complained about that little screw that holds it in position. The old switch had a visible crack in it so something was going on, although I expected to probably find melted plastic and perhaps some burn marks but nothing else looked amiss. Either way, on a few drives I no longer have the spiking tach needle on startup and also haven't gotten a really hot ignition key yet either.

(Now watch...I bet I jinxed myself...)


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Spent the afternoon waxing the ol' boy. I got tired though (and it was kinda hot) so I skipped the roof but I'll do that another weekend. In the meantime here's Herman in all his glory with everything but the roof waxed.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

Nice, that's probably the cleanest long-nose I've seen. I wish mine were that color. I'm not sure what the previous owner did to mine, but it looks like he may have taken it weekly to an automatic car wash that used plastic brushes because the paint looks like anodized aluminum.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Lighting and angles LOL.

Mine actually needs paint and bodywork. The hood maybe you can see if you look closer is hazy as is the top of the front bumper. The roof has no shine whatsoever and is a little more gray than tan. It's totally "sunburned" on the roof and hood with the clearcoat coming off of the hood and the roof pretty much has no clearcoat left at all. All around mine are lots of dings and scratches and the right side has a shallow dent from the passenger door all the way down the slider to the rear wheel. I pushed it out and it's not too bad but it's kinda "bumpy". The right rear bumper cap was a pebble-grain CL one that the PO painted to replace a missing one, so it doesn't match when you look close. I made the mistake of waxing that yesterday and got wax all in the grain (next wash should scrub it out though). I also have a dent in the front bumper that I stuffed a chunk of styrofoam between the dented rebar and the cover that pushes it back out on the cover and makes it not so bad.

The interior of mine is actually in pretty decent shape though. Could use another steam cleaning but otherwise I'd give it a 'B+'.

Oh and all my window tint needs to be removed. It's all bubbly.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

If you've never removed tint before, this method works incredibly well:

Make a 25% dilution of simple green and water, spray it on the inside of the window, then put a black plastic garbage bag against the wet window. The simple green and water solution will cause the plastic to stick in place. Leave it in the sun for about 30 mintues like that, then remove the black plastic and the window tint will just peel right off leaving nothing behind.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

djnibler said:


> If you've never removed tint before, this method works incredibly well:
> 
> Make a 25% dilution of simple green and water, spray it on the inside of the window, then put a black plastic garbage bag against the wet window. The simple green and water solution will cause the plastic to stick in place. Leave it in the sun for about 30 mintues like that, then remove the black plastic and the window tint will just peel right off leaving nothing behind.


Interesting!

Years ago I had to scrape off window tint from my Mk2 because I had tinted the front door windows and eventually got caught. I peeled the stuff off for the most part but I did use Simple Green and an old plastic credit card to scrape off the adhesive. This sounds more effective.

Dumb question...black plastic garbage bag because the black will attract more heat? Or doesn't really matter on the color?


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

gti_matt said:


> Dumb question...black plastic garbage bag because the black will attract more heat?


Yup, that's why. I read about it online some years back and was pretty skeptical but I tried it on a friend's car and couldn't believe how easy it made the job. The tint almost fell off. Of course, there may be differences in how effective the method is depending on the brand of tint that was used but it sure worked well for me.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Mine's bubbly and ripply enough that I think it'll come off easily once coaxed.:thumbup:


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

For a van that's 20 years old, very tidy. It looks like someone has jacked the van by the sill panel in the past. Mine had a small amount of damage from that near the rear wheel but had it repaired when I had the rear hatch touched up.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Yep I've noticed that rocker panel damage. Doesn't bother me too much though...not as much as the faded paint on the hood and roof and the dinged-up slider door. It looks OK from 20 feet away for the most part but as you get closer the nicks and dings (which are many) become apparent.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Also got rid of some of the rattles via adjusting the doors:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6138813


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## miguel indurain (Jun 13, 1999)

> Nice, that's probably the cleanest long-nose I've seen. ...


Short nose, right? The longs are the VR6s with the fender vents, and the longer noses?...

Anyway, your van does look clean, Matt. :thumbup: It's kinda hard to find '93s around here that are ratty and clapped out, but when you do see good examples I'd bet enthusiasts own them.

The original tint on our van went all bubbly a few years back too; started right on the edge of the hatch window where those black dimples on the glass are, then spread into the middle part and even though I could still see out the back, the "look" just really drove me crazy so I had a tint shop just rip it out and re-do it. Of course it didn't help that the van was always parked outside and the hatch always faces due south... 

Djnibler, thanks much for the tip a few weeks ago re: the fan shutters. Found the part, pulled it off, opened up the shutters and the van runs a hash mark cooler. :beer:

Matt, have you waxed your van yet? How's your clear coat doing?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

miguel indurain said:


> Matt, have you waxed your van yet? How's your clear coat doing?


Thanks for the compliments.

In the above pics, the sides and hood are waxed. The clearcoat is pretty much gone on the roof and on the hood and top of the front bumper it's about 1/2 gone. It will need paint eventually but for now I'm stretching it as much as I can. Part of the problem is that it'll need some bodywork as well for the dings and small dents and so that ups the cost too...can't very well paint a dented up van. Well I could...but it's silly.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

miguel indurain said:


> Short nose, right? The longs are the VR6s with the fender vents, and the longer noses?...



I always thought the 5cyl were long nose and the VR6 short (it just looks that way to me) but I googled it and you are correct!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

djnibler said:


> I always thought the 5cyl were long nose and the VR6 short (it just looks that way to me) but I googled it and you are correct!


The North American 5-cylinder ones have rather large front bumpers that probably makes them look long, so I bet that contributes to the mix-up.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

gti_matt said:


> So I replaced the electrical portion of the ignition switch. Surprisingly not that bad given that some people have really complained about that little screw that holds it in position. The old switch had a visible crack in it so something was going on, although I expected to probably find melted plastic and perhaps some burn marks but nothing else looked amiss. Either way, on a few drives I no longer have the spiking tach needle on startup and also haven't gotten a really hot ignition key yet either.
> 
> (Now watch...I bet I jinxed myself...)


I'm jinxed.

I have gotten the spiking tach needle at least once since the swap, but the hot-key situation hasn't returned. But I have a new problem...twice now the headlamps, wipers, and HVAC haven't worked and jiggling the key solves it. New ignition switch appears to be bad.


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## rcxworks (Sep 11, 2010)

*rocker dent*

How does that happen? mine has the same exact dent on the drivers side.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

rcxworks said:


> How does that happen? mine has the same exact dent on the drivers side.


Most likely it was lifted on a rack or jacked up w/the lift or jack not in the right place.


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## jets (Oct 12, 2005)

rcxworks said:


> How does that happen? mine has the same exact dent on the drivers side.


This is very annoying & unfortunately far too common. There was a thread here some time ago with owners reporting similar experiences. I do all my own work & if I need new tyres, I remove the wheels & take them in another vehicle. If I was forced to take the van to a workshop I would talk to the mechanic first about where to position the support. My first & lasting experience of bad jacking was with an early beetle where the tyre fitter placed the jack under the engine to lift the rear end.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jets said:


> My first & lasting experience of bad jacking was with an early beetle where the tyre fitter placed the jack under the engine to lift the rear end.


:screwy:

My father used to have a Ford Aerostar minivan and took it into Goodyear for service (or maybe it was tires...not sure exactly) and they lifted it a bit forward of the rear tire and put a huge dent in it (far worse than the one around the door frame on my T4). I'm stil bewildered to this day my dad took the car from them and nary a word about the damage.

Not his van but it was kinda like this:









Only memory serves me that it was even a little worse than that such that the side panel bowed out slightly and was visible when looking down the side of the van.


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## [email protected] (Apr 2, 1999)

Lookin' good there Matt! That van has come together nicely. :thumbup:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

[email protected] said:


> Lookin' good there Matt! That van has come together nicely. :thumbup:


Thanks!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Small mod done over the weekend. I added these to the front doors (bought from Eurocampers.com):










The glovebox cup holders are a joke...they work with only 12oz soda cans and plus the glovebox light stays on the entire time they're in use. They don't confidently hold a Starbucks grande.:thumbdown:

The previous owner had screwed a MV-style cupholder to the driver's door but that wasn't workable either. He used the closed-loop kind that still only accommodates a 12oz can. For a while I replaced that with the similar kind that has the open adjustable arms. But the front doors have a slight inward tilt to the door panel and anything I put there would vibrate on out and fall on the floor, or fall on the floor when making a left turn.:thumbdown:

These Fischer units are bigger and bulkier but not tremendously so. They are far more effective though in accommodating larger containers securely. They also go well with the black center dashboard inserts and black footwell trim ('93s have black stepwells/footwells) just fine and don't look out of place. They look like VW built the Eurovan with them in it.:thumbup:

You have to drill the holes in them which is a little bit of a pain, as the bottom row of holes are impossible to get at unless you partially dismantle the cupholder's guts (just pay attention how it goes together and don't break anything disconnecting things).

I removed the plugs for the manual window cranks and installed these over the crank holes for optimal positioning (leaving the plugs in place made for an uneven mounting surface). If you have manual windows you might have a problem finding a good spot for these. When mounting them, choose a location that isn't likely to be bumped by your hand when reaching for the turn signal (and if manual windows, pick a place where you have comfortable clearance for cranking the window).


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Drove out to Palm Springs this weekend from San Diego and back again...Herman's first big highway trip since the engine half-rebuild. He performed flawlessly.

Left Friday night and came back Sunday afternoon. Round trip, including some in-town driving around Palm Springs, La Quinta, and Palm Desert. Total distance 350.8 miles and he returned 22.2 MPG. On the freeway I drove 65-67mph, didn't hit traffic to speak of. The trip out we didn't use the A/C at all. While out there we did use he A/C since it was a good 90F or more. Also used the A/C coming back. I'm thinking w/o the A/C that over 23 MPG should be possible.:thumbup:


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## chudzikb (Sep 21, 2000)

gti_matt said:


> Small mod done over the weekend. I added these to the front doors (bought from Eurocampers.com):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I had one of those in an old B5 passat that I owned. The cupholders in that Passt were worse than useless, the fischer cup holder really does a great job, you will be happy.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So this morning I drove Herman the German to work since I haven't driven him in a few days. I go out to him and notice a business card under the driver's wiper. I pull it out and there's additional writing on it but a light overnight rain smeared it and made it illegible.

Curiosity gets the best of me anyway and I email the guy named on the card and ask why he left the card on my van. This was the response.










Just when you thought you were the only nutcase that was addicted to old T4s, you find you're in good company.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well in the 4+ years I've had the ol' boy, I've never been happy with his clutch. I've always suspected the hydraulics.

This afternoon or Monday I guess I'll finally find out.

This morning on the way to work while at a stoplight, Herman refused to go into gear (blocks gears) with no warning whatsoever. Clutch pedal also feels funny and doesn't rebound as fast as it normally does. I'm thinking he crapped his clutch slave cylinder. If it isn't that, my next guess is the clutch release lever inside the bellhousing.

I don't remember the sequence of events exactly but somehow between either stalling him or shutting off the engine, I got it into gear with the engine off, then started the engine in gear (torks!) and was able to limp in 1st to a gas station on the corner and call for a tow from there.

Wish me luck!

EDIT: aaaah I see there's a master cylinder and a slave cylinder. I guess it's one or the other.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Got the call...blown hydraulic line between the clutch master cylinder and clutch slave cylinder. So I was kinda close. $475 P&L but the part has to come from BFE or something so it won't be done until middle of next week.:banghead: Hopefully there's no additional damage...they threw in that caveat that "we can't fully test the hydraulics with the blown line" which yeah is true but hopefully no further surprises.


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## kauboi (Nov 3, 2004)

that stinks, but if it was the original line, I guess it lasted a long time. If it is the master or slave clutch cylinder after all, you might do well to replace both. I've done this, though not on a Eurovan, and think its not too hard to DIY.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

kauboi said:


> that stinks, but if it was the original line, I guess it lasted a long time. If it is the master or slave clutch cylinder after all, you might do well to replace both. I've done this, though not on a Eurovan, and think its not too hard to DIY.


Looking at the parts diagram at jimellisvwparts.com it appears the line is made up of several ones connected together. Most I suspect are formed metal but one is called a "pressure hose" and looks rubbery (the way it's drawn with a dotted "texture" in the diagram). They weren't specific as to which one went but I bet that's the most likely culprit.

I'm thinking at least an hour of that labor is bleeding the system...probably the brakes too. Not sure how you can do this w/o bleeding everything.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Shop called and they got the part in at 3pm today. Won't have time to put it in today and of course tomorrow is Thanksgiving and they said they'll work on it Monday (I assume therefore that Friday is a holiday for them as well). Was really hoping to have the ol' boy back today. Oh well.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

He's back and my wallet is about $478 lighter. $100 or so for the ruptured hose (seems to be about the going price online once you add in shipping and taxes (if any)) and a little bit of brake fluid and the rest is labor. Shifts about the same as before.


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## chudzikb (Sep 21, 2000)

I have had that very part go on other cars I have owned. A Ford, and a past VW, it is truly a quick and easy repair, more annoying than anything else. Glad you got it fixed.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

chudzikb said:


> I have had that very part go on other cars I have owned. A Ford, and a past VW, it is truly a quick and easy repair, more annoying than anything else. Glad you got it fixed.


I'm sure I could have done it myself but it was one of those "I'm really in no mood to do it, we got company coming this week from out of town, it can be a little messy to do, etc." things. I'm also glad it wasn't something more "internal" to the clutch or transmission.

I was hoping after the hose swap that bleeding the system would be in order too and that it'd help out some of my abrupt clutch engagement (randomly happens although it has generally improved over time every time I have the brake system bled, leading me to believe it's hydraulic in nature). It's no worse, but not really any better either (I've been suspecting I have some air bubbles or some goopy fluid in the clutch cylinders), so if they did bleed it (I assume they would have to) it didn't really do much to improve smoother engagement this time around.


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## chudzikb (Sep 21, 2000)

Do you have one of those pressure bleeders that you pump up? They are pretty effective at getting the clutch master and slave flushed out.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

I do...just a matter of getting psyched to do it. Well I have the kind that goes on the master cylinder reservoir. That's probably not the right kind for this sort of thing is it?


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## chudzikb (Sep 21, 2000)

Why, yes, that will work just fine. And I surely understand the "get motivated" problem. Still need to change the trans fluid, has not happened yet. Just get caught up in other things and it is COLD now...


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So a week or so ago I replaced the throttle potentiometer (aka throttle position sensor).

http://europarts-sd.com/sensor-throttlepositionmt1992-1996.asp










I had observed that my throttle was a bit jumpy off idle making the van a little hard to drive smoothly at low speeds.

Testing of the resistance across terminals of the old one (has three terminals) revealed:

1. Across one pair, no change in resistance as the throttle was moved.

2. Across another pair, the resistance increased but right off closed throttle there was a jump in the readings that were not smooth "in order".

3. Across another pair, the resistance decreased but right off closed throttle there was also a jump in the readings that was not smooth and "in order".

For example (making up numbers here for sake of illustration) as I moved the throttle off of closed, I saw a reading like 3.0, 3.3, 3.1, 3.2, 3.3, 3.4, 3.5, etc. where I would expect that it'd be steady.

I also had another issue lately where once warm the van would idle a little erratically and often too fast (around 1000 rpm rather than ~750rpm). Sometimes a restart would correct it, sometimes not.

Replaced it and reset the ECU per the instructions about warming the motor so that the fans come on at least once, disconnect the coolant temperature sensor, disconnect the PCV valve hose and plugging it, letting it idle, etc.

Idle problems are gone (but could have been part of the reset and not a result of the throttle sensor replacement) and the jumpiness is a little better but not improved as much as I'd hoped.

I also previously had a problem where if you were driving downhill and used VERY light throttle (barely off closed where I predict that spike in the electrical resistance would be) that the motor would rhythmically surge. It still does it although maybe slightly less so.

So I might have had some wear in the contacts of the old sensor and this new one has smoothed it out a little but but I was still hoping for a little more tangible improvement for my $80.

Maybe I'll try djnibler's ground location thread...
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6881043-5cyl-Eurovan-ECU-ground-locations

...and check and clean the grounds for the ECU.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

Thx for the followup. I've been waiting for it.... thinking of replacing mine as well (part of my current effort of throwing money at my surging problem lol).


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So after many months of having Herman back together, I noticed the valve cover was seeping oil.

Today I tackled it, thinking I would get a new gasket and RTV it to the valve cover and then install it.

I take him apart and I find crushed gaskets on the studs under the valve cover. WTF?

Thinking I have to go to VW to get four replacements, I start looking online for them.

I then notice that they don't look like what I have.

Then, I realize.:banghead:

When I put the valve cover on, I put new cone-shaped gaskets on the studs.

_Over the old ones._

Don't ask me why. Who knows what I was thinking.

This is how it should look (not a Eurovan motor but I think a Mk3 1.9 diesel but it's the same idea).










Imagine that but with another gasket on top of that existing gasket, lifting the cover too high.

Anyway, so since I had two sets of gaskets on there, the valve cover sat too high and after tightening it down (and crushing the topmost layer of gaskets that were not needed), the cover never sat right on the valve cover gasket. The old valve cover gasket itself looked great...probably since I never had it effectively tightened down nicely, so I'm taking a chance and reusing it.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

Let me know how it works. I've had to replace my VCG gasket twice now. It keeps leaking from the corner. I've taken to using the white VW oil pan gasket maker in addition to the gasket in order to get a good seal. The last VCG I installed lasted about 20k miles or so? I can't remember, but it wasn't that long. Current one is leaking so far. 

I'm almost positive I replaced the center bushing gaskets and that I removed the old ones before but if it starts leaking again around the edge, I'll have to double check that.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

It'll be a while before I know if it's leaking or not, since I drive the van only a few times a week.

On a second note, on your (djnibler's) suggestion (we had an offline conversation about T4 issues), I added an additional ground strap to my battery between it and the body.

Years ago I replaced the OEM cable which attached IIRC to the body and to the transmission. The new cable only had one place to attach at the end so that went on the transmission. So I had nothing to the body. I thought "trans is mounted to the trans mount which is attached to the body so yeah should be fine". Wrong.

So I had two things that were solved by this.

1. When I plugged my cell phone into the AUX jack on my stereo to play music, simultaneously plugging in my cell phone to the 12V charger made a loud static noise come over the radio speakers while the engine was running. This is almost 100% gone.

2. My power windows are more responsive and faster. When I lowered them with one-touch down, it would take a while for the controller to "release" that window to permit the other window to go down as well (in a '93, you cannot operate both windows at the same time). Now, I can hear the controller click off ASAP when the respective window is down. Also, when putting the windows up with the ignition off, they used to be painfully slow. They are more normal-speed now.:thumbup:

This was the strap I used. I went from the battery negative terminal to the ground point at the hood hinge where there's a ground strap between the inside of the fender and the hood.










It's about 15" long and just fits nicely. I bought another one to try to go to the motor, such as the valve cover, but it was too short.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

djnibler said:


> If you've never removed tint before, this method works incredibly well:
> 
> Make a 25% dilution of simple green and water, spray it on the inside of the window, then put a black plastic garbage bag against the wet window. The simple green and water solution will cause the plastic to stick in place. Leave it in the sun for about 30 mintues like that, then remove the black plastic and the window tint will just peel right off leaving nothing behind.


This turned out to be a great tip although I didn't bother with a Simple Green solution...I sprayed it right on.

So I cut a black plastic garbage bag to fit the window, sprayed on Simple Green, smoothed the bag onto the window as best as I could, let it sit for an hour in the sun, came out and removed the bag, and then started peeling the tint (usually I would pick an existing bubble in the tint, slit it with a knife, and then start peeling).

Best results happen with heat, heat, heat. Only do this on a hot sunny day for best results and when you remove the tint it must also be hot. If you put the bag on at like 3pm and come back at 7pm at dusk, it won't really work well at all. Best to do in the middle of the day for applying the bag, waiting an hour or so, and then peeling it all off in the heat of the day.

Simple Green does pretty good at removing the tint's glue from the window too but again....works best in the heat. It smears and streaks a bit and you have to end it all with proper Windex, but this is overall the way to go. It still can be time intensive though, especially if the tint tears and you get smaller pieces, but so far it's working pretty well. I have all of my windows de-tinted except for one and a few that I did already need some extra attention to get a few scraps off, but otherwise I'm well on my way to clear windows again.:thumbup:


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## jjkoa (Jul 17, 2014)

*eurovan*

I have a 92 and really like the inside also im amazed the seats are still firm for its age.I got really lucky 50k original miles and i got it for 300 runs like its new.havent figured how to post pictures yet.just powered it on 17s


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## jjkoa (Jul 17, 2014)

*eurovan*

sorry wrong area


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

jjkoa said:


> I have a 92 and really like the inside also im amazed the seats are still firm for its age.I got really lucky 50k original miles and i got it for 300 runs like its new.havent figured how to post pictures yet.just powered it on 17s





jjkoa said:


> sorry wrong area


I'll weigh in anyway 

The interior on my '93 does amaze me. The van lived in NM and AZ most of its life before coming to SoCal with me in 2009, so by all rights the interior should be sun faded, the dash cracked, and the headliner falling. The P.O. did tint the windows, but still...growing up in inland SoCal we had a 1985 Dodge Caravan, also with tinted windows, and by 1992 or so the front seats were shredded and the headliner billowing down. My van is nearly 3x as old and lived in a harsher climate and yet the interior is probably 80% of new. The front seats have some wear from sliding in/out (I would love to swap the bottoms or upholstery to get more life out of them), the rear seats are in nearly pristine shape except for the middle seat has a bunch of snags on it (I suspect a P.O. had a dog whose nails snagged the cloth) and both seats have minor tears near the seatbelt receptacles (from strapping in a child's seat tightly). Headliner is 95% of new except for one or two minor pokes and along the windshield it might be starting to come unglued right at the edge. Dash is entirely uncracked from the sun. The center section has suffered some trauma and so it's not that great with a few broken mounts.

In short, it's not today's luxe soft-touch plastics, but it's lasted against the sun and most use very well.

The only real defect is it suffers from the "sticky" plastic on all the pillar trim pieces that all the older vans seem to suffer from. It's also rather brittle...I know if I try and remove any of it, it'll crack and break. It's best left alone.

But VW definitely put some generally durable stuff in there.:thumbup: Wish it all didn't rattle so much though.:thumbdown:


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## jjkoa (Jul 17, 2014)

*eurovan*

I didnt realize this post was 10 pages long i was responding to the first page sorry.Im really impressed with the 92 im afraid my 2001 is going to be a money pit!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So Sunday I spent some time tracing down Herman's irritating idle issues.

To recap, for the past couple of months, when it was cold overnight, the first startup in the morning would result in the idle being all over the place. When cold he should idle closer to 1000 rpm, but instead was sometimes too low, too high, bouncing around, and prone to stalling during warm-up and hesitation during warm up, particularly between gears. Once he got warmer, he would at first idle better at around 800 rpm or so, but then for no reason would suddenly kick into idling around 1000 and running rich. Switching the motor off and on would fix it temporarily, but eventually it would come back to idling high.

I scanned with a VAGCOM and got error 00522 coolant temperature sensor intermittent. So I replaced the sensor and o-ring and reset the ECU. The problems continued :banghead: although no more codes were thrown. I continued rather perplexed about this. However during that tankful of fuel, his MPG did improve to 20  but perhaps that's California switching to winter fuel or something? I dunno.

So Sunday I decided to look at him some more. A few years back I was having low idling issues from time to time and my mechanic at the time cleaned the throttle body, which he said was filthy, and it did help a bit. So I went down that road again.

I removed the throttle body from the van and cleaned the heck out of it as best as I could. It wasn't dirty in general but I did get a bit of dirt out of the larger vacuum hose port where some hose connects from the throttle body to some valve mounted on the firewall behind the brake booster. I also noticed what probably is an idle adjustment screw just above where the cable connects. I removed that screw, carefully counting the number of turns, cleaned the screw and the hole where the screw goes, and reinstalled the same number of turns. I have no idea what constitutes baseline or spec on this, but I counted 10 half-turns from where it was to where the threads disengaged, so that's what I put back.

I also removed the ISV and cleaned it pretty good. I wasn't suspicious of this particularly because the van had no problem when it was warm to creep in first gear, even up a hill, but who knows. I was also hesitant to mess with it because the original ISV failed a few years ago after I cleaned it. But nevertheless I cleaned this one.

Reassembled it all and so far for about 70 miles, it's good. I still get a notable hesitation/kick between shifts during the warm-up period, but the idle speed seems mostly spot-on now. The other different behavior so far is when the RPMs return to idle, they return a bit slower than before to idle and sometimes even pause a little bit on the way down. I'm not sure if this is how it *should* be, but if it returns a little slower to idle and cures the stalling issues that I had, I think I'll be pretty happy.

I am thinking that these engines really need to have clean passages for the airflow and vacuum connections wherever possible and that they are sensitive to dirt and whatnot.

Speaking of that, I would love to remove and clean the PCV valve atop the valve cover, but I pulled and twisted it but it didn't seem to want to let go. Anyone know how to remove it? I felt like I was going to break something if I pulled any harder.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So two weeks after doing the above, Herman is running smashingly well. Stable idle, the stalling-after-coasting-in-gear-with-no-throttle-for-a-while problem seems to be gone too, the idle never seems to bounce below where it should be, and I would even say that coasting in gear I feel a tad less drag than before too maybe. MPG continues to be good (seat of the pants gauge tells me about 20, up from mid 18s). The only thing he does is when the revs come down they seem to come down to idle a bit slow as if it might hang and rev too high but then they do return to normal. Part of me wants to (after all this cleaning) reset the ECU again and the other part of me says "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".


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## bigfatgeek (Feb 5, 2005)

Hooray for Herman's recovery. Post some fresh pix of your ride one of these days.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well dammit :-( he's acting up again.

This past weekend he started idling fast again, including a few times getting stuck at about 1800 rpm. When that happens, I can bring him down w/just the clutch engaging and then he'll idle at about 1000 but still high and smelling rich. Did a trip around SoCal from San Diego to Riverside County to the OC and back to SD and got only about 18.7mpg whereas in the past I have gotten over 20mpg on freeway trips.

:banghead: So frustrating.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

I hate to say it but it might be time for a new ISV. They don't last forever, but I know they aren't cheap. It cured all my issues with idling and dying under heavy load (rad fan on, AC on, slowing to a stop). 

These things are hard to diagnose. I still have that surging/hesitation issue under acceleration 100% of the time between 1500 and 4000 RPMs that just drives me nuts and I have tried everything. I keep toying with the idea of just going with a megasquirt ECU. I could do a plug and play setup for like $650, and then I'd be able to data log and view/adjust everything. But $650 is a lot to spend on a 22 year old van for the chance of fixing it, especially when I have other more exciting projects to sink my and time into.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

djnibler said:


> I hate to say it but it might be time for a new ISV. They don't last forever, but I know they aren't cheap. It cured all my issues with idling and dying under heavy load (rad fan on, AC on, slowing to a stop).


Hmmm maybe. After the cleaning I did, I didn't reset the ECU though. I might try that one more time and also scan again for error codes (although lately I've usually gotten none).

Hard to diagnose indeed. It's crazy when they are fine for a week or two and then out of the blue it starts acting up again when nothing changed from the day before.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Got an error....but same as I've had before.:banghead: Has a new sensor but I guess now time to check the wiring and connections.

Thursday,01,January,2015,18:24:31:49819
VCDS Version: Release 14.10.0

Address 01: Engine Labels: 023-906-022.lbl
Control Module Part Number: 023 906 022 F
Component and/or Version: DIGIFANT 1.2 1144
Software Coding: 
Work Shop Code: 
VCID: 0E138A874A95FE51ED7-095C
1 Fault Found:

00522 - Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor (G62) 
34-10 - No Elaboration Available - Intermittent

Readiness: N/A


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

Yeah check the wiring and if you want to ensure it's good, create a bypass harness. Basically create a brand new harness for the coolant temp sensor, putting new pin terminals on each end (ECU and sensor connector ends). De-pin the factory wires and insert the new. It's a bit of work and you need the right tool and connectors but wiring issues that are sporadic due to a weak connection or wire short you can't see inside a harness wrap can be nearly impossible to locate.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Yep

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/00522


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

djnibler said:


> Let me know how it works. I've had to replace my VCG gasket twice now. It keeps leaking from the corner. I've taken to using the white VW oil pan gasket maker in addition to the gasket in order to get a good seal. The last VCG I installed lasted about 20k miles or so? I can't remember, but it wasn't that long. Current one is leaking so far.
> 
> I'm almost positive I replaced the center bushing gaskets and that I removed the old ones before but if it starts leaking again around the edge, I'll have to double check that.


FYI...on this after I reinstalled mine it's leaking less but I still am getting some leakage at the front corner near the distributor. Not a drip, but just some airborne drops/mist enough to attract dirt and turn it to grime.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So a little over a week ago I removed the CTS connector, bent the pins on the CTS slightly in opposite directions, and reinstalled (looking for a snugger fit on the connector which didn't feel all that snug to be honest). Also the wires had been cut and spliced by the PO (IDK why) and I wrapped some electrical tape around them better in case the wires were shorting out or arc-ing (who knows). So far today he drove > 30 minutes each way and totally behaved (correct idle, etc.).

Also I found out as I suspected the shutters on the cooling fans are missing their thermostat-based adjuster. On a whim (since it was cool out) I closed the shutters by hand and after about 15 minutes on the road, he warmed up faster than before (approaching what I would call a normal warm-up (he normally takes a long time to warm up in cooler weather) and got warm enough that I started getting nervous and I pulled over and opened the shutters. So looks like I probably should hunt down a shutter thermostat, since it does make a notable difference in warm up. 

So far all the goofing w/the CTS connector and wiring and pins is holding up. He's been running great again for the past week.

I also experimented with the fan shutters more for now by opening one of them and closing the other. While the weather is cool, it warms the car up better but doesn't generally get too hot to be a problem until I decide to put in a fan shutter controller.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So about a month ago I took the ol' boy in for an oil change and a torn CV boot and asked them to inspect the suspension control arm bushings (the right front was sort of noisier than the left over sharp bumps). Sure enough I had a torn bushing. So I have a new control arm (comes with bushings so I guess less labor than pressing out/in the old ones?) but I did have them save me the old arm in the event that I ever (heaven forbid) hit a curb and bend it in the future and like a lot of T4-specific parts things are starting to be made of unobtanium.:banghead:

All in all it seems it was fairly labor intensive but the parts prices were a bit :screwy:. But of course you can't bring your own parts (usually) to a shop and none of this work I relished doing myself. So my wallet was a LOT lighter in the end after this visit.

On the plus side, he's riding quieter now, I don't grit my teeth and brace myself for every pavement crack/joint anymore either. In general he's also running darn good in general, idling smoothly and quietly, etc.


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## Lugboot (Sep 24, 2010)

I had the same thing done on my van--but did not replace the entire control arm. The shop replaced all the bushings in the control arms. And the steering rack bushings were replaced by a dealership prior to that. I'm guessing that primarily the shop in your case didn't want to deal with pressing or burning out old bushings and pressing new ones in. The van did drive much better after that!


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Lugboot said:


> I had the same thing done on my van--but did not replace the entire control arm. The shop replaced all the bushings in the control arms. And the steering rack bushings were replaced by a dealership prior to that. I'm guessing that primarily the shop in your case didn't want to deal with pressing or burning out old bushings and pressing new ones in. The van did drive much better after that!


If the driver's side one goes, I may seek out another shop so I don't replace the whole thing. Now that I think about it, it also meant that I got a new ball joints too which wasn't very necessary because the old ones were only like 25K miles old. At least one of them is still attached to the old control arm that I have.

Or, maybe I try it myself, I dunno. I kinda hate heavier-duty jobs like this. But at the time I had a lot going on and just didn't even have the time on a weekend to even attempt this job whatsoever. Plus if any special tools are needed, I don't have them.


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## Itsamoto (May 1, 2014)

gti_matt said:


> If the driver's side one goes, I may seek out another shop so I don't replace the whole thing. Now that I think about it, it also meant that I got a new ball joints too which wasn't very necessary because the old ones were only like 25K miles old. At least one of them is still attached to the old control arm that I have.


Matt - can you share what type of parts were used in the repair? Were they OEM or another brand? The reason I'm asking about part choice -- is the unbelievable price (~$370 USD) I found on Rockauto for a Eurovan suspension kit (for my 02) by Moog. Its not clearly stated - but I believe this also includes all the control arm bushings pre-installed too. 

https://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=6386076&cc=1382688&jnid=436&jpid=0 


They have two kits that differ in front stabilizer bar - for either sway bars of 23mm or 27mm diameter. 

I'm knee deep into the van right now -- and my suspension components are all showing a lot of grime and rust -- it's caked and flaking metal in some areas. Even though the parts look awful -- they are holding up. Is there a litmus-test for knowing when to begin replacing rusty/oxidized components? At the moment all I can think to do is scrub them down -- maybe sand blast them and repaint what's decent. Any thoughts?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Nothing on my receipt has any brand names or part numbers (just pricing) and it's even higher than what you found (of course...that's where shops make their money on parts).

Europarts-sd.com has control arms for either $120 (early Eurovans like a '93) or $360 (1997+ ones). I wouldn't worry too much about just surface rust.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman got a new (to him) belly pan last night. Got it a couple of weeks ago from another reader on this list. Original was lost by a previous owner at some point. Once on, it reduces engine noise outside of the van noticeably. From inside, the reduction is minor. You might not even notice it if you didn't know to listen for it. But I do like it's quieter outside within a few feet of him when he's idling.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

Wow, I've had mine off for so long that I didn't even think/notice the noise difference. It's just such a pain to deal with when changing the oil. Glad you mentioned about the noise though..... I should put it back on.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

It's not a dramatic change. But the change in noise level is there if you know to listen for it.

My engine bay needs a good steam cleaning but there's no way I'm going to get to it anytime soon (other cray cray stuff going on with life) and I had to get the dang thing off the garage floor so I had to put it somewhere....hence why I put it where it belongs (on the car) for now.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

I've had good luck with a hose and some Simple Green Automotive Cleaner (it's not green, it's blue - Pep Boys carries it, or you can get it online). The Automotive stuff won't corrode rubber and other things like the green can.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Good to know, although I live in a condo and don't have a place to do this messy sort of job.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Just the other day I was thinking how great Herman's been running and things going fairly well other than needing a valve cover gasket and possibly a thermostat (still takes forever to warm up).

Then scheisse happened and I was on the side of the road waiting for a tow.:banghead:

The story is, he sat out in the rain all night but drove to work OK today. I took him because it was raining and I didn't want to get the Golf (my normal DD) dirty since we had just washed it last weekend.

Trip to work was fine...all raining but not heavily, didn't miss a beat. Sits in the parking lot at work in light rain for most of the day.

At about 3pm, I take a Starbucks break a mile or so down the hill from work. Starts up but misfires a little. Smooths out at higher RPM. I figure he's just reacting to the wet. Whatevs. Get my espresso and driving back to work and he is still misfiring. Take off from a light and he's REALLY misfiring and stumbling and it's getting worse. Hit this hill to go up to work and he's losing power badly. I believe I see unburned fuel going out the back (some hazy smoke).

I know I'm not going to make it so I pull over. Tried a few times to crank it and nothing. Tried to pop the clutch and nothing. Battery eventually goes dead from trying to crank it (I do know my battery is weak and doesn't hold a charge well after the car is shut off).

No idiot lights. Nothing otherwise amiss via gauges, etc.

Got towed to a nearby 4/5 star Yelp shop as I'm > 20 miles from home and my AAA doesn't cover more than 7 miles.

Anyone want to venture a guess while it's in the shop? Yeah it was raining but I never hit any big puddles and I have a belly pan on too. Thoughts? Since it was raining and I was in a bike lane and partially hanging in a traffic lane I didn't bother to get out and look under the hood for anything obvious.

I'm thinking:
1. Plug wires (about 6.5 years old) maybe causing a misfire (why didn't they do this in the morning though?), although he seemed to go from 1 cylinder misfire to probably about 3 cylinder misfire?
2. Coil failing, especially obvious as it heats up?
3. Hall effect sender failing?
4. Fuel pressure regulator or vacuum line controlling it is failing and flooding engine.


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## djnibler (Aug 5, 2005)

Matt, I had that happen to me one night when it was REALLY foggy and humid. The fog came out of nowhere (like in the 80's movie). Anyway, van started running like crap and eventually died. Next morning it fired right up and had no issues. Still have no clue what caused it. 

In your case, I'd guess either a coil or hall sensor. First guess of the two would be coil since it can get wet if you don't have your rain tray installed or a missing hood seal etc.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

I'm to pick up the car later today. I was told the root cause was a simple cracked distributor cap.

The shop kinda talked me into a general tune up (eh, ok, espcially since I haven't checked the ignition timing properly ever on this car and it looks like a pain to do, although I can clean/gap/replace spark plugs myself), throttle body cleaning (he does seem to run better and have less of the stalling problem when that's done), P/S fluid flush (it's been a while, yeah, and this is too sloppy to do myself), battery (definitely...it's dated 2007 and it was in the car when I got it in 2009 and I have never replaced it). Given that the car will need a smog later this year, it can't hurt to have it in tiptop shape.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Got the van back.

On the plus side, the initial impression is that it runs quite well. So far also the on/off throttle is less jumpier too so it's easier to drive this car smoothly. I only drove about a mile and a half back to work so we'll see how it goes on the commute home for a better analysis.

On the down side, I think they charged me 2x for spark plugs :banghead: and I missed that on my receipt and the catalytic converter might be on its way out now from the unburned fuel going through it. The van has a rattle when cold at certain RPMs from the cat area. Goes away when warm. If this is true, dang these things can go bad quite fast when hit with unburned fuel.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Well joy of joys, about one month after replacing my passenger mirror, now my driver's mirror has given up the ghost (broke upon folding). This is a mirror that I replaced back around 2009 or 2010. It's an aftermarket mirror, although of course even the OEM design of these is terrible with respect to the folding mechanism.

One would think with T4s still roaming the planet (particularly more numerous in Europe than in North America) that someone in the aftermarket would have come up with a potentially new design for the folding mechanism. Ugh. Off to buy another mediocre mirror and throw money down the drain...


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## marshy (Aug 7, 2012)

I'm curious what mirror you're going with. I need a new driver's side mirror too, and I keep trolling ebay for a green one but the ones available are asking way too much $$$.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

marshy said:


> I'm curious what mirror you're going with. I need a new driver's side mirror too, and I keep trolling ebay for a green one but the ones available are asking way too much $$$.


http://www.vwheritage.com and it's a UK outfit.

Make sure you pick one for a LHD vehicle and also power + heated instead of manual, as they sell mirrors that are manual and for RHD vehicles too. With shipping and the exchange rate in GBP it came to about $115 for mine. About a month or two ago I bought a passenger one and it was a bit less - came to $80 out the door then both due to a cheaper price than the driver's one and probably some exchange rate stuff going on.

I wasn't overly thrilled with the passenger one but for $80 vs. over $200 for a factory VW one (which doesn't even include the glass!) I guess it's par for the course. The passenger one I got has glass assembly that jiggles quite a bit at higher speeds and the mirror is not only convex like it should be but it's a bit fun-house distorted. Hopefully the driver's one will be better since it should be flat glass and I hope it jiggles less.


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## marshy (Aug 7, 2012)

Have you bothered painting it?
I wonder how close it is in quality to this?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Have not tried painting it since on a '93 they're all black.

And as far as the ebay one goes, dang...wish I saw that before I placed my VW Heritage order. I hadn't seen those in a while and thought that this guy wasn't selling T4 parts anymore. Anyhow, I would go for it if I were you. That is the one (from Latvia) I believe I bought around 2009/2010 to replace the broken factory mirror on my van. It's also the one that just broke on me this week, so it lasted a good 7 years. The black plastic did show some sun fade over time more so than factory mirrors but otherwise it was fine. However, I am not confident that it's a heated mirror (power adjustment yes but heated I'm not so sure). I want to say I didn't see mine behave like a heated mirror on cold mornings when it had condensation on it. If the possible lack of heating is OK with you, I would go for it. At that price it's no worse than a factory mirror really in terms of the crappy folding mechanism that the aftermarket has simply copied.


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## KBATTPO (Jan 15, 2001)

Those are motorised but not heated. At least mine is not.

I am in the process of converting my US spec left (driver) mirror to the UK spec left (passenger) mirror. In my hunt on I got a hold of two sets. One set is brand new aftermarket. Black shagreen plastic. Non heated glass. Very well made. Soon will be for sale.

I was about to install the above mirror onto my bus but accidentally came upon the second mirror - a complete used factory UK spec left (passenger) mirror. Will be repainting it to match my colour and installing it onto the the vehicle.

The idea is to make both mirrors symmetrical and to get the contour of the van a bit narrower that should help when driving through those pesky narrow two-lane rural bridges over the numerous creeks in the area where I live.


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## KBATTPO (Jan 15, 2001)

Those are motorised but not heated. At least mine is not.

I am in the process of converting my US spec left (driver) mirror to the UK spec left (passenger) mirror. In my hunt I got a hold of two sets of those. One set is brand new aftermarket. Black shagreen plastic. Non heated glass. Very well made. Soon will be for sale.

I was about to install the above mirror onto my bus but accidentally came upon the second mirror - a complete used factory UK spec left (passenger) mirror. Will be repainting it to match my colour and installing it onto the the vehicle.

The idea is to make both mirrors symmetrical and to get the contour of the van a bit narrower that should help when driving through those pesky narrow two-lane rural bridges over numerous creeks in the area where I live.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

KBATTPO said:


> The idea is to make both mirrors symmetrical and to get the contour of the van a bit narrower that should help when driving through those pesky narrow two-lane rural bridges over the numerous creeks in the area where I live.


Let us know how this plays out. I thought about getting a UK-spec "passenger" mirror which would mount on our driver's side and thus make both mirrors of the tall-and-skinny shape, but I seem to recall that someone tried this and the issue is that the UK passenger mirror does not tilt outward far enough to allow the driver anything other than a view of the side of the van.

If you sit on our passenger side and look in our passenger mirror, I guess it would be the same thing but in reverse. I find sitting on the passenger side that the mirror shows you the side of the van and not the road. I would think that would be the same problem with sitting on the driver's side with a UK passenger mirror.


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## KBATTPO (Jan 15, 2001)

I don't expect this to be a problem. There are a lot of vans in Europe with portrait oriented mirrors - Benzes and Renaults for example. Commercial grade vans in the US have those as well. 

Also, the asymmetrical mirrors in the Eurovan annoy my OCD.  

Reminds me how back 20 years ago the smallish passenger side mirrors were briefly en vogue. My 1997 Audi S6 and my wife's old 1998 Audi A4 came with those tiny contraptions from the factory. I almost immediately replaced both with the full sized mirrors sourced from the UK. That was a great improvement.


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## Itsamoto (May 1, 2014)

Symmetrical mirrors!!! I love symmetrical mirrors and did this conversion a while back to my GLS and I am completely used to the mirror now and have had zero issues, visibility is great. I highly recommend changing the passenger side mirror!


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## KBATTPO (Jan 15, 2001)

Yes, Itsamoto, I remember yours. They actually inspired me to do the same, only I will be replacing the driver side. With mirrors like yours I doubt I would be able to cross Delaware river via Washington Crossing Bridge w/o scraping the trusses with the passenger side mirror. I have already done this, twice. :banghead:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

KBATTPO said:


> I don't expect this to be a problem. There are a lot of vans in Europe with portrait oriented mirrors - Benzes and Renaults for example. Commercial grade vans in the US have those as well.


It's not the portrait shape that is the problem. It's that the mirror glass in that mirror does not adjust far enough to see much besides than the side of the van.

Adjust the passenger mirror in your van today to the position where it's pointed away from the van as reasonably far as it will go to near the end of its travel. Now, go sit in the passenger seat and what do you see? Probably mostly the side of the van, not the road (even though when sitting in the driver's seat you see the road well and none of the van's side). That is what I predict will happen putting a UK-spec portrait mirror on the driver's side and you sitting in the driver's seat looking at it.


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## Itsamoto (May 1, 2014)

That is a tight bridge -- luckily the Eurovan is pretty svelte already (compared to modern mini vans). That would be a whole lot of hurt in a Sienna or Odyssey. 

B5.5Forever has dual portrait mirrors -- and its looks good, he might know the trick as to how to set them up, butt for the reasons Matt mentioned is why I went with swapping the passenger side window only. Back in the day my first few cars never had a passenger side mirror - so I was less apprehensive on changing that mirror out.

The other thing though, is that the switch to the portrait mirror doesn't save as much space as it looks. Looking at the gap between the mirror housing and the black mount/fascia -- its actually larger than the landscape oriented mirror, pushing the mirror further away from the van. So the potential width savings are probably only about 1-2". Maybe I'll measure this out for the heck of it.


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## Itsamoto (May 1, 2014)

Ok I went and measured this on my van -- so the different is about 6cm (or bit over 2.25"). So you would save that amount, rather than add it on -- so the space savings actually significant (because of both sides).

The base width is shown as 2175mm with the assymmetrical mirrors:










So you'd probably be at about 2115mm with dual "portrait" mirrors, or 2235mm with dual "landscape" mirrors - so the total plus/minus difference is actually quite a bit!


We might as well add this SWB T5 dimensions in for fun too (2242mm at the mirrors):










I didn't realize the T5 had asymetrical mirrors too. :what:


We might as well add this LWB T6 dimensions in for fun too (2297mm at the mirrors):


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## KBATTPO (Jan 15, 2001)

gti_matt said:


> It's not the portrait shape that is the problem. It's that the mirror glass in that mirror does not adjust far enough to see much besides than the side of the van.
> 
> Adjust the passenger mirror in your van today to the position where it's pointed away from the van as reasonably far as it will go to near the end of its travel. Now, go sit in the passenger seat and what do you see? Probably mostly the side of the van, not the road (even though when sitting in the driver's seat you see the road well and none of the van's side). That is what I predict will happen putting a UK-spec portrait mirror on the driver's side and you sitting in the driver's seat looking at it.


Just done this a few minutes ago. You were right, the side of the van occupies most of the mirror, thanks for calling my attention to this. I feel this could be fixed by shimming up two out of four posts (the inner ones) for the mirror motor mount assembly thus turning it outwards. 



Itsamoto said:


> Ok I went and measured this on my van -- so the different is about 6cm


Thanks, much appreciated. 60mm is a lot, well worth pursuing.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

KBATTPO said:


> Just done this a few minutes ago. You were right, the side of the van occupies most of the mirror, thanks for calling my attention to this. I feel this could be fixed by shimming up two out of four posts (the inner ones) for the mirror motor mount assembly thus turning it outwards.


Of course you will lose foldability if you do that.

Then again, it's not like Eurovan mirrors were really meant to fold.:banghead:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So here is the new driver's side mirror, which turned out to be an interesting surprise.

I got it from http://www.vwheritage.com. It's the same place I got the passenger mirror from about two months ago. It was about $35 more, coming to about $115 shipped rather than the $80 that the passenger mirror was, but it's more than just the left hand side version.

For starters, the mirror (while landscape) is convex and the outer portion is even more convex for your blind spot. The innards appear to be pot metal rather than plastic. Both are welcome features, although the convex mirror with blind spot curvature takes getting used to when you are used to flat glass on that mirror. The downside to this is that when maneuvering into a tight spot (as I actually do when I nestle the van into its parking pad on the side of my driveway and I need to snuggle it right up to a wall on the left side), the left rear corner of the bumper fades into the distance in the mirror and is quite small. The metal innards inspire more confidence as to it lasting through more instances of folding, as I live on a narrow street and when I park it on the street I will need to fold the mirror (several cars have had their mirrors whacked on our street if they aren't folded).

Some pics:


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## KBATTPO (Jan 15, 2001)

Congratulations, you've got yourself a Euro version with the Aspherical Wide Angle glass. The vertical line at the outer edge indicates where the curvature begins that lets you see "around the corner" so to speak. Although those are technically not DOT legal they are to the best of my knowledge not illegal. Been replacing the flat DOT mirror glass in the driver side mirrors with these in all of my cars for the past 20 years or so.

Here is mine:


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Didn't expect to get this sort of glass as it wasn't described as such, but it will be interesting to see what it's like to drive with (I haven't driven the van much since installing it).

I'm more excited about the metal internals (although it is pot metal which certainly has its limits). Folding the mirror feels less delicate/fragile so far and the noises it makes are far less scary when folding one of the plastic-internals mirror.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So I've been enjoying my Mk7 Golf quite a bit and not driving the Eurovan, but yesterday I felt kinda sorry for the ol' boy just sitting in front of the house and so I drove him to work. Other than being really dirty (so I treated him to a wash on the way home), I have to say Herman drove very well. Ran like a top and the A/C kept up with 100F SoCal Santa Ana heat just fine. Honestly, it actually was easier to drive smoothly than my Mk7 Golf 5MT (you'll find on the Golf VII forum that many people dislike the clutch system on the Mk7, myself included). The biggest issue with Herman in terms of the drive is that the ride more and more is approaching punishing in terms of coarseness. Feels like I'm riding on concrete donuts.

On another note, this was my first extended experience with the new driver's side mirror. The glass doesn't jiggle or anything like that (unlike the passenger mirror which I'm not in love with) and it appears solid. Overall, it's a good replacement mirror. Functionally, the curvature and split in the glass is effective at reducing blind spots, but the obvious point to note is that the objects in the mirror are truly closer than they appear.

With the passenger mirror, I always treat it as a secondary device relative to looking over my shoulder, so the objects in it are more of a "presence or absence" thing. With the driver's mirror, it's more of a primary device and I find that the inability to properly judge distance via the mirror a bit more disconcerting and it takes getting used to. While it reduces the blind spot (when a vehicle is out of the mirror it's then in my side window pretty much and never really disappears from easy view), I find that after checking my driver's mirror, when I do see a car back there I then check my inside mirror for a more realistic assessment of how far back he is. It's definitely different than using two flat mirrors (outside driver's flat mirror and inside flat mirror). While the curved outside driver's mirror solves the blind spot problem, the distance of a car back there sort of becomes a new problem.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So while Herman has been doing fairly well for the past two years (normal maintenance, and new front brakes), he took a turn for the worse on Sunday. I suppose this problem was inevitable though on a 1993 vehicle....the heater core I believe is leaking.

We were on a trip from San Diego to Temecula for a socially-distant masked outdoor family gathering when 15 minutes into the trip I smelled coolant. When turning on the heat or defogger, steam came out of the vents. When on cold (no heat) and on the dsh face vents, there was barely any steam, although at a standstill it would begin to waft out of the vents. Gradually on the trip the windshield also would fog up a bit. Coolant level went from max to min on the one-way 60 mile journey, and I added water to it for the trip home as well. We did make the trip otherwise uneventfully and the car never overheated and never got low enough on coolant to trigger the warning light either, but now he's in the garage awaiting teardown of the dashboard.

It does give me a chance to fix up the HVAC box and flaps. I'm sure the foam is all gone as there's lots of leakage between the three main ductwork paths and the front heater itself the past few years has been very weak...thankfully we don't live in Minnesota! Also the center trim section of the dash with the HVAC, buttons, and radio is all cracked up as well and needs replacement (I have one) and that requires pulling the dash as well, it's apparently time to address all of those issues now.

Not looking forward to it though....ugh.


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## wky (Feb 18, 1999)

Yeah, your heater core is out. Just did this job during the summer for my 93 EV (Bob) but I had to do it because the original owner bypassed the hoses to the heater core all together and for peace of mind I thought the core should be changed out. Although it was time consuming it wasn't the big pain in the butt that I thought it would be. Worst part was putting the HVAC box back together with all the clips involved. Since the dash was out it was easy access to get a new fan and like you said fix up the HVAC flaps with new foam and seals. 

Question, since I see you're pretty knowledgeable on the EVs on this forum, do you know the hose routing for the heater core? I know the hose with the bleeder screw connects to the right inlet on the firewall but where is that hose coming from and for the outlet hose where is that going to?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Thanks...good to know that the removal is just tedious but not necessarily hard.

The hose w/the bleeder screw goes on the fitting that is on the driver's side of the two fittings on the firewall (left side of car, right side as you look at it standing in front of the car looking at the firewall).

Both hoses connect to separate 3-way tees down under the brake booster area. The one w/the bleeder goes lower and farther back than the other one. Presumably those are tees that are to/from the rear heater...?


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

And, thank you for making me look!!!!

Can someone confirm please? This is NOT my pic...but my hose looks just like this!










Did I simply lose my bleeder screw?!?! Although that doesn't explain the steam coming out from the vents in the cabin since the intake for the cabin is relatively sealed via the bellows...unless the steam is just being sucked into the HVAC another way.

So rather than rip the car's dash apart, did I just lose the bleeder screw?


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## wky (Feb 18, 1999)

Okay, gonna have to look for the tees your talking about. It's hard for me to figure it out since the owner before really routed things up in circles. The Bentley manual isn't very helpful and diagrams keep saying there's a coolant heater control valve when I know there isn't one for EVs with AC.

From that pic you have, I think the top of the bleeder screw has broken off. I remember reading somewhere they break off easy since they're plastic. I don't think this is where your leak is from otherwise the steam would be coming from the hood big time.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Yeah the other symptoms I'm having is the steam is coming from the dash vents which would only happen from this leak if the air is getting sucked into the cabin air intake. Maybe I have two issues really? IDK. Since the hose isn't "right" anyway (I noticed some weeping at the other end where it goes to a tee), I ordered a new hose from Jim Ellis VW to head off any other issues with this hose since it's on its last legs.

After I replace it, I'll see if all is well or not or if I need to tear into the dash. I curse VW for the dashboard design. That entire center section should have been screwed in another way so that dash removal isn't needed to replace it or to get in there. It'd be a nice big gaping access hole to the heater box and core if the thing was screwed in differently.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

So weekend before last I drove the van around and checked for leaks at this hose and found none, so definitely is the heater core as my main issue, but I decided to replace this hose anyway since it's not "right".

As I removed it, the connection at the old heater core started to disintegrate and some of the plastic from the core connection broke off and stayed in the old hose. Well, no biggie there since I'm replacing the heater core anyway later. At the other end where it goes to a tee, it immediately broke off when I tried to remove it. Basically the tee was a ticking time bomb ready to go at any time. I disconnected all three hoses (or attempted to) and at each one on the tee, it just crumbled. Had to dig the broken and crumbling tee out of each of the hoses.

I figured that the other tee won't be far behind in terms of failure, so I removed that one as well (it did come out in one piece though). The part number for these two tees is 701-819-876. Europarts of San Diego appears to have them so I ordered two.

Of course it took forever to remove these since they're in such a tight spot and it's hard to get tools in there to release the spring clamps. Between having to remove the belly pan to remove a hose to drain the coolant (thank you VW for not putting a proper drain on the radiator....geez) and fiddling with these other hoses and tees, I didn't get much else done on the van because I hit my patience limit.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Started tearing into the dash this weekend for about 1.5-2 hours before it got too cold and started raining. It's a little slow going but not too bad. One tip that I have for anyone with an older van (well they're all old by now if it's a T4) is that if you remove the footwell center duct assembly (comes out easily....one hex screw each side and two screws at the next panel up) and remove it and shake it out, you might get a lot of the old foam insulation out. A lot had piled up in there and could be clogging your footwell airflow.

As it is now I have the steering wheel out, the stalk switches out, the steering column clamshell trim out, the cluster bezel out, some dash switches out, and the glovebox out. I'm labelling all electrical connectors with blue tape as I go so I know on reassembly that if I see blue tape on some wiring, it has to go to something.


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## wky (Feb 18, 1999)

Make sure to mark the vacuum hoses from the heater box and control levers too.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Good idea...thanks.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Finished taking out the dash today. All in all it was easier than expected, but a few things here and there up a fight. It's just tedious, especially taking the time to just be "neat" and putting away tools as you finish with them, labelling all electrical connections, etc. For the HVAC, I just got as far as removing the ducting for the face-level dash vents and decided to call it quits for the day there.

Not totally sure how the blender box comes out and where I need to split it. I'd like to not only replace the leaking heater core, but also want to R&R the blender box by recovering the flaps, put in new gaskets, etc. Advice on removing the core and blender box is welcome. It just looks confusing to me while it's in the car.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Good day today...got the two new coolant tees in under the hood (they are the tees that the in and out hoses from the heater core go to) without a lot of drama.

Then I went for removing the heater box. It separates from the air intake by prying off six small clips and you do not have to breach the A/C system if you do this. Two clips are facing the firewall, but one is accessible from underneath and the other is accessible from up top, although both are rather blind and you have to go by feel. Then remove four vacuum hoses from it (they have color-coded stripes so just make note of which color goes where or take pics). Remove two 10mm bolts from the engine compartment (one is under where the two hoses connect, the other is straight down from there hiding behind the firewall heat shield insulation). Disconnect one cable from the bottom of the box and you're good to wiggle it up and out.

Once out, it looks like it just clips together in two halves, so that's where the cleaning and the rebuild will start next weekend.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Good day today too. Cleaned up the box yesterday after separating it. Today, covered the flaps with HVAC aluminum tape, put weatherstripping where I could for sealing and so the flaps don't bang, etc. It looks like a brand new assembly from VW.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Another good weekend working on Herman. He's going back together now and is about 70% back together. I have the box in, the main dash in, glovebox in, floor duct in. I just need to put back the instrument cluster and all the steering column stuff. Then before the dash vents go back in I want to try and reseal the vent flap edges where the foam has worn away. I also have a new rear A/C switch on the way (it didn't work on fan speed 4 anymore) and a new cigarette lighter (I broke it trying to remove it) coming too. I put the coolant back and started him up, no leaks, heater gets warm.

The only main issue I'm having with the HVAC box is that the flap for the face vents is fighting me. During all my fiddling I believe I got the flap position out of sync with its vacuum mechanism and it's not fully opening and sometimes gets stuck closed. However, the mechanism is accessible under the dash and one can sort of pry the two plastic gears apart a little bit enough to make it skip a tooth at a time and reposition the flap. So I'll be playing with that for a while. Hopefully that's all it is.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

98% together now just awaiting the new rear A/C switch that should arrive in the next few days. Everything else is back in place and this evening I replaced the dissolving foam gaskets on the dash face air vents with some new rubber weatherstripping. It's a bit of a hack job but it's better than the nearly-missing foam that has gone AWOL. Also adjusted the flap position of the face-vent-ducting a bit and it's working OK again.

Next up tomorrow will be the driver's window regulator. Already have one that I got a few months ago, and the driver's window is struggling to go down and making some bad noises, so it's time.


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## wky (Feb 18, 1999)

Nice job on the weather stripping and taping up the flaps. I never understood why there's holes in the flaps. Is this done so when the foam is deteriorating it will go thru the holes in the flaps which is deteriorating as well to let you know the everything is effed?

Finally hooked up the hoses correctly and got my heater going.....just in time for spring. Thanks for letting me know about the tee hookups.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Thanks - I am pleased with the results so far. New A/C switch arrived via FedEx about an hour ago so I'll be putting that in today and also doing the driver's window regulator
today as well before it totally fails.

I can only think of two reasons for the holes in the flaps.

1. Weight savings
2. Air diversion from windshield to face to footwells is intentional to divert most of the air but not all of it for general comfort, so the foam lets a trickle amount to the secondary pathways at all time. I had a 1991 Mk2 GTI from new that always gave a trickle of air out the dash vents when you were in defogger or footwell mode and so I assumed it was intentional. Or, perhaps it's just a side effect of weight savings.

Glad you got your hoses worked out for the rear heater. I was pretty horrified at the plastic tees and how badly they crumbled. They were just a few vibrations away from failing on their own catastrophically. I got lucky.

I also found my horn worked twice and then quit after reassembly. Since I had put the steering wheel back on a bit crooked, I took it off again and had another look. On the steering wheel on a '93 the horn pad touches the metal in the steering wheel at four (rather tiny) raised Braille-like bumps that I've never noticed before. These were tarnished. A little sandpaper and they shined right up, reassembled, and the horn works great again now.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Some frustrating updates...


Was replacing the throttle body potentiometer and knocked a vacuum line loose. Didn't realize it until my climate flaps didn't work properly to send the air to the dash vents. Fixed vacuum line, but somehow the total lack of vacuum or something caused the flap mechanism to overrun its normal range of motion and I'm having trouble getting the two plastic gears that drive the dash vents' flap door to align properly. I can get them lined up, works great, flip to floor airflow and back and on the way back the gears jump teeth again. Not sure what I'm doing wrong.

Then, in the process of trying to fix all that, the ignition tumbler broke. Not the electrical part behind the key....nooooo that'd be too easy....the actual key part that's trapped in the steering wheel housing.

Basically it's this:
VW T4: Eurovan ignition key cylinder removal - YouTube 

Although I got a lot of things going on this week and need the van working and I'm hitting my "I can't even" limit with it. I may take it to VW to fix. Can still start the car w/a screwdriver into the electrical switch after it's separated and then turn the key in the cylinder to disengage the steering wheel lock.


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## Josh_wa (May 15, 2017)

Here's my post on repairing that.






TheSamba.com :: Eurovan - View topic - Ignition/steering lock cylinder failure


Classified ads, photos, shows, links, forums, and technical information for the Volkswagen automobile



www.thesamba.com


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Great writeup! Nice job.

I ended up taking it to a local indie mechanic though. I'm kinda out of time and patience this week (work, packing to move, etc., no time for a car repair project).


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Got him back...and $550 later. Replaced the electric switch (it was cracked anyway), the tumbler, and the housing it's all in (mechanic said it was damaged too...IDK...and said I probably got the last one in existence). Works fine now, albeit with different keys for the doors vs ignition.


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## Josh_wa (May 15, 2017)

I hope you kept or are able to get your old tumbler. Not likely the tumbler failed, but the pinned in pot metal key at the bottom. You should still be able to have the same keys. I didn't realize you could even remove the housing.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Did not get the old tumbler. They did say the housing was damaged and that's why they replaced it. I assume this is more or less what they did, including replacing the housing:

VW T4: Eurovan ignition key cylinder removal - YouTube

Two keys are inconvenient. However, the new tumbler operates differently and I kinda like it.

Old:
Key in, nothing.
Turn to 'on' and back again, accessories come on and stay on until you remove the key and you can feel a mechanical "click" when you did this.

New:
Key in, accessories come on and stay on immediately with no turning of the key. I kinda like it because it fires up the radio that much sooner and it then can connect to my phonefaster.


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## gti_matt (Oct 9, 1999)

Herman the German got a new timing belt kit today. I'm kinda bummed because the old one was only 35K miles old (go back several pages and see about my timing belt breakage ordeal around 2012 or so). But the issue was that the engine was making a "crunchy" noise like marbles in a plastic cup. Started a bit before the holidays and just got worse. Traced the noise to the water pump and the idler roller (both don't seem to turn as freely as expected...the mechanic showed me the old parts). As long as he was in there because of the labor, we did a full kit replacement. The van is super quiet now. I'd almost say it runs better too, although maybe it's a placebo effect there. I guess I also have more confidence that the timing belt and accessories were replaced by a professional and not me  so if I did anything wrong before, at least it's all correct now.

The shop owner also said he took the van for a bit of a test drive and was overall impressed with how well it drove. Honestly, I agree. Between brakes and tires and misc suspension (although I know I have a ball joint with a split seal and both tie rod boots are cracked and split too) and engine, he does drive quite well for a 29 year old car.


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